**** BEGIN LOGGING AT Thu Nov 29 02:59:56 2007
Nov 29 03:36:09 <Nescio> Hello
Nov 29 03:38:28 <jasta> Nescio: hi.
Nov 29 03:49:18 <Nescio> How goes?
Nov 29 03:56:58 <jasta> it's ok.
Nov 29 03:58:14 <Nescio> About ready to release?
Nov 29 03:58:40 <Nescio> ...or ya still run'n into some snags?
Nov 29 04:01:47 <jasta> just fixin' shit :)
Nov 29 04:01:57 <jasta> i rewrote all that embarrassing Thread crap :)
Nov 29 04:05:59 <Nescio> heh
Nov 29 04:08:22 <Nescio> hey... it wouldn't be that difficult to add a Next/Back button to your header... so the user (either with the D-pad / or touchscreen) could switch threads without going back to the original list... no?
Nov 29 04:32:15 <jasta> Nescio: yes, i will add that.
Nov 29 05:49:24 <Luniv> hrmm... my emulator disk state somehow got screwed up :s
Nov 29 05:56:44 <getoo> can android be install on like a pc or tivo ?
Nov 29 05:57:38 <ogunnaike> or a graphical calculator? that would be really handy
Nov 29 05:58:01 <getoo> ogunnaike: good question , but you wanna know somehting
Nov 29 05:58:10 <ogunnaike> sure
Nov 29 05:58:14 <getoo> it might be too early for quesitons like this
Nov 29 05:58:19 <getoo> i just realized
Nov 29 05:58:22 <ogunnaike> lol
Nov 29 05:58:26 <ogunnaike> you serious?
Nov 29 05:58:32 <getoo> i am trying
Nov 29 05:59:01 <getoo> ogunnaike: is you a spy :)
Nov 29 05:59:13 <ogunnaike> lmfao, no.
Nov 29 05:59:21 <getoo> good
Nov 29 05:59:25 <ogunnaike> what makes you think i'm a spy? and a spy for what?
Nov 29 05:59:40 <getoo> iphone !!!
Nov 29 05:59:51 <ogunnaike> oh.. no.
Nov 29 05:59:58 <getoo> i feel better
Nov 29 06:00:00 <ogunnaike> not an iphone spy i'm afraid
Nov 29 06:00:07 <ogunnaike> i hear iphone spies get paid heaps
Nov 29 06:00:38 <getoo> i hear if you spy for them you have two options
Nov 29 06:00:44 <getoo> free battery change
Nov 29 06:00:51 <ogunnaike> just two?
Nov 29 06:00:53 <getoo> or unbrick
Nov 29 06:00:57 <getoo> yeap
Nov 29 06:01:04 <ogunnaike> ah..
Nov 29 06:01:04 <getoo> just like the ringtones
Nov 29 06:01:14 <ogunnaike> right
Nov 29 06:01:40 <ogunnaike> hey dont you think it'd be really cool if you could call someone using a calculator?
Nov 29 06:04:01 <ogunnaike> getoo: what do you think of the calculator idea?
Nov 29 06:04:27 <getoo> you mean like skype
Nov 29 06:04:30 <getoo> or
Nov 29 06:05:19 <getoo> ogunnaike: how about this , locate a android user on gmap
Nov 29 06:05:25 <getoo> is that possible
Nov 29 06:05:54 <ogunnaike> just a android user?
Nov 29 06:06:03 <getoo> or even better any phone user
Nov 29 06:06:18 <getoo> i bet u can get some of the 10 mills
Nov 29 06:06:23 <ogunnaike> what if you say, you want to locate the exact location of someone like the pres of usa?
Nov 29 06:06:29 <ogunnaike> does he have to use android?
Nov 29 06:06:37 <getoo> no
Nov 29 06:06:47 <ogunnaike> does he have to use a phone to get located?
Nov 29 06:06:48 <getoo> just a regular cellphone
Nov 29 06:07:05 <getoo> no gps needed
Nov 29 06:07:32 <ogunnaike> whats all this reliance on having a phone?
Nov 29 06:07:41 <ogunnaike> cant you just have a calculator or something?
