**** BEGIN LOGGING AT Fri Oct 16 02:59:57 2009
Oct 16 03:02:52 <zerojay> Anyone here can help me with a few translations?
Oct 16 03:03:11 <zerojay> From English into whatever it is you speak.
Oct 16 03:03:21 <pupnik_> semi german here
Oct 16 03:03:44 <lcuk> northern here
Oct 16 03:04:04 <zerojay> lol
Oct 16 03:05:05 <pupnik_> what is this white mild dutch cheese called
Oct 16 03:05:09 <pupnik_> it is so good
Oct 16 03:05:30 <zerojay> foot cheese.
Oct 16 03:05:38 <Solarion> better than head cheese
Oct 16 03:06:38 <pupnik_> browsing on n900 is really prime-time
Oct 16 03:07:01 <pupnik_> and the multitasking really works
Oct 16 03:07:19 <pupnik_> the power is really there
Oct 16 03:07:40 <zerojay> Sure is.
Oct 16 03:07:58 * microlith looks as nokia places the hold on his account again...
Oct 16 03:09:19 * ifreq just dreams about n900 and continue on hacking n770 :-) (sdhc kernel enabled)
Oct 16 03:09:41 <pupnik_> 770 forevah
Oct 16 03:10:44 <lcuk> ifreq, what are you making it do?
Oct 16 03:11:02 * |R will not sleep until he gets his N900 >:|
Oct 16 03:11:13 * Solarion will sleep many times before he gets his n900
Oct 16 03:11:14 * lcuk can sleep
Oct 16 03:11:21 <|R> hehe
Oct 16 03:11:33 <Solarion> (if at all)
Oct 16 03:11:58 <lcuk> pupnik_, i thought i busted sdk, but it just drained its own battery
Oct 16 03:12:16 <pupnik_> ?
Oct 16 03:12:26 <lcuk> it went off
Oct 16 03:12:35 <lcuk> but it was plugged into usb
Oct 16 03:12:35 <ifreq> lcuk: i dont have any decent mp3players atm. So ill buy today microsdhc card  and hook it up with 770 + canola as mediaplayer
Oct 16 03:12:37 <oilinki> ifreq: that's like eating hamburgers and dreaming of a real stake :)
Oct 16 03:12:39 <lcuk> and it wouldnt come back
Oct 16 03:12:51 <|R> I wonder how fast Zagg will produce their N900 screen protectors
Oct 16 03:13:08 <ifreq> oilinki: well, its fun :) i always liked 770 too.. its been gathering dust for few years now :)
Oct 16 03:13:20 <Proteous> I prefer steak
Oct 16 03:13:21 <ifreq> oilinki: it even has the star trek lcars theme installed!! :-)
Oct 16 03:13:40 <ifreq> ill get n900 when my colleague gets bored with hes prototype from nokia
Oct 16 03:13:43 <oilinki> ifreq: hih :)
Oct 16 03:13:45 <Proteous> stake == splinters in mouth
Oct 16 03:14:22 <oilinki> I guess n770 could be turned to 'the almighty home remote controller'
Oct 16 03:14:39 <Proteous> no IR port
Oct 16 03:15:02 <lcuk> i use my 8x0 900 as remote control
Oct 16 03:15:04 <lcuk> using wifi
Oct 16 03:15:05 <oilinki> maybe could work together with some mediaplayer with usb-port
Oct 16 03:15:20 <lcuk> controls my windows pc easily
Oct 16 03:15:21 <Proteous> lcuk: how?
Oct 16 03:15:26 <Proteous> ah
Oct 16 03:15:55 <oilinki> then the mediaplayer would play music/videos etc.. and also send ir for the home devices like tv, aircon, fans etc.
Oct 16 03:16:37 <Proteous> you have IR controled fans?
Oct 16 03:16:56 <Proteous> I guess with x10 or something
Oct 16 03:16:58 <oilinki> I have one
Oct 16 03:17:09 <lcuk> Proteous, i use liqremote http://liqbase.net/liq.20091016_041607.liqremote.scr.png and a little windows daemon
Oct 16 03:17:19 <lcuk> its very specific to my network
Oct 16 03:17:24 <Proteous> roger
Oct 16 03:17:25 <lcuk> so ive never pushed it to repo :$
Oct 16 03:17:29 <oilinki> but then there are also lot's of pretty cheap ir-power controllers
Oct 16 03:17:43 <Proteous> oilinki: yeah
Oct 16 03:18:00 <lcuk> n900 has ir
Oct 16 03:18:01 <lcuk> ;)
Oct 16 03:18:05 <Proteous> yeah
Oct 16 03:18:11 <Proteous> should make an awesome remote
Oct 16 03:18:26 <lcuk> but this ip remote is more useful - could be configured to change volume from across the world!
Oct 16 03:18:28 <Proteous> and still be cheaper then some of the crazy touchscreen remotes out there...
Oct 16 03:18:29 <pupnik_> fm xmitter works ok too
Oct 16 03:18:36 <pupnik_> needs to be close tho
Oct 16 03:18:43 <pupnik_> couple meters
Oct 16 03:18:52 <lcuk> 12000 miles lol
Oct 16 03:19:11 <lcuk> reliable as heck too, ive never had it not work
Oct 16 03:19:13 <pupnik_> ?
Oct 16 03:19:20 <lcuk> lol my remote control
Oct 16 03:19:35 <lcuk> if i had switched it on in AMS it wouldv controlled the volume at home
Oct 16 03:19:36 <Proteous> uses batteries like nothing though :P
Oct 16 03:19:57 <lcuk> movies are only a couple of hours long and idle wifi and screen is perfect
Oct 16 03:20:04 <Proteous> :)
Oct 16 03:20:04 <lcuk> my 810 is great for it
Oct 16 03:21:02 <pupnik_> rapidshite dl seems broken
Oct 16 03:29:01 <zerojay> pupnik_: Browser will be even better with Adblock Plus and FlashBlock... which I'm working on now.
Oct 16 03:34:06 <pupnik_> awesome
Oct 16 03:36:18 <Solarion> there. Today's progress pushed; I'm going to bed
Oct 16 03:36:53 <pupnik_> cheers Solarion
Oct 16 03:37:26 <|R> zerojay : yeah!
Oct 16 03:40:34 <|R> zerojay : how is the plugin interface on the new browser?
Oct 16 03:40:51 <|R> we won't be able to just install mozilla plugins that don't screw up the interface will we?
Oct 16 03:44:39 <zerojay> Some will work, some won't.
Oct 16 03:45:07 <zerojay> Greasemonkey... it installs but doesn't recognize scripts at all even locally installed.
Oct 16 03:45:39 <zerojay> adblock plus installs, but doesn't allow you to set up subscriptions (therefore the package I'm working on)
Oct 16 03:45:59 <Macer> well
Oct 16 03:46:07 <Macer> looks like bones and booth are slated to finally have sex
Oct 16 03:46:10 <Macer> about time
Oct 16 03:46:15 <microlith> I suspect noscript would be difficult with respect to accessing its functions (status bar, site popup)
Oct 16 03:46:18 <zerojay> k.. who cares.
Oct 16 03:46:50 <zerojay> Anyways, if I want to push a second package to autobuilder, do I have to tell it I want to do so for a new package or what?
Oct 16 03:46:52 <Macer> zerojay: people who have had sex before? :)
Oct 16 03:47:06 <zerojay> Macer: Said like a true virgin. lol
Oct 16 03:47:29 <zerojay> Oh, never mind.
Oct 16 03:47:35 <Macer> lol!
Oct 16 03:47:43 <Macer> i'lll tell that to my son when he gets older
Oct 16 03:48:09 <Macer> like the Michael Jackson test tube baby
Oct 16 03:48:32 <zerojay> [extra-builds] [Fremantle] : adblock-plus-1.0_1maemo0-2, build OK. :)
Oct 16 03:48:57 <microlith> awesome
Oct 16 03:55:21 <pupnik_> how do i delete fraudulent ad-hoc network entries?
Oct 16 03:55:43 <Macer> fraudulent? :) heh
Oct 16 04:03:44 <|R> zerojay : ok :)
Oct 16 04:04:39 <GAN900> pupnik, how you like the N900 anyway?
Oct 16 04:05:08 <GAN900> zerojay, 'Antilles Block'? ;)
Oct 16 04:08:12 <zerojay> GAN900: lol
Oct 16 04:08:15 <zerojay> No.
Oct 16 04:11:17 <pupnik_> i dont see how to search bugs by os release
Oct 16 04:11:26 <pupnik_> on bugs.maemo.org
Oct 16 04:12:35 <GAN900> pupnik, advanced search and select the appropriate versions
Oct 16 04:12:52 <zerojay> First attempt at Flashblock on N900...
Oct 16 04:13:30 <GAN900> andre__, I'm going to start kicking kittens everytime I see you quote from an internal bug. :(((
Oct 16 04:13:40 <GAN900> God that shit is frustrating.
Oct 16 04:14:20 <GAN900> Just cut out the goddamn middle man and get your shit together, Nokia. :(
Oct 16 04:14:56 <Macer> wow this tb is slowly but surely turningn into major suckage :)
Oct 16 04:15:14 <Macer> i have to see if Stskeeps' sd image will work on it
Oct 16 04:15:24 <GAN900> At least it's software.
Oct 16 04:15:24 <Macer> just so i can get rid of this damn touchbook os
Oct 16 04:15:32 <Macer> yeah. the hardware isn't too bad
Oct 16 04:15:44 <Macer> but this operating system is an abortion
Oct 16 04:16:00 <Macer> i think the bigggest thing that is messing me up is the lack of multiple users
Oct 16 04:16:07 <GAN900> Same thing with the SmartQ it seems.
Oct 16 04:16:20 <GAN900> Thus the overwhelming need for Mer.
Oct 16 04:16:28 <Macer> yeah. i would have to agree :)
Oct 16 04:16:51 <Macer> mer in higher res sounds outstanding right about now
Oct 16 04:16:59 <Macer> this thing randomly blanks the screen
Oct 16 04:17:08 <Macer> sometimes once an hour.. sometimes 3 times in an hour
Oct 16 04:17:14 <Macer> sometimes twice every 5 minutes
Oct 16 04:17:26 <Macer> because of piss poor power management
Oct 16 04:17:35 <Macer> as well as having the cpu run at 600MHz
Oct 16 04:17:49 <Macer> non-stop. with no throttling :)
Oct 16 04:18:10 <Macer> so the battery that is supposed to last 12+ hours .. really last 7 or 8
Oct 16 04:19:41 <pupnik_> bugs.maemo.org should show recent bugs with activity / comments
Oct 16 04:19:48 <Macer> i know they said the os would be beta.. but damn :) some things are just definately supposed to work in a beta stage.. like say.. the touch screen mouse for one
Oct 16 04:20:25 <Macer> i had to find a wiki and install tslib by hand.. and it made me wonder why the hell they wouldn't have done that in the alpha stages :)
Oct 16 04:20:41 <Macer> it is called a TOUCH book.. wouldn't that kind of have some sort of priority?
Oct 16 04:21:47 <pupnik_> get a blog
Oct 16 04:22:21 <Macer> i'm still fixing my web server ;)
Oct 16 04:24:25 <pupnik_> i can not search bugs.maemo.org simply for fremantle pre-release bugs
Oct 16 04:24:47 <pupnik_> i need a quick overview if the problems i find have been found already
Oct 16 04:25:58 <pupnik_> if i have to spend 1 hour searching in vain per submitted bug, it is a no-go
Oct 16 04:26:51 <GAN900> punik, sure you can.
Oct 16 04:27:12 <GAN900> Select the Fremantle versions in the version field.
Oct 16 04:29:14 <GAN900> http://tinyurl.com/yjzkvwf
Oct 16 04:29:20 <GAN900> For the Fremantle bugs
Oct 16 04:30:03 <pupnik_> i got zero
Oct 16 04:30:40 <GAN900> and everything changed in the past 2 days
Oct 16 04:30:41 <GAN900> http://tinyurl.com/ygwsgte
Oct 16 04:31:05 <zerojay> Fuck, why do we still have to reboot the tablet twice before plugins work?
Oct 16 04:31:44 <GAN900> Can you reboot the browser twice?
Oct 16 04:32:06 <zerojay> Simply rerunning browser twice won't work.
Oct 16 04:32:27 <zerojay> I guess the daemon...
Oct 16 04:32:30 <zerojay> Wasn't sure though.
Oct 16 04:32:46 <GAN900> Ah, yeah.
Oct 16 04:32:58 <pupnik_> those "fremantle bugs" include bugs from 2007, GAN900
Oct 16 04:33:07 <pupnik_> this is a problem
Oct 16 04:33:33 <pupnik_> nokia lent out 300 N900s and said "please report bugs"
Oct 16 04:33:56 <zerojay> Yes.
Oct 16 04:33:59 <pupnik_> there should be a hotlink to report n900 bugs and quickly get to relevant area
Oct 16 04:33:59 <zerojay> So?
Oct 16 04:34:26 <zerojay> bugs.maemo.org.
Oct 16 04:34:33 <pupnik_> no
Oct 16 04:34:39 <pupnik_> you are not seeing
Oct 16 04:34:48 <zerojay> That's right, I'm not.
Oct 16 04:35:16 <pupnik_> those "fremantle bugs" include bugs from 2007
Oct 16 04:35:27 <zerojay> Yes... so?
Oct 16 04:35:35 <zerojay> What's the problem?
Oct 16 04:36:00 <pupnik_> there is no link to report N900 prototype bugs
Oct 16 04:36:13 <zerojay> Just set the version.
Oct 16 04:36:22 <pupnik_> there is no link to see N900 prototype bugs
Oct 16 04:36:36 <pupnik_> ok
Oct 16 04:37:04 <zerojay> Just use bugzilla's advanced search.
Oct 16 04:37:17 <pupnik_> which as i have shown is not useful
Oct 16 04:37:39 <zerojay> And yes, it's normal for there to be bugs from 2007 listed among fremantle bugs. They were found back in the day and still exist in Fremantle or haven't been fixed yet.
Oct 16 04:37:44 <zerojay> It's quite useful.
Oct 16 04:37:44 <pupnik_> https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=943
Oct 16 04:37:52 <pupnik_> fremantle bug?
Oct 16 04:38:26 <zerojay> Yes, fremantle bug.
Oct 16 04:38:47 <zerojay> First, enhancement.
Oct 16 04:38:55 <zerojay> Second, version is set as 5.0-beta
Oct 16 04:40:30 <GAN900> pupnik, evidently they're still valid in Fremantle, then. :)
Oct 16 04:41:13 <zerojay> pupnik_: https://bugs.maemo.org/buglist.cgi?query_format=advanced&short_desc_type=allwordssubstr&short_desc=&version=5.0&version=5.0+(1.2009.41-10)&version=5.0-alpha&version=5.0-alpha-pre1&version=5.0-alpha-pre2&version=5.0-beta&version=5.0-beta2&version=5.0-final&version=Fremantle&long_desc_type=substring&long_desc=&bug_file_loc_type=allwordssubstr&bug_file_loc=&status_whiteboard_type=allwordssubstr&status_whiteboard=&keywords_
Oct 16 04:41:15 <zerojay> type=allwords&keywords=&bug_status=NEW&bug_status=ASSIGNED&bug_status=REOPENED&emailassigned_to1=1&emailtype1=substring&email1=&emailassigned_to2=1&emailreporter2=1&emailqa_contact2=1&emailcc2=1&emailtype2=substring&email2=&bugidtype=include&bug_id=&votes=&chfieldfrom=&chfieldto=Now&chfieldvalue=&cmdtype=doit&order=Reuse+same+sort+as+last+time&field0-0-0=noop&type0-0-0=noop&value0-0-0=
Oct 16 04:41:18 <zerojay> Argh.
Oct 16 04:41:20 <zerojay> Damn.
Oct 16 04:41:33 <GAN900> pupnik, the advanced search provides you with everything you need. :)
Oct 16 04:41:40 <zerojay> EVERYTHING.
Oct 16 04:42:01 <GAN900> You can time limit it if you want.
Oct 16 04:42:06 <zerojay> Just because you don't know how to use a tool doesn't mean it's useless. I've used Bugzilla daily for 8 years... it has everything you need.
Oct 16 04:43:15 <zerojay> I've got a list of 405 open bugs that were created or targeted for or during fremantle's development in front of me.
Oct 16 04:44:00 <zerojay> (By the way, this is the exact same reaction I hear from new testers each and every time we hire them.)
Oct 16 04:44:35 <pupnik_> thanks
Oct 16 04:44:50 <zerojay> Just click on advanced search, leave everything alone except Version. Ctrl-Click each and every Fremantle version. Then hit search. Boom. The list is yours.
Oct 16 04:45:53 <zerojay> Meh, looks like Flashblock will need additional massaging before it will work. :/
Oct 16 04:48:53 <pupnik_> then i suggest adding links to useful searches
Oct 16 04:49:15 <zerojay> You can do that yourself with Save Search at the bottom of every Bugzilla page.
Oct 16 04:49:25 <pupnik_> yeah i know
Oct 16 04:49:45 <pupnik_> current interface is a barrier
Oct 16 04:50:08 <pupnik_> as your experience with new testers shows
Oct 16 04:50:40 <zerojay> It's a bug tracker.
Oct 16 04:51:28 <zerojay> And my experience with new testers just shows how new they were because none of them has ever worked QA before.
Oct 16 04:51:47 <zerojay> Bugzilla wasn't really the issue. It was the new concepts.
Oct 16 04:52:12 <pupnik_> fine for an in-house environment, bad public interface
Oct 16 04:52:46 <derf> Bugzilla is pretty standard.
Oct 16 04:52:48 <zerojay> It's not bad or hard. You just don't understand it yet.
Oct 16 04:53:45 <zerojay> Yes, it's pretty much standard.. and if you think Bugzilla has a bad interface... if only I could show you some of the bug trackers I've seen, lol.
Oct 16 04:54:51 <zerojay> The interface is a slight barrier. That's a good thing because it keeps us from generally getting retards posting "FIX THIS SHIT" bugs instead of actual useful bugs.
Oct 16 04:55:13 <GAN900> pupnik, trust ne when I say lots of smart people have been over these issues.
Oct 16 04:55:40 <zerojay> There shouldn't be anyone in the set of 300 that can't understand it or who aren't already very familiar with bug tracking so...
Oct 16 04:55:49 <GAN900> Some proposals will be more harmful in the long run, others require more time than is available in the short.
Oct 16 04:56:18 <zerojay> There's a guided bug entry system that... I'm not sure if timeless ever got around to implementing or not.
Oct 16 04:56:24 <GAN900> Either way, it is what it is for tonight, so I recommend you figure out the advanced search and move on for now.
Oct 16 04:57:00 <GAN900> It's implemented but not default.
Oct 16 04:57:18 <zerojay> It would be nice to be able to promote my latest wallpapers into extras-testing, but the interface is timing out after 30 seconds. :/
Oct 16 04:57:52 <GAN900> maemo.org needs servers before the N900 launches. . . .
Oct 16 04:58:48 <zerojay> badly.
Oct 16 05:00:17 <GAN900> It's gonna scare the platform for life if we get a repeat of November 2007
Oct 16 05:00:28 <GAN900> s/scare/scar/
Oct 16 05:00:28 <infobot> GAN900 meant: It's gonna scar the platform for life if we get a repeat of November 2007
Oct 16 05:03:10 <pupnik_> man 2008 flew by
Oct 16 05:54:35 <timeless_mbp> pupnik_: https://bugs.maemo.org/buglist.cgi?query_format=advanced&chfieldfrom=1w&chfieldto=Now
Oct 16 05:56:53 <timeless_mbp> zerojay / GAN900 : https://www.squarefree.com/bookmarklets/mozilla.html
Oct 16 05:57:07 <timeless_mbp> please use "shorten bug query"
Oct 16 05:58:03 <timeless_mbp> fwiw, it's possible to share searches in certain versions
Oct 16 05:58:34 <timeless_mbp> ' course, that only works if you don't get logged out constantly
Oct 16 05:58:37 * timeless_mbp pokes andre__ 
Oct 16 06:00:00 <timeless_mbp> looks like our bugzilla isn't new enough to let people share searches :(
Oct 16 06:03:33 <tigert> hmm
Oct 16 06:04:05 <tigert> hermes should have settings for what info to import :)
Oct 16 06:08:08 <GAN900> Tablet + lazy = tinyurl
Oct 16 06:42:20 * timeless_mbp kicks andre__ 
Oct 16 07:04:51 <L0cutus_> re
Oct 16 07:28:46 <LiraNuna> Stskeeps, I've heard you have the N900
Oct 16 07:28:53 <LiraNuna> D:
Oct 16 07:28:54 <Stskeeps> 300 of us have one?
Oct 16 07:29:16 <LiraNuna> O_O
Oct 16 07:29:18 * LiraNuna cries
Oct 16 07:29:32 <Stskeeps> all maemo summit attendants who werent subcontractors or nokia employees got one for 6 months loan
Oct 16 07:29:35 <Stskeeps> for free
Oct 16 07:30:01 * LiraNuna cries some more
Oct 16 07:30:30 <Jaffa> Morning, all
Oct 16 07:31:07 <Jaffa> tigert: Such as?
Oct 16 07:31:12 <Jaffa> lardman|gone: pong
Oct 16 07:31:15 <Jaffa> crashanddie_: pong
Oct 16 07:31:28 <koala_man> do you get an option to buy it afterwards?
Oct 16 07:31:49 <Stskeeps> no clue
Oct 16 07:31:57 <Stskeeps> at that point price will have been driven down anyway
Oct 16 07:32:25 <Jaffa> And it's unclear what Nokia will do with 300 pre-production devices labelled with an unremovable sticker in the battery bay "Not for sale"
Oct 16 07:32:43 <Jaffa> It'd be good if they went to some kind of educational project, perhaps
Oct 16 07:33:27 <`0660> my guess is that they will let the developers keep them in the end
Oct 16 07:34:47 <tigert> Jaffa: [x] sync birthdays
Oct 16 07:35:34 <Jaffa> tigert: Because you don't want them?
Oct 16 07:36:08 <tigert> maybe, or hmm
Oct 16 07:38:34 <ifreq> is there kismet anymore avail for n770/800?
Oct 16 07:49:17 <crashanddie_> Jaffa, pong
Oct 16 07:51:31 <Jaffa> crashanddie_: Accelerometer goes from -1000 - +1000 with it supposedly representing mG
Oct 16 07:51:44 <crashanddie_> Jaffa, aye
Oct 16 07:51:52 <Jaffa> mg, rather (fractions of Earth's g not the Gravitational Constant)
Oct 16 07:52:16 <crashanddie_> working on detecting some stuff
Oct 16 08:13:27 <mgedmin> uh oh out of disk space again
Oct 16 08:17:15 <mgedmin> Jaffa: Hermes is cool
Oct 16 08:18:01 <RST38h> MOOrning all
Oct 16 08:18:25 <mgedmin> Jaffa: I'm a bit confused about the meaning of 'Update' and 'Retrieve' buttons
Oct 16 08:18:54 <mgedmin> and I wonder why initially the icon did not appear in the app menu
Oct 16 08:19:19 <Shapeshifter> uhm, how do I link against libconic? I get the error Package libconic was not found in the pkg-config search path
Oct 16 08:20:22 <mgedmin> Shapeshifter: do you build-depend on libconic0-dev?
Oct 16 08:21:00 <Shapeshifter> mgedmin: mhh, no, how do I do that?
Oct 16 08:21:17 <mgedmin> Shapeshifter: never mind; pass 'conic', not 'libconic' to pkgconfig
Oct 16 08:21:23 <KMFDM> does 'out of disk space' actually mean the memory is full?
Oct 16 08:21:31 <KMFDM> as i've ran into the error a few times, but each time a restart fixed it
Oct 16 08:21:48 <mgedmin> KMFDM: it means I installed too many applications
Oct 16 08:21:58 <Shapeshifter> mgedmin: ahh, thanks
Oct 16 08:22:07 <mgedmin> it's good to know that restarting fixes it; I was afraid to do so
Oct 16 08:22:49 <mgedmin> the application manager says 'no catalogues installed' when you're out of disk space (or, perhaps, when dpkg complains about dpkg --configure having been interrupted)
Oct 16 08:30:05 <Jaffa> mgedmin: "retrieve" won't overwrite anything. "update" will. Better labels desired :)
Oct 16 08:30:19 <Jaffa> mgedmin: App icons not appearing immediately *seems* to be a HAF bug, but I'm not sure
Oct 16 08:30:31 <mgedmin> most other apps get their icons at once
Oct 16 08:30:46 <mgedmin> at first I thought hermes.postinst didn't call gtk-update-icon-cache, now I see it does
Oct 16 08:30:52 <Jaffa> Hmm. gtk-update-icon cache is in the post... yeah
Oct 16 08:31:00 <mgedmin> Jaffa: what confused me was that update also does retrieve
Oct 16 08:31:08 <mgedmin> does it?
Oct 16 08:31:10 <Jaffa> mgedmin: Yeah
Oct 16 08:31:50 <mgedmin> I expected the workflow to be: 1 retrieve 2 look if the changes make sense 3 apply them
Oct 16 08:32:20 <mgedmin> now it's 1 retrieve 2 look 3 retrieve again 4 apply
Oct 16 08:32:34 <mgedmin> I'm scared the data I look at in step 2 might have changed by the time I get to step 3
Oct 16 08:32:35 <Corsac> I read “extra donuts”
Oct 16 08:32:42 <mgedmin> well, scared is an exaggeration
Oct 16 08:32:45 <Corsac> -ECHAN
Oct 16 08:32:58 <Jaffa> mgedmin: Since Retrieve only populates missing info on matches which it can be pretty damned sure about it doesn't have a review step (though it does have a summary). However, from that summary you'll be able to do manual matching which will be retained for future "Update"s
Oct 16 08:33:04 <mgedmin> also, the look bit is currently not very transparent: I see a contact will be updated, but I don't see how
Oct 16 08:33:28 <mgedmin> aah, I get it now
Oct 16 08:33:31 <mgedmin> hm
Oct 16 08:33:51 <mgedmin> sorry, I read "write" where you wrote "overwrite"
Oct 16 08:33:56 <Jaffa> Ah
Oct 16 08:39:48 <Shapeshifter> mhh, it seems like I can't get libconic to send signals. I've made a dbus connection with dbus_connection = dbus_bus_get(DBUS_BUS_SYSTEM, &error); and set it up with dbus_connection_setup_with_g_main(dbus_connection, NULL); and then I've made a con_ic_connection_new() and did g_object_set(G_OBJECT(connection), "automatic-connection-events", TRUE, NULL); and connected with g_signal_connect(G_OBJECT(connection), "connection-event", ...
Oct 16 08:39:54 <Shapeshifter> ... G_CALLBACK(connection_cb), NULL); but nothing ever happens in my callback
Oct 16 08:40:44 <RST38h> Really Dumb Question (RDQ): How do I *quit* Quake3 ?
Oct 16 08:40:57 <Stskeeps> click camera button? ;p
Oct 16 08:41:05 <RST38h> Really???
Oct 16 08:41:14 <Stskeeps> or ctrl-backspace
Oct 16 08:41:17 <Stskeeps> dunno really
Oct 16 08:46:20 <mgedmin> RST38h: you have to kill the boss monster on the last level to quit
Oct 16 08:51:40 <wazd> heya all
Oct 16 08:51:58 <woglinde> hi wazd
Oct 16 08:52:11 <Stskeeps> morning wazd
Oct 16 08:52:54 <RST38h> mgedmin: Oh. Shit.
Oct 16 08:53:00 <RST38h> Sts: Ctrl+Backspace does not work
Oct 16 08:53:03 <RST38h> Had to reboot
Oct 16 08:53:04 <mgedmin> uh oh
Oct 16 08:53:11 <RST38h> heya wazd!
Oct 16 08:53:30 * RST38h off to a meeting
Oct 16 08:53:37 <woglinde> bye rst
Oct 16 08:54:00 <RST38h> No, they are not planning to kill me there, yet
Oct 16 09:06:13 <wazd> Seriously, a lot of people ate this n920 fake
Oct 16 09:06:22 <Stskeeps> yeah
Oct 16 09:06:39 <wazd> even those who actually own tablets
Oct 16 09:06:47 <RST38h> wazd: Time to photoshop a new one!
Oct 16 09:07:00 <zaheerm> add one with an iris scanner
Oct 16 09:07:17 <zaheerm> to replace pin code entry :)
Oct 16 09:07:30 <adeus> and a fusion powered battery
Oct 16 09:07:44 <range> Oh, and with OS2006 on it.
Oct 16 09:07:57 <jaska> os2000
Oct 16 09:07:58 <zaheerm> or with chrome os ;)
Oct 16 09:08:01 <jaska> the mainframe operating system that is
Oct 16 09:08:02 <wazd> range: OS2006 is for sissies, OS2005 rockz
Oct 16 09:08:11 <mgedmin> I haven't *seen* the n920 fake
Oct 16 09:08:24 <range> But yeah, that was a neat picture.
Oct 16 09:08:25 <mgedmin> engadget pulled the page too quickly
Oct 16 09:08:25 <wazd> mgedmin: http://www.slashgear.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/10/nokia_n920_prototype_leak.jpg
Oct 16 09:10:44 <zaheerm> does anyone know where settings about product picks up its version info from?
Oct 16 09:12:46 <mgedmin> zaheerm: no, but if I needed to do that in my app I probably would cheat and run popen("osso-product-info")
Oct 16 09:12:53 <mgedmin> on maemo 5 it no longer needs root to get the info
Oct 16 09:13:23 <mgedmin> zaheerm: it links to /usr/lib/libossoproductinfo.so.0, so there's probably an API
Oct 16 09:13:35 <zaheerm> great
Oct 16 09:13:47 <zaheerm> my wife's n900 has (null) (null) (null)
Oct 16 09:13:52 <zaheerm> so a bit concerned :)
Oct 16 09:14:11 <mgedmin> um
Oct 16 09:14:42 <mgedmin> interesting
Oct 16 09:17:22 <zaheerm> her osso-product-info shows correct info
Oct 16 09:17:34 <zaheerm> the plot thickens
Oct 16 09:17:48 <mgedmin> screenshot?
Oct 16 09:17:59 <mgedmin> btw what version does osso-product-info report?
Oct 16 09:20:00 <mgedmin> I assume you know about the hidden ctrl+shift+p screenshot shortcut in maemo 5
Oct 16 09:20:19 <mgedmin> I only wish it displayed a notification "screenshot taken" after it does its thing
Oct 16 09:20:52 <frankS2> weeee
Oct 16 09:20:54 <frankS2> nokia n900 for sale
Oct 16 09:21:06 <mgedmin> already? where?
Oct 16 09:21:14 <mgedmin> ebay?
Oct 16 09:21:55 <Stskeeps> if it's some idiot who is selling his NOT FOR SALE one..
Oct 16 09:22:10 <zaheerm> there's loads of pre-order n900s on ebay
Oct 16 09:22:24 <zaheerm> haven't seen one that is not a pre-order yet
Oct 16 09:23:16 <zaheerm> http://www.flickr.com/photos/aandza/4016540454/
Oct 16 09:23:23 <zaheerm> ^ screenshot
Oct 16 09:23:59 <Stskeeps> zaheerm: hmm, maybe CAL corruption or /etc/osso-software-version or something
Oct 16 09:24:19 <mgedmin> cat: can't open '/etc/osso-software-version': No such file or directory
Oct 16 09:26:20 <zaheerm> CAL?
Oct 16 09:27:18 <Stskeeps> zaheerm: report it at least :)
Oct 16 09:27:58 <zaheerm> ok i'll create a new bug, mentioned it in an existing bug
Oct 16 09:29:20 <traut> hello
Oct 16 09:30:08 <Lantz> good morning
Oct 16 09:31:35 <sarower> Hello all, Good morning
Oct 16 09:31:42 <traut> can't make python evolution.ebook.get_addressbook('default') work on n900
Oct 16 09:32:07 <traut> it works in scratchbox but not at the real device
Oct 16 09:32:11 <sarower> How i can run the command "dpkg -i packageName.deb" from postinst file?
Oct 16 09:35:22 <jumpula> why would you want to run something like that from postinst?
Oct 16 09:36:00 <mgedmin> traut: what's your error?
Oct 16 09:36:31 <traut> evolution.ebook.get_addressbook('default') just returns None
Oct 16 09:36:42 <mgedmin> >>> evolution.ebook.open_addressbook('default')
Oct 16 09:36:42 <mgedmin> <ebook.EBook object at 0x4007b238 (EBook at 0x17ddb0)>
Oct 16 09:36:55 * RST38h yawns widely
Oct 16 09:37:02 <woglinde> re rst
Oct 16 09:37:04 <mgedmin> get_addressbook doesn't even exist on mine
Oct 16 09:37:11 <jumpula> sarower: if you're really trying to run dpkg -i from another package's postinst my answer is don't. never do such thing.
Oct 16 09:37:24 <RST38h> heya woglinde
Oct 16 09:37:54 <sarower> jumpula: Then what I can do?
Oct 16 09:38:11 <traut> mgedmin
Oct 16 09:38:11 <mgedmin> sarower: make your package depend on the other one
Oct 16 09:38:18 <mgedmin> that is my nickname, yes
Oct 16 09:38:25 <traut> i'm sorry, it's open_addressbook
Oct 16 09:38:32 <traut> mgedmin: :)
Oct 16 09:38:53 <traut> it works in scratchbox environment but not in python2.5 at the real device
Oct 16 09:39:16 <mgedmin> traut: I did try on the real device
Oct 16 09:39:22 <mgedmin> so, worksforme, nocluewhydoesn'tforyou
Oct 16 09:39:42 <sarower> jumpula:  How I can do that?
Oct 16 09:40:11 <mgedmin> python-evolution 0.0.4-maemo1
Oct 16 09:40:11 <jumpula> if you want the other package as a dependency, make your package depend from that package
Oct 16 09:40:38 <Shapeshifter> So, I think that my libconic connection and event callback are set up correctly, though I don't get any signal when starting the app. So I tried doing con_ic_connection_connect (connection, CON_IC_CONNECT_FLAG_NONE); and then I indeed receive signals in my callback, but the status is actually DISCONNECTED. In my app, the only thing I want is know if an internet connection is up at the launch of the app, and signals for when the connection ...
Oct 16 09:40:40 <mgedmin> sarower: vi debian/control, find the Depends: field, add the name of the package there
Oct 16 09:40:45 <Shapeshifter> ... drops or re-establishes.
Oct 16 09:41:04 <traut> mgedmin: hm. i'm running python as ' run-standalone.sh python2.5'
Oct 16 09:41:18 <mgedmin> traut: I just ran python without a wrapper
Oct 16 09:43:13 <traut> mgedmin: if i'm running it without wrapper I'm receiving 'Segmentation fault'
Oct 16 09:43:21 <mgedmin> whoa
Oct 16 09:43:24 <sarower> mgedmin: If i give the name of the package / application in the control file then how it will get the application and install it?
Oct 16 09:43:36 <traut> yeah
Oct 16 09:43:47 <mgedmin> sarower: it will download it from a repository such as Maemo Extras
Oct 16 09:43:50 <jumpula> the application must be put to a repository
Oct 16 09:43:59 <jumpula> and that repository must be in your sources.list
Oct 16 09:44:20 <sarower> mgedmin: The application of my own. it is not in the repository!
Oct 16 09:44:59 <jumpula> well. if you plan to distribute it, you will put it to one. for testing in your local machine, you can create a repository in your localhost.
Oct 16 09:45:33 <jumpula> or just install it manually in your localhost
Oct 16 09:45:37 <mgedmin> no need to create repositories for testing
Oct 16 09:45:48 <mgedmin> you can install packages manually with dpkg -i if you do that in the correct order
Oct 16 09:45:51 <traut> oh, strange things. if i'm running evolution.ebook.open_addressbook('default') through ssh on n900 it returns None
Oct 16 09:46:08 <traut> it's without wrapper
Oct 16 09:46:13 <mgedmin> traut: actually, I tried it over ssh, haven't tried it in the xterm
Oct 16 09:46:19 <samad> hello everybody
Oct 16 09:46:21 <mgedmin> as you see I didn't get none
Oct 16 09:46:36 <mgedmin> this is confusing, and the version number of python-evolution doesn't inspire confidence (0.0.4? really?)
Oct 16 09:46:41 <traut> mgedmin: yes. I'll keep trying :)
Oct 16 09:47:09 <traut> >>> evolution.__version__
Oct 16 09:47:09 <traut> (0, 0, 4)
Oct 16 09:50:41 <traut> I've installed python-runtime in this session. maybe I need to logout/restart the device?
Oct 16 09:52:17 <mgedmin> doubt that
Oct 16 09:52:28 <samad> i am implementing miss call and unread SMS detection and implemented    RTComElQuery * query = NULL;
Oct 16 09:52:29 <samad>     RTComElEvent * ev = NULL;
Oct 16 09:52:29 <samad>     gint event_id = -1;
Oct 16 09:52:29 <samad>     RTComElIter * it = NULL;
Oct 16 09:52:29 <samad>     GValueArray * values = NULL;
Oct 16 09:52:29 <samad>     RTComElEvent *ev = NULL;
Oct 16 09:52:33 <samad>     ev = rtcom_el_event_new();
Oct 16 09:52:35 <samad>     g_return_val_if_fail (ev != NULL, NULL);
Oct 16 09:52:37 <samad>     RTCOM_EL_EVENT_SET_FIELD(ev, service, g_strdup (SERVICE));
Oct 16 09:52:38 <mgedmin> samad: please use a pastebin instead of flooding the channel
Oct 16 09:52:39 <samad>     RTCOM_EL_EVENT_SET_FIELD(ev, event_type, g_strdup (EVENT_TYPE));
Oct 16 09:52:40 <mgedmin> seriously
Oct 16 09:52:41 <samad>     ev = eventNewFull();
Oct 16 09:52:43 <samad>     if(!ev)
Oct 16 09:52:45 <samad>     {
Oct 16 09:52:47 <samad>         fail("Failed to create event.");
Oct 16 09:52:49 <samad>     }
Oct 16 09:52:51 <samad>     event_id = rtcom_el_add_event(el, ev, NULL);
Oct 16 09:52:53 <samad>     fail_if (event_id < 0, "Failed to add event");
Oct 16 09:52:55 <samad>     query = rtcom_el_query_new(el);
Oct 16 09:52:57 <samad>     rtcom_el_query_set_limit(query, 5);
Oct 16 09:52:59 <samad>     if(!rtcom_el_query_prepare(query, "is-read", TRUE, RTCOM_EL_OP_EQUAL, NULL))
Oct 16 09:53:03 <samad>     {
Oct 16 09:53:04 <traut> oh, so much code :)
Oct 16 09:53:05 <samad>         fail("Failed to prepare the query.");
Oct 16 09:53:07 <samad>     }
Oct 16 09:53:09 <samad>     it = rtcom_el_get_events(el, query);
Oct 16 09:53:11 <samad> is it right way i have done
Oct 16 09:53:13 <mgedmin> grr
Oct 16 09:53:18 <mgedmin> no, it's not
Oct 16 09:53:21 <mgedmin> you should have used a pastebin
Oct 16 09:53:36 <X-Fade> hmm it stopped already ;)
Oct 16 09:54:05 <mgedmin> samad: go to http://pastey.net or something similar, paste the code there, paste the link here
Oct 16 09:54:20 <mgedmin> then we'll be able to see it in one chunk without interruptions from other people talking
Oct 16 09:55:10 <traut> needless to say that example_abook.c works on device without errors
Oct 16 09:55:23 <mgedmin> could be a bug in python bindings
Oct 16 09:56:21 <RST38h> ...all week, trying to view the N-Gage 'All games' catalog in the on-device client has resulted in an error message 'Out of internal memory. Close some applications and try again (Error -4)'....
Oct 16 09:56:24 <traut> thinking about getting contacts by executing bin file from python code
Oct 16 09:56:38 <RST38h> Ah, the horror! TOO MANY GAMES in NGage catalog!
Oct 16 09:57:38 <mgedmin> traut: talk to the maintainers of python-evolution, maybe they'll fix the problem
Oct 16 09:58:22 <Shapeshifter> "If connection establishment failed, a CON_IC_STATUS_DISCONNECTED inside ConIcConnectionEvent is sent"... but why? The internet in scratchbox is working fine. Why do I receive the DISCONNECTED signal from the libconic connection when trying to connect?
