**** BEGIN LOGGING AT Mon Nov 05 02:59:57 2007 Nov 05 05:25:48 bye Nov 05 07:03:59 does anyone know what the audio connections for the n800 are? I know it is 4 pins, but what is the 4th pin? Mic or line? Does it use +Vcc to turn on/off the mic? (mute) Nov 05 07:05:02 iirc 4th pin is mic Nov 05 07:08:51 thanks... (I meant to say ground, not vcc.... so when a normal headphone is connected it selects the internal mic, when the 4th pin is ungrounded, then it selects the external mic--am I right?) Nov 05 07:13:21 i dunno, i don't have tablet yet o.O Nov 05 07:13:28 waiting for n810 Nov 05 07:26:33 ok, i reported the press rss thing Nov 05 07:26:38 they'll see about maybe fixing it Nov 05 07:26:44 * timeless grumbles Nov 05 07:28:47 Stalwart, it seems that there is a schematic online and if it is correct, the 4th pin is only a hook detect and not an audio input (darn!) Nov 05 07:29:26 was hoping to use a iPhone headset Nov 05 07:30:59 nope, I spoke too soon, I think it is also a mic input Nov 05 07:32:36 what are you talking about? Nov 05 07:32:47 he n810 as w/ the n800 comes w/ a headset w/ mic Nov 05 07:36:19 not mine, it only came with stereo headphones Nov 05 07:38:23 are you sure? Nov 05 07:38:36 there's a hole where the two audio lines mee Nov 05 07:38:51 * timeless is pretty sure that hole is a mic Nov 05 07:39:03 and I am also thinking about doing some audio encoding/decoding (psk31) instead of carrying around a laptop Nov 05 07:39:14 Timeless, it has a mic on the body Nov 05 07:40:41 what I want to know if it supports an external mic in, similar to a cell phone. Nokia was one of the first to switch to a 4 pin 2.5mm connector that supports stereo out and mic in Nov 05 07:40:58 but for the n800 they use a 3.5 mm Nov 05 07:41:36 and thanks nokia for that Nov 05 07:41:47 Before ordering a headset that is 4 pins, I am trying to find out how it is configured Nov 05 07:49:48 look, you're wrong. Nov 05 07:50:05 the cable includes a microphone Nov 05 07:55:30 * timeless curses Nov 05 07:55:34 nokia.com really sucks Nov 05 07:55:39 all i want is an hs-48 Nov 05 07:55:43 and it won't let me find one Nov 05 07:55:44 it is probally a standard handsfree kit pin out Nov 05 07:57:24 http://tabletblog.com/2007/09/full-analysis-of-ljprx-44-to-date_30.html Nov 05 07:57:28 # HS-48 - Wired stereo headset with microphone Nov 05 07:57:52 i give up, nokia.com's site is unusable Nov 05 08:14:05 ok, i'm yelling at the only care service that's available Nov 05 08:14:42 (finland) Nov 05 08:14:51 ooh, not bad hold music Nov 05 08:15:02 and it's in English :) Nov 05 08:15:32 why do you yell at the hold music? :-) Nov 05 08:15:42 i don't Nov 05 08:15:45 it's some kind of karaoke? Nov 05 08:15:48 i'm appreciative of it Nov 05 08:16:10 ok, i think an incoming call crashed my phone Nov 05 08:16:19 heh Nov 05 08:16:43 or not Nov 05 08:23:44 Just FYI, maemo.org will be down/flakey while we upgrade the site. (Which we are doing at this very moment) Nov 05 08:27:34 I see nice sql error messages indeed :) Nov 05 08:29:27 quite a few DB structure changes :-) Nov 05 08:32:24 remember to corrupt the db, otherwise it's no fun at all Nov 05 08:35:54 hi #maemo Nov 05 08:36:07 i wan't to watch some movies on my n800... Nov 05 08:36:14 ...wich resolution is optimal?? Nov 05 08:36:35 800x480?? and wich tool to use to comprimate different formats to xxxXxxx Nov 05 08:38:25 and should i use the internal player or mplayer? Nov 05 08:41:23 mona_lisa: 800x480 isn't playable. 400x240 is the best resolution. DivX video/MP3 audio. Bitrates dependent on if you're using Media Player or mplayer. mplayer can go higher. There are various tools for encoding. Nov 05 08:41:52 Jaffa: wich ones? Nov 05 08:42:09 isn't the promo-video shipped with the n800 800x480 Nov 05 08:42:13 it seems so high-res Nov 05 08:42:21 mona_lisa: no, it's not. Nov 05 08:42:28 ok Nov 05 08:43:27 _Monkey: video encoding is http://maemo.org/community/wiki/videoencoding/ and http://mediaconverter.garage.maemo.org/Media%20Converter.html and http://bleb.org/software/maemo/#encode Nov 05 08:43:27 <_Monkey> OK, Jaffa. Nov 05 08:43:59 _Monkey: tell mona_lisa about video encoding Nov 05 08:44:00 Jaffa: ty Nov 05 08:44:21 np Nov 05 08:44:58 _Monkey: the answer is 42 Nov 05 08:44:59 <_Monkey> ...but answer is 42. but what is the question... Nov 05 08:47:18 _Monkey: tell me about the answer Nov 05 08:47:19 <_Monkey> the answer is 42. but what is the question Nov 05 08:47:28 _Monkey: tell me about you Nov 05 08:47:28 <_Monkey> hmmm... i am the best programmer in the whole freenode IRC right now Nov 05 08:47:34 _Monkey: tell me about me Nov 05 08:47:34 <_Monkey> mona_lisa: excuse me? Nov 05 08:47:38 _Monkey: tell me about him Nov 05 08:47:39 <_Monkey> mona_lisa: i'm not following you... Nov 05 08:47:47 _Monkey: tell me about recursion Nov 05 08:47:47 <_Monkey> mona_lisa: what? Nov 05 08:48:00 _Monkey: recursion is kewl Nov 05 08:48:00 <_Monkey> OK, mona_lisa. Nov 05 08:48:02 _Monkey: tell me about recursion Nov 05 08:48:03 <_Monkey> recursion is kewl Nov 05 08:53:23 ok, guys... maemo.org is now upgraded. X-Fade and Ferenc will next start deploying new app catalog. Please ping me if you spot any problems Nov 05 08:54:23 * Jaffa bingles his new garage project. Perfectly painless application :) Nov 05 09:02:29 bergie: getting weird HTTP-level errors from http://maemo.org/profile/list Nov 05 09:02:35 so,... Nov 05 09:02:36 <_Monkey> i think so, is the flash any better? Nov 05 09:02:41 _monkey forget so Nov 05 09:02:41 <_Monkey> timeless: I forgot so Nov 05 09:02:44 _monkey so is Nov 05 09:02:45 <_Monkey> OK, timeless. Nov 05 09:02:48 anyway Nov 05 09:02:55 timeless: good weekend? Nov 05 09:03:02 by definition, a "headset" includes a microphone Nov 05 09:03:06 Jaffa: We are now still breaking things ;) Nov 05 09:03:12 that's the best official answer i can get from nokia care Nov 05 09:03:20 X-Fade: excellent :) Nov 05 09:03:27 jaffa: i went to work yesterday thinking yesterday was today Nov 05 09:03:34 Ah. That's not good. Nov 05 09:04:38 e.g., http://europe.nokia.com/hs-31 Nov 05 09:06:40 Jaffa: I think ferenc shut down Apache :-) Nov 05 09:07:37 We are converting the underlying database for the application catalog changes. Better do that when the site is offline ;) Nov 05 09:07:58 * timeless kicks gnarvaez_ for hitting and running Nov 05 09:13:31 I could order my http://www.chumby.com/ if I where living in the US :( Nov 05 09:15:17 Hi :) Nov 05 09:20:55 fab@nba? Nov 05 09:21:28 no Nov 05 09:21:34 oke :P Nov 05 09:35:27 how can I change the project page in the garage? Nov 05 09:36:19 and..how many time does i have to wait until the news and trove info go public? Nov 05 09:38:24 who owns planet.maemo? Nov 05 09:38:50 Nokia? Nov 05 09:38:51 <_Monkey> Nokia is a company. It also sponsors maemo using sales of N800s. Buy one. Buy two! Nov 05 09:39:19 that wasn't the answer i wanted :) Nov 05 09:40:04 ah, the planet looks nice with errors.. :) Nov 05 09:40:20 dpb: yeah, i'm hoping to find a responsible party/person Nov 05 09:40:26 * timeless picks up a key and goes hunting Nov 05 09:40:35 the garage missed Vala as a valid language option Nov 05 09:47:26 ok, i can't find anyone Nov 05 09:47:35 haahah