**** BEGIN LOGGING AT Sun Sep 27 02:59:56 2009 Sep 27 04:27:41 * lcuk hakcs johnx's toe off Sep 27 04:27:46 hacks even Sep 27 04:57:45 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Aawn0Cm7Hyc Sep 27 04:57:49 :P Sep 27 05:03:42 Neat Sep 27 05:06:12 fernand0: Get started on a Maemo 5 port. :) Sep 27 05:07:40 fernand0: DEB link? or is it not out yet? Sep 27 05:07:55 nvm Sep 27 05:08:29 nvm that nvm. Is it out? Sep 27 05:09:23 haha Sep 27 05:09:27 yea Sep 27 05:09:32 * jaem is looking Sep 27 05:10:09 http://cymonsgames.com/asciiportal/ Sep 27 05:10:19 yes, but I don't see an ARM binary there Sep 27 05:11:02 I can build one, though, but the video would imply that someone has one Sep 27 05:15:12 oh, I did Sep 27 05:15:27 do you want me to upload it? Sep 27 05:15:57 it segfaults when its closed.. need to see why heh Sep 27 05:16:10 also I want to enable fullscreen mode Sep 27 05:24:08 fernand0, yes please Sep 27 05:24:11 is it SDL? Sep 27 05:24:23 yep Sep 27 05:24:35 ah Sep 27 05:24:36 one sec Sep 27 05:25:25 if you upload your sources (if you've modified them, that is), I can patch that for you Sep 27 05:25:29 or I can point you to the wiki Sep 27 05:25:31 it's not hard Sep 27 05:26:39 see this article: http://wiki.maemo.org/Game_development Sep 27 05:28:25 let me check, I'll upload the asciiportal bin if you want, you need to use the maps, and sounds folder from any of the build Sep 27 05:31:45 jaem, http://maemo-es.com.ar/deb/asciiportal.tar.gz Sep 27 05:32:31 yay, thanks Sep 27 05:32:32 sure Sep 27 05:43:51 wow ncis sucked Sep 27 05:43:51 heh Sep 27 05:46:39 fernand0: is that built from vanilla sources, or did you have to do some porting work? Sep 27 05:47:34 jaem, it's vanilla source, I have not touched it heh Sep 27 05:49:52 jaem, oh, I think I removed the gcc -O2 optimization flag, I'll add it again.. besides that, nothing Sep 27 05:50:02 * jmc93739653 is away: Away Sep 27 05:52:36 hmm Sep 27 05:52:51 fernand0: is it like the original game, in that portals only stick to certain surfaces? Sep 27 05:57:02 jaem, yea Sep 27 06:06:01 how are they marked? Sep 27 06:17:11 awesome - ascii portal rules Sep 27 06:27:05 jaem, http://maemo-es.com.ar/deb/asciiportal.bin.gz this one should run faster, also if you use the -f parameter should be fullscreen on 800*480 heh, only the white blocks can be used to place portals Sep 27 06:51:58 nice! Sep 27 06:52:00 that's awesome Sep 27 06:52:51 g'night Sep 27 09:17:48 ahaha...I just got my oldest zaurus running a recent OS again Sep 27 09:18:33 Install Android on it =) Sep 27 09:18:41 no way. :P Sep 27 09:18:51 it's gonna be my DAAP/UPNP server Sep 27 09:19:03 will it be able to stream video? =) Sep 27 09:19:14 we'll find out, won't we? Sep 27 09:19:21 it'll be fine for audio Sep 27 09:19:31 I don't do much video with upnp anyways Sep 27 09:21:00 also, I found something called didiwiki. it's a wiki with built-in web server in like 25KB apparently Sep 27 09:22:07 including the database? Sep 27 09:22:14 have you seen tiddlywiki? Sep 27 09:22:24 A wiki in your browser - powered by js Sep 27 09:22:27 RST38h, nah, that's just the binary Sep 27 09:22:43 It is quite handy Sep 27 09:22:53 SpeedEvil, that's cool, but it doesn't sound very multi-user ... Sep 27 09:23:03 wikipedia.exe =) Sep 27 09:23:21 johnx: no - you need a server Sep 27 09:23:28 Though there is a free one Sep 27 09:24:02 so wait, what? it's a wiki in js, but depends on an external server? Sep 27 09:24:19 not trying to be mean, but I don't understand the use-case... Sep 27 09:24:55 It's a wiki in js - that can save to local disk - or upload to a server Sep 27 09:25:21 ah, got it Sep 27 09:26:23 Mediawiki.el Sep 27 09:26:42 Emacs <3 Sep 27 09:28:42 haha! even usb (gadget) networking works Sep 27 09:57:21 * RST38h moos at Myrtti Sep 27 09:57:57 Moo Sep 27 10:13:03 * lbt o/ Myrtti Sep 27 10:42:29 As a Debianfan, I would really like this N900, but unfortunatelly too expensive for me. Sep 27 10:48:31 qwerty12_N810, you arent that pessamistic Sep 27 11:02:48 * Jaffa feels much better having had a self-imposed tmo embargo since Thursday. Sep 27 11:02:53 And I've no plans to break it. Sep 27 11:04:59 Jaffa, good for you Sep 27 11:05:04 some threads are a bit meh! Sep 27 11:05:11 some are fun tho :) Sep 27 11:05:21 and theres productive nuggets coming from them Sep 27 11:05:46 * Jaffa seems unable to avoid hitting the crackpot conspiracy theories more than anything else. Sep 27 11:09:35 * lbt mainly goes to tmo by request when Mer come up Sep 27 11:13:28 jaffa, :P Never ascribe to malice, that which can be explained by incompetence. Napoleon Bonaparte Sep 27 11:16:31 lcuk: Oh, I know they're incompetent. In reading comprehension etc. Sep 27 11:16:39 haha Sep 27 11:16:52 People seem to actively work on misunderstanding etc. Sep 27 11:16:59 * Jaffa concentrates on development. Much more fun. Sep 27 11:17:02 its easy in a text envionment Sep 27 11:17:08 good good Sep 27 11:17:17 * lcuk does in an odd way Sep 27 11:17:32 Well, got to do a GUI now. That's pretty boring. Sep 27 11:17:55 its always pretty boring Sep 27 11:17:58 vb ftw :D Sep 27 11:17:58 * Jaffa wonders about playing with Glade or GtkBuilder or whatever is the current in-vogue GUI tool Sep 27 11:18:06 lcuk: s/vb/WimpWorks Sep 27 11:18:32 how did guis get done before the ide? Sep 27 11:19:18 Oops. I think I've deleted jaffasoft.co.uk Sep 27 11:19:29 And it's CVS repo. Sep 27 11:19:34 This could be embarassing Sep 27 11:22:44 o_O Sep 27 11:22:46 thats not good Sep 27 11:22:58 * lcuk needs to do some prototyping and is just too lazy Sep 27 11:24:55 I may have a backup from 200*6*! Sep 27 11:28:48 :O Sep 27 11:44:53 mornin yerga javispedro Sep 27 11:44:59 morn Sep 27 11:45:23 morning lcuk Sep 27 11:46:21 yerga, i notice bacon is high on your priorities too Sep 27 11:47:18 lcuk, bacon is a wonderful food Sep 27 11:47:43 you can use it with everything Sep 27 11:48:23 yeah - its even good for clothing Sep 27 11:48:58 yer:maybe a bit fat? :D Sep 27 11:50:02 * lcuk will leave it to google to demonstrate, but bacon bras are quite popular lol Sep 27 11:50:29 the uncooked one is a bit off - but nothing a quick grilling couldnt cure Sep 27 11:52:50 * yerga searches bacon bras in google... :-P Sep 27 11:53:27 *rolleyes* Sep 27 11:54:45 hey Myrtti ;) Sep 27 11:55:37 Mph Sep 27 11:55:59 * aquatix gives Myrtti some good coffee Sep 27 11:57:39 * Myrtti goes away again in a poof of smoke Sep 27 11:59:20 * lcuk gets Myrtti a bacon pony Sep 27 12:09:37 maemo council election voting ends today i believe Sep 27 12:09:53 so anyone that hasnt voted - get your asses into your email inbox and follow instructions Sep 27 12:10:09 http://wiki.maemo.org/Community_Council/Candidate_declarations_for_September_2009 Sep 27 12:11:43 * SpeedEvil discovers the 'edit' link on that page, and decides what to add. Sep 27 12:11:47 :) Sep 27 12:12:23 haha Sep 27 12:12:51 "Keep the Maemo Community Council northerner free - don't vote for lcuk" Sep 27 12:13:14 lcuk is clearly a southerner. Sep 27 12:13:19 o_O Sep 27 12:13:26 in what context Sep 27 12:13:30 south manchester? Sep 27 12:13:31 * SpeedEvil is in Fife. Sep 27 12:13:37 haha cool Sep 27 12:13:42 glad irc has auto subtitles ;) Sep 27 12:14:21 it seems that everyone complains about those northerly of them Sep 27 12:14:26 who does santa comaplin about Sep 27 12:14:29 complain Sep 27 12:14:45 People in Manchester Sep 27 12:14:53 haha Sep 27 12:15:03 * lcuk notices you arent op right now Sep 27 12:16:17 * qwerty12_N810 blames the router Sep 27 12:37:37 Jaffa: there's a voting problem Sep 27 12:37:46 voting seems to be closed Sep 27 12:38:14 "The voting period for the specified election starts on 2009-09-20 00:00:00 (UTC) and ends on 2009-09-26 23:59:59 (UTC). It is not possible to vote now." Sep 27 12:38:47 then technically its right, even i miseread it Sep 27 12:38:52 i tohught it was open all day today Sep 27 12:39:00 misread thought Sep 27 12:39:11 For those who haven't noticed, the voting for the council is on now, and Sep 27 12:39:13 will close on Sunday evening. Sep 27 12:39:21 from dneary's email Sep 27 12:39:25 :( Sep 27 12:39:34 ... Sep 27 12:40:14 he sent a "Don't forget to vote" email to the community list on 25/9/09 Sep 27 12:40:21 yeah reading now Sep 27 12:41:46 http://maemo.org/news/announcements/maemo_community_council_elections_voting_open/ Sep 27 12:44:05 X-Fade ping... Sep 27 12:46:31 we need a batsignal Sep 27 12:47:33 }×@×{ ? Sep 27 12:47:44 hm, no, that's just a dead pig with weird ears Sep 27 12:49:29 I posted on tmo too Sep 27 12:50:02 thanks lbt Sep 27 12:50:29 :D Sep 27 12:50:30 hehe Sep 27 12:51:00 i meant for anything cool where superheroes should come running Sep 27 13:09:42 X-Fade: ping Sep 27 13:12:44 hi Sep 27 13:13:15 can't install fremantle beta2 it seems that the package theme-config is missing.. Sep 27 13:13:25 thats what apt says.. Sep 27 13:13:27 :/ Sep 27 13:13:49 did you have any problems when you last ran apt-get update Sep 27 13:13:59 which might indicate certain repositories are not availabl Sep 27 13:14:04 or is this a general problem Sep 27 13:15:02 I'm just trying to install the sdk on sb1 with the script that is available on the maemo / developtment site.. Sep 27 13:16:04 just tried it weeks ago because I thought its somehow a problem with my sb or whatever.. Sep 27 13:16:15 but is doesn't work again.. Sep 27 13:16:52 sounds odd Sep 27 13:16:59 :/ Sep 27 13:17:02 if its from the normal instructions it generally works Sep 27 13:17:20 try reading the faq there and seeing if it has any pitfalls as you describe Sep 27 13:17:31 hmm k Sep 27 13:17:36 thanks lcuk Sep 27 13:18:08 failing that, post on -dev mailing list Sep 27 13:18:19 theres more devs there that dont always watch the flow here Sep 27 13:28:51 i also had one package missing from fremantle repository when i tried it in a hurry couple of weeks ago Sep 27 13:29:17 didn't have time to look further, but it really was not there. might be that same Sep 27 13:30:16 zemm, what package was that Sep 27 13:30:53 can't remember exactly, but it was needed for gui. might have been that theme-config Sep 27 13:31:34 oooh the proto photo browser users the concept i want to do for widgets Sep 27 13:31:35 http://betalabs.nokia.com/betas/view/nokia-photo-browser Sep 27 13:31:53 it looks like from there it could work Sep 27 13:32:55 the rotating thing :$ Sep 27 13:34:41 When does this council actualy have it's last day? it is today? Sep 27 13:35:01 keesj: Yup. Tomorrow a new council is in place. Sep 27 13:35:11 We can retire to the second house Sep 27 13:35:17 Jolly good! Sep 27 13:35:39 Is the second house hereditary? Sep 27 13:35:52 SpeedEvil: Not any more Sep 27 13:36:30 Jaffa, old council members are now stuffed and mounted on the wall Sep 27 13:36:40 Excellent Sep 27 13:36:52 just thought i would mention that ;) Sep 27 13:37:52 keesj, we will put you in a pose with nbutton concept Sep 27 13:38:37 Is nokia following the ferengi practice of auctioning freeze-dried segments? Sep 27 13:39:00 no, but they will be on sale from the maemo.org store Sep 27 13:39:08 gold pressed latinum is accepted Sep 27 13:39:59 * javispedro likes candidate lcuk words about the important issue at hand ;) Sep 27 13:41:51 javispedro of course, strips of latinum are vital to trade Sep 27 13:42:45 does paypal have a conversion factor for that btw Sep 27 13:43:14 * lcuk leaves a link just in case http://liqbase.net/ Sep 27 13:44:29 maybe talk to egold Sep 27 13:44:34 hah Sep 27 13:44:49 wasnt there a post your gold thing Sep 27 13:44:59 we could have a "postyourgolfplatedlatinum" Sep 27 13:45:04 gold even Sep 27 13:45:15 i wonder how much postage would be Sep 27 13:56:46 * lcuk does some code to relax himself Sep 27 14:01:55 voting? Sep 27 14:08:16 lbt, everything Sep 27 14:08:31 moo wazd Sep 27 14:09:05 hiya RST38h Sep 27 14:09:30 and hi wazd Sep 27 14:09:48 EHLO lcuk Sep 27 14:10:22 250 OK Sep 27 14:13:50 * lcuk drops a 10tonne safe on penguinbait as he enters Sep 27 14:14:02 ouch Sep 27 14:14:16 how are you Sep 27 14:14:22 eliminating competition? =) Sep 27 14:14:36 not at all Sep 27 14:14:43 just seeing who has super powers Sep 27 14:14:51 ehehe Sep 27 14:14:52 kinda like the dunking witches thing lol Sep 27 14:16:00 penguinbait, is your site tablet oriented Sep 27 14:16:05 http://penguinbait.com/ i mean Sep 27 14:16:14 its got fonts visible from orbit on my desktop Sep 27 14:17:00 yeah (H) works nicely from tablet Sep 27 14:17:22 * javispedro spies lcuk's monitor from orbit Sep 27 14:17:30 aka google earth. Sep 27 14:17:37 no, I don't see anything :( Sep 27 14:17:49 looking on the wrong freuqncy Sep 27 14:18:10 frequency Sep 27 14:18:18 see, even my typing letters are phasing in and out Sep 27 14:18:51 orbit ;) Sep 27 14:19:15 http://penguinbait.com/superhero.jpg Sep 27 14:19:26 arrrrrrrrrgh my eyes Sep 27 14:19:46 thank god i dont have one of those! Sep 27 14:19:50 lol Sep 27 14:19:52 you will Sep 27 14:19:57 heh Sep 27 14:20:01 but that looks REALLY good for what i mentioned before Sep 27 14:20:27 When does this council actualy have it's last day? it is today? Sep 27 14:20:27 keesj: Yup. Tomorrow a new council is in place. Sep 27 14:20:27 We can retire to the second house Sep 27 14:20:27 Jolly good! Sep 27 14:20:27 Is the second house hereditary? Sep 27 14:20:28 SpeedEvil: Not any more Sep 27 14:20:30 Jaffa, old council members are now stuffed and mounted on the wall Sep 27 14:20:38 Excellent Sep 27 14:20:38 just thought i would mention that ;) Sep 27 14:20:38 keesj, we will put you in a pose with nbutton concept Sep 27 14:20:38 Is nokia following the ferengi practice of auctioning freeze-dried segments? Sep 27 14:20:40 no, but they will be on sale from the maemo.org store Sep 27 14:20:53 but having them in pimp costumers is even more fitting Sep 27 14:20:57 we can open an attraction Sep 27 14:21:27 like madame tussauds Sep 27 14:21:30 * GeneralAntilles notices a bunch of random people in his apartment. Sep 27 14:21:45 have you considered that its YOU thats in the wrong appartment Sep 27 14:21:46 apple employees reparing the RDF no doubt Sep 27 14:21:47 random spawn Sep 27 14:21:47 I think Quim shaves is chest, lol Sep 27 14:22:06 My roommate went to a party last night and brought home some baggage I guess. Sep 27 14:22:30 They turned the AC to "Express Lane to the Poor House" Sep 27 14:22:40 * lcuk laughs at http://liqbase.net/star_wreck_keisari_ga.jpg Sep 27 14:23:01 GeneralAntilles, if baggage == girls, np ;) Sep 27 14:23:14 +1 agreed VDVsx lol Sep 27 14:24:08 If baggage == girls, then $$ Sep 27 14:24:14 VDVsx, I have no idea, they're all covered head to toe in blankets. Sep 27 14:24:22 Pay up, mothafucka. Sep 27 14:24:41 GeneralAntilles: ELBOW DROP! Sep 27 14:24:44 hahaha GeneralAntilles thing is, if he brought the football team back with him Sep 27 14:24:58 you will be their b***h and have to make em breakfast cos you are up Sep 27 14:25:01 and wearing a pinny Sep 27 14:25:13 make some bacon for us too Sep 27 14:25:18 good idea! Sep 27 14:25:34 Fuck that shit. The rice cooker made breakfast. Sep 27 14:25:39 last act of the council :) lol massive fryup for the community Sep 27 14:25:42 girls fit in baggage, but airlines give discounts for them, so it's kind of a toss-up Sep 27 14:25:57 penguinbait: Shit.. I think it's working. I smell bacon. Sep 27 14:26:11 Oh... haha.. my wife's making breakfast. Sep 27 14:26:15 mmmmmmmmmmmmm bacon!! Sep 27 14:26:37 zerojay, yeah she made breakfast for me before :P Sep 27 14:26:45 pffffft, Sep 27 14:26:51 :D Sep 27 14:26:58 at least ou can afford bacon Sep 27 14:27:00 why is fried ham called Canadian bacon? Sep 27 14:27:02 more code less chat. http://pupnik.de/arbeiten.gif Sep 27 14:27:09 right now, i have a grand total of 26p and some chewing gum Sep 27 14:27:19 cos canadian bacon is like fried ham Sep 27 14:27:24 its thin and wiffly and fake Sep 27 14:28:07 lcuk: I can't afford much more than that, heh. Sep 27 14:28:08 do Canadians call it Canadian bacon? or is that a USA thing? Sep 27 14:28:15 It's an American thing. Sep 27 14:28:20 It's just ham here. Sep 27 14:28:32 Maybe just a Michigan thing? Sep 27 14:28:44 No, it's not. I heard it in Kentucky as well. Sep 27 14:28:44 * lcuk buys mild english cheddar Sep 27 14:29:36 how much beer can you buy with 26p Sep 27 14:29:37 ? Sep 27 14:29:48 If you ever want to either feel like the smartest person alive or depressed that everyone else around you is one notch above "brain dead", Kentucky's the place to go! Sep 27 14:29:52 not much Sep 27 14:29:59 but i have to put that money towards family :) Sep 27 14:30:05 so its not even all available for beer Sep 27 14:30:20 Hi there, I'd like to build maemo from source.... how do I do it, and what would I be missing (ie, what's non-distributable)? Sep 27 14:30:52 Isn't there a wiki page that outlines what would be missing...? Sep 27 14:31:02 ppman: What version of Maemo? Sep 27 14:31:06 I want to run a n64 emulator can someone tell me how? Sep 27 14:31:07 possibly, but I'm not very good at finding it. Sep 27 14:31:22 zerojay: I don't know... probably the latest that's not 5? Sep 27 14:31:35 I don't actually have a maemo-device, keep in mind Sep 27 14:31:52 I'm going to be doing pretty interesting things... Sep 27 14:32:05 theres a mobile business conference happenging in amsterdam on oct 28-30, its about emerging telecoms platforms for companies with fleets/salespeople etc Sep 27 14:32:20 i think it would be great to have maemo representitive there Sep 27 14:32:24 ppman: Like what? Sep 27 14:32:26 http://blog.ecomm.ec/ecomm-amsterdam-2009-1/ Sep 27 14:32:36 so whoever in the council gets in - follow up on it Sep 27 14:32:37 so your going? Sep 27 14:32:52 zerojay: I realize it would be a ton of work, but I was considering trying to bring it to other devices Sep 27 14:32:53 Ugh.. don't even want to think about Amsterdam right now. Sep 27 14:32:58 i heard about it through tinker_it offering a seat Sep 27 14:33:05 im not even sure what next week will bring tho Sep 27 14:33:17 ppman: so you're trying to reinvent Mer? Sep 27 14:33:18 but i think maemo should be a part of it Sep 27 14:33:26 getting some bespoke apps on this platform will be vital