**** BEGIN LOGGING AT Tue Nov 04 02:59:57 2008 Nov 04 03:43:24 GeneralAntilles: skype supports video just fine on my n800 Nov 04 03:43:58 Um, since when? Nov 04 03:50:45 night Nov 04 04:33:44 videochat works on skype? Nov 04 04:33:51 I been trying to find some way to videochat with a friend Nov 04 04:35:51 No. Nov 04 04:35:57 Gizmo. Nov 04 04:36:26 Is the battery life lower, if i boot from SD? Nov 04 04:36:42 im wondering if that might be causing my low battery life Nov 04 05:08:21 ok, who stole my n810 Nov 04 05:08:37 serves me right for not doing anything with it Nov 04 05:08:49 :( Nov 04 05:29:14 what ? Nov 04 07:00:21 hi ! Nov 04 07:00:39 is there a way to detect why an app isn t launch by menu ? Nov 04 07:01:19 maybe an error in .desktop Nov 04 07:01:28 or service file Nov 04 07:01:36 but i don t see it Nov 04 07:02:35 and don t see anything interesting with dbus-monitor Nov 04 07:16:03 moo all Nov 04 07:54:34 Hi ! Nov 04 07:55:04 maybe someone can explain me how an app is launch by the menu Nov 04 07:55:12 ? Nov 04 07:56:22 as i do thing the same as every other app but it doesn t seems to work Nov 04 07:56:53 2hours to make application Nov 04 07:57:16 2day to tweak desktop file Nov 04 07:59:26 * Khertan_n810 is tired ... bye Nov 04 08:12:34 * Stskeeps yawns Nov 04 08:22:29 hi, everybody. Nov 04 08:24:02 I met error "libtool: link: cannot find the library `/usr/lib/libSDL.la'" after install SDL-ttf and SDL-net. Nov 04 08:24:55 autogen.sh and configure is ended successful, but make errors Nov 04 08:25:43 there's not libSDL.la in that directory. Nov 04 08:25:52 then you need to install libsdl :P Nov 04 08:26:36 But the game program runs well before I try to add ttf font in it. Nov 04 08:27:33 mmkay Nov 04 08:28:24 Do I need to install libsdl again? Nov 04 08:28:29 possibly Nov 04 08:30:52 libsdl1.2-dev is already the newest version. Nov 04 08:31:26 libsdl1.2 is already the newest version. Nov 04 08:32:45 k Nov 04 08:33:59 I installed libSDL_ttf and libSDL_net, and there're .la files for them. But ther're not .la files for libSDL, libSDL_mixer and libSDL_image, which are installed by default. Nov 04 08:34:55 how can I generate the .la files ? Nov 04 08:36:52 When I make my program before I add some ttf support in it, no error found Nov 04 08:49:16 johnx: heh, the new batch of people trying ubuntu ended with same conclusion as we did about it, even though it seems complete, not all packages are there Nov 04 09:17:30 Morning, all Nov 04 09:18:02 Hi.. Nov 04 09:24:23 morning Jaffa Nov 04 10:04:56 Morning all ! Nov 04 10:05:32 someone can explain me how the application menu launch an application ? Nov 04 10:05:47 as i ve done thing like my other app Nov 04 10:06:10 but i'm not able to make mTasks be launched by the application menu Nov 04 10:06:22 if i understand it use dbus to launch an app Nov 04 10:06:28 reading the .desktop file Nov 04 10:06:45 and executing something like : dbus-launch /usr/bin/mtasks Nov 04 10:07:24 where the bin path is the one which is specified in the .desktop or .service file ... Nov 04 10:11:40 dbus-launch has actually nothing to do with this Nov 04 10:11:47 ah .... Nov 04 10:12:00 and how maemo menu launch an app ? Nov 04 10:12:11 But if there is X-Osso-Service -field in the .desktop file, then it tries to send a message to the service Nov 04 10:12:16 ok Nov 04 10:12:35 And D-Bus daemon starts up the service, if not running and a .service file is present for the service Nov 04 10:13:25 hum ... Nov 04 10:13:38 and dbus try to launch it how ? Nov 04 10:13:50 can i reproduce the thing under xterm ? Nov 04 10:18:35 hi Nov 04 10:19:26 when i try to connect to an wpa2 peap network it says "authentification failed" is there something to get a more verbose error mesage Nov 04 10:19:29 Khertan, I 'spose the daemon just reads the exec path from the .service file, does fork()/exec() and waits for the program to register the service name Nov 04 10:20:46 DanielW: eduoram or the likes? Nov 04 10:20:54 eduroam, i mean Nov 04 10:21:18 straind`: yes a similar network in my university Nov 04 10:21:26 Stskeeps: Nov 04 10:21:37 http://www.valeriovalerio.org/?p=182 might be a direction then Nov 04 10:21:39 DanielW: http://www.valeriovalerio.org/?p=182 Nov 04 10:21:41 Ah ;) Nov 04 10:22:13 (jaiku subscriptions do come in handy occasionally :P) Nov 04 10:22:15 ok thanks. already googled but didn't find anything helpful Nov 04 10:26:27 Does anyone know what this means: libtool: link: cannot find the library `/usr/lib/libSDL.la' Nov 04 10:26:57 What is .la files? Nov 04 10:28:14 Stskeeps and X-Fade, thank you, got it to work :-) Nov 04 10:29:45 DanielW: That is great news ;) Nov 04 10:29:54 DanielW: ta - i might try that at my uni's eduroam too then Nov 04 10:30:44 inz: strange ... i still don't understand why my prog isn't launch by menu and work well launching it manually Nov 04 10:31:00 inz: thx for your help Nov 04 10:31:07 morning Nov 04 10:31:26 Khertan, does your program register the d-bus service name (in time)? Nov 04 10:31:43 it should :) Nov 04 10:36:56 How can I get libSDL.la file? Nov 04 10:37:45 GeneralAntilles: Ping? Nov 04 10:41:37 camel_liu: why are you statically linking? Nov 04 10:42:23 What should I do? I just try following a sample. Nov 04 10:43:21 How can I control the link type? Nov 04 10:46:18 I'm a freshman in maemo Nov 04 10:51:57 reMOO Nov 04 10:52:02 camel_liu: usually you have to explicitly ask to be statically linked Nov 04 10:52:18 just do -lSDL in your flags and see what happens Nov 04 10:53:53 ok, let me try Nov 04 10:54:52 hmm, any good wiki editors for maemo? editing maemo.org wiki is a nightmare on a n800 Nov 04 10:59:55 hi.... how can i disable serial console and usb-host-mode... i think it is drain my battery... Nov 04 11:01:07 lardman, Could you help me see the configure.ac file? http://pastebin.ca/1244730 Nov 04 11:01:22 usb-host-mode can be switched on and off using a settings applet (available from Extras) Nov 04 11:01:29 but it is off by default Nov 04 11:01:32 that sounds kinda unreasonable. well, usb host with device attached without poweredusb hub obviously.. Nov 04 11:01:45 I don't know what lead the error. Nov 04 11:03:00 camel_liu: looks like that should be ok Nov 04 11:03:46 or are you getting an error when you run configure? Nov 04 11:04:54 neither autogen.sh nor configure Nov 04 11:05:05 echo $? returns 0 Nov 04 11:06:39 camel_liu: well just try to compile it, it looks like it looks for the SDL libs and will link against them dynamically Nov 04 11:09:30 but make returns error: http://pastebin.ca/1244734 Nov 04 11:10:44 ah, I see what you mean now Nov 04 11:11:09 ? Nov 04 11:11:10 do you have libSDL.so.x.x.x somewhere? Nov 04 11:12:48 yes, I have libSDL-1.2.so.0.7.1 and libSDL-1.2.so.0 Nov 04 11:13:12 in target's /usr/lib/ Nov 04 11:13:40 ok, you either need to change the name it's trying to link against, or symlink that file to the expected name Nov 04 11:13:45 I don't know what the usual way is Nov 04 11:14:00 first Nov 04 11:14:05 libSDL-1.2.so.0 will be linked by -lSDL-1.2 Nov 04 11:14:08 symlinking is a hack Nov 04 11:14:22 RST38h: and do you know , how can i disable serial console? i am looking google, but i can't find anything... Nov 04 11:14:25 actually, symlinking to libSDL.so is ok Nov 04 11:14:26 unless it's part of the SDL install procedure, I don't know Nov 04 11:14:47 joueur: I did not even know Maemo had a serial console Nov 04 11:15:19 RST38h, symlinking to libSDL.so, how? Nov 04 11:15:43 cd /usr/lib; ln -s libSDL-1.2.so.0 libSDL.so.0 Nov 04 11:17:15 RST38h: http://maemo.org/community/wiki/Flasher_tool_usage/ .... but i don't know how can i that set to disable... Nov 04 11:17:26 why this error happen to my program? I tried other programms using libSDL, making them did not launch any error Nov 04 11:18:15 camel_liu: there may be an SDL pkg file which should be used and this one doesn't? Nov 04 11:18:47 perhaps look at the configure.ac files for the ones which compile correctly? Nov 04 11:19:05 can I remove libSDL, and then install it again? Nov 04 11:19:25 you can, but it won't make any odds I wouldn't think Nov 04 11:19:25 Can this way correct the problem? Nov 04 11:19:43 apparently not, as other code has compiled ok with it installed.... Nov 04 11:21:25 lardman, I paste a configure.ac which can make correctly, please have a look: http://pastebin.ca/1244742 Nov 04 11:21:52 I cannot find any differences between it and mine. Nov 04 11:22:27 what do these give you?: sdl-config --cflags and sdl-config --libs Nov 04 11:24:24 I also have these in my configure.ac. Nov 04 11:24:37 what values do they return when you run them on the command line? Nov 04 11:25:35 [sbox-DIABLO_X86: ~/spot5] > sdl-config --cflags Nov 04 11:25:36 -I/usr/include/SDL -D_REENTRANT Nov 04 11:25:54 [sbox-DIABLO_X86: ~/spot5] > sdl-config --libs Nov 04 11:25:55 -L/usr/lib -lSDL -lpthread Nov 04 11:26:06 hmm Nov 04 11:26:12 so it's got the wrong name Nov 04 11:26:18 odd Nov 04 11:26:54 no idea, unless the other code you're talking about doesn't actually link against libSDL itself? Nov 04 11:26:54 what correct name should be? Nov 04 11:27:05 well the file has a different name to that the linker wants Nov 04 11:27:26 http://electoral-vote.com/ Hohohoho! Nov 04 11:27:28 i.e. libSDL-1.2.x.x.x vs -lSDL (aka libSDL.so.x.x.x) Nov 04 11:28:08 It is a wonder how much the crisis shrunk Dumbfuckistan's boundaries. Nov 04 11:28:52 is that a running count? Nov 04 11:28:58 I have libSDL.so, libSDL-1.2.so.0 and libSDL-1.2.so.0.7.1. How can I fix this problem? Nov 04 11:29:15 is libSDL.so a symlink that you just created? Nov 04 11:29:55 I do not know how to create a symlink. Nov 04 11:30:32 camel_liu: I told you a few lines back Nov 04 11:30:35 ln -s Nov 04 11:30:51 anyway, it ought to compile now Nov 04 11:31:18 this one?  cd /usr/lib; ln -s libSDL-1.2.so.0 libSDL.so.0 Nov 04 11:31:43 Could you kindly tell me what does this mean? Nov 04 11:31:52 yes that one Nov 04 11:31:56 cd changes directory Nov 04 11:32:06 I know cd Nov 04 11:32:06 ln -s creates a symlink from the first file to the second