**** BEGIN LOGGING AT Fri Feb 15 02:59:56 2008 Feb 15 03:00:12 * johnx reads Feb 15 03:00:30 The big three manufacturers in the US drove him out of business Feb 15 03:00:36 only 51 made! Feb 15 03:00:47 s/three/three car/ Feb 15 03:00:48 Navi meant: The big three car manufacturers in the US drove him out of business Feb 15 03:01:03 (according to the other half of johnx's brain, which is apparently editable by just anyone) Feb 15 03:01:05 Can't reach en.wikipedia.org. :\ Feb 15 03:01:10 Interesting story, really. Feb 15 03:02:00 The first display model was made out of junk and didn't even actually run Feb 15 03:02:32 http://www.tuckerclub.org/html/history.php Feb 15 03:02:46 this sounds like the ideal car to dashmount a 770 in Feb 15 03:03:13 that 1948 sedan actually looks really slick Feb 15 03:03:48 thanks Navi, I'd never heard of the Tucker before Feb 15 03:04:07 Useless facts ain't so useless any more. Feb 15 03:04:08 Check out the Lincoln Zephyr (40s) Feb 15 03:04:11 Purty car. Feb 15 03:07:40 karateka! :) Feb 15 03:09:27 yeah, mechanical fuel injection might not have been the best move... Feb 15 03:09:31 the 30s/40s Lincoln Zephyr looks very nice, but the 2006 model by the same name... not so much Feb 15 03:10:51 but fuel injection, nonetheless Feb 15 03:12:09 GM's Chevrolet didn't have it until '57 Feb 15 03:12:17 it took quite a while to get fuel injection right... Feb 15 03:12:31 heck, lots of cars had carbs into the 90s Feb 15 03:12:46 same with drum brakes Feb 15 03:17:23 johnx, lots of cars have drum brakes now. Feb 15 03:17:37 yes, and that's terrifying Feb 15 03:17:38 They're cheap, and perfectly reasonable as rear brakes for 90% of the economy lot. Feb 15 03:17:48 for small cars I guess Feb 15 03:17:54 Nah, not terrifying at all. Feb 15 03:18:01 Makes great sense as a cost-saving measure. Feb 15 03:18:10 They're a LOT cheaper to manufacture. Feb 15 03:18:23 I'd still rather have disks :) Feb 15 03:18:28 Much better parking brakes. Feb 15 03:18:42 that's because they're easy to lock :P Feb 15 03:19:12 Disc brakes only get a stupid little miniscule pad for the parking brake Feb 15 03:19:16 drum brakes use the real pad. Feb 15 03:19:25 You're only doing 20% of the braking on the rears, anyway. Feb 15 03:19:35 So things like fade and power aren't really an issue. Feb 15 03:20:03 yeah, I just had lots of fun with locking the rear drums (sometimes on purpose, sometimes not...) on my '82 honda accord Feb 15 03:20:19 lol Feb 15 03:20:31 looking back, I probably needed to check the brake balance Feb 15 03:20:42 Ha Feb 15 03:21:26 * johnx actually started like 4 wheel discs with ABS the last time he drove in the ice/snow Feb 15 03:21:39 s/like/liking/g Feb 15 03:24:13 wow, this emu is only taking 8-10% cpu Feb 15 03:24:21 ? Feb 15 03:24:34 down to 6 now Feb 15 03:24:41 Which emu? Feb 15 03:25:02 the one i'm tweaking :) Feb 15 03:25:08 :P Feb 15 03:25:20 What does it emulate? Feb 15 03:25:42 an old computer Feb 15 03:26:01 but as usual there's all kinds of ui crapola that needs doing Feb 15 03:26:12 and sound is bluttery Feb 15 03:26:23 What operating system does this old computer that's trying to be emulated run? Feb 15 03:31:36 And, does the old computer's CPU have a name? Feb 15 03:32:13 if not, can we name it? I' thinking "Fred" would be good... Feb 15 03:33:01 No, "James". Feb 15 03:37:31 so, can someone explain to me why it's so difficult to get replacement styluses? Feb 15 03:37:49 Because Nokia hates you. Feb 15 03:38:01 but, I give them money :( Feb 15 03:38:04 or, it's punishment for being forgetful. :P Feb 15 03:38:26 I wasn't forgetful, my dog decided he might like to chew on it for a bit Feb 15 03:38:31 little shit Feb 15 03:38:48 so I have one left and a fear of being forgetful :/ Feb 15 03:39:08 Got another one in the box? Feb 15 03:39:20 yep Feb 15 03:39:24 I've only almost lost one stylus with 4 tablets. Feb 15 03:39:33 so you have some spares you might flog? :) Feb 15 03:39:34 Fell asleep in the break room at work using the tablet. Feb 15 03:39:48 Fell into the cushions, but I found it later. Feb 15 03:40:01 2 spares for the N800s, 2 for the 770s. :P Feb 15 03:40:14 want to sell them? Feb 15 03:40:17 Use it to create a mold Feb 15 03:40:23 i found a set on ebay Feb 15 03:40:32 Haha Feb 15 03:40:35 pupnik: I looked yesterday, couldn't see any Feb 15 03:40:35 I like that thinking. Feb 15 03:40:37 Manufacture them. Feb 15 03:40:40 and then create cheap replacement styluses and sell them for five dollars each Feb 15 03:40:50 Idiots like GeneralAntilles will buy them up Feb 15 03:40:55 and me :o Feb 15 03:40:55 Haha Feb 15 03:40:58 Somebody should do that. Feb 15 03:41:03 See? Feb 15 03:41:05 :3 Feb 15 03:41:06 Completely plastic. Feb 15 03:41:16 I would go the other way Feb 15 03:41:22 completely stainless steel Feb 15 03:41:24 yeah, completely metal would be better Feb 15 03:41:31 good feel to it Feb 15 03:41:33 then little shithead dogs wouldn't be able to chew them :( Feb 15 03:41:40 Batch of a thousand would cost, what, $0.05-.10 a piece? Feb 15 03:41:45 something like lead would be good Feb 15 03:41:45 Don't make fun of dogs like that. Feb 15 03:41:55 johnx: nah, silver, or platinum Feb 15 03:42:04 Navi: I won't make fun when he doesn't chew my shit Feb 15 03:42:29 Only make fun of humans. Humans are expendable Feb 15 03:42:31 1,200 dollar stylus :D Feb 15 03:42:38 Haha :) Feb 15 03:42:47 There's something I wouldn't want to forget Feb 15 03:42:48 Navi: so are dogs once they're dropped off 10th floor balconies Feb 15 03:42:51 * doc|home looks out his window Feb 15 03:43:14 so, eh, wanting to flog spare styluses anyone? :) Feb 15 03:43:17 Melt down your wife's jewelry to make a stylus Feb 15 03:43:30 She'll appreciate it Feb 15 03:43:59 anyone know if evince works on OS2008 yet? Feb 15 03:44:14 Build it Feb 15 03:44:19 It has for a while, joebloe. Feb 15 03:45:14 ok .. i am somewhat obtuse tonight .. guess lack of sleep .. is it availible from one of the repositories .. or do i need to manually grab it? Feb 15 03:45:25 Check gronmayer Feb 15 03:45:27 or google Feb 15 03:45:28 I should try to compile scratchbox/maemo-sdk on cygwin some time. Feb 15 03:45:46 Navi, because you hate yourself? Feb 15 03:45:51 ok .. thanks .. will look on gronmayer Feb 15 03:46:20 Because it would let Windows developers to get into the action without having to boot Windows or under a VM Feb 15 03:46:24 :P Feb 15 03:46:35 I mean....ow, seriously. Not anything against Windows, but scratchbox even hates non-debuntu linux Feb 15 03:46:38 s/Windows/Linux Feb 15 03:46:56 scratchbox is fine under non-debian linux distros Feb 15 03:47:11 I thought that was where most people had setup issues? Feb 15 03:47:28 argh why is sdl sound so problematic with emulators Feb 15 03:47:32 * Navi isn't running a debian-based distro Feb 15 03:47:32 never looked too closely... Feb 15 03:47:42 oh, well I take it back then Feb 15 03:47:45 have fun :) Feb 15 03:47:50 styluses? anyone? :) Feb 15 03:47:56 there was one set up issue quickly resolved by setting a var Feb 15 03:53:18 doc|home, I'd love one Feb 15 03:56:29 hello Feb 15 03:56:46 hello Feb 15 03:56:58 im lloking for a video chat client that also works with pc Feb 15 03:58:44 I believe that gizmo does Feb 15 03:59:10 so i thought Feb 15 03:59:23 So you thought? Feb 15 03:59:34 but when i installed it there were no video otions Feb 15 03:59:44 PC Gizmo has video. Feb 15 03:59:44 i oculd not find a link to a beta or anything Feb 15 03:59:56 yes Feb 15 04:00:05 N800 Gizmo has video. Feb 15 04:00:08 but for my n800 its does not Feb 15 04:00:17 is there a beta version i have to get? Feb 15 04:00:35 i have 3.1.0.78 Feb 15 04:00:48 Your version is dated. Feb 15 04:01:16 what is the current version? Feb 15 04:01:21 Chinook has 4.0.0.95 Feb 15 04:01:29 i am running bora Feb 15 04:01:32 But Gizmo 3 had video as well. Feb 15 04:01:47 Why would you be running Bora? Feb 15 04:01:54 just opened it Feb 15 04:02:02 The general consensus is that you flash right away. Feb 15 04:02:07 what is the favored os? Feb 15 04:02:10 Of course, you shouldn't listen to me as I don't own one. Feb 15 04:02:27 The latest, susej. Feb 15 04:02:58 the latest being chinook? Feb 15 04:03:03 Yes. Feb 15 04:03:14 More accurately, OS2008 Feb 15 04:03:29 i thougt that chinook was for the 810 Feb 15 04:03:49 so there is a os 2008 for the n800 Feb 15 04:03:52 The N810 is just the N800 with a few revisions, all the same. Feb 15 04:04:09 orly? Feb 15 04:04:17 howso navi Feb 15 04:04:17 Yes. Feb 15 04:04:26 Howso? Same hardware. Feb 15 04:04:36 GPS, transflective, keyboard, minisd Feb 15 04:04:43 That's pretty much the extent of the differences. Feb 15 04:06:16 I guess not everyone is like me. I really dig deep into the stuff I buy. Feb 15 04:06:33 s/buy/looking to buy/ Feb 15 04:06:34 Navi meant: I guess not everyone is like me. I really dig deep into the stuff I looking to buy. Feb 15 04:06:48 s/I looking/I'm looking/ Feb 15 04:06:50 Navi, susej, Gizmo 3 does not have video afaik Feb 15 04:06:59 Gizmo 4 does Feb 15 04:07:38 Really? I remember people making video calls back on Bora. Feb 15 04:08:06 Using GTalk Feb 15 04:08:14 ah Feb 15 04:09:10 and gizmo 4 is still not out for mac or linux (except ITOS2008) Feb 15 04:09:40 Funny Feb 15 04:09:46 What about Skype? Feb 15 04:10:00 No video on the ITs? Feb 15 04:10:04 video on desktop linux, no video on ITs Feb 15 04:10:07 funny, isn't it? Feb 15 04:10:19 the irony kills Feb 15 04:15:46 so Navi, which tablet are you leaning towards? is the requirement just pocketable and Linux or something else? Feb 15 04:16:03 Leaning towards? Feb 15 04:16:57 if you were to get a tablet, which one would it be? Feb 15 04:17:05 what is your preference? Feb 15 04:17:53 hey guys thanks for all the help Feb 15 04:17:59 one more nub question b4 i go Feb 15 04:18:02 sure Feb 15 04:18:07 where can i down load the os2008 Feb 15 04:18:11 maemo.org Feb 15 04:18:21 http://tablet-dev.nokia.org/nokia_N800.php Feb 15 04:18:21 http://tablets-dev.nokia.com/nokia_N800.php Feb 15 04:18:23 johnx, there are several factors in my decision Feb 15 04:18:27 I won locally! Feb 15 04:18:31 me too! Feb 15 04:18:36 But I screwed up the link. . . Feb 15 04:18:37 DAMN! Feb 15 04:18:38 GeneralAntilles, you won globally Feb 15 04:18:50 sans leif__ Feb 15 04:18:50 * GeneralAntilles concedes to leif__. Feb 15 04:19:00 Anyways Feb 15 04:19:43 johnx, first and foremost is that it must be officially supported for at least a few more years after my purchase, or have a powerful development community behind it Feb 15 04:20:42 secondly, it's gotta perform well _with_ good battery life. One without the other just doesn't cut it for me. Feb 15 04:21:52 so, looking at the 770's new unsupported release today with the same old kernel from September 2006 probably isn't encouraging you to buy from Nokia then? Feb 15 04:21:52 Of course, it's gotta be pocketable and not too expensive Feb 15 04:21:56 ;) Feb 15 04:22:22 The proprietary bits really fuck it up. Feb 15 04:22:26 so is Linux one of the requirements? Feb 15 04:22:27 yeah. Feb 15 04:23:25 No, but it's a nice bonus. The fact that the IT _is_ Linux is a plus, however, the proprietary bits that come with it doesn't help it's case Feb 15 04:23:32 s/IT/NIT/ Feb 15 04:23:32 Navi meant: No, but it's a nice bonus. The fact that the NIT _is_ Linux is a plus, however, the proprietary bits that come with it doesn't help it's case Feb 15 04:25:14 i thought i only had one more Feb 15 04:25:18 Really now, GNU is all about all or nothing. You either open the entire device or you lock it up. At