**** BEGIN LOGGING AT Sun Mar 29 02:59:57 2009
Mar 29 03:13:36 <z4chh> props to whoever wrote this http://repository.maemo.org/stable/diablo/INSTALL.txt  ...installing maemo sdk was mad easy
Mar 29 03:13:43 <z4chh> and those scripts..
Mar 29 04:35:19 <jaem> hey folks
Mar 29 06:58:46 <Stskeeps> morning
Mar 29 07:00:05 <GAN800> Stupid desktop wont boot . . . fun
Mar 29 07:00:32 <Stskeeps> after the power cut?
Mar 29 07:00:45 <GAN800> After I turned it off
Mar 29 07:03:04 <Stskeeps> ah
Mar 29 07:04:25 * GAN800 sighs
Mar 29 07:09:08 <GAN800> Oh yeah, that's definitely a leak.
Mar 29 07:09:56 <Stskeeps> speaking about your desktop still or the magical RX-51? :P
Mar 29 07:10:10 <GAN800> Desktop. It's got drips. . . .
Mar 29 07:10:15 <Stskeeps> ah
Mar 29 07:10:32 <GAN800> Exactly what I need.
Mar 29 07:15:51 <qwerty12> Always a nice feeling: just realising that the clocks went forward >.<
Mar 29 07:17:22 <Stskeeps> yeah
Mar 29 07:42:48 * Stskeeps is trying desperately to make a hildon desktop plugin toggle the menu on h-d.
Mar 29 07:46:30 <Meizirkki> Stskeeps, the menu that should open instead of "all"?
Mar 29 07:46:55 <Stskeeps> yeah
Mar 29 07:47:00 <Stskeeps> i have it working with "F4" now
Mar 29 07:47:43 <Meizirkki> ok
Mar 29 07:51:45 <Meizirkki> How about using wmctrl for fullscreening in Mer? That way even unhildonized would fullscreen? :)
Mar 29 07:52:22 <Stskeeps> maybe, but you have to consider the events go to the window i think
Mar 29 07:52:24 <qwerty12> powerlaunch can already do that, just go to its calendar interface and press the fullscreen key
Mar 29 07:57:45 <GeneralAntilles>                                                                                     Well, we'll see what Apple has to say in the morning. . . .
Mar 29 08:00:35 <wazd> hey everbody
Mar 29 08:00:57 <Stskeeps> morning wazd
Mar 29 08:07:53 <aksl> hi
Mar 29 08:08:37 <qwerty12> X-Fade, if you happen to be around on a sunday, ping...
Mar 29 08:10:40 <GeneralAntilles> Does somebody want to go explain why maemo.org/Maemo is an important distinction? I don't think the point will be well received coming from me, and I'm not in a great mood at the moment. ;)
Mar 29 08:10:56 <timeless_mbp_> i'm not sure i want to explain it
Mar 29 08:11:44 <timeless_mbp> wait, explain it to some random end person who's being troublesome? count me OUT
Mar 29 08:12:40 <GeneralAntilles> timeless_mbp, it's the "why didn't you vote" thread on itT
Mar 29 08:12:55 <GeneralAntilles> Your opinion wont be well received there either. ;)
Mar 29 08:13:01 <timeless_mbp> itT? i don't go there
Mar 29 08:13:04 <timeless_mbp> i'm not that stupid
Mar 29 08:13:32 <GeneralAntilles> Not stupid in that way, anyway. :P
Mar 29 08:13:39 * timeless_mbp chuckles
Mar 29 08:13:47 <timeless_mbp> The preflight script for MacFuse Core contains lines such as
Mar 29 08:13:47 <timeless_mbp>  /bin/rm -rf $INSTALL_VOLUME/Library/Extensions/fusefs.kext
Mar 29 08:13:47 <timeless_mbp> If INSTALL_VOLUME contains spaces (e.g., "/Volumes/MyDisk 2"), the
Mar 29 08:13:47 <timeless_mbp> script will execute
Mar 29 08:13:48 <timeless_mbp>   /bin/rm -rf "/Volumes/MyDisk" "2/Library/Extensions/fusefs.kext"
Mar 29 08:13:58 <timeless_mbp> yay scripts
Mar 29 08:14:19 <timeless_mbp> (fwiw, it was fixed the same day it was reported)
Mar 29 08:15:30 <Stskeeps> hehe
Mar 29 08:17:33 * timeless_mbp considers issuing zfs snapshot -r
Mar 29 08:18:41 <timeless_mbp> timeless-mbp:Mobile Applications timeless$ zfs snapshot -r rpool@20090329
Mar 29 08:18:42 <timeless_mbp> :)
Mar 29 08:18:56 <Stskeeps> i guess insanity has finally kicked in. i am occasionally thinking to myself "my, wouldn't it be great to just recode hildon-desktop to make it sane"
Mar 29 08:19:04 <timeless_mbp> now i can wreck most of my system safely :)
Mar 29 08:19:14 <timeless_mbp> Stskeeps: awesome
Mar 29 08:19:26 <timeless_mbp> GeneralAntilles: btw, do you use MSOffice.mac?
Mar 29 08:21:19 <GeneralAntilles> No
Mar 29 08:22:28 <GeneralAntilles> Hum, I'm too stupid to figure out how to make this netbook use an external display
Mar 29 08:22:35 <timeless_mbp> heh
Mar 29 08:22:46 <GeneralAntilles> The Display control panel is worse than XP's
Mar 29 08:23:01 <timeless_mbp> windows' display panel really isn't that bad...
Mar 29 08:23:19 <GeneralAntilles> It confuses me way more than Apple's does
Mar 29 08:23:32 <timeless_mbp> apple's annoys me
Mar 29 08:24:07 <GeneralAntilles> Apple's has always logically done whatever I've asked it to do, which isn't something I can say for anything Microsoft has churned out.
Mar 29 08:24:40 <ds3> 9
Mar 29 08:24:45 <timeless_mbp> can you get osx to do per display color profiles?
Mar 29 08:25:00 <timeless_mbp> i seem to recall not being able to get that to work
Mar 29 08:25:07 <GeneralAntilles> timeless_mbp, yes.
Mar 29 08:25:16 <GeneralAntilles> All of my displays are calibrated.
Mar 29 08:32:06 <timeless_mbp> So basically your kid is like a programming language with poor looping support - http://news.slashdot.org/comments.pl?sid=1179419&no_d2=1&cid=27377255
Mar 29 08:35:59 <Stskeeps> heh
Mar 29 08:38:17 <GeneralAntilles> If I get a new Mac Pro out of this thing it'll make my year
Mar 29 08:40:12 <timeless_mbp> personally i think it's more like a REPL w/o looping support beyond your ability to yell another order :)
Mar 29 08:40:38 <timeless_mbp> since a programming language generally implies some degree of persistence (subroutines)
Mar 29 08:44:07 <qwerty12> No, please. Don't throw a SIGSEGV, I can handle the pain. I won't go insane, I promise.
Mar 29 08:48:11 <vasily_pupkin> Hi. anybody play recent wesnoth on nxx0?
Mar 29 09:10:25 * lcuk has lost an hour, anyone know where it is
Mar 29 09:10:51 <mavhc> it's in october
Mar 29 09:11:22 <qwerty12> lcuk, yeah, check Reykjavik ;)
Mar 29 09:14:26 <lcuk> mavhc, yeah but that doesnt help today
Mar 29 09:18:47 <Stskeeps> wazd: prod
Mar 29 09:19:23 <lcuk> mornin Stskeeps \o
Mar 29 09:19:28 <Stskeeps> morning lcuk
Mar 29 09:22:53 <lcuk> oops i just nearly broke my 810
Mar 29 09:23:45 <Stskeeps> eek
Mar 29 09:25:18 <mavhc> how?
Mar 29 09:25:40 <RST38h> back
Mar 29 09:26:14 <wazd> RST38h: moo!
Mar 29 09:26:25 <RST38h> mooya!
Mar 29 09:26:47 <wazd> RST38h: http://s49.radikal.ru/i123/0903/85/cb21ac18fe9e.png
Mar 29 09:27:01 <wazd> RST38h: and I'm finishing Ti 82 faceplate right now
Mar 29 09:27:04 <Stskeeps> RST38h: good flight?
Mar 29 09:27:21 <Stskeeps> .. if you didn't just go to airport for picking up someone ::P
Mar 29 09:28:04 <GeneralAntilles> Hum, Synergy sends keyboard events, but not mouse. . . .
Mar 29 09:29:47 <RST38h> wazdá: !!! Let me unpack the laptop =)
Mar 29 09:30:05 <wazd> RST38h: have you left Moscow at last?)
Mar 29 09:30:25 <RST38h> stsá: an ok flight, just 9:10, non stop
Mar 29 09:31:08 <RST38h> wazd: came back already, we went to us for two weeks to visit parents and do some paperwork
Mar 29 09:31:49 <RST38h> sts: surprisingly short lines in iad - either they fixed something or people stopped flying
Mar 29 09:32:02 <t_s_o> latter
Mar 29 09:34:49 <RST38h> wazd: the device selector thing looks nice, although I would go for more bright, prime colors, and the button arrangement is a bit different =)
Mar 29 09:42:17 <Jaffa> Morning, all
Mar 29 09:42:38 <wazd> RST38h: ok, will do
Mar 29 09:42:51 <Stskeeps> morning Jaffa
Mar 29 09:43:00 <wazd> morning jaffa
Mar 29 09:43:03 <wazd> :)
Mar 29 09:43:19 <Stskeeps> anyone know any magic way from a panel plugin in hildon-desktop to activate the menu of hildon-desktop itself? :P
Mar 29 09:58:09 <RST38h> wazd: Also, are you absolutely sure this vertical effect at the left and right borders looks exactly like you want it to look? =)
Mar 29 10:00:07 <RST38h> wazd: (current button layout left to right: ti85,ti86,ti82,ti83,ti83+,ti83+se,ti84+,ti84+se, and in the bottom row there is reset at the left and quit at the right)
Mar 29 10:34:38 * konttori_ is installing canola to check it out.
Mar 29 10:39:18 <mavhc> I like canola for podcasts, but it takes up too much ram, and there's a bug involving returning to a recording, and from then on whenever you unpause it skips back to the returning point
Mar 29 10:39:37 <mavhc> also needs more kb control for skip forward/back 5/30 seconds
Mar 29 10:40:12 <mavhc> fails to dl some audio podcasts that videocenter works with also
Mar 29 10:57:36 <sisto> have you guys seen this? http://wiki.maemo.org/GSoC_2009/Project_ideas
Mar 29 10:58:17 <Stskeeps> .. long ago?
Mar 29 10:58:24 <sisto> some pretty neat projects
Mar 29 10:58:33 <sisto> Stskeeps: good for you
Mar 29 10:59:06 <qwerty12> Considering that the GSOC link is in the topic...
Mar 29 10:59:32 <sisto> I never read topics
Mar 29 10:59:40 <qwerty12> *shrug*
Mar 29 10:59:42 <sisto> sorry
Mar 29 10:59:53 <sisto> I'll try to remember though
Mar 29 11:00:20 <sisto> sorry I guess it's a bad subject to talk about
Mar 29 11:00:33 <sisto> for some reason
Mar 29 11:00:46 <sisto> :(
Mar 29 11:02:20 <sisto> or some people like to be assholes
Mar 29 11:02:57 <GeneralAntilles> sisto, chill out, there's no need to get defensive.
Mar 29 11:03:30 <konttori_> mavhc: well, with the new open source version of canola, it's easy to fix those issues
Mar 29 11:03:32 <GeneralAntilles> Old news is just that, you can't blame people for being apathetic to things they've know about for a long time.
Mar 29 11:03:40 <konttori_> except the ram consumption of course.
Mar 29 11:04:53 <GeneralAntilles> konttori_, which should be less relevant with the 256MB in the next tablets, right? ;)
Mar 29 11:05:16 <mavhc> does more ram use a lot more power?
Mar 29 11:05:27 <konttori_> GeneralAntilles: ;)
Mar 29 11:06:03 <GeneralAntilles> Either there's going to be a product announcement or I'm going to get a Nokian tarred and feathered. :D
Mar 29 11:06:26 <konttori_> product announcement where?
