**** BEGIN LOGGING AT Sat Oct 17 02:59:58 2015 Oct 17 03:21:21 hi guys. will there be a difference between the schematics of the bb x15 mouser, digikey etc. will sell and the ti TMDXEVM5728 schematics? or is it the same board? Oct 17 03:22:09 well, I can't speak with authority, but my impression is that the x15 is simply the base board of the evm Oct 17 03:22:45 thats what i think. but then i think: why does ti release the schematics and bb.org will wait 2 more weeks Oct 17 03:23:00 bb schematics are released also Oct 17 03:23:12 really? :o Oct 17 03:23:31 but they say "AM572x General Purpose EVM Processor Module" at the bottom, and the word "beagle" occurs only in the name of the PDF Oct 17 03:23:59 https://github.com/beagleboard/beagleboard-x15 Oct 17 03:24:35 and the picture of the ti evm processor board says: bb x15 too an the ti page Oct 17 03:25:10 uavcam, the ti evm, is just an x15 plugged into an lcd. ;) Oct 17 03:25:17 + more... ;) Oct 17 03:25:58 yeah, the evm has a fairly elaborate expansion board I think Oct 17 03:26:21 camera, wifi, pci-e.. Oct 17 03:26:29 and the cam connector :) Oct 17 03:27:09 rcn-ee: I wonder how much real-estate vayu's padring must be consuming... with three programmable delay lines for each IO pin (in, out, oe) Oct 17 03:27:53 then again, it's such an enormous beast already, that padring is probably not even a big deal anymore Oct 17 03:28:28 with configuable io, it's the only reason the pads work. ;) Oct 17 03:30:26 it's an interesting concept though, the ability to perform these timing adjustments could very well also be useful for other purposes than compensating the internal delays of the SoC Oct 17 03:31:10 like compensating for timing skew due to pcb design Oct 17 03:31:32 I still have absolutely no idea what these "virtual IO timing" modes are though Oct 17 03:31:39 i just cringe everytime someone says "cape" with the x15... it'll be a big mess... ti only wants to support pin setup in bootloader/u-boot... Oct 17 03:32:30 nah, you can reconfigure on the fly, it just needs a tiny bit of creativity Oct 17 03:33:15 yeah.. creativity.. some calibration for every pin.. Oct 17 03:34:48 probably have linux perform a suspend-to-ram, except right before the actual suspend you take a different branch, isolate the chip, perform the relevant reprogramming/recalibration, deisolate, resume Oct 17 03:36:19 if the reprogramming can be done fast enough, you may even be able to get away with doing it without the suspend... it might lead to a corrupted packet on various links (eth, sata, etc) but all of those are already designed to deal with that Oct 17 03:36:59 the only thing that's actually important is making sure EMIF is idle Oct 17 05:26:39 Require help in setting up BeagleBoneBlack Oct 17 05:34:32 http://www.catb.org/esr/faqs/smart-questions.html Oct 17 05:35:46 heh, the reset circuitry of the x15 is really nuts Oct 17 05:38:26 yeah ill check it out Oct 17 05:48:34 * veremit yawn Oct 17 06:07:46 do you see a possibility to get i2c3 ccess via the expansion headers? Oct 17 06:10:25 hmmm seems to be a typo in the ti camera board schematics. i only see i2c5 everywhere Oct 17 06:12:09 sounds like interesting interface naming Oct 17 07:56:11 * nyt yawns Oct 17 07:56:24 first participants in escape the room game tonight with the bbb Oct 17 07:56:26 bbb did well Oct 17 07:56:44 hehe Oct 17 08:51:44 hi I have installed debian on beagle bone black but I cant see it Oct 17 08:52:37 BBB-eMMC-flasher-debian-7.8-lxde-armhf-2015-03-01-2gb Oct 17 08:52:44 open ya eyes .. ahahahaha :D Oct 17 08:53:28 I cant see the GUI Oct 17 08:53:33 I am not blind Oct 17 09:00:28 so you have a HDMI screen attached? Oct 17 11:04:24 I have installed debian on bbb but I am unable to see it on my monitor, when I connect my bbb via hdmi Oct 17 11:08:03 09:00:28< tbr> so you have a HDMI screen attached? Oct 17 11:20:42 yes I can see the desktop for a while and then it goes away Oct 17 11:21:01 I think there is a problem with video driver? Oct 17 11:25:19 http://www.catb.org/esr/faqs/smart-questions.html Oct 17 11:25:55 your initial description is worthless Oct 17 11:26:09 adil: probably it's just screen blanking or screen saver then Oct 17 11:42:06 tbr, I dont know what is the exact