least it's not the Mylo, though. Feb 15 04:25:25 is the current version 2.2007.50-2? Feb 15 04:25:33 susej, yes Feb 15 04:25:59 Navi, yeah...I'm not exactly thrilled either Feb 15 04:26:06 I'm already set on buying the NIT, GeneralAntilles's fault. Feb 15 04:26:29 heh...it really is pretty much the only thing in its category right now Feb 15 04:26:31 * leif__ wonders where the 2008SE_2.2007.51-3 useragents got their firmware Feb 15 04:26:38 (seen in access_log) Feb 15 04:27:02 I was hoping the Intel MID would come around before I make a purchase Feb 15 04:27:04 leif__, that's an user agent... Feb 15 04:27:04 Internal testing, leif__. Feb 15 04:27:15 Mara, Texrat, etc. Feb 15 04:27:21 rather, that's an *interesting* user agent Feb 15 04:28:07 Navi, Until I see hardware in users' hands I'm not too inclined to believe how incredible the MIDs will be... Feb 15 04:28:24 as i mentioned the other day, there are also some people running RX-34+RX-44+RX-48_DIABLO_0.2008.06-10 Feb 15 04:28:31 I'm infering on their decisions from past experience Feb 15 04:28:49 Intel has a good track record of opening their drivers Feb 15 04:28:57 somewhat Feb 15 04:29:05 i used a samsung UMPC with the intel MID software at linuxworld sf last year Feb 15 04:29:08 they seem to be coming around recently Feb 15 04:29:14 it was running google earth :) Feb 15 04:29:40 leif__, impressive. how did the software feel compared to nokia's maemo? Feb 15 04:29:57 it felt like a 900mhz intel system Feb 15 04:29:59 because it was Feb 15 04:30:04 Haha Feb 15 04:30:06 but it wouldn't fit in my pocket. Feb 15 04:30:16 leif__, can you suck the firmware out through their browsers? :P Feb 15 04:30:18 Well, it was a Samsung UMPC :P Feb 15 04:30:22 heh...but the actual design of the UI? Feb 15 04:30:58 it was ubuntu mobile edition, before gutsy was officially released Feb 15 04:31:05 Ha Feb 15 04:31:07 so pretty unfinished? Feb 15 04:31:13 apt-get install ubuntu-mobile if you want to see it... Feb 15 04:31:29 yeah, I guess I should Feb 15 04:31:34 They have a site Feb 15 04:31:34 yeah it was pretty unfinished at the time, and what really killed me was the home screen was all implemented in flash :( Feb 15 04:31:39 or a dedicated page, at least Feb 15 04:31:45 http://www.ubuntu.com/products/mobile Feb 15 04:32:15 I have hardy on my craptastic laptop, I'll just do my guinea pig experiments on it... Feb 15 04:33:10 one of the intel guys from China had his 770 with him :) Feb 15 04:33:19 Lol Feb 15 04:34:19 so does anyone know if Ubuntu is working on an arm port? Feb 15 04:34:26 Pfft Feb 15 04:34:30 there was talk about it at one time, but i never saw anything substantive Feb 15 04:34:38 leif__, I highly doubt it Feb 15 04:34:40 Ubuntu's just a preconfigured Debian Feb 15 04:34:42 they even dropped PPC Feb 15 04:35:04 If there is one, they'll just piggyback on Debian-ARM's progress. Feb 15 04:35:21 well a lot of devs work on packages for both... Feb 15 04:35:24 AFAIK Feb 15 04:35:34 johnx, not completely dropped Feb 15 04:35:54 really? I didn't think they had a gutsy or feisty release for it? Feb 15 04:36:15 http://ports.ubuntu.com/dists/hardy/main/binary-powerpc/ Feb 15 04:36:44 so they have a community supported release now...ok, I see Feb 15 04:36:50 right. Feb 15 04:38:06 Navi, Ubuntu is a little more than just a preconfigured Debian Feb 15 04:38:59 Ha, maybe to you. Feb 15 04:39:14 if you want to run closer-to-current versions of software without compiling your own stuff or using testing or unstable, Ubuntu has it Feb 15 04:39:49 I'm perfectly happy with either for the most part... Feb 15 04:40:02 ArchLinux. Feb 15 04:40:07 I'm perfectly happy using both Feb 15 04:40:22 johnx: johnx :P Feb 15 04:40:33 rm_you, rm_you ? Feb 15 04:40:46 Navi, I've looked at that but haven't run it yet. Is that what you use? Feb 15 04:40:55 johnx: nothing :) just saying hi Feb 15 04:40:57 All right, A stable preconfigured Debian Sid Feb 15 04:41:04 leif__, yes. Feb 15 04:41:30 and there is mint Feb 15 04:41:39 Mint is a themed Ubuntu Feb 15 04:41:43 the windows vista of debian distros Feb 15 04:41:44 * rm_you runs Ubuntu Mint Feb 15 04:42:06 i like the theme :P and it comes with all the codecs i want Feb 15 04:42:22 I have to compile a few things to stay on the bleeding edge though, like mplayer-svn and ffmpeg-svn Feb 15 04:42:37 even ubuntu is too bloated for my tastes in their stock install Feb 15 04:42:45 compiling mplayer is my hobby :P Feb 15 04:43:07 lol, yeah... i just installed debian on my server a few weeks ago and was reminded how ridiculously trim and snappy it is comparatively Feb 15 04:43:08 webkit-svn, midori as well Feb 15 04:43:39 Navi, I finally got my midori build up in OE Feb 15 04:43:46 cool Feb 15 04:43:49 Yeah, I heard Feb 15 04:43:53 oh, right Feb 15 04:43:56 forgot if you were there Feb 15 04:44:08 * johnx tends to just repeat the same things ... O_o Feb 15 04:44:14 ^_^ Feb 15 04:44:23 what is midori? besides delicious melon liquor and japanese for "green"? >_> Feb 15 04:44:35 lightweight webkit based browser in gtk Feb 15 04:44:37 johnx, have you tried building chinook-compatible packages in OE (as talked about on planet maemo today)? Feb 15 04:44:38 ah Feb 15 04:44:42 neat Feb 15 04:44:44 gtk and libsexy Feb 15 04:45:00 leif__, sure, i'll give it a shot Feb 15 04:45:16 dunno if there are still pieces missing for that Feb 15 04:46:03 well, I'll see Feb 15 04:46:18 also, I'd like to try and get an angstrom build for the N800 Feb 15 04:48:49 there have been images of that available, but haven't tried it yet Feb 15 04:49:07 the only non-ITOS distro I've run on my N800 yet was Poky Feb 15 04:49:17 I thought I heard various things didn't work in those... Feb 15 04:49:22 yeah. Feb 15 04:49:28 it was fun for a little while though Feb 15 04:49:43 it should be trivial to take the things that make Debian work and add them to angstrom Feb 15 04:50:06 and to tell the truth...debian really is a little heavy for a zaurus or n800 Feb 15 04:50:38 and the situation for cross compiling leaves something to be desired... Feb 15 04:52:28 ah, I assume the chinook-compat stuff is in OE .dev not OE .angstrom-2007.1-stable Feb 15 04:52:30 bleh Feb 15 04:56:18 Why does everybody want to feed the newbies red pill as some sort of magical fix-all on ITT? <_< Feb 15 04:56:27 haha Feb 15 04:56:59 johnx, "The most parts are already committed to the OpenEmbedded upstream, but we are still maintaining an overlay in our svn." according to http://smancke.blogs.evolvis.org/2008/02/13/using-openembedded-for-maemo-development/ Feb 15 04:57:17 whatever that means Feb 15 04:57:18 leif__, thanks. I will RTFA :) Feb 15 04:57:48 GeneralAntilles, because it sounds cool? Feb 15 04:58:00 I choose the blue pill Feb 15 04:58:36 Anyways, Debian's too heavy for the NIT? Feb 15 04:58:57 yes please elaborate on that, johnx Feb 15 04:59:14 ah, I will read the fine article :) Feb 15 04:59:18 couldn't it be as stripped down as ITOS, if not moreso? Feb 15 04:59:18 Debian was designed to be able to run smoothly, even on ancient hardware Feb 15 04:59:19 slashdot thing I guess Feb 15 05:00:32 obviously, there are many things worked into the desktop Debian, but they can be stripped Feb 15 05:00:38 it can be stripped down. We can do docpurge, but no matter what all the binary packages are going to be pretty big and configured with "everything including the kitchen sink" Feb 15 05:01:47 But why use the binary packages? It's always more sane to gear software torwards your target platform. Feb 15 05:02:40 so, repackage everything you ever want to use? Feb 15 05:02:58 uhm...if that's what you're prepared to do, you're better off with Nokia's ITOS Feb 15 05:03:05 johnx, http://www.joachim-breitner.de/blog/archives/282-Ways-to-fork-privately.html Feb 15 05:03:16 I repackage plenty of things I use Feb 15 05:03:47 and those repackagers can maintain a repository for others to use Feb 15 05:03:57 Yes, but you're a crazy person. :P Feb 15 05:04:08 I'm not crazy, you are. :P Feb 15 05:04:24 Navi, the two tough things then are (a) staying up to date, and (b) being compatible with the rest of Debian Feb 15 05:04:24 yeah, let's splinter debian into a million little semi-incompatible repositories Feb 15 05:04:35 and we can call it ... maemo! Feb 15 05:04:42 Ha Feb 15 05:05:02 If we were to do that, then I would certainly call it f0rqu3. Feb 15 05:05:49 well everyone can name their own fork whatever they want. that's the best part! Feb 15 05:06:12 Then we'll have Fork Wars! Feb 15 05:06:19 Navi, do you have an automated process to build new upstream releases of things you repackage using your own patches (as that blog post I linked is talking about)? Feb 15 05:06:31 Like little warlords over our own little pieces of nothing. Feb 15 05:06:37 and we can end up the same as the zaurus community! Feb 15 05:06:39 woo! Feb 15 05:06:42 * GeneralAntilles Fork Wars Navi. Feb 15 05:06:58 Both A and B are satisfiable with a system of maintainers and developers Feb 15 05:07:01 as a true fork should have Feb 15 05:07:09 riight Feb 15 05:07:13 leif__, yes, I have an automatic process. Feb 15 05:07:17 just add free labor ;) Feb 15 05:07:27 * GeneralAntilles enslaves leif__. Feb 15 05:07:33 what does it entail? Feb 15 05:07:40 (to Navi, not GeneralAntilles!) Feb 15 05:07:44 You work, work a lot. For free. Feb 15 05:07:54 yaourt -Syu --aur Feb 15 05:07:55 * johnx really doesn't want to start a whole new distro... Feb 15 05:08:35 * leif__ reads more about ArchLinux... Feb 15 05:08:39 things that I've seen work: 1) hardware support packages for debian -and- 2) getting a supported machine profile in OE for angstrom Feb 15 05:08:46 * johnx reads about arch as well... Feb 15 05:09:18 Of course, it's really not always automatic and entails editing pkgver= in a build script Feb 15 05:09:22 then building and install it Feb 15 05:09:43 2 you mean? Feb 15 05:09:53 2? Feb 15 05:09:59 oh, well that ruins it! Feb 15 05:10:19 editing pkgver in a build script in OE or Debian? eh? Feb 15 05:10:26 build script in Arch Feb 15 05:10:30 ah Feb 15 05:10:31 assuming the patches apply correctly, it should be as simple as apt-get upgrade, imho :) Feb 15 05:10:53 They're just bash scripts, not complicated deb build scripts Feb 15 05:11:41 * johnx will try arch another day, likely on his guinea pig laptop Feb 15 05:12:03 More than a fair trade to keep up-to-date on a binary distro Feb 15 05:12:50 I realized that I don't care all that much about whether 90% of my packages are up to date Feb 15 05:13:05 and thankfully the API-breakage rate isn't as high as it was 10 years ago... Feb 15 05:13:22 unless we're talking webkit Feb 15 05:13:31 right, that falls into the 10% Feb 15 05:13:36 and I build it out of git Feb 15 05:13:50 API-breakage out of the ass Feb 15 05:13:57 but all it's support libraries don't need to be built from source Feb 15 05:14:11 I can use the ones in gutsy without issues Feb 15 05:14:49 There are specific things I want to keep up with, even past the most recent stable release Feb 15 05:15:52 me too, and I've found a debuntu distro to be good enough almost all the time Feb 15 05:16:10 to each his own I think... Feb 15 05:16:30 Firefox, mplayer, ffmpeg, mpd, abiword are all built on my PC Feb 15 05:16:42 anyone here use sqlite3 under maemo SDK bora? I'm seeing some annoying problems - 1) under ARMEL scratchbox - can create DB but then when you .exit or .quit and re-launch with the same db filename - it seems to have forgotten the schema and db contents Feb 15 05:17:00 Navi, those days are over for me Feb 15 05:17:04 every svn revision for mplayer, ffmpeg, and