**** BEGIN LOGGING AT Mon Dec 17 02:59:57 2007
Dec 17 03:50:38 <lopz> bye
Dec 17 03:52:18 <ScisserFeind> hello
Dec 17 03:52:24 <ScisserFeind> is any one active here?
Dec 17 03:52:35 <skibur> nope
Dec 17 03:52:39 <ScisserFeind> shame
Dec 17 03:52:54 <skibur> everybody asleep
Dec 17 03:52:59 <ScisserFeind> cuz I was hoping maybe someone could helpme with something
Dec 17 03:53:06 <ScisserFeind> perhaps?
Dec 17 03:54:03 <blast007> ScisserFeind: usually it's just best to ask a question and wait for a response
Dec 17 03:54:10 <ScisserFeind> thanks
Dec 17 03:54:36 <skibur> that is a response, try again
Dec 17 03:54:36 <ScisserFeind> Does anyone know of anyway of using the Nokia 770 as a Midi Controller?
Dec 17 03:54:50 <ScisserFeind> looks like a question to me
Dec 17 03:54:57 <ScisserFeind> =)
Dec 17 03:57:29 <skibur> hum... don't
Dec 17 03:59:46 <ScisserFeind> thats not very helpful
Dec 17 04:01:49 <skibur> know
Dec 17 04:02:13 <skibur> sorry on my N800 pidgin
Dec 17 04:02:29 <realcomix> Me too
Dec 17 04:03:44 <lle2> anybody willing to try these: http://freedesktop.org/Software/sbox2/Maemo
Dec 17 04:03:49 <ScisserFeind> im just trying to see if I can use it to send midi through usb at the moment
Dec 17 04:04:21 <halley> It's not a full USB, it's a special kind of USB.
Dec 17 04:04:31 <skibur> what is the purpose of a midi controller?
Dec 17 04:04:37 <halley> Well, not sure about the 770 honestly.
Dec 17 04:04:52 <lle2> it can do host
Dec 17 04:05:00 <lle2> but can't provide power
Dec 17 04:05:35 <ScisserFeind> i dont need it, I want to use it to manipulate params on a softsynth
Dec 17 04:06:00 <halley> So you'd want to do one of those USB->MIDI dongles at the minimum, then do whatever other midi apps do with the usb.
Dec 17 04:07:00 <ScisserFeind> well, ive got the usb cable from n770 to computer
Dec 17 04:07:13 <ScisserFeind> i just need to see if I can use it to send the data i want
Dec 17 04:08:09 <halley> lle2, would love to see if osx could run it without having to use some parallels hack.
Dec 17 04:08:46 <lle2> I need some serious help with dylibs on osx
Dec 17 04:09:41 <lle2> as in, how are they _really_ linked, not this "use libtool" answer that I keep running into
Dec 17 04:51:19 <ScisserFeind> does anyone have any experience with PD or PDa?
Dec 17 06:12:02 <sarower> hello
Dec 17 06:12:11 <pupnik_> hi
Dec 17 06:12:53 <sarower> I need to know: Where the chat history and internet call history  remains in the N800 device..?
Dec 17 06:13:30 <sarower> I mean in which directory this information is??
Dec 17 06:13:35 <sarower> is there anybody?
Dec 17 06:13:40 <sarower> help me?
Dec 17 06:14:15 <sarower> Pupnik: I think you are expert... so please say something!
Dec 17 06:14:24 <pupnik> no idea
Dec 17 06:14:40 <sarower> any body please......!!!
Dec 17 06:14:44 <pupnik> but you can use grep to find text on a filesystem
Dec 17 06:15:02 <sarower> i need to find it in N800 device
Dec 17 06:15:31 <sarower> what the command could be..?
Dec 17 06:15:41 <sarower> I use A X-terminal
Dec 17 06:15:43 <pupnik> in xterm
Dec 17 06:15:47 <pupnik> cd /home
Dec 17 06:15:57 <pupnik> grep -ri $string user
Dec 17 06:16:04 <pupnik> will search subtree of user for $string
Dec 17 06:16:28 <pupnik> so substitute some text from chat, or a phone number for $string
Dec 17 06:16:30 <pupnik> that might work
Dec 17 06:16:51 <sarower> Thanx...
Dec 17 06:16:54 <sarower> let me try
Dec 17 06:18:05 <pupnik> if it is stored in some non-ascii binary format, grep will not find it of course
Dec 17 06:18:16 <sarower> hmmm
Dec 17 06:18:16 <pupnik> s/binary//
Dec 17 06:18:16 <infobot> pupnik meant: if it is stored in some non-ascii  format, grep will not find it of course
Dec 17 06:18:19 <sarower> right
Dec 17 06:18:38 <pupnik> actually maybe it works with unicode now?  i am behind the times
Dec 17 06:19:00 <sarower> but grep is not working at all.......
Dec 17 06:19:18 <sarower> in this device there is no user
Dec 17 06:19:30 <pupnik> cd /home
Dec 17 06:19:30 <pupnik> ls
Dec 17 06:19:36 <pupnik> there should be a /home/user  no?
Dec 17 06:20:11 <sarower> yah there is /home/user
Dec 17 06:23:03 <sarower> pupnik: there is a directory /home/user... then/
Dec 17 06:23:07 <sarower> ?
Dec 17 06:25:53 <jga23> is there a .bashrc file for aliases for os2008?
Dec 17 06:27:54 <sarower> I need to know: Where the chat history and internet call history  remains in the N800 device..?
Dec 17 06:28:11 <sarower> any body please......!!!
Dec 17 06:29:03 <pupnik> sarower: the grep command can take a while to finish.  what happened when you tried it?
Dec 17 06:30:33 <sarower> Usage:grep [-rihHnqvs,,,,] PATTERN [FILES......]
Dec 17 06:30:47 <sarower> then stopping after it.
Dec 17 06:31:08 <|R> here it is: /home/user/.osso/imlogger
Dec 17 06:31:38 <|R> and up one level for other types of log (rtcom (sip)) etc...
Dec 17 06:32:30 <sarower> but the device is not showing these.. (. files and folders)
Dec 17 06:32:46 <sarower> it is only showing /home/user
Dec 17 06:33:17 <|R> where?
Dec 17 06:33:54 <sarower> ther is MyDocs and apps folder only under /home/user
Dec 17 06:34:01 <sarower> in N800 device
Dec 17 06:34:32 <|R> how do you make that list show up?
Dec 17 06:35:37 <sarower> In xter I just write ls
Dec 17 06:35:39 <sarower> there
Dec 17 06:35:55 <sarower> and it shows Mydocs and apps folder
Dec 17 06:36:09 <|R> ls doesn't show up files starting with . unless you use the -a flag
Dec 17 06:36:28 <sarower> ok then i must use ls -a
Dec 17 06:36:51 <sarower> ok it is showing...
Dec 17 06:36:55 <|R> why do you care about the logs anyway? lock your device :)
Dec 17 06:36:58 <sarower> is .Osso a directory
Dec 17 06:37:22 <sarower> I need to retrive the history
Dec 17 06:37:42 <sarower> I am planning to develop an application for N800 device
Dec 17 06:37:59 <sarower> is not it possible to retrieve the information any way..?
Dec 17 06:38:36 <|R> better learn some shell skills first :)
Dec 17 06:39:14 <sarower> why...?
Dec 17 06:39:27 <sarower> for command..?
Dec 17 06:39:46 <|R> well if you plan on developing for the n800, i'm guessing your going to need to play around the Maemo SDK
Dec 17 06:39:52 <|R> which runs on linux :)
Dec 17 06:40:36 <sarower> yah......
Dec 17 06:40:39 <sarower> right.......
Dec 17 06:40:44 <sarower> you are......
Dec 17 06:42:04 <sarower> there is no /home/user/.osso/imlogger
Dec 17 06:42:14 <sarower> pupnik.
Dec 17 06:42:24 <pupnik> hmm
Dec 17 06:42:57 <pupnik> i only have 770
Dec 17 06:43:07 <|R> that example was n800 with OS2008 beta
Dec 17 06:43:40 <sarower> hmm......
Dec 17 06:43:57 <sarower> WHich type of file imlogger is?
Dec 17 06:44:24 <|R> in my path? a folder
Dec 17 06:44:41 <pupnik> ahh sorry, the maemo grep does not support the -r (recursive) flag
Dec 17 06:44:50 <|R> pupnik it does
Dec 17 06:45:14 <|R> at least in 2008 beta :)
Dec 17 06:45:15 <pupnik> ok, on os2006 busybox it doesn't
Dec 17 06:45:24 * corevette wants OS 2008 HE!!!!!
Dec 17 06:45:27 <pupnik> sorry for imprecise language
Dec 17 06:45:30 <|R> but i think that it did in 2007
Dec 17 07:43:55 <steri> graeh, anyway know good mediaplayer for os2008? imho kagu and ukmp both suck
Dec 17 07:49:16 <zerojay> Yeah.
Dec 17 07:49:19 <zerojay> Media Player.
Dec 17 07:54:30 <steri> this might sound stupid but how I can add one directory which has lots of subdirectories to playlist?
Dec 17 07:58:18 <pupnik> steri: i don't know, but that's how i would like to add files
Dec 17 07:58:36 <pupnik> Maybe when xmms is finished for the tablets :)
Dec 17 07:58:51 <steri> I only found a add file and with 1.5gig mp3's thats insane thing to do
Dec 17 07:59:17 <pupnik> steri: with what program?
Dec 17 07:59:24 <steri> media player
Dec 17 07:59:52 <pupnik> the popular players are kagu, ukmp and canola
Dec 17 08:00:19 <pupnik> personally i prefer a more bare-bones app, that will load from directory trees and get out of the way
Dec 17 08:01:08 <pupnik> no album covers, giant fonts and buttons, no online database search, no filesystem crawler
Dec 17 08:01:12 <steri> I know, and I just told at imho kagu and ukmp suck :P canola2 is not released yet. maybe I just install older canola now and wait a week(?) until they get that 2.nd version out
Dec 17 08:01:55 <pupnik> don't say they 'suck'.  the creators put a lot of work and love into them. :)
Dec 17 08:01:56 <steri> that's the same I want, just some basic app which works on the background. knows how to play randomly etc just basic functions
Dec 17 08:02:02 <pupnik> yep
Dec 17 08:02:27 <pupnik> i haven't found that app yet, but it will come eventually
Dec 17 08:02:35 <steri> pupnik: that's way I said imho :P they look nice etc but they are something different what I luike
Dec 17 08:02:45 <steri> like
Dec 17 08:03:00 <pupnik> ok yes
Dec 17 08:03:31 <pupnik> i complained about this on the forums but i offended trev too much :)
Dec 17 08:03:58 <pupnik> I also prefer a native C/C++ app for me, not interpreted language
Dec 17 08:21:34 <sarower> I need to know: Where the chat history and internet call history  remains in the N800 device..?.
Dec 17 08:21:39 <sarower> any body please......!!!
