**** BEGIN LOGGING AT Tue Apr 15 02:59:56 2008 Apr 15 03:00:26 four hours, amirite? Apr 15 03:00:54 yep Apr 15 03:25:33 once again, how do you push .apk into emulator? Apr 15 03:27:20 nvm found it Apr 15 03:29:57 three . five hours Apr 15 03:32:01 Kraln, pondering on doing another submission? :p Apr 15 03:35:32 does anybody know how to force a redraw of a listview/adapter? Apr 15 03:37:42 acsia, .getCursor().requery() on the adapter Apr 15 03:37:56 it is not a cursor adapter Apr 15 03:38:00 I need to force it Apr 15 03:38:34 I basically have an observer on one end and the list on another Apr 15 03:38:39 there is also notifyDataSetChanged() Apr 15 03:38:48 but not sure if it will work for you Apr 15 03:39:35 I am trying that as we speak Apr 15 03:39:57 varjag: no, I'm happy with what I submitted Apr 15 03:39:58 nope.... Apr 15 03:40:08 I can't think of anything I'd like to add or change that is feasible for me to do Apr 15 03:40:15 Kraln, i mean another project in the meantime :p Apr 15 03:44:12 romainguy__: *poke* Apr 15 03:44:20 I replied Apr 15 03:44:25 you need to register :) Apr 15 03:44:41 I know Apr 15 03:44:45 stupid underscores Apr 15 03:48:41 romainguy__, any chance Notification.{expandedTitle,expandedText,appName) will be exposed directly in a future SDK release? Apr 15 03:48:59 no idea why? Apr 15 03:49:59 romainguy__, Because almost all of the other parameters to Notification are, but lacking those three prevent you from avoiding the gigantic constructor that has 10 positional params :) Apr 15 03:50:16 hehe Apr 15 03:50:21 romainguy: which campus are you based in? Apr 15 03:50:21 file a bug :) Apr 15 03:50:31 jjt009: I am in Mountain View Apr 15 03:51:04 romainguy__, As am I, actually. Apr 15 03:51:11 I think Marvin looks to be the best of the location-blog type stuff Apr 15 03:51:18 romainguy: will google be accepting contributions from open source developers for the android source Apr 15 03:51:24 romainguy__, Not sure if we've met.. only been to a few office hours. Apr 15 03:51:33 pawalls: you work for google? Apr 15 03:51:40 jjt009: I don't know and if I knew I could not tell you :) Apr 15 03:52:02 romainguy__, But yeah, I will file a bug. Apr 15 03:52:07 cool Apr 15 03:52:15 romainguy: the source is going to be released? Apr 15 03:53:21 jjt009, You're probably better off checking out the official press releases. Apr 15 03:53:39 jjt009: http://www.openhandsetalliance.com/android_faq.html Apr 15 03:54:06 morrildl: re Apr 15 03:54:41 jjt009: you can ask all of your questions to morrildl, he has answers :) Apr 15 03:54:50 morrildl: hello Apr 15 03:54:56 romainguy: thanks Apr 15 03:55:05 romainguy: that was CRUEL Apr 15 03:55:19 Kraln: what was? Apr 15 03:55:24 oh god, what have I done Apr 15 03:55:27 passing him off like that =) Apr 15 03:55:34 poor morrildl Apr 15 03:55:37 morrildl: how's it going Apr 15 03:55:43 only a few moments left folks!!! Apr 15 03:55:51 f00f-: three hours? Apr 15 03:55:53 Kraln: yes but that's his job :)) Apr 15 03:56:02 yeah man, putting final touches on the documentation Apr 15 03:56:02 * morrildl is..... slightly busy. Apr 15 03:56:04 Kraln: he doesn't have to work on all the bugs you guys file :p Apr 15 03:56:10 morrildl: no problem Apr 15 03:56:15 ;) Apr 15 03:56:16 romainguy: hey, now, I only filed one bug. Apr 15 03:56:24 jasta: have you started thinking about filling out the submission form yet? :P Apr 15 03:56:31 Kraln: problem is, there's thousands of you :p Apr 15 03:56:49 romainguy: did you know that if you dismiss a progressdialog before it gets a chance to appear, it blows up? Apr 15 03:56:59 ye Apr 15 03:56:59 yes Apr 15 03:57:07 is that intentional? =/ Apr 15 03:57:20 not really intentional, but it's a limitation of the implementaiton Apr 15 03:58:54 that's been a big problem for me Apr 15 03:59:01 romainguy: how do i get that to work? Apr 15 03:59:12 I'm essentially doing some network retrieval Apr 15 03:59:26 jjt009: run it in another thread. Apr 15 03:59:41 romainguy: so morrildl is pr? Apr 15 03:59:50 Kraln: and dismiss the progress from within the thread? Apr 15 04:00:01 use a message or something, yes Apr 15 04:00:10 ok thanks Apr 15 04:00:35 ProgressDialog behaves that way precisely because it was being used from background threads Apr 15 04:00:39 but you should avoid doing so Apr 15 04:04:40 romainguy: i don't use an background threads in my code Apr 15 04:04:53 then why do you have a progressdialog?? Apr 15 04:04:53 i essentially have a flow like this: Apr 15 04:05:07 ProgressDialog.show; Apr 15 04:05:14 getNetWorkData() Apr 15 04:05:20 ProgressDialog.dismiss() Apr 15 04:05:22 that will never work Apr 15 04:05:31 you are blocking the UI thread with your getNetworkData Apr 15 04:05:37 preventing the dialog from ever showing up Apr 15 04:05:43 and you application from being repainted Apr 15 04:05:46 it's bad, bad, bad! Apr 15 04:05:48 ok, i see what you're saying Apr 15 04:08:17 so Apr 15 04:08:28 where is everyone posting screencasts of their apps Apr 15 04:08:39 kreativefinally: www.androidchat.net =p Apr 15 04:08:55 first link is a screencast Apr 15 04:09:02 ok Apr 15 04:09:26 you know i was thinking about it today, android is a geek revolution, geeks will no longer really need to be at their desktops / computers all day Apr 15 04:09:51 so through android, geeks will and hopefully earn a new social respect Apr 15 04:10:01 what? you're on coke dude Apr 15 04:10:10 haha Apr 15 04:10:40 srs Apr 15 04:10:41 wtf Apr 15 04:10:51 I'm going to be using Android next to my computer Apr 15 04:10:59 or I'll just keep using the emulator Apr 15 04:12:50 Kraln: so essentially android chat is a traditional chat program with location-based stuff included? Apr 15 04:12:51 i wonder how many people are going to miss the dead line and spam the mailing lists Apr 15 04:13:13 duey: i'm pretty sure most people wont miss the deadline Apr 15 04:13:17 at least nobody is complaining about the deadline extension anymore :) Apr 15 04:13:28 people were complaining about it??? Apr 15 04:13:30 wtf? Apr 15 04:13:37 who complains about an extension Apr 15 04:13:40 duey: exactly what i was thinking? Apr 15 04:13:43 didn't you read the newsgroup? Apr 15 04:13:54 duey: people think that more contributions will lessen their chance of winning Apr 15 04:13:56 i skipped it for about a month Apr 15 04:14:00 jjt009: its a bit more than that, but sure Apr 15 04:14:02 ah Apr 15 04:14:10 cool Apr 15 04:14:51 Kraln: so it's open source Apr 15 04:14:57 i had 6000 unread android mailing list emails in my gmail Apr 15 04:15:00 that's awesome Apr 15 04:15:11 its free and open source. libre, not beer. Apr 15 04:15:28 Kraln: you got a lot of other developers? Apr 15 04:15:29 Androidchat can be used for tons of different purposes Apr 15 04:15:34 just one. Apr 15 04:15:39 * poffy waves Apr 15 04:15:52 poffy: cool Apr 15 04:16:00 i might check out the source Apr 15 04:16:05 Friends can create their own channels to figure out where everyone is Apr 15 04:16:23 Check out some of the application possiblities in the manual Apr 15 04:16:26 awesome stuff Apr 15 04:16:29 jjt009: if it stops you from asking inane questions in here, go ahead Apr 15 04:16:38 =) Apr 15 04:16:50 Kraln: i'm sorry Apr 15 04:17:01 heh Apr 15 04:17:13 Kraln: i usually look things up, but the deadline was approaching and i needed quick answers Apr 15 04:22:09 possible to implement sap or oracle on the android platform Apr 15 04:28:12 jasta, around? Apr 15 04:29:31 yikes, soon is time to send it =D Apr 15 04:29:38 2.5 hours Apr 15 04:30:11 isn't it 1,5? Apr 15 04:30:17 oh well Apr 15 04:30:38 http://code.google.com/p/weatherphone Apr 15 04:30:49 i have put up some screenshots of the application :) Apr 15 04:32:59 michaelnovakjr: have you looked at plotting the weather regions on the map? Apr 15 04:33:29 yes, that will be included with gps abilities in a future release... Apr 15 04:33:36 what do you think? Apr 15 04:33:45 sounds good. is it push or poll? Apr 15 04:33:54 pull Apr 15 04:33:59 you can set the time interval Apr 15 04:34:47 looking good michaelnovakjr Apr 15 04:34:50 re Apr 15 04:34:58 michaelnovakjr: you might consider making it push Apr 15 04:35:23 i was thinking about it Apr 15 04:35:54 maybe making it an option? Apr 15 04:36:41 gotta use Gtalk for push Apr 15 04:37:23 have you worked with it zhobbs? Apr 15 04:37:37 Gtalk? Nope Apr 15 04:37:39 adding GTalk support NOW? Apr 15 04:37:48 why not, 2.5 hours left? Apr 15 04:37:50 who me? Apr 15 04:37:52 haha Apr 15 04:38:09 good luck Apr 15 04:38:19 figure out the server tomorrow Apr 15 04:38:20 michaelnovakjr: essentially you could have users register their number for alerts or something Apr 15 04:38:31 or have a daemon sign in to a web service that pushes alerts Apr 15 04:38:37 or you can just use SMS wap push with a binary payload Apr 15 04:38:45 but you'd need to use an SMSC for that Apr 15 04:38:46 that too Apr 15 04:39:10 yea, i definitely want the ability to push.... i am running the data servers the phones connect to so the options are there Apr 15 04:42:21 you should link up to the androidchat network =) Apr 15 04:42:45 anyone still working on their entry? Apr 15 04:42:54 i am submitting now :) Apr 15 04:43:05 same here Apr 15 04:43:17 i noticed anddev.org is dead Apr 15 04:43:19 is anyone putting their apps up for download anywhere? Apr 15 04:43:27 server overload? ;) Apr 15 04:43:32 haha Apr 15 04:43:45 michaelnovakjr: mine is up at www.androidchat.net Apr 15 04:44:08 \ Apr 15 04:44:09 I think anddev went to permission problem, dunno if it's on purpose or not =) Apr 15 04:44:10 err Apr 15 04:44:11 www.tetrinoid.com Apr 15 04:44:57 jerkface03: so it's a networking and collision lib? Apr 15 04:45:01 cool Apr 15 04:45:10 collision had to be scrapped cause it was buggy, but it's networking twitch lib Apr 15 04:45:13 you use a taylor series? Apr 15 04:45:20 to approximate positions of entities? or Apr 15 04:45:20 so game entity synchronization stuffs Apr 15 04:45:23 cubic spline? Apr 15 04:45:24 muliplexing Apr 15 04:45:26 etc.. etc.. Apr 15 04:45:36 