**** BEGIN LOGGING AT Wed Jul 03 02:59:58 2013 Jul 03 03:47:03 emeb_mac, welcome master of BCC Jul 03 03:48:55 lul Jul 03 03:53:25 heh Jul 03 03:55:10 mastiff: did you build a BCC? Jul 03 03:56:40 yeah, and I had the spi dts setup back when ssi was working on it, but then swapped that bbb to debian so have to setup some things again Jul 03 03:57:18 ok Jul 03 03:57:22 the chip rotating surgery went fine a few weeks ago, and tested the bcc pretty well for shorts Jul 03 03:57:33 hardware should be good Jul 03 03:57:44 I remember now. Jul 03 03:57:52 i have these on the bbb bcc_lib bcc_software Jul 03 03:58:13 IIRC mrpackethead has the BCC & DT stuff working on debian Jul 03 03:58:31 yes, we do. Jul 03 03:58:39 but the brains to make that work is actually jmoyerman Jul 03 03:59:15 emeb_mac: I got three more boards :D Jul 03 03:59:19 I haven't populated them yet though Jul 03 03:59:26 * mrpackethead is a manager! Jul 03 03:59:37 I figure five is enough for now ;) Jul 03 03:59:48 ssi: enough to run all your machines Jul 03 03:59:49 if I succeed in using them for cnc machine interfaces, I may need a mess more though Jul 03 04:00:05 i had a look, there is only 5 boards left for sale Jul 03 04:00:12 the rest are mine. Jul 03 04:00:13 OH NO BETTER BUY THEM ALL UP! Jul 03 04:00:13 :D Jul 03 04:00:14 wow! Jul 03 04:00:26 mrpackethead: thanks for that btw Jul 03 04:00:34 emeb_mac: i've keep 12 of the 50 Jul 03 04:00:35 +1 Jul 03 04:00:59 i think its been a sucessful and useful thing to have done Jul 03 04:01:21 ceartinly we've got some useful things going on with it Jul 03 04:01:42 Joshua will probably right up some help for the debian stuff Jul 03 04:02:09 I'm frankly amazed that so many people wanted them. Jul 03 04:02:43 and encouraged :) Jul 03 04:02:49 there was a few requests for populated ones. Jul 03 04:03:02 not surprised - not everyone wants to solder Jul 03 04:03:15 it would be an easy enough thing to do Jul 03 04:03:23 it's not a super easy board for beginners to solder Jul 03 04:03:28 i wanna use mine for calculating ais codes to transmit for vessel bearing based on gps coordinate input Jul 03 04:03:41 but the tool up costs are a bit prohibitive for low runs Jul 03 04:03:49 not surprised Jul 03 04:04:20 solder stencils Jul 03 04:04:21 I've been doing preliminary design work on an S6 version Jul 03 04:04:25 Cool. Jul 03 04:04:26 has anyone done anything interesting with it? Jul 03 04:04:32 ds2, we have Jul 03 04:04:34 emeb_mac: I'd be very interested in that Jul 03 04:04:37 but its a bit secrect. :-) Jul 03 04:04:40 mrpackethead: what have you done? Jul 03 04:04:43 oh BAH Jul 03 04:04:48 the S6 would have ~2x the gate capacity Jul 03 04:04:52 emeb_mac: the mesa card that I'm trying to emulate uses a vq144 s6 part Jul 03 04:04:57 for about $4 more Jul 03 04:04:59 ds2.. its a 4 universe dmx interface, that supports RDM Jul 03 04:05:10 what's DMX? Jul 03 04:05:13 ssi: that's the one I'm looking at - the LX9 Jul 03 04:05:39 emeb_mac: perfect... lemme know if I can get involved with the board design Jul 03 04:05:57 emeb_mac: can the FPGA get to every pin on the expansion header? Jul 03 04:06:05 ssi: will do Jul 03 04:06:21 ds2: yes - plan is to hook up almost every BBB i/o pin Jul 03 04:06:56 except for I2C1 which is already used for capemgr Jul 03 04:07:04 emeb_mac, http://www.sharebrained.com/2013/05/21/my-first-8-layer-pcb/ Jul 03 04:07:08 no reason not to hook that up too Jul 03 04:07:20 you can share the i2c bus so long as you avoid the four magic addresses Jul 03 04:07:32 ssi: except that it would be possible to kill the capebus enumeration. Jul 03 04:07:48 who cares Jul 03 04:08:18 that's true Jul 03 04:08:20 so don't do that :) Jul 03 04:08:53 I'll think about it. We'll see what the routing looks like. Jul 03 04:09:30 is that big enough to put in a M1? Jul 03 04:10:02 M1? Jul 03 04:10:14 M1 garand? M1 tank? Jul 03 04:12:34 ds2: what do you mean by M1? Jul 03 04:12:49 emeb_mac: going to keep it to four layers? Jul 03 04:13:57 mrpackethead: gonna try. Don't expect issues. Jul 03 04:14:28 bmw m1? Jul 03 04:15:42 could any one recommend a resonable rework station that die'snt cost $2000 Jul 03 04:17:12 i am about to design my first Metal clad PCB Jul 03 04:18:17 emeb_mac: Cortex-M1 Jul 03 04:18:29 you mean a softcore? Jul 03 04:18:37 ds2: ah. Jul 03 04:18:41 maybe. Jul 03 04:18:46 yes Jul 03 04:18:50 M1 is a soft core Jul 03 04:18:54 M0 is hard Jul 03 04:20:16 haboob time! Jul 03 04:20:31 you get to swim in mud! Jul 03 04:20:49 sadly, no rain. just dust. Jul 03 04:21:09 but when it hits the swimming pool... Jul 03 04:21:40 emeb_mac: how many flipflops are in that LX9? Jul 03 04:21:56 ssi: uhhh... lemme check... Jul 03 04:22:45 11,400 flipflops Jul 03 04:22:57 yea you should be able to do an M1 in it Jul 03 04:23:09 something I found estimates 2600 LEs, where an LE is a LUT and an FF Jul 03 04:23:24 looks like the LX9 has ~5k LUTs and 11,440 ffs Jul 03 04:23:46 90kb distrib RAM, 576kb Block RAM, 16 DSP48 slices Jul 03 04:24:21 I've never screwed with DSP in fpga Jul 03 04:24:25 or really dsp anywhere hehe Jul 03 04:24:37 I have an old stratix I dev board that someone loaned me that's got a ton of DSP stuff Jul 03 04:25:17 dsp48 slices are pretty handy. Jul 03 04:25:34 great for making MACs - serial FIRs, IIRs, etc. Jul 03 04:26:16 ok you just said a bunch of letters :D Jul 03 04:26:40 :) Jul 03 04:27:11 Josh told me, we'd used about 65% of the spartan 3A for our project Jul 03 04:31:10 not bad Jul 03 04:31:31 i know we have to get the SPI stuf workign Jul 03 04:31:33 usually you don't start to worry until it gets > 75% Jul 03 04:32:16 I had spi working on one of my projects with the bcc Jul 03 04:34:46 bcc test design on the web page has a spi slave port design in verilog Jul 03 04:57:01 mrpackethead: my rework station was >$2k :) Jul 03 04:57:28 i have a great one at work Jul 03 04:57:34 i just wanted a lower cost one for home Jul 03 04:57:52 ic Jul 03 05:00:17 I have a cheapy aoyue air station that I think I got from sparkfun Jul 03 05:00:27 needs more consonants in the name, but it works :P Jul 03 05:10:10 consonants are heavily taxes Jul 03 05:10:13 taxed Jul 03 05:10:23 :D Jul 03 05:12:12 poland must be raking in the revenue Jul 03 05:13:55 well, if you have a garden on an island in the adria, you might have a vrt on krk :) Jul 03 05:14:38 who needs vocals Jul 03 05:14:53 rock bands Jul 03 05:15:19 sorry, I cannot hear you over the noise Jul 03 05:24:56 nosie.. Jul 03 05:29:55 got yer nosie Jul 03 05:41:23 * mranostay bikes into mrpackethead Jul 03 05:41:30 yhanks Jul 03 05:42:00 why do my customers keep asking for increasingly complicated things Jul 03 05:44:15 blech github changed thier interface a bit Jul 03 05:45:10 mranostay: probably because you keep finding solutions for increasingly complicated things ;) Jul 03 05:45:22 err mrpackethead ^^^ Jul 03 05:46:20 dm8tbr: i just create complicated things for no reason :P Jul 03 05:47:03 aaand you're loving it!™ Jul 03 05:48:00 * dm8tbr is being complicated for mobile operator support... Jul 03 05:48:03 git clones a acpi compiler.. Jul 03 05:48:13 they somehow f*** up their call redirect logic Jul 03 05:48:32 not even the direct SSC stuff standardized in 3GPP works Jul 03 05:56:26 how to use opencv in bb xm Jul 03 05:57:39 heh Jul 03 05:57:51 help me Jul 03 05:58:19 * KotH JIHADS chaitha Jul 03 05:58:32 english? Jul 03 05:59:20 i wage a holy war against you Jul 03 05:59:26 * mranostay holy wars chaitha Jul 03 05:59:54 i have only 2 days to submit my report help me abt opencv in bb xm Jul 03 06:00:37 11th hour college student surprise :) Jul 03 06:00:43 this is not a "i messed up my project completely and new i'm screwed" student help line Jul 03 06:01:15 must NOT look at av500 posts on g+ before bed.... Jul 03 06:01:16 another openCV beagle project? Jul 03 06:01:24 ka6sox: what did you see? :) Jul 03 06:01:36 mrpackethead: it seems to be really popular in india Jul 03 06:01:43 I can't even describe it... Jul 03 06:01:58 ka6sox: the skull one? Jul 03 06:02:05 cheerios Jul 03 06:02:15 that greeted me this morning Jul 03 06:02:40 I'm obviouly behind the times Jul 03 06:02:41 what type of ipk files required for open cv and how to install Jul 03 06:02:53 sigh Jul 03 06:03:58 chaitha, is this for school? Jul 03 06:04:11 yeah Jul 03 06:04:46 chaitha: who is giving you these assignments Jul 03 06:04:49 and how did you find us Jul 03 06:05:45 in my project Jul 03 06:06:21 please some one help me about opencv in bb xm Jul 03 06:06:23 mrpackethead: it's often the inidan institute of science Jul 03 06:06:34 chaitha: use the power of google Jul 03 06:06:43 chaitha: you are not the first indian student to have that problem Jul 03 06:06:51 chaitha: i'm sure someone wrote down the exact steps Jul 03 06:07:14 ok but Jul 03 06:07:18 no buts Jul 03 06:07:27 unless they are female and nicely shaped Jul 03 06:08:34 KotH: and will travel? Jul 03 06:09:03 chaitha, its is not our JOB to do the research for you and hand you the answers. Jul 03 06:09:53 is anyone there? Jul 03 06:10:27 nope, nobody overthere. but there are some people overhere Jul 03 06:10:29 for small values of "here" Jul 03 06:10:42 mranostay: not necessarily Jul 03 06:10:57 mranostay: but i wouldnt mind :) Jul 03 06:11:40 sorry, i made a grammar mistake Jul 03 06:11:57 don't worry. the grammar nazis are asleep Jul 03 06:12:52 for beaglebone, I don't how to open JTAG Jul 03 06:12:58 on my mac machine Jul 03 06:13:13 any advices? Jul 03 06:13:26 you dont need jtag, usually Jul 03 06:13:30 what is your problem? Jul 03 06:23:35 I want to debug MCU Jul 03 06:23:49 the kernel or user space programms Jul 03 06:26:22 you do? Jul 03 06:26:27 I prefer it to just work Jul 03 06:28:30 Rocky: for debugging user space, you dont need jtag Jul 03 06:28:48 Rocky: for debugging kernel stuff, you dont want to use macos unless you know what you are doing Jul 03 06:30:55 I want to debug some driver Jul 03 06:31:04 kernel space Jul 03 06:31:21 just use printk like everyone else. Jul 03 06:31:23 that's a bit more involved Jul 03 06:31:25 so what about windows? how to open JTAG Jul 03 06:31:30 Rocky: dont Jul 03 06:31:33 Rocky: just dont Jul 03 06:31:43 Rocky: you make your life a lot harder and more painfull Jul 03 06:31:58 Rocky: there are some tutorials on how to debug the kernel with gdb Jul 03 06:32:02 Rocky: follow those Jul 03 06:32:19 and you do want to do it on linux Jul 03 06:32:21 you really do Jul 03 06:32:32 somehow, folks manage to write kernel code on x86 w/o JTAG. Do what they do. Jul 03 06:32:48 they used serial ports Jul 03 06:33:26 Ok, Jul 03 06:33:53 I just get some info about JTAG support on "GetStarted" page of beagleboard.org Jul 03 06:34:18 So I just want to know about how to open JTAG Jul 03 06:34:30 it seems that it is not necessary Jul 03 06:35:02 But I want to know how to setup the JTAG debug environment, maybe I will not to debug my code on JTAG Jul 03 06:36:00 you shouldn't need it mostly...unless you need to do some bootloader stuff Jul 03 06:37:08 Ok, skip this question. thanks for your answers! Jul 03 06:39:22 np...have fun Jul 03 06:46:31 wtf is a broken pipe error from bison.... Jul 03 06:48:42 mranostay, means you are going to have water all over your floor Jul 03 06:49:18 mranostay, whats the spicific error. Jul 03 06:54:09 <_Sy_> hi, good morning Jul 03 06:54:22 http://pastebin.com/wcAWEr4d <-- ka6sox Jul 03 06:59:24 ewwwwwwwwwwwwwwww kgdb Jul 03 06:59:41 ds2: kgdb? Jul 03 07:10:23 mranostay: looks like bison didnt like that your anchestors killed all bisons Jul 03 07:10:51 not mind Jul 03 07:10:55 *mine Jul 03 07:11:22 they were in either germany, slovakia or france Jul 03 07:15:56 hmm one of my BBBs doesn't seem to want to boot from uSD Jul 03 07:16:13 I keep the boot button pressed, connect power and the board is completely silent on the serial Jul 03 07:17:33 what is really weird is that pressing the reset button after that also has no effect Jul 03 07:17:58 but if I unplug the power and reconnect it, it starts immediately showing boot messages Jul 03 07:20:07 any ideas? Jul 03 07:21:16 actually.. I do see ONE null (0x00) being output on the serial Jul 03 07:30:44 morning Jul 03 07:32:11 gm panto Jul 03 07:32:31 hi av500 Jul 03 07:32:45 ok I'm stumped.. wth is going on.. :P Jul 03 07:32:45 I hate not having the schematics for stuff I built 15ys ago Jul 03 07:32:53 moin panto Jul 03 07:32:54 google does not help at all Jul 03 07:33:00 lol Jul 03 07:33:01 poor av500 Jul 03 07:33:10 first world problems Jul 03 07:33:13 didnt you burn all your data on CDs back then? Jul 03 07:33:25 KotH: I might have burned the paper I drew them on Jul 03 07:33:40 well, then it's your own fault Jul 03 07:33:49 never throw anything away! never ever! Jul 03 07:34:05 I dont Jul 03 07:34:16 I misplaced them Jul 03 07:34:17 you kept the ashes? Jul 03 07:34:18 I found some Jul 03 07:34:23 but not all Jul 03 07:34:45 but then it's fun to reverse engineer my own stuff Jul 03 07:39:23 let us know how often you facepalmed on the "design" :) Jul 03 07:52:09 KotH: this one is pretty simple Jul 03 07:52:16 a dummy load for a tube amp Jul 03 08:00:14 How can I modify the bootargs booting from the eMMC ? Jul 03 08:03:23 edit uEnv.txt on the emmc fat partition Jul 03 08:04:22 av500: thanks, I see is in /media/BEAGLEBONE/uEnv.txt Jul 03 08:04:28 indeed Jul 03 08:04:32 not /boot/uEnv.txt Jul 03 08:04:59 /boot is not on the fat partition Jul 03 08:05:20 right, thanks Jul 03 08:06:14 but is a bit confusing have two uEnv.txt in the filesystem Jul 03 08:08:46 is there one in /boot too? Jul 03 08:08:55 yes Jul 03 08:08:55 if yes, I blame koen Jul 03 08:10:53 or is it a symlink? Jul 03 08:11:18 not, are different files Jul 03 08:11:45 on beagleboard-xm this always confused me as well Jul 03 08:24:08 https://github.com/pantoniou/linux-beagle-track-mainline Jul 03 08:24:23 non-official mainline tracking kernel tree Jul 03 08:24:30 topic branches, etc Jul 03 08:34:00 Hello, I have an error executing "$xterm" in my BBB (running the Angstrom). This is described as the below picture: http://img812.imageshack.us/img812/3750/zbrb.png. Maybe the window manager metacity was killed. hanks! Jul 03 08:41:00 cxp, looks like ubuntu Jul 03 08:42:00 panto, I run x11vnc server on my BBB Jul 03 08:42:30 still looks like ubuntu Jul 03 08:43:00 cxp, doesn't look like a bbb problem, more like a window manager problem Jul 03 08:43:01 ah, no that's just the whole thing Jul 03 08:43:06 what do the logs say? Jul 03 08:44:18 cxp: why do you always prepend a $ infront of your commands? Jul 03 08:45:34 just show that is a command line. IT's just my habit Jul 03 08:46:56 it makes them look like variables ^^' Jul 03 08:49:25 panto, metacity was killed when I executed xterm. Then I could not move everything, keyboard was blocked. And everything became to normal & metcity restarted again when I kill the xterm process. Jul 03 08:50:20 cxp, perhaps xterm doesn't play nice wit your x11vnc server Jul 03 08:50:27 tried another terminal? Jul 03 08:51:08 KotH, uh Jul 03 08:52:11 panto, my keyboard was blocked! Jul 03 08:52:48 So I killed xterm process through ssh Jul 03 08:52:57 well, that's what I said Jul 03 08:53:16 something's wrong with your vnc client Jul 03 08:53:35 panto: or metacity doesnt play nice with xterm Jul 03 08:55:03 panto, I tested through HDMI and nothing change! Jul 03 08:55:41 oh well, try to figure out anything from the logs and file a bug Jul 03 08:56:48 But, xterm run without any error when I use ssh forwarding x11 (ssh -X root@192.168.7.2). I suppose that error due to X11. Jul 03 08:57:00 hmm, the tcl/tk guy said the same Jul 03 08:57:11 metacity died when he wish'ed Jul 03 08:57:44 av500. It's me Jul 03 08:57:53 see, its you Jul 03 08:57:57 try another user Jul 03 09:03:25 cxp: try using another wm, like twm or fvwm Jul 03 09:06:47 KotH, av500: I have been trying Jul 03 09:06:51 Thanks Jul 03 09:35:00 hi KotH Jul 03 09:35:05 and everyone else Jul 03 09:37:21 gm Jul 03 09:39:23 salut mrpackethead Jul 03 09:40:03 hi mrpackethead Jul 03 09:45:59 Hi! Is it possible to get an OS for the BBB with 3.2 kernel? Or how can I downgrade it to 3.2? Jul 03 09:46:11 why would you? Jul 03 09:46:41 Because TI's Graphics SDK (so OpenGL) for 3.8 isn't ready. Jul 03 09:47:00 sgx has been cleared for use on the bone Jul 03 09:47:06 you'll just have to be a bit patient Jul 03 09:48:08 So there is no OS for the BBB with 3.2? Jul 03 09:48:52 the old kernel is always available Jul 03 09:48:59 you can always try to port it to the bbb Jul 03 09:49:06 or pay someone to do it for you Jul 03 09:49:29 that's the beauty of open source Jul 03 09:49:32 you got options Jul 03 09:50:03 whether those options are something you're willing to put the effort or the money depends on you Jul 03 09:50:57 panto: what does "sgx has been cleared for use on the bone" mean? Jul 03 09:51:06 legal stuff Jul 03 09:51:15 means that the lawyery stuff have been done Jul 03 09:51:39 so it will come Jul 03 09:54:21 Well thanks... So I just have to wait Jul 03 10:10:05 Hello Jul 03 10:10:09 is anybody here Jul 03 10:10:26 yes Jul 03 10:11:02 I have a question about beaglebone Jul 03 10:11:05 ask Jul 03 10:11:12 dont ask to ask Jul 03 10:13:09 i boot my os(Angstrom Distribution) from sdcard, login in it, and write some file to its filesystem, after that, I reboot my board, and I found that the file still in my board's filesystem, why? Jul 03 10:14:11 what would you expect ? Jul 03 10:14:15 Rocky, what is the name of the modified file? Jul 03 10:14:54 * ogra_ would actually expect files he created to still be there after a reboot Jul 03 10:15:02 * KotH would too Jul 03 10:15:11 * KotH would be quite pissed if his files were gone after a reboot Jul 03 10:15:15 yeah Jul 03 10:15:16 No, i expect the file I created should disappear when board is restarted Jul 03 10:15:27 Rocky: you write the file to your sd card Jul 03 10:15:40 Rocky: when you reboot, the sdcard is still there with all its data Jul 03 10:15:48 Rocky, mount -t tmpfs none /mnt/tmp Jul 03 10:15:57 Rocky: if you want to have temporary data, place it somewhere where temporary data belongs to Jul 03 10:15:59 anything you write to /mnt/tmp will be gone on reboot Jul 03 10:17:09 I want to know the root reason Jul 03 10:17:38 the filesystem resides in my sdcard? Jul 03 10:18:03 it all started with some ape figuring out that fire was not something scary and dangerous, but could be used to heat and cook as well Jul 03 10:18:28 no, no, no, it all started after we came down from the trees Jul 03 10:18:31 that was a bad move Jul 03 10:19:34 i found the size of my sdcard is 70M, why not 4G? Jul 03 10:19:52 hmm... well, the baboons came down from the trees as well, but didnt do the mistake with the fire Jul 03 10:20:04 Rocky: get yourself a book on unix/linux Jul 03 10:20:09 Rocky: you need it Jul 03 10:20:58 No, I always use initramfs before, and it never save any files Jul 03 10:21:27 well, angstrom doesn't use initramfs, it uses ext4 on mmc Jul 03 10:21:59 How can I check it on my board Jul 03 10:22:16 12:20 < KotH> Rocky: get yourself a book on unix/linux Jul 03 10:22:19 12:20 < KotH> Rocky: you need it Jul 03 10:22:32 take it easy Jul 03 10:22:36 brother Jul 03 10:22:45 working on an embedded linux system without understanding of how linux works is a very bad idea Jul 03 10:22:49 I just want to know some simple thing Jul 03 10:23:08 well, the book tells you how to do these simple things, and more Jul 03 10:23:13 panto is more patient Jul 03 10:23:25 i know, reading books went out of fashion with the rise of the web, but it's still a recommended thing Jul 03 10:23:32 well, panto is greek, i'm turkish Jul 03 10:23:37 we are like day and night Jul 03 10:24:04 and we often play the good-irc-guy, bad-irc-guy game Jul 03 10:24:25 Do not discard my topic Jul 03 10:24:27 thanks Jul 03 10:24:46 I want to know the layout of my sd card Jul 03 10:24:59 that is my question Jul 03 10:25:08 so take a look with a partition management tool Jul 03 10:25:14 like gparted Jul 03 10:25:16 fdisk? Jul 03 10:25:18 and my answer is for you to get a book on linux and learn how to do such basic things Jul 03 10:26:17 * ogra_ agrees with KotH btw ... learing the bare basics would surely help you quite a bit Jul 03 10:29:45 happy friday, channel! Jul 03 10:30:00 http://26-26-54.hardwarebug.org/18 Jul 03 10:32:35 hey bradfa! Jul 03 10:32:38 moin mru Jul 03 10:32:44 howdy KotH Jul 03 10:35:32 * bradfa is gettin' some pru on Jul 03 10:35:39 i just bought 45kg of IC's Jul 03 10:35:40 :-) Jul 03 10:35:47 what a wonderful way to buy them Jul 03 10:35:49 but the kg Jul 03 10:36:46 lol Jul 03 10:37:06 the only thing i buy by the kg are vegetables, meat and t-shirts Jul 03 10:37:15 no chocolate? Jul 03 10:37:20 nope Jul 03 10:37:30 chocolate has to be selected Jul 03 10:37:55 you cannot buy it by the kg.. unless you are mranostay ;) Jul 03 10:39:15 mranostay can't buy by the kg, he's in .us Jul 03 10:39:20 we use real units here Jul 03 10:40:26 since when does the .us have real chocolate? Jul 03 10:40:48 koen, I don't think we do, but we can't buy anything by the kg Jul 03 10:41:04 we do buy soda pop by the liter, though, which is odd Jul 03 10:43:26 why does the us still use archaic measures? Jul 03 10:43:28 not fl.oz? Jul 03 10:43:34 KotH: its easier Jul 03 10:43:41 ds2 tried to make me understand why Jul 03 10:43:44 I