**** BEGIN LOGGING AT Thu May 31 02:59:56 2007 May 31 06:17:12 nelson: bluetooth battery! May 31 06:17:51 that would be nice, wouldn't it? May 31 07:02:27 So, what did you guys think about the foleo? May 31 07:03:08 http://www.engadget.com/2007/05/30/palm-foleo-announced/ May 31 07:08:40 its a laptop? May 31 07:09:25 with 5 hours batery life? May 31 07:09:49 So odd for them to even try that approach May 31 07:10:01 And that it even doesn't have touch screen. May 31 07:10:20 And it's not even well priced. May 31 07:10:46 I could understand if it was priced at below 400$. May 31 07:10:53 but I would allo to realy work right? May 31 07:12:03 ? May 31 07:13:26 I am trying to compare it with the n800. the n800 does not allow me to perform my work(programming) May 31 07:13:47 and this device sounds like a nice "network client" May 31 07:13:47 it weights as much as my thinkpad x40 May 31 07:15:11 :p May 31 07:16:06 it probabely larger then my 8+ years old thinkpad 520 May 31 07:17:04 the price is quite high yes May 31 07:17:47 I just don't get it that at which point did their marketing decide that they actually want to try to sell that thing. May 31 07:20:30 possible : for me this comment is how I feel about it http://www.engadget.com/2007/05/30/palm-foleo-announced/comments/5166920/ May 31 07:21:20 But what I really shoud do is get my boss to get me a real computer May 31 07:21:59 I currently have three computers for work. Well, two and a half, the last one generally is named "the outlook thing". May 31 07:24:11 :p Veggen idem here. but the folks here are starting to understand that there is something else then MS. my manager and even the product manager does not accept visio drawing. I make my life easyer May 31 07:24:12 keesj: Sounds like a paid commercial ;) May 31 07:24:28 the link on engadged I mean. May 31 07:25:18 morning May 31 07:25:26 * konttori loves his mac. Just perfect for working. May 31 07:25:29 morning! May 31 07:26:21 konttori: Oh, all my real work is done on a Linux box. May 31 07:26:41 konttori yes , export $DEVICE="n800" , echo < I need to work! May 31 07:30:10 morning boys (and possible girls) May 31 07:30:20 little ot, but does anyone know if it's possible to prevent ps from displaying other users' processes on linux like in freebsd? May 31 07:30:54 yeah there ways May 31 07:30:56 dunno what May 31 07:30:59 but sure it can be done May 31 07:31:07 some security modules or such for kernel May 31 07:31:08 i bet May 31 07:31:34 oh.. freebsd only needed one sysctl May 31 07:31:47 Hmmf. Warning to everyone: If ever you should think it's a good idea to just make a temporary certification authority, 1) don't, 2) if you still must, don't do like me and think that it's only gonna be temporary, don't let the CA certificate have expire time less than until your retirement ;) May 31 07:32:44 ok, still 6 years till my CA expires, the temporary CA has lasted 4 years, and I don't see how I'm gonna get rid of it the next six years. May 31 07:32:52 solmumaha alias ps="ps --User=$USER" ? May 31 07:33:37 keesj: yeah but you can unalias May 31 07:34:25 Veggen: there is nothing as permanent as a temporary solution. :-P May 31 07:34:26 ok .. so also alias alias="echo not allowed" :p May 31 07:34:54 or better yet, power off May 31 07:35:39 http://www.linuxdevices.com/news/NS2494029776.html May 31 07:35:45 i don't wanna cripple the system May 31 08:45:47 Aloha! May 31 08:51:21 hello hello May 31 08:55:27 hi everybody May 31 08:56:09 I would like to build mercurial for my Nokia 770, but I didn't find the right to build python extension inside scratchbox May 31 08:56:22 does someone here knows how I can do it ? May 31 08:56:57 as far as I understand running python, runs the host python which use the host gcc for compiling