**** BEGIN LOGGING AT Thu Apr 10 02:59:56 2008
Apr 10 03:04:59 <bigpig> I would like a Fitaly virtual keyboard on my n810. Since Textware Solutions isn't interested in the Nokia tablets as of yet, those of us who would love to pay for their product have to fend for ourselves.
Apr 10 03:05:27 <bigpig> someone has developed the map, but the documentation at maemo.org is so incomplete that he is unable to complete the task.
Apr 10 03:06:20 <bigpig> Ziegler, is creating a new virtual keyboard something that has turned out to be very difficult?
Apr 10 03:48:32 <pupnik_> hello bigpig
Apr 10 03:49:38 <yllus> For the record, pupnik, you rock.
Apr 10 03:49:43 <KotCzarny> lol
Apr 10 03:49:55 <KotCzarny> puprocknik
Apr 10 03:50:07 <pupnik_> thanks yllus
Apr 10 03:50:08 <yllus> pupnick?
Apr 10 03:50:17 <yllus> pupnock.
Apr 10 03:50:19 <KotCzarny> puprock ?
Apr 10 03:50:25 <pupnik> pop rocks!
Apr 10 03:50:33 <KotCzarny> popnik?
Apr 10 03:50:35 <KotCzarny> ;)
Apr 10 03:51:36 <bigpig> hello, pupnik
Apr 10 03:51:54 <yllus> lol, there's a Netrek client for the tablet?
Apr 10 03:52:06 <yllus> good lord, I was playing that game back in 1997.
Apr 10 03:52:31 <pupnik> yes i've played a couple of games.  it is a piece of computing history.  i first played it in 1981 on the Control Data Plato online system
Apr 10 03:52:54 <yllus> Damn good game, especially for its time.
Apr 10 03:52:58 <pupnik> i was 11 years old at the time, and i could not sleep
Apr 10 03:53:02 <pupnik> "this is the future!"
Apr 10 03:53:07 <KotCzarny> :)
Apr 10 03:53:17 <yllus> I remember making Admiral and what an accomplishment that was, because then I could spawn as a base.
Apr 10 03:53:39 <pupnik> it would be fantastic if you could provide some experienced feedback into usability
Apr 10 03:54:05 <pupnik> but large changes take a lot of time
Apr 10 03:54:15 <pupnik> so right now it's difficult to play
Apr 10 03:54:33 <yllus> Is there a project home page? The link on your site is to a JPEG
Apr 10 03:54:54 <KotCzarny> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Netrek
Apr 10 03:55:02 <KotCzarny> links at the bottom
Apr 10 03:55:05 <pupnik> (bigpig, i am not familiar with the hildon virtual keyboard, but xkbd / xvkbd are available)
Apr 10 03:55:05 <KotCzarny> as always
Apr 10 03:55:06 <KotCzarny> :)
Apr 10 03:55:42 <yllus> oh jesus. My Netrek page is still up. 99.232.139.210
Apr 10 03:55:43 <yllus> er
Apr 10 03:55:47 <yllus> http://members.tripod.com/~netrek/
Apr 10 03:56:00 <yllus> Last updated: 13/11/97
Apr 10 03:56:01 * yllus snorts
Apr 10 03:56:03 <pupnik> nice
Apr 10 03:56:30 <pupnik> yeah this is pretty much straight COW
Apr 10 03:58:12 <yllus> I am going to have to take on some projects. Learn some *nix, put my Python knowledge to use.
Apr 10 03:58:13 <pupnik> "Players have to mentally track "built up" time, estimating how far and in what direction ships and torpedoes have moved since the last screen replot."
Apr 10 03:58:23 <pupnik> hah good old times
Apr 10 03:58:31 <pupnik> yes it's so fun
Apr 10 03:58:46 <pupnik> mypaint could use some python skill
Apr 10 03:58:53 <yllus> I imagine the game could use voice chat
Apr 10 03:59:05 <pupnik> true
Apr 10 03:59:50 <yllus> I was thinking that I might write a good picture frame app that auto-rotates through images, given a XML photofeed
Apr 10 04:00:15 <yllus> But Quiver is so close that I feel like I shouldn't bother
Apr 10 04:00:27 <KotCzarny> yllus, have you seen canola2 ?
Apr 10 04:00:44 <yllus> Yeah, but sadly it doesn't run on my beloved 770 with IT2006
Apr 10 04:00:49 <KotCzarny> ah
Apr 10 04:01:01 <pupnik> 770 forevah!
Apr 10 04:01:05 <KotCzarny> it has one nice picture browser
Apr 10 04:01:23 <yllus> Yeah, I heard :( But I like my IT2006 setup too much to go HE
Apr 10 04:01:34 <KotCzarny> hmm
Apr 10 04:01:45 <KotCzarny> buy a second!
Apr 10 04:01:47 <KotCzarny> :)
Apr 10 04:02:01 <yllus> haha, I'll get a N800 soonish
Apr 10 04:02:33 <yllus> It's sad that the tablets aren't more newbie friendly. So damn versatile.
Apr 10 04:02:50 <KotCzarny> they aren't?
Apr 10 04:03:02 <KotCzarny> i think they were pretty straightforward
Apr 10 04:03:03 <KotCzarny> :)
Apr 10 04:03:26 <yllus> My g/f was about to pitch it across the room when I first gave it to her
Apr 10 04:03:36 <KotCzarny> :)
Apr 10 04:03:40 <KotCzarny> why?
Apr 10 04:03:41 <lcuk> so was mine - give her munptyphysics and she will love it
Apr 10 04:03:42 <pupnik> yllus: you got a bluetooth keyboard?
Apr 10 04:03:51 <lcuk> numptyphysics
Apr 10 04:03:55 <yllus> Yeah, I have a wonderful ThinkOutside Stowaway
Apr 10 04:04:06 <pupnik> ++
Apr 10 04:04:08 <yllus> She fell in love with Maemo Mapper later anyways
Apr 10 04:04:16 <KotCzarny> :)
Apr 10 04:04:24 <lcuk> kot - the problem, can i create a mountpoint for the ftp location, then the script can just send to that?
Apr 10 04:04:35 <KotCzarny> hmm?
Apr 10 04:04:36 <pupnik> i will make a netrek package for you soon
Apr 10 04:04:42 <KotCzarny> just change wput to cp
Apr 10 04:04:42 <KotCzarny> :)
Apr 10 04:04:44 <yllus> nice
Apr 10 04:04:47 <lopz> bye
Apr 10 04:05:04 <KotCzarny> i mean comment out wput line and create cp line
Apr 10 04:05:06 <lcuk> would that actually work?
Apr 10 04:05:25 * lcuk was winging it - i just rememebered in the shower someone has done it
Apr 10 04:05:28 <KotCzarny> i assume you mount ftp dir in vmware, yes?
Apr 10 04:05:45 <lcuk> not yet i havent
Apr 10 04:05:50 <lcuk> i wouldnt know where to begin
Apr 10 04:06:00 * lcuk hasnt mounted any electronic equipment
Apr 10 04:06:06 <KotCzarny> install sshd for windows
Apr 10 04:06:06 <lcuk> pupnik
Apr 10 04:06:12 <KotCzarny> then you could use sshfs
Apr 10 04:06:14 <KotCzarny> both ways
Apr 10 04:06:15 <KotCzarny> :)
Apr 10 04:06:42 <KotCzarny> or scp
Apr 10 04:06:45 <lcuk> but if this ends up being proper ftp then i may not be able to install anything
Apr 10 04:07:13 <KotCzarny> ok, let's start over, what do you want to mount and where
Apr 10 04:07:25 <pupnik> what?
Apr 10 04:07:31 <lcuk> i want somewhere in linux filesystem to point at a remote ftp server
Apr 10 04:07:44 <KotCzarny> hmm
Apr 10 04:07:46 <lcuk> i have a little proposition for you..
Apr 10 04:07:49 <johnx> fuse+ftpfs should do it
Apr 10 04:07:49 <KotCzarny> some kind of ftpfs
Apr 10 04:08:05 <johnx> I don't remember the real name though, let me find it...
Apr 10 04:08:30 <pupnik> nfs works out of the box
Apr 10 04:08:38 <lcuk> LUFS is a hybrid userspace filesystem framework supporting many "exotic" filesystems (localfs, sshfs, ftpfs, gnutellafs, locasefs, gvfs, cardfs, cefs, etc. ).
Apr 10 04:08:38 <KotCzarny> for windows?
Apr 10 04:08:39 <KotCzarny> :)
Apr 10 04:08:45 <lcuk> no - needed for linux
Apr 10 04:08:56 <KotCzarny> that was to pupnik
Apr 10 04:08:56 <KotCzarny> :)
Apr 10 04:09:00 <pupnik> ok
Apr 10 04:09:19 <lcuk> isnt nfs part of linux?  is wasnt pupnik right?
Apr 10 04:09:25 * lcuk is pretty confused right about now
Apr 10 04:09:26 <johnx> lcuk, can you install ssh on this remote ftp server? or are you stuck with just ftp?
Apr 10 04:09:30 <KotCzarny> nfs is for *nix
Apr 10 04:09:57 <johnx> lufs is the old thing, fuse is the new thing
Apr 10 04:10:05 <lcuk> im going to assume stuck with ftp - at this moment the ftp is running on this windows box, but tomorrow that will likely change
Apr 10 04:10:36 <johnx> alright, curlftpfs for fuse is probably what you want/need
Apr 10 04:10:57 <lcuk> the box it will likely end up on will not allow me to run my own programs (i would be scared to its our webserver)
Apr 10 04:11:19 <opendeep> hai
Apr 10 04:11:41 <pupnik> shark!
Apr 10 04:12:07 <opendeep> hi X_Fade_
Apr 10 04:12:08 <KotCzarny> lcuk: does this webserver run php?
Apr 10 04:12:44 <KotCzarny> if yes, upload applet is easy
Apr 10 04:12:51 <lcuk> no.  and im not gonna do anything to it.  if i get some space i'll use it as given
Apr 10 04:13:05 <Navi> Heh
Apr 10 04:13:16 <Navi> I'd never go with a webhost/server that doesn't have ssh access
Apr 10 04:13:22 <lcuk> its simplest all round - i would have to explain why and what for anything other than "can you up my account"
Apr 10 04:13:24 <Navi> at least, if I were paying for it
Apr 10 04:14:00 <lcuk> (there is the other thing of me remembering all this lot when i get in and ive got bigger fish to fry tomorrow :)
Apr 10 04:14:02 <KotCzarny> lcuk, everything is doable
Apr 10 04:14:16 <KotCzarny> :)
Apr 10 04:14:31 <Navi> I like fish
Apr 10 04:14:39 <Navi> Not a fan of fried fish though
Apr 10 04:14:42 <lcuk> ive gotta tell my boss that i know we are busy but something quite good has cropped up and its that linux thing i keep going on about.
Apr 10 04:15:13 <johnx> well, there are fuse packages here: http://nakkiboso.com/maemofuse/ but curlftpfs isn't built
Apr 10 04:15:21 <johnx> I might have a look at it, but no promises
Apr 10 04:15:25 <lcuk> i got curl :)    sudo apt-get install curlftpfs
Apr 10 04:15:36 <johnx> aaah, this isn't from the tablet?
Apr 10 04:15:39 <johnx> aaaah...I see
Apr 10 04:16:23 <lcuk> no, this is the vmware box - kot has very nicely built me a script to allow me a quick dirty nightly backup from deep within the vmware onto somewhere we a couple of us can take a peek
Apr 10 04:16:56 <lcuk> jeeesus i havent done an all nighter since college
Apr 10 04:17:01 <johnx> nevermind, super easy then, curlftpfs user@ftp.example.com empty/local/dir
Apr 10 04:17:28 <lcuk> and is that needed on every login?
Apr 10 04:17:38 <johnx> nope, just until you unmount it
Apr 10 04:17:39 <KotCzarny> on every mount
Apr 10 04:17:56 <lcuk> ahhh so it will stay over a reboot?
Apr 10 04:18:01 <KotCzarny> yes
Apr 10 04:18:04 <johnx> nope, not over a reboot
Apr 10 04:18:04 <lcuk> phew!
Apr 10 04:18:07 <johnx> until a reboot
Apr 10 04:18:09 <lcuk> dang!
Apr 10 04:18:19 <lcuk> you build me up, then knock me down
Apr 10 04:18:26 <KotCzarny> i think you can add it to /etc/fstab
Apr 10 04:18:33 <johnx> just bring it up again. It's scriptable.
Apr 10 04:18:56 <lcuk> but i'm forgetful.  i'll curse it everytime its been restarted
Apr 10 04:19:01 <KotCzarny> not this particular line, but mount point in general
Apr 10 04:19:11 <KotCzarny> lcuk: rc.local
Apr 10 04:19:12 <KotCzarny> :)
Apr 10 04:19:26 <johnx> add it to the script, pseudocode: if foo is not mounted ; mount foo ; proceed
Apr 10 04:20:51 <lcuk> lol but that mount line involves an ftp password which because of the script location will end up being inserted into the archive and uploaded...
Apr 10 04:20:58 <lcuk> its just forgetful to leave it in there
Apr 10 04:21:20 <johnx> but anyone who is on your ftp server already put in the password to get there, right?
Apr 10 04:21:46 <johnx> it's like locking the key to your house inside your house...
Apr 10 04:21:49 <lcuk> yes, but all it takes is one slip and the wrong folder goes public
Apr 10 04:21:58 <johnx> fair enough
Apr 10 04:22:11 <johnx> do it in rc.local then
Apr 10 04:22:12 <lcuk> i am expecting to move binaries out fairly often
Apr 10 04:22:17 <KotCzarny> lcuk: why the script location will be inserted in archive?
Apr 10 04:22:30 <KotCzarny> you can make independent script
Apr 10 04:22:40 <KotCzarny> that will live in some other place
Apr 10 04:22:45 <KotCzarny> and you will only call it by name
Apr 10 04:23:04 <lcuk> lol - this little script has got middle aged spread! and its only an hour old :P
Apr 10 04:23:13 <lcuk> feature creep!
Apr 10 04:23:29 <KotCzarny> scripts come and go
Apr 10 04:23:33 <KotCzarny> on demand
Apr 10 04:23:34 <KotCzarny> :)
Apr 10 04:23:56 <johnx> /etc/rc.local is where this stuff tends to go on a Unix system
Apr 10 04:23:58 <lcuk> have you ever read any Larry Niven books?
Apr 10 04:24:07 * KotCzarny haven't
Apr 10 04:24:21 * johnx has read Ringworld and most of his short stories...
Apr 10 04:24:28 <lcuk> ok, so ill get it working and tested singly - then if it works move it into /etc/rc.local
Apr 10 04:24:38 <johnx> sounds like a plan
Apr 10 04:24:43 <lcuk> johnx, have you read the mote in gods eye
Apr 10 04:24:54 <johnx> errr...let me think
Apr 10 04:25:02 <johnx> it's been a while
Apr 10 04:25:15 <lcuk> moties - aliens who build everything on demand and reprogram physically
Apr 10 04:25:24 <lcuk> sounds just like KotCzarnys scripts :)
Apr 10 04:25:37 <johnx> nope, haven't read it
Apr 10 04:25:41 <johnx> do you recommend it?
Apr 10 04:25:58 <lcuk> absolutely
Apr 10 04:26:07 <johnx> I think I have it somewhere around here O_o I'll have to look for it later
Apr 10 04:26:11 <lcuk> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Mote_in_God's_Eye
Apr 10 04:26:39 * johnx doesn't like to have anything spoiled before he reads the book
Apr 10 04:26:39 <dick-richardson> can you do keyboard shortcuts?
Apr 10 04:27:04 <lcuk> personally? or in the system in general?
Apr 10 04:27:04 <johnx> I can do keyboard shortcuts
Apr 10 04:27:43 <dick-richardson> lcuk: system in general
Apr 10 04:28:19 <KotCzarny> Robert A. Heinlein, who gave the authors extensive, detailed advice on the novel, blurbed the story as "possibly the finest science fiction novel I have ever read".
Apr 10 04:28:26 <KotCzarny> sounds like a recommendation
Apr 10 04:28:27 <KotCzarny> :)
Apr 10 04:28:50 <dick-richardson> ringing endorsement
Apr 10 04:29:56 <KotCzarny> maybe i should read it too
Apr 10 04:30:11 <KotCzarny> i have library 50m from my apartment
Apr 10 04:30:31 <KotCzarny> and i have never been there, yet
Apr 10 04:30:41 <dick-richardson> My wife works at the local library here. every now and then random books show up on my desk
Apr 10 04:30:53 <KotCzarny> good wife
Apr 10 04:30:57 <KotCzarny> good books?
Apr 10 04:30:58 <KotCzarny> :)
Apr 10 04:31:01 <dick-richardson> "Oh, did i check this out?"
Apr 10 04:31:08 <dick-richardson> "yes, you did"
Apr 10 04:31:15 <dick-richardson> yeah, generally they are
Apr 10 04:31:26 <johnx> so, dick-richardson, what are you trying to use a keyboard shortcut for?
Apr 10 04:31:35 <dick-richardson> my webmail password
Apr 10 04:31:51 <KotCzarny> o.o
Apr 10 04:31:56 <KotCzarny> use firefox?
Apr 10 04:31:59 <KotCzarny> :)
Apr 10 04:32:02 <rm_you> johnx: hi :P
Apr 10 04:32:02 <johnx> so you want to hit (for example) ctrl+p and have it key in your password?
Apr 10 04:32:06 <johnx> hey rm_you :D
Apr 10 04:32:11 <dick-richardson> you got it
Apr 10 04:32:38 <johnx> hmm, and the built-in microb "remember this password" thing isn't working for you?
Apr 10 04:33:00 <dick-richardson> I'm trying a little security through obscurity
Apr 10 04:33:21 <dick-richardson> it works alright, but I'm not using it
Apr 10 04:33:56 <KotCzarny> security through obscurity isn't recommended..
Apr 10 04:34:00 <johnx> ah ok. you're probably better off just using the "remember password" thing though. That way you don't have random "sensitive" files scattered all over the system...
Apr 10 04:34:15 <johnx> also, it would be somewhat difficult to do something like that.
Apr 10 04:34:31 <johnx> What would you describe your "comfort level" with the command line and a cross compiler as?
Apr 10 04:35:13 <dick-richardson> fairly good
Apr 10 04:35:37 <dick-richardson> which means I'm very comfortable, but probably shouldn't be :P
Apr 10 04:36:11 <johnx> alright, you'll probably need to compile yourself some app which sits in the background and listens for that key combo, then spits out some text
Apr 10 04:36:29 <KotCzarny> hmm
Apr 10 04:36:34 <KotCzarny> osk can help
Apr 10 04:36:58 <KotCzarny> xkbd/xvkbd has an option for strings too
Apr 10 04:37:18 <KotCzarny> so making a simple layout with one button should work
Apr 10 04:37:19 <KotCzarny> :)
Apr 10 04:37:47 <lcuk> or notices you have drawn an X and placed thumb over it
Apr 10 04:37:51 <johnx> kind of the opposite of obscure
Apr 10 04:38:03 <lcuk> security through flashy login script
Apr 10 04:38:18 <KotCzarny> :>
Apr 10 04:38:19 <johnx> :D security through "movie-style" special effects
Apr 10 04:38:19 <dick-richardson> lol!
Apr 10 04:38:43 <KotCzarny> 'please cough three times'
Apr 10 04:38:48 <lcuk> yer, we can simulate a fingerprint scanner
Apr 10 04:38:54 <lcuk> no1 would know and it would be way cool
Apr 10 04:39:17 <johnx> heh...place a random thumb here: approved!
