**** BEGIN LOGGING AT Sat Dec 13 03:00:03 2008
Dec 13 03:04:24 <squeakypants> anyone here have a g1 w/o data?
Dec 13 03:22:45 <squeakypants> anyone know if you can cancel the data service if you get a g1?
Dec 13 03:27:46 <Damm> prolly not
Dec 13 03:27:59 <squeakypants> hmm
Dec 13 03:28:35 <squeakypants> cause i'm not paying $300 a month for 3g :P i wouldn't use it anywhere near enough to be worth it
Dec 13 03:28:46 <Damm> 300$? a month
Dec 13 03:28:50 <squeakypants> and i have unlimited texts already
Dec 13 03:28:51 <squeakypants> ergh a year
Dec 13 03:28:52 <Damm> with web and go there should be a 19$$ plan
Dec 13 03:28:56 <Damm> ah
Dec 13 03:29:02 <squeakypants> nah $25 afaik
Dec 13 03:29:09 <Damm> yeah with web and go it's very difficult to deal with data plans anymore
Dec 13 03:29:15 <squeakypants> web and go?
Dec 13 03:29:28 <Damm> basically now T-Mobile looks up your device by IMEI and decides what data plans it can take
Dec 13 03:29:40 <Damm> or is it web 2 go? ... I forget
Dec 13 03:29:44 <squeakypants> hmm
Dec 13 03:29:45 <Damm> it's T-Mobile's new data plan crud
Dec 13 03:29:57 <squeakypants> i might get an ipod touch and a gravity then :-/
Dec 13 03:30:05 <squeakypants> heh, i can't decide
Dec 13 03:30:23 <Damm> i mean if you buy a D1, and then toss in your T-Mobile SIM with T-Zones free
Dec 13 03:30:28 <Damm> T-Mobile won't be the wiser
Dec 13 03:30:36 <squeakypants> t-zones free?
Dec 13 03:30:46 <Damm> but if you buy a G1, and activate it with T-Mobile... they're going to know and want to add a data plan
Dec 13 03:30:57 <Damm> if you can con the customer service rep out of adding a data plan... your golden
Dec 13 03:31:01 <squeakypants> i heard about that t-zones hack..
Dec 13 03:31:01 <Damm> but I doubt it
Dec 13 03:31:02 <squeakypants> yeah
Dec 13 03:31:20 <Damm> well T-Mobile offers "T-Zones" for free, only allows access to the WAP Deck
Dec 13 03:31:23 <squeakypants> well it's even more of a ripoff to get the $400 dev version
Dec 13 03:31:26 <Damm> you don't have a WAP browser so it doesn't mean squat.
Dec 13 03:31:39 <squeakypants> i heard there was a hack to use t-zones for EDGE actually ;)
Dec 13 03:31:41 <Damm> nah the D1 is more worth it then the G1 IMO
Dec 13 03:31:45 <squeakypants> D1?
Dec 13 03:31:50 <Damm> Developer 1
Dec 13 03:31:54 <squeakypants> ah
Dec 13 03:31:56 <squeakypants> why's that?
Dec 13 03:32:25 <Damm> no sim lock, no hardware lock
Dec 13 03:32:32 <Damm> you can put on any rom you want, or in any sim you want
Dec 13 03:33:43 <squeakypants> can't you unlock the hardware?
Dec 13 03:34:07 <Damm> not without root
Dec 13 03:34:09 <Damm> if you have RC30... you can't unlock the hardware
Dec 13 03:34:17 <squeakypants> i see
Dec 13 03:34:34 <squeakypants> bah...
Dec 13 03:34:51 <squeakypants> i know whichever one i get, the other will get a million kickass apps right away
Dec 13 03:35:19 <squeakypants> can we integrate open source libs into the android OS?
Dec 13 03:35:42 <squeakypants> cause libvlc or libffmpeg should be in there ;)
Dec 13 03:36:01 <jbq> squeakypants: in your local copy, you can do whatever you want. In the core system, it depends on the usefulness/size ratio, and on the license.
Dec 13 03:36:36 <squeakypants> jbq: i see
Dec 13 03:36:38 <jbq> Space tends to be extremely tight, so beyond a few dozen kB you'll have to find other stuff to remove first.
Dec 13 03:36:45 <squeakypants> gotcha
Dec 13 03:37:01 <squeakypants> i'm surprised the source project hasn't done much yet... it's been 1.5 months
Dec 13 03:37:25 <jbq> squeakypants: google hasn't really started to contribute to it yet.
Dec 13 03:37:46 <squeakypants> mmm... yeah it's weird
Dec 13 03:38:02 <squeakypants> google's usually awesome at this kind of thing, but with android it seems kinda half-assed
Dec 13 03:38:24 <jbq> squeakypants: no, the problem is that we were ass-and-a-half :)
Dec 13 03:38:46 <Damm> android is hardly half-assed
Dec 13 03:38:50 <squeakypants> no video recorder, the video player isn't included and is buggy, there's no way to compile native apps (as an apk anyway)...
Dec 13 03:38:50 * Damm is offended
Dec 13 03:38:54 <squeakypants> hahaha
Dec 13 03:38:57 <kRutOn>  the other cheek got blown off in the war
Dec 13 03:39:28 <jbq> preparing an internal source tree for open-source takes a lot of time, and by the time we were done preparing the tree that got open-sourced on Oct 21 the internal tree was so much further along that what we open-sourced was instantly out-of-date.
Dec 13 03:39:58 <squeakypants> jbq, you're from google? :-P
Dec 13 03:40:02 <jbq> Yup
Dec 13 03:40:07 <squeakypants> sweet lol
Dec 13 03:40:31 <jbq> Right now I'm working on open-sourcing our bleeding-edge tree.
Dec 13 03:40:31 <squeakypants> i see...
Dec 13 03:41:03 <squeakypants> excellent ;)
Dec 13 03:41:23 <squeakypants> i gotta ask... why did you decide to go with java (dalvik)?
Dec 13 03:41:52 <squeakypants> i can't name any nonARM phones offhand, so crosscompatibility is kinda moot
Dec 13 03:42:19 <jbq> Gah, sorry, I got a network burp. As I was saying, right now I'm working on open-sourcing our bleeding-edge tree.
Dec 13 03:42:26 <squeakypants> and for security... idk if this is realistic but couldn't you set up a VM-like environment where apps can only access memory they allocated?
Dec 13 03:42:41 <squeakypants> it's cool, can you see what i said before?
Dec 13 03:43:09 <jbq> I can't see what you said beyond "sweet lol"
Dec 13 03:43:24 <squeakypants> k, copy and pasting away!
Dec 13 03:43:40 <squeakypants> i gotta ask... why did you decide to go with java (dalvik)? i can't name any nonARM phones offhand, so crosscompatibility is kinda moot
Dec 13 03:44:02 <squeakypants> and for security... idk if this is realistic but couldn't you set up a VM-like environment where apps can only access memory they allocated?
Dec 13 03:44:07 <Adamant> squeakypants: inter-ARM compatibility can be interesting
Dec 13 03:44:19 <Adamant> also there are non-ARM phones, just not a lot of them.
Dec 13 03:44:27 <squeakypants> adamant: you mean the different arm #s? i see
Dec 13 03:44:31 <spearce> squeakypants: the Linux kernel already sets up that environment.  as does any other UNIX system
Dec 13 03:44:49 <squeakypants> spearce: it does? heh, then what's the security problem?
Dec 13 03:45:05 <Adamant> right, you have to explicitly or implicitly allow access
Dec 13 03:45:06 <jbq> squeakypants: the decision about the VM goes back before my time. There are many variants of ARM, not all compatible with one another, and there are some non-ARM embedded environments that would also benefit from Android.
Dec 13 03:46:01 <Adamant> I think the company Android that got acquirred by Google was already using Dalvik, IIRC
Dec 13 03:46:16 <jbq> squeakypants: for security, we use straight linux UIDs, which have proven to be strong.
Dec 13 03:46:17 <squeakypants> idk... i just feel like android would be more successful (or rather, more quickly successful, since it inevitably will be) if you could easily port existing apps
Dec 13 03:46:26 <squeakypants> which you can only do with Java apps
Dec 13 03:46:32 <Adamant> squeakypants: I agree
Dec 13 03:46:33 <squeakypants> adamant: ah that could be it
Dec 13 03:46:45 <Adamant> it would be nice if you could port C/C++ apps directly
Dec 13 03:46:55 <erus`> yeah
Dec 13 03:47:03 <squeakypants> adamant: right, if only because of the libraries
Dec 13 03:47:06 <jbq> We're thinking hard about ways to support C apps in the future.
Dec 13 03:47:12 <squeakypants> also iphone apps could be ported
Dec 13 03:47:12 <Adamant> but security guarantees go down the toliet at that point.
Dec 13 03:47:13 <erus`> i might hold out for a fone with native gui etc
Dec 13 03:47:17 <squeakypants> jbq: you are? EXCELLENT :)
Dec 13 03:47:19 <Adamant> huh?
Dec 13 03:47:20 <jbq> C++ is a much more thorny issue.
Dec 13 03:47:41 <Adamant> erus`: the Android UI is native
Dec 13 03:47:46 <erus`> runs on java?
Dec 13 03:47:55 <squeakypants> jbq: why?
Dec 13 03:47:58 <erus`> so you cant use aps made for gnome etc?
Dec 13 03:48:13 <squeakypants> erus`: well you can only run android apps :P
Dec 13 03:48:22 <Adamant> why would you want GNOME apps on a phone?
Dec 13 03:48:22 <erus`> yeah
Dec 13 03:48:26 <squeakypants> erus`: if you want linux, get a pandora :)
Dec 13 03:48:38 <Adamant> pandora doesn't use GNOME either
Dec 13 03:48:47 <squeakypants> it supports it, no?
Dec 13 03:48:54 <squeakypants> it's debian-based i thought
Dec 13 03:48:56 <jbq> squeakypants: C++ makes the standard C libraries much more complex (primarily because of exceptions), and the C++ library is really complex to implement.
Dec 13 03:48:57 <Adamant> it's fine for the desktop but it's not designed for mobile devices
Dec 13 03:49:14 <erus`> well not gnome but i wanna run gcc and stuff
Dec 13 03:49:18 <squeakypants> jbq: ah, i see
Dec 13 03:49:19 <Adamant> squeakypants: it's supported but it's stupid to run it and it's not standard
Dec 13 03:49:25 <Adamant> erus`: get a dev phone
Dec 13 03:49:30 <Adamant> if you're US
Dec 13 03:50:14 <squeakypants> jbq: would a java bytecode compiler be possible? that is, to recompile from x86 or MIPS or something?
Dec 13 03:50:17 <Adamant> squeakypants: I know someone working on Pandora UI.. it needs stuff adapted to mobile devices and that's more or less going to be the standard
Dec 13 03:50:42 <Adamant> squeakypants: performance would probably squash that.
Dec 13 03:50:43 <jbq> squeakypants: I'm not quite sure what you mean.
Dec 13 03:50:44 <squeakypants> jbq: i've seen such that convert MIPS to java, but not directly to bytecode, so you can't use them as libraries, and it gets complex to use
Dec 13 03:51:07 <squeakypants> jbq: well i'm not sure exactly how java (or dalvik) bytecode works, but isn't it essentially an architecture?
Dec 13 03:51:22 <Adamant> squeakypants: anytime you translate machine code to another machine code there's usually a big performance hit.
Dec 13 03:51:43 <offby1> .oO("squeakypants"?)
Dec 13 03:51:43 <squeakypants> adamant: ah, so it wouldn't be worth it?
Dec 13 03:51:49 <jbq> ah. well, mathematically they're all equivalent, so it's mathematically possible. Whether the result will be fast and small enough to justify the time spent in writing a cross-compiler is an open question.
Dec 13 03:51:52 <squeakypants> offby1: wha?
Dec 13 03:52:19 <Adamant> squeakypants: I can't say it wouldn't be, but I've never heard of it turning out very well in the speed department
Dec 13 03:52:29 <squeakypants> jbq: interesting. i need to learn more about how cpus work :P
Dec 13 03:52:44 <Adamant> offby1: I know!
Dec 13 03:52:49 <squeakypants> adamant: any worse than java speed?
Dec 13 03:52:59 <jbq> squeakypants: typically, yes.
Dec 13 03:53:00 <Adamant> squeakypants: do you program Squeak?
Dec 13 03:53:06 <Adamant> a lot worse.
Dec 13 03:53:09 <squeakypants> jbq: ah, okay
Dec 13 03:53:36 <squeakypants> adamant: a bit. i love python but i've worked plenty in c++ and java
Dec 13 03:54:16 <squeakypants> heh, i was working on a DS game for awhile, but i was using a bunch of vectors and such and i ran into a memory leak that i couldn't fix :'(
Dec 13 03:54:26 <offby1> squeakypants: just an ... amusing nick :)
Dec 13 03:54:39 <squeakypants> heh, thanks :)
Dec 13 03:55:50 <squeakypants> jbq: anyway, thanks for the answers :) sorry if i insulted you heh
Dec 13 03:56:03 <jbq> actually, you didn't - I've heard far worse!
Dec 13 03:56:11 <squeakypants> hahaha
Dec 13 03:56:48 <Adamant> jbq - jump and branch if quadratic? :)~
Dec 13 03:57:12 <jbq> Adamant: heh. No, those are just my initials :)
Dec 13 03:57:13 <squeakypants> whaa?
Dec 13 03:57:23 <Adamant> squeakypants: assembly code joke
Dec 13 03:57:44 <Adamant> a lot of assembly code uses instructions like "jump" and "branch"
Dec 13 03:57:55 <squeakypants> haha
Dec 13 04:09:06 <loke_> Adamant: "jump and branch"?
Dec 13 04:09:20 <loke_> I'd like to know what the "jump but don't branch" instruction does :-)
Dec 13 04:10:09 <Adamant> loke_: that's why I had my tongue out
Dec 13 04:10:29 <laura--> Hey.. how can I convert a "KeyCode" value (e.g. the value that's passed into a onKeyDown method) into a character?
Dec 13 04:10:31 <loke_> Adamant: Call me old-school, but that would be :-P in my book
Dec 13 04:10:43 <laura--> (without doing a freakin' huge switch block)
Dec 13 04:11:43 <offby1> Adamant: I thought that ( :)~ ) was a soul patch
Dec 13 04:11:57 <Adamant> it's tongue, damnit
Dec 13 04:12:10 <Adamant> :p or :)~
Dec 13 04:12:38 <Adamant> :)> is soul patch or Van Dyke or Flexo
Dec 13 04:14:46 * offby1 humbly admits defeat
Dec 13 04:16:14 <zinx> there any way to get a non-Dev G1 traded for a Dev one or changed in to a Dev one?  can't afford yet another phone :/
Dec 13 04:17:59 <squeakypants> laura--: link me to the javadoc
Dec 13 04:18:17 <laura--> huh?
Dec 13 04:18:23 <Fredbo> zinx, probably the best you'll be able to do is find images of all the different parts and flash them
Dec 13 04:19:16 <zinx> Fredbo: can't flash them myself with this phone afaik
Dec 13 04:19:38 <Fredbo> is it ota 30?
Dec 13 04:19:53 <zinx> it's RC30, yes.  came that way.
Dec 13 04:22:29 <Fredbo> in that case, best you'll probably be able to do is ebay that one and get the dev
Dec 13 04:23:29 <squeakypants> laura--: for "KeyCode"
Dec 13 04:23:55 <Fredbo> there's no direct upgrade path because they're sold by different companies
Dec 13 04:24:11 <zinx> annoying :/
Dec 13 04:27:42 <Fredbo> zinx, is it less than 14 days old?
Dec 13 04:28:47 <zinx> Fredbo: it is
Dec 13 04:29:23 <zinx> but i can't afford the full price of the dev phone 1 outright :/
Dec 13 04:34:30 <Fredbo> the adp1 is priced comparable to what an unlocked, unsubsidized, no-contract g1 would sell for... if you want an unlocked, unsubsidized, no-contract g1 then purchasing the adp1 would be the way to go
Dec 13 04:35:18 <zinx> i don't need it to be unlocked, just need to be able to alter the core components :/
Dec 13 04:35:28 <zinx> i.e., it can still require use of t-mobile
Dec 13 04:35:43 <zinx> and the contract that goes with it
Dec 13 04:38:31 <Fredbo> if you just want a reflashable phone, then you can either wait til ota-30 has been cracked, or find a fault with it, send it back, and hope you get lucky and receive a pre-30 in return
Dec 13 04:39:14 <squeakypants> fredbo: i'm not sure about that
Dec 13 04:39:17 <zinx> the OS tends to not lend itself to the former happening :/
Dec 13 04:39:25 <squeakypants> fredbo: the ipod touch is only what $220?
Dec 13 04:39:36 <zinx> and i hear there are few black pre-30's being shipped these days
Dec 13 04:39:36 <squeakypants> and the g1 doesn't have much more hardware
Dec 13 04:39:57 <zinx> not big on lying to get hardware swapped either.
Dec 13 04:40:29 <Fredbo> apples (no pun intended) to oranges
Dec 13 04:40:55 <squeakypants> well the point is
Dec 13 04:41:03 <squeakypants> the hardware isn't that expensive
Dec 13 04:41:30 <squeakypants> and i doubt apple's manufacturing process is less expensive than HTC's
Dec 13 04:41:49 <squeakypants> so it seems like a high profit margin
Dec 13 04:41:50 <Adamant> iPod has significantly more volume.
Dec 13 04:41:58 <Adamant> squeakypants: you might be surprised
Dec 13 04:42:03 <Fredbo> unlocked, unsubsidized, no-contract s-e x1 is what, $800?
Dec 13 04:42:05 <snadge> if i had've updated to OTA RC30.. my phone would essentially be useless.. well, it would repeatedly cost me 35c every minute or two until i had no credit left
Dec 13 04:42:12 <squeakypants> s-e x1? what's that?
Dec 13 04:42:21 <bparker06> sony-ericsson xperia x1
Dec 13 04:42:32 <bparker06> an awesome phone
Dec 13 04:42:35 <squeakypants> adamant: right but they probably cost less than $200 to make
Dec 13 04:42:56 <snadge> im pretty annoyed with my g1 actually .. after all the stuffing around to get mms working.. i found out i can only send them, not receive them
Dec 13 04:43:01 <Adamant> squeakypants: they definitely cost less than $200 to make, but they have to make a profit margin
Dec 13 04:43:24 <Adamant> and they are comparible in price to a iPhone 3G
Dec 13 04:43:33 <Adamant> so I don't see what the big deal is
Dec 13 04:43:35 <Fredbo> nobody was discussing production costs
Dec 13 04:43:35 <squeakypants> adamant: a d1?
Dec 13 04:43:43 <squeakypants> adamant: isn't the d1 $400?
Dec 13 04:43:47 <Adamant> a G1, yeah
Dec 13 04:43:57 <squeakypants> a dev g1?
Dec 13 04:43:57 <snadge> the phones are too glitchy.. i very much doubt that mms functionality will be fixed.. the bluetooth support is woeful, theres no tethering etc
Dec 13 04:44:06 <Adamant> the unlocked developer phone is
Dec 13 04:44:08 <squeakypants> snadge: waht phone?
Dec 13 04:44:10 <snadge> im starting to think that i should've ignored my preference for linux and open source.. and just got a winmo phone
Dec 13 04:44:18 <squeakypants> adamant: yeah that's what i'm talking about :P
Dec 13 04:44:34 <Adamant> squeakypants: compare it to a unlocked iPhone 3G
Dec 13 04:44:37 <Adamant> the prices are about the same
Dec 13 04:44:48 <squeakypants> that's completely different
Dec 13 04:44:51 <Adamant> and Apple isn't going to put out a developer phone, at all
Dec 13 04:44:55 <squeakypants> apple doesn't sell unlocked iphones
Dec 13 04:45:02 <squeakypants> exactly
Dec 13 04:45:06 <squeakypants> so there's high demand
Dec 13 04:45:06 <Adamant> squeakypants: actually they do, in some markets.
Dec 13 04:45:22 <snadge> squeakypants: im talking about the g1.. i like linux, i like google.. i hate the iphone.. i absolutely loathe windows with a passion, but i cant help but feel my friends htc tytn ii, is way more functional
Dec 13 04:45:26 <Adamant> European mainly, where there are regs that require it
Dec 13 04:45:31 <squeakypants> and since it's done by random ebayers and such, they need a very high profit margin for it to be worth it
Dec 13 04:46:00 <squeakypants> snadge: really? i'm deciding whether to get one... wanna fill me in (on the g1)
Dec 13 04:46:05 <jbq> snadge: I forgot, do you have a US or a UK image in your G1?
Dec 13 04:46:10 <squeakypants> adamant: orly? didn't know that
Dec 13 04:46:12 <Adamant> snadge: the second gen devices will probably be quite a bit better
Dec 13 04:46:35 <snadge> i have a UK image, on a US g1, and im using it in australia
Dec 13 04:46:35 <borg> im loling
Dec 13 04:46:36 <squeakypants> heh, i don't care about 2nd gen devices if i spend $180 on a g1 ;)
Dec 13 04:46:38 <Fredbo> windows mobile has been around for how many years?  of course it has more software/gadgets/support
Dec 13 04:46:39 <borg> (rotating around the new jeep) it has ai
Dec 13 04:46:59 <squeakypants> whatever happened to enkin?
Dec 13 04:47:06 <squeakypants> i want my augmented reality games :)
Dec 13 04:47:06 <borg> finally, an order i want you to shut my ankles while i like a legitimate strategy!
Dec 13 04:47:21 <Adamant> huh?
Dec 13 04:47:25 <Adamant> are you a bot?
Dec 13 04:47:25 <borg> and shook hands with the borg are what matters >.>
Dec 13 04:47:56 <Fredbo> android is still what one might consider bleeding edge
Dec 13 04:47:57 <borg> i might put it in a memo entitled, shit i think rk
Dec 13 04:48:09 <jbq> snadge: I can't promise that this'll work because I'm not very familiar with the UK images, but if in your APN settings you might be able to set your primary APN with the APN type as "default", and your MMS APN with an APN type as "mms", at the same time, and it might actually work.
Dec 13 04:48:09 <snadge> well.. if the bluetooth support is improved in g2.. it would be nice if the web browser supported flash
Dec 13 04:48:09 <borg> there is a very fine line between not listening and im using it to church as a minute, did they put chatter bots in other messags
Dec 13 04:48:33 <Adamant> snadge: I agree more mobile browsers should do that
Dec 13 04:48:51 <Adamant> but iPhone doesn't.
Dec 13 04:49:23 <snadge> its hilarious and embarassing at the same time.. i bluetooth paired with my friends htc, and another friends sony.. and they cant actuall do anything with my phone
Dec 13 04:49:23 <borg> i might be able to set your primary apn with the bluetooth support is improved in a lot of special modifications myself.
Dec 13 04:50:18 <Adamant> jbq: any chance Chrome-like functionality will appear in Android? I'm specifically thinking about process seperation, if you can talk about that.
Dec 13 04:50:19 <borg> the cornerstone of any nutritious breakfast
Dec 13 04:50:26 <Lieutenant> !seen Stericson
Dec 13 04:50:40 <snadge> jbq: i will try the apn type thing you mentioned
Dec 13 04:50:41 <borg> jbq: any chance chrome-like functionality will appear in android?
Dec 13 04:50:45 <Adamant> borg: what's the breakfast of champions?
Dec 13 04:50:46 <borg> i hear they got some shit this mornin' made me an vincent caught you boys at breakfast
Dec 13 04:51:00 <squeakypants> umm
Dec 13 04:51:18 <squeakypants> adobe already got flash running on android ;)
Dec 13 04:51:26 <Adamant> haha nice, Taratino quotes
Dec 13 04:51:31 <jbq> I'd prefer to avoid making commitments in that area. Process separation seems like a natural fit for Android, but the memory requirements that go with it are worrisome given the amount of RAM in current phones.
Dec 13 04:51:31 <borg> that's the field with the amount of questions you
Dec 13 04:51:36 <squeakypants> and jdb aren't you guys working on stereo bluetooth?
Dec 13 04:51:48 <Adamant> jbq: understood
Dec 13 04:52:09 <Adamant> it's just nice to not have Flash pull down your entire session when it crashes
Dec 13 04:52:41 <squeakypants> borg: i love how the entire "what" seen is just sammy jackson trying to make the joke about "why you try to f*ck him like a b*tch"
Dec 13 04:53:06 * jbq has dinner. ttyl.
Dec 13 04:53:15 <Disconnect> yay dinner
Dec 13 04:55:05 <Damm> zinx, only way to alter the components is to get a G1 pre RC30... or a D1 :(
Dec 13 04:55:45 <Damm> however once you get to RC30... no way to go back, no way to setup a testkeys rescue image
Dec 13 04:58:42 <zinx> yeah, i'm aware, was just hoping there was some sort of official way to swap out the bootloader/etc
Dec 13 04:58:50 <zinx> now that the dev phone's out
Dec 13 04:59:07 <Damm> well there is a dev boot loader image out
Dec 13 04:59:12 <Damm> that you can flash if your device is pre-rc30
Dec 13 04:59:59 <Damm> if someone can find a .NBH boot loader that's signed we can toss on our SD Card... and flash the dev boot loader
Dec 13 05:00:02 <Damm> there's hope
Dec 13 05:00:59 <Damm> imo most people that are hacking on the G1 never updated to RC30... and are not concerned about going back
Dec 13 05:01:12 <zinx> yeah, but i never had anything before RC30 in the first place
Dec 13 05:01:20 <zinx> doesn't really help people who are just getting one.
Dec 13 05:01:22 <Fredbo> there is no "official" way because thats how tmobile wants it
Dec 13 05:01:49 <Damm> Fredbo, when there's a will there is a way.
Dec 13 05:01:51 <Damm> other then the D1
Dec 13 05:02:15 <Fredbo> ie, wait til its cracked
Dec 13 05:03:09 <Damm> Fredbo, yep
Dec 13 05:03:18 <Damm> it's that or buy a D1
Dec 13 05:03:23 <Damm> if i cared enough I'd buy a D1
Dec 13 05:04:01 <snadge> im just going to keep using my JF RC8 G1, until the G2 is released i think ;)
Dec 13 05:04:31 <snadge> and live with its little quirks and the fact that it doesnt do as much as a winmo phone.. but hey, i can browse the web, ssh into my servers.. play youtube videos.. woopdedoo ;)
Dec 13 05:04:40 <brocktice_afk> Was it concluded here earlier that there's no way to get the full IM client from the G1 onto the devphone?
Dec 13 05:05:06 <zinx> Damm: if i had enough money, i'd buy a D1
Dec 13 05:05:20 <brocktice> I just did some dangerous-y things in /system and almost lost google talk support as well
Dec 13 05:06:34 <ivantis2> man
Dec 13 05:06:43 <brocktice> ivantis2, you ever get your phone?
Dec 13 05:06:50 <brocktice> looks that way
Dec 13 05:07:06 <brocktice> Which client are you using?
Dec 13 05:07:32 <ivantis2> my G1 is soo cool
Dec 13 05:07:41 <ivantis2> using it now
Dec 13 05:08:09 <Disconnect> yah whats the good irc beta? i had hte url but lost it earlier today when i needed it
Dec 13 05:08:22 <brocktice> Disconnect, I was just trying to find that as well
Dec 13 05:08:28 <ivantis2> i alrdy 4got
Dec 13 05:08:32 <brocktice> http://countercultured.net/ircbeta.apk
Dec 13 05:08:38 <brocktice> <3 google
Dec 13 05:08:41 <brocktice> hope the link is still good
Dec 13 05:08:42 <Disconnect> kewl
Dec 13 05:08:43 <ivantis2> ya that one
Dec 13 05:09:13 <ivantis2> unfortunately, phone is rc30
Dec 13 05:09:20 <ivantis2> ah well
Dec 13 05:09:27 <brocktice> got my dev phone and had to re-set-up everything.
Dec 13 05:09:42 <brocktice> oh holy crap
Dec 13 05:09:45 <brocktice> it now has a google code page
Dec 13 05:09:49 <brocktice> and is all legit and stuff
Dec 13 05:09:58 <ivantis2> ?
Dec 13 05:10:14 <brocktice> it forwards
Dec 13 05:10:18 <brocktice> it's nyt's program
Dec 13 05:10:46 <ivantis2> so, the tmo ips are unroutable?
Dec 13 05:11:07 <brocktice> no
Dec 13 05:11:11 <brocktice> seem to be routing
Dec 13 05:11:17 <brocktice> I think they just have ping turned off
Dec 13 05:11:30 <ivantis2> oic
Dec 13 05:11:41 <brocktice> what is that called... can't remember
Dec 13 05:11:43 <brocktice> something echo
Dec 13 05:11:57 <brocktice> ICMP echo
Dec 13 05:11:59 <ivantis2> so SSH would work to phone?
Dec 13 05:12:00 <Fredbo> icmp
Dec 13 05:12:03 <Disconnect> yah i found the first link earlier but didn't think it was the right one cuz i recalled a google code url. shoulda clicked it anyway :)
Dec 13 05:13:11 <ivantis2> what is the bar-code scanner app called?
Dec 13 05:13:18 <brocktice> lol
Dec 13 05:13:20 <brocktice> barcode scanner
Dec 13 05:13:41 <brockdroid> whee
Dec 13 05:13:43 <ivantis2> ??
Dec 13 05:13:48 <brockdroid> works great
Dec 13 05:14:15 <brockdroid> doesn't show up as tmo because I'm on wifi.
Dec 13 05:14:21 <ivantis2> brb
Dec 13 05:15:25 <ivantis2> everyone locked their phone with the dot combination?
Dec 13 05:16:24 <ivantis2> i did to keep nosy parents/teachers from checking my email & stuff
Dec 13 05:17:22 <brockdroid> I did before
Dec 13 05:17:25 <ivantis2> man this phone is cool
Dec 13 05:17:44 <brockdroid> but I got annoyed it took like 5 minutes to unlock the phone
Dec 13 05:17:58 <brockdroid> between the button and the dots
Dec 13 05:18:24 <`krstnsn> http://androidirc.googlecode.com/files/irc-beta-20081212.apk
Dec 13 05:18:28 <`krstnsn> oops
Dec 13 05:19:45 <`krstnsn> anyways
Dec 13 05:19:47 <`krstnsn> its this
Dec 13 05:19:48 <`krstnsn> http://code.google.com/p/androidirc/
Dec 13 05:23:03 <ivantis2> how do i close an application?
