**** BEGIN LOGGING AT Mon Jun 09 02:59:56 2008
Jun 09 03:01:52 <pupnik> sorry if that sounded arrogant.. i suggest it because of respect
Jun 09 03:02:31 <GeneralAntilles> lol, I've been through some of it.
Jun 09 03:02:35 <GeneralAntilles> Had it bookmarked
Jun 09 03:02:42 <GeneralAntilles> Usually drop by when I'm in the mood. ;)
Jun 09 03:03:09 <pupnik> if you want to talk about a particular topic, i'm free in PM
Jun 09 03:03:16 <GeneralAntilles> Actually, I think the bookmark was from you mentioning it previously.
Jun 09 03:03:21 <fysa> mises is good.
Jun 09 03:03:30 * pupnik happy
Jun 09 03:04:18 <fysa> a little behind, but I usually share any good economics/money-related stuff I find here: http://www.google.com/reader/shared/17922113735390681007
Jun 09 03:04:59 <fysa> http://blog.mises.org/blog/
Jun 09 03:05:41 <pupnik> some fun things on the google link but not much economics
Jun 09 03:06:08 <fysa> if you use Google Reader, my items will automatically show up on your read list and vice versa
Jun 09 03:06:17 <pupnik> actually very cool blog fysa
Jun 09 03:06:25 <pupnik> gameswise
Jun 09 03:06:39 <fysa> but yeah, I'm a week behind and haven't gotten through the economics yet
Jun 09 03:06:47 <fysa> http://suddendebt.blogspot.com/
Jun 09 03:06:59 <pupnik> man... i'm not going to have time for snes
Jun 09 03:07:02 <fysa> http://www.controlledgreed.com/
Jun 09 03:07:03 <GeneralAntilles> Love the 64 article.
Jun 09 03:07:06 <GeneralAntilles> Blast Corps
Jun 09 03:07:14 <GeneralAntilles> I wish it would work in SixtyForce. :(
Jun 09 03:07:18 <pupnik> i could do it too.. :/
Jun 09 03:07:40 <fysa> http://www.shadowstats.com/
Jun 09 03:07:48 <pupnik> yeah i like Williams
Jun 09 03:07:49 <fysa> anyway :)
Jun 09 03:07:54 <pupnik> maybe i gave you that link too :)
Jun 09 03:08:12 <pupnik> no it's great stuff
Jun 09 03:08:12 <fysa> I've been following this stuff for a while now, just was never really on-topic here.
Jun 09 03:08:18 <pupnik> yeah
Jun 09 03:08:29 <pupnik> great to see you on top of it though
Jun 09 03:08:43 <fysa> reading Crash Proof now
Jun 09 03:09:00 <GeneralAntilles> We're frequently not on-topic here. :P
Jun 09 03:09:19 <pupnik> this made my day
Jun 09 03:20:34 <KotCzarny> bahbah.
Jun 09 05:08:19 <Italodance> hi
Jun 09 05:43:11 <RST38h> 'Whoever transmits in interstate or foreign commerce any communication, with the intent to coerce, intimidate, harass, or cause substantial emotional distress to a person, using electronic means to support severe, repeated, and hostile behavior, shall be fined under this title or imprisoned not more than two years, or both.'
Jun 09 05:43:29 <GeneralAntilles> Woo, cyber-bullying!
Jun 09 05:43:36 <GeneralAntilles> They should crack down on real bullying instead. <_<
Jun 09 05:43:50 <johnx> cause I'm sure that won't get abused at all
Jun 09 05:43:53 <johnx> no way
Jun 09 05:44:07 <KotCzarny> yeah, say that to radio free euorope :P
Jun 09 05:44:20 <KotCzarny> or whatever it was called
Jun 09 05:44:34 <RST38h> General: You are done for. The meanwhile guy is coming for you! =)
Jun 09 05:45:08 <RST38h> Kot: Somebody abused RFERL? Was it done anally, I hope?
Jun 09 05:45:48 <GeneralAntilles> ohshiohshiohshi
Jun 09 05:45:52 <KotCzarny> no no, they were abusing commies :)
Jun 09 05:46:15 <RST38h> Commies did not mind, as far as I remember
Jun 09 05:46:33 <RST38h> The weird part is that RFERL continues to exist =)
Jun 09 05:46:38 <KotCzarny> yeah..
Jun 09 05:49:18 <KotCzarny> well, belarus is still in the old times
Jun 09 05:50:00 <RST38h> They still have Russian service
Jun 09 05:50:07 <RST38h> Do they still have Polish one btw?
Jun 09 05:50:18 <KotCzarny> i don't know
Jun 09 05:50:32 <KotCzarny> i know about it from jokes
Jun 09 05:51:27 <RST38h> http://www.rferl.com/languages/
Jun 09 05:51:30 <Dekaritae> Yay
Jun 09 05:51:31 <RST38h> Took Poland out.
Jun 09 05:51:34 <Dekaritae> I have Wi-Fi
Jun 09 05:51:56 <KotCzarny> Dekaritae: no kidding, how does it look?
Jun 09 05:52:07 <Dekaritae> Better than Bluetooth ICS
Jun 09 05:52:29 <Dekaritae> Someone in my building has radio device that clobbers Wi-Fi
Jun 09 05:52:51 <KotCzarny> all channels?
Jun 09 05:52:52 <RST38h> Is it another ap?
Jun 09 05:53:06 <RST38h> Or some kind of Doomsday Weapon?
Jun 09 05:53:26 <Dekaritae> No idea
Jun 09 05:53:51 <KotCzarny> rst, heh, i though ukraine is liberated too
Jun 09 05:53:51 <RST38h> well, chceck
Jun 09 05:53:59 <KotCzarny> but apparently it isn't :>
Jun 09 05:54:04 <KotCzarny> (looking at that list)
Jun 09 05:54:06 <Dekaritae> Channel 11 at full power and an external antennae works, I get 24 Mbps
Jun 09 05:54:11 <RST38h> Kot: Not yet, there is still chance!
Jun 09 05:54:24 <RST38h> The Bad Guys (tm) may still win!
Jun 09 05:54:57 <RST38h> Deka: Distance?
Jun 09 05:54:58 <KotCzarny> heh
Jun 09 05:55:08 <Dekaritae> I can use N800 in bathroom
Jun 09 05:55:13 <KotCzarny> lol
Jun 09 05:55:17 <Dekaritae> upstairs, mebbe 20 feet
Jun 09 05:55:27 <RST38h> Deka: What are walls made of?
Jun 09 05:55:48 <Dekaritae> Gyproc, 2x4 wood, vermiculite and fibreglass insulation
Jun 09 05:56:22 <RST38h> < 8" I hope?
Jun 09 05:56:35 <Dekaritae> I assume
Jun 09 05:57:10 <Dekaritae> Next project
Jun 09 05:57:22 <Dekaritae> Make mini-B to mini-B cable to attach USB hub
Jun 09 05:57:54 <Dekaritae> mini-B to USB female + USB male to mini-B to USB hub works
Jun 09 05:58:16 <RST38h> How about shifting to a different channel?
Jun 09 05:58:47 <Dekaritae> Relevance
Jun 09 05:59:42 <RST38h> Well, if somebody else is also using channel 11, you may get better performance at a different channel
Jun 09 06:00:08 <Dekaritae> No other channels work
Jun 09 06:00:20 <RST38h> Also, when you say 24Mbps, how do you measure it? Where is the other endpoint?
Jun 09 06:00:33 <Dekaritae> Currently < 3 feet
Jun 09 06:00:57 <RST38h> hehehe
Jun 09 06:01:01 <Dekaritae> Measure by speedtest.net
Jun 09 06:01:12 <RST38h> You are measuring it between two wifi clients 3 feet apart?
Jun 09 06:01:19 <RST38h> Ah, ok
Jun 09 06:01:37 <RST38h> How fast is your uplink then?
Jun 09 06:01:38 <Dekaritae> Yes, and with math against known speed from desktop to ISP
Jun 09 06:02:21 <Dekaritae> Varies
Jun 09 06:02:34 <Dekaritae> Peak 3M
Jun 09 06:02:40 <Dekaritae> But rarely
Jun 09 06:03:00 <Dekaritae> ~ 300 ping
Jun 09 06:03:04 * infobot throws ping down a well for making yet another 300 joke.
Jun 09 06:03:17 <Dekaritae> Er
Jun 09 06:03:19 <KotCzarny> hehe
Jun 09 06:03:28 <KotCzarny> now that was actually funny
Jun 09 06:03:51 <Dekaritae> ????? ?????
Jun 09 06:04:01 <KotCzarny> imagine ping as a spartan
Jun 09 06:04:09 <KotCzarny> and what it can do to firewalls
Jun 09 06:04:19 <Dekaritae> Madness
Jun 09 06:04:44 <KotCzarny> exactly.
Jun 09 06:06:37 <RST38h> Deka: Ok. Your uplonk is 3MB/sec. You are measuring speed from your machine through the router through the uplink to speedtest.com
Jun 09 06:06:52 <Dekaritae> Yes
Jun 09 06:06:59 <RST38h> Deka: You are getting 24Mbd which is exactly 3MB/sec
Jun 09 06:07:11 <RST38h> Deka: So, what is your problem?
Jun 09 06:07:21 <Dekaritae> No problem yet
Jun 09 06:07:32 <KotCzarny> high ping is the problem
Jun 09 06:07:36 <RST38h> Ah
Jun 09 06:07:41 <Dekaritae> Have not tried streaming PC to N800 music
Jun 09 06:07:43 <KotCzarny> and probably packet retransmits
Jun 09 06:09:49 <RST38h> Deka: Do a traceroute a few times and see which part of the route causes ping delay
Jun 09 06:10:29 <Dekaritae> In bit
Jun 09 06:11:24 <Dekaritae> Looking for USB drive enclosure with AA power
Jun 09 06:12:24 <Dekaritae> Yay
Jun 09 06:12:25 <Dekaritae> http://www.bixnet.com/60poushadrwi.html
Jun 09 06:12:51 <Dekaritae> Yay. Connects mini-B, so no drain on N800 port
Jun 09 06:13:39 <KotCzarny> Powered from USB port and internal battery
Jun 09 06:13:44 <KotCzarny> o.o
Jun 09 06:13:47 <KotCzarny> both?
Jun 09 06:14:23 <Dekaritae> Assuming draw on USB to save battery
Jun 09 06:14:40 <keesj> Dekaritae: it looks like an ovwersized mp3 player
Jun 09 06:14:49 <Dekaritae> Camoflage
Jun 09 06:15:54 <keesj> it is probably heavyer then the n8x0 :p
Jun 09 06:17:29 <Dekaritae> So I make long cable
Jun 09 06:18:00 <KotCzarny> just buy 2x32gb sd cards ;)
Jun 09 06:19:48 <keesj> or use upnp, that is what this device was designed for
Jun 09 06:20:24 <RST38h> it is an oversized mp3 player!
Jun 09 06:20:32 <keesj> recent Canola version support upnp (I have not tried it yes)
Jun 09 06:20:40 <Dekaritae> Recommend a server?
Jun 09 06:20:54 <qwerty12> Check the canola forum for ones that work.
Jun 09 06:21:17 <Dekaritae> oki
Jun 09 06:21:51 <keesj> "Super scale LCD screen" lol
Jun 09 06:23:06 <RST38h> Deka: I think Caonla guys recommend a server
Jun 09 06:23:38 <GeneralAntilles> FUPPES
Jun 09 06:23:52 <GeneralAntilles> MediaTomb is preferred by many, though.
Jun 09 06:23:56 <patoh> ls
Jun 09 06:23:58 <patoh> oops
Jun 09 06:24:21 * johnx is kinda disappointed by browserd memory usage :/
Jun 09 06:24:48 <GeneralAntilles> patoh, IRC: ls: it's full of assholes
Jun 09 06:24:55 <qwerty12> s**tf**k, I have to reflash my N800 >.<. I've messed up me N800
Jun 09 06:25:04 <qwerty12> hcid keeps crashing :/
Jun 09 06:25:09 <johnx> ah
Jun 09 06:25:10 <GeneralAntilles> qwerty12, and whose fault is that? :P
Jun 09 06:25:29 <KotCzarny> qwerty, do a backups
Jun 09 06:25:33 <qwerty12> GeneralAntilles, Technically, I did say "I've messed up" :p
Jun 09 06:25:34 <GeneralAntilles> johnx, file a bug on that so timeless can kick your ass. :P
Jun 09 06:25:41 <KotCzarny> every day before starting to break your device
Jun 09 06:25:46 <johnx> GeneralAntilles, sounds like fun
Jun 09 06:25:59 <KotCzarny> if your os is cloned it should be trivial
Jun 09 06:26:05 <qwerty12> I'm taking the easy way out, I'm making a Diablo rootfs, I can't be arsed with this flash chinook crap
Jun 09 06:26:23 <GeneralAntilles> Why not just rsync or tar it or something?
Jun 09 06:26:57 <qwerty12> I need to make a new, clean rootfs, I can't be bothered to go through installing diablo again for the 7th time using the SSU method
Jun 09 06:27:11 <qwerty12> So I'll just extract it all of the computer
Jun 09 06:27:15 <KotCzarny> qwerty, make. a. backup.
Jun 09 06:27:16 <KotCzarny> :)
Jun 09 06:27:27 <KotCzarny> of the running os
Jun 09 06:27:30 <KotCzarny> :)
Jun 09 06:27:31 <Dekaritae> Is there a way to disable touchscreen wakeup?
Jun 09 06:27:43 <Dekaritae> This feature I dislike
Jun 09 06:27:48 <KotCzarny> dekaritae: yes, click power button
Jun 09 06:27:55 <KotCzarny> then 'lock the keys and screen'
Jun 09 06:28:24 <qwerty12> KotCzarny, Will do after I've reflashed
Jun 09 06:28:31 <KotCzarny> :)
Jun 09 06:28:53 <KotCzarny> qwerty: and make sure it restores cleanly :)
Jun 09 06:30:27 <qwerty12> Heh, I remember when I made a backup of the icons and it messed up, johnx saved my behind then :)
Jun 09 06:33:16 <Navi> johnx, you use up too much of my memory
Jun 09 06:34:08 <Dekaritae> I don't want to lock the keys ever
Jun 09 06:34:18 <Dekaritae> Just not to wakeup on screen touch
Jun 09 06:34:23 <KotCzarny> well
Jun 09 06:34:31 <KotCzarny> you can set brightness to minimum
Jun 09 06:35:10 <KotCzarny> ie. 0
Jun 09 06:35:12 <Dekaritae> Hob
Jun 09 06:35:22 <KotCzarny> adv-backlight
Jun 09 06:35:29 <KotCzarny> or whatever it was called
Jun 09 06:35:44 <Dekaritae> Mebbe
Jun 09 06:36:00 <Dekaritae> Mebbe I need a case it can't be touch through
Jun 09 06:36:49 <RST38h> Actually, waking up on a certain gesture is a nice idea
Jun 09 06:37:03 <RST38h> Like, you draw a cross or a circle and it wakes up
Jun 09 06:37:31 <KotCzarny> rst, that would suck battery in pocket
Jun 09 06:37:34 <KotCzarny> etc
Jun 09 06:37:40 <RST38h> Why?
Jun 09 06:37:50 <KotCzarny> constant analyzing of the x input
Jun 09 06:38:04 <RST38h> Until your stylus touch the screen, it will suck the same amount as today
Jun 09 06:38:19 <RST38h> Once it touches the screen, it may suck a bit more, but that is a rare event
Jun 09 06:38:42 <KotCzarny> and how do you differentiate between stylus and trash in your pocket?
Jun 09 06:39:07 <KotCzarny> (more analyzing)
Jun 09 06:39:19 <RST38h> true
Jun 09 06:39:50 <RST38h> but then, the current implementation just wakes up on any touch, trash or not
Jun 09 06:40:12 <RST38h> so it can't be worse
Jun 09 06:40:31 <KotCzarny> not unless you leave it unlocked
Jun 09 06:40:37 <RST38h> correct
Jun 09 06:40:54 <RST38h> but the lock switch is not going anywhere, gestures or not
Jun 09 06:41:11 <KotCzarny> power button is well postioned
Jun 09 06:41:22 <KotCzarny> so it's hard for it to be pressed accidentally
Jun 09 06:41:55 <GeneralAntilles> Softpower off is working better in Diablo
Jun 09 06:42:01 <Dekaritae> Vafa
Jun 09 06:42:02 <GeneralAntilles> Which is a nice solution.
Jun 09 06:42:03 <RST38h> http://gizmodo.com/5014392/cruzin-cooler-operator-gets-charged-with-dwi
Jun 09 06:44:21 * qwerty12 isn't entirely sure this rootfs idea is gonna work, I'm probably gonna have to reflash and then use 0xFFFF to dump a rootfs
Jun 09 06:44:39 <KotCzarny> bah.
Jun 09 06:44:55 <KotCzarny> use cp -a
Jun 09 06:44:58 <KotCzarny> or rsync
Jun 09 06:45:05 <KotCzarny> or tar
Jun 09 06:45:07 <qwerty12> Nah, I want a file that I can flash with the flasher
Jun 09 06:45:18 <qwerty12> I don't want to be reflashing chinook and untarring everytime
Jun 09 06:45:27 <RST38h> qwerty <== 100% right
Jun 09 06:45:30 <qwerty12> That's the point of a rootfs, something that I can flash and be done with
Jun 09 06:45:34 <KotCzarny> make your own script and add it to the initfs
Jun 09 06:45:55 <qwerty12> KotCzarny, Why do the extra work when I can just dump a jffs2 image?