May 31 08:58:39 and the link part failed since it try to use arm linker with x86 objects May 31 09:13:32 ptisserand: do you use python2.5 ? May 31 09:13:44 ptisserand: deb http://repository.maemo.org/extras bora free non-free May 31 09:13:59 then apt-get update;apt-get install python2.5-runtime python-dev May 31 09:14:20 do that for both target in scratchbox May 31 09:14:23 worked here May 31 09:14:31 melmoth: no I don't use python2.5 May 31 09:14:54 i did not try with the defautl one. May 31 09:15:15 has anybody made debs that actually install stuff on tme MMC? May 31 09:15:17 melmoth: but Bora is not only for the OS2007 ? May 31 09:15:22 out of curiosity, why not python 2.5? May 31 09:15:24 oh, maybe. May 31 09:16:24 how can I force the correct permissions when making the package? currently the deb refuses to install because of permissions May 31 09:17:08 are you installing as root? May 31 09:17:13 yes May 31 09:17:26 konttori_: I have just install a fresh SDK, so I didn't think about upgrading python version May 31 09:17:40 it fails because of mount options for the mmc May 31 09:17:53 ptisserand: try out apt-get python-dev anyway. It should work May 31 09:18:16 i mean, if python-dev does nto comes with all the dependencies needed to build a python module...there is somethign fishy May 31 09:18:21 jkyro, so perhaps you just need to drop the execute permissions from the files before making the deb May 31 09:18:39 it's not that May 31 09:18:53 error setting ownership of `./media/mmc1/demoapp': Operation not permitted May 31 09:18:59 is what I'm getting May 31 09:19:15 jkyro: well this is probably a vfat filesystem May 31 09:19:22 so changing ownership will always fail May 31 09:19:42 is there a way to make dpkg not try to change the ownership? May 31 09:19:48 i dont know that May 31 09:20:05 but it looks to me not a good idea to package something to install stuff on a removable device May 31 09:20:15 what about if i install it and i do not have the device ? May 31 09:20:15 yes, I know May 31 09:20:43 well, it's nothing public anyway, I'm just trying to share stuff with a couple of people May 31 09:21:02 what if they have mmc2 available instead ? :) May 31 09:21:12 out of luck :) May 31 09:21:30 i woudl put the data in / somewhere , and the use a post installation script that will detetct wich card is there and copy stuff there May 31 09:22:12 Just an idea, but perhaps you should just add a postinst that will move the files to mmc and delete them from the flash after that. (and then prerm that will remove them from the mmc)? May 31 09:22:36 apparently the same idea! May 31 09:22:40 there's quite a lot of stuff, another reason for not using the internal flash May 31 09:22:55 can't do it in phases May 31 09:23:20 hmm, maybe I could just wget and unzip the stuff in the postinst May 31 09:23:36 melmoth: after installing python-2.5 it compiles fine, thanks May 31 09:26:25 python2.5++ :) May 31 09:26:58 melmoth: but it means that I have to update my N770 but python2.5 in order to use my mercurial build :( May 31 09:27:11 s/but py/to py/ May 31 09:27:12 ptisserand meant: melmoth: but it means that I have to update my N770 to python2.5 in order to use my mercurial build :( May 31 09:27:36 i do not know the status of python2.5 for n770 May 31 09:27:41 i only have a n800... May 31 09:27:47 ok May 31 10:01:40 melmoth: python 2.5 should work just fine on it os 2006 on 770 as well May 31 10:25:30 <|tbb|> anyone knows ruby-gtk2 is available for maemo May 31 10:43:09 <|tbb|> how about a subversionclient? May 31 11:16:05 |tbb|: i believe ruby bindings for maemo is a google summer of code project this year May 31 11:16:27 waiting for those too May 31 11:35:25 <|tbb|> whatsup if i get following error after apt-get update May 31 