**** BEGIN LOGGING AT Sun May 04 02:59:57 2008
May 04 03:22:18 <rafael> hi guys
May 04 03:23:21 <rafael> I need a problem with N800
May 04 03:23:44 <KotCzarny> need a problem? then throw it
May 04 03:23:51 <rafael> However, I belive that for yours this problem be very little
May 04 03:24:21 <KotCzarny> hammer could also work
May 04 03:24:22 <rafael> simply, I do not entry as Root on Maemo (N800)
May 04 03:24:44 <KotCzarny> rafael: install ssh-server and do: ssh root@0
May 04 03:25:47 <rafael> I tried, however, it need root to install :S
May 04 03:27:28 <rafael> any idea? any link that you can pass to me?
May 04 03:27:29 <benh> is there any negative side effect of enabling RD mode ?
May 04 03:28:38 <rafael> yeah, however, I should to be anything with error
May 04 03:30:29 <rafael> I access "aplicatives manager"->"tools"->"aplicatives catalogue"->"new" on web address I write "matrix" and cancel
May 04 03:30:55 <rafael> and then, I clicked in "red"
May 04 03:30:59 <benh> heh, there's a DSP in the tablet, I didn't even know :-)
May 04 03:31:02 <rafael> right?
May 04 03:31:06 <benh> it's in the omap or it's separate ?
May 04 03:31:21 <KotCzarny> rafael: r&d mode is NOT red pill mode
May 04 03:31:46 <rafael> :S not?!
May 04 03:31:51 <rafael> hahaha
May 04 03:32:02 <benh> KotCzarny: what is red pill mode btw ? I enabled r&d with 0xffff to get root etc... I didn't know there also was a red pill mode :-)
May 04 03:32:27 <rafael> for this, I don't have a sucess!
May 04 03:32:36 <KotCzarny> benh: red pill disables the need for packages to have "user/" in "Section:"
May 04 03:33:00 <KotCzarny> i never used r&d mode
May 04 03:33:05 <KotCzarny> for root i use ssh
May 04 03:33:06 <KotCzarny> :)
May 04 03:33:21 <rafael> and how I can enable R&D mode?
May 04 03:34:08 <benh> KotCzarny: not sure what "having user/ in Section: means but I suppose it has to do with installing some types of packages..
May 04 03:34:10 <benh> heh, interesting
May 04 03:34:24 <rafael> any quickly answer? (different of "google")
May 04 03:34:28 <benh> reading the docs... it's funny how they insist that you should be using the gstreamer framework for perfs etc...
May 04 03:34:48 <benh> while from some quick tests, mplayer for maemo is significantly better/faster than their codec
May 04 03:34:55 <KotCzarny> banh: it's a nokia's try to comb the packages in app man
May 04 03:35:14 <benh> KotCzarny: I see
May 04 03:35:21 <benh> KotCzarny: thx
May 04 03:36:11 <benh> has access to the DSP been reverse engineered ? or it's still nokia-provided use only ?
May 04 03:36:19 <benh> (unless I misread the docs)
May 04 03:36:21 <rafael> I have developed a ODF reader on tournament of programation, however, those devices was all installed :P
May 04 03:36:40 <KotCzarny> gstreamer or write your own task using it dsp compiler
May 04 03:36:41 <KotCzarny> :)
May 04 03:38:52 <benh> ok so we do have a dsp compiler etc.. it's not some kind of uber srkit bit
May 04 03:38:53 <benh> good
May 04 03:38:54 <rafael> thanks for this tips dear friends...
May 04 03:39:04 <benh> I haven't toyed with a DSP for ages, I might have fun with it some day
May 04 03:39:07 <benh> what kind of DSP is it ?
May 04 03:39:14 <KotCzarny> specialized
May 04 03:39:17 <KotCzarny> heh
May 04 03:39:26 <KotCzarny> google it site i guess
May 04 03:39:32 <KotCzarny> for omap2
May 04 03:40:05 <rafael> Anybody is Brazilian in here?
May 04 03:41:19 <rafael> no?
May 04 03:43:39 <rafael> ok
May 04 03:43:57 <rafael> thanks very much for tips again
May 04 03:44:12 <benh> brb
May 04 03:45:11 <rafael> You is BR?
May 04 03:48:32 <benh> hrm... the install.txt for scratchbox/sdk is a bit weak
May 04 03:48:42 <benh> any tip on how to add a user to scratchbox before installing the sdk ?
May 04 03:48:57 <KotCzarny> just follow install.txt
May 04 03:49:17 <benh> KotCzarny: yeah, forgot to use -u to add a user at install time
May 04 03:49:32 <benh> I suppose I can just reinstall
May 04 04:03:46 <pupnik> Rethinking IP Completely:
May 04 04:03:52 <pupnik> http://mises.org/multimedia/mp3/ASC2008/ASC08-Kinsella.mp3
May 04 04:04:02 <pupnik> By  N. Stephan Kinsella  May 1, 2008
May 04 04:04:10 <benh> heh, red pill mode makes app mgr pretty useless
May 04 04:04:12 <Proteous> Internet protocal or intelectual property
May 04 04:04:30 <benh> version fields becomes 80% of the displayed width leaving barely 8 or 9 chars visible of the package name
May 04 04:04:33 <benh> (in full screen !)
May 04 04:04:41 <benh> fun
May 04 04:04:43 <Proteous> heh
May 04 04:04:45 * benh goes command line
May 04 04:04:52 <KotCzarny> it's not red pill, it's b0rken packages
May 04 04:04:59 <KotCzarny> with veeeeeeery long version info
May 04 04:05:23 <KotCzarny> like 2006+something+something_other+some_stuff_+weee_loove_to_talk
May 04 04:06:05 <benh> yeah
May 04 04:06:16 <benh> it's annoying that the columns can't be resized tho
May 04 04:06:50 <benh> heh, everybody can't resist making his own music player I see :-)
May 04 04:09:12 <flatface> is there one that does gapless playback yet?
May 04 04:13:13 <benh> heh, there's no pipe sign on the keyboard ! oops
May 04 04:14:12 <pupnik> Proteous: intellectual property
May 04 04:14:20 <pupnik> He's an IP lawyer
May 04 04:14:25 <Proteous> thanks
May 04 04:14:37 <pupnik> Some stuff i'd never heard before
May 04 04:17:18 <konttori> were you guys able to get the frisky configured for the application manager? ( fysa, johnx)
May 04 04:39:52 <dick-richardson> what does phonelink do?
May 04 04:47:22 <Italodance> dick-richardson   sms and call with ur bluetooth
May 04 04:47:54 <dick-richardson> Italodance: thank you. :)
May 04 04:48:23 <dick-richardson> anyone know if you can send and receive sms messages w/o a phone?
May 04 04:48:52 <Italodance> dick-richardson  w/o?
May 04 04:49:31 <KotCzarny> dickr: most companies allow you to use www to do it, but it's limited often
May 04 04:49:50 <doc|home> dick-richardson: clickatell.com
May 04 04:50:15 <dick-richardson> :D
May 04 04:50:21 <dick-richardson> thank you!
May 04 04:50:34 <doc|home> although those are wholesalers of sms messages, I'm working on something else for less demanding users
May 04 04:50:43 <doc|home> still much cheaper than telecomms providers
May 04 05:01:11 <adam_> Where can I find python-pygtksourceview at
May 04 05:01:54 <dick-richardson> I'm using curl to send post requests to a site...how do i handle special characters?
May 04 05:05:27 <adam_> Where can I find python-pygtksourceview at?
May 04 05:05:34 <pupnik> google?
May 04 05:15:14 <scibot> Can anyone recommend a task manager for maemo? It doesn't have to be in the todo list style, I'm more looking for personal recommendations.
May 04 05:15:26 <scibot> Even if it's the text editor. =/
May 04 05:16:45 <dick-richardson> I use top
May 04 05:17:02 <scibot> What's that?
May 04 05:17:21 <dick-richardson> open up the command line and type 'top'
May 04 05:17:34 <dick-richardson> better yet, install htop
May 04 05:17:43 <KotCzarny> i think he needs something else
May 04 05:17:49 <Grackle> That's a system taks manager, silly.
May 04 05:17:55 <Grackle> He means a personal task manager.
May 04 05:18:08 <dick-richardson> I'm incredibly slow. 2 demerits for me
May 04 05:18:27 <dick-richardson> gpe todo is good
May 04 05:18:37 <Grackle> hehe
May 04 05:20:02 <flatface> all of the gpe programs I've tried to install have placed me in dependency hell. could never get them installed properly :/
May 04 05:21:05 <dick-richardson> flatface: really? I didn't have that problem. you use the gronmayer.com/it repo recommendation?
May 04 05:21:48 <dick-richardson> how do you send function keys at the command line? f1-f10
May 04 05:21:50 <flatface> Can't remember, I last tried a few months ago. Let me check my repos
May 04 05:22:49 <flatface> ...hm. I've got www.cobb.uk.net/apt/
May 04 05:23:00 <flatface> I'll try the one you linked, thanks
May 04 05:23:18 <dick-richardson> np. :)
May 04 05:25:54 <pupnik> awesome, zodttd got his pandora
May 04 05:45:38 <zpol> hi
May 04 09:02:16 <lcuk> my 810 is dead after 7.5 hours idling
May 04 09:02:28 <lcuk> 8 hours unplugged
May 04 09:02:36 <KotCzarny> you have probably left something running
May 04 09:02:55 <qwerty12> Probably not, battery life on mine sucks.
May 04 09:03:00 <lcuk> it happens every single night
May 04 09:03:05 <KotCzarny> hrm
May 04 09:03:10 <lcuk> from reboot it is dead in that time
May 04 09:03:11 <KotCzarny> what applets you have?
May 04 09:03:20 <KotCzarny> statusbar ?
May 04 09:03:25 <KotCzarny> desktop apps?
May 04 09:03:29 <lcuk> yer - and i noted that refreshes every hour
May 04 09:03:34 <lcuk> ievery second
May 04 09:03:45 <lcuk> is that the price i pay for seeing cpu usage..
May 04 09:03:53 <KotCzarny> nope
May 04 09:03:58 <KotCzarny> i have cpu usage applet too
May 04 09:04:06 <KotCzarny> and it idles ~8-10 days
May 04 09:04:09 <Cptnodegard> me too and i get days
May 04 09:04:10 <lcuk> maybe if it saw that machine was locked it should not check
May 04 09:04:28 <KotCzarny> check your config
May 04 09:04:31 <lcuk> i did leave wifi on, but nothing connected (i closed everything at this end)
May 04 09:04:35 <KotCzarny> it's definitely something running
May 04 09:04:42 <qwerty12> Which CPU applet? The graph one or the load applet (the screenshot one)
May 04 09:04:43 <KotCzarny> with wifi i get 1-3 days
May 04 09:04:44 <lcuk> i know that, but its been running from day 1
May 04 09:04:46 <Cptnodegard> yesterday mine almost depleted in hours, because i left it right in the zone where the wifi signal dropped out. it kept reconnecting and disconnecting all the time
May 04 09:04:52 <lcuk> load applet
May 04 09:05:03 <Cptnodegard> load applet ftw
May 04 09:05:06 <qwerty12> +`
May 04 09:05:13 <qwerty12> s/+`/+1
May 04 09:05:19 <lcuk> can i change the usage of the lock slider
May 04 09:05:26 <KotCzarny> that regexp would fail
May 04 09:05:27 <KotCzarny> :)
May 04 09:05:31 <lcuk> so when i lock it it turns off weifi+bluetooth
May 04 09:05:43 <lcuk> weifi :) cool, new wireless
May 04 09:05:45 <KotCzarny> you can enable wifi idle disabling
May 04 09:05:46 <qwerty12> lol
May 04 09:05:56 <qwerty12> mce may control that lock slider, not sure, I have N800.
May 04 09:06:04 <KotCzarny> ie. if it's not used for 60min it disconnects from ap
May 04 09:06:04 <Cptnodegard> i leave wifi on all the itme... doesnt drain much IMO (at least considering its online in gtalk, refreshing rss etc)
May 04 09:06:29 <lcuk> cos thats how i lock it at night - click app menu, close *ahem* fbreader and then slide the lock
May 04 09:06:51 <KotCzarny> still, you have something running
May 04 09:07:01 <KotCzarny> maybe it's locked on performance cpufreq?
May 04 09:07:27 <lcuk> i cant even blame it on performance, im working towards running everything on ondemand
May 04 09:07:27 <qwerty12> I wonder if AStorm got CPU_TIMER stats to work in .25, you could run powertop then.
May 04 09:07:40 <lcuk> i lowered default res for this reason
May 04 09:07:55 <Cptnodegard> you might have something that accesses the memory card a lot... that usesa shitload of power
May 04 09:08:18 <lcuk> my evil genius overlord program is calculating things?
May 04 09:08:31 <KotCzarny> could be
May 04 09:08:38 <KotCzarny> run top and see
May 04 09:08:53 <lcuk> but that is meant to be inconspicuous - its meant to be low power until it takes over the world
May 04 09:09:04 <lcuk> i cant its shut down
May 04 09:09:22 <KotCzarny> if it drains battery before it reaches it's goal..
May 04 09:09:38 <lcuk> tether
May 04 09:10:04 <qwerty12> I still wonder if CPU_TIMERSTATS was fixed in .25, because then powertop could be used. My kernel crashes with it built, hrw's kernel works with it but wifi is disabled.
May 04 09:10:08 <lcuk> ok, so you guys can hold a wifi connection for days what about if i leave a putty session open and run top at opportune moments
May 04 09:10:23 <KotCzarny> ?
May 04 09:10:47 <lcuk> will me holding a putty session open from this computer drain battery much faster
May 04 09:10:48 <KotCzarny> as long you don't send/receive any data you can even turn off wifi
May 04 09:10:56 <KotCzarny> and session will stay
May 04 09:11:15 <lcuk> i actually think all this is related to my adhoc wifi
May 04 09:11:22 <KotCzarny> could be
May 04 09:11:47 <KotCzarny> try setting wifi idle to 60 min.
May 04 09:12:05 <lcuk> i would like to switch to try bt network for a while but its too much faffing nw
May 04 09:12:23 <lcuk> i did that, most nights i disable wifi totally
May 04 09:12:28 <lcuk> disconnect^
May 04 09:13:30 <lcuk> i can get at top and the stats from my own program can't i
May 04 09:13:41 <KotCzarny> ?
May 04 09:14:18 <qwerty12> Does it defeat the purpose of a "port" when you have to include a killing script with it?
May 04 09:14:22 <lcuk> if i write my own little program to sleep for a minute, grab all top stats, sleep again etc
May 04 09:14:47 <KotCzarny> lcuk, i think kernel can gather stats all by itself
May 04 09:15:03 <lcuk> but how does it share them with mere mortals?
May 04 09:15:33 <KotCzarny> i think it's oprofile in kernel
May 04 09:15:53 <lcuk> that needs recompile of kernel
May 04 09:16:14 <KotCzarny> get used to recompiling the kernel
May 04 09:16:19 <KotCzarny> :)
May 04 09:16:22 <qwerty12> It's not hard :)
May 04 09:16:28 <qwerty12> Even I can do it.