forgot Jul 03 10:43:53 it was too difficult to understand Jul 03 10:44:32 heh Jul 03 10:48:33 I can found two partition on my board, one is /dev/mmcblk0p1, /dev/mmcblk0p2, partition 2 is filesystem, I think u-boot.img in mmcblk0p1 should be the bootloader, however, I can't find the kernel image? where is it? Jul 03 10:50:45 /boot Jul 03 10:53:31 got it, uboot will to parse the filesystem in sdcard and load the kernel image to memory and run it , is that right? Jul 03 10:54:17 after that, kernel will mount that filesystem. Jul 03 10:55:22 yes Jul 03 10:57:44 thanks Jul 03 10:59:28 I am curious that what is included in ***.img which I burn to my sdcard Jul 03 10:59:44 only filesystem? Jul 03 11:00:43 a vfat filesystem and a ext4 rootfs Jul 03 11:00:47 plus assorted s/w Jul 03 11:02:33 s/w stand for softare? Jul 03 11:02:46 software? Jul 03 11:02:51 yes Jul 03 11:03:35 the contents in vfat filesystem should be the contents in /dev/mmcblk0p1, is that right Jul 03 11:03:36 ? Jul 03 11:04:26 yes Jul 03 11:04:53 I want to check the contents of *.img on my linux pc, I don't know how, any advices? Jul 03 11:05:06 why would you want to do that? Jul 03 11:05:20 the rootfs is provided as a tarball Jul 03 11:05:33 the boot filesystem doesn't contain anything interesting Jul 03 11:06:12 it's called "quick image kang" Jul 03 11:09:39 any lens suggestions for mt9p031 (LI-5m03) ? Jul 03 11:10:06 you had me at "kang" Jul 03 11:10:59 a wild mdp appears Jul 03 11:11:44 carslan141: glas lens? Jul 03 11:12:13 the see-through type Jul 03 11:12:26 fisheye if you live in portland Jul 03 11:12:42 Im gonna paste my program in this chat Jul 03 11:12:46 to get some help Jul 03 11:12:47 is it okay? Jul 03 11:12:49 nooooo don't do it! Jul 03 11:12:53 oh Jul 03 11:12:55 pastebin Jul 03 11:12:57 .com Jul 03 11:12:57 pastebin.com Jul 03 11:13:03 hastebin Jul 03 11:13:09 pastebinmypastebin.com Jul 03 11:13:21 pastebinallthethings.com Jul 03 11:13:30 I mean do you have a specific model. Jul 03 11:13:33 paste it there first/ Jul 03 11:13:34 ? Jul 03 11:13:39 yes Jul 03 11:13:42 and paste the url here Jul 03 11:13:45 wastebin Jul 03 11:14:01 by the way did you know that pastebin is banned by governement in Turkey? Jul 03 11:14:21 what is MLO Jul 03 11:14:25 http://pastebin.com/R0Qz8Y1Y Jul 03 11:14:27 here it is Jul 03 11:14:52 Am trying to blink external led on the beaglebone Jul 03 11:15:01 but got an error when running it Jul 03 11:15:14 and the error was? Jul 03 11:15:38 MLO is the first stage bootloaded Jul 03 11:15:46 tag unsupported ... Jul 03 11:15:54 ok, MLO will load u-boot.img? Jul 03 11:16:00 yes Jul 03 11:16:04 ok wait2 Jul 03 11:16:10 whats u-boot.img? Jul 03 11:16:26 may be stage 2 bootloader Jul 03 11:16:29 i already updated the latest image on the bbb Jul 03 11:16:47 MILO1234: stick to your javascript problem; don't worry about u-boot Jul 03 11:16:50 MILO1234: I thought you wanted to blink? Jul 03 11:17:04 we all blink down here Jul 03 11:17:05 yes, blinking the led, On and off Jul 03 11:17:20 MILO1234: what was the error you encountered? Jul 03 11:17:33 When board is powered up, it will try to fink MLO and load it , is that right? Jul 03 11:17:39 yes Jul 03 11:17:41 fink-->find Jul 03 11:17:46 yes Jul 03 11:17:46 is that right? Jul 03 11:18:03 here's the error Jul 03 11:18:04 http://pastebin.com/zDV7Hjqn Jul 03 11:18:07 av500, yes? Jul 03 11:18:15 you answer me? Jul 03 11:18:32 or for anyothers? Jul 03 11:19:15 MILO1234: I think you're using setInterval wrong Jul 03 11:19:45 where do i need to place the setInterval? Jul 03 11:19:52 in the function or outside? Jul 03 11:20:09 MILO1234: setInterval takes two parameters Jul 03 11:20:15 you only gave it one Jul 03 11:20:36 hmmm, thats the problem Jul 03 11:20:44 it takes a function name, and a time for the interval that function should be run Jul 03 11:21:01 why do you use setInterval and not sleep(1) Jul 03 11:21:10 so it should be like this setInterval(on,1000); Jul 03 11:21:13 or whatever the javascript equivilend of sleep is Jul 03 11:21:20 jackmitchell: bonescript never sleeps! Jul 03 11:21:29 well, that will run the function of every 1000ms Jul 03 11:21:38 on Jul 03 11:22:05 yes because what i aimed is, to make the on and off for about 1sec delay Jul 03 11:22:11 setInterval, runs the function you give it at certain intervals, defined by the second parameter Jul 03 11:22:14 *led Jul 03 11:22:47 can on be a variable and a function? Jul 03 11:23:01 ohh...so i need to put the setInterval outside the function? Jul 03 11:23:05 indeed Jul 03 11:23:09 like calling the function right Jul 03 11:23:24 ok gonna try Jul 03 11:23:27 MILO1234: and you need a toggleLED function or something Jul 03 11:23:41 http://beagleboard.org/Support/BoneScript Jul 03 11:24:28 http://www.elated.com/articles/javascript-timers-with-settimeout-and-setinterval/ Jul 03 11:24:42 MILO1234: http://pastebin.com/DTtPrF28 Jul 03 11:24:44 something like that Jul 03 11:25:01 can "on" be a variable and a function? Jul 03 11:25:10 except my state is wrong Jul 03 11:25:32 hmm, why do u need to declare the state? Jul 03 11:25:38 and wtf is b.LOW? Jul 03 11:25:54 aside from a thinly veiled attempt of a corny joke Jul 03 11:26:18 I think b.LOW is the a define/const in bonscript Jul 03 11:27:33 okay, so the digital pin that I used is P8_10 Jul 03 11:27:35 is it okay? Jul 03 11:27:44 no idea Jul 03 11:28:02 we need jkridner here Jul 03 11:28:21 hmm, whats the var state for again? Jul 03 11:28:30 it holds the current state of led Jul 03 11:28:40 MILO1234: do you have any programming experience? Jul 03 11:28:41 you could read it from the pin if you wanted Jul 03 11:28:45 just asking, not judging Jul 03 11:29:00 yep i have...c,vb.net Jul 03 11:29:21 ... in that case holding the state of something should be second nature Jul 03 11:29:43 MILO1234: the function of "state" is the same in C, VB and bonescript Jul 03 11:29:43 you can't toggle something without knowing it's current state Jul 03 11:30:28 well, i havent used it in c and vb to make a led turn on, so never stumbled on the 'state' Jul 03 11:31:35 jackmitchell: that's not always true Jul 03 11:31:41 you never had a program with a "state"? Jul 03 11:31:47 Hey is it possible to run the bbb without any binary blobs? Jul 03 11:31:48 if the thing maintains its own state and has a 'toggle' input... Jul 03 11:31:56 Orvotz: yes Jul 03 11:32:02 of course Jul 03 11:32:05 this is not rpi Jul 03 11:32:24 unless you count the ROM code Jul 03 11:32:46 so how do i do this...still cant blink the led on and off Jul 03 11:32:59 Is the ROM flashable? Jul 03 11:33:07 no Jul 03 11:33:13 that's what rom means Jul 03 11:33:17 read-only Jul 03 11:33:20 Cool :) Jul 03 11:33:31 makes the thing unbrickable Jul 03 11:34:16 So u-boot sets.up the ram? Jul 03 11:34:43 MLO does Jul 03 11:34:47 but yes Jul 03 11:35:03 mlo is often uboot spl Jul 03 11:35:09 so in a sense u-boot does it then Jul 03 11:35:14 please take a look http://pastebin.com/fLp48T4S this program succeed in making the LED turn on only Jul 03 11:35:41 external led Jul 03 11:36:15 hehe my new oscilloscope arrived today Jul 03 11:36:21 not bad for cheap chinese junk Jul 03 11:36:30 owon ds7102v Jul 03 11:36:31 Nice! Will order one! Jul 03 11:36:43 how do i edit it, to make it blinking Jul 03 11:37:19 that if is whack milo Jul 03 11:37:23 do you know javascript? Jul 03 11:37:30 a little bit Jul 03 11:37:35 learned it in youtube Jul 03 11:37:45 wtf Jul 03 11:37:59 if (state == b.LOW) { state = b.HIGH; } else { state = b.LOW; } Jul 03 11:38:07 mru: i'm not used to this new generation of "hackers" either ^^' Jul 03 11:38:17 state = !b.LOW; Jul 03 11:38:18 you use the comparison operators instead of the assignment operator MILO1234 Jul 03 11:38:22 urg Jul 03 11:38:27 state = !state; Jul 03 11:38:38 if there's any sanity Jul 03 11:38:46 mru yah ;) Jul 03 11:38:50 im stuck in PHP mode Jul 03 11:38:54 i.e: things have to be difficult Jul 03 11:39:01 lemme turn on my bone Jul 03 11:40:44 ahhh Jul 03 11:40:46 this is so hard Jul 03 11:40:59 ^^' Jul 03 11:41:09 MILO1234: what is your educational background? Jul 03 11:41:10 lol really? Jul 03 11:41:19 KotH what 'new hackers' you mean? Jul 03 11:41:38 emocakes: the new breed, who learns from youtube and facebook Jul 03 11:41:39 Diploma in Electronic and Information Technology Jul 03 11:41:43 o_0 Jul 03 11:41:46 ok Jul 03 11:41:49 Currently doing Internship in a company Jul 03 11:41:56 MILO1234: are you serious? Jul 03 11:41:57 MILO1234 which country? Jul 03 11:42:03 Malaysia Jul 03 11:42:09 ofcourse im serious Jul 03 11:42:14 y? Jul 03 11:42:58 MILO1234: i dont know how it is overthere, but overhere, programming is considered a basic skill for anyone in electrical engineering or computer science Jul 03 11:43:13 or any other science for that matter Jul 03 11:43:25 MILO1234: and if you have a diploma in any of those fields, you at least know how to deal with c/c++/java and another language Jul 03 11:43:41 mru, what about quasi-science? Jul 03 11:43:50 bradfa: quasi-programming Jul 03 11:43:51 Okay I learned programming while studying, only learned, PLC, C,VB.net,assembly language Jul 03 11:43:55 but not javascript Jul 03 11:43:56 mru, touche! Jul 03 11:44:10 MILO1234: seems like you didnt learn programming at all Jul 03 11:44:10 javascript doesn't deserve to be learned Jul 03 11:44:18 oh Jul 03 11:44:22 C cannot be proved to have been learned Jul 03 11:44:26 MILO1234: if you'd know c, you should be able to solve that problem yourself Jul 03 11:44:51 MILO1234: and with that many languages, you should get a certain knowledge and understanding how to deal with new languages Jul 03 11:44:56 right now im not able to solve it, that why i came here... Jul 03 11:45:00 MILO1234: learning javascript should be a matter of a day or two Jul 03 11:45:04 how long does the darn emmc flasher take? for goodness sake! Jul 03 11:45:09 wo in schweiz KotH? Jul 03 11:45:14 bradfa: one cup of good english tea Jul 03 11:45:15 bradfa, 1h Jul 03 11:45:38 emocakes: north of chocolate county, in the middle of the big village Jul 03 11:45:38 KotH diploma is not like european or german diploma Jul 03 11:45:39 it's much faster if you do the update manually Jul 03 11:45:47 panto, omg Jul 03 11:45:53 I was living in Überlingen Jul 03 11:45:55 i.e. mount the partitions and untar the rootfs Jul 03 11:46:00 bradfa, blame physics Jul 03 11:46:03 k, will keep in mind next time Jul 03 11:46:08 it's only 2GB Jul 03 11:46:20 MILO1234 you know asm? Jul 03 11:46:22 x86 asm? Jul 03 11:46:25 stored in a slow mmc, uncompressed, and written Jul 03 11:46:34 and then a good 30 minutes for gnome shit Jul 03 11:46:44 gnome people are retards, film at 11 Jul 03 11:46:47 panto, ah, gnome shit Jul 03 11:46:52 not x86, Rabbit 2000 microcontroller Jul 03 11:46:52 that explains it Jul 03 11:47:11 emmc does 6MB/s writes if they're big Jul 03 11:47:21 which isn't horrible Jul 03 11:47:39 talk to koen, he'll like to vent about it Jul 03 11:47:47 * bradfa runs from koen Jul 03 11:47:54 so MILO1234 why dont you code in C? Jul 03 11:47:59 you can run C on the BBB Jul 03 11:48:05 why is that required I don't know exactly, bit it's something like thumbnails or what have you Jul 03 11:48:06 emocakes, but D is much better Jul 03 11:48:15 I prefer F sharp Jul 03 11:48:16 :p Jul 03 11:48:22 or DD Jul 03 11:48:23 ;) Jul 03 11:48:23 I know, but cant seem to setup the eclipse Jul 03 11:48:24 ;) Jul 03 11:48:27 B minor Jul 03 11:48:33 FORTRAN! Jul 03 11:48:34 emocakes: close to .ch, but no chocoalate! :) Jul 03 11:48:41 you dont need eclipse MILO, just ssh in and use vim Jul 03 11:48:59 lots of chocolate koth, the aisles of edeka are full of it Jul 03 11:49:04 two whole aisles for chocolate Jul 03 11:49:13 i was in heaven Jul 03 11:49:14 okay whats a vim? Jul 03 11:49:16 emocakes: yeah.. the cheap german stuff ;) Jul 03 11:49:22 :( Jul 03 11:49:25 mru: quote it! Jul 03 11:49:33 vim is the proper way to implement emacs Jul 03 11:49:37 ^^ Jul 03 11:49:55 vim is when there is no joe Jul 03 11:50:21 what about ed? Jul 03 11:50:28 he's a nice guy Jul 03 11:50:35 ed's dead baby, ed's dead Jul 03 11:51:33 thx to all for your time, gonna solve it by myself, sorry for the noob questions Jul 03 11:51:40 np Jul 03 11:51:48 but you might want to revise your coding skills Jul 03 11:51:51 google a bit Jul 03 11:51:56 learn a bit more Jul 03 11:52:05 av500: I thought Zed's dead? Jul 03 11:52:08 buy k&r Jul 03 11:52:14 read it Jul 03 11:52:22 bradfa: read it too? Jul 03 11:52:24 then buy tlpi and read it Jul 03 11:52:27 damn, all these years.... Jul 03 11:52:28 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y7Yp2L6c2KM Jul 03 11:52:36 maybe you can kill a man with tlpi Jul 03 11:52:39 big enough Jul 03 11:53:06 it's possible to kill a man with a single sheet of paper Jul 03 11:53:12 just takes a little more creativity Jul 03 11:53:23 no, I won't tell you how I know this Jul 03 11:53:32 just take a very large sheet Jul 03 11:54:09 first step is to fold it 8 times Jul 03 11:54:20 good luck with that Jul 03 11:55:07 http://pomonahistorical.org/12times.htm Jul 03 11:55:10 12 times! Jul 03 11:55:34 lies Jul 03 11:55:42 any fool knows one can only fold a paper 7 times Jul 03 11:55:59 that photo shows the paper curved, not folded Jul 03 11:56:33 define folded Jul 03 11:57:53 by that definition, this bog roll here is "folded" dozens of times Jul 03 11:58:39 just make the paper sheet larger Jul 03 11:58:50 doesn't work that way Jul 03 11:59:14 tell that to the japanese katana maker Jul 03 11:59:25 those are made of paper now? Jul 03 12:00:43 mru: yeah, paper is enogh to kill somebody :) Jul 03 12:03:56 av500: mru: I know, not always true but for the purpose of exercise... Jul 03 12:04:23 facepalm, ISO/IEC 18000-63:2013 for 190 EUR, heh Jul 03 12:04:42 what standard is that? Jul 03 12:04:54 boring of course Jul 03 12:04:59 must be something "important" with such a nice, round number Jul 03 12:05:10 Radio frequency identification for item management -- Part 63: Parameters for air interface communications at 860 MHz to 960 MHz Type C Jul 03 12:05:45 wtf, I expected something more hypable Jul 03 12:05:56 like 9000 and 14000 Jul 03 12:05:57 it's MegaHertz! Jul 03 12:06:09 ynezz: -6 you mean? Jul 03 12:06:16 there is a pdf that google finds Jul 03 12:06:24 144 pages Jul 03 12:06:28 somebody buy me hackaday.com, please Jul 03 12:06:37 it would seem it's for sale Jul 03 12:06:39 was? Jul 03 12:06:45 av500: yes, but it's the "old" one, not for the C type Jul 03 12:06:52 just A/B, I've found it also :) Jul 03 12:07:01 from 2004 Jul 03 12:07:08 mru: 18000 are the rfid standards Jul 03 12:07:18 mru: that's plenty hypable Jul 03 12:07:32 yes, but it's still meaningful Jul 03 12:07:42 yeah, that's unfortunate Jul 03 12:07:44 unlike most of the x000 ones Jul 03 12:07:49 iso failed there Jul 03 12:08:19 actual technical stuff usually gets the next available number in sequence Jul 03 12:08:24 iso generally fails Jul 03 12:08:36 it's a miracle anything workable comes out Jul 03 12:08:37 like 13818 Jul 03 12:08:42 or 14496 Jul 03 12:08:56 mru: but rest assured, all the rfid standards contradict themselves and make it impossible to have a standard compliant implementation Jul 03 12:09:06 like 14496 then Jul 03 12:09:26 worse Jul 03 12:09:28 much worse Jul 03 12:09:41 worse even than the audio parts? Jul 03 12:09:44 14496 is easy to read, small and understandable Jul 03 12:09:47 yes Jul 03 12:09:56 that's impressive Jul 03 12:10:44 i thought you'd like that :) Jul 03 12:13:16 hm, universities should usually have this standards available in the library, right? Jul 03 12:14:12 some of them Jul 03 12:14:16 not all Jul 03 12:14:30 and only if one of the labs needed it Jul 03 12:14:36 oh, poor students :) Jul 03 12:14:49 yeah Jul 03 12:15:20 they should move ISO to .bg, should be cheaper :p Jul 03 12:16:21 their mindset is similar as welll Jul 03 12:18:26 I doubt my uni buys ISO standard just because Jul 03 12:22:49 Morning everybody Jul 03 12:23:30 greetings stranger! what news of the webz? Jul 03 12:23:45 the webz are inter! Jul 03 12:24:24 * jmoyerman just missed a reference... Jul 03 12:24:59 which tells us, that you are not geeky enough :) Jul 03 12:25:13 Or that the dump trucks are not driving around fast enough. Jul 03 12:25:32 well, at least they cannot take the sky away from you Jul 03 12:27:04 * jmoyerman needs to spend more time under the rock... Jul 03 12:31:44 What's everybody working on good today? Jul 03 12:33:44 I'm running upgrade tests. Trying to workout kinks with opkg based in field upgrades. Jul 03 12:34:09 Sounds like fun. Jul 03 12:34:10 Not on beagle hardware though Jul 03 12:34:48 just working on condensing my BCC FPGA on 3.8 Debian notes Jul 03 12:35:28 I work on keeping the entropy high Jul 03 12:35:40 also I try to further the narrative Jul 03 12:36:26 * mru is working on some new, improved curses Jul 03 12:36:29 av500: heh, I got the hardware rng working on the am335x in 3.8 if you need more entropy in your /dev/random :P Jul 03 12:36:37 I'm pretty sure I'll be needing them soon Jul 03 12:36:45 +1 Jul 03 12:36:52 av500: #beagle -> entropy pool daemon? Jul 03 12:38:00 a first year student in computer science in front of vim is a good entropy generator too Jul 03 12:38:10 LOLOL Jul 03 12:38:42 das: vim is positively user friendly compared to ex :-D Jul 03 12:38:51 too predictable here. mru with mouth off about systemd. someone will make references to mranostay drinking and someone will join the channel and ask a question you can find on google. Jul 03 12:39:03 will* Jul 03 12:39:23 I only blame systemd when it deserves it Jul 03 12:39:27 which happens to be all the time Jul 03 12:39:31 lol Jul 03 12:39:46 just like mranostay's drinking Jul 03 12:39:50 :) Jul 03 12:40:18 gah... I should stop trying to work while I'm sitting in class... Jul 03 12:40:24 XorA: oh, I didn't know that piece of cryptic software Jul 03 12:40:57 dont you all edit files with sed? Jul 03 12:41:01 or is that only me? Jul 03 12:41:17 object files mostly Jul 03 12:41:24 I use butterflies... Jul 03 12:41:28 das: I think my unis sysadmins were evil, default editor was ex Jul 03 12:41:44 butterflies are fine, but the latency can be a little hight Jul 03 12:41:52 a magentised needle is often quicker Jul 03 12:41:58 *magnetised Jul 03 12:42:18 hmmm, if you don't pass u-boot a uEnv.txt where does the uEnv get set, at compile time? Jul 03 12:42:35 Or I just call chuck norris and the hard disk gets so scared that the bits change automatically. Jul 03 12:42:36 there are built-in defaults Jul 03 12:42:51 and I assume they're board specific? Jul 03 12:43:03 depending on the compiled config Jul 03 12:43:31 jackmitchell: more specific to however u-boot is built Jul 03 12:43:49 some vars depend on the board Jul 03 12:44:07 hmm Jul 03 12:44:15 jackmitchell: yes Jul 03 12:44:19 there are board specific Jul 03 12:44:23 georgem, do you know where I can buy a BBB? Jul 03 12:44:26 hardcoded in some am335x header file Jul 03 12:44:55 av500: ah yes, I've found them; I'm trying to deconstruct wtf Altera has done with u-boot ;) Jul 03 12:45:04 nothing good Jul 03 12:45:08 mutilated Jul 03 12:45:35 u-boot needs a Linus Jul 03 12:45:35 they seem to be doing ok to be fair Jul 03 12:45:44 I can almost boot mainline-next Jul 03 12:45:51 uboot is doing fine Jul 03 12:45:53 but I get stuck at the dreaded waiting for mmc Jul 03 12:46:13 it seems there are seriously problems with mmc across the board in linux Jul 03 12:46:15 av500: We need another person to write articles about when they curse about manufacturers... Jul 03 12:46:24 mdp: yeah, thats a pretty common question too around here :). I wonder how stock is holding up at the distributors, haven't checked recently. Jul 03 12:46:44 georgem: there is no stock Jul 03 12:46:50 stock means nobody buys them Jul 03 12:47:31 loads of BBB in stock at Farnell Jul 03 12:47:45 noboby buys at farnell :) Jul 03 12:47:53 so paying one with a credit card automatically releases a fab order ? Jul 03 12:48:00 will there be a new version with BiG.LiTtLe and 37 PWMs? Jul 03 12:48:01 mdp: the better question would be, where to apply for a BBB for free :) Jul 03 12:48:19 Not sure how but a guy here at work ordered one from Newark and got it in like a week. Jul 03 12:48:27 follow koen around and wait for one to fall out of his pocket Jul 03 12:48:51 Crofton|work: lol, I've pretty much seen that happen Jul 03 12:48:59 das: yes, a little chinese girl gets dragged out of the dark and humid basemend of a big factory. and gets handed a stone slate and a chisel Jul 03 12:49:10 Crofton|work: at ELC Jul 03 12:49:25 chinese girls can do 45nm now ? Jul 03 12:49:37 they have really tiny hands... Jul 03 12:49:44 they're getting really good at this Jul 03 12:49:45 and if they fail, the whip awayts them Jul 03 12:50:03 who all is planning on being at ELCE? Jul 03 12:50:09 o/ Jul 03 12:50:09 me maybe Jul 03 12:50:11 * mru waves Jul 03 12:50:13 * emocakes looks at his persian rug and smiles Jul 03 12:50:18 mru, you are going? Jul 03 12:50:22 good old 22mm Jul 03 12:50:27 mdp: I plan to Jul 03 12:50:29 mdp: ka6sox has ordered chocolate... have to be there to deliver it Jul 03 12:50:31 need to get a submission in... Jul 03 12:50:32 kids have come a long way Jul 03 12:50:48 mru, ok, I was looking at the issue of flying across the puddle then back for Connect Jul 03 12:50:52 