**** BEGIN LOGGING AT Thu Jan 31 02:59:56 2008 Jan 31 03:00:05 thanks j0tt Jan 31 03:00:16 hmmm it uses xul :-( Jan 31 03:01:10 pupnik: i think there is still on issue when you release the swap-button before releasing the mouse (as in "pen up") Jan 31 03:01:15 one issue Jan 31 03:01:32 i thought about some nice solution but have not yet implemented it ;) Jan 31 03:01:39 otherwise it seems to work quite nice.. Jan 31 03:02:25 ah and it's right mousebutton on tab and zoom in (or was it out) to activate the left mouse button Jan 31 03:02:37 (as in hold zoom in and tap) Jan 31 03:02:41 to drag and use Jan 31 03:05:48 great stuff j0tt Jan 31 03:05:59 what do you think should be done for music? Jan 31 03:06:16 pupnik: ermm i have rebuild sdl mixer with ogg support... Jan 31 03:06:34 dunno it's not the best solution (perfomance wise) Jan 31 03:06:46 i guess gstreamer with dspmp3 would be better Jan 31 03:07:38 i have made some fairly compact mp3s for that. right now my music player patch launches gstreamer as a system call Jan 31 03:08:53 it's just a hacked audio/Midi.cc do you think you might be interested in implementing a better gstreamer mp3 player? Jan 31 03:09:25 http://pupnik.de/Ultima7_music_mono_mp3.tgz Jan 31 03:10:12 pupnik: yeah i guess system call is mad ;) a proper gstreamer pipe should not be that hard to implement Jan 31 03:10:23 pupnik: yeah already got that ;) Jan 31 03:10:55 speaking of perfomance: i did some (very very simple) float benchmark: http://pastebin.ca/885786 Jan 31 03:11:32 (with chinook gcc 3.4.4 and codesourcery gcc 4.2.1) Jan 31 03:12:25 higher numbers better i assume? Jan 31 03:12:32 yeah.. flops Jan 31 03:12:53 quite a jump from gcc 3.4.4 to gcc 4.2.1 if this is correct (esp. with vfp enabled) Jan 31 03:12:57 do you have to link in a different libm? Jan 31 03:13:26 no it worked.. hmm maybe i should statically link and test again Jan 31 03:13:53 wow...that's nice Jan 31 03:14:32 nothing like hardware you already have getting faster over time thanks to further optimization Jan 31 03:14:40 indeed ;) Jan 31 03:15:29 what is for> ? -mabi=aapcs-linux Jan 31 03:15:35 has anyone noticed that gpsd on maemo is just plain broken? Jan 31 03:16:11 uktube Jan 31 03:16:13 hbox.pack_start(self.send_button, True, True, 0) Jan 31 03:16:15 pupnik: This is also reflected in the -mabi=aapcs or -mabi=aapcs-linux switches to GCC: aapcs defines enums to be a variable sized type, while with aapcs-linux they are always ints (4 bytes). Jan 31 03:16:15 /usr/bin/uktube:519: GtkWarning: gtk_box_pack_start: assertion `child->parent == NULL' failed Jan 31 03:16:42 Any thoughts on why this error occurs? Jan 31 03:18:01 hm i guess it would really be wise to settle to oe for some optimized compilation stuff, or is there an easy way to integrate a gcc 4.2.x toolchain into sbox1 ? ;o Jan 31 03:19:28 * pupnik now thinks j0tt is sensei Jan 31 03:20:51 lol ;) Jan 31 03:21:33 hmm anyway i wonder on which parts a vpf enabled build would slow down... only things like gobject based transfers? Jan 31 03:21:55 i gues sdl usually does not make trouble as it's not really float affine ..:) Jan 31 03:23:10 how about we coordinate based off your patched exult 1.2 Jan 31 03:24:08 what would be your TODO list? mine would be 1) mp3 gstreamer music and 2) Xsp pixel doubling Jan 31 03:24:48 http://exult.sourceforge.net/snapshots/Changelog there's the changelog btw for cvs changes from 1.2 release Jan 31 03:24:54 yeah i guess i would fix this state bug that i *think* can occur (not noticed it while playing) Jan 31 03:25:04 yeah looked at it.. quite nice changes.. Jan 31 03:25:12 but not worth it if its unstable as hell atm :( Jan 31 03:25:21 How does it run now? Jan 31 03:25:29 yes i haven't found what's crashing yet Jan 31 03:25:54 fysa: the 1.2 release is pretty stable but also pretty old ;) Jan 31 03:26:02 you seen http://q-gears.sourceforge.net/ ? Jan 31 03:26:32 Final Fantasy 7 engine clone, also supports Final Fantasy Tactics I believe (maybe a different fork) Jan 31 03:26:43 I don't think it requires GL. Jan 31 03:26:59 The backgrounds are prerendered. Jan 31 03:27:00 ---+, it uses cross-platform graphics libraries (SDL and OpenGL) along with GCC, -... Jan 31 03:27:03 it does :/ Jan 31 03:27:10 hmm Jan 31 03:27:22 I thought you could configure without. let me try something Jan 31 03:27:41 you could run it through mesa.. Jan 31 03:27:55 i guess games like ff7 could be played for most parts with very low fps Jan 31 03:28:44 Final Fantasy Tactics is perfect for a handheld. Jan 31 03:29:39 oh, right. it wants automake 1.9.6 and I haven't upgraded yet. Jan 31 03:31:04 would be faster than through a PSX emulator, anyway. ;) Jan 31 03:32:44 Hey, speaking of emulators, is there a c64 emu that'll run on the handheld? It'd be cool to run demofiles on it instead of youtube-ing them. Jan 31 03:34:28 http://pupnik.de/frodo.html Esworp .. there might be better ones Jan 31 03:34:34 yes Jan 31 03:34:39 frodo is good. Jan 31 03:36:24 Sweet. Now to fix that uktube problem. I wonder if whatever is causing the problem is affecting other stuff, like erming, mebbe. Jan 31 03:38:59 Esworp: i would suggest to mail the author or open a bug report Jan 31 03:39:00 j0tt: if you want to link-in the exult_pocketpc.flx file, you will need the .h header file - i regenerated it Jan 31 03:39:28 pupnik: aye.. i realized this later .. Jan 31 03:39:32 Yah, i'm digging for his email addy presently. Jan 31 03:39:57 pupnik: but did not dig fix as it was too broken ... Jan 31 03:40:15 http://pastebin.ca/885804 j0tt Jan 31 03:41:00 yes that stuff does not cleanly compile in with the linux stuff Jan 31 03:41:07 his changes seem to be msvc project based Jan 31 03:41:17 no.. it compiled fine.. Jan 31 03:41:24 oh Jan 31 03:41:26 (some mvc fixed needed) Jan 31 03:41:46 but the release is unusable (at least the one from jan 14) Jan 31 03:41:56 more the snapshot.. Jan 31 03:41:59 does your patch to the cvs included changes needed to the automake stuff? Jan 31 03:42:21 hmm does not look like so.. Jan 31 03:42:21 like including in touchscreen.cc and Keyboard_gumps ? Jan 31 03:42:40 or is it? Jan 31 03:43:01 i flushed the cvs sources just kept this diff and got back to 1.2 ;) Jan 31 03:43:06 ok Jan 31 03:43:38 but in the long term the cvs version should be used... Jan 31 03:44:02 there are a number of updates since 1.2 but getting a stable, installable release is more important Jan 31 03:44:11 yep.. Jan 31 03:45:15 do you want my gimped Midi.cc? Jan 31 03:45:50 it's in the source http://pupnik.de/exultcvs_07_09_18_770.tgz Jan 31 03:46:00 yep.. looked at it.. Jan 31 03:46:32 ok so I'll.. build and test your 1.2, and then do the pixel doubling? or what would you suggest Jan 31 03:47:16 yeah you can do so.. i'll implement the (theoretical) fix to the fake_rmb in the next few days.. Jan 31 03:47:21 but it should work for now Jan 31 03:47:31 (hopefully ;) Jan 31 03:47:34 ok Jan 31 03:47:59 i'll keep a clean directory of your version on-hand and make diffs Jan 31 03:48:02 try to keep the patches in the debian/patches dir.. Jan 31 03:48:09 ok Jan 31 03:48:22 yeah..clean debian package would be the best to track changes to upstream Jan 31 04:14:35 * elb laments his ignorance of browser stuffs Jan 31 04:15:36 x device Jan 31 04:17:14 http://www.gossamer-threads.com/lists/maemo/developers/31491 Jan 31 04:17:14 blah Jan 31 04:17:18 No injection :( Jan 31 04:19:35 hey, at least monitor mode works more or less and WEXT can be implemented Jan 31 04:23:04 johnx: yeaaaah more less than more Jan 31 04:23:15 theres some definite Strange to it. Jan 31 04:23:20 eh Jan 31 04:23:41 it's actually more reliable than the wireless in my laptop Jan 31 04:23:59 It sometimes gets confused changing channels, and you have to screw with power saving to reliably get it working Jan 31 04:24:01 and kill off wlancond Jan 31 04:24:18 the wext patch is good enough that wpa-supplicant can use it in Debian and kismet works Jan 31 04:24:35 anything else is just gravy to me :) Jan 31 04:24:39 ok, see, why the eff don't people tell me about these things? Jan 31 04:24:58 Whatever. GPSD is still screwed so that has to be rewritten. Jan 31 04:25:14 on the N810? for the internal GPS? Jan 31 04:25:28 Oh for anything Jan 31 04:25:28 I'm more worried about the proprietary power management in the long run :/ Jan 31 04:25:36 Yup, the power management is a big issue Jan 31 04:25:41 yeah Jan 31 04:25:54 These would be the reasons kismet does not, infact, really work. Jan 31 04:26:04 Expect a test package once i rewrite the gps handling Jan 31 04:26:17 ...and the fact that battery charging is controlled by a proprietary user-land binary O_o Jan 31 04:26:23 because it would seem that the maemo gpsd can't, actually, parse nmea. Which is mind-boggling since that's the reason it exists. Jan 31 04:26:35 sounds cool. I don't have a GPS though so I'm just using debian's kismet Jan 31 04:26:51 Neither watcher nor poll mode works - gpsd can't figure out what the quality of the lock is, nor the altitude, nor the velocity Jan 31 04:27:01 gah Jan 31 04:27:02 so everything that uses it has to use debug mode and parse nmea themselves over tcp Jan 31 04:27:04 that's pretty bad Jan 31 04:27:13 well that's pretty broken Jan 31 04:27:17 sure is Jan 31 04:27:19 i'm astounded Jan 31 04:27:43 so i've got to backport the raw nmea support from newcore and link it to the stable gpsd handler, and detect the gpsd signature on maemo Jan 31 04:27:52 Waste of an evening Jan 31 04:28:33 that's why I'm trying to just cut my losses and drop Nokia's ITOS Jan 31 04:29:36 But seriously - people ahve been bitching for a long time about kismet on the nokias, and yet NO-ONE tells me that theres an additional set of wext patches? Jan 31 04:29:53 I didn't know either Jan 31 04:29:57 it's on the mailing list Jan 31 04:30:01 let me find a link Jan 31 04:31:27 https://garage.maemo.org/pipermail/cx3110x-devel/2007-November/000005.html Jan 31 04:32:38 any way to check the n800 battery life in percentage? maybe thru xterm? Jan 31 04:33:13 not that I know of Jan 31 04:33:24 legind: If you find out, let me know Jan 31 04:33:24 battery-status: http://olya.com/maemo/ Jan 31 04:33:26 I am trying to establish what is draining mine Jan 31 04:33:54 oh good. dbus. Jan 31 04:34:02 I'll write you a little network service where you can sms it a cameraphone picture of the battery meter on your nokia and it will sms you back a percentage Jan 31 04:34:47 although it's accuracy won't be that good Jan 31 04:34:52 hahah Jan 31 04:37:00 hmm, you're going to need to make sure there is nothing else red, yellow or green in the picture too Jan 31 04:43:28 so I'm going to start rolling up a new beta of an sd-bootable debian filesystem for the N8x0... Jan 31 04:43:29 It will probably be in the range of a couple hundred MB this time Jan 31 04:44:33 anyone interested in hosting it? Jan 31 04:49:38 * kennyyu is reading the Mozilla codes... Jan 31 04:55:39 I can stick it up at the same location if you'd like. Jan 31 04:56:23 that would be great. Hopefully after this I'll be able to release small .debs to do updates... Jan 31 04:56:49 either way. Jan 31 04:57:56 hmm Jan 31 04:58:03 just happy to have debian at all :) Jan 31 04:58:17 well this is much, much better relase than last time Jan 31 04:58:29 Any progress with dsme? Jan 31 04:58:52 I am going on a trip next week and thinking of picking up a bluetooth mouse for 'laptop' mode. Jan 31 04:58:57 (i.e., booting debian) Jan 31 04:59:00 Haha Jan 31 04:59:03 That would be so win. Jan 31 04:59:39 fysa, well this will include a nice GUI way to pair BT devices :) Jan 31 04:59:53 very nice. Jan 31 05:00:03 I wonder if we can get USB video working. Jan 31 05:00:16 slow down their, turbo :P Jan 31 05:00:47 haha Jan 31 05:00:54 also, this time (thanks to the pkg-maemo guys) it boots into ... hildon-desktop Jan 31 05:01:10 leafpad installs and runs with only dependency modifications Jan 31 05:01:13 then we can use xdm to switch? Jan 31 05:01:23 or just write a script to swap .xinitrc Jan 31 05:02:17 They did it through an init script that just drops you into hildon desktop, so I stopped having it call /root/.xinitrc from rc.local Jan 31 05:02:36 it's really easy to change back though Jan 31 05:02:40 Can you send stop to kill it? Jan 31 05:02:50 hildon-desktop? Jan 31 05:02:52 right Jan 31 05:02:58 yeah, or just find a way to crash it Jan 31 05:03:02 just as easy Jan 31 05:03:29 * GeneralAntilles goes ignorant-mode. Jan 31 05:03:37 Can we boot from multiple partitions on one SD card? Jan 31 05:03:45 GeneralAntilles, yes Jan 31 05:03:51 Ah, good. Jan 31 05:03:53 do you have boot-from-sd setup? Jan 31 05:03:59 Not yet. Jan 31 05:04:09 ah, it will tell you how in the howto Jan 31 05:04:24 I will boot into debian and rootstrap scratchbox1. ;) Jan 31 05:04:48 * johnx kries emo tears for fysa's tablet Jan 31 05:05:05 GeneralAntilles, actually, you can boot from any filesystem you can mount in initfs Jan 31 05:05:23 NFS, USB stick, sshfs, Jan 31 05:05:26 yes. Jan 31 05:05:29 a tiny HDD. Jan 31 05:05:36 with full-on debian Jan 31 05:05:55 how fast is the USB2.0 bus? Jan 31 05:06:04 and how hard does it push the cpu? Jan 31 05:06:09 on the tablet...no idea Jan 31 05:06:24 heh, you could rubberband it to the back of your tablet and include a USB power injector and some batteries Jan 31 05:06:31 it would be awesome Jan 31 05:06:36 Guess I'll chop up my 8GB and give myself a back-up OS2008 partition and Debian. Jan 31 05:06:40 I'm just thinking to use it as a pseudo-desktop, but yeah. Jan 31 05:06:58 swap on HDD would be much improved Jan 31 05:07:10 maemo chess has no online feature? there should be an open-specification online chess protocol Jan 31 05:07:14 I bet that would feel like a large performance increase. Jan 31 05:07:27 dreamchess compiles cleanly I believe Jan 31 05:07:30 I was hunting the other day Jan 31 05:07:41 maemo Chess pwns me. Jan 31 05:08:19 ah, this is what I was thinking of when I sad attach a battery+usb drive to the tablet: http://blog.russnelson.com/2007/10/05 Jan 31 05:08:44 oh, no, not that dreamchess. Jan 31 05:08:52 Photoshop makes me feel like an alchemist. Jan 31 05:09:31 isn't that the most awesome battery addon ever? :D Jan 31 05:09:47 haha Jan 31 05:09:50 that is incredible. Jan 31 05:10:35 right, so I have a 20GB 1.8" HD and I'll need to get a USB charger and a small passive hub Jan 31 05:11:02 battery? Jan 31 05:11:23 one of those battery packs with a USB host port Jan 31 05:11:27 http://www.pcmall.com/pcmall/shop/detail.asp?dpno=552154&Redir=1&description=i.Perris-SUPER20%20Handheld%2020GB%201.8%20Hard%20Drive%20&%20LCD%20Indicator%20USB2.0%20OTG%20Two%20Way%20Copy-External%20Hard%20Drives Jan 31 05:11:51 pretty cool Jan 31 05:11:53 rather steep Jan 31 05:11:56 yes Jan 31 05:11:58 need to find a case-only Jan 31 05:15:39 2.5" are dirt cheap Jan 31 05:15:44 http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817155222 Jan 31 05:15:59 that's pretty cool. Jan 31 05:16:38 not bad but I'd pay $10 or even $20 more for something that got better reviews Jan 31 05:16:44 :P Jan 31 05:16:49 hey rm_you :D Jan 31 05:16:52 :) Jan 31 05:17:32 Russ Nelson of any relation> Jan 31 05:17:33 ? Jan 31 05:18:51 rm_you: yes. Jan 31 05:19:01 ah :P Jan 31 05:19:24 interesting! not what i was referring to, actually, but interesting nonetheless :P Jan 31 05:19:59 johnx: thanks .... glad you like it. Jan 31 05:20:02 shouldn't we have enough power for a 1.8" drive via USB OnTheGo? Jan 31 05:20:03 too bad we don't have power over usb Jan 31 05:20:39 johnx: I'm working on a version of the battery pack for my n810 Jan 31 05:21:31 i found some cheap 3000mA baby C nimh batteries - Jan 31 05:22:16 nelson, very cool. Jan 31 05:22:26 fysa, almost certainly not Jan 31 05:22:36 my Zaurus won't even try to spin it up Jan 31 05:23:28 on a USB hub with 4AAA batteries+host port power it *tries* really hard to spin up but fails Jan 31 05:23:41 whats the news with the wiimote and the NIT? Jan 31 05:24:01 I think I might get a 1.8" drive and try it, could always use an injector cable if it doesn't work. I wouldn't mind carrying a mirror of my work stuff around easily. Jan 31 05:25:00 rm_you: so .... why did you mention my name? Jan 31 05:25:10 http://www.compusb.com/inotgsehadre.html Jan 31 05:25:21 the link he posted earlier Jan 31 05:25:30 i was asking john if it was someone he was related to Jan 31 05:25:55 but I was too dull to get the connection :D Jan 31 05:25:58 Ah! Jan 31 05:26:08 that's not too bad. Jan 31 05:28:17 http://www.usbgo.com/ Jan 31 05:28:25 three AAA's, $40, and slightly ugly Jan 31 05:29:27 yeah, that's pretty ugly Jan 31 05:30:31 It's a shame that theres absolutely no reason to hook my camera up to my nokia Jan 31 05:30:38 because i've got more space in the cam than the 810 Jan 31 05:30:43 why not? Jan 31 05:30:50 you can use the nokia to upload straight to flickr/picasa Jan 31 05:30:51 dragorn, use it the other way around? Jan 31 05:31:01 johnx: can't do UMS on the cam Jan 31 05:31:29 as in: "it won't act like a card reader" ? O_o