May 04 09:16:30 <lcuk> once i start down that road i dont know where it will end
May 04 09:16:47 <qwerty12> You don't have to flash the resulting kernel, you can just boot from it one time.
May 04 09:16:55 <lcuk> im hoping to do as much as possible within the bounds other people have
May 04 09:17:07 <lcuk> but thats not testing what i have here is it
May 04 09:18:04 <lcuk> my compilation may have other attributes set or compiler optimisations or even just a different compiler - i dont know the full toolchain to produce an identical (barring oprofile) modification
May 04 09:18:19 <KotCzarny> hum?
May 04 09:18:28 <qwerty12> ?
May 04 09:18:41 <KotCzarny> if you change gcc version
May 04 09:18:46 <KotCzarny> it changes kernel 'magic'
May 04 09:18:58 <KotCzarny> so it knows modules are different
May 04 09:19:00 <KotCzarny> more or less
May 04 09:19:01 <lcuk> so i can go and get the full kernel right now i can produce an identical binary to the kernel on my machine
May 04 09:19:06 <KotCzarny> and refue to load them
May 04 09:19:22 <KotCzarny> same goes for compilation flags
May 04 09:19:34 <KotCzarny> ie smp, preempt, i686
May 04 09:20:21 <lcuk> i686 is useful on this machine ;)
May 04 09:20:29 <KotCzarny> it was just an example
May 04 09:20:29 <KotCzarny> :)
May 04 09:20:32 <lcuk> i know
May 04 09:23:08 <lcuk> hmmm i have been here before
May 04 09:23:10 <lcuk> top_log_viewer.vbp
May 04 09:26:03 <lcuk> yup, ive even got the top log script
May 04 09:27:43 <lcuk> while true ; do date >> /media/mmc2/toplog.txt ; top -n1 >> /media/mmc2/toplog.txt ; sleep 5 ; done
May 04 09:28:21 <KotCzarny> mount tmpfs somewhere
May 04 09:28:25 <KotCzarny> and log to it
May 04 09:28:30 <KotCzarny> that way you will save battery
May 04 09:30:28 <lcuk> battery is already dying, not an issue. i only left that log running and building stats for a couple of hours last time, ill leave it going this evening
May 04 09:31:53 <lcuk> it didnt really show anything though then either
May 04 09:33:28 <lcuk> top was highest cpu abuser for most of the time
May 04 09:33:39 <KotCzarny> yup
May 04 09:34:39 * lcuk maybe i should ignore top in the %
May 04 09:36:28 <KotCzarny> maybe you should gather stats in some other way?
May 04 09:37:05 <lcuk> well im open to suggestions which dont involve a new kernel
May 04 09:37:23 <KotCzarny> bah.
May 04 09:37:26 <lcuk> hence me thinking about a little program myself
May 04 09:37:50 <KotCzarny> why are you so afraid of new kernel?
May 04 09:38:37 <qwerty12> You can extract original one from the RX44 bin image when you are done.
May 04 09:40:14 <qwerty12> bollox, I hate it when I close sbox accidently.
May 04 09:40:20 <KotCzarny> :)
May 04 09:40:29 <KotCzarny> i have a script that start sbox for me
May 04 09:40:38 <KotCzarny> and closes when i'm done with it
May 04 09:40:43 <qwerty12> I used to have one but it got deleted when I reformatted.
May 04 09:40:49 <qwerty12> I jacked the one from the vmware image.
May 04 09:41:08 <KotCzarny> just put all the repeated command into a file
May 04 09:41:09 <KotCzarny> :)
May 04 09:41:22 <lcuk> changing the kernel feels like walking into the garage and hearing "[sucking air through teeth]  hmmmm i cant tell why your engine is knocking, lets build you a new one and replace your existing one to find out whats wrong"
May 04 09:41:39 <KotCzarny> like cat 0 > vdso; mount; sbox-start; sbox-stop; umount; echo 1 > vdso
May 04 09:41:39 <qwerty12> But you can easily change the kernel back.
May 04 09:41:52 <qwerty12> KotCzarny, nice, thanks
May 04 09:42:10 <KotCzarny> those weren't actual command, more like hint
May 04 09:42:11 <KotCzarny> :)
May 04 09:42:16 <qwerty12> I just keep vdso disabled permanently via sysctl.
May 04 09:42:23 <qwerty12> Ah, I shall use those hints :)
May 04 09:42:48 <KotCzarny> lcuk: i like rotation
May 04 09:42:49 <KotCzarny> :)
May 04 09:43:22 <KotCzarny> and if you use default config and build kernel in scratchbox, you should get the exact kernel you have on nokia
May 04 09:43:41 <qwerty12> exactamont (in broken French)
May 04 09:43:42 <KotCzarny> ie. make n800_config; make
May 04 09:43:51 <qwerty12> I use nokia_2420_defconfig
May 04 09:44:03 <lcuk> different issue, if you want a high performance engine with turbos
May 04 09:44:05 <KotCzarny> that was also a hint
May 04 09:44:17 <qwerty12> Mine wasn't ;)
May 04 09:44:20 <KotCzarny> :)
May 04 09:45:31 <qwerty12> :). lcuk: Think of it like this, using nokia_2420_defconfig would produce an identical kernel to the one you already have. So it would be like the engine being the same but with different engine oil etc (I don't have a car btw)
May 04 09:46:12 <KotCzarny> well, even oil should be the same
May 04 09:46:13 <KotCzarny> :)
May 04 09:46:20 <qwerty12> hehe true :)
May 04 09:46:27 <qwerty12> A speck of dust then :p
May 04 09:46:43 * lcuk prefers to just get a stethascope and listen to the current engine to make a clean diagnosis
May 04 09:46:46 <KotCzarny> it's more like getting a factory that can build the same model
May 04 09:46:57 <lcuk> with an o
May 04 09:47:04 <KotCzarny> then having factory you can tweak some params
May 04 09:47:18 <KotCzarny> and produce a little different model
May 04 09:47:27 <glass> lcuk: if you have blueprints and produce a new engine with relatively little electricity....
May 04 09:47:28 <KotCzarny> with features added/removed
May 04 09:47:47 <qwerty12> lcuk, you can't brick the N810 with a dodgy kernel.
May 04 09:47:54 <lcuk> i dont want a new engine :'( i want to find out whats wrong with my current one
May 04 09:48:11 <glass> you're more likely to find it out from blueprints?
May 04 09:48:29 <KotCzarny> lcuk, but for that having a factory to build modified ones could help diagnosing the differences
May 04 09:48:36 <glass> rather than taking the compiled engine apart
May 04 09:48:36 <qwerty12> Agreed.
May 04 09:48:47 <lcuk> im not afraid of bricking or breaking or anything, im more concerned that ill put oprofile and the problem will go away and ive wasted a day learning how to do it but the core problem remains in the default kernel
May 04 09:48:49 <KotCzarny> ie. add that, see if it runs better/worse
May 04 09:49:12 <KotCzarny> lcuk: default kernel will change with the next os upgrade
May 04 09:49:22 <KotCzarny> so what's the point of treating it as absolute?
May 04 09:49:25 <lcuk> yes fine, ill upgrade it then
May 04 09:49:40 <qwerty12> Go on! :)
May 04 09:49:43 <glass> of course if your stuff has to run on default kernel
May 04 09:49:43 <KotCzarny> but to have a better kernel at the next upgrade problems should be diagnosed
May 04 09:49:45 <lcuk> but i wont have had to learn extra stuff
May 04 09:50:12 <KotCzarny> also, if a simple change can make it run better
May 04 09:50:25 <qwerty12> (I'm interested to learn how to add oprofile btw, so I'll keep a watch on this chan. Last time I tried, I failed)
May 04 09:50:30 <KotCzarny> people would do it and swap the default for the better
May 04 09:50:40 <lcuk> glass, of course i want my stuff to run on default kernel - i cant expect people to have to change their just to run my code
May 04 09:50:56 <glass> lcuk: yeah
May 04 09:51:32 <KotCzarny> people will do anything if you can convince them it will be better
May 04 09:51:53 <lcuk> so far though you 2 havent convinced me
May 04 09:51:56 <KotCzarny> rotation/xrandr is a good example
May 04 09:52:22 <lcuk> but what happens when nokia releases an update?
May 04 09:52:38 <lcuk> do they keep r&r?
May 04 09:52:46 <KotCzarny> who knows
May 04 09:53:08 <KotCzarny> my bet they will use current -omap branch of kernel
May 04 09:53:26 <KotCzarny> current in mainstream, not in nokia.com
May 04 09:53:48 <qwerty12> nah, they won't - it's unofficial community hack so nokia wouldn't support it. But patch is available so it isn't hard to port and apply yourself.
May 04 09:53:49 <KotCzarny> and i think that patch is already in -omap
May 04 09:54:06 <KotCzarny> yeah
May 04 09:54:12 <KotCzarny> that's the beauty of openness
May 04 09:54:59 <lcuk> so joe blow with his rotating nokia will lose it when nokia releases diablo, they then have to scrabble around to regain a feature.  its not ideal
May 04 09:55:19 <KotCzarny> lcuk, as a developer you need tools that are not usefull for joe blow
May 04 09:55:37 <qwerty12> You applied a unofficial community hack in the first place, you should be prepared to accept consequences.
May 04 09:55:42 <KotCzarny> but it doesn't stop you from installing them on your tablet
May 04 09:55:43 <KotCzarny> :)
May 04 09:55:50 <qwerty12> Also, xomap may need updating for diablo.
May 04 09:56:12 <lcuk> 100% agree that i can do whatever i want, but if i expect users to have to do the same it becomes a big problem at upgrade time
May 04 09:56:40 <KotCzarny> then you just revert to 'original' kernel/libs for testing
May 04 09:56:41 <lcuk> better to work with whats available
May 04 09:56:47 <KotCzarny> or ask people to test
May 04 09:56:58 <KotCzarny> or just keep 2 machines
May 04 09:57:24 <lcuk> hence my original question:  how can i log and monitor cpu stats on my device without having to reflash a new kernel
May 04 09:58:00 <jott> lcuk: i really don't get your point. you can even boot a oprofile enabled kernel without flashing it.
May 04 09:58:56 <KotCzarny> lcuk: probably by analyzing files in /proc
May 04 09:59:36 <jott> if you use a oprofile kernel you will use it just for benchmarking/profiling your application/system, when you are done - reboot and get the vanilla nokia kernel back
May 04 10:01:00 <jott> on the other hand - when you achieve a huge perfomance boost or some really nice improvements on a kernel level, there are alot of people willing to take the consequences
May 04 10:01:04 <qwerty12> lcuk, if you decide to go oprofile, http://blog.gustavobarbieri.com.br/2007/05/22/oprofile-and-maemo-n800/
May 04 10:01:43 <qwerty12> v.old however.
May 04 10:01:56 <KotCzarny> i think pupnik had some fun with oprofile
May 04 10:02:02 <qwerty12> yeh
May 04 10:02:26 <qwerty12> he couldn't mount those modules I compiled against stock nokia kernel for him :/
May 04 10:02:37 <qwerty12> s/mount/insmod
May 04 10:02:52 <jott> oprofile is nice for some quick and dirty profiling.
May 04 10:03:39 <KotCzarny> lcuk: if you are interested in simply generating run stats, you can compile your app with gprofile inrofmation
May 04 10:04:04 <KotCzarny> that will save the log of used functions with some oeverhead
May 04 10:04:15 <KotCzarny> and then another tool can generate report from it
May 04 10:04:45 <KotCzarny> i think it's: -fprofile-generate
May 04 10:04:53 <KotCzarny> or -pg
May 04 10:05:06 <lcuk> im already happy which parts of my program are ok - i just wanna see where my battery is draining to
May 04 10:05:25 <lcuk> did you write a command line battery level viewer?
May 04 10:05:33 <KotCzarny> yes
May 04 10:05:43 <KotCzarny> but it's more like raw dc voltage from battery
May 04 10:05:46 <lcuk> where is it? - ill put it in my little thing
May 04 10:05:54 <KotCzarny> usual link
May 04 10:05:55 <lcuk> thats ok, it will allow me to track
May 04 10:06:29 <qwerty12> KotCzarny, oh yeah, I figured out why my retu values were being returned as fffffff :)
May 04 10:06:30 <lcuk> oprofile is above and beyond what i need right now - ill find out in the morning whats happening - ill just run as normal and leave my little script running overnight
May 04 10:06:56 <KotCzarny> lcuk: /n800/kcbatt/
May 04 10:07:06 <KotCzarny> qwerty: root needed :)
May 04 10:07:58 <qwerty12> Yep :). I was running it via personal menu with root option ticked but it doesn't run anything after battery-status as root so it was just running && kcbatt rather than && sudo kcbatt :)
May 04 10:08:24 <KotCzarny> qwerty: chown root kcbatt; chmod +s kcbatt
May 04 10:08:33 <KotCzarny> and you can run it as user then :)
May 04 10:08:54 <qwerty12> Ah, thanks :). I was using sudo with ALL = ALL NOPASSWD etc
May 04 10:09:00 <lcuk> hmmm kot, something wrong with your dns
May 04 10:09:07 <KotCzarny> which one?
May 04 10:09:16 <lcuk> using your normal domain+port gives The server at 192.168.1.32 is taking too long to respond.
May 04 10:09:29 <KotCzarny> add port :23280
May 04 10:09:30 <KotCzarny> :)
May 04 10:09:38 <KotCzarny> hum
May 04 10:10:02 <lcuk> hmmm indeed, it pings ok
May 04 10:10:55 <KotCzarny> mrrau.dyndns.org:23280/n800/kcbatt/
May 04 10:10:57 <lcuk> ping your domain gives 68.blah, but trying from browser gives a 192.blah error
May 04 10:12:02 <qwerty12> If you don't mind me asking, does the "gather_data" stuff run on computer using logs/dumps from kcbatt running on the N800?
May 04 10:12:07 <lcuk> heh - without the trailing slash it gives error
May 04 10:12:34 <KotCzarny> qwerty: i think only script 0_something runs on device
May 04 10:12:45 <KotCzarny> the rest is just parsing/plotting
May 04 10:12:59 <KotCzarny> which can be done anywhere (assuming you have utils/skills)
May 04 10:13:00 <KotCzarny> :)
May 04 10:13:02 <qwerty12> Ah, thanks. The graph looks cool, I'd be interested in trying it out sometime.
