**** BEGIN LOGGING AT Wed Dec 30 02:59:57 2009 Dec 30 03:00:29 if you have full control over the uart clock you don't even need circuitry Dec 30 03:00:37 most arm chips have that Dec 30 03:00:56 Sellinng the midi-bt adapter means you can also sell the software to make the music Dec 30 03:01:52 youd need to make iphone and s60 versions too Dec 30 03:03:08 Anyone with a N900, could you tell me what happens when you hit CTRL+SPACE? Dec 30 03:03:37 nothing happened in browser Dec 30 03:04:00 in terminal i see "input language switched" Dec 30 03:04:05 Ah!!! Dec 30 03:04:17 I think that's interesting. Dec 30 03:04:23 i dont Dec 30 03:04:40 I haven't read about it in any of the forums. Did you discover it fureddo ? Dec 30 03:04:56 On mine, a monkey popped out of the 3.5mm socket, and yelled 'fish' in a norwegian accent. Dec 30 03:05:05 i just get a space :( Dec 30 03:05:58 pupnik, Not yet but that's probably what caused the bug. I think that if I just change the keyboard accelerator CTRL+SPACE that was used by my application to something else that it will prevent the bug occurring again. Dec 30 03:06:48 pupnik, It may be a bug related to Qt, actually, and not necessarily my application. Dec 30 03:07:59 ah midi runs 31,250 baud hehe. now i understand ali1234 Dec 30 03:09:21 do you remember this thing? http://www.amiga-hardware.com/showhardware.cgi?HARDID=698 Dec 30 03:10:02 inside it there is just a 74L04 buffer costing about 10p Dec 30 03:10:29 more then Dec 30 03:10:35 hmm, the browser isn't working, it hangs no matter how I try to open it Dec 30 03:10:35 because the amiga could do MIDI on it's serial port just like the ST ... it just didn't have the right socket Dec 30 03:10:36 even 74 logic wasn't very cheap Dec 30 03:11:26 I remember picking up June 1986 BYTE magazine in library and seing an article written by a 17 year old on building a MIDI pc adapter Dec 30 03:12:41 the roalan.com adapter claims async 1.2-115.2kbps full duplex Dec 30 03:21:11 how much rootfs space does fennec use? Dec 30 03:22:07 maybe the maemo packager should calc rootfs and /hp Dec 30 03:22:34 ... and /home fs usage and provide info in description Dec 30 03:24:32 fennec is damn slo Dec 30 03:24:32 w Dec 30 03:24:42 I have the nightly build repo added Dec 30 03:24:54 someone said though that there was an actual release today? Dec 30 03:25:28 http://www.mozilla.com/en-US/m/ Dec 30 03:26:16 what was the name of that plugin fennec uses to sync with the full desktop version Dec 30 03:26:18 x something Dec 30 03:26:42 weave Dec 30 03:27:34 clever idea odinm Dec 30 03:28:51 shinkamui: i gave up on fennec for now .. i hope the prereleases are debug builds which do some resource intensive things which wil finally optimized out Dec 30 03:29:17 me too Dec 30 03:29:27 fennec looks cool, but its slow as a nuttsack Dec 30 03:29:38 if not, fennec will never get a dent. at least not until we have phones with 2Ghz processors and 2GB Ram :P Dec 30 03:33:41 lol Dec 30 03:34:02 I remember trying a mobile build of mozilla on a pocketpc some years ago Dec 30 03:34:08 it was attroicious Dec 30 03:34:30 tear looks nice .. at least in sense of potential, but i think microb is stil the most useful and fast browser on the n900 Dec 30 03:34:30 but with 3 times the power its unfortunate the performance hasn't improved much after all these years Dec 30 03:35:13 hmm, openssh seems to hang during install :/ Dec 30 03:35:20 huh Dec 30 03:35:23 not here Dec 30 03:35:29 i have built the ugliest, fastest graphical browser cehteh :) links2 with graphics and mouse support Dec 30 03:35:30 it asks for a new user password Dec 30 03:35:50 pupnik: for n900? please send it to testing! Dec 30 03:35:51 it's breathtakingly ugly and yet... fun too Dec 30 03:35:54 no way Dec 30 03:36:00 yes, after the new password dialogue Dec 30 03:36:07 oh, there it finished, I wonder what it was doing Dec 30 03:36:08 pupnik: they once had javascript too .. quite broken :P Dec 30 03:36:11 entropy, perhaps? Dec 30 03:36:26 cehteh: buy me a N900 and I will port links2 for you :D Dec 30 03:36:30 pupnik: i like links2 as doc viewer Dec 30 03:36:46 luke-jr: lol, i can do that by myself if i am in dare need Dec 30 03:36:52 :p Dec 30 03:37:05 but if pupnik already did, why not push it to testing? Dec 30 03:39:23 reminds me that i still need to cancel my 2nd n900 order .. if i dont want to send this amazon warehouse deal back :P Dec 30 03:39:52 if you want it it's on my site, just install by hand Dec 30 03:40:14 pupnik: well its not hildonized or? Dec 30 03:40:25 nope... same exe runs on 770, N800, N810, N900 Dec 30 03:40:28 at least for scrolling that would be a requirement Dec 30 03:40:59 then it would be less ugly Dec 30 03:41:12 how can one make scrollbars biggier for non hildonized apps (like emacs) Dec 30 03:41:29 mhm maybe gtkrc ... Dec 30 03:43:37 Threads Tagged with premature ejaculation Dec 30 03:43:54 Firefox Browser is out!!!! (Multi-page thread 1 2 3 ) Dec 30 03:43:57 ha ha ha Dec 30 03:45:41 well for the deaktop 3.5 was/is a big improvement over 3.1 Dec 30 03:50:09 hmm, todays beta is running a little better Dec 30 03:50:18 its almost...dare I say...useable Dec 30 03:51:40 when N900 crashes does it drop Opps ? Dec 30 03:55:02 bootreason=32wd_to Dec 30 03:55:02 oh, holy crap, nokia messaging is horrible Dec 30 03:55:20 either that or the n900 email app is horrible Dec 30 03:55:55 email app needs some work for sure esp with network protocol side Dec 30 03:56:13 yeah, yesterday, i couldn't send mail Dec 30 03:56:23 i dont like the IM having all contacts jumbled up Dec 30 03:56:30 so, i changed my theme back to the original theme, thinking that somehow screwed it up Dec 30 03:56:39 then i deleted my email settings and redid them, and it worked again Dec 30 03:56:45 and just now, none of the email seems to be working Dec 30 03:56:55 so i'm going to remove nokia messaging and just go directly with gmail and see if that helps Dec 30 03:58:01 odinm_: yeah, i don't like that at all either Dec 30 03:58:39 