Dec 17 08:23:43 <jjo__> sarower: I'm assuming you checked the obvious place (hidden directories in home directory)?
Dec 17 08:25:42 <sarower> jjo: right ....
Dec 17 08:25:54 <sarower> but which directory it may be..?
Dec 17 08:27:05 <steri> gladly there is commandline mplayer <3 mplayer -shuffle /path/mp3/*/*/*
Dec 17 08:29:33 <wplayya> hi
Dec 17 08:30:15 <wplayya> where can i set the color of normal text in a theme_
Dec 17 08:31:40 <sarower> hi.. jjo!!
Dec 17 08:31:45 <sarower> u there?
Dec 17 08:31:52 <sarower> n any idea..?
Dec 17 08:40:54 <pupnik> themes are in /usr/share/themes i think
Dec 17 08:41:03 <pupnik> there is a 'thememaker' application that can assist
Dec 17 08:45:54 <sarower> jjo u there?
Dec 17 08:48:49 <jjo__> oh, yes
Dec 17 08:49:30 <jjo__> actually I have no idea about the name of the directory it might be but the name is usually related to the program
Dec 17 08:50:14 <jjo__> there's no guarantee about that thou ;)
Dec 17 08:55:05 <sarower> hmm.....
Dec 17 08:57:34 <jjo__> actually it doesn't even seem to save the chat logs unless you save them explicitly
Dec 17 09:01:38 <sarower> is not there any information saved by the app itsekf..?
Dec 17 09:02:23 <sarower> like....contact info, chating partner, etc.......
Dec 17 09:02:56 <sarower> if i get the specific directory then it would be helpful to me
Dec 17 09:03:17 <sarower> to get the idea clearly......
Dec 17 09:16:47 <Jaffa> Morning, all
Dec 17 09:28:12 <rothiel> Hello World :)
Dec 17 09:47:32 <sarower> hello........
Dec 17 09:47:58 <sarower> Where the chat application and internet call application is installed in N800?
Dec 17 09:48:05 <sarower> anybody please..?
Dec 17 09:48:23 <sarower> in which directory..?
Dec 17 09:48:32 <sarower> any body can help...?
Dec 17 09:48:46 <jeddy3> sarower, slow down...
Dec 17 09:48:56 <sarower> sure.......
Dec 17 09:49:07 <sarower> can you please..!
Dec 17 09:49:16 <jeddy3> sarower, in wich directory on filesystem, or in menubar=
Dec 17 09:49:17 <jeddy3> ?
Dec 17 09:49:25 <sarower> filesystemm,,!
Dec 17 09:49:28 <sarower> jeddy
Dec 17 09:49:44 <jeddy3> sarower, hang on
Dec 17 09:50:19 <sarower> I need to find the information that it stores during chat or in general..
Dec 17 09:51:27 <jeddy3> oh, information
Dec 17 09:51:42 <jeddy3> information place != application place
Dec 17 09:51:57 <sarower> i need to know about both..!
Dec 17 09:52:20 <sarower> Information place is important...
Dec 17 09:52:52 <sarower> I need to see the history or other information related to chat and internet call
Dec 17 09:52:56 <sarower> jeddy!
Dec 17 09:53:36 <jeddy3> contactinformation is in .osso-abook anyway
Dec 17 09:54:22 <sarower> yah... i got it
Dec 17 09:54:40 <sarower> but history log....!
Dec 17 09:55:00 <jeddy3> maybe in db/adressbook.db
Dec 17 09:55:15 <sarower> yah the addressbook...!
Dec 17 09:55:54 <sarower> that means the contacts are stored in the /db/addressbook.db
Dec 17 09:56:30 <jeddy3> i have no idea :)
Dec 17 09:56:34 <sarower> but i need to know where the history is saved when chatting.!
Dec 17 09:57:07 <sarower> now can you please tell where the application is installed??
Dec 17 09:57:48 <sarower> jeddy..!
Dec 17 10:02:15 <jeddy3> sarower, first of all: doesn't hurt to be polite, second: I already told you, where application is installed have nothing to do with where it store it's information
Dec 17 10:02:40 <jeddy3> sarower, have you checked .osso-abook/db/adressbook.db as suggested?
Dec 17 10:04:09 <sarower> yah......man!
Dec 17 10:18:25 <carbonfreeze> so, would this be the place to discuss issues re: n810?
Dec 17 10:20:27 <Fang64> yup and the N800/N770
Dec 17 10:20:29 <vegai> for now, it's the place to growl at americans for getting their n810 earlier than everyone else
Dec 17 10:20:32 <Fang64> lol
Dec 17 10:20:32 <vegai> :P
Dec 17 10:20:36 <Fang64> or that
Dec 17 10:20:53 <carbonfreeze> wait, its not MY fault. I had to import my last pda (zaurus c3000)
Dec 17 10:22:02 <carbonfreeze> having a couple of odd issues; seems the OS likes to ignore settings in the /etc/fstab file.. can't change mount points (device ignores settings upon OS startup)
Dec 17 10:22:57 <carbonfreeze> ex: the internal sd is mounted to /media/mmc2; but I want to use it as /home. No go, each time device is power cycled, the internal mmc is mounted at /media/mmc2 again
Dec 17 10:34:49 <Rocketman> Does anyone know how to suppress the auto-dim function on the n810?
Dec 17 10:35:11 <Rocketman> It is constantly activating and it is driving me nuts
Dec 17 10:36:13 <Rocketman> they just HAD to put the light sensor right where your finger naturally wants to cradle the device
Dec 17 10:41:41 <Jaffa> Rocketman: finally, something which is better for the left-handers :)
Dec 17 10:43:22 <Rocketman> I am finding the n810 to be terribly unergonomic
Dec 17 10:43:44 <Palintheus> Jaffa: +1
Dec 17 10:43:46 <carbonfreeze> Rocketman: +1
Dec 17 10:44:08 <tontsa> well i don't like the fact that numbers are behind Fn-button. and there's no Fn-button on right side
Dec 17 10:44:19 <tontsa> so numbers 1-4 you need to use very tricky combo
Dec 17 10:44:21 <carbonfreeze> no pipe key on keybord, either
Dec 17 10:44:48 <Rocketman> They should have implemented tap and hold to trigger second functions of keys
Dec 17 10:45:41 <Rocketman> it is an extremely common thing on Win CE devices
Dec 17 10:45:50 <carbonfreeze> it would not have bothered me if the device was .5cm taller for another row of keys on kb
Dec 17 10:47:23 <Rocketman> everything about the button design just feels wrong to me, except they finally fixed the top buttons (fullscreen, +, -, etc.)
Dec 17 10:48:23 <Fang64> seems like nokia didn't completely think out the device
Dec 17 10:49:59 <Rocketman> It seems like after two revisions they should have really been at a very refined stage
Dec 17 10:50:28 <Rocketman> the n810 is a real mixed bag imo
Dec 17 10:50:41 <Rocketman> excellent build quality
Dec 17 10:50:49 <Rocketman> and more pocketable
Dec 17 10:51:29 <carbonfreeze> it would be nice to be able to run full x apps without porting
Dec 17 10:51:53 <Rocketman> but the switch to mini-sd, crappy ergonomics and sub-par gps have me yearning for my n800 again
Dec 17 10:52:09 <Rocketman> kinda feel the same way about Vista
Dec 17 10:52:16 <Rocketman> such a mixed bag
Dec 17 10:52:52 <Rocketman> yeah, carbonfreeze, hildon is the worst thing about maemo
Dec 17 10:53:08 <Rocketman> would see tons more apps without it
Dec 17 10:53:32 <carbonfreeze> doing stuff in the current version of gnumeric is driving me nuts
Dec 17 10:53:48 <carbonfreeze> tap the cell you want to edit, tap the edit field.. etc
Dec 17 10:54:18 <carbonfreeze> should have some sort of fallback mode for normal x apps, just run them in a smaller window or somesuch
Dec 17 10:54:51 <carbonfreeze> i mean, its like 800xsomething res, should be able to handle it. my other pda was 640x480 and i could run GIMP on it with little trouble
Dec 17 10:57:40 <Rocketman> no arguments here
Dec 17 11:00:12 <carbonfreeze> they should have taken something like the gpe pim apps (contact,calendar,todo,timesheet) and integrated it with the other apps (mail/etc). There should also be the ability to change the default application used for a task (chat/mail/rss/browser), or made the communicate menu customizable
Dec 17 11:00:14 <sp3000> Rocketman: hm? fn fn locks fn
Dec 17 11:00:56 <sp3000> hold would seem ...slow
Dec 17 11:01:08 * sp3000 shrugs
Dec 17 11:01:45 <sp3000> I suppose that'd work, too
Dec 17 11:01:48 <Rocketman> doing it that way is many keypresses vs just a few via tap and hold
Dec 17 11:01:51 <carbonfreeze> i cant believe they shipped a linux pda, without a pipe character on the keyboard. its such a pain to work in bash without it
Dec 17 11:02:21 <sp3000> you can put it in the onscreen row, right?
Dec 17 11:02:32 <sp3000> I mean you need tab all the time too, anyway :)
Dec 17 11:03:10 <carbonfreeze> yeah, but i forgot the alias for it, and im too lazy to look it up. much easier to complain about faulty keyboard design
Dec 17 11:07:21 <Rocketman> I've played with 4 different slider keyboard devices in the last few years and this is imo the worst of the lot
Dec 17 11:08:24 <carbonfreeze> I liked the keyboard on my spitz the most of any pda ive used, nice button spacing and reachable.
Dec 17 11:09:11 <Rocketman> spitz?
Dec 17 11:09:23 <carbonfreeze> sl-c3000
Dec 17 11:11:06 <Rocketman> ah, almost ordered one from dynamism
Dec 17 11:11:25 <carbonfreeze> yeah i picked one up as soon as they had them. great pda.
Dec 17 11:11:49 <carbonfreeze> got a 56k modem, wlan & 100 ether CF cards with it. great for travel.
Dec 17 11:11:59 <Rocketman> but kept working with my Jornada 728 and Netbook Pro for another year or so
Dec 17 11:12:09 <carbonfreeze> but, the battery was getting old, and i saw the n810 announced, and decided to pick it up
Dec 17 11:12:20 <carbonfreeze> spitz battery = $80+shipping
Dec 17 11:12:21 <Rocketman> until getting my 770 w bluetooth keyboard
Dec 17 11:13:59 <Rocketman> I'm almost ready to jump ship for one of the ultra small windows devices
Dec 17 11:14:20 <carbonfreeze> eh, only if it gets 6hrs+ battery & can run linux
Dec 17 11:14:36 <carbonfreeze> what bothers me about the n810 is no suspend to ram
Dec 17 11:15:01 <carbonfreeze> its always on, would be nice to suspend for more battery life. Unless the CPU/logic is so effecient that its the same
Dec 17 11:16:23 <Rocketman> like an OQO or Fujitsu U810
Dec 17 11:16:47 <carbonfreeze> i mean, its not a cell phone. My last pda could resume from suspend in like 0.3 seconds, why not allow it on this for great battery life
Dec 17 11:23:21 <Rocketman> I liked the U810 a lot, except for it's screen
Dec 17 11:23:41 <Rocketman> too glossy
Dec 17 11:23:44 * Jaffa thinks the N810 is one of the best mobile devices he's ever owned (modulo Psion Series 5mx)
Dec 17 11:24:40 <Rocketman> I am a big fan of the HPC form factor of the old school win ce devices and the psions
Dec 17 11:24:52 <Rocketman> owned a lot over the years
Dec 17 11:25:10 <Rocketman> as well as ultra-compact full windows devices
Dec 17 11:25:19 <Rocketman> owned two librettos
Dec 17 11:32:49 <gm> is there a way to not mount the SD cards as noexec on the n800 under os2008?
