**** BEGIN LOGGING AT Sun Jan 27 02:59:57 2008
Jan 27 03:00:03 <fysa> http://maemo.org/development/documentation/how-tos/4-x/maemo_4-0_porting_guide.html
Jan 27 03:00:07 <fysa> That is an amazing piece of work.
Jan 27 03:00:56 <pupnik_> yes, the 'state saving' could be super-useful for dosbox :P
Jan 27 03:01:04 <fysa> lots of good things there.
Jan 27 03:02:48 <jott> pupnik_: did you have any mouse issues with dosbox?
Jan 27 03:03:09 <pupnik_> yes, dosbox mouse needs to be tweaked to use the screen like a laptop touchpad
Jan 27 03:03:19 <pupnik_> only relative motion is possible with DOS mouse drivers, afaik
Jan 27 03:03:26 <jott> yieks..hmm
Jan 27 03:03:40 <pupnik_> unlike say, macintosh which can accept an absolute poitner position
Jan 27 03:03:46 <jott> yepp..
Jan 27 03:03:58 <jott> as you say it.. this sounds familiar
Jan 27 03:04:12 <jott> haven't really used dos for ages ;)
Jan 27 03:06:21 <pupnik_> the problem then is how to implement mouse clicks
Jan 27 03:06:33 <pupnik_> either tap-and-hold, or a button press
Jan 27 03:07:06 <pupnik_> however, one 'good' thing is that most mouse-driven games run too slow anyway
Jan 27 03:07:27 <fysa> I'm trying to install libsdl-ttf in a SB2, but sb2 apt-get -f install complains about x11 dependencies.  What am I missing?  Or do I need to apt-get source it?
Jan 27 03:07:27 <jott> hehe i wanted to use deluxepaint ii ;)
Jan 27 03:07:43 <fysa> jott: UAE works
Jan 27 03:07:50 <fysa> and DeluxePaint for it is very nice.
Jan 27 03:08:00 <jott> ah yeah wort a try
Jan 27 03:08:05 <fysa> (is the mouse fixed?)
Jan 27 03:08:07 <jott> worth
Jan 27 03:08:40 <johnx> fysa, does it depend on X11 or recommend it?
Jan 27 03:10:05 <fysa> actually, there's an entire slew -  "Depends: linux-kernel-headers but it is not going to be installed"
Jan 27 03:10:35 <johnx> that's really unfortunate :/
Jan 27 03:10:49 <fysa> what is something that should certainly install that I could test?
Jan 27 03:10:56 <johnx> nano
Jan 27 03:11:05 <johnx> or helloworld
Jan 27 03:11:49 <fysa> something must not be setup right.
Jan 27 03:13:29 <pupnik_> you can install ignoring dependencies by downloading the file and using dpkg -i <package>.deb
Jan 27 03:14:01 <fysa> it's basically complaining about everything in the system.
Jan 27 03:14:06 <fysa> pastebin
Jan 27 03:17:48 <fysa> http://pastebin.com/m584023d1
Jan 27 03:18:09 <ywwg> where's the API docs for the maemo online/offline pop-up-dialog-to-get-me-online stuff?
Jan 27 03:18:18 <ywwg> I forget what it's called and I can't find it on the site
Jan 27 03:18:41 <johnx> fysa, what happens if you run apt-get -f install as it suggests?
Jan 27 03:19:16 <johnx> or also: apt-cache policy libc6
Jan 27 03:21:42 <fysa> same thing.  this is from: sb2 apt-get -f install nano
Jan 27 03:22:20 <johnx> so apt-get -f install with no packages basically says it can't install anything?
Jan 27 03:22:44 <johnx> yeah, your package system is probably very broken
Jan 27 03:23:12 <johnx> can I have a link to the guide you followed?
Jan 27 03:23:42 <fysa> there we go.  "sb2 apt-get -f install" alone -- they're all downloading now.
Jan 27 03:24:16 <johnx> woo!
Jan 27 03:25:28 <fysa> http://maemo-sdk.garage.maemo.org/install.html
Jan 27 03:25:38 <pupnik_> bbbl.  it's beertime.  huge thanks johnx.
Jan 27 03:25:54 <johnx> 'later
Jan 27 03:25:55 <johnx> have fun
Jan 27 03:44:12 <smackpotato> is there any extra hardware devices on the n810
Jan 27 03:45:46 <jott> ?!
Jan 27 03:46:05 <johnx> extra with regards to what?
Jan 27 03:47:23 <johnx> for example, compared to a toaster the N810 has one (1) extra OMAP2420 with vector floating point but lacks two (2) bread slots
Jan 27 04:21:00 <db48x> smackpotato: I'm not sure if this is what you're interested in, but the OMAP2420 chip has a PowerVR core that isn't used by the n810
Jan 27 05:20:16 <kupesoft> Any good tutorials for USB/OTG for the n800?
Jan 27 05:20:25 <kupesoft> re: I have aircrack-ng and a usb wifi dongle in mind
Jan 27 05:25:47 <bmidgley> are there apps out there to use gps and wifi signal strengths to create a wifi ap map?
Jan 27 05:34:41 <johnx> bmidgley, kismet should do it
Jan 27 05:35:48 <bmidgley> johnx ok that looked promising except finding a package
Jan 27 05:36:02 <johnx> the bora package should work I've heard
Jan 27 05:52:20 <kupesoft> What cable to I need for OTG, I'm in Canada (re: shipping)
Jan 27 05:52:44 <johnx> kupesoft, n800 or n810?
Jan 27 05:53:09 <kupesoft> n800
Jan 27 05:53:20 <kupesoft> johnx: ^^
Jan 27 05:53:48 <johnx> hmm, and you want it to automatically enable host mode or you don't care?
Jan 27 05:54:13 <kupesoft> I can manually enable it via  command, doesn't make a difference
Jan 27 05:54:24 <kupesoft> s/via  command/via command line/
Jan 27 05:54:24 <infobot> kupesoft meant: I can manually enable it via command line, doesn't make a difference
Jan 27 05:54:41 <kupesoft> infobot: ^^ (:
Jan 27 05:56:17 <johnx> then you can get a mini-b to a, then a female to female adapter
Jan 27 05:56:33 <johnx> someone on here found one that automagically enabled host mode though
Jan 27 05:56:39 <johnx> let me dig through the logs
Jan 27 05:57:21 <kupesoft> It has to do with shorting some wires or something
Jan 27 05:57:33 <kupesoft> johnx: Have you got aircrack-ng compiled for OS2008?
Jan 27 05:58:14 <pupnikafk> well i have to say arm and omap are wonderful things
Jan 27 05:58:34 <johnx> kupesoft, never tried
Jan 27 05:58:37 <pupnikafk> and may every employee of Intel rot in the pits of hell for all eternity
Jan 27 05:58:40 <pupnikafk> good morning!
Jan 27 06:07:23 <jga23> how do i flush dns? my hosts changes arnt working
Jan 27 06:08:20 <zoran> heh?
Jan 27 06:08:35 <zoran> u mean arp?
Jan 27 06:08:45 <johnx> kupesoft, Cptnodegard apparently found something that worked
Jan 27 06:09:04 <kupesoft> johnx: For a automagic OTG cable or for compiling aircrack-ng?
Jan 27 06:09:12 <johnx> for auto-OTG cable
Jan 27 06:09:15 <kupesoft> s/a /an /
Jan 27 06:09:15 <infobot> kupesoft meant: johnx: For an automagic OTG cable or for compiling aircrack-ng?
Jan 27 06:09:21 <kupesoft> I love that!
Jan 27 06:09:45 <johnx> I think it was a 5-pin mini-b
Jan 27 06:10:04 <jga23> zoran: how do i flush arp?
Jan 27 06:10:14 <zoran> unpower the router
Jan 27 06:10:19 <johnx> and then you use a female-A to female-A adapter with it
Jan 27 06:10:32 <johnx> jga23, specifically what is not reacting to the changes in your hosts file?
Jan 27 06:11:00 <johnx> jga23, if it's a web browser you might need to restart it
Jan 27 06:11:04 <jga23> just added an entry and when i ping it, its not showing the correct ip
Jan 27 06:11:16 <zoran> more details?
Jan 27 06:11:24 <zoran> what is you net?
Jan 27 06:12:36 <jga23> nm, got it
Jan 27 06:12:46 <johnx> what was the problem?
Jan 27 06:12:59 <jga23> closed the webbrowser
Jan 27 06:13:10 <zoran> cash?
Jan 27 06:14:16 <johnx> :) that's what I figured
Jan 27 06:14:50 <jga23> :)
Jan 27 06:15:45 <Savago> is there a Python guy out there?
Jan 27 06:15:57 <Savago> I have 1 question about BlueZ.
Jan 27 06:16:37 <Savago> More specifically, on bluetooth.lookup_name.
Jan 27 06:17:07 <Savago> I got 1 piece of code that works fine in my notebook, but fails when running in N810.
Jan 27 06:17:33 <zoran> u have all modules added?
Jan 27 06:19:14 <Savago> zoran, could you explain what you mean by 'modules'? I don't get it.
Jan 27 06:20:44 <zoran> some added libs to have your ported script work
Jan 27 06:21:05 <Savago> zoran, I only use 'bluetooth' library.
Jan 27 06:21:08 <zoran> probably maemo port is not so extensive as on your desktop
Jan 27 06:21:22 <Savago> Can I post the code here? Its only 7 LOCs.
Jan 27 06:21:29 <zoran> I had to add some libs for getmail and some other simple scripts
Jan 27 06:21:56 <zoran> have some error message?
Jan 27 06:22:00 <Savago> Nopes.
Jan 27 06:22:11 <Savago> lookup_name returns None.
Jan 27 06:22:28 <Savago> Where I was expecting to return the 'human readable' device name.
Jan 27 06:22:32 <zoran> so, no python problem?
Jan 27 06:23:14 <zoran> look_up means $HOST  ?
Jan 27 06:23:20 <Savago> Maybe I forgot something, but it seem rather strange that all calls to lookup_name return None.
Jan 27 06:23:26 <Savago> zoran, yep.
Jan 27 06:23:46 <zoran> I found it strangely done on my 770
Jan 27 06:24:22 <zoran> and I didn't make succes changing some variables
Jan 27 06:24:31 <Savago> Say you have a computer (named 'foobie') that has a BT address (00:xx:xx:xx:xx), the lookup_name returns 'foobie' when you supply the address.
Jan 27 06:24:42 <zoran> probably busybox problem
Jan 27 06:24:54 <Savago> This is the code:
Jan 27 06:24:57 <Savago> <flood>
Jan 27 06:25:05 <Savago> import bluetooth
Jan 27 06:25:06 <Savago> devices = bluetooth.find_service(name = 'Audio Source')
Jan 27 06:25:06 <Savago> def print_name(mac):
Jan 27 06:25:06 <Savago>     for i in range(10):
Jan 27 06:25:06 <Savago>         name = bluetooth.lookup_name(mac)
Jan 27 06:25:06 <Savago>         print u'i = ' + str(i) + ' res = ' + str(name)
Jan 27 06:25:08 <Savago> print_name(devices[0]['host'])
Jan 27 06:25:10 <Savago> </flood>
Jan 27 06:25:42 <Savago> If you have a Linux box near (say, Ubuntu) and run this code, it was supposed to print your box name.
Jan 27 06:26:14 <zoran> found function of the same name on maemo?
Jan 27 06:26:23 <Savago> zoran, yeps.
Jan 27 06:26:47 <zoran> maybe it should be tweaked to match maemo $HOST
Jan 27 06:27:03 <Savago> zoran, what do you mean by tweaked?
Jan 27 06:27:10 <zoran> I also got blank on that call
Jan 27 06:27:23 <Savago> Do you mean that maemo python binding for bluez is incomplete?
Jan 27 06:27:32 <zoran> maybe
Jan 27 06:27:57 <zoran> what if you try it with bash?
Jan 27 06:28:16 <Savago> This is what I got running it in my notebook:
Jan 27 06:28:26 <zoran> I meanth on maemo
Jan 27 06:28:26 <Savago>  python t.py
Jan 27 06:28:27 <Savago> i = 0 res = zv64-0
Jan 27 06:28:59 <zoran> there was a port of bash, called bash-m
Jan 27 06:29:24 <Savago> I'm running it over ssh.
Jan 27 06:29:34 <zoran> after simple "bash" it should read variables
Jan 27 06:29:44 <zoran> Savago, you use ash over ssh
Jan 27 06:30:03 <zoran> built in shell for busybox
Jan 27 06:30:46 <Savago> Do you mean that the code will not run correctly If I try to execute it logged in my N810 using ssh?
Jan 27 06:31:08 <zoran> Savago, the very shell could be the problem
Jan 27 06:31:15 <zoran> on maemo
Jan 27 06:31:18 <Savago> this doesn't make sense.
Jan 27 06:31:32 <zoran> culd you try to install bash and try out?
Jan 27 06:31:51 <zoran> or tcsh if possible
Jan 27 06:32:17 <Savago> yeah, why not... At this late night, what can I miss? :-)
Jan 27 06:32:47 <zoran> Savago, as I see, the device was not intended for you and me and all those folks on the channel, but for multimedia kids
Jan 27 06:33:20 <zoran> so, don't be surprised
Jan 27 06:33:50 <johnx> zoran, maybe I'm missing something, but what does $HOST have to do with the bluetooth device name?
Jan 27 06:34:19 <zoran> u mean mac address?
Jan 27 06:34:26 <johnx> er...no
Jan 27 06:34:44 <zoran> dunno how the variable is set
Jan 27 06:34:48 <johnx> the name that you set in the bluetooth control panel applet
Jan 27 06:35:01 <Savago> could anyone else try to run the code in your device? Maybe its a caveat in my Python install.
Jan 27 06:35:13 <johnx> sure, in a sec
Jan 27 06:35:55 <Savago> johnx, just make sure that you have 1 linux box with bluetooth plugged in.
Jan 27 06:36:02 <johnx> ok
Jan 27 06:36:33 <Savago> and also, make it visible to other devices.
Jan 27 06:36:35 <truent> Savago, this is the 810?
Jan 27 06:36:52 <Savago> truent, yep. I'm trying to run it in N810.
Jan 27 06:36:54 <truent> dunno of any bluetooth library like that.. i've used 'bluez' library
Jan 27 06:37:32 <truent> you can get remote devices, set device name, make discoverable/connectable etc.. by way of dbus
Jan 27 06:37:55 <truent> and python (though i use ruby) has a good dbus implementation
Jan 27 06:38:24 <Savago> truent, to make use of sockets to exchange data between BT devices, you need to use BlueZ.
Jan 27 06:38:50 <truent> ahh you mean bluetooth?
Jan 27 06:38:56 <truent> library
Jan 27 06:39:00 <truent> havent done that
Jan 27 06:39:17 <truent> whatcha tryin to do? not that i can be of any help at this point, im just curious ;)
Jan 27 06:39:39 <Savago> Ah... nothing... (wink, wink).
Jan 27 06:40:19 <truent> very well then
Jan 27 06:40:36 <pupnik_> http://youtube.com/watch?v=UUwUDoC3vc4  [ YouTube - GemRB Baldur's Gate 2 on on Nokia N810 ]
Jan 27 06:40:37 <Savago> Actually, I'm trying to port one soft to Maemo.
Jan 27 06:41:05 <johnx> Savago, it disconnects my bluetooth headphones then says: list index out of range
Jan 27 06:41:32 <johnx> http://pastebin.ca/874360
Jan 27 06:41:52 <Savago> johnx, are you using a bluetooth headphones?
Jan 27 06:41:57 <johnx> yes
Jan 27 06:42:17 <johnx> maybe I copied it wrong
Jan 27 06:42:18 <Savago> It was supposed to run when both devices (computer + n810) are not using headphones.
Jan 27 06:42:21 <johnx> http://pastebin.ca/874361
Jan 27 06:42:26 <Savago> I forgot to tell you, sorry.
Jan 27 06:42:39 <johnx> Savago, well I tested it on my ubuntu box actually
Jan 27 06:42:52 <johnx> my tablet isn't booted into ITOS right now
Jan 27 06:43:01 <Savago> ah, ok.
Jan 27 06:43:18 <Savago> But this code was supposed to run in the device.
Jan 27 06:43:39 <Savago> For my test in my Ubuntu box, I used another bluetooth service running in another box.
Jan 27 06:44:44 <johnx> rebooting tablet anyways, so I'll give it a shot
Jan 27 06:45:01 <Savago> thanks a lot, dude!
Jan 27 06:45:08 <johnx> sure
Jan 27 06:45:40 <johnx> can I have a *little* clue about what your trying to do overall or is it a secret?
Jan 27 06:46:02 <Savago> johnx, no secret at all.
Jan 27 06:46:27 <Savago> I wish to being able to list the nearby BT devices using the 'human readable' name.
Jan 27 06:46:49 <Savago> Instead of using 'xx:xx:xx:xx' addresses to represent each external device.
Jan 27 06:49:12 <Savago> And the soft I'm trying to port has nothing to do with sound at all (I just choose this BT service because is available in any Ubuntu box).
Jan 27 06:50:06 <johnx> ah
Jan 27 06:50:10 <johnx> got my hopes up :P
Jan 27 06:50:23 <johnx> anyways, I ran it on my tablet
Jan 27 06:50:40 <johnx> I could put the results on pastebin but they're all: i = 0 res = None
Jan 27 06:50:52 <johnx> only thing that changes is i = 0-9
Jan 27 06:51:45 <Savago> hum... so it seems that it fails on your device too.
Jan 27 06:52:08 <johnx> yup. that's with a fresh install of python2.5-runtime
Jan 27 06:52:55 <Savago> Are you are of any python app that makes uses of BT and run in the maemo device?
Jan 27 06:53:16 <Savago> Maybe I can have a glimpse in the source code and have a clue of what I'm missing.