Dec 13 05:25:19 <`krstnsn> you dont
Dec 13 05:25:33 <`krstnsn> if the app doesnt have an option you dont
Dec 13 05:25:34 <`krstnsn> oh
Dec 13 05:25:35 <`krstnsn> he left
Dec 13 05:25:37 <`krstnsn> FUCKER
Dec 13 05:25:47 <Nafai> Be nice
Dec 13 05:25:49 <zinx> :/
Dec 13 05:26:23 <`krstnsn> oh ya
Dec 13 05:26:25 <`krstnsn> i was joking
Dec 13 05:26:40 <Nafai> :)
Dec 13 05:27:16 <snadge> i still havnt gotten over the whole 'cant close applications' thing
Dec 13 05:27:23 <snadge> its not like the ram on the things is unlimited
Dec 13 05:27:47 <snadge> i just dont trust software to make decisions on my own behalf :P
Dec 13 05:27:47 <`krstnsn> oh ya
Dec 13 05:27:50 <Disconnect> snadge: so? have you had a foreground app run out of memory? they'd love to hear about htat.
Dec 13 05:27:59 <`krstnsn> hahah
Dec 13 05:28:01 <`krstnsn> well you see
Dec 13 05:28:06 <`krstnsn> heres an example
Dec 13 05:28:06 <snadge> not yet no.. the key word being yet ;)
Dec 13 05:28:09 <Disconnect> it'd be a pretty important bug in the system
Dec 13 05:28:28 <snadge> i can imagine this app called "memoryguts" .. that just allocates all available system memory, and 100% cpu.. and doesnt have an option to quit
Dec 13 05:28:38 <snadge> :P
Dec 13 05:28:42 <`krstnsn> go browse to a webpage, switch to another app use it, switch to another use it.
Dec 13 05:28:46 <Disconnect> snadge: hit "home" and it'll get killed off when home needs the ram
Dec 13 05:28:48 <`krstnsn> then go back to the browser
Dec 13 05:28:52 <`krstnsn> itll reload the page
Dec 13 05:28:54 <zinx> snadge: don't install it :x
Dec 13 05:29:02 <snadge> but what if i wanted memoryguts to continue :P
Dec 13 05:29:02 <`krstnsn> it gave up the mem to give to other apps
Dec 13 05:29:15 <Disconnect> Krstnsn`: thats not ram missing. thats it doing really crappy-ass caching.
Dec 13 05:30:15 <Disconnect> there are a few reasons for killing apps in 'real life' - cycle it off and on (eg when marketplace caches a connection problem or no data, all it needs is a restart). stop or prevent autolaunch apps.
Dec 13 05:30:55 <`krstnsn> well
Dec 13 05:31:11 <`krstnsn> i was under the understanding that the browser thing is an example of efficiancy
Dec 13 05:31:18 <snadge> i just dont like this whole not having root thing.. not being able to quit programs.. i'd like to think of the phone as a mini computer
Dec 13 05:31:29 <Disconnect> snadge: then get a phone that is a mini computer.
Dec 13 05:31:29 <snadge> its like the phone is treating me like a retard
Dec 13 05:31:32 <`krstnsn> well
Dec 13 05:32:04 <`krstnsn> oh shit
Dec 13 05:32:10 <`krstnsn> that sucks
Dec 13 05:32:12 <snadge> i should be able to log in as root and type rm -rf / .. and totally screw the thing ;)
Dec 13 05:32:19 <snadge> on a consumer device hehe
Dec 13 05:32:47 <`krstnsn> no
Dec 13 05:32:52 <`krstnsn> but you should have the option
Dec 13 05:32:56 <`krstnsn> of root
Dec 13 05:33:01 <Disconnect> snadge: you can.
Dec 13 05:33:05 <`krstnsn> w/ a security code
Dec 13 05:33:19 <Disconnect> boot with home+end and hit alt-w when you see the triangle. boom. rm -rf /
Dec 13 05:33:21 <RyeBrye> wow. there is a port knocking app in the market
Dec 13 05:33:30 <`krstnsn> haha ya
Dec 13 05:33:42 <snadge> Disconnect: what will that actually do?
Dec 13 05:33:45 <zinx> i'm trying to find another vuln, not terribly optimistic though
Dec 13 05:33:56 <Fredbo> no, thats rm -rf /data
Dec 13 05:33:59 <Disconnect> reformats /data
Dec 13 05:36:48 <Fredbo> has anyone hacked the system enough to get it to mount a partition on the sdcard as /data?
Dec 13 05:37:43 <Disconnect> not that hard if you have root and either eng bootloader or a trusted recovery partition.
Dec 13 05:37:57 <Disconnect> (in case it breaks..)
Dec 13 05:38:13 <Disconnect> anyway its time to go horizontal for a few hours.
Dec 13 05:39:42 <RyeBrye> Disconnect: is that a euphamism?
Dec 13 05:40:45 <`krstnsn> haha
Dec 13 05:46:37 <Fredbo> hmmm so how many different irc clients are there so far
Dec 13 05:47:33 <squeakypants> fredbo: for android or in general lol
Dec 13 05:47:38 <squeakypants> in general a lot ;)
Dec 13 05:47:58 <Fredbo> for android
Dec 13 05:48:13 <`krstnsn> one that i know
Dec 13 05:48:31 <`krstnsn> anyone know anyothers?
Dec 13 05:57:06 <zinx> stock t-mobile firmware could be considered malicious by the android team :P  * resists (or attempts to resist) the user's effort to uninstall it; * attempts to automatically spread itself to other devices; * hides its files and/or processes;
Dec 13 05:59:12 <zinx> the general level of security present in the code is good, but annoying too..
Dec 13 06:00:20 <zinx> anyone know what the default permissions of /data/data are off-hand?
Dec 13 06:01:49 <zinx> meh, seems to not be sufficient to exploit the race condition in any case
Dec 13 06:02:45 <pffft> wow ... merge much?
Dec 13 06:04:15 <`krstnsn> ?
Dec 13 06:04:21 <`krstnsn> merg3 what
Dec 13 06:09:05 <ivantis2> yawn
Dec 13 06:09:19 <ivantis2> almost me bed time!
Dec 13 06:21:37 <ivantis2> man the camera on this is in a bad spot
Dec 13 06:22:54 <ivantis2> right under my hand
Dec 13 06:30:01 <Krstnsn`> playing some bncaa
Dec 13 06:41:15 <bparker06> any devs around?
Dec 13 06:48:37 <heatX> hey anyone know if i were to directly connect my internet to my pc if i could route the connection to my wireless router via usb?
Dec 13 06:48:47 <DarkriftX> no
Dec 13 06:48:56 <DarkriftX> they dont work backwards via usb
Dec 13 06:49:09 <DarkriftX> lan would prob work though
Dec 13 06:50:39 <heatX> well i'm having issues connecting to irc via my pc on a wireless network and i'm thinking it's the firewall on the router
Dec 13 06:51:08 <heatX> i'm just trying to figure out a solution
Dec 13 06:51:11 <DarkriftX> connecting shouldnt be blocked
Dec 13 06:51:26 <DarkriftX> windows firewal blocks it though
Dec 13 06:54:05 <heatX> aight, ill see if that's it
Dec 13 06:57:14 <heatX> firewall is disabled and i tried disabling avg firewall and it still didnt work
Dec 13 06:57:34 <heatX> any idea what else it could be?
Dec 13 06:57:59 <JesusFreke> do a traceroute, see where it's dropping
Dec 13 06:58:14 <JesusFreke> actually, that may not work. nevermind
Dec 13 06:58:20 <JesusFreke> ignore me. I'm tired :p
Dec 13 06:58:25 <heatX> lol
Dec 13 06:58:46 <heatX> bahhh this is pissing me off so bad
Dec 13 06:59:48 <anno^da_> does someone here know that: http://groups.google.com/group/android-developers/browse_thread/thread/3844c4c41f5c01e6# ?
Dec 13 07:01:37 <kennyyu> hi there, it reads in http://code.google.com/android/reference/android/view/View.OnCreateContextMenuListener.html that "It is not safe to hold onto the menu after this method returns. " (the description of ``public void onCreateContextMenu''). i don't understand what 'to hold onto the menu' here means. could someone perhaps explain it to me? :) thanks
Dec 13 07:02:54 <JesusFreke> for example, storing the menu object in a class member variable
Dec 13 07:04:02 <whatis> how long does the emulator normally take to launch?
Dec 13 07:04:20 <kennyyu> JesusFreke: oh, what might be the danger doing so?
Dec 13 07:04:26 <Damm> whatis, first time always takes the longest
Dec 13 07:04:41 <whatis> Damm: it finally booted up after i sent that message
Dec 13 07:04:41 <Damm> after the first time it'll be easy
Dec 13 07:05:07 <whatis> ahh much faster, cool
Dec 13 07:05:17 <JesusFreke> kennyyu, I don't know offhand.
Dec 13 07:05:29 <JesusFreke> I'm not that familiar with the specifics of the android framework
Dec 13 07:06:02 * spikebike ponders writing an interactive graph in SVG
Dec 13 07:06:07 <kennyyu> JesusFreke: nvm and thanks ;)
Dec 13 07:06:08 <Damm> JF, so is the D1 worth it?
Dec 13 07:06:31 <JesusFreke> yes. it's worth the $25 extra dollars over a G1
Dec 13 07:06:50 * Damm paid nothing for this G1
Dec 13 07:07:00 <Damm> it's nice when work pays for things
Dec 13 07:08:54 <whatis> i love my g1
Dec 13 07:09:06 <JesusFreke> that was random :p
Dec 13 07:09:22 <whatis> JesusFreke: you were talking about the g1 :)
Dec 13 07:09:31 <JesusFreke> this is the android channel
Dec 13 07:09:35 <JesusFreke> we're always talking about the G1 :p
Dec 13 07:10:28 <kennyyu> hi there.. a newbie question about Activity's methods: may i know what are the differences in between on{Context|Menu|Option}ItemSelected (in class Activity)?
Dec 13 07:12:01 <orospakr> Hey, who is Esmertec?
Dec 13 07:12:05 <orospakr> http://www.esmertec.com/
Dec 13 07:13:08 <bparker06> any developers around?
Dec 13 07:14:29 <orospakr> weird.  apparently there is a protocol cellphones can use to chat called IMPS.  I'm not sure what the transport is.
Dec 13 07:14:41 <JesusFreke> carrier pidgin maybe?
Dec 13 07:14:50 <orospakr> pigeon ;)
Dec 13 07:14:54 <JesusFreke> instant message pidgin service? :D
Dec 13 07:14:58 <orospakr> heh
Dec 13 07:15:06 <orospakr> durr, I should have got that. ;)
Dec 13 07:15:35 <JesusFreke> sorry I can't be more helpful :D
Dec 13 07:17:28 <whatis> how do you rotate the emulator screen?
Dec 13 07:17:38 <orospakr> apparently it's a spec with a eye towards replacing sms/mms, if I understand rightly.
Dec 13 07:20:45 <spikebike> sounds like xmpp to me
Dec 13 07:21:24 <orospakr> heh
Dec 13 07:21:36 <orospakr> if only there was an included XMPP implementation. :)
Dec 13 07:22:13 <bparker06> anyone familiar with PhoneStateListener?
Dec 13 07:22:18 <orospakr> huh, it seems that IM protocols are built right into the IM app.
Dec 13 07:24:35 <spikebike> funny that
Dec 13 07:25:35 <orospakr> I would have expected them to be factored out.
Dec 13 07:26:02 <orospakr> This means that in order to ship the version with the proprietary protocol code they would have had to branch the entire IM program.
Dec 13 07:29:53 <orospakr> Although I suppose that isn't so bad, considering they use git. :)
Dec 13 07:32:05 <orospakr> whoa, apparently the T-Mo IM protocols just use SMS to a server backend somewhere!
Dec 13 07:33:04 <spikebike> cept for xmpp
Dec 13 07:33:47 <orospakr> (which is apparently the GTalk proprietary protocol, but I can't read the source of that part to confirm)
Dec 13 07:34:31 <orospakr> well, it seems like branching IM and adding support for something else shouldn't be too hard.
Dec 13 07:45:42 <kennyyu> sorry, may i know what is a context menu? how is it different from a options-menu?
Dec 13 07:49:11 <kennyyu> or is the 'context menu' really the menu displaced on 'click-and-hold'?
Dec 13 08:03:19 <kennyyu> s/displaced/displayed/
Dec 13 08:03:21 <kennyyu> sorry.. ;)
Dec 13 08:08:28 <JesusFreke> kenny, as far as I know (which doesn't say much :)) the context menu is what shows when you click and hold on something
Dec 13 08:14:03 <snadge> is it worth switching from uk rc8 to the dev ver?
Dec 13 08:14:41 <JesusFreke> what's in the dev version you need?
Dec 13 08:16:21 <snadge> nothing really
Dec 13 08:16:34 <JesusFreke> sounds like you answered your question :)
Dec 13 08:16:45 <snadge> i wanted to fix the mms support, but i give up really
Dec 13 08:18:12 <`krstnsn> haha
Dec 13 08:18:31 <snadge> its too hard :p
Dec 13 08:19:50 <JesusFreke> what do you mean by fix it?
Dec 13 08:20:53 <JesusFreke> oooo. finally got fastboot to work from my ubuntu VM
Dec 13 08:21:16 <snadge> well, i can send mms messages if i delete my internet apn,
Dec 13 08:21:27 <JesusFreke> ah. the split apn thing?
Dec 13 08:21:47 <snadge> i receive mms, but when i press to download button, it has an error
Dec 13 08:24:43 <kennyyu> JesusFreke: thanks :)
Dec 13 08:24:55 <JesusFreke> np
Dec 13 08:25:42 <kennyyu> you really have confirmed my guessing was correct :)
Dec 13 08:25:50 <snadge> unable to download. it also does this on another aussie network 3 (hutchison)
Dec 13 08:31:06 <kennyyu> wow building android is much faster than i expected when i do it incrementally :) cool
Dec 13 08:31:46 <JesusFreke> yeah, it's just the first build that takes forever :)
Dec 13 08:32:38 <kennyyu> ya really impressive.
Dec 13 08:32:52 * kennyyu did the same in mozilla, which was really a different story..
Dec 13 08:39:28 <anno^da_> Is there a way to find out if the screen is locked ?
Dec 13 08:41:25 <orospakr> hey, what is the proper way to update an Android UI from a Thread?  is Context.sendBroadcast() thread-safe?
Dec 13 08:58:39 <jsharkey> MAN that was one pile of python hacking
Dec 13 08:59:11 <jsharkey> havent really taken a break since 11am today
Dec 13 08:59:37 <jsharkey> its worth it tho ^^
Dec 13 09:00:04 <jsharkey> have an awesome new home app
Dec 13 09:00:22 <swetland> written in python?
Dec 13 09:00:38 <jsharkey> its nowhere near functionality of current home app, but helps with two missing features
Dec 13 09:00:41 <jsharkey> well three
Dec 13 09:00:52 <jsharkey> swetland: well i used a pile of python for some backend stuff
Dec 13 09:03:15 * jsharkey zzzzz
Dec 13 09:08:52 <kennyyu> hi there.. :)
Dec 13 09:08:58 <kennyyu> about webkit...:
Dec 13 09:10:04 <kennyyu> i wanna get the DOM tree of the document being displayed by the viewport of the current tab of the Browser... not sure which class should i consider to use?
Dec 13 09:10:18 <kennyyu> WebView doesn't seem to have a method getting the tree...
Dec 13 09:11:01 <here-erse> hi all
Dec 13 09:12:04 <here-erse> any good app?? in market
Dec 13 09:18:08 <Krstnsn`> nyt whats new with your sweetass app?
Dec 13 10:24:30 <warren> hmm.... Android Dev Phone or G1?
Dec 13 10:41:05 <Phlogi> can I copy paste text from an email somehow?
Dec 13 12:39:25 <flaushy> hi, is there any nice soap client for android? we are haveing problems with tuxpan
Dec 13 12:39:43 <flaushy> -client + library
Dec 13 13:40:48 <kirberich> ivantis, so did you phone arrive yesterday?
Dec 13 13:40:50 <kirberich> +r
Dec 13 13:53:39 <brocktice> kirberich, he did get his phone
Dec 13 13:54:50 <brocktice> 23:06 < brocktice> ivantis2, you ever get your phone?
Dec 13 13:54:50 <brocktice> 23:07 < ivantis2> -my G1 is soo cool
Dec 13 13:54:50 <brocktice> 23:07 < ivantis2> -using it now
Dec 13 13:55:25 <kirberich> seems ups likes everyone better than me ;)
Dec 13 13:55:31 <brocktice> :(
Dec 13 13:55:37 <brocktice> Well he's in the states, so it was FedEx
Dec 13 13:55:41 <kirberich> ah ok
Dec 13 13:55:49 <kirberich> my damn phone lies about 15 miles from here
Dec 13 13:55:58 <brocktice> Or maybe not if it was not a dev phone.
Dec 13 13:56:03 <brocktice> And you don't have it yet why?
Dec 13 13:56:08 <kirberich> I have no idea
Dec 13 13:56:17 <kirberich> it has just been lying there the whole day yesterday
Dec 13 13:56:22 <brocktice> :(
Dec 13 13:56:26 <kirberich> expected delivery on monday
Dec 13 13:56:57 <brocktice> lame
Dec 13 13:57:24 <kirberich> lame indeed
Dec 13 13:57:28 <kirberich> and highly frustrating
Dec 13 13:57:49 <kirberich> and all the other delivery companies are happily driving along outside my window
Dec 13 13:57:56 <kirberich> just not ups ;)
Dec 13 13:59:21 <ttuttle> I
Dec 13 14:04:07 * flaushy wants a g1 as well :(
Dec 13 14:05:11 <brocktice> Gave up trying to get menuconfig to work on the mac
Dec 13 14:05:27 <brocktice> Building android on my linux box.
Dec 13 14:09:51 <jbq> brocktice: are you trying to compile the kernel?
Dec 13 14:10:58 <brocktice> jbq, yeah
Dec 13 14:11:06 <brocktice> it can't find libncurses
Dec 13 14:11:24 <brocktice> Actually was just trying to compile modules
Dec 13 14:11:27 <ivantis2> how can i just close an app? like browser
Dec 13 14:11:36 <brocktice> But still, 'make config' is not something I want to go through
Dec 13 14:11:40 <ivantis2> it stays open
Dec 13 14:11:47 <jbq> brocktice: I've heard that compiling the kernel on a mac was pretty hard, and all our kernel engineers work on linux.
Dec 13 14:11:48 <brocktice> Especially on a device I'm not that familiar with
Dec 13 14:12:05 <brocktice> jbq, Yeah I've got a 'server' in the house running ubuntu, so I'm doing a repo sync to that now.
Dec 13 14:12:22 <kirberich> ivantis2, you can't
Dec 13 14:12:34 <brocktice> Thanks for the clarification, though, glad to hear I made the right choice by not continuing to bang my head against the wall.
Dec 13 14:13:04 <ivantis2> kirberich, ??
Dec 13 14:13:16 <brocktice> ivantis2, the system frees resources as it needs them
Dec 13 14:13:26 <kirberich> ivantis2, apparently there is no way to manually close a program
Dec 13 14:14:31 <ivantis2> how stupid. so i should just go to a no-JS page when done with browser?
Dec 13 14:15:05 <jbq> ivantis2: it's not stupid. It's logical given the level of integration between all the applications on the phone.
Dec 13 14:15:39 <ivantis2> and the small amount of control a user has
Dec 13 14:20:42 <BlindOracle> brocktice: I had the same problem with nvurses for adb. I had to create a sym link to fix it up. Afterwards, it linked no problem.
Dec 13 14:21:43 <BlindOracle> brocktice_afk: ^^
Dec 13 14:24:51 <laura--> You can close your own program if you want
Dec 13 14:33:25 <anno^da_> http://www.mobilecrunch.com/2008/12/12/best-of-stupid-android-market-comments-by-slightly-stupid-people/  <- Just true. The comments are pretty useless. Especially for the developer cause he can't reply to specific comments.
Dec 13 14:34:07 <jbq> anno^da_: yup. we're working on improving that. the current state is revoltingly sad.
Dec 13 14:35:16 <anno^da_> jbq: nice to hear that.
Dec 13 14:35:47 <anno^da_> It was just pretty annoying to see people having problems with my last release and I had no chance to reply.
Dec 13 14:36:11 <anno^da_> Except the big space of 325 characters :P in the description.
Dec 13 14:37:14 <anno^da_> jbq: Is there a possibility to test the upgrade process from one release to the next without putting the app in the market? When I'm trying to do that via adb I'm always getting the "app already exists" error.
Dec 13 14:37:49 <jbq> anno^da_: I don't know. I don't have much visibility over the actual developer processes.
Dec 13 14:38:06 <brocktice> BlindOracle, anno^da_ adb install -r
Dec 13 14:38:09 <brocktice> err
Dec 13 14:38:10 <brocktice> sorry
Dec 13 14:38:16 <brocktice> anno^da_, adb install -r
Dec 13 14:38:18 <anno^da_> ahh adb install -r
Dec 13 14:38:19 <anno^da_> nice
Dec 13 14:38:25 <anno^da_> that sounds great
Dec 13 14:38:30 <brocktice> "reinstall"
Dec 13 14:38:34 <anno^da_> yeah :)
Dec 13 14:38:55 <ivantis2> would anyone here say that the G1 is a chick magnet?
Dec 13 14:39:04 <brocktice> lol
Dec 13 14:39:05 <tomh-> lol
Dec 13 14:39:07 <anno^da_> brocktice: have you got a force close error with my latest 0.3.7 release while upgrading?
Dec 13 14:39:22 <brocktice> anno^da_, actually I just got my devphone, so I'm doing fresh installs of everything
Dec 13 14:39:47 <ivantis2> well?
Dec 13 14:39:53 <ivantis2> is it?
Dec 13 14:40:16 <brocktice> ivantis2, I don't know, my wife coveted mine until I gave it to her, does that count?
Dec 13 14:40:17 <kirberich> ivantis2, highly doubtful.
Dec 13 14:40:33 <anno^da_> ah nice :)
Dec 13 14:40:38 <anno^da_> and how is it the dev phone :)
Dec 13 14:40:58 <brocktice> anno^da_, a lot like my G1 was before I stupidly reverted it to stock and allowed it to get rc30ed
Dec 13 14:41:02 <ivantis2> well, a lot of girls have sent me messages since i got it
Dec 13 14:41:27 <brocktice> But I do have androids on skateboards
Dec 13 14:41:32 <brocktice> And a custom splash screen.
Dec 13 14:41:32 <anno^da_> ah well I was lucky to get the custom releases installed :)
Dec 13 14:41:38 <ivantis2> 240 texts since last night, mostly girls
Dec 13 14:41:40 <anno^da_> I do have it as well :)
Dec 13 14:41:49 <anno^da_> (on my normal T-mob G1)
Dec 13 14:41:51 <brocktice> Also, it lacks the non-google-talk IM providers
Dec 13 14:42:09 <anno^da_> Well since it is no direct instant messaging it sucks anyway
Dec 13 14:42:24 <anno^da_> Android lacks a really good IM app since now.
Dec 13 14:42:39 <anno^da_> untill/since (what is it :D)
Dec 13 14:42:52 <brocktice> I'd say it still lacks one
Dec 13 14:42:59 <brocktice> Doesn't work well in that sentence structure
Dec 13 14:43:03 <anno^da_> ah even better :)
Dec 13 14:43:09 <SanMehat> morning
Dec 13 14:43:14 <anno^da_> It still lacks a proper IM app. :-)
Dec 13 14:43:14 <ttuttle> SanMehat: morning!
Dec 13 14:43:17 <brocktice> Morning SanMehat
Dec 13 14:43:23 <anno^da_> morning SanMehat
Dec 13 14:43:30 <brocktice> anno^da_, yeah that's more natural :)
Dec 13 14:43:32 <SanMehat> ugh
Dec 13 14:43:35 <SanMehat> why am i awake
Dec 13 14:43:44 <brocktice> SanMehat, West coast?
Dec 13 14:43:46 <SanMehat> yeah
Dec 13 14:43:53 <jbq> Hey SanMehat
Dec 13 14:43:55 <brocktice> Don't know... it's saturday.
Dec 13 14:43:55 <anno^da_> Fine.
Dec 13 14:44:00 <brocktice> Is your boss Bill Lumbergh?
Dec 13 14:44:05 <SanMehat> brocktice: swetland is my boss
Dec 13 14:44:07 <SanMehat> :)
Dec 13 14:44:08 <anno^da_> In Germany it's 4 PM :P
Dec 13 14:44:11 <SanMehat> hey jbq :)
Dec 13 14:44:20 <ttuttle> SanMehat, jbq: morning
Dec 13 14:44:21 <brocktice> Yeah, I'm going to need you to come in on Saturday, thanks.
Dec 13 14:44:35 * jbq waves at ttuttle 
Dec 13 14:44:51 <kirberich> anno^da_, you're in germany? how did you get a g1? ;)
Dec 13 14:45:13 <brocktice> anyone know offhand what JAVA_HOME should be on ubuntu?
Dec 13 14:45:26 <jbq> Speaking of west coast, this time it's really the end of summer.
Dec 13 14:45:27 <brocktice> After installing the sun JDK? it's not set from /etc/profile.d apparently
Dec 13 14:45:39 <anno^da_> kirberich: Yeah I'm in Germany. I got it imported from eBay.
Dec 13 14:46:02 <anno^da_> For about 430€ including unlock, customs, shipping.
Dec 13 14:46:04 <brocktice> anno^da_, I've got an unused train ticket from Munich to Jena if you have any use for that :)
Dec 13 14:46:09 <kirberich> anno^da_, ah ok. where in germany are you? I'm in Dortmund
Dec 13 14:46:15 <anno^da_> In Munich :)
Dec 13 14:46:30 <brocktice> Because my German sucks and the ticket agent heard "Jena" when I said "Vienna" instead of "Wien"
Dec 13 14:46:55 <kirberich> brocktice, couldn't you just have gotten a refund?
Dec 13 14:47:16 <brocktice> kirberich, No, long story short I would have missed my flight back to the states if I'd stuck around for that.
Dec 13 14:47:17 <SanMehat> brocktice: you should have just taken the trip :)
Dec 13 14:47:18 <anno^da_> kirberich: ah nice you had been in Germany?
Dec 13 14:47:29 <anno^da_> Ahh I meant brocktice
Dec 13 14:47:30 * SanMehat wants to go to munich
Dec 13 14:47:31 <brocktice> Tried calling but no joy
Dec 13 14:47:38 <kirberich> I was gonna say ;)
Dec 13 14:48:04 <anno^da_> SanMehat: Just fly to Germany ;) -
Dec 13 14:48:21 <SanMehat> anno^da_: i probably will next year at some point
Dec 13 14:49:03 <brocktice> SanMehat, Make sure you check out J?dlerwirt if you go.
Dec 13 14:49:18 <brocktice> I think that's the name.
Dec 13 14:49:41 <anno^da_> haha I don't even know that. What's that ? brocktice
Dec 13 14:49:43 <Disconnect> morning all
Dec 13 14:50:07 <BlindOracle> is anyone successfully using the code sourcery c++ compiler? I can't seem to get even basic c++ to actually link into a binary
Dec 13 14:50:08 <anno^da_> brocktice: this one: http://www.mobilecrunch.com/2008/12/12/best-of-stupid-android-market-comments-by-slightly-stupid-people/
Dec 13 14:50:10 <anno^da_> ahh
Dec 13 14:50:16 <anno^da_> http://www.jodlerwirt-muenchen.net/
Dec 13 14:50:18 <anno^da_> this one :D
Dec 13 14:50:31 * jbq would like to visit Munich one of those days.
Dec 13 14:50:47 <BlindOracle> “Like a clingy ex-girlfriend that keeps re-installing itself. Seriously, how the heck do you remove this permanently? Worst app ever.” by Erin.
Dec 13 14:50:48 <BlindOracle> lol
Dec 13 14:51:01 <kirberich> well, let's have a #android meet in munich ;)
Dec 13 14:51:11 <anno^da_> kirberich: that would be nice. :-)
Dec 13 14:51:25 <jbq> it's only a 5-hr drive from my parents' home, but I don't really wanna do that in winter.
Dec 13 14:51:41 <BlindOracle> any "must have" apps I should install?
Dec 13 14:51:46 <kirberich> 20 geeks sitting in a bar with their cell phones, it would sure be awesome.
Dec 13 14:53:07 <brocktice> brb
Dec 13 14:56:44 <brocktice> anno^da_, yeah that looks like it
Dec 13 14:56:46 <brocktice> good times.
Dec 13 15:07:46 <Disconnect> BlindOracle: k9sms, k-9, anycut, twitdroid..
Dec 13 15:08:42 <CompBrain> I still cant get a SMS app to deal with message threads with >400 msgs
Dec 13 15:08:52 <CompBrain> lots of not responding dialogs
Dec 13 15:10:31 <BlindOracle> Disconnect: Thanks. ya...been googl'n. Seems someone initially told me to use the wrong compiler. Oh well. D/L'ing right compiler now. Looks like a couple of false starts (prebuilt is too incomplete for c++, and CS' EABI-arm compiler is the wrong one)but I think I'm on the right path now.
Dec 13 15:10:57 <BlindOracle> The GNU/Linux ARM compiler is the one you want
Dec 13 15:11:27 <fnord> does the g1 support 16gb cards?
Dec 13 15:11:31 <Disconnect> yes
Dec 13 15:13:09 <SanMehat> fnord: yup
Dec 13 15:13:11 <fnord> woot, gonna buy one of those now
Dec 13 15:13:12 <fnord> :D
Dec 13 15:13:24 <fnord> http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820211245
Dec 13 15:13:28 <SanMehat> fnord: soon to support high speed cards
Dec 13 15:13:56 <Disconnect> just one quick note about that?
