**** BEGIN LOGGING AT Thu Jul 31 02:59:57 2008 Jul 31 03:00:08 that is usually a good idea ;) Jul 31 03:00:26 and don't develop too much of a friendship with a boss again Jul 31 03:00:52 michaelnovakjr_: i don't know, but there's no way i'll take the job :) Jul 31 03:01:37 yea, did he at least tell you a salary? Jul 31 03:04:05 no, i don't even care :) Jul 31 03:04:10 it could be 6 figures, it's still J2ME :) Jul 31 03:04:24 (but obviously since it's J2ME, it wouldn't be) Jul 31 03:05:38 :) Jul 31 03:05:46 j2me is not fun Jul 31 03:06:57 jasta, the SMS app i'm writing uses autocomplete when writing a new text message Jul 31 03:07:26 hehe, getting fancy :) Jul 31 03:07:37 you should colorize it and stuff :) Jul 31 03:07:44 definitely Jul 31 03:07:49 see my Logcat app to see how ;) Jul 31 03:08:13 i like having autocomplete email addresses, so i figured why not for text messaging Jul 31 03:09:29 the interface for the sms app will be very nice.... its one that i use alot Jul 31 03:09:57 it seems i get all my text messages while playing around with apps on android Jul 31 03:15:23 michaelnovakjr_, your writing an SMS app ? Jul 31 03:15:52 have you posted the code to svn? Jul 31 03:16:52 jasta_, i have been committing, i'm using it as a working svn Jul 31 03:16:54 sayers: yep Jul 31 03:17:05 michaelnovakjr_, /me drops jaw Jul 31 03:17:31 sayers: how come? Jul 31 03:17:45 michaelnovakjr_, the craziest thing I've wrote was a tip calculator ;) Jul 31 03:18:11 sayers: well, we've been developing android aggressively for 7 or 8 months. Jul 31 03:18:19 :) Jul 31 03:18:20 indeed Jul 31 03:18:31 its actually not too difficult Jul 31 03:18:35 The last two months I've been trying to get a solid foundation in java Jul 31 03:18:36 we are quite proficient :) Jul 31 03:18:58 michaelnovakjr_, Oh I know it's a great API, just I can't come up with any projects without learning some sqlite which I don't want to do Jul 31 03:19:03 there will be obvious refactoring, but since i removed the other sms app, i kind of have to get some basic functionality in it first :) Jul 31 03:19:04 so instead I'm working on a game Jul 31 03:19:24 that's my next one after this.... probably a simple little puzzle game Jul 31 03:20:02 sqlite is about the easiest part of a non-trivial android application Jul 31 03:20:21 yakischloba, but you have to learn JDBC Jul 31 03:20:32 uhh? Jul 31 03:20:33 jdbc? Jul 31 03:20:36 for what? Jul 31 03:20:36 is your sms app a provider? Jul 31 03:20:40 No you don't lol Jul 31 03:20:57 jasta_, it will be fully integrated Jul 31 03:21:07 currently i have it setup as an IntentReceiver Jul 31 03:21:14 sayers: I already suggested last week that you look at the Notepad application tutorial for basics about sqlite data access in android Jul 31 03:21:24 doesn't do anything but use the notification manager and log the message Jul 31 03:21:32 so no interruption Jul 31 03:21:52 then there's the activity that you can view the threaded messages and also send a message Jul 31 03:22:17 i am going to fiddle around with the action portion so you can send a message from the contacts app for example Jul 31 03:22:28 yo Jul 31 03:22:46 yakischloba, I tried, but then I got occupied, the next day I started playing with Java Monkey Engine and now i'm doing that till I finish my game, then I will return to android Jul 31 03:23:29 ah sayers i thought you were writing a game for android Jul 31 03:23:30 jasta: with your android experience, why not try goog? Jul 31 03:23:53 michaelnovakjr_, nah it