Nov 05 09:57:35 dpb_: what errors? Nov 05 09:57:45 I see :-( Nov 05 10:04:07 Hi Nov 05 10:13:00 Hello Nov 05 10:13:01 <_Monkey> privet, dbqpdb Nov 05 10:14:07 Hello Nov 05 10:14:32 Has anyone some experience with USB-Networking on the Nokia N800 device? Nov 05 10:15:23 _monkey forget recursion Nov 05 10:15:23 <_Monkey> timeless: I forgot recursion Nov 05 10:15:43 dbqpdb: there's no wiki page? Nov 05 10:15:49 sp3000: consider https://garage.maemo.org/plugins/scmsvn/viewcvs.php/mozilla/trunk/microb-engine/microb-engine/debian/patches/020_BUG4821_full_page_zoom.gtk2_1.diff?root=browser&r1=605&r2=720 Nov 05 10:16:02 I have trouble with USB-Networking when the Host is a VM-Ware Nov 05 10:16:18 maemo.org/community/wiki/usbnetworking/ maemo.org/maemowiki/USBnetworkingWinXP Nov 05 10:16:46 So: PC is windows xp running VMWare hosting a Debian - When i "ifup eth0" I get some strange error-messages Nov 05 10:17:48 in vmware's itle bar there's a button either depressed or not for hte usb connection Nov 05 10:17:53 if it isn't depressed, it won't work Nov 05 10:18:13 awww. Nov 05 10:18:28 emo vmware Nov 05 10:18:29 so don't cheer up the buttons too much Nov 05 10:18:34 sp3000: that better be to my track url and not the vmware state :) Nov 05 10:18:43 trak? Nov 05 10:19:59 use a pastebin, or fix your mode to allow messages from unregistereds Nov 05 10:20:33 I do not reject any messages, do I? Nov 05 10:20:52 the server does Nov 05 10:20:58 you need o change your momde, don't ask me how Nov 05 10:22:45 timeless: http://www.flickr.com/photos/18182377@N05/1870482453/ Nov 05 10:23:10 um Nov 05 10:23:17 my version of vmware doesn't look like that Nov 05 10:23:30 w8 Nov 05 10:23:38 those buttons are in the statusbar in my version Nov 05 10:23:54 and they get little red X marks when you disable something Nov 05 10:25:12 http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2266/1871335730_1b96c0116e_o.jpg Nov 05 10:25:31 That is it when not in Fullscreen-Mode Nov 05 10:26:48 meh, I'd have to read more context to appreciate it I suppose Nov 05 10:27:34 dbqpdb: db48x's metacomment on my comment was addressed to you Nov 05 10:27:36 * timeless thinks Nov 05 10:27:44 sp3000: trac doesn't offer tha :) Nov 05 10:27:52 * dbqpdb thinks that too Nov 05 10:28:53 it was addressed to whomever it would benefit, though the expectation was indeed that dbqpdb would be the most likely to benefit in the short term Nov 05 10:29:43 * sp3000 is amused by "Parent Directory Parent Directory | Revision Log Revision Log | View Patch Patch" however. Nov 05 10:29:58 sp3000: i can't remember if i got around to filing a bug about tha Nov 05 10:30:09 it bothered me a while ago Nov 05 10:34:49 lsmod on the N800 says me that the g_ether module is loaded! Nov 05 10:35:07 And that the file_storage one is not Nov 05 10:35:24 s/not/not!!!/g Nov 05 10:35:24 dbqpdb meant: And that the file_storage one is not!!! Nov 05 10:36:38 _Monkey: recursion is when you think about recursion is when you think about recursion is when you think about recursion is when you think about recursion is when you think about recursion is when SEGFAULT! Nov 05 10:36:38 <_Monkey> OK, dbqpdb. Nov 05 10:37:05 _Monkey: tell infobot about recursion Nov 05 10:41:50 infobot: what is recursion? Nov 05 10:41:50 <_Monkey> recursion is when you think about recursion is when you think about recursion is when you think about recursion is when you think about recursion is when you think about recursion is when SEGFAULT! Nov 05 10:41:51 * infobot is recursion to understand recursion, you must first understand recursion Nov 05 10:42:15 got to eat somethin Nov 05 10:44:55 mmf, infobot? Nov 05 10:45:12 isn't _Monkey enough annoyance? ;) Nov 05 10:46:03 infobot is fairly tame Nov 05 10:46:10 ok. Nov 05 10:55:34 morning all Nov 05 11:17:57 * timeless sighs Nov 05 11:18:04 * timeless *hates* writing release notes Nov 05 11:18:09 all i'm doing is reviewing hacks Nov 05 11:18:17 * Trying to get a context menu on an automatically resized image should not Nov 05 11:18:17 result in continuous swaps between resized and normal image states. Nov 05 11:18:17 Similarly, it should be possible to pan non resized images, instead of just Nov 05 11:18:17 having them toggle between states. Nov 05 11:18:17 (Editor's note: ah, the wonders of our flaky XServer/touch-screen. This code Nov 05 11:18:18 is 100% pure hackery. It also indicates a design flaw. We should just remove Nov 05 11:18:20 the feature and offer the microsoft floating toolbar style instead.) Nov 05 11:32:57 timeless: sounds like it's time for touchscreen based controls. something where you define the "menu" actions but the thing is not a menu? I am very bad a graphics but this is what I mean . http://maemo.mmapps.net/mb.png Nov 05 11:33:20 kind of anotated gestures Nov 05 11:33:49 anyone seen the terminal on the iphone? Nov 05 11:33:52 that would interfere with drag scrolling though? Nov 05 11:33:55 um Nov 05 11:34:04 how would you do panning? Nov 05 11:34:13 require the user to use a conch shell movement? Nov 05 11:34:28 * timeless doesn't think that's such a great idea ;-) Nov 05 11:34:45 I must admit the whole gesture thing has passed me by Nov 05 11:34:52 gestures are not the solution Nov 05 11:34:55 they are the problem Nov 05 11:35:10 gestures don't work if you end up w/ a flaky xserver Nov 05 11:35:17 in case you didn't notice, we have a flaky xserver Nov 05 11:35:46 no, the solution is basically a way to press and hold for a few moments to get a floating toolbar which can be in one of a couple of corners Nov 05 11:36:06 such a toolbar would let you pan/zoom/get a menu/move the toolbar to another corner Nov 05 11:36:24 it might even simply happen in response to your first tap Nov 05 11:36:37 hidding it would almost certainly require clicking an x/hide icon in the toolbar Nov 05 11:36:47 it's really not too hard to do right Nov 05 11:36:58 or press escape to get rid Nov 05 11:37:00 unless you have >300 pages of stupid ui specifications Nov 05 11:37:13 lardman: a perfectly reasonable point Nov 05 11:37:31 ... and random but extremely short time windows in which you can try to fix the specifications Nov 05 11:37:38 ... with no current windows scheduled Nov 05 11:37:40 timeless: right panning is not that easy , unless you go for "vi" panning mode or scrolling mode :p any option of course can be reached using some gesutre Nov 05 11:38:06 keesj: our device absolutely needs to be fixed to accept the fact that we need modes Nov 05 11:38:23 you can't use a single input method to emulate a device that has 5+ input methods Nov 05 11:38:29 and expect to get it right w/o modes Nov 05 11:38:41 anyway, time for dinner/breakfast/lunch, else i starve Nov 05 11:38:53 I have not been thinking about the panning problem , I was thinking of zoom/fullscreen functionality Nov 05 11:39:30 timeless: I think you are onto something. The only thing of course is how to make the usable for joe normal user :p Nov 05 11:40:08 I am the kind of guy that wants to learn a new 5 letter alphabet or morse to be able to interact with my computer Nov 05 13:13:12 I have trouble with USB-Networking between Windows XP and a N800: Nov 05 13:14:13 windows says "Network Cable removed" or