**** BEGIN LOGGING AT Mon Oct 15 02:59:57 2007 Oct 15 04:52:18 hello guys Oct 15 04:52:29 can someone help me. I seem to have broken my wifi on my n800 Oct 15 04:52:49 I don't want to reflash it since I spent the entire day setting it up Oct 15 04:53:05 ..and also because whatever's wrong might be in a config file that will backup Oct 15 04:53:57 Did you try rebooting? Oct 15 04:54:03 yes Oct 15 04:54:06 Okay Oct 15 04:54:31 when I goto select connection, nothing shows but my cell profiles, and there are like 15-20 routers I can see usually Oct 15 04:54:43 lsmod? Oct 15 04:55:51 lsmod... Oct 15 04:55:55 I just installed cifs support Oct 15 04:56:04 I don't know what lsmod means though Oct 15 04:56:05 I'm nub Oct 15 04:56:55 I used insmod ./cifs.ko Oct 15 04:57:00 could this have something to do with it Oct 15 04:57:29 Dunno, Oct 15 04:57:29 <_Monkey> Dunno, is probably a beta of something that, in brief, hasn't been applied in community projects before - or not that we know - so just try and tell us what you like, what you miss, what you think hasn't got a point Oct 15 05:25:37 pupnik, gas assembles (gcc internally calls it ;-) Oct 15 05:25:43 and morning Oct 15 05:25:43 <_Monkey> aloha Oct 15 06:37:30 anyone successfully compile OWB? Oct 15 06:37:43 YAWB Oct 15 06:37:59 Yet another wine blog? Oct 15 06:38:41 yet another web browser Oct 15 06:39:17 http://www.sand-labs.org/owb/wiki/OwbN800 Oct 15 06:39:38 followed those steps, getting an error on cmake. Oct 15 06:40:05 which is the command before make for the browser Oct 15 06:40:34 What's the error? Oct 15 06:41:53 any idea what com.nokia.AS_DIMMED_infoprint well-known name represents? :-) Oct 15 06:42:15 cmake ../owb-n800 Oct 15 06:42:28 host_usr/bin/cmake: error while loading shared libraries: libstdc++.so.6: cannot open shared object file: No such file or directory Oct 15 06:43:15 i went thru all the steps, made sure that file is located where its supposed to be. Oct 15 06:43:31 still get the error Oct 15 06:45:34 Is it the right version for that platform? Oct 15 06:45:57 A 32-bit app under 64-bit still requires 32-bit libraries and will complain when it can't find any. Oct 15 06:47:00 i'm guessing it os Oct 15 06:47:02 is Oct 15 06:47:08 followed all the links. Oct 15 06:47:16 you saying wrong cmake? Oct 15 06:48:43 Maybe, try different stuff out and see what happens. Oct 15 06:49:09 I was saying more along the lines of making sure you got the right version of libstdc++.so.6 for cmake Oct 15 06:49:50 mkdir lib && cp -l /targets/SDK_X86/usr/lib/libstdc++.so.6* lib Oct 15 06:49:54 Under amd64 debian, I usually do, Oct 15 06:50:03 apt-file search to find which package has it. Oct 15 06:50:05 the SDK_X86 part should be the armel libs? Oct 15 06:50:28 Go to http://package.debian.org/ and download the i386 package. Oct 15 06:50:49 Then run dpkg -X /emul/ia32-linux/ Oct 15 06:51:04 After that the 32-bit application has what it wants. Oct 15 07:07:49 i'll just use minimo. Oct 15 07:23:21 unique311, MicroB and Minimo are two different things right? Oct 15 07:23:44 well Oct 15 07:23:58 2 different web browsers Oct 15 07:24:08 i use microb Oct 15 07:24:35 Does it work well? Oct 15 07:24:40 but been trying those iphone friendly site Oct 15 07:25:12 microb do well with them Oct 15 07:25:31 just want to try out different browsers and see which gives best result Oct 15 07:26:33 read that minimo crashes alot. Oct 15 07:26:48 still going to try it out. Oct 15 07:29:39 sciboy: here's screenies of minimo http://tonikitoo.blogspot.com/2007/03/minimo-maemo-port-01611-1-available.html Oct 15 07:52:43 minimo wins... Oct 15 07:53:00 Wins what? Oct 15 07:53:36 sciboy: unique311 means minimo works better for him than the vanilla Opera browser, I guess. Oct 15 07:53:54 yeah Oct 15 07:54:06 But compared to microb? Oct 15 07:54:08 works better with the iphone sites... Oct 15 07:54:22 better than microb with Oct 15 07:54:24 strong with Oct 15 07:54:33 the iphone friendly sites. Oct 15 07:55:31 i like the tabs Oct 15 07:55:39 can microb or opera do tabs? Oct 15 08:07:03 hmm. are the introspection informations missing from com.nokia.statusbar missing by purpose? Oct 15 08:07:27 (or any of the other D-Bus objects in the SDK for that matter) Oct 15 08:36:10 interesting... http://tabletblog.com/2007/10/third-tablet-gets-name-nokia-n810.html Oct 15 08:38:47 yes ty Oct 15 08:42:11 Ooooh, cool. Oct 15 08:43:26 I am now lagging, yay for uploads! Oct 15 08:46:58 doesn't 810 imply an 800+wimax? Oct 15 08:47:44 Yeah, doesn't sound like a generational upgrade. Oct 15 08:48:18 Good! Oct 15 08:48:18 =D Oct 15 08:48:36 Wimax couldn't possibly interest me any less. Oct 15 08:48:39 Means the focus is still on developing this generations device. Oct 15 08:48:53 the name implies 800+ something little Oct 15 08:48:54 like wimax Oct 15 08:49:09 nokia probably needs a wimax product for pilot projects etc Oct 15 08:49:20 sciboy, they've already said that they're not going to drop support for the N800 like they did the 770. >_> Oct 15 08:49:25 but i coldn't care less about wimax either Oct 15 08:49:38 GeneralAntilles: saying doesn't make things so ;) Oct 15 08:49:47 GeneralAntilles, Yeah but even with a new device that means developers would slowly abandon ship. Oct 15 08:50:13 Morning, all Oct 15 08:50:18 The 770 is still quite well supported by developers (except where limited by power), so I don't see the point. Oct 15 08:50:56 if the new device had more buttons etc.. that would mean apps not suitable for the old devices and support slowly dropping Oct 15 08:50:59 The point doesn't matter at all since it won't be happening. Oct 15 08:51:06 Yay N800! Oct 15 08:51:57 as far as this user is concerned, any new nokia still has to beat the 770 Oct 15 08:52:11 never been tempted by a n800 pupnik ? Oct 15 08:52:13 Psh, the N800 has already soundly done that. Oct 15 08:52:29 yes but not $400 tempted Oct 15 08:52:43 It's only $230. Oct 15 08:52:56 closer to $400 in germany Oct 15 08:53:06 Ah, right, sorry about that. ;) Oct 15 08:53:07 $230 for a n800... i know i'm on a different currency, but that sounds very low Oct 15 08:53:15 That's what it is. Oct 15 08:53:17 buy.com Oct 15 08:53:17 <_Monkey> i think buy.com is awesome because they ship free and dont charge tax a lot of places Oct 15 08:54:18 are they US only? ;) Oct 15 08:54:26 Yup Oct 15 08:54:42 shame Oct 15 08:54:59 and i've lost touch with my american friends that could have mailed it to me... but i've got mine now anyways Oct 15 08:55:35 I just got my N800 from the only local store that stocks it. Oct 15 08:55:45 Dispite the lack of said price drop. =( Oct 15 08:55:49 I don't think we've got a store round here that stocks it Oct 15 08:59:46 sup Oct 15 08:59:55 Flaming monkeys! Oct 15 09:11:01 flying beavers Oct 15 09:34:01 So the N800 can't handle 800x480 video at a reasonable rate? Oct 15 09:34:41 depends on the encoding, sciboy ... it'll cope with a lot of videos in mplayer, but if its re-encoded to be optimised for