**** BEGIN LOGGING AT Tue Sep 30 02:59:57 2008 Sep 30 03:05:56 d03boy: if you do typical web surfing, use a browser with the right user-agent, and keep the amount of browsing well below the 1G limit Sep 30 03:06:17 it's doubtful they would catch you, or even care particularly much Sep 30 03:07:42 there's a 1G limit? oh sheesh... Sep 30 03:07:48 ttuttle: I still don't see how Apple got so many patents. working multi-touch was done in research labs back in the 80's Sep 30 03:08:12 Adamant: I'm not sure how much of multitouch they have patented, and how much is legitimately patented. Sep 30 03:14:42 i wonder if they're going to care about the 1g limit at first Sep 30 03:15:04 later on when there's more people on the network sure but in the beginning i'd bet not Sep 30 03:16:41 then again, i wonder how quickly youtube watching would eat 1GB, i'm looking at 2 100MB flv's on my system right now Sep 30 03:17:54 i dont think it would be good business to give people bandwidth and then take it away Sep 30 03:19:06 wastrel: The Youtube videos on Android are smaller mobile versions. Sep 30 03:22:57 ah yes that makes sense Sep 30 03:27:06 wastrel: I mean, T-Mo doesn't want to pay for eztra network usage either. Sep 30 03:28:21 operators make boatloads of money on data revenue Sep 30 03:28:26 wastrel: it's not 1 GB anymore Sep 30 03:28:29 they retracted it Sep 30 03:28:53 im really sad that we're stuck wtih tmo Sep 30 03:30:07 G1 needs to find another operator quickly Sep 30 03:30:21 carrier Sep 30 03:30:33 ya.. if they are stuck with just tmo... i'll be very sad Sep 30 03:30:41 v.v.sad Sep 30 03:30:56 i'm more for G1 coming to india quickly Sep 30 03:31:08 atleast you folks have something to play with Sep 30 03:32:26 you're not paying $1k/mo for rent :] Sep 30 03:32:38 1195 here Sep 30 03:34:26 not sure what we'll pay Sep 30 04:12:28 Adamant: I was under the impression that they had silently backed off on the 1GB...err... what f00f said Sep 30 04:12:51 good, if they did back off Sep 30 04:15:36 where to get jdk for ubuntu? Sep 30 04:15:52 the default repos don't have jdk Sep 30 04:16:19 jasta: where you download jdk for ubuntu? Sep 30 04:20:23 looks like its hidden in synaptic Sep 30 04:20:35 multiverse Sep 30 04:20:44 sun-java6-jdk Sep 30 04:20:49 thx Sep 30 04:21:01 hrm i have java5 jdk on my system Sep 30 04:21:21 yeah, its all java 5 anyways ;) Sep 30 04:22:53 openjdk might be better Sep 30 04:24:28 what does goog use? Sep 30 04:24:31 open or sun? Sep 30 04:28:08 sun Sep 30 04:28:10 java5 Sep 30 04:28:35 at least on ubuntu that's what I install for the system build Sep 30 04:28:48 cool Sep 30 04:38:47 me too Sep 30 04:38:57 java6 will work, but you can't rely on java6 semantics/features on android Sep 30 04:39:09 ok Sep 30 04:39:43 ms Sep 30 04:39:45 oops Sep 30 04:44:27 god i love android ;P Sep 30 04:44:54 * jasta quickly hacks up a fancy looking seek bar Sep 30 04:45:03 you're winking with your tongue sticking out? Sep 30 04:45:13 wierdo Sep 30 04:45:15 i'm putting together some demonstration/test code for the basis of Five now Sep 30 04:45:26 unshackling myself from the evils of the MediaPlayer finally :) Sep 30 04:45:46 i wonder if there will be an IRC client for Android Sep 30 04:45:49 does anyone know? Sep 30 04:46:01 Kruton_Nebulon: there were a few google code projects out there Sep 30 04:46:02 actually, i have my StreamMediaPlayer class working now, so I can invoke setDataSource(InputStream ...) and it "just works" Sep 30 04:46:02 Kruton_Nebulon: there will be if you write one Sep 30 04:46:11 not sure if theyve been upgraded to 1.0 Sep 30 04:46:12 although it turns out the MediaPlayer can't actually stream content (seriously!?) Sep 30 04:46:29 MediaPlayer can only play from HTTP URLs where Content-Length is set. Sep 30 04:47:24 umdk1d3: yo Sep 30 04:47:29 SanMehat: hey there :) Sep 30 04:47:39 umdk1d3: whats going on? Sep 30 04:47:56 finished 5 'views today and have a few more tomorrow Sep 30 04:48:23 nice, i saw you being paraded about Sep 30 04:48:29 orly? lol Sep 30 04:48:39 thats not fair, because i dont think ive met you :P Sep 30 04:48:53 no you havent :) Sep 30 04:49:10 i think im in another building all day tomorrow tho :/ Sep 30 04:49:18 umdk1d3: well, you've seen him paraded about. Sep 30 04:49:23 ;) Sep 30 04:49:27 SanMehat: hey, how's it going? (no I'm not asking) Sep 30 04:49:40 umdk1d3: well you should have someone call me for lunch Sep 30 04:49:49 ttuttle: its cool Sep 30 04:49:50 jason wanted me to do a video interview thing at some point, so maybe ill be back tomorrow/weds at some point Sep 30 04:49:52 SanMehat: cool Sep 30 04:49:54 watching tv with the fiance Sep 30 04:50:03 SanMehat: yay Sep 30 04:50:12 what we're letting developers in the building now? madness Sep 30 04:50:25 swetland: developers? Sep 30 04:50:37 swetland: jeez, next thing you'll be letting *interns* in, and we all know how that'll foul things up... Sep 30 04:50:49 umdk1d3: Are you in MTV? Sep 30 04:50:49 i got to walk past the big "employees only past this point" sign ^.^ Sep 30 04:50:56 ttuttle: yea Sep 30 04:51:09 umdk1d3: You *must* try Pintxo 47 (in Building 47, hence the name). Sep 30 04:51:13 umdk1d3: It is extremely yummy. Sep 30 04:51:16 hmm Sep 30 04:51:22 * umdk1d3 wonders what building i went to today Sep 30 04:51:27 it was across street to east Sep 30 04:51:31 *for lunch Sep 30 04:51:44 What place? Sep 30 04:52:32 went to 45 today looks like Sep 30 04:52:48 umdk1d3: Pintxo is bollocs Sep 30 04:52:52 ks Sep 30 04:55:25 SanMehat: What? Sep 30 04:56:33 SanMehat: You're clearly mistaken :-P Sep 30 04:57:17 umdk1d3: heard goog cafes are the best Sep 30 04:57:24 and its free! Sep 30 04:57:57 muthu: the free is the best part imho, not because its freefood, but because then you dont have cachiers and a checkout line Sep 30 04:58:06 *best part of their cafes Sep 30 04:58:06 buffet style? Sep 30 04:58:21 f00f-: yea kinda Sep 30 04:58:34 agree, the checkout lines are the worst Sep 30 04:58:40 its like they optimized the lunch experience to remove any performance bottlenecks ;) Sep 30 04:58:43 lool Sep 30 04:58:51 hehe Sep 30 04:59:01 O(1) Lunch Sep 30 04:59:08 exactly ;) Sep 30 05:00:16 I'd say it's more like O(log n), where n is proportionate to BMI :) Sep 30 05:00:42 hahahaa Sep 30 05:00:45 a true reality Sep 30 05:00:56 and a worst case of O(n^2) maybe ;) Sep 30 05:01:06 =O Sep 30 05:01:32 O(0) Sep 30 05:01:37 my fav Sep 30 05:04:32 love how nokia is changing tunes Sep 30 05:04:41 nokia loves android now Sep 30 05:05:07 to be fair, they said we'll wait and watch Sep 30 05:05:24 now that android is kickin ass.. they are paying attention Sep 30 05:06:07 umdk1d3: well hit me up tomorrow Sep 30 05:07:09 motorola hiring anroid devs is THE news today Sep 30 05:07:14 muthu: you applied? Sep 30 05:07:21 see i told you they were hiring :D Sep 30 05:07:21 naa Sep 30 05:07:32 yeah Sep 30 05:07:51 i'm stuck in chennai Sep 30 05:07:54 "We are a new start-up division within Motorola with strong executive level sponsorship, a 50M+ budget for our Android platform. Our new CEO, Sanjay Jha, has been in the forefront of the formation of the Android Open Handset Alliance!" Sep 30 05:08:10 gr8 Sep 30 05:08:32 damn, dns is very slow here today Sep 30 05:08:48 i'm sure nokia, verizon everyone follows suit Sep 30 05:08:59 you mean switch to android? Sep 30 05:09:09 not switch Sep 30 05:09:15 but start Sep 30 05:09:23 in parallel Sep 30 05:09:31 Motorola was in bad shit. The move to Android makes great sense for them Sep 30 05:09:38 yup Sep 30 05:09:38 not sure it makes sense for everyone else yet Sep 30 05:09:47 and if motorola turns around.. man! Sep 30 05:09:53 android is like their only card left Sep 30 05:09:55 that's the kind of success story android needs Sep 30 05:10:00 they were looking for a buyer of their mobile unit Sep 30 05:10:05 or were rumored to have Sep 30 05:10:12 if motorola hires me Sep 30 05:10:18 i can turn it around in 3 yrs Sep 30 05:10:21 with android Sep 30 05:10:30 * f00f- pats muthu Sep 30 05:10:31 for sure Sep 30 05:11:13 700B bailout is blocked, heh? Sep 30 05:11:19 yeah Sep 30 05:11:24 SHIT Sep 30 05:11:25 $1.2T lost in market this fnie day Sep 30 05:11:59 android is released when the economy is in bad shit Sep 30 05:12:05 this will be a good test Sep 30 05:12:17 aye Sep 30 05:12:21 google down 9.5% too today Sep 30 05:12:26 yeah Sep 30 05:12:30 its only the beginning Sep 30 05:12:39 yeah Sep 30 05:12:48 hopefully the next bill will give economy a little boost Sep 30 05:12:59 inflation out of control almost Sep 30 05:13:04 err Sep 30 05:13:05 *fears* Sep 30 05:13:06 i mean Sep 30 05:13:18 it's great not to be jobless right now Sep 30 05:13:23 im watching cspan Sep 30 05:14:32 what were the congress thinking? Sep 30 05:15:00 in not passing the bailout? Sep 30 05:15:08 yeah Sep 30 05:15:15 "my constitutents will crucify me if I vote in favor of giving Wall Street taxpayer money" Sep 30 05:15:24 I think that is what they were thinking Sep 30 05:15:37 maybe that bailing out banks that put themselves in the position to fail in the first place seems counter-intuitive? Sep 30 05:15:52 why would you want them to pass a 700b$ bailout? Sep 30 05:16:08 you might as well ask them to take away %5 of your income Sep 30 05:18:10 i dont understand this economic situation.. its bizarre Sep 30 05:18:23 why is it bizarre? Sep 30 05:18:31 republicans wanting to use tax payer money to bail out companies Sep 30 05:18:47 $700 billion will be nothing compared to what wall street is going to lose Sep 30 05:18:51 if this doesn't get passed Sep 30 05:18:55 snadge: I think you mean Democrats. :-) Sep 30 05:19:06 dmoffett: did you see the news today? Sep 30 05:19:08 I hate the fact that our stock market is so dependent on things that don't immediately affect it Sep 30 05:19:12 george bush was almost in tears about it.. please please pass this bill Sep 30 05:19:13 Republican voted it down. Sep 30 05:19:33 well, yeah, because their constituency was up in arms over Sep 30 05:19:35 it Sep 30 05:19:53 neither party likes it much and neither wants to pass it themselves. long term I think it's likely to cause plenty of grief Sep 30 05:19:55 Really it is a bi-partisan screw up. Sep 30 05:19:59 they should have just let wall street collapse Sep 30 05:20:06 I agree. Sep 30 05:20:11 snadge Sep 30 05:20:24 democrats voted it up Sep 30 05:20:26 emotions over country Sep 30 05:20:37 The last thing I want to is to fund some CEO's golden parachute. Sep 30 05:20:40 only about 60 reps voted for it Sep 30 05:20:43 I do think they ought to do something rather than just let everything implode, but what I've heard so far is not particularly encouraging Sep 30 05:20:57 swetland: agreed Sep 30 05:21:46 I'd rather it drag out longer in hopes of a less braindamaged solution than rush to pass something nobody likes with limited accountability/improvements Sep 30 05:22:03 i heard on our aussie news today.. this whole problem is caused by the lack of regulation in that segment of the market place anyway Sep 30 05:22:17 and that banks and other areas of the market are already havily regulated.. and have been for a long time Sep 30 05:22:23 swetland, propping up the gambling game isnt going to help Sep 30 05:22:31 that the assumption that the free market should sort itself out.. was wrong Sep 30 05:22:42 there are problems with the fundamental idea of how our economy works Sep 30 05:22:50 snadge, thats because its not free Sep 30 05:23:00 its highly regulated with little oversight Sep 30 05:23:03 well in australia.. only 1% of our market is futures or whatever they're called Sep 30 05:23:13 in the usa its more like 15% .. which is apparently much more of a problem Sep 30 05:23:15 snadge, its a global economy Sep 30 05:23:41 d03boy: kind of.. another comment was that whilst the usa suffers, others will potentially benefit Sep 30 05:24:09 some will Sep 30 05:24:11 the global economy and the us economy whilst they're interlinked.. are seperate concepts Sep 30 05:24:13 but not very much Sep 30 05:24:51 if you guys want a detailed explination of whats going on check out the first question Sep 30 05:24:52 http://www.themoneymasters.com/faqs.htm Sep 30 05:26:05 nice :) Sep 30 05:26:36 ``To pay for them it creates the $40 billion out of nothing, merely with keystrokes on a computer.