Jan 27 06:54:06 <johnx> I really can't think of anything off the top of my head
Jan 27 06:54:35 <Savago> Well, I will try to google it. Anyway, thanks a lot! :-)
Jan 27 06:54:40 <johnx> sure
Jan 27 06:54:43 <johnx> good luck
Jan 27 06:55:14 <Savago> are/aware
Jan 27 06:58:22 <fysa> pywiisomething
Jan 27 06:58:38 <fysa> http://pyaxelwii.garage.maemo.org/
Jan 27 06:58:54 * Savago checking...
Jan 27 07:02:58 <Savago> fysa, this seems to be good: grep -uR "lookup_name" . | wc -l
Jan 27 07:02:59 <Savago> 12
Jan 27 07:03:18 <Savago> running on the svn trunk directory of pyaxelwii.
Jan 27 07:15:18 <pupnik_> heh
Jan 27 07:15:28 <pupnik_> where am i
Jan 27 07:16:08 <Luria> only you can tell us that
Jan 27 07:17:25 <johnx> you're in "Internic Network" obviously. Is that in Europe?
Jan 27 07:18:46 <Luria> i would bet berlin
Jan 27 07:19:36 <Luria> if im right, do i win a prize?
Jan 27 07:20:09 <pupnik_> somewhere between heaven and hell i think
Jan 27 07:21:02 <Luria> switzerland then?
Jan 27 07:22:17 <Savago> johnx, fysa pyaxelwii has some interesting bit. I will read it tomorrow (its 3:21AM here). Thanks a lot for your help, seeya guys. :-)
Jan 27 07:22:23 <Savago> bit/bits
Jan 27 07:41:10 <johnx> scratchbox2 is like the coolest thing ever
Jan 27 08:46:45 <zetheroo> The FM Radio program does not work for me... all I hear is fuzz
Jan 27 08:48:40 <johnx> do you have headphones plugged in?
Jan 27 08:48:45 <Tama^2> have you plugged in the headphones?
Jan 27 08:48:50 <Tama^2> eh eh
Jan 27 08:49:15 <Tama^2> the headphones work as an antenna, no antenna -> fzfzfzfzf
Jan 27 08:49:15 <zetheroo> ummm
Jan 27 08:49:20 <zetheroo> there are speakers
Jan 27 08:49:27 <zetheroo> oh really?
Jan 27 08:49:32 <johnx> the headphone wire is used as an antenna
Jan 27 08:49:39 <zetheroo> wowo
Jan 27 08:49:40 <zetheroo> ok
Jan 27 08:50:04 <johnx> yeah, confused me at first too
Jan 27 08:50:25 <Tama^2> I went: mmmmm, ahhhhhhhhhh!
Jan 27 08:51:17 <zetheroo> so there is no way to listen to radio via the speakers?
Jan 27 08:51:40 <johnx> there's a way to plug in headphones and switch it back to speakers
Jan 27 08:52:10 <zetheroo> ok
Jan 27 08:52:13 <zetheroo> know how?
Jan 27 08:52:28 <johnx> er no
Jan 27 08:52:32 <johnx> I don't use the fm radio app
Jan 27 08:52:44 <johnx> maybe look in preferences in the radio app itself?
Jan 27 08:53:29 <Tama^2> there is an headphone/redio icon
Jan 27 08:53:39 <Tama^2> *radio
Jan 27 08:53:56 <zetheroo> ok
Jan 27 08:53:58 <zetheroo> I see it
Jan 27 08:54:00 <zetheroo> super
Jan 27 08:54:04 <Tama^2> when you tap it it switches
Jan 27 08:55:01 <zetheroo> indeed
Jan 27 09:03:18 <johnx> hi Cptnodegard, could you give me a link to the 5-pin mini-usb cable you found?
Jan 27 09:05:23 <Cptnodegard> bad new on that front... its not a real 5 pin. it has 5 connected wires, but the 5th pin is copnnected to the metal housing of the mini usb b cable, not the 5th pin of the mini b connector!
Jan 27 09:05:29 <Cptnodegard> i was pissed as hell
Jan 27 09:06:09 <Cptnodegard> i ohmed the thing to find out what wires went where and it made no freaking sense, so opened the mini b connector and realized why :/
Jan 27 09:06:56 <johnx> lame
Jan 27 09:07:42 <Cptnodegard> my initial plan was to use it to make a how to. gonna try some more cables from that place to see if i can find one that does work. the guide is pointless if the people reading it arent able to get the exact same cable, so has to be from DX which ships worldwide
Jan 27 09:08:51 <johnx> hmm...it might be hard to find
Jan 27 09:09:32 <johnx> if you plug a mini-b wired like a mini-a into a non-otg device, I wonder if it would end up fried
Jan 27 09:09:45 <johnx> and that aside it's really against the usb specification
Jan 27 09:11:36 <Cptnodegard> johnx, wont fry anything... normally the last pin simply isnt connected to the usb a
Jan 27 09:12:00 <Cptnodegard> i have a link to a cable that i myself used, one that is extremely easy to work with, but its expensive
Jan 27 09:12:07 <johnx> ah
Jan 27 09:12:25 <johnx> the problem is the world wide shipping
Jan 27 09:12:37 <Cptnodegard> they have
Jan 27 09:12:47 <johnx> ah
Jan 27 09:12:59 <johnx> so worldwide shipping + cheap = not so much ?
Jan 27 09:13:37 <Cptnodegard> nah the cable i used was expensive
Jan 27 09:13:44 <Cptnodegard> 30 bucks shipped type expensive
Jan 27 09:14:00 <Cptnodegard> but it does have all 5 pins connected
Jan 27 09:14:07 <Tama^2> Does anyone know (or is happy to speculate) about some aspects of the metalayer crawler design?
Jan 27 09:14:10 <johnx> it's not that bad...still cheaper than a plain 3' USB cable at best buy
Jan 27 09:16:23 <Cptnodegard> wait a miute!
Jan 27 09:16:26 <Cptnodegard> i read wrong
Jan 27 09:16:49 <Cptnodegard> the cable i used on mine is 13,5 USD shipped anywehere
Jan 27 09:17:05 <johnx> nice
Jan 27 09:17:32 <Cptnodegard> http://www.pc-mobile.net/pspgps.htm - "Mini USB extenson cable" if its still the same type i got a while ago, that cable has all 5 pins connected
Jan 27 09:22:13 <Cptnodegard> ordering one
Jan 27 09:22:28 <kykyu_> Hi, this is Kenny. I'm a newbie to Maemo. I've just installed SDK 3.0. But I cannot find Application Installer in my emulated screen...
Jan 27 09:22:31 <kykyu_> can you tell me why?
Jan 27 09:23:04 <johnx> application manager isn't included
Jan 27 09:23:38 <kykyu_> oh... any way to have it included? or there isn't a way?
Jan 27 09:24:17 <kykyu_> actually I wanted to install MicroB for my research... but I don't know how to... after having built the .deb files.
Jan 27 09:27:56 <melmoth> dpkg -i yourdebfile.deb
Jan 27 09:29:36 <Luria> you can build debs but dont know how to install them? weird.
Jan 27 09:54:03 <|tbb|> hi all
Jan 27 10:01:18 <|tbb|> is there a possibility to kill a msgbox which for example appears when there is a network connect error while trying to connect to an ap
Jan 27 10:02:13 <Tama^2> I very much doubt it, it's generated by the System UI
Jan 27 10:02:35 <Tama^2> but I really don't know much sbout it ;-;
Jan 27 10:11:01 <johnx> if you knew the ID of it's window you could tell it to close
Jan 27 10:13:44 <|tbb|> how to find that out?
Jan 27 10:14:54 <keesj> it would need to go via dbus i guess
Jan 27 10:15:25 <keesj> the dialogs should be nicely added one below the other
Jan 27 10:15:40 <Tama^2> that is *if* it is published on dbus
Jan 27 10:16:12 <Tama^2> yes, they should have. There are a lot of UI issues ;-(
Jan 27 10:18:55 <|tbb|> what is "signal sender=:1.29" is that the id i need
Jan 27 10:20:09 <Tama^2> |tbb|: I have no idea, where did you get that string?
Jan 27 10:20:31 <|tbb|> dbus-monitor
Jan 27 10:20:39 <Tama^2> keesj: also they should not show before finishing rendering, right now the effect is a bit clumsy
Jan 27 10:22:31 <keesj> yes ,specialy with maemo-mapper because it shows/ed ad "waiting for fix" for a long time. while also trying to connect to the internet
Jan 27 10:26:41 <ccooke> Hmm. IIRC, leaving the RSS app open can kill battery life, yes?
Jan 27 10:28:25 <Tama^2> it should not reduce it by much
Jan 27 10:28:41 <Tama^2> of course rss active means wifi connection active
Jan 27 10:28:55 <Tama^2> and it also depends how often you refresh your feeds
Jan 27 10:29:02 <Tama^2> how many feeds etc
Jan 27 10:29:14 <Tama^2> still I believe it should not make an enormous difference
Jan 27 10:44:31 * |tbb| got an idea for the designer of the keyboard, do some small hole on every character so if u just need to push less characters and u got you stylus in the hand, u can push the key easily
Jan 27 10:53:36 <keesj> yes, and also add a m6 hole in on the rocker key so we can modify it to be a joystick
Jan 27 10:55:23 <keesj> also invent a 8 bit keyboard
Jan 27 10:57:24 <n0ob_> has anyone used this vmware maemo sdk image correctly? how can i compile and run the hello world example?
Jan 27 10:59:03 * keesj can not get vmware to work on his machine
Jan 27 10:59:19 <|tbb|> damn, i need to kill the dialog which tells me network error, try again? while trying to connect to an ap
Jan 27 10:59:55 <n0ob_> keesj: thats sad
Jan 27 11:00:09 <johnx> |tbb|, maybe wmctrl?
Jan 27 11:00:14 <johnx> http://www.sweb.cz/tripie/utils/wmctrl/
Jan 27 11:03:40 <johnx> n0ob_, is the hello world a debian package or a .tar.gz?
Jan 27 11:03:40 <|tbb|> johnx, maybe but then i need someone who compile it for chinook, i wonder if there is another way to do that
Jan 27 11:04:21 <johnx> borrow their code?
Jan 27 11:05:17 <n0ob_> johnx: its the example in the esbox called eclipse
Jan 27 11:06:38 <johnx> I don't have the vmware sdk, just the normal debian/scratchbox sdk, so I'm not sure...but eclipse is the name of IDE...
Jan 27 11:10:43 <n0ob_> ok johnx i will try to dig deeper
Jan 27 11:11:42 <crashanddie> johnx, I'm going to finish the gpsd proxy today :)
Jan 27 11:15:15 <michele> is there any way to use the icons of the stock applications in my own?
Jan 27 11:15:27 <michele> like the folders, the arrows
Jan 27 11:15:44 <michele> they don't seem to be gtk stock icons
Jan 27 11:15:56 <michele> (and this sucks, if I may)
Jan 27 11:16:17 <johnx> are you trying to reference them by file name? or do something more clever/automatic?
Jan 27 11:16:38 <michele> well, I'd like to do it as nicely as possible
Jan 27 11:17:05 <michele> but just the file name would be a start
Jan 27 11:17:26 <johnx> so which program shows these files that you're interested in?
Jan 27 11:17:42 <michele> the file manager, the pdf reader, notes
Jan 27 11:18:49 <K-Fox> what is the a rapid pdf reader ?
Jan 27 11:19:46 <crashanddie> michele, did you take a look at /usr/share/icons ?
Jan 27 11:20:01 <michele> looking now
Jan 27 11:21:35 <michele> that aside, am I the only one that actually likes the N810 pouch colors? :)
Jan 27 11:21:54 <crashanddie> define pouch colors
Jan 27 11:22:10 <johnx> well here I was going to make a nice one-liner script with lsof and grep to show which icons are in use...but it pulls them from icon-theme.cache
Jan 27 11:22:10 <melmoth> awfull grey with worst blue inside
Jan 27 11:22:10 <lcuk> michele, i would like the colors, but my missus lost the pouch on the first day she borrowed it
Jan 27 11:22:14 <zuh> michele: I wouldn't say that in public if I were you :P
Jan 27 11:22:30 <K-Fox> Fedora 8 now available for Nokia tablets!
Jan 27 11:22:36 <K-Fox> this is true?
Jan 27 11:22:38 <lcuk> i cant take 810 anywhere :(
Jan 27 11:22:49 <crashanddie> wow
Jan 27 11:22:55 <michele> johnx: so I'd say they actually are registered as stock icons, just with different names than gtk
Jan 27 11:23:42 <johnx> K-Fox, link?
Jan 27 11:24:03 <johnx> or do you just mean that there is a Fedora port to the ARM architecture?
Jan 27 11:24:23 <K-Fox> http://www.internettablettalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=15433&highlight=shot <-----
Jan 27 11:24:25 <lcuk> john, ive heard of ppl compiling it and running on 8x0
Jan 27 11:24:44 <n0ob_> is there any how to use the scratchbox?
Jan 27 11:25:10 <crashanddie> n0ob_, why would you need a how-to ?
Jan 27 11:25:14 <lcuk> noob i have had probs using it
Jan 27 11:25:18 <crashanddie> it's fairly self explanatory
Jan 27 11:25:40 <johnx> n0ob_, lots of howtos on maemo.org and a readme on the same site you got the vmware maemo sdk from
Jan 27 11:25:43 <lcuk> readme glosses over lots of things and for a none linux ninja its heeavy going
Jan 27 11:26:22 <michele> zuh: I don't really see the problem with the colors... better than always the same dull black or dark gray
Jan 27 11:26:47 <|tbb|> if i cant kill the network connection,failed dialog is it possible to hit cancel by sending keystrokes to it via dbus or so?
Jan 27 11:26:58 <lcuk> ive got helloworld compiled and onto 810 but it was luck more than an ything and i cant get my own project running
Jan 27 11:27:10 <crashanddie> |tbb|, you can't kill it ? Like in kill -9 PID ?
Jan 27 11:28:20 * lcuk is evaluating other options which dont involve emulated zephyr testing, its not reqd for me 
Jan 27 11:28:29 <Luria> kill -9 is fun
Jan 27 11:28:42 <Luria> killall on solaris is more fun
Jan 27 11:28:58 <Luria> wow. im sorry, just a bit loopy at 6:30am
Jan 27 11:30:37 <lcuk> did luria kill himself?
Jan 27 11:33:44 <proteous> so tragic
Jan 27 11:33:51 <n0ob_> i think this is really hard for non coders with low experience
Jan 27 11:34:19 <michele> johnx: it sounds like they are way behind your work, and don't plan to improve very much unless somebody comes up to work on the tablets
Jan 27 11:35:01 <johnx> michele, heh. and it turns out I was way behind someone else's work too
Jan 27 11:35:12 <michele> johnx: really?
Jan 27 11:35:15 <lcuk> noob, you can get coding quickly with python.  dont lose heart
Jan 27 11:35:37 <targaryen> michele, did you ever find out what was causing those pkg-config errors compiling evince? I'm getting the same ones
Jan 27 11:35:48 <lcuk> its like methadone compared to full code, but you can get resultts  quickly
Jan 27 11:35:56 <johnx> n0ob_, you might want to start out programming on something more straightforward
Jan 27 11:36:04 <michele> n0ob_: have you read the tutorial? http://maemo.org/development/documentation/tutorials/maemo_4-0_tutorial.html
Jan 27 11:36:09 <michele> n0ob_: that will give you some context, at least
Jan 27 11:36:16 <johnx> n0ob_, start with some python, and then move onto python with gtk
Jan 27 11:36:29 <targaryen> to pickup on a coversation from 11 days ago, anyway..
Jan 27 11:36:55 <|tbb|> johnx do you know how to send the escape character trough dbus?
Jan 27 11:37:04 <johnx> |tbb|, no idea
Jan 27 11:37:07 <michele> targaryen: which errors? I found that most things are ok if you dpkg-buildpakage instead of using make
Jan 27 11:37:16 <johnx> I don't know much about dbus...but I'll probably have to learn it soon
Jan 27 11:37:33 <lcuk> john/michele, i found the same problems, coding inside a foreign vmwar box, then within anotther magic scratchbox and it just gets overwhelming
Jan 27 11:37:50 <michele> targaryen: you need the right options to configure
Jan 27 11:37:51 <johnx> cross development is not easy
Jan 27 11:37:59 * michele off preparing lunch
Jan 27 11:38:05 <targaryen> I'll give that a try, thanks a lot
Jan 27 11:38:13 <lcuk> i am in process offinding a simpler root and documenting as i go
Jan 27 11:38:34 <michele> johnx: who was ahead of you then?
Jan 27 11:38:55 <johnx> michele, yeah. The guys packaging the maemo stuff for debian have more things working, but its easy enough to just go with there stuff and add anything I can fix
Jan 27 11:39:02 <lcuk> john, for my pda it was simple.  same dev env as native and just run code.  it all workeeed.
Jan 27 11:39:03 <johnx> they've been really helpful
Jan 27 11:39:30 <michele> johnx: that's great, now all we need is some easy way to install it
Jan 27 11:39:37 <michele> or some docs..
Jan 27 11:39:53 <johnx> I have something up on the wiki...but don't bother with it right now
Jan 27 11:39:56 <lcuk> wooohooo luria is back from death
Jan 27 11:40:09 <lcuk> kill must be temporary ;)
Jan 27 11:40:11 <johnx> in a couple days all the stuff on the wiki will be quite obsolete
Jan 27 11:40:17 <Luria> hehe
Jan 27 11:40:20 <johnx> (as far as debian goes)
Jan 27 11:40:27 <Luria> no, just got sick of xfce
Jan 27 11:40:33 <lcuk> lol
Jan 27 11:40:38 <michele> johnx: I won't right now, I just think it's a good job
Jan 27 11:40:46 <Luria> i have a big apt-get going on right now
Jan 27 11:40:56 <johnx> and as for install it will always be "untar this onto sd card, boot it"
Jan 27 11:41:13 <johnx> until someone makes a nice boot from sd install script
Jan 27 11:41:15 <lcuk> noob,  what devevlopment are you used to doing
Jan 27 11:42:02 * michele *really* off to lunch
Jan 27 11:42:28 <Luria> good eating
Jan 27 11:42:31 <lcuk> enjoy it
Jan 27 11:42:37 <lcuk> nom nom nom nom
Jan 27 11:43:03 * Luria looks forward to kde
Jan 27 11:43:25 <johnx> KDE on a tablet? or KDE4 on desktop?