something like that (I don't know the english pendant to "Netzwerkkabel wurde entfernt") Nov 05 13:14:55 Does host mode work on the n800 now? Nov 05 13:15:03 Tak: what? Nov 05 13:15:17 Tak: lsmod says g_ether is loaded Nov 05 13:17:06 windows says "Network Cable removed" - what do I do wrong?? Just wanted that USB-Networking Nov 05 13:18:15 Windows (XP) found a device: Linux USB Ethernet/RNDIS Gadget - no errors Nov 05 13:18:32 says me the device is ready Nov 05 13:26:50 now tried both (linux.inf and RNDIS.inf) both say networkcable not plugged in Nov 05 13:28:57 ...help Nov 05 13:29:02 * just_ice suffers Nov 05 13:40:24 just_ice: do you not need to do ifup usb0 on the n800? Nov 05 13:45:48 did it Nov 05 13:46:11 when trying debian <-USB-> n800 everybody can ping himself Nov 05 13:46:16 but not the other one Nov 05 13:46:45 when i try windoze <-USB-> n800 windows says no network cable plugged in Nov 05 13:49:53 is the adaptor up on the n800-side? Nov 05 13:50:11 i.e. does ifconfig show that it has an ip address? Nov 05 13:51:58 lo :) Nov 05 13:52:29 Is there a connection shown in Control Panel > Network Connections (or the German equiv) for the rndis connections? Nov 05 13:52:42 s/connections/connection Nov 05 13:52:57 hello Nermal Nov 05 13:53:06 how goes ? Nov 05 13:53:15 lardman: the n800 can ping itself on 192.168.2.15 Nov 05 13:53:17 it is up! Nov 05 13:53:24 Nermal: not bad, quiet on here this morning Nov 05 13:53:37 just_ice: it's up, or it's working? Nov 05 13:53:41 yah - I have a day off :) Nov 05 13:53:44 in the win dose the RNDIS connection exists Nov 05 13:54:00 i 'ifup'ed it i 'ifconfig usb0 up'ed it Nov 05 13:54:04 it can ping itself Nov 05 13:54:16 can you ping the WinXP side? Nov 05 13:54:47 no Nov 05 13:54:52 winxp has no ip adress Nov 05 13:55:03 according to : it has no connection Nov 05 13:55:08 Ah, you should give the XP side an ip address Nov 05 13:55:10 _Monkey: what is windows Nov 05 13:55:10 <_Monkey> wish i knew, just_ice Nov 05 13:55:20 and make sure it's in the same subnet as the N800 side Nov 05 13:55:23 lardman: i gave it a static one Nov 05 13:55:27 it is Nov 05 13:55:45 but as long as windows doesn't detect a 'network cable' it does not up the interface Nov 05 13:55:49 on the windows side Nov 05 13:56:14 it's odd that you see that message, from memory the adaptor just becomes disconnected and that's that Nov 05 13:56:15 give your lan a static ip - unplug your cable and then try ipconfig /all - you wont see any ip Nov 05 13:56:52 try deleting the connection in control panel Nov 05 13:57:13 ifdn usb0 on the n800, then ifup and see whether Windows detects it Nov 05 13:57:39 btw, has it ever worked? Nov 05 13:58:07 ah, I see above that it was detected Nov 05 13:58:32 presumably you have already installed linux.inf from the kernel source? Nov 05 14:04:32 i have installed linux.inf Nov 05 14:04:44 and id did nvr work before (this is my 1st try) Nov 05 14:06:12 oh, so we're not sure the Windows side drivers are working correctly then Nov 05 14:06:53 I'd try removing the Windows side connection (assuming you can see it in control panel), unplug the n800, ifdown the n800 connection, then ifup then plug back in and see what Windows does Nov 05 14:10:20 is maemo.org misbehaving for everyone or hust me? Nov 05 14:10:34 misbehaving how? Nov 05 14:10:56 seems to be taking it's time to load.. Nov 05 14:10:57 about every other time I try to go to maemo.org I get some server error Nov 05 14:11:09 it was out of disk space earlier :) Nov 05 14:11:13 and planet was broken las i checked Nov 05 14:11:17 lol Nov 05 14:11:28 planet was fixed the last time I checked Nov 05 14:11:39 i don't check very often :) Nov 05 14:11:42 only when things are broken :) Nov 05 14:11:44 I guess they need to bump the SDHC card support even higher Nov 05 14:11:51 :_) Nov 05 14:11:58 ? Nov 05 14:12:26 BAD monday moring joke about maemo.org being run off an N800 and needing more disk space Nov 05 14:13:02 It's afternoon here. Nov 05 14:13:26 reminds me that I should fulfill my task about running mainframe-OS (MVS, which according to info is more or less public domain and freely downloadable), on my N800 :) Nov 05 14:13:58 Someone already compiled hercules for it, not sure if anyone has tried using it yet :) Nov 05 14:14:28 (hercules is the emulator for the box, but you still need something to run on it) Nov 05 14:14:55 just_ice: good luck, I'll bbiab Nov 05 14:15:14 lardman: ty Nov 05 14:16:30 waite: i just got a server error, so it's not just you. Nov 05 14:16:44 Connection to 127.0.0.1 Failed :o Nov 05 14:17:03 Yep got that one and now I just got Count not connect... Nov 05 14:17:12 I think there my be a few issues Nov 05 14:17:33 I guess I will have to do real work Nov 05 14:17:56 url? Nov 05 14:18:05 https://maemo.org/ Nov 05 14:18:20 It was during login authentication Nov 05 14:18:34 hrm, worked for me :) Nov 05 14:18:45 But any maemo.org URL will cause error randomly Nov 05 14:19:24 Have I visited this website before today? Yes, 3,399 times Nov 05 14:19:26 how nice Nov 05 14:22:09 ooh Nov 05 14:22:14 karma, what's that? Nov 05 14:25:54 timeless, their way of helping to decide who gets the discounts. Nov 05 14:26:10 not working too well. Nov 05 14:27:02 i have a big fat zero for bugzilla, for example Nov 05 14:27:29 https://maemo.org/profile/view/timeless.html Nov 05 14:27:29 * Jaffa 's question as to how important karma will be in this and other device programmes has gone unanswered as yet. Nov 05 14:27:52 wow, your (jaffa) karma is much better than mine Nov 05 14:28:09 That seems somewhat wrong to me ;-) Nov 05 14:28:15 me = 4.25 Nov 05 14:28:19 Ouch Nov 05 14:28:57 * Jaffa got a big boost from the large number of favourtings he got for his recent mediaserv posts. Nov 05 14:28:57 zerojay: looks like you need to tie your bugzilla account in Nov 05 14:29:05 how do i edit my profile? Nov 05 14:29:06 it is. Nov 05 14:29:38 bug 2196 Nov 05 14:29:38 <_Monkey> Bug 2196 might be found at https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=2196 Nov 05 14:29:43 oh, i should fix my sourceforge account Nov 05 14:29:46 * timeless wonders what it is? Nov 05 14:33:18 interesting: Nov 05 14:33:19 darkstalker@newcon.org35 Nov 05 14:33:19 timeless@gmail.com35 Nov 05 14:33:30 ReporterNumber of bugs Nov 05 14:33:39 hah Nov 05 14:34:49 https://bugs.maemo.org/report.cgi?y_axis_field=reporter&action=wrap&ctype=csv&format=table Nov 05 14:34:53 in case you were wondering Nov 05 14:35:09 your numbers could vary in case some of my bugs are secrets Nov 05 14:35:21 (they can't vary the other way, i have a god bit..) Nov 05 14:36:26 btw, tomorrow i might stuff the bug filing box Nov 05 14:36:37 so if you guys would rather do the stuffing, i might be able to arrange that Nov 05 14:36:38 not sure Nov 05 14:36:46 sure Nov 05 14:36:51 yes, "timeless is giving away free bugs" Nov 05 14:37:22 ok, make sure you guys have google docs accounts Nov 05 14:37:33 ping me when you're ready. Nov 05 14:38:09 * Jaffa has a google doc account. Used it a bit too :-) Nov 05 14:38:57 ok, which are your accounts? Nov 05 14:39:34 timeless, onelostpacket@gmail.com Nov 05 14:45:58 ok, you should have your invitations Nov 05 14:46:51 