May 04 10:13:12 <qwerty12> Nah, I don't have skills :D
May 04 10:13:32 <KotCzarny> i went lazy way and wrote dat -> gnuplot conversion in php
May 04 10:13:54 * KotCzarny feels a little vbish
May 04 10:14:02 <KotCzarny> but just a little
May 04 10:14:03 <KotCzarny> :)
May 04 10:14:08 <lcuk> if it gets the job done
May 04 10:14:13 <KotCzarny> definitely
May 04 10:14:20 <qwerty12> fo sure
May 04 10:14:21 <KotCzarny> fast enough and easy to modify
May 04 10:15:11 <lcuk> incidentally, my bother with parsing strings in c, the top_log viewer thing i hacked up in vb uses this sort of line for parsing
May 04 10:15:12 <lcuk> qScan(lin, qt, "stp    ", "[d.nam] [d.mon] [d.num] [d.h]:[d.m]:[d.s] GMT [d.yr] :: [d.title]")
May 04 10:15:27 <KotCzarny> :)
May 04 10:15:40 <lcuk> ive started to put same thing into c :)
May 04 10:15:42 <KotCzarny> i think you will see something similiar in .phpsh
May 04 10:15:48 <lcuk> yer probably
May 04 10:16:28 <KotCzarny> \d is any digit in regexp
May 04 10:16:29 <KotCzarny> :)
May 04 10:16:58 <KotCzarny> \s is any spacing char
May 04 10:17:11 <KotCzarny> + is one of more of the char on the left
May 04 10:17:14 <lcuk> i looked at regex and its another language entirely - it hurt my head ;)
May 04 10:17:22 <KotCzarny> lcuk: you will love it
May 04 10:17:23 <KotCzarny> :)
May 04 10:18:23 <lcuk> i reorganised all the page/stroke/point code last night in prep for proper saving - i no longer allocate a buffer array of points as i am drawing the stroke ive got linked list :)
May 04 10:18:37 <KotCzarny> :)
May 04 10:19:32 <KotCzarny> i should move myself into the bed
May 04 10:19:36 <lcuk> im just worried about fragmentation cos calling malloc on lots of little bits is bad so i thought, but then realised that at some level malloc must be a bit sensible
May 04 10:19:49 <lcuk> sudo apt-get install kot_in_bed
May 04 10:19:58 <lcuk> or something
May 04 10:20:05 <KotCzarny> then just call malloc in a loop once
May 04 10:20:06 <KotCzarny> :)
May 04 10:20:40 <KotCzarny> off i go
May 04 10:20:45 <KotCzarny> night ppl
May 04 10:20:48 <qwerty12> night
May 04 10:20:52 <lcuk> nite
May 04 10:21:29 <qwerty12> So seeing as it's gonna be quiet, what's happenin my gangstas?
May 04 10:23:39 <lcuk> im stripping and rebuilding lots of code
May 04 10:23:53 <lcuk> ive got the bits for my battery test tonight and can get on with actual work
May 04 10:24:03 <qwerty12> Cool
May 04 10:24:22 <lcuk> :D whats even better is its bank holiday tomorrow
May 04 10:24:37 <qwerty12> Yep :D
May 04 10:24:49 <qwerty12> No school for me tommorow, w00t
May 04 10:24:50 <lcuk> and then on tuesday im calling finland and confirming my cc details with travel agent
May 04 10:25:16 <lcuk> infact i could do that tomorrow, chances are they havent got a holiday
May 04 10:25:23 <qwerty12> Nice :). Enjoy yourself :)
May 04 10:25:58 <lcuk> in amongst all this planning for linuxtag ive got to stop everything and go on real family holiday
May 04 10:26:33 * lcuk is surrounded by suitcases
May 04 10:26:55 <qwerty12> lol, I wish I was. Furthest I've been is in Bolton :(
May 04 10:27:26 * qwerty12 is tempted to smack my N800 up if it keeps on saying Usb device not supported.
May 04 10:27:29 <lcuk> well this year is the first time we have managed to get abroad on our own wallet
May 04 10:28:17 <qwerty12> Still, it's a nice thing though :)
May 04 10:28:55 * qwerty12 has an odd impulse to compile another kernel
May 04 10:28:59 <Blafasel> Hmm.. Linuxtag would be neat.. If I manage to get vacation I'll probably join there as wel
May 04 10:29:25 <qwerty12> So, what is happening in Linuxtag, in a nutshell?
May 04 10:30:27 <lcuk> there are a number of nokia maemo presentations and talks, and on the wider linux scene similar things from lots of companies
May 04 10:30:46 <qwerty12> Ah nice, thanks for clearing it up for me.
May 04 10:30:47 <lcuk> i dont actually know everything thats going on, but im glad i have the chance to go and see everything
May 04 10:31:14 <lcuk> its a chance to see the best of breed from the scene
May 04 10:31:28 <qwerty12> If I'm being honest, if I was a couple years older and I knew a LOT, I'd go to see more of Berlin :p
May 04 10:31:56 <lcuk> well im there for a few days - im sure i wont sit inside the whole time
May 04 10:32:15 <qwerty12> hehe, I'd hope not :p
May 04 10:32:16 <lcuk> though since i will have a tan (having just got back from family holday a few days before) im not sure i will get in the door
May 04 10:32:30 <lcuk> "im sorry son, you are not pale enough to enter this linux convention"
May 04 10:35:10 <qwerty12> "son, Do You Know Why I'm Stopping You For?"
May 04 10:36:08 <qwerty12> Man, the exam authorities should lower the time for the Citizenship exam :/ :(
May 04 10:43:32 <lcuk> in england?
May 04 10:43:43 <qwerty12> Yep
May 04 10:44:08 <lcuk> where are you from originally then if you are taking?
May 04 10:44:47 <qwerty12> Everyone has to take it in school. I'm originally Pakistani that was born in this country.
May 04 10:45:42 <lcuk> i thought if you were born here you were considered english on paperwork
May 04 10:46:13 <lcuk> not that it matters, good luck with passing it - ive heard its quite tough
May 04 10:46:52 <qwerty12> Yeah, it's a school subject. Everyone of any nationality in school has to take it. (It's usually an optional subject but our school forces everyone to take it). Its about things like AIDS, Bullying etc.
May 04 10:46:55 <qwerty12> Thanks :)
May 04 10:47:09 * konttori just videod a small presentation of the wiicontrol. Just about to push it to youtube.
May 04 10:47:57 <lcuk> lol konttori i laugh everytime i hear about controlling your wii
May 04 10:48:17 <konttori> ;)
May 04 10:48:25 <lcuk> qwerty12, you live in london now dont you
May 04 10:48:27 <qwerty12> lmao
May 04 10:48:30 <qwerty12> lcuk, yes :)
May 04 10:48:55 <lcuk> how you feel about boris becoming mayor - as an outsider i think he will do ok
May 04 10:50:08 <qwerty12> I'm not sure TBH, I want to see what he does yet. Ken wasn't great either imo, a lot of bus fares increased. But the free travel on buses for under 16's was a nice touch.
May 04 11:01:35 <lcuk> :D w000t i have finally got my computer all to myself.  cbeebies works on the laptop
May 04 11:02:28 <keesj> konttori: in combo with maemo I guess?
May 04 11:02:30 <qwerty12> Lol, in this house, we all have our own computers :p
May 04 11:03:08 <konttori> wiicontrol and maemo. yes
May 04 11:04:44 <konttori> Latest version with gyro support in here: https://garage.maemo.org/frs/download.php/3996/wiicontrol-1.02_all.deb
May 04 11:05:42 <konttori> I'll try to make a publish blog today.
May 04 11:17:50 <konttori> Wiicontrol demo video here: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jhnZpkeFhGs
May 04 11:20:31 <jldiaz> hey, konttori :)
May 04 11:20:40 <konttori> Hi jldiaz!
May 04 11:21:12 <jldiaz> I had no time yet to look at your latest .deb
May 04 11:21:39 <jldiaz> but I'm looking at the video :-)
May 04 11:22:59 <lcuk> konttori, you have a black fronted 810 :O
May 04 11:23:24 <qwerty12_N800> wimax
May 04 11:23:25 <konttori> Umm.. nope, it's standard frontend. It's just so bright in the room
May 04 11:23:25 <qwerty12_N800> :p
May 04 11:23:26 * lcuk spray paints his
May 04 11:23:45 <qwerty12_N800> is this a preview of diablo too? :p
May 04 11:24:05 <konttori> I do have a wimax *as well*, but that device on the video is my n810. Special version though (8gb internal card)
May 04 11:24:18 <lcuk> dev model
May 04 11:24:48 <Oniano> konttori: 8GB internal?!
May 04 11:24:55 <konttori> Nope, it's not dev model. We just received surprise presents from the factory.
May 04 11:25:11 <lcuk> you are going to bring lots of cool things to ltag
May 04 11:25:38 <konttori> As you can imagine, Nokia is really good at tailoring products and they just thought they'll make us happy with a surprise. Well, we were!
May 04 11:26:00 <lcuk> i bet :)
May 04 11:26:39 * lcuk goes to his shed
May 04 11:26:54 * qwerty12_N800 packs bags for Helsinki to get a job :p
May 04 11:32:22 * konttori published the wiicontrol blog: http://konttoristhoughts.blogspot.com/
May 04 11:33:34 <konttori> we are hiring at the moment, so if you are interested in a relocating to helsinki and in working with some seriously cool linux stuff, then you might want to contact the nokia guys at linuxtag.
May 04 11:36:05 <qwerty12_N800> Nice :), I don't have the knowledge  yet and the extra numbers on my age! But I think it would be nice if I could program and I was old enough.
May 04 11:39:12 <konttori> well, summer trainee positions *may* also come. Otoh, they may be a bit difficult for non-finnish people.
May 04 11:40:02 * konttori goes to have lunch
May 04 11:40:32 <qwerty12_N800> yeah, my aptitude for languages is really bad, i can't speak my mother tongue ;/
May 04 11:40:33 <jldiaz> bon apetit!
May 04 11:40:40 <qwerty12_N800> s/;//:/
May 04 11:40:47 <qwerty12_N800> enjoy
May 04 11:50:47 <RST38h> konttori: Are you actually hiring people to do linux development?
May 04 11:56:54 <RST38h> .ÆÏÛÜØ ÊÛÅÅÛÉÜ
May 04 11:57:10 <qwerty12_N800> Russian?
May 04 11:57:40 <RST38h> yea, forgot to switch the register
May 04 12:01:16 <mbuf> konttori, we are hiring; who is we?
May 04 12:01:27 <qwerty12_N800> Nokia
May 04 12:01:32 <mbuf> ok
May 04 12:01:59 <qwerty12_N800> probably the Linux/internet tablet division
May 04 12:02:25 <mbuf> qwerty12_N800, ok
May 04 12:03:30 <qwerty12_N800> I'd like to work in rnd so I could steal the plans for retu (it goes in their phones too) :p
May 04 12:03:46 <Blafasel> Hmm.. Employment at Nokia? Thanks, but no thanks. ;) Thinking about the german factory I'd rather choose an employer with better manners.
May 04 12:04:07 <mbuf> but do Nokia take consultants, rather than direct employment
May 04 12:04:22 <mbuf> ?
May 04 12:04:32 <qwerty12_N800> I don't think nokia would close down an Helsinki office...
May 04 12:05:58 <RST38h> Blafasel: You can get laid off by ANY employer
May 04 12:06:38 <RST38h> Standard practice. And in the US, you will also get escorted off premises by security guys.
May 04 12:06:44 <Mikho> there was a cultural aspect as well with the german factory
May 04 12:06:57 <Blafasel> RST38h: But killing a whole factory after reaping a huge amound of subsidy (right word?), directly before you announce huuuge profits is - poor ;)
May 04 12:07:29 <RST38h> Blafasel: Corporation is no human being. Ethical considerations do not apply here.
May 04 12:07:44 <Mikho> well, they're optimizing winnings. Just like everyone
May 04 12:07:44 <mbuf> RST38h, very true; all corporations do that
May 04 12:08:24 <Blafasel> RST38h: As soon as taxes are used to pay for these things I guess it's getting emotional.
May 04 12:09:35 <Blafasel> "My money payed for X and X sucks/is wrong" is the attitude that usually arises. Not that I'm "OMG! Never buy Nokia devices again" or something, but I _am_ pissed off and still think that it's wrong/sad.
May 04 12:10:03 <RST38h> Blafasel: Your taxes are probably used for a lot of weird stuff, from sex change surgeries to subsidies for Kosovar drug traders
May 04 12:11:00 <RST38h> So, just write 'em off and think of something positive
May 04 12:11:01 <Blafasel> RST38h: Proves for that? :) In this case I _know_ where it went. You are presenting chances, theories, assumptions or whatever.
May 04 12:11:11 <Mikho> where did it go?
May 04 12:11:21 <Blafasel> Mikho: Hm?
May 04 12:11:30 <Mikho> sorry, just joined the conversation
May 04 12:12:48 <Mikho> what are the taxes used for at the moment?
May 04 12:13:49 <Blafasel> Mikho: Hm? I can name you some big projects nationally, some minor locally - but what are you trying to say/ask?
May 04 12:14:36 <Mikho> you said the taxes are used to pay for "these things". What is these things?
May 04 12:15:29 <Mikho> *are
May 04 12:15:36 <Blafasel> Mikho: I was talking about the Nokia factory in Germany/Bochum - it received quite a lot of federal and state money
May 04 12:15:48 <Mikho> from germany?
May 04 12:15:51 <Blafasel> Yep
May 04 12:16:00 <Mikho> oh
May 04 12:16:16 <RST38h> Hasn't Nokia agreed to return the money though?
May 04 12:16:18 <Blafasel> Standard stuff for huge plants - they create jobs and get money for that
May 04 12:17:55 <Blafasel> RST38h: Not that I know of - the last info that I had was that they don't want to pay the stuff back, but that's old news. I hope I didn't miss that?
May 04 12:18:41 <RST38h> let me look it up
May 04 12:20:57 <RST38h> No news of the payback, but at least I have found you someone to blaim :)
May 04 12:21:01 <RST38h> s/blaim/blame/
May 04 12:21:01 <infobot> RST38h meant: No news of the payback, but at least I have found you someone to blame :)
May 04 12:21:03 <Blafasel> Ah.. No, as far as I know they talk about a compromise: Nokia invests money in a foundation for Bochum and the state doesn't sue Nokia for about 60 mil. Euro.
May 04 12:21:09 <RST38h> Ah
May 04 12:21:23 <RST38h> THE ROMANIANS, Blafasel! You are losing it to Romanians.
May 04 12:21:28 <Blafasel> So - better than I thought, yes ;)
May 04 12:22:02 <Blafasel> RST38h: Well - no problem with that. I guess they'll reap some subsidy there as well for creating a new factory.. ;-p
May 04 12:22:20 <RST38h> Blafasel: Probably not
May 04 12:23:13 <RST38h> Last time I checked, the place was the usual east-european hellhole. No GDP to speak about, poor citizens, low wages.
May 04 12:23:30 <RST38h> [notice the low wages part :)]
May 04 12:23:50 <Blafasel> Sure
May 04 12:25:20 <Blafasel> (Or maybe the US would be nice - paying in $ instead of Euro :) )
May 04 12:27:53 <pupnik> the state shouldn't interfere with the economy
May 04 12:28:17 <RST38h> not possible nowadays
May 04 12:28:32 <RST38h> although you can minimize interference
May 04 12:30:06 <pupnik> yes but to minimize, liberalism must be taught in schools etc
May 04 12:30:16 <pupnik> orry for the offtopic
May 04 12:32:41 <RST38h> Periodic killing of every third civil servant will be more effective
May 04 12:33:13 <pupnik> lol
May 04 12:33:49 <RST38h> And yes, by all means, start with Department of Education...
May 04 12:33:49 <pupnik> so why is german govt threatening to sue?
