**** BEGIN LOGGING AT Tue May 13 02:59:56 2008 May 13 03:00:20 /usr/share/applications ($(datadir)/applications) May 13 03:00:57 hmm May 13 03:01:27 i'm widdling one down to figure out the problem here May 13 03:03:47 this is so weird May 13 03:05:01 d'oh May 13 03:05:04 i typo'd something stupid May 13 03:07:55 ah May 13 03:13:01 hmm, now i'm confused how to get my icon in there... May 13 03:23:59 not showing up? May 13 03:24:06 yeah, the icon is blank for some reason May 13 03:24:51 if i don't even specify an Icon clause, it uses some default icon May 13 03:24:53 so i don't know May 13 03:33:13 sweet May 13 03:33:16 got this beast building :) May 13 03:35:55 i mean, all from the command-line, integrates neatly with the system, etc. May 13 03:36:12 the whole thing can be done with the usual ./configure && make and then mvn install. May 13 03:36:19 the maven build system even installs the APK into the running emulator May 13 03:36:39 not much left to do now...i really might have this out tonight :) May 13 03:39:53 i have to finish the server setup in Android (so that you can point it at your local server) May 13 03:40:01 and then a couple touch-ups now that the project is out of "demo" mode. May 13 03:40:06 and that should be it May 13 05:11:11 Anybody here read about FriendConnect? May 13 05:11:19 i have read about it May 13 05:11:41 Interesting stuff... Google is really shaking things up May 13 05:12:57 yeah theyre doing something alright May 13 05:13:52 The dynamics of FriendConnect (Google) vs. MyBlogLog (Yahoo) but both backing OpenSocial is pretty complicated. And how their rivalry with Facebook works. Tough to see where everyone's real motivations are for involvement in each initiative. May 13 05:14:23 You think FriendConnect will have an impact on Mobile/Android? May 13 05:14:49 i think every successful service google offers will touch android May 13 05:14:55 so if its successful, yes. May 13 05:14:59 otherwise, no :) May 13 05:19:45 man, ever since that cloud cult show saturday night i have been addicted to this song: That Man Jumped Out The Window May 13 05:29:51 hey dan May 13 05:30:38 hes scared of you jas May 13 05:30:41 jasta May 13 05:32:00 >:) May 13 05:47:01 even after emailing them telling them i didnt get an email, i still ahvent got any confirmation from that May 13 05:47:03 them May 13 05:47:17 that extrmeely sucks :( May 13 05:51:03 well, they are probably sending it, so assume your server is broken and figure out how ;) May 13 06:32:24 hey michaelnovakjr, you here? May 13 06:44:53 wow... the list has been published May 13 06:44:55 sweet May 13 06:45:02 really, just now? May 13 06:45:07 yup May 13 06:45:21 that's unexpected May 13 06:45:24 http://phandroid.com/2008/05/10/adc-round-1-winners/ May 13 06:45:39 nice May 13 06:45:49 it pre'd a few hrs ago on the blog May 13 06:46:09 neat, that jeffrey sharkey guy won May 13 06:46:19 lol May 13 06:46:22 has any of that been confirmed? May 13 06:46:34 jerkface03: it's on the android-developers blog May 13 06:46:41 posted by jason chen, so yeah, i assume so :) May 13 06:46:42 orly? May 13 06:47:03 http://android-developers.blogspot.com/2008/05/top-50-applications.html May 13 06:47:33 oh wow, the weather channel won an app!!! hahahaha May 13 06:47:38 do people actually watch that channel?! May 13 06:48:14 don't hate May 13 06:48:22 i watch the weather channel all the time May 13 06:48:28 it keeps me up on inaccurate weather forcasts May 13 06:48:50 :D May 13 06:49:07 reading this list is really depressing :( May 13 06:49:21 whys that? you're still pouting about losing? May 13 06:49:47 a lot of these are pretty stupid May 13 06:49:49 i think it's well rounded May 13 06:50:04 yet few have value, from the names themselves May 13 06:50:14 what do you mean? May 13 06:50:23 jasta: i agree with you on that one May 13 06:51:23 jerkface03: so call it pouting if you want, but they are very stupid May 13 06:51:25 and mine wasn't. May 13 06:51:31 so, what the fuck ever. May 13 06:51:40 jasta: i guess it's what the people want? May 13 06:51:51 there was 1 media player that won? May 13 06:52:44 i haven't gone through the complete list, but so far of the ones i recognize, i can't say i'd use a single one of them May 13 06:52:48 and i don't think i know anyone who would. May 13 06:53:08 if not for my project, TuneWiki would be an attractive submission though. May 13 06:54:59 i can't wait to see screenshots and descriptions for the apps May 13 06:55:04 *whoa* May 13 06:55:05 it should explain some more May 13 06:55:12 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sBOyGp25sSg -- that is really bizarre. May 13 06:55:17 that one did win, and i can say that's not very stupid at all May 13 06:56:13 what the hell is that May 13 06:56:16 though actually watching the demo...they are not typing faster than i do with my qwerty keyboard phone May 13 06:56:23 not even close May 13 06:56:27 i can type about 25wpm with that thing May 13 06:56:31 now *that* is what i would call useless May 13 06:56:52 yeah, as i'm watching this, i am less and less impressed. May 13 06:56:56 it is slow to type very short words May 13 06:57:00 way too complex for the average user to even understand what this is May 13 06:57:05 which is exactly the opposite of what you want May 13 06:57:44 so... May 13 06:57:49 anyone prepared to make a bold claim with me? May 13 06:58:00 shoot May 13 06:58:09 i'm gonna go on a limb and say that only a handful of these will ever even be used. May 13 06:58:28 nobody will care, nobody will use them. May 13 06:58:29 ie. five or less? :) May 13 06:58:36 yeah, a handful :) May 13 06:58:40 just one hand. May 13 06:58:40 hehe May 13 06:59:04 hmm... like 1 year from now? May 13 06:59:11 it's hard to say, a lot of these have lame names May 13 06:59:16 but might be good ideas May 13 06:59:23 i'm looking them up, one by one May 13 06:59:45 i'm really curious about the 4 that didn't want to be included May 13 06:59:56 btw, i am prepping to run svnsync to upload my code ;) May 13 07:00:06 nice May 13 07:00:44 http://www.cookingcapsules.com/ May 13 07:00:47 that's muthu's thing May 13 07:01:33 hahahaha May 13 07:01:34 awesome May 13 07:01:37 whole foods... i gotta go there May 13 07:01:59 i buy my groceries at walmart May 13 07:02:03 yuppy bastard May 13 07:02:41 haha May 13 07:02:48 i've been to whole foods once in my life May 13 07:03:01 their prepared foods are pretty nice May 13 07:03:03 i was going to make a blogpost about my source going up and stuff but i think i will wait a couple of days May 13 07:03:08 i don't want to get drowned out by this news May 13 07:03:08 ;) May 13 07:03:13 but they're about 25 min from my place May 13 07:03:24 crazy - just seen the winner list - no Enkin in there & no Dup May 13 07:03:28 Duo May 13 07:03:32 *wondering* May 13 07:03:39 whatchu wondering about May 13 07:03:40 i think it has to do with the README May 13 07:03:58 maybe they're the ones that chose not to be listed? May 13 07:04:13 jerkface03: don't think so May 13 07:04:22 then what are you saying? May 13 07:04:25 both ideas are public May 13 07:04:28 are you saying the judging was RIGGED? May 13 07:04:39 i hope Enkin didn't win. that app pissed me off ;) May 13 07:04:40 lol May 13 07:04:49 ;-) May 13 07:04:52 i'm saying the judges are idiots, actually. May 13 07:04:56 not rigged, just stupid May 13 07:05:06 don't be so bitter! May 13 07:05:09 ^^ May 13 07:05:16 jerkface03: it's hard with this list. May 13 07:05:19 it's very hard. May 13 07:06:51 yea May 13 07:07:03 the list crazy May 13 07:07:29 but i'd like some more info there whatt the apps are May 13 07:07:40 yeah, i've been googling lots of them May 13 07:07:42 and there is like nothing May 13 07:07:46 most of these folks have kept quiet May 13 07:07:50 hopefully google will post some info soon May 13 07:07:54 well i'll promote my app: www.pednav.com May 13 07:08:46 f00f-: E(50) || E(1733) May 13 07:09:08 E(int): undefined May 13 07:09:11 f00f-: i like the concept of your app, actually. May 13 07:09:22 f00f-: speaking of pednav, i thought of another cool idea with a similar name May 13 07:09:24 though i don't understand how you get your data? May 13 07:09:25 glad you approve jasta :) May 13 07:09:35 we built our own GTFS data set May 13 07:09:41 i mean, there's no central database for any of this crap? May 13 07:09:47 nope :( May 13 07:09:58 oh, GTFS... May 13 07:09:58 f00f-: i thought of an app that would look at the sex offender registry in the city you were in as you were driving and inform of sex offenders who lived close to where you're at May 13 07:10:03 i thought of calling it pedonav May 13 07:10:05 different transit agencies publish their GTFS data sets (the nice ones, like BART) others just send it to google transit directly May 13 07:10:18 DAMN!! May 13 07:10:24 heh May 13 07:10:29 i'd never heard of this, interesting May 13 07:10:41 my friend actually was bothered by the fact that pednav can be confused with paedophile navigator May 13 07:10:43 sounds interesting May 13 07:10:51 lol May 13 07:10:52 you think it'll be a problem for our app? :/ May 13 07:10:59 unlikely May 13 07:14:36 Anyone that wants to have their APP featured/covered, I'd be happy to do a Q&A if you supply me with info. Just hit up the contact page on phandroid.com May 13 07:16:04 also May 13 07:16:06 just to note May 13 07:16:12 it looks like no libs won any of the top 50 spaces May 13 07:16:24 did OpenIntents enter? May 13 07:16:25 i would've guessed that months ago May 13 07:16:42 @jerkface: unless they are in the 4 out of 50 not mentioned May 13 07:18:56 trigatch4: how likely do you think that is? May 13 07:19:05 not very May 13 07:19:07 but it's possible May 13 07:19:45 i suspect Google is disappointed with this ;) May 13 07:20:38 anyway, i'm off to upload code May 13 07:20:44 stay tuned if anyone wants to tear apart all my hard work May 13 07:21:07 jasta: why not just keep it closed and keep working on it? May 13 07:21:15 someone here was shooting off at the mouth about another ADC coming up May 13 07:21:26 i don't know if that's true tho May 13 07:21:34 there is a second ADC, yes. May 13 07:21:37 many months from now May 13 07:21:39 so hold off May 13 07:21:41 keep working on it May 13 07:21:43 and reenter it May 13 07:21:52 i could still re-enter with an open application May 13 07:22:08 you're going to risk someone stealing your shit May 13 07:22:14 do it afterwards May 13 07:22:16 no one can "steal my shit". May 13 07:22:32 the source is GPL, so they would need to do so illegally. GPL violations are very easy to demonstrate. May 13 07:22:53 otherwise if someone wants to fork and try to submit my own application over the top of me, i think it would be pretty obvious. May 13 07:23:57 and if i kept it closed the ni would not have the advantage of contributors in the community. i also don't see how all this "closed" thinking is going to help Google change the industry. May 13 07:24:55 the ADC has corrupted a lot of you :) May 13 07:25:40 or perhaps i'm being too presumptuous. did anyone even care about the greater possible good here? May 13 07:26:00 nope! May 13 07:26:09 I am a hater of the gpl personally May 13 07:26:14 of course May 13 07:26:16 apache or closed May 13 07:26:19 is my view May 13 07:26:23 just because it's not open source doesn't mean it can't be good May 13 07:26:29 duey: pretty much May 13 07:26:34 open roxxx ( gpl or cc ) May 13 07:26:40 open source is not always for the benefit of the project, f00f. May 13 07:26:45 apache iss good too May 13 07:26:48 it's for the benefit of the community that supports the project. May 13 07:27:02 duey: maybe the gpl hates you too May 13 07:27:06 but if there are too many forks or versions of said code, it can also harm the community (userbase i mean) May 13 07:27:09 oh im sure it does :) May 13 07:27:20 opening our apps is for the benefit of *other* Android developers. May 13 07:27:23 na gpl is ok, i can understand why people use it May 13 07:27:33 this platform should have no secrets. right now, the documentation is miserable, and so i suspect that it does ;) May 13 07:27:37 it would suck if someone just took your code and started selling compiled versions of it May 13 07:27:43 duey: to ensure freedom? May 13 07:27:45 (which is OK under apache) May 13 07:27:51 duey: i worked for a company that did that May 13 07:28:08 duey: that took foss components, made some shitty gui wrapper around it and sold it for $29.95/year May 13 07:28:39 it was run by some fatass with glasses May 13 07:28:45 he kept accusing me of throwing blank paper in the garbage May 13 07:28:46 i just have no interest in further stifling this platform by keeping my work secret. May 13 07:29:04 one day he came in and called me by the wrong name May 13 07:29:04 anyone here wanna help me track down the links for the 46? I'm having trouble with a bunch. Guessing a lot of them don't have sites/pages... :( May 13 07:29:09 i think people who won are being lousy keeping it secret May 13 07:29:29 trigatch4, they are probably companies May 13 07:29:43 duey: i am honestly surprised that google made no stipulation about the applicable business model of winning entries May 13 07:30:04 i had assumed prior to the release of the