**** BEGIN LOGGING AT Tue Jan 06 02:59:56 2009 Jan 06 04:27:40 is there a 770 specific irc channel? Jan 06 04:27:51 (I'm stuck in the past) Jan 06 04:28:18 i dont think so Jan 06 04:28:24 mmm, k Jan 06 04:28:27 i hacked all day on 770 Jan 06 04:28:35 I own two, go figure Jan 06 04:38:35 2008HE is lovely, except that it crashes with a wifi hotspot I need to be able to use Jan 06 04:39:23 anyone know if there is any known fault with the 2008HE browser? workaround? not sure if its https/ssl or whatnot that trips it up. Jan 06 04:39:30 no way for me to tell Jan 06 04:51:40 sucks being an early adopter Jan 06 04:51:58 does nokia have a 2(770) for 1(810) trade in program? (: Jan 06 04:52:29 No Jan 06 04:52:56 well shoot. Jan 06 04:53:07 fireun: I almost wish that was so, but I still can't imagine pocketing a NIT without a metal screen cover regularly Jan 06 04:53:24 true Jan 06 04:53:28 r2d2rogers, I've been doing that to my N800 for 2 years now. :) Jan 06 04:53:37 I see nothing wrong with the 770, except the instabilities Jan 06 04:53:41 As long as you don't fill your pockets with spare keys and glass shards. . . . :roll: Jan 06 04:53:42 * r2d2rogers looks at his slide cover.... Jan 06 04:53:45 and the lack of continued support Jan 06 04:53:53 keys and worse here Jan 06 04:54:14 fireun: I'm playing with Mer on one of my 770s and running 2008HE on the other Jan 06 04:54:26 Mer? Jan 06 04:54:31 ~mer Jan 06 04:54:32 [mer] http://wiki.maemo.org/Mer_Blueprint_New and http://wiki.maemo.org/Mer_Blueprint Jan 06 04:54:38 r2d2rogers, that's why you keep bad things in one pocket and fragile things in another. Jan 06 04:54:42 2008HE works fine for me, except when I go to web-auth at school Jan 06 04:54:46 then blamo, reboot Jan 06 04:54:47 yeah Jan 06 04:55:12 the 770s get a little weird after streaming music for a couple hours as well. Jan 06 04:55:17 my work's internal WLAN wuit working for me... haven't tested on a linux laptop in a while though to know the issue for sure Jan 06 04:55:29 * GeneralAntilles can't work up the energy to write the blog posts that are now two weeks overdue. Jan 06 04:55:54 other wpa wlans work fine, its something in the browser support Jan 06 04:56:57 oh, and it would have saved me 120 bucks if the ti-calc emulator actually worked, oh well Jan 06 04:57:49 GeneralAntilles, still recovering from work Jan 06 04:59:39 johnx, I think December 08 Pt. II is gonna have to be an oversized January 09 Pt. I Jan 06 05:00:40 december got a lot of people this year. I know how vicious it can be. no worries :) Jan 06 05:01:48 is there a text based list of installed packages in maemo 08 Jan 06 05:02:31 v 2.2007.51-3 if it matters Jan 06 05:02:55 Worse is what it did to the debmaster progress. :( Jan 06 05:03:03 musikgoat|main, dpkg Jan 06 05:03:08 Also: upgrade Jan 06 05:03:27 thanks Jan 06 05:08:14 dpkg --get-selections is probably the right thing Jan 06 05:08:59 h-a-m also has a script to display the stuff in user/* Jan 06 05:32:03 sorry, the dpkg is giving me more than i want, :-) Jan 06 05:32:15 what do you mean h-a-m script Jan 06 05:35:13 i'm looking for a method to show what is in the app manager, essentially Jan 06 05:35:16 via text Jan 06 05:35:26 im sshed in Jan 06 05:37:14 also does anyone know of a battery draining tool that writes a counter to disk to mark the battery life? Jan 06 05:37:32 like a timer that plays the default video and keeps track of when the unit dies Jan 06 05:41:55 RX-34_DIABLO_5.2008.43-7_PR_COMBINED_MR0_ARM.bin would be the correct image to update to? Jan 06 05:42:15 maemo-list-user-packages Jan 06 05:42:18 Yes Jan 06 05:42:31 http://nitapps.com/ Jan 06 05:43:11 thanks Jan 06 06:12:11 anyone know why mediabox youtube doesnt play? got latest maemo on n800 Jan 06 07:02:33 how can i get my screen to go black (completely off) when i lock touch screen and keys? Jan 06 07:06:02 technically it should do so on its own, automatically... Jan 06 07:06:26 churl, change the dim timeout to be the same as blank timeout Jan 06 07:09:27 johnx: one sec, downloading :) Jan 06 07:16:49 johnx: under control panel - display? Jan 06 07:16:57 yeah Jan 06 07:17:56 brightness period and switch off display are both at 1 minute Jan 06 07:18:19 what happens when you lock screen? Jan 06 07:18:24 does it dim or stay on? Jan 06 07:18:28 stay on Jan 06 07:18:42 im waiting the minute to see what happens Jan 06 07:19:06 ok Jan 06 07:19:14 it went black after that minute Jan 06 07:19:30 is it plugged into AC? Jan 06 07:19:40 sure nuff :) Jan 06 07:19:56 try unplugging from AC and lock again, just for fun Jan 06 07:20:04 I've been having trouble tracking this down too :/ Jan 06 07:20:04 ok, just for fun Jan 06 07:20:17 it went black after a few seconds Jan 06 07:21:12 yeah, that should be the right behavior Jan 06 07:21:28 sometimes it behaves differently on AC...but then again it doesn't matter as much on AC Jan 06 07:21:31 ok neat, good to know Jan 06 07:21:42 true that Jan 06 07:22:03 there is a option that tells the screen to stay on when charging... Jan 06 07:22:09 very useful to have the quick blackout and lock screen Jan 06 07:22:24 hi Jan 06 07:22:34 yeah, i like mine to be off, im not sure why Jan 06 07:22:47 i was wondering if it is possible to create an algorithm that, based on the images from openstreetmap.org, can actually calculate the streets Jan 06 07:22:59 (street names would be another story) Jan 06 07:23:14 thinking about offline route finding? Jan 06 07:24:10 always Jan 06 07:24:11 :D Jan 06 07:24:46 i suspect it could be done, but it would probably not be cpu friendly by a long shot... Jan 06 07:25:09 probably not Jan 06 07:25:13 but it would only have to be done once... Jan 06 07:25:22 and you can even divide the task Jan 06 07:25:30 i have no interest in mapping other countries, but other people might :> Jan 06 07:26:15 the street name mapping would be a crapload of manual work though Jan 06 07:29:20 do google maps and consorts keep track of one way streets etc? Jan 06 07:32:02 no clue Jan 06 07:35:28 uhm, there is routing info with OSM...I thought. the "picture versions" are just rendered from the vector data...again IIRC Jan 06 07:39:01 there was a lively discussion yesterday here Jan 06 07:39:08 where it was claimed that there is no vector data in osm Jan 06 07:39:11 at least no complete Jan 06 07:39:25 which is the entire problem with offline routing Jan 06 07:40:06 the pictures are rendered from vector data Jan 06 07:40:19 it isn't complete though, that's correct Jan 06 07:40:42 won't be complete until more people wander around with a GPS and upload their maps :) Jan 06 08:01:10 johnx, does maemo mapper download the vector data as well? Jan 06 08:01:13 or just the pictures? Jan 06 08:01:28 cause if it does vector data, the leap to routing offline isn't too far away... Jan 06 08:29:02 Stskeeps: at itT your instructions to make a bootmenu.item have always those "". for example after ITEM_NAME="type here". b-man:s installer creater .item with no quotation-marks.. i haven't tested it, but can you tell me would it work without them too? Jan 06 08:30:13 Hi everyone, i am wondering how can i get the detailed info of user-saved wlan connection in maemo? is there any conf file serving that purpose? thanks in advance:) Jan 06 08:33:34 though libconic can get some info , but i think the info is not sufficed to me. e.g. SSID name Jan 06 08:37:29 iwconfig ? Jan 06 08:40:27 i am not sure yet. i think some kind of api or conf file would be a better choice;) Jan 06 08:50:12 bakarat, no. look up: roadmap Jan 06 08:50:31 johnx, for osm or mapper? Jan 06 08:50:42 bakarat, for osm-based routing Jan 06 08:52:38 hmm.. I had a mid file called 007.mid under MyDocs and the metalayer crawler segfaulted to it everytime.. Jan 06 08:52:48 O_o Jan 06 08:52:51 great behavior Jan 06 08:53:39 I was wondering why the metalayer crawler is never running. Luckily strace told me te reason Jan 06 08:54:58 how can I add a dialog that is shown when an application is installed? Like those license agreement dialogs (although just "OK" would be enough for me) Jan 06 09:00:18 kulve: Use zenity in your post-inst Jan 06 09:01:33 maemo-confirm-text seems to be what the license texts use Jan 06 09:04:22 johnx: saw the gnome-hildon coexistence screenshot? Jan 06 09:04:47 oh didn't know there was screenshot :D Jan 06 09:05:10 well, there it is O_o Jan 06 09:05:20 hehe Jan 06 09:05:37 makes things a bit easier Jan 06 09:12:38 Stskeeps: at itT your instructions to make a bootmenu.item have always those "". for example after ITEM_NAME="type here". b-man:s installer creater .item with no quotation-marks.. i haven't tested it, but can you tell me would it work without them too? Jan 06 09:14:19 in some instancea they matter Jan 06 09:14:48 such as name with a space Jan 06 09:14:59 then it's a bug Jan 06 09:18:50 Moo all Jan 06 09:18:52 http://lj.karlson.ru/Canada/ububu.jpg Jan 06 09:25:44 johnx, auto-startx is just a init script that starts startx at end of bootup btw? Jan 06 09:26:32 yes. it's the one you pointed me at Jan 06 09:26:43 it also makes /etc/default/autologin if it doesn't exist Jan 06 09:26:44 alright Jan 06 09:26:58 but that's part of the init script, not part of the package postinst Jan 06 09:27:10 have to use it at work today so:P Jan 06 09:27:29 so it needs to work 100%? test it first... Jan 06 09:27:43 hehe, i will Jan 06 09:28:35 I did plenty of install tests...but there's always the possibility it will do the wrong thing if you have other window managers or session managers installed or previously installed Jan 06 09:31:55 hehe. it'll prolly just start hildon + some app Jan 06 09:32:32 Anyone who hasn't seen this: http://www.theonion.com/content/video/apple_introduces_revolutionary Jan 06 09:44:15 awesome RST38h Jan 06 09:46:43 pupnik: that is Onion though =) Jan 06 09:46:56 (just in case there is any misunderstanding ;)) Jan 06 09:47:26 http://media.freescale.com/phoenix.zhtml?c=196520&p=irol-newsArticle&ID=1240267 freescale ARM netbook Jan 06 09:48:10 "We believe our power-efficient solution, combined with Linux, plus some special application widget-based software, will enable a new kind of utilization of the internet," Cammal said. "New players want a simple utilization of the Internet." Jan 06 09:48:18 http://news.zdnet.com/2424-9595_22-257347.html Jan 06 09:48:40 funny how copycats pretend they innovate Jan 06 09:50:19 Yep Jan 06 09:50:36 Who is a copycat? Jan 06 09:51:31 Freescale has been making ARM-based chips for years (and no bad ones too). So, why is placing their chip into a notebook enclosure is a copycat? Jan 06 09:51:48 the marketing as an internet device Jan 06 09:52:31 everybody does that nowadays Jan 06 09:52:35 i guess Jan 06 09:52:44 It's a marketing by exclusion :) Jan 06 09:53:17 It can't run MS Office. It can't run WoW or other PC games. So, what is left? Right, Internet apps :) Jan 06 09:53:20 it'd be marketing suicide to not mention your device is inet capable... Jan 06 09:53:24 true Jan 06 09:53:55 johnx: Especially considering that it can't do any other apps known to Joe the User Jan 06 09:53:55 i'd like something as responsive as Epoc was on the original netbook Jan 06 09:54:33 open device, start taking notes and/or sketching, or surfing Jan 06 09:54:39 no wait between any of those Jan 06 09:54:47 Doesn't NIT do that? Jan 06 09:55:27 yes Jan 06 09:56:14 i have to play with the netbook again Jan 06 09:57:19 the psion netbook you mean? Jan 06 09:57:42 yea, because the "netbook" in its Intel interpretation is just a cheap shitty little laptop Jan 06 09:58:08 but serviceable for some scenarios. HP Jan 06 09:59:49 HP's mini note looks nice for example Jan 06 10:00:19 It is actually twice as expensive Jan 06 10:00:39 And if you add a bit more, you can just buy yourself a real subnotebook about the same size Jan 06 10:00:50 $380 is twice as much as what? Jan 06 10:00:58 Wasn't it more like $700? Jan 06 10:01:07 it's CES right now :) Jan 06 10:01:08 remember? Jan 06 10:01:14 $380 is actually nice :) Jan 06 10:01:42 and they have the 6 cell batteries out too ... finally Jan 06 10:01:45 There is no way I give up my Portege though, especially considering Atom's performance Jan 06 10:04:42 yeah, trying to decide between something like that and a used thinkpad x32 is kinda tough Jan 06 10:05:59 No way I am buying a thinkpad Jan 06 10:06:13 yeah, yeah Jan 06 10:06:14 It's like buying a LADA Jan 06 10:07:13 that appeal doesn't work on me though. :D did I ever show you my previous car? Jan 06 10:07:55 No, but the only way you can go lower than Lada is if you owned a ZAZ Jan 06 10:08:15 And there is no way you would either have it or know what it is Jan 06 10:08:22 if they were nice to work on and sold at the right price... Jan 06 10:08:33 I can be convinced to ignore a lot of ills Jan 06 10:08:49 ~curse sonera Jan 06 10:08:50 May the fleas of a thousand camels infest your most sensitive regions, sonera ! Jan 06 10:08:55 I'm screwed :( Jan 06 10:09:04 My parents bought a faster internet immediately when it became available.. but. Jan 06 10:09:14 it's only 5gb per month Jan 06 10:09:18 eep O_o Jan 06 10:09:31 don't talk too much on IRC... might go over the limit Jan 06 10:09:45 wired internet with a 5GB cap...just ouch Jan 06 10:09:57 it's wireless Jan 06 10:10:01 aaah Jan 06 10:10:07 it have been two days here and i have already used 2gb Jan 06 10:10:15 porn? Jan 06 10:10:18 no Jan 06 10:10:20 Mer Jan 06 10:10:25 then WHAT? Jan 06 10:10:28 time to get a part time job and start funding your own inet connection Jan 06 10:10:33 and a corrupted memorycard Jan 06 10:10:49 johnx: Yep :P Jan 06 10:10:57 weird...what is the scenario for this? Jan 06 10:11:15 ? Jan 06 10:11:17 RST38h, a couple ubuntu debootstrap runs will soak up a lot of bandwidth Jan 06 10:11:27 hmm Jan 06 10:11:29 Meizirkki: look into having apt-proxy on your machine :P Jan 06 10:12:05 RST38h: and one try for KDE 4, and one for ubuntu-mobile Jan 06 10:12:07 aha, I see what you mean Jan 06 10:12:17 linux porn! Jan 06 10:12:22 :P Jan 06 10:12:37 Meizirkki: and how much per gb afterwards? Jan 06 10:12:55 * Stskeeps stays way clear of capped connections personally Jan 06 10:22:37 Stskeeps: time per gb? Jan 06 10:22:47 money per gb? Jan 06 10:24:58 it's 39,90 € per month, 1 Mb/s (dl-speed about 130kb/s) wireless connetcion Jan 06 10:26:08 it uses the frequency of old nmt-phones ~450mHz Jan 06 10:26:37 Stskeeps: what would the apt-proxy help? Jan 06 10:27:29 Meizirkki: that it doesnt have to redownload packages that