whats your lag compensation? Apr 15 04:45:52 na, nothing fancy like cubic splines, it's very very simple movement prediction stuff Apr 15 04:45:58 oh dude Apr 15 04:46:02 you should totally taylor series it up Apr 15 04:46:13 cubic interpolation is the bees knees Apr 15 04:46:22 werd, one of these days Apr 15 04:46:25 i'm gonna keep working on it Apr 15 04:46:31 i opted for the simple ways cause you know Apr 15 04:46:34 resources are limited Apr 15 04:47:18 and they're easier to implement ;) Apr 15 04:50:37 i think ListView focus has defeated me Apr 15 04:50:54 rektide: just don't mess with it :) Apr 15 04:51:12 no choice too late Apr 15 04:51:56 submitted :) Apr 15 04:55:26 wee :) Apr 15 04:55:42 * Kraln buys michaelnovakjr an beer Apr 15 04:55:50 thank you sir! Apr 15 04:55:57 an beer? Apr 15 04:55:57 wtf Apr 15 04:56:03 haha Apr 15 04:56:16 its been been rough today :) Apr 15 04:56:24 rough past five days Apr 15 04:56:28 true Apr 15 05:00:02 past last months since first sdk was released Apr 15 05:00:24 yeah man Apr 15 05:00:29 rough since january 3, 2008 Apr 15 05:00:34 totally Apr 15 05:00:35 first mobile platform for me, so it was a lot of pain in my ass =) Apr 15 05:00:41 I started when the sdk was first released Apr 15 05:00:45 then stopped until a week ago Apr 15 05:00:45 its only the beginning :) Apr 15 05:00:47 hehehe Apr 15 05:00:47 same here Apr 15 05:00:51 but a good learning experience Hai-Fai Apr 15 05:00:57 definately Apr 15 05:01:00 i enjoyed it very much Apr 15 05:01:00 i'd say much better than my first Java ME experience Apr 15 05:01:10 i am a fan of xml layouts! Apr 15 05:01:11 nice Apr 15 05:02:43 i made a notepad1 exercise in december, then started on my app on friday Apr 15 05:03:23 I never even made those notepad exercises =D Apr 15 05:03:41 well i didn't get past the 1st one Apr 15 05:03:46 Two hours! Apr 15 05:04:29 yikes Apr 15 05:04:31 oh wow, even before january Apr 15 05:04:40 17 dec 2007 8:16 pm Apr 15 05:04:41 first checkin Apr 15 05:04:46 I noticed on november Apr 15 05:04:49 * f00f- sheds a tear Apr 15 05:05:02 hard worker you are Apr 15 05:05:13 thanks Yoda Apr 15 05:05:14 yeah we all deserve something Apr 15 05:06:44 would be nice if everyone could get something =) but I'm affraid I'm not on top 50, just have to hope for the best and fear the worst Apr 15 05:06:48 I haven't received e-mail confirmation of last submission... Strange Apr 15 05:09:51 Ah, it's ok, just got stuck on mail server for some reason. :p Apr 15 05:11:52 It would be great, though, if submission aconfirmation answers had sent files bundled. So submitter won't panic that may be he sent wrong files. Apr 15 05:14:37 is it over yet? Apr 15 05:14:52 hah, we'll tell you Apr 15 05:15:02 morrildl, change the topic when its over thanks :D Apr 15 05:16:45 doing machine learning expeirments takes forever Apr 15 05:16:47 so annoying Apr 15 05:17:05 i wish java worked accross multiple cpus Apr 15 05:17:13 duey: er? Apr 15 05:17:23 its running at 50% Apr 15 05:17:25 of cpu Apr 15 05:17:32 then spawn new threads... Apr 15 05:17:44 could be windows.. Apr 15 05:17:54 definately Windows Apr 15 05:17:54 =P Apr 15 05:18:25 i wish weka spawned things in multiple threads Apr 15 05:18:36 double the fun Apr 15 05:20:22 Kraln, <3 Androidchat Apr 15 05:23:22 =) Apr 15 05:24:35 poffy: you have approximately an hour and a half to find any bugs Apr 15 05:24:38 better get looking Apr 15 05:25:27 I was looking Apr 15 05:25:39 Nothing horrible Apr 15 05:25:46 or bad, for that matter Apr 15 05:32:05 brb Apr 15 05:39:00 poffy: I think notifications for messages in other channels somehow got broken Apr 15 05:39:14 but the ones for private messages still work, and those are the important ones, so whatever Apr 15 05:41:24 * Kraln shrugs Apr 15 05:41:49 yeah Apr 15 05:42:29 I'm not to bothered by that. it was probably me trying to make them launch the channel view Apr 15 05:42:32 * Kraln eyes zhobbs Apr 15 05:42:58 anyone do a podcast application? Apr 15 05:43:20 * zhobbs wakes up Apr 15 05:43:31 Kraln: what's up? Apr 15 05:43:43 nothing, blaming you for my own breaking of stuff past feature freeze =) Apr 15 05:43:48 haha Apr 15 05:43:49 haha Apr 15 05:44:16 it didn't work? Apr 15 05:44:27 it worse than didn't work Apr 15 05:44:30 it broke Apr 15 05:44:44 not a huge deal though Apr 15 05:44:55 IF WE LOSE ITS YOUR FAULT Apr 15 05:44:59 zhobbs Apr 15 05:45:20 I hope the text isn't too hard to read on a real device. Apr 15 05:45:20 :) Apr 15 05:45:37 Kraln, it's about the size of text on any other cell phone Apr 15 05:45:43 maybe it will be when 2 of my apps bump you out :) Apr 15 05:45:49 haha, j/k Apr 15 05:45:53 heh Apr 15 05:46:00 don't have the highest hopes actually Apr 15 05:46:11 us or you? =) Apr 15 05:46:16 mine Apr 15 05:46:41 why not? =/ Apr 15 05:46:52 hey anddev site is closed today? Apr 15 05:47:08 did them for clients...so they gave me specs and I did it, I'll have to really get something I'm passionate about for challenge II Apr 15 05:47:11 poffy: remember the screen on a mobile is only 60% the size Apr 15 05:47:11 what do you mean "closed"? Apr 15 05:47:26 its saying forbideen Apr 15 05:47:27 sandesh: his site broke, he probably went over some bandwidth limit Apr 15 05:47:39 * Kraln doesn't have a bandwidth limit Apr 15 05:47:39 ah, he might have :) Apr 15 05:47:50 qq Apr 15 05:47:51 * Kraln doesn't like bandwidth limits Apr 15 05:47:56 all the lurkers with their projects suddenly joining :) Apr 15 05:47:58 plusminus is sleeping right now though :) Apr 15 05:48:01 i have a dedicated server thats hardly used Apr 15 05:48:10 * Kraln owns a hosting company Apr 15 05:48:10 got like 1TB Apr 15 05:48:24 * Kraln has a gigabit ethernet cable to the internet Apr 15 05:48:28 so now i cant get help from d site Apr 15 05:48:29 there is no such thing as unlimited bandwidth Apr 15 05:48:37 i would never buy from a place that claims to have Apr 15 05:48:40 f00f-: no, it's limited. to 1000gb full duplex Apr 15 05:48:45 :-D Apr 15 05:48:57 uh.. Apr 15 05:49:02 sandesh, wait until it is back up :) Apr 15 05:49:08 ah ok Apr 15 05:49:16 f00f-: also, for my customers, I don't limit them on transfer, I limit them to an average throughput. there are no 'bandwidth exceeded' errors for my customers Apr 15 05:49:35 ok Apr 15 05:49:36 where's the list of apps on the web? Apr 15 05:49:47 i am curious if someone has done a podcast app Apr 15 05:49:53 there is nolist Apr 15 05:50:03 there's one on helloandroid but its hardly complete Apr 15 05:50:08 a list, I mean Apr 15 05:50:14 android:nolist Apr 15 05:50:16 i thought jasta mentioned something where people were posting Apr 15 05:50:16 sorry Apr 15 05:50:21 too much xml today Apr 15 05:50:26 haha Apr 15 05:50:28 michaelnovakjr: on the mailing list Apr 15 05:50:53 i was comtemplating subliminal messages Apr 15 05:50:55 "best app ever" Apr 15 05:50:58 etcetc Apr 15 05:51:02 so can any one tell me other then anddev which one to prefer now Apr 15 05:51:12 helloandroid.com is the other Apr 15 05:51:21 whoever is trying out androidchat forgot to quit their client lol Apr 15 05:52:37 hey avi123 Apr 15 05:52:44 avi123: Apr 15 05:52:44 where re Apr 15 05:52:56 anddev site is closed Apr 15 05:53:09 seriously Apr 15 05:53:19 he went over bandwith limit Apr 15 05:53:25 k Apr 15 05:53:37 so it will take time to come back Apr 15 05:53:42 k Apr 15 05:53:45 how much Apr 15 05:53:58 by the time u can take help of helloandroid site Apr 15 05:54:06 k Apr 15 05:54:16 send me the link Apr 15 05:54:18 hey how much time dont know Apr 15 05:54:24 k Apr 15 05:54:52 plusminus is sleeping Apr 15 05:54:59 lets call him Apr 15 05:55:06 haha Apr 15 05:55:08 k Apr 15 05:55:08 Does anyone live near Portland and want to go to the InnoTech conferences this Wednesday and Thursday? My company has booth and is giving out free passes ... message me if you are interested Apr 15 05:55:11 dude what do you need that bad Apr 15 05:55:35 fly me up Apr 15 05:55:37 tell him tht his site is broken Apr 15 05:55:37 then i'm down Apr 15 05:55:54 lol ... wish I could Apr 15 05:56:00 chedyecho shepata sangta mare Apr 15 05:56:29 im thinking of going to startupcon or whatever at moscone on may 5th weekend Apr 15 05:56:43 is anyone going to Google I/O? I just booked my flight Apr 15 05:57:13 raidfive.... where do you live? Apr 15 05:57:32 Vancouver, Washington ... just north of Portland Apr 15 05:59:44 time to submit!!! Apr 15 06:00:07 i would go to google, but the flight is probably very expensive :) Apr 15 06:00:12 one hour remains! Apr 15 06:00:46 flight be damned, housing and transit are yuck Apr 15 06:01:37 tic tac Apr 15 06:02:37 fuck this. i'm done :) Apr 15 06:02:40 i think its tic-toc Apr 15 06:02:40 submitted, i give up ;) Apr 15 06:02:44 i hope i get a t-shirt for my submission Apr 15 06:03:58 jasta, http://code.google.com/p/weatherphone Apr 15 06:07:18 michaelnovakjr: Heh, you also didn't know that SDK has tool for making screenshots? Apr 15 06:07:49 nope, too tired to learn new stuff Apr 15 06:08:11 Same here:) Apr 15 06:08:54 I am staying up for another 52 minutes Apr 15 06:09:02 and then I am not going to wake up for a week Apr 15 06:09:30 "Thanks for submitting your application for the Android Developer Challenge." Apr 15 06:09:31 !!! Apr 15 06:09:34 finally Apr 15 06:10:46 their servers going a little slow or just you raidfive? Apr 15 06:11:34 what do you mean? Apr 15 06:12:31 raidfive> finally Apr 15 06:12:34 what do YOU mean Apr 15 06:14:50 why did you say "finally" Apr 15 06:19:15 I finally submitted my application ... as in, I'm glad it is over Apr 15 06:19:33 less pressure Apr 15 06:24:56 any way to set speed at which animateTo() moves? Apr 15 06:24:58 it's a bit fast Apr 15 06:25:02 i'd like to slow it down Apr 15 06:25:54 I didn't see anything f00f- Apr 15 06:26:07 it was almost instant for me Apr 15 06:26:58 half hour :) Apr 15 06:27:06 tick tock .... Apr 15 06:30:02 too late Apr 15 06:30:03 3rd submit Apr 15 06:30:04 i am done Apr 15 06:30:05 WHEW! Apr 15 06:30:08 waiting for confirmation Apr 15 06:30:09 ... Apr 15 06:30:14 ... Apr 15 06:30:14 ... Apr 15 06:30:15 got it Apr 15 06:31:42 done/done Apr 15 06:32:20 well Apr 15 06:32:27 the mail says "New ADC Submission" Apr 15 06:32:30 even though it was a resubmit Apr 15 06:32:31 but whatever Apr 15 06:32:34 they'll figure it out Apr 15 06:32:45 good luck folks Apr 15 06:32:52 especially those who are doing a final code sprint Apr 15 06:33:12 half hour Apr 15 06:33:41 what happened to anddev.org? Apr 15 06:33:51 exceeded bandwidth is my guess Apr 15 06:34:04 wanted to check the clock :) Apr 15 06:34:13 haha, half hour Apr 15 06:34:27 good luck fellas Apr 15 06:34:39 good luck! Apr 15 06:37:27 so, how long will the judging be Apr 15 06:37:36 will we know results after lunch? Apr 15 06:37:45 haha Apr 15 06:37:47 breakfast Apr 15 06:38:06 hope google doesn't have the winners list yet Apr 15 06:38:37 i want a free android t-shirt! Apr 15 06:38:48 given the low volume of submissions (atleast by the forums count), its not going to take more than a few days Apr 15 06:40:06 romainguy should release a new sdk Apr 15 06:40:08 right now Apr 15 06:40:27 you're in such a hurry to port your app to a new SDK? :) Apr 15 06:40:44 if it has working ListView focus yes. ;) Apr 15 06:40:52 focus works in listview Apr 15 06:40:56 dude take a break :) Apr 15 06:41:05 muthu: The forum count is an underestimate Apr 15 06:41:13 romainguy_: i'm sure you are itching to release a new SDK ;) Apr 15 06:41:16 ListView.setSelection() doesnt seem to do anything for me Apr 15 06:41:24 i have a couple different ListViews on the page Apr 15 06:41:25 rektide: in touch mode, no, not in M5 Apr 15 06:41:29 morrildl whats an more estimated count? Apr 15 06:41:35 morrildl: by how much? Apr 15 06:41:44 muthu: I'm itching to be done with my list of features/bugs/tasks :)) Apr 15 06:41:50 will google announce the count tommorrow? Apr 15 06:41:52 which will take me a few clones :)) Apr 15 06:42:14 romainguy_: tabs are restored? Apr 15 06:42:25 they are already restored in M5 Apr 15 06:42:34 ok, i find tabs still deprecated Apr 15 06:42:42 just TabActivity Apr 15 06:42:56 but they were revived enough for Contacts Apr 15 06:43:01 they still need a lot of work Apr 15 06:43:29 romainguy_: ok, almost every app is using tabs Apr 15 06:43:48 i am not, i'm using a prev/next wizard Apr 15 06:43:52 maybe i should have used tabs :/ Apr 15 06:44:03 tabs might be fine to show two/three pages Apr 15 06:44:09 morrildl: is it in the 1000's? Apr 15 06:44:19 but they're usually a good indication that you're making a UI too complex Apr 15 06:44:35 but then why everyone is using Apr 15 06:44:44 because most developers suck at UI :) Apr 15 06:44:48 i didn't :) Apr 15 06:44:49 lol Apr 15 06:45:01 no tabs here Apr 15 06:45:12 i don't think my UI is so great.... but i didn't use tabs! Apr 15 06:45:17 as long as you don't use trees everywhere... :) Apr 15 06:45:26 haha trees and tabs Apr 15 06:45:28 nope Apr 15 06:45:43 http://code.google.com/p/weatherphone that is mine romainguy Apr 15 06:45:49 I saw :) Apr 15 06:45:57 i kept it simple Apr 15 06:46:09 didn't want to take away from the purpose Apr 15 06:47:03 hope atleast 10 boring simple utilties makes into the winners list Apr 15 06:47:22 like cooking ;) Apr 15 06:47:23 hopefully mine :) Apr 15 06:47:30 weather! Apr 15 06:47:36 haha Apr 15 06:47:39 lol Apr 15 06:48:04 i'm happy to be back working on my mobile search engine Apr 15 06:48:05 calculator!!! Apr 15 06:48:16 image viewer! Apr 15 06:48:18 :) Apr 15 06:48:23 i am thinking about writing a podcast app, i am big on podcasts :) Apr 15 06:48:26 dumb q Apr 15 06:48:29 how do i get the apk file? Apr 15 06:48:29 stuff google should have already implemented Apr 15 06:48:40 challenge II would be fun Apr 15 06:48:44 yea Apr 15 06:48:47 michaelnovakjr, I have a love for podcasts too Apr 15 06:49:00 rektide, look in \bin Apr 15 06:49:06 if no one does one i'm going to jump on it Apr 15 06:49:20 or even if maybe i will anyway Apr 15 06:49:21 :) Apr 15 06:49:58 submitted Apr 15 06:50:16 so romainguy, i never could move focus from one ListView to another Apr 15 06:50:25 and i could never figure out how to clear focus from a ListView Apr 15 06:50:36 rektide: setSelection(-1) Apr 15 06:50:40 i never could tell whether i was supposed to be dealing with children, with the ListAdapter or with the ListView Apr 15 06:51:39 yeah i tried that fro a while Apr 15 06:52:17 but really applications should avoid messing with the focus Apr 15 06:52:35 aside from choosing the view focused by default Apr 15 06:52:38 i have three listviews, the default onKeyEvent handlers did very very strange things Apr 15 06:52:50 i assumed i was meant to manually do all that Apr 15 06:52:54 its a three column layout Apr 15 06:53:02 no, you're not supposed to do anything :) Apr 15 06:53:09 three columns, in landscape? Apr 15 06:53:11 yes Apr 15 06:53:16 ok Apr 15 06:53:22 i spent days trying to fight that under control Apr 15 06:53:35 well, we spent days making it a lot better post M5 :)) Apr 15 06:54:07 the submission form should have had a "run on untested super experimental verison" Apr 15 06:54:15 i would've gone for that Apr 15 06:55:31 ok, finally got my blog post up for my android application: http://blog.mapwith.us/?p=6 Apr 15 06:59:29 1hour left? Apr 15 06:59:38 anyone still working on their submission? Apr 15 06:59:40 one minute Apr 15 06:59:43 left Apr 15 06:59:49 too late Apr 15 06:59:51 i hope no one is Apr 15 07:00:05 DING Apr 15 07:00:08 deadline =) Apr 15 07:00:13 \o/ PARTY TIME \o/ Apr 15 07:00:24 hell yea! Apr 15 07:00:33 and by party what i really mean is sleep Apr 15 07:00:33 good night Apr 15 07:01:26 sleep is good Apr 15 07:01:37 time to go get some beer!!! Apr 15 07:01:41 and food Apr 15 07:01:48 but beer first of course Apr 15 07:02:36 definitely beer Apr 15 07:02:56 mmm Apr 15 07:03:06 have a good one guys, good luck trying to keep yourselves from going crazy waiting for the results! Apr 15 07:03:13 ok submitted my app to hello android Apr 15 07:03:13 okay man Apr 15 07:03:42 i'm just hoping for a 'free tshirt' result Apr 15 07:04:05 and a new SDK revision Apr 15 07:05:37 :P Apr 15 07:07:13 night folks! Apr 15 07:07:14 & Apr 15 07:07:30 thus marks the end of 4 months of the absolute worst code productivity of my life Apr 15 07:07:48 i never thought i'd be so happy to see SVG and Javascript again Apr 15 07:07:56 XSLT and atom Apr 15 07:08:16 its like there was a misfile and i'm being let back in to heaven again Apr 15 07:08:24 ahhhhhhhhhhhhh Apr 15 07:08:28 ;) Apr 15 07:11:08 party!! Apr 15 07:11:35 ehehhe Apr 15 07:12:04 * davidw finally got a good sleep without dreaming of androids and electrip sheep and things Apr 15 07:12:24 davidw: heh Apr 15 07:12:52 OFFICIALLY OVER Apr 15 07:12:54 oh, hi... up watching the last things trickle in? how many are there? Apr 15 07:13:09 fluidnexus - http://vimeo.com/899706 Apr 15 07:13:44 davidw: I wouldn't call it a trickle, but basically yes :) Apr 15 07:14:38 someone ported jetty to android. _that is awsome_ Apr 15 07:14:47 that is so extremely totally awsome Apr 15 07:14:55 i should have made my project a website hosted by android Apr 15 07:15:18 hrm... strikes me as neat, but kind of a hack Apr 15 07:15:22 its over, i hate java Apr 15 07:15:31 inner classes kind of kick ass tbh Apr 15 07:15:42 they're what make the lack of polymorphism acceptable Apr 15 07:15:48 in a crazy nutty aspectual kind of way Apr 15 07:16:33 Time for sleep. Apr 15 07:16:46 I crave unconsciousness Apr 15 07:16:52 eheheh:-) Apr 15 07:16:54 And so I take my leave Apr 15 07:17:01 'night Apr 15 07:21:24 i think i'm gonna post my server's code and maybe my apk to let folks try it out without hitting my demo server Apr 15 07:21:35 though i don't really care to right now Apr 15 07:21:38 got yours submitted jasta ? Apr 15 07:21:42 party time :D! Apr 15 07:21:49 duey: well yeah, its 20 minutes past the deadline :) Apr 15 07:21:58 duey: http://android-five.googlecode.com -- posted some screenshots Apr 15 07:22:04 yeah i had a look Apr 15 07:22:06 looks awesome Apr 15 07:22:10 very polished Apr 15 07:22:12 good job Apr 15 07:22:13 it is awesome :) Apr 15 07:22:29 though there is some lame ass bug that can throw up an assertion error (which you can ignore) Apr 15 07:22:43 i now understand why you bugged romainguy all the time Apr 15 07:22:47 i caught it last minute. no idea how i didnt catch it before Apr 15 07:22:50 hmm Apr 15 07:22:59 duey: yeah, i took advantage of the UI toolkit quite a lot i'd say Apr 15 07:23:21 I wonder how many submissions Apr 15 07:23:44 2k? Apr 15 07:23:46 1k? Apr 15 07:23:49 5k? Apr 15 07:23:54 i bet somewhere around 500 - 1500 Apr 15 07:23:57 jebus Apr 15 07:24:12 i don't think its possible to guage Apr 15 07:24:18 no, but it's possible to guess Apr 15 07:24:26 ten million on the line Apr 15 07:24:27 there are many people not on the forums, mailing lists, here etc Apr 15 07:24:30 any tom dick and harry Apr 15 07:24:36 would submit something Apr 15 07:24:49 people will be submitting hello world apps Apr 15 07:24:51 who here is going to be pissed if someone submits their idea better than them? Apr 15 07:25:18 mines pretty unique Apr 15 07:25:29 but its not going to stop me continuing development if someone else has done it Apr 15 07:25:36 Kraln: well, best man wins i suppose. Apr 15 07:25:45 if someone really can do my idea better than me, then hats off to them Apr 15 07:26:03 yeah, let the better stuff win Apr 15 07:26:20 though my idea is pretty unusual. i would think it odd that someone else had the same thought. Apr 15 07:27:16 jasta: you'll be surprise how people can come with the same idea often Apr 15 07:27:42 well, if they have, and they have bested me, oh well. Apr 15 07:27:56 i could only hope that their app will be open so that we can collaborate moving forward Apr 15 07:28:04 great Apr 15 07:28:39 if someone bestest you at your app jasta i call hax Apr 15 07:28:50 damn them maphackers Apr 15 07:28:59 and wallers Apr 15 07:29:46 jasta: screenshots look great Apr 15 07:29:59 good job