Mar 29 11:06:51 * Jaffa imagines there'll be a product announcement at *some* point...
Mar 29 11:07:09 <Stskeeps> yeah, a lot of wasted sw work otherwise :P
Mar 29 11:07:16 <lcuk> there will be a product announcement announcement first!
Mar 29 11:07:24 <GeneralAntilles> I hope the product announcement comes first, as I'd hate to see the fine, open source loving Nokians in this channel replaced by more S60 types. ;)
Mar 29 11:07:47 <Jaffa> Stskeeps: BTW, 0.11 going to include the new UI - with finished(ish) theme?
Mar 29 11:07:56 <Stskeeps> Jaffa: finished(ish) aye
Mar 29 11:09:00 * konttori_ also hopes an announcement would come soon, but has no idea when that would happen. Did we have some estimation of that?
Mar 29 11:09:04 <Stskeeps> quirks atm: menu button in h-d doesn't work in h-d itself, but hw key does, zenvoid is working on the backgrounds of the buttons when selected
Mar 29 11:09:24 <GeneralAntilles> konttori_, we're in the dark
Mar 29 11:09:46 <GeneralAntilles> I guess we can only hope it'll come sometime around the beta release
Mar 29 11:10:11 <GeneralAntilles> Haven't even gotten any spyshots. :(
Mar 29 11:10:31 <sisto> if not we can put maemo on the openpandora
Mar 29 11:10:34 * Jaffa could imagine it being wanted to announce product and "and you can start developing for this device *now* by going to maemo.nokia.com and downloading the beta SDK, including this final UI"
Mar 29 11:11:14 <GeneralAntilles> Lacking an announcement the community is starting to go a bit stir crazy
Mar 29 11:11:23 <Stskeeps> a bit?
Mar 29 11:11:24 <Stskeeps> :P
Mar 29 11:11:39 <Jaffa> And the community was pretty crazy to start with
Mar 29 11:12:26 <Stskeeps> Jaffa: testing images of 0.11 coming out tomorrow
Mar 29 11:16:49 <b0unc3> good morning
Mar 29 11:17:19 <konttori_> Jaffa: it would be great if beta had all the final stuff
Mar 29 11:17:33 <konttori_> (or close to final )
Mar 29 11:17:34 <Jaffa> konttori_: that sounds like it's followed by a "but"
Mar 29 11:17:46 <konttori_> but, I really don't know whether it will.
Mar 29 11:17:59 <konttori_> it comes pretty soon, right?
Mar 29 11:18:51 <Stskeeps> april-may i think beta
Mar 29 11:19:17 <Stskeeps> ah, march-may
Mar 29 11:19:23 <timelE61i> gan: we're actually doing that internally
Mar 29 11:19:37 <timelE61i> They keep adding s60 process lovers
Mar 29 11:20:36 <timelE61i> btw, if i get my mac stuck
Mar 29 11:20:46 <timelE61i> What's the equiv of ctrl-alt-del?
Mar 29 11:21:39 * timelE61i breaks computer
Mar 29 11:22:18 <konttori_> eh, must be april-may then, right? Not much happening this month anymore, right?
Mar 29 11:22:22 * timelE61i hopes the mac port of zfs isn't horribly broken
Mar 29 11:22:43 <timelE61i> aww, it could be Jun/Jul ;)
Mar 29 11:22:58 <timelE61i> Plenty of months left in the year
Mar 29 11:23:29 <timelE61i> Oops
Mar 29 11:23:30 <timelE61i> Um
Mar 29 11:23:38 <Stskeeps> did your MBP die?
Mar 29 11:23:38 <Stskeeps> :P
Mar 29 11:23:51 <timelE61i> Can someone suggest a way to download Terminal.app'
Mar 29 11:24:26 <timelE61i>  /applications and /users/timeless didn't mount :)
Mar 29 11:24:26 <GeneralAntilles> timelE61i, cmd-opt-esc
Mar 29 11:24:36 <GeneralAntilles> How long have you been using Macs?
Mar 29 11:24:57 <timelE61i> More than half my life on and off
Mar 29 11:25:07 <timelE61i> But i don't break the kernel that often
Mar 29 11:25:20 <timelE61i> Ok... So...
Mar 29 11:25:23 <GeneralAntilles> cmd-opt-esc is mostly for killing stuck apps, anyway
Mar 29 11:25:37 <GeneralAntilles> The powerbutton is to be used in the even of a kernel panic. ;)
Mar 29 11:25:38 <timelE61i> yeah, i doubt it'd have helped
Mar 29 11:25:41 <mavhc> cmd-opt-google
Mar 29 11:26:03 <VDVsx> morning,all
Mar 29 11:26:20 <GeneralAntilles> timelE61i, ssh?
Mar 29 11:26:25 <timelE61i> 1. Find mac ip
Mar 29 11:26:29 <timelE61i> 2. Ssh
Mar 29 11:26:42 <GeneralAntilles> Bonjour?
Mar 29 11:27:36 <timelE61i> from wXP or 10.3.9 ? :)
Mar 29 11:27:36 * Stskeeps ponders idly about hildon-desktop 2.2
Mar 29 11:27:57 <Stskeeps> let's see if this one is more sane than the one we tinker with..
Mar 29 11:28:01 <GeneralAntilles> timelE61i, should work from XP with Bonjour installed.
Mar 29 11:28:14 <GeneralAntilles> Or Linux with Avahi
Mar 29 11:30:51 <timelE61i> ok .2 is ppc, .7 is x86
Mar 29 11:31:12 <timelE61i> Awesome
Mar 29 11:31:20 <timelE61i> Zpool status: no pools available
Mar 29 11:31:39 <Stskeeps> zpool import?
Mar 29 11:32:17 <timelE61i> none avail
Mar 29 11:32:27 <timelE61i> And osx claims my pool volume is fat
Mar 29 11:32:38 <timelE61i> Which means i lost a week's work
Mar 29 11:34:11 <Stskeeps> interesting, hildon-home doesn't seem to require clutter
Mar 29 11:34:30 <Stskeeps> might there be some sanity.. hm
Mar 29 11:34:44 <lcuk> no Stskeeps clutter is used as a compositor
Mar 29 11:34:57 <GeneralAntilles> Home applets don't require Clutter, they _are_ clutter. :P
Mar 29 11:35:35 <timelE61i> Sts: i believe home applets are now hosted by a dedicated process
Mar 29 11:35:43 <timelE61i> So they only kill eachother
Mar 29 11:35:44 <Stskeeps> timelE61i: yes, and thank god for that
Mar 29 11:35:44 <qwerty12_N800> if $user = Stskeeps; then "clutter not needed" #just to keep him happy
Mar 29 11:35:53 <lcuk> lol
Mar 29 11:37:16 <Stskeeps> i'd much prefer to get API compatible with fremantle than spend another hour in hildon-desktop. :P
Mar 29 12:02:21 <gnuton> Hi
Mar 29 12:07:16 <GeneralAntilles> Hey, gnuton.
Mar 29 12:07:32 <gnuton> hello GeneralAntilles:D
Mar 29 12:28:37 <lopz> hi
Mar 29 12:39:59 <yerga> please nokia, the rx-51 must be a phone
Mar 29 12:40:20 <yerga> i lost my n95 yesterday and need a new one
Mar 29 12:40:25 <yerga> :)
Mar 29 12:45:25 <GeneralAntilles> Ew
Mar 29 12:47:47 <mavhc> open source phone? won't the carriers complain that it'll distrupt their networks?
Mar 29 12:49:56 <keesj> with the current traffic options offered they must care less
Mar 29 12:50:30 <keesj> the bug problem if it's a phone is that is will be less accesible/usable to students
Mar 29 12:56:30 <GeneralAntilles> I don't think we can have it be a phone without a huge negative impact to Maemo.
Mar 29 12:57:04 <GeneralAntilles> It moves from being a generic Linux OS (with embedded undertones) to a real phone OS. Which is a Bad Thing in my opinion.
Mar 29 13:03:14 * Jaffa wonders if the stuff Ari was "theoretically" discussing at the dinner at OSiM might explain RX-51/71 *and* the phone-y stuff in the s/w stack
Mar 29 13:15:34 <GeneralAntilles> Apple phone support was no help.
Mar 29 13:16:52 <GeneralAntilles> Hehe, Twitter for Canola.
Mar 29 13:16:54 <GeneralAntilles> Canola OS
Mar 29 13:18:08 <ShadowJK> I'd love it if the next tablet has HSDPA
Mar 29 13:18:21 <ShadowJK> Then I'd just use transfer my current cellphone number to VoIP and use that
Mar 29 13:18:41 <Jaffa> ShadowJK: The next tablet has HSPA
Mar 29 13:18:43 <ShadowJK> or get a new one if they wont allow me to transfer
Mar 29 13:38:41 <lfelipe> GeneralAntilles: not until emacs, not until emacs :P
Mar 29 13:43:16 * ShadowJK is hoping for 512megs
Mar 29 13:43:43 <ShadowJK> Oh, anyone noticed Nokia is selling a 16gigabyte /micro/sdhc now?
Mar 29 13:44:00 <GeneralAntilles> and?
Mar 29 13:44:13 <GeneralAntilles> Who buys flash media from OEMs?
Mar 29 13:45:36 <ShadowJK> GeneralAntilles, well I just found it strange to not find 16gig microsdhc from the regular places, but that nokia sells them, and nokia seems to be a bit "lazy" with their own store as to not piss off resellers too much
Mar 29 13:45:57 <GeneralAntilles> Oh? Amazon doesn't have 16GB?
Mar 29 13:45:58 <ShadowJK> just odd to find something as new and big there
Mar 29 13:46:10 <ShadowJK> Amazon doesn't ship to finland :)
Mar 29 13:46:13 <ShadowJK> atleast not !books
Mar 29 13:47:19 <GeneralAntilles> Finland doesn't count
Mar 29 13:49:27 <qwerty12_N800> Florida V Finland
Mar 29 13:54:45 <GeneralAntilles> qwerty12_N800, :P
Mar 29 13:55:24 <GeneralAntilles> Florida & Finland vs qwerty12's stupid face.
Mar 29 13:56:03 <qwerty12_N800> Aww, gee, thanks
Mar 29 14:13:52 <wazd> I'm back
Mar 29 14:13:59 * GeneralAntilles hides
Mar 29 14:14:06 <wazd> behold!11
Mar 29 14:14:08 <wazd> xD
Mar 29 14:15:59 <zlirp> Hey all.  Can anyone help me get my N810 doing GPS with any degree of speed & accuracy?
Mar 29 14:16:38 <zlirp> I just flashed with RX-44_DIABLO_5.2008.43-7_PR_COMBINED_MR0_ARM.bin, and when I try to install A-GPS, it sits there saying "Downloading 190KB"
Mar 29 14:16:45 <zlirp> Then eventually fails.
Mar 29 14:18:14 <RST38h> heya wazd
Mar 29 14:24:23 <getxsick> hi
Mar 29 14:24:27 <zlirp> hi
Mar 29 14:25:02 <GeneralAntilles> zlirp, something wrong with your internet connection?
Mar 29 14:25:08 <zlirp> no
Mar 29 14:25:27 <getxsick> i have 2 questions related to gsoc
Mar 29 14:25:42 <zlirp> GeneralAntilles: I am using the same connection to chat here :)
Mar 29 14:25:58 <RST38h> Beep! Another "tablet sucks" thread on itt!
Mar 29 14:25:58 <zlirp> The IT can access the internet through the web browser.  Albeit slowly.
Mar 29 14:26:40 <GeneralAntilles> zlirp, have you tried apt-get install a-gps?
Mar 29 14:26:42 * timeless grumbles
Mar 29 14:26:50 <zlirp> Do I need root privs for that?
Mar 29 14:26:58 <timeless> how hard is it to spell a cipher suite's name correctly when referencing it?
Mar 29 14:27:03 <getxsick> firstly, tests on maemo platform are necessary?
