**** BEGIN LOGGING AT Tue Apr 22 02:59:57 2008 Apr 22 03:19:26 Does anyone knows how to reboot the 770? except type in CLI. Apr 22 03:19:36 remove battery? Apr 22 03:19:37 ;) Apr 22 03:19:55 on n8x0 there's 'power button menu' Apr 22 03:20:07 that one can enable 'reboot' there Apr 22 03:20:34 StormEveryDay, /etc/mce/mce.ini Apr 22 03:21:07 I need modify the ini file? Apr 22 03:21:50 Actually, that should be /etc/systemui/systemui.xml Apr 22 03:21:58 and yes. Apr 22 03:22:08 It's well commented and easy to read. Apr 22 03:22:17 OKOK, thanks Apr 22 03:22:19 storm: or just install a script in menu Apr 22 03:22:24 that will do the same Apr 22 03:22:35 (ie. call reboot) Apr 22 03:23:31 thanks kot:) I will also try it. Apr 22 03:24:11 i think you can simply use some other app's .desktop file Apr 22 03:24:25 and just change command from that app to /sbin/reboot Apr 22 03:24:26 or something Apr 22 03:24:40 or sudo reboot Apr 22 03:24:49 whatever works Apr 22 03:24:50 :) Apr 22 03:26:10 OK, I use reboot in xterm, it tells me use shutdown is better? Apr 22 03:26:25 shutdown won't reboot Apr 22 03:26:35 only stops the os hard Apr 22 03:26:36 :) Apr 22 03:26:41 haha Apr 22 03:27:18 OK, I also have another problem, how to get an AP list to connect when AP is many in local? Apr 22 03:27:21 anyway, try enabling reboot in power button menu first Apr 22 03:27:44 [grammar parser failed] Apr 22 03:27:45 :) Apr 22 03:27:56 or was it logic parser Apr 22 03:29:11 770 is not in my hand now, I will try your suggestion later. Apr 22 03:29:23 then how to solve scan AP problem? Apr 22 03:29:50 you can define your own ap Apr 22 03:29:55 that will always show on the top Apr 22 03:30:12 keep in mind that i have n800 with os2008 Apr 22 03:30:20 things in 770 can be a little different Apr 22 03:30:38 I know Apr 22 03:36:36 I'm getting my maemo n800 order ready Apr 22 03:36:42 :) Apr 22 03:36:43 i mean amazon order Apr 22 03:36:50 do I need screen protectors? Apr 22 03:36:56 depends Apr 22 03:37:01 I recommend them. Apr 22 03:37:02 will you feel safer? Apr 22 03:37:08 In particular, the Boxwave anti-glare. Apr 22 03:37:15 The glare reduction is particularly nice. Apr 22 03:38:04 thats like 12 bucks for 1 though Apr 22 03:38:11 huh? Apr 22 03:38:12 It's a lifetime protector. Apr 22 03:38:16 where as there are others that come in a 15 pack for 10 bucks Apr 22 03:38:19 You don't replace it. Apr 22 03:38:22 Those are garbage Apr 22 03:38:24 They scratch Apr 22 03:38:28 The Boxwave doesn't scratch. Apr 22 03:38:34 You put it on and forget it Apr 22 03:38:46 the others you have to replace a lot. Apr 22 03:38:50 not true Apr 22 03:39:21 unless you use steel nail instead of stylus/finernail Apr 22 03:40:16 I doin't feel so bad about spending 12 bucks for protection+ antiglare as long as it does stay on there Apr 22 03:40:42 It also reduces the appearance of finger grease quite a bit. Apr 22 03:41:03 Mmmm finger grease Apr 22 03:41:24 what about an actual case for it, that sleeve it comes with looks cheap and useless Apr 22 03:41:43 yup Apr 22 03:41:45 Really depends on your use-case. Apr 22 03:41:59 Personally, the sleeve it's bundled with suite my purposes perfectly. Apr 22 03:42:05 Other people don't like it Apr 22 03:42:09 sleeve makes a nice look Apr 22 03:42:20 I just leave it in my pocket all the time Apr 22 03:42:22 and protects the device from dirt Apr 22 03:42:23 slip the N800 in and out. Apr 22 03:42:28 in the backpack/pocket Apr 22 03:42:31 Most of the other cases block the use of the kickstand Apr 22 03:42:42 which is a deal breaker Apr 22 03:42:51 only for some Apr 22 03:42:52 :) Apr 22 03:43:14 Something like a Nintendo DS or case logic portable hard drive case will work if you just want a carrying case. Apr 22 03:43:25 just use common sense Apr 22 03:43:25 Either way, the unit is quite durable Apr 22 03:43:30 and a case isn't really necessary. Apr 22 03:43:34 whatever suits you Apr 22 03:43:39 I don't just mean a leather sleeve, I mean something a tad bigger so I can fit my keyboard in there and maybe even a GPS device in the future Apr 22 03:44:06 then probably some hardshell hdd case Apr 22 03:44:06 :) Apr 22 03:44:43 KotCzarny: Oooh now you're talking Apr 22 03:44:59 that was ga suggestion Apr 22 03:45:08 I'd have to pick one up later I suppose though. Thats the kinda thing you gotta try out to make sure everthing fits Apr 22 03:45:09 'case logic portable hard drive case' Apr 22 03:48:42 OK, I'm getting the n800, the BoxWave Anti-Glare protector, and the iGo stowaway blutooth Keyboard and 1 16gb stick (i'll get a 32gig later when they come out and lower in price) Apr 22 03:49:26 Audio Input - dsppcmsrc for N800? Apr 22 03:49:32 I'll hold off on the case for now since they sell case logic locally and I won't have to pay shipping and I can make sure everything fits with room for the GPS later Apr 22 03:53:36 Nice, next time you guys hear from me, I'll be a maemo user and prolly bitching because I can't get maemo 2008 installed =) Apr 22 03:54:33 unlikely Apr 22 03:54:43 you will be bitching about pairing bt kb Apr 22 03:54:44 :) Apr 22 03:55:09 it worked for me after ~20-30 tries Apr 22 03:55:22 but i must admit it was first time i have used bt kb Apr 22 03:56:43 lol Apr 22 03:56:56 that or the wiimote Apr 22 03:57:11 blue tooth and linux have never been super easy Apr 22 03:57:25 nah, i think it's more like a proper timing Apr 22 03:57:29 i have a blue tooth headset that'll be necesary to get paired too Apr 22 03:57:38 tiny frame of time to do it Apr 22 03:58:03 you mean to type in the code? Apr 22 03:58:11 yes Apr 22 03:58:38 Ah, I'm fast and I have a room mate if nececary =) Apr 22 03:59:03 man this is gonna be a long week. I hate waiting for stuff I already paid for Apr 22 03:59:28 then start preparing sdk etc Apr 22 03:59:50 i think there is a way to run maemo in emulator too Apr 22 04:00:02 what do I need to do that for? Apr 22 04:00:13 you can try apps ;) Apr 22 04:00:33 ah yes, and I could try to get adom running under Qemu Apr 22 04:00:39 which is critical =) Apr 22 04:00:44 hmm Apr 22 04:00:52 i think there's no port of adom Apr 22 04:01:05 because author haven't released the source Apr 22 04:01:10 nor armel binary Apr 22 04:01:10 :) Apr 22 04:01:24 maybe dosemu version then Apr 22 04:01:26 its an elf binary Apr 22 04:01:38 elf but for x86 Apr 22 04:01:50 right, i can't get that to work under qemu? Apr 22 04:02:14 hmm Apr 22 04:02:28 i think qemu was made available for armel only recently Apr 22 04:02:32 so i don't know :) Apr 22 04:03:21 well poop. Guess I am gonna have to start emulating maemo. Where can I get that from? Apr 22 04:03:43 it comes with sdk Apr 22 04:04:03 for windows just gram vmware image Apr 22 04:04:07 *grab Apr 22 04:04:16 i don't run windows Apr 22 04:04:24 if i did I'da gotten an iphone =) Apr 22 04:04:31 heh Apr 22 04:04:53 i think there's vmware for linux too? Apr 22 04:04:55 :) Apr 22 04:05:04 or just follow sdk install instructions Apr 22 04:05:05 :) Apr 22 04:05:08 maemo.org Apr 22 04:05:39 which do I need? Chinook? Apr 22 04:05:45 yes Apr 22 04:05:51 There's also some coming support for emulating an N800 directly... I've almost got it working :-P Apr 22 04:06:20 `hrw' claims to have it working with a magic "config.mtd" that he won't let anyone else look at, or even compare it to things we send him :-P Apr 22 04:06:23 trolla: good, keep the reports coming Apr 22 04:06:24 :) Apr 22 04:06:59 I guess I could just setup an SSH server at home and SSH in and play adom Apr 22 04:07:10 hmm Apr 22 04:07:13 probably Apr 22 04:07:15 :) Apr 22 04:07:22 of course I would be limited only when I have wifi access Apr 22 04:07:31 I'm going to try putting my N800 in R&D mode and then trying the "config.mtd" (generated from the mtd1 block device), but that will have to wait until tomorrow... I was hoping to get a known-good to compare to Apr 22 04:07:38 you can get nethack or zangband Apr 22 04:08:59 Don't get me wrong, those are fine games. But adom is near roguelike perfection. I don't like the monsters from various sources those games have, it doesn't feel like a consistent universe like every other game. It just seems like a nerds wet dream Apr 22 04:09:33 i have mailed adom's author, but haven't got any reply.. Apr 22 04:10:10 He is making JADE which is gonna be extra sweet. Its in java so hopefully that'll be cross platform enough Apr 22 04:10:22 no java on n8x0 Apr 22 04:10:24 :) Apr 22 04:10:39 Whaaaa Apr 22 04:10:50 DAMN IT Apr 22 04:10:53 mail him Apr 22 04:11:05 Does anyone know where the GCC toolchain repository is for N8X0 devices? Apr 22 04:11:09 my bet is if there's enough request he will make a port Apr 22 04:11:15 it's just a simple compile Apr 22 04:11:24 because all libs/tools are there Apr 22 04:11:36 tankc: official or unofficial? Apr 22 04:11:37 will do, I talked my buddy into it as well and hes getting the same setup as myself. He plays a ton more adom than me, he'll email him too Apr 22 04:11:51 KotCzarny, whichever works better Apr 22 04:12:29 hmm, one more question, you want to install it on device or in scratchbox ? Apr 22 04:12:36 on the device Apr 22 04:12:40 KotCzarny: The SMART thing to do would for us all to send him a postcard with the request Apr 22 04:12:51 then repository.maemo.org/dist/ Apr 22 04:12:52 :) Apr 22 04:12:53 since adom is "postcardware" Apr 22 04:12:59 KotCzarny, Want to mail me your `config.mtd' for an additional compare point ? Generate by doing: cat /dev/mtdblock1 > config.mtd (it will contain your lock code, but ... I won't unlock your device, promise :-P) Apr 22 04:13:27 trolla: i'm afraid because i don't know it's function :) Apr 22 04:14:10 tankc: http://repository.maemo.org/pool/chinook/free/g/gcc-3.4/ Apr 22 04:14:19 KotCzarny, It contains configuration crap (it's like 384KB), most notably your lock code (also contains settings like r&d_mode, brightness, but nothing sensitive) Apr 22 04:14:40 I'll put mine up, if you want to have a look-see :-P Apr 22 04:14:53 interesting, thanks KotCzarny Apr 22 04:15:05 http://www.rkeene.org/tmp/config.mtd Apr 22 04:16:45 lock code is plain text Apr 22 04:16:45 lol Apr 22 04:17:11 Yes, but it's not very useful to know :-P Apr 22 04:17:16 yup Apr 22 04:20:29 Please to be mailing to wiki@rkeene.org ? :-P Apr 22 04:22:26 trolla, i think diff should be made intelligently Apr 22 04:22:41 because cmp resulted in a ~70kb file Apr 22 04:23:18 That's because cmp is silly and doesn't group contigious regions Apr 22 04:23:26 yup Apr 22 04:23:28 And doesn't account for "fuzz" Apr 22 04:23:34 but diff doesn't work on binary files Apr 22 04:23:42 I'm going to use a binary diff, and try to patch my config file to make it work Apr 22 04:23:47 or at least i don't know how to diff it Apr 22 04:23:52 xdiff :-P Apr 22 04:24:02 bash: xdiff: command not found Apr 22 04:24:04 :P Apr 22 04:24:43 That's okay, it wasn't the right command anyway.. :-P Apr 22 04:25:16 bsdiff Apr 22 04:25:23 Xdelta was what I was thinking about, but `bsdiff' might be better Apr 22 04:28:40 Any luck ? Apr 22 04:28:56 bsdiff produced 1.3kb file Apr 22 04:29:01 but i think it's compressed Apr 22 04:29:01 ;) Apr 22 04:29:06 Excellent :-P Apr 22 04:29:46 it would be nice if bsdiff was more verbose about what it found Apr 22 04:31:17 Are our two files exactly the same size ? Apr 22 04:31:21 yes Apr 22 04:31:22 Is your device in R&D mode ? Apr 22 04:31:30 why should i need rd mode? Apr 22 04:31:38 dd is enough Apr 22 04:31:39 I'm just curious Apr 22 04:31:51 i have never used rd mode Apr 22 04:31:54 Mine's not, I was hoping to get one that was, but my Nokia is at work Apr 22 04:33:37 How about this, have you tried to run QEMU using your `config.mtd' ? Apr 22 04:33:43 not yet Apr 22 04:33:54 (I don't see WTF everyone is being secretive about a file with no useful information in it.) Apr 22 04:34:12 because no one know what's there Apr 22 04:34:32 *knows Apr 22 04:34:39 You can look at it Apr 22 04:34:47 0xFFFF will dump it Apr 22 04:34:53 dd will dump it doo Apr 22 04:34:55 *too Apr 22 04:35:08 0xFFFF will PARSE it and dump that. Apr 22 04:35:12 nice Apr 22 04:35:15 cmd line ? Apr 22 04:35:23 Everyone knows what is in it, it's nothing useful Apr 22 04:35:30 link Apr 22 04:35:32 :) Apr 22 04:35:40 because i don't know, yet Apr 22 04:35:50 -x extract configuration entries from /dev/mtd1 Apr 22 04:36:08 hmm Apr 22 04:36:20 i wonder why the tablet drops the connection under load Apr 22 04:36:21 weird Apr 22 04:36:43 It probably runs out of RAM and the oom_killer() kills the next thing that asks for a page. Apr 22 04:36:54 (Likely SSH) Apr 22 04:37:14 could be, as i'm copying a big file Apr 22 04:37:27 though ssh session isn't killed Apr 22 04:37:28 hum Apr 22 04:38:16 may be some power saving brokennel Apr 22 04:38:20 brokennes Apr 22 04:38:40 because it hangs hard Apr 22 04:38:49 even stops responging to pings Apr 22 04:39:15 luckily on linux tcp connections aren't reset on interface down/up Apr 22 04:39:16 :) Apr 22 04:40:08 [237086.015625] cx3110x: WARNING TX dropped. Apr 22 04:40:09 heh Apr 22 04:40:18 i hate closed sources. Apr 22 04:40:40 I assumed you weren't a programmer :-P Apr 22 04:40:53 why? Apr 22 04:40:54 :P Apr 22 04:41:21 because i'm paranoid? Apr 22 04:41:22 :P Apr 22 04:41:23 Because it wasn't obvious to you what that file contained after some basic inspection :-P Apr 22 04:41:40 it contains binary data Apr 22 04:41:46 which may be everything Apr 22 04:41:58 from trash to serial numbers Apr 22 04:42:46 But you would recognize your serial number (MAC address) in a hex-dump Apr 22 04:43:05 it was just an example Apr 22 04:43:15 i don't know what it contains Apr 22 04:43:16 :) Apr 22 04:44:01 There's no other remotely sensitive data that could be on there since (almost) everything presumably runs as a user which doesn't have permission to write to that device Apr 22 04:44:38 i think output of 0xFFFF will be more usefull than raw data Apr 22 04:44:48 0x00040000 : ConF 02 00 01 00 : r&d_mode 00 00 00 00 01 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 b8 46 3c ca 00 ff ff ff Apr 22 04:44:55 that's the line for rd Apr 22 04:45:10 But you have r&d_mode off, just like me :-P Apr 22 04:45:27 still, there may be differences Apr 22 04:45:57 KotCzarny: just broke my Fonera free, seems the earlier revisions are dns exploitable, this should be fun going to load OpenWRT Apr 22 04:46:05 lol Apr 22 04:46:14 0x00052000 : ConF 02 02 01 00 : r&d_mode 00 00 00 00 01 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 3a 70 24 17 00 ff ff ff Apr 22 04:46:26 0x00048800 : ConF 02 00 01 00 : r&d_mode 00 00 00 00 01 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 b8 46 3c ca 00 ff ff ff Apr 22 04:46:57 My "00" version is exactly the same as yours... do you not have any "01" and "02" versions ? Apr 22 04:47:07 nope Apr 22 04:47:10 only this one Apr 22 04:47:43 This helps me none. Apr 22 04:48:29 When I get it working, I'm just not going to post the solution "just-in-case" (I mean, I gotta be paranoid with useless information right ?) :-P Apr 22 04:48:46 :) Apr 22 04:48:54 whatever works for you Apr 22 04:50:19 I'll post screenshots though. Apr 22 04:51:31 hmm, i think it's some kind of /var/log/messages Apr 22 04:52:16 or more like dmi tables Apr 22 05:09:01 tell me n800 won't damage with fall? Apr 22 05:09:14 or hit Apr 22 05:10:01 hi .. im using playbin with gst-launch on maemo.. its creating its own window.. but i want that video output to be part of my window..any pointers... Apr 22 05:10:33 im doing that using gtk in C Apr 22 05:14:26 how can i export the maemo GUI to desktop (ssh -X) and running osso_calculator opens on the device (DISPLAY=localhost:10.0); have done xhost + (just for test purpose) Apr 22 05:43:32 i rekon gimp and/or inkscape are too heavy for the tablets, but are there a similar programs? Or am I wrong and those apps can run? Apr 22 05:44:06 * RST38h remembers someone running gimp on Maemo Apr 22 05:53:31 Hi Apr 22 05:53:51 Someone have try the last mplayer packages Apr 22 05:54:00 internet has Apr 22 05:54:01 :) Apr 22 05:54:13 it s seem s a bit more slow than the last one Apr 22 05:54:13 woodwizzle, there is mtpaint and mypaint for your drawing needs Apr 22 05:54:27 I haven't tried them yet. I have them installed, though Apr 22 05:55:16 Navi, cool i'll check those out then. Having a touchpad interface seems like you gotta ahve some sorta paint =) Apr 22 05:55:41 hrm Apr 22 05:55:51 I can't get simple launcher to launch my stuff :P Apr 22 05:56:35 whatdoesitsay Apr 22 05:56:45 Nothing Apr 22 05:58:07 Maybe it does not find your stuff? Is the directory name correct? Apr 22 05:58:28 What? Apr 22 05:59:14 oh, there it goes Apr 22 05:59:32 but transparent background still no work Apr 22 06:04:40 what should i add for extras repo in chinook in scratchbox? Apr 22 06:04:55 What size is the terminal screen? I need it to be 80x25 Apr 22 06:05:25 woodwizzle: depends on font used Apr 22 06:05:35 but you have ~800x480 pixels Apr 22 06:05:46 which is more than enough Apr 22 06:07:58 KotCzarny: Good deal Apr 22 06:08:07 turns out there is an adom server =) Apr 22 06:08:21 :) Apr 22 06:08:39 problem solved ;) Apr 22 06:08:46 