Nov 29 06:07:45 <getoo> is just an idea
Nov 29 06:07:51 <ogunnaike> not everyone wants to be contactable all the time
Nov 29 06:08:03 <getoo> maybe like a smart phone or something
Nov 29 06:08:23 <getoo> yeah but if u dont wanna be found u can turn your location off
Nov 29 06:08:24 <ogunnaike> a smart phone? whats a smart phone do? run android?
Nov 29 06:08:26 <getoo> you know
Nov 29 06:08:48 <getoo> ogunnaike: are u a android dev
Nov 29 06:08:57 <ogunnaike> lol
Nov 29 06:08:58 <ogunnaike> no
Nov 29 06:09:26 <ogunnaike> if i was android dev i'd put more focus on calculators rather than phones
Nov 29 06:10:07 <getoo> ogunnaike: u thinking bout beating ubuntu
Nov 29 06:10:13 <getoo> and make the perfect os
Nov 29 06:10:19 <ogunnaike> huh?
Nov 29 06:10:44 <ogunnaike> i really dont know about ubuntu.
Nov 29 06:10:58 <ogunnaike> << doesnt do linux
Nov 29 06:11:17 <getoo> i hear is some superior operating system
Nov 29 06:11:23 <getoo> oh
Nov 29 06:11:39 <getoo> fyi , android is linux :)
Nov 29 06:11:53 <ogunnaike> << realize
Nov 29 06:12:05 <ogunnaike> i got android to work on fbsd using linux emul
Nov 29 06:12:23 <getoo> prove it :)
Nov 29 06:12:37 <ogunnaike> hmm..
Nov 29 06:12:47 <ogunnaike> i got a screenshot somewhere i believe
Nov 29 06:12:48 <getoo> i might steal ur idea
Nov 29 06:12:51 <getoo> :)
Nov 29 06:13:48 <ogunnaike> i cant remember what i called the file though: its in here somewhere http://blowie.no-ip.org/alex/
Nov 29 06:16:52 <ogunnaike> getoo, i need to know. is android going to be exclusive to mobile phones or what?
Nov 29 06:19:13 <getoo> too early to tell , but if u good hacker can be ported to everything , even a computer
Nov 29 06:19:35 <getoo> are youa good hacker
Nov 29 06:19:39 <ogunnaike> it would be nice if it ran on calculators
Nov 29 06:19:53 <ogunnaike> no. but i want to be
Nov 29 06:37:59 <ruxpin> ogunnaike: since when do calculators have gsm chips?
Nov 29 06:39:26 <ogunnaike> ok, i dont even know what that is. i've got a hp 49G if that helps
Nov 29 06:39:31 <ogunnaike> 49G+ rather
Nov 29 06:39:37 <ogunnaike> not the 50G
Nov 29 06:39:44 <ogunnaike> the gold one
Nov 29 06:41:56 <ruxpin> ogunnaike: you need a gsm chip to make a call on the gsm network. or a web connection to make a voip call. but using a calculator to phone someone???
Nov 29 06:42:06 <ruxpin> wtf?
Nov 29 06:42:39 <ogunnaike> okay, i just want to know if android will run on anything apart from phones
Nov 29 06:42:47 <ogunnaike> is it a phone only platform?
Nov 29 06:43:33 <ogunnaike> in particular, will it run on calculators
Nov 29 06:43:42 <billmeltsner> well...
Nov 29 06:43:48 <billmeltsner> if the calculator supported linux, I suppose
Nov 29 06:43:55 <billmeltsner> but, you wouldn't be able to make calls
Nov 29 06:44:03 <billmeltsner> or access the internet
Nov 29 06:44:05 <billmeltsner> or do, like anything
Nov 29 06:44:10 <ogunnaike> the hp 49G+ i got, has an arm cpu
Nov 29 06:44:25 <ogunnaike> arm 9 or something not sure
Nov 29 06:44:45 <billmeltsner> the kernel would be able to compile then
Nov 29 06:45:07 <ogunnaike> okay.. so google developed this whole platform just for making calls? is that what youre saying?
