**** BEGIN LOGGING AT Sun Apr 20 02:59:56 2008 Apr 20 03:34:21 Anyone have any idea on how openbox, kde, and xfce4 are started in maemo? Apr 20 03:34:49 maybe the same as on pc? Apr 20 03:40:07 Meh, whatever. I'll just start a new Xomap server Apr 20 04:19:46 Gah Apr 20 04:20:00 I can stop hildon, but the script for stopping matchbox doesn't work Apr 20 04:26:45 change runlevel? Apr 20 04:43:42 ha Apr 20 04:44:17 using matchbox-remote to tell matchbox to exit multiple times in a row made my N800 die Apr 20 04:46:37 * trollasaurus conducts a small memorial service for Navi's N800 Apr 20 04:49:15 ahaha, hax Apr 20 04:49:32 (matchbox-remote -exit) && dwm made it die too :D Apr 20 04:50:20 I wish penguinbait would be a bit more public with his window manager running knowledge. Apr 20 04:55:51 how dead did it make it? Apr 20 04:56:50 watchdog rebooted it, s'all Apr 20 04:58:13 I was kidding. Apr 20 05:01:28 watchdog = program? Apr 20 05:01:28 || person Apr 20 05:01:37 dog Apr 20 05:01:49 sorry I disconnected. was watchdog = prog || person Apr 20 05:01:57 dog Apr 20 05:02:41 Arf arf arf. Apr 20 05:03:03 * KotCzarny throws a bit Apr 20 05:03:20 num nums! Apr 20 05:03:46 good doggie, now watch this place while i go killing sorceress Apr 20 05:04:07 Arf. Apr 20 05:13:37 http://linux.softpedia.com/progScreenshots/The-Launcher-Screenshot-32488.html <- cool beans Apr 20 05:15:37 hello :D Apr 20 05:18:49 is there available car game for n800? Apr 20 05:43:34 yes Italodance but not very good Apr 20 05:46:24 perhaps 'terrible' is a better word Apr 20 05:55:50 carmageddon is nice for s60 Apr 20 05:55:51 :) Apr 20 06:48:30 Navi: It is being sold here: http://www.bestpricedbrands.co.uk/index.php?act=viewProd&productId=1062 Apr 20 06:54:34 Funny that they claim to have 12 WiMAX tablets in stock Apr 20 06:57:41 Why is that funny ? Apr 20 06:57:49 it was ironic Apr 20 06:57:53 i think Apr 20 06:58:00 or sarcastic Apr 20 06:59:12 I don't get it. Apr 20 07:24:20 night Apr 20 07:47:49 Is there a flasher that can flash N810 with intel mac? Apr 20 07:52:07 Hi all you maemo hackers... Apr 20 07:53:23 Just a dumb question... How can I mount the internal mmc with exec flag (automatically) in order to execute the programs that I'm compiling? I'm using the internal (2GB) mmc as "developer space" Apr 20 07:53:48 heh Apr 20 07:53:53 vfat is a bad fs for that Apr 20 07:54:07 but if you want just do mount -o remount,exec Apr 20 07:54:14 (with proper mount point) Apr 20 07:55:14 KotCzarny: I know.. I'm tempted to reformat it with ext2 (no gain in using a journalized fs on an mmc) Apr 20 07:55:31 another brainwashed user.. Apr 20 07:56:30 shhh, its a conspiracy between the fs designers and mmc producers ;) Apr 20 07:56:32 you would see the gains after first os reboot :) Apr 20 07:56:42 KotCzarny: why you say so? I was saying ext2 because I once read that journalized fs are not that good for flash-based memories Apr 20 07:56:56 'once read' .. Apr 20 07:57:02 technology changes Apr 20 07:57:11 what could be true year ago Apr 20 07:57:22 i once read that using flash memory for anything would have it totally die within about a week Apr 20 07:57:31 can be reversed by new technology Apr 20 07:57:43 but that was about 10 years ago Apr 20 07:57:58 yeah, read damaging flash memory, those were times.. Apr 20 07:58:14 Understood. You must admit that ext2 is "usually" faster that ext3 and other journalized fs, is it?? Apr 20 07:58:35 actually it would be faster because of necessary journal writes Apr 20 07:58:51 and flash usually sucks at multiple writes Apr 20 07:59:18 I just need to compile somme SmartEiffel applications on an mmc and run them... I just don't care a lot about which fs I shall reformat the mmc :) Apr 20 07:59:22 tybor, depends on what you use it for - if you are planning on using the internal memory for anything repeated i would advise the best thing to do would be get an external removable mmc plugged in and format that however you want. that way even if it goes titsup its not locked in your device Apr 20 07:59:35 erm. that should be 'actually ext2 would be faster than ext3' Apr 20 08:00:13 the worst thing you could do is damage your internal mmc :) Apr 20 08:00:35 by which time there will be nokia n999 Apr 20 08:00:39 or something Apr 20 08:01:12 * Tybor looks for the fattest mmc he could find in italy Apr 20 08:01:39 and as we see now, people buy n770s Apr 20 08:01:42 tybor: you could be interested in booting off mmc :) Apr 20 08:02:06 well doesn't it get progressively smaller instead of dying completely Apr 20 08:02:15 get* Apr 20 08:02:22 fang64: depends which sector dies Apr 20 08:02:24 :) Apr 20 08:02:51 well flash memory controls I know they can fail completely depending on their design Apr 20 08:03:02 mhm Apr 20 08:03:23 reflashing tsop flash typically only allots for around 1000 writes Apr 20 08:03:28 after that your screwed lol Apr 20 08:03:36 Btw, is here a way to use only pigdin instead of the nativee maemo IM? Apr 20 08:04:05 tybor: yes, there is a pidgin package Apr 20 08:04:55 I think some PSP owners have suffered this killing of flash memory from overflashing the firmware lol Apr 20 08:05:04 KotCzarny: I'm already using it.. I was wondering if I can turn off the native maemo chat Apr 20 08:05:12 hmm Apr 20 08:05:30 i don't know, i usually use ssh Apr 20 08:05:31 :) Apr 20 08:05:44 ssh then irssi? Apr 20 08:05:51 epic Apr 20 08:05:58 ah that's right Apr 20 08:06:05 your the openwrt guy XD Apr 20 08:06:09 ;) Apr 20 08:06:16 'you're' Apr 20 08:06:18 'you are' Apr 20 08:06:19 indeed Apr 20 08:06:21 fail Apr 20 08:06:21 lol Apr 20 08:06:32 <-- tired as hell Apr 20 08:06:32 now repeat that 10 times Apr 20 08:06:34 :) Apr 20 08:06:46 practice makes perfect Apr 20 08:07:05 well I usually don't confuse those, but lack of sleep makes you not think Apr 20 08:07:11 yup Apr 20 08:07:15 it's a brain killer Apr 20 08:08:08 ever heard of afs? Apr 20 08:08:25 yup Apr 20 08:08:29 never used it though Apr 20 08:08:43 ah, I heard someone was porting it to the n800 Apr 20 08:08:53 well N8x0 Apr 20 08:09:31 it's really a good system setup for sharing files. Apr 20 08:09:44 i prefer http/sshfs :) Apr 20 08:09:52 well in a college setting Apr 20 08:09:59 http :) Apr 20 08:10:05 when you need to mass propagate read only data Apr 20 08:10:11 ranging in the 2 terabyte range Apr 20 08:10:16 for research Apr 20 08:10:17 hehe Apr 20 08:10:18 ok Apr 20 08:10:19 :) Apr 20 08:10:23 I don't think http will do that well Apr 20 08:10:28 send 2tb over http uhhh Apr 20 08:10:36 but then again writing it to hdd could be faster Apr 20 08:10:48 depends on how afs is setup Apr 20 08:10:59 afs uses local replication Apr 20 08:11:09 the nodes cache a huge amount of data Apr 20 08:11:10 p2p could be nice Apr 20 08:11:15 it's sorta like that Apr 20 08:11:19 but not realy Apr 20 08:11:20 raelly* Apr 20 08:11:20 assuming more than one person needs that data Apr 20 08:11:22 really* lol Apr 20 08:11:27 yup Apr 20 08:11:30 go get some sleep Apr 20 08:11:30 :) Apr 20 08:11:38 yah I'm at my limit X.x Apr 20 08:11:43 cya Apr 20 08:12:03 k k:) Apr 20 08:19:30 * Tybor switch to the ubuntu clamshell iBook Apr 20 08:19:35 see you soon Apr 20 08:42:57 Morning, all Apr 20 08:47:58 * lcuk_lap has a working nipple Apr 20 08:48:12 (and also a working network) Apr 20 08:48:16 don't overwork it Apr 20 08:48:17 ;) Apr 20 08:48:28 * KotCzarny kills off bahamut Apr 20 08:48:34 i apparantly cannot do a secure network Apr 20 08:49:05 make a vpn or only allow your machines via ssh Apr 20 08:49:17 ok everyone in manchester, there is an unsecured 10ma network running, if you are within about 5 foot of my computer you have internet access Apr 20 08:49:33 its ok, ive dropped power :) no point in shouting Apr 20 08:49:39 ah, yes, lowering txpower works too Apr 20 08:49:40 :> Apr 20 08:50:15 everything started working once i got the fan running Apr 20 08:50:20 unless someone has super duper sensitive antenna Apr 20 08:50:24 me thinks it doesnt like overheating itself Apr 20 08:50:49 i think i would notice if someone is stood outside with a wok Apr 20 08:50:58 who does? Apr 20 08:50:59 :) Apr 20 08:51:36 this is certainly bigger and heavier than the 810 Apr 20 08:51:43 and i keep wanting to touch the screen Apr 20 08:52:19 fluffin ubuntu wants to download 300mb of updates Apr 20 08:52:24 its as bad as windows ;) Apr 20 08:52:26 fun Apr 20 08:52:28 :) Apr 20 08:52:55 ive got a command line thing which i can get to work directly from a console after i sudo su Apr 20 08:53:07 but i cannot get it to work directly from a sudo line Apr 20 08:53:24 su - doesn't work? Apr 20 08:53:45 i think its something to do with where the redirection goes. no, it works if i am in an su console Apr 20 08:54:03 but i want it scripted and hence need it calling directly within a script Apr 20 08:54:56 :) Apr 20 08:55:00 this is the line: echo "force_on:1" >/proc/acpi/toshiba/fan Apr 20 08:55:24 if i do: sudo echo "force_on:1" >/proc/acpi/toshiba/fan it doesnt work because the redirect comes from the results of the sudo Apr 20 08:55:30 instead of the result of the echo Apr 20 08:55:51 you can always make a helper.. Apr 20 08:55:52 :) Apr 20 08:56:38 thats what i thought the script was? is there a way to run the whole echo line including the redirect from the sudo? Apr 20 08:57:00 you can't chmod +s a script Apr 20 08:57:03 i cant just quote the entire line because i am already using quotes in the command line Apr 20 08:57:06 that you can only do with binaries Apr 20 08:57:12 no but ubuntu can make it executable Apr 20 08:57:28 or rather "run this script as a programĀ£" Apr 20 08:57:29 executable != binary Apr 20 08:57:56 you can execute both, but one calls interpreter Apr 20 08:58:16 and interpreter usually drops off chmod +s flag Apr 20 08:58:48 lcuk_lap: you can use 'tee' to do the kind of thing you want Apr 20 08:59:05 lcuk_lap: echo force_on:1 | sudo tee /proc/acpi/toshiba/fan Apr 20 09:04:20 thx jaffa, but i just did some more checking and this appears to work: sudo su -c 'echo "force_on:1" >/proc/acpi/toshiba/fan' Apr 20 09:04:35 i forgot about the 2 types of quotes *doh* Apr 20 09:04:47 :) Apr 20 09:05:06 * lcuk_lap might actually start to get all this eventually :) Apr 20 09:05:51 downloads complete :) its installing all its crap now. i might actually swap main machine with laptop to force me to configure it Apr 20 09:11:54 * lcuk_lap wonders if he will be storyboarding apps before the end of the day Apr 20 09:12:21 oh my! chinook's kernel does not support anything else thatn jffs2, msdos and vfat! Apr 20 09:12:34 tybor, just insmod the proper modules.. Apr 20 09:12:37 Compile your own ;) Apr 20 09:12:39 then make all your partitions fat and dont worry ;) Apr 20 09:13:23 ummm what is this theme? https://garage.maemo.org/frs/download.php/795/docReader-0.1-operationtype.png Apr 20 09:13:39 KotCzarny: I've been looking for proper modules but it seems they haven't compiled them in Apr 20 09:13:43 A theme that doesn't exist for OS2008 Apr 20 09:14:13 Tybor, ext2 & 3 modules can be found in initfs. Apr 20 09:14:14 tybor, then you were looking in the wrong places.. Apr 20 09:14:21 apple mac on n810! Apr 20 09:14:22 as they are on your device already Apr 20 09:14:26 BOOM! Apr 20 09:14:28 in initfs Apr 20 09:14:29 mhmm... Apr 20 09:14:31 * Tybor rechecks Apr 20 09:14:40 look in /mnt/something Apr 20 09:14:56 /mnt/initfs/lib/modules/2.6something Apr 20 09:15:11 hi qwerty12 yes that's a nice apple theme Apr 20 09:15:22 Hi, Which doesn't exist for Os2008 Apr 20 09:15:29 http://fanoush.wz.cz/maemo/modules-2.2007.50-2-custom.tar.gz for more fs modules Apr 20 09:15:36 :( Apr 20 09:17:06 ok can i ask a question about file locations. in windows, i have an application path (which can store app global data), an all users path (which can store data for everyone on the machine) and a current user data area. from what i see on linux this is possible but i dont know the locations (sorry for length) Apr 20 09:17:45 lcuk_lap: generally, app's global data (but not configuration) is in something like /usr/share/ Apr 20 09:18:18 Current user data area is typically ~/. Apr 20 09:20:03 * Jaffa does a bit of bugzilla tidying Apr 20 09:20:21 thx jaffa, but the missing one is machine wide data. ie suppose i wanted a shared message db so i could leave a message for tracy when she logs in. where would i put it? Apr 20 09:20:37 /var/lib/ Apr 20 09:20:55 or /var/queue/ is possible too Apr 20 09:21:24 do ls /var and guess Apr 20 09:21:25 :) Apr 20 09:21:49 thx kot, the messagedb was only an example but ill take a look Apr 20 09:22:08 it seems like linux just sprays data around Apr 20 09:22:35 * lcuk_lap actually thinks window is a tiny weenie bit more logicial in this dept ;) Apr 20 09:22:43 not true Apr 20 09:22:44 :) Apr 20 09:22:54 i know lol just like to get heckles up# Apr 20 09:23:11 i hate it when windows apps put data in c:\windows Apr 20 09:23:12 etc Apr 20 09:23:13 ;) Apr 20 09:23:27 and pretend that they haven't installed anything Apr 20 09:23:28 no no Apr 20 09:23:29 ;) Apr 20 09:23:31 my windows apps never do :) Apr 20 09:23:45 have you ever installed ie ? Apr 20 09:23:45 ;) Apr 20 09:24:00 thats not mine tho :P and besides ff works better Apr 20 09:24:12 btw. you should know about meaning of /usr, /var etc Apr 20 09:24:30 usr isnt what i originally thought i know that much Apr 20 09:24:41 usr is mounted after boot Apr 20 09:24:46 everytime i see it i go "not user" Apr 20 09:24:55 so anything not necessary to boot should go to /usr Apr 20 09:25:40 meh, install only 60% complete why cant computer be as fast as my network Apr 20 09:26:58 at least you don't have to click 'next' Apr 20 09:26:59 :) Apr 20 09:27:12 lcuk: http://www.comptechdoc.org/os/linux/usersguide/linux_ugfilestruct.html Apr 20 09:28:32 a little old, but roughly should give you some information Apr 20 09:28:38 thx kot :) i never managed to find something so concise Apr 20 09:30:11 ahhh, so if im reading that right on a full linux system i could find /home/gary and /home/tracy? Apr 20 09:30:22 :) Apr 20 09:30:26 yes Apr 20 09:30:33 and /home/ftp sometimes Apr 20 09:30:35 ;) Apr 20 09:31:03 no thats ok, but when logged in as one of them that is ~ Apr 20 09:31:23 yes, it's substituted by shell to the proper dir Apr 20 09:31:43 in binary programs you have to resolve it yourself though Apr 20 09:31:58 (i think there's a function for that) Apr 20 09:32:17 ? so i cannot do fopen("~.liqbase/brain"); Apr 20 09:32:38 or whatever the proper line would be Apr 20 09:34:23 nope Apr 20 09:34:54 i think you can create a directory with '~' in it Apr 20 09:35:10 Indeed Apr 20 09:35:16 because only char that's forbidden is '/' and \n Apr 20 09:35:27 lcuk_lap: you can resolve the environment variable 'HOME' Apr 20 09:36:20 but isnt home the base dir which contains all users? or is %HOME the equivilent of ~ Apr 20 09:36:35 $HOME Apr 20 09:36:41 forget '%'s Apr 20 09:36:42 :) Apr 20 09:36:45 ok you know what i meant though :P Apr 20 09:36:50 yes Apr 20 09:36:57 but start thinking *nixish Apr 20 09:36:58 :) Apr 20 09:37:09 i would have tried it once and then worked out what was wrong Apr 20 09:37:18 k k Apr 20 09:37:21 external HDD can work with n800 usb yes? Apr 20 09:37:31 powered i would imagine so Apr 20 09:37:42 do: man getenv Apr 20 09:38:36 getenv('HOME'); will be the eqiv in c of $HOME Apr 20 09:38:41 i will once i get this lump off my knee and get comfy. too many wires around (i just lost the mouse somewhere in duvet ;) Apr 20 09:39:09 you can ssh into that machine from tablet Apr 20 09:39:10 ;) Apr 20 09:39:17 and read manuals on it Apr 20 09:40:52 can someone reply me? Apr 20 09:41:01 lcuk replied you Apr 20 09:41:06 try it italo Apr 20 09:41:38 i havent tried a drive, but i used my mem stick. as long as the drive is self powered i dont see why it would be any different Apr 20 09:41:59 lcuk: missing ntfs driver ;) Apr 20 09:42:11 ok lcuk_lap Apr 20 09:42:15 most drives ive seen are still fat Apr 20 09:42:15 portable drives are usually owned by m$ windows Apr 20 09:42:26 fat on 80gb? Apr 20 09:42:27 not fun Apr 20 09:42:28 ;) Apr 20 09:42:43 solmumaha, went and added usb ntfs support to N800 via fuse Apr 20 09:43:01 works well from what I've read, just plug in the drive Apr 20 09:43:10 qwerty12: i know it's possible, i only point what could be an obstacle Apr 20 09:43:10 :) Apr 20 09:43:22 i use ntfs-3g too Apr 20 09:43:24 :), fair enough Apr 20 09:43:35 right, this has finished updating, maybe now i am on an actual device i can find an ide with sane documentation and file handling Apr 20 09:43:45 heh.. Apr 20 09:43:50 you have documentation.. Apr 20 09:43:54 use 'man' command Apr 20 09:44:01 and: 'apropos' Apr 20 09:44:14 * lcuk_lap tries apt-get install visual-studio-6 and msdn ;) Apr 20 09:44:15 and 'info' (sometimes) Apr 20 09:44:27 that could work with wine i think Apr 20 09:44:39 yer but not with linux apis Apr 20 09:45:01 i dont wanna develop windows`apps in linux, but i like the old style ms ide :) Apr 20 09:45:07 :) Apr 20 09:45:09 * lcuk_lap spits on .net Apr 20 09:45:29 i think there was a free borland ide studio Apr 20 09:45:41 something named with 'k' at the beginning Apr 20 09:45:49 kylix Apr 20 09:45:52 yeah Apr 20 09:45:57 that's the name Apr 20 09:46:07 aint that pascal++ Apr 20 09:46:15 not that thats a problem Apr 20 09:46:23 * KotCzarny never used it Apr 20 09:46:30 * lcuk_lap didnt either Apr 20 09:46:32 i always use mc for editing Apr 20 09:47:12 im seriously pondering just building my own Apr 20 09:47:27 how about emacs? Apr 20 09:47:49 which will do all the "man *" and apropos and info stuff in the background and display for me Apr 20 09:47:57 :) Apr 20 09:48:09 i think it's doable Apr 20 09:48:14 before I go and mount initfs, does anyone know the linuxrc commands that show the picture of the 770 when you are in rd mode? Apr 20 09:48:21 tbh, all the manuals wont help me - i need 2 killer features. Apr 20 09:48:40 name them Apr 20 09:48:53 "find out what i have to include and link to obtain api function X()" Apr 20 09:49:00 grep Apr 20 09:49:01 :) Apr 20 09:49:20 "open this sodding header file when i want to see its contents" Apr 20 09:49:30 i use mc for that Apr 20 09:49:31 :) Apr 20 09:49:39 it annoys me that i want to read more and the editors just wont open for me Apr 20 09:50:24 hmm must reboot first but apt-get install mc appears to want to work Apr 20 09:50:41 to want to work? Apr 20 09:51:09 yer but its locked out at the mo Apr 20 09:51:25 mine grammar parser failed Apr 20 09:51:26 :) Apr 20 09:51:27 i just did a massive system update and its moaning at me to reboot and apt is telling me its locked Apr 20 09:53:13 right, ill reboot this and then shove mc on. you have praised it so many times i might as well see what its like Apr 20 09:53:31 :> Apr 20 09:53:42 if you ever used norton commander it should be familiar Apr 20 09:53:43 back later :) thx for help kot and jaffa and others Apr 20 09:53:43 a little Apr 20 09:54:01 you said its similar to dopus so i will be at homeish Apr 20 09:54:07 mc is great, I'd use it on my n800 if the terminal wasn't so crap. Apr 20 09:54:42 * lcuk_lap reboots Apr 20 09:54:50 qwerty12: just use aterm or something Apr 20 09:54:51 :) Apr 20 09:55:34 KotCzarny, I don't have a Bluetooth keyboard and xkbd etc are a bit hard for me to use. Apr 20 09:55:52 rxvt compiles cleanly but I found it boring Apr 20 09:55:56 :) Apr 20 09:56:26 still, if you ssh into tablet, mc is a great help Apr 20 09:56:32 :), when I get a bluetooth keyboard, I will for sure get round to trying more applications. Apr 20 09:56:38 My router is crap :( Apr 20 09:56:52 change it? Apr 20 09:57:03 routers are dirt cheap now Apr 20 09:57:08 5-25$ Apr 20 09:57:15 with wifi and switch Apr 20 09:57:18 I'm a tramp, I ain't got no money :P. I paid around $210 for the one I got :( Apr 20 09:57:29 huh?? Apr 20 09:57:38 **210**??? It's way too much! Apr 20 09:57:52 I bought it a long time ago but yes, I agree Apr 20 09:58:06 way too much. Apr 20 09:58:07 :) Apr 20 09:58:14 Yep, and it's a POS :P :D Apr 20 09:58:29 BTW, which modules shall I edit to make ext2 module get loaded at boot? The non-esistent in /etc or (if ever editable) the one in /mnt/initfs/etc? Apr 20 09:58:33 i don't mind pos if the price is right Apr 20 09:58:34 :) Apr 20 09:58:51 KotCzarny, but this was a expensive POS :P. Apr 20 09:59:17 tybor: maybe add insmod commands to /etc/rc2.d/S99local ? Apr 20 09:59:43 Or if you plan on setting up initfs, bootmenu has a module loading feature Apr 20 09:59:50 yup Apr 20 09:59:53 KotCzarny: oh... that's better indeed Apr 20 09:59:55 I currently have mine set to load the framebuffer modules. Apr 20 10:01:50 fuxzores, you know the /scratchbox directory? is it owned by the sbox group or your user which you use to log into linux with? Apr 20 10:02:10 probably root Apr 20 10:02:11 :) Apr 20 10:02:42 Ah thanks, I'll take guesses :/ Apr 20 10:03:04 adding an sbox user creates proper subdirs Apr 20 10:03:07 for that user Apr 20 10:03:16 brb Apr 20 10:06:53 KotCzarny, thanks :). I just needed to set right permissions to /tmp Apr 20 10:15:29 "unable to get login information for username "faheem" at /scratchbox/devkits/debian-etch/lib/dpkg/controllib.pl line 65. Apr 20 10:15:29 " Apr 20 10:15:31 :( Apr 20 10:15:38 I royally fucked up. Apr 20 10:25:26 * Cptnodegard hates the world Apr 20 10:29:12 * qwerty12 hates scratchbox Apr 20 10:29:19 why? Apr 20 10:29:22 * MangoFusion hates building cross compilers Apr 20 10:29:47 I've gone and messed it up. I don't want to remove and reinstall as I have a lot of libraries in it etc Apr 20 10:30:16 :> Apr 20 10:30:33 just remove the target/user ? Apr 20 10:30:51 it will remove that users libs/dirs though Apr 20 10:31:13 didn't you Apr 20 10:31:16 whats the word Apr 20 10:31:19 begins with b Apr 20 10:31:21 KotCzarny, Hmm, probably right but I'm really tired :( Apr 20 10:31:29 ;) Apr 20 10:31:30 :) Apr 20 10:31:34 go get some sleep Apr 20 10:31:48 re Apr 20 10:31:58 It's 11:31 AM here, it's not my habit to sleep during the day :) Apr 20 10:32:06 But I go to sleep late at night <.