**** BEGIN LOGGING AT Thu Jan 17 02:59:56 2008
Jan 17 03:10:22 <jasta> hmm, somehow i have broken eclipse debugging
Jan 17 03:10:44 <jasta> my breakpoints are hit, and the program stops, but Eclipse never switches to debug mode, and in debug mode, it claims that the program is not running
Jan 17 03:13:16 <jasta> yup, definitely broke it somehow.  hmm.
Jan 17 03:19:19 <jasta> hmm weird, other projects i used to debug are working?
Jan 17 03:19:28 <jasta> just these two new ones?
Jan 17 03:20:11 <jasta> you can see that the application disappears from the debug context after the "waiting for debugger to attach" message.
Jan 17 03:20:15 <jasta> and it seems to coincide with:
Jan 17 03:20:30 <jasta> [2008-01-16 19:20:18 - FiveClient] WARNING: Package org.devtcg.five is already registered by /data/app/Five.apk
Jan 17 03:21:02 <jasta> and on the projects that do not have this problem, that line does not appear.
Jan 17 03:21:12 <jasta> so, what does that message mean and why it is breaking the debugger? :)
Jan 17 03:22:34 <jasta> oh, i think it happens if you rename your project, and send an apk file with a different name that implements the same package namespace.
Jan 17 03:23:21 <jasta> a simple rm seems to fix it.  hmm, well, moving on :)
Jan 17 04:15:38 <winksaville> jasta: Interesting the same thing happen to me today, rm fixed it for me also
Jan 17 05:47:56 <romainguy_> re
Jan 17 06:50:58 <mypapit> woof
Jan 17 06:52:15 <brooke> meow?
Jan 17 06:56:51 <michaelnovakjr> mooo
Jan 17 07:43:06 <brooke> *pin drop*
Jan 17 09:29:49 <pekayatt> BUenos Dias :)
Jan 17 15:32:32 <Francisco> hola
Jan 17 15:32:54 <pekayat1> hola
Jan 17 17:15:09 <LunohoD_> re
Jan 17 17:15:21 <LunohoD_> how do you create /dev/binder?
Jan 17 17:24:10 <jasta> LunohoD_: it's just a character device, use busybox/mknod.
Jan 17 17:39:25 <LunohoD_> jasta: major minor?
Jan 17 17:39:46 <jasta> ls will tell you that.
Jan 17 17:40:06 <jasta> I show 252, 0.
Jan 17 17:40:21 <jasta> Why are you needing to create this device, though?
Jan 17 17:40:52 <jasta> I thought at first you might be hacking something with the Android kernel, but you don't seem the type all of the sudden :)
Jan 17 17:42:52 <LunohoD_> jasta: i'm trying to start android on my htc prophet
Jan 17 17:43:46 <jasta> i don't recommend that you do that.
Jan 17 17:44:12 <LunohoD_> why?
Jan 17 17:47:03 <jasta> how familiar would you say you are hacking linux and embedded devices? :)
Jan 17 17:48:04 <jasta> getting Android up and running on a device for which it was not intended is sure to require at least a working knowledge of Linux, the standard C library, etc.
Jan 17 17:48:52 <LunohoD_> jasta: hm
Jan 17 17:50:51 <LunohoD_> jasta: i'm helping to develop kernel for my device
Jan 17 17:51:02 <jasta> huh?
Jan 17 17:52:27 <LunohoD_> jasta: 2.6.23 works on htc prophet
Jan 17 17:52:54 <LunohoD_> i've patched it with this patch http://benno.id.au/android/android.diff
Jan 17 17:53:32 <jasta> right, but what about the rest of the Android stack?
Jan 17 17:54:00 <jasta> the android stack is closed source, and is therefore only capable of running on a very specific host.
Jan 17 17:54:27 <jasta> benno is somewhat famous for having tried to make it work regardless of that fact, but is also famous for having failed :)
Jan 17 17:54:30 <LunohoD_> jasta: it is running on zaurus
Jan 17 17:55:01 <LunohoD_> prophet is armv5tej
Jan 17 17:55:03 <jasta> also, the htc prophets wireless radio almost certainly will not work.  do you know it to be supported by Android?