terms that google would require at least a reaosnable minimum guarantee of openness from the winners. May 13 07:30:10 i personally think they should wave the right to keep it secret if they win May 13 07:30:12 so that Google could ensure the app goes in the right direction. May 13 07:30:21 i had suspect that Google would want to dip their hands in the winning apps to "google-ize" them. May 13 07:30:28 yeah May 13 07:30:36 so i'm very surprised that no such conditions were set. May 13 07:30:52 Google made a big mistake there, I think. I can understand why they thought it was a good idea, but they were wrong ;) May 13 07:30:56 jasta, it would mean they would have to stop boozing May 13 07:30:56 we don't know yet :) May 13 07:31:05 Most of these apps are going to require Google's golden touch to take off. May 13 07:31:26 a closed, greedy community will never make it work... May 13 07:32:28 ahem, for the record... May 13 07:32:44 while i fully support opening my app, and have been very open up until this point discussing the idea... May 13 07:32:51 i am concerned that TuneWiki will "lift" it. May 13 07:33:11 i just wanted to go on record as saying that. we'll see what happens ;) May 13 07:34:54 jasta, gpl it May 13 07:34:59 oh, i am. May 13 07:34:59 tune is closed right? May 13 07:35:02 yeah May 13 07:35:12 but my code being GPL doesn't prevent him from reimplementing it May 13 07:35:28 that's his prerogative if he wants to try to enter that fight with me ;) May 13 07:36:45 re May 13 07:36:48 anyway, i really want to get the code out tehre May 13 07:36:55 duey: hang tight, i'd like to get some user feedback ;) May 13 07:37:01 lol ok May 13 07:37:07 but my interents connection is really slow May 13 07:37:19 mornin all May 13 07:37:24 i'm packaging the server and client, so you need not download anything but the code May 13 07:37:30 duey: you run Linux, right? May 13 07:37:35 no May 13 07:37:38 oh, then forget you May 13 07:37:41 qq May 13 07:37:42 there's no Windows or OS X server yet May 13 07:37:43 mornin? it's 3:33am here... i guess it is morning ugh looks like an allnighter May 13 07:37:57 trigatch4, its 9:37 here May 13 07:38:01 jasta, i have a server thats linux? May 13 07:38:03 :) May 13 07:38:04 not a desktop though May 13 07:38:16 cutmasta: good morning to you then May 13 07:38:23 well that might work, i dunno. there's no option to build without a GUI currently. May 13 07:38:26 trigatch4, good night :) May 13 07:38:26 i mean, i just didnt add it. May 13 07:38:32 oh ok May 13 07:38:45 yeah i have no xwindows or anything on the server box May 13 07:39:13 someone else, then :) May 13 07:42:19 well, svnsync is running....VERY SLOWLY May 13 07:42:41 but watching the Changes tab on Google Code is making me feel all warm and fuzzy May 13 07:42:51 Jan 22, 2008: 'begin coding...' May 13 07:42:59 Jan 23, 2008: 'major changes' May 13 07:43:00 ;) May 13 07:43:06 *shivers* May 13 07:44:02 http://code.google.com/p/five/source/detail?r=8 May 13 07:44:03 <3 May 13 07:44:17 'whatever'? :) May 13 07:44:29 yeah lol May 13 07:44:38 almost as descriptive as my commit messages May 13 07:44:40 i mean that was so early in development it's like commit logs didn't mean shit May 13 07:45:07 i use "blah" alot May 13 07:45:21 this is so crazy to watch. May 13 07:45:27 months and months of work are unraveling slowly May 13 07:45:40 or actually, "raveling" :) May 13 07:50:15 49 revisions and you are only in feb! May 13 07:50:24 oh just wait May 13 07:50:32 i commit atomically if i can. May 13 07:51:51 http://code.google.com/p/five/source/detail?r=50 -- oh yeah, that's the gem. May 13 07:53:20 haha May 13 07:53:28 carved in stone May 13 07:55:03 this is making me realize the incredible amount of work i have poured into this project already May 13 07:55:24 its stopped updating! May 13 07:55:34 what? May 13 07:55:50 svn May 13 07:55:58 nah, it's still going May 13 07:56:00 oh nm May 13 07:56:07 it's just so slow ;) May 13 07:56:12 bleh May 13 07:56:49 that was a commit message about 20 revs back ;) May 13 07:58:00 yeah :) May 13 07:58:16 man this thing is just nowhere close to being finished. still in feb :) May 13 07:58:24 lol was just going to say that May 13 07:58:36 april was the heavy month ;) May 13 07:58:41 what revision are you at now? May 13 07:58:44 104 May 13 07:58:47 nono May 13 07:58:51 oh May 13 07:58:52 for real May 13 07:58:54 yeha May 13 07:58:54 i dunno, like 400 May 13 08:02:40 this is entertaining me more than i'd thought May 13 08:02:53 err, than i would've thought May 13 08:04:55 duey: FYI, this project of mine is not small ;) May 13 08:05:04 lol i can see May 13 08:07:47 i think the line count total these days is around 24K May 13 08:20:43 If anyone can help fill in the missing pieces, off the top of their head, it would be much, much, much appreciated: http://phandroid.com/2008/05/10/adc-round-1-winners/ May 13 08:23:22 trigatch4: very helpful May 13 08:23:42 jasta: serious or sarcastic? May 13 08:23:47 serious May 13 08:23:51 oh... ty :) May 13 08:27:36 is there another "list" of winners, i just crawled all ML mails May 13 08:27:45 no May 13 08:27:52 and wrote a "list" of apps which won May 13 08:28:14 http://www.android-portal.com/2008/05/12/a-look-at-the-adc-round-1-top-50-winners/ May 13 08:28:33 http://android-developers.blogspot.com/2008/05/top-50-applications.html May 13 08:28:42 ah May 13 08:29:00 duey: lord, it's still uploading... May 13 08:29:04 in fact, it's only on Apr 10 May 13 08:29:05 lol May 13 08:29:15 you can see me frantically rushing to submit ;) May 13 08:30:04 that locale app is awesome May 13 08:30:10 thats a good idea May 13 08:30:21 i have to leave my phone on perma-silent May 13 08:30:27 duey: where is it? May 13 08:30:40 http://www.android-portal.com/2008/05/12/a-look-at-the-adc-round-1-top-50-winners/ - top of thel ist May 13 08:31:01 top of thel? May 13 08:31:02 location based phone settings May 13 08:31:05 the list May 13 08:31:09 ah May 13 08:31:10 yep May 13 08:31:12 doh May 13 08:31:17 now there are real applications out there May 13 08:31:22 romainguy? May 13 08:31:23 * romainguy__ feels guilty taking an evening off now :) May 13 08:31:30 lol May 13 08:31:36 (actually I don't :) May 13 08:31:47 duey, yeah that's pretty cool one May 13 08:31:48 romainguy__: my source code is uploading to Google Code right now.... ;0 May 13 08:31:55 :) May 13 08:32:03 better watch out jasta May 13 08:32:12 for? May 13 08:32:12 "Google Five" might suddenly be released May 13 08:32:18 they have you code.. May 13 08:32:19 i will cut them May 13 08:32:20 your May 13 08:32:24 lol May 13 08:32:25 LOCALE May 13 08:32:29 great app May 13 08:32:31 nice idea May 13 08:32:33 cool May 13 08:32:53 my windows mobile phone has this feature that lets me associate a settings group with my meeting schedules May 13 08:32:57 so it can go silent when im in a meeting or whatever May 13 08:33:10 still it's strange that some of submissions haven't made it to the list May 13 08:33:11 but i never use it because it's impossible to predict so narrowly May 13 08:33:19 just because my meeting was scheduled for 30 minutes doesn't mean it will be May 13 08:33:22 varjag, yeah.. May 13 08:33:23 maybe they're among 4 withheld though May 13 08:33:39 varjag: what do yo umean? May 13 08:33:43 varjag, i suspect those 4 are not published anyway May 13 08:33:47 as in no one knows about them May 13 08:33:52 duey, good point May 13 08:33:57 oh yeah, almost certainly May 13 08:34:15 if they were public before, there's no reason they wouldn't want you to know they won May 13 08:34:31 true May 13 08:35:06 i hope one of these IM apps just plain works May 13 08:35:22 i've never used mobile IMing just because it's so poorly implemented May 13 08:35:35 there are no good clients that use your data connection instead of SMS, and the SMS ones are pricey because of that. May 13 08:37:26 interesting that enkin program didnt win May 13 08:37:34 thank god May 13 08:37:36 i guess it was pretty complicated May 13 08:37:45 and had some useless features May 13 08:37:58 there are several good IM apps for the iphone May 13 08:38:10 Enkin wasn't using only the emulator May 13 08:38:34 ah May 13 08:40:39 calculater didnt win May 13 08:40:51 i bet a graphing calculator app would've. May 13 08:40:52 * jasta looks around May 13 08:41:21 though maybe not since TI is in the OHA and there could be some scam going on :) May 13 08:41:22 http://www.anddev.org/my_submission_is_a_calculator-t1704.html May 13 08:41:31 i really like that one May 13 08:41:34 jasta, prob :) May 13 08:41:36 yeah, i saw that... May 13 08:41:44 but it should have gone further into a graphing calc May 13 08:42:01 oh, it did... i didn't see that the first time i looked at the videos May 13 08:42:10 yeah must be a new feature May 13 08:42:21 that's great. i'm really glad they did that. May 13 08:42:27 that app could be HUGE with high school and college students May 13 08:43:51 too bad enkin didn't win May 13 08:43:57 no, screw enkin May 13 08:44:00 it was very cool May 13 08:44:07 yes it was cool, bu required hardware May 13 08:44:11 no way judges will have access to that May 13 08:44:16 to fairly evaluate the concept May 13 08:44:22 so perhaps for ADC II they will have a better solution May 13 08:44:42 also, it tasted of 'research' so maybe they didn't believe it would actually be used in the long run May 13 08:44:48 (the judges) May 13 08:45:12 Enkin is a classic example of overengineering and why it just doesn't work. May 13 08:45:20 what was overengineered there? May 13 08:45:39 the 3d stuff May 13 08:45:40 what value does this approach provide over a map and GPS? May 13 08:45:46 and ^^ May 13 08:46:08 convenience? May 13 08:46:13 jasta: I have a very poor sense of direction and I'm sure Enkin would be useful to me May 13 08:46:15 what is more convenient about that? May 13 08:46:25 you can have a paper map and numeric gps readout just as well sure May 13 08:46:29 tomgibara: I'm sure it would, like leading you into the wrong way on a one way. May 13 08:46:34 just like military does May 13 08:46:38 Or into the freeway May 13 08:46:40 Or a river. May 13 08:46:53 As an adjunct to a map representation it is useful in my opinion May 13 08:47:05 It would need to be converted into a directions system, and then the "intuitive" navigation is completely lost. At taht point, GPS and a map becomes the more useful tool. May 13 08:47:12 My doubts about Enkin centre around the fact that it requires a digital compass in the phone. May 13 08:47:14 and with flyover perspective you won't run in the river anyway May 13 08:47:27 tomgibara: No, it would just watch GPS position over time and orient itself May 13 08:47:29 very easy. May 13 08:47:50 jasta: did you read their document? May 13 08:47:54 varjag: flyover perspective is called a map ;) May 13 08:48:05 tomgibara: perhaps not all of it May 13 08:48:06 uh please May 13 08:48:08 jasta: exactly the map May 13 08:48:23 ok, fine. you guys are free to have your opinion. May 13 08:48:36 ... is combined seamlessly with the AR representation, that's their idea May 13 08:48:37 but if i won't be holding my breathe for it to take off. May 13 08:48:50 they are trying to unify the map with your 3d environment May 13 08:49:05 i've done marine navigation app back in late 90s, i know the value of good old map i hope May 13 08:49:30 s/if // May 13 08:49:30 jasta meant: but i won't be holding my breathe for it to take off. May 13 08:49:39 err, i hate that bot May 13 08:51:05 it was certainly more useful and innovative than counting co2 emissions May 13 08:51:32 well, it was certainly more innovative, anyway May 13 08:51:45 the usefulness simply cannot be determined with th eemulator May 13 08:51:57 they should resubmit for the ADC II, then we will see. May 13 08:52:02 perhaps May 13 08:52:38 but again, i won't be holding my breathe. i find nothing deficient about a map and GPS. i don't even like to turn on GPS because it drains my battery May 13 08:52:41 google maps is so good you don't need it May 13 08:53:48 jasta: the point I was making about enkin's documentation is that it requires a 3-axis tilt-compensated compass to work. How many phones have those? May 13 08:54:19 lol, none. are they thinking their app will be so groundbreaking it will change the hardware roll out? May 13 08:54:38 jasta: perhaps :-) May 13 08:55:05 so, did you submit an app? May 13 08:56:24 jasta: me? May 13 08:56:35 does somebody know if the admin of anddev is here? May 13 08:56:36 yeah, sorry :) May 13 08:56:42 cutmasta: plusminus? May 13 08:56:45 yap May 13 08:56:52 he seems not to be atm. May 13 08:56:52 is he also called plusminus here? May 13 08:56:56 yeah May 13 08:56:58 ah May 13 08:57:00 tomgibara, android has api for orientation sensors, it is totally fine to submit an app taking advantage of it May 13 08:57:02 ok then i will wait May 13 08:57:03 thx jasonchen May 13 08:57:06 thx jasta May 13 08:57:10 fuck autocomplete May 13 08:57:11 :) May 13 08:57:19 Moseycode was my app. May 13 08:57:22 Tom... did it win? May 13 08:57:25 oh thats right May 13 08:57:38 ha no, not even in the top 100 :) May 13 08:57:45 yeah, mine wasn't in the top 100 either ;) May 13 08:57:46 tomgibara: it's very cool though :) May 13 08:57:56 I concur May 13 08:58:04 Who submitted Writing Pad... anyone here? May 13 08:58:04 romainguy: Thanks May 13 08:58:18 trigatch4: i actually thought writing pad was relaly cool at first May 13 08:58:25 but then the more i watched i realize it's quite slow to type with May 13 08:58:30 I don't get it... it's like a freaking etcha sketch May 13 08:58:38 The Moseycode system has a good chance of being used in a number of marketing campaigns actually. May 13 08:58:42 counter productive to the goals Android has, IMHO May 13 08:58:55 trigatch4: did you submit? May 13 08:59:01 yeah Tom... I still would love to interview for phandroid... I promise I'll get an email out shortly May 13 08:59:03 Not by me I must add, its an open platform for everyone. May 13 08:59:13 No I'm not a coder unfortunately... wish I could I had 235235 ideas... still do May 13 08:59:18 tigatch4: no rush May 13 08:59:27 But I'm relegated to being obsessed... and covering the news on phandroid.com May 13 08:59:41 that seems like a shackled position :) May 13 09:00:27 you're telling me! it's so frustrating to think you have an amazing idea without the ability to act. Hopefully I'll be able to save some money and hire a developer. May 13 09:01:00 romainguy__: did you have any part in designing the graphics package API? May 13 09:01:06 I was surprised that WiFiArmy wasn't on the list... wonder if they are one of the 4. Parallel Kingdom, too. They seemed like pretty fascinating games that embraced the android concept May 13 09:01:20 actually, it looks like no games won May 13 09:01:31 i had hoped someone would make a monkey ball game that would let you actually tilt the phone May 13 09:01:31 tomgibara: some of it but it was mostly there when I joined May 13 09:01:41 duey: if you're curious, the current revision is 494. May 13 09:01:54 alright folks May 13 09:01:54 romainguy__: I just think it's very well designed May 13 09:01:59 http://code.google.com/p/five/source/checkout -- there it is. May 13 09:02:17 tomgibara: cool, I'll pass the word to the author :) May 13 09:02:21 he will appreciate May 13 09:03:46 (but I'd like to overhaul the animation system) May 13 09:04:03 * cutmasta is impressed of the apps May 13 09:04:07 which i just googled for May 13 09:04:27 romainguy__: the only problem I have with it (and this is me more than the API) is that I've found it difficult to find an effective approach to caching my Paint objects effectively May 13 09:04:35 my head just exploded trying to read diff output on a patch file that has changed substantially May 13 09:04:45 tomgibara: how so? May 13 09:05:08 (I never had to use more than 2 or 3 different Paint at the same time so...) May 13 09:05:18 romainguy__: it might just be the nature of my first application, I don't know what I'm going to be drawing from one frame to the next because barcodes can come and go at any time May 13 09:05:27 ah yes May 13 09:05:39 as long as you don't create new Paint, that's fine May 13 09:06:27 speaking of caching a future SDK will have something cool May 13 09:06:37 excellent May 13 09:06:40 you will be able to create display lists May 13 09:07:01 * jasta perks up May 13 09:08:08 what's a display list? May 13 09:08:39 see it as a recording of all your drawing commands May 13 09:08:48 you issue them once in a display list (called Picture right now) May 13 09:08:48 mhm.. bitter, bitter folks in the forum May 13 09:08:54 I understand May 13 09:09:02 and the next time, instead of issuing all these drawing commands again, you just draw the display list May 13 09:10:13 Can you use a display list within the context of a canvas that has already had transforms applied etc. ? May 13 09:10:35 sure May 13 09:11:05 then that will be very very useful, I can cache a display list for the static barcode representations May 13 09:11:48 duey: *poke* May 13 09:12:06 tomgibara: the web browser uses this on the native side for instance May 13 09:14:20 pong May 13 09:14:25 494! May 13 09:14:27 damn May 13 09:14:29 duey: actually May 13 09:14:31 it's 500 now May 13 09:14:35 haha May 13 09:14:36 i made some changes :) May 13 09:14:54 lol May 13 09:14:55 anyway, you can check it out now if you're interested May 13 09:14:56 whatever! May 13 09:15:05 without a Linux GUI, you won't be able to make the server work out of the box though May 13 09:15:14 hmm May 13 09:15:45 ill dl a distro at work tomorrow May 13 09:15:50 and vmware it May 13 09:16:44 there are a lot of rough edges though, so just hollar if you get lost May 13 09:40:55 romainguy__: does using a display list avoid the overhead of repeatedly calling through to the native layer for each operation in the list? May 13 09:41:09 yes May 13 09:41:22 but calling through the native layer is not that costly on Android May 13 09:42:21 great, faster and more convenient May 13 09:48:44 i saw the list of winners May 13 09:48:51 all i can say is, hahaha! May 13 09:48:54 :) May 13 09:49:08 anyone else have other thoughts? May 13 09:50:39 many of them deserved to win May 13 09:50:59 I'm disappointed by some of the choices May 13 09:51:08 I think the list reflects the judging system chosen by Google May 13 09:53:14 varjag: so do you think 20 of these are worth 100k USD? May 13 09:53:22 Take the Locale application which (AFAIK) adjusts phone settings based on your location. May 13 09:53:44 A worthy application for sure, but the idea was patented by IBM five years ago May 13 09:53:51 Lede, i didn't count, but it could well be the case May 13 09:54:07 but then there are some apps that are not on the list and i think they should be May 13 09:54:31 but thing is May 13 09:54:47 we just had an argument here about one of them May 13 09:55:00 A judging system with more of a committee element might have resulted in one judge knowing that and telling the others May 13 09:55:02 and turns out people diametrally split on it May 13 09:55:12 honestly when i saw programs like Duo i thought i wouldn't win May 13 09:55:19 which just shows that there is no such thing as "obvious" winner May 13 09:55:22 but this list looks pretty weak :/ May 13 09:55:27 Anyone know Locale's website? Or fingerprint painting program? Or any not yet listed on http://phandroid.com/2008/05/10/adc-round-1-winnersadc-round-1-winners/? May 13 09:55:40 I havent slept in like 30 hours cause I want to complete the list haha May 13 09:56:10 Isolating people makes them less effective - we are social beings May 13 09:56:13 woh, oke May 13 09:56:38 So forcing the judges to work in isolation was never going to produce the best results. May 13 09:56:46 Those are some of my views. May 13 12:20:06 hello muthu May 13 12:20:17 Dougie187: hi May 13 12:20:29 how are you on this fine morning/evening for you? May 13 12:22:17 hey muthu May 13 12:22:20 heard you won :P May 13 12:22:53 hey doing good May 13 12:22:57 varjag: yup May 13 12:23:02 cool :) May 13 12:23:07 thanks May 13 12:24:13 new SDK anyone? May 13 12:24:27 no new SDK here May 13 12:24:34 namaskar muthu btw. ;.) May 13 12:24:42 ligi: halo May 13 12:25:13 haha no new sdk huh? May 13 12:25:25 hopefully coming soon.. May 13 12:25:37 me2 May 13 12:25:45 muthu, which app did you submit? May 13 12:25:52 cooking capsules May 13 12:26:03 ah, the one being bashed today :) May 13 12:26:07 hehe May 13 12:26:16 cooking capsules May 13 12:26:17 hmm May 13 12:26:21 * cutmasta googles May 13 12:26:23 :) May 13 12:26:36 :) May 13 12:27:04 its simple and useful May 13 12:27:20 find near markets, share recipes, send shopping list to friends May 13 12:27:28 these are some features May 13 12:27:29 muthu, nice work May 13 12:27:35 just saw the vid May 13 12:27:38 apart from actually learning how to cook! May 13 12:27:43 cutmasta: thanks May 13 12:27:48 its all Mary Ann May 13 12:27:51 she did all the hard work May 13 12:28:13 i just agreed with her vision May 13 12:28:15 whatd you do then? May 13 12:28:18 heh May 13 12:28:34 Dougie187: code? May 13 12:28:38 Ohh ok May 13 12:28:43 She didnt code? May 13 12:28:47 nopr May 13 12:28:54 no, she's is the designer May 13 12:29:08 well coding can be rather difficult sometimes May 13 12:29:17 unless its like "Hello World" May 13 12:29:24 Dougie187, design and idea is at least half the job in the contest May 13 12:29:31 yeah, its the combo which matters May 13 12:29:36 true. May 13 12:29:48 im just saying that she didnt do "everything" May 13 12:29:53 i guess. May 13 12:29:57 correct May 13 12:29:59 its team work May 13 12:30:27 there's a lot of great apps submitted May 13 12:30:36 but unfortunately the idea might not click with the judges May 13 12:35:08 even rejection gives some insights though May 13 12:35:13 it can mean: May 13 12:35:25 a) you had problems with concept, implementation or presentation May 13 12:35:26 or May 13 12:35:32 b) google is against you May 13 12:35:51 many folks opt for b :) May 13 12:36:15 c) you are a suspected terrorist May 13 12:36:21 ooh May 13 12:36:25 didn't think of this one May 13 12:36:31 fair enough May 13 12:36:51 i think more people think the judges are against them then google. May 13 12:37:00 well or that May 13 12:37:19 i just don't see reason for judges to be against average submitter May 13 12:37:35 i think some people just think the judges got lazy May 13 12:37:44 maybe they saw an app they loved in the first half of the apps. May 13 12:37:53 and then they half-assed scored the rest of them May 13 12:37:58 well May 13 12:38:04 like Jasta swears he only got two scores, but dan says he has 4 May 13 12:38:06 a lot of complaints were that judges did not spend enough time on their apps May 13 12:38:18 the apps were distributed among groups of judges, no? May 13 12:38:19 but only 2 people accessed his app May 13 12:38:28 yes May 13 12:38:31 they were May 13 12:38:36 as far as we know at least. May 13 12:38:47 and supposedly sorted for outliers May 13 12:38:58 which i guess there were few May 13 12:39:00 according to dan May 13 12:39:41 i'm happy my app doesn't access servers - saved me a lot of frustration :) May 13 12:39:50 lol May 13 12:39:54 did you win? May 13 12:39:57 no :) May 13 12:40:12 heh May 13 12:40:17 what was your app? May 13 12:40:23 but at least i didn't know that until the end May 13 12:41:19 I want to see the Weather Channel app...I did one for accuweather and we didn't make top 100 May 13 12:41:51 zhobbs`: guess that's the only weather app that made it May 13 12:41:57 yep May 13 12:42:22 a call list, that clusters call history based on location/time of day and presents most likely ones May 13 12:42:35 always hated how recent call list in my nokia acts May 13 12:42:49 thats cool May 13 12:43:02 im gonna write an app for adc2 May 13 12:43:06 apparently not cool enough :) May 13 12:43:12 yeah, thinking about it too May 13 12:43:39 but we need to get phones first .. May 13 12:43:45 no phone - no ADC II May 13 12:43:46 true dat. May 13 12:43:59 I was thinking maybe the judges were looking for a wow factor. May 13 12:44:03 rather then a useful factor. May 13 12:44:24 because i know a couple useful apps that didnt make it. May 13 12:44:33 and some completely useless ones that did May 13 12:44:41 I wonder if all Judges of ADCII will use the same phoenes May 13 12:44:58 i would hope so May 13 12:44:58 lol May 13 12:45:09 I could't buy several phones private to test on May 13 12:45:12 haha May 13 12:45:16 otherwise if you write a touch screen app, and the judge doesnt have a touch screen phone then you get screwed in your test May 13 12:45:33 they'll all use the same app May 13 12:45:36 phone I mean May 13 12:45:44 I would think May 13 12:45:44 thats my point. May 13 12:46:12 * ligi hopes for a phone with touchscreen / WLAN / BT & ACC May 13 12:46:20 +GPS May 13 12:46:31 sounds about right May 13 12:46:33 + micro sd slot. May 13 12:46:34 would be cool if developer phone kits were available for lease or at discount prices May 13 12:46:43 even if they're ugly as sin :) May 13 12:46:52 lol like the one whats his name got. May 13 12:46:59 would be cool if people who made android related sites got one for free May 13 12:47:03 one of the guys who has a forum or something May 13 12:47:26 oh yeah, plus minus has that brick one May 13 12:47:33 yeah thats it May 13 12:47:45 it has dvi and svideo on it. May 13 12:47:47 and 10/100 May 13 12:48:03 it didnt come with android on it thought May 13 12:49:55 i want no brick - i want a phone May 13 12:50:12 well his is like a laptop May 13 12:50:20 its crazy May 13 12:50:22 not really a laptop May 13 12:50:27 its really a brick. May 13 12:50:29 like he said May 13 12:50:34 but it is uglier then sin May 13 12:50:35 lol May 13 12:51:35 http://ftk-bsuir.narod.ru/museum/kommut/Phone_07.jpg << leaked photo of android phone prototype May 13 12:52:05 varjag: lol May 13 12:52:05 damn, cant wait to get my hands on that. May 13 12:52:06 lol May 13 12:52:07 lol May 13 12:52:31 omg, where's the touch screen? May 13 12:52:53 its on the bottom May 13 12:53:03 or on another side of cover May 13 12:53:59 you should have an android sitting on the phone May 13 12:54:03 also, it can work on legacy landlines and withstand EM pulse of nuclear blast May 13 12:54:47 muthu: I just found http://www.cookingcapsules.com/ , looks great! May 13 12:55:04 zhobbs`: thanks, thats