**** BEGIN LOGGING AT Wed Apr 09 02:59:57 2008 Apr 09 03:00:13 Hmm looks good Apr 09 03:00:56 Forgot sie owner, year started.... Apr 09 03:01:02 Site Apr 09 03:02:16 This info can be found easy in googles seach Apr 09 03:02:50 Yeah, I know where to get the info. Apr 09 03:02:54 I KNOW the info Apr 09 03:03:08 cool url re those net cams Apr 09 03:03:54 I just don't want to be the only one investing time in the articles. Apr 09 03:04:05 Then don't. Apr 09 03:04:22 GeneralAntilles: i did some work on the gamedev page Apr 09 03:04:50 i'll do more some time, but i don't have any wiki-fu Apr 09 03:04:51 Ahh honesty i new to maemo so if i can help ill try Apr 09 03:05:00 s/articles./articles. :P/ Apr 09 03:05:01 GeneralAntilles meant: I just don't want to be the only one investing time in the articles. :P Apr 09 03:05:20 well you're not Apr 09 03:05:37 Wikipedia has a gamedev article? Apr 09 03:06:04 Umm wtf is game dev? Apr 09 03:06:24 game development Apr 09 03:06:42 Ahh Apr 09 03:07:05 lol scanning some bedroom at the moment Apr 09 03:07:07 Thought it was like ign Apr 09 03:07:22 perv Apr 09 03:08:08 Um ponsite he webcams to so carefull Apr 09 03:08:16 Have Apr 09 03:08:41 ksoftirqd is taking 100% cpu Apr 09 03:08:46 anyone know what it is? Apr 09 03:08:50 Hit it with a stick. Apr 09 03:09:00 GeneralAntilles, no effect Apr 09 03:09:06 Harder Apr 09 03:09:20 http://www.penguin-soft.com/penguin/man/9/ksoftirqd.html Apr 09 03:09:20 Oops bat-steel Apr 09 03:10:29 apparently, my N800 is under very heavy soft interrupt load. Apr 09 03:10:34 haha now google is blocking the search Apr 09 03:11:09 Bad state of affairs to be in, Navi. Apr 09 03:11:37 Try a differeny cam search ( bottom in blue) Apr 09 03:11:56 What's heavier, 100lb of feathers, or 100lb of bowling balls? Apr 09 03:12:32 What u c in de bed room ? :D Apr 09 03:12:38 100 pounds of confused users? Apr 09 03:12:41 darkness Apr 09 03:13:03 weird Apr 09 03:13:05 masterbedroom? Apr 09 03:13:06 :) Apr 09 03:13:19 Anyone try out Android on the N8X0s yet? Apr 09 03:13:23 neat lawrence berkley national laboratory http://bl1202cam.als.lbl.gov/ViewerFrame?Mode=Refresh&Resolution=640x480&Quality=Clarity&Interval=30&Size=STD&PresetOperation=Save&Language=5 Apr 09 03:13:43 Navi, is eht awesome?!!1 Apr 09 03:13:51 haha who's moving the cam Apr 09 03:13:55 I DUN KNO TATS Y I ASK Apr 09 03:14:03 Navi, nope, but I tried it on the zaurus Apr 09 03:14:13 Was it fun? Apr 09 03:14:17 no reliable touchscreen is kind of a deal breaker Apr 09 03:14:24 it's fun for about 10 minutes though Apr 09 03:14:30 and their web browser is good Apr 09 03:14:47 How good? Apr 09 03:14:52 johnx, did you see Quim's request for the top platform components that the community'd want open sourced? Apr 09 03:14:59 O_o Apr 09 03:15:05 * johnx just got up Apr 09 03:15:13 it's like 8pm Apr 09 03:15:13 It's old, actually. Apr 09 03:15:16 Old news! Apr 09 03:15:21 I just noticed it on bugzilla a few weeks ago. Apr 09 03:15:45 People are just going to pick sucky stuff anyways Apr 09 03:15:48 https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1584 Apr 09 03:16:01 thanks Apr 09 03:16:01 how about something that makes maemo more useful for mamona Apr 09 03:16:03 I figure you're more qualified than most to reply to that. :P Apr 09 03:16:28 heh...I'll just reply with something *I* want though :P Apr 09 03:16:50 Well, I'm assuming that's something that'll ease Debian along, though, right? Apr 09 03:17:03 damnit pupnik - quit moving the camera right! I'm trying to see what's on the left! Apr 09 03:17:20 i'm not moving it! Apr 09 03:17:32 just messing with you man Apr 09 03:17:35 cool stuff though Apr 09 03:17:40 yeah Apr 09 03:17:44 blinkenlights :) Apr 09 03:17:52 http://66.209.109.2:60006/ViewerFrame?Mode=Refresh&Resolution=320x240&Quality=Standard&PresetOperation=Move&Language=11 Apr 09 03:17:59 In a home Apr 09 03:18:54 So... canola won't start for me. Apr 09 03:18:55 gotta mission for ya shadow6: find us a female dorm cam! Apr 09 03:19:10 shapr: what's the error? Apr 09 03:19:17 doesn't have to be the showers.. bedrooms will be adequate Apr 09 03:19:18 canola2 beta8, that is... on my chinook using n800 Apr 09 03:19:22 KotCzarny: No error, just nothing. Apr 09 03:19:30 try running from terminal? Apr 09 03:19:35 python-launcher? Apr 09 03:20:02 KotCzarny: Got the same thing, nothing at all. Apr 09 03:20:06 hmm Apr 09 03:20:07 I tried "canolad start" Apr 09 03:20:12 and then canola, still nothing. Apr 09 03:20:13 Ha ha Apr 09 03:20:17 Assuming yes—uninstall python-launcher, purge Canola with canola-cleaner reboot, reinstall Apr 09 03:20:24 I have a bunch of apps installed, maybe something else is conflicting? Apr 09 03:20:32 what would be a nice size for a movie on the N800? Apr 09 03:20:32 GeneralAntilles: Oh, I do have python-launcher installed. Apr 09 03:20:35 /usr/share/applications/hildon/canola2.desktop Apr 09 03:20:36 python-launch, shapr. Apr 09 03:20:37 Right. Apr 09 03:20:38 or something Apr 09 03:20:40 U need to install tunning Apr 09 03:20:43 aha, I'll rip that out. Apr 09 03:20:44 thanks. Apr 09 03:21:13 skibur, 500px horizontal works pretty well for me Apr 09 03:21:22 little bit of framedrop with high-action stuff, though. Apr 09 03:21:37 ok Apr 09 03:21:48 sub-500px stuff is more of a sure-thing Apr 09 03:21:50 I have 640mb movie Apr 09 03:21:57 400x240 is a definite sure-thing Apr 09 03:22:03 ok Apr 09 03:22:12 500px and 400x240 Apr 09 03:22:15 Most, *ahem* bittorrent stuff works fine for me without extra effort. Apr 09 03:22:16 what do you use Apr 09 03:22:19 mencoder? Apr 09 03:22:27 mediautils.garage.maemo.org Apr 09 03:22:35 I think i found a disney land webcam Apr 09 03:22:54 http://wcam3.iacm.gov.mo/ViewerFrame?Direction=PanLeft2000&Mode=Refresh&Resolution=640x480&Quality=Clarity&Interval=30&Size=STD&PresetOperation=Move&Language=5 Apr 09 03:23:19 gov.mo ? Apr 09 03:23:54 will it take avi format? Apr 09 03:24:58 o ok Apr 09 03:25:00 skibur: i crunch them to around 400MB Apr 09 03:25:13 its based on mencoder Apr 09 03:25:15 nice Apr 09 03:26:14 Wow, lots of stuff cleaned up. Apr 09 03:27:06 Lotta dependencies. Apr 09 03:27:35 Python stuff, media handles and scanners, rendering libraries, etc, etc, etc Apr 09 03:28:01 Ok, rebooted, now reinstalling canola. Apr 09 03:28:07 SHADOW6: lol that cam is from the The Official Provisional Municipal Council of Macau Apr 09 03:28:50 Anybody booting straight to KDE on their tablet yet? Apr 09 03:29:04 O cartoony house =green hmm mus be disnely land Apr 09 03:29:44 it's in southeast asia, bordering china Apr 09 03:30:06 http://geography.about.com/library/cia/blcmacau.htm Apr 09 03:30:10 what is gov.mo? Someone just mentioned it to me at the same time Kot posted it Apr 09 03:30:17 it's a dead link for me Apr 09 03:30:52 dude, the sun isn't shining on disneyland. It's shining over asia. Apr 09 03:30:59 Bah, I was hoping to get http://mae.mo/ but you only get second level names from Macao. Apr 09 03:31:17 my.mae.mo ? Apr 09 03:31:18 :) Apr 09 03:31:34 KotCzarny: Yeah, would be a good community site name :-) Apr 09 03:31:50 finding.mae.mo Apr 09 03:34:01 GeneralAntilles: Yay! Thanks! Apr 09 03:35:09 Sure Apr 09 03:35:20 shapr, they'll have you take it down, anyway. Apr 09 03:35:28 It's Nokia's trademark. Apr 09 03:36:55 Yeah, true. Apr 09 03:37:12 See maemoapps.com -> nitapps.com Apr 09 03:38:13 Look he be drunk lol http://www.ruuhiskamera.ath.cx/view/indexFrame.shtml Apr 09 03:39:20 Well a sec ago he could barly stand Apr 09 03:39:42 Not drunk.....? Apr 09 03:39:59 aww he left Apr 09 03:40:21 we should have a simple webcam stylee app for the N8x0 Apr 09 03:42:23 Yeah, I'm surprised there isn't one. Apr 09 03:42:24 most of those cams are from japan Apr 09 03:43:34 looks snowy Apr 09 03:44:40 Londen mus have a shit load of cams Apr 09 03:44:43 what do you want from webcam app? Apr 09 03:44:51 London Apr 09 03:45:07 i bet it can be written in sh Apr 09 03:45:08 :) Apr 09 03:45:16 Video audio snap shot Apr 09 03:45:19 yeah, i'd expect london to have complete coverage Apr 09 03:45:47 http://219.115.177.172/ViewerFrame?Mode=Refresh&Language=7 Apr 09 03:45:53 some radio studio Apr 09 03:45:54 :) Apr 09 03:46:39 keep trying.. that's not a dorm room either Apr 09 03:46:49 http://iozoonc3.city.miyazaki.miyazaki.jp/ViewerFrame?Mode=Refresh&Resolution=320x240&Quality=Standard&Interval=30&Size=Expand&PresetOperation=Move&Language=4 Apr 09 03:46:51 zoo Apr 09 03:46:54 :) Apr 09 03:47:59 hey, I can't get off on animals man Apr 09 03:48:11 specially porky pines Apr 09 03:48:19 that's a giraffe Apr 09 03:48:25 :) Apr 09 03:48:35 radio announcer person is kind of cute Apr 09 03:48:41 Um, how do I build a playlist with canola? Apr 09 03:49:01 I think I've checked all the menus, yet I cannot see how to select multiple files. Apr 09 03:49:19 you don't Apr 09 03:49:20 :) Apr 09 03:49:30 it's ipodish Apr 09 03:49:37 :-( Apr 09 03:49:42 when they get browse by file mode as i want it Apr 09 03:49:46 Also, how do I get canola to recognize oggs? Apr 09 03:49:56 then one could simply prepare dirs :) Apr 09 03:50:26 I passed up a few porn site cams but forgot where they are lol Apr 09 03:50:32 I have one of the ogg packages installed, whichever is not mogg. Apr 09 03:50:54 * shapr tries installing mogg Apr 09 03:51:23 hmm, that masterbedroom cam looks like one of them, though inactive right now Apr 09 03:51:27 shapr, see the Canola forum on ITT Apr 09 03:51:30 and #canola Apr 09 03:56:07 looking at those webcams i assume n8x0 isn't that bad ;) Apr 09 03:56:26 hi Apr 09 03:56:53 opendeep Hi Apr 09 03:57:50 opendeep so what you are doing now after a break up with your girlfriend Apr 09 04:03:20 Hmm iv found sw airlines web cam but all xxx cams seem to be off or dissabled Apr 09 04:05:13 Quiet to quiet Apr 09 04:05:44 ok the japanese radio station ppl seemed to notice us Apr 09 04:05:52 ;) Apr 09 04:05:59 Link Apr 09 04:06:01 booo end of sending Apr 09 04:08:04 China and japan seem to have many cams Apr 09 04:11:09 ah the radio station is fm takarazuka Apr 09 04:11:20 Well it be late so see ya latter.. Apr 09 04:28:28 Argh, canola doesn't handle ogg with either of the ogg or mogg packages installed. Apr 09 04:28:29 SUCK! Apr 09 04:29:50 http://www.internettablettalk.com/forums/showthread.php?p=114142 ? Apr 09 04:29:56 * shapr looks Apr 09 04:29:58 It's mplayer Apr 09 04:30:06 so it should just be as simple as getting lms to index them. Apr 09 04:32:04 spiffy Apr 09 04:32:11 Now I wonder if it can do FLAC files too... Apr 09 04:32:43 Bah, I'll finish this tomorrow. Apr 09 04:33:01 :) Apr 09 04:33:07 shapr: do you like xmms? Apr 09 04:33:32 solmumaha got xmms2 going also Apr 09 04:33:42 KotCzarny: Nah, I use mpd Apr 09 04:33:46 ok Apr 09 04:33:47 :) Apr 09 04:33:57 I saw libmpd0 in the packages, that would be nice... Apr 09 04:35:03 Anyway, I got the BUG SDK working tonight, I'll try to get maemo dev working tomorrow night. Apr 09 04:44:54 <^Jsn> is there a way to select all updates and download them when updates are available in os2008, instead of having to click on each one individually and install it? Apr 09 04:46:10 ^Jsn, wait for Diablo Apr 09 04:46:19 <^Jsn> what is diablo? Apr 09 04:46:38 The next 4.1 Apr 09 04:46:43 s/next // Apr 09 04:46:43 Navi meant: The 4.1 Apr 09 04:46:47 oh god Apr 09 04:46:50 4.1 Apr 09 04:47:06 Either that or make a deal with the devil himself to make updating easier Apr 09 04:47:23 <^Jsn> lol Apr 09 04:47:36 <^Jsn> diablo is the application manager? Apr 09 04:48:14 Diablo is the next operating system release Apr 09 04:48:16 It's the codename of the next release Apr 09 04:48:21 <^Jsn> oh ok Apr 09 04:48:26 the current OS2008 is chinook, OS2007 was bora Apr 09 04:48:28 any other info on diablo than the name Apr 09 04:48:35 Lots, dospod. Apr 09 04:48:38 See ITT Apr 09 04:48:45 <^Jsn> lol how long is diablo supposed to take? Apr 09 04:48:53 "Q2 2008" Apr 09 04:48:57 July at the latest. Apr 09 04:49:04 <^Jsn> cool Apr 09 04:49:16 also, It will come with free ice-cream, and it will make any computer it touches have wimax Apr 09 04:49:22 WOO Apr 09 04:49:30 My PC can touch it with Bluetooth. Apr 09 04:49:34 <^Jsn> are there any other application managers for maemo besides the one that is installed? Apr 09 04:49:47 GUI app managers? no Apr 09 04:49:56 but there is apt-get, which all the cool kids use Apr 09 04:50:02 unless you count synaptic Apr 09 04:50:14 eh? someone got synaptic running O_o Apr 09 04:50:15 which is "pah" at best Apr 09 04:50:34 <^Jsn> will apt-get update update all of the installed packages, or does it just update the repos? Apr 09 04:50:35 s/ing/g?/g Apr 09 04:50:35 johnx meant: eh? someone got synaptic runng? O_o Apr 09 04:51:11 what flavor ice cream does diablo come with ? Apr 09 04:51:20 boot to the head! Apr 09 04:51:32 :D Apr 09 04:51:37 ^Jsn, it'll update the repos Apr 09 04:51:44 johnx: :) Apr 09 04:51:47 ^Jsn, eh? apt-get update: updates the list of available packages, and apt-get upgrade: pulls down new versions of packages Apr 09 04:51:51 <^Jsn> thats what i thought Apr 09 04:51:56 apt-get upgrade will upgrade packages, but it may break things depending on the repos you have installed. Apr 09 04:52:18 <^Jsn> oh ok Apr 09 04:52:36 ok does anybody know what flavor of ice cream diablo comes with Apr 09 04:52:42 A lot of reboot-loop fun Apr 09 04:53:01 dospod, the flavor you hate the most Apr 09 04:53:08 I already told you, "boot to the head" flavor Apr 09 04:53:16 it _is_ the devil we're talking about, here. Apr 09 04:53:26 dammit strawberry Apr 09 04:53:30 I cant even eat it Apr 09 04:53:32 : \ Apr 09 04:53:40 I love strawberry Apr 09 04:53:47 I'll trade you Apr 09 04:53:57 My least favorite is coconut. Apr 09 04:54:04 ohh ill mix that : ) Apr 09 04:54:09 both of those sound delicious Apr 09 04:54:31 the frantics! Apr 09 04:54:40 * johnx hasn't met an ice cream flavor he didn't like Apr 09 04:54:47 i have Apr 09 04:54:48 Ill make a fkn mixed milk shake Apr 09 04:55:00 you know the frantics - 'boot to the head' johnx? Apr 09 04:55:01 johnx, I'll make you a puke flavored one if you'd like. Apr 09 04:55:20 Navi, :( Apr 09 04:55:40 pupnik, aaah, that's who did it originally. I saw some redone version on youtube Apr 09 04:56:17 they have some great sketches - 'the weight loss clinic' and 'driving chicks mad' are classics Apr 09 04:56:27 <^Jsn> does anyone else have problems updateing apps where it says that the app is for another operating system and may harm your system? I'm thinking its a repo problem Apr 09 04:56:39 another operating system? Apr 09 04:56:57 non-nokia apps will give a warning Apr 09 04:57:13 <^Jsn> it's not that warning. i'm used to that one Apr 09 04:57:21 Hrm Apr 09 04:57:35 is it the one about an updated version being found in another repo? Apr 09 04:57:53 <^Jsn> the error is "unable to install." "Software contains updates to packages installed from a different source and is likely to harm the system. Contact the software author." Apr 09 04:58:52 yup, that's the one Apr 09 04:58:53 what package causes this? have you contacted the packager? Apr 09 04:58:58 If I want to get info from a file with fgets and pass the FILE pointer to another function, do I have to pass the FILE pointer by reference to be able to continue from where fgets left off? Apr 09 04:59:37 <^Jsn> gnokii-gconf, hildon-input-method, libhildon-im-ui3, map and phonelink Apr 09 04:59:40 pupnik, it just happens when you install software A form source X and a more up to date version of A becomes available from source Y Apr 09 04:59:41 <^Jsn> no i havent Apr 09 05:00:00 This is C, I'm asking about. Apr 09 05:00:31 The answer is D, Navi, all of the above. Apr 09 05:00:43 GeneralAntilles, :( Apr 09 05:01:14 <^Jsn> does anyone know how i can fix my prob? Apr 09 05:02:02 Map you can uninstall and reinstall Apr 09 05:02:12 The rest you can use Red Pill (temporarily) to force. Apr 09 05:02:26 or use apt-get if that's your thing :) Apr 09 05:03:38 <^Jsn> another prob that is driving me crazy is the "connecting to pop3 server" dialog popup that clawsmail brings up when it tries to check for new mail. If your not connected to the net, the dialog stays up and does not go away. It covers the top right corner of your screen so you can't select the wifi icon or shut down clawsmail. The only option is to reboot. Does anyone know how to disable that dialog? Apr 09 05:04:16 Use Modest Apr 09 05:05:04 <^Jsn> i had modest but clawsmail seems like more of a full featured mail reader Apr 09 05:05:21 Define full featured Apr 09 05:05:40 <^Jsn> is there a hot key to bring up the process manager? Apr 09 05:06:16 There is no process manager. Apr 09 05:06:17 <^Jsn> allows plugins, nicer GUI, more customizable options Apr 09 05:06:31 GeneralAntilles, well, there's top :P Apr 09 05:07:03 <^Jsn> whats top? Apr 09 05:08:08 a command line program that lists processes and lets you kill them Apr 09 05:08:51 Doesn't have to be kill; you can send any signal Apr 09 05:10:33 <^Jsn> cool that looks good enough for me Apr 09 05:11:14 <^Jsn> well thanks for the help everyone. I'm off to bed. Apr 09 05:11:21 night Apr 09 05:11:26 <^Jsn> night Apr 09 05:16:07 There was an unusual problem serving the requested URL '/cgi-bin/w3cam.cgi'. Apr 09 05:16:15 i love unusual problems Apr 09 05:16:59 ah, so different than the usual problems they have Apr 09 05:42:25 [1] Somebody stole the video device, lets hope we got his picture: Invalid argument Apr 09 05:42:31 thieves! Apr 09 05:48:59 Just a quick q, does incorrectly setting up a program for dBUS (I don't mean in code but by modification of desktop file & making dbus service file) make dbus quit the program after a min? Apr 09 05:49:26 I think I've heard something like that before Apr 09 05:49:38 ...something about the name of the program not matching everywhere Apr 09 05:50:06 Goes, I've been quickly hacking XMMS, but I got what I wanted without dbus. I think I'll just remove it. Apr 09 05:50:11 Thanks, btw. Apr 09 05:50:53 hacking xmms? Apr 09 05:51:01 works ok here, with LANG=C Apr 09 05:51:07 Yep, I got the desktop icon to display ;) Apr 09 05:51:26 when i reinstalled latest version it displayd here Apr 09 05:51:59 I mean so you can task switch :), I don't think thats ever appeared on the maemo port unless you use non-matchbox wm Apr 09 05:52:15 brb, a sec Apr 09 05:54:01 Like this: http://i27.tinypic.com/213gidh.png :) Apr 09 05:54:22 (Yes, I am aware at the lack of tracks but that's because I store them on my W810 :D) Apr 09 05:54:48 erm Apr 09 05:55:02 task switch? xmms hides in the corner and doesn't get in your way Apr 09 05:55:11 that's the beauty of it. leave the playlist up and minimized Apr 09 05:55:17 and you can always see the song title Apr 09 05:55:30 i put it above the applet bar usually Apr 09 05:55:44 did you see the beautiful japanese valley KotCzarny ? Apr 09 05:55:57 pupnik: you mean that vid? Apr 09 05:56:00 But once you minimise, without xmmsctrl or kciconsbox, you cannot restore it. I prefer to keep it fully minimised and able to brought back when I wish Apr 09 05:56:01 yea Apr 09 05:56:17 i started to watch it Apr 09 05:56:23 yeah that's nice. if you could post how you did it qwerty12 that'd be useful Apr 09 05:56:24 then i saw 3 fat chicks Apr 09 05:56:36 http://camera.myohoji.or.jp:60001/ViewerFrame?Mode=Refresh&Resolution=640x480&Quality=Clarity&Interval=30&Size=STD&PresetOperation=Move&Language=4 Apr 09 05:56:38 no fat chicks Apr 09 05:56:53 gettin dark there now Apr 09 05:57:02 pupnik, I plan to on ITT, the thing is, I didn't really make any changes to XMMS... Apr 09 05:57:05 ah. nature. yes i saw it Apr 09 05:57:26 qwerty: i plan on making desktop applet for minimized icons Apr 09 05:57:28 :) Apr 09 05:57:33 Nice :) Apr 09 05:57:45 but it's on 'planned' list Apr 09 05:57:59 kciconsbox was a testcase if it's even possible Apr 09 05:58:27 I find it v.useful, I just run from one of the many launcher applets I have Apr 09 05:58:47 pity it's python Apr 09 05:59:02 i will redo it in raw xlib ;) Apr 09 05:59:13 but it won't be that nice anymore Apr 09 05:59:17 But I notice, I only get minimised icon if I enable show window manager decorations. Apr 09 05:59:21 but will load faster :) Apr 09 05:59:24 If it works better, go for it :P :) Apr 09 05:59:43 qwerty: but with decorations it's getting big Apr 09 06:01:24 Sizewise? or codewise? Apr 09 06:01:32 sizewise Apr 09 06:01:47 i like it when it doesn't take whole screen for itself Apr 09 06:01:56 so i can keep it over my session of mahjonng Apr 09 06:01:57 ;) Apr 09 06:02:12 True :), that actually reminds me of another hack I did ;) Apr 09 06:17:24 hello Nickserv Apr 09 06:20:51 hahaha someone made a usb game controller that shocks the player Apr 09 06:21:02 fun.. Apr 09 06:21:11 sounds like a sex toy for pervs Apr 09 06:21:18 lol, wouldn't want to lose in that game >.