Nov 29 06:45:08 <billmeltsner> but, like I said
Nov 29 06:45:19 <billmeltsner> well, it's designed to do basically anything
Nov 29 06:45:24 <billmeltsner> hence the SDK for application development
Nov 29 06:45:36 <billmeltsner> but it's a mobile phone platform
Nov 29 06:45:44 <ogunnaike> okay, so you dont have to make a call to use it. thats great
Nov 29 06:45:45 <ogunnaike> oh..
Nov 29 06:45:48 <ogunnaike> not so great
Nov 29 06:45:50 <billmeltsner> based around technologies like bluetooth
Nov 29 06:46:04 <ogunnaike> so its based around phones
Nov 29 06:46:08 <billmeltsner> yeah.
Nov 29 06:46:11 <billmeltsner> it's designed to run on phones.
Nov 29 06:46:17 <billmeltsner> you can run it on non-phone environments
Nov 29 06:46:22 <billmeltsner> but it is at heart a phone-based system
Nov 29 06:46:23 <ogunnaike> i thought it was more generic than that
Nov 29 06:46:25 <billmeltsner> and designed as such
Nov 29 06:46:44 <billmeltsner> no, it's definitely a platform intended for phones
Nov 29 06:47:01 <billmeltsner> like I said, you can run it on non-phone environments
Nov 29 06:47:23 <billmeltsner> but then those features don't work
Nov 29 06:48:03 <ogunnaike> ok, thanks for enlightening me
Nov 29 06:54:55 <ogunnaike> i just yahoo'ed your name. is your android calculator rpn?
Nov 29 06:57:20 <billmeltsner> who, me?
Nov 29 06:57:58 <ogunnaike> yeah
Nov 29 06:58:05 <ogunnaike> didnt you write a calculator?
Nov 29 06:58:08 <billmeltsner> I did
Nov 29 06:58:19 <ogunnaike> is it rpn?
Nov 29 06:58:27 <billmeltsner> nope
Nov 29 06:58:55 <ogunnaike> is it harder to write rpn calculators?
Nov 29 06:59:19 <billmeltsner> the parsing is different
Nov 29 06:59:21 <billmeltsner> I wouldn't say harder
Nov 29 06:59:27 <billmeltsner> I could make the calculator RPN I suppose
Nov 29 06:59:40 <ogunnaike> that would be interesting
Nov 29 07:00:09 <billmeltsner> but I wrote it to imitate most calculator software on mobile platforms
Nov 29 07:00:11 <romainguy> RPN calculator are quite easy
Nov 29 07:00:11 <billmeltsner> which is infix
Nov 29 07:00:34 <billmeltsner> hell, I could even support both infix and rpn
Nov 29 07:00:35 <ogunnaike> yes, there arent enough rpn calculator softwares
Nov 29 07:01:01 <billmeltsner> could use Dijkstra's algorithm
Nov 29 07:01:05 <billmeltsner> and handle everything in RPN
Nov 29 07:01:20 <ogunnaike> i know only of one (thats xcalc -rpn)
Nov 29 07:01:36 <billmeltsner> yeah, rpn isn't exactly common
Nov 29 07:01:42 <billmeltsner> and physical RPN calculators are even rarer
Nov 29 07:02:02 <ogunnaike> my hp 49g+ is a rpn calculator
Nov 29 07:02:36 <billmeltsner> yeah, but there aren't many others out there
Nov 29 07:03:36 <billmeltsner> but yeah, I could implement RPN easily
Nov 29 07:03:44 <ogunnaike> ok, i wont download your app for now. i'll wait till you make it rpn
Nov 29 07:03:51 <billmeltsner> I don't have time tho, I just threw the calculator together to give an example of how to write an android app
Nov 29 07:04:03 <ogunnaike> ah..
Nov 29 07:04:03 <billmeltsner> that's a little more complex than Hello World
Nov 29 07:07:58 <ogunnaike> if i was to develop a calculator for a phone i'd make it rpn. just less keys to press
Nov 29 07:08:04 <ogunnaike> no brackets required
Nov 29 07:09:57 <billmeltsner> yeah
Nov 29 07:10:04 <billmeltsner> but the problem is, most people are used to infix notation
Nov 29 07:10:23 <billmeltsner> limiting it to RPN would limit the userbase
Nov 29 07:10:34 <billmeltsner> though you could do what apple did and have an option to switch into RPN mode
Nov 29 07:11:57 <ogunnaike> infix should be made illegal
Nov 29 07:12:16 <billmeltsner> heh
Nov 29 07:12:29 <billmeltsner> you'd have less luck with that than getting america to convert to the metric system
Nov 29 07:12:36 <ogunnaike> there should be ads on tv letting ppl know about rpn
Nov 29 07:13:16 <ogunnaike> i lend ppl my calculator at uni and they're like how do you turn this on?
