**** BEGIN LOGGING AT Mon Jan 05 02:59:58 2009 Jan 05 03:02:01 hmm Jan 05 03:06:13 I'm using the omap branch with the NITDroid patch Jan 05 03:06:30 and I'm afraid I cant find that option Jan 05 03:06:57 use the / Jan 05 03:07:12 it is in, around Epson chip config Jan 05 03:08:14 hmm Jan 05 03:08:20 not seeing autorefresh Jan 05 03:08:24 or refresh Jan 05 03:08:48 default to manual update mode? Jan 05 03:08:55 in graphics Jan 05 03:09:57 i'm giving that a shot Jan 05 03:10:22 yes, that Jan 05 03:10:23 ... Jan 05 03:10:27 uncheck Jan 05 03:10:39 oh Jan 05 03:10:41 it was unchecked Jan 05 03:10:42 hah Jan 05 03:11:42 well i'll try it checked Jan 05 03:12:52 bummer Jan 05 03:12:59 no dice Jan 05 03:13:33 try it unchecked Jan 05 03:14:04 ah, and enable framebuffer console Jan 05 03:16:38 yeah Ive got that checked Jan 05 03:17:21 and unchecked the other Jan 05 03:17:23 still no dice Jan 05 03:17:48 weird Jan 05 03:17:49 it doesn't fade away like some failed kernels though Jan 05 03:18:14 it just sits at the nokia splash and turns off after about 10 seconds Jan 05 03:18:25 ok Jan 05 03:18:35 so it's the watchdog killing it Jan 05 03:18:47 you forgot to enable some needed driver Jan 05 03:18:54 or otherwise made it crash Jan 05 03:19:02 ok Jan 05 03:20:37 i should talk to bundyo, as far as I know hes the only one to have a newer kernel running on the 770 Jan 05 03:21:19 thanks for your help AStorm Jan 05 03:21:34 have you tried NITDroid yet? Jan 05 03:22:57 no, coding hwr takes too much time Jan 05 03:23:13 and wasting the remainder :P Jan 05 03:23:31 fair enough Jan 05 03:23:39 have you tried NITDroid yet? Jan 05 03:23:47 i wish i can on 770 Jan 05 03:23:50 is it possible ? Jan 05 03:23:53 working on getting it working on 770 Jan 05 03:23:59 or trying and failing Jan 05 03:24:01 really ? Jan 05 03:24:08 how far did you go Jan 05 03:24:14 #nitdroid is open btw Jan 05 03:24:21 ah Jan 05 03:24:26 sweetr Jan 05 03:25:04 do you have a page of your works ? Jan 05 03:25:10 I linked some on Jan 05 03:25:15 http://rzr.online.fr/q/omap Jan 05 03:26:38 haven't gotten that far Jan 05 03:27:01 the nitdroid kernel doesnt get anywhere Jan 05 03:27:27 bundyo's kernel at least loads Jan 05 03:28:25 how much space does this operation requiere ? Jan 05 03:28:38 deblet needs like a 2GB card Jan 05 03:29:52 mm, I actually only have the 64meg card now Jan 05 03:30:00 but its enough to hold the nitdroid rootfs Jan 05 03:30:28 no way Jan 05 03:30:43 which bootloader, flasher are you using ? Jan 05 03:30:43 yep, its only about 50 megs Jan 05 03:30:46 unless it'sx jffs2, which can't be ran off a card Jan 05 03:31:29 Hmm Jan 05 03:31:31 what do you mean AStorm? Jan 05 03:31:39 the ext3 partition works fine Jan 05 03:31:43 is there a way to write to the SDcard over wifi? Other than scp... Jan 05 03:31:44 its only about 62 Jan 05 03:31:50 it fits? Jan 05 03:31:54 yep Jan 05 03:31:56 hm Jan 05 03:31:57 its about 50 Jan 05 03:32:01 is there a way to write to the SDcard over wifi? Other than scp... Jan 05 03:32:07 using NFS ? Jan 05 03:32:10 Vulcanis, yup, with gadget driver Jan 05 03:32:19 oh, wait, wifi Jan 05 03:32:37 you can also use nbd (network block device) Jan 05 03:32:45 and how do I use those? Jan 05 03:32:56 kernel driver and some software Jan 05 03:32:59 google knows Jan 05 03:33:05 :) Jan 05 03:33:15 how do I write to the device using nfs, then Jan 05 03:33:32 you'd need an nfs server Jan 05 03:33:35 @rzr nokia flasher, no bootloader I don't think Jan 05 03:33:42 I think there is one in the repos Jan 05 03:33:56 Alright, would it have some obscure name, or would it be easyish to find? Jan 05 03:33:58 stelleg, not, none, but rather Fiasco Jan 05 03:34:10 Vulcanis, no, nfs-server or nfsd Jan 05 03:34:13 ah, ok thanks Jan 05 03:34:14 or such Jan 05 03:34:16 alright Jan 05 03:34:23 http://www.internettablettalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=21747 Jan 05 03:35:58 stelleg: update this thread if you go anywhere plz Jan 05 03:36:37 http://www.bundyo.org/maemo/nitdroid/nitdroid_770_20081223.tar.bz2 Jan 05 03:36:47 okey dokey Jan 05 03:38:03 i'll test this w/ OS2008HE my side tomorow Jan 05 03:38:33 thats the kernel image that should work with a working android rootfs according to the directions at nitdroid site Jan 05 03:39:32 i tried to hack together a working android rootfs to no avail, getting init errors Jan 05 03:41:55 do you want me to compare the process on my device ? Jan 05 03:42:02 how long could it takes ? Jan 05 03:42:12 you have a 770? Jan 05 03:42:29 sorry, android can't be supported. unless google open-sources its server software Jan 05 03:42:37 so anyone can provide android web apps Jan 05 03:42:52 huh? Jan 05 03:42:56 stelleg: yes Jan 05 03:42:58 as it stands, it's a nice way to put all your personal information into the Total Information Awareness database Jan 05 03:43:14 pupnik: you mean google uses the same crap as apple store ? Jan 05 03:43:22 hmmh Jan 05 03:43:27 well i'm not an authority on the details Jan 05 03:43:30 rzr, it works well Jan 05 03:43:46 it will take a bit Jan 05 03:43:59 depending on how comfortable you are with partitionning, and flashing Jan 05 03:44:06 i am ok Jan 05 03:44:24 just follow the instructions on the nitdroid site Jan 05 03:44:28 ok Jan 05 03:44:45 except use the kernel I linked to here Jan 05 03:45:04 as the one on the site doesn't work at all, at least for me Jan 05 03:45:14 there is no risk to brick it ? ;) Jan 05 03:45:22 I don't know Jan 05 03:45:34 but I've treated mine pretty badly and it's survived Jan 05 03:45:41 -Extract the NITdroid files to your new filesystem with 'cd /mnt;tar -xjpvf path_to/rootfs_nitdroid.tar.bz2'. Jan 05 03:45:46 which files ? Jan 05 03:46:02 yours is only an image of kernel right ? Jan 05 03:48:05 this ones i guess Jan 05 03:48:07 http://guug.org/nit/nitdroid/rootfs-nitdroid.tar.bz2 Jan 05 03:48:54 stelleg: Jan 05 03:48:54 NITdroid debugging kernel for N770 (2.6.28-rc8-omap 2008Dec10) Jan 05 03:49:12 god, why does EVERYONE try to run Android on EVERYTHINg? Jan 05 03:49:16 * towo frowns Jan 05 03:49:38 Although I do admit it making more sense on an NIT instead of a netbook.. Jan 05 03:51:31 lol Jan 05 03:51:48 I'm using android on my quad core gaming machine Jan 05 03:51:51 not too many games though Jan 05 03:52:22 tried to install gears of war 2 but it didn't work Jan 05 03:52:28 I filed a bug report Jan 05 03:52:44 Proteous: if it supports vmware :) Jan 05 03:53:31 towo, because it's the latest rage Jan 05 03:53:33 :P Jan 05 03:53:43 and people are slaves to Google Jan 05 03:54:05 Google Fever Jan 05 03:54:39 mer would be my next test too Jan 05 03:54:41 people are silly Jan 05 03:56:56 re Jan 05 04:02:58 i hate to say this in a maemo chatroom but as an open source project android is light years ahead of maemo Jan 05 04:03:33 it's not Jan 05 04:03:41 really Jan 05 04:03:51 you can't even build a package for it Jan 05 04:04:06 what do you mean Jan 05 04:04:11 you can build apk's Jan 05 04:04:30 and you can download and compile their whole tree Jan 05 04:04:34 and put them where? Jan 05 04:04:41 duzt++ Jan 05 04:04:43 do they have a repository? Jan 05 04:04:55 stelleg, you are seriously deluded. Jan 05 04:05:35 no I've had a hell of a time finding maemo sources and resources Jan 05 04:05:40 thats all Jan 05 04:05:47 Pfft Jan 05 04:05:58 the people here are a lot better than any online resources ive found Jan 05 04:05:59 mwhahaha Jan 05 04:06:06 http://maemo.org/development/sources/ Jan 05 04:06:16 exactly Jan 05 04:06:38 One person's ability (or inability) to find sources doesn't say anything about a project and it's Jan 05 04:06:48 "open sourciness" Jan 05 04:06:57 s/it's/it/ Jan 05 04:07:03 * GAN8001 sighs Jan 05 04:07:07 Damn keyboard Jan 05 04:08:23 do those repositories include kernel sources? Jan 05 04:09:28 yes Jan 05 04:09:45 hmm Jan 05 04:10:06 everything except a few nits like closed dsme, bme, wifi driver Jan 05 04:10:06 I guess I'm just bitter because I' Jan 05 04:10:15 ok Jan 05 04:10:19 there's another wifi driver though Jan 05 04:10:21 :) Jan 05 04:10:33 just for 8x0 right Jan 05 04:10:35 Logically enough: http://repository.maemo.org/pool/fremantle/free/k/kernel/ Jan 05 04:11:13 It's similar enough to the 770 that a backport shouldn't be too overwhelmingly difficult. Jan 05 04:12:06 is that what was done for 2008he? Jan 05 04:13:29 yes Jan 05 04:13:52 weird Jan 05 04:14:13 I was under the impression while using 2008he that I was still running a 2.6.16 Jan 05 04:14:34 or maybe... well Jan 05 04:14:51 ask linux-omap guys, they'll be happy to note any bugs Jan 05 04:15:21 AStorm, what are you saying was done for OS2008HE? Jan 05 04:15:38 hmm, no Jan 05 04:15:44 kernel wasn't changed Jan 05 04:15:59 I'm saying the STLC45xx wont be overly difficult to make work for the 770. Jan 05 04:16:14 Which is one of the larger things keeping it on an old kernel. Jan 05 04:16:14 don't they use different wifi chips? Jan 05 04:16:43 One model number apart. Jan 05 04:16:58 which mostly means firmware differences Jan 05 04:17:08 cool Jan 05 04:18:04 i really haven't played with my 770 for a year or two now Jan 05 04:19:49 but not being able to upgrade to newer versions of maemo made me kind of bitter Jan 05 04:20:37 which is one of the things motivating me to work on getting android on it Jan 05 04:20:47 so I'm sorry if I offended Jan 05 04:21:21 deprecation and all Jan 05 04:21:37 I guess android will do such too some time in the future Jan 05 04:49:31 ubuntu 8.10 would use flasher-3.0 correct? Jan 05 05:06:52 anyone want to hold my hand and walk me through flashing? Jan 05 05:07:12 cause there seems to be something trivial that im not getting Jan 05 05:08:38 <`Mace_> hm Jan 05 05:09:08 <`Mace> hm Jan 05 05:09:28 <`Mace> i think someone is botnetting my ip :) Jan 05 05:09:40 * `Mace calls comcast to have it logged and blocked higher up Jan 05 05:09:56 <`Mace> the joy of having a business line Jan 05 05:09:56 <`Mace> haha Jan 05 05:21:48 hi `Mace Jan 05 05:27:00 anyone there? Jan 05 06:34:26 So is it true that there's no OSS PowerVR SGX 530 driver? Jan 05 07:20:24 seen qwerty Jan 05 07:23:00 Anyway... I'm the authour of SyncTERM and apparently, qwerty offered to do a build for Nokia tablets but hat dependency issues (most likely with Cryptlib) Jan 05 07:32:06 Wait a bit and he will come Jan 05 07:32:57 In the meanwhile, are you sure that this page: http://syncterm.bbsdev.net/ has the right background clor? =) Jan 05 07:32:59 color Jan 05 07:33:29 Bwahaha! Jan 05 07:33:31 Yes. Jan 05 07:33:32 :-) Jan 05 07:33:55 Though... the joke may be getting a bit too old now. Jan 05 07:34:55 * Deuce pounces on qwerty12 Jan 05 07:35:22 gmake RELEASE=1 WITHOUT_OOII=1 WITHOUT_CRYPTLIB=1 WITHOUT_PORTAUDIO=1 Jan 05 07:35:34 What's prolly what you want for SyncTERM. Jan 05 07:36:21 If loosing full-screen isn't an issue, you may also want to add WITHOUT_SDL=1 Jan 05 07:36:33 The first line sounds cool. Jan 05 07:36:58 It does run-time linking so even when it's built with SDL, SDL isn't required... Jan 05 07:36:59 Same for X11 Jan 05 07:37:18 Actually same for most optional stuff. Jan 05 07:37:26 What is the normal audio API for the target? Jan 05 07:39:32 hehehehe Jan 05 07:42:03 Deuce, http://qwerty12.maemobox.org/syncterm Jan 05 07:43:46 qwerty12: Cool, thanks... any idea if it works? :-) Jan 05 07:43:59 Nope :) Jan 05 07:44:20 Think he'll know what to do with the binary? Jan 05 07:48:29 * Deuce adds it to the SyncTERM home page. Jan 05 08:26:33 blah Jan 05 08:29:37 Morning, all Jan 05 08:29:43 morning Jan 05 08:41:17 could someone take a quick look what's wrong with this: http://trac.tspre.org/meiz/mer-ui-extras.tar.gz . It's the first script i have ever made, so i think it's pretty simple.. The Theme install and select part of it are both working, but anything else i press in the Main-Menu, just closes it with no output in terminal... Jan 05 08:42:50 i want to have simple way of installing maemos themes etc.. :P Jan 05 08:52:00 * Meiz_n810 gets back tgo maemo... Jan 05 08:58:00 hm Jan 05 09:13:19 Any users about? Jan 05 09:13:40 ... Or devs Jan 05 09:14:19 wrong question. Just ask your question. Jan 05 09:17:11 ... Right. I have some bt kbd issues.... 1) i often have to delete my kbd and re-pair it... What am i doing wrong? 