**** BEGIN LOGGING AT Thu Aug 21 02:59:56 2008
Aug 21 03:17:45 <GeneralAntilles> Interesting bit on OMAP3: http://www.embedded.com/underthehood/210101486;jsessionid=S1PIBDKTEA45IQSNDLOSKH0CJUNN2JVN
Aug 21 03:19:34 <mgedmin> hey, did the last diablo os update (the first one that was apt-gettable) have a changelog?
Aug 21 03:19:41 <mgedmin> "email and browser changes" is a bit vague
Aug 21 03:21:54 <GeneralAntilles> Modest and MicroB updates
Aug 21 03:21:59 <GeneralAntilles> some fixes to text input
Aug 21 03:22:09 <GeneralAntilles> and some fixes to icd2
Aug 21 03:22:24 <GeneralAntilles> Modest had a lot of its larger bugs fixed
Aug 21 03:22:31 <GeneralAntilles> MicroB had some pretty big performance boosts
Aug 21 03:23:19 <moontiger> does anyone know how to mount my n810 over sshfs NOT as root on the n810?
Aug 21 03:23:22 <GeneralAntilles> mgedmin, http://tinyurl.com/5axvau
Aug 21 03:23:48 <mgedmin> moontiger: I do
Aug 21 03:24:04 <moontiger> ummmmm could you enlighten me please :)
Aug 21 03:24:34 <mgedmin> moontiger@laptop $ sshfs user@n810:/ my-n810
Aug 21 03:24:36 <brontide> bah, any pymaemo/pygtk experts... why does showing a dialog during a gobject.idle_add function cause the app to hang
Aug 21 03:25:10 <moontiger> mgedmin, then it asks for a password and user doesnt have one
Aug 21 03:25:13 <moontiger> thats where im stuck
Aug 21 03:25:30 <mgedmin> set up pubkey auth
Aug 21 03:25:38 <brontide> sudo gainroot; passwd user ?
Aug 21 03:25:41 <mgedmin> if you don't have a ssh key, generate one with ssh-keygen
Aug 21 03:25:49 <mgedmin> then ssh-copy-id user@my-n810
Aug 21 03:25:53 <moontiger> ughhhhhhh really? :|
Aug 21 03:26:01 <mgedmin> type in your password... aaah!
Aug 21 03:26:13 <mgedmin> duh, of course 'user' has no password, and that's why you have problems
Aug 21 03:26:14 <moontiger> this doesnt affect me actually USING my n810 afterwards does it?
Aug 21 03:27:04 <gregorovius__> nope
Aug 21 03:27:18 <moontiger> so the password key is only for remote connections yes?
Aug 21 03:27:28 <moontiger> (sorry im being dumb)
Aug 21 03:27:49 <gregorovius__> i created a password for user to login first, did the rest over ssh and then removed the passwd again
Aug 21 03:27:55 <mgedmin> anyway, if you copy ~/.ssh/id_rsa.pub to your n810 and put it into /home/user/.ssh/authorized_keys, you'll be able to do passwordless logins
Aug 21 03:29:05 <moontiger> so ssh-keygen makes that file yes?
Aug 21 03:29:52 <gregorovius__> yes. if yu have gnome you can do it all with seahorse, btw
Aug 21 03:30:11 <moontiger> i use xubuntu these days ... gnome i guess
Aug 21 03:30:24 <moontiger> ok i got the .pub file
Aug 21 03:30:34 <moontiger> now copy to my n810 and voila! yes?
Aug 21 03:31:51 <gregorovius__> pretty much
Aug 21 03:32:30 <moontiger> ok so cool ... thnx so much ... again ! :)
Aug 21 03:33:24 <gregorovius__> funky
Aug 21 03:35:05 <moontiger> hmmmmm still not working
Aug 21 03:37:04 <moontiger> is .ssh/autorized_keys a directory?
Aug 21 03:41:13 <gregorovius__> no, it's a file
Aug 21 03:43:16 <moontiger> so i rename the .pub file? im confused :|
Aug 21 03:48:12 <gregorovius__> moontiger, copy the contents into the  file
Aug 21 03:48:12 <moontiger> ok i think i got it .... the "cat blah >> blee" thing threw me :/
Aug 21 03:48:28 <moontiger> sorry for being dumb ... this stuff is kinda new to me
Aug 21 03:48:35 <moontiger> i got it now :)
Aug 21 03:48:37 <moontiger> thnx
Aug 21 03:49:36 <_gregorovius_> no problem :)
Aug 21 03:50:15 <moontiger> thats so cool :) now i can stop using sbox so much :)
Aug 21 03:56:34 <moontiger> way cool ... now i have to fully hildonize my app ... its running ok enough already ... exciting :)
Aug 21 04:02:06 <moontiger> omg i can actually edit ON the n810! that is way cool :)
Aug 21 04:25:07 <bef0rd> cool moontiger
Aug 21 04:25:13 <bef0rd> what are you developing on?
Aug 21 04:25:26 <bef0rd> I mean, python, c?
Aug 21 04:25:33 <moontiger> well im using python to write a desktop applet
Aug 21 04:25:40 <moontiger> my first attempt
Aug 21 04:25:41 <moontiger> :)
Aug 21 04:27:10 <bef0rd> oh cool
Aug 21 04:27:18 * bef0rd needs some python / gtk help
Aug 21 04:30:42 <moontiger> maybe i can help :)
Aug 21 04:30:49 <moontiger> wassup?
Aug 21 04:33:05 <moontiger> bef0rd, what do you need help with?
Aug 21 04:33:36 <bef0rd> heh ok
Aug 21 04:33:45 <bef0rd> I really know zero about GTK
Aug 21 04:34:01 <bef0rd> I was trying to make this simple app
Aug 21 04:34:31 <bef0rd> It'll download a random image from a server every X minutes, and display it
Aug 21 04:36:46 <bef0rd> This is what I've done so far
Aug 21 04:36:47 <bef0rd> http://slexy.org/view/s20tOXI9AT
Aug 21 04:37:20 <bef0rd> I'm new to python as well :P
Aug 21 04:41:34 <bef0rd> so, what it does atm is to load the random image but only once the app is loaded
Aug 21 04:41:50 <bef0rd> I can't figure out how to make it change the image
Aug 21 04:51:22 * moontiger is looking
Aug 21 04:52:27 <moontiger> bef0rd, im looking and i can see some stuff that could be better :)
Aug 21 04:53:33 <bef0rd> cool :)
Aug 21 04:53:39 <moontiger> bef0rd, is the image getting saved to the nokia?
Aug 21 04:54:05 <bef0rd> atm it is
Aug 21 04:54:20 <bef0rd> I suppose I can add an option to 'cache' the images
Aug 21 04:54:47 <bef0rd> if the user disables it, it will delete it before loading it
Aug 21 04:55:36 <moontiger> so whats not happening?
Aug 21 04:56:04 <moontiger> ahhhhhhhhh sorry ... i just read above
Aug 21 04:56:11 <bef0rd> yep that
Aug 21 04:56:59 <moontiger> btw... all that "window = hildon.Window()" then "self.window = window" isnt necessary
Aug 21 04:57:10 <moontiger> just do "self.window = hildon.Window()"
Aug 21 04:58:36 <moontiger> also... i dont see why you would do threading in this context ... seems unnecessary to me
Aug 21 04:58:43 <Dekaritae> Could someone test something for me?
Aug 21 04:58:56 <moontiger> the problem is ... where are you calling the "getcat" function from?
Aug 21 04:58:58 <Dekaritae> If I try to load this image in Image Viewer, it crashes
Aug 21 04:59:07 <moontiger> Dekaritae, what image?
Aug 21 04:59:07 <Dekaritae> http://dekaritae.nothingtrend.com/uploads/Translink_Vancouver.gif
Aug 21 04:59:59 <moontiger> Dekaritae, works fine here
Aug 21 05:00:05 <Dekaritae> Hmm
Aug 21 05:02:03 <Dekaritae> Oki thanks
Aug 21 05:02:32 <bef0rd> moontiger, the 'changeCat' method?
Aug 21 05:02:44 <moontiger> bef0rd, yes
Aug 21 05:03:21 <bef0rd> I think I'm calling it from 'outside' of the program class, 'Meow'
Aug 21 05:03:23 <moontiger> oh i see...
Aug 21 05:03:32 <moontiger> why not just use a timer inside the class?
Aug 21 05:03:52 <bef0rd> oh, that could work heh
Aug 21 05:03:58 <bef0rd> a timer with gobject?
Aug 21 05:04:09 <bef0rd> or is there any other approach?
Aug 21 05:04:40 <moontiger> a gobject.time_out()
Aug 21 05:05:31 <bef0rd> ok so where should I put the timer?
Aug 21 05:05:33 <moontiger> there are always many other ways ... some better ... some not so ... its all choice but i would use a gobject.timeout_add()
Aug 21 05:05:45 <bef0rd> _init?
Aug 21 05:05:54 <moontiger> well you kick it off in the init function so it starts with the app
Aug 21 05:06:02 <moontiger> then in the timer handler you re-init it
Aug 21 05:06:03 <bef0rd> ok
Aug 21 05:06:06 * bef0rd tries
Aug 21 05:07:43 <moontiger> have a look in there for some ideas :)
Aug 21 05:07:50 <bef0rd> thanks
Aug 21 05:08:05 <bef0rd> let's see if the file transfer works heh
Aug 21 05:13:51 <moontiger> try one more time
Aug 21 05:14:03 <moontiger> or msg me ur email and i'll send
Aug 21 05:14:29 <bef0rd> thanks, munozferna at gmail.com
Aug 21 05:16:44 <moontiger> ok gimme 2mins
Aug 21 05:18:08 <moontiger> chk email ... from "lauren" ;)
Aug 21 05:28:23 * brontide beats gtk to a bloody pulp
Aug 21 05:29:02 <bef0rd> moontiger, thanks again
Aug 21 05:29:12 <moontiger> bef0rd, glad to help :)
Aug 21 05:29:33 <moontiger> awwwwwwwwww brontide wassup with gtk now?
Aug 21 05:29:42 <brontide> Finally figured out that both idle_add and threads require a gtk.gdk.threads_init() and enter/leave blocks, but gobject style stuff doesn't work
Aug 21 05:30:34 <brontide> Now almost all blocking stuff is idle'ed or threaded under DialCentral fka Grandcentral Dialer and it's far more responsive
Aug 21 05:30:47 <brontide> ( not that it was bad before )
Aug 21 05:30:51 <brontide> ;-)
Aug 21 06:00:27 <pupnik> ahha
Aug 21 06:00:28 <pupnik> ah a
Aug 21 06:00:29 <pupnik>  ahan
Aug 21 06:01:10 <pupnik> nah
Aug 21 06:01:57 <n800n> take on me?
Aug 21 06:02:20 <zap> uh, uhuh, huhuh, huhhh
Aug 21 06:06:34 <moontiger> Khertan, how do i package my applet up for dist? its still rough but it works so i would love to get some feedback from a few users :)
Aug 21 06:08:40 * zap hates python applets, they eat up CPU
Aug 21 06:08:46 <zap> and battery
Aug 21 06:10:19 <n800n> what applet
Aug 21 06:11:09 <zap> home*
Aug 21 06:12:46 <moontiger> ummmmm sheesh.... im scared to say now :|
Aug 21 06:13:25 <moontiger> it get stuff from google calendar and show it on the home screen
Aug 21 06:13:25 <n800n> don't listen to the python haters
Aug 21 06:13:41 <n800n> cool
Aug 21 06:14:15 <moontiger> yah well it kinda works for me as i just want to see a scrollable list of events coming up for as far into the future as i choose
Aug 21 06:14:16 <pupnik> fuck all of us
Aug 21 06:14:17 <pupnik> death death death comes
Aug 21 06:14:58 <moontiger> its my forst app for maemo so it has a lot of room for improvement but it does work and do something useful already
Aug 21 06:15:03 <moontiger> forst = first
Aug 21 06:15:04 <n800n> moontiger, i'd try it bu i've never used google calendar
Aug 21 06:15:35 <moontiger> heh i only use it for work stuff ... this means i wont forget appts
Aug 21 06:15:37 <moontiger> :)
Aug 21 06:15:50 <n800n> unless
Aug 21 06:15:58 <n800n> you're offline
Aug 21 06:16:11 <moontiger> no ... it takes care of that
Aug 21 06:16:17 <moontiger> has local storage etc etc
Aug 21 06:17:06 <zap> moontiger: make sure your applet is inactive at least when desktop is invisible
Aug 21 06:17:27 <pupnik> listen to bach when you die
Aug 21 06:17:33 <pupnik> you will die
Aug 21 06:17:35 <zap> moontiger: I've installed yesterday homeip, homediskfree and homecpu and this morning my N810 was dead
Aug 21 06:17:40 <pupnik> listen to bach
Aug 21 06:18:00 <pupnik> you will die
Aug 21 06:18:01 <zap> yes, Bach is a good addition to python applets
Aug 21 06:18:27 <n800n> :
Aug 21 06:18:33 <n800n> ; /
Aug 21 06:18:40 <n800n> is he  ok
Aug 21 06:18:49 <zap> I hope he's not too drunk :)
Aug 21 06:18:59 <n800n> oh that's all?
Aug 21 06:19:28 <zap> drunk+depression perhaps :)
Aug 21 06:20:00 <n800n> they go together
Aug 21 06:20:25 <n800n> hangovers are there to fix that
Aug 21 06:20:52 <moontiger> zap: ummmmm ... inactive as in?
Aug 21 06:21:28 <moontiger> zap, i c ... this one doesnt poll anything unless you tell it to
Aug 21 06:21:42 <moontiger> it does an initial data load and leaves it until you refresh
Aug 21 06:22:04 <moontiger> there is (will be really soon) to set an auto-update period (in hours)
Aug 21 06:22:15 <moontiger> + an option
Aug 21 06:22:22 <Khertan_n810> zap: python applet don t drain battery
Aug 21 06:22:38 <Khertan_n810> at least if they are well coded
Aug 21 06:23:00 <moontiger> i will leave mine "running" all night to test
Aug 21 06:23:14 <Khertan_n810> as when device idle they idle too
Aug 21 06:23:31 <moontiger> my understanding is that if i draw something to the home screen and do not update it then no battery drain will occur ... correct?
Aug 21 06:23:43 <Khertan_n810> mine have run 7 days without problem
Aug 21 06:24:00 <Khertan_n810> moontiger: correct
Aug 21 06:24:15 <moontiger> Khertan_n810, where can i get your pypackager thingy from?
Aug 21 06:24:54 <Khertan_n810> if you use gobject timeout just shutdown it in the background call back
Aug 21 06:25:17 <Khertan_n810> pypackager is available for chinook but not for diablo
Aug 21 06:25:38 <Khertan_n810> as with diablo you can t upload to repository
Aug 21 06:25:44 <moontiger> background callback: yes nice ... how then do ipackage my lil thingy ?
Aug 21 06:26:00 <Khertan_n810> if you want to diablo repository use py2deb
Aug 21 06:26:09 <moontiger> ok cool thanks :)
Aug 21 06:26:34 <moontiger> my app isnt anywhere near as nice as yours are yet but im still learning :)
Aug 21 06:27:10 <Khertan_n810> install py2deb and look at /usr/lib/python2.5/site-package/py2deb.py
Aug 21 06:27:16 <Khertan_n810> as there is no doc yet
Aug 21 06:27:24 <moontiger> ok will do
Aug 21 06:27:27 <Khertan_n810> i m still learning too
Aug 21 06:27:28 <moontiger> thnx so much :)
Aug 21 06:27:40 <Khertan_n810> and ask if you need help :)
Aug 21 06:27:45 <moontiger> will do :)
Aug 21 06:28:50 <moontiger> its a cmdline tool yes?
Aug 21 06:29:03 <Khertan_n810> http://pastebin.com/f367fb9f
Aug 21 06:29:06 <Khertan_n810> yep
Aug 21 06:31:33 <Khertan_n810> a makefile for py2deb example
Aug 21 06:31:33 <Khertan_n810> in fact the one for mcalendar
Aug 21 06:31:41 <moontiger> ahhhhhhh i see ... you made this specific to mcalendar ... so i just edit the stuff i need and run it yes?