May 04 12:33:56 <pupnik> :)
May 04 12:34:11 <pupnik> they bribed VW a lot for a plant, then vw moved it away too, iirc
May 04 12:35:56 <pupnik> but there was no breach of contract.  just stupid policy decisions :)
May 04 12:44:41 <evaryont> Why would I want to 'tether' my cell phone to my n800? What does it mean when I do tether them together? I can already pair them, is there anything more?
May 04 12:45:05 <lcuk> tethering works well with a nokia certified gimp mask
May 04 12:45:39 <lcuk> tethering is just the term for using your mobile phone to get internet
May 04 12:45:51 <qwerty12_N800> s/gimp mask/gimp suit
May 04 12:47:02 <lcuk> sudo apt-get install lunch
May 04 12:48:45 <evaryont> lcuk: thanks a lot. Internet access via phone is useful. :)
May 04 13:09:52 <gpd> Is it / might it be possible to ever plug a three.co.uk / other 3G broadband USB dongle into an N8x0 to get full on the go internet?
May 04 13:11:17 <RST38h> Probably
May 04 13:11:32 <gpd> good answer.
May 04 13:12:06 <gpd> major bottle necks? driver + USB host mode + other?
May 04 13:13:03 <TheNewAndy> I'd suspect that driver for the device would be a bottleneck (I think even on x86 linux they are a bit fiddly)
May 04 13:13:10 <TheNewAndy> (though I've never used one)
May 04 13:13:42 <qwerty12_N800> whi
May 04 13:13:52 <qwerty12_N800> ch model is the modem?
May 04 13:13:52 <gpd> but a generic USB 3G modem with Linux support might work - then it would be a case of finding a provider that supported the card.
May 04 13:14:02 <gpd> Huawei e220 USB Modem
May 04 13:14:17 <gpd> ZTE MF622 USB Modem
May 04 13:14:23 <gpd> both of those are mentioned on the site
May 04 13:14:40 <qwerty12_N800> i made a qu
May 04 13:14:44 <qwerty12_N800> i made a quick build of umtsmon which supports it
May 04 13:15:16 <qwerty12_N800> i never tested however
May 04 13:15:47 <qwerty12_N800> check the zte thread on itt for some tools i  ported
May 04 13:16:07 <lcuk> wouldnt it be easier if you used a mobile with 3g modem inside and connected via some sort of personal wireless networking interface
May 04 13:16:21 <lcuk> i feel blue that i can't remember, its on the tip of my tongue
May 04 13:16:45 <gpd> lcuk: which phone would you suggest?
May 04 13:17:12 <gpd> i was under the impression that using the phone as a modem was very costly with most providers (in the UK)
May 04 13:17:23 <lcuk> i dunno, go into a phone shop and ask - i thought most business phones had impressive data plans and tethering capabilities
May 04 13:18:03 <gpd> This three.co.uk dongle is much cheaper - hence the interest. but maybe you are right
May 04 13:18:12 <lcuk> getting a dinky PAYG phone with basic funcionality would likely be the rip off
May 04 13:18:25 <lcuk> have you checked to see if other 3 phones work
May 04 13:18:40 <lcuk> after all, the 3 dongle is just a mobile phone without a screen or keypad
May 04 13:18:54 <gpd> no - not done much as yet - cheating by asking in here and hoping kind people would have the answers without too many hours of research
May 04 13:19:41 <lcuk> i use my 810 exclusively on wifi - i checked at first if my o2 ice would work with its built in 3g data modem but because its PAYG its all locked down
May 04 13:19:59 <lcuk> im sure there is a way i could use it, but tbh i just cant be arsed i didnt get it for roaming
May 04 13:20:22 <gpd> I have O2 Simplicity - but use an ancient phone and not sure whether now is the time to upgrade it. nothing out there is very exciting.
May 04 13:20:38 <gpd> was away from wifi yesterday and got annoyed - couldn't face the btopenzone charge
May 04 13:20:53 <lcuk> when you do go looking, take your nokia with you andask them to see it working with your device
May 04 13:21:19 <RST38h> heh
May 04 13:21:33 <gpd> last time i asked vodafone they said it was going to cost a fortune to use the phone to dialup - maybe that was PAYG
May 04 13:21:49 <lcuk> no, they wanted you using the dialup internet
May 04 13:21:55 <lcuk> thats not what the full 3g is
May 04 13:21:56 <RST38h> $0.20/MB here, no contract required, no tethering charge
May 04 13:22:07 <gpd> RST38h: which provider?
May 04 13:22:26 <RST38h> MTS.RU :)
May 04 13:22:41 <gpd> lcuk: any idea which Nokias are in the running to do this 'full 3G' of which you speak? does it have to be superfancy N95 etc?
May 04 13:23:23 <lcuk> well i have cheapest most bog standard o2 phone, it is fully 3g and technically has all the hardware in it, but the software is locked down
May 04 13:23:48 <gpd> also: anywhere other than expansys.com you would buy from - especially unlocked phones
May 04 13:23:48 <lcuk> i think if i got the same thing on a contract it would work but as i say i didnt look too far
May 04 13:24:10 <gpd> lcuk: simplicity is very good if you use more than £15 /mo in calls / texts
May 04 13:24:17 <lcuk> i prefer to buy from the main dealer - i got my o2 phone from o2, i got my nokia from nokia..
May 04 13:24:31 <lcuk> i dont though - its rare i get through more than 10
May 04 13:25:41 <RST38h> actually, $0.18
May 04 13:26:52 <gpd> any magic search terms I should use to find phones that will give full 3G via N800?
May 04 13:27:27 <AStorm> all HSDPA will
May 04 13:27:46 <AStorm> as long as they themselves get full 3G
May 04 13:27:52 <RST38h> search for "hsdpa"
May 04 13:28:07 <RST38h> Prefer phones that support DUN BT profile, too
May 04 13:28:13 <gpd> great - thanks - will leave you all in peace and do my research
May 04 13:28:26 <AStorm> pan is fastern and also works
May 04 13:28:32 <AStorm> with an added driver
May 04 13:28:38 <RST38h> yea, but it requires extra software
May 04 13:28:57 <pH5> but PAN with a group of tablets around a single phone is fun :)
May 04 13:29:42 <RST38h> Umgh!
May 04 13:30:14 <RST38h> Anybody knows what the "93 tv stations" post on ITT is all about? I tried these streams and non of them appear to work, at least on PC
May 04 13:32:23 <AStorm> this aep dsp is some sound processor
May 04 13:32:51 <AStorm> boosts bass and adds crossover
May 04 13:39:13 <gpd> Nokia E51 looks suitable - but still a bit expensive
May 04 13:40:30 <Blafasel> What the hell is PAYG?
May 04 13:40:39 <qwerty12_N800> pay  as u go
May 04 13:40:39 <gpd> pay as you go
May 04 13:41:20 <Blafasel> Ah.. Tried to read it as a mixup between pay and 3g, which didn't make sense for me.
May 04 13:42:41 <Blafasel> I have unlimited (well, probably there are hidden limits that they just don't advertise) 3G access on my phone, but the signal sucks most of the time. I really need to switch to vodafone or something soon
May 04 13:44:44 <RST38h> gpd: E51 case wears out in a matter of weeks
May 04 13:45:06 <RST38h> starts developing spots for some reason
May 04 13:45:29 <gpd> RST38h: other suggestions?
May 04 13:45:37 <gpd> 6121? cheaper... :)
May 04 13:46:27 <RST38h> Maybe...
May 04 13:57:39 * RST38h uses E70 which kid of defeats the need for a tablet
May 04 13:57:44 <RST38h> s/kid/kind
May 04 13:58:46 <jldiaz> anyone knows how to *permanently* get rid of the toolbar in osso-xterm?
May 04 13:59:09 <qwerty12_N800> Use osso-xterm from svn
May 04 13:59:28 <qwerty12_N800> fiferboy and jott both have builds
May 04 14:00:03 <jldiaz> there are no side effwcts?
May 04 14:00:34 <RST38h> unless you pray to Satan every wednesday, it quits.
May 04 14:00:34 <qwerty12_N800> none at all afaik
May 04 14:00:45 <jldiaz> issues with utf8 or whatever? (I'm spanish)
May 04 14:01:34 <qwerty12_N800> You can switch the encoding
May 04 14:01:48 <jldiaz> I'll give it a try. I suppose I can return to standard osso-xterm in case of trouble
May 04 14:02:51 <jldiaz> anyway, there is no configuration file for xterm where storing the toolbar preferences?
May 04 14:03:13 <qwerty12_N800> it's in gconf
May 04 14:04:07 <jldiaz> ah, thx
May 04 14:04:57 <qwerty12_N800> np, /apps/osso/xterm is where mine is
May 04 14:05:40 <RST38h> btw. how do you return to the standard xterm?
May 04 14:06:06 <qwerty12_N800> non svn , i.e stock build?
May 04 14:09:01 * konttori published updated version of wiicontrol: https://garage.maemo.org/frs/download.php/3997/wiicontrol-1.03_all.deb
May 04 14:09:12 <konttori> Only updated the install postinst script.
May 04 14:09:14 <RST38h> qwerty: yep
May 04 14:10:01 <konttori> And updated the blog to include the link as well: https://garage.maemo.org/frs/download.php/3997/wiicontrol-1.03_all.deb
May 04 14:10:36 <qwerty12_N800> it's not in  a repo so you would rebuild  0.14.mh3 from svn
May 04 14:10:57 <qwerty12_N800> (mine is stock atm)
May 04 14:11:04 <RST38h> ah
May 04 14:11:19 <qwerty12_N800> alternatively, I could tar up the files?
May 04 14:11:53 <RST38h> it was an academic question but thanks :)
May 04 14:12:03 <qwerty12_N800> :)
May 04 14:17:18 <kulve> http://tuomas.kulve.fi/blog/2008/05/04/ogg-support-07-canola-interoperability/
May 04 14:17:35 <kulve> feel free to test and report all new issues to me
May 04 14:17:50 <qwerty12_N800> cool :)
May 04 14:18:12 <kulve> I'm not sure if the new LMS ogg package is already there. I suppose it is..
May 04 14:19:09 <qwerty12_N800> Is there any  ogg converters available on the tablet?
May 04 14:19:21 <kulve> actually I didn't find the lightmediascanner0-ogg yet..
May 04 14:19:41 <kulve> qwerty12_N800: converters? like mp3->ogg? Not that I know of..
May 04 14:20:04 <kulve> shouldn't things like that be done on a more powerful computer..
May 04 14:20:21 <derf> Things like _that_ shouldn't be done.
May 04 14:20:42 <qwerty12_N800> yeah, thanks, i'm gonna try anyway :p
May 04 14:21:58 <Veggen> kulve: hey, I compiled dcraw for my n810. which means that in a pinch, I could convert Nikon raw pictures (NEF) to jpeg. I actually envision having use for it some day, although not on a grand scale ;)
May 04 14:22:44 <Veggen> (it took 100% of the CPU and all the RAM for around a minute or more, but it did produce a jpeg picture)
May 04 14:23:05 <qwerty12_N800> I think it's already in repo's :/
May 04 14:23:48 <derf> Ah hah, found the file: http://people.xiph.org/~tterribe/heehee.ogg
May 04 14:23:51 <NullM0dem> the n810 is a workhorse :-)
May 04 14:27:16 * lcuk gives NullM0dem's 810 a sugarbube
May 04 14:27:20 <lcuk> cube even ffs
May 04 14:31:56 <jott> speaking of, i compiled "canon capture" for my n810 which works great - the n8x0 could make a really nice remote for powershot cameras with some extra gui foo
May 04 14:31:57 <qwerty12_N800> w00t, i'm finally getting with the times and getting 8gb sd. I'm gonna set up a proper dev environment (may even tar up parts of my sbox)
May 04 14:32:50 <RST38h> on a tablet? =)
May 04 14:33:09 <GAN800> jott, what's it work with? 400D, perhaps?
May 04 14:33:23 <qwerty12_N800> RST38h, yep,  need some proper arm  emulation
May 04 14:34:14 <jott> GAN800: http://capture.sourceforge.net/
May 04 14:34:46 <jott> (it's an incomplete list - there are probably more models supported)
May 04 14:35:12 <GAN800> Unlikely to be DSLRs unfortunately, though.
May 04 14:43:00 <lopz> hi
May 04 14:43:10 <qwerty12_N800> hi
May 04 14:43:23 <jott> GAN800: if you like you can give it a try: http://sse2.net/capture/ needs the camera to be connected in host mode...
May 04 14:48:52 <jott> GAN800: latest gphoto2 seems to support 400D
May 04 14:53:44 <NullM0dem> lcuk: tanks for the cube :)
May 04 14:54:51 <NullM0dem> Anyone play with the dual core low power mini-itx boards?
May 04 14:55:50 <NullM0dem> I have this vision of building a low power / portable workstation combining the n810 with a beefy mini-itx board
May 04 14:57:45 <pupnik> jott: you see the news?  dev packages of pandora now going out... http://zodttd.com/blog/zodttd/i_received_the_package_b-47_sid-217f2b15c73da4bcf943bb63b0316856.html#replies
May 04 14:58:43 <jott> pupnik: yeah sounds really great.
May 04 14:58:53 <Cptnodegard> gpe contacts is being gay
May 04 14:59:01 <Cptnodegard> it doesnt want to import a normal vcard
May 04 14:59:02 <jott> never thought they could maintain their deadline
May 04 14:59:08 <Cptnodegard> anyone know why?
May 04 14:59:17 <kuriiri> because it's gay
May 04 14:59:32 <pupnik> well they are past initial optimistic deadline for the first run - but it's past the 'vaporware' stage
May 04 14:59:45 <jott> indeed
May 04 15:00:01 <NullM0dem> wow! the pandora looks awesome
May 04 15:00:03 <qwerty12> Cptnodegard, make the vcard unnormal
May 04 15:00:07 <qwerty12> looks fugly
May 04 15:00:07 <jott> now we only need to get a device ;)
May 04 15:00:16 <NullM0dem> yes
May 04 15:00:30 <pupnik> yeah it'd be nice to get maemo/mamona on it
May 04 15:00:32 <Cptnodegard> qwerty12: ?
May 04 15:00:52 <qwerty12> I'm pissin around
May 04 15:00:52 <pupnik> but right now they're not too maemo-friendly
May 04 15:01:36 <NullM0dem> id be happy with console and FB
May 04 15:01:36 <GAN800> pupnik, sticking Debian + Hildon/Matchbox on there should be pretty easy.
May 04 15:02:08 <GAN800> Cptnodegard,
May 04 15:02:09 <GAN800> Cptnodegard, GPE is changing all of your male contacts to 'more than friends'? :P
May 04 15:02:13 <pupnik> initial release will be a uni-task program launcher afaik
May 04 15:02:46 <Cptnodegard> -___-
May 04 15:03:08 <qwerty12> Go on Cptnodegard, the closet door is open :p
May 04 15:03:38 <jott> pupnik: do you know if there are already "public" opengl es drivers?
May 04 15:03:59 <GAN800> pupnik what's the difference between the dev devices and the shipping ones?