Oct 16 09:58:23 <traut> mgedmin: where I can find them?
Oct 16 09:58:34 <mgedmin> traut: very good question
Oct 16 09:58:45 <mgedmin> pymaemo-developers@garage.maemo.org ?
Oct 16 09:58:46 <traut> mgedmin: googling
Oct 16 09:59:01 <mgedmin> http://wiki.maemo.org/PyMaemo ?
Oct 16 09:59:38 <mgedmin> is python-evolution part of PyMaemo?
Oct 16 10:00:00 <traut> ha, seems like it's not
Oct 16 10:00:20 <mgedmin> is there a different binding for accessing the address book?
Oct 16 10:00:57 <mgedmin> Jaffa is listed as maintainer for python-evolution
Oct 16 10:01:04 <mgedmin> he's on this channel
Oct 16 10:02:23 <samad> hello could u plz check http://pastey.net/126656
Oct 16 10:02:38 <traut> Jaffa: hey, are you here?
Oct 16 10:02:57 <traut> no. there are no python-abook yet for Maemo 5
Oct 16 10:04:23 <mgedmin> but there will be, right?
Oct 16 10:04:48 <mgedmin> "We plan to work on providing bindings for these components during the Maemo 5 life cycle."
Oct 16 10:04:55 <traut> yeah, in 4 weeks or so
Oct 16 10:05:08 <traut> but I need my prototype to be done in 3 days :)
Oct 16 10:05:39 <traut> so trying to make it work in any way
Oct 16 10:05:47 <mgedmin> hm
Oct 16 10:05:53 <mgedmin> ctypes?
Oct 16 10:06:05 <X-Fade> traut: Good case to try out the binding generator from PySide?
Oct 16 10:06:11 <mgedmin> convince Jaffa to help?
Oct 16 10:06:48 <traut> mgedmin: maybe. easier would be to create simple C binary that will return contacts as txt-file by request
Oct 16 10:07:07 <mgedmin> if you go with C, it's not too difficult to make it a Python extension module
Oct 16 10:07:13 <mgedmin> then instead of os.popen() you could import it
Oct 16 10:07:18 <traut> mgedmin: Jaffa have done such binding in Hermes with ctypes
Oct 16 10:07:40 <traut> X-Fade: thanks, I'll take a look
Oct 16 10:08:15 <traut> mgedmin: oh, maybe. I'm new to ctypes
Oct 16 10:08:26 <mgedmin> can you steal Jaffa's code? ;-)
Oct 16 10:08:39 <traut> :) it's open source
Oct 16 10:08:42 <traut> working on it now
Oct 16 10:08:43 <mgedmin> ctypes ought to be easier than a Python extension module
Oct 16 10:08:48 <mgedmin> yeah, but are your licences compatible?
Oct 16 10:09:13 <mgedmin> hmm http://pymaemo.garage.maemo.org/abook.html
Oct 16 10:09:27 <mgedmin> if python-abook does not exist yet, why are there examples for it?
Oct 16 10:09:44 <mgedmin> oh, it's using python-evolution
Oct 16 10:10:03 <mgedmin> evolution-python is listed as a component of http://pymaemo.garage.maemo.org/development.html
Oct 16 10:10:20 <traut> it's an old abook examples
Oct 16 10:10:32 <traut> for Maemo  3 I suppose
Oct 16 10:11:06 <mgedmin> the universe is large and confusing
Oct 16 10:11:12 <traut> oh, I didn't saw that (about development.html)
Oct 16 10:12:17 <samad> http://pastey.net/126656
Oct 16 10:12:36 <traut> ha, Jaffa code from Hermes package is using addresses = evolution.ebook.open_addressbook('default') as the first step
Oct 16 10:13:05 <mgedmin> traut: the important question is *does Jaffa's code work on your N900*?
Oct 16 10:13:17 <traut> maybe that's why Hermes don't work on my n900 :)
Oct 16 10:13:17 <mgedmin> if so, use it (or compare with your code and see what you do wrong)
Oct 16 10:13:22 <mgedmin> a-ha!
Oct 16 10:13:26 <traut> yeah
Oct 16 10:13:36 <mgedmin> traut: what OS version do you have? .41-10?
Oct 16 10:13:49 <Shapeshifter> http://wiki.maemo.org/Documentation/Maemo_5_Developer_Guide/Using_Connectivity_Components/Maemo_Connectivity#Requesting_for_Connection I'm using the example code for the switch (status) statement. And in my case, I get this output: "And we are disconnected. Let's see what went wrong... Libconic thinks there was nothing wrong.". >.>
Oct 16 10:13:52 <traut> i'll check Hermes one more time
Oct 16 10:14:12 <traut> mgedmin: hm. How I can check this?
Oct 16 10:14:20 <mgedmin> traut: osso-product-info
Oct 16 10:14:29 <traut> Nokia-N900-40-10
Oct 16 10:14:57 <mgedmin> samad: usually we just put the code into pastebin, and put the question directly on the channel
Oct 16 10:15:31 <Jaffa> traut: pong
Oct 16 10:15:40 <traut> Jaffa: hello
Oct 16 10:15:46 * Jaffa asked on pymaemo-developers about python-abook for Maemo 5, they said "it'll be coming"
Oct 16 10:16:16 <traut> Jaffa: have you experienced some problems with open_addressbook on readl device?
Oct 16 10:16:32 <Jaffa> Nope.
Oct 16 10:16:40 <Jaffa> I had problems on beta SDK, but on device it worked fine
Oct 16 10:16:57 <traut> maybe I need to update device software
Oct 16 10:17:14 * Jaffa hasn't had problems with 36-, 39- or 41-
Oct 16 10:17:45 <traut> Jaffa: open_addressbook('default') works for me in the scratchbox but not at the real device
Oct 16 10:17:58 <traut> Jaffa: in the real device it returns None
Oct 16 10:18:07 <Jaffa> traut: Does Hermes work for you on device? Since that does open_addressbook('default')
Oct 16 10:18:38 <traut> Jaffa: Im checking right now
Oct 16 10:20:04 <Stskeeps> wazd: up for a small challenge?
Oct 16 10:20:47 <mgedmin> samad: do you have any specific problems with the code, or are you just looking for a review?
Oct 16 10:25:01 <samad> actually i am implementing miss call and unread SMS detection and
Oct 16 10:25:01 <samad> 2	implemented  the following code i am very beginner. Could u plz
Oct 16 10:25:01 <samad> 3	check the code what i am doing wrong ?
Oct 16 10:25:26 <samad> http://pastey.net/126656
Oct 16 10:26:33 <tbf> Jaffa: btw, quite brave to publish your secret facebook API key with hermes
Oct 16 10:26:51 <tbf> Jaffa: or does facebook have an official policy now on app keys in FOSS?
Oct 16 10:27:39 <samad> mgedmin, just i want to know is the procedure  that i proceed right or wrong ?
Oct 16 10:28:28 <Jaffa> tbf: There's an FAQ which says yes, it's OK.
Oct 16 10:28:39 <Jaffa> tbf: Suggestions on what else could be done, welcome.
Oct 16 10:28:50 <tbf> Jaffa: citation needed
Oct 16 10:29:05 <tbf> Jaffa: wondering myself right now how to deal with this app key mess
Oct 16 10:29:14 <mgedmin> I dunno, samad; it doesn't do much (e.g. no return value, just a lot of assertions)
Oct 16 10:29:17 <mgedmin> what is it supposed to do?
Oct 16 10:29:27 <mgedmin> I'm not familiar with the rtcom apis, btw
Oct 16 10:29:56 <Shapeshifter> could it be that libconic doesn't work in scratchbox?
Oct 16 10:30:06 <traut> Jaffa: I don't know if Hermes actually works.  It's not exiting with error so I suppose it works
Oct 16 10:30:28 <mgedmin> Shapeshifter: I wouldn't find that surprising at all
Oct 16 10:30:29 <samad> mgedmin, i just want to check miss call and unread sms
Oct 16 10:30:45 * mgedmin out for lunch
Oct 16 10:31:17 <tbf> Shapeshifter: there's a good chance
Oct 16 10:31:26 <Jaffa> tbf: See quote at end of http://wiki.developers.facebook.com/index.php/Open_Source_Applications_Terms_Of_Service_Problem#Suggested_solutions
Oct 16 10:32:09 <traut> Jaffa: http://pastey.net/126657
Oct 16 10:32:12 <onion> is there some "official" way to check sdk version when building a package? I need to change some params in debian/rules depending on if it's diablo or fremantle
Oct 16 10:32:47 <Tigge> Are there any documentation for SMS and call api/interfacem? I haven't found it anywhere..
Oct 16 10:32:58 <Jaffa> onion: /etc/maemo_version (installed by package maemo-version)
Oct 16 10:34:09 <onion> Jaffa: ok, thanks
Oct 16 10:34:12 <tbf> Jaffa: yes, also found this - but now section 7 is "Payments". now the terms doc only refers to http://wiki.developers.facebook.com/index.php/Platform_Guidelines, which again states in section 9, that keys must not be published
Oct 16 10:34:15 <Jaffa> traut: And if you open Contacts you see some?
Oct 16 10:34:48 <tbf> Tigge: it's all plain telepathy stuff. there is no special API
Oct 16 10:35:58 <traut> Jaffa: yes
Oct 16 10:36:01 <Jaffa> tbf: The Facebook widget which is available in the Nokia repos must distribute a secret key
Oct 16 10:36:24 <traut> Jaffa: rechecked all libraries. seems like ok
Oct 16 10:37:15 <zerojay> Can someone help me promote a newer version of my package to extras-testing? Seems like the site times out after 30 seconds. :/
Oct 16 10:37:45 <X-Fade> zerojay: which package?
Oct 16 10:39:31 <Tigge> tbf: ah, okay.. didn't think that telepathy had phone and sms support.. or is it something special?
Oct 16 10:40:03 <zerojay> X-Fade: Oh, never mind. Worked for me this time. Thanks anyways. :)
Oct 16 10:40:04 <traut> Jaffa: one more strange thing - seems like get_self_contact works fine
Oct 16 10:40:20 <traut> Jaffa: so it's a problem with address book
Oct 16 10:40:26 <X-Fade> zerojay: calculations can be quite heavy when walking the tree.
Oct 16 10:40:51 <X-Fade> zerojay: I guess I need to make sure it doesn't reach execution timeout.
Oct 16 10:41:27 <zerojay> fiferboy: Get a old of aSIMULAter. She's interested in designing an icon or two for you.
Oct 16 10:41:41 <fiferboy> wooo!
Oct 16 10:41:50 <fiferboy> I like having icons
Oct 16 10:41:58 <woglinde> bah icons
Oct 16 10:42:47 <timeless_mbp> zerojay: so, are you using my strings?
Oct 16 10:42:57 <zerojay> timeless_mbp: I am.
Oct 16 10:43:15 <zerojay> timeless_mbp: All of it looks good to me so far.
Oct 16 10:43:25 <tbf> Tigge: Maemo 5 provides as the tp-ring connection manager
Oct 16 10:43:35 <tbf> s/as//
Oct 16 10:43:35 <infobot> tbf meant: Tigge: Maemo 5 provides  the tp-ring connection manager
Oct 16 10:45:01 <tbf> s/provides.*/rocks/
Oct 16 10:45:10 <tbf> :-(
Oct 16 10:46:04 <traut> Jaffa: is there any way to dig into python-evolution?
Oct 16 10:46:18 <samad> timeless_mbp, how t u?
Oct 16 10:46:42 <Khertan> hello !
Oct 16 10:46:43 <traut> Jaffa: I don'e like that it just doesn't work silently
Oct 16 10:47:21 <Khertan> someone which are really the right allowed users section in fremantle extras ?
Oct 16 10:47:44 <Khertan> +know
Oct 16 10:48:07 <samad> timeless_mbp, just want to check miss call and unread sms is it right way of my thinking http://pastey.net/126656
Oct 16 10:48:33 <samad> what i am wrong ?
Oct 16 10:50:08 <kirma> do maemo 5 APIs provide a chance to look up reasonably accurate WGS coordinates on the basis of cell id? something that'd be correct at suburb resolution in a city in practice...
Oct 16 10:50:30 <Tigge> tbf: okay, hm.. not sure if I follow.. Perhaps I should read up on Telepathy
Oct 16 10:51:28 <Tigge> tbf: but just to be clear.. there is no special stuff going on besides telepathy?
Oct 16 10:51:53 <Tigge> I should experiment a bit in the sandbox,hm
Oct 16 10:52:01 <kirma> making it possible to perform reasonably accurate guesses without GPS power usage, like having a list of locations and comparing them with API-provided coordinates for proximity...
Oct 16 10:52:20 <kirma> kind of "I guess you're at work"
Oct 16 10:52:57 <_marcell_> kirma: http://wiki.maemo.org/Documentation/Maemo_5_Developer_Guide/Using_Connectivity_Components/Using_Location_API#Location_methods
Oct 16 10:53:20 <Jaffa> traut: I dunno, I just packaged it. Source is at http://live.gnome.org/Conduit/evolution-python
Oct 16 10:53:45 <traut> Jaffa: thanks
Oct 16 10:54:05 <kirma> _marcell_: I certainly hope that's closer to 1 km than 10 km in urban environment.
Oct 16 10:54:07 <zerojay> I've got an add-on for the Maemo browser in Maemo 5. It seems that I need to reboot the tablet once or twice before it is seen and running. I'm told I can restart the browser daemon as well. What's the best way to go about doing that?
Oct 16 10:54:42 <_marcell_> kirma: I guess so too.
Oct 16 10:55:08 <kirma> also, is the reverse geodecoding working at level of cities only, not suburbs?
Oct 16 10:55:28 <kirma> or reverse geocoding, whatever
Oct 16 10:55:36 <traut> what's the simplest way to make app for Maemo5? Not with repo but with scp through ssh
Oct 16 10:56:27 <X-Fade> traut: ?
Oct 16 10:57:30 <traut> X-Fade: I mean make an icon on desktop etc
Oct 16 10:57:48 <Jaffa> zerojay: /etc/init.d/browserd <something>
Oct 16 11:01:32 <traut> how evolution.ebook knows where to get addressbooks?
Oct 16 11:02:15 <Jaffa> traut: running as root or user?
Oct 16 11:02:31 <Jaffa> traut: 'default' returns for the *user* address book
Oct 16 11:02:40 <traut> Jaffa: oh shit
Oct 16 11:02:48 <traut> Jaffa: really? :)
Oct 16 11:02:58 <Jaffa> traut: If you're running as root, you may well get None ;-)
Oct 16 11:03:19 <traut> Jaffa: i'll check this right now
Oct 16 11:04:38 <RST38h> traut: have you considered checking out the documentation?
Oct 16 11:05:33 <traut> RST38h: would you please give me the link? I didn't find any documentation about evolution and maemo addressbook communication
Oct 16 11:06:04 <RST38h> traut: I do not mean the evolution, I mean creating a simple Maemo5 applicat5ion
Oct 16 11:06:10 <RST38h> evolution is of course a different business
Oct 16 11:07:09 <traut> RST38h: oh, sorry. I didn't find anything yet (except adding to repo). I'll dig deeper
Oct 16 11:07:55 <Lantz> Does anyone know where I can find info on unbricking... JTAG or cold serial flash for N810
Oct 16 11:08:03 <Stskeeps> Lantz: how badly did you brick it?
Oct 16 11:08:11 <Stskeeps> and what did you do?
Oct 16 11:09:02 <traut> it works! :)
Oct 16 11:09:14 <traut> it was all about root/user
Oct 16 11:09:20 <Lantz> I bought them this way... wont boot, not even in reflash mode... when power is plugged in no indicator led's or anything
Oct 16 11:09:23 <traut> Jaffa: thanks a lot
Oct 16 11:09:41 <Stskeeps> Lantz: does it show NOKIA logo?
Oct 16 11:09:48 <Lantz> no
Oct 16 11:10:02 <Lantz> does absolutly nothing
Oct 16 11:10:11 <Stskeeps> tried alternative batteries?
Oct 16 11:10:13 <Lantz> a true brick...lol
Oct 16 11:10:22 <Lantz> yes
Oct 16 11:10:45 <RST38h> "Bricked to the core" <-- probably deserves a tshirt
Oct 16 11:10:47 <Stskeeps> ick
Oct 16 11:10:53 <Lantz> my working N810 shows the battery is fully charged
Oct 16 11:11:10 <Stskeeps> Lantz: http://bu3sch.de/joomla/index.php/nokia-n810-serial-console
Oct 16 11:12:24 <samad> hello i have run the following code http://pastey.net/126661 contact.c:(.text+0xb6): undefined reference to `rtcom_el_iter_first'
Oct 16 11:12:24 <samad> contact.c:(.text+0xd4): undefined reference to `rtcom_el_iter_next'
Oct 16 11:12:40 <RST38h> samad: My guess is that you have to link to some library
Oct 16 11:12:55 <Lantz> I am building a homemade docking station to access the serial connectors but have no idea where to go from there
Oct 16 11:13:08 <RST38h> samad: What are arguments to pkg-config ?
Oct 16 11:13:18 <Stskeeps> Lantz: heh, once in a while i wish i had that for n810
Oct 16 11:13:23 <traut> moving forward. Are there other addressbooks? Not just default but maybe Skype contacts addressbook?
Oct 16 11:13:41 <zaheerm> you could probably filter the addressbook
Oct 16 11:13:54 <samad> `pkg-config --libs gconf-2.0 hildon-1 hildon-fm-2 gtk+-2.0 gtkmm-2.4 libosso gdk-2.0 gnome-vfs-2.0 libhildondesktop-1 hildonmm hildon-fmmm gstreamer-0.10 gstreamer-0.10 gstreamer-interfaces-0.10 libosso-abook-1.0 `
Oct 16 11:13:55 <zaheerm> to just give you ones with skype ids
Oct 16 11:14:25 <zaheerm> samad, i don't think you need to link to gstreamer
Oct 16 11:14:48 <Mek> from the contacts you can choose groups->skype to get only skype contacts
Oct 16 11:14:49 <samad> i have used gstreamer-0.10
Oct 16 11:15:11 <RST38h> samad: looks like you have to include rtcomm there
Oct 16 11:15:31 <zaheerm> samad, not according to your paste
Oct 16 11:16:06 <traut> zaheerm: in 'default' addressbook there are only contacts added at device
Oct 16 11:16:20 <traut> Mek: thanks, I'll try
Oct 16 11:17:07 <samad> zaheerm: what do u mean ?
Oct 16 11:17:45 <samad> RST38h, plz explain me
Oct 16 11:17:46 <zaheerm> samad, your paste shows no code using gstreamer, you can probably remove all the gstreamer stuff in your pkg-config so you reduce the footprint of your program
Oct 16 11:18:04 <Lantz> Stskeeps the link you sent me is where I got the idea for the docking station. The site owner said if I figure out a way to unbrick these units he would be happy to post the instructions on his site
Oct 16 11:18:23 <RST38h> samad: a moment
Oct 16 11:18:54 <samad> why i use gstreamer ? i have used gstreamer-0.10
Oct 16 11:18:54 <Stskeeps> Lantz: that, serial port and flasher should do it, i think
Oct 16 11:18:56 <Stskeeps> i have never attempted it.
Oct 16 11:19:05 <andre__> ahem. An "Earthquake Monitor App" proposal in Brainstorm. I'm always.... "surprised" by the ideas of people.
Oct 16 11:19:25 <Stskeeps> andre__: Tsunami Alert!
Oct 16 11:19:37 <andre__> "This could provide a tremendous data source for seismologists around the world"
Oct 16 11:19:44 <RST38h> samad: On your device, please do pkg-config --list-all and see if there is a mention of rtcomm
Oct 16 11:19:45 <X-Fade> Do we have a step counter app already?
Oct 16 11:19:47 <Jaffa> andre__: At least they're out of bugzilla? ;-)
Oct 16 11:19:54 <andre__> Jaffa, :-D
Oct 16 11:20:12 <RST38h> andre: It can also be used to automatically send twitter messages every time the user farts
Oct 16 11:20:16 <Jaffa> traut: no probs; suddenly had an inspiration as to why you might be getting nothing for default (cos it bit me ages ago)
Oct 16 11:20:22 <kirma> andre__: makes me wonder how that would work, or differ from something that's not exactly trivial thing to implement otherwise.
Oct 16 11:20:39 <samad> i am using scratchbox
Oct 16 11:20:47 <RST38h> samad: Then do this inside scratchbox
Oct 16 11:20:55 <andre__> kirma, same for me
Oct 16 11:21:11 <andre__> kirma, by using the accelerometer according to the reporter
Oct 16 11:21:59 <kirma> rss feeds coming from an aggregator that is fed with location information might be interesting anyway
Oct 16 11:22:19 <kirma> I think that has to be pretty major earthquake to notice.
Oct 16 11:22:38 <RST38h> N900 GPS receiver is normally powered down
Oct 16 11:22:46 <kirma> putting the phone on table and hitting the table with coffee mug a bit harder would create a major event ;)
Oct 16 11:22:51 <RST38h> When powered up it needs network connection to lock up
Oct 16 11:23:13 <RST38h> As earthquake will most likely topple cell tower and disrupt connectivity, GPS won't work
Oct 16 11:23:58 <kirma> I wonder if accelerometer would be precise enough to detect a desktop computer next to it on the table
Oct 16 11:24:15 <kirma> it's not exactly designed to be an scientific instrument after all...
Oct 16 11:24:18 <RST38h> So, the moral of this story: If you want this to work, go to bugzilla and vote on this bug: https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=5337
Oct 16 11:25:02 <traut> Mek: were you talking about evolution API access to address books or about address book UI?
Oct 16 11:25:27 <Mek> traut: UI... sorry if that wsa not what you were asking for
Oct 16 11:25:50 <traut> Mek: np, thanks anyway :)
Oct 16 11:30:35 <traut> is there any way to access skype contacts from python code at Maemo 5?
Oct 16 11:31:11 <Lupu> Is there any way to export the calendars and contacts to ICS/VCF in Fremantle?
Oct 16 11:32:38 <Lupu> Oh, yeah, it's there for calendar, but I haven't found it for contacts.
Oct 16 11:33:32 <Lupu> (WTF?) Ok, that must be from a software update...
Oct 16 11:33:39 <Lupu> It's quite clear.
Oct 16 11:42:46 <Lupu> Oh right, I was mixing two things. Last time I'd tried to send them over bluetooth.
Oct 16 11:42:54 <timeless_mbp> samad: i really don't know *anything* about rtcom
Oct 16 11:43:14 <timeless_mbp> i think the rtcom devs at one point actually were involved in the maemo-devel mailing list
Oct 16 11:43:16 <timeless_mbp> not sure if they still are
Oct 16 11:43:56 <timeless_mbp> kirma: so the maps / photos people have a supl gateway, i believe it's exposed via the location api
Oct 16 11:44:06 <aSIMULAtor> who takes care of n900wallpapers.com?
Oct 16 11:44:31 <Stskeeps> developer program announced
Oct 16 11:44:33 <Stskeeps> http://talk.maemo.org/showpost.php?p=348237&postcount=1
Oct 16 11:45:06 <samad> get_events_core: assertion `RTCOM_IS_EL(el)
Oct 16 11:45:31 <timeless_mbp> aSIMULAter: did you install my packager?
Oct 16 11:47:36 <VDVsx> Stskeeps, device price - 300 € or it's 300 € ? I'm confused lol
Oct 16 11:47:58 <Stskeeps> 300 euro i guess
Oct 16 11:48:31 <jeremiah> 300 US dollars is cheap.
Oct 16 11:49:13 <VDVsx> Stskeeps, ouch last time was around 100 € ;)
Oct 16 11:49:24 <Stskeeps> VDVsx: it's a phone.. fairly cheap :P
Oct 16 11:49:33 <timeless_mbp> no
Oct 16 11:49:37 <aSIMULAtor> your packager?
Oct 16 11:49:40 <timeless_mbp> it's an *unlocked* phone
Oct 16 11:49:44 <timeless_mbp> err package :(
Oct 16 11:49:55 <timeless_mbp> aSIMULAtor: you aren't in channel :(
Oct 16 11:50:08 <jeremiah> timeless_mbp: Did you end up using dpkg-divert?
Oct 16 11:50:13 <timeless_mbp> nope
Oct 16 11:50:18 <jeremiah> You really should
Oct 16 11:50:30 <jeremiah> That is the tested and recommended technology
Oct 16 11:50:35 * VDVsx expects 'fire' in tmo this afternoon ;)
Oct 16 11:50:37 <timeless_mbp> i was told dpkg-divert was expensive for large numbers of diversions
Oct 16 11:50:43 <Stskeeps> karma 200 is actually quite low
Oct 16 11:50:44 <andre__> fire?
Oct 16 11:50:59 * timeless_mbp randomly pokes andre__ 
Oct 16 11:51:08 <aSIMULAtor> now i am
Oct 16 11:51:10 <Lantz> http://www.markdavestores.com/servlet/the-102/Nokia-N900/Detail   $430.00
Oct 16 11:51:14 <jeremiah> timeless_mbp: Well, we'd probably need some benchmarks but it is the 'canonical' way to do that kinda thing :)
Oct 16 11:51:19 <andre__> timeless_mbp, you're welcome
Oct 16 11:51:56 <Stskeeps> wazd_: you seem to qualify for developer rebate :>
Oct 16 11:51:58 <timeless_mbp> Lantz: wtf?>
Oct 16 11:52:14 <SpeedEvil> 430 - damn that is cheap
Oct 16 11:52:27 <timeless_mbp> they're offering it for 300 USD
Oct 16 11:52:44 <SpeedEvil> timeless: yes - to qualified devs :/
Oct 16 11:52:58 <zerojayN900> what/where?
Oct 16 11:53:01 <timeless_mbp> SpeedEvil: http://www.markdavestores.com/servlet/the-102/Nokia-N900/Detail
Oct 16 11:53:16 <Stskeeps> zerojayN900: developer programme came out today. 200+ karma resulting price 300 euro
Oct 16 11:53:24 <Lantz> not sure if the co is on the up & up or not but I ran across that site last night
Oct 16 11:53:25 <jeremiah> wow
Oct 16 11:53:27 <andre__> aha
Oct 16 11:53:37 * Stskeeps votes for "subtract your karma from the price"
Oct 16 11:53:48 <SpeedEvil> 300?
Oct 16 11:53:52 <SpeedEvil> No way.
Oct 16 11:53:55 <andre__> Stskeeps, cool, Nokia pays 800 to me? :-P
Oct 16 11:53:56 <jeremiah> Stskeeps: heh
Oct 16 11:54:00 <jeremiah> great idea. :)
Oct 16 11:54:06 <zerojayN900> wow.
Oct 16 11:54:16 <andre__> eh, "Task navigator" is an ugly term. how do you call the stuff where you start apps from by clicking an icon, and the stuff where you switch between already running apps? $your_favorite_term welcome
Oct 16 11:54:21 <wazd_> Stskeeps: oh?
Oct 16 11:54:23 <Stskeeps> http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=32951
Oct 16 11:54:31 <Lantz> check out the suggestes retail then their price...
Oct 16 11:54:37 <zaheerm> my karma is 17 only, it doesn't recognise my contributions upstream
Oct 16 11:54:50 <jeremiah> andre__: thing-that-switches-between-stuff ?
Oct 16 11:54:54 <Lantz> doesn't add up
Oct 16 11:55:10 <jeremiah> zaheerm: Yeah, we need a karma trading system
Oct 16 11:55:23 <andre__> jeremiah, i told you before to not literally translate from swedish! ;-)
Oct 16 11:55:28 <jeremiah> Where you can transfer karma from Ohloh, etc. to Maemo
Oct 16 11:55:36 <zerojayN900> still... that's like half off, isn't it?
Oct 16 11:55:37 <jeremiah> andre__: I sorry - me speak pretty one day!
Oct 16 11:55:47 <andre__> tak tak
Oct 16 11:55:48 <SpeedEvil> timeless: -260 accidentally, instead of -230?
Oct 16 11:55:50 <SpeedEvil> 130
Oct 16 11:56:02 <jeremiah> det var so lite!
Oct 16 11:56:04 * SpeedEvil wishes he could port openmoko karma :/
Oct 16 11:56:18 <jeremiah> ingen fara, eller ingen ko pa isen
Oct 16 11:56:31 <frals> lol
Oct 16 11:56:36 <Stskeeps> i like the fact the devel programme is a addition
Oct 16 11:56:37 <andre__> heh
Oct 16 11:56:43 <Stskeeps> not substitution for the devices we already got
Oct 16 11:56:49 <wazd_> Stskeeps: no e-mail for me :P
Oct 16 11:56:59 <Stskeeps> wazd_: me neither, and i have 550 karma
Oct 16 11:57:08 <jeremiah> Stskeeps: So you mean we can buy *another* device?
Oct 16 11:57:12 <jeremiah> One we can keep?
Oct 16 11:57:13 <Stskeeps> jeremiah: that's what it says
Oct 16 11:57:16 <andre__> collect the whole set!
Oct 16 11:57:19 <Stskeeps> This invitation is compatible with previous steps of the N900 device program. If you got a pre-production device on loan you can still keep it for the period agreed and get the discounted device. All we ask you is to make good use of the devices you have e.g. finding a community developer to bring more software to Maemo 5. Otherwise you can return the loaned device.
Oct 16 11:57:22 * jeremiah dances around the room
Oct 16 11:57:34 <jeremiah> Talk about explicit.
Oct 16 11:57:44 <jeremiah> Dear Nokia, I think I love you.
Oct 16 11:57:48 <Stskeeps> wait
Oct 16 11:57:49 <wazd_> Stskeeps: and again, I can't buy it anyway
Oct 16 11:57:54 <jeremiah> Don't tell my wife
Oct 16 11:58:00 <Stskeeps> "finding a community developer to bring more software to maemo 5 or return it"
Oct 16 11:58:03 <wazd_> Stskeeps: cause there's no "device program" in russia
Oct 16 11:58:38 <Stskeeps> what on earth does that mean? :P
Oct 16 11:58:47 <jeremiah> Stskeeps: There is no one in the Mer world who needs a N900?
Oct 16 11:58:55 <jeremiah> That you can send your loaner to?
Oct 16 11:58:55 <Stskeeps> i can mention a few
Oct 16 11:59:04 <jeremiah> Isn't that what it means?
Oct 16 11:59:09 <Stskeeps> but i am still bound by an agreement :P
Oct 16 11:59:19 <jeremiah> That if you buy one via the developer program, you can pass along your device?
Oct 16 11:59:41 <andre__> "Don't bogart the N900! pass it!"
Oct 16 11:59:43 <zerojayN900> i wouldn't send mine out. how do i know the device gets back to nokia in one piece?
Oct 16 11:59:44 <Stskeeps> maybe.. but i think this part needs to be clarified
Oct 16 11:59:45 <jeremiah> Do they really think people will return them?
Oct 16 11:59:55 <Stskeeps> i honestly don't know
Oct 16 11:59:57 <jeremiah> "Sorry - I lost mine. Just can't find it."
Oct 16 12:00:18 <Stskeeps> jeremiah: given the nature of a n900, it's like the ring from lord of the rings..
Oct 16 12:00:21 <Stskeeps> you don't leave it alone.
Oct 16 12:00:22 <Stskeeps> :P
Oct 16 12:00:25 <jeremiah> heh
Oct 16 12:00:27 <jeremiah> so true
Oct 16 12:00:32 <zerojayN900> yeah exactly
Oct 16 12:00:34 <SpeedEvil> Stskeeps: It turns you invisible to girls?
Oct 16 12:00:49 <zerojayN900> it's always on me.
Oct 16 12:00:50 <jeremiah> Well, we all probably start that way
Oct 16 12:00:54 <zerojayN900> fuck no
Oct 16 12:00:55 <jeremiah> :/
Oct 16 12:00:58 <Stskeeps> right, got my mail
Oct 16 12:01:03 <zerojayN900> girls llloooove the n900.
Oct 16 12:01:10 <woglinde> lol
Oct 16 12:01:12 <jeremiah> My wife certainly does!
Oct 16 12:01:17 <zerojayN900> too bad im married.
Oct 16 12:01:23 <jeremiah> That means she has the N810 to herself!
Oct 16 12:01:37 <woglinde> I think my wife woulndt like it
Oct 16 12:01:40 <Stskeeps> jeremiah: after seeing fremantle desktop she wants it on n810 instead :/
Oct 16 12:01:49 <woglinde> she makes software QS
Oct 16 12:01:49 <woglinde> *g*
Oct 16 12:01:55 <zerojayN900> get to work!
Oct 16 12:01:59 <zerojayN900> lol
Oct 16 12:02:00 <SpeedEvil> Is the GPS on the n900 NMEA output?
Oct 16 12:02:06 <SpeedEvil> Or is there a binary driver?
Oct 16 12:02:06 <wazd_> Stskeeps: sooooo
Oct 16 12:02:10 <jeremiah> Stskeeps: Actually for here, all that matters is Mah Jong and some other games. :)
Oct 16 12:02:16 <jeremiah> s/here/her
Oct 16 12:02:25 <wazd_> Stskeeps: that's why you've decided to swith to Fremantle desktop in Mer :D
Oct 16 12:02:51 <jeremiah> I really like the new Mer desktop picture I saw yesterday
Oct 16 12:02:56 <jeremiah> Very cool design
Oct 16 12:04:13 <Corsac> hmhm, develpper program is accessible only to developers already active, isn't it?
Oct 16 12:04:30 <wazd_> http://www.markdavestores.com/servlet/the-102/Nokia-N900/Detail <- do they actually have n900 for 300 bucks? :)
Oct 16 12:04:34 <Mek> in fact even only to developers already active in ways karma can measure
Oct 16 12:04:38 <SpeedEvil> wazd_: One can dream.
Oct 16 12:04:41 <Stskeeps> Corsac: karma 200+
Oct 16 12:04:44 <SpeedEvil> wazd_: I really doubt it
Oct 16 12:04:45 <ifreq> wazd, nope
Oct 16 12:04:48 <Stskeeps> which is actually a low bar
Oct 16 12:05:00 <SpeedEvil> wazd_: I suspect they have taken 130 off 430, instead of 130 off the retail
Oct 16 12:06:02 <Corsac> Stskeeps: hmhm yeah ok so it's not really a way to get involved, more a reward for already done work
Oct 16 12:06:07 <Corsac> (which is fine, though)
Oct 16 12:07:31 <zerojayN900> how long until the first bitchfest in that thread? ;)
Oct 16 12:07:57 <lardman> morning
Oct 16 12:07:57 <lardman> -ish
Oct 16 12:07:57 <Stskeeps> zerojayN900: karma 200 is really low bar
Oct 16 12:08:04 <tru> the N900 developer program, are you invited to that or is there a URL where you can sign up?
Oct 16 12:08:14 <zaheerm> tru, invited by email
Oct 16 12:08:21 <frals> i got over 100 karma and ive been here like a month, so anyone who has been active on maemo.org (not upstream etc) should have that easily :o
Oct 16 12:08:26 <zerojayN900> i know the bar is low. wouldn't stop some.
Oct 16 12:08:35 <lardman> what's the news?
Oct 16 12:08:38 <tru> zaheerm: alright, for already existing developers I guess?
Oct 16 12:08:48 <Stskeeps> lardman: developer programme day
Oct 16 12:08:51 <wazd> Stskeeps: yeah, in fact surprisingly low :)
Oct 16 12:08:52 <Stskeeps> (ie, christmas you pay for)
Oct 16 12:09:21 <zaheerm> yah i jumped from karma 3 to 17 in a cpl days just by posting bugs and comments in talk.maemo.org
Oct 16 12:09:29 <jeremiah> hello lardy!
Oct 16 12:09:38 <lardman> hey jeremiah
Oct 16 12:09:39 <zaheerm> i haven't yet released any of my code on garage or other
Oct 16 12:09:44 <jeremiah> We're talking about getting a cheap N900
Oct 16 12:09:51 <jeremiah> :)
Oct 16 12:09:53 <lardman> Stskeeps: thanks
Oct 16 12:10:05 <Mek> it's just a bit strange that karma doesn't really measure if you've done development, yet it is used for a 'developer' program...
Oct 16 12:10:12 <zaheerm> for £380 you can get it in UK (about 390 euros)
Oct 16 12:10:14 <lardman> hmm, /me still waits for someone who knows the details of osso-abook to appear on the list
Oct 16 12:10:32 <jeremiah> zaheerm: Yeah, you can build up karma pretty quickly - edit the wiki too. :)
Oct 16 12:10:37 <Stskeeps> Mek: community participation, not development
Oct 16 12:10:42 <zaheerm> by using 15pct code from nokia.co.uk and going to site through quidco (which gives 10 pct cashback on nokia)
Oct 16 12:10:59 <Mek> Stskeeps: true, but than don't call it a developer program, but a community program or something..
Oct 16 12:11:14 <zerojayN900> and here we go.
Oct 16 12:11:16 <Stskeeps> development is not only development
Oct 16 12:11:27 <jeremiah> Stskeeps++
Oct 16 12:11:37 <jeremiah> Development is documentation
Oct 16 12:11:40 <suihkulokki> 15:07 < zerojayN900> how long until the first bitchfest in that thread? ;)
Oct 16 12:11:40 * SpeedEvil wishes he'd had time to karma whore.
Oct 16 12:11:46 <suihkulokki> seems it started here already =)
Oct 16 12:11:51 <zerojayN900> yep.
Oct 16 12:12:27 <AndrewFBlack> whats the full price for a n900 going to be in euros?
Oct 16 12:12:40 <Stskeeps> wasn't it like 500-600?
Oct 16 12:12:42 <frals> 599
Oct 16 12:12:45 <Stskeeps> pre tax
Oct 16 12:12:46 <Corsac> Stskeeps: it should use the irc channel too :)
Oct 16 12:13:06 <Stskeeps> Corsac: yeah but then line whoring would be a sport.
Oct 16 12:13:30 <Jaffa> Hmm. 300eur. Think I might pass
Oct 16 12:13:48 <lardman> yeah, expensive esp with the exchange rate
Oct 16 12:13:51 <Jaffa> Mek: Nokia call it a "device program" for "your contributions to the Maemo community"
Oct 16 12:14:07 <Mek> ah, oaky, that's good than...
Oct 16 12:14:08 * Jaffa will stick with the loaner and then reconsider in 6 months.
Oct 16 12:14:23 * Jaffa doesn't think Mrs Jaffa wants one. I *know* Mrs Lardman doesn't ;-)
Oct 16 12:14:28 <AndrewFBlack> wonder what he cost in USD for dev program is because if I have to pay 300 euros thats only $150 from regular us price.  Where in euros it half off there prie
Oct 16 12:14:48 <Corsac> Stskeeps: yeah, well, flooding is not really allowed, nor here nor on talk.m.o
Oct 16 12:14:56 <woglinde> hm where is the program?
Oct 16 12:14:57 <lardman> I don't think she'll want one for £300 anyway ;)
Oct 16 12:15:08 <Jaffa> lardman: :)
Oct 16 12:15:14 <Jaffa> woglinde: in your email, AFAICT
Oct 16 12:15:24 <Corsac> Stskeeps: same goes for mailing lists, I guess
Oct 16 12:15:32 <Stskeeps> what on earth does http://talk.maemo.org/showpost.php?p=348275&postcount=19 mean?
Oct 16 12:15:33 <Stskeeps> :P
Oct 16 12:15:36 <woglinde> hm somehow my garageemails seems to vanish
Oct 16 12:15:45 <woglinde> let me check it
Oct 16 12:15:53 <Corsac> (though there is no perfect way to calcul karma)
Oct 16 12:16:16 <Jaffa> Stskeeps: I'll read the thread in context.
Oct 16 12:16:17 <wazd> Stskeeps: Quim acts like Yoda now :)
Oct 16 12:16:26 <lardman> Jaffa: what are the with contract prices like, quite cheap I thought?
Oct 16 12:16:26 <zerojayN900> lol
Oct 16 12:16:43 <wazd> Stskeeps: like "Follow your instincts" or "Use the Force" :D
Oct 16 12:17:06 <Corsac> arg
Oct 16 12:17:16 <Corsac> talk.maemo.org doesn't share accounts with wiki?