Nov 04 11:32:20 did you run that command? Nov 04 11:32:25 May I suggest getting a reading a beginner's guide to Unix? Nov 04 11:33:03 but I do not have the file: libSDL.so.0 Nov 04 11:33:06 Because explaining what "ln -s" is may be somewhat ridiculous Nov 04 11:36:21 camel_liu: you appear to have a libSDL.so so the Makefile should now work Nov 04 11:37:16 I run ls -s, but make is still error Nov 04 11:37:25 ln -s not ls -s Nov 04 11:37:38 yes, ln -s libSDL-1.2.so.0 libSDL.so.0 Nov 04 11:37:48 ok, what's the error now? Nov 04 11:37:49 same one? Nov 04 11:37:57 yes, same Nov 04 11:38:10 does the linker link to .so.X or does it require .so alone - anyone else? Nov 04 11:39:05 I think ld only uses .so; the .so.X files are used when running stuff, not when linking Nov 04 11:39:15 ok, thanks Nov 04 11:39:32 there's not the second file : libSDL.so.0 Nov 04 11:39:37 camel_liu: you need to create another symlink then: ln -s libSDL.so.0 libSDL.so Nov 04 11:40:24 [sbox-DIABLO_X86: /usr/lib] > ln -s libSDL.so.0 libSDL.so Nov 04 11:40:25 ln: `libSDL.so': File exists Nov 04 11:40:39 odd Nov 04 11:40:40 ? Nov 04 11:40:52 apparently someone else (like the deb) created it for you Nov 04 11:41:14 what does "ls -rtl libSDL.so" give you? Nov 04 11:41:29 I manually install SDL_ttf and SDL_net. Nov 04 11:41:52 hello everybody. i am looking for someone who is familiar with maemo mapper's database backend. can anybody please help me? Nov 04 11:41:57 libSDL.so -> libSDL-1.2.so.0.7.1 Nov 04 11:42:09 does libSDL-1.2.so.0.7.1 exist? Nov 04 11:42:48 yes Nov 04 11:43:04 ok, in that case the error must be for a different lib Nov 04 11:43:36 or is it still asking for libSDL.la? Nov 04 11:43:59 libtool: link: cannot find the library `/usr/lib/libSDL.la' Nov 04 11:44:23 I'm out of ideas, sorry Nov 04 11:45:41 Thanks a lot anyway Nov 04 11:45:58 sorry we didn't achieve anything, perhaps someone else will have an ideas Nov 04 12:03:28 lardman, When delete SDL_ttf and SDL_net from configure.ac and my sources, make can ended without error Nov 04 12:03:59 Could you explain this? Nov 04 12:07:11 lardman? Nov 04 12:21:27 no, not really :) Nov 04 12:22:08 some wonder of linkers and libraries Nov 04 12:22:14 anyone else have an idea? Nov 04 12:22:27 SDL ttf and net have .la files in /usr/lib Nov 04 12:24:11 and .so files too? Nov 04 12:25:55 yes Nov 04 12:27:28 strange, I wonder if it will work if you remove/rename the .a files Nov 04 12:27:50 and put back the SDL_* stuff you removed from the configure.ac file Nov 04 12:28:10 There're libSDL_ttf.la, libSDL_ttf.so, libSDL_ttf-2.0.so.0 and libSDL_ttf-2.0.so.0.6.3 Nov 04 12:28:43 and libSDL_ttf.a Nov 04 12:28:52 rename libSDL_ttf.a? Nov 04 12:29:32 yeah, rename the .la files, tack .old or something on the end Nov 04 12:29:46 and rename the .a file too Nov 04 12:29:54 in fact only one of those should have been installed Nov 04 12:31:25 did you install libsdlttf from source or from a .deb? Nov 04 12:32:54 no, I use:fakeroot apt-get install libsdl-ttf2.0-dev Nov 04 12:33:27 and fakeroot apt-get install libsdl_ttf2.0-0 Nov 04 12:33:47 Do they collide? Nov 04 12:34:03 doesn't matter, apt-get will sort that out Nov 04 12:35:05 that seems right. Nov 04 12:35:55 Done! make without error! Nov 04 12:36:01 good good Nov 04 12:36:15 just rename .a and .la Nov 04 12:36:50 lardman, could you tell me something under the renaming? Nov 04 12:37:02 sure Nov 04 12:37:35 what do you want to know? Nov 04 12:38:35 just a moment, the program failed to run Nov 04 12:38:46 Fatal signal: Segmentation Fault (SDL Parachute Deployed) Nov 04 12:38:47 Segmentation fault (core dumped) Nov 04 12:39:06 well that's probably nothing to do with the build process Nov 04 12:47:18 lardman, have any other idea? Nov 04 12:48:57 you'll need to look at the source probably and see what's caused it to fail Nov 04 12:50:49 this is not relation to the build process? just regarding source code? Nov 04 13:07:45 I don't think so, though using a different version of SDL might get rid of the problem if it's an SDL bug Nov 04 13:07:48 How can I use a relative font path instead of absolute one like this: /usr/share/fonts/truetype/ttf-bitstream-vera/Vera.ttf in X86 target? Nov 04 13:07:59 no idea from me Nov 04 13:10:04 have a good lunch. It does work. After lunch, please give some knowledge about renaming .a and .la. Nov 04 13:24:31 where is the zImage of the kernel running in N810? Nov 04 13:24:50 where on the tablet or on the internet? Nov 04 13:26:12 tablet Nov 04 13:26:24 it's on a partition of the NAND Nov 04 13:26:33 I don't remember which one though Nov 04 13:26:50 /dev/mtdblockN where N is 1-4 Nov 04 13:27:30 only 4 is mounted now .. Nov 04 13:27:37 I mean mtdblock4 Nov 04 13:27:47 well, then that's the rootfs :) Nov 04 13:27:56 initfs is one of the others Nov 04 13:31:23 hmm I think the internet source is better Nov 04 13:31:36 ~flashing Nov 04 13:31:37 rumour has it, flashing is http://wiki.maemo.org/Updating_the_tablet_firmware Nov 04 13:32:05 it's part of the downloadable .bin file Nov 04 13:32:20 you can use the linux flasher to separate out the zImage Nov 04 13:34:09 X-Fade, pong. Nov 04 13:34:23 flasher -u? Nov 04 13:36:45 ~flasher Nov 04 13:36:46 methinks flasher is http://wiki.maemo.org/Flasher Nov 04 13:37:07 LoCusF, flasher-3.0 -F --flash-only=kernel -f -R Nov 04 13:37:50 LoCusF, yeah, I guess flasher -u looks right Nov 04 13:38:07 yep Nov 04 13:38:12 it just won't boot in qemu Nov 04 13:38:20 GeneralAntilles: old wiki is dead and redirects are in place. Nov 04 13:39:46 Woo Nov 04 13:39:50 Thanks, X-Fade! :) Nov 04 13:42:30 X-Fade, http://maemo.org/community/wiki/howto_flashlatestnokiaimagewithlinux/ are both redirecting to http://wiki.maemo.org/Main_Page Nov 04 13:42:39 hola Nov 04 13:42:55 GeneralAntilles: Yes, because you put the lowercase urls in the wiki.. Nov 04 13:43:10 GeneralAntilles: Which they weren't ;) Nov 04 13:43:21 Oh Nov 04 13:43:24 GeneralAntilles: So I had to manually look them up to fix :) Nov 04 13:43:31 Ah Nov 04 13:44:38 IIRC only the first 3 links were affected? Nov 04 13:45:02 Seems to be just the flashing pages. Nov 04 13:45:21 Yeah, I think they were imported from mediawiki to midgard ;) Nov 04 13:46:00 * GeneralAntilles is groggy and confused. Nov 04 13:46:42 !coffee GeneralAntilles Nov 04 13:47:07 Tea for me, thanks. Nov 04 13:47:18 ah, works for me :) Nov 04 13:47:21 !tea GeneralAntilles Nov 04 13:47:22 ;) Nov 04 13:55:06 X-Fade, OK, do you want to complete http://wiki.maemo.org/Task:Package_categories ? Nov 04 13:55:45 Hi Nov 04 13:55:57 GeneralAntilles: I'm thinking of publishing about the proposal for policy change and then close phase 1 of this task. Nov 04 13:56:19 And after that split the rest off to Fremantle categories? Nov 04 13:56:19 GeneralAntilles, X-Fade: Did redirects get done for the pages in http://wiki.maemo.org/Task:Kill_the_old_wiki#Category:Midgard_wiki ? Nov 04 13:56:28 We'll pick up http://wiki.maemo.org/Task:Packaging_policy_proposed_changes for the next Sprint Nov 04 13:56:34 dneary, click some. :D Nov 04 13:56:36 Currently they're all going to [[Main Page]] Nov 04 13:56:41 For me, anyway Nov 04 13:56:51 dneary: didn't touch those. Nov 04 13:57:04 Similar for http://maemo.org/community/wiki/howto_flashlatestnokiaimagewithlinux/ and http://maemo.org/community/wiki/howto_flashlatestnokiaimagewithmacosx/ Nov 04 13:57:30 Ah, yeah, that list was supposed to get redirects too. Nov 04 13:57:33 Just wondering whether it was a local issue, a bug or some un-added redirects Nov 04 13:57:49 dneary: please read scroll back ;) Nov 04 13:58:03 X-Fade: So now I know - not a bug :) Nov 04 13:58:29 X-Fade, anyway, yeah, the task for the October sprint is done, methinks. Nov 04 14:03:32 dneary, why'd you switch the PAN link to an OS2006 page? Nov 04 14:03:59 I switched it to the generic Bluetooth page Nov 04 14:04:04 Which is where PAN should be Nov 04 14:04:32 Then somebody needs to update Bluetooth networking first. Nov 04 14:04:48 Because, currently, it's useless to anybody using recent software. Nov 04 14:06:07 Yes, I would agree Nov 04 14:07:05 What does PAN mean? Nov 04 14:07:24 private area network? Nov 04 14:07:31 Yes, I know, it's a blind acronym to users Nov 04 14:07:34 Personal Area Network Nov 04 14:07:42 It's adhoc with Bluetooth, more or less. Nov 04 14:08:05 I'd rather turn the Bluetooth networking page into an index page that points to Bluetooth DUN or PAN Nov 04 14:08:20 Since having it all on one page is a bit overwhelming. Nov 04 14:08:57 DUN or PAN don't mean anything to most people Nov 04 14:09:00 Networking does Nov 04 14:09:39 Bluetooth networking can be used for x, y, and z. There are several methods for networking. Nov 04 14:09:54 Bluetooth DUN can is a and can be used for x and y Nov 04 14:10:01 Bluetooth PAN is b and can be used for z Nov 04 14:10:04 With links to the main articles. Nov 04 14:11:27 GeneralAntilles: added some polish to the page, - thanks for the work done so far Nov 04 14:11:34 Sure thing Nov 04 14:11:58 complaint: modest won't let me change my IMAP server hostname Nov 04 14:12:07 like, WTF? Nov 04 14:13:15 GeneralAntilles: think i'll comb through it tonight and then shake the beehive a bit about it Nov 04 14:13:29 I'm gonna make a second run-through Nov 04 14:13:41 I'm not really satisfied with the boot-process description. Nov 04 14:14:04 k Nov 04 14:14:35 mgedmin, wow....I must admit I didn't even believe you until I checked it myself Nov 04 14:15:52 * Stskeeps switched to claws Nov 04 14:16:03 really? what pushed you over? Nov 04 14:17:46 modest locking up, not retrieving mails, etc Nov 04 14:18:38 ah, right. I guess I do remember you talking about that. Nov 04 14:20:34 GeneralAntilles: I'm trying to refactor this article, but to be honest, I find it very confusing Nov 04 14:20:52 dneary, that's why I just skipped it and went with the individual articles. Nov 04 14:21:19 Individual articles that don't have titles which are relevant to most people Nov 04 14:21:38 Bluetooth networking is . . . DUN is . . . (link to Bluetooth DUN) PAN is . . . (link to PAN) Nov 04 