Dec 17 11:35:05 <carbonfreeze> gm: seems like os2008 ignores fstab changes on boot.. I was having issues changing mount points, and the two may be related. see bug#2575
Dec 17 11:35:32 <gm> yeah
Dec 17 11:35:33 <gm> thanks
Dec 17 11:36:41 <gm> might just do a startup script to do "mount -o remount,exec /dev/mmc1"
Dec 17 11:37:53 <carbonfreeze> gm: yeah, but it shouldn't ignore fstab.
Dec 17 11:40:07 <gm> hmm, even after mounting it as as exec, it still won't run
Dec 17 11:40:19 <gm> -sh: ./configure: Permission denied
Dec 17 11:40:34 <gm> even after a chmod +x configure
Dec 17 11:40:37 <carbonfreeze> hmm
Dec 17 11:41:38 <carbonfreeze> permissions on files are ok? you can write?
Dec 17 11:41:44 <gm> yeah
Dec 17 11:41:50 <gm> it's just a dir on the memory card
Dec 17 11:41:51 <carbonfreeze> maybe your user doesnt have permission to write to the dir?
Dec 17 11:42:01 <gm> i extracted it from the tarball
Dec 17 11:42:20 <gm> i do have write permissions
Dec 17 11:42:53 <tontsa> anyone happen to have vncviewer packaged for chinook?
Dec 17 11:43:22 <Rocketman> there is one up at garage, tontsa
Dec 17 11:43:34 <gm> tontsa: https://garage.maemo.org/forum/forum.php?forum_id=1948
Dec 17 11:44:06 <tontsa> i have the garage repo in application manager, odd that it doesn't find it
Dec 17 11:45:00 <carbonfreeze> app manager for these devices drives me nutes. should be a setting to show all packages, not some red-pill repo
Dec 17 11:46:17 <Rocketman> I think it is considered beta quality, tontsa, so they just have a .deb for it
Dec 17 11:46:30 <Rocketman> works fine for me though
Dec 17 11:46:46 <gm> hmmm, there is /usr/sbin/mmc-mount
Dec 17 11:46:53 <gm> that has noexec in it
Dec 17 11:47:37 <tontsa> i just hate this bluetooth+packet data. for some reason n810 just disconnects sometimes and doesn't realize it. then only way to get back is disable bluetooth and enable it again
Dec 17 11:47:37 <gm> dmask? hmmm
Dec 17 11:50:18 <gm> carbonfreeze: /usr/sbin/mmc-mount appears to override noexec
Dec 17 11:50:33 <gm> that might be why fstab is ignoring it
Dec 17 11:50:41 <carbonfreeze> gm: ahh, lemmie take a look
Dec 17 11:51:06 <gm> hmm, my cards won't mount
Dec 17 11:51:55 <tontsa> gm, thanks. works surprisingly good
Dec 17 11:52:22 <gm> or was that because i changed dmask
Dec 17 11:58:04 <gm> fmask 0133 might have something to do with it
Dec 17 12:00:38 <gm> ahh, there we go... ish
Dec 17 12:01:09 <gm> wait, that failure was unrelated
Dec 17 12:01:39 <gm> carbonfreeze: you will also need to change fmask in that file if you want to be able to exec
Dec 17 12:59:42 <Fang64> I wondor why I'm having trouble with the ncurses-bin on the n800 and only a few had the same issues I wondor if this has anything to do with me jumping the gun and flashing up to OS2008 then back down to OS2007
Dec 17 13:00:11 <gm> shouldn't be - reflashing wipes everything
Dec 17 13:00:27 <Fang64> That's what I thought
Dec 17 13:01:09 <Fang64> I've been trying different ways to get the package to install correctly seems to be busybox and ncurses-bin not behaving
Dec 17 13:02:12 <Fang64> "/bin/usr/clear" is the the file ncurses-bin attempts to overwrite in one version of the package it fails and just doesn't install it, the maemo-hacker repo leaves a entry guess a bad package
Dec 17 13:02:36 <Fang64> the only problem I'm having is I've search the directory and only found busybox.clear
Dec 17 13:02:43 <Fang64> which i guess causes the issue
Dec 17 13:03:05 <Fang64> not really sure about the whole thing I'm just curious why the package is broken
Dec 17 13:04:14 <Fang64> tontsa recommended just installing it manually by extracting out the package which I'll probably end up doing at this rate
Dec 17 13:05:34 <fnordianslip> i installed some other ncurses packages and clear was installed in /usr/bin
Dec 17 13:05:55 <Fang64> uhm
Dec 17 13:06:05 <Fang64> on OS2007?
Dec 17 13:06:35 <fnordianslip> er, no. 2008. sorry, not paying attention.
Dec 17 13:06:48 <tontsa> yeah the os2008 ncurses package works just fine
Dec 17 13:06:58 <Fang64> lol, it's fine I've been a bit confused why this isn't working right
Dec 17 13:07:33 <tontsa> maybe the beta-2008 differs from the n810's 2008
Dec 17 13:08:00 <Fang64> well I didnt flash to the beta 2008
Dec 17 13:08:02 <Fang64> that's the thing
Dec 17 13:08:19 <Fang64> I kind of jumped the gun and grabbed the N810 OS2008 and flashed mine to it
Dec 17 13:08:54 <Fang64> I got it installed and running then downgraded after looking at the repos and seeing a lack of applications
Dec 17 13:09:55 <Fang64> I was running 42-18 which is probably not supported I take it
Dec 17 13:10:13 <halley> The N810 image is not going to work properly on an N800.
Dec 17 13:10:22 <Fang64> I know this
Dec 17 13:10:36 <Fang64> but I was dabbling around with it when i first got it
Dec 17 13:11:09 <Fang64> anyhow i don't imagine that causing the issue I'm having now
Dec 17 13:13:19 <Fang64> back to the drawing board then
Dec 17 13:18:05 <Tak> morning pupnik
Dec 17 13:18:27 <pupnik> hi
Dec 17 13:19:38 <Tak> any emu news?
Dec 17 13:20:29 <dpb_> emo news?
Dec 17 13:20:43 * Tak stabs dpb_ 
Dec 17 13:20:48 * dpb_ dies
Dec 17 13:20:48 <pupnik> no just offtopic stuff in my life
Dec 17 13:21:07 <pupnik> death and taxes, literally
Dec 17 13:21:12 <Tak> :-/
Dec 17 13:22:38 <Rocketman> sorry to hear that pupnik
Dec 17 13:23:13 <keesj> I am typing this on a "old" ibm thinkpad 560 with 40 mb ram(runnig puppy linux). it realy makes me wonder how much more I will use the keyboard enabled 810 as opposed to th n800
Dec 17 13:23:51 <keesj> anybody already running elinks/screen/ssh as main gui?
Dec 17 13:24:04 <Rocketman> The problem is that it isn't a very good keyboard keesj
Dec 17 13:24:45 <Rocketman> I'm still bringing my BT keyboard around with me
Dec 17 13:25:07 <keesj> Rocketman: am sorry to hear that!
Dec 17 13:25:39 <keesj> I was also thinking of an eeepc, it is getting hard to choose these days
Dec 17 13:25:54 <Rocketman> I honestly might go back to my n800
Dec 17 13:26:19 <keesj> GPS is not the killer attribute?
Dec 17 13:26:24 <pupnik> how does the thumby keyboard suck?
Dec 17 13:26:27 <wumpus> what's wrong with the n810, when just not using the keyboard?
Dec 17 13:26:48 <Rocketman> The GPS is really bad, keesj
Dec 17 13:27:01 <Rocketman> very sub-par performance
Dec 17 13:27:14 <Rocketman> pupnik:
Dec 17 13:27:38 <Rocketman> top row of keys too close to screen for easy typing
Dec 17 13:27:46 <keesj> Well you don't really sound like a happy customer :p
Dec 17 13:28:09 <Rocketman> keys themselves not raises/convex enough
Dec 17 13:28:22 <Rocketman> missing several important keys
Dec 17 13:28:36 <Rocketman> many others on second function
Dec 17 13:29:05 <keesj> hmm, I don't use a bt keyboard becase I want to "internet" on the go (in bed or in front of th tv)
Dec 17 13:29:12 <pupnik> all i see are a lot of gaming buttons :)
Dec 17 13:29:13 <Rocketman> no press and hold for second function as is standard on almost all sliders
Dec 17 13:29:17 <sp3000> "on the go, in bed"
Dec 17 13:29:35 <keesj> sorry on th move in bed
Dec 17 13:29:51 <Rocketman> d-pad center button oversized and 4 way hard to press
Dec 17 13:30:01 <pupnik> i hope you don't use the tablet 'on the move in bed' :)
Dec 17 13:30:35 <Rocketman> with "up" button too close to screen edge as well
Dec 17 13:30:38 <pupnik> yeah that dpad made me shed a tear or too
Dec 17 13:30:51 <keesj> pupnik: no , poor video recording quality
Dec 17 13:31:11 <pupnik> lol
Dec 17 13:31:34 <pupnik> well thoughtfix was typing real fast on it in his demo vid
Dec 17 13:31:40 <Rocketman> All in all, it is an extremely poorly executed slider keyboard
Dec 17 13:32:02 <pupnik> ah, i'll probably be a schlub who is happy with it based on nothing to compare it to
Dec 17 13:33:12 <Rocketman> that combined with the sub-par gps, loss of full size sdhc cards, etc will probably drive me back to n800 once OS 2008 is released
Dec 17 13:33:48 <Rocketman> Pupnik, I have tried out four sliders at length and this is worst of the bunch
Dec 17 13:33:55 <Rocketman> terrible ergonomics
Dec 17 13:34:00 <keesj> I must say that the last two projects I started where video driven.(gst-motion-control/and a video game)
Dec 17 13:34:07 <Rocketman> someone needs to be fired
Dec 17 13:34:38 <pupnik> well that's constructive negative feedback
Dec 17 13:35:10 <Rocketman> I grumble a lot, but I have specific bones to pick
Dec 17 13:35:36 <Rocketman> :)
Dec 17 13:35:43 <pupnik> so you'd have preferred maybe 1-2 millimeter more thickness to accomodate a thicker keyboard?