Sep 27 14:33:28 I am a somewhat-active developer of android for the HTC kaiser, and since the whole google legal mess, we're looking in other directions. Sep 27 14:33:39 javispedro: mer? Sep 27 14:33:45 ppman: http://wiki.maemo.org/Mer Sep 27 14:34:20 I have never heard of that... it's an interesting starting point. Sep 27 14:34:44 penguinbait, it would be good for one of us to go and offer maemo.org services to bring together devs and get their apps built Sep 27 14:34:51 how does it compare to the regular maemo releases? Sep 27 14:34:53 this kind of bespoke work was what i did for years Sep 27 14:34:56 ppman: true. They have ported the Maemo platform libraries to quite a few devices (SmartQ comes to mind) Sep 27 14:35:02 well - i wrote the apps Sep 27 14:35:08 but i didnt get involved in business side Sep 27 14:35:19 to target specific apps? Sep 27 14:35:29 yeah Sep 27 14:35:54 get a few devs together to build their roaming software side using maemo platform Sep 27 14:36:08 should get us some cash Sep 27 14:36:27 couldnt suggest it before cos maemo wasnt really a mobile platform Sep 27 14:36:36 javispedro: this definitely looks very nice... Sep 27 14:36:40 but having solid connectivity and data entry stuff would be cool Sep 27 14:36:46 ie camera Sep 27 14:36:53 think it would scale down to either QVGA (preferred) or hvga (we can emulate)? Sep 27 14:36:59 and most importantly - customization - this platform thrives with it Sep 27 14:37:07 we had it on 640x480 Sep 27 14:37:23 so regular vga Sep 27 14:37:37 Man I just want to get one of things in my hands, I feel slightly disappointed in the new device, but have been trying to stay positive until I can review for myself Sep 27 14:37:41 I think our screen emulation breaks trying to go that high Sep 27 14:37:57 320x480 is small but new desktop may go that low.. Sep 27 14:38:07 we're from 800x480 world so Sep 27 14:38:21 lucky you... :P Sep 27 14:38:34 desktop should scale though Sep 27 14:38:36 so no chance of native 320x240? Sep 27 14:38:44 penguinbait: which device? Sep 27 14:38:49 no idea how apps would react Sep 27 14:38:55 give it a try? Sep 27 14:38:56 n900 Sep 27 14:39:10 ah... well, it is a phone, not a tablet Sep 27 14:39:11 Stskeeps: sure.. Sep 27 14:39:27 so, I guess one should use S60 as comparison point rather than N8x0 Sep 27 14:39:45 that was one of the main problems with android on 320x240 - all the apps were built for 320x480... that's why we built the screen stretch code... Sep 27 14:39:48 ppman: easy way; grab VMDK version, tell virtualbox to use your reso and see how it works Sep 27 14:40:06 or try with Xephyr Sep 27 14:40:16 RST38h: problem is I personally don't expect any other "tablet" soon. Then again i'm a pessimist :) Sep 27 14:40:20 I would NEVER buy a nokia phone again, I swore that long ago Sep 27 14:40:36 penguinbait: lol. I did the same a decade ago iirc. Sep 27 14:40:36 penguinbait, its an internet tablet with a phone app Sep 27 14:40:36 RST38h: Gotta disagree with you. Tablet with phone functions. Sep 27 14:40:39 But the n900 is not a normal nokia phone, its running maemo Sep 27 14:41:05 * ppman will buy a n900 if it gets 850/1900MHz 3g... Sep 27 14:41:06 zerojay: I will abstain from arguing until after the summit Sep 27 14:41:09 penguinbait: Get your hands on one and I think you'll see a lot of your disappointment disappearing quick, like me. Sep 27 14:41:13 hey ppman Sep 27 14:41:15 I agree lcuk, I am a little concerned about the screen size of the tablet Sep 27 14:41:20 ppman: #mer's open for all discussion :) Sep 27 14:41:24 I think so zj Sep 27 14:41:24 i thought i would be worried Sep 27 14:41:28 i draw on everything Sep 27 14:41:28 penguinbait: but the screenshots indicate that a lot of effort went into making it behave like S60 Sep 27 14:41:32 it very quickly fades Sep 27 14:41:34 Meh, screen size isn't the problem. Battery life might be. Sep 27 14:41:40 Agreed. Sep 27 14:41:51 javispedro: Nokia isn't the only ompany producing tablets. Also, we have seen the netbook from nokia, so why not the tablet... Sep 27 14:41:55 was just commenting onat the Android thread on LWN Sep 27 14:42:04 how did everyone get devices? Sep 27 14:42:14 not everyone got devices Sep 27 14:42:18 penguinbait: a conspiracy covering all aspects of government Sep 27 14:42:18 zerojay, some markets see picking up laptop and trying to take a photo with it as clumsy Sep 27 14:42:19 penguinbait: they're whores Sep 27 14:42:30 penguinbait: a single X-Files episody would not cover enough of this conspiracy Sep 27 14:42:32 lcuk: Haha. Sep 27 14:42:34 i like the way it was handled this time Sep 27 14:42:38 they sold their souls Sep 27 14:42:38 we would need two or thrww season arcs. Sep 27 14:42:38 quietly Sep 27 14:42:41 perhaps I pissed off Quim one to many times ;) Sep 27 14:42:50 penguinbait: You have to sacrifice a virgin to the Baphomet and then serve as Satan's enema for 66 days Sep 27 14:43:03 penguinbait: Device programme will have more info at summit, AIUI Sep 27 14:43:16 Yeah.. getting past day 44 was a toughie, but it's all downhill from there. Sep 27 14:43:20 penguinbait: There is a quiet effort to get as many user-facing apps in Extras for launch as possible Sep 27 14:43:35 Mostly involving big sticks and small carrots Sep 27 14:43:54 Jaffa, this is a great idea, as they have always done this backwards in the past Sep 27 14:43:57 * pupnik_ knows what his present for quim will be Sep 27 14:44:04 and large whips Sep 27 14:44:27 day 44 heh Sep 27 14:44:32 i personally think government intervention to restrict access to bacon would be a better way to get app development moving Sep 27 14:45:03 * lcuk makes a cheat version of grid location Sep 27 14:45:08 i personally think government intervention to ensure distribution to all would be best Sep 27 14:45:10 Annoying: Error org.freedesktop.DBus.Error.ServiceUnknown: The name com.nokia.osso_browser was not provided by any .service files Sep 27 14:45:22 i personally think government intervention to ensure distribution of bacon to all would be best Sep 27 14:45:38 penguin: send the marines!!! Sep 27 14:45:45 SOCIALISM! Sep 27 14:45:46 it would, but people would be busy eating and have greasy fingerprints on their n810s Sep 27 14:45:46 lol Sep 27 14:45:55 The marines all have breast cancer Sep 27 14:46:18 http://www.salem-news.com/articles/september262009/lejeune_breast_cancer_9-26-09.php Sep 27 14:46:25 penguinbait: That's what happens when your hazing ritual involves directly pinning medals to each other's chests. Ouch. Sep 27 14:46:30 :( every area of the world has problems like that, theres nothing we as tablets users can do in a short time Sep 27 14:46:34 didnt even know men could get breast cancer? Sep 27 14:46:49 unless we get them on prescription Sep 27 14:47:53 I called the police last night, a guy was breaking into the drug store next to my house about 2am Sep 27 14:48:06 how did you call whilst breaking a window? Sep 27 14:48:07 He's in jail now Sep 27 14:48:17 good for you! Sep 27 14:48:31 and him Sep 27 14:48:40 It was bullet proof glass, he was trying to smash a block through it, making lots of noise Sep 27 14:49:00 it just kept bouncing off Sep 27 14:49:02 doh Sep 27 14:49:16 ive seen a vid where they throw bricks at windows and knock each other out Sep 27 14:49:53 that was my fun for the day, I was all out of breath calling 911 Sep 27 14:49:54 heh Sep 27 14:51:14 looks like voting will get extended until Monday night Sep 27 14:51:14 hah Sep 27 14:51:23 how are you gonna cope swimming across the atlantic Sep 27 14:51:38 cool, then vote lcuk :D Sep 27 14:51:40 <----- is a good swimmer Sep 27 14:51:51 lots of floating on my back Sep 27 14:51:52 i think sharks are better Sep 27 14:52:09 No shark catching this penguin ;) Sep 27 14:52:14 penguinbait: Source? Sep 27 14:52:22 2 different movies Sep 27 14:52:23 http://www.break.com/index/brick-hits-theif-in-face.html http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ekIKNt5rZAg Sep 27 14:52:42 http://talk.maemo.org/showpost.php?p=334724&postcount=4 Sep 27 14:52:51 qgil: pong from Dave. He will be at home soon. He mentioned in SMS that extending the period to Monday night might be the best fix. Sep 27 14:53:04 seems fair to me Sep 27 14:53:42 heh. Sep 27 14:56:47 Who came up with this idea of using 48x48 icons for the new app manager? Sep 27 14:57:18 And who came up with the idea of reusing XB-Maemo-Icon-26 for it? Sep 27 14:57:20 * javispedro hides Sep 27 14:57:37 hey! it was you come to think of it! Sep 27 14:58:02 Jaffa, someone who wanted an easy way to downgrade Sep 27 14:58:09 but who didnt think of the consequences Sep 27 14:58:13 * javispedro votes for breaking all binary and source compatibility NOW at one month left for release. Sep 27 14:58:15 errr upgrade Sep 27 14:58:25 Poor planning originally, should've just been XB-Maemo-Icon ;-) Sep 27 14:58:34 how do you know when release is due Sep 27 14:58:42 lcuk: i don't. wild guess :) Sep 27 14:59:46 Jaffa: Javis did ;) Sep 27 14:59:51 i wonder if you will get black helicopters lol Sep 27 14:59:58 Jaffa: But that was actually ok, least disturbance Sep 27 15:00:20 My problem is that I had 26/40/64 icons and will now render the 48 one Sep 27 15:00:42 fortunately 48x48 is a more standard size Sep 27 15:02:02 javis: Not for Maemo =) Sep 27 15:02:07 can't it just automagically calculate iicon size from field length? Sep 27 15:02:18 assuming icon is square Sep 27 15:02:40 slonopotamus: It does. Sep 27 15:03:05 Jaffa, does it scale? Sep 27 15:03:09 Ha! We now one more day to finish up taking over the council for life! Sep 27 15:03:13 slonopotamus: Diablo's HAM will downscale a 48x48 icon to 26x26 for rendering. Fremantle's HAM will downsample a 64x64 icon for rendering at 48x48. Neither will upscale. Sep 27 15:03:18 Keep the working man down! Sep 27 15:03:23 slono: But how many different icons can be there? Sep 27 15:03:57 RST38h, just one. put 256x256 there and be happy :) Sep 27 15:04:02 General: Deploy the Doomsday Weapon NOW Sep 27 15:04:06 GeneralAntilles: Quick, let's create a Mer section (which I can't do, as I'm not a mod); and then rename Mer whilst Stskeeps isn't looking. Just to serve everyone right. Then, we can take control of maemo.org and keep being berated for life! Woohoo! Sep 27 15:04:15 RST38h: I'm saving it for later Sep 27 15:04:16 slono: Bitmaps scale up/down badly Sep 27 15:04:18 Let's rename it N900! Sep 27 15:04:25 * RST38h screams SVG! and hides Sep 27 15:04:26 I've got to put it off for a day now Sep 27 15:04:35 (remembering what SVG support has done to S60) Sep 27 15:04:39 RST38h, then throw it away and usr svg Sep 27 15:04:45 s/usr/use/ Sep 27 15:04:46 slonopotamus meant: RST38h, then throw it away and use svg Sep 27 15:04:54 screaming “SVG!” might be a little weird Sep 27 15:05:18 Corsac, vector graphics can't be 'weird' Sep 27 15:05:36 slono: performance problems Sep 27 15:05:53 RST38h, ... Sep 27 15:05:53 slono: When S60e3 started using svg, the ui slowed down to a crawl Sep 27 15:06:25 adopt the Haiku icon format. Sep 27 15:06:29 fsck /dev/hands Sep 27 15:06:40 GeneralAntilles: lol Sep 27 15:06:49 RST38h: Everyone should add a gtk-icon-cache-svg-prerender to the end of their postinsts. That'd save it Sep 27 15:07:02 Jaffa: Yea, I guess so Sep 27 15:07:20 slonopotamus: screaming consonnes is Sep 27 15:07:33 Of course, I'd rather the system did things like that (and the other things we have to do), automatically. Especially since the existing approach has always been a bit buggy Sep 27 15:08:25 svg is heavywegith Sep 27 15:08:34 Jaffa: that svg-prerender is quite a nice idea Sep 27 15:08:36 especailly cos people expect mini monal lisas to work Sep 27 15:08:44 lcuk: Indeed Sep 27 15:08:46 and what I am doing at debian package build time with some programs Sep 27 15:08:52 god my typing is awful Sep 27 15:09:04 i need a secretary Sep 27 15:09:06 javispedro: lcuk's right though - a 256x256 SVG has to be carefully designed to look reasonable at 26x26 (although 48x48 gives more room) Sep 27 15:09:21 or pa Sep 27 15:09:29 damn i shouldv gone to london fashion week Sep 27 15:09:32 Jaffa: true. but then, I have mini svg versions (for rendering up until 24x24) Sep 27 15:09:43 and normal svg versions for rest of sizes. Sep 27 15:09:48 javispedro: Good plan Sep 27 15:10:07 still, mini look a bit weird, but with such a high DPI... Sep 27 15:10:29 svg needs quality rendering Sep 27 15:10:46 liqbase manages it - alter the level of detail based on size Sep 27 15:11:05 Jaffa, '256X256 svg' doesn't make sense Sep 27 15:11:07 ie, dont waste tonnes of time rendering pretty pretty in 12*12 Sep 27 15:11:19 slonopotamus, you can base your svg on an idealsize Sep 27 15:11:30 it makes sense to actually Sep 27 15:12:01 scaling svg is similar to font hinting Sep 27 15:12:02 slonopotamus: I know (although, you can provide size hints in the root node). But I was primarily using it as a shortcut for "an SVG file designed to look reasonable when rendered at 256x256px at a 'normal' PPI screen [..." Sep 27 15:12:39 Jaffa, nits have far from normal ppi Sep 27 15:12:46 jaffa, hows your dayjob release coming along Sep 27 15:13:42 actually those icons just introduce one more pain at repackaging. Sep 27 15:14:04 always Sep 27 15:14:11 packaging IS a pain Sep 27 15:14:37 lcuk, in maemo? :) Sep 27 15:14:45 in general lol Sep 27 15:14:59 but at least on windows i have a nice gui and autoscanner available Sep 27 15:15:11 lcuk: Release done. Public announcement on Thursday (http://www.chpconsulting.com/) Sep 27 15:15:40 slonopotamus: Yeah, but either way - the icon is being shown at 26x26 (or 48x48) on /that/ PPI scren Sep 27 15:15:40 good :) Sep 27 15:16:02 lcuk, you're forcing me to go offtopic :) Sep 27 15:16:14 not really Sep 27 15:16:21 lcuk, packaging isn't hard in gentoo Sep 27 15:16:22 just pointing out that its "easier" elsewhere Sep 27 15:16:39 lo konttori Sep 27 15:17:11 hey konttori Sep 27 15:17:36 argh Sep 27 15:17:39 * lcuk is being followed by magicbacon Sep 27 15:17:57 i forgot, who wrote pygtkeditor? Sep 27 15:18:27 khertan is principle guy Sep 27 15:18:58 right Sep 27 15:19:14 2.4.3-1 is totally broken Sep 27 15:19:14 and hes not here lol Sep 27 15:19:17 whats the boggle Sep 27 15:19:20 yikes Sep 27 15:19:22 which platform Sep 27 15:19:25 and whats up Sep 27 15:20:34 'GtkWidget.remove_mnemonic_label() takes exactly 1 argument (0 given)' on any file open Sep 27 15:22:34 how i downgrade it now? Sep 27 15:23:04 yikes Sep 27 15:23:05 just a mo Sep 27 15:23:08 are you on diablo Sep 27 15:23:36 in context of pygtkeditor - yep Sep 27 15:23:44 http://repository.maemo.org/extras-devel/pool/diablo/free/p/pygtkeditor/ Sep 27 15:23:52 i think you can specify version from apt somehow too Sep 27 15:23:54 how i tell apt-get to install specific version? Sep 27 15:23:56 but i dunno Sep 27 15:24:12 someone else will know Sep 27 15:24:14 hey guys.. Sep 27 15:24:21 apt-get install package=version Sep 27 15:24:21 slonopotamus: apt-get install package=version Sep 27 15:24:24 heh. Sep 27 15:24:27 ah, = Sep 27 15:24:31 * lcuk smiles Sep 27 15:24:34 ta Sep 27 15:24:53 qwerty12_N810, thanks Sep 27 15:25:07 slonopotamus, and happily the directory list i pointed to shows all versions Sep 27 15:25:31 do you have to uninstall the old one first Sep 27 15:25:36 lcuk: no Sep 27 15:25:36 lcuk, apt-get is easier :) Sep 27 15:25:37 or will asking for a specific do it for you Sep 27 15:25:50 easier but more hidden as to the usage Sep 27 15:26:06 its like blind dialing Sep 27 15:26:23 gimme a gui and let me decide slowly Sep 27 15:26:57 apt-cache policy to list available versions, then apt-get install with specific version. the only thing i forgot was '=' separator Sep 27 15:27:10 the UI on the phone system in work is awful in this regard - you press numbers and function keys, but the entire device times out after 5 seconds and resets to front menu Sep 27 15:27:44 so i am forever typing half a number, looking over at the rest and then getting back and its gone Sep 27 15:27:51 lol. Sep 27 15:27:53 * lcuk rages often bout daft things like that Sep 27 15:27:59 * javispedro sends death rays to whoever decided that Sep 27 15:28:20 * lcuk nods Sep 27 15:28:31 what does that? Sep 27 15:28:42 physical phone system at work Sep 27 15:28:46 lol Sep 27 15:29:02 * lcuk wont miss it Sep 27 15:29:07 3 days to go! Sep 27 15:29:27 * lcuk is really crapping pants Sep 27 15:29:42 but i still dont like the phone Sep 27 15:29:50 Lcuk: oh, you have work now, congrats) Sep 27 15:30:04 no wazd, i have the end of my notice period Sep 27 15:30:53 * lcuk will have to put his energies to job hunting in 3 days Sep 27 15:31:01 what's the difference between gconf schemas and gconf defaults (i mean, i can put defaults in both)? where can I read more about that? Sep 27 15:31:02 well - non maemo job hunting Sep 27 15:33:45 javis: Schema defines the tree structure Sep 27 15:33:57 javis: And MAY (but does not have to) contain the defaults Sep 27 15:34:22 RST38h: so its just a way to separate them, and nothing more? Sep 27 15:34:27 guess so Sep 27 15:34:39 i'm thinking about how to handle diablo defaults and fremantle defaults Sep 27 15:36:14 aw Sep 27 15:36:20 n810 doesn't have update-gconf-defaults Sep 27 15:36:29 thus I guess i was wasting my time :P Sep 27 15:38:16 are the bluez dbus methods available somewhere? Sep 27 15:38:43 Yay! It's working from both Facebook *and* Twitter. Sep 27 15:38:49 Any deb packaging experts here? Sep 27 15:38:53 I wanted to get wiicontrol updated to fremantle, but fremantle has apparently (surprise surprise ) an API break in there. Sep 27 15:39:18 Picture for Gary Birkett is [http://a3.twimg.com/profile_images/106703019/lcuk_avatar_normal.jpg] Sep 27 15:39:20 konttori, mmm we have accelerometer built in ;) Sep 27 15:39:22 ^^^ lcuk :) Sep 27 15:39:24 Updating photo for Gary Birkett Sep 27 15:39:41 o rly Sep 27 15:39:44 which did u have before Sep 27 15:39:57 lcuk: Accelerometers do suck for classic gaming =( Sep 27 15:40:11 lcuk: none :) Sep 27 15:40:15 lcuk: I was looking for drnoksnes to be useful with wiicontroller Sep 27 15:40:26 konttori: That'd be cool Sep 27 15:40:27 thats what keesj's nbutton