Apr 10 04:39:34 <lcuk> actually detect pressure patterns but dont tell n00b that ;)
Apr 10 04:39:40 <johnx> (hint: doesn't have to be your thumb. In an emergency, any thumb shaped object can be used.)
Apr 10 04:39:47 <KotCzarny> 'now press your forehead firmly to the screen'
Apr 10 04:39:48 <KotCzarny> ;)
Apr 10 04:39:53 <lcuk> so when you do it it says "LOGIN ACCEPTED" but when they try it it doesnt
Apr 10 04:39:58 <johnx> ...for the brain scan
Apr 10 04:39:58 <lcuk> PMSL
Apr 10 04:40:07 <KotCzarny> pms?
Apr 10 04:40:12 <lcuk> pissing myself..
Apr 10 04:40:17 <KotCzarny> :)
Apr 10 04:40:23 <lcuk> i nearly woke missus up
Apr 10 04:40:24 <KotCzarny> close to pms
Apr 10 04:40:25 <KotCzarny> :)
Apr 10 04:40:29 <lcuk> jees this has been a while
Apr 10 04:40:59 <dick-richardson> I'm still stuck on the "thumb shaped object" criteria
Apr 10 04:41:03 <GeneralAntilles> I want video game challenges as a login method.
Apr 10 04:41:10 <GeneralAntilles> Land this 747!
Apr 10 04:42:00 <dick-richardson> Well, we couldn't get into the device, but then Jim got real excited by the technology and what do you know!
Apr 10 04:42:55 <KotCzarny> and the thing is to bang the rocks together guys!
Apr 10 04:43:51 <dick-richardson> you know...just having the system remember the password w/o that last character is what i'm looking for
Apr 10 04:44:12 <lcuk> lol @ steering convo back on topic
Apr 10 04:44:25 <johnx> that would be a lot more secure then storing in plain-text...I kinda like that idea :)
Apr 10 04:44:26 <lcuk> then just do it without last letter and say yes to remembering
Apr 10 04:44:41 <dick-richardson> yep
Apr 10 04:44:44 <KotCzarny> lcuk, but later it will remember proper pass
Apr 10 04:44:52 <KotCzarny> it uses last entered one
Apr 10 04:44:58 <lcuk> no, later it will ask and you can say no feck off
Apr 10 04:45:13 <KotCzarny> probably
Apr 10 04:45:15 <lcuk> firefox or micrapola?
Apr 10 04:45:15 <KotCzarny> :)
Apr 10 04:45:34 <dick-richardson> option 2
Apr 10 04:45:35 <lcuk> we have multiple gmail accounts and one is defaulted, the rest are set as dont remember
Apr 10 04:46:02 <lcuk> i havent tried logging in from the device
Apr 10 04:46:11 <lcuk> and i would never leave any of the passwords in :S
Apr 10 04:46:32 <lcuk> since the whole device is unsecure its open to abuse.
Apr 10 04:46:42 <KotCzarny> yes
Apr 10 04:46:48 <KotCzarny> that's true
Apr 10 04:46:51 <dick-richardson> it does remember the last one used :(
Apr 10 04:46:52 <lcuk> (why havent we got password protection for the device?)
Apr 10 04:47:02 <dick-richardson> truecrypt was made for this thing
Apr 10 04:47:11 <KotCzarny> good idea
Apr 10 04:47:20 <KotCzarny> initfs is there anyway
Apr 10 04:47:27 <GeneralAntilles> lcuk, locking?
Apr 10 04:47:35 <KotCzarny> the only problem is to fit it there
Apr 10 04:47:36 <lcuk> can it open locked though?
Apr 10 04:47:37 <KotCzarny> :)
Apr 10 04:47:44 <lcuk> as in reboot and auto lock
Apr 10 04:47:50 <KotCzarny> lcuk: probably
Apr 10 04:47:59 <lcuk> then that will do it
Apr 10 04:48:01 <KotCzarny> if not sdk is there
Apr 10 04:48:02 <KotCzarny> :)
Apr 10 04:48:04 <GeneralAntilles> Once you lock it, it stays locked until you unlock it.
Apr 10 04:48:11 <GeneralAntilles> Even if you flash it.
Apr 10 04:48:34 <KotCzarny> hmm
Apr 10 04:48:45 <lcuk> stops casual ppl - like i was saying about any security app, the chances that a crook would actually know specifically to re-flash this device immediately makes me want to just upload a picture everytime it is booted or the keyboard slides open
Apr 10 04:48:49 <dick-richardson> are you talking about the hardware switch?
Apr 10 04:48:50 <KotCzarny> another method of unlocking: 'draw a flower to proceed'
Apr 10 04:48:51 <KotCzarny> :)
Apr 10 04:49:01 <lcuk> ooooh GeneralAntilles  i didnt know that..
Apr 10 04:49:08 <GeneralAntilles> No
Apr 10 04:49:10 <GeneralAntilles> Press the power button
Apr 10 04:49:33 <GeneralAntilles> "Lock device"
Apr 10 04:49:40 <dick-richardson> what do you know\
Apr 10 04:49:41 <lcuk> awww why cant we slide like the posh kids?
Apr 10 04:49:49 <dick-richardson> what's the default code?
Apr 10 04:49:58 <GeneralAntilles> 12345
Apr 10 04:50:15 <lcuk> this is from the menu that comes up on power isnt it
Apr 10 04:50:15 <KotCzarny> lcuk, we have sdk
Apr 10 04:50:16 <KotCzarny> :)
Apr 10 04:50:34 <dick-richardson> I must have found it and changed it already
Apr 10 04:51:03 <dick-richardson> alcohol was probably involved
Apr 10 04:51:16 <lcuk> that menu is designed all wrong. when you are putting it away you dont want to fiddle and have to aim for a tiny dot.  selectors should be big and finger friendly
Apr 10 04:51:25 <lcuk> so now your device is locked?
Apr 10 04:51:28 <lcuk> forever?
Apr 10 04:51:33 <GeneralAntilles> That's what the dpad is for, lcuk. :P
Apr 10 04:51:34 <lcuk> or until you find the combination
Apr 10 04:51:44 <GeneralAntilles> But your device sucks ass, and it has the dpad in exactly the wrong spot. ;)
Apr 10 04:51:54 <GeneralAntilles> It requires you to enter the lock to lock it.
Apr 10 04:51:59 <GeneralAntilles> s/lock/code/
Apr 10 04:51:59 <infobot> GeneralAntilles meant: It requires you to enter the code to lock it.
Apr 10 04:52:03 <lcuk> ok, power button slide down down down dpad.   instead of power button BOOM!
Apr 10 04:52:12 <dick-richardson> it's my ssn...wow was that stupid
Apr 10 04:52:41 <KotCzarny> lol
Apr 10 04:52:56 <GeneralAntilles> Hehe
Apr 10 04:53:02 <GeneralAntilles> That's how I memorized mine.
Apr 10 04:53:09 <GeneralAntilles> Used it as a local password for a few weeks.
Apr 10 04:53:33 <lcuk> SSN == National Insurance # ??
Apr 10 04:53:42 <dick-richardson> I'll use my wife's
Apr 10 04:53:42 <KotCzarny> kind of
Apr 10 04:53:45 <KotCzarny> lol2
Apr 10 04:53:47 <GeneralAntilles> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Social_Security_number
Apr 10 04:54:01 <lcuk> ours are combination letters and numbers and ive known it since i was 15
Apr 10 04:54:15 <KotCzarny> we are numbers
Apr 10 04:54:20 <GeneralAntilles> Your serial number. <_<
Apr 10 04:54:21 <dick-richardson> can you change the sliding lock to lock the device?
Apr 10 04:54:52 <GeneralAntilles> dick-richardson, if so, it'd be in /etc/mce/mce.ini
Apr 10 04:55:00 <GeneralAntilles> But I don't think so at the moment.
Apr 10 04:55:01 <lcuk> that would be a cool toy for the desktop - slide over the area to lock
Apr 10 04:55:04 <dick-richardson> kk, thank you
Apr 10 04:55:09 <GeneralAntilles> If not, you could always file an enhancement request on bugzilla.
Apr 10 04:55:54 <KotCzarny> lcuk, have you doubled pixel size in drawing mode?
Apr 10 04:56:14 <KotCzarny> and it's shadowy
Apr 10 04:56:39 <lcuk> coloring..
Apr 10 04:56:50 <KotCzarny> yes, i enabled it
Apr 10 04:56:50 <KotCzarny> :)
Apr 10 04:57:17 <KotCzarny> or is it feature of yuv colorspace?
Apr 10 04:57:24 <lcuk> yuv is 800*480 greyscale, 400*240 color information, its a halfway house (basically jpeg resolution)
Apr 10 04:58:02 <KotCzarny> hum
Apr 10 04:58:18 <lcuk> its more noticable than i would have liked on certain colors but its good enough for now.
Apr 10 04:58:23 <KotCzarny> it will need some antialiasing then
Apr 10 04:59:56 <lcuk> it depends upon which grey level it is at - the brighter it is, the clearer it shows
Apr 10 05:00:04 <KotCzarny> yes
Apr 10 05:00:24 <KotCzarny> but dark green is also very noticeable
Apr 10 05:00:46 * lcuk nods and its also the brightest color
Apr 10 05:01:34 <KotCzarny> have you tried blurring?
Apr 10 05:02:02 <lcuk> ive not tried anything yet - i just put in the colored line routine and played for a while
Apr 10 05:02:04 <KotCzarny> it would work better than plain half-brightness shadow
Apr 10 05:02:31 <KotCzarny> (i guess)
Apr 10 05:03:13 <lcuk> are you able to compile or just looking through?
Apr 10 05:03:19 <KotCzarny> compiled
Apr 10 05:03:38 <KotCzarny> i don't read/compile/run in my head
Apr 10 05:03:49 <KotCzarny> that ability would rock
Apr 10 05:04:10 <KotCzarny> i only needed to install sdl_ttf
Apr 10 05:04:10 <lcuk> liqart.c line 175 holds the for now constant brightness of the grey.  (you will note i tried a few of the things suggested)
Apr 10 05:04:13 <dick-richardson> i wish modest would load inline html images...I can't see my daily dilbert :(
Apr 10 05:04:17 <KotCzarny> yes
Apr 10 05:04:23 <KotCzarny> that's what i have enabled
Apr 10 05:09:19 <lcuk> is your touch still jumpy?
Apr 10 05:09:26 <KotCzarny> yes
Apr 10 05:09:37 <lcuk> thats when your light and gentle
Apr 10 05:09:38 <KotCzarny> also drawing is slower
Apr 10 05:09:55 <KotCzarny> i'm looking through the code where are you keeping pressure
Apr 10 05:10:22 <lcuk> each stroke has a set of points.  each point has an x/y/z
Apr 10 05:10:25 <lcuk> z=pressure
Apr 10 05:10:28 <GeneralAntilles> I thought that bug was fixed.
Apr 10 05:10:29 <KotCzarny> k
Apr 10 05:10:30 <GeneralAntilles> Guess not.
Apr 10 05:10:37 <GeneralAntilles> You up to date, dick-richardson?
Apr 10 05:10:59 <lcuk> i think thats the last file thats #included inline
Apr 10 05:11:01 <dick-richardson> I believe so
Apr 10 05:11:06 <lcuk> all the rest have gone to proper exports
Apr 10 05:16:50 <dick-richardson> time to call it an evening, take care all
Apr 10 05:53:08 <mbuf> what is the current price of the n810?
Apr 10 05:54:12 <GeneralAntilles> ~$400USD
Apr 10 05:54:21 <GeneralAntilles> +/- $50 USD depending on where you buy.
Apr 10 05:54:34 <mbuf> GeneralAntilles, thanks
Apr 10 05:55:07 <unixSnob> Someone frequently in this channel found an n810 for like $1k.. so that will scew your average a bit there AG
Apr 10 05:55:41 <KotCzarny> heh.. someone
Apr 10 05:55:49 <KotCzarny> i'm me, not just someone
Apr 10 05:55:49 <unixSnob> was that you?
Apr 10 05:56:21 * unixSnob bows down to the great KotCzarny
Apr 10 05:58:58 * unixSnob surrenders his sword, and waits for KotCzarny to lop off his head
Apr 10 05:59:06 <KotCzarny> huh?
Apr 10 05:59:11 <KotCzarny> it's late, go to sleep
Apr 10 05:59:14 <KotCzarny> :)
Apr 10 05:59:22 <unixSnob> yeah, 2am here
Apr 10 05:59:26 <KotCzarny> and swords are dangerous
Apr 10 05:59:37 <KotCzarny> you should watch out where you put them
Apr 10 05:59:41 <KotCzarny> ;)
Apr 10 06:00:00 <unixSnob> my swords are actually extremely dull
Apr 10 06:00:04 <unixSnob> just for show
Apr 10 06:00:14 <KotCzarny> dull weapons can hurt too
Apr 10 06:00:31 <unixSnob> yeah, it's almost as dull as a bat
Apr 10 06:00:40 <unixSnob> so I guess it would have the effect of a club
Apr 10 06:00:57 <unixSnob> s/bat/baseball bat/
Apr 10 06:02:12 <unixSnob> guess i'll try some of this SallyD first
Apr 10 06:03:00 <KotCzarny> get some for me too
Apr 10 06:03:03 <KotCzarny> :)
Apr 10 06:03:14 <unixSnob> are you in a state that permits it?
Apr 10 06:03:16 <KotCzarny> it's about time for a therapy
Apr 10 06:03:34 <KotCzarny> we can always go on a raft
Apr 10 06:20:57 <EruditeHermit> hey, does anyone know how to install fennec?
Apr 10 06:21:15 <GeneralAntilles> It's covered pretty well on the ITT forums.
Apr 10 06:21:21 <GeneralAntilles> Not really worth the effort, though.
Apr 10 06:21:23 <GeneralAntilles> Very unstable.
Apr 10 06:22:08 <johnx> if you want to try an alternative browser give midori a shot
Apr 10 06:22:27 <GeneralAntilles> Was midori every rebuilt to use the optimized webkit?
Apr 10 06:22:43 <johnx> i dunno
Apr 10 06:22:52 <johnx> do you have a link to this "optimized webkit"
Apr 10 06:22:59 <johnx> I'm in a hacking mood so maybe I'll give it a go
Apr 10 06:23:02 <GeneralAntilles> It's in Extras.
Apr 10 06:25:26 <johnx> looks like similar versions...I wonder if I can just tell midori to depend on a different library...
Apr 10 06:26:07 <EruditeHermit> midori is in extras?
Apr 10 06:26:11 <Navi> No
Apr 10 06:26:19 <johnx> errr...the other libwebkit is
Apr 10 06:26:31 <johnx> midori is on itt
Apr 10 06:26:31 <Navi> just install libwebkit
Apr 10 06:26:53 <johnx> I imagine it and webkit that midori depends on will conflict
Apr 10 06:26:56 <Navi> you don't have to specifically build midori against a webkit revision unless the API changed.
Apr 10 06:27:17 <johnx> that's what I figured. I'll have a poke at midori's 'control'
Apr 10 06:27:28 <GeneralAntilles> It's too bad all the 3rd party browsers still suck.
Apr 10 06:27:42 <Navi> not links :D
Apr 10 06:27:47 <johnx> Midori has a lot of potential, Mr. Optimism
Apr 10 06:27:49 <GeneralAntilles> Well, links. . .
Apr 10 06:28:01 <EruditeHermit> johnx: can you point me to a link?
Apr 10 06:28:16 <GeneralAntilles> You'd figure after 2 years there'd be some real progress, though. :P
Apr 10 06:28:35 <johnx> gtk-webkit wasn't there until recently
Apr 10 06:28:43 * Navi hopes for an optimized MicroB in the next release
Apr 10 06:28:44 <johnx> neither was firefox for ARM
Apr 10 06:28:56 <KotCzarny> i wonder..
Apr 10 06:28:57 <johnx> EruditeHermit, search midori on itt, first result is: http://www.internettablettalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=18488&highlight=midori
Apr 10 06:29:02 <KotCzarny> will there ever be ie for arm?
Apr 10 06:29:03 <KotCzarny> :>
Apr 10 06:29:21 <johnx> KotCzarny, get to work on your WinMo emulator :P
Apr 10 06:29:39 <KotCzarny> i prefer playing with some nice code
Apr 10 06:29:42 <GeneralAntilles> I suspect MicroB will be setting the bar quite high in Diablo.
Apr 10 06:29:50 <KotCzarny> johnx, expect great things
Apr 10 06:29:51 <KotCzarny> :)
Apr 10 06:30:16 <johnx> I'll "wait and see" but I'm pretty happy with the direction webkit-gtk is going
Apr 10 06:30:27 * Navi uses it on the desktop
Apr 10 06:30:30 <KotCzarny> nah, i'm talking about something else right now
Apr 10 06:30:32 <Navi> Snappy stuff
Apr 10 06:30:49 <johnx> it will get a lot more attention since it will be the html renderer of choice for gnome/gtk apps I think
Apr 10 06:31:03 * Navi shrugs
Apr 10 06:31:13 <johnx> by attention I mean optimizations :)
Apr 10 06:31:23 <Navi> webkitqt's included in the QT4
Apr 10 06:31:59 <GeneralAntilles> Anybody try the Qt demo app?
Apr 10 06:32:01 <Navi> and webkitgtk's rapidly made improvements
Apr 10 06:32:03 <johnx> is there a lightweight qt based browser built on webkit that *doesn't* suck in all of kde as a dependency?
Apr 10 06:32:05 <GeneralAntilles> It's incredibly snappy.
Apr 10 06:32:15 <KotCzarny> hmm
Apr 10 06:32:20 <KotCzarny> webkit is from apple?
Apr 10 06:32:22 <Navi> johnx, doubt it
Apr 10 06:32:26 <KotCzarny> or some independent project?
Apr 10 06:32:36 <johnx> KotCzarny, from KDE originally, now Apple is a big contributor
Apr 10 06:32:43 <KotCzarny> uhum
Apr 10 06:32:47 <KotCzarny> that's good
Apr 10 06:32:48 <Navi> EETZ A FORQUE
Apr 10 06:33:02 <johnx> eh?
Apr 10 06:33:09 <Navi> khtml forke
Apr 10 06:33:13 <Navi> s/forke/fork/
Apr 10 06:33:13 <infobot> Navi meant: khtml fork
Apr 10 06:33:26 <KotCzarny> maybe some nice build script to statically compile in kde libs
Apr 10 06:33:27 <KotCzarny> ;)
Apr 10 06:33:30 <johnx> aaah...I misinterpreted EETZ as "eats"
Apr 10 06:33:43 <Navi> Pfft
Apr 10 06:33:53 <johnx> I kind of pictured Navi with a fork stuck out of his mouth flailing at the keyboard
Apr 10 06:34:10 <GeneralAntilles> That's how I always picture Navi.
Apr 10 06:35:34 <GeneralAntilles> johnx, did you every figure out the top 3 things we need for Debian-maemo?
Apr 10 06:36:10 <johnx> I'm not sure what to put for that actually...I'm really torn
Apr 10 06:37:12 <johnx> dsme/bme/dsp would sure be nice for Debian on N800
Apr 10 06:37:26 <EruditeHermit> I just wish the browsers were faster
Apr 10 06:37:35 <GeneralAntilles> Diablo, EruditeHermit.
Apr 10 06:37:50 <johnx> but to get Maemo stuff into Debian, the top couple deps that all Maemo packages have would be nice
Apr 10 06:37:50 <GeneralAntilles> MicroB is a really old snapshot of Gecko 1.9.
Apr 10 06:38:03 <GeneralAntilles> There've been HUGE speedups since the version we have.
