**** BEGIN LOGGING AT Tue Jul 17 02:59:58 2012 Jul 17 09:41:17 hi all how to compile u-boot for beaglebone i am using u-boot-2011.09-psp04.06.00.07 and i am using toolchin is arago toolchain is existed in my system....pls give me solution Jul 17 09:42:21 Tamilarasi: since you're using TI stuff: go ask TI Jul 17 09:42:57 i exported PATH name and toolchin path eventhought its showing system not configure Jul 17 09:43:08 Tamilarasi: since you're using TI stuff: go ask TI Jul 17 09:45:38 u-boot has documentation online Jul 17 14:04:06 Does anyone know where I could buy my beaglebone from MEXICO? I mean, is there one trusted site to buy it? Jul 17 14:09:55 Hi everyone, I have a question. Does anyone has bought a beaglebone from Mex? I am wondering on what trustful site can I buy one? THANKS IN ADVANCE Jul 17 14:12:24 Guest83773: digikey seems to sell to mexico... Jul 17 14:19:08 LetoThe2nd: Thank you, are you just supposing that digikey sell to mex? However, it seems you are right Jul 17 14:19:36 yes the wonders of NAFTA Jul 17 14:19:55 Guest83773: i have not verified as i am not in mexico. but they a) offer the bone and b) have a mexican web site, hence i *guess* that they sell to mex. Jul 17 14:32:00 LetoThe2nd. To be honest I am not used to buying on Internet! I got some fear to release my debit card number, that is the reason to ask a trustful site. Thank you very much... :) Jul 17 14:35:38 heh Jul 17 14:48:40 <_av500_> release early, release often Jul 17 14:49:48 _av500_: does that count as equivalent to "shit happens"? Jul 17 14:53:12 I think digikey's site reads the die id from your system though. there's no trustiness! Jul 17 14:56:36 they can read eye iris from the orbit, so who cares :p Jul 17 15:03:25 ynezz, not with your tinfoil glasses in place Jul 17 15:04:04 this is a soon-to-be-revealed killer feature from google Jul 17 15:10:29 that just leads to the fact, that more trees will be plant, so possible something good. Jul 17 15:12:09 until governments will forbid to hide below trees because it is some terrorist behaviour Jul 17 16:06:55 koen, meta-ti is the official TI repo for the SDK? Jul 17 16:07:16 that's what I heard Jul 17 16:07:19 I thought it was sdk had their own layer in arago Jul 17 16:07:32 on top of meta-ti Jul 17 16:08:58 joelagnel: but you work for TI, you shouldn't need to ask me :) Jul 17 16:09:18 * koen pulls jkridner into this conversation Jul 17 16:09:51 I'd have to ping chase Jul 17 16:10:08 I thought it was, yes, but I don't know what chase's timeline is. Jul 17 16:18:16 meta-ti is BSP layer Jul 17 16:18:23 meta-arago is SDK layer Jul 17 16:19:03 denix|: I keep getting harassed for "patches and stuff" for capes Jul 17 16:19:07 it will be used for other teams as well - I'm currently working with multi-core group and they might be doing it sooner than chase... Jul 17 16:19:10 denix|: and I keep pointing TI people to meta-ti Jul 17 16:19:27 denix|: and they a few days later I get asked again about it... Jul 17 16:19:52 harassed in what sense? Jul 17 16:20:01 they need them or don't need them? Jul 17 16:20:15 "we need patches!!! send them!!!" Jul 17 16:20:21 :) Jul 17 16:20:33 just keep sending them :) Jul 17 16:20:51 everyone likes receiving presents, i.e. patches :) Jul 17 16:20:53 the questions itself is what is worrying me Jul 17 16:21:10 I want to know who keeps telling cco to ask me for patches Jul 17 16:21:45 and tell that person that it's all in meta-ti Jul 17 16:21:52 modulo review time Jul 17 16:22:16 koen, current sdk releases ship with a different kernel, correct? Jul 17 16:22:23 their recipe is different is my understanding Jul 17 16:22:33 joelagnel: I'm not having that discussion again Jul 17 16:22:37 joelagnel: go ask jkridner Jul 17 16:23:11 joelagnel: it