Aug 21 06:32:21 <Khertan_n810> it a example of makefile :)
Aug 21 06:32:27 <Khertan_n810> yep edit it
Aug 21 06:32:29 <moontiger> nice!
Aug 21 06:32:42 <Khertan_n810> and then scp to extras builder
Aug 21 06:32:45 <moontiger> i see you dont put pygtk etc as depends ... can they be relied upon to be there?
Aug 21 06:33:17 <Khertan_n810> it depends of what u need
Aug 21 06:47:32 <Khertan_n810> i m back
Aug 21 07:02:19 <moontiger> on the cellfone connection?
Aug 21 07:02:54 <moontiger> Khertan_n810, how did you get those nice transparent backgrounds? is that the cairo stuff?
Aug 21 07:03:16 <Khertan_n810> yep
Aug 21 07:03:17 <Khertan_n810> cairo
Aug 21 07:03:33 <Khertan_n810> yep cellphone connection
Aug 21 07:03:33 <moontiger> doh! i didnt want to do all that stuff but it looks so nice :|
Aug 21 07:04:02 <Khertan_n810> at home and work i use the nick Khertan
Aug 21 07:04:03 <Khertan_n810> :)
Aug 21 07:04:20 <moontiger> what work do you do?
Aug 21 07:04:24 <moontiger> if its ok to ask
Aug 21 07:05:05 <moontiger> brb making some tea
Aug 21 07:05:31 <Khertan_n810> i m a software engineer
Aug 21 07:05:40 <Khertan_n810> working in small company ...
Aug 21 07:06:10 <Khertan_n810> mainly dev using the rad 4d
Aug 21 07:06:15 <Khertan_n810> 4d.com
Aug 21 07:06:23 <Khertan_n810> a french rad
Aug 21 07:07:27 <moontiger> nice
Aug 21 07:07:37 <moontiger> are you going to be in long beach in october?
Aug 21 07:08:28 <Khertan_n810> long beach ? vacancy ... haha no :)
Aug 21 07:08:40 <Khertan_n810> s/vacancy/holiday
Aug 21 07:08:56 <moontiger> shame ... its quite nice there ... i saw the conference thing on ur company home page
Aug 21 07:09:10 <moontiger> vacation btw ;)
Aug 21 07:09:23 <Khertan_n810> i don t work for 4d i use their tool
Aug 21 07:09:23 <Khertan_n810> :)
Aug 21 07:09:28 <moontiger> ohhhhhhhhhhhhhh
Aug 21 07:09:44 <Khertan_n810> hehe
Aug 21 07:09:44 <moontiger> my bad i misunderstood :)
Aug 21 07:09:46 <Khertan_n810> i work for naxos ...
Aug 21 07:09:46 <Khertan_n810> naxos.fr
Aug 21 07:09:54 <Khertan_n810> which has been bought by nexity
Aug 21 07:10:19 <moontiger> hmmmmm... its all in french ;)
Aug 21 07:10:22 <Khertan_n810> yes i know website is horrible
Aug 21 07:10:25 <moontiger> are u in paris?
Aug 21 07:10:48 <Khertan_n810> yep
Aug 21 07:10:51 <moontiger> nice
Aug 21 07:11:00 <moontiger> im moving to madrid in december :)
Aug 21 07:11:18 <Khertan_n810> in fact at 'issy les moulineaux'
Aug 21 07:11:48 <Khertan_n810> a south city of paris
Aug 21 07:12:16 <Khertan_n810> but my office is at 300 of paris border :)
Aug 21 07:12:18 <Khertan_n810> 300m
Aug 21 07:12:20 <moontiger> dont know it ... but i dont know paris so well ... only been there a few times
Aug 21 07:12:35 <Khertan_n810> where do u live ?
Aug 21 07:12:42 <moontiger> right now im in san francisco
Aug 21 07:13:18 <Khertan_n810> never see it irl :)
Aug 21 07:13:34 <moontiger> its cool enough but im missing europe too much after 5yrs
Aug 21 07:13:43 <Khertan_n810> hehe
Aug 21 07:14:12 <Khertan_n810> i ve hesitate 2 year ago to go to mineapolis
Aug 21 07:14:34 <moontiger> mineapolis .... i drove thru it once ... glad to leave
Aug 21 07:14:43 <Khertan_n810> :)
Aug 21 07:14:52 <moontiger> i lived in nyc before here
Aug 21 07:14:58 <moontiger> and before that south africa
Aug 21 07:15:38 <Khertan_n810> i have a job there ... but my wife can t work nin us
Aug 21 07:15:47 <Khertan_n810> s/sin/in
Aug 21 07:16:00 <moontiger> shame! i think its going to get better here if obama wins
Aug 21 07:16:43 <Khertan_n810> diplonope
Aug 21 07:16:44 <Khertan_n810> nope
Aug 21 07:17:02 <Khertan_n810> diplome not recognized
Aug 21 07:17:09 <moontiger> ahhhhh yes
Aug 21 07:17:13 <moontiger> they are very strict here
Aug 21 07:17:21 <Khertan_n810> she is 'sage-femme'
Aug 21 07:17:41 <moontiger> ?
Aug 21 07:17:42 <Khertan_n810> don t know how we say in english :)
Aug 21 07:18:05 <moontiger> ahhh midwife
Aug 21 07:18:10 <moontiger> to help with the babies
Aug 21 07:18:18 <Khertan_n810> a less graded doctor that help babyh to born
Aug 21 07:18:25 <AStorm> yeah midwife
Aug 21 07:18:41 <Khertan_n810> midwife ... i ve learn sometning today
Aug 21 07:18:45 <moontiger> :)
Aug 21 07:19:04 <moontiger> whats the work situation like in europe these days?
Aug 21 07:19:26 <AStorm> moontiger: depends on the country :|
Aug 21 07:19:36 <Khertan_n810> bad in france ...
Aug 21 07:19:37 <moontiger> well im heading to madrid to start with
Aug 21 07:20:02 <Khertan_n810> but a bit better for software engineer
Aug 21 07:20:17 <moontiger> cool ... what languages are used a lot there?
Aug 21 07:20:39 <Khertan_n810> economic situation is a bit bad at this time in france
Aug 21 07:20:59 <Khertan_n810> language in france ? french :)
Aug 21 07:21:11 <moontiger> computer languages i mean :)~
Aug 21 07:21:32 <Khertan_n810> java is the hype thing
Aug 21 07:21:42 <moontiger> oh god ... not java :|
Aug 21 07:22:15 <Khertan_n810> yep i hate that things too
Aug 21 07:22:21 <AStorm> Khertan_n810: impossible
Aug 21 07:22:25 <aspect> I thought eiffel would be the go in france :)
Aug 21 07:22:28 <AStorm> it's nowhere near as bad as in Poland
Aug 21 07:22:29 <moontiger> its all java middle-ware
Aug 21 07:22:42 <AStorm> well, it is Java suckage here too
Aug 21 07:22:44 <moontiger> aspect, hahaha
Aug 21 07:22:47 <AStorm> or .NET suckage
Aug 21 07:22:50 <Khertan_n810> there is also many sap / abap need
Aug 21 07:22:55 <moontiger> eeeesh
Aug 21 07:22:58 <AStorm> or low-level hardware :D
Aug 21 07:23:05 <moontiger> hmmmmmmmmmmm that sounds fun
Aug 21 07:23:11 <Khertan_n810> .net too is well payed
Aug 21 07:23:23 <moontiger> .NOT sucks but i can do it
Aug 21 07:23:26 <AStorm> btw, I need to find something good for our "work practice" at uni
Aug 21 07:23:33 <AStorm> moontiger: sucks less than Java
Aug 21 07:23:39 <moontiger> true dat
Aug 21 07:23:40 <Khertan_n810> eiffel have never been used
Aug 21 07:23:46 <AStorm> .nyet is the official codename
Aug 21 07:23:47 <Khertan_n810> except in univesity
Aug 21 07:23:49 <moontiger> eiffel is just a teaching language
Aug 21 07:23:56 <AStorm> Khertan_n810: and at Ericsson
Aug 21 07:24:12 <moontiger> ericsson uses eiffel??
Aug 21 07:24:17 <AStorm> used
Aug 21 07:24:17 <Khertan_n810> seriously ?
Aug 21 07:24:21 <AStorm> they created it
Aug 21 07:24:33 <moontiger> ummmmm really?
Aug 21 07:24:39 <Khertan_n810> this why it s a  so poor language
Aug 21 07:24:39 <AStorm> check history
Aug 21 07:24:45 <AStorm> it's unfinished ;P
Aug 21 07:24:59 <Khertan_n810> it s not started
Aug 21 07:25:05 <AStorm> yeah sure
Aug 21 07:25:16 <moontiger> Bertrand Meyer.
Aug 21 07:25:22 <moontiger> he invented it
Aug 21 07:25:30 <AStorm> ok, so, I want something in low-level programming or firmware
Aug 21 07:25:30 <moontiger> as a demonstration of pure OO concepts
Aug 21 07:25:37 <AStorm> do you have something in mind? :>
Aug 21 07:25:51 <AStorm> moontiger: person... but check who backed it
Aug 21 07:25:52 <Khertan_n810> as400 is also used in many banks
Aug 21 07:25:55 <aspect> AStorm: I think you're thinking of erlang :)
Aug 21 07:25:57 <moontiger> ohhhh
Aug 21 07:26:22 <moontiger> i think python is a good OO language
Aug 21 07:26:24 <Khertan_n810> obj-c powa !
Aug 21 07:26:32 <Khertan_n810> for low level stuff
Aug 21 07:26:39 <moontiger> obj-c for iphones?
Aug 21 07:26:51 <moontiger> is the iphone big over there?
Aug 21 07:27:03 <AStorm> ARGH
Aug 21 07:27:06 <AStorm> I;m wrong
Aug 21 07:27:07 <AStorm> indeed
Aug 21 07:27:18 <AStorm> aspect: sorry for misinformation
Aug 21 07:27:20 <AStorm> my mistake
Aug 21 07:27:24 <AStorm> I thought of Erlang
Aug 21 07:27:44 <AStorm> Khertan_n810: obj-c isn't bad, but it's a bit... lacking
Aug 21 07:31:16 <AStorm> so, I need some fun environment which can sign the pointless "practice contract" with WUT
Aug 21 07:31:34 <AStorm> which is 3-4 papers
Aug 21 07:31:56 <Khertan> i m back :)
Aug 21 07:32:00 <Khertan> i m at office now :)
Aug 21 07:32:22 <Khertan> AStorm: lacking of what ,
Aug 21 07:32:24 <Khertan> ?
Aug 21 07:32:32 <AStorm> Khertan: of some nice syntax
Aug 21 07:32:52 <AStorm> you see, message-passing isn't bad, but isn't convenient in many cases
Aug 21 07:32:57 <Khertan> AStorm: this ... just a point of view
Aug 21 07:33:03 <AStorm> yes
Aug 21 07:33:10 <Khertan> i like it ...
Aug 21 07:33:18 <AStorm> I like it too, more than C++
Aug 21 07:33:26 <AStorm> which has too much syntax, which is hacky
Aug 21 07:33:33 <Khertan> but now i mainly use python ... it s clear that i prefer it ... but for low level stuff ...
Aug 21 07:33:44 <Khertan> AStorm: personnaly i hate c++
Aug 21 07:33:55 <Khertan> it s not a language ... it s a hack
Aug 21 07:33:59 <AStorm> for low-level stuff, nothing beats C augmented with assembly
Aug 21 07:34:13 <Khertan> and i hate read or maintain source made by other
Aug 21 07:34:25 <AStorm> some are nice, like Qt
Aug 21 07:34:31 <Khertan> Qt ?
Aug 21 07:34:31 <AStorm> but it's exception, not norm
Aug 21 07:34:41 <Khertan> it s not a language ...
Aug 21 07:34:50 <AStorm> I mean, code written by others ;P
Aug 21 07:34:54 <Khertan> just a framework ... (which i don t like)
Aug 21 07:34:56 <Khertan> ah :)
Aug 21 07:35:02 <Khertan> never see the qt source
Aug 21 07:36:19 <AStorm> I guess I'll have to delve into Symbian and work with our resident master ;P
Aug 21 07:36:32 <AStorm> get some connections
Aug 21 07:36:44 <moontiger> i like c++ :)
Aug 21 07:36:54 <moontiger> love asm too
Aug 21 07:37:01 <AStorm> moontiger: you either don't know it, or don't use it (C++)
Aug 21 07:37:18 <AStorm> try implementing a general anything in C++ :>
Aug 21 07:37:20 <moontiger> hmmmm well ive been using it for quite a few years now
Aug 21 07:37:29 <AStorm> templates *suck*
Aug 21 07:37:38 <moontiger> i used to write trading systems in c++
Aug 21 07:37:52 <AStorm> writing iterators sucks too
Aug 21 07:37:53 <moontiger> templates are great if you use them properly
Aug 21 07:38:08 <AStorm> moontiger: ... they suck at their purpose, which is writing generic code
Aug 21 07:38:14 <AStorm> it's much too hard for its worth
Aug 21 07:38:28 <moontiger> well thats cos a lot of people cant write good iterators
Aug 21 07:38:32 <moontiger> so they use stl
Aug 21 07:38:46 <AStorm> because writing iterators is hard
Aug 21 07:38:52 <AStorm> guess why :>
Aug 21 07:38:58 <moontiger> its not really that hard
Aug 21 07:39:11 <AStorm> 4 functions would be enough
Aug 21 07:39:22 <moontiger> first last next prev
Aug 21 07:41:20 <AStorm> moontiger: yeah, so, give me a clean iterator example
Aug 21 07:41:28 <AStorm> which will work over tree nodes
Aug 21 07:41:37 <AStorm> (linked nodes)
Aug 21 07:41:47 <AStorm> generic
Aug 21 07:42:06 <moontiger> sigly linked or doubly linked nodes?
Aug 21 07:42:06 <AStorm> I lost a day doing that
Aug 21 07:42:12 <moontiger> singly even
Aug 21 07:42:16 <AStorm> uhm, it's a tree
Aug 21 07:42:23 <AStorm> with parent and child nodes
Aug 21 07:42:43 <AStorm> next is the next child
Aug 21 07:42:49 <AStorm> prev is the parent
Aug 21 07:42:55 <AStorm> first and last are tricky :)
Aug 21 07:43:20 <moontiger> hmmmmm i would prolly use recursion.... but that has problems
Aug 21 07:43:24 <AStorm> any order of walk is acceptable
Aug 21 07:43:29 <aspect> next is child or sibling?
Aug 21 07:43:32 <AStorm> in-order, pre-order and post-order
Aug 21 07:43:40 <AStorm> aspect: any is acceptable :>
Aug 21 07:44:04 <AStorm> I prefer top-to-bottom, = in-order
Aug 21 07:44:15 <aspect> AStorm: no, I'm asking about your ADT. If you only have next/prev pointers it's not a tree afaict
Aug 21 07:44:17 <AStorm> there is no "sibling" pointer
Aug 21 07:44:32 <AStorm> aspect: it has only parent and child pointers
Aug 21 07:44:38 <AStorm> standard tree
Aug 21 07:44:49 <aspect> ok, I misunderstood what you said earlier
Aug 21 07:44:50 <AStorm> multiple children
Aug 21 07:45:00 <moontiger> ahhhhhhhhh so not a binary tree
Aug 21 07:45:11 * aspect doesn't hold enough c++ in his head to write the code anyway :)
Aug 21 07:45:18 <aspect> it's trivial in scheme :)
Aug 21 07:45:21 <AStorm> moontiger: if it were a binary tree, I could make it an array
Aug 21 07:45:23 <AStorm> that is simple
Aug 21 07:45:40 <AStorm> aspect: it's trivial in Python too
Aug 21 07:45:45 <atul> Hi all, How do I install apt-pkg inside scratch-box
Aug 21 07:45:49 <atul> ?
Aug 21 07:45:49 <moontiger> except arrays have different performance metrics to binary trees
Aug 21 07:45:55 <AStorm> atul: it should be there
Aug 21 07:46:14 <AStorm> moontiger: no, different memory metrics
Aug 21 07:46:15 <aspect> AStorm: not as trivial as in Scheme, I'll bet :)
Aug 21 07:46:25 <AStorm> aspect: close enough, but you're right :>
Aug 21 07:47:03 * moontiger thinks about it
Aug 21 07:47:27 <AStorm> a specialization of the tree will walk an SQL database
Aug 21 07:47:31 <atul> AStorm:= but when my application donig ./configure it is giving error message like "checking apt-pkg/configuration.h usability... no" why so ?