Apr 10 06:38:20 <EruditeHermit> yeah but I think they should make them available as they release
Apr 10 06:38:32 <johnx> that's not Nokia's style :)
Apr 10 06:38:34 <EruditeHermit> or atleast have the page on garage so that we can test stuff
Apr 10 06:38:37 <GeneralAntilles> One more downfall of bundling software.
Apr 10 06:38:43 <GeneralAntilles> You could build the svn.
Apr 10 06:38:53 <GeneralAntilles> Though, apparently, it depends on bc-dev
Apr 10 06:38:59 <GeneralAntilles> which doesn't actually exist anywhere.
Apr 10 06:39:14 <GeneralAntilles> EruditeHermit, Diablo also means "over-the-air" updates
Apr 10 06:39:36 <EruditeHermit> yeah
Apr 10 06:39:40 <GeneralAntilles> so that decouples application updates from big firmware updates.
Apr 10 06:39:59 <GeneralAntilles> I'm not sure if that'll bring us back to the pre-OS2007 update frequency for MicroB
Apr 10 06:40:00 <EruditeHermit> chinook was supposed to be that
Apr 10 06:40:01 <EruditeHermit> lol
Apr 10 06:40:05 <GeneralAntilles> But it should improve things.
Apr 10 06:40:10 <GeneralAntilles> No it wasn't.
Apr 10 06:40:20 <GeneralAntilles> Diablo was always the one set for SSU.
Apr 10 06:40:38 <GeneralAntilles> I don't know where people keep getting that Chinook was supposed to have SSU
Apr 10 06:40:42 <GeneralAntilles> but it's simply not true.
Apr 10 06:42:03 <EruditeHermit> wow I am using minefield on the tablet and it is so fast
Apr 10 06:42:15 <EruditeHermit> the rendering engine is so much better
Apr 10 06:43:01 <Navi> Damn it
Apr 10 06:43:22 <GeneralAntilles> Damn you
Apr 10 06:43:31 <Navi> mypaint's freezing up the tablet
Apr 10 06:43:44 <johnx> GeneralAntilles, ok, thanks for the pointer to that better libwebkit. It seems to make a noticeable difference
Apr 10 06:44:38 * Navi prays that the N800 doesn't reboot
Apr 10 06:45:05 <hrw> morning
Apr 10 06:45:25 * johnx tries the engadget torture test on midori
Apr 10 06:45:44 <GeneralAntilles> There's more crud on that website than content.
Apr 10 06:45:57 <johnx> yeah, but I like how snarky they are :)
Apr 10 06:46:01 <Navi> I just use the bench that's on the webkit site.
Apr 10 06:46:01 <GeneralAntilles> Hehe
Apr 10 06:46:05 <GeneralAntilles> I like engadget
Apr 10 06:46:07 <GeneralAntilles> But damn
Apr 10 06:46:13 <johnx> plus, it's like a trial by fire for browser engines
Apr 10 06:46:36 <johnx> and midori handles it great
Apr 10 06:46:46 <johnx> also, wide scroll bars rawk
Apr 10 06:46:50 <Navi> :P
Apr 10 06:47:02 <Navi> They take up screen real estate
Apr 10 06:47:38 <johnx> let's see, "see more crappy ads on engadget" vs "be able to scroll with my thumb"
Apr 10 06:47:44 <GeneralAntilles> I'm interested to see what those kinetic scrolling patches actually mean for MicroB
Apr 10 06:47:46 <johnx> hmm...tough choice
Apr 10 06:47:55 <jaska> adblock pro works on microbrowser :)
Apr 10 06:48:06 <GeneralAntilles> Bogs everything down.
Apr 10 06:48:16 <KotCzarny> johnx: use junkbuster
Apr 10 06:48:18 <KotCzarny> or privoxy
Apr 10 06:48:19 * Navi doesn't see ads
Apr 10 06:48:19 <KotCzarny> :)
Apr 10 06:48:24 <jaska> true.. i just cant browse with ads
Apr 10 06:48:36 <GeneralAntilles> hosts/css is the way to go
Apr 10 06:48:37 <jaska> disrupt my concentration
Apr 10 06:48:48 <EruditeHermit> when is diablo coming?
Apr 10 06:48:57 <GeneralAntilles> "Q2 2008"
Apr 10 06:48:59 <Navi> When hell freezes over
Apr 10 06:48:59 <GeneralAntilles> July at the latest.
Apr 10 06:49:00 <jaska> could probably hosts-ify my desktop opera blacklist
Apr 10 06:49:05 <GeneralAntilles> Pay attention to the Modest progress.
Apr 10 06:49:12 <jaska> they should renamed diablo to saatana
Apr 10 06:49:13 <GeneralAntilles> That's gonna be a decent metric for judging release.
Apr 10 06:49:28 <GeneralAntilles> Trademark issue.
Apr 10 06:54:03 <Navi> GeneralAntilles, http://www.xenf.net/images/Navifork.png
Apr 10 06:54:19 <GeneralAntilles> <_<
Apr 10 06:54:41 <GeneralAntilles> Hahaha
Apr 10 06:54:55 <johnx> :D
Apr 10 06:55:53 <Navi> :P
Apr 10 06:58:13 <Navi> How else do I type?  I've no hands.
Apr 10 06:59:22 <GeneralAntilles> You should at some fairy boy until he types for you.
Apr 10 07:00:51 <Khertan_n810> Hi !
Apr 10 07:00:55 <Navi> Hi
Apr 10 07:01:46 <GeneralAntilles> s/should/shout/
Apr 10 07:01:47 <infobot> GeneralAntilles meant: You shout at some fairy boy until he types for you.
Apr 10 07:01:52 * GeneralAntilles sighs.
Apr 10 07:01:54 <Khertan_n810> I understand now why dev don t upload their packages to extras
Apr 10 07:01:56 * GeneralAntilles to beds!
Apr 10 07:02:02 <Khertan_n810> still no news ...
Apr 10 07:02:04 <EruditeHermit> is there a way to get rid of unwanted libraries somewhat like how apt in debian or ubuntu handles unnecessary libs now
Apr 10 07:02:29 <johnx> maybe get deborphan compiled?
Apr 10 07:02:49 <EruditeHermit> yeah but I don't want to port it myself obviously =p
Apr 10 07:03:03 <EruditeHermit> I'll do it eventually maybe
Apr 10 07:03:03 <EruditeHermit> =p
Apr 10 07:03:28 <johnx> shouldn't be much of a port
Apr 10 07:03:32 <johnx> just a compile
Apr 10 07:05:27 <hrw> johnx: but 'porting' is so nice buzzyword...
Apr 10 07:06:07 <EruditeHermit> midori is ok
Apr 10 07:06:28 <johnx> it's obviously not finished but its *fast*
Apr 10 07:06:33 <EruditeHermit> yeah
Apr 10 07:06:38 <EruditeHermit> has some page rendering problems
Apr 10 07:06:49 <EruditeHermit> and basic bugs for buttons and input
Apr 10 07:06:56 <EruditeHermit> but its nice so far
Apr 10 07:07:31 <Khertan_n810> bye
Apr 10 07:07:55 <EruditeHermit> wow I can't believe how slow microB is in comparison to all of these browsers
Apr 10 07:08:36 <johnx> yeah :/
Apr 10 07:08:48 <johnx> thankfully there is nowhere it can go but up from here :)
Apr 10 07:09:41 <EruditeHermit> it'd be nice if they updated flash with microB
Apr 10 07:09:46 <EruditeHermit> do you think they'll do that?
Apr 10 07:10:01 <johnx> no idea. is it just a minor version bump?
Apr 10 07:10:09 <EruditeHermit> for flash?
Apr 10 07:10:10 <EruditeHermit> yes
Apr 10 07:10:23 <EruditeHermit> but it has some major fixes/feature updates
Apr 10 07:10:28 <EruditeHermit> although its really slow
Apr 10 07:10:28 <johnx> ah
Apr 10 07:10:44 <EruditeHermit> major compatibility fixes with websites that require latest flash
Apr 10 07:10:54 <EruditeHermit> but its slower than the older version on my desktop atleast =p
Apr 10 07:11:01 <johnx> ick
Apr 10 07:11:06 <EruditeHermit> yeah
Apr 10 07:11:12 <johnx> "flash" and "slower than before" is always bad to hear
Apr 10 07:11:14 <EruditeHermit> well the one on the tablet is 2 ago
Apr 10 07:11:30 <EruditeHermit> the one 1 previous to the latest one is faster
Apr 10 07:11:34 <johnx> I have it disabled on the tablet anyways
Apr 10 07:11:35 <EruditeHermit> the new one is slowest
Apr 10 07:11:37 <EruditeHermit> lol
Apr 10 07:11:56 <johnx> I use a youtube viewer and just don't worry about it otherwise
Apr 10 07:14:01 <EruditeHermit> well BBC has added flash videos
Apr 10 07:14:29 <johnx> a good flash video extractor would be nice
Apr 10 07:15:40 <EruditeHermit> I dislike flash for its slowness too
Apr 10 07:16:04 <johnx> it's probably an flv so if it could be extracted you could just save and view with mplayer
Apr 10 07:16:15 <rm_you> yarp
Apr 10 07:21:57 <EruditeHermit> ahh
Apr 10 07:22:03 <EruditeHermit> i'm out of space
Apr 10 07:22:17 * KotCzarny hums prodigy's song
Apr 10 07:24:18 <inz> Damn you, now it's playing in my head
Apr 10 07:24:33 <hrw> ;))
Apr 10 07:25:01 <KotCzarny> maemo should play it in the background when detecting low disc space
Apr 10 07:25:01 <KotCzarny> ;)
Apr 10 07:25:05 <KotCzarny> *disk
Apr 10 07:25:25 <EruditeHermit> it would take up too much space
Apr 10 07:25:27 <hrw> KotCzarny: disc contra disk?
Apr 10 07:25:51 <KotCzarny> disc suggests something round
Apr 10 07:25:51 <hrw> EruditeHermit: really? they willadd it as one of preinstalled songs
Apr 10 07:26:01 <KotCzarny> i use flash memory nowadays
Apr 10 07:26:08 <KotCzarny> almost exclusively
Apr 10 07:26:09 <KotCzarny> :)
Apr 10 07:27:29 <hrw> even with desktop?
Apr 10 07:27:40 <KotCzarny> i don't use desktops
Apr 10 07:27:41 <KotCzarny> :)
Apr 10 07:27:47 <KotCzarny> but yes
Apr 10 07:27:54 <hrw> ok - laptop used as desktop
Apr 10 07:28:00 <KotCzarny> i have 40pin ata--cf adapter too
Apr 10 07:28:14 <KotCzarny> in laptop i have 2x cf -- 44pin ata adapter
Apr 10 07:28:15 <hrw> there are no 160GB cf cards yet
Apr 10 07:28:15 <KotCzarny> :)
Apr 10 07:28:22 <KotCzarny> but there are 32gb ones
Apr 10 07:28:33 <KotCzarny> and that makes 64gb of flash storage possible
Apr 10 07:28:39 <hrw> 32gb would be enough for my wife but not me
Apr 10 07:28:54 <hrw> I use ~360GB of storage in desktop
Apr 10 07:28:56 <KotCzarny> dvd ripper, eh?
Apr 10 07:28:56 <hrw> brb
Apr 10 07:28:57 <KotCzarny> :)
Apr 10 07:29:03 <KotCzarny>   |> My Head Feels like a Frisbee - Shpongle (Tales of the Inexpressible)
Apr 10 07:29:04 <hrw> KotCzarny: lot of misc builds
Apr 10 07:29:33 <KotCzarny> still, i haven't said that i don't have regular hdds
Apr 10 07:29:42 <KotCzarny> i have 320gb usb drive
Apr 10 07:29:46 <KotCzarny> :)
Apr 10 07:30:08 <KotCzarny> but only use it when i want to change my mp3/vid/sources list
Apr 10 07:52:53 <Khertan> Hi again ...
Apr 10 08:00:34 <mbuf> within a single maemo application, can we open mutiple windows, that can be minimized and maximized? or should we use tabs?
Apr 10 08:03:47 <mbuf> from where can i get the source of osso-xterm?
Apr 10 08:03:59 <KotCzarny> apt-get source osso-xterm
Apr 10 08:04:40 <mbuf> KotCzarny, checking it out from svn, thanks
Apr 10 08:14:06 <Khertan> mbuf > yes you can open multiple windows ...
Apr 10 08:14:19 <Khertan> using tabs only eat space ...
Apr 10 08:14:24 <Khertan> use it efficiently
Apr 10 08:14:31 <mbuf> Khertan, so, if i want many applications to be opened from a single application, it is easier this way
Apr 10 08:14:53 <mbuf> Khertan, i just checked xterm and it neatly opens multiple instances
Apr 10 08:15:14 <Khertan> xterm isn't a great example of what a great application should be ...
Apr 10 08:15:25 <mbuf> Khertan, i see
Apr 10 08:15:40 <Khertan> in fact xterm itos2007 was better than the last buggy version ...
Apr 10 08:16:15 <mbuf> Khertan, i only want to see how to open new window with a new application
Apr 10 08:16:40 <mbuf> brb
Apr 10 08:17:01 <Khertan> hildon.Window()
Apr 10 08:23:55 <AD-N770> bon dia / good morning
Apr 10 08:26:23 * Jaffa keeps getting unsubscribed from maemo mailing lists for "excessive bounces" with last bounce dated about 7 days ago. My mail server logs don't show any bounces. Anyone else getting this?
Apr 10 08:26:35 <scibot> Hi guys, I have openssh-server running on my tablet but I can't seem to access it from my desktop.
Apr 10 08:27:09 <scibot> It responds to ping, so it isn't that sort of connectivity issue. =/
Apr 10 08:27:12 <johnx> you get connection refused or your password doesn't work?
Apr 10 08:27:23 <scibot> It doesn't connect at all.
Apr 10 08:27:29 <scibot> No response from the server that I can tell.
Apr 10 08:28:06 <scibot> The ssh client just sits there waiting for a response, but none comes.
Apr 10 08:28:19 <johnx> how long have you let it sit?
Apr 10 08:28:51 <johnx> you should either get "ssh 192.168.1.111" and you get "No route to host" or "connection refused" eventually, I would think...
Apr 10 08:28:58 <johnx> have you tried nmap?
Apr 10 08:29:53 <mbuf> it happens with dropbear as well onN810; most of the time it doesn't respond to ssh requests from the PC
Apr 10 08:30:13 <mbuf> earlier in the N800, i was able to do maximum of 3 ssh connections only from the PC to the device
Apr 10 08:30:52 <johnx> mbuf, when it doesn't respond to ssh, is it able to respond to pings?
Apr 10 08:31:03 <scibot> Debug from the client - http://pasteall.org/389
Apr 10 08:31:03 <mbuf> johnx, yes
Apr 10 08:31:23 <mbuf> johnx, if i restart dropbear, "/etc/init.d/dropbear restart"; then after few seconds it responds
Apr 10 08:31:39 <mbuf> johnx, but, if the connection is inactive for a period of time, the ssh connection on Eterm on the PC just hangs
Apr 10 08:32:04 <johnx> I've started having my ssh client on PC send keep-alives every 45 seconds with good effect
Apr 10 08:32:37 <johnx> My connection to opensshd on my tablet used to die off after a while, but now it seems better
Apr 10 08:32:43 <mbuf> johnx, i see
Apr 10 08:33:00 <johnx> I don't know about dropbear though...
Apr 10 08:33:12 <solmumaha> can the tablet access the net? setting UseDNS no in /etc/ssh/sshd_config could help with connecting
Apr 10 08:34:38 <keesj> solmumaha: you mean the matrix?
Apr 10 08:34:43 <scibot> I can access the net from the tablet, and I can access the ssh from the tablet itself ala. localhost.
Apr 10 08:38:21 <scibot> solmumaha, Doesn't make a difference.
Apr 10 08:38:51 <solmumaha> k
Apr 10 08:39:54 <scibot> I don't get it though, it connects but why wont it continue past that point?
Apr 10 08:40:10 <KotCzarny> ssh -v
Apr 10 08:40:15 <KotCzarny> i mean ssh -d
Apr 10 08:40:36 <scibot> ?
Apr 10 08:40:44 <KotCzarny> debug flag
Apr 10 08:40:54 <KotCzarny> you will see what it is doing
Apr 10 08:41:09 <scibot> No such flag exists for my ssh client.
Apr 10 08:41:17 <scibot> <scibot> Debug from the client - http://pasteall.org/389
Apr 10 08:41:27 <solmumaha> i had the same symptom when my dns servers were acting up and setting UseDNS no helps in that case
Apr 10 08:41:40 <KotCzarny> erm, use pastebin.com
Apr 10 08:41:43 <KotCzarny> it's nicer
Apr 10 08:41:59 <scibot> KotCzarny, It wasn't on my browser. =/
Apr 10 08:42:12 <KotCzarny> try more -v flags
Apr 10 08:42:17 <KotCzarny> ie ssh -v -v -v
Apr 10 08:42:37 <scibot> Same output
Apr 10 08:43:01 <KotCzarny> .196 is some local machine other ?
Apr 10 08:43:15 <scibot> Only additional line, debug2: ssh_connect: needpriv 0
Apr 10 08:43:35 <KotCzarny> and solmumaha may be right
Apr 10 08:43:58 <scibot> It's a semi-local machine, runs through a couple of routers that propogate the wireless signal further, but it responds to ping from the same spot I'm trying to use my ssh client from.
Apr 10 08:44:19 <KotCzarny> it may be long dns resolve
Apr 10 08:44:39 <KotCzarny> on clinet or server side
Apr 10 08:44:54 <scibot> I don't get how that's relevant when it has no problem connecting to the server?
Apr 10 08:45:07 <scibot> The problem here is past the connection there doesn't seem to be much of a response.
Apr 10 08:45:17 <KotCzarny> server tries to resolve client hostname
Apr 10 08:45:20 <KotCzarny> for security reasons
Apr 10 08:46:11 <KotCzarny> add your client's ip to the server's /etc/hosts file?
Apr 10 08:46:48 <scibot> Can't, dynamic IP.
Apr 10 08:46:49 <solmumaha> yes, did you remember to restart sshd after the change?
Apr 10 08:46:57 <scibot> Of course.
Apr 10 08:47:01 <solmumaha> k
Apr 10 08:47:08 <KotCzarny> scibot, it's local ip
Apr 10 08:47:33 <KotCzarny> just try adding it for a test
Apr 10 08:47:48 <scibot> That's more complicated than you think it is.
Apr 10 08:47:53 <KotCzarny> :)
Apr 10 08:48:04 <KotCzarny> do you have local dns server?
Apr 10 08:48:29 <scibot> I doubt it, but the router might.
Apr 10 08:49:24 <solmumaha> you could also try running sshd on foreground with debug if it doesn't log on tablet
Apr 10 08:51:42 <scibot> "Server listening on 0.0.0.0 port 22" "socket: Address family not supported by protocol"
Apr 10 08:54:19 <solmumaha> are you using ipv6? try -4 from client
Apr 10 08:54:41 <KotCzarny> it's not critical..
Apr 10 08:54:44 <KotCzarny> :)
Apr 10 08:56:31 <solmumaha> yes, but it doesn't hurt to rule it out
Apr 10 09:04:31 <scibot> ipv6 has only given me grief with debian. =/
Apr 10 09:06:13 <solmumaha> i hear you, blacklisting ipv6 is the first thing i do on fresh install
Apr 10 09:11:31 <scibot> I give up, not worth the effort of resolving it.