the video part May 13 12:56:16 i take it that was your partner? May 13 12:57:52 Dougie187: no, that was one of the host May 13 12:58:27 oh ok May 13 12:58:46 muthu: how many hosts do you have? May 13 12:59:02 3 for now May 13 12:59:34 do you pay them? May 13 13:04:01 Dougie187: they are all in the team May 13 13:04:30 ohh ok May 13 13:04:32 cool May 13 14:24:50 30+ DIGGS and counting... DIGG IT: http://digg.com/gadgets/Round_1_Winners_of_the_Android_Developer_Challenge May 13 14:27:58 bust for michaelnovakjr May 13 14:29:39 Dougie187: there are actually 2 weather apps May 13 14:29:49 i just saw the first one so far May 13 14:30:02 theres at least 2 "family" managing gps apps too May 13 14:30:16 Anyone done a page of screenshots from the winners yet? May 13 14:30:42 rwhitby: it will come from google May 13 14:30:44 rwhitby, i did some pics on my androidportal.com May 13 14:30:48 (or at least the apps from the list whose authors frequent IRC or the mailing list? May 13 14:30:53 since most winners have presented a screenshot May 13 14:33:49 cutmasta: thx May 13 14:34:00 i wish there were more descriptions on there. May 13 14:34:17 there's more info at http://phandroid.com/2008/05/10/adc-round-1-winners/ May 13 14:34:28 thats where i was May 13 14:34:36 i wish there were more desctiptions though May 13 14:35:09 yeah, I think that list was just a teaser May 13 14:35:31 yap May 13 14:50:42 motherfuckers took my idea May 13 14:50:48 woohoo, sounds like I'm going to google IO May 13 14:51:05 zhobbs`: why, you weren't sure? May 13 14:51:11 michaelnovakjr: there's a couple of weather apps May 13 14:51:36 muthu: I know, pisses me off 2 weather apps won and mine didn't May 13 14:51:49 one of them took my base and added maps May 13 14:51:56 yeah. May 13 14:51:59 its like 3, i guess May 13 14:51:59 fuckers May 13 14:52:02 i said "bust for michaelnovakjr_1" earlier. May 13 14:52:06 muthu: It was going to cost too much to go...but someone is paying for it now May 13 14:52:20 zhobbs`: you just noticed, huh ;) May 13 14:52:29 oh i know May 13 14:54:13 i can't believe 4 winners didn't post May 13 14:54:19 they should have their apps pulled May 13 14:54:25 so much for OHA May 13 14:54:43 i guess they didn't get the memo the 'O' stands for open May 13 14:54:49 :) May 13 14:54:52 haha May 13 14:55:06 one app caught my eye - Sustain May 13 14:55:09 looks interesting May 13 14:55:13 oh please May 13 14:55:24 its only one line description though May 13 14:55:26 i don't use a social network on my computer, why do i need it on my phone May 13 14:55:39 so i can record a blog in the bathroom? May 13 14:55:42 no, but not sure what the twist is May 13 14:55:49 that like 10 people might read if i am lucky May 13 14:56:08 5 of which would be search engine bots :) May 13 14:56:26 i can't wait for social networking to be a thing of the past May 13 14:56:36 I gotta say out of all the ones I've seen (besides TuneWiki of course :) ), muthu's app looks soo cool May 13 14:56:53 I'm into cooking May 13 14:56:58 social networking will probably evolve into .... something like irc. May 13 14:57:03 and the video part is a really good idea May 13 14:57:15 zhobbs`: a lot seemed to like it May 13 14:57:20 :) May 13 14:57:25 i don't get where the videos come from? May 13 14:58:01 jasta: it has to be downloaded from the server on demand May 13 14:58:09 as its available May 13 14:58:17 i mean, where are they being recorded? May 13 14:58:18 muthu: but the team creates them right? May 13 14:58:42 yes, professional shows May 13 14:58:50 foodtv needs to buy your stuff May 13 14:58:52 but *where*? what are they? May 13 14:58:59 who is creating them? May 13 14:59:08 are they filmed specifically for the app? May 13 14:59:14 yes May 13 14:59:22 how can you hope to sustain that content? May 13 14:59:48 jasta: $300k will get you started May 13 14:59:56 agree, lot of cash May 13 14:59:56 actually, no it wouldn't. May 13 15:00:05 $300k is a very small amount of money for a startup. May 13 15:00:12 i see one app on that list i would use May 13 15:00:17 the PhoneBook May 13 15:00:20 most VCs would invest several million. May 13 15:00:31 what they hell was wrong with those judges May 13 15:00:34 lol May 13 15:00:34 need heavy funding though May 13 15:00:37 i know. May 13 15:00:40 theres like that game thing. May 13 15:00:42 where's the chat apps, music apps, video apps????? May 13 15:00:45 it sounds dumb. May 13 15:00:51 tunewiki is at the bottom. May 13 15:00:56 shit that people will actually use May 13 15:01:06 According to the ADC website, anyone who doesnt release their name can't receive the 25k May 13 15:01:11 not sure if they are going to do that. May 13 15:01:15 but thats what it says May 13 15:01:23 hell yea! May 13 15:01:40 yeah i'm really excited for TuneWiki. i can't wait to sap my battery life singing at my phone. May 13 15:01:50 heh May 13 15:01:58 so far i am very disappointed with android's app base May 13 15:02:00 zhobbs made that one, if i recall May 13 15:02:07 i am hoping apps 51-1788 are promising May 13 15:02:09 instead of that ancient practice of just listening to my music. that was so boring :) May 13 15:02:10 but the winners are the users. May 13 15:02:12 and still work on their stuff May 13 15:02:26 Dougie187: i know, i am obviously not impressed :) May 13 15:02:31 because the apps are.... open... May 13 15:02:33 ? May 13 15:02:59 you have to give a dollar to each user Dougie187, thats why they are winners May 13 15:03:00 if these r the apps that r going to be on gphone, im gonna get an iphone May 13 15:03:08 me too living_sword May 13 15:03:09 lol May 13 15:03:19 3G in june and apparently a better SDK May 13 15:03:26 you know... May 13 15:03:32 thumbs down to the list... big time May 13 15:03:34 im still gonna get a Gphone, but I probably wont use any of the top 50 apps May 13 15:03:37 Google is obviously going to write the best apps for Android :) May 13 15:03:55 jasta, agreed... but how many will they write? May 13 15:03:56 i mean, the introductory video said otherwise, but now it's very clear that the quality of the Google apps will greatly exceed community-driven apps. May 13 15:04:47 adc was a big media gimic May 13 15:04:50 michaelnovakjr_1: probably a fucking lot. Google's $10mil community prize surely pales in comparison to how much they are spending internally. May 13 15:05:11 living_sword: it wasn't even a good media gimmick, because now that they release the list, nobody is going to care. May 13 15:05:22 people are gonna look at this and just totally not get it. May 13 15:05:25 living_sword: media gimic.... i haven't seen it on a real media site yet May 13 15:05:36 nor has anyone spoken of it leading up to the ADC May 13 15:05:53 i doubt the media is going to care May 13 15:05:54 it was on forbes the other day May 13 15:06:13 briefly.... i wouldn't expect a follow up May 13 15:06:21 lol, i can't wait for /. to post about the ADC May 13 15:06:23 it's going to be drivel :) May 13 15:06:49 oh, uhh May 13 15:06:53 i released the source to my app btw May 13 15:07:04 i wouldnt blame the ADC having crappy apps on google, personally. May 13 15:07:14 Id blame the judges. May 13 15:07:15 Who was saying they wish there were more descriptions on there? May 13 15:07:20 Me May 13 15:07:27 like half of them just say the app name May 13 15:07:33 jasta, I think you're being overly pessimistic. May 13 15:07:35 some say "A simple whois revealed ..." May 13 15:07:41 Yeah... some of them I couldn't find any info on May 13 15:07:42 pawalls, why? May 13 15:07:53 It was a stretch to even confirm the domain was owned by the Android Developer May 13 15:07:56 It's an open platform, people will find interesting ways to use it. May 13 15:07:57 I was just taking random guesses May 13 15:08:11 not on that list though May 13 15:08:16 thats fine, im not saying you need to get more things. May 13 15:08:23 i think people need to give you stuff to post about their apps May 13 15:08:25 Looking through the list, it looks to me like they are rewarding novel apps, not necessarily functional ones :-P May 13 15:08:27 I just wanted to get quick and dirty info out as soon as possible May 13 15:08:31 Dougie187... May 13 15:08:37 true. May 13 15:08:40 thanks for making the list. May 13 15:08:43 I'm working on http://androidapplications.com over the next day or two May 13 15:08:44 pawalls, this is a cellphone.... they should be functional above all May 13 15:08:47 michaelnovakjr, Surely there were more than 50 submissions. May 13 15:08:49 im glad i could see a lot of the things. May 13 15:08:54 pawalls, 1788 May 13 15:08:58 That'll have very detailed info for all the apps May 13 15:09:02 with screen shots, links, etc... May 13 15:09:09 this was the "quick" go around May 13 15:09:09 michaelnovakjr_1, Are you implying that all 1788 submissions were crap? May 13 15:09:11 pawalls, most of the top 50 don't seem useful at all. May 13 15:09:13 pawalls: agreed. but this crop of apps does not represent that ;) May 13 15:09:13 yup May 13 15:09:13 i'm sure there are cool apps lurking in the shadow. and many more that don't even exist yet. May 13 15:09:13 now is the time to compare iphone apps with the prestigious top 50 May 13 15:09:13 pawalls, if they decide to continue development is another issue May 13 15:09:22 More likely the judging process didn't highlight the most significant apps. May 13 15:09:23 pawalls, no not at all May 13 15:09:34 I'm open to suggestions though.. so bash me if you want... i can take it :) May 13 15:09:43 We know that community driven software can produce great results, and I'm certain Google knows that as well. May 13 15:09:45 i am praying there's some decent stuff in there, and in fact i know quite a few that should have won and didn't May 13 15:09:46 Heh. naw im good May 13 15:09:51 i was just saying thanks for making the list. May 13 15:09:56 but i wish i knew what a lot of the apps were. May 13 15:09:56 and no, i am not including mine in that list :) May 13 15:10:05 pawalls: yeah, but it makes you wonder why so much closed crap won. May 13 15:10:06 they are just like name and owner. May 13 15:10:07 I wouldn't discount the platform simply based on the contest results. May 13 15:10:16 jasta, exactly... so much for open May 13 15:10:16 pawalls i agree. May 13 15:10:30 jasta, I don't have the answer. And I agree that most of the stuff on there looks a bit pointless. May 13 15:10:31 if i wanted a closed up phone i would go get the iPhone May 13 15:10:36 these 50 apps advertise Android platform May 13 15:10:47 they dont make the android platform though. May 13 15:10:54 granted these 50 apps seem to blow for the most part. May 13 15:11:00 Most of the apps look like "life integration" apps. May 13 15:11:01 or be useless and not functional May 13 15:11:05 Dougie187, no but for now that is what the public will see May 13 15:11:09 not really something you would look for a phone with. May 13 15:11:12 yup May 13 15:11:30 I dont think the public will be looking too heavily into the top 50 winners from the ADC though May 13 15:11:32 pawalls: i understand what an open platform can do for innovation. i am not being overly pessimistic to say that the ADC has side-stepped the spirit of innovative, community-driven apps. May 13 15:11:37 i bet a lot of people dont even know what it is May 13 15:11:41 havent even heard of android May 13 15:11:51 hell, every time i talk to my mom about it I have to re-explian the whole thing. May 13 15:11:56 Dougie187, of course.... but if they see these 50 apps will they care to find out more about the platform? May 13 15:12:02 lol i doubt it. May 13 15:12:08 not after seeing this list May 13 15:12:10 unless they are interested in some sort of thing. May 13 15:12:22 but maybe google will advertise the features of the phone rather then these apps. May 13 15:12:27 that might draw people. May 13 15:12:32 i want the media player integration.... how could you not have one of those in the top 50 !?!?! May 13 15:12:40 you have tunewiki? May 13 15:12:45 are you kidding May 13 15:12:45 i havent messed with it May 13 15:12:48 i dont know what it is. May 13 15:12:49 muchael, coz they threw me out May 13 15:12:52 can i listen to music in it? May 13 15:12:56 i dont know May 13 15:13:00 michaelnovakjr_1: of course you can May 13 15:13:12 I mean.. I can see some people wanting to use each of those apps. May 13 15:13:12 it's a full-featured media player. May 13 15:13:19 Let me do a small sample w/ my girlfriend :-P May 13 15:13:24 lol May 13 15:13:42 i just dont think they focused on useful features for this ADC May 13 15:13:53 i think this one should have been based on "Can't live without" apps. May 13 15:13:58 and the next one can be "Extras" May 13 15:14:07 well, there was "indispensibility" May 13 15:14:11 yeah May 13 15:14:18 but 90% of these are "Dispensible" May 13 15:14:20 perhaps the real problem was that nearly every of the 1800 apps were *crap* May 13 15:14:31 if my phone was running slow, they would be the first things I would get rid of May 13 15:14:45 and by indispensibility they mean something u have to bear with May 13 15:14:46 Dougie187, they wouldn't even make it on my phone :) May 13 15:14:49 Or the ones that were the most put together