has advanced physics Jul 31 03:24:01 i see Jul 31 03:25:27 jasta, the messages activity uses a subactivity when clicking on a mesage thread, that way the back button will work Jul 31 03:25:35 same with creating a message Jul 31 03:25:50 i figured its the obvious way to lay it out Jul 31 03:30:07 auto complete is quite responsive Jul 31 03:31:22 is it possbile to hook into the voicemail interface to integrate voicemail from another system? Jul 31 03:32:15 i could be wrong but i think voicemail is in the carrier domain Jul 31 03:33:56 indeed, but I want to hook the voicemail application, and give it the ability to get vm from elsewhere Jul 31 03:35:23 hm, there's not much documentation on voicemail Jul 31 03:35:29 just a bit about getting the status Jul 31 03:35:50 i don't think there's much support at all in the current sdk ( if any real support is there ) Jul 31 03:36:26 weaksauce :\ Jul 31 03:36:33 I played with it some before, I'm grabbing the sdk again Jul 31 03:36:51 can you even generate calls, sms's, etc. ? Jul 31 03:37:56 yes, through telnet Jul 31 03:38:18 telnet localhost 5554 Jul 31 03:38:35 you can type help to get a list of commands and how to run them Jul 31 03:39:09 michaelnovakjr_ awesome, thanks. Jul 31 03:39:16 no problem Jul 31 03:39:38 there is a to voicemail option when the phone is ringing, but i haven't looked at that really at all Jul 31 03:42:40 michaelnovakjr_ I'll dig into it :0 Jul 31 03:42:41 :) Jul 31 03:44:13 :) Jul 31 03:49:08 be back in a few Jul 31 03:49:18 hello all Jul 31 04:05:25 back :) Jul 31 04:07:03 hrm no way to even simulate a voicemail being left? Jul 31 04:07:08 weird Jul 31 04:08:26 yea, i didn't think there was an option for that :( Jul 31 04:08:58 this sdk is way different then what they first came out with Jul 31 04:09:15 absolutely :0 Jul 31 04:09:15 I sent it an sms and that didn't show up Jul 31 04:09:18 calls worked though Jul 31 04:09:27 no wonder we don't have a good device yet :\ Jul 31 04:09:32 there might not be anything for sms Jul 31 04:09:35 try this Jul 31 04:09:44 http://penguinsoftware.org/Messages.apk Jul 31 04:09:55 please note it is still under very active development Jul 31 04:09:57 when I click on the battery or anything else up there some bar drops down, then dissapears, yuck yucky ui behavior Jul 31 04:10:00 but you can see messages :) Jul 31 04:10:11 jjshohoho: you have to slide it down Jul 31 04:10:17 the emulator doesn't do it justice Jul 31 04:10:24 its much better on a real device Jul 31 04:10:47 right, but for example, if I want to know what the green G is, I have no way of knowing in the emulator :\ Jul 31 04:11:09 that whole bar slides down, that is the notification area Jul 31 04:11:22 if you download that apk link i posted it uses it when an sms arrives Jul 31 04:11:40 how on earth do I install that? :P Jul 31 04:11:50 on windows or a *nix machine? Jul 31 04:11:57 windows, import it into my eclipse project? Jul 31 04:12:01 nope Jul 31 04:12:10 open a command prompt Jul 31 04:12:31 and run adb install Messages.apk ( assuming you are in the same directory as the messages.apk ) Jul 31 04:12:35 are you a developer? Jul 31 04:13:09 I've previously written apps in java, and currently do in perl Jul 31 04:13:26 android very much interests me, but it's a chicken/egg think Jul 31 04:13:27 thing8 Jul 31 04:13:47 I saw a link to someone selling 'hardware' that will run android, but it was page all done up in japanese :\ Jul 31 04:13:52 I'm in the telcom industry Jul 31 04:13:57 cool Jul 31 04:14:02 but not enough weight to get a prototype :P Jul 31 04:14:56 do you know how to set environmental variables in windows? Jul 31 04:15:08 yeah, I have it set for the sdk tools already Jul 31 04:15:13 oh cool Jul 31 04:15:31 the file you mentioned is not in that zip anywhere though Jul 31 04:15:33 so if you cd to the directory with that apk and run adb install Messages.apk that should work Jul 31 04:15:43 the .apk? Jul 31 04:15:50 yes, no Messages.apk Jul 31 04:15:53 no Messages.