**** BEGIN LOGGING AT Tue Nov 11 02:59:57 2008
Nov 11 04:41:32 <disco_stu> hi
Nov 11 05:01:04 <darkblue_B> hello - I have been away from this for a couple of months, forgive my dense questions.. I want to do a demo tomorrow with an http server of sone kind.. lighthttpd ?
Nov 11 05:02:51 <johnx> lighthttpd is good
Nov 11 05:02:59 <johnx> are you just serving static web pages?
Nov 11 05:04:44 <darkblue_B> hmm, I have some dojo toolkit pages
Nov 11 05:04:49 <darkblue_B> so its 'ajax'
Nov 11 05:05:02 <darkblue_B> they are not php, if thats what you are asking
Nov 11 05:05:30 <darkblue_B> I'm trying to remember how this works.. looking for my OS version
Nov 11 05:05:39 <darkblue_B> its fairly recently updated
Nov 11 05:05:43 <darkblue_B> I am logged in as root
Nov 11 05:05:56 <darkblue_B> I have some python scripts .. thats already installed and runninng
Nov 11 05:06:14 <darkblue_B> the web pages call them on the python http server, on a seperate port
Nov 11 05:10:15 <johnx> I think apache2 and nginx are available as well if that doesn't end up working for you, but I've got to head out for now
Nov 11 05:10:17 <johnx> good luck
Nov 11 05:10:24 <darkblue_B> johnx: I dont think I see a lighthttpd in the app mgr list on the N800.. which repo do I go it?
Nov 11 05:11:13 <darkblue_B> .. to find it?
Nov 11 05:13:15 <darkblue_B> Nokia-N800-23-14
Nov 11 05:14:03 <johnx> http://www.internettablettalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=23840&highlight=lighttpd&page=2
Nov 11 05:14:19 <darkblue_B> looking, thx
Nov 11 05:16:13 <darkblue_B> I use sqlite3 from python, btw
Nov 11 05:16:19 <darkblue_B> to do this work
Nov 11 05:20:47 <darkblue_B> johnx: geez, that was easy.. it worked
Nov 11 05:20:57 <darkblue_B> php there, even though I dont need it
Nov 11 05:21:06 <darkblue_B> now to figure out where everything landed
Nov 11 05:21:20 <johnx> dpkg -L packagename
Nov 11 05:21:41 <johnx> glad it worked :)
Nov 11 05:21:45 * johnx heads out the door
Nov 11 05:22:20 <darkblue_B> :-)
Nov 11 05:22:49 <darkblue_B> thank you
Nov 11 07:19:58 <Sage> hi, is it possible to install multiple packages (that do not have dependencies to each other) with single .install file on maemo 4.x?
Nov 11 08:09:32 <X-Fade> morning.
Nov 11 08:12:07 <RST38h> moo, XFade
Nov 11 08:37:43 <Sargun> Wait, can you upgrade the internal storage on the N810?
Nov 11 08:39:55 <aquatix> Sargun: not that i'm aware
Nov 11 08:40:09 <aquatix> maybe with some soldering
Nov 11 08:40:30 <X-Fade> No, forget about that.
Nov 11 08:41:00 <X-Fade> Unless you are good at bga unsoldering and want to remove your cpu ;)
Nov 11 08:42:35 <Sage> Because nobody said anything, I guess that nobody knows answer to my question? :)
Nov 11 08:43:15 <X-Fade> Sage, I don't think so.
Nov 11 08:43:28 <X-Fade> I think you need to create a meta package for that.
Nov 11 08:43:47 <Sargun> heh...
Nov 11 08:44:39 <Sargun> so I heard on ITT that some people have some sort of real time traffic for way finder map
Nov 11 08:44:43 <Sage> So there is no ways to have single file install for multiple packages located in different repos.
Nov 11 08:44:47 <Sargun> I purchased a wayfinder license
Nov 11 08:44:54 <Sargun> how do I get real time traffic working?
Nov 11 08:45:28 <X-Fade> Sage: No. But multiple packages in different repos is about the worst thing you can have.
Nov 11 08:47:38 <X-Fade> As that sets you up for dependency hell.
Nov 11 08:56:12 <Sage> Is it possible to create a meta package, e.g., meta.deb what installs also dependencies from repositories when installed? Or does that meta.deb also have to be in some repository?
Nov 11 08:58:19 <X-Fade> Sage: Or you just upload all your packages to Extras and have non of these issues?
Nov 11 08:59:16 <inz> Sage, yes, the meta package must be in a repository
Nov 11 09:02:13 <Sage> So it is as hard as I though :)
Nov 11 09:02:25 <Sage> thx, for the informations.
Nov 11 09:03:44 <inz> Sage, just put the package in a/the repository
Nov 11 10:50:59 <Meizirkki_n810> M-R team?: does xorg packages in http://trac.tspre.org/m-r/incoming/ work. Touchscreen?
Nov 11 10:56:20 <camel_liu> hi, all
Nov 11 10:56:28 <Meizirkki_n810> hi
Nov 11 10:56:54 <camel_liu> I'm trying to install gst-plugins-bad in scratchbox.
Nov 11 10:57:04 <camel_liu> I met a problem
Nov 11 10:59:47 <camel_liu> I installed swfdec lib, but gst-plugins-bad's configure seems to be unaware of the installed swfdec lib. When configure finish, the plugins' list of will not be built always includes swfdec.
Nov 11 11:01:40 <camel_liu> the same with timidity, but different with wildmidi. When I installed wildmidi lib, it will be move to the list of 'will be built'.
Nov 11 11:09:00 <Jaffa> Morning, all
Nov 11 11:10:20 <Meizirkki_n810> good evening ;)
**** BEGIN LOGGING AT Tue Nov 11 11:48:39 2008
Nov 11 11:55:26 <johnx> Meizirkki_n810, those should work, yes
Nov 11 12:05:12 <Stskeeps> Meizirkki_n810: go for the ones johnx has
Nov 11 12:05:17 <Stskeeps> i think
Nov 11 12:05:43 <johnx> Stskeeps, I didn't even see those ones built for m-r when I built mine
Nov 11 12:05:52 <johnx> I'm sure mine aren't any better and possibly worse
Nov 11 12:06:43 <Stskeeps> k
Nov 11 12:07:02 <Stskeeps> well yours definately work;)
Nov 11 12:07:12 <RST38h> A survey has shown that almost half of Brits haven't got a clue how to use the possessive apostrophe correctly, with the most common lapse being the inability to "punctuate a possessive plural"
Nov 11 12:07:14 <RST38h> Hehe
Nov 11 12:32:31 <johnx> Stskeeps, random thought about osso-gnomevfs and "Provides: "
Nov 11 12:35:49 <johnx> trying to find out if "Provides: foo" provides a specific version or just foo in general
Nov 11 12:35:57 <lcuk> RST38h, where's this survey result page. it sounds' like fun
Nov 11 12:37:03 <StsN800> johmx, thats a good question
Nov 11 12:37:14 <lcuk> Stskeeps, how much faster is beagle vs n8x0?
Nov 11 12:37:18 <johnx> yeah, looks like provides: doesn't provide a specific version
Nov 11 12:37:39 <StsN800> omap3 vs omap2, 600mhz i think
Nov 11 12:38:26 <lcuk> i dont mean mhz, i mean usable speed differences - if it feasible to run office etc natively without a 5 minute startup time and stuff
Nov 11 12:38:43 <StsN800> lcuk, no clue
Nov 11 12:39:00 <StsN800> didnt get a screen on it yet
Nov 11 12:39:12 <lcuk> ahhhh
Nov 11 12:39:48 <johnx> so the other question about osso-gnomevfs2 is: Is it really a drop in replacement for the real gnomevfs?
Nov 11 12:40:10 <StsN800> it does provide it
Nov 11 12:40:42 <StsN800> and its based upon afaik
Nov 11 12:41:27 <StsN800> and has soname libgnomevfs
Nov 11 12:41:55 <johnx> so we'll assume it's a drop in replacement unless something fails :)
Nov 11 12:41:58 <StsN800> maybe a package rename is in order
Nov 11 12:42:20 <StsN800> so logic starts working again
Nov 11 12:42:47 <johnx> yeah, that's pretty icky, but I guess it's the same situation as gtk :/
Nov 11 12:44:11 <StsN800> think we should ask sui, he might have a better solution
Nov 11 12:44:50 <johnx> we also might want to ask Nokia. osso-gnomevfs is a little old. they probably are planning to up to at least the current version for fremantle
Nov 11 12:45:13 <StsN800> that too
Nov 11 12:47:45 <RST38h> lcuk: No idea, but I guess the rule of thumb is to check the BBC =)
Nov 11 12:50:21 <StsN800> johnx, guess we can leave the problem for now and continue towards hildon
Nov 11 12:50:58 <StsN800> since we.have it microdocumented we can return to it
Nov 11 12:51:20 <johnx> fair enough. any suggestion for a compile to start before I head off to bed?
Nov 11 12:51:31 <johnx> It's requests hour :)
Nov 11 12:52:27 <lcuk> could you compile me a list of open access bank account numbers with passwords?
Nov 11 12:52:30 <StsN800> fix g_gnuc_function in gtkhtml to g_strfunc and compile i guess
Nov 11 12:52:45 <StsN800> matter of search and replace
Nov 11 12:52:47 <lcuk> RST38h, the bbc is not better
Nov 11 12:53:10 <johnx> think I'll manage :)
Nov 11 12:53:16 <StsN800> im in classes and work the next 8 hours so
Nov 11 13:18:09 <RST38h> lcuk: http://www.theregister.co.uk/2008/11/11/apostrophe_abuse/
Nov 11 13:18:46 * RST38h doesn't get it by the way. Why is it so hard for native speakers?
Nov 11 13:21:28 <user__> buongiorno a tutti
Nov 11 13:22:20 <proto1> anyone tried synergy on  the n810?
Nov 11 13:24:19 <Meizirkki_n810> Johnx: You got Xorg working? Do i have to mess with xorg.conf or orher files?
Nov 11 13:24:43 <johnx> nope, just download the xorg.conf from http://trac.tspre.org/johnx/packages/x11/xorg.conf
Nov 11 13:25:04 <johnx> you need to run ts_calibrate before that though
Nov 11 13:26:01 <Meizirkki_n810> can i copy pointercal from maemo?
Nov 11 13:26:09 <johnx> errr...maybe?
Nov 11 13:26:17 <johnx> yeah, should work
Nov 11 13:26:30 <Meizirkki_n810> ok, thanks :)
Nov 11 13:27:59 <StsN800> and the ln -s fb0 fb
Nov 11 13:28:21 * johnx <3 distcc
Nov 11 13:28:47 <Meizirkki_n810> yep
Nov 11 13:29:51 <johnx> heh...everyone is is using their tablet. I'm just compiling on mine :)
Nov 11 13:34:09 <Meizirkki_n810> i have compiled once
Nov 11 13:34:13 <Meizirkki_n810> with my tablet
Nov 11 13:34:45 <StsN800> we should make omapfb use /dev/fb0 instead of /dev/fb
Nov 11 13:34:45 <Meizirkki_n810> i compiled svn version of tablet-hw-n8x0-nonfree
Nov 11 13:35:05 <StsN800> hehe. and its just a script
Nov 11 13:35:31 <Meizirkki_n810> yep, and my compilation did not work ;J
Nov 11 13:35:57 <Meizirkki_n810> no access to nokia files
Nov 11 13:36:09 <StsN800> mm
Nov 11 13:36:13 <Meizirkki_n810> when i just force-arch it, it works
Nov 11 13:37:02 <Meizirkki_n810> it looks like xorg needs at least xfonts-base
Nov 11 13:37:10 <StsN800> yeah
Nov 11 13:39:14 <Meizirkki_n810> but it is not dependanchy
Nov 11 13:39:23 <Meizirkki_n810> need to install manually
Nov 11 13:39:54 <Meizirkki_n810> anyway, now i finally got working ubuntu
Nov 11 13:40:01 <Meizirkki_n810> no more segmentation faults
Nov 11 13:40:07 <Meizirkki_n810> =)
Nov 11 13:41:32 <StsN800> yay
Nov 11 13:44:14 <Meizirkki_n810> if i install gdm does it start automatically when xorg starts
Nov 11 13:45:15 <Meizirkki_n810> or when i run startx?
Nov 11 13:48:00 <johnx> it will run when you do: /etc/init.d/gdm start
Nov 11 13:48:45 <aquatix> on debian that's done automagically
Nov 11 13:49:15 <Meizirkki_n810> does that start xorg too?
Nov 11 13:50:23 <johnx> Meizirkki_n810, yes
Nov 11 13:50:31 <Meizirkki_n810> thanks
Nov 11 13:55:29 <johnx> gtkhtml wants gnomeui...
Nov 11 14:01:27 <Stskeeps> eh.
Nov 11 14:01:55 <Stskeeps> gtkhtml from trunk says especially that it does not have gnome dependancies
Nov 11 14:02:04 <johnx> yeah, I'll try --without
Nov 11 14:02:16 <johnx> after all it's exactly the same gtkhtml as in diablo
Nov 11 14:05:59 <RST38h> gtkhtml SHOULD NOT require gnome UI
Nov 11 14:06:22 <RST38h> it's a widget after all
Nov 11 14:06:30 <Stskeeps> johnx: where on earth does it want it?
Nov 11 14:06:59 <Stskeeps> in source?