< Apr 09 06:22:10 hmm, using mencoder to grab a frame from camera is an overkill, right? Apr 09 06:22:49 is the camera exposed through v4l? Apr 09 06:22:53 err..it depends on if you already have it Apr 09 06:22:58 yes Apr 09 06:22:59 s/it/mplayer/g Apr 09 06:22:59 johnx meant: err..mplayer depends on if you already have mplayer Apr 09 06:23:02 but i see misc errors Apr 09 06:23:06 can i mplayer the camera device? Apr 09 06:23:07 while trying to use it Apr 09 06:23:16 yes Apr 09 06:23:19 cmd line? Apr 09 06:23:22 yes Apr 09 06:23:28 what is it? Apr 09 06:23:57 mplayer tv:// -tv driver=v4l2:width=176:height=144:device=/dev/video0 Apr 09 06:25:00 hmm mine says mplayer was compiled without tv interface support Apr 09 06:25:13 then compile it with it Apr 09 06:25:18 or use my binary Apr 09 06:25:19 :) Apr 09 06:25:27 pupnik, there's a v4l build already available Apr 09 06:25:35 on garage? Apr 09 06:25:41 where 2 download? Apr 09 06:25:44 this could be fun Apr 09 06:26:07 on a blog somewhere, but KotCzarny's got a build too on his site Apr 09 06:27:09 Here's one build I saw : http://blog.locationist.net/2008/03/19/usb-otg-goes-webcam/ Apr 09 06:28:10 tty Apr 09 06:29:11 Np, I would assume KotCzarny's build is here http://mrrau.dyndns.org:23280/n800/mpu_h/mplayer.bz2 :P (?) Apr 09 06:29:36 hmm, i think it's a build with gst enabled Apr 09 06:29:49 my bad >.< Apr 09 06:30:01 i have made new dir Apr 09 06:30:03 binaries Apr 09 06:31:34 /n800/binaries/ Apr 09 06:31:38 to be exact Apr 09 06:31:39 :) Apr 09 06:32:08 Nice :), I quite enjoy looking through your N800 dir :D Apr 09 06:32:19 it's a mess. Apr 09 06:32:22 :) Apr 09 06:32:32 Even better :p Apr 09 06:33:06 aa-lib isn't available?! Apr 09 06:33:09 unthinkable! Apr 09 06:33:18 hmm Apr 09 06:33:19 you should have told me that it wouldn't work with stock mplayer Apr 09 06:33:26 before giving me a command line that didn't work Apr 09 06:33:44 is there a way to add debian sources repository and no binary ? Apr 09 06:33:46 <- not amused Apr 09 06:33:54 pupnik: stock? what do you call 'stock' Apr 09 06:33:55 ;) Apr 09 06:34:15 I call it Bundyo's build ;) Apr 09 06:34:27 pupnik: 'stock' mplayer doesn't include mencoder too, though it's very simple to build it Apr 09 06:34:35 and probably you have one on your nokia :) Apr 09 06:38:01 * unixSnob just downloaded the rx-34_2008SE...._ARM.bin Apr 09 06:38:10 what do I do with this thing? Apr 09 06:38:25 Flash it? Apr 09 06:38:31 unixsnob: burn on cd and keep in as an enchant Apr 09 06:38:54 Lol, unixSnob , are you on windows or linux? Apr 09 06:39:11 qwerty: do you remember problem you had yesterday? Apr 09 06:39:33 Not really, but I do recall not knowing how to flash under Linux Apr 09 06:39:39 I'm on OS/X, but have windows and linux at my disposal Apr 09 06:39:44 another one Apr 09 06:40:01 unixsnob: you can flash on device itself Apr 09 06:40:09 KotCzarny, I'm not sure what you are on about. Apr 09 06:40:10 IMB OS/X ? :P Apr 09 06:40:19 KotCzarny, the whole bin image? Apr 09 06:40:26 hmm Apr 09 06:40:33 ok, scratch this Apr 09 06:40:34 :) Apr 09 06:40:43 it's late already :) Apr 09 06:40:48 unixSnob, http://www.internettablettalk.com/wiki/index.php?title=Flashing_OS2008_With_Mac_OS_X_%28Console%29 Apr 09 06:41:55 KotCzarny, :), 7:41 AM here and I am really tired. Apr 09 06:42:03 * qwerty12 yawns Apr 09 06:42:31 i like the idea of flashing on the device itself Apr 09 06:42:48 You can only flash initfs or kernel on device. Apr 09 06:43:14 probably rootfs too, but only in rescue mode Apr 09 06:43:38 where are you qwerty? it's 2:30 in the US (east) Apr 09 06:43:39 and after finding a way to unpack that bin Apr 09 06:43:52 unixSnob, London Apr 09 06:44:41 unixSnob, it wont matter in a month or two. Apr 09 06:45:07 * qwerty12 wants to add to the suspense Apr 09 06:45:54 why is that? Apr 09 06:46:15 SSU Apr 09 06:46:17 I was considering updating because a couple things I've tried to install have out of date dependancies Apr 09 06:46:29 Because of this: http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/3/3a/Diablo_Coverart.png :O Apr 09 06:46:42 SSU? Apr 09 06:47:17 see-through summer underwear...or seamless software upgrade Apr 09 06:47:22 one of those is a feature of diable... Apr 09 06:47:29 s/le/lo/g Apr 09 06:47:30 johnx meant: one of those is a feature of diablo... Apr 09 06:47:34 http://www.internettablettalk.com/2008/04/01/its-official-n810-wimax-announced/ Apr 09 06:47:42 or SSU, Suppressed Students United Apr 09 06:47:42 System upgrades will be done through Application manager. Apr 09 06:47:51 Want to let John Yoo know what you think of him? I found two email addresses for him: jyoo@law.berkeley.edu and yoo@law.berkeley.edu. A better tactic would be to let the Dean's office at the law school know what you think of Yoo teaching there--no email listed but phone #: 510-642-6483. Apr 09 06:47:51 ssu sounds like portage, kinda Apr 09 06:48:04 So it will go out and get dependancies automatically? Apr 09 06:48:08 Uh Apr 09 06:48:08 or any decent apt frontend Apr 09 06:48:10 It already does that. Apr 09 06:48:23 pupnik ? Apr 09 06:48:26 We have apt. Apr 09 06:48:32 Application manager is just GUI front-end for apt. Apr 09 06:48:56 The change is mostly that Nokia will be pushing updates "over-the-air" rather than with FIASCO images. Apr 09 06:48:58 it would be like portage if it dragged in a dev env and compiled things on your tablet Apr 09 06:49:06 which would be endlessly amusing :) Apr 09 06:49:15 pupnik, ? + 1 Apr 09 06:50:32 darn. Apr 09 06:50:40 most of the apps are for v4l1 Apr 09 06:54:52 f****n kernel panics Apr 09 06:54:58 :> Apr 09 06:55:05 on desktop or tablet? Apr 09 06:55:23 Desktop, probably because I have to use ndiswrapper Apr 09 06:55:44 ah, emulated windows drivers in kernel space always seemed like bad ju-ju to me Apr 09 06:55:58 compromises.. Apr 09 06:56:25 I don't have a choice :(. TI made closed stuff for the tablet and they made closed stuff for my wifi stick. Apr 09 06:56:30 A binary blob is a compromise...emulating another OS to load drivers is asking for trouble Apr 09 06:57:01 I gave up buying the cheapest I could find a long time ago, now I check compatiblity before purchasing Apr 09 06:57:10 Mac users have been doing it for years... Apr 09 06:57:27 Hehe Apr 09 06:57:39 I used to (and still do :p) use Windows, Linux compatibility never really mattered at the time :( Apr 09 06:57:40 mac users pay double for the same hardware just with different firmware Apr 09 06:57:41 It's not a particularly hard decision. Apr 09 06:58:08 except with Linux there's usually a lottery. "If I buy the cheapest thing maybe it will work anyways Apr 09 06:58:10 It's either generic shit like RAM or hard drives that just works, or graphics cards that are all labelled appropriately. :D Apr 09 06:58:14 morning Apr 09 06:58:17 KotCzarny, , Now now, we all know that there's a smaller market :P Apr 09 06:58:19 morning Apr 09 06:59:56 Well since I have the .bin file, I might as well update. How do I do this on the device itself? Apr 09 07:00:05 You don't. Apr 09 07:00:11 That only works for kernel and initfs. Apr 09 07:00:34 ah, okay.. I'll use the mac flasher then Apr 09 07:00:46 See the link I pasted above. Apr 09 07:02:20 what's the name of the repos site? I'm at maemo.org and can't read the repos on there because it renders all the text on top of itself Apr 09 07:02:28 gronmayer.com/it Apr 09 07:02:43 thanks Apr 09 07:03:54 will this file work on the n800 => RX-34_2008SE_2.2007.51-3_PR_COMBINED_MR0_ARM.bin ? Apr 09 07:04:08 just want to make sure I'm not about to brick it w/ the wrong file Apr 09 07:04:40 yeah, that sounds right. Apr 09 07:04:45 it shouldn't flash if it's wrong Apr 09 07:04:55 I'm running .50-2, going to upgrade to .51-3 Apr 09 07:04:58 you grabbed it from the N800 section of tablets-dev Apr 09 07:05:07 right? Apr 09 07:05:12 uhhh... changelog I think is what I'm looking for Apr 09 07:05:14 naw, bittorrent Apr 09 07:05:22 lol Apr 09 07:05:30 hachi, it's just the bootloader Apr 09 07:05:35 hachi, the only fix was the power-on/off some people were having Apr 09 07:05:45 dangit Apr 09 07:06:14 That's what I meant to do Apr 09 07:06:16 I'm puzzled why OS2008 has version numbers that are all 2007 Apr 09 07:06:21 * GeneralAntilles updates the wiki article to latest firmware. Apr 09 07:06:26 It's the build date, hachi. Apr 09 07:06:40 think about model-years for cars :) Apr 09 07:06:43 I upgraded in january Apr 09 07:06:52 why isn't this one 2008 yet? Apr 09 07:06:56 release.year.week-buildnumber Apr 09 07:06:59 oh, like for cars Apr 09 07:07:26 when you say the on/off some people were having Apr 09 07:07:36 I have mine sometimes get into an uknown state Apr 09 07:07:39 sometimes it wouldn't turn on when off Apr 09 07:07:40 like it has 'locked up' Apr 09 07:07:45 oh Apr 09 07:07:47 So, 50-2 is release 2 of OS2008, and the 2nd of the 50th week of 2007 Apr 09 07:08:04 hachi, you'd know if you had the problem. Apr 09 07:08:20 yeah, I obviously have a different problem Apr 09 07:08:31 where my maemo will spontaneously reboot after hanging for a minute Apr 09 07:08:32 and 51-3 was the software as it was on the 51st week of 2007, except with a fixed bootloader Apr 09 07:08:51 that's the watchdog kicking in after something else hangs or dies Apr 09 07:08:56 It's when the FIASCO image was built. Apr 09 07:09:05 probably an app you have is taking up all the memory or something Apr 09 07:09:57 maybe I'm better off with virtual memory turned off Apr 09 07:10:22 that might help if your card is having problems Apr 09 07:10:23 Only if your internal card is corrupted. Apr 09 07:10:46 or if ITOS doesn't play nice with it Apr 09 07:11:29 WTH Apr 09 07:11:47 http://www.internettablettalk.com/wiki/index.php?title=Flashing_OS2008_With_Mac_OS_X_%28Console%29 Apr 09 07:11:59 Somebody want to try changing 50-2 to 51-3 (2 instances) on there for me? Apr 09 07:12:05 It's throwing an error when I try and submit the edit. :\ Apr 09 07:12:41 There are no 50-2 's on that page Apr 09 07:12:47 yup, 51-3 here as well Apr 09 07:12:48 They all changed to 51-3 Apr 09 07:12:52 I bet it updated anyways Apr 09 07:13:03 So it actually submitted but decided to arbitrarily throw an error? Apr 09 07:13:05 Awesome. Apr 09 07:13:25 heh...when I was writing the Debian HOWTO thing it logged me out after every submit :) Apr 09 07:13:35 * unixSnob wonders if he'll have to reconfigure all his RSS feeds after flashing Apr 09 07:13:42 Shouldn't Apr 09 07:13:47 as long as you restore a good backup. Apr 09 07:14:04 backup? what backup? Apr 09 07:14:06 hahaha Apr 09 07:14:19 I thought that was installing OS X onto a n8x0 Apr 09 07:14:30 * doc|home goes to wash self - feels dirty Apr 09 07:14:41 yes, you'll need to reinstall all your apps as well then Apr 09 07:14:43 ah.. found the backup tool.. I should use that! Apr 09 07:14:51 Yes Apr 09 07:14:57 maemo-mapper is not installed by default on N810? Apr 09 07:14:58 OS2008's backup is quite effective. Apr 09 07:15:08 Duh Apr 09 07:15:11 mbuf, no Apr 09 07:15:27 it's a 3rd party program Apr 09 07:15:31 Good thing, too, because it'd have to comply with the UI spec if it were. :D Apr 09 07:15:39 the Nokia "Maps" app is installed though Apr 09 07:15:43 johnx, i see Apr 09 07:15:50 s/"Maps"/"Map"/g Apr 09 07:16:00 johnx, yes, i was able to mount it from USB-connect Apr 09 07:16:42 Backing up is effective but I can't say the same about restoring applications using it though :/ Apr 09 07:17:05 Meh Apr 09 07:17:06 It works fine Apr 09 07:17:17 It's just that Application manager likes to crash a lot Apr 09 07:17:23 and .deb-installed stuff are problematic Apr 09 07:17:37 and you need to be sure to reenable Extras Apr 09 07:17:58 True :(, any chance of a new application manager in Diablo? Apr 09 07:18:15 Definitely Apr 09 07:18:20 I got Smart to run on the N800 but I can't install anything with it, just remove. Apr 09 07:18:21 How do you think they're gonna deploy SSU? Apr 09 07:18:23 Nice :) Apr 09 07:18:33 A fair number of issues are already fixed in svn Apr 09 07:19:25 Hmm, is it "safe" to package an application manager deb and install it on my device? Apr 09 07:19:50 It's just a frontend Apr 09 07:19:54 so there shouldn't be any issues. Apr 09 07:20:02 At worst you can fall-back to apt until Diablo rolls around. Apr 09 07:20:35 Or advance-guns-a-blazin' depending on your point of view. :D Apr 09 07:20:57 Ok, I'll try it out, thanks. I really hate the application manager. Apr 09 07:21:16 didn't work.... Apr 09 07:21:20 uitable USB device not found, waiting Apr 09 07:21:21 USB device found found at bus 002, device address 002-0421-0105-02-00 Apr 09 07:21:21 Error claiming USB interface: Unknown error: 0 Apr 09 07:21:32 how can i enter the "|" symbol in the N810? Apr 09 07:21:35 sudo Apr 09 07:21:47 i did sudo Apr 09 07:22:03 udo ./flasher-2.0.macosx -F ./RX-34_2008SE_2.2007.51-3_PR_COMBINED_MR0_ARM.bin -f -R Apr 09 07:22:06 that was the command Apr 09 07:22:22 Erm Apr 09 07:22:24 s/udo/sudo/ Apr 09 07:22:32 Did you start the device up correctly? Apr 09 07:22:48 held the house icon, while pressing power Apr 09 07:22:57 USB icon in the upper right? Apr 09 07:22:58 I see the little usb icon in the top right Apr 09 07:23:02 Huh Apr 09 07:23:02 mbuf: either modify the xkb config for a permanent (and imho better) solution or press "Chr" and select it from the bar Apr 09 07:23:03 Weird Apr 09 07:23:09 What Mac? Apr 09 07:23:19 uh oh Apr 09 07:23:22 hackintosh Apr 09 07:23:35 Ha Apr 09 07:23:38 lol Apr 09 07:23:46 yeah yeah.. i deserve it Apr 09 07:23:47 That seems likely to cause trouble. Apr 09 07:23:54 Try a different USB port? Apr 09 07:24:00 k Apr 09 07:24:11 should I power down the device first? Apr 09 07:24:18 or just boot a linux live cd if you need to Apr 09 07:24:20 Hrm Apr 09 07:24:25 Shouldn't need to Apr 09 07:24:27 but might as well Apr 09 07:24:34 I have a redhat box on hand too Apr 09 07:24:41 http://bleb.org/software/maemo/770Flasher-2.0.dmg Apr 09 07:24:44 Maybe try that Apr 09 07:24:47 but unlikely to help Apr 09 07:24:56 Probably better off just jumping over to Linux. ;) Apr 09 07:26:46 http://www.enigmacurry.com/2008/01/09/ron-paul-on-the-dollar-gold-and-oil/ Apr 09 07:26:47 hehe Apr 09 07:32:22 The ITT wiki has instructions for the mac and windows flasher.. nothing on linux Apr 09 07:32:31 http://www.internettablettalk.com/wiki/index.php?title=Main_Page#System Apr 09 07:32:38 unixsnob: maemo.org Apr 09 07:32:56 It's exactly the same as the OS X instructions Apr 09 07:33:09 just different flasher name and you may not need to sudo Apr 09 07:33:10 nice Apr 09 07:33:20 http://maemo.org/maemowiki/HOWTO_FlashLatestNokiaImageWithLinux Apr 09 07:40:09 i downloaded the staticly linked flasher.. i don't trust whatever libraries are on my old RH9 system Apr 09 07:44:31 pupnik: http://www.enigmacurry.com/2007/11/16/fbi-raids-liberty-dollar-hq/ Apr 09 07:45:14 yes i saw that. There may be a case to be made against them. Apr 09 07:46:12 damn.. no good on linux box either.. I get unable to enumerate USB buses Apr 09 07:46:24 Check your BIOS settings? Apr 09 07:46:25 and "lsusb" doesn't list anything useful Apr 09 07:47:11 check cables? Apr 09 07:47:20 I might have to do that. The usb bus worked a long time ago.. but now when I plug in USB drives, I get 'not a valid block device' or something like that when I mount Apr 09 07:47:33 So I think there's just something screwed up with the usb port or drivers Apr 09 07:47:47 I wouldn't say drivers Apr 09 07:47:56 Morning, all Apr 09 07:48:02 I would say BIOS settings or the usb bus Apr 09 07:48:05 Morning Apr 09 07:48:35 Either way, I wouldn't recommend flashing with that computer unless you can be sure that the USB is working fine Apr 09 07:48:51 can anyone post their sources.list for extra repos for the N810? Apr 09 07:51:35 usb functionality is enabled, but legacy support is not Apr 09 07:52:00 I don't think legacy matters, I think mine is disabled Apr 09 07:52:19 but I guess it cannot hurt any more to turn it on? Apr 09 07:52:49 Also check for any bios updates, I had to update my bios to fix usb bugs so my hackint0sh would boot Apr 09 07:54:05 well, I still have a windows box to try.. and I haven't done anything funny with it. It's a Dell.. practically stock. Apr 09 07:56:52 unixSnob: under linux: maybe need to mount /proc/bus/usb (deprecated), run as root Apr 09 07:57:38 what would the command be? I think mounting procs is kinda different than drivespace, correct? Apr 09 07:58:43 apps can use /proc/bus/usb to poke at the usb subsystem Apr 09 07:59:44 I think you're on to something there.. at the end of my lsusb command, I get: cannot open /proc/bus/usb Apr 09 07:59:51 but I'm not sure how to mount it Apr 09 08:00:02 mount non /proc/bus/usb ?\ Apr 09 08:00:14 s/usb ?