my grievance with the email system is that mail isn't downloaded as it comes in Dec 30 03:58:45 so ithe client feels sluggish Dec 30 04:00:13 it's not just sluggish; it actually sometimes isn't doing anything useful other than running your network connection Dec 30 04:04:51 shinkamui same here Dec 30 04:05:08 i have the same issue with thunderbird too Dec 30 04:05:25 but that doesn't belong here :P Dec 30 04:09:00 2nd unexpected poweroff in 20min again bootreason=32wd_to Dec 30 04:09:44 just xchat and rss reader open, plugged into charger using wlan for connectivity Dec 30 04:10:03 odinm: chalk it up to the software being suck Dec 30 04:12:08 m00f! Dec 30 04:12:35 wb johnx Dec 30 04:15:03 but isn't it a "kernel" watchdog? Dec 30 04:15:24 so kernel is stuck not app? Dec 30 04:15:39 where do we see bootreason again? /proc? Dec 30 04:17:38 yeah Dec 30 04:17:42 cat /proc/bootreason Dec 30 04:20:00 i don't see duke nukem 3d in the extras-testing Dec 30 04:20:05 i think someone lied Dec 30 04:20:05 * cehteh reflashed 2 days ago since it was bricked after too much reboots and no reboot since then Dec 30 04:20:27 Vratha: its there, but i didnt figured out how to use it Dec 30 04:21:06 johnx: today you missed: keyboard fix for dosbox by javis, ogl-ES dice simulator by ali123 .. some other fun stuff Dec 30 04:21:09 bricked = unfixable Dec 30 04:21:29 pupnik, cool to see the gl-es stuff being used. did the framebuffer issue get fixed? Dec 30 04:21:46 you mean for blitting/scaling? Dec 30 04:22:11 johnx: hang on boot oOooo Dec 30 04:22:17 err, I dunno, but I heard that at first it was displaying in a totally garbled way Dec 30 04:22:46 hhmm .. why doesnt emacs respect my gtkrc? Dec 30 04:22:51 afaik that is not solved Dec 30 04:25:49 cehteh: it's in extras-devel, not extras-testing like this site i saw said Dec 30 04:25:58 could be Dec 30 04:26:03 it is Dec 30 04:26:14 heh Dec 30 04:26:30 http://www.imgtec.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=475 johnx - javis found this today Dec 30 04:28:28 pupnik, is something similar available for other GPUs (ie, nvidia or ati on the desktop)? or is this a neat trick that only the omap3/sgx can do? Dec 30 04:28:43 wtf, no duke nukem 3d sound Dec 30 04:29:09 Man, my slide has gone so crooked. Dec 30 04:29:19 really? what happened? Dec 30 04:29:25 Dunno Dec 30 04:29:38 It's just slowly gone off over time Dec 30 04:29:49 It's about half a mm down on the right side. Dec 30 04:29:52 so, I'm all kinds of happy about my 900, but I can't seem to find skype. So I go to skype.com, as well as maemo-select, and they both say to go to skype.com/m where it also isn't. Dec 30 04:29:59 September proto, mind you. Dec 30 04:30:09 jX, it's on the device already, but no video yet Dec 30 04:30:17 hints on where to find it? Dec 30 04:30:33 jX, account settings. Dec 30 04:30:43 It's built-in, bub. Dec 30 04:30:58 jX, open the phone app -> menu -> accounts Dec 30 04:31:22 ahh Dec 30 04:31:28 well, that's intuitive. Dec 30 04:31:30 thanks. :) Dec 30 04:32:44 johnx, weird thing is, when I correct it with a hand the left edge gets uneven. . . . Dec 30 04:32:56 is something stuck back there? Dec 30 04:33:07 oh yeah, what IRC client are y'all using? Dec 30 04:33:09 or maybe one slide is over-extended, not under-extended? Dec 30 04:33:47 jX, on the N900? I was playing with x-chat and had a version that worked. I have to find the working one again, cause I think the one in extras-devel is definitely kinda b0rken Dec 30 04:34:10 I'm not thrilled with the idea of using pidgin again. Dec 30 04:34:29 jX: XChat is in extras or devel, I forget... Dec 30 04:34:57 it crashed on me when i wanted to change some preferences Dec 30 04:35:04 that is true.. Dec 30 04:35:18 known bug, saw it listed somewhere... Dec 30 04:35:37 johnx, nothing stuck as far as I can tell. Dec 30 04:35:38 there is also irssi Dec 30 04:36:34 GAN900, does it feel like it's snapping in on both sides? Dec 30 04:36:56 johnx, yup, slide feels fine. Dec 30 04:37:10 It just locks crooked, seemingly. :\ Dec 30 04:37:16 anyone of you had ever success uploading pics to ovi? Dec 30 04:37:27 ye Dec 30 04:37:34 (created ovi account from the share preferences itself) Dec 30 04:37:45 doesnt work for me, just hangs Dec 30 04:37:57 ye Dec 30 04:38:04 I haven't figured out why I should use ovi instead of flickr, really Dec 30 04:39:42 johnx: i dont have a flickr account .. and i dont think yahoo needs all my personal data (way more than ovi) to open an account there Dec 30 04:40:05 i am all after a scp share thing where i can upload to my own server Dec 30 04:40:32 I'd like to make the photo uploading automatic Dec 30 04:40:46 and have the option to use both flickr and scp/sftp/webdav/whatever at the same time Dec 30 04:40:53 yeah Dec 30 04:41:24 well i dont want all my photo automatic uploaded, but for people with flatrate it might be useful Dec 30 04:41:37 morning Dec 30 04:41:41 wow. the yahoo ToS *is* actually kinda scary. "You also agree to: (a) Provide true, accurate, current and complete information about yourself ... and (b) maintain and update the Registration Data to keep it true ..." Dec 30 04:41:43 at least to ones own webspace and not publically Dec 30 04:42:05 cehteh, you comfortable with a little scripting? Dec 30 04:42:10 johnx: yes, i dont want an account there .. Dec 30 04:42:18 johnx: uhm yes Dec 30 04:42:58 ah, sorry. I misread what you said earlier. if you did want auto-upload you could do some neat tricks with dbus-monitor Dec 30 04:43:43 heh, I could cron it up too Dec 30 04:43:57 uhm why has mameo no lua community .. there is only lua51 but no libs, no rocks Dec 30 04:44:17 n900 has no cron by default Dec 30 04:44:30 yea, but I bet I could build one.. Dec 30 04:44:37 sure Dec 30 04:45:09 hehe .. share connect over uucp :) Dec 30 04:45:47 Oh thats a cute app, I never considered it... It uses the FM transmitter to send RDS, so it can display text on a capable radio's display Dec 30 04:46:09 FM RDS Notify in devel, haven't