Jan 27 11:43:31 <lcuk> i like xfce - makes older computers run faster :)
Jan 27 11:43:36 <Luria> on an eee
Jan 27 11:43:43 <johnx> xfce+wmaker rocks on old computers
Jan 27 11:44:15 <Luria> right now xfce+minimal gnome lib+compiz
Jan 27 11:44:24 <lcuk> isn t new kde4 cross platform?
Jan 27 11:44:42 <Luria> supposedy
Jan 27 11:44:53 <Luria> ive seen the screenshots of kate under windows
Jan 27 11:44:59 <lcuk> my boss might suddenly get interested if it looks good
Jan 27 11:45:12 <lcuk> yer, there was an article from slash about it
Jan 27 11:45:14 <johnx> it's nice to see open source software invading the windows desktop :)
Jan 27 11:45:33 <lcuk> openoffice/firefox/gimp ??? its already there
Jan 27 11:45:46 <Luria> meh gimp
Jan 27 11:45:53 <johnx> and pidgin
Jan 27 11:45:53 <lcuk> just an example
Jan 27 11:45:55 <Luria> pirate photoshop
Jan 27 11:45:57 <lcuk> python
Jan 27 11:46:00 <lcuk> eclipse
Jan 27 11:46:07 <johnx> I like gimp
Jan 27 11:46:08 <Luria> eclipse ugh
Jan 27 11:46:16 <johnx> I actually prefer gimp to photoshop
Jan 27 11:46:19 <johnx> but I started on gimp
Jan 27 11:46:25 <lcuk> we have agents everywhere, watching, waiting - preparing themselves
Jan 27 11:46:26 <Luria> i like to be able to print
Jan 27 11:46:37 <Luria> which gimp doesnt do
Jan 27 11:46:44 <johnx> really
Jan 27 11:46:50 <Luria> (cmyk)
Jan 27 11:46:56 <johnx> ah
Jan 27 11:47:03 <johnx> I was about to say "must have had some terribly vivid hallucinations..."
Jan 27 11:47:03 <Luria> last i checked, at least
Jan 27 11:47:30 <K-Fox> it can use the gimp on n8xx?
Jan 27 11:47:45 <Luria> whats the point of my color calibrated lacie monitor, after all, if i cant go subtractive?
Jan 27 11:47:53 <lcuk> im sure if you hold your arms the right way whilst looking north with your dog on your shoulders then you might be able to see a cups printer and save as directly to the printer memory, but of course noone thinks of these things when just pritning
Jan 27 11:48:25 <Luria> still wouldnt help with the color correction
Jan 27 11:48:57 <johnx> Luria, you're right. Gimp isn't a replacement for photoshop in high-end shops yet. It is a replacement for photoshop on a lot of end users desks who just want to touch something up and print it on their ink jet
Jan 27 11:48:58 <lcuk> has anyone reported it
Jan 27 11:49:02 <Luria> gimp is fine for photo -> web, tho.
Jan 27 11:49:19 <lcuk> its a FREE alternative for people who want to run software legally.
Jan 27 11:49:27 <lcuk> who dont need it for work
Jan 27 11:49:35 <Luria> im not a high end shop, just an amateur photographer
Jan 27 11:49:40 <Veggen> yah, isn't photoshop very much pirated?
Jan 27 11:49:55 <lcuk> yer, but thats the point, its pirated
Jan 27 11:50:00 <Luria> yeah :-)
Jan 27 11:50:02 <Veggen> exactly.
Jan 27 11:50:12 <Luria> probably 2nd most after windows
Jan 27 11:50:29 <lcuk> i had a long discussion with a guy at work, he said @linux will never take off, the microsoft are great@   i stopped him in his tracks when i asked him how much he paid for office 2007
Jan 27 11:50:31 <Luria> brb, kde time.
Jan 27 11:51:01 <lcuk> openoffice is free and legal without and hoops to jump through and for the few docs people do at home its enough
Jan 27 11:51:16 <johnx> Linux also solves a couple vendor lock-in issues rather nicely
Jan 27 11:51:28 <johnx> which is where people will get really interested I think
Jan 27 11:52:00 <lcuk> yes, with MS trying to shift away from their almost standard format its gonna get good
Jan 27 11:52:14 <johnx> ooxml is a mine field
Jan 27 11:52:21 <johnx> thankfully people are actually realizing it
Jan 27 11:53:03 <lcuk> i think MS are shooting themselves in the foot changing everything (not for the better) people are in a mood for retraining, why put the extra money into MS at that point if there are OS alternatives which for the same training give complete openness
Jan 27 11:53:21 <johnx> yeah
Jan 27 11:53:56 <johnx> but they're stuck between a rock and a hard place
Jan 27 11:54:01 <lcuk> this nokia device has been good for me (no matter how difficult it has been to setup dev wise so far) because it means i can show them linux and run around all the stuff
Jan 27 11:54:39 <johnx> don't change things and mac os x and linux will outpace them, do change things and "retraining" and "backwards compatibility" start to even out WRT Linux and Mac
Jan 27 11:54:49 <lcuk> its no longer just a part time thing, i have paid out the money and am determined to get it working
Jan 27 11:55:09 <|tbb|> could anyone explain me how match expressions work on dbus-monitor?
Jan 27 11:55:14 <lcuk> absolutely
Jan 27 11:55:25 <lcuk> damn, lost my stylus
Jan 27 11:55:36 <johnx> I never had one :/
Jan 27 11:55:40 * lcuk has wires all around from usb keyboard
Jan 27 11:55:45 <lcuk> :( john
Jan 27 11:55:58 <johnx> floor model
Jan 27 11:56:01 <crashanddie> I have no wires on my bluetooth keyboard :D
Jan 27 11:56:07 <lcuk> any response from nokia or have you not sent yet
Jan 27 11:56:16 <lcuk> crash, its a good reason to get one i think
Jan 27 11:56:25 <crashanddie> yeah, it definitely is
Jan 27 11:56:40 <crashanddie> I never got around hooking it up on my n810 though
Jan 27 11:56:42 <lcuk> i may just consider it, i just wanted to see how usb worked on 810
Jan 27 11:56:43 <crashanddie> I just can't be arsed
Jan 27 11:56:58 <johnx> not sent yet, it's workable for now
Jan 27 11:57:05 <crashanddie> you using a usb keyboard on the 810 ?
Jan 27 11:57:12 <lcuk> just give it a light touch john
Jan 27 11:57:18 <lcuk> stroke it gently :P
Jan 27 11:57:24 <crashanddie> sending what to nokia ?
Jan 27 11:57:32 <crashanddie> Do you guys actually get answers from them?
Jan 27 11:59:19 <lcuk>  with bt keyboard on your knee, do you have pda above it or below it?
Jan 27 11:59:29 <lcuk> crash, ive not needed to speak to them yet
Jan 27 11:59:41 <johnx> crashanddie, my digitizer has gone spastic...haven't contacted them yet
Jan 27 12:00:00 <crashanddie> hmm
Jan 27 12:00:16 <crashanddie> lcuk, like I said, never hooked the bt keyboard to the n810 yet
Jan 27 12:00:19 <crashanddie> don't see the point
Jan 27 12:00:22 <crashanddie> at least, for now
Jan 27 12:00:36 <lcuk> but what do you use your bt keyboard on?
Jan 27 12:00:44 <crashanddie> laptop
Jan 27 12:00:57 <crashanddie> my laptop is my transportable desktop, basically
Jan 27 12:01:03 <lcuk> i like the 810 keyboard, but when im doing major work a full board is best
Jan 27 12:01:31 <crashanddie> I like to have my screen quite far away, and have an uncluttered desktop, so I hooked up bt keyboard to it
Jan 27 12:01:36 <lcuk> with full linux on nokia, it should replace everything :)
Jan 27 12:01:58 <crashanddie> what I miss in the tablet
Jan 27 12:01:59 <lcuk> nokia isnt possible, my eyes need zoom functionality and the only way i can do that is moving it closer
Jan 27 12:02:06 <crashanddie> is a stock fullgrown agenda software
Jan 27 12:02:24 <lcuk> is there one for your fav linux distro?
Jan 27 12:02:34 <crashanddie> I dunno
Jan 27 12:02:44 <crashanddie> might write one in fact, if I get around it
Jan 27 12:02:56 <crashanddie> ossogenda :)
Jan 27 12:03:05 <lcuk> have a look if there is a gtk one and it shouldnt take too much shoehorning to get it in
Jan 27 12:03:28 <crashanddie> yeah, I will
Jan 27 12:03:40 <lcuk> im gonna do a small shared tasks/notes system between my desktop and device
Jan 27 12:03:41 <crashanddie> but well, stock one on the OS would've been nice, well integrated in stuff
Jan 27 12:03:47 <crashanddie> like integrated with the contact list etc
Jan 27 12:03:49 <lcuk> ive had enough of needing links on one or the other
Jan 27 12:04:18 <Luria> yay kde
Jan 27 12:04:33 <lcuk> on tablet?
Jan 27 12:04:34 <crashanddie> so you can just say, that day, that hour, with those persons, and if you need to share something, just hit the email button, and it opens a new draft with the emails of all people you had a meeting with
Jan 27 12:04:54 <Luria> lcuk, on my eee. we discussed this. keep up :-)
Jan 27 12:05:14 <lcuk> lol you are right
Jan 27 12:05:23 <lcuk> have you done any hardhacks with it yet?
Jan 27 12:05:31 <lcuk> ive heard people are really doing lots with them
Jan 27 12:05:55 <Luria> they are
Jan 27 12:05:57 <lcuk> and ive also heard the next gen eee should have a bit bigger *touchscreen*
Jan 27 12:05:58 <Luria> im deciding what too do
Jan 27 12:06:01 <lcuk> it might then become dreamy
Jan 27 12:06:22 <Luria> bt, touchscreen, hdd, i think is what im going to doo
Jan 27 12:06:37 <Luria> or more likely, internal cf
Jan 27 12:06:41 <lcuk> ive got an old windows laptop under the bed with a hacked on touchpanel under its screen
Jan 27 12:07:06 <Luria> i could never get my panasonic cf-m34
Jan 27 12:07:17 <Luria> 's touchscreen to work under linux
Jan 27 12:08:08 <lcuk> mine was all hacked under windows and worked quite well.  only problem was, panel was smaller than screen so i had to customise the front end programs
Jan 27 12:08:14 <Luria> omg does 3.5 look better than xfce
Jan 27 12:08:30 <lcuk> it gave me enough incentive to spend some money on a real device
Jan 27 12:08:43 <Luria> ugh
Jan 27 12:08:52 <Luria> pick up a cf-m34 off ebay
Jan 27 12:08:57 <Luria> great machines
Jan 27 12:09:18 <Luria> cf-19 new if you have the cash :-)
Jan 27 12:09:57 <lcuk> oh crap
Jan 27 12:10:00 <lcuk> internet just died!first crash ive
Jan 27 12:10:00 <lcuk> had with it
Jan 27 12:10:21 <Luria> internet didnt die, it just beat you.
Jan 27 12:10:33 <Luria> the boss levels are hard, i admit.
Jan 27 12:11:03 <lcuk> lol
Jan 27 12:11:43 <lcuk> damn, i know what it was - its the Resize to width of page.  it makes NIT freeze
Jan 27 12:12:21 <johnx> hmm...I think that's my power supply's way of telling me it doesn't love me anymore
Jan 27 12:12:27 <Luria> btw, compiz is really handy on small form factors
Jan 27 12:12:48 <lcuk> compiz would be nice on NIT but for lack of 3d
Jan 27 12:13:31 <Luria> amen.
Jan 27 12:14:19 <johnx> short on RAM, CPU and GPU power really...even if the powerVR it has could work
Jan 27 12:15:00 <Luria> i dunno, xfce+compiz and a couple of lightweight apps = 64mb ram
Jan 27 12:15:15 <Luria> more a vram issue and cpu issue
Jan 27 12:15:26 <lcuk> luria,luria, those toughbooks = old touchscreen laptops arent they
Jan 27 12:15:33 <lcuk> -luria
Jan 27 12:15:44 <Luria> most, yes
Jan 27 12:15:54 <johnx> those things are awesome
Jan 27 12:16:01 <johnx> I really want one to play with
Jan 27 12:16:09 <Luria> cf-m34 = 400-933mhz (depends on model) 8.4" touchscreen
Jan 27 12:16:22 <lcuk> hmmm and for the price they look on ebay that looks nice
Jan 27 12:16:35 <Luria> i have used it in the rain (i bought a sealed backlit membrane keyboard)
Jan 27 12:16:43 <lcuk> i only ever saw touchscreen laps in the 100s of pounds range
Jan 27 12:16:48 <lcuk> guess my foo wasnt on
Jan 27 12:16:49 <Luria> if you can -
Jan 27 12:16:51 <lcuk> thanks for the tip
Jan 27 12:17:01 <Luria> find one with dual minipci
Jan 27 12:17:05 <Luria> they are rare
Jan 27 12:17:15 <oil> uh. I managed to get the maemo-mapper -> mysql -> other maemo-mapper POI sync working. http://oil.iki.fi/maemo/maemo-mapper-poi-sync.html
Jan 27 12:17:20 <Luria> there are also very rare pentium m models
Jan 27 12:17:41 <lcuk> the touch i have below me was all for free, at the time money was tight and it was just confirming that it was wanted
Jan 27 12:17:44 <oil> nice part of the mm is that it will read the poi-database when the map moves.
Jan 27 12:18:02 <lcuk> oil, nice one!
Jan 27 12:18:21 <lcuk> is this from an onboard sql database or from a central server?
Jan 27 12:18:42 <oil> lcuk: thanks. if you try it, it might be better to backup the poi first :)
Jan 27 12:19:07 <oil> it's running on my wlan router
Jan 27 12:19:28 <lcuk> oil, its rare i take this out, so the chances of me getting it running myself is low but its always good to see improvements to our common app source :)
Jan 27 12:20:35 <Luria> http://www.product-reviews.net/wp-content/userimages/2007/02/tbtoughbook.jpg
Jan 27 12:20:51 <oil> lcuk: some day someone could make this work with wget-post and make an central server where to store the pois
Jan 27 12:20:54 <Luria> from iraq :-)
Jan 27 12:21:34 <Luria> http://www.mavromatic.com/images/PANASONIC-BULLETPROOF-TOUGH.jpg
Jan 27 12:21:39 <lcuk> luria, it looks tough ;) i gather apart from the cosmetic it will still work
Jan 27 12:21:52 <Luria> the lcd part held the bullet
Jan 27 12:22:11 <Luria> it passed through an unarmored hummer door
Jan 27 12:22:38 <Luria> the guy had the laptop wedged between his thigh and the gear shifter
Jan 27 12:22:47 <lcuk> thats the definition of wardriving
Jan 27 12:22:50 <Luria> and the bullet hit the computer
Jan 27 12:23:26 <darkip> quick question, is there any easy way to download all the UK maps for maemo mapper?
Jan 27 12:24:06 <crashanddie> Luria, lucky guy
Jan 27 12:24:19 <Luria> very
Jan 27 12:24:24 <lcuk> dark, i think there is a program to grab them all, but usually you get a smaller segment, it will take a long time and take a large amount of space to get such a large range
Jan 27 12:24:45 <lcuk> i think you can get them for specific routes simpler (from what i read in here)
Jan 27 12:24:53 <Luria> still, he took one shot to the shoulder, it was a two pronged ambush
Jan 27 12:25:01 <Luria> but he survived
Jan 27 12:25:09 <lcuk> he should have forked the process
Jan 27 12:25:18 <crashanddie> I'd rather take one in the shoulder than in the leg, if you ask me
Jan 27 12:25:22 <lcuk> lcd on one side keyboard on the other
Jan 27 12:25:25 <darkip> ah ok
Jan 27 12:26:20 <darkip> and also, it's not possible to plan a route without an internet connection is it?
Jan 27 12:26:20 <Luria> yeah, me too. no femural artery in the shoulder.
Jan 27 12:26:21 <crashanddie> I can live with only one arm, I doubt I'd be as happy with only one leg
Jan 27 12:26:23 <lcuk> im not sure dark, have you had a look on internettablettalk forum - they have discussions about mapping etc all the time
Jan 27 12:26:34 <lcuk> i couldnt live without my ARM now
Jan 27 12:27:19 <johnx> darkip, yes, maemo mapper needs to be able to access the internet to do routing
Jan 27 12:27:41 <Luria> the other thing about it is, it was designed to go in dashboard mounts, so the lcd goes all the way back, which can be more useful than you think
Jan 27 12:27:43 <lcuk> have you read about the soldier who lost both legs below the knee and now has a pair of bluetooth feet which communicate and help to keep him upright
Jan 27 12:28:11 <darkip> are there any free alternatives which do?
Jan 27 12:28:24 <Luria> yeah, we all read /.
Jan 27 12:28:48 <crashanddie> darkip, maemo mapper uses web servers in order to create routes, hence the required internet connectivity
Jan 27 12:29:37 <crashanddie> darkip, I don't think there are any free alternatives that do a good job , honnestly
Jan 27 12:29:56 <darkip> ah, well cheers anyway :)
Jan 27 12:30:06 <johnx> darkip, navit.sf.net
Jan 27 12:30:15 <johnx> haven't looked at it recently though
Jan 27 12:30:31 <darkip> i didn't think there was a port available yet?
Jan 27 12:30:51 <johnx> ah, maybe not
Jan 27 12:32:25 <lcuk> has anyone got the full paid for mapper, and if so is it worth it
Jan 27 12:32:43 <darkip> well, i've tried the trial...