Jun 09 06:46:06 <Dekaritae> You talk like cagey tigers
Jun 09 06:46:13 <qwerty12> I'd still have to modify the initfs image anyway which is jffs2
Jun 09 06:46:39 <KotCzarny> it can be anything
Jun 09 06:46:44 <KotCzarny> or you can remount it rw
Jun 09 06:48:03 <qwerty12> But my SSH doesn't work anyway and I'd have to waste time running the initfs flasher in chinook or reflash an initfs with the flasher (while I note, I could be flashing the rootfs)
Jun 09 06:48:12 <Dekaritae> I haf stickers
Jun 09 06:48:20 <Dekaritae> Cannot decide whether N800 is autobot or decepticon
Jun 09 06:48:35 <qwerty12> My N800 is a ladies man
Jun 09 06:48:38 <RST38h> General: Remember ITT thread about marketing?
Jun 09 06:48:51 <RST38h> General: The "PC Mag gives N810 3/6"?
Jun 09 06:48:52 <KotCzarny> qwerty: then do what suits you, but please, don't grouch :)
Jun 09 06:49:39 <qwerty12> I ain't grouching ;) but my idea's a lot easier
Jun 09 06:49:47 * KotCzarny nods
Jun 09 06:49:59 <KotCzarny> easier for you
Jun 09 06:50:00 <KotCzarny> :)
Jun 09 06:50:19 <gomiam> omg wtf rotfl
Jun 09 06:50:50 <gomiam> I have been searched for by a chinese RFID tags maker on Google
Jun 09 06:51:00 <gomiam> and found through this channel's log
Jun 09 06:51:01 <gomiam> XDD
Jun 09 06:51:14 <qwerty12> Well, Set up Diablo one time > Backup rootfs > Reflash with flasher > Profit. Set up Diablo > Rsync rootfs > Reflash Chinook > Reflash initfs flasher > modify linuxrc to untar rootfs.
Jun 09 06:51:21 <gomiam> s/searched/looked/
Jun 09 06:51:39 <KotCzarny> gomiam: or some employee with n8x0 and too much free time?
Jun 09 06:51:40 <KotCzarny> :)
Jun 09 06:53:05 <RST38h> gomiam: did he tag you?
Jun 09 06:53:19 <RST38h> as in "tagged and released"
Jun 09 06:53:47 <KotCzarny> tag! you are it!
Jun 09 06:55:19 <GeneralAntilles> RST38h, maybe, they're all kinda blurred together into one massive, horrifying super-thread.
Jun 09 06:59:36 <GeneralAntilles> RST38h, this the one?
Jun 09 06:59:36 <GeneralAntilles> http://www.internettablettalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=14893
Jun 09 06:59:41 <GeneralAntilles> Seems like it's not.
Jun 09 07:00:16 <RST38h> General: Remember my urinal + drinking fountain example?
Jun 09 07:00:25 <GeneralAntilles> Vaguely
Jun 09 07:00:27 <patoh> that was the wrong time to join
Jun 09 07:00:27 <GeneralAntilles> Get me the link. :P
Jun 09 07:00:37 <patoh> well read the backlog anyway :P
Jun 09 07:00:49 <RST38h> General: a moment
Jun 09 07:00:53 <GeneralAntilles> http://www.internettablettalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=17027&page=17
Jun 09 07:00:55 <GeneralAntilles> There it is.
Jun 09 07:01:49 <RST38h> http://www.internettablettalk.com/forums/showpost.php?p=149130&postcount=159
Jun 09 07:02:17 * RST38h was purposely creating the most unrealistic example
Jun 09 07:02:44 <RST38h> Butr guess what? http://gizmodo.com/5014355/onda-urinal-concept-changes-the-question-did-you-wash-yours-hands-while-going-to-the-bathroom
Jun 09 07:03:09 <GeneralAntilles> Ha
Jun 09 07:03:11 <GeneralAntilles> Gross
Jun 09 07:03:21 * RST38h feels uneasy of making examples and predicting things now
Jun 09 07:03:32 <rm_you> yoyo
Jun 09 07:03:40 <GeneralAntilles> Just don't make any examples about Nazi robots taking over the world, please. ;)
Jun 09 07:03:42 <RST38h> 'cause if at least 10% of his predictions turn true....
Jun 09 07:04:17 <RST38h> General: Actually, I have a different fate for the world =)
Jun 09 07:04:35 <KotCzarny> predict fall of nwo
Jun 09 07:05:07 <RST38h> But on the matter of nazi robots: http://www.ironsky.net/site/?p=16
Jun 09 07:06:07 <RST38h> Kot: to begin with, I predict the replacement of USAF with automated aircraft
Jun 09 07:06:28 <RST38h> Kot: And Boeing/Lokheed/whatever getting a contract for piloting them
Jun 09 07:06:33 <KotCzarny> that's already being done
Jun 09 07:06:45 <KotCzarny> fly by wire etc.
Jun 09 07:06:56 <RST38h> Kot: Yep. And the USAF is being reorganized as we speak
Jun 09 07:07:29 <RST38h> Kot: But the drones are still being piloted by the military. I am pretty sure that they will outsource it to drone manufacturers who already do the maintenance anyway
Jun 09 07:07:50 <GeneralAntilles> I don't see that happening.
Jun 09 07:07:59 <RST38h> General: A moment
Jun 09 07:08:55 <RST38h> General: http://www.strategypage.com/htmw/htlead/articles/20080608.aspx
Jun 09 07:09:27 <RST38h> Kot: Then they will start looking for places to bomb (again)
Jun 09 07:09:33 <Dekaritae> http://lifehacker.com/394706/touchpad-pro-turns-your-iphone-or-ipod-touch-into-a-trackpad-mouse
Jun 09 07:10:12 <GeneralAntilles> Dekaritae, you can do that with an OS X machine and any internet-enabled device with RemoteBuddy.
Jun 09 07:10:17 <KotCzarny> pf. x2x
Jun 09 07:10:41 <Dekaritae> I could do with my Palm devices using Salling Clicker
Jun 09 07:25:58 <GeneralAntilles> Woo
Jun 09 07:25:59 <GeneralAntilles> http://www.engadget.com/2008/06/09/thecus-unveils-the-massive-n7700-eight-bay-nas/
Jun 09 07:26:17 <GeneralAntilles> Combine ten 770s and they become a giant NAS?
Jun 09 07:27:01 <patoh> to many 0's :P
Jun 09 07:27:05 <patoh> well one to many
Jun 09 07:27:23 <KotCzarny> 'too'
Jun 09 07:27:31 <GeneralAntilles> 770 * 10 = 7700 :P
Jun 09 07:27:39 <RST38h> General: and a large screen lcd tv
Jun 09 07:28:05 * GeneralAntilles shoulda bought more 770s when they were cheap.
Jun 09 07:28:18 <Dekaritae> Reference thread regarding local Xvnc server and VNCViewer to run non-hildon apps
Jun 09 07:37:53 <keesj> how about such an adapter http://www.bixnet.com/usbcawibuba.html
Jun 09 07:39:25 <keesj> it remains a lot of calble
Jun 09 07:39:57 <RST38h> heh, brilliant (in a way)
Jun 09 07:40:56 <keesj> I also have a Y cable and I can attacht a phone charger to it (this has the same neto result)
Jun 09 07:41:36 <keesj> the same site sels those cable for 8 $ , and that is a faire price IMHO
Jun 09 07:56:20 <X-Fade> timeless: Thanks for the ping on #1671.
Jun 09 07:58:35 <GAN800> X-Fade, the wiki login page needs to be revised to mention the garage, and maybe provide a link to the garage registration page.
Jun 09 07:59:59 <X-Fade> GAN800: I already tried to edit it yesterday. But there is no edit function for that.
Jun 09 08:00:19 <GAN800> I was poking at it too.
Jun 09 08:00:54 <GAN800> Couldn't figure it out. There are a bunch of Mediawiki:login things, but none of them seem to be the right one.
Jun 09 08:01:52 <X-Fade> Yeah, and you can't edit the Special: page for it.
Jun 09 08:02:08 <GAN800> Gotta be some way to do it.
Jun 09 08:02:21 <GAN800> What mediawiki version are we on?
Jun 09 08:03:42 <X-Fade> 1.12.0
Jun 09 08:04:51 <keesj> I was migging the editing help on the new wiki yesterday
Jun 09 08:08:24 <GAN800> Also, maybe a bug, I have a new message banner that I can't get to go away, even after blanking my talk page. :/
Jun 09 08:10:53 <hrhr> If it's possible dump nand with some tool throught usb?
Jun 09 08:10:57 <hrhr> on n810
Jun 09 08:10:59 <hrhr> =)
Jun 09 08:11:15 <GAN800> 0xffff
Jun 09 08:11:52 <hrhr> ?
Jun 09 08:12:52 <GAN800> Google it.
Jun 09 08:13:02 <hrhr> ok
Jun 09 08:13:21 <GAN800> It's a third party flash t
Jun 09 08:13:35 <GAN800> flasher tool that should do what you need.
Jun 09 08:13:48 <hrhr> ok,just find it
Jun 09 08:15:52 <hrhr> GAN800: how about stability of it?
Jun 09 08:16:01 <hrhr> can it crash my device&
Jun 09 08:16:03 <hrhr> ?
Jun 09 08:16:20 <[nine]> for dumping flash, it's hardly a concern.
Jun 09 08:16:30 <johnx> works fine here
Jun 09 08:16:56 <hrhr> thx, will try
Jun 09 08:25:58 <KotCzarny> mtdtools would also work
Jun 09 08:29:25 <hrhr> mtdtools as I understand works directly from tablet, I want throught usb
Jun 09 08:31:13 <KotCzarny> 0xffff won't work through usb too.
Jun 09 08:31:36 <hrhr> da nu
Jun 09 08:32:18 <hrhr> 0xfff local tool which run in tablet?
Jun 09 08:32:48 <KotCzarny> onenand flash isn't exposed via usb
Jun 09 08:33:21 <rm_you> GAN800: hrm
Jun 09 08:33:34 <rm_you> GAN800: can't figure out how to change the alignment on those number boxes
Jun 09 08:34:00 <KotCzarny> rm_you: tear it down to the foundation, build again :>
Jun 09 08:34:01 <keesj> hrhr: come on hrhr, what kind of luxury do you want?
Jun 09 08:34:11 <GAN800> That I'm certain there's example code around for. ;)
Jun 09 08:35:32 <rm_you> GAN800: well, they are a custom Hildon Widget, not a standard GTK thing...
Jun 09 08:36:54 <RST38h> Gan: btw, did you have a chance to make those arrow icons?
Jun 09 08:38:36 <GAN800> Not yet, I'll get around to it as soon as my AC gets replaced today or tomorrow.
Jun 09 08:39:39 <rm_you> GAN800: oh nm i see what you were talking about
Jun 09 08:40:33 <RST38h> ack.
Jun 09 09:17:56 <zap> Anybody had ever problems with enabling USB host on a N810? I have two things here, one works fine and other doesn't see anything I connect to it (same cable, same USB pen drive)
Jun 09 09:18:12 <AStorm> hm?
Jun 09 09:18:25 <AStorm> same thing, and you're saying "other" doesn't?
Jun 09 09:18:27 <AStorm> wtf?
Jun 09 09:18:31 <AStorm> explain clearer
Jun 09 09:18:33 <X-Fade> zap: Other OS version?
Jun 09 09:18:35 <zap> I have two N810s
Jun 09 09:18:37 <zap> no\
Jun 09 09:18:38 <AStorm> ah
Jun 09 09:18:44 * [nine] tries to work out how long he's been trying to get a 16GB sdhc card working on his N800 for before changing the partition type to an lba variant and it suddenly working
Jun 09 09:18:47 <AStorm> well, it works here
Jun 09 09:18:48 <zap> flashed them both with the same firmware
Jun 09 09:18:52 <AStorm> it should work everywhere
Jun 09 09:19:02 <AStorm> maybe one N810 of yours is damaged
Jun 09 09:19:08 <zap> I use the usbcontrol python script
Jun 09 09:19:32 <zap> when I enable Host mode, the one that works switches from b_idle to a_wait_vrise
Jun 09 09:19:41 <zap> the other stays in b_idle
Jun 09 09:20:00 <zap> peripherial mode on both works fine
Jun 09 09:21:31 <AStorm> i don't know that script
Jun 09 09:22:46 <zap> doesn't matter, cat /sys/whatever/state shows b_idle as well
Jun 09 09:23:22 <andre___> sounds a bit like https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=3026
Jun 09 09:23:51 <zap> aha!
Jun 09 09:24:15 <andre___> feel free to add comments, vote for that bug, or apply the patch and add feedback
Jun 09 09:24:35 <zap> yes, that's it, thank you very much
Jun 09 09:25:08 <andre___> sure, np
Jun 09 09:25:38 <andre___> hmm, i need to escalate for that one to get the patch in quickly
Jun 09 09:26:34 <zap> would be cool to have that fixed in Diablo
Jun 09 09:32:25 <andre___> zap: let me see what I can do - at least having it in an update must be possible
Jun 09 09:48:14 <zap> andre___: will it help pushing the patch if I'll just my two cents to that report?
Jun 09 09:48:39 <andre___> it can never hurt to have "patch works for me" comments
Jun 09 09:49:04 <andre___> i dislike "i want that feature too" comments because we have a voting system, but volunteers testing patches and giving feedback is MOST welcome!
Jun 09 09:52:08 <zap> :) I'm not able yet to build a patched kernel, unfortunately
Jun 09 09:53:08 <andre___> voting is also ok. just make noise :)
Jun 09 10:53:26 <lardman> morning
Jun 09 10:53:59 <dneary> Morning
Jun 09 10:54:10 <lardman> hi dneary
Jun 09 10:54:10 <dneary> how're things in Bath?
Jun 09 10:54:22 <lardman> sunny and warm :)
Jun 09 10:54:42 <lardman> and in France (?)
Jun 09 10:55:28 <dneary> kind of cloudy
Jun 09 10:55:36 <dneary> But I can see some blue sky from here
Jun 09 10:56:14 <dneary> Lots of blue skies today actually
Jun 09 10:56:21 <dneary> But it's not expected to last
Jun 09 10:56:52 <lardman> I'm shocked we've had 3 passable days in a row here, supposed to be summer after all, where's the rain? ;)
Jun 09 10:58:11 <dneary> It's over here :)
Jun 09 11:01:04 <lardman> the problem with nice sunny weather is I'm less inclined to sit in front of the PC in the evening and do anything
Jun 09 11:01:44 <ido--> 'lo
Jun 09 11:01:51 <ido--> is there a way to safe boot the n770
Jun 09 11:02:05 <ido--> or at restore OS
Jun 09 11:02:12 <ido--> cus it keeps on rebooting
Jun 09 11:22:34 <lardman> ido--: what did you install to make it do that?
Jun 09 11:24:02 <ido--> hrm stuff to do with hildon
Jun 09 11:24:16 <ido--> some os2008 stuff on an os2007
Jun 09 11:24:20 <lardman> ido--: to make it boot, you can use the flasher to disable the lifeguard
Jun 09 11:24:29 <lardman> otherwise you'll need to reflash it
Jun 09 11:24:53 <ido--> it boots
Jun 09 11:24:58 <ido--> it just reboots :p
Jun 09 11:25:01 <ido--> hrmf
Jun 09 11:25:03 <lardman> to make it start up then
Jun 09 11:25:04 <ido--> already reflashed it
Jun 09 11:25:10 <lardman> fair enough
Jun 09 11:25:27 <lardman> next time look at how to set the R&D flags
Jun 09 11:25:36 <ido--> how sensative is the screen on the n770 ?
Jun 09 11:25:51 <lardman> I touch it, it notices. ?
Jun 09 11:26:03 <ido--> touch soft, hard ?
Jun 09 11:26:19 <ido--> cus my screen is a little defective
Jun 09 11:26:21 <ido--> i think
Jun 09 11:26:25 <lardman> no objective figures, but works fine for me, I don't have to press too hard
Jun 09 11:26:32 <ido--> i bought it on ebay
Jun 09 11:26:36 <lardman> ido--: could be the sw
Jun 09 11:27:25 <ido--> was like that on os2006
Jun 09 11:27:29 <ido--> and now on 2007 too
Jun 09 11:28:41 <lardman> dunno I'm afraid
Jun 09 11:28:57 <lardman> there were lots of threads about this on itt, & also on the ml iirc
Jun 09 11:29:12 * [nine] grumbles about the "Inconsistency detected by ld.so" error
Jun 09 11:29:14 <ido--> ml / itt ?
Jun 09 11:29:50 <[nine]> scratchbox wouldn't install on amd64, so i setup an i386 chroot and installed scratchbox into that. now it won't start!
Jun 09 11:30:06 <lardman> mailing list
Jun 09 11:30:08 <lardman> ~itt
Jun 09 11:30:12 <infobot> [itt] the forums on internettablettalk.com ( http://internettablettalk.com/forums )
Jun 09 11:30:23 <wnd> [nine], restarting scratchbox-core usually helps with my installation
Jun 09 11:30:49 <wnd> of course if you haven't started it in the first place, well, start it
Jun 09 11:30:57 <[nine]> :D, yuss, it's started.
Jun 09 11:31:04 <lcuk> ok, who teleported me from manchester: its sunny and hot
Jun 09 11:31:24 <lardman> Where would I find the source for bluez-utils-3.28 which is used in Diablo?
Jun 09 11:31:40 <lcuk> hi marius
Jun 09 11:31:42 <wnd> however right now my scratchbox 1 seems to be all messed up, "Inconsistency detected by ld.so: rtld.c: 1192: dl_main: Assertion `(void *) ph->p_vaddr == _rtld_local._dl_sysinfo_dso' failed!", and I haven't had to look into it at all
Jun 09 11:32:06 <wnd> in other words, sounds like we have the same problem
Jun 09 11:32:08 <[nine]> yeah, that's what i'm getting.