Apr 10 10:12:44 <lardman> morning
Apr 10 11:38:51 <jesh> hello
Apr 10 11:39:05 <johnx> hi
Apr 10 11:39:06 <jesh> i wrote a simple helloworld-style application with pygtk
Apr 10 11:39:32 <jesh> and tried to change background color for a one button
Apr 10 11:39:42 <jesh> with rc-file
Apr 10 11:39:59 <jesh> however, while changing font and foreground works, background doesn't
Apr 10 11:40:01 <jesh> i wonder why?
Apr 10 11:40:27 <jesh> i mean, background color stays white
Apr 10 11:55:40 <Mikho> a question:
Apr 10 11:56:16 <Mikho> what is the right way to make it possible for the application to write to it's own data files?
Apr 10 11:57:07 <Mikho> I have the app installed in /usr/share/<appname> but I just realized it can't create log files or modify its own conf file
Apr 10 11:58:31 <johnx> usually log files and user-specific conf goes into /home/user/.<your-app-name>
Apr 10 11:58:50 <Mikho> if I don't want user-specific conf, but app-specific?
Apr 10 11:59:17 <johnx> well, generally anything that is changeable by the user at run-time is considered user specific conf
Apr 10 12:00:43 <Mikho> so there's really no good way for a program to modify its own data files?
Apr 10 12:01:41 <Mikho> without making copies to every user's home directory
Apr 10 12:02:35 <johnx> I think the "copy to $HOME" seems to be how most Unix programs handle it
Apr 10 12:02:57 <Mikho> I don't like the idea, but if there's no choice...
Apr 10 12:03:13 <johnx> well, they're is always a choice...
Apr 10 12:03:20 <johnx> I'm just saying how I've *seen* other apps do it
Apr 10 12:03:31 <johnx> you could just make your data files world writeable
Apr 10 12:03:38 <jesh> or group writeable
Apr 10 12:03:53 <jesh> or make a setuid program to edit them
Apr 10 12:04:21 <johnx> is 'user' in any groups by default, besides dialout, video and audio?
Apr 10 12:04:45 <johnx> either way, you could add 'user' to a group and make the data file only editable by people in that group
Apr 10 12:04:59 <Mikho> i see
Apr 10 12:05:15 <johnx> it's all kind of acedemic as there is basically no way to add another user on the tablet
Apr 10 12:05:37 <Mikho> oh, I didn't know that
Apr 10 12:06:23 <johnx> Unless you're incredibly worried about Unix correctness, making your data files world-writeable and writeable by user only are pretty much the same thing on OS2008
Apr 10 12:06:56 <johnx> I don't see Nokia changing their "single user" approach any time soon, but I don't have any inside info, so I can't be sure
Apr 10 12:07:13 <Mikho> ok
Apr 10 12:11:16 <Mikho> all right, how can I find out the home directory within a c program?
Apr 10 12:13:04 <onion> Mikho: if you use glib: g_get_home_dir
Apr 10 12:13:38 <opendeep> hello X_Fade_
Apr 10 12:13:55 <Mikho> ok, thanks
Apr 10 12:15:28 <johnx> or if you don't use glib, getenv(), $HOME is the one you're interested in
Apr 10 12:16:31 <hrw> ~curse nokia
Apr 10 12:16:32 <infobot> May you be reincarnated as a Windows XP administrator, nokia !
Apr 10 12:16:51 <hrw> 2.6.18-omap1 works nice on 770 but no wifi
Apr 10 12:18:16 <hrw> ssvb: ping
Apr 10 12:23:11 <ssvb> hrw: ack
Apr 10 12:24:46 <hrw> ssvb: you hack cx3110x for 770 - right?
Apr 10 12:24:55 <ssvb> right
Apr 10 12:25:08 <hrw> ssvb: why 2.6.16 instead of 2.6.18 kernel?
Apr 10 12:25:15 <ssvb> ?
Apr 10 12:25:25 <ssvb> just because it works
Apr 10 12:25:39 <hrw> 2.6.18 works on my 770 with Poky
Apr 10 12:26:01 <hrw> ok - other thing
Apr 10 12:26:09 <hrw> ssvb: I have two patches for cx3110x
Apr 10 12:26:49 <ssvb> hrw: but I'm not maintaining cx3110x :)
Apr 10 12:27:00 <ssvb> what kind of patches do you have?
Apr 10 12:27:03 <hrw> ah - I was thinking that you are one of them ;)
Apr 10 12:27:15 <hrw> http://pastebin.ca/979499 makes 1.2 build for 770 with 2.6.18
Apr 10 12:28:04 <ssvb> cool, does it work?
Apr 10 12:28:06 <hrw> http://pastebin.ca/979503 make passing CC and LD much easier
Apr 10 12:28:26 <ssvb> I mean, is that all that is needed to fix?
Apr 10 12:29:23 <hrw> ssvb: I use umac.ko from 2.6.16.27 with some hacking + cx3110x source
Apr 10 12:30:40 <ssvb> I suggest posting your patches to cx3110x-devel mailing list
Apr 10 12:31:17 <hrw> ok
Apr 10 12:49:58 <wom-> hi, anyone familiar with osso file manager
Apr 10 12:50:28 <johnx> you mean using it or its source code?
Apr 10 12:50:30 <wom-> is there away to add kind of "open with" menu to it
Apr 10 12:50:34 <wom-> source
Apr 10 12:50:44 <wom-> i was thinking of plugin for it
Apr 10 12:50:57 <wom-> if it supports plugins or extensions
Apr 10 12:54:10 <wom-> hmm, maybe just registering mime/type and application would be enough
Apr 10 12:54:33 <inz> If it's done properly, then yeah
Apr 10 12:54:34 <wom-> could work in this case
Apr 10 13:08:33 <WormFood> I still can't seem to connect to any sites with bzip2 package for n800 (I'm in china, and some sites are blocked here)....does anyone have a url handy, where I can download that package?
Apr 10 13:17:32 <Navi> Which package?
Apr 10 13:17:48 <Navi> lame
Apr 10 13:21:01 <johnx> hey, try from here WormFood : http://sheeplauncher.net/bzip2_1.0.4-1_armel.deb
Apr 10 13:23:00 <WormFood> thanks johnx
Apr 10 13:23:07 <johnx> did it work? :)
Apr 10 13:23:19 <WormFood> trying now
Apr 10 13:24:18 <WormFood> yes it works for me, thanks a lot ;)
Apr 10 13:24:26 <johnx> I'm not a big fan of people who restrict other people's access to the internet, on principle :D
Apr 10 13:24:31 <johnx> glad it worked
Apr 10 13:27:44 <zxula> I unpacked the rootfs from the latest FIASCO image added a few files in the rootfs usr/bin directory and then I reflashed the device with the new rootfs, everything seems to work but for some reason it's not loading the theme everything seems to be using the default GTK interface and it also shows the mouse cursor anyone knows what the problem could be?
Apr 10 13:28:48 <zxula> the applications and everything seem to work fine
Apr 10 13:29:03 <johnx> definitely sounds like something went pretty wrong, If you launch an app from the terminal does it complain about missing theme images or something helpful?
Apr 10 13:29:12 <johnx> what did you add to /usr/bin ?
Apr 10 13:29:20 <zxula> some binaries I made
Apr 10 13:29:34 <zxula> nop it doesn't it loads it fine
Apr 10 13:29:55 <zxula> but it uses the typical gtk theme the one you see on the pc's the default grayish color
Apr 10 13:30:07 <johnx> if you try to select a theme from the menu on the home screen what happens?
Apr 10 13:30:20 <zxula> also I noticed it doesn't save my startup applet setup it always bails back to the default so I'm guessing it could be a permission problem on the jffs2 fs that I made?
Apr 10 13:30:21 <johnx> could the binaries you added be overlapping in name with something else on the system?
Apr 10 13:30:26 <zxula> it doesn't load it
Apr 10 13:30:31 <zxula> nop
Apr 10 13:30:34 <zxula> it's just 2 binaries
Apr 10 13:30:37 <zxula> different names
Apr 10 13:30:46 <zxula> I mean non typical unix commands
Apr 10 13:31:02 <WormFood> I have another problem I have never experienced before.....if I open a web browser without a wireless connection, it prompts me to pick a wireless connection, and after I select it, it will not work...all screen taps and button pushes do nothing....I do not feel the unit is locked up, but something is wrong.....anyone seen this problem before?
Apr 10 13:31:47 <WormFood> this is on an N800
Apr 10 13:32:29 <WormFood> I have not experimented with it much, but I will....I was just wondering if anyone experienced it before
Apr 10 13:34:08 <mgedmin> I've seen all kinds of strange semi-crashes
Apr 10 13:34:26 <mgedmin> e.g. sometimes the browser just stops making new connections, and you can't use it any more until you restart it
Apr 10 13:35:23 <WormFood> well, I've had this particular problem at least 2 or 3 times now....does not seem to be random
Apr 10 13:35:57 <zxula> the perms seem to be preserved in the filesystem and users directory so I'm guessing it's something else
Apr 10 13:38:15 <zxula> I noticed the xterminal doesn't default to the users home dir so I'm guessing some global variables such as the home aren't set?
Apr 10 13:38:20 <zxula> it defaults to the / dir
Apr 10 13:40:41 <johnx> but /home/user is still there?
Apr 10 13:41:03 <johnx> what about the permissions on /home/user and it's sub-directories?
Apr 10 13:44:49 <zxula> johnx: yea
Apr 10 13:44:54 <zxula> I noticed it had the wrong perms though
Apr 10 13:45:00 <zxula> it had some weird uids
Apr 10 13:45:03 <zxula> 503 or something
Apr 10 13:45:07 <johnx> that would do it :)
Apr 10 13:45:11 <zxula> I restored it lets see
Apr 10 13:45:25 <zxula> yeah that was it!
Apr 10 13:45:27 <zxula> thx :>
Apr 10 13:45:33 <johnx> sure :)
Apr 10 13:45:53 <johnx> ok, I'm drawing a blank, what's the busybox command to add a user to a group
Apr 10 13:46:03 <elb> vi /etc/group
Apr 10 13:46:04 <elb> ;-)
Apr 10 13:46:12 <johnx> heh :P
Apr 10 13:46:22 <johnx> I need to use it in a postinst script
Apr 10 13:46:37 <johnx> I'm trying to make proper "user friendly" fuse packages that "just work"
Apr 10 13:47:51 <WormFood> johnx, thanks again for that bzip2 url, that is exactly what I needed....I've already tried it out on my n800 ;)
Apr 10 13:49:00 <johnx> great. :D I enjoy helping people circumvent impediments to high-quality compression algorithms
Apr 10 13:51:35 <WormFood> I don't know why bzip2 isn't part of busybox
Apr 10 13:52:37 <johnx> because they didn't need it so they figured they could save a couple KB
Apr 10 13:53:46 <elb> johnx: addgroup is the "standard" way, I don't have busybox in front of me to see if it offers it
Apr 10 13:54:11 <elb> I quote standard because it's not very standard
Apr 10 13:54:32 <johnx> yeah, it's adduser in debian :)
Apr 10 13:54:32 <hrw> WormFood: bunzip2 is in busybox
Apr 10 13:54:43 <elb> addgroup works fine in debian
Apr 10 13:54:52 <johnx> ah, heh.
Apr 10 13:54:54 <elb> addgroup username groupname
Apr 10 13:54:59 * johnx learns something new everyday
Apr 10 13:55:45 <johnx> anyways, there's no addgroup on OS2008 and 'groupadd user users' prints the usage info
Apr 10 13:56:45 <ewanchic> hello. I need to talk to someone who is in charge of the http://repository.maemo.org/ files :)
Apr 10 13:57:37 <Jaffa> ewanchic: probably best to raise a bug at bugs.maemo.org if it's anything important
Apr 10 13:57:46 <opendeep> I want to commit to repository ,can anyone send me that invitation
Apr 10 13:58:10 <ewanchic> Jaffa, the problem is that e2fsprogs is missing.
Apr 10 13:58:13 <opendeep> username:opendeep @ garage.maemo.org
Apr 10 13:58:30 <zxula> johnx: my os2008 has groupadd -g gid -o group
Apr 10 13:58:35 <zxula> it's the rel 3 i think
Apr 10 13:58:39 <ewanchic> It was there two days ago, and now it's gone as of yesterday.
Apr 10 14:00:27 <johnx> zxula, so pretend I'm really dumb, what's the command to add a user to an existing group?
Apr 10 14:01:11 <lopz> hi
Apr 10 14:01:18 <johnx> nevermind, got it with usermod
Apr 10 14:01:26 <johnx> err...hmm
Apr 10 14:01:56 <johnx> nah, just tricked myself. The question is still open. :)
Apr 10 14:02:13 <zxula> oh sorry I misunderstood the question
Apr 10 14:02:32 <johnx> no worries. :)
Apr 10 14:04:12 <ewanchic> Does anybody know where else I can get the e2fsprogs package?
Apr 10 14:04:33 <johnx> here: http://repository.maemo.org/pool/chinook/free/e/e2fsprogs/
Apr 10 14:04:41 <zxula> gpasswd works?
Apr 10 14:04:51 <ewanchic> johnx: It's not there.
Apr 10 14:05:06 <ewanchic> AHHH!
Apr 10 14:05:11 <ewanchic> It's there now :P
Apr 10 14:05:16 <johnx> ewanchic, :)
Apr 10 14:05:42 <johnx> zxula, thanks. that might do it. Somehow I've never heard of that command before... O_o
Apr 10 14:05:55 <zxula> np
Apr 10 14:06:00 <johnx> works! awesome
Apr 10 14:06:06 <zxula> :>
Apr 10 14:06:14 <johnx> Using Debian since 1998 has obviously made me soft
Apr 10 14:06:28 <ewanchic> You have to believe me, it was there not more than an hour ago. maybe that 'other' guy I was talking to got it out there. I'm happy again.
Apr 10 14:07:03 <johnx> ewanchic, well, just make sure you grab one before they run out again. It's a popular package so they often run out of stock :D
Apr 10 14:07:32 <ewanchic> johnx: LOL I'm sure of it!
Apr 10 14:07:53 <johnx> honestly though, maemo.org has lots of weird hiccups
Apr 10 14:09:35 <ewanchic> AHHHHH. I see the problem now. I've kept going to http://repository.maemo.org/extras/pool/chinook/free/e/ ....remove the extras directory.
Apr 10 14:09:53 <ewanchic> old post I was looking at I guess
Apr 10 14:09:54 <johnx> yeah, it's kinda confusing
Apr 10 14:10:48 <hrw> ~curse nOKIA for lack of any idea how wifi works in linux
Apr 10 14:10:49 <infobot> May the fleas of a thousand camels infest your most sensitive regions, nOKIA for lack of any idea how wifi works in linux !
Apr 10 14:11:47 <johnx> heh...hrw, get in line. They control battery charge through a userspace binary-only program...
Apr 10 14:11:51 <hrw> good bye WPA on !maemo
Apr 10 14:12:02 <hrw> johnx: I am in that line for over year
Apr 10 14:12:08 <lcuk> qgil, i will have an answer by 6pm gmt, my boss is mumbling over whether to untether me.  (if qgil aint here could someone just pass that on if they see him)
Apr 10 14:12:18 * lcuk goes back to work
Apr 10 14:13:03 <zxula> hrw: yea they limit the sources to the driver too
Apr 10 14:13:03 <johnx> hrw, What problem are you having with WPA? You've seen that patch that adds a little bit of wext support, right?
Apr 10 14:13:07 <hrw> johnx: I booted Poky on 770. we use 2.6.18 (from os2007-n800) on it. I even have modules for wifi which loads into kernel
Apr 10 14:13:33 <hrw> johnx: I used cx3110x 1.2 sources
Apr 10 14:13:47 <johnx> so that incorporates the wext patch?
Apr 10 14:13:52 <zxula> that's only a limited subset of the drivers :/
Apr 10 14:14:09 <johnx> true, but it's enough for wpa_supplicant (for the n800 at least)
Apr 10 14:14:29 <zxula> yea for his case it is but if you wanna do other stuff it's not
Apr 10 14:14:39 <zxula> like support writing tx packets while the card is in monitor mode
Apr 10 14:14:55 <johnx> ah, the famous "packet injection" :)
Apr 10 14:15:55 <zxula> I was disassembling the propriator module that they use and it's entirely based on the prism drivers
Apr 10 14:16:02 <zxula> even the function names are the same
Apr 10 14:16:17 <hrw> zxula: which prism drivers? I know atleast 3
Apr 10 14:16:22 <zxula> I mean doing the mod for the prism like drivers isn't hard
Apr 10 14:16:29 <hrw> orinoco, hostap, wlan-ng
Apr 10 14:16:31 <zxula> prism2 I think
Apr 10 14:16:39 <zxula> oh wlan-ng
Apr 10 14:16:56 <hrw> wlan-ng is the worst shit when it comes to drivers
Apr 10 14:17:06 <hrw> open drivers of course
Apr 10 14:17:09 <johnx> isn't wlan-ng GPL'ed?
Apr 10 14:17:38 <zxula> but even if you modify the lkm directly or setup hooks into them you'd still be violating the users license agreement
Apr 10 14:17:48 <hrw> johnx: about wext patch - no idea
Apr 10 14:17:54 <jobu> have any of you tried putting android on an n800?
Apr 10 14:18:16 <Blafasel> zxula: I wouldn't care about that if that would give me more wlan features..
Apr 10 14:18:42 <zxula> Blafasel: as a user sure, but posting such a thing will get you into trouble
Apr 10 14:19:04 <zxula> I went back and forth telling them what to do and they denied doing it
Apr 10 14:19:12 <zxula> I mean the mods are a joke
Apr 10 14:19:15 <zxula> to add support for it
Apr 10 14:20:19 <johnx> hrw, maybe, I'm confused about what you're talking about, but there is a patch here, that seems to add enough wext support for me to use wpa_supplicant on an N800: https://garage.maemo.org/pipermail/cx3110x-devel/2007-November/000005.html
Apr 10 14:20:24 <hrw> johnx: as usual with maemo stuff all you can get from google contain irclogs or forum posts.
Apr 10 14:20:58 <hrw> someone should host garage.maemo.org on better link and give google access
Apr 10 14:22:56 <Blafasel> zxula: Not for me, I fear. But maybe it's worth looking at them.
Apr 10 14:23:03 <monkeyiq> hmm, I might try googling around for WPA2 patches for the n810.
Apr 10 14:23:26 <johnx> monkeyiq, What kind of network are you trying to join with it?
Apr 10 14:23:42 <monkeyiq> johnx; I join a WPA2
Apr 10 14:23:51 <monkeyiq> johnx; but its rather slower than I'd like
Apr 10 14:24:36 <monkeyiq> I've not looked into what is handing the en/decryption on the 810, but whatever it is, it is very slow.
Apr 10 14:24:59 <johnx> it would probably be handled on the CPU, right?
Apr 10 14:25:11 <monkeyiq> I'm tempted to see what speed I can get on a non encrypted AP using ssh tunneling and firewailling on the router to block non ssh traffic
Apr 10 14:25:28 <monkeyiq> johnx; yeah 100% cpu load at the peak 500kbyte/sec
Apr 10 14:25:47 <johnx> sounds about right
Apr 10 14:25:54 <johnx> Somehow I don't see ssh being faster...
Apr 10 14:26:07 <monkeyiq> I can scp to localhost on the n810 at 1mb/sec
Apr 10 14:26:31 <johnx> right, but just using the wireless card unencrypted takes CPU time
Apr 10 14:26:48 <johnx> but sure, go ahead and test it. I'd be interested in the results
Apr 10 14:27:16 <monkeyiq> also, a tinc VPN ontop of WPA2 can run almost at 400kbyte/sec
Apr 10 14:27:17 <zxula> monkeyiq: it will avg at 250k/s on an open ap with sftp
Apr 10 14:27:48 <monkeyiq> zxula; hmm so sftp is 50% slower than WPA2?