just requires ssh Apr 22 06:09:26 for the most part solved. I'll be dependent on an internet connection, although bluetoothing with my phone to play something similar to a BBS is still more bandwidth than necesary Apr 22 06:09:51 ping times could be a funkiller Apr 22 06:09:53 :) Apr 22 06:10:05 bah, its turn based =) Apr 22 06:10:16 ;) Apr 22 06:10:28 still, if you have to travel many squares... Apr 22 06:10:29 ;) Apr 22 06:10:41 I user to play on a BBS that had just about every other roguelike and of course L.O.R.D. its dead now though. I think a BBS for maemo users would be pretty kick ass Apr 22 06:10:53 s/user/used Apr 22 06:11:14 is there a playable adom port ? Apr 22 06:11:36 only with woodwizzle's method Apr 22 06:11:40 ie. via ssh Apr 22 06:11:57 (or dosemu) Apr 22 06:11:57 naah... Apr 22 06:12:03 RST38h: http://adomserver.ath.cx/adom_server_info.txt Apr 22 06:12:06 * RST38h is still waiting for Angband Apr 22 06:12:21 The version announced on itt does not work Apr 22 06:12:22 rst38h: i believe pupnik compiled it Apr 22 06:12:26 or was it zangband Apr 22 06:12:30 He did, but it does not work Apr 22 06:12:34 zangband will do, really Apr 22 06:12:39 what doesn't work? Apr 22 06:12:58 it brings up the xterm bu then screws up Apr 22 06:13:18 just run some not hildonized term Apr 22 06:13:19 :) Apr 22 06:13:25 Maybe it requires a different, improved xterm - mine is the one that came with OS Apr 22 06:14:37 hmm Apr 22 06:14:46 it's in debian too, should compile cleanly Apr 22 06:23:01 uhum Apr 22 06:23:03 compiled ok Apr 22 06:23:11 :) Apr 22 06:23:34 Did anyone port fortune y/day? I'm doing it now and I've got an essay to do so I don't want to waste time :) Apr 22 06:24:19 nope Apr 22 06:24:24 Ok, thanks :) Apr 22 06:24:26 want me to try compiling it? Apr 22 06:24:36 No worries, I'm doing it now. Apr 22 06:24:39 :) Apr 22 06:24:47 Hmm, to include offensive fortunes? :p Apr 22 06:24:50 yup Apr 22 06:24:53 always Apr 22 06:25:28 Package fortunes-bofh-excuses Apr 22 06:25:29 lol Apr 22 06:25:43 Hehe, I'll package it separately. Offensive fortunes don't really bother me but they actually make me laugh :/ Apr 22 06:25:46 Ok :) Apr 22 06:25:53 yes, they are separate in debian Apr 22 06:27:27 anyway, if someone needs aterm or zangband they are here: http://mrrau.dyndns.org:23280/n800/dist/ Apr 22 06:27:37 Anything wrong with control? Apr 22 06:27:38 http://pastebin.ca/992930 Apr 22 06:27:42 KotCzarny, great, thanks :) Apr 22 06:28:21 why don't you simply use debian source package? Apr 22 06:28:22 :) Apr 22 06:28:46 It was compiled from there, I'm just making into maemo deb :) Apr 22 06:29:01 :) Apr 22 06:29:51 It looks ok to me but I haven't really packaged anything for general public consumption (unless you count the dodgy deb I did for mmc-unionfs) Apr 22 06:30:22 ah, well, i forgot to add user/ Apr 22 06:30:23 :) Apr 22 06:30:37 Hehe, I'm a dpkg fan :) Apr 22 06:30:45 Although most people aren't :/ Apr 22 06:31:29 I really dislike the application manager. I'm gonna have another go with synaptic from the etch section. I built it from unstable and it worked in Scratchbox but not on tablet. Apr 22 06:32:38 what about package kit Apr 22 06:32:43 ? Apr 22 06:32:48 what package kit? Apr 22 06:32:53 woodwizzle, looks too much for me Apr 22 06:33:03 KotCzarny, some freedesktop thing Apr 22 06:33:16 not debianized? Apr 22 06:33:17 :) Apr 22 06:33:23 package kit is kinda an open standard Apr 22 06:33:34 frontend for any package manager Apr 22 06:33:53 nice Apr 22 06:33:54 rpms, debs, conary, smart etc. Apr 22 06:33:58 .tgz too? Apr 22 06:33:59 ;) Apr 22 06:34:16 kinda new. Not done yet but looks promising and its a damn fine idea Apr 22 06:45:56 Hmm. someone else want to do fortune? I can't figure it out. Apr 22 06:46:03 lol Apr 22 06:46:13 i have logged off the sbox Apr 22 06:46:21 because you have said you will do it :) Apr 22 06:46:42 nooooo, i'll keep trying but I'm a failure. If someone beats me to it, I don't care :p Apr 22 06:46:56 k k Apr 22 06:47:08 i'm in the middle of ff8 session anyway :) Apr 22 06:47:25 hehe :) Apr 22 06:47:38 firefox8? :D Apr 22 06:47:39 if you still fail to compile it till tomorrow i will try to do it :) Apr 22 06:47:47 cpt: that would be fx8 Apr 22 06:47:48 :) Apr 22 06:47:55 or even more correctly Fx8 Apr 22 06:48:17 i wish...people keep saying ff3 pwns, and i ask them if they mean for the DS (final fantasy 3 on the nintendo ds) Apr 22 06:48:23 :) Apr 22 06:48:34 KotCzarny, Ok. I can't figure it out. It compiles fine but when I run it in sbox, I get no fortunes even though the data files are there and the package isn't right. Apr 22 06:48:48 qwerty: strace Apr 22 06:49:01 Khertan made a applet that shows fortunes, so that's why we want this :) Apr 22 06:49:02 Thanks Apr 22 06:52:56 http://www.google.co.ck/ Apr 22 07:08:48 anyone know how to fix that glitch where the home screen resets to default? Apr 22 07:25:01 Any chance someone here has the "pushit" package laying around? I can't seem to find it Apr 22 07:34:50 hi, i have newly registered at the internet tablet forums and trying to post a new message, but the forum website keeps giving me "you do not have permission to access this page" message. What do I need to do? Apr 22 07:39:30 jyro: check your email and click the confirm link? Apr 22 07:41:45 oh that's strange... i must have lost that email Apr 22 07:42:04 thanks for the pointer though, let me dig thru my mailbox Apr 22 07:43:52 * tbf wonders why scratchbox installs in /scratchbox, instead of the proper location /opt/scratchbox Apr 22 07:43:54 thu shall not create random folders at / Apr 22 07:44:42 just symlink it Apr 22 07:44:53 also it asks you when do you want it to install to Apr 22 07:45:41 *where Apr 22 07:45:50 KotCzarny: symlinking doesn't get rid of the invalid /scratchbox folder Apr 22 07:46:00 i know Apr 22 07:46:02 KotCzarny: and the debian packages do not ask Apr 22 07:46:09 Morning, all Apr 22 07:46:12 that's what my next comment was for Apr 22 08:02:55 what needs to be installed to get chinese fonts in /scratchbox? Apr 22 08:07:02 never mind, found this, http://browser-extras.garage.maemo.org/news/2/ Apr 22 08:08:49 tbf: the reason falls in the category of "legacy crap" I believe Apr 22 08:47:11 bon dia / good morning Apr 22 09:13:56 CptLaptop: Were you the one that posted the link to a USB "SmartCable" on USB Geek? Apr 22 09:20:34 morning Apr 22 09:20:44 arg Apr 22 09:20:50 what's qgil's public maemo address? Apr 22 09:21:34 timeless: first.last @ nokia ? Apr 22 09:21:52 didn't he have an @maemo.org? Apr 22 09:21:57 thats atleast what he uses in mailinglists.. Apr 22 09:36:53 timeless: he's used both, I think Apr 22 09:51:25 kulve: how to redirect the video output of playbin to my window... playbin is creating its own window... Apr 22 09:53:06 i used gst_x_overlay method... but still i could nt get the video output in my window.... Apr 22 09:53:12 any pointers...how to do that. Apr 22 09:56:04 soman: I don't know much about that, but try to check how kilikali does it: https://garage.maemo.org/plugins/scmsvn/viewcvs.php/trunk/src/kilikali-audio-gst.c?root=kilikali&rev=234&view=markup Apr 22 10:50:53 Hi Apr 22 10:51:27 Someone know how can i set background color to a gtk window in python ? Apr 22 11:04:10 kulve: whats the exact pipeline syntax for playing avi file on maemo Apr 22 11:07:06 soman: dunno. Just playbin uri=file.avi? Apr 22 11:07:33 but with playbin im unable to redirect the video output to my own window.. Apr 22 11:07:50 so iam trying to implement the pipeline for avi Apr 22 11:07:53 I think kilikali uses the playbin and it can do it.. Apr 22 11:08:04 did you check that url? Apr 22 11:08:19 yup... i checked.. but i didnt get any clue. Apr 22 11:08:42 you need to listen to the bus messages and use the gst_x_overlay_set_xwindow_id() there. Are you doing that? Apr 22 11:11:03 yup i did that Apr 22 11:11:23 i have used gst_x_overlay... Apr 22 11:11:23 then I'm out of ideas Apr 22 11:11:33 but it is giving error.. Apr 22 11:55:24 how can i install apps on my internal mmmc1/2? all my apps are installed on device memory! Apr 22 11:55:34 you can't Apr 22 11:55:44 (unless you boot from mmc) Apr 22 11:56:01 or with a kludge Apr 22 11:57:03 johnx are u sure? cos all my 256 mb is full now...almostly Apr 22 11:57:03 tell me n800 won't damage with fall? Apr 22 11:57:04 hit... Apr 22 11:57:33 how much space is left? Apr 22 11:58:02 have you removed the user guides and the Nokia video? Apr 22 11:58:28 "Won't damage with fall?" you mean if you drop it? Apr 22 11:59:13 you haven't installed maemo mapper and not changed the map save location to the SD have you? Apr 22 11:59:13 yes fall down Apr 22 11:59:13 i saw an hammer on n810 somewhere Apr 22 11:59:53 don't drop it and you won't find out :) Apr 22 12:01:13 ? Apr 22 12:01:41 Don't drop your N800 and it won't break Apr 22 12:02:55 dropping depends always on what you drop it on and how it happens to hit the ground... Apr 22 12:03:04 johnx ok Apr 22 12:03:15 something hard hits the screen and it will break Apr 22 12:03:25 yes i know Apr 22 12:06:43 who has this? http://maemo.org/downloads/product/OS2008/wifiinfo/ it is rare now :( Apr 22 12:08:33 zuh: can you please help me in redirecting the playbin video output to my own window Apr 22 12:10:04 oh i found it Apr 22 12:10:46 zuh: playbin is creating its own window .. how to redirect that video output to my own window Apr 22 12:13:01 http://anderenen.de/repository don't work? Apr 22 12:14:08 http://illumination.sf.net/maemo oh Apr 22 12:30:22 i bought a PDF subscription to the local newspaper, using it with Evince :D Apr 22 12:30:24 works great Apr 22 12:36:17 Hello Apr 22 12:36:22 Van itt egy magyar? Apr 22 12:36:42 this is an english channel Apr 22 12:36:52 I know. Apr 22 12:37:17 But i dont find a hungarian, who has got an nokia 770, and who can flash it. Apr 22 12:37:37 because i can't flash my nokia 770 Apr 22 12:37:56 because? Apr 22 12:38:27 sorry for my english Apr 22 12:38:32 one minute Apr 22 12:39:53 I don't know, how can i flash my noka 770. I read this description: http://maemo.org/community/wiki/howto_flashlatestnokiaimagewithlinux/, but i dont understand it. Apr 22 12:40:17 you use linux on your desktop computer? Apr 22 12:41:22 yes, i use ubuntu 7.10 Apr 22 12:42:10 do you want OS2006 or OS2007HE or OS2008HE? Apr 22 12:42:53 os2006 or os2007he Apr 22 12:43:28 It's not hard :/ Apr 22 12:43:45 it's not hard for you. Apr 22 12:44:29 Download the flasher, download the image you want, chmod +x flasher-2.0, sudo ./flasher-2.0 -F -f -R Apr 22 12:44:34 download OS2006 here: http://tablets-dev.nokia.com/nokia_770.php Apr 22 12:45:04 and then connect the 770 and turn it on Apr 22 12:50:26 i download the SU-18_2006SE_3.2006.49-2_PR_F5_MR0_ARM.bin, to my desktop. (/home/atka/Munkaasztal/SU-18_2006SE_3.2006.49-2_PR_F5_MR0_ARM.bin, /-i use hungarian ubuntu-), and i download the flasher-2.0, to my desktop too. Apr 22 12:50:57 what should i do? Apr 22 12:51:51 atka_: http://maemo.org/community/wiki/HOWTO_FlashLatestNokiaImageWithLinux/ Apr 22 12:52:16 hrw: i wrote, i read it, but i dont understand Apr 22 12:52:53 atka_, put the image and flasher in the same directory for convenience Apr 22 12:53:01 atka_: which part? Apr 22 12:53:12 those install instructions are brain dead simple Apr 22 12:53:38 then, within a terminal, cd to the directory you have the files in Apr 22 12:54:02 chmod +x flasher-2.0 Apr 22 12:54:16 sudo ./flasher-2.0 -F -f -R Apr 22 12:54:26 ok Apr 22 12:54:42 make sure your 770 is off and plug in the USB cable Apr 22 12:54:43 and my nokia 770, is on, and it is put on the usb? Apr 22 12:55:04 then turn it on or plug in the charger Apr 22 12:55:11 and it'll flash Apr 22 12:55:15 ok Apr 22 12:55:18 i probe it Apr 22 13:00:09 kulve: im using this "g_signal_connect (playbin, "pad-added", G_CALLBACK (cb_newpad), NULL);", where inside the callback im using gst_x_overlay method... Apr 22 13:00:25 but this callback is not getting called.. any pointer Apr 22 13:00:32 that doesn't sound right.. Apr 22 13:01:01 you should be listening to the bus messages, afaik. As I already said. Apr 22 13:01:16 yup .. i did that also Apr 22 13:03:20 kulve: http://pastebin.com/d2148b831 Apr 22 13:03:45 please check the link for my piece of code Apr 22 13:04:40 any pointer.. i could nt get where its going wrong Apr 22 13:07:18 kulve: even though im listening to bus messages still its not giving me the proper output Apr 22 13:08:32 there's no 3.0 flasher for mac os x? Apr 22 13:08:42 soman: I'm sorry, but I don't know enough about those things.. Apr 22 13:09:45 borism, no, but it doesn't matter Apr 22 13:09:47 ok Apr 22 13:09:53 The 2.0 version works 100%. Apr 22 13:10:10 you know anyone can help me in this matter' Apr 22 13:10:15 dont mind... Apr 22 13:10:16 GeneralAntilles: with n810 as well? Apr 22 13:10:24 With everything. Apr 22 13:10:32 alright Apr 22 13:25:31 re Apr 22 13:25:43 hm.. Apr 22 13:25:53 i write this to the terminal: Apr 22 13:26:41 sudo /home/atka/Munkaasztal/flasher-2.0 -f /home/atka/Munkaasztal/SU-18_2006SE_3.2006.49-2_PR_F5_MR0_ARM.bin -f -R Apr 22 13:26:55 (i wrote my password) Apr 22 13:27:18 "suitable usb device not found, waiting" Apr 22 13:27:20 * pupnik wonders if enum omapfb_update_mode Apr 22 13:27:31 u put u device in flashing mode? Apr 22 13:27:40 atka_, that's what it's supposed to say. Apr 22 13:27:40 in flasing mode? Apr 22 13:27:42 MANUAL_UPDATE should be set for tearsync Apr 22 13:28:06 i put my device to usb Apr 22 13:28:15 and i switch on it Apr 22 13:28:19 but nothing? Apr 22 13:28:23 what is the problem? Apr 22 13:28:50 does show the usb symbol when booting up? Apr 22 13:29:04 yes Apr 22 13:29:05 switch off it and next press button on top left side and power. Apr 22 13:29:15 ok Apr 22 13:29:47 now booting Apr 22 13:30:27 atka_: n810 or n800 ? Apr 22 13:30:46 hmm... i push the "full screen/not full screen button" and the off/on button, and nothing Apr 22 13:30:52 nokia 770 :) Apr 22 13:31:09 ah, then sorry i dont know.. ;) Apr 22 13:31:17 http://maemo.org/community/wiki/HOWTO_FlashLatestNokiaImageWithLinux/ read thaht. Apr 22 13:31:24 You want the home button Apr 22 13:31:24 :'( Apr 22 13:31:28 Not the fullscreen button. Apr 22 13:31:31 The one on the front face. Apr 22 13:31:32 okey Apr 22 13:31:44 770: Now plug in the charger to switch on the 770 or switch it on using the power button WHILE holding the Home-button Apr 22 13:31:54 okey Apr 22 13:32:58 hmm... Apr 22 13:32:59 nothing Apr 22 13:33:13 black screen, and in the centre "chargingi" Apr 22 13:33:17 -i Apr 22 13:33:48 before the black screen, there is a white screen, with the charging in the centre Apr 22 13:34:13 atka_: u read that webpage that i pasted? Apr 22 13:34:16 Unplug the charger. Apr 22 13:34:18 770: Unplug charger and switch off the Nokia 770. Connect it to your computer via USB without turning it on Apr 22 13:34:46 term-sig: yes, i read this page Apr 22 13:35:42 atka_: not enough carefull ;) Apr 22 13:35:58 because u dont unplug charger ;) Apr 22 13:36:05 or not enough langauge know Apr 22 13:36:15 okey, i reprobe Apr 22 13:39:18 atka_: and? Apr 22 13:39:49 i wrote the text to the terminal, (and i switch off my 770, and put off the usb), i press enter to the terminal, "Suitable USB device not found, waiting", i put in the charger, after i put in the usb cable, and i put off the charger Apr 22 13:39:54 and nothing ^^ Apr 22 13:40:27 Here's the procedure: Apr 22 13:40:32 Unplug the 770 and turn it off. Apr 22 13:40:45 Plug in the USB cable to the 770 and your computer. Apr 22 13:40:55 Start the flasher. Apr 22 13:41:27 Press and hold the Home key on the front of the 770 (bottommost button) and turn the device on. Apr 22 13:41:45 Did somebody install other gstreamer plugins in N800? Apr 22 13:42:10 ok GeneralAntillas Apr 22 13:42:15 i probe Apr 22 13:42:18 one minute Apr 22 13:42:24 thank you Apr 22 13:46:37 nothing :'( Apr 22 13:47:17 Either you're still not following the directions properly or there's a problem with your USB cable or port. Apr 22 13:47:27 i press the home button, (and i hold it) , and i press the power button, i waite 1 minute, but something, i "unpress" the home button, and nothing... Apr 22 13:47:30 Will it mount the MMC card when it's plugged into USB when it's turned on? Apr 22 13:47:41 The USB icon should appear in the upper right. Apr 22 13:47:51 USB is plugged in before you turn it on, correct? Apr 22 13:48:06 yes, there is an usb symbol on the right upper corner Apr 22 13:48:25 OK, that's good. Apr 22 13:48:26 and in the centrre, there is a NOKIA text. (blue) Apr 22 13:48:37 The device will wait for you to start the flashing process indefinitely. Apr 22 13:48:43 So get it there and leave it there for the time being. Apr 22 13:48:51 ok, i waiting Apr 22 13:48:55 OK Apr 22 13:48:57 Flasher-side. Apr 22 13:49:01 Stop the flasher and restart it again. Apr 22 13:49:15 now the flasher is running? Apr 22 13:49:21 Is it? Apr 22 13:49:37 in the terminal: Suitable usb device not found, waiting" Apr 22 13:49:49 usbfs mounted? Apr 22 13:49:53 yes Apr 22 13:49:57 i think Apr 22 13:50:03 Perhaps patch the flasher? With that perl string? Apr 22 13:50:13 >.