the n800, you can get decent playback Oct 15 09:35:23 1000-1500Kbps Xvid/MP4 @ 400x240 (padded) Oct 15 09:35:26 That's the resolution to use. Oct 15 09:35:30 Period. Oct 15 09:35:31 Oh good, cause the guides I read said to stick to 400x240 Oct 15 09:35:32 =| Oct 15 09:35:35 Damn. Oct 15 09:35:37 Pixel doubling Oct 15 09:35:37 <_Monkey> Pixel doubling is probably fun Oct 15 09:35:50 Looks good and runs cleanly. Oct 15 09:36:12 morning maemo Oct 15 09:37:34 I'll have to wait and see then. Oct 15 09:37:51 GeneralAntilles, does it really have to be padded? Oct 15 09:38:48 Well, since there isn't a video on the planet in a 10:3 aspect ratio . . . yes. Oct 15 09:39:04 I guess my first impression is that'd be bad, but it's probably a different story when you go from 75dpi to what ever the tablet screens are. Oct 15 09:39:04 erm, 5:3, rather Oct 15 09:39:06 ;) Oct 15 09:39:22 Yeah, it looks fine at that rez. Oct 15 09:39:23 no what I mean is, doesn't it work just as well if its 320x240 for 4:3 movies? Oct 15 09:39:29 I wonder if we'll see any video playback improvement in the N810 Oct 15 09:39:42 or can't it use the hardware pixel doubling if you do that? Oct 15 09:39:59 Probably 4:3 is fine. Oct 15 09:40:33 Holy crap, 225dpi? Oct 15 09:40:44 But I'm not familiar enough with the intricacies of media playback on the N800 to say for sure. Oct 15 09:40:46 Hehe, yeah. Oct 15 09:41:02 ... Something tells me the screen is a whole lot smaller than I am expecting. Oct 15 09:41:37 4.5" Oct 15 09:41:41 or 4.1" Oct 15 09:41:43 Don't remember. Oct 15 09:41:47 * sciboy shrugs. Oct 15 09:41:58 Those measurements mean nothing to me. Oct 15 09:42:03 yep, the 225dpi is very nice Oct 15 09:42:09 this is what I've been using: mencoder -o "n800/filename.avi" -oac mp3lame -lameopts preset=128 -ovc lavc -lavcopts vcodec=mpeg4:vbitrate=600:threads=4 -zoom -vf dsize=400:240:2,scale -idx "filename.avi" Oct 15 09:42:27 10.5cm Oct 15 09:42:37 GeneralAntilles, Diagonal? Oct 15 09:42:40 Yeah Oct 15 09:42:47 the dsize means that it scales to either the x or the y value, depending on what what would make it the largest Oct 15 09:42:48 9.0x5.5cm Oct 15 09:42:50 but it doesn't do padding Oct 15 09:43:14 I'll have to try that, TPC Oct 15 09:43:16 its worked very well for me at least, nice quality, small size, fast encoding speed Oct 15 09:43:36 Make it easier than padding by hand. Oct 15 09:43:41 * GeneralAntilles is a mencoder nooblette. Oct 15 09:44:24 GeneralAntilles, Damn, much smaller than I was expecting. Oct 15 09:44:29 dsize is a pretty new addition to mencoder iirc Oct 15 09:44:53 At least it'll fit in my pocket. Oct 15 09:44:56 Gotta fit in your pocket,. Oct 15 09:44:58 Erm, yeah. ;) Oct 15 09:45:14 I think the N800 screen size is very nice Oct 15 09:45:44 I honestly don't know what to expect now. Oct 15 09:45:46 the pda I had before was about the same height, but it wasn't widescreen Oct 15 09:45:51 and it was only 320x320 Oct 15 09:46:15 and it was reasonably fine for watching movies, etc Oct 15 09:46:22 but N800 is great for it Oct 15 09:46:32 I have a GP2X, 320x240. Oct 15 09:47:29 N800 is absolutely fantastic. Oct 15 09:47:37 what I especially like about the high resolution compared to screen size on the N800, is when reading ebooks Oct 15 09:47:50 its much better than reading on a computer screen, or my old pda Oct 15 09:48:15 I'll be viewing images at a short distance. Oct 15 09:48:16 It's gotta be the greatest ebook reader on the market. Oct 15 09:48:19 a normal computer screen is about 100 DPI, when they print paper books they print at about 300 DPI Oct 15 09:48:21 Images look fanstastic Oct 15 09:48:33 minus the 64k-color screen. Oct 15 09:48:44 minus? Oct 15 09:48:44 Hopefully that gets improved in the next version. Oct 15 09:48:46 for reading you only really need two colors :P Oct 15 09:48:57 You really notice it with gradients and such. Oct 15 09:49:00 (and those should not be black and white, too high contrast) Oct 15 09:49:12 Oh, it's only a 8-bit panel K. Oct 15 09:49:32 I use white on black at a low brightness. Oct 15 09:49:33 Looks great Oct 15 09:49:35 But isn't it less noticable at 225dpi? Oct 15 09:49:58 GeneralAntilles, try light grey on black instead Oct 15 09:50:04 trust me, its even better Oct 15 09:50:04 Gradients? Hardly. Oct 15 09:50:15 At low-brightness, the text basically is gray. ;) Oct 15 09:50:15 and you can read for alot longer and not have your eyes take damage Oct 15 09:50:34 yeah Oct 15 09:50:39 but with a light gray its even better Oct 15 09:50:53 and sometimes you have to go to high brightness (if outside on a sunny day or something) Oct 15 09:51:11 Gray is pointless Oct 15 09:51:13 It is actually viewable outdoors? Oct 15 09:51:18 adjust the white intensity with the backpanel Oct 15 09:51:23 saves the battery. Oct 15 09:51:26 Yes. Oct 15 09:51:36 yes, but in direct sunlight its hard to see things Oct 15 09:51:37 I live in Florida and it's fine in summer sunlight. Oct 15 09:51:50 Transreflective would be nice. Oct 15 09:51:54 But it's fine as it is. Oct 15 09:52:01 The only time I have problems seeing my N800 is in very strong direct sunlight Oct 15 09:52:16 Normally on the train to work when I actually want to see it though :) Oct 15 09:52:20 TPC, Hard, being, squint your eyes and try to see anything but the lcd itself, or really washed out colours but still easily recognisable? Oct 15 09:53:43 Anybody use the device over VNC? Oct 15 09:53:47 sciboy, you can see good enough to control some apps, like changing song when playing music, but I wouldn't watch a movie or read a book in direct sunlight in the middle of the day Oct 15 09:54:04 Any recommendations for getting enter to send enter instead of bring up the fullscreen board? Oct 15 09:54:15 but holding your hand up as shadow makes it viewable Oct 15 09:54:51 and of course the sun is alot stronger at 10-14 than it is later in the afternoon, you might be fine in the afternoon, I really haven't tried it that much Oct 15 09:57:36 but its alot better than my old pda, my old pda I couldn't use outside at all Oct 15 10:10:53 Here's hoping. Oct 15 10:13:21 Hi lard Oct 15 10:13:29 morning sciboy Oct 15 10:24:06 Okay, news of my order should arrive tomorrow. Oct 15 10:30:02 * sciboy does some quick research on existing 2d game engines that'd likely run under the N800 Oct 15 10:35:56 Seems pygame is the main way to go, but I might even use python for the backend and use the browser as the interface. Oct 15 10:42:11 sloooow Oct 15 10:42:41 What is? Oct 15 10:42:47 that would be I imagine Oct 15 10:42:56 python + browser for a game Oct 15 10:43:01 i mixed pygame with gtk. using a gtk modal dialog to get input from the user Oct 15 10:43:29 I haven't tried the browsers under the n800 yet, but in theory it'd only be as fast as they are. Oct 15 10:45:07 anyone here done any video decoding profiling? Oct 15 10:45:27 That aside, provided they're not incredibly slow the python backend wouldn't be doing much work, it's just to store