push! project is for Sep 27 15:40:37 as then I could just hook up my n900 to my projector and continue gaming on there. Sep 27 15:40:44 konttori: :) btw, I remember not getting any keypress while pressing the wiimote B button Sep 27 15:40:52 solution: buy more n900s Sep 27 15:40:52 also, we could easily have 2 player gaming that way Sep 27 15:40:54 does that ring any bell or is me being an stupid :P ? Sep 27 15:40:57 console AND controllers ;) Sep 27 15:41:08 javispedro: that's easy to fix. Sep 27 15:41:18 * RST38h needs to know if the "debian/files" file needs to be present Sep 27 15:41:28 Or if it is created automagically when packaging Sep 27 15:41:29 the buttons were handled as key press events, but they could be ported to be kb down, kb up events as well Sep 27 15:41:40 RST38h: created by some of the late stage dh_somethings Sep 27 15:41:47 javis: Goooooooooooooood Sep 27 15:41:47 I *think* direction buttons already worked like that Sep 27 15:42:00 konttori: Up/Down is of course more preferable Sep 27 15:42:12 konttori: an't do much with keypresses in gaming Sep 27 15:42:23 o_O Sep 27 15:42:37 Perfect. Happy day for Hermes. Sep 27 15:43:19 I'll have to test again. Sep 27 15:43:57 what'd you get, Jaffa Sep 27 15:47:39 konttori, http://maemo.org/api_refs/5.0/beta/bluez/ Sep 27 15:47:47 thanks Sep 27 15:48:15 konttori, I'm not a bluez guru, but can give you some tips, if you need ;) Sep 27 15:51:20 VDVsx: thanks. Is ListDevices the same as the old DiscoverDevices? Sep 27 15:53:02 pupnik_: Lots of photos in Contacts. Now just to do birthdays and a quick GUI. Sep 27 15:54:48 konttori, yes, if you are referring to Adapter -> ListDevices Sep 27 15:54:57 yeah Sep 27 15:55:08 So nice of them to rename the method Sep 27 15:56:16 Why does set OSNAME=Maemo5;echo $OSNAME prints empty string??? Sep 27 15:56:52 $OïÿSNAME ? Sep 27 15:57:02 I would guess the ïÿ between O and S in OSNAME ;) Sep 27 15:57:06 $ set OSNAME=Maemo5; echo $OSNAME --> WORKSFORME Sep 27 15:57:26 hum Sep 27 15:57:37 ash doesn't like set though. Sep 27 15:57:42 konttori, almost everything d-bus related changed in bluez4 :( Sep 27 15:57:44 so just drop it. Sep 27 15:58:40 crap Sep 27 16:00:10 derf,ShadowJK: typo, it was $OSNAME, still did not work Sep 27 16:00:19 konttori, there's a couple of useful python test scripts using the all API inside the bluez tarball, may be handy if you are using python ;) Sep 27 16:00:32 RST38h: What shell? Sep 27 16:00:38 derf: let us say bash Sep 27 16:00:44 (same in sh, but with less diagnostics) Sep 27 16:01:10 RST38h: You want "export". Sep 27 16:02:09 Or drop "set" and just do the assignment. Sep 27 16:02:16 derf: Understood Sep 27 16:03:26 VDVsx: thanks. And yeah. I am. Just need to take care of the baby at the same time, so can do probably 3 lines of change tonight. Sep 27 16:04:42 konttori, good luck then ;) Sep 27 16:05:08 thanks. I think the equivalent to old discoverdevices is startdiscovery Sep 27 16:10:21 konttori, yeah, you are right, misread :(, the other one is to find the devices that you have plugged in your system, in Bluez4 you need to specify the path of the device you want to use Sep 27 16:11:48 one line in the bluez3 turns into something like this in bluez4: Sep 27 16:11:49 manager = dbus.Interface(self.bus.get_object("org.bluez", "/"),"org.bluez.Manager") Sep 27 16:11:50 path = manager.DefaultAdapter() Sep 27 16:11:50 adapter = dbus.Interface(self.bus.get_object("org.bluez", path),"org.bluez.Adapter") Sep 27 16:12:58 derf: Yea, it worked. Thanks! Sep 27 16:13:10 Yer welcome. Sep 27 16:13:30 set with no option flags, in bash, is used for setting positional parameters. Sep 27 16:13:42 (e.g., $1, $2, etc.) Sep 27 16:18:40 unixSnob - I like it Sep 27 16:19:38 Hmmmm...Weird Sep 27 16:20:02 deb packager always creates *_armel.deb file for me Sep 27 16:20:05 no matter what I do Sep 27 16:20:14 where does _armel come from? Sep 27 16:20:38 I gave up trying to figure out the Debian package manager. Sep 27 16:20:48 RST38h: from the arch Sep 27 16:21:18 RST38h: debian/contron Sep 27 16:21:21 RST38h: debian/control Sep 27 16:21:24 "You are in a dark, nested hierarchy of undocumented scripts, all alike." Sep 27 16:21:40 You're eaten by a grue, no matter what man page you read. Sep 27 16:21:42 undocumented scripts? Sep 27 16:25:28 evening all Sep 27 16:25:46 hi lardman Sep 27 16:25:53 hi javispedro Sep 27 16:26:21 javis, Corsac: which field? Sep 27 16:26:42 RST38h: file debian/control, search for "Architecture" Sep 27 16:26:45 afaik it comes from the dpkg architecture :) Sep 27 16:27:02 a Sep 27 16:27:03 (check the output of dpkg-architecture) Sep 27 16:27:20 i misunderstood the problem I guess. Sep 27 16:29:54 is voting still down? Sep 27 16:30:39 javis: Ack. Sep 27 16:31:39 lbt, Dave fixed it. Sep 27 16:31:47 cool Sep 27 16:32:50 Eldar needs to grow up. Sep 27 16:33:45 Not only him though Sep 27 16:34:01 quite a funny thread Sep 27 16:34:24 Would be funnier if it weren't so pathetic. Sep 27 16:34:24 http://talk.maemo.org/showpost.php?p=334767&postcount=505 Sep 27 16:34:26 wtf is going up there Sep 27 16:34:29 page 49 is awful Sep 27 16:34:31 I mean, really, get over yourself. Sep 27 16:35:24 close the fscking thread already. page 49 reminds me of certain EA games forum. Sep 27 16:35:57 why don't lolcats in the next page surprise me? Sep 27 16:38:29 pathetic is fine Sep 27 16:38:30 GeneralAntilles: What I posted to that thread isn't towards you, btw Sep 27 16:38:37 as long as it is funny Sep 27 16:39:18 zerojay, lies! You're out to get me and I know it! Sep 27 16:39:22 lol Sep 27 16:39:34 The maemo gestapo. Sep 27 16:39:37 lol Sep 27 16:39:42 RST38h, unfortunately I can't help but get sinking feelings about the wider ramifications. Sep 27 16:40:19 heh. true. Sep 27 16:40:51 well. this is what we get. Sep 27 16:42:30 * javispedro wonders if the usual "well, grab the source and fix it yourself" std answer will work now Sep 27 16:42:39 {{sofixit}} Sep 27 16:44:04 General: Like "99% of everything is shit"? Sep 27 16:44:51 javis: Actually, the correct answer is "Eldar, if you have such high expectations of Maemo, why not post your concrete ideas on Brainstorm?" Sep 27 16:44:57 RST38h, like, "this prick is now going to go spread around how much he thinks we suck" Sep 27 16:44:59 I thought I was 98% water, not I need to re-evaluate my world? Sep 27 16:45:11 General: Ah, screw him. Sep 27 16:45:12 s/not/now Sep 27 16:45:32 penguinbait: poke your finger into it and witness how much of shit is water Sep 27 16:45:35 GeneralAntilles: Most people have pretty good moron detectors. Sep 27 16:45:38 no wait, don't Sep 27 16:45:42 penguin: just upgrade to liquishit. Sep 27 16:45:42 * jmc93739653 is away: Away Sep 27 16:45:43 GeneralAntilles: same though. Sep 27 16:45:46 Can we remove the "well respected" part from the thread at this point? Sep 27 16:45:52 lol. Sep 27 16:45:52 It helps that morons make themselves easy to spot. Sep 27 16:46:21 derf: Yes, but how ar eyou gonna dispose of the bodies? Sep 27 16:46:41 pigs Sep 27 16:46:51 find a pig farmer ;) Sep 27 16:46:59 My cousin owns a meat-packing plant. Sep 27 16:47:05 * qwerty12_N810 has an incinerator that is often used for this purpose, RST38h Sep 27 16:47:06 Eh Sep 27 16:47:09 hamburger? Sep 27 16:47:14 Myrtti, thats the first ever time i have seen you swear :O Sep 27 16:47:47 Eh? is RST Canadian? Sep 27 16:47:50 * lcuk is thankful he kept away from that thread Sep 27 16:47:51 Ok, at this moment I do not understand how people make deb packager create them a package with _fremantle0 or _chinook1 in its name Sep 27 16:47:59 penguinbait: Nope. Sep 27 16:48:02 * RST38h adopts and reuses, just like MS Sep 27 16:48:15 wow. Sep 27 16:48:22 I never though of that problem Sep 27 16:48:23 RST38h, look at how liqbase splits packaging into different pieces Sep 27 16:48:29 libs need standard + -dev etc Sep 27 16:48:32 where are you zj? Sep 27 16:48:33 lcuk: not the same problem Sep 27 16:48:40 you choose the files in each branch and there can be overlap Sep 27 16:49:00 GeneralAntilles: I've never heard of him before, and I'm sure after all this, I'll never hear of him again. lol Sep 27 16:49:09 penguinbait: Candadia. Sep 27 16:49:17 hm. sorry lcuk, yes, your suggestion is valid. Sep 27 16:49:21 * zerojay is *.ca Sep 27 16:49:21 well Sep 27 16:49:21 I know CA, but where Sep 27 16:49:25 Oh. Sep 27 16:49:27 GeneralAntilles, then its the communities job to show him its not Sep 27 16:49:30 Damn typos. Sep 27 16:49:33 lcuk, no, it's not. Sep 27 16:49:37 not by waffling on a thread Sep 27 16:49:37 only if you can build multiple versions inside the same sbox.. Sep 27 16:49:38 lcuk: I just need one package Sep 27 16:49:41 which I'd guess not. Sep 27 16:49:46 I'm in Quebec City right now, though moving to Halifax to start a new office for my company in about a month. Sep 27 16:49:46 but by seeing and feeling and using and interacting with device Sep 27 16:49:56 Gentlemen, you worry too much about a simple hack, even a notorious one. Sep 27 16:49:56 RST38h, you said 2 packages from same source Sep 27 16:50:05 lcuk: it's part of the Ubuntu IRC indoctrination Sep 27 16:50:12 lcuk: in reality I swear like a pirate Sep 27 16:50:15 2 packages which need diferent sbox target. Sep 27 16:50:21 He liked Maemo. Then he went on a sponsored trip to Korea, liked sponsored trips and now he dismisses Maemo. Sep 27 16:50:21 Hi. I have an N810 and have a problem with updates (because I am both ignorant and cursed with regard to Linux package management!). Is this the right place to come for help? Sep 27 16:50:24 Qole's in BC right? Sep 27 16:50:26 ahhh to get your pass, you are placed in random chans lol Sep 27 16:50:50 im quite certain hes not a time traveller Sep 27 16:51:08 When pressed for details, he first says that Maemo is "unstable", then quickly turns to the lack of portrait mode and MMS, and he is currently bitching about missing voice control and Java Sep 27 16:51:10 RST38h: I'd say the only way is to dch -v into the choosen "version" then build. Sep 27 16:51:20 ohgod Sep 27 16:51:21 javis: Oh Sep 27 16:51:35 didnt someone say the thing he found unstable was 3g calls on korean 3g networks? Sep 27 16:51:35 RST38h: i don't know how the rest of non-free packages do it, sorry Sep 27 16:51:42 frals: Yea, he said Sep 27 16:51:47 * GeneralAntilles just deleted everything in his mailbox more than 1 day old. Sep 27 16:51:48 penguinbait: I'm not sure, but I think so. Sep 27 16:51:59 javis: I do not even know how free packages do it...weird Sep 27 16:52:07 RST38h: I do not. Sep 27 16:52:14 since the autobuilder classifies them in the right repo Sep 27 16:52:17 ah Sep 27 16:52:28 so you get really 3 packages with the same name and same version Sep 27 16:52:52 and you pray nobody pulls the fremantle package from the fremantle repo into a n810 ;) Sep 27 16:52:54 frals: But then, my S60e3 E70 reboots every time I try using GPRS at a certain spot of the road to work Sep 27 16:53:17 the government is on to you Sep 27 16:53:18 nice feature ;) Sep 27 16:53:20 frals: Probably a pair of faulty ground stations or something. So, what's new? Sep 27 16:53:31 so where is a good place for Maemo Summit 2010? Windsor, Toronto, Winnipeg, somewhere in the middle of CA Sep 27 16:53:50 Antarctica. Sep 27 16:54:13 oh wait, I've gone through this already :D Sep 27 16:54:17 Somalia. I need a new AK-47. Sep 27 16:54:28 Gonna be expensive to ship all the european guys over.. probably much more so than just getting us NA people across the pond. Sep 27 16:54:36 I need a pink hello kitty emp Sep 27 16:54:54 You could here to Flint, Michigan, but bring your AK-47, youll need it Sep 27 16:54:55 I think maemo should have an app for emulating it Sep 27 16:54:58 So anyhow, my problem is when I use AppManager to try to upgrade OS2008 it says "Unable to install, some required pkgs are missing". Missing pkg is "pre-installed-documentation-rx44 (= 5.4)" What does that mean and how do I fix or ignore it? Sep 27 16:55:11 like there's a gun app for iphone Sep 27 16:55:24 mcherm, go into your repository management Sep 27 16:55:36 and make sure you have the standard maemo repositories enabled Sep 27 16:55:39 and disable others Sep 27 16:55:51 just a mo, ill try to find repo list, unless someone knows Sep 27 16:56:45 murder rate here is 3x the national average Sep 27 16:56:46 Myrtti: thanks. That's the "Tools > Application Catalog" in "Application Manager" right? Sep 27 16:57:08 *blink* Sep 27 16:57:40 penguinbait: hey, that's good actually. no need to warn the police before the summit, they're already used to the high crime rates. Sep 27 16:58:13 penguinbait: wow. Do you wear kevlar? *wink* Sep 27 16:58:36 mcherm, hes just not been caught yet :O Sep 27 16:58:47 No but I can jump on the pavement quickly Sep 27 16:58:54 lcuk: LOL! Sep 27 16:59:20 Uh.. Eldar's site is http://mobile-review.ru/, right? Sep 27 16:59:22 times change. Sep 27 16:59:30 so instead of the über ogg support bug, Sep 27 16:59:36 we get the über portrait support thread. Sep 27 16:59:41 javispedro: Yeah, my city is no longer murder capital of the world. Sep 27 16:59:44 Firefox is reporting it as an attack site now. Sep 27 17:00:22 Oh, nevermind... that's not it. Sep 27 17:00:30 zerojay: I disabled that freacking list the second day Sep 27 17:00:38 *yawn* Sep 27 17:01:03 im trying to figure out how to propose MMS support as an brainstorm idea, but i find it kinda hard to put it as something more than a 1 solution idea, ie "implement it" : Sep 27 17:01:05 Myrtti, can you knit bacon Sep 27 17:01:18 lcuk: I can't even look at bacon without being sick nowadays Sep 27 17:01:28 :( Sep 27 17:01:28 apart from Jono Bacon Sep 27 17:01:32 *drool* Sep 27 17:01:34 *cough* Sep 27 17:01:37 frals: Problem: "Can't send MMS messages from N900" -- Solution: "Implement MMS support in Fremantle" Sep 27 17:01:37 What if it's taped to a cat? Sep 27 17:01:39 frals: nokia implement it from scratch, reuse mms stack from X project, community implement it from scratch. Sep 27 17:01:50 i've seen those three somewhere else Sep 27 17:01:54 frals: you could split it up Sep 27 17:01:58 is he Alf? Sep 27 17:02:09 javis: Please, make space for the "Just screw it" solution Sep 27 17:02:22 community helps me support postcards, we have a destination as a contact Sep 27 17:02:25 bish bash bosh Sep 27 17:02:46 * lcuk waves hands to the nokia network engineers who would supply the messaging api Sep 27 17:03:03 RST38h: that's actually "hands down", which I plan to do. Sep 27 17:03:08 frals: there's like.. implement parsing of sms messages for the metadata, implement WAP transport and opening up of separate APNs... implement a WML browser.. Sep 27 17:03:42 thanks for the input, :D Sep 27 17:03:49 zerojay: English version at mobile-review.com Sep 27 17:03:51 lcuk: I've been trying it again with everything disabled but the standard repo. Seems to be doing something, which is progress! Sep 27 17:04:44 * lcuk curses non trusted repositories Sep 27 17:05:11 on the other hand i think it would get more "mainstream" attention to post it as one idea, and then the actual implementation of wap transport/sms parsing could be decided later Sep 27 17:05:28 yeah, I would for now keep the thing more "high level" Sep 27 17:05:32 Ahhahaha Sep 27 17:05:34 * RST38h rotfls Sep 27 17:05:58 At the mobile-review forum, they are filing for remote device access at Nokia to find how it feels Sep 27 17:06:07 url. Sep 27 17:06:09 :P Sep 27 17:06:16 all in russian Sep 27 17:06:27 :P Sep 27 17:07:06 And they all seem to be pretty optimistic, so I guess the FUD did not quite work Sep 27 17:07:52 well. Sep 27 17:08:04 RDA rocks. Sep 27 17:08:07 good! rst, now we just need to get the rest of the local mob Sep 27 17:08:19 lcuk: yes, that worked. Thanks so much: it seems like an obvious solution but somehow I still hadn't thought of it. Sep 27 17:08:28 btw - is the messaging ui/related stuff open? Sep 27 17:08:29 * GeneralAntilles can't believe he just nuked 3000+ emails. Sep 27 17:08:50 ~lart videorate Sep 27 17:08:50 * infobot blames videorate for all the evil in the world Sep 27 17:08:59 GeneralAntilles, rly Sep 27 17:09:04 :( lardman Sep 27 17:09:09 * lcuk gets simon a bacon butty Sep 27 17:09:28 mmmm :) Sep 27 17:09:30 I can't believe it defaults to ANY instead of ALL when doing mail rulse. Sep 27 17:09:38 * GeneralAntilles <- dumb, dumb, dumb. Sep 27 17:10:07 restore the .pst file from local backup Sep 27 17:10:21 hmm, how do I build gst videorate I wonder....? Sep 27 17:10:42 video rate used to just be a setting Sep 27 17:10:46 isnt it the case Sep 27 17:11:01 the v4l2 src won't accept anything under 8fps Sep 27 17:11:41 God only knows how the Makefile is supposed to work Sep 27 17:11:43 lardman, the n810 camera didnt either Sep 27 17:11:52 yeah, this is the N800 Sep 27 17:11:57 none of them do Sep 27 17:12:13 i think its cos of the bitbucketing and over exposure issues Sep 27 17:12:20 cos at 8fps its almost a night camera Sep 27 17:12:26 anyway, libdmtx clobbers the framerate quite seriously, and as I can't work out how to drop frames, I thought using the videorate plugin would do the job Sep 27 17:12:50 ahhh in your pipeline Sep 27 17:12:53 The cameras of this sort have no shutter. They output to the SoC as they finish exposing. Sep 27 17:13:08 the edge of the rolling shutter is output to the SoC Sep 27 17:13:20 frals: Messaging is all handled by Telepathy and yes, that's all open. Sep 27 17:13:27 cool, ty Sep 27 17:13:42 Well... as far as I know anyways. I kind of wonder if the Skype plugin is or not. Sep 27 17:13:46 Annoyingly the gstreamer pipeline gets backed up Sep 27 17:13:59 you are running in 640*480? Sep 27 17:14:01 I'd have thought it would just drop frames, but no Sep 27 17:14:06 nah, 320x240 Sep 27 17:14:13 yeah Sep 27 17:14:19 thats how i ran in lb Sep 27 17:14:33 still shocked its still backing up Sep 27 17:14:33 so, if i were to post a thread about this brainstorm idea for discussion, should i put it in community, n900 or maemo5? Sep 27 17:14:39 lardman: Normally people want to _avoid_ dropping frames. Sep 27 17:14:39 is it the parse stage Sep 27 17:14:47 derf: yeah Sep 27 17:14:56 it's the libdmtx decoder which is slow