< Apr 22 13:50:16 i don't know Apr 22 13:50:27 what is perl string? Apr 22 13:50:29 (sorry) Apr 22 13:50:36 Let me search for you ;) Apr 22 13:51:12 http://maemo.org/community/wiki/HOWTO_FlashLatestNokiaImageWithLinux/ Apr 22 13:51:16 Last lines.. Apr 22 13:51:50 oh my god Apr 22 13:51:54 thank you Apr 22 13:51:55 I had to do that too ;) Apr 22 13:51:58 i will patch it Apr 22 13:53:43 what should i draw to the terminal?- > perl -pi -e 's-/proc/bus/usb-/dev/bus/usb\000-;' -i ? Apr 22 13:54:56 Hmm it looks like the wiki messes that string up.. Apr 22 13:55:57 I think it is: Apr 22 13:55:58 perl -pi -e 's-/proc/bus/usb-/dev/bus/usb\000-;' -i.backup flasher-2.0 Apr 22 13:57:20 ooook Apr 22 13:57:23 thank you Apr 22 13:58:23 if i create a debian package from a python software, should i include the .pyo files or remove them? Apr 22 13:59:13 i think, i patched it. Apr 22 13:59:40 if there is a flasher-2.0.backup file, you have done it ;) Apr 22 14:00:31 yes, there is a flasher-2.0.backup :D:D:D Apr 22 14:04:25 USB device found found at bus 001, device adress 015 Apr 22 14:04:50 Found device SU-18, hardwer revision 1802 Apr 22 14:05:05 NOLO version 0.9.14 Apr 22 14:05:38 Version of 'SW release': SU-18_2006SE_3.2006.49-2_PR_F5_MR0_ARM Apr 22 14:05:44 flashing is complete? Apr 22 14:05:57 It'll restart when it's done. Apr 22 14:06:01 No ;) Apr 22 14:06:11 i should restart it? Apr 22 14:06:20 It will restart itself when it's done. Apr 22 14:06:25 or it should restart manually? Apr 22 14:06:27 What was your flasher command line? Apr 22 14:06:45 this: Apr 22 14:06:45 He had -R Apr 22 14:06:46 USB device found found at bus 001, device adress 015 Apr 22 14:06:46 Found device SU-18, hardwer revision 1802 Apr 22 14:06:46 NOLO version 0.9.14 Apr 22 14:06:46 Version of 'SW release': SU-18_2006SE_3.2006.49-2_PR_F5_MR0_ARM Apr 22 14:07:07 atka_: The commandline you used ;) Apr 22 14:07:29 command line=terminal, or not? Apr 22 14:08:13 what did you type in your terminal to get the paste you showed us ;) Apr 22 14:09:10 sudo /home/atka/Munkaasztal/flasher-2.0 -f /home/atka/Munkaasztal/SU-18_2006SE_3.2006.49-2_PR_F5_MR0_ARM.bin -f -R Apr 22 14:09:22 and after, my password Apr 22 14:09:29 That should reboot your device when flashing is done.. Apr 22 14:09:38 It wont flash, actually. Apr 22 14:09:44 Did you see the progress bar on your device? Apr 22 14:09:46 Ah -F Apr 22 14:09:47 You need the flasher-2.0 -f to be flasher-2.0 -F Apr 22 14:09:53 Yeah. Apr 22 14:09:56 omg Apr 22 14:09:59 :'( Apr 22 14:10:07 i will be crazy Apr 22 14:10:11 It is not dead ;) Don't worry.. Apr 22 14:10:35 You told it to flash something, twice, but you never told it what. ;) Apr 22 14:12:30 YEAH Apr 22 14:12:35 Flashing!!! Apr 22 14:13:41 Sending and flashing rootfs image (58368kB )... <- at the moment Apr 22 14:13:47 63% Apr 22 14:14:03 it's a sad day. i put my 810 up for sale :( Apr 22 14:14:10 why? Apr 22 14:14:13 how much? Apr 22 14:14:21 just not the right tool for the right job. Apr 22 14:14:36 and what is the right tool? Apr 22 14:14:44 and id on't need another pda sitting in my drawer of doom for 10 years Apr 22 14:14:48 (reboot now, my device! :D ) Apr 22 14:15:11 It's not a PDA. Apr 22 14:15:14 i'm not really sure. I think I need a mini laptop. I may try a eeepc4g or a 900 Apr 22 14:15:17 You'd have to find another drawer. Apr 22 14:15:22 but that's the drawer it would go into :P Apr 22 14:16:19 1 question: the os2007HE, greater than the os2006? Apr 22 14:16:26 Yes, atka_. Apr 22 14:16:30 ok Apr 22 14:16:36 For me, OS2008HE is better than OS2007HE, too. Apr 22 14:16:45 tomorow i flash it the 2007HE :D Apr 22 14:17:26 btw: you guys (here and over at ITT) have been awesome on helping me out with problems. that is much appriciated Apr 22 14:22:10 Thank you everybody :) Apr 22 14:26:26 mwaldron: how much are you asking, I just bought one Apr 22 14:26:41 400 obo Apr 22 14:26:47 ah, got mine for 320 Apr 22 14:26:54 not bad Apr 22 14:27:00 nope, it failed to suck Apr 22 14:27:26 i just spent $40 on a case that hasn'te ven arrived yet :/ Apr 22 14:28:08 noreve? Apr 22 14:28:53 pdair Apr 22 14:29:00 http://tinyurl.com/6x45a7 Apr 22 14:29:16 N810 costs US $682.11 now in germany. Apr 22 14:29:49 * mwaldron will ship international :P Apr 22 14:29:54 720 here in norway Apr 22 14:30:09 usd is in the crapper. pick up good deal :P Apr 22 14:30:11 we do have better warranties i think Apr 22 14:30:20 yeah we do Apr 22 14:30:37 mwaldron: then why is the N810 under $400 in USA? Apr 22 14:31:13 http://www.dealextreme.com/details.dx/sku.12247 <3 nice price Apr 22 14:31:46 because usa still #1 consumer of crap, they can't raise their prices in line with the weakening dollar or no one would ever buy anything Apr 22 14:33:11 if prices had matched our dollar's decline the us would prolly march on the fed and beat them bloody. as it stands teh average american hasn't yet noticed that we've lost our financial standing in the world Apr 22 14:33:44 you ever had one? Apr 22 14:33:56 $400 Apr 22 14:33:58 ??? Apr 22 14:34:00 :O Apr 22 14:34:35 in hungary, the nokia 770 -> $240 Apr 22 14:34:54 Cptnodegard: well there is a reason most of the world's centran banks held dollars as their reserve currency, and a reason that most commodities are priced in usd. but anyway, this isn't the channel for such converstaions... Apr 22 14:34:57 in the usa everything cheap.. Apr 22 14:35:01 :( Apr 22 14:35:06 mwaldron: US economy is sort of held up by the fact that the world really doesn't want it to go under, because US owns the world a lot of money? (and countries tend to own a lot of dollar) Apr 22 14:35:19 Veggen: yep pretty much Apr 22 14:36:09 atka, things arent cheap in the us compared to the wages there Apr 22 14:37:20 difference is they dont have any countries where its even cheaper that they can order from Apr 22 14:38:16 the canadians are giddy about the state of the USD Apr 22 14:38:27 they keep ordering US stuff at US prices and paying in CAD Apr 22 14:39:01 atka: What is the average appartment rent in Bulgaria? =) Apr 22 14:42:10 Bulgaria? Apr 22 14:47:40 i received just today some stuff from dealextreme.. the "microfiber" wipes seem to be anything but. for i guess that was a risk at $2 per 6pack. :) Apr 22 14:48:08 heh Apr 22 14:53:53 why nokia removed the n770 serial port nfo from the wiki? Apr 22 14:54:11 well..the question is not probably why...but where is it? Apr 22 14:57:58 http://www.internettablettalk.com/forums/showthread.php?p=173057#post173057 ssvb, inz, jott, lcuk, KotCzarny: new thread for high fps and tearsync problem and discussion. Apr 22 14:59:10 " Apr 22 14:59:10 At this point, I refuse to release emulators that run fullspeed internally, but which suffer from screen flicker, horizontal tearing and below 25 fps effective refresh.". you know you can slip some of them to me ;) Apr 22 14:59:18 I won't mind ;) Apr 22 14:59:31 there's plenty of work left Apr 22 15:00:58 Best of luck with it. I could do with some, I hate dead phones. I need to try and reflash a P1i I got :/ Apr 22 15:01:22 thanks and good luck to you too Apr 22 15:01:57 Thanks :). If someone can, tell KotCzarny I couldn't get a working fortune :( Apr 22 15:02:10 I probably won't be here when he is around. Apr 22 15:02:30 the bsdgames / unix fortune program? Apr 22 15:03:10 unix fortune. I've compiled a binary fine but it says nothing. I even tried the armel binary off the debian website and it still says nothing. Apr 22 15:06:23 hello pupnik. hm your sample SIGSEGVs on my n810 ... Apr 22 15:06:41 uh. wow :) Apr 22 15:06:56 thanks for testing - i'll check Apr 22 15:08:04 hola Apr 22 15:09:26 Heh, the US dollar is almost reaching 1.60 for 1 euro. 1.5980 at the moment ;) Apr 22 15:10:27 pupnik: ah you have to give an argument ;) Apr 22 15:10:48 i must have overlooked that in recent changes Apr 22 15:10:54 Hehe, people in the UK were getting excited about the pound being double the dollar. But now, oil is going up and jobs were cut. Apr 22 15:11:18 jott, i'm curious if you get smooth or jerky scrolling at 20-25 fps Apr 22 15:11:23 ;woo Apr 22 15:12:32 pupnik: looks jerky to me.. Apr 22 15:12:41 ok thanks, not related to my kernel then Apr 22 15:14:33 pupnik: should it actually be smooth? i can't see why for that matter.. Apr 22 15:15:37 it is requesting a display at exactly the requested framerate and supposedly telling omapfb to sync the display Apr 22 15:17:54 qwerty111: the debian/sid source package of fortunes builds just fine. Apr 22 15:18:14 jott, I can get it to build but it will not tell me any fortunes. Apr 22 15:19:49 I'm gonna try round 2 now. Apr 22 15:21:25 qwerty111: http://sse2.net/fortune/ Apr 22 15:21:41 Brilliant! Thanks :) Apr 22 15:22:29 pupnik: hmm shouldn't there be a way to use double buffering with the lcd? Apr 22 15:22:36 (atleast at lower resolutions) Apr 22 15:22:47 or is this only possible with yuv modes? Apr 22 15:24:27 jott, same problem as my build. running /usr/games/fortune says nothing. Apr 22 15:24:56 would be nice jott, theoretically i expect yes Apr 22 15:25:11 qwerty111: you also need a database of fortunes Apr 22 15:25:18 which is in a separate debian package, iirc Apr 22 15:25:38 I installed all the databases from that site Apr 22 15:25:43 also the lcd controller can apparently be put into 'manual refresh' mode. Which if i understand right, means you can update a region and the lcd controller only updates display when you tell it to Apr 22 15:25:54 I'm compiling documentation for the thread now Apr 22 15:30:06 qwerty111: works fine here :/ Apr 22 15:30:33 My N800 won't say anything and so doesn't my scratchbox :/. I'll try again :) Apr 22 15:32:08 (works in both sbox and device) Apr 22 15:33:10 Guess I'm unlucky then. ah well. Apr 22 15:34:16 Anyone else tried it? Apr 22 15:34:42 My ******* keeps giving me usb device not supported :@ Apr 22 15:44:42 hi,I tried my n800 with gstreamer but can't find the alsasink plugin,how should I insert alsasink in n800,by compiling the gstreamer sources or other easy way? Apr 22 15:45:11 pupnik: have you looked at the xomap source (hw/kdrive/omap/*)? Apr 22 15:47:19 I think n800 has alsasink,but my n800 can't find alsasink, how should I add alsasink in an easy way,please Apr 22 15:47:52 jott i'll be lost in there but i could try. I'm hoping maybe some other update besides SDL might workaround Apr 22 15:56:27 nill_: I don't think n800 has alsasink Apr 22 15:56:57 I don't see anything mentioning alsa in /usr/lib/gstreamer-0.10 Apr 22 15:57:06 I think the usual sink is dsp???sink Apr 22 15:57:10 where ??? can be mp3, amr, aac Apr 22 16:00:28 mpedmin:may I use dspaacsink for audio? and I want to use faad for aac decodec,n800 also has't faad Apr 22 16:00:30 and the gstreamer plugins in n800 is a part, any easy way to add others? Apr 22 16:01:14 mgedmin:sorry,typed error,may I use dspaacsink for audio? and I want to use faad for aac decodec,n800 also has't faad Apr 22 16:01:15 and the gstreamer plugins in n800 is a part, any easy way to add others? Apr 22 16:14:30 * mgedmin not really knowledgeable in these matters Apr 22 16:16:46 Hii Apr 22 16:17:15 Hi :) Apr 22 16:17:23 The os2007HE really greater than the os2006. :) Thank you :) Apr 22 16:17:25 Khertan, jott built fortune :) Apr 22 16:17:38 It doesn't work for me but it works for jott, would you try too? :) Apr 22 16:19:01 fortune quotes? Apr 22 16:19:33 Yeah, the unix fortune that spits out quotes. Apr 22 16:20:04 I like the simpsons packs Apr 22 16:20:07 mm, you'll need a home screen applet for it too? :) Apr 22 16:20:14 Khertan's made one :) Apr 22 16:20:20 (for fortune) Apr 22 16:20:22 Just waiting for fortune. Apr 22 16:21:35 qwerty111 send me a link with the url of the package at khertan@khertan.net Apr 22 16:21:51 i must run to take my train ... Apr 22 16:21:52 :) Apr 22 16:21:57 ok :) Apr 22 16:22:35 "It's just a ride, it's just a ride. Don't be scared, don't hide your eyes." Apr 22 16:24:04 niiiiice Apr 22 16:24:16 * KotCzarny blinks Apr 22 16:26:08 pupnik.. but it's cut at the end :/ Apr 22 16:26:19 i don't have original Apr 22 16:26:27 * KotCzarny adds name to p2p.todo list Apr 22 16:26:58 http://www.lyrics007.com/Jem%20Lyrics/Just%20a%20Ride%20Lyrics.html lyrics to the song - inspired by Bill Hicks Apr 22 16:31:10 k, have to run, bbl Apr 22 16:31:15 bye Apr 22 16:31:18 for now :) Apr 22 16:35:46 blargh forget the original song KotCzarny Apr 22 16:46:12 * Mousey repeatedly fixes his n810 with a hammer Apr 22 16:46:22 (figuratively speaking) Apr 22 16:46:27 hi Apr 22 16:46:30 gh Apr 22 16:46:39 i can t install fortune too Apr 22 16:46:49 dpkg error Apr 22 16:46:54 I can install it but it won't tell me anything. Apr 22 16:47:03 on fortune-mod Apr 22 16:47:16 no error description Apr 22 16:47:18 /usr/games/fortune? Apr 22 16:48:35 /usr/games/fortune: error while loading shared libraries: librecode.so.0: cannot open shared object file: No such file or directory Apr 22 16:49:03 Khertan, can you accept file over irc? Apr 22 16:49:37 maybe don t know if maemo xchat accept it Apr 22 16:49:37 try to send it Apr 22 16:49:56 ah ha! Apr 22 16:50:03 ? Apr 22 16:50:05 apt-file search librecode.so.0 Apr 22 16:50:09 I'm offering, any chance of accepting? Apr 22 16:51:43 no apt-file on maemo Apr 22 16:51:54 DOH! Apr 22 16:51:56 Khertan, wait a sec Apr 22 16:51:56 and nothing from apt-cache Apr 22 16:52:07 how in the world is there no apt-file!? Apr 22 16:52:17 I built recode before when trying to compile fortune. Apr 22 16:52:19 besides that it would take a trillion years to run Apr 22 16:52:40 qwerty111 don t see the dcc invite Apr 22 16:52:57 I don't think its working, I cancelled it ages ago. Apr 22 16:53:03 so it seems not implemented in xchat Apr 22 16:53:32 http://www.mediafire.com/?d4zxnjga2qh Apr 22 16:56:23 hello Apr 22 16:56:59 i have here an acer travelmate 3002 notebook that do not turn on Apr 22 16:57:14 does someone like to change for a n810? Apr 22 16:57:19 no more error Apr 22 16:57:38 Khertan_on_n810, does fortune say anything? Apr 22 16:58:03 but nothing display Apr 22 16:58:04 does it need params ? Apr 22 16:58:12 p-m 1,73ghz,512mb,80gb,12" screen, Apr 22 16:58:14 Khertan_on_n810, exactly the same problem as me. Apr 22 16:58:32 jott, do you have a build of recode anywhere while building this? Apr 22 16:58:51 I once built recode for mistral Apr 22 16:59:47 I built recode for Chinook but I don't know if it's working. Me and Khertan have the same recode package and fortune returns nothing. Seeing as you need recode to build fortune, jott must have a build as it works for him. Apr 22 17:00:13 * Khertan_on_n810 connection will drop ... entering subway Apr 22 17:08:09 hell0? Apr 22 17:08:22 squeek Apr 22 17:10:23 jott: i don't see which package provides hw/kdrive/omap :/ Apr 22 17:10:38 don't see it in /usr/include Apr 22 17:11:40 http://repository.maemo.org/pool/os2008/free/x/xorg-server/ <- empty Apr 22 17:11:54 Isn't it in xomap? Apr 22 17:12:02 I mean rather wouldn't it be in xomap. Apr 22 17:12:27 hmm xserver-xomap Apr 22 17:12:43 ty Apr 22 17:12:51 i was searching xorg Apr 22 17:12:53 np Apr 22 17:13:48 but no source available with apt in chinook Apr 22 17:16:58 thanks y'all, ext2 works great! Apr 22 17:22:47 pupnik, :) posted and subscribed to the thread Apr 22 17:24:50 cheers yuup Apr 22 17:32:06 re Apr 22 17:32:33 oh can i set focus on a gtk.Entry() ? Apr 22 17:33:38 when i do a entry.grab-focus() i get this error : AttributeError: 'gtk.Entry' object has no attribute 'grab' Apr 22 17:35:00 ouch it s grab_focus it an error of doc Apr 22 17:36:35 i wish i could run freemind on maemo Apr 22 17:37:14 Does anyone have a n00b guide for using oprofile on N8*0 kernel? Apr 22 17:38:15 can java run on maemo? Apr 22 17:38:23 in a word? no Apr 22 17:38:28 well i guess it could Apr 22 17:38:36 i haven't found a jvm Apr 22 17:38:39 jalimo, i guess Apr 22 17:38:41 that's a real drawback Apr 22 17:38:42 but c'mon Apr 22 17:38:47 lbravo: depends who you ask Apr 22 17:38:52 but i agree with you Apr 22 17:39:08 grab_focus seems not to set gtk.entry to get focus Apr 22 17:40:26 rah !!! stupid hildon widget ! no signal else than 'range-error' on hildon.NumberEditor ! Apr 22 17:41:38 you can use notify::value if you want signal on change Apr 22 17:41:49 Do it correctly, Khertan_on_n810. :P Apr 22 17:42:17 juhaz notify ? Apr 22 17:42:44 how does this work ? Apr 22 17:43:11 "The notify signal is emitted on an object when one of its properties has been changed." Apr 22 17:44:11 ::something signifies a detail, which, in case of notify, allows you to specify the property to watch. Apr 22 17:45:49 ah ok thanx juhaz Apr 22 17:47:10 do u now how to set focus on a gtk entry ? Apr 22 17:48:03 entry.grab_focus() Apr 22 17:48:10 hum Apr 22 17:48:25 doesn t seems to work Apr 22 17:48:31 I'm having some trouble getting smtp.gmail and modest to play long Apr 22 17:49:04 _ not - Apr 22 17:49:12 qwerty12_N800: http://sse2.net/fortune/librecode0_3.6-14_armel.deb Apr 22 17:49:30 ah, you noted that already Apr 22 17:49:36 how does it not work? Apr 22 17:49:39 jott: thanks, i'll try it out Apr 22 17:49:40 oh, hm, now it seems to have managed to send