Jan 31 05:31:34 correct Jan 31 05:31:46 that's unfortunate :/ Jan 31 05:31:53 * dragorn shrugs Jan 31 05:32:13 Is the reboot actually required after each filesystem format? Jan 31 05:32:13 I had a great idea involving that "friendly plastic" stuff from russ' battery-mod and a camera too :D Jan 31 05:32:37 format? no. repartition? almost certainly not. Jan 31 05:32:42 fysa: if I used either, and if I shot in a format that they accepted :) Jan 31 05:32:52 the kernel is smart enough to reread the partition table Jan 31 05:32:56 :) Jan 31 05:33:03 if you're paranoid, pull the card and plug it in again Jan 31 05:33:04 The guides have stuff like this: mkdosfs /dev/mmcblk1p1; shutdown -r now Jan 31 05:33:17 yeah, well they also have you mount the card to /floppy Jan 31 05:33:19 mainly i'd be interested in being able to move the files, but not having anything large enough to be worth moving to knocks that plan out Jan 31 05:33:31 Ha Jan 31 05:33:34 Just making sure Jan 31 05:33:43 GeneralAntilles, it's a historical artifact from the late 90's Jan 31 05:33:53 now it's a part of the Linux cargo-cult subconscious Jan 31 05:34:03 phenny, tell hilde "The Science of Affairs with Librarians: http://www.marginalrevolution.com/marginalrevolution/2008/01/what-if-you-alw.html" Jan 31 05:34:18 except that some block devices don't rescan cleanly, and if you're doing stuff with jffs you probably want to reboot to be sure :P Jan 31 05:35:23 oops, wrong channel. Jan 31 05:35:39 dragorn, ok. that makes sense Jan 31 05:36:11 johnx: for intel, it's definitely an artifact of ye olden days Jan 31 05:36:40 johnx: I might have a moment of hesitation about embedded flash, just because they're often a little funny. A SD card is probably less funny. Jan 31 05:37:50 yeah, I've had an ARM Linux handheld of one type or another since 2003 and I've stayed the hell away from repartitioning embedded flash :) Jan 31 05:38:51 I've never had a problem with SD cards not having their partition table rescanned (except when it's rescanned and thus automounted before I can reformat) Jan 31 05:43:21 * GeneralAntilles fails at Linux filesystem tools. Jan 31 05:43:38 uh oh Jan 31 05:43:43 ah, sfdisk? Jan 31 05:43:52 Mostly. Jan 31 05:44:08 seriously, plain fdisk is almost more friendly Jan 31 05:44:12 mmcblk0p[23] don't exist Jan 31 05:44:36 you repartitioned and they don't exist? Jan 31 05:44:39 take out card, reinsert Jan 31 05:45:42 I'm really tempted to compile a copy of cfdisk just so that I never have to use sfdisk again Jan 31 05:45:58 I almost want an AppleTV to hack around on. Jan 31 05:46:00 Aha . . . genius! Jan 31 05:46:41 amazing... usb otg works on my n810 Jan 31 05:46:43 note: the N8x0 will *not* rescan your card after reparitioning so you actually do need to either reinsert it or reboot Jan 31 05:46:47 used a flash drive Jan 31 05:47:08 so that means I get to eat my words from 10 minutes ago Jan 31 05:47:09 heh Jan 31 05:47:25 Reinsert is easy than a reboot. Jan 31 05:47:33 s/easy/easier/ Jan 31 05:47:34 GeneralAntilles meant: Reinsert is easier than a reboot. Jan 31 05:47:45 yes...I didn't think either would be required Jan 31 05:48:05 Maybe sfdisk doesn't actually ask the kernel to rescan the partitions? Jan 31 05:48:11 Haven't a clue. Jan 31 05:48:42 * johnx builds cfdisk Jan 31 05:48:48 seriously...sfdisk is horrible Jan 31 05:52:45 Ah, sweet, I don't have to look at the Nokia logo at all anymore. Jan 31 05:53:01 :) Jan 31 05:54:08 Where's your wiki page, johnx? Jan 31 05:55:01 http://www.internettablettalk.com/wiki/index.php?title=Debian Jan 31 05:55:11 guess I should link it from the front page of the wiki... Jan 31 05:55:45 GeneralAntilles, I'll have a new release out in a couple hours though and it's the end of the month and I have 5GB of transfer to kill today :D Jan 31 05:55:53 would the 4.8V from 4x AA NiMH cells be too low for the 5V power input of N8x0? Jan 31 05:56:07 johnx, that's what I'm gearing up for. :D Jan 31 05:56:10 ah Jan 31 05:56:39 a lot of the instructions on that are kind of outdated Jan 31 05:57:11 these 5v external Li-Ion battery packs are like 70 euro in germany Jan 31 05:57:21 ouch Jan 31 05:57:27 4xAA @ 2300Mah would be about 7 euro with charger Jan 31 05:59:44 sheez, generic bp-4ls on ebay are like 3-9 euro Jan 31 05:59:56 wow Jan 31 06:00:11 original nokia 40 euro Jan 31 06:00:18 * johnx is so happy our devices use popular batteries Jan 31 06:00:36 ah found some for 25 euro too Jan 31 06:00:37 yeah Jan 31 06:03:42 found one that looks decent for 9 eu Jan 31 06:09:31 Alright, rootfs is copying. . . . Jan 31 06:10:35 alright, wireless w/ wpa, should work "out of the box" now :) Jan 31 06:12:03 but I never figured out how to set the MAC back to the actual default :| Jan 31 06:16:33 Erg Jan 31 06:16:59 How can I edit /mnt/initfs/bootmenu.sh when /mnt/initfs/ is mounted as read-only? Jan 31 06:17:13 * GeneralAntilles is mildly out of his depth. Jan 31 06:17:19 which HOWTO are you following? Jan 31 06:17:28 http://www.wahlau.org/fun_with_n800_booting_n800_internet_tablet_from_sd_card#3 Jan 31 06:17:30 perhaps mount -o rw,remount /mnt/initfs will help Jan 31 06:17:58 ah Jan 31 06:18:16 also, fanoush changed it...you want to edit bootmenu.conf I think Jan 31 06:18:43 also, if you edit the bootmenu.conf file before running initfs_flasher (sp?) then it will copy it to initfs for you Jan 31 06:19:55 Ran the intfs_flash already. Jan 31 06:20:00 Where is bootmenu.conf? Jan 31 06:20:15 also in initfs Jan 31 06:20:20 did the remount work? Jan 31 06:20:36 Was about to find out until you started on about a .conf. :P Jan 31 06:22:11 Eh, "No space left on device" Jan 31 06:22:22 yeah Jan 31 06:22:32 they crammed it pretty tight Jan 31 06:23:28 Then how do I get an option for Debian and an option for OS2008 (mmc2) into the bootmenu? Jan 31 06:23:52 let me dig into the initfs readme ... Jan 31 06:24:58 you might just need to reboot to make the kernel free up a page or two on /mnt/initfs Jan 31 06:25:25 Will try Jan 31 06:25:35 or just install the initfs thing again Jan 31 06:25:56 Modify the bootmenu.sh in the initfs_flash directory then re-run? Jan 31 06:26:17 modify the bootmenu.conf then rerun initfs_flasher Jan 31 06:32:31 Ah, beautiful. Thanks, johnx. Jan 31 06:32:37 yay! Jan 31 06:32:53 now you are free from the worry of an unbootable tablet Jan 31 06:32:58 Hehe Jan 31 06:33:03 plus this makes backups so stupid easy Jan 31 06:34:00 * GeneralAntilles waits for Debian. Jan 31 06:44:57 ok the 770 is amazing. I've had it connected to wlan with opera open to my homepage for like 32 hours Jan 31 06:45:13 on battery. and i can ping it from my pc Jan 31 06:45:49 how the heck does the 770 go to sleep and then wake up when it gets pinged? Jan 31 06:45:50 amazing Jan 31 06:46:07 does the first ping take longer than other others? Jan 31 06:46:13 oh yes it takes a while Jan 31 06:46:29 I think that's your answer then :) Jan 31 06:46:33 i haven't been using it of course Jan 31 06:46:50 just occasional taps to make sure it's till alive Jan 31 06:47:01 i just think it's incredible Jan 31 06:47:25 yeah, Nokia's power saving is pretty good. I just wish it wasn't closed source :( Jan 31 06:47:31 lowest display brightness, oh, and cpu monitor is running Jan 31 06:47:54 and my site has no javascript Jan 31 06:47:57 i guess so Jan 31 06:48:43 are there external bp-4l chargers? Jan 31 06:49:17 http://www.internettablettalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=15388 aha Jan 31 07:11:34 http://www.amazon.de/Akku-Ladeger%C3%A4t-f%C3%BCr-6V-7-Li-Ion-Akkuspacks/dp/B000UOJBOC/ref=sr_1_115?ie=UTF8&s=ce-de&qid=1201763401&sr=1-115 Found a charger that might be able to charge the bp-4l Jan 31 07:12:17 I would be careful of charging Lithium Ion batteries in anything except an official charger... Jan 31 07:12:57 People who fly RC airplanes that run on Li-Ion batteries have found out they can be a serious fire risk if charged incorrectly Jan 31 07:14:17 Yes, but think of all the fun you're missing out on! Jan 31 07:14:22 hmrm. crazy how cheap some stuff is - here's a charger from hong kong for $1.99 Jan 31 07:14:28 http://cgi.ebay.com/zd243-USB-Battery-Charger-For-Nokia-BP-4L-E90-E61i-NEW_W0QQitemZ330207407640QQcmdZViewItem?IMSfp=TL080127159a15094 Jan 31 07:14:34 danger! danger! Jan 31 07:14:57 Danger, Will Robinson! Jan 31 07:15:02 guess i'll just swap them and forget about chargers Jan 31 07:15:51 I have two 770s for battery charging. Jan 31 07:17:30 two links: http://www.microrccenter.com/forum/index.php?showtopic=34874 & http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showthread.php?t=209187 Jan 31 07:18:04 lol Jan 31 07:18:54 i remember you always saying you would want to charge them outside, far away from anything, in fireproof buckets :P Jan 31 07:19:21 I don't even think $1.99 covers the component cost of a lithium ion battery charger... Jan 31 07:23:20 Hah Jan 31 07:23:35 Li ion is the safest thing to charge Jan 31 07:23:49 They regulate themselves Jan 31 07:24:07 <_< Jan 31 07:24:07 it depends on the battery... Jan 31 07:25:30 Sure chinese batteries named after ikea furniture may be unstable Jan 31 07:30:18 johnx, ETA? :D Jan 31 07:34:56 later Jan 31 07:34:58 after dinner :P Jan 31 07:39:38 johnx: how much space do i need on my SD Jan 31 07:40:50 maybe ~1GB Jan 31 07:41:14 morning all Jan 31 07:41:43 anybody have 'flex' for chinook? Jan 31 07:41:55 johnx: hrm. i'd be down with trying it :) Jan 31 07:42:54 pupnik_: http://www.atoker.com/webkit-maemo/ Jan 31 07:43:21 thank Yuuu! Jan 31 07:44:36 welcome :-) Jan 31 08:05:02 morning Jan 31 08:12:05 morning all Jan 31 08:12:14 Why the default /home/user look like on a normal OS2008 install? Jan 31 08:12:44 hrw: Am very happy using OE to build .debs :) Jan 31 08:13:08 johnx: when you get back from dinner or whatever, just tell me what i need to DL or point me at your instructions (i assume you posted them somewhere) Jan 31 08:13:48 s/Why/What does/ Jan 31 08:24:15 what do you think the best way to use a vfp libm with Octave would be? Jan 31 08:24:27 alter LD_LIBRARY_PATH before running Octave? Jan 31 08:24:53 Not sure I want to try altering the Octave Makefiles to statically link a vfp libm Jan 31 08:25:29 what is "OE"? Jan 31 08:25:32 <|tbb|> morning Jan 31 08:25:36 OpenEmbedded Jan 31 08:25:43 link? Jan 31 08:26:00 matmo: http://www.openembedded.org/ Jan 31 08:26:06 thks Jan 31 08:26:27 Assuming these debs work, it's far nicer than messing about in Scratchbox Jan 31 08:27:24 partly because it has lots and lots of build recipes provided Jan 31 08:27:59 interesting Jan 31 08:28:39 lardman: did you see j0tt's vfp floating point test? does one need to link-in a different libm statically to make use of vfp? Jan 31 08:29:01 pupnik: no, do you have a link? Jan 31 08:29:17 pupnik: and no, you don't need a vfp libm unless you are going to use trig functions, etc. Jan 31 08:30:11 pupnik: I do of course have my own benchmark tests (http://people.bath.ac.uk/enpsgp/benchmarks/) Jan 31 08:30:52 http://pastebin.ca/885786 lardman Jan 31 08:30:56 lardman: cool Jan 31 08:31:34 lardman: MACHINE="nokia800" CPU_FEATURES="vfp" will give you vfp Jan 31 08:32:22 hrw: ah, okay, I was going to edit conf/machines/include/tune-arm1136jf-s.inc Jan 31 08:32:46 lardman: CPU_FEATURES is new stuff which I still did not documented ;( Jan 31 08:32:58 np, thanks for the pointer :) Jan 31 08:33:26 do you reckon fiddling with LD_LIBRARY_PATH is the easiest method? Jan 31 08:34:24 hmm, compiler error building gnuplot Jan 31 08:35:43 so this ~50 MFlop looks roughly equiv to a ~350 mhz Pentium II Jan 31 08:37:47 pupnik: more benchmarks here: http://hbmobile.org/wiki/index.php?title=Application_Processor_Benchmarks Jan 31 08:38:58 what do you guys think of those CFLAGS? Jan 31 08:39:04 Morning, all Jan 31 08:39:42 CFLAGS -s -static -O3 -fomit-frame-pointer -Wall -fforce-addr -fforce-mem -falign-loops=2 -falign-functions=2 -falign-jumps=2 -funroll-loops -mfpu=vfp -mfloat-abi=softfp Jan 31 08:40:32 iirc that's what I was told would produce the best code Jan 31 08:40:47 i notice they didn't use -march or -mtune or -mcpu on the N800 Jan 31 08:40:55 no I didn't Jan 31 08:41:11 oh that's your comparison between PXA, i.MX31 etc? Jan 31 08:41:21 my data for the 770 and N800 Jan 31 08:41:30 ok Jan 31 08:42:16 but yeah, you might get some more speed out of it with different options Jan 31 08:43:07 not to mention the faster processor :) Jan 31 08:43:48 thanks, interesting stuff to try Jan 31 08:45:30 Curious error message - make: arm-linux-gcc: Command not found Jan 31 08:46:11 maybe it can't follow a link? Jan 31 08:47:10 http://pastebin.ca/885966 Jan 31 08:48:18 pupnik, how's Synergy coming? Jan 31 08:49:01 haven't done anything with it - just tried the old version without visible X pointer Jan 31 08:49:57 There's a thread, IIRC, on ITT called "preliminary mouse support" - not read it, but presumably that solves the invisible X pointer problem Jan 31 08:51:06 https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1109 will be probably never solved ;( Jan 31 08:51:07 you can copy over another x pointer i guess Jan 31 08:52:44 hrw: As you're using an unsupported locale, I fear it will be some way down their priority list Jan 31 08:52:49 hrw: :( Jan 31 08:53:57 hmm, something's clobbering my path Jan 31 08:54:09 lardman: you know how I care about it? not at all. I just assume that system is broken Jan 31 08:55:09 a bit annoying though, but not something that affects you too much at least Jan 31 08:55:17 lardman: it does Jan 31 08:55:37 as maemo does not have a way to set 24 clock instead of am/pm one Jan 31 08:56:23 ah, the clock-linked-to-locale issue Jan 31 08:56:31 thanks to the guys working on debianish tools -- quilt available in scratchbox now Jan 31 08:56:52 saves me so much time Jan 31 09:24:23 gah, i just almost tapped my monitor again with the stylus Jan 31 09:25:05 pupnik, I rarely try to do it with the stylus, but my thumb often goes pretty close to the laptop screen Jan 31 09:28:22 I do that all the time with laptops. Jan 31 09:31:11 hrw: I don't see CPU_FEATURES="vfp" doing anything in particular Jan 31 09:31:36 lardman: it should enable -mvfp Jan 31 09:31:43 hmm Jan 31 09:31:49 lardman: or maybe it is my local change - sorry Jan 31 09:31:53 np Jan 31 09:32:08 I'll edit the .inc file for the time being Jan 31 09:32:56 would libc be the first thing affected? Just wondering how much I need to rm -rf Jan 31 09:55:47 bon dia / good morning Jan 31 10:04:00 good morning Jan 31 10:04:12 huhu Jan 31 10:04:13 someone know format of /usr/share/i18n-locale-resolver files? Jan 31 10:04:17 whoa! why are CF cards still so expensive? Jan 31 10:04:52 * michele wonders about a CF-to-SD adapter Jan 31 10:08:09 they exist, and they're cheap Jan 31 10:08:14 and they can support SDHC Jan 31 10:08:21 can't seem to find sdhc ones Jan 31 10:08:46 and "cheap" means they still cost more than my 4G microsd... Jan 31 10:09:07 http://www.amazon.com/Type-Adapter-Supports-SDHC-SD-CF/dp/B000YZGCIU Jan 31 10:09:36 but you only have to buy the adapter once :) Jan 31 10:10:10 thanks Jan 31 10:11:48 how do i rebuild the deb without recompiling everything? i just want to change the Section: Jan 31 10:12:09 pupnik, fakeroot debian/rules binary Jan 31 10:12:27 ty Jan 31 10:12:31 if you compiled the package yourself and still has the build directory Jan 31 10:12:36 yes Jan 31 10:13:06 * pupnik jots that down Jan 31 10:56:20 anyone still around? Jan 31 10:56:39 I'm still here Jan 31 10:56:40 got a problem with my new n810, it won't turn on Jan 31 10:56:49 it was on, and i locked the screen Jan 31 10:56:55 and then it wouldn't unlock Jan 31 10:57:00 so i pulled the battery Jan 31 10:57:04 now it won't turn back on Jan 31 10:57:31 you've tried plugging it into power, right? Jan 31 10:57:35 yup Jan 31 11:00:41 sorry, I don't really have any ideas :( Jan 31 11:00:57 is there a hard reset switch somewhere that i dont see ? Jan 31 11:01:15 pulling the battery is the "hard reset" Jan 31 11:01:24 it might be worth searching on the internettablettalk.com/forums Jan 31 11:01:33 other people had similar problems with the N800 Jan 31 11:01:44 ok, thanks, i'll continue to do that Jan 31 11:18:18 is this review to be taken serious? Jan 31 11:18:24 http://www.cocoatech.com/weblog/archives/2008/01/08/nokia-n810-review Jan 31 11:21:28 Eh, it's an Apple fanboy reviewing a Nokia product Jan 31 11:21:43 we have Nokia fanboys review Apple stuff all the time on itt Jan 31 11:22:10 still, though harsh, I think he has valid points Jan 31 11:22:21 yeah, some of it is valid Jan 31 11:22:24 and I still love mi n810 Jan 31 11:22:42 whether people are willing to admit it or not Apple set a new bar for mobile UI design Jan 31 11:22:49 indeed Jan 31 11:22:50 as a reviewer he gets more things wrong than the N810 does as a tablet Jan 31 11:23:11 well, the part about scrolling is spot on Jan 31 11:23:32 i'll test that Jan 31 11:23:51 anyone have any ideas about the format of /var/lib/gsp/nvd_data ? Jan 31 11:24:06 I find scrolling is especially bad on reddit Jan 