Dec 13 15:14:00 <fnord> iirc they do already. or class 6 is noticably faster
Dec 13 15:14:04 <Disconnect> g1 only supports microsdhc
Dec 13 15:14:06 <fnord> from what someone says
Dec 13 15:14:07 <Disconnect> ....
Dec 13 15:14:08 <fnord> yeah
Dec 13 15:14:10 <SanMehat> fnord: high speed != class
Dec 13 15:14:18 <Disconnect> unless you have scissors and/or a file, thats not gonna work
Dec 13 15:14:19 <fnord> oh
Dec 13 15:14:21 <fnord> crap
Dec 13 15:14:24 <SanMehat> fnord: the class number is for minimum guaranteed read/write to the underlying media
Dec 13 15:14:26 <fnord> that's not micro ><
Dec 13 15:14:31 <Disconnect> microsd 16g is about $80
Dec 13 15:14:40 <SanMehat> fnord: a 'high speed' card uses a faster clockrate on the bus
Dec 13 15:15:24 <fnord> ahhh
Dec 13 15:15:50 <anno^da_> What could be wrong with my app? Users report that they uninstalled the app and the menue icon still appears in the menue.
Dec 13 15:16:57 <laura--> I think I'm the only person in the world that loves the comments in the Marketplace
Dec 13 15:17:11 <SanMehat> laura--: oh?
Dec 13 15:17:56 <fnord> anno^da_, check androidmanifest.xml?
Dec 13 15:19:05 <anno^da_> fnord: Well but what in the manifest ?
Dec 13 15:19:15 <laura--> Yeah.. heck, I check out every new app not even because I think it's worthwhile, but just to read some of the comments
Dec 13 15:20:57 <laura--> Hey.. so I've got Winx64.  What would be the easiest linux image to use to get up and running so I could debug my G1 with my computer?
Dec 13 15:21:19 <Versed> ubuntu?
Dec 13 15:21:31 <fnord> anno^da_, dunno XD
Dec 13 15:21:35 <laura--> This emulator really drags on my cpu -- I'm guessing it'll be better if I could run my app on my phone directly
Dec 13 15:21:45 <laura--> Yeah, prolly ubuntu I guess..
Dec 13 15:22:13 <laura--> Can anyone confirm that it's more productive to develop/debug directly on the phone rather than using the emulator?
Dec 13 15:22:30 <Disconnect> i prefer the emulator but you -must- spotcheck on the phone..
Dec 13 15:22:45 * Disconnect had a problem with his listview that didn't show on the emu but did on the device
Dec 13 15:23:32 <laura--> Disconnect: Huh.. does your emulator drain like 50% of your cput when it's just sitting there?
Dec 13 15:23:56 <Disconnect> not really. eclipse will periodically suck down all my ram if i'm using the layout editor (typing into the xml fields)
Dec 13 15:23:56 * SanMehat almost has his new fsck.vfat working
Dec 13 15:25:24 <laura--> What?  Really?  So if I'm running a 2.6GHz machine, dual core.. and my emulator takes 50% of my cpu while just idleing... that's absolutely not your experience with it?
Dec 13 15:25:51 <laura--> Eclipse works totally fine for me
Dec 13 15:26:06 <BlindOracle> any recommended carrying cases for the g1?
Dec 13 15:28:02 * anno^da_ notes that the emulator runs Android much faster than the G1 does. (on my machine :) )
Dec 13 15:28:23 <laura--> arg
Dec 13 15:28:27 <BlindOracle> anno^da_: same here until opengl apps run
Dec 13 15:28:36 <laura--> well glad to hear that before I went down the ubuntu route
Dec 13 15:28:37 <alexissoft> anno^da_: clusters don't count.
Dec 13 15:28:44 <BlindOracle> for opengl, well, the one I tested, my g1 was 10x faster than the emulator
Dec 13 15:28:45 <alexissoft> :p
Dec 13 15:29:12 <SanMehat> your mom
Dec 13 15:29:24 <alexissoft> BlindOracle: i don't think qemu relays OpenGL calls to the video chip
Dec 13 15:30:05 <anno^da_> alexissoft: well it is a normal macbook pro :)
Dec 13 15:30:13 <jbq> alexissoft: definitely not. OpenGL on the emulator is pure ARM software running under emulation.
Dec 13 15:30:15 <BlindOracle> alexissoft: nope. andyross (IIRC) said that's the fact and not likely to happen because of the required up call complexity
Dec 13 15:30:18 <anno^da_> So no real cluster needed :D
Dec 13 15:31:10 <jbq> What'd be nice would be to call through to some x86 code. involving the actual PC HW accel would hurt, but getting off the ARM sandbox would be reasonable. It's a truckload of work, though.
Dec 13 15:32:28 <BlindOracle> alright...I'm off to get breakfast and coffee...mmmm...coffeeeeeee...
Dec 13 15:32:35 <Disconnect> BlindOracle: lemme find the case jf got, he said he liked it.
Dec 13 15:32:58 <BlindOracle> Disconnect: please feel free to post url...I ordered something fast/cheap but have no idea of fit or function
Dec 13 15:33:20 <Disconnect> ah he just wanted a basic sleeve
Dec 13 15:33:44 <Disconnect> http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B001GLRQX6?ie=UTF8&tag=scubanetwo-20&linkCode=as2&camp=1789&creative=390957&creativeASIN=B001GLRQX6 (yes its got my referral tag, be nice :) ..)
Dec 13 15:34:10 <Disconnect> fwiw i'm actually assembling an article this morning about basic g1/adp1 accessories (memory cards, carrying cases, screen protectors)
Dec 13 15:35:17 <alexissoft> jbq: qemu is still slow for OpenGL calls on x86 vms
Dec 13 15:35:18 <laura--> Is 5554 the latest version of the emulator?  I just tried upgrading to RC2 and I swear that emulator number didn't change
Dec 13 15:36:06 <jbq> laura--: that's not the emulator version, that's actually the socket you can connect to to communicate with the emulator (useful to distinguish between multiple emulators running at the same time)
Dec 13 15:52:35 <laura--> ahhhhhhhhhhhhhh
Dec 13 16:10:03 <ivantis2> im at the store...using my phone! its so cool
Dec 13 16:10:09 <isaac> :P
Dec 13 16:10:19 <isaac> get a life
Dec 13 16:11:23 <ivantis2> a life? harsh towards me
Dec 13 16:11:31 <ivantis2> i have a life
Dec 13 16:11:39 <ivantis2> in irc
Dec 13 16:11:42 <isaac> haha
Dec 13 16:11:42 <ivantis2> haha
Dec 13 16:12:00 <isaac> which store?
Dec 13 16:12:23 <ivantis2> dillons
Dec 13 16:12:36 <ivantis2> i just walked out
Dec 13 16:12:56 <isaac> i might want to have a look at an android-powered phone too
Dec 13 16:13:21 <ivantis2> no G1 yet?
Dec 13 16:13:43 <ivantis2> i got mine yesterday
Dec 13 16:13:44 <isaac> I am Spanish, nothing has arrived to Spain yet AFAIK
Dec 13 16:13:50 <isaac> but I am in New York right now
Dec 13 16:14:01 <isaac> so I might go and have a look
Dec 13 16:14:28 <ivantis2> ny? go to a t-mobile store
Dec 13 16:15:03 <isaac> will do
Dec 13 16:17:44 <ivantis2> i ordered mine from the tmobile site
Dec 13 16:18:09 <ivantis2> some kind of net discount
Dec 13 16:18:22 * flaushy is total tmo fan ... they now have a site for g1 :)
Dec 13 16:19:32 <flaushy> i hope they bring the g1 into stores till march
Dec 13 16:19:33 <ivantis2> yeah
Dec 13 16:19:48 <ivantis2> its such a cool phone
Dec 13 16:19:59 <ivantis2> well, im out
Dec 13 16:20:01 <ivantis2> later
Dec 13 16:20:02 <flaushy> hf
Dec 13 16:20:38 <rainabba_> I'm trying to setup an IMAP email account and at the last screen, it says that it'd setup and there is a DONE button, but it's grey. What gives?
Dec 13 16:20:53 <flaushy> isaac: did tmo release a roadmap for spain yet?
Dec 13 16:22:19 <rainabba_> NM, I just got a "New Email" notification. Guess that screen is just flawed but the account was setup.
Dec 13 16:22:21 <isaac> flaushy: there is no tmo in Spain, I am not sure if there is already an operator planning to deploy it
Dec 13 16:22:42 <isaac> um, it looks like Telefonica is going to do it
Dec 13 16:23:22 <isaac> oh, I didn't know telefonica owned O2
Dec 13 16:23:33 <isaac> boh, Q3 they say
Dec 13 16:26:04 <flaushy> 2009 q3?
Dec 13 16:26:07 <isaac> yeap
Dec 13 16:26:17 <flaushy> then other vendors will be there first
Dec 13 16:26:43 <isaac> let's hope
Dec 13 16:27:11 <flaushy> yeah, i am again kinda disappointed at tmo that germany has to wait forever for products and tarifs
Dec 13 16:27:17 <isaac> well, should get going and have a look at NY
Dec 13 16:27:17 <isaac> later
Dec 13 16:27:24 <flaushy> cya :)
Dec 13 16:59:30 <binarybeats> heya
Dec 13 16:59:40 <binarybeats> anyone else get the rc30 rollout yet?
Dec 13 17:00:06 <binarybeats> not a minute too soon for me  though.  my wife's touch screen locked up last night
Dec 13 17:01:00 <anno^da_> rc30 ?
Dec 13 17:01:05 <anno^da_> is pretty old
Dec 13 17:01:20 <anno^da_> It's been out since weeks.
Dec 13 17:06:50 <Disconnect> ..it has nothing to do with lockups
Dec 13 17:06:59 <Disconnect> it has everything to do with locking it down so you can't do anything good.
Dec 13 17:10:19 <Disconnect> www.gotontheinter.net/accessories i put together a list of accessories and such that actually work with the g1. (as opposed to a certain store that just threw "for the t-mobile g1" after every cell accessory and bt device they could find and added 20% to the price :) ..)
Dec 13 17:11:52 <anno^da_> nice Disconnect
Dec 13 17:12:46 <Disconnect> i need to get a link for my belt cases (i want a replacement for the e90 one anyway, that was a super nice case) and of course feedback/additions welcome.
Dec 13 17:25:17 <binarybeats> the adapters for right angle and 3-1 are so ugly
Dec 13 17:25:32 <anno^da_> binarybeats: true :)
Dec 13 17:25:40 <binarybeats> someone needs to make a flush fit  adapter which can snap your plug cover into.
Dec 13 17:26:04 <binarybeats> that way you can have a real phone jack and a charger plug and a sync plug all in one
Dec 13 17:26:32 <binarybeats> like an extension of the device so you  can barely notice it
Dec 13 17:26:56 <binarybeats> btw, anyone snag a white g1?
Dec 13 17:27:04 <bparker06> there's white? o_O
Dec 13 17:27:30 <binarybeats> I had six different tmo reps tell me it was in stock, but never seemed to ship out.  I ordered one but never got it
Dec 13 17:28:59 <binarybeats> so what would cause the touch screen to lock up?  even the buttons were very slow responding.  I assume something was hogging the cpu
Dec 13 17:33:42 <binarybeats> will a stylus work on the screen?
Dec 13 17:36:24 <Lieutenant> hey for that sd card internet cache hack, will it continually send the cache to the sdcard or will i have to keep doing it? or just do it once, and it'll just move all the cache there from then on?
Dec 13 17:42:18 <ivantis2> who is there?
Dec 13 17:42:24 <ivantis2> im bored
Dec 13 17:47:36 <brocktice> argh, can't get my linux box to talk to the devphone
Dec 13 17:47:42 <brocktice> works fine on the mac naturally
Dec 13 17:48:23 <d0netsFN> i think there are some steps
Dec 13 17:48:28 <d0netsFN> un momento
Dec 13 17:48:44 <brocktice> been googling but nothing so far
Dec 13 17:49:47 <d0netsFN> do adb devices
Dec 13 17:49:51 <brocktice> nada
Dec 13 17:50:06 <d0netsFN> do you have the setting on?
Dec 13 17:50:10 <brocktice> yep
Dec 13 17:50:15 <brocktice> double-checked even
Dec 13 17:50:20 <brocktice> plus I've been using it with the mac all morning
Dec 13 17:50:52 <brocktice> here's what dmesg says
Dec 13 17:50:53 <brocktice> [4462956.790441] usb-storage: device found at 6
Dec 13 17:50:53 <brocktice> [4462956.790450] usb-storage: waiting for device to settle before scanning
Dec 13 17:50:53 <brocktice> [4462961.787333] usb-storage: device scan complete
Dec 13 17:50:53 <brocktice> [4462967.457144] usb 2-1: reset full speed USB device using ohci_hcd and address 6
Dec 13 17:50:57 <brocktice> [4462977.855649] usb 2-1: reset full speed USB device using ohci_hcd and address 6
Dec 13 17:51:00 <brocktice> [4462994.258955] usb 2-1: reset full speed USB device using ohci_hcd and address 6
Dec 13 17:51:03 <brocktice> [4462994.678700] usb 2-1: reset full speed USB device using ohci_hcd and address 6
Dec 13 17:51:07 <brocktice> [4463005.082114] usb 2-1: reset full speed USB device using ohci_hcd and address 6
Dec 13 17:51:10 <brocktice> [4463005.320032] scsi 6:0:0:0: Device offlined - not ready after error recovery
Dec 13 17:51:51 <brocktice> maybe this motherboard doesn't have USB2?
Dec 13 17:51:52 <SanMehat> yo
Dec 13 17:51:53 <brocktice> I thought it did
Dec 13 17:52:04 <SanMehat> watch the spam please :)
Dec 13 17:52:20 <brocktice> Sorry I'll pastebin it next time.
Dec 13 17:52:57 <Damm_> device should fall back to usb 1.0 if it does not
Dec 13 17:53:52 <brocktice> is there another module I should have loaded?
Dec 13 17:53:58 <brocktice> usbserial maybe...
Dec 13 17:56:49 <Damm> did you tell it that it can mount, or not mount it already?
Dec 13 17:56:59 <brocktice> Damm, no, never had to do that on the mac.
Dec 13 17:57:02 <brocktice> I'll tell it not to.
Dec 13 17:57:28 <brocktice> now it shows HT845GZ50345 attached but offline
Dec 13 17:59:33 <binarybeats> man oh man  there are a few serious flaws with the interface that I need to have addressed.
Dec 13 18:00:01 <binarybeats> first, why is the green button the only button you can use the answer the phone?
Dec 13 18:00:32 <binarybeats> why is the red button the only one you can use to hang up the phone?  why isn't it using the touch screen?
Dec 13 18:02:53 <Disconnect> binarybeats: ..if you need to have them addressed you should go into the local tmobile store and talk to them.
Dec 13 18:03:12 <binarybeats> screw t-mobile  they don't even know what linux is.
Dec 13 18:03:26 <Disconnect> ...they put out the g1. so they are the ones to talk to about your problems with it.
Dec 13 18:03:42 <binarybeats> it's not a problem with the G1, it's a problem with the UI
Dec 13 18:03:49 <Disconnect> ..the ui on what exactly?
Dec 13 18:03:49 <Lieutenant> hey for that sd card internet cache hack, will it continually send the cache to the sdcard or will i have to keep doing it? or just do it once, and it'll just move all the cache there from then on?
Dec 13 18:03:57 <Disconnect> Lieutenant: you should ask the author of the hack
Dec 13 18:04:05 <binarybeats> is there a different UI on the G1 than other android phones?
Dec 13 18:04:17 <Lieutenant> i dunno who the author of the hack is.
Dec 13 18:04:21 <Lieutenant> its just 4 lines of code
Dec 13 18:04:23 <Disconnect> the software on the g1 is a closed-source fork of what is available from android.com
Dec 13 18:04:32 <Lieutenant> that i have to put in terminal emulator. it isn't an app.
Dec 13 18:05:24 <SanMehat> binarybeats: what do you do when your cheek brushes against the hangup button on the touch-screen?
Dec 13 18:05:29 <Disconnect> Lieutenant: my omniscience isn't working today. perhaps you should go to the place that gave you the 4 lines of code and ask. (assuming they didn't spring fully-formed from the aether or arrive on an unsigned post-it note on your front door or something.)
Dec 13 18:05:59 <Disconnect> SanMehat: the same thing you do when it presses '6' i suspect.
Dec 13 18:06:01 <brocktice> and adb shell works just fine on my mac...
Dec 13 18:06:09 <brocktice> I'll blame the ubuntu machine then
Dec 13 18:06:21 <binarybeats> SanMehat: isn't there a way to prevent the button from being simply 'pressed'?  make it slide perhaps?
Dec 13 18:06:34 <brocktice> binarybeats, why not just press the red button?
Dec 13 18:06:43 <binarybeats> someone needs to write an app to do that
Dec 13 18:06:50 <brocktice> get on it
Dec 13 18:07:00 <binarybeats> brocktice:  it's a tiny button that I don't like using
Dec 13 18:07:15 <brocktice> binarybeats, throwing it on the ground hard will probably disconnect your call.
Dec 13 18:07:21 <brocktice> If you want something a little more straightforward.
Dec 13 18:07:45 <binarybeats> percussive maintenance is not called for in this situation
Dec 13 18:07:50 <Nafai> binarybeats: Go ahead, write the app to do this
Dec 13 18:07:54 <binarybeats> this is more of a software problem
Dec 13 18:08:10 <binarybeats> as soon as I learn java
Dec 13 18:08:56 <brocktice> http://tinyurl.com/5r59bm
Dec 13 18:10:20 <binarybeats> thanks.  I'm gonna finish c+ first
Dec 13 18:10:31 <binarybeats> c++ too
Dec 13 18:11:01 <bparker06> any developers around ?
Dec 13 18:11:05 <bparker06> I need help
Dec 13 18:11:22 <bparker06> http://groups.google.com/group/android-developers/browse_thread/thread/976143e6c85d468e/d26abdafdf04ba4c?lnk=gst&q=bparker#d26abdafdf04ba4c
Dec 13 18:11:30 <bparker06> see my post at the bottom
Dec 13 18:12:16 <brocktice> bparker06, I'm not that experienced with it, but don't you usually pass "this" from the activity?
Dec 13 18:12:41 <bparker06> the PhoneStateListener is not called with the activity's context
Dec 13 18:12:43 <bparker06> so it is null
Dec 13 18:12:55 <bparker06> it is called from PhoneApp
Dec 13 18:13:05 <bparker06> or thereabouts
Dec 13 18:13:06 <brocktice> oh
Dec 13 18:13:36 <bparker06> mine is slightly different than his
Dec 13 18:13:39 <bparker06> I'm listening for incoming calls
Dec 13 18:13:46 <bparker06> instead of cell location changes
Dec 13 18:13:54 <bparker06> but it uses the same exact listener
Dec 13 18:15:09 <brocktice> bparker06, last I heard from anno^da_ there's no way to actually listen for incoming calls just yet.
Dec 13 18:15:16 <nightcrawler> s
Dec 13 18:15:17 <nightcrawler> s
Dec 13 18:15:17 <nightcrawler> s
Dec 13 18:15:17 <nightcrawler> s
Dec 13 18:15:18 <nightcrawler> s
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Dec 13 18:15:29 <nightcrawler> s
Dec 13 18:15:31 <nightcrawler> s
Dec 13 18:15:31 <tomh-> stfu
Dec 13 18:15:33 <nightcrawler> s
Dec 13 18:15:35 <nightcrawler> ss
Dec 13 18:15:37 <nightcrawler> s
Dec 13 18:15:39 <nightcrawler> s
Dec 13 18:15:41 <nightcrawler> s
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Dec 13 18:15:45 <nightcrawler> s
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Dec 13 18:15:59 <nightcrawler> s
Dec 13 18:16:01 <nightcrawler> s
Dec 13 18:16:02 <tuxdroidfan> Is the G1 the only android phone atm?
Dec 13 18:16:03 <nightcrawler> s
Dec 13 18:16:05 <nightcrawler> s
Dec 13 18:16:07 <nightcrawler> s
Dec 13 18:16:09 <nightcrawler> s
Dec 13 18:16:11 <nightcrawler> s
Dec 13 18:16:13 <nightcrawler> s
Dec 13 18:16:15 <nightcrawler> s
Dec 13 18:16:15 <tomh-> tuxdroidfan: and the dev phone
Dec 13 18:16:17 <nightcrawler> s
Dec 13 18:16:19 <nightcrawler> s
Dec 13 18:16:21 <nightcrawler> Wath?
Dec 13 18:16:25 <nightcrawler> s
Dec 13 18:16:27 <nightcrawler> s
Dec 13 18:16:29 <nightcrawler> s
Dec 13 18:16:31 <nightcrawler> s
Dec 13 18:16:33 <nightcrawler> s
Dec 13 18:16:35 <nightcrawler> s
Dec 13 18:16:37 <nightcrawler> s
Dec 13 18:16:39 <nightcrawler> s
Dec 13 18:16:41 <nightcrawler> sss
Dec 13 18:16:43 <nightcrawler> s
Dec 13 18:16:45 <nightcrawler> s
Dec 13 18:16:47 <nightcrawler> s
Dec 13 18:16:49 <nightcrawler> s
Dec 13 18:16:51 <nightcrawler> ss
Dec 13 18:16:53 <nightcrawler> s
Dec 13 18:16:55 <nightcrawler> s
Dec 13 18:16:57 <nightcrawler> s
Dec 13 18:16:57 <tuxdroidfan> Can the dev be tethered?
Dec 13 18:16:59 <nightcrawler>  :D
Dec 13 18:17:01 <nightcrawler> Yes
Dec 13 18:17:03 <nightcrawler> o ya
Dec 13 18:17:05 <nightcrawler> KAN NI SVENSKA?
Dec 13 18:17:07 <nightcrawler> Jag pratar svenska f�rst�r ni :)
Dec 13 18:17:10 <nightcrawler> Hall�, n�gon som kan svenska?
Dec 13 18:17:23 * elad slaps nightcrawler around a bit with a large trout
Dec 13 18:17:29 <elad> kke ^.^
Dec 13 18:17:49 <nightcrawler> Wow -.-'
Dec 13 18:17:50 <bparker06> 03:15:09 < brocktice> bparker06, last I heard from anno^da_ there's no way to actually listen for incoming calls just yet.
Dec 13 18:17:54 <bparker06> I'm already doing it
Dec 13 18:17:59 <nightcrawler> o ya?
Dec 13 18:18:01 <nightcrawler> cfvgjhabSDFGXNCH
Dec 13 18:18:02 <nightcrawler> SDGHFJG,K
Dec 13 18:18:03 <nightcrawler> ZDBXFNCBMV,B
Dec 13 18:18:04 <nightcrawler> XZCBVN
Dec 13 18:18:05 <nightcrawler> XCFVNM
Dec 13 18:18:06 <nightcrawler> XCVBNVMB
Dec 13 18:18:07 <nightcrawler> X
Dec 13 18:18:07 <nightcrawler> X
Dec 13 18:18:08 <nightcrawler> X
Dec 13 18:18:09 <tuxdroidfan> does tmobile forbid tethering
Dec 13 18:18:10 <nightcrawler> X
Dec 13 18:18:12 <nightcrawler> X
Dec 13 18:18:14 <nightcrawler> X
Dec 13 18:18:16 <nightcrawler> X
Dec 13 18:18:18 <nightcrawler> X
Dec 13 18:18:18 <tomh-> whats tethering?
Dec 13 18:18:18 <elad> tux: most do
Dec 13 18:18:20 <nightcrawler> X
Dec 13 18:18:21 <brocktice> hm
Dec 13 18:18:22 <nightcrawler> X
Dec 13 18:18:24 <nightcrawler> X
Dec 13 18:18:27 <nightcrawler> HEJ
Dec 13 18:18:31 <Fredbo> no they don't
Dec 13 18:18:33 <brocktice> SanMehat, ....
Dec 13 18:18:33 <tomh-> can someone ban that nightcrawler
Dec 13 18:18:34 <nightcrawler> Sweden here?
Dec 13 18:18:39 <nightcrawler> Haha
Dec 13 18:18:48 <nightcrawler> Sorry
Dec 13 18:19:08 <nightcrawler> Can you forgive me?
Dec 13 18:19:12 <tomh-> no
Dec 13 18:19:13 <elad> nevar
Dec 13 18:19:23 <elad> impending doom awaits
Dec 13 18:19:25 <nightcrawler> Crying -.-'
Dec 13 18:19:33 <tuxdroidfan> does t-mobile forbid teather?
Dec 13 18:19:39 <Damm> tuxdroidfan, no
Dec 13 18:19:51 <Damm> tuxdroidfan, they allow tethering, 3G tethering is another story...
Dec 13 18:20:06 <tuxdroidfan> awesome, is there any extra monthly change to do so?
Dec 13 18:20:09 <Damm> tuxdroidfan, but i've only heard rumors and stories about 3G tethering.
Dec 13 18:20:11 <Damm> nope
Dec 13 18:20:19 <Damm> standard with your G1 Data plan
Dec 13 18:20:52 <nightcrawler> Is anywon from sweden here?
Dec 13 18:21:33 <tomh-> just shut it and wait till you get kicked and banned mkay?
Dec 13 18:21:56 <tuxdroidfan> anyone know of any SSH tunneling clients for android? i want to do secure VNC
Dec 13 18:22:06 <brocktice> I'm from Sweden, isn't that weird?
Dec 13 18:22:15 <d0netsFN> hey disconnect you want a good car cradle to add to your list?
Dec 13 18:22:31 <loke_> nightcrawler: I
Dec 13 18:22:36 <loke_> nightcrawler: I'm from sweden too
Dec 13 18:22:36 <Kottizen> Hi1
Dec 13 18:22:38 <Kottizen> !*
Dec 13 18:22:40 <loke_> although I don't live there
Dec 13 18:22:51 <nightcrawler> Hey kottizen!
Dec 13 18:23:14 <nightcrawler> Haha, dom andra kan inte fatta vad vi skriver nu xD
Dec 13 18:23:20 <Kottizen> Wo are everyone here?
Dec 13 18:23:22 <Kottizen> Nej xD
Dec 13 18:23:25 <Kottizen> VI �GER! :D
Dec 13 18:23:29 <loke_> Damm: how would the prevent you from tehering?
Dec 13 18:23:31 <Kottizen> NC, vad g�r du just nu?
Dec 13 18:23:44 <alexissoft> arg i've just read that i need 5 to 10 days for the dev phone to be shipped :s
Dec 13 18:23:44 <nightcrawler> Har �tit paj...
Dec 13 18:23:51 <Kottizen> Ok, gott?
Dec 13 18:23:56 <nightcrawler> Ja =)
Dec 13 18:24:04 <Damm> loke_, currently they have been disabling BT PAN and BT DUN on handsets they cannot throttle the speed on.
Dec 13 18:24:15 <d0netsFN> do you guys think it would be possible to make a type of "micro gps" using wifi triangulation?
Dec 13 18:24:30 <loke_> Damm: OK, but that would only apply to the handsets they provide
Dec 13 18:24:33 <alexissoft> d0netsFN: you still need to know where your wifi AP are
Dec 13 18:24:35 <nightcrawler> Hehe, �r ni irreterade �n era utl�nska gubbar??
Dec 13 18:24:36 <Kottizen> Japps, det tror jag funkar, d0netsFN.
Dec 13 18:24:49 <nightcrawler> x)
Dec 13 18:24:51 <Kottizen> NC: Haha xD
Dec 13 18:24:51 <Kottizen> Klockrent! :D
Dec 13 18:25:02 <d0netsFN> i was asking for mountain gps
Dec 13 18:25:04 <Damm> loke_, right, only to the handsets they provide... if you bring a unlocked handset to T-Mobile, and it tethers... it works.
Dec 13 18:25:05 <d0netsFN> and maybe in a store
Dec 13 18:25:11 <d0netsFN> so you can search for "sesame oil"
Dec 13 18:25:12 <Damm> loke_, obviously 3G won't work on an unlocked handset
Dec 13 18:25:15 <Kottizen> Kan man spamma h�r? :D
Dec 13 18:25:17 <d0netsFN> and it guides you through the isles
Dec 13 18:25:20 <loke_> Damm: exactly... which is pretty much all phones out there
Dec 13 18:25:21 <nightcrawler> Ja =D
Dec 13 18:25:25 <nightcrawler> x
Dec 13 18:25:26 <nightcrawler> x
Dec 13 18:25:26 <nightcrawler> x
Dec 13 18:25:26 <nightcrawler> x
Dec 13 18:25:26 <nightcrawler> x
Dec 13 18:25:27 <nightcrawler> x
Dec 13 18:25:28 <nightcrawler> x
Dec 13 18:25:29 <loke_> Damm: what do you mean "obviously">
Dec 13 18:25:30 <nightcrawler> x
Dec 13 18:25:32 <nightcrawler> x
Dec 13 18:25:34 <nightcrawler> x
Dec 13 18:25:36 <nightcrawler> x
Dec 13 18:25:36 * d0netsFN waits for a ban
Dec 13 18:25:38 <nightcrawler> x
Dec 13 18:25:40 <nightcrawler> x
Dec 13 18:25:40 <loke_> Damm: of course 3G works fine on any handset
Dec 13 18:25:41 <Kottizen> Ska spamma med Kottens spamprogram.
Dec 13 18:25:42 <nightcrawler> x
Dec 13 18:25:44 <nightcrawler> x
Dec 13 18:25:46 <d0netsFN> oh wait wtf this is freenode
Dec 13 18:25:51 <nightcrawler> Ja :D
Dec 13 18:25:52 <d0netsFN> how do you guys stop spammers?
Dec 13 18:26:01 <Damm> loke_, if you want to use 3G with a T-Mobile US Handset... you have to have a handset that supports "AWS"
Dec 13 18:26:05 <brocktice> we invoke SanMehat
Dec 13 18:26:16 <nightcrawler> Spam
Dec 13 18:26:16 <loke_> Damm: what is that?