Jun 09 11:32:30 <[nine]> COMPAT_VDSO is disabled in the kernel (debian 2.6.25-2-amd64).
Jun 09 11:32:48 <[nine]> it works on the i386 laptop i have, setting vm.vdso_enabled to 0.
Jun 09 11:33:57 <lardman> ah, https://stage.maemo.org/svn/maemo/projects/connectivity/
Jun 09 11:34:53 * [nine] wonders if he can scrape together some crufty i386 machine to sit in the corner to do builds
Jun 09 11:36:28 <lardman> [nine]: ignore the fact it won't install, do it manually
Jun 09 11:36:38 <lardman> used to work on x86_64 for me
Jun 09 11:36:51 <[nine]> lardman: most of the binaries don't seem to work.
Jun 09 11:37:05 <lardman> [nine]: make sure you have the 32bit libs installed too?
Jun 09 11:37:41 <[nine]> lardman: ia32-libs are installed, but the problem seems to be elsewhere.
Jun 09 11:37:58 <mgedmin> hi lcuk
Jun 09 11:38:01 <lardman> hmm, oh well, used to work for me
Jun 09 11:38:17 <[nine]> even running "ldd /scratchbox/tools/bin/python" makes it complain about ld.so inconsistency.
Jun 09 11:38:27 <[nine]> and that's not even executing the binary.
Jun 09 11:38:47 <mgedmin> wnd: known problem with a known fix
Jun 09 11:39:18 <[nine]> mgedmin: afaik, the known fix is "downgrade to an earlier kernel"?
Jun 09 11:39:21 <mgedmin> sudo sysctl -w vm.vdso_enabled=0
Jun 09 11:39:25 <mgedmin> is a much simpler fix
Jun 09 11:39:40 <[nine]> that file doesn't exist.
Jun 09 11:39:48 <[nine]> neither does kernel.vdso
Jun 09 11:39:59 <mgedmin> and then when you get mmap: Permission denied, the fix is
Jun 09 11:40:02 <mgedmin> sudo sysctl -w vm.mmap_min_addr=4096
Jun 09 11:40:10 <mgedmin> nine, what file doesn't exist?
Jun 09 11:40:22 <[nine]> /proc/sys/vm/vdso_enabled
Jun 09 11:40:23 <mgedmin> /proc/sys/vm/vdso_enabled?
Jun 09 11:40:32 <mgedmin> are you looking inside scratchbox or outside?
Jun 09 11:40:36 <mgedmin> you need to look outside
Jun 09 11:40:36 <[nine]> outside.
Jun 09 11:40:40 <mgedmin> then strange
Jun 09 11:40:42 <wnd> % zgrep VDSO /proc/config.gz
Jun 09 11:40:42 <wnd> # CONFIG_COMPAT_VDSO is not set
Jun 09 11:40:43 <[nine]> mmm.
Jun 09 11:40:57 <wnd> I think [nine] already said that
Jun 09 11:41:05 * mgedmin doesn't have /proc/config.gz
Jun 09 11:41:19 <[nine]> seems to be something with debian's amd64 kernels.
Jun 09 11:41:34 <mgedmin> I wish people would just fix scratchbox to work with modern kernels, if that's possible
Jun 09 11:41:38 <[nine]> /proc/sys/vm/vdso_enabled exists on the i386 kernels, and scratchbox works.
Jun 09 11:41:51 <wnd> mgedmin, what about /boot/config-$(uname -r)?
Jun 09 11:42:12 <mgedmin> mg@platonas:~ $ grep -i vdso /boot/config-`uname -r`
Jun 09 11:42:12 <mgedmin> # CONFIG_COMPAT_VDSO is not set
Jun 09 11:42:29 <mgedmin> ah, amd64
Jun 09 11:42:32 <mgedmin> haven't tried that one
Jun 09 11:42:43 * lardman wishes nokia to get on and release Diablo so he can debug sbc without having to backport the changes to bluez-utils-3.20
Jun 09 11:43:06 <wnd> anyway, this wasn't a problem with pre-2.6.25 debian packaged amd64-kernels
Jun 09 11:43:29 <wnd> I wonder if this problem is even valid with sb2
Jun 09 11:43:48 <mgedmin> the mmap one is
Jun 09 11:43:50 <mgedmin> not sure about vdso
Jun 09 11:45:22 * mgedmin should learn not to jump into the middle of a discussion
Jun 09 11:46:26 <wnd> what would irc be without it?
Jun 09 11:54:44 <lopz> hola
Jun 09 12:00:24 * aquatix has the idle hope that diablo is late because nokia is putting in a new gecko version
Jun 09 12:16:13 * lardman wonders if he should try Diablo again, despite not being able to reboot
Jun 09 12:17:54 <X-Fade> lardman: Q2 is still a few weeks. So it can at least between 1 day and 21, _if_ they will release in Q2 :)
Jun 09 12:18:36 <lardman> X-Fade: yeah, I just want to debug the sbc stuff, and bluez-utils-3.28 (which is used in Diablo) doens't need any changes
Jun 09 12:19:01 <lardman> whereas to go back to 3.20 which is in chinook I need to do some backporting
Jun 09 12:26:39 <ido--> how can i mount a smbfs drive on my n770 ?
Jun 09 12:27:13 <lardman> ido--: There's a wizard in downloads/extras iirc, I can't rememeber the name of the top of my head though
Jun 09 12:28:01 <ido--> it didnt work
Jun 09 12:28:04 <ido--> for some reason
Jun 09 12:29:56 <Anunakin> what u OS? 2007 or 2008HE ?
Jun 09 12:30:01 <lardman> Google then is the best bet, and try some options - there seem to be lots: smbmount, mount + smbfs, cifs
Jun 09 12:30:02 <rm_you> lardman: how goes it?
Jun 09 12:30:03 <Anunakin> I think u need 2008He
Jun 09 12:30:13 <rm_you> lardman: got your stuff compiled yet? :P
Jun 09 12:30:14 <lardman> rm_you: not bad, you?
Jun 09 12:30:22 <rm_you> making progress on 0.9b
Jun 09 12:30:24 <rm_you> :P
Jun 09 12:30:29 <ido--> os2007
Jun 09 12:30:30 <rm_you> got most of my TODOs done
Jun 09 12:30:32 <_Zap__> what is the meaning of this warning: We could not read lowmem page stats ??
Jun 09 12:30:33 <lardman> compiled but segfaulting when compiled as part of bluez-utils
Jun 09 12:30:34 <ido--> HE
Jun 09 12:30:36 <rm_you> :(
Jun 09 12:31:00 <rm_you> you would have thought making the driver work would be the hard part >_>
Jun 09 12:31:05 <_Zap__> i try to start my application from the task navigator but it only shows some loading text and doesn't open
Jun 09 12:31:09 <lardman> strange, as if I compile sbcenc in a single line gcc command (after removing the VERSION #define) it works
Jun 09 12:31:20 <rm_you> >_>
Jun 09 12:31:21 <lardman> rm_you: you and me both :)
Jun 09 12:31:24 <ido--> whats the best pdf reader ?
Jun 09 12:31:30 <rm_you> heh
Jun 09 12:31:45 * rm_you is *still* working on tracking down a crash bug
Jun 09 12:32:04 <rm_you> is there a way to actually find out WHY my statusbar applet crashes?
Jun 09 12:32:14 <lardman> rm_you: It would be good if Diablo were released, as the 3.28 version of Bluez-utils in there uses the same interface to the sbc functions; the version I use in chinook (3.20) is different and I'm not sure I've hacked the code in the right way
Jun 09 12:32:20 <rm_you> is there a way to start an strace on a program thats already running?
Jun 09 12:32:37 <Blafasel> Afaik yes
Jun 09 12:32:42 <Blafasel> with -p pid or something
Jun 09 12:32:46 <rm_you> lardman: would love to see diablo out... <_< but is that going to be os2009? or what?
Jun 09 12:32:55 <rm_you> i'm out of the diablo loop
Jun 09 12:32:57 <rm_you> <_<
Jun 09 12:33:10 <lardman> rm_you: no, 2008.1 or something like that, just a minor upgrade
Jun 09 12:33:13 <Blafasel> manpage agrees: -ppid
Jun 09 12:33:57 <rm_you> hrm
Jun 09 12:34:01 <rm_you> wonder if thatll work
Jun 09 12:34:15 * lardman looks for a decent gdb explanation
Jun 09 12:34:21 <andre___> yeah, i think diablo is a minor upgrade
Jun 09 12:35:50 <mgedmin> rm_you: can you reproduce your crash in scratchbox on x86?
Jun 09 12:35:55 <mgedmin> if so, valgrind can be a big help
Jun 09 12:36:16 <rm_you> mgedmin: would be hard for a statusbar app i think?
Jun 09 12:36:23 <rm_you> dunno, never set up the x86 build environment
Jun 09 12:36:39 <rm_you> i always just build for arm and copy the stuff over to my n800 to test
Jun 09 12:36:51 <rm_you> i suppose it would be a better workflow if i could test locally :P
Jun 09 12:37:03 <lardman> rm_you: print out messages, do it the old fashioned way :)
Jun 09 12:37:12 <rm_you> lol
Jun 09 12:37:15 <rm_you> how
Jun 09 12:37:22 <rm_you> statusbar app prints to... ?!?
Jun 09 12:37:33 <ido--> is a n800 much faster then a n770 ?
Jun 09 12:37:41 <ido--> i mean, usage wise
Jun 09 12:37:50 <ido--> is it an enough reason to get an 800 ?
Jun 09 12:38:15 <Blafasel> rm_you: Print to a file? Who cares, should work ;)
Jun 09 12:38:22 <lardman> rm_you: where does stderr go to?
Jun 09 12:38:23 <rm_you> lol
Jun 09 12:38:49 <mgedmin> /tmp/debug.log is sane
Jun 09 12:38:52 <lardman> printing to a file is bad unless you make sure it flushes after each write
Jun 09 12:38:54 <rm_you> printf("entering loop 1.... id = %d", i)
Jun 09 12:38:55 <rm_you> lol
Jun 09 12:39:15 <lardman> don't knock it, that's how DSP debugging is done :S
Jun 09 12:39:15 <mgedmin> rm_you: yes, debugging a statusbar app is hard
Jun 09 12:39:24 <rm_you> yeah i know, i do it a lot that way :P
Jun 09 12:39:25 <rm_you> but still
Jun 09 12:39:28 <mgedmin> but my understanding is that debugging a statusbar app on x86 is easier than debugging it on arm
Jun 09 12:39:34 <rm_you> yeah prolly
Jun 09 12:39:36 * lcuk logs and debugs everything that way
Jun 09 12:39:36 <mgedmin> there was a howto somewhere...
Jun 09 12:39:58 <rm_you> yeah... wish i could print to stderr or something
Jun 09 12:40:03 <rm_you> and actually read it
Jun 09 12:40:10 <rm_you> too bad itos dumps all its logs >_<
Jun 09 12:40:17 <rm_you> no syslog, no real dmesg
Jun 09 12:40:18 <rm_you> >_>
Jun 09 12:40:48 <lcuk> open a port out to remote host and have your software blog about its day :)
Jun 09 12:41:47 <lcuk> 13:43 adv_backlight: w000t, the user clicked me!!!!! r0xxor
Jun 09 12:41:56 <lcuk> 13:43 adv_backlight: awww poo, he closed me down
Jun 09 12:41:57 <rm_you> lol
Jun 09 12:42:00 <aquatix> *g*
Jun 09 12:42:35 <rm_you> thought about having it send mail to nokia every time it got opened, complaining about lack of display applet source :P
Jun 09 12:42:52 <rm_you> but decided that'd prolly just annoy them
Jun 09 12:43:11 <aquatix> no shit ;)
Jun 09 12:43:17 <lcuk> no, you need to have it send a mail every time the slider is changed ;)
Jun 09 12:43:22 <X-Fade> rm_you: You can just install syslog and have your logs..
Jun 09 12:43:35 <rm_you> really?
Jun 09 12:43:40 <X-Fade> Sure.
Jun 09 12:43:55 <X-Fade> apt-get is your friend
Jun 09 12:44:08 <lcuk> simple solutions in a complex world :) thanks x-fade, i think you have just made rm's day
Jun 09 12:44:10 <monkeyiq> is liqbase available for d/load someplace that I missed ?
Jun 09 12:44:21 <rm_you> err
Jun 09 12:44:25 <rm_you> what repo is it in?
Jun 09 12:44:31 <lcuk> not yet its not
Jun 09 12:44:43 <monkeyiq> lcuk: k, thanks... :)
Jun 09 12:44:47 <rm_you> lcuk: did you release stuff yet? :P
Jun 09 12:45:03 <lcuk> monkeyiq, its not even feature complete yet, but will be soon
Jun 09 12:45:13 <X-Fade> rm_you: I think the sdk one, but I don't know exactly. I use it for debugging at least.
Jun 09 12:45:18 * lcuk has proven the concept at least
Jun 09 12:45:25 <monkeyiq> lcuk: just qgil making everyone dry mouthed for it before its in svn ;)
Jun 09 12:45:49 <lcuk> well tell qgil that ill put mine in svn when he puts his in :P
Jun 09 12:45:59 <monkeyiq> hehehehhe
Jun 09 12:46:26 <rm_you> X-Fade: gronmayer says "nothing was found for syslog in OS 2008" >_>
Jun 09 12:46:49 <lardman> I think it's called ksyslog
Jun 09 12:46:50 <lcuk> no, im over the moon at the response ive had - its been an eye opener and ill stop being n00bish about it all and give people some apps to play with
Jun 09 12:46:52 <rm_you> ah yeah
Jun 09 12:46:58 <rm_you> just did an apt-cache search
Jun 09 12:46:59 <lardman> does both kernel & sys logging
Jun 09 12:47:04 <X-Fade> rm_you: ksyslogd
Jun 09 12:47:12 <rm_you> sysklogd
Jun 09 12:47:20 <lcuk> right, back to the grind for a few hours
Jun 09 12:47:27 <lcuk> cyas soon
Jun 09 12:48:29 <X-Fade> rm_you: http://repository.maemo.org/pool/chinook/free/s/sysklogd/ :)
Jun 09 12:50:13 <X-Fade> rm_you: That is the SDK repo, not for end users but works for developers.
Jun 09 12:51:13 <rm_you> sweet
Jun 09 12:51:27 <rm_you> i got a copy of an strace when it crashed
Jun 09 12:51:40 <X-Fade> Be sure not to fill up your rootfs with logs ;)
Jun 09 12:52:55 <rm_you> http://pastebin.ca/1042867
Jun 09 12:52:59 <rm_you> anyone make sense of that?
Jun 09 12:53:29 <lardman> hey ssvb
Jun 09 12:53:43 <SDuensin> Morning!
Jun 09 12:54:43 * lardman is not fond of strace
Jun 09 12:55:02 <ssvb> hi lardman
Jun 09 12:55:09 <lardman> ssvb: how are things coming along with the colorspace converter?
Jun 09 12:55:42 <ssvb> lardman: not so smooth as I would like :)
Jun 09 12:56:06 <ssvb> lardman: looks like access to SDRAM memory from DSP is quite slow on 770
Jun 09 12:56:12 <lardman> I'm hopefully just finishing off the sbc encoder, and after that will come and lend you a hand
Jun 09 12:56:38 <lardman> ssvb: yes, how many frames can you push before the DSP gets bored and resets?
Jun 09 12:56:40 <rm_you> the NEXT LINE if it had worked normally would have been "poll([{fd=10, events=POLLIN}, {fd=6, events=POLLIN}, {fd=5, events=POLLIN}], 3, 0) = 0"
Jun 09 12:56:44 <rm_you> but it segfaulted
Jun 09 12:56:49 <rm_you> right after the close(15)
Jun 09 12:57:22 <rm_you> well, anyone have any other debugging tips for a statusbar applet that i can do ON the tablet?
Jun 09 12:57:39 <lardman> rm_you: fd=10,6,5 sound like likely segfault characters, perhaps
Jun 09 12:57:44 <ssvb> lardman: on the other hand, conversion done in DARAM or SARAM is extremely fast, only SDRAM is slowing down everything
Jun 09 12:57:44 <X-Fade> rm_you: Are you sure you want to poll on devices like this?
Jun 09 12:57:58 <rm_you> i dont know that it's me doing that
Jun 09 12:58:05 <rm_you> that's just from the strace
Jun 09 12:58:09 <lardman> ssvb: yeah, but the data has to be passed through SDRAM
Jun 09 12:58:14 <rm_you> comparing a normal strace to a broken strace
Jun 09 12:58:30 <lardman> ssvb: have you worked out any numbers for how slow/how many frames it might be able to do?
Jun 09 12:59:57 <ssvb> lardman: it is possible to get only ~25MB/s bandwidth for copying SDRAM->SDRAM from DSP according to my benchmarks
Jun 09 13:00:32 <ssvb> lardman: that's with 32-bit memory access, 16-bit access is twice slower
Jun 09 13:01:00 <lardman> a simple copy across needs ~12Mb/sec?