< Apr 20 10:32:48 then name it a 'nap' and go to sleep Apr 20 10:32:48 ;) Apr 20 10:33:52 Hehe, I really should do but I mentally cannot go to sleep in the day, it takes me a verryyyyyy long time and I wake up feeling very very weird, :) Apr 20 10:34:23 eat something good and sleepiness will come naturally Apr 20 10:34:24 :) Apr 20 10:34:49 Hehe, thanks :) Apr 20 10:41:03 Oh yeah, what is an oprofile kernel? (N800 wise) Apr 20 10:41:37 kind of debug enabled kernel Apr 20 10:42:05 Ah thanks, I've heard of it a few times, just didn't know what it was :) Apr 20 11:29:59 Doh. Clicked "publish" on a blog post rather than "save". Apr 20 11:30:48 * GeneralAntilles goes to laugh at Jaffa's aborted blog post. Apr 20 11:35:31 * lcuk sells his laptop on ebay Apr 20 11:36:05 did you recieve your eee ? Apr 20 11:36:34 no :( my missus gave me a speech about wasting money (she used expensive shoes as an example) Apr 20 11:36:54 and i managed to find a laptop with wifi that i could rebuild with ubuntu Apr 20 11:37:13 :P Apr 20 11:37:57 but now after a royal battel i have an amazing theme on the laptop called "everything dark" its got black background with black text and amazingly black images Apr 20 11:38:01 sound works ok though Apr 20 11:38:07 can i has 60fps vsync? Apr 20 11:38:26 * pupnik dcc's lcuk cheezburger Apr 20 11:39:20 * pupnik prepares his hila-bots to invade lcuk's hous and steel his codez Apr 20 11:39:28 http://pupnik.de/hillary_and_hillarie.jpg Apr 20 11:39:33 lol i just noticed loads of PMs waiting for me Apr 20 11:39:49 are you trying to buy my code with comical imagary of hillary Apr 20 11:40:05 i'm just being useless atm Apr 20 11:40:22 you're not the only one Apr 20 11:40:59 so you ant to attempt to run emulator using the nice quick display code Apr 20 11:41:46 or you want to continue running it in sdl but ensuring it is flicker free Apr 20 11:42:03 i don't know how sdl triggers refresh Apr 20 11:42:09 or how to surpress that Apr 20 11:42:21 with the small window, i get enough performance i think with sdl blit @ 16bpp Apr 20 11:42:44 i agree, but whats needed is the removal of tearing Apr 20 11:43:00 yeah i'm kind of scared/lazy to get into that Apr 20 11:45:08 ill gladly let you have a look, but im not doing anything special with the refresh, just xv library raises an X event when its finished sending data after I call putimage Apr 20 11:45:54 does the tearing occur all the time, or does it depend upon the speed of your refreshing Apr 20 11:46:15 not refreshing -> frame generating Apr 20 11:46:25 is there a faster PDF reader for the it? the built in one is SLOW Apr 20 11:46:54 happens all the time. emulator exceeds 60fps on N810 and 770 Apr 20 11:47:08 according to emulator Apr 20 11:47:12 Evince, Cptnodegard. Apr 20 11:47:30 but do you know how long it takes to actually send a screen? Apr 20 11:47:31 rather it tries to hit 60fps. if i remove the wait loop it exceeds Apr 20 11:47:37 nope Apr 20 11:47:40 infact, hangon, doesnt sdl have double buffering Apr 20 11:47:49 waitloop? Apr 20 11:47:50 not on maemo Apr 20 11:48:18 GeneralAntilles: does it work well? the internal one maxes the cpu from trying to check bass tables alone -__- Apr 20 11:48:19 it computes, waits, draws, computes, waits, draws Apr 20 11:48:20 how long are you trying to wait for? just until you hit 60fps, or a specified period Apr 20 11:48:30 It's a lot faster. Apr 20 11:48:32 until next 1/60th of a second Apr 20 11:49:10 need timings really to "simlulate" the expected delay required Apr 20 11:49:35 it has a little timer and wait loop. what is cur time, what is time-to-update, sleep usec Apr 20 11:49:51 well not loop - Apr 20 11:49:56 at the start of all this i was looking at sdl, and tbh even though im playing and doing nice stuff with the xv it would be beneficial to the community as a whole to see if sdl can be made to work Apr 20 11:51:22 yessir Apr 20 11:51:28 you moved past your landscape thingy didnt you. from what i saw that didnt exhibit dreadful tearing though (or didnt appear to) Apr 20 11:52:20 i don't remember Apr 20 11:52:22 (i moved away from sdl because fullscreen 800*480) wasnt as fast on sdl because of a whole buffered page Apr 20 11:52:50 but at the lower resolutions i really dont see why it tears Apr 20 11:53:32 lemme just fire up the couple of sdl projects ive got and see if i can see problem Apr 20 11:53:38 hi Apr 20 11:53:43 unless youve got something simple as a testcase Apr 20 11:53:54 i can give you the emu source Apr 20 11:54:04 but that's not so simple Apr 20 11:54:06 I jave a problem with ossofilemanager : it doesn't show all the files Apr 20 11:54:13 ok but i might end up not seeing the wood for the trees Apr 20 11:54:26 yeah Apr 20 11:54:39 well dude i will try to do work today. sorry to pestery you Apr 20 11:54:40 tell ya what, hold on that for a minute Apr 20 11:55:03 bbiam Apr 20 11:55:07 hey no prob - we both want best quality possible and linuxtag is nearly hear Apr 20 11:55:19 im happy to have a look and at least see if anything can be done Apr 20 11:56:00 gribouille, whats missing Apr 20 11:57:11 lcuk, for example, I have downloaded a video, but the video doesn't appear in the file manager Apr 20 11:57:29 are you looking in the correct location? Apr 20 11:58:05 lcuk, I think so Apr 20 11:58:26 downloading video from where? the internet or over the wifi from your computer Apr 20 11:58:43 lcuk, ues Apr 20 11:58:45 lcuk, yes Apr 20 11:58:45 and where are you saving it to Apr 20 11:58:55 the video is in /home/user Apr 20 11:59:26 /home/user is one directory above where File manager will display Apr 20 11:59:34 Use emelfm or xterm or something Apr 20 11:59:46 GMPlayer should see it. Apr 20 12:00:09 there ya go, i was just gonna say that ;) Apr 20 12:00:21 GeneralAntilles, exactly. but why doesnt File manager show everything ? Apr 20 12:00:32 Because it's "user friendly" Apr 20 12:00:40 because file manager is a user application. users dont care about the innards Apr 20 12:00:50 GeneralAntilles, it is for Mac OS users Apr 20 12:01:03 * GeneralAntilles is an OS X user. Apr 20 12:01:17 * lcuk is an X os user Apr 20 12:01:30 PUN FAIL! Apr 20 12:01:36 * lcuk solders wires to the motherboard to type Apr 20 12:01:48 * gribouille is an ubuntu user Apr 20 12:12:19 indeed this is WAY(!!!) faster GeneralAntilles Apr 20 12:16:56 in File Manager, how can I associate an app with a file type ? Apr 20 12:18:12 http://www.internettablettalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=15194 gribouille Apr 20 12:24:10 pfft Apr 20 12:24:16 is there a good torrent site for magazines? Apr 20 12:24:55 Magazines suck. Apr 20 12:25:17 no Apr 20 12:25:23 i got nothing else to do Apr 20 12:25:28 ebooks! Apr 20 12:26:27 meh Apr 20 12:26:30 takes too long Apr 20 12:26:31 GeneralAntilles, what do I have to put in /usr/share/applications/ ? Apr 20 12:26:42 For what? Apr 20 12:26:46 mime type handling? Apr 20 12:26:50 Dunno, never looked into it. Apr 20 12:27:07 GeneralAntilles, for flv videos Apr 20 12:46:45 can't the video player play mpeg videos ? Apr 20 12:46:54 anyone here using T-Zones for bluetooth DUN? Apr 20 12:51:22 GeneralAntilles: http://www.maemopeople.org/media/users/jaffa/corporate-open-source-triangle.png is going to be part of my blog post Apr 20 12:51:27 Inkscape FTW! Apr 20 12:51:42 Hehe Apr 20 12:52:06 Put little pictures of Darth Vader on the bottom left. Apr 20 12:52:12 heh :) Apr 20 12:53:18 I think we can agree we're closer to the bottom left than anywhere else, ATM ;-) Apr 20 12:53:54 Sadly. :( Apr 20 12:54:40 pupnik Apr 20 12:54:42 meh...it could be a lot worse Apr 20 12:55:21 True, but for an essay on "maemo.org: what next?" saying "it could be worse" isn't going to push us forwards ;-) Apr 20 12:55:34 oh, I completely agree :) Apr 20 12:55:47 what what Apr 20 12:56:33 step into my office ;) Apr 20 12:57:08 Jaffa, I'm sure you know, but hitting on the reasons openness and more community involvement would benefit Nokia would probably the most effective method to get a response. Apr 20 12:57:23 GeneralAntilles: indeed Apr 20 12:57:27 yes! so much yes! what he said Apr 20 12:57:37 Appeal to their rational self-interest. :D Apr 20 12:59:29 If we can actually get to the point where getting a hildonized app from Ubuntu Mobile to Maemo it will pretty much cement hildon as the UI of choice for mobile linux Apr 20 12:59:33 Companies love their bottom line Apr 20 13:00:03 s/Maemo it/Maemo is *really easy* it/g Apr 20 13:00:04 johnx meant: If we can actually get to the point where getting a hildonized app from Ubuntu Mobile to Maemo is *really easy* it will pretty much cement hildon as the UI of choice for mobile linux Apr 20 13:02:55 I wonder if putting it in the form of an open letter would be useful. Apr 20 14:19:16 Can someone suggest someplace to start to get a list of non-free packages in maemo? Should I just screenscrap the index of the repository or can someone think of a better way? Does apt have a "license" field somewhere? Apr 20 14:21:36 Compare the directory listings for the source repo vs. the binary repo? Apr 20 14:22:23 yeah, that's what I thought Apr 20 14:22:55 I just figured someone might pop in here with a really easy way to do it. :D Apr 20 14:25:53 * johnx really wishes apt had a license field :/ Apr 20 14:25:59 * RST38h conquered gconf Apr 20 14:26:15 [hasn't been easy - a lot of API is kinda artificial] Apr 20 14:28:35 johnx/GeneralAntilles: comments welcome on http://bleb.org/software/maemo/next-draft.html Apr 20 14:33:35 it really does surprises me how easily compiling an older version of gcc with a newer version results in insanity Apr 20 14:33:40 lcuk too, if you're about. Apr 20 14:36:00 Jaffa: The "work with Intel/Ubuntu" comment is kind of redundant Apr 20 14:36:15 true Apr 20 14:36:21 As far as I know, they made use of Hildon but ignored the rest Apr 20 14:36:29 So it is kind of a one-way street right now Apr 20 14:37:22 Also, as cute as their Moblin stuff is, it currenty works on exactly ONE UMPC from ONE manufacturer (Samsung) and that device is a full-featured PC. It can run XP Apr 20 14:37:55 * Jaffa tacks on the end of that point: "; to ensure that Moblin, UME and maemo don't splinter and that porting applications between them, and innovations made by one company can be reused without being dismissed because of "Not Invented Here" syndrome." Apr 20 14:38:04 Until Moblin works on low-specced devices like IT, it is irrelevant (and I am sure Intel intends to keep it that way - they are not selling ARM based devices) Apr 20 14:38:04 :> Apr 20 14:38:14 Why wouldn't it work there? Apr 20 14:38:17 Jaffa: Already splintered. Apr 20 14:38:19 Are apps too heavy? Apr 20 14:38:33 It is most likely too heavy for ITs Apr 20 14:38:43 RST38h: indeed; but they're innovating in the UI space and are developing more in the open. Apr 20 14:38:57 I'd expound a bit on the value-added part of openness. Apr 20 14:39:00 Jaffa: they ain't innovating in UI space Apr 20 14:39:02 * Jaffa isn't saying that UME should be used instead of maemo Apr 20 14:39:06 RST38h: more so than Nokia Apr 20 14:39:21 Jaffa: Apple is innovating in the UI space. Microsoft is (see the Table). Moblin is not Apr 20 14:39:39 Yup, Moblin is very similar to Maemo... Apr 20 14:39:46 (as far as UI goes) Apr 20 14:40:07 Jaffa: Nokia actually is (a little bit), just makes sure to call it "Handful's hobby project" ;) Apr 20 14:40:13 I had a few ideas about nicer UI, but these required a 3D chip. Apr 20 14:40:39 * Jaffa was trying to avoid iPhone comparisons as they generate more heat than light; and was trying to stay focused on maemo. Saying "throw out Hildon, copy the iPhone and Canola" is not realistic at this point (or, at least, I'd be very surprised) Apr 20 14:40:51 RST38h: INDt are always at pains to point out they ain't Nokia. Apr 20 14:40:53 BTW, I still do not understand why everybody is so bent against Maemo UI. It's simple and does the job and can be incrementally improved Apr 20 14:40:59 Canola isn't that good IMO Apr 20 14:41:02 too many clicks Apr 20 14:41:02 Jaffa: Yea, yea ;) Apr 20 14:41:04 I can not see, how atom based devices can ever get to the size of n8x0 with the same battery life. Apr 20 14:41:13 "ever" is a strong word in computing Apr 20 14:41:14 AStorm: well, they are experimenting Apr 20 14:41:22 yup Apr 20 14:41:31 but the interface feels much too slow Apr 20 14:41:39 * RST38h probably has to disclose that he is an Intel employee... Apr 20 14:41:49 It's well suited for tiny screens though Apr 20 14:41:54 * Jaffa doesn't think Canola's innovating either. For maemo software, perhaps; but there's no real difference between Canola, MythTV, Freevo and the iPhone. Apr 20 14:41:58 (not directly dealing with Atom though) Apr 20 14:42:07 but not for screen that large Nxxx have Apr 20 14:42:17 Jaffa: Their input methods are pretty innovative Apr 20 14:42:32 Jaffa: some presentation stuff as well (like pictures browsing) Apr 20 14:42:42 what input methods? Apr 20 14:42:51 * Jaffa dittos AStorm. Apr 20 14:42:54 you mean scrolling? baaaah Apr 20 14:42:55 As a whole, Canola is not a huge innovation, but it is a nice workbench Apr 20 14:42:57 There could be different app-launchers, canola like, the one we have now etc. They could even make a desktop applet which is canola like.. Apr 20 14:43:04 * RST38h meant scrolling Apr 20 14:43:22 VRe: Canola is a PMP. Why do you need everything to look like canola? Apr 20 14:43:29 VRe: they did. It's in moblin (both Clutter and Flash-based). Their home screen draggable app launcher is a Hildon Desktop plugin Apr 20 14:43:41 hehehe Apr 20 14:43:42 Jaffa: Ok, so there is selecting then Apr 20 14:43:46 Use similar presentation and input techniques - yes, definitely. But *be* Canola? Apr 20 14:43:51 RST38h: well, scrolling is simple Apr 20 14:43:54 RST38h: the scrolling's "just" a copy of the iPhone (and a somewhat ropey implementation at that) Apr 20 14:44:10 Jaffa: It is not: iPhone has completely different touch screen hw Apr 20 14:44:12 Can't copy it Apr 20 14:44:16 it's simple because you just need some threshold of dragging Apr 20 14:44:20 It is similar but not the same Apr 20 14:44:30 yup, Nxxx doesn't have multitouch - non-capacitive screen Apr 20 14:44:45 RST38h: Well, not canola, I think its more iphone anyways.. or palm style (without scrolling) Apr 20 14:44:47 what I'd love in Nxxx is gestures Apr 20 14:45:00 RST38h: The implementation might be "innovative" then, being able to do it on a passive touchscreen, but the UI isn't. Apr 20 14:45:01 there were some apps for Linux, but very undeveloped Apr 20 14:45:13 with a touchscreen, you could literally draw these Apr 20 14:45:26 Jaffa: UI is not Apr 20 14:46:42 * RST38h wonders how long it will take for some enterprising character to write a Maemo desktop plugin that takes the whole desktop and looks exactly like iPhone... Apr 20 14:46:46 The best would be that all is visible on the screen and there is no need to scroll around, looks cool but takes time Apr 20 14:46:58 RST38h: that would be copyright infringement Apr 20 14:46:59 the video player can't play my mpeg videos Apr 20 14:47:02 actually, leave 50-pixels at the right free for email/time/etc plugins Apr 20 14:47:03 and multitouch is impossible Apr 20 14:47:15 AStorm: Not really: Moblin is doing it and they are still aflotat Apr 20 14:47:16 gribouille: built-in player needs vids to be 800x480 or smaller Apr 20 14:47:18 mplayer can scale Apr 20 14:47:28 RST38h: not similar enough :> Apr 20 14:47:36 AStorm: exactly ;) Apr 20 14:47:38 gribouille: canola uses mplayer too Apr 20 14:47:42 That was what I meant ;) Apr 20 14:47:42 RST38h, somebody already did Apr 20 14:47:45 though it's not a plugin. Apr 20 14:47:49 just a Python application Apr 20 14:47:55 ah right Apr 20 14:47:57 wgy doesn't the video player use mplayer ? Apr 20 14:47:59 General: Yes, but that one was impractical ;( Apr 20 14:48:08 gribouille: because it uses gstreamer Apr 20 14:48:22 and they haven't written a scale plugin for some reason or another Apr 20 14:48:40 There *is* an app launcher for maemo which copies the iPhone's home screen Apr 20 14:48:46 mplayer is fairly heavy too, and less integrated than gstreamer system Apr 20 14:49:09 AStorm, what is the advantage of gstreamer ? Apr 20 14:49:18 gribouille: http://www.gstreamer.org Apr 20 14:49:21 :-) Apr 20 14:49:31 it's nice and pluggable Apr 20 14:49:41 a comfy programming interface too Apr 20 14:49:45 and GNOME uses it Apr 20 14:50:08 Jaffa: URL? Apr 20 14:50:23 blah, I don't like iPhone UI that much Apr 20 14:50:28 * RST38h would prefer /dev/dsp to GStreamer any time Apr 20 14:50:42 RST38h: lol, w/o picking Hz? Apr 20 14:51:01 AStorm: Maemo GStreamer has problems playing samples at anything but 44.1kHz anyway Apr 20 14:51:04 for /dev/dsp to work fine you need to have some (propietary) comm mechanism Apr 20 14:51:12 RST38h: that's because of esd Apr 20 14:51:19 not gstreamer per se Apr 20 14:51:26 * RST38h has comm mechanisms implemented eons ago Apr 20 14:51:27 you could probably switch it to direct ALSA Apr 20 14:51:41 RST38h: is OSS mechanism standarised enough? Apr 20 14:51:42 It's ok - I already integrated gstreamer support Apr 20 14:51:47 does it provide latency info? :-) Apr 20 14:51:47 AStorm: More or less Apr 20 14:51:58 buffer size? channel number? Apr 20 14:52:06 AStorm, the video player can't play a video like this : VIDEO: MPEG1 320x240 (aspect 1) 25.000 fps 0.0 kbps ( 0.0 kbyte/s) Apr 20 14:52:07 Not really, but who gives a damn, just saturate the thing with data Apr 20 14:52:25 0.0 kbps? wtf? Apr 20 14:52:32 jaffa im not about proprly yet but i will be later, just send me a reminder to liquid on gmail Apr 20 14:52:38 I don't know Apr 20 14:52:44 And you *can* set buffer size for /dev/dsp, no problem with that Apr 20 14:52:46 RST38h: well, ALSA got one thing right, and one thing wrong Apr 20 14:52:49 that's mplayer's output Apr 20 14:53:00 gribouille: something is wrong with the movie Apr 20 14:53:11 probably broken header Apr 20 14:53:20 AStorm, maybe, but mplayer plays it normally Apr 20 14:53:40 RST38h: right was plugins, wrong was complex API Apr 20 14:53:45 AStorm, I converted a flash video with ffmpeg Apr 20 14:53:54 gribouille: hmm, weird, should work Apr 20 14:53:58 AStorm: That is a common mistake :) Apr 20 14:54:03 btw, flv can be played by mplayer Apr 20 14:54:19 Weird how few people understand that you only need 2 API calls for audio Apr 20 14:54:19 RST38h: well, gstreamer fixed the latter Apr 20 14:54:27 and it does have 3 calls Apr 20 14:54:35 to sound :P Apr 20 14:54:36 WriteAudio() and GetFreeAudio() Apr 20 14:54:43 RST38h: which Audio? PCM? Apr 20 14:54:45 :P Apr 20 14:54:46 Yea, probably Open/Close as well :) Apr 20 14:54:53 Just about any streaming audio Apr 20 14:54:57 nah Apr 20 14:55:02 that would need filetype detection Apr 20 14:55:06 RST38h: http://maemo.org/downloads/product/OS2007/itablet/ Apr 20 14:55:14 gst sidesteps that by using MIME types all around Apr 20 14:55:20 and separate detection plugin Apr 20 14:55:21 AStorm: But I do not play audio files, I play data buffers Apr 20 14:55:40 RST38h: ah, then, it's simple, init the sink and send away Apr 20 14:55:42 :-) Apr 20 14:55:53 Jaffa: Not a plugin. An app. Written in Python. Too bad :( Apr 20 14:55:56 but the problem is you need decoding anyway Apr 20 14:56:10 btw, my charger broke, again! Apr 20 14:56:14 RST38h: wouldn't be hard to do a Hildon Desktop version now Apr 20 14:56:14 AStorm: yea, but you can tell the nature of the data when initing Apr 20 14:56:26 RST38h: and have automatic decoding Apr 20 14:56:31 Jaffa: I guess so. Still waiting for a hero who makes it ;) Apr 20 14:56:36 yes, that's what high-level GSt looks like Apr 20 14:56:52 AStorm: format detection isn't something audio API has to do, IMHO Apr 20 14:57:01 ok, where do I get a resilient charger for Nxxx? Apr 20 14:57:10 with a plug that doesn't break after 2 weeks? Apr 20 14:57:19 Isn't the standard one good enough? Apr 20 14:57:23 broke! Apr 20 14:57:24 :P Apr 20 14:57:37 aluminum plugs = junk Apr 20 14:57:44 Europlug or US? Apr 20 14:57:47 no no Apr 20 14:57:52 the small 5V plug broke Apr 20 14:57:57 Ah Apr 20 14:58:09 The flimsy little 5V plug Apr 20 14:58:13 yup Apr 20 14:58:21 it'd need iridium or at least steel Apr 20 14:58:26 Is there a RadioShack around? Apr 20 14:58:26 to be resilient enough Apr 20 14:58:32 RST38h: nah, wrong country Apr 20 14:59:05 Ummm....Maybe make one from a catether needle? Apr 20 14:59:10 hmmmmmm Apr 20 14:59:15 that's steel all right Apr 20 14:59:18 That one won't break Apr 20 14:59:20 how can I map flv videos to mplayer ? Apr 20 14:59:21 but solder would Apr 20 14:59:26 gribouille: as in? Apr 20 14:59:40 gribouille: I'd use canola anyway :> Apr 20 14:59:42 Depends on how you solder it Apr 20 14:59:58 RST38h: in any way, it won't solder well Apr 20 15:00:03 AStorm, but it doesnt play flash videos Apr 20 15:00:10 gribouille: wrong! it does Apr 20 15:00:16 let's try Apr 20 15:00:25 but be sure to get the recent version, (like beta7 or newer) Apr 20 15:00:31 it even has a youtube plugin Apr 20 15:00:49 it wont index flv files you have already saved. Apr 20 15:00:56 AStorm: you can make a few notches on it with a file, then wrap the wire around these, and use some evil compound when soldering Apr 20 15:01:09 RST38h: hmm, yup, increase surface Apr 20 15:01:17 AStorm, I tried the youtube plugin, but it failed miserably Apr 20 15:01:21 but it will still break the same Apr 20 15:01:31 And then, just to be sure, deep the whole thing into "liquid metal" epoxy Apr 20 15:01:47 Everything will break when pushed hard enough. Apr 20 15:02:06 the problem is that in both cases it broke just after the pin Apr 20 15:02:25 at the point it connects to the rest of the plug Apr 20 15:02:29 AStorm, canola doesn't show flash videos in my video folder Apr 20 15:02:36 gribouille: what qwerty12 said Apr 20 15:02:49 put these into its youtube save folder Apr 20 15:03:04 AStorm, where is it ? Apr 20 15:03:36 Sigh, I have to reinstall scratchbox :( Apr 20 15:03:39 you can pick that one Apr 20 15:03:42 in Settings Apr 20 15:04:00 they'll probably fix the scanner some more in the next version Apr 20 