**** BEGIN LOGGING AT Fri Jun 29 02:59:56 2007
Jun 29 05:36:03 <Tadafumi> hi
Jun 29 05:38:58 <KaylaKaze> saying hi to anyone in particular? if not, then hi :-)
Jun 29 05:50:13 <Tadafumi> I have a problem with Laika plugins and Eclipse3.2.2. I tried http://www.cs.tut.fi/~laika/update/ as a remote site to install plugins and then got an error msg "com.nomovok.poedit.feature (1.0.0) requires feature "fi.tut.cs.laika.feature (2.1.0)""
Jun 29 05:51:05 <ericz> KaylaKaze, have you got your 770 yet?
Jun 29 05:53:01 <KaylaKaze> nope
Jun 29 05:53:09 <KaylaKaze> I do have the laika plugin though
Jun 29 05:53:27 <Tadafumi> Does anyone use Laika/Eclipse for maemo development? I have no idea how to install the plugin :(
Jun 29 05:53:48 <KaylaKaze> you need to also install the C/C++ plugin from the Calisto repository
Jun 29 05:54:53 <KaylaKaze> it's called CDT or something like that, you can't miss it if you look there for plugins too
Jun 29 05:55:27 <KaylaKaze> ericz: I did get about 33% to 50% done on my D&D character sheet  for the 770 when I get it though.
Jun 29 05:55:39 <ericz> haha, i saw you had people testing it
Jun 29 05:56:02 <KaylaKaze> I just wanted to make sure it got laid out right and would work in opera
Jun 29 05:56:06 <Tadafumi> I installed CDT3.1.1 before Laika.
Jun 29 05:56:39 <KaylaKaze> then ignore the error message. It's probably just a notification.
Jun 29 05:57:00 <KaylaKaze> I've got the whole 1st page of the official character sheet done. I don't have the PHP backend done for saving and loading yet though.
Jun 29 05:57:39 <KaylaKaze> but it autocalculates and stuff. It's pretty cool for a webpage
Jun 29 05:58:14 <ericz> saving it flat file or mysql?
Jun 29 05:58:44 <KaylaKaze> mysql
Jun 29 05:59:03 <KaylaKaze> the saving and loading will be easy. It's configuring the security that's a pain
Jun 29 05:59:16 <ericz> oh?
Jun 29 05:59:56 <KaylaKaze> well, not really too much, I guess. But I probably should have some form of user authorization
Jun 29 06:00:23 <ericz> .htaccess is easy enough
Jun 29 06:00:41 <ericz> i assume opera on the 770 can handle that :P
Jun 29 06:00:42 <Tadafumi> I got err msg "Requested operation cannot be performed because it would invalidate the current configuration. See details for more information.
Jun 29 06:00:42 <Tadafumi>   com.nomovok.poedit.feature (1.0.0) requires feature "fi.tut.cs.laika.feature (2.1.0)"."
Jun 29 06:00:47 <KaylaKaze> I've never used it
Jun 29 06:00:56 <ericz> tis easy!
Jun 29 06:01:10 <Tadafumi> Requested operation cannot be performed because it would invalidate the current configuration. See details for more information.
Jun 29 06:01:10 <Tadafumi>   com.nomovok.poedit.feature (1.0.0) requires feature "fi.tut.cs.laika.feature (2.1.0)".
Jun 29 06:01:24 <KaylaKaze> you must have screwed somethign up then :-P Eclipse and Laika were like the smoothest part of my environment setup
Jun 29 06:02:12 <KaylaKaze> well, I was thinking as long as I have this kickass page done, I might as well allow people to register and have their own charater storage depot
Jun 29 06:02:21 <Tadafumi> Err msg prevents Laika installation. No scratchbox preference in Eclipse :(
Jun 29 06:02:41 <ericz> ah, that'd probably do better with more than just htaccess, haha
Jun 29 06:03:25 <Tadafumi> I will try Laika stuff again from scratch. Thanks
Jun 29 06:03:35 <KaylaKaze> well, I've was working on another site these last few days and got some practive at using user security and such.
Jun 29 06:03:44 <KaylaKaze> Tadafumi: It's worth it
Jun 29 06:04:13 <ericz> i made a big user system where you register, get an email, activate, and it's just a place for users to store notes.. uses php/mysql
Jun 29 06:04:24 <ericz> http://remotenotes.yi.org/
Jun 29 06:05:22 <KaylaKaze> I read some code on how to do the authorization emails and such. Seems easy enough
Jun 29 06:06:33 <KaylaKaze> You don't play Warmachine by any chance, do you?
Jun 29 06:06:41 <ericz> nope
Jun 29 06:17:33 <Viza> i searched all over but couldn't find the answer to this,
Jun 29 06:17:47 <Viza> i noticed that the predictive text picked up on my ssh password
Jun 29 06:17:56 <Viza> is it possible to clear the predictive text cache?
Jun 29 06:20:50 <ericz> picked up your ssh password? is it... like a common word that would be in the dictionary???
Jun 29 06:21:00 <ericz> or once you type something so often, it just starts remembering?
Jun 29 06:22:02 <Viza> i believe the latter
Jun 29 06:24:01 <KaylaKaze> I read a post about that problem
Jun 29 06:25:00 <Viza> hm seems a good idea would be to use public-key auth
Jun 29 06:25:12 <Viza> well, more of a workaround
Jun 29 07:18:10 <jani> g'morning
Jun 29 07:21:29 <N800> hello
Jun 29 07:39:08 <jani> quite a stir in python thread in devel list ..
Jun 29 07:40:26 <dpb_> woah
Jun 29 07:41:19 <osfameron> where!  where!
Jun 29 07:42:54 <jani> maemo-developers mailinglist ..
Jun 29 07:43:23 <jani> well, its not a flamefest but people still bashing .. thats imho thou.
Jun 29 07:44:03 <osfameron> ah, I don't think i'm subscribed, I'll google for archive
Jun 29 07:44:47 <osfameron> the "New release of" thread ?
Jun 29 07:44:54 <jani> yes
Jun 29 07:45:17 <jani> people started to complain about repositories and even uktube gets mentioned there =))
Jun 29 08:11:09 <cy-> yoyo
Jun 29 08:52:44 <konttori> jani: yeah. So odd. Anyway, I'm all for install files having multiple repos, although, at the same time, for the system as a whole, it would be better to keep as much hosted by nokia as possible. That way availability is good and nokia should be able to make good download statistics.
Jun 29 08:52:58 <konttori> I would love to have those statistics public as well if possible
Jun 29 09:14:36 <keesj> konttori: last time I asked they them selves did not know how much download there where. it was a story about "mirrors and other BS"
Jun 29 09:15:28 <konttori> keesj: really? I mean, how hard can tracking that sort of stuff be: One php / alternative and a database.
Jun 29 09:15:40 <konttori> Would take a few minutes of my time to do.
Jun 29 09:16:12 <jani> i agree
Jun 29 09:16:31 <jani> but then again, everything is political in big companies ..
Jun 29 09:16:38 <keesj> garage keepdoes s track of the downloads
Jun 29 09:16:46 <konttori> you put the install link to load a php, which first stores the log and then either: a) forwards you to the actual file or b) retrieves the file and binary writes it to the client.
Jun 29 09:17:40 <konttori> as nokia, I would choose a) to be on the same legal level as for providing the link in the first place.
Jun 29 09:17:54 <keesj> konttori: yes and in your postinstall you add a wget http://my_server.com/install_status=sdaf
Jun 29 09:18:17 <keesj> or upgraded=true times played = 100
Jun 29 09:20:00 <keesj> even better just have a fake dns running for counters
Jun 29 09:20:16 <konttori> yeah, although I don't like calling home that much. You would at least ask the user if it's ok to call home and tell that kind of information
Jun 29 09:21:48 <konttori> Also, if Nokia would make it easier to get stuff to extras, it would be even easier for nokia to track that kind of stuff (updates as well).
Jun 29 09:25:08 <keesj> perhaps where should be little people from mars who do free packaging if you hava registered a garage project and put the code in there
Jun 29 09:30:38 <konttori> yeah, well, there could be a possibility to upload the project files to extras repo in the project files section.
Jun 29 09:31:16 <sbaturzio> Aloha!
Jun 29 09:31:17 <keesj> I have been doing kernel and embedded development at work for the last few month. I think that what will give me the moost joy will be to get a OE/e17 distro running on the 770
Jun 29 09:31:31 <konttori> is everyone waiting fofr the firmware or how come discussion is so muted today?
Jun 29 09:31:43 <keesj> iphone
Jun 29 09:31:50 <cy-> anyone have any luck with kismet/n800 ?
Jun 29 09:31:56 <konttori> keesj: of course!
Jun 29 09:32:12 <konttori> and e17 distro sounds like great thing.
Jun 29 09:32:41 <keesj> but I really feel like openmoko lately, a device that comes with a screwdriver !
Jun 29 09:32:52 <inz> keesj, and guitar pick!
Jun 29 09:33:09 <konttori> and accelerometers! .. . and video accelerator (with drivers as well)
Jun 29 09:33:13 <keesj> inz:  yes , thats just pure love!
Jun 29 09:33:43 <keesj> but I really want the wifi
Jun 29 09:33:54 <konttori> it has wifi, doesn't it?
Jun 29 09:34:29 <keesj> http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Neo1973 The Mass Market Neo 1973) is on schedule to go on sale in October. 802.11 b/g WiFi
Jun 29 09:35:05 <keesj> other model don't have wifi *I think*
Jun 29 09:35:30 <konttori> ok, so the current deveoper model doesn't have the wifi yet then
Jun 29 09:35:33 <rwhitby> GTA01 (July 9), no wifi.  GTA02 (Oct++), wifi.
Jun 29 09:35:39 <keesj> the fun part is that our devices also use the samsung SoC's
Jun 29 09:36:13 <konttori> what's soc?
Jun 29 09:36:15 * rwhitby has 2 x GTA01 (Bv3 and Bv4) P0 developer units.
Jun 29 09:36:23 <inz> konttori, System on Chip
Jun 29 09:36:55 <konttori> ok, which translates in practice to ... what?
Jun 29 09:37:18 <rwhitby> CPU plus lots of other stuff on the same piece of silicon
Jun 29 09:37:40 <keesj> same cpu(arm) kernel, bugs
Jun 29 09:38:53 <inz> konttori, http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/System-on-a-chip (obligatory wikipedia link)
Jun 29 09:40:52 <konttori> all right. So, neo just has a lesser chip as they need a separate gfx accelerator chip.
Jun 29 09:41:15 <rwhitby> lesser chip than what?
Jun 29 09:41:23 <konttori> than on n800
Jun 29 09:42:16 <keesj> they all miss 800x480 + good thumb keyboard
Jun 29 09:43:06 <rwhitby> yes, n800 has gfx accelerator chip, but Nokia didn't pay for the drivers so it's not used to it's full ability.
Jun 29 09:43:16 <keesj> still the thumb keyboard is not great for vi / xterm stuff.
Jun 29 09:44:35 <gla55_> the 3d chip makes for nice gfx on e90 and n95.. (which i think have the same chip..)
Jun 29 09:44:43 <keesj> inz do you rember who did the vte keyboard hack?
Jun 29 09:45:35 <inz> keesj, don't, I was supposed to do mine at some point, but I "forgot"
Jun 29 09:47:52 <keesj> I would like to experiment with such a keyboard and a xterminal of a few lines at the top. or perpahs a normal xterminal + the last line also displayed at the top
Jun 29 09:48:21 <lardman> My understanding was that Nokia were discussion the matter of the PowerVR MBX with imgtec/Ti/etc. Though my impression may be wrong
Jun 29 09:48:32 <lardman> s/discussion/discussing
Jun 29 09:49:13 <konttori> I have the same feeling
Jun 29 09:50:13 <lardman> Was interesting to read the omap ml, looks like someone's improved the idle consumption for the n800
Jun 29 09:50:49 <keesj> perhaps its' something that can be put on the roadmap:"know what we can expect regarding: feature X, where X = jazelle,3d,wifi drivers" just knowing what to expect would be nice IMHO
Jun 29 09:51:32 <lardman> I'd like them on the wishlist, but have brought it up before and don't really want to annoy people by going on about it
Jun 29 09:51:52 <lardman> where my thing was IVA & PowerVR MBX
Jun 29 09:51:53 <konttori> otoh: it would spoil the surprise if we knew too much beforehand. Also it might raise false expectations.
Jun 29 09:52:56 <lardman> Where was that code for switching to Jazelle mode?
Jun 29 09:53:07 <lardman> That I saw mention of on the maemo-developers ml
Jun 29 09:54:13 <konttori> somebody got carried away with the wishlist: http://www.internettablettalk.com/forums/showthread.php?p=54740#post54740
Jun 29 09:55:02 <lardman> "And a fridge, a toaster and DVD player." :)
Jun 29 09:55:16 <gwak> and a babysitter would be nice as well
Jun 29 09:56:15 <konttori> I do totally hope that the 29 will be realized in the firmware. (29. SDHC support.)
Jun 29 09:57:33 <gwak> yep my wish is for a) faster SDHC access b) usb host mode - so i can dump pics from my digicam
Jun 29 09:57:35 <inz> konttori, I find the items on the wishlist: "opera 9" and "open source browser" highly utopious
Jun 29 09:58:08 <inz> konttori, that is, if they want both
Jun 29 09:58:13 <konttori> ;)
Jun 29 09:58:45 <konttori> I think that's a collected wishlist. Anyway, I don't think either of them will happen. But that's just me.
Jun 29 09:58:48 <lardman> I'd expect the usb host, larger SD card support, etc. to be included simply because they are available now and therefore don't need much work
Jun 29 09:59:38 <zuh> Last I heard, usb host mode did need work
Jun 29 09:59:56 <konttori> except if shhc needs nokia to pay for licenses.
Jun 29 10:00:02 <zuh> (SDHC doesn't, I've been using it for ages without problems)
Jun 29 10:00:02 <konttori> sdhc
Jun 29 10:00:03 <Veggen> gwak: pics from digicam would be nice. I got dcraw to run on the N800, though, but it was quite painful ;)
Jun 29 10:00:15 <Veggen> (memory hog, really)
Jun 29 10:00:31 <lardman> zuh: oh right
Jun 29 10:00:41 <Veggen> hmm, meeting.
Jun 29 10:00:41 <keesj> 23. 3gp video capable. ?? it's already working
Jun 29 10:01:58 <gla55_> streaming 3gp too?
Jun 29 10:02:04 <inz> Veggen, maybe the exif headers and image uploading could be doable
Jun 29 10:02:07 <gla55_> i think thats what youtube mobile is
Jun 29 10:02:32 <inz> Veggen, exif headers including the thumbnail
Jun 29 10:03:38 <gwak> Veggen,Inz: i just found the memory card access painfully slow with biggish jpg
Jun 29 10:04:10 <lardman> zuh: What's the problem with usb host atm?
Jun 29 10:04:59 <lardman> ah, probably this then: http://linux.omap.com/pipermail/linux-omap-open-source/2007-June/010402.html
Jun 29 10:07:21 <keesj> I did mesure about 3.5 volt.
Jun 29 10:08:46 <keesj> the problem I have is that otg did rely on a special cable (with pin 5 grounded). and the patch author is saying that the patch only works in otg mode.
Jun 29 10:09:49 <keesj> but the last time I did it i compiled it with only otg mode and I was no allowed to perform s echo host > mode
Jun 29 10:09:50 <lardman> ok, so not quite as working as I'd thought then
Jun 29 10:11:14 <keesj> lardman: I stopped looking at it because I could not figure out how to enable verbose debugging.
Jun 29 10:14:08 <keesj> gla55_: I don't know about streaming , I donloaded self-made movies from met Samsung E730
Jun 29 10:23:23 <lardman> I wonder how Jazelle DBX works, as it's supposed to not natively recognise all instructions. I imagine in must cause an interrupt when it doesn't recognise one and then it can handle it with some microcode
Jun 29 10:31:00 <lardman> microcode is the wrong word isn't it, as that implies something hardcoded on the chip
Jun 29 10:34:03 <lardman> How are unrecognised instructions trapped? Do they cause an interrupt? (this would force the processor out of Jazelle mode, which would be slow(er))
Jun 29 10:40:59 <lardman> Ah, so an undefined instruction trap can be 'hooked'. Wonder if the Jazelle VMZ works in Jazelle mode to save switches (as I assume this is what handles the trap)?
Jun 29 10:41:11 <lardman> Enough talking rubbish to myself, time to do some work
Jun 29 10:51:56 <Feral_Kid> Help... I was having problems with my 770, so I thought I would re-flash... From the boot menu, I select Internal Flash... It starts to boot, then goes back to the Nokia logo and brings me back to the Boot Menu... I just installed os2006-linux-2.6.16+ipv6+ext2+mmc2gb-zImage using flasher-3.0
Jun 29 10:52:16 <Feral_Kid> What can I do know to get back to booting off of flash????
Jun 29 10:54:19 <Feral_Kid> Or should I try some of the other kernels? Like http://armin-warda.de/os2006-linux-2.6.16+ipv6+ext2+mmc2gb-zImage or http://armin-warda.de/os2006-linux-2.6.16+ipv6+ext2+mmc2gb+mmcplus52Mhz-zImage?
Jun 29 10:56:04 <Feral_Kid> And what is the difference between Version 26 and Version 39?
Jun 29 11:02:16 <Feral_Kid> Any sugestions???
Jun 29 11:05:11 <keesj> Feral_Kid: did you install the bootmenu yourself?
Jun 29 11:05:32 <Feral_Kid> Yes
Jun 29 11:05:39 <Feral_Kid> It used to work just fine...
Jun 29 11:06:07 <cy-> Is there a way to get root locally on the n800 without flashing with RD?
Jun 29 11:06:36 <Feral_Kid> Then I went to boot one day, and all I would get was the the boot menu... Made no difference if I booted off the flash or the mmc...