14:21:43 * mgedmin is surprised not to find a bug about it Nov 04 14:21:52 That's why you turn the Bluetooth networking page into a page like Bluetooth Nov 04 14:21:59 * mgedmin thinks the sourceforge-inspired user interface at garage.maemo.org sucks big time Nov 04 14:22:01 Then they land there, figure out what they actually need and go to it. Nov 04 14:22:20 mgedmin, why are you using Garage? Nov 04 14:22:23 Not for Modest, I hope. Nov 04 14:22:27 * mgedmin blinks Nov 04 14:22:30 As its bugs are tracked in Bugzilla. Nov 04 14:22:35 NOOOOOOOOOO Nov 04 14:22:38 *headdesk* Nov 04 14:22:49 so I go to modest.garage.maemo.org, which is the project page, right? Nov 04 14:22:55 I search for a 'bug tracker' under development Nov 04 14:23:00 all I find is a 'garage project page' Nov 04 14:23:06 Ah, well. Nov 04 14:23:07 I go there, I find a working bug tracker Nov 04 14:23:08 I submit a bug Nov 04 14:23:25 Bug sergio about that. Nov 04 14:23:29 which of the steps should've pointed me to bugzilla? Nov 04 14:23:41 hm Nov 04 14:23:42 Well, it's bundled software Nov 04 14:23:51 and bundled software is either 3rd-party or tracked in Bugzilla. Nov 04 14:24:03 maybe I should've though "I want to submit a bug about OS2008" instead of "I want to submit a bug about Modest" Nov 04 14:24:09 a little knowledge is a dangerous thing :/ Nov 04 14:39:59 * GeneralAntilles starts working on the package categories PSA. Nov 04 14:43:12 GeneralAntilles: PSA? Nov 04 14:43:23 Hehe, apparently that "report abuse" button doesn't lead to a form. Nov 04 14:43:32 X-Fade, ignore the abuse I reported on myself if you see it. :P Nov 04 14:43:37 Public Service Announcement Nov 04 14:44:07 Tell everybody about the new categories and about how the transition will work. Nov 04 14:44:13 GeneralAntilles: Ah, I was typing up something too. Let's spam them ;) Nov 04 14:44:22 Btw, check your karma. Nov 04 14:44:47 Hi Nov 04 14:44:56 Hehe Nov 04 14:45:12 hi tekojo. Nov 04 14:45:13 lol Nov 04 14:45:26 hi ! Nov 04 14:45:28 * GeneralAntilles claims the title "Package categories and you" Nov 04 14:45:33 As there seems to be a lot of people around, I'd like to share some details on the weekend break Nov 04 14:45:44 Just talked to the ISP Nov 04 14:46:14 And the servers should be up all night (EEST), so the US people should expect a fairly normal weekend Nov 04 14:46:30 Europe can take a weekend off Nov 04 14:47:11 I'll and comments to the announcement Nov 04 14:48:01 tekojo: Will you be able to make the meeting? Or at least a part of it? Nov 04 14:48:40 It will probably be from 22:00 until 00:00 EEST. Nov 04 14:48:44 X-Fade: Sorry no, iaido training always Saturday 18-20 UTC Nov 04 14:49:07 And I can't join in the car :-) Nov 04 14:49:19 Saturday? Nov 04 14:49:26 Might make it around 22:45 EEST Nov 04 14:49:26 Meeting is today ;) Nov 04 14:49:46 GA: what's saturday? Nov 04 14:49:56 Iaido training, apparently. Nov 04 14:50:26 Yes, Saturday too, but that's earlier and I rarely make it on Saturday (family) Nov 04 14:50:43 So, s/Saturday/Tuesday/ ? Nov 04 14:51:29 But anyway, I'll try to make it around 20:45 UTC to the meeting Nov 04 14:52:03 tekojo: Ok, great. Nov 04 14:52:19 GA: how did you guess the Saturday? Nov 04 14:52:31 [9:48am] X-Fade: Sorry no, iaido training always Saturday 18-20 UTC Nov 04 14:52:44 Mind reading :) Nov 04 14:53:00 Alternative answer: I've installed a GPS tracker in the back of your skull. :P Nov 04 14:53:06 Oops :-D Nov 04 14:53:25 Or you know the dojo site address :-) Nov 04 14:54:17 X-Fade, I guess it would be better to stagger the posting of these announcements so we stay on the front page of Planet for as long as possible. Nov 04 14:55:04 tekojo: Probably one of those? http://www.iaido.fi/Iaido/clubs.html :) Nov 04 14:55:52 GeneralAntilles: Sure. If you talk about the categories and AM then I will talk about changing the policy. Nov 04 14:56:06 X-Fade: no, for weird reasons relating to the Japanese loving federations, I practise under the finnish kendo federation Nov 04 14:56:33 tekojo: Ah, well it was just a google guess for me ;) Nov 04 14:57:24 tekojo: Other guess dojo from Jose Martinez? Nov 04 14:57:31 X-Fade: but we do talk to the iaido federation people (and they do good iaido too) Nov 04 14:58:46 X-Fade: getting closer :-) But I don't think Jose can be considered to be associated to only one dojo, he's the highest ranking iaidoka in Finland Nov 04 14:58:58 hello! I have a question on compiling gstreamer for arm target...the config file returns a strange error, can anyone help me? Nov 04 14:59:12 tekojo: Pretty funny what google can do in terms of social engineering ;) Nov 04 15:00:21 X-Fade: yep, it's a funny tool Nov 04 15:00:57 But I need to cycle home. Bye! Nov 04 15:00:58 tekojo: You were in Poule 1 of the European championships? :) Nov 04 15:01:42 X-Fade: Yes, and l lost my second round match due to a stupid technical mistake, would have otherwise been fourth Nov 04 15:01:52 tekojo: Nice! Nov 04 15:02:16 X-Fade: well, it's a marginal art :-) Nov 04 15:02:34 But now I really need to go, bye! Nov 04 15:03:02 Fins and marshall arts :) Nov 04 15:03:05 http://www.flickr.com/photos/bergie/2998952960/ Nov 04 15:03:10 Hehe Nov 04 15:03:33 So you're saying we shouldn't pick a fight with them at the next Summit? ;) Nov 04 15:03:42 Probably not ;) Nov 04 15:05:03 is anyone able to give me some pointers?:D Nov 04 15:05:46 mimshita: pastebin the error and we'll see Nov 04 15:08:49 ./configure Nov 04 15:08:49 checking nano version... 0 (release) Nov 04 15:08:49 checking build system type... arm-unknown-linux-gnu Nov 04 15:08:49 checking host system type... arm-unknown-linux-gnu Nov 04 15:08:49 checking for a BSD-compatible install... /scratchbox/tools/bin/install -c Nov 04 15:08:50 checking whether build environment is sane... yes Nov 04 15:08:52 checking for gawk... gawk Nov 04 15:08:54 checking whether make sets $(MAKE)... yes Nov 04 15:08:56 checking whether to enable maintainer-specific portions of Makefiles... no Nov 04 15:08:58 checking for style of include used by make... GNU Nov 04 15:09:00 checking for gcc... gcc Nov 04 15:09:02 checking for C compiler default output file name... a.out Nov 04 15:09:04 !paste Nov 04 15:09:04 checking whether the C compiler works... configure: error: cannot run C compiled programs. Nov 04 15:09:06 If you meant to cross compile, use `--host'. Nov 04 15:09:07 ~paste Nov 04 15:09:08 See `config.log' for more details. Nov 04 15:09:08 from memory, paste is http://rafb.net/paste/, or see also pb Nov 04 15:10:10 or Nov 04 15:10:13 ~pastebin Nov 04 15:10:14 [~pastebin] A "pastebin" is a web-based service where you can paste anything over 3 lines without flooding the channel. Here are links to a few : http://www.pastebin.com , http://pastebin.ca , http://channels.debian.net/paste , http://paste.lisp.org , http://www.rafb.net/paste Nov 04 15:11:22 http://rafb.net/p/wCO3aP99.html Nov 04 15:11:56 sorry guys, didn't know, it has been a long time since I use IRC:S Nov 04 15:13:52 probably just a configure script error/assumption Nov 04 15:14:01 ehlo all Nov 04 15:14:08 look at the test which is performed to see if the conpiler works Nov 04 15:14:16 hi RST38h Nov 04 15:14:47 moo, lardman Nov 04 15:15:39 mimshita: what CFLAGS are you trying to use btw? Nov 04 15:16:10 lardman:not using any flags:P Nov 04 15:17:27 lardman: but I should use these: '--prefix=/usr --disable-gst-debug --disable-static' the catch is i do not know where to sick them Nov 04 15:17:36 ok, just that if you try to use the arm1136 mcpu flags, qemu can't run the resulting code Nov 04 15:17:46 ah Nov 04 15:17:52 well do something like this: Nov 04 15:18:03 CFLAGS="your flags here" ./configure Nov 04 15:18:12 actually Nov 04 15:18:16 no they are configure flags Nov 04 15:18:20 pass them after configure Nov 04 15:18:25 ok, I'll try that Nov 04 15:18:27 * lardman is half asleep Nov 04 15:18:56 nothin new there :P Nov 04 15:19:19 yeah, bacon sarnie would sort it out ;) Nov 04 15:19:50 yeah, i was tempted today to ask for bacon topping at pizzahut Nov 04 15:20:13 lol Nov 04 15:20:20 landman Nov 04 15:20:21 how was Bond, am going this evening Nov 04 15:20:43 lcuk2: +? Nov 04 15:20:52 lardman: still not working but it gives a different error now http://rafb.net/p/pm1YOR23.html Nov 04 15:21:02 lardman, bond was amazing Nov 04 15:21:11 but make sure you get there early so you get decent seats Nov 04 15:21:17 if you are too close you will get neck ache Nov 04 15:21:20 we've booked Nov 04 15:21:39 i booked as well, but not specific seats or vip box or anything Nov 04 15:21:42 mimshita: again, see what the test is in configure Nov 04 15:22:00 mimshita: presuming that the toolchain does actually work for a basic hello world? Nov 04 15:22:05 we were near the front, its a movie where they use the full scene Nov 04 15:22:27 very expansive - we were so close it was more like imax Nov 04 15:22:36 http://maemo.org/community/council/view/1225812124/ Nov 04 15:22:37 lcuk2: ah ok, our cinema does specific seats so that should be ok; hopefully quieter too now it's in the week Nov 04 15:22:57 yeah should be - i think they had it on about 10 screens at weekend Nov 04 15:23:03 i couldnt wait to see it though Nov 04 15:23:05 GeneralAntilles: cool Nov 04 15:23:11 You guys book specific seats over there? Nov 04 15:23:12 Bizarre Nov 04 15:23:23 lcuk2: I watched the first one yesterday as the next is supposed to follow on Nov 04 15:23:32 GeneralAntilles: depends on the cinema Nov 04 15:23:38 GeneralAntilles: Sure we do, just like an airplane ;) Nov 04 15:23:41 GeneralAntilles: but yes nowadays Nov 04 15:23:51 GeneralAntilles, i couldv booked a VIP box - they have perfect view, big comfy chairs isle service and away from the riff raff Nov 04 15:24:06 http://www.vat19.com/blog/movie%20theater%20stadium%20seating%20loner.jpg <- open seating Nov 04 15:24:09 X-Fade: you obviously go higher class than I do (Easy-scrummage-for-a-seat-jet) Nov 04 15:24:27 X-Fade: no beer in the cinemas over here though :( Nov 04 15:24:37 lardman! yuou get seats , i have to STAND on the wing Nov 04 