2) how do i get it to type in dvorak? Jan 05 09:23:32 <`Mace> hm Jan 05 09:23:55 <`Mace> i wanna see screen shots of mer Jan 05 09:24:09 <`Mace> how is it coming along? Jan 05 09:30:29 <`Mace> ? Jan 05 09:39:31 * alterego contemplates testing a statically linked ruby distribution with all the gtk and maemo bindings linked in. Jan 05 09:39:40 I bet that would go a bit faster. Jan 05 09:40:07 no Jan 05 09:40:14 it would be heavy Jan 05 09:40:27 I didn't say I'd release it :P Jan 05 09:40:54 And it'll only link in the gtk and maemo extensions. Not a completely static executable. Jan 05 09:41:33 Basically a ruby-maemo VM :P Jan 05 09:41:43 hello! I have a N800. Can I handle calls and sms from my n800? Jan 05 09:42:21 sinak: internet calls - yes Jan 05 09:42:26 no and most likely no Jan 05 09:42:31 you can handle sip Jan 05 09:42:39 and somewhat skype Jan 05 09:42:48 sinak: or connect to your bt enabled phone, i think i saw an application like phonelink or so Jan 05 09:42:50 I think there's a phone manager application. Which can handle SMS. Jan 05 09:43:01 :-( Jan 05 09:43:12 which has very old drivers that won't work with anything Jan 05 09:43:29 phonelink just doesn't work Jan 05 09:43:49 i 'll google it Jan 05 09:43:54 to see if there is anythinh Jan 05 09:44:15 Hello everybody ! Jan 05 09:47:03 hi Khertan Jan 05 09:48:52 Hi Meiz Jan 05 09:50:05 sinak, good luck Jan 05 09:50:21 hello Jan 05 09:50:21 hehe Jan 05 09:50:37 * Khertan have just try to move the left bar of maemo-launcher to the top and reduce it ... Jan 05 09:50:57 and failed? Jan 05 09:51:09 * Khertan say that is wasn't a good idea ... as many things seems to be hard coded Jan 05 09:51:24 the bar is now on top Jan 05 09:51:53 but the menu bar is under it ... and menu open not on the good location so not all items is visible Jan 05 09:52:13 it s seems i can't merge the menu bar and the left one Jan 05 09:53:32 * Khertan was also thinking of porting the launcher of Ubuntu UME ... but it s seems to depends on clutter ... :( Jan 05 09:54:26 Khertan, I guess everything is hardcoded in the matchbox clone Jan 05 09:54:35 yep :( Jan 05 09:54:50 tried another WM? Jan 05 09:54:50 some parameters isn't read from the conf file Jan 05 09:54:56 nope ... Jan 05 09:55:06 Anybody flash poky to an n810? (Latest (pinky) is just reboot looping for me.) Jan 05 09:55:56 go bug hrw Jan 05 09:56:14 who? Jan 05 09:56:32 heh, it seems the minimalist theme for the itt forum is something of a testbed for webkit... Jan 05 09:57:36 fauxmight, the author? Jan 05 09:57:46 thx Jan 05 09:57:51 you mean, webkit fails again? Jan 05 09:58:51 ehh, how oh how should I solve the problem of letter separation in handwriting recognition w/o infringing on M$ patents? Jan 05 09:58:52 AStorm: we have the source of the current matchbox used in maemo ? Jan 05 09:58:58 (that is, no neural nets) Jan 05 09:59:10 Khertan, yes, in source repos Jan 05 09:59:40 k thanks .... maybe i should take a look to see if i can make an fork with a different style ... Jan 05 09:59:41 :) Jan 05 10:00:13 Khertan: you're going in the wrong direction, edit the hildon-desktop .conf's Jan 05 10:00:15 not matchbox Jan 05 10:00:16 or better, give us openbox and some panel? Jan 05 10:00:22 :P Jan 05 10:00:25 and edit themes Jan 05 10:00:44 he said he's tried it Jan 05 10:01:01 and it's not hardcoded in matchbox :P Jan 05 10:01:15 ? Jan 05 10:01:17 really ? Jan 05 10:01:23 oh, the left bar is Jan 05 10:01:24 yeah, it's all themed Jan 05 10:01:29 left bar isn't either Jan 05 10:01:32 it's hard to move it somewhere Jan 05 10:01:42 or drop the "tasklist" Jan 05 10:01:47 but how to merge left bar and top one containing menu ? Jan 05 10:01:48 i accidentially moved left bar in hildon-desktop so Jan 05 10:02:03 Khertan: probably editing the hildon-desktop .conf's and maybe the .sos for it Jan 05 10:02:05 Stskeeps, ... not that kind of simle Jan 05 10:02:22 yeah, .so is really easy to modify :P Jan 05 10:02:29 sure it is Jan 05 10:02:41 open source and all :P Jan 05 10:02:43 tell me, except recompiling code Jan 05 10:02:46 :P Jan 05 10:02:49 whatever Jan 05 10:03:08 yep ... it need a compilation ... Jan 05 10:03:12 so, any ideas how should I separate out letters? Jan 05 10:03:54 what i want to try to do is to remove the left bar to get some space :) Jan 05 10:03:59 ugh, this intertial scrolling that people want to stuff into everything is driving me insane! Jan 05 10:04:05 Khertan: http://bsd.tspre.org/~stskeeps/weirdhildon.png Jan 05 10:04:07 like that? :P Jan 05 10:04:18 (there's no left bar on that picture btw) Jan 05 10:04:20 t_s_o, it's good if done well Jan 05 10:04:30 i drag something around, watch it come to a halt, release the screen and suddenly it decides that it should start moving again! Jan 05 10:04:40 AStorm: then i have yet to see it done well Jan 05 10:04:59 canola? Jan 05 10:05:02 tear Jan 05 10:05:06 http://tabletui.files.wordpress.com/2008/12/12.jpg?w=800&h=480 Jan 05 10:05:10 (except it's right-handed) Jan 05 10:05:13 more like that : http://tabletui.files.wordpress.com/2008/12/12.jpg?w=800&h=480 :) Jan 05 10:05:21 without the bottom :) Jan 05 10:05:45 t_s_o: inertial is good when well used ... so it s mean not everywhere ! Jan 05 10:06:02 Khertan: yeah, i know, it's possible to do something like that :P Jan 05 10:06:07 almost everywhere Jan 05 10:06:10 saves space Jan 05 10:06:33 AStorm: and lost drag and drop... double click Jan 05 10:06:52 drag and drop is simple, do locked Jan 05 10:06:58 double click still works Jan 05 10:07:06 why wouldn't it? Jan 05 10:07:26 AStorm: yep ... it s works ... but need to do it with precision Jan 05 10:07:41 some tunable precision, yes Jan 05 10:07:45 Khertan: saw http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~mer-committers/m-r/hildon-desktop-layout-alpha/annotate/head%3A/desktop.conf for instance? Jan 05 10:07:49 or.. Jan 05 10:08:30 https://stage.maemo.org/viewcvs.cgi/projects/haf/trunk/hildon-desktop/data/desktop.conf.in?revision=13657&root=maemo&view=markup Jan 05 10:08:33 hmm, so no handwriting recognition expert around? :P Jan 05 10:08:50 Stskeeps: but if you move the left one to top ... the old top one is under the old left moved to top ... (you understand me ?) :) Jan 05 10:09:59 Khertan: well, i didn't go deep into details but there's definately a way to do what's in that UI :P Jan 05 10:10:43 but you can't move the main application menu to the top bar which contain menu for example, isn't it ? Jan 05 10:10:44 mer images are moving a lot closer these days, so it will be a -lot- easier to toy with things like that Jan 05 10:10:52 Khertan: i think you can actually Jan 05 10:11:02 so do it for him Jan 05 10:11:04 * AStorm hides Jan 05 10:11:12 :) Jan 05 10:13:18 hehe. maybe after this month. 3 exams coming up :( Jan 05 10:13:39 just 3? easy :P Jan 05 10:14:15 one article-length paper, one course in social and collaborative computing, and one in human-computer interaction Jan 05 10:14:18 :P Jan 05 10:14:38 i ll try to found :) Jan 05 10:14:39 hehe Jan 05 10:14:48 if you found ... i can do it too :) Jan 05 10:15:16 I've 4, one lawyerese, one databases, one computer diagnostics, one ai Jan 05 10:15:24 could someone take a quick look what's wrong with this?: http://trac.tspre.org/meiz/mer-ui-extras.tar.gz. First script i have ever made, so it's pretty simple. I want to have "easy" way to install maemos themes and maybe some other stuff, but this far, only the theme setup works. All the other buttons just closes it and shows no output in terminal... Jan 05 10:15:52 and 2 papers, one handwriting recog. app, two presentations Jan 05 10:15:55 :P Jan 05 10:15:59 it's about Mer (i always forgot to mention) Jan 05 10:16:08 so, I'm doomed Jan 05 10:16:21 Meizirkki: you do shell script? Jan 05 10:16:28 i have plenty of stuff for you to work on then :P Jan 05 10:16:39 i can try Jan 05 10:17:05 heck, forgot to add IT project management Jan 05 10:17:09 dpkg -i *themes-os08-12pt-0.1-1.deb looks weird though Jan 05 10:17:09 another exam Jan 05 10:17:22 AStorm: add on top of that part-time work and having to think about masters thesis :P Jan 05 10:17:24 Stskeeps, so, be happy, I'm more doomed than you Jan 05 10:17:30 yup, you are Jan 05 10:17:31 :P Jan 05 10:17:41 well, Add to that finding a job :P Jan 05 10:17:50 Stskeeps: wget doenloads something like html%kjfkldshfjkgjksghjklsghlökhgf%themes-os08-12pt-0.1-1.deb so i had to add the * Jan 05 10:18:10 and engineer paper soon :> Jan 05 10:18:13 Meizirkki: scary Jan 05 10:19:35 also, it's very cold out there and I can't get myself to move ass outside Jan 05 10:19:37 yet have to Jan 05 10:19:42 drat Jan 05 10:20:28 hopefully tap water is not frozen Jan 05 10:20:53 it's not, hooray! Jan 05 10:20:57 :/ Jan 05 10:21:07 .... Jan 05 10:22:01 hum ... there is no conf file about where the menu is located ? (i mean the menu used by application, not the main application menu) Jan 05 10:22:28 Meizirkki: looks good besides that Jan 05 10:22:43 thanks :) Jan 05 10:22:43 Khertan: i -think- there should be one, but im not sure where Jan 05 10:22:58 i found things about the statusbar applet ... Jan 05 10:23:09 maybe in the theme ? Jan 05 10:23:32 wow, 10cm of snow Jan 05 10:24:11 Khertan: https://stage.maemo.org/svn/maemo/projects/haf/trunk/hildon-theme-layout-4/rc/gtkmenu.rc points to that it might be Jan 05 10:24:31 great thx Jan 05 10:24:41 one plus is that I can have coffee conveniently cooled down by placing it outside Jan 05 10:27:20 yuck, cold coffee Jan 05 10:27:43 not cold Jan 05 10:27:48 just not burning Jan 05 10:27:53 heh Jan 05 10:28:40 wonder what new buttery nothingnesses will be revealed at macworld Jan 05 10:29:04 "steve jobs is dying"? Jan 05 10:29:14 again? :P Jan 05 10:29:16 everyone is dying Jan 05 10:30:10 not everyone just spend 1 hour trying to get AC3 decoding working with tversity Jan 05 10:30:28 luckly I was finaly graced with success Jan 05 10:30:28 everyone ... it s just a matter of time Jan 05 10:31:00 man, how did people solve problems before the internet Jan 05 10:31:20 maybe there weren't any problems before the internet!! Jan 05 10:35:15 * Khertan withdraw ... and will return to his python code ... Jan 05 10:48:06 Happy New Year all Jan 05 10:48:30 Proteous, rotfl Jan 05 10:48:35 we used newspapers Jan 05 10:48:37 and tv Jan 05 10:56:41 Jaffa: ping Jan 05 10:56:58 GeneralAntilles: ping Jan 05 10:58:14 morning lardman Jan 05 10:58:19 hey Stskeeps Jan 05 11:08:55 happy new year lardman Jan 05 11:12:41 ~seen qwerty12 Jan 05 11:12:43 qwerty12 was last seen on IRC in channel #maemo, 3h 28m 44s ago, saying: 'Nope :)'. Jan 05 11:12:54 ~memo Jan 05 11:13:01 ;( Jan 05 11:13:48 hey Khertan, you too Jan 05 11:16:00 so ... i hope disco_stu will read the logs ... :) Jan 05 11:16:16 disco_stu : yep i ve compiled glade ... it s run well on the tablette Jan 05 11:16:42 -o noatime seems to really speed up jaunty .. Jan 05 11:16:53 nah, maybe i am just dreaming Jan 05 11:16:55 it s bit borring as it s require switching windows for everythings ... but it s work Jan 05 11:18:37 disco_stu : and i can send it to you the deb package if you need it ... just send me a mail Jan 05 11:18:48 ~seen disco_stu Jan 05 11:18:49 disco_stu is currently on #maemo. Has said a total of 27 messages. Is idling for 4d 2h 52m 25s, last said: 'thx'. Jan 05 11:20:54 Meizirkki, noatime will speed up a lot on mmc Jan 05 11:21:00 as writes are expensive Jan 05 11:21:25 * AStorm is eager to try latest btrfs with compression Jan 05 11:22:03 Stskeeps: is Mer: linuxrc using -o noatime ? Jan 05 11:28:26 Meizirkki: it's the bootmenu item that decides it Jan 05 11:28:58 and the first mer beta is planned for when ? ( :) ) Jan 05 11:29:52 Khertan: when installer is done, auto-startx, firstboot wizard and osso-xterm is compiled :P Jan 05 11:30:00 and it'd be an alpha :) Jan 05 11:31:38 i m back Jan 05 11:31:41 wb Jan 05 11:31:46 closed the wrong window :) Jan 05 11:31:51 Khertan: when installer is done, auto-startx, firstboot wizard and osso-xterm is compiled :P and then it'd be an alpha :) Jan 05 11:31:55 (if you didnt see) Jan 05 11:32:07 (thx, i ven't see) Jan 05 11:32:27 installer could not be difficult Jan 05 11:32:38 firstboot wizard ... could be borring Jan 05 11:33:23 installer can be difficult when the kernel lies to us, and says the internal SD card is the external SD, on N810 :) Jan 05 11:33:37 (and vice versa) Jan 05 11:34:18 hum ... true Jan 05 11:35:49 it s a bit like a Palm TX saying it s a lifedrive ... a lifedrive is a TX ... and when firmware update come all was Palm TX ... or Treo650 saying it s a Treo680 and a 680 saying ... hum nothing :) Jan 05 11:36:24 every device lies ... look at browser user agent ... Jan 05 11:36:26 :) Jan 05 11:36:28 hehe Jan 05 11:37:45 in mer it's