Jan 17 17:55:46 <LunohoD_> jasta: http://euedge.com/blog/2007/12/06/google-android-runs-on-sharp-zaurus-sl-c760/
Jan 17 17:55:52 <jasta> i saw that as well.
Jan 17 17:56:13 <LunohoD_> :)
Jan 17 17:56:36 <jasta> but again, if the wireless radio is not supported and won't work, what is the point?
Jan 17 17:56:48 <jasta> a cell phone without a working radio is not useful to anyone for any purpose.
Jan 17 17:56:57 <LunohoD_> it's fun
Jan 17 17:57:59 <jasta> well sure.
Jan 17 17:58:15 <LunohoD_> what else can you do with android? run it in the emulator?
Jan 17 17:59:21 <LunohoD_> prophet is not just a cell phone, it's a communicator
Jan 17 18:07:48 <jasta> doesn't that make the need for a working radio seem more imperative?
Jan 17 18:17:38 <LunohoD_> jasta: maybe ;)
Jan 17 18:17:45 <LunohoD_> +++ post-zygote
Jan 17 18:24:18 <pandora--> post zygote wow what conversation did i just miss half of?
Jan 17 18:54:43 <Lede> good evening
Jan 17 19:03:59 <winksaville> Hello, is there a way to see what has been said 'today' after just joining?
Jan 17 19:08:42 <Zer0Her0> winksaville: on here you mean/
Jan 17 19:09:03 <winksaville> yes
Jan 17 19:09:21 <Zer0Her0> nope
Jan 17 19:09:37 <Zer0Her0> as far as i'm aware at least
Jan 17 19:11:03 <Lede> nothing important
Jan 17 19:12:50 <winksaville> I did learn the other day that you can see what happened 'yesterday' by going to http://logs.nslu2-linux.org/livelogs
Jan 17 19:14:51 <winksaville> I'm trying to get two emulated android's talking to one another
Jan 17 19:16:08 <winksaville> I reported a problem with a when executing emulator with -net nic, it segfaulted
Jan 17 19:17:26 <winksaville> Digit then said it can be done but the first nic (eth0) needs to be '-net user' and then you need to instantiate a second
Jan 17 19:18:05 <winksaville> Anyway I've got a second going and I look to be able to connect it to a bridge on my host
Jan 17 19:18:49 <winksaville> So the next step is to configure the android so it will route through the birdge
Jan 17 19:19:06 <winksaville> Any one been down this or similar path with qemu before?
Jan 17 19:35:55 <Lede> no
Jan 17 19:38:58 <winksaville> I've just made some progress, I successfully pinged from android to my host and even out to the internet, next is get dns doing something.
Jan 17 19:46:54 <winksaville> But adb is broken, 1 step forward, 2 steps back:)
Jan 17 20:05:00 <jasta> hmm, crap.
Jan 17 20:05:13 <jasta> my awesome original idea for Android has just been launched on the Alltel network :(
Jan 17 20:05:36 <jasta> damn simultaneous invention.
Jan 17 20:19:54 <brooke> :(
Jan 17 20:20:34 <brooke> I would like an awesome idea for android, but I can't think of anything that I really want on a phone/handheld device that isn't already being implemented
Jan 17 20:21:01 <jasta> brooke: you could always take something well known and simply improve it.
Jan 17 20:21:14 <jasta> the great thing about that is that everything mobile to date has been utterly terrible.
Jan 17 20:21:17 <jasta> so it's all fair game to improve :)
Jan 17 20:21:42 <brooke> I am a student, without much experience... I'd be hard pressed to improve something that a professional hasn't already :)
Jan 17 20:22:24 <jasta> Kind of deadlocked yourself, eh?