11:35:33 <|tbb|> W: GPG error: http://catalogue.tableteer.nokia.com bora Release: The following signatures were invalid: BADSIG CBFC2BECC6903E72 Nokia Internet Tablet Archive Automatic Signing Key May 31 11:50:40 |tbb|, it's only a warning for apt May 31 12:19:44 <|tbb|> ive trying to install pythoon2.5 runtime without success May 31 12:19:57 Is someone working on porting Ekiga? May 31 12:20:06 All I found is 3 screenshots of something May 31 12:20:15 *of something that looks like ekiga but no patches, no code May 31 12:20:38 <|tbb|> libsdlttf2.2 fails May 31 12:21:43 <|tbb|> i tried to install itfrom here http://maemo.org/downloads/product/python May 31 12:32:45 Have you tried 2.4? May 31 12:32:47 https://garage.maemo.org/frs/download.php/1182/python2.4-runtime.install May 31 12:33:50 Oh, here it is: You need to install base repository first: http://pymaemo.garage.maemo.org/base-repository.install May 31 12:34:04 Here are the install instructions: http://pymaemo.garage.maemo.org/installation.html May 31 12:49:18 is there a hacked os distribution based on qtopia around ? May 31 12:54:00 yay. battery lasts 5 hours in offline mode watching non-stop xvid movies with nmplayer May 31 13:53:53 guardian: there's no alternative dist/image for it at all May 31 14:44:08 ok May 31 15:28:07 bergie: Ping? May 31 15:28:17 pong May 31 15:29:02 Can you tell me how I identify if we are displaying a page from the documentation section? May 31 15:29:08 $_MIDCOM->metadata->get_page_class() == 'documentation' ? May 31 15:29:14 Or something like that? May 31 15:37:21 bergie: Hmm no it isn't. That is returning 'default' for those pages, right? May 31 15:37:46 X-Fade: what do you want to do? May 31 15:38:03 I think the schema used for doc pages is "default", yes May 31 15:38:22 we could easily rename it "docs" or something like that and then it would be in the body class May 31 15:39:04 bergie: I'm working on printing stylesheets. But I want to only use them when in the docs section. May 31 15:40:03 I was looking into head-local.php to change that. But couldn't find the midcom way to do that ;) Other than parsing the url in php that is.. May 31 16:46:29 Does anyone know if google gears supports Opera on Maemo? May 31 16:48:05 <`0660> "Google launched an open source browser extension for IE and Firefox called Google Gears that enables web applications to be available offline." May 31 16:49:28 `0660: Yeah, I read a piece that implied Opera was supported. May 31 16:53:10 `0660: http://www.google.com/intl/en/press/pressrel/gears_20070530.html May 31 16:53:26 <`0660> http://code.google.com/support/bin/answer.py?answer=69201&topic=11629 May 31 16:54:24 `0660: Yes, thank you. I've seen that. However it seems the two links give somewhat contradictory information. May 31 16:56:12 <`0660> opera is probably working on their support but they are not there yet May 31 16:57:35 Sigh. That's too bad. I was really excited to use it on my N800 May 31 16:57:49 not to mention they say linux on x86 only too May 31 16:57:52 <`0660> and even if their full version will support it soon, it probably won't make it in the n800 May 31 16:58:22 Drat. I should have figured at much May 31 16:58:24 konttori? May 31 16:58:27 s/at/as May 31 16:58:30 here! May 31 16:58:33 <`0660> hmm May 31 16:58:39 dinner at 9? May 31 16:58:41 <`0660> it's completely open source May 31 16:58:59 <`0660> so you could probably make it work with minimo May 31 16:59:18 `0660: Does minimo support Firefox extensions? May 31 16:59:23 probably , but because it relies on local filesystem support, it might need some changes May 31 16:59:35 and yeah you'd need opera support too May 31 16:59:52 or firefox compiled :P May 31 17:00:28 <`0660> ramatieg, i don't believe so May 31 17:00:29 tigert: Did