\/usb/ Apr 09 08:00:15 johnx meant: mount non /proc/bus/usb Apr 09 08:00:33 fail Apr 09 08:00:34 :) Apr 09 08:00:46 bleh :P Apr 09 08:00:49 mount: you must specify file system type Apr 09 08:01:10 i think there's a switch needed Apr 09 08:01:29 grep usb /etc/fstab Apr 09 08:01:29 I recall from installing gentoo that mounting procs were a little different than drives Apr 09 08:02:24 yeah, it's not mounted here, and I don't know the type Apr 09 08:02:25 /dev/sda1 /mnt/usb vfat .... Apr 09 08:02:34 That was for a usb drive I used to mount Apr 09 08:02:50 unixsnob: mount -t usbfs none /proc/bus/usb Apr 09 08:02:57 thanks, KotCzarny Apr 09 08:03:19 unles you're on 2.4 Apr 09 08:03:21 ;) Apr 09 08:03:26 *unless Apr 09 08:03:53 i think i'm on 2.4 actually.. RH9 Apr 09 08:04:05 try usbdevfs Apr 09 08:04:07 uname -r Apr 09 08:04:11 yeah, 2.4xxxsmp Apr 09 08:04:15 grep usb /proc/filesystems Apr 09 08:04:24 will the flasher even work on 2.4? Apr 09 08:04:43 maybe Apr 09 08:05:00 we will find out soon Apr 09 08:05:01 :) Apr 09 08:05:06 I think you can better try to use 0xffff as you can compile that one yourself. Apr 09 08:05:15 History is about to be made Apr 09 08:05:19 x-fade: can 0xffff flash rootfs? Apr 09 08:05:32 from .bin ? Apr 09 08:05:34 :) Apr 09 08:05:40 KotCzarny, yes Apr 09 08:05:44 It can do the same as the regular flasher.. Apr 09 08:05:52 on running system? Apr 09 08:05:53 :) Apr 09 08:06:04 grep usb /proc/filesystems yields nothing Apr 09 08:06:04 he should drop into initfs Apr 09 08:06:06 i believe Apr 09 08:06:18 Well, no but that is what you use mtdtools foor? Apr 09 08:06:29 KotCzarny, it's from the desktop Apr 09 08:06:31 x-fade: but mtsblock4 is MOUNTED rw.. Apr 09 08:06:32 s/foor/for/ Apr 09 08:06:33 X-Fade meant: Well, no but that is what you use mtdtools for? Apr 09 08:06:40 mtdblock Apr 09 08:07:00 KotCzarny: Ah, I thought you were running from sd. Apr 09 08:07:03 :) Apr 09 08:07:13 KotCzarny, you're confused. 0xffff is used from the desktop to flash over usb Apr 09 08:07:22 no, i'm not confised Apr 09 08:07:29 I think he means it could be compiled for initfs though? Apr 09 08:07:33 ah, ok...nevermind, side conversation then Apr 09 08:07:37 yes Apr 09 08:07:38 :) Apr 09 08:07:56 mount -t usbfs none /proc/bus/usb <= results in "mount point /proc/bus/usb does not exist" Apr 09 08:08:13 KotCzarny, That's quite a nice idea but flashing bin flashes initfs too >.< unless 0xffetc has a option not to flash initfs? Apr 09 08:08:28 qwerty, but initfs is mount readonly Apr 09 08:08:35 so it won't hurt that much Apr 09 08:08:37 :) Apr 09 08:08:46 assuming nothing will fail Apr 09 08:08:48 Oh :) Apr 09 08:09:10 *mounted Apr 09 08:09:45 johnx, hum, i have thought 0xFFFF is ran on device itself.. Apr 09 08:09:59 because there's -C mtd-dev switch Apr 09 08:10:21 so, you were confused? :P Apr 09 08:10:31 yes, but also side conversed Apr 09 08:10:37 ah, ok Apr 09 08:10:40 i have never used 0xffff Apr 09 08:11:12 0xffhhaa FOREVAAAA Apr 09 08:11:44 unixsnob, you know what would be faster? Apr 09 08:11:52 download some small livecd Apr 09 08:11:56 ;) Apr 09 08:12:07 or flash from windows Apr 09 08:12:16 he doesn't have windows Apr 09 08:12:21 unixsnob, you know what would be better? Apr 09 08:12:27 Upgrading to Fedora :p Apr 09 08:12:34 rh is rh Apr 09 08:12:36 i do Apr 09 08:12:38 KotCzarny, he says he has linux, windows & Macosx Apr 09 08:12:43 no matter what name you give it Apr 09 08:12:45 :) Apr 09 08:12:48 i'm working on windows right now.. need .net 2.0 Apr 09 08:12:53 oh Apr 09 08:13:07 so i missed something in the conversation too Apr 09 08:13:08 :) Apr 09 08:13:37 that .net crap is a 23 MB download Apr 09 08:13:53 I think 3.0 is out too :P Apr 09 08:14:25 i see 3.5, actually Apr 09 08:14:43 That means I need an upgrade :p Apr 09 08:15:56 i'll be pissed if I have to download a service pack too Apr 09 08:16:08 guess I'd boot a live cd before I do that Apr 09 08:17:00 Nah, if you have at least SP1, you should be fine Apr 09 08:17:35 i think it said sp2 was needed.. i'll know soon Apr 09 08:25:02 actually I have sp2.. so there won't be an issue there Apr 09 08:32:08 the update takes 20 minutes! wtf Apr 09 08:32:13 I dont' believe it Apr 09 08:32:15 usb1 ? Apr 09 08:32:16 :) Apr 09 08:32:38 Maybe downloading the update over the internet? Apr 09 08:32:55 <|zeus|> yep Apr 09 08:32:58 it took me less than 2 min using file from hard drive usb 2 Apr 09 08:33:00 i hope it lets me use the bin file i already downloaded Apr 09 08:33:07 <|zeus|> downloading it's slowest part Apr 09 08:33:10 just select, update from file Apr 09 08:33:16 You can do before you flash, choose browse Apr 09 08:33:23 too late? Apr 09 08:33:24 :) Apr 09 08:33:44 <|zeus|> flashing tooks less than a minute on linux :) Apr 09 08:33:51 Hehe, if its still downloading, I take it out :P Apr 09 08:35:43 it let me specify the file to grab.. and it even took a samba location Apr 09 08:35:51 so it's going quick Apr 09 08:36:32 * unixSnob prays Apr 09 08:36:43 * unixSnob cheers Apr 09 08:39:57 guess there haven't been any recent developments.. I've had this bin file for a while now, and it's still current Apr 09 08:41:54 nice.. Krispy Kremes has a promo.. buy a dozen, get a dozen free Apr 09 08:50:31 are there any issues of using Google maps API for community-based, not-for-profit use/service? or what are the drawbacks of Google Maps API? Apr 09 09:03:08 hello X-Fade Apr 09 09:03:58 can you send me invitation to commit to the repository. Apr 09 09:04:26 opendeep@garage.maemo.org Apr 09 09:13:46 Has anyone tried the ipv6 support for N800 that was mentioned on ITT. I had to recompile my kernel for it but I cant test it as my router doesn't support it. Apr 09 09:15:54 nice! RSS feeds were restored Apr 09 09:15:56 I compiled IPv6 supprt for OS2008 couple of months ago. the problem is that I screwed up something and the internal memory card of n810 was no longer available :-) Apr 09 09:16:16 Nice! web links were restored Apr 09 09:16:17 I'll have to fix that once I have the time Apr 09 09:16:42 :), I don't know if N810 handles internal card differently but both my cards are working :) Apr 09 09:17:14 The only thing is that I used the patch for an old kernel, so I had to keep going back to restore files. Not good stuff on my part. Apr 09 09:18:13 The howto says "If you have the X Terminal installed, you can verify that the tablet is IPv6 enabled by checking if the following command succeeds: Apr 09 09:18:13 cat /proc/net/if_inet6 Apr 09 09:18:13 ". I run that command and I get something back so I assume it worked :p Apr 09 09:22:36 wow.. backup even recovered my gizmo account Apr 09 09:23:17 IIRC it recovers everything in /home/user/ but I'm not completely sure... Apr 09 09:23:39 I dont think so. You have to write config files for the stuff to be backup afaik Apr 09 09:23:53 *backed up Apr 09 09:35:34 is there a way to flash the OS2008 so that it drops the language dependencies? Only need English, so Spanish, French, German etc dependencies are superfluous Apr 09 09:35:49 nope Apr 09 09:36:04 maybe you can remove them manually once it's installed Apr 09 09:36:09 I don't think so unless you want to do some serious status hacking but you can use localepurge Apr 09 09:36:33 ok, i'll check out localepurge Apr 09 09:39:53 does localepurge just remove files from /usr/share/locale? Apr 09 09:40:44 I think so but it has the added advantage of running after each deb install and you should see the amount you would have to remove by hand... Apr 09 09:41:30 ah ok. Apr 09 09:43:00 anyone install rtcomm and have problems? I got a warning from the installer saying that it's likely to install something that wil damage the system Apr 09 09:43:16 it has a little more weight that the usual warning Apr 09 09:43:26 Some people say that is messing up hildon but I've installed it fine. Apr 09 09:43:29 At your own risk :P Apr 09 09:43:37 Or you could use pidgin Apr 09 09:43:38 so I opted to live dangerously Apr 09 09:43:48 *hildon-desktop Apr 09 09:44:05 will pidgin support SIP voip? Apr 09 09:44:10 Got a backup handy? :P Apr 09 09:44:14 yeah Apr 09 09:44:16 I don't think so come think of it Apr 09 09:45:13 it failed to install.. error was not specific Apr 09 09:45:38 Check the log from tools Apr 09 09:46:43 the log simply says hildon-application-manager 2.02 Apr 09 09:47:26 anyway, i give up for now.. it's not important Apr 09 09:47:41 damn it's almost 6 am.. didn't sleep yet Apr 09 09:47:47 i'm outta here Apr 09 09:48:00 Lol, 10 am here :P Apr 09 09:48:01 Bye# Apr 09 09:52:44 Any experinces: what is the most challenging thing for a Windows/Symbian developer to start using Linux/POSIX libraries and/or GNU/Eclipse etc... Apr 09 09:53:25 new api's i guess Apr 09 09:53:35 keyboard shortcuts :) Apr 09 09:53:53 sibbe: symbian dev would quite likely have used eclipse based carbide already Apr 09 09:54:48 hi all Apr 09 09:56:23 I'm new to maemo and I'm trying to understand if it is possible to sync evolution addressbook and calendar with a maemo device like nokia n810 Apr 09 09:56:25 tnx! Apr 09 10:02:31 vds: by default maemo do not have calendar at all Apr 09 10:02:56 so there is nothing to sync with Apr 09 10:06:15 hrw interesting Apr 09 10:06:16 thanks Apr 09 10:08:45 is there another "better" programm simmilar to sketch for maemo OS2008 ? Apr 09 10:08:58 mtpaint? Apr 09 10:09:03 xournal? Apr 09 10:09:06 mypaint, xournal Apr 09 10:09:09 too late lo Apr 09 10:09:13 *lol Apr 09 10:29:02 http://www.usbgeek.com/prod_detail.php?prod_id=0788 Apr 09 10:45:33 hello, someone uses a n800 for gps tracking or listening music while jogging? Apr 09 10:45:53 Cptnodegard: Did you try out that cable? Apr 09 10:45:59 i think, how i can transport the n800 while jogging Apr 09 10:46:00 eichi, the latter Apr 09 10:46:07 I just shove it in a pocket Apr 09 10:46:37 there are belt-clip cases too, if that's your kinda thing Apr 09 10:46:39 its damn big and heavy for doing sport Apr 09 10:46:57 ooh, a belt clip mount for n800 Apr 09 10:47:02 aren't there? Apr 09 10:47:08 a tablet would make a nifty belt-buckle Apr 09 10:47:11 * johnx hopes he's not making things up Apr 09 10:47:42 yup, they exist :) Apr 09 10:47:51 but, I'm 190cm tall and have pants with big pockets, so it's not an issue for me Apr 09 10:49:09 i use this http://www.troph-e-shop.com/produkte/images/41.136301.jpg regularly, there is my n800 mounted. but its no fixed enaught for running, jogging Apr 09 10:49:45 Hello! Anybody knows where I can get the source code of the flasher-3.0 program? Apr 09 10:50:01 you can't, it's closed source Apr 09 10:50:06 oops :( Apr 09 10:50:07 but there is an open source flasher Apr 09 10:50:10 aha Apr 09 10:50:11 ha ha Apr 09 10:50:29 there must be something very near the body and very fixed Apr 09 10:50:35 0xffff the open flasher is here: http://www.nopcode.org/0xFFFF/ Apr 09 10:50:51 is there something like flasher-3.0 but for windows? Apr 09 10:50:58 he he he he he he he he he he he he he he he he he he he he he he he he he he he he he he he he he he he he he he he he he he he he he he he he he he he he he he he he Apr 09 10:51:04 zap, no Apr 09 10:51:16 johnx: thank you Apr 09 10:54:35 <]-[andful_of_not> mbuf: No :) Apr 09 10:57:40 what are police there for really(i am sure more than half is not enforcing governmental laws)? how to get on the side of the police when encountered? should i pay money to the police/tip whenever they shows up or in advance? Apr 09 11:02:21 good morning Apr 09 11:26:21 Hi ! Apr 09 11:26:51 Someone know how time this take for a package to be accepted in the extras repository ? Apr 09 11:35:27 Hi! Apr 09 11:38:29 hi Spakman Apr 09 11:41:08 Hi Spakman Apr 09 11:42:27 * b0unc3 good morning Apr 09 11:45:10 hello X-Fade Apr 09 11:50:19 Any ideas how I can get the MAC address of the wlan base station? Apr 09 11:51:12 theres usually stickers on them Apr 09 11:51:39 or you can get them from the web config which it probably has Apr 09 11:51:49 I need to know it using software after I have connected to it :) Apr 09 11:51:55 kulve: install wirelesstools package, then you have "iwconfig" Apr 09 11:51:58 iwconfig? Apr 09 11:52:38 then just awk it out :) Apr 09 11:52:53 too bad it's not installed by default :/ Apr 09 11:53:08 maybe I can use some ioctl that does the same as the iwconfig.. Apr 09 11:53:59 kulve: Attach a bluetooth-controlled drone to the device that you can detach and fly to the basestation from your application and analyze the sticker from the video feed it sends back... Apr 09 11:54:38 kulve: ifconfig Apr 09 11:54:39 too complicated Apr 09 11:54:53 b0unc3: how? Apr 09 11:55:04 /sbin/ifconfig wlan0 Apr 09 11:55:13 hwaddr show your mac address Apr 09 11:55:22 that tells the MAC of my wlan device, not the one of the base station Apr 09 11:56:51 I'm trying to identify the network I'm in and I think the MAC address is the most suitable identification. SSID would be fine if most of the people wouldn't use "default" .. Apr 09 11:58:00 if i have an app which may want to change the ondemand cputhreshhold percentage factor (requires root permission) does it have to use a kernel module to do it, or can my app be added to the "sudoers" file as part of the standard installation? Apr 09 11:58:49 kulve: perhaps there's some dbus magic? Apr 09 11:58:55 ei: can a none root user install the package and have it able to change this factor (under users control) without them having to gainroot Apr 09 11:59:05 Someone know how time this take for a package to be accepted in the extras repository ? Apr 09 11:59:41 dunno khertan, how long have you been waiting? Apr 09 11:59:52 kulve: dmesg show the mac address of the ap when you connect to it Apr 09 12:00:06 Veggen: the ConIc API tells me the name, but I didn't see any MAC stuff in there.. Apr 09 12:00:43 b0unc3: so it seems. So the driver knows it. Now I just need to find the ioctl for getting it.. Apr 09 12:01:07 lcuk: you can modify the sudoers file at installation time... Apr 09 12:01:07 there should, most likely, be a system call that does it. try strace iwconfig and see? Apr 09 12:01:36 lcuk : not long is just to know where it ll be pushed to make .install available and announce the new release Apr 09 12:01:47 i ve scp it 30min ago ... Apr 09 12:02:40 (as i don't use the usual way to send package to extras and extras-devel (i use pypackager 0.7 from my nit instead of dput on scratchbox) Apr 09 12:03:23 (yes pypackager 0.7 should now be able to upload package to maemo repository) Apr 09 12:03:49 it s why i'm waiting to know if it works ... Apr 09 12:03:53 khertan, the repo should have a manual step - if it doesnt usually take this long its prob just got someone on dinner or something Apr 09 12:03:55 b0unc3, Apr 09 12:04:00 shat Apr 09 12:04:06 http://maemo.org/community/application-catalog/extras_repository.html Apr 09 12:04:09 lol Apr 09 12:04:25 b0unc3, doesnt updating the sudoers file require root itself? Apr 09 12:04:50 i hope it ll pass the three step : Apr 09 12:04:50 * Apr 09 12:04:51 first verify that the PGP/GPG signature of the package corresponds to the user's key Apr 09 12:04:51 * Apr 09 12:04:51 if the previous check was OK, then comes a light weight sanity check of the package. Apr 09 12:04:51 If the package survived these steps then it will be automatically processed and put to the extras repository. Apr 09 12:05:09 lcuk: yes, but not at installation time... Apr 09 12:05:37 ahhh, so the installer itself (apt-get? or the front end) already have sudoer rights? Apr 09 12:05:39 at install time application manager have root rights Apr 09 12:05:47 the front end Apr 09 12:05:54 yes Apr 09 12:06:11 apt-get need to be launch as root to be able to install something Apr 09 12:06:26 right - that makes sense then - so if i wanted to add a user selectable option to change ondemand it would be perfectly possible :) excellent news Apr 09 12:06:37 #define SIOCGIWAP 0x8B15 /* get access point MAC addresses */ Apr 09 12:06:40 maybe that.. Apr 09 12:07:27 Khertan, this is the best part of the package upload process: "first verify that the PGP/GPG signature of the package corresponds to the user's key" :) Apr 09 12:08:10 why is it hard to admit that i'm being bullied? Apr 09 12:08:15 though i do wonder what sanity checking is being done - i seem to recall its being tightened up and the install locations and categories are being tightened Apr 09 12:08:33 pleaseandthankyo, why are you being bullied Apr 09 12:08:47 or rather, is this an internet thing or rl Apr 09 12:20:35 How to add application to autostart in n800? Apr 09 12:21:36 You create an init.d -script for it Apr 09 12:21:51 for gui apps too? Apr 09 12:23:01 "first verify that the PGP/GPG signature of the package corresponds to the user's key" > yes ... the hard part as gnupg is really limited on tablet ... Apr 09 12:23:02 My firsts reaction would be "don't", but if it's for some special need, then yes Apr 09 12:23:10 -s Apr 09 12:25:19 for gps-camera; where is the file that contains the name of the file and longitude, latitude coordinates stored? "filename;latitude;longitude" is the syntax Apr 09 12:34:52 ok, it is in /home/user/MyDocs/.images/gpscamera Apr 09 12:42:14 inz: why not? Apr 09 12:42:36 inz: I tend to want to treat my n810 as a regular Linux machine. Apr 09 12:43:07 I know it's good to be careful, but it's a Linux system, that *should* be a perfectly ok thing to do. Apr 09 12:45:44 Veggen: that's why it's a bad idea. on a regular linux machine you won't be able to run X applications in a user context via init.d (as you have to login first etc.) Apr 09 12:46:12 hmmm then how wouldyou do it on a normal linux system? Apr 09 12:46:26 jott: oh. I see where I was wrong. Apr 09 12:46:44 usually you would use .xinitrc or something the desktop environment provides Apr 09 12:46:49 you'd do it in Xsession-stuff. If such a thing exists. Apr 09 12:47:15 .xinitrc/.xsession Apr 09 12:48:24 or start the thing via your desktop environment (if any) Apr 09 12:48:38 yep Apr 09 12:49:46 * jott passes unix onions around Apr 09 12:52:21 inz: but on the tablet, if there exists no support for .xinitrc og .xsession (dunno, perhaps strings on Xomap will reveal it?), an init.d-script that's run after x-server would do. Apr 09 12:53:30 what is the best way to implement a table data structure with GLib, GTK+? operations include sorting/searching on the table for Maemo Apr 09 12:58:39 mplayer is so awesome Apr 09 12:58:54 playng back google video flash, cpu 18-22% Apr 09 12:59:38 mbuf: perhaps you mean 'array' Apr 09 12:59:56 pupnik, am looking at GSequence now Apr 09 13:01:11 mplayer wins Apr 09 13:01:44 Veggen, mostly the "don't" meant that if you're creating a package for someone to install Apr 09 13:02:04 Veggen, then that someone probably doesn't like a program that bluntly starts every time your device boots up Apr 09 13:02:14 inz: mm, sure. Apr 09 13:02:38 or just create an status bar applet :) Apr 09 13:02:45 the hildon way, I guess, is to make a home desktop applet. Apr 09 13:03:02 yeah home/status Apr 09 13:03:02 Veggen: xinitrc or xsession is not matter of Xomap Apr 09 13:04:37 osso-software-version depends on pre-installed-{docs,sounds,video}. Who ARE those people? Apr 09 13:05:29 T0botras: nokia Apr 09 13:05:45 T0botras: and their 'we treat whole image as one package' way Apr 09 13:05:56 hrw: ouch Apr 09 13:06:34 Tobotras: thats part of why there are no system packages when new release came Apr 09 13:07:02 they just do not get it that there are people who are used to 'apt-get update;apt-get upgrade' way of installing updates Apr 09 13:07:16 my n810 is non backupable now Apr 09 13:09:01 oh lord. HSBC bank now has scripted pre-recorded telemarketers. the same 'voice' has called me twice in the last week, with the same line -- and when I interrupt saying "I think I spoke to you last week," someone in control over the voice/script would queue up alternate responses. Apr 09 13:09:16 not very fluidly. Apr 09 13:09:29 ehh Apr 09 13:14:37 fysa, isnt that just outsourced telecomms and a script and not very good english ocupled with a bad voip line? Apr 09 13:14:48 no, this is more responsive-- Apr 09 13:14:58 I would interrupt it, and it would immediately change according to