Mar 29 14:27:38 <wazd> RST38h: http://s43.radikal.ru/i100/0903/b8/67c06310c4c5.png
Mar 29 14:27:39 <zlirp> GeneralAntilles: I get "permission denied", likely because I'm not root
Mar 29 14:27:43 <GeneralAntilles> zlirp, yes, try installing rootsh from application manager
Mar 29 14:27:55 <timeless> getxsick: this channel doesn't really seem to answer such questions
Mar 29 14:27:56 <zlirp> k, one mo
Mar 29 14:28:16 <lcuk> getxsick, a project for the maemo platform should be usable on the maemo platofrm, no point in creating a masterpiece if its not optimal for the device
Mar 29 14:28:16 <timeless> personally, i'd hope applicants for GSoC could figure out the answer for themselves
Mar 29 14:28:19 <RST38h> wazd: Looks stunningly perfect =)
Mar 29 14:28:44 <RST38h> wazd: Saving, will reboot to Linux and try it as soon as the ftp transfer is finished =)
Mar 29 14:28:45 <getxsick> lcuk: what with student doesn't have hardware with maemo device?
Mar 29 14:29:10 <getxsick> timeless: personnaly, open moko year ago gave their devices for free for the students
Mar 29 14:29:25 <timeless> cool
Mar 29 14:29:32 <timeless> how's your open moko device doing?
Mar 29 14:29:51 <wazd> I forgot 1 detail
Mar 29 14:29:59 <zlirp> GeneralAntilles: "couldn't find package a-gps"
Mar 29 14:30:08 <RST38h> wazd: ?
Mar 29 14:30:09 <zlirp> GeneralAntilles: Odd because it does show up in the application manager?
Mar 29 14:30:35 <GeneralAntilles> zlirp, I got the package name wrong
Mar 29 14:30:36 <ShadowJK> zlirp, agps-ui
Mar 29 14:30:38 <GeneralAntilles> ^
Mar 29 14:30:40 <GeneralAntilles> Right, that.
Mar 29 14:30:48 <getxsick> mine? i wasn't work on this project, different one. but my flatmate did, he got freerunner
Mar 29 14:31:03 <zlirp> k sec :)
Mar 29 14:31:22 <timeless> does he still use it?
Mar 29 14:31:43 <getxsick> don't think so, at least i only saw it on his desk
Mar 29 14:31:44 <zlirp> GeneralAntilles: It sits at 0% [waiting for headers]
Mar 29 14:31:54 <timeless> right... sounds like a wonderful project
Mar 29 14:32:13 <timeless> i'll be sure to recommend we waste however much money on a similar project the next time i speak w/ someone about this
Mar 29 14:32:26 <getxsick> you mean about whole openmoko idea? :)
Mar 29 14:32:43 <GeneralAntilles> zlirp, maybe an issue with your local Akamai mirror.
Mar 29 14:33:00 <GeneralAntilles> zlirp, have you had issues with the repositories in the past?
Mar 29 14:33:10 <zlirp> possibly?
Mar 29 14:33:14 <zlirp> hard to say
Mar 29 14:33:28 <timeless> there's a requirement somewhere about being enthusiastic
Mar 29 14:33:42 <timeless> if the result is giving away hardware to people who don't use it less than a year later
Mar 29 14:33:46 <timeless> i'd say that something failed
Mar 29 14:33:54 <GeneralAntilles> zlirp, well, you can try waiting a day to see if it improves, or maybe grabbing the debs directly will work.
Mar 29 14:34:01 <timeless> i'd much rather give away hardware to people who have proven they will remain involved
Mar 29 14:34:09 <timeless> fwiw, i've given away a number of nokia tablets
Mar 29 14:34:14 <RST38h> wazd: btw, ti83+ is here: http://www.worsleyschool.net/science/files/usinga/mainpic01.jpg (and both ti83+ and ti83+se have blue APPS button instead of MATRIX)
Mar 29 14:34:23 <timeless> (at least 3, a 770, an n800 and an n810)
Mar 29 14:34:23 <zlirp> GeneralAntilles: Somehow I just don't think this package is in high enough demand for a day to solve the problem :(
Mar 29 14:34:25 <getxsick> timeless: maybe other do, not he. at least there were a lot of bad words about his mentor made by Leslie. whatever
Mar 29 14:34:26 <GeneralAntilles> http://repository.maemo.org/catalogue/certified/pool/diablo/user/a/agps-ui/
Mar 29 14:34:39 <GeneralAntilles> zlirp, it's not the package
Mar 29 14:34:48 <GeneralAntilles> It could be local connectivity issues
Mar 29 14:34:53 <timeless> yeah... wonderful
Mar 29 14:34:57 <zlirp> Yeah, it's the cache.
Mar 29 14:35:04 <wazd> RST38h: http://s58.radikal.ru/i161/0903/b3/4a64fd0a6a2d.png
Mar 29 14:35:13 <zlirp> But will this mean that all my other updates will have to be done manually?
Mar 29 14:35:16 <getxsick> timeless: so, should i have own maemo platform?
Mar 29 14:35:24 <RST38h> wazd: what changed? =)
Mar 29 14:35:38 <GeneralAntilles> zlirp, no, it'll go back to normal whenever the repo figures itself out.
Mar 29 14:35:39 <wazd> RST38h: shadow on the screen bevel
Mar 29 14:35:55 <timeless> personally, if i were organizing it (and i'm not)
Mar 29 14:36:00 <RST38h> oh
Mar 29 14:36:05 <timeless> ....
Mar 29 14:36:05 <wazd> RST38h: screen is a bit deeper than the case
Mar 29 14:36:22 <GeneralAntilles> zlirp, if you're feeling adventurous, you can try changing the sources entry for the certified repo to stage.maemo.org instead of repository.maemo.org
Mar 29 14:36:31 <GeneralAntilles> Which'll bypass the misbehaving cache
Mar 29 14:36:52 <zlirp> GeneralAntilles: I definitely am.  There's so much I want this tablet to be able to do, but it just seems incapable of the most basic of things.
Mar 29 14:36:56 <zlirp> I'll try that right away.
Mar 29 14:37:02 * RST38h is itching to release this version
Mar 29 14:37:20 <GeneralAntilles> zlirp, well, repository connectivity issues are a good way to hamstring yourself starting off.
Mar 29 14:37:25 <zlirp> hahah
Mar 29 14:37:27 <zlirp> Yeah :)
Mar 29 14:37:44 <zlirp> I hope that future OSses *not* produced by Nokia don't tank as badly as Maemo has.
Mar 29 14:37:54 <GeneralAntilles> Maemo really works pretty well
Mar 29 14:38:01 <zlirp> It's slow.
Mar 29 14:38:07 <GeneralAntilles> Better than most of the competitors out there.
Mar 29 14:38:17 <RST38h> Did maemo tank?
Mar 29 14:38:19 <GeneralAntilles> Eh, you're asking a lot of a relatively small CPU.
Mar 29 14:38:32 <zlirp> I've been *sold* a lot of a relatively small CPU.
Mar 29 14:38:44 <zlirp> Fit for purpose comes to mind.  I'm just trying to get somewhere with what I'm left with.
Mar 29 14:38:49 <GeneralAntilles> As long as you stick to light multitasking and are realistic in your expectations it works just fine.
Mar 29 14:39:06 <GeneralAntilles> It's my primary mobile device and laptop replacement.
Mar 29 14:39:11 <timeless> gan: but i want the world in my pocket and three full sized ponies
Mar 29 14:39:19 <zlirp> I think you misunderstand.
Mar 29 14:39:22 <timeless> none of these mini ponies
Mar 29 14:39:24 <zlirp> I'm not asking it to be a supercomputer.
Mar 29 14:39:40 <GeneralAntilles> timeless, I'm hoping to get at least some of the world with OMAP3. ;)
Mar 29 14:40:02 <timeless> i've seen the world, and i still want three full sized ponies
Mar 29 14:40:02 <zlirp> It's not unreasonable however to anticipate that the device will be able to fulfil everything written on the box with some degree of speed and responsiveness.
Mar 29 14:40:24 <timeless> zlirp: um, what does it say on the box?
Mar 29 14:40:30 <GeneralAntilles> zlirp, I've found that it does that and more.
Mar 29 14:40:35 <zlirp> How?
Mar 29 14:40:56 <zlirp> I just can't use this thing with any degree of satisfaction.  It's slow and unresponsive.
Mar 29 14:41:02 <zlirp> Have you been able to use the GPS effectively?
Mar 29 14:41:05 <zlirp> As in --- moving around.
Mar 29 14:41:12 * RST38h has been
Mar 29 14:41:25 <RST38h> is there a problem with using gps?
Mar 29 14:41:50 <RST38h> there was problem with gps locking on a position but that has been mostly solved with agps
Mar 29 14:42:11 <zlirp> See, and I've had AGPS going on prior flashes of the device (this is just my quarterly kick at the can to get this thing working)
Mar 29 14:42:24 * timeless grumbles
Mar 29 14:42:25 <timeless> http://media.arstechnica.com/journals/linux.media/n810_box_closed.jpg
Mar 29 14:42:28 <timeless> is too hard to read
Mar 29 14:42:38 <timeless> how does anyone expect to read the box that way?
Mar 29 14:42:45 <zlirp> It helps with getting the local sats going for sure.  But holding the lock and the actual data returned is still pretty shoddy.
Mar 29 14:43:04 <RST38h> works for me
Mar 29 14:43:06 <GeneralAntilles> timeless, what, have they gotten rid of all the N810 boxes there in favor of the new hotness already? :P
Mar 29 14:43:22 <timeless> gan: my box is 7' behind me
Mar 29 14:43:30 <timeless> i don't want to reach for it
Mar 29 14:43:34 <GeneralAntilles> Haha
Mar 29 14:43:37 <GeneralAntilles> Lazy SOB
Mar 29 14:43:58 <timeless> ok, i will hereby recite the box
Mar 29 14:44:06 <timeless> NOKIA Nseries
Mar 29 14:44:08 <zlirp> GeneralAntilles: Which catalogue should I update?
Mar 29 14:44:11 <timeless> Nokia N810 Internet Tablet
Mar 29 14:44:16 <timeless> <rotate box>
Mar 29 14:44:28 <timeless> NOKIA Nseries
Mar 29 14:44:31 <timeless> <rotate box>
Mar 29 14:44:45 <timeless> Nokia N810 Internet Tablet
Mar 29 14:44:49 <GeneralAntilles> zlirp, the one that has certified in the URL
Mar 29 14:44:50 <timeless> nseries.com/n810
Mar 29 14:44:59 <timeless> <rotate box>
Mar 29 14:45:14 <timeless> Nokia N810 Internet Tablet
Mar 29 14:45:16 <zlirp> GeneralAntilles: So from catalogue.tableteer.nokia.com to stage.maemo.org ?
Mar 29 14:45:27 <timeless> <rotate box>
Mar 29 14:45:30 <GeneralAntilles> Hum
Mar 29 14:45:36 <GeneralAntilles> I though AGPS was on maemo.org
Mar 29 14:45:47 <zlirp> I have 4 repos (I enabled extras)
Mar 29 14:45:52 <timeless> Keep in touch.
Mar 29 14:46:06 <zlirp> Nokia catalogue, Nokia catalogue (3rd party software), nokia system software updates, maemo Extras
Mar 29 14:46:31 <GeneralAntilles> zlirp, sort of hamstrung myself over here, my main desktop just died.
Mar 29 14:46:32 <GeneralAntilles> One sec
Mar 29 14:46:32 <timeless> Entertain. Acess your social sites, update blogs
Mar 29 14:46:36 <zlirp> NP
Mar 29 14:46:47 <timeless> and enjoy the best of the web. With the Nokia N810 Internet
Mar 29 14:46:56 <timeless> Tablet you are free to go and discover what's new -- it's the
Mar 29 14:47:01 <timeless> entire internet in your pocket.
Mar 29 14:47:13 <timeless> Easy internet connection over Wi-Fi or compatible
Mar 29 14:47:14 <VDVsx> getxsick, your friend work in which project for OpenMoko ?