Dec 17 13:36:36 <Rocketman> The screen needs to have slid up more, as the top row is extremely hard to press
Dec 17 13:36:53 <pupnik> yeah that seems pretty clear.  wonder why that wasn't possible
Dec 17 13:36:53 <sp3000> or you could borrow my thumbs
Dec 17 13:37:15 <Rocketman> they don't even need bigger keys necessarily, but the tops of them need to be more curved
Dec 17 13:37:16 * sp3000 would like some friction guidance on the caps though
Dec 17 13:38:19 <Rocketman> I just don't think they paid enough attention to ergonomics in general
Dec 17 13:38:56 <Rocketman> At least they fixed the full screen and +/- buttons
Dec 17 13:39:54 <Rocketman> The 800 was a step down from the 770 as an ebook reader because of the conjoined top keys
Dec 17 13:41:50 <pupnik> what slider keyboard did you like?
Dec 17 13:42:00 <fysa> nokia has their priorities completely wrong.  they have marketing design the product, and the people that actually use it get to put up with their decisions.
Dec 17 13:43:11 <pupnik> if only marketing designed it, would it run linux? :)
Dec 17 13:43:16 <Rocketman> I agree, fysa, I feel too much goes into adding another bullet point for marketing and not enough into useability and customer feedback
Dec 17 13:43:38 <Rocketman> I took their customer surveys twice
Dec 17 13:43:41 <keesj> customer feed-back was really "we need a keyboard" and now we hav it
Dec 17 13:43:51 <pupnik> yep
Dec 17 13:43:52 <Rocketman> and the questions were always aweful
Dec 17 13:44:03 <fysa> all they needed was to listen to a single developer there.
Dec 17 13:44:05 <pupnik> and Rocketman is claiming to know of products with far superior slider keyboards
Dec 17 13:44:10 <pupnik> i'd be curious what those products are
Dec 17 13:44:24 <fysa> I've heard bad things about that keyboard from Nokia folk.
Dec 17 13:45:08 <Rocketman> stuff on the order of how important is color to you when choosing a lifestyle device
Dec 17 13:45:23 <fysa> marketing focus group bullshit
Dec 17 13:45:27 <Rocketman> OQO model 2 keyboard not bad
Dec 17 13:45:47 <Khertan> Rocketman > it's not the same sized device
Dec 17 13:45:49 <Khertan> !
Dec 17 13:45:50 <fysa> I love Maemo.
Dec 17 13:45:56 <keesj> I am not trying to say the keyboard is good(I don't have it). But I think that they do listen to the demand(perhaps a bit late, and therefore in device iterations......)
Dec 17 13:45:57 <fysa> The hardware needs some more love though.
Dec 17 13:46:17 <fysa> they listened as far as 'we need a keyboard' -- but they didn't bother to test it properly.  they half-assed it.
Dec 17 13:46:29 <nomis> The Psion 3* series keyboard was pretty usable.
Dec 17 13:46:41 <Rocketman> latest HTC sliders are much improved over first gen
Dec 17 13:46:41 <fysa> shows lack of leadership somewhere
Dec 17 13:46:57 <pupnik> when i look at that, i see a lot of my life
Dec 17 13:47:02 <pupnik> http://surreality.info/up/success_large.jpg   an old graphic about the long road to success, and the pitfalls
Dec 17 13:47:07 <n800user> people want what they can't have.. like a practical keyboard at such a small size
Dec 17 13:47:14 <fysa> no, not practical -- just not idiotic
Dec 17 13:47:38 <fysa> if they a test to an internal developer and asked for feedback, the keys would not be that close to the upper case.
Dec 17 13:47:49 <Rocketman> n800user, they could have done much better in the same dimensions
Dec 17 13:47:50 <fysa> and they would have a bit more curve.
Dec 17 13:47:53 <n800user> why not use a bt or onscreen keyboard?
Dec 17 13:47:57 <fysa> for fucks sake
Dec 17 13:48:00 <fysa> this is the n810
Dec 17 13:48:07 <fysa> the entire purpose was to get the slide-out :)
Dec 17 13:48:23 <fysa> slide-out is a beautiful idea because it gets you extra screen real-estate
Dec 17 13:48:29 <fysa> you get to type and see what you're doing
Dec 17 13:48:42 <keesj> n800user: no no no. I want a working solution. I am ready to even learn a new keyboard type or whatever is required, but it must b a workable solution.
Dec 17 13:49:06 <fysa> I'm not giving Nokia a pass for making 'effort'
Dec 17 13:49:11 <fysa> this is 2007.
Dec 17 13:49:15 <Rocketman> your average treo or blackberry is more thumb typeable
Dec 17 13:49:26 <n800user> Rocketman, Yeah, they could've done a better job.
Dec 17 13:49:49 <keesj> Rocketman: I agree
Dec 17 13:50:02 <n800user> keesj, a working keyboard that's integrated into the NIT?
Dec 17 13:50:14 <fysa> the n810 looks gorgeous at least. :)
Dec 17 13:50:52 <keesj> NIT? I can ready for surgery/ learing a weird 5 key keyboard,
Dec 17 13:51:16 <Rocketman> I am a form follows function kinda guy
Dec 17 13:51:37 <fysa> but I will be waiting for the "n900:
Dec 17 13:51:41 <fysa> "
Dec 17 13:51:48 <Rocketman> My devices are tools, not freaking fashion accesories
Dec 17 13:52:11 <keesj> fysa: why wait, while you can already have fun right now
Dec 17 13:52:27 <fysa> have a n800
Dec 17 13:52:31 <fysa> and a bt keyboard..
Dec 17 13:52:56 <fysa> having plenty of fun, but if I spend money on a device in this class right now, it honestly would probably be an EEE.
Dec 17 13:53:03 <n800user> I like my n800 and bt keyboard & gps
Dec 17 13:53:07 <fysa> just to use in different occasions
Dec 17 13:53:10 <pupnik> diffrent class imo
Dec 17 13:53:19 <fysa> EEE is something that could hang out in my glove box
Dec 17 13:53:21 <n800user> both perform better then the built in
Dec 17 13:53:22 <nomis> fysa: the EEE is IMHO not that sexy.
Dec 17 13:53:29 <fysa> not looking for sexy ;)
Dec 17 13:53:44 <fysa> I work at the computer all day and always on call some way or another..
Dec 17 13:53:46 <fysa> I want freedom
Dec 17 13:53:52 <keesj> I used an eee for 5 minutes and I lovd it
Dec 17 13:54:12 <n800user> ditto.. Longer battery life and possible use as a phone would be my two biggest requests
Dec 17 13:54:17 <fysa> N800 is something that can go with me anywhere, EEE is something I could take somewhere when I want to work out of the house
Dec 17 13:54:18 <pupnik> the nokia 770 cured me of my psion mourning
Dec 17 13:54:30 <Rocketman> I am considering a Fujitsu U810
Dec 17 13:54:33 <fysa> (or on the plane)
Dec 17 13:54:34 <keesj> still , I was complaining about they keyboard that was to small for real vi sesisons
Dec 17 13:54:45 <fysa> yeah, for the EEE?
Dec 17 13:55:06 <nomis> fysa: The EEE unfortunately is Intel-based and sucks up a lot of enrgy.
Dec 17 13:55:22 <fysa> I hate to push it again, but the Apple Wireless keyboard is the smallest usable keyboard I've ever tried.
Dec 17 13:55:41 <nomis> fysa: Also the Keyboard can at best used with a two-finger system.
Dec 17 13:55:44 <n800user> ooo.. it's kind of cool
Dec 17 13:55:47 <keesj> eee = more speed , better keyboard , better sound , more memory ......
Dec 17 13:56:06 <wumpus> but very bad battery time
Dec 17 13:56:08 <fysa> full size keys with excellent spacing.  it looks like a laptop keyboard, is way lighter than the batteries it takes, and feels nearly as good as my old IBM clicky
Dec 17 13:56:08 <Rocketman> I found the Librettos and Journadas quite touch-typeable
Dec 17 13:56:24 <fysa> you can get 2GB into it now
Dec 17 13:56:30 <nomis> fysa: yeah, the apple KB looks great.
Dec 17 13:56:40 <n800user> fysa, I like the apple keyboard too, but have you tried the stowaway? it's not too bad either
Dec 17 13:56:47 <nomis> (does the wireless one also have this caps-lock-hack?
Dec 17 13:56:58 <fysa> if they extended the EEE screen all the way left/right and ditched the speakers (or put them underneath/elsewhere somehow), I would be happy.
Dec 17 13:57:00 <keesj> wumpus: my n800 with gmail loaded does not survie a morning, and if by chance I don't plug it in at night it wakes me up!
Dec 17 13:57:11 <fysa> I really want 1024x480 or so
Dec 17 13:58:15 <n800user> I loved my libretto. it took a bit of an adjustment to the keyboard but I think they're going for different ways of interacting
Dec 17 13:58:17 <keesj> I guess the real question is what do you use you n800 for?
Dec 17 13:58:34 <fysa> I'm trying to shoehorn my life/work into it ;)
Dec 17 13:58:57 <Rocketman> pupnik, checkout the keyboard on the toshiba portege g900
Dec 17 13:59:06 <n800user> n8x0 shouldn't really be a minicomputer... it should just be a mobile device that works with the internet.
Dec 17 13:59:08 <fysa> caps-lock-hack?
Dec 17 13:59:14 <fysa> I don't know -- I remap caps lock to CTL
Dec 17 13:59:18 <n800user> I'm using mine for the radio atm
Dec 17 13:59:34 <nomis> fysa: then the apple wireless might bite you: http://docs.info.apple.com/article.html?artnum=306811
Dec 17 13:59:36 <fysa> that's my only complaint with this keyboard -- it seems to register caps lock more slowly and doesn't work as CTRL so well.
Dec 17 13:59:49 <nomis> ah, it bit you already  :)
Dec 17 13:59:51 <n800user> messaging, VoIP, maemo mapper
Dec 17 14:00:08 <fysa> heh
Dec 17 14:00:10 <n800user> watching movies etc
Dec 17 14:00:44 <keesj> n800user: OTG?
Dec 17 14:01:07 <pupnik> Rocketman: the top row is flush against the case
Dec 17 14:01:07 <n800user> and browsing the net from the couch when I'm too lazy to go to the computer or when I'm annoyed of the fans on my computers
Dec 17 14:01:19 <keesj> you have some free traffic gprs phone?
Dec 17 14:01:31 <fysa> get the most use of the n800 in the bathroom ;)
Dec 17 14:01:38 <n800user> keesj, only maemomapper and watching movies OTG
Dec 17 14:01:48 <n800user> I also have a iphone so I use that when away from wifi
Dec 17 14:01:54 <keesj> fysa: how is that?
Dec 17 14:02:03 <Rocketman> I was referring to the way the keys bulge
Dec 17 14:02:14 <Rocketman> to make the easy to press
Dec 17 14:02:16 <keesj> shave app or do you have kids like m?