problem Oct 17 11:42:31 do you have keyboard or mouse attached? Oct 17 11:42:38 yes Oct 17 11:43:59 keyboard and mouse both are working fibe Oct 17 11:44:02 *fine Oct 17 11:52:02 -sigh- sometimes its not worth trying lol Oct 17 12:16:44 morning Oct 17 14:05:52 hi I am running linux on bbb but the problem is desktop is appearing for few seconds and than disappears. what is the problem? Oct 17 14:17:29 adil: how long is it visible? what happens after that? Oct 17 14:28:18 * zmatt thinks it may be an infestation of display lice Oct 17 14:29:50 "your display output was eaten by a grue" Oct 17 14:30:48 hehe Oct 17 14:33:22 the obvious solution to that would be increasing the display intensity of course Oct 17 14:33:32 if it's display lice, boil it out Oct 17 15:08:34 I had a display louse once. Oct 17 15:08:52 A 'harvest beetle' that got in between the polariser and light of my laptop LCD Oct 17 15:09:05 And died. Oct 17 15:19:18 friend of mine had the same problem once on a new dell laptop. they refused to repair it. Oct 17 16:39:11 "I'm sorry sir, we can't save the beetle anymore" Oct 17 16:44:56 hello can sombody help plz i want to use the beagle bone canbus cape rev A2 with the beagle bone (revAc) are they compatible ? how to now it ? Oct 17 16:52:05 hello can sombody help plz i want to use the beagle bone canbus cape rev A2 with the beagle bone (revAc) are they compatible ? how to now it ? Oct 17 23:06:19 Hello: I want to view Linux on my new BBB vC. I've connected it to my PC via USB. Do I have to connect to a monitor via HDMI to see Linux? Oct 17 23:57:56 BeagleJohn : there are a couple different ways Oct 17 23:58:08 Hello BBB experts. Did I answer my own question? Do I need to connect to a monitor via HDMI in order to view and use Linux on my BBB? Oct 17 23:59:04 BeagleJohn : you can connect a display via hdmi and keyboard via usb, but you can also use the linux system via network or via usb client connection to another pc Oct 17 23:59:16 BeagleJohn : linux is not primarily a visual system Oct 17 23:59:33 BeagleJohn : oh, and another option is to connect to the console serial port Oct 17 23:59:44 what makes sense depends on what you want to accomplish Oct 18 00:00:07 so, what do you want to accomplish? Oct 18 00:00:31 I want to use Python to develop a GUI and also control an industrial process. Oct 18 00:01:06 So I want to develop Python on the BBB and use Matplotlib, Numpy et al. Oct 18 00:02:00 I have done some Python on my PC doing some analysis and making a GUI. Now want to transfer that code and more to the BBB. Oct 18 00:03:32 okey Oct 18 00:03:44 then you will need a monitor one way or the other Oct 18 00:04:02 or some kind of display, and yes, that would attach to the mini-hdmi port Oct 18 00:04:23 CareBear: So I cannot simply use the USB connection to my PC? Oct 18 00:04:38 not if you want the beaglebone to be driving a gui Oct 18 00:04:51 driving/displaying Oct 18 00:05:16 how will your software interface with the industrial process? Oct 18 00:05:56 Ok, I had ASSumed that I could put the Python code into the BBB and have the GUI show up on my PC, but I guess that's wishful thinking, eh? Oct 18 00:06:25 is that what you want? Oct 18 00:06:40 I mean, don't you want the beaglebone to manage this industrial process standalone? Oct 18 00:07:03 Also I need to install Matplotlib, Numpy et al on the BBB so I can include it for developing the GUI. Oct 18 00:07:38 Yes, I want the BBB to manage the Ind Proc standalone and have it drive the GUI. Oct 18 00:08:08 then how does that fit with the gui being on the pc via usb? Oct 18 00:08:19 So I had planned on getting a 4DSystems 7" touchscreen LCD but haven't done that yet. Oct 18 00:08:49 until you have that you probably can't finish the gui Oct 18 00:09:24 but you could probably finish most of it by using an hdmi screen and a mouse Oct 18 00:09:25 Oh, I just wanted to get started on the software development on the PC and then if I am successful, I would get the LCD. Oct 18 00:09:37 sure, not a bad plan Oct 18 00:11:11 as for installing software on the beagle - it is a linux system, like every other linux system in the world. the particular linux distribution used determines how software is installed, and how that works is unrelated