Oct 16 12:17:18 <Stskeeps> wazd: the force won't help me in a court ;)
Oct 16 12:17:24 <Jaffa> lardman: Last I saw, free on an 18x30 T-mobile contract. With a Vodafone PAYG price of 329 quid
Oct 16 12:17:28 <Jaffa> Corsac: No
Oct 16 12:17:32 <Stskeeps> Corsac: you could have linked your account to garage account
Oct 16 12:17:41 <Corsac> ok
Oct 16 12:17:46 * Jaffa finds the instructions
Oct 16 12:17:54 <woglinde> hm
Oct 16 12:18:12 <woglinde> the password reset msg was sent
Oct 16 12:18:15 <lcuk> Mek, community contributions program == developer program lol
Oct 16 12:18:20 <Jaffa> Corsac: http://wiki.maemo.org/Link_talk.maemo.org_account_with_maemo.org_profile
Oct 16 12:18:42 <Corsac> thanks
Oct 16 12:19:34 <woglinde> maybee I didnt set the spam option
Oct 16 12:20:27 * SpeedEvil sighs.
Oct 16 12:20:34 <SpeedEvil> 18*30 I could _almost_ afford.
Oct 16 12:20:48 <SpeedEvil> But my credit rating at the moment provokes riotous laughter.
Oct 16 12:21:26 <lardman> Jaffa: hmm, so probably cheaper to get with contract realistically, monthly one that is
Oct 16 12:21:40 <Jaffa> lardman: Probably, since you'll want data
Oct 16 12:21:41 <lardman> or we can hope the pound becomes stronger before end of year
Oct 16 12:21:59 <woglinde> lardman nope
Oct 16 12:22:05 <Jaffa> lardman: seems unlikely, TBH. Eurozone slightly further ahead through recession AFAICT (Gemernay & France, anyway)
Oct 16 12:22:08 <zaheerm> lardman, or buy a few from nokia's site currently and sell them in euros at a profit :)
Oct 16 12:22:09 <SpeedEvil> lardman: work out the numbers. - you are saving on the order of a hundred quid a year
Oct 16 12:22:21 <SpeedEvil> lardman: compared with buying the contract SIM only.
Oct 16 12:22:59 <SpeedEvil> This does of course mean you're being screwed when the contract runs out, but...
Oct 16 12:23:23 <Stskeeps> wazd: It looks like if your application is approved, the N900 would appear as an item you can purchase at forum.nokia.com's estore.
Oct 16 12:24:07 <woglinde> hm 432 on ebay germany with plan
Oct 16 12:24:43 <lardman> SpeedEvil: what do you mean? If I have to have a £20/month data contract anyway, buying a more expensive one makes the N900 pretty cheap over the year/18months
Oct 16 12:24:59 <lardman> or is that what you did mean?
Oct 16 12:25:07 <SpeedEvil> lardman: I mean - a SIM only contract is not actually cheaper than a contract with a phone often.
Oct 16 12:25:09 <lardman> has been a long morning
Oct 16 12:25:11 <wazd> Stskeeps: haha
Oct 16 12:25:16 <lardman> SpeedEvil: agreed
Oct 16 12:25:17 <wazd> Stskeeps: fail for me :D
Oct 16 12:25:31 <lardman> SpeedEvil: I think we've had this conversation before, when I was getting a sim only to test the N900
Oct 16 12:25:32 <lardman> :)
Oct 16 12:25:33 <Corsac> Karma 9
Oct 16 12:25:37 <Corsac> woohoo!
Oct 16 12:25:41 <SpeedEvil> lardman: possibly - I've not woken up.
Oct 16 12:25:44 <wazd> oh, got an e-mail!
Oct 16 12:25:47 <SpeedEvil> Corsac: I have you beat. 3!
Oct 16 12:25:47 <Stskeeps> wazd: forum.nokia can probably be used for buying in russia
Oct 16 12:25:48 <Jaffa> Vodafone offered me a saving of 2-3 quid a month when renewing between keeping my existing phone or getting a new W890i
Oct 16 12:26:05 <Lantz> my brother lives in Amsterdam... He says the N900 is free with 1 yr contract there
Oct 16 12:26:14 <Corsac> maybe I'll have access to n9000 developer program!
Oct 16 12:26:28 <woglinde> lantz what are the costs for the plan?
Oct 16 12:26:42 <SpeedEvil> Corsac: I think at karma 9, you qualify for a nokia 3310 headset.
Oct 16 12:26:52 <lardman> Jaffa: same here, I had to take a new contract to get a decent sim only price, and even that isn't great
Oct 16 12:26:57 <Khertan> Hello !
Oct 16 12:27:19 <woglinde> re khertan
Oct 16 12:27:28 <wazd> Username is already taken, please select another.
Oct 16 12:27:29 <Lantz> woglinger: getting that info now
Oct 16 12:27:33 <wazd> no fucking way
Oct 16 12:28:01 <woglinde> hm ah you need this karma stuff
Oct 16 12:28:02 <wazd> ah, it's taken by me :D
Oct 16 12:28:03 <woglinde> bahahaaha
Oct 16 12:28:08 <woglinde> ~karma
Oct 16 12:28:09 <infobot> woglinde has neutral karma
Oct 16 12:28:12 <woglinde> pff
Oct 16 12:28:17 <Khertan> ~karma
Oct 16 12:28:25 <woglinde> lol
Oct 16 12:28:25 <SpeedEvil> ~karma
Oct 16 12:28:25 <infobot> speedevil has neutral karma
Oct 16 12:28:28 <Khertan> <infobot> Someone already said that 8 seconds ago
Oct 16 12:28:30 <Khertan> lol
Oct 16 12:28:38 <Khertan> ~karma
Oct 16 12:28:38 <infobot> khertan has neutral karma
Oct 16 12:28:50 <Khertan> ~karma chaos
Oct 16 12:28:50 <infobot> chaos has neutral karma
Oct 16 12:28:53 <samad> i have run the code http://pastey.net/126661 and get the following
Oct 16 12:28:54 <samad> contact[8742]: GLIB CRITICAL ** default - _build_where_clause: assertion `priv->el' failed
Oct 16 12:28:55 <samad> contact[8742]: GLIB CRITICAL ** GLib - g_string_free: assertion `string != NULL' failed
Oct 16 12:28:55 <samad> contact[8742]: GLIB CRITICAL ** default - _get_events_core: assertion `RTCOM_IS_EL(el)' failed
Oct 16 12:28:55 <samad> contact[8742]: GLIB CRITICAL ** default - rtcom_el_iter_get_valuearray: assertion `RTCOM_IS_EL_ITER(it)' faile
Oct 16 12:29:02 <woglinde> samd pastebin
Oct 16 12:29:07 <zaheerm> i moved to an o2 simplicity 1 month rolling contract at end of my contract...waiting initially for a palm pre before i upgraded
Oct 16 12:29:07 <range> Yay. Everybody checking their karma brought down maemo.org?
Oct 16 12:29:09 <woglinde> ~pastebin
Oct 16 12:29:10 <Khertan> hum ... developpers program
Oct 16 12:29:10 <infobot> [~pastebin] A "pastebin" is a web-based service where you can paste anything over 3 lines without flooding the channel. Here are links to a few : http://www.pastebin.com , http://pastebin.ca , http://channels.debian.net/paste , http://paste.lisp.org , http://www.rafb.net/paste
Oct 16 12:29:13 <Khertan> 300Euros
Oct 16 12:29:14 <Khertan> ouch
Oct 16 12:29:30 <Lantz> 19 euro/mo (I think thats about 25.00 US
Oct 16 12:29:51 <woglinde> lantz  one year 19 euros per month?
Oct 16 12:30:05 <woglinde> or two years
Oct 16 12:31:34 <Lantz> one year
Oct 16 12:31:41 <woglinde> hm
Oct 16 12:31:52 <woglinde> 228
Oct 16 12:31:56 <woglinde> that would be cheap
Oct 16 12:32:10 <Lantz> so that works out to about 230 euro
Oct 16 12:32:20 <lardman> anyone know if the address book is open source?
Oct 16 12:32:27 <mgedmin> oh dear, go out for some quick lunch, come back to find a huuuuge scrollback because nokia announced the developer program
Oct 16 12:32:37 <mgedmin> lardman: the backend or the user interface?
Oct 16 12:32:45 <mgedmin> the backend is evolution-data-server, isn't it?
Oct 16 12:32:53 <Jaffa> mgedmin: + osso abook
Oct 16 12:32:57 <mgedmin> the user interface: my guess, given their previous track record, would be closed
Oct 16 12:33:00 <lardman> mgedmin: ui
Oct 16 12:33:06 <mgedmin> I'd like to know for sure
Oct 16 12:33:14 <Jaffa> mgedmin: There was a talk at the summit talking about osso_abook taking EDS + Telepathy + SIM and combining them
Oct 16 12:33:14 <lardman> mgedmin: though backend might be ok - need to work out how the onlineness of contacts is handled
Oct 16 12:33:15 <mgedmin> where's the free/closed software map of maemo 5?
Oct 16 12:33:31 <mgedmin> a list of all package names preinstalled in the rootfs with green FREE or red CLOSED next to it?
Oct 16 12:33:38 <Jaffa> Everyone been too busy with shiny new SDK or device to actually check the source availability ;-)
Oct 16 12:33:42 <mgedmin> I mean, somebody ought to have made such a map, right?
Oct 16 12:33:49 <lardman> Jaffa: yeah, but the api docs are rather confusing as to how to use everything
Oct 16 12:34:14 <Jaffa> lardman: For online stuff, use osso_abook and it has a "presence" indicator. THat'll merge all VoIP/IM account statuses
Oct 16 12:34:32 <lardman> Jaffa: I want data structs no ui
Oct 16 12:34:46 <Jaffa> lardman: I mean a "presence" property
Oct 16 12:35:05 <lardman> I need to work out which contacts are online, and keep that list updated, and then will display it on libchamplain map
Oct 16 12:35:14 <mgedmin> ooh
Oct 16 12:35:16 * mgedmin want
Oct 16 12:35:17 <Jaffa> lardman: http://wiki.maemo.org/Documentation/Maemo_5_Developer_Guide/Using_Generic_Platform_Components/Using_Address_Book_API#Non-Widget_Classes
Oct 16 12:35:54 <lardman> not much help really
Oct 16 12:36:05 <lardman> I mean good for some specifics
Oct 16 12:36:24 <wazd> Stskeeps: I can't buy online on nokia site in russia
Oct 16 12:36:27 <lardman> but where do things like McAccount *account come from?
Oct 16 12:36:36 <lardman> not the def, how to create one
Oct 16 12:36:39 <Lantz> woglinde: He said that is $342.26 US + tax
Oct 16 12:36:51 <Jaffa> lardman: Ah.
Oct 16 12:36:59 <woglinde> lantz I am in europe
Oct 16 12:37:15 <Khertan> Hum ... should i bought a discounted device ... or ... wait ...
Oct 16 12:37:21 <Khertan> hum ... not sure
Oct 16 12:37:22 <lardman> Jaffa: needs a better example, the one in Garage examples doesn't really use osso-abook at all
Oct 16 12:37:32 <fiferboy> Could someone with a GPRS connection test personal-ip-address 0.3-1 in extras-devel?
Oct 16 12:37:39 <penguinbait> I am thinking wait, not really much of a discount
Oct 16 12:37:39 <Khertan> no ...
Oct 16 12:37:42 <mgedmin> fiferboy: I probably could
Oct 16 12:37:49 <Khertan> i prefer a test of homeip
Oct 16 12:37:52 <mgedmin> fiferboy: are you the author?
Oct 16 12:37:55 <fiferboy> mgedmin: Thanks!
Oct 16 12:38:00 <fiferboy> mgedmin: Yes
Oct 16 12:38:07 <mgedmin> oh, I have 0.3-1 installed
Oct 16 12:38:09 <Khertan> :)
Oct 16 12:38:21 <fiferboy> Khertan: Do python home applets work in fremantle yet?
Oct 16 12:38:31 <mgedmin> fiferboy: it has no icon any more -- is that expected?
Oct 16 12:38:36 <Khertan> fiferboy: i ve just some difficulty with transparency
Oct 16 12:38:40 <fiferboy> mgedmin: Yes, there was a redesign
Oct 16 12:38:51 <Khertan> fiferboy: but works on n900
Oct 16 12:38:57 <Khertan> segfault on scratchbox
Oct 16 12:39:04 <fiferboy> Khertan: There are some weird things going on with transparency on the desktop in general
Oct 16 12:39:11 <Khertan> fiferboy: yep
Oct 16 12:39:22 <Khertan> right now i ve just ported homeip
Oct 16 12:39:22 <fiferboy> mgedmin: Does it tell you the interface you are connected to?
Oct 16 12:39:29 <Khertan> the other will follow
Oct 16 12:39:34 <fiferboy> Very cool
Oct 16 12:39:46 <lizardo> Khertan: did you run it standalone ?   if sou you need to call it like "run-standalone.sh  python2.5 applet.py"
Oct 16 12:40:00 * Khertan have so many thing to do for fremantle
Oct 16 12:40:04 <Khertan> lizardo: yep
Oct 16 12:40:15 <fiferboy> hildon-desktop should take care of that if you add it through the interface
Oct 16 12:40:31 <Khertan> lizardo: and to be honest i didn't understand why it segfault on scratchbox
Oct 16 12:40:46 <lizardo> Khertan: are you using x86 target ?
Oct 16 12:40:52 <Khertan> lizardo: and i ve also pygtkeditor which segfault on scratchbox
Oct 16 12:40:56 <fiferboy> Khertan: What kind of widgets do you use on it?  Just labels?
Oct 16 12:40:58 <Khertan> lizardo: of course
Oct 16 12:41:18 <Khertan> lizardo: maybe something related to my installation
Oct 16 12:41:36 <mgedmin> fiferboy: yes
Oct 16 12:41:44 <lizardo> fiferboy, Khertan : there is a known issue on the home applets , see the "Known issues" section on the release e-mail : http://lists.maemo.org/pipermail/maemo-developers/2009-October/021433.html
Oct 16 12:41:50 <fiferboy> mgedmin: What does it say?  phonet0?
Oct 16 12:41:51 <mgedmin> fiferboy: personal-gprs-monitor is a bit broken'ish, though
Oct 16 12:42:03 <fiferboy> mgedmin: The icons?
Oct 16 12:42:05 <Khertan> fiferboy: a gtk.Icon and a gtk.Label in a gtk.HBox
Oct 16 12:42:06 <mgedmin> fiferboy: wlan0 currently, will switch to 3g now (I expect gprs0)
Oct 16 12:42:20 <lizardo> Khertan: it would be nice if you put the error output on some pastebin for us to look :)
Oct 16 12:42:27 <fiferboy> Khertan: That should be fine.  I have had trouble with gtk.button, though
Oct 16 12:42:49 <mgedmin> fiferboy: icons *and* it says "184.208 ME" since the B doesn't fit
Oct 16 12:42:55 <fiferboy> lizardo: I don't use python, but thanks
Oct 16 12:43:03 <Khertan> fiferboy: you will get trouble with all things with receive click
Oct 16 12:43:05 <mgedmin> fiferboy: icons were broken in old version too until I rebooted
Oct 16 12:43:26 <Khertan> lizardo: yes ... once i will be able to get something more usefull than "segfault"
Oct 16 12:43:26 <fiferboy> mgedmin: Thanks.  Icons are because the widget gets added before the icon cache gets update :|
Oct 16 12:43:30 <Khertan> lizardo: i ll send it ;)
Oct 16 12:43:37 <fiferboy> mgedmin: Simply removing and adding the widget works too
Oct 16 12:43:53 <fiferboy> Khertan: event boxes work fine to get clicks
Oct 16 12:43:55 <Khertan> mgedmin: could i ask you to test homeip too ?
Oct 16 12:44:02 <Khertan> fiferboy: yep
Oct 16 12:44:08 <mgedmin> Khertan: oh, those are different things?
Oct 16 12:44:13 <murrayc__> Khertan: Is it a desktop widget?
Oct 16 12:44:18 <Khertan> mgedmin: yep different developper :)
Oct 16 12:44:20 * mgedmin is drowning in the information flood and losing his touch with reality
Oct 16 12:44:21 <Khertan> murrayc__: yes
Oct 16 12:44:40 <Khertan> murrayc__: currently a python home widget
Oct 16 12:44:59 <Khertan> homeip 1.0.0-2 available in extras-devel
Oct 16 12:45:02 <murrayc__> Khertan: Then it's easy to make the background transparent. See the code from here: http://www.murrayc.com/blog/permalink/2009/05/11/maemo-5-desktop-widget-example/
Oct 16 12:45:12 <fiferboy> mgedmin: Thanks for the gprs-mon report - I will fix that
Oct 16 12:45:45 <penguinbait> why is it good to loan 300 devices to anyone who when to summit, then charge developers so much?
Oct 16 12:45:59 <mgedmin> fiferboy: ip applet bug(?): I switched to a 3g connection and now it shows me usb0 with the address I configured manually instead of gprs0 with my external ip
Oct 16 12:46:01 <penguinbait> wouldnt it have been better to loan 300 developers the devices?
Oct 16 12:46:19 <mgedmin> fiferboy: I suggest you look at the default route when deciding which interface to show
Oct 16 12:46:21 <Khertan> murrayc__: i use cairo too :) but doesn't work ... think i ve made an error somewhere in the code
Oct 16 12:46:23 <Jaffa> penguinbait: The device programme isn't just for developers. Can we kill that meme?
Oct 16 12:46:28 <murrayc__> penguinbait: Users give user feedback. Developers give developer feedback.
Oct 16 12:46:28 <lcuk> a shotgun approach hitting a bigger spectrum of the audience is good
Oct 16 12:46:36 <fiferboy> mgedmin: Thanks, I will look at that too
Oct 16 12:46:43 <murrayc__> Khertan: You understand that it's about the RGBA, right?
Oct 16 12:46:51 <Khertan> yep
Oct 16 12:46:56 <murrayc__> OK, sorry then.
Oct 16 12:46:59 <Khertan> :)
Oct 16 12:47:15 * Jaffa is surprised the device programme is so expensive, but <shrug/>
Oct 16 12:47:26 <Jaffa> It's still a generous discount to a large number of people
Oct 16 12:47:39 <Jaffa> Which I don't think Nokia did to the Symbian community on the launch of the N97
Oct 16 12:47:59 <samad> i have run the code http://pastey.net/126661 and get the following
Oct 16 12:48:08 <Khertan> but thanks for the help as i ll probably found my mistake reading your code
Oct 16 12:48:14 <mgedmin> are the numbers of discounted devices publicly available?
Oct 16 12:48:17 <penguinbait> how it it a generous discount, I can buy new for 549, or buy on dev discount for 449
Oct 16 12:48:23 <penguinbait> not that generous to me?
Oct 16 12:48:24 <samad> the golloeing error http://pastey.net/126663
Oct 16 12:48:27 <mgedmin> maybe more developers will get n900 with a smaller discount?
Oct 16 12:48:51 <samad> i have run the code http://pastey.net/126661 and get the following  error http://pastey.net/126663
Oct 16 12:48:53 <Jaffa> penguinbait: Please send me $100. Don't worry, it's not generous ;-p
Oct 16 12:48:57 * Khertan is surprize too by the price and expect that loaned device will become free :)
Oct 16 12:49:10 <Stskeeps> penguinbait: 549 with subsidy?
Oct 16 12:49:26 <penguinbait> http://www.pcconnection.com/IPA/Shop/Product/Detail?Sku=10330687&SourceID=k130775
Oct 16 12:49:32 <penguinbait> 549 unlocked
Oct 16 12:49:36 <lcuk> jaffa: http://liqbase.net/jaffa_drizzle.jpg
Oct 16 12:50:05 <Jaffa> lcuk: Mmmm, orangey
Oct 16 12:50:23 <penguinbait> I am sure I can get one from a carrier for cheaper
Oct 16 12:50:27 <Khertan> murrayc__: seems that getting the colormap in the expose event instead of the realize event isn't the right way :)
Oct 16 12:50:32 <penguinbait> some day
Oct 16 12:50:34 <Khertan> murrayc__: thx for the help
Oct 16 12:50:38 <Khertan> :)
Oct 16 12:51:05 <lardman> Khertan: s/expect/hope
Oct 16 12:51:14 <Khertan> lardman: yep :)
Oct 16 12:51:40 <mgedmin> Khertan: what kind of testing did you want for homeip?
Oct 16 12:51:53 <murrayc__> Khertan: You mean my example code is correct?
Oct 16 12:52:30 <Khertan> murrayc__: surely as i mean mine is wrong :)
Oct 16 12:52:40 <murrayc__> Khertan: OK. That's reassuring.
Oct 16 12:52:41 <Mozillion> after af-sb-init.sh start... should one be able to use dbus-monitor? because I cannot.. and also some programs report having problems reaching d-bus... but most in the GUI seem to run fine
Oct 16 12:53:39 <Khertan> Mozillion: run your application with run-standalone.sh
Oct 16 12:53:46 <mgedmin> apt-get update fails with write error (28 no space left on device)
Oct 16 12:53:52 <Mozillion> tried that.. didn't really help
Oct 16 12:54:14 <Corsac> mgedmin: self explanatory, I'd say :)
Oct 16 12:54:24 <Mozillion> Khertan:  in particular I want to try hermes and fiddle with it.. but gconftool-2 from postinst doesn't seem to be happy
Oct 16 12:54:47 <lardman> so, any guesses as to whether the OssoABookProfileGroup's refilter-* signals are used to determine change of presence?
Oct 16 12:55:00 <mgedmin> running gconftool from a postinst is a hack
Oct 16 12:55:42 <Khertan> mgedmin: just try if homeip get always ip from the phone in 3G, GPRS or other phone data connection mode
Oct 16 12:56:01 <mgedmin> Khertan: "no free space on device" means I can't try homeip now :(
Oct 16 12:56:08 <Khertan> mgedmin: ouch
Oct 16 12:56:39 <Khertan> mgedmin: just an advice ... make some place before next reboot
Oct 16 12:56:48 <Khertan> mgedmin: as you can have trouble
Oct 16 12:57:17 <lardman> hmm, interesting, libosso-abook doesn't seem to exist in the repo
Oct 16 12:57:17 <mgedmin> well, I have 232 kilobytes free, so I should be all right, yes?
Oct 16 12:57:42 <mgedmin> lardman, can you build a small app with a tree view using the list store you get from abook, and then see if the tree view updates automatically when contacts appear and disappear?
Oct 16 12:58:00 <mgedmin> I would hope that the normal gtk tree model changed signals are emitted to keep the information current
Oct 16 12:58:29 <Corsac> Jaffa: ok, thanks
Oct 16 12:58:48 <Corsac> Jaffa: so first talk.m.o, than Talk:MaemoSecurity then MaemoSecurity, kind-of?
Oct 16 12:58:48 <Jaffa> Mozillion: You running Hermes on the SDK? (I'm the author so may be able to help)
Oct 16 12:58:53 <samad> i have run the code http://pastey.net/126661 and get the following  error http://pastey.net/126663is anybody there to help me ?
Oct 16 12:59:01 <Mozillion> Jaffa: ah.. you are here!
Oct 16 12:59:04 <Corsac> Jaffa: do you think we can switch the already-replied questions to main page?
Oct 16 12:59:13 <milos_> ~karma
Oct 16 12:59:13 <infobot> milos_ has neutral karma
Oct 16 12:59:14 <lardman> perhaps, I need to work out what an McProfile *profile is first though
Oct 16 12:59:18 <Mozillion> Jaffa: well, I wanted to try... but it was just another indication at something being wrong
Oct 16 12:59:19 <Jaffa> Corsac: That's what lbt was thinking at the start, I think. Elena's answered on Talk: tho' ;-)
Oct 16 12:59:40 <Corsac> yeah but that's where the question were asked :)
Oct 16 12:59:42 <Jaffa> Corsac: Moving the already answered stuff and moderating the questions from Talk: to the main page where sensible is good.
Oct 16 12:59:43 <mgedmin> lardman, oh, you know, things like whether you usually order extra fries, etc
Oct 16 12:59:45 <Jaffa> ...idea
Oct 16 13:00:04 <lardman> yeah ;)
Oct 16 13:00:08 <Corsac> ok, will do the first step (if you don't mind)
Oct 16 13:00:16 <mgedmin> does infobot ever say anything other than 'neutral karma'?
Oct 16 13:00:28 <mgedmin> what's the deb-src line for debian?
Oct 16 13:00:33 <Jaffa> Mozillion: The gconftool-2 in postinst is used for two things: setting the Facebook API keys (so the app doesn't have them, and forks use their own); 2) fixing a browser launch issue which affects python-facebook authentication
Oct 16 13:00:37 <Jaffa> mgedmin++
Oct 16 13:00:39 <Corsac> mgedmin: you mean a real debian?
Oct 16 13:00:41 <Mozillion> aah.. ok
Oct 16 13:00:41 <Jaffa> ~karma mgedmin
Oct 16 13:00:42 <Mozillion> but..
Oct 16 13:00:42 <infobot> mgedmin has neutral karma
Oct 16 13:00:45 <Mozillion> Jaffa: Jaffa: http://paste.debian.net/49245/
Oct 16 13:00:51 <Jaffa> ~mgedmin++
Oct 16 13:00:54 <Jaffa> ~karma mgedmin
Oct 16 13:00:54 <infobot> mgedmin has karma of 1
Oct 16 13:00:55 <mgedmin> I want to port a debian package (dctrl-tools) to fremantle, quickly
Oct 16 13:01:17 <Jaffa> Mozillion: af-sb-init.sh start run?
Oct 16 13:01:18 <Corsac> deb-src http://ftp.fr.debian.org/debian sid main
Oct 16 13:01:19 <mgedmin> whoa
Oct 16 13:01:22 <Mozillion> yes.. it's running
Oct 16 13:01:29 <Corsac> replace fr by your country, and suite as appropriate
Oct 16 13:01:31 <Mozillion> I can see d-bus in the ps-tree
Oct 16 13:01:33 <mgedmin> thanks
Oct 16 13:01:41 <Jaffa> Mozillion: There's been a thread on maemo-developers (IIRC) of using D-Bus in the SDK.
Oct 16 13:01:56 <lbt> did I save my changes last night?
Oct 16 13:02:00 <Mozillion> ok.. I already tried searching there.. so might have overlooked
Oct 16 13:02:08 <zaheerm> ~karma zaheerm
Oct 16 13:02:09 <infobot> zaheerm has neutral karma
Oct 16 13:02:12 <zaheerm> :P
Oct 16 13:02:51 <Jaffa> Mozillion: Back in the beta SDK there wasn't any contact support, so I've got used to an "edit on desktop, run on device" use case for Hermes dev.
Oct 16 13:02:58 <Corsac> ~karma Corsac
Oct 16 13:02:58 <infobot> corsac has neutral karma
Oct 16 13:03:01 <Corsac> prft
Oct 16 13:03:14 <lardman> ~karma lardman
Oct 16 13:03:14 <infobot> lardman has neutral karma
Oct 16 13:03:17 <jeremiah> ~Stskeeps++
Oct 16 13:03:17 <lardman> hmm
Oct 16 13:03:19 <Jaffa> Mozillion: patches welcome - outline of some features planned and links to bug tracker now on http://hermes.garage.maemo.org/
Oct 16 13:03:20 <Mozillion> Jaffa: ah.. yes, makes sense :)
Oct 16 13:03:28 <Mozillion> cool
Oct 16 13:03:33 <jeremiah> ~karma Stskeeps
Oct 16 13:03:33 <infobot> stskeeps has karma of 3
Oct 16 13:03:43 <mgedmin> catch 22: I want to free disk space by removing largest packages -> I want dpigs -> I need grep-status which is from dctrl-tools -> I need free space to install dctrl-tools
Oct 16 13:03:53 <jeremiah> ~Corsac++
Oct 16 13:03:59 <jeremiah> ~karma Corsac
Oct 16 13:04:00 <infobot> corsac has karma of 1
Oct 16 13:04:17 <jeremiah> Don't forget your Tilde! :)
Oct 16 13:04:19 <Jaffa> mgedmin: mv /usr/share/hildon-welcome/..hands...avi ;-)
Oct 16 13:04:27 <mgedmin> Jaffa: already done that
Oct 16 13:04:34 <mgedmin> it's only a meg or so
Oct 16 13:05:03 <Myrtti> rubbish.
Oct 16 13:05:07 <mgedmin> head: invalid option -- -
Oct 16 13:05:08 <mgedmin> waaah
Oct 16 13:05:09 <Jaffa> mgedmin: Yeah. apt-get clean (if you've been using apt directly)?
Oct 16 13:05:22 <mgedmin> I'm running apt-get clean every 30 seconds to settle my nerves
Oct 16 13:05:23 <mgedmin> no reduction
Oct 16 13:05:24 <Khertan> Hum ... someone have an idea on how i can use a GtkSourceView.View in a pannablearea ? as gtk.sourceview.view subclasse gtk.TextView and not hildon.TextView
Oct 16 13:05:46 <Khertan> and so i get the feature : select and scroll at the same time
Oct 16 13:05:53 <Khertan> not really useable :)
Oct 16 13:06:11 <Khertan> should i try to fork gtksourceview to hildonsourceview ?
Oct 16 13:06:20 <jeremiah> mgedmin: apt-get autoclean
Oct 16 13:06:26 <mgedmin> looks like you need ... multiple inheritance! (dum dum dum)
Oct 16 13:06:36 <mgedmin> jeremiah: that's a weaker form of apt-get clean
Oct 16 13:06:38 <wao> waah
Oct 16 13:06:41 <mgedmin> I just need to rm a few packages
Oct 16 13:06:44 <mgedmin> vim eats 20 megs, but I need it
Oct 16 13:06:46 <jeremiah> Yes, but safer :)
Oct 16 13:06:48 <Khertan> mgedmin:  .... hum ...
Oct 16 13:06:52 <Khertan> mgedmin:  in c ?
Oct 16 13:06:53 <Khertan> :)
Oct 16 13:06:54 <mgedmin> I ought to optify vim
Oct 16 13:07:18 <Jaffa> mgedmin: I got an email about vim btw
Oct 16 13:07:22 <fiferboy> Khertan: Are you adding it with a container_add or a hildon_pannable_area_add_with_viewport?
Oct 16 13:07:27 <mgedmin> can we get an extra debian control field "Installed-size-in-root"?
Oct 16 13:07:45 <Jaffa> mgedmin: Since the current one is built by mud, optification is a case of adding "optify=1" to the mud.xml, but appeanretly there are some issues with cursor keys
Oct 16 13:07:57 <Jaffa> mgedmin: I'll forward you the mail
Oct 16 13:07:58 <mgedmin> oh?
Oct 16 13:08:01 <mgedmin> after optification?
Oct 16 13:08:19 <Khertan> fiferboy with the equivalent of container_add in python which is add, as hildon_pannable_area_add_with_viewport cannot be used has sourceview.View have native scroll
Oct 16 13:08:28 <mgedmin> mud rules and I should learn to use it some day
Oct 16 13:08:32 <Jaffa> mgedmin: No, with the current one in extras-devel (which was copied from diablo)
Oct 16 13:08:43 * lardman feels the intense frustration of wanting to crack on with a project but having no clue how to use the api
Oct 16 13:09:38 <lcuk> lardman, find the devs of the api and discuss with them
Oct 16 13:11:02 <lardman> lcuk: yeah
Oct 16 13:11:13 <lcuk> i know, easier said than done
Oct 16 13:12:40 <lardman> am feeling my inspiration leaking away
Oct 16 13:13:17 <lardman> spending hours plugging through api docs and still not actually managing to work out what they are supposed to do/how they are supposed to fit together
Oct 16 13:13:45 <lardman> ah well, back to work to do something useful - writing US C-scan analysis code
Oct 16 13:13:49 <lardman> cu all later
Oct 16 13:13:51 <lcuk> ok, why dont you get a piece of paper and draw what you want it to do
Oct 16 13:14:02 <lardman> ready?:
Oct 16 13:14:06 <lcuk> lol
Oct 16 13:14:18 <lardman> [get list of online contacts; make sure it stays up to date]
Oct 16 13:14:19 <lardman> done
Oct 16 13:14:22 <lcuk> haha
Oct 16 13:14:36 <lcuk> ok - just like the list of irc contacts over there >>>>>>>
Oct 16 13:14:39 <lardman> so not very difficult, except in working out how all the components are supposed to fit together
Oct 16 13:14:47 <lardman> yeah, but on the N900
Oct 16 13:14:50 * lcuk nods
Oct 16 13:15:18 <lardman> I could do it with timer callbacks and then parse the whole list, but I guess there must be signals generated when a contact state changes, so I'd prefer to use that method
Oct 16 13:15:28 <lcuk> Robot101 you are involved in the IM side of things, does what lardman want get exposed i nthe api and if so, do you have any examples?
Oct 16 13:15:51 <Myrtti> ohai
Oct 16 13:15:52 <lcuk> or know who would
Oct 16 13:15:55 <lcuk> hi Myrtti \o
Oct 16 13:15:58 <lardman> :)
Oct 16 13:15:58 * Myrtti tries to keep her head up
Oct 16 13:16:29 <lardman> bbiam, must get back to work
Oct 16 13:17:32 <Jaffa> mgedmin: email inbound
Oct 16 13:17:48 <mgedmin> ah, I assumed it was inbound 10 minutes ago when you first mentioned it ;)
Oct 16 13:17:54 <mgedmin> got it
Oct 16 13:18:12 <Jaffa> mgedmin: I got distracted ;)
Oct 16 13:19:00 <mgedmin> the enter key inserts OM thing is familiar: if I use screen inside fremantle's xterm I get the same problem
Oct 16 13:19:05 <mgedmin> without screen everything works
Oct 16 13:19:21 <mgedmin> vim 7.2-0maemo4fremantle0: arrow keys and enter work fine in insert mode
Oct 16 13:20:23 <mgedmin> screen also breaks utf-8 horribly
Oct 16 13:20:44 <mgedmin> and when I say screen I mean: open the maemo 5 xterm, ssh into my remote ubuntu machine, run screen, try to do anything inside screen -> utter fail
Oct 16 13:20:57 <mgedmin> while open maemo 5 xterm, ssh into my ubuntu machine, run apps without screen -> win
Oct 16 13:21:00 <mgedmin> strange
Oct 16 13:21:11 <mgedmin> from my ubuntu laptop ssh'ing to the same server and using screen works
Oct 16 13:21:21 <mgedmin> and maemo xterm uses the same vte as my laptop's gnome-terminal
Oct 16 13:21:36 <mgedmin> does the terminfo db on maemo have an entry for 'screen'?
Oct 16 13:23:19 <mgedmin> interesting: laptop ssh to n900, then from n900 ssh to server, run screen -> same problems
Oct 16 13:23:24 <mgedmin> weird
Oct 16 13:23:37 <mgedmin> maemo changes something in my locale perhaps?
Oct 16 13:23:44 <mgedmin> overrides $TERM somehow?
Oct 16 13:23:51 <Jaffa> hmm, interesting idea
Oct 16 13:24:13 <mgedmin> wait, only just now read the part about losing focus
Oct 16 13:24:46 <fiferboy> mgedmin: Implemented the default gateway suggestiong, thanks ;)
Oct 16 13:25:30 <mgedmin> hm, cannot repro
Oct 16 13:27:46 * VDVsx ponders about the devel discount program ... needs to get a job first :P
Oct 16 13:27:51 <mgedmin> hm, svn doesn't consider VeriSign to be a trusted certificate authority
Oct 16 13:28:01 <Khertan> when i look at all screenshot of application running Maemo 5 ... i still see a low battery icon
Oct 16 13:28:16 <Khertan> 2 solutions : i require sometimes to port something to fremantle
Oct 16 13:28:17 <jeremiah> mgedmin: I think there is a flag you can use to preserve certain environment variables via ssh
Oct 16 13:28:26 <zerojayN900> fiferboy pia appears to show the correct interface. good job.
Oct 16 13:28:44 <Khertan> power isn't well managed yet in the pre production device :)
Oct 16 13:28:51 <fiferboy> zerojayN900: Thanks.  There is an issue with the interface when you set up usb0 as well
Oct 16 13:29:03 <zaheerm> Khertan, my screenshot was not low power :)
Oct 16 13:29:08 <Khertan> someone know what s the differences in the pre production device and the final one ?
Oct 16 13:29:09 <fiferboy> Hopefully that is straightened out now by using the default gateway (thanks mgedmin!)
Oct 16 13:29:20 <zaheerm> Khertan, http://zaheer.merali.org/articles/2009/10/16/using-gstreamer-python-in-maemo-5-on-n900/
Oct 16 13:29:42 <Khertan> zaheerm: not low ... but not full too :)
Oct 16 13:29:56 <Khertan> http://khertan.net/wp-content/uploads/screenshot02.png
Oct 16 13:29:56 <zaheerm> Khertan, it has been many hours since it was last on a charger
Oct 16 13:30:13 <Khertan> zaheerm: hum ... mine drain battery very fast
Oct 16 13:30:21 <Khertan> still don't know why
Oct 16 13:30:25 <zaheerm> yah it does drain battery fast if you use it :)
Oct 16 13:30:36 <Khertan> yep ... maybe the problem i use it :)
Oct 16 13:31:24 <Khertan> look at the load applet icon
Oct 16 13:31:31 <Khertan> i can say : i use it :)
Oct 16 13:32:22 <mgedmin> also, on n810 the battery indicator was like this: 100% ... 100% ... 100% ... 100% ... 100% ... 100% ... 80% 50% 20% 10% dead!
Oct 16 13:32:52 <mgedmin> on the n900 it's more like 100% ... 90% ... 80% ... 70% ... 60% ... 50% ... 40% ... 30% ... 20% ... 10% ... user decides to recharge without waiting for 0%
Oct 16 13:34:06 <mgedmin> ooh, <upgrade-description> in mud.xml
Oct 16 13:35:39 <lcuk> mgedmin, i sat for 2 hours in a cafe in amsterdam writing on liqbase - the battery low indicator even gave up on me
Oct 16 13:35:47 <lcuk> every page i thought "i best stop now"
Oct 16 13:36:00 <lcuk> but i got the whole thing I was trying to write out :)
Oct 16 13:36:14 <zaheerm> yep
Oct 16 13:36:23 <zaheerm> s/yep//
Oct 16 13:36:23 <infobot> zaheerm meant:
Oct 16 13:36:27 <AchipA> also, keep in mind what charger you're using. The 1200mA charger in the box charges fairly quickly, USB charging is slooow and with a 350mA BT headphone charger I'm still actually losing battery power :)
Oct 16 13:37:02 <lcuk> AchipA, that might explain why my battery died even tho plugged in
Oct 16 13:37:11 <lcuk> i was running the device kinda hot for a few hours
Oct 16 13:37:16 <mgedmin> the usb charger can charge my n900 in under 4 hours
Oct 16 13:37:25 <mgedmin> what's the time limit for the 1.2A megacharger?
Oct 16 13:37:37 <mgedmin> 2 hours? one and a half?
Oct 16 13:37:38 <lcuk> i suppose different computers have different ratings and it will depend what you are doing at the time
Oct 16 13:37:58 <mgedmin> isn't usb limited to 500 mA or something like that?
Oct 16 13:38:15 <SpeedEvil> USB standard excepting chargers - yes.
Oct 16 13:38:18 <mgedmin> either that, or supposed to supply at least 500 mA
Oct 16 13:38:28 <Khertan> mgedmin: true
Oct 16 13:38:35 <SpeedEvil> There are other standards that relate to chargers and devices that can provide other than 500mA over the same connector.
Oct 16 13:39:02 <SpeedEvil> For example - short the data pins together, is one way of telling the device that you're a charger
Oct 16 13:39:18 <SpeedEvil> and then the - relatively recent - addition to the spec for chargers applies.
Oct 16 13:39:26 <Khertan> mgedmin: not on some apple macbooks
Oct 16 13:39:42 <SpeedEvil> Also.
Oct 16 13:39:50 <lardman> re
Oct 16 13:39:52 <SpeedEvil> Very few USB ports actually limit at 500mA
Oct 16 13:40:01 <Khertan> mgedmin: some apple macbooks can deliver 1000mA
Oct 16 13:40:10 <Khertan> SpeedEvil:  Really ?
Oct 16 13:40:22 <SpeedEvil> There will often be one polyfuse at 2A - say - shared over 4 ports.