15:04:14 its planned. Apr 20 15:04:30 I hope Vorbis will work Apr 20 15:04:43 AStorm, is it 'My download folder' ? Apr 20 15:04:46 AStorm, There's a deb for vorbis in canola Apr 20 15:05:07 qwerty12: sorry, can't test that yet Apr 20 15:05:15 is it that ogg-support, or something more? Apr 20 15:05:35 qwerty12: first, I need a non-breaking charger Apr 20 15:05:41 where does canola put the videos it downloads ? Apr 20 15:05:45 AStorm, Ogg-support is needed for codecs but then there is another deb. I'll search it up. Apr 20 15:05:54 qwerty12: wait with that Apr 20 15:05:59 I'd have to bookmark it Apr 20 15:06:10 Skeen. Apr 20 15:08:59 I got a question, what benefits does an oprofile kernel give? Apr 20 15:10:07 you can run oprofile with it Apr 20 15:10:12 and profile the kernel and apps Apr 20 15:10:38 Ah nice :), my CPU is always on full usage for some reason and [h]top gives me rubbish results. Apr 20 15:10:42 * johnx was distracted for a while, reads through backlog + Jaffa's "What's next" Apr 20 15:17:12 btw, is it possible to reassemble keys (I mean physical) on N810? Apr 20 15:17:18 switch the layout Apr 20 15:17:58 brb, got to log out to set up sbox Apr 20 15:19:21 Was an intresting post on internettablettalk.com about firewall and security, i didnt understand all what was said, but as i understand it, there is iptables at the bottom of the system, would it be possible for somone to make a script to make it run useful? Apr 20 15:19:42 Believe me, meanwhile was chatting out of his ass. Apr 20 15:20:53 Yes, eathprod, it'd be worthwhile to ignore basically everything that meanwhile "contributed" to that thread. ;) Apr 20 15:21:34 eathprod: well, there is iptables Apr 20 15:21:40 iptables isn't that hard to understand. Apr 20 15:21:44 you can use it Apr 20 15:21:59 and maybe firehol or some other frontend could be ported Apr 20 15:22:02 Though, I've always missed ipfw from my BSD days Apr 20 15:22:11 does anyone know if there is a better shell than ash ? Apr 20 15:22:15 I'm not sure if an useful modules have been built Apr 20 15:22:19 gribouille: sure, bash Apr 20 15:22:24 eathprod, what do you want to do with your firewall? try and keep people out? or try and restrict net access from apps running Apr 20 15:22:29 the b is for better! :P Apr 20 15:22:29 and the default isn't ash, but msh (from busybox) Apr 20 15:22:36 AStorm, ut doesn't seem to be a good idea to install it Apr 20 15:22:52 nitapps.com, gribouille Apr 20 15:23:02 yup, that one has bash3 Apr 20 15:23:12 i know it will be "fireproof" but if somthing could make it better it would be wothwhile Apr 20 15:23:14 you can replace /bin/sh with it w/o harm too Apr 20 15:23:17 The default says "ash" over here, AStorm. Apr 20 15:23:17 :-) Apr 20 15:23:19 wont be* Apr 20 15:23:29 GeneralAntilles: possible, but it isn't that ash Debian uses Apr 20 15:23:37 it still is busybox ash, which sucks :P Apr 20 15:23:54 I didn't like bash tbh on my tablet. bash on my computer is great but I found ash to be more suited for the tablet. Apr 20 15:24:09 in what? Apr 20 15:24:15 it doesn't have *anything* Apr 20 15:24:21 if I want to install bash, apt-get will remove 129 packages ! Apr 20 15:24:27 gribouille: no, nitapps.com Apr 20 15:24:27 I find bash sucks either way. Apr 20 15:24:33 not the one in repos Apr 20 15:24:36 Cooool Apr 20 15:24:40 that one is for scratchbox or hax0rs ;P Apr 20 15:24:44 [whispers] tcsh Apr 20 15:24:51 RST38h: noooooo! Apr 20 15:24:55 yes. Apr 20 15:25:06 eathprod, basically, by default, ITOS isn't listening on any ports, and only programs that *you* install have net access. If you do install a malicious program by accident, chances are it will also be smart enough to subvert your firewall...sooo, unless you have a specific use in mind for iptables, I wouldn't worry about it Apr 20 15:25:11 tsch any good? Apr 20 15:25:13 RST38h: no, I want a Python shell. Apr 20 15:25:22 like ipython, but slightly different Apr 20 15:25:44 qwerty12, it's like csh Apr 20 15:25:45 qwerty12, I prefer the bourne-based shells to the c-based shells Apr 20 15:25:45 AStorm: Weird. Is it difficult to compile? Apr 20 15:25:59 RST38h: what? ipython? no Apr 20 15:26:04 Ah thanks. Apr 20 15:26:05 http://www.faqs.org/faqs/unix-faq/shell/csh-whynot/ Apr 20 15:26:05 * Navi prefers zsh Apr 20 15:26:09 it just doesn't run normal commands by default Apr 20 15:26:09 qwerty: csh/tcsh are standard on BSD systems Apr 20 15:26:21 RST38h: which is unfortunate and sucky Apr 20 15:26:24 and dash for lower systems Apr 20 15:26:29 qwerty: so every time I have to deal with bash, it feels wrong Apr 20 15:26:37 Navi: zsh actually isn't that much better Apr 20 15:26:46 qwerty: that is the only reason really Apr 20 15:26:50 johnx, thanks for the answer, i guess basic healty thinking and dowload from trusted sources is good enuf Apr 20 15:26:50 AStorm, than what, bash? Apr 20 15:26:52 RST38h: because you're wrong, not the shell :P Apr 20 15:27:01 Navi: why not, but then, bash isn't the best Apr 20 15:27:11 I'd love fish, but debroken and improved Apr 20 15:27:15 I've only ever used bash and ash :/. But surely they are easy to port to the tablet? I'd try but scratchbox is officialy over for me. Apr 20 15:27:16 AStorm, then what were you comparing it to? Apr 20 15:27:21 and also, POSIX sh is anywhere Apr 20 15:27:25 Navi: to nothing special Apr 20 15:27:29 :/ Apr 20 15:27:31 eathprod, there are a lot of smart people here and on the forums. Chances are anyone writing malicious code will get caught out pretty quick Apr 20 15:27:35 zsh is better than bash, but only minimally Apr 20 15:28:05 I take zsh's scripting and tab completion over bash any day Apr 20 15:28:08 hi Apr 20 15:28:27 Navi: well, tab completion is configurable in bash Apr 20 15:28:29 Not just a minor improvement, imo Apr 20 15:28:31 the defaults are diff Apr 20 15:28:40 zsh scripting isn't better, just different Apr 20 15:28:54 eathprod, that being said, there are nice tracking programs you can run to easily see what programs are connecting to where: netstat is one of them (try netstat -ltau in the x terminal) Apr 20 15:29:09 if I install bash3, will it break my yablet ? Apr 20 15:29:10 AStorm, if I prefer it, it's better to me. Apr 20 15:29:13 gribouille: no Apr 20 15:29:26 AStorm, can I install it safely ? Apr 20 15:29:27 Navi: exactly, qualified speech is the win ;) Apr 20 15:29:31 gribouille: YES. Apr 20 15:29:34 johnx, i will look into it when i get it conected, thanks Apr 20 15:30:11 is there a way i can tell what is causing my n800 to take so long to poweron ? it hangs at the nokia screen for a very long time. It did not do this before i updated. I am running os2008 Apr 20 15:30:38 Do you have swap enabled? Apr 20 15:30:44 NOCmadman, fanoush written some good stuff about checking. Apr 20 15:30:59 i did but i turned it off when I updated Apr 20 15:31:40 Swap + corrupt internal card has been known to cause those symptoms. Apr 20 15:32:41 i am constantly using internal card and swap is turned off so guess im back to square 1 Apr 20 15:34:26 NOCmadman: check partition layout of that card Apr 20 15:34:33 there's some info on forums Apr 20 15:36:12 I clicked on the link 'Install catalogue' on http://nitapps.com/, but it didn't work Apr 20 15:36:37 click save page, then open it in file manager Apr 20 15:38:55 ...or "install from file" directly in application manager after saving the page Apr 20 15:43:38 I wonder what there is in this catalogue Apr 20 15:43:51 nitapps? just what you see on the front page I think Apr 20 15:44:07 battery status, light meter and temp sensor seem like the coolest ones to me Apr 20 15:44:41 johnx, but the packages don't appear in the software manager Apr 20 15:44:57 you might have to install them with apt-get Apr 20 15:45:04 No Apr 20 15:45:08 Did you refresh. Apr 20 15:45:12 or you might not :D Apr 20 15:45:13 They're all in User/ Apr 20 15:45:22 it normally does when you install a new catalogue Apr 20 15:46:48 I can verify that battery-status is in the application manager catalogue. I use all. Apr 20 15:47:21 johnx: I'd love real applets for these Apr 20 15:47:22 foe example, color-ls appears neither in the available applications list, nor in the installed applications list Apr 20 15:47:38 AStorm, you mean home screen applets? Apr 20 15:47:43 johnx: yup Apr 20 15:47:43 Well of course it isn't going to be in installed application list. Apr 20 15:47:45 that would be kind of neat... Apr 20 15:47:54 But color-ls is in available apps. Apr 20 15:48:09 I wonder how hard homeip and homecpuspeed are to hack Apr 20 15:48:23 well, is it just some GTK? Apr 20 15:48:24 they are all written in python afaik Apr 20 15:48:25 Not really, they are just python Apr 20 15:48:32 PyGTK then? Apr 20 15:48:37 with a transparent PNG? Apr 20 15:48:43 like screenlets? Apr 20 15:48:47 or PyCairo? Apr 20 15:48:48 I made a quick crap uptime applet which fails after 1 hour using that code. Apr 20 15:48:57 qwerty12: lol Apr 20 15:49:05 uptime applet TODO: improve uptime Apr 20 15:49:15 quickly rename it "the countdown applet"! Apr 20 15:49:44 :P Apr 20 15:49:53 I'd be interested if someone did make a proper uptime applet actually ;p Apr 20 15:49:54 I suspect you count seconds Apr 20 15:49:58 ok, I'm in a good mood so I'll take a really quick poke at homeip and see if I can make it do my bidding Apr 20 15:50:08 just display /proc/uptime, d'oh Apr 20 15:50:16 that output is weird :p Apr 20 15:50:25 "uptime" I like though Apr 20 15:50:32 qwerty12: no no, it's not weird Apr 20 15:50:44 Home applets for what? Apr 20 15:50:50 light-meter and internal temperature? Apr 20 15:51:13 yeah, and battery status I guess Apr 20 15:51:17 Making one for internal-temperature would be very very easy Apr 20 15:51:23 It's already been done Apr 20 15:51:29 I recommended that Khertan make them yesterday. :P Apr 20 15:51:31 They're there. Apr 20 15:51:36 O_o Apr 20 15:51:49 battery-status uses dbus which activates the statusbar applet Apr 20 15:51:56 so that wouldn't work very well as a desktop applet. Apr 20 15:52:01 is bash-completion available ? Apr 20 15:52:03 meh, that's just cosmetic Apr 20 15:52:19 It's kind of irritating when a home applet is randomly activating it all the time, though. Apr 20 15:52:48 just cause it gets that background? Apr 20 15:52:53 Maybe kcbatt? But I don't get that program, output was -230% at one time. Apr 20 15:52:58 gribouille: I think yes Apr 20 15:53:07 it should work well anyway if installed by hand Apr 20 15:53:28 AStorm, I tried apt-get install bash-completion, but with no result Apr 20 15:53:42 GeneralAntilles: well, battery state is readable from /sys directly, right? Apr 20 15:53:51 gribouille: ... no, there's no package Apr 20 15:53:56 kcbatt grabs it from dsme/retu Apr 20 15:54:17 AStorm, I'm pretty sure it's not...but I'd like to be wrong Apr 20 15:54:40 Battery status? Apr 20 15:54:48 AStorm, the problem is that the commands available in the tablet OS have fewer options than the same commands in PC distributions Apr 20 15:54:53 ... Apr 20 15:54:58 gribouille: that's busybox for you Apr 20 15:55:03 you'd need coreutils Apr 20 15:55:12 and getting that requires a moderate hack :P Apr 20 15:55:20 Hehe, I hate that hack I made Apr 20 15:55:22 but works here, mostly Apr 20 15:55:26 I hate coreutils on tablet too Apr 20 15:55:28 yup Apr 20 15:55:33 why do you hate them? Apr 20 15:55:46 AStorm, what hack ? Apr 20 15:55:47 I kept getting segfaults with ls -la, mv etc Apr 20 15:55:54 Grackle: don't try it Apr 20 15:56:06 qwerty12: well, that's the price Apr 20 15:56:15 replace ls and mv with busybox symlinks then Apr 20 15:56:21 Grackle: sorry Apr 20 15:56:30 gribouille: don't try it w/o a backup Apr 20 15:56:40 AStorm, I did but I didn't want to find any suprises Apr 20 15:56:43 AStorm, I won't try it at all Apr 20 15:56:55 Dont. Apr 20 15:57:13 If I use an Internet tablet, I don't want to use the command line often Apr 20 15:57:18 heh Apr 20 15:57:32 Well, so do I. But... Apr 20 15:57:37 just when it is absolutely necessary Apr 20 15:57:40 But I have to, devel and such :P Apr 20 15:57:49 I actually prefer the command line Apr 20 15:57:56 qwerty12, so do I Apr 20 15:57:57 and I want lighttpd too :> Apr 20 15:58:12 Application Manager takes ages for something that takes me a few seconds with dpkg and apt-get Apr 20 15:58:14 AStorm, do you devel for thr tablet ? Apr 20 15:58:23 AStorm, make it so, then. http://zedstar.org/blog/2008/03/02/packaging-lighttpd-for-maemo-the-quick-way/ Apr 20 15:58:23 gribouille: not for IT, no Apr 20 15:58:33 Application Manager is really bad, it insists on indexing all the packages upon startup. Apr 20 15:58:35 GeneralAntilles: first, have to finally build the environment Apr 20 15:58:44 qwerty12: hehe, for some reason Apr 20 15:58:52 it should actually only need a cache update Apr 20 15:59:07 Yep :(. Hopefully, it will be fixed in Diablo. Apr 20 15:59:08 GeneralAntilles: the problem is lack of time Apr 20 15:59:15 AStorm, looking at GeneralAntilles link, http://zedstar.org/chinook/ Apr 20 15:59:18 qwerty12: well, svn version I have also fails :P Apr 20 15:59:26 I hate svn versions Apr 20 15:59:30 I reverted back to the old one Apr 20 15:59:34 what is the best application for music/video ? Apr 20 15:59:44 gribouille: depends, but I'd say canola2 Apr 20 15:59:52 For music, anyway. Apr 20 15:59:57 ukmp is fairly good too Apr 20 15:59:58 It's got way too much overhead for videa. Apr 20 16:00:03 video* Apr 20 16:00:03 I made a load of screenies for anyone interested what was changed in the svn I built :p Apr 20 16:00:05 not that much in fullscreen Apr 20 16:00:12 but it unfortunately scales vids Apr 20 16:00:18 (mplayer doesn't) Apr 20 16:00:25 gribouille, you need to try canola2 anyways so that you at least know what everyone is talking about Apr 20 16:00:26 :) Apr 20 16:00:30 otoh mplayer needs a config option to disable that sound delay Apr 20 16:00:33 I ask before spending time learning and configuring canola Apr 20 16:00:38 because some idiot hardcoded it Apr 20 16:00:53 280ms sound delay, stupid stupid Apr 20 16:01:00 It's gone, AStorm. Apr 20 16:01:04 AStorm, the 26 versions dont have it Apr 20 16:01:05 * Navi prefers mpd for music Apr 20 16:01:05 johnx, I tried it for youtube videos and it failed completly Apr 20 16:01:06 GeneralAntilles: in .26 Apr 20 16:01:06 Has been for a version or two. Apr 20 16:01:07 good Apr 20 16:01:15 but .26 has broken flv playback, that is, slow Apr 20 16:01:20 Even better, use Bundyo's rc2 built. MUCH MUCH BETTER Apr 20 16:01:25 flv is fixed in rc2 as well Apr 20 16:01:28 qwerty12, how so? Apr 20 16:01:29 whee Apr 20 16:01:32 Canola's YouTube plugin is hot. Apr 20 16:01:42 wmv and flv are much improved in rc2 Apr 20 16:01:42 GeneralAntilles, does it work ? Apr 20 16:01:44 gribouille, well it's only about 30 seconds to point it at some of audio and see if you like it Apr 20 16:01:44 To what degree of much better is the rc2? Apr 20 16:01:47 qwerty12: tell me a link, later, when I get my power source done :P Apr 20 16:01:51 (that is, bought) Apr 20 16:02:03 Well, for flv, seeking and sound syncing are perfect. Apr 20 16:02:12 seeking in flv? YEAH! Apr 20 16:02:20 Yep, it works properly as well :) Apr 20 16:02:31 btw, is ukmp good enough? Apr 20 16:02:38 It's always worked for me Apr 20 16:02:38 or some other nice mplayer frontend? Apr 20 16:02:38 It's old Apr 20 16:02:42 and unsupported. Apr 20 16:02:45 boo hoo Apr 20 16:02:51 we need a good mplayer frontend Apr 20 16:03:00 hell, I might hack something in Python Apr 20 16:03:02 I found the interfact awkward TBH. But like Navi, I just use mpd now. Apr 20 16:03:13 With powerlaunch, mpd is brilliant. Apr 20 16:03:15 Could be Canola if it weren't so terrible for video playback. :< Apr 20 16:03:31 johnx, the only thing it displays it "Unable to resilve video url ..." Apr 20 16:03:36 qwerty12: btw, does r'n'd mode increase power use? Apr 20 16:03:43 bug konttori about ukmp the next time you see 'em Apr 20 16:03:45 GeneralAntilles: it isn't in full screen mode, as I said Apr 20 16:03:48 but resizes vids Apr 20 16:03:48 AStorm, theoretically a little Apr 20 16:03:54 GeneralAntilles: why? Apr 20 16:03:56 In practice, I've never noticed any difference. Apr 20 16:04:16 AStorm, no afaic unless you enable serial console. Apr 20 16:04:18 for me, the only diff is the logo, and *maybe* power use Apr 20 16:04:23 qwerty12: mhm Apr 20 16:04:31 It's easier to turn on. Apr 20 16:04:41 So you could accidentally turn it on while it's off and use more power. ;) Apr 20 16:04:42 With powerlaunch, mpd is brilliant. <-- Genius Apr 20 16:04:46 :P Apr 20 16:04:51 mpd is junk Apr 20 16:04:55 we need xmms2 Apr 20 16:04:57 :-) Apr 20 16:04:58 YOUR FACE IS JUNK Apr 20 16:04:59 Navi, for sure Apr 20 16:05:01 Lol Apr 20 16:05:19 so, who will port xmms2? Apr 20 16:05:27 and mmpc makes it even more better, I just have the home button in powerlaunch set to launch mmpc Apr 20 16:05:34 hehehe Apr 20 16:05:41 I like the home button as it is Apr 20 16:05:45 xmms2 is missing good clients :/ Apr 20 16:05:46 didn't someone compile it already? Apr 20 16:05:53 That was xmms 1 afaikl Apr 20 16:05:55 Navi: nobody makes it hard to write one Apr 20 16:06:04 johnx: yup, that was xmms1 Apr 20 16:06:22 Navi: it's just that people haven't yet Apr 20 16:06:25 nah, I'm thinking xmms2, gimme a sec to find it Apr 20 16:06:34 AStorm, except the API breakage that used to come in periodic updates in xmms2 Apr 20 16:06:43 Navi: used, but doesn't anymore Apr 20 16:06:49 the api got stabler Apr 20 16:09:17 My scratchbox feels so empty now :(. So many half, unfinished projects I was working on now gone :( Apr 20 16:09:27 I wanted to finish off that port of PCMan I had. Apr 20 16:09:35 :P Apr 20 16:09:58 Hehe, here's to a new start :p Apr 20 16:10:20 This was the bit where you were meant to cry for me. :p Apr 20 16:10:22 I need to clean out my scratchbox Apr 20 16:11:17 Scratchbox Apr 20 16:11:27 Sounds like the sound a cat makes in the litterbox. :P Apr 20 16:11:44 it's just a build env Apr 20 16:11:44 $CR@TC|-||30X Apr 20 16:11:47 Sounds like a brand of mixing tables. Apr 20 16:11:51 :P Apr 20 16:11:53 I think solmumaha was the one who compiled xmms2 Apr 20 16:12:00 solmumaha, you around? Apr 20 16:12:07 blah anyway Apr 20 16:12:15 * GeneralAntilles throws a wikipedia plugin section at qwerty12. Apr 20 16:12:16 I have no Nxxx available right now Apr 20 16:12:18 There we go: http://www.rodec.be/site/content/mixers_scratchbox.asp Apr 20 16:12:37 and xmms2 doesn't do video Apr 20 16:12:40 :| Apr 20 16:12:42 GeneralAntilles, I have no idea what to write :P. I can write what plugins the community have made? Apr 20 16:12:55 Start with a list of plugins and what they do. Apr 20 16:13:03 qwerty12: gimme a home screen plugin for temperature Apr 20 16:13:04 Work from there if you get inspired. Apr 20 16:13:06 light sensor Apr 20 16:13:15 GeneralAntilles, Ok, I can do that. Apr 20 16:13:16 if not, I can write something up. Apr 20 16:13:24 1 or 2 screenshots wouldn't hurt. Apr 20 16:13:33 AStorm, it's very easy to modify one of the existing ones. Apr 20 16:13:33 Maybe Apr 20 16:13:35 and possibly battery status, esp. current drain Apr 20 16:13:45 qwerty12: which ones? linky? Apr 20 16:13:52 AStorm, there's already a homescreen applet for temp. Apr 20 16:14:00 GeneralAntilles: :) Apr 20 16:14:04 Khertan made one for the light sensor and one for temp yesterday. Apr 20 16:14:12 that's why I don't know about it Apr 20 16:14:13 :P Apr 20 16:14:24 I mentioned the fact in scrollback. :P Apr 20 16:14:26 drop me a link and I'll bookmark it Apr 20 16:14:34 It's in extras-devel Apr 20 16:14:39 ahha Apr 20 16:14:41 with the rest of the "Home" stuff. Apr 20 16:14:47 then hopefully tomorrow I'll test it Apr 20 16:14:58 ah! woo! I didn't catch that part! that's nice... Apr 20 16:15:00 btw, I'd like a larger clock applet too Apr 20 16:15:19 maybe, a clock screen saver? Apr 20 16:15:27 (w/o backlight) Apr 20 16:15:27 There's an application Apr 20 16:15:38 mclock I think... Apr 20 16:15:41 ^ Apr 20 16:15:52 ooh, homewifilevel and home internal temp looks nice Apr 20 16:16:12 :D we need homefortune! Apr 20 16:16:19 Suggest it, johnx. Apr 20 16:16:25 I'm sure he'll put it together. Apr 20 16:16:30 GeneralAntilles: OS2007? Apr 20 16:16:32 actually, I should try and do it myself Apr 20 16:16:37 OS2008. Apr 20 16:16:43 * johnx needs an excuse to dig into python Apr 20 16:16:55 print "Hello World" Apr 20 16:17:02 secks Apr 20 16:17:04 mclock needs backlight, duh Apr 20 16:17:17 Anything'll need backlight to be able to see it. Apr 20 16:17:21 nope Apr 20 16:17:23 secks with a python? Apr 20 16:17:31 I want some method to keep LCD on Apr 20 16:17:34 but backlight = 0 Apr 20 16:17:40 like advanced backlight control does Apr 20 16:17:56 Plug it in, turn off the backlight. Apr 20 16:17:57 it's readable with high contrast and external light :P Apr 20 16:18:05 GeneralAntilles: plug it in = no, no Apr 20 16:18:06 AStorm, tried moredimming options? Set the backlight timeout to low and lcd timeout to 24 hours. Apr 20 16:18:16 qwerty12: moredimming.... hmmm :-) Apr 20 16:18:35 If you have gconf-editor, you can do it yourself :) Apr 20 16:18:47 googling returned zilch Apr 20 16:18:58 http://maemo.org/downloads/product/OS2007/moredimmingoptions/ Apr 20 16:19:01 me bad Apr 20 16:19:02 http://maemo.org/downloads/product/OS2008/moredimmingoptions/ Apr 20 16:19:12 it's 2 double 0 8 :p Apr 20 16:19:28 Although they undeniably link to the same deb >.