* Jul 31 04:16:01 did you download it from my link? Jul 31 04:16:29 yeah, it sends me a Messages.zip Jul 31 04:16:49 hm Jul 31 04:16:59 rename to Messages.apk and try to install it? Jul 31 04:17:12 you can try that, sure Jul 31 04:18:53 that worked Jul 31 04:18:56 cool Jul 31 04:19:23 the emulator was really meant just to run apk's in.... certainly not full phone functionality :) Jul 31 04:20:13 that's the SMS application i am writing for android Jul 31 04:20:33 yeah, weird to not see some default apps in it though Jul 31 04:20:36 its really just at the beginning stages, but it does receive messages and allows you to browse them Jul 31 04:20:36 like sms, voicemail, the usual Jul 31 04:20:47 there's a web browser, and a phone app Jul 31 04:20:48 you know? Jul 31 04:20:56 well, when this version came out it was really an infant Jul 31 04:21:05 this version was released in february Jul 31 04:22:56 michaelnovakjr_ it's interesting to say the least, no way to delete my sms yet? :) Jul 31 04:23:45 not yet :) Jul 31 04:24:02 it shouldn't be a long dev process :) Jul 31 04:24:37 http://android-random.googlecode.com has some other projects, more geared towards Vogue devices though. Jul 31 04:24:39 yeah, well I guess I can 'integrate' my solution into android, but, well... *sigh* Jul 31 04:24:42 this is the confusing part Jul 31 04:24:46 no 'official' apps to modify Jul 31 04:25:19 michaelnovakjr_ do you have actual hardware to test on? Jul 31 04:25:26 a new sdk should be coming soon... that's supposed to be a pretty significant update Jul 31 04:25:50 jjshoe: there's a project that got android bootstrapped from win mobile on the htc vogue Jul 31 04:26:14 oh, yeah, a couple of those, it's on a nokia and an two htc's no? Jul 31 04:26:16 michaelnovakjr: I'd be curious to compare that to the actual prototypes we have Jul 31 04:26:16 so i have been writing software for that Jul 31 04:26:31 romainguy__ me too.... wanna send one over :) Jul 31 04:26:35 haha Jul 31 04:26:41 I'll help compare, send me one :P Jul 31 04:26:42 sure :) Jul 31 04:26:49 its basically like the emulator Jul 31 04:26:56 michaelnovakjr: I have too many of them I don't know what to do with them anymore :) Jul 31 04:27:00 :) Jul 31 04:27:02 god I'd kill to work on android for google :\ Jul 31 04:27:27 romainguy__ the data connection driver's a bit flaky but phone and sms work awesome Jul 31 04:27:43 I was wondering about memory usage and speed actually Jul 31 04:27:44 my file browser gets away with more on the vogue version than the emulator too :) Jul 31 04:27:53 speed is pretty fast Jul 31 04:27:56 is there a touch screen on the vogue? Jul 31 04:28:00 yes Jul 31 04:28:12 there's no physical keyboard Jul 31 04:28:30 so there's a really ( almost bad ) keyboard implementation for it Jul 31 04:28:40 we'll just say..... its usable :) Jul 31 04:29:49 michaelnovakjr_ how much did the vogue set you back? Jul 31 04:30:09 in terms of cost.... i got it at a radioshack for 30 bucks with rebates Jul 31 04:30:53 damn Jul 31 04:31:02 