`` Sep 30 05:26:42 i like that. Sep 30 05:27:07 literally it's an increment Sep 30 05:27:11 they're the only ones allowed to do it! Sep 30 05:27:14 uh huh Sep 30 05:27:22 ben bernanke is a piece of poop Sep 30 05:27:57 its all just wrong.. when can we riot against the system? Sep 30 05:28:05 and replace it with something fair etc Sep 30 05:28:08 now is as good a time as ever Sep 30 05:28:12 energize the populace Sep 30 05:28:41 its starting to happn Sep 30 05:28:49 how can these dickwads play with peoples lives like that .. pull money from thin air.. create panic, then calm etc Sep 30 05:28:51 americans are finally waking up to whats been going on Sep 30 05:29:07 ismell, most are clueless Sep 30 05:29:34 most are, true. But theres a small majority thats atleast starting to go out and do some research Sep 30 05:29:45 actually creating it out of thin air is fine, but keep a cap on it Sep 30 05:29:55 f00f-, why is that fine? Sep 30 05:30:13 my mind is exploding trying to comprehend this Sep 30 05:30:13 you don't always need the capital on hand Sep 30 05:30:18 you want to be able to stimulate the economy Sep 30 05:30:22 how do you create 360 billion out of nothing Sep 30 05:30:26 but only up t oa certain point Sep 30 05:30:34 f00f-, what should that point be? Sep 30 05:30:43 until our economy collapses? Sep 30 05:30:45 this whole 10% then reloan 10% thing.. is not only confusing.. it just seems wrong Sep 30 05:31:09 i guess that's what the whole bailout plan is trying to consider Sep 30 05:31:10 it seems to violate the laws of thermodynamics or something Sep 30 05:31:15 to control that Sep 30 05:31:21 its like the laws of physics and the laws of the economy contradict each other Sep 30 05:31:31 f00f-, did you know that this is like.. the first time congress has actually been given a vote for this plan? Sep 30 05:31:39 the fed was just bailing them out on their own before Sep 30 05:31:57 i was not aware Sep 30 05:32:03 * jasta scratches his head why suddenly gravity doesn't behave like it used to Sep 30 05:32:07 peoplein congress don't even read the bills mostly Sep 30 05:32:09 another thing i dont get.. this $700 billion.. is this tax payers money.. like. your taxes are being diverted towards this Sep 30 05:32:16 or is this money that just gets pulled out of "thin air" Sep 30 05:32:23 it's added to the deficit Sep 30 05:32:28 no its not tax payer money Sep 30 05:32:32 remember it's $700bn in loans Sep 30 05:32:37 idea is that tax payers eventually will get a return Sep 30 05:32:45 loans being 11% or so interest Sep 30 05:32:53 we are technically paying for it by inflation tax Sep 30 05:32:54 right.. so let me get this straight.. the government is borrowing money that doesnt exist.. to bail out companies which are going broke, because they loaned out too much non existant money? Sep 30 05:32:55 :P Sep 30 05:33:33 yep, does the great depression sound familiar ? ;) Sep 30 05:33:33 well, the laws allowed banks to create 90% out of thin air, if i'm reading this article correctly Sep 30 05:33:33 its inflation Sep 30 05:33:33 i better fact check Sep 30 05:33:33 republicans are bad for the economy Sep 30 05:33:41 politicians are bad for the economy Sep 30 05:33:45 all i know is.. if things go to crap like this.. i will remove myself from the economy Sep 30 05:33:50 f00f, imagine what 700billion will do with the same logic Sep 30 05:33:58 go live out on a farm with my parents.. and grow my own food etc Sep 30 05:34:09 and have several shotguns to defend myself :p Sep 30 05:34:10 better say bye bye to android dev ;) Sep 30 05:34:16 haha Sep 30 05:34:32 if the bailout doesn't pass, everything should stabilize within the year Sep 30 05:34:43 heh Sep 30 05:34:49 if it does pass, then we will be ok for a year and then get hit even harder and longer Sep 30 05:34:59 wastrel, saying its just the republicans is probably one of the most naive things you could've said Sep 30 05:35:13 +1 ismell Sep 30 05:35:24 it's the republicans who dismantled the regulatory apparatus Sep 30 05:35:29 and allowed this to happen Sep 30 05:35:37 its not just repubs, its the whole fiat currency Sep 30 05:35:42 it's the republicans who have put the nation into debt Sep 30 05:35:45 if the bill passes, you can hope the economy gets back to normal Sep 30 05:35:54 the bill is dead Sep 30 05:36:16 the whole pointing of fingers doesn't help Sep 30 05:36:26 With one socialist “bailout” bill apparently on the way to passage by Congress, two more are pending¯both of them sponsored by Senator Barack Obama. One is the Jubilee Act, which would cancel as much as $75 billion worth of Third World debt, and the Global Poverty Act, which would cost an estimated $845 billion. Total potential cost: $920 billion. Sep 30 05:36:27 wastrel, democrast have held the congress for the past couple years buddy Sep 30 05:36:33 if you want something againt the demos Sep 30 05:36:48 nice Sep 30 05:36:54 d03boy: a year and change, yes Sep 30 05:37:12 50/50 split in the senate Sep 30 05:37:13 good, the nuclear bill got passed Sep 30 05:37:20 with joe lieberman the tiebreaker Sep 30 05:37:24 nuclear bill? Sep 30 05:37:24 nuclear bill? Sep 30 05:37:29 for india Sep 30 05:37:31 joe lieberman who is currently campaigning for mccain Sep 30 05:37:44 it's not a democrat problem Sep 30 05:37:47 the republicnas did this Sep 30 05:37:56 muthu: oh, thought I'd missed something big in the US :) Sep 30 05:37:56 clinton left office with a surplus Sep 30 05:38:07 wastrel, you're retarded I think Sep 30 05:38:16 muthu: i think we need nuclear here, though Sep 30 05:38:17 summatusmentis: no, it helps india's quest of nuclear energy Sep 30 05:38:24 no i am just sick and angry at what the republicans have done to this country Sep 30 05:38:30 wastrel, clinton was the one that orderd fannie and freddy to lower the morgage standards Sep 30 05:38:39 f00f-: we need a place to put the waste first Sep 30 05:38:48 ismell: in times of economic boom and surplus... why shouldn't they? Sep 30 05:38:54 fannie and freddy have nothing to do with subprime. Sep 30 05:38:57 wastrel, you're just another idiot that is completely ignoratn to the fact that dems and reps are the same damn thing Sep 30 05:39:17 d03boy: I suppose you have a candidate that will change things up Sep 30 05:39:19 d03boy: would a democratic administation have invaded iraq? no. Sep 30 05:39:20 sure it does, that $$ circulates in a big circle Sep 30 05:39:30 wastrel, obama wants to attack iran Sep 30 05:39:39 and afganistan Sep 30 05:39:53 d03boy: where do you live? Sep 30 05:39:55 its not a want to, its going to happen Sep 30 05:39:59 get your facts straight. no one wants to attack anyone. Sep 30 05:40:26 i dont think US can afford to attach anyone now Sep 30 05:40:31 attack Sep 30 05:40:31 the banks do, they the ones that make all the $$ durring war Sep 30 05:40:44 the banks are gone! Sep 30 05:41:04 WI, ok safe blue state Sep 30 05:41:08 vote for who you want Sep 30 05:41:08 not really, they have all just merged into larger banks Sep 30 05:41:35 and we all know what happens to large Sep 30 05:41:36 defense spending is also out of control Sep 30 05:41:45 wastrel, i'm voting 3rd party Sep 30 05:41:57 d03boy: green? Sep 30 05:41:58 f00f-, defense is probably the only thing that should be out of control Sep 30 05:42:04 donomo: http://www.barackobama.com/issues/foreignpolicy/#iran Sep 30 05:42:12 donomo: sorry. d03boy ^^^ Sep 30 05:42:14 vote chuck baldwin Sep 30 05:42:35 wastrel, they dont have any weapons Sep 30 05:43:18 paul kruger writes wonderful columns Sep 30 05:43:23 guess he's with NYT Sep 30 05:43:24 krugman? Sep 30 05:43:32 yeah Sep 30 05:43:43 yeah he's good Sep 30 05:44:01 very insightful Sep 30 05:46:38 hope goog has a long time strategy for android given the bad economy Sep 30 05:46:46 heh Sep 30 05:47:01 hehe Sep 30 05:47:10 hmm Sep 30 05:47:14 default pixmaps for the seek bar are ugly :) Sep 30 05:47:22 http://www.barackobama.com/issues/endorsingronpaul/ Sep 30 05:47:24 the bar should be smaller, and the "knob" a circle ;) Sep 30 05:47:25 always complaining :) Sep 30 05:47:27 doesnt seem to have a position on that Sep 30 05:47:29 :P Sep 30 05:47:44 lol Sep 30 05:47:53 didnt NYT endorse barack? Sep 30 05:47:53 * umdk1d3 would kinda like a vertical seekbar ;) Sep 30 05:48:13 umdk1d3: create a RotateLayout that rotates the canvas & motion events :) Sep 30 05:48:17 ron paul? he's a bit old. Sep 30 05:48:17 i wonder who google is endorsing :) Sep 30 05:48:17 take 51% of employee opinion, and endorse that Sep 30 05:48:18 d03boy: not sure, but krugman support obama Sep 30 05:48:34 romainguy_: is it really that easy? =D /me peeks at docs Sep 30 05:48:35 f00f-, younger than mccain Sep 30 05:48:47 f00f-: most tech support dems Sep 30 05:48:54 umdk1d3: I'm sure it's doable, that's how I wrote the rotating MapView in the ApiDemos Sep 30 05:48:54 both frail, next plz Sep 30 05:48:55 yeah Sep 30 05:48:57 muthu, did you do a poll? Sep 30 05:49:00 umm romainguy_ no suck thing as RotateLayout :/ Sep 30 05:49:08 umdk1d3: I meant, write a RotateLayout :)) Sep 30 05:49:22 d03boy: poll on what? Sep 30 05:49:31 muthu, you say most tech support dems..... Sep 30 05:49:36 thats a statistic Sep 30 05:49:38 oh lol Sep 30 05:49:45 just wondering where you came up with that Sep 30 05:49:48 * umdk1d3 adds to the neverending todo list Sep 30 05:50:08 d03boy: that's my guess Sep 30 05:50:26 damn, i just realized a big hole in my StreamMediaPlayer hack :( Sep 30 05:50:56 eww, i have to do cleanup in finalize() i think :( Sep 30 05:52:25 svn Sep 30 05:52:25 The program 'svn' is currently not installed. You can install it by typing: Sep 30 05:52:25 sudo apt-get install subversion Sep 30 05:52:25 bash: svn: command not found Sep 30 05:52:31 ubuntu is fantastic! Sep 30 05:52:37 muthu, sudo Sep 30 05:52:48 oh Sep 30 05:52:56 yeah, like the fact that ubuntu tells you what to do Sep 30 05:55:02 hmm /me wonders if there is a permission for a java app to get full dump of logcat Sep 30 05:56:39 there's a DUMP permission Sep 30 05:56:49 but I don't think it's for logcat Sep 30 05:57:07 jasta: eww, i have to do cleanup in finalize() i think << you shouldn't rely on finalize() being called though Sep 30 05:59:26 romainguy_: so someone had asked about getting