**** BEGIN LOGGING AT Wed Dec 17 02:59:57 2008 Dec 17 03:00:07 I don't check my gmail on my home computer...it basically just gets mailing list stuff I read on the bus Dec 17 03:05:14 hi, all! Dec 17 03:06:22 hi, zz_111! Dec 17 03:06:34 ok, now that I need it I can't find the info on what needs to be done to completely unlock the dev phone (some setting that has to be toggled from 1 to 0 or whatever)... where is it? Dec 17 03:06:47 ro.secure? Dec 17 03:06:50 ro.secure Dec 17 03:06:54 but its gotta be done in the image Dec 17 03:07:06 ah Dec 17 03:07:37 is that what's preventing me from remounting /system as rw? Dec 17 03:07:40 just install jf's 1.2/rc8 Dec 17 03:07:44 dingo: yep Dec 17 03:07:59 with 'adb remount' yes. with "su" "mount -o remount,rw /system /system" .. no Dec 17 03:08:40 yeah, I meant adb remount... I'll read JF's post on xda Dec 17 03:08:45 thanks guys Dec 17 03:08:48 I'll be releasing a modified dev phone image when I release 1.3. (so 3 total, RC30v1.3, RC8v1.3 and devphonev1.2 Dec 17 03:08:56 devphonev1.3* Dec 17 03:09:27 nice Dec 17 03:09:37 whenzat? Dec 17 03:09:44 waiting for rc31? Dec 17 03:09:46 soon. ish Dec 17 03:09:49 and still no way to install on top of RC30? slacker... Dec 17 03:09:49 heh Dec 17 03:09:51 whats new in 1.3? and whats the diff between RC8 and say devphone Dec 17 03:10:03 since you seem to add most of the stuff thats missing anyway Dec 17 03:10:27 snadge: his article @ www.gotontheinter.net has the differences. Dec 17 03:10:47 oh yeah and before i asked.. whats the difference between the engineering bootloader, and the dev phone one Dec 17 03:10:56 a signature check Dec 17 03:11:06 and skateboards? Dec 17 03:11:07 engineering bootloader that got released hasn't got one anymore Dec 17 03:11:13 nope. adp1 has skateboards. Dec 17 03:11:28 oh well... Dec 17 03:11:35 the adp1 still does a signature check? Dec 17 03:11:39 its byte-for-byte except the sig check that dream_kill and cmonex pulled out Dec 17 03:11:43 for nbh yah Dec 17 03:11:50 not for partition flashing Dec 17 03:12:19 right.. i still havn't loaded the eng bootloader onto my g1 Dec 17 03:12:43 JesusFreke: can i suggest that 1.3 comes with different keys? Dec 17 03:12:44 Disconnect: oh interesting. Dec 17 03:12:52 Disconnect: this adp1 setup... Dec 17 03:12:52 disconnect: why? Dec 17 03:13:12 cuz tmob can shuffle out an ota w/ test keys easily enough. Dec 17 03:13:13 Disconnect: has a different package format than previous updates. e.g. no radio.img The system has a .tar in it. Dec 17 03:13:16 kinda interesting. Dec 17 03:13:26 grey-: huh? Dec 17 03:13:32 Disconnect: if you expand the zip Dec 17 03:13:45 Disconnect: vs say, the rc28 OTA, or jf's 1.2 Dec 17 03:13:51 which zip? Dec 17 03:13:52 Disconnect: there's no radio.img Dec 17 03:14:03 Disconnect: adp1_stocksystem_v1.0 Dec 17 03:14:06 and radio.img is just for updating the .. umm.. radio img :) Dec 17 03:14:12 Disconnect: and the system directory Dec 17 03:14:24 that zip you are expanding was made by jf after dumping his adp1. no conclusions can be drawn from it's contents Dec 17 03:14:25 contains a system.tar Dec 17 03:14:30 grey-: yeah, I did the tar thing so I wouldn't have to manually set all the permissions and setup the links and stuff in the update script Dec 17 03:14:36 JesusFreke: ah, k. Dec 17 03:14:57 I just tarred up the system folder on my adp1, and then included busybox in the update.zip, to untar it Dec 17 03:15:11 *nod* that's cool. Dec 17 03:15:18 and naturally you couldn't grab the radio firmware. Dec 17 03:15:23 so Dec 17 03:15:29 ver # is the same at least Dec 17 03:15:32 a friend of mine has been bugging me about looking into the msm stuff a lot. Dec 17 03:15:37 and it occurs to me Dec 17 03:15:46 that _maybe_ the radio.img could be reflashed with a modified one Dec 17 03:15:48 but it's signed. Dec 17 03:15:55 Disconnect: any reason to believe t-mob would do that? Dec 17 03:15:57 I'm not sure if the engineering bootloader cares about that. Dec 17 03:16:00 I'm actually gonna start leaving out the radio.img Dec 17 03:16:13 no need to flash it most of the time, and it makes flashing more dangerous Dec 17 03:16:21 Disconnect: the thought had occurred to me as well; but seeing how the dev system uses those keys, it seems unlikely they will. Dec 17 03:16:26 JesusFreke: *nod* Dec 17 03:16:34 non-tmob units won't poll.. so... Dec 17 03:16:35 if t-mobile puts out a new radio image in a future update, I'll just release a separate update to flash just the radio Dec 17 03:16:35 JesusFreke: I'm kinda interesting in hacking the radio though. Dec 17 03:16:50 grey-: *nod* Dec 17 03:17:08 JesusFreke: just not sure if it honours the same signing mechanisms, or a different one. Dec 17 03:17:19 JesusFreke: but yeah for most people, definitely higher risk of bricking. Dec 17 03:17:45 the radio definitely needs updating anyway.. i call my data access in australia "random g" Dec 17 03:17:49 JesusFreke: my friend tim's been poking around a little with the radio.img Dec 17 03:17:52 JesusFreke: http://www.thenewsh.com/~newsham/android/ Dec 17 03:18:09 snadge: aren't you only on 1 of the tmob-usa freqs? that could do it.. Dec 17 03:18:20 oo, nice grey :) Dec 17 03:18:22 because i can have anything from full 3g access, to just gprs (we skipped edge over here).. to no data at all.. and this is without even physically moving the phone Dec 17 03:18:49 yeah im on 2100mhz Dec 17 03:18:50 this observation raised some questions for him... Dec 17 03:18:50 high entropy, but not quite uniformly distributed. high bit is set only 1/3rd of the time. otherwise fairly flat distribution Dec 17 03:18:57 he wasn't sure what would fit that. Dec 17 03:20:29 something compressed perhaps Dec 17 03:20:51 compressed or intentionally limited Dec 17 03:21:28 so how long does it usually take for these dev phones to ship? Dec 17 03:21:31 been since friday now Dec 17 03:21:48 wasabi: it takes some skill to properly pack the pony Dec 17 03:22:10 hah, just had another phantom notification Dec 17 03:22:27 caught it fast enough...it showed "new email" in the top bar, then disappeared and notifications are blank Dec 17 03:22:28 went and grabbed a tmobile sim today, unlocked an old cingular phone I had, and canceled my vzw. Dec 17 03:22:34 all in anticipation of it arriving Dec 17 03:23:39 wasabi: hmmm people are just getting 'em. Dec 17 03:23:44 grey-: I think I have enough to file a bug report. Gotta send myself two emails to verify though Dec 17 03:23:54 wasabi: but they ordered @ announcement, unknown if that's when they started shipping though. Dec 17 03:24:01 hmm. so i might have a bit of a wait Dec 17 03:24:02 ismarc: kewl. Dec 17 03:26:03 argh it's the vacuum hour @ work. Dec 17 03:26:07 why do I always stay late? Dec 17 03:26:40 free massages? Dec 17 03:26:43 vacuum hour? Dec 17 03:26:51 marix: janitor vacuuming. Dec 17 03:26:52 when the cleaning crew comes in Dec 17 03:26:52 too loud. Dec 17 03:26:56 happens everywhere. ;) Dec 17 03:27:06 *nod* Dec 17 03:27:15 old janitors used to not vacuum until after midnight. Dec 17 03:27:21 at least then I knew it was REALLY time to leave. Dec 17 03:27:26 or at least find a couch to sleep on. Dec 17 03:27:28 *sigh* Dec 17 03:27:37 perhaps you could ask them to knock it the fuck off Dec 17 03:27:42 http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=459941 Dec 17 03:27:45 *NERD RAGES* Dec 17 03:27:45 or whatever that is in spanish Dec 17 03:28:07 MD5 (radio.img) = 4e04b3cf8db5356536519691fc1b75e3 vs MD5 (radio.img) = 4e04b3cf8db5356536519691fc1b75e3 Dec 17 03:28:13 from rc28 OTA vs rc30. Dec 17 03:28:17 same radio firmware. Dec 17 03:28:18 hell Dec 17 03:28:23 why does tmobile push that out? Dec 17 03:28:36 they could be saving hella bandwidth by leaving it out Dec 17 03:28:45 grey-: it's easier to mash the "build a release and ship it!" button Dec 17 03:28:52 ismarc: haha Dec 17 03:28:59 well I'm glad they did initially. Dec 17 03:29:04 ismarc: That button is very tempting. Dec 17 03:29:04 at least it gives us something to start with. Dec 17 03:29:24 I wonder if any changes have been made to it at -all- Dec 17 03:29:27 I mashed that button at work today Dec 17 03:29:34 or if it's from qualcomm Dec 17 03:29:41 and htc has just been passing it along. Dec 17 03:29:55 then again, it was so we could make it before the blackout dates Dec 17 03:30:11 haha Dec 17 03:30:35 damn Dec 17 03:30:40 left the 1gb sdhc @ home. Dec 17 03:30:51 kinda wanted to keep that one as my reflashing one. Dec 17 03:38:09 does anyone have a collection of android boot screens? Dec 17 03:40:15 snapphoto it is a promising looking app Dec 17 03:40:30 yo Dec 17 03:40:41 using the accelerometer to figure out when's a good time to capture a photo Dec 17 03:40:55 now make the default camera app do that :] Dec 17 03:40:57 hmmm, I just applied JF's 1.2 update and after rebooting, I just get to the screen with the android logo and the pulsating android... seems stuck there. What's going on? Dec 17 03:40:58 there is a similar application on the iphone that is continuously in the top 50 Dec 17 03:41:19 now make the default iphone camera do that Dec 17 03:41:23 hey, i'm working on some sd card optimizations.. can you guys run this? 'adb shell df | grep sdcard'? I'd like to know what the 'block size' reports Dec 17 03:41:35 wastrel: hehe Dec 17 03:41:37 wasabi: iphone camera doesn't need to do it :) Dec 17 03:41:44 SanMehat: istr mine is 512 lemme doublecheck Dec 17 03:41:54 hi! Dec 17 03:42:02 man wastrel is always confused for me Dec 17 03:42:07 Captain_Dingo: hmmm, how long? It will sit and glow for a while during boot. Dec 17 03:42:11 Disconnect: 512?... for FAT? thats bad Dec 17 03:42:14 SanMehat: Dec 17 03:42:15 my bad. 32768 :) Dec 17 03:42:17 the block size in df referrs to the FAT cluster size Dec 17 03:42:18 /sdcard: 7856452K total, 2264524K used, 5591928K available (block size 4096) Dec 17 03:42:32 JesusFreke: dude reformat that for at least 32k clusters Dec 17 03:42:35 i think the underlying device is 512 yah. but its a 4g card, 32768 blocks Dec 17 03:42:41 gotcha :) Dec 17 03:42:45 grey- I let it go for a few minutes, pulled the battery, then tried again, with the same result Dec 17 03:42:50 * grey- grabs the usb cable. Dec 17 03:42:54 Captain_Dingo: eep that is a while. Dec 17 03:42:55 longer than the normal boot time, that's for sure Dec 17 03:43:00 Captain_Dingo: *nod* Dec 17 03:43:27 what's my next move? Has anyone seen this before? Dec 17 03:43:34 hmmm not sure. Dec 17 03:43:45 Captain_Dingo: assuming you already did the recovery img stuff. Dec 17 03:43:51 Captain_Dingo: and ensured that was working properly. Dec 17 03:44:12 Captain_Dingo: (if you go into recovery mode and press alt-L it'll tell you what keys you're using and it should say test keys) Dec 17 03:44:13 what? who? Dec 17 03:44:18 it's on the dev phone... JF said I could just apply the update directly with no other steps Dec 17 03:44:20 grey-: fyi you can do that block size check from the onboard terminal Dec 17 03:44:23 Captain_Dingo: than presumably you could try doing an update again. Dec 17 03:44:33 Disconnect: durr, that's a good idea. ;) Dec 17 03:44:42 though copy+paste is slower by hand. ;) Dec 17 03:44:52 Dingo: do a wipe :) Dec 17 03:45:15 SanMehat: /sdcard: 3923968K total, 78496K used, 3845472K available (block size 32768) (this is with a 3rd party 4GB card) Dec 17 03:51:05 grey-: cool. Dec 17 03:51:19 btw.. 4k clusters is good for packing files, but shitty for performance Dec 17 03:51:33 if you have a 16 gig card, i'd suggest 32 or even 64k clusters Dec 17 03:51:51 wait who has a1 16g card? :( Dec 17 03:51:59 i do Dec 17 03:52:03 :( Dec 17 03:52:09 32-64k clusters improves performance on the android? o_O Dec 17 03:52:13 i :( in your general direction even ;) Dec 17 03:52:29 Disconnect: $50 isn't so bad, thinking about it... Dec 17 03:52:36 yah its gotten a lot cheaper Dec 17 03:52:44 i'm kinda waiting for a good music player tho Dec 17 03:52:44 will continue to. Dec 17 03:52:54 * zinx thinks it's a little odd that larger cluster size would improve performance on flash memory Dec 17 03:52:57 it'd be nice if 32GB hit sdhc before iphone hit 32gb. ;) Dec 17 03:53:06 Disconnect: haha, good point. Dec 17 03:53:11 that and ecost f'd me over on a tuner, in the end its an even replacement except shipping 3 ways is totalling $120 .. on a $200 unit :( Dec 17 03:53:14 same for video. Dec 17 03:53:16 there are already 32GB SDHC cards Dec 17 03:53:20 whaaa? Dec 17 03:53:20 just not 32GB microSDHC Dec 17 03:53:31 those are only up to 16GB. Dec 17 03:53:32 zinx: oh right, microsdhc I meant. Dec 17 03:53:41 Disconnect: what kinda tuner? Dec 17 03:54:21 http://www.ecost.com/Detail.aspx?edp=40132753&navid=155441519 Dec 17 03:54:27 i 110% don't recommend it. Dec 17 03:54:50 it sounded great, compared to the 5+ year old sony its replacing :) but it died basically immediately. and its minimum $45 shipping :/ .. Dec 17 03:56:18 we'll see how the replacement does. but in the meantime i'm out a TON of shipping, 2x the cost of the tuner (until they credit it) and i'm back on the tuner that keeps cutting out (drops down to center-channel only) Dec 17 03:57:15 45 is insane for shipping Dec 17 03:57:27 wtf does it weigh 100lbs? Dec 17 03:58:32 huh Dec 17 03:58:35 lame. Dec 17 03:58:47 I got rid of all my surround sound stuff. Dec 17 03:58:56 borrowing some m-audio monitors + sub Dec 17 03:59:17 I mostly do dj stuff anyway, I didn't find a home theater setup for audio was really useful for me often. Dec 17 04:00:10 paid $60 to get 2-day the first time since the old one was effectively dead. (good news is it got better, sorta, after being packed and then unpacked).. ground is $40. so .. plus whatever it costs to send teh dead one back Dec 17 04:01:54 damnit Dec 17 04:02:02 I wish google image search would let you search by pixel ratio Dec 17 04:02:07 they -display- it Dec 17 04:02:10 lol Dec 17 04:02:11 why can't I search on it? Dec 17 04:02:25 'extra large' 'large' 'medium' 'small' bs. Dec 17 04:02:49 I can at least search by filetype Dec 17 04:02:54 and greyscale/etc. Dec 17 04:06:30 ? Dec 17 04:06:32 mt Dec 17 04:07:03 :o Dec 17 04:07:11 Hi Gary :) Dec 17 04:07:13 hi :P Dec 17 04:07:20 i stalked you here Dec 17 04:07:31 merry tree holiday to you too Dec 17 04:07:56 lol Dec 17 04:08:49 sheesh, this place is like 2.5x as large as #wowhead =/ Dec 17 04:12:53 okay Dec 17 04:12:54 so Dec 17 04:13:12 if i do a "factory data reset" on my phone, what all info will get lost? Dec 17 04:13:27 all applications and settings, i think Dec 17 04:13:37 everything on /data Dec 17 04:13:43 installed apps, settings, everything. Dec 17 04:13:48 probably will resync contacts/calendar/gmail/etc once you start them. Dec 17 04:14:05 huh, altavista you can kinda fudge into a pixel search. Dec 17 04:14:10 but not filetype Dec 17 04:14:11 arghz. Dec 17 04:14:13 zinx: it loses login info Dec 17 04:14:14 so annoying. Dec 17 04:14:19 Disconnect: aye Dec 17 04:14:48 I actually want a ratio I guess. Dec 17 04:14:54 okay and 1 more thing, i got the "hacked firmware" and um i did something in terminal emulator with something, will that change back and will my phone reset the modded firmware? Dec 17 04:15:13 no. Dec 17 04:15:38 2:3 Dec 17 04:15:58 what crazyness uses 2:3 or 3:2 Dec 17 04:16:25 zinx: 320x480 Dec 17 04:16:31 your phone. Dec 17 04:16:33 rofl Dec 17 04:16:39 k 1 more question lol if i did this: http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=443336 to my phone, will THAT reset? Dec 17 04:16:41 LCD = 2:3 Dec 17 04:16:55 :P Dec 17 04:17:28 haha Dec 17 04:17:31 Lieutenant: it only changes /data. if you make changes to /system, it will not reset them. Dec 17 04:17:38 I can do 320x480 into google images Dec 17 04:17:41 and come up with a buncha stuff. Dec 17 04:17:42 lulz Dec 17 04:17:43 oh okay, thank you. Dec 17 04:17:57 I could put this on my boot! http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2147/2253971434_bd6266032d.jpg?v=0 Dec 17 04:18:05 lol grey :) Dec 17 04:18:07 that would screw with people. ;) Dec 17 04:18:11 hah Dec 17 04:18:13 iphone 3.0 Dec 17 04:18:15 sweet Dec 17 04:18:17 do it Dec 17 04:18:17 you would need to get a white G1 Dec 17 04:18:23 I'm tempted.... Dec 17 04:19:26 here's a cool one Dec 17 04:19:26 http://www.phonewallpaperpictures.com/images/hubblesite/or-hubblesite-org-320x480.jpg Dec 17 04:19:30 LOL Dec 17 04:19:49 i would totally do that (if i knew how to change the pic) Dec 17 04:19:51 lots of emma watson. Dec 17 04:20:01 emma whosits? Dec 17 04:20:04 Lieutenant: http://www.gotontheinter.net/logo.rle Dec 17 04:20:05 woohoo Dec 17 04:20:15 marix: hermione from the harry potter films Dec 17 04:20:18 marix: errr the err hermione in harry potter movie actress. Dec 17 04:20:28 oh Dec 17 04:20:30 i hope that tut is noob-proof lol. Dec 17 04:20:32 heh Dec 17 04:20:42 searching for 480x320 gives me a buncha -different- images. Dec 17 04:20:53 I wonder if flickr has a better search Dec 17 04:20:59 if not, I've got a friend who works there and could bug. Dec 17 04:21:14 nope it aint :( Dec 17 04:21:34 wow. lot's of cool nasa phone backgrounds :) Dec 17 04:21:35 http://www.phonewallpaperpictures.com/hubblesite-pix.html Dec 17 04:21:40 no Dec 17 04:21:40 damnit. Dec 17 04:21:59 tho, she's cute, whoever she is: http://www.flickr.com/photos/22031159@N03/3085823979/ Dec 17 04:22:07 space is purrrdy Dec 17 04:22:21 thats Fille à lunette Dec 17 04:22:55 heh, these are all ihone wallpapers Dec 17 04:22:55 who made the steel browser app? Dec 17 04:22:58 is that person in here? Dec 17 04:23:05 iphone got too popular :( Dec 17 04:23:17 it will soon be dethroned Dec 17 04:23:24 i doubt it Dec 17 04:23:31 apple just has too much of a head start Dec 17 04:23:40 more like too many fanbois, but ok ;) Dec 17 04:24:14 im sure both will have a good market cut Dec 17 04:24:29 it maybe dethroned, but honestly it won't be by the storm or g1. Dec 17 04:24:32 I, for one, have never owned an apple product, but its still everywhere. they don't say "hey do u have an mp3 player?" instead, they say "hey, do u have an ipod?" Dec 17 04:24:36 maybe the n97 Dec 17 04:24:55 and even more so that att is taking a very strong symbian postion. Dec 17 04:25:06 have you guys heard of the nokia morph? Dec 17 04:25:07 symbian is not going to dethrone anything Dec 17 04:25:13 iphone has been doing shit all in Japan. Dec 17 04:25:24 which is typically a mac friendly place. Dec 17 04:25:27 symbian is crap. Dec 17 04:26:01 I think android has more than a snowball's chance of being a successful platform long term. Dec 17 04:26:06 all Android needs is to be in a release state (was pushed too fast :P ), and a bit of momentum Dec 17 04:26:16 I mean, look how well windows mobile has done and that's total shite. Dec 17 04:26:26 if it was pushed too fast, does that mean it has too much momentum? Dec 17 04:26:26 zinx: *shrug* they needed to get it out the door. Dec 17 04:26:45 it would've been nice if they'd launched with non-htc shitware. Dec 17 04:26:47 but w/e Dec 17 04:26:48 android is doing fine Dec 17 04:26:49 JesusFreke: nah, it means companies were impatient Dec 17 04:26:50 I happen to agree, as long as android doesn't fall into the linux geek thing. Dec 17 04:27:01 JesusFreke: very different from momentum Dec 17 04:27:02 Versed: nokia is the linux geek thing. Dec 17 04:27:07 as far as their tablets/etc. Dec 17 04:27:09 get it on some more phones and some carriers picking it up Dec 17 04:27:11 zinx: pushing something gives it momentum :p Dec 17 04:27:18 if g1 had a better battery life at launch Dec 17 04:27:25 even non geeks would have minimal complaints. Dec 17 04:27:28 oh Dec 17 04:27:29 JesusFreke: but it has to be pushed by the right people.. which tends to not be the carriers ;) Dec 17 04:27:32 the thing android has to overcome is not software. Dec 17 04:27:34 and a proxied IM system like the sidekick Dec 17 04:27:34 it has to sell to them Dec 17 04:27:37 it's politics. Dec 17 04:27:38 and then android will never go away Dec 17 04:27:39 lotsa sidekick users went to g1. Dec 17 04:27:47 grey-: BUT OMG THE SCREEN CREAKS Dec 17 04:27:49 zinx: I think you're missing attempt at a joke :p Dec 17 04:27:52 zinx: lulz Dec 17 04:27:54 apple and the iphone love it or hate it, managed to hit both markets. Dec 17 04:27:55 JesusFreke: oh, probably :D Dec 17 04:27:58 what people dont realise is that it comes down to an issue of trust Dec 17 04:28:06 grey-: AND ITS SO UGLY BUT THE IPHONE IS SO PRETTY Dec 17 04:28:12 zinx: yeah... Dec 17 04:28:15 zinx that too. Dec 17 04:28:16 that'll change too. (: Dec 17 04:28:20 grey-: and why do you need a qwerty keyboard anyway?!?! it should have no buttons like the iphone!! Dec 17 04:28:24 hahaha Dec 17 04:28:25 oh man Dec 17 04:28:28 :P Dec 17 04:28:32 and on that issue android is the best the world has to offer ... and it may even improve more Dec 17 04:28:36 the number of people who hate the iphone due to no keyboard i hear no end of. Dec 17 04:28:44 zinx: i actually know some people who switched _from_ an iphone. Dec 17 04:28:52 * JesusFreke gasps Dec 17 04:28:52 zinx: and despite the cruftier hardware, are still happier. Dec 17 04:29:04 JesusFreke: it's true. Dec 17 04:29:10 grey-: oh, i think it looks fine, and i love the keyboard :) Dec 17 04:29:20 pffft: android improve? nevar! ;) Dec 17 04:29:34 sk3/2008 have better hardware builds. Dec 17 04:29:39 also don't have the screen creaking problem in any way that annoys me to the extent it seems to annoy others, even w/ a black G1 Dec 17 04:29:43 is sharp part of OHA? Dec 17 04:29:49 grey-: another thing people do not understand yet ... Dec 17 04:29:57 zinx: screen creaking is something iphone fanboys rant about. Dec 17 04:30:00 grey-: is the tenacity of open source software Dec 17 04:30:06 zinx: at least, that's the only one who seemed bugged by it to me. Dec 17 04:30:11 my screen creaks Dec 17 04:30:12 ahh, ok Dec 17 04:30:14 pffft: it's true. Dec 17 04:30:18 its a black g1 Dec 17 04:30:23 my adp1 creaks Dec 17 04:30:24 pffft: but there can be a lotta lame fanboys. Dec 17 04:30:29 pffft: we don't want the amiga effect. Dec 17 04:30:31 grey-: once android gets out on a few more devices and through a few more carriers. it will NEVER go away Dec 17 04:30:38 JesusFreke: *nod* htc has always made crap hardware, IMNSHO. Dec 17 04:30:39 not as bad as my last black G1 though Dec 17 04:30:46 JesusFreke: from a physical sense, the innards are fine. Dec 17 04:30:52 wtf is IMNSHO lol? Dec 17 04:30:53 jesusfreke, is it more gray than the black g1? Dec 17 04:30:54 pffft: *nod* Dec 17 04:30:55 wow that is extended Dec 17 04:31:01 marix: yeah Dec 17 04:31:03 Lieutenant: in my not so humble opinion Dec 17 04:31:09 in my near sighted honest opinion? Dec 17 04:31:09 <- not very humble about some opinions. Dec 17 04:31:09 oh Dec 17 04:31:11 gotcha Dec 17 04:31:11 snadge: i got around to putting a thin/short strip of electrical tape in the crack between the screen and the button block.. seems to have removed even the stuff that happened if i intentionally pressed on the screen (which is the only time it would happen) Dec 17 04:31:11 lol Dec 17 04:31:21 whats up kids Dec 17 04:31:25 * grey- has used mobile phones since the 70's. Dec 17 04:31:31 ... Dec 17 04:31:34 or at least, my dad's. ;) Dec 17 04:31:35 i'll just stick with "lol" and "wtf" Dec 17 04:31:38 heheh Dec 17 04:31:44 zinx: good idea. I was thinking about doing something similar Dec 17 04:31:54 zinx: i used an extra piece from my zagg cladding (round cutout from a button) worked great Dec 17 04:31:54 Lieutenant: but what about epic lulz?! Dec 17 04:32:05 pffft: remembers his dad's HUGE $2000 20lb "mobile phone" Dec 17 04:32:07 fwiw black electrical tape works fine as well ;) Dec 17 04:32:28 i suspect any sort of tape would work, even clear thin scotch, but i've not tested that, and it'd probably come off pretty quick Dec 17 04:32:29 zinx: maybe I'll use a bit of extra invisishield material that's leftover when I apply it to my adp1 Dec 17 04:32:44 that should hopefully do the trick Dec 17 04:32:48 JesusFreke: see above. Dec 17 04:32:50 yeah, it most likely will Dec 17 04:33:00 my g1 will do me just fine, until the next best android device comes along.. from what i've seen so far, the successors to the g1, look worse.. thats the g2 (god, why did they call it that) and the other aussie one which looks like a blackberry (spew) Dec 17 04:33:07 disconnect: oh, lol. didn't see your comment :) Dec 17 04:33:25 if the specs i saw on the G2 were right.. i won't be getting one.. looks like it's nothing more than a cheaper device Dec 17 04:33:34 * Disconnect is now known as invisible. Dec 17 04:33:35 pffft: *nod* my first phone was err... a 3w luggable. Dec 17 04:33:42 had a satchel. Dec 17 04:33:44 right.. the successors to the g1, are even cheaper, and even crappier ;) Dec 17 04:33:44 *sigh* Dec 17 04:33:51 zinx: wow. you believed that photoshopped mess? Dec 17 04:33:54 snadge: that kagan one looks nice. Dec 17 04:33:57 havn't they learnt from apple yet.. make it ridiculously expensive Dec 17 04:34:00 Disconnect: not really Dec 17 04:34:05 and thin.. really thin Dec 17 04:34:07 g2? Dec 17 04:34:10 just checking Dec 17 04:34:11 there's a g2?! Dec 17 04:34:20 haha, who the hell? Dec 17 04:34:30 no, there's no g2 Dec 17 04:34:39 phew. Dec 17 04:34:43 uhoh Dec 17 04:34:44 http://officialgosblog.blogspot.com/2008/10/tribute-to-g1-android-g2-pc.html Dec 17 04:34:47 just a bunch of people coming up with what they think the g2 might be like Dec 17 04:34:52 meh Dec 17 04:34:55 im glad it was a hoax.. because if it were for real, i'd be mad Dec 17 04:34:59 I want a samsung or sharp android Dec 17 04:35:04 they made good hardware. Dec 17 04:35:05 someone should post one w/ an iPhone pictured Dec 17 04:35:15 sharp bailed on zaurus :( Dec 17 04:35:15 zinx: android will probably get ported to iphone. ;) Dec 17 04:35:22 and rant about the new OS, and all the features like sleek design that doesn't require a keyboard Dec 17 04:35:24 Disconnect: true, but they make the hardware for the sidekick. Dec 17 04:35:33 Disconnect: and their w-zero 3 is pretty sweet looking. Dec 17 04:35:44 or was, several years ago. Dec 17 04:37:08 http://imgs.idnes.cz/mob_prakticky/A030625_RUDI_KROLLOP_MOTOROLA-DYNATAC__N.JPG Dec 17 04:37:23 pffft, get Android running on that beast yet? Dec 17 04:37:29 he he Dec 17 04:37:32 zomg pffft has insider G2 informations Dec 17 04:37:44 lol Dec 17 04:37:49 0phone: http://officialgosblog.blogspot.com/2008/10/tribute-to-g1-android-g2-pc.html Dec 17 04:37:55 back Dec 17 04:38:02 where is the qwerty t ses it has one. Dec 17 04:38:22 oh no it says no. Dec 17 04:38:23 lame. Dec 17 04:38:39 <- also not a fan of lenovo Dec 17 04:38:41 or asus. Dec 17 04:38:50 pffft: LEET Dec 17 04:39:15 pffft: actually in china, they've got lots of cell phones that -look- like that, but are teeny-tiny. Dec 17 04:39:56 maybe they got a teeny-tiny man to pose with one Dec 17 04:40:39 grey-: those were the days when your battery complaints were legit! Dec 17 04:41:04 pffft: they still are. Dec 17 04:41:10 im used to my g1's battery performance now Dec 17 04:41:13 speaking of which. Dec 17 04:41:15 but i think battery complaints then were more "my battery makes my back hurt..." Dec 17 04:41:22 has anyone tried the bigger batteries? Dec 17 04:41:26 its quite simple.. if it permanently has the screen shutoff and is locked.. it lasts for AGES Dec 17 04:41:28 zinx: I'm sayin! Dec 17 04:41:42 snadge: with my usage I get a couple days fine. Dec 17 04:41:45 <- not a talker. Dec 17 04:41:55 for sms, web browsing, etc. it's fine. Dec 17 04:41:59 yeah.. actually talking on the phone doesnt use much power Dec 17 04:42:02 but for other people... Dec 17 04:42:03 http://farm1.static.flickr.com/31/56004705_c9f53b00d5.jpg?v=0 Dec 17 04:42:08 I understand their complaints. Dec 17 04:42:16 but as soon as i start browsing the web and watching ifap etc Dec 17 04:42:18 btw (to jump back a couple hours) I have confirmation the radio.img uses a 204bit rsa key that is different from the spl key. Dec 17 04:42:24 battery is gone in like half an hour or so :P Dec 17 04:42:31 Disconnect: damn. Dec 17 04:42:50 204bit? Dec 17 04:42:54 i see.. so the radio is not modifiable then? Dec 17 04:42:56 Disconnect: so that means even with engineering bootloader/dev phone can't reflash the radio.img w/o that. Dec 17 04:42:56 2048 you mean? Dec 17 04:43:17 NO 204! ;) Dec 17 04:43:27 204! Dec 17 04:43:31 204 would be much easier to break, for sure Dec 17 04:43:45 still take AGES.. but doable Dec 17 04:44:06 I dont have the same problems with battery life: Dec 17 04:44:11 * grey- misread that as 'still take AES.. but doable' Dec 17 04:44:17 http://www.technologyreview.com/files/13384/grid_x600.jpg Dec 17 04:44:48 adp1 might be different. jf may have gotten a modified radio.img flashed Dec 17 04:44:58 Disconnect: oh? Dec 17 04:45:42 so we can make our radios transmit the lyrics to brittney spears songs in morse code, on restricted frequencies? Dec 17 04:46:04 muahahaha Dec 17 04:46:12 sounds leet. Dec 17 04:46:18 no srsly though. Dec 17 04:46:29 the msm is running OKL4 which seems kinda interesting. Dec 17 04:46:42 i can only think of devious reasons as to why you would want to modify a radio transmitter hehe Dec 17 04:46:53 snadge: then you're not thinking very hard. Dec 17 04:47:03 snadge: http://www.ettus.com/ Dec 17 04:47:06 or maybe im just too devious Dec 17 04:47:13 oh don't get me wrong. Dec 17 04:47:15 there are devious things. Dec 17 04:47:29 its like guns though, or bittorrent.. in itself isnt evil :p Dec 17 04:47:35 but they wouldn't necessarily be the most useful ones. Dec 17 04:47:38 L4 makes up a very very tiny fraction of the 41MB ram footprint of the baseband image Dec 17 04:47:45 bittorrent isn't even remotely evil. Dec 17 04:47:49 guns... Dec 17 04:47:58 well you might think of things to do with them other than shooting Dec 17 04:48:01 but I don't know what they are. Dec 17 04:48:09 collecting? Dec 17 04:48:12 shooting is fun though Dec 17 04:48:27 swetland: radio.img is only about 5MB [albeit uncompressed maybe more] Dec 17 04:48:34 snadge: it's true. Dec 17 04:48:38 shooting is fun. Dec 17 04:48:42 what's wrong with shooting targets? Dec 17 04:48:52 that aren't breathing Dec 17 04:48:54 * grey- paints a target on Adamant's forehead. Dec 17 04:49:01 Adamant: you won't be breathing much longer. ;) Dec 17 04:49:03 beat you Dec 17 04:49:04 MuHAAHAHA Dec 17 04:49:15 aww shucks. Dec 17 04:49:27 they could also have a Emotion Engine though Dec 17 04:49:33 I mean really though, there are plenty of interesting things to do with radios. Dec 17 04:49:39 HAM operators aren't terrorists, are they? Dec 17 04:49:43 or a neural net processah Dec 17 04:49:50 oooh I like those buzzwords Dec 17 04:50:03 does the g1 have blast processing? Dec 17 04:50:09 no you're right.. about that.. having said that, my interests in radio started from wanting to first buy.. then build, a high powered fm radio transmitter Dec 17 04:50:26 hmmm, high powered? Dec 17 04:50:36 grey-: some of the threats to bring down broadband over powerlines were vaguely terroristic Dec 17 04:50:37 in your pocket! Dec 17 04:50:40 works when stoned? Dec 17 04:50:43 pirate radio, android style. Dec 17 04:50:54 Adamant: haha, good point. Dec 17 04:51:01 Adamant: there are some cranks out there. Dec 17 04:51:06 like aiming high power transmitters at them to mess them up Dec 17 04:51:12 Adamant: albeit I'll side with a cranky HAM operator over the FCC any day. Dec 17 04:51:17 true Dec 17 04:54:12 so... how can i make a UI that is rotated? Dec 17 04:54:21 * wasabi playing with eclipse Dec 17 04:55:09 oh man, that was a mistake. seaghost in the shell in japanese image search came up qith a gazillion qrcodes. Dec 17 04:55:46 yeah i didnt realise how much knowledge, effort, goes into high power transmitters Dec 17 04:56:04 im talking about the 10-20kW jobs that commercial radio stations use Dec 17 04:56:40 wasabi: select 'landscape' in the xml editor. or hit kp-7 on the emulator Dec 17 04:56:41 I can only imagine. Dec 17 04:57:01 what an amazing emulator. Dec 17 04:57:03 heh Dec 17 04:57:41 trying to figure out the basics of doing a layout Dec 17 04:58:51 so i got a table layout on the view... but i cannot figure out how to make hte table layout expand horizontal to fill screen Dec 17 04:58:57 and hence it's contents to expand too Dec 17 04:59:01 a slider in col2 needs to expand. Dec 17 04:59:06 width=fill_parent Dec 17 04:59:19 but beyond that you're gonna have to fiddle with it, i'm headed to bed. Dec 17 04:59:58 night Dec 17 05:02:11 wasabi: specifically: android:width="fill_parent" Dec 17 05:02:20 hmm Dec 17 05:03:01 so i have a table row, with 3 items in it... with the center item set to fill parent Dec 17 05:03:05 and the row itself set to fill parent. Dec 17 05:03:13 the center one is not stretching out the row Dec 17 05:05:24 hi all, why does market application use so much precious primary disk space? Dec 17 05:05:54 15MB in my case Dec 17 05:08:26 delete it ;) Dec 17 05:09:21 orci: the system partition is the system partition, it's not available to user data anyway Dec 17 05:09:40 wasabi: fill_parent means "all space computed to be available by parent" Dec 17 05:10:10 morrildl, but I cannot install anymore applications Dec 17 05:10:22 wasabi: that is subtly but specifically different than HTML's notion of 100% width Dec 17 05:10:28 yeah. Dec 17 05:10:33 I'm a long time Gtk developer. Dec 17 05:10:35 Looks about the same. Dec 17 05:10:41 But I can't get it to work. ;) Dec 17 05:10:57 wasabi: try setting android:width="0px" on all 3 cells, and then usnig "android:weight" Dec 17 05:10:59 morrildl, and it looks like I cannot clear the market app data as well Dec 17 05:11:09 width 0px? that's odd Dec 17 05:11:27 wasabi: if you use android:weight, android:width is essentially discarded Dec 17 05:11:36 you can use 1px or 0px or whatever you feel like Dec 17 05:11:57 layout_? Dec 17 05:12:05 wasabi: oops, yes Dec 17 05:12:07 layout_ Dec 17 05:13:51 hmm. so... i have so mnay places to set this at. Dec 17 05:14:14 the table row, and each item Dec 17 05:14:32 weight is supposed to be set to what? Dec 17 05:17:16 man I should've started the build process to get that frigging rgb2565 before I went digging for images. Dec 17 05:17:26 that said, I think I've found and cropped something I'll use: http://flickr.com/photos/artkiver/3114479801/ Dec 17 05:22:10 or maybe this one: http://flickr.com/photos/artkiver/3114490321/ Dec 17 05:22:12 can't decide. Dec 17 05:24:00 I've having the hardest time getting view's to layout properly Dec 17 05:24:19 like when I tell it that one view is below another one, it makes it take up the entire activity screen Dec 17 05:24:23 makes no sense whatsoever Dec 17 05:26:02 z0mg Dec 17 05:26:08 is kernel.org always this slow? Dec 17 05:26:39 so annoying. Dec 17 05:26:40 damnit. Dec 17 05:26:44 why didn't I do this first. Dec 17 05:27:02 how big is the repo anyway? Dec 17 05:27:17 not that it matters, clearly if it's this slow over gigE kernel.org is the bottleneck. *sigh* Dec 17 05:29:05 android.git.kernel.org seems to be having trouble tonight, it's normally very fast. Dec 17 05:30:29 Hello Dec 17 05:32:08 Could someone help me with an issue of implementing a camera view & map on tabs. I can do either or, but not both b/c one extends Activity and the other Extends MapActivity. Dec 17 05:32:31 grey-: 1.5gb Dec 17 05:32:37 fuck me. Dec 17 05:32:51 I have it on faste if you want Dec 17 05:33:04 hehe. Dec 17 05:33:07 we'll see how this goes. Dec 17 05:33:30 and usually no kernel.org is actually gige speed Dec 17 05:33:56 nyt: you rock, sir Dec 17 05:34:33 Length: 42,923,505 [application/x-gzip] Dec 17 05:34:34 20:14:20 (38.76 MB/s) - `/dev/null' saved [42923505/42923505] Dec 17 05:34:40 WHO THE FUCK IS JACK MACKLISON Dec 17 05:34:54 from mit Dec 17 05:35:00 bparker06: clearly. ;-/ Dec 17 05:35:16 * grey- doesn't question why google doesn't host this in google code. Dec 17 05:35:18 but WHY!?