havent been updated Jan 06 10:27:58 and caches them localyl Jan 06 10:28:17 ok, that would help a bit... Jan 06 10:28:55 debootstrap would fly if dl:s packages from another computer :P Jan 06 10:31:50 hehe Jan 06 10:32:02 johnx: does maemo-launcher have to be a init.d script? :P Jan 06 10:32:37 or even have one Jan 06 10:32:47 I got rid of it :P Jan 06 10:32:57 that's the maemo-launcher I just built...I thought Jan 06 10:33:08 wait, is it still there? Jan 06 10:33:49 think i ran into it just now on x86 Jan 06 10:34:24 or it tries to work with it in postinst Jan 06 10:34:59 ah, it won't remove it if it's already there Jan 06 10:35:05 delete it by hand and do a reinstall Jan 06 10:35:24 scripts in init.d are considered a "conf" file by debian and aren't touched Jan 06 10:35:36 ah, its just cos it tries to init.d reload Jan 06 10:37:12 it's really funny how many conf files they source when it runs just fine in start-hildon as exec maemo-launcher --daemon Jan 06 10:37:40 well for theming(?) Jan 06 10:37:47 and perhaps locales and such Jan 06 10:50:06 Apt-get update on Mer says "Bad header line" with apt-proxy on my computer Jan 06 11:05:30 Meizirkki: yeah, you need to set it up :) Jan 06 11:06:01 i did Jan 06 11:06:17 or look into some other caching methods Jan 06 11:07:50 woo \o/ the dead nokia chargers Jan 06 11:07:53 charges Jan 06 11:11:38 it looks like apt-proxy only stores packages downloded by apt-get or aptitude.. So i386 > arm pretty difficult Jan 06 11:13:05 apt-proxy can be used with debootstrap though Jan 06 11:13:13 yep Jan 06 11:13:32 i'll move cache from Mer to my computer... Jan 06 11:21:29 johnx: does hildon-desktop-env make itself a x-session-manager alternative? Jan 06 11:26:23 yes Jan 06 11:27:29 k Jan 06 11:34:55 the maemo will run on the n97? Jan 06 11:35:33 if you can hack a linux kernel on top of it and a bootloader.. maybe? :P Jan 06 11:51:23 http://blog.laptopmag.com/hyperspace-hands-on <=== check out "Pricing" part Jan 06 11:51:33 (and yes, it is Linux) Jan 06 11:55:03 heh Jan 06 11:58:05 that site's blocked at workschool for "criminal skills", obviously they've been reading about there not being any free software Jan 06 12:00:34 laptopmag blocked? Jan 06 12:15:14 RST38h: worst part about the apple "laptop" is that the idea isn't completely insane Jan 06 12:15:40 Sts: The one from Onion? ;) Jan 06 12:15:47 yeah Jan 06 12:15:59 Sts: It's not insane given that you can put a display behind that huge rung Jan 06 12:16:18 ring Jan 06 12:16:30 Otherwise, the input will be too slow Jan 06 12:17:17 DJs would love it Jan 06 12:19:15 DJs and other lower lifeforms Jan 06 12:22:09 * Stskeeps tries to boot the latest image. Jan 06 12:23:28 johnx: auto-startx is empty? Jan 06 12:23:43 huh? Jan 06 12:23:50 look in debian/ Jan 06 12:24:12 package contents only have the copyright, changelog.Debian.gz Jan 06 12:24:17 * johnx kries Jan 06 12:24:21 * johnx looks Jan 06 12:26:37 huh...well something got messed up it seems Jan 06 12:28:34 seems like my windows machine is fucking up immensely (central file server broken at uni) Jan 06 12:28:46 might encourage me to go earlier home, heh Jan 06 12:31:35 johnx: source package doesnt have a init script Jan 06 12:31:37 great. appears to be builder related Jan 06 12:31:51 ok, probably me uploading the wrong version. :D Jan 06 12:31:57 simple to fix. one sec Jan 06 12:34:11 * lcuk turns the heaters on and closes the chan door Jan 06 12:34:30 chan door? cold air coming in from an open IRC window? Jan 06 12:34:49 yes, close it NOW!!!1 Jan 06 12:35:41 close all the bloody windows, especially those wobbly linux ones :P Jan 06 12:36:03 * johnx prefers wobbly, springy windows. makes snapping them to screen edges easier Jan 06 12:36:34 i dont like to snap windows anywhere, its a pain to cleanup Jan 06 12:37:04 i got lunch without asking you lot today btw, you can go outside and get your own Jan 06 12:37:22 had dinner already. burritos! Jan 06 12:37:36 oh shit, reopen the windows Jan 06 12:38:04 im actually glad you are half a world away from me :D Jan 06 12:38:06 lcuk, ever get your car's window washer resevoir unfrozen? Jan 06 12:38:18 not yet, it was even colder last night ;) Jan 06 12:38:31 unfortunate :| Jan 06 12:38:38 but at least i know its not leaking yet Jan 06 12:38:52 the blue washer stuff waqs still there, but frozen solid Jan 06 12:39:01 Morning Jan 06 12:39:02 hehehe Jan 06 12:39:08 replace with better fluid then Jan 06 12:39:17 cant get crappeh fluid out Jan 06 12:39:19 eep. yeah, need washer fluid that has some better anti-freezing solution Jan 06 12:39:20 Siberian variant Jan 06 12:39:28 lcuk: use a building Jan 06 12:39:34 lcuk, pull the resevoir and bring it inside :) Jan 06 12:39:40 i need to setup hose pipe to the hot water tap :) Jan 06 12:39:53 heh...or just run the engine for a bit to warm it up :P Jan 06 12:39:54 nah, it would oxidize (or rust, in layman terms) Jan 06 12:39:57 hahahahahahahahahaha, modern citroen, res is INSIDE the wing Jan 06 12:40:01 esp. all the tubes Jan 06 12:40:05 ahaha...fail Jan 06 12:40:09 modern car fail Jan 06 12:40:16 thus, you have to use a garage Jan 06 12:40:24 sat right next to exhaust side of the block on my old supra Jan 06 12:40:38 yeah K.I.S.S principle should be in effect for all cars Jan 06 12:40:38 johnx: forgot to change version Jan 06 12:40:44 +you Jan 06 12:40:55 yeah, some part of my upload script messed up. probably happened last time Jan 06 12:41:02 lcuk: well, then put some bag with hot water inside Jan 06 12:41:09 and hope the water won't freeze Jan 06 12:41:10 :P Jan 06 12:41:20 saltwater maybe? :P Jan 06 12:41:27 ill just run the hose from the hot tap trickling through :) Jan 06 12:41:34 uhm, it will still be too cool Jan 06 12:41:37 yes, that could work too Jan 06 12:41:40 * suihkulokki is waiting for the first modern car that comes with sticker on the hood: "warranty void if removed" Jan 06 12:41:43 Stskeeps, yes, saltwater...all over the inside of your car :P Jan 06 12:41:52 mm. Jan 06 12:41:54 :P Jan 06 12:42:05 johnf, actually saltwater splshes around all the time Jan 06 12:42:06 johnx: no drivers license or any good knowledge of cars ;) Jan 06 12:42:06 suihkulokki, close enough already. stupid plastic engine lids...like freaking tupperware Jan 06 12:42:21 the problem is sheer amount of fluid to heat Jan 06 12:42:25 gritted roads and stuff splash up Jan 06 12:42:45 lcuk: if correctly greased and oiled, should do nothing Jan 06 12:42:46 :) Jan 06 12:42:54 lcuk, don't get it in more places than it already gets. a patch of it sitting inside a corner can be worse than a whole winter of salted roads Jan 06 12:42:55 AstralSt, i did think about using the jet wash thingy but it would be expensive Jan 06 12:42:58 still, salt water doesn't help containing heat Jan 06 12:43:03 only not freezing Jan 06 12:43:17 right, plain warm water, lots of it Jan 06 12:43:24 johnx: what user does it start x as? Jan 06 12:43:27 or some more dense fluid Jan 06 12:43:28 user Jan 06 12:43:28 (btw) Jan 06 12:43:32 does it add user itself? Jan 06 12:43:39 if i cant get a hose ill just keep sending kits out with the kettle and hope to god we dont burst it Jan 06 12:44:00 AstralSt, that wont permiate throughthough if theres a blockage Jan 06 12:44:19 it will take about a fortnight in which case it will be thawed anyway Jan 06 12:44:26 hm Jan 06 12:44:50 is heating the container and all the pipes feasible? Jan 06 12:44:54 remember, icebergs last for months in saltwater Jan 06 12:45:09 with hot hosepipe yes Jan 06 12:45:38 and when ive got things started ill just shove the end of the pipe all the way down its neck and leave it for a couple of hours Jan 06 12:46:03 lcuk, I ask again: can you easily pull the resevoir and take it inside? Jan 06 12:46:17 yes, if i take the wing off the car Jan 06 12:46:27 wait, how do you fill it? Jan 06 12:46:34 is there a spout somewhere else? Jan 06 12:46:41 with a spout Jan 06 12:46:58 your car is broken. get a 1969 VW Bug Jan 06 12:47:13 thats no way to suppoort my windows vista mobile Jan 06 12:47:41 I'll probably never buy a car made after 96 or so Jan 06 12:48:06 too $(%*ing hard to deal with. I *was* looking at a bug for a while honestly. they look so easy to work on Jan 06 12:48:35 johnx: check the Korean cars Jan 06 12:48:39 or Chinese ;P Jan 06 12:48:40 yeah, the mrs drools everytime and i can see the appeal Jan 06 12:48:49 the latter can be fixed with a hammer Jan 06 12:48:52 pliers Jan 06 12:48:55 and a bit of ljuck Jan 06 12:48:57 *luck Jan 06 12:48:57 lcuk: where's this reservoir? Inside the front wing? Jan 06 12:49:05 johnx: its in fact really easy... and you still get all sorts spare parts very cheap Jan 06 12:49:10 AstralSt, korean? Hyundai cars still have plastic tupperware over the engine Jan 06 12:49:16 yeah simon Jan 06 12:49:26 but still in the engine bay Jan 06 12:49:31 yeah Jan 06 12:49:50 I'd go with the switch it on approach Jan 06 12:50:15 just leave car idling or actively drive round for hours? Jan 06 12:50:29 drive round for a bit, otherwise you won't get any heat into the block Jan 06 12:50:31 florian, and great gas mileage, and a nice RR layout. I went for a 96 subie instead for the AWD. Jan 06 12:50:36 then leave it to soak, at idle Jan 06 12:50:53 no lardman but the problem there is the roads are so crapped up i need wipers and fluid Jan 06 12:50:55 or stick it in the garage do it doesn't get cold straight away Jan 06 12:50:55 lardman, he can't drive around because he needs with washer to keep his windows de-iced as he drives :P Jan 06 12:51:10 ah, sit in neutral at 3k rpm then Jan 06 12:51:11 hello ;) Jan 06 12:51:11 :) Jan 06 12:51:17 heh :D Jan 06 12:51:24 ill leave luke revving it Jan 06 12:51:28 lol Jan 06 12:51:47 Yes officer, a very small boy stole my car, no, no idea who he was Jan 06 12:51:52 Stskeeps, think it'll do the right thing now Jan 06 12:51:58 johnx: alright Jan 06 12:52:14 I think I did a commit but not a push last time... eep Jan 06 12:52:27 heh yeah, i have to do something though, ill just see if tracy will go places tonight Jan 06 12:52:54 what, she doens't need to see out the front? Jan 06 12:53:12 i'm missing the handwriting input method Jan 06 12:53:17 though in this weather, roll down the side windows, probably of more use while sliding sideways :) Jan 06 12:53:22 what happended with it? Jan 06 12:53:29 she can keep coming back for pitstops ;) i hate local driving Jan 06 12:53:59 its not that bad just locally but as soon as you get on the motorway this grey sludge forms Jan 06 12:54:27 yeah Jan 06 12:54:28 stick your head out the window and drive sideways. problem solved Jan 06 12:54:43 johnx: any chance it's still missing the actual init? .. Jan 06 12:54:46 heh, nothing new for me then, tracy says i corner like a maniac Jan 06 12:55:20 Stskeeps, if I build it out of my source tree I get the init file... Jan 06 12:55:46 lardman, libliqbase is looking quite nice and stuff now :) im hammering it into a proper api Jan 06 12:56:06 johnx: source package has debian/changelog, compat control copyright and rules Jan 06 12:56:09 * lcuk is learning a lot Jan 06 12:56:11 (0.2-mer2) Jan 06 12:56:15 and nothing else Jan 06 12:56:32 lcuk: cool, I need to get doing some programming after the new year break Jan 06 12:56:46 you still on holidays? Jan 06 12:56:52 Stskeeps, missed a bzr add. makes a lot more sense now Jan 06 12:57:05 sigh. got it now. Jan 06 12:57:16 lcuk: no way, back at work Jan 06 12:57:42 johnx: building osso-xterm in the meantime Jan 06 12:57:45 did you get holly anything nice? did she get you anytihn Jan 06 12:58:23 nah, just usual sorts of things - books, dvds, etc Jan 06 12:58:32 we were aiming for a cheap-ish xmas Jan 06 12:58:52 as lots of ppl were Jan 06 13:01:18 bbl, work calling Jan 06 13:06:07 crisis! Jan 06 13:06:16 * Stskeeps is just looking forward to osso-xterm building and woring. Jan 06 13:06:18 +k Jan 06 13:07:54 lcuk, the big retailers weren't looking for a cheap x-mas. :P Jan 06 13:11:54 heh, hildon dies when using advanced backlight under x86 Jan 06 13:11:56 wonder why.. :> Jan 06 13:12:16 it tries to read the hw directly doesn;t it? Jan 06 13:12:22 with an ioctl? Jan 06 13:12:33 tries to communicate with dsme Jan 06 13:12:47 oh right, back to sleep for me :) Jan 06 13:14:08 Stskeeps: it dies on arm too if i try to change volume lever Jan 06 13:14:25 oh, doesnt for me, strange :P Jan 06 13:14:34 johnx: auto-startx works Jan 06 13:14:47 What does it do? Jan 06 13:14:52 auto-startx Jan 06 13:15:03 instead of the rc.local trick Jan 06 13:15:09 and makes X run as a user instead Jan 06 13:15:11 / hildon Jan 06 13:15:16 user must be "user"? Jan 06 13:15:19 Meizirkki, auto-login and start X as user or whoever you specify in /etc/default/autologin Jan 06 13:15:26 ok Jan 06 13:15:38 i'll use gdm with no password trick Jan 06 13:15:40 echo PREFERED_USER=meiz > /etc/default/autologin Jan 06 13:15:50 ok Jan 06 13:15:56 Meizirkki: can you test osso-xterm later if it works on armel? seems to crash on x86 Jan 06 13:16:00 I'll save 5% of my RAM and just use auto-startx :) Jan 06 13:16:01 so just curious what the heck happens Jan 06 13:16:36 Stskeeps: i'll install osso-xterm soon Jan 06 13:16:38 k Jan 06 13:32:11 johnx: successful demo of auto-startx ;) Jan 06 13:32:53 good. it was working my local builds for quite a while. I just missed one bzr add. dur. Jan 06 13:32:56 made a new x86 image and presented to co-workers so :P Jan 06 13:33:03 hot :D Jan 06 13:33:24 what hardware did you demo on? Jan 06 13:34:03 cow-orkers? Jan 06 13:34:04 d945gclf2 intel board with tv attached, SATA -> compact flash convertor Jan 06 13:34:12 hmm :) Jan 06 13:34:22 fairly beefy hardware Jan 06 13:34:24 Stskeeps, they should buy you some x86 tablet or MID Jan 06 13:34:33 johnx: hehe, our target is TV atm so :P Jan 06 13:34:40 interesting Jan 06 13:34:47 nice Jan 06 13:34:52 !! I can install mer to my jaunty machine now (without destroying gnome!) hehee Jan 06 13:34:52 but the idea is to be able to move to whatever device we need to Jan 06 13:34:55 probably some set-top box? Jan 06 13:35:06 Meiz_n810: with a bit of pinning, yeah :P Jan 06 13:35:12 AstralSt: in this case, yeah Jan 06 13:35:35 grr... seriously this 5gb/month freaks me out! Jan 06 13:35:53 what did you have before? isdn? Jan 06 13:35:59 adsl Jan 06 13:36:23 with no data/month limit Jan 06 13:36:28 mm Jan 06 13:36:50 this new is wireless, 100% faster, but has 5gb/month Jan 06 13:37:08 find out how much it would cost to get it to be flatrate instead? :P Jan 06 