crashdumps from their apps Sep 30 05:59:31 thu/friday Sep 30 05:59:44 and we thought about creating a single watch service that sits aroud watching for crashes Sep 30 05:59:57 and feeds back the crash through a specific intent if that app was interested Sep 30 06:00:01 wow, another holiday Sep 30 06:00:04 love india! Sep 30 06:00:12 oct 2 Sep 30 06:00:31 what's this one for? Sep 30 06:01:04 Oct 02 - Gandhi Jayanthi - Birthday of Mahatma Gandhi - Father of India Sep 30 06:01:21 ah Sep 30 06:01:28 rather like President's Day here Sep 30 06:01:28 the public ban on smoking comes to effect oct 02 Sep 30 06:01:41 muthu: they're banning it in India? Sep 30 06:01:46 yeah Sep 30 06:01:53 I thought you guys smoked like chimneys Sep 30 06:02:00 the current health minister is really health conscious ;) Sep 30 06:02:03 ah Sep 30 06:02:23 he wants to smoke tobacco, alcohol et al Sep 30 06:02:27 arghhhh Sep 30 06:02:32 s/smoke/ban Sep 30 06:02:34 lol Sep 30 06:02:40 the bans were easier here because a lot of people had already quit smoking Sep 30 06:02:49 banning alcohol isn't gonna work Sep 30 06:02:50 Adamant: really? Sep 30 06:02:51 can i save my text messages on my gmail account ? Sep 30 06:02:58 thought there's a lot of smokers in US Sep 30 06:03:10 muthu: yeah, the US rate of smokers is one of the world's lowest now Sep 30 06:03:22 gr8 Sep 30 06:03:23 part of the reason we got so fat Sep 30 06:03:31 hehe Sep 30 06:03:44 oh well, there's always meth Sep 30 06:03:59 no, that's going out of the frying pan and into the fire. Sep 30 06:04:10 the health minister wants to convert wineshops into ration shops Sep 30 06:04:34 moderate alcohol intake is good for you Sep 30 06:04:37 he's vehemantly against smoking and drinking Sep 30 06:05:00 yup, beer is gooood Sep 30 06:05:03 you can not even smoke in hardly in Los aAgeles or California for that matter, muthu Sep 30 06:05:10 I can understanding smoking but he's wrong about moderate drinking and health studies have proven that. Sep 30 06:05:32 now working with alchoholics and binge drinkers would be a good idea. Sep 30 06:05:49 yeah, alcohol banning in india is a bad idea Sep 30 06:06:02 muthu: we tried it in the US too, it doesn't work Sep 30 06:06:06 Prohibition Sep 30 06:06:08 HELLLLOOOOOOOOOOO Sep 30 06:06:12 ? Sep 30 06:06:13 yup, that never works Sep 30 06:06:26 Pradalvr: everyone was smoking in SF Sep 30 06:06:35 yeah, but they smoke outside Sep 30 06:06:39 not in buildings Sep 30 06:06:44 right Sep 30 06:06:50 umdk1d3: and feeds back the crash through a specific intent if that app was interested << Shift-Menu :) Sep 30 06:07:06 can anyone tell me if i can save my text messages on my gmail account ? Sep 30 06:09:16 you need to be in group "log" to read from the logs, which appears to be associated with android.permission.READ_LOGS Sep 30 06:09:29 romainguy_: is that for developers though? they were looking for something to get those crashes from any random users out in the real world Sep 30 06:09:41 ah yes, that won't help you Sep 30 06:09:42 diane had talked that this wasnt implemented yet because of privacy concerns Sep 30 06:09:59 I am assuming a person can not Sep 30 06:10:11 yeah, there would be serious issues with crashdumps Sep 30 06:10:42 well there is a difference between hard crashdump and just unhandled exceptions Sep 30 06:10:48 that is F****** stupid if you can not Sep 30 06:10:51 probably would want something where the user is given the option to submit a crashlog (and the ability to review the log first) Sep 30 06:11:08 this might just handle exceptions, which should be a harmless stack trace Sep 30 06:11:14 swetland: you mean the dialog box you always reply no to on Windows and Mac OS X? :)) Sep 30 06:11:23 exactly ^^ Sep 30 06:11:41 usually (from a dev perspective) if you know the rough neighborhood of a bug you can usually find it, even if you cant replicate it entirely Sep 30 06:11:52 though if the crashlog were going to the actual developer and not the system vendor Sep 30 06:12:05 I might sometimes say yes, if I thought the developer would actually do something with it Sep 30 06:12:48 romainguy_: oh awesome @ MapViewCompassDemo Sep 30 06:13:03 useless in the emulator tho, so not sure how many people "get" whjat it does right now Sep 30 06:13:18 but your right about having to translate the touch events Sep 30 06:36:07 Oh, wow. Sep 30 06:36:22 Randy's Last Lecture has made WP:List_of_Internet_phenomena, just a few list items up from 2girls1cup. Sep 30 06:37:32 we need more internet phenomena like the former and fewer of the latter. minus the dying part. Sep 30 06:38:38 == Adamant Sep 30 06:38:43 ? Sep 30 06:39:09 "== Adamant" roughly means "I agree with Adamant." Sep 30 06:39:15 ah Sep 30 06:39:24 I didn't realize irssi rearranged my channels ... this was supposed to go to a CMU channel. Sep 30 06:39:36 I've only seen != used. Sep 30 07:21:03 romainguy_: Did you release new sample code? Sep 30 07:31:50 * hamdroid notices that people have filed bugs in the apps-for-android project with patches to get things compiling in the 1.0 SDK. Cool. Sep 30 07:49:28 mornin Sep 30 07:52:01 howdy Sep 30 07:58:31 hmmm.... Sep 30 08:17:48 hello :), is there any way to install apk file from net (browser) ? I get error - "For security reason, your phone is set to block installation of applications not sourced in Android Market " Sep 30 08:23:16 are you using an actual handset? Sep 30 08:25:30 emulator Sep 30 08:26:18 and i can't access settings activity Sep 30 08:26:52 try reinstall? the one apk i downloaded (connectbot) worked fine for me. Sep 30 08:28:52 but how can i reinstall apk ? Sep 30 08:29:14 emulator -wipe-data Sep 30 12:14:47 ls Sep 30 12:53:25 good morning yakischloba Sep 30 12:54:51 hows it going dougie Sep 30 12:56:33 pretty good Sep 30 12:56:35 yourself? Sep 30 12:59:40 ehh fine i suppose other than that its too early Sep 30 13:00:18 never feel quite normal until about noon when i wake this early :/ Sep 30 13:03:55 i do have a bagel with smoked salmon though Sep 30 13:04:00 i wonder if its going to be good Sep 30 13:05:21 dev question: Sep 30 13:05:21 hmm yeah it is Sep 30 13:05:46 i have an intent with extra data that starts an activity... Sep 30 13:05:57 you can then leave the activity Sep 30 13:06:25 there are multiple intents that start this same activity Sep 30 13:06:29 with different data Sep 30 13:06:49 but only the data of the original intent is ever recieved Sep 30 13:07:09 i think a bagel with smoked salmon would be awesome. but it depends on the kinda bagel. not like cinnamon raisin. Sep 30 13:07:39 its plain white. i would have preferred wheat i guess but this is OK Sep 30 13:08:12 I duno if you have Noah's bagels out there but they make this bagel thats uhm...roasted red pepper, tomato and something else and cheese i think Sep 30 13:08:14 its sooo good Sep 30 13:13:40 hrmph. T-MO wants to charge my wife $299 too. Did anyone preorder and actually get the $179 price? My wife is probably half a year past her upgrade time Sep 30 13:13:51 sup eleftherios Sep 30 13:14:42 I've heard of somebody else in this channel that complained of the same thing Sep 30 13:14:52 what was their reasoning why you had to pay more? Sep 30 13:16:12 didn't ask -- just went on the online site for pre-order. Sep 30 13:16:22 i had to part with my first born son Sep 30 13:16:45 and you're wife is past the two year contract since her last upgrade? Sep 30 13:16:54 I assume that it works like Sprint on upgrades Sep 30 13:17:15 will these things be sold out or will i be able to buy one in november.. unlocked Sep 30 13:17:28 snadge: I heard rumors that the preorder is close to selling out. Sep 30 13:17:32 snadge: rumors, though. Sep 30 13:17:36 . Sep 30 13:17:36 hi km- Sep 30 13:17:57 i read somewhere $399 unlocked Sep 30 13:18:14 or you could bail after 90 days or something Sep 30 13:18:48 i want to take mine back to australia Sep 30 13:18:53 is there PAYG data on AT&T? Sep 30 13:18:59 supposedly t-mobile will unlock any of their phones if your account is in good standing after 90 days Sep 30 13:19:01 thats if i can even get it.. hopefully Sep 30 13:19:26 km-: i heard it was already sold out. Sep 30 13:19:35 i've heard that if you're american.. theres not much point unlocking it because pretty much t-mobile is the only carrier that will take it? Sep 30 13:19:36 and tethridge thats only for non-contract Sep 30 13:20:03 snadge: thats what ive heard too. i heard the frequencies for data are only supported by tmobile Sep 30 13:20:38 but in australia, i have no choice but to somehow get one unlocked or unlock it.. im presuming it will work with the 3g providers we have here Sep 30 13:20:52 like three (orange telecom) and telstra, and vodafone Sep 30 13:21:02 whens it even coming out in australia? Sep 30 13:21:11 i dont know, but i will be in the usa in november Sep 30 13:21:29 there is zero information with regards to australia and android based phones Sep 30 13:21:33 do any of the carriers in australia support the data frequency? Sep 30 13:21:41 none of the providers have made any announcements whatsoever Sep 30 13:21:56 i would look into that before you buy one. Sep 30 13:22:05 well i know you can use the 3g iphone here Sep 30 13:22:10 you might want to wait and get a different phone. Sep 30 13:22:15 my friend has a htc tytn ii with windows mobile 6.1 on it Sep 30 13:22:39 yeah but thats a different freq range (for the iphone) and i dont know abou the tytn Sep 30 13:22:52 so i cant really see why dream wouldn't work.. unless it uses some magical 3g standard thats incompatible with every other 3g standard Sep 30 13:23:06 :P Sep 30 13:23:51 well, from what i hear its not going to work on att 3g. Sep 30 13:23:54 only tmobile 3g Sep 30 13:25:30 snadge, fyi, australia's wifi frequencies are different than america I think Sep 30 13:25:37 the wifi may not work. Sep 30 13:26:13 you mean the 802.11 part or the 3g part? Sep 30 13:26:57 here are the specs snadge Sep 30 13:26:58 http://www.htc.com/www/product/g1/specification.html Sep 30 13:27:01 ok.. so t-mobile is using 2100/1700 MHz Sep 30 13:27:04 802.11 part Sep 30 13:27:26 km: no.. they're the same (mostly) Sep 30 13:27:31 at the very least, they overlap Sep 30 13:27:32 in us its using 1700/2100 Sep 30 13:28:03 wow, 7.2mbps? That's pretty sweet. Sep 30 13:28:24 umm.. hangon, according to the htc specs Sep 30 13:28:27 its supports everything Sep 30 13:28:38 ahh.. operator dependant Sep 30 13:28:48 my iphone is having some issues, so I'm hoping to a) fix the issues for free or b) get a new android-based phone soon Sep 30 13:28:59 anyone have a clue when the next phone might hit? Sep 30 13:29:14 the g1 looks okay, but I bet there will be some nice hardware that comes out... Sep 30 13:30:03 Benddd: sprint will have a phone by the end of the year Sep 30 13:30:26 but its probably going to be another htc Sep 30 13:30:28 ewww sprint... I want gsm.. love my sim card Sep 30 13:30:29 heh Sep 30 13:32:09 is the standard g1 uses called umts? Sep 30 13:32:36 because apparently its at 2100mhz in australia.. jointly owned by three and telstra.. telstra also have one at 850mhz Sep 30 13:33:08 so if i can unlock it.. doesnt that mean i can use it at 2100mhz on three or telstra? Sep 30 13:33:41 anyone know of a good example for sqlite db stuff in 1.0? Sep 