tried it yet because I lack any other radio Dec 30 04:46:39 SplasPood, does the RDS transmitter app allow you to send arbitrary strings Dec 30 04:46:40 yeah sms on your car hifi ... Dec 30 04:46:59 jaem|away: yes looks like someone figured that out :) Dec 30 04:47:15 i dont have a radio :) .. but cool idea Dec 30 04:47:20 cehteh, yay Dec 30 04:47:23 I don't either, but I agree Dec 30 04:47:24 counts as 'useful app' .. Dec 30 04:47:35 * johnx is no longer amused by fetchmail :| Dec 30 04:47:51 on the n900? Dec 30 04:48:15 in general Dec 30 04:48:23 well ok then Dec 30 04:48:46 probably user-error but for a second I thought it deleted all my mail from 2005 on and I nearly had a heart attack :S Dec 30 04:48:57 can fetchmail do imap4 with idle support and does modest support local maildirs? Dec 30 04:48:58 cehteh, hmm... do you have a link to the code handy, or should I search for it? Dec 30 04:49:14 jaem|away: no i dont have Dec 30 04:49:17 kk Dec 30 04:49:21 * jaem|away just had an idea Dec 30 04:49:38 what's the app called? Dec 30 04:49:40 anyone have any luck getting 'screen' installed on an n900? Dec 30 04:49:41 cehteh, even if it doesn't support local maildirs, you could still use a local imap proxy Dec 30 04:49:51 is it just "FM RDS Notify"? Dec 30 04:50:26 well, a useable mail client is to be seen on n900 :/ Dec 30 04:50:45 jaem|away: yea Dec 30 04:50:46 claws is not hildonized, and not terribly stable (ok it works) Dec 30 04:50:55 cehteh, it's more usable than Modest in Diablo, at least Dec 30 04:50:55 jaem|away: dunno if it allows random stuff Dec 30 04:50:57 heh. strangely modest has always worked well for me Dec 30 04:51:01 it said SMS, music names, etc... Dec 30 04:51:04 modest make fame of its name as in features and usability Dec 30 04:51:15 Bolapara: what is the problem with it? Dec 30 04:51:21 it's still lacking things like "search", but at least (in my experience) it works, and at a reasonable speed Dec 30 04:51:33 Modest in Diablo didn't like my Gmail IMAP Dec 30 04:51:33 it lacks sooo much Dec 30 04:51:40 cehteh, yeah Dec 30 04:51:56 but it's not fundamentally flawed, from what I can see... it just needs work Dec 30 04:52:04 and as long as someone gets to it, I'm fine with that Dec 30 04:52:32 cehteh, no search is kind of ridiculous, I admit Dec 30 04:52:43 it still has no imap idle ... lacks folder subscritions, notifies only the most recent mail (hey i want another layer of subscriptions and only get notifies for selected folders), no searched Dec 30 04:52:47 no subfolders Dec 30 04:52:49 pupnik: im referring to the program that multiplexes terminls Dec 30 04:53:00 poor performance with imap4 (well thats on the fix) Dec 30 04:53:23 cehteh, I noticed one interesting thing, although it may be something completely mundane that I'm just not up on... Dec 30 04:53:25 called gnu screen Dec 30 04:53:30 jaem|away: well somehow modest is something nokia gets paied for :( Dec 30 04:53:36 Yes, reading comprehension is a problem for many people... Dec 30 04:53:49 screen > * Dec 30 04:54:22 cehteh, I normally use the Gmail Folders mod through a Firefox addon, that simulates subfolder arrangements with '/'-delimited labels... Dec 30 04:54:50 jaem|away: i have my own mail server and 1.5gb maildir ... Dec 30 04:54:57 and Modest displays them all inline, but marks the "subfolders" with a bullet per level of depth Dec 30 04:55:01 and quite some subfolders Dec 30 04:55:12 cehteh, I'm planning on setting up a mail server at some point Dec 30 04:55:31 well wait for a useable mail client on n900 first :P Dec 30 04:55:35 but my friend and I share the bill for the server, and we wanted to give it a few months to make sure we are going to keep it long-term before switching Dec 30 04:56:02 jep we run a open source projects server with a handful of people Dec 30 04:56:51 cehteh, ah Dec 30 04:56:56 jaem|away, aw. rolling your own mail server for fun. always a painful experience :) Dec 30 04:57:05 nah Dec 30 04:57:15 ours doesn't have much (I think my friend is moving his blog to it), but we have some plans Dec 30 04:57:36 postfix & dovecot .. works fine and is manageable Dec 30 04:57:41 the main one is to run a DHT bootstrap node for a project we are planning out Dec 30 04:57:45 if we ever get it done :P Dec 30 04:58:07 it's a drop-in addon for pacman (Arch Linux) to allow package distribution via bittorrent Dec 30 04:58:11 i think i have about 10 vservers on that box Dec 30 04:58:37 cehteh, ldap or mysql? Dec 30 04:58:38 cehteh, specs? Dec 30 04:58:46 johnx: no db Dec 30 04:58:59 aaah, unix accounts? Dec 30 04:59:14 johnx: only mailinglists and forwarding accounts Dec 30 04:59:33 my own mailserver is here at home, unix accounts there Dec 30 04:59:49 I'm doing dovecot+postfix+LDAP+webmail+caldav for work and it's less than straightforward :) Dec 30 05:00:31 yea I used to run my own as well Dec 30 05:00:33 yeah, thats way more than we have Dec 30 05:00:37 running your own mail server is for the birds Dec 30 05:00:48 sure it all SOUNDS like fun at first :P Dec 30 05:00:57 SplasPood, only if you use IPoA Dec 30 05:01:00 -snerk- Dec 30 05:01:01 I actually switched to gmail for domains Dec 30 05:01:14 BUT I still pass all the email through my own exim instance... Dec 30 05:01:37 Running a very simple instance of exim I can deal with Dec 30 05:01:39 SplasPood, agreed for the most part :) I'm willing to put up with the upfront time-sink at the beginning, but what really kills it is dealing with spam filtering :| Dec 30 05:10:58 is it safe to remove localization packages you never need? there are *hundreds* of those. Dec 30 05:11:23 damn I hate my router Dec 30 05:11:49 shinkamui, what's the issue? Dec 30 05:13:56 it just resets all connections on me randomly and periodically Dec 30 05:14:12 I lose all my ssh, irc, and IM connections Dec 30 05:14:24 and the services on my NAS disconnect and reconnect Dec 30 05:14:28 is it a linux-based router? Dec 30 05:14:34 no, thats probably the problem Dec 30 05:14:37 its a cheapie