my interruption. Apr 09 13:15:10 outsourced to scotland? (god i loved the accents of the ladies) Apr 09 13:15:10 as if someone were controlling a sound bank full of quips Apr 09 13:15:27 alice Apr 09 13:16:00 as if suddenly 20,000 telemarketers in a call center in Hyderabad all have the same voice. Apr 09 13:16:03 http://mytube.garage.maemo.org/ mytube is a really nice app for youtube. if i could just have some more search parameters, and a google-video mode Apr 09 13:16:26 pupnik, have you tried Canola2's YouTube plug-in? Apr 09 13:16:42 no canola smells like amarok from a distance Apr 09 13:16:43 i had a hsbc head ring me the other week and try to extract all my info out of him - i managed to find out his full name dob that he banked with natwest and that he had worked for hsbc for 6 months before i would confirm he was speaking to the right person Apr 09 13:16:46 do you like it fysa ? Apr 09 13:17:43 <]-[andful_of_not> :) Apr 09 13:17:56 I haven't tried the YouTube plug-in yet. I played with the Canola2 beta a bit, and it seems like it would be nice if more developers considered it a 'platform.' Apr 09 13:18:23 I think I like how it handled switching between functions. Apr 09 13:18:45 <]-[andful_of_not> fysa: we are still "fighting" for the full open source release Apr 09 13:18:51 it just needs more to do, to convince you to stay in Canola2 .. say.. an RSS or Google Reader plug-in Apr 09 13:19:05 <]-[andful_of_not> but at least, the full desktop build for testing is available + sources of plugins + theme sources Apr 09 13:19:14 yes, that is another issue Apr 09 13:19:21 not for me, but for some certainly Apr 09 13:19:31 <]-[andful_of_not> yeah, these plugins example are like, 2 weeks work max Apr 09 13:19:39 <]-[andful_of_not> for a "quality" plugin Apr 09 13:19:55 <]-[andful_of_not> that's why we are rushing a html renderer also inside the evas canvas Apr 09 13:20:00 scrolling and nav is nice. Apr 09 13:20:03 <]-[andful_of_not> if we can do that.. those things will be even easier Apr 09 13:20:17 and being able to take advantage of that easily makes for an interesting plug-in case Apr 09 13:20:28 <]-[andful_of_not> scrolling has some issues, but seems that we finally made a list that is way better than today's.. We are already testing with some users Apr 09 13:22:38 html renderer would be nice. Apr 09 13:22:59 <]-[andful_of_not> yeah, we have been talking to Alp (from webkit) and he's probably coming back here in brazil to work with us on that Apr 09 13:23:24 <]-[andful_of_not> so even a simple working browser could be done (but that's not our plan) Apr 09 13:23:44 if I could easily jump into gmail, google reader, youtube while listening/watching something, without having to get back to the desktop, it would be a nice interface on-the-go. Apr 09 13:23:45 <]-[andful_of_not> we want the rendering for RSS / podcasts info / other internet related media that wins a lot in experience when maintained the html Apr 09 13:24:13 <]-[andful_of_not> yes... if we had enough work-power we would for sure do it (while of course experimenting a little (integrating stuff into local apps) Apr 09 13:24:16 app-style, sort of how the EEE works it Apr 09 13:24:25 <]-[andful_of_not> but, as the real word is not perfect :) we do what we can :) Apr 09 13:24:45 nice work pushing it forward to this condition anyway Apr 09 13:25:22 <]-[andful_of_not> yeah, I know some people hate it :) but it's the good of those platforms, you have choice :) for those wanting control, detail, and flexibility you have hildon ui Apr 09 13:26:10 <]-[andful_of_not> for the others, just wanting quick access, fast switching, media & content oriented, and of course eye candy (even when gratuitous)... Apr 09 13:26:50 hello X-Fade Apr 09 13:27:40 can anyone give me permission to commit to repository Apr 09 13:28:03 username: opendeep, garage.maemo.org Apr 09 13:32:29 hmm, do not delete /usr/lib/python2.5.zip Apr 09 13:39:55 ]-[andful_of_not: glad to hear you've got a better list implementation in the pipeline, the current one's a bit too eager in grabbing clicks Apr 09 13:40:34 <]-[andful_of_not> yes.. it's bad : / Apr 09 13:41:03 <]-[andful_of_not> the only one not working that well still is the youtube, but now is not actually the list.. Apr 09 13:41:31 <]-[andful_of_not> scrolling... is the fact that each item has so much data, that the drawing / redrawing is sluggish... then prone to errors : / Apr 09 13:43:09 What exactly is the closed part of canola? Apr 09 13:43:57 <]-[andful_of_not> the "terra" plugin loader, all widgets, and the media abs layer, all basic apps (plugins) Apr 09 13:44:08 ugh Apr 09 13:44:46 <]-[andful_of_not> the C work is 100% open (EFL 16 bit engine, the scanner - garage) Apr 09 13:45:05 <]-[andful_of_not> python bindings for EFL / others also.. as well youtube, last.fm and upnp Apr 09 13:45:15 Ah.. Sad that the widgets are closed though. Apr 09 13:45:32 <]-[andful_of_not> Blafasel: the basic ones, but you can extend them as you like Apr 09 13:45:35 I care less about the other stuff but a more widespread use of those would be great. Apr 09 13:45:53 <]-[andful_of_not> yah for sure :) that's why we are after the full openess Apr 09 13:46:02 ]-[andful_of_not: Yeah, but I like your app for it's UI polish among other things ;) Apr 09 13:46:25 So - reinventing stuff like those widgets might be feasible, but they are already good right now. Apr 09 13:46:33 <]-[andful_of_not> also, the destkop version, with small tweaks (and even with openGL) can work great as a media center on the desktop - I have some of the desktop designs.. :) if it was open I could add them to the project Apr 09 13:46:53 <]-[andful_of_not> Blafasel: yes. but they are completely covered in the apis Apr 09 14:14:55 anybody ever thought of making a wriststrap for the IT ? Apr 09 14:15:28 use ducttape? Apr 09 14:15:44 there isnt a lanyard hole Apr 09 14:18:13 You could probably dril a tiny hole in the kickstand or someting Apr 09 14:19:15 why drill? wrap the lanyard around the kickstand Apr 09 14:19:34 might end up ripping the stand right off if you drop it Apr 09 14:19:51 It looks cleaner if you do :P Apr 09 14:20:08 That is, if you have the ability to drill proper tiny holes Apr 09 14:39:21 erhm Apr 09 14:39:33 why bother drilling or ducktaping anything ? Apr 09 14:39:51 anyway, I'll look into it Apr 09 14:43:07 not the small shitty wriststrap you get on a phone or a wiimote for example Apr 09 14:43:09 but more like... Apr 09 14:43:11 this: http://www.digitalcamerareview.com/assets/6680.jpg Apr 09 15:04:37 Khertan: did you work out how to get transparent backgrounds in desktop applets? Apr 09 15:09:41 Spakman ... :) Apr 09 15:09:47 Hi spakman ... Apr 09 15:10:13 http://maemo.org/downloads/OS2008/ Apr 09 15:10:22 in the "fresh" section Apr 09 15:10:38 there is some transparent applet in python Apr 09 15:10:43 so source is available Apr 09 15:12:16 Spakman: look at omweather? Apr 09 15:14:14 my package seems to not be in extras .... since 13h00 (it s 17h14 here) Apr 09 15:14:17 is i normal ? Apr 09 15:14:54 does a mail is send when package is accepted or refused ? Apr 09 15:19:25 Khertan: thanks :) Apr 09 15:19:46 hi Apr 09 15:22:15 bye Apr 09 15:49:55 Rahhh lovely illimited data 3g connection Apr 09 15:50:15 Khertan_n810, isn't it ;) Apr 09 15:50:46 Khertan_n810, are you using sfr ? Apr 09 15:51:02 maybe someone can inform me, someone know how i can contact maintainer of extras maemo repository Apr 09 15:51:04 ? Apr 09 15:51:21 crashanddie > no, orange Apr 09 15:51:23 Khertan_n810, check the package, should be an email in the package info Apr 09 15:51:36 Khertan, hmm, ok, how did you connect the n810 with your phone ? Apr 09 15:52:01 i m talking about maintainer of tthe repository not packages maintainer Apr 09 15:52:16 crashanddie > with bluetooth Apr 09 15:52:26 :) Apr 09 15:52:54 Khertan_n810, I guess garage@maemo.org would be the way to go here Apr 09 15:53:19 Khertan_n810, ok, I have the SFR 3G usb dongle, connected to my laptop, laptop spawns a wifi signal for the n810 Apr 09 15:53:20 hum modest is more and more buggy Apr 09 15:53:35 I don't have any problems with modest, what's wrong ? Apr 09 15:53:36 the first beta work better than the last one ! Apr 09 15:54:03 can't send nothing to my smtp Apr 09 15:54:12 hmm Apr 09 15:54:19 don t retrieve content of email Apr 09 15:54:40 Khertan_n810, did you check with another way of getting of the internet ? Maybe it's your connection... Apr 09 15:55:13 and is frequently not responding (freeze) Apr 09 15:55:37 hi guys Apr 09 15:55:57 hi christian00 Apr 09 15:56:17 Khertan_n810, I dunno, don't have any problems, do you want to contact the repo maintainer for that ? Apr 09 15:57:23 no i want to contact repo maintainer to know why pypackager and pygtkeditor is still not validated in the repo Apr 09 15:57:43 hmm, ok Apr 09 15:57:55 i have a legal question about maemo,i tried to look for info everywhere but i couldn't find it.Is the maemo platform freely redistributable with any device?or nokia tablets are the only one allowed to use it? Apr 09 15:57:57 i ve submit it with a new version of pypackager ... Apr 09 15:58:16 which is not available yet Apr 09 15:58:23 christian00, hang on, I have the answer for that Apr 09 15:58:35 as i wantto be sure that upload process is ok Apr 09 15:58:44 thanx crashanddie Apr 09 15:59:04 Khertan_n810, how long have the packages been uploaded ? Apr 09 15:59:13 Khertan_n810, did the scp happen AOK ? Apr 09 15:59:14 not so long Apr 09 15:59:22 is there a way to prevent the n810/n800 from powering down the screen during idle from the cmd line? Apr 09 15:59:26 i m a bit pressed :) Apr 09 15:59:31 scp ok :) Apr 09 15:59:55 i ve push it this day at 13h00 GMT +1 Apr 09 16:00:45 no not the tunnel ! Apr 09 16:00:51 rer powa Apr 09 16:02:41 christian00, the target market was the nokia nxx0 series, but considering that Maemo (ITOS200x) is based on Debian, the fact that it uses a lot of open source components and only a bit of closed source (drivers for particular pieces of hardware mainly), and the recent announcement that Ubuntu Mobile was going to use Hildon (https://blueprints.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-mobile/+roadmap), I'd say Maemo is clean for use on other de Apr 09 16:02:41 vices, yes Apr 09 16:03:54 oh cool.and apart from flash 9 Apr 09 16:03:54 dougt, yes, don't ask me how though, but I know it's feasible Apr 09 16:03:56 Well, the parts that are open-source/free software are of course freely distributable. For the parts that are closed-source/Nokia proprietary you'd of course have to ask Nokia Apr 09 16:04:06 are there any parts unique to nokia? Apr 09 16:04:20 johnx, but I'm right saying that the whole Maemo "concept" is free ? Apr 09 16:04:42 johnx, only the drivers are closed, drivers you wouldn't need anyway Apr 09 16:05:21 browser-ui, mediaplayer, the onscreen keyboards, the statusbar plugins for brightness/battery, and many other things are closed source Apr 09 16:05:29 argh Apr 09 16:05:32 hmm Apr 09 16:05:41 (the control panel, the image viewer *I think*, the web and contacts menus Apr 09 16:05:55 NOKIA OWNS THE WEB ??? Apr 09 16:06:00 OMG Apr 09 16:06:00 that's not few things Apr 09 16:06:16 basically most of the GUI is closed source Apr 09 16:06:19 you can still get a basic hildon-desktop running without those things Apr 09 16:06:28 the foundations are open source Apr 09 16:06:47 christian00, if you want to port it to another device, you'd have to rewrite a lot of stuff anyhow Apr 09 16:06:49 rah modest is freeze ... again Apr 09 16:06:58 Khertan, froze Apr 09 16:07:14 Khertan_n810, RER ? Where to ? Apr 09 16:07:17 but yes, a lot of the actual apps are closed...however, Nokia is open to providing more source. Look at this bug: https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1584 Apr 09 16:07:38 because we want to create an open source device Apr 09 16:07:52 christian00, is this a device that's out already? Apr 09 16:08:09 no,we are still at early design phase Apr 09 16:08:16 ah Apr 09 16:08:27 so we are evaluating the os to use Apr 09 16:08:52 the maemo seemed the best ,as it already had many app Apr 09 16:08:59 and had a nice ui Apr 09 16:09:24 there are a lot of open source parts worth using Apr 09 16:09:33 and many of the apps that are closed have open source alternatives Apr 09 16:09:43 instead of Nokia's browser-ui you could use Midori Apr 09 16:10:01 instead of the built-in media player you could use youamp or ukmp Apr 09 16:10:02 what do you mean about browser-ui? Apr 09 16:10:23 the UI parts of the browser are closed, but the rendering engine is open Apr 09 16:10:51 what bother me most is the hardware control,such as battery,bluetooth,wi-fi Apr 09 16:10:59 i thought these were abstracted Apr 09 16:11:33 and only needed to add driver and adapt some interface Apr 09 16:11:34 christian00, only the UI of those parts are closed Apr 09 16:11:34 well, they're actually somewhat abstracted by Nokia closed source stuff. Nokia's battery management app is closed Apr 09 16:12:02 christian00, anyway, you'll probably have to write a whole new battery management system on a another device Apr 09 16:12:04 CrashandDie, the wifi driver is closed, as is the battery charging and monitoring software Apr 09 16:12:26 The bluetooth driver is open source, I believe Apr 09 16:12:43 christian00, mind if I ask which company would be wanting to launch this ? Apr 09 16:13:15 not the driver Apr 09 16:13:33 but the control panel Apr 09 16:14:57 it would slow down development Apr 09 16:15:21 if we had to write the control panel for each device Apr 09 16:15:54 and if they are abstracted by nokia parts Apr 09 16:16:06 it mean current apps won't work Apr 09 16:16:38 CrashandDie ,our company is pasen ( en.pasen.it Apr 09 16:16:43 ) Apr 09 16:16:50 johnx, nokia didn't open bme I take it then ? How is that debian port going ? Apr 09 16:17:39 oh Apr 09 16:18:42 CrashandDie, I haven't been working on it lately. I might poke at it again, since there seems to be more interest lately Apr 09 16:18:42 we wanted to focus on hardware and leave the device open to any change,but had to ship with at least a ready os to be commercially attractive for normal user too Apr 09 16:18:59 christian00, if you're based in italy... How come the UI is in some asian language ? Apr 09 16:19:34 johnx, well I might get myself a few extra sd cards for the n810, and start playing around with android, and other distributions Apr 09 16:19:45 because we aren't manufacturer Apr 09 16:20:02 this will be our first project built from scratch Apr 09 16:20:10 christian00, wow, nice Apr 09 16:20:31 the mp3 you see are made by some other factory,and they passed us the picture too Apr 09 16:20:54 christian00, did you look at openmoko ? Hell even Android I know it's phone based, but it might be more interesting than maemo Apr 09 16:21:07 christian00, they have a pretty good photographer ;) Apr 09 16:21:20 that's why we didn't remade them :D Apr 09 16:21:43 yes i looked into openmoko and android Apr 09 16:21:46 CrashandDie, there's no source for Android at all, until Google provides it Apr 09 16:21:54 android was our first choice Apr 09 16:22:48 but i just discovered it's still lacking many parts Apr 09 16:23:07 christian00, Nokia hasn't been completely against open sourcing the rest of Maemo. It might be worth talking to them to see if you could sponsor the opening of more of it or something along those lines Apr 09 16:23:28 I still hope to hold an OpenMoko phone one day.. Apr 09 16:23:34 I hate to see handheld Linux fracturing off into so many directions when in many ways Maemo really is "good enough" Apr 09 16:23:50 we could add application in that,but won't have a common graphical omogenity(does this term exist ? ) Apr 09 16:23:55 * mwaldron remembers this arguement back with familiar... Apr 09 16:24:37 mwaldron, and I remember the Zaurus community fracturing... Apr 09 16:24:47 and i saw openmoko too,this is our other choice as of now,and it's good because it also have telephony Apr 09 16:25:21 but there does seem to be much less applications for it yet,and the community is much more technical Apr 09 16:25:23 openmoko or angstrom might fit the bill. What do you want your users to be able to do with this device? Apr 09 16:25:30 anyway, I'm off, I'll be back later Apr 09 16:25:41 the maemo community is much more user friendly Apr 09 16:25:49 what is angstrom? Apr 09 16:25:51 I hate that buzz term. Apr 09 16:25:56 "User friendly" Apr 09 16:26:09 haha Apr 09 16:26:22 Navi, user friendly has been around for 2 decades Apr 09 16:26:34 we want it to be as more as flexible as possible Apr 09 16:26:38 Navi, hardly a "buzz term", "buzz term", on the other hand, is a "buzz term" Apr 09 16:26:55 christian00, angstrom is another distribution built out of open-embedded: http://angstrom-distribution.org Apr 09 16:27:07 CrashandDie, "buzz term" isn't even used Apr 09 16:27:12 hardly a "buzz term" Apr 09 16:27:20 :D Apr 09 16:27:54 hi again Apr 09 16:28:10 angstrom is even more technical :D Apr 09 16:28:18 3g doesnt work very well underground Apr 09 16:28:37 Wonder why. Apr 09 16:29:13 it should be because of the band frequency used Apr 09 16:29:18 if i remember well Apr 09 16:29:48 christian00, angstrom may appear that way at first glance, but it can be configured in a reasonably friendly way, and there are lots of apps Apr 09 16:30:05 johnx, openembedded a candidate ? Apr 09 16:30:19 openembedded is a build system Apr 09 16:30:27 the build system used to build angstrom and openmoko Apr 09 16:30:38 someone could give me again the email of maemo repository team ? log haven't work Apr 09 16:30:40 openembedded can also build apps for maemo :) Apr 09 16:30:56 Khertan_n810, garage@maemo.org Apr 09 16:31:08 woo Apr 09 16:31:10 thx Apr 09 16:31:27 anyway, cheers, bbl Apr 09 16:31:42 speaking of mail,what email could i use to ask maemo about the closed source? Apr 09 16:32:12 there isn't a single email on their website except in some news Apr 09 16:32:19 the maemo-developers mailing list might be a good place Apr 09 16:32:56 Make sure you tell them the whole story about why you're interested in the source. Apr 09 16:37:05 Give them as much information as you can, and tell them which parts you care about being open sourced the most Apr 09 16:37:41 \o/ Apr 09 16:37:56 Yeah, they've been looking to open up vital parts or something Apr 09 16:37:57 Navi, eh? Apr 09 16:38:06 I'm bored Apr 09 16:38:06 ah, yes Apr 09 16:38:51 ok i will try there Apr 09 16:39:40 alright, good luck Apr 09 16:40:22 thank you Apr 09 16:40:32 you're welcome :) Apr 09 16:40:50 http://www.thisismobility.com/blog/2008/04/09/os2008-homescreen-hackery/#comment-261157 Apr 09 16:40:53 huhu Apr 09 16:41:17 poor comment due to the fact that none repository is available for my python applet Apr 09 16:42:07 * johnx sometimes thinks it would have been easier if Qtopia had stayed the only game in town back in the Zaurus days... Apr 09 16:42:09 i hope maemo repository team will validdate my pypacker made packages to push all my softwares to extras repository Apr 09 16:45:03 Someone with money should set up a unified community repository. Apr 09 16:45:58 Navi: yeah, like extras in maemo.org :) Apr 09 16:46:12 navi > the problem is mainly