Jun 29 11:07:44 <Feral_Kid> It would start the boot process, but just drop back to the Boot Menu
Jun 29 11:08:17 <chrissturm> cy-: what i did is install dropbear-server and client, then ssh root@localhost , with password rootme
Jun 29 11:08:48 <cy-> chrissturm: I have an sshd running and can ssh in as root
Jun 29 11:09:00 <cy-> perhaps I'm typing the root password wrong on the device's gimpy keyboard ;)
Jun 29 11:09:02 * cy- tries again
Jun 29 11:09:18 <cy-> err yeah
Jun 29 11:09:21 <cy-> su -
Jun 29 11:09:30 <cy-> reports "this applet requires root priviledges!"
Jun 29 11:09:47 <cy-> guess I can change ownership of su
Jun 29 11:10:35 <Feral_Kid> I just tried to load the kernel and got this error: Found device SU-18, hardware revision 1801
Jun 29 11:10:36 <Feral_Kid> NOLO version 0.9.11
Jun 29 11:10:36 <Feral_Kid> Version of 'sw-release': <no version>
Jun 29 11:10:36 <Feral_Kid> Sending kernel image (1354 kB)...
Jun 29 11:10:36 <Feral_Kid> 100% (1354 of 1354 kB, avg. 664 kB/s)
Jun 29 11:10:37 <Feral_Kid> Sending request 0x82 failed: Cannot send after transport endpoint shutdown
Jun 29 11:11:02 <Feral_Kid> Does anyone know what that means?
Jun 29 11:14:06 <cy-> there we go
Jun 29 11:14:52 <chrissturm> wow, claws is a very nice mail client
Jun 29 11:16:24 <Feral_Kid> Is there anyway to blow away the Boot Menu, and just allow for a generic flash boot?
Jun 29 11:19:02 <Feral_Kid> Well, if anyone can help just message me... I need to look around google and see if I can solve this...
Jun 29 11:25:16 <ColdFuzzy> hi :)
Jun 29 11:26:53 <ColdFuzzy> anyone alive?
Jun 29 11:27:39 <gla55_> no
Jun 29 11:28:22 <ColdFuzzy> omg zombies!
Jun 29 11:28:24 <ColdFuzzy> lol
Jun 29 11:28:26 <Feral_Kid> Alive and burnout...
Jun 29 11:28:36 <ColdFuzzy> the living dead :P
Jun 29 11:28:43 <cy-> chrissturm: any luck with Kismet?
Jun 29 11:28:58 <cy-> I have it installed but it seems to stop scanning/capturing packets after about 10 seconds
Jun 29 11:29:11 <cy-> I've come across some forum posts with same problem but no solution
Jun 29 11:29:31 <ColdFuzzy> cy is it because the screen goes in standby?
Jun 29 11:29:45 <cy-> I do not believe so no
Jun 29 11:29:58 <ColdFuzzy> then i don't know :)
Jun 29 11:30:03 <cy-> :)
Jun 29 11:30:06 <cy-> more like :(
Jun 29 11:30:28 <ColdFuzzy> yeah...
Jun 29 11:33:32 <cy-> hmm
Jun 29 11:35:27 <lardman> What would be a relatively simple task that a DSP would like? - I was thinking of jpeg decompression, but perhaps some kind of file compression/decompression would be simpler (I just want a test project to start with)
Jun 29 11:36:18 <kulve> speex compress/decompress
Jun 29 11:36:24 <lardman> The use of iDCT/CDT would be beneficial, as these are built-in instructions and so will show decent improvement (as opposed to my unoptimised c-code)
Jun 29 11:36:36 <kulve> it already has a port to the dsp, but not using dsp gateway
Jun 29 11:36:47 <fatal-> talking about dsp, I'm a bit puzzled, which package contains dspctl?
Jun 29 11:37:03 <lardman> I don;t want to get stuck with something huge, I just want a proof of concept for the time being
Jun 29 11:37:13 <fatal-> I'm not that familiar with dpgk/apt-get, unfortunately
Jun 29 11:37:16 <lardman> fatal-: dspgateway
Jun 29 11:37:33 <lardman> ah, dunno which package though, but the source is available
Jun 29 11:37:53 <fatal-> oh well, I'll have to dig around a bit more, then.
Jun 29 11:37:53 <suihkulokki> lardman: I would think a simple codec designed for dsp's like G.711
Jun 29 11:38:12 <suihkulokki> (ogg is not designed for dsp's so that would be painfull)
Jun 29 11:38:39 <lardman> I have ogg source code, but it's a mountain, plus not much use until we can do audio out
Jun 29 11:39:07 <lardman> g.711 looks sufficiently simple that I won't lose the will to live trying to implement it
Jun 29 11:39:10 <kulve> lardman: that's why I suggested speex. It's ported, so it needs only the dsp gateway interface
Jun 29 11:39:39 <lardman> kulve: When you say ported, to a tms320c55?
Jun 29 11:39:57 <kulve> and for a very simple test there's some ready text pingpong example in the dspgateway sources. And iirc somebody already got it working and pasted instructioins to dev mailing list
Jun 29 11:40:02 <suihkulokki> lardman: did you get the audio api?
Jun 29 11:40:04 <kulve> lardman: yes
Jun 29 11:40:21 <kulve> fatal-: it seems to be osso-dsp-loader
Jun 29 11:40:26 <lardman> kulve: Yes, that was me with the examples, I thought I should actually make it do something useful
Jun 29 11:40:56 <kulve> ok, I though it might have been you, but didn't bother to check ,)
Jun 29 11:40:58 <lardman> suihkulokki: No. I asked for it to be added to the wishlist, and am wading through asm atm too
Jun 29 11:41:18 * lardman would prefer a header file to the asm wading
Jun 29 11:42:19 <kulve> lardman: http://svn.xiph.org/tags/speex-tags/speex-1-2beta2/ti/
Jun 29 11:42:49 <kulve> it's of course in the trunk too..
Jun 29 11:43:07 <kulve> not sure if it has been active lately..
Jun 29 11:43:30 <kulve> hmm.. actually that's not the right url
Jun 29 11:43:34 <fatal-> kulve: hmm. is there such a package for 3.1? :o
Jun 29 11:43:36 <chrissturm> anyone here doing ruby with maemo?
Jun 29 11:44:04 <lardman> kulve: Okay, I'll take a look at that. I wonder how the chap on the gstreamer list got on?
Jun 29 11:44:07 <kulve> fatal-: it's useless in the scratchbox, so it's on the device
Jun 29 11:44:17 <kulve> lardman: AC_ARG_ENABLE(ti-c55x, [  --enable-ti-c55x        Enable support for TI C55X DSP],
Jun 29 11:44:21 <kulve> from configure.ac
Jun 29 11:44:27 <kulve> dunno about gst list..
Jun 29 11:45:03 <kulve> I've seen couple of projects saying, that they'll start doing that for dspgateway, but never heard them since
Jun 29 11:45:51 <Feral_Kid> Is there any firmware that will place a stock initfs on the device and also load a new kernel? I think that part of my problem is that my 770 isn't liking the Boot Menu much...
Jun 29 11:46:12 <kulve> you can flash just those parts from the fiasco
Jun 29 11:46:29 <kulve>   --flash-only <arg>            Flash only certain components
Jun 29 11:46:30 <chrissturm> can i use a bluetooth keyboard with the n800?
Jun 29 11:46:33 <lardman> That worries me a little, I'd like to build up gradually with some successes rather than getting bogged down and losing the will
Jun 29 11:46:39 <lardman> I'll take a look though
Jun 29 11:46:47 <kulve> chrissturm: yes
Jun 29 11:47:04 <chrissturm> ok, lets see if it works with my apple wireless keyboard
Jun 29 11:47:13 <kulve> lardman: yeah, that's probably wise
Jun 29 11:47:32 <chrissturm> maybe i should get myself a foldable keyboard
Jun 29 11:47:37 <fatal-> kulve: "on the device" - meaning what? there is no anykind of .deb of it whatsoever?
Jun 29 11:47:42 <kulve> the g711 would probably be ok. Iirc it can be implemented as an array, so it should be very simple
Jun 29 11:48:05 <kulve> fatal-: it's the deb I mentioned. But I'm not sure if you can actually get it from anywhere..
Jun 29 11:48:48 <lardman> yep, that's the kind of thing that should be quick enough to gain some confidence/experience with any issues
Jun 29 11:49:26 <kulve> lardman: and, since it would be an audio "encoder"/"decoder", it would be easy to move along to a more real codec
Jun 29 11:49:55 <kulve> just remember the byte size ;)
Jun 29 11:50:22 <lardman> kulve: Well perhaps, the normal codecs are only one directional, while anything I write now needs to be 2-directional as it can't output as audio
Jun 29 11:50:31 <lardman> kulve: And byte ordering
Jun 29 11:50:32 <Feral_Kid> Can anyone tell me what this means: Sending request 0x82 failed: Cannot send after transport endpoint shutdown
Jun 29 11:51:08 <Feral_Kid> I used the following: sudo ~/bin/flasher-3.0 -l -b -k os2006-linux-2.6.16-39-1+ipv6+ext2+mmcplus52Mhz-zImage
Jun 29 11:51:17 <kulve> lardman: hmm.. I think normal codecs are 2-directionals.. The mp3 dsp sink is not normal :)
Jun 29 11:51:27 <kulve> even though more powerful..
Jun 29 11:51:39 <lardman> kulve: That does 2d, but only shared memory in one direction and words in both
Jun 29 11:51:47 <chrissturm> the name codec implies that its bidirectional
Jun 29 11:51:59 <lardman> kulve: With that said, encoders will be 2D most of the time unless they get their data from the microphone
Jun 29 11:58:40 <cy-> bummer
Jun 29 11:58:42 <cy-> http://www.internettablettalk.com/forums/archive/index.php/t-5834.html
Jun 29 12:01:51 <kulve> lardman|lunch: http://thesis.evtek.fi/lisaa/kirjasto_print_data.php?lang=eng&id=3909&page=27
Jun 29 12:02:04 <kulve> lardman|lunch: I haven't read the thesis though (yet)
Jun 29 12:16:23 <guardian> where can i download the source code for maemo pad please ?
Jun 29 12:16:30 <guardian> http://maemo.org/downloads/maemopad_1.5.tar.gz
Jun 29 12:16:32 <guardian> link is broken
Jun 29 12:16:56 <KaylaKaze> ooooo! my tablet is supposed to be here today! (a day early!)
Jun 29 12:18:10 <KaylaKaze> you should be able to use apt-get to get it
Jun 29 12:30:20 <chrissturm> is there a webkit port form maemo?
Jun 29 12:31:17 <gla55_> a project that is in planning stage afaik
Jun 29 12:31:43 <gla55_> that is, there is a project at https://garage.maemo.org/projects/maemowebkit/
Jun 29 12:31:52 <gla55_> but hasnt released any files nor i'm aware of any info
Jun 29 12:33:33 <chrissturm> ah, theres even a screenshot: http://www.atoker.com/blog/wp-content/uploads/2007/06/webkit-gtk-n800.jpg
Jun 29 12:33:59 <gla55_> nice
Jun 29 12:34:19 <cy-> damn windowmaker looks like it might be worth installing
Jun 29 12:51:32 <gwak> meh, looks like the update will not come today ;-[  is Finland GMT +2 ?
Jun 29 12:53:37 <ColdFuzzy> i think it's +1
Jun 29 12:53:53 <zuh> +3 in summers
Jun 29 12:53:56 <chrissturm> I think its CET, which is GMT+2
Jun 29 12:54:59 <zuh> (that +3 wasn't celsius ;)
Jun 29 12:55:12 <chrissturm> are these updates just installed via apt, or does it need to flash something ?
Jun 29 12:55:22 <chrissturm> zuh: but it could be quite correct
Jun 29 12:55:47 <gwak> crissturm:new firmware so you must flash your device
Jun 29 12:55:49 <konttori> has anyone seen ssvb for a while?
Jun 29 12:57:00 <chrissturm> and that update is coming really soon now?
Jun 29 12:57:27 <gwak> chris:that was the gossip on internettablettalk ..
Jun 29 12:57:46 <chrissturm> I hope they dump opera
Jun 29 12:57:57 <ColdFuzzy> for what?
Jun 29 12:58:00 <gwak> chris: you can see some crazy wish lists here
Jun 29 12:58:02 <gwak> http://www.internettablettalk.com/forums/showthread.php?p=54740#post54740
Jun 29 12:58:14 <chrissturm> ColdFuzzy: nokia has ported webkit to gtk
Jun 29 12:59:04 <ColdFuzzy> does it have flash?
Jun 29 13:01:19 <gwak> it seems my personal and prof life are both waiting for firmware updates from nokia ;-]
Jun 29 13:01:40 <ColdFuzzy> lol
Jun 29 13:02:07 <ColdFuzzy> it HAS to come out today... they go in vacation, right?
Jun 29 13:02:09 <chrissturm> I am having trouble using my motorola v3xx with the n800
Jun 29 13:02:39 <ColdFuzzy> chrissturm: what exactly?
Jun 29 13:03:04 <chrissturm> ColdFuzzy: i dont know if its related to the phone or the provider
Jun 29 13:03:22 <ColdFuzzy> well... what's wrong
Jun 29 13:03:32 <chrissturm> sec.
Jun 29 13:05:04 <chrissturm> The connection manager just says "network connection error"
Jun 29 13:05:32 <chrissturm> ColdFuzzy: When I look at my mac, where i have it working, theres "drei.at" as phone number
Jun 29 13:05:42 <chrissturm> but the n800 does only allow numbers entered there
Jun 29 13:06:36 <ColdFuzzy> do you have a BT connection to the phone?
Jun 29 13:07:16 <chrissturm> how can i check that?
Jun 29 13:08:22 <ColdFuzzy> turn the BT on the phone and the IT
Jun 29 13:08:34 <ColdFuzzy> and search from the tablet for the phone
Jun 29 13:09:55 <chrissturm> ColdFuzzy: it shows up in the bluetooth devices with a key next to it
Jun 29 13:10:19 <ColdFuzzy> that's the passkey
Jun 29 13:10:35 <ColdFuzzy> it's probably 0000 or something
Jun 29 13:10:45 <chrissturm> yeah, i think they are paired
Jun 29 13:10:55 <chrissturm> (an image of a key)
Jun 29 13:11:33 <ColdFuzzy> open the file manager and see if you can browse the phone
Jun 29 13:12:25 <chrissturm> works
Jun 29 13:13:38 <ColdFuzzy> hmmm well maybe some connections for the internet are wrong
Jun 29 13:14:26 <chrissturm> yeah, I think so too
Jun 29 13:15:29 <ColdFuzzy> try in the control panel
Jun 29 13:15:33 <ColdFuzzy> connectivity
Jun 29 13:15:38 <ColdFuzzy> connections
Jun 29 13:15:43 <ColdFuzzy> edit
Jun 29 13:19:40 <konttori> seems like nokia employees are uncanningly silent today. Hope it means something.
Jun 29 13:19:50 <chrissturm> ColdFuzzy: yeah, but what do I enter there?
Jun 29 13:20:04 <konttori> I've been ill for the whole week, so I might just as well test the new firmware thoroughly now.
Jun 29 13:20:06 <chrissturm> packet data seems to be the right setting for umts?
Jun 29 13:20:24 <ColdFuzzy> yeah
Jun 29 13:20:33 <ColdFuzzy> check all the settings
Jun 29 13:20:51 <chrissturm> what config file does it write to?
Jun 29 13:20:58 <ColdFuzzy> compare them with the one on your mac
Jun 29 13:21:04 <ColdFuzzy> hmmm dunno
Jun 29 13:21:15 <chrissturm> on the mac I have drei.at as phone number and i cant enter that on the n800
Jun 29 13:21:17 <ColdFuzzy> konttori: you have the new firmware?
Jun 29 13:21:21 <konttori> Nope
Jun 29 13:21:45 <chrissturm> hmm, i could just wait for the new firmware
Jun 29 13:21:46 <konttori> But in case nokia would release it, I would happily (and sneezingly ) test it
Jun 29 13:21:52 <ColdFuzzy> chrissturm: i mean the connection settings... don't know where they are on the mac
Jun 29 13:22:16 <ColdFuzzy> konttori: a LOT of people would ;)
Jun 29 13:22:37 <chrissturm> after release is a bit late for testing :)
Jun 29 13:23:22 <ColdFuzzy> i'm sure there'll be enough bugs anyway :D
Jun 29 13:23:55 <konttori> Well, the last test is the end user testing. The one after product has been delivered. That's the real test for a device (...program or pretty much anything)
Jun 29 13:24:19 <cy-> Any ideas what's up with this rumor I keep seeing on forums about a new version of the OS for the n800?
Jun 29 13:24:25 <chrissturm> I got my n800 yesterday, and I must say it doesnt look very polished
Jun 29 13:24:31 <cy-> Just keep running across little hints that it's coming soon but I haven't seen anything confirmed
Jun 29 13:25:00 <konttori> chrissturm: It's a bit too much of a hacker device still.
Jun 29 13:25:01 <ColdFuzzy> well no one knows
Jun 29 13:25:11 <cy-> ColdFuzzy: apparently not, heh
Jun 29 13:25:36 <ColdFuzzy> i'm not sure if those rumours are based on actual "inside info"
Jun 29 13:25:44 <trevarthan> Has anyone tried running shtoom under maemo?
Jun 29 13:25:53 <trevarthan> Seems like it would make a good sip phone...
Jun 29 13:25:53 <gwak> chriss:what bit do you not find polished?
Jun 29 13:26:01 <chrissturm> the bundled apps suck. I replaced the mail client with claws, and it works much better
Jun 29 13:26:08 <Okko> cy-: i think they're mostly based on the skype announcement and a blurry screenshot of a staring image with version numbers in it. :)
Jun 29 13:26:17 <Okko> staring->starting
Jun 29 13:26:29 <gwak> gwak:yea the mail client is crap - the rss app is worse
Jun 29 13:26:39 <ColdFuzzy> well they say that the new firmware will have a new mail client
Jun 29 13:27:01 <Sho_> cy-: Nokia originally announced Skype for "1H07", and the summer holidays in Fi start today or tomorrow
Jun 29 13:27:11 <cy-> trevarthan: heh
Jun 29 13:27:12 <Sho_> cy-: So the expectation was it would get released prior to the holidays
Jun 29 13:27:29 <cy-> trevarthan: I'm really hoping to get a decent SIP/IAX2 client
Jun 29 13:27:51 <chrissturm> what about ekiga, does it use too many gnome libs?