mpd. Every nightly for Firefox3 Feb 15 05:17:06 perhaps some sort of byte ordering issue?? Feb 15 05:17:21 Every unstable snap for Abiword Feb 15 05:17:54 Navi, ask me how fun building gnome 0.54 on a K62 was... Feb 15 05:18:23 Bet it was very fun Feb 15 05:18:42 2) also, the file produced inside scratchbox appears to be readable outside Feb 15 05:18:42 of scratchbox...strange indeed. it does seem readable via the Feb 15 05:18:42 python2.5 sqlite3 module under scratchbox. BUT inserts are being ignored when done via python2.5 Feb 15 05:19:42 Thankfully, I don't have to build everything myself a la Gentoo. Feb 15 05:20:15 The sqlite docs mention that it will not work if forked - perhaps the qemu code at work behind the scenes is doing a fork?? Anyone have any ideas? Feb 15 05:20:31 at one point in time I had a redhat 5.1 system that was about 80% the result of compiling from source with no package management Feb 15 05:20:39 Navi, so the process is that you edit the version numbers in some bash scripts, and then run one command? Feb 15 05:20:56 seems like the updating of version numbers could be automated too somehow... Feb 15 05:21:00 correct, for the most part. Feb 15 05:21:08 more bash scripts Feb 15 05:21:15 Ha Feb 15 05:21:19 Or fed as arguments at least. Feb 15 05:21:20 bash scripts to automate the editing of bash scripts Feb 15 05:21:54 then we just automate the process of updating so it happens automatically every so often...with bash scripts! Feb 15 05:22:01 http://aur.archlinux.org/packages/midori-git/midori-git/PKGBUILD Feb 15 05:22:04 pfft Feb 15 05:22:07 cron, foo Feb 15 05:22:21 no need to overload the bash scripts Feb 15 05:22:23 fractal bash scripts Feb 15 05:22:25 who needs cron, when we have bash scripts! Feb 15 05:22:42 "bash scripts all the way down" Feb 15 05:22:42 Can you imagine a beowulf cluster of . . . bash scripts@ Feb 15 05:23:43 * leif__ can Feb 15 05:24:02 I can imagine a GeneralAntilles made out of post-it notes. Feb 15 05:25:01 http://www.impawards.com/1999/posters/office_space.jpg ? Feb 15 05:25:37 hello Feb 15 05:25:38 Heh, the NIT would replace so much of my phone's functionality Feb 15 05:25:47 hi, Nickel_ Feb 15 05:25:49 Nickel_, hi Feb 15 05:26:10 trying to get n800 to stream as a webcam, can't find package gstreamer0.10-3gp-osso Feb 15 05:27:09 anyone tried to do video streaming? Feb 15 05:27:32 I thought someone was doing it with vlc a while back Feb 15 05:28:08 yes there are a couple of projects Feb 15 05:28:36 for one of them we're kind-of waiting for vlc 0.9 to be released Feb 15 05:28:50 i see Feb 15 05:29:24 i think there's a mythtv frontend, a 'mediaserver', and an 'orb' client also Feb 15 05:30:06 oh i missed your prior post Feb 15 05:30:17 Namely: Email, IRC, Email, Putty, Email, Media Playing, Email, dictionary, Email Feb 15 05:30:20 don't know about webcam - let me know if you find something Feb 15 05:31:05 http://maemo.org/community/wiki/howtostreamvideo/ Feb 15 05:31:23 This I have been trying to follow, but I can't seem to get all of the packages Feb 15 05:32:51 the gst-launch actually doesn't crash, but it gives a warning about Glib threading...'the application needs to be fixed..." Feb 15 05:33:28 and I haven't been able to open the stream from VLC (on windows) Feb 15 05:35:20 cool, looking Feb 15 05:35:32 Nickel_, http://web.media.mit.edu/~lifton/snippets/n800_to_sl/ ? (I haven't tried it myself) Feb 15 05:35:52 i cant seem to stream from my mythtv setup Feb 15 05:36:27 the server shows up in the file manager, but the videos can't be played in the default media player on os2008 Feb 15 05:36:33 leif__: yes, that one is almost the same how-to Feb 15 05:36:44 sorry. Feb 15 05:40:06 hrm not gonna do it.. too much headache for no real purpose Feb 15 05:41:47 is the n810 stylus the same as the n800 stylus? Feb 15 05:42:57 no Feb 15 05:43:24 k Feb 15 05:49:27 I would seriously like a thicker stylus but N810 is still usable Feb 15 06:06:12 It beats the DS stylus, I would think. Feb 15 06:06:43 You wouldn't know. Feb 15 06:06:49 You're not part of the club Feb 15 06:06:55 * GeneralAntilles ostracizes Navi. Feb 15 06:07:07 The DS stylus cramps my finger. My little brother, being the creative scamp he is, made a pen stylus Feb 15 06:07:16 s/finger./fingers./ Feb 15 06:07:16 Navi meant: The DS stylus cramps my fingers. My little brother, being the creative scamp he is, made a pen stylus Feb 15 06:07:47 Don't ostracize me. I want to be in the cool club! Feb 15 06:08:07 the cool club is full of losers Feb 15 06:08:11 one person cannot do taht, Navi Feb 15 06:08:22 it is a matter of comunity behaveour Feb 15 06:08:23 losers!!!! Feb 15 06:08:43 that'll show them Feb 15 06:09:38 folks, what is the mp3 player you concider the best, having connection to linux/bsd box in mind? Feb 15 06:09:51 mpd Feb 15 06:11:42 best mp3 player for tablet? or desktop Linux? Feb 15 06:11:51 device, johnx Feb 15 06:11:58 like ipod or alike Feb 15 06:12:07 mpd for either Feb 15 06:12:17 Canola2 looks nice though Feb 15 06:12:21 Device, Navi. Feb 15 06:12:24 N800? :P Feb 15 06:12:36 Device? My phone. Feb 15 06:12:42 ipod nano is about $200! Feb 15 06:12:50 zoran, I use an N800 for mp3s :) Feb 15 06:12:54 Navi, may I get your phone, please? Feb 15 06:12:58 No. Feb 15 06:13:00 n800 was at $179 a few days ago :/ Feb 15 06:13:02 two SD card slots, can sync via rsync Feb 15 06:13:03 it sold out QUICK Feb 15 06:13:12 * GeneralAntilles got in on that sale. Feb 15 06:13:16 oh? :P Feb 15 06:13:23 my 770 is too big to walk with me all day Feb 15 06:13:27 you bought another? Feb 15 06:13:32 need bigger pockets :) Feb 15 06:13:51 Might gift it to my sister. Feb 15 06:13:56 ah :P Feb 15 06:13:57 neat Feb 15 06:14:03 Or it might just stay here. Feb 15 06:14:05 Haven't decided. Feb 15 06:14:07 :P Feb 15 06:14:26 dudes in buses have some strange white apples, looking realy fine Feb 15 06:14:50 maybe Fuji apples... Feb 15 06:14:51 copying files to it could be a headache Feb 15 06:15:12 or greenapples :) Feb 15 06:15:22 The Clix would be my second choice of device Feb 15 06:16:58 hm, those sensa models look all the same; cannot find the diffs Feb 15 06:17:17 it's pretty hard for an mp3 player to be *different* these days Feb 15 06:17:24 yeah Feb 15 06:17:37 I have fine cd player and like it much Feb 15 06:17:37 some flash, a codec, a small screen, a crappy plastic case, and the big difference is marketing Feb 15 06:18:10 connecting to bsd box is my problem Feb 15 06:18:14 ho Feb 15 06:18:18 big room Feb 15 06:18:24 ti should be seen as usb device Feb 15 06:19:35 some sandisk ones do that, and even some sony stuff does now... Feb 15 06:19:40 hi VonGuard :) Feb 15 06:19:54 jonhx, yeah, you could be write Feb 15 06:20:06 oh, right! Feb 15 06:20:07 hi johnx Feb 15 06:22:34 you all worried about the Troll Tech purchase? Feb 15 06:22:49 worried? not really Feb 15 06:23:00 definitely interested to see where it takes things Feb 15 06:23:06 trolls should worry Feb 15 06:23:57 hehe Feb 15 06:24:09 might mean some shakeup for symbian, but I think on maemo the most we'll see is that addition of Qt as a development option Feb 15 06:24:13 and nokia if openmoko comes to public in neat way Feb 15 06:24:40 http://blog.gism.net/2008/01/28/nokia-trolltech-tablet-redux/ Feb 15 06:24:47 really, the more toolkit the support, the better in my book Feb 15 06:25:03 I'll be most interested in where it leaves motorola... Feb 15 06:25:08 and their linux phones Feb 15 06:25:27 yeah Feb 15 06:25:44 they'll all be in a good position when google and android make all this shit irrelevent Feb 15 06:26:00 yeah...unless they drop out of the handset business Feb 15 06:26:12 does moto have an android phone in the pipeline? Feb 15 06:26:45 dunno Feb 15 06:26:46 handset looks like next all round device for everyone Feb 15 06:26:48 i bet the support tyhe standard Feb 15 06:26:54 yep Feb 15 06:27:13 zoran, definitely. that's why google is smart to aim their requirements low :) Feb 15 06:27:16 why do so many people assume google will be successful with android? Feb 15 06:27:28 fic has some new phone, freerunner Feb 15 06:27:36 because of low system requirements, smart phone functionality and lots of support Feb 15 06:28:09 as long as google doesn't completely screw it up, I think they'll be successful in the long run Feb 15 06:28:14 fic has gps to have tips, when you come near shop, post office etc Feb 15 06:28:45 I'll reserver judgement on openmoko until I see the released version Feb 15 06:29:02 really changes the way peole use it Feb 15 06:29:15 johnx, correct Feb 15 06:29:30 it lasts too long to see it as a product Feb 15 06:33:43 http://lostworlds.lv/go.php?1139637493 Feb 15 06:34:34 puika, is this related to maemo? Feb 15 06:36:10 no Feb 15 06:40:24 hm, what a mess about free music downloadable over the net! Feb 15 06:41:16 zoran, hmm? you mean p2p? Feb 15 06:41:21 slashdot pointed to some not really fnctional sites Feb 15 06:41:23 yeah Feb 15 06:41:34 not my kind of protocol Feb 15 06:41:56 and some software should be installed Feb 15 06:42:53 musicians and bands get a money from concerts this days, not cd-s Feb 15 06:43:17 that could be a way to open all songs for download free Feb 15 06:43:24 Just like it used to be. Feb 15 06:43:29 yeah Feb 15 06:43:36 liek in old greek times Feb 15 06:43:47 No, like, 100 years ago. Feb 15 06:44:10 yes, jazz bands play for free on the radio Feb 15 06:44:24 and you go to the dancing room for a fun Feb 15 06:44:34 thankfully at least amazon seems to have rallied some support for "no DRM" music downloads Feb 15 06:44:37 thar's a man at the radio station'll pay you to sing into a can Feb 15 06:45:07 Radio and jazz wasn't 1908 Feb 15 06:45:09 when I found it possible to be true, I started looking for decent mp3 player Feb 15 06:45:11 GeneralAntilles: damn, I've been defeated again... >_> it's not looking good for LCARS icons till MAYBE tomorrow afternoon <_< Feb 15 06:45:26 * GeneralAntilles sets more traps for rm_you. Feb 15 06:45:30 GeneralAntilles: women are troublesome >_> Feb 15 06:45:44 But the troubles come with benefits. Feb 15 06:46:40 * GeneralAntilles turns Nickel_ into a frog. Feb 15 06:46:49 * rm_you sleeps Feb 15 06:47:00 'night rm_you Feb 15 06:47:08 night john Feb 15 06:47:20 remind me to fill you in later :P Feb 15 06:47:58 ok :) Feb 15 06:48:54 aha i can echo 4 > /proc/cpu/alignment manually right when i get to the error i care about... Feb 15 06:50:42 on one mailing list I found thta ipod nano was seen as umass device! Feb 15 06:51:02 freebsd from january Feb 15 06:51:34 it is Feb 15 06:51:49 but you can't copy music to it and have the ipod nano detect and play it Feb 15 06:51:57 msdosfs? Feb 15 06:52:25 some kind of registration? Feb 15 06:53:01 it uses an internal database and needs a program to write that correctly when adding music Feb 15 06:53:14 there's a gtk program that does this, but it never worked for me Feb 15 06:53:30 just don't buy an ipod Feb 15 06:53:45 it is damn expensive, I won't Feb 15 06:54:02 sandisk looks fine, sensa one Feb 15 06:54:09 on the net, I mean Feb 15 06:55:06 my wife has an e260 (I think that one). the ui is ok, nothing special Feb 15 06:55:19 usb as umass? Feb 15 06:55:33 yeah, you can switch modes Feb 15 06:55:40 and decent sound? Feb 15 06:56:04 I'm not really an audiophile and I don't have good headphones Feb 15 06:56:15 plus, I don't use it much. she keeps it in her purse :) Feb 15 06:56:20 lp's were the best Feb 15 06:56:39 nto so easy to take with you away of home Feb 15 06:56:43 * johnx is perfectly happy with mp3s over bluetooth headphones Feb 