**** BEGIN LOGGING AT Sat Oct 11 02:59:57 2008
Oct 11 03:56:56 <morrildl> I am so sad now
Oct 11 03:57:40 <ttuttle> morrildl: Why?
Oct 11 03:58:13 <morrildl> ttuttle: because the libstdc++ that ships on Android is insufficient to run SCUMMVM, basically
Oct 11 03:58:18 <ttuttle> morrildl: :(
Oct 11 03:58:25 <ttuttle> Hey, anyone know why I can't remove contacts from favorites?
Oct 11 04:00:18 <wastrel> i am trying out chandler it's a calendar/task manager
Oct 11 04:00:35 <wastrel> once i ditch palm i won't be stuck on jpilot anymore :]
Oct 11 04:10:46 <muthu> oh my ganesa
Oct 11 05:05:13 <muthu> http://www.techcrunch.com/2008/10/10/google-employees-watch-in-horror-as-60-percent-of-their-stock-options-drown/
Oct 11 05:06:15 <unix_infidel> should read, "google employees double down because they are smart enough to figure out that search is in it's infancy."
Oct 11 05:06:54 <cbeust_> typical techcrunch, although it's the kind of headline I'd expect from Valleywag
Oct 11 05:07:13 <wastrel> hahaa
Oct 11 05:07:29 <wastrel> omfg goog is at $350
Oct 11 05:07:49 <unix_infidel> no, GOOG is at 350 legitimately this time.
Oct 11 05:08:09 <umdk1d3> gah
Oct 11 05:08:14 <umdk1d3> im trying to confirm this, but having a hard time
Oct 11 05:08:29 <jerkface03> 350 is good or bad?
Oct 11 05:08:49 <umdk1d3> "The T-Mobile G1 will only be available in all stores within 3G boundary area"   <--  was that just a rumor, or is it a real fact?
Oct 11 05:08:55 <umdk1d3> i cant really find a solid fact on it
Oct 11 05:08:58 <unix_infidel> jerkface03: was at near 700.
Oct 11 05:09:17 <jerkface03> ahh
Oct 11 05:09:21 <jerkface03> it'll bounce back
Oct 11 05:09:38 <jerkface03> this kind of stuff happens
Oct 11 05:09:41 <jerkface03> markets go up and down
Oct 11 05:09:41 <unix_infidel> meh, there's still plenty of equity that needs to be liquidated.
Oct 11 05:09:42 <jerkface03> etc.. etc..
Oct 11 05:10:56 <umdk1d3> muthu: lol @ that article
Oct 11 05:11:10 <umdk1d3> so wait, does this mean its a good time to be hired, if options are granted at hire?
Oct 11 05:11:13 <lresende> anyone using maven to compile android projects ?
Oct 11 05:11:25 <unix_infidel> i'd bet 95% of employees arent sweating it, they spend half of daylight and a good portion of the night creating value.
Oct 11 05:11:26 <umdk1d3> "As I understand it, Google grants stock options to employees during the week they are hired." -- quote from article
Oct 11 05:11:32 <cbeust_> good thinking, umdk
Oct 11 05:11:59 <unix_infidel> umdk1d3: depends on how options are discounted.
Oct 11 05:12:39 <cbeust_> It's pretty standard in the Valley to get the strike price calculated in the 1-2 weeks after you get hired
Oct 11 05:12:59 <unix_infidel> google is in the cash, but is betting on advertisers following the ogilvian notion of doubling down during a bear market.
Oct 11 05:14:08 <jerkface03> bling bling
Oct 11 05:15:49 <unix_infidel> cbeust_: if you leave a startup to join a large company just because you think you'll get a decent discount on the spot...
Oct 11 05:16:06 <unix_infidel> i'm guessing that's the least of your worries.
Oct 11 05:16:16 <cbeust_> unix: I've been at Google for 4 years and I have never let this kind of consideration guide my job choices
Oct 11 05:17:05 <unix_infidel> cbeust_: wasnt insinutating, i was just positing that 95% of google employees arent sweating it.
Oct 11 05:17:17 <cbeust_> unix: completely agree with you
Oct 11 05:26:51 <umdk1d3> what were the exact dimensions of the home icons?  like 34dip iirc?