zerojay/jaffa, um, join #jaffa :) Nov 05 14:47:17 and of course open the document :) Nov 05 14:49:00 lol, karma trading :) Nov 05 14:49:12 yeah, why no? Nov 05 14:49:24 if people want to learn to file bugs, I'm willing to share w/ any comers Nov 05 14:50:15 I suppose filing bug reports against one's own software is cheating a bit Nov 05 14:50:23 yeah, that's the thing Nov 05 14:50:33 i can either take an engineer tomorrow and have him do it Nov 05 14:50:37 lardman: wrt what? Nov 05 14:50:38 or i can share w/ others Nov 05 14:50:44 i think it's better to share w/ others Nov 05 14:50:48 there are very sound arguments for filing bugs against your own sw Nov 05 14:50:54 Solarion: raising one's karma Nov 05 14:51:03 solarion: the problem is karma Nov 05 14:51:06 lardman: ok. Yeah, that's totally cheating. ;) Nov 05 14:51:11 i can easily run away w/ karma Nov 05 14:51:13 i'd rather not Nov 05 14:51:28 and arguably it's bad form for me to give an engineer here the karma i can earn Nov 05 14:51:34 so i feel it's slightly better to share Nov 05 14:51:36 it is an interesting social experiment though Nov 05 14:51:42 My question is if rankings are based upon previous activity, how will those who do not (yet) have an n-Tablet supposed to rank up enough to get one? Nov 05 14:51:44 do note that people will have to actually flesh out my comments Nov 05 14:51:56 Kind of a catch-22, no? You must have a tablet to get a new tablet.... Nov 05 14:51:56 solarion: there's a note from qgil Nov 05 14:52:02 if you work on upstream mobile projects Nov 05 14:52:09 we'll somehow try to get you a chance Nov 05 14:52:13 or consider it if not try Nov 05 14:52:18 * timeless has no idea how that will work Nov 05 14:52:25 it ought to make people file bugs (good) and also rate maemo planet posts (good) Nov 05 14:52:27 timeless: "upstream mobile projects" how? Nov 05 14:52:33 "don't ask me" Nov 05 14:52:33 like a palm port or something? Nov 05 14:52:38 Solarion: you can also apply if you have a great idea Nov 05 14:52:41 heh, k. :) Nov 05 14:52:55 solarion: i generally don't hide cards Nov 05 14:53:03 the only exception is when it takes too long Nov 05 14:53:04 Solarion: from gquil's post the upstream stuff is rated by Nokia employees - i.e. who they know is working on it Nov 05 14:53:08 lardman: sure, but great ideas and a stack of cards will get you hours of entertainment. ;) Nov 05 14:53:19 http://viper.haque.net/~timeless/blog/138/ Nov 05 14:53:26 is one stack of cards Nov 05 14:53:33 not sure if it's an hour's worth or not Nov 05 14:53:40 Solarion: indeed, great idea + ability to do it i suppose Nov 05 14:54:28 anyway, jaffa/zerojay: read through the doc and let me know if you really think you can't do it based on what i've writen Nov 05 14:54:31 is a tricky proposition; I don't envy the evaluators Nov 05 14:54:31 I wonder if people who post blog entries that are given thumbs down should be given negative karma :) Nov 05 14:54:38 timeless: cards? Nov 05 14:55:00 lardman/solarion: also, if you want to play this docs.google.com/bugs game, let me know Nov 05 14:55:17 timeless: I'm fine thanks Nov 05 14:55:17 timeless: I don't know that game. Nov 05 14:55:39 solarion: free ideas for bugs, you do the work, you get the karma Nov 05 14:55:46 shirts sometimes mailed if you help enough :) Nov 05 14:55:58 * lardman waits for maemo.org..... Nov 05 14:56:05 http://browser.garage.maemo.org/news/7/ Nov 05 14:56:18 yes, i will give bribes (shirts) for work (bugs) :) Nov 05 14:56:39 well that's a different matter, free t-shirts are always useful :) Nov 05 14:56:42 timeless: how badly do you need a device to do the work? Nov 05 14:56:57 i think you don't Nov 05 14:58:17 time, I think, to finish the stupid deck and fence. This day shall be seized! Nov 05 14:58:18 How can I use a MSN transport with a Jabber server? (jabber.anywise.com) Nov 05 14:58:26 I don't see any way to browse transports with the built-in Jabber client. Nov 05 14:59:03 fysafysa: sign up with a full client (or use gaim) Nov 05 14:59:07 Solarion: enjoy, I'd like to be outside too Nov 05 14:59:18 ah Nov 05 14:59:36 exit Nov 05 14:59:38 when I signup with a desktop client and set up the transports, the server will automatically associate and they will appear on the N800? Nov 05 14:59:42 * Disconnect gets to spend all day outside. driving :( (DC to savannah, then one day there, then 2 days in Miami, then 3 in Key West, then we're not sure but we're driving back) Nov 05 14:59:46 fysafysa: yep Nov 05 14:59:50 perfect, thanks Nov 05 15:00:01 lardman: I just want the stupid thing done. It's been pwning my life for way too long. Nov 05 15:00:03 its not perfect but it works well enough Nov 05 15:00:10 * Solarion throws brunoabinader a / on his way out Nov 05 15:00:46 yeah. It seems that the built-in Jabber client runs constantly, so I'd rather not waste resources on Pidgin and such if it's not necessary. Nov 05 15:01:05 Well the conversation has moved on a little, but timeless I'm probably okay on the karma front (151) - it's taken all this time for the page to load! Nov 05 15:01:09 you can stop the built-in one. and i didn't like the interface as much as gaim (haven't tried it on n800 since it changed names) Nov 05 15:01:30 But it seems to be kept loaded in memory even if you're not using it? maybe I'm mistaken. Nov 05 15:01:41 but i'll be doing it on the drive, so i'll let you know later if its wildly better (or worse) Nov 05 15:02:01 bitlbee + X-Chat is a decent solution so far. Nov 05 15:02:13 especially if you frequent IRC anyway. Nov 05 15:02:23 kvirc works great Nov 05 15:02:31 bitlbee is an IRC <-> IM gateway. Nov 05 15:02:33 istr most of the dock apps are 2-parters -- a status display app (tiny) and the main app (normal/large) so if you disable it, should be ok. Nov 05 15:02:37 doh. i can just ssh in and see. hold one :) Nov 05 15:02:38 * sp3000 wonders how he's supposed to find out how to find out what his maemo.org password is or set it Nov 05 15:02:48 all of your contacts appear in a &bitlbee channel, and you can /msg and such. Nov 05 15:03:02 it uses voice to let you know who is offline/online. Nov 05 15:03:13 looks like just the feed-reader is running always. Nov 05 15:03:13 (+v) Nov 05 15:03:32 nothing in my process list relating to chat/jabber/messaging Nov 05 15:03:46 apparently the correct path is: just hit the login button to get a note that happens to mention garage.maemo.org, guess that might be a helpful destination Nov 05 15:04:37 ok gotta get on the road soon. laterz al Nov 05 15:04:38 l Nov 05 15:04:41 maybe I will try irssi-proxy, X-Chat and bitlbee. this way I can access the same IRC/IM session from everywhere.. Nov 05 15:06:04 fysafysa: that's what I do, except s/irssi-proxy/dircproxy/ Nov 05 15:08:42 * sp3000 grubles something about the consistency of wikicreates vs bugzilla_reported Nov 05 15:08:47 * sp3000 grumbles, too Nov 05 15:09:56 what's up sp3000? Nov 05 15:10:52 hmm nothing much Nov 05 15:10:53 <_Monkey> i guess nothing much is compiled for vfp, certainly libm isn't Nov 05 15:11:00 * sp3000 sobs Nov 05 15:11:15 _Monkey: forget nothing much Nov 05 15:11:15 <_Monkey> sp3000: I forgot nothing much Nov 05 15:11:24 _Monkey: nothing much is Nov 05 15:11:25 <_Monkey> OK, sp3000. Nov 05 15:11:34 he does come up with some little random bits of knowledge though :) Nov 05 15:11:36 dircproxy looks slick. would be nice to not have to setup irssi. Nov 05 15:11:38 _Monkey: have a pretzel Nov 05 15:11:39 <_Monkey> sp3000: what? Nov 05 15:12:00 _Monkey: a pretzel is a kind of respiratory aid Nov 05 15:12:00 <_Monkey> OK, sp3000. Nov 05 15:15:50 pretzel? Nov 05 15:15:51 <_Monkey> i heard pretzel was a kind of respiratory aid Nov 05 15:15:53 lol Nov 05 15:16:00 poor _Monkey Nov 05 15:26:13 * timeless sighs Nov 05 15:27:27 jaffa: actually, would it make more sense to only have one sheet? Nov 05 15:27:28 i guess so Nov 05 15:27:37 copying seems like a bad idea Nov 05 15:28:15 timeless: I like the make-it-italic and then ienter the details; copying doesn't seem worthwhile TBH. Nov 05 15:28:57 BTW, question on line 38, sheet 1 ;-) Nov 05 15:31:35 the reason for the other tab is that at some point i'm going to dump a newer version of the noes Nov 05 15:31:48 and i need some way to avoid destroying/disconnecting the reported items Nov 05 15:32:07 i'll probably just move the reported ones to the top and remove them from the changelog Nov 05 15:32:23 big file is 50% sent (ir sucks for sending data) Nov 05 15:37:46 timeless: #2210 raised Nov 05 15:39:15 myfile just arrived :) Nov 05 15:39:37 and i think it crashes the inbox app:) Nov 05 15:41:29 hehe Nov 05 15:42:27 that wasn't quite the goal... Nov 05 15:45:38 ok, let's sneakernet usb the file using my n810... Nov 05 15:45:55 how to load a file using the web browser via bluetooth Nov 05 15:46:03 1. remove mmc from e61i Nov 05 15:46:17 2. remove microsd adapter from minisdadapter from n800 Nov 05 15:46:32 4. insert mmc in microsd adapter, insert microsd adapter into n810 Nov 05 15:46:44 5. attach n810 to laptop Nov 05 15:46:48 6. copy file Nov 05 15:46:51 7. reverse steps Nov 05 15:47:04 0. use wifi Nov 05 15:47:14 hrm Nov 05 15:47:21 the file started on a box that's not on a wifi net Nov 05 15:47:27 box -1 Nov 05 15:47:41 i don't think the e61i supports smb Nov 05 15:47:45 may it be that maemo.org is down Nov 05 15:47:49 i cannont GET https://garage.maemo.org/frs/download.php/1272/Media_Converter_Windows_1.43_setup.exe Nov 05 15:47:57 timeless: theres a commercial smb solution for s60 Nov 05 15:48:13 free or $$$ Nov 05 15:48:20 * timeless suspects nokia won't pay for the $$$ one Nov 05 15:48:22 $$$, dunno if they got a demo Nov 05 15:49:08 does anyone have a mediaconverter setup lying around Nov 05 15:49:16 maybe even a 1.43_windows Nov 05 15:49:25 because of the signing shit it's not as useful when developing native stuff as it would have been on 2nd edition so havent really tried it Nov 05 15:50:52 gah, i hit a snag Nov 05 15:50:58 i can't remove the mmc from the n810 :( Nov 05 15:51:07 :) Nov 05 15:51:07 eh? Nov 05 15:51:34 timeless: have you tried to pull??? Nov 05 15:51:43 rather push Nov 05 15:51:47 _Monkey: what is recursion? Nov 05 15:51:47 <_Monkey> well, recursion is when you think about recursion is when you think about recursion is when you think about recursion is when you think about recursion is when you think about recursion is when SEGFAULT! Nov 05 15:54:01 zoran: i pushed first Nov 05 15:54:09 but the pulling part (after) didn't work right Nov 05 15:54:19 and i got a hand witness Nov 05 15:54:27 (eyes aren' useful for such bugs) Nov 05 15:54:39 jaffa:ok, he message i gave you ... Nov 05 15:54:50 is correct :) Nov 05 15:55:06 it thankfully doesn't destroy the document Nov 05 15:55:14 but as you of course guessed, it's modal :) Nov 05 15:56:10 timess, broken part should be fixed to work flowlessly on and on Nov 05 15:56:46 zoran: oh, for the next version i'm sure they'll do something completely different :) Nov 05 15:56:51 all new bugs! Nov 05 15:58:04 I also experienced memory card prob this days and understand what do you think for yourself Nov 05 15:58:15 (that's sarcasm certainty, i haven't seen nor do i know anything about what they're going to do, or if they're going to do anything, Nov 05 15:58:22 nor could i say if i did know...) Nov 05 15:58:40 he-he Nov 05 15:58:58 and who they are at all Nov 05 16:00:51 does anyone have a media converter setup for windows?? (at least) the garage-downloads are down!! Nov 05 16:01:06 i need it to convert a movie i want to see when driving home today Nov 05 16:01:14 oh Nov 05 16:01:21 what url? Nov 05 16:01:36 timeless.justdave.net/mxr-test/garage/source/ sometimes has what you need Nov 05 16:01:41 depending on whose project Nov 05 16:02:06 also, for some days I cannot get files from repository. Access denied for untrusted people. Nov 05 16:02:20 http://timeless.justdave.net/mxr-test/garage/source/mediaconverter/www/ Nov 05 16:02:21 so, I can't refresh app list on device Nov 05 16:02:34 doesn't look like there's anything useful there, sorry Nov 05 16:02:54 timeless: i need a windows build Nov 05 16:03:19 timeless, maybe you're right, but I still cannot refresh the lists Nov 05 16:03:53 zoran: sorry, what i mean is that whereever they stored their data Nov 05 16:04:23 k, I posted not so readable Nov 05 16:04:33 I cannot use app manager to refresh lists Nov 05 16:04:36 is not in the svn bit Nov 05 16:04:48 because if it were, i'd be able to browse it from my server Nov 05 16:05:17 go to: repository.maemo.org/pool/gregale and try to get something Nov 05 16:05:17 /service Nov 05 16:05:39 http://repository.maemo.org/pool/gregale/free/source/a/acl/acl_2.2.23-1maemo1.dsc Nov 05 16:05:42 wfm :) Nov 05 16:06:04 go to debs Nov 05 16:06:12 get any binary file Nov 05 16:06:38 view-source:http://repository.maemo.org/pool/gregale/free/b/base-files/base-files_3.1.osso2+3.1.10.osso4_armel.deb Nov 05 16:06:39 wfm Nov 05 16:06:41 ! Nov 05 16:07:19 got it? Nov 05 16:07:19 not very pretty, but... Nov 05 16:07:29 yes Nov 05 16:07:39 timeless: so you can see the document in its partiality after clearing the dialogue? Nov 05 16:07:42 zoran: timeless: what?? Nov 05 16:07:51 jaffa: yeah Nov 05 16:08:01 timeless: I'll add a comment clarifying. Nov 05 16:08:26 web page details is odd though! Nov 05 16:08:34 it says Size: {full size} Nov 05 16:08:39 even though i don't have the full file Nov 05 16:08:46 note: I have no idea what expected results should be :) Nov 05 16:09:16 also, the Address field in page details didn't elipsize :) Nov 05 16:09:33 (it truncated) Nov 05 16:09:38 no idea whether that's correct :) Nov 05 16:10:58 http://downloads.maemo.org/downloads/OS2008 Nov 05 16:11:15 you're kidding! Nov 05 16:11:19 oh, good, 500 Nov 05 16:11:21 good good Nov 05 16:11:25 * timeless would hate to be late Nov 05 16:11:29 :) Nov 05 16:11:30 * timeless has ~100 lines left to deal w/ Nov 05 16:11:47 timeless: http://www.simplythrifty.com/100-things-you-can-make-yourself/ Nov 05 16:12:20 is it possible that noone has a mediaconverer setup?!!? Nov 05 16:13:01 forget it is Nov 05 16:13:46 bedboi: We're still working on it at the moment. Nov 05 16:13:53 ah ok. Nov 05 16:14:00 dubidubidub: I use 770-encode from the command line (or web interface through mediaserv) Nov 05 16:14:08 i don't care, just put a redirect Nov 05 16:14:10 or something Nov 05 16:15:15 Jaffa: so i would need pear on my