Aug 21 07:47:40 * Khertan laught as he use a high level language :)
Aug 21 07:47:55 <AStorm> atul: it's probably missing apt-dev or sth
Aug 21 07:48:07 <AStorm> Khertan: I would too, I prefer Python also
Aug 21 07:48:13 <moontiger> well the trick is knowing if you have a sibling or need to cross a boundary
Aug 21 07:48:17 <AStorm> BUT stupid companies prefer C++
Aug 21 07:48:18 <atul> AStorm:= what to do ? Do I need to install apt-dev ?
Aug 21 07:48:28 <AStorm> moontiger: You have to move upwards to get a sibling
Aug 21 07:48:33 <moontiger> right
Aug 21 07:48:38 * aspect doesn't mind low level languages when they're appropriate .. but c++ suffers from layer upon layer of ad-hoc greenspunning
Aug 21 07:48:41 <AStorm> note, siblings "don't exist" unless you prod them
Aug 21 07:48:55 <aspect> you keep a stack. isn't that how trees are always traversed?
Aug 21 07:48:58 <AStorm> (as I said, I want to walk an SQL database representation of the tree)
Aug 21 07:49:08 <AStorm> aspect: it's too heavy
Aug 21 07:49:13 <moontiger> yah
Aug 21 07:49:15 <AStorm> I want to close unneeded nodes
Aug 21 07:49:15 <aspect> AStorm: ?
Aug 21 07:49:36 <AStorm> aspect: nodes have to be "open" only when needed
Aug 21 07:49:44 <AStorm> the representation will be used for A*
Aug 21 07:49:51 <aspect> did I say anything about opening nodes?
Aug 21 07:50:03 <AStorm> no, but you said you want to keep everything on a stack
Aug 21 07:50:15 <AStorm> so can't free it if required
Aug 21 07:50:40 <aspect> to visit a subtree you visit its root, if there's more than 1 child you push the root paired with the integer 1, then visit the subtree rooted at its first child
Aug 21 07:50:49 <moontiger> in what context would you use such a DS
Aug 21 07:50:51 <moontiger> ?
Aug 21 07:51:04 <aspect> if you can traverse a tree without keeping track of the info I'm putting on the stack, you should write a paper
Aug 21 07:51:07 <AStorm> aspect: I want to lose the already traversed tree, thank you
Aug 21 07:51:18 <AStorm> let me say again
Aug 21 07:51:27 <aspect> so you push the remaining children
Aug 21 07:51:29 <AStorm> I want a breadth-first iterator
Aug 21 07:51:36 <AStorm> remaining children, yes
Aug 21 07:51:41 <AStorm> but w/o "loading" them
Aug 21 07:51:50 <AStorm> make that into C++ iterator
Aug 21 07:51:55 <aspect> well, yes
Aug 21 07:52:18 <aspect> you can push a pointer/reference/handle etc without dereferencing it. that would be standard practice I'd assume. unless you're a javanaut ;-)
Aug 21 07:52:43 <AStorm> aspect: this is correct, problem is passing the stack to the iterators
Aug 21 07:52:59 <AStorm> it either has to be global, or kept in some root structure
Aug 21 07:53:05 <AStorm> tree-global
Aug 21 07:53:08 <aspect> I'd have assumed it's internal to the iterator
Aug 21 07:53:15 <AStorm> now, let's say I want to have concurrent access
Aug 21 07:53:16 <aspect> but then, I don't care to know this much about c++ :-)
Aug 21 07:53:17 <AStorm> ;P
Aug 21 07:53:19 <atul> AStorm:= what to do ? Do I need to install apt-dev ??
Aug 21 07:53:25 <AStorm> atul: I think so
Aug 21 07:53:49 <atul> HI all "checking apt-pkg/configuration.h usability... no" How to resolve this ?
Aug 21 07:54:04 <AStorm> atul: ... you need development headers for apt
Aug 21 07:54:08 <AStorm> this means you want apt-dev
Aug 21 07:54:09 <atul> AStorm:= I tryied that but it is failing
Aug 21 07:54:12 <AStorm> install it
Aug 21 07:54:16 <AStorm> huh how?
Aug 21 07:54:32 <moontiger> AStorm, when would you use a sturcture like this?
Aug 21 07:54:58 <AStorm> moontiger: breadth-first traversal? for A* (with minor modifications, like sorting on load)
Aug 21 07:55:39 <AStorm> so, I need to keep an iterator-local stack
Aug 21 07:55:49 <moontiger> sorting on load? wouldnt a simple binary tree do that?
Aug 21 07:55:54 <AStorm> ...
Aug 21 07:56:01 <AStorm> it's a stack actually
Aug 21 07:56:03 <AStorm> how do I pass it
Aug 21 07:56:12 <AStorm> it should be iterator-local
Aug 21 07:57:20 <moontiger> pass it to what?
Aug 21 07:57:28 <moontiger> im obviously not getting something here
Aug 21 07:57:38 <AStorm> either to the recursive or non-recursive iterator
Aug 21 07:57:53 <AStorm> actually, I could do a non-recursive specialized iterator
Aug 21 07:57:57 <AStorm> but I want a generic one
Aug 21 07:58:26 <moontiger> if you use recursion dont you risk stack over-run?
Aug 21 07:58:33 <AStorm> generic breadth-first on a tree which is expanded in each iteration
Aug 21 07:58:51 <AStorm> moontiger: well, it doesn't have to be recursive
Aug 21 07:58:53 <AStorm> just generic
Aug 21 07:59:05 <AStorm> trick is tree is extended in each iteration
Aug 21 07:59:05 <moontiger> im not getting the purpose of the structure so its hard for me to get my head around the problem
Aug 21 07:59:11 <moontiger> ahhhhhhhhh
Aug 21 07:59:13 <moontiger> on load
Aug 21 07:59:14 <moontiger> ok
Aug 21 07:59:21 <moontiger> i get it
Aug 21 07:59:23 <AStorm> also, there may be tree inserts too
Aug 21 07:59:56 <moontiger> do the parent nodes know how many child nodes they have?
Aug 21 08:00:23 <AStorm> how many, yes, but you can't know how many children the children have w/o loading them
Aug 21 08:00:27 <AStorm> which is expensive
Aug 21 08:00:31 <moontiger> right
Aug 21 08:01:10 <moontiger> what did you come up with?
Aug 21 08:01:36 <AStorm> I died at it
Aug 21 08:01:50 <AStorm> in Python, it took a day to write the whole app
Aug 21 08:02:05 <AStorm> because I can dynamically vary the structure in Python
Aug 21 08:02:43 <moontiger> essentially each node would have to be a linked list (in c++)
Aug 21 08:02:54 <AStorm> this is wrong
Aug 21 08:03:00 <AStorm> it has to be a tree
Aug 21 08:03:06 <AStorm> not tree of linked lists
Aug 21 08:03:10 <moontiger> hmmmm
Aug 21 08:03:20 <AStorm> there are no horizontal links
Aug 21 08:03:21 <Jaffa> Morning, all
Aug 21 08:03:24 <moontiger> ok
Aug 21 08:03:47 <AStorm> ok, I lied
Aug 21 08:03:48 <moontiger> interesting problem
Aug 21 08:03:53 <AStorm> there are horizontal links
Aug 21 08:04:34 <AStorm> it's apparently not a tree
Aug 21 08:04:42 <AStorm> but a generic graph
Aug 21 08:05:01 <moontiger> then its a "tree" of linked lists... each child node points to its parent node
Aug 21 08:05:14 <AStorm> uhm, it's a graph, no linked lists
Aug 21 08:05:21 <moontiger> ach!!
Aug 21 08:05:21 <AStorm> it's a graph with one root node
Aug 21 08:05:36 <moontiger> right ... but it has child nodes
Aug 21 08:05:41 <AStorm> there can be only one parent
Aug 21 08:05:44 <AStorm> but there can be loops
Aug 21 08:05:52 <AStorm> :>
Aug 21 08:05:54 <moontiger> ie, a list each of which point to their immediate parent
Aug 21 08:06:06 <moontiger> and so on down
Aug 21 08:06:15 <moontiger> im confused why that wouldnt work?
Aug 21 08:06:16 <AStorm> might be, yes
Aug 21 08:06:22 <AStorm> note, there can be loops
Aug 21 08:06:31 <AStorm> you don't want to traverse them indefinitely
Aug 21 08:06:42 <moontiger> that would be checking for circular refs i presume
Aug 21 08:06:47 <AStorm> so a stack is needed
Aug 21 08:06:49 <AStorm> yes
Aug 21 08:07:04 <moontiger> a stack with only as many slots to hold to max potential loop size
Aug 21 08:07:07 <AStorm> actually, in this algorithm, cycles are beneficial, they cut traversal time
Aug 21 08:07:16 <AStorm> moontiger: with infinitely many slots
Aug 21 08:07:21 <AStorm> so dynamically allocated
Aug 21 08:07:26 <moontiger> right ... i just realized that
Aug 21 08:07:29 <moontiger> yes
Aug 21 08:07:40 <AStorm> and with nodes closed when not needed anymore
Aug 21 08:07:48 <AStorm> so, a GC'd stack
Aug 21 08:07:49 <moontiger> but you only have to keep track of the current path so to speak
Aug 21 08:08:43 <moontiger> sounds interesting tho :)
Aug 21 08:08:54 <moontiger> i like messing with data structures
Aug 21 08:10:13 <AStorm> moontiger: current path and next possible hits :)
Aug 21 08:10:32 <moontiger> oh yah .. i see that
Aug 21 08:10:57 <AStorm> the hard part is the GC'd stack
Aug 21 08:11:06 <moontiger> hmmmmmmm yes
Aug 21 08:11:16 <AStorm> high-level languages give you cheap and easy GC
Aug 21 08:11:23 <Khertan> GC ?
Aug 21 08:11:24 <moontiger> well ... its easy if it can take 4 days to run ;)
Aug 21 08:11:31 <Khertan> garbage collector :)
Aug 21 08:11:33 <Khertan> ;)
Aug 21 08:11:34 <moontiger> garbage collection
Aug 21 08:11:35 <Khertan> sorry :
Aug 21 08:11:37 <Khertan> :)
Aug 21 08:12:00 <moontiger> AStorm, but it isnt too hard to write your own stack allocator
Aug 21 08:12:18 <yacoob> hm... what do you people use for storing passwords on the tablet?
Aug 21 08:12:27 <moontiger> files?
Aug 21 08:12:48 <yacoob> that's very... generic :)
Aug 21 08:12:54 <moontiger> sorry .... its late :)
Aug 21 08:13:09 * moontiger is feeling generic
Aug 21 08:13:22 <yacoob> moontiger, but do you mean that you just keep stuff in a text file and gpg it in/out when needed?
Aug 21 08:14:37 <moontiger> yacoob, actually i dont know ... i was thinking about it today myself ... right now its a home made enc stuffed in a database
Aug 21 08:14:45 <AStorm> yacoob: actually, I keep passwords in my head
Aug 21 08:14:50 <AStorm> it works
Aug 21 08:14:55 <moontiger> but i would like to use mcrypt or something
Aug 21 08:15:16 <lbt> look for and maybe port passwordsafe
Aug 21 08:15:29 <lbt> counterpane version
Aug 21 08:15:34 <yacoob> both password safe and gpasman suck in a different ways :)
Aug 21 08:15:46 <lbt> yeah, security is like that
Aug 21 08:16:08 <yacoob> on palm I was using cryptopad, and someone had a noble goal of making a similar app, but apparently got devoured by pack of angry rhinos some time ago
Aug 21 08:16:28 <moontiger> i'll add it to my list when i get some time
Aug 21 08:16:38 <moontiger> and i'll watch out for hungry rhinos
Aug 21 08:16:39 <moontiger> ;)
Aug 21 08:17:06 <AStorm> train your memory
Aug 21 08:17:14 <AStorm> and make good passwords
Aug 21 08:17:43 <yacoob> moontiger, if you'd be aiming for anything like that: I'm actually looking for storing notes, not only passwords. That's why both of existing software suck.
Aug 21 08:17:57 <yacoob> AStorm, good luck memorizing pgp revocation certificate :D
Aug 21 08:17:58 <AStorm> yacoob: storing notes == maemopad+
Aug 21 08:18:09 <yacoob> does it encrypt them in any way?
Aug 21 08:18:09 <AStorm> yacoob: well, that I keep on a safe CD
Aug 21 08:18:17 <AStorm> no
Aug 21 08:20:16 <moontiger> is there no encryption functionality on maemo?
Aug 21 08:20:40 <yacoob> there's plenty, it's lack of the userfriendly interface that aches
Aug 21 08:20:45 <XTL> There must be. Any particular kind?
Aug 21 08:20:58 <moontiger> i mean a programmer lib that i can use to make a simple app
Aug 21 08:21:00 * Khertan have tryed to port pycripto to maemo ... to be able to port revelation
Aug 21 08:21:01 <AStorm> gpg is there, right?
Aug 21 08:21:14 <moontiger> any luck khertan?
Aug 21 08:21:28 <Khertan> nope ... i ve scratched my scratchbox install :)
Aug 21 08:21:40 <XTL> The usual ssl libs are also there
Aug 21 08:21:56 <Khertan> but if someone make it available in extras-devel i would be happy :)
Aug 21 08:22:05 <Khertan> http://oss.codepoet.no/revelation/
Aug 21 08:22:18 <XTL> and libcrypt
Aug 21 08:22:52 <moontiger> is pycrypto just a recompile away?
Aug 21 08:23:15 <Khertan> GTK+ 2.4, GNOME 2.6, Python 2.3,
Aug 21 08:23:15 <Khertan>         pygtk 2.4, gnome-python 2.6, pycrypto 1.9, and Cracklib
Aug 21 08:23:24 <Khertan> moontiger > it should be
Aug 21 08:25:02 <yacoob> https://garage.maemo.org/plugins/scmsvn/viewcvs.php/?root=cryptochest is there, although it looks a bit abandoned
Aug 21 08:25:04 <moontiger> ok well i canhave a go at that ... i have a scratchbox running still
Aug 21 08:28:42 <moontiger> im off to bed ... im tired ... nn all ... thnx for the conversations :)
Aug 21 08:38:49 <florian> good morning
Aug 21 08:54:49 <GDE> hi
Aug 21 08:55:35 <GDE> is there a way to transfer files from my PC to the 810 via LAN?
Aug 21 08:55:46 <GDE> wifi
Aug 21 09:00:27 <XTL> Sure. Pick any one.
Aug 21 09:01:02 <GDE> pardon?
Aug 21 09:01:07 <XTL> Iow, whatever sw you have on both. sch/sftp/http/ftp/tftp/rcp/uucp/netcat+rzsz...
Aug 21 09:01:19 <XTL> It's just a network connection :9
Aug 21 09:01:26 <XTL> And most work in either push or pull
Aug 21 09:02:00 <XTL> .. both ways around
Aug 21 09:02:52 <GDE> thanks
Aug 21 09:03:16 <GDE> is there a good ftp client for the maemo?
Aug 21 09:04:12 <XTL> Good and ftp don't go together :)
Aug 21 09:05:14 <GDE> :(
Aug 21 09:05:59 <GDE> which way would be the easiest to setup? :p
Aug 21 09:34:21 <usicow> subversion isnt available in the normal 'extras' repository, but I can see it at http://repository.maemo.org/extras/pool/chinook/free/s/subversion/. Is that something which isnt ready to be used or something? (Im new to maemo).
Aug 21 09:35:09 <lcuk2> usicow, i use svn from my tablet
Aug 21 09:35:32 <aquatix> lcuk2: on a fat partition?
Aug 21 09:35:43 <lcuk2> chinook is the previous release of the os which might explain why you cant directly put it on
Aug 21 09:36:20 <lcuk2> aquatix, what does fat have to do with it?  but no its mmc1 which is an ext2 partition
Aug 21 09:36:21 <usicow> lcuk2: ahh, I see.. ok so how did you install svn?