May 04 15:04:00 <Cptnodegard> does anyone have a clue why it fails to open a vcard that any other app including the build in contacts can open?=
May 04 15:04:11 <jott> (which is actually the only thing that matters for this device ;-)
May 04 15:04:22 <GAN800> Cptnodegard,
May 04 15:04:23 <GAN800> Cptnodegard, check the mailing list.
May 04 15:04:57 <GAN800> (stupid goddamn virtual keyboard) I think it's a UTF-8 parsing issue.
May 04 15:05:55 <lcuk> NullM0dem, "id be happy with console and FB"     for want of a blank canvas :)  i am doing exactly that myself and learning a lot in the process
May 04 15:06:08 <GAN800> (maemo-users list if I recall correctly, thread from about a week ago)
May 04 15:06:58 <qwerty12> You can already use console in FB on N800. I can't because I don't have a keyboard but I got getty running on vt 1 :)
May 04 15:07:27 <lcuk> qwerty12, thats what i mean, i have them and am enjoying playing
May 04 15:07:35 * lcuk huggles his nokia some more
May 04 15:08:09 <qwerty12> Nice :). I can't wait to get a usb keyboard and OTG adapter then I'm gonna use FB :)
May 04 15:08:25 <pupnik> GAN800: dev devices are for developers, assemble-yourself, test and give feedback.  jott: no
May 04 15:08:34 <qwerty12> I have it currently set to show me the syslog at bootup time.
May 04 15:09:35 <jott> it would be great to see a pandora at linuxtag :)
May 04 15:10:12 <qwerty12> If I come into a windfall, I'm gonna buy a Pandora and use my N800 for what it's marketed for - a internet tablet :)
May 04 15:11:32 <Cptnodegard> updated but still fails to import
May 04 15:11:34 <Cptnodegard> blargh
May 04 15:11:39 <lcuk_out> cyas later
May 04 15:11:42 <qwerty12> sfe
May 04 15:11:49 <qwerty12> s/sfe/bye
May 04 15:11:55 <Cptnodegard> any other good contact apps?
May 04 15:13:31 <GAN800> Pimlico
May 04 15:18:52 <qwerty12> Hmm, do you think gdebi would work on a N800? i've given up on synaptic.
May 04 15:26:50 <GAN800> qwerty12, just use apt.
May 04 15:27:20 <GAN800> or learn GTK so you can implement my badass Application manager mockups
May 04 15:27:33 <qwerty12> GAN800, I use dpkg but it would be nice to not have to resort to console. I'm gonna try and compile it and force it use sudo to open a file.
May 04 15:27:56 <qwerty12> This looked very promising: http://dkothari.blogspot.com/2006/12/synaptic-package-manager-for-maemo.html
May 04 15:29:16 * GAN800 pimps -> https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=3103
May 04 15:29:27 <jldiaz> hehe... I'm playing marble madness on n810, using the wiimote acelerometers as input
May 04 15:29:48 <jldiaz> I hold the wiimote with the n810 on top with both hands
May 04 15:29:49 <qwerty12> marble madness? :)
May 04 15:30:03 <jldiaz> and I can control the ball by tilting the tablet
May 04 15:30:06 <jldiaz> cooool!
May 04 15:30:12 <GAN800> I had that for Gameboy
May 04 15:30:18 <GAN800> Fun one
May 04 15:30:21 <qwerty12> I had it on my phone :)
May 04 15:30:31 <jldiaz> yes, marble madness, version for NES, through fceu
May 04 15:30:37 <qwerty12> Ah :)
May 04 15:30:43 <jldiaz> but can you play simply tiping the phone?
May 04 15:30:55 <jldiaz> I play without pressing any button or key!
May 04 15:30:55 <qwerty12> W910 can, I have W810 where I can't
May 04 15:31:07 <qwerty12> W910 comes with marble madness preinstalled
May 04 15:31:11 <GAN800> Wiimote + tablet is a fairly inspired combination.
May 04 15:31:13 <qwerty12> with the tilt sensor working
May 04 15:31:20 <jldiaz> oh, so this is not such a novel idea
May 04 15:31:25 <jldiaz> cool anyway :-)
May 04 15:31:28 <qwerty12> :)
May 04 15:32:53 <jldiaz> I'm trying to think a cool application for n810 accelerometers, not game related, but I can't find one...
May 04 15:33:10 <jldiaz> ops
May 04 15:33:18 <jldiaz> n810 -> wiimote
May 04 15:33:22 <qwerty12> mypaint would be sick with a wii controller
May 04 15:33:23 <lcuk_out> you can make xchat wobble around and have all the IRC comments fall to the ground
May 04 15:33:48 <jldiaz> yes, or shake the wiimote for banning a song in Vagalume...
May 04 15:34:03 <jldiaz> but I was talking about useful applications :-)
May 04 15:34:27 <jldiaz> such as carrying the wiimote in the car, as kind of "black box", recording the accelerations in the vehicle
May 04 15:34:30 <lcuk_out> you could just do the usual and make light sabre noises - then when you are walking round town you get the effect by swinging your mote around
May 04 15:34:47 <GAN800> Be mildly interesting to use for racing
May 04 15:34:53 <lcuk_out> jldiaz, thats a really really good idea actually
May 04 15:35:10 <GAN800> If, perhaps, not entirely sensitive enough.
May 04 15:35:13 <lcuk_out> couple it with the gps and track the feel of certain roads
May 04 15:35:25 <qwerty12> Take a look what the N95 community do with accelerometer. Lots of accelerometer programs are written in Python.
May 04 15:35:59 <lcuk_out> do ya reckon if we shake our 810 hard enough the nokia hidden module will start working
May 04 15:36:04 <GAN800> There's a thread on ITT covering use in racing with GPS, acellerometers and such.
May 04 15:36:21 * lcuk_out holds out the barest hint of a chance of an easter egg
May 04 15:36:30 <GAN800> Pfft
May 04 15:36:38 * GAN800 smacks lcuk down.
May 04 15:37:34 * lcuk runs back to his shed
May 04 15:53:01 <konttori> pupnik: any progress on the snes emu?
May 04 15:53:12 <konttori> I just tried the old one from your web page.
May 04 15:53:12 <pupnik> no sorry
May 04 15:53:25 <qwerty12> Does it run any better under OS2008?
May 04 15:53:25 <pupnik> new one loads a rom
May 04 15:53:28 <konttori> It's pretty ok for rpg:s, but not fast enough for super mario bros
May 04 15:53:33 <pupnik> yes
May 04 15:53:53 <konttori> It's now really fun to use with the wiicontrol though.
May 04 15:53:58 <konttori> so, that's a plus
May 04 15:54:08 <pupnik> very cool.  you have a post on ITT how to set up wii?
May 04 15:54:08 <konttori> Just would be great to get a bit more omph to it
May 04 15:54:38 <pupnik> new version will be either fullspeed or frameskip 1
May 04 15:54:47 <konttori> Well, yeah.  ON: http://konttoristhoughts.blogspot.com/2008/05/wiicontrol-for-nokia-n810-n800.html
May 04 15:54:54 <pupnik> ty
May 04 15:55:04 <konttori> there's a thread of it on: http://www.internettablettalk.com/forums/showthread.php?p=177831#post177831
May 04 15:55:20 <konttori> It does not by defult have config for snes. I'll add that today.
May 04 15:55:26 <qwerty12> Does it work any better that cwiid?
May 04 15:55:32 <qwerty12> s/that/then
May 04 15:55:37 <konttori> It works perfectly imho
May 04 15:55:44 <konttori> no issues whatsoever.
May 04 15:55:52 <qwerty12> Cool, I'll buy a wii controller soon :)
May 04 15:55:53 <konttori> works on all sdl games as well
May 04 15:56:06 <konttori> take a look at the blogpost. there's a video on it
May 04 15:56:17 <pupnik> :) cool nice video
May 04 15:56:47 <konttori> thanks. Had to do something quickly to show how wonderful it is.
May 04 15:56:52 <qwerty12> Probably a lot easier than cwiid too, cwiid needs modules inserting. But thanks to KotCzarny and jott, I use modprobe now.
May 04 15:58:13 <pupnik> konttori: in the video you say you are working on 'multi-events?'
May 04 15:59:01 <konttori> mouse events
May 04 15:59:10 <pupnik> ok
May 04 15:59:13 <konttori> To push the acceleration data as relative mouse movement
May 04 15:59:26 <pupnik> ahh.  interesting.
May 04 15:59:47 <konttori> qwerty12: wiicontrol doesn't need anything else, but installing that deb (and python) and running the app
May 04 15:59:48 <jldiaz> konttori, I was playing marble madness on fceu, moving the ball by tilting the tablet
May 04 15:59:58 <konttori> then it asks you to press 1+2 on controller and that's it
May 04 16:00:09 <konttori> jldiaz: really? Cool!
May 04 16:00:09 <jldiaz> this would make another good demo video :-)
May 04 16:00:13 <konttori> Indeed.
May 04 16:00:23 <qwerty12> konttori, I know :). That's why I think this is better.
May 04 16:00:43 <konttori> jldiaz: I have to try that one as well. Cool!
May 04 16:02:17 <konttori> pupnik: if you have wiimote, I can send you a wiicontrol with snes configuration pre-made
May 04 16:02:21 <jldiaz> you have to hold the wiimote below the tablet, obviusly
May 04 16:03:17 <pupnik> don't have it.  it would also be fun to allow two player games
May 04 16:03:34 <konttori> pupnik: true
May 04 16:03:45 <konttori> I've been thinking about that too. would be just great!
May 04 16:04:07 <jldiaz> next step in coolness: recognize "wiimote gestures"
May 04 16:06:02 <konttori> jldiaz: yeah. and the configuration dropdown and user editable controls.
May 04 16:06:13 <jldiaz> such as "shake vertical" "shake horizontal" "rotate left" "rotate right"
May 04 16:06:40 <jldiaz> i was thinking about the config files
May 04 16:07:21 <Italodance> DAMN N800 COVER SKIN IS VERYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYY SHIT
May 04 16:07:41 <jldiaz> one first trivial step would be storing these config files in python syntax
May 04 16:08:07 <jldiaz> this way a simple import would parse them
May 04 16:08:20 <jldiaz> or eval
May 04 16:08:38 <solmumaha> head mount for the tablet would be nice
May 04 16:09:28 <jldiaz> so you can show your mindmap? :)
May 04 16:11:04 <solmumaha> to have both hands free
May 04 16:11:50 <konttori> jldiaz: I agree that we could put those to the configs in python syntax.
May 04 16:12:39 <konttori> A bit of a problem comes on how to handle the rotation: If we want to use it for mouse / analog movement, the config file should support that by having some multiplier to movement.
May 04 16:13:20 <konttori> So, let's start the config files with just the button support and then build on top of that maybe the GU': ["a w"],
May 04 16:13:20 <konttori>     'GD': ["a s"],
May 04 16:13:20 <konttori>     'GL': ["a a"],
May 04 16:13:20 <konttori>     'GR': ["a d"]
May 04 16:13:44 <konttori> For the current rotation-like keybutton events and some option to make the mouse events out of it.
May 04 16:14:06 <konttori> e.g. quake and doom would appreciate mouse movements
May 04 16:14:46 <inz> Italo, did the device slip out of the pouch and break?
May 04 16:15:05 <Italodance> inz yes some crashes
May 04 16:15:21 <Italodance> it is tiny but very important for me
May 04 16:15:43 <Italodance> the pouch is very shit
May 04 16:15:54 <Italodance> it is very sharp
May 04 16:16:07 <Italodance> i hate this pouch
May 04 16:16:27 <Italodance> hi qwerty12 are u there?
May 04 16:16:39 <qwerty12> yes
May 04 16:16:40 <qwerty12> hi
May 04 16:16:49 <Italodance> ur Rise of the triad.  is full screen on n800?
May 04 16:17:02 <qwerty12> Yes but it's buggy. I'm working on it atm
May 04 16:17:53 <Italodance> is it the screenshot http://www.3drealms.com/rott/images/erott1.jpg?
May 04 16:18:34 <qwerty12> That may be later on in the game, the port isn't finished yet. I got freezing reduced by 70% ; I just cant figure out the 30%
May 04 16:18:52 <Italodance> oh tnx friend great job
May 04 16:19:21 <Italodance> can u do for max payne? the source and code is the same...
May 04 16:19:32 <qwerty12> max payne code doesn't exist.
May 04 16:20:49 <Italodance> http://www.3drealms.com/downloads.html  ?
May 04 16:21:03 <Italodance> http://www.3drealms.com/max
May 04 16:21:23 <Italodance> include the demos
May 04 16:21:26 <qwerty12> Tell me where the source is on that page.
May 04 16:21:43 <solmumaha> qwerty12: just do it
May 04 16:22:03 <Italodance> qwerty12 go to http://www.3drealms.com/max/
May 04 16:22:14 <solmumaha> i want it too
May 04 16:22:32 <Italodance> i want with the demos / movies :D
May 04 16:23:35 <qwerty12> come on, I can't get Max Payne source out of my ass now?
May 04 16:24:20 <Italodance> qwerty12 which codes/files do u want?
May 04 16:25:23 <Italodance> http://www.internettablettalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=18347&highlight=max+payne
May 04 16:57:18 <jldiaz> konttori, what kind of mouse support are you thinking of? Do you mean enabling IR support?
May 04 16:57:46 <jldiaz> or moving the mouse pointer by tilting the wiimote (GU, GD, ... events)
May 04 16:57:54 <jldiaz> using relative mouse positions
May 04 16:58:15 <konttori> tilting based to produce the relative movement
May 04 16:58:23 <konttori> I think that's one good solution.
May 04 16:58:34 <jldiaz> I find it a little tricky to control
May 04 16:59:08 <konttori> Yeah, it might not work out at all. I was only thinking about that to the quake like games
May 04 16:59:19 <jldiaz> Another idea: using the accelerometers to compute the inclination angle of the wiimote
May 04 16:59:30 <jldiaz> and set the mouse multiplier proportional to this
May 04 16:59:43 <konttori> yeah. that's one solution
May 04 17:00:13 <konttori> and what I was actually meaning by the mouse support
May 04 17:00:19 <jldiaz> this way, steeper angles leads to faster mouse movements
May 04 17:00:21 <konttori> so that it is 'analog',
May 04 17:00:26 <konttori> yeah
May 04 17:01:11 <konttori> otoh: may be that there is no mouse use beyond the fps games
May 04 17:04:25 <glass> fps games span a lot
May 04 17:04:51 <glass> a good analog controller, be it mouse or good stick, always makes more kind of games possible
May 04 17:05:24 <konttori> New version with snes key bindings: http://konttoristhoughts.blogspot.com/2008/05/wiicontrol-for-nokia-n810-n800.html
May 04 17:05:34 <qwerty12> w00t, thanks
May 04 17:05:41 <konttori> umm.. well, link there at the bottom of the page
May 04 17:08:46 <konttori> pupnik: idi you get the drpocketsnes running?
May 04 17:11:36 <NullM0dem> does anyone use GemRB? I am wondering how well it works
May 04 17:12:19 <NullM0dem> GemRB allows baldurs gate and icewind dale to run on a n810
May 04 17:13:34 <konttori> really? sounds cool!
May 04 17:13:42 <konttori> Try it with wiicontrol!