that upload to maemo repository need a computer working on an debian based distribution Apr 09 16:46:13 too bad extras sucks. Apr 09 16:46:22 Navi, it still wouldn't be official, and thus just cause more confusion... Apr 09 16:46:30 and that uploading to extras is a real pain Apr 09 16:46:34 ^ Apr 09 16:46:42 johnx, perhaps Apr 09 16:46:51 Khertan_n810, get yourself a debian chroot :D Apr 09 16:47:10 it s why i m modifying pypackager to be able to upload to extras Apr 09 16:47:16 but get it popular enough and we should see a good adoption rate. Apr 09 16:47:20 johnx on a tablet ? Apr 09 16:47:29 can t due to busybox Apr 09 16:47:48 Khertan_n810, sure, why not? There's a Debian chroot or you can boot Debian from your SD card Apr 09 16:48:00 a little bit of overkill, but workable Apr 09 16:48:29 i don t want to reboot each time to make a package and send it Apr 09 16:48:45 overkill ... it s the word Apr 09 16:48:46 right, so use a chroot Apr 09 16:48:50 Khertan_n810: uploading to extras does NOT require you to be running a Debian-based distro Apr 09 16:49:08 Khertan_n810, agreed. I'm just saying you *could* :) Apr 09 16:49:14 jaffa ... no but it s help to create the package Apr 09 16:49:23 :) Apr 09 16:49:47 i know because i ve do it from my tablet Apr 09 16:50:03 with gnupg / scp Apr 09 16:50:25 i m just waiting for validation Apr 09 16:50:37 to be sure that the process is ok Apr 09 16:51:46 clicking on a toolbar icon in npypackager will ease a lot the publication in extras :) Apr 09 16:52:38 do u know if there is an answer if package isn't validated by the repository maintainer ? Apr 09 16:52:46 +s Apr 09 16:53:40 'night all Apr 09 16:59:13 arg python launcher prevents displaying error when script launched from pgtkeditor Apr 09 17:10:12 bye Apr 09 17:35:12 is there a way to mount the rootfs.jffs2 unpacked jffs2 image file from the n810 FIASCO image under a pc? Apr 09 17:39:57 yes Apr 09 17:43:25 is there a howto for it? Apr 09 17:44:03 I tried the losetup/loopback, mount routes but it didn't work it says the superblock is wrong as if it doesn't identify the filesystem Apr 09 17:44:12 zxula: google "mtdram" Apr 09 17:44:13 I also tried mapping it to /dev/mtd0 with no success Apr 09 17:44:34 pH5: k thx Apr 09 17:44:49 pH5: have you used it successfully? Apr 09 17:44:55 yes Apr 09 17:45:25 I always get errors that my kernel doesn't have enough ram for the new large images Apr 09 17:46:02 mgedmin: are you sure your total_size module parameter is chosen big enough? Apr 09 17:46:05 iirc it used to be that you had to define the maximum size when you loaded the kernel module Apr 09 17:46:24 pH5: that's the problem, when total_size = 64 megs, the image won't fit, but when total_size = 128 megs, I cannot insmod Apr 09 17:46:27 FATAL: Error inserting mtdram (/lib/modules/2.6.22-14-generic/kernel/drivers/mtd/devices/mtdram.ko): Cannot allocate memory Apr 09 17:46:33 dmesg|tail says allocation failed: out of vmalloc space - use vmalloc= to increase size. Apr 09 17:47:02 I probably should try adding vmalloc=something in grub Apr 09 17:47:05 but that's too much hassle Apr 09 17:49:44 so Apr 09 17:49:48 with this maps that comes with the n810 Apr 09 17:49:57 routing isn't allowed unless you pay? Apr 09 17:50:17 phunguy: right Apr 09 17:50:23 try maemo mapper instead Apr 09 17:51:57 mgedmin: not sure, I have not fiddled with any vmalloc settings, and I can load mtdram with 128MB (vanilla 2.6.24 kernel) Apr 09 17:52:05 hmm Apr 09 17:52:10 hi guys, i have written a bunch of code which i want to release as gpl. however at some later date i want the option of taking it into work and utilising it with our closed application portfolio, or sell customisations to further clients. as the original author is this a viable proposition? Apr 09 17:52:19 2.6.22 from ubuntu gutsy here Apr 09 17:52:38 lcuk: as the original author you don't need a licence to do whatever you want with the code Apr 09 17:52:41 lcuk: sure, as long as you don't take any contributions of third parties under gpl with you. Apr 09 17:52:44 does maemo mapper need a constant data connection or does it use the maps already installed on the device Apr 09 17:52:45 licences are for other people Apr 09 17:52:56 phunguy: it has its own map cache Apr 09 17:53:08 you can download maps when online and then stay offline Apr 09 17:53:22 so even though the core is available and open to everyone else i can just grab my sections of it and use them in whatever apps i want at work Apr 09 17:53:37 routing needs web access to create the route, and then you can work offline Apr 09 17:54:31 lcuk: Modulo any IP agreement you've signed with your employer. Apr 09 17:55:51 my ideas are my own, my time out of the premises are my own, my core ideas are my own, however the work coded implimentation is theirs. i agreed this in writing when i started before i even heard about proper open source :) Apr 09 17:56:07 and besides its in vb :P Apr 09 17:57:58 sfrom a technical basis i could open source my app now and at some arbitary point in the future (as long as either no contribs from other people, or a written agreement with them) i can close the source and cease public development as required Apr 09 17:58:09 keeping the last oss version available obviously Apr 09 17:58:12 I got the same error when I try to insmod with the vmalloc Apr 09 17:58:51 * lcuk has never released code in this was before Apr 09 17:58:55 I guess it needs vmalloc=256m in the grub.conf or something Apr 09 18:04:46 Democracy is two wolves and a lamb voting on what to have for lunch. Liberty is a well-armed lamb contesting the vote! Apr 09 18:04:47 :) Apr 09 18:09:07 evening kot Apr 09 18:10:13 * KotCzarny yawns Apr 09 18:10:43 hey you cant b tired - i had less sleep than you - about 4 hours i think Apr 09 18:10:56 yesterday i have slept 4h Apr 09 18:11:01 :) Apr 09 18:11:14 sounds familiar Apr 09 18:15:11 hmm Apr 09 18:20:15 hiya :) say.. is the nokia770 vo driver better for any of the tablet series from nokia? or should i just go with a safebet as x11? Apr 09 18:21:19 The Nokia 770. Apr 09 18:21:30 tuxprobe: don't ask, use -benchmark Apr 09 18:22:00 and it was renamed to omapfb in newest mplayer .26 Apr 09 18:24:24 ok.. it still has the old alias? Apr 09 18:24:36 probably Apr 09 18:28:20 nice nice, i just found out why my app kept crashing while doing video heh Apr 09 18:33:33 for booting off mmc, do you need to partition the FAT portion if you don't plan on using it? Apr 09 18:34:46 not really Apr 09 18:34:50 but it's usefull Apr 09 18:34:57 (a little) Apr 09 18:35:52 kk Apr 09 19:20:11 About http://maemo.org/community/wiki/linuxtag2008/ Apr 09 19:20:15 what about this Apr 09 19:21:15 1. MAEMO COMMUNITY UPDATE: Niels Breet, someone in this chatroom *now* and myself Apr 09 19:22:55 oooer qgil, seems like tumbleweeds - its been quiet for a while this evening Apr 09 19:22:59 Howdy, qgil. Apr 09 19:23:44 2. COOL MAEMO APPS: Alberto Garcia (Vagalume), another cool app developer here now and Urho Konttori (UKMP, Nokia developer and whatnot) Apr 09 19:23:50 hi there :) Apr 09 19:24:56 shame this is in germany Apr 09 19:25:18 are you based there qgil, or are you flying in specially? Apr 09 19:26:03 I just hope we have somebody there to record everything. Apr 09 19:26:24 3. COOL PLATFORM HACKS: Kees Jongenburger, a cool platform hacker present here now and Tuomas Kulve (Ogg support) Apr 09 19:26:34 I'm based in Helsinki and I will fly to Berlin Apr 09 19:26:43 What about pupnik for cool platform hacks? Apr 09 19:26:46 Mr. Emulator Apr 09 19:26:53 I plan to record audio at least - in OSiM USA was pretty useful Apr 09 19:28:04 cool, i second the pupnik note - he has been tirelessly beavering away compiling and tweaking and has a nice growing set of files Apr 09 19:28:33 He's right around there, too. Apr 09 19:28:52 For #1, what about Jaffa? Apr 09 19:29:03 4. MAEMO.ORG: WHAT NEXT? - Marius Gedminas, a clever mind present here and now and... someone from Nokia tbd Apr 09 19:29:12 Jaffa can't attend, I asked him already Apr 09 19:29:21 Yerga can't either, I asked him as well Apr 09 19:29:37 the rest of names are not confirmed and many don't even know I'm mentioning them here and now :) Apr 09 19:29:42 get GeneralAntilles a ticket for him and his cat and he will come ;) Apr 09 19:29:51 well, keesj has just confirmed Apr 09 19:29:54 Ha Apr 09 19:30:30 restriction: must be in Europe (budget is limited and we are paying travel, accommodation 1-3 nights and registration to these guys Apr 09 19:30:46 hah - i was joking as well lol Apr 09 19:31:23 milhouse might be another option for community. Apr 09 19:31:42 He's in the UK. Apr 09 19:32:04 (I confess getting lost with names & nicknames sometimes) Apr 09 19:32:52 to be frank, I'd be happy having in a same room all the people that have reminded us several times many things Nokia could do better, with clever arguments Apr 09 19:33:04 ah, I was also thinkin on Florian Boor Apr 09 19:33:12 Andrew Flegg Apr 09 19:33:30 milhouse is Neil MacLeod on bugzilla. Apr 09 19:33:37 khertan is someone who has done something noone else has: hes developed apps directly on his nokia Apr 09 19:33:39 ah yes Apr 09 19:33:39 Andrew == Jaffa Apr 09 19:34:01 lcuk, not a bad idea—big Python hacker. Apr 09 19:34:04 ah wait, then who is Frantisek? Apr 09 19:34:06 hes wrote the editor and works directly on his nokia for about 3 hours a day with nothing else Apr 09 19:34:14 oh my :) Apr 09 19:34:41 and hes in france Apr 09 19:34:54 http://khertan.net/ Apr 09 19:34:56 let me start editing the wiki page not to get lost... Apr 09 19:36:05 and he is also trying to get a whole end to end dev environment setup (I believe) so he can even push updates built with the py deb packager thing directly into extras :) ( he was talking about it earlier) Apr 09 19:36:12 Alright: 3. COOL PLATFORM HACKS: Kees Jongenburger, a cool platform hacker present here now and Tuomas Kulve (Ogg support) - candidates for the vacant? Apr 09 19:36:28 pupnik Apr 09 19:36:38 ArnimS on itT Apr 09 19:37:00 http://pupnik.de/ Apr 09 19:37:06 .de sounds good :) Apr 09 19:37:26 pupnik: ping Apr 09 19:37:34 it looks like tp w/ my font cache patch has issues Apr 09 19:37:50 nm wrong channel. dumb colloquy. Apr 09 19:38:13 what what? Apr 09 19:38:23 You're being drafted. Apr 09 19:38:26 Get your gear. :P Apr 09 19:39:01 :D Apr 09 19:39:12 pupnik: ported every single emulator on the planet to maemo right? Apr 09 19:39:36 As far a we can tell. :D Apr 09 19:39:54 he even tried to port an emulator of an emulator but ended up vanishing in a puff of smoke Apr 09 19:40:15 pupnik: can we invite you to LinuxTag? Apr 09 19:40:25 sure that'd be fun! Apr 09 19:40:33 alright, great Apr 09 19:41:11 its on the Falkland Islands this year. Nokia will supply a canoe Apr 09 19:41:21 * pupnik googles Apr 09 19:41:28 http://maemo.org/community/wiki/linuxtag2008/ Apr 09 19:41:35 kulve: are you here? Apr 09 19:41:48 nokia are making canoe's now? Apr 09 19:42:09 only OLED ones Apr 09 19:42:14 well they made military boots a long time ago so why not ;) Apr 09 19:42:15 * GeneralAntilles demands a canoe. Apr 09 19:42:48 (let's assume Tuomas Kulve aka Ogg Support man can do it) Apr 09 19:43:32 arh, too bad it's on thursday. is there already a rough plan what'll be in the morning and what in the afternoon? Apr 09 19:45:22 about 2. COOL MAEMO APPS: Alberto Garcia (Vagalume), another cool app developer here now and Urho Konttori (UKMP, Nokia developer and whatnot) Apr 09 19:46:02 I'll send an email to Alberto right now (or is he here? I don't know his nick) Apr 09 19:46:24 konttori: are you here? Apr 09 19:46:34 and candidates for the third place? Apr 09 19:46:53 I'd really like to see gnuite there. Apr 09 19:46:57 Too bad he's state-side. Apr 09 19:46:58 ph5 the LinuxTag program is being defined these days Apr 09 19:47:19 yeah, we'll find another chance - hopefully later this year Apr 09 19:48:01 so we don't have cool maemo app developers in europe Apr 09 19:48:10 Hehe Apr 09 19:48:29 of course you do :) like i said khertan Apr 09 19:48:41 lol hes the only 1 Apr 09 19:48:52 What about ssvb? Apr 09 19:49:12 oh man, i'd pay to meet him :) Apr 09 19:49:46 An FBReader person might be cool, too, but I don't know if any of them are actually involved in the community. Apr 09 19:49:47 not sure where people are - i dont see daytime lot here in england (working) but generally end up with the statesiders Apr 09 19:50:06 omg I'm getting in an endless loop trying to get the email address from Alberto at http://people.igalia.com/berto/ Apr 09 19:50:32 fbreader is just a quick port - its mainly shared code from what i can gather Apr 09 19:50:36 qgil i'd need an invite in writing if you could manage that Apr 09 19:50:53 qgil, https://garage.maemo.org/users/agarcia/ Apr 09 19:50:55 yes I can do that - only not today :) Apr 09 19:51:08 GeneralAntilles: clever move Apr 09 19:51:16 ;) Apr 09 19:52:30 pupnik, you would need more than invite in writing. you cant wait till the other end to pick up tickets ;) Apr 09 19:52:55 Well, for cool maemo apps either Khertan or ssvb (mplayer) are good options. Apr 09 19:53:19 mmm yes, get the heavy guns out :) Apr 09 19:53:34 and Florian for the GPE suite? Apr 09 19:53:50 (I'm trying to save some money here, yes) Apr 09 19:54:07 since Florian will be in LinuxTag for sure Apr 09 19:54:34 hehe, I think flo_lap is online right now Apr 09 19:55:35 in another channel you mean? Apr 09 19:56:08 (it would be funny to say "we will invite the next one joining the channel) :) Apr 09 19:56:27 yes, #gpe-project or #oe for example Apr 09 19:56:40 do you mind calling him to come here? Apr 09 19:56:41 qgil: will there also be some kind of hacking session (like a reserved room for some nice chatting and hacking) Apr 09 19:57:09 why not, I can ask - but before we need to make sure thre is a critical mass for that Apr 09 19:57:52 sure. atleast most of the speakers will be there ;-) Apr 09 19:57:56 afair LinuxTag has plenty of room around to organize informal hacks of 10 people or so Apr 09 19:59:03 re Apr 09 20:00:13 qgil: the only thing is really that I guess the real-real mamona hackers are located in Brasil. I am merly there local spokesmen Apr 09 20:00:17 flo_lap: can we invite you to LinuxTag? :D Apr 09 20:00:41 keesj: you can speak about whatever - you have earned the invitation by own merits Apr 09 20:00:55 qgil: Sure... but I'll be there anyway. Apr 09 20:01:03 he knew that Apr 09 20:01:17 qgil is wise and read the rosta Apr 09 20:02:01 right, time to get back into this box of mine Apr 09 20:02:04 back later Apr 09 20:02:12 lcuk: thanks! Apr 09 20:02:31 * GeneralAntilles duct tapes lcuk's box shut. Apr 09 20:02:36 does maemo differentiate between a stylus touch and a finger touch? Apr 09 20:02:44 Yes, dougt. Apr 09 20:02:55 if its a finger, it bites you Apr 09 20:03:01 flo_lap: see http://maemo.org/community/wiki/linuxtag2008/ - Cool maemo apps Apr 09 20:03:05 Though less-so on 50-2/51-3 than previous releases. Apr 09 20:03:40 Something was broken and appears to (potentially) be fixed in Diablo (at least from bugzilla reports). Apr 09 20:03:44 GeneralAntilles: are there docs or an api to tell the difference? Apr 09 20:03:57 If I start to sound strange today that's because I spend the day digging in hardware registers :) Apr 09 20:04:50 Not sure offhand, dougt, but FBReader might be a good place to look for code examples. Apr 09 20:05:14 cool thanks Apr 09 20:05:18 About 1. MAEMO COMMUNITY UPDATE: Niels Breet, someone in this chatroom *now* and myself Apr 09 20:05:28 milhouse! :D Apr 09 20:05:35 ( flo_lap - are you confirming then?) Apr 09 20:05:43 milhouse: are you here? Apr 09 20:05:44 qgil: right, I did not manage to read the wiki yet... one sec Apr 09 20:05:52 dougt, if you are using x11 or gtk or something you will not have the pressure information required. you have to enable the RAWmode mouse support to get pressure information. (though you could possibly hack something together based upon the amount of jitter) Apr 09 20:06:18 you can enable the pressure information, theres a wiki somewhere with it - ill dig it out for you Apr 09 20:06:24 please. Apr 09 20:06:26 or were you not meaning from code.. Apr 09 20:06:29 that would be sexy hot for a browser. Apr 09 20:06:37 code would be great Apr 09 20:06:53 milhouse, I'd try email, I haven't seen him around in the last couple days. Apr 09 20:07:15 (now that I think in cool platform hacks we can invite Kate Alhola as well) Apr 09 20:07:21 s/milhouse/qgil/ Apr 09 20:07:21 GeneralAntilles meant: qgil, I'd try email, I haven't seen him around in the last couple days. Apr 09 20:07:46 GeneralAntilles: where can I get the address? Apr 09 20:08:00 qgil: do you have the log of who edited the wiki ? (how many people) ? Apr 09 20:08:46 hi MoRpHeUz ! not many, some people added data and i am the only one deleting right now to get the areas clean Apr 09 20:09:22 Jaffa: are you here? Apr 09 20:09:26 qgil: yeah...because I'm following it and it looks like that too few people edited that (I was the first one to edit hehehe) Apr 09 20:09:35 qgil, http://maemo.org/profile/view/milhouse.html Apr 09 20:09:36 qgil is there some magic hacked tablet that will be available to present software on a projection or large monitor? Apr 09 20:09:39 Only email I see is the bugzilla email Apr 09 20:09:41 dougt, http://test.maemo.org/maemowiki/HOWTO_UseTouchscreenPressureData :) this code will give the information required but will need tweaking i think per device because i believeit is uncalibrated and if you start using other display modes it may be out of alignment alltogether. Apr 09 20:09:42 qgil: any feedback from the other channels ? (ITT, etc..) ? Apr 09 20:10:19 GeneralAntilles: there is a Nokia team that has done that and they are based in Germany so I'm hoping to have them there as well Apr 09 20:10:43 <]-[andful_of_not> qgil : the project from the german guys is awesome :) Apr 09 20:10:55 noBounds Apr 09 20:11:01 <]-[andful_of_not> yeah :p Apr 09 20:11:02 nobounds is a windows app Apr 09 20:11:12 lcuk: have you used it? Apr 09 20:11:13 you can see the xp borders on the video ;) Apr 09 20:11:21 used what? nobounds? Apr 09 20:11:23 <]-[andful_of_not> lol Apr 09 20:11:43 Pressure Data from x. Apr 09 20:11:44 it connects with nokia and mirrors everything but its not running the hidef display directly from nokia Apr 09 20:11:57 yes i use it :) Apr 09 20:12:02 and it works nicely Apr 09 20:12:09 well, almost Apr 09 20:12:10 ;) Apr 09 20:12:13 lolololol Apr 09 20:12:21 shhhh that was a bug :P Apr 09 20:12:30 * ]-[andful_of_not waiting for real testing it :) Apr 09 20:12:30 be it one :) Apr 09 20:13:22 well i am happy to put up a binary tonight and after a bit more discussion with a couple of people later on ill decide on the source tactic :) Apr 09 20:13:33 I'm developing a maemo application that would use interprocess communication, using both signals and methods, what do you guys recomend: dbus or libosso? Apr 09 20:13:33 MoRpHeUz: the changelog of the wiki page: https://maemo.org/community/wiki/__ais/rcs/6e1ebf54017511dd96cd8ffb9e08f938f938/ Apr 09 20:13:49 * lcuk is leaning towards gpl for now Apr 09 20:13:51 lcuk, release early, release often and GPL! :P Apr 09 20:13:59 dbus is more portable i guess Apr 09 