users progress and serve files as needed. Oct 15 10:45:46 Also play sounds, if I ever get around to that. Oct 15 10:52:49 Anyway advantage is that'd enable me to develop the content in a graphic environment. Oct 15 10:53:17 what kind of game will this be? Oct 15 10:53:53 At its most demanding, basic side-scroller with point'n'click elements. Oct 15 10:58:31 pupnik_: you're awfully quiet what with the mention of games! Oct 15 10:58:35 :) Oct 15 10:58:42 Anyway, once I get my hands on my N800, it'll only take me an hour to find out how well it'd work out. Oct 15 10:59:07 well good luck, games aren't really my thing I'm afraid Oct 15 10:59:26 I'm not a programmer so there isn't much else I can really contribute. =P Oct 15 11:02:55 I seem to remember I learned to program so I could get around the security restrictions and play solitaire on my school network... :) Oct 15 11:03:09 Time well spent ey? Oct 15 11:03:24 of course :) Oct 15 11:03:43 I got into art because I failed at programming. D: Oct 15 11:03:57 *shudder* Oct 15 11:04:16 I wasn't too good at art Oct 15 11:04:30 I wasn't either 2 years ago. Oct 15 11:04:55 But 2 years has been plenty of time to draw. Oct 15 11:05:22 give me 20 years perhaps :) Oct 15 11:06:21 Or a bulk order of computer paper and lead for a mechanical pencil. Oct 15 11:07:04 CAD package I reckon Oct 15 11:08:20 back to my earlier question, has anyone done any video decoding profiling? Oct 15 11:08:38 Web games make me cry but I'll be darned if I don't try to improve on it, considering the amount of work that has already gone into the browsers themselves. Oct 15 11:09:21 I wonder whether you need the overhead of the rest of the browser, and how much that would impact performance Oct 15 11:09:41 i.e. would it be better to rip out the html renderer and use that Oct 15 11:09:59 It'd make the demands sky rocket, but I'm doing my best to keep everything piss simple to compensate. Oct 15 11:10:43 Oh, the HTML renderer is where most of the work will be done, I doubt all the rest will do much. Oct 15 11:10:53 ok Oct 15 11:12:16 The question is which browser should I execute through python? Oct 15 11:12:53 Does any of them have a command line option for disabling option or defaulting to fullscreen? Oct 15 11:13:03 options aka. toolbars* Oct 15 11:13:07 I think opera works better, but the gecko-based one is supposed to have better support, and is being actively updated Oct 15 11:13:08 sciboy, next to gtk/hildon and python, there's also SDL and flash Oct 15 11:13:32 s/support/support for web standards Oct 15 11:13:33 pupnik_, Both of which would be tons more difficult for me to work with. Oct 15 11:13:49 pupnik_, I'm thinking python and web browser right now. Oct 15 11:14:07 If the performance works out with a few animated objects on screen. Oct 15 11:14:31 Joy, I seem to have fallen into receiving the opening salvos in a flamewar with Texrat on ITT. That was unplanned. Oct 15 11:14:48 Congratulations. Oct 15 11:14:51 Flamebait Oct 15 11:14:52 often the 'best tools for the job' are the tools you are familiar with Oct 15 11:15:26 * Jaffa thinks he can blame milhouse, though ;-) Oct 15 11:16:01 * lardman is feeling a bit cold, goes looking for the flames :) Oct 15 11:16:04 pupnik_, I'm not touching flash authoring ever again. Oct 15 11:16:34 pupnik_, If the web browser doesn't work out I'll start playing with Pygame though. Oct 15 11:16:45 Had a look at Fenix? Oct 15 11:17:03 no Oct 15 11:17:06 hi Oct 15 11:17:07 pupnik_, http://fenix.divsite.net/index.php?opcion=1&lang=en Oct 15 11:17:24 I'm trying to compile HAL for N770 using scratchbox Oct 15 11:20:19 pupnik_, I heard it mentioned quite a bit while I was still following the GP2X Oct 15 11:20:58 whatever is easiest Oct 15 11:21:14 rapid prototyping, sketching out your ideas Oct 15 11:21:27 jdjdjdjdjd: having any luck? Oct 15 11:21:39 then if you run into roadblocks, you can redo it in a lower level framework Oct 15 11:22:44 I probably wont, lower level frameworks aren't my idea of fun. Oct 15 11:23:07 If it doesn't work, I'll simplify the concept and its demands even further till it does. Oct 15 11:25:27 http://www.ekxd.com/productshtml/UMPC001.htm <- That reminds me of something, can't place what though. Oct 15 11:30:16 lardman, havent manage to do it Oct 15 11:30:25 lardman, any help? Oct 15 11:31:08 jdjdjdjdjd: what's the problem? Oct 15 11:31:44 lardman I'm unable to compile the package Oct 15 11:32:03 is it supported for N770? Oct 15 11:32:50 is it at all possible to develop on the device itself? Oct 15 11:34:50 jdjdjdjdjd: no idea, I do remember seeing something about Nokia thinking of using it in the future though Oct 15 11:35:03 flip^: no gcc afaik Oct 15 11:36:33 i've got a gcc in my app manager, but its not installable :( Oct 15 11:37:28 lardman ok then I have to wait or do it any other way Oct 15 11:39:41 flip^: no idea about that, probably a pseudo package so scratchbox thinks it's got gcc Oct 15 11:39:53 jdjdjdjdjd: what do you want it for? Oct 15 11:41:50 flip^, One of the many reasons I'll be sticking to Python for development on the N800. Oct 15 11:44:38 lardman detecting insertion of mmc card... is there any code available out there? Oct 15 11:45:41 jdjdjdjdjd: I don't know I'm afraid, perhaps ask on the maemo-developers' list Oct 15 11:47:27 http://www.internettablettalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=10565&page=2 interesting Oct 15 11:49:19 I'm going to release a test version of kagu 1.0.9 today. Need some more testing before I announce/upload it Oct 15 11:52:15 its wrote in c? Oct 15 11:54:32 Can someone hit the "start animation" on this and see how well it works? Oct 15 11:54:33 http://www.esqsoft.com/javascript/parallax-scrolling-example.htm Oct 15 12:08:40 Actually, Let's see how hard the N800 chokes on this: http://www.dhteumeuleu.com/dhtml/nav-3D.html Oct 15 12:13:33 so who wants to test the new kagu Oct 15 12:13:39 me Oct 15 12:14:09 get it from here then: https://garage.maemo.org/frs/?group_id=304 :) Oct 15 12:14:22 i didn't upload it to the repositories just yet Oct 15 12:14:41 sciboy: A bit slow, but works.. Oct 15 12:14:42 kool Oct 15 12:14:52 sciboy: nice link Oct 15 12:15:37 unique311: please don't open a thread in ITT this time. i'll do it after the repository upload :p Oct 15 12:15:43 np Oct 15 12:16:02 just need to get it tested a little more first, trev's been busy and i'm the only active developer now Oct 15 12:19:13 different skin Oct 15 12:20:43 t'd probably be much faster with actual size Oct 15 12:20:48 It'd* Oct 15 12:20:52 actual size images* Oct 15 12:20:52 could definitely do without the scroll thingie Oct 15 12:21:08 disq: ^ Oct 15 12:21:54 you'll get used to it :) it's a little too big and doesn't look perfect but our theme artist is not around either Oct 15 12:22:09 i hated it the first time around Oct 15 12:22:28 but having the finger scroll cancels that out. Oct 15 12:22:36 not necessarily Oct 15 12:22:56 it also shows the length of the