Jun 29 13:27:52 <cy-> trevarthan: Gizmo has some "secondary account" settings for "Asterisk" but I haven't had any luck getting it to login to my asterisk server
Jun 29 13:28:04 <cy-> Sho_: woot.. would be nice
Jun 29 13:28:36 <gwak> cy-:do you use your asterisk server for home use?
Jun 29 13:28:58 <chrissturm> gwak: one thing that i really dont get is why its so hard to copy/paste text
Jun 29 13:29:23 <cy-> gwak: I use a few asterisk servers.. one for the office, one at home and one for web apps
Jun 29 13:29:41 <cy-> gwak: but I'd just like to use the n800 for the home server
Jun 29 13:29:46 <cy-> gwak: on the LAN internally
Jun 29 13:30:13 <chrissturm> I have the feeling that sip doesnt work so nice for a mobile device
Jun 29 13:30:24 <chrissturm> skype is much better at working with custom nat setups
Jun 29 13:31:15 <gwak> chrisstrum:i agree with your criticisms so far ..
Jun 29 13:31:23 <cy-> I agree too
Jun 29 13:31:28 <cy-> Though I want to use my asterisk server :P
Jun 29 13:31:31 <ColdFuzzy> because skype can't be stopped by firewalls
Jun 29 13:31:33 <cy-> an IAX client would be ideal
Jun 29 13:32:46 <chrissturm> gwak: I wanted to get a maemo device for years, so i dont want to badtalk it. But I am also not impressed with the overall performance.
Jun 29 13:33:12 <gwak> chrisstrum:do you have a n800 or 700 ?
Jun 29 13:33:17 <chrissturm> n800
Jun 29 13:33:55 <chrissturm> its better now, but the old mail client always managed to drag down the whole system
Jun 29 13:34:17 <gwak> christstrum:i imagine a lot of your criticisms will be fixed by Nokia or the community (hopefully)
Jun 29 13:34:28 <inz> chris, the default mail client is a piece-of-shit
Jun 29 13:34:52 <chrissturm> what do you guys use for mail? I now use claws and its nice
Jun 29 13:35:16 <chrissturm> I think what I'd like to have is a list of 3rd party repos and recommended software
Jun 29 13:35:33 <ColdFuzzy> there is on maemo.org
Jun 29 13:36:00 <ColdFuzzy> i'm more excited about ubuntu mobile actually
Jun 29 13:36:10 <chrissturm> will ubuntu mobile work with maemo devices?
Jun 29 13:36:21 <ColdFuzzy> yeah
Jun 29 13:36:30 <trevarthan> cy-: I was looking at gizmo yesterday. It requires that you connect from the asterisk machine to a proxy on the internet just to make a local call from the n800 over wifi directly to the asterisk server on your network. That's not SIP. That's silly.
Jun 29 13:37:18 <cy-> Silly indeed wtf
Jun 29 13:38:16 <cy-> ubuntu mobile
Jun 29 13:38:16 <cy-> crazy
Jun 29 13:38:20 <cy-> first I've heard of it
Jun 29 13:38:36 <trevarthan> I need to learn to package python apps as debs. No autoconf. How does that work?
Jun 29 13:39:10 <suihkulokki> last I heard ubuntu "mobile" meant small intel-based pc:s that usually run vista ;)
Jun 29 13:40:32 <ColdFuzzy> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MobileAndEmbedded
Jun 29 13:40:48 <chrissturm> #ubuntu-mobile
Jun 29 13:41:17 <ColdFuzzy> yeah
Jun 29 13:41:26 <inz> Cold, it's (currently) targeted at intel MID devices
Jun 29 13:42:40 <ColdFuzzy> yeah, but it's using maemo and is OSS... so... ;)
Jun 29 13:43:11 <chrissturm> they dont target the n800
Jun 29 13:43:19 <ColdFuzzy> a port to arm will surely happen
Jun 29 13:43:40 <chrissturm> maybe, but the ubuntu mobile project is sponsored by intel
Jun 29 13:43:56 <gwak> has nokia said anything about opening up the drivers for the 770?
Jun 29 13:44:18 <ColdFuzzy> it's still opensource, no matter who's sponsoring
Jun 29 13:44:18 <chrissturm> is the n800 / n770 firmware properitary?
Jun 29 13:44:21 <Dr_Nunim> My day just got a lot better, my 770 will be here soon!
Jun 29 13:44:50 <ColdFuzzy> no, it's OSS too
Jun 29 13:45:04 <ColdFuzzy> just some drivers as far as i know are closed
Jun 29 13:45:21 <inz> And applications
Jun 29 13:45:25 <inz> And system services
Jun 29 13:46:05 <ColdFuzzy> apps != OS ;)
Jun 29 13:46:12 <cy-> http://jkontherun.blogs.com/jkontherun/2007/06/skype-on-the-no.html
Jun 29 13:46:23 <cy-> ^^ "skype won't be available for download for the n800 until sometime in july"
Jun 29 13:46:37 <inz> Cold, the question was about firmware, not just "OS"
Jun 29 13:46:53 <ColdFuzzy> cy-: says, some guy in a blog ;)
Jun 29 13:46:58 <cy-> heh true dat
Jun 29 13:47:38 <pdz> > Yea, I offer but I told her that I  have to ask Maureen if
Jun 29 13:48:36 <pdz> whoops! (misplaced putty right click!)
Jun 29 13:51:27 <keesj> I have the same problem when I use the gnome terminal control-mouse button paste!
Jun 29 13:51:30 <keesj> pasts
Jun 29 13:51:46 <keesj> pastes
Jun 29 13:55:18 <lardman> kulve: Thanks for the link. I don;t know suomi unfortunately even if I could get the thesis
Jun 29 13:59:24 <cy-> hahaha wtf
Jun 29 13:59:27 <cy-> why?? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1njdOgxeP3I
Jun 29 14:01:11 <kulve> lardman: ah, sorry, I though I would be in english.. Sorry about that..
Jun 29 14:01:31 <konttori> cy-: actually, not that bad idea if you really need something like that.
Jun 29 14:01:38 <cy-> ....
Jun 29 14:01:43 <konttori> otow: I would rather use bt kb
Jun 29 14:01:43 <cy-> uhhh
Jun 29 14:01:44 <cy-> I guess
Jun 29 14:01:45 <cy-> heh
Jun 29 14:01:53 <kulve> lardman: well, I'm going to read it and I can give out all the interesting details, if there is any :)
Jun 29 14:02:05 <konttori> well, for example if he needs to connect camera to the device... or something else that uses usb
Jun 29 14:05:29 <ColdFuzzy> we'll have host mode in the next update or not?
Jun 29 14:05:53 <gwak> this weekend i m building a case out of a moleskin book
Jun 29 14:06:02 <gwak> the dimensions are perfect
Jun 29 14:06:21 <chrissturm> hmm, how can I set the AT commands that the n800 sends to the mobile?
Jun 29 14:06:46 <lardman> kulve: It would be interesting to see an example using dspgateway, but I don;t think there's anything too hard about it. Rather the DSP-side code is probably the hard bit to make fast
Jun 29 14:07:06 <ColdFuzzy> ummm guys...
Jun 29 14:07:08 <ColdFuzzy> OS 2007 edición v. 2.2006.51-6 is available now!
Jun 29 14:07:21 <gwak> where?
Jun 29 14:07:30 <konttori> sweet
Jun 29 14:07:39 <cy-> WHAT?
Jun 29 14:08:01 <inz> That's like ancient
Jun 29 14:08:03 <konttori> isn't that the old version?
Jun 29 14:08:16 <cy-> yeah wtf
Jun 29 14:08:20 <gwak> i see nothing on maemo.org
Jun 29 14:08:34 <konttori> correct one is probably 6-2007-something ... if it comes today
Jun 29 14:08:54 <kulve> lardman: I compiled the dspgaway long time ago (before 770 was out) on omap1510 and it wasn't hard, like you say.
Jun 29 14:09:38 <kulve> lardman: but it doesn't often matter even if you dsp code is slow, as long as it's fast enough to e.g. decode audio in realtime.
Jun 29 14:09:42 <lardman> kulve: Likewise it's quite easy to make the examples work (on the N800, the 770 is a different story imo), I just want to produce a demo of something useful to get people interested in using it
Jun 29 14:09:57 <lardman> kulve: True, as long as some work is taken off the ARM
Jun 29 14:10:29 <kulve> yeah
Jun 29 14:10:52 <lardman> ~lart ColdFuzzy for the false alarm
Jun 29 14:10:52 * infobot takes large quantities of Krispy Kream donuts and stuffs them one after another down ColdFuzzy's throat until ColdFuzzy puts on 150lbs for the false alarm
Jun 29 14:11:05 <lardman> ;)
Jun 29 14:11:07 <gwak> hehe
Jun 29 14:11:32 <konttori> apparently update wizard has been updated to a new version.
Jun 29 14:11:47 <gwak> kont:is that on the nokia.com site?
Jun 29 14:12:09 <lardman> http://nds1.nokia.com/files/support/global/phones/software/Nokia_Internet_Tablet_Software_Update_Wizard.exe
Jun 29 14:12:15 <kulve> lardman: the dsp isn't that hard. Too bad, there's not a single open source project for it..
Jun 29 14:12:36 <lardman> kulve: Well there's the dspgateway, or do you mean using it?
Jun 29 14:12:43 <kulve> yeah, using it
Jun 29 14:12:54 <lardman> true, perhaps that could change
Jun 29 14:12:57 <kulve> maybe the projects are a bit boring, since they are mostly calculation (codecs etc), no fancy UI etc..
Jun 29 14:13:32 <lardman> also normal c code will run on any processor, while the dsp code is only for the dsp (due to the dsp-isms), which reduces the number of interested parties
Jun 29 14:13:35 <suihkulokki> naah, just anyone who learns the dsp tend's to get hired to work on propiertary dsp stuff ;)
Jun 29 14:14:19 <kulve> lardman: when do you start the garage project on dspg711? I'm going to follow it closely ;)
Jun 29 14:14:27 <lardman> konttori: Is the download wizard a binary that grabs an image from the web, or does it come with one?
Jun 29 14:14:59 <lardman> kulve: Will do, assuming my gf doesn't kill me over the weekend for ignoring her and using the computer too much! ;)
Jun 29 14:15:01 * Jaffa has no windows box so will be dependent on a Maemo.org firmware
Jun 29 14:16:36 <kulve> lardman: my summer vacation is starting next week, so I'm mostly afk during the june, but promise to test your code often after that :)
Jun 29 14:16:45 <kulve> july
Jun 29 14:18:31 <lardman> kulve: I'll get started on something. I've written a test harness for the jpeg code I thought I'd write, but have a feeling that's a bit of a big thing to bite off as the first go
Jun 29 14:18:48 <Jaffa> lardman/konttori: FWIW, the Last-Modified date on the update.exe is 8th May 2007.
Jun 29 14:19:18 <lardman> Jaffa: Ah, probably not anything new then
Jun 29 14:19:50 <lardman> Jaffa: Perhaps it just works now (I tried it a while back and it didn't want to work for me)
Jun 29 14:19:51 <cy-> yeah nothing new
Jun 29 14:19:53 <cy-> http://www.nokiausa.com/link?cid=PLAIN_TEXT_189093
Jun 29 14:22:10 <konttori> Jaffa: Just read that from forum. Should not believe those ;)
Jun 29 14:22:17 <Jaffa> Nope :)
Jun 29 14:22:29 <konttori> http://www.internettablettalk.com/forums/showthread.php?p=54805#post54805
Jun 29 14:28:03 <lardman> have a nice weekend chaps
Jun 29 14:30:28 <bstock> so i flashed 2006.3 on my 770, since then if i have it closed up when it's supposed to be in standby, it makes a sound like every 5 minutes and the battery is dead after about 12 hr
Jun 29 14:30:31 <bstock> hrs*
Jun 29 14:31:10 <bstock> anyone else experience this?
Jun 29 14:31:27 <konttori> http://www.space.com/missionlaunches/070628_genesis2_update.html
Jun 29 14:32:40 <gwak> konttori:all these private ventures make the ISS look like a big joke
Jun 29 14:32:51 <konttori> yep
Jun 29 14:33:26 <gwak> i just string'ed the nokia installer files , did not see anything interesting
Jun 29 14:33:29 <konttori> Probably the biggest problem in the ISS is the fact that it needs shuttle to build it.
Jun 29 14:33:33 <Dr_Nunim> 3.2006.49-2 is the latest right?
Jun 29 14:33:51 <bstock> yeah
Jun 29 14:34:19 <Dr_Nunim> Good...
Jun 29 14:38:51 <gwak> from FlasherGui.exe (OS Edition 2006 Bin files
Jun 29 14:38:51 <gwak> Confirm cancel
Jun 29 14:38:55 <gwak> OS Edition 2005)
Jun 29 15:16:44 <kakos> Where is the firmware download page?
Jun 29 15:16:58 <Milhouse2> N800: http://tablets-dev.nokia.com/nokia_N800.php
Jun 29 15:17:11 <Milhouse2> 770: http://tablets-dev.nokia.com/nokia_770.php
Jun 29 15:19:10 <kakos> Still no flasher-3.0 for OS X
Jun 29 15:19:12 <kakos> :(
Jun 29 15:19:21 <kakos> Can I use flasher-2.0 to flash the new firmwares?
Jun 29 15:19:33 <chrissturm> is there a way to display pdfs in portrait mode?
Jun 29 15:25:39 <komarov> hey all :-) nice holiday, isn't it?
Jun 29 15:30:44 <kakos> Where's my new image, god damn it?  ;)
Jun 29 15:32:32 <Dr_Nunim> erm, on the interwebz
Jun 29 15:43:46 <unique311> my desktop wont connect to the internet...
Jun 29 15:44:05 <unique311> keeps picking up a strange private ip address.
Jun 29 15:44:35 <unique311> and when i manually add the address and gateway address it doesn't seem to want to connect to the internet..
Jun 29 15:44:43 <unique311> but connection seems to be there..
Jun 29 15:45:07 <unique311> both notebooks connect wireless and running nice.
Jun 29 15:45:21 <komarov> what's your OS?
Jun 29 15:45:27 <unique311> xp
Jun 29 15:45:36 <unique311> does xp have a resolv.conf file
Jun 29 15:45:37 <unique311> lol
Jun 29 15:45:55 <komarov> uhm... did you mention resolv.conf anywhere?
Jun 29 15:46:52 <komarov> so what is it seriously?
Jun 29 15:47:04 <unique311> my desktop won't connect to the net
Jun 29 15:47:09 <unique311> tried everything
Jun 29 15:47:19 <unique311> uninstalling drivers..
Jun 29 15:47:21 <unique311> ]reinstall
Jun 29 15:47:25 <komarov> what's your OS? :-)
Jun 29 15:47:28 <unique311> it picks up a wierd ip
Jun 29 15:47:33 <unique311> a parallels ip..
Jun 29 15:47:40 <unique311> parallels is not installed
Jun 29 15:47:46 <unique311> vmware is not installed...
Jun 29 15:47:53 <unique311> m os is windows XP
Jun 29 15:48:01 <unique311> did i say this already...
Jun 29 15:48:18 <komarov> just couldn;'t understand whether you're joking
Jun 29 15:48:29 <komarov> of course there isn't such file there
Jun 29 15:48:39 <komarov> why did you decide to ask this question here? it's maemo stuff discussed there
Jun 29 15:48:49 <unique311> so why is dhcp not working properly
Jun 29 15:49:02 <komarov> I can help you in a private channel, let's continue ther
Jun 29 15:49:08 <unique311> because i do not want to go anywhere else and ask..
Jun 29 15:49:23 <unique311> figure theirs alot of devs in here..someone might want to throw me a bone.
Jun 29 15:49:34 <unique311> forget it man..
Jun 29 15:49:48 <rhsanborn> Anyone here familiar with imagemagick
Jun 29 15:49:55 <unique311> maybe i should've siad off topic..
Jun 29 15:49:59 <komarov> this is very selfish man. I have a question on the channel's topic, but I can't discuss it because you do the offtipic here
Jun 29 15:50:01 <unique311> said.
Jun 29 15:50:24 <unique311> ask away...
Jun 29 15:50:32 <unique311> you don't have to entertain my issues..
Jun 29 15:50:39 <unique311> someone else can..
Jun 29 15:51:07 <rhsanborn> I'm trying to see if imagemagick might work on the 800 simply with a compile as long as only a stripped down version was used...
Jun 29 15:51:15 <unique311> pupnik you around...i need help man..
Jun 29 15:51:35 <komarov> unique311, check out private, I wrote you there
Jun 29 15:52:13 <unique311> cannot join private..
Jun 29 15:52:14 <komarov> doesn anyone know how to setup scratchbox to exec 'apt-get update' inside it?
Jun 29 15:52:20 <unique311> invite only
Jun 29 15:52:42 <komarov> unique311: look at the channel folders, you should see a private chat there
Jun 29 15:52:46 <unique311> if you are not a registered user, you cannot send me an IM
Jun 29 15:52:55 <komarov> oops
Jun 29 15:54:10 <unique311> just tell me in here..
Jun 29 15:54:21 <unique311> no one will mind...i hope not..
Jun 29 15:56:03 <komarov> any maemo devel here??
Jun 29 15:56:11 <konttori> Interesting: http://www.newswireless.net/index.cfm/article/3466
Jun 29 15:56:17 <konttori> komarov: where else?