15:24:48 lardman, im surei n the vip boxes you can Nov 04 15:24:49 lardman: everything other than easjet and ryan air then... ;) Nov 04 15:25:44 bbl Nov 04 15:28:02 hi, does someone know why a gui application looks according to the maemo theme when launched from the eclipse, but gives an osso_initialize() failed when launched from the console in scratchbox Nov 04 15:28:03 ? Nov 04 15:28:22 it still works from the console but with a ugly default theme, not the maemo one Nov 04 15:28:38 lardman: What are Delux screenings? Nov 04 15:28:38 Prices includes comfy chairs (lots of leg room, arm rests lift up, reclining seats) and bar service (normal age restrictions apply). Reserved seating. This is only available at selected Cineworld Cinemas Nov 04 15:28:41 cya later Nov 04 15:29:12 lcuk2: not at my local (don't have to drive to it) one unfortunately Nov 04 15:29:20 lardman: http://rafb.net/p/ohGXsu57.html Nov 04 15:29:31 lardman: config.log result Nov 04 15:30:09 lines 3 and 4 are your answer Nov 04 15:30:54 you didn't pass them in CFLAGS did you? Nov 04 15:37:31 lardman: no i didn't the flags i passed where: '--prefix=/usr --disable-gst-debug --disable-static' Nov 04 15:37:58 I followed this howto http://www.linuxrising.org/gstreamer-maemo-howto.html Nov 04 15:38:47 lardman: I compiled the hello.c and hello.cc from the packages/ dir, and they compiled well Nov 04 15:39:17 cool Nov 04 15:39:35 let me have a quick look at that doc Nov 04 15:39:44 lardman: the problem comes when i tryed to run them, it returned an error: "mmap: Permission denied" Nov 04 15:40:00 mimshita, using intrepid ibex by any chance? Nov 04 15:40:09 so what are you building atm? liboil? Nov 04 15:40:25 the --disable-gst-debug --disable-static is only for the gstreamer packages Nov 04 15:40:53 liboil Nov 04 15:41:21 qwerty12: yup... a bad choice I presume... Nov 04 15:42:03 mimshita: remove the gstreamer related bits for that build Nov 04 15:42:43 e.g. "./configure --prefix=/usr" is enough for liboil Nov 04 15:43:09 mimshita, reduced the mmap value? Heh, add "vm.mmap_min_addr = 4096" to /etc/sysctl.conf (outside scratchbox) and run "sudo sysctl -p" (outside scratchbox) Nov 04 15:43:42 lardman and qwerty12: ok, thanks! Nov 04 15:44:26 I have to keep running sudo sysctl -p everytime I reboot so it reads that setting. In hardy, sysctl.conf was read automatically at boot :( Nov 04 15:46:07 dam...I gess the whole problem has to do with mmap... Nov 04 15:46:15 no Nov 04 15:46:33 on config.log configure:3186: ./a.out mmap: Permission denied Nov 04 15:46:43 your last error was to do with passing unsuitable args to configure Nov 04 15:46:52 yeah, that's another error ;) Nov 04 15:46:53 yes:) Nov 04 15:47:19 i'm gonna change sysctl.conf now Nov 04 15:48:43 qwerty12: the sysctl you are refering to is the Intrepid on, rigtht? Nov 04 15:48:58 mimshita, yeah Nov 04 15:49:14 You have to do the same thing for hardy too :/ Nov 04 15:50:22 aleluia!:D Nov 04 15:50:56 Yeah, I keep forgetting to run sysctl until configure spits that message that I can't run compiled programs :P Nov 04 15:51:11 lol, thanks a lot guys! it has been a hell of a week just to make a streamer for N800:P Nov 04 15:52:08 you should be able to apt-get the binary you know? Nov 04 15:52:13 i found info about it on the web, but never clear enought to point: "Oh, this is the problem!" Nov 04 15:54:00 i should...but for some reason I can't Nov 04 15:54:31 probably because i don't have the correct repository in sources.list Nov 04 15:54:50 http://www.google.com/search?ie=utf8&oe=utf8&q=site:repository.maemo.org+nano Nov 04 15:59:40 http://communitizer.blogspot.com/2008/11/packaging-policy-change-proposal.html Nov 04 16:02:00 Hrm, there's no link to a list of Thanks in karma. Nov 04 16:02:20 http://www.internettablettalk.com/forums/post_thanks.php?do=findthanks&u=$USER_ID will work Nov 04 16:02:24 GeneralAntilles: No, because we don't have a search url? Nov 04 16:02:41 Hmm ok, let me try to add that link.. Nov 04 16:03:29 * qwerty12 loves ITT thanks integration *grin* Nov 04 16:04:51 oo, my discussion karma has suddenly jumped from 8 to 34 ;) Nov 04 16:06:26 * GeneralAntilles wishes there were a link to the user list page on some of the karma pages. Nov 04 16:07:37 Maybe change the breadcrumb from maemo.org > Profile to maemo.org > Profile > $USER_NAME with Profile linking to the list. Nov 04 16:12:06 Thanks link added. Nov 04 16:12:19 Now is it ITT? or itT or... Nov 04 16:12:28 Reggie says "itT" Nov 04 16:12:32 ok. Nov 04 16:12:32 Quim says "ITt" Nov 04 16:12:39 I'd go with Reggie's, personally. Nov 04 16:12:59 Nokia prefers capitalizing Internet Tablet, I guess. Nov 04 16:14:35 Links changed, now I need to find out where the headers are specified ;) Nov 04 16:15:05 Ouch ... Nov 04 16:15:19 after 6 months of no move Nov 04 16:15:32 i'm now under murray in karma list Nov 04 16:15:33 huhu Nov 04 16:15:52 Khertan: Blog more ;) Nov 04 16:16:11 héhé Nov 04 16:16:12 yep Nov 04 16:16:21 but if i blog i ll get less karma Nov 04 16:16:32 with burries ... for my poor english ;) Nov 04 16:16:36 Psh Nov 04 16:16:50 now ... i ll make some other stupid widget home applet ... :) Nov 04 16:16:54 :) Nov 04 16:16:57 The group-think only buries off-topic or idiotic crap. :P Nov 04 16:16:58 HomeDoNothing Nov 04 16:17:03 Yeah, spam applications to Extras. Nov 04 16:17:09 That's a sure-fire way to karma whore. Nov 04 16:17:15 yep Nov 04 16:17:17 i see that Nov 04 16:17:23 Khertan's new line of Hildon widget home applets. Nov 04 16:17:32 HomeRadioButton Nov 04 16:17:37 HomeCheckBox Nov 04 16:17:39 HomeOK Nov 04 16:17:40 HomeCancel Nov 04 16:17:41 HomeDontClick Nov 04 16:17:50 HomeBigRedButton Nov 04 16:17:57 That could actually be kinda fun. :P Nov 04 16:18:06 hum ... it s depends Nov 04 16:18:16 can i have my own section for apps manager ? Nov 04 16:18:21 :) Nov 04 16:18:25 user/desktop Nov 04 16:18:30 user/khertan Nov 04 16:18:31 <|rt|> needs a HomeFinalAnswer button Nov 04 16:18:31 ? Nov 04 16:18:32 There you go ;) Nov 04 16:18:33 user/Khertan is so much cooler than you fools Nov 04 16:18:58 HomeFinalAnswer ... what it should do. Nov 04 16:19:00 ? Nov 04 16:19:11 <|rt|> it's like yes to all when you go to delete something Nov 04 16:19:22 Need a War Games button. Nov 04 16:19:25 Hmm I almost drop of the first page. Need to blog more ;) Nov 04 16:19:54 X-fade ... you could also change calc method :) will be faster :) Nov 04 16:20:01 It seems I don't do enough Karm Whoring.. Nov 04 16:20:07 Khertan, do a promotional campaign with Staples and make some money. ;) Nov 04 16:20:13 HomeEasyButton® Nov 04 16:20:15 Staples ? Nov 04 16:20:25 if ($user=='xfade') karma += 10k ;) Nov 04 16:20:28 http://www.staples.com/sbd/cre/marketing/easybutton/index.html Nov 04 16:21:06 ∞ Nov 04 16:21:38 <|rt|> hehe i have one of those buttons...they used to sell them at the store...it says that was easy when you press it....doesn't work like it does in the commercials unfortnatly Nov 04 16:21:48 The tasks are looking a lot better this Sprint. Nov 04 16:21:58 GeneralAntilles: i don't understand what is the purpose of this things Nov 04 16:22:14 <|rt|> Khertan: it was just a marketing gimick Nov 04 16:22:15 GeneralAntilles: color="LightGreen" + DONE :) Nov 04 16:22:57 from what i understand it s hardware shortcut ... Nov 04 16:23:00 huhu stupid marketing Nov 04 16:23:12 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kMPF-XMyN7g Nov 04 16:23:18 Itt thanks 80 Nov 04 16:23:20 hu ? Nov 04 16:23:30 this is really 80 itt thanks ? Nov 04 16:23:47 sqrt(thanks) * 8 Nov 04 16:24:15 sqrt ? Nov 04 16:24:17 strange Nov 04 16:24:35 square root Nov 04 16:24:43 X-Fade, I'd say reducing external repositories is probably done for this sprint. Nov 04 16:24:57 GeneralAntilles: I think it is a long-term task. Nov 04 16:25:01 qwerty12: i understand sqrt ... it s trivial for a dev :) Nov 04 16:25:05 <|rt|> this commercial with the easy button was better http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NojiCsZQSr8 Nov 04 16:25:10 what i found strange is the calc :) Nov 04 16:25:15 Khertan, ah, sorry :) Nov 04 16:25:16 The ball's not really in your court anymore, anyway. Nov 04 16:25:32 Khertan: That is to limit mega karma whoring ;) Nov 04 16:25:51 The GeneralAntilles Solution ;) Nov 04 16:25:52 But still gives a little bit of growth if you get more and more thanks.. Nov 04 16:25:56 X-Fade: i don't make critics ... Nov 04 16:26:31 just never think about how to calc something like that with limitations ... Nov 04 16:27:00 so ... this mean i ve got around 100 Thanks ... on itt Nov 04 16:27:04 ouch ... Nov 04 16:27:05 Why sqrt and not log? =) Nov 04 16:27:10 :) Nov 04 16:27:27 this is high Nov 04 16:27:43 i mean for me :) Nov 04 16:28:05 btw, gentlemen, does it mean that itt karma calc is finally enabled? Nov 04 16:28:14 * GeneralAntilles only gets 300 with 1400 Thanks! :( Nov 04 16:28:16 RST38h, yes. Nov 04 16:28:26 GeneralAntilles: _only_ :) Nov 04 16:28:27 http://maemo.org/profile/view/generalantilles/ Nov 04 16:28:59 Itt thanks 301 Nov 04 16:29:03 nice Nov 04 16:29:13 ohshitmykarmawentup Nov 04 16:29:20 I do not see itt karma though Nov 04 16:29:29 * qwerty12 doesn't mind getting 248 karma for 969 thanks. I need the boost, whatever it is :P Nov 04 16:29:44 no, itt karma is there but now I do not see bug reports karma Nov 04 16:30:01 haha...they removed both from my profile :) Nov 04 16:30:09 RST38h, have you reported any? Nov 04 16:30:11 I guess they don't like the way I vote on bugs :D Nov 04 16:30:11 be back in 5 min ... in the train Nov 04 16:30:16 Yes. Nov 04 16:30:20 Right, email differences, maybe? Nov 04 16:30:20 General: joking? =) Nov 04 16:30:26 RST38h, brain fart. Nov 04 16:30:30 I did a recount for itt karma, but not everything is done yet. Nov 04 16:30:37 general: it was there before Nov 04 16:30:42 So it can be that your bugs karma isn't updated. Nov 04 16:30:55 Ah Nov 04 16:30:57 X-Fade: Can I suggest listing karma components to the right of the total valus in profile/list ? Nov 04 16:30:58 And a recalc wiped old info. Nov 04 16:31:41 I had