to whatever hardware the system runs on. most distributions have a package manager, which can be used to install hundreds of thousands of software packages Oct 18 00:11:41 if your beaglebone runs debian, the package manager command to install a package is: apt-get install packagename Oct 18 00:11:41 CareBear. Thanks. It all seems so obvious now but I didn't see any info on getting LInux to show up on my PC and figured that was a starting point as I have to install Matplotlib etc. Oct 18 00:12:47 if you connect an hdmi display and a mouse+keyboard there may even be a graphical package manager, I don't know about that, I prefer never to use guis Oct 18 00:13:16 Ok, so do I have to have a monitor on the bbb to run apt-get install packagename? Oct 18 00:14:27 I like to use GUI's for Users who aren't computer savvy, so they can touch buttons etc and get data to show up on graphs. Oct 18 00:15:17 the other ways I mentioned of using the linux system all give you a command line, where you would enter that command Oct 18 00:15:52 And so I cannot view Linux on my PC via USB? I have to connect a monitor? Oct 18 00:15:56 (ssh over ip over ethernet, ssh over ip over usb, and console serial port) Oct 18 00:16:12 "view Linux" isn't a very good expression Oct 18 00:16:22 it makes me very unsure what you actually mean Oct 18 00:17:05 as I said, Linux isn't primarily visual, so graphical interfaces are an exception rather than the norm Oct 18 00:17:42 Oh, I mean "use Linux so that I can run the install command to install Matplotlib etc." Oct 18 00:17:45 not that they are unavailable in any way - but they aren't the "fundamental" way to interact with the system Oct 18 00:17:47 oh ok Oct 18 00:17:48 yes Oct 18 00:18:02 that you can do in at least three different ways without an hdmi display Oct 18 00:18:20 your choices are: ssh over ip over ethernet, ssh over ip over usb, and console serial port Oct 18 00:19:19 since the beaglebone will anyway need ethernet to reach the internet to download the software packages you want to install that seems like a good choice Oct 18 00:19:23 Ok, often it has to be beat into my old head. :-) Oct 18 00:20:23 Thanks very much CareBear for clearing this up for me. I have a couple of books that tell how to do the 3 choices but thought they were unnecessarily complex and hoped to avoid them. Oct 18 00:20:40 did you do some linux experiments before, or is this the first time? Oct 18 00:20:45 But perhaps one of the three choices will do the trick. Oct 18 00:21:11 My first time with Linux. Piece of cake, right? Oct 18 00:21:22 well Oct 18 00:21:49 I think it's great and important to try new things Oct 18 00:21:53 and fun! Oct 18 00:22:02 I have been a Windoz guy with C#, LabWindows/CVI, Python. Oct 18 00:22:43 but I also think that it's important to have a good environment when learning new things Oct 18 00:22:57 Yes, I wholeheartedly agree and am excited to get going on the project. Oct 18 00:23:54 the beaglebone is one example of what's called an embedded linux system, and I personally don't think it's so great to start with an embedded system when learning linux - because they are actually two orthogonal axes Oct 18 00:24:52 what I mean is - it will require learning two very different things at the same time in order to achieve a single goal Oct 18 00:25:24 if you have the patience then great, go ahead, it will be very interesting and really rewarding in the end Oct 18 00:26:30 Ah, but I've gotta dive right in. Can't just get my toes wet. But I agree with your statement, just that I figure Linux is just a command line OS, not to minimize it's importance and value, but I figure I can do command line stuff. Oct 18 00:26:41 but also be aware that you may have the bad fortune of running into troubles while learning linux, which actually have nothing to do with linux systems per se but specifically embedded systems Oct 18 00:27:11 sure, you're absolutely right about that - the command line is the primary interface for a linux system Oct 18 00:27:43 I appreciate your warnings but it really seems that the BBB and Python etc are the way to go for this project. Oct 18 00:28:08 I am not trying to talk you out of it and I think the beaglebone is a fine fit for what you want