Jan 27 12:32:55 <lcuk> what did you think
Jan 27 12:33:00 <darkip> i was working on reverse engineering the registration process but didn't get far
Jan 27 12:33:23 <Luria> wayfinder is embarrasingly bad
Jan 27 12:33:27 <darkip> it was ok, i was using the built in GPS in my n810
Jan 27 12:33:35 <darkip> which takes FOREVER to aquire a signal
Jan 27 12:33:57 <darkip> but on more positive notes, apparently you can compile navit for n800 - http://wiki.navit-project.org/index.php/Navit_on_n770/n800
Jan 27 12:34:10 <lcuk> dark, 810 is bad at getting signal for us if we sit it in cradle, if its on girlfriends lap it aquires much quicker
Jan 27 12:34:15 <lcuk> i think orientation helps
Jan 27 12:34:50 <darkip> i only had my grandpa in the car
Jan 27 12:34:52 <johnx> maybe it just likes your girlfriend?
Jan 27 12:34:54 <|tbb|> hats the difference between  run-standalone.sh dbus-send or dbus-send alone
Jan 27 12:34:55 <darkip> i was at a disadvantage obviously
Jan 27 12:34:56 <darkip> ;)
Jan 27 12:35:00 <lcuk> lol thinking that
Jan 27 12:35:12 <Luria> oh wow
Jan 27 12:35:16 <darkip> ?
Jan 27 12:35:18 <johnx> better watch out in case it starts making any moves. I mean do you have a slick metal finish or a pull-out keyboard?
Jan 27 12:35:20 <lcuk> try it with a nubile young lady and it will ping instantly
Jan 27 12:35:25 <Luria> ive been looking for something just like that
Jan 27 12:35:32 <lcuk> hey she threatened me yesterday
Jan 27 12:35:32 <Luria> nav for x86 linux
Jan 27 12:35:59 <darkip> yep..
Jan 27 12:36:04 <darkip> i might have a try and compiling it
Jan 27 12:36:23 <|tbb|> s/hats/whats/
Jan 27 12:36:24 <infobot> |tbb| meant: whats the difference between  run-standalone.sh dbus-send or dbus-send alone
Jan 27 12:37:00 <lcuk> run standalone is intended only for the scratchbox environment i think tbb
Jan 27 12:37:11 <|tbb|> ah k
Jan 27 12:37:21 <lcuk> if you are running on the device itself you dont need it
Jan 27 12:37:41 <lcuk> i know for gtk apps if you dont run standalone it doesnt hildonize it and it looks crap
Jan 27 12:38:01 <lcuk> if you run-standalone then it does the extra i think
Jan 27 12:38:29 <lcuk> but i hate scratchpox with a passion now (i might learn to love it eventually) so try to not run in emulated
Jan 27 12:39:18 <|tbb|> lcuk: have you noticed for what im looking for about two-three hours -> a way to close the network connection failed dialog, do you know how i can send an escape to this modal dialog or how to close it in another case
Jan 27 12:40:41 <lcuk> tbb, i hope you cannot interupt the network dialogs - it should be under the entire control of the human user.  not even root should be able to manage them.   but thats personal opinion and i just dont know
Jan 27 12:41:12 <lcuk> i have a bugbear at the moment that i think 810 is re-starting a network connection without permission from me, so anything trying to circumvent the network dialogs is bad
Jan 27 12:41:56 <lcuk> does this dialog only come up if the user has actually selected a network
Jan 27 12:42:11 <crashanddie> I've had my battery drained a few times because some app tried to access the interwebs, and it kept searching for wifi for a few hours in my jacket
Jan 27 12:42:35 <|tbb|> lcuk: likely yes
Jan 27 12:42:40 <lcuk> crash, exactly - i have mine set to @always ask@
Jan 27 12:43:31 <lcuk> tbb, if thats the case and the network fails just let the user handle it
Jan 27 12:43:31 <crashanddie> yeah, I guess I should set it to that too
Jan 27 12:43:33 <Luria> ok, bed time
Jan 27 12:43:33 <Luria> bye all
Jan 27 12:43:33 <|tbb|> oh sorry, wrong understand
Jan 27 12:43:33 <lcuk> i let the connection run forever because it doesnt seem to drain the battery too much, but when i disconnect it it should stay disconnected.
Jan 27 12:43:41 <|tbb|> the connection is started automaticly
Jan 27 12:43:51 <|tbb|> and i want stop it if it fails
Jan 27 12:43:55 <lcuk> the nokia tablet cannot be sure how much it costs me to use network, so it should NEVER connect automatically (for me at least)
Jan 27 12:43:56 <|tbb|> or try again
Jan 27 12:44:11 <lcuk> how do you mean automatically tbb?
Jan 27 12:44:14 <johnx> lcuk, I forgot if I asked this...were you in offline mode?
Jan 27 12:44:22 <|tbb|> dbus-send
Jan 27 12:44:22 <lcuk> surely its down to user preferences whether automatic is allowed
Jan 27 12:44:37 <lcuk> no john, but im set to always ask
Jan 27 12:44:53 <lcuk> tbb, you mean you say @please connect to a network@
Jan 27 12:45:12 <lcuk> damn these @@@ quote keys
Jan 27 12:45:13 <crashanddie> I didn't use the phone connection yet, should try to see if it's worth anything...
Jan 27 12:45:30 <crashanddie> You guys know it's possible to have IP over BT right ?
Jan 27 12:45:51 <lcuk> yes john, but its slower and i dont like the extra BT crap[ running on my windows box
Jan 27 12:46:02 <crashanddie> I know it's feasible with a cellphone, so I'm pretty sure it's doable with the tablet... I should write something about that though
Jan 27 12:46:13 <lcuk> using wifi is simple as the rest of my system is geared up for it
Jan 27 12:46:27 <|tbb|> yeah
Jan 27 12:46:34 <crashanddie> in other words, computer is connected to an ethernet network, and 810 surfs through BT on the laptop
Jan 27 12:47:23 <lcuk> 810 ---BT---> BTDongle->desktop ----> internet
Jan 27 12:47:43 <lcuk> 810 ---wifi---> router ---->internet
Jan 27 12:48:14 <crashanddie> lcuk, I'm talking if wifi isn't available
Jan 27 12:48:17 <lcuk> 810 ---BT---> BTDongle->desktop ----> router -----> internet
Jan 27 12:48:17 <|tbb|> is it possible to send keystrokes to the maemo desktop
Jan 27 12:48:35 <lcuk> crash, i agree it can work if thats whats available
Jan 27 12:48:54 <crashanddie> also, I might get myself an ethernet to usb adapter and try to get that to work with the 810
Jan 27 12:48:58 <crashanddie> would be nice though
Jan 27 12:49:25 <johnx> |tbb|, look for "fake keystroke x11"
Jan 27 12:49:27 <lcuk> wifi USB dongle works great - thats what i use here, the router is work connection.
Jan 27 12:49:41 <lcuk> set the computer to use ad-hoc mode
Jan 27 12:49:48 <johnx> but something like wmctrl would be better I think
Jan 27 12:49:52 <lcuk> its nice and quick :)
Jan 27 12:50:11 <crashanddie> lcuk, agreed
Jan 27 12:51:05 <lcuk> the only one i couldnt get working was my phone connection - its got 3g super data stream or something, but the phone isnt exposing the connection
Jan 27 12:51:44 <johnx> maybe the phone doesn't do BT DUN, but BT PAN instead?
Jan 27 12:52:48 <lcuk> i dunno its only a cheapy and i pay as go, so its likely just not exposing anything.  it doesnt bother me so much, if i neededdd it i would go back to phone shop and get a nokia 3g phone and tell them to make sure it connects before i leave store
Jan 27 12:53:28 <johnx> it's sure nice being in a position to make a vendor *do something* isn't it? :)
Jan 27 12:54:18 <lcuk> nokia to nokia with bluetooth should just work, its the phone peoples jobs to know how to connect their data devices together if thats what they are selling.  if they cant do that they cant get a sale out of me
Jan 27 12:55:08 <lcuk> i can help with the specifics of this device but they need to know what settings i need to put in etc
Jan 27 12:55:22 <crashanddie> lcuk, like Johnx said, the n810 uses BT DUN, which is quite old and deprecated, most phones use BT PAN now, there are a few apps that allow phones to simulate BT DUN though
Jan 27 12:55:31 <alterego> Mine works out-of-the-box.
Jan 27 12:55:46 <alterego> Just worked, was expecting something to need to be hacked but it was really easy.
Jan 27 12:55:50 <johnx> my phone does IR, not BT :/
Jan 27 12:56:05 <crashanddie> btw
Jan 27 12:56:12 <johnx> which is good because otherwise I'd run up a terrifying data bill
Jan 27 12:56:16 <crashanddie> anyone seen the real hustlers video about cell phone hacking?
Jan 27 12:56:16 <lcuk> alterego, it works on my girlfriends nokia as well, but im not gonna rely on her connection
Jan 27 12:56:38 <crashanddie> I swear I thought it was a n770 or n800 he was using to phreak the cell phones
Jan 27 12:56:39 <lcuk> like i said, i bought the phone to make calls not for data - when i need one ill just go and make sure it works
Jan 27 12:56:45 <sxpert> crashanddie, put cell phone in plastic baggie, set to "vibrate" ?
Jan 27 12:56:47 <proteous> my pantech c150 works with bluetooth DUN to my 770
Jan 27 12:57:02 <crashanddie> sxpert, ?
Jan 27 12:57:33 <crashanddie> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dltjEnrePxc
Jan 27 12:58:30 <sxpert> ah... sorry. "Hustler" for me was erh, something else :-)
Jan 27 12:58:45 <crashanddie> yup, it's a n770
Jan 27 12:58:55 <crashanddie> 36 seconds in the video, you'll see it
Jan 27 12:59:04 <sxpert> hah... 770 spotted
Jan 27 12:59:37 <lcuk> why doesnt this work? : http://m.youtube.com/details?v=dltjEnrePxc
Jan 27 12:59:48 <lcuk> it finds the video but the codec is not supported
Jan 27 12:59:59 <lcuk> its same video and tries to play in media player
Jan 27 13:00:06 <alterego> I'm making a new soft case for my N810, out of neoprene.
Jan 27 13:00:32 <lcuk> alterego, could you make me one as well, my missus lost mine and keeps threatening to make a furry pink one
Jan 27 13:00:52 <alterego> I'll swap you!
Jan 27 13:00:56 <lcuk> lol
Jan 27 13:01:15 <lcuk> it would be self cleaning i suppose but i lose all coolness
Jan 27 13:01:21 <alterego> Hah
Jan 27 13:01:32 <lcuk> i actually liked the nokia default case but i cant buy one
Jan 27 13:01:38 <alterego> I'm also going to make a Nokia USB charger.
Jan 27 13:01:54 <alterego> I didn't the grey fake leather I thought was very cheap and tacky ..
Jan 27 13:02:09 <lcuk> hack a charger cable and put a usb plug on end
Jan 27 13:02:12 <alterego> The snug fit was great though.
Jan 27 13:02:18 <alterego> That's the idea yeah.
Jan 27 13:02:31 <alterego> I've got quite a few broken chargers I can strip.
Jan 27 13:02:44 <lcuk> yer - the thing i miss most about 810 is my old pda had a cradle
Jan 27 13:02:58 <lcuk> i could quickly just drop it in
Jan 27 13:03:40 <lcuk> mind you, it prefered usb syncing
Jan 27 13:03:56 <alterego> Yeah, not the only quick drops are when it's meandering to the pavement. 8O
Jan 27 13:04:11 <alterego> s/not/now/
Jan 27 13:04:11 <infobot> alterego meant: Yeah, now the only quick drops are when it's meandering to the pavement. 8O
Jan 27 13:04:21 * alterego kicks infobot up it's virtual ass.
Jan 27 13:05:06 <lcuk> Ouch, i dont think this nokia would survive a drop, my old pda was rugged, it took a drop down the stairs the other day - thought it was completely gone but it just fired back up
Jan 27 13:06:41 <jku> lcuk, then again the n800 doesn't look too sturdy either, but it's survived my abuse pretty well...
Jan 27 13:06:55 <lcuk> this 810 was too slippery when i got it, but ive cured that now with a big rubber stickon patch on the back
Jan 27 13:06:56 <jku> of course, no moving parts like n810
Jan 27 13:07:13 <|tbb|> is there a source available -> osso-connectivity-ui-conndlgs
Jan 27 13:07:24 <lcuk> 800 looks better than 810 for sturdyness
Jan 27 13:07:36 <b0unc3> guys, there is a 3gp support for ITOS2008 ?
Jan 27 13:08:04 <lcuk> b0unc3,  yes, i can play 3pg videos from my phone, but i cant seem to play them from m.youtube.com
Jan 27 13:08:23 <lcuk> its a shame because youtube would be much better from the mobile version
Jan 27 13:08:24 <b0unc3> lcuk: with mplayer ?
Jan 27 13:08:36 <lcuk> i hope its just a codec issue and can be rectified
Jan 27 13:08:49 <lcuk> dunno, use standard media player
Jan 27 13:09:21 <lcuk> does mplayer take over playback of mime types - it didnt seem to when i installed it before
Jan 27 13:09:42 <lcuk> tapping from file manager still opened in default mediaplayer
Jan 27 13:09:56 <lcuk> i had to use the mplayer interface to run mplayer stuff
Jan 27 13:10:44 <johnx> ah mime-types...we could have been having this conversation in 1993 and it wouldn't be much different :)
Jan 27 13:10:56 <lcuk> lol yer
Jan 27 13:11:13 <lcuk> actually, in 1993 we would be talking about the library folder in amiga wouldnt we ;)
Jan 27 13:11:24 <johnx> I was thinking win3.1
Jan 27 13:11:41 <lcuk> thankfully i missed that one :P
Jan 27 13:11:45 * johnx is hideously uncultured in terms of computing history
Jan 27 13:12:11 <lcuk> i had to use it for college stuff but never indepth - clait
Jan 27 13:12:52 * lcuk puts his fingers on his homekeys.  then takes them off again and types faster than his teachers ;)
Jan 27 13:13:23 <alterego> I was running Risc OS 3.1 back then.
Jan 27 13:13:29 <johnx> I was never any good at typing until I installed Linux
Jan 27 13:13:36 <lcuk> archy
Jan 27 13:13:45 <johnx> I still try to use tab completion in word processors if I'm tired enough
Jan 27 13:13:49 <alterego> I got a lot of practise from C programming on my RISC PC.
Jan 27 13:13:56 <alterego> Heh
Jan 27 13:14:09 <alterego> Everything should have lazy button support.
Jan 27 13:14:28 <lcuk> i saw first high color graphics on an archemedes computer
Jan 27 13:14:29 <lcuk> -typos
Jan 27 13:14:47 <Blafasel> Hmm.. Is there an easy way to compile a package for maemo as an update? Like - how long do you think does it need to get a compilation setup?
Jan 27 13:15:19 <Blafasel> (Or who can I bribe to compile iodine in a current version? Beer anyone? ;) )
Jan 27 13:15:28 <alterego> A local pub is holding retro gaming nights. I'm thinking of dusting off a BBC Electron and getting Repton, Chucky Egg et all down there :)
Jan 27 13:15:30 <johnx> shipping included?
Jan 27 13:15:34 <lcuk> Blafasel, if you have a scratchbox environment setup recompiling a program is simple, if not you need to get one setup
Jan 27 13:15:59 <Blafasel> lcuk: That's my point: Is that a task for a day or two or more something for 1-2 hours?
Jan 27 13:16:00 <johnx> Blafasel, .deb packages handle updates seemlessly. no need to do anything special.
Jan 27 13:16:19 <johnx> Blafasel, are you on debian/ubuntu or other linux or windows?
Jan 27 13:16:24 <lcuk> blaf, whats your desktop running? are you linux or windows
Jan 27 13:16:24 <Blafasel> johnx: There doesn't seem to exist a .deb for the current iodine version.. ;)
Jan 27 13:16:31 <johnx> and how much experience do you have compiling things
Jan 27 13:16:34 <jku> Blafasel, depends on your experience
Jan 27 13:16:38 <Blafasel> johnx: I have linux and windows machines, no .deb based though
Jan 27 13:16:45 <jku> could be a day or two...
Jan 27 13:17:00 <johnx> Blafasel, is this it: http://packages.debian.org/search?suite=default&section=all&arch=any&searchon=names&keywords=iodine
Jan 27 13:17:05 <johnx> ?
Jan 27 13:17:09 <lcuk> blaf, its simplest if you get the prebuilt vmware development environment, but will take time to download - its about 2GB
Jan 27 13:17:40 <Blafasel> johnx: Yes. The maemo repos that I found don't include 0.4.1 yet
Jan 27 13:18:05 <Blafasel> lcuk: Let me search for that. DL speed is not an issue. ;)
Jan 27 13:18:05 <johnx> Blafasel, this is just CLI, right?
Jan 27 13:18:10 <Blafasel> johnx: Yes
Jan 27 13:18:19 <lcuk> jku, ive been trying for almost a month now to get something workable and reproducable up and running, but then again i had no real linux experience (beyond running a few livecds and a couple of basic installs)
Jan 27 13:18:21 <Blafasel> Just a DNS tunnel tool
Jan 27 13:18:27 <johnx> and what rep has the package? any special build instructions?
Jan 27 13:18:43 <johnx> I'll give it a shot...but if it doesn't compile up first time I'm not going to do much fidgeting
Jan 27 13:19:00 * alterego thinks the N810 may be the last device that is part of a "device program".
Jan 27 13:19:03 <Blafasel> That's awesome, thanks a lot. I'm looking into that vmware image as well.
Jan 27 13:19:20 <alterego> I doubt they'll offer the N810+WiMAX in a program.
Jan 27 13:19:24 <jku> lcuk, I an imagine... scratchbox + debian packaging on top of a new OS is pretty daunting
Jan 27 13:19:37 <jku> "I can", even
Jan 27 13:19:39 <lcuk> alter, you mean we should be able to get things from the default trunk
Jan 27 13:20:06 <lcuk> jku, yer - but i am documenting everything as i go along and hope to have some docs together @from a windows perspective@
Jan 27 13:20:08 <alterego> No, that's not at all what I'm saying :P
Jan 27 13:20:31 <Blafasel> johnx: The current package (0.4.0) is from http://www.mulliner.org/nokia770/repository/ - no idea if that guy is present here or something.