31 11:24:07 scrolling wikipedia runs about 12fps Jan 31 11:24:36 reddi has quite an awful html code, though Jan 31 11:25:11 scrolling reddit gets about 12fps Jan 31 11:25:25 and it doesn't jump back and forth? Jan 31 11:25:32 on a single post page, non on the main page Jan 31 11:25:39 take one with many comments Jan 31 11:26:04 scrolling with the thumb/finger! Jan 31 11:26:22 1) no i don't have an account Jan 31 11:26:32 2) any of these javascript monsters is a browser killer Jan 31 11:26:36 it's the FAULT OF THE WEB PAGE Jan 31 11:26:44 oh, no, not at all Jan 31 11:26:47 3) i don't even see finger scrolling working Jan 31 11:26:49 YES IT IS Jan 31 11:26:50 it's the web right now Jan 31 11:27:05 and it's the browser's fault if it doesn't work Jan 31 11:27:23 no Jan 31 11:27:27 the web page is SOFTWARE now Jan 31 11:27:34 and people who write BAD SOFTWARE are to blame Jan 31 11:28:09 I think the problem there is not JS (gmail goes just fine), but the huge amount of nested tables Jan 31 11:28:12 i'm not going to upgrade to a Core2 duo just to browse some asshat's site Jan 31 11:28:30 we need a webkit based browser on the tablet like yesterday Jan 31 11:29:09 i quit using digg on my PC because the retards made it too slow Jan 31 11:29:46 pupnik: it is faster now I think Jan 31 11:30:11 I remember my Linux machine being unresponsive with Digg, though. Jan 31 11:30:21 yeah well webmonkeys who write browser-raping pages LOSE MY BUSINESS Jan 31 11:30:24 Hello there. Jan 31 11:30:38 hi kikka Jan 31 11:35:01 sorry for my tone there michele, i was just watching tourettesguy on youtube Jan 31 11:36:29 pupnik: don't worry, I'm fine Jan 31 11:37:09 i used to do consulting for a premier web-centric firm and i get angry about this stuff Jan 31 11:37:57 I work on the web for... eight years now ;) Jan 31 11:38:57 anyway, you won't see much faster scrolling until n9x0 Jan 31 11:39:54 f'n retards. "it doens't scroll at 60 fps' Jan 31 11:40:53 good morning Jan 31 11:41:07 huhu Jan 31 11:41:08 'mornin Jan 31 11:41:10 I don't need 60fps, I need reliable scrolling Jan 31 11:41:32 michele, does it "skip" up and down for you as well? Jan 31 11:41:51 What was that setting to change in about:config? Jan 31 11:41:56 johnx: yes, but only on some sites (reddit is the worst offender) Jan 31 11:42:05 I couldn't find it; the page does load eventually for me Jan 31 11:42:35 michele, ah interesting. I've been having some touchscreen problems and I wasn't sure if that was related or not Jan 31 11:42:46 j0tt: you around? Jan 31 11:43:09 johnx: scrolling with the thumb or finger is hard, sometimes it will select, sometimes you have to press very hard. using the nail or stylus seems to work better overall Jan 31 11:43:29 yeah, I just scroll lightly with my fingernail Jan 31 11:43:52 but some sites I can actually hold my finger (or stylus even) in place and watch the page skip up and down :/ Jan 31 11:44:03 glad to hear it's a browser issue actually :) Jan 31 11:48:09 urgh... I finally finished the article and the guy is quite a dork... Jan 31 11:48:39 yeah I read like 3 sentences and gave up Jan 31 11:48:50 I'm so sick of fanboys, no matter what platform they like Jan 31 11:48:59 check out the "operating system" section, priceless Jan 31 11:51:07 lardman: search for "delay" Jan 31 11:51:33 Blafasel: ok, thanks Jan 31 11:52:16 Urgh.. Now that review is quite harsh.. Jan 31 11:55:55 Hrhr.. I do have to agree with the GPS part, but the rest is really crazy.. Jan 31 11:57:01 I don't, it's not *that* bad Jan 31 11:57:23 you could see what was coming from the previous post Jan 31 11:58:02 his whole site is about apple stuff...I don't really think he had any interest in a fair review... Jan 31 11:58:11 few valid points though Jan 31 11:58:27 nokia's earplug sucks too Jan 31 11:58:34 "even a broken clock is right twice a day" Jan 31 11:58:47 michele: I can really support all his points: Worked only once for me. Never ever again, not outside or anywhere.. Jan 31 11:59:07 (All his GPS points, of course) Jan 31 11:59:51 The odd delays due to cpufreq are annoying Jan 31 12:00:30 I wonder how he does ctrl-o on an iphone Jan 31 12:02:08 lardman, echo performance > /sys/devices/system/cpu/cpu0/cpufreq/scaling_governor Jan 31 12:02:29 inz: yeah, but that sort of defeats the purpose ;) Jan 31 12:03:02 lardman, how about powersave then ;) Jan 31 12:03:15 yeah, I suppose it would be slow all the time then :) Jan 31 12:04:17 does it support conservative? that would be good Jan 31 12:04:42 michele, cat /sys/devices/system/cpu/cpu0/cpufreq/scaling_available_governors Jan 31 12:04:57 I still think a userspace one with more tweakable logic might be a good idea Jan 31 12:05:49 <|tbb|> re Jan 31 12:05:50 <|tbb|> what is cat /sys/devices/system/cpu/cpu0/cpufreq/scaling_available_governors that good for Jan 31 12:06:16 tells you which governors are available Jan 31 12:06:24 For cpu frequency scaling Jan 31 12:19:16 ondemand is default Jan 31 12:21:28 seemingly Jan 31 12:21:32 yes Jan 31 12:27:32 I still snicker because of that review. Priceless ;) Jan 31 12:31:02 New Debian beta release for N8x0 tablets! Get it while it's hot! Jan 31 12:31:05 http://sheeplauncher.net/debian-armel-n800-beta2.tar.bz2 Jan 31 12:32:06 and updated the wiki with new info: http://internettablettalk.com/wiki/index.php?title=Debian#HOWTO Jan 31 12:32:22 GeneralAntilles, ping :) Jan 31 12:34:09 has anyone been successfull in setting up usb-networking between n810 and ubuntu gutsy? (While following this guide: http://maemo.org/development/documentation/how-tos/3-x/howto_usb_networking_bora.html) Jan 31 12:34:50 not with that guide, but I've got it working fine under Debian Jan 31 12:34:56 what problem are you running into? Jan 31 12:37:09 hell heck it worked Jan 31 12:37:18 you're welcome :D Jan 31 12:37:25 I just needed to plug in the usb-cable before running ifup usb0 :) Jan 31 12:37:32 yeah thx for your effort :) Jan 31 12:37:55 it'll probably stop working as soon as I leave :) Jan 31 12:38:16 lol :) Jan 31 12:38:31 it's some kind of aura that causes other people not to be able to consistently reproduce computer problems around me :P Jan 31 12:39:18 now I need to ask another question :D Jan 31 12:39:37 how do I disable access control in X server on N810= Jan 31 12:39:50 and I really want to do this Jan 31 12:40:00 so that people can log in remotely? Jan 31 12:40:09 or rather access the X server remotely? Jan 31 12:40:13 xhost on desktops. Not sure about the N810 Jan 31 12:40:17 well I wanna record the :0 screen on my N810 Jan 31 12:40:39 with recordmydesktop Jan 31 12:40:42 LoCusF, from a desktop? or from the tablet? Jan 31 12:40:50 from a desktop Jan 31 12:40:54 OT: anyone knows a good USB WiFi dongle? Jan 31 12:41:07 johnx: I need to know how to pass the -ac flag to the X-server startup Jan 31 12:41:08 obviously working under linux Jan 31 12:41:09 have you tried setting up tunneling via SSH? Jan 31 12:41:14 oh yeah Jan 31 12:41:15 I wonder how one queries supl.nokia.com? Jan 31 12:41:23 but I don't know if it is slow Jan 31 12:41:29 hmm Jan 31 12:41:40 it would almost certainly have some performance impact Jan 31 12:41:43 and there might not be a listening tcp-port Jan 31 12:41:58 look in /etc/init.d/x-server Jan 31 12:42:11 by default the X server won't listen to TCP Jan 31 12:42:35 and like Blafasel said, you might need (or it would be easiest to use) xhost Jan 31 12:42:53 yeah Jan 31 12:43:23 the thing is that theres no xhost package in the repos Jan 31 12:43:28 but I gotta try a debian one Jan 31 12:43:57 lardman, did you find anything of interest RE: gpsdriver Jan 31 12:44:17 jku: /var/lib/gps/* Jan 31 12:44:26 jku: Trying to work out what nvd_data does Jan 31 12:44:39 am also looking at how one can query the Nokia AGPS server at supl.nokia.com Jan 31 12:46:21 I can't see anything about how one should connect to supl.nokia.com except someone saying that it requires TLS Jan 31 12:46:49 I wonder if N95 owners are able to intercept their GPRS data streams? Jan 31 12:46:54 lardman: My N95 connects to it over umts, but tracing that is hard :) Jan 31 12:47:24 so it doesn't use wlan even if it's available? Jan 31 12:47:28 ok xhost up & running Jan 31 12:47:42 nice Jan 31 12:47:43 X-Fade: 3G stuff? Jan 31 12:47:48 from debian sid armel? Jan 31 12:47:51 johnx: yep Jan 31 12:48:04 it needed libxmuu1 Jan 31 12:48:12 X-Fade: I suppose it might be possible to tell it to use GPRS and use a user defined proxy which you can query Jan 31 12:48:13 and here i was about to offer to try mudbuilder :) Jan 31 12:48:26 heheheheh Jan 31 12:48:50 lardman: Yeah, try to let it connect to my wifi and replace the dns entry.. Jan 31 12:49:40 the more immediate question is whether the ability to handle agps data is already in place Jan 31 12:50:13 johnx: there is no /etc/init.d/x-server in N810 but there is one at N800 with OS2007 Jan 31 12:50:41 hmm Jan 31 12:50:50 lardman, exactly but it seems fear of nokia legal prevents ansewring even that :) Jan 31 12:51:10 would be nice to hear something from them Jan 31 12:51:35 LoCusF, I have on on the latest OS2008 on an N800... Jan 31 12:51:42 johnx: oh :/ Jan 31 12:51:43 ugh j0tt... that 1.2 release is ollld Jan 31 12:52:00 johnx: well I have it too douh :)))) Jan 31 12:52:07 :D Jan 31 12:52:45 woops Jan 31 12:52:55 ran /etc/init.d/x-server stop Jan 31 12:52:59 and my n810 rebooted Jan 31 12:53:14 yeah, don't do that :P Jan 31 12:53:18 edit and reboot :D Jan 31 12:53:20 lardman, the guy mentioned as author in the gps library headers answered a couple of questions I had on the APIs. You could try asking directly... Jan 31 12:53:21 well not anymore :( Jan 31 12:53:26 johnx: yep :D Jan 31 12:53:40 jku: ah, ok, thanks Jan 31 12:53:52 lardman: what are you planning on feeding it with? (Either the AGPS or supl.nokia.com) Jan 31 12:53:55 johnx: the point of all this is to actually record an entire maemo desktop on n810 without too much of a lag Jan 31 12:53:58 lardman: I can only select mobile data sources for agps, it won't select my wifi AP. Jan 31 12:53:59 although it is a bit different situation Jan 31 12:54:14 Jaffa: dunno really, depends on what format it requires Jan 31 12:54:48 Jaffa: supl.nokia.com would provide data presumably, if we could work out how to query it, and if we can give that data to the GPS chip Jan 31 12:54:49 why gronmayer page gives php-info? Jan 31 12:55:06 X-Fade: thanks for looking anyway :) Jan 31 12:55:32 lardman: Still trying to proxy that one to a server ;) Jan 31 12:55:43 cool :) Jan 31 12:56:02 I click the topic looking repositories but got php-info page Jan 31 12:56:46 I found this http://www.colorado.edu/geography/gcraft/notes/gps/ephclock.html which gives an example of the amount of data we're talking about Jan 31 12:57:02 i.e. not all that much Jan 31 12:57:06 ah one t at the end was missing Jan 31 12:59:42 16GB sdhc in mail :3 Jan 31 12:59:47 thats 24GB n800 Jan 31 13:01:21 VO: [nokia770] 352x240 => 352x240 Planar YV12 [fs] [zoom] Jan 31 13:01:21 [nokia770] Using ARM JIT YUV420 scaler (quality=2) to scale 352x240 => 352x240 Jan 31 13:01:38 mplayer? Jan 31 13:01:44 mplayer 1.0rc1-maemo.24.n8x0 on n810 is broken Jan 31 13:02:01 it check for 770 and n800 but not for n810 Jan 31 13:02:49 what does it check though? Jan 31 13:03:17 it parse /proc/cpuinfo for 'Nokia 770' and for 'Nokia N800' Jan 31 13:03:23 ah, ok Jan 31 13:03:32 it should also check for 'Nokia RX-44' Jan 31 13:03:44 lardman: I'd guess supl.nokia.com takes - at a minimum - broadcast cell IDs Jan 31 13:04:26 Jaffa: yep, might not be the easiest process to go from geoclue -> Cell tower ID -> server Jan 31 13:04:58 but then the calculations could be run on another server Jan 31 13:05:32 this distortion/crackling on the n810 is amazingly annoying Jan 31 13:05:42 seems to be worst when playing dspmp3sink Jan 31 13:06:00 lunch time! Jan 31 13:06:03 cu Jan 31 13:06:56 hrw, it's strange that no one ran into that before...Does it still play video? Jan 31 13:07:12 lardman|away: Has Geoclue got anything for talking to a phone over Bluetooth? Jan 31 13:07:27 did we lose ssvb at some point? Jan 31 13:07:35 Jaffa, no Jan 31 13:07:53 jku: shame Jan 31 13:08:21 jaffa, true. Do you know if there's a (semi)standard way to get cell data over bt? Jan 31 13:08:24 johnx: yes - via xv Jan 31 13:08:29 Tak, activity did decline but he posted Jan 28 to ITT Jan 31 13:08:55 jku, libgammu ;) Jan 31 13:09:52 infz, I take that as a yes? you can get e.g. cell id over bluetooth without special software on phone end? Jan 31 13:10:02 inz, even Jan 31 13:10:03 this /etc/apt/sources.list is empty? despite i tried to add all the repositories for os 2008 Jan 31 13:10:21 hahlo, look at /etc/sources.list.d Jan 31 13:10:23 johnx: now I've got this error: http://pastebin.com/m4e3eb0fd Jan 31 13:11:01 hahlo, look in /etc/apt/sources.list.d/hildon-application-manager.list Jan 31 13:11:22 ok thanks there they were Jan 31 13:11:49 LoCusF, is that with xhost +desktop ? Jan 31 13:12:18 also got that gpg-key missing error from several ropositories, can it be fixed somehow? Jan 31 13:12:33 johnx: yep Jan 31 13:13:31 it seems that matchbox won't allow itself to be monitored :) Jan 31 13:13:43 ah Jan 31 13:13:50 maybe it's hiding something Jan 31 13:13:50 jku, I once managed to create a simple program that did just that Jan 31 13:13:51 :P Jan 31 13:14:00 jku, you might to need to know _something_ about the phone though Jan 31 13:15:00 inz, that is really interesting... I don't mind a few non-standard tricks. I'm just not interested if the phone needs some software installed Jan 31 13:15:12 GPG error: http://maemo-hackers.org mistral Release: The following signatures couldn't be verified because the public key is not available: NO_PUBKEY 5FD45CD3EA68E29D Jan 31 13:15:21 jku: no, I was hoping Geoclue might have something then I'd know if there was ;-) Jan 31 13:15:53 jku, no specialized software needed on the phone Jan 31 13:25:28 inz, true there is a GSM_GetNetworkInfo() that does return cellid. Very interesting. Jan 31 13:25:43 what's that part of? Jan 31 13:26:04 libgammu, (gammu-info.h) Jan 31 13:26:15 no idea how well it's supported Jan 31 13:26:51 should just be a pretty standard bit of info I'd have thougght Jan 31 13:27:26 or should I say piece of info :) Jan 31 13:27:33 Funny gps info page @ Nokia: http://europe.nokia.com/A4425308 Jan 31 13:27:37 yeah, but it has to do with cell phones so you're probably wrong :) Jan 31 13:28:04 perhaps, but gsm is the standard, so there shouldn't really be any differences between operators or phones Jan 31 13:28:35 though as you say, cell/mobile phones so who knows!? Jan 31 13:28:56 lardman|home, the bt interface is the problem I believe Jan 31 13:29:12 mm Jan 31 13:29:32 well at least it might be possible Jan 31 13:29:49 I'll definitely test Jan 31 13:30:09 cool Jan 31 13:45:49 hmm, gpsdriver doesn't have a main function Jan 31 13:49:32 * Jaffa wouldn't mind installing a small Java ME app on his phone to export its cell data over BT to his N810 Jan 31 13:50:22 Jaffa: do the standard BT AT commands not work/do enough? Jan 31 13:50:46 Anyone know how a file can get away without having a main function? Jan 31 13:51:07 but still have an entry point Jan 31 13:56:10 lardman|home: I've not found anything which says that there *are* standard AT commands for it (I'd love to be proved wrong, even if it required manufacturer-specific codes: there aren't that many). Jan 31 13:56:17 Is there a powertop port for chinook? Jan 31 13:56:45 Jaffa: what phone do you have? Jan 31 13:57:19 lardman|home: SE W850i Jan 31 13:58:15 lardman|home: Using an applet on your phone over bt would be overkill. I can already use my N95 gps for maemo mapper. ;) Jan 31 13:58:16 solmumaha: http://cellphoneforums.net/alt-cellular-ericsson/t246551-re-cell-id-k750i.html Jan 31 13:58:36 * Jaffa doesn't want a phone as big as an N95 if he's got an N810. Jan 31 13:59:05 Jaffa: I had a list of AT codes for a SE k750i (my last phone), try some browsing of the SE website Jan 31 13:59:29 Jaffa, yah an e51 would be nice instead Jan 31 14:03:22 Anyone familiar enough with BlueZ OTTOTH to know how I can send (and see the response) for random AT commands on an N810 to the configured phone? Jan 31 14:04:09 Ah, http://wiki.bluez.org/wiki/HOWTO/SerialConnections has a Python example Jan 31 14:04:24 http://blog.haerwu.biz/2008/01/31/first-days-with-nokia-n810/ Jan 31 14:05:10 hrw: you should get it syndicated on p.m.o Jan 31 14:05:54 Jaffa: why was that interesting to me? :) Jan 31 14:05:54 Or is it already? Jan 31 14:06:00 Jaffa: it is not Jan 31 14:06:18 solmumaha: ? Jan 31 14:06:32 hmm, so an elf binary actually starts at the _start symbol? What happens if there isn't one of these? Jan 31 14:06:44 16:07 < Jaffa> solmumaha: http://cellphoneforums.net/alt-cellular-ericsson/t246551-re-cell-id-k750i.html Jan 31 14:08:05 hrw: Do you have a maemo specific feed? I can add you to planet, if you like. Jan 31 14:09:03 X-Fade: I can create one Jan 31 14:09:49 hrw: It is better to have all posts on-topic, so if you can :) Jan 31 