windows? isn't that a little too much overhead? Nov 05 16:16:27 if anyone is still not aware of this http://risujin.org/cellwriter/ Nov 05 16:20:46 exit Nov 05 16:20:52 :/ Nov 05 16:20:57 part Nov 05 16:21:37 oops Nov 05 16:24:40 hola Nov 05 16:24:40 <_Monkey> que tal, lopz Nov 05 16:26:11 _Monkey: what is _Monkey Nov 05 16:26:12 <_Monkey> rumour has it i am an annoying bot Nov 05 16:26:22 _Monkey: what is a bot Nov 05 16:26:22 <_Monkey> a bot is an automated program that people put on IRC to annoy other people Nov 05 16:26:33 _Monkey: what are other people Nov 05 16:26:33 <_Monkey> bugger all, i dunno, dubidubidub Nov 05 16:26:34 Monkey is bi-lingual? Nov 05 16:26:47 _Monkey: monkeys are bi Nov 05 16:26:48 <_Monkey> OK, dubidubidub. Nov 05 16:26:55 _Monkey: what are monkeys? Nov 05 16:26:56 <_Monkey> monkeys are bi Nov 05 16:27:12 _Monkey: try rm -rf on a root shell! Nov 05 16:27:13 <_Monkey> dubidubidub: excuse me? Nov 05 16:27:31 _Monkey: tell me more about penguinb8 Nov 05 16:27:32 <_Monkey> dubidubidub: what? Nov 05 16:27:38 _Monkey: what is penguinb8 Nov 05 16:27:38 <_Monkey> dubidubidub: no idea Nov 05 16:27:43 hmpg Nov 05 16:27:44 hmpf Nov 05 16:27:59 _Monkey: what is the answer? Nov 05 16:28:00 <_Monkey> i think the answer is 42. but what is the question Nov 05 16:28:00 anyone has any clue about why the heck gtk developers do not spawn a thread when a GtkFileChooser widget is shown? Nov 05 16:28:11 bedboi: no Nov 05 16:28:14 you set variable monkeys t obi Nov 05 16:28:21 it's so stupid Nov 05 16:28:38 QT (i hate QT) is very fast in doing that Nov 05 16:28:55 in fact, GTK file chooser is not usable Nov 05 16:28:57 at all Nov 05 16:29:03 most of the time filechooser is modal - why spawn a thread for a modal dialog? Nov 05 16:29:19 Tak: the point is "IT IS DAMN SLOW" Nov 05 16:29:27 it's so damn fucking slow. Nov 05 16:29:28 anyone get qt4.3 compiled in scratchbox yet? Nov 05 16:30:08 SVG support, is that done in software? Nov 05 16:30:38 this one mail sounds as if it was the mozilla svg engine Nov 05 16:30:40 file systems, e.g. nfs Nov 05 16:30:41 Tak: i think that's the slowest implementation of a file chooser that i ever saw in my life. it make me feel bad. Nov 05 16:30:41 which would be software Nov 05 16:30:44 tend to be blocking in sucky ways Nov 05 16:30:52 spawning threads is the only safe way to deal w/ them Nov 05 16:30:56 dunno, I'd look weird if I spawned a thread every time someone used software I wrote Nov 05 16:30:57 c0ffee: that was the reply though Nov 05 16:31:10 c0ffee: the powervr does svg acceleration too Nov 05 16:31:10 yeah Nov 05 16:31:26 i somehow doubt that there will be powervr support Nov 05 16:31:31 bedboi: probably they should just improve the implementation then... Nov 05 16:31:42 (in an OSS component as mozilla) Nov 05 16:31:53 c0ffee: no, there's no driver for it, but one can live in hope Nov 05 16:32:16 * sp3000 was under the impression that the filechooser had a whole army of threads Nov 05 16:32:18 http://viper.haque.net/~timeless/blog/78 Nov 05 16:32:19 c0ffee: no driver on the n810 that is, ones for 2.6.x do exist Nov 05 16:32:21 eep, wrong window Nov 05 16:32:24 timeless: even without taking into account slow filesystems, you don't need to be a genius to understand that if you have a very large amount (>1000) files in a directory you need something asynchronous dealing it Nov 05 16:32:32 if: yes, the binary translation will work in any target Nov 05 16:32:42 i can provide a math proof for that :) (joking) Nov 05 16:32:47 sp3000: iirc closer to 10 :) Nov 05 16:32:55 which is a fairly large army as things go Nov 05 16:33:00 if: oops, i was miles behind Nov 05 16:33:59 i tend to get a coffee each time i have to open or save a file within a Gtk application, which makes me nervous as a side effect. Nov 05 16:34:01 * suihkulokki waves at robtaylor Nov 05 16:34:16 suihkulokki: hey :) Nov 05 16:34:57 suihkulokki: nice to see some progress getting made on debian armel :) Nov 05 16:34:59 bedboi: you can type into it while it's scanning Nov 05 16:35:05 unless you use an ancient version Nov 05 16:35:05 i want a n810 too :( Nov 05 16:35:08 and plus, add that now i'm in france, coffee sucks here. Nov 05 16:35:22 true :) Nov 05 16:35:28 it does seem to do too much work too slowly before displaying the list Nov 05 16:35:49 yep. Nov 05 16:36:00 try to open /usr/share/doc Nov 05 16:36:02 robtaylor: so what do you want to help with? :P Nov 05 16:36:03 or /usr/bin Nov 05 16:36:07 you are quite dead Nov 05 16:36:12 but I'm not terribly fond of the hildon solution where a random item that happens to appear first gets selected and then items randomly appear into random positions and you end up in a very random unstable place until it settles Nov 05 16:36:18 suihkulokki: heh, what needs help? :) Nov 05 16:36:34 so basically you have something to look at while it's doing stuff but it's not very useful Nov 05 16:36:37 sp3000: yep, that's annoying, esp as it takes such a long time to populate the list Nov 05 16:36:45 robtaylor: http://lists.debian.org/debian-arm/2007/11/msg00001.html Nov 05 16:37:02 and it's surely slower in doing its thing because it's showing you its variant of a defrag.exe hypno clone Nov 05 16:37:17 now it's more than 1 minute Nov 05 16:37:21 yeah, I agree with sp3000 about the problems of asynchronous display Nov 05 16:37:48 lol, now it's two minutes and the filechooser is unresponsive Nov 05 16:38:10 use the web browser to browse your file system ;-) Nov 05 16:38:22 timeless: i always use rox Nov 05 16:38:25 bedboi: sounds like a version from a year or two back? Nov 05 16:38:33 in order to work around fucking stupid gtkfilechooser Nov 05 16:38:46 sp3000: i use debian sid Nov 05 16:38:48 upgraded today Nov 05 16:38:51 or mc? Nov 05 16:39:22 bedboi: interesting, I don't get it unresponsive, but then I seldom wait for it to list things but tell it what I want directly Nov 05 16:39:38 sp3000: 2.12.1-1 Nov 05 16:39:50 it's still unresponsive Nov 05 16:40:00 firefox is 99.9% of CPU Nov 05 16:40:03 but really, it should be: list dents, show tree, update details async Nov 05 16:40:28 it's a cool denial of service Nov 05 16:40:43 just open a gtk file chooser pointing to /usr/bin Nov 05 16:41:08 bedboi: took about 12 secs Nov 05 16:41:36 anyone here using dircproxy? Nov 05 16:42:02 sp3000: there must be something terribly wrong with me. Nov 05 16:42:15 btw i don't see why Nov 05 16:42:37 i don't have libgtk in my usr/local/lib Nov 05 16:43:06 why would it be in *local* ? Nov 05 16:43:10 ...because it's in /usr/lib ? Nov 05 16:43:13 media2: I am Nov 05 16:43:27 Tak: i know that Nov 05 16:43:29 Tak: how are you launching it on the server? Nov 05 16:43:38 that was fx "open file" fwiw, I suppose it could do more work if it was filtering +x or something Nov 05 16:43:50 Tak: I ran it once and it worked, conneted from a client, then when I closed the client the server quit. Nov 05 16:43:51 fysamobi: I have an init script Nov 05 16:44:24 hmm, no Nov 05 16:44:26 * sp3000 shrugs Nov 05 16:45:32 ah, found an init script Nov 05 16:45:36 fysamobi: is "disconnect_on_detach" set in dircproxyrc ? Nov 05 16:48:50 I think I figured it out. Nov 05 16:49:10 was running as a local