Nov 11 14:07:01 <johnx> it's configure script wants it, I'll try --without-gnomeui in a second, but I'm fighting with glade ATM
Nov 11 14:07:43 <Stskeeps> k
Nov 11 14:11:02 <Stskeeps> weird though, didn't get that part
Nov 11 14:16:24 <Stskeeps> heh, i discovered something funny about iphones today.. people use the shiny backside to use as mirror instead
Nov 11 14:16:27 <Stskeeps> :P
Nov 11 14:16:45 <johnx> glade wins round one. I'm going to sleep. :P
Nov 11 14:17:00 <Navi> Ew
Nov 11 14:17:02 <Navi> Sleep
Nov 11 14:17:04 <Navi> Sleep is for the weak
Nov 11 14:17:08 <Stskeeps> nini johnx
Nov 11 14:17:43 <johnx> Navi, yeah, usually that's my line. :P
Nov 11 14:17:45 <johnx> 'night all
Nov 11 14:19:26 <prez00> hello
Nov 11 14:19:35 <Navi> night
Nov 11 14:20:42 <prez00> ever since latest update, my n800's email usinh imap stops updating, my browser gets stuck with an updating window and machine reboots randomly..
Nov 11 14:22:09 <Stskeeps> .ni?
Nov 11 14:22:39 <prez00> nicaragua
Nov 11 14:22:41 <Stskeeps> ah
Nov 11 14:22:51 <Stskeeps> prez00: you're running into Modest, it sounds like :P
Nov 11 14:23:11 <prez00> suggestions?
Nov 11 14:23:57 <Stskeeps> not really, i have same issue
Nov 11 14:24:51 <disco_stu> prez00: hola nicaraguense
Nov 11 14:24:52 <Meizirkki> http://pastebin.com/d42d3f3e3
Nov 11 14:25:00 <Meizirkki> xservder did not start
Nov 11 14:25:07 <Meizirkki> xorg
Nov 11 14:25:25 <prez00> right now i can't even open browser... i get an updating window in upper right corner...
Nov 11 14:25:31 <RST38h> Sts: you do understand that a real man (tm) never uses a mirror except for shaving
Nov 11 14:25:35 <RST38h> =)
Nov 11 14:25:47 <Stskeeps> RST38h: this was a woman, too
Nov 11 14:25:53 <RST38h> Sts: Ah
Nov 11 14:25:56 <prez00> i killed browser and tried to restart, nothin
Nov 11 14:26:40 <Stskeeps> Meizirkki: try add Nokia-N810-23-14 to your /etc/hosts maybe
Nov 11 14:26:56 <Meizirkki> ok
Nov 11 14:27:05 <Stskeeps> just 127.0.0.1
Nov 11 14:27:15 <Meizirkki> There is nothing in /etc/hosts!
Nov 11 14:27:20 <Meizirkki> weird
Nov 11 14:27:22 <mgedmin> there should be
Nov 11 14:27:24 <Stskeeps> that's probably an issue too
Nov 11 14:27:36 <Meizirkki> copy from maemo?
Nov 11 14:27:36 <Stskeeps> 127.0.0.1       localhost
Nov 11 14:27:37 <Stskeeps> atleast
Nov 11 14:27:38 <mgedmin> 127.0.0.1 Nokia-N810-23-14 localhost
Nov 11 14:27:41 <Meizirkki> ok
Nov 11 14:27:43 <Meizirkki> thanks
Nov 11 14:27:45 <mgedmin> is the default content of that file
Nov 11 14:27:47 <Stskeeps> what mgedmin said
Nov 11 14:30:01 <disco_stu> if i create a swap partition in my mmc1, will maemo use it ?
Nov 11 14:30:35 <Meizirkki> you can activate it by running "swapon <patrition>
Nov 11 14:30:36 <Stskeeps> if you insert a swapon somewhere in your init script
Nov 11 14:30:37 <Stskeeps> :P
Nov 11 14:31:15 <disco_stu> then i wont be able to hotswap it, right ?
Nov 11 14:32:01 <Stskeeps> you'll have very interesting experiences if you do, yeah
Nov 11 14:32:36 <disco_stu> and it will be added to the virtual memory already created in the control panel ?
Nov 11 14:32:44 <disco_stu> will it*
Nov 11 14:32:44 <Stskeeps> maybe
Nov 11 14:33:24 <disco_stu> lets check
Nov 11 14:33:50 <disco_stu> what is the schema of partitions, here ?
Nov 11 14:34:08 <Stskeeps> mmcblkXpY
Nov 11 14:34:52 <Meizirkki> Xll won't work
Nov 11 14:34:53 <disco_stu> the swap is added
Nov 11 14:34:56 <disco_stu> nice
Nov 11 14:35:05 <Meizirkki> i'll try johnx:s compilation
Nov 11 14:35:32 <Meizirkki> *Xorg
Nov 11 14:36:10 <Stskeeps> Meizirkki: odd, may just be startx messing up though
Nov 11 14:36:25 <Stskeeps> try X & ; export DISPLAY=:0; xmessage hi
Nov 11 14:36:31 <Meizirkki> ok
Nov 11 14:36:31 <Stskeeps> (with x11-utils on)
Nov 11 14:36:35 <Stskeeps> this in bootable or chroot?
Nov 11 14:36:43 <Meizirkki> bootable
Nov 11 14:36:59 <Stskeeps> k
Nov 11 14:36:59 <Meizirkki> trying to start it from telnet
Nov 11 14:37:13 <Stskeeps> you have pressed the three enters so the system keeps booting
Nov 11 14:37:14 <Stskeeps> ?
Nov 11 14:38:33 <Meizirkki> yep
Nov 11 14:38:42 <Stskeeps> k
Nov 11 14:38:54 <Meizirkki> it shows this : xf86PciVideoInfo is not set
Nov 11 14:39:16 <Meizirkki> Wait
Nov 11 14:39:26 <Stskeeps> normal, and fine, i believe
Nov 11 14:39:33 <Stskeeps> n800's don't have pci
Nov 11 14:40:18 <Meizirkki> The johnx:s xorg.conf seems to not be applied :P
Nov 11 14:40:25 <Stskeeps> put it in /etc/X11?
Nov 11 14:41:23 <Meizirkki> i downloaded it with wget when i was in that directory
Nov 11 14:41:39 <Meizirkki> and of cource wget named it xorg.conf.1
Nov 11 14:41:45 <Stskeeps> ah
Nov 11 14:44:19 <X-Fade> Duh, AWACS plane flying low over my house..
Nov 11 14:44:46 <X-Fade> That bastard is loud.
Nov 11 14:48:43 <aquatix> X-Fade: they found you?
Nov 11 14:48:57 <X-Fade> Don't take my tablet.. Please.....
Nov 11 14:49:02 <aquatix> expect helicopters next
Nov 11 14:49:12 <aquatix> *g*
Nov 11 14:49:22 <X-Fade> aquatix: I'm used to those. Apache base 10km from my house ;)
Nov 11 14:49:37 <X-Fade> And chinooks too.
Nov 11 14:49:54 <disco_stu> X-Fade: i envy you
Nov 11 14:50:04 * aquatix doesn't
Nov 11 14:50:12 * aquatix likes some rest when at home
Nov 11 14:50:18 <X-Fade> disco_stu: Chinooks have a habit of dropping out of the sky..
Nov 11 14:50:24 <aquatix> lol
Nov 11 14:50:33 * aquatix sees enough helicopters at work
Nov 11 14:50:52 <disco_stu> aquatix: where u work ?
Nov 11 14:51:54 <aquatix> disco_stu: dutch naval base
Nov 11 14:52:31 <disco_stu> wow.. awsome
Nov 11 14:52:42 <disco_stu> s/awsome/awesome/
Nov 11 14:52:43 <infobot> disco_stu meant: wow.. awesome
Nov 11 14:52:45 <X-Fade> aquatix: DH?
Nov 11 14:52:47 <aquatix> sounds more interesting then it is ;)
Nov 11 14:52:51 <aquatix> X-Fade: yeah
Nov 11 14:53:22 <X-Fade> aquatix: Not many other options ;)
Nov 11 14:53:25 <Stskeeps> .nl has a naval fleet? :P houseboats? :P
Nov 11 14:53:41 <aquatix> X-Fade: ;)
Nov 11 14:53:48 <aquatix> Stskeeps: ghehehe
Nov 11 14:54:00 * aquatix looks at a submarine in the drydock
Nov 11 14:54:26 <disco_stu> aquatix: i u take a pic of some choppers you could share them with me
Nov 11 14:54:37 * aquatix isn't allowed to
Nov 11 14:54:48 <disco_stu> noone should see ya
Nov 11 14:54:56 <aquatix> still :)
Nov 11 14:55:06 <aquatix> besides, my n810 makes shitty pics ;)
Nov 11 14:55:30 <Stskeeps> "where's your tablet today?" "sitting in .nl's first nuclear bomb"
Nov 11 14:55:42 <aquatix> ghehe
Nov 11 14:56:00 <aquatix> `oh, it's powering our new submarine. why?'
Nov 11 14:57:01 <Meizirkki> Xorg still won't start: 0: /usr/bin/X11/X(xf86SigHandler+0x70) [0x7dcbc]
Nov 11 14:57:12 <Stskeeps> ln -s /dev/fb0 /dev/fb
Nov 11 14:58:54 <Meizirkki> thanks
Nov 11 14:59:20 * Stskeeps heads home
Nov 11 14:59:41 <Meizirkki> i done it before my first try, but noe i did it again and worked
Nov 11 15:00:59 <Meizirkki> Touchscreen and D-pad does not work :(
Nov 11 15:06:53 <Meizirkki> i need to do ln -s /dev/fb0 /dev/fb every time i reboot?
Nov 11 15:09:01 <hahlobit> i have noticed too that tablets doesn't like rebooting.
Nov 11 15:11:16 <Meizirkki> ubuntu-mobile runs directly :)
Nov 11 15:11:21 <hahlobit> maybe they are  evil cause permissions goes 666 when reboot :)
Nov 11 15:11:32 <Meizirkki> at least somehow
Nov 11 15:11:41 <Meizirkki> :)
Nov 11 15:19:11 <Meizirkki> Is there some script that runs before xorg, wehre i could add "ln -s /dev/fb0 /dev/fb"
Nov 11 15:45:31 <Stskeeps> Meizirkki: pic?
Nov 11 15:45:37 <Stskeeps> it actually works?
Nov 11 15:46:02 <Meizirkki> I can see that top-panel
Nov 11 15:46:07 <Meizirkki> like in chroot
Nov 11 15:46:18 <Stskeeps> woo, screenshot is in order i guess :P
Nov 11 15:46:31 <Meizirkki> trying to make mobile-basic-flash work
Nov 11 15:46:36 <Stskeeps> apt-get install imagemagick, import -window root img.png i think
Nov 11 15:47:17 <Meizirkki> adobe-flash player gives me /usr/lib/browser/plugins/libflashplayer.so
Nov 11 15:47:27 <Meizirkki> does it work?
Nov 11 15:47:49 <Meizirkki> ln -s it to xulrunners plugins
Nov 11 15:47:52 <Stskeeps> hmm.
Nov 11 15:47:58 <Stskeeps> do you have the gtk version we have?
Nov 11 15:48:02 <Meizirkki> i tried, but it seemed to not work
Nov 11 15:48:16 <Meizirkki> just basic mojos thing
Nov 11 15:48:19 <Meizirkki> s
Nov 11 15:48:30 <Stskeeps> k
Nov 11 15:48:41 <Stskeeps> else you need the libdebletflashplayer.so thing
Nov 11 15:48:49 <Meizirkki> deblet-flashplayer did not give me that
Nov 11 15:48:53 <Stskeeps> i know
Nov 11 15:49:29 <Stskeeps> basically libflashplayer requires some things that are only in the maemo GTK, afaik, and some other libs, and libdebletflashplayer.so is a hack that makes it think it is in that environment
Nov 11 15:50:38 <Meizirkki> ok
Nov 11 15:51:09 <Stskeeps> but its kinda a difficult hack
Nov 11 15:51:17 <Stskeeps> i would love a screenshot of U-m running, even just with top bar
Nov 11 15:51:31 <Meizirkki> so, installing your gtk would help?
Nov 11 15:51:48 <Stskeeps> possibly, yeah
Nov 11 15:52:02 <Meizirkki> gonna try... :)
Nov 11 15:52:03 <Stskeeps> there was some other thing too but i cant recall off hand
Nov 11 15:53:17 <ron1n> hey guys
Nov 11 15:53:47 <ron1n> do we know anything about a 'next gen' or 9 series nokia internet tablet?, I'm holding out on buying one
Nov 11 15:54:01 <Stskeeps> not a certain date but we do know some things about it
Nov 11 15:54:05 <Meizirkki_n810> Stskeeps: sorry, there is one thing wrong in my DUN guide
Nov 11 15:54:12 <ron1n> Stskeeps, thanks
Nov 11 15:54:12 <Stskeeps> Meizirkki_n810: mm?
Nov 11 15:54:35 <Meizirkki_n810> in /etc/ppp/peers/mobile file
Nov 11 15:54:37 <Stskeeps> ron1n: but not anything like form factor, look, etc
Nov 11 15:54:43 <Stskeeps> Meizirkki_n810: lemme just add you to the user file
Nov 11 15:54:43 <Stskeeps> sec
Nov 11 15:54:53 <ron1n> I bought a 770 a few years ago, and then nokia goes and comes out with the n800 -_-
Nov 11 15:55:49 <mgedmin> ron1n: expect one no sooner than middle of next year
Nov 11 15:55:52 <Meizirkki_n810> ok
Nov 11 15:56:05 <mgedmin> but it'll have 3d
Nov 11 15:56:40 <ron1n> mgedmin, awesome
Nov 11 15:59:04 <RST38h> And it will run WinXP^H^H^Hsorry
Nov 11 15:59:17 <GAN800> lcuk, 3x faster. More if we get more RAM.
Nov 11 16:00:44 <X-Fade> GAN800: Not counting the multimedia extensions/accelerators, which would help more.
Nov 11 16:00:46 <Meizirkki> How can i edit deblet wiki after logging in?