13:37:20 impossible? Jan 06 13:37:21 :P Jan 06 13:37:31 not impossible Jan 06 13:37:39 it's just slightly more expensive Jan 06 13:37:40 :P Jan 06 13:37:40 Stskeeps: i will Jan 06 13:38:04 johnx: so, goal for 0.5 is osso-xterm working, first-boot-wizard? Jan 06 13:38:32 will poke at it more tonight Jan 06 13:38:40 k Jan 06 13:39:09 i'll try if the latest tear works... Jan 06 13:42:38 grr, osso-xterm just segfaults :P Jan 06 13:42:48 without any good reason why Jan 06 13:43:23 Stskeeps: see, I'm in a place where ADSL wiring is damaged by actual rats Jan 06 13:43:43 and nothing else wired is available Jan 06 13:43:55 so I'm (ab)using HSDPA with 6G/mo limit Jan 06 13:44:02 * Meiz_n810 boots to Mer... Jan 06 13:48:48 AstralSt: heh :) Jan 06 14:01:48 grr, i cannot boot to mer Jan 06 14:02:12 it just stays on Starting linuxrc from mer... Jan 06 14:02:49 :( Jan 06 14:07:04 how can i flash a fresh initfs from nokia fiasco? Jan 06 14:09:23 Meizirkki, unpack it with flasher-3.0 then flash just the initfs Jan 06 14:09:31 yes, --flash-only initfs Jan 06 14:09:37 yeah, or that Jan 06 14:09:38 thanks Jan 06 14:09:40 or IIRC, -n Jan 06 14:09:51 thanks Jan 06 14:14:12 noh, still stucks on "Starting linuxrc from mer" :( Jan 06 14:16:37 hi Meizirkki , do you have images of mer ? Jan 06 14:16:58 no, but i can make one right noww Jan 06 14:18:49 anyone here use scratchbox? Jan 06 14:19:01 I'm trying to work out how to change the autoconf etc version Jan 06 14:21:22 JohnFlux: blood sweat and tears Jan 06 14:21:43 Meizirkki: i'll be curious to test this Jan 06 14:21:47 Stskeeps: :-) Jan 06 14:21:48 there should be sufficient autoconf stuff though Jan 06 14:22:03 Meizirkki: just tested nitdroid yesterday : http://rzr.online.fr/q/nit Jan 06 14:22:03 rzr: a new 0.5 image will come out sooner or later now Jan 06 14:22:12 great Jan 06 14:22:20 i'll do this too Jan 06 14:23:37 Good.. I just remembered that i'm not gonna upload anyhing with 5gb/month limit... :P Jan 06 14:24:57 upload it once , at the end of the month :) Jan 06 14:26:50 Stskeeps: ah, SBOX_DEFAULT_AUTOMAKE=1.9;export SBOX_DEFAULT_AUTOMAKE. Jan 06 14:26:55 Stskeeps: that does it :-) Jan 06 14:27:04 yeah Jan 06 14:27:16 johnx: think i'll build a 0.5 image with auto-startx to get things a little more sane Jan 06 14:27:19 the old image is a bit stale so Jan 06 14:27:37 Stskeeps, sounds good. also, we're finally really session based! woo! Jan 06 14:28:03 wonder if Nokia is doing their own session-oriented thing for fremantle :/ Jan 06 14:28:11 no clue Jan 06 14:32:12 what else should i include in standard image? Jan 06 14:32:20 Meizirkki: any suggestions? Jan 06 14:33:04 Tear if it works :P Jan 06 14:33:31 But i can't try it because i am unable to boot! :( Jan 06 14:34:25 ~nuke shitty initfs Jan 06 14:34:26 * infobot prepares 100 missle silos, and targets them at shitty initfs ... B☢☢M! Jan 06 14:34:53 install deblet bootmenu? :P Jan 06 14:36:35 Meizirkki: any apps you've found helpful? :P Jan 06 14:37:21 i have deblet's bootmenu... Jan 06 14:37:40 can i see your bootmenu item? Jan 06 14:37:54 and how did you untar the image tar.gz? Jan 06 14:38:20 i can't think i'm so pissed off right now, sec... Jan 06 14:38:25 i used imager Jan 06 14:38:29 everyhing gone well Jan 06 14:39:02 i'll pastebin the bootmenu item Jan 06 14:39:22 s/ item/.conf/ Jan 06 14:39:27 k Jan 06 14:39:58 hmm, chroot fails. no /bin/sh o_O Jan 06 14:40:09 johnx, session oriented thing? user login sessions? :D ? Jan 06 14:40:14 sounds like something went wrong :P Jan 06 14:40:24 it chrooted while ago... Jan 06 14:40:30 Meizirkki: is it mounted? :P Jan 06 14:40:35 yes it is Jan 06 14:40:43 lcuk, the potential to support those later. :P right now at least stuff isn't running from init.d anymore. hildon can be used with a display manager now Jan 06 14:40:44 wait, not sure Jan 06 14:41:20 pastebin.com/m4206e202 Jan 06 14:41:39 (bootmenu.conf) Jan 06 14:41:59 johnx, ahhh so a session on tvout for instance and one active display? or am i getting knickersi na twist still Jan 06 14:42:15 lcuk, knickers, twisted. yes Jan 06 14:42:17 i hope it boots now.. Jan 06 14:42:30 ok ill rearrange and try again later ;) Jan 06 14:42:33 Meizirkki: bootmenu.conf which is in /mnt/initfs too Jan 06 14:42:36 lcuk, but actually, with two x servers you could do that I suppose...so sure, why not? :) Jan 06 14:42:43 johnx: actually since we have xorg.. Jan 06 14:43:00 you could do a dual screen tablet probably, with usbvga Jan 06 14:43:11 Stskeeps: i used your bootmenu installer, and bootmenu comes up. So i think it is there Jan 06 14:43:19 Stskeeps, that would be triple screen Jan 06 14:43:43 anyway, i was just curious about sessions, ill find out more later Jan 06 14:43:47 lcuk, basically in Nokia's distro user level desktop stuff was started as part of the system init. Now, it's all nicely compartmentalized and done like a normal linux distro Jan 06 14:43:55 Meizirkki: k, and you use your own bootmenu.conf Jan 06 14:44:03 oooh johnx, good Jan 06 14:44:13 thanks, cya in a bit Jan 06 14:44:30 lcuk, and actually, yes, with xorg, we are capable of supporting two screens at once if the hardware supports it, as Stskeeps said. no need to run two x servers now that I think about it correctly Jan 06 14:44:49 we're actually able to support more probably, :P Jan 06 14:44:55 cluster of usbvga.. hmm :P Jan 06 14:45:18 heh...with one poor overworked tablet driving them all via a 7 port hub :P Jan 06 14:45:46 neat demo anyway :P Jan 06 14:45:51 Stskeeps: it's the deblet one, just modified a bit, when i select Mer, it hangs showing me "Starting linuxrc from mer (mmcblk0p2) (ext3) ..." Jan 06 14:46:10 i have chmod 777 it and still that happens Jan 06 14:46:29 Meizirkki: mm, that bootmenu.conf isn't using bootmenu items though Jan 06 14:47:12 I first tried the item-using bootmenu.conf, same happened Jan 06 14:47:38 k Jan 06 14:47:45 then i removed the items and made my own bootmenu.conf, hoping that would help :( Jan 06 14:48:00 wait some hours and grab the 0.5 image instead to base off Jan 06 14:49:15 if i can't get this run i will.. before that i'll ~curse sonera couple of times for giving us a data/month limit :P Jan 06 14:49:23 hehe Jan 06 14:49:45 !! Jan 06 14:49:55 haha, i can use the old modem Jan 06 14:50:00 as long as it works Jan 06 14:50:21 hehe Jan 06 14:50:42 in my family we still have the imap accounts from the isp we had in 2000 :P Jan 06 14:50:45 imap/pop3 Jan 06 14:51:33 * johnx remembers when his cousin used to own an ISP Jan 06 14:51:53 heh, wasnt it mostly a T1 and a modem pool? :P Jan 06 14:53:15 yeah, very likely Jan 06 14:53:24 I had free service until they got bought out Jan 06 14:53:42 Stskeeps: what's the best route for me to start beating ont he new hotness? Jan 06 14:53:50 and man...getting bought out was a great way to leave the game. in another couple years DSL and cable sprung up in the area Jan 06 14:54:35 r2d2rogers: well there's still the sapwood issue Jan 06 14:54:45 and i would like your imager scripts Jan 06 14:54:53 doh Jan 06 14:54:57 rigth Jan 06 14:55:02 will push those Jan 06 14:55:38 Stskeeps: don't suppose you know how to get Xinput.h in scratchbox? :) Jan 06 14:55:41 then i can start generating 770 images, so Jan 06 14:55:46 JohnFlux: libxi-dev? :P Jan 06 14:56:01 Stskeeps: I have that installed, but it doesn't seem to contain it.. Jan 06 14:56:34 not sure then, my area is Mer SDK :P Jan 06 14:57:13 Stskeeps: rats. dpkg -L libxi-dev show no .h files in it at all hum Jan 06 15:00:16 right, off to bus Jan 06 15:18:30 Stskeeps: i am sure now what went wrong... Jan 06 15:18:58 i ran imager when i was booted to cloned maemo Jan 06 15:19:02 on internal Jan 06 15:19:39 "that's why all 3 tries before this were corrupted completely"... Jan 06 15:19:59 ah Jan 06 15:20:02 i'll wait for the 0.5 release... Jan 06 15:20:15 k, building it atm Jan 06 15:20:51 building will surely take less than downloading it with the old connection... Jan 06 15:21:03 yeah Jan 06 15:22:40 ~curse sonera, for giving data limit to Meiz Jan 06 15:22:41 May the fleas of a thousand camels infest your most sensitive regions, sonera, for giving data limit to Meiz ! Jan 06 15:23:02 that feels good... Jan 06 15:23:04 :P Jan 06 15:23:21 Meiz: what happens w=once you exceed the limit? Jan 06 15:23:58 they will first low priority Jan 06 15:24:17 that other modems near override ours Jan 06 15:24:48 then they can take the connection away :( Jan 06 15:25:15 i'll call and ask how much i have to pay for limit-less connection Jan 06 15:25:37 if there is any Jan 06 15:25:49 Wonderful Jan 06 15:26:08 * RST38h just pays per-megabyte once he exceeds the 11GB cap Jan 06 15:26:15 Or is it 20GB now? Mhm Jan 06 15:26:39 on your line? Jan 06 15:26:55 or is that for wireless? Jan 06 15:27:20 Ethernet Jan 06 15:27:45 erm, you have ethernet to your home? Jan 06 15:28:04 $24/month for 15GB + $.01/MB for anything extra Jan 06 15:28:07 aquatix: yep Jan 06 15:28:28 Ah, almost forgotten: all local traffic is free. Jan 06 15:28:39 RST38h: that's some city LAN? Jan 06 15:29:06 aquatix: communal network, covers pretty much whole north-west/north of the city Jan 06 15:29:13 http://www.ultranet.ru/page.php?57#2 Jan 06 15:29:15 neat Jan 06 15:29:34 * RST38h wonders how long before some big company buys them and ruins the service Jan 06 15:30:18 if they're nice, they refuse to sell themselves Jan 06 15:30:54 it does not work this way. They are usually made an offer they can't refuse. Jan 06 15:31:16 It's Russia, after all. Jan 06 15:31:28 Exactly. Jan 06 15:31:30 damn capitalists ;) Jan 06 15:31:35 oh the irony Jan 06 15:37:01 Yes, because there was certainly no Russian mafia under communism. Jan 06 15:37:56 It has nothing to do with mafia. In fact, "Russian mafia" is pretty much gone now. Jan 06 15:38:35 RST38h, much easier to change the laws and do things legit anyways :) Jan 06 15:38:40 There is a plenty of laws and regulations though and a lot of officials ready to enforce them, for a fee. Jan 06 15:38:40 all gone bankrupt? Jan 06 15:38:55 hehehe Jan 06 15:38:59 RST38h: My point was there was one under communism. Jan 06 15:39:00 aquatix: replaced by public servants =) Jan 06 15:39:13 s/replaced/became/ :) Jan 06 15:39:16 derf: Not in the normal meaning of the word Jan 06 15:39:23 johnx: Replaced. Jan 06 15:39:27 hmm, public servant mafia... Jan 06 15:39:51 johnx: The old style purple-suit guys got mostly killed or jailed Jan 06 15:40:17 i find it funny unlock hacks for iphone make it to be direct articles in newspapers.. Jan 06 15:40:53 I find it funny how people keep spending time working with non-open hardware Jan 06 15:41:25 johnx: Instead, the place has gone to the old Soviet system where extensive laws made you guilty by definition and a government official could choose whether to let you live for now or prosecute you Jan 06 15:41:36 i find it funny how the iphone is considered revolutionary Jan 06 15:41:45 iPhone is shiny! Jan 06 15:41:52 so is my m600i :P Jan 06 15:41:58 Shiny things are always revolutionary! Jan 06 15:42:06 and my phone has more buttons, so it's better ;) Jan 06 15:42:16 RST38h, sounds like what the US or UK police will be like in 10-20 years Jan 06 15:42:19 aquatix: your phone has no halo and iPhone does! Jan 06 15:42:24 (the iphone remembered me of my years old Sony Clie TH55) Jan 06 15:42:48 johnx: Yes, in fact the longer I watch the crap ongoing in the States, the more I believe that Jan 06 15:42:50 RST38h: my phone has a C64 emulator and one for lucas arts games Jan 06 15:43:11 mm. c64 emu Jan 06 15:43:14 we have one for tablet yet? :P Jan 06 15:43:19 aquatix: I think I also support m600i, as long as it is a UIQ phone Jan 06 15:43:19 RST38h, used to get pulled over so often for crap reasons. my real crime was "driving a crappy car in a nice neighborhood, late at night" Jan 06 15:43:19 not sure Jan 06 15:43:27 Sts: think so, we have got Frodo Jan 06 15:43:28 RST38h: it's uiq3 Jan 06 15:43:34 aquatix: Should work then Jan 06 15:43:36 yeah, frodo \o/ Jan 06 15:43:49 RST38h: that's about halo? Jan 06 15:44:08 johnx: I have only got into this situation once. NJ Turnpike. A car with MD plates full of young people. Jan 06 15:44:15 johnx: Speeding of course, but who wasn't? Jan 06 15:44:23 johnx: then steal a non-crappy car dammit Jan 06 15:44:41 johnx: The NJ cops REALLY wanted me to pay at the spot Jan 06 15:44:49 RST38h, lol. *I* wasn't. I got pulled over for slowing down after the police started tailgating me Jan 06 15:44:53 johnx: I mean, really, REALLY wanted it Jan 06 15:44:58 The first step to a police state is to make everyone a criminal. Jan 06 15:45:13 johnx: "Hey, man, where the hell are you crawling?" ? =) Jan 06 15:45:21 But I think the US has a long way to go to get there. Jan 06 15:45:41 derf: It only takes a very few corrections to the laws, really Jan 06 15:45:45 derf, it's ok, we can get there together! Jan 06 15:45:58 derf: perfectly sellable to the public, once you terrorise it enough Jan 06 15:46:28 RST38h: If the US survived the drug trade without becoming a police state, I'm at least cautiously optimistic about our long-term chances. Jan 06 15:46:42 the US isn't a police state? Jan 06 15:46:45 derf: In fact, you already can't freely choose your conversation subjects while at airports, you can't freely take pictures Jan 06 15:47:18 wtf @ 70's musical of war of the worlds.. Jan 06 15:47:22 * aquatix looks at the requirements to get into the country, if only on vacation Jan 06 15:47:35 Stskeeps: musical or that play? Jan 06 15:47:37 derf: You can't freely access stuff at the internet Jan 06 15:47:48 aquatix: jeff wayne, so a musical Jan 06 15:47:50 Stskeeps: the LP rocks :) Jan 06 15:47:57 RST38h: I can't? Jan 06 15:48:06 yeah, jeff wayne Jan 06 15:48:26 it's still a bit of a wtf though :> Jan 06 15:48:34 derf: Nope - remember, the feds can always claim you are downloading child pornography *or* copyrighted stuff Jan 06 15:48:43 derf: In fact, they often do now. Jan 06 15:49:05 derf: Ah, btw, looking at bomb making tutorials is also off limits =) Jan 06 15:49:06 And those kinds of accusations are _very_ difficult to actually make stick in court. Jan 06 15:49:19 derf: They don't have to make 'em stick Jan 06 15:49:42 derf: Confiscating all your equipment and detaining you for a while are pretty nice tools on their own Jan 06 15:50:04 derf: Russians know it all too well Jan 06 15:50:17 derf: and having police come and confiscate your equipment and carrying you away in shackles is always a good way to