michaelnovakjr_ did you sign up for service and everything though? Jul 31 04:31:13 and romainguy__ for all those bashing the notification manager, i find it quite nice on the vogue Jul 31 04:31:25 told you it works well on an actual device Jul 31 04:31:26 jjshoe: i have sprint service already, so i use it as my primary phone Jul 31 04:31:35 I agree it feels really weird on the emulator with the mouse pointer Jul 31 04:31:38 yea Jul 31 04:31:45 romainguy___ michaelnovakjr_ the notification thing with the mouse is impossible :D Jul 31 04:31:49 its a different kind of hand motion with a mouse Jul 31 04:32:06 instead of just one finger on a touch screen :) Jul 31 04:32:06 jjshoe: good thing we are not designing Android for a mouse then :) Jul 31 04:32:23 how is the notification manager intended to be accessed on phones w/o touch? Jul 31 04:32:34 that's a good question Jul 31 04:32:35 menu > notifications Jul 31 04:32:41 oh. Jul 31 04:32:41 on the home screen Jul 31 04:33:02 romainguy___ i can see people complaining though who don't have the hardware :P Jul 31 04:33:04 seems like it would be a good job for a side button or something Jul 31 04:33:27 ahh ok Jul 31 04:33:31 that's where I'm hung up Jul 31 04:33:41 you have to open it all the way to get it to stay, like a window shade Jul 31 04:33:47 duh ;) Jul 31 04:33:48 kinda makes sense Jul 31 04:33:53 :) Jul 31 04:34:18 the context menus on the device are pleasant too Jul 31 04:34:19 jjshoe: you can fling it too Jul 31 04:34:30 and if you drag it past the middle of the screen it keeps expanding all the way Jul 31 04:34:35 honestly, I would probably just re-map it to the volume buttons if it were a device, since I tend to never change the volume on phones Jul 31 04:34:52 romainguy___ on the actual hardware? Jul 31 04:34:53 you say that because you haven't tried it :) Jul 31 04:35:08 jjshoe: on the emulator too Jul 31 04:35:08 it really is much easier that it looks to be Jul 31 04:35:16 than* Jul 31 04:35:33 we do use real hardware 8+ hours a day Jul 31 04:35:43 so we try to make it at least nice for ourselves ;-)) Jul 31 04:35:46 :) Jul 31 04:35:56 i bet the data connection works nicely Jul 31 04:36:06 it's way past the half way, and I can't get a 'toss' to work unless I nearly break my mouse :P Jul 31 04:36:20 michaelnovakjr_ I'm sure Jul 31 04:37:07 the main thing that threw me off isn't so much the entire thing, it's just I run WM5 on the ut starcom6700, so I can click on the battery and get battery info, for example Jul 31 04:37:25 WM5, wow Jul 31 04:37:28 i absolutely hated that Jul 31 04:37:34 i'm running WM6 Jul 31 04:37:50 the interface is a little too cluttered for me :) Jul 31 04:38:21 you can't get a free upgrade to wm6 :\ Jul 31 04:38:25 wish I could Jul 31 04:38:34 i am still waiting for my upgrade to 6.1 Jul 31 04:41:30 now I need to find some open source art work since I r teh suck at drawing Jul 31 04:43:45 so romainguy__ anytime you want to send those prototypes over i'll be here :P Jul 31 04:46:10 you can tell this sdk is new Jul 31 04:46:10 none of the tutorials really match up :P Jul 31 04:46:36 tutorials from where? Jul 31 04:47:12 everything I have read matches up pretty well, unless i'm a tard Jul 31 04:47:30 yea, especially the code.google.com/android tutorials Jul 31 04:47:33 yeah Jul 31 05:08:42 sweet, autocomplete on the device is awesome Jul 31 05:09:04 good to hear Jul 31 05:20:07 I don't see a place in SQLitedatabase.query() that you could put a LIMIT clause. Any ideas?.. Jul 