Aug 21 09:36:30 <lcuk2> i have chinook :)
Aug 21 09:36:38 <usicow> ah
Aug 21 09:36:39 <usicow> :)
Aug 21 09:36:47 <usicow> it wont work on Diablo?
Aug 21 09:36:49 <lcuk2> apt-get install svn-specific-name-whatever-it-was
Aug 21 09:36:52 <lcuk2> it should
Aug 21 09:36:56 <lcuk2> add the repo and try :P
Aug 21 09:37:06 <aquatix> lcuk2: well, i tried checking out a repository and i got some errors about locks iirc
Aug 21 09:37:33 <usicow> ok, also is there a way I can just download the .deb file and install it without adding the repository?
Aug 21 09:37:35 <aquatix> apt-get install subversion
Aug 21 09:37:44 <lcuk2> aquatix, it doesnt complain for me - works nicely and ive checked out a number of rojects and pushed changes back
Aug 21 09:37:45 <aquatix> usicow: yes
Aug 21 09:38:00 <lcuk2> usicow, just download from within the folder you posted
Aug 21 09:38:04 <lcuk2> and try it
Aug 21 09:38:06 <aquatix> usicow: just download the .deb and on the tablet do "dpkg -i subversion_blah.deb"
Aug 21 09:38:16 <aquatix> [as root]
Aug 21 09:38:21 <lcuk2> or double tap from the filemanager ;)
Aug 21 09:38:27 <aquatix> ah yeah :)
Aug 21 09:38:28 <lcuk2> and let the isntaller do its stuff
Aug 21 09:38:34 <usicow> aquatix: great thanks
Aug 21 09:38:42 <aquatix> usicow: and what lcuk2 says ;)
Aug 21 09:39:10 * lcuk hadnt noticed he wasnt logged in
Aug 21 09:49:43 <usicow> is there a nice program for maemo that shows CPU usage?
Aug 21 09:51:42 <AStorm> loadapplet?
Aug 21 09:51:55 <AStorm> also, there's top
Aug 21 09:52:05 <AStorm> and probably someone could build htop
Aug 21 09:52:07 <lcuk> usicow, yes, but its top secret and closed source and you cannot even have the binary for it or even see pictures of it
Aug 21 09:52:13 <lcuk> (https://garage.maemo.org/projects/load-applet/)
Aug 21 09:52:26 <yacoob> in fact, one of Nokia associates will be with lcuk shortly to terminate him.
Aug 21 09:52:41 <lcuk> damn
Aug 21 09:52:44 <AStorm> hell, they'll kill ITT and Google for it
Aug 21 09:52:53 <lcuk> it was worth it in the end, information should be free
Aug 21 09:53:08 <AStorm> Long Live Freedom!
Aug 21 09:53:09 <yacoob> too bad load-applet doesn't show more stats in the drop down, though.
Aug 21 09:53:15 <lcuk> hold on, someone at the door
Aug 21 09:53:16 <AStorm> hmmh?
Aug 21 09:53:34 <yacoob> hm, I can simply make a patch... :)
Aug 21 09:54:23 <lcuk> yes you could, if you do decide to dive in, would you find out if it tirelessly updates itself even if the device is locked and screen turned off
Aug 21 09:54:32 <lcuk> cos it would be really wasteful to show information to nothing
Aug 21 09:54:56 <AStorm> heh, it needs some dbus support to disable itself
Aug 21 09:55:00 <lcuk> i had a thought about it being a battery drain when i last had it installed
Aug 21 09:55:13 <AStorm> no, it's not a major battery drain I found out
Aug 21 09:55:39 <usicow> load-applet drains the battery?
Aug 21 09:55:53 <AStorm> not by any noticeable amount
Aug 21 09:55:56 <lcuk> but because its tirelessly ticking over and refreshing itself its doing quite a lot
Aug 21 09:56:07 <AStorm> it's ticking rarely enough
Aug 21 09:56:09 <lcuk> it was just a thought
Aug 21 09:56:14 <AStorm> so it doesn't speed up CPU
Aug 21 09:56:48 <AStorm> doesn't wake it often enough from C3
Aug 21 09:56:52 <lcuk> no but it pushes data to the lcd every second - does the lcd chip have to wake back up to accept the data even if the screen is off
Aug 21 09:57:03 <AStorm> no, it doesn't apparently
Aug 21 09:57:05 <lcuk> and what does it use for its sleep cycle
Aug 21 09:57:11 <AStorm> at least not when dsme is active
Aug 21 09:57:20 <AStorm> it uses sleep(1);
Aug 21 09:57:39 <AStorm> that is, one second
Aug 21 09:57:52 <lcuk> all i was asking was whether it does actually say "ok, the user has display turned off, maybe i should hold off on updating
Aug 21 09:58:01 <AStorm> it doesn't
Aug 21 09:58:01 <Khertan> someone have successfully use a usb mouse with an n8x0 ?
Aug 21 09:58:07 <AStorm> but it doesn't take a lot of power either
Aug 21 09:58:24 <AStorm> really, I should try to measure both stress and wait times
Aug 21 09:58:30 <gomiam> Khertan: not me. I don't even know how the mouse pointer would show up.
Aug 21 09:58:45 <AStorm> you just have to replace the invisible cursor ;P
Aug 21 09:59:02 <lcuk> gomiam, the theme for maemo DOES have a mouse pointer, its just a transparant square - it can be replaced with a proper one
Aug 21 09:59:05 <AStorm> Khertan: I was too lazy to do that
Aug 21 09:59:09 <lcuk> infact, sometimes you see the x pointer
Aug 21 09:59:25 <AStorm> Khertan: it requires a powered hub most likely too
Aug 21 09:59:57 <Khertan> yep ... i'm just thinking to use my n8x0 with an external display an usb keyboard and a mouse
Aug 21 09:59:58 <Khertan> :)
Aug 21 10:00:01 <gomiam> AStorm: probably not. If a keyboard can work directly, a mouse energy consumption shouldn't be a worry, methinks.
Aug 21 10:00:23 <lcuk> not all keyboards work, check the Ma rating on the device you wanna use
Aug 21 10:00:35 <Khertan> gomiam: optical mouse use more power than a keyboard :)
Aug 21 10:00:49 <lcuk> then get a ball mouse
Aug 21 10:00:51 <Khertan> the Ma rating ?
Aug 21 10:00:57 <lcuk> power
Aug 21 10:00:59 <Khertan> i ll use a usb hub
Aug 21 10:01:12 <lcuk> 100ma max current draw from usb OTG host
Aug 21 10:01:13 <AStorm> powered hub, too
Aug 21 10:01:26 <AStorm> lcuk: I suspect if you push it, the USB could provide 200 mA
Aug 21 10:01:29 <Khertan> as it will be too use at home
Aug 21 10:01:40 <lcuk> no astorm, it wont
Aug 21 10:01:45 <lcuk> it has current limiters afiak
Aug 21 10:01:46 <AStorm> it will, if you force it
Aug 21 10:01:49 <AStorm> yes, it does
Aug 21 10:01:56 <AStorm> can disable these
Aug 21 10:02:07 <gomiam> anyway, I don't really mind. I already have a USB ultra-slim hub and its power source :-)
Aug 21 10:02:13 <AStorm> goodie
Aug 21 10:02:17 <lcuk> hmmm, its official spec and you cant go beyond it
Aug 21 10:02:23 <Khertan> and about vga<->usb ....
Aug 21 10:02:25 <AStorm> lcuk: yes, it's a hack
Aug 21 10:02:31 <AStorm> Khertan: definitely more than 100 mA
Aug 21 10:02:39 <AStorm> and you need a driver
Aug 21 10:02:50 <Khertan> what is the state of the driver project ?
Aug 21 10:03:01 <Khertan> you know the name of the project ?
Aug 21 10:03:01 <lcuk> bbl
Aug 21 10:03:13 <Khertan> i m looking for it on itt ... but it s painfull
Aug 21 10:05:56 <AStorm> Khertan: the driver is there, but not built for maemo
Aug 21 10:06:03 <AStorm> sis-something driver
Aug 21 10:06:10 <AStorm> probably sisusb or something like it
Aug 21 10:06:22 <AStorm> as it's the only vga<->usb I know of
Aug 21 10:06:55 <Khertan> noone have tryed to use it on a nit yet ?
Aug 21 10:08:21 <Khertan> xsisusb
Aug 21 10:14:10 <Khertan> hum ... to mirroring screen it use vncserver
Aug 21 10:15:06 <Khertan> 89,69 the adaptator ... ouch
Aug 21 10:15:10 <Khertan> Euros
Aug 21 10:16:29 <Kegetys> you can get one for ~34e from dealextreme
Aug 21 10:16:32 <Kegetys> 35
Aug 21 10:27:11 <Khertan> hum i don't know it
Aug 21 10:27:37 <AFBN810> Khertan I didn't get that email
Aug 21 10:28:24 <Khertan> AFBN810 ?
Aug 21 10:29:05 <AFBN810> The mcontacts one its andrewfblack
Aug 21 10:29:20 <Khertan> Kegetys > i don't find it on dealextrem
Aug 21 10:29:30 <Khertan> AFBN810: ah sorry don't recognize you
Aug 21 10:29:40 <Khertan> AFBN810: i ve send it yesterday with modest
Aug 21 10:29:45 <Kegetys> http://www.dealextreme.com/details.dx/sku.4838
Aug 21 10:29:54 <Kegetys> seems the price has gone up a bit since I ordered, but much cheaper anyway
Aug 21 10:30:09 <AFBN810> andrewfblack@gmail.com?
Aug 21 10:30:46 <Khertan> yep
Aug 21 10:31:10 <Khertan> i ll send it you again ...
Aug 21 10:31:23 <Khertan> Kegetys: do u use it with a nit ?
Aug 21 10:31:37 <AFBN810> do you remember the email subject so I can search for it might be in spam
Aug 21 10:31:48 <Kegetys> Khertan: it hasn't arrived yet
Aug 21 10:32:02 <Khertan> as it s not the same as the tested one ...
Aug 21 10:32:53 <Kegetys> as far as I can tell it is the same one, same chipset etc.
Aug 21 10:33:11 <Kegetys> I should get mine tomorrow hopefully so I can test it then
Aug 21 10:33:54 <Khertan> if it s the same chipset it should be ok
Aug 21 10:36:42 <lcuk> \o/ w000t i'm going on a european vacation - i get to see 3 different germany cities on this trip
Aug 21 10:37:11 * lcuk wonders why there are no direct flights from manchester to berlin
Aug 21 10:37:13 <lbt> does anyone use their N800 as a car stereo?
Aug 21 10:37:31 <lcuk> lbt, wasnt there that car stats thing which would work
Aug 21 10:38:11 <AFBN810> khertan I didn't get it can you send it out again?
Aug 21 10:38:11 <lcuk> oh crap, bbl
Aug 21 10:38:44 <Khertan> AFBN810: yep i ll send it again ...
Aug 21 10:39:05 <Khertan> ouch dealextrem have very poor ratings ...
Aug 21 10:39:18 <AFBN810> thanks
Aug 21 10:42:19 <Khertan> hum ... someone know where is the x11vnc server package ?
Aug 21 10:42:22 <Khertan> can t found it
Aug 21 10:42:54 <Khertan> https://garage.maemo.org/projects/x11vnc/
Aug 21 10:43:31 <Khertan> hum ... if i ve wrote x11 instead of x12 in google ...
Aug 21 10:43:54 <Kegetys> ratings?
Aug 21 10:46:20 <Khertan> someone have hacked microsoft france ? : http://www.microsoft.com/france/windows/products/windowsvista/features/experiences/music/default.mspx
Aug 21 10:46:48 <Khertan> kegetys: many review made by french customers are bad ...
Aug 21 10:48:24 <Khertan> bye ...
Aug 21 10:48:39 <Kegetys> well I havent had any problems and I have ordered alot of stuff from them
Aug 21 10:48:43 <Kegetys> though I'm not french :P
Aug 21 10:50:11 <eichi> is there a way to give the gps information from a external bluetooth device from the maemo device to a third device (like mobile phone)?
Aug 21 10:54:47 <nomis> eichi: I guess it would be possible although I doubt that it is easy with the software on the tablet. Should not be too hard though for someone with bluez knowledge.
Aug 21 10:55:45 <crashanddie> lbt, yeah, I used my n810 for that
Aug 21 10:56:23 <crashanddie> lbt, I had it mounted on the windscreen, audio connector into aux in for the car stereo, works fine
Aug 21 10:56:45 <lbt> crashanddie: just wondering if/how people had done it
Aug 21 10:57:04 <lbt> maybe an external usb drive?
Aug 21 10:57:17 <lbt> do you use canola?
Aug 21 10:57:23 <crashanddie> yeah, I used canola
Aug 21 10:57:42 <crashanddie> canola is much more finger friendly, and using the stylus whilst driving is a big no-no
Aug 21 10:58:49 <lbt> not seen canola yet - just installing
Aug 21 10:59:07 * ariya thinks canola2 rocks
Aug 21 10:59:18 <Kegetys> I prefer mediabox
Aug 21 10:59:22 <crashanddie> I never used an external hard drive on my NIT, but I did have an external drive which was directly connected to the stereo
Aug 21 11:00:29 <lbt> I'll see what the sound quality is like on a decent hifi...
Aug 21 11:00:43 <lbt> I've not even listened to an mp3 on it yet ;)
Aug 21 11:01:04 * lbt really must actually *use* nut
Aug 21 11:01:11 <glass> some car-radios do a2dp
Aug 21 11:01:18 <lbt> <grin>
Aug 21 11:01:54 <lbt> I need a decent amp that takes pcm over wifi...
Aug 21 11:02:32 <lbt> oops - gotta go ... bbl
Aug 21 11:04:34 <lardman> morning all
Aug 21 11:11:04 <usicow> when I open an xterm window, I'd like it to be full screen - as in no typing assistant or anything.. just a 100% full screen text terminal window. Is that possible? I cant seem to get rid of the typing assistant thing.
Aug 21 11:14:11 <lbt> porting.... maemo is based on an upstream debian. Which one? I can't put the upstream deb into my scratchbox (obvioulsy) but I should be able to put the deb-src in...
Aug 21 11:14:12 <XTL> You mean the esc-tab-... line?
Aug 21 11:15:00 <XTL> usicow: menu/view/show toolbar/fullscreen off
Aug 21 11:15:26 <usicow> XTL: nah, I worked out how to remove that one.. its one that Im seeing below that.. all it says on the right hand side is 'abc'.
Aug 21 11:15:41 <XTL> Was it fn-space that should popdown that
Aug 21 11:15:48 <Kegetys> you can remove that entirely by disabling the preidiction & dictionary things from control panel
Aug 21 11:17:34 <usicow> XTL: doesnt seem to work.. but at least you know of something that is capable of removing it :) I'll hunt around more.. any idea what that bar is called by the way?
Aug 21 11:18:34 <XTL> usicow: Can't recall. It doesn't appear on mine. Did you have a look at Kegetys's setting?
Aug 21 11:21:43 <usicow> is kegety a person? :)
Aug 21 11:21:54 <Kegetys> huh?
Aug 21 11:22:04 <lbt> maybe another way - what version of debian is diablo based on? If any?
Aug 21 11:22:24 <usicow> ohhh sorry Kegetys I missed what you said.
Aug 21 11:22:26 <usicow> hmm
Aug 21 11:22:34 <usicow> thanks. I'll disbale it.
Aug 21 11:23:24 <usicow> perfect :)
Aug 21 11:23:27 <XTL> lbt: There's an answer to that buried somewhere in mailing list, itt or docs. I can't recall.
Aug 21 11:23:37 <XTL> A somewhat older version, I think :)
Aug 21 11:23:42 <lbt> I've been digging!!!
Aug 21 11:23:55 <XTL> I don't see it immediately either. :)
Aug 21 11:23:58 <lbt> I guess it is old - which is fine
Aug 21 11:24:06 <lbt> did you catch my objective?
Aug 21 11:24:06 <XTL> But you should be able to pull from any upstream you want and rebuild.
Aug 21 11:24:16 <lbt> to add a deb-src to scratchbox
Aug 21 11:24:19 <lbt> for portin
Aug 21 11:24:21 <lbt> g
Aug 21 11:24:22 <lbt> yes but
Aug 21 11:24:29 <lbt> I want to port autofs
Aug 21 11:24:32 <XTL> Yes. I've done that for random backports from testing to stable sometimes.