14:10:11 X-Fade: I know - my blog is on 3 planets already Jan 31 14:10:29 I saw that :) Jan 31 14:11:10 X-Fade: I have to decide which tag to use. probably 'nokia' one Jan 31 14:11:51 solmumaha: sorry, must have been a mistab Jan 31 14:12:31 np, i'll survive Jan 31 14:13:21 lardman|home: Found a doc on sonyericsson.com containing all the AT commands Jan 31 14:14:01 X-Fade: http://blog.haerwu.biz/tag/nokia/feed/ Jan 31 14:14:27 X-Fade: but I warn you that not all posts will be positive ones Jan 31 14:16:00 and it was all going so well with no crashes Jan 31 14:18:24 hrw: Do you have a maemo account? Jan 31 14:19:50 nmhjy4576i89p[0--0*/* Jan 31 14:19:52 + Jan 31 14:20:18 X-Fade: garage one? I have Jan 31 14:20:23 X-Fade: hrw@ Jan 31 14:21:37 Howdy all. Jan 31 14:22:22 Got an n810, wondering about a silly thing - I can't get youtube to play, it complains about old flash player or javascript turned off (which it is not). Am I the only one? Jan 31 14:22:34 (might be a better channel) Jan 31 14:22:50 hrw: Hmm weird. It doesn't exist on maemo.org, but does on garage.. Jan 31 14:23:07 gok1: enable it from the browsers looking class menu Jan 31 14:23:21 under components Jan 31 14:23:34 X-Fade: I registered ~hour ago Jan 31 14:23:47 hrw: Ah, that'll be it then ;) Jan 31 14:23:56 hrw: looks like you need mediaserv for your videos Jan 31 14:24:33 solmumaha: mplayer works with them Jan 31 14:24:47 no need to transcode them? Jan 31 14:25:04 * gok1 oh... Jan 31 14:25:27 solmumaha: those ones are 352x240 (grabbed from PAL tv) Jan 31 14:25:47 low bitrate too then? Jan 31 14:26:56 VIDEO: [DIV3] 352x240 24bpp 29.970 fps 335.6 kbps (41.0 kbyte/s) Jan 31 14:26:58 AUDIO: 48000 Hz, 2 ch, s16le, 128.0 kbit/8.33% (ratio: 16000->192000) Jan 31 14:27:46 ah, no wonder then Jan 31 14:29:37 Thanks! Jan 31 14:50:30 hrw: It has been added. I see you even uploaded your picture ;) Jan 31 14:51:11 X-Fade: I did not liked avatar ;D Jan 31 14:53:16 hey guys Jan 31 14:53:39 now my n810 does not want to turn on ;( when I was switching it off it told 'battery full' Jan 31 14:54:00 <|tbb|> Disconnect: please change your nick, its not funny sitting on webirc and then your name appears ;) Jan 31 14:54:35 I would like to keem my drives mounted while being connected to a computer (via USB). Jan 31 14:54:47 Any ideas on how to do that? Jan 31 14:54:59 hrw: Try leaving it on the charger for a bit. My N800 does that from time to time. Jan 31 14:55:25 fysa: ugly hw bug? Jan 31 14:55:53 dtatulea, you could modify the script that unmounts them... Jan 31 14:56:02 maybe battery monitor bug. it feels like it wants more juice to power up than it actually has for some reason. Jan 31 14:56:12 dtatulea, or setup usb networking... Jan 31 14:56:13 maybe a capacitor Jan 31 14:56:46 fysa: but it told 'battery full' after poweroff ;d Jan 31 14:56:56 johnx: So it's not something deeper. Like the driver not allowing it... Jan 31 14:57:06 <||cw> dtatulea: what will the computer connection do then? Jan 31 14:57:20 dtatulea, for your desktop to access the cards they need to be unmounted on the tablet Jan 31 14:57:52 <||cw> dtatulea: default is for the desktop to mount he cards, and you can't have 2 OS's mount one card at the same time Jan 31 14:58:09 <||cw> would totaly destroy the file system Jan 31 14:58:11 johnx: Hmm, yeah, you're right...I guess. Jan 31 14:58:27 dtatulea, you could setup usb networking and transfer files that way Jan 31 14:59:24 so the cards would stay mounted on the tablet, and the computer could copy files to it with WinSCP (on win32) or ssshfs (on Linux/Mac) Jan 31 14:59:27 johnx: Or use scp if wireless around. Jan 31 15:00:24 hmm, I see gpsdriver outputs messages Jan 31 15:01:16 "inject customer conf" and "inject recv conf" amongst others Jan 31 15:02:05 so that nvd_data is probably the "customer conf" it's talking about Jan 31 15:04:06 though there is also a gps_serial_ports file scudding about, will have to take another look Jan 31 15:04:13 johnx: I was just searching a low level problem to pick on and fix. :) Jan 31 15:04:31 ah Jan 31 15:04:55 just looking for something to hack on? Jan 31 15:06:35 yeah Jan 31 15:07:41 well, I put up a tarball of Debian for the N8x0, here: http://www.internettablettalk.com/wiki/index.php?title=Debian Jan 31 15:08:12 that could definitely use some hacking, to be sure :) Jan 31 15:09:35 does anyone have experience with obfuscation? Jan 31 15:10:09 Ilkjne LBLLen23 lx00en Jan 31 15:10:31 proteous does. Jan 31 15:10:39 :P Jan 31 15:10:50 ah, pretty good too, I was wondering what he was saying ;) Jan 31 15:11:10 lol Jan 31 15:23:42 johnx: Hmm, interesting... I'll look into it. Jan 31 15:23:50 cool Jan 31 15:24:06 I should probably post a screenshot or two... Jan 31 15:24:14 that will be tomorrow though Jan 31 15:24:21 for now I need to get to bed Jan 31 15:24:26 'night all Jan 31 15:26:06 <|tbb|> night jx Jan 31 15:26:19 * johnx sleeps Jan 31 15:28:42 hello Jan 31 15:31:07 hi fugitivo Jan 31 15:36:17 Hello ! Jan 31 15:36:35 good news ... i can run glade-3 in scratchbox armel :) Jan 31 15:36:47 this will be usefull for onboard dev :) Jan 31 15:37:34 glade's UI is pretty unsuitable for tablet use, though Jan 31 15:38:35 tak yes ... Jan 31 15:38:57 but glade 3 should be better :) Jan 31 15:39:24 sometime is usefull .... better than editing xml in blind mode :) Jan 31 15:39:50 do people use glade for maemo development? Jan 31 15:39:55 * elb is somewhat surprised Jan 31 15:40:04 I do Jan 31 15:42:12 me too Jan 31 15:42:25 but not all the time Jan 31 15:43:24 finally got the IT tethered to my laptop with bluetooth pan Jan 31 15:43:44 I use it for _all_ my gtk/hildon apps Jan 31 15:45:14 not me as i code mainly in the train ... some of my gui was made in the code ... Jan 31 15:47:28 I code the gui Jan 31 15:48:14 ouch ... it s really small on the tablet ... Jan 31 15:49:28 and really slow ... snifff Jan 31 15:51:05 maybe a glade-2 instead a glade-3 will be more usefull Jan 31 15:53:42 I doubt it'll be substantially different Jan 31 15:54:37 I doubt the tablet is a very good development platform anyway Jan 31 15:54:44 wumpus > pfffff Jan 31 15:54:46 :) Jan 31 15:55:11 :D Jan 31 15:55:25 Tak> as it use different windows ... maybe i ll be able to see more than 1 property of widget Jan 31 15:55:44 as scrolling isn't possible due to the size of the property box :) Jan 31 15:57:54 hey all Jan 31 15:57:55 ;-D Jan 31 15:58:10 btw guys/gals...dont use the rss reader applet and let it scroll Jan 31 15:58:17 it eats ya cpu and slows ya device down Jan 31 15:58:19 hehe Jan 31 15:58:25 looks nice...works rubbish Jan 31 15:59:09 at first I thought I installed so much junk that the main menu just needed longer to load Jan 31 15:59:11 haha Jan 31 16:00:11 also...with older Access Points you might experience packet loss Jan 31 16:00:18 I think its a linux related issue Jan 31 16:00:39 bought a new wireless router ..with wpa-psk2 ..works fine Jan 31 16:02:02 yeah that's known it doesn't work with WEP very well Jan 31 16:02:25 works for me Jan 31 16:04:02 wumpus, yeh Jan 31 16:04:14 is ok though...that thing was very old and insecure Jan 31 16:04:18 well more insecure Jan 31 16:04:20 hehe Jan 31 16:04:23 so... Jan 31 16:04:33 ouch glade-2 as too many dependancy Jan 31 16:04:35 bought an all in one modem/router/adsl2 Jan 31 16:04:50 which then also replaced the adsl1 modem Jan 31 16:05:26 so, you have wpa2 aes? Jan 31 16:05:35 aes ? Jan 31 16:05:43 yeah nobody shouldn't be using WEP anyway anymore Jan 31 16:05:45 kind of encryption Jan 31 16:06:00 wumpus, you mean nobody should be using wep hehe Jan 31 16:06:09 zoran, errrm Jan 31 16:06:27 what ap you bought? Jan 31 16:06:34 I know what aes is... Jan 31 16:06:37 hehe Jan 31 16:06:47 didnt know some APs supported aes crypto Jan 31 16:06:52 LinuxCode: hahah yes I mean that Jan 31 16:06:54 zoran, nothing fancy.. Jan 31 16:07:01 DG834 netgear Jan 31 16:07:02 btw! Jan 31 16:07:04 well you have wpa2/tkip and wpa/aes Jan 31 16:07:08 netgear rock! Jan 31 16:07:10 most access points support both Jan 31 16:07:16 wpa2/aes Jan 31 16:07:16 they give instructions for linux users Jan 31 16:07:20 if anyone on my street thinks my 7600k dsl is worth leeching, more power to them Jan 31 16:07:27 wumpus, interesting Jan 31 16:07:32 760k Jan 31 16:07:39 dphil9000, thats not the point Jan 31 16:07:41 dang BT KB Jan 31 16:07:41 ;-p Jan 31 16:07:57 as a winblows user i.e. not a decent integrated firewall Jan 31 16:08:00 as aes is more secure, you should be using that if you have the choice Jan 31 16:08:02 yeah i know wep is lame Jan 31 16:08:06 I wouldnt want my AP to be used Jan 31 16:08:12 but still all wpa2 is hard to hack Jan 31 16:08:20 wep is trivial (ie, three minutes :P) Jan 31 16:08:30 wumpus, pre-shared keys is kinda .... secure Jan 31 16:08:31 lol Jan 31 16:08:38 unless your key is aaaa Jan 31 16:08:40 rofl Jan 31 16:08:49 but then you deserve whats coming at you Jan 31 16:08:51 indeed Jan 31 16:09:12 LinuxCode: pwgen generate nice keys Jan 31 16:09:12 wumpus, yeh when I cracked mine in a 10 mins Jan 31 16:09:22 I unplugged in Jan 31 16:09:30 but then I have gigabit in the house Jan 31 16:09:35 I dont wireless at all Jan 31 16:09:42 only using it because of the N810 Jan 31 16:09:44 kUApzoVb7Hcod4Ek43bFiapk4T7CrdCU for example Jan 31 16:09:50 if it wasnt for that Id switch it off Jan 31 16:09:52 I don't want to put cables everywhere :p Jan 31 16:10:03 hrw, yep use that to make passwords for bots Jan 31 16:10:23 wumpus, well I had the house rewired...the power lines were too few and insecure Jan 31 16:10:25 for wpa2 aes make a 65 letter pass Jan 31 16:10:32 after I fried a machine..it ws all replaced Jan 31 16:11:11 and then I took the opportunity to put 4 cat5e lines in Jan 31 16:11:19 LinuxCode: sure, but if you want to use your laptop/tablet everywhere in the house that'd be an awful lot of wire :) Jan 31 16:11:24 don't think my kids' xo laptop can use wpa Jan 31 16:11:32 for each room to accommodate VoIP and other future stuff Jan 31 16:11:39 neither does the old router Jan 31 16:11:45 dphil9000, isolate it Jan 31 16:11:47 dphil9000: usually it's just a matter of upgrading the wifi drivers Jan 31 16:11:48 should be ok Jan 31 16:12:02 wumpus, the card is integrated Jan 31 16:12:05 or chip Jan 31 16:12:07 ;-p Jan 31 16:12:23 of the xo doesnt support it chipset wise Jan 31 16:12:24 what does that have to do with upgrading drivers? Jan 31 16:12:25 dphil9000: it should be able to do WPA with a recent OS revision Jan 31 16:12:29 you are stuffed Jan 31 16:12:40 dphil9000, there ya go ;-D Jan 31 16:12:42 it has nothing to do with chipset support, encryption is done in software Jan 31 16:12:47 elb, interesting elb ;-D Jan 31 16:13:09 wumpus, ahhh Jan 31 16:13:10 wumpus: chipsets do have to support WPA Jan 31 16:13:20 yes I thought so too Jan 31 16:13:21 some older chips do not handle wpa Jan 31 16:13:25 although I really don't understand how or why Jan 31 16:13:28 i'm too busy playinng with my gentoo laptop and the n810 to botherr with the xo and security Jan 31 16:13:32 like my ME102 rofl Jan 31 16:13:36 atheros is the way to go Jan 31 16:14:13 elb: the drivers have to support it, and some chipsets might not have sufficient drivers, though those must be really crappily old Jan 31 16:14:21 zoran, I had a usb wlan adapter and bought a pc-card for my old laptop.. seems well supported Jan 31 16:14:24 thanks to atheros Jan 31 16:14:48 what os? Jan 31 16:14:58 any of you remember when you had major problems getting hardware to work in linux lol Jan 31 16:15:00 n8xx + evdo laptop = net and voip everywhere Jan 31 16:15:00 wumpus: yes, but -- it doesn't seem t obe able to be bolted on to pre-WPA chipsets Jan 31 16:15:02 yeah for atheros you can find anything Jan 31 16:15:04 zoran, fedora 8 Jan 31 16:15:14 elb: for my laptops it went ok Jan 31 16:15:32 wumpus: even Apple never supported WPA for their Orinoco AirPort cards Jan 31 16:15:35 it was indeed just 'bolted on' with a driver upgrade Jan 31 16:15:46 well yeah apple :) Jan 31 16:15:51 if the chipset has certain features, I think you *can* Jan 31 16:15:54 they want to sell more hardware :P Jan 31 16:15:56 but if it doesn't, I think you're lost Jan 31 16:16:04 openbsd has some strange decision for wpa Jan 31 16:16:19 apple sells the sizzle, not the steak Jan 31 16:16:40 they like n protocol Jan 31 16:16:54 not supported in linux and bsd yet, as I know Jan 31 16:17:21 no 802.11n? Jan 31 16:17:26 depends on the chip I think Jan 31 16:17:28 yeah, I'm reading a page here that says that early 802.11b devices need firware updates Jan 31 16:17:29 not on freebasd Jan 31 16:18:00 I'm sure some n devices must be supported in linux by now Jan 31 16:18:22 but yeah open source wifi driver development goes really slow due to political reasons Jan 31 16:18:25 at leaast in linux, i'd swear i saw n stuff in the kernel config Jan 31 16:18:44 it is a matter of openess of the hardware Jan 31 16:18:55 ~lart control flow graph flattening Jan 31 16:18:55 * infobot takes large quantities of Krispy Kream donuts and stuffs them one after another down control flow graph flattening's throat until control flow graph flattening puts on 150lbs Jan 31 16:19:14 yes the closedness of wifi hardware is forced for political reasons (ie, radios are dangerous mmkay) Jan 31 16:19:36 the newest intel 4965 is mostly open with a small binary firmware. that seems reasonable. Jan 31 16:19:40 green people living in radios could make invasion Jan 31 16:19:47 damn Jan 31 16:19:51 ~lart Tak Jan 31 16:19:51 * infobot whips out his power stapler and staples Tak's foot to the floor Jan 31 16:19:59 aww, why can't I get the doughnut one?! Jan 31 16:20:02 yeah, intel learnt a lesson Jan 31 16:20:13 Tak: I'll swap you Jan 31 16:20:28 * Tak will flatten control flow graphs for doughnuts Jan 31 16:20:34 dphil9000: this firmware is integrated into the card or a binary host blob? Jan 31 16:20:42 also taek a look at intell drivers for their graphical chops Jan 31 16:20:49 *chips Jan 31 16:20:51 binary driver that you install Jan 31 16:21:14 don't know how it works internally Jan 31 16:21:31 no full disclosure, probably Jan 31 16:21:43 those are bad as they tie you to a certain platform Jan 31 16:22:01 amd politics look better Jan 31 16:22:21 most of the driverr gets compiled, but the firmware file gets placed in /lib/firmware by the package insstaller Jan 31 16:22:47 Tak: I want them unflattened though! Jan 31 16:22:55 ooh so the firmware is executed by the device itself,then it's no problem Jan 31 16:23:21 tis iGo bluuetooth keyboard is nice on the n810, but the duplicate letters gets annoying Jan 31 16:23:24 it all started for atheros driver on freebsd Jan 31 16:24:13 ohh Jan 31 16:24:16 dphil9000: does the hardware have a busted debouncer? Jan 31 16:24:21 that'll cost you triple doughnuts Jan 31 16:25:08 debounccer? the springy things in the keys? Jan 31 16:25:29 no, the firmware which says "oh, these super-rapid presses of the same key are a physical phenomenon in the switching hardware" Jan 31 16:25:30 Do you think it's a legal requirement that integration companies (e.g. Ti for with the driver for the PowerVR) have to obfuscate their code, or is it more likely that Imgtech wrote a binary blob and that was linked in? Jan 31 16:26:27 switches do not cleanly move from on to off ... if a very short period of time as off is represented as 0, and on as 1, the press of a key looks like 0000000010101101111011111111111111011010100100000000 Jan 31 16:26:57 and if the hardware is fast enough to sense those transitions, it needs to say "OK, less than K 1s in a row is part of the bounce" Jan 31 16:27:24 well, they're all very secretive. a guy i know worked on network hardware with an nda from intel. he says their ethernet chipsets have way more capabilities than they expose to the public. Jan 31 16:27:30 so, my question is, is it simply a repeat rate problem (the keys are held too long), or is it a bounce problem? Jan 31 16:28:00 dphil9000: yep, it allows them to sell the same chip to different markets as if a different product Jan 31 16:28:16 i hit thee keys a normal amount of time, but multiiple keystrokess are sent to the IT. Jan 31 16:29:31 yeah, that's unfortunate Jan 31 16:29:32 the IT has 2 bluetooth connections, one with the keyboard, and one with tthe evdo laptop to get to the net. Jan 31 16:29:35 all hardware vendors do that, but some just disable the extra features in hardware (ie, by busting connections inside) instead of relying on secret firmware Jan 31 16:29:58 which is imo better Jan 31 16:30:54 i like to think if we can reverse engineer hard ennough we can find all the backdoors and seekrit features Jan 31 16:31:25 dphil9000: sure, but by then the hardware's beyond obsolete Jan 31 16:31:35 ndaa's are never roock solid, people leak info Jan 31 16:32:07 maybe some option in xorg conf or alike Jan 31 16:32:21 xkb-something Jan 31 16:33:36 * lardman doesn't really care about seekrit features, just the ones that are built in but not useable! Jan 31 16:38:54 anybody else using bluetooth pan on the n810? Jan 