estrange your neighbours . Jan 06 15:50:20 :P Jan 06 15:50:30 depends on the neighbors Jan 06 15:50:39 either estranges you or makes you a local hero Jan 06 15:50:41 So you think people should be "free" to download CP? Jan 06 15:50:45 johnx: Sts is basically true as far as US is concerned Jan 06 15:51:01 johnx: People are afraid and do not want to get involved Jan 06 15:51:28 RST38h: Not if you live in Texas. Jan 06 15:52:14 derf: I think vague, hard to prove claims should not be used for incrimination Jan 06 15:52:49 I'm not sure that that is a vague claim. Jan 06 15:52:52 derf: So, if some creep is jerking odd at child pornography, let him do it for now and go for the pornography SOURCE instead Jan 06 15:53:04 people could really need a fair bit of common sense.. let's say, guy working in a kinder garden, gets some bogus claim against him that he touched a child inappropiately, and even if it was proved it definately never happened, the guy wouldn't be able to find work again in that area and rumours go fast.. Jan 06 15:53:09 :P Jan 06 15:53:29 derf: BTW, Sts is raising a good topic Jan 06 15:53:29 Stskeeps: Sure, but that has nothing to do with the law. Jan 06 15:53:48 derf: it follows along with the fact people assume people who get arrested are guilty by definition :P Jan 06 15:54:07 derf: You know that US kindergarten personnel will not wipe your kid's ass unless you sign a paper explicitely freeing them from any liability? =) Jan 06 15:54:21 Last I checked the legal system in this country still used "innocent until proven guilty". Jan 06 15:54:29 derf: Correct. Jan 06 15:54:31 Stskeeps: i really like that Jeff Wayne version though, even was a tad disappointed the new movie didn't include a piece of the music Jan 06 15:54:34 derf: i still wonder if innocent until proven guilty is against human nature.. Jan 06 15:54:41 RST38h, I'm beginning to believe that's a cultural thing, not really a legal one Jan 06 15:54:43 movie was a big disappointment anyway Jan 06 15:54:58 johnx: Maybe, but it does not say anything good about the culture Jan 06 15:54:59 as in, i fully support the principle of innocent until proven guilty, but people act totally contrary to that at times Jan 06 15:55:03 But people will only assume the arrested are guilty if the police actually only arrest guilty people most of the time. Jan 06 15:55:21 If the police start getting out of hand, that assumption will correct itself. Jan 06 15:55:35 derf: Theoretically, yes Jan 06 15:55:47 RST38h, it's an interesting balance between: easy to get people in trouble for things that never happened and impossible to get people held responsible for stuff that everyone knows happened Jan 06 15:55:48 derf: Practically, it depends on many factors. Jan 06 15:55:49 in .dk we have the interesting effect that people get worried if there are police on the street, instead of feeling more protected :P Jan 06 15:55:57 :) Jan 06 15:56:09 i have the same feeling actually Jan 06 15:56:22 cos if there -are- cops, it's a sign there's something up :P Jan 06 15:56:22 if i see police `hanging around', i start getting worried Jan 06 15:56:31 yeah Jan 06 15:56:36 then again we have mostly sane police in .dk :P Jan 06 15:56:37 Stskeeps, same in the states. not so in Japan...because the police in Japan are largely ineffective except to give you directions Jan 06 15:56:41 johnx: It's really easy to avoid, you just have to be prepared to live with the fact that some crap will go unpunished Jan 06 15:57:01 johnx: That's because Japan doesn't have very much crime for them to be effective against. Jan 06 15:57:03 RST38h, and that crap often comes from the highest levels. Jan 06 15:57:42 johnx: that too, but I mostly mean minor crap, copyright violations, people looking at stuff they are "not supposed" to look at etc Jan 06 15:57:49 derf, also true...to a certain extent. though read any story about what happens in a Japanese high speed chase... Jan 06 15:57:50 Jan 06 15:58:06 RST38h, you don't get to pick and choose...it's a very broad cultural thing :P Jan 06 15:59:45 andrewfblack: how's the mer echo theme going btw? Jan 06 16:02:00 johnx: Google doesn't turn up any. Jan 06 16:02:21 derf, ah, sad. let me try and find it. it was truly epic if I recall Jan 06 16:07:21 derf, http://archive.japantoday.com/jp/news/425997 Jan 06 16:11:30 johnx: That's what happens when you have lots of police and no crime. Jan 06 16:12:02 and slow cars...and I have to assume little training into "offensive driving" Jan 06 16:12:44 slow cars? I some pretty quick Japanese cars Jan 06 16:13:00 lardman, yeah. quicker than most police cars :P Jan 06 16:13:19 johnx: But why would you invest in those things when they're not really a problem most of the time? Jan 06 16:13:24 yeah, well Police sholdn't chase people anyway Jan 06 16:14:00 though I am tempted by the US approach of just shooting the buggers if they drive off Jan 06 16:14:06 derf, the cars I will give you...the "what to do in a high speed chase" training should be part of any police training Jan 06 16:14:21 works better than our method of chasing them endlessly until they or the Police car causes an accident of its own Jan 06 16:14:49 lardman: I think that's what actually happened here. Jan 06 16:14:50 johnx: think danish policy is they try to avoid high speed chases cos of the very potential damages Jan 06 16:15:24 helicopter + one or two cars driving at a safe distance; or shoot them :) Jan 06 16:15:27 Stskeeps, exactly. *that* makes the most sense. put up a helicopter as soon as you can and just follow 'em. Jan 06 16:15:54 * lardman thinks that Apache drivers could get some practice in Jan 06 16:16:25 :) Jan 06 16:16:48 `yeah, there was some colateral damage, but hey, we got that sucker!' Jan 06 16:17:02 :D Jan 06 16:17:30 or we could just install a police-override in every car... Jan 06 16:18:31 johnx: yeah, lets do that, and install the trusted computing platform too for good measure Jan 06 16:19:07 aquatix, for sure. and make sure we hand MS a fat contract to put wince on it Jan 06 16:25:49 * Stskeeps tars up v0.5 Jan 06 16:25:57 awesome Jan 06 16:34:54 117mb tar.gz image Jan 06 16:35:04 (no clue about jffs2 atm) Jan 06 16:36:05 Stskeeps, want me to try and be the first to boot mer off flash? :P Jan 06 16:36:30 hehe, if you want Jan 06 16:36:49 it isn't docpurged though Jan 06 16:37:05 heh, docpurge isn't a hard thing to copy :P Jan 06 16:37:19 117mb as a tar.gz should be fine though Jan 06 16:37:29 yeah, it can probably be more stripped down Jan 06 16:37:33 I'll need the deblet bootmenu right? Jan 06 16:37:57 depends if you're going by booting something else than initfs or not Jan 06 16:38:11 just hang on a bit while i test it on my own tablet first :) Jan 06 16:38:25 Stskeeps: did you post a link? i missed (connection problems) Jan 06 16:38:30 no, not yet Jan 06 16:38:33 k Jan 06 16:38:36 Stskeeps, well, I can't do much else if I don't have a link ;P Jan 06 16:39:54 may as well get prepared meanwhile by dumping the contents of my current flash into a jffs2 image ;) Jan 06 16:49:10 we so need an initial image before hildon boots.. Jan 06 16:49:18 i suddenly understand why the hands image is there Jan 06 16:49:19 :P Jan 06 16:49:48 qwerty12: you were talking about dialog placement patch? Jan 06 16:49:50 * qwerty12 refrains from pointing you to Benson's modification of the image Jan 06 16:49:52 how about a picture of the desktop? Jan 06 16:49:58 hehe Jan 06 16:50:05 take a screenshot once its rendered? ;) Jan 06 16:50:13 exactly! Jan 06 16:50:31 Stskeeps, well, I don't think Matan released the source but he released a binary. Maybe if you ask nicely... Jan 06 16:50:32 it would be just like windows 95 -> XP or so Jan 06 16:50:58 hehe, is it possible to add Composite option into xorg.conf? Jan 06 16:51:01 in Mert Jan 06 16:51:03 no clue Jan 06 16:51:04 Mer Jan 06 16:51:23 jauntys xcompmgr and transset are working btw Jan 06 16:51:49 Doesn't that mean that composite is already enabled then? Jan 06 16:51:56 s/composite/compositing/ Jan 06 16:51:56 qwerty12 meant: Doesn't that mean that compositing is already enabled then? Jan 06 16:52:01 * Stskeeps notes to himself the he can't kill root proceses when hildon is running as user.. Jan 06 16:52:24 no, but they work if installed and startted Jan 06 16:52:27 -t Jan 06 16:52:54 Jan 06 16:52:54 Stskeeps, echo PREFERED_USER=root > /etc/default/autologin Jan 06 16:52:54 http://stskeeps.subnetmask.net/mer/mer-armel-n8x0-image-v0.5.tar.gz ready for consumption Jan 06 16:52:59 we can *do* things like that now :) Jan 06 16:53:02 hehe Jan 06 16:53:36 Who wanted emulators for an UIQ3 gadget? Jan 06 16:54:15 * qwerty12 remembers posting links to the first 2 you released for uiq3 on ipmart :P Jan 06 16:54:38 pirate? :> Jan 06 16:54:40 what is ipmart, anyway? Jan 06 16:55:00 UIQ3 Binaries: http://fms.komkon.org/EmuSymbian/ (follow instructions) Jan 06 16:55:44 RST38h, dunno, I just like the forum :P. Although my service cable I bought for Sony Ericsson from Germany has the ipmart logo on it :P Jan 06 16:55:56 Stskeeps, yep, I used to share actually... Jan 06 16:56:06 qwerty12: btw osso-xterm crashes :( Jan 06 16:56:17 Stskeeps, roxterm? :( Jan 06 16:56:17 or at least it did on x86 Jan 06 16:57:23 qwerty12: roxterm did not kick up h-i-m lats time i tried Jan 06 16:57:35 Meizirkki_, damn :( Jan 06 16:58:05 Maybe osso-xterm will work on arm :) Jan 06 16:58:47 * RST38h asks the Tentacled One to reveal to him the secret of settings dialog implementation in S60e5 Jan 06 16:59:20 RST38h, no Jan 06 16:59:36 qwerty, thr false god Jan 06 16:59:44 :P Jan 06 16:59:52 nop, crashes on mer too Jan 06 16:59:56 (armel) Jan 06 17:00:02 :( Jan 06 17:00:36 how about installing the original maemo one ? :P Jan 06 17:00:59 qwerty: The Tentacled One will punish you for that. And for those octopus sushi you had! Jan 06 17:01:01 well this is the original, except its trunk :P Jan 06 17:01:20 yep Jan 06 17:01:31 RST38h, mmmm, kaiten-zushi! Jan 06 17:01:47 RST38h, hmm, I've always wondered how good cthulhu tasted when barbecued.... Jan 06 17:01:58 qwerty: like rubber. Jan 06 17:02:22 yeah, tako sashimi is even when *good* and *fresh* very chewy Jan 06 17:03:38 Meizirkki_: happen to know if mono was ported to ubuntu arm? Jan 06 17:03:44 (.. just for kicks) Jan 06 17:03:54 i don't know... Jan 06 17:04:50 i'll install i386 version of Mer soon (before the limitless connection will be down) Jan 06 17:05:08 mm, thats not that easy though Jan 06 17:05:23 johnx: https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/jaunty/armel/cacao-oj6-jdk/6b13~pre1-0ubuntu2 Jan 06 17:05:29 could also do an interesting demo with this :P Jan 06 17:05:37 Stskeeps, what's latest version of deblet bootmenu? Jan 06 17:05:48 is there something that runs on java that you actually need? Jan 06 17:05:55 oh, er, I assume it's in the deblet repo. sorry. Jan 06 17:06:01 no clue, but taking j2me / j2se apps couldn't be bad :P Jan 06 17:06:15 ah, natively running j2me would be darn neat Jan 06 17:06:55 building phoneme shouldn't be impossible Jan 06 17:07:34 someone needs to integrate davlik into a normal linux install... Jan 06 17:07:54 the whole environment I'm not too fond of ... but there are some really neat apps Jan 06 17:08:57 hm, jalimo doesn't seem that insane Jan 06 17:10:14 Sts: I would suggest sticking with j2me Jan 06 17:10:34 Sts: The only question is whether you will find a small enough runtime environment Jan 06 17:10:34 If i want to install hildon-desktop-env to my ubuntu-box these packages will be removed Jan 06 17:10:36 fast-user-switch-applet gconf2-common gnome-applets gnome-control-center Jan 06 17:10:37 gnome-panel gnome-session gnome-themes gtk2-engines-pixbuf Jan 06 17:10:37 libgnomevfs2-common libgnomevfs2-extra nautilus nautilus-cd-burner Jan 06 17:10:37 nautilus-share ubuntu-desktop Jan 06 17:11:07 johnx: AFAIK, Davlik won't run standard j2me apps Jan 06 17:11:35 RST38h, I'm interested in android apps more than j2me apps really Jan 06 17:11:37 RST38h: well, i dont want to run j2me in internal flash Jan 06 17:11:39 johnx: If we are talking about pirat^H^H^Hstandard j2me games, you only need j2me and a couple of platform extensions Jan 06 17:11:52 Meizirkki_: mm, be aware that this is jaunty, not intrepid Jan 06 17:11:55 johnx: Then you want to port the whole android Jan 06 17:11:58 and i wouldn't recommend what you're doing Jan 06 17:12:05 johnx: Including the kernel I am afraid Jan 06 17:12:32 johnx: Somebody at this channel once said that there are kernel changes needed for android to work properly Jan 06 17:12:38 RST38h, me Jan 06 17:13:04 PhoneME would probably work except for two things: Jan 06 17:13:07 RST38h, *I* said it. and it's true, for the current implementation of davlik and the libc it runs on... Jan 06 17:13:36 johnx: Then things are fucked =( Unless these kernel extensions are harmless enough to just roll them into Mer Jan 06 17:14:06 RST38h, it's just a better low memory killer, and some other crap. I'm sure it can be abstracted away by a different implementation of the davlik vm Jan 06 17:14:15 what is the easiest way to install a recent abiword. Jan 06 17:14:29 s/./? Jan 06 17:14:38 PhoneME: 1) make sure SSL sources are included into it (that is a gotcha SUN plays to make you pay them) and 2) If it uses KVM, things will be dead slow Jan 06 17:14:41 Stskeeps: i'll still... Jan 06 17:14:44 :P Jan 06 17:14:57 yigal: Add extras-devel, install, remove extras-devel Jan 06 17:15:03 Meizirkki_: if you nuke your ubuntu install, it's not my fault ;) Jan 06 17:15:07 yigal: Do you read Hebrew by any chance? Jan 06 17:15:37 * ShadowJK 'd want to run opera mini Jan 06 17:15:37 Stskeeps: i know, i often nuke my ubuntu Jan 06 17:15:49 yeah, true, opera mini would be a hit Jan 06 17:16:30 They had it running on psp iirc... Jan 06 17:16:44 qwerty: PSP is a different CPU. Jan 06 17:16:55 if the joystick on mine wasn't fucked, I'd be probably using it. web browser on psp fat sucks Jan 06 17:17:10 RST38h, i'm talking about opera mini here, does cpu really matter? Jan 06 17:17:17 RST38h: a bit Jan 06 17:17:20 this was an j2me emulator Jan 06 17:17:32 qwerty: Yep. If SUN does not provide SSL sources OR objects for ARM, you are fucked. Jan 06 17:18:00 qwerty: If there are AT LEAST objects you can link (i.e. they use your ABI), then you are in business to compile PhoneME Jan 06 17:18:13 yigal: Would you care to translate this graffiti: http://community.livejournal.com/idu_shagayu/1706917.html ? Jan 06 17:20:10 RST38h: my parents married in Israel but I was born and raised in the states so I really mean only a little, I can try. Jan 06 17:21:43 qwerty: In fact, it may be a good idea to do for NIT - the Jalimo guys appear to be pretty self-centered, they do not intend Jalimo to do any practical work Jan 06 17:22:25 * Stskeeps tries to install abiword on mer Jan 06 17:26:42 rzr: Mer 0.5 now available Jan 06 17:26:49 http://stskeeps.subnetmask.net/mer/mer-armel-n8x0-image-v0.5.tar.gz Jan 06 17:28:28 RST38H: I am too much a lazy American, now I feel I should be studying hebrew, I can read it but I don't understand what is written. Jan 06 17:28:36 I lost my /home dir on the SD. I used to boot of SD and run two programs that where using files, after restarting I lost all my /home Jan 06 17:28:38 Hello everybody ! Jan 06 17:28:42 is there a fix? Jan 06 17:29:09 Khertan: hi Jan 06 17:29:18 cityLightss, so you can't see anything under /home ? Jan 06 17:29:19 hi Jan 06 17:29:25 Meizirkki_: great Jan 06 17:29:33 cityLightss, what filesystem were you using? Jan 06 17:29:37 yigal: Hehe, I know the feeling :) Jan 06 17:29:40 Meizirkki: have to test this too Jan 06 17:29:57 i'm (still) downloading Jan 06 17:30:02 I boot of the flash and mount the /dev/mmcblk0p2 no /home there Jan 06 17:30:11 used to be ext2 Jan 06 17:30:40 rzr: be aware it needs deblet bootmenu and other funny stuff :P Jan 06 17:30:53 just so you're warned :) Jan 06 17:30:56 :) Jan 06 17:31:11 cityLightss, have you tried running fsck on it? or looking into undelete programs for ext2? Jan 06 17:31:38 fsck claims the file system is clean Jan 06 17:33:29 opera claims to have implemented their own ssl anyway, blaming vendor ssl implementations of being too buggy to use Jan 06 17:36:44 ok of to google... Jan 06 17:38:13 Stskeeps, will have to shrink mer a bit :). jffs2 image is 253.3 mb and after sumtooling it, it comes to 265.3 mb Jan 06 17:38:25 no wait. I'm a bellend. Jan 06 17:38:27 huhu Jan 06 17:38:37 I made the image with the tar.gz in it >.