Oct 11 05:27:05 <umdk1d3> and default list items 66dip iirc
Oct 11 05:42:03 <umdk1d3> =O he left
Oct 11 05:43:39 <romainguy> umdk1d3: it's not 66 dip
Oct 11 05:43:43 <romainguy> and the icons are not 34 dip
Oct 11 05:44:06 <umdk1d3> okay cool  :)
Oct 11 05:44:13 <romainguy> :p
Oct 11 05:44:16 <umdk1d3> i remember hearing 66dip somewhere
Oct 11 05:44:22 <romainguy> it's 64
Oct 11 05:44:31 <romainguy> and the icons are either 48 or 44 or 42
Oct 11 05:44:36 <romainguy> I don't remember, I need to look
Oct 11 05:44:45 <umdk1d3> ill just say 48  ;)
Oct 11 05:45:05 <romainguy> lemme check
Oct 11 05:48:15 <romainguy> it's 48px x 48px
Oct 11 05:48:18 <romainguy> not dip, px :)
Oct 11 05:48:21 <umdk1d3> :(
Oct 11 05:48:33 <jota-> hey which permission do I need to listen for incoming data on a udp port?
Oct 11 05:48:39 <umdk1d3> dip are independant for a reason  :P
Oct 11 05:48:51 <umdk1d3> jota-: INTERNET should be all you need
Oct 11 05:49:34 <umdk1d3> jota-: remember that UDP doesnt work in the emulator tho
Oct 11 05:49:45 <jota-> oh really?
Oct 11 05:50:03 <umdk1d3> yep, because QEMU treats it as a NAT'ed device, and the command line only provides tcp port forwarding
Oct 11 05:50:40 <jota-> umm wait thats not right, i've actually stablished udp connections as a client
Oct 11 05:50:55 <umdk1d3> right it should still work for outgoing, because it goes through the nat
Oct 11 05:50:59 <romainguy> umdk1d3: yeah but application icons are not independent, so they would end up looking weird
Oct 11 05:51:21 <umdk1d3> but for incoming, it cant punch through the QEMU NAT
Oct 11 05:51:23 <jota-> oh ok ok I get it
Oct 11 05:51:36 <umdk1d3> i think someone wrote a udp proxy
Oct 11 05:51:47 <umdk1d3> but it was pretty messy
Oct 11 05:52:12 <umdk1d3> hmm i wonder how hard it would be to change ./emulator to setup udp tunnels
Oct 11 05:52:50 <umdk1d3> romainguy: the list heights are 64px or 64dip tho?
Oct 11 05:53:28 <romainguy> 64px
Oct 11 05:53:35 <umdk1d3> grrrrrr :P
Oct 11 05:53:46 <romainguy> doesn't really matter on the G1 :)
Oct 11 05:53:59 <umdk1d3> still, imho ppl should get in habit of using dip
Oct 11 05:54:08 <romainguy> agreed
Oct 11 05:54:12 <romainguy> and that's why we use them
Oct 11 05:54:19 <romainguy> but in some situations it's not the right choice
Oct 11 05:54:21 <romainguy> anyhow
Oct 11 05:54:31 <romainguy> for the list item height there's a theme attribute
Oct 11 05:54:35 <romainguy> that's what you shoud use
Oct 11 05:54:45 <romainguy> ?android:attr/listItemPreferredHeight
Oct 11 05:57:05 <jota-> hey do you think it's likely that by december there will be and android unlocked phone available?
Oct 11 05:57:27 <cbeust_> I'm guessing unlocked phones will be available 24 hours after we ship
Oct 11 05:57:52 <jota-> what price can we expect?
Oct 11 05:57:58 <jota-> for an unlocked g1?
Oct 11 06:14:37 <umdk1d3> yay
Oct 11 06:14:56 <umdk1d3> i created a new emulator skin that gives you the real g1 experience  ^.^
Oct 11 06:15:17 <cbeust_> er...
Oct 11 06:15:31 <umdk1d3> well, a closer one  :P
Oct 11 06:15:41 <cbeust_> how so?
Oct 11 06:15:50 <umdk1d3> http://www.jsharkey.org/blog/2008/10/10/leveraging-the-android-emulator/
Oct 11 06:18:00 <cbeust_> ah you just added the chin and the keyboard
Oct 11 06:18:09 <cbeust_> because hopefully the screen itself is good enough :)
Oct 11 06:18:16 <umdk1d3> oh yea, its just a skin
Oct 11 06:18:22 <umdk1d3> the screen stays unchanged
Oct 11 06:35:49 <jota-> umdk1d3  are you sure INTERNET is enough for listening? if I call new DatagramSocket(port); I get a SocketException which reads "Permissions do not allow action on socket"
Oct 11 06:36:24 <jota-> what else might I be doing wrong?