Jun 09 13:01:07 <lardman> for 30fps 800x480
Jun 09 13:01:22 <ssvb> lardman: so looks like DSP is roughly 4x slower than ARM core when working with memory, that's not good at all
Jun 09 13:01:58 <lardman> but it should be able to copy from MMU->DSP->MMU though within the 25Mb/sec
Jun 09 13:02:21 <ssvb> lardman: 640x480x12bpp * 30fps = ~14MB/s
Jun 09 13:03:14 <ssvb> lardman: and I'm still experimenting how much memory bandwidth is 'stolen' from ARM when DSP is extensively working with memory
Jun 09 13:03:49 <lardman> have you looked at how often the DSP can be polled without reseting? That was the problem I was having
Jun 09 13:04:08 <lardman> 30x per sec was far too much for my code (doing ioctls)
Jun 09 13:04:37 <ssvb> lardman: cat /proc/omap_clocks shows that DSP MMU is working at half frequency on 770 if I understand it right
Jun 09 13:04:47 <lardman> but then rewriting the code may overcome it, allowing the *_tctl fn to return more quickly
Jun 09 13:05:01 <lardman> ssvb: I don't know, sorry
Jun 09 13:05:22 <ssvb> lardman: maybe it is possible to increase this frequency, don't know if it would be severe overclocking
Jun 09 13:06:08 <ssvb> lardman: in any case, with slow memory, getting DMA working to fetch/store data asynchronously is very important
Jun 09 13:06:14 <lardman> The Nokias said they moved to using the ARM rather than DSP for video decoding as they couldn't push large frames fast enough
Jun 09 13:06:41 <ssvb> lardman: so data could be fetched to DARAM/SARAM, processed there and stored back
Jun 09 13:06:57 <rm_you> hrm, may have fixed it... we'll see.
Jun 09 13:07:31 <lardman> ssvb: doing iDCTs for example you mean?
Jun 09 13:07:37 <ssvb> lardman: yes, and DSP is rebooting occasionally
Jun 09 13:07:54 <ssvb> lardman: yes, IDCT or some high quality scaling
Jun 09 13:08:24 <lardman> ssvb: XvMC (or whatever the new thing replacing it is called) - that sort of stuff might be usefully implemented
Jun 09 13:08:40 <ssvb> lardman: XvMC is a bad thing
Jun 09 13:08:47 <lardman> ssvb: Why is that?
Jun 09 13:09:09 <lardman> ssvb: wrt scaling, you'll still have the bandwidth issue trying to push the frame data in and out
Jun 09 13:09:13 <ssvb> lardman: generally what we want is XvMC but done right :)
Jun 09 13:09:29 <ssvb> lardman: it has some API limitations
Jun 09 13:10:16 <lardman> ssvb: yes, hence the new thing Video Acceleration API (which doesn't seem to be used yet)
Jun 09 13:10:30 <lardman> ssvb: but XvMC would be somewhere to start at least
Jun 09 13:10:45 <lardman> ssvb: With applications able to use it, and therefore test if it works, etc
Jun 09 13:10:49 <ssvb> lardman: I want to implement a video accelerator specifically tuned for ffmpeg, without any extra bloat
Jun 09 13:11:16 <rm_you> nope didn't fix it
Jun 09 13:11:22 <lardman> ssvb: ok, sounds fair enough
Jun 09 13:11:50 <lardman> bbiam, got to pop to post office]
Jun 09 13:21:39 <rm_you> ok well, good luck lardman|afk, lcuk I hope you pick a good license soon, gnight everyone else :P
Jun 09 13:24:54 <aquatix> cya rm_you
Jun 09 13:26:40 <lardman> ~lart TheTrainLine
Jun 09 13:26:40 * infobot acting on orders from an unspecified client drags TheTrainLine into court suing for $200 million
Jun 09 13:28:39 <lardman> ssvb: Back to video colourspace/scaling
Jun 09 13:29:01 <lardman> ssvb: I wonder how fast a private bluk transfer to the DSP would be
Jun 09 13:29:26 <lardman> ssvb: I don't know how much overhead is incurred on the ARM side from such a write to the dsp device
Jun 09 13:29:43 <lardman> s/bluk/bulk
Jun 09 13:29:53 <ssvb> lardman: what's private bulk transfer?
Jun 09 13:30:05 <lardman> a way of transfering data without shared memory
Jun 09 13:30:22 <ssvb> lardman: I guess it would be a lot slower
Jun 09 13:30:33 <lardman> or did you work a way around the shared memory limit you were seeing?
Jun 09 13:30:52 <ssvb> lardman: if I understand it right, IPC buffer is in SDRAM
Jun 09 13:31:14 <lardman> I think so
Jun 09 13:31:16 <ssvb> lardman: my guess is that DSP memory bus is slow on 770
Jun 09 13:32:55 <ssvb> lardman: 'clock.c' from 'mach-omap1' directory has the following coment: "DSPMMU_CK == DSP_CK  or  DSPMMU_CK == DSP_CK/2"
Jun 09 13:33:11 <Anunakin> Any knows how to use r&d mode ?
Jun 09 13:33:30 <lardman> ssvb: So perhaps whoever wrote the code didn't know
Jun 09 13:33:39 <ssvb> lardman: on 770 DSPMMU seems to run at half frequency, I wonder if it is possible to make it run at full frequency
Jun 09 13:33:40 <lardman> ssvb: or it's a stability issue
Jun 09 13:34:11 <lardman> Anunakin: maemo.org search for "flasher"
Jun 09 13:34:39 <ssvb> lardman: yes, maybe that's one more tradeoff of using speed-selected chips, maybe memory bus had to be sacrificed to make it run at 252MHz
Jun 09 13:34:48 <ssvb> lardman: but that's only a guess
Jun 09 13:35:39 <ssvb> lardman: I did not benchmark N8x0 yet, maybe it can work faster with SDRAM
Jun 09 13:38:46 <ssvb> lardman: in any case, from the performance point of view, you should always read/write data as 32-bit values when accessing SDRAM
Jun 09 13:39:36 <lardman> hmm, that's certainly interesting as then there's the annoying endianness problem to deal with
Jun 09 13:43:15 <ssvb> lardman: the trick may be to bulk copy data to internal static memory and work with it there and after you are done - write back, it may be faster than working with SDRAM directly
Jun 09 13:44:52 <lardman> bulk copy won't have any advantages over shared memory as it also places the data in SDRAM iirc
Jun 09 13:45:32 <lardman> but certainly doing 32bit accesses/copies from SDRAM to faster SRAM and then accessing in 16bit chunks might be worth a look if needed
Jun 09 13:46:52 <ssvb> lardman: that's exactly what I tried to suggest
Jun 09 13:47:13 <lardman> ah, sorry, my fault
Jun 09 13:47:35 <lardman> saw bulk and thought of transfer from ARM->DSP
Jun 09 13:48:45 * guenther_ sighs "how annoying"
Jun 09 13:50:23 <guenther_> hrm, where did the recover command go?
Jun 09 13:50:40 <ssvb> lardman: right now for YV12->YUV420 conversion less than 3 cycles are required for each pixel when working in SARAM and ~2.2 cycles when working in DARAM, having data copied SDRAM->DARAM and DARAM->SDRAM increases this time to ~16 cycles, so almost all the overhead is introduced by reading/writing SDRAM memory
Jun 09 13:51:30 <ssvb> lardman: if I use the same conversion code directly on SDRAM, it is much slower (because of having 16-bit memory accesses)
Jun 09 13:52:03 <lardman> Cool, is your code in the mplayer svn tree?
Jun 09 13:52:47 <ssvb> lardman: so either the code needs to be changed to work with 32-bit memory reads/writes only dealing with endian issues, or the data should be processed in internal memory
Jun 09 13:53:12 <ssvb> lardman: the second approach theoretically is optimal if we manage to get DMA work properly
Jun 09 13:53:34 <lardman> dealing with endianness issues is not a big problem, just confusing
Jun 09 13:53:35 <ido--> how do i extract a .deb file ?
Jun 09 13:54:01 <ssvb> lardman: it is not in mplayer repository yet, because I'm still experimenting with DMA (unsuccessfully so far)
Jun 09 13:54:32 <dospod> hello
Jun 09 13:56:21 <ido--> how do i see all my currently install apt packages ?
Jun 09 13:56:59 <guenther> ah, finally :)
Jun 09 13:57:19 <aquatix> ido--: i think there's a dpkg switch for that
Jun 09 13:57:28 <ido--> which one ?
Jun 09 13:57:53 <aquatix> dpkg --get-selections
Jun 09 13:58:03 <aquatix> i think that's the one
Jun 09 13:58:27 <lardman> how do I find who has registered a web name?
Jun 09 13:58:33 <lardman> web address evebn
Jun 09 13:58:44 <aquatix> lardman: whois blah.tld ?
Jun 09 13:58:45 <aquatix> :)
Jun 09 13:59:07 <lardman> that's the one, thanks
Jun 09 13:59:13 <aquatix> sure thing
Jun 09 14:11:21 <herwood> hi
Jun 09 14:11:33 <herwood> has anybody ever used object push?
Jun 09 14:38:43 <dospod> hey
Jun 09 14:41:17 <dneary> hi all
Jun 09 14:42:18 <dospod> hey
Jun 09 14:46:43 <manyoso> where can i find the source or the modifications made to Qt that went into the packages at http://qt4.garage.maemo.org/ ?
Jun 09 14:46:51 <manyoso> anyone familiar with this project?
Jun 09 14:47:04 <X-Fade> manyoso: In their svn repo.
Jun 09 14:50:07 <manyoso> browsing the svn repo... it looks like it just contains the sources for the website...
Jun 09 14:50:11 <manyoso> not the packages
Jun 09 14:50:16 <hrw> hi
Jun 09 14:51:00 <manyoso> https://garage.maemo.org/plugins/scmsvn/viewcvs.php/?root=qt4
Jun 09 14:51:10 <manyoso> perhaps the view is messed up
Jun 09 14:51:29 <manyoso> but i can see changes to the website via that service...
Jun 09 14:53:23 <Dekaritae> I have installed VIM, but it does not appear in the application menu
Jun 09 14:54:33 <mgedmin> Dekaritae: it's a command-line app
Jun 09 14:54:41 <mgedmin> open xterm and type 'vim'
Jun 09 14:55:46 <Dekaritae> Ah, oki
Jun 09 14:56:00 <Dekaritae> Recommend a non-command-line editor?
Jun 09 14:56:16 <mgedmin> gvim ;)
Jun 09 14:56:24 <mgedmin> but there's no maemo version yet
Jun 09 15:04:38 <jott> manyoso: it looks like the svn is messed up atm, just fetch the source from the repository (or do something like dget -x http://qt4.garage.maemo.org/dists/chinook/user/source/qt4-4.4.0/qt4-x11_4.4.0-osso1.dsc )
Jun 09 15:05:26 <dospod> is there a reason it seems the community fell off?
Jun 09 15:07:42 <manyoso> alright, i'll try
Jun 09 15:11:00 <hrw> I had gvim under maemo but it had some problems which I did not had time to debug
Jun 09 15:12:15 <aquatix> fullscreen terminal -> vim
Jun 09 15:12:18 <aquatix> enough for me ;)
Jun 09 15:16:48 <Dekaritae> dospod: Maturity
Jun 09 15:17:08 <Dekaritae> The big applications niches are fill
Jun 09 15:20:13 <dospod> Im still waiting for a snes emulator for os 2008 :\
Jun 09 15:20:39 <Dekaritae> Do not wait
Jun 09 15:20:46 <Dekaritae> There is SNES emulator for GBA
Jun 09 15:21:24 <Dekaritae> And NES emulator for SNES crazy
Jun 09 15:22:45 <aquatix> and there's that upcoming OSS gaming handheld
Jun 09 15:23:41 <Dekaritae> Pandora yes I'm sure we will see that
Jun 09 15:23:49 <jott> and there is a gba emulator for palm so you could go  garnetvm->gba->snes for maximum performance ;)
Jun 09 15:23:59 <aquatix> jott: ooooh
Jun 09 15:24:06 * aquatix installs that setup
Jun 09 15:24:26 <Dekaritae> LJP does not emulate GBA, and Firestorm runs < 4 FPS on 400mhz+ hardware
Jun 09 15:24:39 <Dekaritae> Aggressively unoptimized
Jun 09 15:25:15 <Dekaritae> LJP for Palm does do SNES quite well
Jun 09 15:25:48 <Dekaritae> You find it here
Jun 09 15:25:49 <Dekaritae> http://www.metaviewsoft.de/en/index.html
Jun 09 15:26:56 <dospod> Its sad how much intrests I have lost for my n800
Jun 09 15:27:23 <Dekaritae> Is typical male reaction
Jun 09 15:27:33 <Dekaritae> Not be happy with what you have, want what you can't
Jun 09 15:27:56 <Dekaritae> Was not happy with Zodiac, got N800
Jun 09 15:28:04 <Dekaritae> When not happy with N800, get iPod Touch
Jun 09 15:28:24 <Dekaritae> Eventually I get OQO+
Jun 09 15:28:29 <Dekaritae> And still not be happy
Jun 09 15:28:45 <aquatix> you replaced N800 with a Touch? weirdo ;)
Jun 09 15:29:01 <Dekaritae> Not yet. Still happy with N800
Jun 09 15:29:04 * aquatix is happy with his n810/sony ericsson m600i combo
Jun 09 15:29:09 <aquatix> ah, ok :)
Jun 09 15:29:15 <hrw> bye guys
Jun 09 15:30:47 <dospod> If the gba emulation has gotten faster since the last time I had my n800
Jun 09 15:30:53 <dospod> it may spark intrest again
Jun 09 15:32:17 <johnx> it seemed pretty nice when I tried it on ff tactics
Jun 09 15:32:19 <Dekaritae> I have DS, no desire for emulatoring on N800
Jun 09 15:32:28 <Dekaritae> Flash games, there is the plus
Jun 09 15:33:22 <dospod> I have a ds too but no gba carts anymore
Jun 09 15:33:39 <johnx> I hate flash so much...
Jun 09 15:34:08 <Dekaritae> Playing with Flash VNC client
Jun 09 15:48:45 <pupnik> anybody want to work on DrPocketSNES, it's not too hard - i have it loading roms now
Jun 09 15:48:59 <pupnik> i'll finish it evtly
Jun 09 16:33:12 <manyoso> jott: the svn for Qt4 matches what i see on the website
Jun 09 16:33:23 <manyoso> it just contains the source for the website
Jun 09 16:33:29 <manyoso> no code for Qt4
Jun 09 16:33:41 <manyoso> is this code not available?
Jun 09 16:34:13 <Proteous> sorry, I ate it
Jun 09 16:34:19 <Proteous> I was hungry :/
Jun 09 16:47:16 <dneary> GeneralAntilles: Ping?
Jun 09 16:47:24 <dneary> Do you know how the RSS works on the new wiki?
Jun 09 17:06:01 <Dekaritae> InterfaceLIFT.com let you select only 800x480 dimension backgrounds
Jun 09 17:41:42 <CrashandDie`> hey, what's the command again to create a .deb from the .diff.gz .tar.gz and desc files ?
Jun 09 17:42:26 <johnx> I do it in two steps: dpkg-source -x foo.dsc
Jun 09 17:42:38 <johnx> then cd into the dir it creats, and type dpkg-buildpackage -rfakeroot
Jun 09 17:42:43 <johnx> maybe there's a faster way?
Jun 09 17:44:28 <CrashandDie`> johnx, no, that's the one, thanks :)
Jun 09 17:44:36 <johnx> sure :)
Jun 09 17:44:42 <lcuk2> fastest way i would know if to "open irc, ask people how to do it, blindly follow options, reflash device, curse irc, read the manual, do what crash said ;"
Jun 09 17:45:29 <CrashandDie`> lcuk2, I've ported a few apps, I just forgot the name of the commands... And bash_history won't go as far...
Jun 09 17:46:41 <CrashandDie`> anyway, off to celebrate end of (written) exams, and the fact I managed to sell my house :D Cheers
Jun 09 17:46:42 <lcuk2> i know :P its great in here, im constantly surprised by how professional and helpful most folks are
Jun 09 17:46:48 <summatusmentis> GeneralAntilles: this boxwave screen protector is impossible to get off of the sticky plastic sheet it's attached to
Jun 09 17:47:09 <lardman> Where's qwerty when you want him?
Jun 09 17:47:21 <CrashandDie`> lcuk2, I think it has to do with the fact most people actually bought this device to be part of the community... As in, we paid money, so we're not here to fool around
Jun 09 17:47:26 <lcuk2> paper-round?
Jun 09 17:47:34 <lardman> lcuk2: :)
Jun 09 17:47:38 <CrashandDie`> lcuk2, different from say, #ubuntu, where you can just f* people over for free
Jun 09 17:47:39 <lcuk2> lol
Jun 09 17:47:50 <RST38h> "Brian just said it smells like a San Francisco bus in here. I agree. Its a mixture of sweat, urine, desperation, more urine, just a little feces, saliva, Apple fever, bald dudes, a cupful more of urine, and urine." -- straight from WWDC
Jun 09 17:47:57 <johnx> CrashandDie`, speak for yourself, I'm just here to fool around :P
Jun 09 17:48:13 <johnx> RST38h, so you're watching giz as well? :P
Jun 09 17:48:29 <CrashandDie> johnx, bleh, you devil
Jun 09 17:48:41 <lcuk2> crash - i agree that we paid for the device, the community was an extra - i wasnt aware of any of this before i got the device and i didnt use you lot as a buying decision
Jun 09 17:49:25 <lcuk2> (though nowadays i cant talk about this device and what i do without mentioning how great you all are :D
Jun 09 17:49:36 <RST38h> johnx: Just came home and browsing the feed to figure out what is going on
Jun 09 17:50:01 <CrashandDie> lcuk2, agreed, I'm not really that active within the community, but still, I think no one in here is actually someone who just happen to stroll in by accident, and is a stupid troll
Jun 09 17:50:24 <johnx> CrashandDie, just spend more time here...