31 16:39:56 does mplayer on 770/800/810 work in console mode for internet radio? like "mplayer -cache 128 mms://station..." Jan 31 16:42:00 zoran: give me url of radio and I will tell you Jan 31 16:42:32 zoran: and nokia 810 does not run linux. you mean n810 ;) Jan 31 16:42:40 hrw, yep :) Jan 31 16:43:14 so what with mms:// station to test? Jan 31 16:43:32 eww mms Jan 31 16:43:39 something from live365.com Jan 31 16:43:48 counry Jan 31 16:43:54 *country Jan 31 16:44:01 country! Jan 31 16:44:14 humppa! Jan 31 16:44:36 Tak: humppa.. argh ;D Jan 31 16:44:48 zoran: you give me url, I do test. simple rule ;D Jan 31 16:44:57 k Jan 31 16:45:06 mms i detest Jan 31 16:45:11 mp3 i feel free Jan 31 16:46:21 s/free/patent-encumbered/ Jan 31 16:47:05 * LinuxCode doesnt live in the US Jan 31 16:47:11 * LinuxCode doesnt do software patents Jan 31 16:47:32 ttp://www.live365.com/play/167157?auth=6488e77f7651eb08e392f6efd5623f1d-1201826785-metal_blade_radio&tag=live365&token=67a3b0262bd1c678e039cfe6ab96f70d-4616310080100000&sid=212.234.187.150-1201797923678408&lid=j-fra&from=pls Jan 31 16:47:33 ? Jan 31 16:47:36 +h Jan 31 16:47:39 :) Jan 31 16:48:09 hrw, happy typing that in ;-| Jan 31 16:48:11 better ssh Jan 31 16:48:12 hehe Jan 31 16:48:59 huh, just cannot get addres of any of those graphical pages for country!!! Jan 31 16:51:32 AUDIO: 11025 Hz, 2 ch, s16le, 32.0 kbit/9.07% (ratio: 4000->44100) Jan 31 16:51:34 works Jan 31 16:51:55 http://www.sky.fm/mp3/country.pls Jan 31 16:52:26 k, gonna install it on gregale! Jan 31 16:53:54 hm, pls, asx, ram... Jan 31 16:54:48 hrw: does that mean you got your n810 back up ? Jan 31 16:59:55 cu chaps Jan 31 16:59:59 lardman: did you find anybody else interested in getting stuff running on dsp? Jan 31 17:00:01 ah Jan 31 17:00:09 not quite gone yet Jan 31 17:00:21 :) Jan 31 17:00:42 dhd is interested and just had an email from Philipp Zabel (on the list) about DSP stuff too Jan 31 17:00:53 so there seems to be some interest at least Jan 31 17:01:03 better than none i guess Jan 31 17:01:13 will check the list Jan 31 17:01:19 rm_you was also setting up a toolchain iirc Jan 31 17:01:29 it was off-list Jan 31 17:01:41 I should have said (from the list) Jan 31 17:01:57 anyway, really going now, might be on later at home, bye Jan 31 17:02:20 opk cheersk Jan 31 17:03:50 gilad: yes Jan 31 17:05:28 any hints? Jan 31 17:05:35 mine is still down Jan 31 17:05:45 no response to being plugged in Jan 31 17:06:04 leave it as it is Jan 31 17:06:46 plugged in? for how long? Jan 31 17:07:26 I did not checked time - it just started in one moment Jan 31 17:07:56 ok, thanks Jan 31 17:08:01 hi. anyone know of a good tutorial/sample app for writing a network connected app? the Maemo Connectivity Guide is just making me more confused... again! Jan 31 17:11:58 coffee88: If you just want to know how to use libconic, I suggest that you regexxer in tinymail. Jan 31 17:12:08 But that's just how to create a connection. Jan 31 17:14:06 ?? regexxer ?? Jan 31 17:17:50 so, after a few days with the n810 ... I have to say, some of the things I see a lot of complaint about I really think are quite good Jan 31 17:18:13 I haven't had even a *cold* GPS fix take more than 2 minutes or so, and fixes within 100mi or so have been taking <1m reliably Jan 31 17:18:20 and the handwriting recognition isn't too terrible Jan 31 17:19:15 elb, guess depends where you live Jan 31 17:19:39 cloud and stuff interferes Jan 31 17:20:17 this was under rain and snow conditions Jan 31 17:20:46 pupnik: I was trying to figure out how the external function calls into the kernel (_EAP_*) work in pcm2.o. Jan 31 17:21:00 lardman told me to look at the dsp_dld sources, and that's what I'm doing now. Jan 31 17:21:08 elb, whats your firmware version ? Jan 31 17:21:32 elb: I've had a very different experience with gps Jan 31 17:21:44 coffee88: It's partly wext ioctls and partly libconic Jan 31 17:22:10 mine is 2.2007.50-2 Jan 31 17:22:13 LinuxCode: good question ... how do I find that out without going to R&D mode? Jan 31 17:22:42 or do you mean the OS2008 version? Jan 31 17:22:42 control panel ---> about product Jan 31 17:22:43 coffee88: Generally if you just need to connect, you're going to want to look at the libconic API, there are actually several demos out there. It's just a refcounting API for connections, so you say "i want to connect" then "I'm done" and it handles the rest. Note: You have to be a glib/gtk app with dbus and a glib/gtk mainloop for that to work. Jan 31 17:22:51 os version Jan 31 17:22:52 coffee88: if you need to do deeper stuff - depends what you want to do Jan 31 17:23:03 2.2007.50-2 Jan 31 17:23:07 hmm k Jan 31 17:23:52 coffee88: wext scanning works, I'm working on some code for that right now. Injection doesn't. Rfmon does, but tends to be iffy and you need to make some invasive changes to the system to make it reliable (stop wlancond, disable power management) and i find that re-enabling power management doesn't work so well (at least, I can't do it reliably yet) so a reboot is needed. Jan 31 17:24:43 dragorn: that's what I keep hearing, but it's been great for me Jan 31 17:24:54 I kind of wondered if there aren't some problematic specific units out there Jan 31 17:24:57 elb: i spent last night writing gps code. I'm very angry at the gps. :P Jan 31 17:25:02 now, the map application is nothing to write home about Jan 31 17:25:18 I would prefer a Google Maps image stitcher. Jan 31 17:25:24 fysa: maemomapper Jan 31 17:25:28 but I think Google Maps broke that? Jan 31 17:25:43 not the last time I tried to use it, but that was a few weeks ago Jan 31 17:25:50 MaemoMapper will stitch Google Maps together and give me an image that I can pan around in? Jan 31 17:25:54 yes Jan 31 17:25:56 dragorn: I just wanna make a simple remote control type app that opens a socket to a server, sends a command etc... nothing tooooo fancy, I suspect, but still learing all this stuff... Jan 31 17:26:02 and I can give it plain text Google Maps queries? Jan 31 17:26:20 fysa: no, it's a gps/nav program that uses multiple map sources, one of which is google maps, as the backing image Jan 31 17:26:37 ah right Jan 31 17:26:39 I greatly prefer the vector data maps, but the mapper program interface is just poor Jan 31 17:26:58 coffee88: libconic is your friend. Theres some examples on the maemo site under tutorials Jan 31 17:27:47 dragorn: I looked, but couldn't see much.. is that all under 3. or 4. ? Jan 31 17:28:25 coffee88: Should be under 4. the magic functions are con_ic_connection_new and con_ic_connection_connect Jan 31 17:28:54 coffee88: that should give you some stuff to search on. basically you make a new connection with _new, then set up some dbus bindings to get the events, then request a connection, and wait for the dbus link to tell you if you've got it Jan 31 17:29:34 coffee88: it HAS to be inside a glib/gtk main loop or it'll miss the dbus events, so it raises the complexity of your app a fair bit - you'll have to do everything async instead of a simple socket/bind/write Jan 31 17:29:53 coffee88: but the docs should cover that Jan 31 17:30:27 dragorn: cheers. and damn. but thanks for the pointers. I assume it will make writing the server side code a bit more complex too then? Jan 31 17:30:32 coffee88: I believe they explicitly say that conic links the glib main Jan 31 17:30:40 coffee88: if the server isn't on maemo, then no Jan 31 17:31:15 coffee88: Your socket stuff is unmolested, but you need to wrap it all in the glib and dbus stuff to know when you have a connection, and you have to have an async poll loop to get the dbus data Jan 31 17:31:16 dragorn: nah, it will hopefully be a straight listening linux socket... Jan 31 17:31:47 dragorn: a lot to learn and get right then! good job there's no deadline for this stuff... Jan 31 17:32:02 coffee88: which means the client might need to switch to the glib socket io interface, which isn't the worst thing in the world, but isn't a terrible amount of fun, either Jan 31 17:32:24 the server side just gets connections/packets per normal, so long as you don't need to run it on maemo and do intelligent things with connection management Jan 31 17:33:27 me? intelligent things? not normally in the same sentence, so that should be ok! Jan 31 17:35:35 coffee88: http://maemo.org/development/documentation/how-tos/4-x/maemo_connectivity_guide.html Jan 31 17:35:59 bye Jan 31 17:36:36 dragorn: yeah, read that about 3 times before and still no better for it. I think I'll need to go back a few steps and take a run up... Jan 31 17:36:57 dragorn: starting from a low GTK and c base here! Jan 31 17:38:36 coffee88: http://www.tinymail.org/trac/tinymail/browser/trunk/tests/maemo Jan 31 17:39:47 and at that, I depart for lunch. Good luck. Jan 31 17:39:54 dragorn: excellent. thanks. I'll try to disect and digest that. thanks again. Jan 31 17:55:05 ohhh! Jan 31 17:55:11 before I forget Jan 31 17:55:20 has anyone managed to get email certs to work ? Jan 31 17:55:29 and if so what format does it want them in ? Jan 31 17:55:48 p12...crt ? Jan 31 17:56:09 i converted my p12 because it didnt appear to like them Jan 31 17:56:22 and crt shows them but cant seem to sign my outbound email Jan 31 17:59:59 Is there any way to make a bell in an xterm session blink the LED? Or *something*? I'd love to know when stuff happens. Jan 31 18:01:01 id love to know what handles that too...to see if a script could execute something to make it blink Jan 31 18:01:14 be nice to have xchat blink on pm's Jan 31 18:01:24 errm make it blink Jan 31 18:01:29 xchat already does that Jan 31 18:01:29 not blink itself Jan 31 18:01:43 there's an LED plugin for pidgin... but xterm nadda. Jan 31 18:01:45 it blinks its icon, and also unblanks the screen (if you have that selected in options) Jan 31 18:01:59 oh, LED Jan 31 18:02:05 * Tak learns to read sometime Jan 31 18:02:13 tak ;-] Jan 31 18:03:46 hey Tak. Haven't chatted with you in a while. How are you? Jan 31 18:07:08 Is there a repository where I can find sqlite and pysqlite for OS2007? Jan 31 18:07:39 trevarthan: You can create a script that blinks once, twice or something, yes Jan 31 18:09:37 Blafasel: no way to tie that to the xterm bell though, is there? Jan 31 18:09:47 would require some xterm hacking. Jan 31 18:09:58 ~lart GPS5300 for being rubbish Jan 31 18:09:58 * infobot judo chops GPS5300 for being rubbish Jan 31 18:10:21 * |tbb| guess Blafasel means using dbus magic Jan 31 18:10:32 Blafasel, got a how to on that ? Jan 31 18:10:39 trevarthan: doing all right, hacking on/with vala - how are you? Jan 31 18:10:41 or is it a device or does it use dbus ? Jan 31 18:10:44 lardman, you arent having much luck with technology at the moment, have you consider its operator error :P Jan 31 18:11:32 lcuk_2: yeah, may well be ;) Jan 31 18:11:54 evening lcuk_2 Jan 31 18:11:55 ;-} Jan 31 18:11:57 Tak: I'm ok. Got my n810 recently, so I'm in happy hardware whore heaven. :) Jan 31 18:12:08 lcuk_2: stood on my balcony for 5 min trying to get a lock (it's chilly & ver windy in the UK atm) and it still refused Jan 31 18:12:11 lard, has the gremlin moved to a new device or are you having probs with both Jan 31 18:12:17 <|tbb|> LinuxCode: you can control led from dbus yeah, theres a thread on ITT Jan 31 18:12:25 * lcuk_2 knows its cold in uk Jan 31 18:12:29 hi there linux Jan 31 18:12:38 |tbb|, interesting...so one could write a perl hack with dbus modules Jan 31 18:12:39 <|tbb|> trevarthan: congrats, do u still have your s9 motorolla headset Jan 31 18:12:45 for xchat Jan 31 18:12:54 oh poo, bbsoon (tho ive just got here) Jan 31 18:12:57 * LinuxCode makes note Jan 31 18:13:06 |tbb|: yeah, haven't used it in a while though. Been wanting to try it out with Chinook. Jan 31 18:13:07 lcuk_2: well there's still a gremlin in my Linux box, but there's also the standard verrrrryyyy slooooow gremlin in the n810 GPS ;D Jan 31 18:13:20 who is for extending the eartch day to 38 hours ? Jan 31 18:13:24 earth Jan 31 18:13:29 i find it connects faster if i sit 810 on my missuses knee Jan 31 18:13:38 i require more time for fun things Jan 31 18:13:42 hey, is it possible to network boot the tablet? Jan 31 18:13:47 if its sat in the console of the car its not happy, but it gets warm and snug on her lap Jan 31 18:13:56 <|tbb|> trevarthan: let us know if u get it to work Jan 31 18:13:59 lcuk_2, rofl Jan 31 18:14:00 fugitivo: not without hacking the boot loader, no Jan 31 18:14:00 LinuxCode: No, but it's really easy. Jan 31 18:14:05 I can create one, if you want. Jan 31 18:14:14 lcuk_2, make sure it doesnt get damp Jan 31 18:14:19 * lcuk_2 also works faster if he sits in his missuses lap Jan 31 18:14:24 Blafasel, well Jan 31 18:14:24 lardman: but it is possible Jan 31 18:14:27 it would be awesome Jan 31 18:14:34 At least I can create some notes.. Wireing it up to a complete howto might take more time ;) Jan 31 18:14:40 but I dont think I could ask you to do that if its not for yourself Jan 31 18:14:56 fugitivo: not sure, certainly someone wrote a bootloader hack to boot from the SD cards, etc. not sure if he did network booting too Jan 31 18:15:01 Ah - it's interesting. Give me some minutes Jan 31 18:15:07 haha k Jan 31 18:15:08 Yeah, I hope they speed up the GPS in the n810. Slow slow slow. Jan 31 18:15:08 ;-] Jan 31 18:15:25 lardman: well, that's a nice experiment to do Jan 31 18:15:28 Blafasel, that would be very kind of you sir Jan 31 18:15:45 silly thing is if I stand outside with a decent view of the sky it's not happy, but then I get bored and drop it by the window and it gets a lock Jan 31 18:15:46 random Jan 31 18:16:32 positioning is everything, try it flat with screen to sky Jan 31 18:16:39 we find it bad when its upright Jan 31 18:16:49 back soon before i get in trouble for not mashing spuds Jan 31 18:16:52 How do I edit my application menus? Jan 31 18:16:59 lcuk_2: lol. same as me Jan 31 18:17:03 control panel/panels Jan 31 18:17:10 thanks!, lcuk_2 Jan 31 18:17:29 lardman: thanks for the dsp_dld hint, it helped me read the relocation tables. Jan 31 18:17:31 fugitivo: sorry initfs, not bootloader: http://fanoush.wz.cz/maemo/#initfs Jan 31 18:17:43 lardman: thanks Jan 31 18:18:03 pH5: still strange that the relocations aren't done at compile time though Jan 31 18:18:54 pH5: what "tools" are you using? Jan 31 18:19:32 I've yet to build a toolbox. So far it's dis55, gedit and gcc Jan 31 18:20:55 I've looked at the avs_kernel.out output Jan 31 18:21:57 Can't find my pcm output, was here somewhere... Jan 31 18:23:10 * lcuk_2 looks forward to actually compiling things tonight Jan 31 18:23:45 * lcuk_2 was nearly made to wear a fairy costume at work today :| Jan 31 18:23:54 lol Jan 31 18:24:13 it was fine yesterday when my jedi tunic turned up Jan 31 18:24:45 the bosses wife made a "rule" which was whenever costumes are delivered they have to be shown. Jan 31 18:25:01 what do you do? Jan 31 18:25:22 as little as possible usually. my boss thinks im a software developer Jan 31 18:25:31 hmmm Jan 31 18:25:42 no cpan Jan 31 18:25:53 lardman: is http://c55x-binutils.sourceforge.net/ any good? Jan 31 18:25:54 guess one would need gcc and co anyway Jan 31 18:26:06 pH5: Adding a static stream for example seems to just add one number to another; a very short function Jan 31 18:26:22 pH5: never tried, have just used the Ti tools Jan 31 18:26:25 anyone of you uses Maemo Wordpy 0.6 ? Jan 31 18:27:20 * konttori added a new application: USBControl to ukmp package Jan 31 18:27:22 https://garage.maemo.org/frs/download.php/3284/ukmp-1.73_all.deb Jan 31 18:27:23 pH5: what application are you trying to develop, or just for interest? Jan 31 18:27:45 With that it'll be very easy to switch between USB host and USB OTG mode. Jan 31 18:28:09 I would be glad if anyone with USB F-F adaptor could test it out. Jan 31 18:28:21 Easy way to attach a keyboard to the device. Jan 31 18:28:31 Works also with wireless USB keyboards Jan 31 18:28:33 Andy80, I use it :) Jan 31 18:29:09 yerga: well :) could you please explain me where I can find the 0.6 version? even updating the package list, latest available is 0.5 Jan 31 18:29:12 lardman: mostly curiosity. a vorbis codec that plays directly from the dsp would be nice. Jan 31 18:29:38 <_collin_> re Jan 31 18:29:48 it's in extras-devel repository Jan 31 18:30:03 let me check if I've it... Jan 31 18:30:04 http://repository.maemo.org/extras-devel/dists/chinook/install/maemo-wordpy.install Jan 31 18:30:23 It's a beta version Jan 31 18:30:32 pH5: First step is the vorbis decoder then, I'm always looking for more help Jan 31 18:30:48 yerga: yes... but 0.5 doesn't start at all Jan 31 18:31:07 lardman: is there any way to check the dsp's load btw? something like top? Jan 31 18:31:10 I installed it and even if I try to start it from command line, it looks like the command doesn't exist Jan 31 18:31:32 pH5: unfortunately not very easily, there's the sysfs output, but it doesn't seem to work in the current image Jan 31 18:31:37 I received some feedback about it Jan 31 18:31:39 yerga: I connect to irc from the n810, so