also interesting cos we have seperated the hildon desktop code and its "theme" Jan 05 11:37:57 so you can do desktop layout changes Jan 05 11:38:11 so people can experiment Jan 05 11:38:17 yep it could be really interessting Jan 05 11:38:30 Stskeeps, you can detect which is internal Jan 05 11:38:34 from sysfs Jan 05 11:38:36 :) Jan 05 11:38:44 AStorm: you'd think so, but it actually lies to us Jan 05 11:38:50 that's exactly where we got it Jan 05 11:38:58 no, really Jan 05 11:39:03 i'm not kidding either Jan 05 11:39:08 check chip params :) Jan 05 11:39:20 ok, but slot_name lies to us :P Jan 05 11:40:29 or just test case ... if RX44==True : .... elif RX34==True : .... elif RX48==True : ... elif RX51==True : .... Jan 05 11:40:41 Stskeeps, yes, check name Jan 05 11:40:53 k Jan 05 11:40:55 slot_name was fixed in the later linux-omap Jan 05 11:41:13 ah, so there was actually a bug, interesting Jan 05 11:41:53 i see that there is a sysbit driver for n8x0 ... Jan 05 11:42:11 do you know which vga adaptater use this chipset ? Jan 05 11:42:23 huh? Jan 05 11:42:38 ? Jan 05 11:42:44 sisusb you mean? Jan 05 11:42:49 or something Jan 05 11:42:55 ah :) yep sysusb Jan 05 11:43:08 sisusb is obviously for sis usb terminal Jan 05 11:43:23 nice thing, 800x600 Jan 05 11:43:52 ? Jan 05 11:44:25 it looks like a usb monitor Jan 05 11:44:43 think it's usb->vga converter too Jan 05 11:44:53 hm, yes Jan 05 11:45:00 there are two such devices Jan 05 11:45:21 still, no reason to use it with n8x0 Jan 05 11:45:39 no full hd for you either way :P Jan 05 11:47:40 there is reason ... Jan 05 11:47:50 for me ... Jan 05 11:48:01 making prototype application and for demo Jan 05 11:50:55 if only nobounds was true .... and not an hoax ... Jan 05 11:52:38 is there a way to have maemo mapper recalculate a route if you stray from the previous one? Jan 05 11:52:49 (provided that i have downloaded the necessary maps) Jan 05 11:53:02 not Jan 05 11:53:16 the routes aren't calculated at all Jan 05 11:53:16 is there any reason why not? Jan 05 11:53:20 just downloaded Jan 05 11:53:23 o Jan 05 11:53:30 ah, he doesn't calculate on local maps? Jan 05 11:53:34 from where does he download? Jan 05 11:53:41 I think someone could make it grab a new one to the same destination Jan 05 11:53:50 some server being a proxy to google maps Jan 05 11:53:52 :> Jan 05 11:53:57 o Jan 05 11:54:28 damn Jan 05 11:54:38 any work being done on integrating their own algoritm? Jan 05 11:54:44 huhwha? Jan 05 11:54:54 i mean to search routes Jan 05 11:54:56 well, mapper uses bitmap maps Jan 05 11:55:07 so searching on them is impossible Jan 05 11:55:08 mapper has no idea about streets? Jan 05 11:55:10 crap Jan 05 11:55:18 yup Jan 05 11:55:32 is such information also not available from openstreetmaps? Jan 05 11:55:39 I think someone worked on using vector data from openstreet Jan 05 11:55:55 but it means a major redesign of mapper either way Jan 05 11:55:55 bakarat_: we started looking at doing off line routing, but I at least have been busy with other things Jan 05 11:56:10 lardman, ah Jan 05 11:56:28 it was to be my second project, after dreadful handwriting recognition Jan 05 11:56:37 bakarat_: you might try onion's fork of maemo-mapper, it downloads rendered images to display, but can also use a local osm db for searching, etc Jan 05 11:56:49 hmm, nice Jan 05 11:57:01 can it do online route updates? Jan 05 11:57:14 lardman, happen to have a link? :> Jan 05 11:57:17 (well, if mapper could... that'd be great) Jan 05 11:57:33 the idea we were thinking of was to write a stand-alone server for the images & route, to use osm (for example); avoiding changes to maemo-mapper itself Jan 05 11:57:43 heh Jan 05 11:57:46 AStorm: not sure, I've not tried if for a long time Jan 05 11:58:02 what about abusing google some more? Jan 05 11:58:12 howso AStorm ? Jan 05 11:58:20 say, when gps strays more than x from route, redownload Jan 05 11:58:27 bakarat, still a change to mapper Jan 05 11:58:43 http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/index.php/User:Onion/Mapper Jan 05 11:59:17 lardman, thanks Jan 05 11:59:26 np Jan 05 11:59:35 AStorm, the whole problem (for me) is that i don't have connectivity on the road Jan 05 11:59:41 that's why i would need offline route finding Jan 05 11:59:42 well :P Jan 05 11:59:50 you have it Jan 05 11:59:56 but not fixing it Jan 05 12:00:29 In truth none of the free info sources are that reliable; I'd be tempted to pay for the built-in map app licence or to use gprs for route updates while online; at least in the short term Jan 05 12:00:40 osm itself has street-information yes? Jan 05 12:00:51 (that we can access) Jan 05 12:00:55 but certainly it's interesting, and I'd like to get it working so that at some point in the future it could be used Jan 05 12:00:57 yes, although incomplete :) Jan 05 12:01:09 esp. incomplete in my country Jan 05 12:01:09 AStorm, incomplete as in not every town in africa is mapped? :D Jan 05 12:01:22 no, as in Northampton isn't mapped Jan 05 12:01:31 :P Jan 05 12:01:32 damn :| Jan 05 12:01:50 depends where you are/go, but the fact some bits are missing is not ideal Jan 05 12:01:51 or most of Poland (except main transit routes) Jan 05 12:02:15 and i guess google maps and consorts don't hand out the street info? Jan 05 12:02:23 (or is that incomplete as well?) Jan 05 12:02:44 complete, but propietary Jan 05 12:02:51 so, no, you can't have it Jan 05 12:02:55 dammit :( Jan 05 12:03:40 and we can't even have partial vector data Jan 05 12:03:50 maybe.. maybe from hybrid maps Jan 05 12:05:08 gah, why can't the world be a happy place where everyone shares :P Jan 05 12:05:26 because there's no money in that Jan 05 12:05:27 :P Jan 05 12:05:41 pff google is rich enough Jan 05 12:05:41 :p Jan 05 12:05:49 no, sorry Jan 05 12:05:56 :> Jan 05 12:06:00 publically owned company Jan 05 12:06:11 these can never be rich enough Jan 05 12:06:12 well it's sort of going that way, but not there yet (the sharing bit) Jan 05 12:07:26 lardman: pong Jan 05 12:07:50 hey Jaffa Jan 05 12:08:02 was just going to touch base and see when the meeting will be?# Jan 05 12:08:29 Which one? debmaster or sprint? Jan 05 12:08:53 debmaster Jan 05 12:09:06 would debmaster assist community too btw? Jan 05 12:09:15 As opposed to assisting who? Jan 05 12:09:22 It's a community assistant role :-) Jan 05 12:09:27 alright Jan 05 12:09:47 i dunno, i read over the position rather quickly back then :) thought it said assist nokia as well or something :P Jan 05 12:09:50 lardman: Did you see my email yesterday at 15:21, suggesting no meeting needed ;-) Jan 05 12:11:01 Meizirkki: btw heads up - gconf2 in repository is horridly broken right now until i figure out how to deal with odd debian packaging :P Jan 05 12:11:42 Jaffa: ah, emails Jan 05 12:12:02 Jaffa: yes probably after I pinged you, have to trawl through ~300 emails Jan 05 12:12:07 see, debian packaging is odd Jan 05 12:12:11 it should die Jan 05 12:12:22 lardman: ah - you should get some kind of Internet tablet ;-) Jan 05 12:12:43 lol Jan 05 12:12:59 get a mail filter Jan 05 12:13:03 I had one Jan 05 12:13:07 I need one with an always on connection as lots of my hols were spent with no wifi Jan 05 12:13:13 makes life really easy Jan 05 12:13:18 lardman: roll on RX-51 Jan 05 12:13:32 indeed :) Jan 05 12:13:35 I want one already Jan 05 12:13:36 AStorm: some things make me want to bash my head against something, admittedly. but im not sure if other things are better :P Jan 05 12:13:36 :P Jan 05 12:13:40 NOOOO dont roll on it, you might damage the screen Jan 05 12:13:45 Stskeeps, ebuilds are Jan 05 12:13:53 lcuk: :p Jan 05 12:13:54 * AStorm hides Jan 05 12:13:55 .. Jan 05 12:14:01 morning chaps and chaps in dresses Jan 05 12:14:19 how did you know? Jan 05 12:14:24 hahaha Jan 05 12:14:29 I thought the web cam was off! Jan 05 12:14:44 you have been hax0r3d Jan 05 12:15:09 web cam was, but you left your nokia one enabled. Jan 05 12:15:17 we could only tell when you got it out of your handbag though Jan 05 12:15:24 does n810 camera show it's on? :P Jan 05 12:15:31 Jaffa, lardman: btw, you might want to be a bit more active in the debmaster selection. We probably lost the first month of actual work already.. Jan 05 12:15:39 Stskeeps, no, kernel can flash a red led Jan 05 12:15:45 yeah but lardman is used to red lights nearby Jan 05 12:15:48 but it's possible to disable that Jan 05 12:15:51 X-Fade: yeah I know Jan 05 12:16:01 thus, he's been rooted Jan 05 12:16:06 hehe Jan 05 12:16:08 (s)he's Jan 05 12:16:27 who wants lunch today then, and should i spring for bacon butties all round? Jan 05 12:16:35 * RST38h moss neutrally Jan 05 12:16:42 moos, mhm Jan 05 12:16:52 lcuk, ....... damn Jan 05 12:17:05 back in a mo Jan 05 12:17:06 I have to move my a** and buy something Jan 05 12:17:17 clean this place up etc. Jan 05 12:17:20 heck :/ Jan 05 12:17:59 and nobody to do it for me Jan 05 12:18:04 AStorm: i had to drag myself outside this morning too Jan 05 12:18:40 I'm trying since 3h Jan 05 12:18:50 ago Jan 05 12:18:54 i managed after snoozing my alarm for an hour for 4 hours Jan 05 12:18:55 :P Jan 05 12:19:44 meh, I'll better move Jan 05 12:26:01 you know its money when you trip a cable under your desk and suddenly your mouse starts flying.. Jan 05 12:26:04 monday Jan 05 12:41:24 X-Fade: decisions are being made as we speak Jan 05 12:46:38 Stskeeps: i want a flying mouse. Jan 05 12:48:04 i would be perfectly happy with a hoverboard. Jan 05 13:05:11 Stskeeps: Is mer using Maemo's kernel or linux-omap? Jan 05 13:05:29 fauxmight: right now? maemo kernel, but solca said linux-omap works too Jan 05 13:05:56 Where's the /dev/ list from? How'd you get a real /dev/dsp (does that work yet?) Jan 05 13:06:36 no, didn't touch dsp stuff yet, but it's fairly easy once you have dsp loader compiled (OSS) and the dsp tasks Jan 05 13:06:49 thanks Jan 05 13:07:18 i'm the gentoo guy (normally christendoc) -- trying to switch to the initfs loading method. Jan 05 13:07:42 murrayc, heh @ telepathy, theres not much that can be done - the operations are network based and having delays encountered when using synchronous code is much worse Jan 05 13:08:25 lcuk: Or you could read what I said in my blog post. Jan 05 13:08:46 fauxmight: yeah, i noticed - solca's kexec stuff is moving closer though Jan 05 13:10:44 i did Jan 05 13:11:39 So we have Jan 05 13:11:47 1. D-Bus makes normall-sync things async. Jan 05 13:12:13 That's solvable by not using, though there are less drastic ways to improve things there too. Jan 05 13:12:27 2. Runtime API detection makes extra steps. Jan 05 13:12:48 That's solvable by requiring components to implement specific API, so the equivalent of static typing can be used. Jan 05 13:12:55 1. not using d-bus, and having everything in-process, would negate the whole point of telepathy Jan 05 13:13:21 3. There are lots of little steps done together that seems like just one action. Jan 05 13:13:40 That can be improved by making less async operations by hiding the steps, as TpContact does. Jan 05 13:14:11 2. is true, but backwards compatibility means we can't just mandate things implement new API Jan 05 13:14:26 wjt: It would negate some of the design rationales, such as cross-language and letting-components-crash. It wouldn't negate the whole point - which is to do IM and real-time communication with multiple protocosl. Jan 05 13:14:34 wjt: Yes, that's hard. Jan 05 13:14:45 murrayc: we already have a C library for that, it's called libpurple Jan 05 13:15:03 murrayc: part of the attraction of telepathy is to allow various applications to reuse the IM connectivity Jan 05 13:15:05 For what? Jan 05 13:15:09 Stskeeps: just looking at the filesystem (haven't booted it). Once booted is gui or cli functional right now? (Does it boot as is?) Jan 05 13:15:16 for IM and RT communication with multiple protocols Jan 05 13:15:31 wjt: Yes, but that can still be done with a C API. Just as many applications can use the same database server via a C API. Jan 05 13:15:43 wjt: I'm not suggesting that it should be done. It's far too far along, of courtse. Jan 05 13:15:48 and they have to make asynchronous calls to that database Jan 05 13:15:59 or risk blocking the UI Jan 05 13:16:00 fauxmight: boots as-is with deblet bootmenu.d and a linuxrc-using .item Jan 05 13:16:04 if you're speaking of mer Jan 05 13:16:11 wjt: But only the long/slow things are async. Jan 05 13:16:12 yes Jan 05 13:16:12 there's coming a installer and such up soon though Jan 05 13:16:20 which does the