Jun 29 15:56:41 <konttori> Oh, the link is to an article that apple would launch 3g iphone deal on monday
Jun 29 15:56:43 <komarov> tried to ask somewhere like on #scrathbox but there's too few people
Jun 29 15:57:04 <komarov> #scratchbox i meant
Jun 29 15:57:11 <konttori> this is the best place to ask
Jun 29 15:57:27 <komarov> I want to start developing for maemo but can't setup scratchbox under Debian, need some help
Jun 29 15:57:43 <konttori> get the vmware image
Jun 29 15:57:51 <konttori> it's by far the easiest way
Jun 29 15:58:09 <komarov> wow, I'll check it out. Haven't heard about it before
Jun 29 15:58:29 <konttori> it's completey pre-configured for development
Jun 29 15:58:43 <komarov> I live on maemo.org for a couple of days but haven't noticed it anywhere
Jun 29 15:58:45 <Dr_Nunim> Hrm nuts, LCARS failed to properly restore all of the original images.
Jun 29 15:58:46 <unique311> has the worng ip addressssssss
Jun 29 15:58:47 <konttori> As in, just change the root and user password and it's ready
Jun 29 15:58:50 <komarov> could you help finding link?
Jun 29 15:59:09 <komarov> <unique311> I registered and wrote you to the private again
Jun 29 15:59:10 <konttori> DR_Nunim: you probably need to restart
Jun 29 15:59:15 <Dr_Nunim> Did that.
Jun 29 15:59:19 <unique311> i know komarov
Jun 29 15:59:30 <unique311> i'm writing this on my notebook..
Jun 29 15:59:47 <unique311> the desktop listed a bunch of stuff for ipconf /all
Jun 29 15:59:50 <unique311> wrong ip...
Jun 29 15:59:54 <unique311> strange ip..
Jun 29 15:59:54 <konttori> Ok, then install any theme maker theme and uninstall that. It will manually copy the 'original' images that it has.
Jun 29 16:00:06 <unique311> komarov
Jun 29 16:00:20 <unique311> get the vmware image from vmware
Jun 29 16:00:22 <Dr_Nunim> k
Jun 29 16:00:35 <unique311> theres a torrent link for it..
Jun 29 16:00:36 <konttori> for example this: https://garage.maemo.org/frs/download.php/1615/NuvoBlack.deb
Jun 29 16:00:48 <Dr_Nunim> btw, whats the rechage time on the 770?
Jun 29 16:00:50 <komarov> <unique311> don't advice me things on topics you don' understand please
Jun 29 16:01:01 <unique311> lol
Jun 29 16:01:05 <konttori> http://www.vmware.com/vmtn/appliances/directory/702
Jun 29 16:01:08 <unique311> i have scratchbox installed..
Jun 29 16:01:09 <unique311> lol
Jun 29 16:01:28 <unique311> installed it on my desktop and notebook.
Jun 29 16:02:09 <Dr_Nunim> This appears to be a nifty little device, now if only I could figure out the stand :p
Jun 29 16:02:11 <unique311> i feel bad now....he just completely shun'd my help.
Jun 29 16:02:22 <komarov> <konttori> thanks
Jun 29 16:03:53 <komarov> <konttori> it'd great if there also were an image for windows
Jun 29 16:04:23 <komarov> <unique311> I have scratchbox installed too but it's not enough yet to start developing
Jun 29 16:04:44 <komarov> <unique311> what's the IP your desktop has been assigned to?
Jun 29 16:05:02 <unique311> 169.254.0.0
Jun 29 16:05:36 <komarov> this means that Windows didn't get response from DHCP and has selected some random IP
Jun 29 16:06:04 <komarov> check that your DHCP client service is running on that machine (run services.msc)
Jun 29 16:06:16 <trevarthan> I can't seek inside my videos on the n800. It locks up. I'm using AVIs encoded with 770encode.pl. Am I doing something wrong, or is seeking just not possible?
Jun 29 16:07:23 <unique311> DHCP is working, just that its getting an ip that paralles gives it virtual ethernet adpaters..
Jun 29 16:07:42 <unique311> i
Jun 29 16:08:01 <komarov> trevarthan: maybe it was coded using some of the streaming codecs where it's hard to seek. did you try seeking on the desktop?
Jun 29 16:08:22 <unique311> wow, clarke just went byebye
Jun 29 16:08:26 <komarov> uhm......
Jun 29 16:08:53 <komarov> <unique311> maybe you should try to assign an IP manually, just set it similar to the IPs of your other devices
Jun 29 16:09:08 <unique311> i did...
Jun 29 16:09:41 <komarov> ...and?
Jun 29 16:10:33 <unique311> internet is still down when i do so..
Jun 29 16:10:52 <unique311> the connection seems to go thru when i do, but the internet still doesn't work.
Jun 29 16:11:24 <komarov> tell me what you really have - windows inside parallels on Mac?
Jun 29 16:11:34 <unique311> ?
Jun 29 16:11:47 <komarov> what OSes do you have on your desktop?
Jun 29 16:13:58 <trevarthan> komarov: so you've got seeking working on an n800 with videos?
Jun 29 16:17:17 <unique311> my connection is going crazy as of 12:16
Jun 29 16:17:41 <komarov> <trevarthan> I never said that :-)
Jun 29 17:35:48 <monteslu> you know, maemo + python + bluetooth + Lego mindstorms NXT should be a thing of beauty, but man is it a bitch to get this stuff to work
Jun 29 17:59:10 <Ulukia> Anyone here give me a hand with installing wpeditor on Nokia 770 OS2006?
Jun 29 17:59:42 <pupnik> unique311: question?
Jun 29 17:59:53 <pupnik> sure Ulukia
Jun 29 18:00:34 <Ulukia> I'm getting errors when I try to install the dependancy listed on maemopad+
Jun 29 18:01:45 <Ulukia> Let me pull up the exact error, one moment.
Jun 29 18:02:00 <pupnik> Maemopad+ broke here also
Jun 29 18:02:07 <pupnik> back in a minute
Jun 29 18:02:16 <Ulukia> oh
Jun 29 18:04:49 <unique311> thought i fixed it..
Jun 29 18:04:58 <unique311> but my desktops internet connection is broken..
Jun 29 18:05:04 <unique311> running windows xp
Jun 29 18:05:29 <unique311> dhcp keeps picking up an old parallels virtual ethernet adapters IP..
Jun 29 18:05:49 <unique311> and when i manually enter the correct IP...still doesn't work..
Jun 29 18:06:26 <unique311> notebooks and N800 seem to connect via wireless on the same network..
Jun 29 18:06:47 <unique311> might be zonealarm..
Jun 29 18:07:41 <Ulukia> Yeah, zonealarm is notorious to fowling wireless networks. (Level II for Hotel Networks)
Jun 29 18:08:39 <unique311> the wireless connections work..
Jun 29 18:08:47 <unique311> just the desktop
Jun 29 18:08:51 <unique311> which is cable.
Jun 29 18:08:57 <unique311> the only cable at that..
Jun 29 18:08:59 <chrissturm> is there a more lightweight IM app than pidgin for maemo?
Jun 29 18:09:44 <pupnik> irssi
Jun 29 18:09:48 <pupnik> oh IM, not IRC
Jun 29 18:09:59 <chrissturm> oh, irc is also interesting
Jun 29 18:10:16 <pupnik> if you find a console based IM client i'm sure it would be easy to compile for the tablet
Jun 29 18:10:17 <`0660> irssi can be used as an im client when combined with bitlbee :)
Jun 29 18:10:42 <`0660> that's at least how i use it
Jun 29 18:11:04 <pupnik> unique311 i'm like a feminist housecleaner
Jun 29 18:11:22 <pupnik> "I don't do windows"
Jun 29 18:12:07 <unique311> i do..
Jun 29 18:12:12 <unique311> and am hurting right now.
Jun 29 18:12:19 <unique311> 6 hours and counting..
Jun 29 18:12:35 <unique311> way to just delete windows network config.
Jun 29 18:12:53 <unique311> actually do windows on my desktop and thinkpad...
Jun 29 18:12:58 <unique311> linux in vmware.
Jun 29 18:13:16 <unique311> not too comfortable with linux still to install it solo
Jun 29 18:14:12 <unique311> i have osx86 running on my fujitsu notebook...
Jun 29 18:14:27 <unique311> comfortable with that than linux.
Jun 29 18:14:37 <Feral_Kid> I inadventantly installed a program which did not completely load (zsh)... I tried to remove the package, but it wouldn't allow me... Then I tried to install another package and was told that I need to fire up dpkg and allow it to continue trying to load zsh... Is there anyway to stop the installation of zsh?
Jun 29 18:16:43 <pupnik> wow osx cool
Jun 29 18:21:23 <unique311> it works and looks good..
Jun 29 18:21:27 <unique311> no complains..
Jun 29 18:22:06 * Dr_Nunim needs his 2gb memory card for more power!
Jun 29 18:22:09 <Dr_Nunim> and installing on the card.
Jun 29 18:22:17 <unique311> graphics support not too good, but there's a bunch of guys working to make steves releases work on all machines..
Jun 29 18:27:29 <cy-> So did nokia end up releasing a new firmware?
Jun 29 18:28:20 <Dr_Nunim> I have a simple but seemly obviously question, how do I remove a song from my favorites? In this case it's the internet radio that comes with it.
Jun 29 18:28:53 <Jaffa> cy-: nope
Jun 29 18:31:53 <cy-> Bummer :(
Jun 29 18:33:42 <kakos> Dr_Nunim: Delete and then be sure to select save playlist in the menu.
Jun 29 18:35:10 <Dr_Nunim> Ah save playlist ;p
Jun 29 18:35:33 <Dr_Nunim> I'm spoiled by winamp.
Jun 29 18:36:03 <Ulukia> So, anyway of getting wpeditor to work on OS2006?
Jun 29 18:37:31 <Ulukia> I'm getting incompatible package when I try and install it off the maemopad+ page.
Jun 29 18:43:36 <pupnik> Ulukia: i think it's broken.  Email the author
Jun 29 18:54:00 <pupnik> in the world of low user-count open source, everyone needs to contribute.  including good error reports.
Jun 29 19:28:13 <bstock> man intel is rumored to be dropping the Q6600 (quad core 2.4 ghz) to $266 in the end of July... that's rediculously cheep
Jun 29 19:31:57 <Dr_Nunim> Yup yup :)
Jun 29 19:32:02 * Dr_Nunim is buying one if they do.
Jun 29 19:32:21 <Dr_Nunim> I love my core 2 but 4 core... mmmmmm
Jun 29 19:34:42 <pupnik> It's going to be years before i feel like upgrading from my athlon 2800xp
Jun 29 19:36:09 <pupnik> the returns on investment are getting smaller for computer upgrades
Jun 29 19:36:38 <pupnik> What pisses me off is that we don't have good VR goggles yet
Jun 29 19:37:17 <keesj> Jaffa: are you there?
Jun 29 19:37:17 <pupnik> I'd easily plunk down 1000 euro for wide-angle stereoscopic 1280x960 vr goggles with low-latency head tracking
Jun 29 19:53:15 <pupnik> The Stranglers - "Golden Brown"  -- http://youtube.com/watch?v=I_yOQ8ntzLM  great song
Jun 29 19:58:30 <keesj> pupnik: for me it's a song that I have heard so much that I think I like it because I reconize it
Jun 29 19:58:47 <keesj> what's is about?
Jun 29 19:59:40 <Dr_Nunim> Hrm fudgesicles
Jun 29 19:59:50 <Dr_Nunim> I'm somehow managed to rid myself of scroll bar images.
Jun 29 20:01:21 <Dr_Nunim> Unless opera has a display scroll bar setting like every other program that I'm just too retarded to find.
Jun 29 20:13:34 <KaylaKaze> package here!
Jun 29 20:16:33 <pupnik> keesj: hash
Jun 29 20:18:19 <keesj> we have nederwiet here
Jun 29 20:21:34 <keesj> xmoto depends on libode0c2 but is it not going to be installed *you moron*
Jun 29 20:27:56 <nate12o6> anyone have a working pptp client on there 770?
Jun 29 20:29:41 <sbaturzio> Aloha!
Jun 29 20:30:53 <nate12o6> hi
Jun 29 20:32:15 <bstock> pupnik: once i've had more than 1 core, i can't stand working on a single core box anymore
Jun 29 20:43:34 <KaylaKaze> I cna't get this stupid thing on my WLAN :-(
Jun 29 20:49:11 <Dr_Nunim> Whats wrong?
Jun 29 20:49:14 <Dr_Nunim> Not detecting it?
Jun 29 20:53:02 <Inferno18> hey, anyone here?
Jun 29 20:53:16 <pupnik> depends
Jun 29 20:53:27 <Inferno18> i need a bit of help :)
Jun 29 20:54:19 <Inferno18> i was just wondering if anyone has worked out a way of getting around 33: cu: not found for os 2006
Jun 29 20:55:23 <pupnik> ?
Jun 29 20:55:35 <pupnik> copper not found'?
Jun 29 20:56:10 <KaylaKaze> YaY! My dnd char sheet webpage works great on the nokia!
Jun 29 20:56:32 <Inferno18> call up "cu"
Jun 29 20:56:47 <Inferno18> you know the call up another system thing
Jun 29 20:57:06 <pupnik> that was for modems right?  back around 1989?
Jun 29 20:57:43 <pupnik> yeah i remember now.. i used it on my NeXT box to dial up university
Jun 29 20:57:49 <Inferno18> its for the nokia 770
Jun 29 20:57:54 <ericz> KaylaKaze, how do you know?
Jun 29 20:58:04 <ericz> don't tell me you got yours :( before me!
Jun 29 20:58:14 <pupnik> KaylaKaze: got a url?
Jun 29 21:09:30 * pupnik has had 0% success getting other gamedevs to buy a 770
Jun 29 21:14:34 <Dr_Nunim> ahhh ftp client = super useful
Jun 29 21:19:59 <nate337> can i get a little help installing a pptp client on my 770? for now i managed to flash the kernal to the zImage-su-18-200639-2gb-mmcplus52Mhz, i also downloaded a pptp comand line client but when i try to connect it says /usr/sbin/pppd: The remote system is required to authenticate itself
Jun 29 21:20:07 <nate337> I dont know how to input a username or password
Jun 29 21:22:47 <pupnik> can't help nate337, sorry
Jun 29 21:24:20 <nate337> :(
Jun 29 21:39:58 <nate337> anyone in here formiliar with gizmo?
Jun 29 21:41:01 <pupnik> 260 euro = about $312 dollars :( :( :(
Jun 29 21:41:22 <pupnik> Thanks europe!  USA = $130, Europe = $312
Jun 29 21:42:00 <nate337> is it possible to actually dial out with my asterisk dialplan using the gizmo project?
Jun 29 21:42:58 <pupnik> nate337: maybe try internettablettalk.com forums
Jun 29 21:43:17 <nate337> thanks. will do
Jun 29 21:46:15 <KaylaKaze> I'm starting to get annoyed. every pdf viewer is crashing on this
Jun 29 21:46:56 <Dr_Nunim> is your pdf really big?
Jun 29 21:47:04 <KaylaKaze> 10mb
Jun 29 21:48:31 <KaylaKaze> and now, Envince has completely locked it up
Jun 29 21:48:47 <KaylaKaze> or had locked it... until it crashed
Jun 29 22:10:26 <unique311> my dekstop just died on me..
Jun 29 22:10:30 <unique311> BSOD...wow
Jun 29 22:10:39 <unique311> fucking zonealarm..
Jun 29 22:10:59 <unique311> recomendations for a new firewall are welcomed...
Jun 29 22:11:11 <kakos> I recommend ipf
Jun 29 22:11:19 <unique311> ipf?
Jun 29 22:12:16 <unique311> kakos, this is windows xp man..
Jun 29 22:12:24 <unique311> something on the lines
Jun 29 22:14:14 <kakos> unique311: It was a subtle jab at your choice of OS
Jun 29 22:14:16 <kakos> :-P
Jun 29 22:14:25 <unique311> ok...
Jun 29 22:14:42 <unique311> not sure why windows is so bad to people...
Jun 29 22:15:21 <unique311> been thru many of the linux flavors....a regular user would be completely lost in linux.
Jun 29 22:16:06 <unique311> i can manage,  but xp is on my desktop for a reason....
Jun 29 22:16:37 <unique311> Adobe CS3 last time i check is not made available to the linux world...
Jun 29 22:16:43 <unique311> corel painter also
Jun 29 22:17:01 <unique311> alot of apps i make use of ar enot available to linux.
Jun 29 22:17:19 <unique311> that jab you took at my choice of OS's sucked kakos...
Jun 29 22:17:32 <kakos> Yeah, I know
Jun 29 22:17:32 <kakos> :(
Jun 29 22:18:13 <kakos> My mind is currently dominated by an overwhelming desire to buy an iPhone.  My "witty repertoire" process doesn't have the nice value to get cycles many cycles
Jun 29 22:18:28 <monteslu> don't do it
Jun 29 22:18:34 <unique311> i can work with gimp....but i have favorites...and right now none of my favorites are Made for Linux
Jun 29 22:18:50 <unique311> iphone..
Jun 29 22:19:08 <unique311> outdated before its release today..
Jun 29 22:19:17 <unique311> not sure i would do it kakos
Jun 29 22:19:17 <kakos> I know!
Jun 29 22:19:22 <kakos> It's such a flawed device
Jun 29 22:19:25 <kakos> But I want it
Jun 29 22:19:51 <kakos> The Elder God Steve Jobs calls to me in my dreams from a strange city built on a foundation of non-Euclidean reality distortion fields.
Jun 29 22:20:29 <unique311> steve jobs....saw this hackers document with him in it
Jun 29 22:20:35 <kakos> Ia!  Ia!  Jobs fhtagn!
Jun 29 22:20:40 <unique311> as a youngster
Jun 29 22:21:32 <Dr_Nunim> Pirates of Silicon Valley? :p
Jun 29 22:21:38 <unique311> linux is based on unix or is it vise versa?
Jun 29 22:21:42 <Dr_Nunim> Dat was sum good movie.
Jun 29 22:21:49 <Dr_Nunim> Yeah Linux is based on unix.