I can copy the link Jan 31 18:31:56 http://repository.maemo.org/extras-devel/dists/chinook/install/maemo-wordpy.install Jan 31 18:32:44 hello friends Jan 31 18:32:44 * lardman still wonders what the mbx_init_seq function in the avs_kernel does... Jan 31 18:32:51 grrrr... where is copy-èaste on xchat.... Jan 31 18:33:01 oh... I've to go.... I'll be back later... Jan 31 18:33:06 thanks for now yerga Jan 31 18:33:07 :) Jan 31 18:35:24 I'm trying to setup the development environment. I have scratchbox setup on a Linux box. I'm using Windows as my client. I have an X server on my Windows machine (as part of Cygwin). But I can't start the hildon desktop (with 'af-sb-init.sh start'); it says it wants Xephyr, but can work with other X servers. any ideas? Jan 31 18:37:46 billh: do you need to run the Maemo gui? Jan 31 18:38:06 I never switch to x86 mode at all, compile then run on the device Jan 31 18:38:24 billh: how did you set the DISPLAY in scratchbox? Jan 31 18:38:36 is the GUI even supposed to work in an armel target? Jan 31 18:39:08 (I think the qemu's emulation is incomplete or something like that, and armel GUI didn't work) Jan 31 18:39:09 no, I don't think so Jan 31 18:39:29 ah, my point was I use the actual device to do the testing Jan 31 18:39:49 lardman: what is at #09ca4eh? it writes ~0x0 there, and the only other reference to that mem location I can see is in _mbx_newmsg Jan 31 18:40:56 sorry, all, I just stepped away... Jan 31 18:41:14 lardman, I'd like to run the gui, but that's a good point; I could just go straight to the device Jan 31 18:41:50 pH5: my address space only goes up to 0x548080 Jan 31 18:42:03 mgedmin, I set DISPLAY several ways. the default as used by other apps that I use is localhost:10.0, but that doesn't work. I also tried 1 and 2 Jan 31 18:42:10 pH5: or rather addresses in the kernel Jan 31 18:42:28 billh: well, if your X server is on a different *machine*, there's no way localhost can work Jan 31 18:42:33 that includes virtual machines Jan 31 18:42:47 lardman: is there some overview document about the address space somewhere? I'm still completely ignorant about what is internal ram, where the shared memory is, etc. Jan 31 18:42:50 pH5: if that memory is shared OMAP memory for the peripherls, that's interesting Jan 31 18:43:06 pH5: there is, but unless you are an OEM you're not allowed it :( Jan 31 18:43:12 mgedmin, I have an ssh tunnel to the machine with X forwarded, so for other apps, localhost:10.0 works Jan 31 18:43:18 duh Jan 31 18:43:24 * mgedmin slaps forehead Jan 31 18:43:53 * lcuk_2 pokes every memory adress in sequen""£%^^&£$%&%*"$£%$"£%"£[NO CARRIER] Jan 31 18:44:06 Hmmmm. doesn't look like you can test network apps in the scratchbox environment? is that right? Jan 31 18:45:05 omg my 810 still showing full battery and i charged it last night! Jan 31 18:45:22 (first time ever - itsn ormally been flat) Jan 31 18:45:46 finished indexing the media perhaps :) Jan 31 18:46:05 nope, not done anything like that Jan 31 18:46:05 lcuk_2: I'm sure the bme is confused. Reboot your device and see it change ;) Jan 31 18:46:11 i changed a single setting yesterday Jan 31 18:46:26 anyother thoughts on remote emulation on a windows machine? Jan 31 18:46:31 x-fade, why should today be any different to any other day thou.. Jan 31 18:47:38 LinuxCode: well, nothing fancy but I explained the format and how to set led patterns. If you don't know that already I can provide you a link Jan 31 18:47:42 i aligned my brightness period with my switch off display period and when i lock device it turns off screen now. it might be a fluke but cor blimey Jan 31 18:48:09 Blafasel, I will take anything that might be useful and will let me learn Jan 31 18:48:19 It's nothing special though.. I plan to work on a "PatternEditor" as my first project on this toy though Jan 31 18:48:28 hehe Jan 31 18:48:33 LinuxCode: http://google.com/notebook/public/08895672815650307022/BDSTgIgoQ3tW9iP0i Jan 31 18:48:38 * LinuxCode looks Jan 31 18:48:40 pH5: before I forget, there is some info about memeory mapping on the DSP in the dspgateway spec docs Jan 31 18:49:08 gives ranges for the RAM, SDRAM, etc. Jan 31 18:50:14 lardman: ok Jan 31 18:51:48 Blafasel, thats very interesting Jan 31 18:53:08 Don't break your toy though! ;) Jan 31 18:53:20 * lardman goes to eat supper Jan 31 18:53:30 good idea Jan 31 18:53:40 Off for tonight Jan 31 18:53:48 so what are the colours or is that in the /etc/mce/mce.in ? Jan 31 18:53:53 Is there a way in OS2008 to get the tool/command bar on osso_xterm to be on the side it was in OS2007? At the bottom it's taking too much space, though it is nice to have in general Jan 31 18:54:05 blafasel, before you go Jan 31 18:54:07 ;-p Jan 31 18:54:13 unless you are in a rush Jan 31 18:54:46 yerga: I'm back Jan 31 18:55:17 LinuxCode: Shoot Jan 31 18:55:19 ok Jan 31 18:55:28 [18:53] LinuxCode so what are the colours or is that in the /etc/mce/mce.in ? Jan 31 18:56:32 LinuxCode: Do you know the RGB color format? Jan 31 18:56:38 ahh ok Jan 31 18:56:40 Think of websites or whatever.. Jan 31 18:56:53 so that value can be anything up to 255 ? Jan 31 18:57:01 but the colour is 40 ?!!? Jan 31 18:57:01 FF, yes. Jan 31 18:57:04 No Jan 31 18:57:06 ohh! Jan 31 18:57:09 I see! Jan 31 18:57:12 sorry Jan 31 18:57:20 yerga: if I click on that .install it asks me to install maemo-wordpy 0.5-6 Jan 31 18:57:22 not 0.6 Jan 31 18:57:22 The first byte (2 letters) are the "command" Jan 31 18:57:24 why? Jan 31 18:57:39 The second byte is the value Jan 31 18:57:44 I don't know Jan 31 18:57:51 anyway I try... Jan 31 18:57:56 it should install the 0.6 version Jan 31 18:58:08 yeh so 40 is the colour ? Jan 31 18:58:10 the last version in the repo is 0.6beta-4 Jan 31 18:58:13 and ff the brightness ? Jan 31 18:58:24 so am I right to assume that you need 3 values ? Jan 31 18:58:31 i.e. rgb Jan 31 18:58:45 Yes. Look at the mce.ini Jan 31 18:58:51 k Jan 31 18:58:58 The last three parts are those colors Jan 31 18:59:10 k Jan 31 18:59:26 yerga: same problem... I click on the relative voice in the menu, but it doesn't start... Jan 31 18:59:35 sure Jan 31 18:59:49 the 0.5-6 version is the same that in extras repo Jan 31 19:00:08 Okay, have to drink some beer now - bye ;) Jan 31 19:00:14 so it will have same problems Jan 31 19:00:20 bye and thanks Jan 31 19:00:25 i found the commens in that file Jan 31 19:00:54 yerga: is it possible to start it from command line, so I can see the error? Jan 31 19:00:59 yes Jan 31 19:01:12 the binary is called MaemoWordPy Jan 31 19:02:41 oh... the Upper case... Jan 31 19:03:37 nothing... it just quit.... no error messages Jan 31 19:04:45 it's a problem loading some python module Jan 31 19:05:09 yerga: strange... I've installed all python modules available... Jan 31 19:05:59 have you the last python version? Jan 31 19:06:29 errr, I have a stupid question... if I break my kernel or bootloader, I always can flash the device and recover it, right? Jan 31 19:06:49 yerga: yes... all modules are up to date... no updates available Jan 31 19:07:06 * konttori published USB host mode 'easy instructions' on his blog Jan 31 19:07:09 http://konttoristhoughts.blogspot.com/ Jan 31 19:07:23 Andy80, it's very strange Jan 31 19:07:49 run the python interpreter Jan 31 19:08:00 and try import the gtk module Jan 31 19:09:13 I find it kinda irritating Jan 31 19:09:20 if everything is made in china Jan 31 19:09:27 who else is making stuff Jan 31 19:09:28 lol Jan 31 19:09:39 konttori: the set of stuff in the bundle seems a bit weird... Could you consider separate package for USBControl? Jan 31 19:09:46 belkin seems to make absolutely everything in china Jan 31 19:10:03 Could, but that would take more time. Jan 31 19:10:03 yerga: I try wait... Jan 31 19:10:05 konttori: I bet I'm not alone not needing a media player or youtube on my tablet. Jan 31 19:10:15 So, maybe if it gets to be mature control Jan 31 19:10:27 Well, uktube is 200 kb Jan 31 19:10:35 and uktube is 20 kb Jan 31 19:10:39 yerga: import gtk Jan 31 19:10:42 yerga: no errors Jan 31 19:10:50 so, I'm sure you can live with that 'additional' stuff Jan 31 19:11:48 Andy80, I haven't idea :( Jan 31 19:11:57 konttori: yes, I can, and if I cannot, the size of them will not be the problem. Out of curiousity, do they use the usbcontrol functionality? Jan 31 19:11:58 I try do some tests here Jan 31 19:12:04 Hi All, Anyone aware of a screen/audio capture utility that we may be able to run on our NIT's? Jan 31 19:12:04 don't worry... I'll try to contact the author Jan 31 19:12:45 regrettably, not, although, ukmp might actually be nice to be used with some sort of remote. Jan 31 19:12:46 Any notice that sounds don't work in Pidgin when Pidgin doesn't have focus? Jan 31 19:12:51 MikeL2: I used vnc2swf a while ago Jan 31 19:13:17 Andy80, I am :) Jan 31 19:13:53 yerga: oh, good! :D Jan 31 19:14:42 yerga: tell me if there is some other test I cand do Jan 31 19:15:15 Keesj: OK will take a look, so you ran it on a PC and VNCd to the Nokia? did it work reasonably well, thanks for the pointer Jan 31 19:15:22 Lynoure: If you could test that out, it would be great. Jan 31 19:16:26 Keesj: reading the web page http://www.unixuser.org/~euske/vnc2swf/ Jan 31 19:16:29 konttori: I will, one I get F2F from somewhere... Jan 31 19:17:19 Yeah. it's not like we all would have those lying around. I know. Jan 31 19:17:27 MikeL2: yes , so I installed x11vnc on the device and recoded on the pc Jan 31 19:17:43 Anyway, at least I'm hoping that this may help people doing e.g. python development just a bit. Jan 31 19:18:00 Andy80, try to install the 0.6 version Jan 31 19:18:01 and, of course, the occasional plug in the USB stick. Jan 31 19:18:13 konttori: more than 200kb, takes also mplayer =) Jan 31 19:18:26 Yeah. Last minute addition. Jan 31 19:18:36 I thought everyone should have it! ;) Jan 31 19:18:38 Keesj: Sounds good, so once running you could run the Nokia as normal and everything was copied as a swf file Jan 31 19:18:58 konttori: Like I said yesterday, it might replace an EeePC for me. :) Not for devel work, just sysadmin stuff Jan 31 19:19:00 Ok, I'm evil. But uktube needs mplayer for flash video playback Jan 31 19:19:25 yerga: where can I find it? I used the .install you gave me... but it installed the 0.5-6 Jan 31 19:20:21 try disabling the extras repo Jan 31 19:20:45 and open that install file Jan 31 19:21:28 konttori: would you happen to remember what repos mplayer and python are in? Jan 31 19:21:51 repository.maemo.org/extras Jan 31 19:21:54 yerga ok Jan 31 19:21:55 chinook Jan 31 19:21:59 free non-free Jan 31 19:22:51 yerga: the extras-devel is not in the list.... Jan 31 19:22:58 I'll try to put that version to repository tomorrow. Ups am not. Spending the evening with friends. On saturday then. Jan 31 19:23:20 and thus, I'll also update the .install link on the maemo/downloads. Jan 31 19:23:55 Andy80, ok, then add it manually and refresh the app list Jan 31 19:24:10 yerga: ok, give me all the parameters.. Jan 31 19:24:24 repository.maemo.org/extras-devel Jan 31 19:24:27 chinook Jan 31 19:24:31 free non-free Jan 31 19:24:33 :) Jan 31 19:27:37 konttori: thanks... at a closer look, changed my mind about the size, as mplayer+deps for it take >5 megs Jan 31 19:28:16 konttori: but I'll test it anyway... too curious not to Jan 31 19:28:22 Ah ;) Jan 31 19:28:36 Well, I could consider packaging it separately in the future. Jan 31 19:28:52 does the tablet kernel use propietary drivers? Jan 31 19:29:03 konttori: you'll like canola's youtube plugin ;-) Jan 31 19:29:09 It'll need some additional stuff still, like setting the kb locale and stuff like that, so after they have been done, I could then separate the package. Sounds fair? Jan 31 19:29:24 I haven't tried that out. sounds cool Jan 31 19:29:37 where can I dl it? Jan 31 19:29:38 konttori: of course not, it's still to be released Jan 31 19:29:41 konttori: :-) Jan 31 19:29:50 tease! Jan 31 19:29:51 when is 770 version comming out? Jan 31 19:29:59 fugitivo: possible tomorrow Jan 31 19:30:11 we're trying to figure out how to overcome a problem with python-dbus Jan 31 19:30:14 marcelo told me that last thuesday :) Jan 31 19:30:33 the version before the last didn't have a method to remove objects Jan 31 19:30:44 thus we required the pymaemo guys to add it, doing backport Jan 31 19:30:49 they released it as the last version Jan 31 19:30:49 oh, crap Jan 31 19:30:54 but it's now buggy Jan 31 19:31:08 and all our dbus servers crash Jan 31 19:31:19 it will need to be back to that old version Jan 31 19:31:36 and we need to figure out how to implement an equivalent of remove_from_connection() Jan 31 19:32:36 for most of our daemons, we don't have a real problem since it's one object for the whole usage Jan 31 19:32:47 but for download manager, we have one object per request Jan 31 19:33:24 that's why I use my own libraries, lol Jan 31 19:34:03 I'm trying to setup the development environment. I have scratchbox setup on a Linux box. I'm using Windows as my client, but I can't get the emulated hildon desktop to display on the windows box (with 'af-sb-init.sh start'). I have an X server on my Windows machine (as part of Cygwin). it says it wants Xephyr, but can work with other X servers. I've tried different DISPLAY settings, including the working localhost:10.0, and 1 and 2. any ideas? Jan 31 19:34:54 sorry, by "working localhost:10.0" in the above, I mean that that value for DISPLAY works for other apps, as I have an ssh tunnel to the linux box with X forwarding on. Jan 31 19:35:20 konttori: hmmm, extras has pile of other python2.5 stuff, but weirdly I cannot see python2.5 or python2.5-runtime Jan 31 19:35:54 billh: do you get any error? Jan 31 19:39:47 maddler: ping Jan 31 19:40:23 fugitivo, I'm looking for a web place to paste the output... Jan 31 19:40:34 ~pastebin Jan 31 19:40:35 [~pastebin] A "pastebin" is a web-based service where you can paste anything over 3 lines without flooding the channel. Here are links to a few : http://www.pastebin.com , http://pastebin.ca , http://channels.debian.net/paste , http://paste.lisp.org , http://www.rafb.net/paste Jan 31 19:41:05 Lynoure: Install then ukmp first from here: http://maemo.org/downloads/product/OS2008/ukmp/ Jan 31 19:41:21 It has all the right repositories set in the .install file Jan 31 19:41:33 fugitivo, here's the output: http://pastebin.com/d6ab5d6ec Jan 31 19:41:35 After you have that version, just update it to 173 Jan 31 19:41:40 konttori: ok, thanks :) Jan 31 19:43:00 maddler: I finally decide to write a blog entry ;D and the site is parked! Jan 31 19:43:24 can't get address for localhost:6010 Jan 31 19:43:42 try with the ip address Jan 31 19:43:48 * konttori edited the blog with the link to 'normal install' Jan 31 19:43:53 I don't have Xephyr; I'm not clear: is Xephyr just an X server? or does it do something more? Jan 31 19:43:59 fugitivo, will do Jan 31 19:44:00 Lynoure: is the install working now? Jan 31 19:44:37 billh: better yet, add localhost to your hosts file Jan 31 19:45:17 konttori: still processing (moody wifi) Jan 31 19:45:36 ok. lemme know if it works or not! Jan 31 19:46:55 lardman: Just tried libgammu on my laptop Jan 31 19:47:10 works with one out of three phones in my household Jan 31 19:47:15 jku: how did it work? Jan 31 19:47:20 ah Jan 31 19:47:34 I can get country code, local area code and cell id over bluetooth Jan 31 19:48:19 cool, do you have at codes for the other phones? Jan 31 19:49:11 I know nothing about that -- I just setup a config file for gammu and call the functions... Jan 31 19:50:37 should work on maemo too, but i can't be arsed to compile recent versions of gammu ATM... Jan 31 19:51:06 inz has a version for bora, but it's old... Jan 31 19:51:49 for some reason I can't not use ellipsis today... Jan 31 19:53:06 now if there just was a cell id location database on the web, we'd be fine. Jan 31 19:54:14 On the other hand if cell id location could be used for AGPS, then just a few saved ones would go a long way: Home cell means location x,y Jan 31 19:55:12 yerga: I've installed the 0.6 beta version! Jan 31 19:55:21 nice Jan 31 19:55:27 yerga: if I start it from command line I get this error Jan 31 19:55:57 yerga: import gtk.glade - ImportError: no module named glade Jan 31 19:56:23 konttori: installed, yes Jan 31 19:56:38 Lynoure: cool. thanks. Jan 31 19:56:53 So, tomorrow: Buy a F2F usb! Jan 31 19:56:56 Andy80, what python2.5-gtk2 version? Jan 31 19:57:08 apt-cache policy python2.5-gtk2 Jan 31 19:57:11 yerga: I check.. wait... Jan 31 19:57:25 konttori: I'll try to, but if it takes lengthy excursions, it might bet delayed Jan 31 19:57:58 check beforehand from net. Jan 31 19:58:10 yerga: Installed 2.12.1-1osso1 Jan 31 19:58:21 fugitivo, thanks; that took me a little further. still not working, but work is calling me away for now Jan 31 19:58:44 I think there was a bug with that version and glade Jan 31 19:58:58 johnx: got it to work Jan 31 19:59:09 johnx: I'll post a youtube video in a moment :) Jan 31 19:59:11 try install the last one 2.12.1-1osso2 Jan 31 19:59:29 perhaps you need red-pill mode Jan 31 20:00:09 yerga: mm.... are you sure I don't break something :P ? Jan 31 20:00:33 haha, I am not sure :) Jan 31 20:13:59 Found a very strange bug with the Notes application Jan 31 20:14:27 If you do a capital "IJ" it appears to fuck up the font when using monospace 8pt Jan 31 20:14:44 Whether it does it with other fonts/sizes I don't know as I can't be bothered to try as I'm busy :) Jan 31 20:15:34 jku: sorry, got called away, well if we can work out the supl.nokia.com comms protocol we might be able to use the cell data directly to recieve gps almanac/ephemeris data :) Jan 31 20:16:24 ...and figure out how to push that to gpsdriver Jan 31 20:16:34 yeah Jan 31 20:16:39 big ifs but worth trying no doubt Jan 31 20:17:00 looking at the gps_last_saved_report file, it's 14kb, that's very large to save a lat long location! Jan 31 20:17:25 and it's also pretty much filled with 0x00's Jan 31 20:17:36 I wonder why it has all that space available....? Jan 31 20:19:06 yeah weird Jan 31 20:19:28 that sounds like plenty of space to store almanac and ephemeris data, hopefully Jan 31 20:21:22 Are there any N95 owners online atm? Jan 31 20:21:43 can you browse your filesystems? What do you have by way of gps data stored? Jan 31 20:23:29 I've got an N80 which is similar as far as software is concerned. Jan 31 20:23:41 Oh, GPS .. Jan 31 20:23:53 yeah. we know that agps works on the n95 now Jan 31 20:25:46 recently killes my n800 by trying root login.:-! Jan 31 20:25:58 killed in what way? Jan 31 20:26:38 dunno just performed root login Jan 31 20:26:46 over ssh? Jan 31 20:26:49 or in an xterm?