20:14:08 Otherwise we're going to burn effigies of you. :D Apr 09 20:14:10 ie. already available for regular linux Apr 09 20:15:04 well i was reading up on a number of licenses and i need to keep options open for if i want to close it down later - but people have commented that since its my code anyway i can choose to just close off if required (and obviously getting permission from any additional contributors if any) Apr 09 20:15:28 KotCzarny: As far as I've read about libOSSO, it doesn't support signals, or I haven't found anything about it. Apr 09 20:15:36 lcuk, why would you close it? Apr 09 20:15:59 thiagoss: i know next to nothing about libosso, unfortunatelly Apr 09 20:16:14 KotCzarny: I see, thanks :) Apr 09 20:16:20 because i work in a closed source shop and if i decide to incorporate it into one of our apps i know it would only be possible if i didnt have to give everything away Apr 09 20:16:36 lcuk, maybe bsd licence then? Apr 09 20:16:54 fork it, then. Apr 09 20:16:55 seeing that m$ was happily using it in their kernel Apr 09 20:17:01 Maintain a closed version and a GPL version. Apr 09 20:17:32 so you can allow others using your code, and close it for yourself later too Apr 09 20:17:33 im not sure yet. GeneralAntilles i wouldnt need to fork it - i could just say "right, no more gpl updates" and that would be that - the code upto that point would remain open and available Apr 09 20:17:51 lcuk: search for a new shop ;) Apr 09 20:18:13 That's an option, too, but the less desirable one for the community at large. :P Apr 09 20:18:14 i was asking this earlier and thinking along the lines of a dual license, but since its my code i dont need to.. Apr 09 20:18:29 nwhy - i update everything and would be doing the code Apr 09 20:18:41 if someone wanted some part of it it wouldnt be hidden Apr 09 20:18:46 lcuk, anyway, it's your own code, so no one could tell you what to do after closing it Apr 09 20:18:52 no matter what licence it was Apr 09 20:18:59 exactly.. Apr 09 20:19:06 so im thinking of keeping it simple Apr 09 20:19:21 qgil: okay... well, I should be able to attend and prepare a little bit about GPE and syncing... but not that much. Apr 09 20:19:27 * lcuk has read up on about 40 licenses today and my eyes are swimming in legalese Apr 09 20:19:31 the only way licences are for is to keep other from profiting (unlawfully) from your work Apr 09 20:19:47 *others Apr 09 20:20:39 flo_lap, no, my boss is a good man who pays well and gives me enough freedom to code as i need to :) Apr 09 20:20:55 flo_lap: the most important part is to be active during the track - we are looking for bright minds with opinions about maemo present & future Apr 09 20:21:27 qgil, unless you could get nokia to pay me better than him ;) Apr 09 20:21:41 qgil: how much is that? (joking) Apr 09 20:21:51 :D Apr 09 20:22:04 (starts to be late here..................zzzzzzz) Apr 09 20:22:32 nice to finally see you qgil though, ive heard rumours you existed Apr 09 20:22:40 Ha Apr 09 20:22:47 wait, I'm not leaving Apr 09 20:22:58 I want to have that wiki page almost clear Apr 09 20:23:05 What advantages libosso has over dbus for inter application communication? Apr 09 20:23:20 and whilst we have you, can you dig out a powervr driver from within nokia please ;) Apr 09 20:23:51 what was milhouse's name? (my brain starts to slip seriously) Apr 09 20:23:54 all these 3d devices are making our little tablets nervous Apr 09 20:24:08 Neil MacLeod, qgil. Apr 09 20:24:21 lcuk: c'mon, all devices I know are 3D Apr 09 20:24:45 you mean in space or rendering capabilities? Apr 09 20:24:52 Haha Apr 09 20:25:52 qgil: ok, should be possible somehow i hope :) Apr 09 20:25:54 imagine a 3d tablet... you would hold it and your fingers would fall off Apr 09 20:25:58 2d Apr 09 20:26:01 dang Apr 09 20:26:48 flo_lap: good, thanks! Apr 09 20:27:13 about 1. COMMUNITY we need 1-2 more names Apr 09 20:27:31 I'm droping from that slot since I think I'm more useful in 4. maemo.org what next Apr 09 20:28:05 qgil: Since OpenEmbedded will be there maybe someone could talk about what you can do with it for maemo. Apr 09 20:28:36 <]-[andful_of_not> flo_lap: the mamona guys have been contributing and using that for building for the tablets Apr 09 20:28:46 keesj: plans to talk about Mamona Apr 09 20:28:53 qgil: ... thinking about Jalimo, Maona and Maemo support in OE Apr 09 20:29:11 <]-[andful_of_not> actually Mike from open was here in the offices merging the changes from our team into their reps :) Apr 09 20:29:40 sure, I'm looking for names to put in slots :) Apr 09 20:30:28 ]-[andful_of_not: Right... someone from mamona would be nice to see there Apr 09 20:30:30 i honestly think GeneralAntilles would be great there. hes very active in the community. has seen the tablets evolve. shame hes stateside. (sorry gen, but its all true) Apr 09 20:31:02 <]-[andful_of_not> flo_lap: I think the guys are available Vivijim is a good name Apr 09 20:31:02 and he has a laptop 800 ;) Apr 09 20:31:10 as I say I'm sorry but this we can't afford intercontinental flights - next time (September, perhaps) Apr 09 20:31:11 lcuk: i do not think that pressure stuff work out of the box. compiled fine, but when I try to use the app, every tap (or finger press) does the same thing. Apr 09 20:31:23 ah too bad Apr 09 20:31:56 i didnt use it directly, i just needed to know which calls to make and hammered the rest into my code. Apr 09 20:31:59 lcuk: you were saying that you might have to calibrate the device. do you know if "screen calibration" the app, does this? Apr 09 20:32:07 <]-[andful_of_not> ah didn't know that Apr 09 20:32:09 <]-[andful_of_not> too bad Apr 09 20:32:15 Jaffa: stil not around? Apr 09 20:32:36 Jaffa would be my other selection for community, to bad he can't attend. Apr 09 20:32:52 s/to/too/ Apr 09 20:32:53 GeneralAntilles meant: Jaffa would be my other selection for community, too bad he can't attend. Apr 09 20:33:22 dougt, do some printfs or display the pressure readings from xsp_event.pressure and see whats happening. on mine they range from about 300 Light touch) to about 120. i get a final reading of 0 when mouse up Apr 09 20:33:50 GeneralAntilles: wait, wait, perhaps Jaffa can attend Apr 09 20:33:52 yup Apr 09 20:33:54 i dont think the calibration tool works with the readings obtained here - i believe they need calibrating yourself Apr 09 20:34:07 lcuk: that is what I am doing.... the test app is pretty useless. Apr 09 20:34:13 I had mistaken "Jaffa" with Frantisek, that (I think) has a similar nickname Apr 09 20:34:18 Great! milhouse, Jaffa and X-Fade would be PERFECT. Apr 09 20:34:29 Jaffa is Andrew Flegg Apr 09 20:34:31 frantisek is fanoush Apr 09 20:34:33 :) Apr 09 20:34:48 are you getting the rawmouse event though? Apr 09 20:34:49 (event.type == xsp_event_base) Apr 09 20:34:58 yup. Apr 09 20:35:05 lcuk: i think I got what I need now. Apr 09 20:35:11 what pressure are you actually getting out of it Apr 09 20:35:27 http://maemo.org/community/wiki/linuxtag2008/ Apr 09 20:35:33 lcuk: 60s for my big fingers, and >200 for my pen Apr 09 20:35:42 this looks already like a cool program - missing still one candidate for the community update Apr 09 20:36:04 unless you press so hard you feel its gonna go through - a big fat finger pad is more spread out and gives higher pressure readings (its inverted) Apr 09 20:36:36 also - dont do LOTS of rendering or the xevent indicating stylus up (pressure==0) will not occur and you will stick 2 adjacent strokes together Apr 09 20:37:12 qgil: It looks like Phonelink is quite active again... I don't know the people working on it, but I think projects like this are quite important. Apr 09 20:38:45 flo_lap, it's okay Apr 09 20:38:53 I'm sad it doesn't support my phone Apr 09 20:38:59 * flo_lap updates Apr 09 20:40:50 let me ask directly: who is following regularly the conversation in this channel and would like to provide a subjective update in LinuxTag? Apr 09 20:41:23 * KotCzarny is not Apr 09 20:42:04 * flo_lap would... but days are too short Apr 09 20:42:07 ive been following closely and coding hard but i havent been here long enough to be an ambassador Apr 09 20:42:37 lcuk: who are you and where are you based (sorry for my ignorance, a 770 has more memory capacity than myself) Apr 09 20:42:43 I think there is a night shift and day shift on irc Apr 09 20:43:19 im just a n00b dev based in england. this nokia is my first linux device and my first tablet. Apr 09 20:43:32 * lcuk has had a steep learning curve Apr 09 20:43:48 in that wiki page there are already many "ambassadors", so I'm personally not worried about this Apr 09 20:44:34 lcuk: proposal for you Apr 09 20:45:11 lcuk: could you make a brief about maemo in the context of other mobile platforms around? why did you decide to invest your time here and not somewhere else? Apr 09 20:45:27 totally subjective, people could help you here on IRC Apr 09 20:45:38 from a n00b perspective Apr 09 20:45:43 you have 7 weeks or so Apr 09 20:45:59 and you don't need to get stressed Apr 09 20:46:00 it's what is interesting for a other people who haven't got the device yet Apr 09 20:46:08 lcuk: do you know if this is the only way to get pressure info from the device? is there something at the gtk layer? Apr 09 20:46:20 hildeon should just provide this for us, /me thinks Apr 09 20:46:27 (lcuk is getting many questions at once) ;) Apr 09 20:46:35 Is there any other OSS platforms really, which actually ship in numbers? Apr 09 20:46:46 im just checking dates actually, im in portugal the week before Apr 09 20:47:08 how many people would this be in front of Apr 09 20:47:18 no les than 900 Apr 09 20:47:19 * dougt takes a number. Apr 09 20:47:21 joking Apr 09 20:47:24 :> Apr 09 20:47:25 90? Apr 09 20:47:30 Used to be Zaurus. Apr 09 20:47:34 dougt: dont know any other way but if you find one let me know Apr 09 20:47:41 lol ok a room full of people Apr 09 20:47:57 will do Apr 09 20:48:01 GeneralAntilles: yeah, past tense.. Apr 09 20:48:13 lcuk could give a nice Windows-developer perspective. :P Apr 09 20:48:24 interesting too Apr 09 20:48:40 qgil, if you give me your mail address ill just go speak to the other half Apr 09 20:48:48 ill mail you back in a few minutes Apr 09 20:48:58 quim.gil @ nokia.com Apr 09 20:49:09 ok i was thinking pm but here is fine lol... Apr 09 20:49:11 you have the whole night, I'm switching off this thing now Apr 09 20:49:22 not that is a secret one Apr 09 20:49:37 ill have a ponder about whether i have anything valid to say and can contribute for you :) Apr 09 20:49:57 no, you ponder whether you can make it to Berlin those days or not Apr 09 20:49:58 :) Apr 09 20:50:00 ps - this nokia box takes me right back to my amiga days and i love coding on it Apr 09 20:50:15 lcuk: sometimes the old farts need to hear how it is for a n00b, they have forgotten Apr 09 20:50:16 'for it' Apr 09 20:50:17 :) Apr 09 20:50:30 still having issues with booting off mmc Apr 09 20:50:43 good thinking - hey folks in here will expect help to get this sorted Apr 09 20:50:56 alright, thanks for the agile collaboration - besides my sleepy soul Apr 09 20:50:59 how long would it be - 30mins? an hour? 5 mins and run away? Apr 09 20:51:01 after cloning, sd card no problems, fsck fine Apr 09 20:51:13 timing Apr 09 20:51:17 VRe__, :) Apr 09 20:51:19 flexible Apr 09 20:51:37 each slot has 1h to be shared between the participants + questions, discussions Apr 09 20:51:39 after failed to boot off mmc, booting to internal flash, the sd card is corrupted, any thoughts on what might be causing it? Apr 09 20:51:45 ok i'll let you know by tomorrow (must also check dayjob commits) but thank you for the offer Apr 09 20:52:03 * lcuk gets all excited and runs off downstairs Apr 09 20:52:09 I rather go for a model where you come up with a brilliant speech of just 5-10 minutes and then the rest comes from people's discussion Apr 09 20:52:18 jobu: that's what vfat partition is for i think Apr 09 20:52:43 nite zzzzzzzzzzzz Apr 09 20:52:59 lcuk: finish your reader/libs in time and you will have so much to talk about :) Apr 09 20:52:59 * jott sees lcuk protesting for powervr drivers and starting a riot Apr 09 20:53:20 well it happens with the 2 partition setup fat16 first and linux 2nd Apr 09 20:53:39 hum Apr 09 20:53:45 but is it actually corrupt? Apr 09 20:53:49 PMSL jott Apr 09 20:53:51 ie. does it mount in another comp? Apr 09 20:54:09 mounts but when ls some dir have errors Apr 09 20:54:15 hum Apr 09 20:54:59 are you sure that the sd is in ok shape? Apr 09 20:55:17 i dunno, checked with badblocks and no errors there Apr 09 20:55:27 but still haven't gotten around to getting a 2nd card to try with Apr 09 20:55:36 try another partitions setup? Apr 09 20:55:51 ie, 64mb vfat following 1gb ext3 Apr 09 20:55:55 tried 2 partition and 1 partition ext2/3 Apr 09 20:56:32 hm linuxtag will be exciting for the maemo community - i hope there is a nice "aftershow" location to chat with all of you in rl :) Apr 09 20:56:56 jobu, it's ext3, right? Apr 09 20:57:01 you can check that it is ok by dd:ing 1's and zeros on the card.. if if fails then its trash Apr 09 20:57:07 jott: copy party? ;) Apr 09 20:57:10 it has been, i've tried ext2 and 3 >.< Apr 09 20:57:23 i lost track how many tries i've done heh Apr 09 20:57:54 jobu: bad sd contacts? :) Apr 09 20:58:07 though if it's repeatable it would be something else Apr 09 20:58:12 like bad software Apr 09 20:58:12 i tried in internal and external slots =( Apr 09 20:58:24 and badblocks pass so i don't think so Apr 09 20:58:26 What I read here, seems that this linuxtag might be something to get the big gear moving (finally) Apr 09 21:00:07 jott: should be easy to arrange in berlin Apr 09 21:00:17 flo_lap: yeah sure still needs some coordination Apr 09 21:00:46 jott: indeed... would be good to have someone who knows the city Apr 09 21:00:55 KotCzarny: http://xkcd.com/364/ i was more thinking of this :> Apr 09 21:01:22 jott: :) Apr 09 21:02:22 jott: you mean getting drunk and being irresponsible? Apr 09 21:02:24 :) Apr 09 21:02:38 pssst Apr 09 21:04:00 i don't get it Apr 09 21:04:09 why people drink? Apr 09 21:04:17 ie. mind numbing beverages Apr 09 21:04:31 it makes life more tolerable Apr 09 21:04:51 * glass had to stop drinking, pancreas couldn't handle it Apr 09 21:04:55 is life so untolerable? Apr 09 21:04:59 yes Apr 09 21:05:02 hum Apr 09 21:05:40 but it often introduces new problems Apr 09 21:05:46 to the existing ones Apr 09 21:05:47 sometimes Apr 09 21:05:49 see jott's link Apr 09 21:05:51 :) Apr 09 21:06:14 for some it works too good(for a short time) Apr 09 21:06:25 like cocaine? Apr 09 21:06:34 and some just do plain silly stuff Apr 09 21:06:54 though some theorise that they might want to do the silly stuff when sober too(but can stop themselfs) Apr 09 21:07:04 yeah Apr 09 21:07:24 "the truth is in wine" or how the saying goes Apr 09 21:07:45 i would disagree Apr 09 21:07:56 good liar could lie being drunk too Apr 09 21:08:04 yes Apr 09 21:08:08 and most often drunk people just talk trash Apr 09 21:08:09 i could do that Apr 09 21:08:26 i did enjoy drinking Apr 09 21:08:40 whiskeys, cognacs for just taste too Apr 09 21:08:49 i drank during my college years Apr 09 21:09:03 well, why did you drink then? Apr 09 21:09:09 social thing Apr 09 21:09:18 and curiosity Apr 09 21:09:26 'what's in this' Apr 09 21:09:36 and learning my body reactions Apr 09 21:10:16 alcohol just happens to be the socially accepted drug Apr 09 21:10:26 only because it's easy to make Apr 09 21:10:29 it's got lots of shitty effects Apr 09 21:10:30 Now you should try your reactions to SallyD KotC Apr 09 21:10:45 KotCzarny: cultural thing as well Apr 09 21:10:47 unixsnob: been there, done that Apr 09 21:10:50 (before it's outlawed) Apr 09 21:10:53 hmmm, can you boot off a card in read only mode? Apr 09 21:10:58 glass: because it's easy to make Apr 09 21:11:02 howd ya like it? Apr 09 21:11:16 unixsnob: helped for my bad moods Apr 09 21:11:18 KotCzarny: weed is easy to grow too, but alcohol was popular in europe earlier Apr 09 21:11:32 glass: weed wasn't global Apr 09 21:11:44 alcohol is a substance that can be made with everything Apr 09 21:11:47 (nearly) Apr 09 21:11:54 yeah Apr 09 21:12:15 i'm just bitter about the crappier effects Apr 09 21:12:16 if columbus discovered weed instead of tobacco Apr 09 21:12:26 we would have ganja corporations by now Apr 09 21:12:27 :) Apr 09 21:12:47 that cause me being unable to drink(or face pancreatitis again) Apr 09 21:14:38 the only thing i can think about alco is that's easy and popular Apr 09 21:14:52 and 'legal' Apr 09 21:15:25 :/ Apr 09 21:15:29 and people like easy ways to run from problems Apr 09 21:15:35 pupnik: ? Apr 09 21:15:49 no comment Apr 09 21:16:34 good food, a nice woman, and a nice snes RPG Apr 09 21:16:41 :) Apr 09 21:17:08 but drinking a beer does not mean getting drunk. Apr 09 21:17:14 http://arstechnica.com/news.ars/post/20080409-first-look-mozilla-fennec-targets-handheld-browser-market.html <- ouch. does not look good for microb... Apr 09 21:17:43 (at least not necessarily) Apr 09 21:17:45 if you want have you head all messed up really cheap, try sleep deprivation ;-) Apr 09 21:18:04 wnd: been there, done that Apr 09 21:18:17 i can attest to that wnd, 48 hours and it was as if i was drunk... Apr 09 21:18:45 KotCzarny: you are straight edge now? Apr 09 21:18:51 I don't really know how it is like to be drunk, but I know it really makes it difficut to think straight Apr 09 21:19:04 How do you mean, t_s_o? Apr 09 21:19:06 jott: not there yet, because i'm lacking in social department Apr 09 21:19:16 That MicroB benchmark is from the release last year. :P Apr 09 21:19:35 ah, oops... Apr 09 21:19:37 Which is from a very early Gecko 1.9 snapshot. Apr 09 21:19:59 so when diablo gets releases we will see the graph drop to fennec levels? Apr 09 21:20:01 wnd: being drunk disables body first, then your ability to judge (id gets over) Apr 09 21:20:07 If not better Apr 09 21:20:15 Since MicroB is better optimized for the tablets. Apr 09 21:20:44 heh, hope so. i see some very interesting configs on itt Apr 09 21:20:51 Not really Apr 09 21:21:05 The optimizations to the layout engine is... rather lacking. Apr 09 21:21:27 fit to width and all that? Apr 09 21:21:36 anyone know what the default filesystem on a sdhc card? like 4gb? Apr 09 21:21:46 vfat Apr 09 21:22:07 fat16 can only do 2gb Apr 09 21:22:09 know the partition code? w Apr 09 21:22:16 probably 'b' Apr 09 21:22:21 okies Apr 09 21:22:21 hmm, anyone know if microsoft will release info on that new fat format they announced? Apr 09 21:23:51 Fit to width is borked Apr 09 21:24:58 We haven't received an update in months. Apr 09 21:26:40 i like those big graphs that show 2 numbers in 50kb Apr 09 21:26:54 sorry, 200kb Apr 09 21:26:55 http://media.arstechnica.com/news.media/fennec-bench.png Apr 09 21:26:56 :) Apr 09 21:27:14 and it's a great news for meamo Apr 09 21:27:21 arm optimized browser, rejoice! Apr 09 21:27:45 Is there someone here which have right to push packages on maemo repository ? Apr 09 21:28:21 now news since ten hours i ve send it ... to extras ... is it normal ? Apr 09 21:28:29 s/now/no Apr 09 21:29:20 Khertan, talk to X-Fade_. Apr 09 21:30:06 ah thanks ... Apr 09 21:30:51 arg need