you want to ask something? May 31 17:01:09 defor^work: Where did you get the x86 only information? May 31 17:01:22 <`0660> i believe nokia would have to pay opera a lot get them support gears in n800 May 31 17:01:56 <`0660> ramatieg, at least it's dependent on sqlite which means that it needs at least recompilation... May 31 17:02:11 `0660: Why do you think Opera wouldn't do it of their own volition? May 31 17:02:36 <`0660> because they have mouths to feed May 31 17:02:37 `0660: Opera mobile runs on many devices May 31 17:03:18 ramatieg well i cliecked the linux support page http://gears.google.com/?platform=linux and clicked details .. but it also says for toolbar.. so i have no idea May 31 17:03:24 `0660: I suppose Nokia may have to pay if they wanted to use a newer version May 31 17:04:07 <`0660> the browser in n800 is heavily customized if i have understood correctly May 31 17:05:35 Still, I would be surprised if they didn't include it in their 'base' product, and from there I would guess it wouldn't be difficult to port. May 31 17:06:51 <`0660> :) May 31 17:08:23 im still not fans of commercial, although open-source extensions to standards-based internet technologies May 31 17:08:35 a fan/fans May 31 17:10:45 defor^work: I don't follow what you mean. Many standards are driven my commercial interests. I'm not a fan of unilateral standard 'imposition' May 31 17:11:12 defor^work: But more specifically, I think that this whole idea of javascript data store is foolish. May 31 17:11:39 defor^work: And the whole 'rich client' BS. May 31 17:15:31 Their should be an API for Internet services and you write your client however you want (e.g. native application) to interface. Why would you try to jam applications on top of the browser? Why would you choose to write a 'heavy' application in a language like _javascript_? I think Apple 'gets' this (c.f. Their Google maps client on iPhone) May 31 17:16:24 how do you know how google maps is done on iphone May 31 17:17:03 could just as well be js. the widgets most probably are May 31 17:17:04 Steve Jobs describes it at the D5 conference May 31 17:17:15 http://d5.allthingsd.com/20070531/video-steve-jobs-and-bill-gates-together-part-1-of-7/ May 31 17:17:26 It may not be part 1 May 31 17:17:46 but I'm pretty sure it's 1-3 May 31 17:18:41 Might be somewhere in part 3. Sorry I can't remember May 31 17:31:44 evening May 31 17:37:52 google-gears source code is huge. svn checkout stalled after 103 M May 31 18:17:44 ping May 31 18:17:50 can someone help me use apt-get? May 31 18:18:09 i'm trying to use 2 repositories and i need different proxies to get to them May 31 18:22:08 timeless: http://www.die.net/doc/linux/man/man5/apt.conf.5.html May 31 18:30:39 ok May 31 18:30:45 i have foopy.apt.conf May 31 18:30:46 it has May 31 18:31:01 Acquire::http::host.name::Proxy "http://127.1:8000/"; May 31 18:31:03 and May 31 18:31:30 Acquire::http::other.host::Proxy "http://blah:8080/"; May 31 18:31:54 i also have foopy.sources.list which has May 31 18:32:34 deb http://repository.maemo.org/sardine unstable main non-free May 31 18:32:45 actually, host.name was repository.maemo.org May 31 18:35:21 when i do apt-get -c foopy.apt.conf update, i get May 31 18:35:32 Failed to fetch http://repository.maemo.org/sardine/dists/unstable/Release.gpg Could not resolve 'repository.maemo.org' May 31 18:36:18 timeless: is it inside scratchbox? May 31 18:36:23 ubuntu feisty? May 31 18:36:31 it's inside a very strange distro May 31 18:37:24 it'd be great if i could get apt-get to give me debugging spew or to at least mention what it's thinking May 31 18:37:34 Is 127.1 a valid IP address? May 31 18:37:39 absolutley May 31 18:37:49 although that isn't spelled correctly :) May 31 18:38:08 timeless@boffo:~$ telnet 