Jan 27 13:23:27 <Sho_> hm, too bad that the StarDict guy seems to have disappeared; StarDict was a lot nicer than sdictviewer
Jan 27 13:23:28 <|tbb|> blasfasel normally not
Jan 27 13:25:28 <johnx> Blafasel, failing on dependencies
Jan 27 13:25:32 <johnx> I might look at it later
Jan 27 13:26:27 <lcuk> has anyone looked at mono properly.  iis it worth trying or is it not ready/too slow/unsupported?
Jan 27 13:28:22 <lcuk> holy crap!!!!! my kylie tickets arrived yesterday and i didnt open the mail
Jan 27 13:28:37 <Blafasel> johnx: Thanks a lot for trying
Jan 27 13:28:44 * lcuk almost threw it away.  i thought it was junk :S
Jan 27 13:28:49 <johnx> sure, it might not be that hard
Jan 27 13:29:21 <johnx> but I'm having a fight with sb2 and I want to get it working before I have to sleep
Jan 27 13:30:01 <lcuk> scratchbox is a total environemt that sits within a normal linux install isnt it
Jan 27 13:30:40 <LoCusF> lcuk: Miguel de Icaza ran mono on an n800 that had debian installed
Jan 27 13:31:22 <lcuk> LoCusF, but thats running monno on debian, not running mono on default maemo install
Jan 27 13:31:49 <LoCusF> lcuk: yep, but still some progress :)
Jan 27 13:32:11 <lcuk> yer i agree - at least we know it *can* work on devices
Jan 27 13:32:33 <LoCusF> lcuk: http://www.mono-project.com/Maemo
Jan 27 13:32:41 <johnx> well anything that's not too hardware dependent will run..it's just a question of how well and whether it's worth it
Jan 27 13:32:43 <lcuk> im gonna follow a simpler environment first and hope others get mono up,
Jan 27 13:33:23 <lcuk> ... cool ill have a look
Jan 27 13:34:15 <lcuk> i think though first its dinner time
Jan 27 13:34:19 <lcuk> apt-get food
Jan 27 13:34:26 <jku> Blafasel, I was building stuff and run dpkg-buildpackage on iodine (debian version). No guarantees, haven't even tested installing. http://folks.o-hand.com/jku/iodine/
Jan 27 13:34:56 <lcuk> cyas later
Jan 27 13:34:58 <Blafasel> Thanks! Let me check that
Jan 27 13:40:42 <Blafasel> Depends on adduser. Hmm..
Jan 27 13:41:06 <johnx> Blafasel, take it apart and remove the dep and fix the postinst
Jan 27 13:42:44 <Blafasel> Yep, will try. But I'm now going for the VMWare dev environment first.
Jan 27 13:43:09 <johnx> fair enough
Jan 27 13:50:27 <liri> uhmm, is there a vmware image ready with the sdk configured and stuff?
Jan 27 13:51:02 <johnx> http://maemo-sdk.garage.maemo.org/
Jan 27 13:51:23 <johnx> is there a way to add notes to infobot?
Jan 27 13:55:40 <Blafasel> Yay for vagalume, btw. Nice.
Jan 27 13:56:03 <johnx> yeah, it finally feels like I'm in the future
Jan 27 13:56:14 <Blafasel> Hm? Future?
Jan 27 13:56:31 <johnx> a radio station that plays whatever music I want wirelessly
Jan 27 13:56:51 <johnx> and it "just works"
Jan 27 13:57:29 <johnx> when the kind of thing that was in sci-fi at some point comes true I tend to think that the "future" has finally arrived
Jan 27 13:58:28 <Blafasel> Ah.. Good point. ;) I really like their service, I even subscribed to it.
Jan 27 14:03:29 <liri> do you know if it's possible to grab the n800 in europe as well?
Jan 27 14:03:57 <johnx> it depends on what part of Europe I guess, but yes it is possible in many countries
Jan 27 14:04:19 <Jaffa> Last I heard, play.com ha[sd] them fairly cheap.
Jan 27 14:04:23 <johnx> I guess you could poke at Nokia's online store to see which countries
Jan 27 14:04:45 <liri> well I only know of the popular amazon/buy/shoppping.com/circuitcity which are kinda US terrirtory
Jan 27 14:04:48 * Jaffa 's never played with last.fm. Is it really any music you want, for free, on demand? Seems a little... risky, as business models go.
Jan 27 14:04:52 <liri> umm, I'll check play.com thanks
Jan 27 14:05:04 <Jaffa> amazon.co.uk had 'em too
Jan 27 14:05:21 <johnx> Jaffa, I guess they have ads on the site
Jan 27 14:05:29 <liri> I'll check that too
Jan 27 14:05:54 <liri> "Temporarily out of stock. This item will be dispatched as soon as it arrives." on play.copm
Jan 27 14:06:04 <johnx> and to comply with copyright law and licensing it acts more like a radio than an mp3 player
Jan 27 14:06:08 <Jaffa> right
Jan 27 14:07:00 <Jaffa> Aha, iPod Touch's location technology is using a third-party service based on ESSID strengths. http://www.macrumors.com/2008/01/23/skyhooks-wi-fi-location-technology-for-iphone-ipod-touch/ - would be very cool to use in N8x0
Jan 27 14:07:15 <Blafasel> Up till now it doesn't play what you want, just something like what you want.
Jan 27 14:07:33 <Jaffa> Blafasel: ah, much like Pandora, then
Jan 27 14:07:41 <Blafasel> You couldn't choose "Artist - Track" and just listen to it, but you could tune in to "Artist" as a radio station
Jan 27 14:08:06 <Blafasel> But they are changing that model right now and now offer direct access to at least some tracks so far in a "beta".
Jan 27 14:08:41 <Blafasel> http://blog.last.fm/2008/01/23/free-the-music
Jan 27 14:09:44 <|tbb|> johnx could you compile the window control thing for chinook?
Jan 27 14:10:46 <johnx> is that a question of theory or a request to build it?
Jan 27 14:11:24 <|tbb|> second
Jan 27 14:11:58 <johnx> where do you want the deb?
Jan 27 14:12:13 <|tbb|> you can email it to me
Jan 27 14:13:05 <johnx> you'd have to tell me your email address :P
Jan 27 14:13:36 <|tbb|> r u serious ;)
Jan 27 14:13:45 <johnx> I just built it
Jan 27 14:13:57 <johnx> I'll put it on my server if you want
Jan 27 14:14:07 <johnx> it took like 30 seconds to build
Jan 27 14:14:16 <|tbb|> see pm
Jan 27 15:56:27 <|tbb|> where are you from
Jan 27 16:27:54 <alterego> I think this neoprene pouch is gonna suit my N810 a lot.
Jan 27 16:28:09 <alterego> Nokia will be happy, it has the same blue on the inside. But black on the outside :)
Jan 27 16:31:00 <fysa> anyone here using sb2 with ubuntu?  (the maemo-sdk package in their repo)
Jan 27 16:33:16 <fysa> sb2 apt-get -f install is giving me issues: debconf: DbDriver "passwords" warning: could not open /var/cache/debconf/passwords.dat: Permission denied
Jan 27 16:35:56 <fysa> almost seems like it's complaining about access outside of the rootstrap
Jan 27 16:36:17 <lcuk> fysam you in as root on your sb2?
Jan 27 16:36:22 <lcuk> not that i know anything about it
Jan 27 16:38:41 <fysa> I'm not certain how I would do that.  I run "sb2", and then if I "su" it puts me as root -- but outside the scratchbox.  i.e., apt-get update refreshes gutsy.
Jan 27 16:39:02 <fysa> I am going to ditch this and just do the old sb in a minute.
Jan 27 16:40:06 <lcuk> the only way i have had any of this working was in the vmware image
Jan 27 16:42:17 <fysa> trying ttp://repository.maemo.org/stable/4.0/maemo-scratchbox-install_4.0.sh
Jan 27 16:42:20 <fysa> h+
Jan 27 17:15:08 <jga23> is there a python library for accessing the address book?
Jan 27 17:21:30 <jku> jga23, take a look at evolution-python, I think has libebook bindings
Jan 27 17:22:02 <jku> (i don't know of osso-abook bindings specifically)
Jan 27 17:23:52 <jku> jga23, actually there are: pymaemo has python-abook
Jan 27 17:28:55 <trevarthan> hey, anyone from the canola dev team awake? Got a question for ya.
Jan 27 17:29:39 <trevarthan> Are the kinetik scrolling menu widgets open source? Can I re-use them in another application? Or are those proprietary. I really dig them.
Jan 27 17:30:10 <zerojay> That sentence makes baby Jesus cry.
Jan 27 17:31:00 <trevarthan> sigh. passive agressive. what? why?
Jan 27 17:33:18 <alterego> Neoprene N810 sleeve complete!
Jan 27 17:33:21 <alterego> And it's nice :)
Jan 27 17:33:59 <alterego> Just need two bendy metal rods.
Jan 27 17:35:11 <jga23> jku: have you tried python-abook?
Jan 27 17:36:03 <lcuk> alterego, what have you written your case in, and is it under an open source license?
Jan 27 17:39:03 <unique311> trevarthan, try #mamona
Jan 27 17:40:52 <trevarthan> unique311: why?
Jan 27 17:41:03 <trevarthan> that's a separate SDK site, right?
Jan 27 17:41:15 <unique311> the canola guys are always in there.
Jan 27 17:41:56 <trevarthan> oh. ok. cool. thanks.
Jan 27 17:43:24 <alterego> It's written in "Ye Ole Wetsuit ++"  using the needle and thread libraries.
Jan 27 17:44:44 <alterego> Oh, and it's proprietary.
Jan 27 17:45:39 <alterego> It's nice though, makes my N810 bouncy.
Jan 27 17:46:26 <alterego> I think my next model will have a zip.
Jan 27 17:46:49 <lcuk> it was suggested i grab a patch from a wetsuit to use as a backing for my 810
Jan 27 17:46:56 <lcuk> i wanted a sticky rubber back on it
Jan 27 17:47:17 <alterego> Yeah
Jan 27 17:47:23 <lcuk> i got one in the end from the only shop in the world guaranteed to stock these things: my dads garage...
Jan 27 17:47:41 <alterego> Fantastic.
Jan 27 17:48:16 <lcuk> does your case hold the device - like the original grips it
Jan 27 17:48:23 <alterego> Yes
Jan 27 17:48:32 <alterego> It keeps it inside.
Jan 27 17:48:43 <alterego> No slide out like with the N800.
Jan 27 17:48:52 <lcuk> nice
Jan 27 17:49:12 <lcuk> i bet you havent clipped a corner like the original have you :P
Jan 27 17:49:28 <lcuk> (and thats dual purpose, for you to see the throbbing, and to allow pushing it in easier
Jan 27 17:49:31 <alterego> No, but I'm thinking about it.
Jan 27 17:49:51 <alterego> Meh, it goes in and out easy enough.
Jan 27 17:50:17 <lcuk> ...and if it doesnt you can always lube it up...
Jan 27 17:52:06 <alterego> I'm thinking of adding a little pouch for mini SD cards :D
Jan 27 17:52:52 <lcuk> how many are you expecting to take?
Jan 27 17:53:16 <alterego> Just one spare really.
Jan 27 17:53:22 <alterego> 4G for maemo mapper and 4G for music.
Jan 27 17:54:41 <lcuk> wow - have you got entire globe maps
Jan 27 17:55:05 <GeneralAntilles> That's, like, 72TB, lcuk. :P
Jan 27 17:55:24 <lcuk> whats a few Tb between devices
Jan 27 17:55:24 <alterego> Yeah, 4G is barely my region ..
Jan 27 17:56:48 <lcuk> i ask because for uk maps its not even 1g
Jan 27 17:57:01 <alterego> In 2-4 years. We'll probably be able to get 1T SD cards.
Jan 27 17:57:05 <alterego> That's going to be somewhat insane.
Jan 27 17:57:20 <alterego> lcuk, You obviously don't live in the same UK I live in.
Jan 27 17:57:43 <alterego> Either that or you're talking about the inbuild "Map" application ..
Jan 27 17:57:43 <lcuk> im sure i backed it up at less than a gig
Jan 27 17:58:08 <alterego> I'm talking about Maemo Mapper, with satellite images.
Jan 27 17:58:47 <lcuk> ahhh well, thats a lot of extra data
Jan 27 18:00:37 <alterego> I might make a different version of this case. That actually has a flap, that exposes the screen and allows the keyboard to slide out.
Jan 27 18:00:43 <alterego> Might do that next weekend.
Jan 27 18:01:12 <lcuk> i think thats gonna be tough to do
Jan 27 18:01:43 <pupnik_> is there a maemo app that lets me see satellite pics with gps location?
Jan 27 18:01:43 <lcuk> good luck with it thou - if you make it, ill post you a pint of beer if you post me the original v1 case ;)
Jan 27 18:01:58 <alterego> pupnik_, maemo mapper ..
Jan 27 18:02:07 <alterego> Like I've been saying for the last 20 minutes :P
Jan 27 18:02:09 <pupnik_> mmk.  i just have default gps app
Jan 27 18:02:21 <pupnik_> sorry i'm fighting vmware
Jan 27 18:02:30 * lcuk is as well
Jan 27 18:02:50 * lcuk is trying to make anjuta stop being his bitch
Jan 27 18:03:09 <fysa> I think there's a race going on between ubiquitous connectivity and personal storage capacity.  Eventually all digital cameras will have the option to instantly store images online and we will have pocketable devices that can mount networked shares as fast as they could an SD.
Jan 27 18:03:40 <lcuk> SD will just become buffer memory
Jan 27 18:03:43 <GeneralAntilles> Ha
Jan 27 18:04:02 <naba> lcuk: I might be able to help you.
Jan 27 18:04:41 <spirytusick> fysa: I suppose at that time the distinction between networking and local storage will loose its meaning
Jan 27 18:05:09 <fysa> precisely
Jan 27 18:05:38 <GeneralAntilles> Maybe
Jan 27 18:05:43 <spirytusick> fysa: 2-4 years is a bit optimistic though. I suppose 10-12 will be more like it
Jan 27 18:05:43 <lcuk> hmmm naba.  i'll tell you where i am at.  i have the maemo vmware image.  i have installed anjuta, it looks great and reminds me of days gone by :) ..   i see the anjuta plugin but i cant get it installed.  http://anjuta-maemo.garage.maemo.org/
Jan 27 18:05:44 <GeneralAntilles> But data's just gonna get bigger, too.
Jan 27 18:06:00 <fysa> on the longest timeline, networked storage has one major thing going against it -- latency.
Jan 27 18:06:09 <fysa> the speed of light.
Jan 27 18:06:26 <pupnik_> am I silly for wanting to get bridged networking going in the vmware appliance?  what are you using?
Jan 27 18:06:34 <lcuk> i think its because the plugin expects anjuta 2.3, but from the install list on vmware only 2.2.0 is available
Jan 27 18:06:38 <alterego> The government will keep all our storage, using our RFID identity cards we can access them through any device,
Jan 27 18:06:46 <naba> lcuk: Make sure anjuta version you are installing is >= 2.3.0, because the maemo plugin requires that.
Jan 27 18:06:52 <GeneralAntilles> 5-years assuming doubling every year.
Jan 27 18:06:56 <fysa> yes, data is going to get bigger.  But if the network gets faster, data can get bigger and simultaneously less ubiquitous.
Jan 27 18:06:58 <alterego> Oh, and they don't need permission to look through our files or even raid our homes for data seizure.
Jan 27 18:07:00 <spirytusick> alterego: thank you, I would pass on that
Jan 27 18:07:08 <GeneralAntilles> and that doesn't provide for big tech jumps which occur every so often.
Jan 27 18:07:10 <naba> lcuk: Unfortunately, the plugin does not complain if you have lower version (I mentioned it to the author).
Jan 27 18:07:10 <fysa> i.e., if I had gigabit DSL/cablemodem..
Jan 27 18:07:15 <lcuk> naba, will grab it from their site directly then, brb
Jan 27 18:07:28 <fysa> I would open my RAID server up to friends.
Jan 27 18:07:42 <GeneralAntilles> alterego, nah, it's all backed up to the <isn't government organization here> automatically.
Jan 27 18:07:44 <fysa> and they could access it just as quickly as I could.
Jan 27 18:07:45 <spirytusick> GeneralAntilles: Bit tech jumps will most likely be stalled by the big telco companies...
Jan 27 18:07:50 <GeneralAntilles> s/isn't/insert/
Jan 27 18:07:51 <infobot> GeneralAntilles meant: alterego, nah, it's all backed up to the <insert government organization here> automatically.
Jan 27 18:08:02 <alterego> Heh
Jan 27 18:08:49 <fysa> netboot-over-internet.
Jan 27 18:09:01 <fysa> Point your 'BIOS' to ubuntu.org and you're in.
Jan 27 18:09:09 <GeneralAntilles> No thanks.
Jan 27 18:09:35 <fysa> $HOME mounted from Google Drive
Jan 27 18:10:01 <spirytusick> fysa: all the mallware will have a single infection point
Jan 27 18:10:20 <alterego> When you think of those classic computer users, that all they do is browse the web and email. Well, that's already all on a server somewhere anyhow ..
Jan 27 18:10:22 <fysa> that is a good thing.
Jan 27 18:10:25 <alterego> What do they need personal storage for?
Jan 27 18:10:40 <fysa> I would prefer to have Canonical maintain my 'personal' Ubuntu installation.
Jan 27 18:10:46 <fysa> and then I get to install 'packages' into $HOME
Jan 27 18:11:10 <fysa> then I can be at any computer, anymore, and access my workplace desktop.
Jan 27 18:11:14 <fysa> er, anywhere.
Jan 27 18:12:07 <spirytusick> fysa: looks beautifuly, let's wait to see how much the bandwidth prices will fall down
Jan 27 18:12:20 <fysa> hardware manufacturers sell 'form factors' of open-ended designs that you turn into appliances by pointing them at a web site.