Apr 15 07:30:20 thanks Apr 15 07:30:40 better get coding for the second round Apr 15 07:30:46 i'm officially taking 1 week off Apr 15 07:30:49 lo Apr 15 07:30:51 l Apr 15 07:31:33 lol Apr 15 07:31:42 stupid experiments still running Apr 15 07:31:52 i was hoping only an hour :( Apr 15 07:33:08 duey: what experiment? Apr 15 07:33:18 just uni assignments Apr 15 07:34:03 ok Apr 15 07:34:09 (machine learning Apr 15 07:34:15 data mining etc Apr 15 07:34:21 hmm Apr 15 07:34:33 hmm, with Google Code's wiki, how could I put captions on my images? Apr 15 07:34:39 on the screenshots Apr 15 07:34:46 no idea Apr 15 07:36:47 anyway, time for bed Apr 15 07:36:52 good luck to everyone Apr 15 07:37:01 goodnight jasta Apr 15 07:37:45 i'm excited to get the next SDK to play with :) Apr 15 07:37:53 that will horribly explode my app Apr 15 07:50:06 oh, did they mention that? Apr 15 08:15:54 cool - anyone else hear from this woman from Forbes? Apr 15 08:16:38 ? Apr 15 08:18:49 "We've been trying to submit since one hour before the deadline and we Apr 15 08:18:49 couldn't get it. Now the submissions are closed. Does anybody know who Apr 15 08:18:49 ca we contact to send our application directly? Apr 15 08:18:51 poor guy Apr 15 08:28:13 hope he had send emails earlier Apr 15 09:04:31 duey: oh wow Apr 15 09:04:39 that has to hurt Apr 15 09:04:47 yep Apr 15 09:04:56 but thats what happens when you leave it late Apr 15 09:05:02 yeah Apr 15 09:05:10 i anticipated it would get overloaded or something Apr 15 09:05:20 or my internet connection might die etcetc Apr 15 09:05:23 overloaded? Apr 15 09:05:26 google? Apr 15 09:05:27 :P Apr 15 09:06:02 yeah well Apr 15 09:06:11 no body is perfect Apr 15 09:07:47 i suspect more like some odd browser/proxy/gateway problem Apr 15 09:09:06 na they probably had filesize to big Apr 15 10:46:07 Hehm everything is silent... Even helloandroid.com is dead. Apr 15 10:51:13 hi i wanna ask about parameters for starting new subactivity . i have my own (its serializable) class instance and i want add it to extra parameters Apr 15 10:51:22 Intent intent = new Intern(this, PropertiesActivity.class); Apr 15 10:51:22 intent.putExtra("whiter4bbit.classes.Class", classInstance); Apr 15 10:51:22 startSubActivity(intent, PROPERTIES); Apr 15 10:51:31 thatz not working way Apr 15 10:51:57 in android developers list one guy says that is a bug in M5 its really?) Apr 15 10:53:23 there is anybody who is google representative? there is a patch that fixes this bug (if its a bug) Apr 15 10:53:34 ? Apr 15 10:53:40 they are all sleeping? Apr 15 10:54:01 what time is it in your country?) Apr 15 10:54:07 11pm Apr 15 10:54:23 but i believe its more like 4am google time Apr 15 11:15:56 where does stderr go for native applications ? Just got a very small app which sends something to stderr (double-checked with strace) and it doesn't go anywhere Apr 15 11:18:55 bilboed-tp: To console, I think. Better just use Log.e instead Apr 15 11:19:46 *native* applications => C, not Java Apr 15 11:33:07 bilboed-tp, http://www.anddev.org/native_c_-und-quothello_world-und-quot_working_in_emulator-t61.html Apr 15 11:33:35 whiter4bbit, eh, nice page. thx for the tip Apr 15 11:34:47 whiter4bbit, err... wait, that's for c++ Apr 15 11:35:04 whiter4bbit, and doesn't have anything about stderr Apr 15 11:35:57 so Apr 15 11:36:00 look here http://groups.google.com/group/android-developers/browse_thread/thread/dffafba924e3a2e6/52f09cb4dd9687cc?lnk=raot#52f09cb4dd9687cc Apr 15 11:38:16 wait, my problem is not compiling native C applications, nor creating shared/static libraries, nor using "highly-modified" libc, all of that I've solved. I've got a few applications using shared libraries running on it. Apr 15 11:38:36 my only problem is getting stderr to not go to /dev/null or oblivion Apr 15 12:35:54 http://www.forbes.com/technology/2008/04/14/android-developers-challenge-tech-wire-cx_ew_0415android.html Apr 15 12:35:55 :-) Apr 15 12:39:52 davidw: you are even more popular now Apr 15 13:10:09 dims: have you submitted to ADC? Apr 15 13:10:45 anyone NOT submitted to ADC? Apr 15 13:13:12 muthu: where's your app? Apr 15 13:13:49 zhobbs: as said before, i did it with partnership Apr 15 13:14:25 my product is mobeegal.in - coming out June Apr 15 13:14:55 planning to enter mobeegal for challenge II Apr 15 13:15:34 hi there i submitted this: http://www.mikrokopter.de/ucwiki/en/DUBwise Apr 15 13:16:13 need to make screenshots & screencasts from the android version when work is over Apr 15 13:18:06 ligi: what does it do? Apr 15 13:18:24 muthu: see the feature list in the wiki Apr 15 13:18:38 saw that, but couldn't really understand Apr 15 13:18:52 who are the users? Apr 15 13:18:59 Pilots Apr 15 13:19:10 ok Apr 15 13:19:26 you know the QuadroKopter devices? Apr 15 13:19:59 nope Apr 15 13:21:13 this is mine: http://www.mikrokopter.de/ucwiki/en/CampKopter Apr 15 13:21:25 just look one of the videos and u understand Apr 15 13:21:28 ok.. checking Apr 15 13:22:38 or look here: http://ligi-tec.blogspot.com/ Apr 15 13:23:25 wow, looks like fun Apr 15 13:23:59 ;-) Apr 15 13:24:10 fun roxx Apr 15 13:24:37 but there is a serious side too: http://www.mikrokopter.de/ucwiki/en/SeriousUseCases Apr 15 13:25:48 interesting Apr 15 13:25:56 thanx Apr 15 13:26:28 had only 20hours for the coding - so i hope the concept will do the job ;-) Apr 15 13:26:33 roof inspection - i love this ;) Apr 15 13:26:46 only 20H? Apr 15 13:26:54 20 houres Apr 15 13:26:56 what you submit? Apr 15 13:27:13 the DUBwise version for Android Apr 15 13:27:19 oh right Apr 15 13:36:48 good morning Apr 15 13:36:56 good monring Apr 15 13:36:59 morning Apr 15 13:37:01 hi AstainHellbring Apr 15 13:37:06 muthu: nope Apr 15 13:37:07 evening Apr 15 13:37:14 dims: why not? Apr 15 13:37:20 you had some fantastic tutorials Apr 15 13:38:49 thanks. long answer, am involved in harmony at Apache and since Android used Harmony stuff, it will help everyone, so poked around and wrote those tutorials. Short Answer, not enough time :) Apr 15 13:39:35 ok Apr 15 14:11:48 ... a tumbleweed rolls through ... Apr 15 14:12:10 Everyone is re-cooperating Apr 15 14:12:26 * poffy slept in this morning Apr 15 14:13:22 eheh, me too:-) Apr 15 14:14:25 I'm going to log on and see if anyone has used my submission, yet Apr 15 14:17:08 Now I have to decide if I want to start my next Android project Apr 15 14:17:16 on what? Apr 15 14:17:50 on what? What's my next project? or where did I log on? Apr 15 14:17:57 next project? Apr 15 14:18:11 yah Apr 15 14:18:13 I want to do a location based game Apr 15 14:18:16 next project? Apr 15 14:18:21 o Apr 15 14:18:23 I have some really good ideas Apr 15 14:18:23 nice Apr 15 14:18:30 I'm a game developer at heart Apr 15 14:18:33 what devices u have Android on Apr 15 14:18:48 or emulator? Apr 15 14:18:49 ohh thats kewl based off of gps? Apr 15 14:18:52 just emulator Apr 15 14:18:54 o Apr 15 14:19:07 u on Windoze? Apr 15 14:19:09 no Apr 15 14:19:10 Mac Apr 15 14:19:12 o Apr 15 14:19:25 i need to get the Windoze Emulator Apr 15 14:19:39 lenny download the sdk Apr 15 14:19:44 anybody in here porting Android to a device... Apr 15 14:19:45 i will Apr 15 14:19:47 tonight Apr 15 14:20:46 I'm considering working on a MMORPG Apr 15 14:20:54 Less like WoW Apr 15 14:20:58 more like Pokemon Apr 15 14:21:01 if that makes any sense Apr 15 14:21:04 sorda Apr 15 14:21:05 hehe Apr 15 14:21:24 anybody in here porting Android to a device... Apr 15 14:21:51 I actually liked the concept of the Megaman NT Warrior game/shows (Human carries around a device with his/her fighting program on it and battles other people near by) Apr 15 14:21:52 * davidw wants a phone Apr 15 14:22:06 Lenny|Work, kind of tough to do without source code Apr 15 14:22:13 i know.. Apr 15 14:22:15 but Apr 15 14:22:21 its werking a lil so far Apr 15 14:22:28 three devices i know of with it running Apr 15 14:22:43 the kernel source is the most important part of it all Apr 15 14:23:03 two of them touchscreen and all... Apr 15 14:23:07 just no radio for phone yet Apr 15 14:23:57 that part I bet will take having a fully released android phone Apr 15 14:24:06 prob so Apr 15 14:25:49 best bets for dreamy to be first phone (next month?) Apr 15 14:26:02 not sure on date...just end of 08 i heard Apr 15 14:26:16 well rumors are betting on next month Apr 15 14:26:20 nice Apr 15 14:26:24 i hope so Apr 15 14:26:28 wow that makes for some definate fun there Apr 15 14:26:34 def Apr 15 14:26:43 me too, but unfortenately I just wished that it were final version of sdk before that Apr 15 14:26:55 hehe Apr 15 14:26:57 gl on that Apr 15 14:27:16 i hear they gonna wait till after like 2 or 3 phones release with it to release SDK Apr 15 14:27:26 yep that's sad Apr 15 14:27:37 but Apr 15 14:27:40 understandable Apr 15 14:27:46 well yeah Apr 15 14:27:57 they wanna have the first android phones.. Apr 15 14:28:15 me too =P Apr 15 14:28:21 agreed Apr 15 14:34:21 i'm looking towards the next update to my app :) Apr 15 14:35:27 it's understandable because they don't want people selling phones that suck Apr 15 14:36:16 suck? Apr 15 14:36:17 nah Apr 15 14:36:24 their scured they'll be better Apr 15 14:36:25 lol Apr 15 14:37:51 they need good phones Apr 15 14:37:55 well, the open handset alliance is... well, *open* Apr 15 14:38:05 so presumably they can join that if they want to build a phone Apr 15 14:38:26 but given all the bugs in the sdk, it's very unlikely that some cheap clone manufacturer would make something "better" Apr 15 14:38:42 they're not going to stop and fix that stuff, they're just going to slap it on a phone and call it good Apr 15 14:38:45 they'll be more sdks before a phon Apr 15 14:38:45 e Apr 15 14:39:11 michaelnovakjr, exactly Apr 15 14:51:31 what linux os does anyone here use for dev? Apr 15 14:52:26 i use mac, windows, and FreeBSD.... i am downloading Gentoo though as we speak :) Apr 15 14:55:29 gentoo Apr 15 14:59:38 AstainHellbring, Ubuntu Apr 15 14:59:50 nice Apr 15 14:59:52 i will soon Apr 15 14:59:53 ubuntu huh... interesting Apr 15 15:01:32 it's