Sep 27 17:15:02 c lib? Sep 27 17:15:06 yep Sep 27 17:15:09 fp too though Sep 27 17:15:13 when you send it the data Sep 27 17:15:21 can you alter the stride of the bitmap Sep 27 17:15:21 * RST38h is more interested in ICQ support for Messaging Sep 27 17:15:27 to skip alternate lines Sep 27 17:15:41 I mean, this thing may not have MMS or portrait, and nobody would give a shit Sep 27 17:15:45 perhaps, but that won't help much with a 2D barcode Sep 27 17:15:52 But if it has no support for ICQ, Russians will be severely pissed Sep 27 17:15:52 no you are right Sep 27 17:15:58 and at 320 its not really practical Sep 27 17:15:59 RST38h: Everyone that is not from Russia is not :p Sep 27 17:16:02 320x240 is already pretty small. Sep 27 17:16:09 the other option is to lower the pri of the thread it runs in Sep 27 17:16:25 derf: yeah, their code is just quite slow ~0.5/s scan Sep 27 17:16:32 yikes! Sep 27 17:16:34 and the camera is outputting 8fps Sep 27 17:16:39 lardman: Can't you just only hand it a frame when it's done scanning the last one? Sep 27 17:16:42 you need a prefilter section realistically Sep 27 17:16:59 qwerty: yea, but we are talking of eldar and people who read his russian site Sep 27 17:17:04 derf: that's what I have atm, but the thread it runs in is the same pri as the main thread, it slows everything down still Sep 27 17:17:08 I mean, what's to stop you from doing the dropping yourself? Sep 27 17:17:08 does qr have recognisable things Sep 27 17:17:19 lcuk: Yes. Sep 27 17:17:19 like standard has a white boundary and guard bars in the middle Sep 27 17:17:20 yeah QR works very nicely, and quickly, thanks derf Sep 27 17:17:34 Datamatrix is a PITA to find. Sep 27 17:17:37 something that can be scanned and checked Sep 27 17:17:43 qwerty12_N810: you managed to sort my dialog problem yet? ;) Sep 27 17:17:44 and only pass the rectangle with possible barcode in Sep 27 17:17:52 * Firebird can't determine what is being discussed but is assuming its about scanning barcodes with a camera Sep 27 17:17:59 indeed Sep 27 17:18:12 Last stupid question about packaging: Anyone has a sample postinst script for Fremantle? Sep 27 17:18:36 does anyone know about pthread priorities? Sep 27 17:18:39 RST38h, liqtorch has a pretty clean one which makes sure icon etc is there Sep 27 17:18:53 OK, now Reggie needs to close the thread. Sep 27 17:18:56 lcuk: pastebin? =) Sep 27 17:19:01 lardman: why do you think I'd be able to sort it? Besides, having a fun (read: shitter of a) time with GObject... Sep 27 17:19:10 RST38h: fremantle should just need gtk-update-icon-cache and that's about it. Sep 27 17:19:12 RST38h: To do what exactly? Sep 27 17:19:16 It's funny that he things the nutjobs that came swarming out of the woodwork to comment in that thread are the most active ones. Sep 27 17:19:19 I thought you may have chanced upon the problem... ;) Sep 27 17:19:27 solution even! Sep 27 17:19:33 GeneralAntilles, what thread Sep 27 17:19:40 http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?p=334800#post334800 Sep 27 17:19:53 oh Sep 27 17:19:56 RST38h, http://github.com/lcuk/liqbase-playground/blob/master/liqpostcard/debian/postinst Sep 27 17:20:07 Good riddance to bad rubbish. Sep 27 17:20:08 thanks =) Sep 27 17:20:11 GeneralAntilles: kill the thread! Sep 27 17:20:19 General: I do suggest archiving it Sep 27 17:20:34 I would plainly delete it, but they would just recreate it. Sep 27 17:20:38 hold on Sep 27 17:20:40 General: Eldar has been spilling so much crap there that it is a shame to lose all this possible blackmail material =) Sep 27 17:20:41 that shouldnt work Sep 27 17:20:56 http://github.com/lcuk/liqbase-playground/blob/master/debian/postinst Sep 27 17:21:01 thats a more filled up one Sep 27 17:21:09 with lots of checks and a working icon install bit Sep 27 17:21:15 thanks to qwerty the great Sep 27 17:21:18 lcuk: but you're doing quite a chunk of work Sep 27 17:21:34 a typical app does need only the icon cache call. Sep 27 17:21:38 lcuk: This isn't sufficient :( I also need to update mime types etc Sep 27 17:21:47 ahhh RST38h Sep 27 17:21:49 clear gconf entries too Sep 27 17:21:50 even more stuff Sep 27 17:22:04 RST38h: that would be prerm? Sep 27 17:22:08 or postrm purge Sep 27 17:22:34 RST38h: Your Diablo postinst should suffice; just make sure you don't call maemo-select-menu-location anymore Sep 27 17:23:03 what a cool picture. http://www.motivatedphotos.com/?id=40100 Sep 27 17:24:32 random questions: thread priorities are higher with lower numerical values? Sep 27 17:24:51 yes Sep 27 17:24:55 ok Sep 27 17:24:59 RST38h, analyst's could do with some accountability. Sep 27 17:25:14 well I'll try chopping 1 off the current thread pri and see if that improves matters Sep 27 17:25:15 bbiam Sep 27 17:27:18 General: He is a hack, first of all Sep 27 17:27:49 General: Of course he calls himself "analyst", but that is like a whore calling herself "geisha" Sep 27 17:28:58 True. Sep 27 17:29:04 But I've yet to see an analyst who isn't a hack. Sep 27 17:29:18 That too :) Sep 27 17:30:04 Analysts: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Itanium_Sales_Forecasts_edit.png Sep 27 17:30:05 need some input on this; Brainstorm MMS Support http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=32129 Sep 27 17:30:13 good/bad/go back to bed? ;) Sep 27 17:30:16 Ah, the Itanic Sep 27 17:30:47 frals, need to find somebody with some technical information. Sep 27 17:30:47 heh. Sep 27 17:31:17 People who know how MMS work have all ben institutionalized by now Sep 27 17:31:22 frals: having worked on some mms related stuff, let nokia do it :D.. or find someone willing to lose their brains Sep 27 17:31:28 Depression, panic attacks, paranoia Sep 27 17:31:37 So, it is all legacy code now =) Sep 27 17:31:43 * Myrtti yawns Sep 27 17:32:00 lol Sep 27 17:32:09 yeah i looked at the spec the other day, and i really understood why they didnt do it right away, if ever :P Sep 27 17:32:35 RST38h, Well, it starts by people wondering "How to get internets on phone lol?", someone suggested "Maybe we could take a subset of html?", then a comittee said "stfu noob, we must design an entirely new mobile internet, no HTML allowed!", then the comittee began their work in creating a new http and html, that wouldn't be http and html. Sep 27 17:32:39 I say we go to a psychriatric hospital, find someone to code the mms app, the run it under a nobody chroot. Sep 27 17:32:48 for extra brain safety. Sep 27 17:33:32 I got wiicontrol working on n900 (yay!) Sep 27 17:33:37 ShadowJK: yeh blows a lot. 5th edition does interpret html as mms root/body tho Sep 27 17:33:49 konttori: that was fast. Sep 27 17:33:57 ..with the fucking 'services' browser but anyhow Sep 27 17:33:58 * javispedro looks at time ... ohmy Sep 27 17:34:10 yeah. I dropped the bluez code and used the bluetooth lib code instead. Sep 27 17:34:31 as I had no clue where to find proper examples on how to use bluez. Sep 27 17:34:44 (for the simple task of listing available devices) Sep 27 17:34:51 konttori: cool :D Sep 27 17:36:09 frals: so, you are actually trying to get mms support up and running. Great! Sep 27 17:37:08 frals: it would be adequate mms support if it just managed to show attached images Sep 27 17:37:21 yeah, im gonna go mental from the abuse all iphone users are gonna lay on me after making fun of them not being able to send mms.. :D Sep 27 17:37:31 frals: if you try to implement everything you'd go mad as everyone done some stuff differently it seems Sep 27 17:37:34 important part is to get the cellular level working. Rest is trivial Sep 27 17:38:04 glass: yeah, could probably add that as a solution, just do the imagestuff at first.. but once the gsm/lowlevel stuff is done i think the other stuff isnt to complicated? Sep 27 17:38:20 konttori, what about slideshows and polyphonic background music! Sep 27 17:38:24 ;) Sep 27 17:38:29 INTERESTING: looks like you no longer need to update icon cache Sep 27 17:38:40 * ShadowJK would've thought the other stuff would be the most complicated part Sep 27 17:39:04 RST38h: yes. because it won't work even if you do. Sep 27 17:39:06 lol Sep 27 17:39:08 frals: well the other stuff i'm referring to is formatting the message, timing of things in it and that. i guess it's trivial, if one just selects one phone or such to clone from whats relevant Sep 27 17:39:10 RST38h: Try installing a few things and watch the inconsistency that appears... Sep 27 17:39:17 there was an icon bug mentioned here not much ago Sep 27 17:39:21 hopefully it was fixed. Sep 27 17:39:47 I guess I only count establishing IP connectivity as lowlevel Sep 27 17:40:12 hmm, time to go hunting for some open source mms implementation for a phone... Sep 27 17:40:23 hehe Sep 27 17:40:35 frals, or opensource WAP transport or browser? Sep 27 17:41:14 yeah, pretty much all of that, but im hoping if someone has done the one they got resources/links for the others as well :D Sep 27 17:41:29 Opera has a WAP browser, but it does it over http afaik :) Sep 27 17:41:33 and not opensource :/ Sep 27 17:41:35 frals: most mms resources i've found are theoretical.. :\ Sep 27 17:41:43 ugh Sep 27 17:41:51 i have the flu or something Sep 27 17:42:00 maybe swine flu? :) Sep 27 17:42:06 MaceN8x0: hope its not the swineflu, it really sucked Sep 27 17:42:11 heh Sep 27 17:42:32 well, i am strong and don't live in a 3rd world country Sep 27 17:42:45 at least i don't think we have hit 3rd world status yet Sep 27 17:43:02 was out 3days with the fever and another 3 coughing my lungs up.. and was exhausted for the next week ^^ Sep 27 17:43:05 so i am sure i will survive Sep 27 17:43:31 yeah, it just sucks :D Sep 27 17:43:38 yeah... i'm at 102 right now. ah well, i have had worse but i doubt it is swine flu ;) Sep 27 17:43:54 and even if it is that is ok, that which doesn't kill you... Sep 27 17:44:07 I never got myself tested to see if it was swinefly or wh at Sep 27 17:44:57 most people don't go to the dr for flu Sep 27 17:45:05 only weak people die from it Sep 27 17:45:13 ye i never tested myself either, but ~60ppl from the party where i worked got the same symptoms within 3 days so i assume it was Sep 27 17:45:29 ibuprofen was kinda radical though. When fever was at 39.6ish and I got fed up with it and took an ibu, body reversed course and wanted temperature down to normal 3 hours ago. I lost several litres of fluid in 2 hours in sweating :-) Sep 27 17:45:34 people with immunodeficiencies Sep 27 17:45:49 haha Sep 27 17:46:01 ginger ale! the cure all Sep 27 17:46:04 I heard that for hte people that it doesn't kill, swineflu is milder than seasonal flu Sep 27 17:46:11 i just downed 2 shots of nyquil Sep 27 17:46:20 wohoo! super mario bros works now beautifully with wiimote. Sep 27 17:46:25 is that paracetamol + caffeine? Sep 27 17:46:42 ShadowJK: Is fever the only way of getting warm in Finland? :p Sep 27 17:46:48 haha Sep 27 17:46:56 qwerty12_N810, there's also Sauna Sep 27 17:47:09 lol, of course Sep 27 17:47:10 no mountain hot springs? Sep 27 17:47:14 :) Sep 27 17:47:25 and on easter we round up the witches and set fire to them, that warms a bit Sep 27 17:48:23 pupnik_: (when you see this) - drnoksnes does not work in non-com mode for some reason. Screen is black. Sep 27 17:48:23 hahaha Sep 27 17:48:51 konttori: "non-com mode"? Sep 27 17:49:11 * RST38h badly needs hardware scaling =( Sep 27 17:49:18 non-composited mode Sep 27 17:49:39 konttori: I can only think that the XSP still calls are doing "something" Sep 27 17:49:48 s/still calls/calls still/ Sep 27 17:49:48 javispedro meant: konttori: I can only think that the XSP calls still are doing "something" Sep 27 17:49:54 Pseudoephedrine (30 mg/15mL) (nasal decongestant) Sep 27 17:50:07 isn't that what meth is made from? Sep 27 17:50:10 konttori: while composited, does the game area appear centered? Sep 27 17:50:20 MaceN8x0: it's one ingredient Sep 27 17:50:25 MaceN8x0: or one possible ingredient Sep 27 17:50:35 thought it was the main one Sep 27 17:50:48 nope, it's roughly 200,0 from top left corner Sep 27 17:51:01 and running without any scaling Sep 27 17:51:13 MaceN8x0, "main" ingredient is whatever you can get easily that can be made into meth Sep 27 17:51:22 MaceN8x0: pseudoefe is on recipe in large areas of the world for that reason afaik Sep 27 17:51:37 Following the passage of the Combat Methamphetamine Epidemic Act in 2006, in the United States all pseudoephedrine-containing medications must be kept behind a pharmacy counter and all purchases must be logged. Sep 27 17:51:45 konttori: thus the binary is still calling Xsp. Plan to upload a newer version today Sep 27 17:51:54 (without any xsp calls in fremantle) Sep 27 17:52:05 there was a combat methamphetamine act? Sep 27 17:52:06 haha Sep 27 17:52:09 psuedoephedrine is the only thing that will kill chronic asthma sometimes. Sep 27 17:52:12 for me. Sep 27 17:52:13 MaceN8x0: What a shitty law... the person passing that one must've been high :\ Sep 27 17:52:20 i guess only meth heads would have known that Sep 27 17:52:36 "join the army, get meth" Sep 27 17:52:40 haha Sep 27 17:52:53 wikipedia is awesome, almost any nontrivial medication you look up turns out to be hard-drugs in disguise Sep 27 17:52:59 they used to test lsd on soldiers Sep 27 17:53:15 lucky bastards Sep 27 17:53:17 ShadowJK, yeah haha Sep 27 17:53:21 well they had heroin in flu meds here untill fifties or so Sep 27 17:53:28 qwerty12_N810, that's what i said Sep 27 17:53:29 even the anti-diarrhoea pills I had turned out to be some special opium that only affected the bowels Sep 27 17:53:37 and made them slow Sep 27 17:53:38 i'd volunteer for that! Sep 27 17:53:46 javispedro: should the sounds work? Sep 27 17:53:55 I am not hearing anything Sep 27 17:54:02 konttori: try toggling the sound checkbox in gui Sep 27 17:54:11 (even if its on or off, there was a settings gui iirc) Sep 27 17:54:16 settings gui bug I mean. Sep 27 17:54:16 I used to test LSD too Sep 27 17:54:35 Vicks chose to keep its products more easily accessible by reformulating NyQuil Sinus, replacing pseudoephedrine with phenylephrine. Many people were outraged by this change and chose to boycott the product, because studies have shown that phenylephrine is no more effective than a placebo. Sep 27 17:54:41 hahahaha Sep 27 17:54:49 meth heads unite!!! Sep 27 17:55:14 you need huge quantities anyway.. Sep 27 17:55:27 meth head is is jail, he was breaking into the drug store next to my house last night Sep 27 17:55:40 All for some sinus medication Sep 27 17:55:44 javispedro: Ah. I needed to switch from silent profile to generic profile Sep 27 17:55:51 But yeah, now sounds work! Sep 27 17:55:55 ah, well :) Sep 27 17:56:02 ShadowJK: well, purchasing big quantities in several areas of usa was apparently no problem, since theres population density enough to have so many drugstores to buy from Sep 27 17:56:05 pb-away, haha... yeah.. like a crackhead robbing the cartel Sep 27 17:56:15 glass, I guess it's prescription now? Sep 27 17:56:26 pseudoephedrine isn't prescription in the US Sep 27 17:56:33 ShadowJK: dunno. here(finland) it's on prescription Sep 27 17:56:36 RST38h: Nice post. :) Sep 27 17:56:39 yeah Sep 27 17:56:48 konttori: i am writing a slow sw scaler for this version so there may be a (hopefully not big) performance hit. Sep 27 17:56:50 but that act that was pasted here, said that they have to keep records of who buys it Sep 27 17:56:55 zerojay: I actually thing he is baiting you all right now Sep 27 17:56:58 But anyway... Sep 27 17:57:00 until we can get ogles2 scaling right, that will suffice. Sep 27 17:57:01 s/thing/think Sep 27 17:57:09 In Michigan you need to show ID and sign a paper with your address to buy any sinus meds Sep 27 17:57:12 my dr here in finland gave me a prescription of an anti histamine with pseudoephdrine and i was surprised to see that he gave me a prescription for over 10 packs Sep 27 17:57:12 RST38h: Yeah... probably. I'm long done with it. Sep 27 17:57:14 i was like wtf Sep 27 17:57:24 i take duact sometimes to battle allergy symptoms Sep 27 17:57:25 javis: no need to write slow sw scaler when you can use a fast one Sep 27 17:57:31 javispedro, what happens if you request an x11 window at the dimensions you need Sep 27 17:57:31 (it has pseudoefe) Sep 27 17:57:36 does it get opened at that and scaled Sep 27 17:57:40 or does the wm force it bigger Sep 27 17:57:48 lcuk: I get a x11 window at the dimensions I needed :) Sep 27 17:58:05 unless you mean there's compositor magic between, which I can't test. Sep 27 17:58:11 I got duact before the operation to prevent nausea Sep 27 17:58:27 * lcuk curses music groups with generic unsearchable names "james" Sep 27 17:58:48 lcuk: it's a sign: those are the ones to avoid Sep 27 17:58:57 but they are good Sep 27 17:59:14 I thought I was good with penguinbait, but there is now some girl using my name, she works at a zoo, with penguins Sep 27 17:59:39 * SpeedEvil sits down. Sep 27 17:59:42 RST38h: yeah, I should have used yours, but I've changed a lot of things and I wanted something working or crashing at a C source file at least ;) Sep 27 17:59:56 penguinbait: /nick masterbait Sep 27 18:00:45 How did you know I was married? Sep 27 18:00:47 javis: You should get away by just doubling SNES screen, right? Sep 27 18:01:07 RST38h: yes, whose width is 256 so your scaler is fine Sep 27 18:01:37 Roman Polanski nabbed in Switzerland, haha Sep 27 18:01:58 * RST38h has another stupid question: how do I redirect BOTH stdout and stderr into a file in Maemo shell? Sep 27 18:02:00 i'll try if I can finish the rest of things today (drawing onscreen controls + more gui bugfixes) but If I can't i'll just ship Sep 27 18:02:18 javis: Well, sometimes I need to scale by 1.3, 1.5, etc Sep 27 18:02:25 javis: The code for these is different Sep 27 18:02:44 of course :P Sep 27 18:02:45 but at least the 2x can be specifically optimized Sep 27 18:03:14 javispedro, 32bit read/writes makes a big difference Sep 27 18:03:29 lcuk: They can all be specifically optiimized and that is what I do Sep 27 18:03:35 RST38h: 2>&1 > file? Sep 27 18:03:37 * lcuk nods Sep 27 18:03:39 * Myrtti shrugs Sep 27 18:04:05 Myrtti: trying Sep 27 