Nov 11 16:00:51 <Meizirkki> Stskeeps:
Nov 11 16:01:43 <Meizirkki> Found it :)
Nov 11 16:02:07 <GAN800> X-Fade, sure, specific cases like with NEON and video will be more insane.
Nov 11 16:02:53 * Jaffa bingles mvo with some magic fairy dust
Nov 11 16:03:08 <X-Fade> GAN800: http://maemo.org/profile/list/category/mediawiki_edits/ :)
Nov 11 16:03:22 <X-Fade> GAN800: Will fill in the upcoming days of course..
Nov 11 16:03:38 <X-Fade> But that will probably give you a big boost.
Nov 11 16:04:32 <GAN800> X-Fade, what's the modifier?
Nov 11 16:04:55 <X-Fade> GAN800: sqrt(edits > 50 chars)
Nov 11 16:05:53 <Stskeeps> we should have a line count from irc counting in karma too
Nov 11 16:05:53 <Jaffa> X-Fade: btw, just looking at the URL reminded me: I keep thinking there should be a "by total" in the sort list
Nov 11 16:06:01 <Stskeeps> i'd definately be a karma whore then
Nov 11 16:06:21 <Jaffa> Stskeeps: it's been discussed. I'm in favour of it, but I dunno if anyone's working on it.
Nov 11 16:06:39 <X-Fade> Jaffa: Which point to /profile/list/ ?
Nov 11 16:06:42 <Stskeeps> yeah, but difficult to use for anything really
Nov 11 16:07:01 <w00t_> Stskeeps: you're always a karma whore
Nov 11 16:07:22 <Jaffa> X-Fade: correct
Nov 11 16:07:37 <Jaffa> X-Fade: you can do it from the breadcrumb trail, but I always double-take
Nov 11 16:08:00 <X-Fade> Yeah, let's see if I can do that.
Nov 11 16:08:24 <X-Fade> It currenly uses a list of plugins. But the total list is no plugin. So..
Nov 11 16:08:29 <Stskeeps> w00t_: you mean you've always been
Nov 11 16:08:31 <X-Fade> Some hacking is probably needed..
Nov 11 16:18:35 <Stskeeps> GAN800: do you get absolutely spammed by my reconstructedPOC stuff? not sure how much other people see
Nov 11 16:23:08 <GAN800> On Jaiku you mean?
Nov 11 16:23:10 <GAN800> No
Nov 11 16:23:28 <Stskeeps> good
Nov 11 16:23:43 <GAN800> X-Fade, so I have about 900 'useful' edits out of 1200, which will net me 30 karma.
Nov 11 16:23:45 <Stskeeps> was worried cos there was a lot of activity on the channel :)
Nov 11 16:24:51 <Stskeeps> Meizirkki: any luck with screenshots?
Nov 11 16:25:05 <X-Fade> GAN800: I see 1143 edits for you now.
Nov 11 16:25:24 <Meizirkki_n810> wait
Nov 11 16:25:37 <GAN800> X-Fade, that are ove 50 chars?
Nov 11 16:25:45 <X-Fade> GAN800: Yes.
Nov 11 16:25:48 <Meizirkki_n810> i'll first try to get flash working
Nov 11 16:25:57 <Meizirkki_n810> with maemos gtk:s
Nov 11 16:26:13 <X-Fade> GAN800: Ah and modifier is * 2, btw.
Nov 11 16:26:30 <X-Fade> GAN800: So that will be 66 karma for you..
Nov 11 16:26:49 <Stskeeps> Meizirkki_n810: alright
Nov 11 16:27:13 <X-Fade> But we can discuss the weight ofcourse...
Nov 11 16:27:57 <GAN800> Leave it for when we overhaul all of the modifiers
Nov 11 16:28:10 <GAN800> I'll poke at dneary's proposal later this weel.
Nov 11 16:28:14 <X-Fade> Yeah, that will be corrected probably..
Nov 11 16:28:16 <bergie> GAN800: Hirvinen is working on that right now
Nov 11 16:28:18 <GAN800> s/weel/week/
Nov 11 16:28:19 <infobot> GAN800 meant: I'll poke at dneary's proposal later this week.
Nov 11 16:28:29 <bergie> so the earlier you can poke it the better
Nov 11 16:28:39 <lcuk> thanks GAN800 :)
Nov 11 16:28:54 <X-Fade> bergie: I think there need to be discussions first, so don't expect quick answers.
Nov 11 16:29:17 <bergie> X-Fade: oh... I though the points there were the things to implement this Sprint
Nov 11 16:30:02 <X-Fade> bergie: No?
Nov 11 16:30:08 <GAN800> bergie, that's only dneary's list.
Nov 11 16:30:28 <X-Fade> bergie: I see karma for applications and detaching thumbs down from karma.
Nov 11 16:31:34 <X-Fade> https://wiki.maemo.org/Karma#Proposed_improvements is still under discussion.
Nov 11 16:32:07 <GAN800> Should probably be pushed to a task
Nov 11 16:32:22 <X-Fade> Yes, I think so.
Nov 11 16:34:21 <bergie> ok... dneary was talking about "detaching thumbs down" and the proposed improvements at same time, so I though they were both to be implemented now
Nov 11 16:35:38 <GAN800> #3767 is valid and can be fixed
Nov 11 16:35:52 <GAN800> But all the modifiers still need to be discussed.
Nov 11 16:36:08 <crashanddie> GAN800: hey, can you give me some advice?
Nov 11 16:36:26 <bergie> well, we can play with the modifiers... the recount is only 48h anyway
Nov 11 16:37:10 <GAN800> crashanddie, depends. :P
Nov 11 16:37:15 <crashanddie> Anyone know of a embedded device (possibly n800 or n810, but other options would be nice) that plays nicely with RFID readers? I saw the video on YouTube about the n800 reading tags, but the n800 is quite hard to get by these days (in large quantities)
Nov 11 16:37:38 <crashanddie> This would be for a medium sized projet (between 30 and 100 units)
Nov 11 16:37:48 <lardman> qwerty12: you about?
Nov 11 16:37:51 <Hirvinen> a question about proposed karma improvements: from the wiki page: "Discussion: Modify discussion points to be scored as 2 * sqrt(# posts)" <- should that be (sign of good_posts + bad_post_modifier * bad_posts) 2 * sqrt(abs(good_posts - bad_post_modifier * bad_posts)) ?
Nov 11 16:37:57 <qwerty12> lardman, yeah
Nov 11 16:38:07 <crashanddie> Hey Q, wassup bro?
Nov 11 16:38:12 <lardman> qwerty12: which SDK version were you using to compile Qalculate! ?
Nov 11 16:38:15 <GAN800> Find a reader that works reliably with Linux and go from there?
Nov 11 16:38:29 <qwerty12> wag1 crashanddie, I'm good here, how about you? :)
Nov 11 16:38:32 <X-Fade> Hirvinen: thumbs down should not give negative karma. That is all for now..
Nov 11 16:38:39 <qwerty12> lardman, 4.1.1 iirc
Nov 11 16:38:43 <GAN800> WinMob seems like it might require less work to get going, though.
Nov 11 16:38:44 <crashanddie> qwerty12: good good, job and everything :)
Nov 11 16:38:59 <qwerty12> heh, good to hear :)
Nov 11 16:39:00 <Hirvinen> X-Fade: ok
Nov 11 16:39:23 <X-Fade> Hirvinen: Other things need discussion first. And probably pretty heated ;)
Nov 11 16:39:37 <crashanddie> GAN800: well, it's for a student project, and the students are mostly trained to work with Linux (my old school, one of the last bastions of free developers)
Nov 11 16:40:28 <crashanddie> so when I heard about it, I thought about the n800 immediately... Though it's for a university, so I'd like to think in terms of costs as well (and well, a uni has a bit of problems ordering 30 individual units on ebay)
Nov 11 16:40:36 <Hirvinen> X-Fade: Are there parts of karma changes that are agreed upon?
Nov 11 16:41:00 <X-Fade> Hirvinen: No, only this one and that we need karma for applications.
Nov 11 16:41:09 <bergie> Hirvinen: only the one in that bug entry
Nov 11 16:41:44 <lardman> I still think bad posts/bad blogs should reduce that section to 0 (and no lower)
Nov 11 16:42:28 <X-Fade> lardman: Yes, that seems fair.
Nov 11 16:42:30 <GAN800> lardman, per-post zero, not per-section
Nov 11 16:42:54 <X-Fade> Well, yeah if you mess up one time you don't need to be punished too much.
Nov 11 16:43:07 <X-Fade> But if you mess up every time, you will stay at zero.
Nov 11 16:43:11 <mikkov_> aret
Nov 11 16:43:14 <mikkov_> hmm
Nov 11 16:43:24 <GAN800> thoughtfix shouldn't not receive any karma for his timeline and interview posts just because people really hate some of his iPhone and UI posts.
Nov 11 16:43:28 <lardman> GAN800: per section
Nov 11 16:43:35 <GAN800> per-post
Nov 11 16:43:58 <GAN800> The problem is 'bad' doesn't mean anything
Nov 11 16:43:59 <mikkov_> are those karma lists sorted by comments, favourites etc supposed to work?
Nov 11 16:44:02 <lardman> in which case it doesn't disuade people from posting rubbish
Nov 11 16:44:22 <bergie> mikkov_: yep... but unfortunately sometimes the DB server timeouts
Nov 11 16:44:24 <GAN800> It's often more about the groupthink not agreeing with your opinions
Nov 11 16:44:35 <X-Fade> mikkov_: Try again in the morning :D
Nov 11 16:45:07 <GAN800> lardman, clearly if it really becomes an issue it can be addressed to a poster directly.
Nov 11 16:46:06 <X-Fade> lardman: We can always remove a bad author from the planet. Which will do the same..
Nov 11 16:46:20 <lardman> yeah, that's not quite what I mean though
Nov 11 16:46:35 <lardman> if people repeatedly post off topic, their overall blogging karma should be reduced
Nov 11 16:46:41 <GAN800> thumbers are too unfair
Nov 11 16:46:58 <lardman> yes, but I don't think people have abused them have they?
Nov 11 16:47:08 <GAN800> But what if they just say interesting, on-topic, but unpopular things?
Nov 11 16:47:15 <GAN800> Sure they have
Nov 11 16:47:25 <GAN800> Hell, I have. ;)
Nov 11 16:47:26 <X-Fade> Maybe we need a top 10 thumb downers ;)
Nov 11 16:47:26 * lardman still wonders how his ~220 ml posts produce 38 karmas
Nov 11 16:47:41 <X-Fade> Publicly visible..
Nov 11 16:47:58 <X-Fade> lardman: -community isn't counted yet.
Nov 11 16:47:58 <lardman> list people who give a thumb either way
Nov 11 16:48:15 <lardman> X-Fade: yeah, that's not many of my posts though, -dev's the main one
Nov 11 16:48:35 <X-Fade> Yeah, but the forum import is broken atm.
Nov 11 16:48:45 <X-Fade> It is not parsing all mails correctly.
Nov 11 16:48:57 <lardman> fair enough
Nov 11 16:49:00 <X-Fade> So your account isn't attachted to all of them..
Nov 11 16:49:27 <lardman> don't worry :)
Nov 11 16:49:49 <X-Fade> One day...
Nov 11 16:49:49 <Jaffa> lardman: as long as it's sorted before cheap N900s start getting given out, eh? ;-)
Nov 11 16:50:28 <lardman> Jaffa: I'm not too concerned about that either, just that it should be right if it's being done
Nov 11 16:50:32 <X-Fade> Jaffa: I think lardman will be recognized without karma too..
Nov 11 16:50:48 <Jaffa> X-Fade: one would hope
Nov 11 16:50:56 <X-Fade> bbl, dinner.
Nov 11 16:51:15 <lardman> Don't worry, with all my complaining about karma I';m sure I will be, probably in the wrong direction mind you! ;)
Nov 11 16:52:29 <jagernot> hi im working on a synth (some of u know)..i use esound for sound generation and gdk for ui... result here: http://www.poojyum.com/h
Nov 11 16:52:51 <jagernot> the trouble is i cant update the ui as i play the instrument
Nov 11 16:53:01 <jagernot> i can but audio drops
Nov 11 16:53:36 <Stskeeps> threading maybe?
Nov 11 16:53:53 <jagernot> i am threading the audio
Nov 11 17:01:12 <lardman> argh, what do I add to sources.list to add the Extras repo?
Nov 11 17:01:30 <lardman> as you can see, /me would have to do quite a bit of debian packaging learning ;)
Nov 11 17:02:24 <qwerty12> lardman, http://wiki.maemo.org/Uploading_to_Extras#Setting_up_Scratchbox_to_use_the_extras_repository :P
Nov 11 17:02:26 <Meizirkki_n810> Damn, pellet truck arrived... tookna lot of time...
Nov 11 17:02:59 <qwerty12> lardman, I have to remind myself to update the Build-Depends everytime I add a library...
Nov 11 17:03:52 <lardman> thanks
Nov 11 17:05:33 <lardman> I just tried to update my diablo SDK install and it's pulling from maemo4.1, rather than maemo4.1.1
Nov 11 17:05:53 <lardman> is that expected behaviour?