Dec 13 18:26:17 <Damm> or we can ask someone in #freenode to kline him
Dec 13 18:26:18 <nightcrawler> Spam
Dec 13 18:26:19 <nightcrawler> Spam
Dec 13 18:26:20 <nightcrawler> Spam
Dec 13 18:26:21 <nightcrawler> Spam
Dec 13 18:26:22 <nightcrawler> Spam
Dec 13 18:26:23 <nightcrawler> Spam
Dec 13 18:26:23 <nightcrawler> Spam
Dec 13 18:26:24 <nightcrawler> Spam
Dec 13 18:26:25 <nightcrawler> Spam
Dec 13 18:26:27 <nightcrawler> Spam
Dec 13 18:26:29 <nightcrawler> Spam
Dec 13 18:26:30 <RyeBrye-phone> wtf?
Dec 13 18:26:31 <nightcrawler> Spam
Dec 13 18:26:33 <nightcrawler> Spam
Dec 13 18:26:33 <Damm> loke_, switching technology that T-Mobile uses.
Dec 13 18:26:35 <nightcrawler> Spam
Dec 13 18:26:36 <d0netsFN> you guys should come to my chan on efnet
Dec 13 18:26:37 <nightcrawler> Spam
Dec 13 18:26:37 <d0netsFN> lol
Dec 13 18:26:39 <nightcrawler> Spam
Dec 13 18:26:41 <nightcrawler> Spam
Dec 13 18:26:43 <nightcrawler> Spam
Dec 13 18:26:44 <d0netsFN> he would be banned by now
Dec 13 18:26:45 <nightcrawler> Spam
Dec 13 18:26:47 <nightcrawler> Spam
Dec 13 18:26:49 <nightcrawler> Spam
Dec 13 18:26:50 <loke_> Damm: sucks to be in the US, I guess :-)
Dec 13 18:26:51 <nightcrawler> Spam
Dec 13 18:26:52 <RyeBrye-phone> ignored
Dec 13 18:26:53 <nightcrawler> Spam
Dec 13 18:26:53 <d0netsFN> and i have a !google bot haha
Dec 13 18:26:55 <nightcrawler> Spam
Dec 13 18:26:57 <nightcrawler> Spam
Dec 13 18:26:59 <nightcrawler> Spam
Dec 13 18:27:01 <nightcrawler> Spam
Dec 13 18:27:03 <nightcrawler> Haha, god luck with that!
Dec 13 18:27:06 <d0netsFN> i dont have that option in my client :(
Dec 13 18:27:14 <nightcrawler> I now xD
Dec 13 18:27:29 <nightcrawler> Iam now evrefing
Dec 13 18:27:32 <nightcrawler> Spam
Dec 13 18:27:33 <nightcrawler> Spam
Dec 13 18:27:34 <nightcrawler> Spam
Dec 13 18:27:34 <nightcrawler> Spam
Dec 13 18:27:35 <nightcrawler> Spam
Dec 13 18:27:36 <nightcrawler> Spam
Dec 13 18:27:39 <nightcrawler> Spam
Dec 13 18:27:40 <nightcrawler> Spam
Dec 13 18:27:40 <nightcrawler> Spam
Dec 13 18:27:42 <nightcrawler> Spam
Dec 13 18:27:42 <eldenz> he is from sweden, everyone understand please
Dec 13 18:27:44 <Damm> loke_, are you in the UK?
Dec 13 18:27:47 <Kottizen> Spam
Dec 13 18:27:47 <Kottizen> Spam
Dec 13 18:27:47 <Kottizen> Spam
Dec 13 18:27:47 <Kottizen> Spam
Dec 13 18:27:47 <Kottizen> Spam
Dec 13 18:27:47 <Kottizen> Spam
Dec 13 18:27:47 <loke_> Damm: no
Dec 13 18:27:49 <Kottizen> Spam
Dec 13 18:27:51 <Kottizen> Spam
Dec 13 18:27:53 <Kottizen> Spam
Dec 13 18:27:55 <Kottizen> Spam
Dec 13 18:27:56 <nightcrawler> Spam
Dec 13 18:27:57 <Kottizen> Spam
Dec 13 18:27:57 <nightcrawler> Spam
Dec 13 18:27:58 <nightcrawler> Spam
Dec 13 18:27:59 <Kottizen> Spam
Dec 13 18:27:59 <nightcrawler> Spam
Dec 13 18:28:01 <Kottizen> Spam
Dec 13 18:28:01 <nightcrawler> Spam
Dec 13 18:28:02 <nightcrawler> Spam
Dec 13 18:28:03 <Damm> ahh signapore...
Dec 13 18:28:03 <Kottizen> Spam
Dec 13 18:28:03 <nightcrawler> Spam
Dec 13 18:28:04 <nightcrawler> Spam
Dec 13 18:28:05 <Kottizen> Spam
Dec 13 18:28:05 <loke_> ignore lists are nice
Dec 13 18:28:07 <Kottizen> Spam
Dec 13 18:28:09 <Kottizen> Spam
Dec 13 18:28:09 <nightcrawler> Spam
Dec 13 18:28:10 <nightcrawler> Spam
Dec 13 18:28:11 <Kottizen> Spam
Dec 13 18:28:11 <tomh-> seriously
Dec 13 18:28:12 <nightcrawler> Spam
Dec 13 18:28:12 <nightcrawler> Spam
Dec 13 18:28:13 <Kottizen> Spam
Dec 13 18:28:13 <nightcrawler> Spam
Dec 13 18:28:15 <nightcrawler> Spam
Dec 13 18:28:15 <Kottizen> Spam
Dec 13 18:28:17 <nightcrawler> Spam
Dec 13 18:28:17 <Kottizen> Spam
Dec 13 18:28:19 <nightcrawler> Spam
Dec 13 18:28:19 <Kottizen> Spam
Dec 13 18:28:21 <nightcrawler> Spam
Dec 13 18:28:21 <Kottizen> Spam
Dec 13 18:28:21 <eldenz> idd :)
Dec 13 18:28:23 <nightcrawler> Spam
Dec 13 18:28:23 <Kottizen> Spam
Dec 13 18:28:25 <nightcrawler> Spam
Dec 13 18:28:25 <Kottizen> Spam
Dec 13 18:28:27 <nightcrawler> Spam
Dec 13 18:28:27 <Kottizen> Spam
Dec 13 18:28:29 <eldenz> 1928.07 Ignoring ALL from nightcrawler
Dec 13 18:28:29 <Kottizen> Spam
Dec 13 18:28:31 <nightcrawler> Spam
Dec 13 18:28:31 <Kottizen> Spam
Dec 13 18:28:33 <Damm> eldenz, being from sweden allows you to be stupid?
Dec 13 18:28:33 <nightcrawler> Spam
Dec 13 18:28:33 <Kottizen> Spam
Dec 13 18:28:33 <RyeBrye-phone> intersting... i always thought /ignore was on the server
Dec 13 18:28:35 <nightcrawler> Spam
Dec 13 18:28:35 <Kottizen> Spam
Dec 13 18:28:37 <nightcrawler> Spam
Dec 13 18:28:37 <tomh-> just ban everyone from sweden
Dec 13 18:28:37 <Kottizen> Spam
Dec 13 18:28:39 <nightcrawler> Spam
Dec 13 18:28:39 <Kottizen> Spam
Dec 13 18:28:41 <Kottizen> Spam
Dec 13 18:28:43 <Kottizen> Spam
Dec 13 18:28:45 <Kottizen> Spam
Dec 13 18:28:47 <nightcrawler> Haha, det h�r �ger!!!!!!!!
Dec 13 18:28:47 <Kottizen> Spam
Dec 13 18:28:49 <Kottizen> Spam
Dec 13 18:28:51 <eldenz> no Damm :p was just trying to be offensive : (
Dec 13 18:28:51 <Kottizen> Spam
Dec 13 18:28:53 <Kottizen> Spam
Dec 13 18:28:53 <loke_> just do /ignore hostmask all
Dec 13 18:28:55 <Kottizen> Spam
Dec 13 18:28:56 <eldenz> sorry if i offended anyone else
Dec 13 18:28:57 <Kottizen> Spam
Dec 13 18:28:59 <Kottizen> Spam
Dec 13 18:29:01 <Kottizen> Spam
Dec 13 18:29:03 <Kottizen> Spam
Dec 13 18:29:03 <nightcrawler> Spam
Dec 13 18:29:04 <loke_> eldenz: I'm swedish :-)
Dec 13 18:29:04 <nightcrawler> Spam
Dec 13 18:29:05 <Kottizen> Spam
Dec 13 18:29:05 <nightcrawler> Spam
Dec 13 18:29:07 <Kottizen> Spam
Dec 13 18:29:07 <nightcrawler> Spam
Dec 13 18:29:09 <nightcrawler> Spam
Dec 13 18:29:09 <Kottizen> Spam
Dec 13 18:29:10 <nightcrawler> Spam
Dec 13 18:29:11 <Kottizen> Spam
Dec 13 18:29:11 <nightcrawler> Spam
Dec 13 18:29:12 <nightcrawler> Spam
Dec 13 18:29:13 <Kottizen> Spam
Dec 13 18:29:13 <nightcrawler> Spam
Dec 13 18:29:15 <nightcrawler> Spam
Dec 13 18:29:15 <Kottizen> Spam
Dec 13 18:29:16 <nightcrawler> Spam
Dec 13 18:29:17 <nightcrawler> Spam
Dec 13 18:29:17 <Kottizen> Spam
Dec 13 18:29:18 <nightcrawler> Spam
Dec 13 18:29:19 <Kottizen> Spam
Dec 13 18:29:20 <nightcrawler> Spam
Dec 13 18:29:21 <Kottizen> Spam
Dec 13 18:29:22 <nightcrawler> Spam
Dec 13 18:29:23 <Kottizen> Spam
Dec 13 18:29:24 <nightcrawler> Spam
Dec 13 18:29:25 <Kottizen> Spam
Dec 13 18:29:25 <eldenz> swedes have the bandwidth to spam! *cough*
Dec 13 18:29:26 <nightcrawler> Spam
Dec 13 18:29:28 <nightcrawler> Spam
Dec 13 18:29:29 <tomh-> loke_ take your responsibility and kick your fellow swedish spammers in their aass
Dec 13 18:29:30 <nightcrawler> Spam
Dec 13 18:29:32 <nightcrawler> Spam
Dec 13 18:29:34 <nightcrawler> Spam
Dec 13 18:29:36 <nightcrawler> Spam
Dec 13 18:29:38 <nightcrawler> Spam
Dec 13 18:29:44 <loke_> Damm: anyway, I'd be suprised if any telcos could do somehting like that outside the us
Dec 13 18:29:53 <Cowclops> nightcrawler: ever have a spam and egg sandwich?
Dec 13 18:29:58 <loke_> tomh-: I don't live in sweden anymore, for obvious reasons :-)
Dec 13 18:29:59 <bparker06> lol
Dec 13 18:30:03 <RyeBrye-phone> do .local domains resolve for other g1 users
Dec 13 18:30:06 <Cowclops> they're actually kind of gross
Dec 13 18:30:07 <tomh-> loke_: ah, smart choice ;)
Dec 13 18:30:15 <Damm> loke_, for the most part it's a catch 22.
Dec 13 18:30:18 <Damm> yes and no
Dec 13 18:30:26 <alexissoft> aren't .local mdns domain ?
Dec 13 18:30:27 <brocktice> RyeBrye-phone, I can hit .locals while I'm on my home wifi
Dec 13 18:30:27 <Kottizen> Loke, are you swedish?
Dec 13 18:30:34 <nightcrawler> Spam
Dec 13 18:30:35 <nightcrawler> Spam
Dec 13 18:30:36 <nightcrawler> Spam
Dec 13 18:30:37 <nightcrawler> Spam
Dec 13 18:30:38 <nightcrawler> Spam
Dec 13 18:30:38 <nightcrawler> Spam
Dec 13 18:30:39 <nightcrawler> Spam
Dec 13 18:30:41 <nightcrawler> Spam
Dec 13 18:30:43 <nightcrawler> Spam
Dec 13 18:30:45 <nightcrawler> Spam
Dec 13 18:30:47 <nightcrawler> Spam
Dec 13 18:30:47 <d0netsFN> Spam
Dec 13 18:30:48 <d0netsFN> lulz
Dec 13 18:30:49 <nightcrawler> Spam
Dec 13 18:30:51 <nightcrawler> Spam
Dec 13 18:30:53 <nightcrawler> SpamSpam
Dec 13 18:30:55 <nightcrawler> Spam
Dec 13 18:30:57 <nightcrawler> Spam
Dec 13 18:30:59 <nightcrawler> Spam
Dec 13 18:31:01 <pawalls> Really...?
Dec 13 18:31:01 <nightcrawler> Spam
Dec 13 18:31:01 <d0netsFN> wtf someone get this guy to stfu
Dec 13 18:31:03 <nightcrawler> Spam
Dec 13 18:31:05 <nightcrawler> Spam
Dec 13 18:31:07 <nightcrawler> Spam
Dec 13 18:31:09 <nightcrawler> Spam
Dec 13 18:31:11 <nightcrawler> SpamSpam
Dec 13 18:31:13 <nightcrawler> Spam
Dec 13 18:31:13 <RyeBrye-phone> nyt needs to add ignore
Dec 13 18:31:15 <nightcrawler> Spam
Dec 13 18:31:17 <nightcrawler> Spam
Dec 13 18:31:19 <nightcrawler> Spam
Dec 13 18:31:19 <pawalls> SanMehat / jasonchen ?
Dec 13 18:31:21 <nightcrawler> SpamSpam
Dec 13 18:31:23 <nightcrawler> Spam
Dec 13 18:31:25 <nightcrawler> Spam
Dec 13 18:31:27 <nightcrawler> Spam
Dec 13 18:31:29 <nightcrawler> Spam
Dec 13 18:31:31 <nightcrawler> Spam
Dec 13 18:31:31 <loke_> d0netsFN: he's still doing it? just set him to ignore...
Dec 13 18:31:33 <nightcrawler> Spam
Dec 13 18:31:35 <nightcrawler> Spam
Dec 13 18:31:37 <nightcrawler> Spam
Dec 13 18:31:39 <nightcrawler> Spam
Dec 13 18:31:41 <nightcrawler> Spam
Dec 13 18:31:43 <nightcrawler> SpamSpamSpamSpamSpam
Dec 13 18:31:45 <nightcrawler> c
Dec 13 18:31:47 <nightcrawler> Spam
Dec 13 18:31:48 <d0netsFN> i dont have that in my client
Dec 13 18:31:49 <nightcrawler> Spam
Dec 13 18:31:50 <pawalls> I'm really curious why people get off from this stuff.
Dec 13 18:31:51 <nightcrawler> Spam
Dec 13 18:31:52 <tomh-> meh ignore doesnt work
Dec 13 18:31:53 <nightcrawler> Spam
Dec 13 18:31:53 <d0netsFN> who spams  #android?
Dec 13 18:31:54 <RyeBrye-phone> loke_ some clients lack ignore
Dec 13 18:31:55 <nightcrawler> Spam
Dec 13 18:31:57 <nightcrawler> Spam
Dec 13 18:31:59 <nightcrawler> SpamSpam
Dec 13 18:31:59 <d0netsFN> its a fuckin open source OS for a phone
Dec 13 18:32:01 <nightcrawler> vv
Dec 13 18:32:02 <Cowclops> pawalls: its like DoSing your own computer
Dec 13 18:32:03 <nightcrawler> Spam
Dec 13 18:32:04 <d0netsFN> ar eyou a M$ employee?
Dec 13 18:32:05 <nightcrawler> Spam
Dec 13 18:32:07 <nightcrawler> SpamSpamSpam
Dec 13 18:32:09 <nightcrawler> SpamSpamSpamSpam
Dec 13 18:32:10 <loke_> RyeBrye: sucks to be a user of those then :-)
Dec 13 18:32:11 <nightcrawler> SpamSpam
Dec 13 18:32:13 <nightcrawler> SpamSpam
Dec 13 18:32:13 <Cowclops> while you're sitting there spamming (which i'm sure he's doing manually by just hitting up-enter)
Dec 13 18:32:15 <nightcrawler> Spam
Dec 13 18:32:17 <nightcrawler> Spam
Dec 13 18:32:18 <Cowclops> or ctrl-v'ing
Dec 13 18:32:20 <loke_> RyeBrye: out of curiosity... which clients are that?
Dec 13 18:32:21 <nightcrawler> SpamSpamv
Dec 13 18:32:23 <nightcrawler> SpamSpam
Dec 13 18:32:23 <Lieutenant> wow
Dec 13 18:32:25 <nightcrawler> Spam
Dec 13 18:32:26 <Cowclops> you're not using your  computer for anything else actually productive
Dec 13 18:32:26 <Lieutenant> calm down
Dec 13 18:32:27 <nightcrawler> v
Dec 13 18:32:28 <Cowclops> so whats the point
Dec 13 18:32:29 <nightcrawler> Spamv
Dec 13 18:32:31 <nightcrawler> Spam
Dec 13 18:32:33 <nightcrawler> v
Dec 13 18:32:35 <nightcrawler> v
Dec 13 18:32:35 <pandzilla> looks like this channel needs more ops
Dec 13 18:32:37 <nightcrawler> Spam
Dec 13 18:32:37 <RyeBrye-phone> loke_ the android irc one
Dec 13 18:32:39 <nightcrawler> Spam
Dec 13 18:32:40 <d0netsFN> yea i know
Dec 13 18:32:40 <d0netsFN> wtf
Dec 13 18:32:43 <nightcrawler> Spam
Dec 13 18:32:45 <nightcrawler> v
Dec 13 18:32:45 <RyeBrye-phone> yeah, no shit...
Dec 13 18:32:47 <nightcrawler> v
Dec 13 18:32:48 <loke_> RyeBrye: ok... time to write a new one then
Dec 13 18:32:49 <d0netsFN> we have like 10-15 in #android on efnet
Dec 13 18:32:52 <Krstnsn`> ummmm where are the ops
Dec 13 18:33:04 <Damm> ty PriceChild :)
Dec 13 18:33:16 <d0netsFN> and if you F' with us on efnet youll get taken down
Dec 13 18:33:30 <Krstnsn`> thanks
Dec 13 18:33:36 <brocktice> thanks PriceChild
Dec 13 18:33:37 <RyeBrye-phone> efnet is like the back alley of the internet
Dec 13 18:33:37 <d0netsFN> yea thanks
Dec 13 18:33:44 <Damm> pandzilla, doesn't need more ops... just needs less kids.
Dec 13 18:33:57 <PointyThing> I'll let your 2 chanops know not to worry
Dec 13 18:34:05 <RyeBrye-phone> yo gots ta roll 6 deep wiv da bots and a shiv to survive efnet
Dec 13 18:34:09 <d0netsFN> are you scared ryebrye?
Dec 13 18:34:21 <loke_> Hmm... ever since I ordered the dev unit about 1 week ago, the tracking page has said "you haven't placed any order yet"... They took my money though...
Dec 13 18:34:23 <brocktice> has anyone loaded a system image compiled from the repository?
Dec 13 18:34:27 <d0netsFN> nah or just lots of stable, active @'s and 1 bot
Dec 13 18:34:31 <loke_> I sent two mails to them asking for an update, no response
Dec 13 18:34:38 <loke_> anyone else had the same experience?
Dec 13 18:34:46 <brocktice> I'm kind of scared to do it, guess I should try it with the emulator first, but then I'd have to rebuild it all.
Dec 13 18:35:02 <RyeBrye-phone> me? no... I just used to be a punk on efnet when I was a young teenager about 10 years ago
Dec 13 18:35:53 <RyeBrye-phone> do .local domains resolve on wifi? my phone doesnt seem to lfind them when I am on wifi
Dec 13 18:36:12 <loke_> I remeember the first time I was introduced to Internet (and IRC)... I was just a kid, and it was in the late 80's... I started writing various synonyms for genitalia on the channel.
Dec 13 18:36:34 <loke_> ...until a friend nearby told me that it's not really appreciated
Dec 13 18:36:35 <Kottizen> Loke_: I am a kid o.O
Dec 13 18:36:40 <Kottizen> 13 years old :D
Dec 13 18:36:41 <loke_> I felt pretty stupid :-)
Dec 13 18:37:05 <brocktice> RyeBrye-phone, Mine does.
Dec 13 18:37:26 <RyeBrye-phone> Hmm.. perhaps it is something on my router then
Dec 13 18:38:23 <jbq> brocktice: system images built from the current repository need a fair bit of massaging and know-how before they start to kinda work.
Dec 13 18:38:42 <brocktice> jbq, :(
Dec 13 18:38:46 <brocktice> Thanks for the warning
Dec 13 18:39:02 <brocktice> You guys are writing the docs on that, right? ;)
Dec 13 18:39:32 <mikey|> strange, the android editor didnt pick up my typo when i put androidkey instead of android:key
Dec 13 18:39:44 <jbq> brocktice: well, we're mostly trying to get the latest source out, and work from there.
Dec 13 18:39:52 <brocktice> jbq, makes sense
Dec 13 18:40:08 <brocktice> That's right, I forgot that the public tree is not the One True Tree.
Dec 13 18:40:15 <jbq> brocktice: lemme try to dig up my notes and put them on android-platform.
Dec 13 18:40:19 <brocktice> I also forgot to pull the blobs from the device this time around.
Dec 13 18:40:42 <brocktice> jbq, Perhaps it's not worth bothering until the latest source is out.
Dec 13 18:41:58 <jbq> brocktice: well, it depends if you're adventurous, but unless you have a strong need to make changes to the framework and test them, doing it "just to see what it's like" probably isn't worth it.
Dec 13 18:42:35 <brocktice> jbq, I was hoping to do some customizations and whatnot, but I should probably get way more familiar with building and tweaking it on the emulator first.
Dec 13 18:43:04 <jbq> Yes. The emulator built from the source tree works much better.
Dec 13 18:43:33 <d0netsFN> hey when will we know more about the usb host area?
Dec 13 18:43:51 <d0netsFN> that would def be used for live reading of ecu data via obd2
Dec 13 18:44:02 <d0netsFN> (digital gauges, data logging, etc.. on the g1)
Dec 13 18:44:18 <d0netsFN> pull ecu codes
Dec 13 18:44:19 <mikey|> is there any way to check if you already have a lock on the wake_lock?
Dec 13 18:45:40 <jbq> d0netsFN: that's not something that's on the roadmap, especially as the G1 doesn't have the appropriate hardware built-in. Supposedly you could build a cable with a power supply, but you'd really be on your own on that one.
Dec 13 18:46:10 <brocktice> muahaha, tethering is MINE
Dec 13 18:46:24 <brocktice> Thank you Disconnect
Dec 13 18:46:50 <RyeBrye-phone> d0netsFN - i am not sure where to even begin poking to try to find it. The first step would be to figure out a power+data cable that would be required
Dec 13 18:46:59 * jbq wishes that we could get clean patches for tethering.
Dec 13 18:47:31 <brocktice> jbq, what do you mean "clean"
Dec 13 18:47:42 <kRutOn> jbq: Are all of them expect scripts or something similarly fragile?
Dec 13 18:48:09 <jbq> patches that we can accept, that don't require a rooted rc30 to work, and don't rely on GPL user-space components at the core of the system.
Dec 13 18:48:15 <brocktice> jbq, ahh
Dec 13 18:49:58 <Kottizen> Testing...
Dec 13 18:50:26 <ttuttle> jbq: Would you accept it, if someone sent one that met those requirements?
Dec 13 18:50:31 <ttuttle> jbq: Or would T-Mo complain?
Dec 13 18:51:04 <jbq> ttuttle: we'd definitely accept it in Android. Beyond that it's a T-Mobile problem.
Dec 13 18:51:39 <ttuttle> jbq: Nice.
Dec 13 18:51:46 <jbq> It's a very common feature in most phones, there's no reason why we wouldn't put it in.
Dec 13 18:52:00 <`krstnsn> oh jesus
Dec 13 18:54:19 <ttuttle> jbq: Ooh!
Dec 13 18:54:43 <ttuttle> jbq: Does tiwlan support master mode?
Dec 13 18:54:43 <ttuttle> jbq: (Or, failing that, ad-hoc mode?)
Dec 13 18:54:55 <jbq> ttuttle: I have no idea.
Dec 13 18:55:13 <ttuttle> jbq: Oh.  Anyway, someone should write a patch that adds support for turning your phone into a wifi router :)
Dec 13 18:55:26 <jbq> (if it does, I bet that the rest of the Android stack doesn't).
Dec 13 18:55:48 <jbq> but, yeah, that'd be sweet. The phone would run dangerously hot, though.
Dec 13 18:56:02 <brocktice> wow, there's that 80-some kb/s limit disconnect mentioned
Dec 13 18:56:11 <brocktice> someone was asking about latency on 3g, I got 267 ms
Dec 13 18:56:11 <ttuttle> brocktice: wait, what?
Dec 13 18:56:28 <brocktice> http://www.gotontheinter.net/node/6
Dec 13 18:56:41 <jbq> brocktice: the current BT implementations runs as 115200.
Dec 13 18:56:49 <brocktice> yep
Dec 13 18:57:03 <ttuttle> brocktice: oh
Dec 13 18:57:07 <ttuttle> brocktice: i was thinking wifi, not BT.
Dec 13 18:57:15 <ttuttle> brocktice: just make the phone transform into a router :)
Dec 13 18:57:25 <brocktice> ttuttle, sure but there's that whole master mode thing
Dec 13 18:57:35 <brocktice> what about usb?
Dec 13 18:57:41 <ttuttle> brocktice: USB could work.
Dec 13 18:57:44 <brocktice> or does that require host mode?
Dec 13 18:57:49 <ttuttle> brocktice: you'd need to add a network device gadget
Dec 13 18:57:52 <ttuttle> brocktice: but that's doable.
Dec 13 18:57:58 <brocktice> ttuttle, you would?
Dec 13 18:58:08 <ttuttle> brocktice: yeah.  currently it's just usb storage and adb
Dec 13 18:58:22 <brocktice> Right but one should be able to network over a usb connection normally.
Dec 13 18:58:34 <brocktice> iirc
Dec 13 18:58:36 <RyeBrye-phone> there is already usb networking stuff in the tree
Dec 13 18:58:42 <Fredbo> if there's a device driver, yes
Dec 13 18:58:49 <ttuttle> brocktice: you can't "network over a usb connection".  one of them needs to be a host and one needs to be a client offering a network device class.
Dec 13 18:59:00 <jbq> brocktice: you have an ADP1, right?
Dec 13 18:59:03 <brocktice> jbq, yeah
Dec 13 18:59:11 <jbq> can you get a root shell on it?
Dec 13 18:59:15 <brocktice> yep
Dec 13 18:59:19 <brocktice> I'm in already
Dec 13 18:59:21 <RyeBrye-phone> ttuttle - you can have the phone present itself as a usb networking device
Dec 13 18:59:24 <ttuttle> brocktice: oh, what build does it come with?
Dec 13 18:59:33 * brocktice checks
Dec 13 18:59:36 <ttuttle> RyeBrye-phone: Yeah, I know, but doesn't that require turning on the network device gadget?
Dec 13 18:59:43 <jbq> do you know/remember whether adb is enabled by default after a factory reset?
Dec 13 18:59:48 <ttuttle> jbq: it's disabled
Dec 13 18:59:50 <ttuttle> jbq: i think
Dec 13 18:59:55 <brocktice> jbq, It came on I thought.
Dec 13 19:00:00 <jbq> ack! :(
Dec 13 19:00:03 <brocktice> At least from the shop
Dec 13 19:00:07 <brocktice> now if I did a reset I don't know.
Dec 13 19:00:20 <brocktice> why?
Dec 13 19:00:40 <brocktice> android-build@apa27 #6?
Dec 13 19:00:42 <jbq> there's a valid thread on android-discuss that says that you need a sim card to register before you can use it.
Dec 13 19:00:46 <RyeBrye-phone> ttuttle - the usb gadget framework iirc is in android's 2.6.27 kernel which isnt shipping yet
Dec 13 19:01:13 <brocktice> dream_devphone-userdebug 1.0 UNLOCKED 116222 test-keys
Dec 13 19:01:19 <ttuttle> brocktice: nice
Dec 13 19:01:19 <jbq> and I'm wondering if you could adb shell in as root and turn wifi on before registering.
Dec 13 19:01:25 <RyeBrye-phone> the usb stuff in 2.6.25 isnt using the gadget framework
Dec 13 19:01:34 <ttuttle> jbq: /me can try that on a dogfood build
Dec 13 19:01:49 <jbq> ttuttle: unlocked builds aren't configured the same way.
Dec 13 19:01:54 <ttuttle> jbq: oh okay
Dec 13 19:02:00 <jbq> ttuttle: I know it can be done on debug dogfood builds.
Dec 13 19:02:04 <brocktice> jbq, if you can tell me how to dd off the /data partition I'd be happy to reset
Dec 13 19:02:11 <brocktice> I tried before with no joy
Dec 13 19:02:25 <jbq> yeah, not sure.
Dec 13 19:02:40 <ttuttle> brocktice: dd if=/dev/mtdblocksomething of=/sdcard/file
Dec 13 19:02:41 <brocktice> kind of surprised fastboot is only designed to push
Dec 13 19:02:43 <ttuttle> brocktice: maybe?
Dec 13 19:02:45 <brocktice> ttuttle, didn't work
Dec 13 19:02:50 <ttuttle> brocktice: as root?
Dec 13 19:03:16 <brocktice> Input/output error
Dec 13 19:03:18 <RyeBrye-phone> brocktice - infernix has been working very hard on a whole-system-capable dump/restore
Dec 13 19:03:30 <jbq> dd'ing yaffs block devices is a bad idea.
Dec 13 19:03:35 <brocktice> [  694.397224] msm_nand_read_oob: unsupported ops->len, 512
Dec 13 19:03:35 <RyeBrye-phone> brocktice - i think he has something working
Dec 13 19:03:48 <brocktice> hmm
Dec 13 19:04:07 <brocktice> wonder if I can just cp -r
Dec 13 19:04:12 <jbq> what you'd really want is tar.
Dec 13 19:04:15 <RyeBrye-phone> in fact, i am almost positive he has
Dec 13 19:04:20 <brocktice> yeah I was just trying that
Dec 13 19:04:23 <brocktice> I'm running busybox :)
Dec 13 19:04:46 <Fredbo> what I'm interested in is mounting a partition from the sdcard as /data
Dec 13 19:04:53 <jbq> you also want to do that while the rest of the system isn't running ("stop" in a shell).