Oct 16 13:40:36 <SpeedEvil> So you can draw 2.5A for a couple of minutes
Oct 16 13:40:38 <Khertan> SpeedEvil: all my pc wasn't able to deliver more than 500mA over usb
Oct 16 13:40:53 <SpeedEvil> Khertan: measured how?
Oct 16 13:41:00 <zash> Khertan: for external optical drives rigt?
Oct 16 13:41:25 <ArSa> george foreman usb iGrill!
Oct 16 13:41:30 <Khertan> SpeedEvil: measure by two scanner using 500mA on usb
Oct 16 13:41:31 <Khertan> :)
Oct 16 13:41:42 <wazd_> well, that's a fuck up, but whatever
Oct 16 13:41:44 <SpeedEvil> Khertan: it varies dramatically, yes.
Oct 16 13:41:53 <Khertan> if i plug one ... i can't use the second
Oct 16 13:41:53 <SpeedEvil> Khertan: and that's probably a seperate issue
Oct 16 13:42:08 <Khertan> SpeedEvil: maybe ...
Oct 16 13:42:31 <SpeedEvil> Khertan: The USB stack adds up the current in use by the declared devices, and will not enable ones that use more than a total of 500mA
Oct 16 13:43:01 <ArSa> the real usb grill http://xe.bz/aho/24/image/0608152132_009.jpg
Oct 16 13:43:01 <SpeedEvil> There is nothing that typically actually measures it in most PCs.
Oct 16 13:43:02 <AchipA> lcuk: I actually got it charged in little over an hour when turned off with the boxy charger...
Oct 16 13:43:05 <SpeedEvil> As that's expensive.
Oct 16 13:43:05 <fiferboy> mgedmin: When you had the gprs-mon label cut off, were the icons screwed up at the same time?
Oct 16 13:43:37 <lcuk> AchipA, cool
Oct 16 13:43:47 <mgedmin> fiferboy: yes
Oct 16 13:44:03 <fiferboy> mgedmin: Ah.  So the label probably doesn't cut off when the icons are correct.  Could you remove and then add it to see?
Oct 16 13:44:04 <AchipA> usb devices should, in theory, report how many 'units' of power they use (a unit is 100mW in USB2 IIRC)
Oct 16 13:44:18 <SpeedEvil> mA
Oct 16 13:44:32 <AchipA> yes
Oct 16 13:44:37 <SpeedEvil> (500mW@5V)
Oct 16 13:44:51 <mgedmin> fiferboy: you're right, it looks all nice and pretty now
Oct 16 13:44:57 <AchipA> slipped, sorry :)
Oct 16 13:44:58 * RST38h suggests a USB-powered electric iChair for hamsters
Oct 16 13:44:59 <fiferboy> whew
Oct 16 13:45:07 <RST38h> ehlo fiferboy
Oct 16 13:45:14 <fiferboy> I really have to get the icon cache thing rigured out...
Oct 16 13:45:16 <fiferboy> hey RST38h
Oct 16 13:45:25 * mgedmin wonders if it 123<sup>.456</sup> would look better than the current 123.<sup>456</sup>
Oct 16 13:45:30 <RST38h> fiferboy: icon cache thing is slightly broken in current Maemo5
Oct 16 13:45:33 <mgedmin> you're not the only one
Oct 16 13:45:36 <AchipA> the USB port itself is not limiting the power to this exact amount, it's just for bookkeeping. It should, however, disable unused ports if this amount is reached.
Oct 16 13:45:38 <mgedmin> it works for some apps, fails on other
Oct 16 13:45:41 * SpeedEvil sighs and wishes the USB standard supported 'high power' hubs at 30V. That would have killed 99% of random chargers on the desktop.
Oct 16 13:45:48 <RST38h> mgedmin: you are spewing html at us =)
Oct 16 13:45:51 <fiferboy> mgedmin: I can try it :)
Oct 16 13:46:15 <RST38h> fiferboy,mgedmin: folks if you install, update the icon cache, and still do not see the icons, it is ok, not your fault afaik
Oct 16 13:46:25 <fiferboy> RST38h: My problem with icon cache is that it gets executed in postinst, but the desktop widget gets automatically added before that
Oct 16 13:46:25 <mgedmin> some old-school texts had the decimal point centered rather than on the baseline
Oct 16 13:46:38 <RST38h> fiferboy: Oh.
Oct 16 13:46:39 <Corsac> hmhm, can I watch a thread in talk?
Oct 16 13:46:50 <mgedmin> mhm
Oct 16 13:46:50 <Corsac> (like, being mailed on replis)
Oct 16 13:46:52 <Corsac> replies*
Oct 16 13:46:57 <AchipA> SpeedEvil: but it does, you have powered usb :)
Oct 16 13:47:00 <fiferboy> RST38h: The icons are there, icon cache is working.
Oct 16 13:47:17 <RST38h> fiferboy: Can youexplicitley check if the icons are the there and if not, check in 5 minutes?
Oct 16 13:47:33 <fiferboy> RST38h: That sounds like a good workaround
Oct 16 13:47:41 <fiferboy> Or at least, a workable one :)
Oct 16 13:47:45 <SamPieter> hello, I'd like to make screenshots on my N810. there must be an app for that, I'm sure I read about it somewhere, but I cannot find it. Who knows the name of the app?
Oct 16 13:47:55 <SpeedEvil> AchipA: I mean - if devices could negotiate for 30V vcc - at 0.5A - and get it if they were plugged into a high power hub. So you'd lose 99% of the power bricks. But...
Oct 16 13:48:42 <mgedmin> Jaffa: help!  packages/vim.pkg/mud.xml says <version>7.2-0maemo5</version> but mud build vim produces upload/vim_7.2-0maemo1.dsc
Oct 16 13:48:44 <lcuk> fiferboy, how would your app know that the theme (and hence icons) have changed
Oct 16 13:48:51 <lcuk> does osso/hildon raise an event..
Oct 16 13:49:05 <RST38h> fiferboy: it is a hack of course, but should work
Oct 16 13:49:06 <AchipA> SpeedEvil: negotiating voltage is scary business :) lot of potential for damage
Oct 16 13:49:13 <SpeedEvil> AchipA: yeah.
Oct 16 13:49:13 <fiferboy> lcuk: No.  But when I add the icons the first time I can find out if it was successful.
Oct 16 13:49:14 <mgedmin> Jaffa: also, what's the diff between packages/vim.xml and packages/vim.pkg/mud.xml?
Oct 16 13:49:30 <fiferboy> lcuk: If it didn't find the icon then, I can put in a timer and try again later
Oct 16 13:49:31 <mgedmin> ah, one is unversioned
Oct 16 13:49:32 <RST38h> fiferboy: Also, I somehow suspect that there is a way to load the icon ignoring the cache
Oct 16 13:49:47 <RST38h> Maybe some setting passed to some function, no?
Oct 16 13:49:53 <fiferboy> RST38h: There is.
Oct 16 13:49:54 <mgedmin> that'll teach me to use old svn checkouts without checking svn status
Oct 16 13:50:08 <fiferboy> Using the icon cache is the easiest, but there are other ways
Oct 16 13:50:33 <RST38h> fiferboy: then if(cache_fails) { use_the_hairy_way; }
Oct 16 13:50:50 <fiferboy> RST38h: That's probably the way I will go.
Oct 16 13:51:02 <mgedmin> how do other, working, widgets do it?
Oct 16 13:51:08 <mgedmin> do they not use the icon cache?
Oct 16 13:51:23 <fiferboy> The frustrating part is, after I remove the icons and update the cache - I can't replicate the problem!
Oct 16 13:51:32 <Jaffa> mgedmin: packages/vim.xml should've been deleted :-). MUD used to have icons, patches and xml separate. Now they're grouped under the .pkg dir
Oct 16 13:51:46 <fiferboy> mgedmin: Maybe not, I don't know for sure
Oct 16 13:52:04 <mgedmin> Jaffa: <deb optify="1"> should do what, exactly, to debian/rules?  I see nothing about /opt or maemo-optify there
Oct 16 13:52:19 <lardman> hmm, trying to see who to ask for addressbook details, I looked at who the bug tracker would assign such bugs to and the answer is: nobody@maemo.org
Oct 16 13:53:01 <Jaffa> mgedmin: It'll stick maemo-optify in at the end of debian/rules
Oct 16 13:53:05 <fiferboy> Looks like gtk_icon_theme_has_icon is the way to go
Oct 16 13:53:24 <mgedmin> well, it didn't
Oct 16 13:53:30 <mgedmin> also I don't have maemo-optify in my sbox
Oct 16 13:53:34 <mgedmin> and apt-cache search doesn't find it
Oct 16 13:53:38 * mgedmin a bit lost
Oct 16 13:54:38 <Jaffa> mgedmin: You may need apt-get install sharutils maemo-optify and a few other things
Oct 16 13:55:05 <Jaffa> mgedmin: apt-get update and then apt-cache search?
Oct 16 13:55:17 <mgedmin> which repo contains maemo-optify?
Oct 16 13:55:19 <Jaffa> mgedmin: It's in extras-devel IIRC, so you'll need to ensure your sbox has that in /etc/apt/...
Oct 16 13:55:37 <Jaffa> http://maemo.org/packages/view/maemo-optify/
Oct 16 13:56:04 * mgedmin adds extras-devel to apt sources
Oct 16 13:56:30 <Stskeeps> wazd_: forum.nokia is a seperate store than nokia store btw
Oct 16 13:57:26 <RST38h> wazd: Got Quim's email?
Oct 16 13:57:34 <mgedmin> are we supposed to apply for "free company account" ?
Oct 16 13:57:43 * RST38h had to change his address from .RU to .US real quick
Oct 16 13:57:47 <RST38h> mgedmin: Yes
Oct 16 13:57:51 <wazd_> RST38h: yep
Oct 16 13:57:57 <Stskeeps> wazd_: when i get my payout i would probably drop in 50 eur or something into the pool to get you a n900.
Oct 16 13:58:03 <RST38h> wazd: Chances are you will get it first :)
Oct 16 13:58:15 <mgedmin> ha ha office phone field is required
Oct 16 13:58:27 <RST38h> mgedmin: Cell phone number will suffice
Oct 16 13:58:35 <RST38h> And call yourself a president or something
Oct 16 13:58:39 <wazd_> mgedmin: most of red marked fields are not required actually
Oct 16 13:59:02 <wazd_> mgedmin: that's a joke)
Oct 16 13:59:02 <RST38h> wazd: Wrong. The evil robot (tm) even requires both City and Province fields
Oct 16 13:59:18 <jeremiah> mgedmin: Call yourself CORPORATE OVERLORD
Oct 16 13:59:33 <wazd_> Stskeeps: I can't get it anyway so keep your cash for yourself :)
Oct 16 13:59:43 <RST38h> wazd: Why can't you get it?
Oct 16 13:59:44 <mgedmin> ha ha ha: the company name (which is an empty field) is already in use
Oct 16 13:59:45 <Stskeeps> wazd_: hm, would surprise me if you can't
Oct 16 13:59:51 <Stskeeps> wazd_: since it's forum.nokia.com e-store
Oct 16 14:00:23 <jeremiah> N900 Shipping End of October, US $649.00
Oct 16 14:00:29 <jeremiah> http://store.nokia.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/productdetail_10500_10101_-1_10000367
Oct 16 14:00:59 <VDVsx> Stskeeps, I'm in too ;)
Oct 16 14:01:14 <Stskeeps> wazd_: which is very different from nokia store
Oct 16 14:01:17 <johnsq> Hi
Oct 16 14:01:54 <wazd_> Stskeeps: where can I check it's details?
Oct 16 14:02:33 <Stskeeps> wazd_: same place you sign up for an account? :P
Oct 16 14:02:40 <wazd_> Stskeeps: cause I asked manager at the Nokia Store in Moscow and he told me that ynfortunately they're not participating in DDP
Oct 16 14:03:01 <RST38h> wazd: Listen, there are ways around all this stuff.
Oct 16 14:03:02 <Stskeeps> wazd_: yes, i know - but this is forum nokia
Oct 16 14:03:11 <Stskeeps> for professionals/community developers now too
Oct 16 14:03:47 <Stskeeps> seperate store / delivery system
Oct 16 14:03:49 <RST38h> wazd: Screw the Nokia Store. It is a Forum Nokia eStore. If it does not ship to Russia, you can ship to any of the countries where maemo.org devs live and one of them will pass your N900 to Moscow with whoever is traveling here
Oct 16 14:04:14 <RST38h> wazd: Yes, it may not be instant. But it will get here.
Oct 16 14:05:07 <AchipA> exactly, I have forfeited my Serbian address for a Hungarian one for this purpose
Oct 16 14:07:18 <mgedmin> the good: Forum Nokia eStore has Lithuania in the country dropdown for shipping address
Oct 16 14:07:24 <RST38h> wazd: Of course, I would suggest the US (cheaper price + you get all four arrows :))
Oct 16 14:07:44 <RST38h> mgedmin: Do you know anyone regularly traveling to .RU?
Oct 16 14:07:50 <wazd_> call me stupid but I can't find that store :D
Oct 16 14:07:53 <mgedmin> the bad: I cannot test whether they will actually ship anything without ordering something
Oct 16 14:08:12 <woglinde> mgedim shure?
Oct 16 14:08:16 <mgedmin> RST38h: Russian Federation is also in that dropdown
Oct 16 14:08:20 <RST38h> wazd: When you register for the corporate account, at the bottom of the corporate forum nokia page, there is a list of devices and services
Oct 16 14:08:22 <woglinde> cant you cancel it in the last step?
Oct 16 14:08:29 <RST38h> mgedmin: Then it will work for wazd
Oct 16 14:08:41 <RST38h> wazd: The only device on the list is N75 right now
Oct 16 14:09:02 <mgedmin> woglinde: I'm not going to enter my credit card number and risk accidentally buying a N75 just to test that
Oct 16 14:09:12 <woglinde> mgedim *g*
Oct 16 14:09:49 <RST38h> mgedmin: The only possible problem is the taxes though
Oct 16 14:09:53 <AchipA> wazd_: Premium services -> eStore
Oct 16 14:09:54 <mgedmin> if, for the purposes of scientific curiosity, you would be so kind as to provide me with a valid credit card number and billing address, I might go ahead and do the test
Oct 16 14:10:08 * RST38h not curious =)
Oct 16 14:10:22 <mgedmin> RST38h: yeah, I wouldn't be surprised if the customs demands extra $$$ for letting you have it
Oct 16 14:10:43 <wazd_> AchipA: oh, thanks :)
Oct 16 14:11:17 <woglinde> mgedmin lol that was a cheap pishing try
Oct 16 14:11:33 <mgedmin> sir, you would me by your lack of trust!
Oct 16 14:11:44 <mgedmin> I'm risking my reputation here, you know
Oct 16 14:11:45 <mgedmin> ~karma
Oct 16 14:11:45 <infobot> mgedmin has karma of 1
Oct 16 14:11:52 <mgedmin> see, I clearly can be trusted
Oct 16 14:11:55 <woglinde> lol
Oct 16 14:12:51 <RST38h> FCC issued a call for public comments on a study (PDF) done by Harvard's Berkman Center for Internet and Society about whether the US should require the telephone and cable companies to open their networks to competitors so that independent ISPs could begin offering broadband
Oct 16 14:13:24 <Stskeeps> RST38h: i always wondered why they would have to let independent isps in on their owned lines..
Oct 16 14:13:28 * RST38h wonders if Obama does get shot at the end, for making such plans
Oct 16 14:13:56 <RST38h> Sts: You now know why. I just don't think the same will ever happen with cable or wireless
Oct 16 14:16:10 * Khertan don't know what to think about developper programs ...
Oct 16 14:17:10 <Khertan> it s amazing great from Nokia to offer discounted device
Oct 16 14:17:14 <RST38h> Khertan: ?
Oct 16 14:17:15 <mgedmin> vim: optified 9 entries, saving about 17519 kB.
Oct 16 14:17:24 <Khertan> but there is so many people whinning
Oct 16 14:17:31 <RST38h> vim is taking 17+ MB? Horrible
Oct 16 14:17:33 <mgedmin> people like whining
Oct 16 14:17:41 <RST38h> Nano takes <2MB
Oct 16 14:18:01 <Khertan> whining ... i'm not sure this help nokia ... really
Oct 16 14:18:02 <derf> vim has a few more features.
Oct 16 14:18:04 <mgedmin> vim is a full-featured editor rich with features, unlike nano
Oct 16 14:18:21 <Khertan> mgedmin: vim isn't an editor
Oct 16 14:18:23 <RST38h> Khertan: People always whine, disregard
Oct 16 14:18:31 <mgedmin> those 20 megs are mostly vim plugin files adding support for various formats, syntax rules, etc
Oct 16 14:18:32 <Stskeeps> Khertan: i am willing to bet qgil is sitting and grinning at how silly those people are, at a cafe with a beer, reading the thread on his n900 ;p
Oct 16 14:18:38 <AchipA> :)
Oct 16 14:18:51 <RST38h> mgedmin: nano does what I want. vim requires me to switch between navigation and entry modes.
Oct 16 14:19:03 <Khertan> Stskeeps: i hope it take a beer or relaxing when reading this thread
Oct 16 14:19:06 <RST38h> Result: nano stays, vim goes
Oct 16 14:19:09 <AchipA> Khertan: you had the same talk the other way round, when the EUR/USD rate cut Eur folks
Oct 16 14:19:37 <Khertan> AchipA: yep ... but here it s an other talk ...
Oct 16 14:19:39 <kirma> RST38h: I actually think finnish laws have been requiring comparable stuff for years
Oct 16 14:19:43 * RST38h suggsets we troll that thread by exchanging cryptic messages in it
Oct 16 14:19:49 <Khertan> lol ...
Oct 16 14:19:55 <Khertan> it could be funny
Oct 16 14:19:59 <RST38h> No, seriously, let us drive 'em mad
Oct 16 14:20:29 <mgedmin> replacing a directory (/usr/share/vim) with a symlink is not going to work very well, will it?
Oct 16 14:20:29 <kirma> renting cables for affordable price between operators and also providing ATM-level services on the same cabling for third parties
Oct 16 14:20:35 <RST38h> kirma: Depends on which kind of services the cable owners are supposed to be allowing
Oct 16 14:20:40 <derf> RST38h: You can use arrow keys in insert mode in vim.
Oct 16 14:20:40 <Jaffa> mgedmin: See the thread on -developers :)
Oct 16 14:20:51 <Jaffa> mgedmin: It works unless there's already a package installed
Oct 16 14:20:52 <Stskeeps> RST38h: and quim saying 'Act decently' isn't cryptic enough? ;p
Oct 16 14:21:00 <RST38h> kirma: Ah, yea, phone companies in the US have done it for years, but cable is different
Oct 16 14:21:06 <Khertan> 	 the hunter is in the pool
Oct 16 14:21:13 <kirma> to my knowledge, it isn't hugely popular, but it prevents absolute service provider lock-in
Oct 16 14:21:19 <derf> But that's a ridiculously slow way to navigate.
Oct 16 14:21:20 <lardman> has anyone got a photo with a geotag?
Oct 16 14:21:20 <RST38h> derf: I do not want insert mode, just want one mode
Oct 16 14:21:33 <Khertan> lardman: yep ... one at maemo summit
Oct 16 14:21:35 <Khertan> :)
Oct 16 14:21:43 <lardman> do they get gps location stamps?
Oct 16 14:21:51 <kirma> I think especially the ATM (or however it was defined) part is not really used on consumer market in any mentionable way
Oct 16 14:21:53 <lardman> I probably disabled geotagging to avoid paying roaming
Oct 16 14:21:56 <Jaffa> mgedmin: Given vim for fremantle is only in extras-devel, anyone who has installed it already will just have to uninstall. But this one'll be ready for promotion to extras-testing
Oct 16 14:22:05 <RST38h> Sts: The question is, does exchanging cryptic messages qualify as indecency?
Oct 16 14:22:07 <mgedmin> Jaffa: breaking upgrades is extremely rude, so I wouldn't submit a patch to mud-builder adding optification if it did
Oct 16 14:22:11 <derf> RST38h: I'm just saying, press i in vim and you've got nano.
Oct 16 14:22:13 <mgedmin> hey, cool, my upgrade didn't break
Oct 16 14:22:24 <RST38h> derf: I can get nano without pressing i :)
Oct 16 14:22:26 <mgedmin> Jaffa: expect patch in email in 5 minutes
Oct 16 14:22:29 <AchipA> lardman: ? geotagging should not generate traffic...
Oct 16 14:22:31 <Khertan> lardman: what do you mean by gps location "stamp"
Oct 16 14:22:34 <mgedmin> and I've got 5 megs free in /
Oct 16 14:22:35 <RST38h> derf: In about 10% of space too
Oct 16 14:22:38 <mgedmin> ONLY FIVD MEGS?
Oct 16 14:22:44 <mgedmin> darn ubifs compression
Oct 16 14:22:45 <lardman> AchipA: it turns on the gps which requires a connection
Oct 16 14:22:51 <Jaffa> mgedmin: ta muchly
Oct 16 14:22:53 <derf> No real vim user would _want_ nano.
Oct 16 14:22:56 <RST38h> derf: The truly horrible stuff is that you can even do syntax highlighting in nano now
Oct 16 14:22:59 <Khertan> AchipA: when using agps it use traffics
Oct 16 14:23:01 <lardman> Khertan: does the exif data contain a lat/long?
Oct 16 14:23:06 <RST38h> derf: I was very surprised at that
Oct 16 14:23:14 <Khertan> lardman: ahm ... not sure
Oct 16 14:23:14 <AchipA> whoopsie...
Oct 16 14:23:21 <lardman> AchipA: yeah, not good
Oct 16 14:23:42 <Khertan> lardman: i could not answer now as i ven't anymore the photo on my device
Oct 16 14:23:45 <RST38h> derf: What do vim users do in vim, such that nano would not satisfy them?
Oct 16 14:23:46 <Jaffa> mgedmin: http://lists.maemo.org/pipermail/maemo-developers/2009-October/021419.html contains details. Suggestion is rmdir or mv in *.preinst
Oct 16 14:23:49 <kirma> RST38h: well, cable networks may be just technically trickier. still, having wires and carrying stuff on them should be separated from each other in my opinion, to enforce infrastructural efficiency
Oct 16 14:23:53 <Jaffa> RST38h: Syntax highlighting?
Oct 16 14:23:59 <lardman> Khertan: np, will go outside and test :)
Oct 16 14:24:00 <RST38h> Jaffa: yea
Oct 16 14:24:03 <Khertan> lardman: but i ll try to take an other one with n900 when i ll be outdoor
Oct 16 14:24:14 <mgedmin> Jaffa: any chance for commit rights for mud-builder's svn?
Oct 16 14:24:14 <Khertan> lardman: yep ... i m just at work right now :)
Oct 16 14:24:22 <RST38h> kirma: Well technically cable should be able to sell channels
Oct 16 14:24:36 <Jaffa> mgedmin: yup - hang on.
Oct 16 14:24:41 <kirma> if companies that installed and own the cables operate their businesses in matter that benefits both them and the consumers, the forcibly-rentable feature of the media turns irrelevant
Oct 16 14:24:43 <RST38h> kirma: Which is kinda similar to selling bandwidth over traditional phone company trunks
Oct 16 14:24:48 * mgedmin 's finger is hovering over the enter key
Oct 16 14:25:29 <mgedmin> this is perhaps not the best channel for an editor flame war
Oct 16 14:25:40 <Jaffa> mgedmin: Done
Oct 16 14:26:01 <Khertan> RST38h: http://talk.maemo.org/showpost.php?p=348430&postcount=67
Oct 16 14:26:06 <Jaffa> mgedmin: https://garage.maemo.org/project/memberlist.php?group_id=63 :-)
Oct 16 14:26:32 <Khertan> mgedmin: yeah ... as PyGTKEditor rules them all !
Oct 16 14:26:45 <mgedmin> Jaffa: any known delays for that? since I'm getting 403 Forbidden when I try svn commit
Oct 16 14:26:46 <Khertan> (except in fremantle)
Oct 16 14:27:12 <kirma> operator might have exclusivity contract with a county that is really to minimize digging from perspective of the county... but the operator is leveraging the cable monopoly to extend monopoly to other sectors and get extra money by artificial scarity
Oct 16 14:27:51 <kirma> in my opinion, it makes a lot of sense to prevent that from happening.
Oct 16 14:28:05 <Jaffa> mgedmin: I guess there might be a delay between changing gforge group permissions and it syncing to svn
Oct 16 14:28:09 <lardman> Khertan: yep, it looks like it's probably in the exif data
Oct 16 14:28:14 <Jaffa> mgedmin: ferenc would know
Oct 16 14:28:15 <mgedmin> I'll wait a bit then
Oct 16 14:28:20 <kirma> the cabling itself *can* be an investment, it just have to be valued according to what's valuable for those that want to transfer data or whatever on it.
Oct 16 14:28:28 <Khertan> lardman: great so it s respect standard
Oct 16 14:28:56 <tbf|afk> lardman: you have mail.
Oct 16 14:28:57 * mgedmin wishes garage allowed subversion over ssh
Oct 16 14:29:09 <jeremiah> Jaffa: Can you add me to mud?
Oct 16 14:29:17 <tbf|afk> mgedmin: more important would be git over ssh
Oct 16 14:29:20 <jeremiah> I suppose I should join.
Oct 16 14:29:25 <mgedmin> oh yes
Oct 16 14:30:17 <Khertan> so now ... a technical gtk/hildon question : A gtksourceview.View subclass gtk.TextView and not hildon.TextView, so when i put a gtksourceview.View in an hildon.PannableArea scrolling and selecting text works at the same times ... should i fork gtksourceview for hildonsourceview (which means installing scratchbox, sdk, ...)
Oct 16 14:30:40 <Khertan> mgedmin: +1 for git over ssh
Oct 16 14:30:46 <tbf|afk> Khertan: for theming?
Oct 16 14:31:06 <tbf|afk> Khertan: could be enough to call gtk_widget_set_name() with proper arguments for theming
Oct 16 14:31:22 <Khertan> hum  ...
Oct 16 14:31:28 <mgedmin> for not handling mouse events could be enough to install signal handlers
Oct 16 14:31:55 <kirma> authorities would probably deny right to build a highway either if the company that would want to build it would allow people drive it only if they're going to disneyland, when it could be used as part of the general-purpose infrastructure. still, public-private deals on US broadband seem to be full of such absurdly sad deals...
Oct 16 14:31:58 <Khertan> the problem is selecting text and scrolling at the same time
Oct 16 14:32:15 <tbf|afk> Khertan: oh indeed: the widget seems to add some code
Oct 16 14:32:21 <Khertan> :)
Oct 16 14:32:28 <Khertan> the problem :)
Oct 16 14:32:35 <kirma> </rant>
Oct 16 14:32:51 * mgedmin hates passwords
Oct 16 14:33:03 <tbf|afk> Khertan: propose a hildon_helper function which attaches those signal handlers to any treeview ;-)
Oct 16 14:33:11 <tbf|afk> Khertan: maybe it gets accepted
Oct 16 14:33:19 <Khertan> hildon_helper
Oct 16 14:33:20 <tbf|afk> *textview
Oct 16 14:33:35 <Khertan> hum ...
Oct 16 14:33:39 <Khertan> i should take a look
Oct 16 14:33:47 <tbf|afk> Khertan: or hildon_gtk_text_view_* if you prefer
Oct 16 14:33:52 <tbf|afk> Khertan: but you get the idea
Oct 16 14:35:02 <Khertan> hum ...
Oct 16 14:35:21 <Jaffa> jeremiah: garage being slow
Oct 16 14:35:45 <jeremiah> Indeed
Oct 16 14:35:51 <Jaffa> mgedmin: jeremiah: help with docs (and moving to design at http://wiki.maemo.org/User:Jaffa/mud_design) very welcome :)
Oct 16 14:36:00 <jeremiah> Jaffa: I am trying to surf svn and it is like molasses
Oct 16 14:36:22 <Jaffa> surfing molasses? wouldn't have thought you could get a decent wavefront... too sticky.
Oct 16 14:36:23 <jeremiah> Jaffa: A bit of a todo for me already? =]
Oct 16 14:36:27 <Khertan> tbf|afk: i didn't see any hildon_helper related with textview in pygtk hildon binding :(
Oct 16 14:36:33 <jeremiah> Jaffa: Damn you are good at delegating!
Oct 16 14:36:36 <Jaffa> jeremiah: Yeah, or I'll get ya ;-)
Oct 16 14:36:54 * Jaffa has been known to promise ice cream to team members if they beat a deadline ;-)
Oct 16 14:37:02 <jeremiah> Ice cream!
Oct 16 14:37:11 * jeremiah runs to the wiki
Oct 16 14:38:09 * mgedmin suggests 'mud create --debian pkgname --version lenny' instead of 'mud create http://packages.debian.org/source/lenny/cal'
Oct 16 14:38:14 <jeremiah> Jeez. Mud is pretty sophisticated
Oct 16 14:38:16 <mgedmin> long urls are hard to remember
Oct 16 14:38:24 <Jaffa> jeremiah: Ideally, mud'd be in extras itself. If only I knew someone who liked packaging perl...
Oct 16 14:38:27 <RST38h> Khertan: http://talk.maemo.org/showpost.php?p=348456&postcount=66
Oct 16 14:38:34 <jeremiah> Jaffa: Is there watch file support and uupdate?
Oct 16 14:38:46 <Jaffa> mgedmin: Yeah, p'raps. Thought was also to take Ubuntu URLs too, tho'
Oct 16 14:38:57 <RST38h> Jaffa: Cheap. Offer money! =)
Oct 16 14:38:58 <Jaffa> jeremiah: no
Oct 16 14:39:08 <mgedmin> Jaffa: mud create --ubuntu --version karmic pkgname
Oct 16 14:39:13 <Jaffa> mgedmin: That'd work ;-)
Oct 16 14:39:50 <RST38h> Meanwhile: http://www.theregister.co.uk/2009/10/16/boffins_program_fly_brains/  (does that mean that any opaque hat will do?)
Oct 16 14:40:06 <Robot101> lcuk: what does lardman want?
Oct 16 14:40:22 <lcuk> Robot101, a live updating list of contacts
Oct 16 14:40:33 <lcuk> in his gtk app he wants to show the list of contacts who are online now
Oct 16 14:40:41 <Khertan> RST38h: yeah funny
Oct 16 14:40:52 <lcuk> Robot101, like the list here in irc >>>
Oct 16 14:41:20 <Khertan> RST38h: this amazing feature only available in loaner device !
Oct 16 14:41:42 <Robot101> lcuk: IM contacts specifically, or address book contacts w/ presence?
Oct 16 14:41:55 <RST38h> Khertan: My cat is still scratching from it
Oct 16 14:42:08 <Jaffa> jeremiah: Added.
Oct 16 14:42:11 <lcuk> second i think - but arent they one and the same?
Oct 16 14:42:26 <Jaffa> lcuk: depends on what level you look
Oct 16 14:42:37 <Jaffa> Robot101: Requirement is for any contact who has a current online presence
Oct 16 14:42:42 <RST38h> lcuk: Join in: http://talk.maemo.org/showpost.php?p=348456
Oct 16 14:42:52 <jeremiah> Thanks Jaffa!
Oct 16 14:42:57 <lcuk> my computer is goin slower than a slow thing atm
Oct 16 14:43:01 * jeremiah checks out from svn
Oct 16 14:43:06 <lcuk> im installing qt stuff and trying to do something else
Oct 16 14:43:12 * SpeedEvil greases lcuks computer with bacon.
Oct 16 14:43:13 * RST38h moos at pupnik
Oct 16 14:43:24 * mgedmin suggests an electric shock
Oct 16 14:43:30 * jeremiah rubs lard on lcuk's screen
Oct 16 14:43:38 <RST38h> does bacon grease conduct electricity?
Oct 16 14:44:01 <jeremiah> Depends on how much electricty we're talking about
Oct 16 14:44:13 <Solarion> I suspect that may depend on how much power you're trying to put through it
Oct 16 14:44:15 <lcuk> SpeedEvil, my screen is natively constructed on a layer of bacon fat
Oct 16 14:44:44 <lcuk> it does not conduct electricity, but merely glows with amazing vibrance and speed
Oct 16 14:45:09 <pupnik_> does q3a work for anyone here?  complains about missing default.conf
Oct 16 14:45:28 <pupnik_> also dosbox seems like a bit of a dog
Oct 16 14:45:47 <Robot101> Jaffa, lcuk: you can do it at two levels - tp-glib has TpContact objects which represent each contact on each IM account, so you can get the contact list "subscribe" channel (ie your contact list for that connection) then get TpContact objects for each of them, see who is online and put them in the list model etc
Oct 16 14:46:11 <lcuk> how do you then detect new presence
Oct 16 14:46:19 <lcuk> does it need recursing every frame?
Oct 16 14:46:22 <lcuk> or does it raise an event
Oct 16 14:46:41 <Robot101> you get signals off the TpContact when presence changes
Oct 16 14:46:56 <mgedmin> pupnik_: you need data files from somewhere (your original quake 3 cd, e.g.)
Oct 16 14:47:01 <lcuk> sounds like what lardman|gone lardman will need :)
Oct 16 14:47:32 <lcuk> thanks Robot101 when he returns im sure he will ask, is there a page with a bit more info for him?
Oct 16 14:48:03 <pupnik_> k it belongs to the mapset
Oct 16 14:48:05 <zerojayN900> robot101: the msn plugins have been broken for me since firmware 41-10. any ideas?
Oct 16 14:48:08 <pupnik_> i get it ty
Oct 16 14:48:41 <pupnik_> tpcontact - interesting :)
Oct 16 14:48:41 <lcuk> RST38h, which part should i join in with on the gracious device program
Oct 16 14:49:13 <pupnik_> i am using maemo5 contacts to monitor freenode PMs atm
Oct 16 14:49:36 <pupnik_> works well but you need to msg pupnik and not _pupnik
Oct 16 14:49:56 <Robot101> lcuk: http://telepathy.freedesktop.org/wiki/Telepathy GLib
Oct 16 14:50:19 <Robot101> zerojayN900: they broke the ABI of the accounts dialog plugins, its super-lame
Oct 16 14:50:22 <Khertan> zerojayN900: works for me
Oct 16 14:50:24 <pupnik_> so since the agent doesnt enter any irc channels, it isnt so useful
Oct 16 14:50:33 <Robot101> zerojayN900: we have a bug on it in the internal tracker I think
Oct 16 14:50:59 <Robot101> probably just needs a rebuild, might've happened already
Oct 16 14:51:01 <zerojayN900> ok, cool.
Oct 16 14:51:10 <lcuk> "internal tracker == a piece of paper in a filing cabinet down in the cellar" ;) :D
Oct 16 14:51:28 <zerojayN900> msn's pretty essential for me... heh.
Oct 16 14:51:30 <zaheerm> Robot101, is there an account dialog for facebook chat anywhere?
Oct 16 14:51:56 <lcuk> RST38h, why is the hunter in the pool
Oct 16 14:52:07 <Khertan> RST38h: successfull !!! http://talk.maemo.org/showpost.php?p=348473&postcount=71 <---
Oct 16 14:52:07 <mgedmin> hm, I cannot merge 'my information' with a vcard containing my phone number
Oct 16 14:52:10 <lcuk> or rather, Khertan
Oct 16 14:52:19 <zerojayN900> i sent them my fb chat stuff a while ago. i was told they were working on it.
Oct 16 14:52:24 <Robot101> lcuk: nah, it's tagged for the next release
Oct 16 14:52:32 <lcuk> heh
Oct 16 14:52:35 <Khertan> lcuk: haha
Oct 16 14:52:37 <mgedmin> evil evil troll
Oct 16 14:53:01 <zaheerm> zerojayN900, cool
Oct 16 14:53:10 <Robot101> zaheerm: when you install the pidgin plugin, theoretically it will appear and work with the haze accounts plugin
Oct 16 14:53:31 <Robot101> however, there's an annoying bug which means if you remove the static list of protocols, the accounts UI crashes
Oct 16 14:53:37 <Robot101> so we need a new tp-glib version to fix that
Oct 16 14:53:47 <Khertan> [16:19]  * RST38h suggsets we troll that thread by exchanging cryptic messages in it
Oct 16 14:53:55 <Robot101> which we should have out rsn too
Oct 16 14:54:06 <zaheerm> Robot101, it generates a static list of protocols when?
Oct 16 14:54:27 <Robot101> haze comes with a static list in a file, haze.manager
Oct 16 14:54:37 <zaheerm> ah ok
Oct 16 14:54:43 <Robot101> but the telepathy spec says that's just a cache for what the CM actually tells you, and it should be optional
Oct 16 14:54:54 <Robot101> but there's some race in the library and something is null at the wrong time and it crashes
Oct 16 14:55:00 <zaheerm> ouch
Oct 16 14:55:03 <RST38h> Khertan: Ignore the Hogwash guy let us continue
Oct 16 14:56:03 <Khertan> ;)
Oct 16 14:56:21 <Khertan> RST38h: of course !
Oct 16 14:56:23 <RST38h> Khertan: http://talk.maemo.org/showpost.php?p=348476&postcount=72
Oct 16 14:56:26 * mgedmin imagines penguinbait buying a discount device for $449 and getting a customs tax of $100 slapped on top of it
Oct 16 14:57:02 <penguinbait> I am not buying a n900 for 449 on a devloper discount
Oct 16 14:57:06 <penguinbait> I will wait for a carrier
Oct 16 14:57:09 <SpeedEvil> here it'd be 17.5+6%.
Oct 16 14:58:17 <Solarion> I do't have a choice. :(
Oct 16 14:58:29 <Solarion> Is my own fault for sucking, though.
Oct 16 14:58:40 <Stskeeps> penguinbait: set up a developer discount tradings market
Oct 16 14:58:54 <pupnik_> pupbgrp 001 browserd consuming 27% cpu while no pages being displayed
Oct 16 14:59:02 <penguinbait> I think some are just surprised at 66% discount on the 810 and a 25% discount on the 900
Oct 16 14:59:09 <Solarion> I don't get the point of a browser daemon
Oct 16 14:59:20 <range> penguinbait: Yeah, but it was around EUR 300,- in both cases ...
Oct 16 14:59:25 <mgedmin> maybe it's not the percentage but raw monetary value?
Oct 16 14:59:43 <range> penguinbait: Ummm. 25%?
Oct 16 14:59:44 <Jaffa> +1
Oct 16 14:59:44 <pupnik_> pupbgrp 002 device wont shut down claiming usb is connected to pc
Oct 16 14:59:47 <mgedmin> hm, not really
Oct 16 15:00:08 <penguinbait> no it was not 300euro for the 810
Oct 16 15:00:08 <Jaffa> penguinbait: And Nokia official price is $649. Just because you *can* get it cheaper...
Oct 16 15:00:08 <penguinbait> it was 99
Oct 16 15:00:08 <mgedmin> I've seen that! "usb is connected" NO ITS NOT STUPID
Oct 16 15:00:08 <range> I see 600,- vs 300,-
Oct 16 15:00:08 <Jaffa> penguinbait: It was 300eur *off*
Oct 16 15:00:10 <mgedmin> sudo poweroff worked
Oct 16 15:00:12 <range> in EUR.
Oct 16 15:00:25 <range> And the 810 was around 399,- in stores (in EUR)
Oct 16 15:00:50 <Jaffa> So ~399 - 300 = 99, 649 - ~300 = 300
Oct 16 15:00:52 <mgedmin> so, price += 200 eur; discount += 200 eur
Oct 16 15:01:02 <penguinbait> like I said, I'll wait for a carrier
Oct 16 15:01:12 <zaheerm> andre__, whats an SSU update?
Oct 16 15:01:14 <mgedmin> most "new mail" notifications on my n900 are spam
Oct 16 15:01:29 <pupnik_> ty mgedmin
Oct 16 15:01:37 <mgedmin> zaheerm: it's an OS update you apply from the application manager (the older non-SSU method was: backup, reflash, restore backup)
Oct 16 15:01:44 <mgedmin> I forgot what the S stands for
Oct 16 15:01:50 <andre__> seamless
Oct 16 15:01:53 <zaheerm> ah ok
Oct 16 15:01:56 <andre__> sorry
Oct 16 15:02:01 <andre__> i should learn to speak less geeky
Oct 16 15:02:06 <zaheerm> and does it keep your data intact?