to get some fast results, so I could show it in the meeting ;) Nov 04 16:31:51 The rest will update over the coming day orso. Nov 04 16:32:25 RST38h: They are there? Nov 04 16:32:55 X-Fade: no, just the total is there Nov 04 16:32:56 RST38h: You can sort on it? Nov 04 16:33:40 yes, it looks like I can sort on it Nov 04 16:36:15 re Nov 04 16:37:32 so category is finalized for package section ? Nov 04 16:37:46 Khertan_n810, yes. Nov 04 16:37:47 or it s still a draft ? Nov 04 16:37:55 great Nov 04 16:37:57 Khertan_n810: Yes, but it not official until packaging policy has changed. Nov 04 16:37:58 Gotta wait for the Application Manager to be updated before you start changing categories, though. Nov 04 16:38:13 yep of course Nov 04 16:38:30 Although it really does't hurt to change now ;) Nov 04 16:38:39 Because it is already a mess. Nov 04 16:38:51 but i think of activated the thing that let you use only official section in py2deb Nov 04 16:39:15 prepare it for the next release Nov 04 16:43:01 rahhhhh sorry for the topic change Nov 04 16:43:17 n810 in the pocket Nov 04 16:44:54 someone have an idea to help me to find why my app didn t launch from maemo application menu ? Nov 04 16:45:11 i have revised 8 time desktop nd service file Nov 04 16:46:01 a debug mode Nov 04 16:46:11 or something like that ? Nov 04 16:48:35 Khertan_n810, Are you "registering" your app? I ripped this from sonata, this (afaik) is the python equivalent of osso_initialise: http://pastebin.com/m3c1426e6 Nov 04 16:50:02 not like that Nov 04 16:50:12 but it works for my other apps Nov 04 16:50:19 * GeneralAntilles wonders whether mvo has started on the appropriate changes or whether we should put Patch Master yerga on the job. :D Nov 04 16:52:01 I think we need a community 'gateway' delegate. Nov 04 16:52:15 Gateway? Nov 04 16:52:28 With commit access. Nov 04 16:52:43 For h-a-m? Nov 04 16:52:49 yes. Nov 04 16:52:55 Ah, right. Nov 04 16:53:22 So there is not 20 people bombarding mvo ;) Nov 04 16:53:50 Although we could create a 'go-crazy' branch for that ;) Nov 04 16:54:03 * GeneralAntilles fires another volley. Nov 04 16:55:23 mvo ? Nov 04 16:55:24 qwerty12: i ll try Nov 04 16:55:29 qwerty12: but it s work for my other app simply by setting osso.context Nov 04 16:55:42 :) Nov 04 17:01:26 moo qwerty Nov 04 17:01:44 arf RST38h Nov 04 17:03:45 wtf at some people.. i'm stand-in for the network admin on this dorm and because their switch was down and is a bit flakey, some guy talks about moving cos "it's too expensive" (they have flatrate 4/1mbit, no quotas, no traffic shaping, for less than 20$ a month) Nov 04 17:03:49 *shrugs* :P Nov 04 17:04:31 Stab him in the eye. Nov 04 17:04:38 flakey is the word Nov 04 17:04:45 nobody likes flakey Nov 04 17:04:55 No, the word is love. Nov 04 17:05:16 hehe Nov 04 17:05:25 btw hi guys ;-} and gals Nov 04 17:05:29 yeah, but, flakey in the sense someone comes and bangs the switch on the side when it breaks down completely, without charging them $$ for service :P Nov 04 17:06:13 Sts: Tell him that when I was a kid, we had to dial in with 2400bd modems and wait for 15 minutes until a line becomes free Nov 04 17:06:27 i told him when i moved to the dorm and blaster was raging, the net was -useless- Nov 04 17:06:27 :P Nov 04 17:06:34 Sts: And the university dropped connection every three hours just to keep people from abusing it Nov 04 17:06:39 and what they have now is luxury problems Nov 04 17:06:56 tell him about £120 monthly phonebills Nov 04 17:06:59 lol Nov 04 17:07:02 I used to ring up Nov 04 17:07:08 oh how the times change :) Nov 04 17:07:12 mm, good old dialup Nov 04 17:07:17 dialup days were the worst Nov 04 17:07:22 yeh Nov 04 17:07:25 qwerty12: doesn t help :( Nov 04 17:07:37 really though, inet access at all used to be a "luxury" but now people rely on it Nov 04 17:07:38 Sts: Also tell him that ayatollas will switch the internet off and make him wear a burkha, eventually Nov 04 17:07:44 GeneralAntilles: I disagree that Bluetooth PAN does exactly what it says on the tin Nov 04 17:07:50 No, the days before there _was_ dialup were the worst. Nov 04 17:07:55 johnx: I relied on it from the very beginning, never was luxury Nov 04 17:08:02 PAN = Private Area Network Nov 04 17:08:37 RST38h, well, us here are on the bleeding edge for the most part. heh...I'm even getting cut a little bit by it :| Nov 04 17:08:59 dneary, on the tin? Nov 04 17:09:27 johnx: infamous japanese phone UIs? =) Nov 04 17:10:02 GeneralAntilles: UK ad reference Nov 04 17:10:10 RST38h, pandora actually. the phone UIs aren't *that* bad Nov 04 17:10:21 Look up "does exactly what it says on the tin" in googol Nov 04 17:10:41 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Personal_area_network Nov 04 17:10:56 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Does_exactly_what_it_says_on_the_tin Nov 04 17:11:04 RST38h, re phones: I'd rather have a crappy UI for AGPS that works, than a slick UI on a phone with no AGPS Nov 04 17:11:27 I don't think we should be using technical acronyms in wiki page names Nov 04 17:11:54 I think that that page should be called "Bluetooth networking" Nov 04 17:11:56 Then change it to Bluetooth_Personal_Area_Network Nov 04 17:11:57 johnx: well, pandora is not out yet =) Nov 04 17:12:10 dneary, problem is, then the page is giant covering DUN and PAN. Nov 04 17:12:13 Although if we're being accurate it'd be "Bluetooth networking on Diablo" Nov 04 17:12:38 RST38h, and it *might* not be out until January thanks to delays from their LCD provider Nov 04 17:13:10 johnx: if the maemo reconstructed proposal falls to the ground, wouldn't it be a good roadmap for deblet? (i prefer it being maemo really, less work and more people interested.. :P) Nov 04 17:13:10 I think you can break out DUN under a link "Configuring dial-up networking over Bluetooth" that points to "Bluetooth dial-up networking" Nov 04 17:13:15 I would prefer not to put versions in titles. Nov 04 17:13:36 But job #1 is fix the Bluetooth networking page if it's broken, not create other pages Nov 04 17:14:01 I absolutely agree about not putting version names in page names Nov 04 17:14:03 Stskeeps, seems quite reasonable Nov 04 17:14:27 dneary, fix it if you want to. Nov 04 17:14:28 But right now, "Bluetooth PAN" doesn't do what it says on the tin because it's Diablo specific Nov 04 17:14:31 I'm washing my hands of it. Nov 04 17:14:46 To be better, the page should include instructions for doing PAN on older releases Nov 04 17:15:13 GeneralAntilles: That sounds menacing... Nov 04 17:15:22 My goal is not to piss you off here. Nov 04 17:15:26 DUMMY connections weren't broken in Chinook. Nov 04 17:15:37 I'm not pissed off, I just don't care. Nov 04 17:16:01 I don't have a strong enough opinion either way to fix it myself Nov 04 17:16:13 so if somebody else wants to fix it, then I wont tell them how to paint the barn. ;) Nov 04 17:16:29 GeneralAntilles, hehe Nov 04 17:16:36 As long as the information is accurate and up-to-date. Nov 04 17:20:30 dneary, what I mean to say is: I'm arguing over it for absolutely no reason. I actually don't care. Do whatever you think is right. ;) Nov 04 17:20:32 * Khertan_n810 is going crazy !!!!!!!!!! Nov 04 17:20:41 * GeneralAntilles gives Khertan_n810 some downers. Nov 04 17:20:47 2 hours to code a soft Nov 04 17:21:14 two day to try to understand why it doesn t launch from the menu Nov 04 17:21:48 Khertan_n810: i've wasted several days on gtk compilation. that was fun :P Nov 04 17:21:55 you learn by those experiences though Nov 04 17:22:40 no ... i only change name from the current working file for pygtkeditor,mcalendar and my other app Nov 04 17:23:14 but it doesn t work Nov 04 17:23:17 i ll learn something if i could have log oor debug trace Nov 04 17:23:43 * GeneralAntilles pokes at Maemo Reconstructed again. Nov 04 17:24:04 when u understand why it doesn t work you can learn something Nov 04 17:24:24 Reconstructed Again ? Nov 04 17:24:33 https://wiki.maemo.org/Maemo_Reconstructed Nov 04 17:24:47 that's the name for when the reconstruction fails, nokia goes bankrupt and we're stuck with our n8x0s ;) Nov 04 17:24:56 (reconstructed again) Nov 04 17:25:37 .. I have horrible jokes Nov 04 17:25:50 yep Nov 04 17:26:11 and i have horrible connection Nov 04 17:26:26 page still loading Nov 04 17:26:54 oh, that's not always your connection's fault Nov 04 17:26:55 :P Nov 04 17:27:27 * Khertan_n810 think of rewriting the maemo menu itself Nov 04 17:30:09 RAHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH !!!!! Nov 04 17:30:22 Khertan_n810 is turning into the Incredible Hulk. Nov 04 17:30:35 who wouldn't after developing for a while for maemo? :P Nov 04 17:30:36 Khertan_n810, when you do that, could you implement lockable desktop applets too? :P Nov 04 17:30:52 Fremantle Nov 04 17:30:53 * Khertan_n810 will throw is tablet from the train window Nov 04 17:30:58 s/is/his Nov 04 17:31:05 Fuck Fremantle, it would be nice to have it now Nov 04 17:31:16 also, I want a pony Nov 04 17:31:31 qwerty12: i would love that feature too :P Nov 04 17:31:35 TWO ponies. Nov 04 17:31:39 i just want to make my app laucnhable by the menu ! Nov 04 17:31:44 Meh, wanting lockable desktop applets is hardly asking for the world Nov 04 17:32:25 GeneralAntilles: Suggestions on my "Using PAN on older devices" paragraph, please? Nov 04 17:32:26 It is possible to use PAN to share internet connections via PAN between two Nokia devices. However, on older devices it is recommended to use dial-up networking, since this is the normal menthod which smartphones use to share internet access over bluetooth. Nov 04 17:33:05 dial-up networking involves phone lines Nov 04 17:33:17 Khertan_n810, I'm not all that familiar with the menu, but I remember people having problems that have to do with names of things not matching in different places Nov 04 17:33:21 Bluetooth DUN (dial-up networking) Nov 04 17:33:48 johnx : name is ok i review it 20 time Nov 04 17:34:40 However, on most cellphones, only Bluetooth DUN (Dial-Up Networking) is supported for tethering. Nov 04 17:35:25 