Aug 21 11:24:40 <lbt> which depends on libraries
Aug 21 11:24:50 <lbt> and I want to minimise version conflicts
Aug 21 11:24:51 <XTL> There may be problems, of course, but it should essentially work.
Aug 21 11:25:00 <lbt> I've done it for ddd
Aug 21 11:25:07 <lbt> quite a chain - but simple
Aug 21 11:25:13 <XTL> The libraries you build against should match the tablet.
Aug 21 11:25:29 <lbt> but then I end up building more libraries
Aug 21 11:25:30 <XTL> Either they come from the sdk (match) or you built them yourself (match)
Aug 21 11:25:39 <lbt> and have build-dep version issues
Aug 21 11:25:55 <lbt> when I'm 5 deep
Aug 21 11:26:22 <XTL> If the sw you want demands too new libs and you don't want to port those, you'd need to adapt the package/sw to use older libs.
Aug 21 11:26:36 <lbt> or just use the older version (which is probably fine)
Aug 21 11:26:45 <lbt> which is where I came in...
Aug 21 11:26:47 <lbt> :D
Aug 21 11:26:51 <XTL> :)
Aug 21 11:27:50 <lbt> I think my proposal is a safe way to build any debian package without needing to 'adapt'
Aug 21 11:28:03 <lbt> (non-gui of course)
Aug 21 11:57:45 <Italodance> www.internettablettalk.com down?
Aug 21 11:59:14 <lbt> no
Aug 21 11:59:29 <Italodance> long loading...
Aug 21 11:59:42 <lbt> no :)
Aug 21 11:59:57 <lbt> face it, it's you.
Aug 21 12:00:18 <Italodance> strange
Aug 21 12:00:24 <lbt> are you?
Aug 21 12:00:45 <Italodance> just can see a white page
Aug 21 12:01:11 <lbt> I'm getting the usual site, and I'm logged in
Aug 21 12:02:20 <lcuk> Italodance, step into the light
Aug 21 12:02:42 <XTL> I'm getting orange boxes that slowly dissolve into the normal page
Aug 21 12:03:08 <XTL> Though a while ago, wiki disappear and "it was just me".
Aug 21 12:03:17 <lcuk> the orange default colours before the theme is applied are awful - it would make the site much more pleasant if they were default colours in the unstyled page
Aug 21 12:04:04 <XTL> I think web forum users deserve all the unpleasantness you can throw at them.
Aug 21 12:04:42 <lcuk> and they return the love to you in the form of IRC trolls spamming goatse wrapped in nokia informative link clothing
Aug 21 12:04:54 <Italodance> who?
Aug 21 12:04:58 <lcuk> xtl
Aug 21 12:05:04 <Italodance> oh
Aug 21 12:05:12 <Italodance> lol
Aug 21 12:05:23 <lbt> XTL: I agree - web forums <shudder>
Aug 21 12:05:34 <lcuk> theres nothing at all wrong with a forum, they work really well
Aug 21 12:05:40 <lbt> uh huh
Aug 21 12:05:51 <lbt> we've had this debate
Aug 21 12:05:55 <lbt> you're wrong
Aug 21 12:05:57 <lbt> <grin>
Aug 21 12:06:09 <lcuk> though i prefer the moderated comment system slashdot has - it lets you see the signal whilst dropping the noise
Aug 21 12:06:48 <lbt> does the n8x0 sound chip allow spdif out through the headphone?
Aug 21 12:07:05 <lcuk> though they screwed that up recently by defaulting to first 25 comments - thats all people moderate on, the rest below are like a barran wasteland
Aug 21 12:10:29 <XTL> I also find reddit's comment system pretty well-working
Aug 21 12:10:49 <XTL> But what you usually come against is the typical phpBB
Aug 21 12:11:51 <XTL> Mmm.. yabb.pl, was it
Aug 21 12:12:24 <XTL> I'm sure there's a few more nightmares. But they all look the same and breed the same culture.
Aug 21 12:33:53 <herwood> hi, has someone had any problems when developing own statusbar plugins?
Aug 21 12:39:11 <herwood> i'm having these strange problems that when I install my own plugin, everything works fine, but if I keep on installing and uninstalling it then at some stage some of the other icons disappear.
Aug 21 12:40:12 <herwood> I've also had a couple of time an "effect" where the whole screen turns white and every application is minimized and after a while, everything gets reloaded.
Aug 21 12:40:39 <herwood> Has anyone had similar problems?
Aug 21 12:41:32 <herwood> btw, the hello world app (which also creates icon to the statusbar) works perfectly
Aug 21 12:46:06 <Khertan> herwood: you get that because your plugin crash
Aug 21 12:46:14 <Khertan> making maemo-launcher crashing
Aug 21 12:46:23 <herwood> hmm
Aug 21 12:46:28 <Khertan> so at the reboot it load a default config to avoir cycling crash
Aug 21 12:46:29 <herwood> I was thinking that too
Aug 21 12:47:05 <herwood> could I get some log-printing somehow so I could trace the problem?
Aug 21 12:49:02 <Khertan> i use the old method of stdout in a file :)
Aug 21 12:49:38 <herwood> aa, ok :)
Aug 21 12:49:48 <herwood> I'll try that, thanks
Aug 21 12:55:33 * brontide beats up GTK and rifles through their pockets for change
Aug 21 12:59:31 <brontide> Khertan: PyDeb or PyPackager, which is easier for uploading to extras
Aug 21 13:01:34 <jott> herwood: take a look at advanced-backlight, i added some debug code there to make the plugin run as standalone. see the #ifdef TEST_PLUGIN sections.
Aug 21 13:02:18 <jott> it's easier to attach gdb this way and you don't have to worry about taking down the whole desktop :)
Aug 21 13:03:15 <herwood> thanks jott
Aug 21 13:11:14 <Khertan> brontide: py2deb is easier to upload to diablo extras ... as you can't with pypackager :)
Aug 21 13:11:30 <Khertan> as package should be built with autobuilder
Aug 21 13:12:11 <brontide> thanks, do you have a crash course for py2deb ( help / wiki / random scribbles ) or is it intuative?
Aug 21 13:12:28 <brontide> and I assume it's meant to be run on-tablet
Aug 21 13:13:17 <lbt> so apt-get update gives me:
Aug 21 13:13:19 <lbt> W: GPG error: http://www.mirrorservice.org etch Release: Couldn't access keyring: 'No such file or directory'
Aug 21 13:13:32 <lbt> in scratchbox
Aug 21 13:14:01 <lbt> I can't install debian-archive-keyring ('cos I only have their deb-src)
Aug 21 13:14:19 <lbt> so any ideas on how to tell apt-get to JFDI
Aug 21 13:15:56 <crashanddie> anyone got any link to get ssh-agent to work in scratchbox ?
Aug 21 13:16:31 <XTL> Is there some specific problem with it?
Aug 21 13:16:55 <crashanddie> well, ssh-agent is the app that's supposed to remember your SSH-key passphrase, so you don't have to type it everytime
Aug 21 13:16:57 <crashanddie> right ?
Aug 21 13:17:21 <XTL> You could say that
Aug 21 13:17:23 <yacoob> I haven't yet looked for that, but perhaps someone can tell me from top of his/her head - can you use scratchbox on osx?
Aug 21 13:17:37 <jott> lbt: you could just get the debs from debian, they should install fine.
Aug 21 13:17:47 <XTL> yacoob: In an emulator, at least
Aug 21 13:17:58 <XTL> Natively, it might be tricky/fidgety
Aug 21 13:18:26 <crashanddie> XTL, well, I have my SSH-key in ~/.ssh, but even when I explicitly launch ssh-agent, it keeps asking for my passphrase
Aug 21 13:18:33 <jott> yacoob: in theory it could work but i think no one really tried :)
Aug 21 13:18:42 <crashanddie> XTL, and well, my passphrase just isn't that short, and I'm getting tired of typing it everytime I compile something
Aug 21 13:18:54 <yacoob> right :)
Aug 21 13:18:56 <XTL> Hmm..
Aug 21 13:19:11 <XTL> I think ssh-agent is supposed to run a shell (or other command) and pass its env vars there
Aug 21 13:19:22 <jott> yacoob: i think the easiest way is to get the vmware image if you are on x86 :)
Aug 21 13:20:16 <XTL> If you just run it, it launches, prints out the env...
Aug 21 13:20:35 <jott> crashanddie: you could also use a ControlMaster and keep a session open :)
Aug 21 13:20:39 <XTL> and stays in the bg. You should run the commands it outputs
Aug 21 13:20:44 <crashanddie> jott, eh ?
Aug 21 13:20:51 <XTL> Or run "ssh-agent bash" or such
Aug 21 13:21:24 <XTL> and then ssh-add and the agent will do the auth for that shell's children
Aug 21 13:21:35 <crashanddie> bleh
Aug 21 13:21:38 <jott> crashanddie: man ssh-config /ControlMaster :)
Aug 21 13:21:39 <crashanddie> that's an ugly hack
Aug 21 13:21:42 <XTL> You can see if ssh-agent is working by running ssh-add, I think.
Aug 21 13:21:49 <crashanddie> yeah, ssh-add -l
Aug 21 13:22:02 <XTL> crashanddie: And that works?
Aug 21 13:22:12 <XTL> I mean no "can't connect to agent"
Aug 21 13:22:17 <Veggen> Modern Linux-distributions will almost always have it running per default.
Aug 21 13:22:20 <crashanddie> it works when I run ssh-agent bash, and run it from there
Aug 21 13:22:26 <crashanddie> doesn't work from the plain scratchbox
Aug 21 13:23:01 <lbt> jott: I can - but I wanted to make life easier - adding the etch deb-src to the scratchbox makes porting easy
Aug 21 13:23:04 <XTL> How about if you run those export SSH_AUTH_SOCK etc lines in the scratchbox shell
Aug 21 13:23:18 <XTL> (See that the /tmp/ socket is reachable etc)
Aug 21 13:23:19 <Veggen> oh, scratchbox is different. but it's likely that you can try using the one from the mother-session, if you take care of getting some environment-values with you.
Aug 21 13:23:27 <lbt> and allows dependency following that (proabably) won't break things
Aug 21 13:23:33 <jott> lbt: yes, i have a sid deb-src :)
Aug 21 13:23:57 <XTL> Like Veggen said, get the right env vars into the scratchbox shell
Aug 21 13:23:58 <crashanddie> XTL, you're a genius :)
Aug 21 13:24:08 <crashanddie> XTL, I just had to copy/paste the output
Aug 21 13:24:22 <XTL> Close. I'm an ex sysadmin.
Aug 21 13:24:24 <XTL> :)
Aug 21 13:24:27 <lbt> any idea why mine won't apt-get update then?
Aug 21 13:24:33 <Veggen> I am a current sysadmin.
Aug 21 13:24:47 <crashanddie> such problem should be taken care of by scratchbox right from the start
Aug 21 13:24:53 <Veggen> I use ssh-keys and ssh-agent *a lot*
Aug 21 13:25:06 <Veggen> :)
Aug 21 13:25:07 <lbt> FWIW : deb-src http://www.mirrorservice.org/sites/ftp.debian.org/debian/ etch main contrib
Aug 21 13:25:07 <XTL> It's kind of "set up and forget", though.
Aug 21 13:26:40 <Veggen> XTL: well. having a couple of hundred Unix-boxes, and not same home-dir, my routine on sshing into a box the first time is, "oh? password? can't have that. *copy* relevant files into .ssh*
Aug 21 13:27:37 <yacoob> Veggen, don't tell me that you do it by hand with >100 boxes...
Aug 21 13:29:07 <crashanddie> well, if he got 1 box per week
Aug 21 13:29:12 <crashanddie> I don't see the problem
Aug 21 13:29:30 <crashanddie> gotta be buggered though if you notice your SSH key is a debian-pooped key
Aug 21 13:29:52 <yacoob> crashanddie, key gets compromised, do the key dance again... :)
Aug 21 13:29:53 <jott> well you could easily do something like cat .ssh/id_dsa.pub | ssh foo tee -a .ssh/authorized_keys2
Aug 21 13:29:57 <jott> :=
Aug 21 13:30:33 <lbt> or scp (!)
Aug 21 13:30:50 <crashanddie> jott, or maybe easier: scp ~/.ssh/id_dsa.pub user@box:/.ssh/authorized_keys
Aug 21 13:30:53 <jott> scp can append? :)
Aug 21 13:31:02 <crashanddie> I thought it could
Aug 21 13:31:09 <lbt> don't need to - you *want* to replace
Aug 21 13:31:36 <jott> if you *want* that's a different story.
Aug 21 13:31:37 <lbt> you just don't want to get it wrong :)
Aug 21 13:31:56 <lbt> anyhow fix my apt problem
Aug 21 13:31:58 <lbt> grrr
Aug 21 13:32:08 <crashanddie> we're talking about SSH now
Aug 21 13:32:10 <jott> but i have different private keys :)
Aug 21 13:32:12 <yacoob> that's why you should just use cfengine or puppet... :)
Aug 21 13:32:16 <crashanddie> apt discussion is planned around 4PM
Aug 21 13:32:28 <lbt> Ok, for the backlog then....
Aug 21 13:32:37 <lbt> :)
Aug 21 13:32:50 <yacoob> crashanddie, when is punch and pie?
Aug 21 13:33:00 <lbt> I tried a sid deb-src and got the same problem (in case I had cache corruption or summit)
Aug 21 13:33:09 <lbt> 4:15 if you fix my apt
Aug 21 13:34:44 <jott> lbt: why not just install the keyring? ;)
Aug 21 13:34:55 <lbt> I don't have gpg
Aug 21 13:35:17 <lbt> I'd like to minimise the impact on the scratchbox
Aug 21 13:35:59 <lbt> I suppose I could add etch 'deb' and dl the keyring to sb and then remove the deb line
Aug 21 13:36:20 <crashanddie> I some cancer, be back in a bit
Aug 21 13:36:22 <lbt> but then I'd have to dl their gpg too
Aug 21 13:36:39 <lbt> so I've got a really mixed up sb environment at that point
Aug 21 13:36:40 <lbt> ugh
Aug 21 13:37:01 <lbt> this was supposed to be "how do I setup a clean porting ability on sb"
Aug 21 13:37:19 <jott> just add the deb-src and there you go :P
Aug 21 13:37:29 <lbt> A: add this file to the sources.list.d and tell it to ignore gpg sigs
Aug 21 13:37:34 <jott> deb-src http://http.us.debian.org/debian/ unstable main contrib non-free
Aug 21 13:37:34 <lbt> I *did* add the line
Aug 21 13:37:36 <jott> works fine here
Aug 21 13:37:39 <jott> no problems
Aug 21 13:37:46 <lbt> and I get
Aug 21 13:37:48 <lbt> W: GPG error: http://www.mirrorservice.org sid Release: Couldn't access keyring: 'No such file or directory'
Aug 21 13:37:49 <lbt> W: You may want to run apt-get update to correct these problems
Aug 21 13:38:15 <jott> lbt: so?
Aug 21 13:38:49 <jott> lbt: you can't verify the packages. but it's not *that* important.
Aug 21 13:39:05 <lbt> it didn't appear to properly update the local db
Aug 21 13:39:46 <lbt> goddam it I'm an idiot - *NOW* it's working
Aug 21 13:39:53 <lbt> sorry
Aug 21 13:50:25 <rmrfchik> in what package I can find cfdisk or fdisk?
Aug 21 13:50:43 <rmrfchik> ...or other program for partition management
Aug 21 13:51:46 <trenka> rmrfchik: sfdisk in busybox
Aug 21 13:53:31 <Stskeeps> rmrfchik: i have a cfdisk.deb that's kinda hacked together as well
Aug 21 13:53:57 <Stskeeps> rmrfchik: http://trac.tspre.org/svn/deblet/dependancies/maemo/cfdisk.deb
Aug 21 13:54:30 <arachnist> Qermit tez jesteÅ› fajny *_*
Aug 21 13:56:48 <rmrfchik> thanks
Aug 21 14:28:43 <RST38h> BOO, all
Aug 21 14:30:23 <Khertan> brontide > no doc yet, a command line tool ... but there will be a doc in a near future ... at least for the summit :)
Aug 21 14:47:25 <kaie> hi. i think some of the people here are working on the qt port of ff. i tried the binary, won't start up to me, symbol lookup error
Aug 21 14:47:47 <kaie> let me know if you want the full error message
Aug 21 15:05:26 <lbt> RST38h: <eek>
Aug 21 15:37:02 <andrewfblack> Hello
Aug 21 15:39:07 <GeneralAntilles> Howdy
Aug 21 15:57:48 <MakeGho> I can only find source distribution for maemo-latex :/ is there no binary one for n810?