15 06:56:59 k, I will change myself Feb 15 06:57:18 I just don't know the topic Feb 15 06:57:31 ah...the video support on it is *awful* Feb 15 06:57:32 really bad Feb 15 06:57:41 not my point of interest Feb 15 06:57:47 just, pretend that's not even on the feature list Feb 15 06:57:47 just music Feb 15 06:57:58 just like the N800 camera :) Feb 15 06:58:05 lol Feb 15 06:58:10 two fails? Feb 15 06:59:01 The video support is just there because it was convienant Feb 15 06:59:24 it uses some weird encoding of mjpeg Feb 15 06:59:25 never used pc for that Feb 15 06:59:28 with like mono sound Feb 15 06:59:32 I'm not even kidding Feb 15 07:00:05 like, you'd be better humming to yourself while watching a flipbook... Feb 15 07:00:09 if that sansa could send 128/256 k... Feb 15 07:00:12 The chipset they used supported it, so they stuck it in. Feb 15 07:00:24 It's not even worth bothering Feb 15 07:00:25 Navi, they don't *use* the chipset for video Feb 15 07:00:31 Really? Feb 15 07:00:40 the chip supports mp4 and they do mjpeg on the cpu Feb 15 07:00:46 I think the Pandora might be better at it when it comes out if your looking for that kind of functionaliy Feb 15 07:00:51 That's laughable. Feb 15 07:01:06 Pandora over the N800 :D Feb 15 07:01:14 at least for video Feb 15 07:01:18 walking the street watching the movie Feb 15 07:01:20 that OMAP looks better for video Feb 15 07:01:37 well in general for media like that and if your into the whole emulation thing Feb 15 07:01:55 you could go with a PSP if you're into video Feb 15 07:02:12 ah, the N800 is fine for video for my needs Feb 15 07:02:14 that too Feb 15 07:02:16 lol Feb 15 07:02:23 the sansa e2x0 is a joke though Feb 15 07:02:37 as far as videos are concerned, they are. Feb 15 07:02:40 johnx, I'd use it just for mp3 Feb 15 07:02:52 zoran, yeah, sorry, it's fine for music Feb 15 07:02:54 I haven't had too many problems with video, unless your talking about flash video from other sites, that's a horror show Feb 15 07:02:57 seems to last forever on a charge too Feb 15 07:03:00 unless they finish loading x.x Feb 15 07:03:13 yah music is great Feb 15 07:03:29 we're talking about the e2x0 Feb 15 07:03:34 Sansa Feb 15 07:03:39 oh Feb 15 07:03:43 not the N800 Feb 15 07:03:55 They came out with that new sansa Feb 15 07:04:09 ah, I own a sansa never used the video on it XD Feb 15 07:04:13 I forget what they called it, not the crappy rhapsady one Feb 15 07:04:21 oh Feb 15 07:04:29 yah I ended up giving my to a family member to use Feb 15 07:04:32 after I got the N800 Feb 15 07:04:36 the wheel felt a bit better than the e2x0s Feb 15 07:04:47 but it didn't light up Feb 15 07:05:25 also, the e2x0 was charge from usb only Feb 15 07:05:31 http://lostworlds.lv/go.php?1139637493 Feb 15 07:05:42 I recall salesman talking about win program, needed for sansa to work Feb 15 07:05:54 not what i found on the net Feb 15 07:07:07 I wanted the Zen Vision for a while Feb 15 07:07:14 not the crappy, ugly W Feb 15 07:07:16 salesmen lie Feb 15 07:07:34 the nokia tablet sized one Feb 15 07:07:53 single-purpose devices have never really interested me Feb 15 07:08:00 oh hei, the refined the look of the vision W Feb 15 07:08:07 I like single purpose devices :0 Feb 15 07:08:11 Ain't so bad anymore Feb 15 07:08:14 tooth brush Feb 15 07:08:25 hair comb Feb 15 07:08:25 Toothbrush/toilet scrubber Feb 15 07:08:46 hair comb/fur groomer Feb 15 07:08:46 yeah, multi purpose brush Feb 15 07:08:47 I guess I should say, I'm don't find single purpose devices *exciting* Feb 15 07:08:58 Jack of all trades... Feb 15 07:09:04 master of some Feb 15 07:09:12 slave to none Feb 15 07:09:19 Of course, I'm not an audiophile, I'm not picky on video as long as it doesn't suck balls Feb 15 07:09:32 I'm picky on audio Feb 15 07:09:34 but does others adequetely thus requiring me to carry/charge fewer devices... Feb 15 07:09:44 do not care about video at all Feb 15 07:09:53 semi-picky on video Feb 15 07:09:57 I like my websurfing not on tiny windows Feb 15 07:10:05 s/windows/screens Feb 15 07:10:31 hm, 1024x768 is something I would just like for graphical net Feb 15 07:10:35 * johnx will websurf on whatever's at hand... Feb 15 07:10:47 console is fine on whatever Feb 15 07:11:16 I'm known to ssh with my e70 Feb 15 07:11:31 770 is fine too for that Feb 15 07:11:33 that tiny screen makes your eyes tired Feb 15 07:11:50 anticipation is the king Feb 15 07:11:56 zaurus 5500 was actually a pretty good portable ssh term Feb 15 07:12:08 I really want to try paintnet Feb 15 07:12:25 770 is fine for ssh, except for sylusing Feb 15 07:12:33 *stylusing Feb 15 07:12:50 so, n810 _must_ be better for that Feb 15 07:13:01 Navi, paint.net? Feb 15 07:13:59 sansa seems to has some preconfigured directories, audible, config, one dnc... Feb 15 07:15:03 some of them have card slot to extend memory Feb 15 07:15:07 s/paintnet/mypaint Feb 15 07:15:54 ttp://www.internettablettalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=16079 Feb 15 07:18:46 hm, copying files seems enough, but sansa obviously makes some hash to use id3 tags Feb 15 07:19:46 I'm not sure what playlists are, but they should not be copied Feb 15 07:20:18 mypaint looks sexy Feb 15 07:20:21 anyways, I'm off to bed Feb 15 07:20:25 g'night Feb 15 07:21:02 navy should never sleep Feb 15 07:21:39 btw, dit to copy files is something like " ./MUSIC " Feb 15 07:31:53 achchha... constant underruns Feb 15 07:33:58 jku: www.citeulike.org/user/cvm is a good start - especially the taxonomy paper Feb 15 07:35:27 jku: and after march we'll have one out that covers the issue of different radios causing fingerprint methods to perform worse Feb 15 07:36:41 Stskeeps, thanks Feb 15 07:42:34 -Wcast-align Feb 15 07:50:48 pupnik_: thanks for that (it not being the same) Feb 15 07:51:29 http://lostworlds.lv/go.php?1139637493 Feb 15 07:52:34 spam ^ Feb 15 07:55:02 Hi I am new in Maemo development and trying to build a security application in Maemo Chinook .. Feb 15 07:55:02 May I ask why Chinook do not come with osso-gnupg anymore? Basically I would need to access Feb 15 07:55:02 the keyring and I would be using openssl too. Feb 15 07:56:59 icepolarpolar: i see osso-gnupg in my repositories Feb 15 07:57:02 http://gronmayer.com/it/index.php?lang=en&system=maemo4 Feb 15 08:05:24 pupnik: thanks .. in this page it says osso-gnupg has been removed from chinook Feb 15 08:05:28 http://tablets-dev.nokia.com/unstable/4.0beta/content-comparison-3.2-to-4.0beta.html Feb 15 08:06:31 hope to know the reason and would there is some new replacement for that package Feb 15 08:07:23 by the way, i am referring to my scratchbox Feb 15 08:10:08 icepolarpolar, you're looking at the page for beta Feb 15 08:10:38 icepolarpolar, http://tablets-dev.nokia.com/4.0/4.0b_vs_4.0_content_comparison.html says osso-gnupg source should be available Feb 15 08:11:27 not seeing the actual package though Feb 15 08:11:46 * leif__ just checked Feb 15 08:12:02 yeah, source is available Feb 15 08:12:22 osso-gnupg is 1.4.2-7 on the device and in the maemo4.0 source repo, but no binary package is available Feb 15 08:14:09 thanks ppl .. so i can expect osso-gnupg to be continue to be available in the tablets right? Feb 15 08:14:27 and I should compile the source for scratchbox development Feb 15 08:16:02 would there be any replacement package for osso-gnupg in the short future? Feb 15 08:18:25 icepolarpolar, N doesn't talk about the future much, but I'd guess you can rely on on gpg to be there... Feb 15 08:18:42 certainly for OS2008 lifetime Feb 15 08:19:35 ok thanks a lot ppl :) Feb 15 08:20:07 I agree with jku. It definitely looks like a lot of important stuff depends on it Feb 15 08:29:03 morning Feb 15 08:29:13 'mornin' Feb 15 08:31:09 paivaa Feb 15 08:37:17 anybody feel like fixing up sound code for an emulator? :) Feb 15 08:37:29 morning Feb 15 08:38:35 moohoo Feb 15 08:40:54 Morning, all Feb 15 08:46:38 offtopic, does anyone know how grub see optic drives like /dev/hdc ? Feb 15 08:48:40 hahlo, I don't think it *does* see them Feb 15 08:48:55 were you looking to add a 'boot to cd' entry to your grub boot screen? Feb 15 08:49:52 johnx: no i have problem to find /dev/hda in grub Feb 15 08:50:28 ah Feb 15 08:50:40 johnx: /dev/sda is hd0 Feb 15 08:51:16 and /dev/hda doesn't get an (hdx) listing in grub? Feb 15 08:51:37 johnx: grub tends to use hd(0,0) syntax Feb 15 08:51:52 oops, forgot the syntax... Feb 15 08:52:04 but it doesn't get a grub-style entry in grub? Feb 15 08:52:24 You should be able to tab-complete and see what grub can see Feb 15 08:52:33 also, grub syntax is (hd0,1). we were both wrong... Feb 15 08:52:38 how i ask grub to list all devices? Feb 15 08:53:28 johnx: I thought it might be - I can never rememeber ;-) Feb 15 08:53:37 got two ata disks and 8 sata-disks Feb 15 08:53:51 O_o Feb 15 08:55:48 hahlo, type: Feb 15 08:55:53 find (hd Feb 15 08:55:55 then hit tab Feb 15 08:55:57 hi Feb 15 08:56:13 hi Feb 15 08:56:40 johnx: ok thanks Feb 15 08:56:42 Hi Feb 15 08:57:35 i want to kill whoever put that sticker there on the igo kb -.- Feb 15 08:59:42 Binary + Sources of a very fast Apple ][ emulator now online. Consumes very little CPU, works like a charm except for sound buffer issues (fixable). http://pupnik.de/maemoapple.tgz Based off linapple / applewin sources. Feb 15 09:00:11 You should start making debs Feb 15 09:02:08 So... you fix the sound and I'll make the deb? Feb 15 09:02:22 Nah ;) Feb 15 09:03:34 You might enjoy seeing this one run... while playing Karateka it was only using 5-10% cpu... Feb 15 09:03:48 that's pretty cool Feb 15 09:26:24 <_collin_> hi Feb 15 09:55:10 bon dia / good morning **** BEGIN LOGGING AT Fri Feb 15 09:58:04 2008 Feb 15 10:10:07 ~seen jott Feb 15 10:10:09 jott was last seen on IRC in channel #maemo, 8h 20m 41s ago, saying: 'yes.. the white line is still there (on the first slide and on the 3rd/digital clock slide)'. Feb 15 10:50:15 is it possible to restart X11 on os2008 without restarting whole device? Feb 15 10:50:49 If you killed the watchdog, probably. Feb 15 10:56:16 I think shutting down any UI bits first and then X through the /etc/osso-af-init and /etc/init.d scripts should work Feb 15 10:56:24 Even with the watchdog Feb 15 10:56:40 But I haven't actually tested it that far so YMMV Feb 15 11:02:59 Anyone in the UK on here? Feb 15 11:03:09 Best place to buy microSD for the n810? Feb 15 11:04:09 microsd? not minisd? Feb 15 11:04:27 but right - microsd are more popular Feb 15 11:04:34 w/ adapter ;) Feb 15 11:04:53 ~curse nokia for keyboard handling Feb 15 11:04:54 May the fleas of a thousand camels infest your most sensitive regions, nokia for keyboard handling ! Feb 15 11:04:59 usual curse ;D Feb 15 11:06:36 I think it only takes microsd Feb 15 11:06:56 lardman: I got mine from mobymemory.com IIRC Feb 15 11:06:59 I tried to fit a mini mmc yesterday and it wouldn't go in Feb 15 11:07:12 Jaffa: yeah, I'm looking at that now; need it tomorrow though Feb 15 11:07:22 need to check if they do next day Feb 15 11:07:24 lardman: yeah, jut checked: mobymemory.co.uk Feb 15 11:10:47 hmm, doesn't look like that does Saturday delivery Feb 15 11:16:47 it's really annoying that packages get updated, but -dev packages are still of the old version Feb 15 11:29:16 tony2001: I would say 'welcome in maemo world' but today is Friday so I will not be so cruel Feb 15 11:30:18 s/in/to/ :P Feb 15 11:35:54 good morning Feb 15 11:38:22 keesj: nice that your lightning talk got it! Feb 15 11:38:26 looking forward to it Feb 15 11:38:36 in! Feb 15 11:50:11 guys: can maemomapper autosave tracks? Feb 15 11:52:41 between