Mar 29 14:47:15 <timeless> mobile phone
Mar 29 14:47:22 <timeless> Experience Web 2.0 with a browser based
Mar 29 14:47:31 <timeless> on Adobe(r) Flash(r) 9 plug-in
Mar 29 14:47:37 <getxsick> VDVsx: sms middleware
Mar 29 14:47:40 <timeless> Internet calling with built-in web camera
Mar 29 14:47:40 <getxsick> afair
Mar 29 14:47:47 <timeless> Instant messaging and email with
Mar 29 14:47:51 <GeneralAntilles> zlirp, you'll have to edit the sources list directlyh
Mar 29 14:47:51 <timeless> a QWERTY keyboard
Mar 29 14:47:52 <ShadowJK> I haven't really experienced any of the GPS problems other people seem to have.. I am constantly running out of RAM badly though. I wonder if there's anyone that makes DRAM in miniSD formfactor ;-)
Mar 29 14:48:02 <timeless> BE entertained with music and videos
Mar 29 14:48:06 <timeless> Helps you find your way
Mar 29 14:48:09 <GeneralAntilles> Since the Application Manager wont let you mess with the bundled official repos
Mar 29 14:48:10 <timeless> with built-in GPS
Mar 29 14:48:23 <timeless> Be closer with your Nokia N810 Internet Tablet
Mar 29 14:48:28 <timeless> Model Number: N810
Mar 29 14:48:49 <timeless> {translated into a number of languages, i'm relatively confident the translations do not promise more than the English}
Mar 29 14:49:00 <ShadowJK> Actually, I have a complaint about the box. It says Nokia N-Series but the Nseries website tells me to get a Nseries device ;) </joke>
Mar 29 14:49:13 <zlirp> Alright, so just nano /etc/apt...sources whatever?
Mar 29 14:49:34 <timeless> GoogleTalk (logo) penguin (logo) skype (logo) Bluetooth (logo) wayfinder (logo) flash (logo)
Mar 29 14:49:41 <timeless> Warning: Emergency calls are not supported.
Mar 29 14:49:59 <GeneralAntilles> zlirp, hum, looks like it's on tableteer
Mar 29 14:50:06 <timeless> (c) 2007 Nokia. All rights reserved. Nokia, Nokia Connecting People, Nseries, and N810 are trademarks or registered trademarks of
Mar 29 14:50:07 <GeneralAntilles> which there's no non-Akamai mirror for.
Mar 29 14:50:22 <GeneralAntilles> zlirp, just download the .deb directly
Mar 29 14:50:28 <timeless> Nokia Corporation. Other product and company names mentioned herein may be trademarks or trade names of their respective owners.
Mar 29 14:50:32 <GeneralAntilles> You'll need to grab the suplicant daemon, too.
Mar 29 14:50:33 <zlirp> hm
Mar 29 14:50:37 <zlirp> web browser crashed
Mar 29 14:50:42 <timeless> NOKIA Connecting People
Mar 29 14:50:46 <zlirp> God this thing is such a lemon.
Mar 29 14:50:47 <timeless> <end of box>
Mar 29 14:50:51 <GeneralAntilles> http://repository.maemo.org/catalogue/certified/pool/diablo/user/a/agps-ui/
Mar 29 14:50:57 <timeless> I don't see any promises about time to lock
Mar 29 14:51:00 <zlirp> K, I'll grab 'em both...
Mar 29 14:51:14 <GeneralAntilles> zlirp, what were you doing when it crashed?
Mar 29 14:51:16 <Stskeeps> http://internettablettalk.com/forums/showpost.php?p=275487&postcount=4 <- wow :P
Mar 29 14:51:19 <zlirp> typing in THAT URL
Mar 29 14:51:36 <GeneralAntilles> zlirp, not loading a page?
Mar 29 14:51:53 <zlirp> Well, typing it in and hitting enter, so yeah...upon attempting to load it.
Mar 29 14:51:58 <zlirp> Gonna try again though, to be fair.
Mar 29 14:52:10 <GeneralAntilles> Weird
Mar 29 14:52:29 <GeneralAntilles> I wonder, have you ever reformatted the internal 2GB?
Mar 29 14:52:37 <zlirp> multiple times
Mar 29 14:52:38 <GeneralAntilles> repartitioned, I should say.
Mar 29 14:52:51 <zlirp> In the past, I've followed lots of instructions.
Mar 29 14:53:03 * ShadowJK still has the broken partition table
Mar 29 14:53:22 <GeneralAntilles> Well, a corrupt filesystem on the internal 2GB can lead to lots of slowdowns and instability
Mar 29 14:53:24 <timeless> shadowjkl: i think i might have finally fixed mine
Mar 29 14:53:27 <timeless> or not, i can't remember
Mar 29 14:53:32 <timeless> :)
Mar 29 14:53:32 <GeneralAntilles> Many of those bugs have been fixed, but not all of them.
Mar 29 14:53:56 <timeless> anyway, having read the box, i can vouch for the box not having promised a time-to-fix
Mar 29 14:54:02 <zlirp> Yeah, and I'm sure I've followed instructions to redo a bad partition table.  Something to do with size, right?
Mar 29 14:54:18 <GeneralAntilles> zlirp, I'm assuming you've been through something like http://www.internettablettalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=18043 ?
Mar 29 14:54:23 <timeless> and in fact, very few boxes are stupid enough to actually promise time-to-fix
Mar 29 14:54:34 <zlirp> Like I said, about every 3 or 4 months, I dust this lemon off and try to get some degree of functionality out of it.  But it's slow and unresponsive even running ONE app.
Mar 29 14:54:46 <timeless> people who make boxes are in the business of selling products, not accepting returns for failing to do what they promise on their boxes :)
Mar 29 14:54:51 <zlirp> I'm not too sure I can adjust my expectations any lower - nor do I think I should be expected to.
Mar 29 14:54:55 <ShadowJK> Mine seems to get a fix in the time it takes me to walk out the house, get into the car, take tablet and phone out of pocket, put them in their places and attach charger to atleast one of them
Mar 29 14:55:00 <mavhc> I never managed to get anything to fix a corrupted mmc1 vfat partition
Mar 29 14:55:02 <Stskeeps> zlirp: you can always hack the OS though. 80% open source
Mar 29 14:55:03 <zlirp> My old Palm performed better than this.
Mar 29 14:55:06 <GeneralAntilles> zlirp, there is always the chance that you do, infact, have a lemon.
Mar 29 14:55:16 <Stskeeps> true
Mar 29 14:55:17 <zlirp> Well, how do I warranty it?
Mar 29 14:55:19 <Stskeeps> i have seen a dead internal SD
Mar 29 14:55:29 <timeless> zlirp: call nokia care?
Mar 29 14:55:35 <timeless> it's document in the manual
Mar 29 14:55:36 <zlirp> Can I contact Nokia and do some kinda setup?
Mar 29 14:55:39 <timeless> both printed and electronic
Mar 29 14:55:41 <GeneralAntilles> zlirp, not being able to interact with your particular tablet, I can't say whether it doesn't fit the norm or whether your expectations are skewed.
Mar 29 14:55:46 <zlirp> (like I do with most every other electronic device that breaks on me)
Mar 29 14:55:57 <zlirp> My expectations I think are reasonable.
Mar 29 14:56:02 * timeless isn't sure
Mar 29 14:56:15 <zlirp> I've been using lots of devices and the best I can say is that it's very slow to respond to most forms of input.
Mar 29 14:56:31 <ShadowJK> I wonder what kind of sensitivity threshold the nokia care people have for the touchscreen, like, am I supposed to be able to use it with finger without the LCD going funnycolors? :-)
Mar 29 14:56:36 <zlirp> We could split hairs on that all day long, but the fact is that smaller more powerful devices are produced that have better usability than this.
Mar 29 14:56:53 <zlirp> I can conclusively say after trying to do a few runs at geocaching that it's nowhere near accurate or usable though....
Mar 29 14:57:01 <Stskeeps> oh, the GPS we can all agree on is miserable :P
Mar 29 14:57:07 <zlirp> I'll have a Garmin Etrex vista in one hand, and my N810, and my N810 is kilos off.
Mar 29 14:57:08 <GeneralAntilles> zlirp, well, considering that the basic platform is from January 2007, yes, I'd say so.
Mar 29 14:57:14 <mavhc> the gps seems about 1 second behind reality when I'm in a car
Mar 29 14:57:30 <zlirp> My GPS is barely in the same area of the city.
Mar 29 14:57:32 <zlirp> lol
Mar 29 14:57:42 <mavhc> it's broken/corrupted then
Mar 29 14:58:08 <timeless> zlirp: the nokia n810 is not sold as a gps device w/ accuracy of 1 inch
Mar 29 14:58:11 <zlirp> GeneralAntilles: I have followed those instructions in the past.
Mar 29 14:58:16 <zlirp> To no improvement.
Mar 29 14:58:23 <timeless> again, having read the box, just now for everyone else's benefit, it just doesn't say that
Mar 29 14:58:48 <timeless> if you want the best gps signal detection, you probably will find that the latest and greatest dedicated gps will be much better
Mar 29 14:58:50 <zlirp> I'm beyond forgiving of this, I try to do everything possible to get the N810 working nicely because I WANT it to work - rather badly.
Mar 29 14:59:01 <zlirp> If my N810 exploded today, I'd probably wait for another linux-based device.
Mar 29 14:59:25 <ShadowJK> I have a sirf III gps dongle.. the N810 GPS doesn't get first-fix as fast, and needs stronger signal to get fix, but it stays locked on in weaker signal than the dongle.. accuracy seems similar
Mar 29 14:59:35 <zlirp> I wish someone at Nokia would offer me a good-will trade up price or something.  I'll mail the N810 and pay a kind difference.
Mar 29 14:59:48 <GeneralAntilles> Trade up to what?
Mar 29 14:59:55 <zlirp> Whatever is out next whenever it's out next.
Mar 29 15:00:01 <zlirp> I've waited almost a year already, I can wait longer.
Mar 29 15:00:02 <zlirp> lol
Mar 29 15:00:10 <zlirp> That's what I mean.  My expectations are not unreasonable thus far.
Mar 29 15:00:25 <zlirp> I've really let it all slide.
Mar 29 15:00:26 <mavhc> don't wait longer than the warrenty, whic is what?
Mar 29 15:00:34 <ShadowJK> 2 years in europe I believe
Mar 29 15:00:46 <zlirp> at least a year I hope.  Otherwise I'll know this device was a red herring :(
Mar 29 15:01:37 <mavhc> format the internal card, reinstall the OS, does it make a difference?
Mar 29 15:01:42 <zlirp> No.
Mar 29 15:01:47 <RST38h> zlirp: My universal advice is to get an iPhone.
Mar 29 15:01:50 <zlirp> I've done that multiple times (even tried Mer, but it's pretty beta)
Mar 29 15:01:55 <zlirp> I don't want an apple product.
Mar 29 15:02:04 <RST38h> Ok, buy an HTC.
Mar 29 15:02:05 <mavhc> so in the non gps department, what's wrong?
Mar 29 15:02:05 <zlirp> Why are you telling me what to do outside of the scope of the N810?
Mar 29 15:02:09 <zlirp> I don't want windows mobile.
Mar 29 15:02:23 <RST38h> zlirp: Because it is clear to me that you are not satisfied with n810
Mar 29 15:02:24 <mavhc> does it take 3 mins to load the browser?
Mar 29 15:02:29 <ShadowJK> Once when I rebooted, a kernel process was using 99% CPU. It made it pretty unusable
Mar 29 15:02:34 <Stskeeps> zlirp: tried the webkit engine?
Mar 29 15:02:41 <zlirp> RST38h: Okay, well respect the fact that I'm talking about the N810 and not your preference then.
Mar 29 15:03:06 <zlirp> GeneralAntilles: Should I install the supl-daemon from web or repos?
Mar 29 15:03:24 <GeneralAntilles> zlirp, whichever you can make work.
Mar 29 15:03:34 <zlirp> K, sec.
Mar 29 15:04:45 <zlirp> GeneralAntilles: "Unable to install supl-daemon.  Incompatible application package."
Mar 29 15:04:53 <Stskeeps> is it diablo?
Mar 29 15:04:55 <GeneralAntilles> zlirp, dpkg -i
Mar 29 15:04:55 <qwerty12> dpkg -i it
Mar 29 15:05:11 <GeneralAntilles> zlirp, it's not a user-facing package, so Application Manager wont install it.
Mar 29 15:05:39 <zlirp> kk
Mar 29 15:06:24 <zlirp> Where is the "documents" folder on the actual filesystem itself?