Jan 17 20:25:32 <brooke> hehe, indeed
Jan 17 20:25:47 <brooke> unwilling to try anything, due to expectation of failure
Jan 17 20:26:19 <brooke> actually the reason I am here is because I'm interested in the google summer of code, and I was considering working on an android app for it
Jan 17 20:26:48 <brooke> I guess I was hoping if I stared at people talking about it long enough, something would come to me
Jan 17 20:27:37 <jasta> no, that will not happen.
Jan 17 20:27:51 <jasta> in fact, that's hopeless.
Jan 17 20:28:04 <jasta> what type of cell phone do you have currently?
Jan 17 20:46:21 <LunohoD_> how much memory do you need to start android?
Jan 17 20:53:36 <brooke> I have a samsung d807 I think it is
Jan 17 21:07:11 <jasta> brooke: buy a smartphone, running Windows Mobile or PalmOS.
Jan 17 21:07:41 <jasta> in a matter of weeks, you will understand the pathetic brokenness that plagues mobile platforms, and you will presumably have many project ideas to improve the situation :)
Jan 17 21:33:34 <jasta> hello zach
Jan 17 21:33:41 <zhobbs> Hi
Jan 17 21:34:09 <zhobbs> everyone working on their challenge entries?
Jan 17 21:34:30 <jasta> i am.
Jan 17 21:39:35 <inovaweb> hi!
Jan 17 21:40:25 <pandora--> hey
Jan 17 21:45:24 <jasta> zhobbs: was that your question? :)
Jan 17 23:39:34 <LunohoD_> re
Jan 17 23:39:56 <LunohoD_> there are many arm processors with java acceleration
Jan 17 23:40:52 <LunohoD_> can dalvik use this acceleration?
Jan 17 23:45:57 <kristian-m> there is graphics acceleration by java (JSR 184) standard in the qualcomm chip, which may be used - i think it's not accelerating "normal" java code though...
Jan 17 23:47:39 <Stephmw> not the same thing
Jan 17 23:47:46 <Stephmw> he's talking about Jazelle
Jan 17 23:47:57 <Stephmw> LunohoD_: answer is no, not at the moment
Jan 17 23:48:16 <Stephmw> LunohoD_: Jazelle can only accelerate java bytecode, dalvik does't use that bytecode directly
Jan 17 23:48:28 <LunohoD_> :(
Jan 17 23:48:45 <Stephmw> get Google and ARM talking, maybe they can work on it
Jan 17 23:49:34 <kristian-m> Stephmw ahkay
Jan 17 23:49:38 <Stephmw> kristian-m: for accelerated 3d graphics, I imagine Google will invent another API to replace Java3D and JSR184...
Jan 17 23:50:25 <kristian-m> Stephmw why should they?
Jan 17 23:50:57 <Stephmw> kristian-m: why break a trend? Google have avoided where possible the use of Java APIs
Jan 17 23:51:08 <Stephmw> kristian-m: too close to Sun's IP
Jan 17 23:51:27 <kristian-m> ... that wouldn't be very pragmatic and take years...
Jan 17 23:51:38 <kristian-m> well, we'll see
Jan 17 23:52:45 <Stephmw> ;)
Jan 17 23:53:01 <Stephmw> Yup, I'm quite looking forward to the 2nd half of this year
Jan 17 23:53:21 <zhobbs> yep
Jan 17 23:55:47 <zhobbs> once google releases the code we'll be able to get the ball rolling
Jan 18 00:00:47 <jasta> let's all fork it
Jan 18 00:00:47 <jasta> hehe
Jan 18 00:01:34 <jasta> i'm kidding, that would be silly.
Jan 18 00:03:12 <Stephmw> there sure is plenty of silliness around the world these days... would we notice one more?
Jan 18 00:06:49 <zhobbs> don't worry, it'll get forked...that's ok though forks can lead to good things
Jan 18 00:08:47 <Stephmw> aye, I mean, look at the Kaffe forks
Jan 18 00:09:03 <Stephmw> over the years it must've been forked a good 40 times, almost all came back to roost
**** ENDING LOGGING AT Fri Jan 18 02:59:57 2008