Dec 13 19:05:29 <brocktice> interesting
Dec 13 19:05:37 <brocktice> Having to figure out the busybox tar syntax
Dec 13 19:05:39 <brocktice> not what I'm used to
Dec 13 19:05:55 <brocktice> and now the device does nothing :)
Dec 13 19:05:56 * jbq just realizes that build 116222 is pretty old.
Dec 13 19:06:01 <brocktice> does "start" restart it?
Dec 13 19:06:05 <jbq> brocktice: yes
Dec 13 19:06:10 <brocktice> jbq, said it was built november 3rd
Dec 13 19:06:17 <brocktice> good to know
Dec 13 19:07:06 <jbq> brocktice: yes, that's the date.
Dec 13 19:09:14 <brocktice> tarring
Dec 13 19:10:54 <brocktice> maybe I should have left the 'j' option out
Dec 13 19:10:57 <brocktice> it's not what I'd call 'fast'
Dec 13 19:11:26 <RyeBrye-phone> yeah... esp if you dont care about space :)
Dec 13 19:11:42 <brocktice> 8 gb card so no
Dec 13 19:11:47 <brocktice> force of habit
Dec 13 19:12:09 <RyeBrye-phone> i heard the sdhc card io is faster than internal nand - this true?
Dec 13 19:12:39 <jbq> RyeBrye-phone: very true. several times faster.
Dec 13 19:12:49 <RyeBrye-phone> cool
Dec 13 19:13:50 <RyeBrye-phone> does it kill the battery significantly faster to use the sdhc extensively?
Dec 13 19:14:08 <jbq> RyeBrye-phone: I don't know.
Dec 13 19:14:13 <Nafai> I ordered an 8 gig SDHC last night :)
Dec 13 19:14:29 <jbq> I'd guess it doesn't, since you need to keep the CPU powered for a shorter amount of time.
Dec 13 19:14:35 <RyeBrye-phone> as did I... $20 or something for a class 6 from newegg
Dec 13 19:14:44 <brocktice> should I remount the /cache partition on /data/dalvik-cache?
Dec 13 19:14:47 <brocktice> at some point?
Dec 13 19:14:53 <Damm> gosh I remember the good ole days with PocketPC 2003 and no NAND
Dec 13 19:14:59 <Damm> pull the battery and loose your data
Dec 13 19:15:35 <jbq> brocktice: you lose some functionality if you didn't have /cache (especially the ability to download market apps)
Dec 13 19:15:45 <Guest34656> hi, anoyone here have got the dev G1? and how many time it tooks for the delivery ?
Dec 13 19:15:53 <brocktice> jbq, I thought the cache wasn't being used?
Dec 13 19:16:01 <jbq> brocktice: oh, it's used :)
Dec 13 19:16:23 <brocktice> sorry, got to take care of something
Dec 13 19:16:25 <brocktice> back in a short while
Dec 13 19:16:26 <jbq> OTA updates, market downloads, DRM downloads, and GMail attachment previews.
Dec 13 19:16:39 <RyeBrye-phone> but not thre browser :(
Dec 13 19:17:04 <jbq> RyeBrye-phone: nope, that was too much work :(
Dec 13 19:17:09 <jbq> (in the future...)
Dec 13 19:17:47 <jbq> I mean, it's an obvious choice for the browser, for maps, for market's cache, for email... but writing code takes time.
Dec 13 19:19:33 <RyeBrye-phone> Maybe I'll make my phone just use my sdcard for everything :)
Dec 13 19:21:40 <mikey|> http://forums.t-mobile.com/tmbl/board/message?board.id=Android3&message.id=22658
Dec 13 19:21:46 <mikey|> anyone else had this problem?
Dec 13 19:22:26 <jbq> hardware limitation.
Dec 13 19:23:10 <jbq> (or maybe firmware, if you're on a tower that supports simultaneous voice+data in 2G).
Dec 13 19:24:31 <Guest34656> i buy the dev G1 from the android market last monday but i have to leave usa tuesday? thats why im asking for the delivery times from dev G1,
Dec 13 19:24:42 <Damm> class 12, B radio
Dec 13 19:24:50 <Damm> you should have no problem doing voice and data
Dec 13 19:25:01 <Damm> however some towers will not allow it to happen
Dec 13 19:25:09 <mikey|> :|
Dec 13 19:25:13 <jbq> I know that during testing I've never seen it happen.
Dec 13 19:25:26 <Damm> and that's when you call up T-Mobile, and have them file an engineering ticket
Dec 13 19:25:29 <JesusFreke> guest: you can track on the fedex website with your brightstar order number
Dec 13 19:25:33 <Damm> as they need someone to go out to the tower and fix it.
Dec 13 19:25:41 <Damm> now is this a 2G tower or 3G?
Dec 13 19:25:45 <JesusFreke> track by reference, I mean
Dec 13 19:25:53 <Damm> if it's a 2G tower... they are not going to fix it more then likely
Dec 13 19:25:57 <mikey|> don't know, im using 2g for now, i dont really need 3g
Dec 13 19:26:20 <mikey|> would using 3g fix it?
Dec 13 19:26:22 <Damm> right, T-Mobile really didn't support it with 2G... only a few devices could force it properly (Sony Ericsson Phones)
Dec 13 19:26:34 <jbq> mikey|: most likely.
Dec 13 19:26:35 <P1ro> JesusFreke they havent send me any track number and i mail them asking for it and not answer so far
Dec 13 19:26:38 <Damm> that or disable data
Dec 13 19:26:51 <JesusFreke> P1ro: I know. I never got a tracking number from them either
Dec 13 19:27:03 <JesusFreke> P1ro: but you got the initial order confirmation email, right?
Dec 13 19:27:06 <Damm> JesusFreke, I thought you had to ask for it...
Dec 13 19:27:23 <mikey|> Damm: why data you mean sync? if not, how can I turn off what you're referring to?
Dec 13 19:27:25 <JesusFreke> Damm: they never sent me anything after the initial confirmation email
Dec 13 19:27:28 <mikey|> s/why/by
Dec 13 19:27:44 <Damm> mikey|, no idea on how.
Dec 13 19:27:54 <Damm> other then basically ripping out all your APNS
Dec 13 19:27:59 <P1ro> JesusFreke but how many time it took ?
Dec 13 19:28:00 <Damm> which is not worth it
Dec 13 19:28:28 <JesusFreke> P1ro: there's a thing called "track be reference" on the fedex website
Dec 13 19:28:55 <mikey|> damn, I thought I'd solved this bug but it's back :/
Dec 13 19:29:03 <JesusFreke> P1ro: you enter your brightstar order number as the reference, and the zipcode where the package is going, and if it has been shipped, it will show you the tracking info
Dec 13 19:29:11 <mikey|> double messages being posted to the handler, but I cant find the sender for the 2nd post
Dec 13 19:29:24 <P1ro> JesusFreke thank you i will check my email and try that
Dec 13 19:54:21 <brocktice> alright factory resetting
Dec 13 19:54:28 <brocktice> I'll have to log this for jbq
Dec 13 19:54:58 * bparker06 is unboxing his dev phone
Dec 13 19:55:11 <brocktice> bparker06, yay!
Dec 13 19:55:54 <bparker06> hopefully it's not DOA like other peoples'
Dec 13 19:56:03 <brocktice> I've confirmed the dev phone has adb access on after factory reset
Dec 13 19:56:07 <brocktice> bparker06, didn't hear about that...
Dec 13 19:56:09 <brocktice> mine was fine
Dec 13 19:56:16 <DarkriftX> I just mastered all wii sports game. its like in the matrix at the end when he has his epiphany
Dec 13 19:56:32 <DarkriftX> i realized i dont have to swing the bat, just make the sensor inside it think it moved very far very fast
Dec 13 19:56:34 <brocktice> lol
Dec 13 19:56:42 <brocktice> Yeah my brothers in law know how to win the bowling every time
Dec 13 19:56:43 <DarkriftX> a slight twitch can give me a 120mph fastball :)
Dec 13 19:56:50 <bparker06> http://groups.google.com/group/android-developers/browse_thread/thread/f580b390ef705d51#
Dec 13 19:56:53 <bparker06> http://groups.google.com/group/android-developers/browse_thread/thread/266ce8994900f7f4
Dec 13 19:56:59 <bparker06> some dead phones reported there
Dec 13 19:57:04 <DarkriftX> first you must realize there is no bat
Dec 13 19:57:21 <brocktice> damn
Dec 13 19:57:59 <Krstnsn> http://dl.ziza.ru/other/122008/05/ero/025.jpg
Dec 13 19:58:18 <bparker06> lol @ no boxart
Dec 13 19:58:44 <brocktice> eh wow
Dec 13 19:58:50 <brocktice> photoshopped?
Dec 13 19:58:52 <tech9iner> g'day all.. what is our favorite note taking app for android please.. ive been using notepad.. but omg.. someone calls you or screen backlite screensaver or ?? any number of things that happen & it loses any new open notes data completely..
Dec 13 20:00:16 <JonOnt> Hey guys, i just got my G1 last night, is mjsip or mjua the only sip client for android? And can any one point me in the right direction to install mjua or anything other sip client?
Dec 13 20:01:15 <RyeBrye> I didn't know there were any sip clients
Dec 13 20:07:04 <brocktice> just tried untarring that /data tar I did over a factory reset
Dec 13 20:07:08 <JesusFreke> bparker: nice! enjoy :D
Dec 13 20:07:08 <brocktice> rebooting now, we'll see what happens.
Dec 13 20:07:25 <JesusFreke> brock: I've done that before. works fine for me :)
Dec 13 20:07:34 <brocktice> JesusFreke, good to know
Dec 13 20:07:45 <brocktice> hey, my stuff is back!
Dec 13 20:07:59 <bparker06> hmm
Dec 13 20:07:59 <brocktice> awesome
Dec 13 20:07:59 <offby1> Hmm, my "Music" app said "No SD Card Error" ... then after a few seconds it displayed my playlists as it ought to have.  What could have caused that?
Dec 13 20:08:01 <SanMehat> sorry i missed the excitement
Dec 13 20:08:05 <bparker06> where is the memory card slot on this thing
Dec 13 20:08:12 <brocktice> this will make me much less hesitant to reflash
Dec 13 20:08:16 <brocktice> bparker06, open the screen
Dec 13 20:08:23 <brocktice> it's a little tab on the left side of the 'chin'
Dec 13 20:08:40 <brocktice> then you can get to the little fingernail ridge
Dec 13 20:09:05 <bparker06> ah thanks
Dec 13 20:09:16 <brocktice> When I first got it, I thought, "Lies, there isn't a slot anywhere!"
Dec 13 20:09:58 <bparker06> powering up
Dec 13 20:10:26 <brocktice> Is there a way to properly uninstall existing apps once /system is rw?
Dec 13 20:11:07 <tech9iner> no fav STABle note taking apps mates?
Dec 13 20:11:47 <offby1> I use gmail :-|
Dec 13 20:11:50 <offby1> that way it syncs
Dec 13 20:11:57 <bparker06> ok so
Dec 13 20:12:07 <bparker06> I turned on my dev phone for the first time
Dec 13 20:12:11 <bparker06> it wants to sign into gmail
Dec 13 20:12:18 <bparker06> but it didn't let me specify APN settings first
Dec 13 20:12:21 <bparker06> so now what :/
Dec 13 20:12:41 <SanMehat> can you hit menu in the setup wizard?
Dec 13 20:12:50 <SanMehat> i thought there was an option there for entering APN settings
Dec 13 20:13:38 <brocktice> SanMehat, that's what the little insert with mine said
Dec 13 20:13:51 <brocktice> Also, you can log in via shell and turn on wifi
Dec 13 20:14:58 <SanMehat> ah riight
Dec 13 20:15:20 <brocktice> which is what jbq wanted me to verify
Dec 13 20:15:22 <brocktice> and I just did
Dec 13 20:15:27 <brocktice> well, the logging in.
Dec 13 20:15:32 <brocktice> I didn't screw with wifi
Dec 13 20:15:33 <tech9iner> lol.. jolly good pt actually offby1
Dec 13 20:15:35 <tech9iner> tx
Dec 13 20:16:00 <bparker06> SanMehat: yep I see that
Dec 13 20:16:02 <bparker06> but it doesn't help
Dec 13 20:16:08 <bparker06> I added mine in
Dec 13 20:16:11 <bparker06> still same message
Dec 13 20:16:17 <bparker06> also has no bars :/
Dec 13 20:16:22 <bparker06> and there's an X over it
Dec 13 20:16:44 * tech9iner checks for rc30 sexploits.. 
Dec 13 20:17:20 <SanMehat> are there many pre-30 devices left?
Dec 13 20:17:26 <JesusFreke> tech9iner.. it has a vibrate mode :D
Dec 13 20:17:34 <brocktice> snork
Dec 13 20:18:02 <tech9iner> lmao.. who knew /me sheepishly removes g1 from his Hulk Underoos..
Dec 13 20:18:39 <Krstnsn> new aim ap
Dec 13 20:19:16 <brocktice> anyone got some expertise at cross-compiling native binaries?
Dec 13 20:19:27 <brocktice> gcc can't even find stdio.h
Dec 13 20:20:15 <JesusFreke> brock: the easiest thing for me to do was to copy a program in the /core folder in the git source
Dec 13 20:20:26 <JesusFreke> brock: and use android's build system
Dec 13 20:20:37 <brocktice> JesusFreke, good idea
Dec 13 20:20:37 <brocktice> thanks
Dec 13 20:23:42 <P1ro> JesusFreke thank you alot, i hope they will be here for tuesday my phone its on chigago
Dec 13 20:24:30 <JesusFreke> P1ro: it should have an estimated delivery date
Dec 13 20:24:33 <brocktice> ttuttle, Since you were talking about builds earlier, is there somewhere one can get an .img of the build that's on the devphone?
Dec 13 20:24:57 <brocktice> I'd be a lot more ready to hose it if I had that.
Dec 13 20:25:04 <brocktice> accidentally of course.
Dec 13 20:25:05 <JesusFreke> brocktice, I have one
Dec 13 20:25:11 <brocktice> JesusFreke, is it posted?
Dec 13 20:25:17 <JesusFreke> brocktice: yeah, sec
Dec 13 20:25:29 <JesusFreke> http://www.gotontheinter.net/node/13
Dec 13 20:25:35 <JesusFreke> packaged in a nice update.zip
Dec 13 20:25:53 <JesusFreke> it will restore the dev phone to it's original state. (or at least the boot, recovery and system partitions)
Dec 13 20:26:11 <brocktice> JesusFreke, Right, or alternately one could just push the system img
Dec 13 20:26:22 <brocktice> thanks
Dec 13 20:28:39 <warren> The Dev Phone looks pretty good, but the price is pretty significant
Dec 13 20:29:12 <warren> too bad a rc30 root exploit was not found
Dec 13 20:29:14 <JesusFreke> warren: $25 more than a G1
Dec 13 20:29:33 <warren> JesusFreke: total cost of ownership is a lot less if you got a contract, which I would anyway
Dec 13 20:29:44 <warren> I personally would
Dec 13 20:30:01 <JesusFreke> you can sell the contracted G1 for around $400 :)
Dec 13 20:30:05 <squeakypants> on a t-mobile G1 can you use adb and such?
Dec 13 20:30:11 <squeakypants> JesusFreke: really??
Dec 13 20:30:26 <warren> JesusFreke: but then you still have the contract and $200 cancellation fee?
Dec 13 20:30:33 <JesusFreke> squeakypants: check it out. there's this site called ebay...
Dec 13 20:30:40 <JesusFreke> warren, why would you need to cancel?
Dec 13 20:30:43 <squeakypants> warren: there's no cancellation fee if you don't cancel ;)
Dec 13 20:30:48 <squeakypants> but then you can buy a dev g1 :)
Dec 13 20:30:50 <JesusFreke> warren: just take the $400 and buy a dev phone
Dec 13 20:31:03 <warren> ooooh right, I forgot about SIM card
Dec 13 20:31:08 <warren> Sprint doesn't use SIM cards
Dec 13 20:31:20 <JesusFreke> ahh. didn't know that
Dec 13 20:31:52 <Versed> I bught my G1 off contract before the developer phone was offered.
Dec 13 20:32:00 <Versed> I mean, not too upset over it.
Dec 13 20:32:07 <JesusFreke> versed, how long ago?
Dec 13 20:32:16 <Versed> about a month
Dec 13 20:32:25 <JesusFreke> less than 30 days? :D
Dec 13 20:32:30 <Versed> I don't intend on developing, just user
Dec 13 20:32:31 <Versed> yes
Dec 13 20:32:37 <squeakypants> i only see $300 on ebay
Dec 13 20:32:47 <Versed> I also unlocked it already
Dec 13 20:32:51 <warren> I'd like to have the contract discounted price, insurance directly from the carrier, but with the unlocked benefits of Dev Phone.
Dec 13 20:32:52 <JesusFreke> versed, you should have 30 days to take it back
Dec 13 20:33:00 <Versed> and intending on using it on att.
Dec 13 20:33:01 <squeakypants> will RC30 ever be unlocked?
Dec 13 20:33:09 <squeakypants> and like i said, can you use adb and such w/o unlocking it?
Dec 13 20:33:10 <warren> I realize this is possible when the next root exploit is found, but it will be closed quickly by tmobile.
Dec 13 20:33:45 <squeakypants> warren: if you unlocked, then updated to RC30, would it still be unlocked?
Dec 13 20:34:09 <warren> squeakypants: you should really read all the web pages before asking stupid redundant questions
Dec 13 20:34:31 <squeakypants> warren: i love you too
Dec 13 20:34:56 <JesusFreke> squeakypants, if you installed the dev bootloader, then upgraded to RC30, then it would still be possible to revert to a prior RC
Dec 13 20:35:03 <warren> And then there's $200 to break my existing Sprint contract if I leave Sprint before November 2009
Dec 13 20:35:17 <JesusFreke> warren: ah
Dec 13 20:35:32 <warren> JesusFreke: which is only possible if you hacked it prior to RC30 installed itself, which is impossible if you get a new G1 today.
Dec 13 20:35:53 <JesusFreke> warren: right.
Dec 13 20:36:13 <warren> It seems you can't get insurance on the Dev Phone
Dec 13 20:36:14 <JesusFreke> warren: although I think there are still a handful of RC29 phones still out there
Dec 13 20:36:21 <warren> so it would be $625 for me to get the dev phone
Dec 13 20:36:36 <warren> and I would get no contract discount and no insurance
Dec 13 20:36:36 <Versed> there are more phones coming warren
Dec 13 20:36:36 <mikey|> Damm: you and jpb were right
Dec 13 20:36:46 <warren> Versed: I hope so
Dec 13 20:36:50 <mikey|> i turned on 3g and called myself while loading a page and it worked find
Dec 13 20:36:52 <mikey|> fine *
Dec 13 20:37:07 <mikey|> then i turned on 2g and called myself while reloading, and it went to voicemail
Dec 13 20:37:10 <Versed> and sprint, while they don't want it now, is intending on get a android phone.
Dec 13 20:37:28 <brocktice> ah sprint, so funny
Dec 13 20:37:51 <brocktice> "Android sucks, we'll do our own thing."  12 more companies join the OHA. "Okay, we're looking into Android, it's great!"
Dec 13 20:38:00 <warren> Versed: their attitude is annoying
Dec 13 20:38:14 <Versed> well they're sprint.
Dec 13 20:38:23 <warren> I told Sprint that I am leaving unless they have an Android phone in the next few months.
Dec 13 20:38:41 <offby1> yeah!
Dec 13 20:38:44 <Versed> who much longer do you have on your contract?
Dec 13 20:38:48 <squeakypants> haha
Dec 13 20:38:58 <warren> A special department called me, and they told me to write to this other department to get myself signed up for an Android test program on Sprint.
Dec 13 20:39:08 <squeakypants> oooh nice!
Dec 13 20:39:08 <brocktice> O_o
Dec 13 20:39:09 <warren> That other department wrote back, "We have no plans on doing Android."
Dec 13 20:39:13 <brocktice> lol
Dec 13 20:39:15 <squeakypants> HA
Dec 13 20:39:20 <SanMehat> bahahahaha
Dec 13 20:39:22 <warren> this was Wednesday
Dec 13 20:39:30 <squeakypants> is sprint in the OHA?
Dec 13 20:39:46 * brocktice thinks SanMehat knows something
Dec 13 20:39:47 <Versedtoo> damned
Dec 13 20:39:57 <SanMehat> i dont know anything
Dec 13 20:40:02 <squeakypants> yeah they are
Dec 13 20:40:03 <SanMehat> i just found the story hillarious
Dec 13 20:40:29 <warren> as much as I hate Sprint, I've been with them for more than a decade
Dec 13 20:40:31 <SanMehat> how he brought everybodies hopes up, and then dashed them on the next line
Dec 13 20:40:36 <brocktice> Oh, yeah
Dec 13 20:40:37 <warren> and their prices are way lower than the competition
Dec 13 20:40:51 <Nafai> Anyone use ant or maven to build their Android projects?
Dec 13 20:40:57 <brocktice> warren, I had been with them for a long time. Then I wanted linux on my phone, so I switched to Tmo for the RAZR2 v8
Dec 13 20:40:59 <warren> Sprint's service was far worse 4 years ago
Dec 13 20:41:00 <Damm> mikey|, why would you turn off 3G anywho?
Dec 13 20:41:07 <Damm> battery drain to you?
Dec 13 20:41:09 <brocktice> and now I have linux on my phone for the second time
Dec 13 20:41:09 <mikey|> i dont need it
Dec 13 20:41:19 <Versedtoo> warren, if I had to cdma, I'd do sprint.
Dec 13 20:41:22 <Damm> well you do
Dec 13 20:41:25 <Damm> to get voice and data
Dec 13 20:41:27 <mikey|> and yeah, get a bit of battery life
Dec 13 20:41:37 <mikey|> yeah, I didn't know that earlier
Dec 13 20:41:38 <Versedtoo> I use them for my wireless broadband.
Dec 13 20:41:41 <Damm> we won't talk about my battery life... i've been told it's unholy
Dec 13 20:41:43 <Versedtoo> they do that well.
Dec 13 20:41:51 <warren> http://zzzphone.com/ Have you folks been talking about this?  It seems ambiguously real or fake depending on what article you read.
Dec 13 20:41:57 * Damm can go 3-4days between charges
Dec 13 20:42:00 <brocktice> Damm, did you sacrifice a goat?
Dec 13 20:42:07 <Damm> brocktice, no
Dec 13 20:42:39 <brocktice> warren, that's a pretty shoddy looking animation
Dec 13 20:42:50 <brocktice> are they kidding?
Dec 13 20:42:55 <mikey|> lol warren
Dec 13 20:42:59 <warren> Versedtoo: I read that it is possible to unlock Sprint phones from Sprint network now, but what other network can you possibly use it on?
Dec 13 20:43:09 <Versedtoo> vzw
Dec 13 20:43:22 <Versedtoo> if you can get them to activate the esn
Dec 13 20:43:27 <brocktice> It's like something a 10 year-old made after learning flash for the first time. Doesn't encourage me to take them seriously
Dec 13 20:43:31 <warren> I mean, my Sprint Treo 750p really sucks
Dec 13 20:43:52 <Versedtoo> guys on #sprintusers like their touchpro's.
Dec 13 20:44:05 <Versedtoo> those that haven't ported out to att yet.
Dec 13 20:44:20 <warren> brocktice: PC Magazine met them and figured out that they are legitimate, but they are in over their heads, Americans trying to design and ship products directly from China with no budget for marketing.
Dec 13 20:44:28 <squeakypants> warren: no, my samsung e105 really sucks
Dec 13 20:44:30 <warren> brocktice: but then I can find no review of the actual phone
Dec 13 20:44:41 <brocktice> ahhh
Dec 13 20:45:19 <warren> it does sound too good to be true though
Dec 13 20:46:12 <Damm> warren, your whole line there is full of fail... Sprint + Treo = fail
Dec 13 20:46:51 * warren wonders when and where "full of fail" and "failboat" came from
Dec 13 20:47:14 <warren> invented by sprint? =)
Dec 13 20:47:30 <Damm> nah
Dec 13 20:47:35 <Damm> typically T-Mobile is more fail then sprint
Dec 13 20:48:08 <Damm> I find US Phones/carriers to be pretty sad.  If you look at Europe doing Video calling years ago
Dec 13 20:48:08 <Versedtoo> TMO is nice, nice to deal with, nice in their stores, nice when you call them, and they try.  But otherwise I'm not impressed.
Dec 13 20:48:14 <Damm> and guess what... we still don't have video calling
Dec 13 20:48:40 <mikey|> warren: obvious fail, no ssl on checkout when submitting cc details
Dec 13 20:48:43 <Damm> Versedtoo, TMO is very rough on their people to be nice, suckup, nice nice
Dec 13 20:48:59 <Versedtoo> no, I think they honestly try
Dec 13 20:49:13 <Damm> but Tmobile is what you can expect from a company who outsources a ton of its infrastructure
Dec 13 20:49:18 <warren> Sprint has been REALLY nice to me in the last year
Dec 13 20:49:23 <Versedtoo> I happen to like the people who sold me the phone.  I gave them high marks.
Dec 13 20:49:24 <Versedtoo> but
Dec 13 20:49:32 <Versedtoo> their tech people are soso
Dec 13 20:49:33 <warren> Sprint can't compete on features
Dec 13 20:49:42 <Versedtoo> the whole mms'ing issue.
Dec 13 20:49:51 <Versedtoo> they said, well its att who has the problem.
Dec 13 20:49:55 <Versedtoo> doubtful
Dec 13 20:50:09 <Damm> Versedtoo, the problem is that T-Mobile is very heavily based on using Primus... their techs really don't know anything out of the box
Dec 13 20:50:28 <Damm> So it's safe to say they hire alot of people who lack 'common sense'
Dec 13 20:50:30 <Versedtoo> since vzw people sent me mms', sprint people sent me mms's, and a vodafone user friend from europe sent me an mms.  no problem.
Dec 13 20:50:47 <warren> The T-mobile plan with data would be like $35/mo more than what I'm paying for sprint now
Dec 13 20:50:55 <Damm> my woman tried to mms me from her Motorola A1200 and it failed
Dec 13 20:51:01 <Damm> haven't tried from my Sony Ericsson yet
Dec 13 20:51:01 <warren> It appears that you need the higher data plan
Dec 13 20:51:16 <warren> 400 text messages or e-mails through gmail?
Dec 13 20:51:20 <Versedtoo> my blackberry Bold is cheaper or around the same as my g1 plan.
Dec 13 20:51:28 <Versedtoo> pln
Dec 13 20:51:30 <Versedtoo> plan
Dec 13 20:51:51 <Damm> typically I use a blackberry for work
Dec 13 20:51:54 <Damm> but the G1 is a nice change
Dec 13 20:52:00 <Versedtoo> it is nice.
Dec 13 20:52:28 <Damm> I loathe the fact I have to use gmail to get notifications from Nagios
Dec 13 20:52:32 <Damm> because otherwise it gets sent as MMS
Dec 13 20:52:35 <Versedtoo> I never subscribed to the whole my device is great so yours sux theory.
Dec 13 20:53:54 <warren> I suppose I should just be patient and wait for Sprint to have an Android
Dec 13 20:54:03 <warren> it'll probably have a cheaper plan than T-mobile and more 3G coverage
Dec 13 20:54:20 <Damm> if sprint lasts 2 more years
Dec 13 20:55:36 <Versedtoo> lol
Dec 13 20:56:11 <warren> I at least know what crap to expect if I stick with Sprint
Dec 13 20:56:20 <warren> I have to learn all new crap dealing skills if I move
Dec 13 20:56:31 <Versedtoo> sprint has actually got better.
Dec 13 20:56:38 <warren> yes it has
Dec 13 20:56:41 <warren> surprisingly
Dec 13 20:57:36 <warren> I tried to survive the last 10 days without my Treo's data plan.  But I can't do it.
Dec 13 20:57:46 <warren> The web browser sucks, but it was useful for tiny things
Dec 13 20:57:52 <bparker06> ok so
Dec 13 20:57:52 <warren> and Google Maps was functional
Dec 13 20:57:58 <bparker06> who can help me activate my dev phone :P
Dec 13 20:58:01 <Damm> google maps is not functional on the G1?
Dec 13 20:58:16 <xsdg> bparker06: do you have a specific question?
Dec 13 20:58:23 <brocktice> bparker06, do you have wifi available?
Dec 13 20:58:30 <bparker06> brocktice: yes
Dec 13 20:58:34 <bparker06> but how can I enable it?
Dec 13 20:58:36 <warren> Damm: I still have November 2009 until my Sprint contract runs out, and all Android phone options now are both expensive for hardware and for plans
Dec 13 20:58:36 <brocktice> is it secured?
Dec 13 20:58:44 <bparker06> I don't seem to have gsm service on the phone for some reason
Dec 13 20:58:46 <bparker06> it's just X'ed out
Dec 13 20:58:48 <bparker06> brocktice: no
Dec 13 20:58:53 <brocktice> hmm
Dec 13 20:59:11 <brocktice> haven't done wifi setup manually in a while but it shouldn't be too hard with no security
Dec 13 20:59:16 <Damm> put a activated sim in it?
Dec 13 20:59:22 <bparker06> yep
Dec 13 20:59:34 <bparker06> I added the right apn but I can't figure out how to actually 'choose' it
Dec 13 20:59:42 <bparker06> it's just another apn in the list
Dec 13 20:59:53 <xsdg> bparker06: it should automatically, IME
Dec 13 20:59:57 <bparker06> I don't see any option to use wifi at all
Dec 13 21:00:08 <Damm> settings / wireless?
Dec 13 21:00:13 <Versed> you should still get a carrier signal even if apn's aren't configured.
Dec 13 21:00:14 <Damm> turn on wifi, then select a network?
Dec 13 21:00:18 <brocktice> No iwconfig on the device?
Dec 13 21:00:20 <xsdg> Damm: it's at the Setup thing
Dec 13 21:00:25 <Versed> seeing the phone is unlocked.