Dec 17 14:02:17 <n800user> lol.. yeah, in the bathroom too, I played alot of sudoku
Dec 17 14:02:18 <fysa> stopped magazine subscriptions, everything is here ;)
Dec 17 14:03:49 <keesj> what I really use are "radio" wikipedia(when walking the dog, one article already downloaded) and with it2008 pdf sheets because the pdf reader really is gettint to a very usable state
Dec 17 14:04:21 <keesj> on it2007 i love to watch natali del conte?
Dec 17 14:05:20 <n800user> oh yeah, that was the video center wasn't it?
Dec 17 14:05:45 <keesj> your technology news upload
Dec 17 14:06:40 <pupnik> yeah that seems obvious, having a bulge
Dec 17 14:06:53 <keesj> I hope some day I will be able to use it as video phone
Dec 17 14:07:03 <n800user> Does anyone really like the new icons?  I was hoping for something with color
Dec 17 14:07:14 <n800user> gizmo?
Dec 17 14:08:03 <n800user> I think it can do SIP w/ h.323
Dec 17 14:08:04 <keesj> no, gizmo video does not work under linux and my parent's cant install it
Dec 17 14:10:27 <keesj> but the maemo platform gave me my current job. And I love to see the evolution of the devices. it is also funny that when the n800 came out everybody wanted a cover
Dec 17 14:10:28 <n800user> Ah.. any idea if wine could run gizmo?
Dec 17 14:10:52 <n800user> lol.. a cover is still a nice idea
Dec 17 14:11:17 <keesj> the 810 has a on/off button right?
Dec 17 14:11:34 <n800user> dunno, only have a n800
Dec 17 14:12:11 <inz> keesj, N810 has a power key similar to that of N800 and 770
Dec 17 14:13:21 <keesj> thanks
Dec 17 14:15:26 <Rocketman> anyways....and now to bed
Dec 17 14:15:30 <keesj> inz was it you who started a translusive keyboard for the xterm?
Dec 17 14:15:46 <keesj> 0x2bed
Dec 17 14:21:10 <inz> keesj, I was concidering it, but never started implementing
Dec 17 14:21:45 <keesj> I hav played with it at some point, so It must b somebody else :p
Dec 17 14:28:47 <Tak> keesj: there's the one I made using rubygame ;-)
Dec 17 14:30:57 <keesj> no it was a hack in the xterm "vte" lib or something, the keyboard was movable
Dec 17 14:32:09 <Khertan> Does someone has already built python binding for gtksourceview ?
Dec 17 14:32:33 <Tak> I can't imagine that there wouldn't be one
Dec 17 14:32:47 <Tak> btw, what would be the advantage of moving to sbox2?
Dec 17 14:34:15 <Khertan> sbox2 ?
Dec 17 14:36:20 <Khertan> Hi alterego !
Dec 17 14:36:31 <alterego> Aloha
Dec 17 14:38:01 * Tak indicates the topic
Dec 17 14:38:09 <keesj> it was jtra
Dec 17 14:38:31 <alterego> ooo .. What's that then? :D
Dec 17 14:39:16 <alterego> What about sbox2 with maemo4 ? Surely that's more appropriate ^_^
Dec 17 14:39:32 <inz> Tak, sbox2 is supposed to be thinner, cleaner (and faster?)
Dec 17 14:39:51 <Tak> can't go wrong with thinner, cleaner, and faster(?)
Dec 17 14:40:18 * Tak stabs desmume packagers for unnecessary quilt dep
Dec 17 14:40:35 <keesj> jtra.cz !!!
Dec 17 14:40:55 <lopz> hi
Dec 17 14:42:02 <alterego> Well, now I finally appear to have set up my system properly I can install scratchbox into a 32bit KVM :)
Dec 17 14:44:18 <alterego> Which I think I'll do now ..
Dec 17 14:47:33 <pupnik> Tak it's built here
Dec 17 14:47:39 <pupnik> if i can help let me know
Dec 17 14:48:03 <pupnik> oh wait, did I lie?
Dec 17 14:48:06 <Tak> pupnik: how much hacking did you have to do to build it?
Dec 17 14:48:48 <Tak> it looks like their "I don't have gtkglext" fallback doesn't compile :-/
Dec 17 14:49:20 <L0cutus> hum
Dec 17 14:49:20 <pupnik> i don't remember anything
Dec 17 14:49:21 <Khertan> alterego> do u successfully compile gedit last time ?
Dec 17 14:49:26 <pupnik> shall i tgz it to you?
Dec 17 14:49:32 <L0cutus> there are some problem with bluez-utils
Dec 17 14:49:37 <pupnik> then you can diff whatever you want
Dec 17 14:49:55 <pupnik> desmume-cli is built
Dec 17 14:49:59 <pupnik> i have no notes
Dec 17 14:50:30 <Tak> pupnik: sure - email probably best
Dec 17 14:50:31 <alterego> Khertan, I was making progress. Haven't finished it yet though.
Dec 17 14:50:45 <alterego> Khertan, my system died, so I've spent the last 4 days building and installing a new one.
Dec 17 14:51:28 <alterego> building, installing, reinstalling, reinstalling, reinstalling ... Until today :)
Dec 17 14:52:21 <alterego> Ideally, I'd prefer to use Debian over Ubuntu. Unfortunately there's something very off with the display drivers in Debian that appear to be patched properly in Ubuntu.
Dec 17 14:52:58 <Tak> moo?  what display drivers?
Dec 17 14:53:05 <alterego> The intel drivers.
Dec 17 14:53:32 <Tak> hmm - seems to be ok here; maybe I have a lucky chipset ;-)
Dec 17 14:53:55 <alterego> Tak, the problem seems to affect all from i810 up :)
Dec 17 14:54:22 <alterego> Mine was a bit more severe than others though. X wouldn't shut down. It just hung my system.
Dec 17 14:54:39 <Tak> hmm - are we talking about etch?
Dec 17 14:54:44 <alterego> Yes
Dec 17 14:55:02 <alterego> I even pulled X from testing and unstable but they both suffered the same fault :(
Dec 17 14:55:43 <alterego> It's a shame, because the debian gnome desktop _feels_ so much more stable and solid than the Ubuntu gnome desktop :/
Dec 17 14:56:15 <Tak> ah - I'm running unstable, and it works ok here
Dec 17 14:56:32 <alterego> Thankfully, I appear to have ironed out the issues I had with Ubuntu/gnome/compiz so it feels a bit more solid.
Dec 17 14:57:10 <Tak> huzzah!
Dec 17 14:57:17 * Tak wobbles some windows in celebration
Dec 17 14:57:21 <alterego> :)
Dec 17 14:57:27 <alterego> I don't like the window wobbling :P
Dec 17 14:57:58 <alterego> I'm trying to find the option that stops windows going off the edge of virtual desktops. But to no avail.
Dec 17 14:58:14 <Tak> I do; it gives the windows a more solid feel, which makes it easier to arrange them IMO
Dec 17 14:58:37 <alterego> Hah, wobbly windows feel more solid to you? :D
Dec 17 14:59:03 <Tak> heh - I mean, they feel like they have mass
Dec 17 14:59:10 <alterego> Ah
Dec 17 14:59:25 <Tak> gnome-compiz-manager might give you more configuration options
Dec 17 14:59:31 <alterego> Actually, they do seem to snap a bit better around the edges.
Dec 17 14:59:40 <alterego> That was one of my problems with ubuntu compiz before.
Dec 17 14:59:48 <alterego> Yeah, I've been using that.
Dec 17 15:00:14 <alterego> I like the "shiver" effect on dialogs :D
Dec 17 15:03:30 <alterego> It's nice sticking scratchbox/maemo SDK in it's own KVM though.
Dec 17 15:17:58 <Khertan> pffffff stupid scratchbox !
Dec 17 15:18:01 <Khertan> oups ... ww
Dec 17 15:22:42 <Khertan_VM> sourceview is available on os2008 ?
Dec 17 15:25:29 <alterego> Khertan, nope.
Dec 17 15:25:40 <alterego> Though I'm having to package it. So it will be ;)
Dec 17 15:25:51 <Khertan_VM> arg i think i t was available ...
Dec 17 15:26:02 <Khertan_VM>  /s/i t/it
Dec 17 15:26:32 <Khertan_VM> could u make python binding with it ? :-)
Dec 17 15:28:30 <Khertan_VM> the last version is the 1.6 right ?
Dec 17 15:36:13 <alterego> Can't you?
Dec 17 15:36:20 <alterego> You know I don't do Python :P
Dec 17 15:36:28 <Khertan_VM> i ll :-)
Dec 17 15:36:44 <Khertan_VM> i just need the lib and dev :)
Dec 17 15:36:48 <alterego> Hell, the python binding should already exist. It just needs to be compiled. It should be part of the pygnome/gtk stuff
Dec 17 15:37:33 <Khertan_VM> it s exist already, but i m compiling gtksourceview now
Dec 17 15:38:06 <alterego> Ah
Dec 17 15:38:52 <Khertan_VM> E: Couldn't find package gtk-doc
Dec 17 15:39:01 <Khertan_VM> grrrr ... no make dist ...
Dec 17 15:40:25 <Khertan_VM> No package 'gtksourceview-2.0' found
Dec 17 15:40:37 <Khertan_VM> seem s a make install isn t enought
Dec 17 15:41:50 <Khertan_VM> maybe i should try with debian source package
Dec 17 15:42:52 <alterego> That's a very good idea ;)
Dec 17 15:42:58 <alterego> But you'll still need gtk-doc
Dec 17 15:43:03 <alterego> Which is actually installed as a devkit.
Dec 17 15:43:15 <Khertan_VM> arg ... it s still 1.8.5 on debian
Dec 17 15:43:17 <Khertan_VM> grrrr
Dec 17 15:43:30 <alterego> Use unstable or testing
Dec 17 15:43:37 <Khertan_VM> gtk-doc ? so i should have it
Dec 17 15:44:12 <alterego> Yeah, I think you need to add the devkit (doctools) and add the pkg-config path of the devkit into your PKG_CONFIG_PATH variable.
Dec 17 15:44:23 <alterego> Most of those labels are probably wrong by-the-way.
Dec 17 15:44:25 <jigo> is there an easy way of autoloading a gui application when the device starts up? I tried adding entries in the /etc/rc*d. but it didn't load automatically
Dec 17 15:44:53 <Khertan_VM> uh ? the wmware is a feisty and not a debian
Dec 17 15:45:24 <Khertan_VM> s/wmware/vmware image
Dec 17 15:46:43 <rene4jazz> hi all, I tried to intall nfs-common package  on OS 2007 HE for my n770 and because of dependencies it uninstalled osso-core, osso-connectui, etc
Dec 17 15:47:50 <rene4jazz> now I re-flashed the OS to be capabable of networking again
Dec 17 15:55:10 <Jaffa> Going back to earlier: my Eee's very cool, and I love having it (easier to watch videos on with wife than on N810); but it's just not as *fun* as an N810. It's just a small, cheap, laptop.