sessions, yes Feb 15 11:53:59 how to set it to do it? Feb 15 12:27:19 hrw, by default it does that i think Feb 15 12:53:50 hi all Feb 15 12:54:03 good morning smilingMan Feb 15 12:54:16 I want some advice from ppl which have a handheld for some time Feb 15 12:54:42 do you use the same google talk account on the pc and the handheld? Feb 15 12:55:30 do you have them both connected at the same time under the same account 24/7? Feb 15 12:56:10 need I apply a script to kill my IM client at the pc when I am connected via the handheld? Feb 15 12:56:14 I don't do much with gtalk on the device Feb 15 12:56:23 hrw: hi Feb 15 12:56:36 Tak: oh I see Feb 15 12:56:38 but I've had it logged in at several different PCs, and it seems to handle it ok Feb 15 12:56:39 smilingMan, they can be both on Feb 15 12:57:11 hi jku, would msgs be sent to the two devices ALWAYS? Feb 15 12:57:28 you can define different "profiles" (wait I'll dig the real name of that feature) Feb 15 12:57:52 when I leave the pc , I may leave the IM on, then when ppl see me on, they may msg me, while I am away Feb 15 12:58:05 iirc the first message is sent to all devices, and if you respond on one, the remainder of that conversation is directed to that one only Feb 15 12:59:05 smilingMan, Resources. So your tablet might have resource "mobile" and your desktop resource "home" Feb 15 12:59:05 now, If I use a second account, when it comes on , ppl may now I am not avail on my previous account Feb 15 12:59:20 I do not use google talk at all Feb 15 12:59:30 I use normal jabber ;D Feb 15 12:59:32 hrw it's just xmpp Feb 15 12:59:42 jku: I know Feb 15 12:59:57 hi hrw, fine, what do you use to have both clients on? Feb 15 13:00:10 smilingMan: different resources Feb 15 13:00:15 where can I define these resources? in the client? Feb 15 13:00:49 pls tell me where to define the "resource" in the handheld Feb 15 13:01:25 smilingMan, unorftunately xmpp resource prioirities are not widely usedin clients so messages sometimes end up in wrong places... Feb 15 13:01:36 smilingMan, see the advanced settings in IM client Feb 15 13:01:39 crap - "grep: /usr/lib/libXext.la: No such file or directory" Feb 15 13:02:09 * Tak not sure whether to hate libtool or maemo Feb 15 13:02:42 smilingMan, remember to set "away when idle" that helps to get messages to (mostly) the right place Feb 15 13:03:02 oh I do have "resource" in my kopete Feb 15 13:03:45 ok, so my freinds - use he same handle - but the clients figures what resource to use? Feb 15 13:05:10 smilingMan, if message is sent without specified resource (the normal situation) the server decides which resources it will send the message Feb 15 13:05:46 it should do it based on resource priorities, but like I said client support is not too good Feb 15 13:05:51 can I name the resource in my maemo client? Feb 15 13:06:25 smilingMan, yeah in some advanced account settings Feb 15 13:07:16 no priority setting Feb 15 13:08:22 fine thanks Feb 15 13:44:50 hello Feb 15 13:45:27 What to read to get a quick intro to programming in maemo? Maemo-specific, I mean. Feb 15 13:46:31 Tobotras: http://maemo.org/development/documentation/Quick%20Start%20Guide/ Feb 15 13:46:44 jku: thanks Feb 15 13:46:53 that is linked on the main documentation pag, by the way Feb 15 13:47:00 page, even Feb 15 13:47:15 :) Feb 15 13:50:28 ./maemo_example: Segmentation fault Feb 15 13:50:30 * Tak cries Feb 15 14:01:04 there is no plain, "continuous" slider in hildon? the gtkhscale looks alienated and the hildoncontrolbar is ridiculously slow with increasing range... Feb 15 14:02:12 continuous? Feb 15 14:02:34 the hildoncontrolbar uses this "discrete" blocks Feb 15 14:02:37 what about HildonSeekbar ‽ Feb 15 14:03:43 that looks wrong.. as i have to set the fraction to maximum and then it's all "blue" Feb 15 14:03:56 (as position <= fraction) Feb 15 14:04:34 the only thing that looks quite good is the volume slider but that has the mute toggle.. Feb 15 14:04:42 * Tak shrugs Feb 15 14:04:45 jott: presumably you want something like the volu... yeah Feb 15 14:04:53 custom widget? ;-) Feb 15 14:05:04 i suppose.. man gtk sucks :P Feb 15 14:05:10 no, gtk is awesome Feb 15 14:05:16 no way ;) Feb 15 14:05:30 jott: check on maemo-developers Feb 15 14:05:32 blame hildon/maemo/nokia for making it look and act like crap on the device :-P Feb 15 14:05:47 In fact, rm_you's enhanced backlight control has one just like that (from the screenshots) Feb 15 14:06:21 it's the hildoncontrolbar and it's slow :/ Feb 15 14:31:22 hello Feb 15 14:56:58 * jackster is gassuming over this lcars padd theme Feb 15 14:57:13 Ha Feb 15 14:58:35 where do i uncheck make accidental doubleclicks? Feb 15 15:05:23 jott: hi Feb 15 15:05:46 hrw: hello Feb 15 15:05:47 jott: do you have working ISO_Level5_Shift keymap? Feb 15 15:06:01 yes, i suppose Feb 15 15:06:16 jott: I tried to make ISO_Level5_Shift but it then works like there is no key (added it as modifier) Feb 15 15:07:06 for some reason you also need to define "modifier_map Mod3 { ISO_Level5_Shift };" Feb 15 15:07:12 to make the key work.. Feb 15 15:07:15 jott: http://pastebin.ca/905065 Feb 15 15:07:55 hm Feb 15 15:08:27 and Chr does not activate Level5 for you? Feb 15 15:08:47 (for the EIGHT_LEVELs) Feb 15 15:08:53 not at all Feb 15 15:09:01 xev recognize it as Meta_R Feb 15 15:09:43 fwiw i defined the key and modifier_map in "base".. don't know if this changes anything Feb 15 15:10:50 xev shows state 0x20, keycode 135 (keysym 0xfe11, ISO_Level5_Shift), same_screen YES,... Feb 15 15:11:29 what would the next version of n series look like Feb 15 15:11:50 jott: I want to not touch original keymaps Feb 15 15:12:04 i see.. but still might be worth a try to narrow it down Feb 15 15:12:05 jott: it has to be normal package not hack ;) Feb 15 15:13:07 yep Feb 15 15:13:34 leo2007``: will have foldable 1680x1050 7" screen, dual ARM Cortex and 4D acceleration Feb 15 15:13:54 and it can make coffee Feb 15 15:13:58 sexy Feb 15 15:14:13 wimax, wimin, wifi, redtooth, bluetooth and 24 days on one charge Feb 15 15:14:33 oh and it will be based on windows mobile 7 :P Feb 15 15:14:56 jott: no - linux + qt (now when nokia owns trolltech)... Feb 15 15:15:13 hehe i would be fine with that ;) Feb 15 15:15:22 Pfft, my device has all that and it's based on Windows Mobile Vista, which makes it better. Feb 15 15:16:27 with patch for mind supression? Feb 15 15:17:20 yes Feb 15 15:17:39 zoran, I believe distributing a reality distortion field with home electronics is patented, but maybe this is different... Feb 15 15:18:11 this sp11143 will erase all same minds and set defaults Feb 15 15:18:17 *sane Feb 15 15:21:01 hrw: mh i moved the definition and mapping up to my local keymap and it still works.. Feb 15 15:21:17 * jott rereads the hrws pastebin Feb 15 15:23:24 you are aware that the order is: "None, Shift, LevelThree, Shift+LevelThree, LevelFive, Shift+LevelFive, LevelThree+LevelFive, Shift+LevelThree+LevelFive" Feb 15 15:23:29 ?! Feb 15 15:23:35 yes Feb 15 15:24:54 jott: I will do more testing during weekend - now I have to go Feb 15 15:24:56 hmm i c&p'd your stuff Feb 15 15:25:06 ~ $ setxkbmap -symbols "nokia_vndr/rx-44(pl)" Feb 15 15:25:07 Error loading new keyboard description Feb 15 15:25:12 hmm Feb 15 15:25:18 will test later Feb 15 15:25:19 bye Feb 15 15:25:21 bye Feb 15 15:26:36 this setxkbmap could be more verbose :/ Feb 15 15:26:47 increases -v Feb 15 15:38:29 hrw|gone: ok found your error - AC01 misses a comma between "exclam exclam" Feb 15 15:51:58 here is a nice puzzle for jott? :/ :) Apple ][ emulator - almost working great http://www.internettablettalk.com/forums/showthread.php?p=142736#post142736 Feb 15 15:52:26 :) Feb 15 15:52:44 hello :) Feb 15 15:53:40 hi Feb 15 15:54:40 how ya doing pupnik? Feb 15 15:55:38 * pupnik checks mood ring Feb 15 15:56:32 kernel mode reading? Feb 15 15:58:42 podnering why openal is not working Feb 15 16:05:43 cool Feb 15 16:20:09 bye all, see you in 3 weeks Feb 15 16:23:37 hey my email is sitting there trying to send and wont time out i tried to find the process to kill with ps but dont know which process to kill Feb 15 16:24:03 dang it nm didn't mean to send that i found it Feb 15 16:39:10 BReady6433: osso-email if it's the built-in client Feb 15 16:42:12 anyone else experienced a problem with itos2008's mail program and gmail imap? Feb 15 16:42:43 jackster: no-one uses the built-in mail program as it's a pile of crap, and has been since OS2005. Feb 15 16:42:43 i click on an email and it just sticks saying 'retrieving' Feb 15 16:43:14 <||cw> Jaffa: don't hold back, tell us how you really feel :D Feb 15 16:43:19 ah, well that's good to know, any alternatives? Feb 15 16:43:37 jackster: http://modest.garage.maemo.org Feb 15 16:43:50 thanks Feb 15 16:44:01 ||cw: the fact it's still there, and modest is still beta - after 3 years - pisses me off when I think about it Feb 15 16:45:03 <||cw> claws any good? Feb 15 16:45:34 Not a good mobile UI, IMHO Feb 15 16:46:00 <||cw> still using 06 on a 770, looks like modest is no option for me :/ Feb 15 16:46:16 doh Feb 15 16:46:23 There's a 2008 HE now, I read. Feb 15 16:46:36 moo?! Feb 15 16:46:56 <||cw> unstable it says, and not likely to become stable from the sound of it Feb 15 16:47:10 They've said that about every HE, AIUI? Feb 15 16:47:58 Ah, but it does sound very broken. Feb 15 16:48:01 Jaffa: where did you read this? Feb 15 16:48:14 first reports claim it works pretty well Feb 15 16:48:18 well it was my fault because gmail uses ssl.. but it should have timed out or something! Feb 15 16:48:19 http://maemo.org/news/announcements/view/internet_tablet_hacker_edition_pushed_at_chinook_level.html Feb 15 16:48:22 ^Tak Feb 15 16:48:28 killer, thanks Feb 15 16:49:04 "Hardware limitations are clear in certain circumstances, extra swap memory is required to get a decent performance, the device reboots from time to time..." Feb 15 16:49:19 that was already true of 2007HE and 2006 Feb 15 16:49:28 :) Feb 15 16:49:29 X-Fade: fancy making http://maemo.org/news/announcements/rss.xml syndicated on p.m.o? Feb 15 16:54:40 Tak did you see this? http://www.internettablettalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=16662 Feb 15 16:55:31 pupnik: very cool Feb 15 16:57:47 any one know if 2008os make finger scrolling a little easier on apps like the web browser? Feb 15 16:58:07 Compared to what? Feb 15 16:58:56 i just noticed that the reason why scrolling is so hard on opera is because i am not using the stylus.. heh Feb 15 16:59:16 compared to os2007 Feb 15 17:01:17 Well at some point it was ok. Then they made it "easier" to select text and scrolling became very error prone (ie. half of the time you end up selecting text). I'm not sure if it was the 2007->2008 transfer or what. Though I guess it was beta versus final 2008, since it was microb in both cases... Feb 15 17:02:04 But I think some of the problem is just that the touchscreen is a bit flakey Feb 15 17:02:40 * Jaffa is still looking for his perfect device :-/ Feb 15 17:03:34 N810 is closest, but if only it had the polish and attention to detail of an iPhone. You'll just not get that from a big diverse company like Nokia, though Feb 15 17:04:20 okay what you mean by error prone would it crash the app? or you mean text would be selected instead of a link ? Feb 15 17:04:55 Text selected instead of scrolling. Touching links is near-impossible even with the stulys ;) Feb 15 17:05:16 I manage with my thumbs somehow Feb 15 17:05:35 but it does appear that microb in os2008 is buggy and often selects text instead of scrolling Feb 15 17:05:52 or sometimes