boring work Jan 05 13:16:58 When I've got some free space on a sdcard I'll get it going. Jan 05 13:16:59 wjt: Unfortunately many of the benefits of a C library (or C++, ideally) would only be there if you could do static typing (No runtime API detection). Jan 05 13:17:14 murrayc: in the presence of, eg, the kernel swapping things out, you can't reliably guess what will be slow. and, we're spending a lot of time reducing the number of roundtrips needed to do things Jan 05 13:17:16 databases are bad example because theres many types and sometimes async sometimes not, but theres no such thing as syncronous smtp (for example) Jan 05 13:17:52 wjt: That sounds like it would be less of a problem without using separate component processes. Jan 05 13:18:13 anyway. Jan 05 13:18:48 murrayc: tp-glib *is* a static typed C library. the places where excessive type variance show u, or you're exposed to multiple interfaces for the same job, are places in our API where we need to do more work Jan 05 13:19:02 I think the wait_until_ready() calls really annoy me. Jan 05 13:19:26 yeah, don't call that. Jan 05 13:19:35 hook to the ready signal and go back into the mainloop Jan 05 13:19:35 Robot101: equally, call_when_ready is a bit annoying Jan 05 13:19:51 the re-entrant faux blocking was a mistake Jan 05 13:19:53 i don't dispute for a moment that writing async code in C is a pain Jan 05 13:19:55 Robot101: It's not static-typed in the way I mean. I can't just cast to an interface (at build time) and expect it to work at compile time. Jan 05 13:19:58 maybe we should just rip it out and do an ABI bump Jan 05 13:20:36 wjt, technically writing async in any language is annoying Jan 05 13:20:39 Robot101: The faux blocking seems to be not working due to a) bugs in D-Bus and b) aspects of the D-Bus design, such as lack of method sequence guarantees. Jan 05 13:20:56 lcuk: in better languages you can construct better abstractions Jan 05 13:20:59 what?! Jan 05 13:21:11 d-bus absolutely *does* guarantee message ordering Jan 05 13:21:23 d-bus does have /message/ sequence guarantees, but the services can return methods in a different order to what they were called in Jan 05 13:21:37 has the gps first fix time been upgraded with the diablo release? Jan 05 13:21:41 wjt, fact still remains async is harder on the greymatter than sync Jan 05 13:21:47 one of the big problems with faking sync calls is that they reorder messages, thus breaking that guarantee Jan 05 13:21:48 wjt: Sorry. I knew I'd get that sentence wrong. What I meant was "that stuff that smcv or you or someone said in that email that I didnt' take the time to actually parse fully". Jan 05 13:21:50 lcuk: yeah, but threading is /harder/ Jan 05 13:22:12 Robot101: (in C) Jan 05 13:22:22 Threading is indeed even worse. Jan 05 13:22:25 wjt: yes, lets all use message-passing erlang concurrency and stuff :) Jan 05 13:22:34 murrayc: that stuff is what makes blocking stuff totally broken Jan 05 13:23:16 telepathy-glib would be easier with sigc::slot and C++isms, and hopefully it is in the Qt binding. Then you just have the logic to worry about. In C you have the memory management to worry about too. Jan 05 13:23:59 Robot101: So, the lack of a nice semi-async blocking API _is_ down to the use of D-Bus rather than the async nature of things in general. Jan 05 13:24:10 semi-async blocking? Jan 05 13:24:19 "faux blocking". Jan 05 13:24:22 You know what I mean. Jan 05 13:24:45 I think its a problem inherent in IPC Jan 05 13:24:53 you call a method Jan 05 13:25:05 it crosses over with a message which says "foobar is offline/dead/buried/whatever" Jan 05 13:25:05 Right, I don't think the specific IPC mechanism is what makes this hard Jan 05 13:25:15 then you get a reply telling you "the thing you asked for is gone now" Jan 05 13:25:23 * lcuk just uses state transitions with network protocols (and async things in general) Jan 05 13:25:27 if you re-order messages, you fuck this up Jan 05 13:25:39 any kind of blocking implies message re-ordering Jan 05 13:25:45 anyway, back later Jan 05 13:26:08 or you're threading in your client side app and have to unwind ongoing calls when you get the signal in the middle Jan 05 13:26:11 Why does blocking imply reordering? I'm not saying it doesn't. I haven't a clue. I'm just trying to understand. Jan 05 13:26:23 if your app is single threaded Jan 05 13:26:28 and it's sent a message which calls a method Jan 05 13:26:38 because if you send message a, then get message b before getting a reply to message a, if you're blocking on the reply to a you either have to drop b or reorder the two Jan 05 13:26:40 and will not proceed in running any code until it's received the reply Jan 05 13:27:04 wjt: Ah, I see. Jan 05 13:27:07 then the signal callback for the signal in the middle will not be called until you've got the method reply and carried on with what you were doing, and dropped back into the mainloop Jan 05 13:27:12 or, what he said. :P Jan 05 13:27:22 that's not a design *flaw* per se Jan 05 13:27:27 Yeah. Jan 05 13:27:43 it's not a d-bus problem, it's because there is a bidirectional queue of events. we can try and do something at the same time as the world shifting beneath our feet. Jan 05 13:28:27 So threads seem necessary to allow this faux blocking. Jan 05 13:28:45 That of course would be hugely complex. Jan 05 13:29:15 yup Jan 05 13:29:17 in a language like C, yes :) Jan 05 13:29:23 so, we end up with async callbacks Jan 05 13:29:42 no-one @ maemo-politics? Jan 05 13:29:49 :P Jan 05 13:30:33 I wonder if message reordering is a significant problem if your (blocking) methods can be guaranteed (by spec) to finish very quickly. Jan 05 13:30:44 yes Jan 05 13:30:51 it's nothing to do with the time Jan 05 13:30:53 It seems that people do block for D-Bus property gets. Jan 05 13:30:57 they shouldn't Jan 05 13:31:01 people = davidz? :D Jan 05 13:31:20 it's to do with events which are, essentially, simultaneous Jan 05 13:31:30 Yeah. And I thought you were doing that in telepathy. Sorry. Jan 05 13:31:52 we've been meaning to ding him about that :) Jan 05 13:32:13 although to be fair, GetAll won't do network traffic in telepathy backends Jan 05 13:32:34 and nor is it meant to fail Jan 05 13:32:44 but it could fail, if the object's gone away Jan 05 13:32:48 so in that case, the real implications of blocking GetAll are probably quite slim Jan 05 13:33:17 the problem is that it can lead to ridiculously hard-to-reproduce failure cases Jan 05 13:33:21 It just seems sometimes silly that we have all this asyncness just for super-quick getter/setters just because of the IPC, when actually the other process is on the same PC and the call isn't causing any additional IO. Jan 05 13:33:32 the other process might not be Jan 05 13:33:53 we're plotting to do a thing to forward connections from another machine, so you could do something better than irssi-in-screen Jan 05 13:34:23 murrayc: as a general design principle, we're trying to bundle the "ensure the state is up to date and being tracked" round trips (as few as possible) with the slow part (eg request this new channel) Jan 05 13:34:36 Robot101: Cool. Jan 05 13:34:41 murrayc: so you go from request a channel to a working and live channel object, without intermediate steps Jan 05 13:35:04 which is necessarily async, but the "yawn yawn why does this have to be async too ready what life is hard go away" is just done for you Jan 05 13:35:09 Robot101: I also like the technique used in TpContact, of it doing lots of work and just telling me when it has stuff for me. Jan 05 13:35:14 yeah Jan 05 13:35:26 that's what it's /meant/ to be like, we've just not had enough monkeys on tp-glib thus far :) Jan 05 13:35:54 it doesn't help that we're kind of half-way between being really round-trip happy and the future Jan 05 13:35:58 there's code in libempathy which does some of this which we're gradually hoping to drain into libtelepathy-glib, and/or delete/rewrite Jan 05 13:36:16 a concerted effort to upgrade all the old CMs would help Jan 05 13:36:27 Yeah, I know you are doing all kinds of things. I don't mean to criticize unfairly. Jan 05 13:36:27 (he says, having not hacked on haze in forever...) Jan 05 13:37:00 It would be nice to have that new telepathy-glib crasher fixed though. Jan 05 14:19:31 is there any way to draw over an overlay (specifically xvimagesink) or to clear it or hide it or something? Jan 05 14:20:11 uhm, no Jan 05 14:20:25 at least if the overlay is hardware Jan 05 14:20:31 which it isn't really right now Jan 05 14:20:55 or you could just draw some unkeyed color Jan 05 14:25:04 hmm.. it's because I've got an xvimagesink which I want to pause and then draw some things and then unpause, which works ok if I block the sink pad, except it continues to display the last frame it rendered, and even when I sent an expose event it's still there Jan 05 14:25:34 it's an overlay after all Jan 05 14:25:34 interestingly it works on my PC, but not on the N800 Jan 05 14:25:45 you'd have to draw over all the canvas Jan 05 14:25:55 how do you do that? Jan 05 14:26:05 uhm... using the GTK? Jan 05 14:26:16 or whatever you're drawing it with Jan 05 14:27:11 when I draw anything it draws behind it Jan 05 14:28:58 the hint is in the overlay ;) Jan 05 14:29:16 fishmonkey, what kind of thing are you trying to draw? mplayer for example draws is OSD into the overlay itself Jan 05 14:29:46 johnx, with gstreamer you cant really do that without making a new filter Jan 05 14:30:00 afternoon johnx Jan 05 14:30:06 ah, didn't know gstreamer was part of it Jan 05 14:30:08 hey Stskeeps Jan 05 14:30:21 It's drawing an image Jan 05 14:32:12 is there anyway to stop the overlay overlaying. or something Jan 05 14:32:12 well, apparently Xv in maemo is broken Jan 05 14:32:16 as lcuk noticed himself ;P Jan 05 14:32:24 oh Jan 05 14:32:29 it should be possible to draw over an overlay Jan 05 14:32:32 xv WORKS in maemo, nothing else is as fast Jan 05 14:32:39 johnx: how do i make sanely transition from libgconf2-4 to libgconf2-6? there's obviously packages depending on libgconf2-4 >= some version Jan 05 14:32:40 works, but not entirely up to spec Jan 05 14:32:41 ;) Jan 05 14:32:49 whats missing? Jan 05 14:32:58 overlaying an overlay Jan 05 14:33:26 but the "overlay" is simply the latest data sent to the LCD, if that last bit happens to overlay the overlay it works Jan 05 14:33:41 i think Jan 05 14:33:47 johnx: funny stats, debian beta3 was downloaded 25 times in december Jan 05 14:33:48 thats why i can get the menu ontop of liqbase ;) Jan 05 14:33:48 Stskeeps, I think Debian does things like this by just breaking the repo for a while. Just put in libgconf2-6 and then start rebuilding everything Jan 05 14:33:49 from my mirror Jan 05 14:33:56 johnx: yeah, except that's not so easy.. Jan 05 14:33:59 wait wait Jan 05 14:34:08 is that menu normal Xlib? Jan 05 14:34:19 johnx: try a apt-get rdepends libgconf2-4 :) Jan 05 14:34:21 er Jan 05 14:34:24 apt-cache rdepends libgconf2-4 Jan 05 14:34:43 i dunno, but when i embedded liqbase XV overlay into a GTK windiw the gtk drawing operations were overlaying my overlay Jan 05 14:35:01 * johnx pulls out a device running mer. one sec Jan 05 14:35:06 anyway, im not here right now Jan 05 14:35:09 bbl Jan 05 14:35:23 you will not fool us! Jan 05 14:35:28 ;] Jan 05 14:35:40 lcuk: which is actually correct :) Jan 05 14:35:57 as long as you weren't drawing the "key color" Jan 05 14:35:59 btw, a new bug in modest Jan 05 14:36:06 that should be replaced by the overlay Jan 05 14:36:45 doesn't work no matter what color I draw it in Jan 05 14:36:55 weirldly it used to work Jan 05 14:37:03 now it doesn't Jan 05 14:37:46 modest started forgetting my gmail address Jan 05 14:39:03 Hi everyone! I've got a small problem. ssh client on my n810 stopped working properly recently. It says "no route to host". iptables seemed normal. Does anyone knows what's wrong?) Jan 05 14:39:30 kost-bebix, can you ping the host or wget from it on the tablet? Jan 05 14:39:49 johnx: no, can't ping it Jan 05 14:40:24 do other network connections work? Jan 05 14:40:36 can you connect to other hosts on the same network? on the internet? Jan 05 14:41:29 johnx: internet works great. But I can't ping another one or ssh to it at my home wifi or my work wifi network Jan 05 14:42:13 oh shit pop3 accounts no longer seem to work Jan 05 14:42:22 wonderful Jan 05 14:42:35 RST38bis, pop3 accounts never "worked" IMHO Jan 05 14:42:56 they did as of 31.12.08 Jan 05 14:43:15 RST38bis, I mean in