Apr 10 14:28:17 <zxula> no idea that's on a 54mbs router between the n810 and my laptop
Apr 10 14:28:29 <zxula> i sftp from my laptop into the n810
Apr 10 14:28:45 <zxula> it starts at 450k then drops down to 250k
Apr 10 14:29:09 <monkeyiq> hmm, can you easily test what a wget from a web server can give you with no encryption?
Apr 10 14:29:25 <hrw> johnx: thx
Apr 10 14:29:28 <monkeyiq> I'd be interested to see what overhead the ssh is giving you
Apr 10 14:29:42 <zxula> ok 1sec but there are so many factors that may delay it
Apr 10 14:29:45 <zxula> I'll try it on my lan
Apr 10 14:29:56 <johnx> hrw, you think that will work with the 770? If so I'll update my wiki
Apr 10 14:30:10 <monkeyiq> I tested it with just d/loading a 10mb junk file created with dd
Apr 10 14:30:30 <zxula> 450k/s
Apr 10 14:30:58 <monkeyiq> hmm, interesting... so you don't actually seem to get any speed advantage at all not using WPA2
Apr 10 14:31:27 <zxula> don't think
Apr 10 14:31:41 <hrw> johnx: same fault
Apr 10 14:31:52 <zxula> I mean the processing power to do the wpa2 stuff is minimal I guess
Apr 10 14:32:03 <zxula> or not worth worrying about
Apr 10 14:32:15 <hrw> johnx: still crash
Apr 10 14:32:24 <monkeyiq> sort of a shame if you want to scp 600mb of oggs to the n810 at the last minute before heading out. having to dig up the usb cable or wait for 500kb/sec :/
Apr 10 14:32:50 <johnx> hrw, that's interesting. wpa_supplicant certainly complained when I used it, but it worked.
Apr 10 14:32:59 <monkeyiq> zxula; I was sort of afraid of that, given that I can run ssh or tinc ontop of the WPA2 stuff and still see 350-400kb/s
Apr 10 14:33:41 <hrw> root@nokia770:~# wpa_supplicant -Dwext -iwlan0 -c /etc/wpa_supplicant.conf
Apr 10 14:33:41 <hrw> ioctl[SIOCSIWPMKSA]: No such device
Apr 10 14:33:45 <hrw> REBOOT
Apr 10 14:33:50 <johnx> reboot?!
Apr 10 14:33:56 <hrw> device self reboot
Apr 10 14:33:59 <johnx> ok, that didn't happen to me on the N800
Apr 10 14:34:09 <johnx> have you disabled watchdog reboots?
Apr 10 14:34:09 <hrw> n800 has other wifi chip
Apr 10 14:34:14 <hrw> johnx: no
Apr 10 14:35:07 <zxula> oh btw if you're doing long transfers the ssh will die if you don't manually set the power management to off
Apr 10 14:35:38 <johnx> zxula, it doesn't here. I would assume it depends on the router
Apr 10 14:35:42 <zxula> even if you put in the connection settings power management off it will set the power management to on on it's on
Apr 10 14:35:45 <zxula> on/own
Apr 10 14:35:51 <monkeyiq> hmm, I've only tried to xfer files up to about 700mb over scp
Apr 10 14:35:57 <zxula> I had to explicitly set iwconfig wlan0 power off
Apr 10 14:36:29 <zxula> johnx: that's true I haven't had this issue with my old router it sends a keep alive or something
Apr 10 14:36:45 <monkeyiq> and I've got power mgmt=on here.
Apr 10 14:36:56 <zxula> yea your router must be good then
Apr 10 14:37:25 <monkeyiq> though I might experiment with that, I had a longer NFS xfer die unexpectedly on me. Though I thought that might have been a flow control issue
Apr 10 14:37:30 <johnx> that being said, if I send enough *from* the N800 it's wireless connection will eventually die and need to be brought up again
Apr 10 14:38:03 <zxula> yea you need iwconfig wlan0 power off
Apr 10 14:38:24 <zxula> i don't know if there is a way to programatically take control of this
Apr 10 14:38:34 <zxula> through dbus maybe
Apr 10 14:38:46 <Blafasel> Regarding the wifi drivers again: If they are basically using a prism GPL driver, aren't they forced to disclose the source?
Apr 10 14:38:55 <monkeyiq> zxula: dbus might be the go
Apr 10 14:39:12 <monkeyiq> zxula; I bring up tinc using dbus to respond to connection up msgs
Apr 10 14:39:27 <zxula> oh cool
Apr 10 14:39:58 <monkeyiq> zxula; check out these http://www.cobb.uk.net/770/#dbus-scripts
Apr 10 14:41:59 <johnx> Blafasel, They are dual licensed (at least 2 licenses...) MPL and GPL2
Apr 10 14:42:12 <zxula> looks like dbus might be a way to disable the power management
Apr 10 14:42:59 <monkeyiq> yeah, should be fairly quick to brew a little script with that link too.
Apr 10 14:43:07 <Blafasel> johnx: Ah, ok. Sad.
Apr 10 14:43:29 <johnx> yeah, I was wondering about that too. :/
Apr 10 14:43:45 <johnx> anyways, off to bed
Apr 10 14:44:05 <jott> maybe there are still gpl2-only parts in it... hm
Apr 10 14:44:49 <johnx> jott, it looks like "AbsoluteValue Systems, Inc" retains all rights, so they could just license it however they want
Apr 10 14:45:53 <_V_> re
Apr 10 14:46:04 <_V_> i'm unable do unistalle openssh :(
Apr 10 14:46:11 <_V_> this is the message i receive:
Apr 10 14:46:11 <jott> as long as they only used the code from them...
Apr 10 14:46:14 <_V_> http://rafb.net/p/oZEMyF44.html
Apr 10 14:46:34 <_V_> any idea on what is the problem ?
Apr 10 14:47:21 <jott> zxula: have you analyzed how big the difference are between the baseline opensource drivers?
Apr 10 14:48:09 <zxula> jott: not really I just skimmed through the disassembly and looked more into the tx_ routines
Apr 10 14:48:27 <jott> ok
Apr 10 14:48:31 * jott vanishes again
Apr 10 14:48:38 <zxula> but you can write up a script in ELF diff script for that matter
Apr 10 14:48:51 <zxula> not sure if IDA supports it, it should be fairly easy to script a plugin for it
Apr 10 14:49:27 <zxula> or gdb
Apr 10 15:00:30 <konttori> Was someone asking for me?
Apr 10 15:05:50 <hrw> 09 21:52 < qgil> konttori: are you here?
Apr 10 15:06:00 * konttori read the backlog. yeah 
Apr 10 15:06:12 <hrw> konttori: you wrote ukmp?
Apr 10 15:06:13 <konttori> qgil was mentioning me a few times
Apr 10 15:06:16 <konttori> yeah
Apr 10 15:06:24 <konttori> as a python learning hobby
Apr 10 15:06:30 <hrw> konttori: I do not like its post install script
Apr 10 15:06:36 <konttori> and hack test
Apr 10 15:06:45 <hrw> konttori: http://blog.haerwu.biz/2008/03/31/very-small-test-of-maemo-media-players/
Apr 10 15:06:59 <konttori> Yeah. I read your comment
Apr 10 15:07:19 <konttori> ukmp is a hack. The postinst is a convenience for me.
Apr 10 15:07:27 <konttori> Is there something specific you'd like to change?
Apr 10 15:07:54 <konttori> I could maybe put some parts of the script as part of my build script. (like the cp)
Apr 10 15:07:55 <hrw> remove all those "mv this.py this" as it should be done during building of package
Apr 10 15:08:20 <hrw> konttori: next is - remove removing from cards. it should be an option in application for doing this
Apr 10 15:08:32 <hrw> konttori: basic rule: NEVER EVER touch user data
Apr 10 15:09:00 <konttori> it used to be an option. I just then decided to be user friendly/evil/knowitall/knowsitbest
Apr 10 15:09:33 <konttori> as you can see the commented confirmation code there.
Apr 10 15:10:12 <konttori> I just ended up making it (for that version) automatic. As it was actually mandatory (for fixing the database corruptions from previous version)
Apr 10 15:10:31 <hrw> anyway I did not found any media player for me yet
Apr 10 15:10:40 <konttori> I suggest canola. It's nice
Apr 10 15:12:07 <konttori> or just build your own. Should not be too hard
Apr 10 15:12:57 <hrw> ;)
Apr 10 15:14:00 <hrw> http://blog.haerwu.biz/2008/04/10/the-curse-of-maemo-closed-source-components/
Apr 10 15:14:46 <jaska> yeah its fairly silly
Apr 10 15:23:55 <zxula> hrw: nice
Apr 10 15:35:17 <deejoe> hrw: thanks for the link
Apr 10 15:49:54 <hrw|gone> bye
Apr 10 16:01:43 <lcuk> woooooooooooooooooot my boss let me go to germany \:D/
Apr 10 16:03:49 <qwerty12> Nice :), the weather any better than the UK :P
Apr 10 16:43:44 <zerodegre> anyone home can hwlp me with mapper?
Apr 10 16:44:43 <zerodegre> i got the GPs working in my 810 with mapper, but which maps should i use???  also, which ones would be best to make it the most like a regualr step by step GPS system, or is this possible?
Apr 10 16:47:42 <zerodegre> anyone?
Apr 10 17:30:04 <lcuk> zerodegre, i think you caught this channel at its quietest
Apr 10 17:31:12 <lcuk> i just use the regular map software - we havent sprung for the paid for additional turn by turn but i hear its just a normal regular working map app
Apr 10 17:31:39 <Khertan_n810> Hi again !
Apr 10 17:31:50 <lcuk> hi Khertan_n810
Apr 10 17:32:00 <lcuk> how goes the pygtk editor?
Apr 10 17:32:16 <lcuk> and why didnt you let people know it changes font size ...
Apr 10 17:32:45 <Khertan_n810> maybe someone can help me : someone know the process of validating packages uploaded to extras ?
Apr 10 17:33:16 <Khertan_n810> lcuk > since the first version you can change font with zoom key
Apr 10 17:33:32 <Khertan_n810> as maemo guideslines suggest it
Apr 10 17:33:44 <lcuk> i know that now :P it was never documented and its likely the only thing ive ever needed my zoom for
Apr 10 17:33:50 <Khertan_n810> i know i should write a documentation
Apr 10 17:34:09 <lcuk> its ok, it makes it more readable now thanks for pointing it out
Apr 10 17:34:19 <Khertan_n810> but  i prefers coding
Apr 10 17:34:20 <lcuk> now, are you still having same problem as yesterday
Apr 10 17:34:46 <lcuk> i agree with the coding aspect :)
Apr 10 17:34:53 <Khertan_n810> there is other thing not documented as the search which is a regex search
Apr 10 17:35:44 <Khertan_n810> lcuk > my package was not validate ... due to some formatting prroblem in pypackager created files
Apr 10 17:35:57 <__wellu__> hi
Apr 10 17:35:58 <Khertan_n810> but i ve made some fix
Apr 10 17:36:11 <lcuk> and you are in a holding cycle again?
Apr 10 17:36:37 <__wellu__> anyone around using Eclipse+Esbox for developing? Got some problems..
Apr 10 17:36:51 <Khertan_n810> but i would know how they test package to be able to test mine before sending it again and waiting
Apr 10 17:37:13 <Khertan_n810> lcuk > since 10 min yes
Apr 10 17:37:47 <Khertan_n810> __wellu__> no sorry ... i made only onboard dev
Apr 10 17:38:10 <__wellu__> Well, my problem is more IDE problem I guess anyway..
Apr 10 17:38:46 <Khertan_n810> i like this n810 small keyboard !
Apr 10 17:39:03 <__wellu__> Ok, here's the problem: I've got some code that compiles under SB just fine.. Simple Makefile and few sources..
Apr 10 17:39:06 <lcuk> i am expecting to speak with quim tonight, i will ask him your question if i manage to find him and see if i can get some additional info put online or sent to your address
Apr 10 17:39:09 <Khertan_n810> just need to patch it for bracket and commercial and
Apr 10 17:39:23 <lcuk> now you understand the importance of TAB!!!!
Apr 10 17:39:23 <__wellu__> the code is in SVN
Apr 10 17:39:36 <Khertan_n810> to my mail will be prefered
Apr 10 17:39:57 <lcuk> ill certainly pass your concern on or at least find out who it should be directed to
Apr 10 17:40:10 <Khertan_n810> lcuk > the next version of pygtkeditor can int and unindent multiple line
Apr 10 17:40:15 <lcuk> it would help people if we knew what to check for ourselves
Apr 10 17:40:16 <__wellu__> I just want to use Eclipse as an editor.. nothing else.. Somehow it is not trivial as I'm forced to create a new project and duplicate sources.
Apr 10 17:40:34 <lcuk> wellu, i hate eclipse
Apr 10 17:40:42 <Khertan_n810> me too
Apr 10 17:40:46 <lcuk> are you using the vmware box for maemo?
Apr 10 17:40:55 <Khertan_n810> this doesn t work on n810
Apr 10 17:40:58 <Khertan_n810> :)
Apr 10 17:41:01 <lcuk> or is all this in proper grown up linux
Apr 10 17:41:08 <lcuk> what doesnt work on 810?
Apr 10 17:41:57 <Khertan_n810> eclipse
Apr 10 17:42:03 <Khertan_n810> :)
Apr 10 17:42:09 <__wellu__> LOL
Apr 10 17:42:25 <lcuk> you compiled it for 810?  with all java deps?
Apr 10 17:42:50 <Khertan_n810> oh great there is a param for emoticons in chat ...
Apr 10 17:43:09 <Khertan_n810> yeah ! no more this stupid things
Apr 10 17:43:18 <Khertan_n810> :P
Apr 10 17:44:07 <lcuk> what are you using to chat in?
Apr 10 17:44:10 * lcuk is in xchat
Apr 10 17:44:18 * __wellu__ in irssi
Apr 10 17:44:31 * Khertan_n810 use telepathy on n810
Apr 10 17:44:34 * qwerty12_N800 in xchat on n800
Apr 10 17:44:59 * qwerty12_N800 likes except
Apr 10 17:45:13 <qwerty12_N800> for stupid copy and paste
Apr 10 17:45:36 <Khertan_n810> except ?
Apr 10 17:45:50 <Khertan_n810> don t know this client
Apr 10 17:46:01 <lcuk2> well if everyone is in with their devices i might as well join you
Apr 10 17:46:15 <qwerty12_N800> omg, you never heard of xchat! :p
Apr 10 17:46:17 <qwerty12_N800> lol
Apr 10 17:46:20 <Khertan_n810> /ctcp VERSION lcuk2
Apr 10 17:46:20 <lcuk2> on my 810 with a nokia wireless kb
Apr 10 17:46:30 <Khertan_n810> arg can t pass command
Apr 10 17:46:51 <lcuk2> what does ctcp do?
Apr 10 17:47:03 <Khertan_n810> qwerty12 > know it , never really use it
Apr 10 17:47:28 <Khertan_n810> ask irc client version
Apr 10 17:47:41 <qwerty12_N800> I don't know the first thing about irc :p,  the first channel i joined was xbins. this is my 1st particpating channel
Apr 10 17:47:44 <qwerty12_N800> :)
Apr 10 17:47:47 <lcuk2> ahhh thought you were trying to zap me with some sort of defence mechanism
Apr 10 17:48:16 <lcuk2> i think all the mumbo jumbo commands are way over the top
Apr 10 17:48:25 <lcuk2> brb
Apr 10 17:48:31 <Khertan_n810> lol no ! just curious to know if u are testing telepathy after i mention it
Apr 10 17:49:24 <Khertan_n810> just a question ? Does my english is good ? or does i m speaking as well as a spanish cow ?
Apr 10 17:49:57 <lcuk> no you are understandable (a bit odd sometimes but its understandable)
Apr 10 17:50:07 <Khertan_n810> lol oki :)
Apr 10 17:50:30 <Khertan_n810> as i  french so, my native language ;)
Apr 10 17:50:48 <lcuk> yer, infact your english is better than some of the english folks in here ;)
Apr 10 17:50:55 <zerodegre> has anyone use maemo mapper int he 810 with GPS? and able to use it to get routes?
Apr 10 17:50:55 <Khertan_n810> lol
Apr 10 17:52:32 <Khertan_n810> zerodegre > obviously i found the gps terribly slow to get signals... and never use it since i ve understood that it need 15min from a cold start to be ready
Apr 10 17:53:44 <Khertan_n810> and in my car it s more hours ...
Apr 10 17:53:57 <zerodegre> mine seemed to work pretty quick
Apr 10 17:54:07 <elb> zerodegre: are you in the US?
Apr 10 17:54:10 <zerodegre> yes
Apr 10 17:54:24 <zerodegre> i used google street
Apr 10 17:54:25 * elb adds another data point to the support for his hypothesis
Apr 10 17:54:29 <Khertan_n810> hu? maybe i should return my n810
Apr 10 17:54:39 <zerodegre> with maemo maps
Apr 10 17:54:44 <elb> Europeans seem to have a lot more trouble with the GPS than Americans
Apr 10 17:54:46 <zerodegre> and yahoo streets
Apr 10 17:54:59 <zerodegre> but i am unsure how to download entire maps,
Apr 10 17:55:04 <zerodegre> for an area
Apr 10 17:55:08 <Khertan_n810> i ve something random shutdown too when i close keyboard too quicly
Apr 10 17:55:19 <Khertan_n810> s/quicly/quickly
Apr 10 17:55:20 <qwerty12_N800> the eu really needs 2 launch some satellites :(
Apr 10 17:55:29 <elb> zerodegre: for maemo mapper, you can select a center and a radius and snag maps
Apr 10 17:55:42 <zerodegre> elb. how do i do that?
Apr 10 17:55:56 <elb> it's in the documentation, perhaps even the FAQ
Apr 10 17:56:04 <elb> (I'm not in front of my 810 right now, I'll look in a moment)
Apr 10 17:56:11 <zerodegre> ok
Apr 10 17:56:25 <Khertan_n810> qwerty12 > we will have our own satellites with their own protocol ...