< Jan 06 17:38:43 ARF ! Jan 06 17:40:18 Stskeeps, that's better :). 146.0 mb now :) Jan 06 17:41:19 ta, qwerty12 Jan 06 17:42:12 * Stskeeps has 3 screenshots coming up .. Jan 06 17:42:51 Stskeeps, is bootmenu_1.4_armel.deb your latest bootmenu :) Jan 06 17:43:00 ah, fallout from the gconf transition: need to put the right path in start-hildon :) Jan 06 17:43:53 johnx: if its in deblet repository, yes Jan 06 17:44:01 johnx: so gconf isnt started? Jan 06 17:44:06 that might be why some stuff doesnt work :P Jan 06 17:44:36 certainly possible Jan 06 17:44:45 http://bsd.tspre.org/~stskeeps/mer0.5/Screenshot-1.png (roxterm) , http://bsd.tspre.org/~stskeeps/mer0.5/Screenshot-2.png (abiword) , http://bsd.tspre.org/~stskeeps/mer0.5/Screenshot-3.png (abiword with text) Jan 06 17:45:19 looks ok, need to pull in the extras-devel abiword now :) Jan 06 17:45:25 use the roxterm I put in extras, it has some hildonisations on it (which I need to improve come think of it..) Jan 06 17:45:25 hehe Jan 06 17:46:18 qwerty12: i don't recall, did i add you to builder or not? :P Jan 06 17:46:29 @18:44 Jan 06 17:46:29 @18:43 Jan 06 17:46:29 Garage Band 09 Jan 06 17:46:29 @18:43 Jan 06 17:46:29 @18:42 Jan 06 17:46:31 Garage Band 09 Jan 06 17:46:34 @18:42 Jan 06 17:46:34 you have a ~/incoming at least Jan 06 17:46:36 Applaudissement plus enthousiastes après cette fin de démo. Phil est de retour. Jan 06 17:46:39 @18:41 Jan 06 17:46:41 Navigation dans les cartes, effets, etc. Jan 06 17:46:41 Stskeeps, if you did, I don't ever remember saying you did :p Jan 06 17:46:44 @18:40 Jan 06 17:46:46 Retour des effets spéciaux, avec les rayons X, sépia, etc. Jan 06 17:46:48 highly possible Jan 06 17:46:49 oups Jan 06 17:46:51 sorry Jan 06 17:47:17 although I notice the xchat I put in incoming hasn't been added :P Jan 06 17:47:38 qwerty12: your trac.tspre.org account, clean out ~/incoming , upload there, and ssh qwerty12@trac.tspre.org /import-new-packages (source packages only) Jan 06 17:47:46 and then i think you have access to builder already Jan 06 17:48:09 (on #merbuilder jaiku9 Jan 06 17:48:24 ok, the rest of my packages are there afaik, I'll try adding xchat and see how it works out Jan 06 17:49:25 johnx: pushing hildon-desktop-env update? Jan 06 17:49:39 in a sec. Jan 06 17:49:41 k Jan 06 17:49:52 impatient cos of osso-xterm itch ;) Jan 06 17:50:23 I'll tell you if it fixes it :P Jan 06 17:50:24 ~mer Jan 06 17:50:25 mer is probably http://wiki.maemo.org/Mer_Blueprint_New and http://wiki.maemo.org/Mer_Blueprint Jan 06 17:51:41 Stskeeps, looks like no love :/ Jan 06 17:51:52 damnit :P Jan 06 17:53:03 whee, xchat is building :) Jan 06 17:55:03 * Meiz_n810 boots to Mer Jan 06 17:55:32 I think the extras autobuilder could do with stealing some ideas, this gives you a log on the fly and is actually fast ;) Jan 06 17:55:49 qwerty12, it'll slow down if more people hit it I'm sure... Jan 06 17:55:59 yeah, but it's also loaded with some severe craq things and bugs :P Jan 06 17:56:28 also it's our official position that Maemo should be stealing *all our ideas* :) Jan 06 17:56:57 Stskeeps, should libtool be a dependency? Jan 06 17:57:06 s/dependency/build-depends/ Jan 06 17:57:06 qwerty12 meant: Stskeeps, should libtool be a build-depends? Jan 06 17:57:18 qwerty12: yeah, we're not scratchbox on x86 Jan 06 17:57:35 it should be assumed we have nothing but traditional build-essentials Jan 06 17:57:57 qwerty12: was it gnumeric you people had huge problems with, btw? Jan 06 17:58:01 I'm getting used to the niceties of sbox it seems :) Jan 06 17:58:07 Stskeeps, no idea, i've never touched gnumeric Jan 06 17:58:11 k Jan 06 17:58:37 Can I replace the source package with a fixed source package that has the same version number? Jan 06 17:59:01 * GeneralAntilles sighs @ #3519 Jan 06 17:59:33 qwerty12: we have pinnings in place, and you can do build package=version Jan 06 17:59:55 ok Jan 06 18:00:13 or was it qalculate? Jan 06 18:00:47 Stskeeps, ah, qalculate it was, yes. lardman got it to run and I just made the package nicer to install :P Jan 06 18:00:57 alright Jan 06 18:01:30 GeneralAntilles, yeah, not the kind of thing to encourage people to submit patches... Jan 06 18:02:30 hi GeneralAntilles. back to using the full nick I see :D Jan 06 18:02:33 Stskeeps, how did your sapwood bug turn out? any activity recently? Jan 06 18:02:36 GeneralAntilles link? Jan 06 18:02:41 johnx: not recently Jan 06 18:02:55 andrewfblack, https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=3519 Jan 06 18:03:02 johnx thanks Jan 06 18:03:07 then again people are just returning from holidays Jan 06 18:03:29 johnx, ooh, good angle. Jan 06 18:04:12 i'm just looking forward to a faster omapfb xorg driver :) Jan 06 18:04:27 fb_update_mode auto is just nasty Jan 06 18:05:09 well, falling back to xomap would be annoying but not a huge deal really Jan 06 18:05:18 i couldn't compile it last time Jan 06 18:05:22 oh Jan 06 18:05:31 too ancient X headers Jan 06 18:06:12 More silliness: https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=3937 Jan 06 18:06:33 fuck, I forgot to disable vdso when I let my menu.lst be replaced Jan 06 18:08:37 Meizirkki: success or broke? Jan 06 18:09:32 Ubuntu-box: broken. :P Jan 06 18:09:35 n810: still unable to boot :( Jan 06 18:09:53 hmm. Jan 06 18:09:54 that's odd Jan 06 18:10:02 INT_CARD vs EXT_CARD maybe? Jan 06 18:10:10 no Jan 06 18:10:12 so on #3519 no unless you buy a new device and on #3937 just plain no we don't want to make it easier to install software Jan 06 18:10:30 but i have r&d mode on... Can it harm? Jan 06 18:10:36 Meizirkki: no, i have that too, i think Jan 06 18:10:38 andrewfblack, tz is the one in the wrong in #3937 Jan 06 18:10:43 gdebi would be nice for opening debs Jan 06 18:10:46 AlsO: Jan 06 18:10:47 ~mer Jan 06 18:10:48 methinks mer is http://wiki.maemo.org/Mer_Blueprint_New and http://wiki.maemo.org/Mer_Blueprint Jan 06 18:11:01 i reistalled bootmenu installer, now trying again Jan 06 18:11:10 I can see #3937 fron both sides Jan 06 18:11:38 isnt "red pill" basically just installing stuff that isn't in user/, or how was it? Jan 06 18:11:48 Well, tz1 is right in that app manager should resolve dependencies when installing locally from a deb file. Jan 06 18:11:59 Dunno about what else he is talking about though. Jan 06 18:12:03 Stskeeps, I don't know what tz thinking it is. Jan 06 18:12:17 GeneralAntilles: the matrix? :P Jan 06 18:12:19 Mostly, I think he thinks it's a magic talisman that solves world hunger. Jan 06 18:12:37 qwerty12, look at it when considering people who don't have your skills, though. Jan 06 18:12:52 but I am so tired of fixed in fremantle to me everytime they fix something in fremantle and not diablo they are telling me we are not fixing our broke os if i want a good one buy a new tablet. Jan 06 18:12:56 Installing random debs from everywhere isn't something that should be encouraged for them. Jan 06 18:13:08 As it'll mostly get them things that may not work well or they don't know what to do with. Jan 06 18:13:16 Fair enough. Jan 06 18:13:41 andrewfblack, again: Jan 06 18:13:43 ~mer Jan 06 18:13:44 rumour has it, mer is http://wiki.maemo.org/Mer_Blueprint_New and http://wiki.maemo.org/Mer_Blueprint Jan 06 18:13:49 GeneralAntilles, but telling them to use dpkg and apt-get on the CLI isn't the right answer either Jan 06 18:13:51 andrewfblack: btw you didn't answer my question on Mer Echo :) Jan 06 18:13:57 andrewfblack, it's not really as black and white as all that. Jan 06 18:14:09 johnx, yes, the right answer is getting the .deb into Extras. :P Jan 06 18:14:21 Stskeeps didn't see the question Jan 06 18:14:30 GeneralAntilles, I think there's room for gdebi ... I should try it under mer Jan 06 18:14:30 andrewfblack: ah, i was just asking how it was going with it Jan 06 18:14:52 Stskeeps, have you had dpkg-genbuilddeps play nice with your sdk? Jan 06 18:15:03 Stskeeps well its looks nothing lol echo really anymore but its a solid UI I think you will like it Jan 06 18:15:16 andrewfblack: as long as it's not plankton.. Jan 06 18:15:16 :P Jan 06 18:15:22 got it, I needed to install devscripts. Jan 06 18:15:29 qwerty12, I don't think time should be wasted coding for a niche-usecase that benefits very few people directly and could seriously harm others in the process. Jan 06 18:16:16 Stskeeps: still no luck, i even tried to use bootmenu with no linuxrc, and now i cannot get the linuxrc back :( Jan 06 18:16:33 Stskeeps I drew ideas from several themes including Echo. Nuvo, and Titan. Does the deb need to be repackaged to work in mer? Jan 06 18:16:47 andrewfblack: not sure, didnt try it yet, hoping to get meiz to do it when his mer runs ;) Jan 06 18:16:59 Meizirkki: k .. when you have time, reflash, install bootmenu deb, and install bootmenu Jan 06 18:17:12 and then write a bootmenu.d item in /etc/bootmenu.d and refresh_bootmenu.d Jan 06 18:18:18 Stskeeps, not worth building yet... http://pastebin.com/d7c4eb3f3 Jan 06 18:18:47 qwerty12: yeah, ran into same problem Jan 06 18:19:05 qwerty12: eabi qemu, and in the sb-conf install, add --fakeroot after devkit Jan 06 18:19:12 --devkits, that is Jan 06 18:19:22 we had same builder problem yesterday and forgot to change wiki Jan 06 18:23:08 Stskeeps, does http://pastebin.com/d30dce919 look ok to you? :P Jan 06 18:23:49 Or should I resort to modifying linuxrc directly? Jan 06 18:23:52 qwerty12: i wouldn't bet my horses on it, but maybe? O_o Jan 06 18:24:02 Only one way to find out :P Jan 06 18:24:03 i dunno if flash is done differently so Jan 06 18:24:37 * johnx bets Stskeeps' horses Jan 06 18:24:53 Stskeeps ok I'll send you over the deb for it on friday I should have time to get it mostly finished by then Jan 06 18:24:54 qwerty12: else a item with jffs2 and such options may work :P Jan 06 18:24:59 andrewfblack: alright, sounds good :) Jan 06 18:25:44 Stskeeps, I'll do that incase actually, once I'm out of Maemo, things will be a little more annoying if I need to make a change :P Jan 06 18:29:46 GeneralAntilles: sprint meeting was tomorrow? Jan 06 18:30:46 Well, it boots from flash! :) Jan 06 18:30:53 woo :) Jan 06 18:31:05 .. and it gets how far? ;) Jan 06 18:31:11 Well, I'm at the desktop :P Jan 06 18:31:14 woo Jan 06 18:31:29 and we welcome qwerty12 to the club of people who successfully got mer running ;) Jan 06 18:31:43 I can upload the jffs2 image somewhere if you wish? Jan 06 18:32:21 if you want, or just instructions so builder can make them too Jan 06 18:32:25 Here's the item file I used: http://pastebin.com/f1fa3eab Jan 06 18:33:50 Stskeeps, with mtd-tools installed, extract mer image to some folder (I used 232 out of randomness) and from .., run mkfs.jffs2 -r 232/ -o 232.jffs2 -e 128 -l -n and then use sumtool: sumtool -i 232.jffs2 -o 232sumtool.jffs2 -e 128KiB -l -n Jan 06 18:34:18 *nod* similar i did originally Jan 06 18:34:58 Though I see I am spoilt for choice regarding apps ;) Jan 06 18:35:32 yeah.. not much included in the bas e:P Jan 06 18:35:42 How does usbnet get started? :P Jan 06 18:36:19 rescue menu, hold down home key after selecting bootmenu item Jan 06 18:36:49 wicked Jan 06 18:38:40 yay, usbnet works :) Jan 06 18:39:13 Stskeeps: i disabled rd-mode flashed original kernel and initfs, flashed bootmenu, made mer.item, refreshed bootmenu, and it still refuses to even try to run the linuxrc on mer partition :( grr... Jan 06 18:39:23 Meizirkki: hmmm. Jan 06 18:39:34 cacn i see the mer.item you made now? Jan 06 18:39:50 yes Jan 06 18:41:26 shitfuck, at least internet doesn't work over usb Jan 06 18:41:55 language! dont go swearing all over the place without a fucking big reason Jan 06 18:41:56 install wireless-tools and you can connect to open ap:s Jan 06 18:41:57 qwerty12: edit /etc/resolv.conf Jan 06 18:42:12 and check your default route is ok Jan 06 18:42:26 Stskeeps, yeah, I believe so. Jan 06 18:42:36 Sts pastebin.com/m37736128 Jan 06 18:42:47 qwerty12, zenity looks great in Mer :D Jan 06 18:42:51 Meizirkki, thanks, will remember that but first I need an internet connection :P Jan 06 18:42:57 johnx, wicked :D Jan 06 18:43:05 Stskeeps, thanks Jan 06 18:43:36 yeah, means I don't have to learn gtk+ or even try and remember C Jan 06 18:43:39 * lcuk is feckin freezin Jan 06 18:43:44 Stskeeps: it just says boot from mer failed, booting from flash... Jan 06 18:43:47 GeneralAntilles: ah :/ not going to be able to attend, - going to a resturant as part of finishing a work project. Jan 06 18:44:09 Stskeeps: it does not even try to start the linuxrc Jan 