general. switch to imap. call it a new year's resolution Jan 05 14:43:16 johnx: see why it might be a problem? :> Jan 05 14:43:19 and I have a record of that Jan 05 14:43:22 kost-bebix, can you ping the gateway Jan 05 14:43:47 Stskeeps, sorry, got distracted for a sec. looking now Jan 05 14:43:47 kost-bebix: try disabling power savings Jan 05 14:43:54 johnx: server does not support imap. imap is a piece of shit. Jan 05 14:44:35 johnx: I wonder if modest will ever be fixed though Jan 05 14:44:50 * aquatix uses imap with claws-mail Jan 05 14:44:56 same here. works fine :) Jan 05 14:45:02 modest is way too slow with my box Jan 05 14:45:06 johnx: yep, I can ping gateway Jan 05 14:45:27 kost-bebix, but not other things on the same network? Jan 05 14:45:28 modest works ok here Jan 05 14:45:29 including pop3 Jan 05 14:45:47 maybe it's port-filtered Jan 05 14:45:55 * aquatix only uses his (fairly huge) imap4 mailbox with a lot of folders Jan 05 14:46:06 on which modest almost barfs Jan 05 14:46:16 johnx: I can ping machines connected wired, but I can't ping other wireless machines Jan 05 14:46:26 well, it works fairly well vs my overfilled gmail Jan 05 14:46:37 it dls only new messages, unlike claws-mail Jan 05 14:46:45 which tries to download a list of everything Jan 05 14:46:54 esp. things I have to scroll 10 pages to reach Jan 05 14:46:55 :P Jan 05 14:46:58 kost-bebix, I would do like Stskeeps says and try disabling wifi power saving. it's at least good to make sure that's not the problem :) Jan 05 14:47:23 power saving problem would block http too Jan 05 14:47:43 it sounds like a fascist network more than anything else Jan 05 14:47:51 Stskeeps, do you mean it's a problem in terms of breaking compatibility with ubuntu packages? Jan 05 14:48:06 even secured against ping tunnels ;P Jan 05 14:48:11 when i click to update pop3 account nothing happens Jan 05 14:48:52 johnx: yeah, :P Jan 05 14:48:57 as in, most of gnome Jan 05 14:49:10 Stskeeps, well, we already can't install gnome because of gnomevfs Jan 05 14:49:11 when it is a drop-in replacement, it seems Jan 05 14:49:22 it's same problem though isn't it? Jan 05 14:49:49 new package name, drop in replacement Jan 05 14:50:07 for both ossognomevfs and libgconf2-4 Jan 05 14:50:13 and packages depending on it with versions Jan 05 14:50:21 i guess we can make a transitional package Jan 05 14:50:21 I wonder how drop-in they really are... Jan 05 14:50:51 one that has the proper version and actually depends on libgconf2-6 or something Jan 05 14:51:09 I mean in terms of API/ABI Jan 05 14:51:13 yeah, true Jan 05 14:51:18 we'll see :P Jan 05 14:51:40 libgconf2-6 is needed for maemo binaries at least Jan 05 14:51:59 brb Jan 05 14:52:07 w00t! http://news.cnet.com/8301-13924_3-10130690-64.html?part=rss&subj=news&tag=2547-1_3-0-5 Jan 05 14:52:12 heh, as ugly as it is, a fake empty package called libgconf2-4 that depends on libgconf2-6 seems like the least bad way to deal with this Jan 05 14:52:43 johnx: yep, looks like it's a wifi bridge's problem Jan 05 14:52:46 yeah, Meizirkki, seems like 2009/2010 may be pretty interesting, huh? :D Jan 05 14:53:03 yep Jan 05 14:53:20 i have been waitin for this :P (ARM-laptops) Jan 05 14:53:22 hmmmmm.... last modest update somehow broke pop3 account config - recreated it and all is fine so far Jan 05 14:54:12 Meizirkki, me too. I'm looking forward to a beagle for silent video playback actually, and hopefully a nice ARM board to use as a file server. will be wonderful for power consumption Jan 05 14:54:51 i probably have to think about power saving too if i move to poland.. a beagleboard and some usb enclosures might work :P Jan 05 14:55:00 or a mmc card :P Jan 05 14:55:35 I really don't like usb drives for important stuff. had too many bad experiences :/ Jan 05 14:56:04 hard drives are sketchy enough without adding another layer or adapting/converting to the interface Jan 05 14:56:11 mm Jan 05 14:57:02 saw a nice ARM board with some PCI slots and a couple sata ports too. probably really expensive though :/ Jan 05 14:57:37 i'll try transitional packages later today to clean up the mess, im off to bus now :P Jan 05 14:58:01 ok :) Jan 05 14:58:50 hey guys :) Jan 05 14:59:18 does anybody know if the n810 rotation support works with the latest SSU? Jan 05 15:04:02 hmm, omweather's not downloading, is this a known issue? Jan 05 15:04:26 it worked this morning for me Jan 05 15:04:42 did you update it recently? Jan 05 15:04:47 maybe restart tablet Jan 05 15:05:14 no updates, perhaps a network issue on my end, I'll do some looking when I get a minute Jan 05 15:06:19 there was an update recently Jan 05 15:06:25 as weather.com changed something Jan 05 15:06:29 maybe you've missed it Jan 05 15:07:05 lardman have you tried forca weather? Jan 05 15:07:29 AstralSt: could be, thanks Jan 05 15:07:34 moontiger: yep, that works fine Jan 05 15:07:50 yah i use that now Jan 05 15:08:47 I'm still undecided, I like the longer term predictions, though OM seems to say fog a lot more than Forca Jan 05 15:08:49 feel...brains...melting... Jan 05 15:08:58 you have more than one? Jan 05 15:09:01 :) Jan 05 15:09:07 not any more Jan 05 15:09:27 how was your xmas break then lardman ? Jan 05 15:09:56 I'd like an app using new.meteo.pl :> Jan 05 15:10:14 if someone could access the raw data they use for their plots... that would be awesome Jan 05 15:10:21 these are very precise Jan 05 15:10:36 obviously, for Poland ;P Jan 05 15:10:46 lcuk: not bad, not much time with computers (good and bad) Jan 05 15:10:47 :) Jan 05 15:10:48 there will be snowfall over number 22, with a 43% chance of rain at 23 Jan 05 15:10:53 though they predict some parts of Europe too Jan 05 15:10:53 hehe not much use for ppl outside of poland huh? Jan 05 15:11:05 lardman, thats a good thing, i hope you spent time with near n dear :) Jan 05 15:11:21 lcuk: yep :); and how was yours? Jan 05 15:11:23 <--- lives in madrid now Jan 05 15:11:31 it does predict for Madrid too Jan 05 15:11:36 AstralSt, you mean "there will be some of europe over there tomorrow" Jan 05 15:11:41 and other european capitals Jan 05 15:11:46 lardman, tiring tbh, tried lots of things Jan 05 15:11:49 bbl Jan 05 15:11:54 AstralSt, i use forca Jan 05 15:12:01 well, not Madrid, hmm Jan 05 15:12:28 most of central and eastern europe Jan 05 15:12:49 i have forca on my fone too and it works pretty well Jan 05 15:13:11 well, omweather is fine here, haven't tried forca yet Jan 05 15:13:14 where can I get that? Jan 05 15:13:32 its in the repos afaik Jan 05 15:14:09 mhm Jan 05 15:14:20 what are the main selling points over omweather? Jan 05 15:15:23 smaller and easier to use and works Jan 05 15:15:34 hmm, smaller? Jan 05 15:15:47 yah om is rather large imo Jan 05 15:15:54 I like the 6 day forecast Jan 05 15:16:03 forca has a 5 day Jan 05 15:16:16 uhm, right, 5 day + now Jan 05 15:16:17 :) Jan 05 15:16:35 for "now" i look out of the window Jan 05 15:16:40 :) Jan 05 15:16:51 out of the window is inaccurate if you're inside a building Jan 05 15:16:56 and there's no window around ;P Jan 05 15:17:12 also if you want to know the weather in a different city :P Jan 05 15:17:19 yup Jan 05 15:17:53 though sadly my exact area isn't covered: I'm ~15k away from the closest city and it's probably 3-4C colder here on average Jan 05 15:18:08 johnx: sooo, no problem then? :) Jan 05 15:18:15 you know the conversion ;) Jan 05 15:18:21 heh :P Jan 05 15:18:23 * aquatix has the same issue Jan 05 15:18:56 that city lies between my home town and the city i work, so it's not that big an issue Jan 05 15:20:58 johnx: that's why I'd love to use such forecast like that new.meteo.pl Jan 05 15:21:04 and possibly link it with GPS data :) Jan 05 15:21:38 it has 4km precision Jan 05 15:21:51 doesn't weather underground use data from new.meteo.pl or something? Jan 05 15:21:58 they have a lot of sources iir Jan 05 15:22:00 *iirc Jan 05 15:22:15 (although only 2d forecast time) Jan 05 15:23:21 while their alternate (IMO less precise) COAMPS model has 4d forecast length and 13km precision Jan 05 15:25:19 I'd love to work at that mainframe... Jan 05 15:25:33 actually, a large cluster Jan 05 15:27:54 AstralSt: :) Jan 05 15:28:58 but they don't take "inexperienced people" like myself :P Jan 05 15:31:10 Stskeeps: Could you upload Mer:s linuxrc somewhere? Jan 05 15:33:53 Stskeeps: Nevermind Jan 05 15:45:36 Hello again ! Jan 05 15:46:08 wb Jan 05 15:46:11 good morning all Jan 05 15:49:11 im having trouble getting flasher-3.0 working in ubuntu 8.10. im trying to follow the wiki.maemo.org directions, but i may be making a simple mistake Jan 05 15:49:39 churl1, mornin'. what problem are you having? Jan 05 15:49:45 like forgetting -f? :) Jan 05 15:49:53 no Jan 05 15:49:54 churl1: what options are you using? Jan 05 15:50:20 * qwerty12 makes a note to run sstrip only after dh_shlibdeps Jan 05 15:50:42 qwerty12: btw vte builds now, but there's a probable gcc4 problem Jan 05 15:50:57 as it breaks in compilation Jan 05 15:51:04 ./flasher-3.0 -F -f -R Jan 05 15:51:23 and trying sudo in front of that Jan 05 15:51:30 * Khertan see that mibbit.com really slow down his n810 Jan 05 15:51:38 Stslaptop, shitfuck >.<. I'm still liking the idea of vte9 instead... Jan 05 15:51:40 Khertan: just put xchat on your n810 Jan 05 15:51:49 its very usable :P Jan 05 15:51:57 churl1, ./flasher-3.0 -f -F -R Jan 05 15:52:06 but xchat use the real irc port Jan 05 15:52:08 it's ok, hmm Jan 05 15:52:16 which is b:lock by my stupid isp Jan 05 15:52:20 mm Jan 05 15:52:26 sfr sucks Jan 05 15:52:27 Khertan: then use some shell as a jump-off point Jan 05 15:52:35 ssh tunnels rock Jan 05 15:52:55 yep ... but my box at home seems down Jan 05 15:53:04 (all port is block) Jan 05 15:53:21 NAT at home? Jan 05 15:53:28 (only 80 is open) Jan 05 15:53:35 Khertan: train firewall or? :P Jan 05 15:53:35 hmm, fascist filter Jan 05 15:53:46 then run proxy at port 80 Jan 05 15:53:49 :) Jan 05 15:53:53 it says command not found Jan 05 15:53:53 yep i m in the train Jan 05 15:54:09 or a DNS tunnel Jan 05 15:54:16 "iodine"? Jan 05 15:54:16 :P Jan 05 15:54:26 using a phone data connection Jan 05 15:54:38 im making some silly linux mistake, arnt i? Jan 05 15:54:41 yep at home i ve also a dns tunnel :) Jan 05 15:54:55 a "monday detail" if you will. Jan 05 15:55:31 but my box (an p3 running a debian) seems down ... Jan 05 15:55:38 churl1: try chmod +x ./flasher-3.0 Jan 05 15:55:44 and check if you're in the right dir Jan 05 15:56:17 AstralSt: thanks that worked Jan 05 15:56:38 see, it wasn't set as executable Jan 05 16:03:32 huhu i ve a google ads : Nokia is hiring : skilled and motivated professionals to develop the Maemo plateform. Jan 05 16:03:49 back ... connection isn t stable due to snow Jan 05 16:06:14 bye Jan 05 16:06:35 cya Jan 05 16:06:39 bye Jan 05 16:07:36 thanks again all for the help!! Jan 05 16:10:23 Anyone want to respond to Lord Raiden on http://www.internettablettalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=26002 (if no-one has already) Jan 05 16:10:36
What summit?