May 04 17:15:09 <gpd> just installed gnumeric on N800/chinook - quite nice - now tempted by Abiword - any word on that - seems to be a little way off due to upstream bugs - is that right?
May 04 17:16:08 <NullM0dem> konttori RPG scrollers on my n810 with Wiicontrol would be sick!
May 04 17:17:17 <NullM0dem> gpd: I just installed gnumeric as well, though i dont know much about abiword.  It wouldbe a nice addition to have
May 04 17:17:28 <solmumaha> konttori: tried duke3d with it?
May 04 17:17:45 <Navi> I installed abiword a month or so back
May 04 17:17:55 <Navi> It didn't recognize different file formats properly
May 04 17:18:04 <Navi> so you could only open abw files
May 04 17:18:28 <NullM0dem> i would write in abw then export on a desktop
May 04 17:19:06 <gpd> what about another RTF editor? anything come to mind?
May 04 17:20:06 <zakm> what was that quick way to get rid of the metalayer-crawler? on 2007HE ?
May 04 17:22:55 <gpd> zim -  seems dead
May 04 17:23:20 <lcuk> NullM0dem, konttori ping pupnik, you are right up his alley
May 04 17:23:27 <gpd> http://www.pardus.nl/projects/zim/ <-- not dead
May 04 17:26:24 <RST38h> gpd: Google Docs
May 04 17:27:04 <gpd> heh - good point - jest need to get google gears on N800 and for it to work with docs!
May 04 17:27:13 <konttori> solmumaha: nope
May 04 17:27:23 <konttori> where's that?
May 04 17:27:45 <RST38h> gpd: You can simply use their web site version
May 04 17:27:59 <konttori> zakm: I think you need to rename the binary.
May 04 17:28:05 <konttori> so that it won't get triggered
May 04 17:28:18 <gpd> [still researching HSDPA phones - mixed messages about Nokia 6120 - any tips on top phones for use with n800 appreciated]
May 04 17:29:29 <gpd> RST38h: more info on that would be helpful - not heard of it... rock, under, moi?
May 04 17:30:25 <gpd> RST38h: do you mean that you can download and run a version of google docs on your own site? or just use the online version and get over being offline... ever ;)
May 04 17:30:43 <NullM0dem> lcuk: up what alley??
May 04 17:35:03 <zakm> does google gears work on 2007HE ?
May 04 17:39:49 <gpd> Does anyone here use O2 simplicity and understand their 1 pound per day browsing allowance - how does this work with the 3G over bluetooth to N800 for example?
May 04 17:50:16 <RST38h> gpd:you can use google docs as google intended it - via their sitre
May 04 17:50:18 <RST38h> site
May 04 17:50:33 <gpd> ok RST38h thanks.
May 04 17:52:04 <gpd> Looks like O2 Simplicity 'UK Browsing up to Â1GBP per day' means that you pay only 1 pound and then after that you can browse at will up to their reasonable usage allowance... tasty
May 04 17:52:44 <evaryont_> hm, has anyone been able to tether their n8x0 to a Kajeet phone? :/
May 04 17:52:51 <RST38h> 30 pounds/month = $60
May 04 17:53:24 <gpd> RST38h: true - but if i only use it a few days a month then it might be useful / cheap. i am normally near wifi or broadband.
May 04 17:53:29 <RST38h> Of course if their allowance comes down to a few gigabytes a month, then it may be worth it
May 04 17:54:09 <RST38h> gpd: Do you click on some form to get access or how does buying it for a day work?
May 04 17:55:06 <gpd> well - you only pay for the data when you use it- this is a voice / text plan that has this as an option
May 04 17:55:43 <RST38h> so if you used data as much as a few seconds a day, you get chargaed $2?
May 04 17:56:02 <gpd> normally i pay nothing unless i am above 200 minutes or 200 texts per month - but if i use data then it is 'up to 1 pound' per day - ie once you go above that you get free access for the day  :)
May 04 17:56:15 <RST38h> ah!
May 04 17:56:18 <gpd> no - you get a prorated charge up to 1 pound at some crazy ratge
May 04 17:56:24 <RST38h> no, this actually sounds reasonable
May 04 17:56:49 <gpd> so all i need now is  a bluetooth phone which i can tether to the n800 and i am away
May 04 17:57:16 <gpd> 'tethering' is still a mystery - must do some more research
May 04 17:57:30 <RST38h> actually it is dead simple
May 04 17:57:46 <RST38h> as long as you have a Nokia phone, gets a bit more complicated with non-nokias
May 04 17:58:08 <RST38h> it is probably exactly the same with a UIQ-based Sony Ericsson though
May 04 17:58:31 <gpd> ok - great - looking at Nokia phones - tempted by N95 - but too poor ;)
May 04 17:58:42 <RST38h> N95 is a brick anyway
May 04 17:58:49 <term-sig> what about three mobile broadband?
May 04 17:59:22 <gpd> term-sig: that is where i came in ... was contemplating trying to get the 3 USB dongle to attach to the N800 - but sounds complex
May 04 18:00:09 <gpd> http://www.alexwrege.com/index.php/internet/how-to-connect-a-nokia-n800-to-cingular-wireless-internet/ <-- for the logs a howto
May 04 18:00:22 <term-sig> gpd: are uk from uk?
May 04 18:00:25 <jaska> yeah, need bt pan to work with my htc4350 :)
May 04 18:00:43 <gpd> term-sig: yes and yes
May 04 18:01:19 <term-sig> ups, uk/you..
May 04 18:01:42 <term-sig> and what provider u using for internet on your n8x0 ?
May 04 18:02:26 <gpd> term-sig: currently I am on O2 simplicity - but have not used it to connect via N800 as yet -
May 04 18:02:38 <gpd> term-sig:  you?
May 04 18:02:51 <evaryont_> can anyone access the mobile google sites?
May 04 18:03:45 <gpd> ok - looks like I need to find the O2 packet data settings for the connecitvity manager...
May 04 18:04:04 <term-sig> gpd: i`m looking for something nice, on begin i was thinking about "three" but next i heard that this usb dongle doesnt have sim card..
May 04 18:04:24 <term-sig> and it will be quite hard to connect my n810 to it..
May 04 18:04:32 <gpd> three has also got poor signal in some areas
May 04 18:06:53 <term-sig> what about that simplicity? 1 quid for day right? any limits or something like thaht..
May 04 18:09:09 <gpd> £3 per MB up to a maximum of £1 per day (00:00am to 23:59pm). Once you have reached your maximum daily charge of £1, O2 Web Daily allows you unlimited use of O2 UK‘s Edge/GPRS/ 3G networks (as applicable to your handset), for personal internet use via your mobile phone.
May 04 18:09:44 <RST38h> gpd: 3 pounds per megabyte?
May 04 18:09:50 <czr> so you're only allowed to transfer 333 KiB, right? ;-)
May 04 18:09:55 <gpd> up to maximum of 1 pound in one day
May 04 18:10:04 <RST38h> heh
May 04 18:10:13 <gpd> no maximum per day specified - but some terms on usage
May 04 18:11:03 <RST38h> still, that is the highest per-MB rate I have ever heard about
May 04 18:11:44 <RST38h> maybe if you use satellite phones it comes down to higher amounts, but $6 for 1MB of cellular data?!?
May 04 18:13:05 <gpd> agreed - you would have to use it wisely - ie. lots on a few days a month
May 04 18:15:42 <term-sig> gpd: http://threestore.three.co.uk/dealsummary.aspx?offercode=18MB3GD016 it's looking like u can buy it and next put sim card to u phone..
May 04 18:16:04 <term-sig> and it's only 15 quid for 3gb allowance..
May 04 18:16:47 <Cptnodegard> holy crap thats cheap
May 04 18:17:08 <RST38h> $60 for 3GB is cheap?
May 04 18:18:17 <kaatis> i'm paying 9.80e for 256 kb/s unlimited :)
May 04 18:18:43 <RST38h> wired or wireless?
May 04 18:19:04 <RST38h> Actually, 15 quid is $30, right? THAT is cheap.
May 04 18:19:05 <czr> you can get wireless 3g usb dongles here for that price (starting price)
May 04 18:19:08 <glass> wireless i suppose
May 04 18:19:19 <glass> i pay 9.90 for 384kbit/s
May 04 18:19:20 <czr> but 256 kbps is just painful
May 04 18:19:28 <glass> well, the corp pays but anyhow
May 04 18:19:55 <glass> crz: awful perhaps, but always with you..
May 04 18:20:03 <term-sig> it's quite cheap and i dont saw anything better.
May 04 18:20:13 * RST38h is still waiting for 3g
May 04 18:20:32 <gpd> anyone on Vodafone UK PAYG  and know the situation with Data on that?my gf has it and i'd like to test the testhering
May 04 18:20:51 <czr> glass, no I meant that 256 for a 3G is just painful ;-)
May 04 18:21:01 <czr> I'm all for mobility.
May 04 18:21:37 <glass> heh, yeh it's a bit pointless limit point
May 04 18:21:55 <glass> with a little higher i'd get hsdpa
May 04 18:22:01 <glass> or perhaps i'm getting it now
May 04 18:22:07 <kaatis> RST38h, wireless
May 04 18:22:22 <glass> the biggest shit with this connection is just that it's natted
May 04 18:22:42 <glass> of course pings are too high for action games too
May 04 18:22:51 <gpd> don't suppose there is a page somewhere with settings for all providers and how to tether to N8x0? wishful thinking..
May 04 18:23:19 <Cptnodegard> usb modems work with the ITs?
May 04 18:23:22 <iomari> anyone out there?
May 04 18:23:26 <czr> gpd, that's easy, just find the web page with the "all providers" list first ;-)
May 04 18:23:47 <gpd> czr: thanks ;)
May 04 18:23:49 <iomari> can someone tell me if it's possible to run apache on the n810?
May 04 18:23:51 <johnx> Cptnodegard, if it takes less than 100mA and has open source linux drivers, then probably
May 04 18:24:19 <johnx> iomari, yes, but it will take up a good chunk of memory. do you plan to run apache and use the tablet at the same time?
May 04 18:24:31 <johnx> maybe lighthttpd would work better for you...
May 04 18:24:51 <NullM0dem> does lighttpd have a port?
May 04 18:25:18 <gpd> http://www.filesaveas.com/vodafone.html <-- this site seems to have lots of data for setting up tethering - will try
May 04 18:26:07 <Proteous> howardforums.com has a lot of stuff
May 04 18:26:38 <Proteous> about cell phones that is
May 04 18:26:44 <Proteous> along with teathering info and such
May 04 18:26:56 <gpd> http://www.filesaveas.com/wap.html#settings <-- better
May 04 18:27:01 <Proteous> :)
May 04 18:27:06 <Proteous> whatever works
May 04 18:27:21 <gpd> Proteous: sorry - i meant better than my previous link - not yours --- looking now
May 04 18:27:29 <Proteous> heh
May 04 18:40:25 <AStorm> hello
May 04 18:40:58 <AStorm> could someone build pulseaudio with esound support and vs speex integer lib?
May 04 18:41:10 <AStorm> (for the resampler)
May 04 18:43:16 <AStorm> KotCzarny: btw, what have I asked you yesterday to build?,forgot to install
May 04 18:44:49 <AStorm> ah, alsa-utils
May 04 18:47:16 <AStorm> I found out it isn't esd that's making the sound balance adjustments
May 04 18:47:24 <AStorm> it's the aep dsp process
May 04 18:47:48 <AStorm> seems to do psychoacoustic volume adjustment and some form of crossover
May 04 18:48:27 <AStorm> you can disable it in the dsp config file to save a bit of cpu power and have normal sound
May 04 18:48:57 <AStorm> who will wikiize what I said? :P
May 04 18:49:56 <gpd> meh - can't get it to work with Vodafone - thether to N800 :(
May 04 18:50:20 <AStorm> check if your plan allows tethering
May 04 18:52:53 <gpd> anywhere you would suggest to check - is 'tether' the technical term for this - would it be on vodafone site?
May 04 18:53:24 <elb> it's probably listed as a 'laptop data' or 'pda data' plan
May 04 18:55:24 <AStorm> noes
May 04 18:55:34 <AStorm> it's NOT aep itself, darn
May 04 18:55:37 <AStorm> wait
May 04 18:57:55 <AStorm> yes, it's aep... clearly
May 04 18:58:04 <AStorm> :)
May 04 19:12:42 <zakm> does 2008HE take more battery life than 2007HE?
May 04 19:18:22 <gpd> crap - I can access website from the phone - but cannot go via N800 - all I get is 'subscribe to packet data first' - must not allow tethering on this plan - despite not mentioning anything about it on their terms and conditions. :(
May 04 19:20:00 <AStorm> gpd: because they don't, they can do what they want
May 04 19:20:21 <AStorm> so, you got rickrollede
May 04 19:22:56 <gpd> well - that plan is my GF's so I need to try out the same on my plan - (02 simplicity) but not an unlocked phone and no bluetooth on my phone ... so  crapper
May 04 19:37:53 <pupnik> One man writes Linux drivers for 235 USB webcams  heh
May 04 19:38:41 <pupnik> http://www.theinquirer.net/en/inquirer/news/2007/04/30/one-man-writes-linux-drivers-for-235-usb-webcams
May 04 19:40:15 <flatface> I have a couple of cameras that use those drivers. Old news is old, though.
May 04 19:48:05 <Navi> the inquirer sucks as a news source too :P
May 04 20:05:02 <pupnik> wb doc|home
May 04 20:06:23 <doc|home> thanks pupnik
May 04 20:11:14 <pupnik> crap the berlin conference center is huge
May 04 20:11:54 <pupnik> http://maps.google.com/maps?f=q&hl=en&geocode=&q=LIETZENBURGER+STRASSE+85+berlin&sll=50.420399,8.611588&sspn=0.838239,1.082153&ie=UTF8&ll=52.502874,13.293071&spn=0.048224,0.107288&t=h&z=14&iwloc=addr
May 04 20:19:17 <gpd> could someone give me a URL for where youwould buy a phone in the USA - outside of the manufactuer - eg. what is the price of a nokia e51 in america... stupid google wants to give me UK prices :(
May 04 20:20:03 <gpd> ok - nvm - newegg.com has them
May 04 20:21:08 <KotCzarny> astorm: cool, what's the location of that dsp config? can it be changed on-the-fly ? (/me thinks about cheap eq)
May 04 20:23:51 <AStorm> can't be
May 04 20:24:06 <AStorm> /lib/dsp/dsp_dld*.conf
May 04 20:24:39 <AStorm> the effect is fairly mild tthough
May 04 20:24:51 <AStorm> the crossfeed is most noticeable
May 04 20:25:11 <KotCzarny> heh.. config in /lib
May 04 20:25:17 <KotCzarny> those hackers :/
May 04 20:25:31 <AStorm> :P
May 04 20:25:42 <AStorm> I want a disassembler
May 04 20:25:42 <RST38h> gpd: $250..$400
May 04 20:25:59 <RST38h> gpd: you should be able to change localization in google account settings
May 04 20:26:02 <KotCzarny> astorm: any links for aep?