18:04:16 all those splits and joins are making me queasy Sep 27 18:04:24 enough with them dammit Sep 27 18:04:29 do a select Sep 27 18:04:35 javispedro: Welcome to FreeNode. Sep 27 18:04:51 Myrtti: Thanks, it seems to work Sep 27 18:04:51 sigh Sep 27 18:05:12 RST38h: that would be 2€ to Red Cross donation box next time you see one Sep 27 18:05:36 (I don't do sh scripting for free ;-D) Sep 27 18:05:42 *cough* Sep 27 18:06:37 (1€ or equivalent is ok too) Sep 27 18:06:45 ok, .50€ Sep 27 18:06:48 :-P Sep 27 18:06:50 Myrtti: Which is like...mhm...never Sep 27 18:06:56 :-( Sep 27 18:07:09 They have a website. Sep 27 18:07:14 It did not redirect stderr unfortunately :( But that's ok, looks like most output was to stdout Sep 27 18:07:31 RST38h: Put the pipes in the other order. Sep 27 18:07:46 Myrtti: But as a consolation prize, I can send you the latest build of VGBA for Fremantle Sep 27 18:07:50 Nobody has it yet =) Sep 27 18:08:04 hehe, no thanks :-) Sep 27 18:08:04 > file 2>&1 Sep 27 18:08:32 where is the n64 emu, we got opengl right? who's working on that? Sep 27 18:08:45 I want to play smash bros. Sep 27 18:08:53 we got opengles2 so far. Sep 27 18:11:31 penguinbait: a) we can't run open gl stuff straight on N900. b) emulation of N64 is completely fucked since almost no one out there cared about accuracy. Sep 27 18:11:54 javispedro: So, even the soft scaler coming now. Sounds really good! Sep 27 18:12:06 I need to put wiicontrol to repo then. Sep 27 18:12:16 Emulators for N64 and everything newer just seem like plugin runners these days. Sep 27 18:12:19 and get it to support 2 controllers. Sep 27 18:12:34 konttori: heh. I'd need to do that too. Sep 27 18:13:26 opengles1.1 should also be available if that helpts Sep 27 18:13:59 konttori: the ogles 1.1 libs are not in the beta2sdk (so the only way for now is to grab them from imagination) Sep 27 18:14:19 (libs&headers) Sep 27 18:14:21 ok. we need to address that then Sep 27 18:14:35 the headers are in the armel target though. Sep 27 18:14:46 (iirc, lemme check) Sep 27 18:16:29 yes, they are. Sep 27 18:17:31 along with stub libs. so you can indeed build something with ogles 1.1, only you can't test it. Sep 27 18:18:00 lol. not very useful then. Sep 27 18:19:16 we are going to be publishing next sdk version next week afaik. I'll try to check if we can pushi386 content in there still Sep 27 18:19:45 for the record, kate did the i386 2.0 package Sep 27 18:19:52 (according to debian/control) Sep 27 18:20:12 found a php and one java mms-lib *starts reading source code* Sep 27 18:20:20 php mms lib? lol Sep 27 18:21:13 just for encoding and decoding, doh Sep 27 18:21:18 well its something anyway.. ;P Sep 27 18:21:19 maybe RST38h is right and everyone who has ever written a MMS lib has gone crazy ;P Sep 27 18:21:37 a Sep 27 18:23:25 javispedro: I'll check if she would have the time to get the 1.1 done as well if our opengl wizards don't Sep 27 18:23:58 :P :) Sep 27 18:24:47 dpkg-shlibdeps: warning: dependency on libdbus-1.so.3 could be avoided if "debian/vgba/usr/bin/vgba" were not uselessly linked against it (they use none of its symbols). Sep 27 18:24:59 Is this anything to worry about? I am getting a lot of these Sep 27 18:25:00 with accel we should also have a Marble Madness clone Sep 27 18:25:26 RST38h: presumably you're using pkg-config, so I'd say not. Sep 27 18:26:14 unless you have clearly stated dbus in pkg-config call. Sep 27 18:26:18 hmm, lowering pri didn't do much Sep 27 18:27:13 Thread priorities are usually pretty useless. Sep 27 18:27:29 really? Sep 27 18:27:31 oh Sep 27 18:27:34 Yeah. Sep 27 18:27:39 in which case I need to slow down the framerate Sep 27 18:27:45 I haven't touched one in over 15 years, and haven't missed 'em. Sep 27 18:27:53 will have to work out how to build videorate Sep 27 18:29:11 what are you doing lardman ? Sep 27 18:29:43 barcode decoding Sep 27 18:29:51 3 codes, 1D, Qr and dmtx Sep 27 18:29:56 oh right Sep 27 18:30:39 lardman Sep 27 18:30:52 does the queue of data come in sequenctially Sep 27 18:31:06 or does it push another frame whilst you are in the middle of processing the first Sep 27 18:31:14 sequentially even Sep 27 18:32:22 I think the frames queue up Sep 27 18:32:39 javis: I have not Sep 27 18:32:40 i suppose thats the pipeline effect Sep 27 18:32:46 I just need them to be dropped really once they are too old Sep 27 18:32:59 you mentioned threading the decoding process Sep 27 18:33:09 if its a different thread to the newframe event Sep 27 18:33:12 I'll have to do some fiddling with the pipeline settings, see if I can work out some way Sep 27 18:33:25 yeah the libdmtx decoder is in another thread Sep 27 18:33:29 you could simply say "if(frame_process_in_progress) return -1;" and do nothing Sep 27 18:33:36 but it still clobbers everything eles Sep 27 18:33:44 yeah, I do that now Sep 27 18:33:55 but while it's processing, frames are building up Sep 27 18:34:00 what about pausing the pipeline itself Sep 27 18:34:09 or do you suffer from lag still with pause/stop Sep 27 18:34:17 yeah, not tried that as I assumed it would be slow Sep 27 18:34:24 while its processing you should just be dropping frames Sep 27 18:34:25 but may well give it a go this evening Sep 27 18:34:27 cos its busy Sep 27 18:35:18 it sounds like your main work is occuring in sync with the thread gstreamer is sending under Sep 27 18:35:38 some of it is done in the same thread Sep 27 18:36:19 * RST38h badly needs hardware scaling =( <<< for the faster emus (older systems)? Sep 27 18:36:51 RST38h, RGB xv was murmured to be gaining support Sep 27 18:37:22 xv is probably also a very good idea Sep 27 18:37:23 which if it acts like yuv XV mode will get automatic hardware level scaling Sep 27 18:37:38 pupnik: to save time when emulating on n900 Sep 27 18:37:40 like i get arm Sep 27 18:37:43 atm Sep 27 18:37:53 * lcuk never uses it tho Sep 27 18:56:01 please please tell me there's a better audiobook player for fremantle than panucci? Sep 27 18:56:11 No =( Sep 27 18:56:24 :-( Sep 27 18:56:44 Someone should do a better player Sep 27 18:56:50 I mean, you can do s/fremantle/Maemo and it will still be true Sep 27 18:56:57 konttori: We discussed it before Sep 27 18:56:59 I would really like to see a better audio player to be also for podcases Sep 27 18:57:17 podcasts even Sep 27 18:57:17 RST38h: I was kinda hoping that there'd be a better one for *atleast* Fremantle Sep 27 18:57:23 konttori: The Nokia one is a wreck unfortunately :( Sep 27 18:57:40 Myrtti: There is a player that copies iTunes UI Sep 27 18:57:43 for audio book use, yeah, definitely, it's not good for that Sep 27 18:57:51 Myrtti: But is has not been properly packaged and needs Qt Sep 27 18:57:58 *sigh* Sep 27 18:57:59 konttori: For anything :( Sep 27 18:58:08 Myrtti: So if you feel adventurous... Sep 27 18:58:12 for audio books and podcasts, there needs to be good bookmarks and good skip buttons. Sep 27 18:58:21 RST38h: I can't even package hello world. Sep 27 18:58:25 konttori: No playlist management in the nokia player Sep 27 18:58:36 Myrtti: Neither could I Sep 27 18:58:45 but, I'm willing to set up an amount of money for a bounty for developing a proper bloody app for this Sep 27 18:58:53 Myrtti: Still can't, really Sep 27 18:59:09 frade: ^^^ You are not alone --- now you have do do your audiobook client app! ;) Sep 27 18:59:14 lcuk: Email Sep 27 18:59:19 * Myrtti waves 25€ around Sep 27 18:59:36 RST38h, you want it or i should check it Sep 27 18:59:36 I HAS MONEYS, GIEV ME AN AUDIOBOOK APPZ, KTHX Sep 27 18:59:41 lcuk: Check it Sep 27 18:59:51 Myrtti: We charge in favors here =) Sep 27 18:59:53 Is that 25 valid for packaging hello world? :p Sep 27 19:00:06 RST38h, cluestick - which address and which content Sep 27 19:00:16 lcuk: Oh, come on, you know Sep 27 19:00:18 ive currently got a big list of read messages and nothing is jumping out# Sep 27 19:00:40 qwerty: Could you package that itunes like thingie? Sep 27 19:01:01 I desperately want an app that has a bloody sleep timer in it Sep 27 19:01:13 RST38h: Packaging Qt stuff gives me a headache Sep 27 19:01:13 and a more sensible way of adding files to the queue than one by one Sep 27 19:01:18 <-- GTK fan Sep 27 19:01:35 which is my #1 gripe about this Panucci shite, sorry Sep 27 19:01:46 <------ Linux Enthusiast Sep 27 19:01:51 in which languages do you want hello world package? Sep 27 19:02:00 I hate you all. Sep 27 19:02:02 :-( Sep 27 19:02:11 Welcome to FreeNode! :D Sep 27 19:02:13 no cookies for you Sep 27 19:02:29 Myrtti, mmm Sep 27 19:02:34 fiferboy has a countdown app Sep 27 19:02:35 cookies are disabled anyway Sep 27 19:02:44 Myrtti: Fine, can I get 25 for making a script that speaks "Hello world"? Sep 27 19:02:45 * javispedro sues whoever made HildonCheckButton not inherit from GtkCheckButton. arr!! Sep 27 19:02:46 but you mean to turn off XXXXXXX after a duration Sep 27 19:03:45 lcuk: the Nokia Audiobook Player has a sleeptimer, it stops the playback after (5|10|15|20|30|60)mins Sep 27 19:03:56 qwerty: Ah, just package the thing for lulz =) Sep 27 19:04:02 lcuk: Why would any sane person wish to do that? Sep 27 19:04:27 which is nice, because I usually go to bed with an audiobook, and it's really annoying to hear the stupid audiobook play when I wake up, and having no way of guessing where it was when I fell asleep Sep 27 19:05:16 and with the Nokia Audiobook Player I mean the one for stupid bloody S60 Sep 27 19:05:19 haha Myrtti Sep 27 19:05:34 I checked and we don't have i386 based opengl support (as in some wrapper that would wrap those to opengl2.x/1.x). So, better you guys just wait for n900 and then port the opengl 1.x apps (n64 emu and whatnot). Sep 27 19:05:39 just start your audiobook, then do a "sleep xxx; killall audiobook.app" or sleep 3600; shutdown -h now Sep 27 19:05:52 javispedro: ^ Sep 27 19:05:57 need to implement the heartrate monitor that ecoach wants and use it to know when your heart rate changes Sep 27 19:05:59 konttori: a, ta Sep 27 19:06:04 will also work for qwertys xxxxx usage Sep 27 19:06:04 that requires the files encoded to a stupid bloody amr-wb or whatever it is, and the index file and argh Sep 27 19:06:06 konttori: imagination sdk has the Sep 27 19:06:08 penguinbait: hrm. Sep 27 19:06:12 penguinbait: that's no fun Sep 27 19:06:26 penguinbait, it wont remember hwere it stopped Sep 27 19:06:31 * lcuk understands your plight Sep 27 19:06:41 javispedro: really? So, you can use that then atm, right? Sep 27 19:06:41 konttori: imagination sdk has that, but then it comes with their gui debug tools and doesn't play as fine with the compositor. Sep 27 19:06:43 o_O dead mans switch Sep 27 19:06:43 panucci actually might Sep 27 19:06:50 if you are touching the screen or a key it plays Sep 27 19:07:01 I wonder if the mic can pick up breathing noises Sep 27 19:07:03 konttori: yes, in a way. Sep 27 19:07:09 lol @ snore detection Sep 27 19:07:18 So if it runs for 1hour and it stops, you may not know if you heard more than 15minutes before you fell asleep? Sep 27 19:07:32 isn't that the same problem? Sep 27 19:07:48 penguinbait: I've got audiobooks that run for 15+ hours Sep 27 19:07:53 we need an app which every 30 minutes will go "ARE YOU AWAKE?" at top of its voice Sep 27 19:08:07 if your sleeping your not hearing them right? Sep 27 19:08:11 if I need to look for a time frame of one hour, it's better than looking from a timeframe of six Sep 27 19:08:11 Myrtti: All you need is a webcam feed to a website where people watch you fall asleep, and then press a button. Sep 27 19:08:30 you need to find out where you fell asleep, not just start back in the spot it stopped? Sep 27 19:08:48 penguinbait: yes. Sep 27 19:08:51 its a reasonable request Sep 27 19:08:55 OLD tech has such things Sep 27 19:09:00 why do we lose nice features Sep 27 19:09:03 by upgrading Sep 27 19:09:10 lcuk: yeah, cassette players ftw Sep 27 19:09:16 Because someone decided they clutter the interface typically :/ Sep 27 19:09:20 whoa there Myrtti Sep 27 19:09:21 they're still the best interface for audiobooks Sep 27 19:09:36 So you still have to figure out where the book left off, even if its set for 1 hour? Sep 27 19:09:37 if you *really* think about it Sep 27 19:09:39 SpeedEvil, a timer option somewhere discrete should work Sep 27 19:09:41 i like the idea Sep 27 19:09:44 it makes sense Sep 27 19:09:46 for nighttime Sep 27 19:09:50 and goes with powersaving kick Sep 27 19:09:59 my missus has never watched a whole movie at night Sep 27 19:10:05 I like SpeedEvil's idea, although I think the buzzer should wake him up so he can keep listening Sep 27 19:10:11 heh Sep 27 19:10:35 I tend to read ebooks using my laptop, which avoids that issue. Sep 27 19:10:37 penguinbait: yup, but looking from within one hour is better than looking from a timeframe of "pushing play to the moment of waking up" which could be anything from 45min to 8 hours Sep 27 19:10:51 SpeedEvil, how? Sep 27 19:10:58 lcuk: the powersaving is one of the points Sep 27 19:11:00 i have fallen asleep on keyboard before now Sep 27 19:11:05 lcuk: I stop pressing pagedown, and it stops. Sep 27 19:11:07 my point was if it kills the app within the hour its the same thing Sep 27 19:11:13 SpeedEvil, autoscroll ftw Sep 27 19:11:15 my n800 can go on if no audio is playing for days Sep 27 19:11:16 same problem tho Sep 27 19:11:25 you still have the 1hour to look through to figure out when you fell asleep Sep 27 19:11:26 lcuk: I could never get along with autoscroll Sep 27 19:11:28 but with panucci, it can go on for about 4 hours atm Sep 27 19:11:36 the more we discuss this Myrtti the more it seems like a reasonable general feature Sep 27 19:11:46 SpeedEvil, upgrade your brain then Sep 27 19:11:47 after which I wake up to the bloody "YOUR BATTERY IS LOW" noise Sep 27 19:11:53 haha Sep 27 19:12:03 at least you will only be a few hours into the system Sep 27 19:12:13 thats key - go to bed with a low battery Sep 27 19:12:22 iy will automatically stop soon enough Sep 27 19:12:29 (and disable the warning sound effects) Sep 27 19:12:42 i hate it when devices return from the dead Sep 27 19:13:01 to warn you they are dying Sep 27 19:14:01 a new convert to liqbase :) Sep 27 19:14:03 uhoh Sep 27 19:14:04 Thats like opening your laptop and turning it on, only to realize its still shutting down from last time you were using it Sep 27 19:14:09 oohhh I hate that Sep 27 19:14:30 RST38h: I saw you were purging gconf settings from the postrm script, but that is run from the root user and not from "user" user. Sep 27 19:14:33 how can that work? Sep 27 19:14:53 I might end up blogging about this Sep 27 19:15:02 javispedro: Dunno, but it does flush the settings Sep 27 19:15:11 javispedro: Maybe they are global for all users? Sep 27 19:15:32 mmmm, chilli Sep 27 19:15:35 maybe. sbox gconftool-2 spends all day and night complaining about his haxxoring by his evil maintainers Sep 27 19:15:53 Myrtti, :) do it would be a nice thing Sep 27 19:16:02 especially if the played was just paused Sep 27 19:16:05 so you can continue Sep 27 19:16:09 javispedro: Maemo has the GConf tree on the disk stored in /var, not in ~ as is the custom, I believe, on a real distro... Sep 27 19:16:14 and that way it should work for movies too Sep 27 19:16:27 qwerty12_N810: ah. Sep 27 19:16:39 yeah, ~ is on debian at least. Sep 27 19:17:00 anyway, I'll go to bed now with my Panucci of fail Sep 27 19:17:05 Myrtti, a cassette mode would actualyl be nice - press the screen to turn the tape over and continue Sep 27 19:17:09 no press, no continue Sep 27 19:17:16 lcuk: indeed Sep 27 19:17:27 understandable for old folks too :) Sep 27 19:17:34 it would be a dead mans switch in a way Sep 27 19:17:37 * javispedro will purge gconf settings from postrm script too :) Sep 27 19:17:38 yeah Sep 27 19:17:43 and an opportunity to make a killer UI Sep 27 19:17:48 with retro feel Sep 27 19:17:59 indeed :) great idea Sep 27 19:18:11 * lcuk high 5's Myrtti Sep 27 19:18:17 "error: Cannot access URL https://git.maemo.org/projects/drnoksnes/, return code 18" Sep 27 19:18:26 * Myrtti shall blog about this tomorrow... Sep 27 19:18:28 somebody was asking for those kind of errors the other day? Sep 27 19:18:33 javispedro: I use a schemas file & dh_gconf for that :) Sep 27 19:18:48 I'll go and suffer with my panucci. I'm sure I'll wake up at some point of the night to pause the stupid audiobook Sep 27 19:19:06 qwerty12_N810: I will package a schema from now on, but then It does not seem to purge Sep 27 19:19:22 Myrtti: Maybe if I have enough time, we will get together with wazd and make the new media player UI for Maemo Sep 27 19:19:47 * ml-something bangs on nokia's door, demanding his n900 Sep 27 19:19:56 Myrtti: Although I expect somebody else to implement the playback part :) Sep 27 19:20:06 what's MAFW for! :) Sep 27 19:20:08 javispedro: Ah, yeah, it only does so if you "dpkg --purge" :\. Although I'm not entirely sure busybox supports the commands put into the postrm by dh_gconf... Sep 27 19:20:25 microlith: appearently some swedish retailer have confirmed 28th as shipping date... one can hope its true at least :) Sep 27 19:20:30 qwerty12_N810: i've been reading them, and at least the etch dh_gconf ones are easy enough Sep 27 19:20:39 but it does not purge settings on --purge, only schemas. Sep 27 19:20:54 Ah, I see Sep 27 19:21:05 qwerty12_N810: and that would seem sane behaviour to me, since on debian you can't expect to be able to delete user settings as root ;) Sep 27 19:21:12 frals: no joke, at least I hope that's true for the US release Sep 27 19:22:02 (unless there's a trick with the "owner" field in the schemas, since I don't know what that's for) Sep 27 19:23:29 qwerty12_N810: rmdir: unrecognized option `--ignore-fail-on-non-empty' you were right. *sigh* Sep 27 19:24:30 basically, no app using dh_gconf can be purge in diablo. Sep 27 19:25:20 *gulp*. At least I've restricted myself to using it in programs that you'd be insane to remove, in that case... Sep 27 19:25:53 javispedro: yeah, ran into that one too Sep 27 19:26:17 javispedro: submit it as a bug, it isnt fixed yet Sep 27 19:26:50 Stskeeps: C'mon, with Fremantle still using debhelper 5, do you really see