Jan 05 16:11:18 heh, quite out of touch eh :P Jan 05 16:11:37 Jaffa: the timeline wiki reference is sufficient i'd say Jan 05 16:25:21 mikkov_: ping Jan 05 16:33:03 X-Fade, as Jaffa says, decisions and discussions are ongoing. Jan 05 16:33:33 X-Fade, but it's tough when it's sort of sprung on you without notice right before a holiday. :P Jan 05 16:35:07 johnx: transitional package made.. checking how much breaks horridly now Jan 05 16:35:16 fun fun :) Jan 05 16:35:58 * GAN8001 hits the road. Jan 05 16:37:52 probably need to make a v0.5 image after this one :P Jan 05 16:38:35 * qwerty12 updates his system (including scratchbox packages) and makes preparations for obtaining latest mer sdk Jan 05 16:45:11 johnx: amazingly enough, it doesnt break Jan 05 16:45:25 then again im not sure how much gconf2 hildon-desktop uses Jan 05 16:46:05 Advanced Backlight uses gconf doesnt it? Jan 05 16:46:12 yes Jan 05 16:46:16 doesnt die Jan 05 16:46:18 woo :P Jan 05 16:47:21 now let's see if we can fix gnomevfs too Jan 05 16:52:18 having GNOME work alongside wouldn't be a bad thing Jan 05 16:52:19 :P Jan 05 16:54:02 Meizirkki: around and got a mer partition handy? Jan 05 16:55:47 ~mer Jan 05 16:55:48 [mer] http://wiki.maemo.org/Mer_Blueprint_New and http://wiki.maemo.org/Mer_Blueprint Jan 05 16:57:51 ?? I spent whole day to install ubuntu-MID and when i booted my tablet o_0 everyhing was gone! But Maemos packages conflict less now??? Jan 05 16:58:06 Meizirkki: getting closer and closer, yeah Jan 05 16:58:13 Wohoo Jan 05 16:58:13 Stskeeps, I can test :) Jan 05 16:58:28 johnx: apt-get update; apt-get dist-upgrade (i just need the output of the packages to be done with) Jan 05 16:58:39 i would like to test b-man's latest installer... :P Jan 05 16:58:50 running Jan 05 16:58:56 johnx: not the actual upgrade, just what it intends to do :P Jan 05 16:59:03 gotcha Jan 05 16:59:05 Just letting it known in here also that I posted my n810 up for trade. itt Link: http://www.internettablettalk.com/forums/showthread.php?p=254611#post254611 Jan 05 16:59:30 Anybody knows where i could get b-man:s latest Mer installer? Jan 05 17:00:01 lemme see if i can find it in logs. Jan 05 17:00:31 iPhone. Hehe. Jan 05 17:01:06 Meizirkki: -possibly- http://rapidshare.com/files/179521540/merinstaller.deb.html Jan 05 17:01:25 RST38h must be a laugh at my post Jan 05 17:01:32 Yep. Jan 05 17:01:45 Stskeeps: do you know why Mer breaks less now..? i can tell you. Jan 05 17:01:48 Just because i just reflashed my tablet and destroyed my mer partition. Jan 05 17:01:54 RST38h I would take an old dell pda at this point lol Jan 05 17:02:06 now it will take soooo long before i get Mer running again Jan 05 17:02:06 andrew: this would be even funnier in fact Jan 05 17:02:13 Meizirkki: hehe :P Jan 05 17:02:41 andrew: because you would still get the same problem as with NIT + totally screwed up excuse for an OS Jan 05 17:02:46 hopefully we'll get to a point where we just flash the internal flash instead Jan 05 17:03:02 http://rafb.net/p/iQpaI919.html Jan 05 17:03:21 johnx: no "removed"? Jan 05 17:03:26 no removed :) Jan 05 17:03:27 (is gconf2-common installed) Jan 05 17:03:29 RST38h that is true but atleast it would be a little easy to check movie times and look something up real quick Jan 05 17:03:30 that's the whole output Jan 05 17:03:44 it's installed Jan 05 17:03:46 andrew: Not really, as it comes with IE Mobile Jan 05 17:03:50 johnx: hm. Jan 05 17:04:10 johnx: hang on a couple of seconds while mer6 builds Jan 05 17:04:10 andrew: You can complain about MicroB as much as you wish, but it is nothing compared to the horrors of IE Mobile=) Jan 05 17:04:59 RST38h: which emu was it that was yours? Jan 05 17:05:16 RST38h I'm not complaining about microB its the whole device in all. I'm not even saying its a bad device just not what I wanted when I bought it. Jan 05 17:05:18 Sts: it is easier to tell which one was not Jan 05 17:05:43 hehe Jan 05 17:05:47 andrew: As I said, with an old Dell PDA you will get exactly the same features but much worse experience Jan 05 17:05:56 andrew: So go for the iPhone :) Jan 05 17:06:06 RST38h: yeah, ok, found your page for them :P Jan 05 17:06:52 Or get a new Nokia 5800 - we have got one of these in the family and it works pretty well Jan 05 17:07:15 Stskeeps: thanks for the link :P Jan 05 17:07:20 RST38h Well iphone is first choice, then a smartphone running anything but palm second then if I have to settle I'll take a pda lol Jan 05 17:07:41 * Stskeeps passes andrewfblack a half-dead ipaq 3630 Jan 05 17:07:42 RST38h I would take something like that Jan 05 17:08:49 * RST38h still isn't sure why take a pda Jan 05 17:09:13 those things are dreadful, even if they have got a phone inside Jan 05 17:10:17 like I said thats my last choice. BTW I forgot to add in the post I just paided for 3 years of turn by turn directions Jan 05 17:12:07 Well that was a mistake :) Jan 05 17:13:04 GPS does great once you finally get a lock lol Jan 05 17:18:01 well I'm out of here, maybe I can find someone to take the trade Jan 05 17:18:51 fiferboy: hello Jan 05 17:30:10 qwerty12: where to unpack the bzr:s libz.tar.gz? Jan 05 17:30:18 /usr/lib/python2.5 Jan 05 17:30:57 strange, they are there and it still does not work Jan 05 17:32:05 when i put letters "b" and "z" and press tab there is "bzr", when i press enter it says: sh: bzr: not found Jan 05 17:32:22 type: which bzr Jan 05 17:32:23 That's not a libs problem. Jan 05 17:32:43 that's what i was thinking Jan 05 17:32:49 i'll reboot Jan 05 17:33:27 Meizirkki, what does tab completion say when you type python? Jan 05 17:33:43 sec Jan 05 17:34:25 that's it, python 2.5 is missing. o_0 Jan 05 17:34:36 i'm was sure that i installed it Jan 05 17:34:43 s/i'm/i/ Jan 05 17:34:43 Meizirkki meant: i was sure that i installed it Jan 05 17:35:42 Yep, first line in /usr/bin/bzr is "#!/usr/bin/python2.5" and if python2.5 doesn't exist, your shell will throw a not found error even if /usr/bin/bzr exists Jan 05 17:39:03 johnx: think upgrade is safe now Jan 05 17:39:05 (apt-get update first) Jan 05 17:39:18 awesome. is it ok for me to start some builds? Jan 05 17:39:22 yeah Jan 05 17:39:34 i'll toy with libossognomevfs at some point Jan 05 17:39:54 also, is there a way to make packages that are completely arch indep not produce fail messages when they try to build on ARM? Jan 05 17:40:25 not at this point no - but it isnt fatal in any way Jan 05 17:40:38 ok, then I won't worry about it :) Jan 05 17:41:30 Symbian, here I come Jan 05 17:41:36 * johnx updates mer machines, looks for a cheap ARM-based, 2 drive NAS Jan 05 17:41:53 Or rather "Symbian, come to my boudoir" Jan 05 17:42:11 RST38h, who's getting screwed? you or symbian? Jan 05 17:43:00 johnx: Definitely Symbian Jan 05 17:43:06 * RST38h has got the poor critter under control Jan 05 17:44:06 just as long as it's nice and consensual I don't care... Jan 05 17:56:05 johnx: so what's status from your side? Jan 05 17:56:29 from the builds or the upgrade? Jan 05 17:56:39 or work on mer? Jan 05 17:56:43 work on mer i guess :P Jan 05 17:57:16 didn't touch it much today. my wife just got home from the US... :P Jan 05 17:57:55 but qwerty12 did that excellent zenity package. guess I should poke at that after the upgrade here finishes Jan 05 17:58:09 *nod* Jan 05 17:58:45 did you have something besides "first-boot-wizard" you wanted me to look at? Jan 05 17:59:15 well first-boot-wizard and user is one of the important things atm so :) Jan 05 17:59:51 crap, my maemo-launcher build died :/ Jan 05 18:00:46 died installing packages ... Jan 05 18:01:05 yeah, qemu error it seems Jan 05 18:01:33 just re-run build Jan 05 18:01:36 and let's see if it helps Jan 05 18:01:48 ok. did you just change something? Jan 05 18:02:02 no, but sometimes qemu is a bit quirky :P Jan 05 18:02:07 and dbus should work fine :P Jan 05 18:02:10 :/ Jan 05 18:02:38 it'll take x86 build again (not fail, but not succeed in upload) and then take armel again so Jan 05 18:02:41 * johnx prefers quirky girls, not quirky CPU emulators Jan 05 18:03:14 hehe Jan 05 18:04:24 Meizirkki: fixed the tablet-wireless issue Jan 05 18:04:32 ok Jan 05 18:04:48 it's getting built atm :P Jan 05 18:04:54 is that the "wireless takes forever to connect" issue or a packaging issue? Jan 05 18:05:02 johnx: typo in ifconfig wlan0 up Jan 05 18:05:28 * Meizirkki is watching #merbuilder @jaiku Jan 05 18:06:01 most .. interesting channel .. sortof Jan 05 18:06:02 :P Jan 05 18:06:07 :P Jan 05 18:06:26 it's empty! Jan 05 18:06:30 the lies! Jan 05 18:06:32 they spread! Jan 05 18:06:42 Why is the basic font-size of hildon so small ?? Jan 05 18:06:42 * Stskeeps takes away Mousey's caffeine Jan 05 18:06:48 small? :P Jan 05 18:06:49 * Mousey cries! ;_/ Jan 05 18:06:54 ;_;, even Jan 05 18:06:59 Mousey, it's a conspiracy! we must stop them! Jan 05 18:07:14 s/small/BIG/ Jan 05 18:07:14 Meizirkki meant: Why is the basic font-size of hildon so BIG ?? Jan 05 18:07:21 Meizirkki: more readable Jan 05 18:07:35 Because Mer wants to be bigger than Maemo :) Jan 05 18:07:37 Meizirkki: so my damn fingers will touch the right stuff Jan 05 18:07:51 Mousey, it's a jaiku channel :) Jan 05 18:08:18 Meizirkki: it's my biggest beef with the LCARS themes.. they WORK GREAT.. but the font isn't big enough for my fingers and i don't have the hildon-fu to make them bigger without spoiling the theme Jan 05 18:08:27 what's a jaiku? Jan 05 18:08:38 sounds like an ancient artifact from an anime i've never seen Jan 05 18:08:43 http://jaiku.com/channel/merbuilder Jan 05 18:08:47 it's twitter Jan 05 18:08:50 basically Jan 05 18:09:04 oh Jan 05 18:09:05 bleh Jan 05 18:09:45 but the mer package builder is hooked up to it and it blogs about the package build status. so if you're interested in mer you should follow it :) Jan 05 18:10:36 eh.. i'll wait for the movie Jan 05 18:10:48 tell me how that works for you Jan 05 18:13:18 k. ^_^ Jan 05 18:14:38 great, another dbus error Jan 05 18:14:55 jebus Jan 05 18:15:03 * johnx sighs Jan 05 18:15:10 i *built* it in mer sdk Jan 05 18:15:35 i'll just /bin/true useradd in builder Jan 05 18:15:58 huh? what's causing that...hang on Jan 05 18:16:20 qemu: uncaught target signal 11 (Segmentation fault) - exiting Jan 05 18:16:20 adduser: `/usr/sbin/useradd -d /var/run/dbus -g messagebus -s /bin/false -u 101 messagebus' returned error code 126. Exiting. Jan 05 18:16:23 :P Jan 05 18:16:34 not sure why it segfaults though Jan 05 18:16:37 ah, ok. I was worried about auto-startx's init script Jan 05 18:16:46 but I think I --no-start it Jan 05 18:17:32 i'll just check builder for a sec Jan 05 18:19:27 Hello again. I just want to ask is there a 'full' version of top utility? Because I want to make top -pPID, and maemo's top is some kind of small (there are only 3 options about delay and other stuff) Jan 05 18:19:42 ah. Jan 05 18:19:46 wrong qemu Jan 05 18:19:47 sec Jan 05 18:20:12 kost-bebix, http://www.makikiweb.com/n800/downloads/procps_real-3.2.7.armel.deb - install that and you can use rtop to invoke the "real" top Jan 05 18:20:24 johnx: give it a shot now Jan 05 18:20:33 thanx, I'll try that right now Jan 05 18:20:48 johnx: (remember to add some text after build maemo-launcher as jaiku may filter you otherwise) Jan 05 18:21:03 ah, been deleting old build commands Jan 05 18:21:08 ah Jan 05 18:21:20 does make things make less sense though :) Jan 05 18:25:02 Stskeeps: yep, thank you very much. Works great :-) Jan 05 18:25:11 you mean qwerty12 Jan 05 18:25:11 :P Jan 05 18:25:45 anything exciting happen with ppl in first day back then? Jan 05 18:28:37 not really Jan 05 18:29:05 back in a sec Jan 05 18:29:19 Yes. It made me remember how much I hate first days back. Jan 05 18:29:31 heh Jan 05 18:30:18 Added some photos of my N810 I'm trading on itT Jan 05 18:46:28 has anyone had nokia repair a cracked screen? just curious what an out-of-warranty repair will cost Jan 05 18:48:38 Stskeeps / johnx: hildon-desktop-env does not want to install Jan 05 18:48:55 yeah, think we're messing up stuff a little bit atm Jan 05 18:49:19 eep. something bad happen with it? Jan 05 18:49:49 * r2d2rogers hauls out the testing 770\ Jan 05 18:49:57 johnx: try maemo-launcher again Jan 05 18:50:04 alright Jan 05 18:50:07 johnx: well maemo-launcher prolly only has the indep ones.. so Jan 05 18:50:19 was it an old version of qemu? Jan 05 18:50:20 qwerty12_N800: have you mouse working by anyremote? Jan 05 18:50:27 johnx: was, but this was another proble Jan 05 18:50:27 m Jan 05 18:51:04 oli, haven't used anyremote recently :/ Jan 05 18:51:35 the problem has something to do with x-session-manager? Jan 05 18:52:22 huh...let me try a clean install here Jan 05 18:52:24 qwerty12_N800: ok, so I'll try to do it by myself (: Jan 05 18:52:32 Meizirkki, can you pastebin the install log? Jan 05 18:52:35 http;//pastebin.com/m57467d Jan 05 18:52:40 fast O_o Jan 05 18:52:43 that's Jan 05 18:52:47 just the problem Jan 05 18:52:58 :P Jan 05 18:54:08 damn, I made a stupid assumption Jan 05 18:54:17 grrr...fix in a sec Jan 05 18:57:55 * Stskeeps hopes the armel builder behaves better now. Jan 05 18:59:32 Meizirkki, you can test again as soon as it builds :) Jan 05 18:59:39 ok Jan 05 18:59:41 phew Jan 05 18:59:57 it worked Jan 05 19:00:01 rawk! Jan 05 19:00:04 installed fakeroot Jan 05 19:01:43 so much for waiting a sec to try it :/ Jan 05 19:01:54 mm? Jan 05 19:02:23 he just quit, right as I queued it for building Jan 05 19:02:24 ah Jan 05 19:02:28 he'll come back in a sec Jan 05 19:02:31 mikkov_: Have any of your SDL builds used ogg in any way? Jan 05 19:02:44 * Stskeeps tries to fix gnomevfs Jan 05 19:03:20 hiya fiferboy Jan 05 19:03:36 lcuk: Hi! Jan 05 19:04:01 anyone know how to fix a frozen car windscreen doofer thingy so i can actually see where im driving Jan 05 19:04:17 oh you english people.. Jan 05 19:04:26 windshield wiper? Jan 05 19:04:29 that was pure northern tyvm Jan 05 19:04:39 no, the water jet spray thing Jan 05 19:04:39 Stskeeps, just the northerners :p Jan 05 