Nov 11 17:05:54 <Meizirkki_n810> Stskeeps: i screwed my hasty agn
Nov 11 17:06:27 <Stskeeps> Meizirkki_n810: hehe.. happens
Nov 11 17:07:00 <RST38h> lardman: may depend on your linux
Nov 11 17:07:27 <Meizirkki_n810> i tried to install all packages on /stskeeps and now apt-get naggs about missing depends, and apt-get install -f wants to remove evrything i have installed so far
Nov 11 17:07:44 <RST38h> do check if the repo for your linux flavor contains 4.1.1
Nov 11 17:08:15 <lardman> yep it does
Nov 11 17:08:41 <lardman> http://repository.maemo.org/pool/maemo4.1.1
Nov 11 17:10:28 <Meizirkki_n810> Stskeeps: when i boot directly to ubuntu mobile it looks pixel-to-pixel same than the screenshot i took when using u-m first time in chroot
Nov 11 17:10:31 <RST38h> try apt-get update then apt-get upgrade and see what keeps it back
Nov 11 17:10:34 <Stskeeps> Meizirkki_n810: good
Nov 11 17:11:35 <Meizirkki_n810> anything i tell apt-get to do, returns with incorrect depends messages
Nov 11 17:11:46 <Stskeeps> Meizirkki_n810: feel free to link scrshot on the jaiku saying this ran like this
Nov 11 17:11:48 <lardman> RST38h: I did that, nothing kept it back, it just doesn't decide to upgrade the url
Nov 11 17:12:00 <RST38h> hmmm
Nov 11 17:12:01 <lardman> RST38h: will try again after my build has finished
Nov 11 17:12:05 <Stskeeps> Meizirkki_n810: apt-get -f install might help
Nov 11 17:12:30 <RST38h> maybe a typo in the sources file?
Nov 11 17:12:47 <Meizirkki_n810> apt-get -f install suggests removing all these u-m and other packages...
Nov 11 17:12:52 <lardman> no, that's what I mean, it lists maemo4.1 in the sources file
Nov 11 17:13:00 <lardman> I'd expected it to change that to maemo4.1.1
Nov 11 17:13:35 <Stskeeps> Meizirkki_n810: yeah.. i suspected the maemo gtk might blow some things up
Nov 11 17:13:36 <RST38h> maybe its just not that smart?:)
Nov 11 17:13:54 <lardman> RST38h: yeah, will have to look at how to upgrade in the correct way eventually :)
Nov 11 17:14:00 <Stskeeps> Meizirkki_n810: give me a pastebin of the errors about apt-geti nstall something
Nov 11 17:14:08 <Meizirkki_n810> ok
Nov 11 17:16:51 <Meizirkki_n810> Stskeeps: V
Nov 11 17:16:54 <Meizirkki_n810> http://pastebin.com/d11a87163
Nov 11 17:16:56 <Meizirkki_n810> sry
Nov 11 17:18:40 <Meizirkki_n810> I'll try apt-get -f install even if it removes something
Nov 11 17:18:51 <lardman> qwerty12: you have any issues compiling libgmp?
Nov 11 17:19:14 <qwerty12> lardman, I can't remember properly but I think I did
Nov 11 17:19:54 <lardman> rubbish C++
Nov 11 17:20:44 <Stskeeps> Meizirkki_n810: thanks, please edit it on the wiki and make a note in jaiku about this
Nov 11 17:20:51 <Stskeeps> since it's an instance of maemo gtk messing up things
Nov 11 17:21:03 <Stskeeps> (put the exact error somewhere and link to it)
Nov 11 17:21:11 <Stskeeps> pastebins arent forever so
Nov 11 17:21:22 <Meizirkki_n810> ok
Nov 11 17:21:54 <lardman> qwerty12: apparently an issue which has been fixed in GCC4.x.x
Nov 11 17:22:28 <qwerty12> lardman, hrm, i'll set up an cs2008 toolchain later
Nov 11 17:29:25 <Meizirkki_n810> Stskeeps: these confilicts might be nto about meno GTK, maybe i got errors because i tried to install all packages you have upladed so far, and some of them have missing dependacies?
Nov 11 17:29:50 <Meizirkki_n810> *might to be about maemo...
Nov 11 17:30:03 <Meizirkki_n810> so much typos =P
Nov 11 17:31:21 <Stskeeps> Meizirkki_n810: one of the reasons is probably osso-gnomevfs2
Nov 11 17:31:26 <Stskeeps> that blows up UM definately
Nov 11 17:31:51 <Stskeeps> stick with the maemo gtk for now instead of everything else
Nov 11 17:31:55 <Stskeeps> you would get a better result
Nov 11 17:32:02 <lardman> qwerty12: were you using the SDK+ sdk by chance?
Nov 11 17:32:12 <lardman> qwerty12: iirc that has gcc 4.x.x on it
Nov 11 17:32:12 <qwerty12> lardman, never...
Nov 11 17:32:26 <lardman> oh, ok
Nov 11 17:33:07 <derf> Getting the cs2008 toolchain up and running wasn't hard.
Nov 11 17:33:16 <derf> It took up 2GB of disk space for no apparent reason, but it wasn't hard.
Nov 11 17:33:28 <lardman> is that GCC 4?
Nov 11 17:33:31 <derf> Yes.
Nov 11 17:33:33 <Stskeeps> Meizirkki_n810: but in any degree any problems you run into are important to microdocument, cos we will definately deal with them later
Nov 11 17:33:36 <lardman> ah, ok
Nov 11 17:33:43 <derf> You need it for the qrcode stuff.
Nov 11 17:33:52 <derf> gcc 3.x has way too many compiler bugs.
Nov 11 17:33:57 <lardman> right-ho
Nov 11 17:34:01 <lardman> yeah
Nov 11 17:35:40 <derf> Actually, I guess I used cs2007q3, which was also gcc 4.x.
Nov 11 17:36:49 <lardman> I may as well use OE to build it then really
Nov 11 17:38:11 <Meizirkki_n810> ok
Nov 11 17:42:06 <lardman> hmm, or not, doesn't appear to be in the metadata
Nov 11 17:48:12 <GAN800> Can anybody with some language experience look over the list of categories and start generating l10n?
Nov 11 17:48:33 <GAN800> I have a feeling Nokia may take forever to do the translation.
Nov 11 17:48:51 <lardman> stick them on the wiki and let people suggest I suggest
Nov 11 17:49:15 <Meizirkki> Stskeeps: done
Nov 11 17:52:44 <lardman> GAN800: can we add an extra section to the wiki page with a table of names + column for each translation?
Nov 11 17:56:46 <Jaffa> lardman: how's your mediawiki syntax? ;-)
Nov 11 17:57:02 <Jaffa> Bah, going to be another night tonight whe re I don't get home until gone 11pm
Nov 11 17:57:10 <lardman> not very good, and I don';t have the email to hand either
Nov 11 17:57:38 <lardman> Jaffa: I've just had two nights where I did get home, but just kept on going till I went to bed
Nov 11 17:57:47 <lardman> s/going/working
Nov 11 17:58:03 <Jaffa> doh
Nov 11 17:58:58 * Jaffa better damn well get a payrise (hmm) and a promotion (yay, more perks) on Saturday... or else
Nov 11 17:59:30 <gomiam> (Southpark mode) "or else?" Jaffa: "Exactly!"
Nov 11 17:59:31 <gomiam> ;-)
Nov 11 18:00:05 <lardman> is that where "perk"=="working late more often"? ;)
Nov 11 18:00:59 <gomiam> lardman: that depends on your home situation :-)
Nov 11 18:02:15 <Meizirkki> Stskeeps: are you going to switch to armv6el release soon? =)
Nov 11 18:02:33 <lardman> gomiam: :)
Nov 11 18:03:20 <Stskeeps> Meizirkki: when i get the installer and repo going, yeah
Nov 11 18:03:36 <Stskeeps> but the issue is that i cross-compile on a qemu that doesnt seem to like vfp, oddly enough
Nov 11 18:03:46 <Meizirkki> ok
Nov 11 18:03:55 <GAN800> lardman, the table's on the wiki.
Nov 11 18:04:39 <lardman> Stskeeps: or have you passed an -mcpu flag too?
Nov 11 18:05:32 <lardman> GAN800: ok
Nov 11 18:05:39 <Stskeeps> lardman: debootstrap died so :P
Nov 11 18:05:44 <GAN800> Jaffa, I suspect we'll want an English l10n before any others.
Nov 11 18:05:45 <Stskeeps> wasn't really much to do to get a rootstrap
Nov 11 18:05:48 <Stskeeps> to chroot into
Nov 11 18:07:33 <ron1n> anyone try to get armedslack on an internet tablet?
Nov 11 18:08:09 <lardman> GAN800: so you ok with my adding a table with multiple rows to that page then? (assuming I can work out how of course...)
Nov 11 18:08:33 <Stskeeps> ron1n: there was a blog of some guy going insane over it..
Nov 11 18:08:40 <Stskeeps> or was that gentoo..
Nov 11 18:09:48 <GAN800> lardman, https://wiki.maem.org/Task:Package_categories#Translations
Nov 11 18:10:55 <lardman> cool
Nov 11 18:11:01 <Stskeeps> ron1n: think most active alternative OS'es are mamona, deblet, and this strange thing we're doing in here
Nov 11 18:11:35 <GAN800> Stskeeps, Dr. Frankenstein
Nov 11 18:11:39 <ron1n> Stskeeps, thanks
Nov 11 18:11:51 <Stskeeps> GAN800: Maemo "Frankenstein"
Nov 11 18:11:52 <Stskeeps> i like that
Nov 11 18:11:53 <Stskeeps> :P
Nov 11 18:12:38 <Stskeeps> .. but i'm more of a dr jekyll and mr hyde really
Nov 11 18:12:39 <Stskeeps> :P
Nov 11 18:12:57 <Meizirkki> Stskeeps: where can i get libdebletflashplayer.so?
Nov 11 18:13:29 <GAN800> Can somebody provide a quick translation for that table?
Nov 11 18:14:05 <Jaffa> lardman: Company car or car allowance.
Nov 11 18:14:08 <lardman> right, I added columns
Nov 11 18:14:14 <lardman> Jaffa: ah, not so bad then
Nov 11 18:14:18 * Jaffa has his eye on a nice shiny new fast VW Scirocco.
Nov 11 18:14:31 <lardman> Aston Martin?
Nov 11 18:14:38 <Jaffa> Doubtful
Nov 11 18:14:42 <lardman> :D
Nov 11 18:14:47 <Stskeeps> Programming and not Development? :P
Nov 11 18:15:01 <Jaffa> GAN800: I think I've been persuaded of "Sound & Video" for user/multimedia.
Nov 11 18:15:02 <lardman> Development has many menaings
Nov 11 18:15:09 <Jaffa> Indeed.
Nov 11 18:15:13 <Stskeeps> mm
Nov 11 18:15:18 * lardman is happy with Multimedia, it's well known
Nov 11 18:15:30 <Jaffa> lardman: Fair enough. I'm equally happy with either.
Nov 11 18:15:31 <GAN800> Jaffa, change it if you want. ;)
Nov 11 18:15:40 <Jaffa> GAN800: was trying to build consensus ;)
Nov 11 18:15:57 * GAN800 has no opinion
Nov 11 18:16:16 <Stskeeps> and Desktop is ambigious, what does it cover?
Nov 11 18:16:25 <Stskeeps> it would be easier to translate if the justifications for the name was there
Nov 11 18:16:26 <Stskeeps> :P
Nov 11 18:16:27 * Jaffa is ambivalent. And lardman is pro "Multimedia". So I'm fine.
Nov 11 18:16:39 <Jaffa> Stskeeps: scroll up about 400 px ;-p
Nov 11 18:16:42 <lardman> Stskeeps: stuff to go on the desktop - applets
Nov 11 18:16:43 <Stskeeps> ar
Nov 11 18:16:45 <GAN800> Desktop is applets
Nov 11 18:17:24 <GAN800> Interestingly Apple just has 'Music'
Nov 11 18:17:51 <GAN800> and just 'Navigation' for the location stuff.
Nov 11 18:18:04 * Stskeeps dislikes the "desktop" metafor for a tablet home screen for some reason, but that's a personal 
Nov 11 18:18:15 <lardman> GAN800: do you want to reply to Marius' email to ask people to add their translations here? If I reply I'll lose the threading as I don't have the original here
Nov 11 18:18:49 * GAN800 pulls up gmail
Nov 11 18:19:22 * lardman wonders who will do the All and Other translations?
Nov 11 18:19:35 <Stskeeps> why user/development and then Programming?
Nov 11 18:19:41 <Stskeeps> that's slightly confusing :P
Nov 11 18:19:46 <lardman> Stskeeps: just 'cos
Nov 11 18:20:09 <lardman> Stskeeps: you'll never see the user/development unless you develop; if you're an end user it's ambigous
Nov 11 18:20:11 <GAN800> Packagers know what 'development' is
Nov 11 18:20:36 <lardman> getting a company car?
Nov 11 18:21:20 <ron1n> why do debian packages from ARM have arm in the package name, and deblet packages have armel in the package name?
Nov 11 18:21:44 <Stskeeps> ron1n: debian has armel too
Nov 11 18:21:55 <Stskeeps> 'arm' is getting taken out the back and shot eventually afaik
Nov 11 18:22:04 <ron1n> Stskeeps, is armel significantly different from arm?
Nov 11 18:22:09 <Stskeeps> ABI-wise afaik
Nov 11 18:22:10 <Stskeeps> sec
Nov 11 18:22:17 <Stskeeps> gotta finish this translation first
Nov 11 18:22:22 <ron1n> mhmm
Nov 11 18:23:05 <lardman> ron1n: http://wiki.debian.org/ArmEabiPort
Nov 11 18:23:17 <ron1n> lardman, thanks
Nov 11 18:23:24 <lardman> np
Nov 11 18:23:43 <Meizirkki> ronln: arm packages in debian repos are for armv3 and they don't work on tablets
Nov 11 18:24:08 <ron1n> I'm really taking intrest in getting uladulteraded slackware (armedslack as I hear is) on a tablet
Nov 11 18:24:13 <lardman> they used to work on the 770 though before the abi change
Nov 11 18:24:15 <ron1n> Meizirkki, I see
Nov 11 18:24:40 <ron1n> lardman, I remember that from when I still had my 770, thats why I'm a bit confused
Nov 11 18:25:25 <lardman> yeah, have a read of that url, should explain it all - eabi is far better for all except keeping compatible
Nov 11 18:25:46 <ron1n> the TI omap series is just the processor that is used with the eabi arch, correct?