Jun 09 17:50:31 <Dekaritae> I'm a troll
Jun 09 17:50:35 <CrashandDie> johnx, I have a life :P
Jun 09 17:50:36 <johnx> but by and large, the community here is quite nice
Jun 09 17:50:48 <Dekaritae> In the ah, Pratchett sense
Jun 09 17:51:04 <CrashandDie> johnx, no, but really, I've had an insane year, I promise, I'll try to be more active once I settle down on my own, and with my new job and such
Jun 09 17:51:20 <johnx> ah, what I mean is, we get random wandering trolls sometimes
Jun 09 17:51:40 <lcuk2> i was impressed by the "maemo" troll guy.
Jun 09 17:51:50 <CrashandDie> anyway, running late, cheers !
Jun 09 17:52:01 <lcuk2> have fun
Jun 09 17:52:06 <johnx> 'later
Jun 09 17:52:44 <lcuk2> lardman, another round of bluetooth testing then
Jun 09 17:54:36 * mgedmin hands a toothbrush to lcuk2
Jun 09 17:55:09 <lcuk2> :D i remember those blue dye pills from school :D
Jun 09 17:55:36 <RST38h> 25000 applied for Apple development program and 4000 were accepted
Jun 09 17:56:02 <RST38h> That is a whopping 16% acceptance rate
Jun 09 17:56:33 <lcuk2> the other 84% had media players
Jun 09 17:57:16 <lardman> lcuk2: I think I fixed the segfault for 3.32
Jun 09 17:57:34 <lardman> 3.20 is still failing, but probably something to do with my backporting
Jun 09 17:57:40 <RST38h> lcuk: Or emulators. Or Java VMs.
Jun 09 17:57:43 <johnx> or interpreted languages, emulators, daemons, apps that "took too much bandwidth", something that competed with apple
Jun 09 17:58:37 <fnordianslip> i'd like to build a custom kernel with AX.25 support enabled, but I've never built a Linux kernel before.  Do I really have to edit the .config file by hand (as described in the maemo wiki) or is there an easier way?
Jun 09 17:59:07 <mgedmin> fnordianslip: make menuconfig
Jun 09 17:59:11 <mgedmin> or make xconfig
Jun 09 17:59:11 <lcuk2> lardman :D as always, once you stabilise one you might find out why the backport isnt working
Jun 09 17:59:27 <lardman> fnordianslip: editing by hand is easier than using the gui imo ;)
Jun 09 17:59:27 <fnordianslip> does that work in sb2 ? it doesn't seem to for me.
Jun 09 17:59:31 <mgedmin> I believe editing the config file by hand is frowned upon
Jun 09 17:59:51 <fnordianslip> frowned on by me, for sure ;-(
Jun 09 17:59:53 <mgedmin> or at least you need to run some tool to check for dependencies between kernel options
Jun 09 18:00:10 <mgedmin> "works in sb2?" dunno, why bother?
Jun 09 18:00:13 <mgedmin> run it outside sb2
Jun 09 18:00:21 <fnordianslip> wonder if anyone more proficient fancies knocking one out for me ???
Jun 09 18:00:46 <mgedmin> what's AX.25?
Jun 09 18:01:06 <mgedmin> ham radio?
Jun 09 18:01:09 <fnordianslip> it's a Layer 2 protocol used by radio hams - I R 1
Jun 09 18:01:25 <lardman> fnordianslip: why doens't it work?
Jun 09 18:01:50 <fnordianslip> not enabled by default on maemo - it is on Ubutu for example
Jun 09 18:01:59 <fnordianslip> Ubuntu, even
Jun 09 18:02:23 <lardman> inside scratchbox do "ARCH=arm make menuconfig" iirc
Jun 09 18:02:32 <lardman> assuming that's the right arch of course
Jun 09 18:03:03 <fnordianslip> lards - cheers, I'll try that
Jun 09 18:03:41 <mgedmin> you'll need ncurses installed, which, I *think* is not in there by default
Jun 09 18:03:43 <mgedmin> I might be wrong
Jun 09 18:03:43 <lardman> fnordianslip: make sure you do the other pre-cursor stuff, like make sure the right .config is in the right place etc
Jun 09 18:03:59 <lardman> mgedmin: I think it is, I'm pretty sure I've done make menuconfig
Jun 09 18:04:10 <lardman> might have installed it myself of course :)
Jun 09 18:04:46 <fnordianslip> i think you're right...will try adding ncurses to sb
Jun 09 18:05:01 <lardman> apt-get install ncurses
Jun 09 18:05:14 <CrashandDie> make menuconfig
Jun 09 18:05:18 <CrashandDie> sh: make: command not found
Jun 09 18:05:51 <fnordianslip> make not found ?
Jun 09 18:06:12 <mgedmin> lcuk2: remember the discussion about simulating multitouch on maemo?
Jun 09 18:06:31 <mgedmin> here's a perl script that sort of does that on laptops with a synaptics touchpad: http://www.ibm.com/developerworks/opensource/library/os-touchpad/
Jun 09 18:06:34 <lcuk2> yes
Jun 09 18:06:51 <mgedmin> it's simplere here because the hardware gives you the number of fingers (1/2/3) as well as the center point
Jun 09 18:06:52 <lcuk2> i was just re-talking about it last night with kot, ive got notes
Jun 09 18:10:58 <lcuk2> hmmm
Jun 09 18:11:02 * lcuk2 runs off to his lab
Jun 09 18:11:37 <lcuk2> thanks mgedmin, just reading has given me and idea (and a hundred problems to overcome)
Jun 09 18:12:06 <mgedmin> heh
Jun 09 18:12:24 <mgedmin> I'm now thinking it's not as useful as it seemed
Jun 09 18:12:31 <mgedmin> this is more of a gesture recognition than true multitouch
Jun 09 18:15:13 <lcuk2> isnt that what 99% of multitouch is though ;)
Jun 09 18:16:12 <RST38h> even having gesture recognition api on Maemo would be nice
Jun 09 18:16:53 <RST38h> Personally, I do not care whether a map will react to pulling it apart with two fingers or circling a spot with one finger
Jun 09 18:17:40 <MangoFusion> would be nice if there was multitouch with the onscreen keyboard ;)
Jun 09 18:18:57 <summatusmentis> ... we're gonna get to be iPhone owners, w/out the iPhone?
Jun 09 18:22:44 <lcuk2> MangoFusion, my keyboard is multitouch capable :) (at least i can press ctrl and c together ;) )
Jun 09 18:23:17 <lcuk2> its also backlit ;)
Jun 09 18:23:45 <tank-man> oh yea, i got two full size sdhc slots :P
Jun 09 18:24:14 <MangoFusion> lcuk2: n810?
Jun 09 18:24:25 * lcuk2 knew he shouldv stayed out of this pissing contest.    but at least i can (eventually) find my way home
Jun 09 18:25:11 <lcuk2> yer - ive only seen the OSK a couple of times, and thought "how quant" (with a scottish accent)
Jun 09 18:26:52 <johnx> heh
Jun 09 18:27:09 <johnx> I've actually started to like it
Jun 09 18:27:24 <summatusmentis> ...
Jun 09 18:27:33 <lcuk2> the more scratches i get on my screen the more i try not to touch it and leave grease there
Jun 09 18:27:36 <summatusmentis> you like it?
Jun 09 18:27:37 <johnx> only downside is it takes up the whole screen
Jun 09 18:28:00 <johnx> yeah...there's no real problem with it, except for xterm use
Jun 09 18:28:16 <lcuk2> get a second 800
Jun 09 18:28:17 <lardman> or any other use when you need to type
Jun 09 18:28:30 * lardman doesn't like it much you can see
Jun 09 18:28:32 <lcuk2> infact, i think i once pondered using my old pda as a fullscreen kb for my nokia
Jun 09 18:28:35 <johnx> it's fine for email, or forums, or notes, or web addresses
Jun 09 18:28:47 <lardman> hw kb is much nicer
Jun 09 18:28:49 <lardman> imo
Jun 09 18:28:57 <johnx> to a certain extent
Jun 09 18:29:00 <lcuk2> hw keyboard is great, but not configurable
Jun 09 18:29:11 <johnx> I'd be interested in a speed comparison though
Jun 09 18:29:15 <lcuk2> the ability of osk to show you what you need is great
Jun 09 18:29:34 <johnx> I feel faster on the thumb osk than on my zaurus's hardware keyboard with two thumbs
Jun 09 18:29:59 <lcuk2> i touchtype on my little kb (well more hunt and peck)
Jun 09 18:30:37 <dneary> Anyone know how to change the CSS file for MediaWiki?
Jun 09 18:30:46 <dneary> I assume it's not in the wiki somewhere :)
Jun 09 18:30:54 <dneary> Hi lcuk2
Jun 09 18:30:54 <summatusmentis> the OSK isn't bad... works well enough
Jun 09 18:31:06 <dneary> I see you're famous :) Nice demo video
Jun 09 18:31:14 <lcuk2> hi dave :) found your flickr page today and spotted myself
Jun 09 18:31:51 <lcuk2> well some woman did stop me today and ask for my autograph, shame she was a traffic warden
Jun 09 18:32:06 * johnx plays a rimshot
Jun 09 18:32:53 <lcuk2> lol
Jun 09 18:33:19 <MangoFusion> iphone 3g. woo
Jun 09 18:33:20 <lcuk2> ive gotta somehow now get all the rest built into a proper app
Jun 09 18:35:35 <lcuk2> omg, the goggles, they do nothing   http://www.planetdan.net/pics/misc/drunktyping.jpg
Jun 09 18:37:29 <jaska> haha
Jun 09 18:46:51 <MangoFusion> nice princ
Jun 09 18:46:53 <MangoFusion> *price
Jun 09 18:53:55 <Dekaritae> Can the 4-way selector be remapped from Enter to Spacebar in Microb?
Jun 09 18:56:49 <summatusmentis> MangoFusion: yeah, stll crappy gsm provider
Jun 09 18:57:20 <lcuk2> and same low resolution screen  (npot that resolution changes are important)
Jun 09 18:57:40 <lcuk2> is it possible to use a stylus with iphone?
Jun 09 18:57:52 <johnx> nope
Jun 09 18:57:53 * lcuk2 doesn't really wanna do fingerpainting
Jun 09 18:57:58 <johnx> it's a capacitive screen
Jun 09 18:58:10 <lcuk2> yer, low capacity :P
Jun 09 18:58:34 <johnx> their answer to long running network services is rather clever though, I must admit
Jun 09 18:58:36 <johnx> very unixy
Jun 09 18:58:43 <summatusmentis> I just put a screen protector on my n810, so i can use my fingers :)
Jun 09 18:59:03 <johnx> I don't even worry with my n800
Jun 09 18:59:06 <lcuk2> ive given up caring about scratches now (almost) ive got 2 big ones and loads of smaller ones
Jun 09 18:59:24 <lcuk2> the first is always the worst
Jun 09 18:59:58 <lcuk2> hang on, if you can get a phone for $199, are the pods getting even cheaper?
Jun 09 19:00:27 <johnx> lcuk2, abandoning us? :P
Jun 09 19:01:06 <summatusmentis> lcuk2: one would hope so, wouldn't they?
Jun 09 19:01:12 <lcuk2> not at all, i adore the display on my 810 and development model suits me :)
Jun 09 19:01:48 <RST38h> A while ago, somebody suggested gcc options to turn on fpu acceleration via vfp. What were these?
Jun 09 19:01:48 <lcuk2> but it would be good to have other devices around
Jun 09 19:02:16 <kulve> RST38h: http://tuomas.kulve.fi/blog/2008/05/17/gcc-options-and-floating-point/
Jun 09 19:02:24 <RST38h> thanks!
Jun 09 19:02:50 <MangoFusion> lcuk2: you can if you use a capacitive stylus
Jun 09 19:02:56 <MangoFusion> from what i hear at least
Jun 09 19:03:02 <RST38h> should I use vfp / softfp?
Jun 09 19:03:06 <summatusmentis> if I had an iPhone, I don't think I'd be using my n810 nearly as much
Jun 09 19:03:08 <lcuk2> heh, ive got one right in front of me
Jun 09 19:03:52 <MangoFusion> $199? the ipod touch is £199 here. crazy
Jun 09 19:04:13 <lcuk2> yer mango, they havent said how cheap it will be tho
Jun 09 19:04:25 <lcuk2> you are comparing apples to ummmm old apples
Jun 09 19:05:23 <RST38h> "Happy" old iPhone users should be biting their nails right about now
Jun 09 19:05:45 <lcuk2> if theres a 6 week delay, just what is in all those crates brought over recently and filling up the stores...
Jun 09 19:05:56 * lcuk2 hopes for an iNewton
Jun 09 19:06:10 * RST38h hopes for N10000
Jun 09 19:06:17 <fnordianslip> mmmm ... apples
Jun 09 19:06:29 <ido--> iphones suck, no BG processes...
Jun 09 19:06:47 <fnordianslip> but, MacBook Pros are pretty cool
Jun 09 19:06:50 <RST38h> I am not letting Steve Jobs sodomize me with a shiny iPlunger of his
Jun 09 19:06:54 <ido--> and their SDK isn't that open, well, there's nothing like OSS linux..
Jun 09 19:06:56 <Blafasel> Yeah, but they are providing a 'solution' for bg stuff
Jun 09 19:06:58 <lcuk2> theres more reasons why they suck, but they look good whilst they suck
Jun 09 19:07:10 <GeneralAntilles> .Mac dead? :(
Jun 09 19:07:10 <Blafasel> lcuk2: Right, that's the main point ;)
Jun 09 19:07:13 <fnordianslip> like a blonde bimbo ?
Jun 09 19:07:18 <Blafasel> GA: "Upgraded"
Jun 09 19:07:19 <ido--> i got rid of my iphone a year ago
Jun 09 19:07:35 <ido--> only thing i really miss was the touch screen
Jun 09 19:07:39 <GeneralAntilles> Ah, another iTools move
Jun 09 19:07:44 <GeneralAntilles> At least it didn't get more expensive again. :D
Jun 09 19:07:46 <RST38h> GA: $99/year
Jun 09 19:07:51 <ido--> and its sleek interface, and fast graphics
Jun 09 19:08:14 <GeneralAntilles> Hey, milhouse.
Jun 09 19:08:17 <summatusmentis> GeneralAntilles: you're in prime position to getnan iPhone... assuming you have $60/mo
Jun 09 19:08:30 <GeneralAntilles> Why would I want an iPhone? :P
Jun 09 19:08:32 <milhouse> hi GA
Jun 09 19:08:39 <GeneralAntilles> It's thicker than my Samsung.
Jun 09 19:08:46 <summatusmentis> lol, cuz they're sexy
Jun 09 19:08:48 <summatusmentis> is it?
Jun 09 19:08:48 <lcuk2> GeneralAntilles, to go in your iGadgetbelt
Jun 09 19:08:50 <RST38h> It is $199, you can buy one for your wife and pretend you are not using it!
Jun 09 19:08:58 <Blafasel> hrhr
Jun 09 19:09:41 <RST38h> Subject: Can't forget You
Jun 09 19:09:41 <RST38h> Lovin' You  http://83.11.237.153/
Jun 09 19:09:49 <RST38h> What the hell is this spam?
Jun 09 19:09:59 <Blafasel> No idea. Use lynx and check it.
Jun 09 19:10:04 <Blafasel> or wget
Jun 09 19:12:19 <milhouse> oohhhh the dutch are beating italy
Jun 09 19:12:26 <milhouse> quality goal
Jun 09 19:12:37 <milhouse> i'm off to watch the rest ta ta
Jun 09 19:14:20 <summatusmentis> lcuk2: I'll be the reason it's cheaper than the ipods is subsidization
Jun 09 19:14:21 <lcuk2> if i wanted to parse html what library would i use?
Jun 09 19:14:53 <lcuk2> summatusmentis, probably
Jun 09 19:15:47 <summatusmentis> s/be/bet/
Jun 09 19:15:47 <infobot> summatusmentis meant: lcuk2: I'll bet the reason it's cheaper than the ipods is subsidization
Jun 09 19:16:02 <mgedmin> libxml2 has an html parser
Jun 09 19:16:13 <mgedmin> of somewhat dubious quality
Jun 09 19:16:32 <mgedmin> (it works, but I don't know if it's the best option for real-world broken HTML you find out there)
Jun 09 19:18:17 <lcuk2> ive heard stuff about webkit, but everything ive seen says its objective c
Jun 09 19:18:26 <lcuk2> its only for a "hmmm"
Jun 09 19:18:51 <mgedmin> worth a look, perhaps
Jun 09 19:18:58 <||cw> webkit is a renderer though isn't it?
Jun 09 19:19:12 <mgedmin> it's much more than just html parsing, yes
Jun 09 19:19:44 <mgedmin> ||cw: iirc, what lcuk2 wants is a library to parse html & do the layout, just without the output bit
Jun 09 19:19:57 <mgedmin> because I doubt there's one that renders to a YUV video image
Jun 09 19:20:04 <mgedmin> hm... the one used in webtv perhaps?
Jun 09 19:20:07 <||cw> ah
Jun 09 19:20:07 <lcuk2> lol mg :) you are reading my mind
Jun 09 19:20:15 <mgedmin> lcuk2: we talked about this in rl!
Jun 09 19:20:21 <||cw> so you want to render to an image file?
Jun 09 19:20:45 <mgedmin> ||cw, have you seen the youtube video of liqbase?
Jun 09 19:20:54 <||cw> no
Jun 09 19:20:59 <mgedmin> it's a must-see
Jun 09 19:21:00 <lcuk2> yer i know, ||cw - no i want the DOM model so i can render it myself. incase you haven't seen i have a bit of a flashy rapid renderer for maemo
Jun 09 19:21:02 <mgedmin> lcuk2: url?