31 05:20:16 is there a 'widget' overview somewhere? Jul 31 05:20:28 like can I see a visual rep. of all available widgets? like swt gives you an overview Jul 31 05:20:30 yakischloba: you can run a rawQuery too Jul 31 05:20:39 michaelnovakjr_: ahh ok thanks Jul 31 05:20:55 no problem Jul 31 05:21:08 so of my more complex queries i just prefer rawQuery() Jul 31 05:21:15 some* Jul 31 05:21:16 yeah Jul 31 05:21:40 jjshoe: http://code.google.com/android/reference Jul 31 05:21:44 somehow I didn't notice that. I've been using the retarded (ihmo) query() Jul 31 05:21:50 its my best friend when it comes to android development Jul 31 05:22:02 i use query() for simple queries Jul 31 05:22:05 http://code.google.com/android/reference/view-gallery.html Jul 31 05:22:08 that's what it is Jul 31 05:23:00 yea, there's some other stuff like a tree view for lists etc..... if you run the dev tools on the emulator there's the sample projects on there Jul 31 05:23:05 they demo different android stuff Jul 31 05:23:48 jjshoe: these are old :) Jul 31 05:23:57 romainguy___ oh? Jul 31 05:24:04 romainguy___ do you have a link to newer stuff? Jul 31 05:24:09 no :) Jul 31 05:24:19 :) that is what i speaking of before.... Jul 31 05:24:28 its a slightly outdated SDK :) Jul 31 05:24:45 lies Jul 31 05:24:52 :\ Jul 31 05:25:03 romainguy___ can you say when we'll see the next version? Jul 31 05:25:08 no I cannot tell you Jul 31 05:25:14 I hope i'm writing my app in a way that will be easy to port to the new sdk :/ Jul 31 05:25:51 well that blows. Jul 31 05:26:32 does new sdk's typically break apps? Jul 31 05:26:57 I'm so glad I didn't participate in the competition, it would suck to have developed something cool and then have it broken Jul 31 05:27:13 that's part of software development though :) Jul 31 05:27:15 jjshoe: we haven't reached 1.0 yet so we change/break/remove/add APIs Jul 31 05:27:26 between M3 and M5, about 30% of the APIs changed Jul 31 05:27:34 yikes. Jul 31 05:27:40 michaelnovakjr_ most companies call that alpha, not beta. Jul 31 05:27:49 who said anything about beta? Jul 31 05:27:53 and it's not typical to hand a product out that changes that much Jul 31 05:28:02 its pre-release software Jul 31 05:28:10 we're the test bunnies. Jul 31 05:28:16 jjshoe: we never said it's beta, or product, or anything Jul 31 05:28:24 it's a pre-release developer preview :) Jul 31 05:28:47 yakischloba it's beginning to look more and more like it. Jul 31 05:29:00 its really not that bad though :) Jul 31 05:29:03 I don't necessarily have a problem with it (yet) ;) Jul 31 05:29:17 we don't change things just because we find it amusing Jul 31 05:29:19 Its a big job. Why not put it on the community that will benefit from it? Jul 31 05:29:33 we change things to improve the APIs Jul 31 05:29:44 I can only expect so many millions of dollars to be poured into something that will be given to me for free Jul 31 05:30:01 yakischloba 'free'. Jul 31 05:30:07 romainguy__ people don't like to work extra.... they lose out Jul 31 05:30:15 sorry for that Jul 31 05:30:23 shrug Jul 31 05:30:28 its no one's fault but their own Jul 31 05:30:42 you should hope the APIs get better with time Jul 31 05:30:51 and that usually means changes Jul 31 05:31:02 it happens with every other SDK Jul 31 05:31:06 at least in the end you guys will get a free, open source platform :) Jul 31 05:31:15 exactly :) Jul 31 05:31:29 change the sdk a lot, see how many origional developers are left when you finally launch a product :) Jul 31 