Dec 13 21:00:25 <Damm> xsdg, ah
Dec 13 21:00:30 <Versed> if
Dec 13 21:00:35 <warren> Versed: what other android phones are coming?
Dec 13 21:00:46 <Versed> there is this australian phone
Dec 13 21:00:52 <Versed> looks interesting.
Dec 13 21:00:59 <Versed> while even support att's 3g.
Dec 13 21:01:19 <Versed> and about the same price as a non contract g1
Dec 13 21:01:33 <Damm> 3G in the us is a joke.
Dec 13 21:01:40 <Versed> works for me
Dec 13 21:01:40 <Damm> every carrier has a propritary 3G
Dec 13 21:01:43 <squeakypants> damm: internet in general is ;)
Dec 13 21:01:59 <Damm> you can't take a Tmo phone to AT&T and get 3G, nor vise versa
Dec 13 21:02:04 <Versed> actually only tmo is using odd ball 3g.
Dec 13 21:02:06 <Damm> and then you have the VZW Sprint battle.
Dec 13 21:02:16 <Versed> sprint and vzw use the same system
Dec 13 21:02:23 <Versed> both non and 3g
Dec 13 21:02:27 <Damm> Versed, yeah but it's not exactly easy to switch between the two.
Dec 13 21:02:38 <warren> Versed: the australian one has a tiny screen
Dec 13 21:02:40 <Damm> possible, but I believe only Sprint bothers to help
Dec 13 21:02:48 <Versed> yeah
Dec 13 21:02:52 <Damm> Verizon has no interest in Sprint phones
Dec 13 21:02:58 <Versed> they don't have to.
Dec 13 21:03:01 <Damm> I was honestly hoping to see 1900/2100 for T-Mo
Dec 13 21:03:09 <Damm> so it would be the same as Europe
Dec 13 21:03:26 <Versed> US 2100 is different
Dec 13 21:03:35 <Damm> and then the constant delays with homeland security getting off 2100
Dec 13 21:03:36 <Versed> a few mhz off.
Dec 13 21:03:59 * Damm shrugs
Dec 13 21:04:10 <bparker06> anyone have any ideas?
Dec 13 21:04:15 <Damm> It's because America does US 2100 right
Dec 13 21:04:18 <Damm> and Europe does it wrong
Dec 13 21:04:21 <Damm> </fail>
Dec 13 21:04:33 <Versed> has nothing to do with right or wrong
Dec 13 21:04:52 <Versed> canada and a vast majority of latin america use the same system as att.
Dec 13 21:05:42 <Versed> and blame htc and other makers.
Dec 13 21:06:07 <Versed> my friggin bb bold supports 850/1800/1900 umts.
Dec 13 21:06:10 <summatusmentis> I wish there would be one standard, and all companies would follow
Dec 13 21:06:17 <Versed> I agree summa
Dec 13 21:06:28 <Damm> not going to happen aparently
Dec 13 21:06:34 <summatusmentis> might w/ LTE
Dec 13 21:06:38 * warren will just be patient...
Dec 13 21:06:42 <summatusmentis> but probably not
Dec 13 21:06:49 <Damm> Versed, RIM always goes the extra mile with it's radios
Dec 13 21:06:52 <Versed> its easier for the phone side to just make world phones.
Dec 13 21:06:54 <Damm> it's so you can use it in Japan
Dec 13 21:07:11 <Versed> like or hate RIM, they do make good quality
Dec 13 21:07:14 <Damm> but Samsung is good at making dual and single band phones for T-Mobile.
Dec 13 21:07:22 <Damm> cept the Storm
Dec 13 21:07:26 * Damm won't touch it
Dec 13 21:07:27 <warren> I want a phone like the G1, but without T-Mobile restrictions, where I can get it with a contract discount and regular insurance.
Dec 13 21:07:40 <Versed> htc, the att fuze and prior kaiser (tilt) had all the umts bands.
Dec 13 21:07:57 <Damm> Versed, but now we have AWS
Dec 13 21:08:01 <Versed> so
Dec 13 21:08:04 <Damm> so it doesn't matter if your phone supports the frequency
Dec 13 21:08:11 <Damm> if you don't have AWS support your screwed
Dec 13 21:08:16 <Versed> so I've heard.
Dec 13 21:08:25 <bparker06> so how can I activate the dev phone without cell service?
Dec 13 21:08:34 <bparker06> and more importantly, why doesn't it have service :/
Dec 13 21:08:43 <bparker06> the sim works fine in another phone
Dec 13 21:08:48 <Damm> Versed, http://www.phonescoop.com/articles/article.php?a=99
Dec 13 21:09:17 <Damm> all you could ever care about AWS
Dec 13 21:09:18 <Damm> and more
Dec 13 21:10:52 <socketbind> warren: you might want to get a Dev Phone ( http://code.google.com/intl/hu/android/dev-devices.html )
Dec 13 21:11:18 <socketbind> oh i am sry
Dec 13 21:11:40 <socketbind> said nothing i thought i linked the hungarian version
Dec 13 21:12:17 <warren> socketbind: due to my $200 cancellation fee, it would be far more expensive to get the dev phone
Dec 13 21:12:41 <warren> I'm hoping Sprint's future Android phone will have fewer restrictions than Tmobile
Dec 13 21:14:13 <bparker06> can someone help me out with activating my dev phone?
Dec 13 21:15:18 <JesusFreke> bparker, sure
Dec 13 21:15:53 <bparker06> ok
Dec 13 21:15:59 <bparker06> I have AT&T sim inserted
Dec 13 21:16:05 <bparker06> came out of an iphone
Dec 13 21:16:15 <bparker06> and the sim itself works and has data service
Dec 13 21:16:27 <bparker06> but in the dev phone it shows no bars with an X next to it
Dec 13 21:16:31 <bparker06> and registration fails
Dec 13 21:16:45 <bparker06> I already added the correct APN (wap.cingular) but it doesn't help
Dec 13 21:17:25 <JesusFreke> you have 2 options :)
Dec 13 21:17:56 <JesusFreke> either try to mess with the apn settings until it works (here's a page I found.. dunno if the settings are any good or not http://namshik.com/guide-unlock-t-mobile-g1-and-bypass-activation/)
Dec 13 21:18:15 <JesusFreke> or you can enable wifi and register through wifi
Dec 13 21:18:42 <JesusFreke> (but you'll probably still need to figure out the apn settings later)
Dec 13 21:19:22 <bparker06> I don't have access to a t-mobile sim
Dec 13 21:19:29 <bparker06> how can I enable wifi?
Dec 13 21:19:37 <bparker06> adb or something?
Dec 13 21:19:49 <JesusFreke> yeah, adb shell in
Dec 13 21:19:53 <JesusFreke> and let me find the command
Dec 13 21:19:58 <bparker06> thanks
Dec 13 21:20:27 <JesusFreke> am start -a android.intent.action.MAIN -n com.android.settings/.Settings
Dec 13 21:20:37 <JesusFreke> that should open up the settings, and allow you to enable wifi :)
Dec 13 21:20:37 <xsdg> bparker06: where did you get the APN info from?
Dec 13 21:20:56 <xsdg> bparker06: err... sorry; wasn't scrolled all the way down:o)
Dec 13 21:22:14 <bparker06> omg
Dec 13 21:22:17 <bparker06> I just dropped the phone
Dec 13 21:22:25 <JesusFreke> it is ok?
Dec 13 21:22:29 <bparker06> lol yea
Dec 13 21:22:32 <JesusFreke> phew :p
Dec 13 21:22:59 <JesusFreke> now you've got your one manditory dropping out of your system. You don't have to do it anymore :p
Dec 13 21:22:59 <DarkriftX> that link i posted the other day about the g1 case (someone warned that reviews were bad), well i recieved it today and its not bad for $7.50 shipped
Dec 13 21:23:40 <bparker06> ok it's activated
Dec 13 21:23:51 <JesusFreke> cool :)
Dec 13 21:24:12 <bparker06> Your SIM card does not allow a connection to this network.
Dec 13 21:24:35 <anno^da_> Some more "Missed Call" users here that could tell me something of happening "Forced Close" problems?  - I'm trying to find the bugs that the users are reporting but don't see them on my G1. :(
Dec 13 21:25:19 <DarkriftX> http://www.handhelditems.com/google-rubberized-shield-case-black-free-screen-protector-p-19443.html?osCsid=5ea55a8ab713db31f5ad15d69ce42c39
Dec 13 21:25:23 <bparker06> JesusFreke: any ideas?
Dec 13 21:25:51 <JesusFreke> I just use t-mobile.. don't have any experience getting it to work on ATT
Dec 13 21:29:53 <Damm> bparker06, do you have a 64k sim or 32k or earlier?
Dec 13 21:30:08 <bparker06> whatever the iphone 3g sims are
Dec 13 21:30:12 <bparker06> the blue ones from AT&T
Dec 13 21:30:28 <Damm> well the phone is rejecting your sim
Dec 13 21:30:31 <Damm> i'd say try a new sim
Dec 13 21:30:43 <bparker06> don't have one :/
Dec 13 21:30:46 <Damm> go to an AT&T store and get another
Dec 13 21:30:50 <bparker06> hmm
Dec 13 21:31:14 <bparker06> ok
Dec 13 21:31:29 <Damm> i presume this is a developer 1
Dec 13 21:31:30 <brocktice> anno^da_, haven't had any problems since my reinstall
Dec 13 21:31:46 <Damm> but really if it was locked it would ask you for the subsidy code
Dec 13 21:31:58 <brocktice> JesusFreke, Is there a repository of all of the information that you and disconnect et al. have, aside from the posts on gotontheinter.net?
Dec 13 21:31:59 <Damm> afaik T-Mobile doesn't use 64k sims
Dec 13 21:32:10 <Damm> I imagine the DP1/G1 should handle a 64k sim
Dec 13 21:32:10 <Versed> all iphones even 2g ones, came with 3g 64k sims.
Dec 13 21:32:14 <brocktice> I want to start logging this info as I dig into the system.
Dec 13 21:32:17 <zinx> so short of a SHA1 collision, i haven't found a way to root RC30 yet :/
Dec 13 21:32:29 <zinx> and i think SHA1 collisions still require a lot more CPU power than i have
Dec 13 21:32:31 <Damm> Versed, well they've been using 64k sims for awhile on AT&T
Dec 13 21:32:31 <JesusFreke> brocktice: not really.. what kind of information? heh
Dec 13 21:32:47 <brocktice> JesusFreke, everything about the system...
Dec 13 21:32:49 <Damm> zinx, yeah if i cared much more i'd just buy a developer preview 1
Dec 13 21:32:50 <brocktice> I know there are some wikis.
Dec 13 21:32:50 <Versed> damn my g1 will accept and use my att sim
Dec 13 21:32:54 <Versed> 3g
Dec 13 21:32:58 <brocktice> For instance, I'm trying to figure out the init system
Dec 13 21:33:00 <Damm> Versed, unlocked G1?
Dec 13 21:33:04 <brocktice> So I can have things start automatically
Dec 13 21:33:08 <Versed> yes,  I unlocked it
Dec 13 21:33:12 <RyeBrye> Versed: you aren't using AT&T's 3G on the G1
Dec 13 21:33:17 <brocktice> Would be good to document cross-compilation etc.
Dec 13 21:33:22 <Damm> Versed, well then hohum, perhaps he put it in wrong
Dec 13 21:33:22 <Versed> I know I'm not.
Dec 13 21:33:23 <Damm> or something
Dec 13 21:33:28 <RyeBrye> Versed:  ok :)
Dec 13 21:33:43 <Versed> to be honest I am in a tmo 3g area.
Dec 13 21:33:47 <bparker06> lol my girlfriend is playing with the dev phone
Dec 13 21:33:49 <bparker06> now she wants one
Dec 13 21:34:07 <Versed> not as solid as the compitition.  but then again its new.
Dec 13 21:34:08 <offby1> I don't believe you
Dec 13 21:34:21 <zinx> Damm: yeah, and i've stated multiple times that i don't have enough $$$ to do so
Dec 13 21:34:37 <Damm> zinx, I do, but I have to buy xmas presents
Dec 13 21:34:40 <Damm> and I don't care enough
Dec 13 21:35:01 * Damm has enough to buy 4 DP1's right now.
Dec 13 21:35:11 <Damm> and that's pure spending
Dec 13 21:35:15 * RyeBrye mugs Damm
Dec 13 21:35:20 <JesusFreke> brocktice: the best place for that kind of info is the source itself
Dec 13 21:35:25 <Damm> but I gotta buy the womans kids xmas crap
Dec 13 21:35:28 <Damm> and she's not telling me what
Dec 13 21:35:41 <Damm> so i'm just gonna go on walmart.com and send em gift cards
Dec 13 21:35:49 <brocktice> JesusFreke, I guess, but it would be nice for people to be able to get their hands dirty without having to dig through everything manually the first time.
Dec 13 21:36:18 <Damm> zinx, personally i'm under the belief that a RC19 NBH will appear on the internet eventually
Dec 13 21:36:22 <Damm> and save us all
Dec 13 21:36:32 <zinx> Damm: we can hope
Dec 13 21:36:42 <JesusFreke> brocktice: there's a readme on the init system in the source
Dec 13 21:36:45 <zinx> the real problem is the upgrades all check to make sure you have an older version installed already
Dec 13 21:36:52 <RyeBrye> not an NBH file
Dec 13 21:36:53 <Damm> zinx, a NBH wouldn't matter
Dec 13 21:36:57 <zinx> yeah
Dec 13 21:36:58 <RyeBrye> NBH flashes through the sdcard in the HTC bootloader
Dec 13 21:37:06 <Damm> and actually the problem with OTA's are completely different
Dec 13 21:37:11 <Damm> they change keys on each release
Dec 13 21:37:27 <JesusFreke> Damm, no they don't
Dec 13 21:37:27 <zinx> oh, they do?
Dec 13 21:37:31 <brocktice> JesusFreke, ah yes, I'm seeing quite a lot of readmes now that you mention it
Dec 13 21:37:34 <brocktice> find . | grep  -i readme :)
Dec 13 21:37:36 <Damm> JesusFreke, thought they did.
Dec 13 21:37:41 <mikey|> anyone come across this error: wakelock finalized while being held: myActivityName ?
Dec 13 21:37:43 <Damm> hense why a full RC19 wouldn't work.
Dec 13 21:37:46 <JesusFreke> nope. all the ones so far are the same key
Dec 13 21:37:47 <RyeBrye> I thought they changed keys only every once in a while
Dec 13 21:37:54 <mikey|> PowerManager.java:295
Dec 13 21:38:06 <Damm> zinx, i stand corrected
Dec 13 21:38:11 <RyeBrye> they certainly have the capacity to change keys
Dec 13 21:38:23 <JesusFreke> Damm: no, it's because the update script checks the version, and doesn't allow you to downgrade
Dec 13 21:38:25 <zinx> Damm: no, full RC19 won't work because of the getprop("ro.build.fingerprint") checks
Dec 13 21:38:37 <JesusFreke> what zinx said :)
Dec 13 21:38:50 <zinx> Damm: it will not upgrade if you have a version not listed - which is only older versions and the same verison
Dec 13 21:39:42 <zinx> if someone had enough CPU power to alter that file to chmod su or something instead of doing the checks, which i kinda doubt, then that'd also work
Dec 13 21:40:04 <zinx> it would end up hitting garbage and abort, but it would give you a nice root shell first
Dec 13 21:40:24 <zinx> or if someone could make me a software microSD card :P
Dec 13 21:40:47 <DarkriftX> lol
Dec 13 21:42:02 <zinx> strategy with software SD card is make a zip file like the normal update, but pad the last file in the archive with ~100MB of stuff that decompresses to nothing, then return different results each time the update script is read :P
Dec 13 21:42:39 <RyeBrye> but that last file would break the signing check
Dec 13 21:42:51 <zinx> unfortunately i've not found any exploitable vulnerabilities in the stuff that runs as root that i have the source for
Dec 13 21:42:56 <zinx> RyeBrye: no it wouldn't
Dec 13 21:43:27 <zinx> RyeBrye: it verifies the signature, then gets the cache cleared by the 100MB of junk that decompresses to ZERO BYTES (thus not altering the sig), then reads the update script again without verifying the sig - and it's altered at this point
Dec 13 21:43:48 <zinx> deflate allows for this
Dec 13 21:43:54 <RyeBrye> ah
Dec 13 21:44:04 <zinx> but you need a software SD card to make this happen, because you can't change the file otherwise
Dec 13 21:44:10 <zinx> and i don't know of any such things existing
Dec 13 21:44:45 <RyeBrye> oh, right - yeah, I was thinking about that - like a fake SD card that you controlled via a microcontroller or something?
Dec 13 21:44:47 <Damm> fake sd card that plugs into a USB port
Dec 13 21:44:49 <zinx> i haven't tried unplugging the card during use, but from my experience with linux it would just return I/O error to dead device and create a whole new device node/etc when you plugged it back in
Dec 13 21:45:00 <zinx> RyeBrye: yes
Dec 13 21:45:25 <Damm> but the truth is, the best way to do it is a D1 Bootloader NBH on a SDCard with the right signatures
Dec 13 21:45:32 <Damm> or just a NBH with RC19
Dec 13 21:45:39 <RyeBrye> or RC28 or RC29 or whatever
Dec 13 21:46:06 <zinx> apps that do NOT have exploitable vulnerabilities (for this purpose, anyway): debuggerd, mountd, installd, possibly others i'm forgetting
Dec 13 21:46:40 <zinx> the code quality varies and there are some non-exploitable race conditions in installd, but it's all non-exploitable :(
Dec 13 21:46:44 <tmzt_> you need a EyeFi card and some wires
Dec 13 21:47:21 <zinx> that's interesting
Dec 13 21:47:23 <RyeBrye> can you modify those eyefi cards to act as software sd cards?
Dec 13 21:47:49 <RyeBrye> zinx: you have an RC30 phone you are trying to root, or are you just doing this for fun?
Dec 13 21:47:54 <tmzt_> look up EyeFi and linux, the firmware runs on the wireless chip and modifies the flash
Dec 13 21:47:59 <zinx> RyeBrye: RC30 preinstalled
Dec 13 21:48:04 <DarkriftX> ouch
Dec 13 21:48:05 <DarkriftX> that sucks
Dec 13 21:48:14 <Damm> so hohum
Dec 13 21:48:17 <Damm> anyone tried mtty yet?
Dec 13 21:48:20 <DarkriftX> first ive heard of a rc30 preinstalled
Dec 13 21:48:24 <Damm> on the boot console
Dec 13 21:48:28 <DarkriftX> i guess it was due anytime though
Dec 13 21:48:30 <zinx> tmzt_: know how much those things are off-hand?
Dec 13 21:48:30 * Damm lacks windows
Dec 13 21:48:43 <zinx> DarkriftX: it's happening with most or all of the black ones now afaik
Dec 13 21:48:48 <tmzt_> zinx: not more than is on the blogspot page
Dec 13 21:48:49 <DarkriftX> :(
Dec 13 21:48:53 <Damm> if you could get mtty working on a RC19, or D1...  you could dump the ROM to the sdcard
Dec 13 21:48:55 <zinx> and i'm not a fan of phones that look like toilet seats or turds :P
Dec 13 21:48:57 <Damm> and then try and turn it into a NBH
Dec 13 21:48:59 <DarkriftX> im sorry, i got mine 2 weeks ago and it ws rc19 or 28
Dec 13 21:49:06 <DarkriftX> LOL
Dec 13 21:49:30 <zinx> Damm: does NBH not require a signature?
Dec 13 21:49:44 <RyeBrye> NBH does require a signature
Dec 13 21:49:50 <RyeBrye> so you couldn't just dump it from a phone
Dec 13 21:49:53 <tmzt_> maybe you could also use the CS signal and switch between cards???
Dec 13 21:50:11 <Damm> RyeBrye, you dump the ROM
Dec 13 21:50:20 <RyeBrye> Damm: the ROM isn't signed
Dec 13 21:50:23 <Damm> but as far as the signature your right
Dec 13 21:50:26 <Damm> the rom isn't signed
Dec 13 21:50:34 <zinx> yeah, see, dumping it does zero good
Dec 13 21:50:41 <zinx> something signed is needed
Dec 13 21:50:42 <Damm> it's a step
Dec 13 21:50:48 <zinx> no it's not
Dec 13 21:50:49 <zinx> it's nothing.
Dec 13 21:51:05 <Damm> then go crank on your cpu for your SHA1 collision
Dec 13 21:51:09 <zinx> we could probably generate a NBH from the modified RC30 firmware images
Dec 13 21:51:16 <zinx> if it weren't for the signing
Dec 13 21:51:29 <zinx> Damm: not a mathematician, and don't have a massive cluster of computers :P
Dec 13 21:51:53 <zinx> i'm pretty sure SHA1 collision is still at least 2**58
Dec 13 21:52:08 <brocktice> I've got access to a massive cluster :)
Dec 13 21:52:20 <brocktice> 280 cpus.
Dec 13 21:52:40 <cmonex> hi zinx
Dec 13 21:52:42 <brocktice> and ddr infiniband
Dec 13 21:52:47 <cmonex> NBH must be signed with 2048 bit long RSA
Dec 13 21:52:51 <brocktice> anyone got some MPI code?
Dec 13 21:53:15 <zinx> cmonex: yeah, i thought so.. which is why i was wondering about Damm's suggestion
Dec 13 21:53:19 <cmonex> what was it?
Dec 13 21:53:23 <cmonex> i only joined now
Dec 13 21:53:30 <zinx> cmonex: dump the ROM and create a NBH from it.
Dec 13 21:53:32 <Damm> zinx, well you could always try and access the JTAG on the G1.
Dec 13 21:53:38 <cmonex> uhm
Dec 13 21:53:40 <brocktice> zinx, it was 2^63 operations as of August 2005
Dec 13 21:53:42 <cmonex> we would prefer sw solution
Dec 13 21:53:44 <zinx> Damm: if it has JTAG
Dec 13 21:53:47 <Damm> it does
Dec 13 21:53:59 <zinx> Damm: does it have the headers on the board?
Dec 13 21:54:13 <cmonex> no.
Dec 13 21:54:17 <cmonex> dream on.
Dec 13 21:54:20 <zinx> yeah.
Dec 13 21:54:21 <Damm> zinx, yep... to quote a googler (for whos name I forget) it's very hard to get to, and you'd break it damn near
Dec 13 21:54:23 <cmonex> pins may be there somewhere..
Dec 13 21:54:24 <Damm> just getting to it.
Dec 13 21:54:27 <zinx> not going to solder headers on to my phone :P
Dec 13 21:54:30 <cmonex> you can guess the pinout once you get to that
Dec 13 21:54:32 <Damm> but it's there.
Dec 13 21:54:40 <cmonex> well
Dec 13 21:54:46 <cmonex> we dont know if htc decided to lock jtag
Dec 13 21:54:53 <cmonex> there is a way to lock you out of it
Dec 13 21:55:04 <cmonex> perhaps they didn't do that
Dec 13 21:55:11 <Damm> cmonex, perhaps they did, perhaps they didn't.
Dec 13 21:55:14 <DarkriftX> thats not the problem
Dec 13 21:55:17 <Damm> until someone finds out, we will never know.
Dec 13 21:55:21 <DarkriftX> the problem is we need soemthing maintsream
Dec 13 21:55:27 <DarkriftX> something users can do without soldering
Dec 13 21:55:32 * zinx does not need something mainstream at the moment
Dec 13 21:55:39 <DarkriftX> jtagging is out of the question for 99% of users
Dec 13 21:55:40 <RyeBrye> do we even HAVE a pinout of the msm72k?
Dec 13 21:55:43 <Damm> we're talking to zinx... he's hardly mainstream
Dec 13 21:55:48 <zinx> but i do need something i can do without destroying my phone :)
Dec 13 21:55:59 <RyeBrye> meh. JTAG'ing would work - and if someone really wanted root they could ship to someone and have them do it for them
Dec 13 21:56:01 <Damm> zinx, have you checked out the service manual yet?
Dec 13 21:56:03 <zinx> and soldering headers on is not that
Dec 13 21:56:07 <cmonex> RyeBrye? no we dont
Dec 13 21:56:10 <cmonex> :p
Dec 13 21:56:17 <cmonex> and no
Dec 13 21:56:19 <cmonex> jtag is not an option
Dec 13 21:56:21 <RyeBrye> o
Dec 13 21:56:24 <cmonex> i prefer sw hacks :P
Dec 13 21:56:29 <RyeBrye> Yeah, I prefer sw hacks too
Dec 13 21:56:29 <cmonex> much cooler
Dec 13 21:56:51 <RyeBrye> but if we had a pinout, I'd be able to see where to run the lines for a TV-Out hack! ;)
Dec 13 21:56:56 <zinx> short of a magic firmware that will downgrade or another goof-up, i'm not seeing any software stuff left
Dec 13 21:56:57 <DarkriftX> lol
Dec 13 21:57:08 * DarkriftX looks at RyeBrye 
Dec 13 21:57:13 <DarkriftX> lol
Dec 13 21:57:16 <warren> There is a software hack, you just need to crack their signing key.
Dec 13 21:57:22 <warren> good luck
Dec 13 21:57:27 <RyeBrye> got 2 billion years?
Dec 13 21:57:29 <Damm> zinx, I have seen more effort to keep it pre RC30... then hacking RC30 (atleast to my eyes)
Dec 13 21:57:34 <zinx> warren: SHA1 collision would be easier than that.. and it's still way hard.
Dec 13 21:58:07 <zinx> Damm: eh?  there's modified RC30
Dec 13 21:58:07 <warren> how many of you have opened up the source code and looked for exploits?
Dec 13 21:58:11 <DarkriftX> i agree Damm, we need to find a way to get root on rc30 and not just downgrading
Dec 13 21:58:23 <DarkriftX> because downgrading will be fixed at some time
Dec 13 21:58:34 <warren> or look at CVE reports to find existing exploits that might apply
Dec 13 21:58:38 <zinx> warren: i have, and stated as much :P
Dec 13 21:59:04 <DarkriftX> i found something that was kinda odd, but no idea if it was a fluke or even expliotable
Dec 13 21:59:20 <DarkriftX> i moved my browser cache to a folder that was read/writeable only by root, yet the browser was able to read/write to it
Dec 13 21:59:36 <DarkriftX> so it seems browser can (or at least could for me) write as root
Dec 13 21:59:44 <zinx> DarkriftX: can't move the browser cache on RC30.
Dec 13 21:59:52 <DarkriftX> nobody was willing to rest it to see if it was a fluke or not
Dec 13 22:00:01 <DarkriftX> i know zinx but that doesnt change anything, that was just my test method
Dec 13 22:00:13 <zinx> the browser also isn't running as root on my phone
Dec 13 22:00:14 <DarkriftX> if browser can write as root, it can alter anything if you can figure out how to tell it to
Dec 13 22:00:19 <DarkriftX> netiehr was mine
Dec 13 22:00:23 <zinx> o-O
Dec 13 22:00:23 <DarkriftX> i ran it like normal
Dec 13 22:00:38 <DarkriftX> it should have failed to read/write to that folder but it didnt
Dec 13 22:01:56 <DarkriftX> i dont even know if that COULD be used to do anything, but id guess it could if you found the right method (im a n00b, i just know that wasnt normal)
Dec 13 22:02:23 <Damm> i won't disagree with you being a n00b... but atleast you have a G1 now.
Dec 13 22:02:56 <xsdg> DarkriftX: what do you bean "Browser can write as root"?
Dec 13 22:03:11 <DarkriftX> xsdg: i made a folder on sd card, read/write permissions only for root
Dec 13 22:03:11 <xsdg> mean*
Dec 13 22:03:17 <DarkriftX> standard user could not read/write that folder
Dec 13 22:03:24 <DarkriftX> but browser cache still read/wrote to it
Dec 13 22:03:25 <xsdg> DarkriftX: Download Manager is separate from Browser
Dec 13 22:03:27 <kirkz> hey all, anyone has interesting project that needs developers?
Dec 13 22:03:53 <DarkriftX> xsdg: like i said, i dont know what it means, i just know that the browser should not be able to read or write to a root read/writable only folder
Dec 13 22:03:57 <warren> hmm, I just noticed reviews saying the G1 battery life is not good
Dec 13 22:04:00 <DarkriftX> nothing else could
Dec 13 22:04:01 <RyeBrye> I want my sms-to-make-phone-turn-volume-all-the-way-up-and-make-lots-of-noise app
Dec 13 22:04:01 <xsdg> DarkriftX: Browser has code specifically preventing it from reading stuff on the SD card (though I'm not sure why, entirely)
Dec 13 22:04:09 <warren> "
Dec 13 22:04:09 <warren> Battery life is not one of the G1's strengths. Consider this: I charged the phone on a Friday. Left it completely alone all weekend, and by Monday, the battery was completely drained. Keep in mind, this is with the 3G radio on, but absolutely NO usage whatsoever"
Dec 13 22:04:16 <warren> Has anyone experienced this?
Dec 13 22:04:18 <xsdg> DarkriftX: also, note that there are no permissions on the sd card
Dec 13 22:04:22 <xsdg> DarkriftX: it's FAT
Dec 13 22:04:32 <RyeBrye> warren: Yeah.. I'm surprised it lasted that long
Dec 13 22:04:33 <DarkriftX> mine was ext2
Dec 13 22:04:42 <tmzt_> RyeBrye: tv out would be in s1d chip and needs an external encoder, based on information from Touch Pro (raph)
Dec 13 22:04:50 <DarkriftX> but maybe when i changed
Dec 13 22:04:51 <RyeBrye> tmzt_: ah, ok
Dec 13 22:04:54 <DarkriftX> that might be it
Dec 13 22:04:56 <warren> RyeBrye: that's not encouraging at all
Dec 13 22:05:01 <warren> I can go 2-3 weeks on my Treo
Dec 13 22:05:03 <zinx> DarkriftX: mountd mounts it as vfat
Dec 13 22:05:11 <warren> nearly a month if I turn off the radio
Dec 13 22:05:19 <RyeBrye> tmzt_: all I have is just that gigantic block diagram of the MSM7200
Dec 13 22:05:27 <zinx> DarkriftX: so it doesn't matter what filesystem you're using, it won't mount anything but vfat on stock firmware
Dec 13 22:05:30 <RyeBrye> tmzt_: any idea about USB Host (or USB To Go) on the G1?