it's just too slow to start scrolling Feb 15 17:06:01 if the n800 had open authentication with wep and a hair smaller size it would be perfect to me.. Feb 15 17:06:32 karateka is so awesome :) Feb 15 17:07:04 I poke at the link. It gets a mouseover hilight. I poke it again, it gets the blue focus rectangle. I poke third time, almost ramming the stylys through the screen and *then* microb goes "oh, you meant _activate_ the link..." Feb 15 17:07:48 if it gets focus, just push the enter button ;-) Feb 15 17:08:01 right, that's what I do ;) Feb 15 17:08:04 hah yeah i have to click the link a hundred times to get it to work Feb 15 17:08:29 Tak: I already poked it twice by then, you'd think once would suffice :) Feb 15 17:08:33 strange random bug: once I managet to get a popup menu on a link, and it had "open link" but not "open link in new window" Feb 15 17:08:39 usually I find both items in the menu Feb 15 17:09:01 if I knew how to reproduce, I'd create a bug report Feb 15 17:09:59 mgedmin: It depends on the link type, IIRC if it opens in a new window by default (ie. has target=foo) the menu doesn't show the new window option... Feb 15 17:10:08 aha! Feb 15 17:10:10 darn Feb 15 17:10:20 a new window was exactly what I wanted :) Feb 15 17:11:16 Yeah, quite backwards isn't it :) Feb 15 17:12:05 The links that you are most likely to want in a new window are not showing the option... Feb 15 17:14:27 <_berto_> solmumaha: you there ? Feb 15 17:33:54 i managed to discover that doubling the amount written by Speaker.cpp elinimates the frequent underruns Feb 15 17:34:00 but this is not the correct solution Feb 15 17:36:24 no amount of buffering will suffice if the fill rate is consistently less than the play rate Feb 15 17:36:42 That's not true. Feb 15 17:36:48 100% buffering will suffice. Feb 15 17:37:22 that's true; however our devices don't have enough ram to 100% buffer an infinite stream Feb 15 17:37:30 Curses! Feb 15 17:37:42 maybe the n900 ;-) Feb 15 17:40:13 By the time I find a job and get an n800, the n900 will be out :( Feb 15 17:40:27 * Navi goes back to reading the classifieds Feb 15 17:44:18 Tak it's a programmatic problem - the engine has self-adjusting bufferfilling code, which i haven't grokked yet Feb 15 17:44:25 the emu is idling most of the time Feb 15 17:46:35 karateka has a beautiful phased/chorused pulse-wave monophonic software synth... such a shame to hear it go blrubrbuphthlbp Feb 15 18:07:30 Can someone answer a quick question about the N800's capabilities? I bought a 770 and found there's a couple of things it can't do that I need. Feb 15 18:07:40 e.g.? Feb 15 18:08:21 Mount Windows shares and play MP3 audio and Divx/xvid video from them, and PPTP VPN tunnelling. Feb 15 18:10:26 can someone advise/help linking to hardware floating point libm Feb 15 18:12:22 gosh... this lenovo X300 is lovely Feb 15 18:12:48 pope523: what's the question? Feb 15 18:13:20 fwiw I'm sure it's possible to find 3rd party software that lets you mount windows shares and do pptp Feb 15 18:13:25 but it won't be easy, I expect Feb 15 18:13:34 a n800 with os2008 can mount windows shares out of the box Feb 15 18:13:40 I haven't noticed any pptp Feb 15 18:13:41 pope523: OS 2008 allows mounting Window shares and accessing any file on them. DivX/Xvid playback has improved slightly, and mplayer keeps getting better but most video files probably best being transcoded Feb 15 18:13:45 video is still problematic Feb 15 18:14:02 PPTP VPN tunnelling is apparently possible (needs a new kernel) and although it'd be handy for me, I haven't tried Feb 15 18:14:46 Ok, thanks Feb 15 18:16:10 Didn't fanoush compile a kernel to support PPTP? Feb 15 18:18:40 i keep on getting errors for libc6. i look in app manager and find no libc6 to dl. which repo would that be in? Feb 15 18:19:08 when i install diff apps i get that is Feb 15 18:19:54 checked in red pill mode? Feb 15 18:21:11 GeneralAntilles: indeed Feb 15 18:27:06 no.. still missing lbc6. thanks fpr the idea though Feb 15 18:28:31 would it be inside a ;ib package found in app manager? Feb 15 18:41:36 so i did an apt-get install libc6. it says i already have it! Feb 15 18:43:03 i enter matrix in website form in new app catalogue, hit cancel and select red pill. thats all i have to do for red pill mode, correct? Feb 15 18:43:11 BReady6433, what exactly is the erro you get? Feb 15 18:45:18 BReady6433, it's really not possible to not have libc6 so that's not your problem Feb 15 18:45:51 i must be doing redpill qrong.. Feb 15 18:56:44 is there a way to check the version of libc6? Feb 15 18:58:43 sorry jku Feb 15 18:59:29 BReady6433, "apt-cache policy libc6" Feb 15 18:59:41 but like I said that's not your problem Feb 15 19:00:03 not unless you've used considerable violence... Feb 15 19:00:30 lol ol Feb 15 19:00:35 ok Feb 15 19:03:10 so what was the original error message, and what were you doing? Feb 15 19:03:33 ok Feb 15 19:06:18 i was trying to install the dtris .deb abd once i click install in app manager it tells me it couldnt install because some packages required are missing. Feb 15 19:07:15 i checked details and it is the libc6 >= 2.5.0.1 Feb 15 19:07:52 this is after i enabled redpill mode Feb 15 19:08:07 ithat is not compatible with any ITOS I believe Feb 15 19:08:46 the newest OS has 2.5.0-1osso7 and AFAIK that is a smaller version number than 2.5.0.1 Feb 15 19:09:04 dang hit wrong x Feb 15 19:13:15 xxxx Feb 15 19:13:35 yyyyyy Feb 15 19:13:42 zzzzzzzz Feb 15 19:14:05 BReady6433, if you're talking about ltris, then the dependency is to 2.5.0-1 which is fine on the newest OS Feb 15 19:14:18 BReady6433, which OS version are you running? Feb 15 19:14:49 2007 Feb 15 19:15:15 well there's your problem no doubt, older libc Feb 15 19:15:34 that is a way to have an older libc... Feb 15 19:16:01 oh! Feb 15 19:16:40 so maybe i should upgrade.. Feb 15 19:17:02 BReady6433, yeah, I don' Feb 15 19:17:21 I don't think much software will support 2007 in a while Feb 15 19:17:53 anyway OS2008 is pretty good Feb 15 19:18:57 ok.. is that what happened to 2006 and 2005 ? Feb 15 19:19:18 ok i think i qill do that tonight Feb 15 19:20:17 BReady6433, yeah, pretty much, 2006 is still the official OS for the 770 so that has some reason for existence, but OS2007... I think it will pretty much disappear Feb 15 19:21:35 alright cool. Feb 15 19:21:50 thanks for your help man Feb 15 19:35:02 hello Feb 15 20:00:12 hello Feb 15 20:00:28 what is the best package for getting root Feb 15 20:00:28 hello Feb 15 20:00:28 ? Feb 15 20:00:35 on os2008 Feb 15 20:01:59 what is the default root password on for os2008 Feb 15 20:02:10 can i ad my user to the wheel group? Feb 15 20:02:28 suseJ, I just install openssh and "ssh root@localhost" Feb 15 20:03:02 * jott uses easyroot Feb 15 20:03:09 softvfp uses hardfloat? Feb 15 20:03:50 sorry i think i get it Feb 15 20:04:24 the -mfpu=vfp says 'use hardfloat' and the -mfloat-abi=softfp means be comatible with the softfloat libraries linked-in Feb 15 20:05:47 what is the perfered ap for getting root on the os 2008? Feb 15 20:06:12 is there anyone working on a music sequencer? Feb 15 20:09:01 pupnik: yes, i think this is somehow correct (as in vfp instructions with compatible eabi) Feb 15 20:10:09 suseJ: well there is "gainroot", "easyroot" and openssh and then ssh locally... (i prefer easyroot YMMV) Feb 15 20:10:14 n800music: not really. i have found some that might be good candidates Feb 15 20:10:40 n800music: i have compiled schism tracker that works quite nice Feb 15 20:10:52 sweet! Feb 15 20:10:52 hydrogen works too, but is at the hardware limit Feb 15 20:11:17 ok Feb 15 20:11:20 sounds good Feb 15 20:11:24 easy root it is Feb 15 20:11:29 thanks for the advice Feb 15 20:11:38 how do i get that to work Feb 15 20:11:56 is it hard fir mediocre linuxer people Feb 15 20:12:14 err you know what i mean Feb 15 20:12:17 is there a working snes emulator for os2008? Feb 15 20:12:57 n800music: i've some packages for schismtracker.. hold on i can put them somewhere.. Feb 15 20:15:33 http://sse2.net/schism/ you have to install them with dpkg.. Feb 15 20:15:42 (red pill should work too) Feb 15 20:15:48 n800music: ^^ Feb 15 20:16:31 do you know schism tracker? Feb 15 20:16:59 no but i know trackers Feb 15 20:17:19 been using buzz since 98 Feb 15 20:17:20 ok.. it's an clone of the oldschool impulse tracker Feb 15 20:17:33 cool Feb 15 20:17:42 http://sovietrussia.org/wiki/Schism_Tracker Feb 15 20:17:48 for some infos :) Feb 15 20:18:08 sound quality is nice.. i played some xm and it files and they sound great imho ;) Feb 15 20:19:48 i assume you have os2008, but the packages *should* work on 07 as it's basically just SDL.. if there are missing dependency i can put them on the site too Feb 15 20:20:28 awesoome, lemme try it Feb 15 20:21:51 hi. got a strange problem with os 2006, python 2.4 and ukmp/uktube. ukmp does start and works well, uktube does not start and the main problem is that opera seems to be damage since installation as the url bar is hidden since then. Feb 15 20:21:57 suseJ: you can get about 12-18 fps with this one http://pupnik.de/snes9x.html Feb 15 20:22:56 jott: coool :) Feb 15 20:25:34 suseJ: but you have to fix the sound Feb 15 20:27:59 n800music: erm only problem might be input without a keyboard :( .. there is no vkb and i've a n810 so no need for a vkb :/ .. Feb 15 20:28:27 pupnik: a generic sdl vkb would be really great useful sometimes :) Feb 15 20:28:58 s/t u/t and u/ Feb 15 20:28:58 jott meant: pupnik: a generic sdl vkb would be really great and useful sometimes :) Feb 15 20:28:59 I started porting my ruby one to vala Feb 15 20:29:09 jott i would get a bluetooth kb just for this Feb 15 20:29:33 I'm currently blocking on laziness/a better xml lib binding Feb 15 20:29:49 nice Feb 15 20:29:50 i would recommend bluetooth keyboard unconditionally Feb 15 20:29:53 thanks pupnik Feb 15 20:30:08 is there a working version of kismet for os2008 Feb 15 20:30:18 i saw a few but they were not for os 2008 Feb 15 20:31:44 don't think so Feb 15 20:31:58 i can't install the one on the sse2 server Feb 15 20:32:09 n800music: what's the problem? Feb 15 20:32:51 something incompatible, one sec Feb 15 20:33:19 do you have os08? Feb 15 20:33:29 what is the best samba client that is avalible? Feb 15 20:33:31 yeah Feb 15 20:33:51 ok.. it should definitely work somehow then ;) Feb 15 20:34:29 incompatible app package Feb 15 20:34:44 hmm ah yeah.. it's not maemo-rized Feb 15 20:34:55 the "easiest" way is to install them via dpkg from xterm Feb 15 20:35:39 (so ssh root@n810 and then wget http://sse2.net/schism/libxxf86misc1_1.0.1-2_armel.deb and wget http://sse2.net/schism/schism_0+20071208-1_armel.deb and then dpkg -i libxxf86misc1_1.0.1-2_armel.deb schism_0+20071208-1_armel.deb .. Feb 15 20:35:57 * jott should set the "right" section :/ Feb 15 20:37:56 http://pastebin.ca/905501 hehehe dosbox 0.58 drawing much to the screen (oprofile) Feb 15 20:39:38 hm i never logged into as root before Feb 15 20:39:59 i just got mine a couple days ago Feb 15 20:40:31 n800music: oh :) .. just install openssh server via the app manager.. it will ask you for a password and start ssh then Feb 15 20:54:12 still around? Feb 15 20:54:15 yes Feb 15 20:54:26 installed ossh Feb 15 20:54:59 mmm now what ;( Feb 15 20:55:10 can you ssh into the device? Feb 15 20:55:44 ssh root@n800 doesn'ted do anythung Feb 15 20:56:03 ssh root@theipofyourn810 ;) Feb 15 20:56:28 are you on windows or *nix? Feb 15 20:56:55 i'm on the n800 atm Feb 15 20:57:16 ah ok.. you can then ssh root@localhost for now :) Feb 15 20:57:22 hence my typing speed