30 13:33:44 or does it require the 1700mhz part as well? Sep 30 13:33:54 because theres no mention of that anywhere Sep 30 13:58:25 Dougie187, can you give me the details on the sprint version? Sep 30 13:58:36 I thought that it wasn't going to be available until next year Sep 30 14:05:38 Dougie187, must be getting some coffee Sep 30 14:06:00 sprint version doesn't have any details out yet Sep 30 14:06:15 im just speculating that htc will release the first sprint phone Sep 30 14:06:16 what are you basing your info on? Sep 30 14:06:26 the timeframe? Sep 30 14:06:27 but sprint has said that they will release a phone by the end of the year with android on it before Sep 30 14:06:33 yeah, time frames Sep 30 14:06:41 and the OHA members Sep 30 14:06:52 OHA members are LG Motorola Samsung and HTC Sep 30 14:07:05 LG and Samsung are not releasing android phones until Q3 09 Sep 30 14:07:15 Motorola reportedly just started working with android Sep 30 14:07:18 so that leaves HTC Sep 30 14:07:25 I could have sworn I heard that Sprint wouldn't have a phone out until q1 2009. I hope you are right though Sep 30 14:07:37 i heard sprint will have a phone out by 09 Sep 30 14:07:46 one sec ill get the report in a minute Sep 30 14:08:19 * Disconnect heard rumours that sounded like 4q08/1q09 - more likely later than earlier. fwiw. :) Sep 30 14:09:50 http://www.engadget.com/2008/09/17/t-mobile-g1-said-to-be-landing-october-17th-sprint-android-phon/ Sep 30 14:11:02 dougie: that article is pre-announcement Sep 30 14:11:24 yeah Sep 30 14:11:25 ahh Sep 30 14:11:30 pre- tmobile announcement Sep 30 14:11:30 you're talking about the sprint rollout Sep 30 14:11:32 * km- STFU's Sep 30 14:11:35 yeah Sep 30 14:12:14 Dougie187, I hope that is right Sep 30 14:12:28 Otherwise I have to wait until Feb when my Sprint contract is up Sep 30 14:12:31 i don't see why it wouldnt be. Sep 30 14:12:35 yeah Sep 30 14:15:54 I'm really excited about sprint's android phone assuming it's touch screen Sep 30 14:17:07 im assuming its going to be some modification of the g1 Sep 30 14:17:33 I don't know, early android videos were using a device without a touchscreen... Sep 30 14:17:42 i'm kind of amazed that htc didn't put a 3.5mm headphone jack on the phone... i mean, really... in this day and age... Sep 30 14:18:05 well the give the usb adapter. Sep 30 14:18:12 adapters suck Sep 30 14:18:13 they* Sep 30 14:18:17 true Sep 30 14:18:51 what's the storage/expansion situation like on the g1? Sep 30 14:18:51 Dougie187: they give it unless you preorder Sep 30 14:18:59 Benddd: sdhc microsd Sep 30 14:19:03 Disconnect: true Sep 30 14:19:04 cool Sep 30 14:19:17 the adapter really isn't that bad Sep 30 14:19:29 even nokia (eventually) learned not to use the adapter. Sep 30 14:19:46 but i was expecting it, friend was a long-time htc fanboy (until he got the iphone 3g) Sep 30 14:19:54 i hope the price of an unlocked g1 is reasonable in a month or so Sep 30 14:20:13 htc does make nice hardware Sep 30 14:20:17 i don't think 400 is that bad. Sep 30 14:20:41 Benddd: it won't be reasonable for at least 90 days, at which point unlocked used units will start turning up Sep 30 14:20:49 (90 days from release) Sep 30 14:26:15 gotcha Sep 30 14:26:49 i'm interesting in doing some app development for the phone... i know that you can publish an app to their store, but is there a way to distribute your application w/o using the store? Sep 30 14:29:54 buonasera Sep 30 14:30:01 \addone Sep 30 14:47:48 snadge: going by the specs on http://www.htc.com/www/product/g1/specification.html, it won't work on Telstra Next-G Sep 30 14:48:41 thats okay.. next-g is mainly for rural areas, the capital cities all have 2100 Sep 30 14:49:19 km-: wifi in Australia is just a superset of the channels in the US. The freqs for the common channels are the same and fully compatible. Sep 30 14:50:06 snadge: yep, 2100 should be fine for non-next-g 3g stuff here in .au Sep 30 14:51:01 what do you mean non-next-g .. you still get reasonable internet i take it? Sep 30 14:52:33 hi rwhitby suprised to see you in here Sep 30 14:52:48 gambler: why surprised? Sep 30 14:53:52 rwhitby, I thought you were mostly working on OM...you maintain MokoMakeFile right? Sep 30 14:54:33 gambler: I do, but I keep an eye on all "open" (to various levels) phone technology Sep 30 14:56:20 rwhitby: anyone working to put android on the freerunner? Sep 30 14:56:42 km-: bit difficult without the source code, since FR is armv4 Sep 30 14:57:05 that makes sense ....well I hope I can get a G1 soon. Some friends are visiting from Cali in 6 weeks so hopefully they will bring with Sep 30 15:00:00 gambler: and then what, mug them? :) Sep 30 15:00:48 we need a charlie rose for G1 ;) Sep 30 15:03:57 ? Sep 30 15:04:09 Disconnect, no :) Sep 30 15:04:21 just checking Sep 30 15:06:06 np...I couldnt really think of a clever response. Its 1am and my build files are driving me crazy Sep 30 15:06:55 time to wrap it up soon and go watch an episode of Terminator the Sarah Connor Chronicles Sep 30 15:07:16 it was a strange episode last night Sep 30 15:07:23 good though Sep 30 15:08:08 ding Sep 30 15:08:17 * gambler leaves evil computer Sep 30 15:26:03 anyone here actually have one yet? Sep 30 15:26:16 quite a few people. googlers, for instance. Sep 30 15:27:08 thats why i said 'here' :) Sep 30 15:27:25 there are googlers here :) Sep 30 15:27:34 what's a google? Sep 30 15:27:58 a unit of measure? Sep 30 15:28:04 fair enough. anyone try google reader with it yet? (or will we be reduced to the iphone theme?) Sep 30 15:28:30 i dont personally use reader, so, no :P Sep 30 15:28:53 google reader sucks, frankly ;) Sep 30 15:29:09 way better RSS aggregators out there Sep 30 15:29:11 hmm. without having to get too neck-deep in relearning java ;) is there an emulator/sdk edition for testing webapps? Sep 30 15:29:27 Disconnect: there is no special "editions" of the SDK Sep 30 15:29:29 jasta: web based? Sep 30 15:29:31 there are* Sep 30 15:29:40 cbeust_: no, web based aggregation is stupid :) Sep 30 15:29:41 jasta: i was a big fan of ttrss but converted for the iphone/javascript-enabled mobile version of google reader. Sep 30 15:30:08 especially for mobile devices. you want passive synchronization, although i guess now with gears you can have that Sep 30 15:30:10 jasta: over the week, I use about four different computers. Online rss readers are a necessity Sep 30 15:30:21 cbeust_: i just use my cell phone for RSS Sep 30 15:30:23 jasta: web-based (or at least servre-side) aggregation is great depending on your use-case. (I want to read it once, from multiple places,m without missing stories because my latop was turned off overnight) Sep 30 15:31:48 jasta: and (backtracking a bit) I know there aren't special editions. i'm just asking if there is a suggested (or even workable) way to test webapps and sites for the device before we -have- the device. (partially for me, mostly for work - we're adding a mobile view and it'd be nice if it worked on something other than the half-dozen iphones floating around) Sep 30 15:32:32 Disconnect: the emulator should give you a very good idea of what the pages will look like on the browser Sep 30 15:33:01 if i could show s60 emulator, nokia web tablet and android using the same backend view then chances are good i could convince the powers that be that an iphone app is the wrong way and a js-enabled mobile view gains us more (and i've got the s60 emu, 2 s60 phones and the tablets already..) Sep 30 15:33:09 the emulator includes a web browser, so, uhh, yeah. Sep 30 15:33:27 cool. diving waist-deep into the docs to get the emulator+browser working is much more doable :) Sep 30 15:33:29 ok wasn't sure Sep 30 15:33:57 lots of times the sdks don't include any proprietary apps (so even if there is a bare-bones browser it won't have flash, for example) so i thought i'd ask before i got deep into it Sep 30 15:34:22 Disconnect: it's indeed the case for the sdk, but the browser is part of it Sep 30 15:36:26 lol. for the record, it looks like google reader is sent in the iphone flavor (at least using the sdk browser) Sep 30 15:36:48 and our site @ work renders pretty well without modification, so (sigh) taht might hurt my case Sep 30 15:36:50 How does it look? (never tried) Sep 30 15:37:11 http://googlereader.blogspot.com/2008/05/brand-new-google-reader-for-iphone.html basically Sep 30 15:37:19 rounded and touchable Sep 30 15:37:23 its pretty nice actually Sep 30 15:38:10 and its interactive 'enough' with ajax Sep 30 15:39:11 shows headlines, then stories expand in-place (and you can click out to the full page in a new window) Sep 30 15:41:44 Actually I just tried Reader on the device and indeed, it works well. Nice. Sep 30 15:46:06 the iphone reader interface works great on the android browser Sep 30 15:46:10 I use it a _lot_ Sep 30 15:46:21 does it use gears? Sep 30 15:46:30 it doesn't seem to Sep 30 15:46:37 boo :) Sep 30 15:46:58 a *wicked* lot Sep 30 15:47:08 well, there's no gears for iphone and afaik they didn't make any changes for android Sep 30 15:47:15 yah it looks identical Sep 30 15:47:18 that sort of stuff is coming, I'm sure Sep 30 15:47:41 i dont like active rss...i dont want to wait for my phone to download my stories, i just want to go read them Sep 30 15:47:43 (which, for the record, also works on nokia's new phones - i use it on e90 all the time. the standard mobile site is a basic html-forms mess, totally annoying) Sep 30 15:48:07 oh cool, I wonder if the fancy ajaxy reader works on my e61 now too Sep 30 15:48:26 just use the same url (google.com/reader/i) Sep 30 15:48:27 jasta: agree, but I still think that fully in sync whatever the computer I'm using is more important than instant access Sep 30 15:49:15 same here Sep 30 15:49:26 I don't mind loading rss articles as I read them Sep 30 15:49:39 the benefit of the reading list being in sync with my desktop machine's is more than worth it Sep 30 15:49:52 Particularly fast especially with the newly deployed 3G TMobile network in the Bay Area Sep 30 15:52:39 yawn Sep 30 15:52:42 yizzle Sep 30 15:52:45 how fast is their 3G network? has anyone benchmarked? Sep 30 15:52:49 its too early for work :( Sep 30 15:53:00 in boston it seems to be 'fast enough that I don't bother with wifi' generally Sep 30 15:53:00 It varies a lot Sep 30 15:53:01 AT&T's in Seattle is typically around 400-600kbps. Sep 30 15:53:07 from 300 to 1200k Sep 30 15:53:15 is there a benchmark site i can test on? Sep 30 15:53:16 probably because it's in the early stages and has very few users Sep 30 15:53:21 jeffb: yes, there's mobile speed test Sep 30 15:53:27 jeffb: yes, hold on Sep 30 15:53:29 whats the url Sep 30 15:53:33 ill test in boston Sep 30 15:53:34 http://www.dslreports.com/mspeed Sep 30 15:53:37 heh, yeah ... I wonder how bogged-down the network will be when it's full of users Sep 30 15:53:50 Here is one: http://i.dslr.net/iphone_speedtest.html Sep 30 15:54:04 * benley was about to bust that out but sees that jeffb is already doing it Sep 30 15:54:50 my app needs anything over 128kbps ;) Sep 30 15:55:09 although i bet my app will get throttled/shut down by T-Mobile. what a bunch of ass hats. Sep 30 15:55:14 I've been streaming 128k mp3s via http with the phone in my pocket, if that means anything useful