Nov 11 18:25:51 <lardman> especially good for the n8x0 as it moved to vfp as default fp format, away from the awful fpa
Nov 11 18:25:57 * Stskeeps contributes a danish translation for sections
Nov 11 18:26:10 <Stskeeps> even though they probably need verification
Nov 11 18:26:13 <lardman> ron1n: yes, it could run the old abi
Nov 11 18:26:49 <lardman> Stskeeps: cool, thanks
Nov 11 18:26:59 <ron1n> so eabi is the new evolution in arm, got it
Nov 11 18:27:10 <ron1n> I just need to see if armedslack is eabi ready
Nov 11 18:27:21 * lardman heads to grab a beer while cln compiles....
Nov 11 18:28:16 <GAN800> lardman, replied.
Nov 11 18:30:03 <Stskeeps> ron1n: if you want to get it running on tablet, use the deblet boot basics and friends scripts, they're all open source and in svn on deblet home page
Nov 11 18:30:16 <Stskeeps> will save you a lot of time and headache
Nov 11 18:31:06 <Stskeeps> but, you will probably run into same problem as everyone else - power usage
Nov 11 18:31:06 <rafiks> got error installing deblet installer
Nov 11 18:31:23 <Stskeeps> not impossible
Nov 11 18:31:26 <Stskeeps> but which?
Nov 11 18:31:59 <rafiks> unable to installs
Nov 11 18:32:08 <Stskeeps> that's a bit vague :P
Nov 11 18:32:09 <rafiks> ,,.
Nov 11 18:32:25 <rafiks> is te
Nov 11 18:32:25 * Stskeeps goes back to building stuff
Nov 11 18:32:35 <rafiks> The
Nov 11 18:33:24 <rafiks> is there a bug on the package?
Nov 11 18:34:05 <rafiks> I have an n800 w/os2008..
Nov 11 18:34:29 <Stskeeps> do you have extras enabled?
Nov 11 18:34:43 <Stskeeps> and i dunno if there's a bug.. look in application manager log
Nov 11 18:34:53 <rafiks> yes,i think
Nov 11 18:36:11 <Stskeeps> Meizirkki_n810: my bootstrap.tar.gz seriously wrote a debootstrap on top of meamo? :P
Nov 11 18:36:17 <Stskeeps> (reading bug reports)
Nov 11 18:36:45 <Meizirkki_n810> i think so, but i am not sure
Nov 11 18:37:09 <Stskeeps> k
Nov 11 18:38:20 <Meizirkki_n810> installer gave some error, then i wanted to try debootstrapping manuallu
Nov 11 18:38:40 <Meizirkki_n810> but the terminal has gone crazy
Nov 11 18:38:41 <rafiks> just looked @ d log,apparently it doesn't like easy deb package,are this 2 the same?
Nov 11 18:39:10 <Stskeeps> no, but it may conflict heavily
Nov 11 18:39:17 <Meizirkki_n810> Stskeeps, i am sure it was the installer..
Nov 11 18:39:30 <Stskeeps> can you copy-paste the log to me, rafiks?
Nov 11 18:39:32 <Stskeeps> Meizirkki_n810: alright, :P
Nov 11 18:39:44 <Stskeeps> that was probably that night i was drunk and coding on it..
Nov 11 18:41:22 <rafiks> Stskeeps: wiil do .
Nov 11 18:44:37 <MakeGho> oh my... Fennec is so heavy and slow that it's not a clever choice, at least yet.
Nov 11 18:45:36 <Meizirkki> Stskeeps: can you give me direct link to libdebletflashplayer.so I did not find it from trunk
Nov 11 18:46:42 <Stskeeps> http://trac.tspre.org/projects/deblet/export/6/trunk/nit-base-packages/debian-flashplayer/usr/lib/browser/plugins/libdebianflashplayer.so
Nov 11 18:46:52 <Meizirkki> thanks
Nov 11 18:47:05 <Meizirkki> i was looking from the wrong place :)
Nov 11 18:47:13 <GAN800> MakeGho, it's just barely an alpha release.
Nov 11 18:47:34 <Stskeeps> try Tear or something instead, MakeGho
Nov 11 18:50:21 <MakeGho> GAN800: I know :) But I'm wondering because some sources said it to be "six times faster"
Nov 11 18:50:27 <rafiks> Stskeeps: http://pastebin.com/m6de839fa
Nov 11 18:50:47 <GAN800> MakeGho, that was only one js benchmael
Nov 11 18:50:52 <GAN800> s/mael/marl
Nov 11 18:50:55 <GAN800> marj
Nov 11 18:50:59 <GAN800> good lord
Nov 11 18:51:02 <GAN800> mark
Nov 11 18:51:18 <MakeGho> oh ok
Nov 11 18:51:33 <GAN800> MakeGho, and that's only because it's based on a newer release of Firefox
Nov 11 18:51:48 <MakeGho> yup
Nov 11 18:51:55 <GAN800> MicroB will get those js improvements eventually, too.
Nov 11 18:53:14 <Stskeeps> rafiks: you should poke qole about that.. we seemingily ended up using same name for our icon
Nov 11 18:54:20 <MakeGho> Stskeeps: What's this thing you're refering to? I can't succeed to find anything useful.
Nov 11 18:55:44 <Stskeeps> MakeGho: http://internettablettalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=24293&highlight=tear
Nov 11 18:55:49 <rafiks> Stskeeps: qole's not here is he?
Nov 11 18:56:57 <Stskeeps> rafiks: nop, he's on itt, solution is uninstall easy debian for you, it's unintentional we share same icon filename and path..
Nov 11 18:58:30 <ron1n> does the ARM kernel have its own home like the x86 kernel resides at kernel.org?
Nov 11 18:59:34 <rafiks> Stskeeps: thanks..will try that.
Nov 11 19:05:47 <||cw> ron1n: kernel.org is THE home for all officially supported arch's
Nov 11 19:06:19 <||cw> ron1n: every platform tends to have their own patches that are not supported by kernel.org though
Nov 11 19:06:20 <ron1n> ||cw, I found the ppc and ps3 ports, hunting for the arm port still
Nov 11 19:06:26 <ron1n> ||cw, I see
Nov 11 19:06:39 <||cw> ppc is arm....
Nov 11 19:06:46 <Stskeeps> wtf. :P
Nov 11 19:06:52 <||cw> well, in source
Nov 11 19:07:02 <Stskeeps> Meizirkki: http://trac.tspre.org/mrrepo/
Nov 11 19:07:04 <||cw> well, it's all just source anyway
Nov 11 19:07:05 <ron1n> I have a lot to learn =P
Nov 11 19:07:26 <||cw> and there are multiple types of arm
Nov 11 19:07:28 <ron1n> I am use=Pd to x86 and that is about it
Nov 11 19:07:29 <||cw> ppc being one of them
Nov 11 19:07:45 <Meizirkki> Stskeeps: You got it up! =P
Nov 11 19:07:47 <Meizirkki> finally
Nov 11 19:07:49 <ron1n> I am used to x86 and thats about it =P***
Nov 11 19:07:55 <||cw> sure... except now x86 is 2 arch's too, with x86-64
Nov 11 19:08:38 <ron1n> yeah, but the 32 bit vs 64bit is the only difference
Nov 11 19:08:55 <ron1n> while looking at ppc and arm, they seem to be very different
Nov 11 19:09:06 * Meizirkki is adding mr-repo to his sources.list
Nov 11 19:09:10 <ron1n> I had no idea they derive from the same source
Nov 11 19:10:26 <Stskeeps> Meizirkki: codename is 'reconstructed' or 'testing', main, non-free and contrib
Nov 11 19:10:35 <Stskeeps> i'll be adding boot packages later tonight
Nov 11 19:10:42 <Meizirkki> ok
Nov 11 19:12:25 <Stskeeps> so we can install easily
Nov 11 19:14:03 <Stskeeps> wb
Nov 11 19:17:43 <Meizirkki> Ubuntu-mobile starts now when i type startx :)
Nov 11 19:18:44 <Stskeeps> woop
Nov 11 19:18:53 <Stskeeps> take a pic, even though it's crap quality
Nov 11 19:18:56 <Stskeeps> it's a nice showoff
Nov 11 19:19:12 <Meizirkki> what about crap quality 3gp video
Nov 11 19:19:20 <Meizirkki> =P
Nov 11 19:19:34 <Stskeeps> pic is better thancrap quality 3gp :P
Nov 11 19:19:43 * ron1n says this topic is relative to his intrests
Nov 11 19:20:08 <Meizirkki> ookay
Nov 11 19:20:16 <Meizirkki> i'll take both :)
Nov 11 19:20:25 <Stskeeps> ron1n: we're doing a proof of concept of http://wiki.maemo.org/Maemo_Reconstructed
Nov 11 19:29:07 <ron1n> Stskeeps, the deblet project uses jaiky instead of twitter!? =P
Nov 11 19:29:11 * ron1n is a big twitter fan
Nov 11 19:29:19 <ron1n> jaiku*
Nov 11 19:31:59 <ron1n> this is awesome, this is what I expected to see when I first purchased my 770 early 2006
Nov 11 19:32:37 <ron1n> I mean, a little app here or a little app there is cool and all, but I really wanted to see the open source community really "run with" the internet tablets
Nov 11 19:32:37 <Stskeeps> ron1n: well this is just a offshoot of the deblet experiences
Nov 11 19:32:44 * RST38h moos evilly
Nov 11 19:33:16 <ron1n> Stskeeps, I understand, I'm speaking of my recent findings with maemo in general
Nov 11 19:33:17 <Stskeeps> and not a nokia project, but something we in community try to do to somewhat prove to nokia this really ought to be the way to go :P
Nov 11 19:33:33 <ron1n> thats what I really wanted to see from the begining
Nov 11 19:34:10 <RST38h> Sts: Looking at your maemo reconstructed wiki page, "or installing a VMware appliance for non-Linux users" is wrong
Nov 11 19:34:28 <RST38h> Sts: it should be a native windows sdk coming in the .msi package
Nov 11 19:35:02 <ron1n> Nokia is a big company. Big companies like open source, but to a point it just isn't practical. Blobs exist everywhere with in OS200x
Nov 11 19:35:15 <Stskeeps> ron1n: it's actually not that bad when you look closer
Nov 11 19:35:23 <RST38h> Sts: Scratch any mentions of eclipse - I don't think anybody but java diehards use this beast
Nov 11 19:35:48 <Stskeeps> RST38h: yet it seems to be used for a variety of different langs
Nov 11 19:36:03 <Stskeeps> RST38h: and the eclipse/etc is input from other sources in this case :P
Nov 11 19:36:05 <ron1n> Stskeeps, when I checked OS2006 out, it was bad. Everything from the wireless, to low level touch screen stuff was a blob
Nov 11 19:36:39 <RST38h> Sts: it *supports* different languages
Nov 11 19:37:00 <RST38h> Sts: But do try to use Eclipse for serious development and you will see why it is not worth the effort
Nov 11 19:37:10 <Stskeeps> RST38h: i'm a bit of a vim/make person
Nov 11 19:37:11 <Stskeeps> :P
Nov 11 19:37:17 <Stskeeps> so i'm not the best to argue in this area
Nov 11 19:37:22 <RST38h> Slow, unstable, has non-standard UI - typical java app
Nov 11 19:37:25 <ron1n> Kdevelope? works nicely
Nov 11 19:37:41 <RST38h> Sts: pico/make here
Nov 11 19:37:54 <Stskeeps> ick pico
Nov 11 19:37:59 <ron1n> RST38h, pico is the way to go for plaintext all the way
Nov 11 19:37:59 <Stskeeps> :P
Nov 11 19:38:07 * Stskeeps is a joe or vim guy
Nov 11 19:38:10 <Stskeeps> depending on what i need to do
Nov 11 19:38:18 <RST38h> joe is probably ok, not much different from pico
Nov 11 19:38:37 <Stskeeps> i grew up on the polypascal editor so it kinda went from there..
Nov 11 19:38:42 <Stskeeps> same shortcut
Nov 11 19:38:43 <ron1n> I'm a firm believer in optionally reading the man page, I really don't feel like flipping through the mah an appn page just to get up and running wit
Nov 11 19:38:43 <Stskeeps> s
Nov 11 19:38:46 * qwerty12_N800 (despite only knowing the basics) is a vim fan :p
Nov 11 19:39:01 <ron1n> qwerty12_N800, vimtutor is the way to go
Nov 11 19:39:09 <ron1n> I mean to use it, I just haven't found the time
Nov 11 19:39:16 <RST38h> anything that does not support arrow keys out of the box is not a real text editor
Nov 11 19:39:33 <ron1n> RST38h, uses something similar
Nov 11 19:40:19 <qwerty12_N800> ron1n, yeah... I just can't bring myself to run it :/
Nov 11 19:40:23 <RST38h> no, "something similar" won't do
Nov 11 19:40:33 <RST38h> If arrow keys do not work, I am not using it
Nov 11 19:57:16 <Stskeeps> Meizirkki_n810: if you get bored.. see if you can compile kernel-diablo natively
Nov 11 19:57:39 <Meizirkki_n810> are you kidding?
Nov 11 19:57:48 <Stskeeps> i said if you got bored ;)
Nov 11 19:58:00 <GAN800> RST38h, can you do an ru_RU translation for https://wiki.maem.org/Task:Package_categories#Translations ?