Jun 09 19:21:12 <lcuk2> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PUPp_mE7rwI
Jun 09 19:21:31 <lcuk2> was just digging it out ;)
Jun 09 19:22:04 <lcuk2> it might not work at all, but its worth it as a POC
Jun 09 19:22:23 <lcuk2> once i know that i can hand it over to someone else to make the most of
Jun 09 19:22:57 * mgedmin tries to backronym 'POC'
Jun 09 19:23:08 * mgedmin guesses proof-of-concept
Jun 09 19:23:18 <lcuk2> yer
Jun 09 19:23:19 * mgedmin wonders why he put those hyphens in there
Jun 09 19:23:50 <mgedmin> bye, all!
Jun 09 19:23:55 <lcuk2> lol
Jun 09 19:24:13 <lcuk2> i think thats the fastest exit ever
Jun 09 19:25:55 <||cw> interesting
Jun 09 19:27:09 * guenther dances in ecstasy
Jun 09 19:36:11 <GeneralAntilles> summatusmentis, you figure out the boxwave?
Jun 09 19:37:19 <summatusmentis> GeneralAntilles: yeah... I had pulled off the screen protector, and was trying to pull off the 'screen protector' from the plastic cover
Jun 09 19:37:23 <summatusmentis> >_>
Jun 09 19:37:39 <GeneralAntilles> Ha
Jun 09 19:37:46 <summatusmentis> my screen protector looks kinda dusty, but I can't get it to clean off, so I'm just gonna leave it
Jun 09 19:37:58 <GeneralAntilles> Dusty?
Jun 09 19:38:07 <GeneralAntilles> Like, there's dusty between the protector and panel?
Jun 09 19:38:11 <GeneralAntilles> Or the anti-glare finish?
Jun 09 19:38:13 <summatusmentis> yeah, like I let it sit too much
Jun 09 19:38:20 <summatusmentis> might be both
Jun 09 19:39:13 <summatusmentis> more like there's dust between the protector and panel
Jun 09 19:39:25 <GeneralAntilles> Still have my guide handy?
Jun 09 19:39:32 <summatusmentis> yeah
Jun 09 19:39:33 <GeneralAntilles> Take it off, wash it and reapply.
Jun 09 19:39:50 <summatusmentis> I did, like, 4 times
Jun 09 19:40:22 <GeneralAntilles> Move to a cleaner room. :P
Jun 09 19:40:26 <GeneralAntilles> and work fast
Jun 09 19:40:30 <summatusmentis> and then I got fed up, and left it :)
Jun 09 19:40:36 <summatusmentis> it doesn't dry, which is the issue
Jun 09 19:41:14 <summatusmentis> so I'm whipping this thing around, and by the time it's dry, there's dust again :)
Jun 09 19:41:27 <GeneralAntilles> A little water wont hurt things.
Jun 09 19:41:31 <GeneralAntilles> I applied mine wet
Jun 09 19:41:42 <GeneralAntilles> Just shake it gently a couple times to get the big drops off and go for it
Jun 09 19:41:50 <GeneralAntilles> the excess will come out the edges and you can wipe it off.
Jun 09 19:42:16 <summatusmentis> well, I don't know if I can take the faceplate off
Jun 09 19:43:42 <summatusmentis> is dust bad?if it bugs me, i could take the protector off later, and do it then right?
Jun 09 19:44:38 <GeneralAntilles> It wont hurt anything
Jun 09 19:44:42 <GeneralAntilles> It just pisses me off.
Jun 09 19:45:33 <summatusmentis> I'll deal w/ it, for a while
Jun 09 19:45:41 <summatusmentis> then if it's horrible, I'll fi it
Jun 09 19:45:44 <flo_lap> re
Jun 09 19:45:46 <summatusmentis> fix*
Jun 09 19:47:06 <MangoFusion> lcuk2: looks great. nice animation
Jun 09 19:50:10 <lardman> qwerty12_N800: at last!
Jun 09 19:50:23 <qwerty12_N800> hello lardman
Jun 09 19:50:39 <lardman> I think I may have fixed the segfault for the 3.32 code
Jun 09 19:50:55 <qwerty12_N800> brilliant :)
Jun 09 19:51:13 <johnx> all the fun stuff happens just as I head to bed :/
Jun 09 19:51:20 <qwerty12_N800> (i can test sbcenc but my bluez is damaged :/)
Jun 09 19:51:25 <GeneralAntilles> Does ITVC work on Vista?
Jun 09 19:51:35 <lardman> qwerty12_N800: oh, what did you do?
Jun 09 19:52:11 <GeneralAntilles> I guess yes.
Jun 09 19:52:13 <qwerty12_N800> no idea, hcid crashes even when I connect in low quality mono mode :/
Jun 09 19:52:22 <qwerty12_N800> ^@lardman
Jun 09 19:52:38 <lardman> hmm
Jun 09 19:52:40 <lardman> not idea
Jun 09 19:52:46 <lardman> not ideal even, and also no idea
Jun 09 19:53:01 <qwerty12_N800> I'm reflashing tomorrow though
Jun 09 19:53:17 <qwerty12_N800> (and reinstalling 3.32)
Jun 09 19:53:44 <lardman> cool, no rush on my part, am trying to track down a segfault in the 3.20 code
Jun 09 19:54:22 <qwerty12_N800> sigh... admin password, pstools, halkiller = so much fun with school computers...
Jun 09 19:55:10 * johnx was sys admin in highschool 
Jun 09 19:55:25 <summatusmentis> I helped the sysadmin in high school
Jun 09 19:55:37 <johnx> I did for a year
Jun 09 19:55:38 <qwerty12_N800> lets just say i'm an unofficial admin...
Jun 09 19:55:39 <johnx> then he left
Jun 09 19:55:58 <summatusmentis> qwerty12_N800: admin requires being helpful :)
Jun 09 19:56:40 <qwerty12_N800> summatusmentis, not me :p. i remote execed a virus on some comps...
Jun 09 19:57:01 <johnx> yeah, you would have found your account not working so well if I was admin
Jun 09 19:57:39 <qwerty12_N800> and i'd have fixed it ;)
Jun 09 19:58:03 <GeneralAntilles> Then you'd end up suspended by the principle. ;)
Jun 09 19:58:04 <summatusmentis> qwerty12_N800: how the hell do you get away w/ it?
Jun 09 19:58:17 <summatusmentis> you should have your ass kicked out :-P
Jun 09 19:58:22 <GeneralAntilles> ^
Jun 09 19:58:34 <johnx> qwerty12_N800, I doubt it. I ran a pretty darn tight ship
Jun 09 19:58:56 <qwerty12_N800> nah, i'm just too good, i've been excluded on some minor things but that's it
Jun 09 19:59:15 <summatusmentis> qwerty12_N800: then your IT guy must be incompetent
Jun 09 19:59:22 <johnx> you would have gotten admin on a local windows box...but that doesn't count for anything
Jun 09 19:59:47 <summatusmentis> johnx: presumably there was another password somewhere :)
Jun 09 20:00:14 <summatusmentis> which I assume qwerty12_N800 is saying he has
Jun 09 20:00:17 * qwerty12_N800 would <3 the creator of pstools, halkiller & ophcrack if I could
Jun 09 20:00:31 <johnx> qwerty12_N800 is not capable of <3
Jun 09 20:00:34 <GeneralAntilles> Assholism is what it is.
Jun 09 20:00:46 <GeneralAntilles> Why do you feel the need to compulsively break shit?
Jun 09 20:01:04 <qwerty12_N800> johnx, I can better than you :p
Jun 09 20:01:10 <qwerty12_N800> can't help it
Jun 09 20:01:18 <GeneralAntilles> Sociopath
Jun 09 20:01:28 <johnx> qwerty12_N800, can what better than me? put together sentences? :P
Jun 09 20:01:29 <lcuk2> <qwerty12_N800> nah, i'm just too good, i've been excluded on some minor things but that's it              hmmm, what kind of things?   hacking the germany, french, brazillian and egyptian govt computers
Jun 09 20:01:37 <johnx> GeneralAntilles, meh...as long as he's not my problem I don't care.
Jun 09 20:01:55 * qwerty12_N800 is waiting for the computer asbo
Jun 09 20:02:05 <lcuk2> if i was back at school i would reinstall microsoft bob
Jun 09 20:02:35 <summatusmentis> if I was back at school, I'd just out a window...
Jun 09 20:02:39 <summatusmentis> I hate high school
Jun 09 20:02:41 <lcuk2> heh, actually i wonder if my software is still in use at college
Jun 09 20:02:48 <summatusmentis> s/just/jump/
Jun 09 20:02:52 <summatusmentis> s/hate/hated/
Jun 09 20:02:54 <infobot> summatusmentis meant: I hated high school
Jun 09 20:03:01 * KotCzarny was reading about ms bob few days ago
Jun 09 20:03:05 <KotCzarny> with screenshots
Jun 09 20:03:07 <KotCzarny> :)
Jun 09 20:03:14 <lcuk2> i was staff: i wrote software to help stop scrotes like you from hiding in a corner hacking :P
Jun 09 20:03:34 <lcuk2> (especially southern jessies :P )
Jun 09 20:04:02 <lcuk2> mornin kot btw
Jun 09 20:04:12 <KotCzarny> hi lcuk
Jun 09 20:05:06 <lcuk2> did u get to have a look last night
Jun 09 20:05:14 <lardman> lcuk2: oi! enough with the southern abuse!
Jun 09 20:05:20 <lardman> ;)
Jun 09 20:05:37 <KotCzarny> o.o
Jun 09 20:05:43 <lcuk2> sorry simon, you are ok :P just
Jun 09 20:06:00 <lardman> lol
Jun 09 20:06:13 <lardman> once you make an exception, it's all downhill from there
Jun 09 20:06:18 <lardman> :D
Jun 09 20:07:51 <lcuk2> its ok, ill never forget one time we were going to midlands visiting friends and stopped in the service station.  the entire place was filled with arsenel fans coming back from a game, my missus had a face like thunder and if we hadn't been so hungry she wouldv starting shouting man united songs at them (i think they had just lost or something to us..)
Jun 09 20:09:41 <lcuk2> speaking of the better half, i better go and see if the footie has finished
Jun 09 20:09:46 <KotCzarny> :)
Jun 09 20:10:04 * lardman not a big Soccer fan
Jun 09 20:10:11 <lardman> or indeed a fan at all
Jun 09 20:10:20 <lcuk2> why do you think im up here and not watching :)
Jun 09 20:10:28 <lardman> :)
Jun 09 20:10:30 <KotCzarny> http://imagechan.net/img/5610/Mac%20OS/
Jun 09 20:10:32 <KotCzarny> o.O
Jun 09 20:11:05 <lardman> smancke: hi
Jun 09 20:11:17 <lardman> smancke: did you get my email in the end?
Jun 09 20:11:19 <smancke> hi lardman
Jun 09 20:11:34 <smancke> yes, bot no time to test it
Jun 09 20:11:38 <smancke> ... jet
Jun 09 20:11:51 <lardman> same here, but I'll get round to it eventually
Jun 09 20:12:02 <lcuk2> :D w00t i have cold beer
Jun 09 20:12:05 <lardman> let me know if you make any progress
Jun 09 20:12:05 <lcuk2> ill be back later
Jun 09 20:12:11 <Blafasel> lcuk2: Cheers
Jun 09 20:12:13 <lardman> lcuk2: enjoy :)
Jun 09 20:12:46 <smancke> yes, of course, but I also would say, that I enjoied out chat at linuxtag ;-)
Jun 09 20:12:48 <KotCzarny> Today is the 30th birthday of the industry standard known as x86
Jun 09 20:12:49 <KotCzarny> o.O
Jun 09 20:13:21 <lardman> smancke: yes, well it will be interesting to see if anything can come of it
Jun 09 20:13:32 <lardman> smancke: :)
Jun 09 20:13:46 * lcuk_afk wonders who smancke is
Jun 09 20:13:59 * smancke is Sebastian Mancke
Jun 09 20:14:08 <lardman> was in the same session as me
Jun 09 20:14:43 <smancke> I'm mostly only listening in irc because of lacking time :(
Jun 09 20:14:46 <lcuk_afk> ahhh yes, now i recall
Jun 09 20:14:49 <Saviq> hi all, do you guys know of any good app I could tweak my gpx files?
Jun 09 20:15:01 <lardman> time for a break
Jun 09 20:16:11 <lcuk_afk> smancke, irc sucks too much time
Jun 09 20:16:19 <lcuk_afk> hence me not being here now
Jun 09 20:16:52 <Saviq> I have some gpx track files from a trip this weekend, and as I was walking around a city, the result is... somewhat crazy here and there, I would like to tweak some of the points, is there an app that would help me in that?
Jun 09 20:17:51 <smancke> lcuk_afk, yes, assynchronous things, like blogs and mail are more easy to manage with a full shedule
Jun 09 20:18:43 <lcuk_afk> i see you have processing on openmoko, is it available for maemo?
Jun 09 20:18:51 <lcuk_afk> its not that bad really
Jun 09 20:19:05 <smancke> well processing is pure java
Jun 09 20:19:12 <smancke> so, it also runs on maemo
Jun 09 20:19:22 <smancke> but the performance is bad ATM
Jun 09 20:20:24 <lcuk_afk> damn
Jun 09 20:20:40 <smancke> Processing was designed with desktop power in mind and is even slow on my ThinkPad
Jun 09 20:21:34 <gourdin> hi there
Jun 09 20:21:36 <smancke> for good java2d performance we have port the OpenJDK Swing/AWT packages to classpath, which would be a big job :(
Jun 09 20:21:40 <lcuk_afk> such a shame really, software should be written to perform well on small devices :)
Jun 09 20:22:03 <gourdin> maemo:diablo.when() :)
Jun 09 20:22:21 <smancke> unfortunately especially much  java developers don't have that in mind
Jun 09 20:22:31 <Blafasel> Nah
Jun 09 20:22:39 <Blafasel> Java on phones is quite common
Jun 09 20:22:48 <Blafasel> (which are small devices in my book)
Jun 09 20:22:55 <smancke> J2ME: yes; J2SE: no
Jun 09 20:22:56 <KotCzarny> 'java'
Jun 09 20:22:58 <TTilus> especially much of any other than embedded developers...
Jun 09 20:23:03 <KotCzarny> yeah
Jun 09 20:23:10 <Blafasel> smancke: I give you that ;)
Jun 09 20:23:22 <GeneralAntilles> gourdin, the answer is the same everytime you ask it.
Jun 09 20:23:25 <GeneralAntilles> "When it's ready."
Jun 09 20:23:41 <gourdin> GeneralAntilles: nop, this isnew
Jun 09 20:23:59 <gourdin> last time i asked, t'was may, june
Jun 09 20:24:15 <smancke> Blafasel, my hope, that in 2-3  years even J2SE is very common on mobile devices!!
Jun 09 20:24:33 <KotCzarny> yeah..
Jun 09 20:24:39 <lcuk_afk> technically dont the phones have java hardware though
Jun 09 20:24:41 <KotCzarny> not on s60 though
Jun 09 20:24:41 <KotCzarny> :>
Jun 09 20:24:43 <lcuk_afk> and us
Jun 09 20:24:55 <GeneralAntilles> gourdin, it comes out when it's ready. Period.
Jun 09 20:25:02 <TTilus> trying to get ssh connection into my n810, got sshd installed and it responds to $ ssh user@my.n810.ip.digits
Jun 09 20:25:13 <gourdin> GeneralAntilles: ok, don't be rude
Jun 09 20:25:19 <TTilus> but whats the pw?
Jun 09 20:25:26 <Blafasel> TTilus: Set it before.
Jun 09 20:25:26 <TTilus> i don't remember ever setting one
Jun 09 20:25:29 <KotCzarny> the same you entered when installing
Jun 09 20:25:30 <Blafasel> passwd
Jun 09 20:25:30 <GeneralAntilles> All you do is ask about Diablo, and all I do is give you the same answer every time.
Jun 09 20:25:33 <GeneralAntilles> It gets old fast.
Jun 09 20:25:37 <KotCzarny> how do you installed it?
Jun 09 20:25:52 <TTilus> Blafasel: already tried, that says "cannot be changed"
Jun 09 20:25:55 <smancke> for S60, we will eventually port the jalimo package over, within this year, but I don;t know about the performance, yet.
Jun 09 20:26:19 <Blafasel> TTilus: sudo gainroot and passwd user
Jun 09 20:26:32 <gourdin> GeneralAntilles: i do this because the actual system isn't 'ready'
Jun 09 20:26:35 <gourdin> so
Jun 09 20:26:41 <lcuk_afk> TTilus, GeneralAntilles will change his nick to GeneralAntilles_Dialbo_is_here when its released :)  failing that you could sign yourself up to some sort of web rss feed to tell you when important maemo related news comes out.  not sure where you might find that though
Jun 09 20:26:48 <TTilus> KotCzarny: i think its from maemo extras
Jun 09 20:27:01 <KotCzarny> ttilus: apt-get or application manager?
Jun 09 20:27:05 <GeneralAntilles> gourdin, if you want to know when Diablo is out, subscribe to the maemo.org news feed.
Jun 09 20:27:07 <gourdin> :)
Jun 09 20:27:16 <lcuk_afk> ooops, sorry not TTilus i meant gourdin
Jun 09 20:27:24 <lcuk_afk> and im going back afk now :P
Jun 09 20:27:34 <TTilus> sudo gainroot says "Enable RD mode if you want to break your device
Jun 09 20:27:36 <gourdin> ok, i'll check thnis, thx
Jun 09 20:27:45 <TTilus> but i do want to break it!
Jun 09 20:27:52 * unixSnob wonders what a good channel is to discuss laptops
Jun 09 20:27:56 <TTilus> how do i turn it into "break it" mode  :D
Jun 09 20:27:56 <GeneralAntilles> TTilus, nitapps.com
Jun 09 20:27:58 <GeneralAntilles> Install easyroot.