Nov 29 07:18:35 <ogunnaike> heh, i knew it was in the white book. might give this a go in java
Nov 29 08:07:30 <jasta> Nescio: changing the GUI around a bit to improve channel add/edit
Nov 29 08:29:28 <jasta> how would i set an EditText widgets cursor position?
Nov 29 08:33:47 <jasta> do i really need to perform a saveState()/restoreState() updating the sel-start/sel-end magic?
Nov 29 08:58:15 <guardian> morning
Nov 29 09:01:12 <kimnotyze> 0hi
Nov 29 09:01:37 <kimnotyze> s/0hi/hi
Nov 29 09:10:59 <cutmasta> hu
Nov 29 09:11:41 <cutmasta> why does the emu only accept connections from localhost?
Nov 29 09:11:56 <cutmasta> i created a server socket and want to connect from another pc in my lan
Nov 29 09:19:44 <kimnotyze> cutmasta: forwarding?
Nov 29 09:20:04 <cutmasta> kimnotyze, the emu only opens the socket on loopback device
Nov 29 09:20:55 <cutmasta> the bad thing is, it runs currently in win
Nov 29 09:21:07 <cutmasta> so i cannot create a tunnel or something like that
Nov 29 09:22:05 <kimnotyze> so.. why are you wondering?!
Nov 29 09:23:22 <cutmasta> normally , if i create an app with a server socket which listens on ALL devices
Nov 29 09:23:40 <cutmasta> i can connect from anywhere because the port is open on all ips/devices
Nov 29 09:24:03 <cutmasta> here the emu seems to restrict access that i can only connect from 127.0.0.1/localhost
Nov 29 09:24:22 <kimnotyze> hm.. dont know
Nov 29 09:24:40 <cutmasta> i know that i can fwd or tunnel connections with linux
Nov 29 09:25:02 <cutmasta> but i want that it works as expected :)
Nov 29 09:25:51 <kimnotyze> hm.. im sure you can also forward with windows.. cant you create network bridges or something called like that?
Nov 29 09:26:29 <cutmasta> kimnotyze, i will try some other ways, but thanks for your comments on this issue
Nov 29 09:26:43 <kimnotyze> kk np
Nov 29 09:51:30 <Stephmw> mornin
Nov 29 10:18:21 <jasta> morning
Nov 29 11:24:14 <cutmasta> kimnotyze,
Nov 29 11:24:16 <cutmasta> http://groups.google.com/group/android-developers/browse_thread/thread/49704e323eb4fcad?hl=en
Nov 29 11:24:22 <cutmasta> i think this might help me
Nov 29 11:24:38 <cutmasta> did not read it completly but i will start now
Nov 29 11:27:24 <cutmasta> ah
Nov 29 11:27:26 <cutmasta> wrong way
Nov 29 11:27:29 <cutmasta> hehe
Nov 29 15:00:25 <dims> folks, anyone know how to turn cell-id/lac into a lat/long?