Feb 15 20:57:31 ok Feb 15 20:58:06 (i just assumed that typing the long url is not very convinient when you are on your desktop :) Feb 15 20:59:00 i'm in Feb 15 20:59:13 i'm trying to/get used to.it Feb 15 20:59:18 hehe sure :) Feb 15 20:59:42 wget http://sse2.net/schism/libxxf86misc1_1.0.1-2_armel.deb && wget http://sse2.net/schism/schism_0+20071208-1_armel.deb && dpkg -i libxxf86misc1_1.0.1-2_armel.deb schism_0+20071208-1_armel.deb Feb 15 20:59:57 ^^ copy and paste this ;) Feb 15 21:04:04 jott: as root I guess :0 Feb 15 21:04:22 yes.. ;) he has already done ssh root@.. ;) Feb 15 21:05:19 * jott should create an .install file ;) Feb 15 21:08:51 i don'tknow how to copy in pidgin Feb 15 21:09:09 i probably sound retarded. Feb 15 21:09:36 * jott never used pidgin.. maybe someone else can help .. but i would guess ctrl+c might work Feb 15 21:10:02 it's the interface, the touchscreen Feb 15 21:10:15 throwing me off Feb 15 21:10:57 i bet there isnt a single person here who hasnt asked a seemingly silly question on irc before Feb 15 21:11:43 i bet yiu're wrong Feb 15 21:11:54 i hope Feb 15 21:12:19 ok i get wget: not found Feb 15 21:12:25 n800music: you can try this.. my first "install" http://sse2.net/schism/schism.install ;) Feb 15 21:12:33 seems to work here ;> Feb 15 21:13:00 yieks.. wget is not install per default? Feb 15 21:13:09 the install should be easier :) Feb 15 21:13:19 (the schism.install ) Feb 15 21:16:17 how does this work? Feb 15 21:16:18 ah mime type is also fixed ;) Feb 15 21:16:27 ah Feb 15 21:16:29 you should be able to just click on the link Feb 15 21:16:43 and then "Open" it with the application manager Feb 15 21:17:16 Tools -> Clear -> Cache in the MircoB browser .. :) Feb 15 21:17:35 worked Feb 15 21:17:36 ty Feb 15 21:17:47 it's not finished yet i suppose :O Feb 15 21:17:55 hope all dependencies are in the repos ;) Feb 15 21:18:13 hm really straight forward this .install stuff as it seems Feb 15 21:18:32 you must set the mimetype Feb 15 21:18:53 is the path ok? Feb 15 21:19:24 pupnik: yeah already done ;) Feb 15 21:19:31 i got an error at the end about the path to the file seems Feb 15 21:19:48 hmm.. what exactly? Feb 15 21:20:01 one second Feb 15 21:21:10 failed catalog Feb 15 21:21:55 the path/to the packages.gz is 404 Feb 15 21:22:02 hu? Feb 15 21:22:31 hmmm Feb 15 21:22:35 here's the path: Feb 15 21:23:17 Hello folks Feb 15 21:23:22 hello Feb 15 21:24:42 http://sse2.net/shism/dists/chinook/main/binary-armel/Packages.gz Feb 15 21:25:04 arg.. i messied a "c" somewhere.. why did it work for me :/ Feb 15 21:25:20 no that's me Feb 15 21:25:28 ah.. ok Feb 15 21:25:54 ah ... i see.. still strange that it worked for me.. Feb 15 21:25:55 just a sec Feb 15 21:27:07 * pupnik swaps his blunt dagger of dissecting and takes out the +4 cudgel of code removal to dosbox Feb 15 21:27:53 n800music: ok ..try again.. :) Feb 15 21:28:07 * jott did a stupid mistake Feb 15 21:29:27 * jott casts the accelerate spell on pupnik Feb 15 21:30:06 if ths works you should totally post it Feb 15 21:30:22 it'll spur some interest Feb 15 21:30:55 yeah.. i'll might have to fix the .desktop file first.. :) Feb 15 21:33:29 erghafhaoshfaoshfaosh Feb 15 21:33:52 installed! Feb 15 21:33:58 running Feb 15 21:34:02 ah nice Feb 15 21:34:19 keymap is off so i can't do anything Feb 15 21:34:31 but still kickass Feb 15 21:34:33 the hardware buttons should work Feb 15 21:34:35 try xkbd and not fullscreen Feb 15 21:34:41 press back for example Feb 15 21:35:04 the fullscreen button should start playing Feb 15 21:35:23 and zoom out stop ;) Feb 15 21:36:31 still you can download http://alanator.com/music/oldskool/2nd_pm.s3m for example and play it :) Feb 15 21:36:55 lol I remember that song Feb 15 21:37:01 * Tama^2 enter nostalgia mode Feb 15 21:37:07 *enters Feb 15 21:40:12 good sounds but very overused orchestra stab now :) Feb 15 21:40:32 oh it's from the unreal demo Feb 15 21:40:55 second reality :) Feb 15 21:41:07 sweet Feb 15 21:41:21 i gotta split, thanks a mil Feb 15 21:41:27 those guys were great - i think some of them went on to program Max Payne Feb 15 21:41:33 cheers n800music Feb 15 21:41:34 n800music: have fun :) Feb 15 21:41:45 and zoom out is start play :) Feb 15 21:41:48 ok.. Feb 15 21:41:54 erm zoom in Feb 15 21:41:57 anyway :) Feb 15 21:42:13 * jott looks out for some other nice modules Feb 15 21:43:34 hehe maybe a bunch of chiptunes ;) Feb 15 21:44:33 it has a .sid player? Feb 15 21:44:46 forbidden forest theme is nice Feb 15 21:45:27 uuuhm no but chiptunes can also be in .mod format ;) Feb 15 21:45:36 oh ok Feb 15 21:46:02 so the <10kb ones or so.. dunno what the size limit was .. Feb 15 21:46:41 interesting idea. using simple waveforms in mods and translating the control information to .mod format Feb 15 21:47:19 http://www.chiptunes.org/files/ Feb 15 21:48:13 i guess ~30k was the limit Feb 15 21:48:24 but most are ~10k ;) Feb 15 21:48:57 * jott downloads the chiptunes-full archive ;) Feb 15 22:12:39 is there any way to install xterm in scratchbox? Feb 15 22:18:47 B u r p. Feb 15 22:21:21 jga, you'll most likely need to compile it for i386 Feb 15 22:25:15 I had a dream during my nap Feb 15 22:25:46 I dreamed that I found an N800 in my cabinet and then I was like ZOMGLOLWTF? Feb 15 22:26:04 So I went straight to my PC and loaded mypaint Feb 15 22:26:22 After that, I woke up and screamed "damn it!" 'cuz it was a dream. Feb 15 22:26:30 True story. Feb 15 22:38:18 good Navi Feb 15 22:38:32 we need more tablet radicals :) Feb 15 22:39:00 someone will be contacting you soon Feb 15 22:42:59 Hanz Zimmer's score to The Rock is some of the most EPIC music I've ever heard <_< Feb 15 22:43:07 <3 Feb 15 22:47:11 Hey guys, I'm going on a trip soon... quick question: is my 770 optimal enough to play a movie for the 2 hour flight? I'm guess Canola and using DiVx to reduce the video to a proper setting will do it? Feb 15 22:48:21 hello :) Feb 15 22:48:47 reverendnathan: i would try just pure mplayer.... Feb 15 22:49:03 reverendnathan: and i *think* it should have just enough power Feb 15 22:49:33 well, a little more than enough, if you put it in offline mode and havent used it much yet since unplugging it Feb 15 22:50:31 also, just be sensible... like don't have the brightness at 100% :P Feb 15 22:50:57 i think i've managed to get something like 4 hours of video out of my n800 without it entirely dying Feb 15 22:51:10 rm_you: Cool. If not, my cell can handle it. Gotta get some more memory to hold the movie though! Good luck finding MMC, am I right? Feb 15 22:51:31 heh, is that what your phone uses? Feb 15 22:51:47 or... what does the 770 use, exactly? i always just assumed it used SD as well Feb 15 22:52:20 Lemme see, it's not SD unfort Feb 15 22:52:23 770 uses rs-mmc Feb 15 22:52:35 yeah, no idea <_< Feb 15 22:52:37 aka mmcmobile Feb 15 22:52:50 i love my n800 because it uses two nice full SDHC cards :P Feb 15 22:52:54 MultiMediaCard Feb 15 22:52:56 the n810 is lame in comparison <_< Feb 15 22:53:13 It looks like SD if SD was flipped sideways and has a lot of connectors Feb 15 22:53:17 dunno who the hell had the bright idea to downsize it to a single MiniSD Feb 15 22:53:28 hmm, for whatever reason, canola have become a dependency for some lib packages. debs getting confused, or something worse? Feb 15 22:54:33 damnit... my n800 is getting on my nerves, because it keeps just SHUTTING OFF Feb 15 22:54:40 64 MB RS-MMC memory card Feb 15 22:54:40 not rebooting... just powering completely off Feb 15 22:54:50 Going to assume RS-MMC = MMCPlus? Feb 15 22:54:58 never when i'm using it... just while it's in my pocket Feb 15 22:55:05 and only since os2008 Feb 15 22:55:06 Hopefully? Because I'm going to buy bigger memory for this motha Feb 15 22:55:39 rm_you, the single card is probably because of swap Feb 15 22:55:58 they want to make sure the swap card can't be removed... Feb 15 22:56:08 ok, that's semi-understandable then... Feb 15 22:56:15 but why miniSD? >_< Feb 15 22:56:52 takes what could be a 16G or soon 32G card slot, and makes it into a 4G maximum / hard to find / uncompatible with everything else card Feb 15 22:57:16 I know very little of cards -- what should it have been? Feb 15 22:57:21 gotta love the cli, apt-get had no problems removing canola... Feb 15 22:57:31 jku: standard SD again Feb 15 22:57:56 I've heard N810 is very, very tightly packed Feb 15 22:58:02 i like the idea of GPS builtin, and a hardware keyboard... Feb 15 22:58:11 so maybe it was a size problem Feb 15 22:58:15 but the downgrade to miniSD means I would *never* buy or recommend one to anyone Feb 15 22:58:24 ok i got maybe 5% more speed tonight Feb 15 22:59:08 and 100% of the friends i've tried to make buy a Maemo device agree that if they were going to buy one, it would be the n800 over the n810 primarily because of the SD >_> Feb 15 22:59:09 how is minisd a downgrade from sd? Feb 15 22:59:23 there was no space for full sd, rm_you Feb 15 22:59:29 rm_you, why is it that important? Feb 15 22:59:37 space.... Feb 15 22:59:43 takes what could be a 16G or soon 32G card slot, and makes it into a 4G maximum / hard to find / uncompatible with everything else card Feb 15 22:59:54 miniSD are expensive and not well spread Feb 15 23:00:05 the choices of miniSD cards is weak Feb 15 23:00:10 my 4GB minisd was 21 euro Feb 15 23:00:15 best is to buy a microSD w/ an adapter Feb 15 23:00:22 my 4g SD was like 10Euro Feb 15 23:00:23 4GB minisd cards are $25 Feb 15 23:00:28 that doesn't seem unreasonable to me Feb 15 23:00:30 reverendnathan: RS-MMC = MMCMobile (or to be more precise, MMCMobile is a faster, dual voltage version of RS-MMC) Feb 15 23:00:40 wwp: agree... microsd = win Feb 15 23:00:46 but they also have a much smaller maximum size Feb 15 23:00:46 elb: in .fr, miniSD prices are way more expensive Feb 15 23:00:57 compared to micro and normal SD Feb 15 23:01:06 don't blame the technology, blame the socialist economy ;-) Feb 15 23:01:12 you can RIGHT NOW buy a 16Gb SD card Feb 15 23:01:20 micro caps at 4Gb, from what i've seen Feb 15 23:01:24 you'll find 2 miniSD ones for 10 micro or normal ones. of course, at expensive prices and won't find high speeds or capacities Feb 15 23:01:25 mini- and microsd will catch up to SD Feb 15 23:01:26 and SD will soon be at 32 Feb 15 23:01:37 microSD -> 8GB Feb 15 23:01:43 frankly, I haven't seen any reason to augment the built-in storage in my 810 Feb 15 23:02:01 elb: what do you use your device for? Feb 15 23:02:02 the miniSD choise is an error to me. normal or micro was way more pertinent Feb 15 23:02:11 elb, agreed. Not everyone has the same requirements Feb 15 23:02:13 same for the USB plug format, stupid (or commercial) Feb 15 23:02:14 the MaemoMapper database in my n800 takes up 1Gb by itself Feb 15 23:02:20 rm_you: mostly reading documents and keeping a schedule/notes, so far Feb 15 23:02:31 maemo mapper isn't anywhere near that large, on mine Feb 15 23:02:38 but I didn't try to map the entire continent Feb 15 23:02:47 ssvb: This stuff isn't cheap! Cheapest I found : http://www.buy.com/prod/kingston-2gb-mmcmobile/q/loc/101/202807841.html ($32! for 2GB) Feb 15 23:02:49 I need to have most of two large cities and the area between Feb 15 23:02:56 elb: just one city can fill a card... Feb 15 23:02:56 about the USB plug, there are already 2 very common USB formats of this size. there were no use to create a new one, w/ quite no cable that fit Feb 15 23:03:27 the USB plug format and miniSD format choices only reveal some commercial purposes Feb 15 23:03:37 not any pertinent technical ones Feb 15 23:03:39 wwp, like? Feb 15 23:03:54 