nice Apr 15 15:01:37 servers, desktops, whatever Apr 15 15:07:05 ubuntu is nice Apr 15 15:07:11 i ran it in vmware for a bit Apr 15 15:07:18 and kubuntu Apr 15 15:07:23 i liked ubuntu better tho Apr 15 15:07:54 kubuntu is very buggy Apr 15 15:08:15 i wish i could run ubuntu and not windoze.. Apr 15 15:08:22 but too much stuff i do needs windoze.. Apr 15 15:08:25 damn m$ Apr 15 15:08:29 yea Apr 15 15:08:34 i here that :) Apr 15 15:14:49 osx: the superior linux =p Apr 15 15:16:48 I prefer open source stuff like Ubuntu and Android:-) Apr 15 15:17:02 it's nice to have source code around if you need to hack something Apr 15 15:17:38 the darwin kernel is open source..? Apr 15 15:17:51 yea but that is about it Apr 15 15:17:55 Technically speaking, Android isn't open source yet Apr 15 15:17:57 just the darwin kernel Apr 15 15:18:06 what else do you need? Apr 15 15:18:11 it's darwin kernel + freebsd userland Apr 15 15:18:27 and mac stuff on top :) Apr 15 15:19:05 the mac stuff that is on top is sort of inconsequential - when is the last time you dove into the gtk source? Apr 15 15:19:14 * Kraln shrugs Apr 15 15:19:17 it does what I want Apr 15 15:19:50 true Apr 15 15:20:23 yawwwwnnn Apr 15 15:20:25 what a weekend :) Apr 15 15:21:04 what time you get submitted last night? Apr 15 15:24:05 * Stephmw wonders if 'submitted' in this context is the same as 'comitted' in "He was comitted to a mental institution"... Apr 15 15:24:05 zhobbs: like 10:45 ;) Apr 15 15:52:59 i'm happy because i've made one other happy Apr 15 15:53:01 woah! Apr 15 15:53:21 that's the new topic btw Apr 15 15:53:56 yo androids, phase 1 is over.. relax!! Apr 15 15:54:20 dan: how many? Apr 15 15:54:23 we need to be able to nominate a new topic and vote on it Apr 15 15:54:31 oh yeah Apr 15 15:54:37 propose a topic zhobbs Apr 15 15:55:53 challengemeter is picking up Apr 15 15:55:55 "ADC Is OVER! Rest, sleep, reintroduce yourself to your family, and add your application at helloandroid.com/apps" Apr 15 15:56:33 +1 Apr 15 15:57:45 muthu, how many do they have? Apr 15 15:58:30 106 and counting Apr 15 15:59:25 how many what? Apr 15 15:59:30 that's not many at all Apr 15 16:02:30 +112 Apr 15 16:02:34 can you believe it Apr 15 16:02:54 +112 what? :) Apr 15 16:02:59 this is like watching nasdaq in 2000 Apr 15 16:03:03 yo zhobbs Apr 15 16:03:06 where you been? Apr 15 16:03:13 that 's the challengemeter Apr 15 16:03:28 I haven't posted on there Apr 15 16:03:35 post Apr 15 16:03:50 yours is +2, so +114 Apr 15 16:04:08 do I post 2 messages or one? Apr 15 16:04:22 there are 132 apps on helloandroid Apr 15 16:04:42 some may be bogus though (just concepts that never got done) Apr 15 16:08:24 correct, how many you think? Apr 15 16:08:50 15-20 Apr 15 16:08:51 why google not releasing the submissions.. anyone? Apr 15 16:08:59 i mean the number Apr 15 16:09:04 muthu, i think they should!! Apr 15 16:09:11 right Apr 15 16:09:16 yeah, a count(*) wouldn't hurt anything Apr 15 16:09:32 ALL of us are interested except Androids Apr 15 16:11:10 anyone think there was 1000 entrants? Apr 15 16:11:48 my first prediction was 10000 Apr 15 16:11:57 then i quickly changed to 900 Apr 15 16:12:51 hello :) Apr 15 16:13:15 hi Apr 15 16:13:36 zhobbs, I don't think 1000 is a bad bet Apr 15 16:13:48 I think they're all sleeping Apr 15 16:14:02 morrildl was here until midnight PDT (when I was just waking up) Apr 15 16:14:43 yea, i was here until 3 am est time, (midnight pst) time...... he wouldn't say anything about submissions Apr 15 16:15:15 my guess is in the neighborhood of 1337 Apr 15 16:16:11 kraln: good guess Apr 15 16:16:21 http://maps.google.com/maps?q=37.42165526856065,-122.09734909298221 Apr 15 16:16:42 Kraln: you see, it is my feature :) Apr 15 16:17:05 Kraln: ...in irc client :) do you remember ? Apr 15 16:17:09 EQU: our applications are completely different in function. Apr 15 16:17:22 do know that if I wanted to make androidchat an irc client, I'd wipe the floor with you =) Apr 15 16:17:34 Kraln: i know, i know :) Apr 15 16:17:54 Last night, 5 hours before deadline, actual number was 265.395.533. Apr 15 16:18:12 Kraln: do you resolve problem with scrolling ? Apr 15 16:18:55 EQU: for the most part, yes Apr 15 16:19:10 Kraln: scroller.fullScroll(View.FOCUS_DOWN); dosn't work for multyline :/ Apr 15 16:19:20 I did some stuff in addition tot hat Apr 15 16:19:32 if they don't fix it for the next sdk, I'm just going to write my own scrollview Apr 15 16:19:55 it definitely works Apr 15 16:20:00 Kraln: it is registed as a bug? Apr 15 16:20:15 your problem could very well be a timing issue Apr 15 16:20:20 EQU: yes, and romainguy claims to have fixed it Apr 15 16:20:26 for instance a setText followed by fullScroll will not work Apr 15 16:20:38 you have to post() a Runnable to do the fullScroll Apr 15 16:21:00 romainguy: honestly, this information was useful 24 hours ago, less so now =) Apr 15 16:21:09 romainguy: i wil show you something Apr 15 16:21:41 Kraln: I could also not spend my spare time helping on this channel :) Apr 15 16:22:23 hey romain Apr 15 16:22:30 romainguy: I'm not saying I don't appreciate it Apr 15 16:22:39 Kraln: I know, hence my smiley Apr 15 16:22:58 It boils down to something really simple: requestLayout() and invalidate() are asynchronous Apr 15 16:23:00 romainguy__ : http://rafb.net/p/B7wWYZ10.html Apr 15 16:23:10 and calling something like setText() causes a requestLayout() Apr 15 16:23:26 so doing a scroll after calling such a method jut won't work with the new values Apr 15 16:23:53 EQU: Yes, that's wrong Apr 15 16:24:17 after you append your text, you should post the fullScroll call Apr 15 16:24:21 to make sure the layout happens first Apr 15 16:24:35 otherwise, you will scroll the existing content of the text view, then the text will be appended Apr 15 16:24:41 jasta: hi Apr 15 16:25:02 romainguy__ : for one line this work fine, but for multyline doesn't Apr 15 16:25:20 I just told you, you need to post the fullScroll Apr 15 16:25:42 romainguy: that's how I got around it. I post the fullscroll from another thread after I'm sure the text is there Apr 15 16:26:02 you don't need to post it from another thread Apr 15 16:26:02 it still sometimes scrolls past the end though =/ Apr 15 16:26:09 you can post it from the UI thread Apr 15 16:26:17 but in my use case it makes sense to post it from the other thread =) Apr 15 16:32:29 the freenode nick length isn't that long, m8 =) Apr 15 16:32:36 broke your client didn't it Apr 15 16:33:16 romainguy__ : i've changed to "scroller.post(new Runnable() { public void run() { scroller.fullScroll(View.FOCUS_DOWN); } }) ;" Apr 15 16:34:12 damm should be handler.post :) Apr 15 16:47:21 Kraln: it works now but is strange, i dont understand why "scroller.fullScroll(View.FOCUS_DOWN);" called in ScrollerView,TexView thread doesn't work Apr 15 16:47:54 Kraln: only if i post like " scroller.post(new Runnable() { public void run() { scroller.fullScroll(View.FOCUS_DOWN); } }) ;" Apr 15 16:47:57 it will work Apr 15 16:55:54 morrildl,will google announce how many submissions they got? Apr 15 16:57:51 michaelnovakjr_: so far we aren't planning to Apr 15 16:58:29 :( Apr 15 16:58:30 mostly because we don't want to people saying things like "OMG Android only has 1/100th the developers of Windows, THEY ARE TEH FAIL" Apr 15 16:58:43 i see your point Apr 15 16:58:57 it's kind of pointless to compare numbers this early, but that's mostly what people would do with them Apr 15 16:59:08 We prefer to keep the focus on the apps & developers themselves, not magic numbers Apr 15 16:59:29 Obviously this has a downside too, b/c it would be nice to be able to tell you guys Apr 15 16:59:47 i enjoyed developing for the challenge, and certainly will be maintaining my submission as well as developing new apps :) Apr 15 17:04:46 hey morrildl Apr 15 17:09:32 jasta, your app support podcasts? Apr 15 17:09:42 not for this release Apr 15 17:09:48 you are planning it though? Apr 15 17:10:14 yes Apr 15 17:10:17 cool Apr 15 17:10:19 syncing them over the air, of course Apr 15 17:10:27 i also plan to support last.fm neighbor and tag radio, though i do not currently Apr 15 17:10:39 nice, over the air podcasts is cool! Apr 15 17:10:40 basically, so long as the MediaPlayer is a crap chute, I am not going to explore more sophisticated streaming options. Apr 15 17:10:47 haha Apr 15 17:10:49 good point Apr 15 17:16:40 hopefully mediaplayer will be good eventually Apr 15 17:17:17 i think it will Apr 15 17:18:07 it doesn't need that much attention really Apr 15 17:18:15 just put a man on it for a week or whatever, should be good :) Apr 15 17:18:23 :0 Apr 15 17:18:33 how is the location based stuff? Apr 15 17:18:40 my next release will support gps Apr 15 17:19:38 very easy to use Apr 15 17:21:18 sweet :) Apr 15 17:21:30 its actually not going to take much to implement Apr 15 17:21:39 most of the code for logic is server side Apr 15 17:22:04 is there anything special done on android for outputting on stderr (using fprintf(stder, "",...)) ? Apr 15 17:22:09 it's not outputting anything Apr 15 17:22:13 Log.d Apr 15 17:22:23 in fact... even fprintf(stdout, "", ...) doesn't do anything Apr 15 17:22:28 in C Apr 15 17:22:44 C on android..... Apr 15 17:22:59 yes Apr 15 17:23:24 what part? Apr 15 17:23:35 the libc part Apr 15 17:24:41 Can I write code for Android using C/C++? Android only supports applications written using the Java programming language at this time. Apr 15 17:24:49 what part of the sdk are you in? Apr 15 17:25:15 the non-documented but working part Apr 15 17:25:23 :-) Apr 15 17:25:25 cool stuff Apr 15 17:25:52 interesting Apr 15 17:28:08 already got a lot of stuff working Apr 15 17:28:14 but this is just plain weird Apr 15 17:28:25 if i change a text of TextView which is child of ScrollerView, is there any way tu quickly update ScrollerView ? Apr 15 17:28:43 http://www.commandro.net/ Apr 15 17:28:52 nice app Apr 15 17:29:44 muthu, you just have the hots for 'party girl'... Apr 15 17:31:36 party at apt number 23! Apr 15 17:33:39 oh yeah Apr 15 17:34:10 