Jun 29 22:22:36 <unique311> always wondered why he is not attacked..like bill gates is..
Jun 29 22:23:06 <Dr_Nunim> Attacked for what?
Jun 29 22:23:40 <unique311> linux unlike unix is opensource, right?
Jun 29 22:24:07 <unique311> bare with me trying to understand something..
Jun 29 22:24:18 <derf> No.
Jun 29 22:24:28 <derf> BSD, for example, is an open source Unix.
Jun 29 22:24:44 <Dr_Nunim> Unix < Linux
Jun 29 22:24:46 <derf> Unix is fractured into lots of different flavors.
Jun 29 22:24:52 <Dr_Nunim> At least in terms of easy of use.
Jun 29 22:24:52 <unique311> ok.
Jun 29 22:25:11 <unique311> so you come up with your own flavor of unix you can profit of it if you want...
Jun 29 22:25:27 <derf> Including a custom proprietary flavor for every major vender that tried to sell hardware that ran it.
Jun 29 22:25:45 <Dr_Nunim> You can come up with your own flavor of linux too and profit from it.
Jun 29 22:26:08 <unique311> but then people will hunt you down and try to kill you..
Jun 29 22:26:28 <derf> Well, that or post mean blog entries about you.
Jun 29 22:26:35 <unique311> lol
Jun 29 22:26:39 <kakos> Dr_Nunim: You got it backwards.  Unix > Linux
Jun 29 22:26:43 <Dr_Nunim> Lies!
Jun 29 22:27:06 <unique311> ok...
Jun 29 22:27:17 <unique311> now for the million dollar question..
Jun 29 22:27:18 <Dr_Nunim> Unix is very hard for me.
Jun 29 22:27:31 <unique311> and i hope i don't get fuc@#$d for this..
Jun 29 22:27:42 * kakos pre-emptively fucks unique311 
Jun 29 22:27:43 <kakos> :-P
Jun 29 22:27:47 <unique311> why is everyone mad at bill gates?
Jun 29 22:27:55 <Dr_Nunim> They're jealous?
Jun 29 22:28:00 <derf> unique311: Because he has a lot of money.
Jun 29 22:28:04 <Fatal> are people mad at him?
Jun 29 22:28:05 <unique311> ok
Jun 29 22:28:06 <derf> And they don't.
Jun 29 22:28:06 <Fatal> seriously?
Jun 29 22:28:07 <Dr_Nunim> I wouldn't mind billions.
Jun 29 22:28:08 <kakos> unique311: Lots of unsavoury business practices, I think is the big thing
Jun 29 22:28:22 <kakos> unique311: Also, Windows has a reputation for being fairly subpar as far as software goes
Jun 29 22:28:28 <unique311> all big  business lie
Jun 29 22:28:29 <Dr_Nunim> I don't think Microsoft is the real enemy, my ISP is.
Jun 29 22:28:33 <unique311> thats how they make lots of money..
Jun 29 22:28:42 <Dr_Nunim> $89 a month for DSL, it's robbery!
Jun 29 22:28:46 <unique311> big corperations can't be truthful 100%
Jun 29 22:28:49 <derf> unique311: Nothing to do with lying.
Jun 29 22:29:06 <unique311> unsavoury business practices
Jun 29 22:29:08 <Fatal> I fear apple and google more than I fear microsoft
Jun 29 22:29:14 <unique311> lies don't fall under that.
Jun 29 22:29:26 <derf> MS invented things like charging vendors for Windows licenses based on the number of computers sold, not the number of computers sold with Windows.
Jun 29 22:29:30 <unique311> i think google take the cake
Jun 29 22:29:41 <derf> (so every computer sold included Windows)
Jun 29 22:29:45 <Dr_Nunim> Google is pretty evil.
Jun 29 22:29:49 <Dr_Nunim> but they don't act like it.
Jun 29 22:29:52 <kakos> Google doesn't scare me.  Neither does Apple.
Jun 29 22:30:25 <unique311> apple scares me...everyone i talk to own a macintosh..
Jun 29 22:30:31 <derf> They also have some fantastic accounting practices (all of which, as far as I'm aware, are perfectly legal)
Jun 29 22:30:34 <unique311> and when i ask them why...
Jun 29 22:30:38 <unique311> because its perty..
Jun 29 22:30:46 <kakos> I own Apple computers
Jun 29 22:30:50 <Dr_Nunim> Really?
Jun 29 22:30:52 <Dr_Nunim> Can I have some shares?
Jun 29 22:30:53 <Dr_Nunim> :o
Jun 29 22:31:00 <unique311> people are buying macs based on looks..
Jun 29 22:31:05 <kakos> Why do I prefer them?  Because it is a Unix-based OS with a really nice GUI
Jun 29 22:31:11 <kakos> It's basically what Linux is trying to be.
Jun 29 22:31:25 <Dr_Nunim> I really like Mac monitors...
Jun 29 22:32:05 <kakos> unique311: Macs are nice because they are very usable, very efficient, very well-designed, and they look good on top of it.
Jun 29 22:32:22 <kakos> I dislike the people who buy them for just the last part, but I won't deny that it is a part of why they are appealing to me
Jun 29 22:32:28 <unique311> not sure i understand right now after asking, why bill gates is so hated?
Jun 29 22:32:47 <unique311> kakos: people are buying macs because of looks...
Jun 29 22:32:55 <unique311> and thats it.
Jun 29 22:33:00 <monteslu> unique311++
Jun 29 22:33:00 <kakos> unique311: He's viewed as a malevolent force whose unsavoury business practices tends to stifle innovation in the computer industry.
Jun 29 22:33:15 <derf> kakos: Only SOME people want Linux to be Unix with a really nice GUI.
Jun 29 22:33:15 <kakos> unique311: I know there are people who do so.  I dislike them.  I'm not one of them.
Jun 29 22:33:41 <unique311> not good to dislike..
Jun 29 22:33:41 <Milhouse2> Nothing wrong with eye candy
Jun 29 22:33:45 <unique311> hatred follows.
Jun 29 22:33:54 <unique311> a couple of steps behind.
Jun 29 22:34:37 <kakos> As long as the eye candy is supported by functionality.
Jun 29 22:34:46 <monteslu> When I can drop my t-mobile sim card into the iphone and write my own apps for it, I might consider one
Jun 29 22:34:49 <kakos> And Apple is very good at providing things that have lots of eye candy but are also very functional
Jun 29 22:34:54 <Milhouse2> kakos: Absolutely, which in the case of Apple it usually is
Jun 29 22:35:04 <kakos> Yup
Jun 29 22:35:27 <kakos> monteslu: Consciously, I agree.  But I still want an iPhone.  I like new gadgets too much to not want one
Jun 29 22:35:29 <monteslu> one hardware vendor, one software vendor, one wireless service provider... fuck that
Jun 29 22:35:39 <unique311> danm, my desktop really died...
Jun 29 22:35:46 <unique311> need to reinstall windows...
Jun 29 22:35:47 <unique311> yeah
Jun 29 22:35:52 <Milhouse2> monteslu: I don't think the SIM is accessible in the iPhone...
Jun 29 22:35:59 <monteslu> its not
Jun 29 22:36:07 <monteslu> its completely locked down
Jun 29 22:36:11 <derf> Wanting an iPhone is okay. Paying $1220 for one for the first year is not.
Jun 29 22:36:16 <Milhouse2> Also, the iPhone won't function on networks that don't have the back end server infrastructure
Jun 29 22:36:19 <dragorn> You can't even replace the battery in an iphone :P
Jun 29 22:36:29 <pupnik> The FIC Neo1973 is a cooler phone.  Linux and 640x480.
Jun 29 22:36:35 <KaylaKaze> grr I installed dropbear and I can connect to it from the 770 but not from another computer on the network, even though I can connect to the 770's web server
Jun 29 22:36:36 <Milhouse2> So even if the SIM were replaceable, it's unlikely to work on any other network than AT&T right now
Jun 29 22:36:51 <monteslu> Milhouse2, and that makes it garbage
Jun 29 22:36:51 <Fatal> pupnik: plus, it's welte supported! :)
Jun 29 22:37:00 <Milhouse2> KaylaKaze: why dropbear - I've always used openssh
Jun 29 22:37:01 <kakos> So, anyone hear anything about the new firmware for the N800?  Any chance it will be out today?
Jun 29 22:37:06 <pupnik> welte Fatal?
Jun 29 22:37:11 <Milhouse2> menteslu: yep :)
Jun 29 22:37:25 <edt> where can one generate valid routes for maemo mapper?
Jun 29 22:37:28 <KaylaKaze> Milhouse2: 'cause it was on the list :-)
Jun 29 22:37:37 <Milhouse2> monteslu: and the iPhone will be superceeded by a newer and better version on Monday (apparently) when the 3G European version is announced!
Jun 29 22:37:43 <kakos> KaylaKaze: I'd highly recommend openssh over dropbear
Jun 29 22:37:44 <unique311> firmware definitely not today..
Jun 29 22:37:59 <KaylaKaze> I was jsut tryign to get to root fast so I can get SAMBA sharing working
Jun 29 22:38:00 <monteslu> Isn't openmoko about to be released as well?
Jun 29 22:38:07 <edt> I get errors with the url they supply
Jun 29 22:38:09 <kakos> monteslu: July 20, I heard
Jun 29 22:38:18 <Fatal> pupnik: harald
Jun 29 22:38:19 <rwhitby> july 9
Jun 29 22:38:21 <kakos> unique311: Definitely not today?  Why not?
Jun 29 22:38:31 <monteslu> openmoko seems way more interesting to me
Jun 29 22:38:41 <monteslu> though, they should've just used maemo
Jun 29 22:38:50 <Fatal> pffrth
Jun 29 22:39:05 <edt> Eee 701 from asus looks interesting..
Jun 29 22:39:17 <unique311> base on the fact that workday is done....
Jun 29 22:39:23 <unique311> 6:39
Jun 29 22:39:29 <Milhouse2> monteslu - if they manage the development and release process more transparently than Nokia I think OpenMoko will be way more interesting than Maemo.
Jun 29 22:39:30 <unique311> unless nokia is overseas
Jun 29 22:39:39 <kakos> Well... it's past midnight where Nokia is
Jun 29 22:39:56 <monteslu> Milhouse2, hopefully.
Jun 29 22:39:57 <unique311> and holiday is here....for them
Jun 29 22:40:04 <pupnik> nice to see Milhouse2 again :)
Jun 29 22:40:11 <Milhouse2> hello pupnik :)
Jun 29 22:40:21 <rwhitby> Milhouse2: openmoko svn commits appear in #openmoko - can't get more open than that :-)
Jun 29 22:40:54 <Fatal> shame nokia are who they are, and all the suck that comes with it
Jun 29 22:40:57 <rwhitby> (including commits for future yet-to-be-announced products)
Jun 29 22:41:21 <Milhouse2> rwhitby - indeed, and I bet they have no problems discussing future releases and release dates, unlike Nokia...
Jun 29 22:41:38 <rwhitby> future plans are always a problem
Jun 29 22:41:59 <monteslu> And hopefully they don't drop software releases for their products after only 1 year like Nokia did
Jun 29 22:42:03 <Fatal> if they're 100% open you won't have the 770 issue there, someone can always correct bugs
Jun 29 22:42:06 <rwhitby> openmoko have been caned by some people in the last few weeks by being late compared to earliest estimates of release dates
Jun 29 22:42:07 <Fatal> !retort nokia
Jun 29 22:42:17 <pupnik> Fatal: chill
Jun 29 22:42:17 <Milhouse2> Of course Nokia will blame the lack of communication on the corporate mentality blah blah blah... I hope they'll be happy hiding behind that crap when Maemo and Internet Tablets have no community left to communicate with
Jun 29 22:42:19 * monteslu is still mad that I can't get a real IT 2007 on the 770
Jun 29 22:42:51 <Fatal> I don't care much about new features as such, I just want crashes to go away
Jun 29 22:43:22 <monteslu> I just want my 1 year old device to still be supported
Jun 29 22:43:25 <pupnik> AFAIK, IT 2007 is largely open.  If you want to fix bugs, go ahead.
Jun 29 22:43:27 <Fatal> pupnik: chill?
Jun 29 22:43:33 <Milhouse2> Fatal: no chance, Nokia are too busy working on new functionality they are unable to discuss with the likes of you and I! ;)
Jun 29 22:44:02 <Milhouse2> pupnik: It's tricky fixing bugs in apps where the source code isn't available
Jun 29 22:44:04 <unique311> busy working on new devices maybe
Jun 29 22:44:04 <Dr_Nunim> I wouldn't have bought mine if not for the community aps available.
Jun 29 22:44:09 <unique311> not features
Jun 29 22:44:12 <monteslu> Nokia could have spent another year on maemo before they went and released the 800
Jun 29 22:44:30 <monteslu> way to screw over the early adopters
Jun 29 22:44:32 <Milhouse2> pupnik: I'd happily have a go at fixing trivial bugs in Media Player for instance, but it's closed source
Jun 29 22:44:39 <Fatal> the community is excellent, nokia however are not :/
Jun 29 22:45:04 <unique311> agree complete with Fatal
Jun 29 22:46:13 <unique311> guess the community is the open source part about the devices.
Jun 29 22:46:51 <pupnik> Mediaplayer is like windows media player.  I don't care for the bundled apps.
Jun 29 22:46:52 <Fatal> it's not like I'm going to throw my 770 out the window in a fit of rage over nokias idiocy, would just be nice to know that someday maybe just that bug in that closed driver could be fixed. but they took that away :)
Jun 29 22:47:03 <Fatal> I care more about the drivers
Jun 29 22:47:07 <Fatal> but oh well
Jun 29 22:47:14 <Fatal> time for sleep, toodles
Jun 29 22:47:20 <pupnik> CU Fatal. I agree btw
Jun 29 22:47:21 <suihkulokki> Fatal: what driver?
Jun 29 22:47:42 <pupnik> It's reasonable to expect bugfixes in driver and core OS
Jun 29 22:48:06 <pupnik> But if a bundled app isn't perfect, just use an opensource alternative.
Jun 29 22:48:38 <Dr_Nunim> I'm not sure which is worse, clawsmail or the bundled one.
Jun 29 22:49:08 <pupnik> Dr_Nunim: you want me to port pine?
Jun 29 22:49:17 <Dr_Nunim> isn't there already a port?
Jun 29 22:49:21 <pupnik> dunno
Jun 29 22:49:49 <Dr_Nunim> No, I was hoping for something decent gui based.
Jun 29 22:50:01 <Milhouse2> Pine was ported to OS2006
Jun 29 22:50:01 <Milhouse2> http://downloads.maemo.org/product/pine/
Jun 29 22:50:49 <ericz> does the 770 come with a preinstalled/default email client?
Jun 29 22:51:01 <ericz> (preferably that supports ssl/tls?)
Jun 29 22:51:04 <Milhouse2> The email situation on the Internet Tablets is criminal, as is the RSS app. Nokia should forget about adding new functionality while the existing functionality is so lamentable
Jun 29 22:51:08 <Dr_Nunim> SSL I think.
Jun 29 22:51:19 <Milhouse2> ericz: Yes, but you'll hate it
Jun 29 22:51:24 <ericz> really? why?
Jun 29 22:51:28 <Milhouse2> It's crap
Jun 29 22:51:38 <Dr_Nunim> Neither of the two available clients are very good.
Jun 29 22:51:54 <KaylaKaze> dammit! opera crashes every time I try to make a bookmark
Jun 29 22:51:56 <ericz> would it be any better to check gmail just by going to gmail.com ?
Jun 29 22:52:07 <Dr_Nunim> Many people do.
Jun 29 22:52:37 * sp3000 declares it bad vibes day
Jun 29 22:52:52 <Milhouse2> sp3000: yeah, definately :)
Jun 29 22:53:01 <suihkulokki> just a whining day like every other
Jun 29 22:53:18 <ericz> i'd really prefer ssl email :( especially on a random open wifi network
Jun 29 22:53:24 <KaylaKaze> I am SOOO pissed about this pice of crap!
Jun 29 22:53:28 <Milhouse2> suihkilokki: Maybe there's a message in there somewhere? ;)
Jun 29 22:53:36 <pupnik> It depends on what you compare it to.  Considering the quality of the apps microsoft bundled with - say - windows 98..... :)
Jun 29 22:53:38 <Dr_Nunim> If the onboard doesn't support it then claws does.
Jun 29 22:53:57 <sp3000> ericz: ssl works fine iirc
Jun 29 22:54:12 <Dr_Nunim> btw, is the n800 mail client any better?
Jun 29 22:54:20 <Milhouse2> Same as 770 :(
Jun 29 22:54:24 <Dr_Nunim> :(
Jun 29 22:54:44 <KaylaKaze> now why the fuck would Opera crash everytime I try to save a bookmark!? it makes no sense
Jun 29 22:55:04 * sp3000 blames bad vibes day
Jun 29 22:55:12 <Milhouse2> No real change between OS 2006 and OS 2007 as far as the major apps are concerned, cosmetic tweaks mostly, and in the case of Media Player on OS 2007 it's less usable than it was on OS 2006
Jun 29 22:55:24 <Milhouse2> KaylaKaze - bookmarks corrupted?
Jun 29 22:55:35 <Dr_Nunim> I haven't taken the plunge to 2007 yet, I will eventually.
Jun 29 22:56:06 <KaylaKaze> Milhouse2: the bookmarks already there work fine
Jun 29 22:56:13 <Dr_Nunim> plus I thought it had some sort of new browsing engine?
Jun 29 22:56:13 <KaylaKaze> and I've only had it a couple hours
Jun 29 22:56:17 <Dr_Nunim> as well as better flash support
Jun 29 22:56:17 <ericz> i'm guessing the n770 version of opera doesn't do the "Speed Dial" start page like on desktop version? :P
Jun 29 22:56:18 <Milhouse2> RSS App has more bugs on OS 2007 than it did on OS 2006 - and it's a pretty simple app... which is disturbing.
Jun 29 22:56:42 <Dr_Nunim> Nope, thats an opera 9 goodie.