netgear Dec 30 05:14:48 im gonna replace it in the next few days Dec 30 05:14:58 either with a wrt54gl or a cisco router Dec 30 05:15:03 good plan Dec 30 05:15:24 shinkamui, my GL's okay, but it's still pretty cheap Dec 30 05:15:31 it's hard to find a good router for any sane price Dec 30 05:15:34 it's sad that the wrt54gl is still the most reliable/well-supported thing out there essentially :| Dec 30 05:15:35 yea Dec 30 05:15:54 the consumer ones stink, for the most part, and anything else is generally too expensive, and/or overkill Dec 30 05:15:55 I had great success with dd-wrt on my old wrt54g Dec 30 05:16:07 until it burned outduring a lighning storm Dec 30 05:16:24 replaced it with this netgear and I've been crying ever seince Dec 30 05:16:25 since Dec 30 05:16:44 just needed something to get all my computers back up Dec 30 05:16:54 and I put it off and put it off until now its pretty much culminated Dec 30 05:17:05 into a do or die situation Dec 30 05:18:49 shinkamui, my friend toasted two nice Cisco routers, and we have no idea why Dec 30 05:19:11 if it wasn't for the fact that we killed two of them in the exact same configurations and circumstances, I'd call it coincidence Dec 30 05:19:13 ...I still might Dec 30 05:19:24 lol Dec 30 05:19:33 what happened was that we tried to pull a file from FTP (a repo mirror, I think), and the connection hung Dec 30 05:19:36 I still hate working with IOS Dec 30 05:19:40 checked the router, and it was bricked Dec 30 05:19:41 :/ Dec 30 05:19:43 very odd Dec 30 05:19:50 and it sounds improbable Dec 30 05:20:07 but we don't have any other ideas Dec 30 05:20:08 lol Dec 30 05:23:04 wow Dec 30 05:23:08 and you bricked 2 routers that way? Dec 30 05:23:10 thats crazy Dec 30 05:24:03 shinkamui, well, I can't prove it was the cause Dec 30 05:24:10 that would be one heck of a bug if it was :P Dec 30 05:24:16 these weren't cheap ones, either Dec 30 05:24:23 now he just runs a pfSense VM :) Dec 30 05:24:40 maybe you have power problems? Dec 30 05:25:19 pupnik, oh, it wouldn't surprise me, given the general "care" with which they maintain the Residence rooms, but he runs everything through a fairly decent UPS Dec 30 05:25:48 pupnik, we were going to see if we could revive them with the magic that is JTAG, but we never got around to it Dec 30 05:26:36 hmmm...I keep thinking about a UPS for home, but it always feels silly to go AC-DC and DC-AC with a pile of (essentially) car batteries Dec 30 05:26:56 lol johnx Dec 30 05:26:57 that Dec 30 05:26:58 was Dec 30 05:26:59 awesome Dec 30 05:27:17 $ uptime Dec 30 05:27:17 06:27:02 up 398 days, Dec 30 05:27:21 that was obvious Dec 30 05:27:29 .. needs a new kernel in 2 days ... and no i dont have a ups Dec 30 05:27:37 i doubt i need one :P Dec 30 05:27:49 one more thing Dec 30 05:27:53 I fucking love the N900 Dec 30 05:28:02 using apt on my iphone was about 10x slower Dec 30 05:28:08 built in ups here. Dec 30 05:28:09 shinkamui, and the best part is that it's true for any "normal" UPS Dec 30 05:28:48 APC was an unusually good company back in the 90s Dec 30 05:28:57 but UPSes are a PITA Dec 30 05:29:07 given that routers and low-end NASes tend to run off relatively low power DC (5v or 9v or 12v) I keep wanting to make a proper lithium-ion powered UPS that outputs, or maybe just get a battery for each device Dec 30 05:29:14 cehteh, I recall seeing something about a method for hotswapping kernels at some point... have you heard of it? Dec 30 05:29:24 I just remembered, and I can't think of the name Dec 30 05:29:35 kexec or the other hotpatch thing yes Dec 30 05:29:41 kexec Dec 30 05:29:41 anyone tried installing Citrix lately on the N900 Dec 30 05:29:43 ksplice was it? Dec 30 05:29:47 I want to try the arm build Dec 30 05:30:07 but thats kindof limited, the services have to be shutdown for kexec and anyways once a fsck every year or so is not wrong Dec 30 05:30:27 yes ksplice .. but that only hotpatches the running kernel, doesnt swap Dec 30 05:31:26 my server has less uptime :P .. i configured a quite pedantic watchdog there and when its router doesnt ping it reboots Dec 30 05:33:38 hrm... is this RDS Notify program not FOSS? Dec 30 05:33:56 it's in Garage, but its source is not hosted there Dec 30 05:34:17 oh, never mind Dec 30 05:34:18 silly me Dec 30 05:34:37 how long can RDS messages be? Dec 30 05:34:56 and its quite funny if anyone in the car next to you can read your SMS :P Dec 30 05:35:38 it would be if the FM radio had that range Dec 30 05:36:15 oh good grief Dec 30 05:36:17 maybe you shall send "Oil pressure fault, Please stop immediately" .. tune in a common frequency and the ride the highway :) Dec 30 05:36:30 GVoice Telepathy plugin is called "telepathy-theonering"?! Dec 30 05:36:34 *facepalm* Dec 30 05:36:44 pupnik: well next car should work .. considering that the antennas are outside Dec 30 05:36:51 I *like* silly FOSS naming conventions, but that's pushing it Dec 30 05:36:53 lol Dec 30 05:38:43 mmm, think I might pick up a netgear WNR3500L soonish Dec 30 05:39:25 why? Dec 30 05:39:29 so is there really a front facing camera in this puppy? Any one know of software that can access it? Dec 30 05:39:50 luke-jr, out-of-the-box linux support and very nice specs Dec 30 05:40:00 jX: 'mirror' Dec 30 05:40:00 jX, yes, there is a camera, and you can use it Dec 30 05:40:03 but not much does Dec 30 05:40:08 what cehteh said Dec 30 05:40:11 johnx: like actual Linux, or some proprietary fork like Linksys does? Dec 30 05:40:14 wicked Dec 30 05:40:21 luke-jr, it ships with openwrt Dec 30 05:40:21 but dont be shocked you dont look that bad, the camera/firmware is utterly crap Dec 30 05:40:42 now, I should search for mirror in the app manager, or it's installed already? Dec 30 05:40:46 might be a sutpid question Dec 30 05:40:47 jX, yeah, it really is Dec 30 05:40:52 but if I ahve a program thats looking for Motif Dec 30 05:40:53 v3 Dec 30 05:40:56 johnx: that doesn't really answer. RouterBoard ships with Openwrt too Dec 30 05:40:56 shinkamui, bwahahaah Dec 30 05:40:58 good luck Dec 30 05:41:04 damn Dec 30 05:41:12 so no go on making a fake simlink to libXm.so.6 Dec 30 05:41:13 shinkamui, why not just get CDE running on the N900 while you're at it Dec 30 05:41:25 shinkamui, Motif? Seriously? Dec 30 05:41:25 *bwapp!