list and where you are Oct 15 12:23:13 (i don't really use it for scrolling either) Oct 15 12:23:54 i can see it working, but it needs to loose a couple of pounds.. Oct 15 12:24:04 i know Oct 15 12:24:25 i'm fine with it being two or four pixels wide, even :) don't need finger scrolling there Oct 15 12:25:13 but i didn't want to delay the release any longer (we're already two weeks late) for that, didn't want to disable it either Oct 15 12:26:06 new skin is awesome. any chance in choice next release? Oct 15 12:26:39 people will miss the green theme. we want to make it selectable by the next release Oct 15 12:27:13 What is kagu? Oct 15 12:27:14 <_Monkey> well, kagu is http://maemo.org/downloads/product/kagu or #kagu Oct 15 12:28:08 unique311: be sure to read the changelog btw :) https://garage.maemo.org/frs/shownotes.php?release_id=958 Oct 15 12:30:19 That's cool, although I'll be maintaining a remote copy of my music collection and only making my favourites local. Oct 15 12:30:37 i use it on the road Oct 15 12:31:06 I have to wait until I establish my favourite songs. =P Oct 15 12:31:49 everything i just tried work.. Oct 15 12:32:24 from the changelog.. Oct 15 12:32:37 but i am on a fresh install. Oct 15 12:32:55 i'll release it and see what happens Oct 15 12:33:01 updated to the new firmware this morning. Oct 15 12:33:01 kinda bored with all the delays Oct 15 12:33:04 How can I take screenshots of my maemo application? Oct 15 12:33:17 mkshottool Oct 15 12:33:22 mh Oct 15 12:33:32 mh or mk Oct 15 12:34:57 ok, thanks Oct 15 12:35:25 so besides that overweight scroll bar. love it. Oct 15 12:36:25 disq: would it be too much to ask, choice on that first page to turn scroll bar on or off. Oct 15 12:36:49 mmmm.. i'll work on it Oct 15 12:38:21 hmm I have been missing a lot! Oct 15 12:38:25 Hi all Oct 15 12:38:30 hi! Oct 15 12:39:43 rumors about a third tablet are really getting big Oct 15 12:40:15 * czr sighs from relief Oct 15 12:40:19 a break. finally :-) Oct 15 12:40:29 and the kagu green look is pretty nice Oct 15 12:40:48 I really need to start using the n800 for video and music Oct 15 12:40:55 keesj, kagu green? Oct 15 12:42:18 http://maemo.org/downloads/product/kagu/ Oct 15 12:42:52 ah. thanks. Oct 15 12:42:55 last time I looked at it is was black Oct 15 12:43:16 it looks very prof Oct 15 12:43:29 heh. you should see the new kagu :P Oct 15 12:43:47 very nice. Oct 15 12:43:53 looks really good Oct 15 12:44:23 disq, any more recent mugshots of it? Oct 15 12:44:35 there's a test deb at garage Oct 15 12:44:49 and that deb contains screenshots? ;-) Oct 15 12:44:57 no :) Oct 15 12:55:58 it's only down .59% in premarket trading :) Oct 15 12:59:51 somehow iphone.facebook.com works better in minimo than in microb Oct 15 13:01:06 what useragents? Oct 15 13:01:18 meaning? Oct 15 13:01:31 javascript:navigator.userAgent Oct 15 13:02:09 hang on Oct 15 13:03:33 Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; Linux armv6l; rv:1.8.1.5pre) Gecko/20070705 Minimo/0.020 Oct 15 13:05:37 aww, my highlight scrooled offscreen Oct 15 13:06:09 that sucks Oct 15 13:15:26 unique311: there's 1.0.9-2 now at the same place, with a scrollbar toggle option Oct 15 13:45:19 How does xv work on the N800, does it provide an interface to the abilities of the Epson chip? Oct 15 13:45:56 ok, kagu 1.0.9 now officially released. http://maemo.org/downloads/product/kagu to download, still didn't update the screenshots though :) Oct 15 13:47:26 save playlist as functionality, default media player selection, minor enhancements, all around better performer, new theme Oct 15 13:50:36 anyone have a link to the Epson chip used in the n800? Oct 15 14:21:39 hello has someone manages to run gpprof or oprofile on the n800 ? Oct 15 14:22:15 chris-work, I was able to run oprofile this summer. It does require a new kernel to do so. Oct 15 14:28:53 jamey: I sow you jtold before in this channel and i tried to use the kernel you put in the web but somehow it doesn´t work ... i wrote you a letter then ... because here it´s difficult to go into the irc.... what should i do with the initfs you put there ? Oct 15 14:31:17 chris-work, you need to also install the initfs Oct 15 14:32:03 otherwise the wifi driver does not load and the watchdog timer resets the device Oct 15 14:32:32 I seem to have given away my N800 again. Will have to fund another one in order to test. Oct 15 14:33:29 is it possible to emulate tap and hold in the sdk? Oct 15 14:33:56 isn't it right-click? Oct 15 14:34:32 have i install kernel and initfs at the same time ? Oct 15 14:34:45 Tak|work, I trying that, but without success Oct 15 14:34:57 hmm :-/ Oct 15 14:35:39 i installed first the kernel and then the initfs and then nothing was going on ... Oct 15 14:38:45 Tak|work, working now. I was trying to set it on a label. Switched to button and worked. Oct 15 14:39:25 ah, cool Oct 15 14:48:23 fucking metalayer-crawler Oct 15 14:49:34 disable it once and for all :) Oct 15 14:50:07 doesn't that have adverse effects? Oct 15 14:51:20 the default media player gets dumber, that's all :) Oct 15 14:52:16 ah Oct 15 14:52:24 I never use it anyway Oct 15 14:54:56 what i did was chmod a-x /etc/init.d/metalayer-crawler0 Oct 15 14:55:14 effective Oct 15 14:55:18 i also disabled canola's autoscan on mmc-change thingy from gconf Oct 15 14:55:56 heh, I've uninstalled canola Oct 15 14:56:04 Tak|work: :-( Oct 15 14:56:06 eheheh Oct 15 14:56:14 k-s[WORK]: sorry man Oct 15 15:24:14 Tak|work: it was from me - found something that reduced (not eliminated) stuttering on FCEU / 770 Oct 15 15:24:24 oh? Oct 15 15:25:11 yes one thing about it on the 770 - the fps counter is not fps of screen updates, but fps of internal engine afaict Oct 15 15:25:27 when increasing frameskip, fps goes up - most i saw was about 45 Oct 15 15:26:12 second, looking in drivers/pc/main.c i saw it initializes fceu with 48000 hz sound Oct 15 15:27:39 long soundrate=48000; and soundbufsize= very small. Changing soundbufsize to around 512 really cut down on percieved skippyness when frameskip =2-3 Oct 15 15:30:24 |R: said he hears no sound stuttering with fceu on N800, but other people do Oct 15 15:30:40 there shouldn't be any stuttering on N800 with bora3 or bora4 Oct 15 15:32:01 nice Oct 15 15:32:23 i did not know this :) Oct 15 15:32:52 Bora? Oct 15 15:32:53 <_Monkey> somebody said Bora was pointing to 3.2 which is not working yet Oct 15 15:33:02 K Oct 15 15:33:03 pupnik_: hmm, the rate and buffer sizes should be being set in the sound driver Oct 15 15:33:12 * Tak|work goes to check Oct 15 15:33:43 near top of main.c, around line 55 Oct 15 15:38:13 the sound code is too baffling for me :(. fceu->underrun_handler->sexyAL->sdl->esd Oct 15 15:38:44 on 770 we constantly generate underrun condition Oct 15 15:39:28 i also tried very simple update loop, without screen update or input update, just doing sound = gives same results Oct 15 15:40:28 if you set the frameskip very high on 770, you get smooth sound Oct 15 15:40:59 