Jun 09 20:28:08 <gourdin> lcuk_afk: ?
Jun 09 20:28:10 <TTilus> uh, oh, okkkay
Jun 09 20:28:35 <TTilus> KotCzarny: application manager
Jun 09 20:28:48 <KotCzarny> ttilus, well, try reinstalling
Jun 09 20:28:58 <KotCzarny> it sure asked for setting root password
Jun 09 20:29:05 <TTilus> KotCzarny: using application manager or apt?
Jun 09 20:29:10 <KotCzarny> app man
Jun 09 20:29:14 <TTilus> okay
Jun 09 20:29:25 <KotCzarny> but i guess apt way will ask too
Jun 09 20:29:37 <KotCzarny> (because it runs the same postinstall script i guess)
Jun 09 20:29:45 <KotCzarny> (or preinstall, whatever)
Jun 09 20:29:55 <gourdin> GeneralAntilles: are you paid by nokia ?
Jun 09 20:30:29 <TTilus> KotCzarny: there are openssh, -client and -server packages, which one or all of them (-server i guess, but)
Jun 09 20:30:57 <KotCzarny> if you install openssh meta package it iwll install both
Jun 09 20:31:26 <TTilus> ah, it was a metapackage
Jun 09 20:31:50 <TTilus> the size (8k) should have told it ;)
Jun 09 20:32:18 <KotCzarny> :)
Jun 09 20:37:01 <GeneralAntilles> gourdin, no.
Jun 09 20:37:30 <gourdin> ok
Jun 09 20:39:25 <gourdin> did nokia pay someone to support maemo ?
Jun 09 20:39:59 <TTilus> KotCzarny: it just installed it, no questions asked :/
Jun 09 20:40:02 <KotCzarny> hmm
Jun 09 20:40:20 <TTilus> openssh 1:4.7p1-2.maemo2
Jun 09 20:40:24 <GeneralAntilles> gourdin, 100s and 100s of Nokia employees. . . .
Jun 09 20:40:41 <TTilus> i think i'll try that easyroot
Jun 09 20:41:15 <GeneralAntilles> TTilus, if it didn't prompt you for a password change, then the -server side of things wasn't installed.
Jun 09 20:42:04 <TTilus> GeneralAntilles: i uninstalled -server and checked it disappeared from installed apps list, then i installed it again and now it is on the list
Jun 09 20:43:58 <TTilus> GeneralAntilles: nitapps.com is not responding
Jun 09 20:44:22 <GeneralAntilles> Works here.
Jun 09 20:44:36 <TTilus> different version?
Jun 09 20:44:45 <GeneralAntilles> Of nitapps.com?
Jun 09 20:45:01 <TTilus> no, openssh, ive got 1:4.7p1-2.maemo2
Jun 09 20:46:05 <TTilus> weird, can't even get nitapps.com resolved
Jun 09 20:46:26 <TTilus> GeneralAntilles: what's the ip?  i'll try to ping/trace it
Jun 09 20:48:39 <KotCzarny> 24.16.99.151
Jun 09 20:51:18 <Dekaritae> Comment make me laugh
Jun 09 20:51:19 <Dekaritae> http://www.maemo-apps.org/content/show.php/Maemo+Process+Viewer?content=50792
Jun 09 20:53:16 <TTilus> ping 24.16.99.151 - 100% packet loss
Jun 09 20:54:17 <Blafasel> Same. Some idiot admin thought that icmp echo is dangerous
Jun 09 20:54:45 <TTilus> trace goes tnnet->telenor->level3->comcast and dies to te-0-4-0-0-cr01.seattle.wa.ibone.comcast.net
Jun 09 20:55:07 <KotCzarny> site load though
Jun 09 20:55:17 <TTilus> last responding hop to me is 68.85.240.69
Jun 09 20:55:19 <Blafasel> So that's no indicator for a problem. The site works
Jun 09 20:55:37 <TTilus> ..but not for me  :-/
Jun 09 20:55:43 <Blafasel> In other words: You cannot use ping for diagnostics
Jun 09 20:55:57 <KotCzarny> ttilus, use some anonymous proxy
Jun 09 20:56:53 <TTilus> hah, http://24.16.99.151/ says "Hello"
Jun 09 20:58:19 <Blafasel> TTilus: If that works I don't see your problem?
Jun 09 20:58:31 <Blafasel> nitapps.com doesn't resolve?
Jun 09 20:58:41 <KotCzarny> add to /etc/hosts
Jun 09 20:58:42 <KotCzarny> :)
Jun 09 20:58:44 <Blafasel> You could add it to your hosts file
Jun 09 20:58:46 <Blafasel> Hrmpf
Jun 09 20:59:01 <TTilus> hum, ill try hosts
Jun 09 21:11:29 <TTilus> hosts worked ... and i've got root access to my tablet
Jun 09 21:30:29 * lardman spots school-boy errors in his Bluez backport
Jun 09 21:31:32 * GeneralAntilles raps lardman's knuckles with a yard-stck.
Jun 09 21:32:11 * lardman can luckily type with his toes ;p
Jun 09 21:38:08 <RST38h> So, any bets on whether the $199 iPhone will be the new RAZR? =)
Jun 09 21:38:36 <GeneralAntilles> Doubtful
Jun 09 21:38:42 <GeneralAntilles> RAZR's were free
Jun 09 21:39:01 <RST38h> RAZR also started at $200
Jun 09 21:39:25 <RST38h> Even in the US, if I remember correctly
Jun 09 21:39:55 <GeneralAntilles> Don't think so
Jun 09 21:40:01 <GeneralAntilles> It was higher than that initially.
Jun 09 21:40:03 <lcuk> im tempted to think it will be a great gaming system, but lack of buttons means its original hook only has so many uses (even the wii mote has a dpad)
Jun 09 21:40:23 <GeneralAntilles> How can it be a great gaming system with no buttons? O_o
Jun 09 21:40:33 <lcuk> tilt
Jun 09 21:40:50 <GeneralAntilles> Hours upon hours of marble madness?
Jun 09 21:40:59 <RST38h> N810 also has no buttons
Jun 09 21:41:06 <GeneralAntilles> It has a keyboard
Jun 09 21:41:21 <GeneralAntilles> All the buttons in the world
Jun 09 21:41:28 <RST38h> You can't play with that keyboard - it is terribly balanced and the dpad sucks
Jun 09 21:41:43 <lcuk> 51 usable buttons
Jun 09 21:41:47 <GeneralAntilles> Besides, I wouldn't call it a great gaming machine, either. :P
Jun 09 21:42:20 <lcuk> unless i miscounted
Jun 09 21:42:37 <lcuk> lardman, tsk tsk at errors. F-
Jun 09 21:43:09 <GeneralAntilles> Can I talk some people into working through these articles? http://wiki.maemo.org/Category:Midgard_wiki
Jun 09 21:43:12 <MangoFusion> razr was complete shit developer-wise compared to the iphone
Jun 09 21:43:27 <GeneralAntilles> Get the syntax inline with mediawiki, update and revise, etc.
Jun 09 21:43:34 <RST38h> Well, Razr was never supposed to be developed for
Jun 09 21:43:50 <MangoFusion> exactly ;)
Jun 09 21:44:14 <RST38h> iPhone also was never supposed to be developed for though
Jun 09 21:44:45 <MangoFusion> well they did start off with saying "you can write stuff for the web browser"
Jun 09 21:45:07 <MangoFusion> which if you compare it with the razr's, well... enough said ;)
Jun 09 21:45:48 <GeneralAntilles> The iPhone isn't shitty enough to be the next RAZR
Jun 09 21:48:12 <RST38h> You can't write stuff for the web browser
Jun 09 21:48:33 <RST38h> Hey, RAZR became RAZR on the basis of its design
Jun 09 21:48:47 <RST38h> It was sturdid, looked cool for the time, and did the job
Jun 09 21:49:54 <pupnik> ARRRGH
Jun 09 21:50:12 <KotCzarny> hi pupnik
Jun 09 21:50:13 <pupnik> which part of the n8x0 charger plug is positive?  inside or outside?
Jun 09 21:50:19 <RST38h> heheh
Jun 09 21:50:21 <pupnik> greets
Jun 09 21:50:30 <KotCzarny> probably inside
Jun 09 21:50:37 <RST38h> no little picture on the power supply?
Jun 09 21:50:37 <KotCzarny> but use a voltimeter
Jun 09 21:50:42 <KotCzarny> rst: nope
Jun 09 21:50:49 <RST38h> or an led+resistor
Jun 09 21:50:55 <KotCzarny> it's NOKIA
Jun 09 21:50:59 <pupnik> my cable ripped off
Jun 09 21:51:02 <pupnik> i can't measure it
Jun 09 21:51:05 <RST38h> lemme check
Jun 09 21:51:10 <pupnik> THANK YOU!
Jun 09 21:51:11 <KotCzarny> they don't include the picture even on phone chargers
Jun 09 21:52:07 <RST38h> nope, no picture =(
Jun 09 21:52:19 <GeneralAntilles> Anybody have an opinion on whether MAG should go on the front page under Community here? http://wiki.maemo.org/Main_Page
Jun 09 21:52:25 <KotCzarny> k, i'll get a voltimeter
Jun 09 21:53:10 <RST38h> I recently recieved a 'broken' iRiver H120 from my brother. He had been charging it with a Nokia charger.
Jun 09 21:53:10 <RST38h> I've looked into the spec of the Nokia charger and the polarity is the same as iRiver charger (center positive).
Jun 09 21:53:11 <RST38h> The difference is the voltage and current, both less than the proper charger.
Jun 09 21:53:16 <RST38h> here
Jun 09 21:54:05 <pupnik> ok
Jun 09 21:54:23 <pupnik> looking to verify that tho - hopefully kotc finds his meter
Jun 09 21:54:36 * lcuk wonders how many other commercial apps there are out there
Jun 09 21:54:52 <GeneralAntilles> In general? Lots. :P
Jun 09 21:54:53 <RST38h> for Maemo?
Jun 09 21:54:58 <lcuk> yer
Jun 09 21:55:04 <RST38h> not a lot
Jun 09 21:55:07 <GeneralAntilles> About 4
Jun 09 21:55:09 <GeneralAntilles> Maybe 3
Jun 09 21:55:20 <RST38h> but a lot of academic stuff - maemo makes a very good research platform
Jun 09 21:55:30 <RST38h> just look at your own work =)
Jun 09 21:55:56 <lcuk> yes and thats what is weighing heavily on my mind, im thinking beyond this platform
Jun 09 21:56:16 <RST38h> there isn'tmuch beyond this platform for now
Jun 09 21:56:28 <lcuk> you must have your eyes closed then :)
Jun 09 21:56:44 <RST38h> you will have to wait for 6-12 months until other touch-based devices start appearing
Jun 09 21:56:55 <RST38h> lcuk: Well, let us see what is available
Jun 09 21:57:22 <RST38h> There is ASUS EEEh and its clones. These are normal laptops, just small ones
Jun 09 21:57:32 <RST38h> Nothing to touch in general
Jun 09 21:57:49 <RST38h> There is iPhone. But its development is kinda closed.
Jun 09 21:57:57 <lcuk> what about the whole smart phone devices?
Jun 09 21:58:06 <lcuk> full s60 stack etc
Jun 09 21:58:12 <RST38h> There is Moblin, but it only works on the samsung UMPC, a beast
Jun 09 21:58:26 <RST38h> Ok, I was going to get to those in a moment
Jun 09 21:58:32 <lcuk> the "other" n series devices which get all the love
Jun 09 21:58:50 <RST38h> Let us get WinMobile out of the way first mostly because developing for it is torture
Jun 09 21:59:02 <RST38h> We have got S60 and UIQ devices left
Jun 09 21:59:06 <lcuk> i know that - i have done it
Jun 09 21:59:10 <RST38h> Current S60 devices have no touch screen
Jun 09 21:59:25 <KotCzarny> yeah
Jun 09 21:59:28 <KotCzarny> + inside
Jun 09 21:59:30 <RST38h> Which leaves you with UIQ devices. UIQ actually has a very nice SDK
Jun 09 21:59:33 <KotCzarny> - on the outside
Jun 09 21:59:36 <KotCzarny> 6.24V
Jun 09 21:59:36 <RST38h> Better than S60
Jun 09 22:00:07 <RST38h> Too bad most UIQ firmwares are buggy like hell and SE does not try marketing its UIQ devices well enough
Jun 09 22:00:55 <pupnik> thanks a lot KotCzarny
Jun 09 22:01:00 * KotCzarny nods
Jun 09 22:01:14 <RST38h> lcuk: So, back to square one - unless you want to try your luck with a UIQ phone, have to wait
Jun 09 22:01:24 <lcuk> pupnik, you are aware you should keep nokia power supplies away from body parts :P its much simpler to be refreshed by a drink
Jun 09 22:02:57 <lcuk> i never left square one, i was musing about other platforms, you've added a couple of specifics but i was thinking in general
Jun 09 22:03:15 <lcuk> we have had touch devices now for years
Jun 09 22:03:39 <lcuk> they are sold every day and software has to be written for them - things like nav systems etc
Jun 09 22:04:55 <lcuk> theres all the archos devices and other media players..
Jun 09 22:05:04 <KotCzarny> archos.. *shrugs*
Jun 09 22:05:22 <KotCzarny> closed as hell
Jun 09 22:05:25 <lcuk> we are certainly not an island - im just wondering why we have little commercial software here is all :)
Jun 09 22:05:43 <lardman> because it can be done with open source
Jun 09 22:05:55 <lardman> and because the community are savvy enough to do it if they want it
Jun 09 22:06:10 <lcuk> but commercial != closed source
Jun 09 22:06:17 <lardman> if the reach of the device broadens, then we may see commercial as they can't be bothered/are not able
Jun 09 22:06:48 <lardman> lcuk: go back to savvy, if it's open, it will be compiled, we don't yet need hands holding
Jun 09 22:07:03 <lcuk> we dont, but users do
Jun 09 22:07:22 <lardman> even the users are pretty technologically minded
Jun 09 22:08:04 <lcuk> i could never see my missus using apt or knowing about repos and stuff - thats why the .install files work
Jun 09 22:08:27 <lardman> of course, they are great
Jun 09 22:08:38 <lcuk> im only pondering cos i saw a single piece of commercial closed sw ;)
Jun 09 22:08:43 <lardman> they save time, which is a wonderful thing in my book
Jun 09 22:08:58 <lardman> lcuk: what was that? Wifi stuff?
Jun 09 22:09:08 <lcuk> yer - like me, i bought this device cos i needed something to get my teeth into :)
Jun 09 22:09:53 <lcuk> actually, it might not even have been commercial - it was closed lol but from a symbian developer
Jun 09 22:10:46 <RST38h> why no commercial software for tablets?
Jun 09 22:10:47 <lcuk> i went reading round their site and seeing what they do, and lots of sw is like pda style - you buy what you need to save time
Jun 09 22:11:00 <RST38h> well, because there is no market: the userbase is small
Jun 09 22:11:09 <lardman> and the userbase doens't want commercial
Jun 09 22:11:21 <lcuk> but what about maps?
Jun 09 22:11:26 * RST38h considered releasing his emulators on Maemo for a fee but decided against it
Jun 09 22:11:48 <lcuk> i know we have routed round the problem with maemo-mapper, but it still exists and the buy now wasnt put there for nothing
Jun 09 22:11:49 <pupnik> wow, with my different 5.0 v source, the n810 boots when i plug it in, then it makes a sad beep and says "not charging"
Jun 09 22:12:01 <RST38h> Not enough potential buyers to justify it, better use the platform to debug new features
Jun 09 22:12:23 <lardman> lcuk: maps is not a big thing for me, the osm stuff is pretty good
Jun 09 22:12:42 <RST38h> lcuk: Well, the builtin mapping app is a lemon
Jun 09 22:12:43 <lcuk> i could have done with maemomapper in germany ;)
Jun 09 22:12:55 <RST38h> lcuk: Just ignore it, easier this way
Jun 09 22:13:00 <pupnik> how are your feet healing lcuk?
Jun 09 22:13:25 <lcuk> very well thanks pupnik :) though i now have urges to randomly wander the streets
Jun 09 22:13:29 <lardman> lcuk: before the days of agsp, so would have taken you as long to get a lock as to trawl every bar & restaurant looking for us ;)
Jun 09 22:13:38 <lardman> s/agsp/agps
Jun 09 22:13:40 <RST38h> As to general map availability, there are maps from commercial packages available on the net, just need to parse them
Jun 09 22:13:53 <RST38h> lcuk: what happened with your feet? =)
Jun 09 22:14:05 <lcuk> shoes at end of life
Jun 09 22:14:13 <RST38h> ah
Jun 09 22:14:14 <lcuk> newish as well, only a couple of months old
Jun 09 22:16:17 <RST38h> all right, sleep
Jun 09 22:16:22 <KotCzarny> pupnik: try 6.24V source?
Jun 09 22:16:24 <lcuk> gnite rst
Jun 09 22:16:32 <lardman> aaargh, why are my values changing enroute from DSP to ARM?
Jun 09 22:16:36 <KotCzarny> or maybe this charger does some magic
Jun 09 22:16:38 <RST38h> two more work days and a long weekend
Jun 09 22:16:55 <KotCzarny> lardman: endiannes?
Jun 09 22:17:15 <lardman> KotCzarny: nah, dealing with 16bit values, plus the values coming out don't look like that
Jun 09 22:17:36 <lcuk> what are you doing to move the data? writing to normal memory from your onchip dsp buffer?
Jun 09 22:17:36 <KotCzarny> undocumented ops?