were these ones. May 13 15:14:59 haha May 13 15:15:09 hey, but again, i released the source to my app if anyone wants to check it out May 13 15:15:14 i mean i havent used these, or used anyone else's apps. May 13 15:15:26 but maybe they thought the "best put together apps" were these 50. May 13 15:15:29 ill check it out jasta May 13 15:15:29 sure May 13 15:15:39 jasta what app was yours again? May 13 15:15:49 trigatch4: http://five.googlecode.com May 13 15:15:57 my bet, is the judges didnt fairly judge based on the criteria on the ADC judging site. May 13 15:16:17 Dougie187: The Maven build system is being worked on now. Apparently the newest version of the maven-android plugin doesn't work right. I'm fixing stuff. May 13 15:16:22 dougie, thats for sure. May 13 15:16:28 Dougie187: fucking tell me about it. May 13 15:16:52 I think certain things should have been weighed more heavily personally, and i dont think the judges really thought about that. May 13 15:17:01 agreed May 13 15:17:03 jasta: thats a sick ass idea... you're gonna stick with that i hope May 13 15:17:10 trigatch4: of course. May 13 15:17:19 good.. .i'll be looking forward to it May 13 15:17:23 that it didn't win the ADC is mind boggling. May 13 15:18:13 also, how TuneWiki won over me. this is the sort of thing i'll wonder about for the next 10 years i think. May 13 15:18:21 lol May 13 15:18:43 originality, indispensibility, polish and appeal, and effective use of the android platform May 13 15:18:44 damn, i cant check out your source yet. May 13 15:18:45 yup May 13 15:18:52 Dougie187: why not? May 13 15:18:52 ill have to do it when i get my laptop back jasta May 13 15:18:56 ...windows... May 13 15:19:04 oh yeah, Linux only server support for now May 13 15:19:33 jasta, let me know when you wanted to do the mac and win setups May 13 15:19:42 michaelnovakjr_1: ...soon ;) May 13 15:19:45 i've got lots of free time now :) May 13 15:19:49 like, real soon :) May 13 15:19:50 win will be important. May 13 15:19:58 we'll talk this week[/end] May 13 15:20:04 cool May 13 15:20:49 i ended up not going with that google desktop / interanl http server idea May 13 15:20:56 the UI is light enough that it should just be natively done May 13 15:21:11 agreed May 13 15:23:13 man, im disappointed about the apps. May 13 15:23:19 it bums me out. May 13 15:23:43 i don't think most of them will be around for long Dougie187 May 13 15:23:43 probably not as much as you guys. May 13 15:23:46 especailly michaelnovakjr_1 May 13 15:24:17 i for one will directly compete with any and all closed source android project May 13 15:24:30 AndroidScan, Eco2Go, Em-Radar, Fingerprint, PocketJourney, PedNav, Locale May 13 15:24:31 i think its dumb that they can be closed source. May 13 15:24:37 yep May 13 15:24:39 Those are the ones she said she would definitely use. May 13 15:24:51 Em-Radar. there you go michaelnovakjr May 13 15:24:55 7 out 50 May 13 15:25:07 what the heck does that do Dougie187? May 13 15:25:11 Your app. May 13 15:25:11 About 20 on that list have extremely poor descriptions. May 13 15:25:21 So she wasn't even sure if she would be interested in them. May 13 15:25:25 its the notification durring severe weather. May 13 15:25:29 oh the bad words I could say right now May 13 15:25:38 pawalls, i wouldnt blame her May 13 15:25:41 but that is what i get for being open, right jasta? May 13 15:25:47 Dougie187, Especially would be useful if it notifies you in the morning to grab an umbrella before you leave ;-) May 13 15:26:19 heh. May 13 15:26:26 you know May 13 15:26:33 are any of us surprised here? May 13 15:26:34 here michaelnovakjr_1: Em-Radar is a revolutionary mobile product that alerts you about emergencies and severe weather anywhere, any time. By Jack Kwok. May 13 15:26:42 jasta, nope May 13 15:26:54 I personally am. May 13 15:26:55 actually. May 13 15:27:10 Dougie187, the other problem is I was trying to keep mine simple too, not add all that eye candy garbage May 13 15:27:10 i'm certainly not. i expected simple crap for about the past month and a half actually May 13 15:27:17 i knew the list would suck when tunewiki got in. May 13 15:27:25 yeah. May 13 15:27:29 and you were trying to watch battery life May 13 15:27:48 yep May 13 15:27:49 i would have expected more from the ADC/ May 13 15:27:49 My guess is that the judges didn't know whether the apps were community created or proprietary. May 13 15:28:00 are you serious? May 13 15:28:00 I imagine that didn't factor into the judging process. May 13 15:28:18 "The Weather Channel for Android - The Weather Channel Interactive Inc." ? May 13 15:28:33 They can't tell if that is Community created or Proprietary? May 13 15:28:42 that is bullshit May 13 15:29:04 Dougie187, The large majority of them are not obvious from the name. May 13 15:29:10 pawalls: they were required to read the provided documentation. that should have made it clear. May 13 15:29:23 well im just saying based on this app. May 13 15:29:33 based on that one app, your comment doesnt matter anymore. May 13 15:29:34 jasta, Possible. May 13 15:29:43 they dont care if it is proprietary. May 13 15:29:45 i would love to chat with some of the judges that reviewed my app. i genuinely don't understand what the problem was. May 13 15:29:50 yep May 13 15:29:58 where's this list of jduges May 13 15:30:04 maybe they didn't get it? May 13 15:30:07 i dont think its up yet May 13 15:30:11 Anyway, I agree that a lot of those apps aren't very useful and that it's unfortunate that there weren't more high quality community apps on the list. May 13 15:30:13 i wonder why :) May 13 15:30:14 maybe i implemented my concept *so* well, that it was transparent to them? May 13 15:30:14 ill check May 13 15:30:30 nope "Once we have the list of participating judges finalized, we will post it here. Keep watching this space!" May 13 15:30:57 do u think there were any *real* judges ? or google developers around the world ? May 13 15:30:58 i'm not surprised May 13 15:31:08 i hope its not google developers around the world. May 13 15:31:23 if its google, then i would be very suprised. May 13 15:31:53 personally, i would expect the judges to be members of the OHA but not directly affiliated with Android or Google May 13 15:32:04 bye all May 13 15:32:19 bye May 13 15:32:21 jasta, Possibly because your app enables you to have fair use of your media? ;-) May 13 15:32:52 I mean.. at its core, your app is a media distribution system. May 13 15:33:08 i know, thats the first line in the README. May 13 15:33:11 Maybe funding that would be a poor move. May 13 15:33:26 maybe they can suck it, that's all i have to say May 13 15:33:26 jasta, I wouldn't know that, as I haven't seen your README :-P May 13 15:33:27 but they are not "Funding" apps. May 13 15:33:35 they dont even get rights to the apps. May 13 15:33:39 or make the apps open. May 13 15:33:51 Dougie187, You can fund things without getting rights to them. May 13 15:33:55 Case in point.. SoC May 13 15:34:00 SoC? May 13 15:34:03 Dougie187, Summer of Code May 13 15:34:16 Dougie187, Anyway.. what would *you* call giving money to people to work on an app? May 13 15:34:23 If not "funding", I'm not sure what else. May 13 15:34:40 I would have thought of it as funding. But people dont even have to release their apps period. May 13 15:34:48 dan said its like a grant. May 13 15:34:48 jasta, I'm just throwing out ideas. I personally think your app is awesome and extremely useful. May 13 15:34:55 jasta, I'd use it every day even. May 13 15:34:55 why does the weather channel need funding ?????????????????????????? May 13 15:35:40 jasta, I'm just trying to think of reasons it wouldn't have won, and the possible PR backlash seems like a reasonable explanation. May 13 15:36:02 well they can still suck it. the backlash is coming no matter if they give me money or not :) May 13 15:36:16 michaelnovakjr_1, I don't think "need of funding" was listed in the judging guidelines ;-) May 13 15:36:29 no, but it should have been May 13 15:36:39 pawalls, then why would u participate in adc ? May 13 15:36:46 living_sword: EXACTLY! May 13 15:36:49 yes, it should have been if you think about the "prizes" as funding. May 13 15:37:00 its a 'gran' May 13 15:37:03 grant May 13 15:37:10 if you are funding people to develop apps, then you should think about need of funding too. May 13 15:37:15 you dont fund a rich bastard. May 13 15:37:19 who can fund himself. May 13 15:37:32 living_sword, Because you think you have a superior product that you could make money off of and get some publicity. May 13 15:37:46 people are still doing that. May 13 15:37:51 even if they get the "grants" May 13 15:37:56 i think thats the thing that pisses me off the most. May 13 15:38:09 people who win the prizes can still take their product and charge money for it. May 13 15:38:25 ok quiet everyone. May 13 15:38:34 shhh May 13 15:38:48 adc rocked ! May 13 15:38:56 lol May 13 15:39:13 hehe May 13 15:39:21 (do you think he can tell?) May 13 15:41:35 alright. so what did you hate most about the ADC? May 13 15:41:36 lol May 13 15:41:43 hey michaelnovakjr, you gonna get on halo tonight? May 13 15:42:01 should be.... if i can get out of the office at a decent time today May 13 15:42:11 nice. May 13 15:42:17 we are working on adcII here, company is entering :) May 13 15:42:24 im making a new cops and robbers map May 13 15:42:28 heh what are you guys making now? May 13 15:42:29 lol May 13 15:42:33 haha just kidding May 13 15:42:38 lol May 13 15:42:48 i would laugh at them if they approached me with the idea May 13 15:46:04 i might have to call toshiba today May 13 15:46:07 and see when my laptop will be done. May 13 15:46:21 yea, that is nuts you are still waiting May 13 15:46:32 2 weeks now. May 13 15:47:00 damn May 13 15:48:11 http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/android_class;_ylt=ArgYOP1yjRZciuiWoNnhgdYjtBAF if someone haven't read yet.. May 13 15:50:06 lame May 13 15:51:30 lameo May 13 15:57:32 grrrrrr May 13 15:57:43 i am having a hell of a time getting my project to build correctly with all this AIDL hell May 13 15:59:42 jasta, you don't like ant? May 13 16:00:23 i just didn't want to write an elaborate custom build system May 13 16:00:29 and ant would have forced me to :) May 13 16:00:54 makes sense May 13 16:02:04 I personally find all of the MIT projects pretty neat. May 13 16:02:30 Then again, I couldn't participate in the ADC, so I'm not embittered like the rest of you ;-) May 13 16:02:46 why couldnt you participate? May 13 16:02:48 why couldn't you? May 13 16:02:56 he works at google May 13 16:03:22 what do you do at google? May 13 16:03:23 hey, so anyone know what all these apps are? May 13 16:03:29 lol May 13 16:03:30 nope. May 13 16:03:36 useless davidw May 13 16:03:39 lol May 13 16:03:42 true dat May 13 16:03:51 overrated May 13 16:04:04 how's your newborn davidw? May 13 16:04:11 michaelnovakjr, beautiful:-) May 13 16:04:15 you just had another baby? May 13 16:04:17 and she's quite a dumper, too:-/ May 13 16:04:27 haha May 13 16:12:31 http://www.techcrunch.com/2008/05/09/sneak-peak-at-android-apps-out-of-mit/ May 13 16:15:54 holy crap i gotta get to work May 13 16:16:01 i didnt realize what time it was May 13 16:28:40 any1 tried fedora 9 ? May 13 16:34:53 nope, im an ubuntu guy. May 13 16:35:59 i've used that too. May 13 16:38:30 i tried fedora back in the day, and it didnt do my wireless right May 13 16:38:34 so i used ubuntu ever since May 13 16:38:49 ubuntu here May 13 16:39:06 i use it coz its easier to test my red hat server scripts. May 13 16:39:24 ew red hat May 13 16:39:32 yeah May 13 16:39:35 plus i hate yum May 13 16:39:48 centos May 13 16:39:54 instead of red hat May 13 16:39:54 uck May 13 16:40:01 or just use solaris :0 May 13 16:40:03 :) May 13 16:40:03 i think id rather use red hat. May 13 16:40:04 lol May 13 16:40:10 or solaris. May 13 16:40:12 thats decent. May 13 16:40:13 its closed up and you have to pay!! May 13 16:40:14 better then centos May 13 16:40:35 i use solaris for java May 13 16:40:48 nah, its yet another company that forgot about the word 'open' in open source May 13 16:40:54 i use solaris on my servers May 13 17:24:37 hey dan May 13 17:24:49 he came back May 13 17:27:15 quiet May 13 17:31:47 quick! get the pitchforks and torches!;-P May 13 17:32:53 Your IRC pitchforks cannot harm me May 13 17:33:15 * jasta e-mails morrildl a pitchfork May 13 17:33:19 i'm sure he's heard some of the disappointment with that top 50 May 13 17:33:20 neener neener neener! neener neener neener! You can't get me! May 13 17:34:04 lol May 13 17:34:25 michaelnovakjr_1: I've heard a whole bunch of disappointment, and I've heard a lot of excitement, too May 13 17:34:31 the one tends to be more vocal than the other May 13 17:34:31 i wouldnt blame him. he didnt choose them May 13 17:34:52 i don't blame him May 13 17:35:09 can you personally speak about the app? i doubt you can, but i thought id ask May 13 17:35:15 i just find those top 50 utterly useless May 13 17:35:57 i meant apps. May 13 17:36:02 and that was directed at morrildl May 13 17:36:10 haha May 13 17:36:26 i would love to hear about why those 4 apps are 'closed' May 13 17:36:30 nah, I can't really comment on the apps May 