this is the kind of mobile search for the future Apr 15 17:34:23 you network, search, find out Apr 15 17:47:17 davidw: http://www.forbes.com/technology/2008/04/14/android-developers-challenge-tech-wire-cx_ew_0415android.html Apr 15 17:47:37 morrildl, yeah, I thought that was kind of cool:-) Apr 15 17:47:43 :) Apr 15 17:53:25 Can one sqlite file be opened by two apps simultaneously? Or should I use a Content Provider as proxy? Apr 15 17:58:25 two apps, or two activities? Apr 15 17:58:46 Two activites. Apr 15 17:59:05 are you using an adapter class? Apr 15 17:59:10 be back sorry Apr 15 18:01:43 well that's interesting... dalibor topic -> sun Apr 15 18:02:06 I want to make a resource manager that optimizes file processing - pack unused files to zips (and back), preparses xml files, etc. And I want to carry data about current state of files in db Apr 15 18:02:17 michaelnovakjr_: What adapter do you mean? Apr 15 18:09:50 sweet... client is happy with our submission... I have to say that so far this android thing has been pretty good Apr 15 18:18:50 hey, can anyone answer some general cell phone questions for me? I'm kinda an idiot in such matters... Apr 15 18:19:55 whats your questions? Apr 15 18:21:00 hmm, where do I start? Oh, ok... are any of the cell providers less likely to spy on my calls for the NSA? Apr 15 18:21:35 on other fronts... I've got a Mac w/ bluetooth... I can use that to get 'net access? Apr 15 18:22:12 the bluetooth usually sometimes requires extra fees all depends on phones nsa spying no idea Apr 15 18:22:43 I'd need a bluetooth phone + a data plan? Apr 15 18:26:36 yah and a good phone if you get a windows mobile phone you can test some android stuff on there as well as get a program called wmwifirouter that will even allow you to share over wifi Apr 15 18:28:00 share == make calls? Apr 15 18:29:01 share == share data plan but not require a tethering plan on top of mess Apr 15 18:29:11 ?? Apr 15 18:30:05 speak of the devil... I was just commenting on Dalibor Topic, and his predecessor shows up Apr 15 19:18:51 pics jasta Apr 15 19:18:52 romainguy: are you now :) ? Apr 15 19:20:53 ? Apr 15 19:21:45 NEW SDK PLS! Apr 15 19:22:01 romainguy_: is there another way to resolve the problem with scrolling ? Apr 15 19:22:26 romainguy_: i am reading now about measure and layout methods. Apr 15 19:22:36 I'm sure there is but I can't take care of that now Apr 15 19:23:07 romainguy_ : if i measure and call layout for ScrollView it should work Apr 15 19:24:31 you don't have to measure Apr 15 19:24:37 and you don't have to call layout Apr 15 19:24:42 setText will call requestLayout Apr 15 19:24:59 append also ? Apr 15 19:27:05 append() does not Apr 15 19:27:14 it should Apr 15 19:28:02 if i call requestLayout handy, will it works ? Apr 15 19:28:32 asdasdasdasd Apr 15 19:28:33 asd Apr 15 19:28:35 as Apr 15 19:28:36 d Apr 15 19:28:38 as Apr 15 19:28:39 d Apr 15 19:28:41 as Apr 15 19:28:43 d Apr 15 19:28:44 sory :/ Apr 15 19:28:44 actually it does Apr 15 19:28:52 but it's doing it through an alternative code path Apr 15 19:28:54 sorry :) Apr 15 19:30:38 romainguy_ : i use now "scroller.post(new Runnable() { public void run() { scroller.fullScroll(View.FOCUS_DOWN); } }) ; " Apr 15 19:30:55 romainguy_ : wich is so ugly :/ Apr 15 19:31:19 how is that ugly? Apr 15 19:33:00 i thought it is possible to write " scroller.refresch()" Apr 15 19:33:03 :) Apr 15 19:33:47 which is fine for me :) Apr 15 19:38:27 romainguy_ : last question. If i use post , i am sure that sizes and position are correct ? Apr 15 19:39:59 what do you mean by size and position? Apr 15 19:40:49 for exmaple a height of TextView after append method Apr 15 19:41:08 well that's why you should post Apr 15 19:41:11 romainguy_ : where i can read about android-views framwork ? Apr 15 19:41:13 to run the code after the layout Apr 15 19:48:50 did I win yet? :-D Apr 15 20:00:07 shit Apr 15 20:00:13 shit shit shit :) Apr 15 20:00:43 one of the big known bugs in my app that i considered too fundamental to the way i designed the system to fix prior ot the challenge... Apr 15 20:00:55 i just had one of those eureka moments where i thought of a graceful, efficient fix :\ Apr 15 20:01:05 i could have definitely deployed, *sigh* Apr 15 20:01:18 <_avatar> i'm using a ListView to display a list of items... each item has a sub view i'd like to gain focus when the item is highlighted and the right DPAD button is pressed -- what's the best way to do this? i've tried anrdoid:nextFocusRight in the listview item's XML file, as well as setOnKeyListener for each individual item's view (the key listener is never called) Apr 15 20:01:31 <_avatar> jasta: :( that's how stuff always seems to work out Apr 15 20:01:36 <_avatar> i'm sure you'll do fine, anyway Apr 15 20:02:07 basically, i ignore the synchronization error between the time an app starts (and bindService is called), and the connection is actually available. Apr 15 20:02:17 during such time, any interaction with the UI that would have required the service, will fail. Apr 15 20:02:43 i had thought i'd need to implement a work queue which would be too disruptive to each of my activities and my main service that i would just prefer to leave the bug in Apr 15 20:03:18 instead, i just realized that the Handler could gracefully take care of this problem for me. I could simply send a message with the handler, and when the message is received, check if the service is connected, and if not, just put the message back in the queue. Apr 15 20:03:30 by doing postDelayed Apr 15 20:03:34 or sendMessageDelayed Apr 15 20:03:46 <_avatar> doh. that is indeed a good idea Apr 15 20:03:49 actually though, that's not going to work either now that i think about it. since the order would be screwed up. Apr 15 20:04:02 if MSG_A was sent, then MSG_B, and neither could be processed... Apr 15 20:04:10 MSG_A would be put at the end of the queue, then MSG_B might come up and run. Apr 15 20:04:12 <_avatar> oh, yeah, if order matters then i guess it wouldn't work Apr 15 20:04:14 then MSG_A after it. Apr 15 20:04:32 so i guess i would need to implement my own work queue. sigh. Apr 15 20:04:55 and the queue would just come into existence in a stalled state Apr 15 20:05:01 when the service is connected, the queue would start running Apr 15 20:05:18 that's lame though, since it's introducing a loss of efficiency. Apr 15 20:05:37 and it would be tough to implement with the main event queue. Apr 15 20:06:04 you'd have to use the handler anyway, or implement your queue in such a way that it is used only during that window Apr 15 20:06:07 and not otherwise Apr 15 20:06:16 which would be a bitch to maintain for complex services. awwwwgggh. Apr 15 20:06:38 i had discussed with Romain solving this problem in the framework, but he rejected my idea ;) Apr 15 20:06:47 i had thought it made sense to stall the UI until the service connection is made Apr 15 20:07:08 and then having a similar way to stall a service Apr 15 20:07:12 if it also needs a service connection Apr 15 20:08:32 jasta: dont worry we all have that service thing. judges will wait at least 5 seconds before clicking anything on the GUI. Apr 15 20:09:14 it's ample time for the service to get started Apr 15 20:09:20 you think so? because this is a solveable problem. Apr 15 20:09:25 it would just be with a work queue Apr 15 20:09:28 implemented atop the handler Apr 15 20:09:36 is your service's init code taking too long? Apr 15 20:09:45 my concern, and what frustrates me, is that it would introduce overhead that is necessary only to solve a corner case Apr 15 20:09:46 it should connect "nearly" instantly, from what i've seen Apr 15 20:09:52 true Apr 15 20:10:01 f00f-: No, the services and activity start up very fast, but still, I can trigger the bug easily. Apr 15 20:10:09 hmm Apr 15 20:10:13 Especially since my arrangement is: Apr 15 20:10:20 re Apr 15 20:10:30 Song List activity starts Playlist service which starts the Content service. Apr 15 20:10:37 and the very first call to the playlist service needs the content service. Apr 15 20:10:56 so there is acutlaly 2 layers working against me to make the bug more obvious and easier to find Apr 15 20:11:19 so you have more than one Service? Apr 15 20:13:08 yes, I have 3 total Apr 15 20:13:25 2 of which are necessary to play content Apr 15 20:13:39 my system is very logically arranged. there are even two separate apk files for now. Apr 15 20:13:39 why did you not combine them into one? Apr 15 20:13:47 because they should not be logically combined Apr 15 20:14:04 okay, i hope the users can deal with two .apk's Apr 15 20:14:17 two apks? Apr 15 20:14:29 i mentioned in my README that two apks are currently distributed now to be consistent with the way google internally distributes their external services. Apr 15 20:14:41 and that, depending on how android evolves, this design may change in favor of simplicity for the user. Apr 15 20:14:51 internally? what? Apr 15 20:14:55 though my hope is that android includes a feature to do simple dependency resolution or coupling. Apr 15 20:15:06 f00f-: look in /system/app some time. Apr 15 20:15:10 they should have an installer for the more complex apps Apr 15 20:15:26 for example, the gtalk service is not distributed with the framework, or with any other app. it's isolated. Apr 15 20:15:30 exactly Apr 15 20:16:21 kinda like a cab file, or mac pkg file Apr 15 20:16:38 where the different components are there and there's a script to do it Apr 15 20:16:47 hey :) i think i just found a new project :) Apr 15 20:17:12 cabbage files Apr 15 20:17:15 hah Apr 15 20:17:15 a Apr 15 20:17:38 so for the challenge i have left them as two apks, because i do not know how the platform will progress Apr 15 20:17:42 i wouldn't mind writing an installer application for android Apr 15 20:17:51 my hope is that you will be able to bundle multiple projects into one apk Apr 15 20:17:57 use a basic scripting language to handle the installs Apr 15 20:18:12 hecl... lol Apr 15 20:18:15 haha Apr 15 20:18:28 davidw would be thrilled :) Apr 15 20:18:37 jasta, would you find something like that useful? Apr 15 20:18:53 michaelnovakjr_: well, it really depends how android chooses to do it. Apr 15 20:19:54 obviously the apk concept is set to expand some moving forward Apr 15 20:20:01 for example, do you suppose users will run adb install? :) Apr 15 20:20:25 obviously a distribution system will be envisioned somehow, including installation from a desktop app Apr 15 20:20:30 signing information, etc. Apr 15 20:20:30 no.... you should be able to click on a bundle like an executable Apr 15 20:20:39 so hopefully when they expand this, they will include what i ned :) Apr 15 20:20:40 need* Apr 15 20:21:04 you should be able to click on the file on the phone and that should trigger the installer. Apr 15 20:21:18 to install the application as needed Apr 15 20:22:28 anyway, if they penalize correct software design then shame on them Apr 15 20:23:10 well nowadays you can have two insallers in a .sisx Apr 15 20:23:12 on symbian Apr 15 20:23:20 my submission is separated into two apk files because it really is two separate components. i imagine evolving my app such that the music player is not the only package utilizing the client. Apr 15 20:23:56 for example, am image browser, or video player. that would not need to be bundled with, or require, the music player. Apr 15 20:24:26 likewise, the playlist service does not bundle the content/caching service because i envision the content delivery scheme being composable as well Apr 15 20:24:55 for example, merging traditional features with the download/streaming content delivery system. Apr 15 20:25:11 so that users could sync with their PC if they so choose, and still have access to additional content on the go Apr 15 20:28:00 I think apk will be installed from the network usually... Apr 15 20:28:13 like a .jad Apr 15 20:28:21 can describe Apr 15 20:28:22 a few .apk's Apr 15 20:28:24 signing Apr 15 20:28:24 etc. Apr 15 20:30:16 exactly Apr 15 20:30:39 i think its a good idea... Apr 15 20:41:06 f00f-: so, your app has this race condition in it as well though? the servic econnection problem? Apr 15 20:41:15 i had assumed most developers would work around it :( Apr 15 20:41:27 i didn't just because i didn't catch the race until way late in development Apr 15 20:41:32 as in, yesterday :) Apr 15 20:41:37 i had one, but killed it like the pest that it is Apr 15 20:41:39 well i don't allow the user to select anything in the UI until the ServiceConnection has connected itself Apr 15 20:41:48 it adds an annoying 1sec or so delay Apr 15 20:41:52 but works for a prototype Apr 15 20:42:00 yeah, hmm Apr 15 20:42:09 oh well, i did mention it in my BUGS section Apr 15 20:42:19 there should be a way to share a service connection amongst activities, but dont know if that fits with android philosophy Apr 15 20:42:22 you guys are using aidl right? Apr 15 20:42:31 like connect once, and have it running for all subactivities or something Apr 15 20:42:35 michaelnovakjr_: yeah Apr 15 20:42:36 basically "I failed to correctly implement a work queue in my service relationships and, as such, it is possible to catch the program in an unworkable state." Apr 15 20:42:58 f00f-: I was thinking that too. They should pool connections and hand them out from the pool. Apr 15 20:43:06 maybe they do already, actually Apr 15 20:43:43 i spawned a thread that starts the service and waits for the method to actually return something, it then tells the UI thread its cool to display it if it wants to Apr 15 20:44:02 but the UI can be doing other things at the same time Apr 15 20:44:02 isn't bindService asynchronous anyway? Apr 15 20:44:06 are the service functions async? Apr 15 20:44:06 f00f-: yes Apr 15 20:44:10 yes Apr 15 20:44:11 zhobbs: yes. Apr 15 20:44:23 each connection is in its own binder thread, as i understand it. Apr 15 20:44:28 yes Apr 15 20:44:41 but that doesn't mean you necessarily know when its done :) Apr 15 20:44:42 i will probably fix this bug by simply abusing the handler actually. Apr 15 20:45:02 so you were able to pass a Handler through aidl? Apr 15 20:45:24 i can avoid the ordering problem by clearing the handler and readding all queued events Apr 15 20:45:37 which won't be too damaging to perfromance since the list is bound by the time of the window that it is necessary Apr 15 20:45:49 i used the stub to call the method in the aidl which runs the service i need, waited for the result on the thread and when it came in reported back Apr 15 20:45:59 f00f-: No, I'm referring to usage of the service. Apr 15 20:46:08 ok Apr 15 20:46:16 bind it, then until it is connected, have the caller schedule interaction with it Apr 15 20:46:29 and if the handler comes up and the service isnt connected, just reschedule the message delayed Apr 15 20:46:48 until such time that the connection is ready, or a timeout occurs and the activity explodes Apr 15 20:47:05 i'm kicking myself for not handling this correctly in my submission :\ Apr 15 20:47:11 oh well. Apr 15 20:47:50 so much to think about, so much work to do *sigh* Apr 15 20:48:09 so did you submit your app to helloandroid yet jasta? Apr 15 20:48:10 at least it's not a huge issue. if they just wait patiently it won't be an issue Apr 15 20:48:18 and once it is connected, the playlist service would persist around for a while Apr 15 20:48:28 (it dies only 30 minutes after the playlist has finished) Apr 15 20:48:38 f00f-: i think zhobbs submitted it for me Apr 15 20:48:49 yep Apr 15 20:48:52 f00f-: i still haven't recorded a video yet though. i'll post to android-challenge when i have that. Apr 15 20:49:20 i'd like to show my system in use so people get a sense for how workable the idea is Apr 15 20:49:40 jasta: how's it work with 3G speeds? Apr 15 20:49:52 dont see it Apr 15 20:49:59 zhobbs: Really well :) Apr 15 20:50:03 Like, remarkably well hehe Apr 15 20:50:16 hiya Apr 15 20:50:16 With EDGE, the delay seems to be around 5 seconds or so Apr 15 20:50:20 and it preempts of course Apr 15 20:50:27 so for the common case of just clicking a song in an album... Apr 15 20:50:43 how can i submit my app to helloandroid? Apr 15 20:50:45 so you should only see the buffer wait once Apr 15 20:51:19 also, my buffer time is 10% of the song, which i can obviously improve with greater heuristics moving forward Apr 15 20:51:41 10% of the size of the song? Apr 15 20:51:48 such as using the average kbps of the encoding Apr 15 20:51:50 VBR will make that 'weird' :P Apr 15 20:51:56 ok Apr 15 20:52:00 f00f-: VBR is easily predictable to an average bitrate. Apr 15 20:52:04 michaelnovakjr_: sign up for an account and then submit Apr 15 20:52:43 eventually I will have it attempt to buffer 10-15 seconds of audio, computing how much data is necessaryu to make that possible Apr 15 20:53:17 but still, there are lots of problems with my system that must be worked around moving forward. at least i kept a list :) Apr 15 20:53:32 and that's much better than just ignoring the complexity. i've ignored and documented it ;) Apr 15 20:54:06 thanks zhobbs Apr 15 20:54:47 zhobbs: you should totally host a leaf on the androidchat network =) Apr 15 20:55:26 Kraln: yeah, maybe so Apr 15 20:56:00 can you connect to that network with a regular IRC client? Apr 15 20:56:26 yes, but you'll get garbage Apr 15 20:56:39 or rather, it depends on the client what side effects you'll get Apr 15 21:00:24 submitted my app over at helloandroid Apr 15 21:00:42 f00f-: so have you published your app anywhere? Apr 15 21:00:42 Kraln: if the androidchat network gets overloaded let me know :) Apr 15 21:01:07 michaelnovakjr_: you can attach a screen too Apr 15 21:01:07 its more about providing redundancy than capacity, but I will =) Apr 15 21:01:26 michaelnovakjr_: it'd kinda hidden...but the option is there if you edit your entry Apr 15 21:02:19 zhobbs: i saw that you picked the cloud cult album cover for my screenshot. Apr 15 21:02:19 jasta: just a blurb at http://www.helloandroid.com/node/430 Apr 15 21:02:24 zhobbs: my gf would be pleased :) Apr 15 21:02:31 cool, i don't have them on this machine, but I will post a screenshot tonight :) Apr 15 21:02:43 jasta: hehe, was going to ask for your recomendation on which screen Apr 15 21:03:17 100 people on the site...feel like I just got linked to Apr 15 21:04:08 zhobbs: i like the screen that shows the progress "bar" moving, but i'm fine with what you picked :) Apr 15 21:04:34 yeah, I should really add the option for multiple screens...but I guess it's ok for now Apr 15 21:04:47 Has anyone done profiling for Android? Like, how fast is java, how fast is sqlite, how fast are inter-app calls, etc Apr 15 21:04:48 i spen ta lot of time tweaing that stupid album cover screen. first of all, romain let me stray by convincing me that LinearGradient shaders could be applied to bitmaps ;) Apr 15 21:05:12 mihoshi: I have done profiling of my own app. And I intend to do much more now that I'm in optimizing mode :) Apr 15 21:05:26 the next couple of weeks will be devoted to bug fixing, cleaning things up, optimizing, etc. Apr 15 21:05:35 i went for flare leading up to the submission deadline :) Apr 15 21:05:45 Is that available somewhere in the web? :) Apr 15 21:05:56 mihoshi: i just used the traceview tool Apr 15 21:05:58 you can use it yourself Apr 15 21:06:19 just look up the docs Apr 15 21:10:45 i'll be going through optimization and a few things I left out that really would be nice to have Apr 15 21:11:16 i need to do a lot of optimization :) Apr 15 21:11:28 i released this shit ot the judges using plain text XML :) Apr 15 21:11:49 WbXML will be an enormous leap in sync efficiency Apr 15 21:12:09 i'd like to make it snappy.... the gps thing will be fun! Apr 15 21:12:13 also, i plan to accomplish first-time sync by having the server prepare a database ahead of time and just send it. Apr 15 21:12:35 because asking the phone to do all that indexing is insane Apr 15 21:12:41 it's just impractical; it takes ages. Apr 15 21:12:57 on my personal 85GB music collection it takes like 45 minutes to do a