Oct 16 15:02:16 <andre__> already trying to avoid "Fremantle" in favor of "maemo5"
Oct 16 15:02:19 <mgedmin> it does
Oct 16 15:02:24 <andre__> if you do a backup before
Oct 16 15:02:31 <zaheerm> :)
Oct 16 15:02:40 <SpeedEvil> freemantle?
Oct 16 15:02:44 * SpeedEvil runs from the lava.
Oct 16 15:02:51 <mgedmin> it's nice to have /home on a separate partitition
Oct 16 15:02:57 <mgedmin> reflashing won't delete your files
Oct 16 15:03:12 <mgedmin> otoh if you break something very badly in ~/.gconf or something, reflashing won't rescue you
Oct 16 15:03:13 <Jaffa> mgedmin: Especially handy for ~/.ssh :)
Oct 16 15:03:16 <zaheerm> but contacts, calendar are sytored in /home too?
Oct 16 15:03:38 <pupnik_> very nice layout of filesystem.  choice of 230 MB rootfs is puzzling to me though.
Oct 16 15:03:41 <Jaffa> mgedmin: I think gconf keys on maemo 5 are stored in /var/lib/gconf
Oct 16 15:03:50 <Stskeeps> pupnik_: NAND
Oct 16 15:03:55 <mgedmin> hm
Oct 16 15:04:03 <pupnik_> speed?  power use?
Oct 16 15:04:05 <Jaffa> pupnik_: It's what you call a "cock up" (well, not intrinsically, but only realising it'd be a problem in September...)
Oct 16 15:04:13 <mgedmin> jaffa is right
Oct 16 15:04:16 <Jaffa> pupnik_: both, IIRC. Definitely "speed"
Oct 16 15:04:34 <Jaffa> mgedmin: Makes it easy to grep :)
Oct 16 15:04:37 <mgedmin> still, I imagine you could bork ~/.profile or something like that
Oct 16 15:04:43 <pupnik_> pupbgrp 003 device does not warn of impending filesystem full situations.
Oct 16 15:04:47 <Jaffa> mgedmin: indeed
Oct 16 15:05:17 <pupnik_> pupbgrp 004 device does not give user-comprehensible error when filesystem full.
Oct 16 15:05:22 <mgedmin> who is pupbgrp?
Oct 16 15:05:46 <pupnik_> my key for auto-submitting these bugs to bugs.maemo.org
Oct 16 15:05:53 <mgedmin> cool
Oct 16 15:08:55 <zerojayN900> robot101: thanks, btw.
Oct 16 15:09:12 <RurouniJones> Right, I have just had a good meal, topped off by chocolate icecream. Now is the time to try and install the SDK for the first time
Oct 16 15:09:23 * RurouniJones prays to the god of computing
Oct 16 15:09:47 <RurouniJones> And if anyone suggests that is bill gates I'll shatter their kneecaps :p
Oct 16 15:10:40 <SpeedEvil> RMS, clearly.
Oct 16 15:10:51 <SpeedEvil> He's got the scraggly beard down.
Oct 16 15:10:52 <Myrtti> Grace Hopper
Oct 16 15:11:15 * SpeedEvil hops.
Oct 16 15:11:18 <Myrtti> do not bring RMS into this discussion
Oct 16 15:12:01 <SpeedEvil> Ada lovelace.
Oct 16 15:12:27 <Myrtti> would do.
Oct 16 15:12:58 <jeremiah> He's St. IGNUtius!
Oct 16 15:13:08 <pupnik_> pupbgrp 005 camera app UI obscures viewfinder picture (shaded dark) when adjusting exposure, white balance -- change icons to get out of way of viewfinder picture
Oct 16 15:13:18 * SpeedEvil wants an original nanosecond.
Oct 16 15:14:00 <jeremiah> This is for you Myrtti http://www.flickr.com/photos/mtlin/15936575/
Oct 16 15:14:07 <Myrtti> jeremiah: and he knows his martyrdom shit well
Oct 16 15:14:40 <Khertan> pupbgrp 006 ... need an hildonsourceview
Oct 16 15:14:55 <Khertan> :)
Oct 16 15:15:05 <Myrtti> jeremiah: all the respect I had for him died when heard reports from GCDS
Oct 16 15:15:58 <mgedmin> aren't you supposed to be dead before you can be made a saint?
Oct 16 15:16:10 <Myrtti> mgedmin: you said it, not I
Oct 16 15:16:18 <jeremiah> mgedmin: Yeah. Umm, its not that kind of a church.
Oct 16 15:16:25 <jeremiah> =]
Oct 16 15:16:27 <pupnik_> pupbgrp 006 file manager: feature request - add "share, email, bluetooth" or similar context menu entries to files?  (or is this overloading that menu)
Oct 16 15:17:22 <RurouniJones> Is it just me or woudl Quassel-IRC be a prime candidate of an app to be shoved onto the N900
Oct 16 15:17:26 <lcuk> haha jeremiah that guy with the widget question just got a bit of feature creep
Oct 16 15:17:27 <mgedmin> pupnik_: there already exists such a bug in bmo
Oct 16 15:17:56 <pupnik_> pupbgrp 007 picture viewer app: after deleting image, screen pops-up "no image available" then black screen
Oct 16 15:18:04 <pupnik_> nice :) ty mgedmin
Oct 16 15:18:04 <Jaffa> pupnik_: There's a bug open for 006
Oct 16 15:19:04 <pupnik_> have you guys been able to pair wwith n810?
Oct 16 15:19:21 <VDVsx> andre__, help ;)
Oct 16 15:19:47 <andre__> VDVsx, yes please? :)
Oct 16 15:19:59 <VDVsx> andre__, need to report a bug against bluetooth docs, what's the correct keyword ? docs ?
Oct 16 15:20:14 <andre__> we have BT docs? :-P
Oct 16 15:20:15 <andre__> URL?
Oct 16 15:20:30 <andre__> yeah, keywrod is "docs"
Oct 16 15:20:41 <VDVsx> andre__, http://wiki.maemo.org/Documentation/Maemo_5_Developer_Guide/Using_Connectivity_Components/Maemo_Connectivity#Bluetooth_DBUS_UI_dialogs
Oct 16 15:21:11 <andre__> hmm. that"s no official BT API docu, "just" the wiki. good question
Oct 16 15:21:22 <andre__> but just do
Oct 16 15:21:26 <Jaffa> pupnik_: https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=5300
Oct 16 15:21:31 <mgedmin> pupnik_: pair a n810 with a n900? yes
Oct 16 15:21:43 <mgedmin> not much to do afterwards, though
Oct 16 15:21:57 <VDVsx> andre__, affects diablo also, lol, it's an artifact that cost me around 2 hours :(
Oct 16 15:22:04 <Jaffa> andre__: That's not "just" the wiki - as the official Developer Guide home is now http://wiki.maemo.org/Documentation/Maemo_5_Developer_Guide/
Oct 16 15:22:06 <mgedmin> a n810 can browser the n900's files via bluetooth ftp, if the phase of the moon is right
Oct 16 15:22:10 <pupnik_> k ill try to figure out how to better document the pairing issue
Oct 16 15:22:23 * mgedmin wonders why his fingers insist on adding the r to the verb 'to browse'?
Oct 16 15:22:28 <andre__> Jaffa, oops :)
Oct 16 15:22:34 <pupnik_> hehe
Oct 16 15:22:37 <andre__> interesting. looks like i missed some stuff
Oct 16 15:22:44 <andre__> too much info....
Oct 16 15:22:55 <mgedmin> oh yes
Oct 16 15:23:04 <Myrtti> hm
Oct 16 15:23:12 <Myrtti> that page is supposed to have the index file...
Oct 16 15:23:20 <Myrtti> I wonder what has happened to it
Oct 16 15:23:51 <Jaffa> Myrtti: drop the '/'
Oct 16 15:23:56 <range> mgedmin: I cannot type compuserve, it always comes out as compuserver (lucky me that they don't exist anymore) :)
Oct 16 15:24:06 <Myrtti> Jaffa: ah, of course
Oct 16 15:24:10 <Myrtti> hehe
Oct 16 15:24:12 * Jaffa puts in a redirect
Oct 16 15:24:12 <mgedmin> at one point when I tried to type 'text' it came out 'test'
Oct 16 15:24:18 <mgedmin> lots of unit tests at work
Oct 16 15:24:45 <Jaffa> Myrtti: That URL should work now
Oct 16 15:24:52 <Myrtti> you haven't seen me, roight?
Oct 16 15:25:34 <Stskeeps> wow, the dead baby joke mention killed the developer program thread
Oct 16 15:25:47 <mgedmin> what dead baby joke?
Oct 16 15:25:50 <penguinbait> you just need one dead baby
Oct 16 15:26:51 <mgedmin> what's the procedure for linking talk.maemo.org with my garage account?
Oct 16 15:27:06 <mgedmin> I think I heard today here on this channel that this was possible
Oct 16 15:27:16 <Jaffa> mgedmin: http://wiki.maemo.org/Link_talk.maemo.org_account_with_maemo.org_profile
Oct 16 15:28:05 <mgedmin> I think step 1 is missing a sub-step: "Create a talk.maemo.org account if you don't already have one", right?
Oct 16 15:28:29 <Jaffa> mgedmin: Perhaps. It was written for tmo users :)
Oct 16 15:28:31 <mgedmin> ah, the linking is for purposes of karma sharing, not for having the same username + pwd
Oct 16 15:29:28 <Stskeeps> yes, trolling on tmo gets you device rebates :)
Oct 16 15:29:34 <Jaffa> mgedmin: Indeed. Single Sign-On is a while off, as is even Shared Sign-On
Oct 16 15:29:46 <Jaffa> Stskeeps: and then the ability to moan about it.
Oct 16 15:29:47 * mgedmin dreams of openid
Oct 16 15:32:12 <mgedmin> hey, who took my username on t.m.o?
Oct 16 15:32:18 <mgedmin> did I register and forget all about it?
Oct 16 15:32:55 <Jaffa> mgedmin: User id 2332, posts 21
Oct 16 15:33:05 <Jaffa> mgedmin: With your email address (b4net.lt?)
Oct 16 15:33:10 <mgedmin> Jaffa: link me one of the posts pls?
Oct 16 15:33:17 <mgedmin> oh crap I no longer have mgedmin@b4net.lt
Oct 16 15:33:34 <mgedmin> still, it's me, so I should have the password stashed somewhere
Oct 16 15:33:38 <Jaffa> mgedmin: http://talk.maemo.org/member.php?u=2332
Oct 16 15:38:47 <Khertan> bye
Oct 16 15:38:52 <Khertan> coming back to home
Oct 16 15:38:53 <Khertan> :)
Oct 16 15:41:14 <mgedmin> garage has a field for mugshot.org
Oct 16 15:41:31 <mgedmin> what's mugshot.org?  if I go there I get redirected to www.redhat.com
Oct 16 15:42:29 <mgedmin> wow, I've got more karma than textrat?
Oct 16 15:42:40 <AchipA> mgedmin: http://www.redhat.com/magazine/020jun06/features/mugshot/
Oct 16 15:42:58 <mgedmin> some overhyped 2006 website that's dead now?
Oct 16 15:43:10 <AchipA> mgedmin: goal
Oct 16 15:43:53 <Stskeeps> probably some site from the garage software times when sourceforge was cool and hip..
Oct 16 15:44:02 <mgedmin> timeless doesn't resemble his profile picture
Oct 16 15:44:24 <Solarion> mugshot was ok
Oct 16 15:44:32 <AchipA> mgedmin: texrat posts mostly on talk, you on lists. Talk has a sqrt() on karma, lists are linear. You do the math :)
Oct 16 15:44:45 <mgedmin> cool
Oct 16 15:44:53 <AchipA> mgedmin: most people don't, judging from the summit :D
Oct 16 15:45:24 <fiferboy> mgedmin: Could you see if personal-ip-address 0.3-2 (in extras-devel) works in your case now?
Oct 16 15:48:08 <mgedmin> fiferboy: works for wlan0, crashes the desktop when I switch to gprs0
Oct 16 15:48:21 <fiferboy> Ack!
Oct 16 15:48:37 <mgedmin> all custom applets are disabled now, how do I reenable them?
Oct 16 15:48:45 <mgedmin> without adding them one-by-one
Oct 16 15:48:49 <mgedmin> preferably
Oct 16 15:50:06 <fiferboy> mgedmin: It used to be that a reboot would restore everything
Oct 16 15:50:12 <mgedmin> shame crash-reporter is not installable
Oct 16 15:50:17 <fiferboy> I'm not sure with maemo5, but it might still work
Oct 16 15:50:29 <mgedmin> I think there's away to restart just hildon-desktop
Oct 16 15:51:25 <absolute> maybe a script in /etc/init.d/
Oct 16 15:51:32 <fiferboy> mgedmin: I can reproduce the problem.  It happens when changing any connection
Oct 16 15:51:43 <fiferboy> /etc/init.d/hildon-desktop restart
Oct 16 15:51:47 <absolute> yzyz
Oct 16 15:51:52 <fiferboy> That might work, but it doesn't in scratchbox
Oct 16 15:51:58 <mgedmin> I would really appreciate a fix
Oct 16 15:52:30 <lcuk> mgedmin, i once saw some random irc stats for maemo.org
Oct 16 15:52:33 <Stskeeps> 'lo frethop
Oct 16 15:52:34 <frethop> 'lo
Oct 16 15:52:43 <lcuk> any chance you could produce a new set ?
Oct 16 15:53:13 <mgedmin> I never produced an original set
Oct 16 15:53:13 <mgedmin> give me a script and I'll run it
Oct 16 15:53:34 <lcuk> hold on then - it was jott
Oct 16 15:53:41 <lcuk> and his page is 404ing
Oct 16 15:53:44 <mgedmin> log file format ought to be clear from looking at e.g. http://mg.pov.lt/maemo-irclog/%23maemo.2009-10-16.log
Oct 16 15:53:44 <lcuk> google cache
Oct 16 15:53:44 <lcuk> http://209.85.229.132/search?q=cache:qWcXKZTTE20J:outpo.st/irc/+%23maemo+irc+stats&cd=4&hl=en&ct=clnk&gl=uk
Oct 16 15:53:58 <lcuk> produced by http://pisg.sourceforge.net/
Oct 16 15:53:59 <Stskeeps> wazd_: seems like there'll be a "n900 meetup" in moscow
Oct 16 15:54:13 <mgedmin> I hate those %23 in filenames, but supybot is just unfriendly
Oct 16 15:56:00 <fiferboy> Even a reboot doesn't restore the widget placement...
Oct 16 15:58:39 <cvandonderen> hi
Oct 16 15:59:11 <cvandonderen> how come it is not possible to compile on the N900 itself? I added the SDK repo and installed build-essential
Oct 16 15:59:25 <cvandonderen> now when I run qmake and then make it gives loads of errors
Oct 16 15:59:32 <Mek> qmake is an intel binary
Oct 16 15:59:53 <Mek> unless you compiled qt differently/not in the maemo version...
Oct 16 15:59:53 <Stskeeps> cvandonderen: it's the way Maemo is done.
Oct 16 15:59:55 <Stskeeps> it uses busybox.
Oct 16 15:59:57 <cvandonderen> Mek: I'm not stupid ;-) I recompiled Qt with the armel compiler (took ages, but at least it works)
Oct 16 16:00:00 <Stskeeps> which most development tools die with.
Oct 16 16:00:10 <Stskeeps> you will want ot develop in SDK, not on device
Oct 16 16:00:14 <Stskeeps> at next upgrade , your N900 rootfs will be hosed
Oct 16 16:00:18 <cvandonderen> okay, so then no development for me
Oct 16 16:01:02 <Stskeeps> you don't own a desktop computer?
Oct 16 16:01:11 <cvandonderen> blegh, I can't wait till the Qt Creator version with Windows Maemo support comes
Oct 16 16:01:13 <wazd_> Stskeeps: oh?
Oct 16 16:01:17 <wazd_> Stskeeps: where? :)
Oct 16 16:01:26 <Stskeeps> wazd_: moscow, seemingily. information coming
Oct 16 16:01:42 <wazd_> Stskeeps: now that's interesting :)
Oct 16 16:01:45 <trbs> anybody have experience esbox/pluthon hanging when starting up ?
Oct 16 16:01:58 <cvandonderen> Stskeeps: I use Windows, my external HDD contains a Linux with the SDK, it's too cumbersome to boot that all the time....
Oct 16 16:01:59 <pupnik_> will qt be dog-slow like it is on a 3ghz pc?
Oct 16 16:02:00 <GAN900> 200 seems high.
Oct 16 16:02:08 <wazd_> RST38h brings his n900 to the McDonalds? :D
Oct 16 16:02:18 <Stskeeps> GAN900: 6 pages of /profile, it isn't that high
Oct 16 16:02:37 <Stskeeps> cvandonderen: virtualbox/vmware is my solution
Oct 16 16:02:53 <absolute> yeah
Oct 16 16:02:58 <absolute> vmware w/ unity
Oct 16 16:03:01 <cvandonderen> Stskeeps: tooo slow, for some reason it stays at 100% CPU in VBox
Oct 16 16:03:07 <Stskeeps> cvandonderen: hm, weird
Oct 16 16:03:13 <absolute> i run debian and have vmware around for trailing xp needs
Oct 16 16:03:17 * Stskeeps hugs his mer device and goes look for coffee
Oct 16 16:03:19 <cvandonderen> (Windows 7 x64...)
Oct 16 16:03:32 <mgedmin> cvandonderen: lcuk builds C programs on his n900, I'm sure -- he certainly used to do that on a n810
Oct 16 16:03:51 <Stskeeps> mgedmin: yeah, but qmake is more complicated
Oct 16 16:03:53 <mgedmin> qt may have its own issues
Oct 16 16:04:06 <lcuk> mgedmin, building as we speak
Oct 16 16:04:08 <cvandonderen> yeah, C works, it is mostly that it cannot find stuff like stddef.h
Oct 16 16:04:18 <lcuk> apt-get install build-essential
Oct 16 16:04:21 <cvandonderen> since they are not symlinked
Oct 16 16:04:25 <cvandonderen> lcuk: did that
Oct 16 16:04:29 <mgedmin> symlinked where?
Oct 16 16:04:33 <cvandonderen> (optified them first)
Oct 16 16:04:34 <lcuk> 	deb http://repository.maemo.org fremantle/sdk free non-free
Oct 16 16:04:34 <lcuk> 	deb http://repository.maemo.org fremantle/tools free non-free
Oct 16 16:04:40 <lcuk> o_O really
Oct 16 16:04:40 <wirelessdreamer> anyone know when the sdk is doing to be functional, after getting the binaries repo added to the sdk and running apt-get install nokia-binaries,  all the binaries complain they have dependency errors, I've waited a week, and did an apt-get update && apt-get upgrade, and the binaries still are broken
Oct 16 16:04:51 <lcuk> see if you can get the optified versions back into the sdk
Oct 16 16:05:01 <lcuk> so that when others (like me) try, it doesnt kill 80mb
Oct 16 16:05:15 <cvandonderen> stddef.h is in /usr/lib/c++/arm-linux-gnueabi/include or something
Oct 16 16:05:29 <lcuk> cvandonderen, after build essential, i just add the deps for libliqbase and start coding
Oct 16 16:05:33 <cvandonderen> and that is not in the include path for cmake
Oct 16 16:05:40 <lcuk> you are still in scratchbox?
Oct 16 16:05:42 <lcuk> or on device?
Oct 16 16:06:07 <lcuk> c++ is a little different then
Oct 16 16:06:07 <cvandonderen> lcuk: Windows, not gonna happen, I want to code my Qt code on my Windows, rsync it and then compile the ARM version on device...
Oct 16 16:06:18 <lcuk> i do that with c
Oct 16 16:06:27 <lcuk> i use komodo edit in windows
Oct 16 16:06:35 <lcuk> scp it back to tablet using winscp
Oct 16 16:06:43 <lcuk> and build from an ssh window direct
Oct 16 16:07:08 <lcuk> im running faster than native qt on windows ;)
Oct 16 16:07:13 * lcuk has qt creator open as well
Oct 16 16:07:34 <cvandonderen> lcuk: ?
Oct 16 16:08:36 <wazd_> Indeed, the FN store can't deliver to Russia, but basically the rest of the World is supported
Oct 16 16:08:51 <wazd_> why would I care for the rest of the world :(
Oct 16 16:08:58 <mgedmin> wohoo! because we're in it
Oct 16 16:08:58 <lcuk> wazd_, first, the army.  now, the postal service!
Oct 16 16:09:15 <wazd_> lcuk: yeah, my mood is completely down
Oct 16 16:09:19 <lcuk> :(
Oct 16 16:09:22 <lcuk> i feel for you
Oct 16 16:09:37 <mgedmin> we'll find a way to get a device to you somehow
Oct 16 16:09:48 <lcuk> lardman builds rockets..
Oct 16 16:09:59 <lcuk> but that might start other frictions
Oct 16 16:10:06 <Stskeeps> and the maemo community accidentially triggers ww3
Oct 16 16:10:26 <lcuk> we could get them playing tictactoe first
Oct 16 16:10:33 <cvandonderen> And does anybody have problems with the WiFi dropping all the time? on my laptop it works and the 3G works, the WiFi just drops every 10 minutes...
Oct 16 16:10:49 <lcuk> might be your router
Oct 16 16:11:07 <Stskeeps> a laptop doesn't use PSM, your device probably does
Oct 16 16:11:14 <cvandonderen> lcuk: every other device works....
Oct 16 16:11:21 <Mek> I have those problems with wifi at university... but it even being able to connect to it is already a big improvement over the n810 :)
Oct 16 16:11:23 <lcuk> maybe not then lol
Oct 16 16:11:39 <ali1234> "every other device works" is typical of the mess that is wifi
Oct 16 16:11:46 <cvandonderen> Expensive Belkin unit (I just forced it to Wireless G only, to see if that helps)
Oct 16 16:11:55 <lcuk> i had these troubles with adhoc to the old dev device.  but the new device is much more capable
Oct 16 16:12:13 <Stskeeps> cvandonderen: define 'drops' btw
Oct 16 16:12:24 <Stskeeps> does your ssh stop working when you ssh into it or something? :P
Oct 16 16:13:02 <cvandonderen> Stskeeps: yes, and my MSN gets disconnected, twitter can't open it's account, email says the account cannot be reached (but the icon for wireless acts like nothing is wrong)
Oct 16 16:13:21 <zerojayN900> reboot.
Oct 16 16:13:21 <Stskeeps> cvandonderen: try to disable power saving and see what happens
Oct 16 16:13:21 <cvandonderen> I can connect over SSH fast
Oct 16 16:13:27 <cvandonderen> Stskeeps: where?
Oct 16 16:13:40 <zerojayN900> yes. put power saving at intermediate.
Oct 16 16:14:01 <cvandonderen> Where can I find that option?
Oct 16 16:14:11 <Stskeeps> cvandonderen: internet connections under advanced under your AP
Oct 16 16:14:12 <Stskeeps> as i remember it
Oct 16 16:14:25 <zerojayN900> yep.
Oct 16 16:15:56 <cvandonderen> Stskeeps: my SSH still doesn't do **************
Oct 16 16:16:02 <cvandonderen> I can connect fast
Oct 16 16:16:06 <cvandonderen> but then don't type anything
Oct 16 16:16:28 <Stskeeps> cvandonderen: disabling power saving should make some things easier..
Oct 16 16:16:28 <Stskeeps> brb
Oct 16 16:17:28 <pupnik_> !extras-devel
Oct 16 16:17:29 <fiferboy> mgedmin: 0.3-3 is building with the crash fixed
Oct 16 16:19:22 <cvandonderen> Mek: Stskeeps: lcuk: this is what happens when trying to compile on device: http://pastebin.ca/1623862
Oct 16 16:19:26 <Stskeeps> wazd_: btw, - two things: imagine mer on a eink device, and on a 320x480.. how does it look?
Oct 16 16:19:53 <Stskeeps> cvandonderen: compiling full qt on device isn't a supported use case though.. it will break due to busybox and other issues
Oct 16 16:20:04 <Stskeeps> do you have libstdc++ installed
Oct 16 16:20:07 <Stskeeps> -dev
Oct 16 16:20:16 <cvandonderen> Stskeeps: I compiled Qt on scratchbox
Oct 16 16:20:20 <GAN900> $450?!
Oct 16 16:20:23 <cvandonderen> Stskeeps: yup, build-essential
Oct 16 16:20:36 <Stskeeps> cvandonderen: btw, you can do a better trick
Oct 16 16:20:37 <Stskeeps> hang on
Oct 16 16:20:39 <cvandonderen> stdc++6-4.2-dev is included in that
Oct 16 16:20:51 <GAN900> Sheesh, US users kinda get screwed.
Oct 16 16:20:52 <wazd_> Stskeeps: on e-ink it will look monochrome :D
Oct 16 16:20:53 * mgedmin takes back his t.m.o account, clicks on a random thread link, sees "Page 24 of 103" and runs away screaming
Oct 16 16:21:19 <ali1234> cvandonderen: try specifying an absolute path on -I
Oct 16 16:21:44 <Stskeeps> cvandonderen: grab http://repository.maemo.org/stable/fremantle/armel/maemo-sdk-rootstrap_5.0_armel.tgz , unpack it, chroot into the directory
Oct 16 16:21:49 <Stskeeps> on device
Oct 16 16:21:52 <GAN900> Hooray for %30 off. . . .
Oct 16 16:21:54 <Stskeeps> you should be able to build your tools within it
Oct 16 16:22:02 <Stskeeps> (this goes for lcuk too)
Oct 16 16:22:14 <cvandonderen> Stskeeps: what tools? full Qt?
Oct 16 16:22:20 <Stskeeps> for instance
Oct 16 16:22:24 <Stskeeps> it's the SDK rootstrap
Oct 16 16:22:36 <cvandonderen> hmm, you sure it should work?
Oct 16 16:22:50 <Stskeeps> no, but it's a valid theory. apt-get should be possible too.
Oct 16 16:22:59 <Stskeeps> you may have to mount --bind /proc and other things but..
Oct 16 16:23:15 <cvandonderen> Stskeeps: the lesser powersaving seems to have kicked in.. It keeps working now :-)
Oct 16 16:23:26 <Stskeeps> it's the same image SDK uses
Oct 16 16:23:50 <cvandonderen> but will keeping my N900 running at 100% CPU for 18 hours not burn my CPU?
Oct 16 16:23:52 * Meiz_webirc has a really satisfied look on his face now
Oct 16 16:23:58 <Stskeeps> cvandonderen: probably.
Oct 16 16:24:09 <Stskeeps> wazd_: reason why i ask is because there's actually a sane target for Mer on eink out
Oct 16 16:24:11 <cvandonderen> hmm, no option then :-P
Oct 16 16:24:48 <AchipA> cvandonderen: should not be a problem, if 3hrs of movies don't hurt, then 18h shouldn't either
Oct 16 16:24:58 <Stskeeps> cvandonderen: you don't have to build entire qt, you can apt-get it
Oct 16 16:25:27 <AchipA> in fact, my N900 gets less hot than my N810, but that might be just the metal backplate :)
Oct 16 16:25:51 <cvandonderen> Stskeeps: no 4.6 packages yet....
Oct 16 16:25:51 <mgedmin> remember that one slide about power saving from maemo summit? "locking the cpu at 600 mhz or 550 mhz will damage the device.  please do not fry your cpu."
Oct 16 16:25:59 <cvandonderen> mgedmin: trhat's the one I'm talking about ;-0
Oct 16 16:26:08 <Mek> hopefully the cpufreq stuff will take care of that...
Oct 16 16:26:11 <mgedmin> I never understood what you'd have to do to "lock the cpu at 600 mhz"
Oct 16 16:26:18 <AchipA> that's a different issue
Oct 16 16:26:23 <ali1234> merely using 100% cpu is not the same as patching the kernel cpu scaling to always run at 600mhz
Oct 16 16:26:33 <mgedmin> is it echo performance > /proc/cpufreq/whatever or something as simple as while(1);
Oct 16 16:26:55 <mgedmin> I *hope* the cpu scaling code keeps my n900 safe from frying
Oct 16 16:27:35 * mgedmin wonders if liqbase still has that 'set cpu mode to full performance' button
Oct 16 16:27:55 <mgedmin> well, if lcuk fries his n900, I'm sure we'll hear about it
Oct 16 16:28:38 <absolute> generally speaking, i never hear too many accounts of frying cpus that aren't overclocked in some manner...
Oct 16 16:28:55 <cvandonderen> hmm, maybe worth trying then...
Oct 16 16:28:59 <Stskeeps> cvandonderen: 14 hours on device? hah. 3 days.
Oct 16 16:29:20 <cvandonderen> Stskeeps: will everything being apt-get get put in a subfolde rof the rootstrap?
Oct 16 16:29:25 <lcuk> mgedmin, no way
Oct 16 16:29:30 <lcuk> liqbase runs too fast on n900
Oct 16 16:29:35 <Stskeeps> cvandonderen: yeah i guess
Oct 16 16:29:36 <lcuk> i want powersave :)
Oct 16 16:29:40 <Stskeeps> lcuk: you should checkout the chroot environment btw
Oct 16 16:29:57 <Stskeeps> it's FREMANTE_ARMEL target basis
Oct 16 16:29:58 <lcuk> i spoke to igor at the summit
Oct 16 16:30:07 <Jaffa> mgedmin: vim_7.2-0maemo5 built; on its way to auto-builder queue
Oct 16 16:30:11 <VDVsx> andre__, thanks ;)
Oct 16 16:30:24 <lcuk> and he showed me how to achieve this, and if i remember Ill make use of it lol
Oct 16 16:30:31 <cvandonderen> Mek: any update on the CMake package?
Oct 16 16:30:33 <lcuk> Stskeeps, what will the chroot give me
Oct 16 16:30:36 <lcuk> or allow me to do
Oct 16 16:30:43 <Stskeeps> lcuk: full development environment on device
Oct 16 16:30:43 <Mek> cvandonderen: apparently there is a correct cmake in the sdk
Oct 16 16:30:51 <lcuk> could i, for instance, supply a complete development chroot as one image..
Oct 16 16:30:53 <Mek> cvandonderen: http://maemo.org/packages/view/cmake/
Oct 16 16:31:05 <Mek> cvandonderen: the 2.6.3-2maemo4 should work
Oct 16 16:31:11 <mgedmin> igor hasn't uploaded his slides, has he?
Oct 16 16:31:13 <lcuk> ahhh yes, with added dpkg goodness
Oct 16 16:32:03 <mgedmin> okay, my battery is uncomfortably low; this makes it 10 hours of light use today
Oct 16 16:32:10 <mgedmin> well, medium use
Oct 16 16:32:10 <cvandonderen> Mek: okay, nice :-)
Oct 16 16:33:33 <RST38h> Insane stuff: http://gizmodo.com/5378390/the-app-store-effect-are-iphone-apps-headed-for-oblivion
Oct 16 16:33:49 <RST38h> It all sounds almost like the effect that killed Atari 2600
Oct 16 16:34:22 <mgedmin> what's the most obnoxious app on maemo 5?  I vote for ovi maps: loooong startup time with the "switch to other app" button disabled
Oct 16 16:35:02 <Mek> mgedmin: ctrl-backspace still works for switching apps
Oct 16 16:35:19 <Jaffa> mgedmin: Ovi Maps is pretty obnoxious on so many levels
Oct 16 16:35:26 <Stskeeps> mgedmin: "end application" is my favourite choice for that
Oct 16 16:35:44 <RST38h> mgedmin: You want the list of Ovi Maps bug trackers on bugzilla
Oct 16 16:35:53 <RST38h> ?
Oct 16 16:35:54 <andre__> VDVsx, welcome :)
Oct 16 16:36:47 <mgedmin> cool, if I re-add widgets manually, they remember their previous position
Oct 16 16:36:50 <andre__> cool. didn't know about control+backspace to get to the dashboard
Oct 16 16:37:00 <mgedmin> still waiting for personal-ip-address with the crasher fix to appear in the repo
Oct 16 16:37:02 <javispedro> the quality of posts in tmo is degrading again...
Oct 16 16:37:13 <Jaffa> andre__: Ctrl-Shift-P for screenshot will be useful for you in bugs.
Oct 16 16:37:17 <mgedmin> andre__: did you know about ctrl+alt+p for taking a screenshot and ctrl+alt+x for launching xterm?
Oct 16 16:37:24 <javispedro> can't make any sense of the dev program thread :P
Oct 16 16:37:28 <Stskeeps> javispedro: time to get them in shape with wild rumours
Oct 16 16:37:30 <AchipA> javispedro: not again -> still, but currently at an increasing rate :) :(
Oct 16 16:37:44 <fiferboy> mgedmin: I will send you the link once it is in - it will take a while after that to show up when refreshing
Oct 16 16:37:52 <Stskeeps> wazd_: picture of n1000 running windows mobile, stat
Oct 16 16:37:53 <woglinde> re
Oct 16 16:38:28 <cvandonderen> mgedmin: is there an alt key on the device then/
Oct 16 16:39:24 <crashanddie> My boss asked me to do a presentation about Maemo while I'm in the US Headquarters to our Product Manager
Oct 16 16:39:33 <Stskeeps> hrm
Oct 16 16:39:35 <javispedro> and to top it off someone grabs two source tarballs of an ongoing mupen64 pandora port (incomplete), rars them and puts the rar file in rapidshare only to say "here, n900 n64 emulator")
Oct 16 16:39:41 <andre__> uh
Oct 16 16:39:43 <crashanddie> one side of me went "Yay", the other side went "Oh shit"
Oct 16 16:39:49 <Jaffa> crashanddie: Cool
Oct 16 16:39:49 <andre__> control+shift+p? cool
Oct 16 16:39:49 <mgedmin> s/alt/shift/
Oct 16 16:39:49 <infobot> mgedmin meant: andre__: did you know about ctrl+shift+p for taking a screenshot and ctrl+alt+x for launching xterm?
Oct 16 16:39:52 <Stskeeps> hmm, TXTR is 319 euro
Oct 16 16:39:56 <mgedmin> s/alt/shift/g
Oct 16 16:39:56 <infobot> mgedmin meant: andre__: did you know about ctrl+shift+p for taking a screenshot and ctrl+shift+x for launching xterm?
Oct 16 16:40:00 <Stskeeps> i would pay that for a hackable eink device
Oct 16 16:40:07 <mgedmin> cool, infobot implements substitution flags
Oct 16 16:40:14 <crashanddie> Jaffa: maybe not so cool
Oct 16 16:40:19 <mgedmin> cvandonderen: no alt key
Oct 16 16:40:34 <Jaffa> crashanddie: I've got my comunity one I gave at onedotzero you could use as a starting point
Oct 16 16:41:32 <crashanddie> Jaffa: quote "the purpose is mainly to understand what initiatives you are working on to identify if it can be interesting for the company"
Oct 16 16:41:56 <batsheep> what company?
Oct 16 16:42:01 <crashanddie> mine
Oct 16 16:42:31 <javispedro> management...
Oct 16 16:42:32 <Jaffa> crashanddie: Blurb from maemo.nokia.com and maemo.org/intro/ to the rescue?
Oct 16 16:42:41 <crashanddie> Jaffa: it's not that
Oct 16 16:42:42 <Jaffa> And 2 minutes using the video for the N900? ;-)
Oct 16 16:42:57 <crashanddie> Jaffa: I don't want my day job to start poking into my hobbies
Oct 16 16:43:08 <Jaffa> crashanddie: True
Oct 16 16:44:40 <crashanddie> Jaffa: I've done tons of presentations, I've taught classes about OS, I train customers on our products. I'm definitely not afraid to be in front of an audience, especially an audience that's asking ME to do stuff
Oct 16 16:44:44 <crashanddie> I just don't want them to ASK
Oct 16 16:44:46 <crashanddie> anyway
Oct 16 16:45:51 <cvandonderen> when will the first official image appear to reflash the device?
Oct 16 16:46:15 <andre__> when it's ready :)
Oct 16 16:46:20 <andre__> nokia never announces this beforehand
Oct 16 16:46:45 <cvandonderen> hmmm
Oct 16 16:47:10 * javispedro is now founder of Javispedro Stupid Devices, Inc. just to be able to pass the forum nokia reg page
Oct 16 16:48:25 <absolute> hah
Oct 16 16:49:00 <AchipA> how many fingers does it take to press ctrl-shift-x ? :D
Oct 16 16:49:14 <javispedro> thirteen.
Oct 16 16:49:26 <Arkenklo> 2^-4
Oct 16 16:49:27 <AchipA> using your foot is cheating !
Oct 16 16:49:34 <javispedro> doesn't it do sticky ctrl ?
Oct 16 16:49:52 <AchipA> nope, for me it doesn't...
Oct 16 16:49:59 <javispedro> baah then
Oct 16 16:50:28 <wazd_> am I the only that typed "Unemployed"? :D
Oct 16 16:50:48 <AchipA> it works only if I press the three buttons simultaneously, no sticky shift, no sticky ctrl
Oct 16 16:50:50 <woglinde> wazd I think lcuk too
Oct 16 16:50:50 <Arkenklo> it takes one serial converter, one broken calculator and three hours of putting them together
Oct 16 16:51:03 <absolute> with no ALT, is there a replacement for Ctrl-Alt-F# for accessing tty prompts outside of X?
Oct 16 16:51:06 <Arkenklo> and a whole lot of superglue
Oct 16 16:51:19 <woglinde> hm but wait lcuk already have one
Oct 16 16:51:22 <javispedro> wazd: actually, i can't put there my current employeer
Oct 16 16:51:25 <Jaffa> absolute: There are no tty prompts outside of X. This isn't an x86 machine
Oct 16 16:51:31 <Arkenklo> absolute: dude, it's a cellphone
Oct 16 16:51:32 <woglinde> if I remember correctly
Oct 16 16:51:39 <lcuk> no woglinde
Oct 16 16:51:40 <javispedro> since that page is for registering the company itself.
Oct 16 16:51:55 <absolute> no harm, just askin :)
Oct 16 16:52:00 <lcuk> but i just got off the phone to a potential employer :)
Oct 16 16:52:09 <woglinde> hm I should try if qemu still crashes java
Oct 16 16:52:15 <javispedro> lcuk: congrats. looking good?
Oct 16 16:52:33 <woglinde> lcuk that would be good news
Oct 16 16:52:57 <Stskeeps> lcuk: congrats
Oct 16 16:53:11 * Stskeeps hopes lcuk gets a job
Oct 16 16:53:13 <lcuk> indeed it would :) hold on guys this is only a first interview lol
Oct 16 16:53:19 <aSIMULAter> evening
Oct 16 16:53:31 <lcuk> and theres many more to come no doubt
Oct 16 16:53:33 <Jaffa> lo aSIMULAter
Oct 16 16:53:39 <javispedro> hiyo  asim
Oct 16 16:53:45 * lcuk thinks he had more than one at the summit
Oct 16 16:54:18 <GAN900> Hey yo
Oct 16 16:54:27 * aSIMULAter wonders what rom to play
Oct 16 16:54:52 <GAN900> Kirby!
Oct 16 16:54:58 <absolute> Super Pang!
Oct 16 16:55:04 * javispedro is sick today, only got out of bed to read dev program news :(
Oct 16 16:55:06 <aSIMULAter> hi absolute
Oct 16 16:55:15 <absolute> heya
Oct 16 16:55:27 <woglinde> lcuk cool
Oct 16 16:55:41 <woglinde> javis yes I want summer back
Oct 16 16:55:46 <crashanddie> Jaffa: on the other hand, I just got promoted today :)
Oct 16 16:55:46 <Arkenklo> is a shared positive voltage needed for serial conversation?
Oct 16 16:55:56 <crashanddie> Jaffa: note my priorities: worried about Maemo, money later
Oct 16 16:55:57 <aSIMULAter> yeah congrats lcuk
Oct 16 16:55:57 <woglinde> hm I need a job half year australia and half year home
Oct 16 16:55:58 <Solarion> I'm gonna make me a pizza for lunch
Oct 16 16:56:01 <woglinde> that would be fine
Oct 16 16:56:06 <Arkenklo> on a ttl, isn't just tx/rx required?
Oct 16 16:56:25 <crashanddie> lcuk: nice
Oct 16 16:56:32 <Jaffa> crashanddie: Heh, cool
Oct 16 16:56:49 <Jaffa> lcuk: Based nearby?