05:31:30 i don't see why people are surprised about changes in the SDK..... Jul 31 05:31:47 jjshoe: quality > quantity :) Jul 31 05:32:03 jjshoe: but how can you release something that you got right on the first try? Jul 31 05:32:11 yakischloba I'm not sure how you market a phone with no applications Jul 31 05:32:23 jjshoe: its a developer SDK Jul 31 05:32:28 not a marketing release Jul 31 05:32:33 jjshoe: Apple did market the iPhone with no applications Jul 31 05:32:43 many phones out there are marketed without people ever installing apps Jul 31 05:32:45 romainguy___ and it's absolute junk, still to this day :) Jul 31 05:32:47 romainguy__ if i remember correctly without an SDK too Jul 31 05:32:52 and without an SDK Jul 31 05:32:56 we will have apps Jul 31 05:33:00 jjshoe: there were how many entrants into the contest? Not all those people spent their time writing their apps so they could bail when the SDK changed. Jul 31 05:33:03 we're not just writing an SDK :p Jul 31 05:33:27 and remember, we are not releasing one product Jul 31 05:33:27 1788 i believe Jul 31 05:33:31 we are releasing a platform Jul 31 05:33:47 which means that we have long terms plans Jul 31 05:33:58 is it true what I read? are we locked into gtalk too now? Jul 31 05:34:00 so yeah, it'd be nice to release the first product with 10,000 apps Jul 31 05:34:06 jjshoe: ?? Jul 31 05:34:39 jjshoe: u can just use smack if u dont want gtalk Jul 31 05:34:41 http://davanum.wordpress.com/2007/12/31/android-just-use-smack-api-for-xmpp/ Jul 31 05:35:16 romainguy__ you have seen my file manager screenshots correct, is that close to android's standard ui practices? Jul 31 05:35:36 mickrobk awesome, thanks for the link Jul 31 05:35:41 michaelnovakjr: link? Jul 31 05:35:55 one sec Jul 31 05:36:09 np, i owe davanum too :) Jul 31 05:37:15 I'm not too shocked to hear about the lock in.. just keep getting a worse taste in my mouth :\ Jul 31 05:37:41 jjshoe: what lockin? Jul 31 05:37:47 there's no lockin Jul 31 05:38:12 romainguy__ http://code.google.com/p/android-random/wiki/Glance Jul 31 05:38:33 michaelnovakjr: we don't use colored icons in menus Jul 31 05:38:49 other than that... :) Jul 31 05:39:08 cool, any particular reason? Jul 31 05:39:22 I'm sure the designers have a reason Jul 31 05:40:41 jjshoe: what lock in are you talking about? Jul 31 05:40:54 is that new romainguy__ i see the contacts apk has colored menu icons Jul 31 05:41:03 yeah, the next SDK Jul 31 05:41:13 i see Jul 31 05:41:15 cool Jul 31 05:44:39 why is the spinner nudged down by default relative to other widgets on the same horizontal layout? (and how can I bump it back up?) Jul 31 05:44:56 because they are baseline-aligned Jul 31 05:45:34 Is there a tutorial about this stuff? Jul 31 05:46:05 if there is, probably on code.google.com/android Jul 31 05:51:43 Hmm. I guess I'll deal with it later. If there's a tutorial it isn't easy to find Jul 31 05:52:18 you can always use android:baselineAligned="false" on your linear layout Jul 31 05:52:26 Thank you :) Jul 31 05:52:27 but then the texts won't be aligned correctly Jul 31 05:52:33 Oh. Jul 31 05:52:39 it's up to you :) Jul 31 05:52:57 So I only get one or the other? Jul 31 05:53:02 lies Jul 31 05:53:14 yes :) Jul 31 05:53:36 ugly spinners it is then. Jul 31 05:53:46 they changed anyway since then Jul 31 05:53:53 I'm sure Jul 31 05:53:57 I won't worry about it then. Jul 31 06:10:38 lol u tease Jul 31 06:10:39 they changed anyway since then Jul 31 06:16:11 night folks Jul 31 07:31:04 bye Jul 31 11:51:47 Someone here ? Jul 31 11:55:19 * alex2308 leaves Jul 31 12:17:57 anno^da_, lots of people Jul 31 12:25:20 yeah :) Just trying to figger things out on my own now :> Jul 31 13:01:59 Is there a method that gives me the possibility to check from my activity if my service is running, after having started if from my Activity via startService(..)