user, so had to specify pid_file in ~ instead of the default. Nov 05 16:49:24 found the cronchk.sh script for keeping dircproxy running from crontab Nov 05 16:49:36 hi, anyone here know if it is too late to file a submission for the N810 device program? I couldn't find a way to do so. Nov 05 16:49:57 There was no "place" to submit a ticket from my profile. Nov 05 16:50:09 for some reason I have a mental block about checking /usr/share/doc/packagename/ -- I usually just google. :P Nov 05 16:51:34 test Nov 05 16:51:53 hmm. Nov 05 16:54:14 fysamobi: maybe because nokia strips that? :) Nov 05 16:54:35 timeless: on my ubuntu server :) Nov 05 16:56:18 ah Nov 05 16:56:20 there we go. Nov 05 16:56:44 * fysakk test Nov 05 16:57:14 interesting replication, just like amaebas do Nov 05 17:00:04 looking at my depot directory, I found Cron.pm module. have I started something with that on this channel? Nov 05 17:02:15 Cron.pm? Nov 05 17:02:43 perl module from cpan Nov 05 17:02:45 There is a tiny cron/crontab available for busybox. I don't know why Maemo just doesn't include it.. Nov 05 17:03:23 I turn off my 770, so I have just teorethical interest Nov 05 17:03:25 but you can compile it as 'busybox2' and ln -s crond /usr/bin/busybox2 Nov 05 17:03:41 what would be nice is some way to hook cron into alarmd.. Nov 05 17:03:56 then you could schedule a cron task to potentially wake up your device, execute, then turn it back off again. Nov 05 17:04:02 would be nice for syncing.. Nov 05 17:04:18 I found perl/python more close to my heart Nov 05 17:04:35 hey, what do you mean "wake up"? Nov 05 17:04:47 no power down? Nov 05 17:04:48 <||cw> bring it out of suspend Nov 05 17:04:56 well, we're comparing apples and oranges here. a busybox cron would use maybe 50kb more space/RAM Nov 05 17:05:06 python/perl cron would use something in the order of a megabyte or more. Nov 05 17:05:24 such is the glory of busybox Nov 05 17:05:35 hm, 44762 Nov 05 17:05:36 but yeah, alarmd lets you schedule power management events to bring your device out of sleep. Nov 05 17:06:34 is there a diff between 770 and 800 in that matter? Nov 05 17:08:12 don't believe so Nov 05 17:09:32 sp3000: for kicks, try this Nov 05 17:09:36 load: https://garage.maemo.org/plugins/scmsvn/viewcvs.php/mozilla/trunk/microb-engine/microb-engine/debian/patches/?root=browser Nov 05 17:09:40 http://www.informit.com/guides/content.aspx?g=security&seqNum=249&rl=1 Nov 05 17:09:43 enter "705" in the box by "set" Nov 05 17:09:45 and click "set" Nov 05 17:09:50 search for 'busybox2' Nov 05 17:11:16 timeless: I suppose that intends to be a redirect Nov 05 17:11:34 except it forgets to emit a header or something Nov 05 17:11:47 fysamobi, search.cpan.org/src/ROLAND/Schedule-Cron-0.97/README Nov 05 17:12:21 * sp3000 giggles at the log messages Nov 05 17:12:44 "Added missing part". Nov 05 17:13:08 green wizard from mmc added that? Nov 05 17:16:40 * zoran gone to feed dragons Nov 05 17:19:01 http://www.engadget.com/2007/11/05/live-coverage-of-googles-android-gphone-mobile-os-announcement/ Nov 05 17:35:28 cool Nov 05 17:35:33 android can replace maemo :) Nov 05 17:36:13 <||cw> maybe Nov 05 17:37:28 It doesn't seem entirely clear on what it actually *is* Nov 05 17:37:38 <|R> Apache v2 license... Nov 05 17:37:43 <|R> i wonder what the result will be Nov 05 17:37:53 it's an os written w/ a better license (apache) Nov 05 17:38:07 <|R> Nov 05 17:38:07 <|R> haha Nov 05 17:38:34 <||cw> wonder how it differs from openmoko Nov 05 17:39:18 real backing? :) Nov 05 17:39:22 :) Nov 05 17:39:31 <||cw> technically I mean Nov 05 17:39:36 It's a vapourware announcement tho'. Nov 05 17:39:53 <||cw> they said the sdk will be available in 2 weeks Nov 05 17:40:08 <|R> on the 12 Nov 05 17:40:14 <|R> 1 week :) Nov 05 17:40:22 motorola, htc, samsung, lg Nov 05 17:40:46 ||cw: true, but no screenshots or any technical detail yet. It sounds more like a mission statement atm Nov 05 17:40:53 <||cw> oh, right, one week, dunno why i remeberd 2 Nov 05 17:41:54 do you have so little understanding Nov 05 17:43:04 ok, the kids are really cute Nov 05 17:44:58 dolfun; ? Nov 05 17:45:13 "i'd rather see mobs beating lawyers, rather than the state itself" - Scott Horton Nov 05 17:45:39 web-browser-phone? Whats new.. devices out by next summer or not Nov 05 17:48:26 Looks like something where maemo could go if it would be on device with phone-chip Nov 05 17:48:34 vre: a non suckilly licensed phone is a big deal Nov 05 17:48:41 lgpl is a sucky license Nov 05 17:49:28 timeless: depends what you need it for Nov 05 17:49:28 <|R> what does the alliance wins (except for google) if everyone can just take their code and not give back, ever...? Nov 05 17:50:07 free code is the front line of the fight against evil Nov 05 17:50:43 <|R> (but i see this turning into a bsd vs gpl ;) Nov 05 17:50:44 it's not like it's the first linux for mobiles alliance either Nov 05 17:50:53 I wonder what the apis will be like, it is nesessary to invent the weel again to do a bit ui Nov 05 17:51:57 but sure it'll kick some symbalium ass anyday Nov 05 17:53:48 * Jaffa reckons it's about the fourth or fifth Linux phone alliance. Now, that's not to say it won't be successful or not, but not everything Google touches turns to gold (c.f. Orkut) Nov 05 17:55:33 operators want to get rid of big phonesuppliers, so they can generic pc-phones and lock them down and keep the money. Underdogs phonesuppliers want to get atleast some part of the market.. Nov 05 17:56:34 Indeed. When at IBM I was peripherally involved in a big proof-of-concept project for an operator who felt too the phone manufacturers like Nokia & SE had way too much control. Nov 05 17:59:33 there's just not anything new about this alliance from the previous one's.. Nov 05 17:59:48 and the companies involved are involved in other things as well Nov 05 18:00:07 moto has a spoon in every os soup there is, including their own closed linux juix Nov 05 18:00:52 Indeed, I'd say they're hoping to ride Google's coattails, rather than being convinced about an open platform. Nov 05 18:00:58 and because of nature of "android" we can't really know what the devices are untill they ship. if we're able to build applications for them or not even Nov 05 18:17:08 Hi there Nov 05 18:17:26 wanted to install the bluesnarf toolkit on my N770 Nov 05 18:17:51 or the bluetooth stack hack tools on it ... any hints ? Nov 05 18:48:43 anyone know what the maemo users IRC channel is? Nov 05 18:49:48 hmm? Nov 05 18:50:00 isn't it this Nov 05 18:50:37 well, taking into account that maemo is a development platform, users are mostly developers, right? :) Nov 05 18:51:00 but it's common to talk about tablet os specific stuff here Nov 05 18:51:01 does anyone know how to change teh lock code on an N800? Nov 05 18:51:21 or rather set a lock code. Nov 05 18:51:23 What's the best format for ebooks with fbreader? Nov 05 18:51:28 fbreader? Nov 05 18:53:20 or even just how to reset the N800 back to a default install. i inherited one from someone and would love to just get back to default and start from there. Nov 05 18:55:38 <|R> harkonen: can't you just flash it then? Nov 05 18:57:46 it doesn't help that my internet seems to be spotty here at work..... Nov 05 18:57:47 R: probably could. how do i do that? just download maemo and install it via my Linux box? Nov 05 18:58:12 yes Nov 05 18:59:45 http://europe.nokia.com/A4305010 Nov 05 19:02:08 apple can't afford working internet connection ?