Sep 30 15:55:15 lol Sep 30 15:55:35 benley: well i do that currently on my AT&T phone all the time Sep 30 15:55:39 jasta: yes, streaming is frowned upon Sep 30 15:55:44 in fact, i wrote a test app that is basically a trimmed down Five client for Windows Mobile Sep 30 15:55:50 jasta: yeah, in theory that should work with EDGE too Sep 30 15:56:03 benley: yeah, but with EDGE the connection is too unstable. Sep 30 15:56:06 right Sep 30 15:56:06 i tested that too Sep 30 15:56:55 cbeust_: i'd be happy to develop an app that intentionally uses right up to their limits every single month ;) Sep 30 15:57:50 bbl, off to work Sep 30 15:57:51 later folks Sep 30 15:58:33 my device measured 460kbps on cbeust's test Sep 30 15:58:43 Sounds right Sep 30 15:58:55 tried again and it got 497kbps Sep 30 15:59:24 lets try the other one Sep 30 16:00:01 hey the opened-in-new-window animation is pretty slick Sep 30 16:00:23 Yup, tab browsing ftw Sep 30 16:00:28 yeah, I'm sure people will be all "AAAA NOT AS SHINY AS IPHONE" though Sep 30 16:01:37 the other one is 435kbit on a 1mb file Sep 30 16:01:38 i haven't seen anything with the apparent crispness of the iphone display yet (although i don't have a g1 so...) except maybe the new psp. Sep 30 16:03:03 jeffb: you have an iphone and a g1 on your desk, compare :) Sep 30 16:03:10 which is funny because apple blurs the shit out of their text Sep 30 16:03:14 annoys the shit out of me Sep 30 16:03:16 yah i know Sep 30 16:03:35 people talk about using it as an ebook reader (i've got a cybook, fyi don't get one, they are -way- too fragile for release into the world..) but ugh Sep 30 16:04:18 * benley shrugs Sep 30 16:04:30 quit Sep 30 16:04:38 jeffb, benley: morning Sep 30 16:06:32 ..unclear on the concept. "Requires: Win 2K/03/XP/Vista" - http://androidcommunity.com/forums/androidmarket_view.php?catid=12&linkid=54 Sep 30 16:06:40 TUTTLES Sep 30 16:06:41 I dunno, both displays are nice and sharp Sep 30 16:07:06 benley and i just compared iphone vs g1 head to head, you really cant tell the difference except for the size difference Sep 30 16:07:11 the iphone's is a lot more yellow (they set the color temperature somewhere around 6500k, whereas the android one is more blue) Sep 30 16:07:22 the iphone's screen is bigger, which I didn't realize until just now Sep 30 16:07:26 but they're both nice and sharp :) Sep 30 16:07:28 JEFFBEEEEEEEEEEEE Sep 30 16:08:16 every time i've seen them close they looked like the same size screen. i should go dig out dimensions. Sep 30 16:08:25 jeffb: how are you? Sep 30 16:08:51 romainguy: hey Sep 30 16:09:01 yo Sep 30 16:09:17 romainguy: how's it going? Sep 30 16:09:44 just got 1099kbps on i.dslr.net Sep 30 16:11:59 damn. esato has a great phone comparitor (including sizes and such) but its not updated for g1 yet Sep 30 16:14:26 gdsx: I've made a few measurements at 1200 as well, but it's not going to last I bet Sep 30 16:23:41 * Disconnect is in DC - no 3g love here :( Sep 30 16:24:53 Cedric2: yeah, probably not Sep 30 16:25:04 anyone notice SAX acting differently in 1.0? Sep 30 17:02:47 jeffb: those benchmarks are just about what i et with AT&T... Sep 30 17:02:53 maybe a hair worse Sep 30 17:03:30 i was secretly hoping since T-Mobile's network was new they might have some augmented bandwidth :( Sep 30 17:03:52 Disconnect: what about verizon 3G? Sep 30 17:04:19 verizon is pretty fast out here yah Sep 30 17:04:29 Sprint devices I've seen get up to 1mbps. Sep 30 17:04:32 are their detailed hardware specs for the g1 anywhere? Sep 30 17:04:41 fearphage: what level of detail are you after? Sep 30 17:04:55 the chipset that it uses for wifi connectivity Sep 30 17:05:45 or perhaps my question has been asked numerous times already, does the g1 support monitor/promiscuous mode? Sep 30 17:06:14 anyone gotten a shell running yet? (and for that matter, is tmob/google really gonna be -that- hands-off in their marketplace approval? shell tools, sim unlockers, etc...) Sep 30 17:07:15 the t-mobile network is kind of annoying.. they do some tricks on port 80 Sep 30 17:10:31 yeah they have fancy transparent caching proxies and such Sep 30 17:11:38 benley: yep, we were trying to pull down a chunked response for ShopSavvy, and their proxy was buffering everything up and wouldn't flush the pipe until the remote connection closed. Sep 30 17:12:47 yuck Sep 30 17:13:19 I bet it seemed like a good idea at the time Sep 30 17:16:33 anything public yet about shopsavvy's expected pricing? (i'm hoping for "free but sponsored" of course :) ..) Sep 30 17:17:06 umdk1d3 originally said his AndroidScan (now renamed) was going to be open source Sep 30 17:17:12 we'll see how his good fortune has corrupted him :) Sep 30 17:17:32 heh Sep 30 17:18:04 anyone here have a standard reusable about dialog lying around? Sep 30 17:19:50 shopsavvy will be free, but not opensource afaik Sep 30 17:21:22 I take it the silence means "no", Ill develop one myself then Sep 30 17:22:19 I think we should start to collect some standard components, dialogs and apps though, I find I'm developing them myself far too often Sep 30 17:22:53 anyone agree or know about such an effort? Sep 30 17:23:25 pjv: don't most other dev kits start with a simple "here's an app, here's a main window, fill in the about page, here's the menu" etc..? maybe a new "new app" template for eclipse is needed with all that stuff covered. Sep 30 17:23:41 jasta: ? Sep 30 17:24:09 Disconnect, yep, an app that has the most-used components already Sep 30 17:24:26 jasta: it may be because im sitting in an area with crappy reception (5th floor of a 15 story building) Sep 30 17:24:32 surrounded by other buildings Sep 30 17:24:34 like a menu, a texview and an edittext in a linearlayout, a preferences window, etc Sep 30 17:24:44 istr the palm sdk (back in 98/99) pretty much started as a "hello world" app with the event loop and such all stubbed out Sep 30 17:26:39 an about dialog that is reusable would be useful for lots of people for starters I believe Sep 30 17:26:54 as gnome/gtk has too Sep 30 17:26:58 yah Sep 30 17:27:34 a main window on the project/app, a list of people who contributed, license info, etc Sep 30 17:29:12 hmmmm http://software.jessies.org/terminator/ wonder if thats a decent place to start relearning java (and learning android) Sep 30 17:31:01 Disconnect, I'm not sure what you mean, are you looking to start/translate a project in/into Android? Sep 30 17:31:12 pondering porting that over Sep 30 17:31:35 javapassion.com is the best java learning resource Sep 30 17:31:41 cuz once a decent terminal is available its -really- open Sep 30 17:32:00 I'm not sure if a terminal is the app you want on a phone Sep 30 17:32:46 I might be proven wrong very soon but in my phone-universe there is no place for a terminal currently Sep 30 17:33:45 Disconnect, I think there are lots of (atomically) small but very useful projects possible though for Android Sep 30 17:34:07 esp with a keyboard, terminal turns it from a shiny phone into a small linux laptop. Sep 30 17:34:54 the nice thing about Android is that the about dialog in itself could be an app for example Sep 30 17:34:57 instead of porting a bunch of preexisting apps (think ssh) the commandline versions work and the ports and new app 'effort' can go into the gui Sep 30 17:35:02 I was just thinking about that Sep 30 17:35:31 isn't ssh written in C? Sep 30 17:36:15 yep Sep 30 17:36:34 there are several ssh clients written in java Sep 30 17:36:36 (there are java ssh apps but effectively yes, there iare a couple of nice fast arm-friendly ssh apps in C) Sep 30 17:36:41 including sshd Sep 30 17:38:07 with SDK 1.0, is it actually possible to communicate with tcp between two emulators (one should be the server, the other the client) ? Sep 30 17:43:05 ha, finally someone reviewed the -qemu bug/issue Sep 30 17:43:44 thinair: telnet to your emu and use redir or somthing, so you can forward the ports Sep 30 17:45:16 ok, i will try.. Sep 30 17:45:18 real device should support it ? communication between two devices.. and one as a server ? Sep 30 17:47:19 i hope so ;) Sep 30 17:49:09 tric : thanks it help me a lot ! I was not sure to go in a bad direction.. Sep 30 18:00:31 not to ask a stupid question, btu does chris haseman hang out here? Sep 30 18:01:09 * Disconnect wants to find out if 'pro android' will have an index or if it'll go the road of 'pulling strings with puppet' (diff't author, same pub) and be effectively worthless after the first read :/ Sep 30 18:02:14 Is that a book? Sep 30 18:02:21 ya Sep 30 18:02:39 * Cedric2 would stay away of any book coming up too quickly after 1.0 Sep 30 18:03:23 apress is famous for having fast, reasonably good books that on cutting-edge tech. but (according to auth of the puppet book) they cut corners if they don't expect huge sales. Sep 30 18:03:39 (wanna buy a puppet book? cheap? great intro, then useless cuz of lack of index :( ..) Sep 30 18:03:48 We've changed so many API's in the past months that I would make sure the book is at least covering 0.9 Sep 30 18:03:58 which is reasonably close to 1.0 Sep 30 18:04:23 $35 Annual Subscription for Commosware Mark Murphy's book. Sep 30 18:04:47 http://apress.com/book/view/9781430210641 not sure which sdk ver it covers. Sep 30 18:04:50 Greetings. Sep 30 18:04:51 obviously not 1.0 :) Sep 30 18:05:16 Mark Murphy is the best Sep 30 18:05:33 * Disconnect doesn't pay "subscription fees" for books Sep 30 18:07:40 murphy keeps the forums alive Sep 30 18:07:43 Android Essential is M5 base Sep 30 18:07:59 Yuck Sep 30 18:09:56 what would be the best way to wait a couple of seconds during functional instrumentation? Sep 30 18:10:45 i followed jasta's advise ......using only Mark Murphy's Busy Coder Guide, Anddev.org and developerlife.com Sep 30 18:11:32 why do you need books when the docs are great? (afaik these books just somewhat copy the docs) Sep 30 18:12:00 how come we can only declare two applications to have the same user id? Sep 30 18:13:48 agree pjv, i don;t know about others but as beginner I am finding docs difficult to understand...... Sep 30 18:14:12 or i should say difficult to follow Sep 30 18:15:43 read most of the links on the lefthand side of the android site and you'll probably know as much or more as from the books Sep 30 18:16:30 if you've done the Notepad tutorials (and the api demos version) and can explain why everything is done that way, then that's it basically Sep 30 18:19:41 well, i would have loved some books covering the internals, like dalvik vs sun vm. background of jni and stuff. Sep 30 18:20:17 There's a 1-hour talk on the android site for Dalvik vs. JVM Sep 30 18:20:38 JNI is generic (and not officially supported as a mode of development in the 1.0 release). Sep 30 18:22:06 i know this talk. and well, not only jni, but discovering the c api to logcat earlier would have helped me alot Sep 30 18:23:26 and btw, jni is not supported. but in those talks developer are adviced to actually use jni for cpu intensive tasks Sep 30 18:24:09 I believe it states that JNI *is* used for CPU-intensive tasks, reducing the need for a JIT for common apps. Sep 30 18:24:48 I don't think they actually recommend that you plan on using it. Sep 30 18:25:54 JNI is not supported in 1.0, wait for the official support Sep 30 18:26:39 