Apr 22 17:49:44 * sp3000 is confused Apr 22 17:51:08 also, barf on the choice of monospace Apr 22 17:51:49 qwerty12_N800: please tell me if you have all of it working, so i can delete it.. this server has very little space :/ Apr 22 17:51:50 or rather, the choice of a "typewriter style" fantasy font in place of monospace >:| Apr 22 17:52:29 courier would be so much happier in the dustbin with its friend comic sans :) Apr 22 17:52:37 jott: brilliant!, thanks it works! Apr 22 17:52:52 ah glad to hear Apr 22 17:53:32 Khertan_on_n810: any chance of the applet soon please? Thanks jott again Apr 22 17:53:51 yawn Apr 22 17:53:54 hehe :) Apr 22 17:53:56 it's hot here Apr 22 17:54:18 what is the cmd line ... Apr 22 17:54:28 i ll make a one shot package Apr 22 17:54:28 btw milkytracker is gpl now and i made a deb: http://sse2.net/milkytracker_0.90.80-1_armel.deb really great tracker Apr 22 17:54:28 /usr/games/fortune Apr 22 17:54:30 probably Apr 22 17:54:37 in blind mode Apr 22 17:54:42 KotCzarny: it is Apr 22 17:54:51 qwerty12: i know Apr 22 17:54:55 i was answering a question Apr 22 17:54:56 :) Apr 22 17:55:19 * jott needs to apply for maemo extra so he can push the stuff there ;) Apr 22 17:55:26 KotCzarny: :), i thought because of probably :) Apr 22 17:55:36 i'm always adding it Apr 22 17:55:40 just in case;) Apr 22 17:55:53 Brb, i need to figure out bitchx commands for my port. Apr 22 17:56:44 BitchX is the worst Apr 22 17:57:06 hmm Apr 22 17:58:57 http://imagechan.net/img/5365/Desperation/ Apr 22 17:58:58 lol Apr 22 17:59:21 qwerty i m uploading home fortune to extras devel ... i ven t test it Apr 22 18:02:27 Because we are quiet (or this is messing up), can someone just give a quick reply please. Apr 22 18:02:42 no way. Apr 22 18:02:50 Thanks ;) Apr 22 18:02:54 :) Apr 22 18:03:10 At least I know this BitchX port works :) Apr 22 18:03:14 you can simply clone yourself Apr 22 18:03:18 why shouldn't it? Apr 22 18:03:20 :) Apr 22 18:03:30 Doesn't segfault on me like irssi Apr 22 18:03:34 it has to be hardware specific to not to work Apr 22 18:03:40 Because i'm crap :) Apr 22 18:03:50 why do you say that? Apr 22 18:03:51 :) Apr 22 18:04:38 Because I can only do simple mods to get something to compile :), which i figured out a week ago Apr 22 18:04:45 and? Apr 22 18:04:56 most of the people can't do that Apr 22 18:05:00 qwerty i m uploading home fortune to extras devel ... i ven t test it Apr 22 18:05:03 and only bitch about things Apr 22 18:05:16 so don't say such things Apr 22 18:05:16 Khertan_on_n810 thanks Apr 22 18:05:16 :) Apr 22 18:05:22 KotCzarny :) Apr 22 18:05:38 still need to be validate ... Apr 22 18:06:07 If the deb is there, i'll go into repo and grab it myyself :) Apr 22 18:06:55 hum ... setting a notify on value was not a great idea ... my calendar app go in loop mode :( Apr 22 18:07:12 the deb is uploaded Apr 22 18:07:17 life - endless experiences Apr 22 18:07:19 milkytracker gpl? neat Apr 22 18:07:25 now i can run it on my toaster! Apr 22 18:07:38 fridge is better Apr 22 18:07:46 does i can set notify on userchanged value ? Apr 22 18:07:47 it can store your data during those hot days Apr 22 18:08:08 khertan: 'can i set' Apr 22 18:08:08 MangoFusion: you could start with your NIT ;) Apr 22 18:08:11 yes but with the toaster you can burn your music to toast Apr 22 18:08:21 hmm Apr 22 18:08:25 i like my music chilly Apr 22 18:08:30 hmmm delicious chip-toasts? Apr 22 18:08:35 at least in summer Apr 22 18:09:11 kotczarny > yes sorry for my horrible english Apr 22 18:09:15 :) Apr 22 18:09:43 khertan: np as long you accept learning :) Apr 22 18:09:48 Khertan_on_n810 I cannot see it :/, i'm in http://repository.maemo.org/extras-devel/pool/chinook/free/h/ Apr 22 18:10:03 an 8-track-sandwich Apr 22 18:10:10 huh Apr 22 18:10:21 with cheesy track please Apr 22 18:10:31 more than one if it's possible Apr 22 18:10:37 only the finest samples manually created Apr 22 18:14:40 anybody think it would be a bad idea to move my /home directory to /media/mmc2? Apr 22 18:14:48 yes Apr 22 18:14:53 and just link /home to /media/mmc2/u00/home or something? Apr 22 18:15:02 mmc2 is ext2 so it'll preserve permissions =) Apr 22 18:15:02 unless you mount it early Apr 22 18:15:05 JFFS2 notice: (407) check_node_data: wrong data CRC in data node at 0x01d7a744: read 0xcf7a755b, calculated 0x949ff8ce. Apr 22 18:15:09 this can't be good Apr 22 18:15:17 lcdd, i think it happens to everyone Apr 22 18:15:21 KotCzarny: o rly Apr 22 18:15:26 lcdd: i assumed it was just unclean shutdown Apr 22 18:15:37 lcdd i get them all the time Apr 22 18:15:56 KotCzarny: i see, so i'll probably rouse the dreaded watchdog if i do something like that, eh? Apr 22 18:16:03 well that's a relief. now i just have to figure out why maemo mapper keeps crashing Apr 22 18:16:11 ...is what you're saying? Apr 22 18:16:24 mousey, maybe not that bad Apr 22 18:17:02 Mousey, not recommended but check Pickleworth's posts on itt if you are interested Apr 22 18:17:25 ty Apr 22 18:19:06 Mousey, just boot from the card. Apr 22 18:19:51 can i boot from the internal card? Apr 22 18:21:20 Sure Apr 22 18:21:29 * KotCzarny does Apr 22 18:21:36 gah, i wish there was a wiki for this nonsense Apr 22 18:21:43 there is Apr 22 18:21:51 !? Apr 22 18:21:52 http://www.internettablettalk.com/wiki/index.php?title=Main_Page Apr 22 18:22:00 It's also called "google" Apr 22 18:22:04 that too Apr 22 18:22:15 google's only good for pr0n Apr 22 18:22:19 Bullshit Apr 22 18:22:21 www - world wide wiki - make your own page, get a link, and it shows up on google :D Apr 22 18:22:50 and be visited by bots in grey suits. Apr 22 18:23:03 who will interrogate you fully Apr 22 18:24:10 ok, the wiki's pretty cool Apr 22 18:25:15 My favourite google is www.google.co.ck Apr 22 18:25:27 I bullshit you not. Apr 22 18:25:36 The ITT wiki is really shit. Apr 22 18:25:41 But it's better than nothing. Apr 22 18:25:43 .ck ? Apr 22 18:25:51 Yep, cook islands Apr 22 18:26:01 megabyte405: nah, it won't be visited by anyone Apr 22 18:26:04 do you live here? Apr 22 18:26:05 :) Apr 22 18:26:05 I typed it in for fun one day Apr 22 18:26:13 astorm: i was in radioshack today Apr 22 18:26:16 KotCzarny, no :p Apr 22 18:26:21 they have 2.3mm smallest plugs Apr 22 18:26:28 and they are a little too big Apr 22 18:26:29 :) Apr 22 18:26:31 argh, yup Apr 22 18:26:37 1,7mm it is Apr 22 18:26:38 syncml!! w00t! Apr 22 18:26:49 my egroupware master plan takes a new turn! Apr 22 18:26:52 or 2mm flat Apr 22 18:27:01 astorm: i assume 2mm Apr 22 18:27:04 stupid Nokia uses non-standard plugs Apr 22 18:27:09 ^ Apr 22 18:27:10 yup Apr 22 18:27:23 but, fortunately, the socket is easy to change Apr 22 18:27:38 I have to get that older Nokia socket Apr 22 18:27:41 so i think cheaper way would be to rip of sime chinese charger Apr 22 18:27:55 (i don't want t dismantle my tablet, yet) Apr 22 18:27:56 which was standard Apr 22 18:27:58 hehe Apr 22 18:28:06 *some Apr 22 18:28:52 AStorm: tried searching for nokia gpe sync recently? People visited my site... Apr 22 18:29:07 'people visited my site' Apr 22 18:29:15 sounds nice Apr 22 18:29:16 :) Apr 22 18:29:26 lol Apr 22 18:29:53 ~it's just a ride~ Apr 22 18:29:56 ~lalala~ Apr 22 18:32:33 megabyte405: nope Apr 22 18:33:30 You know in v.13 of osso-xterm, can you rename the tabs? Apr 22 18:33:32 fysa: there's a modest update, yeah Apr 22 18:33:38 qwerty12_N800: hehe Apr 22 18:34:01 working well so far, thanks Apr 22 18:34:06 osso-xterm got tabs? Apr 22 18:34:08 :) Apr 22 18:34:16 AStorm, it would look nicer :) Apr 22 18:34:25 KotCzarny, grab v13 Apr 22 18:34:38 Of fiferboy's website Apr 22 18:34:40 qwerty12: not yet, just a nice to know Apr 22 18:34:43 tabs are pointless space waste Apr 22 18:35:02 Prefer it to windows Apr 22 18:35:08 tabs are nice if you have to have more than one window Apr 22 18:35:12 tabs would be one less painful touchscreen touch for me Apr 22 18:35:17 KotCzarny: naah Apr 22 18:35:37 i don't like task manager grouping Apr 22 18:35:40 I would like to have xterm just autolaunch all tabs Apr 22 18:35:55 with preset commands for each Apr 22 18:35:59 KotCzarny: yeh, it's not mru Apr 22 18:36:16 astorm: depends on implementator Apr 22 18:36:18 :) Apr 22 18:37:49 tabs are a solution to a non-existing problem Apr 22 18:37:55 proper window management is better Apr 22 18:37:56 not true Apr 22 18:38:06 amen Apr 22 18:38:17 i have tabs in fluxbox Apr 22 18:38:23 yet i like tabs in firefox Apr 22 18:38:27 well, tabs do have their place Apr 22 18:38:29 I'd like, what are they called... slits, or what Apr 22 18:38:41 heh, s/i/u/ Apr 22 18:38:41 *splits Apr 22 18:38:41 ;) Apr 22 18:38:44 windows have been broken to emulate hidden tabs. Apr 22 18:38:48 but many apps use tabs to get around window management problems Apr 22 18:38:54 KotCzarny lmao Apr 22 18:38:56 fysa: naaaah Apr 22 18:39:01 elb, still Apr 22 18:39:02 they're correct really Apr 22 18:39:06 nesting applications is horrible Apr 22 18:39:13 I waz thinking s/s/c Apr 22 18:39:20 qwerty12: lol Apr 22 18:39:27 fysa: what do you mean? Apr 22 18:39:39 cascade layout? Apr 22 18:39:53 if you have 6 windows of an app open, you see a little icon with a tiny [6] next to it. Apr 22 18:40:04 ah, that Apr 22 18:40:13 it's fairly ok actually Apr 22 18:40:15 why do I need to touch that and wait .. to see the other windows? I need to be able to flip between apps. Apr 22 18:40:25 that's lack of gestures of you Apr 22 18:40:26 use the menu key Apr 22 18:40:34 need context somewhere Apr 22 18:40:38 I'd create a gesture to switch the windows Apr 22 18:40:45 we *need* them Apr 22 18:41:05 i need more genericised panels Apr 22 18:41:10 i hate being the minority Apr 22 18:41:14 or just bigger tabs Apr 22 18:41:40 yeah, I'd like to get rid of the contact button to free more room for app icons Apr 22 18:41:51 exactly Apr 22 18:42:01 Mousey: well, yup Apr 22 18:42:02 the Internet button I find fairly useful Apr 22 18:42:04 when I'm using an xterm, at least don't show me the XTerm6 icon Apr 22 18:42:05 Why did they feel the need to increase the application height on the taskbar? :\ Apr 22 18:42:05 it should be a generic panel, with launcher icons and taskman applet and systray applet Apr 22 18:42:10 we have contacts, yet people b*tch about missing pim functionality Apr 22 18:42:11 :) Apr 22 18:42:18 elb: I find it fairlypointless Apr 22 18:42:20 fsck a pim Apr 22 18:42:24 I want it broken out so I can flip. or give me tabs. Apr 22 18:42:27 if i wanted a pim i'd install garnet Apr 22 18:42:36 fysa: yea, gnome drawers would be nice Apr 22 18:42:37 Mousey: it's too crummy Apr 22 18:42:51 just make it configurable Apr 22 18:42:54 if I am switching from firefox to xterm and back. that's possibly 3-4 touches each way. Apr 22 18:42:59 it doesn't matter what you choose Apr 22 18:43:05 sorry, not firefox -- microb Apr 22 18:43:06 elb: the bookmarks are directly available in Web Apr 22 18:43:09 don't push it down user's throat Apr 22 18:43:18 contacts and email, too Apr 22 18:43:45 the bookmarks are available, yes, if the browser is already open Apr 22 18:43:51 fysa: or 3 key presses Apr 22 18:43:55 elb: so? Apr 22 18:44:06 mine normally isn't Apr 22 18:44:09 you want a bookmark to run, you have to run Web anyway Apr 22 18:44:11 multiply by 1000 each day Apr 22 18:44:12 :) Apr 22 18:44:21 either it'll run later, or first Apr 22 18:44:29 spawning the browser on the bookmark is significantly faster Apr 22 18:44:29 yeah, that's too much for something that is portable/pocketable. Apr 22 18:44:54 fysa: it should be one keypress and one touch Apr 22 18:44:56 i'd propose not changing anything about the way the ui looks Apr 22 18:44:58 a gesture could be good. Apr 22 18:45:06 fysa: press the front application/window key, and then tap the application you want Apr 22 18:45:12 I use that pretty often Apr 22 18:45:19 for multi-window browsing, as well as xterms Apr 22 18:45:20 i'd just change what made up that look Apr 22 18:45:22 window key is HARD Apr 22 18:45:25 A working alt-tab would be nice for keyboards. Apr 22 18:45:29 and distract from touchscreen Apr 22 18:45:53 *distracts Apr 22 18:46:04 KotCzarny: but it doesn't take screen estate Apr 22 18:46:43 i don't mind sacrificing 160x480 for statusbar/taskbar/shortcuts/buttons Apr 22 18:46:51 I do. Apr 22 18:46:51 you get 640x480 then Apr 22 18:46:58 it's not enough for www Apr 22 18:47:04 or even IRC ;> Apr 22 18:47:10 you are on the go Apr 22 18:47:20 for regular www/irc you use laptop Apr 22 18:47:22 ... Apr 22 18:47:25 I would prefer all apps to be full screen, then have the home button bring up the OS UI as an overlay Apr 22 18:47:26 or something bigger Apr 22 18:47:40 fysa: well, that wouldn't help your use case Apr 22 18:47:48 KotCzarny: then what's the point of the tablet? Apr 22 18:47:49 then double-touch the home button to swap between the last two apps Apr 22 18:47:56 just use a cell phone then Apr 22 18:48:04 KotCzarny: you're missing the point of the IT Apr 22 18:48:13 which is to have comfortable usage :> Apr 22 18:48:13 maybe Apr 22 18:48:22 but it's comfortable for me Apr 22 18:48:23 :) Apr 22 18:48:34 640x480 and scrolling webpages? I concur Apr 22 18:48:43 i only find lack of customizability in some places annoying Apr 22 18:48:59 that is a problem, yes Apr 22 18:49:59 ok, time to work... Apr 22 18:50:06 these things weren't well thought-out in the beginning, 5(?) years ago. it was just "a solution" not "the solution." Apr 22 18:50:06 * AStorm kicks Java Apr 22 18:50:42 * AStorm hits Java with a 1-ton BSD handbook Apr 22 18:51:28 I'd do the same or worse to PHP Apr 22 18:52:34 :> Apr 22 18:52:37 php is nice Apr 22 18:52:40 and easy Apr 22 18:53:09 and PITA vs debugging Apr 22 18:53:15 and is *not* easy, at all Apr 22 18:53:20 not any worse than c Apr 22 18:53:25 :) Apr 22 18:53:25 it's easy to write shit code in it Apr 22 18:53:30 unlike C Apr 22 18:53:33 LOL Apr 22 18:53:36 not true Apr 22 18:53:37 ;) Apr 22 18:53:38 In C, incorrect code crashes Apr 22 18:53:46 in PHP, it does something unexpected Apr 22 18:53:55 astorm: not true Apr 22 18:53:56 :) Apr 22 18:53:58 and we have proper C debuggers Apr 22 18:54:19 KotCzarny: I'm talking about mistakes, not deliberate errors :> Apr 22 18:54:30 still not true Apr 22 18:54:30 :) Apr 22 18:54:37 so, tell me one case when it's not true Apr 22 18:54:41 just *one* Apr 22 18:55:14 assume I'm building with stack and heap protector for the app to crash nicely on invalid accesses Apr 22 18:55:15 tell me one thing Jave doesn't have compated to c Apr 22 18:55:27 keesj: pointers, plain functions Apr 22 18:55:28 compared Apr 22 18:55:43 and it forces stupid namespace naming system Apr 22 18:55:45 :> Apr 22 18:56:02 it also has overdone classes all around Apr 22 18:56:03 and it's slow Apr 22 18:56:05 re Apr 22 18:56:07 and not available on IT Apr 22 18:56:08 ;) Apr 22 18:56:10 :P Apr 22 18:56:20 Java only has references (so pointer == false) , it also has a stac for "native" objects Apr 22 18:56:24 Java is the worst of all. It just creates "orthodox" spaghetti code. Apr 22 18:56:39 well, spaghetti, maybe not Apr 22 18:56:47 but it's overdone any way Apr 22 18:56:48 AStorm: plain functions? Java does have static methods yes Apr 22 18:56:49 sure it is. spaghetti functions and classes. Apr 22 18:57:02 keesj: well, static method is not a function... Apr 22 18:57:12 pascal is king of spaghetti code Apr 22 18:57:18 MangoFusion: old pascal, yup Apr 22 18:57:23 new Object Pascal, no Apr 22 18:57:38 thats why i said pascal ;) Apr 22 18:57:41 a static method in Java has no real contect and is therefore a function (IMHO) Apr 22 18:57:47 right, my n810 wont load, the blue bar goes all the way to the right but then stays there Apr 22 18:57:53 keesj: what does it take as a first argument? ;P Apr 22 18:58:02 practisevoodoo_: uhoh Apr 22 18:58:16 did you install powerlaunch recently? Apr 22 18:58:20 blue bar is a fake Apr 22 18:58:26 whats thqat? Apr 22 18:58:28 AStorm: whatever you feel like Apr 22 18:58:30 ah, so not Apr 22 18:58:31 simple draw bar in 10s Apr 22 18:58:38 keesj: good anyway Apr 22 18:59:08 AStorm: don't get me wrong. I do like C but your arguments are untrue Apr 22 18:59:13 so, Java is now missing only real multi-way inheritance Apr 22 18:59:24 keesj: C is that, a small language Apr 22 18:59:36 What I hate in Java is how enterprise perverted it Apr 22 18:59:42 anyway any ideas? Apr 22 18:59:44 O.o Apr 22 18:59:56 wasn't java a enterprise product from beginning? Apr 22 18:59:58 *an Apr 22 18:59:59 KotCzarny: no Apr 22 19:00:06 it was designed to run on toasters Apr 22 19:00:15 link? Apr 22 19:00:16 :) Apr 22 19:00:27 google for "history of java" Apr 22 19:00:34 AStorm: is there is no "real" MI . that is kind of true (but there are proxy object that can delegate ) Apr 22 19:00:55 which smells of an enterprise hack Apr 22 19:00:57 KotCzarny: nope it was for applets , portable code etc Apr 22 19:01:57 and we all know what a big success that was :p Apr 22 19:02:03 ;P Apr 22 19:02:21 I don't see much wrong with android btw Apr 22 19:02:32 ah ha, it is starting up now that i have removed the new microsd i got Apr 22 19:03:02 * keesj remebers the time MacroMedia