involves inhabitants of a non US country being touchy Jul 17 16:23:25 heh Jul 17 16:23:30 joelagnel: here we go again... Jul 17 16:23:49 joelagnel: I don't work for TI, you're asking questions about TI SDK Jul 17 16:24:03 joelagnel: current SDK releases are not even meta-ti based yet Jul 17 16:24:21 denix, that's what Jul 17 16:24:41 well I guess my question was will the patches from meta-ti apply directly, and that is the confusion i think Jul 17 16:24:49 finding patches is not the problem Jul 17 16:25:06 if it's not a problem, why do I keep getting harrassed about them? Jul 17 16:25:31 koen, I think Rao means that someone has to apply those patches to TI SDK, its not the finding part that's tough Jul 17 16:25:32 joelagnel: apply directly to what? Jul 17 16:25:55 I would not assume they would apply directly to the SDK kernel. Jul 17 16:25:55 koen: there is internal TI policy - if you have nay problems, go harass koen :) Jul 17 16:26:04 rofl Jul 17 16:26:23 jkridner, yeah i'm sure they wont Jul 17 16:26:50 jkridner: you're implying that SDK is not using a pure PSP kernel Jul 17 16:26:52 jkridner: they may - SDK for beagle was updated to the latest kernel from arago/PSP some time ago Jul 17 16:27:21 oops, not beagle but bone Jul 17 16:27:26 I'm implying it isn't the *same* pure SDK kernel. Jul 17 16:27:36 that's correct Jul 17 16:28:26 My understanding was that SDK moved to a newer/different PSP kernel than the meta-ti bone kernel is based on. Jul 17 16:29:09 anyway, I'd suggest that joelagnel take a look at the tags and tell us what the shared commit is. Jul 17 16:30:18 hmmm… no tags on http://arago-project.org/git/?p=arago.git;a=summary for 5 months. Jul 17 16:30:49 jkridner: there won't be any Jul 17 16:31:03 why no tags to match up with SDK releases? Jul 17 16:31:06 why do you need tags in arago? Jul 17 16:32:10 jkridner: it's like asking why there are not AM-SDK tags in OpenEmbedded repo... Jul 17 16:32:56 I'm not sure why, but ok. Jul 17 16:32:59 there are AM-SDK, EZSDK, DVSDK, SC-MCSDK etc. all made out of arago repo Jul 17 16:33:05 http://arago-project.org/git/?p=arago.git;a=history;f=recipes/linux/linux-am335x_3.2.0-psp04.06.00.08.sdk.bb;h=337351b2988623780066d8b5f88d26ee6a698779;hb=HEAD seems to have had updates in June. Jul 17 16:34:01 ugh. ${AUTOREV} Jul 17 16:35:35 so Jul 17 16:35:39 to sum it up: Jul 17 16:35:49 meta-ti based sdk Real Soon Now(TM) Jul 17 16:35:57 just like 12 months ago Jul 17 16:36:20 denix|, quit dragging your feet on that one ;) Jul 17 16:36:22 given that 3.2 has been out for over 6 months, seems like the branch ought to be called something other than 3.2-staging. Jul 17 16:36:33 koen: something like that Jul 17 16:36:42 mdp: which one? Jul 17 16:37:00 denix|, need you to make that RSNer Jul 17 16:37:05 denix| is not in charge of AMSDK Jul 17 16:37:14 jkridner: that's PSP Jul 17 16:37:16 he's um, being leveraged..or didn't you know? ;) Jul 17 16:37:23 sounds dirty Jul 17 16:37:31 mdp: RSNer? what's that? Jul 17 16:37:37 koen, perhaps, and maybe that's why I stay very distant Jul 17 16:37:39 denix|: I now. Just stating the obvious. Jul 17 16:37:43 er, know even. Jul 17 16:37:43 i.e. being used? Jul 17 16:38:10 jkridner: I know you know, just stating the obvious as well :) Jul 17 16:38:25 denix|: RSNer would be *more* real soon now. Jul 17 16:38:38 agmlego: thanks :) Jul 17 16:38:59 denix|, more power to your warp core Jul 17 16:39:16 mdp: leveraged = used? Jul 17 16:40:19 joelagnel: seems koen's base is 720e07b4c1f687b61b147b31c698cb6816d72f01 and PSP/SDK is at 23b32eed0b053a08a7dee9e8d78bd9adc6009a2e, so you might need to merge the deltas before you can apply those patches. I'm still wondering why this question was asked, but I wanted to go look at what the state was so