Nov 11 19:58:14 <Meizirkki_n810> okay, it is the next thing i will try :)
Nov 11 19:58:36 <RST38h> GAN: Depends on how much work it is
Nov 11 19:58:38 <Meizirkki_n810> that kernel tihng
Nov 11 19:58:42 <Meizirkki_n810> *thing
Nov 11 19:59:00 <RST38h> if it is just typing a text file then yes
Nov 11 19:59:01 <GAN800> 12 categories
Nov 11 19:59:06 <Meizirkki_n810> now i am fighting with ubuntu-mobile =)
Nov 11 19:59:28 <GAN800> Just stick them on the wiki, or send them to me and I'll stick them there.
Nov 11 20:00:02 <RST38h> Working.
Nov 11 20:00:07 <lcuk> why does os2007 do different stuff and try to guess if i use finger or stylus?
Nov 11 20:00:24 <GAN800> Because that's the way it was programmed
Nov 11 20:00:45 <GAN800> It was dropped for OS2008 because it really didn't work very well.
Nov 11 20:00:51 <lcuk> yeah i can tell
Nov 11 20:01:14 <lcuk> good idea in principle
Nov 11 20:01:31 * lcuk now sees what people meant about stylus friendly
Nov 11 20:02:55 <mlpug> i attach n810 with usb to computer. /media/disk pops up with some subdirectories. Where are these in n810 filesystem?
Nov 11 20:03:37 <Stskeeps> Meizirkki_n810: actually nm
Nov 11 20:03:56 <Stskeeps> Meizirkki_n810: i'll do that on my own, as it is deadly :P
Nov 11 20:04:09 <Meizirkki_n810> ok
Nov 11 20:04:32 <mlpug> I mean if I run  e.g. cp /home/mlpug/file.avi /media/disk     where in n810 I can find that file.avi?
Nov 11 20:06:06 <qwerty12_N800> Stskeeps, hmm, compiling the kernel on n800? Do you plan to do that after you've taken drugs? :P
Nov 11 20:06:43 <milhouse> like flashing, recompiling the kernel on the n800 should always be done with the charger connected...
Nov 11 20:07:00 <Stskeeps> qwerty12_N800: no, vodka!
Nov 11 20:07:08 <RST38h> GAN: Ready
Nov 11 20:07:12 <qwerty12_N800> Stskeeps, heh...
Nov 11 20:07:13 <Veggen> Well. We *did* compile kernel back in the days when we had 386/25 w/4 MB memory, too...
Nov 11 20:08:34 <derf> The kernel was a lot smaller back then.
Nov 11 20:08:52 <RST38h> 1MB kernel was considered huge
Nov 11 20:09:02 <derf> SLOC-wise, too.
Nov 11 20:09:07 <GAN800> RST38h, I see it on the wiki. Excellent, thank you! :)
Nov 11 20:09:20 <RST38h> FreeBSD had 600kB..1MB kernels
Nov 11 20:09:31 <GAN800> Hi, milhouse. :)
Nov 11 20:09:42 <milhouse> hi GAN
Nov 11 20:10:13 <Veggen> derf: true. But the n810 has more memory and is faster ;)
Nov 11 20:10:14 <RST38h> OSF/1 had a huge 10MB kernel that was actually a Mach "microkernel" + crap
Nov 11 20:10:24 <qwerty12_N800> milhouse, hrm, want to update your schematics folder? ;)
Nov 11 20:10:30 <milhouse> we got a new one?
Nov 11 20:10:57 <qwerty12_N800> milhouse, i found n810 ones and some other goodies a while back...
Nov 11 20:11:12 <milhouse> sure - you got the url?
Nov 11 20:18:23 <GAN800> Somebody should package up avahi for Extras so it doesn't need to be coerced into working.
Nov 11 20:25:34 <qwerty12_N800> GAN800, Bug pH5 :P
Nov 11 20:26:04 <qwerty12_N800> according to summary, he's the uploader
Nov 11 20:26:42 <sjgadsby> Why am I bothering to argue with allnameswereout?
Nov 11 20:26:45 <GAN800> Imma bug qwerty12
Nov 11 20:27:10 <Stskeeps> sjgadsby: the kind of person that's kinda like fly paper?
Nov 11 20:27:12 <GAN800> sjgadsby, S'okay, it's hard to avoid
Nov 11 20:27:26 <GAN800> I still want to know his angle
Nov 11 20:28:07 * lcuk needs to update to 2008, its all strange in here
Nov 11 20:29:02 <sjgadsby> He appears to be omniscient and infallible.
Nov 11 20:29:14 <GAN800> Clearly
Nov 11 20:29:21 <lcuk> hiya sjgadsby
Nov 11 20:29:24 <GAN800> He's an intellectual
Nov 11 20:29:33 <sjgadsby> HiHi, lcuk.
Nov 11 20:30:29 <Meizirkki_n810> with telnet, i would be able to start apps in ubuntu-mobile-desktop...
Nov 11 20:31:22 <qwerty12_N800> lardman|afk, compiled gmp with cs2008 toolchain, gcc went fine, libtool did not...
Nov 11 20:32:16 <lcuk> do you think tim could become an opensismus trainee? (i really hope he gets sorted)
Nov 11 20:32:19 <Stskeeps> Meizirkki_n810: scrshots!
Nov 11 20:32:57 <qwerty12_N800> lardman|afk, attempted to compile rather :)
Nov 11 20:33:03 <Meizirkki_n810> they look exsactly same that those i already have in picasaweb
Nov 11 20:33:40 <Meizirkki_n810> okay, i'll upload some more :)
Nov 11 20:34:26 <GAN800> lcuk, well, he's not in Berlin and he'  waaaaaay overqualified.
Nov 11 20:35:24 <lcuk> yeah i know gan, it bites
Nov 11 20:35:55 <Meizirkki_n810> Stskeeps: Sould i uplodad em somewhere that is possible for anybody to download?
Nov 11 20:36:53 <qwerty12_N800> GAN800, seen pybattery? if there should be something that takes the name of adv-power, it's that...
Nov 11 20:37:09 <Stskeeps> Meizirkki_n810: picasa is fine i think
Nov 11 20:37:21 <Meizirkki_n810> ok
Nov 11 20:39:33 <milhouse> oh dear - what's going on here? Open this link on Jaaksi's site (http://jaaksi.blogspot.com/2008/10/few-thoughs-on-openness.html) then click the link to Jaffa's "ideas and opinions" and get a 403 because Jaaksi is a spammer... :)
Nov 11 20:40:24 <lcuk> why the heck did they remove the layout mode from 2007?
Nov 11 20:41:01 <milhouse> lcuk: to annoy you (probably)
Nov 11 20:41:28 <Stskeeps> lcuk: layout mode?
Nov 11 20:41:30 * lcuk has never run os2007 before
Nov 11 20:41:34 <lcuk> desktop applets
Nov 11 20:41:41 <lcuk> locked unless in layout mode
Nov 11 20:41:55 <Stskeeps> ah
Nov 11 20:42:00 <milhouse> Desktop applets that couldn't be locked in place was a genius feature
Nov 11 20:42:08 <milhouse> s/was/is/
Nov 11 20:42:08 <qwerty12_N800> lcuk, but at least they were able to be locked :)
Nov 11 20:42:10 <infobot> milhouse meant: Desktop applets that couldn't be locked in place is a genius feature
Nov 11 20:42:23 <lcuk> qwerty12_N800, thats the point, why remove the feature
Nov 11 20:42:38 * lcuk shakes head lol
Nov 11 20:42:42 <Stskeeps> "we don't need no stinkin' layout mode when we have lock touch screen and keys!"
Nov 11 20:43:00 * lcuk is forever movin his clock around
Nov 11 20:43:56 <milhouse> stskeeps - on the contrary, because it IS a touchscreen is exactly why you need them locked down! :) too many times i've messed up the desktop just picking up/putting down the n8x0... takes about 5 minutes to get everything back to normal 'cos the snap to grid is so shit
Nov 11 20:44:33 <Stskeeps> milhouse: i was being mildly sarcastic, i want to lock mine too, bloody irritating "feature"
Nov 11 20:44:34 <qwerty12_N800> a free shank to whoever makes a patch for hildon-desktop to add an option to lock applets!
Nov 11 20:44:36 <Stskeeps> :P
Nov 11 20:44:45 <GAN800> Fremantle.
Nov 11 20:44:59 <milhouse> stskeeps: sorry thought you were a nokia drone :)
Nov 11 20:45:31 <Stskeeps> oi, i take offense to that :(
Nov 11 20:45:34 <qwerty12_N800> someone "frontport" the relevant code from maemo-af-desktop into hildon-desktop :p
Nov 11 20:45:47 <milhouse> stskeeps: hehe, sorry :)
Nov 11 20:46:20 <GAN800> milhouse, you've been away too long. ;)
Nov 11 20:46:32 <GAN800> See Maemo Reconstructed. :)
Nov 11 20:46:52 <milhouse> yah, just been monitoring bugzilla mostly
Nov 11 20:47:03 <milhouse> GAN800: Again!
Nov 11 20:47:21 <milhouse> GAN800: It's like rearangging deckchairs on the Titanic...
Nov 11 20:47:27 <milhouse> :(
Nov 11 20:48:29 <milhouse> GAN: No offence to you and the guys who are busting a gut for Nokia, but well you know how it is...
Nov 11 20:49:29 <milhouse> I shall read the Wiki entry though
Nov 11 20:49:48 * Stskeeps personally isn't, - if nokia sees potential in this stuff, we'll have a kickass maemo future, if not, we have a kickass maemo alternative :P
Nov 11 20:49:54 <GAN800> milhouse, we're moving in a positive direction these days.
Nov 11 20:50:18 <milhouse> I do wonder sometimes when I read some of the "WONTFIX" and "RESOLVED" bugs in bugzilla
Nov 11 20:51:10 <GAN800> Well, WONTFIXing recently is more of a Diablo -> Fremantle issue
Nov 11 20:51:26 <GAN800> A LOT of platform stuff is changing in Diablo
Nov 11 20:51:41 <GAN800> s/Diablo/Fremantle/
Nov 11 20:51:41 <infobot> GAN800 meant: A LOT of platform stuff is changing in Fremantle
Nov 11 20:51:53 <milhouse> Maybe, the ones that have got my goat the last few days are the GPS one and the English (Canada) bug... I mean how hard would it be to support English (Canada)? I like Canada.
Nov 11 20:51:56 <milhouse> :)
Nov 11 20:51:59 <GAN800> Anyway, I'm not busting a gut for Nokia
Nov 11 20:52:11 <GAN800> I'm busting a gut for the community.
Nov 11 20:52:20 <milhouse> GAN: There's always lots of platform changes with every big release, that seems to be part of the problem...
Nov 11 20:52:35 <GAN800> Nah, these are good.
Nov 11 20:53:05 <milhouse> Having said that, I look at 2008 and compare it to 2005 and I don't see a huge amount of change in 3 years.... most of it is under the cover, still the same old sh1tty UI and application bugs...
Nov 11 20:53:18 <milhouse> GAN: I hope you are right, I really do.
Nov 11 20:53:30 <GAN800> Fremantle is a brand new UI direction
Nov 11 20:53:48 <milhouse> GAN: I really appreciate your gut busting :)
Nov 11 20:54:13 <GAN800> Trust me, I'm just as jaded, tired and cynical as you and I'm feeling good about things.
Nov 11 20:54:34 <milhouse> GAN: I know, that means many of the old bugs will be "WONTFIX"'d (good) but new ones will emerge that will be ignored for 3+ years until the next major UI redesign etc. It's this attitude which must be changed... somehow.
Nov 11 20:54:42 <Stskeeps> qwerty12_N800: you ever tried bashing your head in with the source package for kernel-diablo-modules-extra_2.6.21-200829maemo1_all.deb and such?
Nov 11 20:55:08 <GAN800> milhouse, thing is, though, we're getting close to that step 5
Nov 11 20:55:35 <milhouse> GAN: I got a developer N810 which makes me feel guilty about slating Maemo so next time I'll pay full whack for a N900 and have a clear conscience. :)
Nov 11 20:55:56 <Meizirkki_n810> Stskeeps: There are some photos: http://picasaweb.google.com/mail.deweb/MaemoReconstructed# They are VERY crappy quality. I'll continue playing with this tomorrow, it is 22.50 here.
Nov 11 20:56:05 <Stskeeps> nini, Meizirkki_n810
Nov 11 20:56:12 <qwerty12_N800> Stskeeps, nah. just compiled the kernel the "traditional" way, go on to ssu repo and replace their kernel  image in the deb with mine
Nov 11 20:56:17 <Meizirkki_n810> =)
Nov 11 20:56:41 <milhouse> GAN: Is there a Step 6?
Nov 11 20:56:46 <Stskeeps> and what meiz just posted is ubuntu mobile on a n810
Nov 11 20:56:49 <Stskeeps> booting
Nov 11 20:56:54 <Stskeeps> very blurry pics
Nov 11 20:57:37 <lcuk> milhouse, harmattan
Nov 11 20:57:46 <GAN800> milhouse, pressumably
Nov 11 20:57:47 <milhouse> Ah yes...
Nov 11 20:57:48 <Meizirkki_n810> There are better quality pics in n810 album, but they are from chroot
Nov 11 20:57:49 <GAN800> No
Nov 11 20:57:58 <GAN800> lcuk, Fremantle is step4
Nov 11 20:57:58 <lcuk> no?
Nov 11 20:58:08 <lcuk> fremantle is maemo 5 is it not?
Nov 11 20:58:14 <milhouse> it is
Nov 11 20:58:14 <GAN800> Harmattan is either 4.1 or 5
Nov 11 20:58:19 <GAN800> step
Nov 11 20:58:28 <milhouse> but I think the N810 was step 3.5 of 5 wasn't it?
Nov 11 20:58:42 <milhouse> or something like that...