blech Jul 03 12:51:10 * mru is going there too Jul 03 12:51:14 figured Jul 03 12:51:16 I'd like to make it to ELCE but not sure I'll be able to get my employer to cough up the funds. They'll likely rather just send me to ELC here in the states next year Jul 03 12:51:19 only a short hop Jul 03 12:51:52 It appears I need to submit something to get travel funding Jul 03 12:52:09 then submit something Jul 03 12:52:18 KotH, mmm Jul 03 12:52:36 mru, I need to google for ideas..I have none ;) Jul 03 12:52:38 mdp: if you want choclate, you have to bring your wife too Jul 03 12:52:44 mdp: like ka6sox :) Jul 03 12:53:08 mdp: 6052? Jul 03 12:53:10 6502 Jul 03 12:53:34 I think I already did that one IIRC Jul 03 12:53:37 memory is bad Jul 03 12:54:04 do a z80 one Jul 03 12:54:13 thats more enterprisey Jul 03 12:54:27 heh Jul 03 12:55:33 really need to just boot linux on the uARM emulator running on the 6502 Jul 03 12:55:37 everybody wants that Jul 03 12:55:50 I figured the presentation I did in SF has a reasonable chance of being accepted for a repeat over here Jul 03 12:56:03 past elce schedules agree Jul 03 12:56:06 -e Jul 03 12:56:17 I mentioned in another channel the idea of putting an arduino emulator in a PRU. Jul 03 12:56:32 arduino is an API, no? Jul 03 12:56:45 dont we do that for gsoc? Jul 03 12:56:47 That'd be interesting Jul 03 12:57:04 It's several things - a software stack to compile and run code on specific AVR microcontrollers. Jul 03 12:57:06 hmm, maybe I should submit "you and me and bitbang" Jul 03 12:57:12 And some hardware 'standards'. Jul 03 12:57:38 A fully code compatible AVR emulator would be amusing. Jul 03 12:57:48 av500, I will submit, "you and me and SPIes" Jul 03 12:57:51 prism edition Jul 03 12:57:59 mdp: QSPIes? Jul 03 12:58:05 av500: how I stopped worrying and learned to love the bitbang? Jul 03 12:58:15 mdp: the SPI that loved me not Jul 03 12:58:39 "I SPI with my little rpi" Jul 03 12:58:40 On edgeconnectors. Gold Fingers. Jul 03 12:59:17 along came a SPIder Jul 03 12:59:34 av500: I'd be seriously disappointed if you don't have slim pickens in one of your slides riding the bomb Jul 03 13:00:13 av500, ahh, and I was silently thinking of that one too Jul 03 13:00:24 av500, hrm, tbh, it's not a bad one Jul 03 13:00:45 I'd like to do a presentation on why systemd doesn't suck as much as you think. I'd need a tomato shield or something to protect me from mru though Jul 03 13:01:07 a shield made of tomatoes? Jul 03 13:01:11 little use Jul 03 13:01:17 georgem: no, what you need for that is a reality shield Jul 03 13:01:35 I think apple has the patent on that and is not licensing it Jul 03 13:01:57 georgem, I did one once on implementing a binary-only userspace gpu driver for a customer...the heckling from hch was epic. Jul 03 13:03:04 whois hch? Jul 03 13:03:19 Anybody have good reccomendations for psu's for a few beagles (AC 110V to power maybe 4 or 5 beaglebones, doesn't have to be fancy) Jul 03 13:03:31 5V/several A Jul 03 13:03:43 there are legion Jul 03 13:03:55 mru: you think all things systemd are bad? even things like private /tmp Jul 03 13:03:57 for there are many Jul 03 13:03:59 av500, christoph hellwig Jul 03 13:04:15 I use GS18A05-P1J Jul 03 13:04:22 mdp: said presentation online? Jul 03 13:04:31 hrm Jul 03 13:04:36 should be archives..sec Jul 03 13:04:39 whois hrm? Jul 03 13:04:49 heh Jul 03 13:05:04 http://www.ebay.com/bhp/5v-10a-power-supply Jul 03 13:05:18 cheep, cheep Jul 03 13:05:24 av500, haha, found the old press release :) http://www.embeddedalley.com/news/2007/09_24_07.html Jul 03 13:05:35 av500: cheap != good Jul 03 13:05:43 jackmitchell: How many you have that powering? Jul 03 13:05:47 just get a pc ps jmoyerman Jul 03 13:06:01 jmoyerman: just the one; it's got a barrel jack Jul 03 13:06:20 Jack Barrel from 24V Jul 03 13:06:24 jmoyerman: if you want to power multiple from one, you either need a splitter or power straight over VDD I would imagine Jul 03 13:06:43 one can buy barrel connectors and solder cables to them Jul 03 13:06:48 av500, http://goo.gl/0TZQv Jul 03 13:07:06 Yeah. I was trying to avoid taking up an entire power strip with wallwarts Jul 03 13:07:12 I would just ditch the barrel idea and go straight in on the headers with a high amp supply Jul 03 13:07:26 maybe the headers are for capes Jul 03 13:07:31 barrel is fine Jul 03 13:07:34 just solder a cable Jul 03 13:07:45 jmoyerman: as said, there are plenty to be had Jul 03 13:07:48 in all forms Jul 03 13:07:57 open frame, closed frame, like a laptop psu Jul 03 13:07:59 av500, it was about the time that UIO was getting better and I wasn't yet using it..but we did the same approach people do now on UIO Jul 03 13:08:01 19" Jul 03 13:08:09 Just wondering if there were any specific reccomendations... Probably going to go for a meanwell or something similra Jul 03 13:08:35 5*2 10 amps on the 5v rail Jul 03 13:08:48 http://www.ebay.com/bhp/5v-10a-power-supply Jul 03 13:10:50 or put 22 BBBs in series and run it directly from 110V Jul 03 13:11:27 .... peak voltage is 175V :P Jul 03 13:13:10 get some more then Jul 03 13:14:04 don't forget the diodes ;) Jul 03 13:14:20 I thought the BBBs have them? Jul 03 13:14:32 ah, right Jul 03 13:14:40 panto, will you show PRU remoteproc at elc-e perhaps? Jul 03 13:14:48 yes, I'm planning to Jul 03 13:14:52 * dm8tbr wonders how long that contraption would survive on 110V AC Jul 03 13:15:00 I want something flashier though :) Jul 03 13:15:09 attach a xenon tube? Jul 03 13:15:21 I also think about a BoF about switching from board files to DT Jul 03 13:15:27 certainly flashier than a blinking led! Jul 03 13:15:33 dm8tbr, :) Jul 03 13:15:41 dm8tbr: hmm, no diode Jul 03 13:15:59 why does the DC-in go to a pin on the PMIC called "AC"? Jul 03 13:16:00 how about pwms/uarts only limited by number of pins Jul 03 13:16:02 av500: they accidentally the diode, this bad? Jul 03 13:16:04 (and processing overhead) Jul 03 13:16:35 panto: and a presentation with 64 VT100s? Jul 03 13:16:39 or even a PRU pcode Jul 03 13:16:44 av500, :) Jul 03 13:16:50 heh, that could be fun Jul 03 13:16:56 a VT100-wall Jul 03 13:17:05 VT100 donations accepted Jul 03 13:17:41 panto: do I have to take it back as well? Jul 03 13:17:41 panto, my method of switching from board files to DT is to just change SoCs where there's no legacy board files :P Jul 03 13:17:47 anyway, let's coordinate on the submissions so we don't step on each other toes Jul 03 13:17:56 panto, I can do a lightning talk on that approach Jul 03 13:18:05 hmm, ok, I will offer a fex BOF Jul 03 13:18:05 :) Jul 03 13:18:11 panto, with #exactsteps Jul 03 13:18:17 av500, +1 Jul 03 13:18:18 step 1. ditch old Jul 03 13:18:23 step 2. in with the new Jul 03 13:18:25 step 3. profit Jul 03 13:18:56 what if you work for a non-profit? you can't have step 3 !!! Jul 03 13:19:04 anyway, mdp, I expect you to read my patches :) Jul 03 13:19:08 ok, ok Jul 03 13:19:18 see if something's odd there Jul 03 13:19:25 alright folks. Gotta jet. Jul 03 13:19:38 while I'm drawing pretty git branching diagrams, not sure I can tear myself away to read code ;) Jul 03 13:19:53 panto: is there any such submission coordination authority for #beagle? Jul 03 13:19:54 I'm thinking of creating some kind of slave cpu subsystem Jul 03 13:20:25 we call it... the trilateral commission Jul 03 13:20:41 and a certain greek is chairing this commision? Jul 03 13:20:49 that is a secret Jul 03 13:21:09 it is unfortunate you found out Jul 03 13:21:13 KotH: if its a EU project, its always a greek chairing Jul 03 13:21:24 av500, you're joking right? Jul 03 13:21:38 only if it's on leaning submarines Jul 03 13:21:39 and "chairing" is his work description Jul 03 13:21:41 so it blow its budget and get bailed out by the Germans? Jul 03 13:21:53 panto: we had that at uni Jul 03 13:21:58 part of an eu project Jul 03 13:22:00 KotH, that sounds very organized Jul 03 13:22:06 all the work was done in the north Jul 03 13:22:11 the chair was in the south Jul 03 13:22:19 av500: I thought 'chairing' was what happened to the first row of attendees at a MS conference Jul 03 13:22:24 the money went there too Jul 03 13:22:36 mdp: organizational entities are always organized... sometimes even disorganized Jul 03 13:22:43 * mdp boggles Jul 03 13:22:45 another eu project would not be funded, unless they found a "southern" uni to chair ut Jul 03 13:22:49 well, the money was ephemeral, the knowledge was permanent Jul 03 13:23:02 which is how things turned out the way they are Jul 03 13:23:06 panto: dont worry, the knowledge never touched greece :) Jul 03 13:23:15 that's what I'm saying Jul 03 13:23:30 av500: well.. eu law demands that project participants are in at least 3 eu countries and have a certain distribution Jul 03 13:23:38 yes Jul 03 13:23:51 so in hindsight, you got a nice subsidy, and the southern idiots got some money that they spend on the stuff you've made Jul 03 13:24:01 yes Jul 03 13:24:21 so... who's got the better part of the deal? Jul 03 13:24:36 I dont think we got any money Jul 03 13:24:44 I think it went all to buy chairs Jul 03 13:24:57 you're missing the point :) Jul 03 13:25:20 the chair missed him Jul 03 13:25:27 cause he ducked Jul 03 13:25:38 although old his reflexes are still sharp Jul 03 13:36:18 hum, vring io is considerably easier using proto threads Jul 03 13:44:10 mrpackethead: is it possible to substitute the 0603 100nF X7R caps in the BOM with 0805 Y5V? or they won't fit / won't filter well enough? Jul 03 13:44:23 err substitute 0805 Y5V for 0603 X7R Jul 03 13:44:49 only use Sprague Orange Drops Jul 03 13:46:31 av500: for Vcc decoupling? (-: Jul 03 13:48:57 kfoltman: it damn sounds better Jul 03 13:49:35 av500: only if you power the BCC with full tube power supply, it gives the FPGA chip a nice orange glow :P Jul 03 13:49:57 I can do that Jul 03 13:49:59 send it over Jul 03 13:50:45 kfoltman: I think you'll have a hard time making them fit Jul 03 13:51:23 and they certainly won't sound as good Jul 03 13:52:09 OTOH, I think 0603 will make a great sound of deep fried capacitors when soldered by me :/ Jul 03 13:52:20 they're not that bad :P Jul 03 13:52:44 if you anticipate trouble with the 603s on the top, what on earth are you gonna do about all the 402s on the bottom? Jul 03 13:53:13 kfoltman: http://www.jogis-roehrenbude.de/Bastelschule/NGU/NGU.htm Jul 03 13:53:18 I can use that to power your FPGA Jul 03 13:53:29 I've tried, just for shits and giggles, to take some old useless PCI USB board and unsolder a few components using my iron and no hot air or anything fancy... epic fail so far Jul 03 13:53:48 removing SMDs is a bit harder than placing them Jul 03 13:53:55 kfoltman: put the PCI card on the stove Jul 03 13:54:01 I did that here to get some parts Jul 03 13:54:25 ssi: I can hardly see them without a magnifier :S Jul 03 13:54:52 get a decent pair of esd safe tweezers Jul 03 13:55:04 and a good soldering iron Jul 03 13:55:16 wes51 with a 1/32" tip works great Jul 03 13:55:33 av500: like, the top of the cooker? ok, that doesn't sound too bad (from cooking perspective at least) Jul 03 13:55:41 kfoltman: yes Jul 03 13:55:47 whatever you call that Jul 03 13:55:48 av500: I'll try it, thanks! Jul 03 13:56:24 though I did it with a mainboard Jul 03 13:56:28 few bottom components Jul 03 13:56:31 ymmv Jul 03 13:56:31 av500: won't that fry the plastic though? Jul 03 13:56:44 I have nothing to lose anyway, at least on that card Jul 03 13:56:51 is it my kitchen or yours? Jul 03 13:57:23 I can't try yours AFAIK ;) Jul 03 13:57:44 try harder Jul 03 13:58:02 av500: well, if the components fall off and end up inside it, it might be fairly bad, but if I put it on some metal thingy, I can at most fry the components Jul 03 13:58:08 kfoltman: why the heck have you 0805 100n Y5V and no X7R's ? Jul 03 13:58:09 use this https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-MZHpO2sZsgM/UctEydloHTI/AAAAAAAAC98/CBu7GIVXmAA/w1039-h779-no/IMG_20130626_170835.jpg Jul 03 13:58:22 works for desoldering also :) Jul 03 13:58:32 but the label says...! Jul 03 13:58:40 ynezz: for desoldering turn it upside down Jul 03 13:58:41 ynezz: also for home reflow work, eh? Jul 03 13:58:56 kfoltman: sure, why not Jul 03 13:59:13 kfoltman: https://plus.google.com/u/0/111387094029238541867/posts/ZvYuDe2RUaG Jul 03 14:00:06 ynezz: what's that laser thing? Jul 03 14:00:28 well, this beast is harder to regulate :) Jul 03 14:01:04 it's a temp Jul 03 14:01:15 oh, thermometer Jul 03 14:01:23 ynezz: do you fry it before or after? Jul 03 14:01:54 frying is so 80's, it's not healthy anymore Jul 03 14:02:00 what kind of oil do you use? Jul 03 14:02:11 Lidl Classic Jul 03 14:02:18 +1 Jul 03 14:02:19 * dm8tbr wonders if that would work on an induction stove or if the field goes too much through the pan and would fry the magic smoke out of the parts Jul 03 14:03:23 we bought one of teh elector reflow ovens once Jul 03 14:03:27 The pan shorts out the field in the first few microns. Jul 03 14:03:28 works great! Jul 03 14:03:48 SpeedEvil: what frequency are induction stoves working at? Jul 03 14:03:50 For aluminium - 20 microns or so. For steel, .3mm or so. Jul 03 14:03:55 KotH: 60khz Jul 03 14:04:02 jo, denn! Jul 03 14:04:15 omg, thats the strange sound I hear Jul 03 14:04:23 when my wife is cooking Jul 03 14:04:37 totally messes up my hifi Jul 03 14:04:38 av500: are you a bat? Jul 03 14:04:49 av500: funny as it is, i know someone who can hear wifi access points Jul 03 14:05:12 KotH: that's a second carrier they use to send stuff via long waves to NSA ;) Jul 03 14:05:17 yep, makes me wonder how they passed the certifications :p Jul 03 14:05:31 KotH: all of them or just some? Jul 03 14:05:51 mru: aperantly all of them, if he is near enough Jul 03 14:05:59 even 5GHz? Jul 03 14:06:06 uhmm.. that i dont know Jul 03 14:06:09 :) Jul 03 14:06:24 and what do they sound like? Jul 03 14:06:33 he couldnt describe it Jul 03 14:06:37 Chicken. They sound like chicken. Jul 03 14:06:41 lol Jul 03 14:06:49 depends what it's downloading Jul 03 14:07:25 obviously nobody can hear radio waves Jul 03 14:07:55 but maybe some component vibrates at a lower frequency Jul 03 14:07:59 mru, oh yeah? how can you explain my nice tin foil hat Jul 03 14:08:22 like usb ports often make chirping sounds when active Jul 03 14:10:01 panto: that's to block mind-control rays Jul 03 14:10:04 mru: not entirely Jul 03 14:10:23 what not entirely what? Jul 03 14:10:28 mru: it is known that some people are able to hear some portion of electromagnetic waves... usually one in the lower range Jul 03 14:10:31 KotH: does he also hear voices? Jul 03 14:10:39 like I do? Jul 03 14:10:45 av500: only of people who are talking Jul 03 14:11:01 thats the problem, they talk ALL the time Jul 03 14:11:08 PLEASE, make them stop Jul 03 14:11:08 KotH: I'll accept that electromagnetic waves might induce currents in some nerves causing the owner to perceive sounds Jul 03 14:12:10 mru: juup.. it's usually thought that this is the way how people hear it. but nobody knows exactly Jul 03 14:12:39 av500: that's called irc. people are there to talk Jul 03 14:13:26 mru: interestingly: from what i know, it should not be possible to induce currents into nerves. they are not conductors in the first place Jul 03 14:13:40 ask the CIA Jul 03 14:14:16 KotH: so maybe not the nerves as such Jul 03 14:14:19 http://26-26-54.hardwarebug.org/146 Jul 03 14:14:26 but there's plenty of conductive material in the human body Jul 03 14:14:48 mdp: why, we are Jul 03 14:15:21 KotH: if you doubt that, feel free to touch my high-voltage generator Jul 03 14:17:24 Nerves may not be conductors - however once you exceed the action potential - some one volt - a cascade of signal will be triggered along them. Jul 03 14:19:04 av500, I just want to keep you all on track Jul 03 14:22:18 mru: there, it's mostly the blood vesels that conduct the current :) Jul 03 14:22:50 whatever it is, it sure affects the nerves _somehow_ Jul 03 14:22:51 are we talking about a new cape here? Jul 03 14:22:55 mind-control-cape Jul 03 14:23:19 juup Jul 03 14:23:47 i know that some animals have corpi in certain cells that react on electrical or magnetic fields Jul 03 14:24:00 so some current in the right place should reasonably be able to stimulate the auditory nerves Jul 03 14:24:08 might be that some people have variants fo those corpi as well Jul 03 14:24:10 thus making the person 'hear' things Jul 03 14:24:36 anyone can feel a sufficiently strong electric field Jul 03 14:24:51 * ogra_ thought since google glass it all goes "through the bone" now ... Jul 03 14:25:00 mru: google for transcranial magnetic stimulation Jul 03 14:25:12 ogra_: when I hold my beagelbone to my ear, I hear nothing Jul 03 14:25:14 :( Jul 03 14:25:21 its broken then Jul 03 14:25:23 mru: that's being used by psychologist to excite or inhibit whole brain areas :) Jul 03 14:25:23 RMA it Jul 03 14:25:28 cheep sheet Jul 03 14:25:41 morning Jul 03 14:25:42 or you are just missing a triod on top :) Jul 03 14:25:46 *triode Jul 03 14:25:55 working on that Jul 03 14:25:55 to amplify Jul 03 14:25:59 :) Jul 03 14:26:02 BEERISH JIHAD mranostay Jul 03 14:26:05 mourning mranostay Jul 03 14:26:09 been drinking again? Jul 03 14:26:27 this channel is in eternal friday Jul 03 14:26:31 hi mranostay Jul 03 14:26:35 tgif, right? Jul 03 14:26:50 another day off? Jul 03 14:26:52 unpossible Jul 03 14:26:52 this is the channel of confusion Jul 03 14:27:09 it's channelling it for sure Jul 03 14:27:28 mranostay, don't tell you've blacked out again for two days Jul 03 14:27:32 *tell me Jul 03 14:27:35 it's friday you know Jul 03 14:27:41 panto: no, he was, uhm, biking Jul 03 14:27:58 uh, yeah, that's the ticket Jul 03 14:27:59 in his kilt playing the accordion Jul 03 14:28:00 I was 'biking' Jul 03 14:28:02 that's what they call it these days? Jul 03 14:28:09 they do in portland Jul 03 14:28:50 portland? Jul 03 14:28:54 what's wrong with portland? Jul 03 14:29:02 portland Jul 03 14:29:09 can we portland android to it? Jul 03 14:29:17 does it supportland ubuntu? Jul 03 14:30:05 ubuntu, darth vader wearing a kilt playing the bagpipe edition Jul 03 14:30:11 *on a unicycle Jul 03 14:31:38 I like portland Jul 03 14:33:24 * mranostay bikes in Jul 03 14:35:13 the dream of the 90s is alive in portland Jul 03 14:38:30 damned hippies Jul 03 14:38:59 hippies were 30 years late in portland? Jul 03 14:39:09 young folks went there to retire Jul 03 14:39:33 lol my wife has a different perspective on the craziness, she grew up near there back before it was an artist haven Jul 03 14:40:15 portland is pretty cool Jul 03 14:40:45 alas I haven't spent that much time there, just a week and most of that week I was driving around the area's scenic stuff :) Jul 03 14:46:47 mourning Jul 03 14:46:47 Spirilis: punk haven too Jul 03 14:47:09 mourning Chief Punk mranostay ;) Jul 03 14:47:22 damned good coffee though Jul 03 14:47:43 happy friday ka6sox Jul 03 14:47:57 Spirilis, they don't burn it like the Seattle bunch... Jul 03 14:48:05 huh? Jul 03 14:48:14 oh man Jul 03 14:48:16 KotH, did I miss a few days? Jul 03 14:48:18 don't get me started on seattle Jul 03 14:48:26 ka6sox: seems you drunk too much like mranostay Jul 03 14:48:28 someone here at work really likes that Starbucks French Roast Jul 03 14:48:33 that shit seriously makes me sick I think Jul 03 14:48:35 grotesque Jul 03 14:48:37 didn't seattle create starbucks? Jul 03 14:48:42 yes Jul 03 14:48:47 say no more Jul 03 14:48:48 me never? Jul 03 14:48:49 good representative :P Jul 03 14:49:06 anyways.. time go to home and get some real work done Jul 03 14:49:08 grotesque burned coffee, the American Petroleum Institute should seriously consider certifying it Jul 03 14:49:09 bye boys Jul 03 14:49:13 enjoy your friday! Jul 03 14:49:18 "for light car and passenger truck use only" Jul 03 14:52:35 Hello everyone, sometime when I connect to my BBB through ssh (using usb gadget), the terminal's prompt shows "root@dhcppc6" insteads of "root@beaglebone". But the file /etc/hostname is still "beaglebone". And my BBB is connecting to the Internet using DHCP by the Ethernet port. Thanks! Jul 03 14:53:08 your dhcp server sends a hostname that the bone client accepts Jul 03 14:55:47 Oh, this is really weird for me! Can I config the BBB to not accept this hostname? Jul 03 14:55:56 probably Jul 03 14:56:25 connman if it's angstrom, something else if it's a different distro Jul 03 14:56:35 Will devicetree object compile on debian wheezy yet? Google foo is failing me. Jul 03 14:56:37 KotH, if I ever get to that point...my liver will give up Jul 03 14:57:05 Thanks, the BBB is running Angstrom Jul 03 14:57:38 haksaw, can you get the device tree compiler on wheezy? Jul 03 14:58:47 ka6sox: http://packages.debian.org/wheezy/device-tree-compiler Jul 03 14:59:29 im having an issue compiling a 1wire dts on hipster circuit's site Jul 03 15:01:11 Thanks panto, I got it! Jul 03 15:02:00 how to install sdb server on Narcissus image loaded in beagle board Jul 03 15:02:02 ? Jul 03 15:02:13 haksaw, did you have any output from DTC? Jul 03 15:02:42 BB-W1-00A0.dts:2.2-8 syntax error Jul 03 15:02:57 edk, how to install sdb server on Narcissus image loaded in beagle board Jul 03 15:03:44 Nilking, what is sdb server? Jul 03 15:04:09 Hi :) Jul 03 15:05:05 I want to beeld a poky distro using yocto for my beaglebone black, but as I'm just a beginner at this I'd