to register Apr 09 21:31:58 huh, now rename the other one to 'Khertan_TheImaginary' Apr 09 21:32:02 :) Apr 09 21:32:08 lol Apr 09 21:32:12 KotCzarny: sad that the same does not apply for the rendering speed as it seems (alteast desktop ff3 is still super slow) Apr 09 21:32:18 it s at work ;) Apr 09 21:33:02 jott, hum, still, nice news that work is being done Apr 09 21:33:11 indeed Apr 09 21:33:21 * lcuk ponders Apr 09 21:34:14 'MS issues updated updater needed for SP1 update' Apr 09 21:34:18 o.o Apr 09 21:35:18 MS Style ... Apr 09 21:35:19 News update: MS updates info about updated updater needed for SP1 update Apr 09 21:35:34 update error: success. Apr 09 21:36:28 ###### ################### Apr 09 21:36:32 ########## ######################################## Apr 09 21:36:35 ############ ##################################################### Apr 09 21:36:37 fail Apr 09 21:36:39 ############## ################################################################# Apr 09 21:36:42 ############## ################################################################### Apr 09 21:36:44 (on 100px wide screen) Apr 09 21:36:45 ############## ################################################################# Apr 09 21:36:48 ############ ##################################################### Apr 09 21:36:52 ########## ######################################## Apr 09 21:36:55 ###### ################### Apr 09 21:36:59 oups ... stupid shortcut Apr 09 21:37:01 sorry Apr 09 21:37:17 Haha Apr 09 21:37:18 haha banner your life Apr 09 21:37:23 lol Apr 09 21:37:23 somebody set us up the bomb Apr 09 21:37:59 * KotCzarny sets up bomb for lcuk (at his request) Apr 09 21:38:12 ó Apr 09 21:38:15 We got signal! Apr 09 21:38:23 ... Apr 09 21:39:44 why cat need always to play with my screen each time i m in front of my computer Apr 09 21:40:06 install cat typing detector Apr 09 21:40:08 as i don't use mouse it shouldn't be attracted by that ... Apr 09 21:40:53 the cat want's to use the keyboard mouse Apr 09 21:41:03 Woo Apr 09 21:43:17 hey.. anyone attempt to connect a USB keyboard to the NIT? That is, a USB keyboard that has the larger connector? I'm wondering if theres an adapter that would work, and if I can expect the NIT to automatically recognize it Apr 09 21:43:31 yes Apr 09 21:43:40 you will need to switch to hostmode though Apr 09 21:43:48 unixSnob, use the nokia provided charger cable and a female - female dongle Apr 09 21:43:51 and check for power rating Apr 09 21:43:59 more than 100mA and it will fail often Apr 09 21:44:01 there is a software toggle as kot has mentioned Apr 09 21:44:13 unixSnob, jolouis makes an OTG dongle Apr 09 21:44:21 in my faq Apr 09 21:44:22 :) Apr 09 21:44:27 time to find out if it was my card or not, got my hands on another one XD Apr 09 21:44:30 http://www.internettablettalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=15705 Apr 09 21:44:39 this is my keyboard: http://www.gyration.com/c-2-mice-keyboards.aspx Apr 09 21:44:45 ty Apr 09 21:45:57 seprgj[ sgjis ero[igj seriogjs erg Apr 09 21:46:08 ha, and what's funny is I got one of these USB kits that has just about every kind of USB adapter you can imagine, except this one Apr 09 21:46:09 i can't believe all the time i wasted was cuz of my stupid card Apr 09 21:46:24 works fine with new one -_- Apr 09 21:46:34 jobu: happy now? Apr 09 21:46:40 at least you learned new things Apr 09 21:46:41 sorta lol Apr 09 21:46:41 :) Apr 09 21:46:54 so now you can have 2gb internal os Apr 09 21:46:58 and 4gb external storage Apr 09 21:46:59 :) Apr 09 21:47:05 well new card is 1gb Apr 09 21:47:15 still, bigger than 256mb Apr 09 21:47:16 :) Apr 09 21:47:17 so i have about 640mb free Apr 09 21:47:23 with 64mb fat Apr 09 21:47:50 which is still nice but i don't know if it will be enough to install all compiling tools and compile omniorb XD Apr 09 21:48:07 :) Apr 09 21:48:17 you can always partition that 4gb card Apr 09 21:48:22 to snatch some space Apr 09 21:48:22 :) Apr 09 21:48:23 what do u think of this web site design ? : file:///home/khertan/Bureau/motion/index.html Apr 09 21:48:29 oups Apr 09 21:48:31 :> Apr 09 21:48:35 hrm, so any thoughts on how to tell what was causing it like perhaps some boot sector thing? Apr 09 21:48:42 http://khertan.net/motion/ Apr 09 21:49:30 I think the maemo software tab is a little big Apr 09 21:49:36 its expansion is rathe jarring. Apr 09 21:49:41 well, to any of you thinking of booting off SD card, my PQI card fails so i'd avoid that brand Apr 09 21:49:54 maybe that's why they're so cheap ;-) Apr 09 21:49:59 ya lol Apr 09 21:50:16 Otherwise it looks great, khertan__. Apr 09 21:50:22 but it works fine in my digi cam so oh well Apr 09 21:50:24 khertan__: it looks nice but it's unusable :) Apr 09 21:51:15 jott & GeneralAntilles : ok ... i find this nice ... but for a small site ... it s unusable ... and no really navigation friendly Apr 09 21:51:17 (e.g. switching from maemo software to the sections below) Apr 09 21:51:40 s/ but for a small site/ but for a small site only Apr 09 21:52:40 The design would be fine if each of the tabs were less than a page in length. Apr 09 21:54:30 so there would be to many tabs ... which not fit in the size of the page. Apr 09 21:55:19 i vetested with a lower resolution than mine (n810) .... unusable Apr 09 21:56:06 Other option would be to arrange the tabs along the top Apr 09 21:56:16 and have them swipe from left/right. Apr 09 21:57:29 hey w/ that adapter, I can use the NIT to power a USB mini refridgerator! :P Apr 09 21:57:36 nope Apr 09 21:57:41 you only have 100mA Apr 09 21:57:58 Er, no. :P Apr 09 21:58:03 It's only 100mA Apr 09 21:58:18 You'd need a powered hub. ;) Apr 09 21:58:31 hmm.. i thought usb was spec'd to 500 mA Apr 09 21:58:38 It's OTG spec Apr 09 21:58:42 not fullsize spec Apr 09 21:58:53 unixsnob: it wasn't meant to be used in host mode Apr 09 21:58:56 The battery isn't juicy enough to push 500mA Apr 09 22:01:16 it is, but only for about 5 minutes Apr 09 22:01:31 Same difference. ;) Apr 09 22:01:31 lcuk, anyone tried? Apr 09 22:01:40 no, 100 is hardware limit Apr 09 22:01:46 :) Apr 09 22:02:08 and actually, yes i know it is because my kb is 100ma rated. when i push one key at a time it works Apr 09 22:02:09 i believe i have seen 200mA number somewhere Apr 09 22:02:13 describing the port Apr 09 22:02:31 but when i chord it knocked the power draw over 100ma and the usb chip dies a horrible battery popping heart stopping death... Apr 09 22:03:01 add capacitor? Apr 09 22:03:02 :> Apr 09 22:03:03 no, 100ma is the USB initial interface wake up draw. an OTB device must not ever attempt to draw or supply more than this figure Apr 09 22:03:28 sounds like for chording it could help Apr 09 22:03:32 after the init stage a full usb adapter can go upto 500ma but there is not the same requirement for otg Apr 09 22:03:46 it doesnt matter i got apple wireless Apr 09 22:03:59 :) Apr 09 22:04:23 lcuk, if you go to LinuxTag you have to start a PowerVR riot. :P Apr 09 22:07:06 Is it possible that my Gyration USB keyboard/mouse transceiver would attempt to draw more than 100 mA? Apr 09 22:07:18 read it's specs Apr 09 22:07:23 should be on the bottom Apr 09 22:07:40 Yes Apr 09 22:08:04 unixSnob: it's definitely possible. Apr 09 22:09:11 sigh. maemo-mapper can't load a 9MB GPX file into memory. Apr 09 22:09:30 enable swap ? Apr 09 22:09:48 or it simply states that it's too big? Apr 09 22:10:27 it simply crashes. Apr 09 22:11:06 it may be killed by oom killer Apr 09 22:11:10 dmesg|tail Apr 09 22:11:13 you will see Apr 09 22:11:16 it probably uses some silly XML library which reads the entire file into memory, and creates a data structure. Apr 09 22:11:23 if that's the case enabling swap could help Apr 09 22:11:40 Go talk to gnuite. Apr 09 22:12:37 Oh, I didn't expect it work. Even if it loaded it, I expect that the render time would put me to sleep. Apr 09 22:12:54 There's no power specs on the AS00216 transceiver.. but I don't think it will hurt to try. Certainly the NIT won't over power it, and underpowering doesn't fry things Apr 09 22:13:05 we're talking about over 1 lakh vectors Apr 09 22:13:25 lakh ? Apr 09 22:14:00 we have words for 1E3 and 1E6. Indians have words for 1E5 (lakh) and 1E7 (crore) Apr 09 22:14:09 lol Apr 09 22:14:22 lakh: translation: "a lot" Apr 09 22:14:29 crore: translation: "a fucking lot" Apr 09 22:14:34 :) Apr 09 22:15:13 they have a show: "Who wants to be a Crorepati?" Apr 09 22:15:29 you can guess how the show goes, I'll venture. Apr 09 22:15:47 is it a play on the word 'psychopatic' ? Apr 09 22:16:22 Even storing 8 double's worth of data per vector, 100,000 vectors is still only 6MB of real data. Apr 09 22:16:48 derf: add info tag Apr 09 22:18:10 I don't know what you're putting in your info tag... but you can still fit quite a lot before you run into problems. Apr 09 22:18:17 hi is anybody bored? Apr 09 22:18:25 i am Apr 09 22:18:30 Never, pupnik. :D Apr 09 22:18:32 though i'm in a bad mood Apr 09 22:18:34 yeah, but I believe that maemo-mapper is using an xml library. Anybody want to venture a guess as to whether it's memory efficient? Apr 09 22:18:36 found the USB adapter for $7 shipped: http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detail/-/B000Y6UL5E/ref=ord_cart_shr?%5Fencoding=UTF8&m=A1SHTSJSJQA89P&v=glance Apr 09 22:18:45 pupnik, quick word Apr 09 22:19:03 xu4 could use a touchscreen interface Apr 09 22:19:09 unixSnob, I'd get the one from jolouis. Apr 09 22:19:13 new lib? Apr 09 22:19:17 That'll switch to host-mode automagically. Apr 09 22:19:18 ie. new ver? Apr 09 22:19:28 ah, nice Apr 09 22:19:40 Plus, you'll be supporting the community. :P Apr 09 22:20:16 yeah, it's swapping already. Apr 09 22:20:40 how much? Apr 09 22:20:44 pupnik: do you support X and a mouse already? Apr 09 22:21:05 i support X for president Apr 09 22:21:14 can we trust X ? Apr 09 22:21:29 nelson for xu4? Apr 09 22:21:40 x11? Apr 09 22:22:44 pupnik: that's what I'm asking. Does xu4 support X11 and a mouse? Apr 09 22:22:49 x11 looks like 'multiply by 11' Apr 09 22:23:55 no Apr 09 22:24:08 do you like ultima? Apr 09 22:24:26 i can work on it some more ... but i really just play xu4 with bluetooth or n810 kbd Apr 09 22:29:38 as a rule, are these mini USB sockets like what's on the NIT normally in client mode? Apr 09 22:30:18 it's called 'device mode' Apr 09 22:30:20 i think Apr 09 22:30:24 yes, however the socket/plug specification allows for a hostmode cable which if configured at the pins will automatically enabled hosted usb sessions Apr 09 22:30:36 Megahoc.v22 ??? Anyone familiar with it? Apr 09 22:31:27 Its some ad hoc connection that seems to follow me where ever i go. Apr 09 22:31:47 but it cannot be done with the nokia cable because it is not connected inside the moulded cable Apr 09 22:32:08 first adhoc listed in your connections. its like freelan or whatever it is Apr 09 22:32:50 City wide? Apr 09 22:33:00 at one point you will have attempted to connect to it, because its adhoc it stays in your list, and you are yourself giving it out to others ;) Apr 09 22:33:10 Ohhhhh Apr 09 22:33:58 it tries to rebuild itself by broadcasting that its adhoc, someone else nearby tries connecting and whammo... its on their list so when you get back home even after clearing it up the person down the road tries to offer it you again Apr 09 22:34:06 its a very elegant virus :) Apr 09 22:34:16 (blame microsoft i think) Apr 09 22:34:16 That would explain why my work mates started seeing it also Apr 09 22:34:51 there are certain names sweeping around towns and some common ones involve the free ones Apr 09 22:34:58 i read a great article on it earlier this week Apr 09 22:35:02 ill find it.. Apr 09 22:35:02 hehe Apr 09 22:35:31 Wonderful... I tried to google it and came out not knowing much Apr 09 22:35:48 ziegler: you want it to spread to google too? Apr 09 22:35:57 Lol Apr 09 22:37:39 Any reason to adhoc two tablets? Apr 09 22:38:15 Fun Apr 09 22:38:17 Bomberman Apr 09 22:38:35 ziegler: sharing a phone conenction? Apr 09 22:38:50 2 player games would be AMAZING Apr 09 22:39:00 nintendo ds :) Apr 09 22:39:07 x player games... Apr 09 22:39:15 multiplayer over different platform would rock Apr 09 22:40:04 So.... Could i create an adhoc cennection and have other devices do the same thing... Spread my silly adhoc name? Apr 09 22:40:33 Ziegler: yes, in theory Apr 09 22:40:44 :> Apr 09 22:40:51 (Not planning to... Just curriuos if it works that way) Apr 09 22:40:57 it's like a chain lettor Apr 09 22:41:00 ;) Apr 09 22:41:12 Infected by the Free Public Wifi virus http://travel.timesonline.co.uk/tol/life_and_style/travel/business/article3554838.ece Apr 09 22:41:25 Hehe thats quite rediculous Apr 09 22:41:38 plenty of other links available, but thats basically the article and available to find more from there :) Apr 09 22:41:43 free public adhoc network would be nice Apr 09 22:41:44 :) Apr 09 22:41:53 Danke Apr 09 22:41:57 "FREE INTERWEB PORN" Apr 09 22:42:03 Lol Apr 09 22:42:25 Thanks for the info... Sorry abot the off topic Apr 09 22:42:30 tube me, tube you Apr 09 22:42:46 Figured you all would have an answer Apr 09 22:44:47 yessir, we are hax0rz Apr 09 22:44:55 hax0rz know everything Apr 09 22:45:05 (future perfect) Apr 09 22:47:24 lcuk: I was wondering where Free Public Wifi came from.... Apr 09 22:49:27 i should setup 'free cookies' Apr 09 22:49:29 :> Apr 09 22:52:29 ooooooh the Free Public Wifi! Apr 09 22:52:35 I've seen that, like everywhere Apr 09 22:53:39 I should rename my wifi network to that. Give my housemates a fit Apr 09 22:53:55 * KotCzarny luckily doesn't see it on the list Apr 09 22:54:41 thats cos your network list is filled with "free midget porn" :P Apr 09 22:55:06 nope, nothing with 'free' Apr 09 22:56:23 i wonder actually if this could be why my nokia turns network back on in the night - if something comes around and wakes up mine (which is set to adhoc) whether it will wakeup and broadcast itself even though i have it configured to ask for connection Apr 09 22:56:45 The "Free Public Wifi" I saw in Chicago's O'Hare airport was there to break into Windows computers from the "local network" when they tried to connect. Apr 09 22:57:04 http://news.zdnet.com/2100-1035_22-6122707.html Apr 09 22:57:32 not at all - it will have just been someones windows laptop and nothing odd especially after reading the other articles Apr 09 22:58:09 it doesnt take hackers, it takes business managers running microsofts cludges Apr 09 22:58:15 :> Apr 09 22:58:25 lcuk: Try it with a honeypot in O'Hare :-) Apr 09 22:59:18 shapr: does it do linux boxes too? Apr 09 22:59:19 :) Apr 09 22:59:59 Nah Apr 09 23:00:22 but if they were 1337 hax0rz wouldnt they have linux skills? Apr 09 23:00:28 At least, Linux isn't less secure when it's on the "local network" Apr 09 23:00:39 Its not really a virus.. It doesnt do any harm... Just remove it for the connections list Apr 09 23:00:49 zieglar: it could Apr 09 23:00:55 human is the weakest link Apr 09 23:00:57 Yes it coild Apr 09 23:01:20 Could... If somone one the othe end was using it for suce purposes Apr 09 23:01:34 BAN LAPTOPS. this virus would not spread if laptops are illegal. Apr 09 23:01:40 :) Apr 09 23:01:50 lcuk: wm based phones? Apr 09 23:02:01 But the adhoc connection by itself is just funny Apr 09 23:02:04 (with wifi) Apr 09 23:02:05 do they have same wifi stack? Apr 09 23:02:15 never had one Apr 09 23:02:18 so i can't comment Apr 09 23:02:20 Zig.free.wifi Apr 09 23:02:32 Add hoc on my device now Apr 09 23:02:37 Adhoc Apr 09 23:02:46 even i find it hard to believe MS could get two totally seperate design teams to come up with the same behaviour on more than one operating system Apr 09 23:03:06 hell, that would mean they were following some kind of a rulebook Apr 09 23:03:11 It did it on my nokia device Apr 09 23:03:19 only cos you wanted free internet Apr 09 23:03:25 or your missus did Apr 09 23:03:25 Heheh Apr 09 23:03:27 or your dog Apr 09 23:03:30 lcuk: they need some interoperability on their boxes, don't they? Apr 09 23:03:41 yes, but thats whaty a floppy is for Apr 09 23:03:53 it is Apr 09 23:04:03 but not for m$ os Apr 09 23:04:13 it tries to think for you Apr 09 23:04:26 and i guess it will do it in their every project Apr 09 23:04:48 the 4 worst lines of code microsoft ever invented: on error resume next Apr 09 23:05:16 bits* Apr 09 23:05:19 Hehe Apr 09 23:05:21 that's one line Apr 09 23:05:22 :) Apr 09 23:05:52 * lcuk thinks you get the idea though Apr 09 23:06:01 yup Apr 09 23:06:31 on error print success Apr 09 23:06:32 ;) Apr 09 23:06:39 that one is nice too Apr 09 23:06:42 hehe Apr 09 23:08:22 * lcuk juggles about 10 things round his head Apr 09 23:09:48 * fysa catches a stray bolt Apr 09 23:10:14 electrostatic fun Apr 09 23:12:00 ok, i'll start simple. i heard earlier that i can add myself to sudoers file at installation time to enable a runtime software turbo option (it will either change to performance, or change the ondemand%threshold) do i need to make a .deb file for that to all work and will the user themselves ever need to be root Apr 09 23:12:17 myself==liqbase program Apr 09 23:12:22 hmm Apr 09 23:12:37 you should add a script that will ask user Apr 09 23:12:47 its optional only so wouldnt change without permission Apr 09 23:12:57 or a carefully crafted suid binary Apr 09 23:13:00 no - it will default off, user will have to say "full speed" Apr 09 23:13:58 name it lcuk-helper and it will do only 2 things Apr 09 23:14:20 i suppose the script could work, but then i need to make sure noone can alter the script to do something im not expecting. but because its a script it will turbo on and turbo off Apr 09 23:14:20 1/ set default governor, 2/ set performance Apr 09 23:14:29 you can't suid a script Apr 09 23:14:36 it needs to be a binary Apr 09 23:14:48 hence me saying add the installed app to it? Apr 09 23:14:55 does it need a second binary? Apr 09 23:14:57 though i don't know if it's the case with busybox ash Apr 09 23:15:14 lcuk: you don't want to suid something complicated Apr 09 23:15:24 more ways to introduce exploitable bugs Apr 09 23:15:30 agreed Apr 09 23:15:46 * lcuk can see the logic here Apr 09 23:16:06 it's a linux philosophy, do one thing, but do it perfect Apr 09 23:16:11 (or at least good enough [tm]) Apr 09 23:16:12 :) Apr 09 23:16:23 or maybe it's unix Apr 09 23:16:48 if thats the case then, couldnt we just call it liq_ondemandtweak? then its name says what it is Apr 09 23:17:18 and it could feasibly be used for something else - either all that of course or hope diablo makes it redundant Apr 09 23:17:20 liq_cpufreq_governor_helper Apr 09 23:17:21 ;) Apr 09 23:17:50 liq_cpufreq_governor_helper -TURBO Apr 09 23:18:04 hmmm Apr 09 23:18:10 you will have to store default governor somewhere too Apr 09 23:18:56 governor isnt so bad Apr 09 23:19:07 if i change the %age it reverts after a reboot Apr 09 23:19:26 but by default its 80% it just needs lowering to 40 Apr 09 23:19:42 or to anything that was before Apr 09 23:19:52 you don't want to piss of user Apr 09 23:19:53 :) Apr 09 23:20:22 *off Apr 09 23:20:27 yer which is why i was doing it in software as root. grab current, apply turbo. run program. restore original exit Apr 09 23:21:01 heh, it could still do it - "runasturbo myprogram" Apr 