Nov 29 15:01:40 <davidw> ehehhe:-)
Nov 29 15:01:52 <davidw> google knows, apparently
Nov 29 15:02:07 <dims> :)
Nov 29 15:03:24 <dims> just figured out how to get the cell-id/lac..(http://davanum.wordpress.com/2007/11/29/android-access-cell-phone-details-cell-id-lac-signal-strength/)
Nov 29 15:09:54 <davidw> dims, http://www.viking.tm/gps/cellpos.php
Nov 29 15:10:06 <davidw> looks like you need to find a db that has the information you need
Nov 29 15:11:55 * davidw is curious too
Nov 29 15:13:05 <Stephmw> you can probably build such a DB fairly quickly if you distribute your app to owners that have a GPS... kinda like gmap is used for on the N95
Nov 29 15:14:35 <Stephmw> davidw: lol. that db you linked
Nov 29 15:14:51 <Stephmw> davidw: just checked the UK O2 cells... I doubt its correctness :D
Nov 29 15:15:04 <Nescio|away> Why don't you just use the LBS built into the API
Nov 29 15:15:11 <davidw> no, it seems to suck, actually
Nov 29 15:15:20 <Nescio|away> It will switch between GPS/CellID as needed
Nov 29 15:15:44 <dims> there's a CellLocationProvider in adroid.jar...can't seem to be able to activate it. if i could, then i could use LocationManager's getCurrentLocation
Nov 29 15:15:46 <Stephmw> Nescio|away: it's more fun to DIY :)
Nov 29 15:16:08 <dims> Nescio|away: can't figure out how to activate that provider
Nov 29 15:16:18 * Nescio|away agrees
Nov 29 15:16:27 <dims> Nescio|away: that's when i started scratching my head/DIY :)
Nov 29 15:16:41 <edu> dims: Hi good question, how to activate that provider?
Nov 29 15:16:50 <Nescio|away> :) - yea, i don't believe they activated it yet >.<
Nov 29 15:17:13 <Nescio|away> but, it's in the docs that is works that way.... next releaase?
Nov 29 15:17:25 <dims> tried adding "class" file under /data/misc/location/cell directory. that seems to add the provider, but the get location returns null
Nov 29 15:17:34 <davidw> they could have just left a stub... "where? sitting in front of your computer, dumbass"
Nov 29 15:17:42 <Nescio|away> lol
Nov 29 15:18:23 <Stephmw> *** Out of cheese error *** Redo from start ***
Nov 29 15:18:34 <Nescio|away> ...Does anyone know if mylocation will be part of the google maps api?
Nov 29 15:19:13 <dims> FYI, found this url in msft live maps...shows you your lat/long
Nov 29 15:19:15 <dims> http://maps.live.com/wifiipservice/locate.ashx
Nov 29 15:19:27 <dims> using ip address stuff
Nov 29 15:19:38 <Stephmw> geoip?
Nov 29 15:20:01 <dims> doc here - http://msdn2.microsoft.com/en-us/library/aa907670.aspx
Nov 29 15:20:15 <dims> no idea
Nov 29 15:20:19 <Stephmw> yeah, it uses geoip... not exactly dependable
Nov 29 15:20:25 <davidw> stupid IP based ones all return Vienna for me
Nov 29 15:20:37 <Nescio|away> haha
Nov 29 15:21:47 <Nescio|away> if you guys had the option to broadcast you current location, would you? -if you could remain annonymous?
Nov 29 15:22:17 <dims> so...another dead-end :) just hit the JNI dead end yesterday :(
Nov 29 15:22:53 <Stephmw> Nescio|away: you'd be surprised
Nov 29 15:23:21 <Nescio|away> dims, you probably need to set it up like the GPS config... I'd talk to a googler
Nov 29 15:23:42 <Nescio|away> Stephw - how so?
Nov 29 15:24:20 <Stephmw> Nescio|away: joe blog on the street still has little comprehension about personal privacy when it comes to mobiles
Nov 29 15:25:05 <Zer0Her0> does the android spec require a gps in the devices? or is it optional component?
Nov 29 15:25:23 <Nescio|away> According to the doc, it's optional
Nov 29 15:25:39 <Nescio|away> if it is missing it will use, what they are now calling "mylocation"
Nov 29 15:26:44 <Nescio|away> LBS was what perked my interest in this api...
Nov 29 15:27:12 <Nescio|away> so, I was just curious how people would feel broadcasting it - given the choose
Nov 29 15:28:15 <Nescio|away> Anyway, work time... happy coding :)
Nov 29 15:28:41 <Stephmw> 2 more hours and I'm off to Google ;)
Nov 29 15:33:20 <davidw> which one?
Nov 29 15:33:46 <Stephmw> London
Nov 29 15:33:57 <Stephmw> monthly Open Source Dev Jam
Nov 29 15:34:17 <davidw> ah, cool
Nov 29 15:37:02 <dims> Stephmw: have fun!