it as being fixed? =) Sep 27 19:26:54 that would be from a etch devkit bug Sep 27 19:26:59 s/from// Sep 27 19:26:59 javispedro meant: that would be a etch devkit bug Sep 27 19:29:13 qwerty12_N810: busybox error, not devkit Sep 27 19:29:20 * Jaffa wonders what a good game on VGBA is Sep 27 19:29:36 Stskeeps: i'd say bashism Sep 27 19:29:58 solving it n the devkit would be as easy as " || true" Sep 27 19:30:05 Jaffa, Pokémon, clearly. Sep 27 19:30:12 rmdir != bash :P Sep 27 19:30:24 gnuism then ;P Sep 27 19:31:24 better Sep 27 19:32:25 and I wonder why not just use gconf-schemas --unregister Sep 27 19:32:46 ah, it's there actually. Sep 27 19:33:33 * javispedro thinks about patching the dh_gconf generated file in debian/rules *evil grin* Sep 27 19:35:13 * jmc93739653 is back (gone 02:49:35) Sep 27 19:35:55 so what's that snippet for? nothing at all. Sep 27 19:36:00 * javispedro sighs Sep 27 19:36:57 rm -f $(CURDIR)/debian/package.postrm.debhelper #Remove this and die Sep 27 19:38:19 i need to be able to afford real cigs :'( Sep 27 19:38:23 makin rollups sux Sep 27 19:38:48 in the war we used newspaper Sep 27 19:39:06 heh Sep 27 19:39:10 and camel dung Sep 27 19:39:15 hang on Sep 27 19:39:17 which war pupnik_ Sep 27 19:39:19 * qwerty12_N810 laughs at you cigarette addicts. if you're gonna get addicted to smoking stuff, at least smoke the right stuff Sep 27 19:39:23 you are only about 12 yo arent you Sep 27 19:39:31 camel dung probably Sep 27 19:39:52 qwerty12_N810, theres a whole different reason to need to rollup those kind of cigs Sep 27 19:40:02 i just want normal regular cigs Sep 27 19:40:15 * lcuk has a hankering for menthol Sep 27 19:40:41 hm, is there anything preventing "rm -rf /" from being in a postinst Sep 27 19:40:56 yeah Sep 27 19:41:00 re Sep 27 19:41:04 your future involvement in the community Sep 27 19:41:08 planes, trains and baseball bats Sep 27 19:41:11 nd a lot of pissed off users Sep 27 19:41:17 ha Sep 27 19:41:24 Firebird: The value of your life Sep 27 19:41:38 some pissed off member decides to upload a seemingly useful package and trods off into life? Sep 27 19:41:54 upload to where? Sep 27 19:42:00 devel Sep 27 19:42:15 devel is totally unstable tablet breaking non regular users anyway Sep 27 19:42:18 right Sep 27 19:42:22 well, it won't end up in extras that way anyway (only devel) Sep 27 19:43:21 also nice that autobuilder builds binary from the uploaded source Sep 27 19:43:32 Firebird: more interesting would be hidden spyware. but that's quite an interesting topic of discussion not only for #maemo. Sep 27 19:44:57 aw, I see black helicopters. Sep 27 19:45:15 if you see them, theres something wrong Sep 27 19:45:16 http://cache.gawker.com/assets/images/gizmodo/2009/09/blood_01.jpg Sep 27 19:45:18 Finally Sep 27 19:45:21 and they arent what you think Sep 27 19:45:38 maybe a type of 'zonealarm' service would be useful Sep 27 19:45:54 'proccess X is trying to connect to...' Sep 27 19:46:03 pupnik_: useless for "cloud" apps. Sep 27 19:46:22 sure if the app is supposed to use an interface, it's not a bug Sep 27 19:46:41 well, gotta hide from the helicopters, cy Sep 27 19:48:11 was that a metaphor for the night sky... Sep 27 19:48:16 process y is asking process x to connect to website z that will send your data to pakistan Sep 27 19:49:21 yes, Osama will now get the complete list of naughty sites you have visited since you got your computer Sep 27 19:49:45 If he finds any that are new to him, he will send you a postcard Sep 27 19:50:00 well i'd like to know if a process is using microphone, camera, cell radio... Sep 27 19:50:06 well, all this acceptable blowing people up came from a guy who visited america and was disgusted by people dancing so close together Sep 27 19:50:25 Wrong, he is faking a reason. Sep 27 19:50:31 is it just me or does liqbase sound like some kind of sexual reference? I am pronouncing this correctly right lick-base? Sep 27 19:50:37 The real reason is that blowing up things (and people) is fun Sep 27 19:50:40 mavhc has watched the Power of Nightmares Sep 27 19:50:44 true Sep 27 19:51:28 blowing up yourself isn't fun though Sep 27 19:51:57 mavhc: more fun than spending the next 60 years in a penitentiary I guess Sep 27 19:51:57 penguinbait, unintentional. however i do have to be careful with naming other liq* modules for this reason Sep 27 19:52:08 to bring this back on topic, can I use an n900 to detonate a bomb? Sep 27 19:52:16 Yes. Do you want to? Sep 27 19:52:17 liqbacon Sep 27 19:52:33 see it still sounds like your up to something Sep 27 19:52:59 what did you name your library for viewing lolcats? Sep 27 19:53:12 * RST38h off for now Sep 27 19:53:38 lcuk: Can I propose liqadiqaday Sep 27 19:53:52 heh Sep 27 19:54:45 i have liqdoc Sep 27 19:55:02 Tame. At least make the o an i Sep 27 19:55:15 liqtwit Sep 27 19:55:15 for a dictionary application? Sep 27 19:55:28 Sure :) Sep 27 19:55:28 liqtwat Sep 27 19:55:33 yessir Sep 27 19:55:44 Mek, the document reader class Sep 27 19:56:15 liqbattery is shocking Sep 27 19:56:16 liqtwit and liqface for the social butterflys Sep 27 19:56:33 * lcuk does like liqbrain :) Sep 27 19:56:43 lcuk: name one after yourself... Sep 27 19:57:12 and dedicate it to crashanddie_ Sep 27 19:57:52 i like liqface :D Sep 27 19:58:22 AKA liqhead / liqbrain Sep 27 19:58:56 liqbrain was the name of the database classes ;) Sep 27 19:59:45 Ironically, talking about database classes would not get you brain Sep 27 20:00:06 depends if it was run in a zombie process or not Sep 27 20:00:09 I got to go bake a chicken, and make mash potato's Sep 27 20:00:42 haha Sep 27 20:00:42 lcuk accepts Sep 27 20:01:27 thanks to penguinbait, i now know what to call people who use twitter Sep 27 20:01:35 twits? Sep 27 20:04:26 mashed potatos? Sep 27 20:06:12 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KEUFLwl-Ac8 Sep 27 20:06:18 both are good, SpeedEvil suihkulokki :) Sep 27 20:06:56 yeah mashed potatos even Sep 27 20:11:39 i like Mike and Rich better. more fun. Sep 27 20:12:04 get 'Expert Knob Twiddlers' fnordianslip Sep 27 20:13:30 pupnik_: tnx for the recommendation - will have a listen. personally, i'm just an amateur DIY knob twiddler Sep 27 20:14:14 have you heard the venetian snares 'einstein-rosen bridge' 12"? Sep 27 20:15:06 pupnik_: not sure. hard to tell what i've heard, but i don't know it by name. Sep 27 20:15:06 Is it a covered bridge? Sep 27 20:15:08 back Sep 27 20:15:24 i think you'd remember it, actually Sep 27 20:15:29 :) Sep 27 20:15:58 quite a worm, that track Sep 27 20:17:33 you know how kids always stand around listening to music from one cell phone? Sep 27 20:17:49 it would be cool if they could share the stream and get synched playback over BT Sep 27 20:18:33 better to hack them and make them listen to punk! Sep 27 20:19:03 that track is pretty warped Sep 27 20:19:10 or pixies. straighten em out. Sep 27 20:19:20 :) Sep 27 20:19:38 yeah i heard it on a german radio station Sep 27 20:19:41 almost had to pull over Sep 27 20:19:53 * fnordianslip likes Sep 27 20:21:17 * pupnik_ bounces Sep 27 20:21:31 * lcuk flows Sep 27 20:22:15 * SpeedEvil farts. Sep 27 20:23:06 pupnik_, simpler solution nowadays Sep 27 20:23:16 n900 has FM radio transmit Sep 27 20:23:41 lots of cells have fm recv (n900 does i think ..?) Sep 27 20:23:50 so everyone in your little group have same music Sep 27 20:24:39 fnordianslip, workplace radios can be hacked once you know the frequency ;) Sep 27 20:25:09 nic enice Sep 27 20:25:24 we control the airwaves :) Sep 27 20:25:25 fm xmitters are cool Sep 27 20:25:45 i should not have started with venetian snares Sep 27 20:25:45 SpeedEvil: You should have really done it on twitter, not here Sep 27 20:25:49 now i'm all weirded-out Sep 27 20:26:00 lcuk: indeedy. once i had to sabotage a company car's CD player with chewing gum, when i realised the boss had a Tina Turner CD Sep 27 20:26:24 yikes Sep 27 20:26:40 * SpeedEvil goes into a stirring rendition of 'Simply the Best'. Sep 27 20:26:40 i thought they removed the frequency range testing disks when they sold car Sep 27 20:26:55 it wouldn't play it or eject it after that Sep 27 20:27:12 the very first digital sample i ever ripped on zx spectrum! was a tina thing Sep 27 20:27:21 as long as it didnt play thats ok Sep 27 20:38:08 anyone familiar with the internet connectivity api for fremantle? i.e. would all network access require user confirmation? Sep 27 20:39:14 unless you let it connect automatically Sep 27 20:39:19 there is an option Sep 27 20:40:03 is it a per app setting or systemwide? Sep 27 20:40:30 since fetching an MMS automatically would require the gprs/3g connection to be able to autoconnect Sep 27 20:40:52 frals: AIUI - it requires a seperate APN for MMS Sep 27 20:41:12 frals: ideally - otherwise you tear down the internet connection, which is obviously not optimal Sep 27 20:42:07 hmm yeah good point Sep 27 20:44:28 mmm twitter is odd Sep 27 20:44:41 follower counts go up and down but no new people are added Sep 27 20:44:43 or removed Sep 27 20:45:07 They're magic twitter fairies. Sep 27 20:45:12 yeah i tihnk same Sep 27 20:45:15 tis odd Sep 27 20:45:23 http://twitter.com/lcuk incase anyone has acct Sep 27 20:45:48 uh oh, "write error on swap device" Sep 27 20:48:00 qwerty12_N810, I'm going to dedicate something to yourself Sep 27 20:48:58 I sound really n00bish here, but does anyone here have recommendations for a WSYWIG html editor that actually works well ? Sep 27 20:49:04 I am a little pained with Seamonkey. Sep 27 20:49:09 crashanddie_: Awesomeness Sep 27 20:56:26 that's weird Sep 27 20:56:32 the microsd -> sd adapter died Sep 27 20:56:47 I thought my microsdhc card had died in my N800, but I put it in another adapter and it works Sep 27 20:56:56 It's not exactly complex circuitry... Sep 27 20:57:01 Hmm Sep 27 20:57:02 Too flimsy Sep 27 20:57:11 ShadowJK: I've had two die so far Sep 27 20:57:12 A lot of them do not work in n810s to begin with Sep 27 20:57:19 you've tried removing it and put it back in again? Sep 27 20:57:35 SpeedEvil, lol yeah, now it works on both adapters Sep 27 20:57:39 I actually have a small stack of 2g microSD cards, because that was the cheapest way to get another adapter Sep 27 20:57:46 heh Sep 27 20:58:00 use old console method - remove, blow reinsert Sep 27 20:58:23 lcuk, don't forget the step where you rub it against your shirt Sep 27 20:58:39 lcuk: the first one of mine that died... well, it just split in two. Not very well made. Sep 27 20:58:57 I had a mini-full that split in two Sep 27 20:59:46 i dont know what you guys do with adapters and memory cards Sep 27 20:59:52 the only thing i manage is losing them Sep 27 21:00:20 i actually need a little tint box for them - like old floppy disk cases Sep 27 21:00:23 tiny Sep 27 21:01:24 my cards stay in the device Sep 27 21:03:00 I just discovered that I have misplaced all the cards I didn't have in a device Sep 27 21:03:09 except for the broken 1gig SD and a sandisk 1 gig SD Sep 27 21:03:13 ... and a nokia 32meg MMC Sep 27 21:03:54 I'd make finding the 32MB MMC a top priority Sep 27 21:04:15 oh that was list of cards NOT lost Sep 27 21:04:22 the lost cards include a bunch of 4 gig Sep 27 21:04:32 Ouch :/ Sep 27 21:05:50 * ShadowJK finds one 2 gig miniSD in SD adapter, an empty miniSD->SD adapter, a 2 gig microSDHC, a 4 gig microSDHC in miniSD adapter, a USB -> microUSB cable, and 4 eneloops in his travel bag Sep 27 21:05:55 so that's where they were :-) Sep 27 21:06:26 Damn! That's a lot of porn to take with you Sep 27 21:06:57 I like to be prepared for any kind of flacidity during my travels Sep 27 21:09:16 ShadowJK, dont you find it difficult stopping errrr midflow to change the memory card? Sep 27 21:10:12 hi Sep 27 21:10:28 I'm sure 10 years from now we'll look back and wonder how we ever managed with such primitive technology Sep 27 21:10:37 hi woglinde Sep 27 21:11:07 wb qwerty12_N810 Sep 27 21:11:36 Thank you, lcuk Sep 27 21:11:51 * qwerty12_N810 blames his sister for his router restarting Sep 27 21:14:52 you blame your sister for many tihngs Sep 27 21:15:20 "muuuuum, tell ~~~~~~, she got me kicked out of #maemo" Sep 27 21:15:50 she was named after wikipedia comment signing? Sep 27 21:15:52 hang on, qwerty12_N810 supposedly has a sister who comes on IRC? Sep 27 21:16:01 mavhc, or the other way around Sep 27 21:16:16 lol mavhc Sep 27 21:16:23 hi woglinde how you doing Sep 27 21:16:28 crashanddie_: Eh? No, I have a sister that, somehow, makes the router restart Sep 27 21:16:35 alien Sep 27 21:16:45 pupnik I am pissed Sep 27 21:16:53 because of the election Sep 27 21:16:56 o_O annoyed or drunk? Sep 27 21:17:02 or annoyed and drunk? Sep 27 21:17:04 boooooooooo Sep 27 21:17:27 ah yes. one day more for the candidates to eliminate themselves before the election day Sep 27 21:17:42 woglinde: Yeah, I felt the same after seeing lcuk's name there Sep 27 21:17:49 qwerty lol Sep 27 21:17:58 german election or maemo election? Sep 27 21:18:03 german Sep 27 21:18:16 qwerty12_N810, I know you're missing one, but with us humans, it's called an opposable thumb. It allows people to manipulate small things easily, such as, but not limited to, wires, buttons, etc Sep 27 21:18:21 * javispedro sighs http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?p=334868#post334868 Sep 27 21:18:21 wonder why I didnt get this time an invation Sep 27 21:18:31 woglinde: so now it's 97% of wrong decisions, instead of 95% with the result you would prefer Sep 27 21:18:44 ach joerg Sep 27 21:18:47 if you want to talk about it, ##Economics would be a nice place Sep 27 21:19:10 please show your economics degree to the guy at the door to get in Sep 27 21:20:01 crashanddie_: I see. This is why you have one. After all, you do need it to manipulate your small thing (thing being knob) Sep 27 21:20:49 I'm tired talking to you qwerty12_N810, we're talking about your sister, and immediately the conversation veers off to sex, you're twisted man Sep 27 21:20:55 :D Sep 27 21:21:09 cunt :p Sep 27 21:21:14 why is the eldar thread still open? Sep 27 21:21:14 hahaha :D Sep 27 21:21:32 javispedro, must be if you are mentioning it Sep 27 21:21:32 why do i always picture 'Eldar' in a wizard robe Sep 27 21:21:39 dont feed the troll Sep 27 21:21:39 javis: in hopes that he will come back and create some more hilarity Sep 27 21:21:42 other than pure fear and nobody volunteering to be the "public head". Sep 27 21:21:47 pupnik_: and hat? Sep 27 21:22:05 mmm javispedro "public head" Sep 27 21:22:21 I don't want to lose my head thank you ;) Sep 27 21:22:42 in what battleground? Sep 27 21:22:50 lcuk, when are you arriving in dam? Sep 27 21:23:02 dont know yet Sep 27 21:23:14 probably about 10 minutes before the start Sep 27 21:23:17 lardman, Jaffa same question as the above (when are you arriving in amsterdam?) Sep 27 21:23:17 you should arrive first day Sep 27 21:23:17 lcuk: whoever closes that thread is going to attract quite a bit of criticism Sep 27 21:23:38 you dont have to close the thread to kill it Sep 27 21:23:39 rkirti: this isn't bad... http://quanta.kdewebdev.org/ Sep 27 21:23:47 just change the subject enough to make it unfashionable Sep 27 21:24:13 javispedro, what, more criticism from the highly respected russian who couldn't tell grammar from cabbage but is still allowed to bash everyone because he has "expert knowledge", and an ego that couldn't fit in the world trade center? Sep 27 21:24:26 or actualyl answer some of the questions loud enough and with enough unity that the dull roar of 'tards is sataited Sep 27 21:24:30 crashanddie_, he and his fan club. Sep 27 21:24:55 javispedro, if eldar's ego was inside of the WTC, it would never have collapsed, without bending the rules of physics Sep 27 21:25:24 nice analogy Sep 27 21:25:38 couldn't find one with a car Sep 27 21:25:45 Eldar is an overweight tartar guy, who talks a lot Sep 27 21:25:48 one GOOD thing will come of the eldar stuff - if there are infact issues he is raising which are problems, you can be damned certain as much as possible would be done to cure them Sep 27 21:26:13 and since its linux those things would continue Sep 27 21:26:20 * SpeedEvil loves their sauce. Sep 27 21:26:21 if that means nokia is going to devote a single maemo devices person to java ME, I hope you're wrong ;) Sep 27 21:26:34 no Sep 27 21:26:38 And you folks are becoming uselessly obsessed with the guy. He is a hack. He does not decide on this or that gadget success. Sep 27 21:26:39 crashanddie_: I thought along same path ;-) Sep 27 21:26:57 but if an open source java person from within the company showed an interest - why would they be blocked from trying Sep 27 21:26:58 * frals coughs something and MMS and points to brainstorm and the talk thread about it... Sep 27 21:27:07 * lbt read tmo earlier and is wondering about the rotation support too now... the arguments are persuasive ... "I want it" Sep 27 21:27:10 nokia have thousands of thousands of employees in different fields Sep 27 21:27:26 very important question Sep 27 21:27:35 stupid TV show or PS3 game? Sep 27 21:27:39 {{sodoityourselfdammit} Sep 27 21:27:41 } Sep 27 21:27:45 lol Sep 27 21:27:58 javispedro: you talking to me? Sep 27 21:28:05 not until now: Sep 27 21:28:07 lbt: tv show. Sep 27 21:28:16 javis: Why don't YOU just port a MIDP JVM and JNI to Maemo? Sep 27 21:28:22 I want it is not a futile argument in the case of a device people are going to plop money down for Sep 27 21:28:28 javis: I mean, it is somewhat tedious but no rocket science Sep 27 21:28:42 lbt, of course its desired - i want it too and am thinking how - the 3 OS areas which need it are menus, desktops, alttab preview thingy Sep 27 21:28:43 instead of just removing the "eldar" thread, can we just remove the "well respected" from the thread title, surely that title no longer fits? Sep 27 21:28:43 RST38h: totally agreed. In fact, I still have a .txt here documenting the steps. Sep 27 21:28:49 javis: Make it a single executable, make it auto-execute .jar and .jad files Sep 27 21:28:52 the alt-tab preview thingy would appear to be the simplest Sep 27 21:28:58 followed by menu Sep 27 21:29:02 then the desktop Sep 27 21:29:04 RST38h, JNI is a bitch to