Nov 11 20:58:43 <GAN800> 770, N800, N810, N900, Nxxx
Nov 11 20:59:36 <lcuk> what about the w
Nov 11 20:59:45 <milhouse> Will be interesting to see if Nokia/Maemo manage to push out regular, working Freemantle updates AND take on board the feedback and fix the bugs prior to release. That would be a sign of major progress.
Nov 11 20:59:57 <milhouse> sorry, I meant alphas not updates
Nov 11 21:00:55 <GAN800> lcuk, N810W is not a step.
Nov 11 21:01:00 <lcuk> that also depends on if we test them properly
Nov 11 21:01:19 <milhouse> lcuk: if you mean file quality bug reports, yep couldn't agree more.
Nov 11 21:01:20 <GAN800> milhouse, that's in the discussion phase
Nov 11 21:01:33 <GAN800> The alpha sdk is coming out next month.
Nov 11 21:01:55 <GAN800> Quim and Marius were talking an unstable distribution
Nov 11 21:02:24 <milhouse> Hopefully not like Sardine
Nov 11 21:02:47 <bergie> IIRC they considered sardine a failure and said they will do better this time
Nov 11 21:02:51 <lcuk> depends where it sits in the community
Nov 11 21:02:53 <bergie> but don't remember who said that
Nov 11 21:03:07 <milhouse> bergie: that would be a fair assesment, cheers
Nov 11 21:03:53 <lcuk> if it stays ahead of stable branch it will work
Nov 11 21:04:05 * Stskeeps 's vision is the maemo basics in community hands and nokia basing firmware on top of it, and contracting companies to contribute to the base maemo and such
Nov 11 21:04:08 <Stskeeps> :P
Nov 11 21:04:22 <GAN800> milhouse, browse around the -developers archives a bit.
Nov 11 21:05:08 <milhouse> I must admit I've got several hundred unread -developers messages :)
Nov 11 21:05:29 <milhouse> Must catchup eventually - last time I checked it Darius was in the process of get blackballed. :)
Nov 11 21:05:31 <GAN800> Worth poking through
Nov 11 21:05:45 <lcuk> milhouse, thats some bad lag
Nov 11 21:05:46 <milhouse> s/get/getting/
Nov 11 21:08:55 <milhouse> qwerty: All schematic files now uploaded to http://nmacleod.com/nokia/schematics - thanks! :)
Nov 11 21:08:58 <RST38h> ~curse BSCIS and each of its many departments
Nov 11 21:11:38 <qwerty12_N800> milhouse, cool :)
Nov 11 21:12:16 <qwerty12_N800> ~stab watchdog
Nov 11 21:14:42 <Stskeeps> hm, pybattery in extras?
Nov 11 21:14:50 <Stskeeps> can't seem to find a screenshot or link
Nov 11 21:15:00 <qwerty12_N800> Stskeeps, http://www.internettablettalk.com/forums/showthread.php?p=241131
Nov 11 21:15:04 <GAN800> He seems to have dropped the link.
Nov 11 21:15:29 <Stskeeps> mmk
Nov 11 21:15:35 <qwerty12_N800> an upgrade? *hopeful*
Nov 11 21:15:58 <Stskeeps> does it use HAL or similar to kcbatt?
Nov 11 21:17:01 <RST38h> Yes, but is it in Python?
Nov 11 21:17:13 <Stskeeps> pybattery kinda gives that off
Nov 11 21:17:23 <RST38h> No go then...
Nov 11 21:17:26 <qwerty12_N800> Stskeeps, hal
Nov 11 21:17:28 <Stskeeps> (.. morbid curiousity), besides showing stuff like advanced backlight and a battery applet in maemo-r wouldn't be that bad
Nov 11 21:17:48 <Stskeeps> as a demonstrator it's silly to close source stuff like that
Nov 11 21:18:56 <Stskeeps> qwerty12_N800: if you ever want to compile the source package i spoke of, remove HOST_CC=host-cc or something in the package rules, it breaks everything
Nov 11 21:19:35 <milhouse> Anyone know if Freemantle will support remote SIM ?
Nov 11 21:19:38 <qwerty12_N800> Stskeeps, ah, thanks. btw: http://i38.tinypic.com/zjjrd0.png
Nov 11 21:19:45 <milhouse> (Bluetooth Profile)
Nov 11 21:20:09 <milhouse> ermm... OK maybe that should be Freemantle on N900
Nov 11 21:20:22 <RST38h> qwerty: coool
Nov 11 21:20:24 <Stskeeps> qwerty12_N800: quite intruging
Nov 11 21:20:34 <RST38h> qwerty: now, if it only were in C...
Nov 11 21:20:39 <Stskeeps> get on recoding it
Nov 11 21:20:39 <Stskeeps> :P
Nov 11 21:20:44 <milhouse> Remote SIM would avoid me having to get a second mobile network contract
Nov 11 21:20:48 <GAN800> Fremantle. :p
Nov 11 21:21:06 <Stskeeps> manatee?
Nov 11 21:21:09 <GAN800> milhouse, we're way too far off to know something like that.
Nov 11 21:21:24 <milhouse> Hopefully someone/somewhere has given it some thought... :)
Nov 11 21:21:45 <milhouse> Not too many people will be keen on getting a second airtime contract
Nov 11 21:21:46 <GAN800> Pressumably, but they're shuttered up in Nokia HQ
Nov 11 21:22:03 * RST38h isn't very keen on getting the first airtime contract either
Nov 11 21:22:14 <milhouse> hehe - true
Nov 11 21:22:30 <RST38h> why should I make a contract with these guys? isn't money enough?
Nov 11 21:23:18 <milhouse> Seemingly not... although if you buy a subsidised phone it's fair enough to have a contract otherwise you could run off with the phone...
Nov 11 21:23:44 * RST38h isn't buying subsidized phones. I can still pay for my gadgets, thanks =)
Nov 11 21:23:45 <milhouse> I'm on a SIM-only "contract" which means the contract is pretty pointless
Nov 11 21:24:28 <milhouse> If all you want is airtime then I suppose there's always Pay as you go - no contract required
Nov 11 21:24:55 <RST38h> Is there anything else to want from these guys?
Nov 11 21:25:03 <milhouse> LOL
Nov 11 21:25:05 <RST38h> Ringtones for $3 a pop?
Nov 11 21:25:25 <RST38h> SMS messages for $.15 when I can just as well run ICQ client?
Nov 11 21:25:51 <milhouse> Data pipes... one day they'll learn that's all they are...
Nov 11 21:26:21 <RST38h> You can't effectively milk clients with a data pipe
Nov 11 21:26:51 <milhouse> sure you can - ask T-Mobile/Google
Nov 11 21:27:04 <milhouse> apparently they charge you for IM messages sent with any client other than GoogleTalk
Nov 11 21:27:06 <Stskeeps> heh, android "rm -rf /"
Nov 11 21:27:15 <RST38h> milhouse: And how do they count?
Nov 11 21:27:29 <milhouse> no idea
Nov 11 21:27:46 <RST38h> Let us say I run Slick and connect to an ICQ server. How is my traffic different from other traffic?
Nov 11 21:27:48 <`0660> that should be pretty easy to get around :)
Nov 11 21:28:02 <Stskeeps> ssl :P
Nov 11 21:28:03 <milhouse> badly, judging by my last bill from O2 which made me leave rather than get stung with another bill for services I never used...
Nov 11 21:28:24 <RST38h> you have got a Googlephone? =)
Nov 11 21:28:34 <milhouse> RST - I'm sure some people will get around it, most normal people may not
Nov 11 21:31:05 <RST38h> most "normal people" will send SMS messages for 4.15
Nov 11 21:31:14 <`0660> http://psi-im.org/wiki/Gateway
Nov 11 21:31:49 <milhouse> 4.15? A bargain! ;)
Nov 11 21:31:56 <RST38h> s/4/$/
Nov 11 21:32:33 <lcuk> the principle thing i want from my service provider is reliability
Nov 11 21:33:20 <RST38h> which means you are likely to buy service from a traditional phone company (Verizon in US, MTS in Russia)
Nov 11 21:33:47 <milhouse> I just want my service provider to stay out of my face - I don't want to know they are there
Nov 11 21:33:54 <lcuk> no way! im not payin long distance, ill find a provider in the UK ;)
Nov 11 21:34:07 <RST38h> milhouse: but how are they gonna develop your brand loyalty? :)
Nov 11 21:34:10 <Sargun> Why would you guys say the community has not come up with an alternative vector mapping program?
Nov 11 21:34:29 <lcuk> cos vectors are hard
Nov 11 21:34:37 <RST38h> lcuk: But surely, your landline phone monopolists also provides cellular service?
Nov 11 21:34:55 <milhouse> RST: Bugger loyalty! I'm on SIM only for a reason!!
Nov 11 21:34:58 <RST38h> Sargun: Where would you get vector map data?
Nov 11 21:35:03 <Sargun> RST38h, OSM.
Nov 11 21:35:04 <lcuk> RST38h, im pullin ur leg a bit, yeah theres reliable cell phone providers here
Nov 11 21:35:10 <GAN800> Sargun, um? Navit? Roadmap?
Nov 11 21:35:26 <RST38h> Sargun: There is already a program for that called Navit. Or you can use Roadmap
Nov 11 21:35:30 <Sargun> ah
Nov 11 21:35:36 <Sargun> Let me try them
Nov 11 21:35:43 <RST38h> But the OSM data is rather crappy
Nov 11 21:35:51 <lcuk> depends on location
Nov 11 21:36:13 <lcuk> if its crap near you walk around with gps for a while
Nov 11 21:36:15 <milhouse> RST: What landline monopolists, the phone exchanges have been open for several years now - literally anyone can provide a service (voice and/or data)
Nov 11 21:36:16 <RST38h> Ok, to correct myself, most locations I really need are complete crap in OSM
Nov 11 21:36:16 <lcuk> it will get better ;)
Nov 11 21:36:44 <lcuk> RST38h, just drive where you need to go a few times and then a few weeks later the data will be available for you to use
Nov 11 21:36:49 <lcuk> hope you dont need directions today
Nov 11 21:36:52 <RST38h> milhouse: Yes, but only landline monopolist has enough locations throughout the area to saturate it with cell transceivers
Nov 11 21:37:14 <RST38h> lcuk: Yea, the open source principle - "if you need something, do it yourself!"
Nov 11 21:37:36 <Sargun> Where does navit/roadmap get its vector data?
Nov 11 21:38:00 <RST38h> milhouse: The rest will have to negotiate tower space with all the property owners
Nov 11 21:38:00 <milhouse> RST: Few companies are able to make the kind of investment that operating a cellular network requires, we've got 4 or 5 companies in the UK all competing and squabbling over the same locations...
Nov 11 21:38:07 <RST38h> Sargun: OSM.
Nov 11 21:38:13 <Sargun> RST38h, ah.
Nov 11 21:38:23 <RST38h> milhouse: Let me show you an example
Nov 11 21:38:34 <milhouse> RST: And none of them are British Telecom which used to be (and possibly still is from a backhaul perspective) the landline monopolist
Nov 11 21:38:40 <Sargun> RST38h, Do you guys think people would pay $40-50 + map fee for Teleatlas or Navteq?
Nov 11 21:38:50 <lcuk> whats performance of navit like on the n8x0?
Nov 11 21:38:52 <RST38h> milhouse: Take east coast US. Its landlines are served by Verizon, a monopolist
Nov 11 21:39:00 <RST38h> Sargun: No.
Nov 11 21:39:14 <Sargun> rsalveti, Why would you say that?
Nov 11 21:39:17 <milhouse> RST: Sorry, I was talking about the UK - I have little idea how the US operates, I assumed it was open
Nov 11 21:39:19 <Sargun> err, RST38h
Nov 11 21:39:39 <RST38h> milhouse: There are (or were) several cell providers: AT&T, Sprint, T-Mobile, Verizon, etc
Nov 11 21:39:47 <RST38h> milhouse: Guess who has the best coverage ;)
Nov 11 21:39:52 <lcuk> milhouse, didnt o2 start as the mobile arm of bt?
Nov 11 21:40:07 <milhouse> LCUK: It did, got flogged off to the Spanish
Nov 11 21:40:27 <RST38h> milhouse: Open or not, but you can't MAKE Verizon place your cell transmitter onto their tower
Nov 11 21:40:32 <qwerty12_N800> lcuk, yeah... cellnet > bt cellnet >  o2
Nov 11 21:40:34 <RST38h> You have to pay for that
Nov 11 21:41:02 <milhouse>  RST: Why can't the other companies put up their own towers? That's what happens here although it would make more sense to share towers
Nov 11 21:41:41 <RST38h> milhouse: You do not place tower in the air. It stands at some property. Or your transmitter gets mounted on a building.
Nov 11 21:41:41 <milhouse> RST: Cell towers are prime assets - why should Verizon make space for a competitor?
Nov 11 21:41:57 <RST38h> milhouse: And of course, people always complain about these
Nov 11 21:42:07 <RST38h> milhouse:right. and it does not.
Nov 11 21:42:10 <milhouse> RST: Yes, same here - usually on top of tall buildings.
Nov 11 21:42:24 <milhouse> RST: Getting a cell tower is like being given the permission to print money.
Nov 11 21:42:30 <RST38h> milhouse: That is why Verizon has the best coverage - it has historically owned a lot of pieces of land
Nov 11 21:43:08 <RST38h> milhouse: It has got landline exchanges throughout the region and being a monopolist it can easily make deals that other companies can't
Nov 11 21:43:21 <RST38h> Like placing stations in DC subway
Nov 11 21:43:54 <milhouse> RST: In the UK that was BT (O2) but they didn't site their cell towers optimally, whereas Vodafone did the mathematics to work out the optimal coverage and bought the rights to site their towers in the best locations using the least number of towers and still had a better network than O2...