127.1 22 May 31 18:38:08 Trying 127.0.0.1... May 31 18:38:08 Connected to 127.1. May 31 18:38:08 Escape character is '^]'. May 31 18:38:08 SSH-1.99-OpenSSH_4.4 May 31 18:38:17 it's a shorthand May 31 18:38:36 timeless: http://lists.scratchbox.org/pipermail/scratchbox-users/2007-March/000906.html May 31 18:39:20 i'm not in scratchbox May 31 18:39:57 hello all again.. I'm trying to get started devloping and compiling... if i understand this right, I need to install a custom distribution as a full os to the development station, is this correct? or can I do all of my work on a stock debian install with certain development resources built? May 31 18:39:59 timeless: and do you have an http_proxy set? that will override the entries in the config iirc. May 31 18:40:07 blah is in /etc/hosts and is basically a symbolic name for the system vm host May 31 18:40:26 timriker: not set :) May 31 18:41:41 if you set http_proxy to http://localhost:8080/ does that one work? May 31 18:44:41 when i used something like that, it seemed to work May 31 18:47:07 ok May 31 18:47:14 my problem was in the few lines i pasted :) May 31 18:47:33 specifically the Acquire lines have ::Proxy in the wrong place May 31 19:15:45 hi there May 31 19:16:22 need a little help May 31 19:16:46 maemo mapper is frozen, and I can't even kill it with a kill -9 under osso-xterm May 31 19:16:57 anyone had a similar issue in the past ? May 31 19:17:02 thanks for any help May 31 19:48:53 ey, do you know if I can use the GPS included on the N95 as a bluetooth GPS for the n800/maemo-mapper? May 31 19:49:54 ferulo: I would like to know that too, as I am getting one next week :) May 31 19:50:28 what was that command line utility that show you bluetooth capabilities? May 31 20:03:48 X-Fade: it seems that is not possible May 31 20:06:11 ferulo: Maybe if you write some series60 tool that communicates over bt ;) May 31 20:06:25 yeah, there is an api for that May 31 20:06:33 But the bt chip in the N95 is not that great either. May 31 20:06:36 I hope I can access that from python May 31 20:08:04 If you can emulate a com device via bt, it should be doable? May 31 20:08:59 And talk NMEA over that.. May 31 20:09:02 I have no idea of S60 APIs :( May 31 20:11:06 ferulo: http://forum.nokia.com/main/resources/technologies/location_based_services.html May 31 20:14:22 X-Fade: combined with: May 31 20:14:25 http://forum.nokia.com/info/sw.nokia.com/id/64a34a8d-e65b-4a42-b9ae-dfcf5fe00426/S60_Platform_Bluetooth_API_Developers_Guide_v2_0_en.pdf.html May 31 20:14:34 you probably can "export" it May 31 20:16:42 It should even know NMEA... EPositionFieldNMEASentences May 31 22:41:36 new os and skype june 12?????how valide is this.... May 31 22:41:42 nokia peeps, validate May 31 22:45:33 source? May 31 22:47:16 internet tableteer i think May 31 22:47:25 but i read it on internettablettalk May 31 22:47:44 http://www.internettablettalk.com/forums/showthread.php?p=50315#post50315 May 31 22:47:58 unless its like june fools day May 31 22:51:41 guess you'll have to wait for it May 31 22:55:49 i want to be special and get it nowwwwwwww Jun 01 00:05:36 there is no qt2hildon tool, per chance? Jun 01 00:05:56 not really Jun 01 00:06:03 i guess it will be Jun 01 00:06:12 it will *never be Jun 01 00:06:18 too diferent stuff Jun 01 00:06:48 ok. is there a way to use some gtk gui designer thingy with hildon? Jun 01 00:07:25 * dalibor would like to avoid writing things from scrath Jun 01 00:08:53 i.e. ... glade Jun 01 00:13:42 ah .. gazpacho Jun 01 00:16:03 yes Jun 01 00:16:12 glade and gazpacho ;-O Jun 01 00:16:14 =-P Jun 01 00:16:19 hildon is made with GTK Jun 01 00:16:25 and there is a plugin for those Jun 01 00:58:51 gazpacho and glade makes life easier? **** ENDING LOGGING AT Fri Jun 01 02:59:58 2007