Oct 16 16:58:55 <crashanddie> anyway, i'm out, bb
Oct 16 17:02:07 <VDVsx> hey aSIMULAter ;)
Oct 16 17:02:20 <aSIMULAter> o hai mr valer
Oct 16 17:02:27 <VDVsx> eheh
Oct 16 17:02:39 <eichi> does the n900 has got a slot for 1 or 2 sim cards?
Oct 16 17:02:40 <aSIMULAter> i haven't met anyone else who has that family name u know :P
Oct 16 17:02:58 <aSIMULAter> are you spanish?
Oct 16 17:03:05 <microlith> eichi: only one
Oct 16 17:03:20 <eichi> microlith, thats a mess ^^
Oct 16 17:03:48 <VDVsx> aSIMULAter, nop, Portuguese
Oct 16 17:04:04 <zaheerm> i don't know of a nokia that has more than one sim card slot
Oct 16 17:04:06 <eichi> one for umts and one for telephone would be nice
Oct 16 17:05:16 <aSIMULAter> oh interesting
Oct 16 17:07:23 <fiferboy> Hi lbt
Oct 16 17:07:34 <lbt> hi fiferboy
Oct 16 17:07:48 <lbt> I'm getting Qt/Shopper on the n900 this weekend
Oct 16 17:07:59 <fiferboy> lbt: Antonio has a Qt sprint coming up
Oct 16 17:08:08 <lbt> 'k
Oct 16 17:08:13 <EspadaV8> Qt/Shopper?
Oct 16 17:08:19 <lbt> would be good to get my dev env sorted then
Oct 16 17:08:30 <lbt> EspadaV8: http://maemo.org/downloads/product/OS2008/shopper/
Oct 16 17:08:36 <fiferboy> lbt: The current Qt libs available for the device are... not so good.
Oct 16 17:08:51 <EspadaV8> ahhh yes
Oct 16 17:08:58 <lbt> fiferboy: yeah - I am a bit uncertain about how Qt is being handled
Oct 16 17:09:01 <EspadaV8> i remember seeing that ages ago
Oct 16 17:09:08 <lbt> it kinda blows hot+cold
Oct 16 17:09:14 <RST38h> moo, vdvsx, asimulator
Oct 16 17:09:16 <fiferboy> Hopefully the sprint will get things in shape
Oct 16 17:09:20 <EspadaV8> what's up with the libs fiferboy?
Oct 16 17:09:35 <lbt> *nod* but the direction seems unclear too
Oct 16 17:09:41 <fiferboy> EspadaV8: They aren't using finger scrolling, or the latest finger interfaces yet
Oct 16 17:10:01 <lbt> I didn't get the chance to ask but I feel that maemo-qt is a dead-end
Oct 16 17:10:01 <EspadaV8> they aren't? it was working for me
Oct 16 17:10:15 <EspadaV8> or do you mean the scrollbars aren't finger friendly?
Oct 16 17:10:16 <lbt> EspadaV8: onthe N900 ?
Oct 16 17:10:25 <EspadaV8> lbt: mhmm
Oct 16 17:10:40 <fiferboy> lbt: Well, Antonio said in his email that the community libs would be going forward, as 4.6 is not ready yet
Oct 16 17:10:57 <EspadaV8> compiled my app for it and everything worked really well, i was surprised tbh
Oct 16 17:11:03 <fiferboy> It seems like they were hoping to use the official 4.6 libs, but it will be too long until they are ready
Oct 16 17:11:06 <EspadaV8> expected to have to change a load of stuff
Oct 16 17:11:29 <lbt> OK - lets see then :)
Oct 16 17:11:29 <fiferboy> EspadaV8: What version are you using?
Oct 16 17:11:42 <EspadaV8> fiferboy: whatever was with the sdk
Oct 16 17:11:57 <EspadaV8> 4.5.x
Oct 16 17:12:03 <fiferboy> I have tried the libs available in the repo, built from git, built from 4.6 tech preview, and none of it was quite complete
Oct 16 17:12:29 <fiferboy> EspadaV8: Everything works, but is all stylus-sized?
Oct 16 17:13:12 <EspadaV8>  fiferboy: the whole pane became scrollable, so you didn't have a scrollbar
Oct 16 17:13:21 <EspadaV8> just tap, hold and drag
Oct 16 17:13:34 <EspadaV8> even had kinetic scrolling
Oct 16 17:13:45 <fiferboy> EspadaV8: That is for a certain type of widget (and thanks to lbt :)
Oct 16 17:14:08 <Khertan_> re
Oct 16 17:14:26 <fiferboy> EspadaV8: Are dialogs shown in the hildon style?  Buttons to the side with no cancel/close?
Oct 16 17:14:59 <fiferboy> I think kinetic scrolling is turned off for table widgets and some others by default
Oct 16 17:15:31 <EspadaV8> fiferboy: i've only got the one popup, and i'd added a cancel button so it did show
Oct 16 17:15:34 <EspadaV8> http://blogs.palringo.com/andrew/wp-content/uploads/2009/10/02-n900-signin.png
Oct 16 17:15:47 <Khertan_> i ve finally crash my n900 with a sudden reboot
Oct 16 17:15:51 <Mek> in the office viewer we actually had to turn kinetic scrolling off even though it worked by default, becuase the implementation in qt 4.5 for maemo at the time was incredibely buggy...
Oct 16 17:16:34 <Khertan_> 50 pygtkrunning and 15 webpage
Oct 16 17:16:36 <fiferboy> EspadaV8: Yeah, that is the stylus interface.  Antonio has done lots of work since then getting it finger friendly and hildon-like
Oct 16 17:16:50 <Khertan_> while listening the last rammstein album and updating apps :)
Oct 16 17:18:04 <lbt> Mek: that's good to hear
Oct 16 17:18:12 <EspadaV8> fiferboy: got a screenshot of how it's different?
Oct 16 17:18:19 <lbt> did the pass-thru of events work?
Oct 16 17:18:26 <lbt> to allow drag-higlight
Oct 16 17:18:36 <lbt> and drag'n'drop ?
Oct 16 17:19:11 <Mek> lbt: more or less... but there were some problems with that as well I think; but the main problem was the the kinetic scrolling itself just often got stuck bouncing back and forward...
Oct 16 17:19:20 <fiferboy> EspadaV8: I do not.  I haven't been able to get the version that Antonio was showing a thte Summit to work
Oct 16 17:19:26 <EspadaV8> Mek: ah yes, i did find that error
Oct 16 17:19:35 <Khertan_> hum i m trying to block drag select in a gtksourceview2 which subclass gtk.textview
Oct 16 17:19:38 <fiferboy> Mek: That has been fixed since then ;)
Oct 16 17:19:41 <EspadaV8> fiferboy: ah, shame, wouldlike to see what's changed/changing
Oct 16 17:19:42 <lbt> Mek: fiferboy fixed that iirc
Oct 16 17:19:49 <Khertan_> someone have an idea how to do it in python ?
Oct 16 17:20:11 <fiferboy> EspadaV8: You can look at the gitorious page to see the commits that have been occurring
Oct 16 17:20:44 <Khertan_> why? to be able to use it in a hildon.pannablearea
Oct 16 17:20:47 <fiferboy> I was going to leave in the infinite oscillation, as it looked pretty cool ;)
Oct 16 17:20:52 <EspadaV8> sorry, meant changes in a visual way
Oct 16 17:21:12 * Khertan_ is spamming with is question every hour
Oct 16 17:21:16 <fiferboy> EspadaV8: Ah.  Look at any other app in hildon, and that is how Qt should look (in theory)
Oct 16 17:21:43 <EspadaV8> fiferboy: add it as an application setting QApplication::infiniteBounce( bool );
Oct 16 17:21:44 <EspadaV8> ;-)
Oct 16 17:22:00 <fiferboy> :)
Oct 16 17:22:30 <Khertan_> :)
Oct 16 17:23:54 <Khertan_> pyqt isn t available yet for fremantle right ?
Oct 16 17:24:29 <cvandonderen> Stskeeps: thanks for the scratchbox hint, seems to work :-)
Oct 16 17:27:20 * GAN900 wonders if the XChat netcode can be made a little more aware of conic events.
Oct 16 17:27:22 <cvandonderen> eh, Fremantle extras reports that the signature has changed. is this correct?
Oct 16 17:27:30 <Khertan_> ~ping
Oct 16 17:27:31 <infobot> ~pong
Oct 16 17:27:55 <lbt> Khertan_: sounds like no-one here is a gtk-head :)
Oct 16 17:28:05 <penguinbait> ~ding
Oct 16 17:28:06 <infobot> dong
Oct 16 17:28:17 <lbt> pyqt is being 'replaced' by pyside
Oct 16 17:28:20 <lbt> slowly
Oct 16 17:28:26 <Khertan_> GAN900 use webchat.freenode.net :)
Oct 16 17:29:07 <Khertan_> lbt: next time when i ll go to a maemo summit i ll catch the hildon developper head
Oct 16 17:29:35 <Khertan_> after there presentation i ll not been able to meet them ...
Oct 16 17:29:44 <Khertan_> s/there/their
Oct 16 17:30:20 <cvandonderen> Stskeeps: ow, too early, does not seem t work...
Oct 16 17:30:22 <lbt> do we have any python/django people in here?
Oct 16 17:30:47 * Teijo is python people 
Oct 16 17:31:01 <lbt> I have some mer/maemo website work I'd like them to look at
Oct 16 17:31:28 * Khertan_ is a python user but never use django
Oct 16 17:31:33 <fiferboy> Okay, time to try to get personal-gprs-mon into extras.
Oct 16 17:31:52 <fiferboy> If anyone uses this app (and upgrades to the latest version) the package page is here:
Oct 16 17:31:53 <Khertan_> fiferboy what is it ?
Oct 16 17:31:58 <fiferboy> http://maemo.org/packages/package_instance/view/fremantle_extras-testing_free_armel/personal-gprs-mon/0.5-2
Oct 16 17:32:11 <fiferboy> Khertan: Monitors your dataplan usage on the desktop
Oct 16 17:32:17 <Khertan_> ah a gprs data monitor
Oct 16 17:32:20 <Khertan_> oki
Oct 16 17:32:35 <lbt> so msg me if you're interested in a little community website project
Oct 16 17:32:39 <Teijo> is it true that n810 does not support xrandr out of the box?
Oct 16 17:32:41 <fiferboy> It used to be a grps monitor, but no one uses that kind of data ;)
Oct 16 17:32:48 <fiferboy> (bad typo in the original release)
Oct 16 17:32:50 <Khertan_> so i ve a concurrent now which do widget
Oct 16 17:32:57 <lbt> should be a high visibility proj and not *too* demanding
Oct 16 17:33:13 <lbt> zerojay: ping
Oct 16 17:33:35 <Khertan_> lbt: sorry i didnt have enough time
Oct 16 17:33:51 <lbt> Khertan_: np... looking for volunteers who do :)
Oct 16 17:33:53 <pupnik> meh
Oct 16 17:34:40 <Khertan_> lbt: if it s a teleporter project i ll be intereated else maybe if it s day extender tool which enable you to got 48hours in 24hours
Oct 16 17:35:10 <pupnik> pupbgrt 008 xchat: setting input text box to equal chat text caused segfault
Oct 16 17:35:12 <lcuk> Khertan, just behind the SIM slot behind the battery on the n900 is a space for a flux capacity
Oct 16 17:35:27 <lcuk> insert one into there, set your alarm clock back 12 hours and party!
Oct 16 17:35:32 * absolute hands Khertan_ a time dilation device
Oct 16 17:35:42 <lcuk> capacitor even
Oct 16 17:35:44 <pupnik> can we do ustream with camera?
Oct 16 17:35:50 <lcuk> ffs
Oct 16 17:35:51 <lbt> VDVsx: Ping
Oct 16 17:36:06 <Khertan_> +w
Oct 16 17:36:06 <Khertan_> lcuk: is it connected to liqflo ?
Oct 16 17:36:08 <EspadaV8_L> :(
Oct 16 17:36:14 * EspadaV8_L needs a 12 core system
Oct 16 17:36:42 <Khertan_> ~ping
Oct 16 17:36:43 <infobot> ~pong
Oct 16 17:36:50 <Khertan_> i still make many mistake with this small n900 keyboard
Oct 16 17:37:02 <lcuk> Khertan, theres an idea
Oct 16 17:37:57 <lcuk> firmly grab device by the left and right edges, and pull!
Oct 16 17:37:57 <lcuk> it will stretch to be 32 inches wide, unfortunately it will only be 2mm thick
Oct 16 17:38:05 <EspadaV8_L> hahaha, my app crashes on the line QApplication( argc, argv );
Oct 16 17:38:06 <EspadaV8_L> :(
Oct 16 17:38:20 <RST38h> pupnik: we can, if it gets open
Oct 16 17:39:46 * EspadaV8_L waits for the 4.6b1 to finish compiling :(
Oct 16 17:42:22 <pupnik> pupbgrt 009 browser: weba_ti_textlist_multi and weba_ti_textlist_single and button wdgt_bd_done missing engl translation
Oct 16 17:44:32 <fiferboy> EspadaV8_L: I could be wrong, but I think the beta doesn't have any maemo-specific code in it
Oct 16 17:44:40 <fiferboy> The tech preview does, though
Oct 16 17:45:16 <EspadaV8_L> fiferboy: alas i don't have the n900 any more
Oct 16 17:45:25 <EspadaV8_L> so i'm just developing on the desktop
Oct 16 17:45:30 <fiferboy> Ah.  Gotcha
Oct 16 17:46:08 <EspadaV8_L> and gentoo likes to take its time
Oct 16 17:46:28 <AndrewFBlack> wow there is some drama going on at t.m.o
Oct 16 17:47:47 <VDVsx> lbt, pong
Oct 16 17:47:54 <pupnik> do we have a bugreport helper to submit relevant app/device status
Oct 16 17:48:06 <RST38h> ?
Oct 16 17:50:18 <RST38h> AFB: What *again*?
Oct 16 17:50:23 <pupnik> n810 is shocked and offended at being put to use playing mp3s on stereo
Oct 16 17:52:56 * RST38h facepalms reading people discussing Maemo5 at nokia_ru
Oct 16 17:53:32 <zerojayN900> lol
Oct 16 17:53:36 <RST38h> Claiming 30000+ packages for Maemo. Saying that "every Linux program will run on Maemo". Saying that "Maemo apps will run on Android".
Oct 16 17:53:47 <absolute> oh my
Oct 16 17:54:09 <RST38h> "Maemo5 is Qt4!"
Oct 16 17:54:09 <range> I need an N900 for running oracle on it.
Oct 16 17:54:22 <range> Oh. No java.
Oct 16 17:54:24 <RST38h> Cthulhu, please, kill all these people *first*.
Oct 16 17:54:39 <RST38h> range: You cannot install Oracle on N900 because Oracle installer is in Java
Oct 16 17:55:00 <ifreq> but its linux.. ofcourse u can run every app like on your ubuntu. *sarcasm*
Oct 16 17:55:07 <RST38h> range: So, search for an older version =)
Oct 16 17:55:22 <range> Yeah.
Oct 16 17:56:04 <SpeedEvil> range: For when you're out boating in your coracle?
Oct 16 17:58:52 <range> Made me look that up :=
Oct 16 17:58:55 <range> )
Oct 16 18:07:58 <mrJiggles> what carrier has the n810?
Oct 16 18:08:05 <mrJiggles> ...in the USA.
Oct 16 18:08:19 * mrJiggles wants to try it before buying
Oct 16 18:11:06 <lardman> hmm, cool seemless (nearly) transitions from BT headphones to FM radio to built-in speakers
Oct 16 18:12:51 * lardman just needs one of those room-by-room stereo systems so his music can follow him
Oct 16 18:13:06 <lardman> (overriding that of his wife naturally ;)
Oct 16 18:13:25 <lbt> jeremiah: hey
Oct 16 18:13:30 <Solarion> mrJiggles: n810 isn't a phone
Oct 16 18:14:02 <lardman> hmm, anyone happen to have some example e_book_query_from_string() code?
Oct 16 18:14:30 <lardman> hey JamieBennett
Oct 16 18:14:36 <GAN900> Khertan_ ew
Oct 16 18:14:37 <JamieBennett> hey
Oct 16 18:14:54 <GAN900> Oh, Khertan_, how'd you get the key remapping working?
Oct 16 18:19:09 <mrJiggles> how would one go about programming on his/her maemo based cell phone, something like the n810/n97/n900
Oct 16 18:20:19 <lcuk> 2/3 of those options are not maemo based cell phones
Oct 16 18:20:25 <lcuk> 1/2 of those options is not maemo based
Oct 16 18:20:42 <lcuk> 1/3*
Oct 16 18:21:41 <lardman> JamieBennett: still on the £7/pint?
Oct 16 18:21:50 <lcuk> yikes
Oct 16 18:22:22 <JamieBennett> lardman: no, found a supermarket around the corner from the hotel so I'm being a trap. Supermarket beer, find a free wifi spot and a bench, start hacking
Oct 16 18:22:30 <JamieBennett> tramp
Oct 16 18:22:32 <Solarion> mrJiggles: maemo.org has developer documentation for maemo-based devices
Oct 16 18:23:07 <JamieBennett> but hey, I'm poor so I have to :)
Oct 16 18:23:22 <fiferboy> lardman: I like 7 Euro pints?
Oct 16 18:23:32 <fiferboy> That wasn't supposed to be a question?
Oct 16 18:23:43 <JamieBennett> 7 euro = 7 pounds :(
Oct 16 18:23:59 <lardman> for us, yeah :(
Oct 16 18:24:01 <lardman> bad news
Oct 16 18:24:02 <fiferboy> 7 CAD = 7 USD :)
Oct 16 18:24:08 <lardman> :p ;)
Oct 16 18:24:59 <lcuk> JamieBennett, brown bag too?
Oct 16 18:25:17 <JamieBennett> lcuk: not quite at that stage yet :)
Oct 16 18:25:49 <mrJiggles> kthxbye
Oct 16 18:26:27 <SpeedEvil> Does anyone know of a nice program that takes a video4linux device, and outputs EAN/... barcodes on text?
Oct 16 18:27:39 <keesj> SpeedEvil: ask lardman
Oct 16 18:30:08 <lardman> quoi?
Oct 16 18:30:16 <lardman> oh
Oct 16 18:30:21 <lardman> well I dunno about nice
Oct 16 18:30:45 <lardman> SpeedEvil: for the Tescos stuff?
Oct 16 18:31:01 <johnsq> Hi
Oct 16 18:31:26 <keesj> nice like stuff you make yourself :p
Oct 16 18:31:44 <lardman> well it doesn't really output text, or shouldn't
Oct 16 18:32:07 <lardman> but then gcobb was suggesting I break it up into parts, so perhaps this is the first customer ;)
Oct 16 18:33:32 <lardman> in fact the decoder bit is pretty simple, and eventually I hope to move to nothing more than a simple wrapper for zbar
Oct 16 18:34:03 <lardman> but when I started the 1D decoding wasn't great if you wanted QR codes too; datamatrix is a separate lib
Oct 16 18:34:10 <lardman> anyway, that's ot
Oct 16 18:35:16 <igagis> Hi
Oct 16 18:35:54 <igagis> is anyone able to do apt-get update in scratchbox when fremantle extras-devel are in apt/sources.list?
Oct 16 18:37:42 <lardman> SpeedEvil: anyway, I plan to separate the barcode stuff into some layers: decoding a buffer; simple gui to take images; webscraping/lookups
Oct 16 18:37:50 <lardman> ontop of which people can put their apps
Oct 16 18:37:53 <lardman> if that sounds of use
Oct 16 18:37:53 <lardman> ?
Oct 16 18:38:31 <SpeedEvil> lardman: initially for just doing my cupboard inventory.
Oct 16 18:38:36 <SpeedEvil> (not on a n900)
Oct 16 18:38:40 <SpeedEvil> (unless...)
Oct 16 18:38:49 <lardman> np, works on N8X0 too
Oct 16 18:38:58 <lardman> try grabbing mbarcode and trying
Oct 16 18:39:03 <SpeedEvil> alas - no 8x0
Oct 16 18:39:03 <SpeedEvil> ok
Oct 16 18:39:13 <lardman> I want to use it for book/DVD inventory, so perhaps you could add some db patches, etc
Oct 16 18:39:20 <lardman> ah, what device then?
Oct 16 18:39:24 <lardman> or none?
Oct 16 18:39:55 <SpeedEvil> currently just laptop
Oct 16 18:40:15 <lardman> well you're welcome to modify the maemo-barcode source
Oct 16 18:40:20 <SpeedEvil> I was wondering if there was somethign you were basing your code off that did that
Oct 16 18:40:30 <lardman> do you want a ui?
Oct 16 18:40:50 <SpeedEvil> no
Oct 16 18:40:53 <lardman> it will probably run on a laptop anyway, just alter the hildon_window to gtk_window and check the camera caps
Oct 16 18:41:26 * RST38h solved the CPU load problem
Oct 16 18:41:29 <lardman> if you only want 1D then I suggest you grab batoo.c from the project and write a command line wrapper for it
Oct 16 18:41:34 <RST38h> It was pretty easy at the end
Oct 16 18:42:04 <lardman> https://garage.maemo.org/plugins/scmsvn/viewcvs.php/branches/simon_wip/maemo-barcode/?root=maemo-barcode
Oct 16 18:42:18 <SpeedEvil> lardman: thanks!
Oct 16 18:42:23 <lardman> np
Oct 16 18:42:31 <lardman> that code works well
Oct 16 18:42:45 * SpeedEvil isn't feeling up to beating on google and fighting past the windows stuff.
Oct 16 18:42:48 * SpeedEvil has been turning compost.
Oct 16 18:42:49 <lardman> zbar 0.9 is also supposed to be pretty good, and handles more types of 1D code (e.g. EAN8)
Oct 16 18:42:50 <SpeedEvil> Fun.
Oct 16 18:42:55 <SpeedEvil> hmm.
Oct 16 18:43:03 <SpeedEvil> I don't think I have much EAn8
Oct 16 18:43:06 <SpeedEvil> some spices
Oct 16 18:43:18 <lardman> cigs, chewing gum
Oct 16 18:43:42 <SpeedEvil> possibly the latter
Oct 16 18:44:39 <lardman> SpeedEvil: I'd be interesting in using your Tescos stuff for mBarcode eventually
Oct 16 18:45:02 <lardman> need to sort out some fundamentals first, like camera focus and Amazon "scraping£
Oct 16 18:45:08 <SpeedEvil> lardman: there is no info on the barcode
Oct 16 18:45:32 <lardman> oh, I thought you did a lookup from barcode to price/product from your webscrape?
Oct 16 18:46:39 <SpeedEvil> no. There is no barcode data on the public site. I'd just be doing it privately for the couple of dozen lines here.
Oct 16 18:47:04 <lardman> ok, np
Oct 16 18:47:14 <SpeedEvil> http://www.mauve.plus.com/output.12092009 - the basic table of data
Oct 16 18:47:42 <SpeedEvil> http://www.tesco.com/superstore/xpi/5/xpi63703795.htm
Oct 16 18:47:55 <SpeedEvil> a product page - that I haven't yet scraped down to that level
Oct 16 18:48:09 <SpeedEvil> unfortunately - the xpi6... does not seem related to the barcode
Oct 16 18:48:15 <SpeedEvil> which  I'd hoped it did.
Oct 16 18:49:03 <lardman> actually, rather than that code, there's a nearly complete app y9ou could use
Oct 16 18:49:07 <lardman> hang on a tick
Oct 16 18:49:18 <lardman> same Garage project, let me find the url
Oct 16 18:50:41 <lardman> https://garage.maemo.org/plugins/scmsvn/viewcvs.php/trunk/?root=maemo-barcode
Oct 16 18:50:41 <lardman> maemo-barcode.c should be pretty much just a 1D scanner using batoo
Oct 16 18:50:48 <lardman> should be pretty easy to modify back to plain GTK+ from Hildon
Oct 16 18:50:55 <lardman> only 1 or 2 lines I imagine
Oct 16 18:51:10 <lardman> and it has the GStreamer stuff too, reading from v4l2 src
Oct 16 18:51:33 <lardman> this directory 'twas the test cases
Oct 16 18:51:50 * lardman heads off to eat supper, bbiab
Oct 16 18:55:17 <SpeedEvil> Thanks!
Oct 16 19:06:50 <lbt> syncML on the N900 ?
Oct 16 19:06:58 <lbt> anyone know anything?
Oct 16 19:09:08 <GAN900> Anybody having weird scrolling issues in MicroB?
Oct 16 19:09:29 <fiferboy> GAN900: What kind of scrolling issue?
Oct 16 19:09:42 <penguinbait> God me and Jaffa are thanking each other, I am agreeing with GA, what has this place become?
Oct 16 19:09:44 <GAN900> I'm getting some random part of the page scrolling in whenever I scroll down
Oct 16 19:10:11 <fiferboy> GAN900: On every page?
Oct 16 19:10:12 <GAN900> Which pops back down as soon as I stop scrolling.
Oct 16 19:10:17 <GAN900> On some pages.
Oct 16 19:10:33 * frals thinks its time for "Did Your N900 Ship Today" to move to Off Topic-land
Oct 16 19:10:41 <GAN900> and I can sometimes get it to stop for a bit by zooming or scrolling in other directions.
Oct 16 19:11:26 <fiferboy> facebook has that wierd bar at the bottom and pop-in windows that act funny when scrolling
Oct 16 19:11:26 <GAN900> fiferboy, lots of weird things seem to happen to MicroB when js is involved.
Oct 16 19:11:44 <GAN900> fiferboy, been happening on Talk.
Oct 16 19:12:08 <fiferboy> GAN900: I was going to say it is probably js related.
Oct 16 19:12:14 <GAN900> I'll get a section of the page from higher up the page scrolling in.
Oct 16 19:12:29 <GAN900> Like it took a cutout and stuck it down below.
Oct 16 19:13:41 <GAN900> Ah
Oct 16 19:13:45 <GAN900> It is Js
Oct 16 19:13:47 <wirelessdreamer> anyone with a n900 in hand verify if usb host works or not?
Oct 16 19:14:16 <GAN900> It happens when I Thank a post with no Thanks and it adds a bunch of lines to the page.
Oct 16 19:14:26 <GAN900> It messes up the whole page flow.
Oct 16 19:14:49 <GAN900> So MicroB needs to be better anout reflowing when js adds stuff.
Oct 16 19:14:50 <fiferboy> GAN900: Ah.  I was going to say it wasn't happening for me.
Oct 16 19:15:03 <keesj> wirelessdreamer: not yet looked as the source code
Oct 16 19:15:09 <woglinde> re
Oct 16 19:15:52 * GAN900 hits zerojay with the idiotic PC pronoun stick.
Oct 16 19:18:43 <GAN900> timeless, ping?
Oct 16 19:22:27 <keesj> Yea!
Oct 16 19:22:48 <AndrewFBlack> GAN900, is that problem on regular Talk theme or minimalist?
Oct 16 19:25:49 <lardman> mmmmmmm
Oct 16 19:25:53 <lardman> bacon
Oct 16 19:25:55 <lardman> :)
Oct 16 19:26:46 <GAN900> AndrewFBlack, regular.
Oct 16 19:27:20 <AndrewFBlack> GAN900, K, I know my minimalist theme has some bugs with thanks maybe one day I will be able to fix them
Oct 16 19:29:24 <GAN900> MicroB bug anyway.
Oct 16 19:30:35 <Khertan_> Hi again ...
Oct 16 19:30:50 <Khertan_> Just a question, where is the place to vote for a application package
Oct 16 19:31:04 <Khertan_> it s here : http://maemo.org/packages/
Oct 16 19:31:10 <Khertan_> isn't it ?
Oct 16 19:31:50 <Khertan_> as i can't vote for anything in it. For example : http://maemo.org/packages/view/attitude/ i cannot vote
Oct 16 19:31:56 <Khertan_> is it normal ?
Oct 16 19:32:29 <Khertan_> http://maemo.org/packages/repository/qa/fremantle_extras-testing/ <<< doesn't show the homeip icon ... but package manager in n900 show it ...
Oct 16 19:32:51 <RST38h> Not normal but may be cause by some irregularity in control file
Oct 16 19:33:14 <lcuk> holy crap, claesbas did a dark maemo.org intro http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=32935
Oct 16 19:34:06 <ali1234> does the welcome video use the same format as recorded by the camera?
Oct 16 19:34:07 <RST38h> this is supposed to replaced the connecting-people thing?
Oct 16 19:34:49 <Khertan_> RST38h: i suppose the icon not in png format
Oct 16 19:34:52 <Khertan_> i use jpg
Oct 16 19:34:56 <lcuk> RST38h, it can replace or enchance.  the startup vid app allows a list
Oct 16 19:35:18 <RST38h> cooooooooool
Oct 16 19:35:18 <fiferboy> Khertan: It uses the icon field in the control file
Oct 16 19:35:24 <RST38h> Khertan that will break things
Oct 16 19:35:33 <RST38h> Why not use png?
Oct 16 19:36:16 <cvandonderen> Hmm, okay, my scratchbox-on-device is working, but now I get the error: bash: su: command not found when I want to switch user within the scratchbox
Oct 16 19:37:04 <GAN900> Anybody else getting constant network errors with AIM and Haze?
Oct 16 19:37:21 <RST38h> Yes, but with ICQ
Oct 16 19:37:24 <cvandonderen> GAN900: Haze
Oct 16 19:37:37 <RST38h> Using mobile connection?
Oct 16 19:37:39 <Khertan_> RST38h: because integrated image application doesn't want to save image in png
Oct 16 19:38:00 <RST38h> Khertan, for Tentacled's sake, don't you have a desktop PC? =)
Oct 16 19:38:10 <Khertan_> the n900 picture application save application in jpg only
Oct 16 19:38:18 <Khertan_> RST38h: héhé i'm an onboard developpers
Oct 16 19:38:37 <zerojayN900> gan900: sign out and sign in again or reboot.
Oct 16 19:38:42 <lcuk> Khertan, the imaging guy suggested that there was RAW data somewhere lurking under the surface
Oct 16 19:39:09 <Khertan_> RST38h: as it work in application manager ... it s a possibility
Oct 16 19:39:23 <RST38h> Khertan: Then install image conversion tools
Oct 16 19:39:39 <Khertan_> RST38h: yep ... but before i need to fix problem i ve right now ...
Oct 16 19:39:43 <Khertan_> tmpfs full
Oct 16 19:40:00 <Khertan_> df -h say it s 1Ko sized only
Oct 16 19:40:06 <Khertan_> seems i ve a problem
Oct 16 19:40:08 <RST38h> lcuk: raw is possible but only if they change gstreamer pipeline a little bit
Oct 16 19:41:09 <lcuk> yeah
Oct 16 19:41:33 <cvandonderen> lcuk: since you develop on-device: is there a subversion client for the N900?
Oct 16 19:41:43 <GAN900> Weird bug.
Oct 16 19:41:48 <lcuk> svn is in maemo repositories i think
Oct 16 19:41:59 <lcuk> i havent used it in ages tho
Oct 16 19:42:00 <lcuk> i use git
Oct 16 19:42:01 <lcuk> which is
Oct 16 19:42:16 <cvandonderen> lcuk: it says that the packages were referenced but don't exist anymore
Oct 16 19:42:38 <cvandonderen> blegh, not all of KDE is Git yet (as is my own server)
Oct 16 19:43:12 <cvandonderen> lcuk: git is also not in the repo...
Oct 16 19:43:45 <lcuk> cvandonderen, diablo extras
Oct 16 19:43:47 <lcuk> git-core
Oct 16 19:43:50 <zerojayN900> maybe we should rename talk to moron.maemo.org.
Oct 16 19:44:02 <cvandonderen> lcuk: fremantle :-S
Oct 16 19:44:08 <lcuk> and?
Oct 16 19:44:11 <lcuk> just add the repo
Oct 16 19:44:12 <lcuk> use it
Oct 16 19:44:14 <lcuk> remove repo
Oct 16 19:44:19 <cvandonderen> does that work?
Oct 16 19:44:34 <johnsq> cvandonderen: just test it
Oct 16 19:45:07 <lcuk> cvandonderen, ive done it every time ive reflashed now
Oct 16 19:45:21 <cvandonderen> lcuk: I cannot reflash....
Oct 16 19:45:36 <lcuk> i mean i install it the same way every time i reflash it
Oct 16 19:45:43 <lcuk> not that you have to reflash before installing it
Oct 16 19:45:45 <tripzero> what app does maemo5 use for timer/alarms?
Oct 16 19:45:48 <cvandonderen> yeah, but if something breaks I can't fix it
Oct 16 19:45:53 <lcuk> its git
Oct 16 19:46:18 <lcuk> pull the debs and install manually if you need to
Oct 16 19:46:38 <absolute> dunno, but if you need to schedule stuff i'm sure you could use crontab
Oct 16 19:47:29 <ali1234> cvandonderen: you could do the same what you've done, but on a nfs share. and then run a nice dev environment on the pc
Oct 16 19:47:44 <lcuk> cvandonderen, "subversion (v. 1.4.6-maemo1)"  is also around
Oct 16 19:47:55 <cvandonderen> ali1234: NFS is not possible from Windows
Oct 16 19:48:05 <cvandonderen> (at least it is crappy)
Oct 16 19:48:25 <ali1234> well, if you insist on using legacy OS...
Oct 16 19:48:36 <microlith> heh
Oct 16 19:48:41 <cvandonderen> ali1234: don't even start
Oct 16 19:49:04 <lcuk> ali1234, has anyone ported winxp to linux yet?
Oct 16 19:49:13 <absolute> haha
Oct 16 19:49:23 <lcuk> (i mean the window manager part only)
Oct 16 19:49:28 <absolute> oh
Oct 16 19:49:45 <lcuk> lol
Oct 16 19:49:46 <ali1234> lcuk: i run it in a VM, with all the security crap removed, and networking disabled. it's a lot faster than running it native with all AV stuff installed
Oct 16 19:50:18 <lcuk> aww your poor windows box much be lonely
Oct 16 19:50:25 <microlith> y'know, cause it might explode
Oct 16 19:50:26 <lcuk> which os have you got trapped inside a cage ?
Oct 16 19:50:34 <cvandonderen> Windows 7 is pretty cool and for KDE Windows development I need Windows ;-)
Oct 16 19:50:48 <ali1234> it's not lonely, it's lobotomized
Oct 16 19:51:12 <absolute> for its own safety
Oct 16 19:51:14 <tripzero> noone know what the app is called were you create alarms in maemo?
Oct 16 19:51:17 <lcuk> yeah what do you do with it tho
Oct 16 19:51:29 <ali1234> i run adobe software :)
Oct 16 19:51:32 <lcuk> tripzero, "alarm"
Oct 16 19:51:46 <tripzero> kk, thx
Oct 16 19:51:48 <lcuk> tripzero, do you mean gui app
Oct 16 19:51:50 <lcuk> or console
Oct 16 19:51:54 <tripzero> yes, gui
Oct 16 19:53:21 <Khertan_>  bye
Oct 16 19:53:59 <lcuk> tripzero, think its actually called worldclock then
Oct 16 19:54:10 <tripzero> ok, i'll look
Oct 16 19:57:45 <cvandonderen> What is that Couldn't access keyring error I get sometimes with fremantle extras-devel?
Oct 16 19:58:24 <tripzero> lcuk: is the src for worldclock not available?  I can't find it at garage.maemo.org
Oct 16 19:59:06 <lcuk> tripzero, i dunno. i know not all source is in the garage, but i honestly dont know which packages are open or closed
Oct 16 19:59:19 <lcuk> Stskeeps started a list off somewhere
Oct 16 19:59:23 <lcuk> i think
Oct 16 19:59:41 <fiferboy> tripzero: It was closed in diablo, it is probably still closed
Oct 16 19:59:56 <tripzero> :(
Oct 16 20:00:55 * RST38h decides to get back to Transmission
Oct 16 20:01:26 <tripzero> fiferboy: were can i find the deb package for it.  I need to find out if it uses EDS as a backend for alarms or if it implements it's own
Oct 16 20:02:01 <fiferboy> It uses alarmd for the backend, you can find API docs for that on maemo.org
Oct 16 20:02:07 <tripzero> kk
Oct 16 20:02:27 <RST38h> Gentlemen, anyone else ever looked at Transmission sources?
Oct 16 20:03:31 <wazd_> http://media.boygeniusreport.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/10/android-16.jpg <- camera icon fails :)
Oct 16 20:03:58 <RST38h> wazd: Is this what I think this is?
Oct 16 20:04:09 <wazd_> RST38h: no :P
Oct 16 20:04:20 <RST38h> ufff
Oct 16 20:04:23 <lcuk> RST38h, qwerty
Oct 16 20:04:31 <wazd_> RST38h: it's Android 2.0 UI
Oct 16 20:04:44 <RST38h> lcuk: qwerty does not know why it hangs the whole system
Oct 16 20:04:59 <wazd_> Shutter in front of the lens is a fail :)
Oct 16 20:05:02 <RST38h> lcuk: I have some ideas but need someone to show me the main loop
Oct 16 20:05:53 <lcuk> is it all the time
Oct 16 20:05:59 <lcuk> or under specific pressure
Oct 16 20:07:42 <RST38h> lcuk: All the time it is transferring something
Oct 16 20:08:04 <lcuk> sniff the wire
Oct 16 20:08:19 <lcuk> i can do it with ease from windows :D
Oct 16 20:08:33 <RST38h> it is not the network
Oct 16 20:09:10 <lcuk> teleportation?
Oct 16 20:09:22 <lcuk> telekinetics?
Oct 16 20:09:28 <lcuk> OOB experience?
Oct 16 20:09:30 <RST38h> something makes a lot of kernel calls, apparently non-blocking read() or something similar
Oct 16 20:09:38 <lcuk> ahh
Oct 16 20:10:40 <lcuk> does it still do it with no file?
Oct 16 20:10:49 <lcuk> errr torrent
Oct 16 20:11:31 <hrw|gone> hi all
Oct 16 20:11:33 <johnsq> RST38h: vmstat -n 1
Oct 16 20:13:26 <RST38h> johnsq: I will try
Oct 16 20:13:46 <RST38h> no vmstat on Maemo
Oct 16 20:13:59 <hrw> RST38h: many things are not present in maemo
Oct 16 20:14:31 <RST38h> Hello, Cpt Obvious :)
Oct 16 20:14:36 <hrw> ;d
Oct 16 20:15:45 <slonopotamus> biggest maemo fail is absence of compatibility with upstream
Oct 16 20:15:59 <hrw> slonopotamus: define upstream
Oct 16 20:16:15 <hrw> slonopotamus: and do not use word "Debian" please
Oct 16 20:16:58 <slonopotamus> hrw, why not? debian, gtk
Oct 16 20:17:17 <johnsq> slonopotamus: hi. bluetooth working, diablo-sources compiled and working, but no flasher ebuild :(
Oct 16 20:18:14 <slonopotamus> johnsq, i think you want to try booting kernel without flashing it first
Oct 16 20:19:09 <johnsq> slonopotamus: too much work, this seems only working with flasher-3.5
Oct 16 20:19:31 <hrw> johnsq: tried 0xffff instead of nokia flasher?
Oct 16 20:21:10 <johnsq> hrw: no fiasco-flasher from rootfs
Oct 16 20:21:23 <hrw> ah... I forgot about that one
Oct 16 20:21:40 <hrw> johnsq: trying to make hildonized gentoo?
Oct 16 20:22:09 <johnsq> hrw: no i don't want this incompatible awefull piece of code
Oct 16 20:22:40 <slonopotamus> hehe
Oct 16 20:23:29 <hrw> johnsq: you mean hildon? :D
Oct 16 20:23:53 <johnsq> hrw: sure
Oct 16 20:24:28 * hrw -> sleep
Oct 16 20:24:43 <hrw> have to think about n900 - to buy or not
Oct 16 20:25:06 <johnsq> hrw|gone: dream about getting one :)
Oct 16 20:25:14 * SpComb twiddles spotify on his N810
Oct 16 20:25:34 <SpComb> a bit laggy
Oct 16 20:25:47 <hrw|gone> johnsq: I do not dream about such things
Oct 16 20:25:49 <SpComb> ...but I guess most software is when run over remote-X over a WLAN :)
Oct 16 20:26:04 <SpComb> sure to confuse the heck out of anyone, showing them a working spotify on maemo
Oct 16 20:26:15 <hrw|gone> johnsq: I wrote what I think in t.m.o thread
Oct 16 20:26:18 <hrw|gone> bye
Oct 16 20:26:23 <SpComb> it's kind of convenient, but it lacks all the multi-user stuff like mocp has
Oct 16 20:28:41 * javispedro glances at n900 is for girls thread
Oct 16 20:31:22 * lcuk notices javispedro is wearing a rather fetching dress today
Oct 16 20:31:27 <lcuk> it matches your handbag
Oct 16 20:32:04 <javispedro> ... with my Nxx0 inside.