06 18:44:23 and it is on the external card? Jan 06 18:44:29 on partition 2? :P Jan 06 18:45:00 bollocks, can't deal with all this now, going to reflash back to maemo Jan 06 18:45:02 yes it is Jan 06 18:45:19 Meizirkki: and it is ext3 format? :P Jan 06 18:45:29 yes, i'm not that stupid... Jan 06 18:45:35 didn't say you were :) Jan 06 18:45:40 :) Jan 06 18:46:25 johnx, did you remove sstrip dependency out of interest? :) Jan 06 18:46:39 Meizirkki: there's a possibility that it's because you used busybox tar Jan 06 18:47:03 qwerty12, yeah, wouldn't build in builder and sstrip doesn't exist for ARM :P Jan 06 18:47:25 try get 'gnutar' from extras, re-make FS and unpack again Jan 06 18:47:31 !! i have flashed initfs with diabos original fiasco now 3 times and bootmenu even more times and still there is bootmenu.conf in initfs, that i made 6 hours ago! Jan 06 18:47:42 and that's not even working bootmenu Jan 06 18:47:45 johnx, yeah, I think I quickly debianied it and uploaded it for maemo only Jan 06 18:47:50 .conf Jan 06 18:47:51 Meizirkki: impressive Jan 06 18:48:05 can you show me your /etc/bootmenu.conf ? Jan 06 18:48:06 johnx, glad they came in use though :) Jan 06 18:48:09 qwerty12, no worries. it works a treat even with the strange button placement in fremantle's gtk Jan 06 18:48:20 Meizirkki: /etc/bootmenu.conf gets copied to initfs too so Jan 06 18:48:21 qwerty12, it'll be the first thing anyone sees in Mer :) Jan 06 18:48:26 wicked :D Jan 06 18:48:54 Stskeeps: hmm, i edited it directly, still fails Jan 06 18:49:31 Stskeeps: /mnt/initfs should be read-only? Jan 06 18:49:42 Meizirkki: yeah Jan 06 18:49:55 Meizirkki: grab http://bsd.tspre.org/~stskeeps/bootmenu.conf , put in /etc/bootmenu.conf, refresh_bootmenu.d Jan 06 18:50:18 (on maemo, not in initfs) Jan 06 18:50:21 Stskeeps: that's a clone of mine... Jan 06 18:50:42 mmk Jan 06 18:50:48 then run the "install bootmenu" menu item again Jan 06 18:50:59 what?? Jan 06 18:51:02 okay Jan 06 18:51:13 my bootmenu.conf is not like that Jan 06 18:51:17 and verify that /mnt/initfs/etc/bootmenu.conf is the same as /etc/bootmenu.conf Jan 06 18:51:38 i removed bootmenu installer with --purge and the old file is still there? Jan 06 18:51:52 mm Jan 06 18:51:57 possibly Jan 06 18:52:12 johnx, when I saw what it was being used for, gnomecanvas dependency annoyed me :p. you may have seen the chunk of code i removed in the diff.gz :p Jan 06 18:52:23 Stskeeps: my bad again, thanks for help :P Jan 06 18:54:51 and the first pass at first-boot-wizard works! Jan 06 18:55:13 woo Jan 06 18:55:15 wish zenity had a "multiple text entry" dialog though Jan 06 18:55:19 and it does what? Jan 06 18:55:31 johnx: think you'd have to drag out glade and python for that :P Jan 06 18:55:33 just gets a name and username to be used by adduser Jan 06 18:55:38 *nod* Jan 06 18:56:39 Stskeeps, now that we've seen that mer is flash proof, i demand an jffs2 image is released with each tarball :p Jan 06 18:57:27 hehe Jan 06 18:57:38 its basically same source material Jan 06 18:57:44 i do the tarring up manually :P Jan 06 18:58:04 hehe :P Jan 06 18:59:01 folks, i have some difficulties understanding the external boot thingie. i need some special bootloader in flash which enables me to select ext sd as bootsource right? Jan 06 18:59:10 i'll flash back the mer jffs2 image i made after school, i had to gtfo from my computer and wanted to have a tablet i could use :p Jan 06 18:59:16 hehe Jan 06 18:59:31 furthermore i clone a rootfs on my external card after formatting it appropriatly (with first partition beeing some vfat, then ext2/3) Jan 06 18:59:35 is that it? Jan 06 19:00:04 x29a: basically we have a additional thing in initfs that enables you to start other things than the internal flash Jan 06 19:00:35 ok, that part is working, i can select (like in grub) where i want to boot from Jan 06 19:00:48 yeah :P Jan 06 19:01:14 i did the clonethingie to my external sd, but it cant boot from there (the script where you do the steps from 0 to 5 or so) Jan 06 19:01:44 so it falls back to flash (which is a good thing!!!! phew), there i can see my external card (the vfat partition) but my internal one anymore Jan 06 19:01:47 im on N810, btw Jan 06 19:03:03 mm, there's also stuff like console-tools which can do the stuff for you Jan 06 19:04:44 what else needs to be set on first boot: User's fullname, username and tablet's hostname/bluetooth name. any other ideas? Does anyone feel strongly that location should be set? Jan 06 19:05:06 timezone Jan 06 19:05:37 ok, I can do that in zenity Jan 06 19:07:57 * johnx ganks tzselect in large chunks Jan 06 19:08:20 oh noes! Jan 06 19:09:15 wow...that's some somewhat involved bash code O_o Jan 06 19:09:45 Meiz_n810: success or it broke again? :P Jan 06 19:09:57 success :) Jan 06 19:10:04 good Jan 06 19:11:12 i'm lost with this 5gb/month. Jan 06 19:11:31 hehe Jan 06 19:11:33 poor meiz Jan 06 19:11:33 near 3gb already used Jan 06 19:11:55 i can dl everything at school .P Jan 06 19:11:57 :P Jan 06 19:12:00 yeah :P Jan 06 19:13:36 Stskeeps: i nagged about slow internet before, now i am magging about datalimit... how long it takes before ChanServ kicks me outta here... Jan 06 19:13:45 :) Jan 06 19:13:50 Meiz_n810: no clue :P Jan 06 19:14:07 Meiz_n810: when you have time, test if you can make andrewfblack's Mer Echo theme run in .. Mer Jan 06 19:14:31 tomorrow i think ... Jan 06 19:15:05 it's late and tomorrow i can use schools internet Jan 06 19:15:12 yep Jan 06 19:15:46 Stskeeps btw, did you find out what i screwed in my little theme installer) :P Jan 06 19:15:53 nop Jan 06 19:16:01 didnt use it :P Jan 06 19:16:11 hehe Jan 06 19:16:21 maybe i'll forget about it :P Jan 06 19:16:33 naah :P Jan 06 19:16:37 hmm, don't think I do want to find out... :p Jan 06 19:17:02 qwerty12_N800: installing nokia themes and such into mer, script :P Jan 06 19:17:31 hehe :P Jan 06 19:17:38 (first script i have ever made...) Jan 06 19:18:13 Meiz_n810, have you released it or does only Stskeeps have it? :) Jan 06 19:18:25 hmm.. Jan 06 19:18:43 trac.tspre.org/meiz has it, doesnt it? Jan 06 19:18:44 trac.tspre.org/meiz Jan 06 19:18:50 yep Jan 06 19:20:24 I'll have to see about running a dns server on my computer :>, or if i am lucky, I can forward dns requests over usb to my router :) Jan 06 19:21:08 qwerty12_N800: you have masqurading or? Jan 06 19:21:21 (sp) Jan 06 19:22:28 because you should really just be able to put your usbnet at 2.1, route add default gw 2.1, and etc/resolv.conf to whatever Jan 06 19:22:41 Stskeeps, it should be according to the lines in interfaces... Jan 06 19:22:49 hmm. Jan 06 19:22:57 also mer interfaces? Jan 06 19:23:02 finally a Maemo based distro that covers the Anarctic timezone properly. next step: ensuring we run on hardware that works at -60C Jan 06 19:23:15 heh heh Jan 06 19:23:37 Stskeeps, hmm, not there. i was hoping it was done automatically :p Jan 06 19:24:11 qwerty12_N800: think im just missing tablet-network-setup or something Jan 06 19:24:16 Meiz_n810, boo, zenity! :p Jan 06 19:24:44 ? Jan 06 19:24:54 Stskeeps, w/out at least an usb connection to the internet, I can't do much :/ Jan 06 19:25:06 zenity was conflicting when i made that script.. :P Jan 06 19:25:06 qwerty12_N800: good point Jan 06 19:25:43 Meiz_n810, instead of gxmessage (don't worry, i'm biased after spending 2 hours packaging it :p) Jan 06 19:26:54 yeah, zenity is working great for the timezone picker. probably faster than the fancy-shmancy map based one :) Jan 06 19:28:55 but at least i know why cdbs has the letters bs in it :p Jan 06 19:31:01 lol...no one will be missing a time zone this time Jan 06 19:31:10 close that bug right now :) Jan 06 19:38:10 heh, http://linuxdevices.com/news/NS3781573061.html Jan 06 19:38:43 cause they've only been running debian since ... forever Jan 06 19:38:47 yeah Jan 06 19:40:16 why jaunty?... Jan 06 19:40:17 Am I correct predicting that at least 70% of comments will be along the lines of "Well, choice is good! This is the power of open source!" ? Jan 06 19:40:29 s/jaunty/hasty Jan 06 19:40:35 Meiz_n810: yeah, pondered that one too Jan 06 19:41:18 Stskeeps, they started on hasty from mojo. guess it would be a pain to re-base when jaunty is still missing stuff for armel Jan 06 19:41:46 *nod* Jan 06 19:41:53 powerlaunch near in todo list? Jan 06 19:41:56 RST38h, an appropriate amount of choice is healthy for an appropriately sized community Jan 06 19:42:23 johnx: This has nothing to do with the nature of my prediction ;) Jan 06 19:43:05 RST38h, comments where? if you mean here on #maemo then I'll take that bet... Jan 06 19:43:08 Meiz_n810: i think other people should hack at it.. i don't have sufficient time until end of this month to hack freely :P Jan 06 19:43:47 okay :P Jan 06 19:45:15 must go on ... Jan 06 19:45:18 see you later ... Jan 06 19:45:20 bye Jan 06 19:45:27 bye Jan 06 19:45:31 later Khertan Jan 06 19:45:36 johnx: No, comments to the linuxdevices articles at the same site Jan 06 19:45:47 i hope solca will release first version of NITselector soon :) Jan 06 19:45:56 johnx: I have kinda better opinion about #maemo regulars :) Jan 06 19:46:12 RST38h, it's actually a news site, not a blog. no comments there... Jan 06 19:46:20 no forum? weird Jan 06 19:46:28 Meiz_n810: sadly there's a problem with kexec :( Jan 06 19:46:35 huh, there is a forum Jan 06 19:46:39 Meiz_n810: it only works if r&d serial console is enabled Jan 06 19:46:40 never knew that Jan 06 19:46:53 there has to be a forum :) Jan 06 19:47:30 it's on oesf iirc Jan 06 19:47:44 :( Jan 06 19:48:15 qwerty12_N800: there's actually an ultraboard one P Jan 06 19:48:34 RST38h, actually the linuxdevices forum looks pretty serious. lots of questions about (*drumroll please*) embedded linux Jan 06 19:48:42 umgh Jan 06 19:50:24 * GeneralAntilles is now all provisioned up. Jan 06 19:50:31 time for blogging? :> Jan 06 19:51:21 Stskeeps, maybe. Jan 06 19:51:46 For some reason the break not only drained all of my available freetime, but sapped all of my strength for stuff like that. :P Jan 06 19:52:09 * Stskeeps slides the coffee pot across to GeneralAntilles Jan 06 19:52:21 * GeneralAntilles doesn't do caffeine Jan 06 19:52:28 GeneralAntilles, you should start Jan 06 19:52:43 No, because if I do I'm just going to waste lots of money on it and become dependent. :P Jan 06 19:53:15 only $20-$30/month for me ... caffeine is running the mer project :) Jan 06 19:53:23 sure is Jan 06 19:55:02 Hehe Jan 06 19:56:13 also, they hand out coffee for free in lots of places, especially at jobs Jan 06 19:56:25 yeah, i get 70% of my coffee at work atm too :P Jan 06 19:56:39 is there some sort of mapping software (opensource preferably) that allows offline routing? Jan 06 19:56:49 the routing that i need in my country seems to be pretty much complete Jan 06 19:56:54 (on openstreetmap) Jan 06 19:57:01 * qwerty12_N800 gets his caffeine fix with energy drinks, not a fan of tea or coffee Jan 06 19:57:08 bakarat, I think I mentioned roadmap earlier Jan 06 19:58:08 johnx, ah yes Jan 06 19:58:13 but i could not find exactly what you meant Jan 06 19:58:39 but i think i misunderstood then Jan 06 19:58:41 hehe Jan 06 19:58:49 "omegamoon" is crazy... "NOW KEEP CLICKING THOSE ADS" :P but seriously Google is able to make him pay back everything he have get and even more... Jan 06 19:58:51 * GeneralAntilles going to survive the Zombie Apocalypse to build back his strength. :P Jan 06 20:00:04 Meiz_n810: much of the work i do in mer directly converts to work at my work.. without that i couldn't make a reasonable argument for spending this much time on it :P Jan 06 20:00:24 true :P Jan 06 20:00:30 from an economic point of view Jan 06 20:00:54 bakarat, search on itt for it. there's one other map program I think that uses OSM vector routing too, but I don't remember right now Jan 06 20:01:07 Stskeeps: you shoud get a ad banner somewhere :P Jan 06 20:01:29 heh, nah Jan 06 20:01:44 johnx, installing the roadmap Jan 06 20:01:49 s/shoud get a/should get an/ Jan 06 20:01:50 Meiz_n810 meant: Stskeeps: you should get an ad banner somewhere :P Jan 06 20:01:52 johnx, would you happen to know if it also allows downloading of maps? Jan 06 20:01:53 too much typos Jan 06 20:01:53 * Stskeeps will be perfectly happy to be able to put it on CV and gain contacts, personally :P Jan 06 20:02:02 (in much the same way as mapper i mean) Jan 06 20:02:03 Stskeeps, do a nokia and make an ad displaing applet :p Jan 06 20:02:15 *displaying Jan 06 20:02:22 qwerty12_N800: "you can buy Mer Professional here"? Jan 06 20:02:23 :P Jan 06 20:02:34 (i'm kidding.) Jan 06 20:02:36 o btw, small question, i am using evolution on two pc's (desktop @ home and laptop @ work) Jan 06 20:02:41 i would like to synchronize them and the pda Jan 06 20:02:45 with wireless capability? :p Jan 06 20:02:49 but i found that i can only successfully sync 1 calendar Jan 06 20:02:57 if i try multiple, the pda combines them into one Jan 06 20:03:00 yes, and unlocking usb host mode costs 10$ Jan 06 20:03:02 and sends the combined calendar back to the computers Jan 06 20:03:03 that could be a business model Jan 06 20:03:04 :P Jan 06 20:03:07 Stskeeps: "home-Donate" Jan 06 20:03:11 (using gpe-* software and opensync) Jan 06 20:03:19 :P Jan 06 20:03:22 Stskeeps, new user accounts are $5 right to johnxx's paypal account :) Jan 06 20:03:37 zenity --take-their-money "got your money" Jan 06 20:04:00 heh Jan 06 20:04:08 :) Jan 06 20:05:48 Stskeeps, i'll fix the xchat package when I can fix the sdk to let me actually install the build-depends Jan 06 20:06:12 qwerty12_N800: saw the --fakeroot mesagE? Jan 06 20:06:18 you can see in builder logs what it does, btw Jan 06 20:07:28 or make a qemu-arm-eabi package ;) Jan 06 20:08:02 Stskeeps, yeah, I may take the lazy way out and see where it fucks up each time and keep reuploading :p Jan 06 20:08:08 hehe Jan 06 20:09:24 * RST38h slowly makes his way through new S60 bugs Jan 06 20:10:22 we better get a lot of use out of this timezone picker >_< Jan 06 20:10:23 hah, the devil has possessed my maemo.org profile :p Jan 06 20:11:25 * RST38h kinda knows the name of that devil Jan 06 20:11:38 He is probably asleep now though Jan 06 20:13:38 qwerty12_N800: karma 666? heh Jan 06 20:14:58 Stskeeps, yep :P, as karma is updated as one lump, i'm spooked that it found its way to that number :p Jan 06 20:14:59 static linking vs dynamic: from a coding perspective, is there a noticable difference, or does it just effect how the end user gets it (with