< Apr 20 16:19:31 :-) Apr 20 16:19:44 well Apr 20 16:19:55 does it make dimming go to 0 light? Apr 20 16:20:18 ah, I'd need to disable screen shutdown on keyboard lock too Apr 20 16:28:28 can someone tell me what color-ls does exactly ? Apr 20 16:28:55 installs a file that allows coloring of ls output Apr 20 16:28:58 :> Apr 20 16:29:07 DIR_COLORS or something Apr 20 16:29:09 Exactly what it says on the tin. Apr 20 16:29:32 the package contains only /bin/ls.color Apr 20 16:29:36 sends you colored screen overlays in the mail... Apr 20 16:29:50 it gives me a good time Apr 20 16:30:20 I want a company that provides ssh by mail. Apr 20 16:33:45 GeneralAntilles: rotfl Apr 20 16:34:53 MITM attacks are bad. damn that mailman Apr 20 16:34:55 how can I add a new mime type ? Apr 20 16:35:28 "package contains one (1) ssh server and one (1) ssh client, do not bend spindle, fold or mutilate." Apr 20 16:36:22 package actually sends the first IP packet over mail devliery network. GeneralAntilles must Ack by postcard. Apr 20 16:36:27 GeneralAntilles, I've made a very ugly plugins section. Could do with a lot of clean up. I was and did add links but wikipedia went into read only mode. Fucking idiots. Apr 20 16:36:39 Just send it again Apr 20 16:36:43 I would upload a picture but I dont have permissions. Apr 20 16:36:44 It only lasts a few seconds. Apr 20 16:36:50 You registered? Apr 20 16:37:07 Yes but I have to wait 4 days before I am a "confirmed user" Apr 20 16:37:26 Ha Apr 20 16:37:33 with a name like qwerty12 you could be confused for a spambot ;) Apr 20 16:37:56 GeneralAntilles got through all the beurocratic bullshit because he is in the military ;) Apr 20 16:38:05 When I started using it (few years back) out of randomness, it wasn't common but now there is a virus called qwerty12.exe :( Apr 20 16:38:07 :p Apr 20 16:38:26 :( your work of art is out there :P Apr 20 16:38:38 If only I could program... :p Apr 20 16:38:40 yeah, I saw it on this forum I visit, ITT or something... :P Apr 20 16:38:42 "The worlds first nokia maemo platform virus Apr 20 16:39:05 would actually be very easy Apr 20 16:40:36 lcuk: I suggest using RFC1149 Apr 20 16:40:39 Oh yeah, can anyone confirm if Rapier uses Sword (the Sword project or something like that)? Apr 20 16:41:31 IPoAC Apr 20 16:41:31 :-) Apr 20 16:41:42 :) astorm Apr 20 16:41:52 does anyone know how many pixels the N800 camera has ? Apr 20 16:42:01 Not much. Apr 20 16:42:03 gribouille: I guess 1,2 mpix Apr 20 16:42:05 3 Apr 20 16:42:09 9 Apr 20 16:42:14 ah, that :> Apr 20 16:42:15 but 6 are snow Apr 20 16:42:23 640*480 Apr 20 16:42:33 mhm, 0,8 mpix? junk ;P Apr 20 16:42:47 its frustrating, i wanna play with the came but i cant be arsed setting up the base snap code Apr 20 16:42:49 0,3 mpix Apr 20 16:43:00 even more junk Apr 20 16:43:02 :P Apr 20 16:43:03 cam Apr 20 16:43:18 anyway, it's a webcam, not a camera Apr 20 16:43:21 yer if i can just call a function to take a picture i would start to use it Apr 20 16:43:28 just one frame then Apr 20 16:43:44 * lcuk is in a pondering mood Apr 20 16:44:10 virus on the NIT? Apr 20 16:44:14 is it possible to record videos with the cam ? Apr 20 16:44:17 anyone fancy downloading my port of the gimp? Apr 20 16:44:17 OMGVIRUS Apr 20 16:44:24 * MangoFusion looks decidedly evil Apr 20 16:44:27 MangoFusion, does it run like suck? Apr 20 16:44:35 It's a virus Apr 20 16:44:36 RUN FOR THE HILLS! Apr 20 16:44:38 It runs great, Navi. Apr 20 16:44:47 Liar Apr 20 16:44:55 nah just installs a bit of spyware, formats your sd cards, and makes large farting noises Apr 20 16:45:12 im in Apr 20 16:45:21 hah - that has to be a sample for the music thing - the harder you hit your NIT the louder it farts Apr 20 16:45:35 (sorry, am pondering music as well.. but thats for another day) Apr 20 16:46:27 does video work with wkype ? Apr 20 16:46:31 the screen can read pressure data? Apr 20 16:46:32 skype Apr 20 16:46:33 gribouille: no Apr 20 16:46:37 because it's skype 1.4 Apr 20 16:46:40 but why ? Apr 20 16:46:40 storm, yes Apr 20 16:46:44 coupled with cruddy codec Apr 20 16:46:52 G.174 or so Apr 20 16:46:58 lcuk: is there a new beta? Apr 20 16:47:00 will it work one day ? Apr 20 16:47:10 gribouille: when skype writes an app Apr 20 16:47:14 no ill find you the howto Apr 20 16:47:18 lcuk: gimme Apr 20 16:47:32 I want one to stop skype disconnecting on any tablet usage :> Apr 20 16:47:48 AStorm, but normally, video works with skype Apr 20 16:48:03 gribouille: but not on IT Apr 20 16:48:06 ... Apr 20 16:48:12 at least, not with the version I have Apr 20 16:48:29 Linux Skype 2.x works fine with video and sound Apr 20 16:48:37 but still uses weird amounts of CPU Apr 20 16:48:43 what's missing to make it work ? Apr 20 16:48:46 for what it does, it eats a lot Apr 20 16:48:47 gribouille, for some reason the skype guys haven't bothered to get video working on the n8x0. That's their choice. Apr 20 16:48:51 gribouille: Skype source code ;P Apr 20 16:49:09 actually, a rebuild of Skype 2.x for Maemo Apr 20 16:49:18 but then, 2.x isn't released for Linux yet Apr 20 16:49:36 what's missing: a paid, motivated programmer with access to skype source code Apr 20 16:49:38 and we'd need them to implement their audio codecs properly Apr 20 16:49:55 they suck at it Apr 20 16:50:07 totally unoptimized, choke sometimes on C2D Apr 20 16:50:19 in other words: they can't code Apr 20 16:50:52 and they can't use usual frameworks too Apr 20 16:50:54 AStorm, http://maemo.org/community/wiki/howto_usetouchscreenpressuredata/ Apr 20 16:51:00 I think they've gotten complacent... Apr 20 16:51:01 lcuk: :-) Apr 20 16:51:27 I prefer standards-based VOIP to proprietary solutions, myself. Apr 20 16:51:29 its also available i believe from within python, but that might have been lost in the sands of ummm time (about 3 months) Apr 20 16:51:34 lcuk: do you have a workaround for Hildon to use AccessX? Apr 20 16:51:42 and switching it on by default in hold mode? Apr 20 16:51:44 :-) Apr 20 16:51:55 what is this accessx you speak of? (I hope its not an access database) Apr 20 16:52:00 it's X extension Apr 20 16:52:04 for what Apr 20 16:52:05 available in Xomap too Apr 20 16:52:12 for keyboard accessibility Apr 20 16:52:14 sticky keys Apr 20 16:52:16 etc. Apr 20 16:52:28 dunno at all, i havent even seen how the keyboard works or anything Apr 20 16:52:38 accessx, have you got a build? sounds useful for a tablet. Apr 20 16:52:44 qwerty12: it's in Xomap Apr 20 16:52:49 * lcuk assumes some magic happens and i get keyboard events Apr 20 16:52:51 switch it on by adding +accessx option Apr 20 16:52:56 back later Apr 20 16:53:01 lcuk: actually, it's a real hw keyboard Apr 20 16:53:02 Ah, thanks :) Apr 20 16:53:19 qwerty12: 5x shift key enables sticky keys Apr 20 16:53:31 that includes ALL modifiers Apr 20 16:53:56 and that double key press hold enabler Apr 20 16:54:00 like Hildon does Apr 20 16:54:08 but less sucky, as it's X server feature Apr 20 16:54:29 Ah ok, but I'll have to use XVKBD then as I'm on N800. Apr 20 16:54:39 well :P Apr 20 16:54:46 not with a bluetooth keyboard Apr 20 16:54:57 I want sticky keys enabled by default Apr 20 16:55:07 just that - it doesn't collide with Hildon at all Apr 20 16:55:19 hmm. If I had sticky ctrl, I could give up my left one... Apr 20 16:56:00 also, I would have to disable toggle sequences too Apr 20 16:57:06 I don't know why Nokia didn't use that Apr 20 16:57:16 probably they didn't research enough Apr 20 17:03:09 We need to get Nokia to improve that part. Apr 20 17:04:34 Ha anybody bothered to file a bug? Apr 20 17:05:58 Does anyone have a 3G USB Modem (for "mobile broadband" as is touted in this country): if so, could someone try it with an N8*0: http://www.internettablettalk.com/forums/showthread.php?p=172282 Apr 20 17:11:54 GeneralAntilles: could you file a bug for me? :-) Apr 20 17:11:59 No Apr 20 17:12:06 I'll confirm it and vote for it, though. :P Apr 20 17:12:10 hmmhmm Apr 20 17:16:42 while they're at it, they could increase autorepeat delay Apr 20 17:17:38 Better yet, give us a GUI slider. Apr 20 17:19:16 ew Apr 20 17:19:42 Navi, what? your slider all GUI? Apr 20 17:20:11 My slider is telepathically controlled Apr 20 17:20:36 a little box where you can select the delay in ms would be nice really... Apr 20 17:20:46 delay for what? Apr 20 17:20:52 autorepeat Apr 20 17:20:52 I haven't been reading Apr 20 17:20:53 key repeat Apr 20 17:20:54 ah Apr 20 17:21:02 * GeneralAntilles pokes Navi with a stick. Apr 20 17:21:17 There's probably a gconf setting for it or something Apr 20 17:21:22 Navi: nope Apr 20 17:21:25 Aw :( Apr 20 17:21:26 but there is xset Apr 20 17:21:30 yay \o/ Apr 20 17:21:50 we should turn johnx into a slider Apr 20 17:22:14 He's one already :P Apr 20 17:22:17 woo! if *anyone* suggests this to Nokia as a wishlist *please* tell them about xset so they don't manage to create a closed source replacement O_o Apr 20 17:22:29 Heh Apr 20 17:22:40 Somebody file some bugs. Apr 20 17:22:51 Bitching in #maemo is not an effective way to get Nokia to do things. Apr 20 17:22:54 yeah, they have something of a NIH attitude Apr 20 17:22:58 Anyways, anyone know how kde is launched on the N800? Apr 20 17:23:05 * johnx sets slider mode: snarky |---+--------| ornery Apr 20 17:23:08 Navi: as usual Apr 20 17:23:18 not the click the menu thing specifics, but the technical stop hildon-desktop specifics Apr 20 17:23:23 it's Debian Apr 20 17:23:32 Not Maemo at all. Apr 20 17:24:00 I've never run Debian or it's derivatives for a long span of time Apr 20 17:24:14 Maemo is Debian-based Apr 20 17:24:19 so, you lie Apr 20 17:24:24 not including maemo, fine. Apr 20 17:24:49 do they just do /etc/init.d/whatever stop ? Apr 20 17:24:56 Anyways, I've looked up what penguinbait did in OS2007 Apr 20 17:24:57 does that actually work and not result in reboots? Apr 20 17:25:04 and I can stop hildon-desktop Apr 20 17:25:18 but trying it with matchbox doesn't work Apr 20 17:25:21 it just respawns itself Apr 20 17:25:35 and replacing it right when matchbox is down causes a reboot Apr 20 17:25:47 Navi: just a simple mod of init script away Apr 20 17:25:49 Navi fails hard. Apr 20 17:25:54 GeneralAntilles, agreed Apr 20 17:26:04 AStorm, how do you do it? Apr 20 17:26:05 and it's /etc/rc.d Apr 20 17:26:29 Navi: find the initscript and mod the line with dsmetool Apr 20 17:26:37 AStorm, what is /etc/rc.d ? Apr 20 17:26:43 dsmetool is the autorebooter and restarter watchdog Apr 20 17:26:47 johnx: rc.d :P Apr 20 17:26:54 init script dir Apr 20 17:26:57 init scripts are thrown in there Apr 20 17:26:59 too much BSD lately :P Apr 20 17:27:08 ls: /etc/rc.d: No such file or directory :P Apr 20 17:27:22 johnx: as I said, too much BSD lately :P Apr 20 17:27:26 aaah Apr 20 17:27:27 there are multiple rc directories Apr 20 17:27:42 Navi, /etc/init.d has the real stuff Apr 20 17:27:45 yup, rc.0 - rc.6 and rc.S Apr 20 17:27:48 the rcN.d is just symlinks Apr 20 17:27:52 yup Apr 20 17:27:57 but important ones Apr 20 17:28:03 Well, the maemo init scripts and crap are in osso-af-init Apr 20 17:28:10 more or less Apr 20 17:28:18 right, but they're *called* from scripts in init.d Apr 20 17:28:21 still, nokia needs a bash on head for dsmetool Apr 20 17:28:26 stupid software daemon Apr 20 17:28:31 and bme Apr 20 17:28:37 they should've used Linux kernel watchdogs instead Apr 20 17:28:52 they should have used *anything* instead of bme Apr 20 17:28:59 another hit on the head is retu* Apr 20 17:29:10 I guess it's stupid TI NDA Apr 20 17:29:20 so uh, how exactly do you use dsmetool? :/ Apr 20 17:29:35 Navi: you don't - that's how you prevent matchbox from restarting Apr 20 17:29:44 or the device from rebooting when X server fails Apr 20 17:29:49 you make sure it doesn't get launched by dsmetool Apr 20 17:29:49 and other things Apr 20 17:30:09 dsmetool watches things waiting for them to die and then if they do it freaks the hell out and reboots Apr 20 17:30:14 I find matchbox to be restarting quite often Apr 20 17:30:15 mmk Apr 20 17:30:22 ...to use some technical language... Apr 20 17:30:25 johnx: or restarts the program in question Apr 20 17:30:33 that depends on the option Apr 20 17:30:41 btw, why is that matchbox so crashy? Apr 20 17:31:03 hmm? I've never had matchbox crash on zaurus or nokia... Apr 20 17:31:03 crashes at least once a day Apr 20 17:31:15 maybe it's some applet that makes it crash? Apr 20 17:31:21 btw, dsmetool has at least a vaguel useful help text Apr 20 17:31:27 johnx: :> Apr 20 17:31:38 that was more aimed at Navi Apr 20 17:32:39 btw, I should be able to design a better environment that that matchbox Apr 20 17:32:45 *than Apr 20 17:33:13 So uh, how do I prevent dsmetool from running scratchbox? I'm thoroughly confused. Apr 20 17:33:20 from what? Apr 20 17:33:26 you mean, restarting matchbox? Apr 20 17:33:29 Yeah Apr 20 17:33:36 remove it from the line that starts it Apr 20 17:33:38 :-) Apr 20 17:33:49 grep matchbox /etc/init.d/* | grep dsmetool Apr 20 17:33:50 (its options too) Apr 20 17:33:51 Can't find the init script that starts matchbox Apr 20 17:33:56 ... Apr 20 17:34:03 shotgun approach Apr 20 17:34:12 Navi: find /etc | xargs grep -Hn matchbox Apr 20 17:34:20 if there is xargs on it Apr 20 17:34:24 I think there is Apr 20 17:34:53 johnx, fail Apr 20 17:35:20 it's /etc/osso-af-init/matchbox.sh Apr 20 17:35:28 whee Apr 20 17:35:38 there's no references to dsmetool in there Apr 20 17:35:53 except that one comment line Apr 20 17:35:54 what do you think that variable that launches PROG is? Apr 20 17:36:06 ~lart Nokia for their non-standard init scripts Apr 20 17:36:06 * infobot takes out Nokia with the trash for their non-standard init scripts Apr 20 17:36:14 btw, where can I grab a table charger for that battery BP-4L? Apr 20 17:36:27 ebay? Apr 20 17:36:28 the one for N810 Apr 20 17:36:35 johnx: wrong country :/ Apr 20 17:36:46 local ebay equivalent? Apr 20 17:36:52 unavailable :| Apr 20 17:37:01 why no one produces that? Apr 20 17:37:03 (you're not missing much...) Apr 20 17:37:05 hold up a Nokia shop? Apr 20 17:37:12 no such thing there Apr 20 17:37:31 I can't find one on the net, except some OEM thingy Apr 20 17:37:35 that supposedly works Apr 20 17:37:40 but can't buy it anywhere Apr 20 17:38:43 btw, is the battery smart? (That is, charge circuitry inside) Apr 20 17:39:13 That's a question I'd like answered as well Apr 20 17:39:22 Astorm: it is Apr 20 17:39:26 if it's stupid, I'd need exact charge specs Apr 20 17:39:35 if not, I can build a 3,7V charger just fine Apr 20 17:39:59 or adapt an existing one Apr 20 17:40:14 (that is, mod the case and pins) Apr 20 17:41:39 ~lart Nokia for using micro-star screws Apr 20 17:41:40 * infobot slaps Nokia upside and over the head with one freakishly huge killer whale named hugh for using micro-star screws Apr 20 17:42:43 100 screwdrivers and I still don't have that one Apr 20 17:42:55 You need a better set. Apr 20 17:43:14 I do have one Apr 20 17:43:23 I just don't have a star that small :P Apr 20 17:44:06 fortunately, can unscrew it with flat one :> Apr 20 17:46:20 AStorm: If I understand things correctly, you only need to replace the jack, not the power supply? Apr 20 17:47:59 more or less Apr 20 17:48:28 I'd personally use a microjack plug, should fit Apr 20 17:48:50 but Nokia thought well about those chargers needing a lot of replacement Apr 20 17:49:14 I wonder why they didn't provide USB charging Apr 20 17:49:25 that's exactly 0,25 of a chip ;P Apr 20 17:49:59 Astorm: they have a Usb Adapter for the them lol although a bit annoying Apr 20 17:50:06 yup Apr 20 17:50:09 have you seen their USB connector? Apr 20 17:50:20 Do you really want to break and have to replace THAT? Apr 20 17:51:19 usb wouldn't break Apr 20 17:51:23 it's large enough Apr 20 17:51:34 I've never managed to break a Nokia barrel charger. <_< Apr 20 17:52:00 I haven't either, it's the first time I've heard of being a problem Apr 20 17:52:02 I managed to break the plug. Twice. Apr 20 17:52:18 Maybe I'm unlucky or handling it too roughly ;P Apr 20 17:52:27 Likely Apr 20 17:52:34 I haven't exactly handled mine gently, either, though. Apr 20 17:52:44 sounds like my luck with cell phones flying onto the highway Apr 20 17:52:50 I feel more comfortable with the bigger zaurus/psp charger, but my n800 charger hasn't broken yet... Apr 20 17:53:09 just the "barrel" part I mean... Apr 20 17:54:07 does N800 have that flimsy 1mm 5V plug, or the older one? Apr 20 17:54:21 Now Nokia is required by Chinese to use USB port for charging ;P Apr 20 17:54:32 All Internet Tablets have exactly the same plug. Apr 20 17:55:23 argh Apr 20 17:55:47 the problem is that getting these chargers here (Poland) is hard Apr 20 17:55:47 Anybody know anything about "Imendio"? http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Maemo Apr 20 17:55:50 See the infobox. :\ Apr 20 17:56:24 GeneralAntilles: these are the guys after that gnome communicator or something Apr 20 17:57:00 johnx: yes Apr 20 17:58:37 hmm, not much to see inside N810 Apr 20 17:58:51 hrm? Apr 20 17:58:53 not much there :p Apr 20 17:59:10 apart from a LOT of free space Apr 20 17:59:23 gah Apr 20 17:59:33 they could've easily retained that FM radio Apr 20 17:59:40 and added zillion other things Apr 20 17:59:43 imendio are the guys who do the gtk port for mac os x Apr 20 17:59:49 4 cm^2 free Apr 20 17:59:52 amongst other things Apr 20 18:00:02 i dont even use fmradio tbh Apr 20 18:00:33 me neither.. Apr 20 18:00:43 Actually.. I've never used it o.O Apr 20 18:00:58 in my n95 i have a radio, gps, and wifi. muhahaha Apr 20 18:01:18 hurray for you? Apr 20 18:01:39 and you use none? Apr 20 18:01:43 not a good idea to turn them all on at the same time though, mind you Apr 20 18:01:47 gps is the same junk as in N810 Apr 20 18:01:54 didn't even realise it had a radio till today Apr 20 18:02:00 ;) Apr 20 18:02:05 lol Apr 20 18:02:08 AStorm, but hooked up to AGPS service in this case, IIRC Apr 20 18:02:24 no AGPS here, so... Apr 20 18:02:25 :P Apr 20 18:02:43 there's a minor problem... I can't unscrew the two screws holding the keyboard Apr 20 18:02:50 another diff. screw, even weirder Apr 20 18:03:06 hrm.. any clue where the images for the status bar icons are kept? Apr 20 18:03:07 ah, yes, microstar-b Apr 20 18:03:16 General: Is it some new way to spam through Wiki? Apr 20 18:03:32 I dunno Apr 20 18:03:58 ImMelody: /usr/share/icons/hicolor/hildon afair Apr 20 18:04:14 ^ Apr 20 18:04:35 thanks Apr 20 18:04:37 Just grab the icons directory and all its subdirectories with sftp or something Apr 20 18:04:44 makes icon work a bit easier. Apr 20 18:04:46 blah Apr 20 18:04:54 my tiny flat screwdriver can't grab it Apr 20 18:05:35 With the help of those HomeXXX apps, I've finally decided I can go through with my little pet project Apr 20 18:06:02 homexxx? Apr 20 18:06:08 excuse me Apr 20 18:06:20 homeip, homewifi, homenetstats Apr 20 18:06:37 Capital X's make that bad. :P Apr 20 18:06:56 lol, what i was thinking ;p Apr 20 18:06:58 Sorry.. No desktop porn yet for the n8x0 Apr 20 18:07:10 Boys ;p Apr 20 18:08:22 argh! Apr 20 18:08:33 the keys are mounted on a single piece of plastic Apr 20 18:08:38 AStorm: dissappointed? :p Apr 20 18:08:51 no way to change the layout Apr 20 18:08:57 Paint! Apr 20 18:09:21 won't hold Apr 20 18:09:22 HAHA Apr 20 18:09:29 Buy better paint! Apr 20 18:11:54 AStorm: USB charging is not supplied because USB can provide a maximum of 500mA, and the IT pulls more than that Apr 20 18:13:17 General, do you think doing three sets of icons would be easiest? one blue signifying when bluetooth is connected and one green when it's not, and like white when bluetooth is off totally? (if you remember what I'm up to) Apr 20 18:13:30 elb: blah blah Apr 20 18:13:35 there is a charger Apr 20 18:13:47 and N810 lives on 650 mA Apr 20 18:14:19 and 650mA > 500mA ;-) Apr 20 18:14:22 ImMelody, there was a significant amount of discussion on the icon coloring and usability for Bluetooth. Apr 20 18:14:30 I don't recall what the result of that was right now Apr 20 18:14:38 I suspect future generations will charge by USB, as power requirements are brought down Apr 20 18:14:43 But I'd say, blue: on and connected, white: on, gray: off Apr 20 18:14:58 and a redslash gray icon for offline mode. Apr 20 18:15:08 right Apr 20 18:15:19 but doesn't the icon disappear when bt is off? Apr 20 18:15:22 I couldn't remember the coloring everyone else thought either Apr 20 18:15:40 ok, power plug is easily replacable Apr 20 18:15:41 :> Apr 20 18:15:43 I'm trying to make a new statusbar icon Apr 20 18:15:50 uhm, power socket Apr 20 18:15:53 With the default applet, qwerty12_N800. Apr 20 18:15:55 connected by two pins Apr 20 18:16:13 not pins Apr 20 18:16:19 GeneralAntilles: is another being made? Apr 20 18:16:23 slide-on ports Apr 20 18:16:30 or what its called Apr 20 18:16:39 GeneralAntilles, it's happening right around you. :P Apr 20 18:16:51 qwerty, it's something I've been on and off working on for a few months now Apr 20 18:16:55 qwerty12_N800: qwerty12_N800 really? Apr 20 18:17:03 ImMelody: great :) Apr 20 18:17:11 s/GeneralAntilles/qwerty12_N800/ Apr 20 18:17:13 GeneralAntilles meant: qwerty12_N800, it's happening right around you. :P Apr 20 18:17:20 Combining wifi and bluetooth together Apr 20 18:17:39 using the colors to signify whether or not the bluetooth is on.. then having a signal strength for the wifi Apr 20 18:17:51 there is both wifi and bluetooth antenna Apr 20 18:17:57 but not GPS one Apr 20 18:18:11 That does sound good, I went and removed the wifi icon of my statusbar today Apr 20 18:18:28 It's too bad the icons are the easy part. Apr 20 18:18:36 yeah :( Apr 20 18:19:02 but hopefully with Khertan's apps, I'll be able to get a little further Apr 20 18:19:49 actually, rouing USB to power port would be easy Apr 20 18:20:02 adding a switch would be hard though Apr 20 18:20:03 yeah, hasn't someone done it before? Apr 20 18:20:07 AStorm, people have done it. Apr 20 18:20:44 where did they add the switch? Apr 20 18:20:53 and I'm talking about N810 Apr 20 18:21:17 it should be largely similar to the N800, no? Apr 20 18:22:07 I'm sure there is a GPS antenna Apr 20 18:22:10 but it's probably a patch Apr 20 18:22:16 nope Apr 20 18:22:30 it'll just look like a small square Apr 20 18:22:35 it could be on top of the GPS chip itself Apr 20 18:22:45 (though that would be a pretty small antenna) Apr 20 18:24:06 nope, the gps has an antenna micro whatit' called port Apr 20 18:24:15 the one wifi uses Apr 20 18:24:20 not connected Apr 20 18:24:28 yes, but that's probably not the only port Apr 20 18:24:29 do I smell a mod? Apr 20 18:24:36 it wouldn't work at *all* if it had no antenna whatsoever Apr 20 18:24:59 no, why? Apr 20 18:25:17 reception would simply be too poor Apr 20 18:25:21 particularly inside that metal case Apr 20 18:25:47 it's