I'd know. Jul 17 16:41:03 denix|, leveraged is the kind term that "those above" use when they have 4+ people assigning you work Jul 17 16:41:28 "Leverage your entire potential" is frequently the whole phrase. Jul 17 16:41:34 Or some derivative thereof. Jul 17 16:42:15 * koen changes the cover of his TPS reports Jul 17 16:42:40 I once had a boss who made me a book about managing time as gift Jul 17 16:42:42 jkridner: let's do a seperate boardfile for bone so we opt out of that evmsk breakage in board-am335x-evm.c Jul 17 16:43:38 koen, watched that last weekend...was imagining you doing the "I have people skills!! What the hell is wrong with you people??!??" rant. ;) Jul 17 16:44:04 :) Jul 17 16:44:38 Don't think you need to coordinate with me since there isn't any collaboration on it at this level. (May we meet again at the mainline!) Jul 17 16:45:03 jkridner: I don't want to spend time on it, TBH Jul 17 16:45:08 Seems that the SDK has to keep the bone working. Jul 17 16:45:19 on the mainline or on a new board.c file? Jul 17 16:45:35 jkridner: we both know that the sdk level of 'working' will not pass geralds standards for shipping Jul 17 16:45:36 or on collaborating in meta-ti or all of it? Jul 17 16:46:05 if you have a new board.c file, how will it be selected? Jul 17 16:46:25 I would guess in Kconfig Jul 17 16:46:52 * jkridner thinks that the board.c file needs to mostly go away in the next 6-12 months anyway as device tree stuff gets merged into mainline (as a new board.c file is unlikely to land in mainline anyway). Jul 17 16:47:01 Kconfig? Yuck! Jul 17 16:47:04 I want to avoid needing to spend 2 days a week redoing bone patches just because evmsk/industrialevm/etc changed Jul 17 16:47:13 k. :( Jul 17 16:47:35 way too much boardfile churn in the arago tree Jul 17 16:47:38 you guys missed the window of enjoying the fruits of having a separate board file...back when it could have been done in october Jul 17 16:47:46 right Jul 17 16:47:48 I'm not saying I'm agreeing…. but I am saying I won't fight it. Jul 17 16:48:27 you have to abstract all this stuff for board-generic.c anyway, as jkridner points out Jul 17 16:48:39 I know Jul 17 16:48:46 I need to have DT working before ELC-E Jul 17 16:48:55 oh?!? Jul 17 16:49:24 * jkridner perks up with the sound of some good news. Jul 17 16:49:28 if you didn't know, apps engineering gives a "how to do a bsp" that involves making a separate board file for bone..I nice clean one (with minimal functionality) Jul 17 16:49:30 well Jul 17 16:49:40 my talk has "the broken promis of DT" as subtitle Jul 17 16:49:45 so I don't need it working Jul 17 16:49:52 just enough so I can bitch about it Jul 17 16:50:01 mdp: I know Jul 17 16:50:10 sounds like a sales demo...you just need slideware...no working s/w Jul 17 16:50:25 * kkeller ouch! Jul 17 16:50:35 mdp: I also remember getting threatened when suggesting a seperate board file around RTM time Jul 17 16:51:36 I was beat up and chose to walk away Jul 17 16:52:24 I guess I should say: Jul 17 16:52:31 "\o/ finally some common sense!" Jul 17 16:52:55 6 months, btw, requires some rose-colored glasses Jul 17 16:55:24 just wait until musb is usable ;) Jul 17 16:55:37 aholler, hold your breath and send me a photo Jul 17 16:55:40 time lapse Jul 17 16:56:43 koen, having been in that role a little while back, the worst thing of the whole situation with SDK/bone/capes would be that it's guaranteed to increase support load on a fix number of people. Jul 17 16:57:26 * jkridner admits to administering developer abuse Jul 17 16:57:51 second worst is it will be a slight fork of what the beagle community uses and level of functionality is generally less Jul 17 16:58:42 -CONFIG_USB Jul 17 16:58:43 ;) Jul 17 16:58:52 heh Jul 17 16:59:24 sorry ;) Jul 17 17:03:42 I didn't want to break the discussion ;) Jul 17 17:04:43 * aholler rolls some penguins into the channel Jul 17 17:05:14 As someone not following the mailing lists or repo comments, could someone give me the ten-word summary of the issue? Jul 17 17:05:22 aholler, honestly, I think that subject may well be the Godwin's Law of this channel :) Jul 17 17:07:54 running gags are an old invention, fortunately not patented ;) Jul 17 17:14:50 but I wonder what other manufacturers are doing. Wasn't there really no new arm-board in the last months? Jul 17 17:16:14 : You said that "I thought digikey's site read the die id from your system though. there's no trustiness!" As a foreign buyer, I really interested to know whether digikey is a trusted site to buy the bone with a debid car. Jul 17 17:16:37 Did anyone try to submit a board-file for am*? Jul 17 17:19:36 Guest83773: there aren't much distributors that big. Jul 17 17:20:33 but on the other side, no one would have mistrust the dutch government Jul 17 17:21:31 aholler: I am from Mex, and I guess it is cheaper to order the bone from USA Jul 17 17:23:08 I don't know about your taxes, but I assume digikey doesn't add a mex-bones on top their usual price (besides needed tax) Jul 17 17:23:29 s/bones/bonus/ Jul 17 17:31:45 gm Jul 17 17:32:14 hmm i have a desire for tacos all of sudden Jul 17 17:33:28 :) but its pizza day here Jul 17 17:38:45 burger day here... Jul 17 17:38:53 mru: pub? Jul 17 17:39:04 ack Jul 17 17:40:40 mru: pastebin a picture of your fav barmaid :) Jul 17 17:47:08 back to the am*-discussion, maybe it would be possible to offer a set of patches on top of a mainline-kernel for TI. Preferable in git-format (with comments). That would be much better than releasing complete kernel sources, imho. Jul 17 17:47:39 koen: ping Jul 17 18:22:22 mdp: who's giving the "how to do a bsp" talk? you? Jul 17 18:22:45 nope Jul 17 18:23:05 stevek and schuyler do that Jul 17 18:23:15 hmm, ok Jul 17 18:24:30 aholler, if that doesn't exist in hvaibhav's github tree then somebody can grab all the patches in flight on linux-omap and maintain something Jul 17 18:27:22 aholler, also new board files are no longer accepted, you must boot using board-generic.c in mainline for new platforms Jul 17 18:30:15 mdp: some git-repo somewhere with tons of branches and moving content isn't the same as a link to an archiv which contains a patch-set e.g. for mainline 3.4. The latter is much easier to handle for most people. Jul 17 18:32:52 but it's just a suggestion Jul 17 18:37:37 of course for developing and maintaining those patches a git-repo is just fine. But as a customer, I just want a definitive link to a set of needed patches. Jul 17 18:37:52 right, I was suggesting that somebody motivated should maintain such a thing Jul 17 18:38:38 considering that the content against mainline is incomplete, I'm not sure anybody will do it Jul 17 18:38:47 Isn't this something like the repo you are talking about? https://github.com/beagleboard/kernel Jul 17 18:39:12 that's an old kernel Jul 17 18:39:48 RobertBerger: yes, but as a customer I don't want to search for such. I just want a link at the website for the board like "here are the needed patches for mainline 3.4" Jul 17 18:40:06 aholler, and if they don't exist? ;) Jul 17 18:40:28 than for 3.2 or whatever ;) Jul 17 18:40:29 It's 3.2 for the bone and 3.4 for beagle/panda Jul 17 18:40:49 *whew* Jul 17 18:40:59 ok, you originally said mainline Jul 17 18:42:04 s/mainline/vanilla/ Jul 17 18:42:11 @aholler - I would like it mainline ;) Jul 17 18:42:41 ... at least to be able to boot and get some shell ... Jul 17 18:44:48 I confused mainline with vanilla, I always meant vanilla in the above context. Jul 17 18:45:05 mmm vanilla