like to ask where to find the .bb files for this machine Jul 03 15:05:14 Beeld should be build :) Jul 03 15:06:31 ka6sox, hv installed image builder from narcissus for agnstrong into my beagleboard but is giving me error coz i didnt install one of the package Jul 03 15:07:30 ka6sox, i have tried the Opkg update command still it's nt installing the package for " gdb server " Jul 03 15:08:30 haksaw, this dts came from the beagleboard/kernel repo or from hipster circuits? Jul 03 15:08:48 Nilking, opkg install gdb-server? Jul 03 15:09:24 need more coffee Jul 03 15:09:37 ka6sox: hipster circuits Jul 03 15:10:05 haksaw, url or paste of the dts you are trying to compile? Jul 03 15:10:22 better would be paste of the actual one Jul 03 15:10:22 http://hipstercircuits.com/dallas-one-wire-temperature-reading-on-beaglebone-black-with-dto/ Jul 03 15:10:40 ka6sox, tried , gdbserver comes in the category of Additional Console Pakages Jul 03 15:11:10 ka6sox: http://pastebin.com/XmUUPwMV Jul 03 15:11:28 Nilking, are you trying to get narcissus to give this to you or after you have the image fetch it? Jul 03 15:14:14 ka6sox, i have the image, i tried to fetch on it, is it possible or i have to go for whole new process of narcissus online image builer ? Jul 03 15:15:34 Nilking, you should be able to get it from the repo Jul 03 15:18:45 has anyone been able to get resolutions higher than 320 x 240 using opencv and a webcam on the BBB? Jul 03 15:18:56 ka6sox, how to do that, coz m very new to this i don't know, any link will be helpful Jul 03 15:21:20 _asdf: isn't the resolution limited by the webcam? Jul 03 15:22:49 Nilking, have you googled for this...there are at least 4 examples that give you #exactsteps Jul 03 15:23:54 fenrig my webcam is HD but I can only get a max of 320 x 240. I think the drivers (UVC?) might be limiting higher resolutions Jul 03 15:24:24 going to have to dig around Jul 03 15:24:27 what happens at a giher resolution? Jul 03 15:24:31 higher Jul 03 15:24:46 haksaw, its kind of a mess relative to the ones I'm used to seeing (in the git repo) Jul 03 15:25:41 I get errors from c++ (didn't save the log) and frames aren't captured at all Jul 03 15:28:16 ka6sox: yeah its having an issue finding /plugins/ Jul 03 15:29:57 haksaw, I realize it might be a long process but I'd get the real repo and patch the kernel Jul 03 15:30:08 then look in firmware/capes at how those are formattted Jul 03 15:31:29 I thought dtbo are the new standard Jul 03 15:32:09 yes, the overlays are in firmware/capes Jul 03 15:33:14 (the uncompiled ones in the sources) Jul 03 15:34:18 * mranostay throws cherry bombs in the room Jul 03 15:35:12 back to work troll Jul 03 15:36:04 ka6sox: so where is the source for all of these? Jul 03 15:36:31 https://github.com/beagleboard/kernel/tree/3.8 Jul 03 15:36:42 kk, thanks! Jul 03 15:36:43 those are the patches Jul 03 15:36:58 follow the instructions to patch the kernel then look in firmware/capes Jul 03 15:37:40 there *might* even be a w1 example in there. Jul 03 15:38:37 there is Jul 03 15:38:40 weathercae Jul 03 15:38:44 *weathercape Jul 03 15:38:52 is there a way to add addtional bootargs to u-boot from the u-boot promt? Jul 03 15:39:04 I know you cna do setenv bootargs xxx=xxx Jul 03 15:39:21 but that overwrites all the bootargs does it not? Jul 03 15:39:27 yes Jul 03 15:39:32 * panto looks at Tartarus Jul 03 15:40:47 * mranostay looks at panto Jul 03 15:42:19 KotH, yes indeed Happy Friday! Jul 03 15:45:15 jkridner: http://prpplague.github.io/Energia/blog/2013/07/03/compiling-the-blink-sketch-for-the-bbb/ Jul 03 15:45:37 prpplague: thanks! Jul 03 15:45:49 jkridner: major progress Jul 03 15:48:34 panto: did you push your kernel stuff? :) Jul 03 15:49:02 panto: fwiw, i could boot a v3.10 vanilla yesterday Jul 03 15:49:12 ezequielgarcia, err, you've missed it Jul 03 15:49:26 https://github.com/pantoniou/linux-beagle-track-mainline Jul 03 15:50:09 I see a note on the AM355X TRM that you can only write the Contolr registers from supervisor mode. on DM37XX I am quite sure I did do just that Jul 03 15:50:31 or am I just dreaming? Jul 03 15:51:11 which control registers? Jul 03 15:51:26 some are certainly restricted Jul 03 15:51:31 some others are not Jul 03 15:52:32 * Tartarus looks around Jul 03 15:52:44 Yes, jackmitchell, setenv bootargs a=b overrides bootargs Jul 03 15:52:52 setenv bootargs ${bootargs} a=b will append Jul 03 15:52:53 iirc Jul 03 15:52:55 Tartarus: it's ok; I coped! Jul 03 15:53:05 panto: cool, have you followed buildroot discussion about this? Jul 03 15:53:27 Tartarus: that's a neat trick though, will use next time Jul 03 15:53:32 * Tartarus confirms quick Jul 03 15:53:33 no, I don't care about buildroot Jul 03 15:53:54 ok, because they're looking for a kernel. so it might make sense to try yours Jul 03 15:54:34 U-Boot# setenv test 1;printenv test;setenv test $test 2;printenv test Jul 03 15:54:34 test=1 Jul 03 15:54:34 test=1 2 Jul 03 15:54:41 sweet Jul 03 16:00:23 ezequielgarcia, don't use that one Jul 03 16:00:27 this is for tracking the mainline Jul 03 16:00:34 it won't do you any good for actual use Jul 03 16:01:08 ah, ok. Jul 03 16:01:44 there is another tree in my github account Jul 03 16:02:07 the branch that works (although it's a dev branch) is not-capebus-v31 Jul 03 16:15:52 Can the Allegro .brd files be opened in Allegro v. 16.3 Jul 03 16:16:13 try and find out Jul 03 16:16:39 We have opened them but we can't see the layers. Jul 03 16:17:40 We cannot see the components but we get a pop up box when hovering over them which indicates that they are there. Jul 03 16:17:59 <_av500_> ask allegro? Jul 03 16:18:38 We have but have been getting the run around. Jul 03 16:19:12 so it's a game of battleship Jul 03 16:19:46 indeed. Jul 03 16:22:03 <_av500_> C3E2: you can ask Gerald on the ML Jul 03 16:22:33 Who is Gerald? Jul 03 16:22:40 beagledad Jul 03 16:22:46 jkridner is beaglemom Jul 03 16:22:52 <_av500_> koen is beaglekid Jul 03 16:23:02 <_av500_> prpplague is beagleuncle now Jul 03 16:23:16 <_av500_> joel_ is beagleintern Jul 03 16:23:18 I hate to guess what makes me Jul 03 16:23:19 who's beagletroll? Jul 03 16:23:23 ah, panto Jul 03 16:23:23 that one Jul 03 16:23:38 * panto bows Jul 03 16:23:51 * panto starts singing - allow to introduce myself... Jul 03 16:23:59 <_av500_> ds2 is beagleNAND Jul 03 16:24:03 why do i have to be the mom? Jul 03 16:24:16 jkridner: you don't _have_ to, but you are Jul 03 16:24:16 <_av500_> jkridner: because that supreme court was late Jul 03 16:24:30 <_av500_> jkridner: these days it could be two dads Jul 03 16:24:40 _av500_, or two moms Jul 03 16:24:53 <_av500_> right Jul 03 16:25:08 two trolls? Jul 03 16:25:16 <_av500_> only? Jul 03 16:25:18 tale of two trolls Jul 03 16:25:21 a novel Jul 03 16:25:27 <_av500_> a shovel Jul 03 16:25:57 tail of two trolls Jul 03 16:41:52 <_Sy_> hello Jul 03 16:42:12 <_av500_> world Jul 03 16:42:14 <_Sy_> panto, I got the two BBB talking on UART4, works great! Jul 03 16:42:22 <_av500_> _Sy_: that did they say? Jul 03 16:42:26 <_av500_> complain much? Jul 03 16:42:39 <_Sy_> P8-11 crossed Jul 03 16:42:42 <_Sy_> what do you mean? Jul 03 16:42:57 <_av500_> wellm they talked to each other Jul 03 16:43:10 having a tea party Jul 03 16:43:22 _Sy_, good Jul 03 16:43:22 <_av500_> just gossip I would guess Jul 03 16:43:30 <_Sy_> connected P9-11 and P9-13 crossed over on each board and connected P8-1 to each other Jul 03 16:43:41 GND and TX/RX? Jul 03 16:43:45 <_Sy_> yep Jul 03 16:43:52 <_av500_> is there a kernel driver for token ring over serial? Jul 03 16:44:03 <_Sy_> P9-11 RXD, P9-13 TXD, P8-1 GND Jul 03 16:45:36 ka6sox: ok, got it compiled. Turns out the debian packaged didn't have support for the -@ flag. Had to install roberC's DTC to work. Jul 03 16:45:42 <_Sy_> In the PDF P8-1 isn't mentioned as being GND, but I found it elsewhere. Jul 03 16:46:14 haksaw, can you add that tidbit of information to the DTC pages @ elinux.org? Jul 03 16:48:55 <_Sy_> am I correct in thining the baud rate is 115200 for UART4? where is this set? Jul 03 16:49:16 <_av500_> its whatever you want Jul 03 16:49:23 <_av500_> you can set it Jul 03 16:49:33 <_av500_> (within limits) Jul 03 16:50:01 <_Sy_> It must be initialised someplace as both of them seem to be set the same, I haven't set anything. Jul 03 16:50:14 <_av500_> how did you use it? Jul 03 16:50:23 _Sy_, you set it Jul 03 16:50:28 man termios Jul 03 16:50:42 <_Sy_> from the terminal I did cat >/dev/ttyO4 and on the other system ls -l > /dev/ttyO4 Jul 03 16:50:47 <_Sy_> just to test it Jul 03 16:51:24 <_av500_> ah Jul 03 16:51:28 <_av500_> so default baudrate Jul 03 16:51:35 <_av500_> whatever that is Jul 03 16:51:55 <_Sy_> I'll set it in my application before use Jul 03 16:53:01 _Sy_, use screen for quick tests Jul 03 16:53:07 screen /dev/ttyO1 115200 Jul 03 16:53:09 just works Jul 03 16:53:31 * _av500_ runs Hyperterm in qemu Jul 03 16:55:09 <_Sy_> ty for help, I'll be back l8r. Jul 03 17:28:15 hello Jul 03 17:28:44 anyone there? Jul 03 17:29:18 What SD card to ourchase for BeableBone Black? Jul 03 17:29:26 A microSD card. Jul 03 17:29:26 purchase Jul 03 17:29:37 size matters? Jul 03 17:29:38 2GB or bigger. Jul 03 17:29:46 how big can I go? Jul 03 17:29:55 amurican size big Jul 03 17:30:03 Faster classes will obviously be faster, but anything Class 4 or better should be fine. Jul 03 17:30:15 beginner: I believe 64GB is the biggest that exist. Jul 03 17:30:47 stupid question... are all of the people in the list to my right on this site now? Jul 03 17:31:03 The names you see are people in the channel, yes. Jul 03 17:31:06 yes, but they may not be payin gattention at all times Jul 03 17:31:10 people "dile" Jul 03 17:31:13 grr Jul 03 17:31:14 idle Jul 03 17:31:17 Most of them are not active, as Crofton|work says. Jul 03 17:31:35 * ogra_ surely diles a lot here Jul 03 17:31:37 when we have time, we may review the scorll back Jul 03 17:32:08 I just bought a BBB and am very... captivated by it. Jul 03 17:32:31 absolutely the SMALLEST embedded target I have ever been on! Jul 03 17:32:39 vary cool. Jul 03 17:32:46 you must be very light for it not to break Jul 03 17:32:50 are you wearing shoes? Jul 03 17:33:19 * panto notes that this is the troll channel too Jul 03 17:33:19 my other home system is a am335x evm. Jul 03 17:33:33 my sympathies Jul 03 17:33:43 they look sort of funny sitting beside each other. Jul 03 17:34:12 actually I like the 335x evm a whole lot. Jul 03 17:34:58 it has made me a ton of... what's that stuff... oh yea, money! Jul 03 17:35:40 thanks for the SD card info... later all. Jul 03 17:48:53 panto: even my internet traffic is trollish now Jul 03 17:50:22 * mranostay puts on troll cap Jul 03 17:53:12 bradfa: you are on a 26+26=54 spree Jul 03 17:53:26 * bradfa parties! Jul 03 17:53:48 2 in a row! :) Jul 03 17:54:20 they turn into trolls so fast *sniff* Jul 03 17:55:55 * bradfa needs lunch! Jul 03 18:28:08 <_Sy_> hello, is panto here? Jul 03 18:30:23 <_Sy_> I have enabled UART4 in boot with: optargs=quiet drm.debug=7 capemgr.enable_partno=BB-UART4 Jul 03 18:30:58 <_Sy_> this works fine, I would like to enable UART5 too, I tried appending capemgr.enable_partno=BB-UART5 Jul 03 18:31:11 <_Sy_> but it doesn't work, how to I add another port? Jul 03 18:32:18 <_Sy_> anyone here? Jul 03 18:33:56 <_Sy_> nvm Jul 03 18:58:29 Hello, is the the correct place to enquire about a repair on the LCD7? Jul 03 19:01:21 Possibly. Jul 03 19:02:31 <_Sy_> anyone here? Jul 03 19:03:03 yes Jul 03 19:03:11 Looks like about 248. Jul 03 19:03:14 The names you see are people in the channel, yes. Jul 03 19:03:24 <_Sy_> Hi panto, sorted now, uarts 4 and 5 enabled and working Jul 03 19:04:01 good Jul 03 19:04:37 are they usable with minicom, etc? Jul 03 19:05:55 obviously Jul 03 19:06:14 that's the working part Jul 03 19:08:00 <_Sy_> I'm using both ports for communications between two BBB's in addition to the ethernet, the idea is the serial link is used purely to send heartbeats between devices, nothing else Jul 03 19:09:26 it should work Jul 03 19:13:36 i'm using uarts for nmea and bluetooth, have done some testing on one of the other uarts, but may to switch ports Jul 03 19:17:10 <_Sy_> NMEA183 GPS ? Jul 03 19:24:27 ais and gps from my marine radio and chart plotter Jul 03 19:24:36 also sonar data Jul 03 19:24:40 _Sy_, just be careful not to drive the boot pins while in reset Jul 03 19:28:16 <_Sy_> Why? Shouldn't do, but what could it do? There isn't any current on these pins is there? Jul 03 19:28:50 _Sy_, it could change the boot order Jul 03 19:29:14 <_Sy_> oh...ok, ty Jul 03 19:33:35 hey anyone seen a NULL pointer dereference during omapdss init on the beaglebone black? Seems to be related to omap_current_dss_features being null. Jul 03 19:34:06 <_Sy_> Writing a simple application to mange floating IP address between two BBB's, each BBB will have it's own static IP and the pair will use the heartbeat between them to decide which one gets the floating IP.... Jul 03 19:34:07 bone has no dss Jul 03 19:34:25 bone has no dss? what is used for display subsystem then? Jul 03 19:34:31 lcdc Jul 03 19:35:03 essentially a shift register Jul 03 19:36:18 ok, i'll look into this. thank you! Jul 03 19:36:37 <_Sy_> Any experts on node.js here? Jul 03 19:39:04 * mru points at jkridner Jul 03 19:39:26 hi _Sy_ Jul 03 19:40:23 <_Sy_> hi, I've just finished reading a book on node.js "Node Up and Running" by Tom Huges & Mile Wilson, but it doesn't go far enough for what I want to do. Jul 03 19:41:04 * jkridner has a list of recommended books at http://beagleboard.org/support/BoneScript Jul 03 19:41:07 <_Sy_> I want to write a test application to try our the performance as a feasibility study for replacing a native application. Jul 03 19:41:24 if you already have a native application, why would you want to replace it? Jul 03 19:41:50 replacing native with naive Jul 03 19:42:15 <_Sy_> I have a native C application that raises an interrupt on the 1PPS GPS pulse, when this occurs I have to do something, what I want to find out is if its possible to raise my own event when the 1PPS pulse comes in then get an app written in node.js to do something. Jul 03 19:42:24 unlike mru, I actually think JavaScript has its place in embedded. Jul 03 19:42:53 <_Sy_> Portability between systems, at the moment the app runs on a PC104 x86 system, I'd like to move it away from QNX and onto Linux and ARM. Jul 03 19:43:08 if that pulse is coming in on a pin, tying a gpio-keys event to it will make it simpler. Jul 03 19:43:25 then, you can simply trigger on an OS event. Jul 03 19:43:39 <_Sy_> The real challenge is to see if an app written in Node can keep up. Jul 03 19:43:50 With once-per-second events? Jul 03 19:43:52 Maybe. Jul 03 19:43:54 depends what you ask it to do. Jul 03 19:44:13 <_Sy_> Our data comes in at 5000x32 byte samples per second... Jul 03 19:44:36 I shouldn't heckle. Jul 03 19:44:37 <_Sy_> An interrupt on 1PPS triggers when the data flow starts. Jul 03 19:44:52 node is pretty fast, but creating unoptimized stuff can be done pretty easily too. Jul 03 19:44:56 I've written real-time signal processing with sox+hexdump+awk Jul 03 19:45:34 <_Sy_> The data goes into a ring buffer then is picked out by the interrupt handler, will could be done in node...I'm looking forward to prototyping the system. Jul 03 19:45:41 PPS = packet per second? Jul 03 19:46:08 <_Sy_> Pulse Per Second, 1PPS defines to approx. 20ns when the rising edge of the next GPS timestamp occurs. Jul 03 19:46:47 ..and at that time you need to move 5000x32 *bytes* of data? Jul 03 19:47:01 <_Sy_> We use GPS 1PPS to synchronise two remote units so the data each acquires is spot on and can be cross referenced by a remote server. Jul 03 19:47:14 do you have some kind of DMA engine moving that data? Jul 03 19:47:29 getting something to happen in node on a pulse edge is pretty easy. Jul 03 19:47:34 <_Sy_> No, just QNX streaming the data to the file system. Jul 03 19:47:48 latency can be pretty low, but much of that depends on the OS context switch latency. Jul 03 19:48:08 <_Sy_> The device driver and interrupt handler is written in C, a Java application picks up the actual data out of the ring buffer and writes to disk Jul 03 19:48:12 * jkridner doesn't understand where the magic data comes from. Jul 03 19:48:37 k, well, guess you'll need to re-implement that part too? Jul 03 19:48:39 <_Sy_> QNX is pretty excellent in terms of its real time performance. Jul 03 19:49:32 <_Sy_> I could raise and event periodically to tell the node application that there is content in the ring buffer to read, then the node application could empty the ring if it can keep up before its filled again. Jul 03 19:50:43 k, what's the question again? Jul 03 19:51:12 <_Sy_> is it possible to create user definable events that can be raised by a native library? Jul 03 19:51:35 <_Sy_> library probably to right, I mean a driver. Jul 03 19:51:53 define 'user definable events' Jul 03 19:52:36 <_Sy_> for example....when my driver has to notify the node app that data is ready to read from the ring buffer, I could raise an event "ringrdy" Jul 03 19:53:24 is that from a gpio? Jul 03 19:53:51 <_Sy_> it could be. Jul 03 19:53:54 sounds like you would want to get node to listen via select() or epoll() Jul 03 19:54:19 if your native library is in something like C Jul 03 19:54:28 theterg: node already has an event loop that does a poll(). the ideal case would be to use the existing event loop. Jul 03 19:54:35 <_Sy_> but isn't polling or listening in a loop kind of defeating the whole point of an event driven system? Jul 03 19:54:55 _Sy_: don't add a new event loop, use the existing one. Jul 03 19:55:01 right, but I guess the question is getting an event from a native library / file descriptor into node Jul 03 19:55:32 things like gpio-keys create native events that will trigger the existing event loop. Jul 03 19:55:40 <_Sy_> If I was coding this in another language, then the event would be associated with a context, is the same true in node? Jul 03 19:56:07 yes, your event handler would preserve your JavaScript context. Jul 03 19:56:17 that's the nice thing about JavaScript closures. Jul 03 19:56:31 <_Sy_> So can you tell in the event handler what/where the event came from? Jul 03 19:56:40 yes. Jul 03 19:57:08 <_Sy_> excellent, in that case I should be able to re-use an existing event, ok, will hunt around for some examples. Jul 03 19:57:09 node.js's job is to manage the event loop and call your routines in the right context. Jul 03 19:57:47 <_Sy_> Another question on node, completely different, is there any way to protect one's IPR and javascript with node? Jul 03 19:58:39 Has anyone hooked up a lipo battery to the TPS65217C on the BBB? Sounds like the host USB won't work without a 5v supply though :( Jul 03 20:02:07 _Sy_: btw, I'm pretty sure all you'd need to do is fs.read the event file, which should 'block' and cause node to go into its event loop. I'll test that. Jul 03 20:02:24 I need to do that anyway because I need to replace my attachInterrupt() routine with a sane one. Jul 03 20:02:34 What is IPR? Jul 03 20:02:47 Intellectual Property Rights? Jul 03 20:03:03 From who are you protecting your JavaScript code? From someone with root access to your device? Jul 03 20:03:13 <_Sy_> Intellectual property Jul 03 20:03:25 I mean, if they can't get to the device, they shouldn't be able to see code running server-side... Jul 03 20:03:45 <_Sy_> I have a package that I am about to sell and I don't want the customer simply rippling it off... Jul 03 20:03:52 but, obfuscating scripts is generally silly. Jul 03 20:04:00 possible, but silly. Jul 03 20:04:10 there are obfuscators for js Jul 03 20:04:13 <_Sy_> I'm deliverying a system, they will have the server and everything on it. Jul 03 20:04:27 panto: js is obfuscated enough already Jul 03 20:04:31 _Sy_: Does your contract specifically say you can obfuscate? Jul 03 20:04:35 I suggest not using an interpreted language then. Jul 03 20:04:40 If it doesn't, I'd refuse obfuscated code. Jul 03 20:04:49 _Sy_: might do what you want: https://github.com/crcn/nexe Jul 03 20:04:50 And require you deliver it cleartext. Jul 03 20:05:01 Unless you wish to supply free bugfixes. Jul 03 20:05:09 <_Sy_> I've written packers and compressors before, but I was wondering if since node.js uses a JIT compiler, is there a pcode type file it uses like Java's jar file? Jul 03 20:05:34 (though you'd probably want to run the .js through an obfuscator first) Jul 03 20:06:53 <_av500_> _Sy_: node does not use a JIT Jul 03 20:06:58 Or learn to do what you want done using a real language :P Jul 03 20:07:05 _av500_: V8 doesn't have a JIT? Jul 03 20:07:09 * jkridner thought it did Jul 03 20:07:11 <_av500_> yes Jul 03 20:07:14 <_av500_> but that is the browser no? Jul 03 20:07:16 <_av500_> ah no Jul 03 20:07:18 * georgem thought V8 did too Jul 03 20:07:20 <_Sy_> I thought it did, I'm sure I read that someplace...that V8 compiled the javascript Jul 03 20:07:26 <_av500_> ignore me Jul 03 20:08:05 * _av500_ is too old and thinks browsers when reading js Jul 03 20:08:10 <_Sy_> So like Java it produces pcode, then the actually JVM does the last bit turning the pcode into native code, thought that was exactly what V8 did. Jul 03 20:08:41 I wonder if there are apps to compile js into stand alone native Jul 03 20:08:41 I don't think it has an intermediate