13 17:36:36 michaelnovakjr_1: because they asked to be May 13 17:36:38 must be better than sliced bread! May 13 17:36:46 Hey morrildl. i have a question. May 13 17:36:57 Do those who asked to be "closed" still get their prize? May 13 17:36:57 technically we "reserve the right" to publish them, etc. but that would be lame if they don't want us to do it May 13 17:37:20 because it says they don't get their prize if you cant publsih their names on the ADC criteria May 13 17:37:25 why morrildl, isn't this the OHA?? wouldn't the 'o' stand for open? May 13 17:37:53 michaelnovakjr_1: is the contest put on by the OHA? I thought google put it on May 13 17:38:06 Android is an OHA project May 13 17:38:10 zhobbs is right, the ADC is strictly Google's May 13 17:38:41 that's so lame though... the whole point is to have an open platform May 13 17:38:53 we aren't interested in being the "GPL of mobile", virally forcing everyone to be open :) May 13 17:39:22 but what about this? "Each participant will need to sign an affidavit confirming their eligibility to receive a prize and a release for Google to use your name in connection with your Entry." May 13 17:39:31 Dougie187: they did May 13 17:39:35 we *can* publish them May 13 17:39:41 oh. May 13 17:39:45 we are just choosing not to because it would seem classless May 13 17:39:47 can you at least publish the Entries then? May 13 17:39:50 instead of their names. May 13 17:40:04 yes, but we are just choosing not to because they asked us not to May 13 17:40:06 so we know the other 4 apps, just not who wrote them. May 13 17:40:12 Dougie187, we might steal their ideas May 13 17:40:16 why do you care about the four? May 13 17:40:23 but they already won. May 13 17:40:25 I agree with f00f- May 13 17:40:32 surely 46 don't all suck to be ignored :) May 13 17:40:34 Im just wanting to see all the apps. May 13 17:40:41 the four closed/hidden ones might not be nefarious at all :P May 13 17:41:02 ive seen a list of the 46 already. May 13 17:41:04 just not the other 4 May 13 17:41:09 so im curious what the other 4 did to win. May 13 17:41:43 i'm pretty sure closed source, profit apps won't last on android May 13 17:42:11 im not gonna support them. May 13 17:42:22 i certainly won't May 13 17:42:24 i dont even care about the apps, or who wrote them. May 13 17:42:29 i jut wanna see what they made. May 13 17:42:33 or what their idea was. May 13 17:43:11 everyone spent a great deal of time on this thing, and it would be a shame to ignore all the winning entries May 13 17:43:19 i'm sure we'll find out more when the descriptions are published May 13 17:43:27 f00f-, no one said anything about ignoring them May 13 17:43:29 well he said they arn't publishing them. May 13 17:43:36 the 4 who asked not to be published at least May 13 17:43:50 if you have to pay for them all, well then yes i won't give them the time of day May 13 17:43:51 not even a description (at least if i read it correctly) May 13 17:44:02 so that means the winners aren't allowed to publish them on their own? May 13 17:44:10 they are just waiting for the right time May 13 17:44:12 do you think they would? May 13 17:44:15 of course May 13 17:44:22 not until its done. May 13 17:44:36 if you have an idea, unless you get it into the hands of the consumer, it's going nowhere May 13 17:44:55 one of them is f00f-'s May 13 17:45:00 :) May 13 17:45:02 lol May 13 17:45:08 so what's your reasoning then? May 13 17:45:09 if you're idea is so secretive that you have to protect it, then it's not that great an idea May 13 17:45:20 why is it so secretive? May 13 17:45:20 f00f-: you didn't disclose? May 13 17:45:25 ? May 13 17:45:29 did he win? May 13 17:45:42 i didnt even know f00f- won May 13 17:46:04 i know zhobbs` won May 13 17:46:08 we kept our stuff secret until monday May 13 17:46:13 and muthu May 13 17:46:19 so you are on the list f00f-? May 13 17:46:20 what was yours? May 13 17:46:25 PedNav May 13 17:46:31 oh yeah May 13 17:46:35 i think you told me that last friday May 13 17:46:44 i like PedNav. May 13 17:46:49 though i haven't seen it May 13 17:46:54 i can totally see keeping it a secret until the top 50 were released May 13 17:46:57 i mean i like the idea May 13 17:46:58 just not anymore May 13 17:47:08 if the implementation sucks or is a paid service, then forget it. May 13 17:47:16 jasta, damn straight May 13 17:47:28 i hope to have an .apk out in early july May 13 17:47:34 actually, if *any* of these are not free as in gratis then forget it. May 13 17:47:44 totalyl May 13 17:47:51 just make a free version that does the same thing May 13 17:47:51 mobile software is SUCH a rip-off. May 13 17:47:56 then you two are gonna write an open source version. right? May 13 17:48:05 damn straight May 13 17:48:07 i won't. ;) May 13 17:48:08 give it out for free, figure out a business model later ;) May 13 17:48:09 heh nice May 13 17:48:19 f00f-: that's the google way. May 13 17:48:30 step 1: collect underpants May 13 17:48:32 step 2: ??? May 13 17:48:33 step 3: profit May 13 17:48:39 well, i'd love to have it pluggable where third parties can write extensions, etc. May 13 17:48:41 lol May 13 17:48:48 underpants gnomes May 13 17:49:06 oh yeah, underpants is big business. May 13 17:49:22 especially the fancy kind May 13 17:53:18 after writing the install instructions for my project, i realize now that it must be an enormous pain to get it going from source. May 13 17:56:49 "Social networking is going mainstream", David Glazer, Google May 13 17:56:51 damnit May 13 17:57:05 ill try to do it after i get my laptop bac May 13 17:57:07 back* May 13 17:57:09 yeah i know michaelnovakjr May 13 17:57:14 isnt that disappointing? May 13 17:57:18 extremely May 13 17:58:00 well, its time to call toshiba. May 13 17:58:24 jasta: why's it such a pain? May 13 18:02:19 well, i use the maven-android plugin, and it has a bug which doesn't specify -pframework.aidl May 13 18:02:25 which means my usage of Uri and other things doesn't work. May 13 18:02:45 and also, i created my won Parcelable, and due to Eclipse bugs I have to add the reference to the global framework.aidl (so do you if you build it) May 13 18:03:01 and the server requires patches to libsyncml, so you have to compile that from source May 13 18:03:18 and then libsyncml as of 0.4.6 (the version i require) uses an unconventional build system, so that's weird. May 13 18:03:28 re May 13 18:03:57 and the server has lots of requirements and since it hasnt been packaged by Debian you can't just apt-get build-dep May 13 18:06:24 zhobbs: so...that's why :) May 13 18:07:24 you should make a .deb for it May 13 18:08:15 nah, i'll let the Debian wizards do that later May 13 18:08:20 jasta: ouch May 13 18:09:12 i'm working to get my changes to libsyncml sent upstream, but i dunno how far that'll go May 13 18:09:29 it's just extending their interface some is all May 13 18:09:57 yeah, that might take a while May 13 18:10:31 that's not really my problem though. usually, package maintainers will be the ones pushing for stuff like this :) May 13 18:10:53 once i have my desktop client working, i will contact Debian and have them put something together for me May 13 18:10:56 they're good folks. May 13 18:15:32 damn,it takes a week and a half for toshiba to get new parts in stock May 13 18:53:13 jasta: do you know of any good client/server mp3 players for the desktop similar to what you're building? May 13 18:53:24 morrildl, there's a term for the bias of people complaining louder than being enthusiastic May 13 18:53:31 unfortunately I don't remember it May 13 18:54:06 davidw: hows your daughter doing? May 13 18:54:13 having fun he May 13 18:55:58 muthu, pooping a lot May 13 18:56:05 some screaming too May 13 18:56:05 ha! May 13 18:56:23 yeah, the first 15 days is real fun May 13 18:56:33 kiss your sleep goodbye May 13 18:56:42 haha May 13 18:56:53 muthu: you have kids? May 13 18:57:05 yeah, 2 daughters May 13 18:57:20 one 4yrs, one 15months May 13 18:57:30 zhobbs: how bout you> May 13 18:57:32 hehe May 13 18:58:40 muthu: nope :) May 13 18:58:53 only 24, so not in a hurry May 13 18:59:22 haha i know May 13 19:00:22 zhobbs: started on p2? May 13 19:02:02 muthu: yep, you? May 13 19:02:10 not yet May 13 19:02:31 you know if we could expand our teams? May 13 19:02:42 morrildl: can we expand our teams? May 13 19:02:49 you can May 13 19:02:56 ok great May 13 19:02:58 cool May 13 19:03:10 so zhobbs thats what i'll be doing first May 13 19:03:35 there's still a lot of time, isn't it? May 13 19:03:50 50 days or so? May 13 19:03:52 june 30 May 13 19:03:55 right May 13 19:04:08 p2 is a bit tricky May 13 19:04:21 we have lots of things to do on ours May 13 19:04:32 not sure what the judges criteria would be May 13 19:04:36 zhobbs: what's the criteria to focus? May 13 19:04:44 I assume the same May 13 19:05:07 expanding the team and getting everyone working together in just over a month is hard May 13 19:05:39 why? May 13 19:05:57 zhobbs: you think so, really? May 13 19:06:12 I don't know...maybe not May 13 19:06:12 unless muthu is doing it full-time :) May 13 19:06:42 f00f-: but finding people to do it full time is hard May 13 19:06:54 exactly May 13 19:07:12 how much work are you planning to actually do? May 13 19:07:23 if it is not a whole lot just do it yourself May 13 19:07:39 michaelnovakjr: you have a valid point May 13 19:07:40 yawn May 13 19:07:46 and that's why most of them will stick to the same team May 13 19:07:50 :) May 13 19:07:56 yo jasta May 13 19:08:02 sup May 13 19:08:05 muthu: i released my source last night May 13 19:08:07 i'm still trying to figure out what to improve.. May 13 19:08:14 jasta: cool May 13 19:08:21 f00f-: that's the challenge May 13 19:08:27 muthu: five.googlecode.com if you want to check it out May 13 19:08:33 that's why p2 is going to be real tricky May 13 19:08:36 jasta: sure, i will May 13 19:08:42 want to see your coding skills ;) May 13 19:08:49 man screw you guys, i have an endless list of things i want to improve with my project May 13 19:08:50 haha May 13 19:09:17 muthu: there's a lot of spaghetti code in there, i'll just warn you now. things got real stressful leading up to the ADC deadline. May 13 19:09:32 jasta: when are you going to complete five? May 13 19:09:43 good idea != good programmer May 13 19:09:44 i work on it all the time, so, whenever it's complete. May 13 19:10:42 you don't have a deadline May 13 19:10:49 sure i do May 13 19:11:00 ADC or not, phones will launch at some point. May 13 19:11:01 muthu, everyone has a deadline May 13 19:11:03 and that's my deadline. May 13 19:11:04 when's the first release? May 13 19:11:34 muthu: i'll be releasing the desktop client next, and since i havent even started yet i have no idea when that will be May 13 19:12:04 when are phones available? May 13 19:12:20 december or so, at the latest May 13 19:12:28 second half of 2008 May 13 19:12:32 whatever that means May 13 19:12:40 still haven't seen a new sdk May 13 19:12:42 that probably means January 3rd to Google. May 13 19:12:43 ADC 2 not on devices? May 13 19:12:51 muthu: no way. May 13 19:12:58 ha, come on May 13 19:13:07 you can't have this emulator thing again May 13 19:13:13 yes you can May 13 19:13:14 it'll be on the device May 13 19:13:21 well they'll have devices, i'm sure of that May 13 19:13:21 or a device May 13 19:13:25 ADC 2 will be on device May 13 19:13:31 but they won't be production -grade devices for mass market May 13 19:13:35 muthu: no, it won't. May 13 19:13:44 yea, they definitely won;t May 13 19:13:50 I think they will May 13 19:13:54 they will May 13 19:13:57 they'll probably have some OTA firmware update as new SDK's get released May 13 19:14:05 muthu you say this with such confidence May 13 19:14:23 you guys can think they will all you want May 13 19:14:33 but you'd be wrong :) May 13 19:14:59 nah.. ADC 2 will be boring on emulator May 13 19:15:01 no way! May 13 19:15:06 ADC2 will have real devices, yes. May 13 19:15:10 but not ADC1, round 2. May 13 19:15:13 dude May 13 19:15:15 ha May 13 19:15:16 wtf May 13 19:15:18 rofl May 13 19:15:23 jasta: that's what we were talking about right? May 13 19:15:28 jasta: you smokin something? May 13 19:15:31 that's not what i thought you were talking about. May 13 19:15:36 loo May 13 19:15:41 :) May 13 19:15:43 haha May 13 19:15:56 jasta: went insane! call the press!! May 13 19:16:08 BREAKING!!! May 13 19:16:24 jasta, you'll be on helloandroid in a few minutes May 13 19:16:30 oh yeah May 13 19:16:37 typing write now May 13 19:16:39 ...... May 13 19:16:45 yes, along with the rest of that meaningless drivel. May 13 19:16:48 *grin* May 13 19:16:50 haha May 13 19:16:54 haha May 13 19:17:01 hehe May 13 19:17:52 zhobbs: ha is boring without stories May 13 19:17:55 well, regardless, Google has already stated that ADC2 would be on real handsets. May 13 19:18:02 muthu: start writing! May 13 19:18:02 they said that way back when this whole thing launched May 13 19:18:28 will start soon, when the madness dies May 13 19:18:32 hey jasta want to work on my next project with me May 13 19:18:35 and when i get some time May 13 19:18:40 really, there's not a ton of new to write about May 13 19:18:44 news* May 13 19:18:49 btw, the OHA is unlikely to release