Dec 17 15:55:52 <pupnik> Jaffa: yeah- in that category it's a good thing of course
Dec 17 15:55:58 <pupnik> as prior subnotebooks were very pricey
Dec 17 15:56:50 <Jaffa> Exactly.
Dec 17 15:56:57 <Khertan_VM>  apt-get source gtksourceview2
Dec 17 15:57:01 <Khertan_VM> oups ww
Dec 17 15:58:40 <zoran> Jaffa, do you have vanilla xandros or something else on eee?
Dec 17 15:58:52 <alterego> You really call the eee pc a sub notebook?
Dec 17 15:58:58 <alterego> I'd have thought it's the perfect notebook size.
Dec 17 15:59:03 <alterego> But yes, it's cheap :)
Dec 17 15:59:49 <zoran> doesn't look in the same category as 770/800/810
Dec 17 16:01:56 <Khertan_VM> s/wmware/vmware image/scratchbox/tools/bin/sh: line 1: debian/control: Permission denied
Dec 17 16:01:59 <Khertan_VM> make: *** [clean] Error 1
Dec 17 16:02:05 <Khertan_VM> yeah /
Dec 17 16:02:21 <Khertan_VM> i like that /
Dec 17 16:02:29 <zoran> Permission denied
Dec 17 16:03:28 <Khertan_VM> yes ...but i m root
Dec 17 16:03:33 <Khertan_VM> :)
Dec 17 16:03:57 <zoran> linux or bsd?
Dec 17 16:04:18 <Khertan_VM> linux :)
Dec 17 16:04:29 <zoran> so, no security levels?
Dec 17 16:04:33 <Khertan_VM> maemo scratchbox
Dec 17 16:04:34 <dragorn> Khertan: looks like it's trying to execute debian/control?
Dec 17 16:04:44 <zoran> maybe the wrong prompt
Dec 17 16:04:54 <dragorn> or you're not running the pkg build under fakeroot
Dec 17 16:04:58 <Khertan_VM> it s seem that it try to execute control
Dec 17 16:05:15 <Khertan_VM> dragorn: i ve running it with fakeroot
Dec 17 16:06:46 <zoran> Jaffa didn't answer, but there is custom debian distro for eee
Dec 17 16:09:07 <Khertan_VM> pffff and it s source from a gutsy packet
Dec 17 16:09:12 <dpb_> Khertan_VM: you're not root inside scratchbox
Dec 17 16:09:15 <keesj> would the whole qemu/sbox run on eee?
Dec 17 16:09:47 <zoran> probably yes, but is is a small flash ram
Dec 17 16:10:00 <Khertan_VM> still so boring to compile existing source providing from the gnu community
Dec 17 16:10:15 <Khertan_VM> dpb_: you can :)
Dec 17 16:10:20 <Khertan_VM> i ve try both
Dec 17 16:10:50 <dpb_> you can? I thought you couldn't login as root..
Dec 17 16:11:44 <dpb_> Yeah, you can't. The login script checks for root and doesn't allow root to login.
Dec 17 16:12:39 <timeless> dpb: you can log into root
Dec 17 16:13:03 <timeless> oh, in scratchbox
Dec 17 16:13:09 <timeless> yuck, who uses scratchbox? P:)
Dec 17 16:13:18 <Tak> hah
Dec 17 16:13:23 <dpb_> Yeah. :)
Dec 17 16:13:31 <Khertan_VM> fakeroot sh give you root no ?
Dec 17 16:13:45 <dpb_> no, that's just a FAKE root.
Dec 17 16:13:57 <Khertan_VM> :) oups ... true
Dec 17 16:14:04 <Khertan_VM> just verified
Dec 17 16:14:37 <Khertan_VM> so ... the problem is mainly that the rule debian package try to execute debian/control
Dec 17 16:15:49 <dpb_> what does 'ls -l debian/control' say?
Dec 17 16:18:18 <Khertan_VM> -rwxrwxrwx  1 root root 3072 Dec 17 11:29 debian/control
Dec 17 16:19:15 <dpb_> that surely doesn't look right
Dec 17 16:19:29 <Khertan_VM> yes
Dec 17 16:19:37 <dpb_> are you still running sh with fakeroot?
Dec 17 16:19:43 <Khertan_VM> no
Dec 17 16:21:09 <dpb_> did you get/unpack those sources as root outside of scratchbox?
Dec 17 16:21:15 <timeless> is this from a debian sourceball? :)
Dec 17 16:21:46 <timeless> did you do: fakeroot apt-get source? :)
Dec 17 16:21:47 <Khertan_VM> it s from a ubuntu sourceball
Dec 17 16:22:12 <Khertan_VM> i m getting the debian package ...
Dec 17 16:22:15 <timeless> although really, the root bit would only have happened if you either really were root when you did it
Dec 17 16:22:28 <timeless> or are really confused now :)
Dec 17 16:22:39 <dpb_> yeah :)
Dec 17 16:22:50 <timeless> because only root can actually create or make files with owner/group root
Dec 17 16:23:33 <Khertan_VM> timeless: yes ... i get using it with sudo apt-get source ... but i should be able to compile it with fakeroot
Dec 17 16:23:46 <Khertan_VM> and i shouldn t be 777 for all file
Dec 17 16:23:55 <Khertan_VM> s/i/it s
Dec 17 16:24:29 <dpb_> uh, no no
Dec 17 16:24:43 <dpb_> apt-get source doesn't need root, run it without sudo
Dec 17 16:24:53 <dpb_> so the permissions will be right
Dec 17 16:26:17 <timeless> yeah, sudo apt-get source was your problem
Dec 17 16:26:24 <timeless> "don't do that"
Dec 17 16:26:29 <Khertan_VM> maybe :)
Dec 17 16:27:10 <Khertan_VM> samething ... with the ubuntu package
Dec 17 16:27:19 <timeless> "don't do that"
Dec 17 16:27:23 <Khertan_VM> seems to work with the debian one
Dec 17 16:28:42 <Khertan_VM> don't do that ? using ubuntu package yes i know .... :)
Dec 17 16:29:12 <timeless> don't do: sudo apt-get source
Dec 17 16:29:19 <timeless> sudo should be used for installing, not getting sources
Dec 17 16:29:26 <Khertan_VM> right
Dec 17 16:32:23 <Khertan_VM> there is news about discount code ? i ve try the 15th but don t see news
Dec 17 16:32:26 <Andy80> hi all
Dec 17 16:32:35 <Khertan_VM> hi alone :)
Dec 17 16:35:25 <pupnik> 5 days Khertan_VM
Dec 17 16:35:36 <dpb_> Khertan_VM: http://flors.wordpress.com/2007/12/15/the-n810-codes-for-maemo-contributors-next-week/
Dec 17 16:36:29 <Khertan_VM> thx for the link
Dec 17 16:36:51 <Khertan_VM> gtksourceview compiled :)
Dec 17 16:37:13 <|R> 5 days?
Dec 17 16:38:50 <Khertan_VM> i mainly see that : I’m still reluctant to give any exact day
Dec 17 16:39:10 * |R puts 2¢ on the 19th :P
Dec 17 16:40:42 <Andy80> 19 is the last day here (italy) to have it delivered before 25th :P
Dec 17 16:42:25 <|R> Considering that Canada just got added, i thought i wouldn't be able to get it before february, so that's good enough for me :D
Dec 17 16:42:29 <zopodo> can i have skype running while in stanby mode and then have the nokia n800 load up and ring when someone is giving me a skype call?
Dec 17 16:43:19 <X-Fade_> |R: Can't be as bad as NL: http://shop.nokia.nl/ ;)
Dec 17 16:43:33 <X-Fade_> The shop isn't even open to the public ;)
Dec 17 16:43:36 <|R> haha indeed :)
Dec 17 16:43:43 <Khertan_VM> lol
Dec 17 16:44:14 <Khertan_VM> 499 $ on france store .... hiccccckkkkkk
Dec 17 16:44:22 <|R> 499 E !
Dec 17 16:44:28 <|R> that's more like 750 :P
Dec 17 16:44:29 <Andy80> lol :D
Dec 17 16:44:32 <Khertan_VM> ouch euro i mean
Dec 17 16:44:42 <|R> 654 USD
Dec 17 16:44:51 <pupnik> ha ha germany is cheaper
Dec 17 16:45:05 <Khertan_VM> (swithing between vm ... different keyboard layout)
Dec 17 16:45:15 <Khertan_VM> spain is 400 Euros
Dec 17 16:45:23 <pupnik> !
Dec 17 16:45:26 <pupnik> spain wins
Dec 17 16:45:33 <Khertan_VM> :)
Dec 17 16:45:41 <Fang64> Tontsa: I caved in and switched back to OS2008, couldn't get the ncurses-bin package to work right.
Dec 17 16:45:46 <Khertan_VM> don t why there are this diff
Dec 17 16:45:48 <|R> weird
Dec 17 16:45:58 <pupnik> government regulations
Dec 17 16:46:04 <|R> germans should be ritcher than french no?
Dec 17 16:46:19 <|R> s/t//
Dec 17 16:46:20 <infobot> |R meant: germans should be richer than french no?
Dec 17 16:46:30 <Khertan_VM> bof ...
Dec 17 16:46:53 <Khertan_VM> the german country is more rich than the french one
Dec 17 16:47:03 <|R> yeah, but i guess berlin is poor hehe
Dec 17 16:47:10 <Khertan_VM> but people ... don't know
Dec 17 16:47:49 <Khertan_VM> dh_pycentral: Command not found
Dec 17 16:48:06 <Khertan_VM> someknow where i can found this command ?
Dec 17 16:48:49 <pupnik> deb helper python crap?
Dec 17 16:49:17 <bedboi> |R: in italy it's rated 450
Dec 17 16:49:22 <dpb_> in debian it's atleast in the python-central package
Dec 17 16:49:25 <bedboi> wtf is this
Dec 17 16:49:34 <zopodo> can i have skype running while in stanby mode and then have the nokia n800 load up and ring when someone is giving me a skype call?
Dec 17 16:49:45 <X-Fade_> bedboi: VAT.
Dec 17 16:49:59 * |R wonders what the price will be in north america for discount code holder...
Dec 17 16:50:01 <bedboi> X-Fade_: i don't think so. In italy we have 20%
Dec 17 16:50:17 <X-Fade_> bedboi: VAT & Shipping?
Dec 17 16:50:31 <X-Fade_> And VAT on Shipping ;)
Dec 17 16:50:58 <dragorn> zopodo: no idea.  try it.
Dec 17 16:51:01 <Tak> |R: supposed to be 99E
Dec 17 16:51:05 <dragorn> zopodo: depends if skype is wakeup-aware
Dec 17 16:51:20 <|R> Tak : so 145$ ?