Dec 13 22:05:36 <DarkriftX> zinx: i dont have stock
Dec 13 22:05:37 <tmzt_> RyeBrye: actually, that's apparently the lcd controller too
Dec 13 22:05:42 <DarkriftX> and i had other fs modules loaded
Dec 13 22:05:48 <Damm> warren, i go 3days without charging
Dec 13 22:05:50 <xsdg> warren: was it on an account that was still receiving mail?
Dec 13 22:05:50 <zinx> DarkriftX: but the people wanting it rooted do ;)
Dec 13 22:06:00 <warren> xsdg: no
Dec 13 22:06:04 <DarkriftX> yes, but my browser is the same
Dec 13 22:06:05 <tmzt_> RyeBrye: the kernel (clock.h??) refers to it as Full-speed OTG
Dec 13 22:06:17 <warren> Damm: what kind of usage pattern?
Dec 13 22:06:28 <Damm> warren, just push notices, occasional texts
Dec 13 22:06:29 <Damm> no voice
Dec 13 22:06:33 <tmzt_> RyeBrye: that first one was found by cr2 in #htc-linux last night
Dec 13 22:06:38 <Damm> (gmail and text)
Dec 13 22:06:53 <JesusFreke> sanmehat, you around?
Dec 13 22:06:56 <warren> Damm: can you use non-gmail accounts?
Dec 13 22:07:10 <Damm> warren, you have to have a gmail account to use a G1
Dec 13 22:07:24 <warren> doh!  No ordinary IMAP/
Dec 13 22:07:25 <warren> ?
Dec 13 22:07:27 <RyeBrye> tmzt_: yeah, I think it will need a hybrid data + power cable - any idea what the steps are now to try to get USB host in a driver tested?
Dec 13 22:07:28 <Damm> I personally use a hosted google mail (work domain)
Dec 13 22:07:30 <zinx> there's an IMAP client
Dec 13 22:07:34 <tmzt_> zinx: do you know what user it's mounted as?
Dec 13 22:07:34 <Damm> there's a seperate email client on it
Dec 13 22:07:34 <zinx> IMAP/POP3
Dec 13 22:07:35 <Damm> it sucks
Dec 13 22:07:42 <warren> sigh
Dec 13 22:07:43 <Damm> however you still have to have Gmail
Dec 13 22:08:03 <Damm> several people have went to great lenghts to fix the Email application on the G1
Dec 13 22:08:04 <zinx> tmzt_: mounted via the root user, lemme check uid/gid, but probably system/system
Dec 13 22:08:07 <Damm> such as K-9mail
Dec 13 22:08:09 <tmzt_> RyeBrye: figure out this ULPI phy, that's what rolk is working on now for client mode
Dec 13 22:08:13 <Damm> and jasta has his version also
Dec 13 22:08:42 <tmzt_> zinx: system is 1000?
Dec 13 22:08:46 <mikey|> i keep getting this error which i can reproduce but dont understand why it's thrown
Dec 13 22:08:54 <warren> Damm: I guess this means I need to wait more to see how good the options are.  I want a G1 but with my own IMAP server.
Dec 13 22:09:01 <zinx> tmzt_: yes, AID_SYSTEM is 1000, and that is indeed what it's mounted as
Dec 13 22:09:02 <mikey|> connect to server->rotate app->join channel->wake lock error
Dec 13 22:09:23 <xsdg> mikey|: what do you mean by "wake lock error"?
Dec 13 22:09:27 <RyeBrye> warren: for a second there I thought you meant you wanted to run an IMAP server ON your phone
Dec 13 22:09:42 <warren> RyeBrye: =)
Dec 13 22:09:50 <mikey|> this is the android line that throws it: http://min.ie/x7
Dec 13 22:10:00 <zinx> flags |= MS_NODEV | MS_NOEXEC | MS_NOSUID | MS_DIRSYNC; result = mount(device, mountPoint, "vfat", flags, "utf8,uid=1000,gid=1000,fmask=711,dmask=700");
Dec 13 22:10:04 <zinx> then it tries with readonly :/
Dec 13 22:10:11 <mikey|> xsdg: it crashes my app with that error, but i dont get why
Dec 13 22:11:02 <xsdg> mikey|: oh, do you have a wake lock?
Dec 13 22:11:12 <xsdg> mikey|: your activity is recreated when you switch orientations
Dec 13 22:11:43 <mikey|> so i should release it?
Dec 13 22:11:50 <xsdg> mikey|: if so, you probably need to clean it up in onPause and then re-grab it in onResume (this is a guess)
Dec 13 22:12:33 <mikey|> but it only seems to happen when i do the same exact steps, try to create a new view after restoring my old stuff
Dec 13 22:12:47 <mikey|> shouldnt it crash when i try to restore state?
Dec 13 22:13:15 <brocktice> hahaha
Dec 13 22:13:18 <brocktice> adb lolcat works
Dec 13 22:13:22 <mikey|> i'll try your idea anyway
Dec 13 22:13:36 <brocktice> interesting info here: http://ioerror.livejournal.com/495454.html
Dec 13 22:13:40 <brocktice> maybe not new to you guys
Dec 13 22:13:42 <xsdg> mikey|: creating the view might cause the VM to GC the old activity
Dec 13 22:14:46 <xsdg> brocktice: haha :o)
Dec 13 22:15:11 <DarkriftX> so zinx are you working on a sw hack to get root on rc30 or just hw stuff
Dec 13 22:15:36 <brocktice> hehe
Dec 13 22:15:39 <zinx> DarkriftX: i would prefer SW, i don't really have the stuff to do a HW one unless it's really simple
Dec 13 22:15:44 <brocktice> just turned on the keyboard backlight manually
Dec 13 22:15:48 <brocktice> good stuff
Dec 13 22:16:02 <DarkriftX> ok, categorizing your work basically lol
Dec 13 22:16:07 <zinx> DarkriftX: but i try not to limit myself in thinking of possible ways to do it.
Dec 13 22:17:09 <mikey|> xsdg: still same old, i released the lock onPause and got it again on onResume, but crashed
Dec 13 22:17:25 <DarkriftX> well basically there are ppl who want to hack thier own device and ppl who want to hack rc30 in general. the first mostly work solo, the second would benefit more from groups
Dec 13 22:17:41 <DarkriftX> i think everyone working on the second category need to start grouping up
Dec 13 22:17:56 <brocktice> so apparently on the Dream blue+red+white leds = purple?
Dec 13 22:18:01 <brocktice> err + green
Dec 13 22:18:02 <brocktice> not white
Dec 13 22:18:11 <DarkriftX> i think i described that completely wrong, but im sure you get the point
Dec 13 22:18:47 <zinx> DarkriftX: more of a community sort of guy, but people rarely join me
Dec 13 22:18:56 <DarkriftX> heh, we need to fix that
Dec 13 22:19:10 <xsdg> brocktice: it's orange when charging, so you probably get a good deal of "all colors" depending on how many levels you can get per led
Dec 13 22:19:26 <brocktice> xsdg, yeah I got orange from red+green
Dec 13 22:19:34 <brocktice> 255 levels per LED
Dec 13 22:19:42 <brocktice> well, at least in the "brightness" file
Dec 13 22:19:50 <brocktice> Not sure how much you can actually modulate that.
Dec 13 22:19:51 <xsdg> brocktice: then isn't it just 8-bit RGB?
Dec 13 22:20:01 <brocktice> yeah but #FFFFFF = purple
Dec 13 22:20:04 <brocktice> It's not perfect.
Dec 13 22:20:44 <zinx> 8-bit with different gamma / contrast / brightness most likely
Dec 13 22:21:28 <zinx> would be useful to find all the levels where it's basically gray
Dec 13 22:21:48 <zinx> could easily turn that in to a formula for typical R/G/B
Dec 13 22:22:00 <zinx> or at least 3-4 of them
Dec 13 22:22:10 <brocktice> can do fun stuff like this
Dec 13 22:22:24 <brocktice> for i in `seq 0 255` `seq 254 -1 0`; do echo $i > brightness; done
Dec 13 22:22:30 <brocktice> Ramps the brightness up and down.
Dec 13 22:22:52 <brocktice> pulses
Dec 13 22:22:56 <brocktice> Could mimic the apple sleep light
Dec 13 22:23:32 <xsdg> brocktice: can you find any combination that looks gray? (basically, first step for what zinx said)
Dec 13 22:23:46 <zinx> alas, those files are only writable by root
Dec 13 22:23:53 <brocktice> xsdg, I'm going to have it run through each combination and see how it looks.
Dec 13 22:24:02 <brocktice> doing it manually would be a bear, I'm writing the bash script now
Dec 13 22:24:55 <waldo_> JesusFreke: is your 1.3 image out yet?
Dec 13 22:25:55 <xsdg> brocktice: not really
Dec 13 22:26:18 <JesusFreke> waldo: no
Dec 13 22:26:18 <xsdg> brocktice: just pick 128/128/128 and then depending on the color, you should see what you need to change
Dec 13 22:26:26 <brocktice> ok
Dec 13 22:26:29 <xsdg> brocktice: like, for purple, you've got too much red/blue and not enough green
Dec 13 22:27:37 <zinx> aye
Dec 13 22:27:49 <zinx> need 4 points for that optimally
Dec 13 22:28:05 <zinx> the highest numbers you can set it to @ black and still be black
Dec 13 22:28:12 <zinx> two in the middle spaced appropriately
Dec 13 22:28:19 <zinx> and the brightest white you can get
Dec 13 22:28:38 <zinx> can be done with 3 but 4 will probably be a little better
Dec 13 22:33:01 <mikey|> is there any way to store an Object in the bundle
Dec 13 22:34:17 <brocktice> 4 is the minimum for all of them
Dec 13 22:36:14 <eldenz> mikey|, it has to be Parcelable iirc
Dec 13 22:36:42 <tmzt_> Serializable?
Dec 13 22:36:44 <eldenz> so: no
Dec 13 22:36:47 <mikey|> k
Dec 13 22:36:56 * mikey| is a bit worried
Dec 13 22:37:07 <mikey|> my g1 screen seems much looser then when i got it
Dec 13 22:37:09 <brocktice> so, white at about rgb = 4 200 30
Dec 13 22:37:28 <xsdg> haha
Dec 13 22:37:34 <eldenz> tmzt_, kinda serializable but i've read something along the lines it's heavily bytestream optimized (whatever that means) and not really for compatibility
Dec 13 22:37:36 <brocktice> depends on the angle you look at it though
Dec 13 22:37:40 <brocktice> probably due to LED placement
Dec 13 22:37:42 <xsdg> brocktice: ::nod::
Dec 13 22:37:56 <eldenz> http://code.google.com/android/reference/android/os/Parcelable.html
Dec 13 22:38:12 <tmzt_> eldenz: something else different from j2se then
Dec 13 22:38:17 <xsdg> brocktice: sounds like the red and blue are a lot more efficient (whether it's placement, or running them at higher current, though, who knows?)
Dec 13 22:38:21 <brocktice> 4 200 100 = BMW headlights
Dec 13 22:38:25 <eldenz> tmzt_, there in the highlighted zone http://code.google.com/android/reference/android/os/Parcel.html
Dec 13 22:38:39 <zinx> oh holy crap
Dec 13 22:38:45 <brocktice> ?
Dec 13 22:38:48 <xsdg> zinx: yeah
Dec 13 22:38:54 <zinx> http://cache.saurik.com/android/updates/signed-kila-srk-116143.1.zip
Dec 13 22:39:01 <zinx> does that use the right keys?
Dec 13 22:39:07 <tmzt_> test keys probably
Dec 13 22:39:31 <zinx> yeah looks like it
Dec 13 22:39:39 <brocktice> 4 200 0 is a really good solid yellow, that was my first step
Dec 13 22:39:42 <unix_infidel> anyone know of a way to toggle 3G directly without launching the mobile network settings activity?
Dec 13 22:39:52 <brocktice> unix_infidel, apparently not
Dec 13 22:39:56 <brocktice> since no utility does it yet
Dec 13 22:40:04 <brocktice> they all just skirt around 3G
Dec 13 22:40:16 <tmzt_> you have source for mobile network settings?
Dec 13 22:40:44 <zinx> why the heck they naming it signed-kila :P
Dec 13 22:40:58 <tmzt_> it's signed but with test keys
Dec 13 22:41:11 <tmzt_> you can probably check with jartool/signtool
Dec 13 22:41:15 <eldenz> zinx, what is it?
Dec 13 22:41:27 <zinx> i always assumed kila was the one doing the signing
Dec 13 22:42:01 <zinx> eldenz: looks like some altered something
Dec 13 22:42:23 <zinx> eldenz: from the Debian on G1 project
Dec 13 22:42:56 <tmzt_> eldenz: what are you trying to store? this says it's for IPC through the kernel binder mechanism
Dec 13 22:43:00 <eldenz> hmm, i was wondering when selfbuilds are popping up...
Dec 13 22:43:07 <tmzt_> eldenz: more marshalling then serializing
Dec 13 22:43:27 <eldenz> tmzt_, not me :) someone asked whether you can put an Object into a Bundle
Dec 13 22:43:53 <eldenz> which you can't... you can only put Parcelable things in it (iirc)
Dec 13 22:45:52 <tmzt_> eldenz: so the Object would have to implement Parcleable ?
Dec 13 22:46:00 <eldenz> yes
Dec 13 22:49:18 <cmonex> hmm.
Dec 13 22:49:20 <cmonex> reading back
Dec 13 22:50:19 <unix_infidel> heh, weird, looks like the 3G draws more power than the USB power can provide.  it's winding down at 98%.
Dec 13 22:50:27 <shad0w1e> hey guys -- while booting my G1 it turns to a picture of a phone next to a triangle exclamation point. am i fucked?
Dec 13 22:51:28 <xsdg> unix_infidel: I'm fairly confident that that's not the case
Dec 13 22:51:46 <zinx> unix_infidel: it won't always fully charge
Dec 13 22:51:51 <xsdg> unix_infidel: what may be an issue is how it measures 100%, or how accurate the battery measurement is, etc
Dec 13 22:52:25 <zinx> unix_infidel: overcharging lithium-ion is very bad
Dec 13 22:52:47 <xsdg> shad0w1e: that's the rescue partition.  Were you holding the Home key when you started the phone?
Dec 13 22:53:00 <xsdg> shad0w1e: Alt+L to see instructions
Dec 13 22:53:01 <unix_infidel> zinx: well i'm hoping that the G1 takes care of the trickle...though I'm not sure of that.
Dec 13 22:53:06 <shad0w1e> i was not. this occurred during an automatic update. ..
Dec 13 22:53:20 <xsdg> shad0w1e: oh, that's normal then
Dec 13 22:53:23 <Damm> then your update failed
Dec 13 22:53:27 <Damm> if it's stuck there
Dec 13 22:53:31 <shad0w1e> cant open /cache/recovery/cp,,amd
Dec 13 22:53:35 <Damm> if it moves past it and goes to the RAM chip, your good
Dec 13 22:53:38 <Damm> that's normal
Dec 13 22:53:47 <shad0w1e> its been here for .. 10 min?
Dec 13 22:53:56 <Damm> hit alt + l
Dec 13 22:53:59 <Damm> what options do you see
Dec 13 22:54:06 <shad0w1e> L S M
Dec 13 22:54:16 <shad0w1e> s = apply update
Dec 13 22:54:18 <shad0w1e> should i do that?
Dec 13 22:54:27 <tmzt_> not rc30
Dec 13 22:54:28 <Damm> only if you have update.zip on your sdcard
Dec 13 22:54:36 <shad0w1e> this was completely automatic...
Dec 13 22:54:39 <Damm> i presume you are trying to update to rc30
Dec 13 22:54:43 <Damm> or it is
Dec 13 22:55:00 <Damm> best suggestion is to grab a RC28/RC29 update.zip, shove it on your sdcard
Dec 13 22:55:00 <shad0w1e> i didnt put an update there unless it dloaded automatically
Dec 13 22:55:03 <Damm> and hit alt + s
Dec 13 22:55:08 <shad0w1e> ah
Dec 13 22:55:15 <Damm> then grab JF's RC30 v1.2
Dec 13 22:55:19 <Damm> and keep root
Dec 13 22:55:21 <shad0w1e> so its not gonna be there if i didnt put it there?
Dec 13 22:55:31 <Damm> right, it's not gonna be there
Dec 13 22:56:08 <Damm> if you can read your MicroSD card, shove it in your computer
Dec 13 22:56:10 <Damm> and put update.zip there
Dec 13 22:56:16 <shad0w1e> great where do i get this update
Dec 13 22:56:21 <Damm> http://android-dls.com/wiki/index.php?title=OTA_Updates
Dec 13 22:56:35 <Damm> or https://android.clients.google.com/updates/signed-kila-ota-115247-prereq.TC4-RC19+RC28.zip
Dec 13 22:56:35 <shad0w1e> shwing! thanks!
Dec 13 22:57:11 <Damm> then tell it not to update next time, or install jf's... and you won't have to worry
Dec 13 22:57:28 <shad0w1e> id rather go official.. no?
Dec 13 22:57:35 <Damm> do you want root?
Dec 13 22:57:45 <shad0w1e> i had root before on official..
Dec 13 22:57:53 <Damm> right, RC30 won't have root
Dec 13 22:57:56 <shad0w1e> ahh!
Dec 13 22:58:01 <shad0w1e> k then i want haxored RC30!
Dec 13 22:58:10 <Disconnect> xsdg: i can verify that i was losing power while playing music (full vol) with 50% backlight, intermittent gps and web browsing. it claimed charging but i went from 50% to 30% during a 60-75 minute car ride
Dec 13 22:58:10 <Damm> then you want jf's version of RC30 with root
Dec 13 22:58:13 <shad0w1e> and i want bash while im at it!!
Dec 13 22:58:14 <Disconnect> steady web browsing that is
Dec 13 22:58:45 <brocktice> does anyone else's devphone "menu" button feel like it doesn't have enough travel?
Dec 13 22:58:50 <shad0w1e> so where do i get RC30, JF edition?
Dec 13 22:58:51 <Damm> then you'll want to read this url ... http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=443713
Dec 13 22:58:52 <brocktice> my G1's menu button felt a lot better
Dec 13 23:00:12 <tmzt_> shad0w1e: you want saurik debian then
Dec 13 23:00:37 <tmzt_> shad0w1e: the others only have ash/busybox
Dec 13 23:00:51 <shad0w1e> ahh but debian is a side-by-side OS
Dec 13 23:00:57 <shad0w1e> so elts say for now i dont want that..
Dec 13 23:01:17 <tmzt_> runs in chroot in pterm
Dec 13 23:01:26 <shad0w1e> interesting. lets hold off on that
Dec 13 23:01:31 <shad0w1e> but this is something ill prolly wanna look into.
Dec 13 23:01:33 <tmzt_> I would like to have a recovery parition that mounts the sd card as e2 root for debian
Dec 13 23:01:35 <shad0w1e> for now i need a working phone!
Dec 13 23:01:43 <tmzt_> right
Dec 13 23:01:58 <shad0w1e> so where do i get the JF's RC30 v1.2 ?
Dec 13 23:02:34 <Disconnect> perhaps oyu should check some of the urls you've been told to read
Dec 13 23:02:47 <shad0w1e> i was there, didnt see any reference to JF
Dec 13 23:03:06 <tmzt_> "JesusFreke"
Dec 13 23:05:15 <Damm> shad0w1e, http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=443713
Dec 13 23:05:18 <Damm> i gave you the url
Dec 13 23:06:11 * Disconnect is occasionally tempted to walk some of these people through a careful detailed manual tmob rc30 :)
Dec 13 23:06:52 <brocktice> Disconnect, JesusFreke mentioned something earlier about building native binaries in the core directory of the source tree.
Dec 13 23:07:09 <brocktice> However, I'm not having much luck. Is there something I can just source that will set up all of the includes?
Dec 13 23:07:17 <JesusFreke> tmzt_, yes?
Dec 13 23:07:22 <Disconnect> yah hang on i think i wrote something like that up (at least a quick sketch)
Dec 13 23:07:47 <tmzt_> JesusFreke: sorry, was explaining JF, thought the quotes wouldn't trigger your client
Dec 13 23:07:54 <JesusFreke> oh :)
Dec 13 23:07:57 <JesusFreke> np. hehe
Dec 13 23:08:00 <brocktice> When hello world can't find stdio.h you know you have a problem. :)
Dec 13 23:08:55 <Disconnect> lol
Dec 13 23:09:08 <Disconnect> i don't have a writeup but there is an ok one in teh goog.
Dec 13 23:09:09 <tmzt_> you've disabled updates though, or only made it so they need to be signed with test key?
Dec 13 23:09:22 <Disconnect> i'm about to change locations so i'll dig it out when i get there..
Dec 13 23:09:24 <JesusFreke> yes
Dec 13 23:09:26 <brocktice> kthx
Dec 13 23:09:36 <JesusFreke> they have to be signed with the test key
Dec 13 23:09:43 <JesusFreke> and OTA updates will never be applied
Dec 13 23:09:56 <tmzt_> ok
Dec 13 23:10:48 <SystemWizard> any suggestions on a video player for the G1?
Dec 13 23:10:52 <brocktice> cinema
Dec 13 23:10:58 <brocktice> nice gesture support and saves your spot
Dec 13 23:11:29 <SystemWizard> is it on the market?
Dec 13 23:11:29 <bparker06> anyone using the dev phone on AT&T?
Dec 13 23:11:35 <brocktice> SystemWizard, yes
Dec 13 23:11:47 <brocktice> icon is a very dark movie camera with two yellow Cs
Dec 13 23:11:50 <tmzt_> swetland was
Dec 13 23:12:23 <shad0w1e> Damm, thank you!
Dec 13 23:13:44 <SystemWizard> hrm... will it take a while to load from an SD card?  I just tapped on a .MP4 video I created with handbrake and so far a whole lotta nothing.. :|
Dec 13 23:14:07 <offby1> yikes!  Calling 411 costs $1.79.
Dec 13 23:14:21 <zinx> i wouldn't expect AVC to play on a G1
Dec 13 23:14:30 <tmzt_> call GOOG411
Dec 13 23:14:34 <zinx> it's a pretty crazy cpu-hungry codec
Dec 13 23:14:51 <SystemWizard> ah.. ok.
Dec 13 23:15:02 <SystemWizard> suggestions for an alternate codec?  I'm happy to recode.. ;)
Dec 13 23:15:23 <SystemWizard> and yea it's playing the audio and ignoring the video
Dec 13 23:15:34 <brocktice> SystemWizard, use ffmpeg not xv264 in handbrake
Dec 13 23:15:43 <SystemWizard> ok.
Dec 13 23:15:46 <SystemWizard> I'll go try that.
Dec 13 23:15:47 <SystemWizard> thank you.
Dec 13 23:15:50 <brocktice> no larger than 320xwhatever if you want it to have decent performance
Dec 13 23:15:56 <SystemWizard> ok
Dec 13 23:16:06 <brocktice> around 384 kbps mean rate
Dec 13 23:16:31 <tmzt_> does that one use the dsp codec?
Dec 13 23:19:07 <brocktice> tmzt_, don't know?
Dec 13 23:19:12 <brocktice> I think so
Dec 13 23:19:22 <brocktice> Maybe not, and that's why the performance isn't great
Dec 13 23:19:34 <brocktice> But when I use x264 it's just a green screen
Dec 13 23:20:01 <Adamant> any chance of a OMAP Android phone anytime soon?
Dec 13 23:20:15 <Adamant> I'd like to see a really powerful one
Dec 13 23:20:42 <zinx> h.264 is NOT going to play on a G1.
Dec 13 23:21:04 <brocktice> I thought that's what the hardware decoder is supposed to handle?
Dec 13 23:21:05 <SystemWizard> bparker06 asked a good question.. HAS anyone tried the G1 on AT&T?  I'd think edge would work but not 3G..
Dec 13 23:21:10 <zinx> need a 2GHz processor or so for that, with a good decoder :/
Dec 13 23:21:14 <zinx> more without :P
Dec 13 23:21:21 <tmzt_> Adamant: there is some support for excalibur (omap850), which should work on wizard
Dec 13 23:21:32 <tmzt_> Adamant: but not phone or anything working yet
Dec 13 23:21:33 <Adamant> don't iThings play h.264?
Dec 13 23:21:40 <summatusmentis> yes
Dec 13 23:21:46 <shad0w1e> hey guys, when trying to use the update_TC4-RC30_full_xda-dev_v1.2 , I get a 'no signature' error
Dec 13 23:22:05 <zinx> Adamant: if they do, they have a hardward decoder for it
Dec 13 23:22:09 <zinx> hardware
Dec 13 23:22:38 <tmzt_> msm has a dsp, the question is if the right codecs are in there
Dec 13 23:22:43 <zinx> shad0w1e: you need a modified recovery image
Dec 13 23:22:57 <shad0w1e> ahh
Dec 13 23:23:18 <shad0w1e> so it sounds like first i need to put on an official image, get my phone booting, and then mod the recovery image, right?
Dec 13 23:23:27 <zinx> read the instructions on the site :x
Dec 13 23:23:35 <shad0w1e> good idea! thanks
Dec 13 23:23:35 <zinx> but yeah, official image < RC30
Dec 13 23:25:25 <shad0w1e> gotcha thanks
Dec 13 23:25:33 <shad0w1e> im wondering what i can do with root anyway...
Dec 13 23:25:44 <zinx> plenty of fun things
Dec 13 23:25:49 <shad0w1e> ssh server might be nice
Dec 13 23:26:17 <nyt> http://androidirc.googlecode.com/files/irc-beta-2008121300.apk
Dec 13 23:26:19 <d0netsFN> tue dat, when are we going to have an ssh server?
Dec 13 23:26:22 <shad0w1e> thing is im not keeping the phone for long (most likely) if i sell it to someone modded, it shouldnt make things any WORSE for them should it
Dec 13 23:26:25 <nyt> ^ now has thread synchronization, no more random crashes
Dec 13 23:26:35 <d0netsFN> ok good nyt
Dec 13 23:26:39 <d0netsFN> it crashed the first 3 times for me
Dec 13 23:26:42 <zinx> fixed /quit? :D
Dec 13 23:26:43 <d0netsFN> when i used my bnc
Dec 13 23:27:01 <nyt> there is no /quit yet
Dec 13 23:27:05 <nyt> it just sends a quit to the server
Dec 13 23:27:12 <zinx> ah, k
Dec 13 23:27:13 <nyt> so you get disconnected and end up reconnecting
Dec 13 23:27:19 <nyt> if you want to disconnect, hit menu
Dec 13 23:27:20 <nyt> =]
Dec 13 23:27:24 <zinx> and need to do the :
Dec 13 23:27:34 <nyt> donpdonp: if youre getting crashes with a bnc still, send me the logcat output of the crash
Dec 13 23:27:36 <nyt> err
Dec 13 23:27:38 <nyt> d0netsFN: if youre getting crashes with a bnc still, send me the logcat output of the crash
Dec 13 23:27:39 <d0netsFN> nyt make it vibrate when someone says your nick
Dec 13 23:27:48 <d0netsFN> i havent tried this release
Dec 13 23:27:51 <d0netsFN> it was the 12/12 release
Dec 13 23:27:53 <nyt> d0netsFN: its in my things to do
Dec 13 23:27:54 <jham> zinx: The G1 has support for H.264 up to 480x352
Dec 13 23:28:00 <d0netsFN> and it was only the first 3 times i ran it
Dec 13 23:28:03 <d0netsFN> it works fine now
Dec 13 23:28:04 <jham> zinx: Using the MSM DSP
Dec 13 23:28:08 <nyt> yeah it was a random thing
Dec 13 23:28:13 <nyt> it had to do with memory allocation
Dec 13 23:28:20 <d0netsFN> seemed like it
Dec 13 23:28:22 <nyt> so once it had enough to connect without reallocing crap it waws fine
Dec 13 23:28:26 <d0netsFN> cause it was when it loaded chans
Dec 13 23:28:28 <nyt> but now that wont be an issue
Dec 13 23:28:36 <d0netsFN> k cool
Dec 13 23:29:14 <zinx> jham: ah, nice
Dec 13 23:29:27 <nyt> i had to get those fixes done
Dec 13 23:29:30 <nyt> now i can start on more features
Dec 13 23:29:32 <nyt> wee
Dec 13 23:30:01 <tmzt_> jham: any idea how to/if the video players use that?
Dec 13 23:30:54 <jham> tmzt_: I know mine does, if you use the standard built in playback activity it just works
Dec 13 23:31:31 <jham> tmzt_: Not sure if the other players use the built in video playback support or have done their own thing
Dec 13 23:32:56 <tmzt_> jham: which one is yours?
Dec 13 23:33:09 <shad0w1e> ok thanks everyone -- got my phone working again!
Dec 13 23:33:18 <jham> tmzt_: "Video Player"
Dec 13 23:33:37 <tmzt_> ok
Dec 13 23:35:24 <brocktice> All of these howtos use "scratchbox" for compiling arm binaries
Dec 13 23:35:39 <brocktice> That seems totally wrong to me, given that I've already got a complete toolchain here.
Dec 13 23:36:43 <heatX> hey nyt, that apk didnt work
Dec 13 23:36:58 <heatX> said 'install unsucessful'
Dec 13 23:37:03 <tmzt_> brocktice: you are using the android build system?
Dec 13 23:37:14 <brocktice> tmzt_ yes
Dec 13 23:37:48 <brocktice> tmzt_, I'm trying to figure out how to get all of the proper includes.
Dec 13 23:38:22 <brocktice> supposedly the answer is in "teh goog" somewhere but no luck so far.
Dec 13 23:38:37 <JesusFreke> brocktice, gimme a min
Dec 13 23:38:44 <brocktice> k
Dec 13 23:39:03 <JesusFreke> lemme put together a quick hello world that you can dump into the android source somewhere
Dec 13 23:40:06 <brocktice> Well, seems silly. I ought to be able to figure it out (and I'm trying) but so far i'm made of fail.