to do Oct 18 00:28:30 what is the interface to the industrial process? Oct 18 00:28:45 are there many different ones, or just a single one, etc? Oct 18 00:28:51 Originally I had planned on using a Digi International BL2600 SBC as the controller and then connect to a PC for the Supervision and Monitoring and GUI. Oct 18 00:29:34 rabbit, wow, haven't heard about those in a while Oct 18 00:29:38 But then I realized that the BBB probably has all the hardware that I need to do the control and GUI. Oct 18 00:29:40 do they still make z80s? Oct 18 00:30:45 It's some form of Z80. They took over Z-World. I had used Z-World boards and Dynamic C for a couple of decades. Oct 18 00:30:54 nod Oct 18 00:31:22 I think you made a good choice replacing the z80 with an arm Oct 18 00:31:40 it's a nice jump into the current millenium Oct 18 00:32:10 So I'm familiar with Digi's stuff and like Dynamic C. I would have to do Ethernet comm between the BL2600 and the PC or whatever. Oct 18 00:32:38 So this simplifies the system quite a bit and I only have to develop code on one processor. Oct 18 00:32:56 you can still do a remote control application for pcs if you like Oct 18 00:33:23 your gui is allowed to also use the network :) Oct 18 00:33:37 but it's not neccessary in any way Oct 18 00:33:54 the beaglebone can certainly do all you need, and probably at much lower cost Oct 18 00:34:04 the big difference is in the development environment Oct 18 00:34:06 And yes, it's nice to get into the 21st century with the ARM. And yes, the idea of the remote PC is a possibility but not for the industrial users, for me. Oct 18 00:34:41 what's the interface to the process? I'm not asking about protocols but about the electrical interface Oct 18 00:35:08 single io pins that will need some isolation, or serial ports, or i2c, or .. ? Oct 18 00:35:30 all digital? some analog? Oct 18 00:35:31 etc Oct 18 00:37:01 I guess I got kicked off. But the connections are 4-20 mA with possibly a single digital input. Oct 18 00:37:16 okey Oct 18 00:37:28 the beagle can't drive those current outputs directly Oct 18 00:37:36 CareBear: You've been extraordinarily helpful. Thanks very much. I guess I got kicked off. Bye. Oct 18 00:38:00 so you'll need some parts in between Oct 18 00:38:06 Oh, I'm still connected. Oct 18 00:38:29 Yes, I'll have to make a simple cape to handle the analog I/O. Oct 18 00:38:31 yep. the beaglebone has 3.3v IO pins, which can source a max of I believe 8mA before they break Oct 18 00:39:03 I was figureing on using the PWM for the outputs and a voltage to current converter. Have done it before. Oct 18 00:39:32 hm pwm Oct 18 00:40:12 I'm not sure that PWM will be easy on the software side Oct 18 00:40:18 Yes, have done PWM on Microchip micros. Works great. Just need R-C filtering followed by opamps. Piece of cake. Oct 18 00:41:15 sure, the hardware is simple, but I don't know if Linux has general infrastructure for PWM - hang on, I'd like to check that Oct 18 00:41:26 pwm does exist in the beaglebone . Oct 18 00:41:42 controlling it isn't trivial from what I've heard Oct 18 00:41:56 yes, the hardware is all there, hang on Oct 18 00:42:00 Hopefully software won't be a problem with PWM. I was thinking that I should be able to simple load a digital word in some buffer to control the duty cycle, like I have done with other micros that have PWM outputs. Oct 18 00:42:22 BeagleJohn : this is the part I am looking into now Oct 18 00:42:38 Linux does have a PWM framework Oct 18 00:42:53 you can't just load values into registers .. that way you're gonna crash your processor ;) Oct 18 00:43:08 its very easy in pic/arduino etc .. in a linux os you've got a lot more going on! Oct 18 00:43:40 sure you can, but it's not how things normally happen when building on top of an operating system Oct 18 00:43:47 Great. Thanks very much for your help and consultation. Ah, Linux, another challenge! Oct 18 00:44:17 Gotta go. Thanks very much CareBear. Oct 18 00:44:29 you're welcome Oct 18 00:44:46 good luck with your project :) Oct 18 00:45:18 yeah, the pwm userspace api is in sysfs Oct 18 00:45:38 period and duty_cycle, in nanoseconds Oct 18 00:49:14 bedtime - good night Oct 18 00:51:39 nn **** ENDING LOGGING AT Sun Oct 18 02:59:58 2015