Dec 17 16:51:24 <Tak> so, depending on current exchange rate, anywhere from $130 to $600
Dec 17 16:51:29 <|R> ahha :)
Dec 17 16:51:44 <Khertan_VM> lol
Dec 17 16:52:00 <Andy80> bedboi: "we"? are you italian?
Dec 17 16:53:23 <Khertan_VM> dh_pycentral not found in debhelper ...
Dec 17 16:53:42 <kaie> is it possible that network will fall asleep, too? When I'm logged in from my pc to the n810 over ssh, after a while the ssh connection will be frozen
Dec 17 16:54:06 <kaie> If the network connection falls asleep, I suppose the skype network will conclude you're offline
Dec 17 16:54:06 <alterego> Doesn't appear to happen with me.
Dec 17 16:54:07 <kaie> ?
Dec 17 16:54:08 <zopodo> has skype been released for the n800?
Dec 17 16:54:35 <dragorn> Yes.  Though my experiences with the os2008 beta + skype left a lot to be desired
Dec 17 16:54:46 <Khertan_VM> nor dh-buildinfo
Dec 17 16:54:49 <keesj> zopodo: yes (for it2007 and it2008 beta)
Dec 17 16:54:51 <zopodo> is there an option to have skype wake aware?
Dec 17 16:55:08 <Khertan_VM> repository.maemo.org seem s to be down
Dec 17 16:55:19 <zopodo> i don't have the n800 yet but if i can have skype wake aware, then i'll most likley get it
Dec 17 16:56:10 <keesj> what is wake aware?
Dec 17 16:56:55 <alterego> I wonder, if when maemo is finally fully buildable from source. We'll be able to compile using the host toolchain ..
Dec 17 16:57:06 <alterego> That'd be neat.
Dec 17 16:57:16 <keesj> the first skype release for it2008 did not work well for me , it was not possible to have a long disc. I have not tried it yet again
Dec 17 16:58:37 <keesj> the host toolchain as in  x86?
Dec 17 16:59:22 <zopodo> kaie, can i have the n800 in low power mode and have a connection for skype?
Dec 17 17:00:30 <kaie> zopodo, I don't know
Dec 17 17:01:01 <zopodo> does anyone have an example photo or video of the quality of the n800 cam?
Dec 17 17:02:50 <kaie> I'm conducting an experiment. I have skype started on the n810, signed in with account A. on the pc I signed in to skype using account B. I'll not touch the n810 for 20 minutes then I'll look what happens when I use the pc to contact A
Dec 17 17:03:57 <kaie> feel free to remind in 20 minutes if you're curious about the result
Dec 17 17:08:36 <Khertan> bye
Dec 17 17:10:15 <bedboi> Andy80: yep, i happen to be italian
Dec 17 17:19:21 <zepede> is it possible to have the n800 in standby mode and have WiFi connected at the same time/
Dec 17 17:23:38 <kaie> I just sent a skype message from pc to n810 after 20 minutes not using the device. The n810 made noise, so the connection is apparently still active
Dec 17 17:24:58 <zepede> is the n810 in standby mode?
Dec 17 17:25:19 <zepede> what about the n800/
Dec 17 17:25:35 <pupnik> it is in dominate world mode
Dec 17 17:26:13 <zepede> is it in stab pupnik in the eye mode?
Dec 17 17:26:44 * Tak always in that mode
Dec 17 17:26:46 <kaie> all I can tell, the display was black and the device had switched to "locked"
Dec 17 17:27:01 <kaie> how do you define "standby mode"?
Dec 17 17:27:36 <kaie> in addition, I remember that I have the network idle time disabled, changed to "always keep connection"
Dec 17 17:29:52 <zepede> ok
Dec 17 17:30:20 <zepede> does the battery in the n800 die down after use like the iphone batteries?
Dec 17 17:31:31 <kaie> zepede, every battery I'm aware of eventually dies down after a lot of use. if that happens, replace the battery I'd say...?
Dec 17 17:31:44 <zepede> can you buy replacement batteries for the n800?
Dec 17 17:31:59 <zepede> or are they proprietary nokia stuff that cost $500?
Dec 17 17:32:18 <Tak> seems to be a fairly good market for them on ebay and similar
Dec 17 17:32:28 <kaie> zepede, have you tried reading the product information pages and info on availably accessiores on nokia.com?
Dec 17 17:32:37 <X-Fade_> zepede: You have never owned anthing from Nokia, have you? :)
Dec 17 17:32:58 <zepede> kaie, yes a bit, and x-fade: no
Dec 17 17:34:06 <X-Fade_> zepede: About every phone/device they made since 199x had replacement batteries..
Dec 17 17:36:10 <zepede> does x forwarding work?
Dec 17 17:36:14 <inz> X-Fade, iPhone!
Dec 17 17:36:28 <inz> X-Fade, sorry, missed the "they"
Dec 17 17:36:37 <X-Fade_> inz: Soldering iron battery replacements ;) Fun..
Dec 17 17:42:57 <lardman> re
Dec 17 17:43:53 <zepede> is $250 a good price for n800?
Dec 17 18:00:25 <Fang64> yo zepede buy.com has them for 228 free shipping
Dec 17 18:02:57 <zepede> Fang64: i live in canada
Dec 17 18:03:11 <Fang64> zepede ah that's a problem
Dec 17 18:03:34 <Fang64> confused me for a bit
Dec 17 19:22:36 <Pavlz> hello
Dec 17 19:23:18 <Pavlz> i got a problem with kismet
Dec 17 19:24:39 <blkorpheus> anyone have fuppes compiled and running properly?
Dec 17 19:24:52 <Pavlz> Server options: none
Dec 17 19:25:16 <Pavlz> Client options: none
Dec 17 19:25:49 <Pavlz> Starting server ...
Dec 17 19:27:01 <Pavlz> Waiting for server to start before starting .
Dec 17 19:27:51 <bedboi> any further info about canola2?
Dec 17 19:28:21 <alterego> bedboi, it was a hoax. It never really existed. Like the N810
Dec 17 19:28:31 <bedboi> eheh
Dec 17 19:29:11 <Pavlz> /usr/bin/kismet_server : error while loadiy
Dec 17 19:29:24 <alterego> Probably a typo
Dec 17 19:31:12 <Pavlz> [1]  + Done (127)        $ {BIN} /ki}
Dec 17 19:31:40 <Pavlz> What does mean all this ?
Dec 17 19:32:25 <Pavlz> I have not understood the real problem of nokia
Dec 17 19:33:20 <Pavlz> it seems got a problem with kismet_server
Dec 17 19:34:15 <Pavlz> anyone can help me ?
Dec 17 19:34:53 <Pavlz> i got the os 2006
Dec 17 19:35:07 <florian> re
Dec 17 19:35:14 <Pavlz> i must update to 2007
Dec 17 19:35:54 <Pavlz> I have logged myself using
Dec 17 19:36:04 <Pavlz> sudo gainroot
Dec 17 19:36:11 <alterego> Why not 2008?
Dec 17 19:36:28 <Pavlz> and i have try to use
Dec 17 19:36:41 <Pavlz> apt-get update
Dec 17 19:36:58 <Pavlz> apt-get dist-upgrade
Dec 17 19:37:43 <Pavlz> but kernel, dependencies... never updated
Dec 17 19:39:17 <Pavlz> so i am to the old kernel version 2.6.16.27-omap1
Dec 17 19:39:51 <Pavlz> ok i try to update my self to the os 2008
Dec 17 19:40:46 <giskard> barisione, :P
Dec 17 19:42:50 <FMz> Any ideas on the final release date of OS2008 for n800?
Dec 17 19:44:08 <Pavlz> i got many problems with this nokia and many times i needed to go to the assistance and last time, they removed me the root access so i needed to use how to become root without have on the screen the image of mounting the debian gnu/linux operating system on the nokia
Dec 17 19:44:34 <alterego> I didn't understand a word of that.
Dec 17 19:45:08 <FMz> Oh wow... that's like Engrish v2.0
Dec 17 19:45:55 <khertan_> re
Dec 17 19:46:28 <Pavlz> where i can download os 2008 for nokia 770 ?
Dec 17 19:50:45 <alterego> Oh, you're using one of _those_ ..
Dec 17 19:50:51 * alterego doesn't support the 770
Dec 17 19:54:45 <Pavlz> what is the difference between nokia n800 an n810 ?
Dec 17 19:55:14 <BeBraw> price, keyboard, gps, screen
Dec 17 19:55:19 <tontsa> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nokia_N810
Dec 17 19:55:25 <tontsa> there's what's changed from n800
Dec 17 19:56:06 <Pavlz> and cpu ?
Dec 17 19:56:30 <alterego> Also, storage options and size.
Dec 17 19:56:35 <tontsa> same cpu on both
Dec 17 19:56:42 <tontsa> just see the wikipedia.org article
Dec 17 19:56:47 <alterego> (and USB connector)
Dec 17 19:56:53 <alterego> And buttons.
Dec 17 20:02:08 <Pavlz> Thanks
Dec 17 20:13:14 <tank-man> does anyone know if the ps3 bluetooth gamepad work with the n800?
Dec 17 20:13:42 <alterego> Does it work with Linux?
Dec 17 20:13:52 <tank-man> yea, i think so
Dec 17 20:14:15 <tank-man> works with the ps3 with linux installed on it i think
Dec 17 20:14:34 <alterego> ffs ..
Dec 17 20:14:40 <tank-man> just wondering if someone has done it with the n800
Dec 17 20:14:42 <alterego> Why does everything rely on Python now-a-days.
Dec 17 20:14:54 <alterego> I can't install the SDK into a base system without python. How lame ..
Dec 17 20:15:51 <derf> Because people like writing software in Python.
Dec 17 20:16:19 <alterego> This is a bash script ..
Dec 17 20:16:28 <alterego> It probably uses python for something _Really_ lame ..
Dec 17 20:16:54 <derf> Probably, but the person writing it found it easier to do it in Python than think about how to do it somewhere else.
Dec 17 20:16:59 <derf> People use the tools they're comfortable with.
Dec 17 20:17:13 <derf> It doesn't actually matter much how well-suited those tools are for the task at hand.
Dec 17 20:17:29 <alterego> Not to them it probably doesn't ..
Dec 17 20:18:23 <derf> They're the ones writing the code.
Dec 17 20:19:00 <alterego> Specifically for other people ..
Dec 17 20:19:39 <derf> Yeah, how much do you think your average developer considers other people?
Dec 17 20:19:48 <derf> Especially in the open-source world.
Dec 17 20:19:58 <alterego> Hmm .. This is actually scratchbox .. So I guess that makes it a little better.
Dec 17 20:20:07 <alterego> I wonder why they don't use their own python ..
Dec 17 20:21:42 * melmoth wonders wich system alterego use that does not comes with python by default.
Dec 17 20:26:10 <alterego> melmoth, debian base install :P
Dec 17 20:26:20 <alterego> I'm creating a KVM for scratchbox.