first-time sync, no joke :) Apr 15 21:13:04 but it's an easy problem to solve, so whatever Apr 15 21:13:41 the size of the database is something like 50MB, so just transmitting that would be much faster :) Apr 15 21:14:15 85 GB ? you buy all that? Apr 15 21:14:23 haha Apr 15 21:14:27 hehe Apr 15 21:14:46 I have about 290 gigs of mp3s from cds and records that I've recorded to flawless mp3 and flac Apr 15 21:14:48 f00f-: Uhh, ...yeaah. Apr 15 21:14:52 so, yes, I've bought all of that Apr 15 21:14:56 :D Apr 15 21:15:04 Kraln: my system supports flac, fyi :) Apr 15 21:15:22 my ipod supports flac >_> Apr 15 21:15:28 it re-encodes it on the fly to Ogg Apr 15 21:15:37 ouch Apr 15 21:15:44 on a mobile device? Apr 15 21:15:48 no silly ;) Apr 15 21:15:48 flac first, then mp3 sitting side by side on redundant hard drives =) Apr 15 21:15:50 on the server. Apr 15 21:15:54 ah, okay Apr 15 21:16:00 scared me a bit there :) Apr 15 21:16:05 SUSaiyan: how's ipod support flac? Apr 15 21:16:12 rockbox Apr 15 21:16:21 though the falc support is currently broken because i swear the MediaPlayer doesn't really support Ogg Apr 15 21:16:23 i can play almost anything on my ipod Apr 15 21:16:26 i could never make it work in my tests Apr 15 21:16:32 like 1 of my songs plays, and none of the rest of them do. who knows Apr 15 21:16:38 just not wma Apr 15 21:17:01 my system doesn't support wma or anything like that yet :\ Apr 15 21:17:11 eventually i will just have the server re-encode anything known not to be supported on Android Apr 15 21:17:12 wma sucks :/ Apr 15 21:17:23 and then simultaneously try to improve Android's support for other formats ;0 Apr 15 21:17:44 i sort of forgot but i have a day job Apr 15 21:17:49 i should go back to it Apr 15 21:17:50 :) Apr 15 21:17:53 hehe Apr 15 21:17:59 been so caught up hehe, bbl :) Apr 15 21:21:36 who has apks for me to play with? =) Apr 15 21:21:56 not me, i am trying to put them together though Apr 15 21:22:06 the version i submitted to the judges connects to my demo repository and has some other magic in it Apr 15 21:22:18 i'd like to remove it, implement the fast sync mode, then show everyone. Apr 15 21:22:23 and also release the server source code Apr 15 21:22:37 i dont want to release the client source until after i clean up some of these embarrassing hacks! :) Apr 15 21:23:04 :-) Apr 15 21:23:21 the server has far fewer embarrassing hacks ;) Apr 15 21:23:36 I wish I could see Android java library sources... May be I'll understand than why SQLiteQuery.fill_window takes so much time. 2ms per a very simple row... Apr 15 21:25:07 Kraln, i can send you mine later Apr 15 21:28:42 mihoshi: SQLiteQuery.fill_window? what? Apr 15 21:30:34 jasta: I select from a database, and it seem to spend time translating query result to java, hundred more than actually executing query... Apr 15 21:31:43 wow Apr 15 21:36:32 :O Apr 15 21:36:36 hi poffy Apr 15 21:36:42 anyone done an m5 rss-reader? Apr 15 21:36:49 oh hai, Kraln Apr 15 21:38:08 Kraln, have any judges logged on? Apr 15 21:38:32 no. I have a bot seeding two channels so they aren't presented with an empty network Apr 15 21:38:54 oh ok Apr 15 21:39:03 (it also logs) Apr 15 21:39:52 We should release Androidchat minus the location feature Apr 15 21:40:01 so people can do IRC with it Apr 15 21:40:05 I like the interface Apr 15 21:40:30 I don't think EQU would be too happy with us =) Apr 15 21:40:39 EQU? Apr 15 21:40:45 he's making an irc client Apr 15 21:40:52 oh Apr 15 21:40:56 I practically told him if we chose to go that route we'd wipe the floor with him =p Apr 15 21:41:16 Is EQU's client out? Apr 15 21:41:23 haha Apr 15 21:41:25 morrildl: I am curious. When the results are posted, are we going to recieve individual reports on how the judges judged our entries with comments? or just the top 50 list? Apr 15 21:41:50 almost certainly just the top 50 Apr 15 21:41:58 I really like our interface Apr 15 21:41:59 their task would be too huge otherwise Apr 15 21:42:03 aww. it'd be nice to get some feedback Apr 15 21:42:04 Really intuitive, in my opinion Apr 15 21:42:55 plus might discourage developers who didn't do so well :) Apr 15 21:43:12 if getting told your shit sucks discourages you, you shouldn't be developing Apr 15 21:43:21 jasta: Anyway, great tool, thanks Apr 15 21:43:30 mihoshi: what, traceview? yes Apr 15 21:45:04 poffy: if we want to release two different products, we'll have to abstract some stuff out so that the difference is just a compile time switch Apr 15 21:45:29 ok Apr 15 21:46:05 the channel map will turn into a normal channel list, same with user map Apr 15 21:46:07 or we could give the user a choice to connection to a location-IRC server Apr 15 21:46:12 or a normal irc server Apr 15 21:46:17 no. Apr 15 21:46:35 that's conflating two completely different functional ideas Apr 15 21:47:11 k Apr 15 21:47:42 think about the user confusion Apr 15 21:47:57 androidchat is for the everyman, irc is a very specific and restricting use case Apr 15 21:48:16 ok Apr 15 21:48:25 i thought you guys are on the same project? Apr 15 21:48:32 we are. welcome to our design meeting Apr 15 21:48:40 :D Apr 15 21:48:50 ah ok ;) Apr 15 22:14:55 Problem with map-based apps is that they are all, basically, nearly same... Apr 15 22:15:04 yep.. Apr 15 22:17:26 you mean the location based blogs/geolocation/geocaching blah stuff? Apr 15 22:17:27 yeah. Apr 15 22:19:09 I plan to ass support of using world map as a playing board to Tabletop too... Then it will be able to do about everything that other apps can:) Apr 15 22:19:25 so anyone have any apks to test? Apr 15 22:20:14 *add support Apr 15 22:20:20 :p Apr 15 22:34:30 Anyone use sqlite to query big chunks of data? Apr 15 22:35:56 It takes about 10ms per row (when outside of Android only 0.1ms per row) to select from db. In non-debug mode. Is it similar for others? Apr 15 22:36:12 the timing will depend on your machine Apr 15 22:36:18 because you are running an emulator Apr 15 22:36:40 you should give a relative number, not an absolute one Apr 15 22:37:21 Relative is about 100 times slower on Android compard to same query on native. Apr 15 22:37:39 no, relative to another operation in Android Apr 15 22:37:58 you are measuring the cost of being emulated in your 100x number Apr 15 22:40:24 romainguy_: It's at least ten times slower than putting same amount of data to string-indexed map Apr 15 22:41:48 romainguy_: Basically, everything is acceptably fast compared to that - xml parsing, unzipping, even writing into db. But when I pull from sqlite to a crsor, everything halts Apr 15 22:44:16 romainguy_: Here are details: http://groups.google.com/group/android-developers/browse_thread/thread/c48426969992b441?hl=en# Apr 15 22:44:39 well another developer just told me "t's hard to tell what exactly is going on from that email along" Apr 15 22:44:54 apparently the next SDK will be a lot faster for most queries Apr 15 22:46:29 how do you measure the times btw? Apr 15 22:46:46 with traceview? Apr 15 22:47:11 romainguy_: Traceview. And also prints to be sure. Apr 15 22:47:13 mihoshi: can you send me the traceview files? Apr 15 22:47:33 romainguy_: Sure. Where to? Apr 15 22:47:52 mihoshi: romain.guy@mac.com Apr 15 22:48:36 <_avatar> the maps application displays a zoom widget on top of the main activity on a long touch event -- i'd like to do something similar in my application. are there any API demos that show how display an arbitrary view on top of an activity at a specified location? or can anyone give me some hints as to what to search for? :) Apr 15 22:49:40 use a FrameLayout or a RelativeLayout Apr 15 22:51:24 <_avatar> my main view is uses a LinearLayout -- can I still use a FrameLayout or RelativeLayout "on top of" the LinearLayout? i've never done anything like this before Apr 15 22:51:48 mihoshi: romainguy_ said you were asking about slow SQL queries Apr 15 22:52:08 mihoshi: Can you send me the result of "EXPLAIN " Apr 15 22:52:09 ? Apr 15 22:52:25 jham: Ok Apr 15 22:52:26 _avatar: no, FrameLayout stacks its children, so your LinearLayout would have to be part of the FrameLayout Apr 15 22:53:30 <_avatar> ok, thanks Apr 15 22:55:28 what gcc version is best for compiling kernel for android? Apr 15 22:58:00 romainguy_: Sending profiler dump to you now. Has slow connection here... Apr 15 22:58:53 jham: Sent explain in pm Apr 15 23:01:20 mihoshi: BTW, CREATE INDEX notes_id on notes (_id); is redundant, SQLite stores the rows in a B-Tree with the INTEGER PRIMARY KEY as the key Apr 15 23:02:25 jham: Thanks. Will remove _id indexes. Apr 15 23:03:44 Hmm, really, same speed without it... Apr 15 23:04:02 Yeah, but it saves disk space :-) Apr 15 23:04:27 romainguy_: Done sending dump, should be on gmail server now Apr 15 23:05:13 Btw, about disk space. Is it possible to use db bases in zipped files? Apr 15 23:05:22 mihoshi: you forgot the .key file Apr 15 23:05:36 or it got inlined with the mail Apr 15 23:05:37 mihoshi: No, you can't have compressed databases Apr 15 23:05:42 you might even say that the file is key Apr 15 23:06:34 ;p Apr 15 23:06:36 romainguy, you guys got offices or cubes? Apr 15 23:06:54 Kraln: it depends :) Apr 15 23:07:14 depends on your life perspective, or? :) Apr 15 23:07:17 jham: I hoped that there is some analogy of ZIP folders on Android, or something... Apr 15 23:07:42 Kraln: depends on the employees, some share offices, some share cubes/open spaces Apr 15 23:07:55 * Kraln nods Apr 15 23:08:10 you know the tables at aol hq are made out of tons of aol floppies? Apr 15 23:08:17 I guess they have a sense of humor Apr 15 23:11:43 when/if they go under, I want one of those tables Apr 15 23:12:06 pics? Apr 15 23:12:29 I didn't take any. =/ Apr 15 23:13:16 if I ever go back, I'll be sure to Apr 16 01:57:20 quiet in here Apr 16 01:57:40 haha, everyone is passed out Apr 16 02:22:46 java.lang.Package.getPackages() failed Apr 16 02:28:23 my computer runs soooo much better now that eclipse and the emulator isn't running Apr 16 02:28:43 haha **** ENDING LOGGING AT Wed Apr 16 02:59:56 2008