Jan 27 18:12:24 <alterego> I might make a new home on an 8G mini SD when they eventually appear.
Jan 27 18:13:03 <fysa> yes, bandwidth is the key. :)
Jan 27 18:13:31 <Jaffa> And ubiquity
Jan 27 18:13:32 <spirytusick> fysa: bandwidth and latency
Jan 27 18:13:33 <alterego> I still think capacity is important.
Jan 27 18:13:41 <fysa> I threw together a quick nzbfs ("usenet" filesystem)
Jan 27 18:13:45 <Jaffa> Don't want to not be able to boot my device in the Channel Tunnel
Jan 27 18:13:51 <alterego> I'm not _always_ connected right now.
Jan 27 18:13:59 <alterego> Maybe in the future if that becomes more plausible ..
Jan 27 18:14:03 <fysa> using FUSE..
Jan 27 18:14:04 <Jaffa> Indeed. Which is why online PIMs suck.
Jan 27 18:14:08 <Jaffa> They're also crap for alarms
Jan 27 18:14:27 <fysa> I could mount every binary newsgroup and stream anything I wanted.
Jan 27 18:14:54 <fysa> There was no longer a need to 'download' -- except if your connection is lower than the bitrate+overhead
Jan 27 18:15:33 <lcuk> naba, i need to download the unstable .deb version 2.3 rather than add/remove
Jan 27 18:16:20 <lcuk> ive just tried updating my sources and its not changed whats available
Jan 27 18:16:23 <fysa> anyway.  exciting stuff. :)
Jan 27 18:17:59 <naba> lcuk: I am not sure what you meant, but yes, 2.3.x is not available widely. You can get the deb packages from http://anjuta.org/downloads
Jan 27 18:18:33 <naba> lcuk: for gusty, that is. I suppose you are installing ubuntu.
Jan 27 18:18:40 <lcuk> yes, ive just got the debs directly. i tried adding the repo they list thinking it would have the later version than the official repo.  its ok, ive started getting direct
Jan 27 18:54:21 <skibur> hello
Jan 27 18:57:35 <skibur> Is there a Dictionary App for the N800?
Jan 27 18:58:43 <skibur> ok
Jan 27 18:59:33 <skibur> anybody alive?
Jan 27 19:01:41 <tank-man> yea there is, sdict, but i havent got it installed, had some problems before installing and i'm not familiar with debs/repos
Jan 27 19:02:27 <tank-man> another one could be using noah pro with the garnet vm
Jan 27 19:08:42 <|tbb|> anyone knows fnmatch?
Jan 27 19:09:07 <Sho_> skibur: There's sdictviewer
Jan 27 19:09:26 <Sho_> skibur: For OS2007 there used to be a second nice one, StarDict, but that hasn't been ported to OS2008 so far
Jan 27 19:09:44 <skibur> yeah, installing it right now. :)
Jan 27 19:10:30 <skibur> I do see it on 2008 link on maemo
Jan 27 19:11:23 * Sho_ doesn't
Jan 27 19:15:15 <|tbb|> # Filters are matched like shell wildcards (using fnmatch(3)). # If a filter is specified (even if it is *), the corresponding argument # must be present in order to get a match.
Jan 27 19:17:10 <|tbb|> the argument i need is sometimes empty sometimes not , how can i define a filter  which tells the argument (string)  must be empty, something like NULL
Jan 27 19:19:26 <|tbb|> for example: 1arg=one 2arg=two 3arg= 4arg=fourth
Jan 27 19:20:09 <|tbb|> sometimes the third argument isnt empty then i dont want  it to match
Jan 27 19:20:38 <|tbb|> anyone understand what im trying to say
Jan 27 19:21:51 <pupnik_> jott: around?
Jan 27 19:23:10 <skibur> where will I download a dictionary file?
Jan 27 19:23:28 <skibur> For the use of SDicViewer?
Jan 27 19:23:32 <Sho_> skibur: sdict.com
Jan 27 19:23:40 <skibur> thanks
Jan 27 19:39:52 <pupnik> test
Jan 27 19:39:55 * pupnik 's fans are intune with nowplaying music
Jan 27 19:49:49 <maddler> hey all!
Jan 27 19:49:57 <pupnik> huhu
Jan 27 19:51:06 <pupnik> battery tip, don't leave your tablet on charger and on full charge
Jan 27 19:51:20 <skibur> Sdictviewer is pretty neat. :)
Jan 27 19:55:37 <fysa> there we go.  scratchbox setup.
Jan 27 19:56:27 <Blafasel> Canola2's interface is really, really slick and nice
Jan 27 20:02:38 <Jaffa> pupnik: that shouldn't damage the battery - if it does, it's a s/w bug in the firmware
Jan 27 20:04:27 <fysa> does the quetoo port use GL at all?
Jan 27 20:06:12 <pupnik> no
Jan 27 20:13:16 <Tama^2> Hi
Jan 27 20:27:46 <killfill> hi..
Jan 27 20:28:19 <killfill> should the media player be able to connect to a ogg stream?...
Jan 27 20:28:56 <felipec> killfill: if you have the oggsupport package, yes
Jan 27 20:30:06 <killfill> hm..
Jan 27 20:30:37 <killfill> weired..
Jan 27 20:33:36 <reinard> hello. im wondering how could i make flv's perform better with mplayer in n770
Jan 27 20:33:38 <killfill> ogg-support                                    0.6
Jan 27 20:33:58 <killfill> it says "format not admitted"..
Jan 27 20:34:18 <skibur> anybody using rapier?
Jan 27 20:34:21 <killfill> (or something like that.. my device in in spanish.. im makeing the traduction:)
Jan 27 20:34:33 <reinard> those play perfectly with -nosound, but without it mplayer just hangs
Jan 27 20:34:34 <killfill> felipec, can you connect to http://200.73.13.54:8000/music.ogg
Jan 27 20:34:35 <killfill> ?
Jan 27 20:35:21 <killfill> cannot do it nor with media plary, neither with canola
Jan 27 20:36:54 <fysa> if we had PyOpenGL, we could get Frets on Fire working. ;)
Jan 27 20:38:35 <reinard> does anyone have a good settings playing flv's in mplayer
Jan 27 20:38:47 <reinard> i would appreciate it
Jan 27 20:38:54 <fysa> haven't tried yet, but shouldn't be a problem.  what are you experiencing?
Jan 27 20:40:30 <reinard> -framedrop -nosound makes video play good, but is there someway to make those play good with audio
Jan 27 20:40:44 <fysa> what resolution/bitrate are the flvs?
Jan 27 20:40:48 <fysa> (where are they from?)
Jan 27 20:41:47 <felipec> killfill: it works here
Jan 27 20:41:58 <felipec> with the media player
Jan 27 20:42:00 <felipec> do you have the oggsupport package?
Jan 27 20:42:10 <killfill> yup: ogg-support 0.6
Jan 27 20:42:17 <killfill> and i can play local .ogg files just fine..
Jan 27 20:42:47 <killfill> hm.. mplayer works fine...
Jan 27 20:43:31 <reinard> flv's are something like 300-500*200-400... streaming tv-series mostly
Jan 27 20:43:49 <killfill> felipec: how did you add the stream?.. menu->clip->the second menu?
Jan 27 20:43:49 <felipec> killfill: I had to add it to my favorite internet radios
Jan 27 20:44:46 <reinard> is there some setting to prevent mplayer to scale the file to fullscreen. so it would play it in 1:1 or 2:1
Jan 27 20:45:15 <killfill> weired.. it doesnt work here.. :S
Jan 27 20:45:43 <killfill> felipec: you added the stream in the second menu?.. you just entered http://....:800/...ogg?
Jan 27 20:46:00 <fysa> are H264 flvs common-place yet?
Jan 27 20:46:06 <fysa> if so, that could be an issue.  I dont
Jan 27 20:46:21 <fysa> I don't think h264 decoding is very optimized for our devices yet in mplayer core.
Jan 27 20:46:26 <fysa> (very unoptimized)
Jan 27 20:46:47 <fysa> BTW - Yabause, the Sega Saturn emulator, compiles cleanly. ;)
Jan 27 20:47:22 <reinard> that might be it... still, is there that no fullscreen option?
Jan 27 20:47:36 <fysa> the fullscreen button on top works for me
Jan 27 20:48:02 <reinard> hmm, that just crashes my device
Jan 27 20:48:10 <fysa> you likely need a better mplayer then ;)
Jan 27 20:48:13 <killfill> felipec: in here, it says with  "Processing buffer"
Jan 27 20:48:18 <killfill> stays
Jan 27 20:48:25 <killfill> doesnt start playing
Jan 27 20:48:58 <felipec> killfill: it takes a long while here, and doesn't play too well
Jan 27 20:49:01 <felipec> but it does
Jan 27 20:49:06 <reinard> my device is very unstable in everything though.. opera crashes every 2min (hangs and boots the device)
Jan 27 20:49:31 <reinard> this happens in every it os i have tried
Jan 27 20:49:52 <killfill> oh.. there it is.. i guess the buffer is hudge.. :P
Jan 27 20:50:02 <killfill> :D
Jan 27 20:50:06 * pupnik relegates another evening to dosbox
Jan 27 20:50:27 <fysa> Have you tried Yabause yet, pupnik?
Jan 27 20:50:29 <killfill> hm.. i hear strange things in the stream.. i thought it was my PC player.. seems to be the server..
Jan 27 20:50:32 <fysa> it will certainly be slow ;)
Jan 27 20:50:42 <pupnik> haha no :)
Jan 27 20:50:48 <fysa> compiling everything I can to play with later.
Jan 27 20:51:25 <fysa> http://www.happypenguin.org/
Jan 27 20:51:27 <fysa> starting here
Jan 27 20:52:23 <fysa> http://www.happypenguin.org/show?O.H.R.RPG.C.E
Jan 27 20:52:26 <pupnik> if you work on something, please let me know - i might have already solved some problems without releasing
Jan 27 20:53:33 <fysa> sounds good
Jan 27 20:54:27 <GNUtoN810> Hi
Jan 27 20:54:28 <fysa> http://www.happypenguin.org/show?POWDER
Jan 27 20:55:21 <fysa> http://www.happypenguin.org/show?Vulture%27s
Jan 27 20:55:55 <fysa> http://www.happypenguin.org/show?UFO%3A%20Alien%20Invasion
Jan 27 20:56:11 <pupnik> that one has been worked on by no less than fanoush, iirc
Jan 27 20:56:18 <fysa> UFO?
Jan 27 20:56:20 <pupnik> or maybe ssvb
Jan 27 20:56:25 <fysa> or Vulture?
Jan 27 20:56:30 <pupnik> ufo
Jan 27 20:56:50 <fysa> it looks like bits of sdlquake/quetoo need to be shoehorned in.
Jan 27 20:56:50 <pupnik> check itt forums
Jan 27 20:56:51 <fysa> cool.
Jan 27 21:00:36 <pupnik> oh sorry, it's a different UFO
Jan 27 21:02:28 <fysa> ah.  this is that old X-Com game.. ported to Q2 engine.
Jan 27 21:02:35 <fysa> turn-based strategy
Jan 27 21:02:50 <fysa> or, turn-based tactical maybe
Jan 27 21:03:04 <fysa> doesn't need a high framerate, but should look nice.. anyway.
Jan 27 21:03:06 <fysa> that's for later.
Jan 27 21:08:18 <maddler> woah! truecrypt ported to N800! :D
Jan 27 21:23:48 <fysa> http://www.happypenguin.org/show?FreeRa
Jan 27 21:29:46 <EruditeHermit> hi, where can I find a list of the default packages for OS2008
Jan 27 21:29:54 <EruditeHermit> also is there a repository with these packages?
Jan 27 21:30:17 <hendry> EruditeHermit: i think http://www.gronmayer.com/it is what you need
Jan 27 21:30:35 <EruditeHermit> hendry: yes I have those things installed
Jan 27 21:30:40 <EruditeHermit> err those repositories
Jan 27 21:30:52 <EruditeHermit> my problem is that I tried to install rtcom beta
Jan 27 21:31:15 <EruditeHermit> but I realised that I didn't want to use beta stuff
Jan 27 21:31:21 <EruditeHermit> so I tried removing the beta installer
Jan 27 21:31:29 <EruditeHermit> but it left an item in my menu
Jan 27 21:31:42 <EruditeHermit> and I am not sure if it left behind some packages that I don't need
Jan 27 21:32:12 <hendry> debian packages are usually pretty good with removing things like menu items
Jan 27 21:32:20 <hendry> can't really help you i'm afraid
Jan 27 21:32:59 <EruditeHermit> hendry: do you know where the default package list for OS2008 is?
Jan 27 21:33:42 <hendry> umm, i think it's all the packages in the repo with "Essential" or "Important"
Jan 27 21:33:58 <hendry> a carefully craft apt-cache search or something will give you a list
Jan 27 21:34:06 <hendry> a carefully craftED apt-cache search or something will give you a list
Jan 27 21:38:12 <EruditeHermit> hendry: the package osso-rtcom-oma has a "pi" in the information column of dpkg -l
Jan 27 21:38:16 <EruditeHermit> what does the p mean?
Jan 27 21:39:01 * pupnik shakes a bony fist at the sky
Jan 27 21:43:15 <fysa> does battledrome run? :)
Jan 27 21:50:41 <fysa> http://www.happypenguin.org/show?Jagged%20Alliance%202%20-%20Stracciatella
Jan 27 21:51:54 <Tama^2> Stracciatella?
Jan 27 21:51:56 <Tama^2> lol
Jan 27 21:52:20 <Tama^2> like the icecream... it must be yummy game
Jan 27 21:52:38 <EruditeHermit> does anyone know where I can find the package osso-rtcom-oma?
Jan 27 21:53:37 <Tama^2> nope
Jan 27 21:53:54 <pH5> fysa: 'straciatella' should run. I got it to run on an old ipaq hx4700.
Jan 27 21:56:57 <fysa> seems to build fine :)
Jan 27 21:57:22 <fysa> hmm.
Jan 27 21:57:23 <fysa> http://www.happypenguin.org/show?typhoon%202001
Jan 27 21:57:31 <fysa> they say source available, but I can't find it.
Jan 27 22:03:16 <Doni^> good evening
Jan 27 22:06:17 <smackpotato> any one find any undocumented hardware on the n810
Jan 27 22:08:20 <GeneralAntilles> No.
Jan 27 22:08:51 <db48x> powervr doesn't count?
Jan 27 22:10:33 <GeneralAntilles> No.
Jan 27 22:10:40 <GeneralAntilles> We've known about that for forever.
Jan 27 22:12:04 <Doni^> does anyone have any stability problems after installing rtcomm (telepathy-haze?
Jan 27 22:13:23 <GeneralAntilles> Doni^, "stability problems" is pretty generic.
Jan 27 22:13:28 <Doni^> GeneralAntilles: :D
Jan 27 22:13:39 <Doni^> my n810 seems to reboot every now and then.
Jan 27 22:13:44 <Doni^> removing all that returns stability
Jan 27 22:14:07 <Doni^> i.e. no more reboots.
Jan 27 22:30:58 * lcuk twiddles his thumbs whilst anjuta compiles
Jan 27 22:37:53 <kupesoft> The wiki is broken,
Jan 27 22:38:42 <kupesoft> wiki.maemo.org
Jan 27 22:39:55 <Blafasel> Hmm.. Shouldn't it be possible to use the camera with Gizmo?
Jan 27 22:45:30 <Blafasel> Ah.. Okay, have to get the beta version for windows..
Jan 27 22:50:28 <kupesoft> What are the repos for the n800/chinook?
Jan 27 22:52:16 <Blafasel> Check the topic, gronmayer.com/it
Jan 27 22:55:58 <fysa> do we have Lua for OS2008?
Jan 27 23:06:41 <unique311> fysa,
Jan 27 23:10:07 <Doni^> hey, btw: do we have cron or similar scheduler available?
Jan 27 23:16:06 <pupnik> i think so
Jan 27 23:19:16 <reinard> quite ironical: i was googling for info of why my n770 is so unstable it's far from usable. i wrote words "n770 opera crash boot" and pressed search. device hangs, and after few seconds of waiting nokia-logo appears
Jan 27 23:19:26 <reinard> device booted again
Jan 27 23:19:46 <GeneralAntilles> Are you running the default config?
Jan 27 23:19:49 <reinard> this happen every few minutes. is this normal?
Jan 27 23:19:53 <GeneralAntilles> No.
Jan 27 23:20:05 <GeneralAntilles> Have you done anything to the device?
Jan 27 23:20:08 <reinard> yes default, now im runnin it2007he
Jan 27 23:20:13 <reinard> nothing
Jan 27 23:20:18 <GeneralAntilles> Restored a backup?
Jan 27 23:20:31 <reinard> i have tried every os, mmchacks etc.
Jan 27 23:21:00 <smackpotato> i can give you a trick for the 770 but it slows it down
Jan 27 23:21:03 <GeneralAntilles> Opening a lot of applications at once?
Jan 27 23:21:04 <reinard> i have restored whole device several times, no luck
Jan 27 23:21:15 <johnx> are you on the latest 2007HE?
Jan 27 23:21:15 <GeneralAntilles> Restored backup? Or reflashed?
Jan 27 23:21:48 <reinard> no, it hungs even with only one browser window open, no other apps
Jan 27 23:22:01 <smackpotato> go to maemo garage and search for seatbelt
Jan 27 23:22:24 <reinard> reflash, i don't have backups... this have been this bad for whole time since i bought it
Jan 27 23:22:45 <lcuk> is there a possibility there is something on the website "770 crashing all the time" which is crashing it?   however if you dont go onto that page it doesnt crash ;)
Jan 27 23:23:12 <GeneralAntilles> fwiw, I have 2 770s and they rarely crash with the latest OS2007HE.
Jan 27 23:23:39 <reinard> that crashes in no matter what page im in
Jan 27 23:24:02 <reinard> could this be hw problem?