19:04:45 hi fiferboy Jan 05 19:04:54 its frozen solid cos i was a pratt and filled it with normal water before it got cold Jan 05 19:04:54 Hey qwerty Jan 05 19:05:30 infact, it wasnt normal water, i think it was evian or something Jan 05 19:05:32 lcuk, "frozen" as in ice or frozen as in stuck? and is only one stuck? does it seem like it's trying to move and the belt is slipping? Jan 05 19:05:41 fiferboy, did you dig in and find anywhere, or have you left it for now Jan 05 19:05:50 its -9 Jan 05 19:05:54 aaah, the squirter thing... Jan 05 19:06:10 "frozen car windscreen doofer thing" yeah Jan 05 19:06:20 lcuk: I am waiting to have some free time, but things don't look good for the immediate future :/ Jan 05 19:06:38 no problem fifer, its obviously not vital since ppl have stopped moaning ;) Jan 05 19:06:48 but its a leak all the same Jan 05 19:06:59 lcuk, if you said "doofer" to a neighbor, would he think "windshield squirter" or would he think you were calling him names? Jan 05 19:07:04 perhaps i should just leave the tablet in the car so that freezes as wel Jan 05 19:07:23 johnx, he would know what i meant :) Jan 05 19:07:41 a1 Jan 05 19:07:49 doofer. (slang) An object whose name the speaker or writer cannot remember. Jan 05 19:07:58 leaks seem to be my specialty... Jan 05 19:08:26 heh fiferboy its just drummed into me to always cleanup everything and watch every call Jan 05 19:08:38 lcuk, maybe add some booze to it :D everclear would be good or isopropyl alcohol, pure only Jan 05 19:08:38 if data magically appears from nowhere i know i have to release it again afterwards Jan 05 19:08:48 I never did much gui programming with c before Jan 05 19:08:59 I like garbage clean up in C++ Jan 05 19:09:01 same principle in all languages i write in Jan 05 19:09:18 cow orker leaves things and hopes the mythical gods of .net will fix his code for him Jan 05 19:09:21 drives me batty Jan 05 19:09:49 C++ has garbage cleanup? Jan 05 19:10:05 i thought you had to call delete on things Jan 05 19:10:27 and depends on references and pointers and a whole host of other things Jan 05 19:10:33 I think objects deinstatiate themselves (at least with Qt) but maybe I am way off Jan 05 19:10:33 i think i even cleanup in python as well Jan 05 19:10:49 maybe you are just used to not repeating things often enough ;) Jan 05 19:10:53 lcuk, alternatively, heat some water in the kettle and haul it out and pour it in the resevoir, then add the proper mix of soap or whatever Jan 05 19:11:13 and maybe releasing the qt reference will destroy the whole tree under it, but thats not the same as full cleanup Jan 05 19:11:34 I hate it in C when I free something that gets free'd somewhere else and the code crashes Jan 05 19:11:34 ok johnx thanks ill give it a go in a minute Jan 05 19:11:49 :) Jan 05 19:12:03 then dont use freed objects Jan 05 19:12:19 or dont free objects in use Jan 05 19:13:03 bbiab, car stuff Jan 05 19:13:43 what is the default sans font on Maemo4? Jan 05 19:13:58 Nokia Sans I think Jan 05 19:14:16 It's called Nokia Sans if that is what you are asking Jan 05 19:14:20 c++ boost does have "smart pointers" but I would not even call that garbare collection Jan 05 19:14:23 I don't even have a Maemo device, I just think it's a great looking font :) Jan 05 19:14:46 liqbase read chms? Jan 05 19:15:01 Get the device, enjoy it and copy the font :D Jan 05 19:15:23 Mousey, no afaik but fbreader does (albeit slowly) Jan 05 19:15:30 evince? Jan 05 19:15:34 thanks. Jan 05 19:15:48 * Mousey makes a note to install fbreader slowly Jan 05 19:16:08 keesj: You are right, I think I was mixing up C++ and java Jan 05 19:16:35 Although Qt seems to manage its objects pretty well Jan 05 19:19:50 johnx: objections to wrecking havoc with libgnomevfs? Jan 05 19:20:16 nope. go ahead. wouldn't want to stop your fun :) Jan 05 19:20:56 fiferboy: No auto memory management in C++, so I guess you may have been leaking memory all this time :) Jan 05 19:21:26 I have never released any C++ code, so I don't think I have inconvenienced any users Jan 05 19:22:02 btw, java garbage collection is not exactly the final solution as well Jan 05 19:22:53 if you are lucky enough not to run out of memory first, garbage collector will kick in (at the most inopportune moment, by Murphy's law) and do its thing for seconds at a time Jan 05 19:23:05 Clearly memory management has never been my forte Jan 05 19:24:26 Stskeeps: on mer is there a place that has the time in a file that it loads as you can't hit the on board clock? Jan 05 19:24:45 r2d2rogers: hmm, not sure, why? retutime doesnt work? Jan 05 19:25:06 (gets run in linuxrc) Jan 05 19:25:33 I just keep seeing packages from teh furture on updates Jan 05 19:25:46 the future... Jan 05 19:26:02 how much in the future? Jan 05 19:26:23 time stamp 2009-01-05 19:03:21 is 1072109.161072 s in the future Jan 05 19:26:31 Has anyone run into problems with the gcc optimization flags in scratchbox? Jan 05 19:26:33 what does 'date' say? :P Jan 05 19:26:42 what problem? Jan 05 19:26:49 Wed Dec 24 09:18:19 UTC 2008 Jan 05 19:27:20 I keep getting an error in dh_clean where it cannot remove a directory because of a changed dev/ino Jan 05 19:27:37 I have no idea if it is releated to optimizations, bue I am running out of things to check Jan 05 19:27:52 what flags are you using? Jan 05 19:28:49 Just -O2 in the rules file Jan 05 19:29:24 I've never had any problems like that with -O2 personally Jan 05 19:29:33 fiferboy: itis not related to optimizations Jan 05 19:29:42 Do you know what could cause it Jan 05 19:29:43 ? Jan 05 19:29:48 scratchbox Jan 05 19:30:03 it is a fucked up scrqatchbox. Jan 05 19:31:30 So, is it a case of remove and reinstall scratchbox? Jan 05 19:31:44 don't know Jan 05 19:32:04 it may be just fundamentally broken or it may have got broken on some update Jan 05 19:33:23 The same code used to build. Jan 05 19:33:49 is there a way to reset the security code? Jan 05 19:34:20 Can you get a root shell on the tablet? Jan 05 19:34:27 yes Jan 05 19:35:56 dick-richardson, run this as root and it will display your current lock code : http://austinche.name/maemo/getlockcode Jan 05 19:36:19 thank you! Jan 05 19:38:23 fiferboy: wormux uses ogg, but it doensnt't really work on the device Jan 05 19:38:48 mikkov_: How did you get it to auto-build with the SDL in extras? Jan 05 19:39:58 nothing special, I have libsdl-mixeroggwav1.2-dev in build-deps Jan 05 19:41:07 Did you have to change anything to get it to actually use libsdl-mixeroggwav over the stock SDL? Jan 05 19:42:08 no, libsdl-mixeroggwav is a replacement for libsdl-mixer Jan 05 19:43:51 or it's a build time replacement, it has only static libraries Jan 05 19:45:34 Thanks for the information. I will give that a try Jan 05 19:49:30 < Meiz_n810: gimme a package that you know would mess up on Mer normally cos of libosso-gnomevfs-2 Jan 05 20:04:43 hmm... Jan 05 20:05:02 xchat-gnome? Jan 05 20:05:19 ta, lemme try Jan 05 20:05:33 nah, qwerty:s port is maybe better Jan 05 20:05:57 gdm! Jan 05 20:06:26 Stskeeps: gdm something i would like to use. :P Jan 05 20:06:41 s/gdm/gdm is/ Jan 05 20:06:42 Meiz_n810 meant: Stskeeps: gdm is something i would like to use. :P Jan 05 20:07:41 maybe epiphany.. Jan 05 20:08:52 Meiz_n810, hildon-desktop-env install ok for you now? Jan 05 20:09:08 johnx: let me try... Jan 05 20:09:38 gail is another issue atm, compiling nokia one Jan 05 20:10:52 gnomevfs2 no more on the way? Jan 05 20:11:15 seems not, but gnomecanvas is pretty used.. Jan 05 20:12:01 which uses gail Jan 05 20:14:19 k Jan 05 20:17:59 johnx: installed without a problem Jan 05 20:18:20 great Jan 05 20:18:24 that's what I like to hear Jan 05 20:18:31 even better when it's true Jan 05 20:20:15 quick poll QT or GTK users on IRC? Jan 05 20:20:41 user but not developer :P Jan 05 20:25:06 ohnojaiku, now is not the time to be down Jan 05 20:26:50 yeah, dead here too :/ Jan 05 20:27:27 i get 502 Bad Gateway 0_o Jan 05 20:27:32 same Jan 05 20:27:49 http://cache.gawker.com/assets/images/gizmodo/2009/01/poweradapters.jpg Jan 05 20:28:26 RST38h, I like the moralizing Jan 05 20:29:16 * Stskeeps swears Jan 05 20:30:30 betweeb launchpad and jaiku we don't always have the best luck... Jan 05 20:31:29 i'm starting to point towards garage as a good cooperation platform Jan 05 20:31:31 at least it works Jan 05 20:31:40 ya'know...sometimes Jan 05 20:31:53 guess maemo.org has been reasonably stable for a couple months now though Jan 05 20:32:35 one gets used to good things really fast... Jan 05 20:32:40 it was about a month though Jan 05 20:37:50 looks like someone at jaiku is working on it at least Jan 05 20:38:40 * johnx sleeps. will look at first-boot-wizard more tomorrow Jan 05 20:39:01 nini Jan 05 20:42:18 evening b-man Jan 05 20:42:33 hello Jan 05 20:43:05 just got back from school, if you were wondering ware i was :p Jan 05 20:43:09 hehe Jan 05 20:43:33 you're on school ? Jan 05 20:43:39 it's 5th day.. Jan 05 20:44:01 yes, i go to a technical highschool Jan 05 20:44:06 unlucky, today was my first day back too :P Jan 05 20:44:21 Meiz_n810: my work started today too :P Jan 05 20:44:37 haha, i'll be @ home for couple of days Jan 05 20:45:11 ~sophmore ;p Jan 05 20:45:46 how much did i miss today? :) Jan 05 20:45:53 i have to move my ass to school 7th day Jan 05 20:46:10 heh Jan 05 20:46:35 b-man: maybe we're able to run gnome alongside hildon now.. working on that right now. kexec has problems when serial console isn't enabled in r&d mode.. builder fixes Jan 05 20:46:52 sweet! :D Jan 05 20:47:29 sorry for this question, but what do i need to be able to see text in westnoth? Jan 05 20:48:11 why do you apologize for asking questions? :P Jan 05 20:48:22 it's probably a silly one Jan 05 20:48:26 like all of mine Jan 05 20:48:55 and? :P Jan 05 20:49:07 all of us have sounded completely moronic in here once or twice, i believe :P Jan 05 20:49:31 true that :P Jan 05 20:49:50 i have surely more than once or twice :) Jan 05 20:50:04 guys, what's a linux? Jan 05 20:50:24 she sounds hot Jan 05 20:50:36 it's a ghost story parents use to spook kids into not downloading viruses onto the family PC Jan 05 20:51:20 don't install crap or the linux will come and you'll have to use the command line foreeeever Jan 05 20:51:22 i bet linux hid my adjustable wrench Jan 05 20:51:40 apt-get install fear Jan 05 20:51:56 as for text in wesnoth: no idea. you've checked ITT, right? Jan 05 20:52:08 and you dont have to worry about repositories Jan 05 20:52:29 * johnx heads off to bed for real Jan 05 20:52:52 nah, i just finished flashing i figured that would fix it, but it didnt Jan 05 20:53:12 it worked for me pre diablo Jan 05 20:53:24 but not since, ill check itt Jan 05 20:54:20 i should use apt-get install life Jan 05 20:54:40 nah, maybe too much conflicts Jan 05 20:54:48 very nice Jan 05 20:54:57 what is it vodka buying age is in finland again, Meiz_n810? Jan 05 20:55:19 Stskeeps: 18 Jan 05 20:55:31 Meiz: stick with nerding. It takes some time, but it can get you a nerd-safe girl finally ;) Jan 05 20:55:58 being able to fix a computer well can get you far Jan 05 20:56:02 mine partner codes:) Jan 05 20:56:06 :P Jan 05 20:56:11 in my case, it brought me to my fiancée Jan 05 20:56:31 Stskeeps: Oh, I haven't fixed my girlfriends computer :) Jan 05 20:57:16 Meiz_n810; responded to your bootstrap-script question on ITT. - just to let you know Jan 05 20:58:04 k Jan 05 20:58:24 I actually met my girlfriend first in a job interview. She opened the door for me as I arrived and rang the bell. Jan 05 20:59:21 i found mine on myspace (really) it's been one year and one day Jan 05 21:00:56 Veggen: i met mine originally at this dorm but then while i was fixing another girls computer she mentioned she had some problems too.. and it was one of those windows problems that took 8 hours. plenty of time to sit and talk and get to know eachother :P Jan 05 21:01:26 :) very nice Jan 05 21:01:29 Stskeeps: hum. Not sure I'd learn windows to do that ;P Jan 05 21:01:37 hehe Jan 05 21:02:05 What was the problem with osso_xterm? Jan 05 21:02:51 Meiz_n810: vte Jan 05 21:03:01 and libtool, but libtool is fixed now Jan 05 21:03:17 Stskeeps: my girlfriend is a mac user, working in the VOIP business, and a member of the local LUG :) Jan 05 21:03:39 hehe Jan 05 21:03:47 Stskeeps: much nicer, I'll not have to fix her Windows computer :) Jan 05 21:04:51 b-man: this far i have had no problem with Gutsy script, if fact guys @ #ubuntu-arm told me to use it... Jan 05 21:06:20 hmm, mabe it