or if you screw up the graphics code so that it's not drawing to the screen ;-) Oct 15 15:41:03 hi Oct 15 15:41:04 ok. well, at least this makes sense to me, since fceu internally tries to update at 50/60 hz and i hadn't found settings to get it up to 50/60 Oct 15 15:41:18 interesting, i removed screen updates entirely and still got stuttering Oct 15 15:42:34 well it's good to know you have smooth playback on n800 Oct 15 15:43:37 do you see the soundrate= in main.c? Oct 15 15:44:37 you should get smooth playback on 770 without screen updates Oct 15 15:44:55 yes, I see it - I also note that it's settable via command line arguments Oct 15 15:45:04 * Tak|work add arguments to xmaeme and try Oct 15 15:47:56 ok will try identical FCEUD_Update but comment-out BlutScreen(XBuf); Oct 15 15:50:04 http://tuxrecife.blogspot.com/2007/10/xomap-3x-more-fast.html interesting Oct 15 15:52:55 disq: damn, that's nice Oct 15 15:54:47 viva brasil! Oct 15 15:55:09 there's a mailing list link in the post. and danielstone replied to that. so it's possible we'll see this patch in a near maemo release Oct 15 15:55:27 killer Oct 15 15:56:00 cool Oct 15 16:02:03 my verdict is that setting those flags doesn't noticeably improve audio quality, but *does* noticeably degrade gameplay quality Oct 15 16:02:50 i don't even think the existing code gives clean contiguous samples under any circumstances Oct 15 16:03:58 frameskip=59, disabled gfx gives full speed sound, but there is a jitter at about 40-60hz which sounds like breaks in sample data Oct 15 16:04:52 it manifests as a subtle buzz Oct 15 16:05:05 or not so subtle if you're a sound guy Oct 15 16:05:57 do you hear it too Tak|work ? Oct 15 16:06:21 it's not perfect, but the emulator is slightly pitch-shifted anyway, due to the way it emulates NES audio Oct 15 16:06:56 part of it is also that I'm degrading the rate to 8192Hz Oct 15 16:06:56 <_Monkey> okay, Tak|work. Oct 15 16:07:11 what solved the problem for the N800 / bora2? Oct 15 16:07:29 pupnik_: pixel doubling Oct 15 16:07:29 <_Monkey> somebody said pixel doubling was fun Oct 15 16:07:43 _Monkey: have you ever been stabbed in the face via IRC? Oct 15 16:07:43 <_Monkey> tak|work: i haven't a clue Oct 15 16:07:49 aight :) Oct 15 16:08:31 case closed. filed under 'reasons to upgrade' Oct 15 16:08:40 _Monkey: forget pixel doubling Oct 15 16:08:40 <_Monkey> lardman: I forgot pixel doubling Oct 15 16:10:46 jamey: do you remember if you have installed kernel and initfs at the same time ? Oct 15 16:11:17 hi all Oct 15 16:11:46 <|user|> heloo??? Oct 15 16:11:56 i would like to ask how i can do a cron on a n800? Oct 15 16:12:25 there is no cron and with alarmd i'm not able to understand... Oct 15 16:12:31 cron is not on the n800, which makes cron jobs pretty difficuly Oct 15 16:12:32 t Oct 15 16:12:39 :( Oct 15 16:12:44 eh i'm seeing! Oct 15 16:13:20 what is the easiest way to substitute cron? Oct 15 16:13:22 never really looked into compiling it, but it can'tbe hard Oct 15 16:14:11 i haven't found anything useful on internet about it Oct 15 16:14:24 hey I have a runaway process on my n800 and I am trying to determine what started it, any idead Oct 15 16:14:37 ideas how to figure it out Oct 15 16:15:05 keeps happening, its pissing me off Oct 15 16:15:40 lsof could help Oct 15 16:15:43 Oct 15 16:15:58 doesn't ps tell you? Oct 15 16:16:17 disq: It was the one-threaded process! Oct 15 16:16:32 ps fax is good for listing child processes as ascii trees Oct 15 16:17:33 ps Oct 15 16:18:22 penguinait killed his own process :) Oct 15 16:19:17 any idea on how to do like with cron? Oct 15 16:20:53 some perl script using time as value? Oct 15 16:21:39 I'd try building anacron Oct 15 16:22:36 Schedule::Cron Oct 15 16:23:28 zoran, i have to install any dependance? Oct 15 16:23:44 lemme c Oct 15 16:23:51 Tak|work, how i can build anacron? Oct 15 16:24:01 it is a module Oct 15 16:24:11 not as I see, but must to downlaod first Oct 15 16:24:43 zoran, have you used it? Oct 15 16:24:49 never :) Oct 15 16:24:50 it doesn't recall cron? Oct 15 16:24:58 the name let me think that.. Oct 15 16:25:00 :) Oct 15 16:25:02 I just found the module Oct 15 16:25:26 on perl always works as it was advertised Oct 15 16:26:32 and cross compiling something for the n800? it's hard? Oct 15 16:26:44 http://fcron.free.fr/ Oct 15 16:26:48 this seems ok Oct 15 16:26:57 setting up the development environment is a touch involved Oct 15 16:26:59 not really, once you setup your scratchbox Oct 15 16:27:07 what would you cross compile? Oct 15 16:27:11 cron would indeed be nice on the N800 Oct 15 16:27:14 http://fcron.free.fr/ Oct 15 16:27:19 this Oct 15 16:28:07 it's described as good also for environment not always on Oct 15 16:28:32 the compiling environment is scratchbox? Oct 15 16:29:01 c requirements! Oct 15 16:29:43 zoran, what? Oct 15 16:29:52 running mail system Oct 15 16:30:12 you can do also without it Oct 15 16:32:12 |R: ping? Oct 15 16:32:12 <_Monkey> ping is in 4.2007 on n800 :) Oct 15 16:32:36 * Tak ignore _Monkey Oct 15 16:32:39 http://www.anomaly-music.com/cron/ Oct 15 16:32:42 found it! Oct 15 16:33:25 pupnik_: would you like to test fceu current before I release? Oct 15 16:33:37 also xmaeme? Oct 15 16:35:27 Mat_Jack1, looks promissing Oct 15 16:35:35 :) Oct 15 16:35:38 i'll try! Oct 15 16:35:46 what device? Oct 15 16:35:51 n800 Oct 15 16:38:26 Mat_Jack1, what would you use scheduler for? Oct 15 16:38:53 to launch bashpodder Oct 15 16:39:02 it's a shell script that gets a podcast Oct 15 16:39:26 kulve: I was wrong, it is fully threaded Oct 15 16:39:43 Tak sure Oct 15 16:40:23 lardman: ok Oct 15 16:40:24 what's the best distribution method? email? Oct 15 16:40:54 sure, also if your router has dcc port open you can dcc to me Oct 15 16:46:06 found the Cron.om; requires Time::ParseDate, Data::Dumper Oct 15 16:50:17 Has anyone been able to send music from an N800 or N770 to a stereo bluetooth headset? Oct 15 16:50:22 * zoran gone to tell dragons all about danger playing with fire Oct 15 16:55:25 shapr: tried kagu? Oct 15 16:55:33 _Monkey: kagu? Oct 15 16:55:33 <_Monkey> kagu is, like, http://maemo.org/downloads/product/kagu or #kagu Oct 15 16:55:43 Kagu can play music via bluetooth? Oct 15 16:56:03 yay, A2DP! Oct 15 16:56:08 much happiness! Oct 15 16:56:18 Now I'll be able to listen to music while unicycling without cables! Oct 15 16:57:09 unicycling? cool Oct 15 16:57:14 see the a2dp instructions at http://www.internettablettalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=8435&highlight=a2dp Oct 15 16:57:29 heh, cables + unicycling sounds like trouble Oct 15 16:57:33 truly Oct 15 16:58:08 mountain unicycling with music - http://picasaweb.google.com/shae.erisson/OakMountain20070127/photo#5025111427466324306 Oct 15 17:04:53 Does A2DP work with OS2007 Hacker's Edition on the N770? Oct 15 17:05:33 you'll have to test that, but afaik with bare 770 a2dp is painfully slow Oct 15 17:06:11 I may have to upgrade. Oct 15 17:08:17 I don't care