Jan 27 23:24:02 <johnx> there is a known bug where using wifi causes memory corruption but there is a hotfix for the latest IT2006OS and the latest IT2007HE has that fix rolled in
Jan 27 23:24:22 <smackpotato> i had 2006 and it rarly crashed
Jan 27 23:24:45 <smackpotato> after changing swappiness
Jan 27 23:24:47 <reinard> sounds possible cause because i have problems with wifi often
Jan 27 23:26:04 <reinard> im browsing the web, and suddently pages doesn't load anymore. then i disconnect wlan, and reconnect.. after it i usually get local-link
Jan 27 23:26:26 <reinard> after few reconnects i get it working again
Jan 27 23:26:41 <reinard> this is too very annoying
Jan 27 23:27:04 <GeneralAntilles> Crappy router?
Jan 27 23:27:48 <reinard> no, every other devices i have always keeps connected. this happens everywhere
Jan 27 23:27:55 <reinard> not only in my home
Jan 27 23:28:18 <GeneralAntilles> Could be a bad unit.
Jan 27 23:29:12 <reinard> i hope it's not, but definately looks like it
Jan 27 23:29:49 <reinard> how i can get this replaced, no place has these n770s anymore
Jan 27 23:30:01 <GeneralAntilles> Nokia if it's still under warranty.
Jan 27 23:30:04 <GeneralAntilles> Where'd you buy it?
Jan 27 23:30:12 <reinard> expansys
Jan 27 23:30:21 <GeneralAntilles> How long ago?
Jan 27 23:30:34 <reinard> i bought it in summer, so it has warranty left
Jan 27 23:30:44 <GeneralAntilles> Warranty it, then.
Jan 27 23:30:48 <smackpotato> try searching for oom-killer
Jan 27 23:30:59 <GeneralAntilles> If they can't fix it, they usually do a payout.
Jan 27 23:31:03 <GeneralAntilles> Then get yourself an N800. ;)
Jan 27 23:31:46 <reinard> i would get n810 but i dont want to risk if its as unstable as this
Jan 27 23:31:56 <GeneralAntilles> N810 is a waste of money
Jan 27 23:31:58 <GeneralAntilles> Get an N800.
Jan 27 23:32:16 <GeneralAntilles> But, no, the stability issues you're describing are highly unusually for a normal 770.
Jan 27 23:32:28 <GeneralAntilles> and the N800 and N810 are much, much better than the 770.
Jan 27 23:32:40 <reinard> yes i know
Jan 27 23:32:51 <smackpotato> the 810 is a big step up
Jan 27 23:33:14 <reinard> but n800 costs quite much in finland where i live
Jan 27 23:33:54 * Cymor is away: afk
Jan 27 23:34:01 <reinard> n800 sells with like 160usd in us, but customs+shipping would be high
Jan 27 23:34:28 <reinard> which is the cheapest place in EU to get n800?
Jan 27 23:38:26 <lcuk> why are nokia devices more expensive in home country?
Jan 27 23:39:20 <pupnik> almost all electronics are more expensive in europe
Jan 27 23:39:35 <johnx> didn't you ever play "lemonade stand" on an Apple ][ ?
Jan 27 23:40:05 <pupnik> taipan!
Jan 27 23:40:10 <smackpotato> the oom-killer uses seniority when not to kill a process if it decides to kill the browser the browser doesnt get seniority and continues to be a candidate to be killed
Jan 27 23:40:16 <reinard> its because of high taxes and "suomilisä" (everything here is expensive, finland add)
Jan 27 23:40:23 <proteous> according to the canola guys the 770 is better at displaying movement without tearing
Jan 27 23:40:48 <GeneralAntilles> Yes, but that doesn't make it a better device.
Jan 27 23:41:05 <proteous> sure, but still worth noting
Jan 27 23:41:26 <GeneralAntilles> Who cares about tearing when the whole device is stupid slow.
Jan 27 23:41:35 <proteous> I use ssh a lot so an 810 is going to be me upgrade from my 770 when the time comes
Jan 27 23:42:27 <proteous> just thought I'd mention that GeneralAntilles, didn't know you were going to get offended
Jan 27 23:42:38 <proteous> maybe you should lighten up
Jan 27 23:42:39 <pupnik> typing on the thinkoutside stowaway is still 3x better than on n810 thumbboard
Jan 27 23:42:43 <pupnik> at least for shell stuff
Jan 27 23:42:52 <reinard> addon, i crash my  770 in 99% of cases when downloading over ~10mb file with opera. not normal i guess?
Jan 27 23:43:01 <smackpotato> i want to turn my 770 into a picture frame
Jan 27 23:43:04 <GeneralAntilles> No, reinard.
Jan 27 23:43:04 <proteous> did you install teh wifi patch?
Jan 27 23:43:34 <reinard> does the newest os2007 have it?
Jan 27 23:43:53 <proteous> my 770 was a crashing machine untill I reflashed it and installed the patch
Jan 27 23:44:00 <proteous> yeah, I belive it does reinard
Jan 27 23:44:26 <GeneralAntilles> Who said I was offended, proteus?
Jan 27 23:44:36 <reinard> where can i get the patch? i have os2007he, but not the newest
Jan 27 23:44:46 <reinard> newest from tablets-dev
Jan 27 23:44:53 <proteous> it's already in the 2007he
Jan 27 23:45:03 <proteous> was from the begining
Jan 27 23:45:19 <lcuk> does it crash when you are not online
Jan 27 23:45:26 <reinard> well thats not the solution then
Jan 27 23:46:23 <reinard> lcuk, well have this always online and my problems usually happens when browsing or downloading
Jan 27 23:47:13 <proteous> reinard, have you enabled any virtual memory on your memory card?
Jan 27 23:47:27 <lcuk> i realise that, but to diagnose problem, might be worth just trying to stay offline for a short duration.  do some intensive memory/cpu stuff (play a game, compile something etc) and see if it crashes
Jan 27 23:47:44 <reinard> but this also hangs and boots when trying to watch native video-files with mplayer... i open the file, wait minutes and boot (can't do anything)
Jan 27 23:48:17 <reinard> i have virtual memory enabled yes
Jan 27 23:48:26 <GeneralAntilles> Tried doing all this stuff without a card in the slot?
Jan 27 23:48:27 <lcuk> have you considered a duff emmory card
Jan 27 23:48:31 <reinard> but problem stays without it also
Jan 27 23:48:39 <smackpotato> try this reinard
Jan 27 23:48:46 <smackpotato> https://garage.maemo.org/projects/seatbelt/
Jan 27 23:49:07 <smackpotato> but try the patch first
Jan 27 23:49:55 <smackpotato> try the wifi patch first
Jan 27 23:50:00 <reinard> now i remember.. i have used this device offline for long times.. playing scummvm games and mahjong. no crashing
Jan 27 23:50:17 <reinard> its always opera or mplayer
Jan 27 23:50:31 <reinard> os2007 has that patch, no help
Jan 27 23:50:38 <lcuk> reinard, are the movies you attempted been network playback, or were you downloading files in the background during playback
Jan 27 23:50:39 <reinard> i chech that seatbelt
Jan 27 23:51:13 <reinard> usually converted avi's directly from mmc
Jan 27 23:51:51 <reinard> not doing anything at the same time
Jan 27 23:53:32 <reinard> ok, i installed that seatbelt. what now?
Jan 27 23:53:37 <micko_22> Hello, how to flash the OS for N810? I have read about flasher utility, but it seems to be for N770/N800. Can I use it safely for N810 also?
Jan 27 23:53:49 <pupnik> flasher 3.0 yes
Jan 27 23:54:37 <micko_22> OK thanks!
Jan 27 23:54:39 <GeneralAntilles> or 2.0 on OS X.
Jan 27 23:55:07 <reinard> or 1.0 on ms-dos 3.2 ;)
Jan 27 23:55:24 <GeneralAntilles> 1.0 doesn't run on DOS.
Jan 27 23:55:46 <reinard> my bad
Jan 27 23:57:28 <lcuk> crash?
Jan 28 00:00:12 <reinard> :D guess what just happened?
Jan 28 00:00:34 <crashanddie> lcuk, yeah ?
Jan 28 00:00:35 <zerojay> You fell down some stairs?
Jan 28 00:00:36 <smackpotato> what
Jan 28 00:00:43 <crashanddie> lcuk, highlight me, works better
Jan 28 00:00:43 <reinard> n770 rebooted by it self.
Jan 28 00:00:55 <reinard> i love this stability
Jan 28 00:01:14 <lcuk> lol crashanddie - i was remarking about reinard...
Jan 28 00:01:30 <crashanddie> oh
Jan 28 00:01:31 <crashanddie> right
Jan 28 00:01:39 <crashanddie> well, you're always saying "crash", so...
Jan 28 00:01:40 <crashanddie> :D
Jan 28 00:01:42 <crashanddie> sorry
Jan 28 00:01:51 <reinard> some of you said something about mmc, could it be that problem is with it?
Jan 28 00:02:12 <reinard> like 770 lost connect with it and hangs
Jan 28 00:02:53 <reinard> because it acts just the same way when using mmc and then taking it off > causes boot
Jan 28 00:03:03 <proteous> I was just going to suggest turning on virtual memory if you hadn't
Jan 28 00:03:15 <proteous> lots of things can cause a reboot
Jan 28 00:03:30 <proteous> the hacker edition isn't exactly the most stable OS for the 770
Jan 28 00:03:43 <proteous> hence the name and the warnings
Jan 28 00:03:52 <proteous> although most people don't have too many problems with it
Jan 28 00:04:03 <proteous> might be worth just trying a reflash with the newest version
Jan 28 00:04:07 <reinard> yes but i have had these same probs with os2006 since beginninv
Jan 28 00:04:30 <proteous> well, if you didn't install the wifi patch on os2006 then it's crashtastic
Jan 28 00:04:51 <proteous> and you have to install it right after a reflash before you use the wifi
Jan 28 00:05:22 <proteous> so the usualy precedure is to copy it to your memory card before you reflash
Jan 28 00:05:44 <reinard> where to download newest os2007he? i think there is newer somewhere elsewhere than in tablets-dev.nokia.com?
Jan 28 00:06:10 <reinard> i don't want to get back to 2006, 2007 is seems to be faster
Jan 28 00:07:42 <benno2> hi all, is there a simple way to install ping on the n770 and n800 ? thanks
Jan 28 00:08:26 <aspiers> Anyone here familiar with creating .deb repositories? The HOWTOs and man pages are not easy to understand.
Jan 28 00:12:10 <johnx> benno2, isn't it installed by default?
Jan 28 00:12:19 <GeneralAntilles> Yeah, johnx, it should be.
Jan 28 00:12:20 <benno2> no
Jan 28 00:12:25 <benno2> ping command not found
Jan 28 00:12:26 <GeneralAntilles> Just need root for some reason.
Jan 28 00:12:33 <benno2> I am root
Jan 28 00:12:36 <benno2> via ssh
Jan 28 00:13:46 <jumpula> bow before me, for i am root
Jan 28 00:14:12 <GeneralAntilles> ping works fine as root on my N800 with OS2008.
Jan 28 00:14:25 <johnx> benno2, which OS are you on?
Jan 28 00:14:31 <johnx> also, ls /bin/ping
Jan 28 00:14:42 <jumpula> which ping
Jan 28 00:14:47 <benno2> I tried on both n700 os2006  and n800 os2008
Jan 28 00:15:22 <GeneralAntilles> Have you been messing with stuff?
Jan 28 00:15:52 <reinar1> ok, mmc off, virtual memory disabled > opened browser, typed "internettablettalk.com" and enter
Jan 28 00:16:05 <reinar1> hang > boot
Jan 28 00:16:21 <reinar1> problem is not mmc then
Jan 28 00:17:44 <reinar1> i think i try yet again reflash, then i see that the problems stays, i will reflash to original os2006 and send this thing to warranty
Jan 28 00:18:24 <smackpotato> i could only open itt with microb
Jan 28 00:18:58 <GeneralAntilles> reinar1, are you on the latest OS2007HE?
Jan 28 00:19:31 <reinar1> 4.2007.26-8
Jan 28 00:20:12 <t_s_o> about ping, there are a package up on on the 08 reps that contains a ping that can be used by non-root
Jan 28 00:20:22 <reinar1> i have had latest os2006, earlier 2007 and this... every of those i have flashed several times. but no success
Jan 28 00:23:18 <t_s_o> kinda fun watching the N800 report low battery, then after resting in offline mode for a while, showing near half battery again...
Jan 28 00:23:34 <smackpotato> can anyone run the video at bloomberg with the n810
Jan 28 00:23:51 <GeneralAntilles> Somebody need's to get Nokia's battery monitor some ADD meds.
Jan 28 00:24:01 <johnx> t_s_o, yeah. poor battery reporting seems to be a trademark of portable devices
Jan 28 00:24:20 <reinard> someone there, sell me a used n800
Jan 28 00:24:59 <GeneralAntilles> $500 USD
Jan 28 00:25:02 <t_s_o> johnx: well, its kinda expected as the drain from wireless on and full cpu to complete rest is quite large
Jan 28 00:25:07 <reinard> does n810 have signif. better performance than n800
Jan 28 00:25:34 <johnx> reinard, n810 is *exactly the same* mainboard as the n800
Jan 28 00:25:59 <smackpotato> nicer screen aperently
Jan 28 00:26:24 <reinard> oh
Jan 28 00:26:48 <johnx> n800: 2 SD slots, n810: keyboard, GPS, transflective screen, 256MB+2GB internal flash, one mini-sdhc slot
Jan 28 00:26:50 <reinard> n800 is probably better choice for the money then
Jan 28 00:27:51 <smackpotato> hears a deal
Jan 28 00:28:03 <smackpotato> here is a deal
Jan 28 00:29:01 <reinard> once my father was doing business with nokia finland (<2000) and often received phones and stuff... we had communicators and all that times cool phones... wish the situation was the same again *sigh*
Jan 28 00:29:03 <smackpotato> post to itt 5 times  a week and apply for a developers discount for the n920
Jan 28 00:30:29 <reinard> how much is that discount? i'm just interested... i'll never become developer though, too hard for me :D
Jan 28 00:30:59 <johnx> reinard, what version of 2007HE are you using again?
Jan 28 00:31:37 <smackpotato> i got 350 off the price by pledging to tell people i love my 770
Jan 28 00:32:24 <reinard> 4.2007.26-8 is the version
Jan 28 00:32:37 <johnx> there are newer versions :)
Jan 28 00:32:45 <GeneralAntilles> I really wonder at some of the selections for the last batch of discount codes.
Jan 28 00:32:50 <reinard> where?
Jan 28 00:32:56 <johnx> http://tablets-dev.nokia.com/os2007_hacker_edition.php
Jan 28 00:33:07 <johnx> or at least I think they're newer
Jan 28 00:33:15 <johnx> I mean the "week number" is later
Jan 28 00:33:31 <smackpotato> most people that applied got one
Jan 28 00:34:09 <reinard> oh oh.. i think that i have the newest from there but this version shows in "about device"
Jan 28 00:34:24 <johnx> hmm
Jan 28 00:34:27 <johnx> interesting
Jan 28 00:34:34 <johnx> sorry to get your hopes up
Jan 28 00:34:35 <reinard> i once though there was newer and upgraded but text didn't change
Jan 28 00:35:41 <johnx> cat /etc/osso_software_version
Jan 28 00:38:31 <reinar1> surprise, hang and boot immediately when i decided to browse the web
Jan 28 00:39:11 <timelyx> reinar1: how about 500EUR + shipping :)
Jan 28 00:39:15 <lcuk> are you charging battery
Jan 28 00:39:17 <reinar1> i was going to check n800/810 prices in ebay.. maybe 770 didn't want to retire yet
Jan 28 00:39:22 * timelyx thinks GeneralAntilles's price is too low :)
Jan 28 00:39:29 <reinar1> no i'm not
Jan 28 00:39:38 <lcuk> does it crash even if you are
Jan 28 00:39:44 <johnx> heh...Your 770 is worried about job its job security
Jan 28 00:39:56 <GeneralAntilles> timelyx, you're supposed to undercut me if you want a sale. :P
Jan 28 00:40:06 <reinar1> well i could n800 for under 300e here
Jan 28 00:40:08 <timelyx> johnx: you left out the n800's fm radio + mini usb. v the n810's micro usb :(
Jan 28 00:40:24 <reinar1> from uk or germany for like 200e
Jan 28 00:40:28 <johnx> yeah...I was going by major features
Jan 28 00:40:42 <johnx> can we teach infobot factoids?
Jan 28 00:40:43 <GeneralAntilles> johnx is an AM guy, evidently. ;)
Jan 28 00:41:00 <timelyx> GeneralAntilles: i like my devices :)
Jan 28 00:41:08 <t_s_o> heh, no wonder that the N810 comes with 2GB nailed to the insides. i have to find room for 172MB to get a map i can use...
Jan 28 00:41:10 <reinar1> lcuk, yes it crashes also if charging
Jan 28 00:41:16 <timelyx> GeneralAntilles: can i offer "never used"?
Jan 28 00:41:20 <lcuk> rules out battery then
Jan 28 00:41:22 <timelyx> that has to increase its value :)
Jan 28 00:41:26 <GeneralAntilles> Ha
Jan 28 00:41:41 <lcuk> reinar1, does it crash if you use an alternative router, or usb networking (if applicable)
Jan 28 00:41:43 <timelyx> (seriously)
Jan 28 00:41:55 <lcuk> "mint in the box"
Jan 28 00:41:56 <GeneralAntilles> You like them but never use them? :P
Jan 28 00:42:00 <timelyx> infobot x and y are 5
Jan 28 00:42:04 <reinar1> alternative router, yes
Jan 28 00:42:04 <timelyx> infobot what are x and y?
Jan 28 00:42:06 * infobot are x and y to understand recursion, you must first understand recursion
Jan 28 00:42:12 <timelyx> or not
Jan 28 00:42:17 <timelyx> infobot xw and y are 5
Jan 28 00:42:18 <infobot> okay, timelyx
Jan 28 00:42:19 <timelyx> infobot what are wx and y?