like what? Feb 15 23:03:59 what like? Feb 15 23:04:19 I'm wondering what you mean by "commercial purposes" Feb 15 23:04:32 just that it makes economical sense to Nokia? Feb 15 23:04:35 wwp: they didn't "create a new one" Feb 15 23:04:36 good question. ways to control specific cable prices? Feb 15 23:04:42 wwp: you realize that the plug on the 810 is standard, right? Feb 15 23:04:54 elb: no, right, they didn't create a new one, they just make use of the most uncommon one ;) Feb 15 23:05:01 and that it serves a functionality which is different from the other small plugs Feb 15 23:05:04 whereas similar very popular ones were available Feb 15 23:05:14 there's an *extra pin* compared to those "very popular ones" Feb 15 23:05:23 and that extra pin allows you to do things that the "very popular ones" can't do Feb 15 23:05:26 what functionality? bind pin 4 and 5? Feb 15 23:05:30 tss Feb 15 23:05:44 USB OTG requires those pins, yes Feb 15 23:05:52 it's not just about "bind pin 4 and 5" Feb 15 23:05:54 you can find other plugs w/ OTG Feb 15 23:06:08 google a bit! Feb 15 23:06:17 devices which are *only* compatible with either host or client mode, yes Feb 15 23:06:24 ;) Feb 15 23:06:29 but devices which can do both require the extra pin Feb 15 23:06:35 yes Feb 15 23:06:37 right! Feb 15 23:06:39 So, what is usb to go? Feb 15 23:06:40 "google a bit!" Feb 15 23:07:00 reverendnathan: unfortunately Nokia 770 does not support cheap SD cards, Kingston 2GB MMCMobile is probably the best choice for this device Feb 15 23:07:04 esworp: it's a standard which allows devices to act either as a host or a device, depending on what they're plugged in to Feb 15 23:07:16 that explains it and makes sense with the card issue: you can now use usb sticks to store stuff... Feb 15 23:07:21 esworp: e.g., the n810 is a host when you plug it into a keyboard, and a device when you plug it into your computer Feb 15 23:07:25 38363 7.3391 no-vmlinux (no symbols) <<< what is that? the virtual memory of the itos kernel? Feb 15 23:08:39 oh duh nevermind Feb 15 23:08:47 i'd need a kernel with debugging symbols Feb 15 23:10:52 if only dosbox didn't segfault when i run -fprofile-generate :( Feb 15 23:13:13 anyone know if a screen protector for the 800 will fit on an 810? Feb 15 23:13:30 I don't know if they have the same exact screen or not... I would assume so normally Feb 15 23:15:10 the screen on n810 is smaller than 770 Feb 15 23:15:21 don't know about vs. n800 Feb 15 23:16:20 pupnik, are you sure? They all look the same to me... Feb 15 23:16:40 i have both here and 770 is larger by perhaps 2-3 mm Feb 15 23:17:05 which direction? Feb 15 23:17:15 horiz Feb 15 23:17:37 vert maybe 2 mm or so Feb 15 23:18:06 oh, right. had to turn them on to see it Feb 15 23:18:57 if you have an 800 there, can you tell me the horizontal dimension of the display? Feb 15 23:19:16 my 810 is exactly 90mm Feb 15 23:19:56 x 53mm, vertical Feb 15 23:21:30 hachi, I don't have really good measuring tools Feb 15 23:21:45 but yeah they can't be more than 1mm different Feb 15 23:23:00 so many sites list the size of the display in inches, and the size of the device in mm horizontal and vertical Feb 15 23:23:04 gah Feb 15 23:23:17 pupnik, even the difference to 770 is only maybe 1 mm to each direction, when I actually try to measure Feb 15 23:23:44 maybe 2 Feb 15 23:23:55 800 is 4.1" Feb 15 23:23:59 770 is 4.13" Feb 15 23:24:53 does anyone ever replace screen protectors? Feb 15 23:25:04 I'm debating buying one or three :\ Feb 15 23:26:47 0.03" = 0.76 mm, so not much to each direction (of course specs and reality do not always meet) Feb 15 23:27:17 yeah :) Feb 15 23:30:48 anybody here done gcc tests with funroll-loops / funroll-all-loops? Feb 15 23:41:11 whoa, xomap xrandr: http://labs.vivi.eng.br/blog/?p=39 Feb 15 23:41:55 rotated by the lcd controller so should be plenty fast Feb 15 23:42:31 nice job Feb 15 23:46:55 http://www.arm.com/support/faqdev/1228.html useful info on alignment on ARM and packed structures Feb 15 23:48:41 cool jku Feb 16 00:17:17 the rootme password not work, I just flashed my n800 with OS2008 :( Feb 16 00:17:45 and no ssh root@localhost Feb 16 00:23:31 "no ssh root@localhost" -- be more exact. What is the problem? Feb 16 00:23:34 install sshd Feb 16 00:23:38 :) Feb 16 00:28:20 can anyone tell me if the igo bluetooth keyboard works with the n810?: http://www.amazon.com/Stowaway-Ultra-Slim-Bluetooth-Blackberry-Handhelds/dp/B0002OKCXE/ref=pd_bbs_sr_1?ie=UTF8&s=electronics&qid=1203121394&sr=8-1 Feb 16 00:36:44 I read in this channel before that it does Feb 16 00:36:55 but I have no first hand information Feb 16 00:39:03 cool thanks :) Feb 16 00:44:44 hello Feb 16 00:45:11 is there a way to remove the contact button? the second one on the left side..i dont need this Feb 16 00:57:51 anybody create a TaskNav panel in python? (like http://www.internettablettalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=16460) Feb 16 01:09:42 hello everyone Feb 16 01:10:26 I have a quick but possibly difficult question. Feb 16 01:11:02 How do you compile a toolkit for maemo using crosstool or crosstool-NG? Feb 16 01:42:20 how I get root password? Feb 16 01:42:49 install a system and take notes Feb 16 01:45:25 anybody know how to remap the hardware keys on the n810? Feb 16 02:09:36 a dremmel and some duct tape Feb 16 02:10:18 * jott tries to imagine a world without duct tape but fails Feb 16 02:10:51 we'd still be using bailing wire for everything Feb 16 02:11:37 nah that's not the same :/ Feb 16 02:12:42 i know, but its how the world survived before the shiny bond that holds us all together Feb 16 02:13:23 but look under what circumstances they had to live.. Feb 16 02:13:54 duct tape! Feb 16 02:14:28 symbolized by | Feb 16 02:16:00 the stuff is unaffordable in germany Feb 16 02:20:32 I drove several Citroen 2CV, they are basically made of duct tape. ;) Feb 16 02:20:39 hahaha Feb 16 02:21:19 you have to love the unique design and simplicity Feb 16 02:21:29 I did. Still do. Feb 16 02:21:35 duct tape, *expensive* ? Feb 16 02:21:49 * elb shakes his head at broken socialist economies for the second time in one day Feb 16 02:22:56 i'll agree but perhaps duct tape producers in some countries are externalizing pollution costs, which are then borne in sickness Feb 16 02:23:07 so goes the theory Feb 16 02:23:40 I'm having a doubt Feb 16 02:23:53 well, in *some* countries, I'm sure Feb 16 02:24:25 anyway the reason germans don't use it is they have a cultural aversion to sloppy quick fixes to anything Feb 16 02:24:26 Germany does have a horrid subsidy system in place for "environmental" stuff, though, I hadn't thought about that Feb 16 02:24:32 yes Feb 16 02:24:34 man, I bet that makes all kinds of things crazy expensive Feb 16 02:24:43 there's also a cultural antipathy towards chemistry Feb 16 02:24:56 as evinced in a strong market for homeopathic and herbal remedies Feb 16 02:25:08 a friend of mine was waxing fond on the solar energy subsidies the other day Feb 16 02:25:29 I tried to explain that it isn't all bunnies and flowers, but I don't think I got through Feb 16 02:25:30 everyone should go to mises.org and learn some economic reality imo :) Feb 16 02:25:35 amen Feb 16 02:26:01 i just discovered the speeches of Hans-Herman Hoppe - awesome Feb 16 02:26:28 http://mises.org/media.aspx?action=showname&ID=164 Feb 16 02:26:49 I don't know as much about economy as I'd like Feb 16 02:26:59 pupnik, tablet radicals? Feb 16 02:26:59 there's just not enough time ;-) Feb 16 02:27:20 yeah Navi, then you too can become infused with THE FORCE and help our communist linux revolution Feb 16 02:27:27 I see. Feb 16 02:27:30 OK, if I've semi-bricked my N800 -- I can ssh into it but the GUI isn't starting -- after I've finished backing everything on it up, what's the best way to figure out what's gone wrong with the gui with an eye toward fixing it? Feb 16 02:28:04 So, it's not starting on a fresh start? Feb 16 02:28:06 this isn't going to be in German, is it? ;-) Feb 16 02:28:10 you see, elb, in software scarcity is not a natural state, but rather an artificial one Feb 16 02:28:18 no he speaks english Feb 16 02:28:21 <`0660_> why not just reflash it? Feb 16 02:28:27 It's not starting on a power-off, take the battery out, put the battery back in and turn on cycle. Feb 16 02:28:30 I should burn these to CD and listen to them in the car Feb 16 02:28:37 I didn't realize they had audio content on mises.org Feb 16 02:28:45 yep i just listened to him on a long walk Feb 16 02:28:53 The system is running, as I said. I'm rsynching it right now. But the GUI is just not starting. Feb 16 02:29:00 `0660_, I view reflashing and red pill as a last resort Feb 16 02:29:06 unless it's ultimately easier Feb 16 02:29:44 pupnik, are the ones that will contact me also bringing my very own N810? Feb 16 02:29:54 :) Feb 16 02:30:05 I could do with an IT Feb 16 02:30:11 buy one :) Feb 16 02:30:38 I only have enough money stored for half an N800 Feb 16 02:30:44 `0660_: Reflashing is my last choice. I'd rather not go through the hassles of re-installing all the software all over again. And, too, this won't help me understand what went wrong in the first place. Feb 16 02:30:48 in the N800 fund anyways, the rest is for gas Feb 16 02:31:38 pupnik: if you've listened to some of these ... is any particular order better than linear? Feb 16 02:32:08 it depends on your favorite subject - you can also go by events Feb 16 02:32:26 and your favorite speaker might well differ from mine. i am just going down the list Feb 16 02:32:56 sure Feb 16 02:32:58 i find it much more entertaining than pop music, or god forbid television now Feb 16 02:32:59 pupnik: thanks for the link :) Feb 16 02:33:02 mnight as well start with a recommendation, though :-) Feb 16 02:33:35 you're very welcome. umm well my favorites were on imperialism personally cause they ventured more into obvious political territory Feb 16 02:33:58 http://mises.org/events/88 Feb 16 02:34:38 oops where's the media Feb 16 02:34:56 http://mises.org/media.aspx?action=category&ID=94 Feb 16 02:34:57 there it is Feb 16 02:35:16 Anybody with an idea of how to diagnose the GUI-not-starting-up problem? Feb 16 02:35:33 ttmrichter: can you ssh into the device? Feb 16 02:35:54 pupnik: Yes. And indeed I'm backing everything up through rsynch as we speak. Feb 16 02:36:32 is the device a N810 or N800 with os2008? Feb 16 02:37:09 N800, OS2007. Feb 16 02:37:57 i don't think i can help Feb 16 02:38:57 Well, what is the command sequence that launches the GUI? I could fire that up in SSH and see what error messages erupt. Feb 16 02:40:26 hildon-desktop ? Feb 16 02:40:55 i don't even know how to turn on /var/log Feb 16 02:41:59 Hi. Feb 16 02:42:02 I have a 770 Feb 16 02:42:08 What fun thing can I do with it? Feb 16 02:42:27 SDP http://pupnik.de/software.html Feb 16 02:42:45 acydlord: No such command it seems. Feb 16 02:42:45 help fix-up the games and emulators Feb 16 02:44:57 oo. fun things. Feb 16 02:45:00 thanks. Feb 16 02:52:24 OK, for the record: I think I've solved the problem. Feb 16 02:52:30 There was a libpango update. Feb 16 02:52:42 The update invoked a new script in /sbin. Feb 16 02:52:48 The script existed -- but it was a PERL script. Feb 16 02:52:55 Perl is not installed on my N800. Feb 16 02:52:59 Until now, I imean. Feb 16 02:53:19 Now the apt-get update/upgrade cycle has worked. Feb 16 02:53:31 So once my backup is finished, I'll see if I have a GUI again. Feb 16 02:57:06 hmm. Feb 16 02:57:22 hardware sucks, Feb 16 02:57:35 only hoovers **** ENDING LOGGING AT Sat Feb 16 02:59:57 2008