plastic Apr 20 18:25:48 you don't see a ceramic square anywhere inside the case? Apr 20 18:25:55 the n810? Apr 20 18:25:58 it's at least metallized Apr 20 18:26:05 yup Apr 20 18:26:31 Both GPS and WiFi antennas should be in the left upper corner of N810 Apr 20 18:26:37 At least this is what the manual says Apr 20 18:27:03 they might be able to share antennae, even, although that would be kind of surprising to me Apr 20 18:27:20 receive-only antennae are not as picky as those which have to transmit Apr 20 18:27:25 I see the antennas in the top part of the device Apr 20 18:27:35 the black plastic strip has them Apr 20 18:27:44 but I think one is wifi Apr 20 18:27:47 the other BT Apr 20 18:27:51 and no GPS Apr 20 18:27:58 bluetooth probably doesn't have an antenna you can distinguish Apr 20 18:28:29 it could be simply a trace on the circuit board Apr 20 18:28:46 no traces visible Apr 20 18:28:56 it doesn't have to be visible Apr 20 18:28:59 every chip is nicely insulated, each has a cage Apr 20 18:29:01 RF doesn't care ;-) Apr 20 18:29:30 so, the point is, physical reality dictates that there is a GPS antenna *somewhere* Apr 20 18:29:35 whether or not you can locate it Apr 20 18:30:10 wait Apr 20 18:30:28 there is a strip of gold or cu Apr 20 18:31:23 aaaand... Apr 20 18:31:50 the whole screen has a back from aluminum Apr 20 18:32:28 if that strip is zig-zag and occupies 1cmx.5cm or so, it's almost certainly a bluetooth antenna Apr 20 18:32:48 it's straight Apr 20 18:33:04 then I don't know Apr 20 18:33:11 0,5mm x 2cm Apr 20 18:33:19 blah Apr 20 18:33:26 there's no reason a bluetooth antenna has to be zig-zag, of course Apr 20 18:33:26 2mm x2cm Apr 20 18:33:42 but they typically are, to save space Apr 20 18:33:55 hehe Apr 20 18:33:58 RF gets wonky at those frequencies Apr 20 18:34:04 that is certainly GPS antenna Apr 20 18:34:17 no, the GPS antenna won't be a trace Apr 20 18:34:20 the BT antenna is close to battery Apr 20 18:34:24 it's probably a patch Apr 20 18:34:33 it IS a patch Apr 20 18:34:38 not a trace Apr 20 18:34:48 I think you don't know what a patch antenna is ;-) Apr 20 18:34:59 it's really tiny Apr 20 18:34:59 it would be square, and have visible cutouts in the traces Apr 20 18:35:08 and it doesn't Apr 20 18:35:15 but it's certainly NOT a BT antenna Apr 20 18:35:22 bt antenna isin the back, 100% sure Apr 20 18:35:25 http://www.alphamicrocomponents.com/components/product~line~48~id~470.asp <-- there's a picture of a GPS antenna next to a micro connector Apr 20 18:35:45 it might not be an antenna at all, of course Apr 20 18:36:13 it is in the place that affects GPS... Apr 20 18:36:18 left top corner of the device Apr 20 18:36:24 a strip of gold Apr 20 18:36:40 I can see that logic is futile here Apr 20 18:36:42 * elb checks out Apr 20 18:36:59 close to left speaker Apr 20 18:38:23 or i've got it the wrong way around Apr 20 18:39:01 there is something close to gps chip... that touches its shielding Apr 20 18:39:13 might be the antenna too, size iscorrect Apr 20 18:39:25 just right to the battery port Apr 20 18:39:37 Can you simply show us the image of the damn thing? Apr 20 18:39:45 yup, wait Apr 20 18:39:57 sorry for webcam quality Apr 20 18:44:14 have to grab gqcam first... Apr 20 18:44:46 nah, w3cam is better Apr 20 18:46:50 ok, bt antenna is by the lock key apparently Apr 20 18:47:18 a small chip, 1cmx2mm Apr 20 18:47:23 x1mm Apr 20 18:47:43 nah, wrong Apr 20 18:47:49 just the lock switch :P Apr 20 18:53:12 is there nokia porn going on that im missing out on. i wanna see a stripped down 810 Apr 20 18:53:39 elb,astorm wakey wakey.. ^ Apr 20 18:54:20 lcdd: .... Apr 20 18:54:23 lcuk: :> Apr 20 18:54:24 heh I don't have the disassembled unit, AStorm does :-) Apr 20 18:54:29 in a while Apr 20 18:54:38 right now, I'm setting up the webcam Apr 20 18:54:57 vidcat is ok, but doesn't give time for cam to autoadjust the brightness Apr 20 18:55:03 sod the webcam, wheres the mood lighting and get that nokia a drink. i wanna see it from all angles Apr 20 18:55:37 * qwerty12_N800 is getting excited over this talk of nokia porn Apr 20 18:56:20 AStorm: Plan on distributing a dvd? :p Apr 20 18:56:21 * johnx is getting skeered. :sleeps instead of waiting around to see where this goes: Apr 20 18:56:24 qwerty12_N800: lol Apr 20 18:56:37 well i dont think anyones ever seen beneath its cover before, the most its done is lifted its screen and shown a bit of ankle Apr 20 18:56:49 hehehe Apr 20 18:57:56 if you tell me how to NOT photograph myself while grabbing vid with mplayer, then... maybe a vid Apr 20 18:58:00 might i ask, why are you invading her privacy? Apr 20 18:58:09 because of the power socket Apr 20 18:58:15 There's are enough dissection pics online. Apr 20 18:58:25 GeneralAntilles: of N810, or N800? ;P Apr 20 18:58:27 of the 810? Apr 20 18:58:29 Am I the only one that has thought of my nokia as a guy? Apr 20 18:58:30 Both Apr 20 18:58:33 goodie Apr 20 18:58:40 ImMelody: hehehe Apr 20 18:58:41 Heck, the FCC docs have all sorts of pictures of the board. Apr 20 18:58:44 probably, because I think of mine as an inanimate object Apr 20 18:58:45 yup Apr 20 18:58:50 GeneralAntilles: board, sure Apr 20 18:58:51 Haha, elb. Apr 20 18:59:08 Well, i consider mine both, as it has a hole and an ejecting camera Apr 20 18:59:11 do they have pics of the various antennas? Apr 20 18:59:13 I think my nokia is very masculine Apr 20 18:59:25 qwerty12_N800: N810 doesn't have the ejecting camera Apr 20 18:59:27 :P Apr 20 18:59:36 you have to stroke the nokia gently. you cannot be rough with it at all Apr 20 18:59:42 qwerty12_N800: you realize, guys have a hole too, right? ;) Apr 20 18:59:55 so what happened to the power port Apr 20 19:00:02 nothing Apr 20 19:00:09 I'm mad at the plugs breaking Apr 20 19:00:10 ImMelody: Of course, it's how the air gets to my brain! Apr 20 19:00:25 and there's enough space for the larger variant Apr 20 19:00:39 it's easily replacable, the socket Apr 20 19:00:52 lol Apr 20 19:01:12 hmmm upgrades! Apr 20 19:01:19 :> Apr 20 19:01:30 AStorm, Nokia tends to use the same components across their product lines Apr 20 19:01:32 it costs less money Apr 20 19:01:41 yup Apr 20 19:01:43 The fat plug has been phased out. Apr 20 19:01:47 yes Apr 20 19:01:54 USB plug has been phased in Apr 20 19:02:02 thus I need an USB charge mod Apr 20 19:02:03 GeneralAntilles, show me a pic of an 810 before astorm then Apr 20 19:02:09 lcuk: :> Apr 20 19:02:24 AStorm: have you had plugs actaully break? Apr 20 19:02:29 or is this theoretical? Apr 20 19:02:33 ive tried looking in the usual places Apr 20 19:02:39 who cares, dont try and talk him out of it Apr 20 19:02:49 heh Apr 20 19:03:16 it should go back together (mostly) Apr 20 19:04:39 i took apart my toshiba 6100 the other night, before i thought to go online and check i had a bed full of jigsaw pieces. when i went back online i found the guide with 3 sodding pages full of detailed pictures showing the teardown Apr 20 19:04:50 i wouldnt have started if i had known.. Apr 20 19:05:55 I broke my Pocket pc opening it. I have to press on the screen for the display with a broken backlight appears. Apr 20 19:06:19 lcuk: you should have simply googled for service manual Apr 20 19:06:33 at least ibm and dell have them Apr 20 19:06:55 elb: actually Apr 20 19:06:56 and twice Apr 20 19:07:10 And N810 is already apart, so... Apr 20 19:07:14 time for pics Apr 20 19:07:17 nokia is mia Apr 20 19:09:08 * KotCzarny goes into darkness of backlog Apr 20 19:15:56 does evince support bought pdf ebooks? i think thweres some drm crap on them Apr 20 19:16:48 No, Cptnodegard. Apr 20 19:17:13 -____- Apr 20 19:17:20 gay drm crap :( Apr 20 19:17:30 Yeah, don't support it with your money. :P Apr 20 19:17:45 couldnt find the book in #bookz on udnernet Apr 20 19:17:58 * Jaffa publishes his blog post, and thanks y'all for your help with it Apr 20 19:18:16 ok, pics done Apr 20 19:18:17 post-nemesis star trek books, apaprently too new to be there Apr 20 19:18:42 * Cptnodegard buys a kindle Apr 20 19:18:43 Ha Apr 20 19:18:45 Star Trek books. Apr 20 19:19:04 what? -__- Apr 20 19:19:20 sorry for lack of quality :> Apr 20 19:23:05 http://astralstorm.bounceme.net/n810/ Apr 20 19:24:01 unable to connect :(, i wanna see my n810 porn :p Apr 20 19:24:16 ehhh... Apr 20 19:25:16 lighttpd failing at me Apr 20 19:27:00 fcgi, to be exact Apr 20 19:28:36 now working Apr 20 19:29:33 OH YES Apr 20 19:30:08 * qwerty12_N800 is DOWNLOADING RIGHT NOW AND GETTING MY CREDIT CARD OUT Apr 20 19:30:31 :P Apr 20 19:30:40 maybe you should order a COBOL programming book while at it :-) Apr 20 19:30:43 you borked it o.o Apr 20 19:30:49 no Apr 20 19:30:54 it's just disassembled Apr 20 19:30:57 :-) Apr 20 19:31:03 reassembling now :P Apr 20 19:31:13 astorm! Apr 20 19:31:15 wait! Apr 20 19:31:19 take photos! Apr 20 19:31:22 I did Apr 20 19:31:30 there's no 810 pr0n on internet, yet Apr 20 19:31:31 KotCzarny: http://astralstorm.bounceme.net/n810/ Apr 20 19:31:32 :) Apr 20 19:31:40 sorry for bootleg quality ;P Apr 20 19:31:45 :) Apr 20 19:32:00 someone should find a chick and take real IT pr0n Apr 20 19:32:16 :P Apr 20 19:32:30 'if you look long enough you will see tits' ? Apr 20 19:32:31 :) Apr 20 19:32:55 hmm Apr 20 19:33:02 astorm, why are the pic reversed? Apr 20 19:33:04 O.o Apr 20 19:33:08 *is Apr 20 19:33:10 I'd push the n810's buttons any time... Apr 20 19:33:55 AStorm: that is highly amateurish pr0n Apr 20 19:34:33 better than nothing Apr 20 19:34:35 :) Apr 20 19:35:01 But the antennas will probably be under the white layer of plastic Apr 20 19:35:34 RST38h: nah, that's the keyboard Apr 20 19:35:37 :-) Apr 20 19:35:51 the rubber part of the keyboard lies on top of these switches Apr 20 19:35:56 :) Apr 20 19:36:11 OMG! I totally forgot to factor in data calls! Apr 20 19:36:17 * ImMelody cries Apr 20 19:36:24 :P Apr 20 19:36:31 data calls? Apr 20 19:37:01 are you on some pay-per-byte plan? Apr 20 19:37:09 lol...no Apr 20 19:37:09 reassembly 50% complete Apr 20 19:37:25 I forgot to factor in data calls when I started making my icons Apr 20 19:37:29 AStorm: which memory chip does it use? accessible? Apr 20 19:37:52 is there any diff between getting a minisd or a microsd and an adapter? Apr 20 19:38:02 other than size? Apr 20 19:38:03 :) Apr 20 19:38:07 everything is under the grills it seems Apr 20 19:38:09 wifi/adhoc/data/GPRS Apr 20 19:38:12 yeah Apr 20 19:38:39 fysa: I won't be taking these off Apr 20 19:38:45 they're real pain to mount back Apr 20 19:39:04 data is only online, connecting or off, right? Apr 20 19:39:50 reassembly 80% complete Apr 20 19:39:54 practice: 8GB cards are only available in microsd format Apr 20 19:39:57 but not minisd Apr 20 19:40:13 AStorm: severely scary stuff Apr 20 19:40:32 erm Apr 20 19:40:41 full size sd too Apr 20 19:40:42 ;) Apr 20 19:41:22 * qwerty12_N800 needs to set up localepurge again :( Apr 20 19:43:24 Well, full size sd won't fit into that hole, so it is out of consideration Apr 20 19:43:57 there are microsd to minisd adapters Apr 20 19:44:02 Why did they decide to go with miniSD instead of regular SD for 810? Apr 20 19:44:19 space Apr 20 19:44:36 there's no way a full sd would fit Apr 20 19:44:40 rst38h: drill it Apr 20 19:44:45 they could've used 2x microsd though Apr 20 19:44:52 because minisd is cooler Apr 20 19:44:52 yeah Apr 20 19:45:05 * BugBlue has actually a microsd card in his n810 Apr 20 19:45:12 * AStorm too Apr 20 19:45:31 * BugBlue awaits the first 'dual microsd to minisd' adapter at dealextreme.com (it's chinese crap but hey it works) Apr 20 19:45:37 reassembly 95% complete Apr 20 19:45:50 * KotCzarny has dual full size sd cards in his n800 Apr 20 19:45:51 :) Apr 20 19:46:17 and now I get that "shit I forgot to put those two screws in" feeling Apr 20 19:46:36 ;)) Apr 20 19:46:47 'hey, i've got spare parts' Apr 20 19:46:47 ;) Apr 20 19:47:02 'but i don't see any empty holes' Apr 20 19:47:08 exactly Apr 20 19:47:10 AStorm: that's why I make maps on paper where I get the screws from and work backwards from that map when I put it together again Apr 20 19:47:16 there are holes Apr 20 19:47:18 AStorm: laptops, mobile phones, ... Apr 20 19:47:20 inside Apr 20 19:47:40 not much work now though Apr 20 19:47:45 bugblue: ibm thinkpads have (dis)assembly manuals Apr 20 19:47:49 take a sheet of paper, draw the device (very simple) and number the screws :P Apr 20 19:48:11 KotCzarny: apple's too... and you know what the fun is, most of these manuals miss one or 2 screws Apr 20 19:48:15 damn Apr 20 19:48:18 my mobile phone is empty Apr 20 19:48:18 I know which two I forgot ;P Apr 20 19:48:21 means: IRC is empty Apr 20 19:48:29 bugblue: that's not the case in thinkpads Apr 20 19:48:29 :) Apr 20 19:50:57 lot: most hardware I touch isn't IBM hardware Apr 20 19:51:13 kot: I mean Apr 20 19:51:14 :) Apr 20 19:51:29 ofc, forgot keyboard screws :P Apr 20 19:52:35 hmm, no Apr 20 19:52:44 where do these two come from... Apr 20 19:52:53 :> Apr 20 19:53:00 maybe from another device? Apr 20 19:53:57 no, I don't use any microstar screws Apr 20 19:54:12 ahhhh, my bad Apr 20 19:54:23 no need to dismantle again Apr 20 19:54:31 from the stand Apr 20 19:54:34 :) Apr 20 19:55:26 I need to buy something to adjust my kickstand. Apr 20 19:55:28 there are exactly 6 screws in n810 Apr 20 19:55:33 It's a little loose after a year of heavy use. Apr 20 19:56:01 superglue works wonders Apr 20 19:56:06 if something is loose Apr 20 19:56:07 ;) Apr 20 19:59:45 * lcuk never uses his kickstand Apr 20 19:59:51 unless changing the battery Apr 20 20:00:11 * KotCzarny uses it sometimes during skype sessions or vid watching Apr 20 20:00:24 It's always open when it's set down on my desk. Apr 20 20:00:38 also it takes less space on desk Apr 20 20:00:39 :) Apr 20 20:03:19 i cant use the stylus with it on stand Apr 20 20:03:42 be gentle Apr 20 20:03:43 ;) Apr 20 20:04:01 using finger nails can work too Apr 20 20:04:01 lcuk, let ur shoulders lean back :p Apr 20 20:04:07 i always am but it still falls over Apr 20 20:04:16 not gentle enough :) Apr 20 20:04:42 mouse pressure reads "Are you touching me?" Apr 20 20:05:15 * lcuk looks at his stumpy chewed fingers Apr 20 20:05:25 u touchin me? huh? u touchin? *angry sounds* Apr 20 20:06:05 SEXUAL HARASSMENT, theres some guy touching me and another one stripped me before and took naughty pictures of me Apr 20 20:06:44 i wonder if the n95 will protect his sister Apr 20 20:07:45 Creepy bastard. . . . Apr 20 20:08:06 GeneralAntilles: GPRS and Data calls are either just on or off, right? Apr 20 20:08:21 GPRS, definitely. Apr 20 20:08:24 Data, I've never used. Apr 20 20:08:37 Grab the icons directory and look at 'em. Apr 20 20:08:43 blah, broke the kick stand ;P Apr 20 20:08:48 I mean, the stops Apr 20 20:08:51 lol Apr 20 20:08:51 let's see ;P Apr 20 20:08:52 how? Apr 20 20:08:57 I have them and it just has two icons.. one for GPRS and one for data call Apr 20 20:09:14 I just wanted to make 100% before just making two blue icons XD Apr 20 20:09:20 lcuk: something didn't click apparently Apr 20 20:09:23 let's see again Apr 20 20:09:57 that's what you get after getting naughty and stripping underage technology Apr 20 20:10:11 hahaha Apr 20 20:10:45 "she said she was 18" Apr 20 20:10:52 ..months Apr 20 20:10:53 AStorm: Have you taken measures btw? Apr 20 20:10:54 ;) Apr 20 20:11:03 RST38h: measures of what? Apr 20 20:11:07 I took pictures :-) Apr 20 20:11:10 AStorm: The Measures Apr 20 20:11:15 ah, these Apr 20 20:11:18 sure Apr 20 20:11:47 The Measures to prevent it from giving birth to a a hybrid monster Apr 20 20:12:04 o.o Apr 20 20:12:05 You know, the listtle OMAP-based AStorm Apr 20 20:12:12 avoid thunderstorms. Apr 20 20:12:13 s/listtle/little/ Apr 20 20:12:13 RST38h meant: You know, the little OMAP-based AStorm Apr 20 20:12:14 n810-AStorm the black sheep of the NIT family Apr 20 20:12:15 :) Apr 20 20:12:21 <_< Apr 20 20:12:43 hmm, wait, is n810 male or female? Apr 20 20:12:44 O.o Apr 20 20:12:57 and more importantly, is astorm male or female? Apr 20 20:12:59 o.O Apr 20 20:13:00 ahha, attached the stand the wrong way Apr 20 20:13:06 you don;t stroke a male as gently as you stroke your nokia internet tablet Apr 20 20:13:18 KotCzarny: I give you two guesses Apr 20 20:13:19 o.o Apr 20 20:13:35 whenever i try to be gentle stroking my man pussy he bites and claws at my hand Apr 20 20:14:00 character. Apr 20 20:14:01 :) Apr 20 20:14:14 mine is female, and bites and claws too Apr 20 20:14:42 mine are called george and lennon :D we are gettin a new cat in a few weeks called mcartney Apr 20 20:14:59 where is yoko Apr 20 20:15:00 ;) Apr 20 20:15:02 creepy Apr 20 20:15:21 N800 cannot determine the signal of a phone so i would assume it is just 2 Apr 20 20:15:21 Has anyone connected xbox controller? Fanoush's kernel has xpad driver as module. Apr 20 20:15:24 the last female cat we had was called elvis, and to say she was the neighbourhood bike was an understatement Apr 20 20:15:56 neighbourhood bike? Apr 20 20:15:57 (dont ask why she was called elvis btw..) Apr 20 20:16:09 yes, all the other cats used to ride her Apr 20 20:16:14 yay Apr 20 20:16:23 now the kickstand works better than before ;P Apr 20 20:16:29 wicked Apr 20 20:16:48 :) Apr 20 20:17:01 it will break faster Apr 20 20:17:14 i mean the clicking parts will get flat Apr 20 20:17:16 nope Apr 20 20:17:33 they're made from metal Apr 20 20:17:40 metal can get flat too Apr 20 20:17:45 sure Apr 20 20:17:51 but first, the keyboard will fail Apr 20 20:18:16 or the screen Apr 20 20:18:33 or the user Apr 20 20:18:34 :) Apr 20 20:18:44 screen works Apr 20 20:18:58 * AStorm gains 50% to his Repair skill Apr 20 20:19:00 so why did you do this again? Apr 20 20:19:24 to see how to replace the damned plug Apr 20 20:19:35 uhm, power socket Apr 20 20:19:36 has it actually broken Apr 20 20:19:41 no Apr 20 20:19:48 what broke is the plug Apr 20 20:19:49 just planning for the future Apr 20 20:19:52 exactly Apr 20 20:19:59 conversion to USB power supply Apr 20 20:20:12 btw, I saw 5 pins in micro-USB Apr 20 20:20:23 hmm, 5 wires Apr 20 20:20:27 or what you will Apr 20 20:20:32 would that work or would it fry anything in the usb if you connect both Apr 20 20:20:37 which are + and -5V? Apr 20 20:20:45 well... Apr 20 20:20:48 dont know specifically for that plug type Apr 20 20:20:51 I could put two diodes Apr 20 20:20:58 just google it Apr 20 20:20:59 so no burnup Apr 20 20:20:59 :) Apr 20 20:21:05 yer kot, it is around Apr 20 20:21:12 theres some russian connector site somewhere Apr 20 20:21:16 infact ive got links somewhere Apr 20 20:21:39 http://pinouts.ru/Devices/mini-USB_pinout.shtml Apr 20 20:22:00 confirm everything first Apr 20 20:22:05 hmm Apr 20 20:22:13 pin x is between 3 and 4 ? Apr 20 20:22:14 O.o Apr 20 20:22:51 that's mini-USB Apr 20 20:22:54 not micro-USB Apr 20 20:23:28 in n800 it's mini-usb Apr 20 20:23:30 I only care about +5V and GND Apr 20 20:24:25 these two are exposed as nice two solder points :> the 5V socket is replacable Apr 20 20:24:43 how's it called... sliding connection or whatever Apr 20 20:24:52 really crummy Apr 20 20:25:01 not connected to the board at all :> Apr 20 20:27:40 fortunately, <1 A, so it doesn't spark ;P Apr 20 20:28:58 *doesnt spark at a range visible to your eye Apr 20 20:29:30 nah, shouldn't Apr 20 20:29:34 i have always thought it's V that's important for sparks Apr 20 20:29:36 not A Apr 20 20:29:36 ;) Apr 20 20:29:52 both are Apr 20 20:30:43 not really Apr 20 20:30:47 i think Apr 20 20:31:07 unless you know something i don't Apr 20 20:39:35 high voltage low ampage can produce huge sparks (tesla coil) 10KV 250ma Apr 20 20:40:01 yes Apr 20 20:40:05 voltage defines if it will jump, afaik Apr 20 20:40:05 that's what i have said Apr 20 20:40:15 but if you provide 1000A and 0.0000001V Apr 20 20:40:21 then it won't spark Apr 20 20:40:31 no, but that shit willkill you Apr 20 20:40:41 assuming material is resistant to sparks below 1V Apr 20 20:40:50 we are talking about sparks Apr 20 20:40:56 not killing with high current Apr 20 20:40:57 :) Apr 20 20:41:15 i thought astorm had electrified his n810 as an alarm Apr 20 20:41:30 BZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZT! Owwww! Apr 20 20:41:43 :P Apr 20 20:41:48 not yet Apr 20 20:42:26 ok, time to read Micro USB pinout Apr 20 20:43:11 hmm Apr 20 20:43:25 i think electrified n810 would kill itself Apr 20 20:43:26 :) Apr 20 20:43:42 |> My Head Feels like a Frisbee - Shpongle (Tales of the Inexpressible) Apr 20 20:44:09 gooood evening everyone! Apr 20 20:44:11 i can only think of high current producing sparks as the result of wire meltdown Apr 20 20:44:12 :) Apr 20 20:44:26 wire/insulator meltdown Apr 20 20:44:32 hey people, i have just found a SPLENDID way to destroy the screen of my n800! Apr 20 20:44:45 cyberholic: hammer is the best Apr 20 20:44:50 http://www.mojocafe.net/test.html Apr 20 20:44:53 cyberholic: :> Apr 20 20:45:00 sorry. http://www.mojocafe.net/test.swf i meant Apr 20 20:45:19 hammer is the name of a german METAL-ROCK magazine *lol* Apr 20 20:45:27 i know Apr 20 20:45:31 but it's metal hammer Apr 20 20:45:32 lol Apr 20 20:45:33 afair Apr 20 20:45:34 :) Apr 20 20:45:42 And rock is wwhat you can do with the test.swf looooool Apr 20 20:45:45 unless they have changed the name Apr 20 20:46:10 kot: ya right! .... the flash performance on the n800 is so slow, that i am only able to play "we will rock you" from Queen on the test.swf :) Apr 20 20:46:17 :) Apr 20 20:46:24 cyberholic, optimize, optimize Apr 20 20:46:26 hey cyberholic you takin ideas again :P that would work better with touchscreen pressure data :P Apr 20 20:46:36 do you really need the drum app rendered with 'high' quality? Apr 20 20:46:59 lcuk: looool... touch sensitive you mean? come one! Tell me ONE rock band that is touch sensitive ;) Apr 20 20:47:05 :D you have a drum on your logo Apr 20 20:47:30 actually no i meant pressure sensitive, hold your drumsticks and drum soft or drum hard Apr 20 20:47:30 Kot: thanks a lot man! i forgot that one again! I will switch that! Apr 20 20:47:35 heh.. Apr 20 20:47:49 lcuk: i know! it's ab cow-bell because i am such a pig *lol* Apr 20 20:48:13 i keep saing your efforts would be so much more appreciated if you came to the darkside and started coding natively Apr 20 20:48:54 lcuk, ask him if he owns a nokia tablet first Apr 20 20:48:55 :) Apr 20 20:49:01 lcuk :) .... "came to the darkside" equals "get employed by NOKIA" ? *pffffff* Luke - i am your farther" *pfffffffffff* Apr 20 20:49:31 Hello Apr 20 20:49:37 wooot, then i must be employed by nokia, kot you as well, pupnik, did you know you were on the payroll, anyone else? Apr 20 20:49:42 Hello Tama.... i'm your father Tama! *pfffffffff* Apr 20 20:50:06 now I know why I am so UGLY! Apr 20 20:50:23 *rofl* ... nah ya not! I was just kidding. Apr 20 20:50:34 ugly? or his father? Apr 20 20:50:36 Hey people.... want me to add some basslines to the drum-machine? Apr 20 20:50:37 I will soon be... why not Apr 20 20:50:39 :> Apr 20 20:50:49 cyberholic: first, make the drums louder Apr 20 20:50:53 they're puny now Apr 20 20:51:01 turn them upto 11 Apr 20 20:51:06 cyberholic: if you want more clicks find a thread on itt that was about drum machine Apr 20 20:51:19 AStorm: impossible..... can't you plug your device to your stereo? *gg* Apr 20 20:51:36 bt ear drum killer Apr 20 20:51:37 ;) Apr 20 20:51:46 do what the kids tv studios do: increase sampling rate. pump up and clip the samples Apr 20 20:51:48 Kot: i do not want more clicks - i want from all of you your love 8x Apr 20 20:52:10 Kot: but i will mention it on ITT Apr 20 20:52:14 cyberholic: I prefer my headphones Apr 20 20:52:20 cyberholic: i mean, those will be the people actually interested in this specific app Apr 20 20:52:38 KotCzarny, cyberholic has an 800 ive seen pictures Apr 20 20:52:39 Kot: so you still don`t love me? :[ Apr 20 20:52:40 cyberholic: find that thread, don't just start new one :) Apr 20 20:52:54 cyberholic: i'm ambivalent :) Apr 20 20:55:55 Ok, i hvae updated it and set som Credits (now you three will hate me!)