was just a problem on my side :p Jan 05 21:07:02 I love the finger-scrolling in tear. Jan 05 21:11:16 hmm, a nother linux fan on DeviantArt; http://furumaru.deviantart.com/art/Ubuntu-Symbol-42498950 Jan 05 21:11:57 Meiz_n810 you mean tear the web browser? Jan 05 21:12:15 yes Jan 05 21:12:19 :-) Jan 05 21:12:46 like to hear it Jan 05 21:12:58 heh, you're the guy that implemented it, right? :P :) Jan 05 21:13:09 yeah :-) Jan 05 21:13:23 nice :) Jan 05 21:14:13 thx Jan 05 21:25:01 does fbreader on any platform scroll? Jan 05 21:25:13 qwerty12_N800: ping Jan 05 21:25:17 apart from the java version Jan 05 21:25:31 solca, p0ng :) Jan 05 21:25:37 hi! Jan 05 21:25:48 hey solca :) Jan 05 21:26:05 qwerty12_N800: do you test with kexec? Jan 05 21:30:23 solca, not successfully :(, i nearly ended tearing my hair out... uclibc scratchbox toolchain doesn't agree with kernel versions above 2.6.21 because I got an segfault when I tried to run the binary. Bootmenu doesn't work under the new kernel either (I tried forcing it to open to no avail either) so I applied some patches I found for arm proc/atags support in 2.6.21 but kexec tools won't recognise it as a valid atags (even using Jan 05 21:30:23 kexec tools version which was around at the time) Jan 05 21:32:14 qwerty12_N800: I too compiled kexec-tools with scratchbox2 and it segfaults Jan 05 21:32:29 qwerty12_N800: statically was around 600KB Jan 05 21:32:58 so I was wondering if you have a reduced kexec binary to test but... Jan 05 21:33:18 I used -Os & strip & sstrip and i got 200kb but it segfaults anyway :/ Jan 05 21:33:47 sstrip? never heard about it Jan 05 21:34:11 I used -Os -funit-at-a-time then strip but 600KB with sb2 Jan 05 21:34:29 ah, I used uclibc Jan 05 21:34:57 thats the difference, I used eglibc from sb2 (freemantle sdk) Jan 05 21:35:39 anyway kexec just works when the tablet is in r&d serial-console mode... weird... Jan 05 21:37:02 This is why access to cal would be nice, at least could theoretically play around with rd flags straight from the tablet :) Jan 05 21:37:04 solca: you can always probe on linux-omap maybe, igor & co seems to be conversing there Jan 05 21:39:25 solca: and even encouraging it, the other day, on iTT Jan 05 21:39:51 Stskeeps: Ill try linux-omap then as my workarounds dont work Jan 05 21:40:00 Stskeeps: what happen the other day? Jan 05 21:40:34 http://internettablettalk.com/forums/showpost.php?p=254439&postcount=11 Jan 05 21:41:05 just generally encouraging low level discussion for maemo/nokia platform to go to linux-omap when dealing with kernel Jan 05 21:42:26 Meiz_n810: i -think- we might have some the gnomevfs and gail problems now.. going to look closer Jan 05 21:44:09 +solved Jan 05 21:44:17 Stskeeps: good as the kernel stuff for NITs is being slowly eroding in latest kernels Jan 05 21:44:36 Stskeeps: great! Jan 05 21:45:29 * b-man is still not able to use the on-screen keyboard in mer or ubuntu... starting to ram head on desk... -_- Jan 05 21:46:24 ports.ubuntu.com down? Jan 05 21:46:39 i get timeout Jan 05 21:46:53 works here Jan 05 21:47:03 or not.. Jan 05 21:47:06 yeah, works Jan 05 21:47:08 works now here to Jan 05 21:47:10 o Jan 05 21:47:12 na, the gnome desktop in ubuntu and hildon desktop in mer keeps crashing the desktop Jan 05 21:47:25 edit: keyboard Jan 05 21:47:31 going nutz Jan 05 21:47:43 ;p Jan 05 21:47:44 hehe Jan 05 21:48:15 Meiz_n810: don't leave the next 10 min :) Jan 05 21:48:30 ok Jan 05 21:49:23 http://bsd.tspre.org/~stskeeps/gnomemer.png Jan 05 21:50:08 cool Jan 05 21:50:23 (gnome libraries, thati s) Jan 05 21:50:25 yahoo Jan 05 21:50:46 so, no more conflicts with gnome? Jan 05 21:51:13 yeah Jan 05 21:51:19 well, not that i've seen yet :P Jan 05 21:51:36 some of it has a bit of suspicious package update over it, so :P Jan 05 21:51:51 hehe, i'll leave my tablet to install some stuff @ night Jan 05 21:52:33 is xchat-gnome better than qwerty:s one? Jan 05 21:52:43 i like qwertys' better :P Jan 05 21:52:53 k Jan 05 21:53:00 heh, it's really skyhuskers :) Jan 05 21:53:38 gdm installing... Jan 05 21:55:28 something still hangs with ubuntu-desktop.. Jan 05 21:56:53 probably Jan 05 21:57:08 i didn't promise coexisting ubuntu-desktop and mer, gnome maybe :P Jan 05 21:57:20 hm, whats the easiest way to share files from linux pc to my n800? i wannt to mount few dieectorys so ftp and http are not for me. nfs/sshfs what do you thinnk? Jan 05 21:58:13 samba? : Jan 05 21:58:14 P Jan 05 21:58:16 Stskeeps: yeah, andi don't want to use gnome/ubuntu-desktop... horribly sslow... Jan 05 22:02:07 Stskeeps: I don't want to interupt what you are doing, but is there a place I can find /etc/osso-af-init//af-defines.sh to look at? Jan 05 22:02:21 r2d2rogers: maemo? :P Jan 05 22:02:28 k Jan 05 22:02:30 just checking Jan 05 22:02:35 it's missing in my mer install Jan 05 22:02:57 @Meiz_n810; not if you use plenty of swap ;) Jan 05 22:03:13 nah :P Jan 05 22:03:16 r2d2rogers: yeah in mine too :P Jan 05 22:03:51 Stskeeps: is it worth copying it over? Jan 05 22:04:34 we're going to reconstruct that a bit probably, and things work without, so Jan 05 22:04:41 no, dont bother, i think :P Jan 05 22:05:22 k Jan 05 22:05:28 r2d2rogers: i copied the whole directory to Mer , everything i got was a couuple of errors Jan 05 22:05:48 I'm just doing random apt-get upgrades and seeing what breaks Jan 05 22:07:27 ports.ubuntu.com seems to be a bit bandwitch limited... Jan 05 22:11:31 * Stskeeps tries compiling vte again. Jan 05 22:13:02 does any sane apps use pyvte? Jan 05 22:13:25 a terminal emulator in python? Jan 05 22:13:32 * qwerty12_N800 shudders Jan 05 22:13:58 well there could be reasons Jan 05 22:14:02 such as apt-get update output or whatever Jan 05 22:14:03 :P Jan 05 22:14:03 Something like Ubuntu's package manager could be written in Python which shows console output Jan 05 22:14:07 yeah :) Jan 05 22:14:09 snap Jan 05 22:15:02 fair enough, i was thinking inside the box it seems :) Jan 05 22:16:16 i actually do believe there is allrety a terminal written in python, in the debian repo, i can't recall the name though... Jan 05 22:17:48 gdebi in Maemo would be cool actually, at least gdebi installs dependencies automatically if you install locally from a deb Jan 05 22:18:31 woo, it builds! Jan 05 22:19:00 Not another sdk update I hope? :) Jan 05 22:19:28 hehe, no, just a code fix Jan 05 22:20:09 brilliant, i don't think i can take installing it anymore :D Jan 05 22:21:29 lol Jan 05 22:22:09 and i refuse to touch that thing again for a while, so we're even Jan 05 22:22:09 :P Jan 05 22:22:22 hehe Jan 05 22:27:55 qwerty12_N800: anyremote mouse works :) Jan 05 22:28:48 oli, brilliant :), is it hard to use? :) Jan 05 22:29:11 enough for scrolling www pages, but cursor is not visible Jan 05 22:31:40 there's a way to bring it back but i can't find right file yet.. Jan 05 22:32:50 anyremote devels should also include shell support, it shouldn't be hard to code but extremely useful Jan 05 22:33:26 ~lart grep Jan 05 22:33:27 * infobot executes killall -KILL grep Jan 05 22:34:21 oli, found it! edit /home/user/.icons/default/index.theme as root and comment the inherits line & reboot Jan 05 22:36:18 brb, reboot ;) Jan 05 22:36:48 evening Jan 05 22:37:00 hi lardman :) Jan 05 22:37:19 hey qwerty12_N800 :) Jan 05 22:37:50 hi lardman Jan 05 22:38:15 hi woglinde Jan 05 22:42:52 why does fn +tab only work some of the time im using yen for tab Jan 05 22:43:02 Hi Jan 05 22:46:01 qwerty12_N800: works, thanks :) Jan 05 22:46:14 hello, gnuton :) Jan 05 22:47:33 Hey b-man Jan 05 22:47:35 :D Jan 05 22:48:20 qwerty12_N800: mouse click is always double, but you don't feel it in browser Jan 05 22:49:42 oli, heh, now i need to actually reinstall anyremote again sometime :) Jan 05 22:51:36 scripts do not seem to be difficult to modify so i'll try to improve them a little Jan 05 22:56:36 how come fn+tab only work some of the time Jan 05 23:06:10 can I get connection info programmatically on my Nokia N810 somehow in a shell script or perl ? Jan 05 23:06:23 ifconfig? Jan 05 23:06:33 I mean like... access points Jan 05 23:06:49 mac addys and whether I'm connected with GPRS Jan 05 23:06:51 those pieces Jan 05 23:07:09 python-dbus should work Jan 05 23:08:37 hachi search the maemo-user or dev mailing list Jan 05 23:08:40 there are some hints Jan 05 23:08:51 for getting this infos from dbus Jan 05 23:09:00 roger roger Jan 05 23:09:01 thank you Jan 05 23:12:23 how much time is it to build a dev env for maemo, maybe I'll just write this in C instead Jan 05 23:12:47 install scratchbox Jan 05 23:12:59 oh, I remember this Jan 05 23:13:00 shouldnt be last longer then 2 hours Jan 05 23:13:09 I ran out of disk space while trying it the last time :) Jan 05 23:13:15 I'll fix that and be on my way Jan 05 23:25:01 d-feet! Jan 05 23:25:11 awesome live dbus debugger Jan 05 23:25:35 good nite Jan 05 23:25:42 prove it Jan 05 23:25:47 my night is spent at work Jan 05 23:25:48 working!! Jan 05 23:25:50 ;_; Jan 05 23:25:55 your problem Jan 05 23:26:35 lardman, pong? Jan 05 23:38:04 qwerty12_N800: compiling osso-xterm:) Jan 05 23:43:07 Mousey: d-feet? Jan 05 23:43:29 $ apt-cache search d-feet Jan 05 23:43:29 d-feet - A D-Bus debugger Jan 05 23:43:34 sweet Jan 05 23:43:41 hmm, that's debian tho Jan 05 23:43:57 maybe there's a maemo port. sure would be nice ^_^ Jan 05 23:44:05 Anyone here play ice hockey? Jan 05 23:44:14 slightly random question Jan 05 23:44:19 slightly Jan 05 23:44:25 Mousey: trying the new SDK? Jan 05 23:44:25 :) Jan 05 23:44:39 Mousey: ah sorry :) Jan 05 23:44:49 * Mousey isn't a developer. Jan 06 00:10:26 night all Jan 06 00:10:51 g'night Jan 06 00:33:03 does anyone know how to disable maemo update checking? the orange blinky actually noticeably slows down some of our tests. Jan 06 00:42:54 dougt, there's a gconf setting for the update interval. Jan 06 00:43:08 do you recall its name? Jan 06 00:43:15 Not offhand Jan 06 00:43:23 qwerty12_N800 will know, though, I'm sure. Jan 06 00:45:14 I imagine the actual checking slows down things more than the blinky afterwards.. Jan 06 00:46:07 The actual checking happens once every 24 hours. Jan 06 00:46:22 So unless you're doing all of your testing in that 30 second-2 minute window. . . . Jan 06 00:54:55 GeneralAntilles: we are testing around the clock. Jan 06 00:55:11 did you check out the crazy pictures? Jan 06 00:56:01 http://drkscrtlv.livejournal.com/tag/mozilla Jan 06 01:05:48 ~ $ gconftool -R / | grep update Jan 06 01:05:50 /apps/hildon/update-notifier: Jan 06 01:05:52 ~ $ gconftool -R /apps/hildon/update-notifier Jan 06 01:05:54 check_interval = 1440 Jan 06 01:08:37 dougt, how'd you set up the power? Jan 06 01:08:47 https://garage.maemo.org/frs/download.php/4492/install.html Jan 06 01:08:58 should I be using that document for building up a dev env? Jan 06 01:09:08 it seems like it, but I'd love feedback before I spend too much time Jan 06 01:41:13 no, apparently that doc is wrong Jan 06 01:42:21 Are you actually using SDK+. . . . Jan 06 01:43:06 should I not be? I was reading something and it pointed me towards here Jan 06 01:43:28 I'm not sure if you're asking to make sure that I do use it, or asking why I'm using SDK+ Jan 06 01:43:40 It's not a question of whether you should be or not, but if you actually are. Jan 06 01:43:49 I am hoping to Jan 06 01:43:53 Because if you're not, then of course that documentation wont help. . . Jan 06 01:44:15 ahh, found a more up to date version of it Jan 06 01:44:16 GeneralAntilles, you're back Jan 06 01:47:13 hmmm Jan 06 01:47:24 disco_stu, back to school. :( Jan 06 01:47:40 I used debootstrap to build a chroot environment to install maemo-sdk Jan 06 01:48:04 and maemo-sdk is making a choot environment inside it too Jan 06 02:02:46 :\ Jan 06 02:02:58 I can't install rootstraps as root, bleh Jan 06 02:12:25 hi Jan 06 02:13:02 n800 still doesn't recharge by usb, correct? Jan 06 02:14:17 Unless fairies have come in the night and rewired it, no. . . . Jan 06 02:14:51 i'll check by i doubt it Jan 06 02:15:15 You can get a USB->powertip cord to charge it with. Jan 06 02:15:47 is the voltage ok? Jan 06 02:16:10 It's not enough to charge it if the battery is completely drained, but otherwise I haven't had a problem. Jan 06 02:16:25 i'm going onbo Jan 06 02:16:37 k, 1 sec Jan 06 02:17:42 i'm going on the amazon and i was looking for a crank dynamo generator for this Jan 06 02:17:55 any experience with those? Jan 06 02:22:34 guess i'll have to take a chance **** ENDING LOGGING AT Tue Jan 06 02:59:56 2009