Apr 10 17:56:46 <elb> maybe, eventually
Apr 10 17:56:50 <elb> if it doesn't get scrapped again
Apr 10 17:57:01 <qwerty12_N800> hopefully :)
Apr 10 17:57:19 <florian> bbl
Apr 10 17:57:21 <elb> but there are certainly GPS receivers which work fine in Europe
Apr 10 17:57:21 <Khertan_n810> so need new device
Apr 10 17:57:27 <elb> the n810 just doesn't seem to be one of them ;-)
Apr 10 17:57:57 <elb> note that this is entirely empirical observation, I have no understanding of why this might be -- although GPS is more difficult to use in high latitudes
Apr 10 17:58:16 <lcuk> gps works for me as long as i hold aloft my mighty 810 and worship the sun god (for upto 30 minutes facing north)
Apr 10 17:58:51 <lcuk> gps works at any altitude, and infact the heigher you are the more sats are in clear view
Apr 10 17:58:58 <glass> n95's gps sucks bigtime if the assist isn't enabled
Apr 10 17:59:05 <elb> I said *latitude*, not altitude
Apr 10 17:59:08 <Khertan_n810> in fact none gps receiver work in my car
Apr 10 17:59:15 <lcuk> lol @ misreading
Apr 10 17:59:24 <elb> as you near the poles, GPS becomes more problematic
Apr 10 17:59:35 <lcuk> but still, nope there are some in a polar orbit as well as other directions
Apr 10 18:00:16 <elb> but still, yeah, it's the truth
Apr 10 18:00:29 <elb> I think maybe because the poles are farther from the satellites on average
Apr 10 18:00:30 <lcuk> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:ConstellationGPS.gif
Apr 10 18:00:33 <elb> (the Earth is not spherical)
Apr 10 18:00:46 <elb> it could also have to do with atmospheric conditions, however
Apr 10 18:00:56 <elb> I know what the constellation looks like, I'm telling you that this is a fact of GPS operation
Apr 10 18:01:00 <lcuk> earth doesnt have to be spherical - more likely localised buildings as well
Apr 10 18:01:07 <elb> in fact, it's one of the reasons the EU wants to put up its own constellation
Apr 10 18:01:29 <lcuk> i thought it was just so that they werent reliant upon america
Apr 10 18:01:31 <elb> (look up Galileo)
Apr 10 18:01:36 <elb> that's one reason, yes
Apr 10 18:02:16 <Khertan_n810> hu ! can't use google tanslation tool on my n810
Apr 10 18:02:22 <lcuk> oooh yer: better positioning services at high latitudes
Apr 10 18:02:46 <elb> anyway, I don't know if that's related
Apr 10 18:02:56 <Khertan_n810> there are saying that my request look like an automated request that could be do by a virus
Apr 10 18:03:01 <elb> but I do know that a lot of American n810 users say it works fine for them, and I've never seen a European say so :-)
Apr 10 18:03:19 <elb> perhaps it simply assumes a US starting position, and so US cold starts are quicker
Apr 10 18:03:43 <lcuk> doesnt make sense for a european company
Apr 10 18:04:02 <elb> I agree
Apr 10 18:04:20 <elb> although the US may be their largest market for ITs
Apr 10 18:04:29 <elb> I don't get that impression from this channel, but I don't know
Apr 10 18:04:38 <Khertan_n810> a will said more : no sense for a european company where the main market is europe
Apr 10 18:05:10 <elb> but all of my speculations are just that -- speculation
Apr 10 18:05:15 <elb> it's simply a trend I have noticed
Apr 10 18:05:26 <Khertan_n810> in europe nokia is the leader on phone :)
Apr 10 18:05:38 <Khertan_n810> distancing all other company
Apr 10 18:05:45 <Khertan_n810> companies ?
Apr 10 18:05:48 <lcuk> well and truly
Apr 10 18:05:52 <elb> I think that may be true worldwide
Apr 10 18:06:00 <elb> now that Motorola was ground into the dirt
Apr 10 18:06:07 <glass> Khertan_n810: dunno if europe is 'main' market anymore, asia and emerging markets take a lot of the business volume
Apr 10 18:06:13 <elb> although one of the Asian companies may hold that title
Apr 10 18:06:20 <glass> they are biggest worldwide
Apr 10 18:06:24 <glass> nokia that is
Apr 10 18:06:25 <glass> 40%
Apr 10 18:07:34 <lcuk> elb, your observation may infact be valid for this device.  it could simply be that suboptimal antenna location/choice could make what should be a standard worldwide chip solution into something that is indeed flakey when things go off the yellow brick road
Apr 10 18:08:11 <glass> n95's antenna is under the keypad.. so you have to keep the device open
Apr 10 18:08:31 <glass> dunno where the antenna is in n810
Apr 10 18:08:42 <lcuk> top left corner in the body ifiak
Apr 10 18:22:58 <GeneralAntilles> Anybody notice konttori's post on ITT on the new MicroB? :D
Apr 10 18:23:36 <qwerty12_N800> yeah
Apr 10 18:23:38 <qwerty12_N800> :)
Apr 10 18:24:24 <qwerty12_N800> I want Diablo to come quick
Apr 10 18:24:54 <qwerty12_N800> KotCzarny, you  around?
Apr 10 18:26:10 <lcuk> he went to bed sometime after 1pm
Apr 10 18:26:13 <elb> no, is an update pending?
Apr 10 18:26:32 <qwerty12_N800> lcuk, thanks
Apr 10 18:26:34 <GeneralAntilles> http://www.internettablettalk.com/forums/showthread.php?p=167852#post167852
Apr 10 18:26:46 <qwerty12_N800> I wanted to ask him something
Apr 10 18:27:15 <lcuk> well i gathered that :PO
Apr 10 18:27:24 <lcuk> GeneralAntilles, is it real? does it actually work better?
Apr 10 18:27:25 <elb> GeneralAntilles: thanks
Apr 10 18:27:31 <lcuk> have you tried it?
Apr 10 18:27:39 <GeneralAntilles> Do I have access to Diablo? :P
Apr 10 18:28:40 <qwerty12_N800> GeneralAntilles, you probably have your sources :p
Apr 10 18:28:47 <GeneralAntilles> If only.
Apr 10 18:29:02 <lcuk> lol  GeneralAntilles's cat runs diablo when gen isnt looking
Apr 10 18:29:52 * lcuk is feeling dog tired after only getting < 1 hour kip last night
Apr 10 18:29:53 <GeneralAntilles> I hear she held Texrat hostage for a few days and got an N900 and a copy of Diablo out of him.
Apr 10 18:30:05 <GeneralAntilles> She wont show me until I upgrade her Deli Cat to caviar.
Apr 10 18:30:51 <lcuk> i wonder if this is more efficient ondemand settings kicking into effect.
Apr 10 18:31:44 <lcuk> qwerty12_N800, was there anything we could help with or did you specifically need kot
Apr 10 18:33:04 <qwerty12_N800> lcuk, I wanted to ask kot because he compiled mplayer with v4l but i'm getting errors. I'm off my computer anyway :)
Apr 10 18:33:10 <qwerty12_N800> Thanks btw
Apr 10 18:33:38 <rm_you> I wish I could test all this cool new stuff that's coming out :/
Apr 10 18:34:07 <rm_you> Maybe I will be able to afford the N8/9xx whenever it comes out
Apr 10 18:37:41 <qwerty12_N800> I'm not so keen on an n900. I think I'll buy another pocket pc or maybe an iPhone (yes, but I don't really like  it but there is supposed to be a q3 port. but if q3 runs on the n900, i'm sold9
Apr 10 18:37:48 <qwerty12_N800> s/9/)
Apr 10 18:38:02 <pupnik> can i quote you on that qwerty12_N800 ?
Apr 10 18:38:09 <GeneralAntilles> Assuming we get drivers, the N900 will run a lot better than Q3.
Apr 10 18:38:26 <qwerty12_N800> pupnik, erm :/ :p
Apr 10 18:38:27 <mwaldron> n900? am i missin something?
Apr 10 18:38:49 <qwerty12_N800> GeneralAntilles, I don't  have much hope, looking at Nokia current record
Apr 10 18:39:23 <pupnik> btw quake 3 is on uphone
Apr 10 18:39:30 <pupnik> or it's a april 1 hoax
Apr 10 18:39:45 <pupnik> maybe it's quake 2 with a q3 levelset
Apr 10 18:39:45 <GeneralAntilles> The record that they didn't want to provide driver support hardware with technical limitations? :P
Apr 10 18:41:33 <pupnik> also 'it's not a game machine'
Apr 10 18:41:35 <qwerty12_N800> True :), I guess i have to wait. But i am reluctant as I only got a n800 a few months back.
Apr 10 18:41:38 <elb> fast is apparently relative
Apr 10 18:42:13 <elb> (for this mozilla browser)
Apr 10 18:42:34 <GeneralAntilles> Is it ever not?
Apr 10 18:42:44 <elb> it takes a MONTH to load
Apr 10 18:42:54 <||cw> pupnik: late for fools day, and it runs, but they aren't releasing it, they are doing a conversion project.  probably get around the limitations like no right-click for alt fire or scroll wheel for weapons switch
Apr 10 18:42:56 <lcuk> pupnik, have you heard back after accepting?
Apr 10 18:43:55 <lcuk> elb, if you leave it on your windows sill for 30 minutes your browsing experience will be faster
Apr 10 18:44:31 <elb> scrolling is smarter than microb
Apr 10 18:44:36 <elb> and double-click to zoom is nice
Apr 10 18:45:21 <flo_lap> re
Apr 10 18:46:37 <qwerty12_N800> elb, how much space does it roughly take? i have  11mb free woot :(
Apr 10 18:48:04 <keesj> modest works really nice now with gmail imap. really worth trying again
Apr 10 18:48:27 <elb> qwerty12_N800: the package file was 10MB ... let me query dpkg
Apr 10 18:49:49 <qwerty12_N800> Hmm, I may get lucky, I'll remove mythtv, never got it to work anyway. Thanks.
Apr 10 18:50:10 <GeneralAntilles> Just boot from a card. :P
Apr 10 18:51:05 <elb> qwerty12_N800: claims 10MB installed, too
Apr 10 18:51:08 <elb> I'm not sure I believe it ;-)
Apr 10 18:51:16 <qwerty12_N800> My sd card is s*** :p, with 48hz kernel, io errors all the way. I actually damaged my sd boot partition
Apr 10 18:51:22 <qwerty12_N800> elb, lol, thanks
Apr 10 18:53:19 <elb> qwerty12_N800: yeah it totally lied -- it's over 25MB here
Apr 10 18:53:36 <elb> the 'minefield' package shows up as 76k installed or some crap ... but it's huge
Apr 10 18:54:11 <qwerty12_N800> Hehe, i have 32mb free now :), more useful to me than mythtv
Apr 10 18:54:52 <KotCzarny> yawn
Apr 10 18:55:07 <whooper> hey guys
Apr 10 18:55:30 <whooper> i have a 770-- what would you reccomend I do with it and a 2gb rs-mmc?
Apr 10 18:56:07 <KotCzarny> install 2008he for fun
Apr 10 18:56:27 <whooper> what else?
Apr 10 18:56:37 <whooper> id like to try and dual boot, too
Apr 10 18:56:48 <GeneralAntilles> FBReader, Canola, Maemo Mapper and mplayer.
Apr 10 18:57:38 <whooper> speaking of canola-- i installed it on os2006 and the yt plugin-- when i try to use it, it crashes!
Apr 10 18:57:44 <whooper> any idea how to fix?
Apr 10 18:57:54 <KotCzarny> is there flash on 2006?
Apr 10 18:58:00 <KotCzarny> erm.
Apr 10 18:58:02 <KotCzarny> scratch that
Apr 10 18:58:06 <KotCzarny> it uses mplayer
Apr 10 18:58:15 <KotCzarny> check if your mplayer works
Apr 10 18:58:19 <kenne> whooper, try running it from the terminal (as user)
Apr 10 18:58:25 <kenne> like 'canola -vvvv'
Apr 10 18:58:32 <whooper> i cant right now, i sent it in for repair yesterday ..;
Apr 10 19:00:06 <whooper> but when i get it back (probably a new one) what would be the best things to install-- i.e. killer apps?
Apr 10 19:00:55 <qwerty12_N800> KotCzarny, mind if i ask  you what configure options did you use to build mplayer with v4l. I tried --enable-tv-v4l2 (something like  that) and i got make errors.
Apr 10 19:01:44 <KotCzarny> i think i haven't enabled anything in particular
Apr 10 19:01:51 <KotCzarny> just a ./configure and make
Apr 10 19:02:04 <KotCzarny> can you pastebin.com the errors?
Apr 10 19:02:18 <qwerty12_N800> I'm away from computer :9
Apr 10 19:02:23 <qwerty12_N800> s/9/)
Apr 10 19:02:23 <KotCzarny> :)
Apr 10 19:02:51 <KotCzarny> it can be anything from missing headers to some lines needing fixing in the code
Apr 10 19:03:35 <qwerty12_N800> Thanks :), is there a way to try out v4l support without connecting a webcam? It may already be enabled.
Apr 10 19:03:53 <KotCzarny> you have a webcam in n800..
Apr 10 19:03:56 <KotCzarny> :)
Apr 10 19:04:16 <KotCzarny> download my mplayer and just run with a proper args
Apr 10 19:04:36 <KotCzarny> that's the fastest way to try :)
Apr 10 19:04:38 <qwerty12_N800> I'm trying to test the build I made :)
Apr 10 19:04:49 * qwerty12_N800 is searching for args
Apr 10 19:04:58 <whooper> is it possible to run the adnroid on 770?
Apr 10 19:06:10 <KotCzarny> qwerty: search for a line i have suggested for pupnik :)
Apr 10 19:06:21 <]-[andful_of_not> whooper : the 2006 is really complicated to use with today's software : /
Apr 10 19:07:01 <qwerty12_N800> KotCzarny, okie :), I tried      mplayer-v4l -cache 128 -tv driver=v4l:width=420:height=240:outfmt=i420:device=/dev/video1 -vc rawi420 -vo xv tv:// but i need to enable tv support :/
Apr 10 19:07:16 <qwerty12_N800> s/mplayer-v4l/mplayer
Apr 10 19:07:30 <qwerty12_N800> s//dev/video1/dev/video0
Apr 10 19:08:35 <konttori> GA: Well, I really don't remember how fast chinook version was. I just tried the ferret browser and compared it side by side with another device running microb.
Apr 10 19:08:41 <konttori> and microb was much faster
Apr 10 19:09:02 <GeneralAntilles> That means Diablo's MicroB is also significantly faster than Chinook's.
Apr 10 19:09:10 <KotCzarny> qwerty: video1 ?
Apr 10 19:09:11 <konttori> did you try ferret?
Apr 10 19:09:16 <KotCzarny> search for my line :)
Apr 10 19:09:39 <qwerty12_N800> i did /s/video1 video0 :p
Apr 10 19:09:42 <elb> the fennec install put up by vladimir is slow as mud
Apr 10 19:09:47 <qwerty12_N800> :)
Apr 10 19:10:54 <whooper> How does one patch KDE2 under FreeBSD?
Apr 10 19:12:59 <rm_you> KotCzarny: you have a forum thread for your mplayer?
Apr 10 19:13:18 <KotCzarny> qwerty: -tv driver=v4l2:width=320:height=240:device=/dev/video0
Apr 10 19:13:25 <KotCzarny> rm_you: no i think
Apr 10 19:13:29 <qwerty12_N800> Thanks!
Apr 10 19:13:31 <KotCzarny> but there's a http server for it
Apr 10 19:13:41 <rm_you> koo
Apr 10 19:13:43 <rm_you> PM me that?
Apr 10 19:13:46 <rm_you> i gotta run now
Apr 10 19:14:02 <rm_you> what exactly are your patches?
Apr 10 19:14:12 <KotCzarny> mrrau.dyndns.org:23280/n800/
Apr 10 19:14:33 <KotCzarny> no patches because i didn't do anything special
Apr 10 19:14:37 <rm_you> ah
Apr 10 19:14:38 <rm_you> so....
Apr 10 19:14:43 <rm_you> it's just a build of mplayer?
Apr 10 19:14:58 <rm_you> what's different from the official build?
Apr 10 19:15:30 <rm_you> gah, needz to go
Apr 10 19:15:35 <KotCzarny> i have enabled gst (which is buggy on 2008 hence disabled) and tv, also i have built mencoder
Apr 10 19:15:41 <rm_you> :)
Apr 10 19:15:45 <KotCzarny> but it's all based on .25
Apr 10 19:15:50 <rm_you> kk i will check it out later...
Apr 10 19:15:57 <rm_you> and possibly ask you again as i really have to run
Apr 10 19:16:05 <KotCzarny> :)
Apr 10 19:16:07 <rm_you> and this is going to be scrolled off my log window by the time i get back
Apr 10 19:16:10 <rm_you> BBL
Apr 10 19:16:13 * rm_you RUNS to work
Apr 10 19:16:14 <qwerty12_N800> hmm, my build is based on rc2 :)
Apr 10 19:16:16 <KotCzarny> no problems
Apr 10 19:16:19 <KotCzarny> you have google
Apr 10 19:16:20 <KotCzarny> right?
Apr 10 19:16:21 <KotCzarny> ;)
Apr 10 19:16:32 <KotCzarny> that' why i have answered on public channel
Apr 10 19:16:33 <KotCzarny> :)
Apr 10 19:18:11 <qwerty12_N800> "MPlayer was compiled without TV interface support." - says  it all, i have to look into why it is compiling with errors with tv on in the morning
Apr 10 19:19:10 <KotCzarny> :)
Apr 10 19:20:02 <qwerty12_N800> :), v4l1 is obsolete right?
Apr 10 19:20:37 <KotCzarny> you won't benefit from v4l1 because camera on n8x0 is exposed as v4l2 device
Apr 10 19:20:37 <KotCzarny> :)
Apr 10 19:21:35 <qwerty12_N800> Thanks, kernel has it disabled too. I know Bundyo's rc2 build has tv working.
Apr 10 19:22:03 <qwerty12_N800> I've only made  a few changes compared to that though.
Apr 10 19:22:43 <KotCzarny> hmm
Apr 10 19:22:45 <KotCzarny> is it?
Apr 10 19:23:02 <KotCzarny> i believe i ran mplayer/mencoder with tv mplayer on a stock kernel
Apr 10 19:23:45 <qwerty12_N800> I mean v4l1 is disabled in my kernel :), unless i misunderstand you
Apr 10 19:24:24 <KotCzarny> ah, ok
Apr 10 19:24:32 <KotCzarny> i was thinking about v4l2
Apr 10 19:24:36 <KotCzarny> :)
Apr 10 19:26:00 <qwerty12_N800> Has anyone tried compiling with radio support?
Apr 10 19:26:34 <qwerty12_N800> I tried the fmradio xmms plugin but I wouldn't hear anything.
Apr 10 19:29:12 <KotCzarny> hmm
Apr 10 19:29:37 <dougt> has anyone used GDK_AXIS_PRESSURE to discover the touchscreen pressure of a gtk event?
Apr 10 19:31:51 <hrw> morning
Apr 10 19:32:09 <KotCzarny> that's japan?
Apr 10 19:32:27 <hrw> KotCzarny: ?
Apr 10 19:32:31 <KotCzarny> morning
Apr 10 19:32:32 <KotCzarny> :)
Apr 10 19:32:41 <hrw> ~morning
Apr 10 19:32:42 <infobot> Good morning!
Apr 10 19:32:56 <hrw> heh.. no apt/ibot/dpkg here
Apr 10 19:38:34 <mgedmin> dougt: no, but if you're looking for working source code, grep in the fbreader tree
Apr 10 19:38:55 <mgedmin> also, don't trust the value too much
Apr 10 19:39:10 <dougt> thanks.  the microb source is what I am looking at.
Apr 10 19:39:14 <mgedmin> there were long threads and ugly workarounds mentioned on the fbreader mailing list
Apr 10 19:39:23 * dougt nods
Apr 10 19:39:33 <mgedmin> apparently the hardware itself sometimes has trouble distinguishing thumb presses from stylus events
Apr 10 19:39:46 <dougt> hildon has specific helpers
Apr 10 19:39:56 <dougt> hildon_button_event_is_finger
Apr 10 19:40:06 <mgedmin> as a user I've given up a long time ago and no longer even try to use finger presses
Apr 10 19:42:26 <mgedmin> fwiw the hildon_button_event_is_finger is half of the solution, iirc the other half is to indicate that your widget wants to get the pressure information via some sort of event mask
Apr 10 19:42:33 <mgedmin> I'm fuzzy on the details
Apr 10 19:45:32 <dougt> mgedmin: so, i can get pressure data if I use X directly.
Apr 10 19:45:46 <dougt> that seems to work fine, but I don't process X events in my application
Apr 10 19:45:58 <mgedmin> um... ?