~ Dec 17 05:35:23 why!? ;_; Dec 17 05:36:58 how do i setup my g1 to use wifi? Dec 17 05:37:19 so i can activate it Dec 17 05:37:34 settings > wireless settings > turn on wifi Dec 17 05:37:47 :D Dec 17 05:37:57 * dugATwork hides Dec 17 05:38:03 how do i get to settings? Dec 17 05:38:15 (i am at the part where i need to enter my google account data) Dec 17 05:38:16 pull up the menu Dec 17 05:38:20 ohh Dec 17 05:38:30 google acct first Dec 17 05:38:35 =( Dec 17 05:38:41 no joy until then Dec 17 05:38:42 I think there's a workaround to that actually. Dec 17 05:38:43 i don't have network yet.... Dec 17 05:38:54 X| Dec 17 05:39:03 IIRC there's no work arounds anymore Dec 17 05:39:10 oh? Dec 17 05:39:13 I thought there was one. Dec 17 05:39:20 also how come my google apps (chris@mydomain.tld) does not work? Dec 17 05:39:52 it should Dec 17 05:40:01 WHO THE FUCK IS JACK MACKLISON???????????/ Dec 17 05:40:01 FFForever2: dunno, mine does. Dec 17 05:40:06 but you need net access Dec 17 05:40:36 there is no way via wifi? Dec 17 05:40:44 no Dec 17 05:40:49 I thought there -was- a way. Dec 17 05:40:49 no Dec 17 05:40:53 on xda-dev recently. Dec 17 05:41:02 xda-dev? Dec 17 05:41:02 err, wait Dec 17 05:41:08 hit menu Dec 17 05:41:15 and I think there's an area to change apn's Dec 17 05:41:33 fill them in with some fake/non working stuff and it'll let you skip that IIRC Dec 17 05:41:35 yeah there is but it list tmobile apns and nothing about wifi Dec 17 05:41:43 apn.voicestream.com Dec 17 05:41:46 Gary|tp, nope =( Dec 17 05:41:48 >< Dec 17 05:41:54 no it has a list of 3g ones... Dec 17 05:42:06 write them down, change them to non-working APNs Dec 17 05:42:28 all 50 of them..... Dec 17 05:42:47 or call 8778168601 Dec 17 05:42:57 what is that number? Dec 17 05:43:08 tmo g1 tech care Dec 17 05:43:42 "you have to: Dec 17 05:43:43 1. your G1 is unlocked for sure Dec 17 05:43:43 2. have data added on your SIM Dec 17 05:43:43 3. enter safe mode (press menu when powering up all the way till standby screen appears) Dec 17 05:43:45 4. configure your network setting for your carrier Dec 17 05:43:48 5. restart, activate" Dec 17 05:43:50 herm, that's maybe not helpful. Dec 17 05:44:11 mine is not unlocked? Dec 17 05:44:18 + its a new sim Dec 17 05:44:41 is the sim provisioned for the G1? Dec 17 05:44:49 tmo sim or no? Dec 17 05:44:58 yea tmo sim Dec 17 05:45:00 bran new Dec 17 05:45:04 brand new* Dec 17 05:45:10 call that number Dec 17 05:45:14 trust me Dec 17 05:45:42 i am Dec 17 05:45:43 thxs Dec 17 05:45:45 yeah looks like even with other carriers, you need to get data working for the reg part. Dec 17 05:45:49 It hought tthere was a workaround though. Dec 17 05:45:50 damn. Dec 17 05:45:55 *flashes his T-Mobile ident badge Dec 17 05:46:00 ;) Dec 17 05:46:42 *flashes her virgin mobile id briefly before realizing how badly it sucks :p* Dec 17 05:46:58 * DarkriftX flashes the channel Dec 17 05:47:04 oops, wrong kind of flash game Dec 17 05:47:09 sparkle: hehe, one of my friends helped setup canada's virgin mobile network. Dec 17 05:47:15 * DarkriftX closes his trenchcoat up Dec 17 05:47:17 iirc he stopped working there ages ago though. Dec 17 05:48:11 can I have that link to nyt's irc client again? I want to share it with my peeps on gamesurge #g1 Dec 17 05:48:13 dugATwork: if you work at tmo do you know why there was no statement yesterday about why root is removed in rc30 (tmo replied to a few ppl that they would issue a statement on the subject on monday) Dec 17 05:48:35 basically, have you heard anything about it? Dec 17 05:48:44 darkriftx: officially I know nothing Dec 17 05:48:48 darkriftx, I heard that it's been pushed back to tomorrow Dec 17 05:48:55 figures Dec 17 05:49:02 they are trying to find a nice way to say "go fuck yourself" Dec 17 05:49:13 from dave (the original poster about that thread on xda-dev) Dec 17 05:49:36 um Dec 17 05:49:39 unofficially, I would say it was done to protect the 'less savvy' G1 users from royally screwing themselves Dec 17 05:49:42 root was removed in rc30 because it was a bug Dec 17 05:49:47 im sure tey will unlock it eventually (once other carriers put out unlocked phones they will have to keep up or be left behind) Dec 17 05:49:53 what is unclear about that exactly? Dec 17 05:50:02 im so glad i rejected that OTA update about 200 times :P Dec 17 05:50:09 local root is not a bug; echoing everything to console as root is. Dec 17 05:50:10 and then found out about JF's image Dec 17 05:50:12 no, the output of all text was the bug Dec 17 05:50:18 local root is a feature Dec 17 05:50:23 that feature wasn't included in the product Dec 17 05:50:27 * sparkle shrugs Dec 17 05:50:30 root period Dec 17 05:50:31 hehe. Dec 17 05:50:42 not the bug itself, but the bug was the only way we were able to get root access Dec 17 05:50:45 well it was included. ;) Dec 17 05:50:50 maybe not anymore. Dec 17 05:50:59 that'd be great on a spec sheet. Dec 17 05:51:00 so...that link to nyt's irc...I can has? Dec 17 05:51:05 can you imagine? Dec 17 05:51:09 linux doesnt cripple stuff for the good of the world Dec 17 05:51:16 * this product comes with local root access! Dec 17 05:51:22 sparkle: the announcement will supposedly be about the local root "feature". not about the bug that allowed us to get it in the first place Dec 17 05:51:24 there probably is an RC30 exploit that people are sitting on.. because then they'll just patch that too Dec 17 05:51:33 there should be some sort of "god mode" method to get root Dec 17 05:51:35 or hell on a cisco: * your 6509 comes with enable mode! Dec 17 05:51:38 with warnings and all that crap Dec 17 05:51:47 i.e. why they will continue to disallow local root. (or if we're really lucky, why they will allow it) Dec 17 05:51:55 snadge: hmmm only reason I'd sit on it is if i only had -one- Dec 17 05:52:06 snadge: and wanted a second to be safe as a fallback. Dec 17 05:52:22 DarkriftX: agreed. Dec 17 05:52:26 snadge: there is, but not for that reason Dec 17 05:52:30 clearly the radio firmware is still locked away. ;-/ Dec 17 05:52:49 its not released because its not 100% safe and they dont want swarms of ppl returning bricks and getting it locked down even more Dec 17 05:52:52 DarkriftX: sure it does Dec 17 05:52:59 see also: other embedded linux installs Dec 17 05:53:04 z0mg 500KB/s from kernel.org? Dec 17 05:53:07 so painful. Dec 17 05:53:25 DarkriftX: Make it something you have to do via adb Dec 17 05:53:31 painful. Dec 17 05:53:36 kids :p Dec 17 05:53:38 * DarkriftX is useless, i just collect info Dec 17 05:53:46 and have like 50 confirmations that it will void warranty Dec 17 05:53:48 i remember when all of .oz was on a single 56k satlink :p Dec 17 05:53:51 now *that* was painful Dec 17 05:53:57 i havent contributed much to anything android related other than the wiki and only partially there Dec 17 05:54:10 so im not the one to tell that Dec 17 05:54:24 sparkle: satlinks are always painful Dec 17 05:54:36 I just propagate gizmodo links on my facebook >< Dec 17 05:55:58 it seems andnav's donations have slowed down sadly Dec 17 05:56:06 sparkle: I too remember the days of 300baud, but geezus fucking christ. I pay good money for fastlinks now. Dec 17 05:56:07 i was hoping it was picking up speed and we might see something soon Dec 17 05:56:11 sparkle: or well, my company does. Dec 17 05:56:53 i blame linus torvalds personally ;) Dec 17 05:58:30 w00t Dec 17 05:58:34 I really hope htc merges the touch pro with the touch hd to make the G2 :D Dec 17 05:58:41 the market now has 130 tip calculators Dec 17 05:58:57 snadge: personally? Dec 17 05:59:04 ;) Dec 17 05:59:12 DarkriftX: 131 after I'm through tonight! Dec 17 05:59:15 muahAh Dec 17 05:59:20 lol Dec 17 05:59:34 DarkriftX: and imma add another flashlight app too. Dec 17 05:59:40 actually a tip calculator would've come in handy when i was in the USA Dec 17 05:59:54 or even better.. a tax calculator, thats even more confusing than the tipping Dec 17 05:59:55 snadge: oh, tip calculator with LOCALES. Dec 17 05:59:56 wanted: Quake 1 for G1, plzkthx Dec 17 05:59:56 snadge: just take the total, multiply by zero, and add. Dec 17 06:00:00 snadge: e.g. in japan, no tip. ;) Dec 17 06:00:18 no tip in australia either.. only third world countries have tipping Dec 17 06:00:25 heheh Dec 17 06:00:29 because their wages arn't enough to sustain their existance Dec 17 06:00:39 hey we don't have socialized health care, those waitresses need to get by on something. Dec 17 06:00:42 what about a tip calculator *with* a flashlight! Dec 17 06:00:50 dugATwork: now you're talking! Dec 17 06:01:12 call it AndG1TipFlashProBeta Dec 17 06:01:26 v.o.o5b Dec 17 06:01:29 how about a tip calculator that just does this.. "here's a tip... F*CK YOU!!" with an animated character extending their middle finger Dec 17 06:01:48 mooninites Dec 17 06:02:05 gotta use the mooninites Dec 17 06:02:23 complete with voice track Dec 17 06:02:32 doggamnit Dec 17 06:02:41 you people are going to make me create an xda-developers account. Dec 17 06:02:50 heheh Dec 17 06:03:04 join the dark side...they have cookies Dec 17 06:03:13 I DON'T WANT COOKIES. Dec 17 06:03:16 or javascript. Dec 17 06:03:17 *sigh* Dec 17 06:03:35 xda-devs pwns Dec 17 06:03:42 its pathetic that I dont know the answer to this but, can I send a message to a mailing list w/o being subscribed? Dec 17 06:03:56 been on that site for years, was a great place to tweak the hell out of my wizard Dec 17 06:03:58 depends on the mailing list. Dec 17 06:03:59 some, yes. Dec 17 06:04:01 typically, no Dec 17 06:04:30 there is no default policy huh Dec 17 06:04:45 although I *did* take out my jr college 5-campus email system with a single message Dec 17 06:05:23 (sent to the send-to-all list, explaining it's use and wide-openess) Dec 17 06:05:32 }:D Dec 17 06:05:33 hehe Dec 17 06:05:46 hax2fix Dec 17 06:06:07 caught the sysadmin with his pants down Dec 17 06:06:13 jasta: yt? Dec 17 06:06:45 oh, I also put his email addy in that message Dec 17 06:06:55 his mailbox = kaboom Dec 17 06:08:23 my network security prof gave me kudos (to the class after he had sent me home for the day for CYA purposes) Dec 17 06:10:34 done. Dec 17 06:10:36 yay. Dec 17 06:10:40 custom boot image! Dec 17 06:10:44 still... Dec 17 06:10:50 SITS THERE FOR FRIGGING EVER. Dec 17 06:10:58 but at least it's not tmobile bs. Dec 17 06:11:00 do i have to signup with a google account on my email address? Dec 17 06:11:24 or should the same login with google.com/a/domain.tld work with the g1? Dec 17 06:11:24 FFForever2: ? Dec 17 06:11:39 FFForever2: ah, if you've got a googleapps account, that should work fine. Dec 17 06:12:15 do i signin with the gmail address with the google apps or just the google apps email? Dec 17 06:12:30 just google apps email should be fine. Dec 17 06:12:33 FFF: just sign up for gmail Dec 17 06:12:37 nvm it works!!!!!!! Dec 17 06:12:40 e.g. FFForever2@superleetgmailapps.com Dec 17 06:13:01 FFForever2: it should sync all your contacts/calendar/etc. automatically too. Dec 17 06:13:18 geeze Dec 17 06:13:21 still pulling from repo Dec 17 06:13:38 thanks to whoever did the fastboot binary build for osx. Dec 17 06:13:48 hey how does this my maps app work Dec 17 06:14:02 wow Dec 17 06:14:07 i want to place a marker with an addy how do i do that Dec 17 06:14:07 it's after 10 and I haven't eaten yet. Dec 17 06:14:12 rc30 =( Dec 17 06:14:23 and all I accomplished hacking-wise was put on a custom bootloader screen. Dec 17 06:14:34 I think this may be close to the most time spent for least accomplished ever. Dec 17 06:14:53 especially since I'm rarely booting/rebooting my phone (thank god) Dec 17 06:15:35 -> afk Dec 17 06:18:41 I lied. Dec 17 06:18:43 what is the name of the media player for the g1? Dec 17 06:18:53 Disconnect: what's an unsigned nbh file for? Dec 17 06:18:58 and dugATwork THANKS for the number =) Dec 17 06:19:27 FFForever2: Music Dec 17 06:19:34 FFForever2: there's also a video player in the marketplace. Dec 17 06:19:47 a couple even, I think Dec 17 06:19:50 i need both =) Dec 17 06:20:05 well now that you've got an activated one Dec 17 06:20:08 bah!!!! Dec 17 06:20:12 fire up the wifi and check out the market. Dec 17 06:20:16 edge is FASTER then my dsl at home lol Dec 17 06:20:22 hahaha Dec 17 06:20:26 that's sad. :( Dec 17 06:20:32 XD Dec 17 06:20:37 ok, I think I leave for reals now. Dec 17 06:20:45 * grey- debates going to noisebridge or just home. Dec 17 06:20:57 lol Dec 17 06:21:15 its cool though i have wifi XD Dec 17 06:21:28 10mps across the street XD Dec 17 06:21:35 ;) Dec 17 06:21:44 laptop loves it XD Dec 17 06:24:08 i have a 1gb sd card =) Dec 17 06:24:11 =(*** Dec 17 06:24:17 gotta wait for 8gb to come in the mail.... Dec 17 06:24:36 1GB will go a long way. Dec 17 06:25:00 not when you are me XD Dec 17 06:25:08 * JesusFreke imagines a stack of almost 1000 floppy disks Dec 17 06:25:23 JesusFreke: that's a lotta 4K demos! Dec 17 06:25:36 JesusFreke: bah, you assume 1.44MB floppies... Dec 17 06:25:40 heck, 64K if we're getting bloated. Dec 17 06:25:54 think of 360kB ones (I'm not old enough to remember smaller) Dec 17 06:26:01 sorry, I just barely caught the tail end of 5.25 floppies :p Dec 17 06:26:06 no 8" floppies? Dec 17 06:26:10 ok Dec 17 06:26:14 dinner, for reals. Dec 17 06:30:01 i received my g1 :) Dec 17 06:30:14 it *truely* rocks! Dec 17 06:30:39 root it fast Dec 17 06:30:43 if you can Dec 17 06:31:02 to test, type reboot Dec 17 06:31:34 hmm sorry it's a dev phone Dec 17 06:31:40 ahhh, nice Dec 17 06:31:46 then you received the adp1 ;) Dec 17 06:31:55 DarkriftX, doesn't an update erase what you did? Dec 17 06:31:58 yes :) Dec 17 06:32:01 ? Dec 17 06:32:09 elaborate that question please Dec 17 06:32:14 i have a g1 .. maybe one day, i'll be able to sell it as a collectors item Dec 17 06:32:30 you root it and then a system update comes and then?... Dec 17 06:32:33 to get root you just need to type "su" and that's cool :) Dec 17 06:32:36 you are fucked Dec 17 06:32:43 unless you update to modified rc30 Dec 17 06:32:55 alexissoft: thats how g1's should be Dec 17 06:33:03 you root it.. then install a hacked firmware that doesnt download new updates ;) Dec 17 06:33:08 DarkriftX: yes i agree Dec 17 06:33:16 thats how tmo should have done it Dec 17 06:33:18 snadge, ah i see Dec 17 06:33:29 android-dls.com/wiki has all the steps Dec 17 06:33:34 like JF's modified RC8 or RC30.. yah Dec 17 06:33:37 see "rooting android" then see "keeping root" Dec 17 06:33:49 those 2 pages will get you root you can keep Dec 17 06:33:51 DarkriftX: telcos vision of business was always strange ... Dec 17 06:34:12 has always been* Dec 17 06:34:12 i wish i could return mine and get an adp1 Dec 17 06:34:17 if everyone did tmo might learn a lesson Dec 17 06:34:18 :) Dec 17 06:34:20 is dialer app eqqual as any other app or is it a bit more equal? Dec 17 06:34:36 once again: What?? Dec 17 06:35:04 android motto every app is equa, right? Dec 17 06:35:24 kinda Dec 17 06:35:29 is dialer a bit more equal was my question Dec 17 06:35:37 equal means the same Dec 17 06:35:48 so you are asking: is dialer the same or more the same than other apps Dec 17 06:35:51 I was thinking same quanta time Dec 17 06:36:13 DarkriftX, what does equal mean? Dec 17 06:36:25 equivalent Dec 17 06:36:36 DarkriftX, hehe sorry what does the same mean Dec 17 06:36:46 rough definition = same Dec 17 06:36:50 1 is the same as 1 Dec 17 06:36:53 1 equals 1 Dec 17 06:36:59 2 and 2 are the same as 4 Dec 17 06:37:04 2 + 2 equals 4 Dec 17 06:37:21 when I heard that i thought cpu would be allocating equal system resources to each app Dec 17 06:37:35 no Dec 17 06:37:36 sorry s\cpu\os Dec 17 06:37:51 they mean same as in certain apps arent more or less replaceable than others Dec 17 06:38:14 thats a load of crap though ;) .. you cant replace "MyFaves" Dec 17 06:38:15 but i dont think it made it to that point yet Dec 17 06:38:17 equality is, mathematically, reflexive, transitive and symetrical :p Dec 17 06:38:58 orci: funny pun, through, but i don't know Dec 17 06:39:14 i don't think they had a special case for dialer Dec 17 06:39:21 have* Dec 17 06:39:35 google did say hte dialer specifically Dec 17 06:41:04 how do i use my phone to get directions? Dec 17 06:41:17 bepst Dec 17 06:41:19 er Dec 17 06:41:23 maps Dec 17 06:41:30 maps, but its pretty raw right now Dec 17 06:41:47 maps has a zoom in/out option that is all =( Dec 17 06:41:51 heh Dec 17 06:41:52 gps is for lazy people Dec 17 06:41:52 basically Dec 17 06:42:07 any leads as to when next major android update is coming? Dec 17 06:42:16 sometime in the next year or so Dec 17 06:42:44 u just never know when u will need gps.... Dec 17 06:42:45 FFF: unlock the power of your mind by reading the manual and experimenting with the menu button ;) Dec 17 06:43:08 the plan is to use 2.6.27 isn't it? can't you follow the git log and see where that's going? Dec 17 06:43:25 if I'm *that* lost, f*ck it, I'll figure something out Dec 17 06:44:34 tmzt_: there's some work to move toward 2.6.27 indeed. Dec 17 06:44:48 (there's some work going on, that is) Dec 17 06:44:54 I used to work at a hotel that defied gps Dec 17 06:45:36 ppl would call for the address, ignore my suggestion to let me give them directions Dec 17 06:45:55 an hour later they'd call back in Dec 17 06:46:24 "WHERE THE HELL ARE YOU LOCATED?!,!?! Dec 17 06:47:06 that is, of course, the reason why you need street view. Dec 17 06:47:13 the smugness once they arrived was completely gratifying Dec 17 06:48:16 google maps on winmo is superior to the one on android.. why? :P Dec 17 06:48:33 my location cannot be determined LMAO!!! Dec 17 06:48:45 my mates tytn ii, the map will actually SCROLL with the blue dot Dec 17 06:48:57 on android, you have to wait for the dot to go offscreen.. then it will pan Dec 17 06:49:04 mine doesnt Dec 17 06:49:22 I suspect that the maps team had more time to work on the winmo version than on the android version Dec 17 06:49:23 if it gets about 20% from the edge of the screen it scrolls Dec 17 06:49:46 what is the big blue circle? Dec 17 06:49:53 where i can be? Dec 17 06:49:55 thats where you might be Dec 17 06:50:03 depending on how accurate it thinks its location signal is Dec 17 06:50:05 FFForever2: yes, that's the location uncertainty. Dec 17 06:50:13 =( Dec 17 06:50:25 with gps enabled, that circle disappears pretty much Dec 17 06:51:19 how do i find out if gps is enabled? Dec 17 06:51:29 gps icon in status bar Dec 17 06:51:37 you should see a satellite thing up the top.. flashing, if it doesnt have a lock.. and solid if it does Dec 17 06:52:39 another thing.. whatever happened to cell tower info? i remember all my old phones.. used to tell me where i was, from the tower.. eg, what suburb you were in or whatever Dec 17 06:52:55 no phones appear to do that anymore? Dec 17 06:52:56 that works also Dec 17 06:53:10 now my phone just says "Optus" or whatever provider im on Dec 17 06:53:12 i think your g1 is broken lol Dec 17 06:54:20 where is that info normally on a g1? the lock screen? Dec 17 06:55:16 do you really not know where you are? Dec 17 06:55:19 * sparkle ponders Dec 17 06:55:40 no, im just curious about a feature that appears to no longer exist :P Dec 17 06:56:00 something that the majority of my older phones did.. but i havnt seen any new ones do Dec 17 06:56:01 if gps is disabled your info shows proximity to certain towers Dec 17 06:56:14 right, but it doesnt tell you the name of that tower Dec 17 06:56:20 :S Dec 17 06:56:32 there are some apps on the market that will tell you tower info if oyu want Dec 17 06:57:04 also.. why does my uptime say 341526:55:48 ? thats so obviously wrong ;) Dec 17 06:57:13 its a bug Dec 17 06:57:30 is that a bug in JF's image.. or not related to that Dec 17 06:57:38 i dont think so Dec 17 06:57:42 i think its an rc30 thing period Dec 17 06:57:49 well im on RC8 .. but yeah Dec 17 06:57:58 it used to work fine on my original RC28 Dec 17 06:57:59 rc anything that has the root bug patched Dec 17 06:58:11 there, generalized Dec 17 06:58:29 so even the official RC30 does it? Dec 17 06:58:36 i *think* so Dec 17 06:58:49 it also seem not everyone is affected by it (based on xda-devs comments) Dec 17 06:58:54 you're not going to be silly enough to try the official rc30 are you ;) Dec 17 06:59:15 i can Dec 17 06:59:16 bbl...peace out Dec 17 06:59:17 altho with the engineering bootloader.. you safely can right? Dec 17 06:59:27 without losing root that is Dec 17 06:59:29 i dont have eng bootloader Dec 17 06:59:35 but i still have a method to get back :) Dec 17 06:59:41 recovery image? Dec 17 06:59:44 speaking of Dec 17 06:59:51 i need to install the enginerring bootloadre Dec 17 06:59:56 ouch, fingers got all confused Dec 17 07:00:24 is it possible to run android on g1 without a sim card? Dec 17 07:00:33 after you register it, yes Dec 17 07:05:03 DarkriftX, thanks Dec 17 07:05:29 np Dec 17 07:05:39 DarkriftX, "being more equal than others" was an analogy to George Orwell Dec 17 07:05:59 i c Dec 17 07:06:56 * DarkriftX goes off to look for the eng bootloader Dec 17 07:08:23 its on the gotinternet site Dec 17 07:08:38 http://www.gotontheinter.net/bootloader Dec 17 07:10:38 so just rename update.zip and go to recovery? Dec 17 07:11:53 shouldnt i be able to do it via command line? Dec 17 07:12:00 yes! finally Dec 17 07:12:11 got busybox to build against uclibc Dec 17 07:12:14 w00t Dec 17 07:12:15 nice Dec 17 07:12:21 700kb :) Dec 17 07:12:25 nice Dec 17 07:12:25 JesusFreke: Cool Dec 17 07:12:40 JesusFreke: you going to pack that in to your next update? Dec 17 07:12:44 yep Dec 17 07:12:50 cool Dec 17 07:13:13 JesusFreke: can i flash the eng bootloaders spl.bin via command line instead of recovery? Dec 17 07:13:22 write_hboot_image PACKAGE:spl.bin (from the update script) Dec 17 07:13:23 not easily Dec 17 07:13:25 oh Dec 17 07:13:36 so just apply it like i would an OTA update? Dec 17 07:13:38 write_hboot_image is a command in the recovery binary Dec 17 07:13:42 just use recovery :P Dec 17 07:13:47 it's not a separate binary you can run Dec 17 07:14:10 although I guess you could probably extract that code and compile it into a separate utility :p Dec 17 07:14:21 but yeah, just name it update.zip and apply it in recovery mode Dec 17 07:15:26 and be sure to yank out the battery in the middle of the update. I've heard it opens a special easter egg on the phone.. Dec 17 07:15:31 something to do with a brick or something Dec 17 07:16:56 you know you could probably extract it Dec 17 07:16:56 but Dec 17 07:17:25 if there was ever any circumstance where you'd really, really, really want to be sure the handset was in a "known clean" state and freshly started Dec 17 07:17:28 this is it :p Dec 17 07:17:43 yep. :) Dec 17 07:17:56 I wasn't seriously suggesting extracting that code Dec 17 07:18:05 hah yeah Dec 17 07:18:40 i dont really understand much about this recovery image.. that you hold home or whatever when its booting up..my understanding is, i've put a modified recovery image on my phone already.. thats how come i could flash whatever update.zip i wanted to Dec 17 07:18:41 so when are you going to hook me up with some cpu scaling goodness :D Dec 17 07:18:50 oh hang on Dec 17 07:18:51 1sec Dec 17 07:19:15 did the phone come with a recovery image already? how was it modified Dec 17 07:19:59 snadge the basic modification is to change the recovery image so that it uses a different set of keys to sign/check the updates Dec 17 07:20:12 snadge: so that we can sign our own updates and apply them Dec 17 07:20:30 snadge: plus, I added some nifty features to it. like being able to run adb shell while in recovery mode Dec 17 07:21:21 snadge: plus.. there will be a bit of a surprise waiting in the next version of the recovery image :D Dec 17 07:21:34 JesusFreke: Goatse? Dec 17 07:21:45 Rye... shhhhh Dec 17 07:21:56 Oh. Goatse only on failed sig check... right Dec 17 07:22:55 lol!! yes! i finally figured out what to change my bootup "t-mobile g1" logo to Dec 17 07:23:07 rofl snadge Dec 17 07:23:19 then send it back to t-mobile.. and say theres something wrong with my phone Dec 17 07:23:20 hahahaha Dec 17 07:23:34 yeah, ryebrye suggested I do that when I returned my G1. lol Dec 17 07:23:53 I think rye has a secret fascination for goatse Dec 17 07:24:09 I was the one holding the camera Dec 17 07:24:16 you were the giver hehe Dec 17 07:24:27 or maybe you were the one at the other end of the camera :p Dec 17 07:24:36 * RyeBrye has actually never seen the actual goatse... and would like to keep it that way Dec 17 07:24:53 you mean hello.jpg? Dec 17 07:24:58 the one and only original? Dec 17 07:25:01 :) Dec 17 07:25:22 for flashing that t-moble G1 bootloader image, I posted a simple shell script to do it all for you if you have teh tools installed Dec 17 07:25:31 the image is burned into my brain.. thousands of years.. aliens could discover the fossilised remains of my brain.. and find the goatse image Dec 17 07:26:59 and what a sad indictment on our society it would be Dec 17 07:27:40 http://android-dls.com/wiki/index.php?title=Engineering_Bootloader Dec 17 07:27:44 look correct anyone? Dec 17 07:29:22 I added the confirm step to it Dec 17 07:29:25 but yeah, looks right Dec 17 07:30:30 cool Dec 17 07:30:40 is there a way to root an rc30 phone yet? Dec 17 07:31:44 i fucking hate the default terminal Dec 17 07:31:47 up/down doesnt work Dec 17 07:31:54 gambler: yep. it was announced about a week and a half ago Dec 17 07:32:04 JesusFreke, linky? Dec 17 07:32:11 gambler: sell the RC30 G1 and buy an ADP :p Dec 17 07:32:31 i put one of them on ebay but I didnt get any bites Dec 17 07:32:58 cheapo aussies Dec 17 07:33:02 why doesnt busybox wget work? Dec 17 07:33:29 darkriftx: something to do with dns resolution, I think. ping doesn't work either Dec 17 07:33:33 everything is "bad address" Dec 17 07:33:36 oh :( Dec 17 07:33:52 so what can you do with the original boot loader? i got the tri color bar thing to come up Dec 17 07:34:07 snadge: look at it. that's about it Dec 17 07:34:18 it says Serial0 .. thats very exciting Dec 17 07:34:21 you can press camera and then back and then camera nad then back Dec 17 07:34:27 it causes a refresh Dec 17 07:34:34 it's quite exciting really Dec 17 07:34:44 * JesusFreke raises his hands in the air and says "weeee!" Dec 17 07:35:13 if you had a signed nbh image named DreaIMG.nbh on the sdcard, you could apply that Dec 17 07:35:13 ok now how do i reboot :P Dec 17 07:35:21 send + menu + power Dec 17 07:35:47 so yet another way of flashing.. interesting Dec 17 07:36:03 yeah, another way that is completely locked down too. Dec 17 07:36:12 so doesn't exactly help us much :) Dec 17 07:36:23 well all you need is a signed nbh file.. everyone has one of those ;) Dec 17 07:36:27 unless a signed nbh gets leaked somehow Dec 17 07:36:43 why do i feel like i'm in a bad film noir Dec 17 07:36:45 that wont give us the key though, unless we were to brute force it Dec 17 07:36:46 but I don't see that happening in the near future :/ Dec 17 07:36:47 people standing in shadows Dec 17 07:36:49 * sparkle laughs Dec 17 07:37:19 deep boot Dec 17 07:37:26 dollar if someone steals t-mo's keys Dec 