May 04 20:26:13 <AStorm> huh? no
May 04 20:26:23 <AStorm> it's at the bottom of the config
May 04 20:26:24 <KotCzarny> how it is used?
May 04 20:26:28 <AStorm> dunno
May 04 20:26:42 <AStorm> it affects the sound though
May 04 20:27:00 <KotCzarny> so it's not user controllable?
May 04 20:27:10 <AStorm> yes, isn't
May 04 20:27:17 <AStorm> apart from disabling
May 04 20:27:28 <AStorm> unless you get me a dsp disassembler
May 04 20:30:23 <KotCzarny> or porting some soft eq for dsp
May 04 20:34:20 <AStorm> KotCzarny: shouldn't be hard
May 04 20:34:25 <KotCzarny> yup
May 04 20:34:35 <KotCzarny> because c compiler for dsp is available
May 04 20:34:41 <AStorm> I could port fftw-based eq, but I need a disasm first :P
May 04 20:34:48 <AStorm> and paid time :P
May 04 20:35:13 <KotCzarny> ok, i should take $$ for compiling packages from now on :P
May 04 20:36:31 <Proteous> I'll give you $0.50
May 04 20:37:20 <konttori> jldiaz: let's take a look at also the nunchuc next week.
May 04 20:37:26 <KotCzarny> per package? ok :)
May 04 20:39:03 <AStorm> naaah
May 04 20:39:05 <shapr> yarr
May 04 20:39:08 <AStorm> per hour
May 04 20:39:17 <AStorm> of work time
May 04 20:39:25 <KotCzarny> that's 25$/h
May 04 20:39:29 <KotCzarny> :)
May 04 20:40:25 <AStorm> no, I sail 0.5$/h
May 04 20:40:26 <KotCzarny> http://www.techamok.com/?pid=4485
May 04 20:40:27 <KotCzarny> lol
May 04 20:40:29 <AStorm> said
May 04 20:55:26 <NullM0dem> back in the day spies would hide data on leftover romspace in atari cartirdges :)
May 04 20:55:36 <NullM0dem> nothng new
May 04 20:57:56 <NullM0dem> i do often wonder what china puts in consumer grade router hardware
May 04 20:58:03 <NullM0dem> :P
May 04 21:00:47 <czr> small chinese people
May 04 22:17:10 <lcuk> is it possible to blow the stack by passing too many parameters along a c vararg thing?
May 04 22:17:25 <KotCzarny> probably
May 04 22:17:35 <derf> No.
May 04 22:17:43 <AStorm> not if properly done
May 04 22:17:57 <lcuk> 1681 items
May 04 22:17:58 <derf> Caller cleans stack in C.
May 04 22:18:08 <AStorm> yep
May 04 22:18:14 <AStorm> in cdecl at least
May 04 22:18:27 <derf> No one cares about Microsoft.
May 04 22:18:29 <AStorm> in stdcall it's funnier
May 04 22:18:36 <AStorm> derf: you wish
May 04 22:18:45 <AStorm> in pascal it's diff too
May 04 22:18:51 <lcuk> thank you! i missed the final va_end(arg);
May 04 22:18:51 <derf> Pascal is not C.
May 04 22:19:11 <AStorm> lcuk: whee :)
May 04 22:19:27 <AStorm> derf: you wish - you can call pascal code from C
May 04 22:19:47 <AStorm> but there are no varargs there
May 04 22:19:57 <derf> And it's _still_ not C.
May 04 22:20:42 <lcuk> hmmm, still got the problem though
May 04 22:22:00 <AStorm> lcuk: doing something wrong
May 04 22:22:07 <AStorm> show  us the code
May 04 22:22:12 <lcuk> heh..
May 04 22:22:20 <lcuk> http://pastebin.ca/1007479
May 04 22:22:23 <lcuk> thats one half..
May 04 22:23:58 <lcuk> and this is the other
May 04 22:23:58 <lcuk> http://pastebin.ca/1007491
May 04 22:25:09 <lcuk> the code appears to munch over another global variable outside of this code.  if i return early and only do a few small ones the effect isnt noticed
May 04 22:25:12 <AStorm> char == uint?
May 04 22:25:24 <lcuk> 8bit byte
May 04 22:25:55 <AStorm> you must do va_list and va_start at the beginning
May 04 22:25:55 <lcuk> i tried it with chars but gcc told me the va_ functions could only take ints
May 04 22:26:02 <AStorm> not somewhere in the middle
May 04 22:26:02 <lcuk> i do
May 04 22:26:09 <AStorm> no, you don't
May 04 22:26:10 <Proteous> seems the top shelf of my fridge gets pretty cold
May 04 22:26:10 <lcuk> ahh ok
May 04 22:26:24 <derf> gcc is smarter than you.
May 04 22:26:24 <Proteous> if you were wondering, yes you can freeze hard boiled eggs
May 04 22:26:38 <derf> Arguments automatically get promoted to ints in C.
May 04 22:27:03 <AStorm> lcuk: at least va_list
May 04 22:27:13 <AStorm> lcuk: and use -Wall
May 04 22:27:18 <lcuk> ive just moved both to be the first items in the function
May 04 22:27:50 <lcuk> in cflags?
May 04 22:27:54 <AStorm> what do you get? segfault?
May 04 22:27:55 <AStorm> yes
May 04 22:28:42 <lcuk> no - i get something very strange happening in ive got a fullscreen menu showing, if i run through this code and return to the menu, it occupies half the screen instead of the whole thing
May 04 22:29:06 <AStorm> I see no va_next
May 04 22:29:06 <lcuk> if i bailout of the big initialise function half way down (by just returning after the first few small ones) it doesnt happen
May 04 22:29:49 <AStorm> you're looping over one item
May 04 22:30:04 <lcuk> no im not, it works in the other places -  theres no mention in the docs
May 04 22:30:31 <lcuk> http://www.elook.org/programming/c/va_arg.html
May 04 22:30:58 <AStorm> lcuk: you're mixing old-style with new style
May 04 22:31:08 <AStorm> use:
May 04 22:31:20 <AStorm> va_list a;
May 04 22:32:11 <AStorm> and do include stdarg.h
May 04 22:35:19 <lcuk> i was doing
May 04 22:35:54 <AStorm> ok, what does -Wall print?
May 04 22:35:59 <lcuk> and it works correctly until i have 324 params
May 04 22:36:18 <lcuk> i dunno, is that a gcc flag
May 04 22:37:01 <lcuk> ooooer, its gonna take me a while, i gather thats extra checking...
May 04 22:37:26 <AStorm> it is an essential cflag
May 04 22:37:40 <AStorm> wnables most of important warnings
May 04 22:37:54 <lcuk> yes, its stopping on unused variable
May 04 22:38:09 <lcuk> nothing drastic, theres just a few there as code gets shuftied about
May 04 22:38:15 <AStorm> hmm
May 04 22:38:22 <AStorm> no invalid casts?
May 04 22:38:28 <lcuk> im gonna have to cleanse all code
May 04 22:38:50 <lcuk> no - like i said the warnings its moaning about aren't showstoppers yet
May 04 22:39:02 <AStorm> hmm
May 04 22:39:12 <lcuk> but its gotta get through that with all files, ill come back in a few
May 04 22:39:24 <AStorm> well, it should work... maybe you're overflowing some counter?
May 04 22:39:49 <lcuk> like i said, it works until i try using it with 324 items
May 04 22:40:09 * lcuk is doin overkill
May 04 22:40:31 <AStorm> heh
May 04 22:40:45 <AStorm> maybe some malloc is failing?
May 04 22:41:00 <AStorm> try -lmudflap
May 04 22:41:00 <KotCzarny> why not a single pointer to an array of those 700 items?
May 04 22:41:10 <AStorm> should crash neatly on any corruption
May 04 22:41:27 <AStorm> KotCzarny: because he's making it a macro
May 04 22:41:32 <lcuk> because its not inline with the rest of the declaration, ive gotta start spreading out the bits i want together
May 04 22:41:34 <AStorm> a macro lookalike
May 04 22:41:47 * KotCzarny likes arrays
May 04 22:41:54 <lcuk> so do i
May 04 22:42:08 * AStorm doesn't like **
May 04 22:42:28 <lcuk> and the original codegen did them as arrays, but then i needed arrays of sizes and it got spread out and to move something around would involve multiple cuts in multiple places
May 04 22:42:54 <AStorm> blah
May 04 22:42:55 <lcuk> this way i can just define a glyph entirely inline
May 04 22:43:01 <lcuk> any shaped brush i want
May 04 22:43:21 <lcuk> theres an alternative function which takes byte * :)
May 04 22:51:27 <cLin> is there anyway in ssh to use a command to make the browser open and go to an address?
May 04 22:51:39 <cLin> say i wanted to load an url from my computer to my n800
May 04 22:58:47 <iomari> can someone tell me if it's possible to run apache on the n810?
May 04 22:59:49 <jldiaz> cLin, better use wget
May 04 23:02:18 <jldiaz> iomari, never tried, but read about. Appaerntly, yes
May 04 23:02:30 <Navi> best to use something lighter
May 04 23:03:09 <jldiaz> Navi, yeah, wget is a big app
May 04 23:03:54 <jldiaz> if you already have python installed, a simple script could do the trick
May 04 23:04:09 <Navi> I'm not talking about wget
May 04 23:04:13 <Navi> I was talking about apache :P
May 04 23:04:20 <jldiaz> ah :)
May 04 23:04:43 <jldiaz> anyway, wget is also surprisingly heavy
May 04 23:04:49 <iomari> navi: which webserver would u advise?
May 04 23:05:25 <jott> cLin: you can use -> browser_dbuscmd.sh load_url http://foo
May 04 23:05:49 <Navi> lighttpd
May 04 23:06:27 <iomari> never heard of it. I'll look it up.
May 04 23:06:37 <Navi> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lighttpd
May 04 23:07:46 <iomari> thanks, i'll see if it will do the job.
May 04 23:08:11 * KotCzarny likes thttpd
May 04 23:10:03 <iomari> i'll check that one out also.
May 04 23:14:51 <jldiaz> why xterm does not store the shown/hidden status of the toolbar? I'm tired of hidding it in each xterm instance...
May 04 23:15:15 <jldiaz> I even edited the gconf file, chnging a true for false
May 04 23:15:38 <jldiaz> but the true reappears!
May 04 23:16:33 <jott> iomari: lighttpd should be faster and is more flexible than thttpd also it is under active development.
May 04 23:17:01 <jldiaz> I heard about an osso-xterm replacement. Is it available as .deb or only in source code?
May 04 23:17:24 <jldiaz> btw, I'm using OS2008 on n810
May 04 23:17:45 <KotCzarny> jildiaz: then get any other terminal emulator
May 04 23:17:48 <KotCzarny> fe. aterm
May 04 23:18:12 <jldiaz> any recomendation?
May 04 23:18:27 <jott> jldiaz: or use a recent svn snapshot of the osso-xterm
May 04 23:18:49 <jldiaz> I'm basically happy with osso-xterm, except for the toolbar issue
May 04 23:19:54 <jott> jldiaz: i made a build from a svn version http://sse2.net/xterm which fixes most of the issues of the release version
May 04 23:19:57 <jldiaz> jott, this is source code, isn't?
May 04 23:20:22 <jldiaz> oh, sorry
May 04 23:20:24 <jott> yes, osso-xterm is open source
May 04 23:20:38 <jott> and in a public garage svn
May 04 23:20:47 <jldiaz> you typed faster than me. I was referring to the svn
May 04 23:21:04 <jldiaz> but then you mentioned your build
May 04 23:21:36 <jldiaz> can I downgrade in case of trouble?
May 04 23:21:56 <jott> yes, just reinstall the old version either with apt-get or dpkg
May 04 23:22:28 <jldiaz> I'll give it a try then. Thanks!
May 04 23:23:48 <jott> inz: wouldn't it make sense to put debs of the tagged versions on the garage page?
May 04 23:30:43 <Rafael> Hi dears
May 04 23:30:57 <jldiaz> hi Rafael
May 04 23:31:33 <Rafael> yesterday I become in here and yours give me a great tip
May 04 23:31:39 <Rafael> :)
May 04 23:32:06 <Rafael> however, I need other :P
May 04 23:32:15 <Rafael> with SSH...
May 04 23:32:26 <Rafael> anybody want help me?
May 04 23:33:14 <jldiaz> If I can help...
May 04 23:33:27 <Rafael> ok :)
May 04 23:33:34 <jldiaz> jott, do I need to install all the .debs in your xterm folder?
May 04 23:33:59 <Rafael> yes, exactaly
May 04 23:34:26 <jott> jldiaz: no, osso-xterm_0.14.mh11_armel.deb libvte4_0.12.2-0mh7_armel.deb libvte-common_0.12.2-0mh7_all.deb are enough
May 04 23:34:32 <Rafael> I "googling", however, I don't have success :(
May 04 23:34:43 <jldiaz> ok jott, this was my guess
May 04 23:35:46 <jldiaz> Rafael, what's your native tongue? (I can talk spanish)
May 04 23:36:40 <Rafael> haha, sorry for my English
May 04 23:37:01 <Rafael> my native tongue is Brazilian - Portuguese
May 04 23:37:20 <jldiaz> ok, I was only trying to facilitate communication, no offense intended :-)
May 04 23:38:24 <Rafael> haha, no problem, I understand
May 04 23:39:03 <Rafael> ok, where I can download this packs?
May 04 23:39:31 <jldiaz> what packages are you talking about? I was not here yesterdey
May 04 23:39:42 <jldiaz> dey -> day
May 04 23:40:40 <Rafael> sorry again! osso-xterm_0.14.mh11_armel.deb libvte4_0.12.2-0mh7_armel.deb libvte-common_0.12.2-0mh7_all.deb...
May 04 23:40:55 <jldiaz> http://sse2.net/xterm
May 04 23:40:59 <Rafael> this packages I need to run OpenSSH on my device
May 04 23:41:04 <jldiaz> but this is not related to ssh
May 04 23:41:22 <Rafael> yeah, I tried this Site, but, not acces :/
May 04 23:41:26 <jldiaz> this is about xterm, the topic I was talking about with jott, before you arrival
May 04 23:41:32 <tibibo> gainroot?
May 04 23:41:48 <Rafael> sorry, I am confusing
May 04 23:42:14 <jldiaz> you were about asking something about ssh, but then we mentioned those packages, which are not ssh related
May 04 23:42:16 <Rafael> I have root, and need OpenSSH
May 04 23:42:47 <jldiaz> Do you want openssh in order to gain root access?
May 04 23:42:48 <Rafael> ok, I understand
May 04 23:42:52 <tibibo> And what problem?
May 04 23:43:16 <tibibo> Download it
May 04 23:43:17 <Rafael> no, I need access the devide by Ubuntu
May 04 23:43:58 <jldiaz> then, from xterm, with root permissions, issue the command:
May 04 23:44:01 <jldiaz> apt-get install openssh
May 04 23:44:09 <Rafael> I find this package openssh-client+server.install, but don't work
May 04 23:44:39 <tibibo> Strange
May 04 23:44:53 <Rafael> yeah, my Ubuntu worked with ssh, but on device I need install the OpenSSH server, right?