Apr 10 19:46:10 <mgedmin> what does your app do then?
Apr 10 19:46:22 <dougt> i mean.
Apr 10 19:46:26 <dougt> it is a Gtk Application
Apr 10 19:46:31 <dougt> i setup callbacks, ect
Apr 10 19:47:07 <dougt> i am not doing while(1) { XEventsQueued(), xnexevent...}
Apr 10 19:47:16 <dougt> mgedmin: http://test.maemo.org/maemowiki/HOWTO_UseTouchscreenPressureData
Apr 10 19:47:25 <dougt> ^^ this more or less works fine.
Apr 10 19:47:36 <dougt> you get different values depending on how hard you strick the display
Apr 10 19:47:37 <mgedmin> Gtk is the way to process X events :-)
Apr 10 19:47:44 <dougt> exactly!! ;-)
Apr 10 19:47:51 <mgedmin> well, gdk is the part of gtk that abstracts X for you, afaiu
Apr 10 19:48:38 <dougt> i want to do something like:
Apr 10 19:48:39 <dougt> http://pastebin.mozilla.org/399787
Apr 10 19:49:43 <mgedmin> right
Apr 10 19:50:33 <mgedmin> dougt: does it work then?
Apr 10 19:50:42 <dougt> no.
Apr 10 19:50:59 <mgedmin> if not, then maybe you also need to call gdk_input_set_extension_events on the window where you're registering your button callback
Apr 10 19:51:03 <dougt> maybe you can't get pressure data on a button?
Apr 10 19:51:21 <dougt> that is an idea.
Apr 10 19:51:23 * dougt tries.
Apr 10 19:51:28 <mgedmin> you can get it anywhere, but you need to indicate that in advance, IIRC
Apr 10 19:51:35 <mgedmin> which is where the set_extension_events suggestion comes from
Apr 10 19:52:15 * mgedmin is just echoing old conversations from this channel/maemo mailing list and pretending he knows stuff
Apr 10 19:52:31 <mgedmin> google also gives me this example for PyGtk: http://www.pygtk.org/pygtktutorial/sec-addingxinputsupport.html
Apr 10 19:52:50 <mgedmin> xinput is the mechanism for passing pressure information from input devices to applications
Apr 10 19:54:15 <mgedmin> this was the first google hit for "gdk pressure" by the way
Apr 10 19:54:53 <dougt> cool, that did it.
Apr 10 19:55:02 <dougt> but....
Apr 10 19:55:07 <dougt> the values are all fucked up. :-)
Apr 10 19:55:24 <dougt> there is no consistency.
Apr 10 19:55:35 <dougt> (thanks mgedmin  for googling!)
Apr 10 19:57:32 <mgedmin> http://www.fbreader.org/docs/tapControl.php talks a bit about the pressure values on n8x0
Apr 10 19:59:04 <qwerty12_N800> Ok, sorry for sounding like a broken record but is enabling tv equal  to enabling v4l2 support in mplayer? Quick answer is all I need :)
Apr 10 19:59:32 <KotCzarny> mplayer says it wasn't compiled with tv support
Apr 10 20:00:31 <dougt> perfect
Apr 10 20:00:40 <dougt> mgedmin: thanks.
Apr 10 20:00:40 <qwerty12_N800> I mean when compiling :), basically is "tv" the only way to use v4l2 in mplayer.
Apr 10 20:00:44 <hrw> http://blog.haerwu.biz/tmp/n800-qemu.png
Apr 10 20:00:50 <hrw> more tomorrow
Apr 10 20:02:55 <G7KES> Hello, does anyone know how to get the ogg mediaplayer to be the default app for ogg files to that it doesn't ask me what I want to use to open the ogg file every time?
Apr 10 20:04:03 <qwerty12_N800> look into pipeline's dbus-switchboard. or as media player is built in app, editing defaults.list may be all that  is needed
Apr 10 20:05:51 <G7KES> Ah, defaults.list. I shall hunt that down. Thanks very much.
Apr 10 20:06:02 <G7KES> Gotta go for a fire drill now, but back in a while :-)
Apr 10 20:06:37 <qwerty12_N800> /usr/share/applications/defaults.list :)
Apr 10 21:04:45 <smackpotato> whats anyone think of the n810 as a bicycle computer
Apr 10 21:04:52 <smackpotato> http://soundofmotion.com/products/
Apr 10 21:05:13 <ds3> '
Apr 10 21:13:09 <||cw> smackpotato: interesting.  bet it's rfcomm and so writing an app to use it would be pretty simple
Apr 10 21:55:43 <ol_schoola> any idea if there is generic webcam support in the kernel? if i could put the guts of a webcam on a flexi rod with a couple of LEDs, we have a poor man's inspection camera
Apr 10 21:56:25 <qwerty12_N800> If it supports v4l2 and has modules, then yes.
Apr 10 21:56:55 <qwerty12_N800> Grab a mplayer & mencoder with v4l2 support as well.
Apr 10 21:57:44 <ol_schoola> hm, dunno crap about webcams and (current) v4l2. must go a-hunting, thanks for the pointers
Apr 10 22:11:08 <CrashandDie> i'm off, cheers :)
Apr 10 22:15:52 <Ikkakujyu> Hmm, I just realized the camera in the N800 is perfect for augmented reality.
Apr 10 22:16:00 <KotCzarny> augmented?
Apr 10 22:16:12 <glass> perfect?
Apr 10 22:16:17 <johnx> an augmented reality of low resolution with the white-balance all wrong?
Apr 10 22:16:20 <glass> far from it
Apr 10 22:16:24 <KotCzarny> ;)
Apr 10 22:16:37 <Ikkakujyu> Well, by perfect I mean capable.
Apr 10 22:16:54 <Ikkakujyu> i.e. it can point in the right direction, and there's a driver for it.
Apr 10 22:17:02 <glass> it's lowres, if you had for example 2d barcodes on things they'd have to be pretty big for recognition
Apr 10 22:17:22 <glass> of course depends what kind of augmented reality you were thinking of
Apr 10 22:17:31 <Ikkakujyu> ...2d barcodes.
Apr 10 22:17:51 <Ikkakujyu> Though the Klimt project did a pretty good job with crappy cameras on PocketPC :D
Apr 10 22:18:12 <glass> well just about any cam can read 2d barcoes up close
Apr 10 22:18:46 <elb> I had very little luck reading barcodes with the n810 camera
Apr 10 22:18:49 <elb> it's so horribly noisy
Apr 10 22:19:39 <glass> huh
Apr 10 22:21:32 <Ikkakujyu> Eh, Invisible Train uses pretty big barcodes - http://studierstube.icg.tu-graz.ac.at/invisible_train/
Apr 10 22:21:51 <Ikkakujyu> Would it be too farfetched to hook up a USB webcam? :D
Apr 10 22:22:15 <KotCzarny> power requirements
Apr 10 22:22:39 <KotCzarny> if it draws more than 100mA you need power injector or powered hub
Apr 10 22:23:10 <Ikkakujyu> Hm.
Apr 10 22:41:50 <fysa> or a battery..
Apr 10 22:42:01 <fysa> I mean, you're walking around like a cyborg anyway.
Apr 10 22:42:15 <fysa> sorry, you said power injector
Apr 10 22:42:16 <fysa> ;)
Apr 10 22:43:55 <fysa> a slim digital camera could work
Apr 10 22:44:24 <Cptnodegard> yei hurray for mirc scripts missing a }
Apr 10 22:44:28 <fysa> how fast can you process an image, anyway?
Apr 10 22:44:29 <Cptnodegard> -_____-
Apr 10 22:44:33 <KotCzarny> 4fps
Apr 10 22:44:35 <KotCzarny> at full res
Apr 10 22:44:44 <KotCzarny> 16fps at 352x288
Apr 10 22:44:55 <fysa> would you need to process that fast?
Apr 10 22:45:00 <pupnik> would be nice if N900 had a better camera
Apr 10 22:45:00 <KotCzarny> ?
Apr 10 22:45:07 <KotCzarny> hi pupnik
Apr 10 22:45:16 <KotCzarny> wanna see liqart with aa lines?
Apr 10 22:45:16 <GeneralAntilles> Seems likely, pupnik.
Apr 10 22:45:17 <KotCzarny> :)
Apr 10 22:45:29 <GeneralAntilles> If just because of gradual technological improvements increasing the baseline quality. :D
Apr 10 22:45:41 <fysa> I would think you'd be better off using a higher res capture at less fps.
Apr 10 22:45:45 <fysa> then you can OCR the world
Apr 10 22:45:53 <fysa> and wikipedia it
Apr 10 22:46:05 <KotCzarny> at higher res you must have a steady hand
Apr 10 22:46:15 <KotCzarny> othjerwise your 'scan' would come out.. bendy
Apr 10 22:46:16 <KotCzarny> ;)
Apr 10 22:46:22 <fysa> use a regular digital camera in CCD mode
Apr 10 22:46:24 <fysa> at 1fps
Apr 10 22:46:24 <fysa> ?
Apr 10 22:46:30 <KotCzarny> use scanner?
Apr 10 22:46:31 <KotCzarny> ;)
Apr 10 22:46:33 <fysa> then you can get 8 megapixel?
Apr 10 22:46:42 <KotCzarny> scanner is even more
Apr 10 22:46:45 <fysa> haha
Apr 10 22:46:49 <fysa> true
Apr 10 22:47:00 <KotCzarny> and gets quite even lighting
Apr 10 22:47:27 <fysa> sew a scanner into a shirt
Apr 10 22:47:29 <pupnik> what is liqart KotCzarny ?
Apr 10 22:47:31 <lcdd> i'd like manufacturers to stop building parts that are utterly useless for any imaginable purpose
Apr 10 22:47:35 <lcdd> like the camera
Apr 10 22:47:48 <KotCzarny> pupnik, join my chan
Apr 10 22:47:49 <KotCzarny> :)
Apr 10 22:49:32 <johnx> lcdd, I kind of imagine Nokia going through this parts bin as they made the N800: "Well we have a *ton* of these SD card slots!" "That's fine, give every tablet 2!" "And what should we do with these crappy camera modules...?"
Apr 10 22:49:58 <GeneralAntilles> Ha
Apr 10 22:50:04 <GeneralAntilles> Cost-cutting.
Apr 10 22:50:11 <GeneralAntilles> If they used a real camera, they'd have to up the price.
Apr 10 22:58:19 <pupnik> i'd like a google books reader btw
Apr 10 22:58:19 <lcdd> i guess shipping to customers is just another way of avoiding waste collection fees
Apr 10 22:58:36 <pupnik> something that scrapes google and getches the .gifs
Apr 10 22:59:32 <pupnik> i think the tablets are a great deal
Apr 10 23:03:09 <lcdd> they're not bad overall
Apr 10 23:09:44 <plb> Anyone know where I can download the echo theme wallpaper? Want to put it on my d2...I luv it ;]
Apr 10 23:10:02 <plb> can't seem to find it online anywhere
Apr 10 23:10:55 <pupnik> it should be on your device if you have it installed
Apr 10 23:11:13 <plb> I don't have it on me =\
Apr 10 23:11:17 <pupnik> or download the deb and extract the files with "ar x debfilename.deb"
Apr 10 23:12:50 <pupnik> or um.. dpkg -X debfilename.deb .
Apr 10 23:13:12 <plb> hm I'm surprised that wallpaper isn't posted somewhere
Apr 10 23:16:24 <plb> where can i download echo theme?
Apr 10 23:20:05 <pupnik> try searching http://gronmayer.com/it
Apr 10 23:20:12 <plb> ok thanks
Apr 10 23:38:10 <KotCzarny> hm
Apr 10 23:38:16 <KotCzarny> is there a gdb for maemo?
Apr 10 23:41:54 <termsig> i dont think so but i`m not sure.
Apr 10 23:44:24 <KotCzarny> http://packages.debian.org/sid/armel/gdb/download
Apr 10 23:44:25 <KotCzarny> :>
Apr 10 23:45:31 <plb> argh KotCzarny happen to know where I can find default os2008 wallpaper echo?
Apr 10 23:45:47 <KotCzarny> plb, i can put it on my site if you want
Apr 10 23:45:54 <KotCzarny> that will be faster than googling
Apr 10 23:45:54 <plb> please!
Apr 10 23:45:55 <KotCzarny> :)
Apr 10 23:45:57 <plb> hehe
Apr 10 23:50:43 <KotCzarny> btw. can you navigate to: /usr/share/backgrounds
Apr 10 23:50:51 <KotCzarny> and tell me if you have echo.png ?
Apr 10 23:50:56 <plb> ya but I'm not on my device atm
Apr 10 23:51:08 <plb> I want to put the bg on my cowon d2 ;]
Apr 10 23:51:14 <KotCzarny> hmm
Apr 10 23:51:25 <KotCzarny> should i..
Apr 10 23:51:26 <KotCzarny> ;)
Apr 10 23:51:37 <plb> =P
Apr 10 23:52:02 <KotCzarny> mrrau.dyndns.org:23280/echo.png
Apr 10 23:52:03 <plb> I can't seem to find it anywhere online
Apr 10 23:52:19 <plb> thanks!
Apr 10 23:52:36 <KotCzarny> tell me when you got it
Apr 10 23:52:51 <plb> got it thanks
Apr 11 00:10:01 <legind> is there any way to get the maemo browser to run through a proxy? if im on some cafes open wifi I want to make sure I'm securely browsing
Apr 11 00:11:19 <KotCzarny> it's in the config
Apr 11 00:12:29 <legind> ah thanks KotCzarny i just looked in the settings
Apr 11 00:39:57 <mikedep333> hey, how do I take the external SD out of my N800?
Apr 11 00:40:15 <KotCzarny> use nail
Apr 11 00:41:53 <shapr> yarr!
Apr 11 00:46:20 <whooper> lol
Apr 11 00:49:53 <WormFood> mikedep333, I was pushing on that external SD, expecting it to pop out....then I used my nail
Apr 11 00:59:16 <mikedep333> yeah
Apr 11 00:59:20 <whooper> and what? it came out?
Apr 11 00:59:29 <mikedep333> unfortunately I don't think I can use my nail on the microSD to SD adapter
Apr 11 00:59:34 <mikedep333> only on the microSD itself
Apr 11 00:59:38 <GeneralAntilles> Stupid adaptors.
Apr 11 00:59:38 <whooper> probably not
Apr 11 00:59:42 <GeneralAntilles> Get a pair of tweezers.
Apr 11 00:59:47 <mikedep333> yeah
Apr 11 00:59:56 <GeneralAntilles> Then wrap a piece of scotch tape around it.
Apr 11 01:00:07 <whooper> uh huh
Apr 11 01:00:17 <GeneralAntilles> Make yourself a little tab.
Apr 11 01:00:22 <whooper> m'kay
Apr 11 01:00:36 <whooper> that's not a bad idea
Apr 11 01:01:22 <GeneralAntilles> If only stupid manufacturers didn't throw the whole spec out the window when they make adaptors.
Apr 11 01:01:29 <whooper> indeed
Apr 11 01:01:47 <whooper> if only there was ONE standard
Apr 11 01:02:01 <mikedep333> the nokia updater is downloading the 2008 image
Apr 11 01:02:05 <mikedep333> where does it temporarily store it?
Apr 11 01:02:10 <mikedep333> I want to back it up
Apr 11 01:02:13 <mikedep333> on windows xp
Apr 11 01:04:09 <GeneralAntilles> Who the hell knows? :P
Apr 11 01:04:12 <mikedep333> lol
Apr 11 01:04:19 <mikedep333> the program is using up 121 megs and growing
Apr 11 01:04:24 <mikedep333> it is probably keeping it in RAM
Apr 11 01:04:41 <GeneralAntilles> http://tablets-dev.nokia.com/nokia_N800.php
Apr 11 01:04:46 <GeneralAntilles> Just grab it from there for a backup.
Apr 11 01:06:39 <mikedep333> so my first impressions are that the screen is nice
Apr 11 01:06:55 <mikedep333> but youtube was displayed horrible on ITOS2007
Apr 11 01:07:04 <mikedep333> not properly rendered and the video went slow
Apr 11 01:07:47 <mikedep333> I do like the zooming in and out ability
Apr 11 01:08:22 <elb> the screen is gorgeous
Apr 11 01:10:22 <GeneralAntilles> OS2008 is much better.
Apr 11 01:14:57 <mikedep333> yeah, youtube is better on it
Apr 11 01:15:10 <mikedep333> ok, time to transfer to my 2 GB SD
Apr 11 01:23:54 <legind> does os2008 use operas microbrowser?
Apr 11 01:24:31 <zion> legind: afaik, os2008 uses a gecko based browser
Apr 11 01:25:28 <mikedep333> do I need red pill mode for this?
Apr 11 01:25:28 <mikedep333> http://www.internettablettalk.com/forums/showthread.php?p=99536
Apr 11 01:25:31 <mikedep333> I added the repo
Apr 11 01:25:32 <legind> I thought so, but what made me unsure is that it uses the acronym "microb"
Apr 11 01:25:39 <mikedep333> then searching for becomeroot didnt find anything
Apr 11 01:25:45 <legind> and operas micro browser has some big security issues
Apr 11 01:27:30 <t_s_o> should not need red pill to install becomeroot
Apr 11 01:29:19 <GeneralAntilles> It's not an acronym.
Apr 11 01:29:21 <GeneralAntilles> It's just the name
Apr 11 01:29:25 <GeneralAntilles> It's based on Gecko
Apr 11 01:29:28 <GeneralAntilles> 1.9
Apr 11 01:30:50 <Ikkakujyu> I spent all day compiling MusicPD only to find out someone else already did it :( I need to google harder.
Apr 11 01:31:11 <Navi> "Microbe"
Apr 11 01:31:22 <GeneralAntilles> Your google-fu is still weak and untrained, young padawan.
Apr 11 01:31:34 <Navi> It's a nice play on words
Apr 11 01:31:51 <Navi> since it can also stand for micro browser
Apr 11 01:32:09 <Navi> Either way, it's tiny
Apr 11 01:33:23 * GeneralAntilles infects Navi with MRSA
Apr 11 01:33:54 <mikedep333> whoops, entered typo in the eko.one.pl address
Apr 11 01:51:54 <G7KES> Hi does, anyone know the location of a deb for a shell? I'm running OS2008 on an N800.
Apr 11 01:53:39 <GeneralAntilles> deb for a shell?
Apr 11 01:53:50 <GeneralAntilles> Oh, right.
Apr 11 01:53:55 <GeneralAntilles> Ask the question, then run away.
Apr 11 01:55:19 <WormFood> that is real effective....ask a question, then leave
Apr 11 01:55:42 <WormFood> I hope his nick isn't a ham call....he'd give hams a bad name
Apr 11 01:55:58 <celesteh> i hate it when i ask a question and then my network dies
Apr 11 01:56:19 <KotCzarny> dead network doesn't produce /part command
Apr 11 01:56:47 <KotCzarny> calls a ruthless peer sometimes
Apr 11 01:56:51 <KotCzarny> :)
Apr 11 01:56:56 <celesteh> heh
Apr 11 01:57:18 <WormFood> well, he left the channel, as you can tell by the message...also he is still on irc
Apr 11 01:57:36 <WormFood> that IS his ham call
Apr 11 01:57:38 <celesteh> clearly, we must track him down to answer his question
Apr 11 01:57:42 <legind> the micro browser doesn't seem to take my SOCKS proxy settings - has anyone had similar problems?
Apr 11 01:57:53 <legind> network.proxy.socks
Apr 11 01:58:01 <KotCzarny> hmm, bad socks?