17 07:37:27 * JesusFreke turns sideways and disappears behind a really skinny lamppost Dec 17 07:37:27 how does shazam work? Dec 17 07:37:49 FFForever2: magic Dec 17 07:38:01 .... Dec 17 07:38:20 hmm.. that would be a way to get root on post rc30 images.. install an update thats been hacked, but signed with the legit tmo key Dec 17 07:38:25 old magic... from before the start of recorded history Dec 17 07:38:28 FFForever2: i worked on something similar years ago Dec 17 07:38:31 snadge: and impossible. Dec 17 07:38:42 for a .com that died in 2001 Dec 17 07:38:43 and it would be googles key, not t-mobiles Dec 17 07:38:47 why impossible gary? Dec 17 07:39:15 * sparkle does ten impossible things before breakfast Dec 17 07:39:21 a key is only as secure as the person or people who protect it Dec 17 07:39:26 XD Dec 17 07:40:08 mm that's true, I remember when googles page rank algorithm got leaked Dec 17 07:40:10 oh wait... Dec 17 07:41:03 oh well, at least their AdSense view/click ratio got leaked. Dec 17 07:41:05 oh wait... Dec 17 07:41:15 WELL AT LEAST THEIR SEARCH SOURCE WAS LEAKED. Dec 17 07:41:17 oh wait! Dec 17 07:41:29 ur weird =P Dec 17 07:41:41 * sparkle chuckles Dec 17 07:41:45 all of those are moving targets Dec 17 07:41:56 gary: I heard that their code for android was leaked :p Dec 17 07:42:02 pagerank has been excessively tuned but the basic ideas are very much out there Dec 17 07:42:02 but Dec 17 07:42:08 JesusFreke: Leaked... OR STOLEN? Dec 17 07:42:08 leak a crypto key once Dec 17 07:42:11 or the right signed image Dec 17 07:42:13 * Gary|tp calls NSA. Dec 17 07:42:28 * sparkle forwards Gary|tp to homeland security Dec 17 07:42:35 it's kinda funny Dec 17 07:42:51 more antiterrorist dollars per capita go to wyoming than any other state Dec 17 07:43:02 That is true, sparkle Dec 17 07:43:03 makes you wonder how many terr'rist camps they have breeding up in the hills Dec 17 07:43:11 but I can't think of one thing in google that got leaked Dec 17 07:43:20 JesusFreke or RyeBrye does the recovery at least verify the bin is correct? Dec 17 07:43:24 I could see HTC's key getting leaked, maybe even tmobile if they have access to it Dec 17 07:43:30 (downloaded it with droidftp and im not sure about it lol) Dec 17 07:43:43 darkriftx: it verifies that it matches the signature when the update was created Dec 17 07:44:00 s/signature/sha1 hash/ Dec 17 07:44:01 He means to make sure that it downloaded okay. Dec 17 07:44:08 immma check md5 Dec 17 07:44:19 But yes, the installer will check signature/checksums Dec 17 07:44:24 if it didn't download ok, then the hash wouldn't match and it wouldn't apply Dec 17 07:44:28 it won't even install if it doesn't match signature Dec 17 07:44:39 couldnt some hardware genius come up with a way to disable to bootloader signing check? Dec 17 07:44:40 oh, i c Dec 17 07:44:45 i thought the signatures were disabled on it Dec 17 07:45:00 s/to/the Dec 17 07:45:04 gambler: we have. we just can't flash that bootloader onto non-rooted G1s Dec 17 07:45:50 DarkriftX: no, it still checks signatures for nbh updates. it's fastboot that let's you flash unsigned images Dec 17 07:45:54 JesusFreke: *opens up his G1* Dec 17 07:45:56 THERE YA GO Dec 17 07:46:07 JesusFreke, right. Well I was wondering if there was a way to bypass it physically - even on non-rooted G1s Dec 17 07:46:33 physically? sure. desolder the flash chip and reflash it :) Dec 17 07:46:46 if there's a jtag header handy you can get in there somehow Dec 17 07:46:50 There's some korean hacker that unlocks 3G iPhones by desoldering and reflashing baseband chip Dec 17 07:46:55 for like $70 USD Dec 17 07:46:59 yep, seen than gary :) Dec 17 07:47:02 pretty cool Dec 17 07:47:17 I need a little korean... Dec 17 07:47:52 best part is, if you upgrade to 2.2 it reflashes over it Dec 17 07:48:00 so you have to pay another $50 to get it done again Dec 17 07:48:35 oh shit Dec 17 07:48:44 i hit back button right as the actual flash was happening Dec 17 07:48:49 and it seemed to dissapear really fast Dec 17 07:48:57 like the button press did it Dec 17 07:49:11 darkriftx: probably coincidence. the flash goes pretty quick Dec 17 07:49:19 whew Dec 17 07:49:22 darkriftx: you'll know soon enough :) Dec 17 07:50:33 whats up kids Dec 17 07:50:39 WHO THE FUCK IS JACK MACKLISON Dec 17 07:52:09 JesusFreke: I'm just shocked he hasn't bricked a phone yet Dec 17 07:52:15 out of hundreds Dec 17 07:52:20 prolly ha Dec 17 07:52:21 has Dec 17 07:52:41 ok, now i need the fastboot binary Dec 17 07:52:56 Krstnsn: He hasn't. Dec 17 07:53:05 He even offers to buy a brand new phone if he does. Dec 17 07:53:08 hes korean Dec 17 07:53:18 nimble fingers Dec 17 07:53:33 I think he said he bricked 1 or 2 when first perfecting the process Dec 17 07:53:39 hehe im listening to a cassette tape in my car Dec 17 07:53:46 thats so 80s Dec 17 07:53:46 haha Dec 17 07:53:50 nice snadge Dec 17 07:53:50 what's one of them? Dec 17 07:53:53 nvm Dec 17 07:53:58 forgot i already built the source :S Dec 17 07:54:17 i still only have tape decks in both cars :p Dec 17 07:54:23 LOL Dec 17 07:54:28 how old are your cars? Dec 17 07:54:44 hm Dec 17 07:54:47 '98 and '00? Dec 17 07:54:51 wtf Dec 17 07:54:58 likes kia? or hyundia? Dec 17 07:55:08 doesn't matter too much, i'm almost always on a conf bridge anyways :p Dec 17 07:55:19 a windstar and a toyota :p Dec 17 07:55:24 IIRC those were his own, JesusFreke Dec 17 07:55:25 thats crazy Dec 17 07:55:38 nah Dec 17 07:55:41 the toyota's even a stick Dec 17 07:55:45 i know that's so unamerican :p Dec 17 07:55:55 its hard to drive stick shift and type on a g1 at same time Dec 17 07:56:10 how do you escape from the bootloaders clutches? Dec 17 07:56:12 s/hard/stupid/g Dec 17 07:56:21 gary|tp: yes, they were Dec 17 07:56:31 in heaqvy traffic too Dec 17 07:56:41 * JesusFreke loved his 6 speed Dec 17 07:56:42 it's not that bad Dec 17 07:56:45 loves* Dec 17 07:56:55 my binder was a 10sp dual stick Dec 17 07:57:01 now that was a pain to drive with a heavy load Dec 17 07:57:28 dual stick? sorta like the 2 gear thingies on 10sp bikes? Dec 17 07:57:50 1 to switch between the high and low 5 gears? Dec 17 07:57:57 * sparkle nods Dec 17 07:58:07 wow. never heard of that Dec 17 07:58:15 only you really needed both hands to shift Dec 17 07:58:21 so you ended up with one arm through the steering wheel Dec 17 07:58:24 5->6 must be a pain :) Dec 17 07:58:49 heh Dec 17 07:58:51 ok, my g1 is now fully hax0riz3d Dec 17 07:58:53 wtf is a binder? Dec 17 07:58:57 modified everything ' Dec 17 07:59:37 spikebike: international harvester Dec 17 07:59:47 my old truck Dec 17 07:59:58 spikebike: it's an IPC thing, I think Dec 17 08:00:12 but in android context Dec 17 08:00:12 yeah Dec 17 08:00:13 :) Dec 17 08:00:49 can someone here please write a damned file manager that takes advantage of root (if needed) to show system folders? Dec 17 08:00:50 everytme I try to start codign I end up playing spiral defense Dec 17 08:01:00 im so tired of all these filemanagers that show sdcard only Dec 17 08:01:08 lol spikebike that game rox Dec 17 08:01:12 if only it had better controls Dec 17 08:01:18 it's kinda hypnotizing Dec 17 08:01:19 upgrading is HARD with those tiny lines Dec 17 08:01:30 yeah they should split that row in 1/3rds Dec 17 08:01:33 i gave him a 5 star anyways Dec 17 08:01:37 DarkriftX: you'd really need to have an agent running as root separately Dec 17 08:01:40 great game, just needs help Dec 17 08:01:58 horizontally and use the entire area instead of splitting it into 3 horizontal rows that are smaller than a finger Dec 17 08:02:09 sparkle: i just want to be able to see/modify files/folders that i can from command line Dec 17 08:02:24 yeah Dec 17 08:02:26 i don't know if i'd trust the gui for a lot of that Dec 17 08:02:31 it's too easy to fat-finger something Dec 17 08:02:32 ...literally Dec 17 08:02:44 well i mostly mean for browsing/viewing Dec 17 08:02:47 not much deleting etc Dec 17 08:02:55 * sparkle nods Dec 17 08:02:57 but that should be an option with "are you sure?" "really?" Dec 17 08:03:02 hm Dec 17 08:03:19 browsing with the built in kb is kinda hard via terminal Dec 17 08:03:25 there's a web version btw Dec 17 08:03:29 the /'s are hard Dec 17 08:03:43 spikebike: ive played tower defense a few times and love it (i kinda suck at it though) Dec 17 08:03:48 but spiral defense is nice Dec 17 08:03:54 needs more spots for towers though Dec 17 08:03:57 that's why i usually use connectbot to connect to sshd locally Dec 17 08:04:05 ahhhh Dec 17 08:04:05 easier to type and better font selection Dec 17 08:04:09 i dont have sshd lol Dec 17 08:04:14 but i do hjave it compiled Dec 17 08:04:37 or no i dont :( Dec 17 08:04:46 thats ssh :( Dec 17 08:05:28 i never figured out a more permanent method of using debian Dec 17 08:05:41 i need an sh script or something that will reload everything Dec 17 08:05:50 the web version has more spots for towers Dec 17 08:06:01 fo sho Dec 17 08:06:10 WHOA Dec 17 08:06:28 i got very good at what i call the app drawer "wheel of fortune" lately Dec 17 08:06:45 slamming the drawer down and stopping it at just the right spot for hte app i want Dec 17 08:06:58 well, i just rebooted and that messed up the speed a lot, so now its instant bottom of the list Dec 17 08:07:40 but of course things don't get faster when you reboot... because that would imply they get slower when the system has been running for a while Dec 17 08:13:29 i have to give you props DarkriftX your wiki is coming along nicely. Dec 17 08:17:15 i deserve about 5% of the credit :) Dec 17 08:17:40 bgupta did almost all of the faq Dec 17 08:18:01 ive done a few pages, but all ive done is rephrase what i find on forums form ppl like JesusFreke Dec 17 08:18:03 guys, question, when you've built binaries for the G1, where do you store them? Dec 17 08:18:19 speaking of, JesusFreke can i get a copy of your busybox? Dec 17 08:18:21 I started putting mine in /data/local/bin, but what do other people use? Dec 17 08:18:40 darkriftx: gimme a bit. I'm recompiling it Dec 17 08:18:45 * DarkriftX had codeine cough syrup a few mins ago and i feel like im slipping away Dec 17 08:18:50 ok Dec 17 08:19:03 huge grin i cant get rid of Dec 17 08:19:17 darkriftx: I didn't pay much attention to the options when I built it, I was just trying to get it built first :) Dec 17 08:19:22 lol Dec 17 08:19:27 I'm going through the options now, and will recompile Dec 17 08:20:23 * Foxdie awaits eagerly :) Dec 17 08:24:42 there is an app i have on my kubuntu laptop that takes any commmand that doesnt exist and tells you how to get it (xxx does not exist, run "apt-get install xxx" to install it) Dec 17 08:24:47 we need something like that for busybox Dec 17 08:24:55 if the app isnt found, it tries busybox Dec 17 08:27:32 uh.. Dec 17 08:27:33 no Dec 17 08:27:57 just make the correct links and all's well Dec 17 08:30:07 there are hundreds of commands for busybox, that would take a lot of time or a well written script, and I have neither Dec 17 08:30:25 i tried to write the script and couldnt figure out how to remove the comma from each command name Dec 17 08:30:47 doesn't busybox do it itself? Dec 17 08:30:56 if you run busybox sh it does Dec 17 08:31:10 but certain things do not work in busybox sh Dec 17 08:31:11 or --install? Dec 17 08:31:22 hrmmmm, didnt know about that Dec 17 08:32:04 lol Dec 17 08:32:05 try it :S Dec 17 08:32:13 is there an automated security update procedure for rooted androids? Dec 17 08:32:19 i guess its just missing /usr/bin and some other folders Dec 17 08:32:31 so it's compiled with the wrong paths? Dec 17 08:32:39 maybe Dec 17 08:32:45 i dont know :S Dec 17 08:33:02 sounds like it Dec 17 08:33:18 JesusFreke: can you look into that part? Dec 17 08:33:28 busybox: /usr/bin/yes: No such file or directory Dec 17 08:33:28 busybox: /bin/zcat: No such file or directory Dec 17 08:33:28 busybox: /sbin/zcip: Invalid cross-device link Dec 17 08:33:35 example of some of the hundreds of errors Dec 17 08:35:16 yeah, that's what I'm looking at right now Dec 17 08:35:22 where should it install the links? Dec 17 08:35:31 /system/bin Dec 17 08:35:33 i would imagine Dec 17 08:35:42 but that would wipe out some of the existing stuff Dec 17 08:36:19 somewhere in data? Dec 17 08:37:03 But I want to install the links by default when an update is applied Dec 17 08:37:16 and I don't want to use /data for something in an update Dec 17 08:37:24 because it would be lost with a wipe Dec 17 08:37:42 I'm thinking maybe just making another folder in system Dec 17 08:37:48 or maybe a subfolder of /system/bin Dec 17 08:37:55 and adding it to the end of the path Dec 17 08:37:58 would require to remount /system though wouldnt it? Dec 17 08:38:35 darkriftx: that's why I want to install it during the update Dec 17 08:39:00 hmm Dec 17 08:41:18 hmm, anyone seen any batteries for the G1 out there with a capacity greater than 2200mAh? Dec 17 08:41:35 2200mAh is pretty dense for the size of the battery Dec 17 08:42:03 where's a 2200mAh one? Dec 17 08:42:14 JF, problem is that /system has limited space as you already know, /data has lots of free space Dec 17 08:42:26 its all symlinks Dec 17 08:42:28 no space needed Dec 17 08:42:44 * Foxdie wishes that mtd3-5 could be all merged into one large partition Dec 17 08:42:56 or at least merge /cache and /system Dec 17 08:43:01 have yet to see /cache used for anything Dec 17 08:43:03 didnt i read that /cache is not even used? Dec 17 08:43:16 foxdie: symlinks don't take up much space :p Dec 17 08:43:18 cant we shrink that, make a new partition thats auto mounted? Dec 17 08:43:33 true but where are you going to put the busybox binary? ;) Dec 17 08:43:40 make cache like 10mb instead of 70 something Dec 17 08:43:47 Foxdie: its already in system Dec 17 08:43:50 I'm definitely not putting it in data Dec 17 08:43:56 its about 2mb, his new one is half a meg Dec 17 08:43:58 don't want to lose it on a wipe :) Dec 17 08:44:10 ahh, you're thinking of putting busybox in every update.. ooh :) Dec 17 08:44:18 foxdie: it already is :p Dec 17 08:44:19 its already in there Dec 17 08:44:30 wasn't there on mine *scratches head* Dec 17 08:44:40 when I flashed RC8 that is Dec 17 08:44:46 or am I missing a page of the book? Dec 17 08:44:53 yes Dec 17 08:44:56 in terminal, type busybox Dec 17 08:44:58 and poof Dec 17 08:45:09 busybox and poof? Dec 17 08:45:14 it wasn't there when I first got my G1 Dec 17 08:45:28 foxdie, it (probably) wasn't in my original RC8, but it was definitely in v1.2 Dec 17 08:45:45 understood :) Dec 17 08:45:52 don't remember for sure if I included it in the original or not Dec 17 08:56:31 JF, you know of a tutorial explaining the steps to correct the fubar whatshisfaces Shell app created with your 1.1 RC30? Dec 17 08:59:42 languish: easiest method: re-install RC30 1.1 or1.2 Dec 17 09:03:34 my PC won't boot overclocked anymore Dec 17 09:03:42 fails before post everytime Dec 17 09:03:51 seriously pissingme off Dec 17 09:04:01 it's ran 333x9 on stock voltages for months Dec 17 09:04:59 my second attempt at busybox was like 1.1mb, so I'll worry about tweaking the options later Dec 17 09:05:07 here's the 700kb binary Dec 17 09:05:21 http://www.jesusfreke.com/busybox.tar.gz Dec 17 09:10:29 Gary|tp Dec 17 09:10:35 2 factors Dec 17 09:11:06 1. capacitors (on both the motherboard AND the power supplys PCB) lose their ability to hold the same amount of charge over time Dec 17 09:11:29 2. keeping your cpu overclocked for extended periods of time slowly wears it out anyway Dec 17 09:11:53 to counteract this, you usually have to keep slowly increasing the voltage over time, but naturally that increases heat / wear, which accelerates the whole process further Dec 17 09:12:07 its a logarhythmic curve Dec 17 09:13:54 try replacing your power supply first Dec 17 09:14:19 or turn off the OC Dec 17 09:14:44 capacitors take a really long time to decay Dec 17 09:15:22 typically yes, but if the systems running hot for example, power supplies in particular, they start to lose their capacity much faster Dec 17 09:16:03 its why apple airport express's only last about 18 months, not enough cooling, the capacitors lose their capacity, which alters voltage slowly until something else breaks, fuses blow, damn things rendered useless Dec 17 09:17:08 caps usually come with a life rating in their technical documentation Dec 17 09:17:29 some even specify multiple life ratings dependant on ambient temperature, which is handy :) Dec 17 09:17:49 but these days, no one "services" anything, they just buy new and throw the old away Dec 17 09:18:42 I've always made sure my PC runs cool Dec 17 09:18:46 even OC'd Dec 17 09:20:51 first thing I tried was lowering OC, doesn't work at anything but stock Dec 17 09:21:12 266 * 9 Dec 17 09:21:32 What's odd is why I had to restart it Dec 17 09:21:55 windows was complaining about virtual memory being low, eventually logged me out and said page file was full Dec 17 09:21:59 couldn't even restart it Dec 17 09:23:58 I suggest you run a memtest Dec 17 09:32:48 yeah, good call Dec 17 09:36:13 cpu jiffies over the course of an hour of (mostly) sleeping: system_server:1591, com.streamfurious.android.free:388, com.google.process.gapps:386, android.process.acore:258, com.android.calendar:185, wpa_supplicant:79, not going past that Dec 17 09:36:31 why is system_server taking so much, and why the HECK is streamfurious even doing *ANYTHING* Dec 17 09:36:44 main app isn't even running, or shouldn't be Dec 17 09:37:31 why does g1 touchscreen lose responsivity sometimes? Dec 17 09:37:50 can too many running apps cause that? Dec 17 09:39:09 i should have watched /proc/interrupts too, oh well Dec 17 09:41:25 what is app_47? Dec 17 09:41:42 orci: device-specific Dec 17 09:41:56 do a 'ps' and see if anything's running as app_47 Dec 17 09:42:19 Android just uses the next free uid when you install an application Dec 17 09:43:04 ah, ok seperate user for each app Dec 17 09:43:10 yep Dec 17 09:44:15 there alternatives to streamfurious that don't eat cpu when doing absolutely nothing? :/ Dec 17 09:45:19 zinx, and I couldn't add any streams to streamfurious manually, i mean not using that websites it refers me to Dec 17 09:45:52 orci: strange, all i had to do was go to a shoutcast stream, and it automagically popped up streamfurious Dec 17 09:46:22 but the radio I want to add is not on the shoutcast website Dec 17 09:46:40 hi all, I am trying to right a stack of cards for game of solitare. so I am trying to override onLayout of LinearLayout, but I don't understand what normally goes on when onLayout is called. Is there anyone here I can talk to? Dec 17 09:46:45 the app worked great here, i've just suddenly had my battery life cut by around 1/3rd (day and a half -> one day) Dec 17 09:46:50 s/right/write/ Dec 17 09:46:53 and am trying to find something to blame Dec 17 09:47:40 orci: doesn't have to be on the shoutcast website Dec 17 09:47:56 orci: the link to the shoutcast stream, on any website, should pop up streamfurious Dec 17 09:48:09 zinx, what is a shoutcast stream exactly? Dec 17 09:48:26 orci: the link you click that pops up a music player on your computer :P Dec 17 09:48:53 an http link right? Dec 17 09:48:56 orci: it generally goes to a playlist with a stream in it Dec 17 09:48:58 or mms: Dec 17 09:48:58 orci: yes Dec 17 09:49:13 orci: http to a .m3u or .pls with a link in it Dec 17 09:49:26 shoutcast is over http too, i think Dec 17 09:49:33 hmm ok let me try it that way then Dec 17 09:49:41 does anyone here know what should happen when onLayout is called? Dec 17 09:49:48 just hit what you'd hit to play it on your computer. Dec 17 09:50:01 louzer: not off-hand, you might try #android-dev too Dec 17 09:50:13 zinx: thanks! Dec 17 09:55:09 zinx can you play .asx files in streamfurious Dec 17 09:56:06 who killed http://android.kernel.org/ ? Dec 17 09:56:28 orci: probably not. Dec 17 09:56:59 orci: crazy proprietary microsoft audio stuff :/ Dec 17 09:58:34 ..or is it just my connection that refuses to load the page.. Dec 17 09:58:49 zinx, sad things is that those radios I try to listen to are alternative radios. I mean they are opponents to the status quo and what they do is supportting the proprietary software not knowing and not caring enough about it Dec 17 10:01:12 tauno, http://downforeveryoneorjustme.com/ Dec 17 10:02:12 orci, whoa, thanks :) Dec 17 10:02:15 just me then :/ Dec 17 10:03:14 you can assume that nothing will happen to kernel.org :) Dec 17 10:04:13 tauno, you may be looking for http://android.git.kernel.org/though Dec 17 10:05:31 orci: they should use mp3 streaming :/ Dec 17 10:05:42 orci: been around the longest, supported by the most stuff, and not proprietary. Dec 17 10:06:16 there was really no reason for all the realaudio/wma streaming stuff to ever exist :P Dec 17 10:06:45 other than padding the pockets of someone Dec 17 10:06:50 zinx, I hated rm and wma since the first day I heard them Dec 17 10:07:00 realaudio is *terrible* Dec 17 10:07:10 I would prefer vorbis over mp3 though Dec 17 10:07:20 i think wma at least doesn't sound like crap at normal bitrates, but it can only be played on windows and/or Microsoft blessed devices Dec 17 10:07:37 yeah, vorbis would be nice Dec 17 10:08:16 but most places don't stream it.. not sure if streamfurious supports it, but it really should tbh. android supports vorbis, and so do things like icecast (shoutcast streaming server) Dec 17 10:12:18 the G1 can stream wma, I believe... 'plain' android can't Dec 17 10:13:32 Leeds: interesting Dec 17 10:14:27 I really really need to find the page I found which listed all the codecs and containers supported by android, including the extra wma ones on the G1 Dec 17 10:25:47 the fuck Dec 17 10:25:58 why wouldn't android have vorbis support Dec 17 10:26:18 I'm also curious as to why most companys use a proprietary format like mp3, STILL Dec 17 10:26:34 hi there, i wonder if someone can explain to me what Dec 17 10:26:36 HelloAndroidHelloAndroid.apk Dec 17 10:26:38 sorry Dec 17 10:26:57 Could not find HelloAndroid.apk! Dec 17 10:26:58 means? Dec 17 10:27:06 thanks.. Dec 17 10:27:43 Gary|tp: android *does* have vorbis support Dec 17 10:29:07 ahh, just can't stream it? Dec 17 10:29:42 dunno, I haven't tried to stream it... but I think orci and zinx were talking about the lack of available streams, not the lack of support in Android Dec 17 10:29:54 anyway, hometime Dec 17 10:33:06 Gary|tp: Android most definitely has vorbis supports - the stock ringtones on the G1 are even in vorbis Dec 17 10:33:24 Gary|tp: and mp3 is merely patented, not proprietary Dec 17 10:33:29 <[nine]> first phone to ship with vorbis support, isn't it? Dec 17 10:34:50 dunno about that Dec 17 10:35:00 but it did ship w/ vorbis support Dec 17 10:36:01 err yes, patented Dec 17 10:36:03 sorry ^^ Dec 17 10:36:21 point remains that if you want to use it, you're forced to pay royalties Dec 17 10:37:04 <[nine]> Gary|tp: have fraunhoeffer ever demanded royalties for it? Dec 17 10:37:31 <[nine]> i've not heard of any situation where they have. Dec 17 10:37:39 and mp3 is supported by pretty much everything nowadays :) Dec 17 10:37:40 <[nine]> mind you, i stopped reading slashdot 8 years ago. Dec 17 10:38:30 [nine]: http://www.mp3licensing.com/royalty/ Dec 17 10:38:53 <[nine]> Gary|tp: ah, useful. Dec 17 10:39:25 Appears the source is down, but wikipedia: "MP3 license revenues generated about €100 million for the Fraunhofer Society in 2005." Dec 17 10:39:55 <[nine]> ! Dec 17 10:40:13 <[nine]> "Annual minimum royalties... US$ 15 000.00 per calendar year" Dec 17 10:40:20 yup Dec 17 10:40:21 In September 1998, the Fraunhofer Institute sent a letter to several developers of MP3 software stating that a license was required to "distribute and/or sell decoders and/or encoders". The letter claimed that unlicensed products "infringe the patent rights of Fraunhofer and Thomson. To make, sell and/or distribute products using the [MPEG Layer-3] standard and thus our patents, you need to obtain a license under these patents from us." Dec 17 10:40:50 IIRC they made some silly loophole where open source encoders were fine Dec 17 10:41:29 Is your left side of the screen also hanhing down a bit when you slide the keyboard out? Dec 17 10:41:37 <[nine]> anno^da_: yes. Dec 17 10:41:39 Err, decoders, sorry. Dec 17 10:41:40 "Additionally, patent holders declined to enforce license fees on free and open source decoders, which allows many free MP3 decoders to develop." Dec 17 10:41:53 [nine]: thanks so I don't have to worry. :-) Dec 17 10:42:00 so I suppose Android pays no royalties. Dec 17 10:42:15 THAT WAS GOOGLES ENTIRE PLAN! OMG! That's why they made it open source! Dec 17 10:42:46 <[nine]> anno^da_: no :) although i get concerned by removing the battery cover - it's a bit of a job to remove it once it's been put on. and i cringe every time those retaining clips go "snap" Dec 17 10:42:57 ugh, indeed. Dec 17 10:43:04 [nine]: same for me. :) Dec 17 10:43:06 [nine]: I remove the battery cover a dozen times every day Dec 17 10:43:09 I never broke one Dec 17 10:43:29 <[nine]> romainguy: i haven't broken it yet, but it does make me worry. Dec 17 10:43:42 and I'm saying you should not worry :) Dec 17 10:43:46 romainguy: can you remove the sd card cover easily ? Dec 17 10:43:53 kk sleep time Dec 17 10:44:06 (I'm not saying it's not possible to break it, just that in more than a year I never broke one) Dec 17 10:44:09 sd card is easy, and only need to do it every now and then Dec 17 10:44:15 I know I'm going to break the thing on the USB port off Dec 17 10:44:15 anno^da_: a pen is useful :)) Dec 17 10:44:28 anyway, I'm away Dec 17 10:44:29 Yeah. just didnt want to scratch it :D Dec 17 10:44:35 i'm using ubuntu 64 bit.. should i install 32bit eclipse or 64 bit eclipse for ADT plugin? Dec 17 10:44:37 bye. :) Dec 17 10:44:42 romainguy = official dev? Dec 17 10:44:48 si Dec 17 10:44:55 Ahh, didn't know that :) Dec 17 10:44:55 Oui :) Dec 17 10:45:42 romainguy: IF A2DP ISN'T HERE TOMORROW I QUIT. Dec 17 10:45:52 (kidding, you're all doing an amazing job! thank you :)) Dec 17 10:46:03 <[nine]> kennyyu: you'll have to pardon my ignorance, as i don't use eclipse (i prefer vim & ant), but isn't eclipse actually a java app? Dec 17 10:46:36 <[nine]> kennyyu: and thus 32/64-bit agnostic? Dec 17 10:47:53 [nine]: it is, but there's also native-compiled (with GCJ) version Dec 17 10:48:14 hmm, thanks Dec 17 10:49:16 i've tried quite a few ways to make a hello android application but without a success after i've changed eclipse / JDK into 64-bit... Dec 17 10:49:57 and if i used createactivity / adb, it cannot success as well.. Dec 17 10:50:16 <[nine]> actually, that reminds me. i was trying out gcj t'other day to see if i could build android apps with it. ended up receiving sdk 1.4 vs. sdk 1.5 complaints. Dec 17 10:50:32 <[nine]> i altered the build.xml file to no avail. Dec 17 10:50:52 <[nine]> if eclipse uses gcj as a compiler, how does it manage to build android apps? Dec 17 10:51:39 [nine]: afaiu eclipse can use other compilers to build applications Dec 17 10:52:11 <[nine]> k. Dec 17 10:52:17 anyway... still trying ;) Dec 17 10:53:08 [nine] so how did you do without eclipse? with createactivity then adb? Dec 17 10:53:27 so, THATS how old the G1 is - "more than a year" (: Dec 17 10:53:31 Does some use OpenIntents at the moment ? Dec 17 10:54:30 <[nine]> kennyyu: yup, activityCreator, then use ant.to build. Dec 17 10:54:39 <[nine]> ant.to? ant to. Dec 17 10:56:00 understood... i just observed that it genreated a build.xml in my directory ;) Dec 17 10:56:18 i oughta try it with ant as well... Dec 17 10:56:23 thanks Dec 17 10:56:59 <[nine]> you have to run "ant release" to make an apk, then use jarsigner to prepare the apk for installation. Dec 17 10:59:29 looks kinda complicated ;) do you know any documentation/tutorial online so that i can perhaps can look into detail? Dec 17 10:59:44 <[nine]> only the android sdk docs. Dec 17 10:59:54 <[nine]> they detail it all in "other ides" section. Dec 17 11:01:32 "Other ideas"? or... "other tools"? Dec 17 11:01:42 <[nine]> other IDEs. Dec 17 11:02:01 <[nine]> http://code.google.com/android/intro/develop-and-debug.html#otherides Dec 17 11:02:32 <[nine]> sorry, my tendancy to irc in lowercase means the acronyms don't stand out :) Dec 17 11:03:21 ah hahaa :P Dec 17 11:03:32 nvm thanks ;) Dec 17 11:03:48 * kennyyu tends to type in lowercase too Dec 17 11:04:39 anno^da_, I was using their products until I realized that they'll be charging for them soon Dec 17 11:06:06 charging ? Dec 17 11:06:21 Where have you seen that? Dec 17 11:06:35 Everything is open under the Apache license at the moment. Dec 17 11:07:21 anno^da_, hmm may be I am wrong but i remmber seeing expires on... kind of stuff in some descriptions of their products Dec 17 11:08:01 good to hear that they produce free software sorry for blaming them without sufficient proof Dec 17 11:10:40 OpenIntents is completly open :D. Just wanted to hear if some developers use the open intents. :) Dec 17 11:10:53 hmm.... it seems to me android sdk doesn't really work with 64-bit version JDK... :( Dec 17 11:11:00 (but i aren't sure..) Dec 17 11:22:50 Juts reading through the rules when I want to travel to the US. It is a mess what the terrorist myth lead to ... Dec 17 11:23:15 seccurity by obscurity *rolling eyes* Dec 17 11:23:29 anno^da_, better don't if you have the option - they clearly do NOT want anybody coming there :) Dec 17 11:24:14 Well I will not. Dec 17 11:24:25 I hate that fucking surveillance. Dec 17 11:25:17 They should deal with the reasons of terrorist attacks and not taking down liberty all the time. Dec 17 11:25:43 ..then keep out of the UK too :( - was there for a month and I always felt.. watched.. cameras are everywhere there :/ Dec 17 11:25:55 I have to be 2h in front of the flight at the airport what a mess. Dec 17 11:25:56 it's insane.. Dec 17 11:26:11 Oh yeah I know that. The UK is even worse. Dec 17 11:26:34 I'm waiting for the day everyone gets a chip. Dec 17 11:26:54 Just to make sure that you don't do something evil. :/ Dec 17 11:26:55 imagine what good things could have been done with the money that goes into surveilance - the world would be a much better place to live in :) Dec 17 11:27:38 Well we invest billions of dollars (that we dont have) to save our economy Dec 17 11:27:50 But have no money for food programs Dec 17 11:28:09 Saving our environment. Dec 17 11:28:45 But well we don't have to understand that because there is nothing to understand. Dec 17 11:29:31 I simply would like to ask Bush for the reason why he thinks a terrorist gets a terrorist. Dec 17 11:29:53 Perhaps he would answer "He does not believe in god." or "He ist evil." Dec 17 11:30:56 anno^da_, don't you know? "Because they hate our freedoms!!!!" :) Dec 17 11:31:44 Well lol yeah another answer from bush :) Dec 17 11:32:35 That they are poor, have nothing to lose, left alone, living in countries taken down by a lot of wars. I don't know if he is able to understand such things. Dec 17 11:37:06 android may be that chip in everyone's packet :) Dec 17 11:44:29 imagine a wolrd where everyone is chipped... now imagine the possibilities for Google ;) - personalized ads like "Hi, steve, remember when you were at *random shop name* yesterday and looked for a new laptop and then drove another 10miles to another shop to look for them but you didn't buy anything? Well, today is you lucky day.. only 0.5 miles from you is a shop called *shop name* and they sell the laptop you were looking for for $xxx, we can Dec 17 11:56:01 