Stskeeps, can you section-title-ize this: Scripts to ease deployment and debugging built applications inside Scratchbox+rootstrap to emulated and actual devices. ? Nov 04 17:35:50 GeneralAntilles: It looks to me like the whole article is how to do this on the master device (the one sharing internet) not the tablet Nov 04 17:36:16 "activate dund in /etc/default/bluez-utils on Debian"??? Nov 04 17:36:31 I don't think we need to cover PAN setup on other devices. Nov 04 17:36:43 s/PAN/networking/ Nov 04 17:36:43 GeneralAntilles meant: I don't think we need to cover networking setup on other devices. Nov 04 17:37:16 GeneralAntilles: Deployment and debugging support scripts maybe Nov 04 17:37:24 Stskeeps, for example: https://wiki.maemo.org/Maemo_Reconstructed#SDK_.28developer_kit_for_the_platform.29 Nov 04 17:37:57 ah Nov 04 17:38:22 so section instead of bold Nov 04 17:38:40 Makes it a little easier to read. Nov 04 17:39:15 i'm not sure what i should do ;) making it more of a section title? Nov 04 17:39:47 Yeah Nov 04 17:39:56 k Nov 04 17:40:00 editing' Nov 04 17:40:04 Looks OK to me as it is right now. Nov 04 17:40:07 I did two edits. Nov 04 17:40:15 ah Nov 04 17:41:28 going to comb it a bit through and then post on maemo-developers then. Nov 04 17:42:15 re Nov 04 17:42:41 Hopefully qgil's gonna get back to me with his meeting outline. Nov 04 17:44:11 sprint tonight or? Nov 04 17:44:16 +meeting Nov 04 17:45:04 Yeah, Sprint today. Nov 04 17:45:10 2:15 Nov 04 17:45:12 hours Nov 04 17:45:55 k Nov 04 17:46:24 hi Nov 04 17:46:26 Hmm. So am I expected to add the one new task I plan for November to add to https://wiki.maemo.org/Maemo.org_Sprints/November_08 already? Nov 04 17:46:43 anyone knows how to unminimize apps like Links2 ? Nov 04 17:46:48 * andre__ is always confused by the amount of wiki pages we have Nov 04 17:48:39 NaN ? Nov 04 17:50:16 disco_stu, hmm, there was an desktop applet that let you do that Nov 04 17:50:52 some CLI command ? Nov 04 17:50:56 disco_stu, try kotczarny's kciconsbox: http://www.internettablettalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=18542 Nov 04 17:51:05 qwerty12, nice catch :) Nov 04 17:51:12 thanks :) Nov 04 17:51:13 hum now i get freeze in gtk.main() Nov 04 17:51:25 what could do that ? Nov 04 17:51:25 disco_stu, if you want to do it from the command line wmctrl should do the trick Nov 04 17:51:56 is it bundled ? Nov 04 17:52:06 or a third party deb ? Nov 04 17:58:00 andre__, stick it on the proposals page, I guess. Nov 04 17:58:21 The Sprint instruction page needs to be written. Nov 04 17:58:31 gnarf :) Nov 04 17:58:40 i'll just a file a bug against myself. Nov 04 17:58:53 https://wiki.maemo.org/Maemo.org_proposals Nov 04 17:59:25 I guess I should flesh out the index page: https://wiki.maemo.org/Maemo.org_Sprints Nov 04 17:59:39 Quim seems to be the only one who really knows how everything is supposed to work. Nov 04 17:59:53 same impression here ;-) Nov 04 18:00:28 I guess there's kinda this: https://wiki.maemo.org/Task:Sprint_progress Nov 04 18:00:30 arg ! i ve found ! Nov 04 18:00:36 and: https://wiki.maemo.org/Pushing_a_maemo.org_task Nov 04 18:00:42 stupid things ! Nov 04 18:00:44 a corrupted png file Nov 04 18:02:29 GeneralAntilles: I think I'm going to miss tonight's meeting - either I will still be working, or I'll be travelling from work home Nov 04 18:03:32 Soo, just me and etrunko, then? :P Nov 04 18:04:08 GeneralAntilles: http://rafb.net/p/SScdHh91.html , anything that needs an injection of executive speak? Nov 04 18:04:54 Looks fine. Nov 04 18:05:00 alright Nov 04 18:05:04 GeneralAntilles: I'm attending Nov 04 18:05:13 (at last) Nov 04 18:05:15 :P Nov 04 18:05:50 (Apparently) I'm running this one. ;) Nov 04 18:06:31 GeneralAntilles: I know a bit about scrum... Don't know how the process is being adapted to our reality though Nov 04 18:08:48 Hehe, yeah, I figured you would. :D I was considering shoving it off on you, but you haven't had the opportunity to pick up the specifics of the maemo.org sprints. Nov 04 18:09:01 yup Nov 04 18:09:05 Not that anybody but Quim is really all that clear on them anyway. Nov 04 18:09:13 I can try for the next one Nov 04 18:10:39 andre__, think I should commit this for this Sprint? https://wiki.maemo.org/Task:Document_the_maemo.org_Sprint_procedure Nov 04 18:22:02 posted.. and now where is my pizza. Nov 04 18:23:44 GeneralAntilles: should i cross-post on iTT "Developers" too or will that just attract unwanted cesspool? :P Nov 04 18:24:15 I don't think there are any good low-level devs on ITT but not on -developers Nov 04 18:24:28 true Nov 04 18:24:44 GeneralAntilles: One input I'd give to the meeting: we, as a council, haven't done anything with the voting process etc. yet. Nov 04 18:26:42 Jaffa, do you want to pick up a task for this Sprint? Nov 04 18:29:35 GeneralAntilles, 3844 and 3845 are really high prio? just asking, if you think so, you're probably right :) Nov 04 18:29:57 andre__, well, they're blockers for implementing the new package categories. Nov 04 18:30:06 ah, ok Nov 04 18:30:18 So they basically have to be out in the next SSU push. Nov 04 18:30:31 understand Nov 04 18:34:05 Jaffa, https://wiki.maemo.org/Task:Define_voting_procedure_for_Community_Council_elections ? Nov 04 18:45:10 Hello all Nov 04 18:52:50 herro Nov 04 18:54:11 herro, herr pupnik Nov 04 18:54:24 You are my herro! Nov 04 19:01:17 hehe Nov 04 19:01:36 Jaffa, http://www.internettablettalk.com/forums/showthread.php?p=239338#post239338 Nov 04 19:07:49 I like the idea of range voting. Nov 04 19:13:20 45 minutes until -> #maemo-meeting Nov 04 19:24:39 #maemo-meeting? whats that? Nov 04 19:25:12 whatever it is, sounds like it could be interesting to watch Nov 04 19:25:59 http://wiki.maemo.org/Maemo.org_Sprints/October_08 Nov 04 19:26:27 ok, thanks Nov 04 19:29:00 hi Nov 04 19:29:10 * X-Fade feels bad whenever he needs to reject a project on garage which has Maemo in the title.. Nov 04 19:29:19 Hehe Nov 04 19:29:33 Just tell them to flip it around to x for Maemo Nov 04 19:29:33 I always hope they come back.. Nov 04 19:29:54 Can you tell them why? Nov 04 19:30:13 Yes, I have a default text for that. Nov 04 19:30:20 Ah Nov 04 19:30:34 But still, rejection feels bad ;) Nov 04 19:36:19 Suggest Moema Nov 04 19:36:19 :) Nov 04 19:54:26 5 minutes -> #maemo-meeting Nov 04 20:00:03 * Stskeeps ponders idly Nov 04 20:00:30 Now -> #maemo-meeting ;) Nov 04 20:00:32 my national tv is just rickrolling an entire tv channel with obama+rickrolling. Nov 04 20:00:38 that's disturbing. Nov 04 20:07:04 on a sidenote, when was power management a differentiation area for nokia? i thought it was the ui, seamless connectivity and apps :P Nov 04 20:07:37 Since they began talking about differentiation. Nov 04 20:07:47 mmkay Nov 04 20:07:50 Since the first phone.. Nov 04 20:08:00 Power is always a selling point. Nov 04 20:08:31 And you don't want to know how many patents they have on that ;) Nov 04 20:08:33 true, but then, libosso should be closed by that logic, as it really aids in making apps sleep and such :P Nov 04 20:08:44 and other components Nov 04 20:08:57 Don't give them ideas. Nov 04 20:09:03 sorry :P Nov 04 20:11:03 what do they mean by "legacy" as a reason of not opening btw? Nov 04 20:17:22 Inertia, I guess. Nov 04 20:17:34 It's that way mostly because it's already that way Nov 04 20:17:45 ah Nov 04 20:18:04 Newton's first law and all that. ;) Nov 04 20:18:51 i'm glad there was finally an official reason why BME is as it is, though Nov 04 20:18:56 and that's understandable Nov 04 20:19:32 Yeah, they don't want people blowing themselves up. ;) Nov 04 20:19:49 sucidal maemo hackers, eh. Nov 04 20:19:49 :P Nov 04 20:20:06 +i Nov 04 20:35:02 GeneralAntilles: Sure, I can help push the Nokia guys involved. Nov 04 20:35:26 Alright, since you're working on the server, I'll pick up the responsibility. ;) Nov 04 20:36:39 Well, there will be times where I need to wait on ISP etc to do something. So I can help. Nov 04 20:38:39 hallo all! Nov 04 20:39:16 live from a bar -- a new feat for me! Nov 04 20:39:44 hehe Nov 04 20:39:51 Hooray, tablets! Nov 04 20:39:52 but definately not a first in this channel ;) Nov 04 20:40:43 long time i didn't use my n800, are there progress with input methods lately ? handwriting recognition ? Nov 04 20:40:45 oh, stskeeps, many, MANY pb trying to install deblet;;;; Nov 04 20:41:02 bilaw_live: did it steal your wife? Nov 04 20:41:17 (Hello, by the way!) Nov 04 20:42:03 not even, it'd have meant i had 1! Nov 04 20:43:10 hehe, because that's the only thing it guarantees it -might- do :P deblet has so far been a good exersise in showing the feasability of open OS's on tablets Nov 04 20:43:21 without it having to be a "hack" Nov 04 20:44:21 and collect research for improving maemo, or pushing it in the right direction Nov 04 20:45:24 my experience with it is that it installed sth "somewhere", for 2 hours, and then... nothing! I must have screwed w/ the partition;;; Nov 04 20:45:50 hehe. many reasons for that to happen :) Nov 04 20:46:23 I Have to go, ill try and locate the logs if yore interestedc... Nov 04 20:46:28 k Nov 04 20:56:54 http://www.surveyusa.com/wp-content/uploads/2008/11/ecv-2006.png Nov 04 20:56:58 hehehe Nov 04 21:11:31 qwerties breed! Nov 04 21:42:09 * Stskeeps yawns Nov 04 21:44:11 http://maemo.org/profile/list/category/itt_thanks/ Nov 04 21:44:13 er Nov 04 21:44:16 bad paste Nov 04 21:47:44 wb Nov 04 21:47:59 Stupid client Nov 04 21:48:20 Will sometimes stop redrawing windows when you open a new tab. Nov 04 21:48:24 ah Nov 04 21:48:45 * Stskeeps ponders playing with debootstrap a bit Nov 04 21:50:04 atleast one person commented on proposal so far ;) Nov 04 21:51:14 Obama crazy person #4 today. Nov 04 21:53:14 is the meeting due to start or have i missed it? Nov 04 21:53:30 missed Nov 04 21:53:31 :P Nov 04 21:53:37 ahhh phoey Nov 04 21:53:55 lcuk2, what, you wanted to commit a task? ;) Nov 04 21:54:24 i wanted to keep myself informed is all :) i thought 22:00 utc was 10pm uk time Nov 04 21:54:33 crap! Nov 04 21:54:36 even worse lol Nov 04 21:54:43 