Oct 11 06:37:45 <umdk1d3> yep they should be plenty
Oct 11 06:37:56 <umdk1d3> i think i remember running into that error tho
Oct 11 06:40:44 <umdk1d3> jota-: is your permission in the right place?
Oct 11 06:41:06 <umdk1d3> it should be just before </manifest>
Oct 11 06:41:11 <umdk1d3> and after </application>
Oct 11 06:42:45 <jota-> thats where it is, I have another activity on the same app that acts as a client which is working right
Oct 11 06:42:47 <umdk1d3> \
Oct 11 06:49:46 <romainguy> umdk1d3: ?
Oct 11 06:53:54 <jota-> ah just found out whats the problem
Oct 11 06:54:29 <jota-> apareantly I just cant listen on well known ports (<=1023)
Oct 11 06:55:05 <romainguy> usually it's the contrary
Oct 11 06:55:14 <umdk1d3> that sounds like it might be from the linux side of things
Oct 11 06:55:31 <umdk1d3> usually linux requires superuser to listen to privilidged ports
Oct 11 06:55:48 <romainguy> don't you need to be root to listen to ports < 1024 on Linux?
Oct 11 06:56:01 <umdk1d3> yep
Oct 11 06:56:09 <jota-> yes
Oct 11 06:56:22 <romainguy> ooh I misread your sentence
Oct 11 06:56:32 <romainguy> I thought you said you can only listent to ports < 1024
Oct 11 06:56:41 <romainguy> hence my surprise :)
Oct 11 08:25:21 <umdk1d3> f00f-: this looks interesting http://www.hopstop.com/freeapi/
Oct 11 08:46:38 <jasta> yawn
Oct 11 08:48:18 <muthu> jasta: sup
Oct 11 08:48:38 <jasta> hi
Oct 11 08:48:47 <muthu> oy
Oct 11 08:52:10 <muthu> jasta: G1 for you
Oct 11 08:52:12 <muthu> http://www.jsharkey.org/blog/2008/10/10/leveraging-the-android-emulator/
Oct 11 08:52:20 <jasta> whatev, i already have it running on real devices
Oct 11 08:52:25 <muthu> he
Oct 11 08:52:59 <muthu> the custom components are pita
Oct 11 08:53:05 <muthu> the focus selection etc.,
Oct 11 10:05:08 <umdk1d3> yay snow  ^.^  /me considers making snowman at 4am
Oct 11 14:45:08 <Disconnect> (random side note: i take back my assumptions about anddev mailer not doing retries - once i was accepting mail again, it worked. error on my end :) ..)
Oct 11 14:50:42 <Disconnect> although it does hold true for androidcommunity.com and there is no way to request resends (or at least, i can't find one)
Oct 11 14:51:29 <Disconnect> bizarre access restrictions too - i can read threads, post but not view attachments and pics (?!?)
Oct 11 15:12:36 <Disconnect> (and yes, i emailed the admins with no response like a week ago)
Oct 11 17:27:34 <muthu> ro yo or
Oct 11 17:30:48 <muthu> http://blog.transmit.net/2008/10/my-best-unix-tricks.html
Oct 11 17:31:11 <muthu> less instead of more
Oct 11 17:31:18 <muthu> how true!
Oct 11 17:33:45 <Disconnect> most instead of less
Oct 11 17:34:42 <muthu> less is more
Oct 11 18:06:10 <Disconnect> most is better than less
Oct 11 18:14:32 <jasta> you know
Oct 11 18:14:43 <jasta> this document suprises me, because i actually didnt know quite a few of these things
Oct 11 18:14:54 <jasta> however, it misses quite a few cool ones i use all the time :)
Oct 11 18:15:31 <jasta> like watch, and ls -tr1sh
Oct 11 18:16:19 <jasta> and find | while read a; ...do stuff with $a...; done as a more flexible alternative to find -exec...
Oct 11 18:16:41 <jasta> also re #7, just use vim and :set list
Oct 11 18:17:33 <jasta> also #6, to jump to a line *in* vim you merely hit :<line#>
Oct 11 18:18:55 <jasta> and of course they miss the most useful one-liner, perl -pi -e
Oct 11 18:19:08 <jasta> which allows you to transform a file in-place.
Oct 12 00:14:28 <mohbana> does G1 have a standard earphone jack?