Jun 29 22:57:56 <Milhouse2> I think it's Opera 8.5 in OS 2007 for N800 - 8.1 in OS 2006. No change of Opera version in OS 2007 HE on 770, same as OS 2006 (ie. no bug fixes etc.)
Jun 29 22:58:08 <suihkulokki> Milhouse2: my impression is that the whiners complain about the bundled propiertary software, but they don't actually bother to write anything better themselfs..
Jun 29 22:58:55 <Milhouse2> suihkulokki - while that may be true, it's not unreasonable for people to expect better quality software than Nokia currently ship
Jun 29 22:59:28 <suihkulokki> Milhouse2: then they say if Nokia would open source (insert pet piece of code) the community would fix it (never mind the fact that almost nobody contributed to current free code parts)
Jun 29 22:59:56 <pupnik> exactly, suihkulokki
Jun 29 23:01:21 <suihkulokki> Milhouse2: I agree some parts are horrible..
Jun 29 23:03:30 <Milhouse2> As far as the built-in apps are concerned, I get the impression that Nokia seem unwilling to accept some bugs are even bugs in the first place
Jun 29 23:03:31 <unique311> not sure about the write anything better themselves part of that comment suihkulokki
Jun 29 23:04:14 <Milhouse2> Why waste time working on a patch only to have it rejected by Nokia because it doesn't fit in with their unannounced and therefore secret future plans?
Jun 29 23:04:40 <Milhouse2> Have a look at some of the RSS bugs I've filed... nightmare.
Jun 29 23:04:44 <KaylaKaze> wow! I've had this 3 hours and already it seems like it'll have to be flashed to original settings]
Jun 29 23:04:56 <Milhouse2> KaylaKaze: :(
Jun 29 23:05:32 <Milhouse2> KaylaKaze: out of interest, what's the current shipping version - still 3.2007.10-1?
Jun 29 23:05:49 <KaylaKaze> I don't know. this is a 770
Jun 29 23:06:07 <unique311> if you a developer with the skills then, more power to you....but what about the everyday user that expects nokia to be putting out software, they want to use.
Jun 29 23:06:17 <Milhouse2> oh right, sorry... should be 3.2006.49-2 in that case
Jun 29 23:06:24 <KaylaKaze> none of my background is showing up now
Jun 29 23:09:35 <KaylaKaze> how do you reboot this thing?
Jun 29 23:09:44 <Milhouse2> Pull out the battery
Jun 29 23:10:11 <Milhouse2> Holding down the Power Button for a few seconds may also work, but pulling the battery is the ultimate reset :)
Jun 29 23:10:16 <Dr_Nunim> Hehe.
Jun 29 23:10:47 <Dr_Nunim> Yeah 3.2006.49-2 is shipping.
Jun 29 23:11:01 <KaylaKaze> http://kaylakaze.sytes.net/screenshot00.png that's what my home screen looks like
Jun 29 23:11:54 <Milhouse2> Dr Nunim - thanks... I know when the N800 was first released they shipped a slightly newer version to that which could be downloaded (2.2006.51-7 on device, 2.2006.51-6 for download). Can't remember the reason for the change - something minor.
Jun 29 23:12:19 <Milhouse2> KaylaKaze - try changing the theme
Jun 29 23:12:33 <Milhouse2> Or reboot
Jun 29 23:13:01 <KaylaKaze> I tried changing the theme. It errored and said "Can't load file" or something to that extent
Jun 29 23:13:09 <KaylaKaze> and I don't know how to reboot it
Jun 29 23:13:13 <Milhouse2> See above
Jun 29 23:13:41 <KaylaKaze> well, I turned it off and back on, but that didn't help
Jun 29 23:14:20 <Milhouse2> Try removing the battery, just to make sure
Jun 29 23:14:29 <KaylaKaze> just did
Jun 29 23:14:32 <Milhouse2> ok
Jun 29 23:14:39 <Milhouse2> Guess a reflash might be needed :(
Jun 29 23:15:11 <KaylaKaze> well, I'm waitingfor it to start up
Jun 29 23:15:31 <KaylaKaze> though it looks like it might not be
Jun 29 23:15:47 <KaylaKaze> there it goes
Jun 29 23:16:08 <Milhouse2> KaylaKaze: Any better?
Jun 29 23:16:39 <KaylaKaze> yeah, but it was hooked to my pc and apparently went into update mode
Jun 29 23:17:58 <KaylaKaze> and bookmarks are working noe
Jun 29 23:18:06 <Milhouse2> cool
Jun 29 23:20:01 <Dr_Nunim> :)
Jun 29 23:20:13 <Dr_Nunim> Now where did my Opera scroll bars run off to...
Jun 29 23:25:09 <pupnik> if the site is small, the scrollbars don't show up.  if it's not, try hitting the minimize button (top left) twice
Jun 29 23:25:26 <pupnik> s/site/page
Jun 29 23:25:33 <pupnik> o good, that bot is gone
Jun 29 23:26:20 <KaylaKaze> doh! somehow Opera turned off it's javascript
Jun 29 23:27:46 <sp3000> hmm, where'd my planet subscribe go
Jun 29 23:28:12 * sp3000 guesstimates something along lines of something moving and greader not liking
Jun 29 23:28:16 * sp3000 scratches head
Jun 29 23:28:22 <sp3000> or maybe I didn't have it there
Jun 29 23:28:24 <sp3000> weird
Jun 29 23:28:38 <Dr_Nunim> Kayla, Opera>Tools>Settings
Jun 29 23:28:40 <sp3000> no wonder it's been quiet :)
Jun 29 23:29:34 <KaylaKaze> it'd be nice if this opera had a javascript console so I coudl see why the page isn't working right on it
Jun 29 23:29:45 <sp3000> wtfbbq
Jun 29 23:30:00 * sp3000 subscribes to the atom and gets shown markup by greadr
Jun 29 23:30:48 <sp3000> ...which isn't really feasible with atom because the content type is supposedly, uh, known
Jun 29 23:31:04 * sp3000 cries
Jun 29 23:31:50 <sp3000> oh nm it's some obsolete version from the nineties
Jun 29 23:32:35 <ericz> KaylaKaze, so what am i going to have problems with when i get my n770? :P i see mine's in maryland
Jun 29 23:32:54 <KaylaKaze> Dr_Nunim: yeah, I knew where it was, I just don't know how it got turned off and that explained why my page wasn't working at all
Jun 29 23:33:38 <Milhouse2> There has been mention in the past on ITT that Javascript may get turned off for no reason at all
Jun 29 23:33:58 <KaylaKaze> ericz: well, I can't get my desktop to ssh into it... I can't get the book readers to not crash...  for some reason my DND character sheet page isn't working right in some of the calculation...
Jun 29 23:34:03 <Milhouse2> It's never happened to me, and I don't think a bug has been raised for it, not that it would help
Jun 29 23:34:24 <ericz> can't ssh why? :/ that's like my first thing-to-do.
Jun 29 23:34:30 <KaylaKaze> and now I jsut got a message saying it can't install samba
Jun 29 23:34:43 <Dr_Nunim> My opera problem: http://dragon-gaming.com/screenshot03.png
Jun 29 23:34:47 <KaylaKaze> it just says "connection refused"
Jun 29 23:34:49 <Dr_Nunim> I tried the zooming out but nothing.
Jun 29 23:35:01 <KaylaKaze> I can ssh into itself but that doesn't help when you have to type stuff
Jun 29 23:36:38 <ericz> ssh to self is easiest way to get root, right?
Jun 29 23:37:25 <Dr_Nunim> I just used gainroot
Jun 29 23:37:41 <KaylaKaze> well, ssh from something else would be nice. Though it'd be nicer not to have to root in the first place
Jun 29 23:38:19 <Milhouse2> kaylakaze: can you ping it?
Jun 29 23:38:20 <ericz> you can ssh to it from elsewhere, right?
Jun 29 23:38:27 <Dr_Nunim> So anyone have some thoughts on where my scroll bars went?
Jun 29 23:38:28 <KaylaKaze> wow! this Discovery channel video it comes with is only 2.6 M and 46 seconds long
Jun 29 23:38:50 <Milhouse2> Dr Nunim - have you got optimized view enabled?
Jun 29 23:38:52 <KaylaKaze> Milhouse2: I haven't tried pinging it, but I can connect to the web server on it
Jun 29 23:38:53 <Dr_Nunim> Nope.
Jun 29 23:39:01 <Milhouse2> what web server?
Jun 29 23:39:23 <KaylaKaze> ngibx
Jun 29 23:39:25 <Milhouse2> or you mean you can access the internet from your 770
Jun 29 23:39:27 <KaylaKaze> nginx
Jun 29 23:39:48 <KaylaKaze> I installed nginx on it and I'm able to connect to it from my pc
Jun 29 23:39:53 <sp3000> Dr_Nunim: yeah it's a bitt odd that you have page parts for scrollbar graphics I guess
Jun 29 23:39:56 <Milhouse2> establish if you have basic connectivity first
Jun 29 23:39:58 <sp3000> do the scrollbars work though?
Jun 29 23:40:08 <Dr_Nunim> Yeah they work fine.
Jun 29 23:40:09 <Milhouse2> maybe the web server has screwed things up
Jun 29 23:40:12 <Dr_Nunim> They're just invisible.
Jun 29 23:40:28 <sp3000> have you *cough* rebooted?
Jun 29 23:40:32 <Dr_Nunim> Yes...
Jun 29 23:40:39 <Milhouse2> Dr Nunim - is it theme related? or as sp3000 suggests... reboot :(
Jun 29 23:40:40 <Dr_Nunim> That was the first thing I tried.
Jun 29 23:40:53 <Dr_Nunim> Default theme.
Jun 29 23:40:57 <sp3000> did you have charger connected at the time?
Jun 29 23:40:58 <Milhouse2> odd
Jun 29 23:41:08 <Dr_Nunim> Nope.
Jun 29 23:41:11 <Dr_Nunim> Did hard reboot.
Jun 29 23:41:15 <Dr_Nunim> aka removed the battery.
Jun 29 23:41:35 <Dr_Nunim> What does optimize view do by the way
Jun 29 23:41:44 <sp3000> it lays out the page differently
Jun 29 23:41:46 <Dr_Nunim> I don't notice a difference.
Jun 29 23:41:50 <sp3000> it tries to squash it
Jun 29 23:41:56 <Milhouse2> less horizontal scrolling
Jun 29 23:41:59 <sp3000> to view width
Jun 29 23:42:02 <Dr_Nunim> Ah.
Jun 29 23:42:10 <Milhouse2> sometimes works, sometimes doesn't :)
Jun 29 23:42:15 <sp3000> works better or worse, depending on page
Jun 29 23:42:21 <Milhouse2> wish it were a per-site setting but...
Jun 29 23:42:21 <sp3000> I usually have it on
Jun 29 23:42:25 <KaylaKaze> do I have to use xterm to run prgrams that don't show up in the menu?
Jun 29 23:42:37 <rhys> depends on the page
Jun 29 23:42:53 <sp3000> KaylaKaze: I think there's an applet or somethinsomething for running arbitrary programs guifully, somewhere
Jun 29 23:42:58 <sp3000> , too
Jun 29 23:43:07 <Milhouse2> yes - or consider one of the status bar apps which may include the ability to run shell programs (one of the screenshot apps I think)
Jun 29 23:43:19 <sp3000> Dr_Nunim: I guess switching the theme around might
Jun 29 23:43:30 <Dr_Nunim> Just rebooted again
Jun 29 23:43:38 <Dr_Nunim> if that doesn't work I'll try installing a new theme and then uninstalling it.
Jun 29 23:43:41 <KaylaKaze> I saw a file manager in the repository
Jun 29 23:43:45 <Dr_Nunim> Then flash time.
Jun 29 23:44:00 <Milhouse2> There's a simple app launcher application which may support shell programs
Jun 29 23:45:05 <Dr_Nunim> Nope rebooting didn't help :(
Jun 29 23:45:08 <Dr_Nunim> Time to install theme.
Jun 29 23:45:18 <Dr_Nunim> Well, would switching to another default theme work?
Jun 29 23:46:18 <Milhouse2> KaylaKaze: https://garage.maemo.org/projects/simple-launcher/
Jun 29 23:46:23 <KaylaKaze> found the run app
Jun 29 23:46:33 <Milhouse2> k
Jun 29 23:46:50 <Dr_Nunim> Yay, scroll bars now to get the default one's working..
Jun 29 23:46:54 <KaylaKaze> but it won't install. I'll try that one
Jun 29 23:48:00 <Dr_Nunim> Sucess :)
Jun 29 23:48:06 <Dr_Nunim> I am back to the scrolling world.
Jun 29 23:50:33 <pupnik> i saw the top mahjong scores on the ITT forums... you guys scare me
Jun 29 23:51:22 <KaylaKaze> I installed the simplae app launcher... now I have to figure out how to run it :-/
Jun 29 23:51:35 <Dr_Nunim> lol
Jun 29 23:53:57 <Milhouse2> Anyone want an iPhone? :) http://cell-phones.search.ebay.com/apple-iphone_Cell-Phones_W0QQ_trksidZm37QQcatrefZC12QQfromZR40QQsacatZ146487
Jun 29 23:54:03 <Milhouse2> eBay flooded...
Jun 29 23:54:35 <Molagi> what the hell
Jun 29 23:54:45 <Milhouse2> $15K for an iPhone? hehe
Jun 29 23:54:54 <Molagi> nice profit for someone
Jun 29 23:55:00 <Dr_Nunim> Hell, I should have waited outside the apple store while browsing on my 770, sold the iphone and took the profits to buy an n800
Jun 29 23:55:01 <Milhouse2> Suspect they won't see any of that
Jun 29 23:55:18 <Dr_Nunim> Only problem is you have to sign a 2 year contract to get one.
Jun 29 23:55:28 <Dr_Nunim> Thus I'd be stuck with cingular for another 2 years.
Jun 29 23:55:33 <Dr_Nunim> And do iphones use sim cards?
Jun 29 23:55:51 <Milhouse2> Yes, internal and not accessible/replaceable
Jun 29 23:56:02 <Milhouse2> iPhones won't work on any other network - not even the iPod functionality
Jun 29 23:56:16 <Dr_Nunim> So how are you supposed to sell them?
Jun 29 23:56:22 <Milhouse2> And unless these iPhones are being sold with the activation code they'll be paperweights
Jun 29 23:56:25 <Dr_Nunim> Wouldn't they be programmed to your account?
Jun 29 23:56:32 <Milhouse2> You'd have thought so
Jun 29 23:56:59 <Dr_Nunim> He says "Upon purchase we will email you the code that you need for activation via iTunes.
Jun 29 23:57:07 <Dr_Nunim> I suppose thats the code.
Jun 29 23:57:11 <Milhouse2> There is a $175 option to get out of the AT&T contract... it's possible these are such phones but whether they can be re-registered is another matter
Jun 29 23:57:20 <Milhouse2> Dr Nunim - yes
Jun 29 23:57:27 <pupnik> isn't there an #iphone channel for this?
Jun 29 23:57:32 <Milhouse2> :)
Jun 29 23:57:38 <pupnik> oh, there is
Jun 29 23:57:54 <Molagi> its always nice to talk shit about iphone
Jun 29 23:57:57 <Milhouse2> Just having a laugh at the suckers on eBay wanting (or trying to sell) an iPhone :)
Jun 29 23:58:09 <Dr_Nunim> 3.5-inch (diagonal) widescreen multi-touch display
Jun 29 23:58:09 <Dr_Nunim> 480-by-320-pixel resolution at 160 dpi
Jun 29 23:58:21 <Dr_Nunim> Junk :o
Jun 29 23:58:21 <Molagi> i think people over #iphone wouldnt like our discussions
Jun 29 23:58:22 <Molagi> :P
Jun 29 23:58:45 <Milhouse2> Awesome - that's like such high resolution, Apple are so innovative... nobody else can match that rez!
Jun 29 23:59:03 <Milhouse2> Molagi - could be fun for a while... ;)
Jun 29 23:59:12 <Milhouse2> I think I'll join up and lurk
Jun 29 23:59:22 <Molagi> hehe i can already smell the flames
Jun 29 23:59:26 <Milhouse2> Damn, only 5 people??!
Jun 29 23:59:39 <Milhouse2> And one of them was Dr Nunim!
Jun 29 23:59:49 <Molagi> blasphemy
Jun 29 23:59:49 <Dr_Nunim> Lies!
Jun 29 23:59:56 <Dr_Nunim> I would never be caught in the iphone chan.
Jun 30 00:00:04 <Dr_Nunim> I don't secretly love apple!
Jun 30 00:00:12 <Milhouse2> I have proof! :)
Jun 30 00:00:43 <Molagi> i wanna see videos of people karate chopping iphones to pieces
Jun 30 00:00:50 <Dr_Nunim> What I don't understand is that they had a YouTube commercial for the iphone yet the browser doesn't display flash..
Jun 30 00:01:30 <Milhouse2> Molagi - I'm surprised such a video hasn't appeared of someone trashing an iPhone.. they did it to all of the new consoles
Jun 30 00:01:45 <Molagi> yeah
Jun 30 00:01:52 <Molagi> karate chop would look cool though
Jun 30 00:02:02 <Molagi> like breaking those boards
Jun 30 00:02:08 <Molagi> but just with an iphone
Jun 30 00:02:10 <Dr_Nunim> Not as dramatic to smash an iphone.
Jun 30 00:02:22 <Dr_Nunim> People didn't camp out for day(s) to get them.
Jun 30 00:02:26 <Milhouse2> Sure it would be - in front of all the queueing fan bois
Jun 30 00:02:35 <pupnik> Fix Neo1973.  Open source, better resolution.  And you can easily port your happy-fun-apps to it
Jun 30 00:02:40 <pupnik> s/Fix/FIC
Jun 30 00:03:03 <pupnik> Might be possible to run maemo on it too
Jun 30 00:03:10 <Milhouse2> I think I might have to get me one of them thar Neo1973s when they become available, probably one of the Phase 2 units at the end of this year (or there abouts)
Jun 30 00:03:23 <pupnik> Any word on pricing?