format that it supports Jul 03 20:08:55 somethign like what was done back early in the C# / vb.net days Jul 03 20:09:27 <_Sy_> It must do...else the execution would take longer, thats really why Java performance is good, because most of the work in compilation has already been done. Jul 03 20:11:26 <_Sy_> mmmm...sounds like I'm wrong, the V8 engine doesn't produce byte code, but it does compile the Javascript into native code. Jul 03 20:12:30 never really read much about it. soudns cool though Jul 03 20:13:02 web technology moves too fast for me to read much about all that. AngularJS uses V8 too doesnt it ? Jul 03 20:13:19 <_Sy_> It means that javascript isn't just a cool browser client side language but potentiially can be used to create effecient server side applications. Jul 03 20:14:15 isnt that what node.js is meant for ? Jul 03 20:14:17 <_Sy_> node.js isn't multi-threaded, however I read in this book that it does have support to utillize multiple cores in a system to run, which sounds like threading to me. Jul 03 20:15:04 <_Sy_> Yes, node.js can be used to replace Apache and PHP and offers better performance than both Apache and PHP, whilst giving a really powerful and nice to use language. Jul 03 20:15:42 If i really needed performance though. id probably want ot use an embedded web server API Jul 03 20:15:52 like snorkle perhaps Jul 03 20:16:21 <_Sy_> But then if you want to do anything like database interface would you write a native application? Jul 03 20:16:26 <_Sy_> CGI ? Jul 03 20:16:41 _Sy_: yeah, the 'cluster' API provides access for running on multiple cores. general theory of node.js is to encourage you to write non-blocking code and avoid creating threads. Jul 03 20:16:47 <_Sy_> which falls down on the performance and requires much more resources, doesn't scale to well either. Jul 03 20:16:55 sql probably. access time on sql databases is remarkably fast. Jul 03 20:17:02 access times* Jul 03 20:17:35 <_Sy_> Threads are bad...remember years ago going on a real-time programming course, the advice given then was if you are thinking about using threads, try and use seperate processes instead. Jul 03 20:18:29 _Sy_: "Threads are bad" is a gross over-generalization IMHO Jul 03 20:18:40 and impossible not to use sometimes Jul 03 20:18:44 yeah... Jul 03 20:18:52 you use an OS you're struck with threads Jul 03 20:18:54 <_Sy_> probably, but there are lots of potential pitfalls and it can get very complicated. Jul 03 20:19:03 _Sy_: concurrency = complication Jul 03 20:19:22 kfoltman: it is a drastic oversimplification, but it works. Jul 03 20:19:41 OK i'm stumped - can anyone help. I want to grab a hold of S2 on the BBB from within a kernel driver. Is it mapped in anywhere and can I get it to raise an interrupt? Jul 03 20:19:41 <_Sy_> Don't get me wrong, I've use threads frequently, but if I can I try to avoid it. Jul 03 20:20:22 hey guys, i have a brainfart question to ask Jul 03 20:20:43 * mranostay gets out the air fresher Jul 03 20:20:44 jkridner: it makes things harder, sure - but sometimes it's the best-performing option Jul 03 20:21:11 in bash, what is an elegant way of reading a value from gpio set as input? Jul 03 20:21:15 _Sy_: sure, unnecessary concurrency and shared data structures is a good way to shoot oneself in the foot Jul 03 20:21:24 <_Sy_> I use mutexes when neccessary, but still can be difficult to visualize when a problem occurs and synchronisation can be a bitch. Jul 03 20:21:30 Absolutely. Jul 03 20:21:37 im stuck on `cat /sys/class/gpio/gpioxx/value` kludgery Jul 03 20:21:49 _Sy_: In some code, I can't even use mutexes due to realtime constraints Jul 03 20:21:54 exosyst: what is S2? Jul 03 20:22:00 _Sy_: lockless queues FTW Jul 03 20:22:05 cyronin: with bash that's probably about as elegant as you're going to get Jul 03 20:22:05 jkridner, the user boot switch Jul 03 20:22:11 exosyst -> http://pastebin.com/nc0VUbRH Jul 03 20:22:19 exosyst, you can't use it Jul 03 20:22:27 or, you can't use it with hdmi on Jul 03 20:22:30 or video Jul 03 20:22:32 _Sy_: and it's always a bitch to debug Jul 03 20:22:39 <_Sy_> In QNX where I have multiple processes communicating, I creatd a shared memory area and then use locking flags to allow each process to synchronise access. Jul 03 20:22:56 I don't want video so that's fine :D panto Jul 03 20:23:09 * kfoltman never used a true RTOS, alas Jul 03 20:23:38 gotcha, been a while since ive done significantly sophisticated bash scripting, tossing an if [ `cat /sys/xxxx/value` != 1 ] felt wrong Jul 03 20:23:38 I'm not sure you want to use it Jul 03 20:23:40 it's tricky Jul 03 20:24:16 panto, It's the only push button on the board I can really use. i don't want to buy additional capes just to prove to students that I can raise an interrupt Jul 03 20:24:19 <_Sy_> I try to avoid RTOS where you have to link with the kernal as its very each to produce a brick if you get it wrong....QNX is very nice because its a lot like Linux but can be extremely small. Jul 03 20:24:27 panto: doing non-trivial realtime-like stuff on a non-RTOS isn't any better, I suppose Jul 03 20:24:50 _Sy_, Linux can be extremely small too Jul 03 20:25:02 m_billybob, what am I looking at there? eMMC_RSTn isn't the right line is it? Jul 03 20:25:02 ds2, how small have you gotten it to be? Jul 03 20:25:08 cyronin: gpio=( $( We use to use RT Linux, before Wind-River bought it up and stopped selling it.... Jul 03 20:25:37 exosyst, i misunderstood what you meant ( too much coffee for me this morning ) Jul 03 20:25:41 _Sy_, I used to do RT Jul 03 20:25:49 exosyst you said S2 I was thinking USR LEDs . . . Jul 03 20:25:51 RTOSes are overrated IMO Jul 03 20:25:57 XorA: that looks better, thanks Jul 03 20:26:10 I'm mostly leaning to no-os for hard realtime stuff these days Jul 03 20:26:11 cyronin: I had to look it up, I remembered there was a way to do it, but not how Jul 03 20:26:30 m_billybob, no problems. Nope, I plan on delivering training courses using the Beaglebone Black (one userspace course already run succesfully) but for the Device Drivers stuff I want to show an interrupt setup and triggered Jul 03 20:26:35 <_Sy_> Its very strange Real-Time means different things to people, to me it just means that you can count on the OS to do something when you need it to. Jul 03 20:26:38 RTOSes were a kludge where you couldn't get a nice host processor to handle your mundane stuff Jul 03 20:27:00 ideally without hanging wires out of the headers and having to buy a breakout board which is what I did for the BBW based courses Jul 03 20:27:21 XorA: that describes everything I know about bash right now, "I know there is a way to do x, but damned if i can just remember that syntax" Jul 03 20:27:23 exosyst, probably the best way to go with whats been said now Jul 03 20:27:33 ( hanging wires off the board ) Jul 03 20:27:37 thanks though Jul 03 20:27:56 exosyst, look in the tester cape Jul 03 20:27:58 panto: +1, though messaging APIs are still useful and a semaphore/priority thing can be helpful for more complicated real-time systems Jul 03 20:28:01 <_Sy_> The problem with a lot of OS's is that when you need them to be there to do something, they aren't and instead are doing something non critical like house keeping, this is where a RT OS differs. Jul 03 20:28:05 cyronin: Ive been doing LaTeX for last couple of hours, bash looks nice now :_D Jul 03 20:28:25 hahaha Jul 03 20:28:31 panto: in case of musical stuff, I want the 'host' CPU to do DSP, so it's no longer the 'host' proper :) Jul 03 20:28:38 panto: though, adding another right-sized processor for more tasks would generally be more elegant/efficient. Jul 03 20:29:00 m_billybob, that kinda sucks :( Jul 03 20:29:01 _Sy_, for example if you had a way to set aside a few cores to only run your code (in as tight loop as you want) you wouldn't need a RTOS Jul 03 20:29:17 <_Sy_> panto, thats very true Jul 03 20:29:24 panto: having dedicated cores for DSP might be a good idea, but then you have the interdependencies still Jul 03 20:29:30 panto: as in, bus contention... Jul 03 20:29:31 I have a cunning plan about that Jul 03 20:29:42 exosyst, well with that said Derek Molloy has a video on just that too, although he's isnt using interrupts . .. Jul 03 20:29:43 kfoltman, yes, you do Jul 03 20:29:51 he isnt* Jul 03 20:29:56 panto, I've got the breadboard cape that I used with the BBWs, can I not just disable HDMI (which drivers?) and then ioremap it in as a memory location? Jul 03 20:30:13 such that I can get at the interrupt from S2 Jul 03 20:30:25 optargs=capemgr.disable_partno=BB-BONELT-HDMI,BB-BONELT-HDMIN Jul 03 20:30:29 done. Jul 03 20:30:29 but the thing is, having a core just set aside for yourself is the best guarantee that you'll get the best performance out of that single core Jul 03 20:31:07 kinda seems like the whole overlays thing is getting useful Jul 03 20:31:18 imagine having to hack the board file to do that Jul 03 20:31:26 no kidding. Jul 03 20:31:49 exosyst that optargs statement was meant for you btw Jul 03 20:31:50 not using an RTOS is great until you want to do something that is a pain in the ass on bare metal Jul 03 20:32:13 m_billybob, panto would I not be able to tweak the dts file and set it as a triggered interrupt? Jul 03 20:32:14 georgem, right, that's why I said, you always have a few cores running a general purpose os like linux Jul 03 20:33:02 * m_billybob defers to panto Jul 03 20:33:12 <_Sy_> Most people don't want to engineer the whole solution or re-invent the wheel when others have already invested 100's or 1000's of hours in wiriting device drivers etc....so you need to pull it all together and know that whilst you don't know what others have done, you can count on the OS not to let you down. Jul 03 20:33:13 in the old days you couldn't, cause cpu power was $$$$ Jul 03 20:33:30 _Sy_, you can count on the OS to let you down Jul 03 20:33:32 panto: what if linux could just run the processes on the dedicated cores without locks and shit getting in the way. then you'd have the best of both worlds. Jul 03 20:34:15 <_Sy_> Except without locks you have some almost impossible and infrequent errors to find. Jul 03 20:34:26 georgem, there is work underway Jul 03 20:34:32 _Sy_: well... yeah. thats not what I meant Jul 03 20:34:33 look up core/process isolation Jul 03 20:35:28 <_Sy_> Kind of reads like protected memory Jul 03 20:35:50 sort off Jul 03 20:35:52 *of Jul 03 20:36:28 exosyst, i'd answer, but honestly have no experience with that *yet* Jul 03 20:37:24 georgem, btw, the biggest win, is having a huge address space, covered by only very few TLBs Jul 03 20:37:41 the HPC guys are looking at it Jul 03 20:37:44 Cool Jul 03 20:38:03 Oh, nice. Jul 03 20:38:13 one of those days ( again ) ? Jul 03 20:40:11 just checking . . . Jul 03 20:40:16 <_Sy_> Time to sign off and get my beauty sleep...nite all Jul 03 20:44:57 m_billybob, no problems. I've fired off an email to a guy at TI who might no.... maybe.... with hope. Jul 03 20:45:31 know* - yeesh, i've been at this too long. Give me a hardcoded location and ioremap any day haha. Bloomin device trees! Jul 03 20:54:30 * jkridner wonders if there are any TI interns online for the design challenge office hours. Jul 03 20:54:34 exosyst, well i belive theres been talk on the beagleboard google groups about interrupts( for sure regarding the PRU ) but yeah, I dont normally read all that post per post Jul 03 21:00:44 m_billybob, yeah I read about that a few minutes ago. People want there interrupts dammit haha. - if I can get it I'll be using it to fire a USB rocket launcher mwahaha Jul 03 21:01:21 <_av500_> yeah, usb interrupts often Jul 03 21:01:39 _av500_: more than Kayne? Jul 03 21:01:50 exosyst, I understadn what you're trying to do. But cant help but wodner "why?" when sysfs would work jus tfine too Jul 03 21:01:55 _av500_, yeah, but they want a button to press for FIRE!! Jul 03 21:02:20 why do you need the PRU for that? Jul 03 21:02:25 wow typo central here. Jul 03 21:03:18 m_billybob, sysfs is great and all but it's a device drivers course. These guys are gonna have piece of hardware connected at a memory location and want to know how to drive a line and get an interrupt off it. I don't want to use SYSFS or anything *too* beaglebone specific where I can as the delegates are gonna have radically different kernels and hardware setups Jul 03 21:03:40 <_av500_> mranostay: hey, this being drunk is nice... Jul 03 21:04:34 <_av500_> why is sysfs beagle specific? Jul 03 21:04:40 <_av500_> my intel PC has it too Jul 03 21:04:46 <_av500_> intel yay Jul 03 21:04:59 there's nothing beaglebone specific in the last kernel Jul 03 21:05:06 besides the capemgr Jul 03 21:05:12 everything else is generic Jul 03 21:05:19 <_av500_> board_generic.c Jul 03 21:05:29 exosyst, maybe im wrong, but yeah I think a kernel driver is going to be less abstract compared to sysfs Jul 03 21:05:54 err i worded that wrong Jul 03 21:06:34 I think having a kernel module would be more differcult to deal with across "multi platform" or distro's if you like Jul 03 21:06:55 <_av500_> multi platform? Jul 03 21:07:03 <_av500_> what other platform? Jul 03 21:07:28 <_av500_> from a distro pov, sysfs or kernel module is the same Jul 03 21:07:36 <_av500_> both is compiling a kernel Jul 03 21:08:04 yeah I suppose that is true. I guess im thinking more of dtc Jul 03 21:08:13 * m_billybob is still learnign too Jul 03 21:08:17 you guys are really giving me a hard time huh ;) - m_billybob, these aren't typically multiplatforms. They'll have, as an example, a dedicated piece of radio equipment that connects into their SoC and want to be able to get at the interrupts and drive it Jul 03 21:08:30 <_av500_> connect how? Jul 03 21:08:40 <_av500_> a gpio? Jul 03 21:08:57 exosyst, not really giving you a hard time, just trying ot udnerstand is all Jul 03 21:09:10 to understand. Jul 03 21:09:24 _av500_, ARM so memory mapped IO. Not SPI, I2C or anything useful at all. Jul 03 21:09:25 <_av500_> and who is "they"? Jul 03 21:09:33 <_av500_> "they" they? Jul 03 21:09:37 <_av500_> or the other "they"? Jul 03 21:09:43 <_av500_> *they* Jul 03 21:09:49 <_av500_> *_THEY_* Jul 03 21:09:51 _av500_, The students I get in are from a broad spectrum of companies... THEY ARE THEY! :D Jul 03 21:09:51 them ;) Jul 03 21:10:03 <_av500_> hey, I am THEY too Jul 03 21:10:10 <_av500_> and so is my wife Jul 03 21:10:18 <_av500_> WE ARE ALL THEY Jul 03 21:10:24 yes yeah, and we're all legion.... So about my interrupting switch? Jul 03 21:10:28 :D Jul 03 21:10:35 <_av500_> yes, ask that one again Jul 03 21:10:41 <_av500_> I missed it between beers Jul 03 21:10:43 lol Jul 03 21:10:55 _av500_: you should leave the beer to mranostay Jul 03 21:11:07 <_av500_> he got me hooked Jul 03 21:11:13 _av500_: you are neither 20 nor is your liver trained! Jul 03 21:11:58 <_av500_> this one says: strawberry vanilla german fizzy bubble organic microbrewed whole grain light beeer Jul 03 21:12:06 <_av500_> (made in china) Jul 03 21:12:10 lol Jul 03 21:12:11 <_av500_> it must be good, no? Jul 03 21:12:14 mranostay: now, you shouldnt get other people addicted to your drugs! that's not nice! Jul 03 21:12:41 <_av500_> even the voices stopped Jul 03 21:12:43 _av500_: cream and chocolate is missing Jul 03 21:12:56 <_av500_> KotH: that was in the other bottle Jul 03 21:13:03 <_av500_> its a binary thing Jul 03 21:13:07 and you didnt mix them? Jul 03 21:13:13 KotH: that would be too JIHAD! Jul 03 21:13:14 how un-usian of you! Jul 03 21:13:32 <_av500_> I had each in one show Jul 03 21:13:41 one shoe? Jul 03 21:13:41 * KotH hits kfoltman for the wrong use of the word JIHAD Jul 03 21:13:47 <_av500_> but TSA made me take them off Jul 03 21:13:47 <_av500_> shoe Jul 03 21:13:49 KotH: is there a right use? Jul 03 21:13:54 ofc! Jul 03 21:14:05 <_av500_> KotH: btw, egypt is doing an anti-jihad Jul 03 21:14:14 about time, perhaps Jul 03 21:14:45 too bad the choice is between military coup and religious nuts Jul 03 21:14:47 _av500_: actually, they are rebelling against a US founded government, so in a way, it's the right JIHAD Jul 03 21:15:12 <_av500_> KotH: wasnt the previous one US funded too? Jul 03 21:15:19 <_av500_> maybe they have a subscription Jul 03 21:15:22 they all are Jul 03 21:15:29 <_av500_> and military tends to be US funded too Jul 03 21:15:32 <_av500_> turltes Jul 03 21:15:36 <_av500_> all the way down Jul 03 21:15:37 morsi was allegedly elected a couple of years ago Jul 03 21:15:45 nobody in the middle east came to power without a subscription to usian kool aid Jul 03 21:15:46 <_av500_> the shadows looked fake Jul 03 21:16:06 <_av500_> mru: wasnt he elected on twitter? Jul 03 21:16:15 <_av500_> or was it FB likes Jul 03 21:16:22 <_av500_> arab spring 2.0 Jul 03 21:16:44 well, now he's been unfriended Jul 03 21:16:53 <_av500_> blocked and reported Jul 03 21:17:13 and sent to PRISM Jul 03 21:20:55 <_av500_> PRISON Jul 03 21:21:15 _av500_: funny how they sound so similar, eh? Jul 03 21:22:18 PRISMON Jul 03 21:23:24 cameras have a pantoprison Jul 03 21:23:28 err, pentaprism Jul 03 21:23:59 usa all things :) Jul 03 21:24:03 * mranostay ducks Jul 03 21:24:19 abusa Jul 03 21:25:22 KotH: good thing we in the US are always right :P Jul 03 21:25:37 -wing Jul 03 21:26:25 <_av500_> -eous Jul 03 21:27:00 heh Jul 03 21:28:04 mdp, are you here? Jul 03 21:28:43 someone is a-asking for a-bombing :P Jul 03 21:30:25 start with the fed. that would be a good place to start Jul 03 21:30:47 * mru points at guy fawkes Jul 03 21:30:53 that dude was onto something Jul 03 21:31:22 why does that name seem familiar Jul 03 21:31:50 do you remember the 5th of november? Jul 03 21:31:52 m_billybob: remember remember Jul 03 21:32:23 ah ha Jul 03 21:33:09 dont even remember the name of that movie . . .um . . . tip of the tongue . . Jul 03 21:33:26 it wasn't just a movie.. Jul 03 21:33:39 are you sure ? Jul 03 21:33:42 heh Jul 03 21:33:45 vendetta Jul 03 21:34:45 <_av500_> your history teacher is cringing Jul 03 21:35:15 Dumb question, is there a way to adjust the display size to match the screen ( not resolution ), cant seem to get the top and bottom status bars to show. This is out of the box linux distro Jul 03 21:36:19 _av500_: possibly crying too Jul 03 21:38:09 pb__: turn off 'overscan' on your tv Jul 03 21:38:13 if not possible, get proper tv Jul 03 21:38:43 Its a panasonic plasma, not exactly a junker. I'll see if I can find the option Jul 03 21:38:53 av500, British / spanish history is not a huge priority in US schools Jul 03 21:39:10 thank you Jul 03 21:39:13 greek mythology is though Jul 03 21:39:17 ok, PRU virtio serial port works Jul 03 21:39:27 m_billybob: did you learn about panto? Jul 03 21:39:39 lol Jul 03 21:39:41 I'm a myth too Jul 03 21:40:06 mru I'd probably have learned about my own familiay first sicne my family is largly greek Jul 03 21:40:58 which part? Jul 03 21:41:07 the dodgy part Jul 03 21:41:17 greek mythology was actually taught in English classes when i went to school Jul 03 21:41:28 <_av500_> mru: btw, on rpi, you can adjust overscan (or rather underscan) at first boot Jul 03 21:41:31 fathers side panto Jul 03 21:41:45 <_av500_> with rasbian Jul 03 21:41:51 err, I mean which part of the country does he come from? Jul 03 21:42:06 _av500_: compensating for overscan and getting pixel-for-pixel translation is pretty much impossible Jul 03 21:42:32 panto, he was born American, his mother / father were from greece, and I do not remember off hand. Jul 03 21:42:42 especially when the actual display resolution is something like 1366x768 but edid insists it's 1280x720 Jul 03 21:42:47 heh, where are you located? Jul 03 21:42:54 US Jul 03 21:43:14 Arizona spepcifically Jul 03 21:43:19 specifically too Jul 03 21:44:25 <_av500_> mru: I guess they tell X to use less pixels Jul 03 21:44:28 panto, my grandmother used to tel me all that stuff when i was a kid, suppose i should have paid more attention. I was not even interrested in geneology as a kid. Jul 03 21:44:46 <_av500_> mru: and yes, the TV scales Jul 03 21:44:48 doesnt look like it has overscan options. O well. Just need to set it up as a file server either way. Jul 03 21:44:54 <_av500_> but then, they have composite out too Jul 03 21:45:03 <_av500_> pb__: edges of your files will go bad Jul 03 21:45:10 so they don't really have pixels Jul 03 21:45:12 <_av500_> dont write in the margins of your word docs Jul 03 21:45:19 ... Jul 03 21:45:20 <_av500_> mru: they have rpi-xels Jul 03 21:45:25 very helpful :) Jul 03 21:45:31 _av500_: so _that's_ how fermat lost that proof Jul 03 21:45:37 <_av500_> yep Jul 03 21:45:51 pb__ what do you expec for o'beer-tirty ? Jul 03 21:45:54 <_av500_> the monk that copied it had overscan enabled Jul 03 21:46:09 <_av500_> or he was too narrow minded Jul 03 21:46:23 sounds about right for a monk Jul 03 21:46:44 True true m_billybob Jul 03 21:46:59 on a friday no less Jul 03 21:47:09 not a friday for us mru Jul 03 21:47:22 <_av500_> but for US Jul 03 21:47:23 not a friday anywhere on this planet lol Jul 03 21:47:24 we've had friday all day here Jul 03 21:47:30 Has it finally started cooling down in AZ Jul 03 21:47:34 <_av500_> I have friday since monday Jul 03 21:47:35 #beagle is not of this planet Jul 03 21:47:48 lol Jul 03 21:47:56 http://26-26-54.hardwarebug.org/52 Jul 03 21:48:03 yeah just remembered the 4th is tomorrow Jul 03 21:48:06 http://26-26-54.hardwarebug.org/181 