lcuk2, http://maemo.org/maemo-meeting Nov 04 21:54:45 Should be up tomorrow Nov 04 21:54:46 * lcuk2 misread time Nov 04 21:55:25 lcuk2, it's when eastenders finishes :p Nov 04 21:55:51 lol, i have had it in my head that it was 10pm - doesnt matter Nov 04 21:55:55 * lcuk2 gets in his time machine Nov 04 22:02:07 * Jaffa debates staying up to see the first few results, incl- Florida & Ohio Nov 04 22:02:47 So not worth it. Nov 04 22:05:09 heh, is it just me or has the terrorist rhethoric at all been in play? i haven't heard anything about "there are warnings terrorist might bomb polling places" or the other crap :P Nov 04 22:06:47 Stskeeps: mostly around the "palling around with terrorists" stuff from Palin AFAICT Nov 04 22:08:17 ah Nov 04 22:15:07 heh, upstart, planned feature: "Events generated at timed intervals or scheduled times" Nov 04 22:15:11 that's where alarmd went Nov 04 22:16:22 Stskeeks: you mean...somerthing like...cron? Nov 04 22:17:36 yeah, obviously. but if you've seen how tablets work, cron isn't always the best choice Nov 04 22:17:45 think upstart integrating with retu wakeups and such Nov 04 22:18:06 There's no reason a crond couldn't. Nov 04 22:18:26 well have to go in over alarmd i guess Nov 04 22:19:00 .. *ponders sleep* Nov 04 22:26:49 Stskeeps: that feature has been in "planned features" for years :| Nov 04 22:28:09 the retu driver should be rewritten to look more like a regular RTC device Nov 04 22:31:07 As Jaffa said: I would prefer if someone implemented an alternative cron. cron interface/configuration isn't bad, and it's *well known* since the 70s. Nov 04 22:31:31 why cant u just use the standard one? Nov 04 22:31:41 does it have to be "alternative" Nov 04 22:32:13 lcuk: One can. But it could be that it needs to be rewritten/modified a bit to be a bit nicer, power-wise etc. Nov 04 22:32:30 suihkulokki: yeah, but when did you see people using RTC alarm latest? :P Nov 04 22:32:40 i thought it wasnt cron that was the problem, but the things you dangle from it Nov 04 22:36:19 Mauku's menu seems massivley oversized. Is this a new feature? Nov 04 22:36:25 does anyone have anything quantitive about crons battery use Nov 04 22:36:33 jaffa, i really like that - i was surprised Nov 04 22:37:03 I'd rather have consistency since Fremantle's doing something here anyway Nov 04 22:37:30 * lcuk2 mouths out "mauku" every time now, i was with hendrik when he gave his summit interview Nov 04 22:37:48 More to the point, it's not talking to jaiku at all for me Nov 04 22:38:28 mine works or seems to - im not sure if it live refreshes, but it did when i pressed refresh Nov 04 22:38:58 Mine says "unable to refresh" Nov 04 22:39:07 does normal net work>? Nov 04 22:39:50 yeah, on SSH and BBC live update site - http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/americas/us_elections_2008/7700298.stm Nov 04 22:39:59 jaffa, did u see my big visible from orbit brightness applet Nov 04 22:40:15 (which works well on Maemo once you stop the Flash scripts) Nov 04 22:40:25 lcuk2: yeah, looked good. Nov 04 22:40:40 How you showing current value? Nov 04 22:40:50 Jaffa, you aren't on o2 internet/be [there Nov 04 22:40:55 are you? Nov 04 22:41:07 Yeah, be Nov 04 22:41:08 sorry, h-i-m again :/ Nov 04 22:41:25 Known routing issue? Nov 04 22:41:34 Jaffa, yeah, my jaiku is down too. i think it's an o2/be problem Nov 04 22:41:40 FFS Nov 04 22:41:50 most sites aren't coming for me :/ Nov 04 22:42:17 yeah jaffa, you have a problem - you've been rewiring now for 2 weeks ;) Nov 04 22:42:29 mm. following US tv coverage with commercials makes me want to die Nov 04 22:42:42 sickening commercials :P Nov 04 22:42:59 lcuk2: heh Nov 04 22:43:40 im so nervous whenever i have to type that damned /msg nickserv identify 12345 thing Nov 04 22:44:00 :) Nov 04 22:44:00 make it a autoperform instead? :P Nov 04 22:44:00 set your IRC to do it :P Nov 04 22:44:08 it does when i log in Nov 04 22:44:15 but if the name was in use it doesnt Nov 04 22:44:21 lcuk: That's the same code as my luggage! Nov 04 22:44:25 !!! Nov 04 22:44:35 qwerty12_N800, use IRC-proxy: you paste in URLs and someone will cut+paste it to pastebin :) Nov 04 22:45:06 if you put goatse into pastebin will the universe collapse? Nov 04 22:45:07 :) Nov 04 22:45:10 lol Nov 04 22:45:39 there is an ascii goatse (i know, not hard to do) Nov 04 22:46:01 * qwerty12_N800 favourite goatse has to be goatsemarathon Nov 04 22:46:47 I miss the more innocent internet memes of yore ... Nov 04 22:47:12 what? like tubgirl? Nov 04 22:47:27 more like "all your base" Nov 04 22:47:34 or were yoiu meaning hamster dance type Nov 04 22:47:50 gah...nothing innocent about hamster dance O_o Nov 04 22:47:55 heh Nov 04 22:48:05 a true test of a hu-man's will to live Nov 04 22:48:09 * qwerty12_N800 still wants to run http://sam.zoy.org/lmos/ in an internet cafe and duck out Nov 04 22:49:14 for anyone remotely curious, its the lastmeasure OS, ive heard very evil things and have never been tempted to click Nov 04 22:49:24 Anyone remember Canter and Siegel? Nov 04 22:49:27 What is it? (tablet cr... ah) Nov 04 22:49:37 (when we're talking history here :) Nov 04 22:49:55 the site's ok (i promise) but linked content and actual os is not :p Nov 04 22:51:08 but i find it funny that the creator of that os keeps his cv on the same site as lmos... Nov 04 22:53:01 http://sam.zoy.org/lmos/ sounds interesting Nov 04 22:53:07 but not interesting enough to click Nov 04 22:53:17 oh, it's a great os Nov 04 22:54:00 it's an OS? Nov 04 22:54:12 It's interesting that people are so vocal about an issue at one point, but then don't seem to want to step up and be constructive on that same issue later. Nov 04 22:54:17 oh, i see Nov 04 22:54:23 i thought it was a shock site Nov 04 22:54:25 GeneralAntilles: ? Nov 04 22:54:39 GeneralAntilles: it's easier to discuss than act Nov 04 22:54:42 Jaffa, not one response on the voting system thread on itT. Nov 04 22:54:56 Yet it generated dozens of replies before. Nov 04 22:55:04 Pfft Nov 04 22:55:15 peopel are concentrating on another kind of voting tongiht Nov 04 22:55:28 lcuk, who cares? We're all fucked either way. Nov 04 22:55:38 * Jaffa isn't convinced that the approach last time was significantly sub-optimal. Nov 04 22:55:45 * qwerty12_N800 didn't find anything wrong with how the voting was conducted. then again, i wasn't looking for problems Nov 04 22:55:46 GA for president! Nov 04 22:55:48 :P Nov 04 22:55:50 Goatse Rescue Floppy? wtf? Nov 04 22:56:18 "As my first and last act as President I say, 'Fuck you guys.'" Nov 04 22:56:41 Hmm. The Auto-reloading AJAXey goodness on the bbc.co.uk URL above doesn't work if you zoom out in microb to 80% Nov 04 22:57:09 If I raise a bug, it'll just get marked WFM when they get up tomorrow Nov 04 22:57:23 GeneralAntilles, you sound like you really dont like the guy on a personal level Nov 04 22:57:33 lcuk, which guy? Nov 04 22:57:43 I don't like lots of people, so it's hard to keep track. :D Nov 04 22:58:07 obama Nov 04 22:58:16 I don't like either of the bastards. Nov 04 22:58:44 ok, at least you are balanced Nov 04 22:58:45 They're deceitful, evil people out to improve things for only themselves and their cronies. Nov 04 22:58:58 better obama then mccain or bush Nov 04 22:59:02 Unlike the Council? *cough* Nov 04 22:59:03 ^ Nov 04 22:59:05 ^ Nov 04 22:59:22 woglinde, giant douche or turd sandwich. Nov 04 22:59:28 Neither of them are very appealing. Nov 04 22:59:45 lol @ jaffa Nov 04 22:59:51 Jaffa, hey, I didn't say I wasn't a hypocrite! :P Nov 04 23:00:28 Palin's the decider, I think. I didn't mind either (from afar), but slightly preferred Obama. But after the last few weeks... Nov 04 23:00:56 obama really has stepped up Nov 04 23:01:15 Never thought Bush'd look sensible, well-balanced & intelligent ;-) Nov 04 23:01:20 How can I hide that "tab esc pgup pgdn ctrl" bar in the terminal? Nov 04 23:01:27 I use aa keyboard so I don't need it Nov 04 23:01:58 dmsuperman: View > show toolbar > ... Nov 04 23:02:09 control panel / text input settings / onscreen tab and languages / settings Nov 04 23:02:18 lcuk, different thing. Nov 04 23:02:22 untick everything Nov 04 23:02:28 Wow, that was stupid of me Nov 04 23:02:30 :P Nov 04 23:02:35 :) Nov 04 23:02:40 I didn't even think that was it Nov 04 23:03:09 Hrm, doubt it for this one but is the scrollbar possible to hide? Nov 04 23:03:38 Just a waste of space for me, screen doesn't relaly make use of it Nov 04 23:03:51 Not easily. Wait for Fremantle (hopefully) Nov 04 23:03:57 sky and virgin have kissed and made up Nov 04 23:04:09 ? Nov 04 23:04:09 'bout time Nov 04 23:04:10 lol Nov 04 23:04:20 lcuk, elaborate please Nov 04 23:04:22 and hi mate Nov 04 23:04:23 Jaffa: New terminal? Nov 04 23:04:25 http://www.telegraph.co.uk/finance/newsbysector/mediatechnologyandtelecoms/3380775/Sky-and-Virgin-end-cable-TV-row.html Nov 04 23:04:33 hiya lc :) Nov 04 23:04:43 dmsuperman, new scrolling method. Nov 04 23:04:47 maybe sky noticed that virgin one wasnt a bad channel Nov 04 23:04:50 Ah Nov 04 23:04:57 dmsuperman: Will have consistent (and, expectation is scrollbarless) scrolling Nov 04 23:05:18 Sweet Nov 04 23:05:33 scrollbarless is tricky, and does need some method to quickly go through Nov 04 23:05:41 lo dneary Nov 04 23:05:52 This will be for the window manager / toolkit, or just xterm? Nov 04 23:06:00 lcuk, have you had the opportunity to try inertial on an iPhone? Nov 04 23:06:07 lol looks like sky is getting more out of it than virgin! Nov 04 23:06:11 dmsuperman, everything. Nov 04 23:06:19 dmsuperman: ^^^ Nov 04 23:06:19 hi Ja Nov 04 23:06:25 hi Jaffa even Nov 04 23:06:29 LinuxCode, yeah, virgin are being raped Nov 04 23:06:30 Sweet, I'm excited :) Nov 04 23:06:33 6 channels versus 2 Nov 04 23:06:46 1 rubbish channel available on freeview anyway! Nov 04 23:06:47 Too bad it's in the range of 6-8 months away Nov 04 23:06:54 those 2 are probably asked for more on virgin helplines than anything Nov 04 23:07:00 Everything good takes time Nov 04 23:07:07 lcuk, yeh Nov 04 23:07:10 dmsuperman, gconftool --set --type=bool /apps/osso/xt erm/scrollbar 0 Nov 04 23:07:24 qwerty12_N800: I love you, thanks :) Nov 04 23:07:30 oh, cool Nov 04 23:07:32 :) Nov 04 23:07:37 I dont have sky or virgin Nov 04 23:08:03 GeneralAntilles, not really, ive had a quick browse around, do you mean the a-z listing or something else Nov 04 23:08:11 most tv is rubbish Nov 04 23:08:11 i am a virgin Nov 04 23:08:18 user Nov 04 23:08:22 ... Nov 04 23:08:23 enough of rubbish on freeview Nov 04 23:08:44 lcuk, well, it works pretty well for medium-length pages Nov 04 23:09:09 GeneralAntilles, yeah - everything does : ive got it in liqbase remember and my graffiti wall is massive now Nov 04 23:10:04 but there is a point where your eyes go funny at scrolling at a zillion miles an hour - ive put in a continuous calendar test - it scrolls forever but i go crosseyed if i move more than a month a second Nov 04 23:10:52 errr forget i said that, i wasnt gonna mention the calendar yet Nov 04 23:11:13 Everybody's got a half-baked PIM solution these days. :P Nov 04 23:11:54 heh GeneralAntilles :) but ive got 8 years experience in database scheduler/tasks/jobs/workflow ;) Nov 04 23:12:18 * Jaffa won't hold his breath Nov 04 23:12:22 heh Nov 04 23:12:35 i really dont want to though i enjoy throwing graphics around Nov 04 23:12:58 What was johnx's quote? "Yep, emacs." Nov 04 23:13:07 i dont like getting stuck in random apis - i would like to see khertan extend where hes going with mcalendar Nov 04 23:13:37 heh Nov 04 23:13:44 Worrying that khertan's rewriting it from scratch. Easy to do as a developer Nov 04 23:14:01 yeah jaffa, hes gone off the radar somewhat Nov 04 23:14:20 but so have others, we know where a few have gone, hopefully the rest are also busy in productive ways Nov 04 23:14:33 More fun than properly finishing an app (sometimes it's the right answer, but often not) Nov 04 23:15:32 yeah - the push i had recently stabilizing and releasing liqbase for general use wasnt the best time - it felt more like work than the relaxing time i normally have Nov 04 23:15:42 work is for the daytime Nov 04 23:15:48 :) Nov 04 23:16:00 and the night time for me ATM :( Nov 04 23:16:07 Finishing projects is the worst. Nov 04 23:16:09 'night, Jaffa. Nov 04 23:16:16 no, i enjoy getting projects out there Nov 04 23:16:32 i work hard and try to give the best experience i can to customers Nov 04 23:16:33 It's fun in the beginning, and it's fun once it's out Nov 04 23:16:48 But that span of time in the middle is no fun. Nov 04 23:16:59 the only times i dont like releasing is when someone over my head tells me that its time to go Nov 04 23:17:49 normally ive got goals and targets that i meet (like the summit was one) but if they get radically altered it throws out my mind Nov 04 23:18:26 jaffa, have you seen the video from tim at cbase Nov 04 23:18:39 Not watched it yet Nov 04 23:18:51 Was wondering when he had time! Nov 04 23:19:13 i was with hendrik when he gave his, and ive got one as well - we were told they were internal nokia things when we did them Nov 04 23:19:21 Ah Nov 04 23:19:28 mine will pop up soon aparantly Nov 04 23:22:07 I'm sitting in class. The buil;t in notes utility is a bit lacking, imo Nov 04 23:22:17 Is there something I might use to better take notes? Nov 04 23:22:34 liqbase :) for reading and reviewing - its stroke based Nov 04 23:22:39 liqbase, xournal, maemopad+ Nov 04 23:22:44 AbiWord Nov 04 23:23:02 GeneralAntilles: Do you have a favorite? Nov 04 23:23:23 I don't really use any of them very much lately Nov 04 23:23:33 liqbase is preferable because it's easy to use on the go. Nov 04 23:23:40 But no keyboard entry. Nov 04 23:23:44 yet Nov 04 23:23:49 Not good then Nov 04 23:23:58 Do any of them support easily categorizing notes? Nov 04 23:24:08 xournal or maemopad+ Nov 04 23:24:10 Try both Nov 04 23:24:16 all 3 Nov 04 23:24:25 Alright Nov 04 23:24:28 why isnt xournal in extras? Nov 04 23:24:31 Thanks for the suggestions :D Nov 04 23:24:56 lcuk, dunno, email the maintainer. Nov 04 23:24:58 lcuk, it is..infact the -devel version is messed up Nov 04 23:25:05 dmsuperman, :) if you do try liqbase and have suggestions for improvements or required features put them on the site Nov 04 23:25:25 lcuk: I don't have the time to try to hand write my notes, sorry :(o Nov 04 23:25:27 its under extensive development at the moment and has many planned directions Nov 04 23:25:42 tsk tsk, is it really slower to hand write? Nov 04 23:26:03 with my handwriting yes Nov 04 23:26:06 lol Nov 04 23:26:12 lol Nov 04 23:26:25 surely you have your own shorthand though Nov 04 23:26:29 i can barely sign my name these days Nov 04 23:26:40 keyboard cripple Nov 04 23:26:57 LinuxCode, can't be as bad as me :p. mine is *awful* Nov 04 23:27:39 Mine surely wins. Nov 04 23:30:38 My handwriting isn't that slow Nov 04 23:30:42 But my typing is very fast Nov 04 23:30:53 I type much faster than the professor can speak Nov 04 23:35:41 dmsuperman, the art of taking notes is to not catch every word, but write enough that every word can be recalled Nov 04 23:35:47 its like jpeg for your memory Nov 04 23:36:19 I know Nov 04 23:36:23 I was only saying Nov 04 23:36:35 My handwriting isn't neat enough though Nov 04 23:36:41 And typing is a lot more comfortable Nov 04 23:36:53 heh, i sat and took notes from every presentation i sat in at the summit Nov 04 23:37:21 and i think people on the plane mustv thought i was mad - i was scribbling hundreds of notes Nov 04 23:37:44 making sure everything i thought of was noted down for later :) Nov 04 23:39:21 Meh, xournal's a cool idea Nov 04 23:39:30 The ability to type anywhere and handwrite at the same time is cool Nov 04 23:39:45 It just seems like it'd be too slow to ever try to move anything around Nov 04 23:40:22 dmsuperman, in early versions of liqbase i had the ability to simply type whilst sketching and assign notes to any visible page Nov 04 23:40:28 xournal is nice Nov 04 23:40:29 but the N8xx screens are a bit too small for it Nov 04 23:40:30 I tried using it for taking notes during lectures, but it was too slow Nov 04 23:40:37 compared to paper Nov 04 23:40:43 it would be very nice on a table pc or something Nov 04 23:40:47 tablet* Nov 04 23:41:01 If I had a tablet this wouldn't even be a question Nov 04 23:41:01 tpc :) http://liqbase.net/ Nov 04 23:41:09 * lcuk is bein a salesman tonight Nov 04 23:41:21 principle features. sketching - faster than paper. Nov 04 23:41:33 I'll take a look Nov 04 23:42:06 good evening Nov 04 23:42:12 hey there seb Nov 04 23:42:18 did you get my mail?> Nov 04 23:42:20 how's it going? Nov 04 23:42:24 lcuk, didn't I reply? Nov 04 23:42:43 not according to google Nov 04 23:42:46 oh crap Nov 04 23:42:50 I thought I had Nov 04 23:43:05 Woo, crashanddie. Nov 04 23:43:09 How's the working life? Nov 04 23:43:12 busy Nov 04 23:43:14 fucking busy Nov 04 23:43:31 I do something like 12-14 hour days Nov 04 23:43:35 Worth it? Nov 04 23:43:39 Definitely Nov 04 23:47:37 lcuk, GeneralAntilles: NoteCase Nov 04 23:47:45 It's pretty cool Nov 04 23:47:59 Like maemopad+ but it seems to be a bit more organized Nov 05 00:11:57 Anyonee got a VLC command line to transcode a stream to, say, MPEG1 and stream over HTTP? Nov 05 00:13:46 Jaffa, look at knots, maybe? Nov 05 00:14:20 Can't get to it from here ATM Nov 05 00:14:26 good nite Nov 05 00:14:33 Jaffa, http://wiki.videolan.org/Documentation:Streaming_HowTo/Command_Line_Examples Nov 05 00:14:39 gnite woglinde Nov 05 00:15:01 vlc -vvv input_stream --sout '#transcode{vcodec=mp4v,acodec=mpga,vb=800,ab=128}:standard{access=http,mux=ogg,dst=server.example.org:8080}' Nov 05 00:22:34 GeneralAntilles: yeah, that's the kind of thing I've been trying but it says "no suitable sout access module http/{ts,asf,ogg}" Nov 05 00:22:58 I played with it about 6 months ago, but don't remember anything. Nov 05 00:33:38 where can i find a list of repo adresses for os2008? Nov 05 00:34:47 there is only one Nov 05 00:35:05 ~extras Nov 05 00:35:06 hmm... extras is http://wiki.maemo.org/Extras Nov 05 00:35:32 ok thx Nov 05 00:46:41 does anyone here have maemo-mapper working with flite ? Nov 05 00:48:17 does anyone here have maemo-mapper working with flite ? Nov 05 00:54:42 ugh my n770 just resets when i try to open the app manager Nov 05 00:56:57 actually its when refreshing Nov 05 00:58:36 or just randomly nvm Nov 05 01:19:48 is there any way to load an xchat plugin which appears to need gcc? I'm just trying to make a command which ignores a user by nick (e.g. /ignore_nick ignorednick) Nov 05 01:26:13 i would be deeply suspicious of a plugin trying to compile code Nov 05 01:26:58 besides, isnt /ignore nick a builtin command? Nov 05 01:27:29 * lcuk may have a dependency for gcc one day Nov 05 01:27:54 LinuxCode, what you been up2 then Nov 05 01:28:38 in general ? Nov 05 01:28:51 yeah Nov 05 01:28:59 still sorting finances out Nov 05 01:29:03 takea a time Nov 05 01:29:06 takes Nov 05 01:29:11 long time Nov 05 01:29:26 apart from that not much Nov 05 01:29:33 need to look for a new job soon Nov 05 01:29:50 yeah? what you thinking Nov 05 01:29:51 but need to leave the country soon again Nov 05 01:29:54 more sorting out Nov 05 01:30:03 then I can take care of work again Nov 05 01:30:16 security/net admining Nov 05 01:30:30 but if I cant find anything in that field Nov 05 01:30:39 although Im specialised in it Nov 05 01:30:44 shining your torchlight along some patch cables Nov 05 01:30:51 then...as long as its a linux/unix based job Nov 05 01:30:54 lcuk, not really, no. new command "ignore %2!*@* ALL" fixes it though! Nov 05 01:31:00 I dont mind Nov 05 01:31:22 cars__, you've really got that many people you need to ignore? Nov 05 01:31:50 cars__, you obviously have more l33t skills with xchat than me cos that is meaningless lol Nov 05 01:32:20 lol GeneralAntilles hes "popular" Nov 05 01:33:46 GeneralAntilles, In the #politics channel, definitely! Nov 05 01:33:58 Urg Nov 05 01:34:42 lcuk, not at all. Mostly meaningless to me too. I had to ask in #xchat :) Nov 05 02:02:25 n #politics **** ENDING LOGGING AT Wed Nov 05 02:59:57 2008