hi guys, does anyone know if Android is going to be ported to the Omnia? Dec 17 12:01:40 tauno: nice idea. But what if someone manages to clone the chips :) Dec 17 12:01:47 Oh I like this idea :D Dec 17 12:02:06 Getting person one in 1 second and then switching back :P Dec 17 12:25:34 Hey all. How do i create a mutithreaded GUI. E.g. I have a ProgressDialog, and I want the user to be able to use menu while this is showing (however, right now, the ProgressDialog is blocking the entire UI thread). Dec 17 12:28:57 don't show the progress dialog? Dec 17 12:29:04 you can use the progress bar in the window title? Dec 17 12:30:41 kiz: how would you envison someone using the ui when a proressdialog shows up? the dialog covers most of the screen Dec 17 12:31:20 Kizoomer121: Just do the hard work in an extra thread Dec 17 12:31:30 and update the UI with a Handler Dec 17 12:31:49 So your UI will be reponsive and you can do some hard work in the background Dec 17 12:31:57 oh i didnt read your entire thing sorry, you just want to use menu Dec 17 12:32:24 make your own progress dialog? and add a menu to it that mimics the background one Dec 17 12:53:28 hi Dec 17 12:54:49 anyone knows how to increase the touch screen sensitivity Dec 17 12:54:51 ? Dec 17 12:58:22 you cant? Dec 17 12:58:28 what do you mean by sensitivity? Dec 17 12:58:42 i have a htc g1 Dec 17 12:59:14 and i need to change the touch screen sensitivity..... Dec 17 12:59:46 there isn´t a method or something like in android.test.TouchUtils Dec 17 12:59:57 so you touch it lighter? Dec 17 13:00:06 yes Dec 17 13:00:46 im not sure if its possible Dec 17 13:01:04 is the updtime fucked with ota rc30 as well? Dec 17 13:01:15 i mean... i need to touch the screeen with a pen Dec 17 13:01:39 but g1 do not detect that.... Dec 17 13:02:05 you cant Dec 17 13:02:15 why? Dec 17 13:02:37 http://www.informationweek.com/news/personal_tech/iphone/showArticle.jhtml?articleID=212400532 Dec 17 13:02:52 its the technology behind the touching Dec 17 13:04:10 ;( Dec 17 13:04:14 :( Dec 17 13:06:16 Capacitive touch technology may allow for pinching and zooming, but costs, legacy apps, and cultural factors mean conventional touch screens may win in the end. <- lol just because windows mobile and symbian are not made for finger use :P Dec 17 13:06:35 I would bet that we will see even more of this screens in the future :) Dec 17 13:08:40 right on Dec 17 13:09:09 my friend is always losing his styluses Dec 17 13:09:24 i like conventional touch screens Dec 17 13:09:31 The operating systems have to adapt to the users. Dec 17 13:09:37 the only advantage i see these having is not going nuts if it turns on your pocket Dec 17 13:10:03 Well I hate the handwriting recognition Dec 17 13:10:07 and for the most part the screens are prettier Dec 17 13:10:50 i think different people have different requirements, which is reflected in the different approaches that have been taken Dec 17 13:11:20 snadge: true Dec 17 13:11:26 android is more likely to capitalise on the recent success of the iphone, than either winmo or symbian Dec 17 13:11:41 But the best operating system will adapt to all the different usage scenarios Dec 17 13:11:59 and in many ways it already exceeds the iphone, at least ideologically and somewhat technically Dec 17 13:12:18 Well it will exceed it just for the more available handsets Dec 17 13:12:35 beacause not all the people like big touchscreen phones Dec 17 13:12:40 some like sliders Dec 17 13:12:53 some like really small phones Dec 17 13:12:54 yeah really to me.. the g1 isn't whats going to make or break android Dec 17 13:13:04 Thats true. Dec 17 13:13:10 true Dec 17 13:13:14 Sometimes I would love to have a smaller handset. Dec 17 13:13:17 but a lot of people are kind of treating it that way.. sink or swim Dec 17 13:13:38 snadge: Well at the moment. But this will change when more handsets are out. Dec 17 13:13:48 you either love the g1, or you think its a pile of crap.. to many people, it represents what android has the potential to be there.. nobody would say its even close to realising all of those expectations, yet Dec 17 13:13:51 I'm waiting for the handsets of Sony Ericsson. Dec 17 13:14:21 And I'm waiting for open handsets :) Dec 17 13:14:27 like the Neo Freerunner Dec 17 13:14:37 but with more advanced hardware Dec 17 13:14:38 well.... g1 have a lot of problems.... like home key.... Dec 17 13:14:46 home key ? Dec 17 13:14:53 whats wrong with it Dec 17 13:14:57 you need to upgrade the firmware... Dec 17 13:15:01 yeah tell me about that one.. i can give you a list, but that one i havn't heard Dec 17 13:15:05 yes to "close" apps Dec 17 13:15:28 i think the g1 is htc's best phone yet Dec 17 13:15:33 its got a great keyboard Dec 17 13:15:34 well i´m currently develop to this phone... Dec 17 13:15:42 i think its pretty intuitive really.. after a few moments, you figure out that you dont need to quit anything.. because you cant.. and that pressing home.. takes you home.. fancy that Dec 17 13:16:52 mmmm i don´t like that behavior Dec 17 13:17:01 i like to remove apps from memory Dec 17 13:17:03 .... Dec 17 13:17:07 i think the creaking noise gets to me a little bit, when you press on the screen Dec 17 13:17:21 morning gents Dec 17 13:17:26 the short battery life, if you actually use the phone rather than leave it sit in standby or just make calls Dec 17 13:17:29 snadge: mine doesnt creak :/ Dec 17 13:17:37 marix_work: hi Dec 17 13:18:00 I just don't like the hanging down left corner of the screen when you slide the keyboard out Dec 17 13:18:04 i've combatted that with a portable external battery, car charging kit and usb charging cable when at work :P Dec 17 13:18:30 i dont get why they made the screen now line up Dec 17 13:18:35 it annoys me to no end Dec 17 13:18:38 But well battery life is ok for such a device. Show me one device that lasts longer with this big touch and all the networks, Dec 17 13:19:06 i've agonised over stupid little details with the g1 myself.. but i think im in love Dec 17 13:19:22 its my first phone with internet capability :p Dec 17 13:19:23 Same Dec 17 13:19:28 except with the battery :D Dec 17 13:19:57 Well it is the first system except the OSX iPhone that uses the internet in the backrground and you dont have to setup much to use it. Dec 17 13:20:12 mmm that is nice Dec 17 13:20:13 and really, for a first effort.. its absolutely amazing, given that a lot of this stuff has been written from scratch or at the very least, heavily customised Dec 17 13:20:17 And relatively cheap Dec 17 13:21:04 im surprised theres been so few security problems and bugs myself Dec 17 13:21:48 for the most part, it just works Dec 17 13:23:06 sorry the g1 crash my PC... Dec 17 13:23:41 windows? Dec 17 13:23:50 Yeah. The only thing that annoys me sometimes is that Android gets slower and slower and I have to restart it. Dec 17 13:23:57 But I hope that they will work on it. Dec 17 13:24:12 thats because you cant quit anything and supposedly thats a good idea :P Dec 17 13:24:37 yes windows :( Dec 17 13:24:42 one tip is to not load so many applications in the first place.. or if you do, powercycle your phone Dec 17 13:24:43 i can´t choose... Dec 17 13:25:07 Well the thing is we can't actually see what is open and what is not Dec 17 13:25:12 its good to make the phone able to cope in that situation, rather than have the winmo situation of your phone just crashing Dec 17 13:25:22 you can, hold the home key Dec 17 13:25:49 i dont think that tip is included in the manual Dec 17 13:25:56 I know that. Dec 17 13:26:16 But well the system should faster kill the apps :D Dec 17 13:26:28 After one night I don't need them in memory. Dec 17 13:26:29 thats not what is open Dec 17 13:26:32 you can quit stuff Dec 17 13:26:33 that is the last 6 items you ued Dec 17 13:26:36 i have stuff killed frequently Dec 17 13:26:43 almost down to 1 or 2 apps Dec 17 13:26:48 Disconnect: but well they are in memory. Dec 17 13:27:09 ...not necessarily. that is JUST the last 6 apps. nothing more, nothing less. Dec 17 13:27:11 They open up pretty fast. Dec 17 13:27:15 install a terminal (or adb shell) and type "ps" Dec 17 13:27:18 thats what is running. Dec 17 13:27:20 Yeah thats what I meant. Dec 17 13:27:27 sometimes more than 6, sometimes less. Dec 17 13:27:29 theres also a process viewer in the amrket Dec 17 13:27:36 But well after a night I dont need anything to run. Dec 17 13:27:38 i dont know how accurate it is, but ive been using it Dec 17 13:27:50 except the system stuff Dec 17 13:27:53 oh yah the camera-button one. it was really crashy for me when it first came out, haven't tried it since. Dec 17 13:28:05 anno^da_: what else would that ram be doing? Dec 17 13:28:20 camera button one? Dec 17 13:28:56 there is/was one that popped up a task list and could override the camera button Dec 17 13:30:06 ahh nah, this is just a list no real funcitonality Dec 17 13:30:44 it should have a kill button for people who have root :p Dec 17 13:30:49 service viewer? Dec 17 13:32:49 may i know what toolchain has android build system been using in compiling C/C++ codes Dec 17 13:32:51 ? Dec 17 13:33:01 i don't know if its just because the camera app is so slow, but it seems like that camera button isn't very responsive. Dec 17 13:33:15 button pushes are very hit or miss. Dec 17 13:33:28 you have to push and hold.. this is a good thing Dec 17 13:33:37 to go into camera mode.. i normally press for about a second or two Dec 17 13:33:54 to focus.. only half press.. it'll beep, you'll see a green dot, then fully depress to take the shot Dec 17 13:34:19 kennyyu: http://android.git.kernel.org/?p=platform/prebuilt.git;a=tree;f=linux-x86/toolchain/arm-eabi-4.2.1;h=d7f0bae7259685b69666f895860aaa8506185207;hb=master Dec 17 13:34:34 otherwise you'd be accidentally taking pictures all the time hehe Dec 17 13:36:06 jbq: thanks. but should it be in which directory in mydroid/ top source dir? prebuilt/? Dec 17 13:36:23 yes Dec 17 13:37:16 :) thanks Dec 17 14:14:08 aargh.. why cant i get an eee pc with a 64gb ssd :p Dec 17 14:21:50 what kind of manual comes with the adp1? Dec 17 14:28:32 bert0: the one jf listed in his article. Dec 17 14:32:26 hi, anyone knows if the SAXParser in the SDK 1.0r2 is working fine? Dec 17 14:32:26 I tested the same code in android and j2se, in j2se everithing works fine, in android i get an empty strin on the parameter qName of startElement and endElement methods. Dec 17 14:32:29 and again I have the feeling that I should add some simple features to Android.. like filtering apps in settings -> installed app list.. just like you do in the home app :/ Dec 17 14:32:49 ..but I'm on windows :( Dec 17 14:33:26 ..so? afaik it builds fine under windows Dec 17 14:33:32 oh. case sensitivity. Dec 17 14:48:02 morning Dec 17 14:48:21 hello Dec 17 14:48:29 How does one calibrate their compass?? I get, "D/SensorService( 51): Compass needs calibration, accuracy=3", in log output Dec 17 14:48:55 ..this is gonna sound dumb but i'm serius Dec 17 14:49:01 you wave it around. figure-8 seems to work best Dec 17 14:49:02 hold your device and draw a few large shapes (e.g. figure 8) in the air. Dec 17 14:49:19 run around in circles Dec 17 14:49:31 lol Dec 17 14:49:35 jbq: really? Don't need to be in a calibration mode? Dec 17 14:49:37 do you have to stand on your desk too? Dec 17 14:49:42 or turn it around in all directions in your hands. Dec 17 14:49:54 bert0: you say that, but that's what you have to do to calibrate the compass in my wife's vehicle Dec 17 14:50:10 BlindOracle: it auto-calibrates if it detects that it's rotated in all directions in a short amount of time. Dec 17 14:50:27 I troed sticking my tongue out and jumping on one foot under a full moon...it didn't help Dec 17 14:50:37 jbq: ok Dec 17 14:51:33 compass (and others) have a calibration mode i think Dec 17 14:52:09 Disconnect: how do you enter calibration mode...and does it have to be calibrated every time the compass is used, once per boot, or only once? Dec 17 14:52:33 they do it automagically when they get the no-calibration error Dec 17 14:52:37 and i dunno how often Dec 17 14:53:38 Disconnect: any idea how to enter calibration mode? I just tried moving it around and still get the same message Dec 17 14:53:48 keep doing it Dec 17 14:53:54 while its being read Dec 17 14:54:30 Disconnect: ok... Dec 17 14:54:42 * BlindOracle continues to look like idiot waving phone around... Dec 17 14:54:57 * BlindOracle ponders yelling "snakes....snakes" while calibrating phone Dec 17 14:57:22 lmao Dec 17 14:57:36 snakes on a mother-fscking G1 Dec 17 14:57:50 Foxdie: hehe Dec 17 14:57:55 can't laugh...busy looking crazy Dec 17 14:58:09 "I've had it with these mother fscking snakes on this mother fscking phone.. oh wait, compass needs calibrating.." Dec 17 14:58:16 Disconnect: are you a fan of Dogbert's Technical support? Dec 17 14:59:35 kslater, is that much like percussive maintenance? Dec 17 15:00:40 Dogbert (from the Dilbert comic strip) would suggest things like this solution. I'm not discounting Disconnect's advice; just saying it sounds like something Dogbert would suggest. Dec 17 15:02:26 maybe try and put a paperclip inside a CRT monitor to try and discharge the bad static so you only get good static :) Dec 17 15:02:39 Are there any developer cons/meetings in the future for android? Dec 17 15:11:32 Disconnect: do you have an accuracy better than 3 with your compass? Dec 17 15:11:46 dunno, haven't done any compass dev Dec 17 15:12:57 I found this: http://blog.davidcarrington.co.uk/2008/11/10/how-to-calibratefix-the-compass-in-androidg1/ Dec 17 15:15:12 did it work? Dec 17 15:15:59 Foxdie: nope...still at accuracy 3 Dec 17 15:16:10 I *assume* it needs to get to 1 Dec 17 15:25:42 does the location manager store an association between wifi sid and geographic location Dec 17 15:33:30 hey. teh goog is checking bug reports. they're up to the ones i entered 2 days after the release. at this rate it'll only be 5 more months before they get to today's reports :) Dec 17 15:33:58 lol Disconnect XD Dec 17 15:34:38 oh.. that's handy.. let's hope they don't stop doing in in 3 months then :) Dec 17 15:36:02 "the goog" = me ;-) Dec 17 15:36:43 heh Dec 17 15:36:57 and its "teh goog" thank you very much. :P Dec 17 15:37:08 lol Dec 17 15:37:22 Disconnect: you're welcome to fix them though :) Dec 17 15:37:57 (just trying to spot if there are serious bug reports that need to be considered for the next release) Dec 17 15:38:10 hahaha http://www.applecanceledchristmas.com/ Dec 17 15:38:12 jbq: I've been going through pretty much daily Dec 17 15:38:39 romainguy, you are not supposed to hang around here at this time.. it's not january :) Dec 17 15:39:00 uh? Dec 17 15:39:13 you were supposed to be on a coding marathon for a month or so :P Dec 17 15:39:18 am I? Dec 17 15:39:34 Disconnect, Dec 17 15:39:50 you say that when in an hour I"m going down to an apple store to pick myself up a new macbook :P Dec 17 15:40:54 * Disconnect wnats a new mbp but its hard to justify without the massive discount i got @ the old job Dec 17 15:41:38 * jbq dives into git merging Dec 17 15:42:02 jasta: since romain is out for a month i'm guessing IMF is ready to ship and being tested or IMF is delayed and wont be available until 09. Dec 17 15:42:07 <@SanMehat> tauno: he just may be in a month long coding binge... who knows :) Dec 17 15:42:16 jbq: before next release, gmail app needs to not abort notifications when screen is locked. or even when its not. Dec 17 15:42:21 ..and more comments like that gave me the impression, yes Dec 17 15:42:34 :) Dec 17 15:43:16 Disconnect: I think I've seen that bug float around in the DB. I'll make sure to push the bug report in if I get my hands on it. Dec 17 15:43:39 cool Dec 17 15:46:20 Disconnect: why do all the enhancement requests in the bug database seem to be coming from you? ;-) Dec 17 15:46:36 (oh, wait, that's because you actually care enough about the product to write them!) Dec 17 15:46:51 hello everyone :-) Dec 17 15:47:03 that and its not amazingly simple to find the bug db as a user.. Dec 17 15:47:12 jbq, I didn't know that you can add feature requests there :P Dec 17 15:47:21 or.. that you are supposed to add them there.. Dec 17 15:48:27 An issue db is the right place to keep track of feature requests. Sadly, just like for the source code, there's currently still a separation between an internal google db and the externally visible one. Dec 17 15:48:29 what does git stand for? Dec 17 15:48:57 nothing... other than Linux jokes that he names his projects after himself. Dec 17 15:49:05 s/Linux/Linus/ Dec 17 15:49:12 ok silly question, am i right in thinking that user installed apps goto /data/bin Dec 17 15:50:08 jbq, this place just seems like a desert - people report issues and that's it.. ok, I agree that omse feedback comes back from there from time to time.. but I just thought that if bugs get a response in a month or so, then feature request won't get a response at all :) Dec 17 15:51:09 would be cool if gps also had WAAS receiver Dec 17 15:51:22 tauno: they'll get looked at, eventually. really, no kidding. Dec 17 15:51:51 jbq, nice to know.. I'll add a few things that bother me currently Dec 17 15:51:54 jbq ehhh +/- 5months XD Dec 17 15:52:46 FFForever: well, just about everything that we've been working on recently was decided more than 5 months ago anyway :D Dec 17 15:53:06 Disconnect: why not get the old MBP? Dec 17 15:53:10 jbq u work 4 google? Dec 17 15:53:20 FFForever: yup Dec 17 15:53:30 tauno: you should know by now, everything said in here from someone who doesnt have google in their hostmask is pure speculation. Dec 17 15:53:35 is it everything they say it is pure awesomeness Dec 17 15:53:44 unix_lappy: i already have an old mbp. Dec 17 15:53:53 jbq, another thing that scared me off when using the issue tracker is this: "NOTE: This form is only for reporting bugs." :/ I guess I'm not the only one Dec 17 15:53:54 any chance we might see an android version of this? Dec 17 15:53:55 http://www.boygeniusreport.com/2008/12/17/more-details-emerge-about-blackberry-application-suite/ Dec 17 15:54:02 Disconnect: get a second, it's a tremendous value right now at 1400 bucks. Dec 17 15:54:03 Disconnect just ignores these warnings :P Dec 17 15:54:15 jbq any idea when we will actually see soft keys (on screen keys instead of flipping the device) Dec 17 15:54:26 unix_lappy, well.. I was joking anyway :/ Dec 17 15:54:37 FFForever: http://source.android.com/roadmap on the roadmap for next year. Dec 17 15:55:07 so within the first 3 months of 09? Dec 17 15:55:12 I bought a G1 because I know that unlike the iPhone 3G the device wont find itself in a state of diminishing returns. Dec 17 15:55:20 nvm, just my g1 going daft for a second Dec 17 15:55:34 FFForever: that's what the current roadmap says. Dec 17 15:55:46 i have a g1 Dec 17 15:55:51 XD Dec 17 15:55:53 tauno: and among other reasons that the guys in here work really hard to make a great platform for the device. Dec 17 15:55:59 how much longer will the apps be free? Dec 17 15:56:02 i'm sure regardless of who's on vacation things are getting done. Dec 17 15:56:19 i should put in for some vacation days Dec 17 15:56:34 unix_lappy, I have never thought that they don't :) Dec 17 15:56:46 which part of the road map does high speed bt driver fall into? Dec 17 15:58:14 that roadmap is a bit sparce Dec 17 15:58:53 marix: it's a roadmap, not a set of release notes :) Dec 17 15:59:42 * unix_lappy thinks the official roadmap should be a ustream feed pointed at the whiteboard(s) Dec 17 15:59:54 jbg, should I prefix feature requests in a certain way so they look different from bug reports? Dec 17 16:00:10 is there an app for local movie listings?, also what about a tv guide? Dec 17 16:00:26 tauno: "feature req" or "RFE" would make my life easier. Dec 17 16:00:40 * Disconnect tried to flag them but didn't always bother Dec 17 16:00:59 jbq: there's a box to check for feature requests Dec 17 16:01:04 it would be shocking to have it as a category or something Dec 17 16:01:24 romainguy, can't see it.. Dec 17 16:01:28 romainguy: not for the rest of us.. Dec 17 16:01:29 jbq, I guess we should be glad to have anything, wouldn't get that out of any other mobile os dev's Dec 17 16:01:36 hmm Dec 17 16:01:44 template (user/dev) subject, description. Dec 17 16:01:46 its a little thin Dec 17 16:01:55 ..a "little" :) Dec 17 16:01:58 romainguy: yeah, as an unprivileged user there's no such thing. Dec 17 16:02:03 that sucks Dec 17 16:02:11 ..yah Dec 17 16:02:28 Yeah, in its current state it's *ahem* underfeatured. I know we're actively working on it. Dec 17 16:02:49 i'm not a fan of unconfigured bugzilla, but SOMETHING that says "type of bug/request" (security, ui, interface, other, unknown) .. "module" "version/repo date" .. Dec 17 16:02:54 couple more boxes Dec 17 16:03:02 disc Dec 17 16:03:11 Yup, we're on it, really :) Dec 17 16:03:25 (should I add a feature request saying that you should remove the inital warning text "NOTE: This form is only for reporting bugs." ? (: ) Dec 17 16:04:01 jbbq Dec 17 16:04:30 tauno: ouch, yeah, the template is old. as in, at least 5 months old ;) Dec 17 16:05:07 it's not like people read it, so it doesn't matter that much! Dec 17 16:05:10 Hi- I'd like to mount my G1. When I plug it in the only thing I find in /dev is sdb, no partitions.. But it's a linux system rite, so it should have at least three..? So I tried just mounting sdb but it told me to select filesystem, I tried ext2 and ext3 without luck. Tips? Dec 17 16:05:28 jbq, why do you think that? :P Dec 17 16:05:29 Blice: it doens't mount the g1. it only mounts the sd card. Dec 17 16:05:38 But I want to mount the G1 :[ Dec 17 16:05:49 ..but thats too bad. Dec 17 16:05:50 tauno: because I've read through many bug reports and extremely few have the output of adb bugreport attached. Dec 17 16:05:56 whining isn't gonna help tho. Dec 17 16:06:04 indeed Dec 17 16:06:06 I guess. Is there another way? Dec 17 16:06:06 * Disconnect wants a pony Dec 17 16:06:09 I'd like to chroot into it :/ Dec 17 16:06:13 jbq is there any plans to allow users (without rooting the phone) to store the apps (or just backup/restore) from the sd card? Dec 17 16:06:32 we really need a faq Dec 17 16:06:45 we had one, it was in a bot. Dec 17 16:06:50 beyond that there is the roadmap Dec 17 16:07:03 unfortunately, the roadmap is a lot more like "we're running this internally" and less like "here are our plans" Dec 17 16:07:03 FFForever: there are plans, but nothing very concrete at this point. Stuff will likely come bit by bit. Dec 17 16:07:11 whining and a basket of cookies does though ;-) Dec 17 16:07:23 ffforever: the filesystem on sd lacks permission bits. hence, no security for apps Dec 17 16:07:46 Disconnect: So you're sure there's no way for me to mount this? Dec 17 16:07:49 so format it ext3 XD Dec 17 16:08:00 FFForever: ext2 Dec 17 16:08:05 wow, you're the first guy to think of that!! Dec 17 16:08:07 :-) Dec 17 16:08:20 whats the difference from ext2 and ext3 i use ext3 on my desktop =\ Dec 17 16:08:30 jbq: um. if "no google earth even tho iphone has it" is "not core build" so are the gmail bugs Dec 17 16:09:19 argh .. anybody any good with windows serial communications code? Dec 17 16:09:22 FFForever: Only difference is that ext3 has journaling Dec 17 16:09:28 ahhh Dec 17 16:09:33 Disconnect: true, to some extent. Dec 17 16:09:43 journal means it writes everything 2x or more. thats BAD for flash. Dec 17 16:10:19 jbq: ..unless there are closed source bits of the core android build..? Dec 17 16:11:08 Let's say that for now gmail has been grandfathered in as being developed very close to the core of android. Dec 17 16:11:19 does anyone know if there is an app for syncing with quicken i still have my pda because of pocket quicken i would love to ditch it any chance i get =D Dec 17 16:11:45 FFForever: dude. google. seriously. its your friend. Dec 17 16:11:56 Disconnect, i am looking at google i find nothing =( Dec 17 16:12:06 that might be a hint Dec 17 16:12:30 =( maybe there is a dev in here working on it and needs testers? Dec 17 16:12:31 XD Dec 17 16:12:35 ffforever, i think a few of the finance apps have data stored on a website. Im guessing they allow for importing to their format. Dec 17 16:13:07 marix, i really don't wanna hand out all my financial data to a 3rd party website... =S Dec 17 16:13:12 Bah, can't see anything on it with fdisk either. wtf >:/ Dec 17 16:14:10 ffforever, me neither, but i think thats your only option till quickendroid gets built Dec 17 16:14:30 marix thanks =D Dec 17 16:14:45 disconnect: http://www.letmegooglethatforyou.com Dec 17 16:14:54 :) Dec 17 16:15:10 djtachyon, that site works fine on the g1, even shows the animations. Dec 17 16:15:16 DJTachyon: too lazy to work up a search key for him Dec 17 16:15:24 hehe Dec 17 16:15:29 marix: nifty Dec 17 16:15:50 for a second i htought the g1 had a mouse pointer, i was psyched Dec 17 16:16:30 hehe Dec 17 16:16:47 http://tinyurl.com/6x2zlg Dec 17 16:18:37 ugh i hate windows api coding .. Dec 17 16:27:03 does anyone else find it weird that the charger for the g1 is a mini usb and everything else is that other connector? Dec 17 16:27:51 wait what? Dec 17 16:28:03 he's been confused by this for a few days Dec 17 16:28:07 its funny at this point Dec 17 16:28:13 haha Dec 17 16:28:14 FFForever: do you have your g1 yet? Dec 17 16:28:21 yeah i got it last night =D Dec 17 16:28:28 witch is why i find it really weird =\ Dec 17 16:28:29 DJTachyon: why are you doing windows api coding? Dec 17 16:28:42 ok i want you to do me a favor. Dec 17 16:29:03 smash it in the ground and leave? Dec 17 16:29:05 pick it up, and put your right index finger on the charger connector. Dec 17 16:29:09 no nothing like that Dec 17 16:29:16 loke: for testing my embedded controller's communcation interface. I'm at work Dec 17 16:29:18 charger port i mean, on the phone Dec 17 16:29:39 ffforever, thats an htc thing, atleast its compatible with the regular standards. Dec 17 16:29:55 then i want you to put your let index finger on "that other connector". Dec 17 16:29:59 DJTachyon: I feel your pain... On a couple of occations I have had to program a few lines of windows code. That was enough to leav eme scarred for life. Seriously... The horror. Dec 17 16:30:04 could be worse, could have some god awful iphonesque connector on the bottom. Dec 17 16:30:04 marix, i was just checking i waas not the only one XD Dec 17 16:30:08 then tell me how many parts of the phone you are touching. (you can put the phone down) Dec 17 16:30:30 Disconnect, ... Dec 17 16:30:46 i assume u wanted the charger plugged in as well? Dec 17 16:30:48 XD Dec 17 16:30:50 ffforever, yea im luck, all my blackberry powerstuff still works :) Dec 17 16:30:57 Yeah .. it's scary that im starting to get the hang of it ... I just can't figure out why the commands don't actually configure the COM port Dec 17 16:31:12 yet i switch to RealTerm, configure it, and go back to my program and they work Dec 17 16:31:12 on my phone at least there is no "that other connector". its 1 11pin miniusb-compatible port on the bottom. Dec 17 16:31:19 marix, how would u rate the g1 to ur blackberry? Dec 17 16:32:09 the g1 just has a regular mini-usb connector... Dec 17 16:32:20 ffforever, i had a pearl on release day about 2 years ago, the g1 is above and beyond it in every way except battery life and camera. Dec 17 16:32:49 i assume silent mode will cut the ringer and speakers? Dec 17 16:33:22 ffforever, there are 2 volume settings, 1 for media and 1 for ringer/phone sounds Dec 17 16:34:09 i am talking about the silent mode when u hold the power button Dec 17 16:34:21 ..yah unfortunately so is marix i think. Dec 17 16:34:32 istr that just hits the ringer Dec 17 16:34:39 I got my Dream today... There are a whole bunch of things that made me quite disappointed. Unfortunately. Dec 17 16:34:59 loke: like what? Dec 17 16:36:44 heatX: well... apalling battery life for one, the fact that it forces the phone numbers to US format (looks bizarre for singapore numbers), Dec 17 16:37:21 loke: how bad is appalling? Dec 17 16:37:24 forces numbers to us format? Dec 17 16:37:30 what do you mean? Dec 17 16:37:33 ah, yeah. battery life is horrible. thats the worst for me Dec 17 16:37:51 but if you calibrate it, it definitely improves it Dec 17 16:37:53 blau-MikeDG: it inserts dashes in the number at the weidest locations Dec 17 16:38:18 heatX: how do I do that? Because what I have now is unacceptable. After a fresh charge, it drains in about 4 hours Dec 17 16:38:27 i havent seen that on mine Dec 17 16:38:37 i have a ton of numbers with no dashes or parenthesis Dec 17 16:38:39 and a ton with Dec 17 16:38:59 loke: charge it all the way up, then put a constant drain on the battery (like youtube or something like that) till the battery dies and the phone shuts down Dec 17 16:39:04 then charge it back up Dec 17 16:39:05 blau-MikeDG: when you go to the dialler and tap a number, doesn't it insert dashes? if i type 12345678 it prints it as 123-45-678 (i think) Dec 17 16:39:09 and repeat like three times Dec 17 16:39:17 i really wish google contacts would format my numbers nicely lol Dec 17 16:39:24 ohh Dec 17 16:39:27 i thought u meant the contacts Dec 17 16:39:34 heat: no need to repeat or charge at first. simply drain it until it won't turn on, then charge it -uninterrupted- for at least 8 hours, longer is better, then it should be ok. Dec 17 16:39:34 i guess it does insert them when you type manually Dec 17 16:39:43 might need to repeat once if its really wacky Dec 17 16:39:45 ya Dec 17 16:40:04 and how can that improve it? Dec 17 16:40:10 inserting them on manual type is pretty stupid, though Dec 17 16:40:18 wasabi: these kinds of batteries have a "memory" Dec 17 16:40:30 Disconnect: even though it says 100%? Dec 17 16:40:50 wasabi: no memory in li-ion. but there is a controller that says "..i think i'm full so I'm gonna stop charging" and "I think I'm empty".. Dec 17 16:41:24 loke: no, clearly if it says 100% yours is totally different from everyone else's.. Dec 17 16:41:28 how do batterys have memory? Dec 17 16:41:41 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Memory_effect Dec 17 16:41:41 OK, so if I leave it connected using connectbot to an ssh server it should drain pretty quickly, since it has a feature to prevent sleep. right? Dec 17 16:41:43 FFForever: read what i just wrote. nicad and such have actual memory in that they form crystals Dec 17 16:41:49 there are circuits in smart batteries Dec 17 16:41:49 I went to bed last night on about 45% charge, put it on airplane mode, woke up 7 hours later on 1% Dec 17 16:42:16 loke: yeah Dec 17 16:42:17 my current phone, which is 4 years old mind you, only needs to be recharged every 3 or 4 days. Dec 17 16:42:23 no data stuff, but still Dec 17 16:42:27 OK... i'll do that Dec 17 16:42:28 wasabi: Yeah, but I bet it doesn't do as much. Dec 17 16:42:32 time to go to sleep now anyway Dec 17 16:42:38 yeah that data stuff makes a difference Dec 17 16:42:39 while idle? i'd expect it to do the exact same Dec 17 16:42:44 * ttuttle is sorta annoyed that people expect a week of battery life out of a computer with a tiny battery. Dec 17 16:42:49 as does the backlight, huge color lcd, etc Dec 17 16:42:56 FFForever: memory effect was first noticed by NASA. It was later determined it doesn't exist Dec 17 16:43:00 needing to be charged twice a day is ridiculous Dec 17 16:43:04 Fredbo: Yes, that is. Dec 17 16:43:09 it'll kill the battery life Dec 17 16:43:27 ttuttle: a colleague of