... http://www.mojocafe.net/test.swf Apr 20 20:56:46 are sd cards hot-swappable ? Apr 20 20:56:56 does lowering the quality helped with speed? Apr 20 20:57:02 grib: yes Apr 20 20:57:08 well a bit indeed! Apr 20 20:57:18 The sound-response is much quicker! Apr 20 20:57:24 good Apr 20 20:57:41 hey, i didnt help Apr 20 20:57:43 but if you play a lot of the instruments my device starts to hate me! Apr 20 20:57:56 * lcuk is a hinderance Apr 20 20:58:06 KotCzarny, If I put an sd card in my tablet, is it automatically mounted ? Apr 20 20:58:10 lcuk: but you take your time and in days like these, time is very valuable! Apr 20 20:58:18 grib: assuming it's vfat Apr 20 20:58:29 and formatted Apr 20 20:58:47 KotCzarny, and what happens if I remove a card without unmounting the file system ? Apr 20 20:59:04 grib: when you open sd cover it umount automatically Apr 20 20:59:05 shall i put a "music-teacher" in the drum machine? it could blink up so that you will learn to play "we will rock you" looool. Apr 20 20:59:16 ie. open latch and see if the card is still mounted Apr 20 20:59:22 i cant hear the highhat options Apr 20 20:59:23 (but don't eject the card) Apr 20 20:59:50 cyberholic: is there a midi player in flash? Apr 20 20:59:56 KotCzarny, why not ? Apr 20 20:59:58 yep Apr 20 21:00:02 grib: for testing Apr 20 21:00:07 no wait! i mean, flash can play midis! Apr 20 21:00:08 but my cats ears are pricking and the kids are complaining so i will assume its working Apr 20 21:00:30 lol, lcuk, you're deaf! Apr 20 21:00:49 so early.. Apr 20 21:00:49 :) Apr 20 21:00:55 i can hear them really, but they are at upper bounds, i have to turn speakers up more to hear them normally Apr 20 21:01:15 * lcuk alters the tone Apr 20 21:01:20 ahhhh damn kids Apr 20 21:01:27 deafness doesn't happen in one moment Apr 20 21:01:36 it decreases gradually your ability to hear Apr 20 21:01:48 geeeeesus! i am not going to respond on that "drummachine" thread at ITT - it is from LAST YEAR! *sigh* .... Last year is so... is sooooo old! Apr 20 21:01:51 lol Apr 20 21:01:59 it did for my missus, she is exactly 50% deaf Apr 20 21:02:13 cyberholic: so what? it will notify people that were subscribed to it Apr 20 21:02:25 and bump it Apr 20 21:02:27 i know, i was just kidding. Apr 20 21:02:33 it may reawaken their urges to play drums Apr 20 21:02:38 o.o Apr 20 21:02:43 which they will do for 5 minutes before carrying on whatever they did Apr 20 21:02:57 happy in the knowledge their lifes achievement of playing drums on their 810 is complete Apr 20 21:03:10 lol :) Apr 20 21:03:13 |> DMT (remix 2) - Shpongle (bootleg) Apr 20 21:03:31 lcuk: i can add Levels to it! Apr 20 21:03:33 re Apr 20 21:03:38 heh.. Apr 20 21:03:39 incidentally, why do i have to kick tom? Apr 20 21:04:13 cyberholic, yeah, making simon game out of drums is nice Apr 20 21:04:14 :) Apr 20 21:04:54 kot: i have that on my to-do list already :) Apr 20 21:07:13 looooooooool! i played around with my drummachine and for a moment i went mad and thought i was playing something from Sepultura! Apr 20 21:07:53 i'm a techno freak anyway Apr 20 21:12:57 maybe i can optimized the speed of the drummachine if someone of you could tell me what the best sound quality would be, or is that of no matter to the device? Apr 20 21:13:59 AStorm: suck (broken plugs) Apr 20 21:14:51 elb: hmm? Apr 20 21:14:57 yup, they do suck Apr 20 21:15:07 that's why I'm seeking to convert USB to charge my Nxxx Apr 20 21:15:15 what broke, exactly? Apr 20 21:15:24 astorm, just make an adapter? Apr 20 21:15:26 that flimsy 5V plug Apr 20 21:15:35 what *part* of the plug? Apr 20 21:15:37 KotCzarny: no! it'd still have the junk plug Apr 20 21:15:41 mine doesn't seem flimsy at all Apr 20 21:15:47 elb: the plug itself :> Apr 20 21:15:48 astorm: straight angle adapter Apr 20 21:15:48 :) Apr 20 21:16:02 elb: metal part Apr 20 21:16:07 and plastic too Apr 20 21:16:13 junk Apr 20 21:16:27 and twice Apr 20 21:16:27 huh Apr 20 21:16:34 one weekly Apr 20 21:16:53 so, I'll find out which is 5V and which is ground Apr 20 21:16:57 seems improbable to me Apr 20 21:17:03 that's labeled on the wall wart Apr 20 21:17:12 .... Apr 20 21:17:14 (by law) Apr 20 21:17:18 the 5V broke Apr 20 21:17:22 not the 220V plug Apr 20 21:17:31 yes ... but the polarity of the 5v plug is labeled on the wall wart Apr 20 21:17:33 look at it Apr 20 21:17:34 ... Apr 20 21:17:40 which wall wart? Apr 20 21:17:45 in the device? ;P Apr 20 21:17:48 the 220v end Apr 20 21:17:56 there should be a label with a little diagram of a ring and pin Apr 20 21:18:01 heh Apr 20 21:18:06 it's not the problem Apr 20 21:18:08 :) Apr 20 21:18:10 and it will say which is + and which is -, as well as the voltage and amperage Apr 20 21:18:15 the real problem is that i broke Apr 20 21:18:22 nopes Apr 20 21:18:27 huh Apr 20 21:18:28 and he doesn't want do have anything with that nokia's plug anymore Apr 20 21:18:29 voltage and amperage are there Apr 20 21:18:30 * elb looks at his Apr 20 21:18:40 KotCzarny: right, but he's trying to identify polarity Apr 20 21:19:01 yup Apr 20 21:19:05 usb only has +5V Apr 20 21:19:06 ah, i see Apr 20 21:19:11 sorry :) Apr 20 21:19:17 so the other has to be GND Apr 20 21:19:18 and no, it's not labelled Apr 20 21:19:21 at least not on mine Apr 20 21:19:26 but usualyy + is in the center Apr 20 21:19:32 I think the pin is live, the sleeve is GND Apr 20 21:19:35 and - is on the outside Apr 20 21:19:44 huh, mine's not labeled, either ... maybe because it's a european import? Apr 20 21:19:50 hehehe Apr 20 21:19:55 mine is us version Apr 20 21:20:06 made in china Apr 20 21:20:09 normally the tip is +5 and the ring is ground, but you can't count on that Apr 20 21:20:09 (charger) Apr 20 21:20:10 :) Apr 20 21:20:13 yeah, mine is the US version as well Apr 20 21:20:19 but normally things in teh US are labeled Apr 20 21:20:20 elb: that's why I'll check Apr 20 21:20:23 in fact, I thought UL required it Apr 20 21:20:28 it's easy to do once I broke the plug ;P Apr 20 21:20:38 but this has a UL logo on it Apr 20 21:20:41 and no diagram Apr 20 21:20:47 interestingly enough regular phone charger also is missing diagram Apr 20 21:20:47 :) Apr 20 21:21:03 do you guys think that i can destroy the device loudspeakers with the drummachine? If i play multiple drums for a while the loudspeaker sounds like "its time to say goodbye old boy!" Apr 20 21:21:05 that's because it's non-mandatory Apr 20 21:21:18 Astorm: the loudspeakers? Apr 20 21:21:32 AStorm: for at least some equipment, it's mandatory in the US Apr 20 21:21:37 I thought it was for all wall warts Apr 20 21:21:46 but perhaps only if they carry a certain amount of power or some crap Apr 20 21:22:09 well, mandatory in some locales -- but in practice that means everywhere, because it's not like companies make different parts for CA or MA or whatever states are the problem ;-) Apr 20 21:22:23 elb: as i said, mine is us version Apr 20 21:22:29 and is missing diagram as well Apr 20 21:22:30 it's pretty normal to have a little logo that looks like -Co- where the o is inside the C Apr 20 21:22:33 KotCzarny: as I said, mine is too Apr 20 21:22:36 :) Apr 20 21:22:56 KotCzarny: and also not labeled Apr 20 21:22:59 KotCzarny: but ... this is atypical Apr 20 21:23:03 the construction of the 5V plug is suicide ;> Apr 20 21:23:05 not for nokia Apr 20 21:23:10 it's two rings Apr 20 21:23:10 does anyone of you know REST? Apr 20 21:23:16 as i said other nokia's phone charger is missing it too Apr 20 21:23:23 cyberholic: I don't Apr 20 21:23:24 cyberholic: change your nick name Apr 20 21:23:31 because you're not true to it Apr 20 21:23:34 Kot: why? Apr 20 21:23:41 asking such questions Apr 20 21:23:43 *lol* Apr 20 21:24:04 yeah, nokia sucks, apparently ;-) Apr 20 21:24:07 Man, i am so much into XML and think that i am falling in love with REST but i do not know how to parse it within php Apr 20 21:24:17 elb: maybe it's nda ;) Apr 20 21:24:27 I just looked at my Nintendo DS wall wart, a Motorola phone wall wart, a clock power adapter, and a GameCube inline wart Apr 20 21:24:28 lol Apr 20 21:24:30 all of them are labeled Apr 20 21:24:38 i have thought you are talking about physical rest Apr 20 21:24:39 :) Apr 20 21:24:41 it's just Nokia ;-) Apr 20 21:24:48 stupid name for a project Apr 20 21:24:48 :) Apr 20 21:24:51 or language Apr 20 21:25:15 Kot: nope, the SOAP / REST thing going on Apr 20 21:25:27 first time i have heard about 'rest' Apr 20 21:25:27 :) Apr 20 21:25:32 elb: well, the most easiest way to find out the power is to wetten your finger and touch it - i think. Apr 20 21:25:44 Kot :) Apr 20 21:25:46 drat, I've to write some AJAX with SOAP (mwhahaha) for Wednesday Apr 20 21:25:53 checking with multimeter is simpler Apr 20 21:26:00 and ore correct Apr 20 21:26:00 AStorm: aint that nearly the same? Apr 20 21:26:02 KotCzarny: indeed Apr 20 21:26:07 cyberholic: no Apr 20 21:26:12 ok :[ Apr 20 21:26:13 SOAP is a protocol Apr 20 21:26:14 *more Apr 20 21:26:17 AJAX is just a technique Apr 20 21:26:29 like for parsing, right? Apr 20 21:26:39 both are abbreviations Apr 20 21:26:40 :) Apr 20 21:26:41 uh, it's simpler Apr 20 21:26:47 Adv. JavaScript and XML Apr 20 21:27:06 KotCzarny: and both are washing products :P Apr 20 21:27:08 apache/js/a?/xml Apr 20 21:27:09 or cleaning Apr 20 21:27:21 KotCzarny: Advanced JavaScript And XML Apr 20 21:27:23 forgot what was second 'a' for Apr 20 21:27:37 nah Apr 20 21:27:43 Asynchronous JavaScript and XML Apr 20 21:27:51 Ajax (Asynchronous JavaScript and XML) Apr 20 21:27:51 Good afternoon .... I have a Nokia 770 running latest OS 2006 .. My question is: Is ther a way to make a FULL BACKUP of the OS partition (from a Linux PC) so I can make my own modified .bin and whenever I need to reinstall the system, I already have a full operating copy and don't need to install the Nokia .bin and start installing all the apps .... ? Apr 20 21:27:51 that's the correct one Apr 20 21:27:52 :) Apr 20 21:27:57 yeah Apr 20 21:28:10 2006 isn't latest Apr 20 21:28:15 AlbertoP_: sure, it's called rsync Apr 20 21:28:18 :-) Apr 20 21:28:25 lastest of OS2006 ... ;) (49-2, I think) Apr 20 21:28:31 alberto: with some hacking, probably Apr 20 21:28:34 also, you can backup using the flasher program Apr 20 21:28:51 thus create a .bin Apr 20 21:28:55 the flasher program for linux, you mean ? Apr 20 21:29:07 (I have used the Nokia flasher for Windowze so far only) Apr 20 21:30:07 hmm, anyone knows where fluxbox stores window positions? Apr 20 21:30:32 AStorm, you mean the flasher utility for Linux, right ? Apr 20 21:30:50 yup Apr 20 21:30:58 nvm, found it Apr 20 21:31:00 cool, will check it out .... Apr 20 21:31:03 thanks Apr 20 21:31:10 it is really more powerful than the doze version Apr 20 21:31:13 Returns: The LCD Panel or TV Clock setting in Hz Apr 20 21:31:16 UInt32 seClkGetPanelClk (void) Apr 20 21:31:24 wonder if we can access the lcd controller directly Apr 20 21:31:27 http://vdc.epson.com/index.php?option=com_docman&task=cat_view&gid=38&Itemid=40 Apr 20 21:31:33 So far I have only nneded to send the BIN file to the 770 ... but will swithc then ;) Apr 20 21:31:38 http://vdc.epson.com/index.php?option=com_docman&task=cat_view&gid=145&Itemid=40 Apr 20 21:32:48 elb: how large a diode would I likely need to prevent USB burn? ;> Apr 20 21:32:53 I hav not been able to find tcpdump nor btscanner for OS2006.... (eko1 repository is gone) ... ay other repositories with those packages or DEBs ? Apr 20 21:32:57 5V/1A? Apr 20 21:33:10 re Apr 20 21:33:16 AStorm: I don't understand the question ... what are you wanting to do with a diode, and why? Apr 20 21:33:30 you can't expect to pull more than 500mA off a USB bus safely, period Apr 20 21:33:33 connect USB port power to the nokia power Apr 20 21:33:35 I know Apr 20 21:33:43 that's enough for power circuitry of N810 Apr 20 21:34:04 it will struggle a bit, but work and charge correctly Apr 20 21:34:10 elb: many products break that rule Apr 20 21:34:17 KotCzarny: that doesn't make it safe, or a good idea Apr 20 21:34:18 mostly those charging related Apr 20 21:34:20 fairly advanced power regulator it has Apr 20 21:34:22 i know Apr 20 21:34:28 770 charges at 890mA Apr 20 21:34:31 but some people will just do that Apr 20 21:34:37 that's fine, I won't ;-) Apr 20 21:34:41 AlbertoP_: nah, it can easily grab more Apr 20 21:34:48 and I don't understand what a diode is supposed to do with the price of cheese Apr 20 21:34:52 and then manufacturers see the trend Apr 20 21:34:52 safe?? Apr 20 21:34:55 elb: I can put a regulator to not overdrive the port Apr 20 21:34:57 nothing is going to explode. Apr 20 21:35:00 and hopefully fix the design Apr 20 21:35:00 :) Apr 20 21:35:04 I know, but is what the adapter is designed to give ... Apr 20 21:35:09 fysa: yeah, only the laptop can burn ;P Apr 20 21:35:10 fysa: you could damage the USB host adapter Apr 20 21:35:24 have you damaged one personally? Apr 20 21:35:35 he avoids such risks Apr 20 21:35:37 in the last 5 years? Apr 20 21:35:37 :) Apr 20 21:35:39 blah blah Apr 20 21:35:46 most have proper regulators Apr 20 21:35:48 no, and it may even be extremely unlikely -- there are a relatively small number of adapter manufacturers Apr 20 21:35:53 but that doesn't change the fact that you're violating spec Apr 20 21:35:56 so it should be a question for someone that actually did it Apr 20 21:35:57 :) Apr 20 21:36:00 elb: I can put a limiter Apr 20 21:36:04 no problem with that Apr 20 21:36:10 ie. pulled more than allowed current Apr 20 21:36:11 N810 *will* work on 500 mA Apr 20 21:36:12 AStorm: go for it Apr 20 21:36:18 just don't expect a diode to do that for you ;-) Apr 20 21:36:23 it's not like USB was just released.. although non-standard, everyone is aware of this by now and I would take it as an exception to have a problem. Apr 20 21:36:25 diode was to prevent backflow Apr 20 21:36:27 If you really want to know the aperage rating of your personal IT, plug it through a normal 2A charger, and measure the current it is pulling out ..... Apr 20 21:36:39 to not destroy the USB if I connect power input ;P Apr 20 21:36:42 500ma which usb supplies is under spec, but you can currently buy USB->Nokia Power adapter cable kits which work Apr 20 21:36:42 Then you know how much it is going to be asking of your USB port Apr 20 21:36:47 fysa: if everyone is aware of it, then all devices should pull no more than 500mA ;-) Apr 20 21:36:53 lcuk: exactly Apr 20 21:36:53 has anyone else used the homewifilevel? Apr 20 21:37:40 the only problem i see with your method is that you are jacking onto the usb OTG port which will attempt to communicate with the host device and tell it it only needs 100ma max (which is the USB OTG spec) Apr 20 21:37:57 Well, that is just an average ... you need to test at maximum usage (brightest screen, wifi on, bluetooth on, etc .... Apr 20 21:37:59 lcuk: hmmhmm Apr 20 21:38:20 now that would be the problem Apr 20 21:38:24 i believe to prevent that you would need to disable your actual usb which would be folly Apr 20 21:38:29 and that's why I'm reading the spec Apr 20 21:38:40 lcuk: not folly, just simple Apr 20 21:38:45 in order to pull > 100mA you're *supposed* to negotiate Apr 20 21:38:48 (many devices do not) Apr 20 21:38:51 blah blah Apr 20 21:39:03 the spec says SHOULD Apr 20 21:39:04 :> Apr 20 21:39:08 the negotiation is part of the spec, no device can supply over 100ma until AFTER the negotiation Apr 20 21:39:09 actually, it says MUST Apr 20 21:39:09 guess what that means Apr 20 21:39:15 elb: let me check Apr 20 21:39:20 lcuk: ARGH Apr 20 21:39:27 That is what my motorola cell phone does to charge of the USB port (through miniUSB connector) Apr 20 21:39:31 lcuk: a lot of devices do, though Apr 20 21:39:51 it's easier to simply be prepared to push 500mA on every port, then to actually switch it Apr 20 21:39:58 still, I feel I should point it out :-) Apr 20 21:40:04 :) Apr 20 21:40:07 better to be prepared for 1A Apr 20 21:40:09 ;P Apr 20 21:40:12 or more Apr 20 21:40:14 :) Apr 20 21:40:20 some devices sure are power hungry Apr 20 21:40:30 some take two ports Apr 20 21:40:33 of course you are prepared to do that, but if you do before its ready then you will fry anything which touches the port immediately Apr 20 21:40:43 i was happily running 1A hdd off my thinkpad usb port Apr 20 21:40:43 yes, normally devices which need much more than 500mA use more than one port Apr 20 21:40:47 lcuk: yeah sure Apr 20 21:41:04 the host device cannot assume 500ma directly because that would blow a lot of lesser devices Apr 20 21:41:12 and yes, it gets that much during spinning start Apr 20 21:41:12 i have a 100ma keyboard Apr 20 21:41:14 I hav not been able to find tcpdump nor btscanner for OS2006.... (eko1 repository is gone) ... ay other repositories with those packages or DEBs ? Apr 20 21:41:17 lcuk: it's autoregulating Apr 20 21:41:27 so if there is higher load, it will be given Apr 20 21:41:33 some devices refuse to charge unless they *can* negotiate Apr 20 21:41:33 yer, when the magic smoke appears the device stops pulling Apr 20 21:41:35 I think ipods do Apr 20 21:41:43 more devices should be so compliant :-P Apr 20 21:41:48 lcuk: rotfl Apr 20 21:41:51 al bertop: gronmayer.com/it/ Apr 20 21:41:56 correct elb, ipods cannot charge without intelligent device Apr 20 21:42:10 :-| Apr 20 21:42:19 computers operate on smoke Apr 20 21:42:20 ;) Apr 20 21:42:21 I wonder what does that Nokia charger do Apr 20 21:42:32 once the smoke gets out they stop working Apr 20 21:42:33 that charger isnt a usb Apr 20 21:42:33 ;) Apr 20 21:42:47 or are you on about another one Apr 20 21:42:49 lcuk: dummy, the USB charger Apr 20 21:42:57 KotCz..: thanks Apr 20 21:43:32 Stupid Nokia could've just built that in :> Apr 20 21:43:47 I suspect if the device drew <500mA, they would have Apr 20 21:43:51 but then they'd get complaints like "the device is barely charging" Apr 20 21:44:01 nahhh i would hate to have to open kickstand to charge, or unplug keyboard etc Apr 20 21:44:12 this isnt just a phone where you can just have possibly 1 connector Apr 20 21:44:17 Besides, no other Nokia device uses USB for charging. Apr 20 21:44:24 lcuk, not a problem if it was included in the place of the current charger port Apr 20 21:44:28 GeneralAntilles: all new phones do ;P Apr 20 21:44:33 my phone does, but it is also a full sync etc Apr 20 21:44:34 Chinese now require that Apr 20 21:44:46 KotCzarny, 2 usb ports? Apr 20 21:44:48 I'm wondering if they just send AStorm extra crappy plugs or something Apr 20 21:44:52 lcuk, why 2? Apr 20 21:44:57 because I really don't see a way to break this one short of some serious effort Apr 20 21:44:57 A DIY kit, made out of three AA batteries with around 3000mAh should give charge to the IT replacing around four hours of outlet charge ..... and just carry around (on trips) the battery recharger ... (15minute one from Rayovac) Apr 20 21:45:10 because i would have to keep unplugging my memory stick or my keyboard or whatever was plugged in just to charge it Apr 20 21:45:16 elb: just horizontal force Apr 20 21:45:25 :) Apr 20 21:45:28 not too large, even Apr 20 21:45:35 yeah ... not seeing it Apr 20 21:45:38 rotational will do the same even quicker Apr 20 21:45:43 lcuk: ok, that's an argument Apr 20 21:45:44 I mean, I'm not goign to plug it into the tablet and smash down on it or anything Apr 20 21:45:49 :) Apr 20 21:45:53 but it's a relatively short lever and pretty well-built Apr 20 21:45:54 I didn't do that either Apr 20 21:46:01 that's why it fails Apr 20 21:46:03 though i don't use any usb devices withh IT n Apr 20 21:46:05 because it's short Apr 20 21:46:10 so 1 will be enough for me Apr 20 21:46:11 :) Apr 20 21:46:11 but its there for a reason Apr 20 21:46:16 Even easier, just take a couple wires directly from your laptop's battery and plug your tablet there ;):P Apr 20 21:46:30 i agree though kot, it should OPTIONALLY use usb for charging Apr 20 21:46:30 AlbertoP_: and fry it with 14.2V? Apr 20 21:46:35 ontop of the current chrager Apr 20 21:46:35 no, sorry Apr 20 21:46:40 zener diode ;) Apr 20 21:46:40 you think it would be stronger if it were *longer*? Apr 20 21:46:54 AlbertoP_: and fry the diode or waste power? rotfl Apr 20 21:47:07 SCR ;):P Apr 20 21:47:08 