any of this stuff on time. May 13 19:18:53 :) May 13 19:19:04 I guess writing application reviews would be good May 13 19:19:05 p2 plan is keeping me busy May 13 19:19:05 second half of 2008 may veyr well turn into first quarter 2009 May 13 19:19:29 or it might be Dec 30th, 2008. May 13 19:19:36 lol May 13 19:19:44 muthu, you should put martha stewarts picture in your app, and include an ad for ankle trackers! May 13 19:19:48 might start in 2008, with deadline in 09 May 13 19:20:10 michaelnovakjr great idea May 13 19:20:15 hey btw, android-developers.blogpost.com got a new post May 13 19:20:18 and it's wordy. May 13 19:22:08 uh oh May 13 19:22:39 oh my May 13 19:23:09 nice, the judges used Ubuntu ;) May 13 19:23:55 that's interesting May 13 19:24:48 wtf May 13 19:24:53 they supported mock location providers?! May 13 19:24:57 that would have been useful to know May 13 19:25:02 yeah, how'd they do that? May 13 19:26:47 no idea, but you have to edit the fstree May 13 19:26:55 so i supose we couldve provided a mock data file May 13 19:27:05 yep May 13 19:27:36 but they went through and searched all the submissions for location providers? May 13 19:27:39 oh god May 13 19:27:49 (actually, the "top 100" were really "top 119"... May 13 19:27:53 they should have just had a form field for a kml file or something May 13 19:28:00 so that means i didn't even make the top 119!? ****groan*** May 13 19:28:13 haha May 13 19:28:26 you could have been 1290 May 13 19:28:29 120 *** May 13 19:29:09 should have just given them devices ! May 13 19:29:11 heh, maybe your network code fscked up May 13 19:29:37 no, it didn't. May 13 19:29:46 dan assured me my app was judged consistently May 13 19:29:51 and i saw successful usage May 13 19:30:04 it just was 'social network' enough May 13 19:30:04 hmm May 13 19:32:22 the sucky thing is that i think my app would have done much better if i focused more of my energy on the last.fm features May 13 19:32:43 i just figured those would be what i'd do between round 1 and 2. May 13 19:34:20 so anyway, is somebody willing to take a crack at compiling my app? :) May 13 19:34:46 http://android-developers.blogspot.com/2008/05/challenge-in-more-than-one-way.html if passed by from someone May 13 19:35:22 jasta, sure i'll take a crack at it May 13 19:35:51 cool, you'll need maven. May 13 19:35:54 you are using the google code repo now? May 13 19:35:59 otherwise, the INSTALL instructions *should* be sufficient May 13 19:36:03 michaelnovakjr_1: yeah May 13 19:36:39 i've got maven May 13 19:36:44 and you'll need a Linux GUI. Ubuntu and Debian are what I've tested with. May 13 19:36:57 i'm running ubuntu May 13 19:37:03 then great :) May 13 19:37:15 and you'll need some music ;) May 13 19:37:30 looks like i am all ready then! May 13 19:38:14 wow May 13 19:38:17 www.techcrunch.com May 13 19:39:00 f00f-: what? May 13 19:39:17 that's some real old technology May 13 19:39:17 http://www.techcrunch.com/2008/05/13/fifty-android-developers-get-25000-each-the-list/ May 13 19:39:34 suprised it wasn't there already May 13 20:09:10 just wondering why you did you guys see that they explained how the judges scored the applications? May 13 20:09:27 huh? May 13 20:09:33 here read this: May 13 20:09:35 http://android-developers.blogspot.com/2008/05/challenge-in-more-than-one-way.html May 13 20:09:42 yeah, i did May 13 20:09:45 oh May 13 20:09:50 sorry i was gone for a long time May 13 20:09:56 your sentence is confusing :) May 13 20:09:59 did that clear much up for you guys? May 13 20:10:13 not really, we knew all of that before May 13 20:10:21 i had something written in the search box from like 3 hours ago that i didnt finish and forgot to delete before I started again May 13 20:21:30 hi all May 13 20:21:48 A lot of messages in ADC group :-) May 13 20:22:04 Many are asking for scoring May 13 20:22:18 not going to happen May 13 20:22:42 Do you think judges really have them ? May 13 20:22:59 google has the scores May 13 20:23:05 but they wont tell us, no way. May 13 20:23:17 It could be possible for 50 to 100, but not for 101-1787 May 13 20:24:22 it won't happen May 13 20:24:25 Arg ... I really wonder if I was in the 100 May 13 20:24:37 did you get server hits after last Wed? May 13 20:24:46 or actually, 2 Wed ago. May 13 20:24:54 the Wed before last ;) May 13 20:24:58 Yes, but I'm not sure if it was coming from Judges May 13 20:25:11 your system is public? May 13 20:25:31 what was your app, btw? May 13 20:25:35 I provided a testing URL May 13 20:25:46 Amazon S3 Bucket Upload May 13 20:26:08 here is the URL: http://www.lysesoft.com/products/s3-bucketupload-android/index.html May 13 20:26:38 I should have not publish the PHP testing script publicly May 13 20:26:46 arg May 13 20:26:46 no, you should not have :) May 13 20:27:02 haha May 13 20:29:11 so no regret :-) May 13 20:30:13 Maybe because it's Amazon May 13 20:30:26 It should have done the GDrive upload :-) May 13 20:33:32 what does this app actually do for you? May 13 20:33:36 i mean, so you upload things...then what? May 13 20:34:06 Idea to backup data stored on the phone May 13 20:34:15 but it's not automatic? May 13 20:34:22 Images, documents ... May 13 20:34:42 No, end-user selects files/folders we want to backup May 13 20:34:43 it should be automated, don't you think? otherwise it's not a very good backup. May 13 20:35:15 Yes May 13 20:35:26 make it encrypted, too May 13 20:35:32 it should be seamless yet secure May 13 20:35:38 well... May 13 20:35:44 encryption is pretty heavy for a mobile phone to do May 13 20:36:04 yeap May 13 20:36:22 well you can still burst new content or deltas over May 13 20:36:27 it's not a full load everytime is it? May 13 20:36:32 please make rsync-like or better :) May 13 20:36:51 strong encryption of even small data sets would be very expensive on a mobile phone May 13 20:36:57 Also, as S3 is based on standard HTTP, the application could be used to share May 13 20:37:07 photos with any web site May 13 20:37:13 but that all seems pretty crude, doesn't it? May 13 20:37:31 i mean, not a very convenient interface once it gets out to S3. you'd have to have a lot of knowledge to build stuff around it. May 13 20:37:37 when you could just use picasaweb or whatever. May 13 20:37:45 which google will certianly be writing a client for May 13 20:38:12 drop S3, or supllement it with other things May 13 20:39:31 I should write picasa for Android :-) May 13 20:40:46 lyse: you'd compete with Google, for sure. May 13 20:40:58 you can rest assured Google is feverishly working on integrating all of their services in Android May 13 20:42:53 Yes, I think so May 13 20:43:28 We've ported it to J2ME May 13 20:43:49 It works fine but the Android UIs is quite better May 13 20:46:34 anyway, thanks for your feedback May 13 20:46:56 You're all in last round ? May 13 20:47:08 not me, i wasnt even in the top 100 May 13 20:48:30 what was your app ? May 13 20:48:36 http://five.googlecode.com May 13 20:48:42 incidentally, i released the source last night May 13 20:48:50 so you can check it out and build it if you want (and are very brave) May 13 20:49:05 my project is massive, with quite a few dependencies. May 13 20:49:49 does it play MP3 ? May 13 20:50:04 yup, though i would not describe it simply as that. May 13 20:50:46 which library did you use for MP3 decoding ? May 13 20:51:05 the Android stack provides "robust" audio playback. May 13 20:51:17 hahahaha.... May 13 20:51:18 including MP3, Ogg ? May 13 20:51:19 and by robust I mean it's terrible and buggy, but maybe some day will be good May 13 20:51:30 lyse: yes May 13 20:52:22 jasta: I saw on an internal thread talking about what googlers want to do with their android phone that your app was suggested as the answer to one wish :) May 13 20:52:33 what? May 13 20:52:45 what internal thread? May 13 20:53:17 your app is surely something we need May 13 20:53:39 just one asking for ideas including super far fetched ones abuot what an android phone could do May 13 20:53:53 it's not far fetched May 13 20:53:56 it's novel and useful. May 13 20:53:58 right, yours isn't May 13 20:54:01 some others were ;) May 13 20:54:03 looking at your code now jasta May 13 20:54:13 but your app was the answer to what one person wanted to do May 13 20:54:18 i'm just so frustrated that i had a genuinely original, open app and it lost. boooo. May 13 20:54:32 Think about Enkin May 13 20:55:04 well i actually thought enkin was totally unnecessary. May 13 20:55:11 as did i May 13 20:55:11 you and your mNamingConvention :P May 13 20:55:20 if you can't read a map with a blue dot telling your exact position then you need serious help. May 13 20:55:22 heh, I figured you'd at least want to hear there's some buzz around your app, however minimal May 13 20:55:30 f00f-: read my C source then. May 13 20:55:41 f00f-: i write C and Java somewhat different. May 13 20:55:54 well in some cultures or IQ levels, visual is better than a map. but it's limited use case. May 13 20:56:26 Bonkers: yes, i do appreciate it. just understand how frustrating it is to hear :) May 13 20:56:46 Enkin is unnecessary. Blog too, social networking too ... May 13 20:56:54 especially since my app was no small task to build. it's over 20k loc. May 13 20:58:47 oh my, lots of C structs, etc. May 13 20:58:50 have you done a security audit? May 13 20:58:53 Bonkers: morrildl confessed that he had dreamed up my app almost a year ago when he first started working on Android May 13 20:58:57 trying to think of cool uses for the platform May 13 20:59:01 and then i went along and implemented it May 13 20:59:20 f00f-: I need not, my C-fu is incredible. unlike all you mere mortals. May 13 21:00:11 i think i'll check it out May 13 21:00:14 and do a quick once over :) May 13 21:00:16 * jasta maniacally laughs out of sync with his lips May 13 21:00:39 you go right ahead. but do not look at libsyncml. i am thinking i will need to spend significant time auditing their source since i linked with it. May 13 21:00:52 i'm just concerned with your server May 13 21:00:55 they are Java developers, i think. they leak a lot of memory. May 13 21:00:59 i saw some strcmp but i want to investigate :) May 13 21:01:15 f00f-: you go right ahead and be concerned. i've written a fucking lot of C. May 13 21:01:29 nice :) May 13 21:01:43 most of it has been run for years on public-facing internet servers May 13 21:02:09 so, bleh. May 13 21:02:17 but i always welcome a free code audiot ;) May 13 21:02:18 audit* May 13 21:03:11 what's a public-facing server? May 13 21:03:25 f00f-, is a winner.... you know how they get ;) May 13 21:03:35 jerkface03 a server that faces the public May 13 21:03:55 i'm always looking to learn how to write better C May 13 21:03:58 jerkface03: not otherwise protected by any credentials. May 13 21:04:03 reason i dont write in C is due to fear of creating too many holes May 13 21:04:16 :) May 13 21:04:17 i love C May 13 21:04:23 c is my fav May 13 21:04:29 i have had an embarrassing blunder when i was 16. May 13 21:04:31 and none since. May 13 21:04:39 google my name if you're curious to read about it :) May 13 21:04:46 bbl, gotta work May 13 21:06:04 so have i May 13 21:06:05 i've had many May 13 21:06:06 lol May 13 21:06:17 once even dan bernstein, author of qmail, emailed me May 13 21:06:21 one of his students found a bug in my C code May 13 21:06:41 i didn't believe someone would actually use my code in prod May 13 21:06:44 and i dont think anyone has May 13 21:06:59 what was it for? May 13 21:07:11 i wrote an smtp server in like 1000 lines of c May 13 21:07:18 had some buffer overflows May 13 21:07:26 bust May 13 21:07:39 i write buggy c code all the time May 13 21:08:09 the riskiest code i have May 13 21:08:10 is in C May 13 21:08:15 i write perfect c code ALL the time May 13 21:08:16 and it runs as root on a web server May 13 21:08:19 wow May 13 21:08:21 but it invokes a perl script, May 13 21:08:32 basically just execve May 13 21:08:33 ^^ joking about the perfect c code :) May 13 21:08:38 hehe May 13 21:08:39 no one's perfect May 13 21:08:56 yeah just gotta learn somehow May 13 21:09:00 sometimes the hard way May 13 21:10:33 hey michaelnovakjr_1. they arn't even supposed to receive the new part for my laptop until thursday May 13 21:10:40 1.5 weeks after they ordered it. May 13 21:10:48 isnt that lame? May 13 21:11:23 toshiba ftl May 13 21:11:35 true dat. May 13 21:11:44 they dont make my laptop anymore. May 13 21:11:47 damn May 13 21:11:49 so they didnt have any parts in stock May 13 21:11:55 they had to order it from the manufacturer. May 13 21:11:59 its like they had to make it. May 13 21:12:23 that is nuts May 13 21:12:37 i guess sometimes it pays to build your own shit May 13 21:13:02 build me a tablet laptop. May 13 21:13:13 sure :) May 13 21:13:15 lol May 13 21:13:55 i dont know if I will be on halo tonight. May 13 21:14:02 my wife and I are going out with some friends. May 13 21:14:16 being social huh? May 13 21:14:17 friends? wife? pfft. Master Chief knows not these things. May 13 21:14:25 yeah... May 13 21:14:32 i know May 13 21:14:41 its gonna be me, her, and a bunch of her friends. May 13 21:14:47 oh damn May 13 21:14:55 besides, shouldn't you be getting in bed with Niko? May 13 