Mar 29 15:06:37 <GeneralAntilles> /home/user/MyDocs/.documents
Mar 29 15:06:45 <zlirp> k
Mar 29 15:07:56 <zlirp> Man, if I could even just geocache with this thing, I'd be so happy!
Mar 29 15:07:56 <zlirp> lol
Mar 29 15:08:01 <RST38h> zlirp: I am simply making a practical suggestion
Mar 29 15:08:23 <GeneralAntilles> zlirp, well, a Bluetooth GPS is an option
Mar 29 15:08:34 <GeneralAntilles> That'll get more accurate fixes faster than your Garmin.
Mar 29 15:08:38 <zlirp> RST38h: Okay, well your practical suggestion has a familiar aire of "haha, I just told you to go away" to it.  I have an N810, it's staying with me, and I'm TRYING to make it work.  Maybe you could give me some credit?
Mar 29 15:09:02 <zlirp> Alright.  We got A-GPS installed.
Mar 29 15:09:06 <zlirp> Should I fire it up off the menu first?
Mar 29 15:09:11 <zlirp> Select my general location?
Mar 29 15:09:16 <zlirp> Oh, it pops up for me :D
Mar 29 15:09:17 <GeneralAntilles> Yup
Mar 29 15:09:27 <mavhc> the problem is you come in saying it sucks, thus everyone hates you, go out, come in again and say you can't get it to work
Mar 29 15:09:54 <zlirp> mavhc: I'm not exactly in an unfounded minority.  Maybe a vocal minority ;)
Mar 29 15:10:07 <GeneralAntilles> Generally with open source, it helps to stroke peoples egos rather than tearing them down before you ask for help. :D
Mar 29 15:10:14 <Stskeeps> heh.. the times i have moaned about maemo when i was doing deblet
Mar 29 15:10:15 <zlirp> mavhc: There are more than enough accounts of the N810's performance from multiple sources.  At least I'm still trying because I know at least one application could be useful and still fit.
Mar 29 15:10:25 <Stskeeps> until i realized there's good things and good reasons for things being as they are
Mar 29 15:10:50 <zlirp> I look forward to other projects taking the N810 on as a platform.  I realize performance will never exceed expectations.  But maybe one day something will take root.
Mar 29 15:10:56 <zlirp> Mer looks great TBH.
Mar 29 15:11:02 <timeless> trying to annoy people isn't a good starting position
Mar 29 15:11:06 <timeless> you're asking for help.
Mar 29 15:11:24 <timeless> these people for the most part are just people like you who happen to be slightly happier than you are
Mar 29 15:11:29 <zlirp> Given time, it could have potential.  Especially if some focus is done on just some simple (and boring, yes) UI usability an responsiveness efforts.
Mar 29 15:11:30 <timeless> none of them are paid to support you
Mar 29 15:11:35 <zlirp> Anyway, that's not here right now.
Mar 29 15:12:09 <zlirp> GeneralAntilles: Should I allow packet data?
Mar 29 15:12:21 * GeneralAntilles doesn't have an N810
Mar 29 15:12:47 <zlirp> Just wondering if it's a setting I want to enable for A-GPS...
Mar 29 15:12:56 <Stskeeps> zlirp: trust me.. some of the other open source frameworks are miserable in comparison :) (usability/responsiveness)
Mar 29 15:13:12 <GeneralAntilles> zlirp, I can't answer usefully. I think it only applies to if you're tethering, but I'm not sure.
Mar 29 15:13:14 <mavhc> do you have a mobile phone connected to the n810 for internet?
Mar 29 15:13:46 <zlirp> No.
Mar 29 15:13:51 <mavhc> then no
Mar 29 15:13:59 <zlirp> kk, thanks
Mar 29 15:14:04 <zlirp> moving forward :D
Mar 29 15:15:12 <zlirp> I fire up maemo mapper.  It's stuck in the English channel right now and establishing GPS fix.
Mar 29 15:16:14 <GeneralAntilles> zlirp, note, you're unlikely to have much luck getting a fix indoors
Mar 29 15:16:24 <GeneralAntilles> Take it to a southern facing window if possible.
Mar 29 15:17:32 <timeless> aww, what if he travels to .au? :)
Mar 29 15:17:36 <zlirp> Alright.
Mar 29 15:18:04 <GeneralAntilles> timeless, who would want to go there?
Mar 29 15:18:35 * timelE61i !
Mar 29 15:18:49 <timelE61i> they speak English or so i've heard
Mar 29 15:18:58 <zlirp> So, now...Should it be able to hold a lock once I get it and walk around?  My house is a bungalow, if that helps at all ;)
Mar 29 15:19:02 <mavhc> come for the snakes, stay for the coffins
Mar 29 15:19:16 <qwerty12> To the land where the government are anal about games & the internet. No thanks.
Mar 29 15:19:22 <qwerty12> *?
Mar 29 15:19:32 <GeneralAntilles> It apparently hold locks well once it gets them.
Mar 29 15:19:41 <mavhc> if you're not outside I'd say leave it on a south facing windowsill until it locks, however long that takes
Mar 29 15:19:48 <mavhc> then experiment
Mar 29 15:20:07 <GeneralAntilles> s/hold/holds/
Mar 29 15:20:07 <infobot> GeneralAntilles meant: It apparently holds locks well once it gets them.
Mar 29 15:26:55 <zlirp> Ok!  I have a lock.
Mar 29 15:27:04 <zlirp> That was reasonably fast I'd say.
Mar 29 15:27:11 <zlirp> Would it need the internet on always to get that kind of precision and speed?
Mar 29 15:27:26 <GeneralAntilles> Only if you move more than 300 miles.
Mar 29 15:27:35 <zlirp> That's unlikely ;)  LOL
Mar 29 15:27:53 <timelE61i> some people do
Mar 29 15:28:12 <zlirp> Oh, I do lots of driving.  I just don't have much of a reson to take this with me.
Mar 29 15:28:17 <zlirp> Maybe that will change.
Mar 29 15:28:52 <mavhc> move 300 miles without turning the gps on that is
Mar 29 15:29:16 <zlirp> Yeah, if you keep it on, I guess it can track the changes?
Mar 29 15:29:55 <ShadowJK> I think it needs internet in the last half hour or hour before you try start and get a lock with the gps
Mar 29 15:30:10 <zlirp> Is there any way to tell maemo-mapper to pre-cache an entire region?
Mar 29 15:30:12 <ShadowJK> otherwise it's a bit slower
Mar 29 15:30:23 <zlirp> So that I can go offline with this?
Mar 29 15:30:23 <Stskeeps> zlirp: yeah, you can ask it to download i think
Mar 29 15:30:28 * Stskeeps does that occasionally
Mar 29 15:30:36 <GeneralAntilles> zlirp, yes, there's an option in the menu
Mar 29 15:30:43 <GeneralAntilles> It's covered in detail in the help
Mar 29 15:30:57 <timelE61i> if you're bored, you can do it by hand from the ui
Mar 29 15:30:59 <zlirp> k
Mar 29 15:31:09 <timelE61i> Not a bad way to pass time at an airport...
Mar 29 15:31:40 <timelE61i> (LHR, works best if a carrier is offering tetherable phones for net access)
Mar 29 15:32:36 <mavhc> do you not have the wayfinder map software?
Mar 29 15:32:45 <zlirp> I think I'll use the google sat maps.
Mar 29 15:32:49 <zlirp> That's a lot of data to cache though.
Mar 29 15:33:00 <timelE61i> it's not bad
Mar 29 15:33:18 <zlirp> Ah.  It just lost my GPS fix.
Mar 29 15:33:28 <timelE61i> I used a 1g card to cache data for both sat and st for the globe at a bunch of res's
Mar 29 15:33:40 <zlirp> It's kind of jumping around, is there anything I can do to get better stationary precision?
Mar 29 15:33:45 <Stskeeps> not be indoors? :P
Mar 29 15:34:03 <timelE61i> Move in a straight line in a car :)
Mar 29 15:34:04 <zlirp> In the past, I've left this "tracing a route" an left it sitting still, and I get a 10KM square scribble for a route.  LOL
Mar 29 15:35:13 <timelE61i> i think my bouncing has generally been closer to 100m
Mar 29 15:35:31 <ShadowJK> about 50-100m for me
Mar 29 15:35:36 <ShadowJK> (indoors in a window)
Mar 29 15:35:39 <suihkulokki> could be a hw error. gps antenna not connected properly or something.
Mar 29 15:35:39 <timelE61i> Otoh, having used google maps on a phone recently, it was off by an entire cell
Mar 29 15:35:55 <zlirp> tower GPS or phone GPS?
Mar 29 15:36:15 <timelE61i> Phone doesn't have gps
Mar 29 15:36:25 <zlirp> Yeah, tower GPS is a joke.  LOL
Mar 29 15:36:27 <timelE61i> So whether it was triangulating or trusting...
Mar 29 15:36:38 <zlirp> It does it based off of the current tower it's communicating with.
Mar 29 15:37:10 <zlirp> I've been driving on the road and my blackberry thinks I'm 30KM "back that way".
Mar 29 15:37:38 <ShadowJK> It would be awesome if you could get the full list of towers in range and the timing advance, for added precision, but I think you can only get the ID of the current cell the phone is communicating with :/
Mar 29 15:37:51 <mavhc> there's various kinds of agps, the cell phone tower stuff is about 3 of them
Mar 29 15:38:12 <timelE61i> historically phones new of a couple of towers
Mar 29 15:38:27 <ShadowJK> yeah but there's no sane API to get the phone to tell you?
Mar 29 15:38:31 <timelE61i> s/new/knews/
Mar 29 15:38:31 <infobot> timelE61i meant: historically phones knews of a couple of towers
Mar 29 15:38:38 <zlirp> JavaScript in an opera browser :D
Mar 29 15:38:44 <timelE61i> Whether they expose that to apps is a different story
Mar 29 15:38:51 <timelE61i> Zlirp: eh?
Mar 29 15:39:14 <zlirp> timelE61i:  I'm not 100% sure as I haven't tried it myself, but opera I think can pull GPS data when running on a phone.
Mar 29 15:39:19 <zlirp> I think it's an option on my BB.
Mar 29 15:39:21 <ShadowJK> The triangulation business requires network/operator support though :(
Mar 29 15:39:35 <zlirp> So if that were the case, they might abstract it a little.
Mar 29 15:39:37 <mavhc> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/AGPS
Mar 29 15:39:57 <timelE61i> oh, fennec can get gps from supported models too
Mar 29 15:40:07 <timelE61i> So what?
Mar 29 15:40:26 <mavhc> that lists 6 or 7 things agps can do
Mar 29 15:40:46 <ShadowJK> mavhc, you know, timeless was talking about google maps on phone without (a)gps
Mar 29 15:41:08 <mavhc> that's number 1 on the list
Mar 29 15:41:11 <timelE61i> Heck, fennec on your n810 can support gps too
Mar 29 15:43:57 <ShadowJK> in the google maps case, when you use google maps with a GPS unit, google maps is recording the cell ID and the GPS position and sending that to google. When you don't have a GPS, google just looks up the cellID in their database and draws a circle around previous GPS-enabled observations of that cell, or something similar :D
Mar 29 15:46:37 <mavhc> I'm wondering if they scan for wifi networks and gps locate them whilst they're doing streetview
Mar 29 15:50:12 <mavhc> what's minigpsd about?
Mar 29 15:50:18 <qwerty12> Oh, nice. osso_display_blanking_pause() actually worked for me.
Mar 29 15:51:31 <timelE61i> Heh
Mar 29 15:51:43 <timelE61i> Working apis?
Mar 29 15:52:29 <Stskeeps> umpossible
Mar 29 15:53:01 <qwerty12> Lol, yeah. If they weren't working though, I'd blame the person in front of my monitor :)
Mar 29 15:54:41 <timelE61i> Hrm, you've been conditioned- you may pass
Mar 29 15:54:45 <qwerty12> Ah, cute, the autobuilder/scratchbox chokes when building Bundyo's libwebkit for x86 :)
Mar 29 15:55:20 <qwerty12> I was hoping I could avoid setting arch: armel as opposed to arch: any but I guess I'll have to.