hahaha Apr 20 21:47:21 just build a real step-down Apr 20 21:47:24 i would like to make an extended battery pack which basically extended the back by a few mm, it can have its own charging port wherever and be constantly plugged into nokia Apr 20 21:47:24 switching regulators are almost free Apr 20 21:47:29 I got an EE degree some thousand years ago, heheheh Apr 20 21:47:46 elb: exactly Apr 20 21:48:11 lcuk: we were thinking about NiMH battery pack Apr 20 21:48:14 like this: >>> http://crave.cnet.com/8301-1_105-9713850-1.html Apr 20 21:48:15 lcuk, everything you need is to check what voltage is required for charging Apr 20 21:48:19 4x NiMH Apr 20 21:48:28 ie. if it would work on anything lesser than 5V Apr 20 21:48:42 KotCzarny: 3,7V, d'oh Apr 20 21:48:44 it's on the battery Apr 20 21:48:58 astorm: but nokia has charging circuitry Apr 20 21:49:01 it has a smart charge circuit built in apparently Apr 20 21:49:04 it's not connected directly to battery Apr 20 21:49:08 KotCzarny: no, the battery has inside Apr 20 21:49:09 if make up the voltage in series, ampage in parallel. just work out whats acceptable and fill the space Apr 20 21:49:33 NiMH AAs will provide *plenty* of amperage Apr 20 21:49:36 astorm: have you actually tried plugging anything other than original charger? Apr 20 21:49:57 ok, I amn going, thanks for the help ... bye Apr 20 21:50:02 KotCzarny: no :> Apr 20 21:50:07 I don't have a spare yet Apr 20 21:50:08 astorm: tell me when you do Apr 20 21:50:14 elb: sure Apr 20 21:50:14 right now we are speculating :) Apr 20 21:50:21 BBZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZTTTTT Apr 20 21:50:30 we just don't know if 4,8V will be enough Apr 20 21:50:30 i would be interested in external battery pack too Apr 20 21:50:35 4x AA seems nice Apr 20 21:50:41 yup Apr 20 21:50:43 that, I of course can't tell you Apr 20 21:50:47 anyone with a broken plug ? Apr 20 21:50:48 ;) Apr 20 21:50:49 but ... switching power supplies are almost free! ;-) Apr 20 21:50:52 theres plenty of those battery extender chargers around Apr 20 21:50:55 KotCzarny: I have one ;P Apr 20 21:51:05 astorm: care to try? Apr 20 21:51:06 :) Apr 20 21:51:06 lcuk: exactly, it must be simple Apr 20 21:51:15 KotCzarny: but it's broken in a wrong way :-( Apr 20 21:51:17 what good yexy editors are available for the tavblet ? Apr 20 21:51:27 text editors Apr 20 21:51:28 define 'photo' ? Apr 20 21:51:28 gribouille: text? like, vim? Apr 20 21:51:30 erm Apr 20 21:51:32 'wrong' Apr 20 21:51:42 KotCzarny: it's the plug that's broken, not the cable Apr 20 21:51:50 grib: i believe there was an abiword port Apr 20 21:51:52 astorm, most devices will work under voltage. its just like a torch, if you replace normal AAs with rechargables you get a slightly dimmer light but it works Apr 20 21:51:58 KotCzarny: crashy like hell ;P Apr 20 21:52:05 just get clsoe enough to the voltage (keeping under) and try it Apr 20 21:52:07 astorm, but you can put it inside and silder wires to it? Apr 20 21:52:10 lcuk: let's hope so ;P Apr 20 21:52:22 AStorm, I dont find vim well adapted for the tablet because of all the commands that need a lot of typing Apr 20 21:52:23 KotCzarny: I smell sparks... ;P Apr 20 21:52:25 *solder Apr 20 21:52:33 under voltage == so what it might not fire up. over voltage == danger area Apr 20 21:52:35 gribouille: not a lot, esp. not for N810 Apr 20 21:52:41 lcuk: exactly Apr 20 21:52:48 that's why 5x AA is risky Apr 20 21:52:50 I installed jed on my tablet Apr 20 21:52:55 agreed.. Apr 20 21:52:58 although 0,2V overvoltage is <10% Apr 20 21:52:59 i installed mcedit Apr 20 21:53:00 ;) Apr 20 21:53:00 it works OK, although control sequences are a bit painful sometimes Apr 20 21:53:05 even 5% tolerance Apr 20 21:53:17 4 is right, must dash, ive got sdl on the brain Apr 20 21:53:19 blah Apr 20 21:53:28 KotCzarny, from where ? Apr 20 21:53:29 4,8V, have to test Apr 20 21:53:34 grib: internet, of course Apr 20 21:53:37 but first, I need a lot of spare plugs Apr 20 21:53:37 lcuk: well ... under voltage *can* mean it draws too much current, in the interest of full disclosure ;-) Apr 20 21:53:38 i haven't tried it Apr 20 21:53:46 (I doubt anything as sophisticated as the tablet would do so) Apr 20 21:53:51 elb: it can't possibly overdrive NiMH Apr 20 21:53:59 AStorm: oh, no, of course not Apr 20 21:54:06 it'd have to pull like 3A or so Apr 20 21:54:08 astorm: but control circuit can be too 'smart' Apr 20 21:54:24 KotCzarny: hehe, 4,8V is just 5% below Apr 20 21:54:25 are these Nokia plugs at all standard? Apr 20 21:54:31 in the way 'use only ORIGINAL charger and refuse to work with anything else Apr 20 21:54:40 elb: yes, they look very much like standard 6V Apr 20 21:54:57 ffs dont we have car chargers. elb go find a 4aa multichargers set somewhere and just try it Apr 20 21:55:03 astorm ^ Apr 20 21:55:06 anoother question : for file sharing, what is the best ? samba ? Apr 20 21:55:14 sneakernet Apr 20 21:55:21 lcuk: :> Apr 20 21:55:23 http Apr 20 21:55:24 I use scp Apr 20 21:55:24 :) Apr 20 21:55:27 gribouille: rsync Apr 20 21:55:36 lol Apr 20 21:55:37 sftp is fine too Apr 20 21:55:39 DC: Apr 20 21:55:43 i prefer sshfs Apr 20 21:55:45 nah, DC is junk Apr 20 21:55:54 4 people 7 answers Apr 20 21:55:56 heehe Apr 20 21:56:00 KotCzarny, does it work well on the tablet ? Apr 20 21:56:09 grib: define 'it' Apr 20 21:56:17 sshfs Apr 20 21:56:21 yup Apr 20 21:56:29 both ways Apr 20 21:56:31 server/client Apr 20 21:56:54 for server you only have to install ssh-server and nothing else Apr 20 21:56:58 much more setting up though isnt it - dont most machines have samba? Apr 20 21:57:05 for client you have to get kernel module and some libs Apr 20 21:57:17 lcuk: none of mine ;) Apr 20 21:57:19 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/DC_connector Apr 20 21:57:23 pick the one :> Apr 20 21:57:26 i agree, sshfs is nice, but i dont expect it everywhere Apr 20 21:57:32 lcuk: i do Apr 20 21:57:38 KotCzarny, I know, I already use sshfs Apr 20 21:57:41 openssh is ubitiquous Apr 20 21:58:04 even on m$ windows Apr 20 21:58:19 and compulsory on *nixish systems Apr 20 21:58:20 :) Apr 20 21:58:23 gahhhh!! those tamiya connectors were the bain of my life at one point Apr 20 21:58:39 the third on the left is the right one I think Apr 20 21:58:52 you are going off a PICTURE Apr 20 21:58:59 just get a voltmeter on it and be certain Apr 20 21:59:15 or pick up an LED or use your tongue or anything other than picking a picture Apr 20 21:59:43 i think its the 4th Apr 20 22:00:07 ... Apr 20 22:00:12 only recently i made an observation that bigger plugs mean higher voltage Apr 20 22:00:13 :> Apr 20 22:00:14 4th is larger, you fail Apr 20 22:00:42 or maybe... let me check Apr 20 22:01:06 hey, I have a question about the n810. A friend of mine pointed out options for configuring GPRS / Data Call internet connections within the n810. That's only for use with a synced cell phone, correct? There's nothing built in to the n810 to handle it? Apr 20 22:01:20 might be 4th Apr 20 22:01:23 mhm Apr 20 22:01:36 Joe_CoT: yes Apr 20 22:01:38 hmm Apr 20 22:01:41 it may be the 3rd Apr 20 22:01:48 KotCzarny, how do you unmount an sshfs filesystem ? Apr 20 22:01:50 because of the ring on the end of the plug Apr 20 22:01:56 AStorm, ok, thanks. I wish it was otherwise, but I wanted to confirm with someone Apr 20 22:02:01 mine has a ring ;) Apr 20 22:02:01 grib: umount /some/mount/point Apr 20 22:02:46 KotCzarny, do I have to be root to do that ? Apr 20 22:02:49 yes Apr 20 22:03:23 that's strange : you don't have ti be root to mount, but you have to be root to unmount Apr 20 22:03:34 lcuk, also 3rd is all plastic at the end Apr 20 22:03:58 grib: what can i say, ask sshfs/fuse author Apr 20 22:03:59 :) Apr 20 22:04:09 sure Apr 20 22:04:19 at least it works as i want Apr 20 22:04:57 btw, is it possible to make small films with the tablet ? Apr 20 22:05:02 probably Apr 20 22:05:03 is it EIAJ-02 or EIAJ-03? Apr 20 22:05:49 gribouille, sure, dont see why not, just get your rolling pin out and keep rolling till its really thin Apr 20 22:05:59 yes, EIAJ-02 Apr 20 22:06:05 standard 6V plug Apr 20 22:07:23 nah, that one was 4mm Apr 20 22:08:44 http://europe.nokia.com/link?cid=EDITORIAL_344303 Apr 20 22:10:50 tbh, it's 2.45 mm Apr 20 22:10:54 EIAJ-01 Apr 20 22:11:02 rated usually for 3V Apr 20 22:11:46 nah, I'm wrong again Apr 20 22:11:50 it's radio shack size B Apr 20 22:11:53 = EIAJ-02 Apr 20 22:11:59 4mm x 1.7mm Apr 20 22:12:06 http://www.radioshack.com/product/index.jsp?productId=2102598&cp=2032058.2032231.2032284&parentPage=family Apr 20 22:12:27 this one looks much more sturdy than the flimsy ones used in chargers Apr 20 22:12:39 there is also Apr 20 22:12:40 http://www.energizer.eu/en/products/energi-go Apr 20 22:12:52 oh, it's available in radioshack stores? Apr 20 22:12:53 cool Apr 20 22:12:56 lcuk: anything that pushes 5V and can sustain 1A will do Apr 20 22:13:01 i have one few streets away Apr 20 22:13:08 KotCzarny: but there's no RadioShack in Poland, right? Apr 20 22:13:17 you still dont know the polarity Apr 20 22:13:25 astorm: i'm not in poland, right now :> Apr 20 22:13:30 :> Apr 20 22:13:41 lcuk: that's a 10s with multimeter Apr 20 22:13:43 :) Apr 20 22:14:05 hmm Apr 20 22:14:07 it's yellow Apr 20 22:14:12 may be incompatible :> Apr 20 22:14:43 you would be better just getting a molded variation thats already configured for a phone - from a cheap adapter kit - that way you wont have a weak spot Apr 20 22:15:00 KotCzarny: that is one Apr 20 22:16:38 i wonder if there is straight angle one somewhere.. Apr 20 22:16:48 blah blah, might be wrong one thought Apr 20 22:16:51 *though Apr 20 22:17:00 http://www.accesscomms.com.au/reference/outputplugseiaj.htm Apr 20 22:17:15 2,35mm diameter is more like the plug of N8x0 Apr 20 22:17:53 take your nokia with you to radioshack Apr 20 22:17:59 hehehe Apr 20 22:17:59 http://www.americanesuperstore.com/pcca-44.html Apr 20 22:18:02 it says '2mm Apr 20 22:18:13 because it is 2.35mm Apr 20 22:18:15 :-) Apr 20 22:18:15 so neither 2.35 nor 1.7 Apr 20 22:18:21 no, it's not exactly 2mm Apr 20 22:18:53 Me again .... I have downloaded flahser-3.0 (and 2.0) .. Anyone here knows how to use it to get an image (BIN file) out of the OS partition of the 770 ? (what parameter ?) Apr 20 22:20:08 hmm Apr 20 22:20:20 most of the sites gives 2mm Apr 20 22:20:28 maybe it's really exact 2mm Apr 20 22:20:29 because it is 2.35mm ;P Apr 20 22:20:36 no, it's not, argue with my ruler Apr 20 22:20:53 your ruler is wrong Apr 20 22:20:58 fight the power! Apr 20 22:21:24 don't let the physics bound you! Apr 20 22:21:25 :> Apr 20 22:22:11 any ideas ? Apr 20 22:22:27 1.7mm Apr 20 22:22:29 :> Apr 20 22:22:49 astorm, now mister, changing the side? Apr 20 22:23:19 next time, I'll use the interferometer from the uni Apr 20 22:23:21 :> Apr 20 22:23:35 that will give you precision to some nanometers Apr 20 22:23:47 good Apr 20 22:23:48 :) Apr 20 22:25:04 :~( Apr 20 22:25:28 albertop: you have to find knowledgable 770 user Apr 20 22:27:08 is there a better place than this channel to find one ? Apr 20 22:27:39 ah, my mistake Apr 20 22:27:45 flasher can't read images :> Apr 20 22:28:01 albertop: itt ? Apr 20 22:28:41 AStorm .... are you serious ?? :~( Apr 20 22:28:47 just use a tarball Apr 20 22:28:53 it works just as well Apr 20 22:29:30 just Tarball the whole '/' filesystem ? Apr 20 22:29:48 What is "./flasher-3.0 --enable-usb-host-mode" for ? anyone ? Apr 20 22:29:56 for usb Apr 20 22:30:07 might work, might not Apr 20 22:30:18 and won't on N770, that's for sure Apr 20 22:30:24 astorm, only after mounting with --bind Apr 20 22:30:35 or telling tar to stay on one filesystem Apr 20 22:30:40 AlbertoP_: after mounting it somewhere else Apr 20 22:30:50 e.g. mount /dev/whatitscalled /mnt/tmp Apr 20 22:30:55 then cd /mnt/tmp Apr 20 22:31:08 astorm slightly wrong Apr 20 22:31:10 tar cpf . | nc somehost:8080 Apr 20 22:31:14 ;) Apr 20 22:31:20 wrong Apr 20 22:31:27 tar cp . | nc somehost:8080 Apr 20 22:31:39 wow i love it when i code a new algorithm and no syntax errors and it works Apr 20 22:31:44 KotCzarny: not wrong, it's actually correct Apr 20 22:31:45 that's like a christmas present Apr 20 22:31:54 astorm: you can't mount already mounted fs Apr 20 22:31:56 pupnik: code what? Apr 20 22:32:00 KotCzarny: WRONG! Apr 20 22:32:03 you can Apr 20 22:32:08 see it yourself Apr 20 22:32:17 but that's wrong. Apr 20 22:32:18 a new timing algo. gets Apr 20 22:32:18 :) Apr 20 22:32:24 KotCzarny: no, it's not Apr 20 22:32:28 yes it is Apr 20 22:32:34 unless you think about --bind Apr 20 22:32:38 no Apr 20 22:32:41 it doesn't bind Apr 20 22:32:51 then you're asking for problems Apr 20 22:32:52 :) Apr 20 22:32:53 it really mounts it, but 90% of FSes under linux allow it Apr 20 22:33:03 that's the same VFS, it manages the write Apr 20 22:33:19 What is the safest bet ? Apr 20 22:33:19 so, the write is done once Apr 20 22:33:21 with --bind, yes Apr 20 22:33:27 KotCzarny: also w/o bind Apr 20 22:33:28 with separate mounts, i think not Apr 20 22:33:28 :-) Apr 20 22:33:36 unless something has changed Apr 20 22:33:39 it's the VFS that does the writes Apr 20 22:33:43 since i last played with vfs Apr 20 22:33:43 and reads Apr 20 22:33:52 VFS is the / Apr 20 22:33:58 and everything below Apr 20 22:34:00 I just go on the shell to my MMC card and do a "tar -zcvf My770.tgz /" ? Apr 20 22:34:10 AlbertoP_: almost Apr 20 22:34:12 don't use -z Apr 20 22:34:16 and don't use - at all Apr 20 22:34:17 ok, no gzip .... Apr 20 22:34:21 and add p Apr 20 22:34:25 alberto, you should tell tar to stay on one file system Apr 20 22:34:26 (store permissions) Apr 20 22:34:32 "tar -pcvf --bind My770.tgz /" Apr 20 22:34:33 ? Apr 20 22:34:37 yes, but busybox tar is stupid Apr 20 22:34:45 AlbertoP_: did I say no - Apr 20 22:34:52 and no --bind, that's mount option Apr 20 22:34:53 you don't want to tar /sys and /proc Apr 20 22:34:54 :> Apr 20 22:35:04 hmmm ... Apr 20 22:35:20 AlbertoP_: mount /dev/whatever /mnt/tmp Apr 20 22:35:24 see, it works Apr 20 22:35:25 and few others Apr 20 22:35:30 should I better just tar different files for specific dirs under / ? (like etc, home, ....) ? Apr 20 22:35:30 for extra safety if you're paranoid Apr 20 22:35:34 Target FPS: 57 Average FPS: 56.985 Apr 20 22:35:36 mount -o ro /dev/whatever /mnt/tmp Apr 20 22:35:45 pupnik: whee Apr 20 22:35:53 close enough Apr 20 22:35:54 pupnik: what res? Apr 20 22:36:00 I don't understand what you are mounting ? the MMC ? Apr 20 22:36:05 What's pupnik working on? Apr 20 22:36:09 AlbertoP_: /dev/mmcblk4 or something Apr 20 22:36:13 pupnik, you about still Apr 20 22:36:15 trying to draw something smoothly Apr 20 22:36:17 the / filesystem Apr 20 22:36:20 yearh Apr 20 22:36:26 ahh yes :) Apr 20 22:36:28 lcuk i'm still putzing with the loop and delay Apr 20 22:36:39 events, I say Apr 20 22:36:41 :-) Apr 20 22:36:48 change the call to SDL_SetVideoMode to 0 bpp Apr 20 22:36:49 asynchronous drawing, I follow Apr 20 22:36:56 lcdd: lol Apr 20 22:36:56 it's mtdblock4 Apr 20 22:36:56 :) Apr 20 22:36:59 lcuk: Apr 20 22:37:04 you get a direct buffer without the SDL shadow surface :) Apr 20 22:37:06 lcdd: change that nick, damnit ;) Apr 20 22:37:13 0_o Apr 20 22:37:14 doubles effective maximum Apr 20 22:37:15 tabuser :P Apr 20 22:37:30 no wai! Apr 20 22:37:33 and eases the cpu up Apr 20 22:37:35 lcuk: but introduces artifacts Apr 20 22:37:41 you lose double buffering Apr 20 22:37:54 using just the ioctl and no waiting with 8bpp=117fps with 0bpp=206fps Apr 20 22:37:54 AStorm: what double buffering Apr 20 22:38:03 hmmmm tryin Apr 20 22:38:07 there is an ioctl to wait until transfer complete Apr 20 22:38:16 pupnik: SDL does double-buf Apr 20 22:38:20 its not necessarily YOUR transfer, but it appears to remove the worst of it Apr 20 22:38:36 still, FPS > VSync is waste Apr 20 22:38:55 astorm: good for benchamrking the code Apr 20 22:39:01 absolutely but writing in the middle is worst Apr 20 22:39:08 sending over half old frame and half new one Apr 20 22:39:32 if you wait until its gone at least next time you draw on it its not in the middle of something else Apr 20 22:39:41 thats what it appears to be anyway Apr 20 22:40:00 there comes double buffering Apr 20 22:40:07 you draw in memory then do a synced flip Apr 20 22:40:14 but the flip isnt synced Apr 20 22:40:17 thats the problem Apr 20 22:40:27 it draws all over a buffer thats not quite taken Apr 20 22:40:32 AStorm: thanks, but sdl on the tablets has some quirks Apr 20 22:40:43 so the lcd takes it as its meant to do but sdl appears to spoil the party Apr 20 22:41:03 thats my view anyway after digging through this evening Apr 20 22:41:16 i might be completely wrong but its a start Apr 20 22:41:32 thanks lcuk Apr 20 22:41:50 Last.fm's being overloaded today Apr 20 22:41:52 :< Apr 20 22:41:58 but anyway, time for a bath. im gonna keep at this because proper rgb may be benificial for later Apr 20 22:42:02 :) Apr 20 22:42:13 or yuv->rgb converter? Apr 20 22:42:19 IVA will work for that Apr 20 22:42:25 if i can get to it Apr 20 22:42:37 most likely have to go through pvr first Apr 20 22:42:54 not going to happen atm Apr 20 22:42:55 :) Apr 20 22:43:01 time :) Apr 20 22:43:09 don't sink your tablet Apr 20 22:43:10 ;) Apr 20 22:43:20 lol Apr 20 22:43:24 anyway, cyas later Apr 20 22:43:30 :) Apr 20 22:43:32 ;) Apr 20 22:43:57 and no1 even try asking how i got hold of the SDL_ShadowSurface the first time ;) Apr 20 22:44:10 :> Apr 20 22:47:47 :) Apr 20 22:47:58 how have you got hold of the SDL_ShadowSurface the first time ? Apr 20 22:48:41 * pupnik tests this Apr 20 22:49:10 KotCzarny: I suspect some mad hack Apr 20 22:49:13 lcuk: i still see the 'charging' popup when using bpp = 0 Apr 20 22:50:07 do i need any extra flags set? Apr 20 22:52:22 Ok, I am back (and a little bit slow) ... My / filesystem is /dev/mtdblock4. Now, I need to mount it somewhere ? Isn't it already monted in / ? Apr 20 22:55:52 ? Apr 20 22:57:32 i dunno. follow the recipe Apr 20 22:57:36 @ AlbertoP_ Apr 20 22:59:49 pupnik: I am trying to find a way to make a full backup (on a 770) .... Something like getting a full (BIN) image of the OS partition (/) or something like that ...... Apr 20 23:00:21 are you following the howto clone rootfs recipe? Apr 20 23:00:22 AStorm and KotCzarny were recommending something using tar, but recommended mounting something and I didn't get it ... Apr 20 23:00:37 nop .. didn't know it existed ..... Apr 20 23:00:39 :O Apr 20 23:00:44 alberto, problem would be when restoring that backup Apr 20 23:00:58 as you would have to be in initfs or something Apr 20 23:01:16 http://maemo.org/community/wiki/HowTo_EASILY_Boot_From_MMC_card/ AlbertoP_ Apr 20 23:01:43 I want to be able to 1) flash my own BIN file or 2) flash the Nokia original BIN file and modifiy it with my "full backup", so I can have my machine back in 20 minutes if I mess it up .... Apr 20 23:02:35 booting off mmc is a nice way for it Apr 20 23:02:43 mmc is more readily available Apr 20 23:02:49 so you can backup/restore on pc Apr 20 23:02:49 pupnik: your recommnedation would be to have the OS on the MMC ? Apr 20 23:03:15 My MMC is the factory default (64MB) :( Would I be able to pull it off ? Apr 20 23:03:39 (I am in Colombia (Southamerica) and RS-MMCs are not easy to come by) Apr 20 23:03:52 hmm Apr 20 23:03:57 AlbertoP_: you probably can use SD in there, right? Apr 20 23:04:05 how big is the internal flash in 770? Apr 20 23:04:18 assume sd card 2x of that Apr 20 23:04:20 I think 128M Apr 20 23:04:26 ah, 2x mmc Apr 20 23:04:28 yeap 128M Apr 20 23:04:58 Modest hasn't been updated to fix the gmail issue yet? Apr 20 23:05:01 in the field of disk space n800 rulez :) Apr 20 23:05:11 Navi: not yet, just downgrade Apr 20 23:05:20 Nah, too lazy Apr 20 23:06:15 :( Apr 20 23:07:28 Navi, pay attention. Apr 20 23:07:34 You can compile it from svn if you want Apr 20 23:07:34 to? Apr 20 23:07:38 .deb tomorrow. Apr 20 23:07:43 k Apr 20 23:07:43 Blogs, the relevant thread. :P Apr 20 23:07:47 Nah Apr 20 23:07:49 too lazy Apr 20 23:11:59 lcuk: still awake? Apr 20 23:12:06 he is all wet Apr 20 23:12:13 i think Apr 20 23:12:22 ok Apr 20 23:13:15 http://www.techamok.com/?pid=4405 Apr 20 23:13:16 hehehehe Apr 20 23:13:24 You can purchase the 32 volume Britannica, which has 65,000 articles and 44 million words, for just $1,400. Or you can access it on the web for $70 per year. Apr 20 23:13:25 ;) Apr 20 23:16:58 * pupnik discovers that the eye is very damn sensitive to timing problems in horizontal scrolly Apr 20 23:17:07 :) Apr 20 23:17:18 just rotate it? Apr 20 23:17:19 ;) Apr 20 23:17:38 Target FPS: 60 Average FPS: 59.998 Apr 20 23:17:42 still doesn't look smooth Apr 20 23:17:52 maybe the problem is something else Apr 20 23:18:13 well i get strange occasional underruns Apr 20 23:18:26 where the app is slower than the target time Apr 20 23:18:44 which is strange cause app takes 0% cpu and xomap takes 3.3-4.0% cpu Apr 20 23:19:05 bandwidth limit? Apr 20 23:19:06 it should be spending a lot of time waiting Apr 20 23:19:14 interrupts? Apr 20 23:19:26 no 256x224 pix Apr 20 23:19:32 maybe watchdog? Apr 20 23:19:43 or something weird with lcd Apr 20 23:19:51 have you tried renicing the app? Apr 20 23:20:06 uh no Apr 20 23:20:15 * pupnik googles Apr 20 23:20:34 nice -20 your_app Apr 20 23:20:47 ifyou are ondemand then this will occur often Apr 20 23:20:49 or if it's already running: renice -20 `pidof your_app` Apr 20 23:20:49 is there a .deb with 'nice'? Apr 20 23:20:54 if its performance its much rarer Apr 20 23:20:58 pupnik: it should be standard Apr 20 23:20:59 but im still soapy Apr 20 23:21:02 i have OMAPFB_SYNC_GFX Apr 20 23:21:09 i have no nice Apr 20 23:21:16 then just use renice Apr 20 23:21:27 or some call in c Apr 20 23:21:29 ooh duh i DO have renice Apr 20 23:22:08 -20 means: give my app all the priority you can Apr 20 23:22:16 ok makes no difference Apr 20 23:22:31 app is usleeping 90% of the time anyway Apr 20 23:22:50 if you moved this into your emulator it wouldnt sleep Apr 20 23:22:55 then it's some kind of interrupt Apr 20 23:22:57 just be busy running Apr 20 23:23:19 !damn you guys Apr 