Jul 17 18:46:18 What do you mean by mainline vs. vanilla? Jul 17 18:46:54 mainline is the latest tree from linus, vanilla is 3.2, 3.3, 3.4, ... Jul 17 18:47:23 in the context of kernel, kernel.org says mainline is 3.5-rc7...so we are on the same page Jul 17 18:47:28 OK - I call them all mainline Jul 17 18:47:44 what you can find in the stable-tree is what I call vanilla Jul 17 18:47:49 so iow, you aren't happy with a patchset on top of the linux-psp-3.2 release like is in meta-ti? Jul 17 18:48:14 ok..so that's stable 3.2.y, 3.3.y, 3.4.y...gotcha Jul 17 18:48:25 no, I wouldn't like something with psp in the name as base ;) Jul 17 18:48:36 :) Jul 17 18:48:44 ;) Jul 17 18:48:45 aholler, well, I can't fault you for that Jul 17 18:49:12 denix, didn't you quote some nice number of patches earlier..perhaps elsewhere? Jul 17 18:49:21 it's just that then I would have to go for a search for the correct psp-kernel Jul 17 18:49:41 mdp: 1200 or so... Jul 17 18:49:53 a trivial amount Jul 17 18:50:01 although, >1000 of them are to update 3.2 to 3.2.18 Jul 17 18:50:08 sure Jul 17 18:50:18 git am * shouldn't be problem ;) Jul 17 18:50:30 aholler: indeed Jul 17 18:50:40 at least not if the number of patches is below 10000 Jul 17 18:50:43 does that include the 70 from the recipe..or just to bring it from 3.2 to the psp release? Jul 17 18:51:29 mdp: psp is based on 3.2 Jul 17 18:51:47 mdp: those 1000+ is from kernel.org to get it to 3.2.18 Jul 17 18:51:49 ahh, no bug fixes Jul 17 18:51:59 mdp: 70 or so are koen's specific bone/cape patches Jul 17 18:52:03 right Jul 17 18:52:21 and about 20 are diffs between psp that we based off and the current tip of psp Jul 17 18:52:56 meta-ti carries those stable patches on top of 3.2 you're saying? Jul 17 18:53:06 mdp: correct Jul 17 18:53:13 interesting model :) Jul 17 18:53:32 that's between psp and koen... :) Jul 17 18:53:51 I can at least say that I've preferred a different model when I had to do production stuff versus stable releases Jul 17 18:53:52 psp is not willing to update to the latest stable, koen needs the latest stable Jul 17 18:54:28 As far as I understand there are various ways to get a 3.2 kernel running on a bone. How a about something more recent? Jul 17 18:54:52 and koen won't merge the patches to a new 3.2.18 baseline himself, I guess..ok Jul 17 18:55:21 RobertBerger: do you mean 3.2.y latest or something like 3.3/3.4? Jul 17 18:55:37 mdp: new baseline? we have too many of those... Jul 17 18:55:44 3.4, 3.5 Jul 17 18:57:28 erm...denix...generally stable patches are low impact so it's easier to merge those and drop your soc/bsp patches in a branch...then koen's uber cape commits on top of that Jul 17 18:57:30 RobertBerger: not yet, 3.2 is the current base, there are no resources to rebase to 3.3/3.4 or 3.5 Jul 17 18:57:49 denix...that's life living out of tree...you deal with it Jul 17 18:58:18 So the question is when will the bone be mainline. Jul 17 18:58:27 mdp: needs a tree anyway Jul 17 18:58:38 mdp: correct, but why should _I_ dela with it? Jul 17 18:58:43 denix, needs somebody that cares ;) Jul 17 18:58:43 deal Jul 17 18:59:30 RobertBerger: depends on what functionality you expect Jul 17 18:59:52 but plan on next year Jul 17 19:00:17 Very basic functionality. Boot from SD card and get a shell. No graphics/video Jul 17 19:00:24 networking Jul 17 19:00:51 yep, next year Jul 17 19:02:05 we are the Care Bears? Jul 17 19:02:40 doesn't it boot from SD and get a shell now? Jul 17 19:02:40 denix, we bring rays of sunshine to the world Jul 17 19:03:02 exactly! Jul 17 19:03:16 Where I am currently it's getting dark outside ;) Jul 17 19:03:54 blame someone else... :) Jul 17 19:06:50 I don't care about the darkness, but maybe I should talk to him about mainlining the