Mar 29 15:58:18 <Meizirkki> Why is marquee-background disabled atm?
Mar 29 16:04:21 <Stskeeps> Meizirkki: it fails to work properly
Mar 29 16:04:31 <Stskeeps> we suspect it's because the background is -actually- black :P
Mar 29 16:07:20 <Stskeeps> ok, this is possibly violating a bunch of encapsulation principles..
Mar 29 16:07:28 <Stskeeps> but it makes menu button work in H-D
Mar 29 16:07:43 <Stskeeps> http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~carsten-munk/m-r/hildon-desktop-um-patches/revision/1165
Mar 29 16:08:35 <zeptar> good afternoon
Mar 29 16:08:41 <Stskeeps> afternoon
Mar 29 16:08:59 <zeptar> does anyone have an alternate download link for MediaConverter for OSX Intel?
Mar 29 16:09:07 <zeptar> the link i have doesn't work anymore
Mar 29 16:09:19 <zeptar> http://www.helsinki.fi/~konttori/MediaConverter/Media_Converter_osx_intel.zip
Mar 29 16:09:23 <zeptar> is a dead link
Mar 29 16:09:38 <GeneralAntilles> zeptar, try mediautils?
Mar 29 16:09:39 <zeptar> and the new 'beta' one doesn't work well for me
Mar 29 16:10:52 <zeptar> where would that be GeneralAntilles ?
Mar 29 16:11:20 <GeneralAntilles> http://mediautils.garage.maemo.org
Mar 29 16:12:13 <zeptar> thanks! i'll give it a shot!
Mar 29 16:12:19 <zeptar> :D
Mar 29 16:12:39 <zeptar> do you know what happened to konttori's ?
Mar 29 16:13:17 <qwerty12> Why not ask him yourself? He's currently on the channel, just dunno if he is around.
Mar 29 16:13:28 <zeptar> i emailed him earlier today
Mar 29 16:13:54 <zeptar> konttori_: i was wondering where i can download your mediaconverter for mac osx intel
Mar 29 16:14:06 <zeptar> konttori_: the link on your site doesn't work
Mar 29 16:15:38 <zeptar> the link for PPC works, but converts to slow under rosetta
Mar 29 16:17:11 <Stskeeps> qwerty12: i has clickable h-d menu, and through it, drag lock :>
Mar 29 16:17:24 <Stskeeps> seems to be trivial to add state with gconf
Mar 29 16:17:29 <qwerty12> Stskeeps, ooh, sexy
Mar 29 16:17:44 <qwerty12> Cool, I was thinking about trying to do the same sometime
Mar 29 16:18:02 <lbt> gnuton: you around ?
Mar 29 16:19:48 <Stskeeps> qwerty12: http://www.daimi.au.dk/~cvm/mer-menubutton2.png
Mar 29 16:19:50 <gnuton> lbt: Hi David! :D I'm cleaning my flat. But every N minutes I check my laptop
Mar 29 16:20:44 <qwerty12> Stskeeps, wow, looks wicked. Although, had any luck with the task switcher chopping the first line of the title off? :)
Mar 29 16:21:07 <Stskeeps> qwerty12: not yet, but next week is for bug fixing
Mar 29 16:21:18 <qwerty12> fair ennuf
Mar 29 16:21:21 <Stskeeps> which means theme errors, inconsistencies, etc, but not extra features
Mar 29 16:22:06 <Stskeeps> so we can probably look into it there :P
Mar 29 16:22:15 <qwerty12> :D
Mar 29 16:22:26 <lbt> gnuton: no probs... I had success last night :)
Mar 29 16:22:37 <lbt> I am running qtdemo as a test suite :)
Mar 29 16:22:48 <lbt> and I think you are going to like it :)
Mar 29 16:23:17 <lbt> graphicsview, TreeView, textedit, scrollarea... all working
Mar 29 16:23:43 <lbt> I'm going to make a video...
Mar 29 16:27:59 <zeptar> have a good day maemoers :D
Mar 29 16:29:05 <lcuk> +1 lbt
Mar 29 16:29:14 <lcuk> infact, +a cherry as well
Mar 29 16:29:53 <gnuton> lbt: cool :D
Mar 29 16:32:29 <gnuton> lbt: I've done some progress too with the ariya code. Now it works, but the animation could be improved with jumping edges, limits in the maxiumum speed..
Mar 29 16:33:23 <zeptar> i found a link that works
Mar 29 16:33:26 <zeptar> https://garage.maemo.org/frs/?group_id=26
Mar 29 16:33:32 <zeptar> just in case anyone was wondering
Mar 29 16:33:35 <zeptar> :D
Mar 29 16:33:42 <zeptar> peace and love, peace and love
Mar 29 16:40:54 <konttori_> zeptar: https://garage.maemo.org/projects/mediaconverter
Mar 29 16:41:48 <zeptar> thanks konttori i found it.
Mar 29 16:41:50 <zeptar> :D
Mar 29 16:42:07 <zeptar> great tool waay better than the new beta they got
Mar 29 16:42:32 <Meiz_mer> Stskeeps, are those menus in panel meant to look like this?: http://trac.tspre.org/meiz/screenshot01.png
Mar 29 16:43:01 <zeptar> konttori_: you may want to update the links on your site, it was driving me crazy
Mar 29 16:50:33 <Stskeeps> Meiz_mer: grab a newer version of hildon-theme
Mar 29 16:50:44 <Stskeeps> or is this your own theme?
Mar 29 16:51:07 <Meiz_mer> that is hildon-theme-liberty-mer, latest available
Mar 29 16:51:25 <Stskeeps> hmm.
Mar 29 16:51:36 <Stskeeps> also hildon-desktop? :P
Mar 29 16:51:45 <Stskeeps> grab hildon-desktop and marquee-plugins
Mar 29 16:51:58 <Meiz_mer> ok
Mar 29 16:52:08 <Meiz_mer> thanks again :)
Mar 29 16:52:10 <Stskeeps> just dist-upgrade really
Mar 29 16:52:29 <Stskeeps> np, tomorrow it is party time for the testers, as they can have 0.11 images to start testing :P
Mar 29 16:52:33 <Stskeeps> nice job on the (x)
Mar 29 16:52:36 <Stskeeps> what filename is that?
Mar 29 17:12:29 <torkiano> hello all, I read http://blogs.gnome.org/aklapper/2009/03/27/checking-and-updating-old-maemo-bug-reports/ and I'd like change the version of one bugs but I can't
Mar 29 17:13:40 <torkiano> for example this bug https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1282 is still valid in latest maemo release 4.1.3
Mar 29 17:22:18 <timelE61i> gan: do you have grant:canconfirm+editbugs?
Mar 29 17:24:44 <GeneralAntilles> Don't believe so.
Mar 29 17:25:57 <timelE61i> torkiano: not having read the article, and not knowing you, i'd sooner have you comment in a couple of bugs
Mar 29 17:26:10 <timelE61i> Unless someone vouches for your reliability
Mar 29 17:28:19 <torkiano> timelE61i, I'll comment in the bugs then ;)
Mar 29 17:37:17 <RST38h> Intel Core 2 Quad S-Series shaves power consumption to 65W
Mar 29 17:37:26 * RST38h hehes nervously
Mar 29 17:40:03 <summatusmentis> is there anyone around that chose to use an n8x0 over an eee?
Mar 29 17:40:42 <RST38h> what is there to choose?
Mar 29 17:40:59 <RST38h> eee is a laptop, n8x0 is a gsm-less phone.
Mar 29 17:41:13 <RST38h> two absolutely different animals
Mar 29 17:41:28 <summatusmentis> right, but they both have similar functionality
Mar 29 17:41:38 <RST38h> yea, they both run Linux
Mar 29 17:41:50 <RST38h> and can run the same applications
Mar 29 17:41:50 <freelikegnu> eee does not function in my shirt pocket
Mar 29 17:42:03 <RST38h> that is where similarity ends
Mar 29 17:42:32 <summatusmentis> i'm trying to figure out if I can get away with using my n8x0 as the only mobile device (well, a phone)
Mar 29 17:43:05 <summatusmentis> That is, switching from macbook, to desktop+nit
Mar 29 17:43:21 <summatusmentis> as compared to desktop+eee
Mar 29 17:43:56 <RST38h> ok
Mar 29 17:44:07 <RST38h> Could you list what you are going to use it for
Mar 29 17:44:30 * RST38h was able to use n8x0 as the only mobile device (+ phone) for 3 weeks, in a pinch
Mar 29 17:45:23 <summatusmentis> uh... web (browsing,im,irc,etc.), ssh, document creation/editing
Mar 29 17:45:48 <summatusmentis> basically a mobile computer when not at a desktop
Mar 29 17:46:23 <RST38h> ok. IM and IRC are no problem at all as long as you can deal with the keyboard input.
Mar 29 17:46:41 <till-> document can be a problem
Mar 29 17:46:44 <summatusmentis> I'm irc'ing from the n810 as we speak
Mar 29 17:47:17 <RST38h> Ditto for ssh
Mar 29 17:47:24 <summatusmentis> how well does google docs work?
Mar 29 17:47:25 <RST38h> Now, browsing is a bit different
Mar 29 17:47:33 <RST38h> work well but slow
Mar 29 17:47:45 <till-> gnumeric is usable
Mar 29 17:47:56 <RST38h> For browsing, I suggest you collect URLs for mobile/iPhone sites and use those
Mar 29 17:48:03 <summatusmentis> is the slow gonna be an issue all around?
Mar 29 17:48:09 <RST38h> They are much lighter on both the traffic and the cpu
Mar 29 17:48:24 <RST38h> AND they are usually ad free :)
Mar 29 17:48:31 <till-> well adblock :)
Mar 29 17:48:47 <RST38h> till: This does not solve 1B-of-javascript problem
Mar 29 17:48:49 <RST38h> 1MB
Mar 29 17:49:04 <till-> iv'e used a mobile and a n800 for 2 month
Mar 29 17:49:07 <till-> during a bike trip
Mar 29 17:49:15 <summatusmentis> I was using my n810 for a while, switched to an iPod Touch, and stopped using it
Mar 29 17:49:37 <RST38h> summa: Basically, for browsing I have got: iGoogle Mobile, Google Reader Mobile, LJ+ Mobile, ITT in its Mobile skin
Mar 29 17:49:48 <RST38h> summa: And the mobile version of rbc.ru for local news
Mar 29 17:49:54 <till-> used it for blogging and watching movies mainly
Mar 29 17:50:14 <RST38h> summa: Google Reader for iPhone edition works like a charm
Mar 29 17:50:27 <summatusmentis> hrm..
Mar 29 17:50:55 <RST38h> summa: for document editing, I think you are fucked, no reason even trying
Mar 29 17:50:56 <summatusmentis> I really like the idea of a full keyboard
Mar 29 17:51:32 <till-> you can use an usb-keyboard with an mini-usb adaptor
Mar 29 17:51:37 <RST38h> summa: I did try Gnumeric etc, and they work fine for viewing and making a few modifications, but you won't be doing heavy duty editing
Mar 29 17:51:50 <summatusmentis> and the other desktop type environments aren't usable?
Mar 29 17:52:00 <RST38h> Dunno, but suspect that they are not
Mar 29 17:52:13 <RST38h> Software isn't a limit with NITs, it is the hardware that limits you
Mar 29 17:52:29 <summatusmentis> just too old?
Mar 29 17:52:40 <RST38h> For external keyboard, you can use any USB or BT keyboard (Apple BT kbd works well), but they all lag hideously
Mar 29 17:52:57 <RST38h> summa: No, just not designed for heavy duty desktop apps
Mar 29 17:53:01 <summatusmentis> mm
Mar 29 17:53:08 <till-> maybe an umpc is better in your case
Mar 29 17:53:11 <RST38h> summa: As I said, N8x0 is a generic OMAP2-based smartphone
Mar 29 17:53:25 <RST38h> till: No more than 5 hours runtime. Usually 2-3.
Mar 29 17:53:47 <summatusmentis> RST38h: I know, I was using it for a while...