20 23:23:22 :> Apr 20 23:23:26 im goin gettin dried Apr 20 23:23:27 no! it does help! Apr 20 23:23:37 neat Apr 20 23:23:44 then you know it's some other app taking cpu from you Apr 20 23:23:48 at the bad time Apr 20 23:23:55 probably x itself Apr 20 23:23:56 how often pup Apr 20 23:23:56 ;) Apr 20 23:23:59 well i gotta check Apr 20 23:24:03 pupnik: I sense scheduler unfairness Apr 20 23:24:07 once every 1-2 seconds Apr 20 23:24:14 you get pwnd because you're sleeping a lot Apr 20 23:24:18 i sense dont worry because you arent stressing the cpu yet Apr 20 23:24:21 its giving time to others Apr 20 23:24:29 ah interesting Apr 20 23:24:37 check it in the proper thing Apr 20 23:24:53 adding debug code Apr 20 23:24:59 ok, it's my turn to get wet Apr 20 23:25:00 bbl Apr 20 23:26:35 yup renicing fixed the underruns mostly Apr 20 23:26:42 still getting some Apr 20 23:27:05 that's old scheduler messing up Apr 20 23:27:25 we need 2.6.23 (preferably something newer) on Nxxx Apr 20 23:27:39 or a nice clean backport of CFS to 2.6.21 Apr 20 23:28:18 that should really help the performance of the device Apr 20 23:31:13 hrm Apr 20 23:35:36 where can I find vnc server for maemo ? Apr 20 23:36:29 server? might be hard Apr 20 23:36:43 why ? Apr 20 23:38:36 x11vnc Apr 20 23:38:37 Google it. Apr 20 23:39:16 for Maemo? ;P Apr 20 23:41:11 Assuming you're not being facetious about the ITOS/maemo distinction (it isn't capitalized), then, yes: http://mike.saunby.googlepages.com/x11vncfornokia7702 Apr 20 23:43:26 N810? Apr 20 23:43:38 Click the link. <_< Apr 20 23:44:03 later, no N810 right now (no power source) Apr 20 23:44:29 Why do you need an N810 to get information from a website? Apr 20 23:44:30 I don't have hamster-powered power supply with that kind of plug Apr 20 23:44:35 I don't Apr 20 23:44:42 but I'll forget, so give it to me later :> Apr 20 23:53:29 LOL Apr 20 23:53:58 yeah, gotta go gimme the internets later pal U,u Apr 20 23:54:24 GeneralAntilles: you told me that the downloadable maps will not work with maemo mapper 2.x. I got it to work. Apr 20 23:55:09 http://www.navicoretech.com/Consumer/Support/Downloads/tablet/en_GB/tablet/ <= the maps came from here Apr 20 23:56:05 Erm, those are for "Map" Apr 20 23:56:09 Not Maemo Mapper Apr 20 23:56:41 ah, i didn't realize there were two different apps in there Apr 20 23:57:07 Maemo Mapper is a GPL mapping application that uses Google/Yahoo/Microsoft/Open Street maps. Apr 20 23:57:22 "Map" is basically the Navicore mapping application, except bundled. Apr 20 23:57:26 hmm.. sounds like something I should look into Apr 20 23:57:28 They're significantly different. Apr 20 23:57:47 How'd you get "Map" -> Maemo Mapper? :P Apr 20 23:57:57 Which one is better ? I'm getting a Nokia N810 for work and I might like to use the GPS. Apr 20 23:58:07 They're two completely different beasts. Apr 20 23:58:14 the bundled one just gave me a popup asking me to register, or run the trial Apr 20 23:58:26 (if I want to navigate w/ it) Apr 20 23:59:00 btw, how do I get navigation to work in Maemo Mapper? Apr 20 23:59:05 unixSnob: exactly Apr 20 23:59:13 it's navicore all right, with all the expenses Apr 20 23:59:52 You get yourself a Bluetooth GPS, get a fix and download a route to somewhere. Apr 21 00:00:01 AStorm, the help is incredibly excellent Apr 21 00:00:08 and available online. Apr 21 00:00:14 wheee Apr 21 00:00:22 GeneralAntilles: "from somewhere" Apr 21 00:00:24 thanks Apr 21 00:00:31 esp. none are relevant for Poland Apr 21 00:00:39 None of what? Apr 21 00:00:44 routes and sites Apr 21 00:00:50 Open Street, Google, Microsoft, or Yahoo? Apr 21 00:00:52 None work? Apr 21 00:00:57 maps do works Apr 21 00:01:00 *work, routes don't Apr 21 00:01:14 esp. voice nav. doesn't work :> Apr 21 00:01:23 flite not set up for that? :P Apr 21 00:01:26 is maemo mapper free (as in free beer)? Apr 21 00:01:47 GeneralAntilles: I have flite, doesn't work still Apr 21 00:01:49 unixSnob: yep Apr 21 00:01:58 nice Apr 21 00:02:07 ofc. the maps are non-commercial, except (quite poor) Open Street Apr 21 00:02:22 i'm glad the free one will work w/ google maps Apr 21 00:02:48 It's free as in everything. Apr 21 00:03:13 The guy who wrote it goes by gnuite. ;) Apr 21 00:03:34 GeneralAntilles: so how do I set up that voice nav. and where do I get POI db for Poland? :-) Apr 21 00:03:53 You just install flite. Apr 21 00:04:02 GeneralAntilles: I have that, still no voice nav. Apr 21 00:04:06 :> Apr 21 00:04:16 Did you download a route? Apr 21 00:04:25 ok, so if the navicore product is a different beast, what does it do that mapper doesn't? Apr 21 00:04:26 where? Apr 21 00:04:34 unixSnob: it has paid maps Apr 21 00:04:37 ;P Apr 21 00:04:42 From one of the map repositories. Apr 21 00:04:49 Google/Yahoo/Microsoft/Open Street Apr 21 00:04:55 ... Apr 21 00:05:10 can't I make one myself? Apr 21 00:05:12 Or something else if you have something else. Apr 21 00:05:18 make maemo mapper autofit to roads? Apr 21 00:05:19 It'll load GPX routes. Apr 21 00:05:21 IOW, it offers teleatlas maps - is that the only significant difference? Apr 21 00:05:31 Guess mapper is what i'm after Apr 21 00:05:32 Erm, they're just bitmaps. Apr 21 00:05:49 "Map" is like a traditional GPS navigation unit. Apr 21 00:05:56 GeneralAntilles: hmmhmm Apr 21 00:05:59 Maemo Mapper is like a supercharged Google Local Apr 21 00:06:14 the problem is, how do I set such a route? Apr 21 00:06:33 argh, what I feared most Apr 21 00:06:37 You could do it with Google Earth Apr 21 00:06:50 There isn't a single mapping site that provides maps for Poland, though? Apr 21 00:06:57 which totally fails for Poland :> Apr 21 00:07:19 it fails to find some of the streets Apr 21 00:07:37 even quite major Apr 21 00:08:18 hmm Apr 21 00:08:24 i think google maps works quite well Apr 21 00:08:28 and openmaps too Apr 21 00:08:36 at least for bigger cities Apr 21 00:08:40 maps, sure Apr 21 00:08:45 route planning, uhm, no Apr 21 00:08:52 :) Apr 21 00:09:00 i wouldn't trust gps anyway Apr 21 00:09:14 it's useful as a guide Apr 21 00:09:45 there's a problem with Google Earth Apr 21 00:09:49 it's for Windows :P Apr 21 00:09:58 ah, no, 4.3 is for Linux too Apr 21 00:10:17 does the free version have .GPX support? Apr 21 00:10:26 google earth requires 3d accel Apr 21 00:10:27 :> Apr 21 00:11:14 I have that Apr 21 00:11:19 on n8x0 ? Apr 21 00:11:20 O.o Apr 21 00:11:22 the problem is twofold Apr 21 00:11:26 not on n8x0 Apr 21 00:11:31 :) Apr 21 00:11:44 so, loses Apr 21 00:11:49 anyway Apr 21 00:11:52 :) Apr 21 00:11:59 we need real GPS apps Apr 21 00:14:17 is the navicore app fully functional on the stock n810? Apr 21 00:14:31 trial Apr 21 00:14:32 If you register it. Apr 21 00:14:43 It works fine as a "Map" unregistered. Apr 21 00:14:48 But there's no navigation. Apr 21 00:14:58 wow, all that extra expense for the n810.. and i thought that was for gps functionality Apr 21 00:15:08 No, it's for expensive hardware. Apr 21 00:15:12 just install maemo-mapper Apr 21 00:15:13 :) Apr 21 00:15:16 s/gps/navigation/ Apr 21 00:15:16 unixSnob meant: wow, all that extra expense for the n810.. and i thought that was for navigation functionality Apr 21 00:15:43 i will.. i have the n800, btw Apr 21 00:15:57 hehe Apr 21 00:16:30 The only benefit to navicore seems to be Teleatlas maps - and that's a shortcoming from my standpoint (teleatlas screwed up the local maps where i am) Apr 21 00:17:18 teleatlas maps are better in europe, from what I understand Apr 21 00:17:33 and navteq is better in the US Apr 21 00:17:49 as most of the global apps Apr 21 00:19:53 and none are better in Poland, which is mapped worse than Russia, even Apr 21 00:19:54 :/ Apr 21 00:20:08 russia is bigger Apr 21 00:20:09 :) Apr 21 00:20:35 astorm, maybe you can snatch some maps from pilot.pl or something? Apr 21 00:20:46 ie. figure out the proper link and maybe it will work? Apr 21 00:20:56 interesting that maps would be lousy in poland.. from what I understand, the roads don't change much in most of europe - meaning they just need to get it right once Apr 21 00:21:15 unixsnob: someone has to do it Apr 21 00:21:17 KotCzarny: actually, google maps are mostly ok Apr 21 00:21:27 the problem is.... lack of navigation :-) Apr 21 00:21:28 and once someone does he wants money for it Apr 21 00:21:29 :) Apr 21 00:21:56 hmm, i don't know, /me checks something Apr 21 00:25:02 KotCzarny: I would pay, but not for navicore lack of maps Apr 21 00:25:03 :> Apr 21 00:25:13 :) Apr 21 00:27:42 AStorm: you can always migrate away from poland, and return when the maps are right Apr 21 00:27:57 astorm: ve street maps are quite ok Apr 21 00:28:00 that means "when Poland is a prosperous country" Apr 21 00:28:12 that means 'then there's no more poland' Apr 21 00:28:13 :) Apr 21 00:28:17 which also means "When Hell freezes over" Apr 21 00:28:18 *when Apr 21 00:28:23 :-) Apr 21 00:28:39 KotCzarny: maps are ok, lack of navigation isn't Apr 21 00:28:59 you can always plan using a paint program Apr 21 00:29:00 :) Apr 21 00:29:31 AStorm: what do you mean? why would you not be able to navigate? Apr 21 00:30:00 unixSnob: because maemo mapper has no real route data Apr 21 00:30:06 :-) Apr 21 00:30:21 I could plan a route myself, but that is an extremely painful process :P Apr 21 00:30:30 and time consuming Apr 21 00:30:30 Is there a good/reliable way to run a OS2008 scratchbox from windows? Apr 21 00:30:40 AStorm, does Google, etc not provide routing AT ALL for Poland? Apr 21 00:30:43 ImMelody: using vmware and Nokia image Apr 21 00:30:51 GeneralAntilles: it does provide "some" routing Apr 21 00:31:01 but is missing a lot of streets, even in major cities Apr 21 00:31:10 (from routing, not from maps) Apr 21 00:31:34 interesting.. so some streets appear on the map, but they're not part of the vector graphic? Apr 21 00:31:37 a free good/reliable way* Apr 21 00:31:45 yup Apr 21 00:31:51 immelody: vmware image Apr 21 00:31:59 os independent Apr 21 00:32:12 I was under the impression vmware cost money.. Am I wrong? XD Apr 21 00:32:17 yup Apr 21 00:32:26 vmware player is free for personal use Apr 21 00:32:33 oh ok Apr 21 00:32:47 unixSnob, there are no vector maps involved in any of the web-mapping stuff. Apr 21 00:32:50 but you should learn linux anyway Apr 21 00:33:03 because that's what is used on tablet Apr 21 00:33:04 :) Apr 21 00:33:23 I know linux, but I don't feel like asking my husband for another computer to put it on, and I really don't want to dualboot :P Apr 21 00:33:32 :) Apr 21 00:33:39 add second drive Apr 21 00:33:49 even usb one will do Apr 21 00:33:56 how does it work then? w/out a vector map, I'm not sure how a route could be computed Apr 21 00:34:03 as most of the pcs can boot from usb nowadays Apr 21 00:34:40 unixsnob: i guess there are some pre-programmed routes Apr 21 00:34:49 otherwise it's a salesman dillema Apr 21 00:34:50 ;) Apr 21 00:35:09 and that's where all nav apps could go lacking Apr 21 00:35:12 yup Apr 21 00:35:32 actually, they could autodetect possible routes automatically using gfx map Apr 21 00:35:43 but that could go wrong Apr 21 00:35:44 and some smart algorithm, like A* Apr 21 00:35:46 terribly wrong Apr 21 00:35:47 ;) Apr 21 00:35:54 why terribly? one-way? Apr 21 00:36:03 no problem with that ;P Apr 21 00:36:19 hey, there's a bridge with 2m of the light! Apr 21 00:36:26 or very narrow Apr 21 00:36:27 http://kotaku.com/381802/two-brothers-meditating-upon-questions-of-pac+man Apr 21 00:36:29 or closed Apr 21 00:36:33 KotCzarny: yes, that happens Apr 21 00:36:47 that's why GPS is only a guide Apr 21 00:37:01 if you find a problem, you go around it, not INTO it, like some idiot Apr 21 00:37:15 lcuk: heh Apr 21 00:37:17 salesman dilemma with only 1 root though Apr 21 00:37:31 pacman operates on pure energy Apr 21 00:37:34 if you add alternative expected stopoffs it becomes more difficult Apr 21 00:37:41 and energy is very.. what's the word? Apr 21 00:37:41 :) Apr 21 00:38:17 diluted Apr 21 00:38:18 :) Apr 21 00:38:25 you start at the destination and throw outwards until you hit the destination. give each a TTL and you are rocking Apr 21 00:38:46 add extra weight to the larger routes.. Apr 21 00:38:51 its not a tough problem Apr 21 00:39:01 hmm Apr 21 00:39:03 Figures. I can't download VMWare right now =\ Apr 21 00:39:07 though you may find examples where it goes wrong Apr 21 00:39:16 then it should be possible to write an algo to operate on bitmap maps Apr 21 00:39:25 ie being routed across the continent before coming back Apr 21 00:39:40 not really, using vectors you have priority Apr 21 00:39:52 with bitmaps you would be screwed by resolution Apr 21 00:40:04 but with maemo-mapper you have bitmaps Apr 21 00:40:05 well it's an unsolved problem from what I understand. There's infinite possibilities. So an algorithm necessarily will overlook paths - possibly the best path Apr 21 00:40:46 unixSnob, its an evolving function. if a path is missed at first it can be updated and it will be usable by people in future Apr 21 00:41:18 if a new motorway opens up it can be added quickly and all old functional routes become redundent unless you throw in traffic to the weighting Apr 21 00:41:28 unixSnob, there's a database and routing algorithm. Apr 21 00:42:32 the problem i see with gps mapping is out of date vectors ie sending big lorries through small towns Apr 21 00:42:56 sometimes longer route is faster Apr 21 00:42:59 using a one size fits all lookup means that it will send a small person on a motorbike along the motorway Apr 21 00:43:04 because of speed/quality Apr 21 00:43:12 KotCzarny: it's called A* Apr 21 00:43:19 k k Apr 21 00:43:34 add coarse/fine distinction and it will be fast enough Apr 21 00:43:36 i wasn't on IT course Apr 21 00:43:38 :) Apr 21 00:43:47 it's like a Dijkstra, but informed Apr 21 00:44:07 How can I enable host USB support on the 770? Apr 21 00:44:16 you could set rough points and it would search for the track Apr 21 00:44:18 I know I need a power injector, and I'm working on that. But host mode is first Apr 21 00:45:47 Paulius: flasher Apr 21 00:45:57 could you elaborate? Apr 21 00:46:06 Paulius: flasher3.0 -h. it's one of the switches. Apr 21 00:46:16 oh it's a command? Apr 21 00:46:28 yes, for the tool you use to flash the device. Apr 21 00:46:36 flash it to what? Apr 21 00:46:38 which I don't have installed right now, so. Apr 21 00:46:38 Another OS? Apr 21 00:46:53 hmm, i should see the barber soon Apr 21 00:47:03 or find a way keeping my hair out of my eyes Apr 21 00:47:21 no, you can use the flasher tool to send commands to the device. one of the commands is "enable host mode" (according to dragorn ) Apr 21 00:47:34 cut it. i did unfortunately Apr 21 00:47:35 lcuk, shouldn't you be in bed alredy? Apr 21 00:48:03 :( but mum can i just stay up and watch this? Apr 21 00:48:10 no, you can't Apr 21 00:48:15 it's dark Apr 21 00:48:21 oh i hate you. its so unfair. Apr 21 00:48:31 your eyes will hate YOU Apr 21 00:48:35 otherwise Apr 21 00:48:36 :) Apr 21 00:48:40 nahhh im thinking Apr 21 00:48:58 k k, just kidding Apr 21 00:56:49 lcuk: oh, are you? Apr 21 00:57:12 always Apr 21 00:57:40 * lcuk wonders what he just answered to Apr 21 00:57:59 I think he's insinuating that you don't think.. but I might be wrong Apr 21 00:58:31 * ImMelody is glad she's a woman and can take huge steps in logic like that. Apr 21 00:59:50 the left column on the app manager is just a few characters wide. I can't seem to widen the column. The column marker is not draggable Apr 21 01:00:05 Fixed in svn Apr 21 01:00:08 or Diablo Apr 21 01:00:27 For the time being, you can display by category Apr 21 01:00:32 or disable the bad repository Apr 21 01:00:34 or just use apt Apr 21 01:01:13 has it changed from 1 category per program? Apr 21 01:01:31 ImMelody, i think you're right Apr 21 01:01:56 huh Apr 21 01:02:18 i turn my eyes away from the chan for a few mins and there's a hundreds of lines Apr 21 01:02:37 get a neural interface :P Apr 21 01:02:55 what? are you crazy? Apr 21 01:02:56 what did I miss? : Apr 21 01:03:06 conencting irc directly to neural if is dangerous Apr 21 01:03:07 :) Apr 21 01:03:07 I leave for a few hours and miss thousands of lines Apr 21 01:03:13 if=interface Apr 21 01:03:34 only in your mind ;) Apr 21 01:08:52 If you can't handle that much of fuzz... then yeah Apr 21 01:09:47 ok... I'm SOOOOOOOOOOoooooooooooo confused Apr 21 01:09:59 :) Apr 21 01:10:03 too much irc? Apr 21 01:10:26 too many antihistamines Apr 21 01:10:51 take some antiantihistamines Apr 21 01:11:12 wouldn't that bring the histamines back? Apr 21 01:12:06 i have thought you have stated your problem with 'too many' Apr 21 01:12:07 :) Apr 21 01:12:37 allergy = no fun Apr 21 01:12:50 move Apr 21 01:12:51 :) Apr 21 01:13:04 I didn't think about the fact that one of my regularly daily meds for anxiety is an antihistamine before taking another antihistamine earlier today Apr 21 01:13:32 then just go to sleep Apr 21 01:13:33 :) Apr 21 01:13:41 We haven't had supper yet XD Apr 21 01:14:08 but I think I'll nap til my husband makes some.. Apr 21 01:14:14 bibi! Apr 21 01:14:30 bibi? Apr 21 01:15:07 bye bye? Apr 21 01:15:11 ahm Apr 21 01:22:46 Hey. has anyone installed the kde desktop to your MMC Card? Apr 21 01:23:23 probably Apr 21 01:23:36 someone was fighting with it yesterday Apr 21 01:23:40 with success afair Apr 21 01:25:05 well i followed the guide from tablethack.com and got it to install, and boot to the mmc card, but for some reason it installed to the wrong partition. I created a 1.5 gig partition for the OS and a 400 mb partition for storage, and for some reason it installed to the 400mb partition. Does anyone know how I can fix this? Apr 21 01:26:00 copy the filesystem over to the other one? Apr 21 01:27:04 yeah how do i copy it? Apr 21 01:28:11 right, im off for the evening. another week starts Apr 21 01:28:26 gnite KotCzarny, pupnik and everyone else :) Apr 21 01:28:56 nite nite Apr 21 02:12:44 I'm trying to download "pushit" (sokoban clone) for the N800 (OS2008), but the only url I can find is broken....does anyone happen to have a working url for that package? Apr 21 02:12:54 tearsync works up to 11 fps, breaks at 12 fps Apr 21 02:14:21 at 256x240 @ 8bpp with sdl Apr 21 02:16:10 :o Apr 21 02:17:07 just makes me more impressed at ssvb and lcuk's work Apr 21 02:17:20 but horizontal scrolling is *the* torture test Apr 21 02:17:21 :> Apr 21 02:18:04 rotating wheel is also nice Apr 21 02:18:13 in the way of showing tearing Apr 21 02:23:05 sorry WormFood Apr 21 02:23:20 ? Apr 21 02:23:28 Navi: you can try it if you're curious. http://pupnik.de/SDL_scrolly_sync.tgz Apr 21 02:23:46 untar it somewhere and run ./scrolling [FPS] Apr 21 02:23:50 I'm curious about something? Apr 21 02:24:02 Oh, right. Apr 21 02:24:10 Yay, no tearing Apr 21 02:24:17 actually i'm curious if maybe my oprofile kernel is screwing things up Apr 21 02:24:30 right now 50fps looks pretty good Apr 21 02:24:33 ./scrolling 50 Apr 21 02:25:42 but i can still see waves, at least on my device Apr 21 02:25:52 holding the unit vertically Apr 21 02:28:20 20 fps is atrocious Apr 21 02:29:45 it's as if my sync is fighting another sync Apr 21 02:31:49 looks like the maemo mapper automatically downloads maps on demand, as needed, so I don't need to store maps of cities I won't travel.. is that correct? Apr 21 02:32:03 maybe this horrible SDL video mode of 800x480 is actually telling lcd controller to refresh the whole screen on sync, even if pixel doubling is on and only a small area is updated? Apr 21 02:32:29 cause the motion in between jerks at 20fps looks about as smooth as 60 fps Apr 21 02:32:38 unixsnob: as long you have inet connection.. Apr 21 02:33:03 pupnik: i believe that may be true Apr 21 02:33:12 i have a portable evdo hotspot! this will be cool indeed Apr 21 02:33:17 http://www.gossamer-threads.com/lists/engine?do=post_view_printable;post=19711;list=maemo there's perhaps ssvb's best (incomplete) explanation of this Apr 21 02:33:49 the only thing I don't like is that bluetooth gps devices can only pair to one unit at a time Apr 21 02:34:13 So I can't use both tomtom for the palm and maemo mapper at the same time Apr 21 02:34:20 i think that i'm also losing for missing this ioctl(fd, OMAPFB_UPDATE_WINDOW, &update); Apr 21 02:34:44 pupnik: i think you have to tell sdl not to update fb automatically too Apr 21 02:34:57 but thx for the link Apr 21 02:35:01 that will come handy Apr 21 02:36:40 On N800 (OS2007 2.2006.51-6), every YUV screen update (OMAPFB_COLOR_YUY422) Apr 21 02:36:40 takes about 41ms without tearsync enabled and 41-58ms with tearsync. It does Apr 21 02:36:40 not matter what video resolution we try to watch, the result is the same. So Apr 21 02:36:40 the maximal screen update rate is about ~24fps without tearsync and ~20fps on Apr 21 02:36:41 average with tearsync. Apr 21 02:36:58 :( Apr 21 02:37:10 i could live with 20fps Apr 21 02:37:11 :) Apr 21 02:37:26 as long it's stable Apr 21 02:37:54 if that's true it means pixel doubling is fucking useless Apr 21 02:37:55 wow.. it's interesting to look at zoom level 1 on the mapper, and see how inaccurate the GPS signal actually is.. my stationary receiver is drawing a large blob Apr 21 02:38:21 how many meters off is it unixSnob Apr 21 02:38:49 pupnik: not true, you still gain some cp cycles Apr 21 02:38:51 *cpu Apr 21 02:38:55 ok true Apr 21 02:39:12 What GPS, unixSnob? Apr 21 02:39:23 Practically speaking, consumer GPS is plenty accurate, though. Apr 21 02:39:29 unixsnob: remember some maps NEED offset Apr 21 02:39:30 i'm not good at eyeballing distances.. but looks like 50 meters Apr 21 02:39:40 so it's not entirely gps inaccuracy Apr 21 02:39:41 Holux GPSlim240 Apr 21 02:39:44 You indoors? Apr 21 02:39:57 i've been off at most about 2-3 meters Apr 21 02:39:59 it would be inaccurate if you observe DRIFT Apr 21 02:40:08 constant drift Apr 21 02:40:16 yes, indoors, signals coming through skylights Apr 21 02:40:25 There's your problem. Apr 21 02:40:51 and that's w/ 6 satellites Apr 21 02:40:58 i think maemo-mapper allows entering offset Apr 21 02:44:45 6 satellites is a weak lock. **** ENDING LOGGING AT Mon Apr 21 02:59:56 2008