Jul 03 21:48:28 a holiday that means less, and less every year now days Jul 03 21:48:59 very true Jul 03 21:49:48 just what we need now days. leader(s) who tell us we need to eat right while scarfing down an icecream cone. Jul 03 21:50:45 I'm more worried about the ones mandating healthcare, yet except themselves, but I don't think this is a political IRC channel so I won't dive to much into it Jul 03 21:51:10 politics isnt meant for discusssion anyhow Jul 03 21:51:19 and yes bck to #beagle Jul 03 21:51:44 back to trying to figure out how to turn off %*&^*&^ overscan Jul 03 21:51:49 http://pastebin.com/k2NxxQ5i Jul 03 21:51:54 I really don't understand how the americans be so angry about getting a little bit of healthcare for free Jul 03 21:52:04 Simple, its not free. Jul 03 21:52:09 exactly Jul 03 21:52:10 here in europe it's _all_ free Jul 03 21:52:13 and its not healthcare either Jul 03 21:52:22 no, its not free there either : ) Jul 03 21:52:25 control of a bitbanged pwm on the PRU using a standard terminal connected to the virtual serial port Jul 03 21:52:26 nobody is forced to see the doctor Jul 03 21:52:30 its anexcuse to suck more taxes off of the populace Jul 03 21:52:34 but _if_ you need one, it's free Jul 03 21:52:40 no, its not free Jul 03 21:52:53 its paid for by the higher tax rates Jul 03 21:53:00 <_av500_> the ppor 1% Jul 03 21:53:03 <_av500_> poor Jul 03 21:53:07 and you have to pay health insurance instead Jul 03 21:53:15 which you can't get if you're actually sick Jul 03 21:53:27 which is lower then the proposed mandated heathcare plans Jul 03 21:53:38 I declare victory and head to bed Jul 03 21:53:43 panto dahm I thought you were going ot show real code ;) Jul 03 21:53:47 which in turn is already increasing our private plans Jul 03 21:53:51 m_billybob, ah ok Jul 03 21:54:10 panto its all good dt overlays is good enough Jul 03 21:54:18 ill hold off the revolt for a while ;) Jul 03 21:54:25 http://pastebin.com/KTC4ik1e Jul 03 21:54:43 it's a bit weird, but then again PRU coding is weird Jul 03 21:55:05 dahm i could make a book out of that Jul 03 21:55:16 worth investigating im sure. Jul 03 21:55:19 the code i mean Jul 03 21:55:54 pb__: ofc it's more expensive: because for once, those people who couldnt afford health care until now, will get it Jul 03 21:55:57 panto, thank you sir, and sleep well Jul 03 21:56:11 * panto looks around to find the sir Jul 03 21:56:20 panto, thank you. Jul 03 21:56:23 -sir Jul 03 21:56:25 pb__: but i guess, that's too social for 'murica Jul 03 21:56:26 +troll Jul 03 21:56:29 night Jul 03 21:56:40 Koth, if you think the people who couldn't afford heath care were not being treated, you have no idea how it was actually working in practice Jul 03 21:56:44 <_av500_> panto: sir means cheese in serbian :) Jul 03 21:56:48 But again, this isnt for this channel : _ Jul 03 21:56:50 <_av500_> its all about tiropita Jul 03 21:56:58 I like cheese Jul 03 21:57:07 * m_billybob loves cheese Jul 03 21:57:21 <_av500_> panto: cheese likes you back Jul 03 21:57:23 panto: will you bring some cheese to elce? Jul 03 21:57:31 panto: i'd trade for chocolate Jul 03 21:57:31 <_av500_> bring the goat Jul 03 21:57:40 <_av500_> or the sheep Jul 03 21:57:54 goats . . . Jul 03 21:57:56 goodnight trolls Jul 03 21:58:00 lol Jul 03 21:58:03 _av500_: either sheep or cow,.. goat isnt my kind of cheese Jul 03 21:58:11 <_av500_> KotH: you can bring a swiss cocoa plant Jul 03 21:58:12 night greek guy! Jul 03 21:58:19 feta is excellent Jul 03 21:58:19 _av500_: i will! Jul 03 21:58:50 although i mucgh prefer a good gouda Jul 03 22:00:45 mru, just a fyi. here in the US for emergencies health services can not be denied by a hospital. Granted then the hospital is forced to pay the expenses out of pocket. so there are two different ways of lookign at it. Jul 03 22:01:13 either way, the government has no business in it IMHO but im only one person Jul 03 22:01:31 what about non-emergencies? Jul 03 22:01:42 Don't forget that the hospitals are already heavily subsized! Jul 03 22:02:06 mru, there is a ton of federal programs already in place for people who were unable to afford health care pre AHCA Jul 03 22:02:54 ah america where firearms are a right and healthcare isn't :) Jul 03 22:03:14 unless you're shot with said firearms Jul 03 22:07:39 * mranostay shoots mru Jul 03 22:07:49 either way its not about care, its about power Jul 03 22:08:06 <_av500_> mranostay: if you was a 3rd grader, you would now be escorted off premises Jul 03 22:08:15 <_av500_> and labeled a terrorist Jul 03 22:08:25 <_av500_> you pointed gun shaped words at somebody Jul 03 22:08:33 poptart guns Jul 03 22:08:35 watch out Jul 03 22:08:47 <_av500_> m_billybob: some care about power Jul 03 22:08:59 we already know how well european health care works atleast I do. I've seen it first hand. Jul 03 22:09:04 <_av500_> it works Jul 03 22:09:06 <_av500_> mostly Jul 03 22:09:10 it's not perfect Jul 03 22:09:17 not in germany at least not while I was living there Jul 03 22:09:18 <_av500_> if my kid breaks an arm, I dont have to shell out $10k Jul 03 22:09:19 nothign is Jul 03 22:09:31 but it mostly works Jul 03 22:09:36 not at once Jul 03 22:09:39 <_av500_> m_billybob: I libe in germany Jul 03 22:09:41 <_av500_> live Jul 03 22:09:52 <_av500_> its not perfect, but pretty OK Jul 03 22:09:52 No such thing as "european health care". Jul 03 22:10:44 Unlike murica, Europe is not a single nation, and the quality of public and private health care varies a lot from nation to nation. Jul 03 22:10:45 even though I've never had to use it, the healthcare system is something I don't mind paying for through taxes Jul 03 22:10:59 <_av500_> +1 Jul 03 22:11:02 +1 Jul 03 22:11:12 <_av500_> mostly, I dont want to worry about it at all Jul 03 22:11:26 I can understadn that Jul 03 22:11:35 and it's not like the taxes are all that much lower in the us anyway Jul 03 22:11:41 if at all Jul 03 22:11:50 <_av500_> I dont want to keep $50k in a bank just in case I need a surgery Jul 03 22:12:05 av, you don't. You have private insurance Jul 03 22:12:05 <_av500_> or decide, college or liver Jul 03 22:12:08 yeah lol and 50k is about right too Jul 03 22:12:09 mru: they nickle and dime better here :) Jul 03 22:12:20 which works much, much better then any public program in the US. Jul 03 22:12:25 i don't mind paying for a base level of care, but I don't want to subsidize bloated end of life care and chronic care for people who choose poor lifestyles Jul 03 22:12:25 <_av500_> yes Jul 03 22:12:26 _av500_: $50k will barely get you a badger's liver Jul 03 22:12:34 friend of mine just had a gal blader removed. 30k USD was the cost for 4 hours with of "work" Jul 03 22:12:43 healthcare pisses me off. a lot of it isn't based on science. a lot of trial and error and unexplainable crap Jul 03 22:12:50 <_av500_> m_billybob: i'd have done it for $15k Jul 03 22:13:07 mastiff: yeah once you starting going down the road who deserves to live... Jul 03 22:13:09 <_av500_> georgem_home: yes, they experiment on us Jul 03 22:13:10 a lot of it isn't effective either Jul 03 22:13:10 georgem_home: that's the same regardless of who pays for it Jul 03 22:13:33 thats why they call most hospitals a " campus" Jul 03 22:13:36 <_av500_> mastiff: simple, kill everybody at age 50 Jul 03 22:13:43 heh Jul 03 22:13:48 * mranostay declares an emergency friday Jul 03 22:13:54 <_av500_> too late Jul 03 22:14:03 <_av500_> its eternal friday Jul 03 22:14:13 mru: yes but in the US we do have lots of people with financial interest in screwing with things to make them even less based on proper science for instance Jul 03 22:14:20 _av500_: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/%C3%84ttestupa Jul 03 22:14:49 procedures and drugs aren't exactly chosen based on patient outcomes Jul 03 22:14:53 criminaly inept comes to mind Jul 03 22:15:21 more to do with keeping you a live to keep charging you, then quality of life Jul 03 22:15:29 yes Jul 03 22:15:31 mru: i suspect taxes in any real state mirror european's Jul 03 22:15:47 what is your yearly tax rate Jul 03 22:15:47 <_av500_> mastiff: yes all maybe true Jul 03 22:15:56 truth of the matter is that the government here already takes enough taxes to cover it themselves. they're just all crinimaly inept when it comes to managing money. and it's not accidental Jul 03 22:15:59 there are only like 5 or 6 :) Jul 03 22:16:03 <_av500_> but still the US pays the most for healtcre for the wirst results Jul 03 22:16:06 <_av500_> worst Jul 03 22:16:10 m_billybob: comletely true Jul 03 22:16:12 maybe 10 if you count ones with major cities :) Jul 03 22:16:56 best thing to do is eat well, exercise, and avoid the medical system as much as possible Jul 03 22:16:57 mastiff: you don't think you paying health insurance helps those on the same group plan that make bad life choices? Jul 03 22:17:19 mastiff, and keep one in the chamber if the pain gets to be too much ;) Jul 03 22:17:34 <_av500_> m_billybob: or the zombies rise Jul 03 22:17:40 :) Jul 03 22:17:45 mastiff: yes good idea if you can manage to Jul 03 22:17:52 crap i forgot to pick up silver bullets Jul 03 22:18:01 or was that werewolves? Jul 03 22:18:16 <_av500_> michael j. fox ones Jul 03 22:18:35 i've seen plenty of zombies already Jul 03 22:18:41 wonder how that guy is doign now days Jul 03 22:19:02 probably not good Jul 03 22:19:20 so just curious, a quick google search guestimates a good chunk of Europeans tax rate slightly lower than 50%. Sound accurate? Jul 03 22:19:27 shaking like 1.21 gigawatts no doubt Jul 03 22:19:35 <_av500_> pb__: depends Jul 03 22:19:56 overall, I pay about 30% in tax Jul 03 22:19:58 <_av500_> with health care and retirement fund, yes Jul 03 22:20:08 mru: thats quite low Jul 03 22:20:12 <_av500_> take home money is about >50% Jul 03 22:20:14 <_av500_> in total Jul 03 22:20:17 ok Jul 03 22:20:19 <_av500_> tax, health, pension Jul 03 22:20:28 do you get refunds at the end of the year? Jul 03 22:20:33 <_av500_> for what? Jul 03 22:20:36 30% is lower than low income earner in the US here Jul 03 22:20:36 need to include sales tax, various fees, licenses, etc Jul 03 22:20:42 overpayed tax cost Jul 03 22:20:45 <_av500_> sure Jul 03 22:20:48 they pay back if they overcharge Jul 03 22:20:51 <_av500_> I hand in the thing to the IRS Jul 03 22:20:51 many hidden taxes Jul 03 22:21:11 what is your sales tax Jul 03 22:21:15 ffuel tax i get Jul 03 22:21:15 <_av500_> 19% Jul 03 22:21:17 at least locally Jul 03 22:21:19 19%? Jul 03 22:21:22 jesus Jul 03 22:21:23 UK has crazy fuel tax Jul 03 22:21:32 fuel tax makes complete sense if its used the way its meant to be used Jul 03 22:21:37 <_av500_> no Jul 03 22:21:37 pb__: where you live? :) Jul 03 22:21:42 uk has no sales tax on some things Jul 03 22:21:44 like food Jul 03 22:21:46 <_av500_> it is meant to make fuel expensive Jul 03 22:21:51 <_av500_> 7% on food Jul 03 22:21:54 <_av500_> and thta it does Jul 03 22:21:56 US, Lived in a few states with varying tax rates Jul 03 22:21:56 0% sales here :) Jul 03 22:21:59 mru: thats like california. its like 9% in Kansas Jul 03 22:22:01 <_av500_> nice Jul 03 22:22:03 for food Jul 03 22:22:04 av500 its meant to keep the roadways in good shape Jul 03 22:22:08 <_av500_> no Jul 03 22:22:12 <_av500_> it is meant to make fuel expensive Jul 03 22:22:18 10% state income though but i'm fine with that Jul 03 22:22:18 thats the justification for the tax Jul 03 22:22:19 <_av500_> which is good Jul 03 22:22:21 there's road tax to for upkeep of roads Jul 03 22:22:36 <_av500_> not here Jul 03 22:22:49 Yea, your taxes are considerably higher then a lot of US states. Jul 03 22:22:58 at least the way its souding Jul 03 22:22:59 <_av500_> dont count taxes Jul 03 22:23:01 So... the difficulty is figuring the total percentage of income tax rate when many of the taxes are taken off the other end Jul 03 22:23:07 <_av500_> count take home money after all expenses Jul 03 22:23:19 <_av500_> its not so easy Jul 03 22:23:35 I'm streaming fm radio off my rtl-sdr on BBB right now over lan to the speakers on my desktop. Jul 03 22:23:35 well, that's 70% then Jul 03 22:23:39 take home is not a good way to look at it Jul 03 22:23:44 whts the price of gas in germany now days ? 10Eruo a liter ? Jul 03 22:23:49 <_av500_> no Jul 03 22:23:50 <_av500_> 1.5 Jul 03 22:23:51 that doenst take in consideration overpayment/underpayment Jul 03 22:23:52 so call it "toy budget" then Jul 03 22:23:54 <_av500_> ish Jul 03 22:23:58 <_av500_> 1.6 maybe Jul 03 22:24:00 <_av500_> I dont know Jul 03 22:24:09 <_av500_> I always top up for a twenty :) Jul 03 22:24:16 used to be considerably higher than in the US seems lower now days Jul 03 22:24:34 m_billybob: yeah... kind of seems that way Jul 03 22:24:35 Billy, your in AZ right Jul 03 22:24:39 no state income tax their right Jul 03 22:24:41 yeah Jul 03 22:24:59 pay taxes for food though Jul 03 22:25:03 its all a smoke screen Jul 03 22:25:10 yes Jul 03 22:25:11 <_av500_> yeah, 1.6€ Jul 03 22:25:11 well yea sales tax Jul 03 22:25:18 and property tax Jul 03 22:25:29 Don't get me started on property tax Jul 03 22:25:30 very high property tax in kansas Jul 03 22:25:36 <_av500_> property tax is low here Jul 03 22:25:41 <_av500_> in germany Jul 03 22:25:43 I'm in TX, property tax is way high Jul 03 22:26:12 funny that too because theres plenty to go aroudn in tx Jul 03 22:26:22 yep Jul 03 22:26:28 figuratively speaking Jul 03 22:26:38 <_av500_> so again, its not so easy Jul 03 22:26:39 I think its how they fund the social programs out of DFW/Austin/Huston/SA Jul 03 22:26:57 compared to CA Jul 03 22:27:01 I think the world is just fucked... Jul 03 22:27:05 lower property taxes, but huge state income tax Jul 03 22:27:11 <_av500_> georgem_home: no Jul 03 22:27:18 in no way proportionally makes up for the higher property tax in TX Jul 03 22:27:19 georgem_home: that's one thing we can all agree on Jul 03 22:27:26 <_av500_> it was always fucked Jul 03 22:27:36 <_av500_> being a peasant in the dark ages was not better Jul 03 22:27:45 being a king then? Jul 03 22:27:47 _av500_: people seem to forget that :) Jul 03 22:27:55 <_av500_> mranostay: the good ole times Jul 03 22:28:02 <_av500_> we had nothing, but that was great Jul 03 22:28:11 _av500_: you remember i bet Jul 03 22:28:12 <_av500_> and you died from a cold Jul 03 22:28:17 lol Jul 03 22:28:35 av500 living conditions are far better so it seems like it *is* better Jul 03 22:28:37 <_av500_> and you died at age 50 Jul 03 22:28:46 <_av500_> so, no need to kill people at that age Jul 03 22:28:47 <_av500_> all taken care off Jul 03 22:28:50 i'm pretty sure it is better Jul 03 22:28:55 <_av500_> just remove all hand sanitzers Jul 03 22:29:05 and a lot less smeller Jul 03 22:29:17 LOL Jul 03 22:29:22 heh Jul 03 22:29:30 Someone just set off a bomb, my wife just jumped 10 feet Jul 03 22:29:30 chamber pots out the window ! Jul 03 22:30:01 georgem, too much coffee ? Jul 03 22:30:25 <_av500_> a prof of mine once told us stories from his past in the country side as a kid, the thing everybody claims was so great Jul 03 22:30:28 <_av500_> he said it was all crap Jul 03 22:30:49 like what for instance ? Jul 03 22:30:49 countryside is and always has been crap Jul 03 22:30:57 <_av500_> fresh bread was put under a lock for a few days Jul 03 22:31:02 _av500_: Was the planet as close to irreversal climate catastrophe then though? Jul 03 22:31:15 <_av500_> because otherwise the maids and stable boys would gobble it all up at once Jul 03 22:31:32 georgem lol . . . more of that eh ? Jul 03 22:31:46 georgem_home: canadians allergic to fireworks? Jul 03 22:31:57 mranostay: yes Jul 03 22:32:05 georgem_home kinda late for a mini ice ages arent we ? Jul 03 22:32:29 <_av500_> its not global warming, its just people leaving their microwave doors open.... Jul 03 22:33:14 im of the camp that thinks we need to go into an ice age for the planet to rejuv its self Jul 03 22:33:39 supposedly thats how it works . . .but yeah im not an expert. Jul 03 22:34:02 <_av500_> on a long scale yes Jul 03 22:34:18 <_av500_> heat death of the universe Jul 03 22:34:23 <_av500_> and it all starts again Jul 03 22:34:49 m_billybob: yes, perhaps an astroid or super volcano can cloud the atmosphere in debris long enough to block the sun and send us there. Jul 03 22:35:01 <_av500_> All Of This Has Happened Before And Will Happen Again Jul 03 22:35:22 _av500_: true, but the human race hasn't survived through it all Jul 03 22:35:33 <_av500_> now you set conditions Jul 03 22:35:41 heh Jul 03 22:35:57 <_av500_> what next, free wifi all the time? Jul 03 22:35:57 I just think now since we have "civilization" the planet wont go into an ice age, unless like you said we have an atmospheric "disturbance" of some type Jul 03 22:36:14 it would take some rather extreme changes to wipe out humans _entirely_ Jul 03 22:36:30 mru: yes we do seem to be quite cochroach like Jul 03 22:36:45 lol Jul 03 22:36:45 <_av500_> georgem_home: by what past experience? Jul 03 22:36:48 indeed. Jul 03 22:37:03 if some parts of the world become uninhabitable, others might become more habitable at the same time Jul 03 22:37:07 <_av500_> we did not have a catastrophic event on a global scale yet Jul 03 22:37:11 we're adaptable to a wide variety of climates Jul 03 22:37:17 <_av500_> we are Jul 03 22:37:34 like cochroaches. and they've been around for millions of years. maybe there is hope! Jul 03 22:37:37 I'm not saying we should not be concerned about what might be happening Jul 03 22:37:43 my friday meter is reading an eleven Jul 03 22:37:44 but I don't fear for the human race Jul 03 22:38:03 <_av500_> mru: I dont fear either Jul 03 22:38:03 mru: me either, robots will kill us anyways :P Jul 03 22:38:08 hi folks Jul 03 22:38:13 <_av500_> kblin: hi Jul 03 22:38:15 hola Jul 03 22:38:38 I've written a small webapp/node thing that uses bonescript to drive some electronics from my beaglebone Jul 03 22:38:50 <_av500_> does it use samba? Jul 03 22:38:53 fun fun Jul 03 22:38:56 mru: not like we'd run out of people anytime soon Jul 03 22:38:59 <_av500_> alsom ontopic! Jul 03 22:39:02 what is the easiest way to make sure node runs on startup? Jul 03 22:39:08 <_av500_> jkridner: ^^^ Jul 03 22:39:13 <_av500_> kblin: systemd module? Jul 03 22:39:17 systemd unit! Jul 03 22:39:21 <_av500_> unit Jul 03 22:39:22 hm, ok Jul 03 22:39:24 opkg remove node Jul 03 22:39:29 <_av500_> +100 Jul 03 22:39:29 never used that before Jul 03 22:39:32 init.d if using debian / ubuntu Jul 03 22:39:40 <_av500_> kblin: its the new hot shitz Jul 03 22:39:47 no, it's the default angstrom image Jul 03 22:39:52 * mru just puts a respawn entry in inittab Jul 03 22:40:08 <_av500_> respawn systemd? Jul 03 22:40:26 no, that's just spawn Jul 03 22:40:28 of satan Jul 03 22:40:32 <_av500_> spam Jul 03 22:40:37 does systemmd work like init.d in that you can load a "service" at various stages ? Jul 03 22:40:43 <_av500_> yes Jul 03 22:40:47 nice. Jul 03 22:40:52 <_av500_> they depend on each othr Jul 03 22:41:00 work is pushing it Jul 03 22:41:20 * _av500_ needs a sleep unit Jul 03 22:41:32 <_av500_> init z Jul 03 22:41:37 * m_billybob needs a work unti Jul 03 22:41:37 * mru sends _av500_ to a capsule hotel Jul 03 22:41:47 mru: there are a lot of problems that other init systems don't address. For instance private /tmp and per unit selinux rules Jul 03 22:42:00 wtf does that have to do with init? Jul 03 22:42:10 * m_billybob cringes at the mention of SELinux Jul 03 22:42:14 why would you NEED private /tmp? Jul 03 22:42:16 how does the cloud9 thing that runs the demo stuff start up? I can't find any entry for that in /etc/systemd/ Jul 03 22:42:21 kfoltman: +1 Jul 03 22:43:05 * georgem_home facepalms Jul 03 22:43:18 systemd/system/multi-user.target.wants/ Jul 03 22:43:20 ah Jul 03 22:44:33 <_av500_> see, easy :) Jul 03 22:45:40 and how do I start a systemd service? Jul 03 22:45:48 systemctl start service Jul 03 22:47:28 someone could probably make alittle bit of money writting an Angstrom system usage book Jul 03 22:48:07 hm, refuses to start up... Jul 03 22:48:30 you already have port 80 in use ? Jul 03 22:48:39 m_billybob: beer tabs for a few weekends money? :P Jul 03 22:50:08 mru, kfoltman: looks like lennarts site is down (haha systemd killed it right) but check out this link. http://webcache.googleusercontent.com/search?q=cache:http://0pointer.de/blog/projects/security.html Jul 03 22:50:36 m_billybob: I listen on 8888 Jul 03 22:51:01 mranostay, idk all i know is that because of my years of debian experience, and the Fact that Angstrom us not what I would consider as "standard" Linux. Coupled with the fact that some thigns seem difficult to learn quickly . . . yeah Im stayign with Debian. Jul 03 22:51:01 georgem_home: not clicking that Jul 03 22:51:03 but apparently my node service doesn't like to be started from outside its directory Jul 03 22:51:19 mru: thats fine I expected as much :P Jul 03 22:52:05 yay more dumb questions from me Jul 03 22:52:10 lennart says the way I want _my_ system to work is invalid and other bullshit Jul 03 22:52:17 georgem_home: sounds like solution looking for a problem, at least on BBB Jul 03 22:52:19 are they allowed :) Jul 03 22:52:20 so there's no reason to read is nonsense Jul 03 22:52:23 *his Jul 03 22:52:34 kfoltman: that's lennart in a nutshell Jul 03 22:52:55 if you're using bbb for hobbist stuff thats