> Jan 31 20:27:15 had to repair in service center Jan 31 20:27:27 hmm Jan 31 20:27:33 fixed now? Jan 31 20:27:37 lardman, do you know if n95 agps uses cell id at all? Jan 31 20:27:47 it's hard to explain Jan 31 20:28:09 jku: I don;t know, but I think it does; certainly I've seen posts about communicating with that nokia.com server Jan 31 20:28:34 works fine now with newly installed OS2008 Jan 31 20:28:40 yeah, but it could just be up-to-date satellite data Jan 31 20:28:43 nikobit: glad to hear it Jan 31 20:29:10 jku: yes, but I think some of the data is site specific Jan 31 20:29:24 you can't imagine how glad am I Jan 31 20:29:32 jku, does the bora libgammu not work on chinook? Jan 31 20:29:43 jku, the age of the build surely could be a problem Jan 31 20:29:51 inz, it does as far as I can tell Jan 31 20:29:53 jku: almanac certainly, but ephemeris is pre-processed for a given location/time combo, plus atmospheric effect compensation, etc. Jan 31 20:30:14 but the api has changed... Jan 31 20:30:34 jku, I have a meeting tomorrow, I could build new one during it ;) Jan 31 20:30:43 lol Jan 31 20:31:31 hah, I'm pretty sure it works and there's no immediate use. But if it's a really dull meeting, go ahead Jan 31 20:32:51 Anyway, it was about 20 lines of code, so doing it on the old api would not be bad. I just didn't feel like it Jan 31 20:33:54 jku, well, it's not really boring at all, but there's always some loose time Jan 31 20:34:05 jku, and most of the time goes to (re)compiling anyway Jan 31 20:34:30 Should I submit a bug to ask for info about these gps-related files? what other ways are there of asking? Jan 31 20:35:38 It's me back again.I'll try to remember what had happened that day. I've made my new root passwd. Using xterm and some stuff called dread-something. Not dregale but close. Entered all that was described in "How do I become root" page at maemo site. Logged into mc. Rebooted. Thats all. N800 dead Jan 31 20:36:45 Installing new software version made back Jan 31 20:38:58 actually I didn't expected from Nokia service to be such enthusiastic in helping people Jan 31 20:40:01 lardman, can't think of anything else, and the chances are slim. N seems to be even more paranoid about releasing HW info than releasing source... Jan 31 20:40:17 Hello Jan 31 20:40:49 jku: I'll try a direct email first Jan 31 21:01:04 man os2008 is tasty Jan 31 21:01:10 * Solarion needs to get on the intarwebs Jan 31 21:01:24 sadly, getting on the intarwebs through my fascistic school network is Difficult Jan 31 21:03:54 Early result: my N800 seems to idle and draw very little power only if I remove the sd cards Jan 31 21:04:42 not sure if it's the cards or something like the metalayer crawler that accounts for the increase in power consumption when thecards are in Jan 31 21:06:28 Tama^2: interesting Jan 31 21:06:47 the difference is night and a day Jan 31 21:07:22 with cards, in 1 day more than 50% of the battery was gone while idle Jan 31 21:08:07 without cards 18% Jan 31 21:08:08 I'd be interested to know if it's metacrawler related or not Jan 31 21:08:33 I will run tests to check that Jan 31 21:09:23 cool Jan 31 21:12:50 <_collin_> hi Jan 31 21:15:06 Tama^2: did you have any symlinks to external card under your home dir? Jan 31 21:16:52 yes I do, and that is something I want to test separately (i.e. card inserted, no symlink) Jan 31 21:17:05 ustunozgur: why? :) Jan 31 21:18:37 because I had symlinked all those default directories to an external card for easier navigation Jan 31 21:18:44 and battery drained quickli Jan 31 21:18:53 .sounds .videos etc Jan 31 21:19:50 I see Jan 31 21:20:19 It makes sense still, it should not matter when the device is offline,locked and idle >.< Jan 31 21:20:51 I observed that metacrawler was using too much cpu, too. Jan 31 21:22:25 now I have no symlinks and I think it is much better. Jan 31 21:23:29 I think the metalyer crawler is badly designed anyway: when you pull a card out it has to update its db Jan 31 21:24:07 metadata db should be stored within the volume Jan 31 21:34:29 Hi Jan 31 21:39:53 I'm looking for a good os2008 irc client, any suggests? Jan 31 21:40:12 GNUtoN810: Google for "xchat skyhook chinook" Jan 31 21:40:51 Yes, my answer from the last time you asked hasn't changed. ;) Jan 31 21:40:58 GNUtoN810: Here's the link http://zeus.rm-fr.net/~skyhusker/xchat-chinook-betas/ Jan 31 21:41:04 That's the one Jan 31 21:42:53 Jsmith: nothing! Jan 31 21:45:38 GNUtoN810: Follow this link: http://zeus.rm-fr.net/~skyhusker/xchat-chinook-betas/ Jan 31 21:46:08 GNUtoN810: Install the .deb file named xchat_2.8.4-chinook0-beta1_armel.deb Jan 31 21:47:25 you could just use pidgin? Jan 31 21:47:45 has skyhusker released the sources to this beta anywhere? is there anywhere we can fix problems if they arrise with this beta? Jan 31 21:47:57 darkip, Pidgin is about the worst IRC client ever. :P Jan 31 21:49:06 actually GeneralAntilles, i think this client is worse ;) Jan 31 21:49:39 web based, works from anywhere but acts like a dog Jan 31 21:50:18 Hi All! Jan 31 21:59:10 ok, now i'm using xchat..:) Jan 31 22:04:55 * LinuxCode cries Jan 31 22:05:02 syncevolution dont work Jan 31 22:05:13 no machine id for dbus Jan 31 22:05:32 hmm Jan 31 22:05:37 is the latest rtcom-beta-os2008 (2.1-18) usable or does it still cause reboot loops for some ppl? (postponed the upgrade until now) Jan 31 22:05:59 * LinuxCode directs the uuidgen string into the file Jan 31 22:06:54 hmm fixed new error Jan 31 22:06:55 lol Jan 31 22:09:57 jott, I'm pretty sure I heard that it was fixed a while ago actually Jan 31 22:10:01 haven't tried it though Jan 31 22:12:08 hmm ok.. i'll see and report back ;) Jan 31 22:17:23 jott: https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=2803 (FIXED) Jan 31 22:17:50 jku: thanks Jan 31 22:34:52 is there a way to get modest to open when 'more email messages' is the current state? Jan 31 22:35:26 it opens just fine when there are individual messages, but when I get more than... 8, or whatever the threshold is, it tries to open the builtin mail app Jan 31 22:35:41 also, what sort of network traffic triggers the icd to make a connection Jan 31 22:36:03 I suspect that message comes from the builtin email client Jan 31 22:36:14 builtin email client isn't set up, so it's not possible Jan 31 22:36:21 ah Jan 31 22:36:42 if I set up the builtin email client... I lose power even faster Jan 31 22:37:02 icd should open a connection when an app requests it via libconic Jan 31 22:37:04 not that modest is helping the situation at all, anytime I'm away from a network it just fires up the icd on me and constantly scans Jan 31 22:37:39 I have disable modest/builtin automatic checks Jan 31 22:38:10 s/disable/disabled Jan 31 22:42:22 AUGH Jan 31 22:42:28 maemo extras failed gzip again today Jan 31 22:55:38 hachi, link to the file that failed? Jan 31 22:55:55 or is this the known bug on bugs.maemo.org? Jan 31 23:12:51 anyone tried getting media player to play OGG/Theora? Jan 31 23:14:52 yep Jan 31 23:15:01 does it work well? Jan 31 23:15:05 install kulve's ogg gstreamer stuff Jan 31 23:15:09 seems to wotk ok Jan 31 23:15:16 plays sound at least ;) Jan 31 23:15:26 I got the vorbis part working Jan 31 23:15:37 just wondering if I should push my luck and get theora Jan 31 23:15:52 ah, I misread in that case Jan 31 23:16:02 my apologies, nearly ned time Jan 31 23:16:06 bed time Jan 31 23:16:11 oh you just did audio? Jan 31 23:16:36 it is so nice to have a unified player for both ogg and mp3 Jan 31 23:16:44 ds3: have a chat with derf, he's one of the theora devs and was interested in getting it running (on the dsp, but he may have tried an arm decoder) Jan 31 23:17:07 yeah, tried audio and am currently debugging a dsp task for vorbis decoding Jan 31 23:17:20 i saw your frustrating efforts to get it working on the DSP Jan 31 23:17:56 not too frustrating, the code runs ok, just needs some tweaks as I;ve not removed all the 16bit byte issues yet Jan 31 23:18:11 tho it was certain;y frustrating getting started :) Jan 31 23:18:28 ah, last I read you were stuck at the 16bit vs 8bit bytes btwn the arm and dsp Jan 31 23:19:04 ah, that's all sorted, data are passed across fine. The problem is that the vorbis stream fails recognition at some point in the setup process Jan 31 23:19:57 lardman: was there some docs for the DSP you started with or was it purely a reverse engineering effort? Jan 31 23:19:58 https://garage.maemo.org/pipermail/dsp-tremor-devel/2008-January/000000.html should summarise Jan 31 23:20:18 ds3: There are docs, I did a fair bit of work to determine what they meant Jan 31 23:20:36 but certainly not reverse engineering, more filling the gaps Jan 31 23:20:46 gotcha Jan 31 23:21:03 info about it is on the maemo wiki -> dsp programming Jan 31 23:21:07 I wonder how well would the DSP stuff work on a totally free kernel (i.e. the OMAP tree) Jan 31 23:21:15 OMAP open source tree that is Jan 31 23:21:28 you still need a dsp kernel Jan 31 23:21:38 and that is not free I take it? Jan 31 23:21:45 and we're currently using (as a basis) the most free there is Jan 31 23:22:17 yes, the source is available, partly from Ti iirc, not sure of the license, but on the ITs Nokia have added to that base Jan 31 23:22:24 it would be nice to be able to upgrade the kernel as needed instead of wait for nokia Jan 31 23:22:55 kernel can be updated, its the file system image we wait for (or am i totally wrong) Jan 31 23:22:57 shouldn't be a problem with the dsp really, as long as you keep the dspgateway interfaces the same Jan 31 23:23:22 lardman: but isn't the dsp stuff all available as a binary .ko? Jan 31 23:23:29 but then Nokia do a lot of the work for the omap kernel Jan 31 23:23:49 lcuk: the OMAP tree lacks support for a few things Jan 31 23:23:57 the tasks are all binary, the kernel is also binary, but you can build a basic kernel from source, just wothout the nokia additions Jan 31 23:24:25 lardman, this is the dsp kernel, yes? Jan 31 23:24:28 right but if I wanted a 2.6.24 kernel on there, I don't have the DSP stuff at all (or am I wrong?) Jan 31 23:24:49 yer i noticed just after, i know the base kernel is available tho, my mistake Jan 31 23:24:49 the dspgateway stuff is included in the omap tree now Jan 31 23:25:01 so assuming the interface hasn't changed (which it may have) it should just work Jan 31 23:25:18 so the DSP kernel is not bundled into a binary module? Jan 31 23:25:23 also, is the DSP required for any type of sound at all? Jan 31 23:25:57 i seem to recall some page on DSP programming where they tell you to build stuff, then replace one of the objects with the .ko file from the device Jan 31 23:26:05 yes on both counts, though it may be possible to bypass it and produce sound through the kernel Jan 31 23:26:20 that's good to know Jan 31 23:26:32 ds3: but you can roll your own, without the Nokia bits (i.e. the supplied tasks for mp3 decoding will then not work) Jan 31 23:26:59 lardman: but how are the nokia bits provided? as a .hex file I can download or soemthing specific to the kernel? Jan 31 23:28:09 the kernel has compiled-in modules (for want of a better word), these modules are the nokia bits, the base kernel has source Jan 31 23:28:24 ah I think I get it now Jan 31 23:28:31 there are also dynamically loaded modules which do mp3, aac, etc. decoding Jan 31 23:28:57 Nokia have also provided the audio codec driver Jan 31 23:29:02 as part of the kernel Jan 31 23:29:23 but not as source, though there is similar source floating about, but not a trivial job Jan 31 23:29:44 and nokia did not use the openmax stuff either I take it? Jan 31 23:30:26 not yet, but it's on their roadmap Jan 31 23:30:35 oh cool Jan 31 23:30:45 prehaps one day with OS2010 I guess ;) Jan 31 23:31:13 they acknowledged that it would take some time, so probably not too far off ;) Jan 31 23:31:52 OS.. THREE-THOUSAND! Jan 31 23:32:00 glad this is less nasty then the umac.ko situation Jan 31 23:32:34 yeah... Jan 31 23:32:43 well it's not necessarily, there's no real scope to access the audio codec from the dsp side, Nokia are not willing (the legal dept) to release any info about that Jan 31 23:33:28 it's just that they use the dspgateway, so we can also use it. Ti provide good docs for the tms320c55 (unlike other chips like the GPS5300) Jan 31 23:34:38 * johnx sighs Jan 31 23:34:53 simple question - where is the actual audio hardware connected to? the arm side or the DSP side? Jan 31 23:35:11 both I think Jan 31 23:35:39 the question is really whether the DSP is required to setup the codec before the ARM side can do anything with it directly Jan 31 23:35:54 okay Jan 31 23:35:56 I'm not sure, kernel source has the relevant code for the ARM-side access to the audio codec Jan 31 23:36:35 IIRC, I can't get sound out via the stock OMAP kernel Jan 31 23:36:47 on an IT? Jan 31 23:36:55 on the N800 specifically Jan 31 23:37:02 lardman: if one was to develop a DSP task, is there a way to dump the result directly into the mixer task provided by nokia? Jan 31 23:37:06 in which case the DSP may need to set it up Jan 31 23:37:19 Tama^2: I really don't know Jan 31 23:37:34 or there is some userland madness that needs to happen Jan 31 23:37:41 Tama^2: I think this is probably where we want to look at the EAP_* functions in the DSP kernel, but we have no headers Jan 31 23:37:47 I was booting directly into a shell and getting in via usbnet Jan 31 23:38:08 ds3: I don't know I'm afraid. Jan 31 23:38:50 despite all this, the N800 as shipped does most of what I want... marketing hasn't turned it into a doorstop Jan 31 23:39:02 Tama^2: The best bet atm is to decode on the DSP, then send the audio data back to ARM to output (either directly, or via the pcm dsp task) Jan 31 23:39:35 but as we have no working audio decoders it's a bit of a moot point :) Jan 31 23:40:45 bed time, night all Jan 31 23:40:48 lardman: does all this apply to the 770 or is it 800/810 specific? Jan 31 23:40:58 ds3: all have the same DSP Jan 31 23:40:58 the communication between decoder tasks and the /eap SIO minidriver is really not complicated. we just need either somebody with a bit of C55x experience or a lot of time, but completely reversing the pcm2.o module is certainly possible. Jan 31 23:41:35 pH5: but to produce a codec driver you'd need to recompile the dsp kernel, and lose any Nokia stuff in there Jan 31 23:41:52 ah, you're talking about using the existing driver Jan 31 23:41:57 yup Jan 31 23:41:59 that is what i was asking before Jan 31 23:42:07 all good, once we have a working decoder then perhaps more people will be interested in that Jan 31 23:42:24 agreed, it wouldn't be too bad, just some asm learning and testing, etfc. Jan 31 23:42:31 i can't compile my own kernel without loosing compatibility? does the actual kernel have propietary kernel drivers? Jan 31 23:43:00 yes, the audio codec, but you could write your own reasonably easily Jan 31 23:43:18 only the audio codec? Jan 31 23:43:20 there is other stuff too, configuration stuff you'd lose, etc. Jan 31 23:43:34 can you dump it first? Jan 31 23:43:41 but I don't know much more than that, I've only really looked at the audio situation Jan 31 23:43:44 what about that kernel image to support bigger memory cards? Jan 31 23:43:50 ? Jan 31 23:43:55 we're talking dsp kernel atm Jan 31 23:43:57 i.e., can you dump it, repurpose, use it, then restore when finished? Jan 31 23:44:29 fysa: possibly, but it would take some serious work unless you could place it back at the same memory location Jan 31 23:44:51 fysa: plus the interplay between the bits might make it hard Jan 31 23:44:58 fsya, no there are a group of constants in source code which are different to the base options (if i remember rightly) Jan 31 23:44:59 s/bits/part Jan 31 23:45:06 ah Jan 31 23:46:04 anyway, learn to crawl before we run and all that eh? ;) Jan 31 23:46:28 * lcuk_2 is still learning to roll over Jan 31 23:46:37 :) Jan 31 23:46:49 right, I really am going to bed now Jan 31 23:46:51 night nigh Jan 31 23:47:01 night lard, interesting as always Jan 31 23:47:14 * lcuk_2 should look at screen whilst typing Jan 31 23:47:32 Where's the fun in that? Jan 31 23:47:54 Is there a package in OS2008 that provides wget? I tried apt-get install wget and it didn't work. I thought it would be in extras Jan 31 23:48:03 gronmayer.com/it Jan 31 23:48:27 on a different thing... what is the browser doing when it is displaying 'Updating...' during the first start? tcpdump shows no outgoing packets Jan 31 23:48:40 this is OS2008 Jan 31 23:48:59 its updating Jan 31 23:49:05 updating what? Jan 31 23:49:07 Never seen it say "Updating..." Jan 31 23:49:10 "..." Jan 31 23:49:13 :P Jan 31 23:49:19 ive seen it, its one of those baloon things isnt it Jan 31 23:49:49 GeneralAntilles: close all the browser sessions and open a new blank sessions. shortly, it will say "Updating..." Jan 31 23:49:58 Oh, guess so. Jan 31 23:50:11 "web loading" browser displays, then before it loads page you get "updating" Jan 31 23:50:21 I'm going to say that's been there since OS2005 and I've stopped noticing. Jan 31 23:50:33 but its a different browser app isnt it Jan 31 23:50:53 Engine Jan 31 23:50:56 thought it was the mozilla autoupdate but I see no options for it nor any traffic Jan 31 23:50:59 yeah, it does say Updating. Jan 31 23:51:08 it can get very annoying while using the browser with an RSS reader and closing it between links Jan 31 23:51:18 There's no such thing as auto-update for MicroB Jan 31 23:51:33 I think it's initializing plugins.. Jan 31 23:51:39 or the engine. Jan 31 23:51:41 fysa, that's probably correct. Jan 31 23:51:47 can we search the source tre for the browser and find "Updating..." Jan 31 23:51:50 hmm Jan 31 23:52:12 * lcuk_2 goes for the shotgun approach Jan 31 23:52:43 I believe the majority of the lagginess you feel with the browser is non-packet-related. Jan 31 23:53:02 Then a good chunk is DNS/wireless overhead, then the rest is engine bloat. Jan 31 23:53:32 i really want a proper flash block on the device Jan 31 23:53:38 it was just released. Jan 31 23:53:46 flash is great for specific items but 99% of the adverts kill pages Jan 31 23:53:46 Dunno why it takes so much longer to load in OS2008 final than all previous versions. Jan 31 23:53:58 lcuk_2, pay attention. :P Jan 31 23:54:01 browser-extras Jan 31 23:54:15 OS2008 has some I/O problems. Jan 31 23:54:16 ... Jan 31 23:54:17 http://browser-extras.garage.maemo.org/ Jan 31 23:54:32 I don't know if this was there before.. Jan 31 23:54:38 It loaded up about twice as fast in the beta. Jan 31 23:54:41 where do i get info on new/updated packages Jan 31 23:54:46 but I think I/O on OS2008 is slower than on OS2007 Jan 31 23:54:51 unless the CPU is pegged. Jan 31 23:55:15 subscribe to their RSS, lcuk_2 ;) Jan 31 23:55:25 or just pay better attention. :P Jan 31 23:55:53 but that involves installing and configuring another program. the update manager should have a branch to say "hey heres all the new bits" Jan 31 23:55:57 btw, is there a way to get a web page RSS feed link icon to automatically add a feed like in the older OS200[67]? Jan 31 23:55:58 hopefully I will have time to play with webkit next week. Jan 31 23:56:55 fysa, which webkit based browser have you been looking at? Jan 31 23:57:13 s/have you been looking at?/are you planning to look at?g Jan 31 23:57:23 http://webkit.org/ Jan 31 23:57:32 compiles fine, just haven't tried running yet Jan 31 23:57:53 Webkit/Gtk+ Jan 31 23:57:55 repaste for myself: http://browser-extras.garage.maemo.org/ thanks for letting me know its avail Jan 31 23:58:03 http://www.atoker.com/blog/2007/08/07/webkit-maemo-port-n800-and-the-eal/ Jan 31 23:58:20 I didn't know if they were still working on that or not ... Jan 31 23:58:29 epiphany-webkit runs great, BTW Jan 31 23:58:38 Yeah, I don't know about that one. Jan 31 23:58:51 it could use a little slimming down, and hildonization though Jan 31 23:58:54 But someone here was talking about it.. Jan 31 23:59:13 #webkit maybe Jan 31 23:59:56 midori Feb 01 00:00:15 http://software.twotoasts.de/media/midori/screen1.png Feb 01 00:00:25 I need to look at that again actually... Feb 01 00:00:43 Right now I'm in the market for a hildonized browser that doesn't just hook into Nokia's EAL... Feb 01 00:00:49 webkit would make gmail actually usable. ;) Feb 01 00:01:04 epiphany-webkit makes google maps usable too... Feb 01 00:01:21 try GdkLauncher.. Feb 01 00:01:27 I think that's dead simple light Feb 01 00:01:41 http://michael.susens-schurter.com/blog/wp-content/uploads/2007/08/webkit-gdklauncher.png Feb 01 00:02:08 interesting Feb 01 00:02:11 Oh, I know what it was. Feb 01 00:02:49 http://atoker.com/webkit-maemo/ Feb 01 00:03:19 :D Feb 01 00:03:51 I'll get a compile going ... Feb 01 00:04:00 <|tbb|> re Feb 01 00:05:02 the webkit SVN has hildonized bindings if you set the CPPFLAGS or something. Feb 01 00:05:12 http://atoker.com/webkit-maemo/README Feb 01 00:05:48 and then I heard something about the Android tree Feb 01 00:06:11 android is neat...It'll be interesting to see how that plays out Feb 01 00:09:10 i like blackberry Feb 01 00:09:20 they are delicious Feb 01 00:09:59 i hated it first, but then I realized they did a great work with email, PIM and all that stuff Feb 01 00:10:34 So, I'm new to this Maemo/n810 stuff and I'm looking for some tips - just got my device yesterday. Feb 01 00:10:39 if we can put that in the tablet, i'd be the perfect device (for me) Feb 01 00:10:42 The only media player I Feb 01 00:10:54 The only media player I've gotten to work is the built-in one. Feb 01 00:11:03 And Modest email. Feb 01 00:11:13 daveux: did you try canola2? Feb 01 00:11:29 Yeah, for some reason it only scans 20 of my songs. Feb 01 00:11:39 It looks great, but it doesn't see my other music. Feb 01 00:11:53 weird Feb 01 00:12:02 maybe some configuration need changes Feb 01 00:12:31 Maybe it's my filenames. Feb 01 00:12:50 Where can I find useful applets for the home screen? (or are there any...?) Feb 01 00:12:51 why? you have weird characters or something like that? Feb 01 00:13:01 Yes, some question marks and foreign accent chars. Feb 01 00:13:04 hm, i don't have my n810 yet Feb 01 00:13:10 daveux, you want mplayer Feb 01 00:13:12 do you like facebook? i'm writing a home applet for it Feb 01 00:13:21 it plays stuff and is faster than the built in one Feb 01 00:13:24 and less jittery Feb 01 00:13:28 Ok, I'll check it out. Feb 01 00:13:42 daveux, downloads.maemo.org: omweather is a nice weather applet Feb 01 00:13:55 daveux, linux user ? Feb 01 00:13:59 Yes. Feb 01 00:14:00 Also, I'm having trouble re-arranging my panel. Feb 01 00:14:05 xchat, amsn user ? Feb 01 00:14:11 xchat Feb 01 00:14:20 (IRC in pidgin) Feb 01 00:14:21 haha Feb 01 00:14:22 amsn for maemo? Feb 01 00:14:32 http://zeus.rm-fr.net/~skyhusker/xchat-chinook-betas/ Feb 01 00:14:49 i want bitchx for maemo :) Feb 01 00:14:58 http://kakaroto.homelinux.net/~kakaroto/n810/ Feb 01 00:15:03 last one is amsn Feb 01 00:15:15 made by the amsn guy Feb 01 00:15:21 does the webcam works with amsn? Feb 01 00:15:25 yes sir Feb 01 00:15:33 I wish someone would create a sexy gmail app. Feb 01 00:15:37 <--- was well impressed Feb 01 00:15:38 that's great news for a friend Feb 01 00:15:54 he complains because he can't use the webcam with anyone Feb 01 00:15:58 he's going to be happy Feb 01 00:16:15 fugitivo, will he buy me a pint ? Feb 01 00:16:19 haha Feb 01 00:16:23 that happy ? Feb 01 00:16:35 daveux, it's called "Modest". Feb 01 00:16:44 if you come to Argentina sure he will Feb 01 00:16:55 fugitivo, ok Feb 01 00:16:58 lol Feb 01 00:17:04 * LinuxCode politely declines Feb 01 00:17:12 thats a long travel sir Feb 01 00:17:36 where are you from? Feb 01 00:17:42 Oh, mplayer is just for movies. Feb 01 00:17:48 I just listen to music. Feb 01 00:17:54 daveux: no, you can use it for anything Feb 01 00:18:00 mplayer is a media player Feb 01 00:18:12 m(edia)player :) Feb 01 00:18:41 Try Kagu or UKMP or summuch for music. Feb 01 00:19:11 Hmm, doesn't want to play anything but video on maemo. Feb 01 00:19:34 http://www.gronmayer.com/it/index.php?lang=en&system=maemo4 Feb 01 00:19:40 daveux, you might find that link interesting Feb 01 00:19:42 I tried Kagu and UKMP, and they both really fritzed out on me. Feb 01 00:19:49 but beware...not everything will work Feb 01 00:19:53 due to dependencies Feb 01 00:19:58 be very picky! Feb 01 00:21:44 ohh, too bad the video window is not in the same window as the chat Feb 01 00:21:45 ukmp was interesting. it played something but the sound was loud and clipping. even after shutting the tablet down it still continued for 5 seconds or so Feb 01 00:22:03 in the charging screen that is Feb 01 00:22:12 Also, they way ukmp (or Kagu) played my ogg files sounded like shit. Feb 01 00:24:04 So, is it possible to add/remove apps in the organize applications dialog in the panel preferenceS? Feb 01 00:24:20 No, that's not what that's for. Feb 01 00:24:28 You want Application Manager. Feb 01 00:24:30 bloody hell Feb 01 00:24:43 £90million in the jackpot Feb 01 00:24:46 lool Feb 01 00:24:48 No, I don't want to install/uninstall them. Feb 01 00:24:56 whoever wins that will be a happy bunny Feb 01 00:25:00 open a datacenter Feb 01 00:25:07 fund a few opensource projects Feb 01 00:25:13 and live at the beach somewhere Feb 01 00:25:31 daveux: settings, panels, organise Feb 01 00:25:33 LinuxCode: and then? Feb 01 00:25:40 enjoy life ? Feb 01 00:25:44 LinuxCode: and then? :) Feb 01 00:25:49 develop for the N810 Feb 01 00:25:51 daveux, what's your intention, then? Feb 01 00:25:53 LinuxCode: that's too much for one person Feb 01 00:25:53 or pay people to Feb 01 00:26:01 pay 20 people Feb 01 00:26:13 daveux: you can move them around, you cannot remove them Feb 01 00:26:14 So, my "My selection" category has Skype in it - I'd like that gone. Feb 01 00:26:20 or pay the maintainers of packages to port stuff to N810 Feb 01 00:26:25 That's just an add for skype. Feb 01 00:26:47 fugitivo, tbh mate Feb 01 00:27:00 Id probabbly pay people to make fedora arm work properly Feb 01 00:27:03 I'm not sure, you might be able to use that to install skype then uninstall it to get rid of all the skype icons... Feb 01 00:27:12 Yeah Feb 01 00:27:14 as its very develop status Feb 01 00:27:17 atm Feb 01 00:27:40 LinuxCode, so I was thinking about a similar situation - what if I were Steve Jobs, with $18bn in the bank and running Apple? Feb 01 00:28:01 daveux, Id be like Mark Shuttleworth Feb 01 00:28:04 I would buy all the patents and licences that make OS X closed source, then release it all under GPL. Feb 01 00:28:07 who funds ubuntu Feb 01 00:28:15 daveux, haha Feb 01 00:28:19 I want to use the tablet as a diskless terminal Feb 01 00:28:19 Just buy up BSD, let it free. Feb 01 00:28:22 daveux: That would be hard considering some of it is already BSD. Feb 01 00:28:24 fuck software patents Feb 01 00:28:29 they dont even count in the EU Feb 01 00:28:34 spend ya money on something else Feb 01 00:28:35 oh that'd be cool, boot minimyth on it using the network Feb 01 00:28:35 fugitivo, an x terminal? Feb 01 00:28:42 like making a distro based in the EU Feb 01 00:28:53 better way to spen your money Feb 01 00:28:55 spend Feb 01 00:29:11 johnx: booting the OS through the network Feb 01 00:29:29 pxe boot Feb 01 00:29:33 hehe Feb 01 00:29:35 yes Feb 01 00:29:55 fugitivo, uhm why? Feb 01 00:30:07 if somebody wrote a bootloader like I have for my Jornada 710 to load familiar Feb 01 00:30:08 fugitivo, though actually I know how ... Feb 01 00:30:15 i have several mini-itx in my house booting minimyth Feb 01 00:30:19 you could probably do it Feb 01 00:30:37 it resets wince into the system state Feb 01 00:30:42 and you can boot linux Feb 01 00:30:48 johnx: because I like diskless terminals :) Feb 01 00:31:04 you could probably get it working pretty well using fanoush's modified initfs Feb 01 00:31:07 pitty I never had a flashbaord for it Feb 01 00:31:21 it would have been like a N810 years ago Feb 01 00:31:24 yes, i'm reading http://fanoush.wz.cz/maemo/#initfs Feb 01 00:31:29 just bring up wifi inside the initfs (left as an exercise for the reader :) ) Feb 01 00:31:43 fugitivo, let me know how that goes please Feb 01 00:31:44 mount nfs share, and pivot_root Feb 01 00:32:18 I was pondering to do that to boot the fedora arm rootfs Feb 01 00:32:21 though I think an x-terminal sounds more interesting :D Feb 01 00:32:21 i'll need to compile a kernel Feb 01 00:32:46 fugitivo, for nfs? Feb 01 00:32:53 speaking of.. is there a working nx client for os2008? Feb 01 00:33:16 LinuxCode, read my thing on Debian wiki, specifically the "How I did it" section for some (very hacky) ideas Feb 01 00:33:29 http://www.internettablettalk.com/wiki/index.php?title=Debian Feb 01 00:33:32 smack me with the Feb 01 00:33:34 link Feb 01 00:33:35 lol Feb 01 00:33:42 beat me to it Feb 01 00:33:43 well, i'll start with the experiment when my n810 arrives Feb 01 00:34:05 so i can break my 770 and keep a working tablet for development :) Feb 01 00:34:25 sounds reasonable :) Feb 01 00:35:31 LinuxCode, though really, why fedora over debian? :P Feb 01 00:38:40 I laways use and liked fedora Feb 01 00:38:43 used Feb 01 00:39:58 I guess so... Feb 01 00:40:15 what does it use as window manager ? Feb 01 00:40:15 there are really a lot more packages for Debian armel...including hildon Feb 01 00:40:34 well sounds like a lot of stuff still doesnt work Feb 01 00:40:58 yeah, it won't work in fedora either...in fact I can pretty much guarantee that less stuff will work Feb 01 00:41:18 are you reading the "How I did it" or the status at the top? Feb 01 00:41:24 status Feb 01 00:41:33 yeah, that's pretty current :/ Feb 01 00:41:34 im flying overit all Feb 01 00:41:51 what window manager is used ? Feb 01 00:42:00 I'm using hildon-desktop Feb 01 00:42:08 when unloading an applet is any other function hit after lib_deinitialize? Feb 01 00:42:59 In a previous version I was using matchbox wm (w/ matchbox desktop and panel) Feb 01 00:53:52 johnx, k Feb 01 01:08:22 so is this new Video Center better than gpodder? Feb 01 01:09:02 They're . . . different. Feb 01 01:09:12 I use Canola2 for podcasts, though. Feb 01 01:15:47 nn all Feb 01 01:15:48 ;-] Feb 01 01:43:23 does anyone use canola 2 on a regular basis? Feb 01 01:44:55 Just installed it 5 minutes ago Feb 01 01:45:36 Now to get some videos loaded on this thing Feb 01 01:50:05 Tama^2, yes, mostly for podcasts. Feb 01 01:50:57 good, I am running some battery draining tests for idle mode so I cannot try it myself Feb 01 01:51:05 at the moment at least Feb 01 01:51:24 the videos I found online are cool, too cool to be true ;) Feb 01 02:29:56 what's the n8xx way to run chron, or schedule a program? Feb 01 02:30:13 install crond Feb 01 02:30:33 thanks Feb 01 02:31:05 there is something called alarmtool and alarmd that should be able to technically do it, but it looked like a pain to me Feb 01 02:31:10 so I compiled cron Feb 01 02:31:35 http://sheeplauncher.net/cron_3.0pl1-100_armel.deb Feb 01 02:40:55 Anybody know where to find a standard ftp client for maemo? Feb 01 02:42:50 if you search for ftp on garage.maemo.org you'll find a couple ... but I don't know how well they work Feb 01 02:42:57 I tried ncftp from the elkins.org repository, but its features seem a bit odd Feb 01 02:43:12 Ok tks Feb 01 02:55:23 .hi, i am trying to navigate to my memory card in applications manager but cannot find the card.. is there a setting that lets me browse the whole filesystem? Feb 01 02:56:40 are you talking about an SD card or the internal flash on the device? Feb 01 02:56:54 (this is a n800 and i have uploaded from my mac to one of the SD cards and wish to install the software) Feb 01 02:57:04 an SD Feb 01 02:57:29 you should be able to see your whole SD card... Feb 01 02:57:32 "Uploaded"? What software? Feb 01 02:57:41 freeciv and nethack Feb 01 02:57:52 "Uploaded"? Feb 01 02:57:56 i just threw them in the root folder of my SD cards Feb 01 02:58:07 (plugged in usb cable and transferred them over) Feb 01 02:58:07 Did you unplug the USB cable from the Mac? Feb 01 02:58:15 nope Feb 01 02:58:17 with ermining I can sync google calendar with gpe-calendar. is there an similar app for the google notes? Feb 01 02:58:21 There's your problem Feb 01 02:58:23 Unmount the cards Feb 01 02:58:29 (eject) Feb 01 02:58:32 and disconnect the cable. Feb 01 02:58:42 ahh, that did it.. thank you **** ENDING LOGGING AT Fri Feb 01 02:59:57 2008