Jun 09 22:17:48 <pupnik> KotCzarny: that's what you measured?
Jun 09 22:17:56 <KotCzarny> pupnik: yeah
Jun 09 22:18:02 <KotCzarny> but may be 5V under load etc
Jun 09 22:18:10 <pupnik> Cause i have 5.7 sitting here, measures 6.15 without load
Jun 09 22:18:15 <lardman> probably an error on my part, but I can't see it
Jun 09 22:18:15 <pupnik> the 5.0 must have been too low
Jun 09 22:18:16 <pupnik> thanks
Jun 09 22:18:27 <pupnik> bbl
Jun 09 22:30:47 * GeneralAntilles beats his head against mediawiki tables.
Jun 09 22:38:06 * lardman joins in with the head hitting
Jun 09 22:38:14 * KotCzarny leans back
Jun 09 22:38:19 <KotCzarny> more blood!
Jun 09 22:39:20 <Mousey> uh
Jun 09 22:39:39 <lardman> I can't see it, I feel like crying
Jun 09 22:39:48 <lardman> or beating my computer to a pulp :)
Jun 09 22:40:08 * Mousey senses windows users
Jun 09 22:40:27 <lardman> Mousey: feels like that, but no, it's a dsp
Jun 09 22:40:53 <Mousey> the sound kind?
Jun 09 22:41:03 <Mousey> or just random signals from outer space
Jun 09 22:41:08 <lardman> well whatever you give it really, but in this case yes
Jun 09 22:41:16 <lardman> sbc to be exact
Jun 09 22:41:42 <GeneralAntilles> The mediawiki help pages pretty much suck ass.
Jun 09 22:41:47 * Mousey skims the scrollback and decides he's teh wrong mouse for the job
Jun 09 22:56:22 <CrashandDie> Why is it I can't find x-chat for OS2008 ???
Jun 09 22:56:33 <GeneralAntilles> http://zeus.rm-fr.net/~skyhusker/xchat-chinook-betas/
Jun 09 22:56:33 <CrashandDie> And when the hell is diablo going to be released ?
Jun 09 22:56:38 <GeneralAntilles> When it's ready.
Jun 09 22:56:49 <CrashandDie> yeah, that, I know
Jun 09 22:57:05 <CrashandDie> but that's a bit like saying "After rain there will be sunshine"
Jun 09 22:57:10 <shapr> Has anyone done anything to get the NITs and the OLPC XO to work together at all?
Jun 09 22:57:12 <CrashandDie> Just say "we don't know"
Jun 09 22:57:26 <GeneralAntilles> We do know, though, and that answer is "when it's ready"
Jun 09 22:57:26 <CrashandDie> thanks for the link though
Jun 09 22:57:36 <GeneralAntilles> Which will be sometime within the next 2 weeks to 2 months
Jun 09 22:58:36 <CrashandDie> well that's an answer
Jun 09 22:58:37 <GeneralAntilles> ~lart mediawiki
Jun 09 22:58:38 * infobot flings poo at mediawiki
Jun 09 22:59:06 <CrashandDie> "Between this and september"... At least that gives some kind of timeframe
Jun 09 22:59:07 <GeneralAntilles> Thanks, infobot!
Jun 09 22:59:24 <GeneralAntilles> August at the outside
Jun 09 22:59:27 <GeneralAntilles> Not September
Jun 09 23:00:35 <lardman> night all
Jun 09 23:17:14 <Anunakin> Any using diablo?
Jun 09 23:18:16 <GeneralAntilles> Yo
Jun 09 23:20:52 <rm_you> Any using OmniWeb?
Jun 09 23:22:30 <CrashandDie> GeneralAntilles, that a remix between yes and no ?
Jun 09 23:23:22 <GeneralAntilles> Yo, rm_you! :P
Jun 09 23:23:28 <GeneralAntilles> Something of an Americanism I guess
Jun 09 23:23:37 <rm_you> Yo yo, sup foo?
Jun 09 23:23:41 <rm_you> :P
Jun 09 23:23:46 <rm_you> Gangsta
Jun 09 23:23:50 <GeneralAntilles> Not really
Jun 09 23:23:54 <rm_you> lool
Jun 09 23:23:59 <GeneralAntilles> Though it's used in that context
Jun 09 23:27:51 <acydlord> G'day folks
Jun 09 23:35:17 <summatusmentis> GeneralAntilles: did you hear anything about Snow Leopard?
Jun 09 23:38:08 <GeneralAntilles> Only that it's the new codename
Jun 09 23:38:09 <timelyx> be careful around Finns
Jun 09 23:38:26 <GeneralAntilles> Haven't gotten around to paying attention to the WWDC fallout.
Jun 09 23:38:36 <GeneralAntilles> Hi, timelyx.
Jun 09 23:40:41 <rm_you> timelyx: going to work today? :P err... tomorrow I guess techinically? :P
Jun 09 23:41:13 <acydlord> oh dear, i thought this would be one of the few safe places from all the wwdc talk
Jun 09 23:42:00 <GeneralAntilles> summatusmentis, as good a summary as any: http://www.macrumors.com/2008/06/09/mac-os-x-snow-leopard-to-focus-on-performance-quality/
Jun 09 23:44:23 <timelyx> rm_you: it's 2:45am
Jun 09 23:44:28 <timelyx> so today technically
Jun 09 23:44:35 <timelyx> and as long as i wake up, yeah i suppose so
Jun 09 23:47:05 <rm_you> timelyx: lol
Jun 09 23:50:17 <zen__> hi
Jun 09 23:50:37 <GeneralAntilles> X-Fade, ping
Jun 09 23:58:14 <GeneralAntilles> X-Fade, just went ahead and filed an enhancement request.
Jun 10 00:00:22 <Anunakin> GeneralAntilles: to install diablo... is only change chinnok to diablo on apt config files and use apt-get upgrade?
Jun 10 00:00:57 <GeneralAntilles> Figure out the repository password, change the entry in the sources list to Diablo, and follow these steps: http://mariusv.wordpress.com/2008/05/07/a-pleasant-surprise/
Jun 10 00:06:19 <Anunakin> ok
Jun 10 00:06:21 <Anunakin> thanks
Jun 10 00:07:53 <Anunakin> I go try it
Jun 10 00:30:42 <dick-richardson> no n810 yet :(
Jun 10 00:32:30 <GAN800> dick-richardson, you could make a paper N810 to act as a proxy to dull the pain while you wait. :P
Jun 10 00:33:05 <Navi> Woo
Jun 10 00:33:35 <dick-richardson> I'm about that desperate
Jun 10 00:34:07 <dick-richardson> I carry around the warranty repair and check the status frequently
Jun 10 00:34:14 <GAN800> Naw, what are you gonna remember not to do after you get your next tablet. ;)
Jun 10 00:34:38 <GAN800> s/Naw/Now/
Jun 10 00:34:38 <infobot> GAN800 meant: Now, what are you gonna remember not to do after you get your next tablet. ;)
Jun 10 00:34:53 <dick-richardson> sell this one...right there with ya
Jun 10 00:35:28 <GAN800> Backup tablets ftw! :D
Jun 10 00:36:12 <dick-richardson> i wish woot.com would get one
Jun 10 00:37:16 <dick-richardson> I could get a 770 for cheap
Jun 10 00:38:44 <GeneralAntilles> I used mine as couch/nightstand IRC/web/ebook machines.
Jun 10 00:38:54 <GeneralAntilles> Oh, and Gizmo handsets.
Jun 10 00:40:05 <dick-richardson> I will just forget that I sold my n800 for the same amount I'm buying a 770
Jun 10 00:40:29 <GeneralAntilles> The 770 is a neat machine.
Jun 10 00:40:41 <KotCzarny> then it's not cheap
Jun 10 00:40:48 <KotCzarny> how much it was?
Jun 10 00:40:51 <dick-richardson> $100
Jun 10 00:41:07 <KotCzarny> o.o
Jun 10 00:41:15 <KotCzarny> dirt cheap.
Jun 10 00:41:27 <KotCzarny> you could easily reach 200$
Jun 10 00:41:33 <dick-richardson> we're not going to focus on that :P
Jun 10 00:41:51 <KotCzarny> let me know when you will be selling that n810
Jun 10 00:41:53 * KotCzarny grins
Jun 10 00:42:02 <timelyx> heh
Jun 10 00:44:42 <dick-richardson> it'll go on sale 2 product cycles away
Jun 10 00:45:29 <KotCzarny> :)
Jun 10 00:45:35 <dick-richardson> is diablo going to be released with a hardware platform, or just a firmware upgrade for existing machines?
Jun 10 00:45:51 <GeneralAntilles> With the N810W
Jun 10 00:46:06 <GeneralAntilles> Around that time, presumably, anyway.
Jun 10 00:46:10 <KotCzarny> backward compatible though
Jun 10 00:46:21 <KotCzarny> so it's for n8x0
Jun 10 00:46:33 <dick-richardson> I'd thought it was already being sold
Jun 10 00:46:47 <GeneralAntilles> July, probably.
Jun 10 00:47:43 <rm_you> n810W!?
Jun 10 00:47:46 <rm_you> srsly?!
Jun 10 00:47:52 <dick-richardson> wimax
Jun 10 00:47:53 * rm_you is SOOOO out of the loop
Jun 10 00:47:55 <rm_you> yeah
Jun 10 00:48:04 <rm_you> didnt know that was comin round till the next major revision
Jun 10 00:50:18 <KotCzarny> chinook is 4.0.1, diablo is 4.1
Jun 10 00:50:28 <KotCzarny> so it's not that major
Jun 10 00:50:57 <GeneralAntilles> rm_you, fail.
Jun 10 00:55:07 <summatusmentis> rm_you: where have you been?
Jun 10 01:20:18 <pupnik> this fnordianslip person could be interesting
Jun 10 01:20:25 <shapr> fnord
Jun 10 01:21:12 <summatusmentis> how many of you are buying the n810w?
Jun 10 01:21:33 <shapr> I won't, it doesn't support any of the unlicensed WiMAX frequencies.
Jun 10 01:22:15 <GeneralAntilles> I have 3g. :P
Jun 10 01:24:02 <pupnik> you're a great maemo person GeneralAntilles
Jun 10 01:24:10 <pupnik> why do you care about the tablets
Jun 10 01:24:14 <summatusmentis> GeneralAntilles: yeah sure, rub it in
Jun 10 01:25:22 <GeneralAntilles> Why? Hrm. I guess because it's really the perfect handheld device for me.
Jun 10 01:25:29 <GeneralAntilles> I like the community, I like the product
Jun 10 01:25:40 <GeneralAntilles> I'd like to see them really become something great.
Jun 10 01:25:40 <shapr> And it distracts him from tremulous.
Jun 10 01:25:44 <GeneralAntilles> Hehe
Jun 10 01:25:50 <pupnik> do you care about freedom from tyranny?
Jun 10 01:26:09 <summatusmentis> w00t tyranny!
Jun 10 01:26:23 <GeneralAntilles> Well, DUH. :P But that's not a huge factor in my caring about the tablets.
Jun 10 01:26:34 <pupnik> it is for me
Jun 10 01:26:47 <pupnik> helping linux into the pocket is pretty important
Jun 10 01:27:06 <summatusmentis> "is that a linux in your pocket, or are you just happy to see me?"
Jun 10 01:27:15 <pupnik> do you have any idea what kind of terminator style future is in store for us?
Jun 10 01:27:27 <summatusmentis> I'm hoping for it
Jun 10 01:27:37 <pupnik> summatusmentis: do you suck cock for a living too?
Jun 10 01:27:52 <summatusmentis> only if I'm paid well enough
Jun 10 01:27:57 <summatusmentis> I do have standards you know
Jun 10 01:28:01 <acydlord> hmm, i wonder how long it will take to download the dev environment on evdo
Jun 10 01:28:10 <pupnik> no you've said enough summatusmentis
Jun 10 01:28:12 <pupnik> plonked
Jun 10 01:28:18 <summatusmentis> plonked?
Jun 10 01:28:31 <summatusmentis> acydlord: who's your ev-do provider?
Jun 10 01:28:37 <acydlord> sprint
Jun 10 01:28:53 <summatusmentis> any chance you're in the western MN area?
Jun 10 01:29:06 <acydlord> but unfortunately due to crummy drivers my evdo speed is usually in the upper 300s
Jun 10 01:29:06 <summatusmentis> or mid-northern maine area?
Jun 10 01:29:18 <acydlord> nah, im in the southwest, arizona to be specific
Jun 10 01:29:26 <summatusmentis> that's useless to me :)
Jun 10 01:29:39 * summatusmentis is hoping to go Sprint SERO soon
Jun 10 01:30:13 <acydlord> i'm hoping to go with xohm here in a few months
Jun 10 01:31:42 <summatusmentis> I'm always so behind the times
Jun 10 01:36:19 <acydlord> anyone know the size of the maemo SDK?
Jun 10 01:37:05 <KotCzarny> ~500-1500mb
Jun 10 01:37:28 <KotCzarny> depending on how many packages you additionally install
Jun 10 01:37:38 <acydlord> ouch, that shalnt be fun on the evdo
Jun 10 01:37:49 <acydlord> mayhaps i'll pilfer someone's wifi to get it
Jun 10 01:38:02 <KotCzarny> :)
Jun 10 01:38:10 <KotCzarny> well, that's installed size
Jun 10 01:38:23 <KotCzarny> download is still ~300-500mb
Jun 10 01:38:26 <acydlord> ahh
Jun 10 01:38:32 <acydlord> thats not too terribly bad
Jun 10 01:40:38 <acydlord> i've got 420k down at the moment
Jun 10 01:40:56 <acydlord> unfortunately my phone's dun connection doesnt want to work with my one running linux box
Jun 10 01:44:22 <GeneralAntilles> The iPhone thread makes me laugh
Jun 10 01:44:31 <GeneralAntilles> All those old itT trolls are screaming out of the woodwork for it.
Jun 10 01:45:13 <ido--> where's minisip?
Jun 10 01:45:52 <GeneralAntilles> ido--, use rtcomm?
Jun 10 01:45:53 <ido--> for the nokia
Jun 10 01:46:42 <ido--> does it work on the n770?
Jun 10 01:47:09 <GeneralAntilles> If you're using a hacker edition.
Jun 10 01:48:36 <ido--> i am
Jun 10 02:05:11 <christefano> is anyone here on the maemo.com web team?
Jun 10 02:06:21 <GeneralAntilles> maemo.org
Jun 10 02:06:24 <GeneralAntilles> and, yes, X-Fade
Jun 10 02:06:27 <GeneralAntilles> but he's sleeping
Jun 10 02:07:20 <GeneralAntilles> christefano, if you have a bug or a specific feature request, please see bugs.maemo.org
Jun 10 02:07:46 <christefano> right, maemo.org. I'll see bugs.maemo.org, thanks
Jun 10 02:08:36 <christefano> okay, the bug isn't listed. it's security related, so I'll talk to X-Fade when I see him.
Jun 10 02:11:26 <GeneralAntilles> christefano, he's usually available around 0700-1500 UTC
Jun 10 02:11:51 <christefano> sounds good. thanks, GeneralAntilles
Jun 10 02:28:23 <summatusmentis> does anyone know if there's a way to re-size partitons on the internal sd card in a n810?
Jun 10 02:31:56 <zerosum> is there any way to copy paragraphs while using the browser?
Jun 10 02:32:19 <zerosum> if I tap twice with stylus it highlights a single word
Jun 10 02:32:32 <zerosum> but I want to copy a whole paragraph
Jun 10 02:33:08 <KotCzarny> summa: just use usb cable
Jun 10 02:33:15 <KotCzarny> and some partition magic
Jun 10 02:33:44 <KotCzarny> (i assume mswin)
Jun 10 02:35:01 <GeneralAntilles> zerosum, tap, tap-drag
Jun 10 02:35:54 <zerosum> thx
Jun 10 02:36:19 <summatusmentis> oh crap!
Jun 10 02:36:30 <summatusmentis> I think I just deleted everything off of my n810
Jun 10 02:38:05 <KotCzarny> lol
Jun 10 02:38:28 <summatusmentis> no, you don't even know
Jun 10 02:38:28 <KotCzarny> btw. you should n810 partition table if you haven't done before
Jun 10 02:38:49 <summatusmentis> I installed util-linux, and apt-get removed everything
Jun 10 02:38:53 <summatusmentis> I should what?
Jun 10 02:39:51 <KotCzarny> factory formatted at the wrong size
Jun 10 02:40:00 <KotCzarny> so corruption is inevitable sooner or later
Jun 10 02:40:28 <KotCzarny> so you should backup data from sd, remove partition table, create again, format, restore data
Jun 10 02:40:59 <zerosum> if im in the terminal window how do i mount the removable card?
Jun 10 02:41:28 <summatusmentis> well, I'm reflashing anyway, I'm just gonna delete everything :)
Jun 10 02:41:43 <KotCzarny> summa, there should be thread about it on itt
Jun 10 02:42:08 <summatusmentis> thanks, I'll look into it, after I can fix the white screen on my n810 :)
Jun 10 02:44:22 <zerosum> any one know how to switch to the removable card in the terminal window?
Jun 10 02:45:35 <KotCzarny> just open/close it's door
Jun 10 02:45:54 <zerosum> ha
Jun 10 02:46:01 <zerosum> i mean im on the prompt
Jun 10 02:46:09 <zerosum> and i want to mount the card
Jun 10 02:46:17 <zerosum> so that i can run a file that is on it
Jun 10 02:46:45 <KotCzarny> mount /dev/mmcblk0p1 /media/mmc2
Jun 10 02:46:47 <KotCzarny> or something
**** ENDING LOGGING AT Tue Jun 10 02:59:56 2008