Mar 29 17:54:09 <summatusmentis> also, the eee's with 6cell batt. get at least 5 hours
Mar 29 17:54:28 <RST38h> summa: Two main differences between OMAP2 and its ARM friends and the desktop Intel CPUs are cache sizes and memory performance
Mar 29 17:55:14 <RST38h> summa: General desktop apps have huge memroy footprints, so they miss meager ARM cache all the time. And once they do, the SDRAM speeds are in 100-180MHz range.
Mar 29 17:55:29 <summatusmentis> hrm... ok
Mar 29 17:56:02 <RST38h> summa: Intel CPUs have 512kB-4MB caches and memory bus speeds of 400-800MHz
Mar 29 17:57:44 <torkiano> timelE61i, can you see https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=2186? I think that you can mark it as solved
Mar 29 17:58:20 <summatusmentis> RST38h: yeah, I'm leaning more toward eee, obviously you lose some mobility (non-pocket thing)
Mar 29 17:59:21 <RST38h> summa: Unless you are short on money, I would just suggest buying a real small subnotebook
Mar 29 17:59:42 <RST38h> summa: Will cost you $900-$1800
Mar 29 18:00:25 <summatusmentis> RST38h: poor college student here
Mar 29 18:00:55 <RST38h> summa: Then a netbook it is (not necessarily EEE though)
Mar 29 18:01:02 <summatusmentis> and I'd rather invest money in an upgradeable desktop too
Mar 29 18:01:26 <RST38h> summa: which is probably wrong, given that few people upgrade their upgradeable desktops :)
Mar 29 18:01:53 <summatusmentis> RST38h: well, the idea would be to build it myself, etc. :D
Mar 29 18:02:18 <summatusmentis> hrm
Mar 29 18:02:21 <RST38h> summa: I have been doing some comparisons lately and found that a netbook basically has 75-90% of a Centrino1 (Pentium M) performance
Mar 29 18:02:59 <RST38h> summa: As they run at higher speeds than Pentium Ms, you should be able to get something that will even let you run VS.NET, albeit sluggishly
Mar 29 18:03:02 <summatusmentis> which means it's not _that_ useful
Mar 29 18:03:29 <summatusmentis> well, I'd be running linux on it, and I can shell into other machines if needed
Mar 29 18:03:36 <RST38h> summa: Hey, my R100 is a 1.1GHz PentiumM and I have just stopped using it due to cardiac arrests
Mar 29 18:04:00 <RST38h> summa: Have done all development on it for the last 4-5 years
Mar 29 18:05:10 <summatusmentis> RST38h: hrm... thanks for the hlep
Mar 29 18:05:13 <summatusmentis> help*
Mar 29 18:07:37 <RST38h> summa: Other ideas: get a netbook with N280 (I think they have slightly higher FSB clock) *or* wait for Moorestown
Mar 29 18:07:52 <summatusmentis> the n280 isn't out, is it?
Mar 29 18:07:55 <RST38h> it is
Mar 29 18:08:02 <summatusmentis> hrm
Mar 29 18:08:18 <RST38h> Moorestown is not but it is gonna be real soon now
Mar 29 18:08:33 <summatusmentis> Moorestown is the 330 model, or whatever, right? and dual-core/
Mar 29 18:09:50 <RST38h> summa: It is an Atom with memory bridge integrated
Mar 29 18:10:12 <RST38h> summa: supposed to be the first Atom suitable for cellphones, energy wise
Mar 29 18:10:19 <summatusmentis> intriguing
Mar 29 18:10:21 <summatusmentis> hrm
Mar 29 18:10:40 <summatusmentis> thanks for the input, I'll play more
Mar 29 18:31:56 <torkiano> I can't reproduce bug #2186 with latest diablo release. Can someone mark it as fixed?
Mar 29 18:33:35 <torkiano> I think https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=2642 is solved too
Mar 29 18:34:28 <zeptar> here's a bug. on the default media player if mp3s are tagged with track number the program orders the tracks in the playlist 1, 10, 11, 12, 2, 3, 4, 5 ...
Mar 29 18:35:09 <xoox`> Can anybody give me some tips on moving/resizing the "personal launcher" applet?
Mar 29 18:36:59 <zeptar> i've not used that program xoox`
Mar 29 18:37:47 <qwerty12_N800> xoox`: when applets prove difficult to move,  I find tapping the applications menu & trying to move the applet again helps me
Mar 29 18:45:08 <xoox`> Thanks, I got it.
Mar 29 18:46:56 <RST38h> Am I the only one unable to connect to n810 via obex:// from Ubuntu?
Mar 29 18:47:38 <qwerty12_N800> sftp? Or is BT your only option? :)
Mar 29 18:47:56 <RST38h> sftp works fine
Mar 29 18:48:15 <RST38h> Just wondering why obex does not work. It may come handy if there is no wifi nearby
Mar 29 19:18:12 * GeneralAntilles bangs his head against the wall repeatedly.
Mar 29 19:19:03 * qwerty12_N800 sneaks up behind GeneralAntilles and shoots him while he's banging his head
Mar 29 19:19:35 <GeneralAntilles> Please
Mar 29 19:19:37 <GeneralAntilles> Pretty please
Mar 29 19:19:38 <GeneralAntilles> do it
Mar 29 19:19:47 <GeneralAntilles> The Mac Mini's hard drive has now failed
Mar 29 19:19:51 <GeneralAntilles> They're dropping like flies.
Mar 29 19:20:03 <fireun> fries
Mar 29 19:20:28 <AStorm> french variety?
Mar 29 19:20:31 <AStorm> ;)
Mar 29 19:20:35 <fireun> criss cross
Mar 29 19:20:44 * GeneralAntilles kills himself.
Mar 29 19:20:50 <StsN800> GeneralAntilles, happened after you got something dell?
Mar 29 19:20:57 <AStorm> now, we have to resurrect him
Mar 29 19:20:58 <fireun> screeeeaaachKlink
Mar 29 19:21:15 <AStorm> otherwise, the council will be incomplete
Mar 29 19:21:24 <RST38h> General: No way?!?
Mar 29 19:21:24 * fireun reads scroll of resurection
Mar 29 19:21:33 <RST38h> (about hd)
Mar 29 19:21:59 <StsN800> GeneralAntilles, hard fail? SMART reporting what?
Mar 29 19:22:01 <GeneralAntilles> Next up, the Mini 9's going to explode in my lap.
Mar 29 19:22:02 <fireun> tinktinktinkbeepbeepklinktinktink
Mar 29 19:22:08 <AStorm> fireun, you're missing the 3000gp-worth diamond
Mar 29 19:22:15 * RST38h guesses it will be the Battery
Mar 29 19:22:27 <GeneralAntilles> StsN800, flashing questionmark Mac on startup. No apparent issues until this point.
Mar 29 19:22:27 <RST38h> nice high temperature burning with visual effects
Mar 29 19:23:03 <StsN800> GeneralAntilles, hmm. i would verify the hd in another device with smartmontools
Mar 29 19:24:05 <GeneralAntilles> StsN800, if I had the other devices
Mar 29 19:24:12 <GeneralAntilles> or the patience
Mar 29 19:24:24 <fireun> willpower is a slippery thing
Mar 29 19:24:28 <GeneralAntilles> I'm about at the end of my rope for technology bullshit for one day.
Mar 29 19:24:48 <fireun> GeneralAntilles: its sunday, try going outside?
Mar 29 19:24:58 * fireun stays inside despite his recommendation
Mar 29 19:25:17 <GeneralAntilles> fireun, then I have to come back inside to thousands of dollars worth of paperweights.
Mar 29 19:25:27 <GeneralAntilles> Unless I just skip town
Mar 29 19:25:31 <fireun> GeneralAntilles: in time, this too will pass
Mar 29 19:25:54 <GeneralAntilles> fireun, not before it ends up costing me a lot of money and/or time.
Mar 29 19:26:02 <fireun> been there holmes
Mar 29 19:28:58 <GeneralAntilles> Of course, a fun X crash as the pretty little cherry on top.
Mar 29 19:29:47 <StsN801> time to grab a cup of tea and a book and considering to go into the wild :P
Mar 29 19:30:09 <GeneralAntilles> Move out west and hunt coyote for ranchers for a living.
Mar 29 19:30:36 <fireun> GeneralAntilles: hey, you got a lead on that job? really?
Mar 29 19:31:00 <GeneralAntilles> fireun, got a friend in the business.
Mar 29 19:31:04 <StsN801> you could also consider hunting iTT trolls for profit
Mar 29 19:31:10 <GeneralAntilles> Who would pay me?
Mar 29 19:31:26 * fireun is out west
Mar 29 19:31:53 <StsN801> i'm sure a donation fund would be possible
Mar 29 19:32:11 <fireun> would I need to bring back the pelts, or are ears good enough?
Mar 29 19:32:42 <GeneralAntilles> fireun, dunno, honestly.
Mar 29 19:32:53 <fireun> (:
Mar 29 19:33:27 <fireun> I suppose slogging through the cold woods, getting tick bites and craving hot coffee would drag after awhile
Mar 29 19:33:36 <fireun> and no internet!
Mar 29 19:33:48 <fireun> or do coyotes have wifi?
Mar 29 19:33:51 <GeneralAntilles> That's the best part!
Mar 29 19:34:20 <fireun> does it pay by the coyote, or is it a general retainer?
Mar 29 19:34:23 <fireun> (:
Mar 29 19:34:29 * fireun finds the idea appealing
Mar 29 19:35:05 <GeneralAntilles> I think he's got a part-time position with one guy and by-the-dog with some others.
Mar 29 19:36:39 <timelE61i> Torkiano: just comment in the bug(s) someone can speed through them if you do
Mar 29 19:38:48 <timelE61i> gan: what are the odds i can find a firewire cable at work? :)
Mar 29 19:39:37 <GeneralAntilles> timelE61i, slim to none?
Mar 29 19:39:47 * timelE61i nods
Mar 29 19:39:53 * GeneralAntilles wonders what the odds of something exploding in his face are.
Mar 29 19:39:57 <timelE61i> i should just buy one on my way to work
Mar 29 19:40:09 <timelE61i> gan: high :)
Mar 29 19:40:28 <timelE61i> That is... If you have anything that hasn't failed yet
Mar 29 19:40:34 <timelE61i> Bt headset/phone :)
Mar 29 19:40:46 <GeneralAntilles> Double failures
Mar 29 19:40:51 <GeneralAntilles> Man that's a scary thought.
Mar 29 19:41:05 * GeneralAntilles moves the G5 paperweight into the other room just in case.
Mar 29 19:41:18 <StsN801> and that's why raid isn't a backup
Mar 29 19:41:30 <GeneralAntilles> Firewire cables are a pain.
Mar 29 19:41:53 <GeneralAntilles> I can never manage to scrounge one up when I need one even though I have at least a dozen.
Mar 29 19:42:20 <fireun> the student mail server at school crashed this weekend too
Mar 29 19:42:25 <fireun> hd failure
Mar 29 19:42:41 <fireun> *apparently* they dont have it on a raid ):
Mar 29 19:42:58 <timelE61i> Please say that unlike usb there's only one cable type
Mar 29 19:43:06 <Veggen> gah. I don't dare not even for my home desktop :)
Mar 29 19:43:09 <timelE61i> Fireun: raid sucks
Mar 29 19:43:20 <timelE61i> They should use zfs w/ a supported os
Mar 29 19:43:22 <StsN801> i have 2x raid, seperated in different buildings
Mar 29 19:43:25 <timelE61i> != OSX
Mar 29 19:43:30 <GeneralAntilles> timelE61i, 4
Mar 29 19:43:51 <GeneralAntilles> 4-pin, 6-pin, 9-pin
Mar 29 19:44:15 <timelE61i> lovely
Mar 29 19:44:27 <GeneralAntilles> Firewire 800, Firewire 400, Firewire 800 to 400, and Firewire 400 (MiniUSB style).
Mar 29 19:44:31 <fireun> timelE61i: I didnt say raid was the only way to do it, just pointing out they still dont have it back up again and so likely dont use any kind of failure avoidance
Mar 29 19:44:34 <timelE61i> I want to slave my mbp to a desktop workstation
Mar 29 19:44:48 <GeneralAntilles> Target Firewire drive is genius.
Mar 29 19:45:17 <GeneralAntilles> I can't tell you how many times that's saved my ass.