about lag time, but I do hope it's fast enough to replace my ipod shuffle (which sucks for a variety of reasons). Oct 15 18:45:29 CAO Oct 15 18:45:32 HELLO Oct 15 18:45:35 MONTENEGRO Oct 15 18:47:05 um Oct 15 18:49:10 o_O Oct 15 18:50:23 EX-YUGOSLAVIA, roger Oct 15 18:50:59 KARJALA Oct 15 18:51:00 er Oct 15 19:07:05 at least karjala is beer as well. I don't think anyone brews anything called "former yugoslavia". not yet at least. Oct 15 19:12:32 heh Oct 15 19:18:14 although there also was beer called 'karhu' in shanghai. also beer called 'golden eagle' (with chinese characters this time). and personal favourite, beer called 'reeb' (yes). Oct 15 19:18:49 I wonder if the same could be succesfull in finland. a beer called Tulo. Oct 15 19:36:02 kulve: you about at this hour? Oct 15 19:38:44 anyone know off hand if the kernel source for the n800 has been updated with the SD card patch? Oct 15 19:39:14 lardman: yes it has been Oct 15 19:39:20 The most recent release of OS2007 says "Includes patch to fix SD card corruption" Oct 15 19:39:58 btw, what's the max size SD card supported nowadays? Oct 15 19:40:02 shapr: I need to rebuild the kernel so I'm checking the source has been updated Oct 15 19:40:07 suihkulokki: thanks Oct 15 19:40:10 lardman: there's the source too Oct 15 19:40:36 kulve: hi, I was wondering if you'd built a new kernel with dsp debugging built in? Oct 15 19:40:40 it was mentioned on the mailing list that the "extra" mmc patches has has been applied to that too Oct 15 19:41:07 lardman: it's pretty trivial to do. I can do it tomorrow Oct 15 19:41:49 Is it possible to have two 32GB SDHC cards in the N800? Oct 15 19:42:13 kulve: I've done it for the Zaurus, just checking to not waste time doing it Oct 15 19:42:40 lardman: I'm not going to do it for myself now, so go ahead :) Oct 15 19:42:49 I can do it for you though, if you want :) Oct 15 19:42:50 kulve: I'll give it a go and see if I can remember, can you remember where the dsp debugging entry was? Oct 15 19:43:08 Wikipedia says only up to 8GB in each slot. Oct 15 19:43:24 search "MBOX" from the .config and guess the menu location from there Oct 15 19:43:26 but I'm off Oct 15 19:43:41 kulve: cheers, have a nice evening Oct 15 19:44:09 shapr: I think it will eat whatever is the max of SDHC spec. the "8GB support" means only means nothing bigger has been tested Oct 15 19:45:04 ah Oct 15 19:45:46 <`0660> yeah Oct 15 19:46:03 <`0660> just like 4gb of normal sd works just fine Oct 15 19:46:45 <`0660> at least with the cheap transcend Oct 15 19:48:34 Newegg only lists one 16gb SDHC card, going for $160. Oct 15 19:52:58 Hm, two 8GB cards for $120 or one 16GB card for $160? Oct 15 19:59:07 since when do 16GB cards work in N800 Oct 15 19:59:23 suihkulokki just said that any SDHC card should work. Oct 15 19:59:42 The SDHC spec goes up to 32GB. Oct 15 19:59:42 i don't know about this, just asking Oct 15 20:00:12 confirm before buying Oct 15 20:00:27 truly Oct 15 20:00:59 pupnik: it's not exactly what I said, see my comment above Oct 15 20:01:33 * shapr rereads Oct 15 20:09:37 * lardman notices OMAP hardware random number generator entry in .config Oct 15 20:21:44 is there programmer's editor (other than vi) for maemo? Oct 15 20:22:19 mcedit is good Oct 15 20:27:30 also zile Oct 15 20:27:58 mc ... :///// Oct 15 20:28:27 hello world Oct 15 20:28:29 anything based on gtksourceview? Oct 15 20:28:31 svu_ there is a nice editor written in python that supports running the current program. Oct 15 20:28:34 fwiw i'm attacking bugs.maemo.org Oct 15 20:28:59 i may or may not write an announcement on the browser project blog explaining why abusing bugs.maemo.org will not be tolerated Oct 15 20:29:03 keesj: the name? Oct 15 20:29:29 http://maemo.org/downloads/product/pygtkeditor Oct 15 20:29:40 thanks Oct 15 20:29:47 * dpryo recommends an editor on your computer, and sftp for i/o Oct 15 20:30:35 local edits are hell, unless you've got an external keyboard.. (which is still hell, because the return-button doesn't work) Oct 15 20:30:42 any fix for that btw? Oct 15 20:30:45 (on 770) Oct 15 20:31:38 keesj: looks really nice. It is a pity it does not support ruby... Oct 15 20:31:39 did anybody look at Raemo? http://raemo.garage.maemo.org/ it sounds nice Oct 15 20:35:56 looks nice Oct 15 20:37:01 kulve: hmm, compiled the kernel, and now get messages from mbox: in dmesg, but no dbg() messages Oct 15 20:37:45 kulve: I manually enabled one entry in .config - CONFIG_OMAP_DSP_MBCMD_VERBOSE=y Oct 15 20:38:14 kulve: let me know if you have any ideas what I did wrong Oct 15 20:55:02 wtf - somehow xmame is 9th most active on garage this week Oct 15 20:55:07 * Tak scratches head and doesn't argue Oct 15 21:01:13 Am I correct in thinking the newest Nokia image supports SDHC up to 8GB per card or 8GB total in the two card slots? Oct 15 21:05:30 8GB+ per card Oct 15 21:05:50 Nokia only guarantee 8GB but the firmware should support larger capacities Oct 15 21:18:01 fceu -bora4 and xmaeme 0.10 released, and uploaded to garage extras Oct 15 21:19:53 milhouse: thanks. One other question. what's the maximum card class (indicating bus speed I guess) the slots can handle? Oct 15 21:31:12 Hi! Oct 15 21:31:53 I just realised that the search on maemo.org doesn't search the wiki. Is this intentional? Oct 15 21:38:31 timeless: What's your idea of abuse? Oct 15 21:39:39 * sp3000 only saw an attack on invalid urls Oct 15 21:40:10 * sp3000 crosses out an item in a virtual todo list Oct 15 21:40:58 Anyone happen to know if there is actually someone working on the multimedia bugs? There's a ton of old simple bugs that haven't been touched or seemingly looked at in ages. Oct 15 21:43:19 yeah, also WEP+PEAP Oct 15 21:47:47 Has anyone tested both class 2 and class 6 SDHC cards in an N800? Are there significant performance differences? or are the benefits limited by the N800 card bus? Oct 15 22:01:51 hillct: I'd like to know if you find out. Oct 15 22:03:21 shapr: been reading. Lots of discussion. No answers Oct 15 22:03:24 ah Oct 15 22:03:32 the but speed supports at least class 4 Oct 15 22:03:38 not sure about class 6 Oct 15 22:03:38 That's good to know. Oct 15 22:05:29 shapr: http://www.internettablettalk.com/forums/archive/index.php/t-8426.html Oct 15 22:08:11 best deal I can find is this http://www.adorama.com/KGSD68GB.html but nobody is tyalking about Kingston SD cards so I don't know if they're any good Oct 15 22:15:38 why do you need such high speed on your sd card anyway? Oct 15 22:20:03 Why not? Oct 15 22:20:11 I try to tune everything to be as fast as it can be. Oct 15 22:37:00 TPC: when watching your porn, you don't want to see lots of frame freezes and jerkiness do you? Oct 15 22:38:57 shapr: I take it that rebate means release of a new higher capacity/faster product is imenant, but that's always the case I suppose Oct 15 22:39:15 Has anyone here installed the assembler on their nokia? Oct 15 22:49:21 at the risk of sounding unbearably ignorant, which assembler? Oct 