Aug 21 15:58:57 <krutt> MakeGho: how much did you pay for your 810?
Aug 21 15:59:46 <MakeGho> around 380 €, how so?
Aug 21 16:15:50 <Mek> anybody know of any packages of (parts of) boost for maemo?
Aug 21 16:16:17 <jott> Mek: i think i have them floating around somewhere
Aug 21 16:18:01 <Mek> jott: ah, that would be nice... I can't get boost to install...
Aug 21 16:18:44 <jott> Mek: what's the problem?
Aug 21 16:19:23 <Mek> jott: 'bjam install' crashes (or causes qemu to crash)
Aug 21 16:20:23 <jott> qemu is very fragile...
Aug 21 16:20:31 <jott> try to use the cvs-m version.
Aug 21 16:20:51 <jott> btw. qemu was the reason why cmake crashed.
Aug 21 16:21:13 <Mek> ah, okay :)
Aug 21 16:21:19 <jott> but in this case the other way around (0.8.2-sb2 seems to work but not cvs-m)
Aug 21 16:21:26 <jott> it really stinks :/
Aug 21 16:21:38 <Mek> how do I install a different qemu/tell scratchbox to use that one? :)
Aug 21 16:22:07 <jott> look at /scratchbox/user/$USER/targets
Aug 21 16:22:31 <jott> and /scratchbox/devkits/cputransp/bin
Aug 21 16:22:47 <jott> cvs-m should come with the default installation.
Aug 21 16:23:23 <Mek> ah, yes; so just changing the .config to refer to that one should make it use that? (after restarting scratchbox)?
Aug 21 16:23:55 <jott> you don't need to restart, it's parsed on each prompt :)
Aug 21 16:24:10 <jott> or rather after it.
Aug 21 16:24:16 <jott> before executing something
Aug 21 16:25:15 <jott> Mek: other than that http://outpo.st/boost/
Aug 21 16:27:04 <Mek> ah, that is a lot easier than building them myself :)
Aug 21 16:27:54 <jott> yeah in the end it should be build by the builder anyway :)
Aug 21 16:28:09 <jott> but that's another adventure  :)
Aug 21 16:31:13 <Khertan_n810> hi ... again ...
Aug 21 16:31:35 <Khertan_n810> someone know where i can get the defoma lib for abiword \
Aug 21 16:31:36 <Khertan_n810> ?
Aug 21 16:33:57 <andrewfblack> Hey Khertan
Aug 21 16:40:05 <andrewfblack> umm looks like apple is getting sued because the IPhone 3G is twice as fast as the Regular IPone like they prommised it would be lol
Aug 21 16:40:47 <Khertan_n810> twice as fast too lost network too
Aug 21 16:40:48 <Khertan_n810> :)
Aug 21 16:41:43 <jott> i wonder if they get/got sued for "Half the price." too, as it's pure BS :)
Aug 21 16:41:58 <mutu_rock> oe sergio
Aug 21 16:42:05 <andrewfblack> lol I'm sure that is next jott
Aug 21 16:42:29 <sergio> eo
Aug 21 16:42:31 <Khertan_n810> can t code app in python
Aug 21 16:42:36 <mutu_rock> como te va
Aug 21 16:42:49 <Khertan_n810> no interpreted language is accepted by apple on iphone
Aug 21 16:43:11 <Khertan_n810> no possibility to code onboard
Aug 21 16:43:12 <Khertan_n810> so really not interesting
Aug 21 16:43:30 <jott> but it has working 3d drivers :P
Aug 21 16:44:15 <mutu_rock> sergio donde estas
Aug 21 16:44:22 <andrewfblack> yeah I had a friend who got a free itouch from going on work trip he came home same week I got my N810 and he was so excited until he saw my Nokia lol
Aug 21 16:44:39 <Khertan_n810> useless if we can t use it
Aug 21 16:45:19 <Khertan_n810> haha
Aug 21 16:46:01 <andrewfblack> hey Khertan did you get that email sent back out
Aug 21 16:48:00 <sergio> mutu_rock trabajando
Aug 21 16:51:39 <kaie> would you mind if I do some brainstorming? mobile phones still don't have nice cameras, they are still toys (no real flash, no nice optical zoom)
Aug 21 16:52:12 <kaie> let's say I'm travelling with a digital camera, that doesn't use SD cards, and the n810, only
Aug 21 16:52:28 <kaie> is there any way to transfer files from the camera (in my case XD) to the n810?
Aug 21 16:52:36 <Veggen> yes.
Aug 21 16:52:37 <andrewfblack> card read?
Aug 21 16:52:56 <andrewfblack> I havn't tried my USB card reader on my tablet but I would think it would work
Aug 21 16:52:57 <Veggen> The n810 can do USB host mode. You might need to provide power, but a powered hub  can do that.
Aug 21 16:53:25 <Khertan_n810> andrewfblack: yep you should have already get it
Aug 21 16:53:33 <Khertan_n810> as i send it a 13pm
Aug 21 16:53:56 <andrewfblack> ok its ok my personal email at home I'll check it when I get home.
Aug 21 16:54:00 <kaie> oh really. I didn't know that. hmm. so I should go and hunt for a matching cable and it might immediately work?
Aug 21 16:54:10 <Veggen> kaie: yes, it might.
Aug 21 16:54:13 <andrewfblack> I havn't found a way to check gmail at work yet
Aug 21 16:54:32 <Veggen> kaie: you need a small app to change to USB host mode on the n810 too.
Aug 21 16:55:10 <andrewfblack> kaie : worse case you might need a powered USB hub I would think but card reader shouldn't pull anymore power then a USB Stick
Aug 21 16:55:21 <Veggen> The n810 provides *some* power, but not too much. It *might* be enough for your camera.
Aug 21 16:56:31 <Khertan_n810> andrefblack: just in case i m uploding it in experiment downloads of my website
Aug 21 16:57:35 <Khertan_n810> s/uplodind/uploading
Aug 21 16:57:49 <kaie> ok thanks. I'll go and see if I can find an usb-male to usb-male adapter
Aug 21 16:58:26 <andrewfblack> khertan_n810 cool
Aug 21 16:58:47 <Khertan_n810> mcontacts.tar.gz
Aug 21 17:00:50 <andrewfblack> cool, btw I noticed my custom theme doesn't look that good on mcalendars I guess its becuase i use 20 for my large font and I guess thats what the buttons use in mcalendar
Aug 21 17:01:42 <lbt> so I need getopt to run ucf to install autofs.... that comes from util-linux -- so how does that interact with busybox?
Aug 21 17:01:55 <Khertan_n810> 20px for text button ?
Aug 21 17:02:23 <Khertan_n810> i think many other gtk gui may be broken
Aug 21 17:02:47 <andrewfblack> well on theme maker only choose two font sizes Small font and Large font
Aug 21 17:02:58 <andrewfblack> I guess buttons use the large font one
Aug 21 17:03:06 <Khertan_n810> arf ... edit the gtkrc manually
Aug 21 17:03:10 <Khertan_n810> it ll be better
Aug 21 17:03:53 <andrewfblack> yeah I am going to do that because I want to add custom icons and I think I have to do it by editing gtkrc someone said
Aug 21 17:04:04 <crashanddie> \o/
Aug 21 17:04:08 <crashanddie> CloudReader is finished :D
Aug 21 17:04:35 <qwerty12> Cloudreader... Hmm, can I smoke that?
Aug 21 17:04:47 <crashanddie> you're too young to smoke
Aug 21 17:04:53 <lbt> so I need getopt to run ucf to install autofs.... that comes from util-linux -- so how does that interact with busybox?
Aug 21 17:05:06 <Khertan_n810> 'ALARM_EVENT_CONNECTED
Aug 21 17:05:14 <lcuk> crashanddie, so you have been a busy geezer, what does it do
Aug 21 17:05:14 <Khertan_n810> sorry wrong window
Aug 21 17:05:26 <qwerty12> crashanddie: Hey, you gave me GPS coordinates for France :P
Aug 21 17:05:35 <crashanddie> qwerty12, so ?
Aug 21 17:05:54 <qwerty12> lbt: util-linux conflicts with busybox. Or rather the other way around
Aug 21 17:06:01 <lcuk> hang on a minute, hes too young to take part in an illegal activity?
Aug 21 17:06:02 <qwerty12> crashanddie: sudden change of mind? ;)
Aug 21 17:06:09 <lcuk> what age do you have to be to do something illegal?
Aug 21 17:06:17 <lbt> is it safe to remove bb and install util-linux?
Aug 21 17:06:37 <crashanddie> qwerty12, I gave you GPS coordinates, does that mean I condone your acts ?
Aug 21 17:06:51 <lcuk> hell yeah
Aug 21 17:06:56 <qwerty12> lbt: sure. just install corelinux, bash2 etc
Aug 21 17:07:03 <qwerty12> crashanddie: just helping me with them right?
Aug 21 17:07:31 <crashanddie> lcuk, only what it's supposed to, get the feed for the cloud, display the cloud, wait for user input to select the tag, retrieve the feed for a given tag, wait for user input to select a story, open browser to story, sit in the background until the browser is closed
Aug 21 17:07:38 * qwerty12 is just taking the piss anyway, jam :)
Aug 21 17:07:46 <lcuk> nice :)
Aug 21 17:08:00 <crashanddie> lcuk, I optimised the kinetic scrolling, and I have dynamic memory allocation
Aug 21 17:08:07 <lcuk> even nicer :)
Aug 21 17:08:27 <crashanddie> lcuk, I just need to add one last "loading" screen when the browser is loading, and then find out how to get the screen resolution
Aug 21 17:08:40 <crashanddie> and the app will work in landscape/portrait mode
Aug 21 17:08:43 <lcuk> i gave you the sdl_ function call you need to do that
Aug 21 17:08:52 <crashanddie> yeah, only for SDL 1.2.10
Aug 21 17:08:58 <crashanddie> and we have 1.2.8
Aug 21 17:09:09 <lcuk> hmm ok then
Aug 21 17:09:17 <lcuk> you can talk to x
Aug 21 17:09:25 <crashanddie> Yeah, I probably will
Aug 21 17:12:56 <lbt> qwerty12: removing busybox and getting the wrong apps to replace it sounds like a great way to prepare for a re-flash... I can't see 'corelinux' although I have installed bash2
Aug 21 17:13:34 <lbt> apt-cache showpkg busybox shows a lot of interdependencies
Aug 21 17:13:39 <qwerty12> lbt: oops, I meant coreutils. There is probably more you need to get like procps etc. It's in the SDK repo
Aug 21 17:16:21 <Khertan_n810> back again
Aug 21 17:16:49 <Khertan_n810> is there someone that understand how alarmd work ?
Aug 21 17:17:11 <lbt> hmm - so I see conflicing info on this... some suggests that I can install coreutils and it'll replace any busybox links
Aug 21 17:17:26 <lbt> but I get "Note, selecting busybox for regex âcoreutilsâ"
Aug 21 17:17:51 <lbt> sigh - I just want "getopt"
Aug 21 17:17:51 <Khertan_n810> if i set flag CONNECTED does it wake up device only when connected or also when there is a new connection after the time up ?
Aug 21 17:18:15 <lbt> I hate having to dick around for hours to run a shell script
Aug 21 17:18:33 <Khertan_n810> parse args manually
Aug 21 17:18:40 <Anunakin> lbt, rebuild coreutil package for not remove busybox
Aug 21 17:19:16 <Khertan_n810> or do script with python  :)
Aug 21 17:19:32 <lbt> Anunakin: there was chat on -dev about just getting rid of bb
Aug 21 17:19:49 <Anunakin> I made some .debs... for bash, grep, ...
Aug 21 17:19:49 <lbt> if someone is doing that then I'll pass
Aug 21 17:19:53 <Khertan_n810> no alarmd expert here ?
Aug 21 17:20:21 <Anunakin> lbt: but it -dev can break you maemo
Aug 21 17:20:39 <lbt> yes - I wanted to avoid that...
Aug 21 17:20:56 <lbt> (I meant the -dev mail list BTW...)
Aug 21 17:21:16 <lbt> Eero Tamminen <eero.tamminen@nokia.com> writes: Let's get rid of busybox already.
Aug 21 17:21:21 <lbt> good man :)
Aug 21 17:21:32 <gregorovius_> is the maemo-announce mailing list worth subscribing? it seems to be completely dead
Aug 21 17:21:49 <yacoob> speaking of which.
Aug 21 17:22:23 <yacoob> question to those of you that have some developer connections: how would you rate Nokia's attitude to the community? And their plans, responsivness, ideas...?
Aug 21 17:22:31 <lbt> ah, too hard to publish - I'll just hack it for me
Aug 21 17:23:05 <Khertan_n810> yacoob: i will say nokia has a great attitude
Aug 21 17:23:28 <Khertan_n810> as they sell me an n810 for 99Euros
Aug 21 17:24:17 <zuh> Khertan_n810: That's bribing, not great attitude ;)
Aug 21 17:24:22 <lcuk> yacoob, nokia is a community grandparent, they are getting us together for a party next month :D
Aug 21 17:24:28 <Khertan_n810> and extras repository maintainer really help me to dev a tool to upload package from a nit
Aug 21 17:24:40 <gregorovius_> well... if they do that, they're expecting you to pay the difference in development time
Aug 21 17:24:55 <Mek> they gave me one for free :P
Aug 21 17:24:57 <Khertan_n810> yep an paid travel and accomodation for the summit
Aug 21 17:25:00 <lcuk> gregorovius_, which you would do anyway
Aug 21 17:25:22 <lcuk> mek, yer we've been waiting for you freeloaders to arrive :P
Aug 21 17:25:29 <yacoob> on site, you'll be fed nokia-love-inducing drugs...
Aug 21 17:26:17 <Khertan_n810> they sold me it without condition
Aug 21 17:26:39 <Khertan_n810> palm as never listen to third party developper
Aug 21 17:27:00 <Khertan_n810> and never answer to my help request with the api
Aug 21 17:27:07 <RST38h> lcukkk
Aug 21 17:27:14 <lcuk> thats cos palm world was $$$
Aug 21 17:27:27 <lcuk> rst387.9999999h
Aug 21 17:27:45 <Khertan_n810> and the worst thing is that their api sucks
Aug 21 17:27:50 * lcuk cant type ever when he needs to
Aug 21 17:27:53 <Khertan_n810> as change isn t documented
Aug 21 17:28:06 <andrewfblack> Ehy qwerty12 this weekend I need to get with you on how to do those changes to my theme deb
Aug 21 17:28:07 <lcuk> Khertan, it is if you are in the club
Aug 21 17:28:14 <RST38h> Programming for PalmOS is like ass-fucking a pidgeon
Aug 21 17:28:17 <andrewfblack> opps he gone lol
Aug 21 17:28:17 <ariya> anyone here knows someone who does something with the qt hildon IM ?
Aug 21 17:28:22 <RST38h> [and I mean it literally]
Aug 21 17:28:23 <gregorovius> RST38h: disgusting!
Aug 21 17:28:39 <RST38h> Disgusting does not even begin to describe it
Aug 21 17:28:42 <lcuk> ariya, yes, GNUton and jott are doing qt type stuff
Aug 21 17:28:45 <lcuk> and others as well
Aug 21 17:28:51 <Khertan_n810> lcuk: which one my software kmeteo hit the top 20 used softwares for palm os
Aug 21 17:29:41 <lcuk> and they never let you in the club? shameful
Aug 21 17:30:31 <Khertan_n810> example of a bad things : setting the prefs 'HomeButton' on tx set it really to the home button, on treo650 it set the phone button, and on a Treo680 the other phone button to end call
Aug 21 17:30:38 * yacoob just wonder where does RST gathered the experience to compare it to... :D
Aug 21 17:30:40 <gregorovius> any recommendations for a personal wiki sorta thing?