mine (iphone fanboy) said he gets 5 days from his ihpone... I wouldn't know if it's true though Dec 17 16:43:27 FFForever: NASA determined it was the cyclic nature of the sat's orbit as it recharged via solar panels Dec 17 16:43:38 when using path prefix to match an intent in an intent filter, do you include the "content://" part of the uri? Dec 17 16:43:43 blind: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Memory_effect Dec 17 16:43:44 usage really affects our phones Dec 17 16:43:52 i can go for a long time using this like a phone Dec 17 16:43:56 wasabi: I've done tons of reading on the topic Dec 17 16:44:00 ttuttle: i've got a "computer with a tiny battery" thats much older (c760) and gets a week or more sleeping and almost as long as the g1 while running, screen on and everything (with wifi module plugged in, in 1s-polling power save when not in use) Dec 17 16:44:01 using it like a computer and im charging it like its a laptop Dec 17 16:44:01 it would be cool to have an app kill the phones network connection and stuff during xx-xx XD and then reactivate it XD Dec 17 16:44:21 FFForever: ..why are you mixing "XD" randomly into your text? it makes it very hard to read. Dec 17 16:44:24 wasabi: there are many root causes and almost all of them are external to the battery Dec 17 16:44:30 Disconnect: it's a weird smiley Dec 17 16:44:35 wasabi: external cause means no memory effect Dec 17 16:44:38 BlindOracle: then fix the wikipedia article Dec 17 16:44:45 Disconnect, ok ill stop using XD Dec 17 16:44:57 wasabi: it doesn't mean they are not observing something...but it isn't the battery's memory Dec 17 16:45:01 Turning off wifi yesterday gave me muuuuuch better battery life. Dec 17 16:45:03 Leeds: that doesn't mean it helps clarity "xx-xx XD F00F C02"... :) Dec 17 16:45:21 Disconnect: I totally agree Dec 17 16:45:30 jbq: yes. Dec 17 16:45:50 brocktice: hmm, wifi uses more battery than 3G or EDGE? Dec 17 16:45:58 i hate winter its so bloody cold in cali lol Dec 17 16:46:00 unix_lappy, per the discussion in here yesterday, apparently. Dec 17 16:46:00 unix_lappy: on idle, Yes Dec 17 16:46:06 yeah on idle. Dec 17 16:46:08 BlindOracle: http://www.repairfaq.org/ELE/F_NiCd_Battery.html#NICDBATTERY_014 Dec 17 16:46:19 So then if I'm around wifi I toggle it on if I'm going to do some heavy data usage. Dec 17 16:46:21 on hidle it reverts to edge no? Dec 17 16:46:29 idle* Dec 17 16:46:40 unix_lappy: its a design flaw. if 3g/edge was in always-on mode and didn't do any power saving they'd take more (more powerful transmitters) but wifi is either on or off, so.. Dec 17 16:46:42 * loke never turns on WLAN, but battery life is still horrible :-( Dec 17 16:46:49 I wish wifi toggled on and off like GPS does. Dec 17 16:46:56 jasta: I assume that you reported bug 1555 Dec 17 16:47:09 loke: agree on the number formatting - but I have had over 24 hours of typical use without charging Dec 17 16:47:17 I had it on airplane mode and it still drained from 45 to 1% in 7 hours Dec 17 16:47:31 Fredbo, maybe you had a runaway process or something? Dec 17 16:47:35 Leeds: we'll see... tomorrow will be my first day of actual use. I'll bring my old Nokia just in case though Dec 17 16:47:42 jbq: yes, i did. Dec 17 16:47:59 Btw, how can I force kill a process? Dec 17 16:48:06 loke: why? Dec 17 16:48:10 loke kill -9? Dec 17 16:48:13 loke: there may or may not also be something to the idea that it takes a few charge cycles to get to full potential... you can't kill a process Dec 17 16:48:20 yeah my load average is 4-5 Dec 17 16:48:27 brocktice: why do you turn on wlan? Don't you have unlimited data plan?: Dec 17 16:48:35 jasta: did you see any situation where the behavior would change based on which application (other than scoreboard itself) would be in front? Dec 17 16:48:46 loke, Because it's faster? Dec 17 16:48:48 jbq: regarding your memory pressure suggestion, cant you just look at the log to see how much memory is consumed? Dec 17 16:48:49 Disconnect: he redefined "memory" Dec 17 16:48:50 FFForever: don't I need to connect the computer via USB to get a root shell? Dec 17 16:48:57 loke: it's past your bedtime... and mine Dec 17 16:48:57 jbq: no, it didnt matter. the phone was running dog slow for hours... Dec 17 16:49:01 Disconnect: he is not addressing "memory effect" Dec 17 16:49:02 brocktice: hmm, not in my practical experience... Dec 17 16:49:05 My home wifi is 5 Mbps down. 3G is hardly that. Dec 17 16:49:13 brocktice: depends on your 3G coverage though, I guess Dec 17 16:49:35 Disconnect: deterioration of a cell over time is not "memory effect" Dec 17 16:49:37 my block is a 3g dead zone lol its the only dead zone area around me.... Dec 17 16:49:44 Disconnect: even the wikipedia article gets that right Dec 17 16:49:45 when I use the 3G on my laptop I'm getting those kinds of speeds... well, perhaps 3 Mb/s Dec 17 16:50:11 downloading stuff over 3G gives me around 250-300 kB/s Dec 17 16:50:17 nice Dec 17 16:50:32 what happens when i hit 5gb? Dec 17 16:50:35 I need to check out 3G properly at some point Dec 17 16:50:50 FFForever: 5 GB? Dec 17 16:50:56 the data cap Dec 17 16:51:05 FFForever: sucks to be you then :-) Dec 17 16:51:08 * loke has no data cap Dec 17 16:51:08 FFForever: many of us are not using the same provider as you Dec 17 16:51:10 There's 3g here, but alas my devphone will only do EDGE (curse you t-mo, curse you) Dec 17 16:51:11 loke: go to bed! Dec 17 16:51:13 FFForever: I read they reduce to you EDGE speeds Dec 17 16:51:21 Leeds: haha. yah, I should :-) Dec 17 16:51:34 FFForever: I have no idea if that's true Dec 17 16:51:35 loke: tell you what, I'll go first... Dec 17 16:51:36 Blice, thats better then kicking meh off XD Dec 17 16:51:38 loke: kB/s?!? perhaps you mean kilobits/s Dec 17 16:51:39 g'night all :-) Dec 17 16:51:44 I'm starting to sound like a troll... that's usually a sign for me to sign off Dec 17 16:51:59 unix_lappy: I mean kilobytes... kilobit would be kb/s Dec 17 16:52:04 * unix_lappy assumes loke is in the US. Dec 17 16:52:49 unix_lappy: I'm not Dec 17 16:52:59 unix_lappy: he said taiwan earlier iirc Dec 17 16:53:01 unix_lappy: Singapore Dec 17 16:53:07 here 300-400 kb/s is more reasonable. Dec 17 16:53:17 unix_lappy: where is here? Dec 17 16:53:27 texas. Dec 17 16:53:33 orospakr, why curse tmobile? Dec 17 16:53:37 unix_lappy: ah Dec 17 16:53:48 if u cant beat them join them XD Dec 17 16:53:48 unix_lappy: but you have HSDPA in the US, as far as I heard? Dec 17 16:53:51 FFForever, HTC Dream hardware only supports T-Mo 3g frequencies. Dec 17 16:53:57 hell, most DSL lines dont get 300-400kB/s Dec 17 16:53:59 ow Dec 17 16:54:04 FFForever, I don't live in the United States. :P Dec 17 16:54:18 unix_lappy: wouldn't that be a limitation of the ISP, rather than the technology? Dec 17 16:54:22 so join us over here? Dec 17 16:54:42 my dsl gets dialup speed =( Dec 17 16:54:54 unix_lappy: my ISP gives me 12 Mb/s over some kind of DSL... I think they even offer 20-something Mb/s Dec 17 16:55:28 nice Dec 17 16:55:37 FFForever: upload speeds are terrible though :-( Dec 17 16:55:40 i only get 8mps =( Dec 17 16:55:54 FFForever: 1 Mb/s peak I think Dec 17 16:56:02 loke oddly i get dsl upload spped its just the dl speed Dec 17 16:56:10 in practice, never over 30 KB/s (yes, byte) Dec 17 16:56:14 I mean kB Dec 17 16:56:47 i gotta go into work 2day =( Dec 17 16:57:00 there is some way of balancing a DSL connection, right? you increase download speed at the expense of upload speed? Dec 17 16:57:01 i normally get away with a screen sshd session =D Dec 17 16:57:16 so that's probably what those nasty ISP's do? Dec 17 16:59:07 nasty! Dec 17 16:59:11 yah Dec 17 16:59:12 anyway Dec 17 16:59:15 sleepy thime Dec 17 16:59:50 how cold is it where u guys are its 52f here =( Dec 17 17:00:05 27f Dec 17 17:00:18 Fredbo, HOLY WOW!!! Dec 17 17:00:23 30f here, but yesterday it was 16f Dec 17 17:00:37 OW!!!!! Dec 17 17:00:41 warmest its been since sunday Dec 17 17:01:04 we don't have a heater sadly so i feel the 52f lol Dec 17 17:01:04 same here, we've had some really cold weather, the coldest its been here in 6 years Dec 17 17:01:21 thankfully u guys have heaters? Dec 17 17:01:28 oh yeah Dec 17 17:01:37 and a fireplace too Dec 17 17:01:38 i've got P4s for space heaters Dec 17 17:01:44 just crank up SETI or something Dec 17 17:01:46 heh Dec 17 17:02:00 has SETI every found something? Dec 17 17:02:12 i'm hoping i can get android on my htc fuze sometime soon Dec 17 17:02:19 they've found some unusual astronomical events, but no alien life as of yet Dec 17 17:02:29 =( Dec 17 17:02:35 waste of money lol Dec 17 17:02:38 I suspect it's very unlikely that they'll find it Dec 17 17:02:44 same Dec 17 17:03:13 most of my view on space comes from the novel "Accelerando" Dec 17 17:03:19 i have 2 walk 2 work car is busted =( Dec 17 17:03:25 so we should be looking for spaces that there ought to be stars but we cannot see any Dec 17 17:03:31 that is where the matroiska brain is :> Dec 17 17:04:30 :-] Dec 17 17:07:24 25 C here... I have no idea what that is in F Dec 17 17:07:33 77 F Dec 17 17:08:55 That's odd. Accuracy of compass seems to change based on keyboard position Dec 17 17:09:12 keyboard in - accuracy = 3, keyboard out - accuracy = 0 Dec 17 17:09:26 =\ Dec 17 17:09:39 the compass doesn't work in landscape mode Dec 17 17:09:46 your mom doesnt Dec 17 17:09:55 now it just changed to accuracy = 1 with keyboard out Dec 17 17:10:35 RyeBrye: compass doesn't work in landscape mode? hmmm... Dec 17 17:10:45 opps...ignore the accuracy change above...that was diff sensor Dec 17 17:11:19 M-Sensor status - what does a value of 0, 1, or 3 mean? Dec 17 17:11:59 i wonder why battery charging takes so long on the g1 Dec 17 17:12:17 most of the phones ive worked with recently take 20 minutes to get up to 80% Dec 17 17:12:32 this thing creeps along at about 1% a minute or so. Dec 17 17:12:39 marix: you USB charging? AC charging? Dec 17 17:12:43 ac Dec 17 17:13:13 and im not even messing w/ it or anything Dec 17 17:13:28 i am using a blackberry charger, but they are spec for spec the same... Dec 17 17:13:30 so i dunno Dec 17 17:13:30 guess it is just a conservative charging circuit Dec 17 17:14:15 looks like some new battery tech is on the way for laptops, hopefully that will trickle down soon to cells Dec 17 17:15:30 they need to run off blood Dec 17 17:15:42 or fidgeting Dec 17 17:16:03 even a simple hand crank would rule Dec 17 17:16:06 blau-MikeDG: they have cells that will run off urine. Dec 17 17:16:19 why can't they just run off of hard rock, ive got tons of that to go around. Dec 17 17:18:47 rock hard Dec 17 17:20:11 which tool compiles the AndroidManifest? Dec 17 17:20:26 apkbuilder or something else? Dec 17 17:20:42 probably aapt Dec 17 17:20:58 I expect aapt too. Dec 17 17:21:30 ya so i have this non htc usb cord plugged in and adb doesn't like it :\ Dec 17 17:21:30 and I think the manifest is kept as an XML file in the apk Dec 17 17:21:33 but I would need to check Dec 17 17:21:34 when they gonna fix that? Dec 17 17:22:09 RyeBrye: BTW, is compass not working on landscape mode a hardware issue or software issue? Dec 17 17:22:16 fix? Dec 17 17:22:23 pohamir: I use non-HTC cables all the time (from at least 3 different sources) and I've had no problems. Dec 17 17:22:36 romainguy, nope, it's compiled Dec 17 17:22:53 * Disconnect never uses his htc cable Dec 17 17:22:56 romainguy was wrong? Dec 17 17:23:00 zomg the world is over Dec 17 17:23:03 i even use a really cheap retractable usb Dec 17 17:23:06 jbq: i have tried three differnt things and all the same? Dec 17 17:23:09 BlindOracle: No idea Dec 17 17:23:26 pohamir: that's odd. and it works fine with HTC's cable? Dec 17 17:23:33 tauno: indeed Dec 17 17:23:40 wait maybe we have a definition issue Dec 17 17:23:56 it does power it, but doesn't allow for debugging nor storage access Dec 17 17:24:11 I use normal USB cables that allow for data and debugging Dec 17 17:24:11 so probably its a power-only cable. i've got one of those that came with a bt headset. Dec 17 17:24:13 pohamir: you running linux? Dec 17 17:24:19 Are you connecting through USB2? Dec 17 17:24:33 i am on mac os x Dec 17 17:24:55 does the firmware have dmesg on it? Dec 17 17:25:13 pohamir: I think so, not sure. Dec 17 17:25:14 * BlindOracle discovered last night that linux kernel has usb2 bug which requires reboot to fix Dec 17 17:25:23 lol yes it does Dec 17 17:25:40 linux kernel on host Dec 17 17:26:58 it just suspends reset portchange Dec 17 17:28:37 jbq: you have a response pending from xaviar Dec 17 17:29:04 does android have the selinux patches? Dec 17 17:29:09 lol Dec 17 17:29:11 sexylinux? Dec 17 17:29:18 Disconnect: damn, my bogometer pegged again. Dec 17 17:29:28 ya cause trusting the nsa is booth fun and profitable Dec 17 17:29:50 * unix_lappy thinks he might just have to get an iTouch to supplement the G1. Dec 17 17:30:01 lappy: blasphemy Dec 17 17:30:04 lol i have a ipod touch Dec 17 17:30:08 well, I was wondering how else a process could get EACCES on a socket(...) call Dec 17 17:30:15 it has better medical apps then the g1 Dec 17 17:30:18 pohamir: its open source. so please, i'm dead serious, show me the piece of code you are claiming they are hiding backdoors in. Dec 17 17:30:25 i've got a conf call to join so i can wait. Dec 17 17:30:45 jbq: according to him you are wrong and anything android-related is on topic to android-dev. Dec 17 17:30:46 Disconnect: i was being sarcastic, children and you don't normally get that Dec 17 17:31:06 right. sarcastic. you said "its fun!" but meant "its not fun" .. so show me where its not fun. Dec 17 17:31:21 Disconnect: yeah. I've got to be wrong here, especially since I'm the guy who wrote the descriptions for the mailing lists... ;-) Dec 17 17:31:28 :D my coffee level must be below yours Dec 17 17:31:28 hahahaha and now no android phones are 3g Dec 17 17:31:29 give me some time Dec 17 17:31:44 xavier almost made me laugh into a speakerphone :( Dec 17 17:31:55 so um... any ideas? Dec 17 17:35:07 Ah, Xavier... :D Dec 17 17:35:24 ^^ Dec 17 17:35:28 doh. email goes out at 1235 "conference call to start at 1255, meeting at 1p" .. instead of 1230.. doh. Dec 17 17:35:34 (a.k.a. comic relief) Dec 17 17:36:13 he needs a comic stfu. or have someone @google.com to ask to speak to his teacher. Dec 17 17:36:23 cuz i really doubt trolling is part of his assignment Dec 17 17:36:48 Can someone tell me why I can call the last entry in the CallLog from my Bluetooth headset? Haven found a real sense to it. Dec 17 17:36:50 he removed the 'google groups' part tho after i asked Dec 17 17:37:23 anno^da_: you're basically hitting the talk button. personally, i dislike it but i -really- dislike the voice dialer. my old e90 used to pants-call people all the time. Dec 17 17:38:07 speaking of pants-call Dec 17 17:38:15 I'm kind of annoyed that I have to use the unlock code Dec 17 17:38:21 or my phone will hit menu twice and pants-call people :\ Dec 17 17:38:25 hehe Dec 17 17:38:31 get a better case? Dec 17 17:38:38 s/better// Dec 17 17:38:44 my case is my pants pocket Dec 17 17:38:51 screen facing my leg so my keys don't scratch it Dec 17 17:38:54 actually i've been running w/o unlock code for a while without issue. Dec 17 17:40:11 how do i stop my phone from auto adding favorites? Dec 17 17:40:17 favorites? Dec 17 17:40:17 any idea how to interpret the magnetic sensor triplet? Dec 17 17:40:22 ive nevr used the unlock code Dec 17 17:40:28 on the call list Dec 17 17:40:30 and still dont see how you ar epants calling people Dec 17 17:40:42 your leg is hitting, menu, menu, talk, talk Dec 17 17:40:45 BlindOracle: x,y,z its documented. used to have a link, google it i guess. but its a 3d compass. Dec 17 17:41:09 well its mostly documented, there was a ml post a while back about one of the axis being reversed from the docs Dec 17 17:41:17 Yeah, it's a magnetic field measured in microTeslas. Dec 17 17:41:28 Disconnect: k...looking Dec 17 17:41:31 (the axis for the sensors are a total mess in 1.0) Dec 17 17:41:47 Disconnect: I just found that one Dec 17 17:41:49 s/the axis for// Dec 17 17:41:56 jbq: ouch...didn't know that Dec 17 17:41:59 esp if you include the vision sensor ;) Dec 17 17:42:13 lols Dec 17 17:43:18 BlindOracle: in 1.0 the official way is "test on the hardware until it works for you". Dec 17 17:43:49 but... the emulator man! the emulator! Dec 17 17:44:10 jbq: heh...nice Dec 17 17:44:36 Disconnect: there's gonna be so much work to make the emulator better emulate the hardware of many devices (heck, emulating one device is already hard enough!) Dec 17 17:45:09 hahaha "xavier: SMS Text or SMS Email?" Dec 17 17:46:07 can we at least unsub him from the dev list? Dec 17 17:46:42 can a service create a gui? Dec 17 17:47:45 Disconnect: what'd be really would would be to do it in a way that he doesn't notice (i.e. his emails come back to him, and appear on the groups pages when he's logged in). Dec 17 17:48:09 that smaks of totally AWESOME Dec 17 17:48:24 jbq: I implemented that on my web site Dec 17 17:48:30 jbq: I can ban users Dec 17 17:48:33 but they can still post Dec 17 17:48:41 but they are the only ones able to see their own posts Dec 17 17:48:47 romainguy: yeah, that kicks ass. Dec 17 17:48:57 clearly we need to move google groups to romainguy's site Dec 17 17:49:16 Disconnect: you don't want to use a French web server Dec 17 17:49:26 you'd be complaining about connection speed :) Dec 17 17:49:29 heh Dec 17 17:49:40 the same way accessing many US servers is awfully slow from France :( Dec 17 17:50:05 Hmmm...compass does seem to work in landscape mode. In fact, compass accuracy seems to increase. It changes from three to one in landscape mode Dec 17 17:51:19 * mikey| wanders if he has been /shun-ed Dec 17 17:51:45 with the next market update will i really have to redownload all of my apps?, http://www.modmygphone.com/forums/showthread.php?t=2431 Dec 17 17:52:18 mikey|: heh. You should be able to startActivity(), but the user experience would be jarring. Better put up a notification and start the UI when the user clicks the notification. Dec 17 17:52:24 FFForever: ...dude. look at the date. Dec 17 17:52:58 whoops =\ Dec 17 17:53:24 "rc28" should have been a hint too, since rc30 has been out for a while now (rc28 started out, then rc29 went everywhere, then rc30 went everywhere w/ root fix) Dec 17 17:54:36 ahhh Dec 17 17:55:13 lol that was before the release of the g1 Dec 17 17:55:21 wasnt it? Dec 17 17:55:46 yag Dec 17 17:55:48 yah Dec 17 17:56:44 i used to write better code before eclipse existed :( Dec 17 17:56:58 It's not too late. You can go back. Dec 17 17:56:58 designs too Dec 17 17:57:26 is there a better app viewer btw (one with category's) i hate scrolling down the list Dec 17 17:57:31 ok, I got disconnected writing that out, I will have missed (any) replies :| Dec 17 17:57:39 IDEs are like BASIC, if you learn to program on them you are irreparably damaged Dec 17 17:57:50 morrildl: I'm unsure if I agree with you Dec 17 17:57:56 It depends on how you use it, I think Dec 17 17:58:03 If I am building android from source and the build fails, complaining about a "missing run-java-tool" when would it do so? Within the first 5 minutes or after an hour? Dec 17 17:58:17 WEDNESDAY FLAME WAR: BEGIN Dec 17 17:58:22 TOPIC: IDEs Dec 17 17:58:23 ;) Dec 17 17:58:37 lol Dec 17 17:58:45 Gonna skip this one. Did the emacs vs. eclipse thing about a month ago, I think. Dec 17 17:58:46 eclipse made me lazy, I type java code in notepad++ and sit there for a sec wandering where the auto suggest is >.< Dec 17 17:59:01 eclipse made me so lazy Dec 17 17:59:03 FFForever: there's one in jsharkey's stuff Dec 17 17:59:27 kk Dec 17 17:59:31 now i just write everything in one big file and figure, eclipses refactor will make it pretty if i need it Dec 17 17:59:42 with arbitrary names :( Dec 17 18:00:21 where there any replies to what I wrote? :) Dec 17 18:00:27 s/where/were Dec 17 18:00:41 Speaking of Eclipse, does anyone build Android projects outside of Eclipse? Dec 17 18:00:57 FFForever: yea i wrote it last week :) its a bit slow right now tho Dec 17 18:01:12 is it in the market? Dec 17 18:01:21 nope, wasnt market-ready yet Dec 17 18:01:25 but apk is on the blogpost Dec 17 18:01:26 still no /nat/google Dec 17 18:01:36 jsharkey: Congrats on your new job, btw! Dec 17 18:01:42 jsharkey, where is your blog? Dec 17 18:02:05 FFForever: http://www.jsharkey.org/blog/2008/12/15/grouphome-organize-your-android-apps-into-groups/ Dec 17 18:03:04 (extending flame war) It's the tool atrophe that's the problem, not the features themselves. IDEs make development in their "native" environment (Java for eclipse) so different from other environments that people start forgetting about other stuff. So they write Java code instead of python scripts because the python mode doesn't have autocomplete. Which is insane. Dec 17 18:03:18 thcs it looks amazing, jsharkey congrats on your google job =D Dec 17 18:03:23 this* Dec 17 18:03:41 andy: yeah thats it! Dec 17 18:03:55 andyross: interesting angle Dec 17 18:04:07 i used visual studio .net for a while while i was playing with .net on my winmo phone Dec 17 18:04:13 OTOH I wrote Python full-time for 2 years (without IDE FWIW) but forgot Java, mostly Dec 17 18:04:14 they had some crazzzzy simple stuff Dec 17 18:04:19 jsharkey: Compare Everywhere paid for my g1. Thank you! Dec 17 18:04:31 ive been teaching myself python slowly over the last few weeks Dec 17 18:04:33 so I think you atrophy either way, IDE or not Dec 17 18:04:35 so i can play with google app engine Dec 17 18:05:05 bert0: hehe thx :) Dec 17 18:05:26 I definitely wouldn't remember 68k assembly if I had to write some right now... and I wrote more than 100k lines of it. Dec 17 18:05:36 morrildl: I'm trying to forget Java, but my desire to write apps for my phone is preventing that :( Dec 17 18:05:39 Anybody need some 6502/65816? Can do. Dec 17 18:05:59 Learning stuff when you're 13 seems to embed it in your brain. Dec 17 18:06:05 You could write a new Nintendo game. Dec 17 18:06:13 * nostferka is embedded with C++ Dec 17 18:06:14 Yeah, but if you're a python web jockey who suddenly needs to write a Java front end for something, you'd just fire up your editor and do it. My experience is IDE users tend to just avoid the rest of the world because the tools scare them too much. Dec 17 18:06:28 sharvil: I wrote some of the code for the Nintendo version of the XBAND video game modem. Dec 17 18:07:06 andyross: agreed! Dec 17 18:07:06 My 1337 skillz were put to professional use. :-) Dec 17 18:07:17 fadden: thats awesome Dec 17 18:07:25 haha, that's pretty sweet :) Dec 17 18:07:31 Dunno. I did a ton of BASIC when I was 12, but found that when I bought an Atari 800 on eBay a few years ago I just couldn't think in GOTO anymore. Didn't work. Block structure had polluted my brain. Dec 17 18:07:33 andyross: I'm often amazed at how many IDE users have no clue what is going on under the covers Dec 17 18:07:37 i remember xband Dec 17 18:07:54 bert0, cool =) Dec 17 18:08:57 fadden i learned to code mirc scripts but i couldn't do it today if you asked me lol Dec 17 18:10:08 BlindOracle, what is going on under the covers XD Dec 17 18:10:38 It's perfect timing to release an application like Compare Everywhere... people are chomping at the bit to get anyone to buy anything it seems Dec 17 18:10:50 FFForever: I have pictures...but you'd wind up blind. ;) Why do you think I'm *Blind* Oracle Dec 17 18:10:52 heh Dec 17 18:10:58 ;) Dec 17 18:11:36 FFForever: i learned mirc scripts and i can go years without doing it and pick it back up Dec 17 18:11:53 i used to be able to do anything with mirc scripts Dec 17 18:12:17 i wrote rootkits, bots, irc clients (yes, an irc client inside an irc client) and all sorts of other stuff Dec 17 18:12:51 but seriously.. at the end of the day, its still an mirc script. Dec 17 18:12:55 DarkriftX, same here Dec 17 18:13:02 you would be surprised Disconnect Dec 17 18:13:10 mirc root kits? Dec 17 18:13:14 most ppl were surprised i could make mirc do so much Dec 17 18:13:25 its like the loser version of "I once wrote an editor in elisp" :) Dec 17 18:13:31 DarkriftX, i wrote an ircd + services XD Dec 17 18:13:54 i once wrote an irc client in java Dec 17 18:13:55 yes, it did port scanning, ntpass rooting, uploaded files, started itself and then started scannign for more Dec 17 18:14:25 DarkriftX, nice, did u also do ntpass hash cracking? Dec 17 18:14:36 nope Dec 17 18:14:43 it was weak pw, which was good enough lol Dec 17 18:14:55 most were "admin" "pass" or "password" Dec 17 18:15:01 my password is 18 chrs lol Dec 17 18:15:30 truecrypt still tells me my password is weak..... Dec 17 18:15:36 lol Dec 17 18:15:52 numbs+lets and since its less then 20 it says haha weak mofo lol Dec 17 18:16:32 FFForever: TrueCrypt is expecting a passphrase, not a password. Dec 17 18:16:54 well my password is a passphrase =D Dec 17 18:17:04 FFForever: 18 chars is not a passphrase. Dec 17 18:17:20 what would u call a passphrase then? Dec 17 18:17:34 FFForever: 30+ chars, several words. Dec 17 18:17:45 ahhhhhhh Dec 17 18:17:52 is jsharkey getting a job at googl :o? Dec 17 18:17:56 FFForever: Mine is a little over 30. Dec 17 18:17:58 google * Dec 17 18:18:08 not is mikey|_. has Dec 17 18:18:14 Cool Dec 17 18:18:25 or i could just use supercalafragicrealsticaladoish? Dec 17 18:18:46 if you spelled it right lol Dec 17 18:18:49 FFForever: I wouldn't, as you just pasted that on IRC. Dec 17 18:18:56 i know its not spelt right..... Dec 17 18:19:00 heh Dec 17 18:19:04 FFForever: Also, it's supercalifragilisticexpialidocious, unless the misspellings are intentional, which I think they are... Dec 17 18:19:33 ttuttle, sure intentional XD Dec 17 18:19:42 lol Dec 17 18:19:50 FFForever: Then sounds great, just as long as you make different modifications as the ones you made here. Dec 17 18:19:56 ttuttle: IM IN UR DROID / FLASHIN UR BITS Dec 17 18:20:01 ctate++ Dec 17 18:20:37 i have one password Dec 17 18:20:40 for my email Dec 17 18:20:46 and i just reset my passwords for everything else Dec 17 18:20:55 my email password is weak =\ Dec 17 18:21:23 and i use the password elsewhere also =S, if i update my password do i have to update it on the g1 also? Dec 17 18:22:09 whats your password Dec 17 18:22:14 ill tell you if its weak Dec 17 18:22:42 lol Dec 17 18:23:02 i wonder if google used its all knowing all powerful information could google take over the world? Dec 17 18:23:29 new here , does APK package contain source codes? Dec 17 18:23:30 why limit yourself to the world? Dec 17 18:23:39 right after they install sonar and long-range mic's into all our phones Dec 17 18:23:41 skyred: no, just binaries Dec 17 18:23:43 so yeah... I've been using the soft case that came with my OpenMoko Neo1973 for my devphone. :D Dec 17 18:23:43 skyred: no, an .apk is just the executable + resources Dec 17 18:23:48 it fits quite nicely. Dec 17 18:23:50 no source code included Dec 17 18:23:56 ttuttle, ctate thanks Dec 17 18:24:09 skyred: you're welcome. Dec 17 18:24:13 de nada Dec 17 18:24:49 i wonder if google has had anyone vanish in there conquest for power Dec 17 18:25:27 yes Dec 17 18:25:40 software development is a pretty cutthroat business Dec 17 18:25:43 if you take my emphasis Dec 17 18:25:44 jasta only *thinks* he's going to work for T-Mobile. Dec 17 18:25:48 haha Dec 17 18:25:52 Really he's going "on vacation". Dec 17 18:26:05 fadden: Oh, did you guys pretend to be a T-Mo recruiter? Dec 17 18:26:05 with "Milly" Dec 17 18:26:09 i wonder... who has had more vanish.... microsoft or google or yahoo or ibm? Dec 17 18:26:26 I know how has more varnish Dec 17 18:26:29 "Tonight jasta sleeps with the robots" Dec 17 18:26:32 who* Dec 17 18:26:36 LMAO! Dec 17 18:27:18 pagerank is powered by human sacrifice Dec 17 18:27:22 fadden: then we'll mail a pile of gears, cogs, and circuit boards to T-Mobile. One of them will ask "What's it mean?" "It's a Mountain View message. It means....." Dec 17 18:27:58 on the letterhead, one of the O's in Google will be made in human blood. Dec 17 18:28:10 Don't you guys have work to do? Dec 17 18:28:19 I'm still waiting for A2DP support :P Dec 17 18:28:23 thats right, I need to pay you a vacation ttuttle Dec 17 18:28:32 vol: er Dec 17 18:28:37 vol: not the same kind, I hope? Dec 17 18:28:38 I like Turtles Dec 17 18:28:39 ttuttle: the build is not getting any faster Dec 17 18:28:41 haha Dec 17 18:28:50 fadden: You need interns to improve build time. Dec 17 18:28:54 how many of you guys work for google? Dec 17 18:29:07 I did, over the summer, and hope to again. Dec 17 18:29:07 is there a size limit on sharedpreference strings? Dec 17 18:29:30 i want to work for google Dec 17 18:31:48 is market down? Dec 17 18:32:18 Disconnect: Dec 17 18:32:29 haha it only works on edge/3g? how lame is that? Dec 17 18:32:36 it lit up hte second i got off my conf call Dec 17 18:32:36 your site says hold down camera to enter fastboot but the back arrow worked for me last night Dec 17 18:32:39 are they the same? Dec 17 18:33:05 skateboards? Dec 17 18:33:25 maybe someone from google can answer this, when will we (google apps users) see gmail themes? Dec 17 18:33:33 on switches to fastboot, the other switches to Serial0, iirc Dec 17 18:33:37 *one Dec 17 18:33:56 ctate: hitting back while IN spl does that.. Dec 17 18:34:20 does it toggle, or only go one direction? Dec 17 18:34:23 ok looks like yes, back arrow and camera does the same thing Dec 17 18:34:42 "does the same thing" during initial boot, i.e. goes into the bootloader? Dec 17 18:34:45 ctate: it does a basic check. you can't get fastboot w/o a usb cable Dec 17 18:34:49 yah Dec 17 18:34:53 well right Dec 17 18:35:01 i turned off my g1 and held down back and hit power Dec 17 18:35:12 DarkriftX: if you see skateboards, its the same thing. Dec 17 18:35:18 no matter how you get tehre :) Dec 17 18:35:19 it booted into the skateboard mode and says "fastboot" and i was able to connect using the fastboot binary Dec 17 18:35:21 blau-MikeDG: how simple was dgAlert? I'm looking into Morse xlation of SMS messages... Dec 17 18:35:21 ok, cool Dec 17 18:36:11 not hard relaly Dec 17 18:36:17 msg me if you have any questions though Dec 17 18:36:38 hah. http://www.cyrket.com/asset/7356977537823724277 "I installed just to leave a comment, lol. Go to {omitted}.ning.com and meet g1 & sidekick users (its like a myspace & facebook)" Dec 17 18:36:57 maybe a simple fix to block ning/fb/myspace links and email addresses from comments.. Dec 17 18:37:18 Since more Android developers are here: does Android use selinux to deny a process rights to acquire resources (e.g. sockets)? Dec 17 18:37:50 no Dec 17 18:37:55 because that would make too much sense Dec 17 18:38:08 chekc out the kernel source, there is a bunch of lumpy wheel-reinventing in the patches Dec 17 18:39:05 grrr having sharedpreference problems Dec 17 18:39:18 well, the permissions model is quite different from the standard linux user-identity based model Dec 17 18:39:28 it just happens to use a lot of the same machinery Dec 17 18:39:54 It's pretty code. If you drink. A lot. Dec 17 18:40:14 ctate: selinux would allow things like "user foo cannot read files owned by user bar" and "even on sd, user foo cannot access files x, y, z" Dec 17 18:40:32 but yah. it takes a "special" kind of person to appreciate it properly Dec 17 18:41:01 (the kind of person who thinks that 5-way merges are enjoyable) Dec 17 18:41:08 hehe Dec 17 18:41:12 ack Dec 17 18:41:12 I'm willing to bet you can do the same in selinux...but getting