* Dec 30 05:41:27 johnx: 8 MB flash is not very much Dec 30 05:41:28 * shinkamui takes a shot tot he face Dec 30 05:41:34 jaem|away: citrix :) Dec 30 05:41:39 shinkamui, ah Dec 30 05:41:45 well, I'm not saying it's impossible Dec 30 05:41:50 I'm just laughing at you :) Dec 30 05:41:58 jaem|away I can' get the client to run, but not the manager Dec 30 05:42:00 luke-jr, USB and 64MB of RAM and built-in wifi, plus a nice solid case Dec 30 05:42:01 which makes it useless Dec 30 05:42:16 but the routerboard does look kinda interesting Dec 30 05:42:45 shinkamui, run it in a debian chroot Dec 30 05:43:00 yea, I read that a lot actually Dec 30 05:43:02 johnx: nope, can't run Linux on WNR3500L Dec 30 05:43:09 was hoping I might be able to make it run natively Dec 30 05:43:13 johnx: it uses an undocumented Broadcom chipset apparently Dec 30 05:43:20 http://laforge.gnumonks.org/weblog/2009/10/07/#20091007-netgear_myopenrouter Dec 30 05:44:17 luke-jr, uhm...it *does* run linux Dec 30 05:44:25 johnx: no, it runs a proprietary fork Dec 30 05:44:50 proprietary fork of Linux != Linux Dec 30 05:45:10 you realize that's a contradiction in terms, right? Dec 30 05:45:16 jX: only in theory Dec 30 05:45:22 jX: in practice, it's pretty commonplace for routers Dec 30 05:45:25 either you run linux, or you don't. you can't close source a fork, only your non-linked emhancements Dec 30 05:45:30 no, that's called "theft" Dec 30 05:45:31 jX: they do it anyway Dec 30 05:45:32 not a fork Dec 30 05:45:37 it's called copyright infringement Dec 30 05:45:39 but nobody sues Dec 30 05:45:41 :/ Dec 30 05:45:41 yes, and they routinely get called on teh carpet for forced to open the code Dec 30 05:45:45 actually, they do Dec 30 05:45:47 jX: nope Dec 30 05:45:49 yup Dec 30 05:45:56 nVidia still gets away with it. Linksys still gets away with it. Dec 30 05:45:56 I can cite cases Dec 30 05:46:04 nvidia gets away with what now? Dec 30 05:46:19 proprietary fork of Linux Dec 30 05:46:28 and where is this fork run? Dec 30 05:46:35 you mean proprietary drivers, right? Dec 30 05:46:39 most desktop Linux PCs with nVidia cards Dec 30 05:46:41 I don't htink he knwos what he means. Dec 30 05:46:53 I don't know of nvidia releasing a fork Dec 30 05:46:55 dmj7261: Linux doesn't have "drivers" in the microkernel sense, it has hardware support Dec 30 05:47:08 luke-jr, pretty sure the nvidia kernel code is actually open Dec 30 05:47:09 nvidia's blobs are kernel modules Dec 30 05:47:11 not ther kernel Dec 30 05:47:11 Linux is a monolithic kernel. All "drivers" are part of it. Dec 30 05:47:15 wrong Dec 30 05:47:18 johnx: not GPL-compatible Dec 30 05:47:27 it can link to closed source blobs and still comply with the GPL Dec 30 05:47:31 that doesn't count as a "fork" Dec 30 05:47:35 jX: wrong Dec 30 05:47:37 read the GPL Dec 30 05:47:41 I have Dec 30 05:47:43 you cannot link to closed source blobs Dec 30 05:47:53 but you CAN load them Dec 30 05:47:58 the link headers are open source Dec 30 05:48:14 and those call the closed BLOB which is fine. Dec 30 05:48:27 jX: open source != GPL-compatible Dec 30 05:48:28 luke-jr, in the case of the kernel isn't there an explicit exception to the GPL for this specific case? Dec 30 05:48:35 johnx: no Dec 30 05:48:38 lucent: Correct, also, day != night Dec 30 05:48:41 er, luke-jr Dec 30 05:48:43 johnx: the ONLY exception to Linux's GPL is for userland Dec 30 05:48:44 if nVidia were in violation of the GPL don't you think one of the many organisations that sue for violations of the GPL would of already started action? Dec 30 05:48:46 but back on topic Dec 30 05:48:53 that nvidia does is in fact fine by the GPL Dec 30 05:48:57 Termana: nope, because of this exact problem :( Dec 30 05:49:07 Termana: the person suing will get all the blame, and nVidia treated as a martyr Dec 30 05:49:12 jX: nope Dec 30 05:49:15 yup Dec 30 05:49:18 this has been settled. Dec 30 05:49:20 long ago. Dec 30 05:49:27 jX: it has been settled as illegal, long ago :) Dec 30 05:49:32 no, it's not Dec 30 05:49:36 nvidia as a martyr... i don't think courts give 2 god damns about that Dec 30 05:49:36 cite sources of please stop. Dec 30 05:49:39 jX: go read Greg's article on Linux myths :p Dec 30 05:49:47 this is about the time when the folks in europe are sleeping, and suddenly there's no more coding happening Dec 30 05:49:52 http://www.kroah.com/log/linux/ols_2006_keynote.html Dec 30 05:49:55 luke-jr, do you really think that http://gpl-violations.org/ is afraid of suing nvidia over this? Dec 30 05:49:57 nvidia isn't in violation of the GPL Dec 30 05:50:05 Vratha: correct. Dec 30 05:50:05 if they were, we'd have seen some lawsuit by now Dec 30 05:50:11 luke's had a little too much RMS tea. Dec 30 05:50:16 yeah Dec 30 05:50:17 johnx: I'm not sure that gpl-violations.org has copyright of Linux Dec 30 05:50:31 pupnik - thats right, luke-jr is awake which means its flamebaiting time Dec 30 05:50:47 Vratha: I can cite undeniable examples that prove that wrong Dec 30 05:50:47 ahh, I was unaware luke was a known troll. Dec 30 05:50:49 my bad. Dec 30 05:51:00 * Termana grabs some popcorn Dec 30 05:51:06 luke-jr: You're right, no need to continue arguing, you've shown us all the light. Dec 30 05:51:07 luke-jr: i doubt it Dec 30 05:51:10 moving on. Dec 30 05:51:25 and besides, i won't be clicking on any links you send Dec 30 05:51:30 Vratha: the Zaurus originally shipped with all those "drivers" in the single bzImage blob and nobody ever sued Sharp Dec 30 05:51:54 luke-jr: hang on, i'm not caring, and i also don't have background knowledge of the Zaurus and Sharp or this straw man Dec 30 05:51:59 jX - not so much a troll. i just don't advise mentioning even the word proprietary around him Dec 30 05:52:15 