May 04 23:44:59 <tibibo> Always worked
May 04 23:45:22 <tibibo> Yes
May 04 23:45:30 <jldiaz> right, if you want to login in your device from the ubuntu machine
May 04 23:45:54 <jldiaz> tried apt-get install openssh ?
May 04 23:46:04 <Rafael> yeah
May 04 23:46:06 <Rafael> :/
May 04 23:46:13 <jldiaz> what is the result?
May 04 23:46:36 <Rafael> install normaly
May 04 23:46:52 <jldiaz> ok, so what is the problem now?
May 04 23:47:00 <Rafael> but, the device, don't have a server of SSH
May 04 23:47:13 <Rafael> so, I can't access it
May 04 23:47:16 <Rafael> :/
May 04 23:47:18 <tibibo> Type ssh root@... Etc.
May 04 23:47:25 <jldiaz> try: ps aux|grep ssh
May 04 23:47:35 <Rafael> no
May 04 23:47:44 <Rafael> I try now
May 04 23:48:02 <tibibo> Right
May 04 23:48:11 <Rafael> wait, please :)
May 04 23:49:06 <jldiaz> "ps aux"  lists all processes running on your tablet. Piping this through | grep ssh, shows only those lines containing the "ssh" string, so you can find if you have any process running called ssh or similar
May 04 23:49:30 <tibibo> Start sshd
May 04 23:51:14 <tibibo> With sscript or by hand (;
May 04 23:55:21 <tibibo> What about porting on arm dc-client
May 04 23:55:36 <jldiaz> I'm going to bed
May 04 23:55:39 <jldiaz> see ya
May 04 23:59:23 <rafael_> sorry, dears, I had problems with the connection
May 04 23:59:28 <rafael_> :(
May 05 00:01:14 <jldiaz> rafael_, I'm going to bed, sorry
May 05 00:01:35 <rafael_> Ok :(
May 05 00:01:37 <jldiaz> did you have any progress with the ps command?
May 05 00:01:53 <rafael_> Thanks to help
May 05 00:02:14 <rafael_> no, this is result of ps, "rafael    6458  0.0  0.0   3020   764 pts/0    R+   20:57   0:00 grep ssh"
May 05 00:02:18 <jldiaz> can you see if you have the folder /etc/ssh ?
May 05 00:03:04 <rafael_> yes, I have :)
May 05 00:03:13 <jldiaz> and if it contains the files ssh_host_dsa_key      ssh_host_key          ssh_host_rsa_key ?
May 05 00:03:31 <jldiaz> among others
May 05 00:04:31 <jldiaz> if yes, as root, issue the command: /etc/init.d/ssh start
May 05 00:04:40 <jldiaz> this should start your sshd server
May 05 00:04:42 <rafael_> no, only "moduli" and "ssh_config"
May 05 00:04:45 <jldiaz> oh
May 05 00:04:49 <jldiaz> so this is the problem
May 05 00:05:13 <jldiaz> apparently the script which installs sshd did not set up correctly the server
May 05 00:05:15 <rafael_> how I try? reinstall the ssh package?
May 05 00:05:46 <rafael_> wait, this is on Ubuntu right? or on Device?
May 05 00:05:48 <rafael_> :S
May 05 00:05:56 <jldiaz> all on device
May 05 00:06:49 <jldiaz> on ubuntu you only require the command ssh, not the server
May 05 00:08:04 <rafael_> ok
May 05 00:08:51 <rafael_> I understand wrong, sorry again
May 05 00:09:02 <rafael_> on device, this folder no exists
May 05 00:09:31 <rafael_> I need of any repositories to install openssh?
May 05 00:14:52 <jldiaz> no
May 05 00:15:05 <jldiaz> just try as root:
May 05 00:15:19 <jldiaz> apt-get install openssh
May 05 00:17:17 <rafael_> it return "couldn't find package openssh"
May 05 00:18:46 <rafael_> and, it order that I run "apt-get update", and I run many times, and the return is the same
May 05 00:19:51 <jldiaz> you need the repository "maemo"
May 05 00:20:15 <jldiaz> I thought  it was standard
May 05 00:22:33 <jldiaz> http://repository.maemo.org/
May 05 00:22:43 <rafael_> uhm
May 05 00:22:47 <rafael_> just this
May 05 00:23:11 <rafael_> I am listed only "Maemo Extras"
May 05 00:23:12 <jldiaz> you can add it throuh the app manager
May 05 00:23:36 <rafael_> yaeh, I know! ;)
May 05 00:24:03 <jldiaz> not extras, only maemo
May 05 00:25:21 <jldiaz> free non-free collections
May 05 00:25:41 <rafael_> ok, "maemo Extras" was standard, I can Delete? or only add "maemo" on "http://repository.maemo.org/"?
May 05 00:26:00 <jldiaz> (only free is required for openssh, but better leave both)
May 05 00:26:19 <jldiaz> better add a new one
May 05 00:27:01 <jldiaz> if you delete a reposigory from which you installed somethin, you break the upgrade mechanism
May 05 00:30:11 <rafael_> Yes, I know, only thought in my case was not necessary, but I leave it so good there, anyway now it makes no difference
May 05 00:31:32 <rafael_> (I do not know how to express laughter in English in Brazil is "haha" or something like)
May 05 00:31:35 <rafael_> :D
May 05 00:31:38 <rafael_> haha
May 05 00:31:47 <rafael_> Its worked!
May 05 00:31:49 <rafael_> :D
May 05 00:32:43 <jldiaz> haha
May 05 00:32:54 <jldiaz> jaja in spanish
May 05 00:33:11 <rafael_> very very, thanks, I never imagined it would be a repository my problem
May 05 00:33:14 <KotCzarny> jaja means 'eggs' in polish
May 05 00:33:14 <KotCzarny> :)
May 05 00:33:26 <jldiaz> XD
May 05 00:33:33 <rafael_> yeah, the "jaja" I know! :P
May 05 00:34:01 <rafael_> I have speaked with argentines
May 05 00:34:32 <rafael_> "eggs"? hahahahahahaha
May 05 00:34:53 <rafael_> I did not mind
May 05 00:34:53 <jldiaz> jaja is pronounced like haha, but with a stronger h, like th x in mexico or TeX
May 05 00:35:25 <KotCzarny> in polish it's pronounced like yaya
May 05 00:36:05 <jldiaz> so no confusion wirh eggs when a spaniard is laughing :D
May 05 00:36:16 <rafael_> si si, mi amygo, yo coñeso un poco de spañol, pero, no mucho!
May 05 00:36:35 <rafael_> aeuhuiaehuiaehae
May 05 00:36:50 <rafael_> this is laughter too
May 05 00:37:07 <KotCzarny> chihuahua?
May 05 00:37:07 <KotCzarny> ;)
May 05 00:37:18 <jldiaz> well, now really I'm going to sleep
May 05 00:37:39 <rafael_> indeed in the Brazilian Portuguese, anything that has not entered sense is laugh! : P
May 05 00:37:41 <rafael_> haha
May 05 00:37:48 <jldiaz> good night (at least here)
May 05 00:38:19 <rafael_> sorry for disturb dear fried
May 05 00:38:23 <rafael_> *friend
May 05 00:38:45 <rafael_> good night
May 05 00:38:53 <jldiaz> I'm feeling fried too
May 05 00:39:02 <rafael_> thank you make much again
May 05 00:39:25 <rafael_> hahaha
May 05 00:39:28 <jldiaz> youre welcome
May 05 00:39:34 <rafael_> :D
May 05 00:39:36 <rafael_> thanks
May 05 00:40:19 <rafael_> maybe one day I also help others as you, for now I only develop ... :)
May 05 00:40:29 <rafael_> good night
May 05 00:43:44 <rafael_> I am going too
May 05 00:44:45 <rafael_> I'm tired, although not so late here in brazil
May 05 00:44:56 <rafael_> thanks all that help me :)
May 05 00:45:20 <Proteous> hagalahaglalhahgla
May 05 00:58:01 <benh> hrm... having a hard time trying to find the source for maemo-pc-connectivity
May 05 00:58:29 <benh> trying to figure out if it does something to dnsmasq when hooking up the USB networking
May 05 01:06:57 <benh> how do one setup a DNS for the DEFAULT connection ?
May 05 01:18:31 <pupnik> Wow asus claims 1 million Eee PCs sold.
May 05 01:18:45 <pupnik> we gotta make teh nokias even bettur :)
May 05 01:20:40 <Grackle> They're not really competing, are they?
May 05 01:20:56 <pupnik> yes true
May 05 01:21:15 <pupnik> perhaps a subset of consumers will be weighing the two vs each other
May 05 01:21:28 <Grackle> I guess if I carried an eee around, I might not carry the n800. I'm not sure.
May 05 01:21:53 * Grackle got an IT because it is pocket sized and doesn't require a bag to carry it in
May 05 01:22:20 <pupnik> yes pocket sized is a different world
May 05 01:22:23 <Grackle> I'd like an eee or something similar, though. They look awfully fun.
May 05 01:23:01 <pupnik> yes looking at my thinkpad, i might be just as well off with eee. just runs linux anyway
May 05 01:25:10 <Grackle> I bought a fairly hefty laptop because I needed something portable, but didn't have money to get a decent desktop as well. I stand by that decision, but now that I have a nice desktop, I'd like a more portable laptop.
May 05 01:25:18 <Grackle> What thinkpad do you have?
May 05 01:25:35 <KotCzarny> x32
May 05 01:25:36 <KotCzarny> :>
May 05 01:25:40 <KotCzarny> the best one
May 05 01:25:55 <KotCzarny> though i like x30 too
May 05 01:26:39 <Grackle> I think I'd get a T40 if I were to buy a thinkpad
May 05 01:26:47 <WormFood> T42
May 05 01:26:53 <KotCzarny> name t40 features you need
May 05 01:27:02 <WormFood> I have a T30 (I'm using it now)...great machine!
May 05 01:27:26 <KotCzarny> http://www.thinkwiki.org/wiki/Category:X32
May 05 01:28:19 <Grackle> KotCzarny: I like how solid thinkpads are. The t40 is affordable, has well supported hardware, and doesn't contain a battery-gobbling core duo like the t69s
May 05 01:28:22 <Grackle> t60s even
May 05 01:28:26 <Grackle> Have a better suggestion?
May 05 01:28:31 <KotCzarny> x40
May 05 01:28:37 <KotCzarny> the best in battery life
May 05 01:28:43 <KotCzarny> ulv version of course
May 05 01:28:58 <SenileBob> I'm looking to develop a custom application for the N800/810, I need to get hold of someone who knows their stuff who can help me out. Anyone interested in doing some programming work for me? :)
May 05 01:29:19 <Grackle> the x40 "lacks" a touchpad :|
May 05 01:29:28 <KotCzarny> grackle: i hate touchpads
May 05 01:29:29 <KotCzarny> :)
May 05 01:29:50 <Grackle> Yeah. Seems like people go one way or the other.
May 05 01:29:54 <KotCzarny> my fingers get wet often
May 05 01:30:06 <KotCzarny> so touchpads stop working for me then
May 05 01:30:30 <Grackle> I've never had such problems with my hp touchpad. It works quite well, even if I lick my finger (ew).
May 05 01:30:44 <Grackle> But I have had older laptops with horrific touchpads
May 05 01:30:54 <Grackle> I think the technology has come a long way..
May 05 01:31:00 <KotCzarny> probably
May 05 01:31:11 <KotCzarny> but i still prefer point stick way
May 05 01:31:23 <KotCzarny> it's less distracting when i'm typing
May 05 01:31:27 <Grackle> In any case, I have seen people use the stick point quite efficiently, and it looks nice for those who are used to it.
May 05 01:31:53 * Grackle feels like a fish out of water if he's stuck with the trackpoint thing
May 05 01:32:06 <KotCzarny> :)
May 05 01:32:19 <KotCzarny> you should try 'power dome' cap sometimes
May 05 01:32:23 <KotCzarny> hum
May 05 01:32:54 <Grackle> If it weren't for web pages, I wouldn't need a mouse.
May 05 01:32:57 <Grackle> Damn you, internet.
May 05 01:33:03 <KotCzarny> ah, sorry
May 05 01:33:06 <KotCzarny> it's 'soft rim'
May 05 01:33:09 <KotCzarny> http://www-307.ibm.com/pc/support/site.wss/VLAR-443LTU.html
May 05 01:33:12 <KotCzarny> third one
May 05 01:33:24 <KotCzarny> provides the best feeling
May 05 01:33:29 <KotCzarny> and is easiest to move
May 05 01:33:40 <Grackle> Hmm, I didn't realize they came in different flavors.
May 05 01:33:47 <Grackle> I think my friend has the soft dome one
May 05 01:34:05 <Grackle> I'm sure I'd get used to it if I gave it a chance.
May 05 01:34:09 <KotCzarny> :)
May 05 01:34:15 <KotCzarny> they are interchangeable too
May 05 01:34:22 <Grackle> I see.
May 05 01:38:16 <pupnik> SenileBob: feel free to ask questions.  Check topic for links.  And tell about your project.
May 05 01:39:08 <pupnik> think i might order some of those softrims
May 05 01:39:24 <pupnik> SenileBob: you doing that home automation thing?
May 05 01:42:57 <SenileBob> yes pupnik, thats the one :)
May 05 01:43:20 <SenileBob> I found a programmer, but turns out he didnt have the time
May 05 02:17:40 <unixSnob> SenileBob, what's the home automation idea?  To use a NIT to control your lights?
May 05 02:20:02 <SenileBob> Something like that :)
May 05 02:20:48 <SenileBob> basically, control a whole house automation system (lighting, security, AV, heating/cooling, etc) - possibilities are endless
May 05 02:21:21 <unixSnob> very cool.. and are the switches x10?
May 05 02:21:39 <SenileBob> not x10 - all Crestron hardware
May 05 02:21:46 <SenileBob> high end automation
May 05 02:22:00 <SenileBob> used in multi-million dollar residences, company board rooms, etc
May 05 02:22:05 <unixSnob> I became an x10 fanatic (for a couple weeks), then one of the switches melted
May 05 02:22:13 <unixSnob> I don't trust x10
May 05 02:22:18 <SenileBob> either do i ;)
May 05 02:22:28 <unixSnob> haven't heard of crestron
May 05 02:22:29 <SenileBob> Crestron on the other hand - very reliable stuff
May 05 02:22:53 <SenileBob> its not something the average home owner uses, used mainly in high-end stuff
May 05 02:22:56 <SenileBob> www.crestron.com
May 05 02:23:50 <unixSnob> I like x10's prices.. too bad the stuff is a fire hazard, and flakey
May 05 02:24:02 <SenileBob> yep. Crestron aint cheap...
May 05 02:24:02 <unixSnob> I've had some switches simply die
May 05 02:24:15 <SenileBob> are you getting my PM's?
May 05 02:24:35 <unixSnob> ah, sorry didn't notice
May 05 02:47:19 <SenileBob> Is there any way to store a website link, like a favourite, in the main menu on N800, and force the web browser to start in full screen mode?
May 05 02:48:08 <SenileBob> and also to have the N800 automatically load a webpage in full screen mode when its turned on?
**** ENDING LOGGING AT Mon May 05 02:59:57 2008