Aug 21 17:30:44 <Khertan_n810> tx is identified as lifedrive ...
Aug 21 17:31:00 <Khertan_n810> lifedrive as a e2
Aug 21 17:31:07 <yacoob> but yah, I've read briefly PalmOS programming guide, looked like ressurected c64  manual in few places
Aug 21 17:31:10 <lbt> gregorovius: Zim is excellent
Aug 21 17:31:12 <Khertan_n810> and treo650 itg s depends on rom version
Aug 21 17:31:17 <yacoob> gregorovius, tiddlywiki!
Aug 21 17:31:25 <lbt> not a web wiki -desktop wiki
Aug 21 17:31:28 <yacoob> it does... everything!
Aug 21 17:31:45 <Khertan_n810> yacoob: worse than a c64 manual
Aug 21 17:31:50 <gregorovius> is zim ported to NITs?
Aug 21 17:32:05 <yacoob> zim seems to be dead.
Aug 21 17:32:15 <Khertan_n810> other example ... there is a lib to know if a lib exist ...
Aug 21 17:32:24 <yacoob> ah, no, that's just me looking for wrong thing.
Aug 21 17:32:30 <Khertan_n810> but on some models it answer true instead of false
Aug 21 17:33:14 <Khertan_n810> so you need to make many switch case in your code to test model, and rom revision
Aug 21 17:33:46 <gregorovius> yacoob: does tiddlywiki work ok on the tablets?
Aug 21 17:33:57 <Khertan_n810> other thing ... you can t do more than 4 socket or u will break socket stack
Aug 21 17:34:11 <Khertan_n810> and there is many things like that
Aug 21 17:34:24 <yacoob> gregorovius, don't know, tbh. It's all html+js, so I don't think microb will have any problems with that...
Aug 21 17:35:03 <gregorovius> i was thinking maybe it'll be too much of a strain, but i'll try it out
Aug 21 17:38:55 <ariya> GNUton: ping
Aug 21 17:48:33 <Khertan_n810> raaaaahhhh ! alarmd will make me crazy
Aug 21 17:49:41 <Edulix> hi
Aug 21 17:50:03 <Mek> Edulix: hi
Aug 21 17:50:04 <Edulix> is there any easy way to transform an ilbc sound file to wav or mp3?
Aug 21 17:50:20 <Edulix> using command line in linux if possible =)
Aug 21 17:50:41 <Edulix> I recorded the ilbc file with maemo recorder
Aug 21 17:50:47 <Edulix> *files
Aug 21 17:51:13 <brontide> Khertan: I'll give py2deb a whirl and see if I can get Dialcentral ( Grandcentral Dialer ) into extras already
Aug 21 17:52:53 <Khertan_n810> brontide: is it in python ?
Aug 21 17:52:58 <brontide> Yep
Aug 21 17:53:03 <Khertan_n810> oh
Aug 21 17:54:09 <Khertan_n810> oh do u cancel an alarm when u don t have his id ?
Aug 21 17:55:25 <brontide> Hmmm... I've tackled a lot of python/gtk/maemo quirks, but alarmd is not something I've tackled.  I'll be working on alarmd next when I finish up the google docs sync
Aug 21 17:56:20 <Khertan_n810> ...
Aug 21 17:56:51 <Khertan_n810> i have created an alarm for a test that launch mcalendar each minute
Aug 21 17:57:06 <Khertan_n810> can t cancel it as i vn t his id
Aug 21 17:57:29 <Khertan_n810> don t found anything in the python binding to list alarm
Aug 21 17:57:42 <brontide> Hmm... that's stupid
Aug 21 17:57:49 <Khertan_n810> yep
Aug 21 17:57:59 <brontide> there needs to be a way to enumerate alarms
Aug 21 17:58:59 <brontide> can you get it from the xml file that alarmd uses?
Aug 21 17:59:54 <brontide> here /var/lib/alarmd/alarm_queue.xml
Aug 21 18:01:19 <lcuk> which distro is prefered for scratchbox?
Aug 21 18:02:45 <XTL> Debian might be the most natural one
Aug 21 18:02:58 <XTL> I think the instructions for installing devkits are for D
Aug 21 18:03:49 <Khertan_n810> hum passing the right say me False
Aug 21 18:03:51 <Khertan_n810> pfff
Aug 21 18:04:06 <RST38h> lcuk: ubuntu
Aug 21 18:04:18 <RST38h> lcuk: you may have problems with others
Aug 21 18:04:38 <lcuk> ubuntu is debian based isnt it
Aug 21 18:04:38 <brontide> So no luck with the cookie from the xml file?
Aug 21 18:04:46 <lcuk> thanks xtl/ RST38h
Aug 21 18:05:36 <Khertan_n810> no ... i ve edited file
Aug 21 18:05:36 <Khertan_n810> work better
Aug 21 18:06:26 <lcuk> RST38h, is it straight forward to install if im careful
Aug 21 18:06:56 <RST38h> it is safe as long as you follow the instructions exactly
Aug 21 18:06:59 * lcuk needs a machine once again for the summit and it might as well have proper features
Aug 21 18:07:00 <brontide> getting threads/gobject.idle_add was my big advance today, dialcentral is now lots more responsive
Aug 21 18:07:02 <ariya> Icuk: scratchbox on OpenSUSE is also dead easy
Aug 21 18:07:15 <RST38h> I do suggest installing sb2 instead though
Aug 21 18:07:35 <lcuk> simpler? or just another thing to learn
Aug 21 18:07:54 <RST38h> gentler
Aug 21 18:08:01 <lcuk> i was tempted the other day to dd the vmware image directly onto my laptop
Aug 21 18:08:03 <RST38h> you will not have completely insulated environment
Aug 21 18:08:32 <RST38h> In sb1, you log into the "system" and use it this way. To get to your own file system you have to configure networking and use nfs locally
Aug 21 18:08:38 <RST38h> In sb2, you do not log in
Aug 21 18:08:52 <RST38h> Just use "sb2 gcc" instead of "gcc" and you are all set
Aug 21 18:08:58 <lcuk> i dont ever think bout logging  in with vmware - its just a console box like i have now
Aug 21 18:09:12 <lcuk> but i run make - do the makefiles need altering to do similar?
Aug 21 18:09:20 <RST38h> yes, but you will have to log in from that console box into sb1
Aug 21 18:09:34 <RST38h> In sb1, you will run make inside the scratchbox
Aug 21 18:09:46 <lcuk> yes - the desktop icon does all that for me - once ive clicked it im ready to go with no logins
Aug 21 18:09:52 <RST38h> In sb2, you can use whatever make you have in your Linux, just change CC setting
Aug 21 18:09:53 <Mek> in sb1 you can just mount --bind to get your local file system inside scratchbox..
Aug 21 18:10:20 * lcuk would prefer to compile and build on a native arm system
Aug 21 18:10:37 <lcuk> would a beagleboard allow this incidentally?
Aug 21 18:10:46 <lcuk> use it as a desktop and build maemo apps?
Aug 21 18:11:24 <lcuk> ill get ubuntu on the machine first anyway and see which sb fits
Aug 21 18:11:28 <brontide> lcuk: I'm kinda hoping that the maemo firmware under qemu thing pans out
Aug 21 18:11:34 <RST38h> http://exiledonline.com/dolan-who-wants-ice-man/
Aug 21 18:11:53 <GeneralAntilles> Speaking of that, where'd hrw disappear to?
Aug 21 18:12:07 <lcuk> brontide, i would hope to never have to use an emulator
Aug 21 18:12:10 <RST38h> check his blog?
Aug 21 18:12:15 <lcuk> GeneralAntilles, probably very busy
Aug 21 18:12:45 <RST38h> http://blog.haerwu.biz/
Aug 21 18:13:19 <crashanddie> isn't hrw on holiday ?
Aug 21 18:13:20 <lcuk> good job i didnt get his blog mixed up with "human rights watch" links :D
Aug 21 18:13:36 <RST38h> He is working at OpenedHand
Aug 21 18:13:42 <lcuk> crashanddie, like i said, very busy
Aug 21 18:13:43 <crashanddie> so ?
Aug 21 18:13:55 <RST38h> Which means he should be VERY busy right around now ;)
Aug 21 18:14:01 <lcuk> holiday is the most important time of the year (assuming he is having one)
Aug 21 18:14:55 <Khertan_n810> grr...
Aug 21 18:15:03 <Khertan_n810> this is stupid to not have iterator to get alarm ... how cancel it if the databased is scratched by user ?
Aug 21 18:15:08 <brontide> I'm on the deck looking out over the water enjoying candy and hard cider..... after spending all morning at the beach... list is hard
Aug 21 18:15:21 <crashanddie> nha
Aug 21 18:15:35 <RST38h> lcuk: afai, no
Aug 21 18:15:36 <crashanddie> at OpenedHand, they just spend time moving desktops around at this time
Aug 21 18:16:55 <GeneralAntilles> kaie, with the right software (gphoto2) you can hook your camera in directly
Aug 21 18:17:08 <GeneralAntilles> and OTG has plenty of power for that (which it wont have for a card reader).
Aug 21 18:18:22 <crashanddie> QWERTY !!!
Aug 21 18:19:08 <crashanddie> No one would know how I can find out if the tablet is running in landscape or portrait mode ?
Aug 21 18:19:27 <lcuk> yes, see xomap or whatever it is
Aug 21 18:19:36 <lcuk> xrandr maybe
Aug 21 18:19:45 <lcuk> i cant remember which but theres a library for it
Aug 21 18:19:54 <crashanddie> yeah, but that means they need to have xrandr installed :)
Aug 21 18:20:13 <lcuk> and if its not installed then you know its not rotated :)
Aug 21 18:20:41 <lcuk> for now just check for 800*480 or 480*800?
Aug 21 18:21:08 <RST38h> check root window dimensions
Aug 21 18:21:27 <RST38h> in fact, I would expect *any* pair of numbers, not just these two
Aug 21 18:21:45 <RST38h> this is the right thing to do, in case you run app on a different device
Aug 21 18:25:17 <GeneralAntilles> crashanddie, xrandr is bundled.
Aug 21 18:25:48 <crashanddie> nha, I managed without it
Aug 21 18:34:46 <a-l-e> hello. i'd like to install php on the n810 and i see 3 packages... which is the difference? is php5-fastcgi-pear a metapackage with all i need?
Aug 21 18:42:52 <TrueJournals> Hello!
Aug 21 18:43:27 <TrueJournals> ... or not :-P
Aug 21 18:43:54 <TrueJournals> I'm trying to modify rdesktop to get it to work on my n800... but I'm having trouble with power button presses
Aug 21 18:44:12 <TrueJournals> I can't figure out a reliable way to detect if the power button is pressed... any ideas?
Aug 21 18:44:47 <crashanddie> done
Aug 21 18:44:54 <crashanddie> lcuk, want to see the latest version ?
Aug 21 18:45:17 <lcuk> gfi
Aug 21 18:45:32 <crashanddie> hang on, I'll just tar the needed things so that everyone can try it
Aug 21 18:45:38 <crashanddie> works in both landscape and portrait mode :)
Aug 21 18:46:54 <lcuk> crash, with randr, or you rotating your assets?
Aug 21 18:47:06 <crashanddie> with xrandr
Aug 21 18:47:11 * lcuk crosses legs at that thought actually
Aug 21 18:47:13 <crashanddie> I don't change a thing
Aug 21 18:47:47 <lcuk> yer, we should push for native support in default nokia kernel - jott has proven its stable and lots of things benefit
Aug 21 18:48:47 <crashanddie> http://undercity.doesntexist.com/~crashanddie/cloudreader.tar
Aug 21 18:49:44 <crashanddie> anyway, time for star trek voyager, ttyl
Aug 21 18:50:47 <penguinbait> Window Maker anyone?  http://www.internettablettalk.com/forums/showthread.php?p=216174#post216174
Aug 21 18:52:10 <lcuk> penguinbait, great stuff, give a gallery as well: http://www.windowmaker.info/gallery.php
Aug 21 18:52:31 <GeneralAntilles> lcuk, there's already a bug
Aug 21 18:52:34 <GeneralAntilles> For kernel and xserver
Aug 21 18:52:46 <GeneralAntilles> xrandr is already shipped
Aug 21 18:53:11 <GeneralAntilles> So get Nokia to ship the kernel and xserver patched then "rotation support" is just "install Advanced Backlight"
Aug 21 18:53:44 <GeneralAntilles> Woo, Voyager.
Aug 21 18:53:44 <lcuk> penguinbait, how much modding did you need to slot this into maemo?
Aug 21 18:53:54 <GeneralAntilles> There a throwback to my youth.
Aug 21 18:53:58 <lcuk> GeneralAntilles, it needs a new kernel though
Aug 21 18:54:07 <penguinbait> none, it just runs nicely
Aug 21 18:54:15 <GeneralAntilles> lcuk, erm, "ne"
Aug 21 18:54:19 <GeneralAntilles> s/ne/new/
Aug 21 18:54:20 <infobot> GeneralAntilles meant: lcuk, erm, "new"
Aug 21 18:54:20 <lcuk> its a "simple" window manager isnt it
Aug 21 18:54:47 <GeneralAntilles> [2:53pm] <GeneralAntilles> So get Nokia to ship the __kernel__ and xserver patched then "rotation support" is just "install Advanced Backlight"
Aug 21 18:55:04 <penguinbait> 25MB and fits right in flash
Aug 21 18:55:21 <penguinbait> its really only about 6-8mb but I added lots of other stuff
Aug 21 18:55:28 <GeneralAntilles> I don't understand the "let's use a desktop WM on a 4.1" screen with a stylus" thought process.
Aug 21 18:55:54 <lcuk> penguinbait, ive just grabbed the base source, im looking for something to sit ontop of liqbase to use the speed boost..
Aug 21 18:56:04 <penguinbait> well #1 WM was designed when 800x600 was the majority :)
Aug 21 18:56:28 <GeneralAntilles> Yeah, well, that's 800x600 at ~72dpi
Aug 21 18:56:31 <GeneralAntilles> Not 225dpi
Aug 21 18:56:32 <penguinbait> It works real nice, but not for old people who can't see small fonts :)
Aug 21 18:57:58 <MangoFusion> GeneralAntilles: what's hard to understand? it's a desktop... in your pocket. OMFG!!
Aug 21 18:58:16 <penguinbait> hell its almost worth 25MB just to have real fdisk :)
Aug 21 18:58:42 <Stskeeps> cfdisk isn't bad either
Aug 21 18:58:54 <penguinbait> its got pico too
Aug 21 18:58:55 <penguinbait> hehe
Aug 21 18:59:24 <penguinbait> rcp/rsh/telnet/ftp
Aug 21 18:59:37 <penguinbait> lest also not forget how usefull xeyes is :)
Aug 21 19:00:20 <RST38h> does pico still crash on search?
Aug 21 19:00:36 <penguinbait> not sure, I will test
Aug 21 19:01:14 <Stskeeps> penguinbait: have you looked at my bootmenu.d stuff btw? (since you do clone to sd stuff and other stuff)
Aug 21 19:01:24 <penguinbait> nope search works fine
Aug 21 19:01:58 <remex_> >/w 8
Aug 21 19:02:26 <penguinbait> Stskeeps, I really only remove Fanoush's checks and balances and place in a deb
Aug 21 19:02:53 <Stskeeps> ah
Aug 21 19:03:15 <Stskeeps> my idea was mostly the part about adding bootmenu items through a /etc/bootmenu.d system, so its easy to install new items
Aug 21 19:04:29 <penguinbait> I made a bootmenu installer deb, it just installs bootmenu.  It will scan all partitions and write out new bootmenu, ext2 and 3 are supported
Aug 21 19:04:48 <penguinbait> It might only scan two per SD card, I dont recall at this point in time
Aug 21 19:04:51 <GeneralAntilles> MangoFusion, I almost exclusively use my thumbs.
Aug 21 19:05:00 <GeneralAntilles> Hitting those tiny little widgets is not possible.
Aug 21 19:05:30 <MangoFusion> not my problem. get smaller thumbs ;)
Aug 21 19:05:41 <Stskeeps> penguinbait: yeah, - my goal was more to have the systems tell how they want to be booted and how to represent in boot menu
Aug 21 19:05:44 <MangoFusion> though seriously
Aug 21 19:05:48 <MangoFusion> i don't get it either
Aug 21 19:05:50 <RST38h> GAN: Use nails
Aug 21 19:06:09 <MangoFusion> thumbs on an n800 or n810?