it right would be hard. Dec 17 18:41:26 mmarker: hitachi did it. youtube 'selinux android' for the video Dec 17 18:41:26 Disconnect: sure, but that's still based on user identity. in Android, a "userid" identifies an application, not a human. Dec 17 18:41:52 ctate: yes, thank you for that refresher. any other obvious facts you'd like to point out? :/ Dec 17 18:42:05 might not be obvious to everyone here; be nice :) Dec 17 18:42:08 I'm sure, but getting a policy together is a royal pita. Dec 17 18:43:09 "nobody can do anything. ok.. here we go. users 1-1000 can access dirs 1-1000. crap..ok. now they can read/execute dalvik. oops, and those 2 libraries. ok now we boot.. oops. icons." .. Dec 17 18:44:07 and it would have totally mitigated root, too. Dec 17 18:44:08 amusingly, the huge majority of trickiness in android permissions lives strictly in user-space. Dec 17 18:44:16 yup Dec 17 18:44:27 (isn't a lot of the selinux infrastructure GPL?) Dec 17 18:44:54 I mean, you can audit, but you need to think about groups, what can talk to what. I loved the demo of the root can't do squat Linux demo. Dec 17 18:45:16 lol Dec 17 18:45:19 yup, ages ago Dec 17 18:45:25 got a link? Dec 17 18:45:41 note the 2nd paragraph. http://www.nsa.gov/selinux/info/faq.cfm#I2 Dec 17 18:45:52 Its on the nsa linux site. lemme find it Dec 17 18:45:58 and #3 just -screams- "android security model" Dec 17 18:46:35 ah, yeah, this confirms that the SELinux stuff is all GPL. Dec 17 18:47:40 hey guys, anyone know how to work with the overlay Dec 17 18:47:45 to get the markers to show up? Dec 17 18:47:49 ctate: http://www.nsa.gov/selinux/info/license.cfm says "upstream licenses, possibly including gpl" Dec 17 18:47:57 http://www.coker.com.au/selinux/play.html Dec 17 18:48:07 ah, the page you linked before had a simpler declaration. Dec 17 18:48:13 a play machine where he gives you root Dec 17 18:48:30 gotcha Dec 17 18:49:09 would my compiled fastboot binary work on most other x86 linux machines? Dec 17 18:49:24 i was thinking of putting a copy on the wiki Dec 17 18:50:08 i hate preferences... Dec 17 18:50:29 DarkriftX: generally yes, unless you're using a weird glibc configuration (cough, gentoo, cough). That said, why bother? Anyone competent to reflash their phone will be comfortable with building the source tree anyway Dec 17 18:50:57 heh Dec 17 18:51:23 i have no problem flashing a phone, but im very new at building (i did it, but so far besides fastboot its been a waste of time) Dec 17 18:51:31 oh, good question. if I wanted to muck with the kernel on a devphone, which branch in git should I muck with? Dec 17 18:51:57 mmarker: there is info on getting the right kernel on my site. lemme find the article. Dec 17 18:52:16 http://www.gotontheinter.net/content/compiling-your-own-g1-kernel-modules Dec 17 18:52:17 i wasted a huge amount of time building it and all ive gotten from it is fastboot. also i have kubuntu 7.10 which seems to be the most popular with android users Dec 17 18:52:42 doh. its not listed there. it just provides the link to http://www.telesphoreo.org/pipermail/g1-hackers/2008-November/000042.html :/ Dec 17 18:52:48 24% of my sites visitors are using *buntu and 4% are using other linux distros Dec 17 18:53:03 this is sad.... my g1 gets the best reception in the house LOL Dec 17 18:53:04 so id think if they are on x86 it should be good Dec 17 18:53:19 anyone wanna help me solve a problem with sharedpreferences? Dec 17 18:53:35 FWIW: my day job's product still builds on Red Hat 9 to cover all the customer's distros and configurations. Dec 17 18:53:48 ok, htc branch...thats goof Dec 17 18:54:26 hahaha from the selinux-play faq "# Regarding core-dumping bash to read the history. That's nice work, but you could have just used cat, grep, or any of your favourite tools on /root/.bash_history with much less effort." Dec 17 18:55:22 hey look, its something that should be part of the platform: http://www.cyrket.com/asset/-5269825185187650262 :) Dec 17 18:56:04 think I should add it in the next release disconnect? :D Dec 17 18:56:26 SanMehat, jbq: you had asked for my notes/thoughts on selinux before.. i'm probably gonna do up a test on the emulator soon but the profile will be gpl. Dec 17 18:56:31 JesusFreke: heh Dec 17 18:56:56 JesusFreke: i think that one dev should hurry up with the toggleable/tristate orientation (sensor, flip, standard) patch and -that- should be included. Dec 17 18:57:00 bbiab tho Dec 17 18:57:24 http://android-dls.com/wiki/index.php?title=Fastboot Dec 17 19:00:10 Hi, does any one have idea about the web browser running on android.. Dec 17 19:00:10 ? Dec 17 19:00:56 ping all: Dec 17 19:01:12 madha1: idea in what sense? Dec 17 19:01:33 (what's your question?) Dec 17 19:03:10 what's that linux command to send other users a message via shell? Dec 17 19:05:24 anyone happen to know what build of webkit they used for the browser? Dec 17 19:07:41 ctate: like i want to know the details of engine..is it webkit? Dec 17 19:08:22 im not sure whelther there a port of webkit for JVM? is it ? anyone? Dec 17 19:08:23 does this string look bad ? Dec 17 19:08:25 rowser,Ca$hFlo,CPR (POC),DialNPR Podcasts & Stations,PAChannel,Trap!,Txtract,TxtSpeed,Voice Dialer,Voice Recorder,YouTube Dec 17 19:08:29 for an xml entry? Dec 17 19:08:52 madha1: It's just WebKit. The browser front end is in Java, the engine is C++. Dec 17 19:09:34 so android got gtk/cairo ? Dec 17 19:11:05 madha1: no. front end: java. back end: C++ Dec 17 19:11:35 is the port open source? Dec 17 19:11:54 madha1: http://tinyurl.com/6x2zlg Dec 17 19:12:10 what else besides ampersand needs to be escaped in xml strings? Dec 17 19:12:10 madha1: the rendering is done with SGL Dec 17 19:12:26 similarly Sun released a Java/Swing port of WebKit that does rendering with Java2D Dec 17 19:12:49 blau-MikeDG: < and > Dec 17 19:13:12 what db does the android use for apps sqlite? Dec 17 19:13:45 thanks rome Dec 17 19:14:16 this /data/data/com.whatever/databases/webview.db Dec 17 19:14:22 yay phone arrived Dec 17 19:14:25 romainguy: u have the link to repos? Dec 17 19:14:29 and it hasn't even shipped yet according to google! Dec 17 19:15:15 wasabi: Since we don't sell devices, I would generally expect us to say "no" if you asked us whether we have shipped you anything :) Dec 17 19:15:44 googlers are so snarky Dec 17 19:16:23 sure, market.android.com which links to that provider says so Dec 17 19:16:29 dev phone. Dec 17 19:16:53 now i have to figure out how to combine my google account and my gmail account into one account Dec 17 19:16:58 phone bill time o/ Dec 17 19:17:10 wasabi, different email accounts? Dec 17 19:17:18 I don't use gmail. Dec 17 19:17:23 but I did sign up for it a long time ago Dec 17 19:17:26 as a different name Dec 17 19:17:34 i've been using a non @gmail.com name Dec 17 19:17:39 i signed up for it when it was still 1gb.... wow how long ago what that? Dec 17 19:17:58 Your last payment of $78.04 Dec 17 19:17:59 was received on 12/17/2008 Dec 17 19:18:09 Gary|tp, what was that for? Dec 17 19:18:11 why does t-mobile text me that I owe them money when easypay went through fine? Dec 17 19:18:12 ugh. Dec 17 19:18:22 =S Dec 17 19:18:36 that was funny. unepxectedly got phone, so called tmobile for data plan Dec 17 19:18:39 my phone bill, $80 for one line! Dec 17 19:18:44 they said they couldn't start it for 5 days until my existing plan expired. Dec 17 19:18:55 i'm like. uh. i can't use my phone for 5 days? fat chance! Supervisor please. Dec 17 19:19:00 Gary|tp, we pay 230 for 4 lines Dec 17 19:19:02 wasabi: Just use your non-gmail @domains email Dec 17 19:19:29 doesn't work on the phone Dec 17 19:19:35 says it requires a gmail enabled account Dec 17 19:19:43 it's using google domains? Dec 17 19:19:49 or google for domains, whatever Dec 17 19:19:58 gfyd or google apps XD Dec 17 19:19:59 got me. Dec 17 19:20:05 we pay $100 for 2 lines (g1 and bb, both with data, etc) Dec 17 19:20:17 Disconnect, how many mins? Dec 17 19:20:35 400 shared, plus tmob to tmob plus nights, weekends. Dec 17 19:20:53 we have 2 data plans, and my favs + 1000 whenever mins XD Dec 17 19:21:15 +mob2mob and unlimited nights/weekends.... Dec 17 19:21:31 my sister used 6345 mins talking 2 her bf last month..... Dec 17 19:21:32 so... there a way to combine these two accuonts? Dec 17 19:21:37 I have two @gmail.com addresses, actually. Dec 17 19:21:39 wasabi, nope Dec 17 19:21:44 hmm. suck. Dec 17 19:22:05 fav5 was a blessing lol Dec 17 19:22:17 I'm on 300 myFaves plan Dec 17 19:22:32 I use like, 10-20 non myFaves minutes a month Dec 17 19:22:38 XD Dec 17 19:22:44 i swear it's a conspiracy, each time I made a thread on the group, it double posts it Dec 17 19:22:50 but I use roughly 7-8k myFaves minutes Dec 17 19:22:55 so it's apretty good deal on my end :) Dec 17 19:23:08 lol =) Dec 17 19:23:27 * ctate cannot imagine spending 4 hours on the phone every day Dec 17 19:23:47 Get in a long distance relationship, you will :p Dec 17 19:23:54 even when i was! Dec 17 19:23:57 okay, 2 hours :) Dec 17 19:24:07 egh god Dec 17 19:24:08 my sister is in a long distance relationship lol he lives 30mins away (by foot) Dec 17 19:24:13 anyone worked with map overlay? Dec 17 19:24:14 long distance relationships are terrible for me Dec 17 19:24:19 mostly because I'm terrible on the phone : ( Dec 17 19:24:30 FFForever: She's more like, 2k miles Dec 17 19:24:36 another question, is there a way to check all of your installed apps for updates on the market? Dec 17 19:24:43 Gary|tp, =( Dec 17 19:24:49 vol: No :( Dec 17 19:24:51 vol: yes. click each one in 'my downloads' and see if it says "install" or "launch" at the bottom. Dec 17 19:24:51 vol: wait for a future update? Dec 17 19:24:54 without, you know, doing it individually :\ Dec 17 19:24:57 err Dec 17 19:25:12 doesn't always work Dec 17 19:25:18 i have 8 apps how many do you guys have? Dec 17 19:25:26 a bajillion Dec 17 19:25:47 what are apps Dec 17 19:26:05 Disconnect: ah, excellent. Thanks Dec 17 19:26:08 MY MOMMY BOUGHT mE THIS PHUN NI CAN LEAV COMMENTS ON THESE THINGS ITS COOL LOL Dec 17 19:26:09 blau-MikeDG: (: Dec 17 19:26:10 I have like 100 apps installed Dec 17 19:26:16 Gary|tp: lulz Dec 17 19:26:22 Gary|tp: stop leaving comments : ( Dec 17 19:26:30 :( Dec 17 19:26:35 I've left like, 1 comment Dec 17 19:27:34 hmm. figured out how to delete a google account Dec 17 19:27:40 * BlindOracle now understands the compass data and sees why compass is not supported in landscape mode...API says accuracy is unreliable Dec 17 19:27:40 but it says name isn't free still Dec 17 19:27:46 shazam, anycut, ringdroid, pterm, maverick, firewallet, meebo, g1 central, imeem, and chess Dec 17 19:31:36 i got dgQuickCut, dgQuickLaunch, dgAlert, dgAway, dgBlue Battery, dgMoney, dgMMS CPR, dial zero, DroidsSans weaks, friction, g1 central, glance, imeem, mybackup,, npr crap, pacman, picsay, missed call, pop pop corn, power manager, service views, ring droid, rss reader, txtract, txtspeed,api demos, anycu, automata, cashflow, coloroid, compare everywhere, connectbot, dealsdroid, Dec 17 19:34:19 whats dgblue battery? Dec 17 19:34:26 what is a good book for learning java for coding on the android Dec 17 19:34:41 ffforever, do you have any exp w/ java? Dec 17 19:34:47 nope Dec 17 19:35:07 FFForever: headfirst java, then the online info Dec 17 19:35:15 I like the head first books for programming, its no android stuff, but still good Dec 17 19:35:22 java.sun.com/docs/books/tutorial/ Dec 17 19:35:24 yea. Dec 17 19:35:25 sun java tutorials Dec 17 19:35:40 doesn't really give you work problems to test your skills Dec 17 19:35:44 but does teach you Dec 17 19:35:47 also, free Dec 17 19:35:55 eclipse has some good video tutorials on the site Dec 17 19:36:41 javaomatic has some good very beginning stuff Dec 17 19:36:57 in video form, the narrator is a bit tarded though Dec 17 19:37:14 www.javaomatic.com Dec 17 19:37:21 javalava.com Dec 17 19:37:51 one more question about webkit in android...webkit not running on JVM right? correct me Dec 17 19:38:17 madha1: there's an android layer that performs JNI onto a C library Dec 17 19:38:26 so it's running on both JVM and Android Dec 17 19:38:28 er Dec 17 19:38:34 both JVM and native code Dec 17 19:38:45 unless I'm horribly mistaken Dec 17 19:39:28 this is a trusted source right?, http://graha.ms/androidproxy/ Dec 17 19:39:41 Tetherbot (as in it won't destroy my android) Dec 17 19:39:46 so webkit's complete source is ported on to java? Dec 17 19:40:14 no Dec 17 19:40:20 JNI is the Java Native Interface Dec 17 19:40:27 it allows you to call into c/c++ code Dec 17 19:40:35 there's a shared library, libwebkit.so Dec 17 19:40:35 anyone got an architecture diagrams..showing where webkit is sitting in android Dec 17 19:40:50 anyways what about the tetherbot? Dec 17 19:41:06 there is a stub android application for the browser that makes native webkit calls Dec 17 19:41:19 ffforever, what about it? Dec 17 19:41:25 madha1: source.android.com Dec 17 19:41:32 madha1: http://code.google.com/android/what-is-android.html Dec 17 19:41:44 is it safe to install? Dec 17 19:42:08 * unix_lappy wonders if there's a hopscotch game out there that uses the accelerometer..hmm. Dec 17 19:42:10 ive never installed it, but i believe its legit Dec 17 19:42:49 okay so android got a java UI which is using JNI calls to webkit c -code, everything else like rendering, platform is pretty same.. Dec 17 19:43:13 jbq: tk Dec 17 19:43:22 something like that. Dec 17 19:44:20 vol: tk... Dec 17 19:44:32 whats tk? Dec 17 19:44:54 thanks, I guess? Dec 17 19:45:02 yep Dec 17 19:45:02 ah, Dec 17 19:45:06 kk Dec 17 19:46:57 whats kk? Dec 17 19:47:00 ;) Dec 17 19:47:01 android's UI is a little bit jerky..not smooth...do u guys have any info...about composite manager/window manager Dec 17 19:48:45 madha1: look up surfaceflinger in the android source Dec 17 19:48:54 the UI is smooth enough for me Dec 17 19:50:34 surfaceflinger, uses GL as backend? Dec 17 19:50:52 i mean openGL Dec 17 19:51:35 I don't think so. Dec 17 19:51:42 hardware acceleration eats power Dec 17 19:51:51 feeel free to dig into the source code for android Dec 17 19:51:55 I'm the last person to ask Dec 17 19:52:00 lol, check this out Dec 17 19:52:00 http://lwn.net/Articles/249460/ Dec 17 19:52:33 ha, yes Dec 17 19:52:37 was looking at this earlier Dec 17 19:52:51 http://thread.gmane.org/gmane.comp.version-control.git/57643/focus=57918 Dec 17 19:53:09 wow. its not even a faq at this point, it should be a header in all the source files. Dec 17 19:55:05 vol: hardware acceleration eats power << OpenGL != hardware acceleration Dec 17 19:55:15 we have the awesome PixelFlinger for fast software based OpenGL rendering Dec 17 19:55:52 yay phone works Dec 17 19:56:39 i wish google made a java idea Dec 17 19:56:42 ide Dec 17 19:56:58 why? there are very good IDEs out there already Dec 17 19:56:59 why Dec 17 19:57:09 i wish k9 used logging :( instead of just "unable to connect" (you lie! you lie! you already got the cert! you lie!) Dec 17 19:57:17 so any good AIM/MSN clients? Dec 17 19:57:28 wasabi: yep. ships on the phone, called "IM" Dec 17 19:57:32 ;) Dec 17 19:57:34 bills as sms :( Dec 17 19:57:35 does aim/msn? oh Dec 17 19:57:38 oh geeze Dec 17 19:57:43 how's it manage that? Dec 17 19:57:56 tmob does it Dec 17 19:58:02 oh i'm not using a tmob phone Dec 17 19:58:06 so no such thing for me Dec 17 19:58:16 i need a good jabber client Dec 17 19:58:19 thats tmo's bread and butter Dec 17 19:58:32 20cents for a 5k file transfer Dec 17 19:58:46 wasabi: ah. Dec 17 19:58:48 speaking of that... Dec 17 19:58:52 geez, don't you guys get unlimited data plans? Dec 17 19:58:52 with a data plan that's unlimited though, right? Dec 17 19:58:56 <--- does Dec 17 19:58:59 is it possible to rip the tmobile apps off a g1 and run 'em on a dev phone? Dec 17 19:59:05 for say, IM Dec 17 19:59:07 grey-: probably. just need to grab the .apk Dec 17 19:59:09 or MYFAVES! lulz Dec 17 19:59:12 unlimited data doesn't cover sms/mms Dec 17 19:59:18 romain: just cause Dec 17 19:59:25 ahh, i got unlimited sms/mms too Dec 17 19:59:29 it was only $10 more Dec 17 19:59:34 because they are some sort of mythical file transfers that happen at a different level than regular data Dec 17 19:59:38 and I have lots of chicks that sms me Dec 17 19:59:40 marix: the $34.99 g1 plan from tmo has unlimited messaging too Dec 17 19:59:54 sms/mms isnt data its voodoo dust Dec 17 19:59:58 korndub, the 400 messages i was forced to buy is more than enough Dec 17 20:00:24 no g1 account comes w/o text messages Dec 17 20:00:31 marix: there is one Dec 17 20:00:39 its the same price, but no text messages Dec 17 20:00:46 oh, well phew Dec 17 20:00:49 i just looked no more than an hour ago Dec 17 20:01:01 marix: there are two g1 features, 24.99 unlimited data and 400 sms/mms Dec 17 20:01:08 and 34.99 ulimited data and unlimited messaging. Dec 17 20:01:21 *nod* it's $10/more/mo for unlimited txt. Dec 17 20:01:31 i can has ssh and tethering, i win Dec 17 20:01:39 my blackberry plan has unlimited data and no sms for 20 a month, why can't i have that plan without all the blackberry backend? Dec 17 20:01:43 i wish google had a web based browser incorporated into google docs Dec 17 20:01:56 a web based browser.... Dec 17 20:02:00 uhhh Dec 17 20:02:09 don't you need to access a web based browser with a browser? Dec 17 20:02:22 but they could make a better one, a faster one Dec 17 20:02:24 did you guys see the article on engadget about the actual cost of text messaging if converted to a per megabyte calculation, it was crazy... something like $1000.00 per meg at the current text rates of $0.20 Dec 17 20:02:28 blau-MikeDG: I see... Dec 17 20:02:29 that uses less memory Dec 17 20:02:32 haha Dec 17 20:02:37 perhaps. Dec 17 20:02:38 i have to believe at some point this text messages thing will come to a court room and it will be really hard for them to argue that the cost is appropriate. Dec 17 20:02:47 korndub: mmmm $1000/Meg. Dec 17 20:02:51 esp if they are already paying for unltd data Dec 17 20:03:14 grey-: isnt that ridiculous!!! Dec 17 20:03:30 and the txt rates keep going up Dec 17 20:03:31 wtf Dec 17 20:03:33 korndub: not for greedy telco operators like me MUHAHAhah Dec 17 20:03:44 grey-: pm? Dec 17 20:03:50 I'm just kidding. ;) Dec 17 20:04:53 anyone buy one of those livescribe pulse pens? Dec 17 20:07:31 marix: Or everybody starts using email or something at text messages finally just *go away*. Dec 17 20:08:25 *nod* Dec 17 20:08:27 cworth: or people switch to blackberry and use pin messaging which only uses data. Dec 17 20:08:32 in Japan email usage is up over sms now. Dec 17 20:08:41 ewww blackberry. Dec 17 20:08:45 cworth, perhaps... and the funny thing is i can email Phonenumber@tmomail.net and not get dinged for the cost. Dec 17 20:09:33 grey-: lol... Dec 17 20:09:36 there aren't 10 million blackberries out there? Dec 17 20:09:49 whatever there are, they're too many. Dec 17 20:09:57 have you ever run a BES system? Dec 17 20:10:00 z0mg, terrible. Dec 17 20:10:01 no Dec 17 20:10:12 their backend stuff is some of the worst software I've ever dealt with. Dec 17 20:10:17 yeah BES is horrid...permissions lockdown and SLOW Dec 17 20:10:28 not user friendly or efficient. Dec 17 20:11:03 people complain about android going through google [for now] but egads, I trust google more than I do RIM. Dec 17 20:11:35 bes isn't a bad solution, but relying on the RIM backend for delivery isn't a good method. Dec 17 20:11:49 well as a solution, it gives people what they want Dec 17 20:11:50 and even if google servers break, the androids will still work for the most part Dec 17 20:11:53 is there going to be a google earth for android? Dec 17 20:11:55 but as an implementation, IMNSHO it's terrible. Dec 17 20:12:03 d0netsFN: there's a bugreport about that Dec 17 20:12:04 how does this mymaps app work Dec 17 20:12:11 d0netsFN: good question, seeing how they released an iphone version, maybe? Dec 17 20:12:13 it uses pixie dust Dec 17 20:12:13 not like when the Blackberry servers went down for that week a while back Dec 17 20:12:20 Disconnect: and ponies. Dec 17 20:12:36 i want to make a map for my snowboarding trip Dec 17 20:12:54 i added a few destinations to my maps from my pc Dec 17 20:12:56 korndub, that was less than 12 hours but yea still a huge impact. Dec 17 20:13:05 but i want directions and such to the places Dec 17 20:13:46 marix: true...sorry about that... its funny how 12 hours without blackberries impacted so many people.... Dec 17 20:13:57 d0netsFN: i want a ponie. Dec 17 20:14:03 er.. duh. pony. Dec 17 20:14:12 im sure you do disconnect Dec 17 20:14:17 p0wny Dec 17 20:15:44 * blau-MikeDG slaps korndub around a bit with a large trout Dec 17 20:15:49 lol that was an accident Dec 17 20:16:27 blau-MikeDG: lol...thanks... i needed that...was falling asleep at the console.....lol Dec 17 20:18:06 what is with these horrible browsers :/ Dec 17 20:18:18 steel has a horrible ui, opera does too Dec 17 20:18:25 korndub, yea the problem wasn't that it happened, it was that it happened several times that spring/summer and really showed the fragility of the RIM servers Dec 17 20:18:26 yep i agree Dec 17 20:18:46 with that said, id pay an arm and a leg to have Blackberry messenger on my g1 Dec 17 20:18:48 marix: yep, and with all of the government employees using it, it got major attention. Dec 17 20:19:09 government and Wall Street Dec 17 20:19:13 marix: me too... i was a blackberry user prior to the G1 and i really miss how clean and functional the BB messenger is. Dec 17 20:19:18 yep Dec 17 20:19:57 my pearl has been reassigned to mp3 player duties :( Dec 17 20:20:23 steel fails so huge wtf Dec 17 20:20:40 blau-MikeDG: its got a ways to go for sure... Dec 17 20:21:39 their icons are way too small and what possessed them to make the menu button goto that stupid full page settings Dec 17 20:21:47 do they honestly expect people to be in there that often Dec 17 20:22:08 and then they used their own ugly ass preference page Dec 17 20:22:38 fullscreen - win. simple, repeatable way to get zoom/pan on any page - win. Dec 17 20:22:42 I've tried steel twice, and uninstalled it immediately on trying to use it Dec 17 20:22:55 their keyboard is nice at least Dec 17 20:22:58 anyone remember the paper airplane game that came on the macs? Dec 17 20:23:14 onscreen haptic keyboard concept - win. (reality is.. eh. doesn't register very well.) Dec 17 20:23:32 disc: double click trackball is in normal browser Dec 17 20:23:55 i should say 'on or off' Dec 17 20:24:17 glider, someone needs to recreate that game really bad. Dec 17 20:24:24 cuz i hate having to scroll somewhere, then wait or the + - X to go away so i can click something thats under it Dec 17 20:25:02 anyone tried the 3d jet game yet? Dec 17 20:25:11 just released on the market Dec 17 20:25:17 it hurts my head Dec 17 20:25:39 disc: theres no way to click anything in the upper right or lower left corners in steel Dec 17 20:25:44 * unix_lappy would *LOVE IT* if the volume up down buttons could be used to zoom. Dec 17 20:26:07 thats awesome lappy Dec 17 20:26:26 blau-MikeDG: admittedly. but its a much smaller area and at least for me, its way less annoying than the default ones. Dec 17 20:26:40 it'd be nice to see some integration between them Dec 17 20:27:02 i think im gonna release my quicklaunch app as a browser Dec 17 20:27:08 thats what I use it more for now anyway :( Dec 17 20:28:11 lappy: is there a way to detec volume keys? Dec 17 20:28:45 but not actually let it affect volume Dec 17 20:29:43 i gotta roll Dec 17 20:30:55 blau-MikeDG: not sure. though it would be nice imho. i dont quite like that pinch gesture because it takes two hands. Dec 17 20:31:56 unix_lappy: i swear one of the demo videos worked that way Dec 17 20:32:08 i hate that you have to move the map a bit to be able to zoom in/out Dec 17 20:32:17 or whatever else is zoomable Dec 17 20:33:20 you could tie zooming to the trackball Dec 17 20:33:49 yeah trackball usually useless for scrolling 2d surfaces anyway Dec 17 20:34:12 but thats more of an android source patch than an app anyone could write, right? Dec 17 20:34:33 http://groups.google.com/group/android-developers/browse_thread/thread/2cdc04c60ab2eaee# Dec 17 20:34:43 really stuck on this one Dec 17 20:34:46 luok, you could probably rerelease the browser w/ that functionality... Dec 17 20:34:51 can't not update the GUI :/ Dec 17 20:35:18 that flyer game sucks.... Dec 17 20:35:40 mikey|: sure you can. same as k9, k9sms etc did. Dec 17 20:35:52 or test it out in emulator and get jf &tc to bundle it in the next rc30 Dec 17 20:36:28 mikey|: connectbot is your model for doing that successfully Dec 17 20:36:33 hi folks, im after a little advice please... dont suppose anyone knows how to extract the origional boot logo? im going to replace it, but want the old one for warranty purposes Dec 17 20:36:43 haha Dec 17 20:36:48 any good music player for android? Dec 17 20:36:49 good plan Dec 17 20:36:52 fastboot has no 'get' but you can pull it with dd from inside the system Dec 17 20:36:57 Disconnect: I had a look at their code but didnt really understand it Dec 17 20:37:18 korndub, it needs to be cooking for alot longer... and some heads up about orientation etc would be nice. Dec 17 20:37:31 mikey|: #connectbot might be able to help. (I stopped messing with the code a -long- time ago.) Dec 17 20:38:03 Disconnect: cheers, what would the command be please? Dec 17 20:42:32 Disconnect: any idea where it is? Dec 17 20:43:29 marix: i suppose..all i saw was a white screen, maybe it is corrupt on my g1 Dec 17 20:44:59 <_Lunch> How can I read sms messages (in code)? Dec 17 20:46:12 korndub, you hold your g1 like a steering wheel and tilt it Dec 17 20:46:20 push the track ball to shoot bullets Dec 17 20:46:31 but i dunno anythign else Dec 17 20:46:41 i tried that but all i see is white... and the little boxes at the bottom left are hard to see... Dec 17 20:47:55 _Lunch: iirc, you catch broadcasts Dec 17 20:47:58 I could be wrong Dec 17 20:48:54 <_Lunch> vol, well MyBackup extracts the messages, so I'm assuming its possible Dec 17 20:49:24 <_Lunch> there's also SmsExtract (I think) but none of those does what I want them to do Dec 17 20:49:47 <_Lunch> and from looking through the android source and reference, I can't figure out how to do any of them Dec 17 20:53:58 I guess I can't help you, sorry : ( Dec 17 20:54:16 <_Lunch> maybe there's an app like this, I don't know. Dec 17 20:57:07 i just had a guy come in looking for a 3.5 inch floppy, when i pulled one out he told me back in his day this is all they had, no cd's at all... I think he believes i've never worked w/ a floppy disk before. Dec 17 20:57:35 but have you ever worked with 8" floppy disks? ;) Dec 17 20:57:49 how stupid that the ubuntu repositories dont carry the latest eclipse Dec 17 20:58:07 <_Lunch> very stupid Dec 17 20:58:15 or the latest xchat Dec 17 20:58:22 <_Lunch> ok here is what I want. Dec 17 20:58:24 or latest * Dec 17 20:58:30 ctate: Ive tossed one. Dec 17 20:58:37 heh Dec 17 20:58:40 * mmarker_ shuts up now. Dec 17 20:58:51 They are damn good at flying. Dec 17 20:58:57 * ctate 's first paid programming job involved a machine whose only external storage was a streaming tape drive. Dec 17 20:59:18 <_Lunch> I want an app that extracts sms messages to txt, and mms messages as pictures/video/sound, onto my sd card Dec 17 20:59:30 ivantis: I agree : ( Dec 17 20:59:38 they err on the side of "really stable" though Dec 17 20:59:58 * ivantis 's first paid programming job involved a person who replied to messages at 4:00 AM and then eventually died, so i actually never got paid for it Dec 17 21:00:00 <_Lunch> "In my day all we had were 1s and 0s... and sometimes we didn't ever have 1s" Dec 17 21:00:09 _Lunch: that would make sense, except its not "secure" to let you have your data :) Dec 17 21:00:11 <_Lunch> "You had 1s? We had to use the letter I" Dec 17 21:00:31 "You had Is? We had to use i!" Dec 17 21:00:39 <_Lunch> ivan, ha Dec 17 21:01:05 <_Lunch> Disconnect, if I wanted security I wouldn't have a cellphone, or a credit card... Just guns, lots of guns. Dec 17 21:01:36 but how would you get on IRC at school if you didn't have a cell phone? Dec 17 21:02:08 _Lunch: then you should stick to winmo or symbian. they figure you are in charge of your data, unlike android :/ Dec 17 21:02:31 <_Lunch> the day I get on IRC on my cellphone is the day I give up completely and just wear sweatpants 24/7 Dec 17 21:02:38 oh crap that reminds me of my geometry test on friday. anyone know how to find the area of an irregular rhombus? Dec 17 21:02:39 and omg, xavier has a brother. http://groups.google.com/group/android-developers/browse_thread/thread/c8c4d65327dcfa8e Dec 17 21:02:47 _Lunch: no G1 yet eh? Dec 17 21:02:53 stuff like IRC is an interesting problem for mobile devices Dec 17 21:03:00 <_Lunch> ivan, I just haven't installed an irc client. Dec 17 21:03:06 dude Dec 17 21:03:06 <_Lunch> besides this channel, I don't really irc anymore Dec 17 21:03:08 androidirc Dec 17 21:03:11 since the devices ideally want to drop connection ALL THE TIME Dec 17 21:03:11 i use it all the time Dec 17 21:03:12 _Lunch, exactly, a road trip Dec 17 21:03:18 its less interesting when wifi supports variable power saving modes. Dec 17 21:03:18 wear sweatpants and irc from phone Dec 17 21:03:22 mine doesnt Dec 17 21:03:30 ivantis: does that just hold the connection open all the time, even when the screen goes dark? Dec 17 21:03:34 i am at my limit of channels i can be in on freenode Dec 17 21:03:35 a roadtrip is the day you will do it Dec 17 21:03:41 proxy + variable powersaving == long-life irc on mobile Dec 17 21:03:45 (that's not ideal for battery) Dec 17 21:03:48 ctate: androidirc prevents it sleeping Dec 17 21:03:56 <_Lunch> androidirc not in the market? Dec 17 21:03:59 irc on my phone blows Dec 17 21:04:00 and i dont use it that much Dec 17 21:04:07 see my dropping butt Dec 17 21:04:08 yeah, battery drain then FTL. having a caching proxy is really the right approach. Dec 17 21:04:12 _Lunch: you have to download it, i forget the link Dec 17 21:04:18 no its on on market Dec 17 21:04:19 a good mobile IRC client would use a server proxy to be able to take the connection down at the first opportunity. Dec 17 21:04:22 it wont be until you can charge for apps Dec 17 21:04:24 it is? Dec 17 21:04:27 he plans on charging 5 bucks Dec 17 21:04:28 i couldnt find it Dec 17 21:04:34 $5? Dec 17 21:04:35 dude Dec 17 21:04:36 jbq: i was writing mine to do that Dec 17 21:04:38 i got it fo' free Dec 17 21:04:42 right Dec 17 21:04:43 <_Lunch> irc clients are easy Dec 17 21:04:44 when its done ivantis Dec 17 21:04:49 oic Dec 17 21:04:53 <_Lunch> what does he have in it that justifies 5 bucks? Dec 17 21:04:54 well, it works great for me Dec 17 21:04:59 right now its just beta, hence why its on google code and not in the market Dec 17 21:04:59 _Lunch: but GOOD irc clients aren't :) Dec 17 21:05:15 _Lunch time Dec 17 21:05:22 <_Lunch> irc clients are easy < maybe you can help me with a problem I'm having then :p Dec 17 21:05:22 _Lunch: time Dec 17 21:05:24 If it's a cell phone and uses the network, it's not easy. Dec 17 21:05:31 Addicted to _Lunch? Dec 17 21:05:32 dude, if it had alerts and vibration on PMs/highlights, it would be worth $5 Dec 17 21:05:42 _Lunch in an Elevator? Dec 17 21:05:44 * ctate stops now. Dec 17 21:05:47 it is in his to do list Dec 17 21:05:49 <_Lunch> d0nets, time what? Dec 17 21:06:04 _Lunch thats what he has in the app tha tjustifies 5$ Dec 17 21:06:06 his