Dec 17 20:26:26 <melmoth> hmm
Dec 17 20:26:30 <melmoth> i did a xen image for it :)
Dec 17 20:26:50 <alterego> The idea is having it as minimal as possible you see ;)
Dec 17 20:27:17 <melmoth> hmm. i did not care about size, it s stored on an external usb drive anyway.
Dec 17 20:27:26 <alterego> Heh
Dec 17 20:27:31 <melmoth> i just installed debian clicking on next/next/next
Dec 17 20:27:39 <alterego> I don't like waste. Sorry, I know I'm pretty anal ;)
Dec 17 20:27:43 <alterego> Hahah
Dec 17 20:28:09 <melmoth> i think i even got openoffice installed there.
Dec 17 20:29:00 * alterego chuckles.
Dec 17 20:29:08 <alterego> Yeah, your probably did the desktop install :)
Dec 17 20:29:22 <melmoth> must be the default one :)
Dec 17 20:29:44 <alterego> Yeah, it is.
Dec 17 20:31:35 <Tak> alterego: I agree
Dec 17 20:32:24 <kala> how can I trust some CA in the OS2008 ?
Dec 17 20:32:49 <alterego> It's on the Control Panel kala
Dec 17 20:32:58 <alterego> Under "Certificate Manager" or some such.
Dec 17 20:33:06 <kala> hmm
Dec 17 20:33:48 <kala> right, the Certificate Manager is there
Dec 17 20:34:04 <kala> ok, and thereis Import.
Dec 17 20:34:05 <kala> thanks
Dec 17 20:34:56 <alterego> hmm
Dec 17 20:35:00 <alterego> That's okay :P
Dec 17 20:35:14 <Tak> (doesn't actually work for me)
Dec 17 20:36:24 <alterego> Great .. segfault ..
Dec 17 20:38:27 <kala> jee, this fixed my Outlook Web Access crash
Dec 17 20:41:32 * alterego starts from scratch.
Dec 17 20:41:43 <alterego> Right, now I know the process works. Time to do it properly.
Dec 17 20:41:44 <alterego> :D
Dec 17 21:13:59 <pat26> hi.  I would like to install a dual boot system with OS2008 as the main system and 0S2007 on a SD card. Is it possible ?
Dec 17 21:16:31 <alterego> Yes.
Dec 17 21:17:36 <pat26> The link I found is about N770.  Any change ?
Dec 17 21:18:04 <alterego> What's an "N770"?
Dec 17 21:18:40 <pat26> N770 device (mine is an n800)
Dec 17 21:19:01 <alterego> I don't remember an "N770" do you mean the "770"?
Dec 17 21:19:02 <alterego> :P
Dec 17 21:19:15 <pat26> Nokia N770
Dec 17 21:19:26 <shackan> bzzzt, wrong
Dec 17 21:19:27 <alterego> There is no Nokia "N770" ..
Dec 17 21:19:52 <alterego> I can't believe people still think it's N-series :D
Dec 17 21:20:21 <pat26> is that so important ?
Dec 17 21:21:00 <alterego> No, being correct is never important.
Dec 17 21:21:34 <pat26> could you give me information about dual boot or do you prefer playing with words ?
Dec 17 21:22:11 <alterego> The instructions for dual booting an N800 or the 770 should be somewhat applicable. But I'm sure there will be differences.
Dec 17 21:22:19 <alterego> (OS2007) that is .
Dec 17 21:22:38 <maddler> evening all!
Dec 17 21:22:52 <alterego> So, by all means. Go ahead, if you have any questions then ask them more specifically. The process should be somewhat similar though.
Dec 17 21:22:52 <protocol_> Hi
Dec 17 21:23:09 <alterego> I think the only difference will be dealing with the initrd ..
Dec 17 21:26:06 <protocol_> I am trying to capture sound on N800 using ESD. There is a example application called "esdrec". "esdrec" works fine on the pc but does not work on N800. Any help would be appreciated regarding ESD on maemo platform.
Dec 17 21:28:09 <protocol_> ESD socket is opened successfully but ESD socket reading fails to read correctly thus hangs on the reading phase.
Dec 17 21:28:46 <protocol_> Is there some issues using ESD on maemo platform?
Dec 17 21:44:13 <protocol_> Does anybody know how to use esd in maemo platform?
Dec 17 21:44:34 <protocol_> I can not use gstreamer.
Dec 17 21:45:01 <protocol_> I have to use esd to capture sound data from microphone.
Dec 17 21:47:53 <dragorn> I'd guess not.
Dec 17 21:49:29 <youam> it's not possible to use larger sd cards than 2gb in the n800, right?
Dec 17 21:49:58 <skibur> hello
Dec 17 21:50:21 <skibur> I'm using N800 - OS2008.  Any app that can read .doc files yet?
Dec 17 21:51:13 <blast007> youam: on the nseries.com site it says 8GB limit, but in the user manual it says 2GB
Dec 17 21:51:19 <blast007> youam: http://www.nseries.com/nseries/v3/media/sections/products/tech_specs/en-R1/tech_specs_n800_en_R1.html
Dec 17 21:51:34 <blast007> iirc, amazon.com lists 2GB as well, so I'm just as confused ;)
Dec 17 21:51:46 <glass_> 2gb was probably biggest they tried before shipping
Dec 17 21:51:56 <glass_> it didn't ship with sdhc support iirc originally
Dec 17 21:52:01 <youam> anybody tried id with sdhc cards yet?
Dec 17 21:52:03 <glass_> thus, 2gb limit on the shipping day specs
Dec 17 21:52:13 <glass_> sdhc came in upgraded fw, no?
Dec 17 21:53:11 <tontsa> you need sdhc versions if you want to use bigger than 2gb atleast with n810
Dec 17 21:53:20 <youam> glass_: is sd vs sdhc a software limitation? i thought it's hardware?
Dec 17 21:53:36 <glass_> youam: sw in this case at least
Dec 17 21:54:19 <glass_> if you can control the pins i don't know why it would be a hw issue, really...
Dec 17 21:55:07 * |R just ordered a 8GB microSD for the n810 to come... :)
Dec 17 22:04:53 <doc|home> skibur: abiword can I think
Dec 17 22:09:21 <sgehrman> FM Radio in n810 doesn't do anything
Dec 17 22:09:24 <sgehrman> is it suppose to work?
Dec 17 22:10:26 <derf> I thought the N810 didn't have an FM tuner.
Dec 17 22:10:36 <sgehrman> not sure, but the applet is included
Dec 17 22:12:10 <sgehrman> its the second applet in the list of installed stuff.  It would be strange to include it but to not have a chip right?
Dec 17 22:12:20 <derf> Yes. I agree that would be strange.
Dec 17 22:12:32 <Vulc|Bleh> its probably included in OS2008 final
Dec 17 22:12:33 <halley> The N810 does not have FM hardware.
Dec 17 22:12:48 <Vulc|Bleh> It'd be in there for the n800, and they just didn't remove it for the 810
Dec 17 22:13:51 <youam> anyone know about the status of the pimlico tools for os2008?
Dec 17 22:35:46 <diver_x> hi, is there a way to get or build a kernel module for mppe without flashing the n800 again ? i'm using os2008
Dec 17 22:36:13 <skibur> abiword?
Dec 17 22:36:28 <skibur> is there a .deb for abiword  for OS2008?
Dec 17 22:37:04 <skibur> Wow!  Otopia for N800?
Dec 17 22:39:55 <halley> apt-get often hangs after 'gzip' on chinook/free for some reason; then when I bail it has dupe entries in sources.list to clean up
Dec 17 22:41:07 <halley> Disconnect has a problem.
Dec 17 22:41:16 <halley> "What we have here is a failure to communicate."
Dec 17 22:41:21 <Fang64> lol
Dec 17 22:52:19 <skibur> hacking is all I know
Dec 17 22:54:22 <killfill> hi guys
Dec 17 22:54:33 <killfill> the "mediastreamer" should see daapd servers, right?
Dec 17 22:54:50 <killfill> or just upnp's?
Dec 17 22:56:20 <killfill> anyone?.. :)
Dec 17 22:56:23 <dev> killfill: afaik only upnp
Dec 17 22:57:45 <killfill> :S
Dec 17 22:57:54 <killfill> whats a daap client (except for canola)
Dec 17 22:58:26 <killfill> my upnp server is a little buggy..
Dec 17 22:58:28 <killfill> (mediatomb)
Dec 17 22:58:41 <killfill> whats up with canol2 anyway?.. :P
Dec 17 22:58:44 <killfill> any news?
Dec 17 22:59:11 <dev> killfill: mine works, but mediatomb should be fine too
Dec 17 23:00:08 <killfill> its a bug with freebsd or something.. it telling something about the swap..
Dec 18 00:16:19 <penguinbait> its next week, them codes work yet??? :)
Dec 18 00:55:17 <lopz> hola
Dec 18 01:29:16 <czr> hey alterego & all
Dec 18 01:38:15 <alterego> Hey czr enjoying your holiday?
Dec 18 01:38:36 <czr> alterego, yup. although today was slightly cold
Dec 18 01:38:46 <czr> got sun-burned the very first day, just my luck :-)
Dec 18 01:38:55 * czr looked like a small little piggie
Dec 18 01:39:42 <czr> alterego, hows things over here?
Dec 18 02:01:34 * czr continues relaxing ->
Dec 18 02:13:31 <Esworp> so, what is scratchbox exactly?
Dec 18 02:15:36 <dragorn> a mix of an emulator, the compilers, and a development environment.
Dec 18 02:15:36 <dragorn> lets you run (most) of the maemo dev as if it were on a device
Dec 18 02:15:40 <Esworp> ahhhh.
Dec 18 02:15:55 <alterego> It's a cross platform development environment.
Dec 18 02:15:55 <alterego> It's used for building customized linux root filesystems and applications for other architectures.
Dec 18 02:16:57 <Esworp> i use the gpe caleendar and todo a LOT.  can i expect it to work w/os2008?  wasn't it going to get updated?
Dec 18 02:30:35 <kaie> it's unfortunate that device flashing will not reinstall all the apps. how do the maemo developers solve that problem, who probably flash their device all the time?
Dec 18 02:31:04 <kaie> is there a batch-like mechanism that can be used to reinstall all the apps you want? I guess the answer is to login via ssh and do it from the shell via apt-get...
Dec 18 02:31:32 <kaie> ( s/device flashing will not/data restore after device flashing/
Dec 18 02:38:56 <Esworp> i /think/ you can use rsync to basically image things- but as i type that i could imagine that that wouldn't work in the case of a os change.
Dec 18 02:42:50 <Esworp> ohoh,  i got a question about videocenter...
Dec 18 02:44:07 <Esworp> how do you add channels/services?  the nokia-provided selection is a little paltry
Dec 18 02:47:32 <unique311> video center available for os2008?
Dec 18 02:51:24 <Esworp> dunno.  but it's underutilized in general.
**** ENDING LOGGING AT Tue Dec 18 02:59:56 2007