implement Sep 27 21:29:10 javis: I have done it before, wasn't too bad, except that you have to get hold of SSL sources Sep 27 21:29:14 * lbt wanted it on his N800.... and he wrote it :) Sep 27 21:29:20 crashanddie: you do not need to implement it, has been done for you Sep 27 21:29:27 In MIDP that is Sep 27 21:29:44 people shouldn't be allowed an N900 if they don't grok xrandr Sep 27 21:29:52 well, there's a JVM compatible with 1.6 that takes .jar files and converts them to .dll for use in C# Sep 27 21:30:02 crash: Not needed. Sep 27 21:30:03 lbt, what if xrandr was broken Sep 27 21:30:10 and things could not be rotated so easily Sep 27 21:30:11 surely we can write something that runs Java decently on Maemo, right, if something like that exists Sep 27 21:30:20 and what if the rotation was wanted lower than the app level Sep 27 21:30:28 How hard can it be? Sep 27 21:30:34 then do it Sep 27 21:30:35 crash: One more time, for teary eyed Java fanatics: your language sucks, it is unpractical, it fixes non existent problems at the cost of creating more serious problems Sep 27 21:30:43 crash: BUT! Sep 27 21:30:44 dead easy. but nobody wants it that much. Sep 27 21:30:58 * crashanddie_ loves buts Sep 27 21:31:06 lbt: thanks Sep 27 21:31:06 crash: There is a huge bunch of MIDP apps for mobile devices, so it makes sense to implement MIDP on tablets. Sep 27 21:31:18 rst it already is Sep 27 21:31:22 crash: As a single executable. No libraries, no dlls, no c#, no classpathes Sep 27 21:31:33 http://midpath.svn.sourceforge.net/viewvc/midpath/ Sep 27 21:31:35 woglinde: I have not seen it run. Evet. Sep 27 21:31:37 RST38h: before that I would make sure GarnetVM still works. Sep 27 21:31:37 Ever Sep 27 21:31:46 available in jalimo and oe Sep 27 21:32:07 qt/gtk/awt backend Sep 27 21:32:10 as you like Sep 27 21:32:25 woglinde: Except that it's packaged in such a way that you have to be a jalimo developer to use it Sep 27 21:32:45 nope Sep 27 21:33:09 choose chinook-compat as machine Sep 27 21:33:17 and you will get deb's out of it Sep 27 21:33:25 * RST38h does not understand Sep 27 21:33:42 huh Sep 27 21:33:48 rst you need to compile it with oe Sep 27 21:33:55 wogline: To me, properly packaged means I go to App Manager, install a single (small) package, and all my jar/jad files suddenly start running from file manager Sep 27 21:34:00 mmmm oe Sep 27 21:34:07 crispy Sep 27 21:34:17 because of the problem with java in sratchbox Sep 27 21:34:22 woglinde: Once you start telling me to get oe, compile something, get something else, compile, etc, it is not packaged Sep 27 21:35:00 woglinde: doesnt this sound like we should have a .deb builder like koen's narcissus for oe's .debs ? Sep 27 21:35:04 RST38h as I said fix jvm/scratchbox problem and you will get the deb's in extra-devel Sep 27 21:35:44 lbt: lol Sep 27 21:35:56 what's the problem with java in sbox? Sep 27 21:36:31 crashanddie_: arriving evening on the wed before the first day iirc Sep 27 21:36:51 javis qemu crash Sep 27 21:36:53 oh no, what is the first day? Friday? In which case evening of the Thursday Sep 27 21:37:13 woglinde: ah, so a java devkit is needed. Sep 27 21:37:27 night all Sep 27 21:38:00 javis we could workaround with native java in scratchbox but I believe the builder dont support it Sep 27 21:38:41 woglinde: will sb2 work? Sep 27 21:38:47 rst nope Sep 27 21:38:53 oh :( Sep 27 21:38:54 did try Sep 27 21:39:04 but you have the builder problem again Sep 27 21:39:21 lardman|gone, first day is friday, lol Sep 27 21:40:00 rst and its not fast with cacao Sep 27 21:40:05 and openjdk takes 80mb Sep 27 21:42:22 hhm, can an n810 do like a radio clock? Sep 27 21:43:42 Corsac: not as standard Sep 27 21:44:01 and do you know an application which would do that? :) Sep 27 21:44:16 (it's just a random idea before going to bed, so I'm not gonna script it tonight ;p) Sep 27 21:44:20 I was playing with a way to make iwork myself a while back, but work ate my life Sep 27 21:44:33 you can easily do it without an interface, mind Sep 27 21:44:59 A radio clock? Sep 27 21:45:00 from the console Sep 27 21:45:14 yeah, not sure the english word is correct :) Sep 27 21:45:21 Fremantle is supposed to have it Sep 27 21:45:23 oh - you mean a cock radio. Sep 27 21:45:26 but, you know, an alarm which wakes you up in the morning Sep 27 21:45:31 I remember that bug being fixed in fremantle, anyway Sep 27 21:45:33 SpeedEvil: a *cock* radio? Sep 27 21:45:39 meh Sep 27 21:45:45 now, that's a good one Sep 27 21:46:09 for some reason english always says 'clock radio' not radio clock Sep 27 21:46:17 Corsac: as long as you're comfortable in the terminal, I can give you the script I've used. it's not at all pretty, but it does work. Sep 27 21:46:33 could you mail it at corsac@debian.org ? Sep 27 21:47:50 better, I can pastebin it Sep 27 21:47:51 once I find it! Sep 27 21:47:55 aha :) Sep 27 21:48:00 but I'll be gone :( Sep 27 21:48:18 ccooke, will this small shell script replace the important job my children have Sep 27 21:48:32 oh, hell. Sep 27 21:48:35 and will it actually bring me a brew with them Sep 27 21:48:42 lcuk: apparently not, since I've just arrived back into London Sep 27 21:49:09 which means it's at least an hour or two before I'll be able to do it. Sep 27 21:49:45 Corsac: Assuming I can find it when I get home, I'll email you. You'll need to find the URL of an internet radio station you want to use, though Sep 27 21:49:50 and install mplayer on your tablet Sep 27 21:49:55 (I *did* say it's ugly) Sep 27 21:50:22 time to pack up. Sep 27 22:28:01 if you haven't voted for community council: do it now! Sep 27 22:33:59 javispedro: hi, are you around? Sep 27 22:34:11 bobbyd: yes Sep 27 22:34:33 hi Sep 27 22:34:42 hiya Sep 27 22:35:20 I was trying to get your OGLES sample working, but I can't find the libraries under the x86 target, just the arm one, and I can't seem to run the graphical interface under the arm target Sep 27 22:35:30 am I just missing something obvious? Sep 27 22:36:31 check for libgles2-dev pkg in x86 Sep 27 22:36:36 ok Sep 27 22:38:42 it doesn't exist apparently Sep 27 22:39:15 maybe I'm missing an apt source? Sep 27 22:39:18 E: Couldn't find package libgles2-dev Sep 27 22:40:32 ahh Sep 27 22:41:01 thought I'd found it as libglesv2-dev, but no Sep 27 22:41:30 http://maemo.org/packages/view/libgles2-dev/ Sep 27 22:42:01 well, get it from there if your sources.list is wrong :P Sep 27 22:42:04 gles stuff is closed Sep 27 22:42:13 yep :) Sep 27 22:42:18 (to javispedro ) Sep 27 22:42:28 woglinde: closed source, yes. Sep 27 22:42:40 (for some weird reason it is in both free and non-free repos) Sep 27 22:42:41 is there actually GLES for x86? Sep 27 22:42:50 johnx only emulation Sep 27 22:43:04 more like "simulation": it uses host ogl. Sep 27 22:43:08 woglinde: I only want to write apps, not change the source of the driver Sep 27 22:43:25 bobbyd ah Sep 27 22:43:45 javis hm isn't there the security token anymore? Sep 27 22:43:59 looked half an year ago the last time Sep 27 22:44:26 the maemo.org/packages thing claims libgles2-dev is available from x86 from extras-devel Sep 27 22:44:31 dunno if you already found it Sep 27 22:45:04 johnx: yes, just looking for the repository line for extras-devel Sep 27 22:46:25 * lcuk sighs Sep 27 22:46:31 deb http://repository.maemo.org extras-devel free Sep 27 22:46:40 ta Sep 27 22:46:43 (or at least I think that's it based on my deconstruction of the URL) Sep 27 22:46:52 just pasting that before you gave me it :) Sep 27 22:47:14 no Sep 27 22:47:24 if i had a fruitbowl full of vibrating devices Sep 27 22:47:34 which responded to light and vibration stimuli Sep 27 22:47:43 by vibrating and illuminating Sep 27 22:47:52 (delayed reaction to things flow) Sep 27 22:48:05 woglinde: yes, that token thing still exists, but this is outside nokia-binaries. Sep 27 22:48:09 would it just look like nothing or would the whole unit shimmer and shake Sep 27 22:48:23 lcuk: can't you build that with n900's? Sep 27 22:48:26 probably because you can get mostly the same from imagination by just registering with them (free) Sep 27 22:48:28 bobbyd, pupnik_ is right. let me figure out the right URL Sep 27 22:48:34 well thats what im thinking of filling the bowls with Sep 27 22:48:39 johnx: I think I've got it Sep 27 22:48:41 the devices are shiney pebbles lol Sep 27 22:48:46 ah, good deal Sep 27 22:48:48 http://repository.maemo.org Sep 27 22:48:56 ^^^ check that for repo urls Sep 27 22:49:00 javispedro++ Sep 27 22:49:06 * johnx must need more coffee Sep 27 22:51:01 its always time for more coffee Sep 27 22:51:04 but i have no milk Sep 27 22:51:07 so its orange juice Sep 27 22:51:26 took to drinking black coffee at work cause all they have is that synthetic creamer Sep 27 22:51:55 good nite Sep 27 22:53:48 johnx, good idea Sep 27 22:54:04 arghhh i wondered why ssh dropped off before Sep 27 22:54:11 something is up with my thing Sep 27 22:57:55 RST38h: you're evil. Sep 27 22:58:32 RST38h: I hope the pop r15 at the end wasn't intentional. Sep 27 22:58:38 javispedro, you are only just finding that out Sep 27 22:59:45 http://images.google.com/images?q=pupnik Sep 27 23:00:18 you're such a videogame collector ;) Sep 27 23:00:58 http://images.google.com/images?q=lcuk bah, only 2 are mine Sep 27 23:01:49 augh! I am not the only johnx! the goggles; they do nothink! Sep 27 23:02:12 ... Sep 27 23:02:28 I share a name with a canadian polar bear researcher. Sep 27 23:02:40 I once got an email offering me a place on a polar expedition. Sep 27 23:02:48 I did actually look a bit like him. Sep 27 23:03:11 I considered trying to blag it, but decided on balance it was probably a bad idea. Sep 27 23:03:12 http://images.google.com/images?q="luke+dashjr" Sep 27 23:03:13 ... Sep 27 23:03:39 wow while doing an egosearch i found Sep 27 23:03:40 http://fkwjcw.bay.livefilestore.com/y1p27A0pF0A3D-tY-TyYSVGeiEiYwz7rJQwyHuK2J7maIj8Lblr4afkyEaamixjMAXfrT6-RietVZK6FNnr1P_iAw/tiemu.png Sep 27 23:03:42 i want this Sep 27 23:04:14 on the pro side: free trip to canada to find polar bears Sep 27 23:04:24 on the con side: trip to canada to find polar bears Sep 27 23:05:00 mavhc: yeah - and they can be quite dangerous if you get between them and their natural prey of apples frozen inside a block of ice. Sep 27 23:07:24 javispedro, push that pic to rst Sep 27 23:07:45 what? why? Sep 27 23:07:52 well, have to go to bed, now that I got his scaler to work Sep 27 23:08:06 did garage explode or something? I can't commit or access the site Sep 27 23:08:10 after removing his EVIL pop r15 which made me waste half an hour. Sep 27 23:08:43 RST38h, have you seen this: http://fkwjcw.bay.livefilestore.com/y1p27A0pF0A3D-tY-TyYSVGeiEiYwz7rJQwyHuK2J7maIj8Lblr4afkyEaamixjMAXfrT6-RietVZK6FNnr1P_iAw/tiemu.png ? Sep 27 23:08:46 javispedro, RST38h is the person who does calculators Sep 27 23:08:53 lol Sep 27 23:09:04 oh Sep 27 23:09:11 why did i tihnk he wanst in the chan Sep 27 23:09:13 will bother him tomorrow for that Sep 27 23:09:26 i want that calc. Sep 27 23:09:46 well, gnite all. Sep 27 23:11:03 well, since we're discussing tiemu skins, I made this one yesterday: http://img14.imageshack.us/img14/4241/ti89.jpg Sep 27 23:11:32 that looks liqbaseish in its simplicity and skinning lol Sep 27 23:11:38 heh Sep 27 23:11:43 was going for gigantic buttons Sep 27 23:12:07 too busy Sep 27 23:12:20 i like dual mode calculators Sep 27 23:12:27 most of the time you only need base math func Sep 27 23:12:55 but then occasionally you wish it would roll out an ide and whiteboard and actually let you present your entire thesis Sep 27 23:13:14 those times are much rarer tho lol Sep 27 23:13:51 * lcuk tosses a coin Sep 27 23:13:55 heads i have a curry Sep 27 23:13:55 eh, made it so I didn't have to rotate the screen when I needed an 89 Sep 27 23:14:00 tails i go to bed Sep 27 23:14:17 Firebird, nothing against yours - i know what you mean Sep 27 23:14:27 im saying that most of the time the extra buttons are useless Sep 27 23:30:07 aww, can't commit to garage.maemo.org still :o Sep 27 23:34:07 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UoI8JIsrC0k&feature=player_profilepage :P got it fullscreen now heh Sep 27 23:34:45 fernand0, how's the performance feel? Sep 27 23:35:00 cause it looks really smooth Sep 27 23:35:19 johnx, its pretty fast Sep 28 00:34:31 Corsac: still around? Sep 28 00:34:44 hey GeneralAntilles \o Sep 28 00:34:50 If so, the script I've used is at http://pastebin.com/m1c7e91fd Sep 28 01:07:44 still love the 770. it is so.. solid. Sep 28 01:11:06 hah Sep 28 01:16:17 I have a n810 and I hace noticed something. When running Xchat I have noticed my battery lasts about half as long. Any ideals why this is happening? Sep 28 01:16:38 I seen nothing in the forums describing this Sep 28 01:16:51 if it keeps the wifi active constantly it'll shorten battery life Sep 28 01:17:04 makes sense thanks Sep 28 01:18:04 Not even chatting on it just being connected does it but that makes sense since the chats scrolling by are using the wifi Sep 28 01:18:17 right Sep 28 01:18:19 thanks microlith Sep 28 01:18:42 np Sep 28 01:18:54 comhack, file a bug Sep 28 01:19:02 ask people not to talk when you arent paying attention Sep 28 01:19:15 yeah right Sep 28 01:19:38 it might work :D Sep 28 01:19:49 hehehe Sep 28 01:20:04 also I am connected to 5 channels so 5x the wifi Sep 28 01:20:17 well not really all freenode Sep 28 01:20:17 not really Sep 28 01:21:01 how long is your battery lasting then Sep 28 01:21:16 on xchat? Sep 28 01:21:27 about 5 or 6 hours Sep 28 01:21:31 yeah - you said it was lasting about half as long Sep 28 01:21:36 yeah Sep 28 01:21:46 If you have a modernish router, it should support powersaving mode Sep 28 01:21:49 I can get about 8 or nine hours without it Sep 28 01:21:55 yeah its newer Sep 28 01:22:06 mmm not that new then Sep 28 01:22:09 this lets the radio in your device sleep for a substantial portion of the time, and the router to queue packets for it. Sep 28 01:22:10 8-9 hours with screen on? Sep 28 01:22:15 or idle Sep 28 01:22:19 cos mine lasts days Sep 28 01:22:21 idle Sep 28 01:22:22 still connected Sep 28 01:22:27 and pingable and sshable Sep 28 01:22:29 well I use it Sep 28 01:22:31 alot Sep 28 01:22:56 belkin G+mimo Sep 28 01:23:21 what other network apps do you have running? Sep 28 01:23:30 5 days idle and about 6 hours in use Sep 28 01:23:39 nothing really Sep 28 01:23:40 yeah sounds about right Sep 28 01:23:45 screen takes most Sep 28 01:24:06 weather sometimes pidgin and tear Sep 28 01:24:17 #weather-applet Sep 28 01:24:23 * lcuk nods Sep 28 01:24:54 I just notice if xchat is connected I sometimes run out of battery while sleeping Sep 28 01:25:00 not always but sometimes Sep 28 01:25:21 should connect when sleeping but I forget to plug up sometimes Sep 28 01:25:35 right guys Sep 28 01:25:56 no biggie though I have 6 computers anyway Sep 28 01:26:20 best $220 I have spent in a while though Sep 28 01:27:07 comhack: Cant wait for mer to become stable Sep 28 01:27:11 comhack, i tend to leave my charger nearby Sep 28 01:27:17 when its idle Sep 28 01:27:22 yeah I do too Sep 28 01:27:30 on my desk but you know forget sometimes Sep 28 01:27:33 lol Sep 28 01:27:34 yeah Sep 28 01:29:31 comhack, the way to do actions is type /me asdasdadasd Sep 28 01:29:38 * lcuk sadasdasdasd Sep 28 01:29:48 ahh Sep 28 01:30:00 I knew that but forgot thanks for reminding me Sep 28 01:30:27 penguinbait, how are we gonna cope waiting for an extra day Sep 28 01:34:30 I wonder if there is something wrong with my N810. Sep 28 01:34:49 Revolution is put off for 24hours, is their a coup? Sep 28 01:34:50 It seems to get really, really hot when either low on battery, or re-charging from being low on battery. Sep 28 01:35:13 how high does it go? Sep 28 01:35:29 I mean, it's not so hot that I can't pick it up. Sep 28 01:35:36 But it didn't used to do this. Sep 28 01:35:36 ohh thats not good Sep 28 01:35:51 mine rarely goes to 90F usually stays at 85F Sep 28 01:36:09 I mean, it's charging. I don't have a temperature reading. Sep 28 01:36:22 It's not even really turned "on". Sep 28 01:36:26 hometools provides the temp Sep 28 01:36:44 oops mean the weather-applet does Sep 28 01:36:50 OMWeather Sep 28 01:37:11 but hot to the touch is not good at all Sep 28 01:37:17 still under waranty? Sep 28 01:37:24 depends how cold your house is Sep 28 01:37:26 I doubt it. Sep 28 01:37:35 lcuk: true Sep 28 01:37:43 It's like 2 years old now. Sep 28 01:37:51 derf: probably not then Sep 28 01:37:59 is your house hot? Sep 28 01:38:01 the only time my device has run hot has been when i left it in the crate and had a book ontop and it was charging Sep 28 01:38:27 Not really ,no. Sep 28 01:38:32 derf - sounds like the battery itself might be fading Sep 28 01:38:45 How do you get the temperature from omweather? Sep 28 01:38:49 after 2 years of hard service - if as you say its at end of charge Sep 28 01:39:18 lcuk: Yeah, I just hope it's not one of those that explodes. Sep 28 01:39:21 derf: under the last tab sensor Sep 28 01:39:36 Tab? Sep 28 01:39:44 check yes when config Sep 28 01:39:48 its shows tabs Sep 28 01:39:57 last tab called Sensor Sep 28 01:40:05 I have absolutely no idea what you're talking about. Sep 28 01:40:08 check "Use device temperature monitor" Sep 28 01:40:19 click the desktop applet Sep 28 01:40:42 then click the icon to the left that looks like a wrench Sep 28 01:40:52 does omweather have a little nuclear reactor icon Sep 28 01:40:56 I don't have one of those. Sep 28 01:40:58 you will see tabs at the top then Sep 28 01:41:02 "the temp today is scorchio!" Sep 28 01:41:05 the last one to the right is Sensor Sep 28 01:41:09 I have a settings button. It does not have a Sensor tab. Sep 28 01:41:21 hmmm OMWeather?