Oct 16 20:32:58 <javispedro> hiyo pupnik
Oct 16 20:33:05 <javispedro> enjoying your n900? :P
Oct 16 20:35:13 <lcuk> haha
Oct 16 20:35:19 <lcuk> and his high heels
Oct 16 20:35:21 <GAN900> javispedro, you get a code?
Oct 16 20:35:30 <javispedro> GAN900: yep, moments ago in fact.
Oct 16 20:35:34 <GAN900> Cool
Oct 16 20:35:46 <javispedro> expected, I have around 300 karma iirc.
Oct 16 20:36:16 <woglinde> SpComb I ported qtnx it is in devel-extras so you have better roundtrip times
Oct 16 20:36:47 <lcuk> RST38h, can you run it on a full debugger
Oct 16 20:36:52 <lcuk> does such a thing exist
Oct 16 20:37:14 <javispedro> woglinde: woulnd't you know of a "mini" NX server? (for the client/server protocol, not the nx protocol)
Oct 16 20:37:25 <javispedro> I mean, FreeNX from Ubuntu is there but has a lot of deps.
Oct 16 20:38:38 <javispedro> Hm. Google made one. Cool.
Oct 16 20:39:30 <woglinde> javis yes but it doesnt support yet all options
Oct 16 20:39:50 <javispedro> better than having to remember the nxagent cmd line args.
Oct 16 20:39:52 <woglinde> javis hm the ubuntu dont take so much if you only install the minimal requirements
Oct 16 20:40:13 <woglinde> javis or you might test x2go
Oct 16 20:40:25 <woglinde> they are using nx-libs too
Oct 16 20:40:31 <woglinde> but have there own server and clients
Oct 16 20:40:36 <javispedro> hum. ta
Oct 16 20:40:51 <javispedro> but it follows its own protocol I guess.
Oct 16 20:41:27 <javispedro> s/protocol/session protocol
Oct 16 20:41:54 <woglinde> javis as I said they are using the nxlibs too
Oct 16 20:42:17 <woglinde> only pitty the normal nxclient dont work with their  server
Oct 16 20:42:26 <javispedro> thats the problem
Oct 16 20:42:27 <woglinde> but they have a nxclient for the nxx's too
Oct 16 20:42:42 <javispedro> actually I want the server in the nxx
Oct 16 20:42:43 <woglinde> and all other major archs too
Oct 16 20:42:54 <woglinde> ?????
Oct 16 20:43:01 <woglinde> oh my good
Oct 16 20:43:24 <javispedro> lenny chroot + xfce + nx server on n810 is usable...
Oct 16 20:43:44 <javispedro> only missing is "easy of use", currently I have to bootup both the server and client by hand each time.
Oct 16 20:46:33 <woglinde> make a startscript
Oct 16 20:46:37 <pupnik> yes javispedro
Oct 16 20:46:39 <woglinde> shouldnt be that hard
Oct 16 20:46:58 <javispedro> woglinde: touché. blinded by trying to do it the proper way I guess :)
Oct 16 20:47:10 <javispedro> pupnik: :)
Oct 16 20:47:18 <javispedro> pupnik: how is the keyboard for gaming?
Oct 16 20:47:20 <pupnik> i think we could wrap sdl windows into clutter bitmaps yes?
Oct 16 20:47:39 <javispedro> yesterday I downloaded clutter source for first time so I have to say "dunno".
Oct 16 20:47:53 <lcuk> it does by default doesnt it
Oct 16 20:47:56 <lcuk> or rather, via x11
Oct 16 20:48:08 <pupnik> get a snapshot of in-game screen going in app overview
Oct 16 20:48:17 <javispedro> hm.
Oct 16 20:48:21 <javispedro> that should happen already
Oct 16 20:48:29 <lcuk> liqbase isnt composited
Oct 16 20:48:34 <lcuk> and needs that capability soon
Oct 16 20:48:36 <javispedro> hm.
Oct 16 20:48:44 <javispedro> pupnik: tried windowed drnoksnes?
Oct 16 20:48:44 <pupnik> can i use n900 as usb networking brouter for laptop?
Oct 16 20:48:48 <lcuk> YUVbitmap->x11 pixmap
Oct 16 20:48:56 <javispedro> both windowed drnoksnes and windowed vgba should be composited.
Oct 16 20:49:05 <woodong50> n810 can not use maemo5?
Oct 16 20:49:24 <javispedro> woodong50: the answer is still on this channel's topic
Oct 16 20:49:24 <johnsq> pupnik: how without usb host or otg?
Oct 16 20:49:35 <andre__> so, installing a desktop statusbar widget in fremantle, i assume that running gtk-update-icon-cache is still needed?
Oct 16 20:49:35 * andre__ trying to update older bug reports
Oct 16 20:49:47 <lcuk> johnsq, usb networking from laptop into tablet
Oct 16 20:49:53 <lcuk> then 3g internet out
Oct 16 20:50:02 <lcuk> i see what hes asking, i just dont know if its possible
Oct 16 20:50:07 <javispedro> doesn't it have internet sharing mode?
Oct 16 20:50:07 <lcuk> tethering?
Oct 16 20:50:12 <javispedro> ^^ that :)
Oct 16 20:50:23 <javispedro> i'd say it should be easy enough.
Oct 16 20:50:27 <lcuk> yeah
Oct 16 20:50:31 <javispedro> if usbnet and iptables are avail.
Oct 16 20:50:34 <lcuk> even if from just a silly port80 proxy basis
Oct 16 20:50:43 <javispedro> yeah, that may be even easier.
Oct 16 20:51:26 * javispedro ponders 300€ n900...
Oct 16 20:51:39 <javispedro> well, I did say I wouldn't buy it until it reached that pricepoint... so...
Oct 16 20:52:11 <javispedro> lol. I had convinced myself to wait and now I have to convince myself otherwise.
Oct 16 20:53:52 <Stskeeps> hehe
Oct 16 20:54:03 <Stskeeps> you had enough karma?
Oct 16 20:54:08 <javispedro> yep  :D
Oct 16 20:55:08 <absolute> yeah, my pre-order is still in... haha, i'm so far behind the times... my e62 was a mistake for many reasons, but i busted the charging pin and the rubberband/stripped wire doesn't charge it anymore... my cam is 2.1mpx from 1999... my zen broke... no gps yet... no eee or tablet of any sort... it is definitely time for me
Oct 16 20:55:23 <Stskeeps> i am torn between what to do with my loan device and prospect of a device i can call my own..
Oct 16 20:55:43 <javispedro> btw, I've been thinking of some project lately: codesourcery windows toolchain + qt 4.6 armel libs + qt creator = windows sdk (not packaging).
Oct 16 20:56:14 <javispedro> (_without_ sbox)
Oct 16 20:56:21 <woglinde> javis *g*
Oct 16 20:56:57 <javispedro> i've been wondering around forum nokia and it's like the setup they use for symbian sdk.
Oct 16 20:57:03 <javispedro> only they have an emulator in symbian sdk...
Oct 16 20:58:02 <javispedro> Stskeeps: yours is 6 month or 1 year?
Oct 16 20:58:16 <javispedro> in 1 year n900' price might have actually drop down so much.
Oct 16 20:58:22 <javispedro> in 6 months... IMHO, no.
Oct 16 20:58:53 <javispedro> ("so much" => i'm in europe ;) )
Oct 16 20:59:05 <ShadowJK> I asked this elsewhere too....
Oct 16 20:59:09 <ShadowJK> What's up with headphone ports on top?
Oct 16 20:59:32 <ShadowJK> when I take phone out of pocket it's upside down as a result
Oct 16 20:59:37 <Stskeeps> javispedro: 6
Oct 16 20:59:47 <ShadowJK> and having both headphones and power connected at same time makes it even sillier :/
Oct 16 20:59:58 <javispedro> so it all depends on wheter qgil promises dev program will last through next year.
Oct 16 21:00:28 <GAN900> Why torn, Stskeeps?
Oct 16 21:00:35 <javispedro> as for myself... so far I think I'll get it. not this month though.
Oct 16 21:00:37 <woglinde> javis I would like to see the numbers how many it will buy for 500 euros
Oct 16 21:00:59 <GAN900> Use the loaner as yours, let the wiff use the discounted one. :P
Oct 16 21:01:05 <javispedro> woglinde: it all depends on "when"
Oct 16 21:01:12 <Stskeeps> javispedro: issue is really if i should keep it as developer device, pass it on to a needy developer, or what to do..
Oct 16 21:01:32 <Stskeeps> GAN900: she does actually want one
Oct 16 21:01:38 <woglinde> lets see if my company will buy some
Oct 16 21:02:42 <javispedro> Stskeeps: hard decision then, but if you plan to stay here I'd say you'd "enjoy" having a n900 when the 6 months pass by...
Oct 16 21:02:53 <javispedro> s/pass by/come around
Oct 16 21:03:03 <Stskeeps> true
Oct 16 21:03:55 <javispedro> in fact, you and most of maemo.org would enjoy you having a n900 then ;)
Oct 16 21:04:00 <woglinde> early adaptors lalalalala
Oct 16 21:04:44 <javispedro> lalalalalal can't hear you lalalalala
Oct 16 21:04:48 <javispedro> ;P
Oct 16 21:05:05 * RST38h moos again
Oct 16 21:05:13 <javispedro> hi RST38h
Oct 16 21:05:21 <RST38h> Anyone knows an easy way to access proximity sensor?
Oct 16 21:05:31 <RST38h> Heya javis, wanna power-saving hint?
Oct 16 21:05:33 <javispedro> how's the emus going? still banging omapfb directly?
Oct 16 21:05:38 <javispedro> RST38h, why not?
Oct 16 21:05:56 <javispedro> i'm considering ditching sdl and going your way (gtk + omapfb)
Oct 16 21:06:11 <RST38h> javis: well, I bang fb0 when in full screen mode. It works. And an hour ago, I managed to fully cut off power consumption when inactive
Oct 16 21:06:26 <RST38h> Mine isn't really omapfb any more, just plain fb0
Oct 16 21:06:38 <javispedro> too many bugs in hgw, plus zeemote lib requiring glib also may "help" me choose gtk
Oct 16 21:07:05 <RST38h> javis: Anyways, in order to completely freeze things, wait for focus-out on your app window
Oct 16 21:07:13 <javispedro> RST38h: i found out hgw has a provision for powersaving that consists in blocking in dbus receive call
Oct 16 21:07:18 <javispedro> up to a second only, tho.
Oct 16 21:07:23 <RST38h> javis: then shut down sound, stop any timers you are using to sync (setitimer and friends)
Oct 16 21:07:31 <javispedro> well, up to two seconds if you add system+session busses.
Oct 16 21:08:02 <RST38h> javis: and do gtk_main_loop_iteration() in a while loop until focus returns
Oct 16 21:08:22 <Khertan__> hi again
Oct 16 21:08:23 <javispedro> RST38h: ah, you're making me remember why game devs don't choose gtk ;P
Oct 16 21:08:32 <RST38h> javis: this will nicely block until focus returns
Oct 16 21:08:37 <RST38h> javis: come one, gtk is ok
Oct 16 21:08:46 <RST38h> javis: you wrap it away and it is fine
Oct 16 21:08:54 <Khertan__> homeip is available in extras-testing
Oct 16 21:09:06 <RST38h> Seen it =)
Oct 16 21:09:13 <Khertan__> py2deb is availale in extras testing
Oct 16 21:09:19 <javispedro> it would help me solve "the input problem" in dosbox (the international one, not the focus one)
Oct 16 21:09:41 <javispedro> sigh I want my opengles 2 book.
Oct 16 21:10:01 <woglinde> *g*
Oct 16 21:10:21 <RST38h> javis: Look at my EMULib source code if you decide to use Gtk based framework
Oct 16 21:10:34 <woglinde> javis why not qt?
Oct 16 21:10:44 <RST38h> javis: (the only things you really need from gtk is event loop and a GtkImage)
Oct 16 21:10:52 <Khertan__> modest on n900 have a nicer ui ... but still not useable with gmail
Oct 16 21:11:02 * RST38h though gmail was ok?
Oct 16 21:11:06 <woglinde> re pupnik
Oct 16 21:11:15 <RST38h> Nowadays, it is only pop3 that is screwed isn't it?
Oct 16 21:11:16 <Khertan__> no email retrieved since 5 days
Oct 16 21:11:23 <javispedro> woglinde: no answer, really. I have nearly the same experience with both (one app = 3 o 4 dialogs = 24 hours work) ;)
Oct 16 21:11:24 <RST38h> probably hung
Oct 16 21:11:29 <Khertan__> i use imap
Oct 16 21:11:39 <woglinde> javis hu?????
Oct 16 21:11:45 <RST38h> yea, gmail is imap and it seems to work so far
Oct 16 21:11:57 <Khertan__> i ve restart the n900 since
Oct 16 21:12:07 <javispedro> woglinde: that I don't have any real reason to prefer gtk over qt right now.
Oct 16 21:12:07 <RST38h> you can also kill modest hanging in memory
Oct 16 21:12:14 <javispedro> woglinde: so if you have any reason for qt... (not futuristic ;) )
Oct 16 21:12:25 <woglinde> javis qt-designer
Oct 16 21:12:37 <RST38h> woglinde: anyone seriously using that?
Oct 16 21:12:41 <woglinde> yes me
Oct 16 21:12:48 <GAN900> Khertan_!
Oct 16 21:12:50 <wazd_> VDVsx: ping? :)
Oct 16 21:12:50 <javispedro> I have to say that from all gui designers, qt-designer is best, hands down.
Oct 16 21:12:51 <woglinde> needed some time to figure some stuff out
Oct 16 21:12:58 <GAN900> Give me your secrets!
Oct 16 21:12:58 <javispedro> still, it's an automated gui designer.
Oct 16 21:12:58 <woglinde> but now its cool
Oct 16 21:13:04 <woglinde> I only make the .ui
Oct 16 21:13:17 * lcuk coughs and compares it to vb and still finds it complex
Oct 16 21:13:17 <woglinde> and can use this in my python proggie
Oct 16 21:13:27 <Khertan__> GAN900 ?
Oct 16 21:13:32 <javispedro> lcuk: yes :(
Oct 16 21:13:38 <lcuk> it needs streamlining
Oct 16 21:13:48 <lcuk> and specific tablet oriented project types
Oct 16 21:13:56 <lcuk> with full packaging etc included
Oct 16 21:13:57 <GAN900> Khertan_, how'd you get tab, etc working?
Oct 16 21:14:00 <javispedro> every tutorial I've following forces me to create custom widgets.
Oct 16 21:14:04 <javispedro> s/following/followed
Oct 16 21:14:13 <lcuk> so someone can walk up and create a qt app quickly and easily for maemo
Oct 16 21:14:32 <javispedro> but I want to do it the ugly way and just put the whole app logic in the form itself >:)
Oct 16 21:14:33 <Khertan__> GAN900	tabs for what ?
Oct 16 21:14:36 <woglinde> lcuk feel free to send in a mameo template
Oct 16 21:14:45 <lcuk> woglinde, it needs more than a template
Oct 16 21:14:55 <lcuk> it needs to communicate with the build process properly
Oct 16 21:14:55 <javispedro> lcuk: tried qt creator?
Oct 16 21:14:57 <woglinde> would be a first step
Oct 16 21:14:57 <javispedro> try it.
Oct 16 21:15:01 <lcuk> and debug etc
Oct 16 21:15:04 <woglinde> javis he did
Oct 16 21:15:10 <lcuk> i am talking about creator lol ;)
Oct 16 21:15:12 <javispedro> a.
Oct 16 21:15:18 <javispedro> designer != creator though.
Oct 16 21:15:18 <lcuk> i was speaking to one of the devs at the summit
Oct 16 21:15:25 <lcuk> o_O then lol
Oct 16 21:15:30 <lcuk> is it better ? :D
Oct 16 21:15:40 <woglinde> designer is only for gui
Oct 16 21:15:43 <javispedro> designer is for gui only. it does not even touch code.
Oct 16 21:15:44 <Khertan__>  tabulation in irc ? on webchat ? i did use it :)
Oct 16 21:15:46 <woglinde> creator makes more
Oct 16 21:16:14 <lcuk> haha javispedro even closer to my current use of vb
Oct 16 21:16:20 <lcuk> load up vb, make standard forms
Oct 16 21:16:23 <lcuk> click export
Oct 16 21:16:24 <Khertan__> but tab is available at fn+sym
Oct 16 21:16:46 <Khertan__> s/did/didn't
Oct 16 21:17:00 <javispedro> i found qt creator nice. a bit on the "trivial" side though.
Oct 16 21:17:17 <javispedro> (not really much featured... I mean)
Oct 16 21:18:17 <lcuk> well creator includes designer, so we are still on same page
Oct 16 21:18:20 <javispedro> still, I'm gonna keep with gtk, just because I'm going to use it as a x11 wrapper and that's about it, thus no need to keep the libs loaded.
Oct 16 21:18:29 <Khertan__> really, modest works four day with gmail and now it doesn t retrieve anymore new mail ... strange
Oct 16 21:18:30 <woglinde> lcuk hm right
Oct 16 21:18:32 <lcuk> from technical basis it works, it just doesnt get a project to this side easily enough
Oct 16 21:18:41 <Khertan__> noone really use it in imap
Oct 16 21:18:53 * lcuk never uses email from mobile
Oct 16 21:19:27 <javispedro> lcuk: but qt creator comes "near" the VB dream. "double click" on a button in a form to edit "command1_clicked()" code nearly works.
Oct 16 21:19:37 <lcuk> "nearly"
Oct 16 21:19:49 <lcuk> it actually asks to rename the object from the quick look i did
Oct 16 21:20:00 <javispedro> nearly= it's not double click, but rather right click, go to slot....
Oct 16 21:20:09 <lcuk> select slot
Oct 16 21:20:15 <javispedro> but it opens the code editor and fills in the headers.
Oct 16 21:20:16 <lcuk> get error message couldnt find xyz
Oct 16 21:20:20 <lcuk> not for me :D
Oct 16 21:20:28 <lcuk> i am trying again later
Oct 16 21:20:31 <javispedro> maybe you were using beta :P ?
Oct 16 21:20:34 <Khertan__> haha lcuk
Oct 16 21:20:40 <Khertan__> i say the same things
Oct 16 21:20:49 <lcuk> i wouldnt mind looking at whether i can parse qt .ui files and produce a liq* layout
Oct 16 21:20:52 <lcuk> lol
Oct 16 21:21:01 <pupnik_> hmm xchat on n900 lagging badly
Oct 16 21:21:08 <lcuk> javispedro, i redownloaded from qt today
Oct 16 21:21:24 <javispedro> lcuk: dunno, i am just opening a new project..
Oct 16 21:21:36 <pupnik_> last thing i saw is RST38h: "Nowadays, it is only pop3 that is screwed, isn't it?"
Oct 16 21:21:38 <lcuk> tis ok
Oct 16 21:21:41 <lcuk> its prolly the old one
Oct 16 21:21:46 <lcuk> i just went on their site and grabbed
Oct 16 21:21:54 <ShadowJK> pupnik: scrolled uo?
Oct 16 21:21:54 <javispedro> lcuk: drag pushbutton from toolbox into form,
Oct 16 21:21:57 <ShadowJK> up
Oct 16 21:22:00 <javispedro> right click push button,
Oct 16 21:22:01 <Khertan__> pupnik use webchat
Oct 16 21:22:04 <javispedro> go to slot...
Oct 16 21:22:07 <lcuk> http://qt.nokia.com/downloads/downloads#lgpl
Oct 16 21:22:10 <javispedro> "clicked()"
Oct 16 21:22:14 <javispedro> and it opens the code editor.
Oct 16 21:22:15 <javispedro> no errors.
Oct 16 21:22:15 <pupnik_> nope
Oct 16 21:22:16 <andre__> pupnik, xchat on n900 is really BAD. also tried it
Oct 16 21:22:17 <Khertan__> works well on the n900 browser
Oct 16 21:22:21 <lcuk> javispedro, good
Oct 16 21:22:27 <pupnik_> ah ok ty
Oct 16 21:22:34 <lcuk> where you grab from, i would gladly gladly do again
Oct 16 21:22:43 <pupnik_> back to my friend irssi which works everywhere the same
Oct 16 21:22:56 * ShadowJK imagines webchat uses lots more battery...
Oct 16 21:22:59 <pupnik_> but xchat has some nice finger optimization work in network list - take a look at it
Oct 16 21:23:22 <javispedro> lcuk: from that page O.o
Oct 16 21:23:56 <javispedro> so I dunno whats going on on your install :P
Oct 16 21:24:38 * javispedro dislikes the animation on qt creator when you click on a }
Oct 16 21:27:17 <pupnik_> you are using qt creator in scratchbox?
Oct 16 21:27:18 <lcuk> ahhhh
Oct 16 21:27:20 <lcuk> ahhhhhhhh
Oct 16 21:27:22 <lcuk> said the blind man
Oct 16 21:27:24 <pupnik_> or that sits outside scratchbox?
Oct 16 21:27:34 <javispedro> pupnik, so far, non-maemo qt creator.
Oct 16 21:27:44 <GAN900> Khertan_, I heard you had managed to do some keyboard layout gymnastics at the Summit. My experimentations have been fruitless so fars so I was hoping you vould enlighten me.
Oct 16 21:27:49 <lcuk> "file new"      "qt designer form"    dialog blah blah
Oct 16 21:27:53 <javispedro> but I think it "outside sbox" qt creator may be doable.
Oct 16 21:28:05 <lcuk> right click on the dialog ok/cancel buttons goto slot
Oct 16 21:28:12 <lcuk> accepted
Oct 16 21:28:16 <lcuk> moans about missing file
Oct 16 21:28:19 <lcuk> now i see why..
Oct 16 21:28:42 <woglinde> lcuk why?
Oct 16 21:28:55 <javispedro> lol here too.
Oct 16 21:29:00 <lcuk> because i added a designer form only
Oct 16 21:29:02 <javispedro> the problem is within the dialog template I guess.
Oct 16 21:29:06 <lcuk> i just redid it with a project
Oct 16 21:29:11 <lcuk> and it does as you describe
Oct 16 21:29:18 <Khertan__> going to sleep
Oct 16 21:29:19 <Khertan__> bye
Oct 16 21:29:20 <lcuk> works and opens code
Oct 16 21:29:34 <javispedro> bye Khertan
Oct 16 21:29:36 <javispedro> ouch.
Oct 16 21:30:07 <lcuk> so it lets you create ui stuff without a project - i am guessing this was the original use of qt-designer now
Oct 16 21:30:25 <javispedro> if i add to an existing project a new "dialog", and try to "goto slot" it complains about missing ui_dialog.h file.
Oct 16 21:30:44 <javispedro> it should know enough to try to build that file..
Oct 16 21:31:05 <pupnik_> :|
Oct 16 21:31:06 * RST38h is still looking for a proximity sensor example. Any good samaritans?
Oct 16 21:31:16 <lcuk> RST38h, source for q3
Oct 16 21:31:26 <RST38h> (btw, you give me that code, you get quake-style fire button in VGBA)
Oct 16 21:31:26 <lcuk> unless its being huddled
Oct 16 21:31:29 <RST38h> lcuk: Where?
Oct 16 21:31:32 <javispedro> ah sorry, my fault. in the "new" dialog you have to choose "dialog with class" or either it won't have a .cpp file to "edit" for you ;)
Oct 16 21:31:34 * lcuk shrugs
Oct 16 21:31:40 <lcuk> they showed it at summit didnt they
Oct 16 21:31:46 <RST38h> yea
Oct 16 21:31:51 <RST38h> it is in the Extras too
Oct 16 21:32:00 <javispedro> RST38h: interesting. how's that fire button? :)
Oct 16 21:32:30 <RST38h> javis: The quake3 Nokia guys made for n900 uses proximity sensor as the fire button. You close it with your finger and fire away
Oct 16 21:32:46 <RST38h> javis: I think it is neat and will go well with accelerometer controls
Oct 16 21:32:59 <javispedro> interesting way to gain an extra hard button
Oct 16 21:33:04 <javispedro> "hard" lol
Oct 16 21:33:05 <RST38h> aha, it is in the MCE.
Oct 16 21:33:15 <RST38h> But I would like to know the sysfs entry
Oct 16 21:33:19 <lcuk> yeah novel hack :)
Oct 16 21:33:25 <lcuk> cant play in the dark tho
Oct 16 21:33:39 <RST38h> ehhehe, it can, as long as you have unlimited amount of ammo
Oct 16 21:33:46 <lcuk> haha
Oct 16 21:33:51 <woglinde> lol
Oct 16 21:34:17 <lcuk> ok javispedro so it will do as you said
Oct 16 21:34:34 <lcuk> i am still curious how to get this over to tablet
Oct 16 21:35:45 <javispedro> first step would be to get the codesourcey windows toolchain working (if it exists! lol)
Oct 16 21:36:31 <lcuk> isnt there a qt single lib
Oct 16 21:36:36 <ShadowJK> why not in the dark?
Oct 16 21:36:41 <lcuk> that it can be built against directly on device
Oct 16 21:36:41 <javispedro> qt single lib?
Oct 16 21:36:55 <lcuk> ShadowJK, its based on light isnt it?
Oct 16 21:37:00 <lcuk> or is proximity something else
Oct 16 21:37:03 <javispedro> or infrared.
Oct 16 21:37:19 <ShadowJK> lcuk: yeah but there's an emitter there too?
Oct 16 21:37:24 <ShadowJK> infrared light
Oct 16 21:37:31 <lcuk> o_O cool
Oct 16 21:38:20 <greenfly> noticing a strange issue with the maemo 5 xterm when connecting to a remote screen session
Oct 16 21:38:24 <woglinde> lcuk single?
Oct 16 21:38:25 <greenfly> seems to just... stall
Oct 16 21:38:56 <greenfly> keystrokes seem to get across (when I re-attach from a different host I can see them) but it's like it stops updating the maemo5 xterm
Oct 16 21:38:59 <lcuk> woglinde, ill have a double tonight thx
Oct 16 21:39:13 <trbs> is it possible to get the widgets in the scratchbox ( xephyr ) for fremental transparent?
Oct 16 21:39:35 <woglinde> lcuk there is QtCore
Oct 16 21:39:35 <RST38h> fremental is a novel spelling
Oct 16 21:39:38 <RST38h> have not seen it
Oct 16 21:40:14 <javispedro> fremental. ok. lmao.
Oct 16 21:40:16 <lcuk> woglinde, at the summit i heard about qt single lib
Oct 16 21:40:56 <woglinde> lcuk a big fat one?
Oct 16 21:41:12 * javispedro notes another spanish maemo fanboy site.
Oct 16 21:41:15 <lcuk> yeah why not
Oct 16 21:41:20 <woglinde> okay one epsiode of naruto and than bed
Oct 16 21:41:39 <javispedro> this one way more cult than the other ones at least, making proper references to omap2 3d drivers.
Oct 16 21:41:43 <lcuk> bbiab code bein more annoyin
Oct 16 21:42:14 <RST38h> All righty!
Oct 16 21:42:24 * RST38h further lowered CPU load
Oct 16 21:42:34 <javispedro> lol.
Oct 16 21:42:38 <javispedro> it should _block_!
Oct 16 21:42:40 <javispedro> 0 load.
Oct 16 21:43:01 <Stskeeps> select()?
Oct 16 21:43:21 <RST38h> It does block
Oct 16 21:43:34 <RST38h> It now blocks when waiting for a key (real or virtual)
Oct 16 21:43:41 <Stskeeps> also, the device programme thread has caused me to give up hope in humanity.
Oct 16 21:43:48 <RST38h> It now blocks when it is ready to show a frame
Oct 16 21:44:01 <javispedro> do you have cycles to spare? O.o
Oct 16 21:44:01 <RST38h> Sts: whining freeloaders, all of them?
Oct 16 21:44:08 <RST38h> I do, javis!
Oct 16 21:44:11 * RST38h is a miser
Oct 16 21:44:22 <javispedro> what emu? O.o
Oct 16 21:44:35 <RST38h> Finally, it now blocks completely when you move it to background
Oct 16 21:44:52 <RST38h> javis: testing on VGBA, but they will all act like this in the next release
Oct 16 21:45:17 <javispedro> but but but.
Oct 16 21:45:31 <javispedro> did I grasp this well? think not.
Oct 16 21:45:38 <VDVsx> Stskeeps, S/humanity/TMO :P
Oct 16 21:45:45 <RST38h> javis: What?
Oct 16 21:46:05 <javispedro> what are you doing? powersaving when the user is not "there",
Oct 16 21:46:17 * RST38h quietly sends a note to the Tentacled one to queue up half of t.m.o membership for dinner
Oct 16 21:46:19 <javispedro> or powersaving while the emulator is actually running?
Oct 16 21:46:36 <RST38h> javis: Well, several things
Oct 16 21:47:06 <RST38h> javis: #1: When EFF_SAVECPU option is in effect and the emulator window goes into background for whatever reason, I block now.
Oct 16 21:47:10 <GAN900> Stskeeps, meh, it's like 4 people. :P
Oct 16 21:47:24 <javispedro> ok, #1 is same as you requested to me too.
Oct 16 21:47:28 <RST38h> javis: #2: When MCE sends me INACTIVE notification, I *always* block
Oct 16 21:47:38 <javispedro> ah.
Oct 16 21:47:53 <RST38h> javis: #3: When emulator prepares a frame, but the 60fps timer has not ticked yet, I block.
Oct 16 21:47:54 <greenfly> is this channel more aimed toward development? I can take my user-level question to a different channel if there's a more appropriate one
Oct 16 21:48:02 <javispedro> Stskeeps: just wait, a few more threads about that are on the making ;)
Oct 16 21:48:18 <RST38h> javis: And finally #4: When waiting for a keypress or mouse (WaitKey() in EMULib) I also block
Oct 16 21:48:25 <javispedro> greenfly: this can be a user channel, but please google your question a bit before asking.
Oct 16 21:48:26 <Stskeeps> greenfly: asking is better
Oct 16 21:48:26 <RST38h> greenfly: Shoot
Oct 16 21:48:40 <greenfly> javispedro: done a lot of googling already
Oct 16 21:48:43 <RST38h> But yes, do google or we may ask you to unask your question
Oct 16 21:48:55 <frals> a good unask is nice
Oct 16 21:49:04 <greenfly> sure, I give you permission to flame me if you can find the answer in a quick google search
Oct 16 21:49:20 <javispedro> RST38h: ah, #4 only blocks if emulated cpu is paused (you're on the onscreen gui, etc.)
Oct 16 21:49:33 <RST38h> javis: Yea.
Oct 16 21:49:34 <greenfly> I'm noticing when I connect to a remote screen session over ssh in the xterm, the local xterm seems to stall and stop showing updates
Oct 16 21:49:44 <javispedro> actually #3 is on drnoksnes but of course only certain parts of sm world actually get enough speed to sleep.
Oct 16 21:49:48 <RST38h> greenfly: Correct
Oct 16 21:49:56 <greenfly> from the testing I've done the keypresses seem to get through
Oct 16 21:49:57 <RST38h> greenfly: It is the result of the tablet WiFi saving power
Oct 16 21:50:26 <RST38h> greenfly: You can actually go to wifi connection Advanced Config and turn off the power saving. This will make ssh more responsive
Oct 16 21:50:29 <greenfly> why does that affect screen sessions but not regular interactive shells?
Oct 16 21:50:37 <RST38h> greenfly: Your device will eat batteries like crazy though
Oct 16 21:50:39 * ShadowJK hasn't noticed this
Oct 16 21:50:59 <RST38h> greenfly: It affects everything. Screen may just transfer more data before it shows you anything
Oct 16 21:51:26 <RST38h> ShadowJK: Well, latest firmware we have got (41.10?) is way better on this
Oct 16 21:51:35 <RST38h> ShadowJK: But still does it
Oct 16 21:51:39 <javispedro> actually, as for the tmo thread, qgil is pretty good following what's going on in maemo. can't complain.
Oct 16 21:51:42 <wazd_> gnite maemo
Oct 16 21:51:47 <greenfly> let me try that. thanks for the help :)
Oct 16 21:51:48 <javispedro> he's 100% right on his last post.
Oct 16 21:51:51 <RST38h> wazd: good night...
Oct 16 21:51:51 <javispedro> wazd_: gnite!
Oct 16 21:52:00 <ShadowJK> rst38h: oh on N8x0 I mean
Oct 16 21:52:40 <RST38h> ShadowJK: Ah! N8x0 is way better on this
Oct 16 21:52:52 <javispedro> uh.
Oct 16 21:52:53 <RST38h> ShadowJK: N8x0 will STILL hiccup every now and then though
Oct 16 21:53:03 <pupnik_> interesting
Oct 16 21:53:11 <KMFDM> is there any way to get the phone to accept an expired 802.1x cert?
Oct 16 21:53:23 <RST38h> set the clock back?
Oct 16 21:53:25 <KMFDM> my school decided they are too lazy to update their cert that expired in 2008
Oct 16 21:53:34 <javispedro> KMFDM: blame your school.
Oct 16 21:53:39 <javispedro> I went on a personal rampage on mine
Oct 16 21:53:42 <javispedro> and got an updated cert.
Oct 16 21:53:52 <RST38h> how many casualties?
Oct 16 21:54:04 <ShadowJK> rst38h: mine seem pretty consistent. no hiccups, just higher latency
Oct 16 21:54:05 <javispedro> only a poor guy who didn't even work in IT.
Oct 16 21:54:16 <greenfly> RST38h: does the change to the wifi settings take immediately or should I re-associate?
Oct 16 21:54:30 <RST38h> ShadowJK: You can call it that
Oct 16 21:54:42 <RST38h> greenfly: Once you ok all dialogs, it will reassociate automatically
Oct 16 21:55:14 <greenfly> RST38h: thx
Oct 16 21:58:47 <javispedro> ouch.
Oct 16 21:59:43 <javispedro> this guy, the one who posted incompleted mupen64 source to tmo and claimed it was a "n900 n64 emu"
Oct 16 22:00:30 <javispedro> is now trying to post a "n900 emulator package" with 13 emus, including NDS, PSX and N64.
Oct 16 22:00:30 * javispedro sighs
Oct 16 22:00:45 * absolute hands javispedro a stess ball
Oct 16 22:01:50 <RST38h> javispedro: does he even have an n900?
Oct 16 22:01:58 <javispedro> no, but he "wants one badly".
Oct 16 22:02:55 <RST38h> The kids finally discovered t.m.o. God save us all.
Oct 16 22:03:09 <javispedro> yeah, he comes from same fansite posting java tutoriales.
Oct 16 22:03:14 <javispedro> err... tutorials.
Oct 16 22:04:22 * javispedro grabs stress ball
Oct 16 22:04:54 <RST38h> The Tentacled One needs a lot of these for a good dinner: pretty much no gray matter, just some spinal fluid...
Oct 16 22:05:33 <javispedro> really, the marketing dept. is redundant.
Oct 16 22:05:41 <javispedro> these guys auto-marketize the thing to themselves
Oct 16 22:05:55 <javispedro> "arm 600 mhz cortex comparable to intel core 2 due 1 ghz"
Oct 16 22:06:24 <ShadowJK> lol :)
Oct 16 22:06:26 <RST38h> do they have money to spend?
Oct 16 22:06:31 <dotblank3> So I just learned that the n900 cant act as a usb host?
Oct 16 22:06:41 <RST38h> yes. so?
Oct 16 22:06:43 <absolute> its true, but there are workarounds for most use cases
Oct 16 22:06:53 <RST38h> afaik, no workarounds.
Oct 16 22:06:53 <Mousey> see? tolja it was saddening, the no host-mode thing
Oct 16 22:07:01 <absolute> not pretty, and probably never out of that port
Oct 16 22:07:09 <dotblank3> damn cause that would have been awesome
Oct 16 22:07:10 <absolute> but for certain tasks you could wish to use the usb for
Oct 16 22:07:15 <Mousey> dotblank3: it's awesome on the n810
Oct 16 22:07:20 <absolute> there are other ways to accomplish
Oct 16 22:07:21 <ifreq> same with older internet tablets.. tho with soldering it was possib.
Oct 16 22:07:32 <SpeedEvil> Is there more recent information than the couple of mails to the list a month ago?
Oct 16 22:07:39 <SpeedEvil> Or is this just ongoing speculation?
Oct 16 22:07:42 <ifreq> but you prob should have any need for usb-host, bt devices are usually sufficient
Oct 16 22:08:08 <RST38h> Speed: Well, I no longer remember the source but it was said that usb host is not compatible with usb charging feature
Oct 16 22:08:11 <SpeedEvil> ifreq: plugging in hard-drives, scanners, ethernet dongles, ...
Oct 16 22:08:19 <RST38h> Speed: Not compatible on hw level. End of story.
Oct 16 22:08:31 <dotblank3> cause I would really like to use my USBtoSerail adapter to work and program my embeded devices with it
Oct 16 22:08:44 <SpeedEvil> RST38h: If that's based on the same sources that I saw - I don't quite conclude the same thing from that.
Oct 16 22:08:53 <ifreq> cant you do such things withan laptop
Oct 16 22:08:58 <dotblank3> As a cisco engineer it would be awesome to be able to program from my phone
Oct 16 22:09:03 <javispedro> the pessimist on me also says "end of story". but i'm sure someone will get it open. or maybe the debug ports on the backside are connected to the usb host transceiver.
Oct 16 22:09:04 <ifreq> within*
Oct 16 22:09:07 <RST38h> Speed: Well, can't deny people hope
Oct 16 22:09:27 <SpeedEvil> RST38h: There is a big difference between 'OTG compatible' and will work if you apply power and flip bit 47 in the USB config register.
Oct 16 22:09:30 <ifreq> dotblank3: you mean the keyboard is sufficient for doing firewall rules
Oct 16 22:09:41 <ifreq> dotblank3: or cutting/pasting rules between systems etc
Oct 16 22:09:45 <SpeedEvil> dotblank3: you get bluetooth->serial links
Oct 16 22:09:48 <ifreq> I cant see it so usable as you.
Oct 16 22:09:56 <SpeedEvil> dotblank3: they regrettably aren't very cheap - but they do exist.
Oct 16 22:10:01 <dotblank3> ifreq: well for quick diagnostics
Oct 16 22:10:28 <ifreq> dotblank3: yeh, for that there is usually other ways too to connect into your router/fw
Oct 16 22:10:31 <ifreq> :)
Oct 16 22:10:33 <ifreq> but i get your point yes
Oct 16 22:10:52 <dotblank3> If pymaemo had the serial class I could write some quick apps that would let me handle the cisco devices better
Oct 16 22:11:05 <RST38h> javis: BTW have you got the network play already?
Oct 16 22:11:06 <dotblank3> Im not a developer
Oct 16 22:11:29 <javispedro> RST38h: nah, since chances I ever find another n8xx user to play adhoc are 0.
Oct 16 22:11:38 <SpeedEvil> dotblank3: http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/PICO-PLUG-bluetooth-adapter-for-LPT-and-serial-devices_W0QQitemZ190262209575QQcmdZViewItemQQptZUK_Computing_Networking_SM?hash=item2c4c82ec27
Oct 16 22:11:42 <SpeedEvil> dotblank3: for example.
Oct 16 22:11:48 <RST38h> javis: Should I suggest a workaround?
Oct 16 22:11:51 <SpeedEvil> dotblank3: there may be more appropriate ones
Oct 16 22:11:53 <javispedro> and doing internet play with insane latencies will be tricky at least.
Oct 16 22:11:57 <dotblank3> SpeedEvil: wow thx those are cheap
Oct 16 22:11:58 <javispedro> RST38h: shoot.