time Dec 17 21:06:13 <_Lunch> ahh Dec 17 21:06:21 i agree, i wont be paying 5$ when its not free Dec 17 21:06:26 jbq: you busy or anything? Dec 17 21:06:39 i will just figure out a way to pirate it and/or just use connectbot and bitchx Dec 17 21:06:42 mikey|: somewhat busy, but I can spare a few seconds. Dec 17 21:06:42 i know thats wrong Dec 17 21:06:44 and i love nyt Dec 17 21:06:45 <_Lunch> mikey, what's the problem you're having? Dec 17 21:06:50 hes an @ in my chan on efnet Dec 17 21:07:04 but i as well as others wont see 5$ in the budget for an irc app Dec 17 21:07:10 does he deserve it? maybe Dec 17 21:07:18 but can i pay it? not really Dec 17 21:07:21 jbq: im having a problem with my irc app, I have an idea of how to work around it by using the same method as connectbot, but I want to see if theres any other way Dec 17 21:07:30 http://groups.google.com/group/android-developers/browse_thread/thread/2cdc04c60ab2eaee Dec 17 21:07:59 use a service Dec 17 21:08:11 <_Lunch> reading the thread... one sec Dec 17 21:08:59 I am using a service, but the problem is keeping the GUI up to date. Should I just keep a temp var which stores the info? Dec 17 21:09:09 if the irc app is going to charge people, i'll have to continue writing mine then :) Dec 17 21:09:14 A good trick would be more or less to have a service update the back-end to a content provider, and have the UI pull from the provider. Dec 17 21:09:16 plus mine uses a proxy setup Dec 17 21:09:23 right Dec 17 21:09:27 its supply and demand Dec 17 21:09:39 (the advantage of doing it like that is that you naturally strongly decouple the front-end and the back-end) Dec 17 21:09:45 michaelnovakjr_: yeah, that's the Right Way. you use a LOT less battery with that approach. Dec 17 21:10:23 you supply me a free irc app, i wont have a demand to pay 5$ for another one Dec 17 21:10:24 <_Lunch> I agree Dec 17 21:10:24 lulz Dec 17 21:10:39 well, my battery usually lasts a while Dec 17 21:10:43 ctate: nothing wrong with straight tcp over wifi if you set your power saving options correctly. http://linux.die.net/man/8/iwconfig ('power' not 'txpower' just 'power' :) ..) Dec 17 21:10:58 not after the first couple charges, but now it will last all day playing games/ircing Dec 17 21:11:02 my app seems pretty stable, just need to make it into a service Dec 17 21:11:10 and it's free, but not multi server Dec 17 21:11:25 Disconnect is that the command powertop has you run? Dec 17 21:11:31 d0netsFN: ..no Dec 17 21:11:35 or at least, probably not Dec 17 21:11:38 iwconfig -power 5? Dec 17 21:11:46 im not positive one sec Dec 17 21:12:01 Disconnect: you still have to let the radio power down entirely SOMEHOW to save the battery, and unless you've got a proxy somewhere, that will show up as a dropped connection to the other end of the socket. Dec 17 21:12:13 well, when mine's released if people use that's cool, if not at least i have a client that's good on battery life :) Dec 17 21:12:19 bouncing on and off IRC isn't ideal. Dec 17 21:12:43 using it over 3g doesn't seem to harsh on the battery Dec 17 21:12:46 ctate: you don't though, thats the beauty of it. you turn off rx/tx and every - second or more - you wake up and ask the AP for pending packets. (if you get nicely in sync, in a perfect world, you wake up just in time to see the AP say "i have packets for ,,"..) Dec 17 21:13:04 without using power in the middle, and without losing association Dec 17 21:13:06 only works with wifi, and is still more power than not asking at all :) Dec 17 21:13:12 its a specific 802.11 powersave mode Dec 17 21:13:26 yea, and if you are on 3G? then what? Dec 17 21:13:32 FWIW, that's basically how bluetooth works too. At idle, the radio is off most of the time. Dec 17 21:14:18 andyross: zigbee too, which is where i ended up implementing it Dec 17 21:14:20 when I used it, the 3g icon didnt show a persistant connection to the server (i.e. the arrows were not changed to white) Dec 17 21:14:26 (wow thats an ugly spec and a half) Dec 17 21:14:39 mikey|, that doesn't mean it was connected Dec 17 21:14:44 mikey|: that isn't a connection, that means you are maxing out the link Dec 17 21:14:46 wasn't* Dec 17 21:15:04 heh Dec 17 21:15:28 maxing out the link? with a text based protocol? not sure what you mean? Dec 17 21:16:46 ctate: your options on wifi are to stay full power and rx all the time, tx when needed, drop connection completely and reestablish (a long cpu and power intensive process) -- these are what android currently does -- or keep connection as long as possible, adjusting polling rates and powersave modes as needed. according to spec, "off" and "powersave" are the same power draw (actually, might just be very close. either way, not noticable outside a lab environme Dec 17 21:17:11 * Disconnect waits for ctate to ignore the "on wifi" bit again Dec 17 21:17:25 Disconnect: but you aren't programming for just wifi Dec 17 21:17:41 michaelnovakjr_: sure. but 3g has similar powersave modes. Dec 17 21:17:55 "I can't cure cancer with this, so whats the point of writing it?" Dec 17 21:18:12 not that, but you can certainly implement something that works for both Dec 17 21:18:26 grrr. I need to finish my xmpp muc app Dec 17 21:18:38 so I can kill batteries Dec 17 21:18:51 * Disconnect never understood "oh, its not worth bothering with that - sure, its a major savings, but only for part of the time" Dec 17 21:19:07 Disconnect: i'm not saying it isn't worth it Dec 17 21:19:16 argh Dec 17 21:19:38 I don't know about wifi, but I've seen power graphs for the cell radio and it really powers down as much as it possibly can. Since wifi doesn't use much more power than cell, it's reasonable to assume that it does something very similar already. Dec 17 21:20:01 disconnect link me to your g1 accessories page Dec 17 21:20:03 jbq: wifi rx's something like 80% of the time in 'normal' mode to keep latency down Dec 17 21:20:06 i need to finish up my xmas shopping Dec 17 21:20:17 d0netsFN: http://www.gotontheinter.net/content/essential-g1adp1-accessories Dec 17 21:20:26 cool :) Dec 17 21:20:49 * Disconnect personally isn't -that- worried about getting a "your-name" notification 1s late on irc :) Dec 17 21:20:50 Disconnect: I guess that you need to talk to people who actually know stuff in that area. Because for anyone else, it indeed won't be worth the effort. Dec 17 21:21:18 disconnect did you get my pm about the arkon car mounts? Dec 17 21:21:22 i got mine today Dec 17 21:21:32 i must have missed it Dec 17 21:21:40 i sent it a few days ago Dec 17 21:21:45 :( Dec 17 21:21:48 i need a car mount actually Dec 17 21:22:34 http://www.google.com/product_url?q=http://www.beegool.com/product_info.php%3Fproducts_id%3D48125&fr=AHRUs-OVE0nYP9i2dRqxilul_QJt-gWUA-Kx6-yddSuqtxUoQfynd2ivWi8PrPmtl1ZWWE0pVhnQ4HPlMYdz2yG6bnE7Fc5IGWrV-JcK36YxhqVuCgslwbWhkRGc0oxzaELE2C1wys7RAAAAAAAAAAA&ei=kG1JSbrfC4usgAK5l5S0Bw&sig2=9eDXg5i452jQ9W5XyeK4IA&gl=us&hl=en&sa=title Dec 17 21:22:38 mondo link Dec 17 21:22:50 yah thats a link and a half Dec 17 21:23:12 http://www.beegool.com/product_info.php?products_id=48125 unless the first one had associate links Dec 17 21:23:16 arkon sm210 or 215 Dec 17 21:23:34 one has a shorter flex thinger Dec 17 21:24:59 i could do with an in car charger as well, but I need to fix the plug thing Dec 17 21:26:35 It's like my phone is a totally different phone since I've started leaving the wifi off. Dec 17 21:26:52 I haven't plugged it in since 06:30 and it's still mostly green Dec 17 21:27:10 And that's with 3G idling. Dec 17 21:27:22 I don't have email auto-checks on, though, for philosophical reasons. Dec 17 21:28:17 email checks are actually pretty light Dec 17 21:28:21 wifi isn't :( Dec 17 21:28:22 that's totally weird, when the G1 wakes up it goes from EDGE to Wifi. Dec 17 21:28:50 unix_lappy: cuz wifi is off after it goes to sleep. Dec 17 21:28:53 either that's a onResume bug or it actually does drop wifi and go to edge when sleeping. Dec 17 21:28:53 blame ttuttle Dec 17 21:28:56 the powered-down state just keeps the radio alive enough to stay on the cell network, and turns off the wifi parts Dec 17 21:28:57 unix_lappy, I've seen that, but somehow, it's making a big difference Dec 17 21:28:59 i used wifi for 30 mins full earlier today, it went down by 8% Dec 17 21:29:05 * brocktice shakes his fist at ttuttle Dec 17 21:29:09 brocktice: what is? Dec 17 21:29:24 unix_lappy, leaving wifi totally off Dec 17 21:29:31 it drops wifi 2 mins after the screen goes out Dec 17 21:29:35 Sorry I thought your statement was in response to my earlier ones. Dec 17 21:29:37 ==Disconnect Dec 17 21:29:41 no point shaking his fist at ttuttle, he just implemented what he was told to implement. Dec 17 21:29:54 jbq: just followin orders is never an excuse Dec 17 21:29:58 jbq, Disconnect told me to blame him :) Dec 17 21:29:59 i think it's a proper power management model. Dec 17 21:30:01 so I did Dec 17 21:30:13 it was tongue-in-cheek Dec 17 21:30:44 * jasta never uses wifi... Dec 17 21:30:53 if an app sees wifi enabled and it's plugged in it should assume it has the right to keep the G1 from sleeping. Dec 17 21:30:54 i dont think ive even turned it on for any reason but development/debugging Dec 17 21:30:54 I'd better shut up here or I'll say something I'll regret. Dec 17 21:31:19 jbq: ? Dec 17 21:31:58 i don't think he'll reply.... Dec 17 21:32:13 and a (very brief) rundown of 802.11 powersave modes. http://www.techworld.com/mobility/features/index.cfm?featureid=4103 Dec 17 21:32:20 I definitely won't ;) This is not a reply. Dec 17 21:32:59 meh. then you shouldn't have said that to begin with. Dec 17 21:33:14 it actually seems like wifi takes up less battery for me Dec 17 21:33:16 im not sure why Dec 17 21:33:19 Of all the things we should be bugging them about, this is certainly not one of them ;-) Dec 17 21:34:26 * Disconnect ponders lodging a gpl req for the exact rc28 kernel, bluez sources. just cuz. Dec 17 21:35:12 is there anything like the iphone slide lock for android? i remember seeing some app in the market but it had a sketchy description Dec 17 21:35:13 Disconnect: sure, be a smartass :) everybody will love you when we blame you for the delay in releasing the latest source tree. Dec 17 21:35:28 LOL Dec 17 21:36:09 according to you, rc30 is a branch from your trees. so its up to tmob, not you. Dec 17 21:36:25 try to blame me and then pull that "platform not device" crap, see how that works out :) Dec 17 21:36:43 That doesn't mean that T-Mobile doesn't work with subcontractors and partners. Dec 17 21:36:47 dammit! Dec 17 21:36:55 eh? Dec 17 21:37:06 eclipse isnt working for me Dec 17 21:37:14 surprise Dec 17 21:37:52 that's pretty general, how is eclipse not working for you? Dec 17 21:38:57 it goes to that eclipse thing, the purple window Dec 17 21:39:06 then opens a small window with nothing in it Dec 17 21:39:15 but the one from the ubuntu repositories works Dec 17 21:39:17 hm, corrupt workspace? Dec 17 21:39:22 oh interesting Dec 17 21:39:29 which, sigh, is NOT 3.4, its 3.2 Dec 17 21:40:01 i just rm -r'ed my workspace Dec 17 21:40:04 trying again Dec 17 21:41:08 grrrr! did it again Dec 17 21:41:11 sounds like something could be messed up with your classpath maybe Dec 17 21:41:20 or my computer Dec 17 21:41:42 new account Dec 17 21:41:45 time Dec 17 21:42:52 remember this link for me: http://www.howtoforge.com/installing-google-android-sdk1.0-on-ubuntu8.04-desktop Dec 17 21:43:06 why not try starting eclipse from the shell, see if it throws an error Dec 17 21:43:08 luok: In Settings -> Security & Location, you can choose Require pattern. That will make it require you to draw a pattern of your choosing to unlock the screen Dec 17 21:43:47 streeter: yeah i was just lookin for a clone of the iphone unlock Dec 17 21:44:04 the iphone slide lock? Dec 17 21:44:18 Is there some way to disable the default screen lock? Dec 17 21:44:26 luok: I don't know the iPhone well, but doesn't it do the same thing? Dec 17 21:44:35 the iphone screen lock by default sucks Dec 17 21:44:40 you can make it not lock... is that what you're looking for brocktice? Dec 17 21:44:48 michaelnovakjr_: is there a replacement iphone screenlock? Dec 17 21:44:49 marix, Yes, how have I not found this option? Dec 17 21:45:02 I mean, not lock at all, not "not lock with a pattern" Dec 17 21:45:06 benley: if you jailbreak it i think there is Dec 17 21:45:18 So I don't have to press menu every time I turn it on. Dec 17 21:45:37 michaelnovakjr_: ah Dec 17 21:45:44 * benley isn't sure he wants to bother jailbreaking his ipod touch Dec 17 21:45:53 brocktice, but then it would be activating in your pocket Dec 17 21:45:55 the iphone unlocked in my pocket a few times Dec 17 21:46:22 yeah, it's generally not a great idea to let the phone fully wake up in your pocket (which the Menu requirement is for) Dec 17 21:46:29 marix, normally with devices like this, like my treo 650, you can do something to lock it but not have it lock every time. Dec 17 21:46:31 it's really easy to wind up with it making calls Dec 17 21:46:39 brocktice: why would you want it to never lock? You'd be making random phonecalls and such every time you put the phone in your pocket Dec 17 21:46:49 streeter, not never, only when I tell it to. Dec 17 21:47:00 like if I do menu->lock Dec 17 21:47:15 he has superior command over his phone obviously streeter Dec 17 21:47:16 luok: the pattern could just be a horizontal swipe on the bottom row. Dec 17 21:47:26 hehe i tried that Dec 17 21:47:33 but you need >4 dots and you still have to press menu Dec 17 21:47:33 must be at least 4 dots :) Dec 17 21:47:36 cant find the boot logo on the g1, anyone know the location please. im after copying it before i replace it Dec 17 21:47:39 annoying Dec 17 21:47:41 i dunno why its power, menu, slide rather than just power, slide Dec 17 21:47:50 luok YES Dec 17 21:47:54 SGTDavePwnage: it's flashed and you can't change it on the commercial G1s Dec 17 21:47:57 today's cellular sadness: http://zoiks.net/~benley/nicethings.jpg Dec 17 21:48:17 benley, ouch Dec 17 21:48:18 if you slide the keyboard up it will unlock w/ out menu Dec 17 21:48:18 ctate: yeah, already changed it on one Dec 17 21:48:22 does that help you? Dec 17 21:48:28 luok: its not power, menu, slide. its just menu menu slide. but yah, when lock is enabled 'menu' could be enough to wake-and-look-for-code Dec 17 21:48:29 i do like that feature Dec 17 21:48:34 SGTDavePwnage: you broke the bootloader to do it? Dec 17 21:48:38 * ctate just curious Dec 17 21:48:41 but a lot of times i'm not using the keyboard Dec 17 21:48:52 Disconnect, right, I usually do menu menu. Dec 17 21:48:58 ctate: yeah :-) Dec 17 21:49:14 marix, not really :( Dec 17 21:49:20 * luok misses treo 650 Dec 17 21:49:24 I guess there's not something I'm missing after all -- it's just that way. Dec 17 21:49:31 Guess I should get hacking on it eh? Dec 17 21:49:50 ctate: just dont want to remove it from my other g1 before i get a copy of it. might need it for sending back or something Dec 17 21:50:06 its one of the small mtd partitions. Dec 17 21:50:28 maybe mtdblock0 Dec 17 21:50:54 cheers, will have a look on my already changed one then do a compare Dec 17 21:51:11 /proc/partitions is your friend Dec 17 21:51:19 bbl its beer oclock Dec 17 21:51:24 mount too Dec 17 21:52:07 mount won't show him the splash partitions. Dec 17 21:52:18 ah Dec 17 21:52:20 but yah, it will help prove that the splash images aren't 69 megs :) Dec 17 21:52:29 :) Dec 17 21:52:51 man what a piece of crap Dec 17 21:52:55 it didnt even work Dec 17 21:53:23 try downloading eclipse again :) Dec 17 21:53:33 looking at mtd0 it looks too small Dec 17 21:53:35 noo! Dec 17 21:53:40 it took like 10 years to download Dec 17 21:53:54 well, get yourself something other than a 56K modem Dec 17 21:54:46 well, cant i just not use eclipse? Dec 17 21:54:52 sure Dec 17 21:54:54 it just makes things look fancy, right? Dec 17 21:54:57 no one is forcing you :) Dec 17 21:55:02 okay, what should i start with? Dec 17 21:55:05 my first app Dec 17 21:55:12 you can use another IDE then Dec 17 21:55:27 intellij is another choice Dec 17 21:57:15 can i just do it with a text editor? Dec 17 21:57:22 sure' Dec 17 21:57:24 sure you can Dec 17 21:57:28 it will just be a PITA :P Dec 17 21:57:33 you won't get syntax coloring and stuff like that Dec 17 21:57:42 or autocomplete Dec 17 21:57:46 yea that too Dec 17 21:57:47 or constant error checking Dec 17 21:57:53 which saves a lot of checking docs :) Dec 17 21:57:53 or call hierarchy calls Dec 17 21:57:55 or refactoring Dec 17 21:57:56 ai dont care Dec 17 21:58:03 or integrated debugging Dec 17 21:58:04 * michaelnovakjr_ smells a newb Dec 17 21:58:07 gedit has enough simple highlighting for me Dec 17 21:58:08 (enjoy javad or whateverit's called) Dec 17 21:58:21 Wait. Text editors don't do syntax highlighting? News to me... Dec 17 21:58:25 thats how i have always written C++ for ages Dec 17 21:58:37 okay Dec 17 21:58:37 andyross: not all of them Dec 17 21:58:42 anyone here using gears + google reader for offline reading on the G1? Dec 17 21:58:51 can i download the helloworld app .apk somewhere? Dec 17 21:59:00 All of them except notepad. Dec 17 21:59:12 Hi all people! Dec 17 21:59:15 hi Dec 17 21:59:33 hello all; no joy here on error popping initially infrequently. now solidly pops & remains until i mount the sdcard upon tethering g1 to my laptop. 'Exception Processing Message 0xc0000013 Parameters 0x75E992A0 0x00000004 0x75E992A0 0x75E992A0' Dec 17 21:59:42 I've got a small question for someone who is a registered android market dev :) Dec 17 21:59:50 tried googled resolve @ http://teknobabble.wordpress.com/2007/08/18/vista-driver-problems-installing-a-usb-media-reader-a-solution/ to no avail Dec 17 21:59:52 How much is the shipping of the Dev1 to Spain?? :D Dec 17 21:59:59 * jbq checks Dec 17 22:00:09 thanks! :) Dec 17 22:00:52 Seems to be $80.32 Dec 17 22:00:52 any clues appreciated.. running vista home on laptop here fyi. rc30 on g1. i have already tried safely removing g1 etc & above advisory. monkey still here Dec 17 22:02:22 cool jbq thanks a lot! Dec 17 22:02:37 so in all the phone is $480 Dec 17 22:02:48 is that with all taxes included and all? Dec 17 22:03:43 how do i make a .apk? Dec 17 22:03:45 i forgot Dec 17 22:04:19 ditman: from what I'm reading, yes, that's with all taxes included. Dec 17 22:04:39 ditman: shipping itself was about $45 if I read correctly, the rest is taxes. Dec 17 22:04:53 jbq thank you a lot! You've just saved me 25$ just to check this out :) Dec 17 22:05:01 (I hope I got those numbers right, it'd be good if someone could confirm) Dec 17 22:05:35 anyone knows how to handle rollerball events? Dec 17 22:05:39 form g1 Dec 17 22:06:04 ivantis check out the docs Dec 17 22:06:14 oh, ant? Dec 17 22:06:20 yes Dec 17 22:06:24 ant builds the project Dec 17 22:08:05 ?? Dec 17 22:08:12 what javac do i need for ant? Dec 17 22:08:27 Unable to find a javac compiler; Dec 17 22:08:27 com.sun.tools.javac.Main is not on the classpath. Dec 17 22:08:27 Perhaps JAVA_HOME does not point to the JDK. Dec 17 22:08:41 I'll see you later, I just got a G1 and will start developing ;) Dec 17 22:08:53 ivantis: read the instructions on how to set up your paths for java Dec 17 22:08:56 or, just use eclipse :\ Dec 17 22:09:07 (trust me, it's srsly just easier to do that) Dec 17 22:09:09 where are the instructions? Dec 17 22:09:24 google "java paths" or something Dec 17 22:21:22 <_Lunch> Is there a list of common Content URIs? Dec 17 22:37:38 anyone have experince with ItemizedOverlay for a MapActivity? I've got items drawing, but cant get the title/summary to display when tapped. Dec 17 22:38:42 using setFocus(item) from onTap in the ItemizedOverlay but nothing happens. it may need a new approach but unsure how to proceed. Dec 17 22:59:09 sweet! Dec 17 22:59:16 i finally compiled HelloAndroid! Dec 17 22:59:17 yay! Dec 17 22:59:33 yes, with ant and only gedit Dec 17 22:59:39 no fancy IDE Dec 17 22:59:54 wow Dec 17 23:01:05 who needs IDEs Dec 17 23:01:13 squares Dec 17 23:01:16 i do Dec 17 23:01:59 have fun finding spelling or syntax mistakes while compiling :) Dec 17 23:02:14 ah wait... i don't even compile.... eclipse builds automatically when i save :) Dec 17 23:02:40 Eclipse is a pretty good Java IDE. i've come to appreciate it. Dec 17 23:02:48 indeed ctate Dec 17 23:03:00 Are we back to this flame war? What do you use to do your build automation? Oh wait, you don't, you just have some monkey press F3 or whatever whenever you need a build. :) Dec 17 23:07:03 anyone know of a good site of android openGL games and source code? Dec 17 23:08:18 probably not too many games right now due to storage issues Dec 17 23:09:02 can someone explain line 35 in http://androidguys.com/?p=1413. 'NooYawk' is the app name i assume but what does NooYawk.this mean in the context of another class? (i get 'no enclosing instance of type accessable in scope') Dec 17 23:09:03 there's a demo thing on the market though, probably source available to it somewhere Dec 17 23:11:52 how do i use adb to reinstall a package? Dec 17 23:12:00 adb install -r Dec 17 23:12:37 kay Dec 17 23:13:01 oh, battery stuff - disabled wifi and uninstalled streamfurious and it went back up.. probably the wifi, though i'm not sure how much of a power drain wifi has when the phone is sleeping Dec 17 23:14:31 zinx: well, normally when the phone sleeps wifi shuts off... Dec 17 23:14:41 with a wifilock on, however, wifi would drain quite a bit of battery even idle Dec 17 23:14:42 then i blame streamfurious Dec 17 23:15:09 that assumes nothing wakes it up :) Dec 17 23:15:13 it was doing something when idle, it didn't really seem like that much though, as far as cpu time consumed Dec 17 23:15:34 it must have held a wake lock then Dec 17 23:15:34 "adb install -r" ... Wow ... was android designed to feel just like any other linux distro, because it makes all us Linux geeks feel so warm and fuzzy :-) Dec 17 23:15:39 which would explain why the battery drained so quickly Dec 17 23:15:39 someone needs to do a sideby side power management test with the iPhone 3G. Dec 17 23:15:39 something when it should have been doing absolutely nothing, since it has nothing to sync and wasn't playing :/ Dec 17 23:16:01 * zinx looks to see if it has that ability Dec 17 23:16:24 unix_lappy: i believe the power usage is comparable to an iPhone 3G Dec 17 23:16:32 zinx: you can't do anything once the CPU sleeps unless you a) have a wakelock, or b) are using the AlarmManager to wake up. Dec 17 23:16:37 ctate: i mean objective testing. Dec 17 23:16:39 although i don't have an iPhone and am just repeating what i've read outside Dec 17 23:16:40 yeah Dec 17 23:16:50 jasta: then it was doing something to wake it up Dec 17 23:17:09 ...or it had a wakelock. Dec 17 23:17:16 the right way to do it is to hook up a measuring power supply instead of the battery on each phone, and then put them through their paces Dec 17 23:17:23 i dunno if any review sites bother to do it though Dec 17 23:17:31 ctate: i disagree Dec 17 23:17:44 i have both and the iPhone does a slightly better job with power management Dec 17 23:17:51 aha, good to know Dec 17 23:17:59 at least for my settings i should say Dec 17 23:18:03 it does indeed have the ability to "prevent phone from sleeping" Dec 17 23:18:05 michaelnovakjr_: werent you saying you got about 8 hours of heavy usage (ie gaming) with the 3G? Dec 17 23:18:12 (3G iPhone) Dec 17 23:18:19 (note that the cell network itself has a significant impact on the phone's power usage!) Dec 17 23:18:21 zinx: well it might legitimately need that. a music player app, for instance, would require it Dec 17 23:18:24 i did at first unix_lappy Dec 17 23:18:30 so how AT&T vs T-Mobile provision their 3G matters a lot Dec 17 23:18:33 but they might also be abusing it (forgetting to release the wakelock, perhaps) Dec 17 23:18:34 <_Lunch> Is there a list anywhere of content uris used by the system? Or how would I got about listing them? Dec 17 23:18:40 but after the first update from Apple it significantly improved Dec 17 23:18:41 jasta: certainly. but it shouldn't do it when it's not playnig. Dec 17 23:18:48 something with the 3G settings on the iPhone Dec 17 23:19:07 when i first bought it i always had it on edge because 3G would kill the phone Dec 17 23:19:27 but now i always have it on 3G and i go days on the battery Dec 17 23:19:48 what's the battery capacity on those? Dec 17 23:19:54 streamfurious isn't open source either, so i can't fix it :( Dec 17 23:20:09 i blame apps not the phone :) Dec 17 23:21:11 oh yeah, badly behaved apps will kill your battery in nothing flat Dec 17 23:21:31 yep Dec 17 23:21:38 and there's plenty of them out there :) Dec 17 23:22:03 :( Dec 17 23:24:47 but programming is so easy anyone can do it! Dec 17 23:24:57 haha Dec 17 23:26:39 WaT? Dec 17 23:26:51 i get an error from ant because my domain has a dash in it Dec 17 23:26:53 how stupid Dec 17 23:37:05 be grateful to ant.. otherwise the package name resolver might subtract the both terms! Dec 17 23:38:15 ivantis, the spec says to use an underscore instead Dec 17 23:38:38 okay Dec 17 23:46:05 how do i put newlines in labels? Dec 17 23:46:08 like \n? Dec 17 23:46:31 your
label ? Dec 17 23:46:36 * pfn shrugs Dec 17 23:46:38 * pfn reaches Dec 17 23:49:48 i have come up with the perfect two applications that need to be made! a tip calculator and a flashlight! Dec 17 23:49:53 hehe Dec 17 23:50:23 hello all; no joy here on error popping initially infrequently. now solidly pops & remains until i mount the sdcard upon tethering g1 to my laptop. 'Exception Processing Message 0xc0000013 Parameters 0x75E992A0 0x00000004 0x75E992A0 0x75E992A0' Dec 17 23:51:10 zinx, i like the comments on thoseo apps though :) you can feel the anger Dec 17 23:51:13 any rumors of rc30 exploits yet ppl? Dec 17 23:51:21 nope Dec 17 23:51:25 get cracking on it :) Dec 17 23:51:48 zinx, and it's amusing if you think about how can you getting angry about something like that Dec 17 23:51:51 * tech9iner thinks if that last was @ t9.. grandly hilarious.. Dec 17 23:52:29 i develop headaches on occasion.. cause a few even.. but software lmao.. i barely install it.. Dec 17 23:54:45 strange though this new popping error everytime i tether to laptop.. started out infrequently & could be cancelled.. but now its persistent & will not cancel or close or continue. not until i tell my g1 to mount sdcard Dec 17 23:56:41 hmmm.. just realized the g1 cant seem to unmount from usb tether either? Dec 17 23:56:54 only way to umount it untether Dec 17 23:57:21 is there a way to tether now that doesn't need root access? Dec 17 23:57:34 unmount/eject sd card is greyed out & unresponsive Dec 18 00:07:22 hello all Dec 18 00:07:26 i am french Dec 18 00:07:45 and i have a problem Dec 18 00:07:57 well? what is it? Dec 18 00:07:59 can you help me if it s possible for you? Dec 18 00:08:10 don't ask to ask Dec 18 00:08:12 i would like to install android Dec 18 00:08:21 the motto of all irc channels Dec 18 00:08:24 on what? Dec 18 00:08:25 eldenz: the comments in general are crazy imho :) Dec 18 00:08:35 i have the samsung i900 Dec 18 00:08:37 but Dec 18 00:08:45 my question is simple Dec 18 00:08:54 no Dec 18 00:08:56 android dont are compatible withe all phone? Dec 18 00:09:05 correct Dec 18 00:09:12 not compatible with all phones Dec 18 00:09:17 ok Dec 18 00:09:18 eldenz: people cursing for no apparent reason (on decent apps), giving 1 star with no explanation at all, some giving 5 without even having tried the app due to the 1 stars... Dec 18 00:09:43 it s not possible for my phone ? Dec 18 00:09:45 go buy a G1, i am loving mine which i got last friday :) Dec 18 00:09:53 windows mobile is bad.. Dec 18 00:09:55 get an adp1 Dec 18 00:09:56 y2: maybe, i am not the person to ask Dec 18 00:10:16 you can load the g1 software onto it anyway, plus its already hacked and rooted.. blessed by google Dec 18 00:10:19 if i would like to install android Dec 18 00:10:24 and it has a pretty picture on the back Dec 18 00:10:37 if possible tan android damage my phone or no? Dec 18 00:11:17 android can damage my phone or no? Dec 18 00:11:25 y2: any change of OS or update can damage your phone Dec 18 00:11:32 i don't think it will work on your phone Dec 18 00:11:44 ok Dec 18 00:11:57 why michael? Dec 18 00:12:30 hardware compatibility Dec 18 00:12:39 arf Dec 18 00:13:18 are there a compatible list of phone support by android? Dec 18 00:13:25 sorry for my bad engalish :s Dec 18 00:13:36 *english Dec 18 00:13:53 not really, only the g1 so far... a few ports are in progress Dec 18 00:14:11 ok Dec 18 00:14:25 windows mobile is bad really Dec 18 00:14:26 http://android-dls.com/wiki/index.php?title=Android_FAQ#Q:_What_devices_has_Android_been_ported_to.3F Dec 18 00:14:32 i dont like Dec 18 00:14:47 tanks zinx Dec 18 00:14:52 snadge; wtf is an adp1 please? Dec 18 00:15:11 tech9iner: android dev phone Dec 18 00:15:26 ah tx Dec 18 00:16:01 tech9iner: exactly like the G1, except for a different back cover and different software (mostly keys, but there are some minor differences in the apps installed and the version as well) Dec 18 00:16:23 ahh.. tx Dec 18 00:16:27 or not so minor depending on what you need ;) Dec 18 00:17:28 speaking of microsux.. im blaming it not android for my current debacle.. sux is always bad somewhere/how/time Dec 18 00:19:19 dunno, i don't have that problem in Linux Dec 18 00:19:38 except the not being able to unmount thing.. but that is more a design thing with USB Dec 18 00:20:08 just make sure you've hit 'safely remove' or whatever, and unplug the USB cable Dec 18 00:29:29 zinx; been there done that.. 1st thing i tried during troubleshooting was safely remove/eject.. no positive effect at all Dec 18 00:30:11 like i said, you have to do that then unplug the USB cable Dec 18 00:30:14 zinx; sux always sux.. tux is always dressed to the nines imho ;] Dec 18 00:30:21 tried that too Dec 18 00:30:27 * pfn wonders whether to wait for more android phones or just jump on the g1 Dec 18 00:30:36 phone should regain access to the sdcard once the USB cable is unplugged Dec 18 00:30:41 can someone give me a code example of a changing text box? Dec 18 00:30:53 like it changes on a certain event Dec 18 00:30:56 indeed it does zinx .. g1 shows no probs Dec 18 00:31:05 tech9iner: blame MS then :P Dec 18 00:31:09 its microsux vista with the popping error problem Dec 18 00:31:14 xactly zinx Dec 18 00:31:16 heh Dec 18 00:31:23 its always me first guess.. Dec 18 00:31:23 I remember reading a review saying that only a usb host or the g1 can mount the sd card at a given time Dec 18 00:31:25 tech9iner: the G1 presents removable media to windows, with the card not inserted initially Dec 18 00:31:42 tech9iner: if windows is having problems with removable media that's not inserted... it's windows' fault :P Dec 18 00:32:34 right 0.. each time i tether it to veeeeesta.. now of late anyway.. horrid error dialog will not go away until i tell g1 to mount sdcard.. Dec 18 00:32:35 tech9iner: what is the error you're getting, anyway? Dec 18 00:32:52 pfn: that is true Dec 18 00:32:55 zinx; Exception Processing Message 0xc0000013 Parameters 0x75E992A0 0x00000004 0x75E992A0 0x75E992A0 Dec 18 00:33:05 pfn: there is no real way for two OSs to access a FAT32 partition at the same time Dec 18 00:33:10 tech9iner: in Windows? Dec 18 00:33:28 not rw, but ro should be ok Dec 18 00:33:28 tech9iner: do you have an up-to-date virus scanner installed? Dec 18 00:33:41 tech9iner: (could just as likely be a windows bug, just trying to cover