15 22:49:29 i.e. could you point me to it Oct 15 22:49:41 I assume he's talking about asm. Oct 15 22:51:09 rodarvus: armasm? Oct 15 22:51:14 Any assembler. Oct 15 22:51:18 I don't know if ther eis more than one. Oct 15 22:51:26 Erm Oct 15 22:51:34 Robdgreat: rather. Oct 15 22:51:36 Sorry rodarvus Oct 15 22:52:00 I see Oct 15 22:52:04 checking it out Oct 15 22:52:41 hillct, movie playback is perfectly fine on the cheapest SD cards around Oct 15 22:53:14 just like it was with the pdas that existed 4 years ago Oct 15 22:53:43 you don't need any new techology for smooth video playback (altought the N800 screen is very nice for it) Oct 15 22:53:46 Anyone know why my mmc card stalls out whenever I try to copy too much stuff to it? Oct 15 23:04:57 Deformative: it resumes though after a while Oct 15 23:05:38 Mine doesn't. Oct 15 23:05:40 It stalls out. Oct 15 23:05:44 And an error comes up. Oct 15 23:05:56 Maybe I should try with cp instead of konqueror copy. Oct 15 23:06:04 how are you sharing Oct 15 23:32:19 Interesting. Oct 15 23:32:28 It will no longer connect to the pc. Oct 15 23:32:37 Lame and interesting at the same time. Oct 15 23:33:03 i'll assume you're using samba then Oct 15 23:33:17 Uh. Oct 15 23:33:18 Nope. Oct 15 23:33:22 Just a usb cable. Oct 15 23:34:28 ok Oct 15 23:36:18 Completely does not communicate with the device Oct 15 23:36:19 Hmm. Oct 15 23:36:30 No little usb symbol at the top of the screen. Oct 15 23:38:20 That usually happens when the cards are being used. Oct 15 23:38:28 eg. Playing music, etc.. Oct 15 23:40:07 zerojay: It isn't. Oct 15 23:40:21 Perhaps I need to mess with the flasher. Oct 15 23:40:29 What options should be enabled/disabled? Oct 15 23:42:09 Canola/Media player could be indexing the cards. Oct 15 23:42:19 Or you could have a bum jack/cable Oct 15 23:42:29 Does the computer show it in the USB device tree? Oct 15 23:42:51 No. Oct 15 23:42:59 there could be a bad reconnection, and kernel remounting as /dev/sdb1 Oct 15 23:43:13 Nope. Oct 15 23:43:23 The device doesn't even notice when the usb cable is plugged in. Oct 15 23:43:33 I think it is something weird witht he flasher. Oct 15 23:43:41 ah Oct 15 23:44:27 What is rd mode? Oct 15 23:44:28 <_Monkey> i heard rd mode was not needed Oct 15 23:45:07 WOW Oct 15 23:45:07 Lame Oct 15 23:45:09 good monkey, botsnak Oct 15 23:45:12 The device will not boot now. Oct 15 23:45:20 Oh, there it goes. Oct 15 23:45:58 I still would like to know what rd mode is. Oct 15 23:46:40 I'd guess the rd mode is something that is used when developing the device. Oct 15 23:47:19 Ugh, I really wish this would recognize the device. Oct 15 23:47:22 ._. Oct 15 23:48:13 Oh, I think I am in usb host mode. Oct 15 23:48:15 Aha. Oct 15 23:51:45 Aha, usb host mode was the problem. Oct 15 23:56:08 So, it still seems to be stalling. Oct 15 23:56:09 With cp Oct 15 23:56:12 But not timing out. Oct 15 23:56:15 I wonder if it will work now. Oct 15 23:56:36 Gotta be something on your end. Oct 15 23:58:15 Heh, it resumes after like, 2 minues of stalling. Oct 15 23:58:18 Cool. Oct 15 23:58:32 pupnik: do you know what causes this? Oct 15 23:58:38 Oh damnit. Oct 15 23:58:42 It didn't resume this time. Oct 15 23:58:45 Cp failed. Oct 15 23:58:49 Damnit! Oct 15 23:58:57 I think I have a defective mmc card or something. Oct 15 23:58:57 i suspect different problems Oct 15 23:59:12 i see regular pauses every 30 or so seconds Oct 15 23:59:24 Wouldn't be surprised if it was something to do with your USB host patch. Oct 15 23:59:34 Maybe it is a problem with hal/dbus ? Oct 16 00:00:12 Maybe you corrupted your card. Oct 16 00:00:40 I think I got a faulty card to begin with. Oct 16 00:00:43 Most people don't realize but yanking out the USB cable right after a copy to the card is shown on your OS to be finished can damage it. Oct 16 00:00:49 This thing has been working like shit since I got it. Oct 16 00:00:54 Because the copy isn't complete, regardless of what your OS says. Oct 16 00:01:53 I think pretty soon I will just dump all my files on an ftp. Oct 16 00:01:57 Then download them. Oct 16 00:02:27 What did you tinker with aside from the usb host mode stuff? Oct 16 00:04:29 That's it. Oct 16 00:04:57 Oh, and I formated my mmc to fat32 somehow. Oct 16 00:05:01 Do not remember how I did it. Oct 16 00:05:13 Because fat16 was going unbarably slow, not sure why. Oct 16 00:17:34 bzzt Oct 16 01:01:49 minimo the only browser that offers tab browsing? Oct 16 01:02:33 So far. Oct 16 01:02:47 We can only hope for that wonderful feature in one of the future MicroB updates. Oct 16 01:02:59 You already have that. Oct 16 01:03:00 Especially with switching windows being as much of a pain as it is. Oct 16 01:03:06 Do I now? Oct 16 01:03:18 GeneralAntilles: MicroB is just a browser engine, it can't add tabs to the UI shell Oct 16 01:03:38 Semantics, but ok. ;) Oct 16 01:03:45 so an update to the browser Oct 16 01:03:48 opera Oct 16 01:04:06 minimo works pretty descent. Oct 16 01:04:07 I am trying to install bash, and doing it with apt-get will replace busybox. Does that seem like a good idea? (on N800) Oct 16 01:04:12 <|R> is the TUN/TAP interface active in the latest 2007 firmware? Oct 16 01:04:13 Before you install microb, you can set stuff like tabbed browsing for opera. Oct 16 01:04:23 <|R> nn_ : i don't think so Oct 16 01:04:24 microb crashed on me 3 times today..so not happy with it. Oct 16 01:04:26 But, as predicted, it's horrible and a huge waste of space. Oct 16 01:04:44 |R: any idea how to get bash otherwise then? Oct 16 01:05:09 instructions on how to tab browse with the opera browser? Oct 16 01:05:16 preference? Oct 16 01:05:25 nope. minimo has tabbed browsing Oct 16 01:05:28 <|R> nn_ : not sure sure of the best course of action but worst case you can dpkg -X the package and get the binary and place it somewhere... Oct 16 01:05:50 I remember that you have to reflash and not install microb.. then you get an extra set of options past Set Engine. Oct 16 01:06:06 And in there, you see "Webcore" as a third engine option but greyed out. Oct 16 01:06:21 But don't even bother if you want tabbed browsing. Oct 16 01:06:26 The tabs take up WAY too much space. Oct 16 01:06:35 ok Oct 16 01:07:16 Minimo's ui is buggy as all get out. Oct 16 01:07:26 Nothing behaves the way it should Oct 16 01:07:28 There was also some other cool options.. such as enabling/disabling javascript in general or just for Google specific sites. Oct 16 01:07:30 Hey. Oct 16 01:07:34 What's videocenter, and does it work on Hacker 770? Oct 16 01:07:46 and I'd always end up in a context where I'd have to quit and restart to get it to work again. Oct 16 01:07:48 Google is a great tool. Oct 16 01:08:39 Well, I know what it is, but does it work on Hacker Edition? Oct 16 01:08:51 minimo works fine with my bank, and works better with iphone.facebook.com atm. i don't use it for anything else, i use opera or microb Oct 16 01:09:00 well considering microb crashed on me for i don't know what reason..i'll