flash was implemented as java applet Apr 22 19:03:10 keesj: :> Apr 22 19:03:14 and it actually worked Apr 22 19:03:17 not crashed ;P Apr 22 19:03:25 albeit slow Apr 22 19:03:48 flash is also overdone, in the same way as Java Apr 22 19:03:56 that "include the kitchen sink" approach Apr 22 19:04:01 It was all Dynamic and such :p Apr 22 19:04:04 ;) Apr 22 19:04:15 O.o Apr 22 19:04:25 flash in java? Apr 22 19:04:27 o.O Apr 22 19:04:34 yes, it started as a Java applet Apr 22 19:04:44 that couldn't bode well, right? ;P Apr 22 19:04:56 sounds like a recipe for fail. Apr 22 19:04:57 :) Apr 22 19:05:02 dammit Apr 22 19:05:14 I've to write WSDL ;(;(;( Nooooo! Apr 22 19:05:29 white screen of death language ? Apr 22 19:05:55 KotCzarny: Web Service Definition Language Apr 22 19:05:58 a perverted XML Apr 22 19:06:10 we where all happy and then came XML Apr 22 19:06:24 and then everything crashed Apr 22 19:06:30 not crashed Apr 22 19:06:35 went slooooow and unreadable Apr 22 19:06:49 and overly descriptive Apr 22 19:07:00 yup Apr 22 19:07:12 and the worst part is: I have to write it by hand! Apr 22 19:07:20 write a script to do it Apr 22 19:07:22 simple. Apr 22 19:07:29 or a converter Apr 22 19:07:29 then use that overblown AXIS to launch that web service Apr 22 19:07:36 from your format Apr 22 19:07:37 :) Apr 22 19:07:45 ... Apr 22 19:07:54 still would have to write it Apr 22 19:07:58 argh Apr 22 19:08:06 I use cocoon http://cocoon.apache.org/ ozone-db and other tools Apr 22 19:08:35 keesj: no, I'm required to use AXIS2 Apr 22 19:08:40 ;( Apr 22 19:09:10 1024 factories when 100 functions would suffice Apr 22 19:09:11 AStorm: lucky b*stard Apr 22 19:09:25 keesj: lucky? you're funny Apr 22 19:09:36 I want to do electronics, not idiocy of web services Apr 22 19:09:48 I must admint I did write xsl last week Apr 22 19:10:15 astorm: outsource! Apr 22 19:10:15 :) Apr 22 19:10:22 xml is great when it is used properly Apr 22 19:10:22 lol Apr 22 19:10:26 MangoFusion: sure Apr 22 19:10:34 sadly though that only makes up like 1% of usage cases nowadays ;) Apr 22 19:10:34 KotCzarny: well, can't Apr 22 19:10:40 why? Apr 22 19:10:51 KotCzarny: assignment Apr 22 19:10:56 hmm Apr 22 19:11:00 I *could* outsource that, *but*... Apr 22 19:11:07 grab a student/assistent Apr 22 19:11:14 but no sane person would want it Apr 22 19:11:15 Speed/7Low memory foot print , is must run on the n810! Apr 22 19:11:19 *assistant Apr 22 19:11:37 It even comes with MEP Support! Apr 22 19:11:37 KotCzarny: what did I tell about sanity? Apr 22 19:11:52 astorm: students are insane anyway Apr 22 19:11:59 KotCzarny: I know, I'm one ;P Apr 22 19:12:01 so that's not a problem Apr 22 19:12:04 :) Apr 22 19:12:10 but nobody around wants to touch that with a 10-foot pole Apr 22 19:12:16 at least w/o M$ tools Apr 22 19:12:25 10-foot pole, he he he. Apr 22 19:12:43 and i though they come in 6-foot size max Apr 22 19:12:44 ;) Apr 22 19:13:15 it's just 3,5m Apr 22 19:13:24 there are even longer Apr 22 19:13:30 astorm: a widziales kiedys polaka 3.5m ? ;) Apr 22 19:13:36 I really choose c and other because of all the bad documentation and unmaintainable code Apr 22 19:13:46 KotCzarny: rotfl, I was talking about the stick Apr 22 19:13:47 pvanhoof: I just read about the new prerelease and TMut - pretty good! Apr 22 19:13:47 I feel right at home Apr 22 19:13:52 astorm: i know Apr 22 19:13:54 :) Apr 22 19:14:13 keesj: unmaintainable? naaaah Apr 22 19:14:19 bad documentation? depends on the project Apr 22 19:14:29 pvanhoof: I know I'm a little bit slow - have an extremely tight schedule currently. Apr 22 19:14:32 actually, any language can shine Apr 22 19:14:38 yup Apr 22 19:14:42 *but* I have to write WSDL Apr 22 19:14:46 that is the fun killer Apr 22 19:15:01 a SOAPy WSDL too Apr 22 19:15:10 AStorm: dbus is the success story i am enoying every moment of right now Apr 22 19:15:23 keesj: well, dbus is not that bad Apr 22 19:15:28 but also overengineered Apr 22 19:16:00 dbus is completely wrong all the way Apr 22 19:16:22 keesj: what do you dislike about IPC? Apr 22 19:16:29 it's just an IPC mechanism Apr 22 19:16:51 the bad of it is XML ;P Apr 22 19:17:00 I don't dislike IPC, I dislike the docs and way it is implemented Apr 22 19:17:23 way it is implemented is ok Apr 22 19:17:29 but docs are not ;P Apr 22 19:17:36 I crashed the dbus service already maeny time when making it enjoy my code :p Apr 22 19:17:42 bonus points for underdocumented HAL Apr 22 19:17:46 keesj: ah, the bugs ;) Apr 22 19:17:55 that's totally another thing Apr 22 19:18:02 It sould be documented and implented as a protocol not a lib Apr 22 19:18:10 uhm, it is a protocol Apr 22 19:18:23 the lib is for easy access Apr 22 19:18:34 the protocol is XML flying here and there Apr 22 19:18:41 = suck Apr 22 19:18:46 you *don't* want to see it Apr 22 19:18:51 <||cw> i love flying xml! Apr 22 19:19:14 AStorm: read "what is dbus" http://dbus.freedesktop.org/doc/dbus-tutorial.html#whatis Apr 22 19:19:59 oh noes Apr 22 19:20:04 it's a binary protocol Apr 22 19:20:07 I am going to stop. I want to DO something tonight :p Apr 22 19:20:12 :> Apr 22 19:20:17 teh suck! Apr 22 19:20:18 do it in xml Apr 22 19:20:21 ;) Apr 22 19:20:24 I want to Do something too. Apr 22 19:20:34 and I *have* to use WSDL ;( Apr 22 19:20:38 anyone know anything more about linuxtag yet? Apr 22 19:20:44 :P Apr 22 19:20:46 and write AWT or Swing too :( Apr 22 19:20:54 Like what, lcuk? Apr 22 19:21:08 Like that you're bringing all of your suck there? :P Apr 22 19:21:22 lcuk: I have been there several times... ;) Apr 22 19:21:23 Like an idea what to do? Apr 22 19:21:32 (als community) Apr 22 19:21:39 like do we make our own way there, stay in the hilton and expect nokia to pay, or are they arranging a hotel? Apr 22 19:22:00 you stay in hildon Apr 22 19:22:00 ;) Apr 22 19:22:13 ive got a some ideas, but not sure if they are whiz bang Apr 22 19:22:23 i will need some help testing a bluetooth radar :) Apr 22 19:22:39 argh, WSDL is so verbose.... ;( Apr 22 19:22:49 lcuk: Bluetooth detector? Apr 22 19:22:57 lcuk: sounds cool Apr 22 19:23:12 for WSDL, I have to write XSD too, noooooo! Apr 22 19:23:20 yes, but have multiple fixed detectors around the room (just sat in bag somewhere) and have all devices communicating and you can see the motion in the room Apr 22 19:23:29 Hehe, make a port of the java bt info somehow :p Apr 22 19:23:33 WSDL was designed by the same pro-verbosity team as java. ;) Apr 22 19:23:45 will be nice with ermmmm forogt whos bouncing ball thing - if we can locate other 8x0 owners we can send stuff to them Apr 22 19:23:47 AStorm: there must is a "easy" WSLD factory generation tool. good luck :p Apr 22 19:24:00 keesj: unfortunately, nopes Apr 22 19:24:11 I have WSDL2Java Apr 22 19:24:21 OMG Apr 22 19:24:43 im also doing some security login program with fake biometrics ;) Apr 22 19:25:34 all of this of course rendered with nice fast graphics :) Apr 22 19:25:45 keesj: probably I can write a client w/o WSDL... but will it work all right? ;P Apr 22 19:25:47 hmm Apr 22 19:25:51 speech synth? Apr 22 19:25:53 and I have to write a PHP client too Apr 22 19:25:56 argh Apr 22 19:27:38 * keesj wispers http://hessian.caucho.com/ Apr 22 19:27:53 hmm Apr 22 19:28:21 lcuk: what kind of help are you looking for? Apr 22 19:28:21 keesj: the assignment specifies SOAP Apr 22 19:28:25 :-( :-( Apr 22 19:28:51 lcuk: I can probalbly HELLLp with some dbus things :p Apr 22 19:30:17 it's good that I have PEAR-SOAP and that AXIS Apr 22 19:30:24 but I still get to write WSDL ;( Apr 22 19:32:09 anyone know how to fix that glitch where the home screen resets to default? Apr 22 19:32:48 cLin Disabling some applets :p? Apr 22 19:32:51 not just to default Apr 22 19:32:57 it resets to nothingness Apr 22 19:33:02 well yea Apr 22 19:33:02 when matchbox crashes Apr 22 19:33:13 any way to make it so it doesn't Apr 22 19:33:14 the fix is to make matchbox not crash Apr 22 19:33:22 and make it load config correctly if it does Apr 22 19:34:42 has anyone done that? Apr 22 19:35:00 dunno Apr 22 19:35:08 write a bug Apr 22 19:36:11 wheee, PEAR-SOAP allows me to *not* write WSDL Apr 22 19:36:15 it will autogenerate that Apr 22 19:36:23 * AStorm exploits that Apr 22 19:40:30 argh Apr 22 19:40:38 additional bonus - my server has PHP 4.4 Apr 22 19:40:53 and there's no version of php 4.4 that has no security bugs ;P Apr 22 19:41:16 AStorm: you must be living in the USA Apr 22 19:41:27 why? Apr 22 19:41:32 keesj: no, fortunately, not Apr 22 19:41:40 KotCzarny: all are masked for security issues ;P Apr 22 19:41:57 i was asking keesj Apr 22 19:41:58 :) Apr 22 19:42:31 though i agree, i didn't write nick at the beginning Apr 22 19:42:52 KotCzarny: :P I was under the impression that he had no choice in what / how to do things . and I think this often happens in the USA (mainly from reading "THe career programmer") Apr 22 19:42:52 ok, time to update to PHP 5 and cross fingers that everything works... Apr 22 19:43:06 keesj: sorry, it's a study assignment Apr 22 19:43:11 :> Apr 22 19:43:13 that's why I get no choice :-( Apr 22 19:43:23 If I could choose, I would pick Python myself Apr 22 19:43:36 having no choice isn't that bad, you have something to put a blame on :) Apr 22 19:43:53 lol, yea right Apr 22 19:44:06 KotCzarny: no, it's bad Apr 22 19:44:15 really Apr 22 19:44:22 i know Apr 22 19:44:25 just kidding Apr 22 19:44:26 putting a blame won't help the grade ;P Apr 22 19:44:32 hmm Apr 22 19:44:45 how about a thesis 'why did my project fail' Apr 22 19:44:46 :) Apr 22 19:44:57 ;P Apr 22 19:45:06 it's too small to write a thesis Apr 22 19:45:21 just collect them Apr 22 19:45:24 over years Apr 22 19:45:25 :) Apr 22 19:45:50 heh, my thesis will be about... nah, I shouldn't tell you Apr 22 19:45:51 :-) Apr 22 19:46:04 then whisper Apr 22 19:46:05 ;) Apr 22 19:46:16 |> Dorset Perception (Total Eclip - Shpongle (bootleg) Apr 22 19:48:33 KotCzarny: :-) Apr 22 19:59:08 Hi Apr 22 19:59:35 Ho Apr 22 19:59:42 Hu Apr 22 19:59:43 :) Apr 22 20:09:29 for shared folders in the file manager what type of shares do they need to be? Apr 22 20:09:41 o.o Apr 22 20:09:41 samba or NFS Apr 22 20:09:43 ^_^ Apr 22 20:09:57 are there sharing functionality? Apr 22 20:09:58 :) Apr 22 20:10:29 hrm, i already have samba on so i wonder why it isnt showing up Apr 22 20:25:28 numptyphysics is awesome! any instructions for the buttons in the middle button menu? Apr 22 20:35:17 * gpd wonders when this # died a death or if everyone is now on #iphone Apr 22 20:35:56 iPhon... Apr 22 20:36:09 died? why? Apr 22 20:36:16 it is fairly active Apr 22 20:37:06 gpd, this is a very active channel. Apr 22 20:37:19 I point you to: http://mg.pov.lt/maemo-irclog/ Apr 22 20:37:37 Wow, #iphone overflows Apr 22 20:38:47 well, it's full of Apr 22 20:39:42 A badly maintained septic tank will overflow, too. :D Apr 22 20:39:49 yup Apr 22 20:40:45 Hey guys could you tell me where i can find the gnumeric repo Apr 22 20:41:02 Or anything else that can manage Apr 22 20:41:04 giskard: it's in maemo-extras-devel afaicr Apr 22 20:41:11 Xls Apr 22 20:41:29 Astorm didnt find it Apr 22 20:41:44 use the gronmayer.com Apr 22 20:42:07 The maemo repo site? Apr 22 20:42:17 Didnt find here Apr 22 20:43:23 so i am reasking a question i previously was wondering about 3 months ago, wondering if it has changed any. any progress on rebasing maemo's distro on ubuntu? Apr 22 20:43:39 giskard, google? Apr 22 20:44:11 Did ao Apr 22 20:44:12 So Apr 22 20:44:14 wasabi, it's already based on Debian, why would they change that to another Debian based distro? Apr 22 20:44:28 Internet tatble talk was not usefull Apr 22 20:44:55 GeneralAntilles: Mostly because I remember talking about doing that with Carlos. Because Ubuntu is better maintained. Because launchpad makes forking and tracking differences easier. Apr 22 20:45:14 And because it would be nice to actually USE Ubuntu archives, instead of the fork. Apr 22 20:45:26 giskard_n810: it might be in maemo-extras or maemo-extras-devel Apr 22 20:45:29 not any special repo Apr 22 20:45:29 Remove some work on the part of maintaining said fork. Apr 22 20:45:31 Ubuntu iss better maintained? In which sense? Apr 22 20:45:41 in sense that it gets more and better updates Apr 22 20:45:42 giskard, just, fyi, gronmayer shows TWO repos with gnumeric Apr 22 20:45:46 and google has lots of valid answers. Apr 22 20:45:49 giskard, how old is the debian fork used in Maemo now Apr 22 20:45:52 Extras-devel in particular Apr 22 20:46:05 wasabi: it's new Apr 22 20:46:13 is it? Somebody update it? Apr 22 20:46:17 actually, it has only minor resemblances to debian Apr 22 20:46:22 General.. I ctrlf f for it.. Apr 22 20:46:24 I see. Apr 22 20:46:33 first of all, maemo is busybox-based Apr 22 20:46:35 See the search box? Apr 22 20:46:42 That's kind of what I meant. It would be neat if all the maemo packages were in Ubuntu, and the n8** distribution was just a snapshot. Apr 22 20:46:50 wasabi: and it's more like scratchbox-based, not directly debian-based Apr 22 20:46:56 scratchbox is based on debian though Apr 22 20:47:11 wasabi: well, some won't be, closed software Apr 22 20:47:20 Yes. I know that. Apr 22 20:47:23 Obviously some wouldn't be. Apr 22 20:47:46 I think you know what I mean though. Instead of a custom distro, maintain it as a real Ubuntu fork. All open work just takes place in regular archives. Apr 22 20:47:51 Or is at least synchronized by some tool. Apr 22 20:48:49 it's based off Scratchbox and not Ubuntu Apr 22 20:49:05 And it is synced with Scratchbox. Apr 22 20:49:07 Uh huh. Never said otherwise. Apr 22 20:49:11 uh? Apr 22 20:49:33 not "based" on scratchbox? Apr 22 20:49:45 lol Apr 22 20:49:48 I guess my question has been answered. No progress has been made and none is likely to be made because it's not a goal. Apr 22 20:49:59 The article says it's based on top of Debian EABI, which makes sense Apr 22 20:50:19 Veggen: who cares ;) Apr 22 20:50:29 there are efforts to make Ubuntu run on arm, no? Apr 22 20:50:33 yes Apr 22 20:50:48 Nokia is partly financing the Ubuntu ARM port. Apr 22 20:51:14 There is an Ubuntu ARM port? Apr 22 20:51:25 See, that's what I talked about with Carlos. Apr 22 20:51:55 http://www.linuxdevices.com/news/NS2097004728.html Apr 22 20:52:08 What it actually means isn't very clear at the moment, though. Apr 22 20:52:08 Oh. See. This is new. Apr 22 20:52:27 Heh. At UDS-MTV, Carlos was wondering about what would be required to do this. Apr 22 20:52:36 And I thought it was a wonderful idea. So we sort of explained what would be required. Apr 22 20:52:49 Hence why I'm here, asking, two years later, if anything has progressed. =) Apr 22 21:02:17 Installed in 1U rackmount cases, and stacked up in a rack, the boards can collectively compile the 25,000 binaries comprising a full Ubuntu distribution (some packages build more than one object file) in about 10 days Apr 22 21:02:22 Yeaaah Apr 22 21:02:55 Give monkeys enough typewriters and this is what you get =) Apr 22 21:03:13 all of ITT should get together and run folding@home on our ITs Apr 22 21:03:17 Ha Apr 22 21:03:32 We'd be the best of the best Apr 22 21:03:40 Better yet Apr 22 21:03:59 We should create a distributed ITT network for compiling 25000 Ubuntu binaries Apr 22 21:04:08 meh Apr 22 21:04:21 And make one REEEALLY BIG tablet to install them on Apr 22 21:06:29 teh gigatablet Apr 22 21:06:38 RST38h: we'd easily lose Apr 22 21:06:47 Lose to whom? Apr 22 21:06:48 ITT is *sloooow* at compiling Apr 22 21:06:56 building perl takes about 30 minutes Apr 22 21:07:11 or more Apr 22 21:07:13 AStorm: They (Ubuntu) built a rack of custom-built ARM-based boards to compile stuff Apr 22 21:07:16 es Apr 22 21:07:19 that's the way Apr 22 21:07:26 or use cross compilers, if you're lazy Apr 22 21:07:51 They say it is not easy as a lot of Ubuntu packages break when cross-compiled Apr 22 21:07:53 but to use cross compilers, they'd have to fix certain build systems Apr 22 21:07:56 yup Apr 22 21:08:15 So better build a rack of custom boards, yees, the industrial way... Apr 22 21:08:29 cheap and easy Apr 22 21:08:41 Still, the whole thing strikes me as very artificial Apr 22 21:09:04 why? Most ARMs just doesn't have enough power Apr 22 21:09:05 Who needs this it, especially given such exotic build process? Apr 22 21:09:11 exotic? Apr 22 21:09:15 it's just distcc I guess Apr 22 21:09:24 yea Apr 22 21:09:34 or maybe a real cluster? Apr 22 21:09:43 like, uhm, Beowulf? Apr 22 21:09:57 or large NUMA machine ;P Apr 22 21:10:00 no, description actually sounds like just a bunch of machines compiling stuff Apr 22 21:10:12 mhm Apr 22 21:10:20 so they will still have problems with some packages Apr 22 21:10:29 they also use Intel ARM chips, those are fast Apr 22 21:10:51 Oh well, time to go to bed Apr 22 21:10:54 we need arm11 optimized packages Apr 22 21:10:57 not some generics Apr 22 21:11:02 Intel xscale chips suck Apr 22 21:11:13 They do not Apr 22 21:11:16 do to Apr 22 21:11:19 they're nice Apr 22 21:11:23 s/to/too/ Apr 22 21:11:23 Navi meant: do too Apr 22 21:12:06 NaviL they suck at power consumption Apr 22 21:12:21 But provide decent performance Apr 22 21:12:32 yep Apr 