Oct 12 00:31:40 <snadge> no
Oct 12 00:32:13 <snadge> im sure you can get an adaptor though that gives you an earphone jack
Oct 12 00:32:35 <snadge> and yes.. many people have already whinged about it
Oct 12 00:33:11 <snadge> of course, that one little silly thing gives enough reason to go buy an iphone, or a winmo or symbian phone instead... (not)
Oct 12 00:33:52 <snadge> actually, my flatmates htc tytn ii winmo phone has the same limitation
Oct 12 00:35:16 <snadge> my own personal irritation is that i dont know anything about any google phones that ARNT the htc dream .. and i don't have any idea, WHEN this stuff will be available in australia
Oct 12 00:36:23 <snadge> australian telcos have their thumbs up their bottom and have commented along the lines "we think google android is cool, but we are clueless and have no idea"
Oct 12 00:46:44 <BBHoss> hi all, i am getting a null pointer exception, can someone pleas look at my code and try to help me? CODE: http://pasternak.superalloy.nl/pastes/901 DEBUG: http://pasternak.superalloy.nl/pastes/902
Oct 12 00:50:44 <rayado> BBHoss:  what's in the log?
Oct 12 00:50:54 <rayado> sorry
Oct 12 00:50:57 <BBHoss> heh
Oct 12 00:51:03 <rayado> I mean, what's before that in the log
Oct 12 00:51:07 <BBHoss> i think my gps provider is disabled, how can i enable it
Oct 12 00:51:10 <rayado> anything?
Oct 12 00:51:24 <BBHoss> no, thats all the applicable info for that crash
Oct 12 00:51:39 <BBHoss> i can paste the entire log, but i dont think that would get us anywhere
Oct 12 00:51:57 <BBHoss> i have all the permissions defined for it too
Oct 12 00:51:59 <rayado> do you see "getLastKnowLocation: RemoteException"
Oct 12 00:52:46 <BBHoss> rayado: i don't see anything like that
Oct 12 00:53:20 <BBHoss> full log http://pasternak.superalloy.nl/pastes/903
Oct 12 00:55:35 <BBHoss> i ran it a few times, everywher you see a null pointer exception thats where it died
Oct 12 00:55:52 <rayado> This is going to be so much easier once it's open sourced...
Oct 12 00:56:19 <rayado> It looks like getLastKnownLocation returns null if the setting is turned off
Oct 12 00:56:31 <rayado> So you definitely need to check for that
Oct 12 00:56:32 <BBHoss> right
Oct 12 00:56:40 <BBHoss> if the provider is not enabled
Oct 12 00:56:59 <rayado> yeah
Oct 12 00:57:27 <rayado> Also, getLastKnownLocation is an IPC, so you really shouldn't call it twice in a row
Oct 12 01:00:15 <BBHoss> rayado: what should i do instead
Oct 12 01:00:31 <rayado> Location loc = myManager.getLastKnownLocation("gps");
Oct 12 01:00:44 <rayado> loc.getLatitude();
Oct 12 01:00:44 <BBHoss> then do loc.getLatitute?
Oct 12 01:00:51 <BBHoss> ok thanks
Oct 12 01:00:52 <rayado> and loc.getLongitude();
Oct 12 01:01:10 <rayado> I have no idea how to turn on the gps in the emulator
Oct 12 01:01:59 <rayado> see if it's in home > menu > settings > security & location > enable gps satellites
Oct 12 01:02:09 <BBHoss> rayado: well it works if i send it using ddms
Oct 12 01:02:28 <rayado> but I don't know if (a) that's  present in the sdk emulator and (b) does anything
Oct 12 01:02:39 <BBHoss> i heard it was supposed to have a route, maybe i have to adb pull it to a gpx file and the upload it with ddms
Oct 12 01:03:23 <rayado> yeah, sorry I can't help you there
Oct 12 01:21:31 <ttuttle> romainguy: Hey.
Oct 12 01:23:40 <ttuttle> Anyone know of a good ssh client for Android?  ConnectBot doesn't seem to have functionality for keys like Escape or Alt-anything.
Oct 12 01:24:13 <cbeust> Never heard of one
Oct 12 01:24:24 <cbeust> There's already SSL so it's half the battle :)
Oct 12 01:27:03 <ttuttle> Er, I don't think SSH uses SSL.  Does it?
Oct 12 01:27:16 <cbeust> I thought it di
Oct 12 01:27:19 <cbeust> d
Oct 12 01:27:39 <ttuttle> Nope.
Oct 12 01:27:45 <cbeust> Ah
**** ENDING LOGGING AT Sun Oct 12 02:59:57 2008