Mar 29 19:45:32 * timelE61i nods
Mar 29 19:45:42 <timelE61i> now tell me which cable type :)
Mar 29 19:46:21 <GeneralAntilles> 6-pin to 6-pin
Mar 29 19:46:38 <GeneralAntilles> Or, actually, does the new MBP ship with a 400 port?
Mar 29 19:48:34 <fireun> the shadownet s destroying hds
Mar 29 19:49:00 <GeneralAntilles> I actually have a replacement HD on hand, but I don't have a putty knife to get the damn thing open.
Mar 29 19:49:06 <timelE61i> there was a port of about the same size as the usb ports next to them
Mar 29 19:49:21 <timelE61i> W/ a Y logo which i presume is firewire
Mar 29 19:49:34 <GeneralAntilles> Was it USB A shaped or USB B shaped?
Mar 29 19:49:52 <GeneralAntilles>  Is this a Unibody MBP?
Mar 29 19:49:57 <timelE61i> Is that powered/unpowered?
Mar 29 19:50:48 <GeneralAntilles> Well, the Firewire 800 port is more square, the Firewire 400 port is more rectangular
Mar 29 19:50:58 <GeneralAntilles> They've removed the 400 ports from most of the newer Macs.
Mar 29 19:51:04 <timelE61i> the usb ports are what i consider rectangular
Mar 29 19:51:15 <GeneralAntilles> http://www.appleinnovation.com/images/macbookpro-ports.gif
Mar 29 19:51:17 <timelE61i> And the adj port seemed about the same
Mar 29 19:51:34 <timelE61i> My phone's running low on power :V
Mar 29 19:52:03 <GeneralAntilles> Probably 400
Mar 29 19:52:31 <GeneralAntilles> So a 6pin to 6pin Firewire 400 cable will do.
Mar 29 19:53:01 <timelE61i> Um, are those my choices?
Mar 29 19:54:19 <timelE61i> Because i have 2usb, power, express and two optical, and ethernet iirc
Mar 29 19:54:29 * timelE61i gives up and walks home
Mar 29 19:54:46 * GeneralAntilles can't be usefully specific without more details.
Mar 29 19:54:57 * GeneralAntilles is also addled.
Mar 29 19:55:27 <timelE61i> 2.4ghz 4g ram, 300g hdd?
Mar 29 19:55:38 <timelE61i> New thinner than previous model
Mar 29 19:55:43 <GeneralAntilles> Black border around the LCD?
Mar 29 19:55:51 <timelE61i> Yes
Mar 29 19:55:58 <GeneralAntilles> It may not even have Firewire, actually.
Mar 29 19:56:47 <GeneralAntilles> The rectangular port is the DisplayLink port
Mar 29 19:56:51 * timelE61i decides to walk home and look
Mar 29 19:56:55 <GeneralAntilles> there's a Firewire 800 port on there
Mar 29 19:57:18 <GeneralAntilles> So, depending on whether your desktop has Firewire 800 you'll need either an 800 cable or an 800 to 400
Mar 29 19:57:52 <timelE61i> so basically i have to walk to work before i buy
Mar 29 19:58:07 <timelE61i> Fun
Mar 29 19:58:23 <timelE61i> Well, in that case, i think i'll buy more storage too
Mar 29 19:58:36 <GeneralAntilles> Retail?
Mar 29 19:58:38 <GeneralAntilles> Ew
Mar 29 19:58:43 <timelE61i> Sp3000: where's the price point for sata-ii?
Mar 29 19:59:00 <GeneralAntilles> Bigger is always cheaper per GB
Mar 29 19:59:04 <timelE61i> You'd suggest i use mynokiapurchase?
Mar 29 19:59:27 <GeneralAntilles> Well, buying retail here basically means a 20-30% markup over what I could get online
Mar 29 19:59:56 <timelE61i> Typically those take a while, don't match what you want, aren't compatible, and are more expensive and slower than retail. Plus smaller
Mar 29 20:00:05 <timelE61i> We're good at purchasing
Mar 29 20:00:22 <GeneralAntilles> 1TB is the price I like for drives, anyway.
Mar 29 20:00:41 <timelE61i> Oh, and they recommend the wrong components
Mar 29 20:01:00 <timelE61i> E.g. They recommend an 8port noisy unstackable switch
Mar 29 20:01:28 <timelE61i> Instead of a 16port quiet stackable one which costs nearly the same...
Mar 29 20:02:15 <timelE61i> Do you find internal is cheaper than ext?
Mar 29 20:02:24 <GeneralAntilles> Always
Mar 29 20:03:15 <GeneralAntilles> Well, for US prices anyway
Mar 29 20:03:22 <GeneralAntilles> I can't speak for crazyland
Mar 29 20:06:14 <timeless> yay, stupid irc client crashed
Mar 29 20:06:19 <timeless> ok, so i have a fw800 port
Mar 29 20:06:29 <timeless> and dp, and the other stuff i mentioned:)
Mar 29 20:08:53 <StsN802> 'lo milhouse
Mar 29 20:09:12 <atv> After submitting application in gsoc, how we r supposed to get feedback from mentors?
Mar 29 20:10:33 <fireun> http://www.ft.com/cms/s/2/03775904-177c-11de-8c9d-0000779fd2ac.html
Mar 29 20:14:48 <GeneralAntilles> itT -> Talk is like XP -> Vista . . . wait, what?
Mar 29 20:15:21 <Jaffa> <sigh/>
Mar 29 20:15:48 <GeneralAntilles> I wish it would just happen so people can stop making idiotic predictions about it.
Mar 29 20:16:09 <lbt> For those who are interested (and haven't already seen it on #liqbase) I've been working on fingerscrolling for Qt4.5 on the nokia tablets: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4TxAIScXQvk​
Mar 29 20:16:38 <timeless> gan: compare:
Mar 29 20:16:39 <timeless> http://www.verkkokauppa.com/popups/prodinfo.php?id=8786
Mar 29 20:16:45 <GeneralAntilles> So, what does it mean when something with no moving parts starts making noise?
Mar 29 20:16:45 <timeless> http://www.verkkokauppa.com/popups/prodinfo.php?id=17284
Mar 29 20:17:02 <lcuk> GeneralAntilles, you need a bigger hammer
Mar 29 20:17:50 <GeneralAntilles> timeless, I don't read Finnish.
Mar 29 20:18:07 <timeless> nor do i
Mar 29 20:18:16 <timeless> afaict the only difference between those are the price
Mar 29 20:18:25 <timeless> and probably the one that costs more is internal :)
Mar 29 20:18:28 <GeneralAntilles> The Seagate serial is different, too.
Mar 29 20:18:49 <GeneralAntilles> Maybe one's the enterprise model?
Mar 29 20:18:56 <timeless> maybe
Mar 29 20:19:11 <GeneralAntilles> Or OEM package and retail package
Mar 29 20:19:11 <timeless> anyway, nothing makes sense in this messed up land :)
Mar 29 20:21:47 <GeneralAntilles> The 340AS is heavier, uses more power and has faster seek times.
Mar 29 20:22:18 <GeneralAntilles> The 333AS is, apparently, has higher theoretical throughput.
Mar 29 20:22:31 <GeneralAntilles> http://www.seagate.com/ww/v/index.jsp?vgnextoid=c9d88cf6a794b110VgnVCM100000f5ee0a0aRCRD http://www.seagate.com/ww/v/index.jsp?vgnextoid=0732f141e7f43110VgnVCM100000f5ee0a0aRCRD
Mar 29 20:22:41 <GeneralAntilles> Is there a next-tab/previous-tab in Firefox?
Mar 29 20:22:55 <Jaffa> Ctrl/Command-PgUp/Down
Mar 29 20:23:12 <timeless> gan: wanna verify 2642?
Mar 29 20:23:33 <timeless> depending on your ver, ctrl-tab/ctrl-shift-tab may also work..
Mar 29 20:23:38 <GeneralAntilles> Ah, thanks Jaffa
Mar 29 20:24:00 * GeneralAntilles is used to having those as mouse buttons.
Mar 29 20:24:34 <fireun> ctrl-pgup/pgdwn works as well, and is the same under chrome
Mar 29 20:25:00 <GeneralAntilles> timeless, I don't have any bookmarks in Google.
Mar 29 20:25:43 <GeneralAntilles> timeless, ask me in a week.
Mar 29 20:31:04 <sp3000> timeless: oh, yeah, my pvr fails at dst
Mar 29 20:31:11 <timeless> awesome
Mar 29 20:31:13 <timeless> hrm
Mar 29 20:31:15 <timeless> come to think of it
Mar 29 20:31:18 <timeless> i suspect mine does too
Mar 29 20:31:22 * timeless goes to find out
Mar 29 20:31:50 <sp3000> it updates local but the programming doesn't follow
Mar 29 20:32:00 <sp3000> which is a pretty exciting way to fail
Mar 29 20:32:13 <timeless> well, that stems from the fact that pvrs here utterly suck
Mar 29 20:32:18 <timeless> sp3000: anyway
Mar 29 20:32:49 <timeless> tomorrow i need help getting a firewire cable
Mar 29 20:32:52 <sp3000> I guess it's valid if things you record are usually not on your tz, but that seems ...uncommon
Mar 29 20:32:54 <timeless> so i can try to rescue my mac
Mar 29 20:33:03 <timeless> lol
Mar 29 20:33:19 <timeless> and i also want to buy a new hdd
Mar 29 20:33:28 <sp3000> you're making a tradition of breaking it on weekends?
Mar 29 20:33:31 <timeless> btw, does verkokauppa have an en thing
Mar 29 20:33:36 <GeneralAntilles> timeless Goes Shopping
Mar 29 20:33:36 <timeless> sp3000: i guess so
Mar 29 20:33:43 <GeneralAntilles> You should put that on YouTube
Mar 29 20:33:51 <timeless> but next time, i'm going to ZFS Send to my new HDD :)
Mar 29 20:40:09 <VDVsx> atv, yes, all the applications under maemo org have comments right now
Mar 29 20:41:14 <GeneralAntilles> timeless, by the way, newegg really doesn't like that drive
Mar 29 20:41:25 <timeless> as in claims it sucks?
Mar 29 20:41:39 <GeneralAntilles> http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16822148373
Mar 29 20:41:41 <timeless> istr saying that the quality of what we get here is awful
Mar 29 20:41:49 <GeneralAntilles> 3/5 stars
Mar 29 20:42:05 <timeless> also note the price differential
Mar 29 20:42:13 <timeless> it's about 2x as much here
Mar 29 20:46:08 <suihkulokki> timeless: an en thing ?
Mar 29 20:46:28 <timeless> ? for verko? that'd be nice, yes
Mar 29 20:47:30 <suihkulokki> ah, you mean the language
Mar 29 20:47:45 <timeless> some of us don't speak fiFI
Mar 29 20:48:39 <suihkulokki> I don't think their business has enough profit margin to translate all the stuff in their shop
Mar 29 20:48:57 <suihkulokki> they don't even have swedish pages although that's a official language
Mar 29 20:49:15 <timeless> s/ a / an /
Mar 29 22:33:14 <rohananil> hey all :)
Mar 29 22:33:29 <rohananil> i am interested in the Improve Xournal project
Mar 29 22:33:37 <rohananil> and adding handwriting recognition to it :)
Mar 29 22:34:15 <rohananil> are there any mentors around :) (i know its a sunday )
Mar 29 22:36:02 <VDVsx> rohananil, the mentor for this project should be anidel, but he is not here right now, I guess
Mar 29 22:36:57 <rohananil> VDVsx: thanks , could you tell me  what time is he around usually ? :)
Mar 29 22:38:05 <VDVsx> rohananil, probably during the working hours (UTC time)
Mar 29 22:39:10 <rohananil> ok thank you again :)
Mar 29 22:39:43 <rohananil> i have one more question , the opencv svn ,porting to maemo and testing , would require the student to have a tablet ? :)
Mar 29 22:40:55 <rohananil> oh yeah its written there itself :)
Mar 29 22:41:08 <VDVsx> rohananil, yup
Mar 30 02:52:46 <derkaiser> hi,all~
Mar 30 02:56:26 <Shasie> Hi derkaiser
**** ENDING LOGGING AT Mon Mar 30 02:59:57 2009