22 21:12:44 I prefer batterly life over performance on a mobile device :P Apr 22 21:12:45 And what is in ARM11 that you want to specifically optimize for? Apr 22 21:13:02 Navi: Well, we know by now that Intel sees it differently :) Apr 22 21:13:25 And that is probably why it lost to TI in mobile space Apr 22 21:13:55 RST38h: because Maemo has: Apr 22 21:13:58 1) VFP Apr 22 21:14:21 2) ARM11 has stream instructions (SIMD) Apr 22 21:14:31 Isn't VFP already being used? Apr 22 21:14:36 3) its Thumb has denser code Apr 22 21:14:41 It is just floating point math, isn't it Apr 22 21:14:43 ? Apr 22 21:14:44 yup Apr 22 21:14:49 Ok, now #3 Apr 22 21:15:08 THUMB exists since ARM7. Every -T labeled CPU has it Apr 22 21:15:11 there are a few nice new instructions Apr 22 21:15:13 yes Apr 22 21:15:24 So, you can actually turn THUMB compilation on in GCC Apr 22 21:15:33 Finally, #2 Apr 22 21:15:37 I know... Apr 22 21:15:54 but ARM11 Thumb is better slightly Apr 22 21:15:57 If I remember correctly, ARM "SIMD" is basically a bunch of cross-product opcodes Apr 22 21:16:05 not that cross-product Apr 22 21:16:19 stuff like A*B+C*D Apr 22 21:16:23 more or less Apr 22 21:16:35 that's what MMX is about Apr 22 21:16:40 Unless you are doing an MPEG decoder this stuff isn't very useful Apr 22 21:16:50 or MP3 decoder Apr 22 21:16:53 or any other MDCT Apr 22 21:16:55 Compiler can't really make use of it Apr 22 21:16:58 (jpeg?) Apr 22 21:17:03 correct Apr 22 21:17:04 yes, compiler can make use of it Apr 22 21:17:13 at least gcc 4.3 Apr 22 21:17:29 Compiler can prov ide you with a bunch of intrinsics to use this stuff directly in your program Apr 22 21:17:35 no Apr 22 21:17:36 This is what Intel does Apr 22 21:17:38 it will use it Apr 22 21:17:46 automatically, when deemed optimal Apr 22 21:17:48 :-) Apr 22 21:18:00 Yes, but what is the probability of these things to be deemed optimal? Apr 22 21:18:07 depends on the code Apr 22 21:18:08 They are very specific operations Apr 22 21:18:19 yes, like multiple addition and multiplication Apr 22 21:18:20 Well, given "normal" average code? Apr 22 21:18:28 not too often Apr 22 21:18:33 So, that is why Intel has intrinsics Apr 22 21:18:37 but it will speed things up where it matters Apr 22 21:18:47 RST38h: but then you have to rewrite code Apr 22 21:18:49 = work Apr 22 21:18:57 insert asm into C, and all Apr 22 21:18:58 yuck Apr 22 21:19:32 AStorm: not exactly Apr 22 21:19:44 well, the intrinsics are there Apr 22 21:19:47 AStorm: you insert what looks like C fnunctions into C Apr 22 21:19:49 but it still is special case code Apr 22 21:19:57 = work Apr 22 21:19:57 And compiler (or preprocessor) does the rest Apr 22 21:19:59 Correct Apr 22 21:20:03 and looks ugly ;) Apr 22 21:20:21 And the reason why it is special case code is because these opcodes are so specific that compiler does not have generic use for them Apr 22 21:20:33 One notable exception is, of course DIV :) Apr 22 21:20:37 whoops ;) Apr 22 21:20:40 One notable exception is, of course DIV :) Apr 22 21:20:51 and multiple sum Apr 22 21:21:05 that one is less clearly cut Apr 22 21:21:20 gcc 4.3 can detect looped addition and optimize it accordingly Apr 22 21:22:18 Yes, but how frequently do you do looped addition? :) Apr 22 21:22:37 Anyways, specific ARM11 optimizations do not look very promising... Apr 22 21:24:00 Fuck, RUR/USD is already at 23.4299 Apr 22 21:24:03 RST38h: more important are instruction delays Apr 22 21:24:16 USD/RUR, actually Apr 22 21:24:27 hehehe Apr 22 21:24:31 AStorm: You mean, they shrunk the number of clocks per instruction? Apr 22 21:24:38 yes Apr 22 21:24:50 so allocator can make better decisions with correct data Apr 22 21:24:51 But this does not require specific optimization ;) Apr 22 21:24:54 yes Apr 22 21:25:04 that's just -mtune=arm11etc Apr 22 21:25:12 At this rate, it is going to hit 20 soon Apr 22 21:25:16 but Ubuntu will provide generic code Apr 22 21:25:24 RST38h: huh? Apr 22 21:25:38 actualy, it will increase I think Apr 22 21:25:40 And *then* we will have to build the huge distributed compilation farm out of ITTs! :) Apr 22 21:25:44 USD is falling Apr 22 21:25:56 AStorm: yes, but that was USD/RUR rate Apr 22 21:26:01 So it is falling Apr 22 21:26:19 I prefer tracking USD/EUR Apr 22 21:26:22 It was 26 just a few months ago Apr 22 21:26:27 No use for EUR here Apr 22 21:26:47 soon, USD will be worth less than the paper it's printed on Apr 22 21:26:48 ;) Apr 22 21:27:52 I hope the current Supreme Commander gets sentenced before that Apr 22 21:28:18 Or, at least, finally goes away after 8 years Apr 22 21:28:51 and no idiot equal to him appears? ;) Apr 22 21:31:04 That is a good question...billion and billion dollar question Apr 22 21:32:12 So far, we have got a black, a woman, and a post-vietnamese nutcase to choose from Apr 22 21:32:40 I pick the black. Apr 22 21:32:50 They're all terrible. Apr 22 21:32:53 yep Apr 22 21:33:00 I'm not a US citizen anyway ;P Apr 22 21:33:20 * RST38h no longer cares, black, green, purple, as long as this thing is not republican Apr 22 21:33:28 I am, does not change much Apr 22 21:33:37 yup Apr 22 21:33:50 well, Hilary is worse than Obama ;P Apr 22 21:34:07 But the truth is that the only way the nutcase is gonna lose is if the public finds out he is gay or something Apr 22 21:34:17 Or, better, a pedophile Apr 22 21:34:21 or he dies Apr 22 21:34:23 :P Apr 22 21:34:26 He will not Apr 22 21:34:38 Why not, he's damaged already ;P Apr 22 21:34:51 These guys never duy Apr 22 21:34:53 die Apr 22 21:35:18 * lcuk eyes hurt Apr 22 21:35:26 Just look at Cheney - he just goes to sleep in a coffin at some undisclosed location, then bathes in virgins' blood and he is back as new Apr 22 21:35:45 a life modelled upon mr burns Apr 22 21:35:52 Republic, Democrat Apr 22 21:35:55 They're all exactly the same Apr 22 21:36:12 s/Republic/Republican/ Apr 22 21:36:21 BTW, the old zoldat has some really interesting plans Apr 22 21:37:12 He has mentioned an idea of mandatory (!) work for high-schoolers Apr 22 21:37:30 rotfl Apr 22 21:37:40 Hitler Jugend? Apr 22 21:37:40 ;P Apr 22 21:37:52 More or less like in USSR where in 9-10 grades you spent 1 day a week working at some factory or cleaning school yard Apr 22 21:37:59 oh yes, something like that Apr 22 21:38:16 Not rwally a Hitler Jugend, as everybody absollutely hated it Apr 22 21:39:20 night Apr 22 21:40:20 oh, well, at least I can watch the whole thing from sidelines... Apr 22 21:40:24 good night all Apr 22 21:53:30 anyone here use tomboy notes? Apr 22 21:53:45 I'm wondering if I can sync my notes up with my n800 Apr 22 21:54:13 tomboy runs under mono so I doubt I can explicitly run it on the n800 Apr 22 21:54:34 but the notes themselves can probably be synced. There in an .xml format Apr 22 22:03:58 Evenin' fellows :) Apr 22 22:04:53 look up opensync Apr 22 22:17:53 * Mousey fscks up his tablet AGAIN Apr 22 22:17:55 dammit! Apr 22 22:17:59 what did i do?? Apr 22 22:18:03 * Mousey blames gpe-summary Apr 22 22:18:07 take the battery out. Apr 22 22:18:11 What happened? Apr 22 22:18:12 huh? Apr 22 22:18:15 gpe-what? Apr 22 22:18:18 it's worse than that, it's dead jim Apr 22 22:18:23 it's rebooting over and over again Apr 22 22:18:26 I have gpe-calendar and gpe-todo Apr 22 22:18:28 all i was doing was installing packages Apr 22 22:18:37 :o Apr 22 22:18:41 dead? impossible Apr 22 22:18:42 Do you get a message about /home something? Apr 22 22:18:43 with the application installer! Apr 22 22:18:43 did you install powerlaunch? Apr 22 22:18:46 flash it Apr 22 22:18:53 qwerty12_N800: now that you mention it, i did Apr 22 22:19:03 Mousey: it's not dead, just probably sleeping Apr 22 22:19:11 qwerty12_N800: something about it not being able to write to .gpe-todo or some such Apr 22 22:19:12 and powerlaunch has problems starting up on AC Apr 22 22:19:23 and is suck anyway ;P Apr 22 22:19:24 You have to run the gpe programs once in the menu Apr 22 22:19:35 i hadn't finished installing them yet Apr 22 22:19:41 Do you have ssh? Apr 22 22:19:44 and now its reboot city Apr 22 22:19:46 yes Apr 22 22:20:04 how quick are you? ;) Apr 22 22:20:17 Keep the message on the screen and ssh in 2 run the gpe apps Apr 22 22:20:34 what message? "NOKIA"? Apr 22 22:20:35 qwerty12_N800: nah, it can't boot ;P Apr 22 22:20:40 Mousey: ok, then Apr 22 22:20:41 all i get is NOKIA Apr 22 22:20:47 do you have the battery charged? Apr 22 22:20:50 fully Apr 22 22:20:54 mhm, disconnect ac Apr 22 22:20:58 remove battery Apr 22 22:21:05 reinsert, power up the device Apr 22 22:21:11 It's just hildon desktop that crashes for me with that msg :/ Apr 22 22:21:26 powering up Apr 22 22:21:27 uhoh Apr 22 22:21:31 "NOKIA" Apr 22 22:21:44 Mousey: if it's the desktop rebooting, then I suggest flashing Fanoush' initfs in Apr 22 22:21:52 aaaaaaaaaaaaaaand it's rebooting Apr 22 22:21:53 and using its ssh or telnet Apr 22 22:22:06 why don't you just flash it? :o Apr 22 22:22:14 ImMelody: because it sucks and loses data ;P Apr 22 22:22:27 GeneralAntilles has told me to look into fanoush's initfs for about 3 decades now. i guess i have to finally do it Apr 22 22:22:33 ImMelody: then i have to reinstall all the packages Apr 22 22:22:38 You don't have fanoush initfs installed by any chance? Like AStorm says. Apr 22 22:22:38 yeah, it's very nice, that initfs Apr 22 22:22:48 ImMelody: thats what i was in the middle of doing [from the LAST time it went reboothappy] Apr 22 22:22:50 try booting once without any mmc cards Apr 22 22:23:21 Mousey: You have Linux on host? Apr 22 22:23:28 so you're not going to lose very much XD sorry.. trying to find the silver lining.. Apr 22 22:23:30 i haven't used windows in 10 years Apr 22 22:23:43 Hehe, good man :) Apr 22 22:24:16 Mousey: use Linux flasher, d'oh Apr 22 22:24:20 brb, i h8 typing on tablet :( Apr 22 22:24:25 Yep, AStorm Apr 22 22:24:43 ok, back to adding SOAP to the web Apr 22 22:24:48 as if it doesn't have enough Apr 22 22:24:51 I like IMing on the tablet Apr 22 22:24:58 810? Apr 22 22:24:59 just not long posts and stuff Apr 22 22:25:03 N800 Apr 22 22:25:04 screw this. i'm gonna go see what this fanoush nonsense is all about. i was so happy being ignorant, now i have to go edumacate myself Apr 22 22:25:11 fysa: 810 Apr 22 22:25:20 long posts no problem Apr 22 22:25:31 except when in this state Apr 22 22:26:08 I take it you don't think it's a hardware issue despite it happening twice now Apr 22 22:26:28 it's not Apr 22 22:26:39 it's a software issue, with hildon desktop not starting Apr 22 22:26:40 ok :) Apr 22 22:26:42 I don't have any trouble at all typing on the N800. Apr 22 22:26:51 ImMelody: no, sorry. i don't have enough info to judge it's the hardware, but the info i do have doesn't point to the hardware, just my own retardedness Apr 22 22:27:00 I don't have any trouble typing on N810 ;) Apr 22 22:27:07 GeneralAntilles, have you tried any wpm apps? Apr 22 22:27:08 me either ^_^ Apr 22 22:27:40 No, clocked myself at (5-letters-per-word) around 30-60wpm with a few self tests. Apr 22 22:28:06 Mousey: Give me time, I'll generate generic fanoush's initfs 4 u Apr 22 22:28:16 You can flash with linux flasher. Apr 22 22:28:19 GeneralAntilles: suck ;) Apr 22 22:28:26 Suck? Apr 22 22:28:29 I'm faster with N810 ;) Apr 22 22:28:38 although N800 screen keyboard is worse Apr 22 22:28:41 70wpm with the N810? Apr 22 22:28:44 I don't buy that for a minute. Apr 22 22:28:57 qwerty12_N800: don't worry about it, i'll study it.. I want to learn how to boot from the other drives anyway. i should know my own hardware. i'm just being a lazy whining n00b Apr 22 22:29:00 hah, my powerful new method of one hand, 4 finger typing Apr 22 22:29:17 AStorm: eww Apr 22 22:29:30 what? Apr 22 22:29:37 * GeneralAntilles calls baloney. Apr 22 22:29:59 I've been reading too much fortunes >.< Apr 22 22:30:02 I'm still making too many errors though. Apr 22 22:30:04 ;) Apr 22 22:32:57 here's for all you 800/770ers out there Apr 22 22:32:59 http://www.vouspensez.com/2008/04/22/the-geekiest-pants-ever/ Apr 22 22:35:14 it'd break quickly Apr 22 22:35:43 and it's ugly Apr 22 22:35:45 it's for people who play track-and-field with the spacebar Apr 22 22:35:48 ^_^ Apr 22 22:36:00 :/ Apr 22 22:48:21 thats funny Apr 22 22:50:32 yawn Apr 22 22:50:47 nway Apr 22 23:18:25 wheeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee code is making me disy Apr 22 23:18:30 dizzy XD Apr 22 23:18:45 ride it Apr 22 23:19:13 'I tell my patients, if you can't pronounce it, don't put it in your body' Apr 22 23:19:14 lol Apr 22 23:19:21 lol Apr 22 23:19:42 but what if you can pronounce just about anything? Apr 22 23:20:11 then you already know what it is Apr 22 23:20:13 usually Apr 22 23:20:23 and know if it's safe or not Apr 22 23:20:25 usally Apr 22 23:20:30 usually Apr 22 23:20:44 so what do you do for a living XD Apr 22 23:20:52 nothing Apr 22 23:20:53 :) Apr 22 23:21:00 oh ok Apr 22 23:24:17 KotCzarny: you're unemployed for a living? Apr 22 23:24:27 i'm just lazy Apr 22 23:24:28 :) Apr 22 23:27:20 wow. you get paid for being lazy? cool Apr 22 23:27:39 * ljp needs to find a job like that Apr 22 23:27:39 who said anything about being paid? Apr 22 23:27:40 :) Apr 22 23:30:10 people in australia get paid for being lazy. its called centrelink Apr 22 23:30:25 some kind of wellfare program? Apr 22 23:31:39 sort of. Apr 22 23:34:23 hmm... I guess I would take a lot of money for beeing lazy - I don't like this that much ;) Apr 22 23:42:06 Cranberry juice Unsweetened cranberry juice can be used as mouthwash and as a solution for brushing one's teeth. It will kill all motile bacteria on contact and help to disintegrate plaques. Since it is somewhat acidic, probably it should not be used more then a few times a week. Apr 22 23:42:08 lol Apr 22 23:43:22 heh Apr 22 23:49:45 and it's very sour ;P Apr 22 23:54:46 better than unsweetened commercial toothpaste :P Apr 22 23:55:51 |> VA_-_Super_Set_Mixed_by_Yahel-CD-2005-JFK/01-va_-_super_set_mixed_by_yahel.mp3 Apr 22 23:56:11 KotCzarny: well, not that much better Apr 22 23:56:34 and menthol, xylitol and sorbitol also kill germs Apr 22 23:56:41 additionaly, are sweet Apr 22 23:56:42 i'm going to try toothpaste based on baking soda + salt Apr 22 23:56:46 so does vodka Apr 22 23:56:54 vodka kills braincells too Apr 22 23:56:56 swill that round first thing and you are good to go Apr 22 23:56:57 good night Apr 22 23:56:57 definitely Apr 22 23:57:05 :) Apr 22 23:57:06 nite flo Apr 22 23:57:11 KotCzarny: baking soda damages teeth Apr 22 23:57:53 any abrasive does Apr 22 23:58:03 it's the point of brushing Apr 22 23:58:04 *WARNING: DO NOT CHEW SAND* Apr 22 23:58:11 ... Apr 22 23:58:17 KotCzarny: no, it's not Apr 22 23:58:28 * GeneralAntilles puts diatomaceous earth in lcuk's toothpaste. Apr 22 23:58:33 also, baking soda kills germs too Apr 22 23:58:37 you don't take the top surface of your pots when you clean them, you jsut want to get the food off Apr 22 23:58:40 the point is to use something slightly softer than teeth, but harder than plaque Apr 22 23:58:55 that's why we use toothbrushes Apr 22 23:59:17 we use toothbrushes because our fingers are too fat to get in the crevises Apr 22 23:59:50 that too Apr 22 23:59:51 but your finger can clean your tongue much more effectively than any of these tongue scrubbers Apr 23 00:00:08 tongue scrubbers? Apr 23 00:00:08 O.o Apr 23 00:00:08 (the ones on back of toothbrush) Apr 23 00:01:25 omg they have torture equipment for it now Apr 23 00:01:45 i meant the none brush side of the toothbrush having a rough patch specifically for tongue cleaning Apr 23 00:02:05 huh Apr 23 00:02:22 http://www.clusterflock.org/images/Colgate_360.jpg Apr 23 00:02:37 fancy Apr 23 00:02:48 Hey, it's my toothbrush! Apr 23 00:03:21 The backing is rubber. Apr 23 00:05:02 good to see they fully embrace the razorblade marketing technique Apr 23 00:05:14 Hehe Apr 23 00:05:18 MOAR IZ BETTAR! Apr 23 00:05:42 * GeneralAntilles must admit to having a 5-blade razor. Apr 23 00:06:11 from the pic you look unshaved tohugh Apr 23 00:06:18 *though Apr 23 00:06:27 Question: where can I find what the permissions should be for particular directories? I'm having constant problems in certain respects. Apps install but say they didn't (figure they're not able to write some log files or something) - my settings never last through a shutdown, etc. Apr 23 00:06:50 Is there a good python IDE available for maemo? Apr 23 00:07:13 otherwise, things seem to work ok ... N800, OS2008, booting from MMC2 Apr 23 00:07:23 MY buddy and I are learning python, and it'd be great if we could run edit and test on the go with the n800 Apr 23 00:07:44 woodwizzle, yes there is. its called pygtkeditor Apr 23 00:07:53 just write a simple pygtk app to do it Apr 23 00:08:07 its fully designed and tested by a guy on his n800 and now 810 :) Apr 23 00:08:11 or just add the app to menu Apr 23 00:08:12 :) Apr 23 00:08:27 I use pygtkeditor for quick comix tweaks Apr 23 00:08:29 sweetness Apr 23 00:08:42 its got syntax highlighting and a run button :) Apr 23 00:08:49 cool Apr 23 00:08:49 :) Apr 23 00:08:56 all a person could ask for Apr 23 00:09:08 what about massage? Apr 23 00:09:13 oh - and its the