Oct 16 22:12:21 <RST38h> javis: Look at NetPlay stuff in EMULib
Oct 16 22:12:23 <dotblank3> SpeedEvil: oops thats in pounds isnt it.. nm
Oct 16 22:12:26 <dotblank3> nvm
Oct 16 22:12:36 <RST38h> javis: Basically, as long as both ends have IP addresses, you are in a game
Oct 16 22:12:38 <SpeedEvil> dotblank3: I think that's a remaindered stock - it's about 1/4 the price I've seen
Oct 16 22:12:41 <RST38h> no need for adhoc
Oct 16 22:12:51 <absolute> Yeah, there's seriously like a 46 pages of talk on maemo.org under a search of "USB OTG" that will cover all the bases... I too was kinda disappointed about no USB host, but i'll deal with it and work around it... for my needs
Oct 16 22:12:57 <javispedro> RST38h: i have code from snes9x to do that, already compiled in (missing frontend code mostly)
Oct 16 22:13:01 <RST38h> javis: Now, if you are behind NAT, it is not possible
Oct 16 22:13:05 <javispedro> but I was worried about how it handles latency.
Oct 16 22:13:15 <ShadowJK> best workaround is n8x0 ;)
Oct 16 22:13:15 <javispedro> basically every 10-20 frames it syncs up.
Oct 16 22:13:28 <javispedro> which ... sucks. for anything non adhoc.
Oct 16 22:13:36 <SpeedEvil> hmm - they've become cheaper.
Oct 16 22:13:37 <SpeedEvil> http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/Bluetooth-RS232-Serial-Adapter-Dipole-Antenna_W0QQitemZ320414777912QQcmdZViewItemQQptZUK_Computing_Networking_SM?hash=item4a9a358238
Oct 16 22:13:39 <RST38h> javis: But if we establish a server somewhere that will take both connections and relay them, that may work
Oct 16 22:13:41 <dotblank3> did you see that video of quake III on the n900?
Oct 16 22:14:05 <RST38h> javis: I sync up on every frame. Seems to work over WiFi
Oct 16 22:14:24 <absolute> ShadowJK: yeah, I'm looking at picking up a used n800... seems you can get them for < $100 and someone in that thread talked about using its usb host hack/mod over wifi adhoc on the 900... so really, worst case scenario, its still there...
Oct 16 22:14:25 <javispedro> 10 frames is like, 200ms.
Oct 16 22:14:30 <RST38h> infrastructure WiFi
Oct 16 22:14:41 <javispedro> that prohibites anything internet.
Oct 16 22:14:42 <RST38h> 200ms is a lot of time
Oct 16 22:14:49 <javispedro> well, my ISP sucks then.
Oct 16 22:14:57 <RST38h> Guess so
Oct 16 22:15:09 <javispedro> I get 100ms ping to google...
Oct 16 22:15:13 <RST38h> But I think it is at least worth a try. At least games like final fantasy will do
Oct 16 22:15:17 <javispedro> and 200ms ping to google.com
Oct 16 22:15:34 <RST38h> 40ms ping to google.com here
Oct 16 22:15:48 <javispedro> so yes, I guess my ISP sucks hard :P
Oct 16 22:16:29 <RST38h> another feature I want to try is the vibro
Oct 16 22:16:44 <RST38h> Works in VGB-Symbian, so should work in VGB-Maemo
Oct 16 22:16:46 <javispedro> hum. some vgba games have it in the cartridge iirc?
Oct 16 22:16:58 <javispedro> er.. s/vgba/gba
Oct 16 22:16:59 <RST38h> Dunno about GBA, but GB had an extension
Oct 16 22:17:03 <javispedro> a.
Oct 16 22:17:09 <RST38h> And it works pretty well
Oct 16 22:17:38 * RST38h actually prefers GB games to MIDP games performance wise =)
Oct 16 22:17:49 <javispedro> and they even have more content.
Oct 16 22:17:57 <RST38h> yep, ironically
Oct 16 22:18:11 <javispedro> when I need to get depressed
Oct 16 22:18:18 <dotblank3> My palm treo can play NES games perfectly......
Oct 16 22:18:22 <javispedro> I compare memory usage of drnoksnes vs drnoksnes_gui
Oct 16 22:18:31 <dotblank3> now I'll pay someone for an snes emulator
Oct 16 22:18:36 <javispedro> gui uses like 10x more memory.
Oct 16 22:18:47 <RST38h> mmm....what is VIRT vs RES?
Oct 16 22:19:01 <RST38h> I can bet the RES is not that high
Oct 16 22:19:32 * pupnik_ does the n900 really is very good dance
Oct 16 22:19:42 <javispedro> pupnik_: how's the keyboard for gaming?
Oct 16 22:19:44 <ShadowJK> virt is mostly a useless measure
Oct 16 22:20:07 <RST38h> RES is also not exactly correct
Oct 16 22:20:18 <RST38h> as it includes shared libs
Oct 16 22:20:26 <SpeedEvil> yeah - it includes shared libs.
Oct 16 22:20:35 <SpeedEvil> There are a couple of projects to merge shared pages
Oct 16 22:20:39 <SpeedEvil> err
Oct 16 22:20:45 <SpeedEvil> I mean identical unshared pages
Oct 16 22:20:46 <javispedro> the whole thing is a mess. if I were evil I would include even ro pages of shared libraries.
Oct 16 22:20:55 * RST38h answered the "is Cortex really that fast?" question at work by showing off quake3
Oct 16 22:20:56 <SpeedEvil> Which may be useful.
Oct 16 22:21:16 <javispedro> cause "they do not count because they're shared" is like a theorital lie practical truth issue.
Oct 16 22:21:17 <ShadowJK> it includes all kinds of meomory maps
Oct 16 22:21:18 <pupnik_> dunno javispedro - so far ok
Oct 16 22:21:33 <RST38h> javisL not exactly
Oct 16 22:21:46 <SpeedEvil> http://209.85.229.132/search?q=cache:2Sf3ZthRVTsJ:mergemem.ist.org/+mergemem&cd=1&hl=en&ct=clnk - like that - but more recent
Oct 16 22:21:52 <RST38h> javis: Take gtk+ for example: it is used by a shitload of maemo apps on regular basis
Oct 16 22:22:11 <RST38h> javis: So, you also make use of it. Does it mean it should count against your program footprint?
Oct 16 22:22:35 <javispedro> not doing that is a partial truth.
Oct 16 22:22:46 <RST38h> but doing that is a partial truth as well, just a different part
Oct 16 22:23:04 <javispedro> yeah, I guess it depends on your level of nitpickyness
Oct 16 22:23:13 <RST38h> and it all depends on how many processes use that particular library
Oct 16 22:23:23 <RST38h> actually here is a good measure:
Oct 16 22:23:39 <RST38h> for every shared library, divide its size by the number of processes that use it
Oct 16 22:23:53 <RST38h> this will give me your process' share in that library
Oct 16 22:24:16 <javispedro> RST38h: drnoksnes uses 10m RES, gui uses 12m.
Oct 16 22:24:36 <RST38h> SDL?
Oct 16 22:24:38 <javispedro> (I don't know where busybox top gets the %MEM)
Oct 16 22:24:53 <RST38h> Install htop from the repo
Oct 16 22:25:02 <javispedro> i'm using debian top now
Oct 16 22:25:16 <RST38h> htop is better, top is kinda untruthful
Oct 16 22:25:34 <RST38h> Also, SDL probably maps the whole fb0 into address space of the process
Oct 16 22:25:37 <ShadowJK> Atleast in the past, each new thread got something like 8megs of stack mapped, so every new thread would grow virt by 8Megs even if the thread was using only 4k of it (meaning only 4k of ram/swap used) :)
Oct 16 22:25:59 <RST38h> Shadow: It is ok: mapped != allocated
Oct 16 22:26:09 <ShadowJK> yes
Oct 16 22:26:15 <ShadowJK> that's my point.
Oct 16 22:26:16 <RST38h> Also, look at the file dialog: it still maps 100+MB
Oct 16 22:26:16 <javispedro> RST38h: nope, SDL uses XShm after all.
Oct 16 22:26:25 <RST38h> javis: Hmm...ok
Oct 16 22:26:35 <dotblank3> It would be awesome if someone ported electric sheep
Oct 16 22:27:23 <RST38h> <sleep>
Oct 16 22:27:50 * javispedro can't go to sleep untils vista vm's 300 upgrades get applied
Oct 16 22:28:04 <javispedro> even though I'm considering plugging the virtual plug though. It's damn slow.
Oct 16 22:28:11 <javispedro> s/pluggin/unpluggin
Oct 16 22:29:15 <pupnik_> javispedro what do you think about sdl programs drawing to gtk pixbuf or whatever is needed for integration into clutter
Oct 16 22:29:29 <javispedro> pupnik_: sdl programs should be integrated into clutter already.
Oct 16 22:29:37 <pupnik_> oh ok
Oct 16 22:29:43 <pupnik_> >_<
Oct 16 22:29:56 <javispedro> drnoksnes is going through X11. it's one of the reasons I'm reticent to go RST's way and bang fb0.
Oct 16 22:30:36 <javispedro> try drnoksnes windowed mode and switch tasks
Oct 16 22:30:40 <javispedro> it works even in x86 sdk
Oct 16 22:30:47 <johnsq> javispedro: with shared memory and dga x11 has the same speed like fb
Oct 16 22:31:11 <dotblank3> would aircrack-ng run?
Oct 16 22:31:23 <pupnik_> just about to test now javispedro
Oct 16 22:31:39 * VDVsx needs a name for a small app that will enable HID support in maemo5 and will help to connect keyboards o_0
Oct 16 22:31:54 <javispedro> "WTFDIDNOKIAFORGETTHIS"
Oct 16 22:32:11 <javispedro> abbv. wdnfgt
Oct 16 22:32:28 <javispedro> abbv. wdnft  (i can't spell...)
Oct 16 22:32:57 <greenfly> VDVsx: nothumbs
Oct 16 22:33:03 <javispedro> johnsq: i don't think xomap supports dga...
Oct 16 22:33:09 <javispedro> but XShm, sure.
Oct 16 22:33:16 <halves> hello guys, can anybody help me with n800 and a mono bluetooth headset?
Oct 16 22:33:41 <lardman> depends what's wrong with it
Oct 16 22:34:03 <johnsq> javispedro: i have written a c64 emulator long ago.
Oct 16 22:34:12 <javispedro> using dga in maemo?
Oct 16 22:34:24 <javispedro> i assumed it is a 386-thing only.
Oct 16 22:34:55 <johnsq> javispedro: long a ago, 486 times, no it was portable C code runs also on suns
Oct 16 22:36:05 <halves> lardman: I am trying use nokia bh-101 bluetooth headset with n800 to do internet call, but it doesn`t worked
Oct 16 22:36:41 <lardman> halves: does it pair? Can you hear any audio through it?
Oct 16 22:38:17 <halves> lardman: yes it was pair, I can hear a ringtone if I receive a internet call, but when I accept this call, it use the n800`s speakers
Oct 16 22:38:39 <lardman> might be something specific to the sw
Oct 16 22:38:48 <lardman> anyone else managed a call using a mono headset?
Oct 16 22:39:45 <Sargun_screen> Is the Nokia tablet/netbook MAemo based?
Oct 16 22:39:55 <Arkenklo> Sargun_screen: no, windows 7
Oct 16 22:40:14 <Sargun_screen> Arkenklo: Are you serious, or was that a bad joke?
Oct 16 22:40:19 <halves> lardman: I don`t found any option to configure it.
Oct 16 22:40:19 <Arkenklo> Sargun_screen: speaking about the netbook/laptop
Oct 16 22:40:35 <Sargun_screen> Arkenklo: Fuuuck.
Oct 16 22:40:38 <Arkenklo> Nokia Booklet
Oct 16 22:40:47 <Sargun_screen> and it looked so cool.
Oct 16 22:40:49 <Arkenklo> let me doublecheck that
Oct 16 22:41:11 <Lantz> Anyone know anything about "Cold Serial Flash" on N810?
Oct 16 22:41:14 <lardman> halves: I don't know I'm afraid. Might be worth a post to the maemo-users list to ask if anyone else has had it working, or if it's a limitation of the call software
Oct 16 22:41:14 <javispedro> Arkenklo: no need, it's true.
Oct 16 22:41:33 <Arkenklo> javispedro: thanks
Oct 16 22:41:41 <Sargun_screen> I wish the N900 had an OLED screen
Oct 16 22:41:52 <Arkenklo> indeed it is a massive fail by nokia installing windows
Oct 16 22:42:43 <Sargun_screen> Arkenklo: I wonder what modem they are using in it.
Oct 16 22:43:06 <halves> lardman: ok, thanks
Oct 16 22:43:06 <Arkenklo> actually, a omap-based netbook running maemo would have been pretty nice, probably not commercially but for the platform
Oct 16 22:43:07 <Sargun_screen> I mean $299 for the cost (After rebate), they could probably take $50-$100 off
Oct 16 22:43:19 <Sargun_screen> With Win7
Oct 16 22:43:40 <Sargun_screen> though, extra development costs are...costly
Oct 16 22:43:45 <Sargun_screen> :-P
Oct 16 22:44:18 <Arkenklo> releasing another generic atom netbook seems extremely redundant
Oct 16 22:44:34 <Sargun_screen> Arkenklo: nokia has a brand
Oct 16 22:44:34 <Arkenklo> anyway, I should be going to bed
Oct 16 22:44:42 <Sargun_screen> they make good hardware
Oct 16 22:45:38 <Arkenklo> I guess, well, even the best makes mistakes
Oct 16 22:45:45 <Sargun_screen> if they had a good alternative UI, etc...
Oct 16 22:45:53 <Solarion> stupid Windows
Oct 16 22:45:53 <Arkenklo> this is a multi million dollar company we're talking about after all
Oct 16 22:46:01 <Solarion> I want my flying car
Oct 16 22:46:05 <Arkenklo> they can only be that awesome
Oct 16 22:46:39 <ShadowJK> I guess booklet has one feature: fanless
Oct 16 22:46:54 <Sargun_screen> Aren't a couple other ones fanless?
Oct 16 22:47:16 * ShadowJK hasn't heard of any before
Oct 16 22:47:18 <javispedro> man, why's windows vista update speed "1 update per hour"????? :(
Oct 16 22:47:24 <Arkenklo> I laugh just at the thought of anything branded Nokia that has a fan
Oct 16 22:47:37 <ShadowJK> not that it matters, they are samle class as booklet: unobtanium :)
Oct 16 22:47:47 <Arkenklo> javispedro: because that's how ofter security gets breached
Oct 16 22:47:58 <Arkenklo> or well, that's how often they detect one
Oct 16 22:47:59 <javispedro> but I have 300 updates to do!
Oct 16 22:48:11 <Arkenklo> javispedro: 300 viruses knocking at your door!
Oct 16 22:48:49 <Lantz> Anyone know anything about "Cold Serial Flash" on N810? I have 3 that wont boot (even in reflash mode) No indicator LED when pluggen into charger... Nothing
Oct 16 22:50:44 * ShadowJK is curous about their battery voltage
Oct 16 22:51:01 <javispedro> first interesting question of the night ;)
Oct 16 22:51:16 <javispedro> did anybody get cold flash working? I remember reading so.
Oct 16 22:52:06 <javispedro> lol.
Oct 16 22:52:11 <javispedro> 110/270 updates installed.
Oct 16 22:52:15 <javispedro> the rest faile.d
Oct 16 22:52:20 <Lantz> I can fabricate the docking station to access the contacts but don't know where to go from there
Oct 16 22:53:12 <Arkenklo> I'm suprised that none of the 371 geeks in here have shouted at him to stop using microsoft products and install linux
Oct 16 22:53:35 <javispedro> Arkenklo: did you miss our conversation about VB6 just about an hour ago? ;)
Oct 16 22:53:46 <Arkenklo> javispedro: I must have
Oct 16 22:53:56 <javispedro> don't worry, this is a VM.
Oct 16 22:54:11 <Arkenklo> crap, I hate vb6, and to make things worse, I'm forced to use it weekly
Oct 16 22:54:12 <ShadowJK> arkenklo: warning examples speak best for themselves
Oct 16 22:54:22 <Firebird> javispedro, do you have the changes to SDL1.3 documented anywhere?
Oct 16 22:54:46 <javispedro> Firebird: sdl documentation task started like... a week ago. they only have 5 or 6 functions documented.
Oct 16 22:55:07 <javispedro> in the off documentation, i don't remember if they have any generated docs.
Oct 16 22:55:09 <Firebird> javispedro, I meant the changes necessary for it to work on maemo
Oct 16 22:55:10 <javispedro> s/off/oficial
Oct 16 22:55:18 <Firebird> ...properly
Oct 16 22:55:36 <lcuk> whats broken in it
Oct 16 22:55:41 <javispedro> Firebird: i think sdl 1.2 was shipped "as is" without any specific patches, lemme check.
Oct 16 22:55:59 <Firebird> something about color being messed up or something like that.. according to javispedro
Oct 16 22:56:02 <Corsac> Khertan_: hey, seen you're an SFR user
Oct 16 22:56:10 <Corsac> Khertan_: which kind of contract do you have?
Oct 16 22:56:31 * javispedro checks logs
Oct 16 22:57:45 <Firebird> javispedro, Oct 09 21:09:46 <javispedro>    if upstream, get my sample to get some of the egl parameters.
Oct 16 22:57:54 <javispedro> ah, yeah.
Oct 16 22:58:08 <javispedro> actually, I got them from a mailing list post.
Oct 16 22:58:28 <Firebird> ah
Oct 16 22:58:29 <javispedro> but the issue at hand is not wrong colors, but that it won't found any "compatible" option set.
Oct 16 22:59:11 <javispedro> Firebird: http://lists.maemo.org/pipermail/maemo-developers/2009-September/020517.html
Oct 16 22:59:59 <Firebird> thanks
Oct 16 23:00:21 <javispedro> so be sure sdl-1.3 does not set EGL_RED, GREEN, ... _SIZE and you'll be fine
Oct 16 23:02:30 <Firebird> though, I don't think SDL uses EGL.. does it?
Oct 16 23:02:40 <lardman> night all
Oct 16 23:02:44 <javispedro> Firebird: only way to get a oglesv2 renderable.
Oct 16 23:02:47 <javispedro> gnite lardman
Oct 16 23:02:50 <Firebird> ah
Oct 16 23:02:56 <javispedro> no glx in oglesv2
Oct 16 23:03:06 <javispedro> (and oglesv1 for the matter)
Oct 16 23:03:14 <lcuk> javis, you didnt use sdl at first did you
Oct 16 23:03:32 <javispedro> lcuk: nope, the triangle test was as bare metal as possible.
Oct 16 23:03:39 <javispedro> X11 + EGL.
Oct 16 23:03:56 * lcuk nods
Oct 16 23:04:09 * lcuk has presentation working :)
Oct 16 23:04:12 <pupnik> reboot loop on n900
Oct 16 23:04:15 <pupnik> from some desktop widget apparently
Oct 16 23:04:16 <lcuk> with the extra bits
Oct 16 23:04:17 <javispedro> ouch.
Oct 16 23:04:27 <Firebird> aha, I found it
Oct 16 23:04:41 <lcuk> pupnik, i thought mine was in a reboot loop
Oct 16 23:04:49 <pupnik> would be nice if device detected reboots and what it launched to cause the crash
Oct 16 23:04:51 <lcuk> until i realised the other end of usb wasnt plugged in
Oct 16 23:05:00 <lcuk> and it was just not charged :$
Oct 16 23:05:01 <pupnik> eh?
Oct 16 23:05:12 <javispedro> pupnik: i thought it did that ?
Oct 16 23:05:13 <pupnik> oh this has been chargin but i double check
Oct 16 23:05:23 <javispedro> I mean, sometimes hildon-desktop boots without any widget.
Oct 16 23:05:31 <javispedro> at least here on my n810.
Oct 16 23:05:47 <pupnik> dunno - 13 reboots here
Oct 16 23:05:55 <javispedro> lmao.
Oct 16 23:06:09 <javispedro> and they say the n920 will be "ofcourse better" ;) lol
Oct 16 23:06:24 <pupnik> well unexpected things happen with third party apps, i think that is natural
Oct 16 23:06:43 <pupnik> it might have been that gpsd monitor desktop applet
Oct 16 23:07:05 <pupnik> would like to boot into console mode plx
Oct 16 23:07:08 <pupnik> :|
Oct 16 23:07:30 <javispedro> pft. the current situation with the firmware sucks.
Oct 16 23:07:53 <javispedro> the should release the damn flasher already
Oct 16 23:07:56 <javispedro> s/the/thet
Oct 16 23:07:58 <javispedro> s/the/they
Oct 16 23:08:07 <lcuk> the current situation with the firmware is transitional, its not suckage surely
Oct 16 23:09:08 <javispedro> Firebird: don't remember right now... you got an n900 to test?
Oct 16 23:09:26 <lcuk> javispedro, how do i get qt app onto tablet then without code sourcery - or is that the only way
Oct 16 23:09:45 <javispedro> lcuk: i've not started developing that idea yet!
Oct 16 23:09:58 <lcuk> pupnik, add to mailing list, your total failure might make something change
Oct 16 23:10:02 <javispedro> but of course you need codesourcery, but that's avail for windows
Oct 16 23:10:28 <lcuk> thats ok
Oct 16 23:10:49 * lcuk heads back to lb pres
Oct 16 23:10:54 <javispedro> lcuk: i'd get the codesourcery toolchain from their webpage, try to crossbuild qt (or get it from the device) and try to configure qt-creator to use that.
Oct 16 23:11:08 <javispedro> and hope no more libs required  :)
Oct 16 23:11:08 <Firebird> javispedro, no
Oct 16 23:11:14 <lcuk> hand waving, complex for either of us
Oct 16 23:11:18 <javispedro> Firebird: uh.. dev program?
Oct 16 23:11:18 <pupnik> now i have a paused "5 dots" animation and the status light is slowly flashing orange :(
Oct 16 23:11:24 <Firebird> javispedro, nope, failed to make the mark
Oct 16 23:11:32 <javispedro> ouch.
Oct 16 23:11:36 <pupnik> i think flashing orange is kernel panic
Oct 16 23:12:10 <lcuk> are the lights included in the pdf documentation i wonder
Oct 16 23:12:18 <pupnik> hehe
Oct 16 23:12:39 <javispedro> Firebird: that's bad, cause from what I found, the sdk libgles2-dev is way more forgiving than the device one.
Oct 16 23:13:09 <Firebird> hm, javispedro I'm modifying the pandora driver for maemo, shouldn't that work?
Oct 16 23:13:22 <javispedro> the keyword here is "should" ;)
Oct 16 23:13:28 <Firebird> heh
Oct 16 23:13:41 <javispedro> I had something that worked flawlessly in both libgles2-dev and powervr sdk, but not on device.
Oct 16 23:13:53 <lcuk> strange
Oct 16 23:13:55 <pupnik> "your total failure might make something change" is about the most hopeful thing i've heard in a long time, lcuk :)
Oct 16 23:14:01 <javispedro> but I guess who did the pandora driver had an actual pandora...
Oct 16 23:14:05 <lcuk> i had something which worked flawlessly on my device but not on the big day
Oct 16 23:14:15 <lcuk> lol pupnik
Oct 16 23:14:22 <lcuk> i havent heard of anyone bricking them yet
Oct 16 23:14:25 <lcuk> and its been a week
Oct 16 23:14:28 <javispedro> lcuk: i have.
Oct 16 23:14:32 <lcuk> o_O who else
Oct 16 23:14:35 <lcuk> long line?
Oct 16 23:14:37 <javispedro> er.. someone did apt-get dist-upgrade to extras.
Oct 16 23:14:40 <javispedro> extras-devel.
Oct 16 23:14:51 <javispedro> can't remember the name, but it's all on tmo.
Oct 16 23:15:09 <pupnik> this is really good for me so i can have some time to fix up things around the house
Oct 16 23:15:10 <javispedro> (I wish I could have an n900 to brick lol )
Oct 16 23:15:19 <lcuk> ahhh yes, but i think they were still at summit
Oct 16 23:15:25 <lcuk> and there was a big red warning
Oct 16 23:15:30 <javispedro> lcuk: think not...
Oct 16 23:15:30 <lcuk> and he got it flashed afaik
Oct 16 23:15:37 <Firebird> javispedro, the pandora driver sets those attributes: "wdata->gles_attributes[attr_pos++] = EGL_GREEN_SIZE;"
Oct 16 23:15:42 <lcuk> :D
Oct 16 23:15:43 <fiferboy> that was me
Oct 16 23:15:52 <fiferboy> that got it flashed at summit
Oct 16 23:16:06 <fiferboy> someone else talked about it on t.m.o
Oct 16 23:16:25 <lcuk> lol trust you fiferboy !
Oct 16 23:16:44 <fiferboy> of course!  I've got to try it...
Oct 16 23:17:07 <lcuk> heh
Oct 16 23:17:11 <fiferboy> brb
Oct 16 23:17:26 <javispedro> Firebird: well, for sure they don't work in N900.
Oct 16 23:17:39 <javispedro> well, unless they changed that in latest device.
Oct 16 23:19:05 <Firebird> ah, can maemo gles double buffer?
Oct 16 23:19:18 <javispedro> didn't try.
Oct 16 23:20:04 <Firebird> "/* Under PND OpenGL ES output can't be double buffered */"
Oct 16 23:20:31 <javispedro> any clue what PND means here?
Oct 16 23:20:42 <Firebird> pandora
Oct 16 23:20:56 <javispedro> uh.
Oct 16 23:22:48 <pupnik> i think triple buffering works well for gl, but if orgots
Oct 16 23:23:09 <pupnik> Firebird what you looking at for gl app?
Oct 16 23:24:01 <javispedro> sdl-1.3 port. everytime I see news about the lib it seems more interesting.
Oct 16 23:24:13 <Firebird> pupnik, going a port of the pandora SDL1.3 driver, double buffering is disabled here
Oct 16 23:24:16 <Firebird> *doing
Oct 16 23:24:20 <javispedro> btw
Oct 16 23:24:22 <pupnik> cool cool
Oct 16 23:24:33 <javispedro> Firebird: why did you started off the pandora version, and not upstream trunk?
Oct 16 23:24:33 <pupnik> what have they done with it that is useful?
Oct 16 23:24:40 <pupnik> same question
Oct 16 23:24:55 <Firebird> javispedro, eh? I'm using the pandora driver in the upstream trunk
Oct 16 23:25:03 <Firebird> there's a ipod driver in here too
Oct 16 23:25:07 <javispedro> uuh???
Oct 16 23:25:14 <javispedro> that rings a warning bell.
Oct 16 23:25:23 <Firebird> really
Oct 16 23:25:25 <javispedro> does "pandora driver" depend on X11?
Oct 16 23:25:49 * Firebird goes check
Oct 16 23:26:03 <javispedro> if it does not, you're fscked. killing x11 is not an option in maemo.
Oct 16 23:26:35 <javispedro> unless you want to bang fb0 and draw over everything like rst38 ;)
Oct 16 23:27:50 <javispedro> don't say that a non-x11 driver would be useless (it may work for fullscreen), but ensure there's a x11 gles driver in there.
Oct 16 23:27:52 <pupnik> i picture the maemo helicopters coming to pick rst up at night
Oct 16 23:28:05 <javispedro> lol
Oct 16 23:28:48 <pupnik> i was just going to try drnoksnes out for the first time, too
Oct 16 23:28:51 <ali1234> hmm... g++ doesn't like static libs?
Oct 16 23:28:55 <Firebird> javispedro, hmm, don't see anything x11 related in the gles bits
Oct 16 23:29:26 <Firebird> its using pure egl it looks like
Oct 16 23:29:36 <javispedro> that's called "native" iirc
Oct 16 23:29:56 <javispedro> man, I have too many temp folders
Oct 16 23:30:02 * javispedro creates another and checkouts sdl trunk
Oct 16 23:31:40 <Firebird> javispedro, there is a opengles file in the x11 driver folder
Oct 16 23:32:01 <Firebird> guess we could just use that driver
Oct 16 23:33:23 <Firebird> alright, fixed the EGL attributes, now to remove junk from the source tree
Oct 16 23:33:55 <lcuk> can i just use gstreamer to play a movie
Oct 16 23:34:10 <lcuk> like i currently have gstreamer showing live camera
Oct 16 23:43:04 <javispedro> well, gnite
Oct 17 00:08:52 <zerojay> GAN900: Connection issues?
Oct 17 00:19:29 <zerojay> I'm installing browser plugins with my package. To avoid needing a reboot or two, I wanted to restart the browser daemon (/etc/init.d/tablet-browser-daemon.init restart). Is there anything I need to worry about when doing this? Are there any negative issues that crop up for the user because of it?
Oct 17 00:23:10 <Firebird> hurray, SDL13 with OpenGLES2.0 is now going through the autobuilder
Oct 17 00:23:19 <pupnik> :) ?
Oct 17 00:23:45 <pupnik> firebird, so a project like secret maryo world could use that
Oct 17 00:24:06 <pupnik> afaict, the sdl just sets up the gl env
Oct 17 00:24:07 <Firebird> yea, and my own project
Oct 17 00:24:18 <pupnik> what project?
Oct 17 00:24:22 <zerojay> I smell some Super Mario War. :)
Oct 17 00:24:32 <Firebird> zerojay, thought that was already on maemo4
Oct 17 00:24:43 <zerojay> Firebird: Sure was.
Oct 17 00:24:51 <Firebird> pupnik, http://maemo.org/downloads/product/OS2008/slysics/
Oct 17 00:25:04 <pupnik> ty
Oct 17 00:26:13 <guysoft42> hey all, i am trying to compile the N810 generic. and i seem to get an error: http://pastebin.com/m30537037
Oct 17 00:26:26 <pupnik> oh yea....
Oct 17 00:26:40 <zerojay> Does a postinst script need to be executable?
Oct 17 00:28:04 <pupnik> guysoft42 - you using a different compiler than package maintainera?
Oct 17 00:28:43 <Firebird> well this is odd, SDL_Flip isn't redrawing the screen in fullscreen mode (at least on the SDK)
Oct 17 00:30:17 <guysoft42> pupnik, i am using sandbox2
Oct 17 00:30:19 <pupnik> we have hwsurface? ? :)
Oct 17 00:30:37 <guysoft42> pupnik, [SB2 devel diablo4.1.2_armel]
Oct 17 00:30:59 <pupnik> ah
Oct 17 00:32:16 <guysoft42> :(
Oct 17 00:32:24 <guysoft42> is there any .config file i need, maybe?
Oct 17 00:34:26 <guysoft42> didn't anyone here ever compile the maemo kernel?
Oct 17 00:34:49 <pupnik> not i
Oct 17 00:35:23 <ali1234> guysoft42: __bad_udelay means the module is delaying for too long
Oct 17 00:35:52 <guysoft42> ali1234, so how can i solve that?
Oct 17 00:37:30 <ali1234> well i'd guess those drivers are delaying based on cpu jiffies or something, and expect a very dfferent clock speed. why are you even compiling them?
Oct 17 00:41:37 <guysoft42> ali1234, i just wanted it to compile venilla, what i really want is just to compile acm_cdc module
Oct 17 00:41:57 <ali1234> build it out of kernel then
Oct 17 00:42:08 <ali1234> actually i'm not sure if you can get the headers to do that
Oct 17 00:42:10 <ali1234> anybody?
Oct 17 00:42:48 <guysoft42> ali1234, all i did was download the kernel source package, and compile with the generic .config, no luck
Oct 17 00:43:03 <ali1234> which source package, which config and which compiler?
Oct 17 00:43:36 <guysoft42> ali1234, maemo-sdk compiler
Oct 17 00:43:44 <guysoft42> ali1234, kernel-source i think it is
Oct 17 00:44:29 <guysoft42> ali1234, used this: http://maemo-sdk.garage.maemo.org/install-debian.html
Oct 17 00:45:14 <ali1234> and what steps to build kernel?
Oct 17 00:46:11 <ali1234> http://maemo.org/community/oldwiki/howto-kernelcompilation/ ?
Oct 17 00:46:27 <ali1234> hmm that's a bit old?
Oct 17 00:50:13 <guysoft42> ali1234, i more or less had that
Oct 17 00:51:00 <ali1234> i think you must be using a wrong .config because n810 does not use any of those failing modules
Oct 17 00:51:14 <ali1234> but i can't really help any more than that cos i've never done it on this hardware
Oct 17 00:51:48 <SpeedEvil> http://www.eetimes.com/showArticle.jhtml?articleID=220601177&cid=NL_eet hmm
Oct 17 00:51:53 <ali1234> but maybe this can help you: http://koltsoff.com/pub/hello-n800/
Oct 17 01:26:24 <Solarion> boo-riiing
Oct 17 01:26:37 <penguinbait> ~ding
Oct 17 01:26:38 <infobot> dong
Oct 17 01:27:16 <Firebird> hm, the autobuilder seems to have frozen
Oct 17 01:32:04 <zerojay> really? :/
Oct 17 01:32:09 <clmntch> what size should icons in a treeview be?
Oct 17 01:32:15 <clmntch> 32x32 or 24x24
Oct 17 01:50:31 <bobbyd> hi
Oct 17 01:52:49 <Andril> hello all
Oct 17 01:53:32 <bobbyd> does anyone know if the fennec browser uses the new tracemonkey javascript VM from firefox 3.5?
Oct 17 01:54:00 <zerojay> no idea, sorry.
Oct 17 01:54:06 <Andril> sorry
Oct 17 01:54:23 <bobbyd> looks like it does from the developer page
Oct 17 01:54:37 <bobbyd> that'll make a large difference on JS heavy pages
Oct 17 01:54:42 <bobbyd> it does on my netbook
Oct 17 01:54:56 <bobbyd> Gecko 1.9.1 apparently
Oct 17 01:55:18 <bobbyd> I wonder if Adobe will hardware accelerate flash, if it's not already
Oct 17 01:55:43 <bobbyd> if it's not and they did, it could be amazing
Oct 17 01:55:55 <bobbyd> it'll be interesting to profile the machine when it's running flash :)
Oct 17 01:56:01 <bobbyd> (the n900)
Oct 17 01:58:26 <bobbyd> could someone with a device maybe find out what gecko runtime the current browser uses?
Oct 17 01:59:48 <Andril> anyone working working on android?
Oct 17 02:05:15 <ali1234> bobbyd: how to check?
Oct 17 02:06:28 <ali1234> about: says "gecko/20090928 firefox/3.5"
Oct 17 02:06:45 <Andril> any n810 users on?
Oct 17 02:06:54 <bobbyd> hmm
Oct 17 02:07:08 <bobbyd> ali1234: so maybe it's already the new vm
Oct 17 02:07:19 <ali1234> also, the n900 does a better job of fullscreen youtube than my desktop pc
Oct 17 02:07:22 <bobbyd> ali1234: thanks
Oct 17 02:07:36 <bobbyd> ali1234: is your desktop a Pentium 3? :)
Oct 17 02:07:50 <bobbyd> I just saw a video of bbc iplayer on the n900 on youtube
Oct 17 02:07:51 <ali1234> no, it's a pentium 4. apparently they're worse
Oct 17 02:08:01 <ali1234> it's 8 years old anyway
Oct 17 02:08:01 <bobbyd> I suppose the guy might have had 20 things running in the background
Oct 17 02:08:10 <bobbyd> right
Oct 17 02:08:59 <ShadowJK> fullscreen without hwaccel is extremely cpu intensive even on desktop :)
Oct 17 02:09:10 <ali1234> yes, it is
Oct 17 02:09:35 <ali1234> but all it takes is three or four embedded youtube videos to kill my PC, even if none of them or playing
Oct 17 02:10:27 <ShadowJK> that's just flash being crap :-)
Oct 17 02:10:43 <ShadowJK> runnig the player interffaces
Oct 17 02:12:23 <ali1234> it really sucks
Oct 17 02:14:24 <zerojay> jeremiah: You there?
Oct 17 02:16:52 <ali1234> is there any way i can stop ssh-agent from asking for my passphrase every time i use ssh inside scratchbox?
Oct 17 02:17:32 <jaem_N810> happy weekend
Oct 17 02:17:54 <penguinbait> not really
Oct 17 02:18:15 <jaem_N810> oh?
Oct 17 02:18:49 <penguinbait> just disappointed with some peoples actions
Oct 17 02:18:59 <jaem_N810> :(
Oct 17 02:19:28 <b-man17> hello penguinbait :)
Oct 17 02:19:32 <penguinbait> hey b-man
Oct 17 02:19:36 <penguinbait> whats been up
Oct 17 02:20:25 <zerojay> yo pb.
Oct 17 02:20:32 <penguinbait> hey zj
Oct 17 02:20:40 <zerojay> Anyone awake that can help me with a packaging issue?
Oct 17 02:20:50 <zerojay> postinst in particular?
Oct 17 02:20:59 <b-man17> penguinbait: nothing much at the moment - just playing with LFS :)
Oct 17 02:21:21 <penguinbait> probably not zj, but whats the issue
Oct 17 02:22:10 <penguinbait> hey zerojay are you developing something?
Oct 17 02:22:33 <zerojay> I'm installing AdBlock Plus for MicroB.. and I want the user to get a warning after installation telling them that all browser windows need to be closed before it will work.
Oct 17 02:23:09 <zerojay> penguinbait: I've made a .deb of about 25 classic gaming wallpapers in extras-testing now and I'm working on bringing AdBlock Plus and Flashblock to the browser.
Oct 17 02:23:09 <penguinbait> so you need a popup window with an OK or something?
Oct 17 02:23:39 <zerojay> Yeah, I know how to do it, but for some reason it's just not coming up even though I know the command is right. Aside from this one little issue, the package is ready for testing and works fine.
Oct 17 02:24:13 <zerojay> Basically the package manager will fire up a script called "postinst" after install and... just seems like I'm missing something here to make this work.
Oct 17 02:24:53 <zerojay> Other than that, no, nothing else being developed on my end yet. I'm not really a seasoned programmer anyways.
Oct 17 02:25:42 <zerojay> I'd start on Facebook chat but I'm sure Collabora's already working on it with the stuff I sent them to get it working in Diablo.
Oct 17 02:27:56 <zerojay> http://code.google.com/p/msn-pecan/ - might be interesting to get this working through telepathy-haze.
Oct 17 02:28:10 <MoRpHeUz> ali1234: try using ssh-add ?
Oct 17 02:28:29 <ali1234> "Could not open a connection to your authentication agent"
Oct 17 02:28:43 <ali1234> i guess i'll just have to keep another shell open outside sbox
Oct 17 02:29:00 <MoRpHeUz> ali1234: probably you need to correctly setup the SSH_AUTH_SOCK env var
Oct 17 02:29:35 <MoRpHeUz> ali1234: echo $SSH_AUTH_SOCK outside scratchbox and put the same value on the var inside scratchbox
Oct 17 02:29:49 <MoRpHeUz> or if you're starting for the first time ssh-agent: eval "$(ssh-agent)"
Oct 17 02:35:18 <jaem_N810> hmm
Oct 17 02:36:07 <jaem_N810> is it possible to install an ssh daemon in the Maemo Diablo SDK VM?  I get package issues, due to the age of the Ubuntu version it's based on
Oct 17 02:36:34 <Firebird> mmm, still frozen
Oct 17 02:36:55 <ali1234> jaem_N810: can you dist-upgrade it?
Oct 17 02:38:15 <ali1234> (probably not a good idea)
Oct 17 02:39:19 * b-man17 wouldn�t
Oct 17 02:40:12 <b-man17> (recomending from experience ;) )
Oct 17 02:42:09 <jaem_N810> b-man17: I concurr
Oct 17 02:42:16 <jaem_N810> sounds like a recipe for Badness
Oct 17 02:51:58 <penguinbait> zerojay do you know if it is even running your script
Oct 17 02:53:00 <wirelessdreamer> once the scratchbox and the skd are installed with nokia-binaries and i'm in Xeypher after running af-sb-init.sh start, should I have a virual functioning n900? or is it still missing most of the default apps?
Oct 17 02:53:05 <wirelessdreamer> *skd = sdk
Oct 17 02:53:29 <Firebird> not exactly
Oct 17 02:57:30 <zerojay> penguinbait: I'm not.
Oct 17 02:57:41 <zerojay> Not sure it's being run, I mean.
Oct 17 02:58:36 <penguinbait> add some lines that echo to a file or pipe some output from the commands to a file in /tmp and see if you getting anything or any errors
Oct 17 02:59:17 <penguinbait> I assume permissions are executable
**** ENDING LOGGING AT Sat Oct 17 02:59:57 2009