Nov 29 15:42:09 <Stephmw> dims: thanks :) they're usually pretty fun
Nov 29 15:42:56 <Stephmw> dims: tonight's topic is "Distributed Systems"
Nov 29 15:43:42 <davidw> interesting
Nov 29 15:43:48 <davidw> wonder if there will be any erlang dudes there
Nov 29 15:43:56 <Stephmw> http://osjam.truemesh.com/
Nov 29 15:44:41 * davidw is kind of sick of this backwater in some ways:-/
Nov 29 15:44:52 <davidw> otoh, there are beautiful mountains out my window;-)
Nov 29 15:45:10 <Stephmw> yeah, I'm kinda sick of this backwater too
Nov 29 15:45:18 <Stephmw> but no nice views to make it up
Nov 29 15:47:59 <davidw> london is a backwater
Nov 29 15:48:00 <davidw> ?
Nov 29 15:49:43 <Stephmw> compared to the US when it comes to IT stuff
Nov 29 15:49:53 <Stephmw> conferences, trade shows, etc
Nov 29 15:57:02 * Marv|LG laughs a bit at that comment
Nov 29 15:57:17 <Marv|LG> i am working on an os so old it would make you cry
Nov 29 15:57:31 <Stephmw> AIX?
Nov 29 15:57:54 <Marv|LG> extremely old version of linux
Nov 29 15:58:07 <Zer0Her0> OS/2
Nov 29 15:58:09 <Stephmw> hmmm 2.2? or older?
Nov 29 15:58:19 <Zer0Her0> oh linux, hehe
Nov 29 16:02:31 <davidw> vax?
Nov 29 16:42:43 <constant_> hi!
Nov 29 16:43:34 <constant_> 5
Nov 29 16:43:44 <Dralspire> hi hi
Nov 29 16:44:14 <constant_> where i can find an android application to see it?
Nov 29 16:44:27 <cutmasta> constant_, check emulator
Nov 29 16:44:43 <cutmasta> the maps application is an android based app
Nov 29 16:45:07 <cutmasta> bye all
Nov 29 16:45:18 <constant_> tks
Nov 29 16:56:13 <asymptonic> Q: If I want to create a view backed by a layout XML resource, how do I then instantiate that view in code?
Nov 29 17:00:04 <asymptonic> nm, I think I found it, ViewInflate
Nov 29 17:18:12 <ViaToR> anybody knows how to get size of the screen?
Nov 29 17:40:43 * billmeltsner sighs
Nov 29 19:27:33 <ViaToR> whats the diference of GLSurfaceView or GLView???
Nov 29 19:50:22 <shishirmk> hi
Nov 29 21:17:01 <mmealling> so what's the current bet on when the first android based phone will come out?
Nov 29 21:17:11 <Zer0Her0> 2008
Nov 29 21:17:39 <nagaxen> Zer0Her0: good bet. :)
Nov 29 21:17:49 <Zer0Her0> :-D i claim the whole year
Nov 29 21:18:35 <mmealling> heh..... so in other words, if I want a 3G phone I should just go ahead and get one now instead of waiting?
Nov 29 21:39:36 <absentia> hi
Nov 29 21:51:15 <Dralspire> hi h
Nov 29 21:51:17 <Dralspire> i
Nov 29 22:15:29 <absentia> moin moin?
Nov 29 23:46:08 <Android001> test
Nov 30 01:40:38 <jasta> sweeeet
Nov 30 01:40:47 <jasta> I/DEBUG   (  448): pid: 1061, tid: 1061  >>> org.devtcg.rssreader <<<
Nov 30 01:40:47 <jasta> I/DEBUG   (  448): signal 11 (SIGSEGV), fault addr deadd00d
Nov 30 01:40:48 <jasta> ;P
Nov 30 01:41:50 <nagaxen> haha
Nov 30 01:42:07 <nagaxen> nice.
Nov 30 01:46:14 <jasta> alright, alright, i'm gonna release the rss reader tonight for sure
Nov 30 01:47:15 <nagaxen> suuuure you are :)
**** ENDING LOGGING AT Fri Nov 30 02:59:57 2007