only program i know to use the zoom buttons - bigger fonts == + button ;) Apr 23 00:09:23 no sorry, but khertan himself might do Apr 23 00:09:28 hum Apr 23 00:09:48 if he is good at it, why not Apr 23 00:09:49 :) Apr 23 00:09:54 otherwise i'll pass Apr 23 00:12:02 im off 2 bed, theres a new file on my ftp SDL_scrolly_sync_20080423_closest.zip if you wanna grab it and have a play kot. that function is inside. its defaulted to not running. find it and run it yourself if you wanna have a play Apr 23 00:12:22 lcuk, zomg wut ur ftp :P Apr 23 00:12:33 its private for now :P Apr 23 00:12:49 that code there ^ isnt but i dont have webspace Apr 23 00:12:54 k k Apr 23 00:12:54 ermmm, hang on a min Apr 23 00:13:50 http://liquid.googlepages.com/SDL_scrolly_sync_20080423_closest.zip Apr 23 00:13:53 gnite Apr 23 00:14:05 k k Apr 23 00:14:07 nite Apr 23 00:14:07 :) Apr 23 00:15:12 404 Apr 23 00:17:15 hmm Apr 23 00:17:38 maybe it's missing index.html Apr 23 00:17:39 KotCzarny, can you see that file i put on google Apr 23 00:17:39 :) Apr 23 00:17:50 lcuk, nope, 404 on google Apr 23 00:17:55 ftp works though Apr 23 00:20:34 http://liquid.googlepages.com/testfiles Apr 23 00:20:54 thur eet iz Apr 23 00:20:57 woo Apr 23 00:20:58 \o/ Apr 23 00:21:12 i did that the other nite with pupnik and he got it Apr 23 00:21:16 wonder what was diff Apr 23 00:22:42 ahhh well, this is just a dirty test program for sdl, this is probably the closest i have gotten to making a smooth verison, but its not perfect and doesnt suit my rendering style still. there may be more someone can do though Apr 23 00:23:20 (like follow into shmPutImage and see where the rabbit hole leads Apr 23 00:23:58 hmm Apr 23 00:24:16 me thought for a moment to dump x Apr 23 00:24:40 but it would break compatibility for many apps Apr 23 00:24:59 ok, brushing time Apr 23 00:25:00 technically sdl can be fired with quite a lot of drivers Apr 23 00:25:04 there is one for directfb Apr 23 00:25:42 plus, we have not seen RGB updates from any library yet at full speed, full resolution Apr 23 00:31:00 grrr Apr 23 00:31:05 you and your absolute paths Apr 23 00:31:06 :) Apr 23 00:32:25 hmm Apr 23 00:32:37 have you seen the first few pixels on the right? Apr 23 00:32:48 with the scaly thing? Apr 23 00:32:59 no, i mean on that scrolling thing Apr 23 00:33:09 yes Apr 23 00:33:09 when text goes up and down Apr 23 00:33:39 im not even sure if thats the ideal version anymore, its the closest i could get it Apr 23 00:33:40 interesting as it goes out of/in sync Apr 23 00:33:51 it seems to miss a frame every second Apr 23 00:33:58 ! ding Apr 23 00:34:06 Apparently I'll be able to drive N8x0 from 1x AA even Apr 23 00:34:08 mm? Apr 23 00:34:18 dont we have ermmmmm whats the power/cpu updater thingy toolbar button whatsit Apr 23 00:34:18 astorm: tested or theory? Apr 23 00:34:19 I'll make such an option in my battery pack Apr 23 00:34:27 KotCzarny: 100% possible Apr 23 00:34:31 lcuk: yes we have Apr 23 00:34:44 if it can live off 400 mA, surely Apr 23 00:34:45 that refreshes once a second and takes bandwidth from the lcd Apr 23 00:35:04 although efficiency will be shiz ;) like 75% Apr 23 00:35:10 erm Apr 23 00:35:12 :/ Apr 23 00:35:14 it refreshes even if you are doing other things. i noticed when i was messing with the framebuffer right at the start Apr 23 00:35:38 KotCzarny: Unless I plug that into battery port ;P Apr 23 00:36:02 then I would get about 80% Apr 23 00:36:05 astorm: the point is to make that battery pack complimentary Apr 23 00:36:09 yes Apr 23 00:36:16 so, 2x AA is more real Apr 23 00:36:32 and it would fit along top/bottom/back Apr 23 00:36:33 800 mA at 89% is good Apr 23 00:36:33 4aa would be minimum for mw Apr 23 00:36:50 lcuk: nowhere near minimum Apr 23 00:36:54 much more than required Apr 23 00:37:00 I'm thinking NiMH, btw Apr 23 00:37:04 Not alkaline ;P Apr 23 00:37:25 would need a switch for normal battery too Apr 23 00:37:31 but i want longevity - play all day on one charge and leave the pack charging at night Apr 23 00:37:37 yup Apr 23 00:37:42 2x AA = 2800 mAh Apr 23 00:37:49 coupled with internal battery, that's a lot Apr 23 00:37:54 astorm: include possibility to piggyback those Apr 23 00:38:03 this is inherent Apr 23 00:38:03 ie. to use 2 x 2AA Apr 23 00:38:06 or 3 x 2AA Apr 23 00:38:08 ah, that, hmm Apr 23 00:38:16 good idea Apr 23 00:38:27 simple to add, *if* I get proper plugs Apr 23 00:38:28 but the AAs will be recharging the internal battery pack? i need to fully charge myself at least twice to do a whole day Apr 23 00:38:33 lcuk: they will Apr 23 00:38:44 they'll both charge it and power the device Apr 23 00:39:17 hmm Apr 23 00:39:33 im gonna have to get one of these extension chargers before i go on holiday - i will give you results Apr 23 00:39:34 it's essentially additional 2400 mAh Apr 23 00:39:38 i whink 890mA is reached only when charging + using the device Apr 23 00:39:44 otherwise it's much less Apr 23 00:39:48 KotCzarny: no, more can be even Apr 23 00:39:51 up to 1A Apr 23 00:40:02 that's why the device is straining AC-4E sometimes ;P Apr 23 00:40:05 because it goes into trickle charge mode Apr 23 00:40:10 yes Apr 23 00:40:21 then it's about up to 250-300 mA Apr 23 00:40:26 in full load Apr 23 00:40:32 right, goognight Apr 23 00:40:35 night night Apr 23 00:40:36 so quite high efficiency Apr 23 00:40:37 :) Apr 23 00:40:38 night Apr 23 00:40:41 astorm: more i think Apr 23 00:40:47 3-4h of usage Apr 23 00:41:00 on 1500mAh internal battery Apr 23 00:41:02 KotCzarny: 4-5h Apr 23 00:41:11 let's say 4h Apr 23 00:41:17 k Apr 23 00:41:21 420mA then Apr 23 00:41:25 400 mA Apr 23 00:41:40 that includes various losses Apr 23 00:42:15 lcuk: btw. no reboot is needed Apr 23 00:42:18 only kill -9 Apr 23 00:42:19 :) Apr 23 00:42:30 well Apr 23 00:43:09 with 1x AA (NiCd/NiMH), the max current I'll be able to get will be about 400 mA, but that's old data Apr 23 00:43:18 these puppies have since improved Apr 23 00:43:22 yup Apr 23 00:43:33 you shouldn't worry about aa cell Apr 23 00:43:36 yep Apr 23 00:44:00 hmm Apr 23 00:44:36 6x 2.4Ah AA could be long time Apr 23 00:44:37 :) Apr 23 00:44:56 ok, have to drop into some shop, but a few MAX1703, schottky diodes, resistors, caps and inductors ;> Apr 23 00:45:07 KotCzarny: like a few days of usage Apr 23 00:45:27 6x 2800 mAh would give somewhere like 6x 2600 mAh, due to inefficiency of step-up Apr 23 00:45:34 also you should include cutoff switch Apr 23 00:45:42 although the link mode could use 4x AA almost directly Apr 23 00:45:47 with very high efficiency Apr 23 00:45:50 yes, I will Apr 23 00:46:16 because constant trickle charging may be damaging for internal battery Apr 23 00:46:36 no, it isn Apr 23 00:46:37 't Apr 23 00:46:40 it is Apr 23 00:46:41 it's Li-Poly after all Apr 23 00:46:42 believe me Apr 23 00:46:50 and it's not trickle-charged Apr 23 00:46:55 :> Apr 23 00:46:57 it is Apr 23 00:47:06 from what i have seen Apr 23 00:47:14 I suspect not, just left to unload for a while Apr 23 00:47:18 then charged back up Apr 23 00:47:46 http://mrrau.dyndns.org:23280/n800/kcbatt/batt2gp.png Apr 23 00:47:53 i believe pink is charging rate Apr 23 00:47:57 or something Apr 23 00:48:20 i mean violet Apr 23 00:48:34 where's the AC? Apr 23 00:48:45 i believe it's violet Apr 23 00:48:56 if pink is, then it's definitely *not* trickle charging :> Apr 23 00:49:10 because it goes from 0 to some value after connecting charger Apr 23 00:49:29 look at the data from 24/03 Apr 23 00:49:50 it charges for an hour then goes into some jumping state Apr 23 00:49:57 not bad xchat on the tablet Apr 23 00:50:19 yup Apr 23 00:50:28 KotCzarny: I think it's protecting from overheating Apr 23 00:50:40 but then it goes into flat line Apr 23 00:50:48 with some spikes Apr 23 00:51:08 and i think reading is inverted Apr 23 00:51:29 excluding 'not connected' state, which is at real 0 Apr 23 00:51:43 which spikes? Apr 23 00:51:51 these small at the bottom? it's noise Apr 23 00:52:04 trickle charge would have to be higher current Apr 23 00:52:09 like at least 1% Apr 23 00:52:15 hum Apr 23 00:52:29 on the second though you may be right Apr 23 00:52:39 it may be a fluctuation because of using the device Apr 23 00:53:26 btw. temperature reading is also inverted Apr 23 00:53:38 ie. hhigh on sclae mean low temp Apr 23 00:53:53 no Apr 23 00:53:54 temp. is blue and red Apr 23 00:54:02 temp. is read, right Apr 23 00:54:10 note that it is charging only when temp is low Apr 23 00:54:10 yes, because i know when it was hot. Apr 23 00:54:13 believe me on that Apr 23 00:54:33 :> Apr 23 00:54:56 ie. look at 24-25/03 Apr 23 00:55:04 when it was starting to discharge Apr 23 00:55:11 temp. was high Apr 23 00:55:22 (and reading was low) Apr 23 00:55:46 then after i went to sleep it gradually fallen Apr 23 00:55:54 (and reading was high) Apr 23 00:56:27 the slate blue might be battery use Apr 23 00:56:58 what is slate blue? Apr 23 00:57:15 you have some legend in the middle of the pic Apr 23 00:57:24 #10 Apr 23 00:57:41 i think it may be op_state Apr 23 00:58:12 in xchat, I don't see where to put the passwords for servers. Does anyone know ? Apr 23 00:58:31 in Network window Apr 23 00:58:35 get to it using menu Apr 23 00:58:41 or ctrl+something Apr 23 01:00:02 this kcbatt could be useful for me - where do I get it and will it work on N810? Apr 23 01:00:20 astorm, same server Apr 23 01:00:25 just go up Apr 23 01:00:58 and how do I make a chart? Apr 23 01:01:06 there should be a subfolder Apr 23 01:01:29 usually i just ran the bin in a screen session Apr 23 01:02:30 let me check Apr 23 01:02:30 i think it reports battery voltage too Apr 23 01:02:35 but in unscaled values Apr 23 01:02:35 my N810 should still be charging Apr 23 01:02:42 mhm, no problem with it Apr 23 01:03:22 btw. if you gather some data let me look at it too Apr 23 01:03:38 i'm interested if n810 is much different Apr 23 01:03:43 from n800 Apr 23 01:04:01 not in values, but more in usage patterns Apr 23 01:13:03 hmm, while charging, its telling me like, 4% or 1% ;P Apr 23 01:13:20 don't look at % number Apr 23 01:13:25 it's only a guesstimate Apr 23 01:13:31 look at the field #8 Apr 23 01:13:31 reall guesstimate ;P Apr 23 01:13:37 #8 is 394 or so Apr 23 01:13:49 and varies a lot Apr 23 01:13:53 between runs Apr 23 01:14:03 yup Apr 23 01:14:08 it's raw read Apr 23 01:14:13 without any processing Apr 23 01:14:54 also #3 is the charging rate i think Apr 23 01:14:58 or charging voltage Apr 23 01:15:30 8 is increasing apparently Apr 23 01:15:40 just look at generated png Apr 23 01:15:44 3 is 0xdd Apr 23 01:15:51 nah, I don't have the script yet, wait :-) Apr 23 01:16:11 btw. to gather data use 'batt' binary Apr 23 01:16:17 kcbatt processes data Apr 23 01:16:32 yup Apr 23 01:16:38 but not kcbatt -d ;) Apr 23 01:16:51 wait, d/ling Apr 23 01:17:00 but if you gather data with kcbatt you will have to modify php script Apr 23 01:17:06 that will prepare data for gnuplot Apr 23 01:17:07 :) Apr 23 01:17:22 heh, php, ugh Apr 23 01:17:36 you can write converting script in python Apr 23 01:17:39 sure Apr 23 01:17:43 it's just a shuffling fields Apr 23 01:17:47 heh Apr 23 01:17:58 actually, for kcbatt, parsing would be even easier Apr 23 01:18:04 and hex to int conversion Apr 23 01:18:14 astorm, you can modify the batt.c Apr 23 01:18:18 I know Apr 23 01:18:22 and just generate data in format you want Apr 23 01:18:22 but I'm lazy ;P Apr 23 01:18:39 and have to add gnuplot to the IT Apr 23 01:18:49 actually writing script in python will take more work than modifying printf Apr 23 01:18:50 :) Apr 23 01:18:57 ya Apr 23 01:18:58 or just copy .dat file to pc Apr 23 01:18:59 :) Apr 23 01:19:36 i like php because of preg_* functions Apr 23 01:19:48 and easiness of operations on arrays Apr 23 01:19:53 Python has perl regexes too :P Apr 23 01:20:04 arrays? who needs them when we have dictionaries and lists? Apr 23 01:20:08 ;P Apr 23 01:20:20 i will convert to python one day Apr 23 01:20:22 :) Apr 23 01:20:34 but for now it's faster to write code in php Apr 23 01:20:35 :) Apr 23 01:21:02 i should make some tiny cli php port for IT Apr 23 01:21:20 there is normal php Apr 23 01:21:50 -rwxr-xr-x 1 root root 3303700 2007-09-19 20:49 /usr/bin/php* Apr 23 01:21:52 ;) Apr 23 01:22:01 huge, eh? Apr 23 01:22:26 that's kitchen sink for anyone in need Apr 23 01:22:48 + classes and modules in /usr/share of course Apr 23 01:22:59 ;P Apr 23 01:23:11 Python is still smaller ;) Apr 23 01:23:39 last time i checked package was ~15mb Apr 23 01:23:39 ;) Apr 23 01:23:55 which translated to ~40-60mb of disk space Apr 23 01:24:07 (for python) Apr 23 01:24:21 not that large Apr 23 01:24:41 it's mostly .py files, which is text, just bloats out on ext Apr 23 01:24:49 yup Apr 23 01:24:50 python-2.5.2-i486-1.tgz 01-Mar-2008 19:53 15M Apr 23 01:24:52 15mb Apr 23 01:25:02 let me check installed size Apr 23 01:25:09 i486? check IT one ;P Apr 23 01:25:16 there is one too Apr 23 01:25:41 UNCOMPRESSED PACKAGE SIZE: 65500 K Apr 23 01:25:44 64mb Apr 23 01:25:44 :) Apr 23 01:25:58 UNCOMPRESSED PACKAGE SIZE: 19520 K Apr 23 01:26:01 and that's for php Apr 23 01:26:02 ;) Apr 23 01:26:14 wicked Apr 23 01:26:17 yup Apr 23 01:26:20 its impossible Apr 23 01:26:22 as i said, modules, classes Apr 23 01:26:28 must be docs Apr 23 01:27:05 21M python-2.5.2 Apr 23 01:27:10 21mb of dosc Apr 23 01:27:11 docs Apr 23 01:27:11 :) Apr 23 01:27:18 still 44mb vs 19 Apr 23 01:27:35 38 MB here on Gentoo, ext4 Apr 23 01:27:43 still 2x more Apr 23 01:27:44 :) Apr 23 01:28:13 hehe Apr 23 01:28:16 I'll check php Apr 23 01:28:26 17 MB Apr 23 01:29:10 i have seen working perl in ~500kb Apr 23 01:29:23 and i believe there was similiar version for php too Apr 23 01:29:31 (on openwrt) Apr 23 01:31:02 I think Python is very shrinkable too Apr 23 01:31:09 yes Apr 23 01:31:10 lib-dynload takes 3 MB Apr 23 01:31:23 you can ditch all the .py files too Apr 23 01:31:31 (after compiling them) Apr 23 01:32:24 huh, full collection of .pyc takes 12M Apr 23 01:32:31 fun Apr 23 01:32:32 on ext4 Apr 23 01:32:32 :) Apr 23 01:33:00 next 12M is .pyo Apr 23 01:33:17 4M of .so files Apr 23 01:33:51 13M of .py files Apr 23 01:35:34 largest module is the test one :> Apr 23 01:36:22 The average human being produces about a litre of saliva every day. Apr 23 01:36:23 :> Apr 23 01:36:36 yup, why not? Apr 23 01:36:43 fun fact Apr 23 01:36:50 that's 365l/year Apr 23 01:37:00 imagine that amount of salive Apr 23 01:37:02 saliva Apr 23 01:37:17 hmm, no gnuplot in repos... wth? Apr 23 01:37:36 gimme a port :-) Apr 23 01:37:40 pf Apr 23 01:37:48 just use sshfs Apr 23 01:37:48 :) Apr 23 01:37:53 blah blah Apr 23 01:37:55 I know Apr 23 01:38:03 but I want gnuplot on IT Apr 23 01:38:07 for some plotting Apr 23 01:38:10 let me see Apr 23 01:38:23 if it compiles on the first try Apr 23 01:38:55 whee, gnumeric was updated Apr 23 01:39:36 why don't you setup sbox on your pc? :) Apr 23 01:39:47 because I have to code stupid SOAP ;P Apr 23 01:40:00 I'll do during national holiday weekend ;) Apr 23 01:40:13 KotCzarny, The solution was pretty easy... screenshots coming soon Apr 23 01:40:38 huh Apr 23 01:40:46 solution to what? Apr 23 01:41:05 * KotCzarny had little sleep today Apr 23 01:41:08 Emulating a Nokia N800 with QEMU Apr 23 01:41:15 (Running Maemo) Apr 23 01:41:17 nini Apr 23 01:41:21 uh? there's a port already Apr 23 01:41:26 so? Apr 23 01:41:34 AStorm, Right, but it doesn't work :-P Apr 23 01:41:43 no, it does, it's used in Scratchbox Apr 23 01:42:00 I thought Scratchbox used an x86 ? Apr 23 01:42:02 ofc not everything is emulated Apr 23 01:42:15 trollasaurus: both ARM + emulation or sbrsh Apr 23 01:42:18 and x86 Apr 23 01:42:25 sbox used some tools natively and some emulated stuff Apr 23 01:42:27 This runs the Nokia blessed firmware unmodified Apr 23 01:43:07 erm Apr 23 01:43:12 so many deps Apr 23 01:43:16 oh, new mplayer Apr 23 01:43:17 .27 Apr 23 01:43:18 * KotCzarny hates debian sometimes Apr 23 01:43:30 * trollasaurus hates Debian all the time Apr 23 01:43:34 astorm: yup, ssvb announced it few days ago Apr 23 01:43:40 KotCzarny: well, it deps on X, gfx libs, etc Apr 23 01:43:47 probably cairo Apr 23 01:43:51 dpkg-checkbuilddeps: Unmet build dependencies: texinfo (>= 4.8) texlive-latex-base | tetex-bin texlive-latex-recommended | tetex-extra libgd2-noxpm-dev | libgd-dev libwxgtk2.6-dev Apr 23 01:43:59 that should be optional Apr 23 01:43:59 fun, isn't it? Apr 23 01:44:00 :) Apr 23 01:44:11 libwxgtk is for wx UI Apr 23 01:44:18 tex is for latex output Apr 23 01:44:23 but libgd is essential Apr 23 01:44:25 i think Apr 23 01:44:33 yes Apr 23 01:44:49 does modest .17-2 works with gmail? Apr 23 01:44:50 and nonexistend in armel packages Apr 23 01:45:06 libgd2? naaah, should be Apr 23 01:45:51 no luck with apt-cache Apr 23 01:45:53 Works fine, AStorm. Apr 23 01:46:03 GeneralAntilles: great Apr 23 01:46:20 I hope .27 has flv performance improvements Apr 23 01:47:45 libgd should be without user/ in section ? Apr 23 01:49:11 might be, who knows Apr 23 01:49:44 hmm, weird, clock on my N is consistently 1h off Apr 23 01:49:51 I guess DST didn't record in retu Apr 23 01:50:01 grrr. Apr 23 01:50:04 and local is used