09 23:22:31 i would prefer to not need it, but i cannot expect a user to install root and i cannot keep bumping up the processing just to force it to be busy. its more of a waste. %age does seem like best avenue at present Apr 09 23:23:20 yup Apr 09 23:23:30 though sudo way can be nice too Apr 09 23:23:45 but user cannot sudo from the console in device Apr 09 23:24:25 installation process has root right -> add your sudo commands -> user's program can run those commands Apr 09 23:24:36 or am i wrong? Apr 09 23:24:45 thats the impression i get Apr 09 23:24:58 that i'm wrong? Apr 09 23:24:59 lol Apr 09 23:25:02 lol Apr 09 23:25:30 i thought once you were added to the sudoers list running an instance of that app ran it in root context Apr 09 23:25:41 without needing to sudo xyz Apr 09 23:25:58 no, you only add specific command Apr 09 23:26:04 sudo checks the permissions and asks the user. items added to sudoers doesnt need to because its trusted Apr 09 23:26:06 and no, you shouldn't add sudo * Apr 09 23:26:12 yes - i under stand we add this helper Apr 09 23:26:21 erm Apr 09 23:26:23 no Apr 09 23:26:27 suid is something else Apr 09 23:26:28 :) Apr 09 23:27:41 if you add to sudo list: echo performance > /sys/something/governor Apr 09 23:27:52 user can do: sudo echo performance > /sys/something/governor Apr 09 23:27:55 and nothing else Apr 09 23:28:12 unless you add '*' somewhere Apr 09 23:28:22 will user be asked for password when calling sudo with that command? Apr 09 23:28:47 don't know, probably not if there's NOPASSWORD on the line Apr 09 23:28:59 or will it just run the command as a trusted authorized call Apr 09 23:29:30 look in the sudoers file Apr 09 23:29:52 so, really this could be handled without needing a seperate exe if we just added those echo lines required to switch modes? Apr 09 23:30:00 yes Apr 09 23:30:01 that was my next question, where is it? Apr 09 23:30:18 but the command will need to be typed exactly the same Apr 09 23:30:20 visudo ? Apr 09 23:30:21 :) Apr 09 23:30:27 or somewhere in /etc Apr 09 23:30:28 yes i can understand that Apr 09 23:30:51 im slowly getting used to things being case sensitive Apr 09 23:30:58 surprisingly enough nokia has been wise enough to include visudo in os2008 Apr 09 23:32:03 if you decide to edit the file, you may want to take a look at the manual page first, http://www.sudo.ws/sudo/man/sudoers.html Apr 09 23:32:35 also it looks like they have modularized it Apr 09 23:32:38 ive got LOTS of things to sort out before i even consider touching a single file on somebodies system Apr 09 23:32:59 * lcuk is still treading on eggshells Apr 09 23:33:20 *nix is fun Apr 09 23:33:26 * GeneralAntilles throws ninja stars for luck to dodge. Apr 09 23:34:24 * lcuk throws a 2d nokia tablet at GeneralAntilles and neatly slices the screen off his apple laptop Apr 09 23:35:35 * GeneralAntilles doesn't have any laptops, fool! Apr 09 23:35:42 i take it lots of installers still use the older update-sudoers program/script, or is that a part of visudo? Apr 09 23:37:38 Nokia-N800-51-3:~# dpkg -S update-sudoers Apr 09 23:37:38 sudo: /usr/sbin/update-sudoers Apr 09 23:37:50 it's a part of sudo package Apr 09 23:38:05 same for visudo Apr 09 23:38:59 hmm Apr 09 23:39:10 some freaking page eats 100% cpu from my firefox Apr 09 23:39:28 arstechnica.com, doh. Apr 09 23:40:03 I had four nasty firefox crashes today, two simultaneously on two different machines that I was using via synergy. Apr 09 23:40:23 bad protons Apr 09 23:40:24 badverts? Apr 09 23:40:29 Firefox fails fysa! Apr 09 23:40:41 both caused Windows (blech) to fall apart, cascading 100% CPU usage down through explorer.exe and a dozen random rundlls. ;) Apr 09 23:40:44 breaking news! Apr 09 23:41:05 check your firefoxen are patched Apr 09 23:41:29 and double check the av.. Apr 09 23:41:50 startkeylogger ? Apr 09 23:41:51 :) Apr 09 23:41:52 oh crap!!! its late again Apr 09 23:42:01 heh Apr 09 23:42:05 To bed! Apr 09 23:42:07 Run run run! Apr 09 23:42:17 i was meant to be getting an early night but it feels like i have had pro plus Apr 09 23:42:53 how the heck do i get up infront of a load of people and tell them about my nokia? Apr 09 23:43:02 Haha Apr 09 23:43:07 You have 7 weeks. :P Apr 09 23:43:11 I'm sure we can think something up. Apr 09 23:43:38 and, no i wont be saying anything directly about pvr Apr 09 23:43:43 hmm Apr 09 23:43:45 slides Apr 09 23:43:46 ;) Apr 09 23:43:53 people will look at them Apr 09 23:43:55 i hopefully wont need to because ill have fullscreen full color rendering by then Apr 09 23:43:58 and not at you Apr 09 23:43:58 :) Apr 09 23:44:01 umm Apr 09 23:44:03 i've been wondering Apr 09 23:44:11 they will only look at them if i put the software there myself Apr 09 23:44:12 wtf is with everyon and the + or - infront of their speech Apr 09 23:44:30 It's your client, phunguy. Apr 09 23:44:33 its ratings - like slashdot or digg Apr 09 23:44:37 you can moderate us Apr 09 23:44:51 KotCzarny didn't have it before Apr 09 23:45:05 phunguy: hmm? Apr 09 23:45:11 KotCzarny, if i have slides though it will be like i am coasting Apr 09 23:45:26 im not so much bothered about people looking at me, its having enough to say Apr 09 23:45:29 lcuk: remember, no tvout Apr 09 23:45:38 i dont just wanna "ummmmm this nokia rulez, gimme pvr" Apr 09 23:45:46 unless some kind of vnc will be in place Apr 09 23:46:04 ill grab a lappy just in case Apr 09 23:46:15 as i said Apr 09 23:46:18 start a blog Apr 09 23:46:20 or diary Apr 09 23:46:31 adn write your thoughts there Apr 09 23:46:41 by the time of linuxtag you will have enough material Apr 09 23:46:42 :) Apr 09 23:46:51 yer it is starting to come into shape Apr 09 23:46:55 5-10 minutes shouldn't be too hard to fill. Apr 09 23:47:27 * lcuk thinks next week would have been a better time to find out, but take the bullby horns so to speak Apr 09 23:47:35 hmm Apr 09 23:47:36 i wonder Apr 09 23:47:50 maybe nokia should setup some multiplayer room? Apr 09 23:47:55 cos i would have something to discuss because people would start to have software Apr 09 23:48:03 with free n8x0's Apr 09 23:48:04 maemo_play Apr 09 23:48:06 :) Apr 09 23:48:40 would be better to have a chillout room - pupnik has mentioned a room for discsussions about this upcoming thing Apr 09 23:48:42 which is wise Apr 09 23:49:13 mmm Apr 09 23:49:14 curry Apr 09 23:49:16 right, let me think ill b back tomorrow Apr 09 23:49:27 http://www.enigmacurry.com/blog-post-images/mmmcurry.jpg Apr 09 23:49:29 :) Apr 09 23:50:49 gnite all :) thx Apr 09 23:51:05 nite nite Apr 09 23:56:03 hi pupnik Apr 10 00:04:53 hey, I just got my n800. When you go to flash the device with OS2008, it asks you to fully charge the battery. Will flashing the device cause it to stop using AC power or something? Apr 10 00:05:10 I don't want to disrupt the initial 12-24 hour charge Apr 10 00:06:51 That charge isn't important on modern batteries. Apr 10 00:07:13 The issue is, if the device is plugged into the charger, it doesn't actually fully power off even when you turn it 'off' Apr 10 00:07:22 so you can never get into flashing mode Apr 10 00:08:12 So, the easy solution, is to unplug it, turn it off, plug in the USB cable, start the flasher, hold down the Swap/Home key and plug in the charger. Apr 10 00:09:29 ok, thanks Apr 10 00:18:38 i would like gst-plugins-good bumped to version 0.10.7 Apr 10 00:18:50 has speex, jpg, png etc. added Apr 10 00:18:52 :) Apr 10 00:44:15 silly question guys. How can I make the "make" command work? Apr 10 00:44:28 create Makefile Apr 10 00:45:09 er, sorry, I misstated that. I have a package with a Makefile that I want to compile for my 770. But "make" doesn't work? Apr 10 00:45:18 hmm Apr 10 00:45:34 are you compiling on device or in sdk? (scratchbox) Apr 10 00:45:41 on device Apr 10 00:45:44 Is that no good? Apr 10 00:45:51 you will have to install some packages Apr 10 00:45:57 by default they aren't included Apr 10 00:46:05 ah, is there a FAQ or list somewhere for that? Apr 10 00:46:09 hmm Apr 10 00:46:14 don't know Apr 10 00:46:32 usually binutils/gcc/glibc-dev/make Apr 10 00:46:47 and -dev packages if you need some lib Apr 10 00:46:51 like ncurses Apr 10 00:46:54 or x11 Apr 10 00:47:26 hmm, I see Apr 10 01:33:04 someone 'splain me what this gadget does => www.dealextreme.com/details.dx/sku.9472 Apr 10 01:33:32 Allows you to monitor your home and office from anywhere in the world (as long as there is a phone with you) Apr 10 01:33:56 probably evasedropping device Apr 10 01:34:15 *eavasedropping Apr 10 01:34:31 how can it transmit over gsm? doesn't it then need a cellphone account? Apr 10 01:34:44 probably you put your sim in Apr 10 01:35:20 so it's continuously running up minutes? Apr 10 01:35:49 if you go with such plan Apr 10 01:36:52 there are many plans with unlimited calling Apr 10 01:36:56 I thought folks could not simply pop their sim chip in any device.. I heard cell providers want to control what hardware gets used Apr 10 01:37:16 You can pretty much pop your SIM into anything. Apr 10 01:37:22 unixsnob: phones can be 'simlocked' Apr 10 01:37:24 As long as it's compatible with the carrier's network. Apr 10 01:37:35 because they're expensive promotions Apr 10 01:37:49 and they don't want you to buy iphone and go with t-mobile Apr 10 01:37:50 etc. Apr 10 01:38:15 right, that's the context that I heard about the restriction Apr 10 01:38:17 if your device is unlocked you can use any card Apr 10 01:38:42 assuming it uses proper technology Apr 10 01:38:50 ie. gsm is not compatible with cdma Apr 10 01:38:58 but it is compatible with wcdma Apr 10 01:38:59 :-) Apr 10 01:39:04 :) Apr 10 01:39:11 unixSnob: the locks go the other direction, is what he's saying Apr 10 01:39:42 i should open a position for an interpreter :> Apr 10 01:40:00 however, the devices you can put on a GSM network are pretty heavily regulated by the radio regulations administrations Apr 10 01:40:04 (e.g., the FCC in the USA) Apr 10 01:40:38 yeah, I think it's GSM that terrorists have been using for detonation Apr 10 01:40:47 what terrorists? Apr 10 01:40:49 :) Apr 10 01:41:04 It's heavily restricted in the US, but there are ways to get anonymous gsm abroad Apr 10 01:41:07 (read: don't fall for tv news) Apr 10 01:41:09 if I were a terrorist, I wouldn't care about the radio technology Apr 10 01:41:15 i don't have a tv Apr 10 01:41:31 anonymous gsm? Apr 10 01:41:38 just hook a detonator up to, e.g., the vibrator circuit in an off-the-shelf handset and ring it Apr 10 01:41:43 do you have your own base stations? Apr 10 01:41:44 :) Apr 10 01:41:48 well you would want the technology that exists in the area of your target Apr 10 01:42:01 I don't know of any country which allows *really* anonymous mobile phones Apr 10 01:42:09 elb: prepaid Apr 10 01:42:10 ;) Apr 10 01:42:20 KotCzarny: but they're not really anonymous anywhere I'm aware of Apr 10 01:42:32 elb: yes, imei is probably logged Apr 10 01:42:41 and sim id Apr 10 01:42:44 I looked into it in the US a while back, and you had to pay with a proper credit card or else sign up with some personal information Apr 10 01:42:51 well there are some ways to get an anonymous GSM outside the US, but it's not straight forward Apr 10 01:42:56 I don't recall the details Apr 10 01:43:01 but as long you don't leave any traces it can be treated as anonymous Apr 10 01:43:03 and disposable Apr 10 01:43:04 :) Apr 10 01:43:16 outside the US, I've dealt with phones in several countries, and in most cases you have to have a passport or other form of semi-permanent ID Apr 10 01:43:17 elb: pay with cash Apr 10 01:43:18 :) Apr 10 01:43:24 (alien registration, for example, in japan) Apr 10 01:43:33 KotCzarny: yes, but then you have to provide personal information, as I said Apr 10 01:43:39 at least with the providers I looked at Apr 10 01:43:40 do i? Apr 10 01:43:56 I think it's a matter of getting a GSM sim chip that's activated.. very difficult to do anonymously, but other countries will enable you to order online.. I think that's how it works. Apr 10 01:44:09 my sim is registered to 'john doe customer' Apr 10 01:44:10 basically they required a credit check, even if you prepaid -- you just don't have to *pass* it Apr 10 01:44:10 :) Apr 10 01:44:16 KotCzarny: nice Apr 10 01:44:24 elb, t-mobile Apr 10 01:44:26 what carrier? Apr 10 01:44:38 ahh t-mobile prepaid wasn't available in the area I checked in Apr 10 01:44:48 (the network is there, but you have to go somewhere else to get teh phone) Apr 10 01:44:52 i didn't really liked att Apr 10 01:44:57 and verizon used cdma Apr 10 01:45:03 we had go phone, whatever the Sprint one was, and US Cellular Apr 10 01:45:16 so i went with tmob Apr 10 01:45:27 not that i'm happy about pricing, but it works Apr 10 01:46:06 what's the pricing? Apr 10 01:46:25 ~16c/min incoming/outgoing Apr 10 01:46:36 and no free minutes at all Apr 10 01:46:40 in the US? Apr 10 01:46:44 yes Apr 10 01:46:52 that's rape Apr 10 01:46:55 quite Apr 10 01:46:57 well, unless you don't hardly use it Apr 10 01:47:00 but for me it's ok Apr 10 01:47:03 in which case it's probably still cheaper than a monthly plan Apr 10 01:47:08 i don't talk that much Apr 10 01:47:11 I pay $50/month flat, unlimited Apr 10 01:47:15 and no contract Apr 10 01:47:23 so any monthly plan would take MORE for me Apr 10 01:47:36 ie, i use 25$ for ~6months Apr 10 01:47:38 roughly Apr 10 01:48:35 what about internet on your NIT? Apr 10 01:48:42 wlan Apr 10 01:48:53 so it only works at home and hotspots? Apr 10 01:48:59 yes Apr 10 01:49:17 but you have hotspots everywhere Apr 10 01:49:30 and if there's no free/open ones you can go to starbucks Apr 10 01:49:33 or something Apr 10 01:49:43 Subway Apr 10 01:50:22 Well, don't have home ISP service.. just EVDO for $50/mo Apr 10 01:50:34 i'm cheap Apr 10 01:50:37 20$ dsl Apr 10 01:50:37 but coverage is spotless, almost Apr 10 01:50:38 :) Apr 10 01:50:38 $20 "non-tethering" "unlimited" from AT&T for the NIT Apr 10 01:50:39 3g Apr 10 01:50:42 Works really nicely. Apr 10 01:50:47 really? Apr 10 01:51:13 wow.. the best price I've heard so far has been $30 for SERO Apr 10 01:51:26 is that a 1 yr contract? Apr 10 01:51:44 knowing att it's 2-3years Apr 10 01:51:45 :) Apr 10 01:51:54 $12 / mo no contract dsl here Apr 10 01:52:04 that would blow it.. Millenicom is month to month Apr 10 01:52:09 Well.... 12.99 Apr 10 01:52:15 ziegler + tax ? Apr 10 01:52:16 :) Apr 10 01:52:29 Nope Apr 10 01:52:48 but $20 for att 3g unlimited is great for folks who know they can be locked in.. I'll have to mention that to a buddy Apr 10 01:53:27 unixsnob: what pings you have on evdo? Apr 10 01:53:36 fe. google.com etc Apr 10 01:54:04 i know I get 156 ms from indiana to the east coast (battlenet) Apr 10 01:54:08 I'll check google Apr 10 01:54:38 main color: turn on :) Apr 10 01:54:53 lcuk: shouldn't you be sleeping? Apr 10 01:54:54 :) Apr 10 01:55:00 $ ping google.com Apr 10 01:55:00 PING google.com (64.233.187.99): 56 data bytes Apr 10 01:55:00 64 bytes from 64.233.187.99: icmp_seq=0 ttl=235 time=122.710 ms Apr 10 01:55:00 64 bytes from 64.233.187.99: icmp_seq=1 ttl=235 time=139.183 ms Apr 10 01:55:00 64 bytes from 64.233.187.99: icmp_seq=2 ttl=235 time=110.751 ms Apr 10 01:55:03 64 bytes from 64.233.187.99: icmp_seq=3 ttl=235 time=111.732 ms Apr 10 01:55:05 64 bytes from 64.233.187.99: icmp_seq=4 ttl=235 time=105.947 ms Apr 10 01:55:07 64 bytes from 64.233.187.99: icmp_seq=5 ttl=235 time=170.369 ms Apr 10 01:55:08 sleep? after the night i have had Apr 10 01:55:09 64 bytes from 64.233.187.99: icmp_seq=6 ttl=235 time=111.807 ms Apr 10 01:55:12 unixsnob 1 is enough Apr 10 01:55:14 :) Apr 10 01:55:32 lcuk: it's 3am in .de :) Apr 10 01:55:35 well, 4 Apr 10 01:55:37 well, with evdo, spikes are common Apr 10 01:55:51 unixsnob: nice Apr 10 01:55:54 that's pretty good latency for cellular Apr 10 01:56:09 there might be a frequent periodic 500ms ping.. so that's a neussance Apr 10 01:56:23 (i meant an unfavorable spike) Apr 10 01:56:24 KotCzarny: AT&T doesn't reduce plan prices by contract Apr 10 01:56:59 yeah, but that's way better than the old 1xRTT I used to use on Sprint Apr 10 01:57:12 Also, my evdo connection is inconsistent. If a lot of users are hitting my tower, VOIP becomes useless Apr 10 01:57:20 I had latency all over the map, from about 100ms to about 2s Apr 10 01:57:27 and also in uk Apr 10 01:57:29 so latency is poor at peak times Apr 10 01:57:48 lcuk: isn't uk gmt+0 ? Apr 10 01:57:51 yeah, much better than 1xRTT Apr 10 01:58:14 If I'm out in the sticks, my connection drops to 1xRTT Apr 10 01:58:15 there's no excuse for cellular data to be so friggin' expensive Apr 10 01:58:27 back when I had 1xRTT ... it's what there was ;-) Apr 10 01:58:28 would assume so since greenwich is in uk... Apr 10 01:58:41 lcuk: :) Apr 10 01:58:49 I paid $10/mo unlimited data Apr 10 01:58:56 so it's 3am Apr 10 01:59:00 you in your hidey hole? Apr 10 01:59:01 back before they figured out they could rape people for it, I guess Apr 10 01:59:04 elb: wow, for a cellular data? Apr 10 01:59:08 elb, you paid that for 1xrtt? Apr 10 01:59:12 I did Apr 10 01:59:22 in about 2001 or 2002 Apr 10 01:59:24 that's a very good price for 1XRTT Apr 10 01:59:34 what provider? Apr 10 01:59:42 can you get only cellular plan? Apr 10 01:59:43 Sprint Apr 10 01:59:49 who I no longer carry because they suck ass Apr 10 01:59:50 i mean data plan Apr 10 01:59:57 That had to be an employee plan, right? Apr 10 02:00:01 at that time you couldn't, I don't think Apr 10 02:00:05 no, it was a regular subscriber plan Apr 10 02:00:20 I mean, I paid $40/mo for the voice line that went with it or something Apr 10 02:00:26 but $10/mo additional for unlimited data Apr 10 02:00:31 I tethered my laptop to it and everything Apr 10 02:00:33 ah, it was bundled.. that explains it Apr 10 02:00:35 heh.. Apr 10 02:00:40 i would love data only plan Apr 10 02:00:53 That's what millenicom is Apr 10 02:01:04 * KotCzarny googles Apr 10 02:01:30 The $50/month would turn you off though Apr 10 02:01:46 heh.. Apr 10 02:01:50 It's 50/mo. for unlimited data, contract free, data only Apr 10 02:02:05 10$/mon for data only would suit me very well Apr 10 02:02:05 (it uses the sprint network) Apr 10 02:02:12 even for 256kbit or something Apr 10 02:02:16 the sprint network is nice Apr 10 02:02:30 if you don't have to deal with Sprint, that is Apr 10 02:02:43 Yeah, that's what's nice about millenicom Apr 10 02:03:06 They have good tech support, and because it's subcontracted through them, they don't require a contract to users Apr 10 02:03:39 i only have to talk to sprint if I have some obscure problem millenicom can't solve Apr 10 02:04:12 (like when I tried to hack the modem to use a closer hub) Apr 10 02:05:10 pupnik_, are you still knocking about? Apr 10 02:08:09 Any DNS zone file gurus about? Apr 10 02:08:22 I can't get a NS record to resolve for the life of me. Gah. Apr 10 02:09:05 The details: http://forums.anandtech.com/messageview.aspx?catid=36&threadid=2175891&enterthread=y Apr 10 02:45:48 if I had a virtual keyboard file, would someone do whatever is needed to make it usable for me? Apr 10 02:49:08 Hehe Apr 10 02:49:26 "Useable" you say Apr 10 02:58:38 bigpig, what exactly are you trying to do with the virtual keyboard? **** ENDING LOGGING AT Thu Apr 10 02:59:56 2008