21:15:14 who is niko May 13 21:15:16 lol. i dont have that one yet May 13 21:15:16 hopefully some place with alcohol May 13 21:15:18 gta4 May 13 21:15:23 we shall see. May 13 21:15:31 but it will probably be her who is drinking rather then me May 13 21:15:37 damn May 13 21:21:50 k well its dinner time. May 13 21:21:51 see ya later May 13 21:31:25 hi all May 13 21:37:59 I'm having fun with posting a runnable to a view. The post returns false, the docs say "usually because the looper processing the message queue is exiting" I am doing the post after setcontentview in onCreate. Does anyone have ideas ? May 13 21:38:30 What is the looper ? May 13 21:40:25 anyone there ? May 13 21:40:32 the looper is the thread that dequeues the messages from the event messages queue May 13 21:40:53 how do you post? May 13 21:40:56 do you call View.post()? May 13 21:44:32 I was doing a post to a textview instance. May 13 21:44:52 the one that needs updating May 13 21:47:00 Any ideas why the looper would exit ? Could it be because my activity has no input fields ? May 13 21:47:08 were you calling textView.post(Runnable) then? May 13 21:47:14 if so, it doesn't work in onCreate() May 13 21:47:22 it's been updated/fixed since M5 May 13 21:47:34 ah..... yes May 13 21:48:00 has there been a release since M5 ! ? May 13 21:48:04 no May 13 21:48:13 Is there a standard work around ? May 13 21:48:37 yes, use your own Handler May 13 21:51:00 ok, not used a handler before, will have a look at the docs. Thanks for your help romainguy May 13 21:58:03 romainguy: That worked perfectly thankyou for your help. May 13 21:58:28 no pb :) May 13 22:04:55 romainguy, new SDK? May 13 22:05:20 poffy: what do you mean? May 13 22:05:28 Coming soon? May 13 22:05:37 I cannot answer this question May 13 22:05:38 Ask Dan May 13 22:05:43 Heh May 13 22:05:50 * poffy goes whining to Dan May 13 22:10:44 i mean just tell us May 13 22:12:22 i am predicting there will be a release of a new sdk one day May 13 22:13:37 It'd be a bugger to do it between now and when the 50 have to get there apps finished :) May 13 22:13:50 i think they'll do it a week before ADC I.2 is due May 13 22:13:50 why? May 13 22:13:54 last week of june May 13 22:13:59 so none of them will use it May 13 22:14:00 the top 50 dont deserve an easy ride :) May 13 22:14:04 and the others will get an easy start May 13 22:14:08 so ADC folks will be stressed May 13 22:14:09 they should release a new sdk every day! May 13 22:14:12 and hence reduce chances of winning May 13 22:14:16 lol May 13 22:14:19 which will increase chances of google keeping more of the money May 13 22:14:22 If there is flash support in new SDK bring it on May 13 22:14:28 f00f-, how so? May 13 22:14:30 duey, well, they could do a daily build May 13 22:14:32 or youtube support May 13 22:14:35 maybe when it gets closer to final product May 13 22:14:46 they need an agreement with adobe May 13 22:14:48 zhobbs, is there no flv player availab?E May 13 22:15:01 duey: nope May 13 22:15:04 not yet May 13 22:15:05 zhobbs: write one, the spec is open now May 13 22:15:10 doesn't your thing play youtube? May 13 22:15:14 nope May 13 22:15:34 lummie: waste of time...doesn't youtube do some other type of video streaming for mobiles? May 13 22:15:37 i saw something with youtube logos May 13 22:15:41 maybe it was different project May 13 22:16:10 you could get an iphone and watch the packets May 13 22:16:30 /make it go through a proxy May 13 22:16:34 and log the urls May 13 22:17:34 you tube content is restricted ofr iphone, you don;t want to do that. May 13 22:17:39 *for May 13 22:20:28 duey: that was just a mockup May 13 22:20:34 damn cable modem went out May 13 22:20:38 did anyone figure out how iphone streams youtube? May 13 22:20:50 looks like there is an H.264 stream for iphone May 13 22:20:56 yeah there is May 13 22:21:04 like i said May 13 22:21:16 get an iphone, install a proxy server, watch the urls May 13 22:21:39 or go to http://m.youtube.com May 13 22:21:40 ;) May 13 22:22:05 its an rstp stream May 13 22:22:11 rtsp May 13 22:23:49 hmm, does MediaPlayer work with rtsp? May 13 22:24:13 rsvp works, send it a messsage and it will get the stream back to you asap. May 13 22:25:55 well MediaPlayer can play streams May 13 22:26:04 so rstp might work May 13 22:27:47 hmm, here's a URL: rtsp://ehug.rtsp-youtube.l.google.com/Ci4LENy73wIaJQkctPUmT1rFghMYESARFEIJbXYtZ29vZ2xlSARSB2RldGFpbHMM/0/0/0/video.3gp May 13 22:27:56 I can't get xine, mplayer, vlc to play it out of the box May 13 22:28:04 neither May 13 22:28:09 but 3gp May 13 22:28:13 is that 3 g protocol? May 13 22:28:23 ah nm May 13 22:28:47 hmm May 13 22:29:01 Any idea what size icons should be used for menu items, 48x48 png's work a treat until the text ends up multi lining, then the image is clipped. Thought it would have auto resized them, rather than clipping :( May 13 22:29:25 I saw dims had an example of playing local 3gp files in M3...wonder if streaming works in M5 May 13 22:35:05 back May 13 22:35:28 lummie: use 48x48 May 13 22:36:53 romainguy: I'm using 48x48 but when I get three menu items in a row, long text e.g. "FIle Information" wraps and the icon gets clipped top and bottom. May 13 22:37:41 hmm I don't know if we still do multi-line text in menus May 13 22:37:46 The menu is context sensitive, so sometimes only the one item appears, in wheich case it renders nicely. May 13 22:38:54 michaelnovakjr_1: *poke* May 13 22:39:11 romainguy: you say "we" are you working on the sdk ? May 13 22:39:15 yes May 13 22:39:54 wow cool. Great work. May 13 22:39:58 thanks May 13 22:41:47 I'm only just starting out with android development, hardly any java experience (I'm a c#, delphi, js guy) and it's just a dream to code on. Fun, and flexible.... so far... but I'm not exactly stressing it yet. May 13 22:42:14 I'm sure you'll encounter bugs and weaknesses soon enough ;-) May 13 22:42:36 even still, it is a nice platform May 13 22:42:41 you don't seem confident romainguy May 13 22:42:48 I am confident May 13 22:42:49 Well, now I know who to talk to :p May 13 22:42:58 but I also know that our platform is not perfect May 13 22:43:09 ah well i didn't have any problems May 13 22:43:18 (although my gui was basic) May 13 22:43:21 it would be very arrogant of me not to acknowledge our shortcomings :)) May 13 22:43:22 i have had lots ;) May 13 22:43:31 It's new, the principles are sound, rom wasn't built in a day, yada, yada May 13 22:43:37 *rome May 13 22:43:47 the rom probably was built in a day May 13 22:43:53 compilers being what they are May 13 22:43:54 ;) May 13 22:43:56 lol May 13 22:44:49 duey: the most insane, frustrating bug i've encountered so far was the debugger crashing my application on the emulator when attempting to look at local variables May 13 22:44:57 also, watch expresisons not working is frustrating May 13 22:45:07 they work just fine for me May 13 22:45:09 and the mediaplayer being so buggy and limited May 13 22:45:11 jasta: I second that one May 13 22:45:18 the only thing i dislike is slow emulator boot times May 13 22:45:19 the watches... May 13 22:45:30 would be nice if you could save the state or something May 13 22:45:31 romainguy: They don't in Eclipse. May 13 22:45:31 keep it running..... May 13 22:45:34 "quick boot" May 13 22:45:45 duey: you're booting a full OS on an emulated CPU after all :) May 13 22:46:03 sure - but in things like vmware you can save the state of the emulated app May 13 22:46:16 yeah except VMWare doesn't emulate the CPU May 13 22:46:23 virtualpc used to May 13 22:46:32 qemu can save state I think...... May 13 22:46:38 (windows on ppc) May 13 22:46:55 once the emulator is booted up its fine May 13 22:47:00 just the boot time is zz May 13 22:47:06 hey May 13 22:47:08 don't complain :) May 13 22:47:10 yes i know :) May 13 22:47:13 I have to reboot it for every change I make :p May 13 22:47:30 that's the answer, keep the emulator running and suspend your machine instead.... May 13 22:47:39 lol May 13 22:47:54 except when eclipse and the emulator fall out and it all stops working May 13 22:48:24 Develope in a vmware and take a snapshot with the emulator open ? May 13 22:48:38 lol thats a good idea May 13 22:48:50 s/good/horrible May 13 22:48:54 If it dies, restore the snapshot, it will take longer than booting the meu up of course May 13 22:49:06 *emu May 13 22:50:26 right, time for bed, speak soon all. have a good day, night etc. May 13 22:50:58 thanks for all your help romainguy May 13 22:54:11 hm... is it possible to install Android applications (aps) by downloading them from a webserver? May 13 22:57:33 not currently, since the web browser doesn't understand what an apk is May 13 22:57:44 otherwise, yes. placing an apk file in /data/app is sufficient to install it May 13 22:58:09 jasta: thanks! May 13 22:58:21 that's what adb install does May 13 23:02:22 morrildl: you know what would be a nice feature for Google Code's new AJAX browse feature? May 13 23:03:03 if you click to open/descend a directory which has only one directory itself and no files, it should just automatically descend that dir as well, until a non-empty directory is found. May 13 23:03:31 browsing java source code is lame when you have like src/org/foo/bar/baz. that's 5 clicks when 1 should be enough. May 13 23:04:16 jasta: http://code.google.com/p/support May 13 23:04:29 you can enter bugs against Project Hosting itself there May 13 23:04:32 hazaa. May 13 23:04:34 ...or feature requests, in this case May 13 23:04:56 hey, when creating a new issue on Google Code, is there some magic to specify that it is a feature request versus bug? May 13 23:05:03 or do the maintainers have to classify them? May 13 23:05:31 maintainers classify May 13 23:05:34 why, I don't know May 13 23:05:41 yeah, i always felt that was strange behaviour May 13 23:08:37 morrildl: i was curious what you thought, though May 13 23:08:41 that's why i addressed you ;) May 13 23:20:23 morrildl: hey, did you see i released the source last night? May 13 23:20:37 http://code.google.com/p/five/source/browse May 13 23:21:00 this is, AFAICT, the largest open source Android project currently released. May 13 23:23:25 jasta: oh cool May 13 23:27:09 lots of cleanup to do, but there it is :) May 13 23:28:44 the svn code browser on google code totally sucks: i click a file to see its source, then i go back, and it just goes to the root, not where i was browsing. May 13 23:30:55 yeah, i hate that thing. the old plain HTTP directory listing one was much, much better. May 13 23:31:21 i've heard that it still works, actually May 13 23:31:47 no, it doesnt May 13 23:31:49 yeah, there's a way to get to it May 13 23:32:06 zhobbs: really? i think people are just confused by the fact that you can browse the SVN repository directly May 13 23:32:21 but that's not the same. the svnweb tool shows you much more useful information like revision, changelogs, etc May 13 23:32:25 and does syntax highlighting May 13 23:32:27 lots of niceties :) May 13 23:33:11 anyway, i'm so tired i can't stand it May 13 23:33:12 going home May 13 23:33:23 wow early! May 14 00:20:57 home May 14 00:20:58 :) May 14 00:21:07 it doesn't really take me 50 minutes to get home May 14 00:21:13 i just fell asleep for a little bit ;) May 14 00:24:09 while driving :)? May 14 00:25:10 i need a topic to write about May 14 00:26:01 duey: what are you writing? May 14 00:26:26 small article about the internets May 14 00:26:28 anything May 14 00:26:39 technical, political? May 14 00:26:50 social/techical May 14 00:27:03 net neutrality May 14 00:27:18 that might be a good one May 14 00:27:21 ADC ;) May 14 00:27:33 hmm May 14 00:28:08 last one i wrote raised some eye brows :o) May 14 00:28:48 the paper is about web dragons May 14 00:29:05 social and technical issues May 14 00:29:06 morrildl: seriously, what is the deal with the next SDK? May 14 00:29:45 the gap between m3 and m5 was shorter than m5 to now. May 14 00:30:04 by a lot. May 14 00:32:22 oh i see, you don't have answer now May 14 00:32:26 but soon *shakes fist* May 14 00:32:50 I already predicted that the sdk will be released one day May 14 00:32:54 is that not enough jasta ? May 14 00:34:36 i just so don't get it May 14 00:34:40 i thought we'd have several releases by now May 14 00:35:06 well they have been very busy with adc May 14 00:35:23 no they havent May 14 00:35:28 the google engineers haven't done squat with the ADC May 14 00:35:41 just the dev advocates and stuff. May 14 00:35:46 oh im sure they spent awhile playing May 14 00:36:36 you know, it still is a job. May 14 00:36:59 i dont think their manager would really be ok with them spending significant time playing with projects that have nothing to do with their job duty :) May 14 00:40:53 blasphemy May 14 00:41:22 we're just running in circles all day long, waving our arms in the air and screaming May 14 00:41:32 I knew it May 14 00:42:17 romain is just trying to start an office thing. May 14 00:42:20 so far, it hasn't caught on. May 14 00:42:23 haha May 14 00:42:35 or maybe it has :o) May 14 00:48:33 well at least I have an up to date SDK :p May 14 00:48:53 i cut you May 14 00:48:57 hehe May 14 01:31:05 hey jasta, around? **** ENDING LOGGING AT Wed May 14 02:59:57 2008