simpler less dependencies if static linking is used) ? Jan 06 20:16:08 only the end user is affected Jan 06 20:16:47 there are also a few quirks related to how dynamic linker behaves when it encounters duplicated names in different dependencies, but you probably don't have to worry about it Jan 06 20:17:04 and if another developer wanted to create another app, do they just install the -dev like currently occurs Jan 06 20:17:23 ? Jan 06 20:17:24 lcuk, if you plan for more than one app based on that library to run at the same time, dynamic linking lets both apps use the same copy of the library in memory Jan 06 20:18:18 but thats not entirely a good thing right now, theres a ocuple of statics which im having trouble shifting out of the way Jan 06 20:18:29 globals rather Jan 06 20:18:40 hmm, bit tricky to download first maps on roadmap :| Jan 06 20:18:57 the roadmap map itself is empty, i have no gps fix cause i'm inside trying to download maps :D Jan 06 20:19:06 so i can't tell it to download from the radius of the gps Jan 06 20:19:07 dammit :p Jan 06 20:19:09 or do they get their own instance of memory data and its just code thats shared Jan 06 20:19:25 RoadMap doesn't work very well Jan 06 20:19:37 I still haven't downloaded ANY maps with it =) Jan 06 20:19:52 RST38h, heh :p Jan 06 20:19:55 It says "downloading" and hangs there Jan 06 20:19:58 RST38h, does it work if you do have maps? Jan 06 20:20:01 ic :| Jan 06 20:20:04 No idea Jan 06 20:20:09 I don't have maps Jan 06 20:20:48 wel currently i've put my nokia as close to the window as it goes, hoping to get a gps signal long enough for the damn thing to realize where i am :p Jan 06 20:21:07 a-gprs helps Jan 06 20:21:13 a-gps Jan 06 20:21:31 yes Jan 06 20:22:19 haven't gotten round yet to reflashing, if i don't have to, i won't for the forseeable future Jan 06 20:22:46 (need it too much atm, can't risk running into unforseen problems or having to reinstall all my software or something like that :D) Jan 06 20:32:35 Dr.Dobbs kaput! Jan 06 20:35:11 I really hope archival of websites gets more serious or the early 21st century is going to be a big blank spot in history 100 years from now... Jan 06 20:35:42 i think we would rant to erradicate tubgirl and such from the history books.. :P Jan 06 20:36:01 big flashy colorful spot filled with prozac and penis extension ads Jan 06 20:36:13 No way you eradicate the tubgirl Jan 06 20:36:19 Stskeeps, OTOH, I do want the opportunity to rick-roll someone 100 years from now... Jan 06 20:36:20 She is part of history now! Jan 06 20:37:01 "Erotic rites of XXI century internet users" section Jan 06 20:37:25 "it seems like we've found some sort of important religious document, and I've constructed an emulation environment to run it..." "never gonna give you up never gonna..." Jan 06 20:38:20 Is tubgirl going to be equivalent to the scrolls of Necronomicon? =) Jan 06 20:38:51 goatse ftw Jan 06 20:40:33 yup, damn mapgetter for roadmap does not work :( Jan 06 20:41:53 given the name i guess rdm is a specific protocol? Jan 06 20:41:58 um Jan 06 20:41:58 format Jan 06 20:41:59 * Jan 06 20:42:04 predictions for the year of the first N800 emulator? Jan 06 20:42:13 uses openstreetmap Jan 06 20:42:27 pupnik_, 2008 Jan 06 20:42:31 just screw it, I kept trying and then gave up Jan 06 20:42:37 pupnik_, it's already been done Jan 06 20:42:40 pupnik: already exists Jan 06 20:42:46 oh Jan 06 20:42:59 i am doubtful Jan 06 20:43:12 qemu svn head Jan 06 20:43:27 pupnik_, hrw's been working on one for a while. Jan 06 20:44:23 oh that actually got running Jan 06 20:44:41 maemo-image.qemuflash Jan 06 20:45:24 ah i see qwerty12_N800 was involved Jan 06 20:45:34 pupnik_, no no Jan 06 20:45:47 i've just used it successfully :) Jan 06 20:45:56 RST38h, if it is osm format, is it not possible to download from osm and upload to nokia? Jan 06 20:46:39 bakarat, can't you try running roadmap on a computer and getting the maps from there? Jan 06 20:47:21 bakarat: no idea, why do it? the program obviously does not work Jan 06 20:47:50 qwerty12_N800, not sure if it would make a difference? the nokia has no connectivity problems Jan 06 20:47:57 RST38h, well maybe the program would work with maps? :| Jan 06 20:48:01 and i _need_ offline routing :p Jan 06 20:48:24 bakarat, I'm pretty sure the maemo port is pretty old npw.. Jan 06 20:48:29 The buy a Wayfinder subscription or a dedicated GPS Jan 06 20:48:30 s/npw/now/ Jan 06 20:48:30 qwerty12_N800 meant: bakarat, I'm pretty sure the maemo port is pretty old now.. Jan 06 20:48:34 s/The/Then/ Jan 06 20:48:35 GeneralAntilles meant: Then buy a Wayfinder subscription or a dedicated GPS Jan 06 20:49:57 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3ToYOgP9f9U Jan 06 20:50:50 bakarat: I have really low expectations for Roadmap Jan 06 20:51:05 bakarat: If it can't even download maps, the chances of it working are pretty low Jan 06 20:51:35 Stskeeps: finally getting the files for the mer imager targets and platforms.. Jan 06 20:51:52 r2d2rogers: alright Jan 06 20:52:31 Stskeeps: getting modded xorg.conf and should be good on trac.tspre.org in my home Jan 06 20:54:35 ta - seen it now, will mess more with it later Jan 06 20:56:12 Stskeeps: k may have more there later Jan 06 20:57:06 i hope the nitdroid on 770 kernel work will feed off some to mer-770 too Jan 06 20:58:02 that would be nice Jan 06 20:58:16 I still need to play with the wireless driver patches Jan 06 20:59:15 evening b-man Jan 06 20:59:36 hello, Stskeeps Jan 06 20:59:38 b-man: new v0.5 image at Jan 06 20:59:39 http://stskeeps.subnetmask.net/mer/mer-armel-n8x0-image-v0.5.tar.gz Jan 06 20:59:46 * w00t passes Stskeeps beer Jan 06 20:59:56 w00t: mm. i wouldnt mind getting horridly drunk atm. Jan 06 21:00:02 beer > #maemo. Jan 06 21:00:04 that is all. Jan 06 21:00:24 w00t: people combined those at the summit last year ;) Jan 06 21:00:25 @Stskeeps: lol x10000 Jan 06 21:00:42 :-) Jan 06 21:00:56 b-man: you use the dpkg-deb method to make the installer btw? Jan 06 21:01:12 yes Jan 06 21:01:23 k Jan 06 21:01:45 Hrm, does anyone here have an eeepc? Jan 06 21:02:06 I know its completely offtopic, but I need a replacement for my lappy Jan 06 21:02:09 * b-man sucks at dpkg-buildpackage ;) Jan 06 21:02:23 b-man: it really isnt that bad once you get to know dh_make :P Jan 06 21:03:10 Vulcanis: i have a netbook. it sits around waiting for a girl to use. Jan 06 21:03:14 i've spent hours on some packages that would take minutes for others ;p Jan 06 21:03:35 Pupnik: I'd be switching from a lenovo x60, though Jan 06 21:03:43 * pupnik_ splutters Jan 06 21:03:45 b-man, no one starts off fast. :) Jan 06 21:03:48 so the only downgrade would be the processor, going from a 1.8c2d Jan 06 21:03:55 you want battery life or what Vulcanis Jan 06 21:04:00 and lightness Jan 06 21:04:05 heh :) Jan 06 21:04:05 I'd use it for taking notes and doing school stuff, mostly Jan 06 21:04:12 some movies and music, perhaps. Jan 06 21:04:16 b-man: http://bsd.tspre.org/~stskeeps/mer0.5/ screenshots from earlier btw Jan 06 21:04:51 i'm disappointed with them. not comfy enough to be a notebook, not small enough to be pocketable Jan 06 21:05:00 well Jan 06 21:05:13 and a 9-cell pack adds weight and bulk. 3 cell giving me 1.5 hours use Jan 06 21:05:20 how do you mean not comfy enough? You mean on the lap? Or for typing Jan 06 21:05:23 @Stskeeps; sweet! Jan 06 21:05:33 typing Jan 06 21:05:34 (and these were just apt-get install stuff) Jan 06 21:05:37 roxterm & abiword Jan 06 21:05:49 Ah. Well, I guess I'll have to go to a store and see how it feels, then... Jan 06 21:05:56 hey hows abiword doing Stskeeps Jan 06 21:05:57 Vulcanis, have you tried typing on one yet? you're going from one of the best keyboards to one of the worst Jan 06 21:06:04 Would you know of any other comparable 'netbooks' that have a better keyboard? Jan 06 21:06:17 pupnik_: on mer it was a matter of apt-get install abiword :P Jan 06 21:06:18 Johnx: Yeah, I knew that anything but ibm would be bad, just not entirely sure /how bad/ Jan 06 21:06:24 Vulcanis, HP mini-note 2133/2140 or mini 1000/700 Jan 06 21:06:34 Are those all HP? Jan 06 21:06:40 yeah Jan 06 21:06:46 some just released at CES today :) Jan 06 21:06:54 Thanks, I'll look into it Jan 06 21:07:02 They're more expensive, though. But is the keyboard good? Jan 06 21:07:02 , - this is really how maemo should be - easy to get hildonized apps (user/) and an abundant repository of software that just needs to be hildonized to act well on the tablets Jan 06 21:07:24 Stskeeps: sounds good. Jan 06 21:07:35 Vulcanis: go for one of the BIG netbooks, with 10" screen, eg asus, msi or similar, those have ok keyboards aswell, big enough to use mho Jan 06 21:07:39 but that's what IT has been about since 2005 Jan 06 21:07:39 Vulcanis, yeah, really nice keyboard. they're bigger than other netbooks and so there's enough room for a full sized enter and right shift Jan 06 21:07:42 'just hildonize it' Jan 06 21:07:54 yeah, except life isn't that easy Jan 06 21:08:22 usually hildonizing is 1% of it :P Jan 06 21:08:24 er, what are the asus ones called? Jan 06 21:08:29 I just remember Wind is the MSI one Jan 06 21:08:34 Vulcanis, eeePC Jan 06 21:08:42 Oh, I thought I already said that >.< Jan 06 21:09:06 Damnit, BULLE Jan 06 21:09:10 Anyway, thanks guys Jan 06 21:09:14 also: ibm keyboards > other notebooks > hp mini > other 10" netbooks > smaller netbooks > fujitsu fmv / kojinsha Jan 06 21:09:25 I lurved my x60 Jan 06 21:09:27 but it is dying Jan 06 21:09:44 and I don't really want to go for their new ultraportable Jan 06 21:09:46 reanimate ! Jan 06 21:09:48 I guess I could go for the x61 Jan 06 21:10:05 but thats already really, really old Jan 06 21:10:12 Vulcanis, the x200 looks great to me, but it is a tad expensive if you haven't got spare cash Jan 06 21:10:18 well Jan 06 21:10:20 Vulcanis: so you might get it for a good price Jan 06 21:10:39 it would carry into college, John. So I could probably live two months or so without a laptop Jan 06 21:11:02 and then use money from birthday + anything else + student discount (if lenovo does that type of thing, I know apple does) Jan 06 21:11:48 Vulcanis: or just buy a cheaper laptop, and go out partying like crazy and have a good time Jan 06 21:11:58 except I'm not really into that *sadface* Jan 06 21:12:10 sadly, I'd probably get more entertainment from the laptop Jan 06 21:12:12 Vulcanis: practice make perfect! Jan 06 21:12:30 Not really. I hate most people. Jan 06 21:12:56 thats because you are not drunk enough then Jan 06 21:13:08 I know I'd be happier with an x200 vs any of the netbooks out there Jan 06 21:13:37 the weight difference isn't that much and the x200 is a real"desktop replacement" while netbooks ... aren't Jan 06 21:14:03 well, the thing is, I'd still have a desktop with me Jan 06 21:14:05 so... I dunno Jan 06 21:14:19 but I'll probably just wait the three months Jan 06 21:14:36 hopefully the harddrive and everything else of this one will hold out until then Jan 06 21:14:54 is it physically falling apart or just the HD is dying? Jan 06 21:15:07 * b-man still has'nt given up on the ubuntu/mer keyboard problem... Jan 06 21:15:15 HD is dying, the battery is completely dead, monitor has some brightspots Jan 06 21:15:29 replacing HDD and Battery costs more than a netbook Jan 06 21:15:30 so... Jan 06 21:15:49 Vulcanis: yeah Jan 06 21:16:01 I've been seriously deciding between a used x31/x32 and a netbook actually Jan 06 21:16:22 go get an x60 >.> Jan 06 21:16:34 kind of a price difference :P Jan 06 21:16:36 b-man: could you do me a favour and upload latest installer to that scp thing? Jan 06 21:16:37 johnx: imho, if you can get used to the keyboard size of a netbook, go for it, but do try it out a bit beforehand Jan 06 21:16:56 b-man: so i can point innocent victims to it Jan 06 21:17:03 johnx: i have small hands, so i can hapilly use the keyboard on my eee 1000 att full typing speed Jan 06 21:17:15 BULLE, tried them out plenty. the HP ones are ok. nothing else seemed worth it. Jan 06 21:17:58 and an atom really is slower than an old pentium m Jan 06 21:18:36 johnx: oh, i find both msi wind and eee 1000 keyboards to be just fine for me Jan 06 21:19:06 Stskeeps: if i can :p To tell you the truth, i don't know how to upload it with ssh X( Jan 06 21:19:18 "scp filename username@hostname:~/public_html" Jan 06 21:19:19 :P Jan 06 21:19:20 they're ok...and would be fine occasionally I suppose. Jan 06 21:19:57 johnx: yeah, its nothign you use as your main computer Jan 06 21:20:11 and I'd be intending to use this a lot Jan 06 21:20:51 but a used laptop will come with a HD I can't trust and a dying battery...should really just save for an x200 Jan 06 21:23:02 johnx, are you onj a laptop now or a dying desktop Jan 06 21:23:19 on an old desktop I'd like to repurpose or get rid of Jan 06 21:23:34 grab an eee and carry on as if it were a desktop Jan 06 21:23:39 then use it as a lappy when needbe Jan 06 21:24:06 I kind of need a certain amount of CPU power... Jan 06 21:24:23 put it in performance mode :D Jan 06 21:24:27 imagine something half as fast as that new tablet you just got lcuk Jan 06 21:24:44 i run it at half as fast anyway, its locked to 798mhz Jan 06 21:25:02 and you'd be happy with that as a main machine? Jan 06 21:25:23 not yet im not, its at my side, its a slate Jan 06 21:25:32 its running liqbase 247 Jan 06 21:25:40 nah, I'll just keep hauling my desktop around the world for now Jan 06 21:25:51 yeah Jan 06 21:26:18 for what i use this machine for though, the vga out we see from omap3 will replace need to copy files over the network Jan 06 21:26:42 i hope to god they put the port in Jan 06 21:27:01 lcuk, they can't if they use an unmodified omap Jan 06 21:27:22 if i can get basic monitor and keyboard i will b happy :) really, why not? Jan 06 21:27:42 theres videos on youtube from movial showing all this Jan 06 21:27:46 IIUC, you get one high res output that they hook up to the LCD and one NTSC output to hook up to s-video Jan 06 21:28:31 Well, the second framebuffer is 640x480 Jan 06 21:28:46 ahhh video out != monitor dvi out? Jan 06 21:28:48 So it could certainly drive VGA or composite Jan 06 21:29:07 so if you get a beagle you're in good shape, but if you're counting on VGA out from Nokia you're probably out of luck Jan 06 21:29:26 Yeah, not gonna happen Jan 06 21:29:27 oh noes! Jan 06 21:29:31 Even a proprietary port is gonna be too big. Jan 06 21:29:43 Nokia AV port to the rescue :) Jan 06 21:29:46 That said, VGA over USB is much more feasible with OMAP3 than OMAP2 Jan 06 21:29:50 ahhh well, plan b Jan 06 21:30:03 plan b ?