bone this year ;) Jul 17 19:11:36 ask for it to be mainlined last year Jul 17 19:14:17 He should be able to do things like thatO:-) Jul 17 19:20:56 mdp: the problem is that psp is not based on mainline, but on linux-omap with extra branches merged in Jul 17 19:21:17 mdp: so git can't tell you how far apart it is from mainline Jul 17 19:21:25 wow, that's worse that I could imagine Jul 17 19:21:40 mdp: otherwise I would have done the stable +psp + cape thing Jul 17 19:21:59 the psp kernel also has some musb cherry-pick from 3.2.stable Jul 17 19:22:08 ok, I wondered if it was an "ethnic standoff" line-in-the-sand thing ;) Jul 17 19:23:12 I asked for the l-o commit sha for months Jul 17 19:23:18 no usefull reply Jul 17 19:23:45 my past customers always required some relationship of a patchset on top of stable...so I guess I'm just coming from left field in groking this situation Jul 17 19:24:04 you're preaching to the converted Jul 17 19:24:54 this makes me even happier to be distanced from the situation now, thanks for the clarification. Jul 17 19:25:49 mdp: the beagleboard recipe in oe is stable + patches, so going from 3.2.x to 3.2.y is just updating the SRCREV Jul 17 19:25:53 mdp: bone, not so much Jul 17 19:26:15 next year! Jul 17 19:27:48 koen, when things seem bad, I suggest reading some RPi mainline threads Jul 17 19:32:18 hehe, yeah, i never got used to the linux-omap tree. tons of branches and tags and branches and tags don't have comments like patches ;) Jul 17 19:35:09 so you have to find a tree in a wood, something hard without beeing one of the foresters ;) Jul 17 19:38:57 real foresters use conventional or now electronic tree tags...hrm. Jul 17 19:39:53 * mdp wonders how the Carebears fit into this digital forest. Jul 17 19:42:55 adventure in wonderland Jul 17 20:15:02 hmm, btw. just found that: https://github.com/git/git/commit/b7200e839737491dfe8f0297fba54621fd7d7583 Jul 17 21:57:34 <_av500_> home Jul 17 21:57:39 <_av500_> gm Jul 17 21:58:22 _av500_: awesome! Jul 17 21:58:31 <_av500_> :) Jul 17 21:58:40 av500 Jul 17 22:02:59 get me a brew Jul 17 22:03:30 <_av500_> good idea Jul 17 22:04:48 <_av500_> brew aquired... Jul 17 22:07:55 * mranostay has $500 worth of geiger tubes on his desk atm.. Jul 17 22:07:57 * mranostay is a dork Jul 17 22:08:20 <_av500_> nuclear meltdown much? Jul 17 22:08:54 I have an old geiger counter Jul 17 22:08:57 but the tube is busted Jul 17 22:09:38 precision radiation inc, model 107c "professional" Jul 17 22:09:57 http://www.orau.org/ptp/collection/surveymeters/precision107c.htm Jul 17 22:10:26 group buy of LND-712 tubes Jul 17 22:11:06 this uses a gm tube Jul 17 22:11:57 ah, those are gm tubes Jul 17 22:12:28 yep Jul 17 22:18:56 I don't think the tube is replacable, but it did come with a cool book, 64 questions and answers on geiger counters and scintillators Jul 17 22:19:21 Russ: calibrated to one tube type? Jul 17 22:19:42 heh $150 in 1960 Jul 17 22:20:44 I'm not really sure Jul 17 22:20:48 back in school we had one that used nixie tubes to display the numbers Jul 17 22:21:08 kblin: that is my plan to do :) Jul 17 22:21:41 aren't nixie tubes a pain to get these days? Jul 17 22:23:12 the old soviet warehouses still have some Jul 17 22:27:06 have fun with that then.. Jul 17 22:27:20 nixie tubes sure are some darned cool pice of tech Jul 17 22:35:19 I saw a mention or armhf TI SGX binaries, are they (freely) available now? Jul 17 22:42:16 i tried installing python-setuptools, but got "Unknown package 'python-setuptools'." Jul 17 23:09:18 <_av500_> kblin: hi :) Jul 17 23:11:29 sorry I mean - armhf SGX Ti omap3 binaries Jul 17 23:14:41 _av500_ is smilely today Jul 17 23:38:29 beagleboard xm's on order for a long while **** ENDING LOGGING AT Wed Jul 18 02:59:58 2012