romainguy: what are the reasons for the missing support. cause it seems to work in sdk just fine Sep 30 18:27:09 where do you put your .so? Sep 30 18:27:35 into the apk and local app paths. Sep 30 18:27:43 working really great Sep 30 18:27:47 anyway Sep 30 18:27:53 compatibility is not guaranteed Sep 30 18:27:58 your app will probably break with the next update Sep 30 18:28:02 which sucks both for you and the users Sep 30 18:28:30 yeah, i first thought that is a showstopper, im putting it as a raw resource into the apk and "extract" it into the app writable directory. Sep 30 18:29:12 romainguy: well, my app is for research only. and i needed jni. its just for my interested why you didnt include it. Sep 30 18:29:54 tric: using System.load() to pull it in manually from an absolute path? Sep 30 18:30:10 tric: because we didn't have time to get a native SDK ready for 1.0 and it wasn't a priority Sep 30 18:30:18 again, compatibility is not guaranteed Sep 30 18:30:21 romainguy: ah ok. ;) Sep 30 18:31:05 fadden: lamme check, i wrote it months ago ;) Sep 30 18:31:18 ok, weeks Sep 30 18:33:02 fadden: yeah, exactly System.load(context.getFileStreamPath(jniLibName).getAbsolutePath()) Sep 30 18:34:24 pawalls: yo, you around? Sep 30 18:34:49 one disadvantage using this method, the lib exists twice on your device, in the apk and in the filesystem. but mine is small anyway Sep 30 18:35:04 tric: that's a nice way to quickly run out of internal storage :) Sep 30 18:35:22 tric: you could design a system to download the library from somewhere else Sep 30 18:35:34 but your approach is possibly better. Sep 30 18:35:50 romainguy: how much internal storage is there btw? i've heard some conflicting answers... Sep 30 18:36:02 i thought it was 192MB + 1GB SD included? Sep 30 18:36:29 jasta: my lib isnt public, so loading it from somewhere is no choice, and it extends needed bw aswell Sep 30 18:36:54 my device tells me I have 76 MB in /data Sep 30 18:36:59 25 MB of which are free Sep 30 18:37:31 is it possible to display an activity inside another activity? Sep 30 18:37:38 romainguy: yes, sadly. i used adb push to /system/lib before, but that sucked for my dev process ;) Sep 30 18:37:51 besides, you can't do that on an actual phone Sep 30 18:37:59 yes. Sep 30 18:38:24 but unless you send me one, i dont think ill "ever" get one. Sep 30 18:38:37 buy one on October 22nd :) Sep 30 18:39:21 hehe, im not in the us. i dont have 400$ for spare, and my android work will prolly be over December 27th ;) Sep 30 18:40:22 but actually in my dreams my company buys me one end of october, we will see Sep 30 18:42:09 is it possible to start an Activity instrumentation with an Intent? Sep 30 18:45:29 the Acticity seems to be initialized within the constructor so there isn't any way to do append an intent directly from ActicityInstrumentationTestCase Sep 30 19:26:14 now that you guys have had a chance to really get to know android, is it possible to intercept calls before the phone starts ringing and have some business logic run to determine whether or not to send the call straight to voice mail? Sep 30 19:26:37 maybe one of you google guys will have to answer that? Sep 30 19:30:08 maybe locale will have some of this functionality? Sep 30 19:31:54 you can listen on a call... i don't know about hanging up on it Sep 30 19:32:05 for* Sep 30 19:32:37 I don't want to hang up on it, just block the phone from ringing by sending it to voicemail Sep 30 19:33:05 say it's after midnight and unless it is an emergency I want all calls to go to voicemail so it doesn't wake me up Sep 30 19:33:10 that feature is in the contacts Sep 30 19:33:27 really? Sep 30 19:33:40 pardom: what about procedurally generating a ring tone based on who is calling? Sep 30 19:33:40 how does it determine if it is an emergency? Sep 30 19:34:16 ah... didn't see your "emergency" scenario Sep 30 19:34:33 how would you determine an "emergency" anyway? Sep 30 19:34:56 romainguy, can you answer my question? You seem to have a good grasp on the capabilities of android Sep 30 19:35:06 I have an extremely urgent need to sell you an auto warranty! Sep 30 19:35:06 pardom: that's what he just asked :) Sep 30 19:36:14 one other question I have is about "visual voicemail" Sep 30 19:36:26 does android have that capability with the g1? Sep 30 19:36:37 I know it's possible, I just don't know if it is implemented Sep 30 19:38:14 tethridge: idk what is visual voice mail? Sep 30 19:38:26 * hagna <-- not a google Sep 30 19:38:28 it's a feature of the iphone Sep 30 19:38:38 that narrows it down Sep 30 19:38:43 is anyone developing any social games for android Sep 30 19:38:44 like tag Sep 30 19:38:45 tethridge: tmob would have to implement that on their end Sep 30 19:38:50 you can see a listing of all your voicemail and listen to them in whatever order you wish Sep 30 19:38:58 not necessarily Sep 30 19:38:58 gives you a list of all voicemail messages, so you can decide which to listen to Sep 30 19:39:01 oh Sep 30 19:39:02 tethridge: ahh ok cool Sep 30 19:39:02 or you could develop an app, but it wouldn't be reliable Sep 30 19:39:27 if you phone implemented an answering machine it could do it Sep 30 19:39:34 s/you/your/ Sep 30 19:39:35 tethridge meant: if your phone implemented an answering machine it could do it Sep 30 19:39:36 yep Sep 30 19:39:55 it would take up storage on your phone Sep 30 19:40:25 yeah, but not much. I think the bigger problem would be when you are without service Sep 30 19:40:44 yea for the 1 - 5 minutes they leave a message ha Sep 30 19:41:19 i dunno if tmob does call forwarding, but it could be forwarded to a service that handles that Sep 30 19:43:31 tmob does forwarding but charges minutes (might be 2x minutes, i don't recall) Sep 30 19:43:51 i figured. my carrier does the same Sep 30 19:44:49 one ghetto way of doing it is: Sep 30 19:45:08 store all missed calls in a sqlite db and show them in the list Sep 30 19:45:26 click on the 3rd one in the list i calls your vm and dials 1-7-7-7 Sep 30 19:45:37 or whatever keys it needs to get to the message Sep 30 19:46:05 that makes the pretty strong assumption that not only did everyone leave a message but you don't mind blindly deleting the ones in your way :) Sep 30 19:46:38 well... you should get a notification of a vm Sep 30 19:46:55 dunno if you can listen for that but maybe Sep 30 19:47:13 right but htat just says "there is a message waiting" it never says "now there are 2" Sep 30 19:47:24 LISTEN_MESSAGE_WAITING_INDICATOR Sep 30 19:47:49 so clear it when a message comes in and show a custom Notification Sep 30 19:47:54 I guess the google guys are still at lunch Sep 30 19:48:00 that way you get a count Sep 30 19:48:06 meh, i said it was ghetto Sep 30 19:48:20 can you clear it from the phone? i thought the network would reassert it periodically Sep 30 19:48:56 i dont see why not... i can manually clear it on my crappy LG flip Sep 30 19:52:47 i could also, 'way back when' but istr that tmob resent it every 6-24 hours regardless of message count Sep 30 19:53:32 (a few times it resulted in the 'new message' alert in the dark hours while i was on call :( ..) Sep 30 19:54:42 eh, well i guess the idea of visual voicemail is non-existent on android until carriers provide it then Sep 30 19:57:16 I was thinking earlier that to have a an equal amount of space as an iPhone for your music you are going to have buy another microSD card which makes the g1 more expensive Sep 30 19:57:37 at least for the 8gb iPhone Sep 30 19:57:56 8gb micro sd is less than $30 online Sep 30 19:57:56 most 8gb cards are about $30 - $40 I think Sep 30 19:58:05 froogle that shit Sep 30 19:58:06 I bought an 8 GB micro sd for about 25$ Sep 30 19:58:09 less than 20? Sep 30 19:58:25 romainguy, hey Sep 30 19:58:34 is 8GB the biggest? Sep 30 19:58:41 on the g1 yes Sep 30 19:58:42 you can get 16gb ones now. Sep 30 19:58:43 can you answer my question about the ability to intercept calls? Sep 30 19:58:44 and the plan is still cheaper than iPhone's Sep 30 19:58:44 you can get 16 Sep 30 19:58:47 so on the long run... Sep 30 19:58:59 long run the g1 is better Sep 30 19:59:03 pardom: 16's don't work on the G1? Sep 30 19:59:05 and 16gb sandisk cards do indeed work in the g1 Sep 30 19:59:14 (others probably do too, but I haven't seen any of them) Sep 30 19:59:22 i dunno... tmob said you can expand it up to 8 Sep 30 19:59:54 benley: 16gb does work? Sep 30 19:59:55 pardom: they said that probably because they thought >8 didn't exist :-P Sep 30 19:59:59 pardom: thats cuz nobody is official with 16 yet Sep 30 20:00:06 zhobbs: yeah, I've heard directly from someone who tested a 16gb card. Sep 30 20:00:06 gotcha Sep 30 20:00:25 and afaik if it supports 8 then it will support 16, the sdhc spec is kinda all-or-nothing Sep 30 20:00:31 yeah, pretty much Sep 30 20:00:34 tethridge: what do you want to do with phone calls? Sep 30 20:00:49 (supposedly if it supports 4g but there are some non-sdhc 4g that work in things like the nokia 770, a non-sdhc platform..) Sep 30 20:00:53 a good use case is preventing drunk dialing. :-) Sep 30 20:01:13 lol Sep 30 20:01:17 lets say that I want to send all calls that aren't from members of my "family" contact list to voicemail if it is after 10:00 PM Sep 30 20:01:26 ok Sep 30 20:01:32 I have no idea whether you can do this :) Sep 30 20:01:38 ask on the mailing list ^^ Sep 30 20:01:41 ok Sep 30 20:02:05 tethridge: i assume you can Sep 30 20:02:32 you would have to be able to hook into the software that accepts the call Sep 30 20:02:36 you can listen for calls, and if you can set contacts to go straight to voice mail through the contacts i assume you can do that programatically too Sep 30 20:03:08 tethridge: neat idea btw Sep 30 20:03:43 thanks Sep 30 20:04:26 should be able to invert it also - these people cannot call while i'm out drinking and bitching about work :) Sep 30 20:04:39 true Sep 30 20:05:25 tethridge: you might be able to do that without worrying about intercepting calls Sep 30 20:05:41 in the contacts list there is a flag for each contact for "go straight to voicemail" Sep 30 20:05:53 might just set/unset those flags with an alarm manager Sep 30 20:06:39 I was just thinking something similar Sep 30 20:06:52 this functionality would be good to add into the contact list Sep 30 20:07:14 so when that setting is requested from the contacts app, it could run the business logic to determine the state Sep 30 20:07:52 no tethridge: the alarm manager would set it at 10:00 to go to vm Sep 30 20:08:57 sure Sep 30 20:09:11 I guess I'll need to play with that some Sep 30 20:09:56 so what's the path to get my app on a G1? do I upload it to google's market place and then ppl are free to dl or can it go straight to the phone over usb or something? Sep 30 20:10:14 both Sep 30 20:10:32 i have the same question about getting it on the market place Sep 30 20:10:37 what's the procedure Sep 30 20:10:49 It will be explained in time Sep 30 20:10:54 ahh ok Sep 30 20:10:56 You can also make the app available on a web site Sep 30 20:11:34 I was about to say that Sep 30 20:11:52 romainguy: both nice Sep 30 20:12:39 one thing I don't like about cel phones is that they don't work so great when everyone is calling 911 at once Sep 30 20:13:00 hagna: yah but neither do land-lines Sep 