probably true Jul 03 22:52:58 mru: not quite, pulseaudio was trying to solve a real-world problem Jul 03 22:53:06 and failed pathetically Jul 03 22:53:11 hm, no, that's not it Jul 03 22:53:16 I have updated my beaglebone black with latest image using SD card but now my board is not booting and when i press boot button then LED is not turning On. Looks like my board is bricked . Can anyone suggest me what wrong with the board Jul 03 22:53:21 grrr Jul 03 22:53:32 I'm getting 'no such file or directory' Jul 03 22:53:42 georgem: if you're trying to use it for non-hobbyist stuff, chances are you want to minimize the number of unnecessary complicated components, too Jul 03 22:53:45 it'd be nice if I was told which frigging file or directory Jul 03 22:53:54 Guest1795 what does the serial debug output have to say ? Jul 03 22:53:55 kfoltman: +1 Jul 03 22:54:20 mru: well, I think pulseaudio would fare much better if it wasn't doomed by being built on ALSA Jul 03 22:54:46 if it weren't for alsa crap, it wouldn't have been "necessary" in the first place Jul 03 22:55:02 note that my systems have never had pulseaudio installed Jul 03 22:55:02 mru: right Jul 03 22:55:06 and they work just fine Jul 03 22:55:14 it's not needed for some scenarios Jul 03 22:55:26 it's not needed for _any_ that I ever encounter Jul 03 22:55:51 But if you have multiple applications trying to output sound at different sample rates at the same time, some mixing infrastructure is nice to have. Jul 03 22:56:33 Well, M$ got it right. Pulseaudio, not so much. Jul 03 22:56:44 But M$ didn't consider it a good idea to break APIs left and right in the process. Jul 03 22:57:07 kfoltman: there are people that take that approach. I've dealt with pretty complex control systems that are restricted from using routable protocols Jul 03 22:57:16 I have updated my beaglebone black with latest image using SD card but now my board is not booting and when i press boot button then LED is not turning On. Looks like my board is bricked . Can anyone suggest me what wrong with the board Jul 03 22:57:48 Do you have a console cable? Jul 03 22:58:08 serial console, that is Jul 03 22:58:47 georgem: that's still in the obscure category, I think Jul 03 22:59:47 ok, seems like my unit file isn't picked up Jul 03 22:59:53 is there some extra magic for that? Jul 03 23:00:15 kblin: you just created it? what does it say? Jul 03 23:02:17 georgem_home: I basically did "cp bonescript-autostart.service my-autostart.service" and fixed the paths Jul 03 23:02:47 into which path? /lib/systemd/system? Jul 03 23:02:58 ARRRRRRRG FTDI Jul 03 23:03:08 FTDI all things! Jul 03 23:03:14 heh Jul 03 23:03:40 damn driver b ug Jul 03 23:03:41 FTDI seems to be one of the better USB-to-Serial IC vendors to be honest Jul 03 23:03:41 bug Jul 03 23:04:29 when the driver lies to you, I don't care what the chip is doing Jul 03 23:04:34 georgem_home: /etc/systemd/system/multi-user.target.wants Jul 03 23:04:48 that's where I found the bonescript-autostart.service Jul 03 23:05:10 but yes, apparently those are links Jul 03 23:05:12 can you pastebin the file? Jul 03 23:06:37 moving the file to /lib/systemd/system fixed it Jul 03 23:06:45 oh ok Jul 03 23:06:50 silly me for expecting configuration to live in /etc Jul 03 23:06:52 dumb newbie question. Trying to flash new angstom, boots up to a text login screen....good or bad Jul 03 23:07:02 kblin: actually that should still work... Jul 03 23:07:20 georgem_home: oh well. as long as it works now :) Jul 03 23:07:31 pb__: text login screen == epic win Jul 03 23:10:31 mru: I'm curious... what linux distro do you run on your workstation? Or do you roll your own? Jul 03 23:12:30 ok, and now it also starts up automatically when the system boots Jul 03 23:12:33 awesome :) Jul 03 23:12:51 see... systemd is awesome! Jul 03 23:14:28 * georgem_home chuckles Jul 03 23:16:10 I suppose I should do patches Jul 03 23:16:58 well, apart from taking almost as long to get a server to start up as it did to program nodejs to run my stage prop Jul 03 23:17:25 whereas I was expecting to just add a "node /path/to/index.js" to /etc/rc.local Jul 03 23:17:51 heh Jul 03 23:18:08 that is some badass rock star tech there Jul 03 23:18:38 mranostay: yeah, systemd is clearly web scale Jul 03 23:19:05 but I already used that to make fun of bind10 in my last samba talk :) Jul 03 23:20:05 systemd solves some problems I' Jul 03 23:20:09 Doh Jul 03 23:22:04 * m_billybob is just too hard core Debian to like anything else. Jul 03 23:22:13 systemd solves some problems I've been wrestling with in production embedded systems in high security environments for years, it may seem like rock star tech but there is some real utility there. Jul 03 23:23:29 example Jul 03 23:23:31 ? Jul 03 23:24:20 m_billybob: services with securit exploits involving /tmp Jul 03 23:24:50 m_billybob: parallel boot for starter startup, less downtime Jul 03 23:24:56 faster* Jul 03 23:25:50 m_billybob: cgroup resource restriction, eg limit certain unit to fix amount of RAM so if it is comprimised it doesn't take down the entire system Jul 03 23:26:30 paralell boot ? Jul 03 23:26:40 read: RAID ? Jul 03 23:27:10 no, services starting in parallel Jul 03 23:28:51 guess i personally dont have much use for any / most of that Jul 03 23:29:04 most people probably dont Jul 03 23:29:27 The rest can use busybox init Jul 03 23:29:28 for boot time . . .i boot NFS, but production ... yeah that most likely would not work Jul 03 23:29:51 you could but there wouldnt be much use Jul 03 23:30:12 or much point rather Jul 03 23:30:22 moin moin Jul 03 23:30:34 if you absolutely NEED parallel stuff like that, your boot process is broken Jul 03 23:31:04 dont think he said absolutely *needed* Jul 03 23:31:05 m_billybob have you tried windows 8? Jul 03 23:31:19 think he meant to help speed up boot times Jul 03 23:31:27 windows 8 for what Jul 03 23:31:33 short answer no. Jul 03 23:31:43 ds2: because starting X and apache simultaneously is broken? Jul 03 23:31:48 i havent touched win8 at all Jul 03 23:32:09 Texicans: http://atechnologyjobisnoexcuse.com/2013/07/found-while-the-lady-was-gardening/ Jul 03 23:32:09 no, needing them to do that is Jul 03 23:32:44 wonder if it still shot haha Jul 03 23:33:42 emocakes curious as to why you ask though Jul 03 23:34:19 as far as "Win8" goes, id be more interrested in RT id think Jul 03 23:34:47 Crofton|work: was a nice 1911 Jul 03 23:34:50 *was* Jul 03 23:35:04 M1911a1 ? Jul 03 23:35:08 1911? like the gun? Jul 03 23:35:10 * m_billybob didnt look Jul 03 23:35:21 yes Jul 03 23:35:27 cool Jul 03 23:35:29 thats an interesting cut in the top of the slide if its a 1911. Jul 03 23:35:36 looks like a funky 22lr kit was on it Jul 03 23:36:23 pb__: could be Jul 03 23:36:27 missing the clip eject button too Jul 03 23:36:38 mag not clip Jul 03 23:36:55 pendantic ;) Jul 03 23:37:05 I am no a clip Jul 03 23:37:13 heh Jul 03 23:37:15 heh Jul 03 23:37:55 45 ACP is a pretty terrible munition though Jul 03 23:38:02 looks more like a star B to be honest Jul 03 23:38:13 you know the story behind the M1911 ? Jul 03 23:38:27 why the US military initially used them ? Jul 03 23:38:35 I've heard parts of it. Jul 03 23:38:39 :\ muricans Jul 03 23:38:45 talking bout guns and liberty Jul 03 23:38:46 the 38 didnt put down the injuns! Jul 03 23:39:00 Philippines Jul 03 23:39:02 for putting big burly guys down in one shot ;) Jul 03 23:39:21 by 38 you mean 9mm luger? Jul 03 23:39:27 no Jul 03 23:39:42 I thought they tested it vs the luger at one point Jul 03 23:39:57 Filipino's were getting drugged up and charging US military personnel and .38 wouldn't put them down (they didn't feel pain) Jul 03 23:39:57 they did Jul 03 23:40:00 was what I heard Jul 03 23:40:09 that was during the trials when they were switching Jul 03 23:40:11 but the .45 did put them down Jul 03 23:40:13 and again after wwii Jul 03 23:40:46 Story i heard while in the military was "Samoens" but yeah same basic story Jul 03 23:40:48 i heard ~1910-1911 hence when it was designed Jul 03 23:40:53 Samoans ? Jul 03 23:40:56 * m_billybob shrugs Jul 03 23:41:09 * mag goes back to work Jul 03 23:46:42 If you compare 45 ACP 230 gr US Army Ball FMJ = 477 J to 9mm 115 gr FMJ = 570 J, 9mm has the energy advantage. Eventually the Army switched to 9mm after like 60 years... Jul 03 23:47:52 only problem with eh .45 ACP is that it wasnt terribly accurate passed 30 or so meters Jul 03 23:48:00 true story Jul 03 23:48:25 good for 60 gunners without baonets though ! Jul 03 23:48:39 Oh no, caliber debates Jul 03 23:48:54 which is funny because 1911s now are target shooting pistols Jul 03 23:49:27 the way they are designed you can really milk accuracy out of them Jul 03 23:49:28 kited up no doubt Jul 03 23:49:37 if you arent talking about mass machined military units Jul 03 23:49:53 you talk fitted barrel bushings Jul 03 23:49:59 hand cut locking lugs Jul 03 23:50:05 tight frame rails Jul 03 23:50:12 that aint granddads 1911 Jul 03 23:50:14 pb__: it might be easy to milk accuracy out of a 9mm? Jul 03 23:50:35 in a 1911 forum Jul 03 23:50:36 ye Jul 03 23:50:47 or some of the specific 9mm variants Jul 03 23:51:39 Anyway... I'm cheap so the only gun I have is an MN1891/30 Jul 03 23:51:53 #beagle-guns Jul 03 23:51:54 plz Jul 03 23:52:10 only handgun ive personally own was a glock 19. if i had to do it all over again id probably pick the same gun. Jul 03 23:52:11 i have two guns, left arm and right arm Jul 03 23:52:12 ;) Jul 03 23:52:31 I stil need to get a MN Jul 03 23:52:43 sick of my girlfriend going through all my 45/70 and not hitting anything Jul 03 23:53:14 teach her how to shoot lol Jul 03 23:53:14 I'm old fashioned and european, I just have a sword :) Jul 03 23:53:22 <- carries a knife Jul 03 23:53:23 hehehe Jul 03 23:53:38 emocakes: I apologize but its not like anything else was being discussed. Jul 03 23:53:38 she doesn't listen to me Jul 03 23:53:52 this is wrong! Jul 03 23:53:54 guns are bad Jul 03 23:53:56 I keep meaning to get her in with an instructor friend of mine. I built her a new AR and everything. Jul 03 23:53:57 they kill children Jul 03 23:54:05 pb__: tell her she has to pay for every shot that misses. Jul 03 23:54:06 gun dont kill people . . . Jul 03 23:54:10 bullets do. Jul 03 23:54:23 guns kill Jul 03 23:54:33 hold on Jul 03 23:54:35 knives kill too Jul 03 23:54:35 if thrown hard enough ;) Jul 03 23:54:40 bricks . . . Jul 03 23:54:41 I need to check if the guns in my safe have killed anyone today Jul 03 23:54:43 brb Jul 03 23:54:47 death tend to kill people as well. Jul 03 23:54:51 if I'm no back in 10 minutes, they attacked me Jul 03 23:54:57 emocakes: I have an MN1891/30... You could literally waltz up to someone holding this gun and poke their eyes out before they'd have a prayer of shooting you. Jul 03 23:55:17 i still disagree, doesnt anyone remember waco? Jul 03 23:55:25 and georgetown? Jul 03 23:55:26 yes. Jul 03 23:55:33 Oh you mean where people killed people? Jul 03 23:55:48 ahem bullets . . . Jul 03 23:55:54 lead poisoning. Jul 03 23:55:57 Let's not remember the reason the founding fathers of america allowed for gun's was to overthrow a corrupt government... Jul 03 23:56:05 emocakes, how about jonestown ? Jul 03 23:56:15 jmoyerman: not convinced they're used for that anymore Jul 03 23:56:19 grape coollaid kills too. Jul 03 23:56:22 I bet the people in Libya wish they had more guns :) Jul 03 23:56:23 and jonestown m_billybob! Jul 03 23:56:37 georgem_home im sure the US will send them some more guns Jul 03 23:56:42 to help spread democracy of course Jul 03 23:56:47 uhh oh, now we're getting into politics Jul 03 23:56:48 the same as is happening in syria Jul 03 23:57:20 guns shouldnt be allowed Jul 03 23:57:22 emocakes: Why do we always need to help out, can't someone else fix it before we have a chance to F it up :) Jul 03 23:57:25 if you want to kill something, use a knife Jul 03 23:57:26 or a rock Jul 03 23:57:36 heaps more respect if you kill a deer with a rock Jul 03 23:57:45 I killed one with an arrow Jul 03 23:57:50 do I get "respect" now Jul 03 23:57:52 respect pb Jul 03 23:57:53 yes Jul 03 23:58:07 it wasnt any harder then killing it with a gun Jul 03 23:58:08 just an fyi Jul 03 23:58:39 pb__: but you got to prance around in the forest with a bow, wearing tights, and sing ;) Jul 03 23:59:04 shhhhh don't tell anyone. Jul 03 23:59:18 mmmhmm Jul 03 23:59:23 or isn't that how it works? all these robin hood movies have me confused Jul 03 23:59:28 pb__: did you rob the rich and give to the poor? Jul 03 23:59:30 I've never killed probably anything, yet I hold the ideal that should my government turn tyranical (which given recent Snowden happenings is very possible) that I should be able to rebel against it. Jul 03 23:59:40 did the arrow have a armor piercing tip like in rambo on it pb__ Jul 03 23:59:40 ? Jul 03 23:59:45 that would be cool Jul 03 23:59:49 no Jul 03 23:59:55 it was a big nasty looking SOB though Jul 04 00:00:10 georgem_home: I'll believe that when I see it happening :) Jul 04 00:00:13 I don't bow hunt normally, was a buddies set up so no idea what kind it was Jul 04 00:00:27 Thanks to georgem_home, the NSA is now recording and wiretapping all of our houses.. Jul 04 00:00:34 heh Jul 04 00:00:44 the NSA is already doing it to me, I'm not an citizen of the us a Jul 04 00:00:46 jmoyerman: unlike ten minutes ago Jul 04 00:00:50 i have no rights according to them Jul 04 00:00:50 don't worry they were doing that anyway Jul 04 00:01:10 can do it here Jul 04 00:01:12 im just glad that the NSA is doing all this to protect me from nigerian scammers Jul 04 00:01:18 no landlines an no grid power Jul 04 00:01:20 and scammers on craigslist Jul 04 00:01:33 and 6 dogs to get passed to get on the proerty Jul 04 00:03:04 nothing to worry about anyhow Jul 04 00:03:49 having a 6kW solar array and 2200aH battery storage has it's pluses :) Jul 04 00:04:05 nice Jul 04 00:04:28 The only solar we have is on our patio set umbrella.... Jul 04 00:04:30 and cheaper than paying the utilities company 50k + to run lines out here too Jul 04 00:04:50 m_billybob: do you feed back to the grid Jul 04 00:05:03 cant no grid here period. Jul 04 00:05:15 cloest powr pole is 1/4 down the road Jul 04 00:05:17 m_billybob: Where are you? Jul 04 00:05:21 That's a lot of cost to run cabling. Jul 04 00:05:23 arizona. Jul 04 00:05:27 Ah. Jul 04 00:05:36 I guess dull winter days aren't much of an issue Jul 04 00:05:46 Or snow. Jul 04 00:05:48 or dull summer days Jul 04 00:06:03 arizona at about 5800ft above sea level, so yeah we get decent sun, and good wind too Jul 04 00:06:13 today the 50kW grid at my university managed to get ~8kW Jul 04 00:06:15 Just drop a 18 ga cable to your neighbor Jul 04 00:06:16 I did the numbers for here. Jul 04 00:06:22 quick question, utility for wiping an SD cards partitions for windows. I remember there used to be some HP one\ Jul 04 00:06:23 To run a 2.5W load 24*7. Jul 04 00:06:30 I need a 250W solar panel. Jul 04 00:06:35 (Scotland) Jul 04 00:06:50 pb__ i know if it but cant remember the name offhand Jul 04 00:06:54 And that'll likely drop out 2-3 days a year - even neglecting snow. Jul 04 00:07:01 pb__ disk management would do it though Jul 04 00:07:04 ok Jul 04 00:07:06 pb__: just reformat it? Jul 04 00:07:13 reformating doesnt work Jul 04 00:07:14 SpeedEvil: wind would be an option, I guess? Jul 04 00:07:17 partition size stays the same Jul 04 00:07:29 kblin: Not really Jul 04 00:07:32 ooh... partitioning... there's a partition utility built into win7 i think Jul 04 00:07:36 pb__ oh you want ti completel wiped ? got a windows 95 / 98 cd ? Jul 04 00:07:45 better idea: install linux Jul 04 00:07:54 self promotional link: http://www.novatechweb.com/utility/ Jul 04 00:07:57 kblin: Some places just basically suck for small scale renewable Jul 04 00:08:25 windwos 95 fdisk will completely wipe any partition. Jul 04 00:08:50 I might have a disk somewhere Jul 04 00:09:08 I cleaned my office today and I found a couple. Ewwwwwwwwwwww Jul 04 00:09:09 you worried about possible exploits ? Jul 04 00:11:09 ever have those days where you're just sick of being infront of a computer, but it's raining too hard to go outside? Jul 04 00:11:24 We would love some rain right now Jul 04 00:11:27 pb__: the "manage computer" menu should have a partition tool Jul 04 00:11:31 our aquifier is at like 5% Jul 04 00:11:45 anyway, zZzZ time Jul 04 00:12:16 pb__: Florida always has rain Jul 04 00:12:22 heh Jul 04 00:12:37 yea but in florida I cant go buy skittles and tea. Jul 04 00:12:43 skittles? Jul 04 00:12:45 and if not you can swim in the air there Jul 04 00:12:46 like the candy Jul 04 00:12:52 heh Jul 04 00:13:11 never mind lol Jul 04 00:13:16 I think we scared all the Europeans away (or they fell asleep) Jul 04 00:13:24 'merica Jul 04 00:13:52 one of my favorite moments in florida was sittign in a hotel pool on a floating matress drinking a beer, while it was raining Jul 04 00:14:11 quite plesant Jul 04 00:14:15 sounds like what we did in WV Jul 04 00:14:21 pb__: savin the m'r f'in day yeah Jul 04 00:14:22 cept it was on the green river Jul 04 00:15:36 heh i was in PC ( Panama City ) during spring break sittign right on the coast watching two water spouts circlign one another off shore Jul 04 00:15:37 funny story... I had never been to Florida until I married a Canadian. Her family goes there every year :) Jul 04 00:15:56 georgem_home: sigh, one of those people :) Jul 04 00:15:57 It's a great place... although pouring right now. Jul 04 00:16:25 I been to florida once Jul 04 00:16:29 was to much for me Jul 04 00:17:13 Florida is kind of a white trash extravaganza. With all due respect of course... Jul 04 00:17:34 I lived in WV....I'm sure florida had nothing on wv. Jul 04 00:17:47 yeah... that could be true Jul 04 00:17:52 georgem depends on where Jul 04 00:17:54 georgem_home: and you live where? Vegas? Jul 04 00:18:08 jmoyerman vegas is worse lol Jul 04 00:18:18 waaaay worse. Jul 04 00:18:20 SpeedEvil, you only need a 20W panel making power for 4hrs per day on average to run a 2.5W device 24/7 Jul 04 00:18:23 jmoyerman: Kansas, center of 'Merica Jul 04 00:18:38 Heartland of 'Merica Jul 04 00:18:42 mastiff: Yes, I know. Jul 04 00:18:59 mastiff: There are typically 0 hours of sun for several weeks. Jul 04 00:19:02 georgem_home: got a few friends out that way. quite nice Jul 04 00:19:12 personally i prefer the left coast, but beach wise florida is hard to beat Jul 04 00:19:30 mastiff: It's what gets through the clouds - which is often 10% of nominal power. Jul 04 00:19:37 I grew up in northern CA Jul 04 00:19:43 I can't stand the people out there anymore Jul 04 00:19:47 Sonoma here. Jul 04 00:19:53 Hah, Healdsburg for me Jul 04 00:19:59 peace folks. Jul 04 00:20:00 not far away Jul 04 00:20:01 mastiff: Also - charge/discharge inefficiency. This was based of real solar measurements every 10 mins. Jul 04 00:20:07 not at all Jul 04 00:20:20 thats up the russian river ? i forget Jul 04 00:20:26 yep Jul 04 00:20:32 I see, sounds like lousy conditions for solar. Jul 04 00:21:12 we get 100+ A when its overcast here Jul 04 00:21:22 plenty to keep the batteries up and charged Jul 04 00:21:41 over long periods, it wouldnt be good enough though Jul 04 00:21:55 ( read: months ) Jul 04 00:22:11 last week I welded up some stainless solar tracker frames Jul 04 00:22:21 In Kansas, wind is the best option Jul 04 00:22:27 they fit 60W panels Jul 04 00:22:36 how do they work ? Jul 04 00:22:40 good ? Jul 04 00:22:48 manual rotation tilt and locking Jul 04 00:22:57 why not aluminum ? Jul 04 00:23:20 i used a well-tested design for sailboats Jul 04 00:23:20 hmm on the ocean i guess you'd have to paint it Jul 04 00:24:34 stainless is better for marine and easy to stick weld Jul 04 00:24:49 we use aluminum or steel brackets here ( steel for solar water pumps ) but we dont have salt water to contend with Jul 04 00:26:01 our two solar wells give us around 4 gallons / minute from 500 feet down Jul 04 00:26:10 ocean messes up everything. need to conformal coat boards Jul 04 00:26:15 really cool but not cheap either Jul 04 00:26:45 and only realy useful for the garden Jul 04 00:26:58 solar wells are nice for self-sufficiency Jul 04 00:27:09 thatswhat we're aiming for Jul 04 00:27:17 nice Jul 04 00:27:34 not really preppers but self sufficient as possible Jul 04 00:27:44 this is what my solar trackers look like http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l9CsCOYQlSQ Jul 04 00:28:19 cool Jul 04 00:28:22 seen it already Jul 04 00:28:36 * SpeedEvil wishes trackers had a point. Jul 04 00:28:46 thats . . .here would fold over in 5 minutes lol Jul 04 00:28:47 They don't help much for overcast :) Jul 04 00:28:59 they help the most for over cast Jul 04 00:29:08 they are good for limited space Jul 04 00:29:13 Thats why we don't do solar in Kansas. Wind is the way... Jul 04 00:29:20 put the panels on drones Jul 04 00:29:33 mru: thought we lost you! Jul 04 00:30:27 SpeedEvil, problem is solar is only about 30% efficient from the panels, ~50% efficient from the controller( of that 30% ) so . . . you basicaly have to over do your solar array to get good consisant power Jul 04 00:30:45 More like 17% Jul 04 00:31:08 mru: j/k. I appreciate your point of view. Not to mention your resilience... what time is it there anyway? Jul 04 00:31:20 The controller should be 95% or