Aug 21 19:06:14 <RST38h> penguinbait: cool! Now, if you just pack pico... =)
Aug 21 19:07:12 <penguinbait> use vi, or its 25MB :)
Aug 21 19:08:28 * GeneralAntilles scratches up RST38h's N810 with two rusty nails.
Aug 21 19:08:54 <penguinbait> ouch!
Aug 21 19:09:32 * penguinbait slaps GeneralAntilles around a bit with a large trout
Aug 21 19:09:46 <RST38h> urgh
Aug 21 19:09:53 <GeneralAntilles> Hey, save the trouts for slapping around the Nokians!
Aug 21 19:09:56 <RST38h> penguin: not fair! =)
Aug 21 19:12:19 <penguinbait> RST it might work by itself
Aug 21 19:12:29 <penguinbait> try penguinbait.com/pico.gz
Aug 21 19:13:27 <lbt>  <Stskeeps> my idea was mostly the part about adding bootmenu items through a /etc/bootmenu.d system, so its easy to install new items...... oh, that was your idea ;)
Aug 21 19:13:34 <Stskeeps> oh, lbt's idea
Aug 21 19:13:34 <Stskeeps> my bad
Aug 21 19:13:37 <lbt> ;)
Aug 21 19:13:46 * lbt lurks
Aug 21 19:14:07 * lbt reads the backlog sometimes
Aug 21 19:14:13 <RST38h> penguin: thanks!
Aug 21 19:14:40 <penguinbait> I think it will work, there are no other files that go with it
Aug 21 19:14:46 <penguinbait> let me know?
Aug 21 19:20:34 <RST38h> it should work - will test a bit later
Aug 21 19:22:14 <andrewfblack> I was just thinking I have seen dozens of posts about missing stylist how come no one has ever made some I'm sure people would buy them
Aug 21 19:23:36 <GeneralAntilles> Made some that'd actually fit in the tablet's stylus slot?
Aug 21 19:23:56 <GeneralAntilles> You'd have to produce at LEAST a thousand to have any sort of reasonable price.
Aug 21 19:24:23 <andrewfblack> I could make them my self to fit for less then a quarter a peice
Aug 21 19:26:44 <kkrusty> lol
Aug 21 19:26:54 <kkrusty> who came up with i-am-free?
Aug 21 19:27:00 <kkrusty> brilliant
Aug 21 19:30:00 <RST38h> Information technology workers at the US Department of Homeland Security are busy scraping egg off their collective faces after unknown hackers broke into their telephone system and wracked up $12,000 in calls to the Middle East and Asia.
Aug 21 19:44:47 <andrewfblack> just did some quick math and I can make a Stylus for 9 cents
Aug 21 19:46:56 <RST38h> in how big batch?
Aug 21 19:47:30 <andrewfblack> 100
Aug 21 19:50:14 <andrewfblack> thats not to big of a batch I wouldn't think
Aug 21 19:50:34 <andrewfblack> since if I decided to make them I would make min order like 5
Aug 21 19:50:35 <RST38h> hm
Aug 21 19:53:00 <andrewfblack> well figuring in cost of material to make the molds it would cost me 39 cents for first batch and then 9 cents for each next batch since molds are reusable
Aug 21 19:57:13 <RST38h> oh you are doing it by yourself
Aug 21 19:57:52 <andrewfblack> yeah
Aug 21 20:13:03 <moontiger> would they be the same as the existing stylus's (stylii?) ?
Aug 21 20:13:50 <andrewfblack> about 99% I most likly will not have the Nokia imprint on them just to watch out for myself
Aug 21 20:14:13 <andrewfblack> and be smooth instead of the slight texture it has now
Aug 21 20:14:25 <moontiger> color?
Aug 21 20:15:04 <andrewfblack> could be just about any including clear if thats what people wanted
Aug 21 20:15:26 <moontiger> awesome ... put me down for some :)
Aug 21 20:16:37 <andrewfblack> lol I got to order the stuff to make the molds first and I can only make 2 molds at a time since I only have 2 stylus right now  I guess once I make the first 2 then I would have 4 to make molds from
Aug 21 20:16:58 <kkrusty> the n810 stylus isnt as good as the one with n800 but Im sure this must be an old topic now
Aug 21 20:17:27 <andrewfblack> whats not the same about them never owned a n800
Aug 21 20:18:21 <kkrusty> well they arent the same. The n800 is thicker
Aug 21 20:19:03 <andrewfblack> well if people wanted some n800 ones I would just need someone to send me there stylus for 24 hours and I could send it back to them
Aug 21 20:19:41 <moontiger> well if you get round to it and need some upfront $$ (oooooooo $10) just let me know ;)
Aug 21 20:20:35 <andrewfblack> I only need $33 to make my first 100 so money isn't the problem, I'll order the stuff next week I might have my first batch done 2 weeks from now
Aug 21 20:22:14 <moontiger> you rock! :)
Aug 21 20:22:46 <andrewfblack> I'll post something on itT once I get the stuff to make the molds in
Aug 21 20:32:02 <andrewfblack> I have to finish work on my Vac Table so I can make the Nokia Tablet Custom Grip with built in Game Controls
Aug 21 20:32:41 <andrewfblack> I finally decided how to hook the tablet to the Grip
Aug 21 20:34:52 <Luria> duct tape
Aug 21 20:34:55 <Luria> ?
Aug 21 20:35:46 <lcuk> i use highly advanced elastic bands
Aug 21 20:36:19 <Luria> duct tape - it surrounds us, penetrates us, and binds the galaxy together.
Aug 21 20:36:57 <Luria> except for the stuff that's soldered together. thats the dark side, which is a bit more fun.
Aug 21 20:38:46 <andrewfblack> going to use a stylus hold on the n810 to mount it actually
Aug 21 20:39:34 <Luria> evicting the stylus?
Aug 21 20:39:51 <Luria> hmmm.... cool, i have 13 weeks 6 days of audio in my collection now. need another hdd or two
Aug 21 20:41:38 <lbt> woo hoo - automount works :)
Aug 21 20:42:02 <Luria> automount on maemo
Aug 21 20:42:08 <lbt> yes
Aug 21 20:42:12 <lbt> autofs
Aug 21 20:42:15 <lbt> with nfs
Aug 21 20:42:16 <Luria> shouldnt it work anyway?
Aug 21 20:42:41 <lbt> didn't appear to be in the modules
Aug 21 20:43:02 <Luria> huh, i wish eeexubuntu knew what it's doing... it always mounts sd as cdfs
Aug 21 20:43:16 <lbt> this is /net/host/files_on_host
Aug 21 20:43:26 <lbt> automagically via nfs/cifs
Aug 21 20:43:35 <lbt> so the mount occurs on access
Aug 21 20:43:54 <lbt> not hotplug
Aug 21 20:43:58 <Luria> no, i get what you are doing. mostly talking to myself, reminding me to fix my issues. good work, btw.
Aug 21 21:06:21 <Sargun> uhm
Aug 21 21:06:26 <Sargun> Maemo is GTK based, right?
Aug 21 21:06:40 <lcuk> yes
Aug 21 21:06:41 <Mek> for now, yeah...
Aug 21 21:27:09 <dougt__> is nohup available on device?
Aug 21 21:33:48 <GAN800> Mek, not gonna change anytime soon.
Aug 21 21:34:26 <melmoth> moi ca m est jamais arrivé un inconnu qui m offre une boulette
Aug 21 21:34:27 <melmoth> oups
Aug 21 21:42:45 <crashanddie> melmoth, stoi la boulette
Aug 21 21:43:10 <crashanddie> CloudReader: http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=nCFir0_5Jws
Aug 21 21:56:57 <lbt> any canola people here - does it work on nfs folders?
Aug 21 22:02:28 <moontiger> i use mediabox :)
Aug 21 22:08:39 <crashanddie> what are the "accepted" Section values for .debs again ?
Aug 21 22:14:39 <moontiger> does anybody know how to get a gripper handle on the bottom left of a home screen window?
Aug 21 22:14:59 <moontiger> bottom right i mean
Aug 21 22:15:01 <moontiger> :|
Aug 21 22:19:51 <GNUton> night
Aug 21 22:26:39 <moontiger> crashanddie, user free non-free afaik
Aug 21 22:26:53 <GeneralAntilles> moontiger, no.
Aug 21 22:26:55 <GeneralAntilles> That's in the repo
Aug 21 22:26:59 <moontiger> oh
Aug 21 22:27:03 <moontiger> my bad sorry
Aug 21 22:27:06 <GeneralAntilles> He's talking Section: User/Utilities Section
Aug 21 22:27:27 * moontiger shuts up 
Aug 21 22:27:33 <GeneralAntilles> crashanddie, https://wiki.maemo.org/Package_Categories
Aug 21 22:27:40 <GeneralAntilles> and Extras is just free and non-free. :P
Aug 21 22:28:28 <moontiger> GeneralAntilles, how do i get the gpg key for uploading to extras again? :)
Aug 21 22:29:02 <GeneralAntilles> ~uploading-extras
Aug 21 22:29:09 <GeneralAntilles> ~extras-uploading
Aug 21 22:29:18 <GeneralAntilles> ~upload-extras
Aug 21 22:29:19 <infobot> upload-extras is, like, http://wiki.maemo.org/Uploading_to_Extras
Aug 21 22:29:29 <moontiger> hehe nice! :)
Aug 21 22:34:44 <shapr> @yow !
Aug 21 22:40:59 <crashanddie> GeneralAntilles, there is no internet category ? That sucks
Aug 21 22:41:45 * shapr hugs GeneralAntilles
Aug 21 22:42:31 * GeneralAntilles 's Tyrant hugs shapr.
Aug 21 22:42:41 <shapr> yipes!
Aug 21 22:43:28 <jaska> oh its you
Aug 21 22:43:32 <shapr> yes it is!
Aug 21 22:43:41 <shapr> heippa hei!
Aug 21 22:43:45 <jaska> moo
Aug 21 22:43:55 <shapr> hyvää huomenta!
Aug 21 22:44:05 <jaska> bit early for that
Aug 21 22:44:11 <shapr> well, yeah...
Aug 21 22:44:24 <shapr> hyvää ihltaa?
Aug 21 22:44:31 <shapr> anyway....
Aug 21 22:44:46 <jaska> iltaa :)
Aug 21 22:44:57 <shapr> bah, I never could spell Finnish :-(
Aug 21 22:45:13 <shapr> I'm better with Swedish.
Aug 21 22:45:16 <jaska> heh, i remember you lived around here for a while
Aug 21 22:45:24 <shapr> joo
Aug 21 22:45:37 <shapr> Are you in Oulu?
Aug 21 22:45:47 <shapr> Or was that a country-wide 'around here' ?
Aug 21 22:46:01 <crashanddie> GeneralAntilles, an app that downloads/displays an RSS feed about general news, where should that go ? Communication ? accessories ? tools ? other ?
Aug 21 22:46:10 <jaska> naah, alahärmä (east of vaasa), but i you used to be in a chan where i was iirc
Aug 21 22:46:20 <jaska> prolly with myrddraal or someone
Aug 21 22:46:26 <shapr> or #debian-fi ?
Aug 21 22:46:36 <shapr> I haven't seen myrddraal in a long time.
Aug 21 22:46:51 <jaska> ditto
Aug 21 22:47:00 <crashanddie> in doubt, I'll put it in other
Aug 21 22:48:08 <GeneralAntilles> accessories, maybe, but I don't actually know
Aug 21 22:48:15 <GeneralAntilles> That PDF might have more info
Aug 21 22:48:22 <GeneralAntilles> I haven't paid much attention.
Aug 21 22:48:26 <crashanddie> nha, it doesn't say a lot
Aug 21 22:48:39 <crashanddie> just gives an example for an office app, but your guess is as good as mine
Aug 21 22:49:08 <GeneralAntilles> Get with X-Fade when he gets back from vacation
Aug 21 22:49:11 <GeneralAntilles> He needs some help. ;)
Aug 21 23:09:28 <crashanddie> is the autobuilder log in real time ?
Aug 21 23:10:07 <crashanddie> As in, I just uploaded my package, how long before I see it? :P
Aug 21 23:13:11 <GeneralAntilles> crashanddie, ~5 minutes
Aug 21 23:13:41 <crashanddie> hmm, ok
Aug 21 23:25:28 <crashanddie> GeneralAntilles, I'm sure that the fact it's me is why the build takes 20+ minutes :D
Aug 21 23:25:57 <crashanddie> if (username == "crashanddie") sleep(3600);
Aug 21 23:26:24 <crashanddie> /that's for bitching about the votes
Aug 21 23:46:42 <pupnik> opengl es 2.0 bling on Omap 3530 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-UFUbqoNgs8
Aug 21 23:52:37 <Dekaritae> So, a friend of mine had his notebook taken at customs coming back from the states
Aug 21 23:57:36 <moontiger> Dekaritae, serious? which customs?
Aug 21 23:57:57 <Dekaritae> Well he flew back from florida to ontario
Aug 21 23:58:15 <moontiger> us customs took it?
Aug 21 23:58:41 <aspect> coming *from* the states? I thought that was supposed to happen the other way around?
Aug 21 23:58:44 <Dekaritae> The agent put it on the inspection conveyor, and he went through the metal detector, and when they were done processing him it was gone, and no one knew anything about it
Aug 21 23:59:10 <moontiger> oh so it wasnt customs as such then?
Aug 21 23:59:14 <Dekaritae> Sucks less 'cause it was a work laptop, but still
Aug 22 00:02:04 <Dekaritae> It was outbould from florida
Aug 22 00:09:50 <moontiger> does anyone know where i can find alist of the stock icons available in maemo?
Aug 22 00:14:56 <mikkov_> moontiger: depends what you mean by stock icons. Here's gtk stock icons http://www.pygtk.org/docs/pygtk/gtk-stock-items.html
Aug 22 00:16:00 <moontiger> mikkov_, they dont look like that on the n8x0 tho right?
Aug 22 00:16:24 <mikkov_> depends on the theme, I think
Aug 22 00:16:49 <moontiger> ok so if i want icons instead of text for buttons i can use the stock icons and things will be ok?
Aug 22 00:17:23 <mikkov_> should be
Aug 22 00:18:40 <GAN800> /usr/share/icons
Aug 22 00:33:45 * GeneralAntilles loves the OGG bug
Aug 22 00:34:10 <GeneralAntilles> It's the wonderful place for all the retards to come and illustrate to the world the depths of their retardation.
Aug 22 00:36:07 <derf> Which bug is this?
Aug 22 00:37:46 <GeneralAntilles> https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=176
Aug 22 00:38:27 <n800m> i cannots plays my oggs plzkthx
Aug 22 00:38:47 <GeneralAntilles> People need to get a grip
Aug 22 00:38:52 <GeneralAntilles> Was it advertise on the box?
Aug 22 00:38:54 <GeneralAntilles> No.
Aug 22 00:38:59 <GeneralAntilles> advertised*
Aug 22 00:43:28 <brontide> I love how it can play ogg..... since all the Navigation cues are stored in ogg  ;-)
Aug 22 00:45:56 <derf> I should post a comment telling them to get on #maemo and start cracking the whip on lardman.
Aug 22 00:51:35 <crashanddie> damnit
Aug 22 00:51:40 <crashanddie> package still not built :(
Aug 22 00:51:54 <crashanddie> me wonders if he did it correctly...
Aug 22 00:52:39 * crashanddie blames GeneralAntilles 
Aug 22 00:56:54 <tank-man> "Was it advertise on the box" <-- sounds like an apple user ;)
Aug 22 00:57:01 <tank-man> j/k
Aug 22 01:06:45 <moontiger> thnx GAN800 :)
Aug 22 01:06:55 <moontiger> GeneralAntilles, i thought you were talking about me there :|
Aug 22 02:13:24 <AFBN810> what would cause invalid package error?
Aug 22 02:13:53 <AFBN810> Trying to install usb control
Aug 22 02:15:56 <AFBN810> Any idea?
**** ENDING LOGGING AT Fri Aug 22 02:59:56 2008