Apr 11 01:58:02 <KotCzarny> ;)
Apr 11 01:58:11 <legind> my socks are fine
Apr 11 01:58:21 <KotCzarny> btw. if it isn't in settings dialog maybe it's not supported ?
Apr 11 01:58:22 <legind> even after toring
Apr 11 01:58:37 <legind> it's there
Apr 11 01:58:41 <legind> ahh ok
Apr 11 01:58:42 <WormFood> anyways, I'm out of here...have fun guys
Apr 11 01:58:51 <legind> yeah its not in settings, only in the config
Apr 11 02:03:25 <mikedep333> when I go to untar this: http://fanoush.wz.cz/maemo/initfs_flasher.tgz
Apr 11 02:03:25 <mikedep333> I get tar: unexpected end of file
Apr 11 02:03:25 <mikedep333> tar: short read
Apr 11 02:03:40 <GeneralAntilles> Download it better?
Apr 11 02:03:51 <KotCzarny> use wget?
Apr 11 02:03:54 <GeneralAntilles> Alternatively, this is a great opportunity to install openssh and use sftp. :D
Apr 11 02:04:34 <mikedep333> downloaded it again
Apr 11 02:04:38 <mikedep333> no errors this time
Apr 11 02:06:44 <whooper> good
Apr 11 02:07:08 <whooper> hey guys-- here's a topic
Apr 11 02:07:17 <whooper> killer apps for different os's
Apr 11 02:07:49 <KotCzarny> maemo.org
Apr 11 02:07:57 <KotCzarny> has a great lists
Apr 11 02:08:00 <KotCzarny> and top25
Apr 11 02:08:01 <KotCzarny> :)
Apr 11 02:08:19 <whooper> yeah, but really, what are your's, #maemo?
Apr 11 02:08:27 <whooper> *yours
Apr 11 02:08:34 <KotCzarny> ?
Apr 11 02:09:33 <whooper> like, for games, media, office, worst
Apr 11 02:09:40 <whooper> ect.
Apr 11 02:09:54 <mikedep333> I forgot to flash the FAT partition on my SD before installing initfs
Apr 11 02:09:59 <KotCzarny> i love sdk
Apr 11 02:10:05 <whooper> kay
Apr 11 02:10:06 <mikedep333> will that give me a problem?
Apr 11 02:10:11 <KotCzarny> lots of fun
Apr 11 02:10:15 <mikedep333> *format the FAT partition
Apr 11 02:10:21 <KotCzarny> and lots of adventure
Apr 11 02:10:34 <whooper> how would one learn best how to program apps in maemo?
Apr 11 02:10:43 <KotCzarny> mike: fat partition isn't critical for booting/running
Apr 11 02:10:45 <whooper> or program in general
Apr 11 02:10:53 <mikedep333> ok, just making sure
Apr 11 02:11:19 <KotCzarny> whooper: by reading good books and twiddling in examples
Apr 11 02:11:30 <whooper> can you reccomend any?
Apr 11 02:11:40 <KotCzarny> not in english
Apr 11 02:11:47 <whooper> ah.
Apr 11 02:11:49 <KotCzarny> :)
Apr 11 02:12:55 <whooper> i doubt that i could grep my way out of a paper bag.
Apr 11 02:13:49 <smlackpotato> .
Apr 11 02:13:51 <mikedep333> hmm, crap
Apr 11 02:13:58 <whooper> whats up?
Apr 11 02:14:02 <mikedep333> I used the file manager to format the SD card
Apr 11 02:14:15 <KotCzarny> hehe
Apr 11 02:14:16 <mikedep333> and now I only see /dev/mmcblk0p1
Apr 11 02:14:21 <mikedep333> no p2
Apr 11 02:14:27 <mikedep333> did it remove the ext2 partition?
Apr 11 02:14:34 <KotCzarny> probably
Apr 11 02:14:41 <KotCzarny> sfdisk -l
Apr 11 02:14:57 <KotCzarny> if it's not there then it created new partition table
Apr 11 02:15:26 <mikedep333> yeah, it did
Apr 11 02:15:32 <whooper> ouch
Apr 11 02:15:36 <KotCzarny> fun
Apr 11 02:15:37 <KotCzarny> :)
Apr 11 02:15:44 <mikedep333> how do I properly format only the fat partition?
Apr 11 02:15:51 <mikedep333> nm
Apr 11 02:15:54 <mikedep333> mkdosfs
Apr 11 02:15:54 <KotCzarny> mkdosfs
Apr 11 02:15:55 <KotCzarny> :)
Apr 11 02:15:57 <mikedep333> well, let me ask this
Apr 11 02:15:59 <whooper> anyone here firmiliar with mintyboost (ladyada)?
Apr 11 02:16:04 <GeneralAntilles> whooper, start by learning bash and the basics of the Linux shell.
Apr 11 02:16:11 <whooper> alright
Apr 11 02:16:12 <mikedep333> do I need to format it at all before installing the OS to the ext2 part?
Apr 11 02:16:14 <GeneralAntilles> Then I'd move up to bash scripting.
Apr 11 02:16:17 <whooper> ok
Apr 11 02:16:22 <KotCzarny> mike, nope
Apr 11 02:16:25 <GeneralAntilles> Then Python, Ruby, or Perl from there.
Apr 11 02:16:27 <mikedep333> ok, great
Apr 11 02:16:34 <whooper> probly python
Apr 11 02:16:37 <GeneralAntilles> Then C
Apr 11 02:16:42 <whooper> uh huh
Apr 11 02:16:52 <GeneralAntilles> Though Python provides you with 95% of the stuff you'd need.
Apr 11 02:17:04 <KotCzarny> ga, the great coder ;)
Apr 11 02:17:13 <KotCzarny> i wonder if he ever written anything
Apr 11 02:17:15 <whooper> yeah, and it works with maemo and (i think) Android
Apr 11 02:17:22 <KotCzarny> other than pr stuff
Apr 11 02:18:25 <whooper> alright, brb then-- thanks GA!
Apr 11 02:18:41 * GeneralAntilles puts KotCzarny back on ignore.
Apr 11 02:18:49 <GeneralAntilles> Turns out he's still just as much of an asshole as he's always been.
Apr 11 02:19:03 <KotCzarny> ^ same arrogant idiot
Apr 11 02:20:28 <whooper> winning a flame war is like winning the special olympics-- even if you win, you're still retarded
Apr 11 02:20:34 <KotCzarny> yup
Apr 11 02:20:34 <whooper> so stop arguing
Apr 11 02:20:40 <KotCzarny> he started it
Apr 11 02:20:46 <whooper> an d im ending it
Apr 11 02:20:51 <KotCzarny> :)
Apr 11 02:20:57 <whooper> LAWL
Apr 11 02:21:05 <whooper> brb for real now
Apr 11 02:21:18 <whooper> dont make me have to separate you two again
Apr 11 02:21:30 <KotCzarny> i have my screen
Apr 11 02:21:34 <KotCzarny> to keep me safe
Apr 11 02:21:35 <KotCzarny> :)
Apr 11 02:31:11 <mikedep333> the N800 comes with a skype voucher, right?
Apr 11 02:31:17 <KotCzarny> yes
Apr 11 02:31:21 <mikedep333> in the box?
Apr 11 02:31:30 <KotCzarny> mine did
Apr 11 02:31:30 <GeneralAntilles> Some do, some don't.
Apr 11 02:31:34 <GeneralAntilles> Not sure of the pattern.
Apr 11 02:31:39 <mikedep333> ok, oh well
Apr 11 02:35:49 <Navi> "he started it" is a horrible excuse.
Apr 11 02:35:58 <dospod> hey
Apr 11 02:36:04 <Navi> Hi
Apr 11 02:36:19 <KotCzarny> still true
Apr 11 02:36:32 <dospod> how is everyone
Apr 11 02:36:34 <Navi> Depends on your viewpoint
Apr 11 02:36:37 <Navi> dospod, bored
Apr 11 02:36:45 <esworp> so, does anyone else have trouble invoking tje thumbboard via the touchscreen?
Apr 11 02:36:49 <KotCzarny> my viewpoint is that i don't like being called names
Apr 11 02:36:54 <dospod> navi it could be worse
Apr 11 02:36:58 <GeneralAntilles> esworp, just use the center dpad.
Apr 11 02:37:00 <KotCzarny> without a reason
Apr 11 02:37:05 <dospod> wayyy worse
Apr 11 02:37:05 <GeneralAntilles> Reliable 100% of the time.
Apr 11 02:37:18 <Navi> KotCzarny, and calling people names back helps?
Apr 11 02:37:25 <esworp> some apps interpret the centter butron for other stuff, making stylus-frree operation a pain.
Apr 11 02:37:28 <KotCzarny> navi: how would you react?
Apr 11 02:37:28 <GeneralAntilles> Thumb detection should be fixed in Diablo.
Apr 11 02:37:35 <GeneralAntilles> Ah, right, Skype's stupidity.
Apr 11 02:37:53 <GeneralAntilles> I've had some success double-tapping with the thumb to get the fullscreen keyboard.
Apr 11 02:37:54 <Navi> KotCzarny, by not acknowledging their existence like I have you for the past few weeks.
Apr 11 02:38:07 <Navi> GeneralAntilles, should be
Apr 11 02:38:16 <Navi> Didn't bork up when I tried it
Apr 11 02:38:31 <esworp> i use the hell out of gpe cal, and the button's mapped to something else.  :(
Apr 11 02:38:31 <dospod> all I got to say dont fight
Apr 11 02:38:34 <dospod> seriously
Apr 11 02:38:42 <dospod> cherish everything you have\
Apr 11 02:38:49 <dospod> it could be gone the next moment
Apr 11 02:38:53 <dospod> just boom its gone
Apr 11 02:38:55 <Navi> KotCzarny, you've called me a few names while you thought I /ignore'd you :P
Apr 11 02:38:57 <KotCzarny> navi, still, he acted arrogant, not i
Apr 11 02:39:45 <Navi> Oh, you're always arrogant; You don't have to worry about that.
Apr 11 02:40:01 <KotCzarny> yes, i am, sometimes
Apr 11 02:40:13 <KotCzarny> but i know when i do it
Apr 11 02:40:22 <Navi> Mhm
Apr 11 02:40:52 <Navi> dospod, I'm fine with moments being gone
Apr 11 02:40:57 <esworp> i'm just a casual visitor, and alway feel a bit of snarkiness  from some users.  not that i ever remember who they are.
Apr 11 02:41:02 <Navi> S'not like it cares.
Apr 11 02:41:05 <dospod> navi you may say that now
Apr 11 02:41:09 <Navi> s/cares/matters/
Apr 11 02:41:09 <infobot> Navi meant: S'not like it matters.
Apr 11 02:41:10 <dospod> seriously
Apr 11 02:41:23 <GeneralAntilles> dospod, you're too young to wax philosophical. :P
Apr 11 02:41:25 <Navi> I've thought that for a long time.
Apr 11 02:41:25 <dospod> I never thought just id miss just chillin with someone
Apr 11 02:41:36 <dospod> GeneralAntilles I just lost my best friend
Apr 11 02:41:42 <dospod> I went to ohio for his funeral yesterday
Apr 11 02:41:45 <GeneralAntilles> Ouch
Apr 11 02:41:47 <GeneralAntilles> Sorry to hear that.
Apr 11 02:41:48 <dospod> yea
Apr 11 02:41:54 <dospod> Ive lost people before
Apr 11 02:41:57 <dospod> but this one hurt
Apr 11 02:42:08 <Navi> Sorry for your loss
Apr 11 02:42:15 <dospod> thanks
Apr 11 02:42:56 <Navi> I don't remember the stylus board ever coming up when I was messing with Diablo
Apr 11 02:43:22 <Navi> Well, when I switched to finger tap = thumb board anyways
Apr 11 02:43:34 <Navi> even when I tapped with the stylus :/
Apr 11 02:43:51 <dospod> is diablo look any cleaner
Apr 11 02:43:54 <Navi> center button on the rocker brought up the stylus board
Apr 11 02:44:07 <Navi> Looks the same as it is now
Apr 11 02:44:21 <GeneralAntilles> dospod, it's a bugfix upgrade.
Apr 11 02:44:26 <dospod> : \
Apr 11 02:44:31 <GeneralAntilles> That's GOOD.
Apr 11 02:44:32 <Navi> I'm judging off an old alpha build, so I don't really know much :P
Apr 11 02:44:36 <dospod> I know
Apr 11 02:44:42 <dospod> but Im attracted to a good looking ui
Apr 11 02:44:51 <Navi> It looks all right the way it is now
Apr 11 02:44:53 <esworp> i /never/ use the stylus board.  seems like a waste, really.
Apr 11 02:45:01 <dospod> I still wish we could change the layout to what the mock up for ubuntu mobile looks like
Apr 11 02:45:02 <Navi> We just need some talented themers
Apr 11 02:45:09 <Navi> esworp, then Diablo should be good for you
Apr 11 02:45:19 <GeneralAntilles> Echo looks a helluva lot better than any previous ITOS release's default theme.
Apr 11 02:45:26 <GeneralAntilles> dospod, it's hardware accelerated.
Apr 11 02:45:27 <esworp> what's it's ETA?
Apr 11 02:45:30 <Navi> the stylus board doesn't pop up
Apr 11 02:45:35 <GeneralAntilles> and, as far as I can tell from the videos and such, not very useful.
Apr 11 02:45:40 <GeneralAntilles> esworp, "Q2 2008"
Apr 11 02:45:42 <dospod> I like the ui
Apr 11 02:45:47 <Navi> GeneralAntilles, remember what it was replaced by?
Apr 11 02:45:47 <esworp> :/
Apr 11 02:45:54 <Navi> Some orange crap :P
Apr 11 02:45:56 <dospod> and I know its hildon also
Apr 11 02:46:25 * Navi hopes Echo stays in the next release
Apr 11 02:46:28 <Navi> I don't really like orange
Apr 11 02:46:31 <dospod> http://www.ubuntu.com/files/u1/html-small.jpg that does look clean
Apr 11 02:46:32 <GeneralAntilles> esworp, pay attention to the Modest progress.
Apr 11 02:46:44 <GeneralAntilles> That's gonna be a decent way to tell how close we are.
Apr 11 02:46:57 <Navi> dospod, looks like Ubuntu Mobile.
Apr 11 02:47:07 <GeneralAntilles> Navi, at worst you can just package it from Chinook.
Apr 11 02:47:10 <Navi> Or android
Apr 11 02:47:10 <dospod> it is ubuntu mobile
Apr 11 02:47:17 <KotCzarny> no transparency?
Apr 11 02:47:24 <dospod> and I like the way they made it look
Apr 11 02:47:25 <Navi> I've tried the Ubuntu Mobile UI PoC
Apr 11 02:47:25 <KotCzarny> or it's just black wallpaper?
Apr 11 02:47:26 <dospod> http://www.ubuntu.com/files/u1/clutter-small.jpg
Apr 11 02:47:32 <dospod> thats clean also
Apr 11 02:47:33 <Navi> At least I hope it's just a proof of concept
Apr 11 02:47:50 <esworp> 'modest'?
Apr 11 02:47:59 <Navi> It's an unbearably slow UI
Apr 11 02:48:13 <Navi> The transitions were flashy, but unneeded
Apr 11 02:48:37 <dospod> the way they made it look is nice
Apr 11 02:49:07 <Navi> KotCzarny, the interface of Ubuntu Mobile is just a flash interface at the moment :P
Apr 11 02:49:19 <dospod> I thought it was hildon?
Apr 11 02:49:19 <Navi> I don't know if they're going to keep it.
Apr 11 02:49:25 <esworp> antilles, what is Modest?
Apr 11 02:49:38 <GeneralAntilles> http://modest.garage.maemo.org/
Apr 11 02:49:42 <GeneralAntilles> New email client for Diablo.
Apr 11 02:49:43 <Navi> dospod, the screenshot you showed is the flash interface.
Apr 11 02:49:52 <GeneralAntilles> It has weekly beta releases.
Apr 11 02:50:21 <Navi> The clutter interface is a bit better
Apr 11 02:50:26 <Navi> not by much, though
Apr 11 02:50:35 <dospod> but arent they all based on hildon
Apr 11 02:50:43 <dospod> either way they all look great
Apr 11 02:50:47 <Navi> Hildon UI styled apps, sure
Apr 11 02:51:14 <Navi> but the UI isn't hildon-desktop :P
Apr 11 02:51:34 <dospod> :( I was under the impression the ui was hildon
Apr 11 02:51:39 <Navi> It is >_>
Apr 11 02:51:51 <dospod> ok now im confused
Apr 11 02:51:56 <GeneralAntilles> Hildon UI != hildon-desktop
Apr 11 02:51:57 <dospod> but then again today has been sooo weird
Apr 11 02:51:57 <Navi> I'm as confused as you are
Apr 11 02:52:50 * GeneralAntilles hands Navi a new fork.
Apr 11 02:53:06 <Navi> Eh
Apr 11 02:53:11 <Navi> I don't want to draw another navi
Apr 11 02:53:36 <dospod> has anyone played numpty physics?
Apr 11 02:53:47 <Navi> Me
Apr 11 02:54:06 <GeneralAntilles> Hopefully the in-game level repository idea pans out.
Apr 11 02:54:13 <dospod> its fun
Apr 11 02:54:26 <dospod> but kinda difficult
Apr 11 02:54:31 <GeneralAntilles> Pause!
Apr 11 02:54:53 * Navi shrugs
Apr 11 02:55:20 <esworp> numpty rawks
Apr 11 02:55:33 <shapr> Yeah, it's way cool.
Apr 11 02:56:04 <dospod> indeed it is
Apr 11 02:56:16 <Redline`> I read from one of the pages related to the moz mobile that hardware accel on the 810 is enabled? is this true?
Apr 11 02:56:17 <shapr> Ookay, I'm ready to try to install scratchbox again for maemo development, and I'm on debian/unstable - amd64
Apr 11 02:56:40 <Redline`> I thought the video chip on the N8x0 was still disabled
Apr 11 02:56:41 <GeneralAntilles> What sort of accel, Redline`?
Apr 11 02:56:46 <Redline`> video
Apr 11 02:56:47 <dospod> and does anyone know if kde is ever going to be updated
Apr 11 02:56:51 <KotCzarny> redline: link ?
Apr 11 02:56:54 <GeneralAntilles> 3d or IVA?
Apr 11 02:56:55 <Redline`> sec
Apr 11 02:57:02 <dospod> It seems like no work on the project is not being worked on
Apr 11 02:57:06 <GeneralAntilles> Well, either way, the only hardware acceleration is the DSP.
Apr 11 02:57:18 <Navi> dospod, on Mozilla Mobile?
Apr 11 02:57:26 <Redline`> it was in reference to accel of video streams
Apr 11 02:57:49 <dospod> nope it seems kde was dropped
Apr 11 02:57:59 <Redline`> http://www.0xdeadbeef.com/weblog/
Apr 11 02:58:07 <GeneralAntilles> Talk to penguinbait, dospod.
Apr 11 02:58:14 <Redline`> "If you want to play a video you should make sure that you’ve encoded it for the N810 using a decent script to take advantage of the hardware accel on the device."
Apr 11 02:58:31 <KotCzarny> heh
Apr 11 02:58:40 <KotCzarny> so wrong
Apr 11 02:58:43 <KotCzarny> :)
Apr 11 02:58:43 <Redline`> I read that as was like WTF?
Apr 11 02:58:49 <Redline`> Thought so.
Apr 11 02:58:55 <GeneralAntilles> Dunno
Apr 11 02:59:01 <GeneralAntilles> Maybe they mean pixel doubling?
**** ENDING LOGGING AT Fri Apr 11 02:59:57 2008