Jun 30 00:03:33 <Dr_Nunim> Why does it look so ugly?
Jun 30 00:03:47 <pupnik> Designed in Asia
Jun 30 00:03:59 <Milhouse2> I thought the silver/black one looked ok, don't care much for the orange or green colour scheme though!
Jun 30 00:04:05 <Milhouse2> price - I'm sure it will be competitive
Jun 30 00:04:07 <pupnik> I think it's decent.
Jun 30 00:04:35 <pupnik> I like the little loop for a string/chain.
Jun 30 00:05:51 <Dr_Nunim> Yeah but it's qwertyless.
Jun 30 00:08:30 <Milhouse2> not too sure about the loop - seems to increase the size of the device without adding any real value
Jun 30 00:09:32 <Milhouse2> hopefully the hardware will get a make over before final release - i have to admit the Apple iPhone is pretty good looking, the Neo1973 could be made to look similar
Jun 30 00:09:58 <pupnik> Yep, they'd be smart to emulate iphone more closely - piggyback on the style.
Jun 30 00:10:14 <pupnik> That's what asian corps do anyway, with just about any product (cars, appliances)
Jun 30 00:12:05 <Milhouse2> $350 is the target price for the Neo1973
Jun 30 00:12:36 <Milhouse2> screen is only 480x640 - shame :(
Jun 30 00:12:48 <pupnik> "only"
Jun 30 00:12:53 <Milhouse2> indeed, "only"
Jun 30 00:13:02 <Milhouse2> that res is crap for surfing
Jun 30 00:13:18 <Dr_Nunim> We've only got 800x480.
Jun 30 00:13:19 <Milhouse2> would never go back to my VGA iPaq
Jun 30 00:13:28 <pupnik> what is the iphone res?
Jun 30 00:13:29 <Milhouse2> the extra pixels make all the difference
Jun 30 00:13:36 <Milhouse2> less than the Neo!
Jun 30 00:13:45 <Dr_Nunim> iPhone res is TV I think.
Jun 30 00:13:46 <pupnik> 480x320 iirc
Jun 30 00:13:51 <Dr_Nunim> Oh.
Jun 30 00:14:30 <Dr_Nunim> The ability to change directions is kind of neat.
Jun 30 00:14:33 <pupnik> so the neo costs less, is open source and has 2x the res.  Iphone may win on style, but not on hardware, afaict
Jun 30 00:14:47 <Milhouse2> pupnik - yes, it's 320x480, eeeeeek!
Jun 30 00:15:01 <Milhouse2> plus the neo has GPS
Jun 30 00:15:41 <Milhouse2> the neo isn't likely to replace my internet tablet unless they can match the 800x480 resolution
Jun 30 00:15:45 <pupnik> Same here
Jun 30 00:16:03 <Milhouse2> can't see why FIC can't increase the screen resolution - 640x480 will look pretty lame coming into 2008
Jun 30 00:16:20 <pupnik> an 800x480 screen would make it the size of the 770
Jun 30 00:16:23 <pupnik> or larger
Jun 30 00:16:31 <Dr_Nunim> So?
Jun 30 00:16:34 <Milhouse2> http://gizmodo.com/gadgets/smartphones/first-look-the-antiiphone-openmokos-neo1973-236841.php
Jun 30 00:16:43 <Dr_Nunim> It's only a bit bigger then my smartphone.
Jun 30 00:16:46 <Milhouse2> look at the pictures - plenty of plastic available
Jun 30 00:16:49 <Dr_Nunim> And not nearly as thick.
Jun 30 00:17:11 <pupnik> i dunno man, 640x480 is damn good for a phone.
Jun 30 00:17:18 <Milhouse2> but horrible for surfing
Jun 30 00:17:38 <pupnik> better than 160x160
Jun 30 00:17:38 <Milhouse2> though not as horrible as 480x320 it has to be said :)
Jun 30 00:17:42 <pupnik> yep
Jun 30 00:18:08 <Milhouse2> i think 800x480 is the sweet spot where you can view sites without monkeying around with "optimized view" and that crap
Jun 30 00:18:16 <pupnik> you're right about that
Jun 30 00:18:23 <Dr_Nunim> 800x600 would have been nice
Jun 30 00:18:54 <pupnik> A lot of users have trouble reading the 770 screen.  Can't make 800x480 much smaller
Jun 30 00:19:03 <Milhouse2> I think slightly wider than 800 would be perfect - not so bothered about the vertical scrolling
Jun 30 00:21:42 <Dr_Nunim> That'd be fine but then add a scroll wheel.
Jun 30 00:22:26 <milhouse> hmmm what did i miss? :)
Jun 30 00:23:06 <pupnik> 02:20 < Dr_Nunim> That'd be fine but then add a scroll wheel.
Jun 30 00:25:36 * pupnik duct-tapes milhouse to the channel
Jun 30 00:25:50 <milhouse> yay, i got my nickname back!
Jun 30 00:26:13 <milhouse> for some reason i couldn't log in with it the other week but now i can
Jun 30 00:28:23 <Dr_Nunim> hrm that was bad
Jun 30 00:28:26 <Dr_Nunim> it crashed on me
Jun 30 00:28:41 <pupnik> opera isn't 100% robust on wonky websites
Jun 30 00:29:07 <milhouse> or even non-wonky sites... ;)
Jun 30 00:29:33 <Dr_Nunim> I meant the 770 itself ;p
Jun 30 00:30:11 <pupnik> i think i've had about 8 crashes in as many months
Jun 30 00:30:22 <pupnik> but as always ymmv
Jun 30 00:31:08 <pupnik> i'm still lmaoing at the japanese game show with the girls and the big iguana
Jun 30 00:34:44 <milhouse> I have to say that the OpenMoko wiki beats the pants off the new Maemo "wiki" for looks and readability
Jun 30 00:34:49 <KaylaKaze> minimo won't work :-(
Jun 30 00:34:56 <milhouse> just reading about the hardware now... http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Neo1973_Hardware#LCD_Display_Module_.28LCM.29
Jun 30 00:35:18 <KaylaKaze> oh! there it is. just takes a really long time to start.
Jun 30 00:35:34 <KaylaKaze> and then it crashed :-(
Jun 30 00:36:41 <Dr_Nunim> sounds like firefox :)
Jun 30 00:36:52 <KaylaKaze> I neve have problems with ff
Jun 30 00:37:14 <Niacin> do you need > 64mb flash card to install os2007 on 770?
Jun 30 00:37:37 <milhouse> no card is needed, but swap is always useful
Jun 30 00:37:52 <milhouse> you can choose the size of swap up to 128mb
Jun 30 00:38:28 <KaylaKaze> I closed everything else and it works... but own't connect to anything
Jun 30 00:38:43 <Niacin> hmm even with everything uninstalled
Jun 30 00:38:49 <Niacin> i still have < 78mb
Jun 30 00:39:26 <Niacin> so how does one do the install?
Jun 30 00:40:09 <Niacin> ./dev/mtdblock4          123.5M     62.9M     60.6M  51% /
Jun 30 00:40:10 <pupnik> IT2007 is the Hacker edition
Jun 30 00:40:28 <pupnik> if you have some experience with debian packages and the command line, you might like it
Jun 30 00:40:40 <pupnik> Otherwise you're going to end up with a lot of broken apps
Jun 30 00:40:52 <Niacin> sounds like fun
Jun 30 00:41:03 <milhouse> in terms of "installing OS2007 HE on 770" - just flash it like you would OS 2006
Jun 30 00:41:09 <KaylaKaze> oh, that's why. for some reason my connection disconected
Jun 30 00:41:22 <Niacin> yeah but how do i flash it if i have no space on the device ;)
Jun 30 00:41:34 <pupnik> It installs a whole new root fs
Jun 30 00:41:35 <milhouse> it doesn't install to flash card
Jun 30 00:41:54 <Niacin> i only have a 64mb flash card
Jun 30 00:41:57 <milhouse> you replace your existing OS installation on the internal memory - it will wipe all existing data
Jun 30 00:41:58 <Niacin> and the .bin file is 78mb
Jun 30 00:42:03 <Dr_Nunim> Ooh... 128mb swap....
Jun 30 00:42:12 <Dr_Nunim> I don't understand why that wasn't part of 2006.
Jun 30 00:42:22 <pupnik> Niacin, it doesn't install to flash card
Jun 30 00:42:24 <Niacin> so how does one actually flash it... if the userland has < 78mb free
Jun 30 00:42:43 <Niacin> pupnik: i understand this... i'm not trying to install it on the flash...
Jun 30 00:42:47 <milhouse> it wipes the internal memory
Jun 30 00:42:56 <Niacin> i got that like 3 times already
Jun 30 00:42:56 <milhouse> you have 128Mb internal memory on the deive
Jun 30 00:43:01 <milhouse> s/deive/device
Jun 30 00:43:25 <Niacin> yes but mine out of the box seems to have < 70mb free
Jun 30 00:43:29 <Niacin> so no space for the image
Jun 30 00:43:34 <milhouse> right...
Jun 30 00:43:44 <Dr_Nunim> Well some is being taken up by the os..
Jun 30 00:43:44 <Niacin> soooooo again how does one flash it if i have no where to put it ;)
Jun 30 00:43:45 <milhouse> the image doesn't go on the device
Jun 30 00:43:51 <milhouse> just try it
Jun 30 00:44:01 <milhouse> you don't copy the image to the device
Jun 30 00:44:08 <pupnik> correct
Jun 30 00:44:12 <Niacin> arr its a usb flash?
Jun 30 00:44:14 <milhouse> you use the flasher which loads the image over what is already there
Jun 30 00:44:15 <KaylaKaze> at least my D&D page works in minimo, though the recalculations are slow
Jun 30 00:44:16 <Niacin> this makes more sense
Jun 30 00:44:51 <Dr_Nunim> minimo does ajax better?
Jun 30 00:45:02 <milhouse> can't do it any worse
Jun 30 00:45:10 <Dr_Nunim> it could not do it all :p
Jun 30 00:45:44 <KaylaKaze> apparently
Jun 30 00:45:53 <milhouse> true :) i think it does ajax - haven't tried it to be honest. I like minimo, but the UI still needs more work before it replaces opera (it's not far off)
Jun 30 00:46:51 <KaylaKaze> th recalculations aren't exaclty fast on my pc either
Jun 30 00:47:25 <KaylaKaze> now I just need to figure out how to serve it from the local web browser, php, and sql so I don't use battery power using the wifi
Jun 30 00:47:53 <rhys> what kind of usb port does the n800 have?
Jun 30 00:48:06 <milhouse> a semi functional one
Jun 30 00:48:12 <milhouse> mini USB
Jun 30 00:48:29 <milhouse> female
Jun 30 00:48:48 <rhys> it a usb slave ? you plug it into a computer to let the flash / sd cards act as a drive?
Jun 30 00:49:00 <pupnik> yes
Jun 30 00:49:21 <milhouse> yes, it will appear as a mass storage device in windows etc.
Jun 30 00:49:32 <KaylaKaze> I wonder if it'd be better if I set it up so that when a change is made, php does calculations and sends back the results instead of doing the calculations in javascript
Jun 30 00:49:39 <rhys> ive heard something about changing it to a USB host. does it work? can you use a flash drive with it? do flash drives fall under the 100mA limit?
Jun 30 00:50:08 <rhys> usb keyboards?
Jun 30 00:50:20 <milhouse> when doing client side processing you should always consider that the client may not be the fastest computer in the world so if you can do the calculation server side you should
Jun 30 00:50:52 <milhouse> rhys: i think it's being worked on but needs changes in the kernel
Jun 30 00:51:05 <milhouse> rhys: worked on by the community, not nokia
Jun 30 00:51:23 <Dr_Nunim> Where'd you get minimo from?
Jun 30 00:51:37 <rhys> milhouse, so not a viable solution as of yet?
Jun 30 00:51:38 <KaylaKaze> maemo
Jun 30 00:51:42 <KaylaKaze> I think
Jun 30 00:51:44 <KaylaKaze> maybe not
Jun 30 00:51:48 <Dr_Nunim> checked there.
Jun 30 00:51:50 <milhouse> rhys: not yet, but maybe one day...
Jun 30 00:52:09 <milhouse> minimo: http://tonikitoo.blogspot.com/2007/06/minimo-02-maemo-port-release-and-new.html
Jun 30 00:55:17 <milhouse> Wow, that iPhone auction is now up to $18K! I think someone is having a laugh...
Jun 30 00:55:52 <rhys> wow
Jun 30 00:55:58 <rhys> when..the n800 is better
Jun 30 00:56:06 <KaylaKaze> minimo doesn't semm to have bookmarks
Jun 30 00:56:45 <milhouse> KaylaKaze: Bookmarks are a little bit "broken" in the latest minimo
Jun 30 00:57:03 <milhouse> I believe the author is aware
Jun 30 00:58:19 <milhouse> haha, that iPhone auction is increasing by about $500 every 30 seconds!
Jun 30 00:58:25 <milhouse> now up to $19,100
Jun 30 00:58:33 <milhouse> 15 hours to go!
Jun 30 00:58:46 <milhouse> should hit a million quite easily
Jun 30 00:59:07 <milhouse> damn, stopped increasing now
Jun 30 01:03:31 <KaylaKaze> now I need to get maeo mapper set to download maps...
Jun 30 01:03:47 <pupnik> you have gps cellfone?:
Jun 30 01:06:21 <KaylaKaze> bo
Jun 30 01:06:24 <KaylaKaze> no
Jun 30 01:06:36 <Dr_Nunim> Well, minimo displays google nicer
Jun 30 01:06:47 <Dr_Nunim> Opera has a habit of making text boxes disappear.
Jun 30 01:08:02 <KaylaKaze> and opera turned off my javascript again...
Jun 30 01:09:07 <Dr_Nunim> wow, meebo works on minimo!
Jun 30 01:09:50 <Dr_Nunim> seems to choke the cpu though
Jun 30 01:09:57 <Dr_Nunim> would probably work much better on an n800
Jun 30 01:11:20 <pupnik> ah never saw meebo before - interesting
Jun 30 01:11:42 <KaylaKaze> well, as long as I have a wifi connection, I can use google maps, but I'd like to get a repository for my city local for maemo mapper...
Jun 30 01:14:24 <rhys> KaylaKaze, doesnt it cache them?
Jun 30 01:20:06 <Dr_Nunim> Minimo isn't bad.
Jun 30 01:20:15 <milhouse> $32,100 for an iPhone now! LOL
Jun 30 01:20:24 <Dr_Nunim> Not perfect but it has different strenghts then opera.
Jun 30 01:20:34 <milhouse> $35,100 now
Jun 30 01:20:39 <milhouse> bid frenzy going on
Jun 30 01:20:42 <Molagi> is someone really gonna pay that price?
Jun 30 01:20:46 <Dr_Nunim> Nah.
Jun 30 01:20:46 <pupnik> i have a library of ramen
Jun 30 01:20:46 <milhouse> doubt it!
Jun 30 01:21:06 <milhouse> noodles?
Jun 30 01:21:56 <pupnik> yeah, 8 cases, different brands / flavors
Jun 30 01:22:14 <milhouse> nice, always handy if you get peckish in the middle of a good read
Jun 30 01:23:16 <pupnik> yeah, this local russian shop that just opened buys them.  I told the guy "I'll buy every new brand/flavor you get in here"
Jun 30 01:23:17 <Niacin> so when i go to flash the 770... do i need to put it into a certian mode?
Jun 30 01:23:22 <Niacin> or do i just plug it in and ./flash
Jun 30 01:23:44 <milhouse> plug in the USB cable, hold down the home key and power on the 770
Jun 30 01:23:57 <milhouse> it should go into "Flasher" mode
Jun 30 01:24:08 <pupnik> plug in, start flasher, turn on (on linux)
Jun 30 01:24:16 <pupnik> i started the flasher before turning it on iirc
Jun 30 01:24:38 <milhouse> i think if you hold down the Home key it puts it into flasher mode whereby it will wait for you to start the flasher
Jun 30 01:24:46 <pupnik> ahh
Jun 30 01:24:49 <milhouse> otherwise it will probably work as you describe
Jun 30 01:25:04 <pupnik> yeah read instructions before flashing
Jun 30 01:25:04 <KaylaKaze> yay! got samba access!
Jun 30 01:25:22 <pupnik> how did you mount from the 770 KaylaKaze ?
Jun 30 01:26:29 <Dr_Nunim> I like the japanese import noodles.
Jun 30 01:27:12 <KaylaKaze> pupnik: smb browser
Jun 30 01:27:20 <pupnik> the ones i have are all vietnamese or korean.  the japanese 'nissin' brand is kinda pricey.
Jun 30 01:27:23 <KaylaKaze> sucky program interface though
Jun 30 01:27:29 <pupnik> sorry s/vietnamese/thai
Jun 30 01:27:36 <pupnik> aha KaylaKaze i was trying to mount from command line
Jun 30 01:27:41 <Niacin> flasher mode have a usb symbol in top right?
Jun 30 01:27:46 <Niacin> and stick on the nokia screen?
Jun 30 01:27:47 <milhouse> yes
Jun 30 01:27:51 <milhouse> yes
Jun 30 01:28:07 <milhouse> that means it's waiting for you to run the flasher utility
Jun 30 01:28:48 <ericz> anybody have any experience setting up a vpn daemon on a home linux box to tunnel into from their 770?
Jun 30 01:30:29 <Niacin> Found image xloader (length 13824)
Jun 30 01:30:30 <Niacin> Found image secondary (length 86912)
Jun 30 01:30:30 <Niacin> Invalid data block subblock count (3)
Jun 30 01:30:35 <Niacin> i get that when i run flasher
Jun 30 01:31:03 <milhouse> what OS are you flashing? and which flasher are you using?
Jun 30 01:32:06 <Niacin> 2007 hacker and using latest flasher from nokia
Jun 30 01:32:16 <milhouse> Hurrah - $60,100 for an iPhone now!!!!