30 20:13:05 Are there any google engineers here who know about the battery apis/intents? Sep 30 20:13:06 Disconnect: ham radios Sep 30 20:13:36 hello Sep 30 20:14:15 zhobbs: (kinda late comment) the only issue with automatically "manually" changing that flag is you need to intercept user changes and alter one fo the profiles ('no-work' or 'last state') Sep 30 20:14:58 hagna: ham radios only work better because of the limited number of operators vs number of available freqs/channels. Sep 30 20:15:35 Disconnect: and there is also the not tied to a repeater/cel tower aspect Sep 30 20:15:42 true Sep 30 20:16:19 Disconnect: not sure I follow Sep 30 20:16:34 so when will you have an android app for controlling a radio via g1? :) Sep 30 20:17:48 zhobbs: say i activate profile "no-work" to drop calls from my boss and coworkers. it goes in, saves the prev state of the flag for those accounts and then sets it to "drop". then I say "oh but james might call" and uncheck it on james - does it get saved permanently, on the "no-work" profile or just ignored? Sep 30 20:19:05 or go the other way - say i check a new account while that profile is active. if you ignore my actions completely it'll never uncheck -- thats suboptimal, I may expect "when i turn off the no-work profile it lets people call again".. Sep 30 20:19:54 I would assume it's a one time exception I guess, and if you wanted to change it permanently you'd do it in the profile settings Sep 30 20:20:52 there's a couple of use-cases there though, one of which is just a user who migrates from profile to profile and never "turns it off".. but even with the temporary case, unless you record the flag for each contact entry (and that could be thousands) you need to watch for the state change somehow instead. Sep 30 20:21:33 * Disconnect thinks its a cool idea Sep 30 20:22:13 yeah, but for when I'm ignoring some calls I don't want it to go straight to voicemail, I want it to ring for a while Sep 30 20:22:20 then go to voicemail Sep 30 20:22:45 thats something i had wondered about. although "my phone was off" (or out of range) works for that case Sep 30 20:22:52 so long as you never ever tell anyone you are the developer of that app :) Sep 30 20:23:05 cuz as soon as you do, anytime you miss a call people are gonna take it personally :) Sep 30 20:24:37 ooooh and it'd need an (optional) override mode - "if a number calls more than x times, allow it through" Sep 30 20:25:03 ahh...then you have to monitor incoming calls...and we're not sure if that's possible Sep 30 20:25:21 if you flip that flag you don't get a missed-call notification? Sep 30 20:25:39 * Disconnect hasn't gotten particularly far into the sdk yet, still just reading the intro docs Sep 30 20:25:39 hmm, don't know Sep 30 20:26:41 you could listen for calls and just count them from that number, then when you reach your max change the flag Sep 30 20:28:13 then that crazy girl would still get through after calling you 15 times Sep 30 20:28:15 :-) Sep 30 20:28:44 i missed the important part, but this sounds like a very interesting application :) Sep 30 20:28:53 crazy girl / booty call Sep 30 20:29:25 is this some kind of application that sits on top of the core system managing calls or a replacement for it ? Sep 30 20:29:39 on the same kind of lines, I was thinking that an app called "DumbPhone" would be good...it makes it so you can just dial/recieve calls Sep 30 20:29:53 * tethridge imagines custom pbx like messages. "If this is a booty call, press 1..." Sep 30 20:30:03 cause sometimes you're out with people and you get a notification about an email, etc Sep 30 20:30:14 ha Sep 30 20:31:58 you would need crazy girl CAPTCHA tho Sep 30 20:32:09 http://gizmodo.com/5056476/why-android-will-soon-kick-ass# <- the press is getting better and better Sep 30 20:32:30 pardom: "If you want some of {bob}'s hair in a locket, press 3" "I'm sorry, this call is too insane for this caller. Please try your call again saner." Sep 30 20:32:56 lol Sep 30 20:35:51 * Disconnect likes "I'm sorry, your call could not be completed while psycho. Please try your call again saner." but couldn't find the wording in time :) Sep 30 20:36:42 ooooh someone needs to start porting asterisk and flite :) Sep 30 20:36:54 course, there is already a nice fast flite for arm but its in native C Sep 30 20:40:28 hi anyone using android on zaurus? Sep 30 20:41:46 man, that's a product from the past. I haven't heard mention of it in a long time Sep 30 20:41:54 :( Sep 30 20:42:01 it was a nice product back then Sep 30 20:42:13 yeah, I remember reading about it Sep 30 20:42:15 been playing with the an old beta of android on it Sep 30 20:42:17 afair its been done but not in any reasonable/useful way Sep 30 20:42:22 ah maybe that was you i was reading Sep 30 20:42:30 nope Sep 30 20:42:43 but I bet we read the same stuff Sep 30 20:42:47 heh Sep 30 20:42:57 got a fully patched kernel Sep 30 20:43:07 but on init > seg fault Sep 30 20:43:08 :( Sep 30 20:43:09 * Disconnect has a c760 he wouldn't mind charging up again Sep 30 20:43:14 :) Sep 30 20:43:18 I have c750 Sep 30 20:43:37 I can provide working kernel with modules if you care Sep 30 20:43:52 I installed a base angstrom Sep 30 20:44:06 newer patched kernel on top of it Sep 30 20:44:39 and found a slc3200 android root that I unpacked to sd Sep 30 20:44:41 gonna hold off on the biggest efforts until i have my g1 Sep 30 20:44:46 0.9 beta Sep 30 20:44:55 oh Sep 30 20:44:56 * Disconnect is prolly gonna focus on a terminal app first. Sep 30 20:44:58 I'm in france Sep 30 20:45:02 :( Sep 30 20:45:05 so no g1 for quite some long ass time Sep 30 20:45:08 un français ! :) Sep 30 20:45:13 yup Sep 30 20:45:18 There are a few of us on this channel already Sep 30 20:45:47 might be able to swing an import deal if you get enough people. freqs are prolly wrong (at least for 3g) but.. Sep 30 20:46:03 that's true that zaurus are things of the past it still hasn't finished dding a 80 megs ext2 image since I'm talking there Sep 30 20:48:32 salve Sep 30 20:57:45 !list Sep 30 21:03:59 quick question, why android.view.Menu has setIcon() method is not available? where android.view.SubMenu does...... Sep 30 21:13:00 tethridge: not really an iphone feature, blackberries have it as well. Sep 30 21:13:16 what feature is that? Sep 30 21:13:16 yikes, my scroll bar was waaay up. Sep 30 21:13:19 disregard. Sep 30 21:13:23 :-) Sep 30 21:15:33 does anyone knows if androids calendar has sync support for evolution? Sep 30 21:15:50 not yet Sep 30 21:16:04 that should be android does not have support yet Sep 30 21:16:25 so, there is already a project for that? Sep 30 21:16:31 it only syncs to gmail at the moment Sep 30 21:16:36 nope Sep 30 21:17:27 k, thanks tethridge Sep 30 21:17:55 np Sep 30 22:02:23 * jasta wonders if it will be a commercial exchange solution or an open source one that wins out on Android... Sep 30 22:02:33 now that M$ has all the docs open, i can't imagine the latter being that hard Sep 30 22:04:25 they could obviously release their own client as they'd make more money on server, exchange, etc licensing than WindowsMobile. Sep 30 22:04:27 but they wont. Sep 30 22:31:58 wandering if anyone can help, i'm trying to find out when you should use @+ in the manifest. I read about it before briefly but didnt save the link. Sep 30 22:32:16 manifest/xml layout files Sep 30 22:34:49 @+ creates an id Sep 30 22:35:04 it's like of like a directive to the parser Sep 30 22:35:09 it's kind of like* Sep 30 22:35:53 do you have a link where ii can read more about it? Sep 30 22:36:02 nope, i just know that to be true :) Sep 30 22:36:15 anyone knows who's taken over the development of undroid? Sep 30 22:36:40 undroid? Sep 30 22:36:51 android netbeans plugin Sep 30 22:36:58 hmm. Sep 30 22:38:33 interesting...wonder what netbeans offers that eclipse or jedit doesnt. Sep 30 22:38:57 for android development or in general? Sep 30 22:40:44 undroid hasn't been updated since january so it doesn't work with the current android release, the website says they've passed it on to a new developer but doesn't mention any details Sep 30 22:54:27 hey Sep 30 22:59:18 sweet, masa was updated Sep 30 23:15:10 does anyone know if MediaPlayer#getCurrentPosition or getDuration are expensive? Sep 30 23:15:28 as in, should i just call them every second to update playing progress or rely on a timer myself? Sep 30 23:16:01 actually nevermind, i have to do that since i can't detect choking Sep 30 23:16:02 couldn't you time them? Sep 30 23:16:34 Dougie187: i just realized i can't, because if the MediaPlayer playing from a stream chokes then each second will not necessarily represent a change in playback position Sep 30 23:17:01 true Sep 30 23:39:02 * jasta looks at re-styling the seek bar to be much sexier Sep 30 23:42:57 wait, i'm no good at this :) Oct 01 00:05:49 umdk1d3: ping Oct 01 00:29:06 zhobbs: so I ran it through the WAF filter and the feedback was (at least by default) if you make a change with a profile on, it should go away when the profile does. so each template is 2 lists - a sticky "forced settings" list ("Joe: no ring, Bob: ring") and a temporary list ("Jan: no ring") - temp list isn't stored between profile swaps. Oct 01 00:29:13 * Disconnect might have to write this thing just to get it out of his head :) Oct 01 00:32:04 romainguy_: I have a ListView, and click on a row launches an Activity. Why would my adapter's getItemId() method get called *after* onPause() ? Oct 01 00:32:28 I don't know, why are you calling it? :) Oct 01 00:32:33 haha Oct 01 00:32:43 use the debugger and see what the stack is Oct 01 00:32:51 it could be the selection resurrection code Oct 01 00:32:55 (thats Wife Acceptance Factor fyi, for any non-english-speakers :) ..) Oct 01 00:33:52 romainguy: VideoLibraryAdapter(CustomCursorAdapter).getItemId(int) line: 69 Oct 01 00:33:52 ListView(AdapterView).rememberSyncState() line: 1082 Oct 01 00:33:52 ListView(AbsListView).onSizeChanged(int, int, int, int) line: 1141 Oct 01 00:34:03 well here you go Oct 01 00:34:15 * jasta really likes the new cat wallpaper :) Oct 01 00:34:20 it's the code that saves the state of the list Oct 01 00:34:23 ok Oct 01 00:34:28 jasta: it's a snow Leopard :) Oct 01 00:34:34 it's gorgeous Oct 01 00:34:36 did you take that? Oct 01 00:34:41 unfortunately no Oct 01 00:34:48 this one and the beach are not mine Oct 01 00:34:48 so, if my adapter is based on a cursor, I'm supposed to deactivate it in onPause() right? Oct 01 00:34:49 is it from planet earth? Oct 01 00:34:57 all others (except the last 3 drawings) are mine Oct 01 00:34:57 (deactivate the Cursor that is) Oct 01 00:35:05 romainguy: is the device gonna ship with some of your work on it? that would be so freaking cool Oct 01 00:35:20 the wallpapers you see are what the device in store will have Oct 01 00:35:24 jasta: yeah, it'll ship with ListView, GridView, etc Oct 01 00:35:26 so yes, it's cool :) Oct 01 00:36:06 i don't have the snow lepoard. Oct 01 00:36:07 :( Oct 01 00:36:27 romainguy: that alone is a cool thing to put on your resume :P Oct 01 00:36:32 ^^ Oct 01 00:36:38 romainguy: you're still on the android team? Oct 01 00:36:47 yes Oct 01 00:36:54 lol Oct 01 00:36:58 ...stil? Oct 01 00:36:59 still* Oct 01 00:37:02 for those interested, here are the high-res