**** BEGIN LOGGING AT Wed Mar 31 02:59:56 2021 Mar 31 03:13:21 Well, the last two day is when I tried the compilation of Yocto for the beaglebone black. Blah is it! Mar 31 03:13:25 I failed. Mar 31 03:13:56 I tried old ideas, new tuts, and the GInormous manual! Mar 31 03:14:07 All have nothing for me to figure out (so far). Mar 31 03:15:42 Updates on the way (as soon as I crack this egg)... Mar 31 03:21:21 The dang bblayers.conf shows the meta-beaglebone as the main machine. It is not as easy as uncommenting though. Argh. Mar 31 03:22:17 Oh well, I am taking up space now. If someone is using the BBB and Yocto, let this brother know. Mar 31 03:23:07 I tried here too: https://jumpnowtek.com/beaglebone/BeagleBone-Systems-with-Yocto.html Mar 31 03:23:16 No go. I cannot get past the bitbake build. Mar 31 03:23:54 I tried Ubuntu, Debian, WSL2, and other ideas. Luckily, I finally found the updated pages online outside of their older manual(s). Mar 31 03:34:02 Aw! Mar 31 03:34:06 meta-beagleboard! Mar 31 03:53:01 zmatt: thanks, booted with the image from issue Mar 31 06:11:07 hi, does beaglebone have boards with mipi csi camera connections? Mar 31 06:11:25 beaglebone has no video input of any sort Mar 31 06:11:46 right, is that an obtuse use case? what is recommended for doing video processing in general? Mar 31 06:12:30 the AM335x isn't really particularly designed for any sort of video processing Mar 31 06:13:25 it has no video input, limited video output capability (mainly designed for touchscreen interfaces, no hardware compositing, it doesn't even have hardware cursor support!), and no hardware video en-/decoding acceleration Mar 31 06:15:14 the AM572x that's on the beagleboard-x15 and beaglebone-AI _is_ designed for video processing, though I'm not sure whether there's any video input interface available on the limited pinout of the beaglebone-AI.. the beagleboard-x15 has multiple video input interfaces on its expansion headers (though all parallel digital video, not mipi csi) Mar 31 06:15:42 mipi csi is more a thing for mobile processor Mar 31 06:16:19 i see, although it's weird that they have video processing capability but no recommended way of actually getting the video into the sbc? Mar 31 06:16:42 you're referring to the beaglebone-AI ? Mar 31 06:16:47 yes Mar 31 06:17:52 well the beaglebone-AI had some rather unique design constraints... it's like a big chunk of an beagleboard-x15 crammed into the tiny form-factor of a beaglebone :P Mar 31 06:18:09 although i can't find beagleboard-x15 in stock on either mouser or digikey, weird. is it discontinued? Mar 31 06:19:34 not that I know of, though I don't have any insight into who is producing what at any given time (I'm just a random beaglebone user) Mar 31 06:19:43 ok thank you so miuch Mar 31 06:20:05 jkridner would be the one who knows the answer to that Mar 31 06:20:25 https://www.digikey.com/en/products/detail/beagleboard-by-seeed-studio/102110288/10493001 Mar 31 06:21:21 looks like production switched over to Seeed, and for some reason the product is not listed as "BeagleBoard-X15" but as "102110288" ... very intuitive Mar 31 06:21:24 :P Mar 31 06:21:59 thanks Mar 31 06:22:21 interesting, it seems to have gotten significantly cheaper Mar 31 06:23:07 but yeah, iirc when I dug into it I came to the conclusion that none of the video input interfaces were usable on the beaglebone-AI due to one or more required signals not being pinned out Mar 31 06:23:23 as for why this is the case... that would be a good question Mar 31 06:23:31 I guess they assume people use usb cameras? Mar 31 06:24:10 lemme check if I remember correctly Mar 31 06:24:13 since I'm not actually sure Mar 31 06:25:07 well my application is simple fiducial decoding, so don't need any 'deep learning' features Mar 31 06:27:30 I have no idea how much processing that requires Mar 31 06:27:54 i am able to do it on raspi 3 and jetson nano with no problem Mar 31 06:28:59 its 2d qr code basically. eg. openmv cam does it on board on with  STM32H743VI ARM Cortex M7 processor that does video encoding/decoding also Mar 31 06:29:28 both of those are pretty beefy in terms of cpu power I think? (for small ARM SBCs) Mar 31 06:29:44 ah ok Mar 31 06:29:54 that's a lot smaller ;) Mar 31 06:31:22 sounds like maybe even a regular ol' beaglebone could do it.. I guess it all depends on having code that's well-optimized for the cortex-a8 Mar 31 06:31:39 and being able to get the image data into the beaglebone in the first place (at whatever the desired frame rate is) Mar 31 06:34:14 one thing I'm not completely clear on: do you already have a beaglebone-ai (or regular beaglebone?) and are you trying to get this working on it, or are you just trying to figure out which board you want to use? Mar 31 06:36:33 nope, figuring out what board is best forme Mar 31 06:38:55 my constraints are: should have barcode decoding capability (@50hz preferably), have atleast one real time coprocessor @100Mhz minimum, have enough GPIO with good documentation (eg. jetson nano has poor gpio support), preferably have quadrature encoder x3 reading/decoding capability (which i see is there in beaglebone ai) Mar 31 06:40:10 i also have a mipi csi camera that i want to use, but maybe there are hats/capes to enable that? Mar 31 06:41:36 so, the I/O and quadrature decoding is no problem on any beaglebone, it has some really nice interfaces (e.g. also do things like measure pulse-width and pulse-distance in 10ns resolution) Mar 31 06:42:01 thats nice Mar 31 06:43:26 but can it do 3 at a time? i haven't looked up much on it yet Mar 31 06:43:27 the AM335x also has a "PRU" (Programmable Real-Time Unit) subsystem, with two non-pipelined (i.e. any instruction other than memory access = 1 cycle) 200 MHz cores which also have dedicated gpios wired into register (so you can bit-bang signals using software with 5ns resolution if need be) Mar 31 06:44:11 yeah i saw that, that is what piqued my interest in beaglebone ecosystem. only piece missing is the video processing part. Mar 31 06:44:12 yeah it has three hardware quadrature decoders Mar 31 06:44:23 beaglebone black also? Mar 31 06:44:37 the BBB has three, I'd need to check how many the BBAI has Mar 31 06:44:44 i see, i'll check Mar 31 06:44:55 it has 3 also its says on website Mar 31 06:44:56 the BBAI has two PRU subsystems (each with two cores) Mar 31 06:46:06 yeah indeed looks like the BBAI also has three Mar 31 06:46:15 quadrature decoders Mar 31 06:46:33 of course a PRU core could do quadrature decoding if need be Mar 31 06:46:54 oh so youre saying the decoding has special hardware and doesn't use the PRU? are you sure? Mar 31 06:47:04 yes, they have nothing to do with PRU Mar 31 06:47:33 interesting, and do you know the frequency limit? eg. can it handle 5k ppr per decoder? Mar 31 06:47:47 pretty sure 5M would be no problem either Mar 31 06:47:58 pulses per second Mar 31 06:48:07 yes pps sorry Mar 31 06:48:39 ok i will look more into it. although i still need a video processor/camera interface recommendation if you have any Mar 31 06:49:49 so, with the BBB your only option would be usb (which itself is kinda meh on the BBB) ... (or maybe sdio? are sdio cameras a thing? dunno, lol) Mar 31 06:50:09 dunno what sort of camera bandwidth is achievable on the BBB in practice Mar 31 06:51:35 pretty sure the BBAI has better USB support, and I'm still checking whether it actually has a usable video input interface (in which case a mipi csi cape would in principle be possible, with a converter ic) Mar 31 06:51:58 okay maybe it does have video input Mar 31 06:52:32 can you share link where you got that? Mar 31 06:52:37 yeah the BBAI does seem to have at least one full video input interface Mar 31 06:53:03 ehh I dredged it out of my pins spreadsheet into vim and through some regex and sorting ;) Mar 31 06:53:33 ah! I knew I had looked this up before, I even made a pastebin: https://pastebin.com/Lm1KnHXr Mar 31 06:53:33 ok Mar 31 06:55:03 right, so that didn't look completely great, not having a complete set of signals belonging to one ioset is kinda annoying since it means timing characteristics may be off (which will reduce the max bandwidth achievable) Mar 31 06:55:29 you said you wanted 50 fps, what resolution and pixel format? Mar 31 06:55:39 mono camera, 800x600 Mar 31 06:55:52 pixel format not sure Mar 31 06:55:52 8-bit mono presumably? Mar 31 06:55:55 yes Mar 31 06:56:03 well that's the pixel format: 8-bit mono Mar 31 06:56:07 right Mar 31 06:57:37 so that's like a 30 MHz pixel clock or thereabouts Mar 31 06:58:32 I'd say it looks like getting that into the BBAI ought to be no problem from a hardware point of view Mar 31 06:59:22 I know absolutely nothing about the software side of it though, haven't done anything with this stuff myself Mar 31 06:59:45 can you elaborate a little why it won't be a problem from hardware point of view? Mar 31 06:59:53 i didnt get you Mar 31 07:01:47 well it looks like there are multiple video input interfaces available on the BBAI's headers that have at least d0-d7 available (and I think even the vin 2.1a one with d8-d15 may be usable, iirc the data mapping in the video input subsystem is flexible enough for that, but I'd need to double-check that) Mar 31 07:02:12 and 30 MHz sounds like it should be slow enough that iosets are probably not really a worry Mar 31 07:02:55 ok i will look through the docs. thanks a lot Mar 31 07:03:11 you'd still need external hardware to convert csi into parallel video Mar 31 07:03:23 right Mar 31 07:04:31 and of course, just because it looks like the hardware can do it doesn't mean getting it actually _working_ will be easy and smooth... it might be, perhaps, if you're lucky :P Mar 31 07:05:27 unfortunately since I've not even attempted to play with