> Sep 28 01:42:17 I also wonder why it thinks it's Feb 22 1970. Sep 28 01:42:25 ugh Sep 28 01:42:32 man i feel like crap Sep 28 01:42:38 go to control then change the time/date Sep 28 01:42:39 omg Sep 28 01:42:45 its gotten so hot its gone back in time Sep 28 01:42:51 hehehe Sep 28 01:43:20 something is defintely wrong with your n810 Sep 28 01:44:03 never had an issue with the time/date myself Sep 28 01:44:11 course mine is only 4 months old Sep 28 01:44:33 have you updated to the newest diablo? Sep 28 01:45:11 Of course not. Sep 28 01:45:16 * lcuk must reflash tomorrow Sep 28 01:45:40 hahaha Sep 28 01:46:11 derf, kot still runs chinook :) Sep 28 01:46:22 ugh Sep 28 01:46:36 rock solid stable tho :) Sep 28 01:46:53 nothing wrong with chinook Sep 28 01:47:05 Might be your problem Sep 28 01:47:08 dunno Sep 28 01:47:35 MaceN8x0: n810? Sep 28 01:47:38 omfg this cold or flu Sep 28 01:47:47 i run diablo Sep 28 01:47:51 MaceN8x0: sorry to hear that Sep 28 01:47:56 sorry Sep 28 01:47:58 haha Sep 28 01:47:58 meant derf Sep 28 01:48:01 derf, it might be symptoms of upgraditis Sep 28 01:48:38 lcuk: that what I thin ktoo Sep 28 01:48:57 damn little keyboard Sep 28 01:49:16 ;) i make worse mistakes with a big keyboard Sep 28 01:49:17 I'll believe you when you can point me to a closed bug report. Sep 28 01:49:34 which bug you waiting to be "fixed in fremantle"? Sep 28 01:49:48 Whatever bug makes my device really warm when it charges. Sep 28 01:50:20 try it with a different battery if possible Sep 28 01:50:29 or have you perhaps changed the charger itself Sep 28 01:50:45 Nope. Sep 28 01:51:06 Only one battery, and I sold the N800 last year, so I've even been using the proper charger. Sep 28 01:51:07 derf: does it get hot plugged in? Sep 28 01:51:14 comhack: Yes. Sep 28 01:51:22 How do you think it was charging? Sep 28 01:51:26 hmm not the battery then dont think anyway Sep 28 01:51:40 ari jaaksi reality distortion field ;) Sep 28 01:51:42 I mean, it was also really hot while in my pocket unplugged last week, running low on battery. Sep 28 01:51:44 devices not trickle charging from USB is evil Sep 28 01:51:50 no I meant does it get hot when chargin or just when using battery Sep 28 01:51:52 is it expensive to implement? Sep 28 01:51:57 comhack: Both. Sep 28 01:52:01 hmm Sep 28 01:52:38 derf do some monitoring with top etc Sep 28 01:52:40 It's cooled off substantially now. Sep 28 01:52:44 see if anything is sitting draining Sep 28 01:53:21 #1 CPU user is top. Sep 28 01:53:33 If I am not mistaken I think I read the advanced-backlight caused heating issues Sep 28 01:53:47 running it?/ Sep 28 01:53:48 Good thing I don't have that installed. Sep 28 01:54:06 well it was an ideal Sep 28 01:55:13 well lets hope it is not a hardware problem hopefully it is software related Sep 28 01:56:01 Yes, let's. Sep 28 01:56:24 what do you run software-wise all the time Sep 28 01:56:37 that may cause this Sep 28 01:56:58 Not much. Sep 28 01:57:24 a crontabbed ps may be a plan Sep 28 01:57:25 what then? to figure out what is causing it Sep 28 01:57:37 I've got the clock, Google bar, and omweather as my only desktop applets. Sep 28 01:57:46 well thats not much Sep 28 01:57:50 I'd say ntpd, but that isn't started by default. Sep 28 01:57:56 I have those running Sep 28 01:58:01 besides ntpd Sep 28 01:58:03 ps -aux run every ten minutes or so Sep 28 01:58:12 see if anything comes up as using lots of cpu Sep 28 02:02:17 Ah, found the temperature sensor. Sep 28 02:02:25 derf: cool Sep 28 02:02:25 /sys/devices/platform/i2c_omap.1/i2c-1/1-0048/temp1_input Sep 28 02:02:37 It's apparently down to 41.4°C now. Sep 28 02:03:19 thats still way high Sep 28 02:03:24 106 F Sep 28 02:03:46 I⇧have never got over 92F with tons of stuff running Sep 28 02:04:12 On that note, why do they say that the n900 can multiatsk n810 can too wtf Sep 28 02:04:20 temp1_crit is 96°C. Sep 28 02:04:43 Because the N900 has enough RAM to load 2 programs. Sep 28 02:04:47 still for normal use that is way hihg Sep 28 02:04:52 #high Sep 28 02:05:07 I have 4 or 5 running sometimes with no lag Sep 28 02:05:23 Depends what they are. Sep 28 02:05:40 Sometimes I can't even open a second browser window. Sep 28 02:05:43 well I have maemo on sd card and use 128 virtual Sep 28 02:06:27 In my experience, if you're actually using VM in any real fashion, it becomes faster to reboot the device and start over than to wait for it to actually page things back in. Sep 28 02:06:42 128+ 128 virtual Sep 28 02:06:59 It's okay for an occasional escape valve, but that's about it. Sep 28 02:07:47 multitask all the time I use the n810 I figure it is just a selling point since the n810 can multitask Sep 28 02:07:52 Fortunately, heavy swapping often lags the device so badly the watchdog will helpfully reboot it for you. Sep 28 02:08:45 never had a problem running multiple apps well a tiny bit but nothing major Sep 28 02:09:07 I said, it depends on what programs. Sep 28 02:09:13 I can do that with one program. Sep 28 02:09:34 Hmm well usually pidgin, xchat, and tear Sep 28 02:09:44 all stays running Sep 28 02:09:58 and vagalume Sep 28 02:22:40 http://www.theonion.com/content/news/cat_congress_mired_in_sunbeam Sep 28 02:23:17 I voted for the cat congress Sep 28 02:23:29 heheheh nice link Sep 28 02:27:05 At this point, I'd see the cat Congress doing a better job than the buffoons currently in office. Sep 28 02:28:13 thats the truth Sep 28 02:28:46 change my ass Sep 28 02:29:00 more of the same Sep 28 02:29:38 The best approach to government is to keep as much of what you own far away from it, and scam it for all it's dumb enough to give you, in my opinion. Sep 28 02:29:40 I was at trhe g2 summit I live 40 miles away Sep 28 02:29:59 I heard the sound weapon screetching Sep 28 02:30:09 got a headache from it Sep 28 02:30:12 mild Sep 28 02:30:49 I wonder if it ended up killing anyone? (as a side effect, that is... it's supposedly nonlethal) Sep 28 02:30:56 I left right away myself Sep 28 02:31:05 dunno first time uses on us citizens Sep 28 02:31:18 Not the last, though. Sep 28 02:31:41 I know Sep 28 02:31:48 locked and loaded here Sep 28 02:32:05 welcome to 1984 Sep 28 02:32:12 almost anyway Sep 28 02:32:37 more like animal farm Sep 28 02:32:44 Oink Sep 28 02:32:57 I concur Sep 28 02:33:04 We'd be OK if they'd just prosecute for treason. ;) Sep 28 02:33:36 n900 is doubleplusgood! Sep 28 02:33:40 kind of hard to do that when congress are traitors Sep 28 02:33:57 SpeedEvil: looks nice but not for the proice Sep 28 02:34:02 #price Sep 28 02:34:23 and I already have a phone Sep 28 02:34:27 price is doubleplusungood. Sep 28 02:34:32 "Didn't you say something about 'supporting and defending the Constitution of the United States'? Didn't work out, I guess?" Sep 28 02:34:34 Meh, the n900 is overrated. A nice gadget, to be sure, but the price is too high for something of that... what comhack said. Sep 28 02:34:37 was fine with the internet tablet but a phone no thanks Sep 28 02:34:42 comhack, give it 6 months. Sep 28 02:34:50 true Sep 28 02:34:50 It's an internet tablet with phone functionality. Sep 28 02:35:07 a gimmick for now IMHO Sep 28 02:35:22 Exactly, I don't want a phone, which in the US means a ridiculous contract. I can afford it with no trouble, but I'll be damned if I'm ripped off by some greedy telecom. Sep 28 02:35:23 besides maemo 5 Sep 28 02:35:24 It's a revolution. Sep 28 02:35:38 no doubr Sep 28 02:35:46 #doubt Sep 28 02:35:52 It's the first real open source cellular communications devices. Sep 28 02:36:14 hmmm g1? Sep 28 02:36:33 comhack, can you easily load Debian on a G1? Sep 28 02:36:42 not for sure Sep 28 02:36:42 comhack, can you run desktop Linux applications on a G1? Sep 28 02:36:55 Will Google let you participate in the architecting and coding of the platform? Sep 28 02:37:05 GeneralAntilles: Actually, yes. Sep 28 02:37:08 dont have one Sep 28 02:37:24 MoaBird, to which of the above? :) Sep 28 02:37:46 google is testing the idea of 'waves' on the interent... Sep 28 02:37:56 like when a url link passes around chat Sep 28 02:38:00 Android isn't open source like Maemo is open source. Sep 28 02:38:04 Your last comment about the coding of the platform. No idea about Debian, although I can't see why not if someone would bother to port it. Sep 28 02:38:13 i think it's just branding of existing phenomena, like twit-ter Sep 28 02:38:16 GeneralAntilles: didnt know that Sep 28 02:38:30 No, and Maemo isn't half as useful as Android at the moment, nor has it ever been in the past. Sep 28 02:38:51 MoaBird, have you ever used Maemo? Sep 28 02:38:52 me: waitng on mer to become stable Sep 28 02:38:56 If it can get a critical mass of devs behind it, that may change... until then.... Sep 28 02:39:17 I find Maemo a lot more fulfilling and _useful_ than Android day-to-day. Sep 28 02:39:29 GeneralAntilles: I have, I own an n810 with Maemo 4 on it, and Mer on an external card. Sep 28 02:39:56 MoaBird: I had mer on my n810 but too much stuff not working yet Sep 28 02:39:57 To each his own, then. I just find that the apps aren't there. Sep 28 02:40:01 cannot wait till stable Sep 28 02:40:04 Qualifications about "usefulness" are about as personal and anecdotal as it can get, anyway. Sep 28 02:40:15 So it's hardly a useful metric to try to use on a larger scale. Sep 28 02:40:19 Android's terrible. Sep 28 02:40:28 Android is fake open source. Sep 28 02:40:31 True enough, but I wasn't making claims to an objective statement. Sep 28 02:40:38 zerojay: yup ran it in virtualbox and it sux Sep 28 02:40:41 Was so close to getting an HTC Magic when the N900 started showing up. Sep 28 02:40:57 Glad I saved myself the trouble. Sep 28 02:41:01 Stuff life Anrdoid and LiMo are going to do major harm to open source in the long run if things keep moving as they have. Sep 28 02:41:17 comhack, the final Fremantle SDK is apparently coming out soon. Sep 28 02:41:26 Next week. Sep 28 02:41:30 comhack, so it should be a lot better once that code is integrated. Sep 28 02:41:37 zerojay, didn't want to quote exact dates. ;) Sep 28 02:41:40 GeneralAntilles: cool thanks alot Sep 28 02:42:10 GeneralAntilles: That's what I heard from kon... konto... whatever his name is. :) Sep 28 02:42:20 MoaBird, Android is yet-another-phone-os. Maemo is the desktop computing experience in your pocket. Sep 28 02:42:26 Worlds of difference there. Sep 28 02:42:35 *HUUUUGE* difference. Sep 28 02:42:42 zerojay, canttory, I think. Sep 28 02:42:42 GeneralAntilles: I agree so far Sep 28 02:42:46 Get it in your hands and you'll understand. Sep 28 02:42:47 lol Sep 28 02:43:10 it is kind of funny when they get a jew to play a christian reverend Sep 28 02:43:21 irony at its best :) Sep 28 02:43:23 mmkay. Sep 28 02:43:38 MaceN8x0: lol Sep 28 02:43:47 best one was the movir conspiracy Sep 28 02:44:23 where a jew was playing one of the final solution nazis Sep 28 02:44:38 GeneralAntilles: Maybe so, but what advantages do you feel the desktop computing experience offers? Sep 28 02:44:57 MoaBird, I don't carry a laptop around with me. My Maemo device is my laptop. Sep 28 02:45:06 So it needs to be able to do things that a mobile phone OS just can't do. Sep 28 02:45:12 how much will take for n900's price to drop to a more reasonable level? Sep 28 02:45:14 are the community results in yet? Sep 28 02:45:26 milos_, shouldn't be more than 6 or 8 months. Sep 28 02:45:29 kind of curious to see who won Sep 28 02:45:34 pupnik, voting was extended until tomorrow night. Sep 28 02:45:37 Such as? In my own experience, I've really not had much trouble using a mobile OS for everything I'd do on a laptop. Only the UI differs. Sep 28 02:45:42 milos_: I dunno considering the n810 went back up from $220 to $400 Sep 28 02:45:42 GeneralAntilles: ok thnx! Sep 28 02:45:43 ty GeneralAntilles Sep 28 02:46:08 MoaBird, suck as not being knackered with and generally catering to operator requirements. Sep 28 02:46:10 i hope the people i want to work on other things don't win :) Sep 28 02:46:17 Such as not being a pain in the ass to get root access. Sep 28 02:46:42 Such as having a decent web browser. Sep 28 02:46:52 impossible Sep 28 02:46:53 Such as not generally being unpleasant to install software from wherever the hell I please, thank you very much. Sep 28 02:46:55 because the web is crap Sep 28 02:46:57 Such as not having some piss-poor watered down internet experience. Sep 28 02:47:02 ^ Sep 28 02:47:05 zerojay: I dunno tear is ok Sep 28 02:47:07 pupnik, ur crap!!1 Sep 28 02:47:18 comhack: Didn't know Tear ran on mobile phones. Sep 28 02:47:34 oh sorry Sep 28 02:47:39 Funny, I actually prefer the water-down experience, due to small screens forcing pages into better layouts. With ad-blocking it's much easier to access all the info. Sep 28 02:47:44 thinking of maemo Sep 28 02:47:46 watered-down* Sep 28 02:47:54 GeneralAntilles: if i were supergod programmer, i'd make a browser that seeks-out text blocks and displays them compactly on a page - compacting all the ads and suspect useless shit into little shrunken blocks Sep 28 02:47:59 MoaBird, ah, yes, those small screens that nothing fits on. Sep 28 02:48:05 My Maemo device has 800x480 Sep 28 02:48:10 Nothing else matches that. Sep 28 02:48:18 The N900 means no compromise... and I did add my own adblocking hosts file too. :) Sep 28 02:48:39 To each his own, I suppose. I prefer a user interface tailored to a handheld device, as opposed to a scaled down desktop UI. Sep 28 02:48:52 maemo has a tailored ui Sep 28 02:48:56 It is tailored. Sep 28 02:49:04 zerojay: yup Sep 28 02:49:04 just using the devkit shows that Sep 28 02:49:23 MoaBird, where did I say that we have a scaled down desktop UI? Sep 28 02:49:29 MoaBird, where did I say I prefer that? Sep 28 02:49:33 It's not simply desktop running on a mobile unit... the UI is very optimized to a mobile device. Sep 28 02:49:35 random user holds up his imaginary world as the standard for 'handheld device UI'/ Yawn Sep 28 02:49:36 I prefer the desktop EXPERIENCE not the desktop UI. Sep 28 02:49:47 I'm aware, but seeing as GeneralAntilles was referring to the ability to run desktop Linux on one's Nokia, I figured I'd bring it up. Sep 28 02:49:47 GeneralAntilles: me too Sep 28 02:49:53 hm Sep 28 02:50:09 point of the internet tablet Sep 28 02:50:17 world domination now Sep 28 02:50:19 MoaBird: in the sense that it is actually Linux and not Dalvik or some other layer, and you have control over the system. Sep 28 02:50:20 if I wanted that I would use my phone Sep 28 02:50:25 GeneralAntilles: right? Sep 28 02:50:40 Right Sep 28 02:50:55 which is why I'm jumping on the N900 bandwagon Sep 28 02:51:02 In the sense that getting running on Maemo is reasonably pain free. Sep 28 02:51:24 i prefer seperate phone / tablet. but n900 is still greatness. Sep 28 02:51:26 GeneralAntillesL And that would require a UI overhaul, yes? Sep 28 02:51:55 pupnik: I agree but I think it is over hyped Sep 28 02:52:15 MoaBird: They can run straight without an overhaul.. but it works a lot better when you do spend the time to port the UI over to Maemo standards. Sep 28 02:52:27 MoaBird, depends entirely on the application. Sep 28 02:52:39 But the point is, you have the option not to do the overhaul if you just need the application. Sep 28 02:52:53 Right. Sep 28 02:52:56 You're not required to spend months porting it to Davlik or a web runtime. Sep 28 02:53:09 or hope apple approves it :) Sep 28 02:53:13 comhack: really depends on your perspective. if you're asking 'what can it do *today*?' you have a good point Sep 28 02:53:33 microlith: As an iPhone developer, don't even get me started. Sep 28 02:53:58 just send some weed to the store interns Sep 28 02:54:09 pupnik: And *today*, it's still in beta... so that makes sense. Sep 28 02:54:22 pupnik: true I know as mer becomes stable it will be able to do alot more Sep 28 02:54:47 i use linux on my desktop so these are the only devices for me Sep 28 02:54:59 i can't begin to guess what 'normal' people want Sep 28 02:54:59 me too on 6 machines Sep 28 02:55:18 'normal' people go for the iphone I suppose Sep 28 02:55:29 screw normal I want geeky only Sep 28 02:55:34 since before that they had basic flip-phones and candybars Sep 28 02:55:35 I've been on Linux at home since 2000... but I still have to use Windows at work. Sep 28 02:55:35 or maybe the n900.. it does pack a punch. Sep 28 02:55:53 pupnik: n900 has kind of a narrow audience, imo Sep 28 02:56:00 I wish linux was stil geeky instead of for "normal peopl" Sep 28 02:56:16 microlith: if i didn't know linux, i'd be attracted to screen and keyboard Sep 28 02:56:19 comhack: Stay away from Ubuntu and you're fine. :) Sep 28 02:56:20 thats why I use archlinux and openbox Sep 28 02:56:38 hey now Sep 28 02:56:44 I like building my machines from ground up Sep 28 02:56:51 ArchLinux is pretty good. Been using it for a few months after years on Gentoo. Sep 28 02:56:51 ubuntu is good stuf Sep 28 02:57:03 err not for me though Sep 28 02:57:08 too mainstream Sep 28 02:57:09 for me Sep 28 02:57:14 lol Sep 28 02:57:21 I gotta disagree. Ubuntu does all sorts of shit that just pisses me off. Sep 28 02:57:26 any gnu linux system can be both Sep 28 02:57:32 next LFS Sep 28 02:57:37 not everybody needs to know internals Sep 28 02:57:39 linux from scratch Sep 28 02:57:44 yeah I know Sep 28 02:57:46 and if you do you can Sep 28 02:57:54 but more users more problems Sep 28 02:57:57 imho Sep 28 02:57:58 nothing wrong with making it more accessible Sep 28 02:58:02 wrong Sep 28 02:58:04 I know Sep 28 02:58:04 Turning off the root account? GTFO. Sep 28 02:58:09 more users more debugging output Sep 28 02:58:10 just like the geekiness Sep 28 02:58:14 zerojay: it's not -off- Sep 28 02:58:22 and more willingness by manufacturers to create drivers Sep 28 02:58:34 I like to compile my own Sep 28 02:58:35 microlith: It might as well be. Sep 28 02:58:36 but yes Sep 28 02:58:45 better support because of more users Sep 28 02:58:58 zerojay: c'mon, if you're even halfway used to Linux it's trivial to get a root console Sep 28 02:58:59 its a oxymoron Sep 28 02:59:15 I for one wish that more non Windows OSes had survived the 90s. Sep 28 02:59:18 microlith: I'm not a fan of needing to sudo everything, sorry. Sep 28 02:59:25 heh Sep 28 02:59:28 so Sep 28 02:59:29 sudo su Sep 28 02:59:30 passwd Sep 28 02:59:31 done Sep 28 02:59:33 speaking of moron, does anybody want to push a couple of sdl projects into fremantle? Sep 28 02:59:45 microlith: See, why should I even have to jump through that loop? Sep 28 02:59:51 i can help jumpstart any project on my page **** ENDING LOGGING AT Mon Sep 28 02:59:57 2009