Jun 30 01:32:21 <milhouse> flasher 3?
Jun 30 01:32:31 <milhouse> you might want to try flasher-2 with 770
Jun 30 01:32:38 <Niacin> arr ok
Jun 30 01:33:02 <milhouse> what size is your bin?
Jun 30 01:33:09 <milhouse> exactly
Jun 30 01:33:13 <milhouse> in bytes
Jun 30 01:33:30 <milhouse> SU-18_2007HACKER_2.2006.47-17_PR_F5_MR0_ARM.bin
Jun 30 01:33:40 <milhouse> mine is 82,150,887 bytes
Jun 30 01:34:43 <Niacin> arr that looks like it worked
Jun 30 01:34:46 <Niacin> its flashing now
Jun 30 01:35:15 <milhouse> it's working with flasher-2?
Jun 30 01:35:18 <Niacin> ya
Jun 30 01:35:43 <milhouse> ok cool - i always wondered if flasher-3 was backwards compatible with the 770, obviously not
Jun 30 01:36:08 <ericz> anybody used the 770 with a vpn?
Jun 30 01:37:27 <Niacin> milhouse did yours reboot automaticly?
Jun 30 01:38:58 <milhouse> yes, but only because i told it to
Jun 30 01:39:41 <milhouse> i normally flash with "./flasher -F <bin> -R -f"
Jun 30 01:39:58 <KaylaKaze> pdf files are slow to render :-(
Jun 30 01:41:19 <pupnik> PDF is bloaty by design
Jun 30 01:42:04 <pupnik> like so many things, it gets fat and ugly with age
Jun 30 01:44:12 <KaylaKaze> well, ocr'd docs with images hidden aren't too bad...
Jun 30 01:44:34 <Dr_Nunim> I hate PDF
Jun 30 01:44:51 <Dr_Nunim> even on my dual core a 2 megabit pdf can bring the cpu to a hault for a few seconds.
Jun 30 01:45:03 <Dr_Nunim> Horrible software and such.
Jun 30 01:45:17 <KaylaKaze> yeah, but that's the format they scan RPG books as well as in which popsci puts out digital editions
Jun 30 01:45:39 <KaylaKaze> and cbr files aren't working :-(
Jun 30 01:45:52 <Dr_Nunim> I used to get popsci
Jun 30 01:46:02 <Dr_Nunim> I get wired now, for some reason they send them to me for free and I don't argue.
Jun 30 01:46:26 <KaylaKaze> I was getting CGW for free for quite a while
Jun 30 01:47:14 <pupnik> there's a cbr viewer for nokias iirc
Jun 30 01:47:14 <Niacin> hehe when my 2007 dims... the screen flickers like crazy
Jun 30 01:47:54 <KaylaKaze> I think if I can get a 2GB card, it'll act better... maybe
Jun 30 01:48:03 <pupnik> Niacin: i saw something like this.  if you tap the screen-brightness control at the top, do you see screen brightness going up and down quickly?
Jun 30 01:49:32 <Niacin> ya
Jun 30 01:49:49 <pupnik> looks like a bug.  i'll have to file one
Jun 30 01:49:59 <pupnik> can you see the actual brightness bar going up and down?
Jun 30 01:52:27 <Niacin> yeah
Jun 30 01:52:47 <pupnik> i couldn't turn it off when that happened
Jun 30 01:52:50 <pupnik> can you power down?
Jun 30 01:52:55 <Niacin> sec installin stuff
Jun 30 01:53:38 <Dr_Nunim> http://www.tatermitts.com/
Jun 30 01:54:01 <Dr_Nunim> Just saw the commercial on TV.
Jun 30 01:54:04 <pupnik> most of us won't click on random URLs.  Give a title or description please.
Jun 30 01:54:12 <Dr_Nunim> It's tatermitts!
Jun 30 01:54:18 <Dr_Nunim> Potato peeling gloves.
Jun 30 01:56:55 <pupnik> heh
Jun 30 01:57:28 <Niacin> the 770 have some sort of serial interface? jtag?
Jun 30 01:57:38 <milhouse> next to the battery
Jun 30 01:57:44 <Niacin> jtag or serial?
Jun 30 01:57:50 <milhouse> serial i think
Jun 30 01:58:47 <Niacin> so no LVTTL to RS232 level translater built in?
Jun 30 01:58:55 <Niacin> s/translater/translator
Jun 30 01:59:10 <Niacin> i still have a cable laying around from my msntv hack
Jun 30 02:04:33 <milhouse> Niacin: http://www.gossamer-threads.com/lists/maemo/developers/6981#6981
Jun 30 02:08:02 <Niacin> thanks
Jun 30 02:20:31 <Niacin> is there some sort of built in wget
Jun 30 02:20:34 <Niacin> on the 770?
Jun 30 02:20:40 <Niacin> like a cmd line url grabber
Jun 30 02:21:00 <milhouse> not built in, but wget is available
Jun 30 02:21:09 <Niacin> even in ipkg?
Jun 30 02:21:25 <Niacin> eh dpkg
Jun 30 02:21:38 <pupnik> there's a deb somewhere
Jun 30 02:21:59 <milhouse> http://maemo.org/downloads/product/wget
Jun 30 02:22:17 <pupnik> nice milhouse
Jun 30 02:22:41 <pupnik> i'm imposing a personal moratorium on googling for other people in chat
Jun 30 02:22:54 <milhouse> haha, fine by me :)
Jun 30 02:25:24 <sorbix> oooh i like the sound of that 2007 om the 770 linlk
Jun 30 02:25:26 <sorbix> link*
Jun 30 02:25:30 <sorbix> on*
Jun 30 02:25:31 <Dr_Nunim> just install weget
Jun 30 02:25:47 <sorbix> does OS 2007 fix flash issues?
Jun 30 02:25:48 <Dr_Nunim> gah too late
Jun 30 02:26:21 <pupnik> 2007 slicker in some ways.  the virtual keyboard more responsive.  the click sound much more elegant (it's like tapping a screwdriver on crystal glass, instead of wood)
Jun 30 02:26:28 <milhouse> sorbix - depends on what issues. same flash as on OS 2006, but some flash issues might be OS related and fixed in OS 2007
Jun 30 02:26:47 <sorbix> oh OK, from what I read, flash in 2007 is a newer version?
Jun 30 02:26:59 <milhouse> it is on N800 but not 770
Jun 30 02:27:06 <sorbix> i just got the 770 and am in the process of trying to fix flash
Jun 30 02:27:20 <milhouse> flash is licenced to the device so Nokia have to ship the old Flash on 770 no matter what OS is used
Jun 30 02:27:25 <sorbix> yea, i was disappointed to hear that 2007 was only for 800
Jun 30 02:27:32 <milhouse> kinda...
Jun 30 02:27:44 <sorbix> so theres no way to update it myself?
Jun 30 02:27:48 <milhouse> OS 2007 HE works well on 770
Jun 30 02:27:58 <milhouse> no - the OS isn't entirely open source
Jun 30 02:28:04 <sorbix> ouch
Jun 30 02:28:07 <milhouse> indeed
Jun 30 02:29:04 <sorbix> so what happens if everyone starts using the new GPL?  does that mean new gpl 3 software cant be on the tablets?
Jun 30 02:30:30 <sorbix> man i was really hoping to play tower defense on my 770 :)
Jun 30 02:30:47 <pupnik> someone ported it?
Jun 30 02:31:28 <sorbix> err, the new flash-based TD games
Jun 30 02:31:31 <pupnik> sorbix, where's tower defense?  too many hits for "tower defense"
Jun 30 02:31:38 <pupnik> ah
Jun 30 02:32:06 <Dr_Nunim> Play it in flash?
Jun 30 02:32:18 <pupnik> i did some early flash development and i think it stinks
Jun 30 02:32:31 <sorbix> well, thats the problem.  all the new flash games use the latest flash version i guess
Jun 30 02:32:34 <Niacin> how do i get libxau0 ?
Jun 30 02:32:43 <Dr_Nunim> :(
Jun 30 02:34:14 <KaylaKaze> I need something like nautilus for maemo
Jun 30 02:37:20 <sorbix> man the 770 is so close to being awesome
Jun 30 02:37:34 <sorbix> just falls short with shitty flash and java support
Jun 30 02:37:40 <pupnik> isn't the screen dreamy, sorbix?
Jun 30 02:37:43 <sorbix> yea
Jun 30 02:37:46 <Dr_Nunim> http://maemo.org/downloads/product/canoe/ ?
Jun 30 02:37:53 <Dr_Nunim> Kayla^
Jun 30 02:38:00 <pupnik> like when that nokia logo comes up, i can't see any pixels along the diagonal
Jun 30 02:38:02 <sorbix> its the most satisfying gadget to hold
Jun 30 02:39:05 <Dr_Nunim> Eh, java is silly.
Jun 30 02:39:09 <Dr_Nunim> Flash I could see though.
Jun 30 02:39:21 <sorbix> google apps need it
Jun 30 02:39:25 <sorbix> like the calendar
Jun 30 02:39:43 <sorbix> for some reason it doesnt work well as it is
Jun 30 02:39:50 <sorbix> i mean, its there its just buggy
Jun 30 02:40:35 <ttuttle> ericz: Mine's getting here tomorrow!
Jun 30 02:40:48 <ericz> ttuttle, mine says it left maryland about an hour ago
Jun 30 02:40:58 <ttuttle> ericz: Yay.  Where are you?
Jun 30 02:41:01 <ericz> if the dude floors it, maybe it'll come tomorrow, but expected delivery is still tuesday
Jun 30 02:41:12 <ttuttle> ericz: Mine's expected tomorrow.
Jun 30 02:41:12 <ericz> virginia, but the most south east part of VA you can get
Jun 30 02:41:20 <ericz> no fair!
Jun 30 02:41:46 <ttuttle> ericz: Meh.  I ordered earlier.  My brother's is expected Monday or Tuesday, 'cause he ordered later.
Jun 30 02:41:55 <Dr_Nunim> I got mine Today :)
Jun 30 02:42:03 <ttuttle> Dr_Nunim: pffft.
Jun 30 02:42:04 <Dr_Nunim> Wasn't expected until tomorrow.
Jun 30 02:42:08 <ttuttle> Dr_Nunim: Cool.
Jun 30 02:42:16 <ttuttle> Dr_Nunim: Is it awesome?
Jun 30 02:42:17 <Dr_Nunim> And with the terrible FedEx tracking site I didn't know what was going on.
Jun 30 02:42:17 <ericz> i mean, there's no reason, if they just left maryland, for it to not be delivered tomorrow other than laziness, but it should *definently* be here monday
Jun 30 02:42:20 <Dr_Nunim> Yes, yes it is.
Jun 30 02:42:35 <Dr_Nunim> once I get my 1gb card on monday it'll be more awesome.
Jun 30 02:42:44 <ericz> i was getting concerned, woot.com forums have a ton of comments about "white screen"
Jun 30 02:43:06 <ttuttle> ericz: Oh noes.
Jun 30 02:43:11 <brlancer> ericz: why should they deliver it earlier than they need to? better to save the space on the truck for people paying extra for one or two day shipping
Jun 30 02:43:16 <ttuttle> ericz: Is it a big problem, or just a lot of people talking about it?
Jun 30 02:43:25 <Dr_Nunim> the WSOD?
Jun 30 02:43:29 <Dr_Nunim> I thought that was flash fixable.
Jun 30 02:43:31 <ericz> i mean, it's only 4 hours from where they just left from, and to here..
Jun 30 02:43:33 <ttuttle> brlancer: If there's extra space, or they'd have to run an extra truck to get it there within the promised period.
Jun 30 02:43:38 <ericz> 4 hours shouldn't take 4 days
Jun 30 02:43:46 <ttuttle> ericz: WSOD?
Jun 30 02:44:15 <brlancer> ttuttle: agreed--but it's in their interest to meet all agreed upon service levels
Jun 30 02:44:18 <ericz> woot.com had a few people mention that had "WSOD" (i guess thats what you'd call it?)
Jun 30 02:44:34 <brlancer> and so the 5-7 day shipping sits on a loading dock while overnight stuff gets put in front
Jun 30 02:45:19 <Dr_Nunim> Eh, I was happy with my fedex
Jun 30 02:45:24 <Dr_Nunim> 1 day early aint bad.
Jun 30 02:45:30 <Dr_Nunim> UPS has a better tracking system though.
Jun 30 02:45:34 <Dr_Nunim> I always know where my package is
Jun 30 02:45:40 <ericz> so my thing gets to the local fedex eadquarters tomrrow, or late tonight, and sits their until tuesday.. i mine as well go over there [30min drive] and ask for it
Jun 30 02:45:47 <Dr_Nunim> FedEx it said it was in texas until yesterday.
Jun 30 02:45:51 <brlancer> Dr_Nunim: mine was a day early also (showed up after 5p last night)
Jun 30 02:45:54 <Dr_Nunim> You can call and see if you can pick it up.
Jun 30 02:46:12 <Dr_Nunim> Mine was here by the time I woke up, 10:30.
Jun 30 02:46:20 <KaylaKaze> yay! I can run my 770 over vnc
Jun 30 02:46:40 <pupnik> KaylaKaze: synergy is awesome on the 770 too
Jun 30 02:46:54 <pupnik> mine sits below my desktop monitor and i use my mouse and keyboard with it
Jun 30 02:46:57 <ericz> i'd rather run my pc over vnc from the 770 :P but with xfce on linux and dual monitors, i don't think i can
Jun 30 02:47:03 <KaylaKaze> I'm guessing that's a remote viewer?
Jun 30 02:47:19 <pupnik> no it lets you share keyboard + mouse + cutandpaste between multiple machines
Jun 30 02:47:20 <brlancer> synergy is a virtual kvm
Jun 30 02:47:36 <KaylaKaze> I haven't seen that listed...
Jun 30 02:47:41 <pupnik> the cutandpaste is awesome -- hilight a url in chat and paste it on another machine
Jun 30 02:47:44 <brlancer> it's damn awesome, especially with stunnel to encrypt the traffic
Jun 30 02:48:31 <pupnik> http://box.mmapps.net/~keesj/synergy/
Jun 30 02:49:21 <brlancer> schweet
Jun 30 02:49:22 <milhouse> wow, $51,000,100 for the iPhone on ebay now ($51million)!
Jun 30 02:49:28 <Dr_Nunim> lol
Jun 30 02:49:31 <sorbix> has anyone gotten google calendar to work on the 770?
Jun 30 02:49:32 <Dr_Nunim> so fake.
Jun 30 02:49:45 <ericz> iPhone's like $500, right?
Jun 30 02:49:55 <Dr_Nunim> I think its 600 or 800
Jun 30 02:49:57 <milhouse> correction, $52m - just jumped $1m
Jun 30 02:50:26 <milhouse> shit
Jun 30 02:50:30 <milhouse> $66m now
Jun 30 02:50:34 <milhouse> LOL
Jun 30 02:50:35 <ericz> holy shit
Jun 30 02:50:37 <Dr_Nunim> gonna get pulled soon.
Jun 30 02:50:46 <milhouse> Free shipping though
Jun 30 02:50:47 <milhouse> http://cgi.ebay.com/Apple-iphone-8GB-8-GB-i-phone-Mac-cell-phone-FREE-SHIP_W0QQitemZ290134220620QQihZ019QQcategoryZ64355QQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem
Jun 30 02:50:52 <ericz> oooh free shipping!
Jun 30 02:50:55 <ericz> im sold.
Jun 30 02:50:58 <milhouse> i know - bargain!
Jun 30 02:51:14 <ericz> no payments until '08!
Jun 30 02:51:21 <milhouse> $76m now!!!!
Jun 30 02:51:27 <Dr_Nunim> Google calendar use ajax?
Jun 30 02:51:29 <milhouse> nuts
Jun 30 02:51:33 <ericz> the seller has 100% feedback too.
Jun 30 02:51:45 <milhouse> bless
Jun 30 02:51:51 <sorbix> yea something like that
Jun 30 02:51:56 <sorbix> it just doesnt render right
Jun 30 02:52:18 <sorbix> gmail works fine though
Jun 30 02:52:19 <Dr_Nunim> I had 100% until some asshole didn't like a usps delay
Jun 30 02:52:43 <Dr_Nunim> What part doesn't work?
Jun 30 02:52:52 <ericz> i wonder if there's a cap on how much can actually be bid
Jun 30 02:53:12 <milhouse> i was just wondering if this could turn out to be the most expensive auction in ebay history
Jun 30 02:53:22 <ericz> it'll get taken down, im sure
Jun 30 02:53:23 <milhouse> something else has probably topped it though
Jun 30 02:53:40 <KaylaKaze> it says synegy is incompatible
Jun 30 02:53:41 <ericz> 99m!
Jun 30 02:53:49 <sorbix> Dr_Nunim: it only renders the top left google logo and a couple links but there st is nada
Jun 30 02:53:57 <sorbix> rest*
Jun 30 02:54:11 <Dr_Nunim> Sorbix, try in minimo.
Jun 30 02:54:15 <Dr_Nunim> Seems to be working fineish..
Jun 30 02:54:17 <Dr_Nunim> Well working.
Jun 30 02:55:05 <ericz> hrm, to place a big over 15k, you have to provide a valid credit card or complete the id verify process (whch costs $5) that sucks
Jun 30 02:55:09 <ericz> bid*
Jun 30 02:56:06 <sorbix> minimo only has windows and cab installers it seems
Jun 30 02:56:10 <sorbix> one sec...
Jun 30 02:56:32 <sorbix> nvm\
Jun 30 02:57:28 <brlancer> ericz: it's not hard to get a valid credit card number
Jun 30 02:57:37 <KaylaKaze> that synergy deb says it's incompatible
Jun 30 02:58:39 <pupnik> IT2007?
Jun 30 02:58:54 <Dr_Nunim> http://dragon-gaming.com/screenshgot00.png
Jun 30 02:58:58 <Dr_Nunim> Google Calendar
**** ENDING LOGGING AT Sat Jun 30 02:59:57 2007