Jan 28 00:42:20 * infobot are wx and y to understand recursion, you must first understand recursion
Jan 28 00:42:30 <reinar1> havent tried usb networking though
Jan 28 00:42:31 <timelyx> um...
Jan 28 00:42:38 <timelyx> infobot wx is  9
Jan 28 00:42:38 <infobot> ...but wx is already something else...
Jan 28 00:42:42 <timelyx> infobot what is wx?
Jan 28 00:42:43 * infobot is wx to understand recursion, you must first understand recursion
Jan 28 00:42:49 <johnx> ahahaha
Jan 28 00:42:51 <timelyx> infobot status
Jan 28 00:42:52 <infobot> Since Tue Jan 22 20:20:44 2008, there have been 28 modifications, 587 questions, 0 dunnos, 0 morons and 354 commands.  I have been awake for 5d 4h 22m 7s this session, and currently reference 114293 factoids.  I'm using about 19136 kB of memory. With 0 active forks. Process time user/system 10740.71/417.61 child 0/0
Jan 28 00:43:01 <timelyx> 0 morons, cute
Jan 28 00:43:02 <reinar1> ram or cpu got to be broken i think
Jan 28 00:43:10 <lcuk> i tend to agree
Jan 28 00:43:16 <lcuk> theres not much left to consider
Jan 28 00:43:16 <timelyx> it claims to know 100k factoids
Jan 28 00:43:22 <timelyx> but doesn't seem interested in sharing
Jan 28 00:43:31 <GeneralAntilles> You gotta pay.
Jan 28 00:43:41 <johnx> can anyone else check what the latest version of 2007HE shows in the "About" dialog?
Jan 28 00:43:45 <timelyx> pay for factoids?
Jan 28 00:43:45 <lcuk> if its warranty covered, then call it in
Jan 28 00:43:53 <GeneralAntilles> $5 a pop.
Jan 28 00:43:56 <reinar1> yes i will
Jan 28 00:44:16 <lcuk> since you have had this after multiple flashes its unlikely anything you specifically are doing
Jan 28 00:44:46 <johnx> GeneralAntilles, do I just feed the money into this slot on the front of the computer?
Jan 28 00:44:46 <lcuk> we could spend all week looking at alternatives when other people just dont have the kinds of problems you appear to be getting.
Jan 28 00:45:07 <johnx> I still am weirded out by the version dialog not showing the right thing...
Jan 28 00:45:08 <lcuk> johnx, just type your credit card details here, we will do the rest
Jan 28 00:45:23 <reinar1> i think i have to pay shipping to uk to get it in warranty... or does someone know how expansys's warranty work?
Jan 28 00:45:24 <johnx> there have been cases where flashes failed in interesting ways before
Jan 28 00:45:42 <lcuk> not sure reinar1, call or email them and see
Jan 28 00:45:48 <johnx> GeneralAntilles, you have a 770 with 2007HE, right?
Jan 28 00:45:54 <reinar1> i would check their webpages, but this would crash :)
Jan 28 00:45:58 <GeneralAntilles> western union transfers only, johnx.
Jan 28 00:46:08 <GeneralAntilles> Yes, johnx, but I couldn't tell you which one is the most recent. ;)
Jan 28 00:46:16 <reinar1> yes i will contact them with email soon
Jan 28 00:46:17 <lcuk> rein, have you got a desktop/laptop you could check from...
Jan 28 00:46:45 <reinar1> yes i have, i check it out later
Jan 28 00:47:25 <reinar1> clock is 3 at night here, and i should wake up in 4 hours :)
Jan 28 00:48:01 <lcuk> sounds familiar, you could make up excuse that the clock kept crashing and it didnt wake you up
Jan 28 00:48:20 <GeneralAntilles> 4.2007.26-8 and 2.2006.48-7
Jan 28 00:48:25 <esotic> Howdy
Jan 28 00:48:56 <johnx> thanks GeneralAntilles
Jan 28 00:48:56 <esotic> I'm trying run Vagalume in Xephyr and i'm getting an error about the audio system
Jan 28 00:49:15 * GeneralAntilles should probably update the old one.
Jan 28 00:52:09 <johnx> heh...nothing quite like compiling code under an emulator
Jan 28 00:53:22 <zerojay> How about compiling KDE under an emulator? :)
Jan 28 00:53:37 <johnx> why, it's already compiled for debian/armel?
Jan 28 00:53:39 <johnx> :P
Jan 28 00:53:45 <zerojay> Just saying. :)
Jan 28 00:53:58 <johnx> I can just apt-get install kde
Jan 28 00:54:17 <zerojay> If you like breaking your tablet, sure.
Jan 28 00:54:21 <jott> johnx: speaking of.. how is the status of debian on IT?
Jan 28 00:54:48 <johnx> jott, the pkg-maemo guys actually had a lot of stuff working that I didn't
Jan 28 00:55:00 <johnx> so, right now I'm working on getting their stuff up and running on my tablet
Jan 28 00:55:06 <reinard> i decided to gamble and check expansys website... how other: hang loading and BOOT
Jan 28 00:55:07 <johnx> then I'll roll a new filesystem tarball
Jan 28 00:56:15 <jott> ah.. hmm are those guys targeting the ITs? and why you did not know about them :P
Jan 28 00:57:03 <johnx> I knew they were packing libhildon into debian. I didn't know they had boot scripts hidden away in a bzr repository with no mention on their website except for a link in a mailing list
Jan 28 00:57:34 <jott> ah .. i see.. and those bootscript bring powermanagment and working keyboard etc?! ;)
Jan 28 00:57:43 <johnx> keyboard = yes
Jan 28 00:57:48 <johnx> power management, not so much
Jan 28 00:58:06 <reinard> funny, this device jamming gets the clock jam also... just few hours ago i put it in right time.. now its 7 minutes behind
Jan 28 00:58:24 <johnx> power management will be the biggest problem...but now that they have other stuff figured out it frees me up work on it
Jan 28 00:58:31 <jga23> whats the max sd capacity for the n810? 8gb?
Jan 28 00:58:53 <johnx> jga23, it should support the biggest mini or micro sdhc card you can buy
Jan 28 00:59:00 <esotic> i think so, but it comes with 4GB internal
Jan 28 01:00:05 <jott> johnx: yeah.. well question is, which approach to take with the pm. reverse engineer the libdsme or dsmesock stuff?
Jan 28 01:00:54 <esotic> the website says 8GB  http://web.nseries.com/products/n810/#l=products,n810
Jan 28 01:01:08 <GeneralAntilles> SDHC supports up to 2048GB
Jan 28 01:01:14 <johnx> esotic, the website says 8GB for the N800 too but people use 16GB no problem
Jan 28 01:01:23 <esotic> gotcha
Jan 28 01:01:29 <johnx> jott, no one working on this right now is a serious kernel hacker.
Jan 28 01:01:34 <reinard> whats the news with os2008he? is it still planned
Jan 28 01:01:41 <GeneralAntilles> Yes, reinard.
Jan 28 01:01:46 <johnx> so I think I'll try and just talk to dsme and make it behave
Jan 28 01:02:26 <jott> johnx: yeah.. ltrace gives some nice insights for starters ;).
Jan 28 01:02:33 <reinard> after year, two or what? is there any expected schedule
Jan 28 01:02:50 <jott> johnx: where did you get those information from? is there a ml or irc channel?
Jan 28 01:03:24 <johnx> there is #debian-maemo and http://pkg-maemo.alioth.debian.org/
Jan 28 01:03:48 <jott> yeah found the latter one..
Jan 28 01:03:51 <johnx> there's a mailing list too and the pkg-maemo guys seem to be responsive
Jan 28 01:04:39 <jott> joined the channel ;)
Jan 28 01:04:58 <GeneralAntilles> reinard, no schedule.
Jan 28 01:05:04 <GeneralAntilles> It's being done in people's free time.
Jan 28 01:05:14 <reinard> ok thanks for info
Jan 28 01:05:43 <reinard> better would be just to buy that n800 somewhere
Jan 28 01:06:10 <GeneralAntilles> Yes.
Jan 28 01:09:23 <benno2> hi, do you know if I can set the wireless to not go in standby mode on the n800 ?
Jan 28 01:12:14 <lcuk> depends what you are using it for benno, if its because of an scp/ftp type connection from another machine - its normally enough to get that machine sending keepalives.  or do you mean total standby
Jan 28 01:12:20 <pupnik> -fgenerate-profile dumps all the .gcno files into /scratchbox/ccache , then i copy those to /scratchbox/ccache on the n810
Jan 28 01:12:32 <pupnik> er -fprofile-generate
Jan 28 01:13:00 <pupnik> but i'm not getting any .gcda files yet
Jan 28 01:13:38 <reinard> not having enough problems yet: is there way to fix operas not responding to url-clicks problem
Jan 28 01:13:42 <pupnik> hehe
Jan 28 01:14:00 <pupnik> maybe i need to copy the whole source tree over
Jan 28 01:14:23 <reinard> i often have to open links by holding link and open new window.. then close the old one
Jan 28 01:15:56 <esotic> does anybody have a suggestion for a maemo project I could grab to start getting familiar with the environment?
Jan 28 01:17:09 <reinard> is there some way to get "reboot" setting to shutdown-menu?
Jan 28 01:17:46 <GeneralAntilles> Yes.
Jan 28 01:17:47 <pupnik> http://maemo.org/development/documentation/how-tos/4-x/maemo_4-0_porting_guide.html  there's a nice guide esotic
Jan 28 01:17:50 <GeneralAntilles> You edit a file.
Jan 28 01:17:52 <GeneralAntilles> I don't recall which one.
Jan 28 01:18:38 <reinard> kk thanks if you replied to me
Jan 28 01:18:45 <fysa> some fun things configuring well here :)
Jan 28 01:19:06 <fysa> have 20 games ready to compile, whatever works I will throw up in a couple of repositories
Jan 28 01:19:13 <fysa> one for direct compiles (i.e., non-hildon)
Jan 28 01:19:27 <fysa> and one for proper ports
Jan 28 01:19:43 <fysa> the latter may take some time, of course
Jan 28 01:20:00 <fysa> one problem I'm having is locating Abuse-SDL
Jan 28 01:20:46 <fysa> oh, got one.
Jan 28 01:20:50 <lcdd> "Sorry ... but your query looks similar to automated requests from a computer virus or spyware application. To protect our users, we can't process your request right now."
Jan 28 01:21:03 <lcdd> this is what maemo mapper is getting back from google
Jan 28 01:21:44 <pupnik> fysa - just add debian source repos to your scratchbox and apt-get source abuse-sdl
Jan 28 01:21:58 <fysa> excellent
Jan 28 01:22:08 <fysa> yeah, just ended up grabbing it from there manually ;)
Jan 28 01:22:10 <fysa> but that's even better.
Jan 28 01:22:29 <fysa> I'm determined to get at least one decent RTS going.
Jan 28 01:24:10 <fysa> stratagus looks nice.
Jan 28 01:24:23 <fysa> http://www.stratagus.org/screenshots.shtml
Jan 28 01:24:25 <pupnik> yes
Jan 28 01:24:39 <pupnik> you're hitting good ones i haven't touched yet
Jan 28 01:24:47 <fysa> and the Super Maryo engine
Jan 28 01:25:07 <fysa> I would love to see Frets On Fire working, but it uses PyOpenGL or whatever.
Jan 28 01:25:07 <pupnik> secret maryo chronicles?
Jan 28 01:25:27 <fysa> Frets On Fire would work with the bluetooth driver and Wii Guitar Hero controller.
Jan 28 01:25:47 <reinard> another finnish masterpiece
Jan 28 01:26:10 <reinard> back to background >
Jan 28 01:26:10 <GeneralAntilles> Stop trying to hax google, lcdd.
Jan 28 01:29:11 <fysa> if there is something someone would like compiled, let me know now while I'm still filling my queue ;)
Jan 28 01:29:46 <GeneralAntilles> A little of the world's 10 best beaches.
Jan 28 01:29:53 <GeneralAntilles> s/little/list/
Jan 28 01:29:53 <infobot> GeneralAntilles meant: A list of the world's 10 best beaches.
Jan 28 01:30:04 * GeneralAntilles mumbles something about muscle memory.
Jan 28 01:30:07 <fysa> ha
Jan 28 01:30:40 <fysa> we have directfb?
Jan 28 01:33:09 <aspiers> Argh, I *finally* have a working armel repository for emacs and all its dependencies, and I just found out I can't test it because /dev/mtdblock4 doesn't have enough space left :-(
Jan 28 01:33:26 <aspiers> Can I install to /media/mmc2?
Jan 28 01:34:24 <pupnik> is it vfat?
Jan 28 01:34:39 <pupnik> fysa not really
Jan 28 01:34:51 <aspiers> pupnik: yes
Jan 28 01:35:34 <pupnik> you should probably make an ext2 partition
Jan 28 01:35:52 <aspiers> is there any good reason why it was vfat in the first place?
Jan 28 01:36:03 <pupnik> so ppl could easily share data
Jan 28 01:36:20 <aspiers> ?? but this is the internal card ...
Jan 28 01:36:36 <pupnik> oh, that i don't know
Jan 28 01:36:48 <aspiers> I didn't even buy an external one yet.
Jan 28 01:37:02 <aspiers> It's the built-in 2GB internal (N810)
Jan 28 01:38:00 <aspiers> But how is it possible to install packages in there anyway?
Jan 28 01:38:18 <aspiers> dpkg --root ?
Jan 28 01:38:19 <pupnik> the root filesystem is on a different flash
Jan 28 01:38:27 <fysa> oh, rhythm box is the other that I needed to get working.
Jan 28 01:38:38 <pupnik> yeah fysa give that one a shot
Jan 28 01:38:54 <pupnik> it's pretty crude though imo
Jan 28 01:39:09 <fysa> I just want something decent with DAAP
Jan 28 01:39:24 <fysa> and that seems to be left out of Canola2 for now
Jan 28 01:40:06 <benno2> lcuk: thanks for the info about standby. basically i do vnc from the n800 to a linux vnc box but it could be that I dont use it for 10-20min and then often when i touch the screen the wlan is dead for 15secs or or works very slow. is there a way to tell the wlan to stay active all the time, at expense of reduced battery time
Jan 28 01:41:19 <k-s> fysa: what's decent to you?
Jan 28 01:41:35 <k-s> fysa: is itunes6/rhythmbox ok?
Jan 28 01:41:39 <lcuk> on os2008 you can configure the idle times in the connectivity settings (tap the network indicator) for different kinds of connections: wlan - unlimited
Jan 28 01:41:39 <k-s> if so, you can use canola1
Jan 28 01:41:51 <lcuk> dunno about older versions though
Jan 28 01:41:55 <fysa> that is true.
Jan 28 01:42:31 <benno2> lcuk: thanks i will try
Jan 28 01:43:46 <lcuk> but benno, it could be something from your linux side.  on windows when vncing to another box if i minimise vnc and leave it for ages it disconnects itself after about same timespan.  check you have lates tversion of vnc on linux box
Jan 28 01:45:20 <lcuk> also, depending upon what you are doing whilst minimised, it could be a memory issue - recovering from virtual memory or something???
Jan 28 01:47:28 <aspiers> so is it possible to install packages to the internal MMC and actually have them work more or less out of the box? or are a whole load of symlinks from the root filesystem required?
Jan 28 01:48:36 <aspiers> or do you have to boot with rootfs on MMC?
Jan 28 01:58:30 <jga23> how do I set the default editor?
Jan 28 02:02:24 <benno2> lcuk: thanks for the advices I will try tomorrow and let you know. bye
Jan 28 02:03:08 <xment> aspiers: or you can compile packages for yourself with root path for example /opt and package them
Jan 28 02:06:00 * lcuk goes to sleep
Jan 28 02:53:28 * czr peeks
Jan 28 02:54:34 <unique311> czr gets punched in the forehead for being nosy
Jan 28 02:55:14 * czr expertly avoids such greeting maneuvres and redirects all of the kinetic energy of unique311 into a svn repository of some stagnant open source project
Jan 28 02:55:20 <czr> ha!
Jan 28 02:55:41 <unique311> damn, wtf
Jan 28 02:55:46 <unique311> that was deep
Jan 28 02:56:11 <czr> yes. it's called attack by entanglement :-)
Jan 28 02:56:15 <pupnik> anybody want to patch an alsa backend onto snes9x 1.5?  it's halfways playable speed now @400mhz
Jan 28 02:56:28 <unique311> halfway
Jan 28 02:56:34 <korpios> hmm, anyone else getting an md5 mismatch on the MD5SUMS file itself for the N810 flash images?
Jan 28 02:56:35 <unique311> 25 fps
Jan 28 02:56:40 <pupnik> ?
Jan 28 02:56:50 <pupnik> depends on the game unique311
Jan 28 02:57:24 <fysa> enough for final fantasy, at least?
Jan 28 02:57:31 <unique311> you mean to tell me super mario is in my future pretty soon pupnik
Jan 28 02:57:56 <korpios> MD5SUMS : crc does not match (d41d8cd98f00b204e9800998ecf8427e!=affb99fab47fcac5dd48f82accd07a64)
Jan 28 02:58:05 <unique311> link me betas.
Jan 28 02:58:28 <fysa> how about alsa-oss?
Jan 28 02:58:31 <czr> korpios, crc?
Jan 28 02:58:35 <czr> korpios, try using md5sum program instead
Jan 28 02:59:04 <korpios> czr: nah that's just the output of the "cfv" program, it uses the term "CRC" for any checksum
Jan 28 02:59:19 <korpios> line from the MD5SUMS file: d41d8cd98f00b204e9800998ecf8427e  MD5SUMS
Jan 28 02:59:22 <czr> heh. poor cfv.
Jan 28 02:59:28 <czr> ah, that one. that's normal.
Jan 28 02:59:39 <korpios> output from "md5" binary: MD5 (MD5SUMS) = affb99fab47fcac5dd48f82accd07a64
Jan 28 02:59:40 <czr> they build the MD5SUMS file incorrectly. it includes the file itself
**** ENDING LOGGING AT Mon Jan 28 02:59:57 2008