version of the Android wallpapers: http://www.flickr.com/photos/romainguy/sets/72157607462733219/ Oct 01 00:37:05 would you expect anything else? Oct 01 00:37:17 nice Oct 01 00:37:32 where's the snowy mountain? i liked that one a lot too Oct 01 00:37:33 Wheres the grass land one taken? Oct 01 00:37:34 lol Oct 01 00:37:44 romainguy: do you get to see any cool phone prototypes from various manufacturers? (i know you can't discuss details) Oct 01 00:37:44 Dougie187: in China Oct 01 00:37:45 all it lacked was a snowboarding racing an avalanche :) Oct 01 00:37:52 soulless: I can't tell :p Oct 01 00:37:58 jasta: http://www.flickr.com/photos/romainguy/61153541/in/set-72157607462733219/ Oct 01 00:38:09 that means the answer is yes ;) Oct 01 00:38:19 blasphemy, these should be on picasa! Oct 01 00:38:33 romainguy: i know it's nothing like yours, but i took a really cool photo when iw as in ireland Oct 01 00:38:39 hang on let me grab the url Oct 01 00:39:04 http://picasaweb.google.com/jasta00/Ireland2008#5249763835446290226 Oct 01 00:39:07 jasta: here are the photos of the Android team member who took the picture of the Snow Leopard http://www.flickr.com/photos/visiglow/ Oct 01 00:39:07 what kinda camera do you have romain? Oct 01 00:39:17 Dougie187: a Canon EOS 30D Oct 01 00:39:33 i take it you like it a lot? Oct 01 00:39:36 jasta: nice! Oct 01 00:39:38 it takes some pretty sweet pictures. Oct 01 00:39:45 Dougie187: well I shot 2,500 photos lat week :) Oct 01 00:39:50 lol Oct 01 00:40:02 romainguy: that spot was so flippin cool. the clouds were rushing by so fast that the scene changed every couple of minutes we stood there Oct 01 00:40:02 does anyone know if the G1 accelerometer is more or less sensitive than the iphones? Oct 01 00:40:05 are you a freelance photographer in addition to android? Oct 01 00:40:16 jasta: here you go: http://www.flickr.com/photos/visiglow/224157465/ Oct 01 00:40:29 sweet :) Oct 01 00:40:31 Dougie187: I'm not, but I'd definitely like to Oct 01 00:40:35 that is sweet. Oct 01 00:40:41 romainguy: it looks especially cool on the "right" android screen Oct 01 00:40:42 you should try to do some of it. Oct 01 00:40:58 I just need to check whether it's compatible with my work visa ;-) Oct 01 00:41:24 I also recently got 2 photos published in this book: http://www.curious-creature.org/page/2/ Oct 01 00:42:04 romainguy: that photo i took was on the Dingle Peninsula in Ireland btw :) Oct 01 00:42:15 how was your trip btw? Oct 01 00:42:40 i loved it. i had so much fun Oct 01 00:42:42 romainguy: did you get paid for the photos? Oct 01 00:42:53 people were great, the country side is beautiful, ... Oct 01 00:42:55 so much to love there Oct 01 00:43:01 Dougie187: I chose not to because all of my photos are under Creative Commons Oct 01 00:43:45 well thats cool Oct 01 00:44:36 last week I finally went to Antelope Canyon Oct 01 00:44:52 which means I took a picture that looks exactly like one of M3's wallpapers ^^ Oct 01 00:45:00 romainguy: http://picasaweb.google.com/jasta00/Ireland2008#5249763347500241394 :) Oct 01 00:45:39 hehe cool Oct 01 00:46:23 that's a really neat story actually Oct 01 00:46:33 that dolphin lives there, he comes up and swims with any boat the drives by Oct 01 00:46:44 http://www.emeraldtiger.com/countys/kerry/fungie.htm Oct 01 00:48:41 check this place out too: Oct 01 00:48:47 http://picasaweb.google.com/jasta00/Ireland2008#5249765324994644210 -- there's a whole series of pictures before this Oct 01 00:48:56 they let you walk all along that cliff side. about 2.5 miles total. Oct 01 00:53:30 romainguy: was the eclipse android plugin developed at google? Oct 01 00:53:38 it still is Oct 01 00:54:08 you need to use your influence to have someone make an updated netbeans plugin ;) Oct 01 00:54:21 lol Oct 01 00:54:29 well, I use IntelliJ... :) Oct 01 00:55:07 i suppose tor norbye isn't on irc much anymore Oct 01 00:55:37 I haven't seen him on #javaposse in months Oct 01 00:56:27 i'm a bit surprised that they haven't put any effort on support for android and gwt Oct 01 00:57:02 NetBeans? Oct 01 00:57:05 yes Oct 01 00:57:11 they're busy with dynamic languages and Java FX Oct 01 00:57:16 unfortunately nobody cares about Java FX Oct 01 00:57:41 i've only played around a bit with the media support in fx Oct 01 00:57:55 * Disconnect wants a python api (I know, it'll be a while at best) Oct 01 00:58:25 oh.. .god.... no... Oct 01 00:58:56 could be worse. could be ruby. Oct 01 00:59:06 that's my shuttle stop Oct 01 00:59:07 see ya Oct 01 00:59:15 romainguy: night man Oct 01 01:20:16 i've been writing lots of fun java code lately :) Oct 01 01:21:04 basically writing "tail" in java at the moment Oct 01 01:22:47 you have a very personal definition of fun :)) Oct 01 01:23:00 yeah really Oct 01 01:23:38 jasta: save me the effort and embarrassment by writing a terminal app? :) Oct 01 01:24:10 * Disconnect does -not- feel like relearning ansi codes and writing a proper term emulator :/ but if begging fails.... :) Oct 01 01:24:58 Disconnect: you don't have to, there's a public domain terminal emulator (ported to android even, bonus) already out there Oct 01 01:25:12 i think its contained within a project called connectbot maybe. i know it exists, i just dont know what the project is called Oct 01 01:25:13 cool. i looked around but couldn't find it. Oct 01 01:25:15 ah ok Oct 01 01:25:24 there's also the one we wrote :p Oct 01 01:25:28 installable and working on the actual hardware? Oct 01 01:26:00 Disconnect: its not a terminal, but it contains a general purpose VT100 implementation and a view for it on android Oct 01 01:26:02 * Disconnect had expected tmob to object to that Oct 01 01:26:08 you would need to adapt it to be a terminal and not an ssh client, of course Oct 01 01:26:13 but thats very, very easy if you know what youre doing Oct 01 01:26:24 ah ok. thats not bad, thats about the same scale as the first-effort i was gonna do anyway :) Oct 01 01:26:25 Disconnect: oh, it won't be useful, and it won't be a real terminal without JNI Oct 01 01:26:53 (you wont have permission to do anything interesting, and tehre wont be many interesting tools) Oct 01 01:26:56 ah Oct 01 01:27:47 does the g1 have bluetooth? Oct 01 01:27:59 yes Oct 01 01:28:03 ssh client is important of course, but it won't be long before somebody slaps a proper shell on it. embedded linux devices hardly ever stand long without that. Oct 01 01:30:18 wastrel, BT isnt officially supported yet in the SDK though. Oct 01 01:33:52 wasn't someone saying they had jni working? Oct 01 01:34:08 (not -supported- just working) Oct 01 01:34:16 it works Oct 01 01:34:20 just don't do it :) Oct 01 01:34:24 lol Oct 01 01:34:51 * Disconnect isn't feeling -huge- pressure to get a shell running. on the emulator. and i've already -got- a shell on the mac, so... :) Oct 01 01:36:12 that'll change when i ahve a device in my hand and its all locked away and mean. Oct 01 01:41:43 i feel like ive asked this before but is there some type of spacing attribute on layouts? Oct 01 01:42:22 i've got for example a horizontal row of buttons and i'd like them to be spaced apart equally, but it seems lame to specify the same padding/margin for each button Oct 01 01:50:05 what are some of the best android apps that people have made? Oct 01 01:50:37 that's a pretty loaded question don't you think? Oct 01 01:50:47 no Oct 01 01:50:51 google's answer is the winners of the ADC, i'd say. Oct 01 01:50:51 just a regular question Oct 01 01:51:36 has anyone made an IRC app yet? Oct 01 01:51:47 ive been out of the loop because of my busy life lately Oct 01 01:53:42 i actually don't know what's out there at this point. i'm sure the android market will tell you very fast. Oct 01 01:58:56 i'm excited Oct 01 02:02:33 hmm, i think the idea i'm still forming is more interesting than most of the adc winners.. but i'm sure someone must have had the same idea already Oct 01 02:02:47 soulless, care to divulge? Oct 01 02:03:23 can you use a stylus on the screen? Oct 01 02:04:38 basicly an app that uses the accelerometer to detect seizures and possibly accidents, and automaticly sending gps data to for example a family member.. could be used for things like epilepsy patients or even some accidentprone sports like slalom and mountain biking Oct 01 02:07:57 "Hello, Tom. It seems that you are having a seizure. Please press 'Disable' if that is incorrect." Oct 01 02:08:18 exactly Oct 01 02:09:41 might have to talk to some doctors or something to see what kind of movements they generate Oct 01 02:09:52 i wonder how sensitive it is Oct 01 02:11:31 yeah, it would have to have different profiles for different things.. but i think the idea has potential.. but yet, the sensitivity of the accelerometer would be an issue, but at least someone recently created an iphone app that measures earthquakes Oct 01 02:11:49 its worht a try Oct 01 02:13:01 you need to have a way to ignore all the false positives that could happen... Oct 01 02:13:41 as d03boy said, are you planning to have something like press to 'Disable' ? Oct 01 02:13:43 this would be one of those applications that doesn't fit into steve jobs "we have a better idea, 'push' can do anything background apps can" idea Oct 01 02:14:06 yeah, it would have to give the person a chance to cancel false alarms Oct 01 02:14:26 It really doesnt make sense when the user meets with an accident or the sort where the user is too busy to think about his/her phone Oct 01 02:15:04 packetthirst: but they only need to cancel if it's a false alarm.. if it's not a false alarm they don't need to do anything Oct 01 02:15:35 don't you think false alarms will happen pretty often ? Oct 01 02:15:57 hard to say without having a chance to play with the accelerometer Oct 01 02:16:26 oh yeah, provided the user only enables your app when he feels an impending disaster :-D Oct 01 02:16:30 i think the back and forth would have to be sustained over a long period of time Oct 01 02:16:36 * packetthirst uses his "spidersense" Oct 01 02:17:54 great idea, but pretty hard to implement usefully Oct 01 02:17:58 also the accuracy of the gps could play a large role.. a person that still moving at a steady pace but still shakes enough to indicate a seizure would be a sign that it's a false alarm Oct 01 02:18:06 worth a challenge anyway :-D Oct 01 02:19:42 i think the whole challenge of finding ways to predict an "event" would be the fun part of the project Oct 01 02:20:04 you'd likely have to build in an aspect of AI Oct 01 02:20:09 maybe someone should port that boob fondling iphone app to android :-D Oct 01 02:21:49 that can wait til we get haptic tactile screens ;) Oct 01 02:23:19 oh yeah, im already getting a lotta ideas Oct 01 02:25:33 wonder if there was a database somewhere with dimensions of various celebrity boobies... Oct 01 02:26:24 their implant specs.. then you order the same one and put a bluetooth chip in it ;) Oct 01 02:26:42 hehe Oct 01 02:28:08 jasta: fyi (from 30 mins or so ago) last time i checked android market it showed me things like chromium. except its the windows version. (and other similar "applications") Oct 01 02:30:57 anyone know if Thrift works (data structure side) under Android? Oct 01 02:58:39 covalentbond_, yep **** ENDING LOGGING AT Wed Oct 01 02:59:59 2008