Termana: Has no clue what it means, yeah... Dec 30 05:52:33 "Closed source Linux kernel modules are illegal. That's it, it is very simple. I've had the misfortune of talking to a lot of different IP lawyers over the years about this topic, and every one that I've talked to all agree that there is no way that anyone can create a Linux kernel module, today, that can be closed source. It just violates the GPL due to fun things like derivative works and linking and other stuff. Again, it's very Dec 30 05:52:34 luke-jr, so, how much would it cost me to get myself a decently functioning 802.11n routerboard system setup? Dec 30 05:52:36 simple." Dec 30 05:52:52 johnx: dunno, I'm still using g Dec 30 05:53:08 johnx: maybe look for an Atheros or Ralink chipset router Dec 30 05:53:39 alright then, s/802.11n/802.11g/ Dec 30 05:53:42 my G access point is a La Fonera, which is Atheros Dec 30 05:54:03 luke-jr: you are very very confused. for it to violate the GPL, they'd have to make their code an integral part of the kernel code. running your code in kernel space does not violate any license. no one said "only i can be in kernel space", and if they did, i doubt it'd be enforceable Dec 30 05:54:30 Vratha: distributing GPL'd software linking to a blob is prohibited, and nVidia does just that Dec 30 05:54:34 SplasPood, have you tried that RDS app? Dec 30 05:54:38 nvidia keeping its code in a separate space and using open source, GPL compatible headers to send messages to their blobs means nothing Dec 30 05:54:54 Vratha: the only technicality is that it's not "copyright infringement", but rather "contract violation" Dec 30 05:55:13 Vratha: the "headers" as you call them are not GPL compatible Dec 30 05:55:44 connecting your code to GPL'd code at runtime is not a violation. if it was, i wouldn't be able to make syscalls from kernel space without violating the GPL Dec 30 05:55:47 Vratha: being derived work of Linux (undeniable), those "headers" are legally required to be GPL; distributing GPL'd code that links to proprietary blobs is prohibited by the GPL Dec 30 05:55:49 that's just unenforcable Dec 30 05:55:50 get over it Dec 30 05:55:59 and they've already not won that bet Dec 30 05:56:05 luke-jr: But GPL code that LOADS non-GPL code IS IN FACT LEGAL Dec 30 05:56:12 Vratha: Linux has a specific exception for user-space Dec 30 05:56:29 jX: not if it links to it also Dec 30 05:56:36 luke-jr: so? apparently the rest of their contract is unenforcable or some big names would've lost by now Dec 30 05:56:39 but none have Dec 30 05:56:42 luke-jr, does it matter to you that the *author* of Linux sides against you? Dec 30 05:56:52 johnx: there is no single author of Linux Dec 30 05:56:59 yes there is Dec 30 05:57:02 RMS wrote it all Dec 30 05:57:03 there was at first ;) Dec 30 05:57:10 oh wow, a technicality Dec 30 05:57:11 johnx: Greg (as I sourced a minute or two ago) is one of the major kernel developers Dec 30 05:57:22 jX: AFAIK, RMS didn't write a line Dec 30 05:57:22 "it's not one person; it's many! i sure showed you!!!" Dec 30 05:57:29 RMS wrote all of Linux, which is why he wants it called GNU/Linux Dec 30 05:57:29 no dobut RMS *would* sue if he had any code in there Dec 30 05:57:40 RMS would lose Dec 30 05:57:41 he is tired of that Torvoid kid ghetting all the credit. Dec 30 05:57:48 jX, lol Dec 30 05:58:17 jaem|away: nah, I don't have any RDS capable devices Dec 30 05:58:35 hmm http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPII.dll?ViewItem&item=220526816961 i probably want this one Dec 30 05:58:40 will formatting my SD card ext3 still allow it to automount Dec 30 05:58:46 luke-jr, you're not doing a very good job of convincing me about the routerboard. :P Dec 30 05:58:47 hey everyone, i want you all to know that when i send IPC messages to my kernel-space blob, it's a violation of the contract! even though it isn't directly involved with the kernel in any way! except the message passing, and that's already GPL code! Dec 30 05:58:57 or was that non automount problem only on earlier versions of maemo Dec 30 05:59:05 SplasPood, did you see my bracelet hack? I'm curious if RDS might be a really cheap alternative Dec 30 05:59:08 johnx: oh right, the routerboard does G too I think? Dec 30 05:59:10 * RST38h slaughters a penguin for the RMS Dec 30 05:59:14 RMS wrote the userland utilities and not Linux Dec 30 05:59:19 RMS is God! Dec 30 05:59:25 luke-jr: what is your professional / educational background? Dec 30 05:59:27 RMS WROTE IT ALL Dec 30 05:59:28 luke-jr, does it come with a wifi card? Dec 30 05:59:30 EVERY LINE Dec 30 05:59:30 YES Dec 30 05:59:45 shinkamui, it automounted in maemo 4.1, but only the first partition Dec 30 05:59:48 jaem|away: nope, no idea what you're referring to Dec 30 05:59:49 Arkenoi: Make sure keyboard is usable though Dec 30 05:59:54 SplasPood, if it would work, I can probably convince ST Micro to sample me up some RDS decoders if I ask really nicely :) Dec 30 05:59:54 Vratha: it would be infringement, except that Linux isn't strict GPL, and has an explicit exception for userland Dec 30 05:59:59 johnx: IIRC Dec 30 06:00:10 Vratha: I write software. Sometimes proprietary. Dec 30 06:00:11 jX - lol obviously your being sarcastic Dec 30 06:00:30 rst38h: according to the picture it should be.. Dec 30 06:00:38 sarcastic? No, sorry, I like girls. Dec 30 06:00:46 Termana: RMS disciples are never sarcastic Dec 30 06:00:53 RMS is not a sarcastic god. Dec 30 06:00:53 http://www.pdair.com/catalog/product_info.php?cPath=10100000_1900000_11000787&products_id=26892 or is this one better? Dec 30 06:00:58 luke-jr: no, it doesn't matter what the GPL says. writing code that sends messages to other pieces of code doesn't violate anything. nvidia's primary driver only sends messages. the bulk of it isn't even part of the actual kernel Dec 30 06:01:05 jX++ :D Dec 30 06:01:17 luke-jr - if you write proprietary software, whats with the knee-jerk reaction towards proprietary code Dec 30 06:01:31 Vratha: it doesn't "only send messages" Dec 30 06:01:36 if it did violate the contract, then the whole internet would be violating the contract, and as you can see, that is unconcionable (sp?) Dec 30 06:01:44 lol @ jX and RST38h Dec 30 06:02:00 Termana: I don't use proprietary software. Dec 30 06:02:08 luke: Really? Dec 30 06:02:43 hahahhahaha Dec 30 06:02:45 ~join us now and share the so-oftware~ Dec 30 06:02:52 * jaem|away covers his ears Dec 30 06:02:52 luke-jr: really? i didn't realize nvidia's kernel driver needed to use linux's SMP mechanisms or libs in order to write code to its own device. that would be crazy to think they could write their own! Dec 30 06:02:57 ~youlll be freee, hacker. youlll beee freeeeeee-ee-ee~ Dec 30 06:02:59 it's worse when RMS sings it :P Dec 30 06:03:06 i also didn't realize you knew everything about nvidia's kernel driver! Dec 30 06:03:16 that said, it was an "experience" Dec 30 06:03:17 Vratha: Linux' .. no 's since X has an s sound at the end Dec 30 06:03:20 jaem|away, lol Dec 30 06:03:26 * Macer hides Dec 30 06:03:32 us now and share the so-oftware~ is not a valid channel name. Dec 30 06:03:34 Macer: it has an X sound Dec 30 06:03:42 mhm .. emacs has dbus support... one step closer to EmacsOS .. :) Dec 30 06:03:50 Vratha: whether or not it *has to*, it does Dec 30 06:03:55 jaem|away, yeah, in the same way that falling down a flight of concrete stairs is an experience Dec 30 06:03:56 X actually is like ks Dec 30 06:03:56 pupnik, LOL Dec 30 06:03:58 :) Dec 30 06:03:59 sure, nVidia could loophole it and put their driver in userland Dec 30 06:04:01 but they didn't Dec 30 06:04:09 johnx, true, true Dec 30 06:04:10 Macer: cool, but here in english, we put 's after an X Dec 30 06:04:25 who turned this into a samantics debate about the spelling of Linux! :P Dec 30 06:04:29 Vratha, not as I was taught Dec 30 06:04:36 the apostraphe would be placed at the end of x and not require a 's Dec 30 06:04:37 but I must admit I'm inconsistent myself Dec 30 06:04:41 i actually like RMS's singing of it. cause it's *RMS*! :) Dec 30 06:04:48 Vratha: canadian? :) Dec 30 06:04:49 Macer: even if not required, it's not forbidden either Dec 30 06:05:05 Macer: no Dec 30 06:05:07 luke-jr: nothing is forbidden. shakespeare invented hundreds of words :) Dec 30 06:05:09 pupnik, well, yes, hence my comment about the "experience" - It was worth hearing once in person, but it is rather dreadful Dec 30 06:05:43 Here in Australia i'm pretty sure we use 's after an X Dec 30 06:05:50 and tell me Dec 30 06:06:02 when has australia ever been wrong? Dec 30 06:06:04 well, in Canada I was taught no Dec 30 06:06:06 :P Dec 30 06:06:08 but that may well be wrong Dec 30 06:06:31 for example, until about grade 6, they taught us about homonyms Dec 30 06:06:35 luke-jr: you are crazy. you assume putting any code in kernel space violates the GPL, which it doesn't Dec 30 06:06:44 then afterwards, they started teaching the primary kids that they were called "homophones" Dec 30 06:06:48 luke-jr, the routerboard is kinda steep once you add it all up :| Dec 30 06:07:04 and it took a few years until I bothered to look it up and realize that not only was the second one wrong, but there's a difference :P Dec 30 06:07:06 Vratha: putting it in kernel space doesn't, but linking it with Linux internals does Dec 30 06:07:12 jaem: Another 5 years or so, and they will become homophobes Dec 30 06:07:14 also, you assume dynamically linking code violates the GPL, and i'm afraid to say, that unless that code actually belonged to the kernel in the first place, the courts (here in the USA at least) don't care Dec 30 06:07:20 * RST38h cackles evilly Dec 30 06:07:45 lol Dec 30 06:07:52 jaem|away, homonyms and homophones are two different things (sound vs spelling, IIRC) Dec 30 06:08:02 johnx, my point, yes Dec 30 06:08:05 Vratha: I'm not a lawyer; I only know the GPL rules, I don't know their extent of enforcability Dec 30 06:08:14 ah, sorry. only half paying attention :) Dec 30 06:08:19 anyone knows how much mA the device draws, when idle/under load? .. without charging Dec 30 06:08:24 As a matte of fact, homophones and homonyms are a bit different Dec 30 06:08:29 but they taught me just the one, then switched names for later classes, and then (AFAIK) never taught the difference Dec 30 06:08:32 homonyms are a subset of homophones Dec 30 06:08:37 RST38h, yes, we've both said that Dec 30 06:08:45 RST38h: Hey hey, stop with the racial slurs, dude. Dec 30 06:08:48 RST38h, fair point, actually Dec 30 06:08:57 anyway, i don't have any references to that but remember reading some case outcome like that. but you're free to mount a lawsuit against nvidia if you want to prove me wrong Dec 30 06:08:59 jX, what? Dec 30 06:09:01 lol jX Dec 30 06:09:02 jX: What racial slurs? =) Dec 30 06:09:08 RST38h, they overlap, but they're not a strict subset I think Dec 30 06:09:22 "now talking on #grammar" Dec 30 06:09:22 johnx: sound the same, not necessarily spell the same Dec 30 06:09:23 Vratha: though even if their driver itself isn't seen as contracting the GPL, nVidia still needed to accept the terms in order to copy Linux ever. Dec 30 06:09:33 since no one is enforcing this part of the GPL, i think the courts would also kind of wonder why no one was ever called out on it until "now" (now being whenever a lawsuit is brought) Dec 30 06:09:33 what's the chance they wrote their driver w/o copying Linux? ;) Dec 30 06:09:37 johnx: homonyms spell and sound the same (and yes I found it in wiki :)) Dec 30 06:09:41 jaem|away: Ever since I said I like girlshe keeps calling me a homonym Dec 30 06:09:46 Vratha: oh, it's been enforced, just not against nVidia Dec 30 06:09:52 though in German courts Dec 30 06:10:02 RST38h, nevermind. just looked it up on wiki as well. I was about to say wind vs wind, but you're right Dec 30 06:10:12 jX, newsflash - "homo" was a prefix long before the word "homosexual" was created Dec 30 06:10:16 again, nvidia is in america, and afaik, nvidia still releases their