better, with sane stuff - but batteries may eat 30%++ Jul 04 00:31:39 PWM controllers at most are 60% efficient Jul 04 00:31:53 on a cool day ( 25C ) Jul 04 00:32:01 batter SoC matters too Jul 04 00:32:06 battery* Jul 04 00:32:22 Right so if you're relying on solar it can payoff more to reduce power consumption than buying solar capacity Jul 04 00:32:37 Hrm... GMT 0032 Jul 04 00:32:42 mppt can be as much as 75% efficient Jul 04 00:33:23 mastiff thats hard to do when you'reused to a certain way of living though Jul 04 00:33:53 mastiff: thats because it's inefficient Jul 04 00:33:55 we dont use much power technicaly but we do run a couple laptops a jetpump for pressurizing the water tank and a freezer Jul 04 00:34:01 switching to all led navigation and interior lights reduced my boat power requirements a lot Jul 04 00:34:14 lights of course microwave oven etc etc Jul 04 00:34:28 sure it did Jul 04 00:35:06 yeah, for houses I like geothermal because heating and cooling are the biggest energy uses by far for a home Jul 04 00:35:25 yes, true Jul 04 00:35:36 and wives Jul 04 00:36:30 best way to go 100% RE would be having a stream with enough head to go hydro Jul 04 00:36:51 you can dump ac off a good hydro generator Jul 04 00:37:09 forgt about batteries and power conversion et al Jul 04 00:37:25 Three phase ftw Jul 04 00:38:56 m_billybob: Err - no - good switchmode converters can exceed 95% on a good day. Jul 04 00:39:19 There is a tradeoff on how much you're willing to spend on them. Jul 04 00:39:24 SpeedEvil considering perfect condidtions maybe Jul 04 00:39:30 heat is the killer Jul 04 00:39:34 as is cold Jul 04 00:39:42 but cold is less of a killer Jul 04 00:39:48 m_billybob: Good MPPT designs will hit >95% under practically any conditions. Jul 04 00:40:11 * SpeedEvil needs to get his MPPT built. Jul 04 00:40:48 depends on how much you sink into it at which point you might be asking yourself "why" when you can buy a panel or two cheaper Jul 04 00:41:04 we get good deals on panels here though Jul 04 00:41:17 we hve a surplus store close enough to drive to Jul 04 00:41:41 It's not especially expensive - it can actually be cheaper to do high efficiency designed well - as no heatskinking and fewer parts to dissipate heat. Jul 04 00:41:41 well more of a warehouse Jul 04 00:41:50 $/W? Jul 04 00:42:20 I don't think solar is practical at my latitude (N 39) Jul 04 00:42:21 i forget 3what we paid for the las batch, but roughly $4400 for 24 200W panels Jul 04 00:42:38 That's not terrible. Jul 04 00:42:53 for the time we bought them it was a really good price Jul 04 00:43:08 they were purchased last year Jul 04 00:44:28 georgem_home: Do you mean 39 degrees from the pole - or 39 degrees from the equator? Jul 04 00:44:43 If the latter - which would be normal - certainly! Jul 04 00:44:56 SpeedEvil, also ive been thinking in terms of low voltage e.g. 12, 24, or 48 nominal. if you string many in series . . . say 300v then yeah thats the way to go Jul 04 00:45:34 string converters is something else im am interrested in from a techical standpoint but not realy ideal for our situation here Jul 04 00:45:47 we would end up converting twice Jul 04 00:46:08 http://re.jrc.ec.europa.eu/pvgis/apps4/pvest.php - a nice estimator - for europe Jul 04 00:46:11 And africa Jul 04 00:46:39 Converting twice may be significantly easier in some ways. Jul 04 00:46:50 It vastly simplifies your converters. Jul 04 00:46:55 whats this ? estimator for potential power output ? Jul 04 00:47:23 yes - you feed it a lat/lon, and it looks up a weather database, and gives you kWh/year per kW peak of panels. Jul 04 00:47:49 or arrays are capable of around idk 5800W but we rarely see more than 2kW at any one time Jul 04 00:48:09 I have been planning a small 24V system - with each panel on a mppt to the battery, with a shunt to dump power to prevent overcharge. Jul 04 00:48:24 those 24 we put up this year sit flat on the roof, and the smaler arrays sit closer to winter maximum Jul 04 00:48:50 so we *hope* to get good coverage al year around Jul 04 00:49:00 we'll see what winter brings this year Jul 04 00:49:27 guys switchers are bad for the BB right ? Jul 04 00:49:32 power supplies . . . Jul 04 00:49:40 No, just fine. Jul 04 00:49:51 This is what ive been seeing Gerald say on the google groups Jul 04 00:49:56 Most power supplies that are suitable are switching PSUs Jul 04 00:50:04 * SpeedEvil sighs. Jul 04 00:50:16 ok explain ? Jul 04 00:50:20 You will find it really hard to source a 5V 1A or so linear PSU. Jul 04 00:50:21 plese. Jul 04 00:50:31 i get that Jul 04 00:50:40 Tehre is basically no point whatsoever - the BBB does not require an especially low noise power supply. Jul 04 00:51:10 So why have i been seeing otherwise on the groups ? no doubting just tryng ot understand Jul 04 00:51:22 i guess because of especially bad supplies ? Jul 04 00:52:07 There are some very, very bad chinese dangerous chargers out there. Jul 04 00:52:39 we actually use a 1A supply here not sure if its switch mode or not( not my bbb ) whatever it is, it seems pretty solid Jul 04 00:52:49 ah ok yeah that was my assumption lol Jul 04 00:52:59 pb__ got that ? Jul 04 00:53:00 Basic rules of thumb. Never buy 'USB chargers' from ebay, or any other small vendor. Buy them only from first world actual legitimate vendors that have brand names. Jul 04 00:53:19 And don't expect to pay $2. Jul 04 00:53:25 is there a list of known good supplies ? Jul 04 00:53:38 got it Jul 04 00:53:55 Where are you? Jul 04 00:54:14 US, but our power system has line noise already Jul 04 00:54:17 if that matters Jul 04 00:54:44 grr ubuntu distro is still booting to a text login Jul 04 00:55:05 pb__ put lxde on it Jul 04 00:55:19 df -h / says what ? Jul 04 00:55:36 got a link for it Jul 04 00:55:41 im uessing its probably a bare minimum install Jul 04 00:56:06 as long as it has a basic gui and networking its all I need Jul 04 00:56:26 http://www.digikey.com/product-detail/en/PSA05F-050Q/993-1068-ND/2384534 - for example Jul 04 00:57:15 aptitude update && aptitude install lxde *may* handle it all but Robert C Nelson has a script for installing lxde on debian / ubuntu already Jul 04 00:57:32 pb__ not sure why you'd want to crap up a file server with a UI though Jul 04 00:57:42 SpeedEvil thanks will have a look see Jul 04 00:57:45 because I'm a dumby and I like pretty colors. Jul 04 00:59:00 SpeedEvil ah heheh id probably spend more for something even better :) Jul 04 00:59:09 thats a really good price though Jul 04 00:59:58 In general, digikey will check that it's actually legit - and not stamped out as a clone with no attention to safety. Jul 04 01:00:03 pb__ your call of course, but honestly you can get get "windows functionality" with putty nd WinSCP Jul 04 01:00:58 pb__, that would give you shell access and a pretty GUI ( from windows ) for browsing the file system Jul 04 01:01:37 i guess im just oldschool . . .have a problem with putting X on linux period Jul 04 01:01:44 hah Jul 04 01:02:22 life would be much easier if I could find my DVI-HDMI adapter Jul 04 01:02:32 i do that because of many different reason, but mainly to keep size down, and for reliability Jul 04 01:03:04 I'm open to anything that works Jul 04 01:03:32 it works well proble is you have to learn the command line. Not everyon has the time for that Jul 04 01:03:58 in the end though the better you understadn the command line the better off you are Jul 04 01:04:08 I won't be messing with it that much, but I wouldnt mind learning it Jul 04 01:04:22 what all do you plan on running on it ? Jul 04 01:04:28 Samba ? Jul 04 01:04:51 Honestly, my main goal is just to stick 4 external HDDs on my home network Jul 04 01:04:59 to run my media boxes off of it Jul 04 01:05:11 cool thing about Ubuntu / debian, is that many things such as that are well documented on the web so finding something out is a matter of a google season or three away Jul 04 01:05:13 possibly remote access also Jul 04 01:05:58 google session* Jul 04 01:06:12 define "remote access" Jul 04 01:06:14 yea, im a little familiar with ubuntu, have ran it in the past Jul 04 01:06:32 remote file access to the drives that are connected to the BBB Jul 04 01:06:40 nothing more Jul 04 01:06:49 that would most likely be samba then Jul 04 01:07:17 The media boxes I'm hooking up are WD TV live's Jul 04 01:07:19 could be done a few difeferentways but i think samba makes the most sense from a users standpoint Jul 04 01:07:24 ok Jul 04 01:08:03 do you want to restrict access ? Jul 04 01:08:17 ubuntu > * Jul 04 01:08:22 ubuntu is amazing Jul 04 01:08:24 or is it like a local free for all sort of deal ? Jul 04 01:08:29 local free for all Jul 04 01:08:29 its the best os ever created from the ground up Jul 04 01:08:33 unlike debian Jul 04 01:08:38 external restricted Jul 04 01:08:41 which is just a copy of gentoo and redhat Jul 04 01:08:44 thats easy Jul 04 01:08:46 but even if there is no external, there is no big deal. Jul 04 01:09:53 emocakes since that was obviously a troll i'll completely ignore that statement Jul 04 01:10:06 ( almost completely ) Jul 04 01:10:16 huh m_billybob? Jul 04 01:11:03 first of all debian is nothing like redhat or gentoo second of all Debian was around before Ubuntu which leads to the point that Ubuntu is *based on * Debian. Jul 04 01:11:20 anyhow diner time bbl Jul 04 01:11:23 it says on wikipedia otherwise m_billybob Jul 04 01:11:31 same here billy Jul 04 01:14:24 wtf Jul 04 01:14:30 you guys got your history bass ackwards Jul 04 01:14:40 gentoo came way after debian IIRC Jul 04 01:14:49 redhat not so much though Jul 04 01:14:56 they were quite different for a very long time Jul 04 01:15:03 then redhat got YUM, which leveled the playing field a bit Jul 04 01:15:09 and Ubuntu is most definitely based on Debian. Jul 04 01:16:20 apt-get install yum wtf you talking about Spirilis Jul 04 01:16:22 ;) Jul 04 01:16:32 yum install dpkg Jul 04 01:16:37 yargh Jul 04 01:16:39 yum install alien Jul 04 01:16:43 ;) Jul 04 01:17:14 debian has been around a long long time Jul 04 01:17:35 yeah Jul 04 01:17:37 slackware too Jul 04 01:17:45 .....though you don't hear much about it anymore :-) Jul 04 01:17:48 slackware was my first linux Jul 04 01:18:12 slackeware was my first linux experience perhaps, maybe debian i dont exactly remember Jul 04 01:18:50 slackware for me only b/c it was the only distro at the time offering a downloadable install floppy with the experimental 2.1.48 kernel Jul 04 01:19:07 which happened to have working IBM Microchannel architecture support for the junk-ass tank of a 386 someone sent me for free Jul 04 01:19:19 never bothered with "redhat" until mandrake and yeah . . . never really liked redhat based distros much though from a technical standpoint i find gentoo interesting Jul 04 01:19:26 have even tried sabayon Jul 04 01:19:38 redhat I ended up getting involved with through work. It's very common in enterprises. Jul 04 01:19:42 never heard of sabayon Jul 04 01:20:01 its a gentoo cutting edge "fork" i guess Jul 04 01:20:13 lets you compile as you want / go Jul 04 01:20:13 ah Jul 04 01:20:17 I never got into the gentoo stuff Jul 04 01:20:32 sounded like more bullshit than it was worth to me Jul 04 01:20:55 was one of the first live dvd distros ( that seemed to work correctly anyhow ) Jul 04 01:21:06 ubuntu is still better than debian Jul 04 01:21:13 it is mobile friendly Jul 04 01:21:15 responsive Jul 04 01:21:22 web 2.0 ready Jul 04 01:21:26 and cloud scalable Jul 04 01:21:28 worked ghreat for me, but didnt support my hardware at the time mainly ICH9 chipset ( SATA drivers ) Jul 04 01:21:44 I'll admit I use ubuntu over debian, even the server edition here at home. Jul 04 01:21:50 emocakes great have funwith it Jul 04 01:22:01 it seemed ubuntu took debian and cleaned up the install experience Jul 04 01:22:07 ive had too many bad experiences with ubuntu Jul 04 01:22:25 largely upgrade paths early on sucked really badly Jul 04 01:22:28 ah Jul 04 01:22:31 yeah Jul 04 01:22:31 :p Jul 04 01:22:34 not sure its been fixed entirerly either Jul 04 01:22:43 m_billybob in all honesty for a server I run solaris Jul 04 01:22:45 I never trusted distro version upgrades until a few years back and ubuntu has executed them quite well since Jul 04 01:22:50 smartOS zones Jul 04 01:22:58 ugh Jul 04 01:23:01 dislike ubuntu Jul 04 01:23:17 emoq if you're into solaris then you probably like debian most of all distros Jul 04 01:23:22 solaris is like that pimple on the back of my spine I can't quite reach Jul 04 01:23:25 emocakes* Jul 04 01:23:37 we have plenty of solaris at work but it's shrinking little by little Jul 04 01:24:00 Oracle is ruining many things Jul 04 01:24:10 yeah Jul 04 01:24:17 not Oracle solaris Jul 04 01:24:25 I hated solaris before oracle but Oracle is doing a stellar job of building its coffin for it Jul 04 01:24:29 http://smartos.org/ Jul 04 01:24:30 Indiana ? Jul 04 01:24:31 this solaris Jul 04 01:24:45 ahh Jul 04 01:24:46 gotcha Jul 04 01:25:00 which is basically indiana m_billybob Jul 04 01:25:02 illumos Jul 04 01:25:09 its wonderful Jul 04 01:25:10 Spirilis from a technical standpoint solaris had many gret features Jul 04 01:25:40 yeah I know, solaris always performs better under heavy memory load, I/O scheduling always seemed smoother, etc. Jul 04 01:25:43 still fucking hate it :) Jul 04 01:25:50 ZFS ZRAID the "each process running in its own VM" long before android was around Jul 04 01:26:03 solaris zones :D Jul 04 01:26:21 zones are pretty awesome Jul 04 01:26:24 not to mentions its system config / data stuff ive long forgot about Jul 04 01:26:33 Spirilis well see you're not alone either Jul 04 01:26:42 i could never get used to using it Jul 04 01:26:49 BSD for that matter either Jul 04 01:27:07 package mgmt seemed like a perpetual ugly hack, couldn't necessarily figure out what a patch was from its .tar.Z filename or whatnot like you can with deb's or RPMs where the version is usually in the filename Jul 04 01:27:29 I can not sayfor sure 100% what it is exactly but Debian for me . . . brings back my dos days somehow Jul 04 01:27:30 GNU tools sometimes are there sometimes not, sometimes in /opt/csw, sometimes in /usr/sfw Jul 04 01:27:43 anyway yeah Jul 04 01:27:54 linux is here to stay :) Jul 04 01:28:00 e.g. my dos knowledge somehow translate over to Debian/Linux very easily somehow Jul 04 01:28:17 haha that is slightly frightening at face value Jul 04 01:29:06 yeah well lol just means i felt right at home at the debian CLI Jul 04 01:29:13 so, you guys where arguing about Gun size? Jul 04 01:29:21 yeah Jul 04 01:29:23 mine's got girth Jul 04 01:29:40 apt-get install blah <---- makes total sense to me as does dkpg-reconfigure dpkg -l etc etc Jul 04 01:30:04 mrpackethead was talking about it Jul 04 01:30:14 arguing * shrug* i wasnt Jul 04 01:31:49 Spirilis so why do you use ubuntu ? ease of use ? Jul 04 01:32:00 I hear that alot amonst developers actually. Jul 04 01:33:00 m_billybob: yeah, debian's .... uh.... dselect? thing turned me off the first few times I used it, ubuntu basically rolls out the door with a reasonable set of defaults and I have no problem shoring up the rest with apt-get. Jul 04 01:33:25 m_billybob: I think ubuntu added more frills as of late during the installer but still, reasonably concise package sets that I hardly ever use anyway so I just hit "next" Jul 04 01:33:31 Spirilis, also did you find those links i gave last night was hoping it wasnt too obvious lol Jul 04 01:33:34 m_billybob: alas, I haven't done a debian install as of late. maybe all that's changed Jul 04 01:33:49 Debian is probably less user friendly Jul 04 01:34:04 m_billybob: yeah, I decided to buy the new book anyway. 4th edition and sounds like there are a lot of changes (mostly modern applications) that I'd like to see particularly if it helps get me up to speed even quicker. Jul 04 01:34:08 from the command line its goign ot be similar i thnk Jul 04 01:34:16 yeah Jul 04 01:34:34 I honestly have no used Ubuntu seriously in over 5-6 years Jul 04 01:34:46 the GUI sucks ass now, Unity it's called... Jul 04 01:34:59 yup Jul 04 01:35:01 last time I used it as a full-blown work laptop GUI workstation O/S was 3 years ago Jul 04 01:35:08 was rolling with the older GNOME and loved it Jul 04 01:35:12 tried Unity once and puked Jul 04 01:35:13 if gnu got a window manager similar to OS X Jul 04 01:35:16 i would use it Jul 04 01:35:38 until then its just going to be a server Jul 04 01:35:40 or headless Jul 04 01:36:00 back then though i was attemptign to do Xen + iSCSI and ubuntu was falling on its face fairly badly, but also was something that I could not achieve on debian because of debians stable build process ( couple years between upgrades etc ) and no huge hurry to add "modern" packages Jul 04 01:36:45 yeah Jul 04 01:36:54 that's another thing, ubuntu's more aggressive release cycle back then Jul 04 01:37:00 appealed to me a bit better Jul 04 01:37:11 I used to hate udev with a passion Jul 04 01:37:12 but yeah the virtualization and iSCSI world took a while to mature I found Jul 04 01:37:23 and both are transforming even more nowadays Jul 04 01:37:27 was the source of all my ills on ubuntu wuith Xen and iSCSI Jul 04 01:37:36 I think there's a new target daemon platform now to support iscsi + other stuff? Jul 04 01:38:22 open-iscsi has been around since the get go its all i use Jul 04 01:38:32 that's client-side I think Jul 04 01:38:39 and yeah it works pretty well Jul 04 01:39:16 iscsitarget iscsitarget-dkms Jul 04 01:39:35 my first legitimate use of iscsi was OpenStack, which is rapidly evolving and still in its infancy but the eval environments I rolled use iSCSI for the nova-volume (now Cinder, I think) feature which is openstack's version of Amazon EBS block volumes Jul 04 01:39:38 iscsitarget been aorudn since the gt go too i thnk but i am unfamiliar with the dkms file there Jul 04 01:39:49 not quite sure exactly what it is exactly Jul 04 01:39:49 ah yeah dkms, dell kernel module system I think Jul 04 01:40:07 basically a way to package up kernel modules in a manner that they're easy to build on different versions I think Jul 04 01:40:27 idk i have gotten much into the new stuff on debian yet Jul 04 01:40:45 just learned a couple weeks ago the new debian way to do init.d stuffs Jul 04 01:41:26 Spirilis though back then 5-6 years ago iSCSI boot was not an options but now it is Jul 04 01:41:41 yeah Jul 04 01:41:50 matter of fact some woman i knew from this server and I were looking into a way to make it work Jul 04 01:41:58 I haven't kept up with the hardware side of that but that was a killer feature I wanted to see back when I was first introduced to iSCSI in concept Jul 04 01:42:02 she was an ex IBM employee if i remember right Jul 04 01:42:11 ex IBM or intel Jul 04 01:42:16 i forget whcih Jul 04 01:42:20 ah neat Jul 04 01:42:28 but yeah that was way over my head lol Jul 04 01:42:35 so i bowed out Jul 04 01:44:01 still trying to figure out how to get iSCSI root workign on the bbb Jul 04 01:44:37 iSCSI boot wouldnt be of much use Jul 04 01:45:24 NFS reads == 11.9MB/s and writes == 11.1MB/s Jul 04 01:45:57 thats close enough to iSCSI speeds ( and better writes ) that im no longer interrested so much in iSCSI Jul 04 01:46:07 err better reads Jul 04 01:47:18 rootpath=/home/username/rootfs,rsize=16384,wsize=16384 <--- double rsize and wsize makes a huge difference Jul 04 01:48:04 rootpath=/home/william/rootfs,rsize=32768,wsize=32768 this is what i use now Jul 04 01:48:22 eat up a lot of bbb ram initially though lol Jul 04 01:51:26 Jesus Christ ‏@Jesus_M_Christ 11m Jul 04 01:51:26 This 4th of July don't forget to celebrate God's three favorite american traditions: Beer, Bacon & Teen pregnancy. Jul 04 01:51:39 Yes, I follow Jesus on twitter :) Jul 04 01:55:15 we all need to find peace in what we belive Jul 04 01:55:20 i dont' belive in Angstrom Jul 04 01:57:13 Yee-haw! How does this fine Friday treat you? Jul 04 01:59:00 Much as I expected. Ah well, may as well blow stuff up. Jul 04 01:59:25 you should call yourself bbc, my wife loves bbc Jul 04 02:22:49 friday? Jul 04 02:22:50 lol Jul 04 02:25:28 merica mrpackethead . .. 4th of july tomorrow. long weekend Jul 04 02:31:20 kd0vyu, we blow stuff up regularly Jul 04 02:32:42 Letting the magic smoke free? Jul 04 02:33:27 mostly blue, but other colours too Jul 04 02:33:51 kids are setting off m-80s over here Jul 04 02:34:07 Many ICs have met there fate here. And bottle rockets Jul 04 02:34:37 last year our 4th display went off ALL AT ONE TIME.... Jul 04 02:34:49 the sequencer broke and it sent everything up at one time. Jul 04 02:35:01 so it was 10seconds Jul 04 02:35:06 (and then it was OVER) Jul 04 02:35:56 Last year it rained. I'd rigged an arduino to do a timed display. Jul 04 02:36:13 Epic Fizzle Jul 04 02:39:11 mastiff: A co-worker ask me today where she could procure a 1/4 stick of dynamite. Jul 04 02:42:57 i hear fishing is a good use for a 1/4 stick Jul 04 02:45:51 mastiff, we used a 1/4 stick under a 55gal drum...i think it blew it up 60+ft Jul 04 02:46:03 (yes it was empty) Jul 04 02:48:58 morning emeb_mac Jul 04 02:49:17 hi ka6sox - what's shakin'? Jul 04 02:54:26 thankfully not the ground Jul 04 02:54:32 but I can't get pcb to launch Jul 04 02:54:36 and no errors Jul 04 02:57:09 bizarre Jul 04 02:58:31 truely **** ENDING LOGGING AT Thu Jul 04 02:59:59 2013