= learn to love ssh Jan 06 21:30:14 gen, tbh it doesnt matter that much, ive got a headless laptop here that im gonna try with Jan 06 21:30:24 plan b ^ Jan 06 21:31:16 bbl anyway Jan 06 21:31:47 hey! Does anyone know how the hildon desktop translates the "Name"-attribute in the *.desktop files in Human readable form? Does it use gettext or somethign else? Jan 06 21:32:06 hey gnuton Jan 06 21:32:42 hey zchydem Jan 06 21:32:54 what's up? Jan 06 21:34:08 zchydem: That's fine.. I'm trying to understand something more about the finnish taxation system.. O_o Jan 06 21:35:38 uh.. The basic guideline is that they will always take more than you want:) I pay apprx. 31% tax from my every salary.. That sucks Jan 06 21:36:35 hello, 31% slave Jan 06 21:36:40 31% only? liberal bastards :P Jan 06 21:36:44 38% + 10% here Jan 06 21:36:56 Stskeeps: where do you live? Jan 06 21:36:58 .dk Jan 06 21:37:39 Now I know to avoid moving there:) Jan 06 21:37:52 well on the other hand we get a lot of free stuff :P Jan 06 21:38:20 Stskeeps, what's the default font for mer btw? Jan 06 21:38:20 you mean like health care etc? Jan 06 21:38:34 13% Jan 06 21:38:45 healthcare, student support (we dont have to have loans like .fi), etc :P Jan 06 21:39:01 zchydem: I paid about 50% in December O_o and I don't understand why... Jan 06 21:39:17 * sp3000 has survived without loan in .fi Jan 06 21:39:58 * johnx thinks the US lack of national healthcare is basically barbaric Jan 06 21:40:05 My tax card in december was fine... Jan 06 21:40:23 johnx: but hey, US has got the greatest military in the world! Jan 06 21:40:23 we get about 500 eur per month post-tax in student support if you live away from parents :P Jan 06 21:40:23 * qwerty12_N800 <3's nhs Jan 06 21:40:23 Stskeeps, "free" :roll: Jan 06 21:40:26 johnx: Ain't you fucking proud? =) Jan 06 21:40:36 GeneralAntilles: hehe Jan 06 21:40:47 johnx, you're insane. Jan 06 21:40:49 GeneralAntilles: there's no free lunch, true, but we get a lot back -for- our taxes :P Jan 06 21:40:56 RST38h: are you happy for that? :P Jan 06 21:41:09 Stskeeps, no you don't, you lose a lot then they give you a little back. Jan 06 21:41:14 gnuton: Can't you see how happy I am? =) Jan 06 21:41:17 Stskeeps: 4 to 5 here fwiw Jan 06 21:41:17 Government is almost always less efficient. Jan 06 21:41:34 GeneralAntilles, I just exercised my access to the national healthcare that I pay into right now. In the US it would have cost 10+ times what it ended up costing here Jan 06 21:41:40 efficient at what goal Jan 06 21:41:57 johnx, health care would cost a lot less if there were no insurance at all. Jan 06 21:42:01 RST38h: :D I can see it! :P Jan 06 21:42:05 that's definitely true GeneralAntilles Jan 06 21:42:06 General: I would prefer it to be less efficient about providing me with medical care than about bombing people I do not know in places I have never been to Jan 06 21:42:18 Nationalizing health care just degrades quality and increases price overall. Jan 06 21:42:34 General: Have you tried? =) Jan 06 21:42:35 GeneralAntilles, every so often you need serious intervention though, not just a band aid and a pat on the head Jan 06 21:42:36 RST38h, this is a discussion about health care, not about military operations in foreign countries. Jan 06 21:42:41 * Stskeeps is perfectly happy with nationalized healthcare Jan 06 21:42:43 I'll accept that business is likely better incentivized for internal efficiency, but that alone means nothing Jan 06 21:42:47 we have private hospitals too though Jan 06 21:42:52 General: This is the discussion about how your tax dollars are spent Jan 06 21:43:03 RST38h, since when? Jan 06 21:43:10 General: Since the beginning I am afraid Jan 06 21:43:13 * GeneralAntilles goes back to shooting zombies. Jan 06 21:43:18 Red Herrings are awesome. Jan 06 21:43:27 general: But anyway, medicare/medicaid level healthcare isn't particularly bad Jan 06 21:43:49 Not stellar of course, but acceptable as a basic level Jan 06 21:44:07 Especially instead of above-mentioned military adventures Jan 06 21:45:02 RST38h, your argument seems to be that because I'm against nationalized healthcare, I'm obviously for military spending. Jan 06 21:45:09 Which is just silly, and doesn't really deserve to be addressed. Jan 06 21:45:17 General: No, it is a bit more subtle than that Jan 06 21:45:30 Sorry you haven't got it, I must have been more clear Jan 06 21:45:56 I think his idea goes like "take military funds and put together a national health care system. no tax increase" Jan 06 21:46:08 General: The argument is that US is wasting huge amount of tax money for military enterprises it does not really benefit from Jan 06 21:46:27 General: So, wasting THAT SAME money on healthcare isn't such a big problem Jan 06 21:46:28 RST38h, my argument is that the government is a giant waste. Jan 06 21:46:31 End of story. Jan 06 21:46:43 It is, but there is waste and then there is waste Jan 06 21:46:55 and mine goes like: not everyone will have $50,000 just sitting around waiting for an emergency, so it's nice to have a healthcare plan to cover you Jan 06 21:47:22 They'll have a lot more when government isn't sucking money out of them like a leech Jan 06 21:47:28 As to your libertarian ideas, just wait until you get a bit older and need to fix your health Jan 06 21:47:45 Or end up without housing. Jan 06 21:47:49 GeneralAntilles, would you really have $50,000 in savings *right now* with lower taxes? Jan 06 21:48:14 johnx, if insurance weren't creating such a huge overhead on the healthcare system, it wouldn't cost $50k Jan 06 21:48:15 RST38h, heh...don't need to get much older. turns out there are fun problems to get when you're young too :) Jan 06 21:48:32 GeneralAntilles, depends on the problem, doesn't it? Jan 06 21:48:51 johnx: Yea, God provides, but Darwin has His own ways to reveal Himself =) Jan 06 21:48:51 Anyway, silly discussion that I'm not going to continue. Jan 06 21:49:15 GeneralAntilles, a couple months ago I would have agreed with you, :) Jan 06 21:49:24 US insurance system is all private, no government there ;) Jan 06 21:49:44 RST38h, and modern medicine is annoying as hell, sometimes uncomfortable, but is really nice to have Jan 06 21:49:58 Putting more government into healthcare will essentially create competition for insurance industry and make it level its costs Jan 06 21:50:56 johnx: Not sure this did not apply to pre-modern medicine :) Jan 06 21:52:06 RST38h, nah, I'm happy to exist in the present and not even 10 years ago :) Jan 06 21:59:35 anyways, giant bash scripts are a pain...time to get some sleep Jan 06 22:03:16 Johnx; agreed. :) Jan 06 22:16:24 Hrm, johnx: Do you think they'll release anything before mayish? Jan 06 22:18:09 re Jan 06 22:26:22 Either I do not understand something or S60e5 has buggy AknSettingsLists Jan 06 22:31:32 Anybody else notice notifications appear in the top left first before moving down in fullscreen? Jan 06 22:34:54 Yup Jan 06 22:35:06 GAN800: sometimes I've seen them stay up in the top /right/ Jan 06 22:35:40 Weird stuff. Obnoxious, too, wuth Jan 06 22:35:53 with the terrible redraw rates. Jan 06 22:36:11 Yep. Jan 06 22:43:21 * Stskeeps tries to drag in some maemo connectivity packages to see how much blows up. Jan 06 22:46:34 * andre___ has wasted way too much time to build fremantle sdk pre alpha on fedora it seems. sigh... Jan 06 22:46:57 mm, it's a bit of a uphill battle on non-debian systems Jan 06 22:47:17 switch to a deb based distro and you'll thank yourself for it wrt to the sdk :p Jan 06 22:49:23 Ubuntu = yay Jan 06 22:50:04 well, i installed now ubuntu and the sdk on another machine and it works Jan 06 22:50:19 but... hmm. i would have loved to avoid this :-P Jan 06 22:55:34 qwerty12_N800: i'm currently installing osso-connectivity-ui-statusbar .. :> Jan 06 22:55:50 (read: i'm going to hell) Jan 06 22:56:33 say hi to Steve Jan 06 22:57:01 Stskeeps, hehe, if it works, i promise to upload an jffs2 image & initfs for mer :p Jan 06 23:01:24 * qwerty12_N800 wonders if "this can be done in a community edition" will become the defacto excuse for nokia not willing to do something... Jan 06 23:02:03 if they are willing to enable it, i'm in Jan 06 23:02:03 :P Jan 06 23:04:18 * b-man starts aimlessly browsing google trying to find a fix for the virtual keyboard in ubuntu :p Jan 06 23:05:03 qwerty12_N800: http://bsd.tspre.org/~stskeeps/mer0.5/Screenshot-4.png Jan 06 23:05:12 still a problem with icd though Jan 06 23:05:32 shitfuck Jan 06 23:05:53 lol Jan 06 23:06:12 i *really* don't want to disable wpa on my router or fuck around with usbnet tbh Jan 06 23:06:29 qwerty12_N800: i don't get what the issue is with usbnet though Jan 06 23:07:38 Stskeeps, i'm lazy and can't be arsed trying to get internet to work & I'm using the rather short usb cable supplied by nokia.. Jan 06 23:07:45 hehe Jan 06 23:07:57 qwerty12_N800: editing /etc/network/interfaces should work fine for WPA. Jan 06 23:08:47 Stskeeps, is wpasupplicant installed by default? Jan 06 23:09:02 yeah, - i think Jan 06 23:09:08 feel free to check Jan 06 23:09:46 will do tomorrow :), expect me to exhaust your builder btw :p Jan 06 23:09:52 hehe Jan 06 23:09:55 fair enouh Jan 06 23:09:56 gh Jan 06 23:13:31 qwerty12_N800: if you get bored, make a transitional package for base64 (depend on coreutils) Jan 06 23:13:40 you'd be amazed how much depends on it.. Jan 06 23:13:48 I'll be installing mer on my sd card anyway, I killed my sd boot by installing devscripts... :p Jan 06 23:13:53 Stskeeps, sure Jan 06 23:14:28 Didn't know coreutils had base64 in it :> Jan 06 23:14:42 i found out when dpkg complained Jan 06 23:14:42 :P Jan 06 23:15:47 hehe Jan 06 23:23:20 cos of pinning "just" adding nokia updates repository isn't bad :P Jan 06 23:25:31 out of question, have you ever thought about applying the tablet identification patch to apt? :p Jan 06 23:25:58 why should i? it runs over http :P Jan 06 23:26:05 and apt supports auth, it seems Jan 06 23:26:34 I know, it just keeps you a little safer wrt to legalities Jan 06 23:26:40 yeah, i know Jan 06 23:26:46 Anyone know how to broadcast DVB-T video to an N810 over wireless? Jan 06 23:26:48 this is my own personal experimentation anyway Jan 06 23:26:55 alterego: VLC? :P Jan 06 23:27:03 Hmmm, Jan 06 23:27:51 alterego, knots can do it Jan 06 23:28:02 or rather, vlc Jan 06 23:28:11 I was thinking that pupnik_ Jan 06 23:28:21 Just wondering how well it'd work. Jan 06 23:28:24 * Jaffa has used a little wrapper and mplayer on the tablet Jan 06 23:28:34 solmumaha knows Jan 06 23:28:43 Will mplayer read from an RTP stream? Jan 06 23:28:44 dunno about channel changing from the tablet Jan 06 23:28:48 * Jaffa hasn't used knots in anger due to packaging issues of the VLC version it required originally Jan 06 23:29:51 alterego: http://www.flegg.org/~andrew/vlcstream.txt Jan 06 23:30:13 Lots of it commented out as originally it did multicast and stuff, which is a little bit like overkill Jan 06 23:30:17 Jaffa, what about now being on intrepid? (well, I assume that you are :)) Jan 06 23:30:49 qwerty12_N800: my always-on home box only *just* got upgraded to gutsy. From dapper. Jan 06 23:31:31 Jaffa: i have not been able to get a food ffmpeg + vlc compiled here yet Jan 06 23:31:36 Jaffa: what would the URL I supply to mplayer be? Jan 06 23:31:38 s/food/good Jan 06 23:31:50 bbl food Jan 06 23:32:04 Jaffa, heh, I see what you mean then with vlc. I had trouble on hardy using newer vlc :/ Jan 06 23:32:16 alterego: mplayer http://192.168.1.5:8191 Jan 06 23:32:27 Cool, just checking ;) Jan 06 23:32:37 Jaffa: thanks, that script looks awesome ;) Jan 06 23:32:38 alterego: you might need to change the last line of the script to change the IP to the IP address of your server/box - and choose a port you like :) Jan 06 23:32:51 Yes, I was going to do that ;) Jan 06 23:33:15 * Jaffa used it to watch BBC One's US election night coverage from bed, since the online streaming version they did was Flash based. Jan 06 23:33:28 Worked very well; it's just a shame David Dimbleby was so boring. Jan 06 23:34:16 Hah, I want to watch serenity and I can't be arsed to sit at my desk ;) Jan 06 23:36:16 * Jaffa should go to bed - early start in the morning. Jan 06 23:36:32 ...and big day (touch wood) Jan 06 23:36:40 Jaffa Jr #2 should be being extracted Jan 06 23:36:58 good luck! Jan 06 23:37:02 ta Jan 06 23:37:16 g'night Jan 06 23:41:05 hm, UIQ filed for bankruptcy Jan 06 23:41:14 Yes, I read that. Jan 06 23:41:17 yay Jan 06 23:41:20 That leaves S60 :/ Jan 06 23:42:52 uiq was losing badly when you compared it next to s60 (albeit nokia producing more s60 phones than se/motorola producing uiq phones probably helped...) Jan 06 23:43:54 Yes, Nokia devoted themselves to S60, where as SE really seemed to just stick it in random models. Jan 06 23:44:23 If they'd backed it more it would have been more successful. The PXXX series were pretty damn neat. Jan 06 23:45:28 I was looking at phones today in Best Buy. They've moved on from just plain printed screens to holographic screens that give you a different screenshot when you twist and turn it. :roll: Jan 06 23:47:15 alterego, they were nothing special when compared to nokia's range of phones. my p1 wouldn't even connect to my router with wpa on but the n80 managed fine Jan 06 23:47:38 When the P800 came out it was a damn sight nicer than the 7650 .. Jan 06 23:49:08 Nice, I've got it streaming to my tablet! :D Jan 06 23:49:28 Is it stuttery as shit? :) Jan 06 23:49:28 Screwed up the aspect ratio though. Jan 06 23:49:49 No, it's working pretty well. Jan 06 23:49:54 It's been scaled. Jan 06 23:50:18 Maybe it's just the N810's screen, I can deal with it though. Jan 06 23:50:20 g'night folks Jan 06 23:50:21 Wicked, now if only my computer stayed on longer... Jan 06 23:50:35 :) Jan 06 23:50:47 I'm going to try and get this working on the embedded PC104 board I have. Jan 06 23:51:02 That'd be neat. A dedicated DVB->Network server. Jan 06 23:51:13 indeed :) Jan 06 23:52:05 Anyhow, I'm gonna go to bed and watch this :) Jan 06 23:52:08 g'night. Jan 07 00:36:51 Quim keeps talking about the Community Edition as the way forward, but I wonder when we'll actually see support from Nokia. :\ Jan 07 01:26:00 does anyone know how to fix 'make: *** /lib/modules/2.6.18-6-686/build: no such file or directory. Stop.' ? Jan 07 01:36:14 ? **** ENDING LOGGING AT Wed Jan 07 02:59:57 2009