Nov 11 21:44:09 <RST38h> milhouse: Same stuff with MTS in Moscow. And I am pretty sure T-Mobile enjoys the same privileges in Germany
Nov 11 21:44:46 <RST38h> milhouse: just means BT management was stupid
Nov 11 21:45:01 <milhouse> RST: Yep
Nov 11 21:45:45 <milhouse> RST: But Vodafone were smart, and beat BT - however the challenge that Vodafone faced is the same for Sprint etc.
Nov 11 21:46:30 <milhouse> RST: It's the reality of the situation, what do they expect - hand outs from Verizon? They just have to accept it and be smart about what they do. Sadly they're probably not (judging by the complaints I hear about various US service proviers)
Nov 11 21:47:37 <RST38h> milhouse: I don't think US consumers expect anything from cell companies any more
Nov 11 21:47:53 <milhouse> It does seem to be a bit of a mess over there
Nov 11 21:48:05 <RST38h> milhouse: Everybody got used to be assfucked on permanent basis
Nov 11 21:48:12 <milhouse> Not helped by trying to push their own world standard...
Nov 11 21:48:25 <RST38h> US isn't pushing cell standards any more
Nov 11 21:48:43 <RST38h> If you mean CDMA it is only supported by one network in the US (Verizon)
Nov 11 21:48:54 <milhouse> No but they did in the past, when everyone else was happy with GSM etc.
Nov 11 21:49:01 <RST38h> They didn't
Nov 11 21:49:19 <RST38h> AT&T historically used TDMA (pre-GSM standard) and moved to GSM eventually
Nov 11 21:49:42 <RST38h> Verizon used CDMA all the way, provided by QUualcomm
Nov 11 21:50:01 <milhouse> Why did the US try to setup a CDMA network in Iraq? :)
Nov 11 21:50:19 <RST38h> BTW, 3G (UMTS) is also CDMA based (CDMA/TDMA are MAC protocol names rather than standard names)
Nov 11 21:50:39 <RST38h> milhouse: Verizon or Qualcomm probably got a contract, that's all
Nov 11 21:50:56 <milhouse> Yes, it was political - not much use to the Iraqis
Nov 11 21:51:11 <RST38h> Iraq has known worse things than CDMA network
Nov 11 21:51:20 <milhouse> true
Nov 11 21:52:49 <sjgadsby> At some point this afternoon, my N810 began popping up the stylus keyboard for input even when the hardware keyboard is out. What settings might I check to try to return to the old, stylus-keyboard-only-when-hardware-keyboard-is-closed behavior?
Nov 11 21:53:38 <milhouse> Control Panel -> Text Input?
Nov 11 21:53:41 <lcuk> sjgadsby, have you tried the windwos fix
Nov 11 21:53:48 <lcuk> windows even
Nov 11 21:53:56 <sjgadsby> What's the windows fix?
Nov 11 21:54:02 <lcuk> turn it off and back on again
Nov 11 21:54:13 <sjgadsby> Ah. Gotcha.
Nov 11 21:54:32 <sjgadsby> I'll try that now, lcuk.
Nov 11 21:54:39 <lcuk> may be simpler than twiddling with things - if you havent done anything specific to change stuff something couldv justcocked up
Nov 11 21:55:07 * lcuk iwll pass you onto level 2 support if its still broken :P
Nov 11 21:55:16 <lcuk> where do i get typing assistance?
Nov 11 21:55:44 <lcuk> i need an intern
Nov 11 21:56:14 <lcuk> usb lead for my n810 wont work on n800 will it
Nov 11 21:56:23 <milhouse> no
Nov 11 21:56:26 <lcuk> damn
Nov 11 21:56:44 <lcuk> who lives near manchester and has an n800
Nov 11 21:56:56 <lcuk> or do i have to send off for one
Nov 11 21:57:01 <milhouse> sarf lahndan - sorry
Nov 11 21:58:02 <milhouse> any miniUSB lead should work in a N800
Nov 11 21:58:25 <sjgadsby> Yep, lcuk, a reboot fixed it. Such a simple fix; sorry for the noise.
Nov 11 21:58:26 <milhouse> (microUSB on n810)
Nov 11 21:59:45 <lcuk> mmm ill try and find one though
Nov 11 22:00:09 <lardman_> qwerty12_N800: segfault here too
Nov 11 22:01:27 <lcuk> thanks milhouse
Nov 11 22:01:34 <lcuk> hiya simon
Nov 11 22:01:48 <qwerty12_N800> lardman, heh, i was getting a crap load of errors
Nov 11 22:02:47 <lcuk> n800 os2007 startup is much quicker than os2008
Nov 11 22:04:17 <lardman> qwerty12_N800: qalc runs fine from the command line, some glib errors at start up
Nov 11 22:04:22 * qwerty12_N800 has to see if i can get bora's running at 400mhz. an n800 dvfs change at best :)
Nov 11 22:04:49 <qwerty12_N800> kernel^
Nov 11 22:05:13 <qwerty12_N800> lardman, ah, i thought you were talking gmp. yeah, probably easier to build qt version of qalc
Nov 11 22:07:22 <lardman> I've given up on gmp, won't compile with GCC 3.x.x; I compiled qalculate-gtk and that's causing the segfaults
Nov 11 22:08:11 <qwerty12_N800> lardman, gcc4 will compile it here, just libtool messes up
Nov 11 22:08:47 <GAN800> lcuk, Bora is a lot lighter.
Nov 11 22:08:50 <lardman> gmp3 isn't actually needed anyway
Nov 11 22:08:54 <RST38h> Microsoft is now offering 25 per cent off eBay purchases made by way of its Live Search engine
Nov 11 22:09:26 <RST38h> Rob 'em, quick!
Nov 11 22:09:47 <glass> whats the catch&safeguard?
Nov 11 22:09:57 <lardman> hmm, wonder if it works for car purchases? ;)
Nov 11 22:12:11 <lcuk> GAN800, seems it
Nov 11 22:12:29 <lcuk> lardman, are you actually workin in qt there on device
Nov 11 22:12:44 * qwerty12_N800 goes reads up on how python handles if statements... need to make this swap counter i've added to adv-power hide itself when swap is disabled
Nov 11 22:12:48 <lardman> lcuk: no
Nov 11 22:13:15 <lcuk> qwerty i saw that adv-power thing, looks very interesting :)
Nov 11 22:13:35 <lardman> night all
Nov 11 22:13:37 <lcuk> lardman ahhhhhh i got all excited
Nov 11 22:13:39 <lcuk> gnite
Nov 11 22:13:49 <qwerty12_N800> night lardman
Nov 11 22:13:53 <lardman> sorry, just trying to compile qalculate
Nov 11 22:14:02 <qwerty12_N800> lcuk, yeah, it's cool :)
Nov 11 22:14:17 <lardman> anyway another all day meeting tomorrow so bed beckons, bye
Nov 11 22:14:19 <lcuk> especially the python aspect and features
Nov 11 22:16:01 <RST38h> glass: there is no catch that I know of
Nov 11 22:16:16 <RST38h> It just looks like a stupid/desperate marketing move
Nov 11 22:16:52 <glass> RST38h: yeah but whats there to stop me from selling myself stuff, them paying the discount?
Nov 11 22:17:56 <Stskeeps> http://trac.tspre.org/mrrepo/dists/reconstructed/main/binary-arm/Packages <- damn, we've been busy
Nov 11 22:17:59 <Stskeeps> :P
Nov 11 22:18:54 <lcuk> either busy or rediercted /dev/random to your webserver :P
Nov 11 22:27:03 <RST38h> glass: nothing
Nov 11 22:27:23 <RST38h> except I think it is one deal per person only, so you can't continue reaping those 25%
Nov 11 22:31:09 <doc|home> so only use when buying a house
Nov 11 22:33:14 <Stskeeps> ~curse circular build dependancies
Nov 11 22:33:43 <Stskeeps> hildon-desktop build-depends on maemo-launcher, which build-depends on hildon-desktop
Nov 11 22:34:47 <Stskeeps> open sourcing is one thing but allowing people to bootstrap is a good thing too..
Nov 11 22:35:40 <qwerty12_N800> Stskeeps, hildon-desktop should be able to be built w/out maemo-launcher support
Nov 11 22:36:30 <Stskeeps> yes, but the boosters are are a good maemo thing
Nov 11 22:37:18 <qwerty12_N800> rebuild hildon-desktop again afterwards with launcher support :p
Nov 11 22:37:50 <Stskeeps> mm
Nov 11 22:38:31 <qwerty12_N800> afaik, maemo-launcher doesn't depend on hildon-desktop in the sense of needing it, rather hildon-desktop launches programs built taking advantage of maemo-launcher properly
Nov 11 22:38:55 * Stskeeps looks
Nov 11 22:43:25 * Stskeeps tries building without libhildondesktop-dev
Nov 11 22:43:33 <Stskeeps> okay..
Nov 11 22:43:33 <Stskeeps> :P
Nov 11 22:43:40 <Stskeeps> didn't work
Nov 11 22:45:52 <qwerty12_N800> bollocks >.<
Nov 11 22:48:16 <Stskeeps>   * Add build-dep to maemo-launcher-dev
Nov 11 22:48:38 <Stskeeps> aug 2007.. and: march 2007: * hildon-desktop-dev should not depend on maemo-launcher
Nov 11 22:48:42 <Stskeeps> "%"
Nov 11 22:49:12 <Stskeeps> i need a punching bag in my apartment.
Nov 11 22:55:12 <johnx> Stskeeps, I have no idea why gtkhtml wanted to build against gnomeui and glade on my system...
Nov 11 22:55:59 <Stskeeps> dunno
Nov 11 22:56:36 <Stskeeps> i'm attempting bootstrapping hildon-desktop now
Nov 11 22:56:57 <Stskeeps> as qwerty suggested
Nov 11 22:58:54 <Stskeeps> there's a nolauncher thing so
Nov 11 23:01:37 <Stskeeps> johnx: so what's your plans?
Nov 11 23:02:48 <johnx> hmmm...well other people use glade, so I might as well take a stab at it, unless you have a suggestion
Nov 11 23:02:54 <Stskeeps> *nod*
Nov 11 23:03:36 <Stskeeps> well there's always editing deblet installer to get from mojo handhelds and set up a proper hasty minbase script, and installing packages, but that might take some time to get working
Nov 11 23:04:23 <Stskeeps> i've uploaded all the boot scripts and packages so
Nov 11 23:04:43 <Stskeeps> or simply see what packages need to be added for it to boot
Nov 11 23:05:27 <Stskeeps> from a bare debootstrap minbase
Nov 11 23:06:47 <johnx> hmm, no ohm release yet
Nov 11 23:08:47 <Stskeeps> yeah, it'll come eventually
Nov 11 23:12:35 <johnx> actually, one quick question about m-r policy? Do we care about the possibility of having more than one user? or does that even make sense?
Nov 11 23:15:36 <Stskeeps> i think we'd run in a bunch of problems but then again, im not sure hildon is dependent on it being /home/user
Nov 11 23:15:47 <Stskeeps> maybe not multiple users at the same time
Nov 11 23:17:20 <johnx> I don't think it's that dependent, but now would be a good time to push for multiuser if there were people who had a legitimate interest in it
Nov 11 23:26:22 <Stskeeps> mm - im not sure its a good idea on such low power devices though
Nov 11 23:26:34 <Stskeeps> i mean, if there was a "fast user switch" with suspended sessions, maybe, but..
Nov 11 23:27:55 <Stskeeps> okay, i'm off to bed
Nov 11 23:30:41 <johnx> alright, I'll take a look at packages needed to boot
Nov 11 23:30:51 <johnx> 'night
Nov 11 23:32:16 <towo> Mhm. Any help against the GPS doing erratic jiggling when it's not mounted rather statically?
Nov 11 23:33:00 <Stskeeps> johnx: debootstrap --arch=arm --variant=minbase --include=wget,udev,apt-utils hasty /mnt/deblet http://repository.handhelds.org/hasty-armv5el/
Nov 11 23:33:08 <Stskeeps> is my current debootstrap atleast
Nov 11 23:33:09 <Stskeeps> bbl
Nov 11 23:33:16 <johnx> ok, looks good :)
Nov 11 23:49:28 <bef0rd> http://mail.google.com/videochat
Nov 11 23:49:36 <bef0rd> ;_; no linux
Nov 12 00:26:22 <windstorm> Hi all, anyone know how to write multi thread application under maemo?
Nov 12 00:26:35 <windstorm> Is it something the same as under command line?
Nov 12 00:44:32 <pferrel> Can someone point me to install instructions for the G1 version of Android on the Nokia 810?
Nov 12 00:53:45 <johnx> did someone get it working?
Nov 12 01:15:54 <pferrel> Let me rephrase: Has anyone gotten Android v1 running on the 810?
Nov 12 01:21:17 <ron1n> pferrel, try using whatever docs are out there with the latest sdk from android's page at google code
Nov 12 01:21:38 <ron1n> the install process should not be excrutiatingly different
Nov 12 01:23:45 <johnx> it needs a newer kernel than 2.6.21
Nov 12 01:35:03 <disco_stu> hi every1
Nov 12 02:48:00 <GAN800> http wiki doesn't work period.
Nov 12 02:48:04 <GAN800> Nice.
Nov 12 02:52:28 <johnx> at least it works via https now
Nov 12 02:52:38 <johnx> at least we can tell people to go somewhere now
Nov 12 02:53:39 <GAN800> The no-error blank page isn't much fun
Nov 12 02:55:22 <johnx> no, not especially
Nov 12 02:55:48 * GAN800 crosses his fingers and wait three days.
Nov 12 02:56:33 <johnx> ahaha...it's a pain in the ass, but it's so much better dealing with Nokia than Sharp :)
Nov 12 02:58:10 * GAN800 wouldn't know.
**** ENDING LOGGING AT Wed Nov 12 02:59:58 2008