for the clock Apr 23 01:50:10 no love from libgd2 Apr 23 01:50:14 even more deps. Apr 23 01:50:18 ;> Apr 23 01:50:22 like? Apr 23 01:51:44 i hooked up a USB mouse to an n800... and no pointer Apr 23 01:51:53 life Apr 23 01:51:54 ;) Apr 23 01:52:05 it's possible to enable it though Apr 23 01:52:10 with a simple folder renaming Apr 23 01:52:15 really.. cool Apr 23 01:52:17 in /usr/share/icons i think Apr 23 01:52:21 (and a reboot) Apr 23 01:52:28 yup Apr 23 01:52:34 you can install your own theme too Apr 23 01:52:42 and switch cursor themes w/o reboot even Apr 23 01:52:51 I have to remember how to do that Apr 23 01:52:51 :) Apr 23 01:52:53 more work Apr 23 01:53:03 dpkg-checkbuilddeps: Unmet build dependencies: gnulib (>= 0.0.20041014-2) devscripts (>= 2.10.7) patchutils (>= 0.2.25) libfontconfig-dev d-shlibs (>= 0.30) Apr 23 01:53:06 i've had to reboot a couple times lately.. it gets into a locked scrolling mode Apr 23 01:53:08 that's for libgd2 Apr 23 01:53:13 build deps Apr 23 01:53:17 not run deps :> Apr 23 01:53:23 yeah Apr 23 01:53:27 but i don't have them Apr 23 01:53:27 :-) Apr 23 01:53:31 these are mostly minor Apr 23 01:53:32 so no build Apr 23 01:53:36 sure Apr 23 01:53:39 so grab them Apr 23 01:53:43 not today Apr 23 01:53:43 :) Apr 23 01:53:56 as i said, if it build without much fuss Apr 23 01:53:56 ;) Apr 23 01:53:59 *builds Apr 23 01:54:04 hehe Apr 23 01:54:17 any of you keep a keyboard in your car, so you can type on the NIT while driving? Apr 23 01:54:18 which is not happening Apr 23 01:54:26 * KotCzarny doesn't have a car Apr 23 01:54:31 but i have a kb Apr 23 01:54:33 does it count? Apr 23 01:54:34 :) Apr 23 01:54:35 ok, how do I switch clocks to UTC and change timezone to be software-applied? Apr 23 01:54:53 change your home city in clock applet Apr 23 01:54:54 unixSnob: that's crazy and dangerous Apr 23 01:54:54 :) Apr 23 01:55:03 KotCzarny: I did, it's correct Apr 23 01:55:07 hmm Apr 23 01:55:13 unixSnob, . . . Apr 23 01:55:15 well keyboarding in the car is a unique problem.. because it will involve cutting a hole to access the USB port Apr 23 01:55:16 then your proggy uses wrong gettime func Apr 23 01:55:16 :) Apr 23 01:55:23 hehe Apr 23 01:55:29 maybe some hack with /etc/TZ ? Apr 23 01:55:30 the clock is off Apr 23 01:55:35 add voice recogonition Apr 23 01:55:42 busybox is notorious in that point Apr 23 01:55:54 I've been able to participate in forums while driving.. but my messages are short Apr 23 01:55:54 try echo CEST > /etc/TZ Apr 23 01:56:14 i figure the keyboard will remedy that Apr 23 01:56:19 heh Apr 23 01:56:42 i wouldn't do IRC while on the road Apr 23 01:56:57 i think it's useful in traffic jams Apr 23 01:57:04 good point Apr 23 01:57:05 when you move <1km/h Apr 23 01:57:07 KotCzarny: no such file here Apr 23 01:57:17 astorm: create one Apr 23 01:57:18 doh Apr 23 01:57:31 made, and? Apr 23 01:57:33 or on a highway w/ little traffic Apr 23 01:57:37 and relogin Apr 23 01:57:43 open new term and see Apr 23 01:57:46 or just reopen app Apr 23 01:57:54 /etc/localtime is correct Apr 23 01:57:56 You're nuts, unixSnob. Apr 23 01:58:09 busybox doesn't use timeconfig, only TZ Apr 23 01:58:11 tz is ok too, according to date Apr 23 01:58:16 Typing while driving is high idiocy. Apr 23 01:58:20 but time is 1h off ;P Apr 23 01:58:38 that's what TZ is for Apr 23 01:58:39 :) Apr 23 01:58:41 Have to set ntpdate Apr 23 01:58:52 KotCzarny: no, TZ is correct (according to date proggy) Apr 23 01:59:19 I think retu is wrong, or something Apr 23 01:59:25 anyway, off to ff8 Apr 23 01:59:26 well, I'm a pilot, so I'm used to having to concentrate on action in front of me while operating electronics. And I consider the NIT a way to train for that Apr 23 01:59:43 unixSnob: do it somewhere else than on the road, please Apr 23 01:59:45 :-) Apr 23 01:59:52 yup Apr 23 01:59:54 You don't have hard objects 20 feet in front of you while flying. :\ Apr 23 01:59:56 much more noise on road Apr 23 01:59:57 :) Apr 23 02:00:08 high frequency noise Apr 23 02:00:08 ;) Apr 23 02:00:10 When you fuck up while in the air, it's usually only you that pays Apr 23 02:00:22 ga: not true, see wtc Apr 23 02:00:23 When you do it on the interstate, you're putting other people in danger. Apr 23 02:00:23 ;) Apr 23 02:00:36 That, in my opinion, is incredibly irresponsible. Apr 23 02:00:39 or any bigger plane crash Apr 23 02:01:01 KotCzarny: k, there may be hard buildings Apr 23 02:01:08 and ground too Apr 23 02:01:15 sometimes other planes ;P Apr 23 02:01:25 and ice clouds Apr 23 02:01:26 :) Apr 23 02:02:06 The way pilots handle it is look up most of the time.. look down to press one key, and look up again.. never pressing more than one key w/out looking up Apr 23 02:02:59 unixSnob: still that makes at least 20ms in which you can crash Apr 23 02:03:04 And that's how I write a forum post while driving.. one key at a time Apr 23 02:03:06 with planes, it's unlikely :> Apr 23 02:03:16 Doesn't matter how you do it. Apr 23 02:03:28 Taking your attention off the road is a good way to get yourself and others killed. Apr 23 02:03:31 well w/ a keyboard, I don't even have to look down Apr 23 02:03:32 but in a car, 20ms might be enough to crash, esp. if driving >= 100 km/h Apr 23 02:03:42 yup Apr 23 02:03:46 bt kb can be useful Apr 23 02:03:47 I can type w/out looking at the keyboard Apr 23 02:03:50 and yup, lack of attention is what kills :p Apr 23 02:04:04 btw, where is the retutime tool? Apr 23 02:04:17 /mnt/initfs ? Apr 23 02:04:25 damnit Apr 23 02:04:29 fanoush removed it Apr 23 02:04:36 just a guess Apr 23 02:04:37 :) Apr 23 02:04:38 at least thinks it's unnecessary Apr 23 02:04:43 idjit Apr 23 02:04:48 mail him Apr 23 02:04:49 :) Apr 23 02:04:50 I'll have to fix the initfs then Apr 23 02:04:55 or just copy to regular fs Apr 23 02:05:00 ya Apr 23 02:05:12 but first I have to get orig. initfs unpacked and mountable Apr 23 02:05:19 i'm thinking there must be a device out there to make it easier to steer w/ knees Apr 23 02:05:26 Nokia should pay him to do kernel hacking for the community. Apr 23 02:05:30 unixSnob: ubermad Apr 23 02:05:40 Yeah, they're called your hands. Apr 23 02:05:48 unixsnob, there was a kb embedded in pants Apr 23 02:05:51 unixSnob: maybe steering by eyes? Apr 23 02:05:54 knee-hands! Apr 23 02:05:54 complete with trackball Apr 23 02:05:55 :) Apr 23 02:05:55 you look where you drive ;P Apr 23 02:06:09 just take the train Apr 23 02:06:10 could be fun to use ;P Apr 23 02:06:11 kotczarny - i heard about that keyboard recently Apr 23 02:06:20 AStorm, just hope you don't pass any hot women on the sidewalk. O_O Apr 23 02:06:26 GeneralAntilles: hahaha Apr 23 02:06:28 yup Apr 23 02:06:31 does anyone know where I can find a command like netsat for IT OS2008 ? Apr 23 02:06:42 you mean netstat? Apr 23 02:06:42 busybox has one Apr 23 02:06:46 ds3 - apparently you're not in the US :) Apr 23 02:06:48 you want the real thing? Apr 23 02:06:48 astyes Apr 23 02:06:54 AStorm, yes Apr 23 02:07:07 http://www.vouspensez.com/2008/04/22/the-geekiest-pants-ever/ Apr 23 02:07:09 this one Apr 23 02:07:22 KotCzarny: I'm feeling lazy, could you put retutime on your server? Apr 23 02:07:31 astorm: where it is? Apr 23 02:07:37 i have fanoush's initfs too Apr 23 02:07:38 :) Apr 23 02:07:54 should be in /mnt/initfs/sbin Apr 23 02:08:17 blah Apr 23 02:08:18 it is there Apr 23 02:08:24 hehe Apr 23 02:08:25 /mnt/initfs/usr/bin/retutime Apr 23 02:08:33 so you have it? Apr 23 02:08:34 :) Apr 23 02:08:35 * AStorm bashes head against keyboard Apr 23 02:08:37 yup Apr 23 02:08:52 unixSnob: yes, the People's Republic of California has succeded :P Apr 23 02:09:04 * unixSnob thinks those pants would be better if the keyboard were a strap on device Apr 23 02:09:06 netstat gives the following error message : netstat: warning, got bogus unix line Apr 23 02:09:19 trains are fine modes of transportation Apr 23 02:09:34 ok, retu is keeping time in UTC Apr 23 02:09:38 CA only has one overpriced metro rail, right? Apr 23 02:09:48 It's not good coverage Apr 23 02:09:56 nope, we got 132493289230492138948123904890123489012849023 different rail systems Apr 23 02:10:08 rail system overflow Apr 23 02:10:14 I figure if I get back to CA again, I'll either live next door to work, or fly to work. Apr 23 02:10:26 US fails at rail systems Apr 23 02:10:33 not true Apr 23 02:10:36 it does Apr 23 02:10:39 i find nj path quite nice Apr 23 02:10:39 no trains there Apr 23 02:10:40 :) Apr 23 02:10:42 can someone try netstat to see if it works ? Apr 23 02:10:42 AMTrack doesn't count Apr 23 02:10:42 we got the amtrak stuff, fed run stuff, locally run stuff, state run stuff, and in some area city run stuff Apr 23 02:10:44 that can't be right.. I lived in LA area 8 years ago.. no trains Apr 23 02:11:11 North a bit. Apr 23 02:11:17 gribouille: also have these Apr 23 02:11:22 probably some weird unix sockets Apr 23 02:11:27 try netstat -t for tcp Apr 23 02:11:31 or -u for udp Apr 23 02:11:40 probably some busybox lack of features Apr 23 02:11:41 :) Apr 23 02:11:45 no Apr 23 02:11:48 I have coreutils ;P Apr 23 02:12:00 interesting Apr 23 02:12:29 * unixSnob would buy those pants if they were washable Apr 23 02:12:32 AStorm, you mean the real netstat gives the same error ? Apr 23 02:12:37 yes Apr 23 02:13:06 linux 2.6.25 Apr 23 02:13:07 nice Apr 23 02:13:14 changelog 7.7mb Apr 23 02:13:15 ;) Apr 23 02:13:38 wait, no Apr 23 02:13:41 netstat is separate ;P Apr 23 02:13:56 AStorm, why did you install coreutils instaed of busybox ? Apr 23 02:14:00 has some arm:omap fixes too Apr 23 02:14:11 gribouille: because busybox is underfeatured Apr 23 02:14:26 KotCzarny: but we need working wifi and bt Apr 23 02:14:44 nothing about wifi or bt Apr 23 02:14:50 KotCzarny: how do I check to which package does a file belong? Apr 23 02:14:56 dpkg -S Apr 23 02:15:00 KotCzarny: that's separate, at least wifi Apr 23 02:15:16 no strings with cx311 Apr 23 02:15:22 blah busybox Apr 23 02:15:30 KotCzarny: it's a separate driver Apr 23 02:15:37 name it Apr 23 02:15:38 :) Apr 23 02:16:18 AStorm, didn't it damage your system too mutch ? Apr 23 02:16:25 gribouille: some minor hassle Apr 23 02:16:30 mv has problems Apr 23 02:16:41 uhm, wrong Apr 23 02:16:47 it had problems, but these went away Apr 23 02:16:54 after a reboot Apr 23 02:16:58 lol Apr 23 02:17:04 now it's fine and kicking Apr 23 02:17:13 just installed net-tools (the pkg that has netstat) Apr 23 02:17:35 (ifconfig, arp and others too :) Apr 23 02:17:57 including 'reboot' in post-install could be fun Apr 23 02:18:08 heh Apr 23 02:18:11 whoooops Apr 23 02:18:18 still no netstat in net-tools Apr 23 02:18:23 some idjit stripped it Apr 23 02:19:23 ah, forgot --force overwrite Apr 23 02:19:25 AStorm, but it removes a lot of osso-* packages Apr 23 02:19:39 that's good Apr 23 02:19:42 isn't it? Apr 23 02:19:43 :) Apr 23 02:19:51 why ? Apr 23 02:19:53 less points of breakage from nokia Apr 23 02:19:54 :) Apr 23 02:20:01 *fewer Apr 23 02:20:49 gribouille: you have to hack a few Apr 23 02:20:54 in the main cache file Apr 23 02:21:11 where was it... Apr 23 02:21:15 I'm tired of hacking Apr 23 02:21:21 not packages Apr 23 02:21:25 but the file itself Apr 23 02:21:36 change data about busybox and that network thingy Apr 23 02:22:00 ok, normal netstat works ok Apr 23 02:23:14 wouldn't it be possible to install coreutils in /usr/local ? Apr 23 02:23:33 the package is made for /usr Apr 23 02:23:45 but yes, it should be possible Apr 23 02:24:21 KotCzarny: where is the main apt package data file located? Apr 23 02:25:05 ok, got it Apr 23 02:25:15 gribouille: you have to hack /var/lib/dpkg/status file a bit Apr 23 02:25:24 to make busybox not block coreutils Apr 23 02:25:42 wouldn't it reverse after apt-get update ? Apr 23 02:25:43 ofc you still have to install it with --force override and dpkg Apr 23 02:25:46 KotCzarny: no Apr 23 02:25:55 unless they upgrade busybox ;P Apr 23 02:26:06 that's a possibility Apr 23 02:26:19 then it won't install and will cry ;) Apr 23 02:27:03 AStorm, where do I have to hack in the file ? Apr 23 02:27:11 the cheap and easy way to update it would be to pass overwrite ignorance to dpkg Apr 23 02:27:16 gribouille: search for busybox Apr 23 02:27:30 change all packages that dep on busybox to dep on busybox | coreutils Apr 23 02:27:53 well, maybe except color-ls ;) Apr 23 02:28:38 most important are osso-core-busybox and ke-recv Apr 23 02:28:59 then remove Conflicts line from busybox package status Apr 23 02:30:15 if one day I really want to install coreutils, I'll rebuild it with prefix=/usr/local and put /usr/local at the beginning of my PATH Apr 23 02:32:03 you could alternatively install coreutils with --force conflicts,overwrite Apr 23 02:32:17 I wonder if there's something like --force ignore-overwrite Apr 23 02:32:44 yes, but I don't want to break my system Apr 23 02:33:00 mine (and not just mine) works Apr 23 02:33:06 but feel free to backup Apr 23 02:34:15 I haven't changed /bin/sh Apr 23 02:34:20 but I do have bash3 :- Apr 23 02:34:25 from nitapps.com Apr 23 02:34:46 me too Apr 23 02:34:55 I cant' live without bash ;-) Apr 23 02:35:27 I can't live with csh Apr 23 02:35:33 and I have to :-( Apr 23 02:35:55 busybox' ash is weak, but still better than csh to my eyes Apr 23 02:36:19 never tried Apr 23 02:36:42 ash? it's the default shell on IT Apr 23 02:36:59 I wonder why they didn't use msh, which is more powerful and nicer Apr 23 02:37:08 i can live without csh Apr 23 02:37:09 ;) Apr 23 02:37:17 AStorm, no, csh Apr 23 02:37:26 gribouille: the default FreeBSD shell Apr 23 02:37:34 it sucks. Apr 23 02:37:35 :) Apr 23 02:37:37 ya Apr 23 02:37:49 AStorm, never tried freebsd. I'm a linux guy Apr 23 02:37:59 linux boi ;) Apr 23 02:38:12 still better than 'doze boi Apr 23 02:38:13 :) Apr 23 02:38:43 do free wifi hotspots give full access to the INternet ? Apr 23 02:39:00 most don't Apr 23 02:39:08 usually they're heavily firewalled Apr 23 02:39:25 like, port 80, port 443 Apr 23 02:39:30 do they prenvent skype ? Apr 23 02:39:46 no, that's hard to do Apr 23 02:39:58 they will reduce performance of it though Apr 23 02:40:10 you'll use one of skypes zombies^Wrouters Apr 23 02:40:13 why is it hard to do ? Apr 23 02:40:36 because skype uses passive connections through so-called routers Apr 23 02:40:44 which can listen on port 80 and 443 just fine Apr 23 02:40:49 it's P2P Apr 23 02:40:57 yes I know that Apr 23 02:41:07 some higher bandwidth machines are marked as supersomething or another Apr 23 02:41:21 and they will route traffic for other users too Apr 23 02:42:13 the system is automatic and makes the network very hard to block (even packet matching doesn't work reliably) Apr 23 02:43:14 but it becomes extremely slow Apr 23 02:43:23 no, why? Apr 23 02:43:29 slower, yes, but not extremely Apr 23 02:43:35 there are really a lot of users Apr 23 02:43:53 and algorithm picks the best router for you Apr 23 02:43:58 it takes about 10 seconds to ring Apr 23 02:44:19 that's because it has to make a query in the network Apr 23 02:44:35 connecting is slow Apr 23 02:44:38 ringing isn't that bad Apr 23 02:44:55 that's the problem of version of Skype on IT Apr 23 02:45:49 will there be a newer version ? Apr 23 02:46:04 ask Skype, not me Apr 23 02:46:13 I guess when 2.0 is released for Linux Apr 23 02:46:17 or slightly later Apr 23 02:46:41 right now 2.0 for Linux is in beta testing Apr 23 02:46:45 works nicely Apr 23 02:47:05 this includes camera Apr 23 02:47:08 with video ? Apr 23 02:47:10 yes Apr 23 02:47:22 great ! Apr 23 02:47:26 but Idk if the tablet can sustain 4 streams Apr 23 02:48:02 skype will reduce number of frames and quality when running on a slow CPU Apr 23 02:48:11 but it might not be enough Apr 23 02:48:20 they might have to use DSP some more Apr 23 02:48:40 as Skype is fairly cpu intensive even on my desktop Apr 23 02:49:10 the 1.4 intermittently fails under load on IT Apr 23 02:49:16 that's with sound only Apr 23 02:49:59 anyway, the camera on the tablet is quite weak Apr 23 02:50:13 not that bad as far as webcams go Apr 23 02:50:24 it's pretty bad as far as webcams go Apr 23 02:50:32 blah blah Apr 23 02:50:33 if you don't move too quickly Apr 23 02:50:35 workable Apr 23 02:50:47 the old zaurus cam that connected through CF was a little better Apr 23 02:51:12 if you want something better, connect one though USB Apr 23 02:51:36 I could I guess. I'll worry about it when skype w/ video is out :P Apr 23 02:51:45 ;P Apr 23 02:51:50 or SIP works correctly? Apr 23 02:52:08 I can't really picture getting my mom to use SIP Apr 23 02:52:20 why? NATs abound? Apr 23 02:52:29 STUN can't pierce through? Apr 23 02:52:30 is it possible to redirect a call to a normal phone number to skype ? Apr 23 02:52:47 gribouille: you can buy skype-in afaicr Apr 23 02:53:02 then use normal call redirection service of your phone company Apr 23 02:53:36 AStorm, NATs and any troubleshooting I did would have to be over skype... Apr 23 02:53:46 johnx: :> Apr 23 02:54:19 we need an open P2P-like protocol Apr 23 02:54:38 might as well be some evolution of Jingle Apr 23 02:54:50 with proxies and relevant negotiation **** ENDING LOGGING AT Wed Apr 23 02:59:56 2008