this stuff I have no idea what the software state is... maybe it all works perfectly already, I just don't know Mar 31 07:09:33 probably if I were faced with this task I'd still at least first *try* to see if a BBB is able to do it, just because the BBAI seems like more headache (pinmuxing is more complicated, it tends to get hot hot hot, it's much newer so less resources available) Mar 31 07:10:00 using bbb usb interface or something else? Mar 31 07:10:08 unless usb is simply a no-go Mar 31 07:10:38 I don't think there's any real alternative to usb for getting video into the bbb Mar 31 07:10:54 i actually need 2 cameras, although second one will be used occasionally and doesn't have the 50fps thing, only a single frame at a time Mar 31 07:10:57 ok Mar 31 07:12:44 depending on budget the beagleboard-x15 may also be an option... unlike the BBAI my bbx15 doesn't seem to get particularly hot even without heatsink, and the bbx15 has most processor signals on its expansion headers (even stuff like PCI-express) Mar 31 07:13:27 its expansion headers are also better suited for high-speed signals, albeit at the cost of being less convenient for experimentation Mar 31 07:14:49 (the bbx15 also has twice the amount of RAM and twice the RAM bandwidth) Mar 31 14:47:45 Hello guys. Greetings!  have hard time in connecting BBB wireless in mac. Tried to install drivers but mac says it is incompatible with the OS. I am using the image "Debian 10.3 2020-04-06 4GB SD IoT".  Driver detected but could not see it in network section. Can anyone please help? Mar 31 14:49:11 you're trying to connect your Mac to a BBB-wi or you have problems with the MAC of the networking? Mar 31 14:49:34 if its wifi, why does it need drivers?! :) Mar 31 14:49:54 (assuming your wifi networking already works..) Mar 31 14:54:10 I want to ssh the board from mac. Sorry not driver, it is drive. Beaglebone drive detected but could not get response for the ping to 192.168.6.2 and 192.168.8.1. Mar 31 14:55:19 Why I brought network into this picture is, tried to see whether usb is listed in network section of my mac but it does not. Mar 31 15:10:49 I am able to connect it from windows PC but not sure why I could not from Mac Mar 31 15:12:24 zmatt can you please pass the updates if you have any with you. Mar 31 17:38:57 Hi jkridner . I'm using the 4.3" cape from Element 14 (https://www.element14.com/bbcape43), but I cannot find its schematics anywhere. How can a cape be on http://beagleboard.org/approved but have no schematics available? Or were the schematics removed since the approval? Mar 31 18:18:23 hmmmm..... probably. let me see if I can just dig them up. Mar 31 18:21:38 k, I just sent an e-mail request as I cannot find them easily either. :-( Mar 31 18:25:19 zmatt: I think I simply didn't know what all needed to be pinned out for camera support. Also, I try to keep https://beagleboard.org/x15 updated with purchase links, despite the fact distributors have been very confused with the manufacturing switchover from Embest to Seeed. Mar 31 20:13:48 jkridner: many thanks for your efforts :) Mar 31 22:07:52 On providing and applying .patch files w/ git, is it supposed to take more than 20 minutes for a poky patch? Mar 31 22:08:22 ouch. Mar 31 22:08:58 Heh? Mar 31 22:09:52 I do have another form of poky being installed now w/ bitbake on the same system. So, my system has been held senseless for the time being. Mar 31 22:38:56 hm... that don't sound right, what you using a old 286/386 :) Mar 31 22:40:13 i no that depending on how many files need to be patched i found it a bit slow but 20 minutes seems a bit long Mar 31 22:41:46 It is still going. Mar 31 22:42:45 I have a sort of new computer. It has a 1TB of space but only 178GB left on this partition. Mar 31 22:50:28 i5-4400 w/ 3.1Ghz. It used to be speedy before poky. Ha. Mar 31 22:51:31 is poky called poky b/c it makes the 'puter poky? Mar 31 22:51:41 Sorry. Mar 31 22:52:27 Oh! They have an enormous update I missed. This is most likely the issue. Mar 31 22:57:11 Oh bitbake, it has shown 4 sec. for the last two hours. Ha. Mar 31 23:23:06 jkridner: analysis of the video inputs available on the BBAI... it doesn't seem that bad: https://pastebin.com/Lm1KnHXr Mar 31 23:23:29 jkridner: it's unfortunate that vin4a is missing one of the 24 data signals Mar 31 23:36:24 Hey, what is the lowest bitrate that can be set for 1920x1080@60 before the bitrate overshoots? H264 Beaglebone AI Apr 01 01:26:35 bytebits: uhh, what do you mean? Apr 01 01:27:05 ah Apr 01 01:27:13 I had to read that sentence a few times Apr 01 01:27:32 dunno, that might depend on the encoder Apr 01 01:40:47 bytebits: I think H.264 can go down to pretty low bitrates... but of course the quality will be terrible Apr 01 01:42:05 "H.264 can go down to about 160bits per frame" -- according to some forum post I found **** ENDING LOGGING AT Thu Apr 01 02:59:56 2021