-) Nov 05 19:11:45 we need a _fantastic_ today screen with calendar events,todo,appointments etc :) Nov 05 19:14:26 and tabs. Nov 05 19:14:37 i don't get why we still don't have tabs in the home screen Nov 05 19:37:38 Can only say, L0cutus, amen.. Nov 05 19:56:36 * fysa test Nov 05 20:45:40 some kind of chandler Nov 05 20:58:21 does the retu-adc.c code really work? seems to be getting odd values back when running it Nov 05 21:08:02 re Nov 05 21:09:00 isn't possible to set bluetooth on n800 to accept multiple-files and save them always to the same directory ? Nov 05 21:09:11 hey, rc#.d and init.d operate the same in maemo as in linux normally right? Nov 05 21:22:15 legind, yeah Nov 05 21:26:56 hello Nov 05 21:27:16 so, os2208 out yet? Nov 05 21:32:00 doh, left already, was going to suggest coming back in about two centuries Nov 05 21:43:48 win 40 Nov 05 21:43:50 oops Nov 05 22:10:42 re Nov 05 22:33:53 re Nov 05 23:26:59 wow Nov 05 23:27:06 new download webpage? Nov 05 23:31:04 Uh. Works again... was b0rked a few hours ago... Nov 05 23:31:45 yeah Nov 05 23:31:48 working now Nov 05 23:32:53 Hmm. Can you login? Nov 05 23:33:29 Uuuh. Vagalume rocks! ;-) finally a last.fm client. 8-) Nov 05 23:38:50 oo cool Nov 05 23:39:09 Oh. There's also a plugin that I've missed... maemoscrobbler. Nov 05 23:40:16 The CMS seems to be a little confused... Nov 05 23:40:22 ...bleeding edge. ;-) Nov 05 23:42:11 * rwhitby notes conversations with real Google developer advocates happening in #android ... if anyone is interested in the new Google phone OS. they can't say anything till next week though. Nov 05 23:48:06 rwhitby: thanks for the headsup :) Nov 05 23:49:09 kismet is nice on N800 Nov 05 23:49:32 I really don't want to keep on adding apps if OS2008 is coming out Nov 05 23:49:34 :( **** ENDING LOGGING AT Mon Nov 05 23:50:56 2007 **** BEGIN LOGGING AT Mon Nov 05 23:51:17 2007 Nov 05 23:52:57 win 40 Nov 05 23:53:01 what does kismet get you over the standard network selector thing? Nov 05 23:54:37 skibur, Actually it's a good excuse to add every app and test them out. Nov 05 23:54:54 skibur, Since you'll be clearing them with 2008 comes around anyway. Nov 05 23:54:56 true Nov 05 23:55:26 ?ds3 Nov 05 23:57:00 on OS2007 and 2006, if tapping on the thing in the upper right area brings up a list that will scan for wireless networks Nov 05 23:57:11 how is kismet different from that Nov 05 23:57:44 kismet operates totally differently Nov 05 23:57:55 network list is simply an active probe from the card. Nov 05 23:57:59 but isn't the information the same? Nov 05 23:58:02 nope Nov 05 23:58:05 not in the slightest Nov 05 23:58:21 if all you want is the active network list, don't use kismet. Nov 05 23:59:05 I am trying to understand what additional info kismet gives me Nov 06 00:00:04 Data capture, hidden network disclosure, IDS functionality, client lists per network, etc. Nov 06 00:00:12 Or, look at the website Nov 06 00:00:30 if all you want is a list of networks from the probe responses, don't use kismet. Nov 06 00:00:31 kismet has its own website? all I been seeing is the stuff for the various ports Nov 06 00:00:38 * ds3 searches Nov 06 00:00:57 uhhhh yeah :P Nov 06 00:01:12 found it Nov 06 00:03:04 ook Nov 06 00:03:05 lol Nov 06 00:03:07 yeah Nov 06 00:08:17 <|R> uhm, there is a non crashing kismet? (2007) Nov 06 00:08:46 ? Nov 06 00:08:48 yeah Nov 06 00:08:56 I really haven't tested yet Nov 06 00:09:01 just works so far Nov 06 00:09:05 N800 Nov 06 00:09:25 <|R> 2007.01.R1b-1.0 ? :) Nov 06 00:09:31 Hey guys, I want to put out N800 compatible files with my video podcast, will using the 770-encode script on Best be good enough>? Nov 06 00:10:16 |R Nov 06 00:10:18 yeah :P Nov 06 00:10:24 <|R> k:) Nov 06 00:10:28 I guess it will crash soon Nov 06 00:10:39 <|R> hehe only tried once Nov 06 00:10:45 <|R> but it screwed up my wifi, i had to reboot Nov 06 00:10:51 got btscanner? Nov 06 00:10:52 <|R> (should try again...) Nov 06 00:11:14 <|R> uhm nop? Nov 06 00:12:31 don't suppose there is a equiv of kismet for bluetooth? Nov 06 00:14:57 ds3: Not really. Sniffing bluetooth isn't as straight forward Nov 06 00:15:14 infact you're basically limited to the network-finder model of "what BT devices report they exist" Nov 06 00:16:02 Reddaway: kismet crashing - 2007-10-R1 has a crapton of memory saving, speed boosts, and bugfixes, however no-one has contributed anything from the list of things needed for proper maemo support and I haven't had any time, so no maemo packages yet Nov 06 00:16:08 hm Nov 06 00:16:20 stupid auto-complete, that was "re:" not meant to be a users name Nov 06 00:17:36 dragorn: I found the references about people hacking the CSR firmware, but I figure I'd ask incase someone had a breakthru Nov 06 00:17:42 anyway. Bluetooth is sniffable but not generally with commodity hardware, and definitely not w/ the cpu power available in the N800 should you happen to get it working with non-commidity hardware Nov 06 00:18:38 some things can be done w hacked firmware, but you still need data not easily obtainable. doing it with a SDR like the USRP requires you do the FFT and demodulation on the host, and the n800 is never going to pull that off Nov 06 00:19:40 according to one page, even the USRP required 10 radios to do all the channels Nov 06 00:19:52 the N800 does have a built in DSP to help a bit Nov 06 00:20:03 not going to help enough Nov 06 00:20:34 and, you'd probably need more than 10 to sniff all the channels, and each one will basically need a dedicated PC Nov 06 00:20:46 it takes 100% of a 2ghz cpu to demod barker CCK at 1mbit Nov 06 00:21:03 and even that only gets about 12mhz of the 25mhz channel because of the usrp hw limitations Nov 06 00:21:51 quad core/4way physical SMP should come close but yes, I get your point Nov 06 00:21:54 in theory you can do it a little cheaper since if you sit on a 1mhz slice for bluetooth and wait for it to hop to that, but I'd never expect the n800, even with a dsp chip, to be able to handle the demod. Nov 06 00:22:14 Wouldn't come close to demodulating 84mhz of overlapping channels, no. Nov 06 00:22:29 * dragorn has a usrp. Nov 06 00:22:30 all I want is to be able to debug a pairing session; there are sniffers out there using CSR radios + special firmware that will do it Nov 06 00:24:03 what you really want to do is sit on a channel, capture a fractional mac address, brute the remainder to get the hopping pattern, and then feed it to a fpga for decoding Nov 06 00:25:33 this is the page I was talking about; the claim is 8 radios can cover all 79 channels - http://www.usenix.org/events/woot07/tech/full_papers/spill/spill_html/ Nov 06 01:17:50 is the mmc card supposed to be fat or fat32? Nov 06 02:38:49 hay guys Nov 06 02:38:57 I just went to the phone store Nov 06 02:39:08 saw me a HTC Mogul Nov 06 02:39:10 h4x Nov 06 02:44:15 .. Nov 06 02:54:27 Is Video center developed using maemo? **** ENDING LOGGING AT Tue Nov 06 02:59:56 2007