? (except doing it with a Handler and sending messages) Jul 31 13:28:58 anno^da_, if (startService(...) != null) ? Jul 31 13:44:14 :) I am a damn noob. :) Yeah for sure thats the easiest way :/. I'm thinking too complicated all the time :) Jul 31 13:47:55 you could bind the service Jul 31 13:59:10 back Jul 31 13:59:23 yeah michaelnovakjr I know that I could bind it. But I recognized that I dont have to communicate that mich with the service. Jul 31 13:59:57 Just giving him video, audio, photo data and let him handle the communication with the APIs of tumblr etc. Jul 31 14:01:33 is your service the one download network content? Jul 31 14:02:47 No it is uploading stuff Jul 31 14:02:57 to the networks like flickr etc Jul 31 14:03:32 Just playing with the SDK and improving a bit of my Java knowledge Jul 31 14:04:27 Is there a way to get the display size ? (I've just found http://code.google.com/android/reference/android/util/DisplayMetrics.html) Jul 31 14:05:19 i would assume that class can provide you with that information :) Jul 31 14:05:29 have you tried it? Jul 31 14:06:43 anno^da-: getWindow().getWindowManager().getDefaultDisplay().getWidth() Jul 31 14:07:11 thanks zhobbs_ Jul 31 14:07:17 yeah I had tried michaelnovakjr Jul 31 14:07:18 :D Jul 31 14:07:48 ah i thought you were doing what zhobbs_ just said :) Jul 31 14:08:25 its a common practice in android to retreive such objects like screen, services, etc through the activity Jul 31 15:15:41 hello umdk1d4 Jul 31 15:19:19 * jasta struggles to figure out how to use jdb on the command-line. Jul 31 15:21:36 ohh, nice, found a helpful tutorial Jul 31 15:22:38 jasta: why command line? Jul 31 15:22:49 because jasta is a Real Man, obviously Jul 31 15:23:13 lol Jul 31 15:27:16 muthu: command line is easy Jul 31 15:28:18 michaelnovakjr: there's so many wonderful tools.. available Jul 31 15:28:47 sure, but there's nothing wrong with the command line, it gives you what you need Jul 31 15:29:07 command line is like single-player irc Jul 31 15:31:26 ? Jul 31 15:31:55 I tried using eclipse and absolutely hated it Jul 31 15:32:12 it was all roses and candy until I actually wanted to do something that it was Not Happy With Jul 31 15:32:20 that I could do just fine on the command line Jul 31 15:35:42 The command line is awesome. Jul 31 15:41:39 morning Jul 31 15:44:03 morning Jul 31 15:48:17 my monitor is supposed to come today...im worried they wont be able to get into the building Jul 31 15:48:28 UPS has a key or a code or something, but this is DHL :( Jul 31 15:49:56 can you leave a note ? Jul 31 15:50:32 Well, I'm hoping the guy will just use the call box to ring me up and I can let him in with my phone. I left a note with a signature on my door. Jul 31 15:51:06 Either that or call the apartment manager. Jul 31 15:51:31 cool Jul 31 15:51:51 Normally I just have stuff sent to my work but this is too big to carry home on my bike ;) Jul 31 15:52:09 i'd say so :) Jul 31 15:53:05 usually they leave at the apartment office, right? Jul 31 15:53:17 There is no apartment 'office.' Jul 31 15:53:40 where does the apt manager sit? Jul 31 15:53:47 In his apartment :) Jul 31 15:53:55