Dec 13 23:40:44 <JesusFreke> take a look at system/core/logwrapper
Dec 13 23:40:45 <brocktice> my make-fu is not strong enough
Dec 13 23:40:46 <brocktice> ok
Dec 13 23:40:47 <JesusFreke> it's a super simple one
Dec 13 23:40:55 <SystemWizard> any reason why the SD card on my G1 won't mount when I plug the USB cable into my PC?
Dec 13 23:41:09 <brocktice> JesusFreke, oh yes, indeed.
Dec 13 23:41:55 <SystemWizard> I know this *was* working.. :|
Dec 13 23:41:57 <JesusFreke> you can just make a copy of that, and change the android.mk a bit.. change LOCAL_SRC_FILES and LOCAL_MODULE
Dec 13 23:42:20 <eldenz> SystemWizard, you clicked on the mount button (statusbar)? :f
Dec 13 23:42:23 <JesusFreke> I *think* that should work, iirc
Dec 13 23:43:12 <SystemWizard> eldenz: I didn't see a mount button the status bar.. I'm cycling the power I'll try again..
Dec 13 23:44:10 <eldenz> SystemWizard, there is a notification in the statusbar... you can pull down, click it and it asks whether you want to mount it
Dec 13 23:44:21 <eldenz> wasn't in my rc19 but rc30
Dec 13 23:44:41 <SystemWizard> DOH.. thankd eldenz
Dec 13 23:45:35 <eldenz> you're welcome
Dec 13 23:47:19 <brocktice> oh
Dec 13 23:47:22 <Captain_Dingo> anyone else hate FedEx right now?
Dec 13 23:47:29 <brocktice> envsetup.sh
Dec 13 23:47:34 * brocktice headdesks
Dec 13 23:48:20 <Captain_Dingo> stupid fedex left a door tag while I was home... it was my dev phone :(
Dec 13 23:48:36 * CompBrain claps
Dec 13 23:48:54 <brocktice> Captain_Dingo, I think they do that when they're short on time.
Dec 13 23:49:02 <brocktice> annoying
Dec 13 23:49:14 <Captain_Dingo> that's really nice considering it's a signature required package
Dec 13 23:49:30 <SystemWizard> brocktice: thanks for the tip on FFMpeg - that worked
Dec 13 23:49:35 <brocktice> yw
Dec 13 23:49:42 <Captain_Dingo> and this place apparently doesn't deliver on Monday, so I have to either A) stay home on Tuesday to get it, or B) drive to their DC on wednesday
Dec 13 23:50:00 <SystemWizard> the guy who made cinema needs to make a better icon tho.. ;;)
Dec 13 23:50:07 <brocktice> yeop
Dec 13 23:52:38 <SystemWizard> brocktice: 320x... what's the highest you can use there?  I'm using 176 right now..
Dec 13 23:52:52 <SystemWizard> or is that source-dependent?
Dec 13 23:52:59 <brocktice> 480 but it's very choppy
Dec 13 23:53:03 <brocktice> oh
Dec 13 23:53:29 <brocktice> wait yeah depends on aspect ratio. 320 i guess
Dec 13 23:53:39 <SystemWizard> ok thanks
Dec 13 23:54:19 <brocktice> yw
Dec 13 23:56:21 <brocktice> woohoo, hello world working
Dec 13 23:56:39 <SystemWizard> lol
Dec 13 23:56:47 <SystemWizard> yea that was the biggest challenge for me, too
Dec 13 23:57:06 <brocktice> it's a native hello world
Dec 13 23:57:07 <brocktice> c
Dec 13 23:57:11 <SystemWizard> oh NICE
Dec 13 23:57:24 <SystemWizard> via 'jailbreak'?
Dec 13 23:57:29 <brocktice> devphone :)
Dec 13 23:57:34 <eldenz> brocktice, now go and write a tutorial ;)
Dec 13 23:57:35 <SystemWizard> oh very cool
Dec 13 23:57:49 <brocktice> eldenz, I am about to.
Dec 13 23:57:53 <eldenz>  \�/
Dec 13 23:57:54 <brocktice> Only thing is it's very simplistic.
Dec 13 23:58:03 <brocktice> Eventually I'd like to get perl compiled on here and some such
Dec 13 23:58:12 <brocktice> Unfortunately I think that will require scratchbox
Dec 13 23:59:03 <brocktice> Is there a preferred wiki or should I just do it on my own site and let teh goog find it?
Dec 13 23:59:24 <cr0vax> pfiou too many people there
Dec 14 00:03:10 <ivantis2> how lame
Dec 14 00:03:25 <ivantis2> tmobile doesnt support ipv6
Dec 14 00:07:32 <tmzt_> ivantis2: you got g1 with rc30?
Dec 14 00:07:51 <ivantis2> ya
Dec 14 00:13:18 <bparker06> anyone using AT&T on their phone?
Dec 14 00:14:03 <shad0w1e> ME
Dec 14 00:14:35 <nyt> http://androidirc.googlecode.com/files/irc-beta-2008121301.apk
Dec 14 00:14:36 <nyt> fixed
Dec 14 00:14:37 <nyt> woops
Dec 14 00:15:01 <offby1> hey Mr Nyt!
Dec 14 00:15:09 <cr0vax> Est-ce que quelqu'un utilise le G1 en France ?
Dec 14 00:15:29 <bparker06> shad0w1e: how do you setup data?
Dec 14 00:15:39 <shad0w1e> go to access points and add another one
Dec 14 00:15:40 <saurik> brocktice: http://www.saurik.com/id/10 <- as Debian supports this architecture there isn't much point spending time painfully cross compiling things like perl
Dec 14 00:16:23 * brocktice reads
Dec 14 00:16:31 <brocktice> I've heard of this "saurik's debian"
Dec 14 00:16:44 <shad0w1e> bparker06, http://www.androidmobileforum.com/forums/showthread.php?t=2982 but use the second one (media.net)
Dec 14 00:17:11 <shad0w1e> actually media.net is for the new ATT (aka cingular), the MMODE is for the old ATT
Dec 14 00:17:53 <bparker06> shad0w1e: tried that already
Dec 14 00:18:19 <shad0w1e> workx for me
Dec 14 00:18:35 <bazz> i need a new phone.  i want an android phone.  i don't really want a G1.  do i have any other good options (t-mobile)?  if not, when will i have some good other options?
Dec 14 00:19:05 <SystemWizard> you won't see another Android phone from T-Mobile until sometime in 09
Dec 14 00:19:23 <shad0w1e> whats wrong with G1 , other than the fact that theres no dedicated headphone jack?
Dec 14 00:19:33 <shad0w1e> bparker06, did you try it in caps?
Dec 14 00:19:43 <bazz> shad0w1e: that, mainly
Dec 14 00:19:44 <SystemWizard> and even then that's not THAT big a deal, shad0w1e
Dec 14 00:19:55 <JesusFreke> bazz, have you looked at the australian android phone? can't think of it's name offhand
Dec 14 00:20:01 <SystemWizard> when you get a G1 now it comes with a headphone jack adapter..
Dec 14 00:20:04 <bazz> JesusFreke: i haven't, i will
Dec 14 00:20:05 <offby2> nyt: yo amo su irc app
Dec 14 00:20:12 <bparker06> shad0w1e: yep
Dec 14 00:20:26 <shad0w1e> i mean i love new gadgets. I got this to test out two things and am categorizing my "issues" into two fields, one being the physical phone (G1) , and the other being the platform (Androd)
Dec 14 00:20:44 <shad0w1e> the handset seems pretty solid.
Dec 14 00:21:08 <shad0w1e> i wish there was an onscreen keyboard in portrait mode. i wish when you clicked on "add call" it didnt mute you, etc. but those are OS issues
Dec 14 00:21:25 <JesusFreke> bazz, it's called the kogan agora
Dec 14 00:21:44 <bazz> yeah, i just found it.  looks a bit more pdaish than i want, but i'll investigate. thanks
Dec 14 00:21:51 <bazz> so when in 09 are more models expected?
Dec 14 00:21:58 <shad0w1e> i wonder if android will come to keyboardless handsets..
Dec 14 00:28:41 * MegadethGuy is SystemWizard geeking with androidirc
Dec 14 00:29:46 <SanMehat> JesusFreke: you pinged?
Dec 14 00:31:55 <JesusFreke> oh, yes
Dec 14 00:32:06 <JesusFreke> I'm having some issues getting fastboot to work..
Dec 14 00:32:18 <JesusFreke> I see the device with fastboot devices
Dec 14 00:32:24 <SanMehat> ok
Dec 14 00:32:26 <JesusFreke> and can reboot with fastboot reboot
Dec 14 00:32:29 <SanMehat> ok good
Dec 14 00:32:35 <JesusFreke> but when I try to flash an image, it just hangs
Dec 14 00:32:38 <Captain_Dingo> have people been able to tether over USB or only over bluetooth and/or wifi?
Dec 14 00:32:48 <SanMehat> hmmm
Dec 14 00:32:58 <tmzt_> Captain_Dingo: there is no real ethernet function in the usb driver
Dec 14 00:33:00 <JesusFreke> it says something like "flashing <partition>", and just sits there.
Dec 14 00:33:01 <SanMehat> which image? the boot image?
Dec 14 00:33:12 <tmzt_> Captain_Dingo: there is only the port forwarding with adb, and tunneling things through that
Dec 14 00:33:18 <Captain_Dingo> ah
Dec 14 00:33:19 <JesusFreke> I've tried recovery, and the the boot image
Dec 14 00:33:47 <SanMehat> hmm.
Dec 14 00:33:54 <tmzt_> there is some work being done to add that to the kernel for similar devices, some of which may apply to a g1 kernel
Dec 14 00:33:58 <SanMehat> did you build your own fastboot?
Dec 14 00:34:00 <brocktice> JesusFreke, interesting since I'm considering flashing a kernel
Dec 14 00:34:18 <brocktice> just to try it
Dec 14 00:34:28 <JesusFreke> yes, I'm using a fastboot binary that had gotten built when I did built the full git tree
Dec 14 00:34:41 <SanMehat> JesusFreke: hmm ok
Dec 14 00:35:09 <offby1> now I've done it -- I've booted into the bootloader, and now have no idea how to get out of it :-|
Dec 14 00:35:12 <JesusFreke> it's in a linux vm though, so VM usb weirdness isn't totally out of the question
Dec 14 00:35:26 <SanMehat> JesusFreke: oh
Dec 14 00:35:30 <SanMehat> JesusFreke: well then i have no idea :)
Dec 14 00:35:34 <JesusFreke> but it's definitely connecting and everything, since reboot works
Dec 14 00:35:40 <SanMehat> JesusFreke: i've never had any issues with fastboot if reboot works
Dec 14 00:35:46 <JesusFreke> *nod*
Dec 14 00:35:47 <tmzt_> is fastboot using a standard usb serial port?
Dec 14 00:35:51 <Captain_Dingo> tmzt: That'd be nice, since the time I can think of when I've needed it most was when I was stuck on a plane that wasn't pulling out of the gate, so neither my laptop nor my phone had AC power... so using energy on both to run wireless was a waste
Dec 14 00:35:58 <JesusFreke> I'm working on compling a windows binary atm
Dec 14 00:36:07 <JesusFreke> so hopefully that will work
Dec 14 00:36:35 <JesusFreke> thanks though :)
Dec 14 00:37:32 <brocktice> there aren't really many interesting unchecked options in the kernel for this device
Dec 14 00:37:56 <offby1> gaah!  How do I get my phone to work normally again, now that I've gotten into the bootloader?  Halp halp.
Dec 14 00:38:13 <brocktice> offby1: call-menu-hangup?
Dec 14 00:38:19 <tmzt_> brocktice: what do yo mean?
Dec 14 00:38:20 <offby1> what's that?
Dec 14 00:38:21 <brocktice> hold them all
Dec 14 00:38:24 <brocktice> at once
Dec 14 00:38:24 <offby1> brocktice: oh I see.
Dec 14 00:38:43 <brocktice> reboots the device normally if you can manage to hit them all at once
Dec 14 00:38:47 <brocktice> that bit is nontrivial
Dec 14 00:39:08 <offby1> nothin' happenin' :-(
Dec 14 00:39:18 <Leeds> or just pop the battery?
Dec 14 00:39:27 <offby1> ah that should do it.
Dec 14 00:39:30 <brocktice> offby1, You're in fastboot?
Dec 14 00:39:41 <offby1> I dunno.
Dec 14 00:39:47 <offby1> I see four broad colored bands.
Dec 14 00:39:50 <brocktice> Do you have androids on skateboards?
Dec 14 00:39:53 <offby1> nope
Dec 14 00:39:54 <brocktice> Oh, everyone talks about those.
Dec 14 00:39:58 <brocktice> I've never seen them
Dec 14 00:40:05 <offby1> the top band says DREA100 PVT 32B
Dec 14 00:40:11 <offby1> and a few more lines of text
Dec 14 00:40:13 <offby1> that's all
Dec 14 00:40:15 <Leeds> 32B???? oh no
Dec 14 00:40:52 <offby1> wozzat?
Dec 14 00:41:04 <offby1> does that mean I have the Phone of Doom™?
Dec 14 00:41:39 <Leeds> heh :-)
Dec 14 00:42:27 <offby1> yanking the battery and USB, not surprisingly, let me reboot normally.
Dec 14 00:42:36 <SystemWizard> has anyone tried to go to http://market.android.com/publish/Home with their G1?  and if so, where you able to see your market listings?  it doesn't work for me..
Dec 14 00:42:43 <offby1> Makes me wonder what that bootloader is for, though; I'd have expected to be able to type commands or something.
Dec 14 00:44:08 <xsdg> offby1: I believe you can hit Home+Back from the bootloader to get the phone to reboot
Dec 14 00:44:09 <SystemWizard> nevermind.. it's working for me since the R30 update apparently.. *sigh*
Dec 14 00:44:16 * SystemWizard gets back on the fence
Dec 14 00:53:24 <xsdg> offby1: and interaction with fastboot is over USB
Dec 14 00:53:54 <starfireg1> .
Dec 14 00:55:20 <offby1> xsdg: aaaahhhh
Dec 14 00:55:29 <offby1> perhaps if I unplug the cable and try again ...
Dec 14 00:56:15 <unix_infidel> anyone feeling any creakyness when pressing down on the side of the screen?
Dec 14 00:56:55 <JesusFreke> my old G1 did, unix_infidel
Dec 14 00:57:07 <unix_infidel> JesusFreke: old G1?
Dec 14 00:58:25 <snadge> unix_infidel: yeah mine does that
Dec 14 00:58:36 <snadge> i thought maybe i'd caused that by putting it in my pocket
Dec 14 00:58:55 <snadge> its just a g1 thing i think ;)
Dec 14 00:59:01 <JesusFreke> unix_infidel, I returned it. have a dev phone now.
Dec 14 00:59:14 <JesusFreke> no squeakyness yet
Dec 14 00:59:37 <snadge> do you pocket that phone or do you have a holster for it?
Dec 14 01:00:21 <kRutOn>  horse hide IWB holster
Dec 14 01:02:23 <unix_infidel> can you increase the number of mis draws on the lock screen?
Dec 14 01:03:20 <wasabi> So I ordered a dev phone. Anybody have one yet?
Dec 14 01:03:40 <brocktice> wasabi, yep
Dec 14 01:03:46 <brocktice> anyone know how to access the sim card from the command line?
Dec 14 01:03:57 <wasabi> Anything worth noting or is it exactly what is claimed?
Dec 14 01:04:15 <brocktice> My wife's sim card was full of SMSes and apparently there's a bug where it can't actually manage them if it's full.
Dec 14 01:04:20 <brocktice> It just complains regularly.
Dec 14 01:04:28 <brocktice> wasabi, Pretty much is what it is.
Dec 14 01:04:35 <wasabi> Cool. Exactly what I hoped.
Dec 14 01:04:46 <brocktice> Doesn't have aim/yahoo/msn chat, voice dial
Dec 14 01:04:53 <wasabi> Eh that's all fine.
Dec 14 01:05:00 <wasabi> the IM stuff can be taken care of some other way I'm sure.
Dec 14 01:05:05 <wasabi> And I never use voice stuff anyways.
Dec 14 01:05:19 <wasabi> So anybody have much information about the boot loader yet? Wondering how hard it is to get a kernel and initramfs choosable at boot beyond hte default one?
Dec 14 01:05:23 <JesusFreke> wasabi: http://www.gotontheinter.net/node/12
Dec 14 01:05:31 <wasabi> <--- highly interested in getting a Linux install on a SD.
Dec 14 01:05:41 <JesusFreke> wasabi: fastboot info: http://www.gotontheinter.net/node/8
Dec 14 01:05:54 <wasabi> Sweet. Praise our new Google overlords.
Dec 14 01:05:59 <SanMehat> wasabi: thats easy
Dec 14 01:06:03 <wasabi> Figured it would be.
Dec 14 01:06:29 <SanMehat> wasabi: just root=/dev/block/mmcblk0p1
Dec 14 01:06:34 <wasabi> Nice.
Dec 14 01:07:07 <SanMehat> you can pass command line options via fastboot as well
Dec 14 01:07:32 <wasabi> I haven't been keeping up with the device. I know people got vanilla LInux booting... but I have yet to hear any information about what sort of hardware has been access? Console obviously. Framebuffer support or X driver?
Dec 14 01:07:39 <SanMehat> fastboot -c "root=/dev/block/mmcblk0p1" arch/arm/boot/zImage ../out/target/product/dream/ramdisk.img
Dec 14 01:07:47 <SanMehat> X ? ew.
Dec 14 01:08:09 <wasabi> I am highly interested in getting a Ubuntu port running on it and fixing Maemo crap to operate.
Dec 14 01:08:15 <wasabi> That's not going to work without an X server.
Dec 14 01:08:18 <SanMehat> good luck.
Dec 14 01:08:25 <wasabi> Yeah. It'll be "fun".
Dec 14 01:08:28 <wasabi> What is hte framebuffer then?
Dec 14 01:09:10 <Leeds> why X and ubuntu?
Dec 14 01:09:18 <wasabi> Because it's my home turf.
Dec 14 01:09:34 <Leeds> modern X on a 480x320 screen will be unusable
Dec 14 01:09:35 <SanMehat> wasabi: look at drivers/video/msm
Dec 14 01:09:36 <wasabi> Having upload access lets me fix things without maintaining large forks. ;)
Dec 14 01:09:55 <wasabi> Leeds, Hence the maemo interest.
Dec 14 01:10:22 <Leeds> I think there's probably more interest the other way - getting android running well on maemo devices :-)
Dec 14 01:10:32 <wasabi> No maemo devices have GSM units.
Dec 14 01:10:32 <SanMehat> yeah :)
Dec 14 01:10:35 <wasabi> So utterly useless.
Dec 14 01:10:51 <wasabi> Been there. I have a 770 and 800. I have never used them for anything meaningful except as a mpd controller.
Dec 14 01:10:55 <SanMehat> so then why not just drop maemo?
Dec 14 01:10:57 <wasabi> No reason to carry something with you.
Dec 14 01:11:02 <wasabi> Because I like Gtk. :)
Dec 14 01:11:06 <SanMehat> rather than try to shoe-horn it ..
Dec 14 01:11:07 <SanMehat> oh
Dec 14 01:11:16 <SanMehat> you're hopeless then
Dec 14 01:11:17 <SanMehat> :)
Dec 14 01:11:18 <wasabi> And I have this idea that a Telepathy GSM provider would be Freaking AWesome.
Dec 14 01:11:19 <wasabi> Yeah.
Dec 14 01:12:24 <wasabi> I suspect the GSM hardware is locked behind doors though.
Dec 14 01:12:31 <wasabi> I'm very interested to see how access to it is possible.
Dec 14 01:12:45 <SanMehat> well i'd suggest #htc-linux then
Dec 14 01:12:54 <SanMehat> they are more into getting normal linux up on devices
Dec 14 01:13:04 <wasabi> Ahh, cool. Okay thanks.
Dec 14 01:13:07 <SanMehat> np
Dec 14 01:13:11 <Leeds> until/unless Nokia releases mainstream hardware running maemo... it'll stay niche
Dec 14 01:13:19 <wasabi> Yeah, it will.
Dec 14 01:13:30 <wasabi> Which is disappointing, and a terrible flaw in whatever business plan they may think they have.
Dec 14 01:13:44 <wasabi> I suspect they were contractually prevented from putting a GSM unit in any Maemo device. And hence they didn't.
Dec 14 01:13:46 <wasabi> And hence nobody cares.
Dec 14 01:15:13 <snadge> i was kind of intrigued to note that android practically has nothing to do with linux.. apart from the kernel
Dec 14 01:15:36 <snadge> the rest is bsd stuff
Dec 14 01:15:48 <tmzt_> SanMehat: is rootdelay needed?
Dec 14 01:16:05 <snadge> its a hybrid monster :P
Dec 14 01:16:36 <Leeds> contractually prevented?
Dec 14 01:16:43 <wasabi> It's a weird non-Linux lie stack built on top of a hacked Linux kernel.
Dec 14 01:16:46 <wasabi> Like so many devices before it.
Dec 14 01:16:51 <wasabi> s/lie/like/
Dec 14 01:17:12 <wasabi> I'll also be interested to see what portions of Android can be ripped off of it and put on vanilla Linux.
Dec 14 01:17:28 <Leeds> pretty much all, I suspect, if you wanted to
Dec 14 01:18:33 <wasabi> apt-get install android. =)))
Dec 14 01:19:04 <Damm> once you get davlik running
Dec 14 01:19:06 <Damm> the rest is cake
Dec 14 01:20:00 <wasabi> Is the whole thing build on the VM? System stuff too?
Dec 14 01:20:15 <wasabi> Does the interaction at the hardware level step out of that? Like, USB?
Dec 14 01:21:08 <JesusFreke> yeah, most of the system level stuff is native
Dec 14 01:21:40 <tmzt_> wasabi: you need at least binder and ashmem
Dec 14 01:38:00 <snadge> the whole lot should've been GPLed to begin with.. bsd sucks ;)
Dec 14 01:38:33 <jham> Damm: You need lots of other stuff, like kernel drivers, etc. It's not quite as simple as getting Dalvik running
Dec 14 01:38:59 <jham> Damm: Dalvik itself was designed to not be very tied to the other parts of Android
Dec 14 01:39:08 <Damm> jham, ah
Dec 14 01:39:22 <Damm> jham, if you guys ever put this knowledge into a book "Developing Android"... let me know
Dec 14 01:39:26 <Damm> it'd be worth buying a copy
Dec 14 01:40:59 <jham> Damm: I write code, not books :-)
Dec 14 01:41:18 <tmzt_> Damm: wasabi: what device are you working on?
Dec 14 01:42:59 <geist> jham: you mean you write bugs
Dec 14 01:43:09 <snadge> are we going to see bluetooth pan support?
Dec 14 01:43:30 <jham> geist: Oh snap!
Dec 14 01:43:33 <geist> jham: exhibit A: http://tkgeisel.com/pics/Be/summer%202000/small/P0001037.JPG
Dec 14 01:43:38 <snadge> and ability to browse files, remote control phone etc with bluetooth
Dec 14 01:43:47 <geist> jham busy writing bugs
Dec 14 01:43:53 <jham> geist: I see lots of wires, no bugs...
Dec 14 01:44:13 <geist> you were testing your subtle usb stack bug
Dec 14 01:44:21 <geist> iirc
Dec 14 01:44:21 <jham> I plead the 5th
Dec 14 01:46:38 <snadge> i wonder if it would be worth loading the dev code and trying to add bluetooth pan with nat
Dec 14 01:49:13 <jham> geist: Exhibit B is much stornger: http://tkgeisel.com/pics/Be/summer%202000/small/P0001041.JPG
Dec 14 01:50:03 <SanMehat> haha
Dec 14 01:51:19 <jham> even better: http://tkgeisel.com/pics/Be/summer%202000/small/P0001035.JPG
Dec 14 01:51:33 <geist> yeah, see you were caught in the act
Dec 14 01:51:41 <geist> lookin a little surprised
Dec 14 01:51:47 <jham> SanMehat: That was back in the day when I still did kernel work :-)
Dec 14 01:53:10 <laura--> Is there any documentation around what object types can be passed to a javascript interface (used to pass parameters from a webview into an activity)
Dec 14 01:53:35 <laura--> So far, from my own testing, it seems that only primitive types and arrays of primitives are supported
Dec 14 01:54:24 <laura--> If that's about all there is, I guess I'm thinking about passing in a String, then using some JSON java lib to convert that into a map or something (since maps don't seem to be supported)
Dec 14 01:58:53 <Damm> snadge, Disconnect has a setup that works with BT PAN.
Dec 14 01:59:03 <Damm> i believe the docs are on his site.
Dec 14 01:59:19 <snadge> the site comes up article not found or something
Dec 14 02:00:50 <SanMehat> oh god i ate too much
Dec 14 02:01:21 <VersedG1> i here ya and drank too
Dec 14 02:01:52 <VersedG1> at caesers at the bar with a cigar
Dec 14 02:02:16 <SanMehat> bastard
Dec 14 02:02:53 <VersedG1> wiife just won almost $1k
Dec 14 02:03:03 <SanMehat> nice
Dec 14 02:03:16 <snadge> damn you went to vegas with your wife :P j/k
Dec 14 02:03:17 <VersedG1> yeah
Dec 14 02:03:26 <VersedG1> atlantic city
Dec 14 02:08:42 <snadge> is there a newer release of the port to kaiser? the one i have is ancient, and very bad
Dec 14 02:08:54 <snadge> htc tytn ii
Dec 14 02:10:17 <VersedG1> and tilt if you have at&t
Dec 14 02:23:23 <infernix> does anyone know where the device id (for example HT843GZ53291) is stored? it shows when you run adb devices
Dec 14 02:27:03 <xsdg> infernix: it's the serial number of the handset (you'll find it on a label under the battery, also)
Dec 14 02:27:18 <xsdg> as to where it's stored, no, I don't know
Dec 14 02:27:28 <infernix> hmm
Dec 14 02:27:31 * infernix investigates
Dec 14 02:28:11 <zinx> could be stored in USB stuff
Dec 14 02:28:26 <xsdg> zinx: hmm?
Dec 14 02:29:11 <infernix> im testing device backup and restore
Dec 14 02:29:41 <infernix> so far im failing to correctly restore data partition. even though data and apps are there, apps will crash and phone asks to restart signup process
Dec 14 02:29:58 <infernix> im hoping there is some link to the device id or IMEI in the data that i can replace
Dec 14 02:30:10 <infernix> if not, backup and restore won't work from one phone to the other
Dec 14 02:30:29 <zinx> uhm
Dec 14 02:30:32 <RyeBrye> ah. gotcha
Dec 14 02:30:46 <zinx> i'm not sure the device id / IMEI has anything at all to do with that
Dec 14 02:30:57 <infernix> well, we'll know in a few mins
Dec 14 02:31:01 <infernix> testing backup from/to same device now
Dec 14 02:32:41 <xsdg> infernix: my guess would be "there's stuff that's stored in places that aren't /data"
Dec 14 02:32:51 <infernix> ok, seems to work fine from&to same device
Dec 14 02:32:54 <xsdg> I have no idea whether this is actually the case
Dec 14 02:33:06 <infernix> xsdg: can't be. besides, i'm flashing boot, recovery, system, data
Dec 14 02:33:16 <zhobbs> infernix: there is some info in android.os.Build that might be helpful
Dec 14 02:33:17 <infernix> well perhaps in misc then
Dec 14 02:33:23 <zinx> you may need to erase the .obex files if you you're backing them up
Dec 14 02:33:34 <zinx> or say what error the apps are giving
Dec 14 02:33:56 <zinx> not sure on the .obex, i just know they're generated
Dec 14 02:34:25 <infernix> .obex is stored in /data?
Dec 14 02:34:41 <zinx> stored with the app afaik
Dec 14 02:35:59 <infernix> in /system?
Dec 14 02:36:02 <infernix> thats mounted ro?
Dec 14 02:36:11 <infernix> either way, i'm writing that too
Dec 14 02:36:19 <infernix> so if anywhere it has to be either on sdcard or on misc
Dec 14 02:36:50 <zinx> whereever the app is, that's where the obex is.
Dec 14 02:36:58 <infernix> zhobbs: where do i find that? can't find /mydroid -name android.os*
Dec 14 02:37:12 <xsdg> infernix: adb shell `find` | grep foobar
Dec 14 02:37:21 <xsdg> that's one way; might be slow, I guess
Dec 14 02:37:38 <infernix> no find on there
Dec 14 02:37:44 <xsdg> ls -R?
Dec 14 02:37:50 <infernix> n/m busybox find works
Dec 14 02:38:00 <zhobbs> infernix: oh, in busy box?
Dec 14 02:38:24 <infernix> either way, there must be more to it
Dec 14 02:38:33 <infernix> from/to same device seems to work, just not cross-devices
Dec 14 02:38:51 <infernix> so i guess somewhere with the initial install process the device id gets stored in /data, or some other unique ID
Dec 14 02:42:07 <zhobbs> might want to look in android-git/frameworks/base/core/java/android/os/SystemProperties.java and/or android-git/frameworks/base/core/jni/android_os_SystemProperties.cpp
Dec 14 02:46:02 <RyeBrye> does the ANDROID_ID or whatever it is change between reflashing?
Dec 14 02:51:04 <xsdg> infernix: couldn't you start with two clean images, back them both up, and then do a recursive diff?
Dec 14 02:51:36 <infernix> yeah i could do that later on
Dec 14 02:51:47 <ivantis2> is there a way to gain root on an RC30 yet?
Dec 14 02:51:49 <infernix> gonna bindiff misc firat
Dec 14 02:52:15 <RyeBrye> who is misc firat, and what did he do to offend you?
Dec 14 02:55:49 <infernix> hehe
Dec 14 02:55:52 <infernix> *first
Dec 14 02:55:57 <RyeBrye> oh, ok
Dec 14 02:58:31 * unix_infidel just tried using the G1 as a proper media device. not too unpleasant at all.
Dec 14 02:58:51 <unix_infidel> too bad i cant charge and audio out at the same time...meh.
Dec 14 02:59:13 <ivantis2> speaker?
Dec 14 02:59:24 <ivantis2> i dont like the earbuds
**** ENDING LOGGING AT Sun Dec 14 02:59:57 2008