be using opera and minimo. Oct 16 01:09:22 microb seems to stress the cpu out a lot during rendering though. i don't like unresponsiveness Oct 16 01:09:39 tried a bunch of iphone sites last night with minimo. Oct 16 01:22:52 Oh, I'm running Hacker 2007... what's best? Opera, Minimo, or MicroB? I've never seen MicroB before. Oct 16 01:23:17 Try them and decide for yourself. Oct 16 01:23:59 Some like Opera's speed. Others like MicroB's javascript/css (being the engine for Firefox 3.0). Oct 16 01:24:05 What is MicroB like? Oct 16 01:24:21 It's like whoa. Oct 16 01:24:26 Really? Oct 16 01:24:28 How so? Oct 16 01:24:31 It's a web browser. Oct 16 01:24:32 Slow, or cool, or both? Oct 16 01:25:03 It looks and runs more or less like Opera does but supports stuff like javascript better. Oct 16 01:25:06 Try it. Oct 16 01:25:10 ok Oct 16 01:26:49 it is still beta and damn slow Oct 16 01:26:56 oh :-( Oct 16 01:27:28 Yeah, it's still beta in two ways. One, microb itself is beta. Two, the rendering engine, Gecko, is a bleeding edge version. Oct 16 01:27:35 But I don't find it slow. Oct 16 01:27:49 Not that I'm going to try it, but does it do Gmail? Oct 16 01:27:57 You should try it. Oct 16 01:28:01 ok Oct 16 01:28:07 * tom_ is rebooting after a hung installation of wesnoth. Oct 16 01:28:24 I believe it does, but I'm not sure. I don't use Gmail, but I'm pretty sure it would run it better than Opera would. Oct 16 01:28:30 id like to see webkit based browser Oct 16 01:28:45 Not going to be that different, really. Oct 16 01:28:56 Might be as fast as Opera though. Oct 16 01:29:38 would the tablets be better served with the OS on a SD card from the factory? Oct 16 01:29:48 Not really. Oct 16 01:31:07 you're probably right Oct 16 01:31:55 but there isn't a clean solution for installing big things to mmc/sd right now Oct 16 01:32:59 Not many apps bigger than 128MB. :) Oct 16 01:36:27 don't think i'm not responding because your point was valid Oct 16 01:37:02 |R: Thanks, worked like a charm! Oct 16 01:39:02 I am trying to apt-get install gcc on my N800 and I get this message "Package gcc is not available, but is referred to by another package.". Any idea what it means? Oct 16 01:40:58 pupnik: Well, it is valid. ;) Oct 16 01:41:30 Really though... if someone feels the need to install packages on the memory card because the internal flash isn't enough, I *really* don't want to see that person's menus. ;P Oct 16 01:41:48 it is not and here are the reasons Oct 16 01:41:55 1) there is less than 128Mb free Oct 16 01:42:08 2) users do not install a single program Oct 16 01:42:14 <|R> nn_ : cool :) Oct 16 01:42:34 Huh? Oct 16 01:43:19 your assersion is that a user has 128MB free on internal flash, and that the user will have no problems with any program <= 128MB Oct 16 01:43:25 this is false, as shown above Oct 16 01:43:46 Where? Oct 16 01:44:29 installing 10 7 MB programs will exceed a typical 770's free space Oct 16 01:44:30 Yeah, it's not simply 128MB free. What is it right after a reflash then? It's still a good amount of space for just applications. Oct 16 01:44:59 hence the claim that 128MB programs are not a problem is ludicrous Oct 16 01:45:31 There aren't that many large apps though. Most are pretty small... maybe 1MB or so. Oct 16 01:45:37 i know this Oct 16 01:46:00 I'm not saying that it should be disallowed. Oct 16 01:46:13 it'most of the core apps do fit nicely into free flash Oct 16 01:46:52 But most average users won't usually end up filling the flash with apps alone.. for those power users that do, they've got the option to install to SD card. Oct 16 01:47:50 that's correct Oct 16 01:48:05 i'm just struggling right now with the best way to deal with big programs Oct 16 01:48:16 Is it safe to do apt-get upgrade on Hacker 2007, or will that pull in versions that are too new? Oct 16 01:49:08 basically it means adding logic for them to search mmc for their data, and then fail gracefully if it's not found Oct 16 01:53:04 pupnik: They can just add /media/mmc1/ to PATH and be done with it. Oct 16 01:53:30 Well, /media/mmc1/bin... Oct 16 01:54:18 or anywhere on mmc1 or mmc2 Oct 16 01:54:30 then you also have to write a program to download the data Oct 16 01:54:39 Download what data? Oct 16 01:54:48 because you can't install a 30 MB .deb file on a tablet with 30 MB free space Oct 16 01:55:14 i want to make my game ports easy to install Oct 16 01:55:28 can't do that with .debs Oct 16 01:58:39 You should have them give you their ssh logins. Oct 16 01:58:43 That'll be very easy. ;) Oct 16 02:01:21 How do I run MicroB? It's not in the menu... Oct 16 02:02:06 It's an engine option Oct 16 02:02:14 it just runs under the regular browser Oct 16 02:02:28 Did the homepage change to one with a yellow-gray background? Oct 16 02:08:26 GeneralAntilles: How do I pick it? Oct 16 02:09:27 Great, now "Web" crashes every time I run it... Oct 16 02:10:40 Ah, the TestGtkEmbed screwed it up. Now it only crashes when I pick MicroB... Oct 16 02:11:15 Does this need some strange library or something? Oct 16 02:13:01 Great, I uninstalled all of it and it still crashes. Oct 16 02:14:19 Did you restart? Oct 16 02:14:23 no Oct 16 02:14:30 Do I need to restart after installing? Oct 16 02:15:52 ? Oct 16 02:39:38 <|R> Anyone know if the TUN/TAP interface active in the latest 2007 firmware? Oct 16 02:39:54 <|R> (would be veryyy useful for the new ssh -w (tunnel) feature) Oct 16 02:46:51 i don't know Oct 16 02:47:33 would someone smart please find a way to tap-in text to fullscreen sdl apps with a virtual keyboard like xkbd? http://pupnik.de/xkbd_m_bottom.gif Oct 16 02:51:15 I'm getting a strange error from "apt-get update". It's saying it can't verify the GPG signature of maemo-hackers.org, khertan.net, or catalogue.tableteer.nokia.com because the signatures could not be verified (NO_PUBKEY), "Unknown error executing gpgv", and "The following signatures were invalid". Oct 16 02:51:39 And nothing in Application manager works. Oct 16 02:51:51 It all says "Operation failed". Oct 16 02:53:20 What should I do? Oct 16 02:55:01 ARGH! This is totally broken, and it's giving me NO information on how to fix it! Oct 16 02:55:33 I can't even see the goddamn app catalog to turn off the extra repos I installed! Oct 16 02:57:23 * tom_ remembers why Hacker 2007 sucks again. Oct 16 02:58:28 Is anyone here? Oct 16 02:58:36 What's the log say? Oct 16 02:58:39 For app manager? Oct 16 02:58:45 Clearing the cache worked for me Oct 16 02:58:49 though I don't recall how I did that Oct 16 02:58:51 Where? What cache? Oct 16 02:58:56 Where is the log? Oct 16 02:58:58 The apt cache Oct 16 02:59:02 apt-get update gives me three different errors. Oct 16 02:59:04 menu -> log Oct 16 02:59:07 All about GPG verification. Oct 16 02:59:10 Ignore gpg Oct 16 02:59:13 Those don't matter. Oct 16 02:59:27 The log says: Oct 16 02:59:34 "osso-application-install 4.46, UI version 2" Oct 16 02:59:38 then "apt-worker exited." **** ENDING LOGGING AT Tue Oct 16 02:59:57 2007