all bases) Dec 18 00:33:41 can someone give me a code example of a changing text box?? Dec 18 00:33:44 like it changes on a certain event Dec 18 00:33:47 ??? Dec 18 00:33:54 pfn: no, not even read-only Dec 18 00:34:06 why not? Dec 18 00:34:16 just disable all caches and read, should be ok Dec 18 00:34:16 pfn: you -might- be able to get away with it on a journalling filesystem, but definitely not something like FAT32 Dec 18 00:34:26 pfn: because the filesystem is often in an inconsistent state Dec 18 00:34:32 of course, writes mean the reads will be unreliable Dec 18 00:35:01 pfn: it just doesn't work, mmkay? :D Dec 18 00:35:07 I guess so Dec 18 00:35:26 in that case, sounds like the g1 should automatically dismount the sd card and let windows mount when plugging in Dec 18 00:35:29 * pfn shrugs Dec 18 00:35:42 not really Dec 18 00:35:47 zinx; http://img255.imageshack.us/img255/5493/exceptionprocessingmessbd2.gif Dec 18 00:35:52 there's no way to take the sd card back Dec 18 00:35:58 and sometimes people just want to charge their phone Dec 18 00:36:18 the way to take the sd card back would be ejecting it in windows Dec 18 00:36:25 yes i use woze full on avast scanners Dec 18 00:36:56 pfn: windows does release the device such that it can tell when you do that, but many other operating systems don't Dec 18 00:37:15 damned woze.. Dec 18 00:37:25 pfn: and i'm not sure if the G1 hardware can tell or not :/ Dec 18 00:37:46 * tech9iner has been too busy to get opensuse on this new laptop.. Dec 18 00:38:04 I think the best plan of action is to wait for the next android phones.... Dec 18 00:38:09 * pfn wants more choices before jumping in Dec 18 00:38:19 yo Dec 18 00:38:22 i'm pretty sure that's not really going to change much Dec 18 00:38:31 or if it does, it'll change on all phones Dec 18 00:38:38 maybe Dec 18 00:38:44 but can't argue with more choices being good Dec 18 00:39:02 there are some ports in progress - http://android-dls.com/wiki/index.php?title=Android_FAQ#Q:_What_devices_has_Android_been_ported_to.3F Dec 18 00:39:11 pfn: we purposely disabled automatic UMS enabling on usb plugin Dec 18 00:39:28 probably not anything you'd want ;) Dec 18 00:39:44 SanMehat: and i'm glad you did ;) Dec 18 00:40:30 pfn: Some UMS hosts mount and start writing crap to the card as soon as they detect a UMS device. This is a real problem if you have a 'partial' usb insertion... which can happen if the little usb cover gets in the way sometimes.. Dec 18 00:40:52 stupid hosts Dec 18 00:41:03 pfn: in this case, the electrical connection is flakey, and will likely disconnect as soon as you pull your fingers away... thus messing up the file transfer in progress. Dec 18 00:41:29 any clues to be had SanMehat please? such an uber time waster here having to either full on mount sbcard or NOT on those busy busy days professionally when main reason for tethering to laptop is simply to charge g1's short life battery? Dec 18 00:41:42 *or NOT tether at all Dec 18 00:41:51 SanMehat: could the android phone ever be a good usb host? Dec 18 00:42:11 tech9iner: what? Dec 18 00:42:26 pffft: can you clarify what you would call a 'good' usb host? Dec 18 00:42:26 SanMehat; http://img255.imageshack.us/img255/5493/exceptionprocessingmessbd2.gif Dec 18 00:42:37 Unanswered Dec 18 00:42:38 Q: How do I change the default system wallpaper via the API? Dec 18 00:42:41 pffft: depends on specs/drivers.. there are no drivers for it right now, and i don't think the specs are in the hands of anyone who could write them :/ Dec 18 00:42:43 can anyone answer this? :P Dec 18 00:42:52 since not using the API re-compresses wallpapers _horribly_ Dec 18 00:43:14 SanMehat; this new popping error everytime i tether to laptop.. started out infrequently & could be cancelled.. but now its persistent & will not cancel or close or continue. not until i tell my g1 to mount sdcard Dec 18 00:43:18 zinx: would they be worth writing? Dec 18 00:43:31 pffft: i think so personally, but many people may have no use for such a thing Dec 18 00:44:05 tech9iner: so you plug the G1 in and that message pops up on your windows host until you enable UMS and mount the volume in windows? Dec 18 00:44:08 SanMehat: i guess lets cut that back to being ... just a normal usb host :-) Dec 18 00:44:11 bparker06: yeah, i wouldn't mind a way to set a non-stock wallpaper without having it look like a cat puked all over it Dec 18 00:44:17 SanMehat; yes sir Dec 18 00:44:27 pffft: ah.. you mean otg? Dec 18 00:44:41 SanMehat; it was occasional at first now persistently exasperating ;]] Dec 18 00:44:56 tech9iner: what version of windows is this? Thats really odd. When you just plug the device in, the device will expose a UMS drive which has no media Dec 18 00:44:58 SanMehat: means the kind of thing where you'd plug a keyboard/flash drive/whatever in to the phone, afaik Dec 18 00:45:13 zinx: ah yeah.. usb on-the-go Dec 18 00:45:32 SanMehat: otg? on the go? Dec 18 00:45:39 yeah Dec 18 00:45:40 SanMehat: yes Dec 18 00:45:47 zinx: the docs say that you use com.android.server.WallpaperService however it's not part of the SDK, it's in the android source Dec 18 00:46:01 bparker06: :X Dec 18 00:46:01 and I don't see an easy way to hook into it Dec 18 00:46:06 but I'm not that awesome at java either Dec 18 00:46:25 SanMehat; vista Service Pack 1 Dec 18 00:46:25 Dec 18 00:46:41 oops.. mea culpa.. didnt catch extra lf Dec 18 00:47:05 tech9iner: hmm.. interesting. Dec 18 00:47:19 bparker06: there is no API for setting the system wallpaper at present Dec 18 00:47:28 indeed SanMehat .. interesting your end.. frustrating/time wasting mine heh Dec 18 00:47:47 ctate: then is there any way to set a wallpaper without it being re-compressed? Dec 18 00:47:48 tech9iner: you sure you don't have some piece of software which is trying to do I/O to the UMS volume even though its reported 'empty'? Dec 18 00:47:55 bparker06: which means that if you try to brute-force it based on the Android source, your code will probably break on future devices Dec 18 00:48:06 er Dec 18 00:48:12 not empty.. its reported as having 'no media' Dec 18 00:48:37 hmmm.. SanMehat only change to vista comes to mind is tinyResMeter ive recently started using which does have 'removable drives' monitor? Dec 18 00:48:46 AH Dec 18 00:48:47 AHA Dec 18 00:48:49 disable that Dec 18 00:49:00 mk lemme test now SanMehat & tx your time mate Dec 18 00:49:07 no problem. Dec 18 00:49:37 and email the author of that program a bugreport :) Dec 18 00:50:49 at first I thought I could just overwrite /data/data/com.android.settings/files/wallpaper but it seems even root doesn't have permission to change it Dec 18 00:51:04 hah Dec 18 00:51:13 just do some choice chmods :) Dec 18 00:51:21 also toss me some root :( Dec 18 00:51:53 has JF released 1.3? :P Dec 18 00:52:08 bparker06: if you use the InputStream variant rather than the Bitmap variant of setWallpaper(), does it still recompress? Dec 18 00:53:10 ctate: the problem is I don't know how to call setWallpaper() because there is no import for it Dec 18 00:53:11 see http://code.google.com/android/reference/android/content/ContextWrapper.html#setWallpaper(java.io.InputStream) Dec 18 00:53:54 (which exists on the Application class) Dec 18 00:54:02 rc31JF1.3? ;) Dec 18 00:54:03 aha was spot on SanMehat lmao.. already exchanged emails with dev'r today bout other issues.. adding this ticket now ;].. thanks for helping eliminate/discern Dec 18 00:54:13 tech9iner: no problem man.. glad i could help Dec 18 00:54:17 ;] Dec 18 00:54:29 makes 3 of us.. 1 of you & 2 of me heh Dec 18 00:55:00 * tech9iner ALMOST ask microsux for forgiveness....... naaaaaaaw ;] Dec 18 00:56:05 yeah i thought it had to be some kind of utility program or something... windows normally leaves removable media devices which report 'no media' well enough alone Dec 18 00:56:11 win 17 Dec 18 00:57:12 grey-: lose Dec 18 00:58:11 Irssi: Unknown command: lose Dec 18 01:01:08 so for my daughter's phone boot splash screen Dec 18 01:01:10 this: http://www.pulsarmedia.eu/data/media/17/Pink_Hello_Kitty_Ballerina_320X480_iPhone_Mobile_Wallpaper.jpg Dec 18 01:01:13 or this: http://www.pulsarmedia.eu/data/media/17/Pink_Hello_Kitty_Ballerina_320X480_iPhone_Mobile_Wallpaper.jpg Dec 18 01:01:17 errr Dec 18 01:01:18 or this: http://www.pulsarmedia.eu/data/media/17/HelloKitty-Terrorist_320X480_iPhone_Mobile_Wallpaper.jpg Dec 18 01:01:24 ignore 2nd one [repeat] Dec 18 01:01:57 lol Dec 18 01:04:26 DO WANT ANDROID! Dec 18 01:04:38 that is all :-P Dec 18 01:04:48 beep boop Dec 18 01:13:22 * tech9iner is soo glad he missed hello kitty fandom insanity w his kids heh Dec 18 01:13:57 is there a video record app yet? Dec 18 01:14:43 from what i've seen of the camera in low-light, i'm not sure i'd want such an app.. Dec 18 01:15:36 half bread is better than none Dec 18 01:18:22 is it posible to encrypt files on the storage card? Dec 18 01:19:11 not without root, unless you want something application-specific Dec 18 01:19:12 anyone here using eclipse with a netbook? Dec 18 01:19:27 well eclipse + android emulator, is it usable to debug apps? Dec 18 01:20:16 i got a mini asus and it is pretty slow Dec 18 01:21:14 unix_infidel: it is, but you may have to wait a while for anything to happen :P Dec 18 01:21:58 mmm bread Dec 18 01:22:05 unix_infidel: mostly you need enough memory Dec 18 01:22:41 otherwise it's all thrashy Dec 18 01:22:50 ctate: well 2GB is the max on most netbooks. Dec 18 01:22:54 why does rgb2565 just give me a blank line with a blinking cursor until I press enter and then it spits out a .raw565 file that is 0 bytes Dec 18 01:22:54 Eclipse is ... not lean. Dec 18 01:23:16 unix_infidel: i have 2gig in my MacBook Pro and have used that to debug Android stuff in Eclipse + emulator. Dec 18 01:24:08 well i enjoy eclipse more than jedit. Dec 18 01:24:11 bert0: dunno Dec 18 01:24:16 bert0: that sounds wrong. Dec 18 01:24:19 ctate: i'm assuming the bottleneck is the atom processor, not the memory. Dec 18 01:24:45 possibly, unix_infidel, but Eclipse is seriously piggy about memory Dec 18 01:24:48 i know some guys who develop for mac with a hackintosh on an acer aspire one. it's sluggush but useable. Dec 18 01:25:21 who has gotten rgb2565 to work? Dec 18 01:25:28 bert0: is it trying to read from stdin? Dec 18 01:25:45 stdin? Dec 18 01:25:55 from the console Dec 18 01:26:00 as opposed to from a file Dec 18 01:26:09 I think so Dec 18 01:26:22 bert0: I have. Dec 18 01:26:22 it seems like it wants some sort of input Dec 18 01:26:29 bert0: errr, it does. Dec 18 01:26:52 bert0: http://www.gotontheinter.net/logo.rle Dec 18 01:27:30 yeah, it looks like it just reads stdin and writes to stdout Dec 18 01:27:47 do I need the < and > symbols from that tutorial? Dec 18 01:27:54 how are you invoking it? my quick glance suggests it should be rgb2565 < inputfile > outputfile Dec 18 01:28:08 can someone give me an md5sum of the engineering bootloader with no sigcheck? :P Dec 18 01:28:09 yes, exactly. the "<" tells it what file to read, and the ">" tells it what file to write. Dec 18 01:28:14 ahh Dec 18 01:28:22 thanks Dec 18 01:28:43 (they're shell directives to hook up the relevant pipelines before running the command) Dec 18 01:28:49 im about to flash my g1 with the eng bootloader.. and i dont want to brick it Dec 18 01:29:42 good luck snadge Dec 18 01:30:43 snadge, still need the md5? Dec 18 01:31:10 (btw, it wouldn't apply if it's corrupt, so it's not like it would brick your phone. at least not because it was corrupt :p) Dec 18 01:31:51 what if it has your secret gps location squealer in it that tells his wife he is at the shooting range? Dec 18 01:33:10 hermz Dec 18 01:33:15 how do I get it to say fastboot again? Dec 18 01:33:20 I thought it was boot spl. Dec 18 01:33:25 then plug in usb Dec 18 01:33:27 then press menu Dec 18 01:33:55 back Dec 18 01:34:03 hold 'back' during [early] boot Dec 18 01:34:05 back! Dec 18 01:34:06 thx Dec 18 01:34:19 * grey- can't keep all these key combos to memory easily. Dec 18 01:35:01 haha Dec 18 01:35:08 daughter's g1 now with pink hello kittyness. Dec 18 01:35:11 so cute. Dec 18 01:35:12 wow. Dec 18 01:37:56 ok so i have androids on skateboards.. yay Dec 18 01:38:02 now what? :P Dec 18 01:38:26 grey, how olds your daughter? Dec 18 01:38:27 snadge: WINz Dec 18 01:38:29 Versed: 16. Dec 18 01:38:38 yeah, mine is 16 too. Dec 18 01:38:41 Versed: amazingly she still likes the colour pink, and hello kitty. Dec 18 01:38:50 she uses my old 2g iphone. Dec 18 01:38:59 Versed: albeit... she won't be getting this until she passes her driver's test. Dec 18 01:39:09 which is taking a while, giving me more time to hack on it. Dec 18 01:39:11 16 with a g1.. looking at some of the marketplace comments thats not all that uncommon Dec 18 01:39:17 Fredbo: haha Dec 18 01:39:24 Fredbo: lotsa ex-sidekick users too Dec 18 01:39:30 Fredbo: hence why they all think the IM sucks. Dec 18 01:39:34 Assuming that I recorded exactly the same thing and compressed it to mp4 and 3gpp; which would have a smaller size? Dec 18 01:39:36 yeah Dec 18 01:39:42 never got into the whole sidekick thing. Dec 18 01:39:46 because the sidekick proxied IM making disconnects transparent to the user. Dec 18 01:39:51 my youngest, has a texting phone. Dec 18 01:39:57 ITechJunkie: generally 3gpp Dec 18 01:39:59 the new att quickfire. Dec 18 01:40:03 grey-: thanks Dec 18 01:40:05 ITechJunkie: though 3gpp is -terrible- in quality. Dec 18 01:40:05 sidekick was pretty much built around IMing Dec 18 01:40:22 closest thing att has to a sidekick but cheaper and 3g. Dec 18 01:40:30 well, android is very sidekick-y; many of the same developers. Dec 18 01:40:38 but like, six years later. Dec 18 01:40:46 sadly, no proxied IM. Dec 18 01:40:48 it does seem like the upgrade path for them Dec 18 01:40:50 wouldn't be hard though. Dec 18 01:40:57 also no D-pad. Dec 18 01:41:01 which was actually pretty nice. Dec 18 01:41:08 grey-: i'm working on some voice recognition software. Do you have any useful advice? Dec 18 01:41:10 perhaps future androids will have such a thing. Dec 18 01:41:17 ITechJunkie: uhhh? (: Dec 18 01:41:23 ITechJunkie: what kind? Dec 18 01:41:28 ITechJunkie: speech-to-text? Dec 18 01:41:39 ITechJunkie: what kinda engine are you using? IBm, BBN? Dec 18 01:41:44 grey-: anything, i'm new at this lol Dec 18 01:41:49 ah Dec 18 01:41:52 well iirc bbn's are licensed. Dec 18 01:42:07 but I think IBM maybe have a speech-to-text engine under an open source license of some sort. Dec 18 01:42:25 the only free speech-to-text thing i know of that's worth anything is Sphinx, and i think it's rather large too Dec 18 01:42:26 grey-: i don't know what IBm or BBN is, and all i want to do is have the user record a word and then be able to repeat that word and it recognize it Dec 18 01:42:39 ITechJunkie: http://ibmtts-sdk.sourceforge.net/ Dec 18 01:42:45 if you just need some random limited vocabulary stuff, there's far more available Dec 18 01:42:50 ITechJunkie: although, that's text-to-speech I guess, wrong direction. Dec 18 01:42:52 because you can usually just go based on level :/ Dec 18 01:43:23 Android may or may not have that built in.. check to see what the voice dialer does Dec 18 01:43:38 yeah, the g1/tmobile version has some stt engine. Dec 18 01:43:53 nah, that's not really speech to text Dec 18 01:43:54 but yeah otherwise, sphinx I guess is the only oen source system for that. Dec 18 01:43:56 i want the user to record a word and then when he repeats the word to the software it will cross check previous learned words and run a command assigned to that particular word... am i making sense? Dec 18 01:44:02 word recognition would be more accurate Dec 18 01:44:03 albeit, sphinx is written in Java. Dec 18 01:44:12 so potentially easily ported to Android/Dalvik. Dec 18 01:44:42 ITechJunkie: yeah makes sense. Dec 18 01:44:54 ITechJunkie: maybe start with http://cmusphinx.sourceforge.net/html/cmusphinx.php as zinx suggested. Dec 18 01:45:11 okay, so theres not any audio comparing stuff in the api? Dec 18 01:45:33 * zinx does not know what's in the API for that Dec 18 01:45:44 * zinx would also not recommend sphinx :/ Dec 18 01:46:08 * ITechJunkie wonders what zinx would recommend Dec 18 01:47:07 has someone got a fastboot binary for ubuntu intrepid x86? Dec 18 01:47:19 i dont want to download 2.1 gig ;) Dec 18 01:47:25 ITechJunkie: android/packages/apps/VoiceDialer/src/com/android/voicedialer/Recognizer*.java :D Dec 18 01:47:40 zinx: your da man! Dec 18 01:48:29 I have had this g1 phone for 2 days and well, it could be better Dec 18 01:48:42 ya, but i still <3 mine Dec 18 01:49:18 i am comtemplating returing it and getting my old dash Dec 18 01:49:26 want: root, dialer that doesn't lock during voice mail, wallpaper that doesn't look like crap Dec 18 01:49:42 zinx: wallpaper easily solved. Dec 18 01:49:48 grey-: do tell Dec 18 01:49:52 zinx: sorry to hear you don't have root. ;-/ Dec 18 01:49:54 zinx: your dialr locks during voice mail? Dec 18 01:49:58 im stoked with my g1.. i've replaced the bootloader and the operating system with a hacked one :P Dec 18 01:50:02 and no idea about the dialer during vm, haven't had that. Dec 18 01:50:03 ITechJunkie: it locks the screen, yes. Dec 18 01:50:14 snadge, share please Dec 18 01:50:23 ITechJunkie: so i have to turn the screen on, then hit menu, then the number every time Dec 18 01:50:27 zinx: doesn't do that to me... are you talking about pressng buttons to delete vm and stuff? Dec 18 01:50:32 yay for skateboards hehe.. you need a pre RC30 phone, or RC8 phone Dec 18 01:50:34 ITechJunkie: i am Dec 18 01:50:37 or a dev phone (adp1) Dec 18 01:50:44 mine is rc30 Dec 18 01:50:59 out of luck until someone finds a new hack Dec 18 01:51:00 hmm, it looks like the zooming using the volume buttons isnt possible. Dec 18 01:51:11 zinx: oh... well... so your just talking about making the screen timeout "never" for the VM app, yes? Dec 18 01:51:13 * unix_infidel is sorely dissapointed. Dec 18 01:51:19 ITechJunkie: yes. Dec 18 01:51:29 * Twois10 is not too happy with g1 Dec 18 01:51:43 Twois10: if you bought it less than 14 days ago go return it. Dec 18 01:51:48 i'm sure there's other random stuff i'm forgetting, but those are the things that stick in my mind Dec 18 01:51:50 zinx: okay, then i do have that problem, maybe that will be a fix in the near future Dec 18 01:51:55 Twois10: what are your gripes? Dec 18 01:52:00 unix_infidel, i am thinking about it Dec 18 01:52:07 Who here is using MonoDevelop to create Android Apps Dec 18 01:52:20 30 days in CA Dec 18 01:52:32 the dash is windows mobile, right? egads, I haven't been able to deal with that in years. Dec 18 01:52:37 winmo = so bad. Dec 18 01:52:42 grey-: still wanting to hear how to not have terrible looking wallpaper :( Dec 18 01:52:46 winmo = so so bad Dec 18 01:52:49 grey- there are some feature that i miss from my previous dash Dec 18 01:53:00 albeit< i last used winmo 2003 and 5.0 Dec 18 01:53:09 but it doesn't look like it's improved. Dec 18 01:53:10 althought the touchpro doesn't seem too bad Dec 18 01:53:18 Twois10: e.g.? Dec 18 01:53:25 ability to record inc/out calls and store them in storage card Dec 18 01:53:33 video recorder Dec 18 01:53:35 zinx: uhh you can change the wallpaper to images, just download something you like and change it. Dec 18 01:53:41 oh right, need to be able to store apps and other such stuff on the SD card too :) Dec 18 01:53:45 maps that gives turn/turn direction Dec 18 01:53:47 Twois10: hmm yeah that could be handy. Dec 18 01:54:01 turn-by-turn? Dec 18 01:54:02 grey-: but it turns the jpeg quality way down, so any pics i put on myself look TERRIBLE Dec 18 01:54:07 oh you mean read-out-loud? Dec 18 01:54:13 yes Dec 18 01:54:21 turn by turn Dec 18 01:54:27 grey-: and i've not yet found a way to make it not recompress wallpapers i put on there myself Dec 18 01:55:24 i dunno sounds like they are about to dump the latest source tree and do a pretty decent sized release. Dec 18 01:55:35 so you could see quite a few features pop up. Dec 18 01:55:36 one thing i like is when my live map was running and gps is activated, it disables screen saver mode. Dec 18 01:55:38 zinx: if you're having such a hard time with android recompressing wallpapers, why not just resize them yourself and slap em on there? Dec 18 01:55:49 ITechJunkie: because it still recompresses them. Dec 18 01:56:18 oh... how so? Dec 18 01:56:21 ITechJunkie: the only ways i have to set the wallpaper recompress no matter what the input is. Dec 18 01:59:32 isnt there another adroid g1 irc channel, that discuss everythin including apps? Dec 18 01:59:40 zinx: I honestly haven't noticed any difference when I use a picture as a wallpaper. How does it recompress the wallpapers? Does it change size, picture quality, format? I don't get it. Dec 18 02:00:04 ITechJunkie: quality Dec 18 02:00:36 oh, what is the point of it? I don't get why the developers would do it. Dec 18 02:00:47 that's just how it was implemented Dec 18 02:01:00 you know where the current wallpaper is stored? Dec 18 02:01:07 hmmm, weird. Dec 18 02:01:08 every picture you set as wallpaper goes through the crop program Dec 18 02:01:19 the crop program recompresses even if you crop to the entire picture Dec 18 02:01:24 i applied one from the Backgrounds app and would like to backup that elsewhere Dec 18 02:01:55 eldenz: you can't read it unless you're root, probably.. someone said /data/data/com.android.settings/files/wallpaper possibly Dec 18 02:02:07 ah nice, thanks Dec 18 02:02:20 right, but supposing that you crop the entire picture after you risize it to what it needs to be to fit the screen perfectly, would the quality still change? Dec 18 02:02:36 ITechJunkie: yes. Dec 18 02:02:55 ITechJunkie: it recompresses it no matter what :/ Dec 18 02:03:31 zinx: bummer Dec 18 02:03:54 how do i browse files in the storage card from my g1 Dec 18 02:04:10 what if the source image is in a lossless format? does it still save it as jpg? that would be bad Dec 18 02:04:12 Twois10: you can use one of the file managers off the market Dec 18 02:04:26 zinx thanks Dec 18 02:04:33 eldenz: yeah, as far as i can tell Dec 18 02:04:34 Twois10, i know of Bender and OI File Manager Dec 18 02:04:45 which is best Dec 18 02:04:47 aaw... hello artefacts Dec 18 02:04:57 i'm using Android File Manager, but the name got changed and I don't recall to what Dec 18 02:05:13 ah bender got renamed as well, artso iirc Dec 18 02:05:26 Astro it is Dec 18 02:06:13 yep Dec 18 02:07:23 the one feature that could be the deal breaker is not being able to encrypt data on the storage card. How could they have missed this one Dec 18 02:07:37 what data do you want to encrypt Dec 18 02:08:04 everything Dec 18 02:08:14 that's not stored on the sd card Dec 18 02:08:17 :P~ Dec 18 02:08:56 no, stored on the sd card. I lost my Dash 3 days ago, and thank god it was encrypted. I had personal files on there Dec 18 02:09:24 the only thing stored on the SD card is downloads/music/pictures Dec 18 02:09:44 :/ Dec 18 02:09:55 My dast was setup to record every call, in/out and stored on the sd card Dec 18 02:09:59 i also question how well your Dash's encryption worked Dec 18 02:10:12 there were also other important fiels Dec 18 02:10:17 did you enter the decryption key every time you unlocked it? Dec 18 02:10:18 Twois10, isn't that illegal? :P Dec 18 02:10:19 dash* Dec 18 02:10:28 no Dec 18 02:10:30 eldenz: depends on state / possibly county Dec 18 02:10:40 just cant use it in court Dec 18 02:10:46 eldenz: some places require both parties know, some only require one knows Dec 18 02:14:10 the program phone record, lets you only record 5 or 10 mins or the conversation. I wonder if the developer would release the codes Dec 18 02:15:30 probably not.. probably going to release a version for $$$ once the market supports that Dec 18 02:16:22 Ah, it makes sense, that is why s/he probable had the limit on it Dec 18 02:17:52 OI filemanage works great, thanks Dec 18 02:22:34 evening, peoples Dec 18 02:22:38 hello Dec 18 02:27:27 hey, to set up a phone with a google apps for your domain account, you just enter me@my-domain.tld for the username, yes? Dec 18 02:28:33 yeah Dec 18 02:28:44 KNY: yes. works great for me Dec 18 02:28:57 JesusFreke, excellent Dec 18 02:29:47 KNY: w3rd is teh winz. Dec 18 02:30:00 oh, I'm not doing it, I was checking for my dad Dec 18 02:30:00 haha Dec 18 02:30:16 I wish you could set up multiple "push" accounts, though Dec 18 02:30:26 so I could use my google apps account and my gmail account Dec 18 02:30:28 oh well Dec 18 02:31:03 this phone is like one whom you don't like much but must keep around for sex Dec 18 02:31:08 anyone using GReader + Gears on the G1? Dec 18 02:31:09 sorry, that is my feeling Dec 18 02:31:21 unix_infidel: greader yes, gears, no... Dec 18 02:31:37 Twois10, the G1? Dec 18 02:31:42 yep Dec 18 02:31:45 grey-: for offline reading. Dec 18 02:31:54 I'll take it off your hands if you hate it that much Dec 18 02:32:11 I personally love mine Dec 18 02:32:23 though I wish I had an ADP1 instead :( Dec 18 02:32:24 unix_infidel: good idea. Dec 18 02:32:31 KNY: ? Dec 18 02:32:36 KNY: haxed g1 = adp1. Dec 18 02:32:45 KNY: although no leet backcover. Dec 18 02:32:52 KNY: but a more leet backcover for $6. Dec 18 02:32:53 It's all about the back cover :p Dec 18 02:33:00 grey-: hax my G1 :P Dec 18 02:33:01 JesusFreke: clearly. Dec 18 02:33:01 Yeah, if i could hack it. it would make me feel better Dec 18 02:33:05 zinx: rc30? Dec 18 02:33:10 hmmm Dec 18 02:33:11 grey-: yep, came with it. Dec 18 02:33:14 damn Dec 18 02:33:21 plus a subtle shade of black that's really a bit more grey Dec 18 02:33:26 well maybe we should start poking around for local roots. Dec 18 02:33:28 grey-, I'm already at rc30 Dec 18 02:33:31 Captain_Dingo: oh geeze. Dec 18 02:33:31 but still, the back cover :P Dec 18 02:33:36 grey-: there aren't any that i've found Dec 18 02:33:37 Captain_Dingo: the 'bronze' is already off-black. Dec 18 02:33:41 it's just palstic. Dec 18 02:33:44 zinx: not public. Dec 18 02:33:50 but the bronze has an invisible keyboard Dec 18 02:33:51 grey-: not talking about public. Dec 18 02:34:01 grey-: i sifted through everything that's running as root. Dec 18 02:34:03 zinx: in time there will be I'm sure; but we can start poking now, maybe find some. Dec 18 02:34:17 zinx: sdcard mount presumably runs as root. Dec 18 02:34:26 grey-: there are some non-exploitable race conditions that are not even worth mentioning, not a whole lot else Dec 18 02:34:33 zinx, yours is hacked? Dec 18 02:34:33 grey-: it does. but it's not exploitable. Dec 18 02:34:34 mount apps have historically had bugs... Dec 18 02:34:37 Twois10: no. Dec 18 02:34:40 zinx: hmmm. Dec 18 02:34:59 grey-: dunno what mount apps you're talking about, but i didn't find anything when i looked over mountd Dec 18 02:35:13 zinx, using the terminal emulator? Dec 18 02:35:28 Twois10: for what? i used the source to try to find stuff.. Dec 18 02:35:50 the source? Dec 18 02:36:08 the only thing i came up with in all my efforts was i could h4x0r it with a software SD card.. which i certainly don't have :P Dec 18 02:36:20 Twois10: yes, the source code for Android Dec 18 02:36:26 software sd card.. Dec 18 02:36:29 that's an interesting idea. Dec 18 02:36:48 isn't it, though? Dec 18 02:36:56 hopefully someone will make one cheap so i can buy it Dec 18 02:37:02 I willl download it and play with it Dec 18 02:37:30 zinx: url2softsd? Dec 18 02:37:39 grey-: i don't personally know of any Dec 18 02:39:18 I'll wait till march, if by then, there is not software to do what I want, I will give the phone away and go back to what i know Dec 18 02:41:44 Twois10, make sure to /msg me when you do Dec 18 02:41:46 haha Dec 18 02:42:04 but you already have one Dec 18 02:42:13 his dad has one, apparently Dec 18 02:42:16 I was actually thinking of giving it to my sister Dec 18 02:44:08 zinx, no, I've got one too Dec 18 02:44:10 he's a copy-cat Dec 18 02:44:19 Twois10, my girlfriend is mighty jealous of mine Dec 18 02:44:27 a discounted one might convince her to drop verizon Dec 18 02:44:45 she needs a reason to drop verizon? Dec 18 02:44:51 lol Dec 18 02:45:46 wow http://gizmodo.com/5112895/toshiba-512gb-solid-state-drive-come-to-papa Dec 18 02:45:54 zinx, yeah, she pays $5/mo on her family's family plan Dec 18 02:45:57 haha Dec 18 02:46:11 at this rate ssd's will maintain a density lead over hdd's for laptops. Dec 18 02:46:24 and prossibly overtake hdd densities in a couple years. Dec 18 02:46:27 grey-, a dollar density? Dec 18 02:46:28 heh Dec 18 02:46:31 for 3.5" Dec 18 02:46:33 whaat Dec 18 02:46:34 KNY: hah. Dec 18 02:46:40 ooh la la Dec 18 02:46:42 SSDs larger than conventional drives?! Dec 18 02:46:44 KNY: we'll see. Dec 18 02:46:53 zinx: in a laptop, largest hdd is 500GB right now. Dec 18 02:46:57 vs 512GB ssd? Dec 18 02:47:09 it seems like they're all competing on size; I'd rather they compete on price Dec 18 02:47:16 KNY: they'll start to. Dec 18 02:47:17 I'm sure that will come with time, though Dec 18 02:47:22 KNY: ssd's can fetch a premium due to speed. Dec 18 02:47:24 grey-: oh, i thought they were still stuck at 320GB, for the really really slow drives Dec 18 02:47:37 KNY: and at least in like enterprise database applications, SSD's speed increase is worth the price. Dec 18 02:47:38 grey-: and something like 200 for the sanely speeded ones Dec 18 02:47:59 zinx: nah, 320gb 7200rpm in mine right now, 500GB 5400rpm. Dec 18 02:48:00 grey-, wouldn't a raid 0+1 still be faster though? Dec 18 02:48:12 KNY: what's going to stop you from raid'ing ssd's? ;) Dec 18 02:48:22 cost? Dec 18 02:48:23 haha Dec 18 02:48:25 yes, cost. Dec 18 02:48:28 they are pricier. Dec 18 02:48:30 but much faster. Dec 18 02:48:40 fancy laptops with two drives :( Dec 18 02:48:42 sadly, they also have shorter life cycles potentially. ;-/ Dec 18 02:48:53 zinx, where do you work that has laptops for db servers? Dec 18 02:49:09 zinx: oh no, I don't have a 500GB 5400rpm Dec 18 02:49:12 grey-, only if you're writing Dec 18 02:49:14 zinx: just saying they exist. Dec 18 02:49:17 KNY: nowhere Dec 18 02:49:44 though there's only 1 500GB hdd 2.5" drive that is 9.5mm or whatever and will actually -fit- in a laptop. Dec 18 02:49:48 err standard laptop Dec 18 02:49:53 not gaming 19" luggable. Dec 18 02:50:09 the samsung spinpoint. Dec 18 02:50:13 errr 9mm not 9.5 Dec 18 02:50:25 Heh. Dec 18 02:50:33 it's like $100. Dec 18 02:50:52 all the other 500GB laptop hdd's are ginormous. Dec 18 02:51:49 is there a general purpose file chooser that can be added one's activity? Dec 18 02:51:56 added to* Dec 18 02:51:57 my laptop has a 160GB drive.. definitely feeling the crunch Dec 18 02:52:08 zinx: I figured out the wallpaper thing Dec 18 02:52:14 zinx: me too Dec 18 02:52:25 bparker06: figured out a way around the recompression? Dec 18 02:52:31 waiting for affordable 256gig SSD's with Intel-like performance Dec 18 02:52:53 yep Dec 18 02:53:22 yeah, i'd love a SSD if i could afford one Dec 18 02:53:35 but they are way expensive, and i'd struggle to even get a new drive at this point :/ Dec 18 02:54:14 bparker06: do tell.. was it the setWallpaper variant that takes InputStream? Dec 18 02:55:10 yep Dec 18 02:58:56 pretty easy Dec 18 02:59:01 http://pastebin.ca/1288276 Dec 18 02:59:06 yo Dec 18 02:59:12 that just sets the static file I put in there to the wallpaper when the activity starts Dec 18 02:59:23 and it works without compression apparently Dec 18 02:59:42 now I just need a filechooser and I can throw it on the market lol **** ENDING LOGGING AT Thu Dec 18 02:59:56 2008