drivers to germans Dec 30 06:10:27 jaem|away, that's what gay people want you to think Dec 30 06:10:30 ...or something Dec 30 06:10:34 ... Dec 30 06:10:37 ahem Dec 30 06:10:37 :) Dec 30 06:10:40 jaem|away: Newsflash, ther's nothign wrong with being a prefix! Some people are jsut born that way. Dec 30 06:10:47 jX, rofl! Dec 30 06:10:59 so if nvidia is releasing their drivers in germany, then no one successfully enforced that rule in germany Dec 30 06:10:59 eek Dec 30 06:11:11 (i don't know if nvidia releases their linux drivers in germany) Dec 30 06:11:11 Vratha: they have, just not against nVidia Dec 30 06:11:13 and some people even have things suffixed at birth! Dec 30 06:11:23 luke-jr: if nvidia is releasing the drivers, then they didn't. Dec 30 06:11:33 or not to an extent that scares nvidia Dec 30 06:12:04 Vratha: nVidia's alternatives are ceasing Linux support, providing userland drivers (slower), or opening the code Dec 30 06:12:15 it would have to be *very* scary to get them to do anything Dec 30 06:12:26 nvidia's alternatives? you mean like ATI and other companies? Dec 30 06:12:28 Well, poor English-speaking peoplez Dec 30 06:12:35 Vratha, ATI is an alternative? Dec 30 06:12:37 ha Dec 30 06:12:39 Vratha: alternatives to persisting in their violation Dec 30 06:12:57 Vratha, if you buy a 5-year old card, maybe Dec 30 06:13:09 Hardly any prefixes. No multiple suffixes. No postfixes. Dec 30 06:13:26 jaem|away: okay, that is your opinion Dec 30 06:13:27 Miserable morphology, yesssss. Dec 30 06:13:42 Vratha, I was kidding Dec 30 06:13:46 and exaggerating Dec 30 06:13:47 :) Dec 30 06:13:55 but I haven't exactly had food luck with them Dec 30 06:14:01 RST38h, so I've actually been confusing homonym and homograph for a long time it seems, but OTOH, wiki defended my use of homonym in a "non-technical" sense (whatever that means) Dec 30 06:14:21 i've only been on a mac for a while anyway. my server is the only place i use either BSD or Linux Dec 30 06:14:25 example: my current card (HD 2400 Pro) did not work with 5 subsequent versions of catalyst Dec 30 06:14:28 so i don't know about current driver support Dec 30 06:14:34 jaem: Hey, I am using Intel Integrated Graphics, the drivers are open =) Dec 30 06:14:35 did not work, as in "X bombs immediately" Dec 30 06:14:39 * RST38h laughs sadistically Dec 30 06:14:59 RST38h, at risk of inciting luke-jr's fury, I will admit I use nVidia Dec 30 06:15:05 johnx: AFAIK, nothing changes if you do not know what each of these are Dec 30 06:15:09 jaem|away: RWOAR Dec 30 06:15:18 I fully support FOSS, and nVidia does a really poor job of even playing nicely Dec 30 06:15:20 however Dec 30 06:15:20 johnx: There is a dozen or two of categories Dec 30 06:15:33 " Dec 30 06:15:36 johnx: Including ones for items related with HAS and IS relationships Dec 30 06:15:36 oops Dec 30 06:15:43 they release often and early, and their list of known issues is not generally longer than their list of fixed bugs Dec 30 06:15:50 which I can't say for ATI, in my experience Dec 30 06:15:59 and Intel is... well... Intel Dec 30 06:16:09 intel stuff works nicely...most of the time Dec 30 06:16:16 i don't care how a company plays. as long as it works and they are legal Dec 30 06:16:17 once ATI cards get good support across the board, I'll happily switch Dec 30 06:16:25 and i don't believe they violate any GPL anyway Dec 30 06:16:27 that is, when they don't borrow SGX-based cards and fail to deliver *any* kind of working driver for linux Dec 30 06:16:32 but the ones I've tried have given me so much grief that it's not worth it, violation or no Dec 30 06:16:51 jaem|away: ATi cards work fine, without any mess setting up illegal drivers Dec 30 06:16:57 I like illegal drivers. Dec 30 06:17:06 luke-jr, and Catalyst is Open Source? Dec 30 06:17:06 that's why I always drink before a road trip. Dec 30 06:17:12 jaem|away: wtf is Catalyst? Dec 30 06:17:20 luke-jr, it seems that the key thing is your definition of "fine" Dec 30 06:17:30 luke-jr, the only driver (for most new cards) that actually supports a modern feature set Dec 30 06:17:34 it's from ATI Dec 30 06:17:36 luke-jr: A staunchy GPL-abiding open-source guy like you probably shouldn't use computers Dec 30 06:17:39 and it fails horribly Dec 30 06:17:58 they've released their specs, and good for them, but there's a ways to go Dec 30 06:17:59 luke-jr: At least, stop using the keyboards: 8042 controllers in both keyboard and the PC run closed source firmware Dec 30 06:18:08 and also your definition of "ATi cards" doesn't include most cards made by ATi Dec 30 06:18:23 luke-jr: Speaking of firmware, most PC BIOSes are also closed source Dec 30 06:18:27 using a card that breaks X every month or so (or worse) isn't really an option Dec 30 06:18:29 it just isn't Dec 30 06:18:30 jaem|away: my Radeon X850 continues to work fine with vanilla Linux, Mesa, and X.org Dec 30 06:18:37 luke-jr, yes, and some do Dec 30 06:18:42 but not the ones I own Dec 30 06:18:47 have owned* Dec 30 06:18:59 * luke-jr doesn't just buy crap without researching it Dec 30 06:19:11 luke-jr, that's fine if you have a choice Dec 30 06:19:13 or money Dec 30 06:19:28 most of what I own was scrounged, begged, or salvaged Dec 30 06:19:51 and the few things that were purchased new were the cheapest I could buy, out of necessity Dec 30 06:20:01 admittedly, ATi is fine if you don't care about performance Dec 30 06:20:04 anyhow, I don't really want to argue about it Dec 30 06:20:15 but if you don't care about performance, you might as well save money and buy intel integrated Dec 30 06:20:21 I see nVidia's drivers as a necessary evil for the moment, given my situation Dec 30 06:20:33 luke-jr, which routerboard are you using? Dec 30 06:20:39 johnx: I don't have one. Dec 30 06:20:50 luke-jr, which router are you using? Dec 30 06:21:01 johnx: WRT54G minus WiFi Dec 30 06:21:35 johnx: that was an easy trick question Dec 30 06:22:46 lol Dec 30 06:23:15 RST38h, actually, I was trying to pick his brain to find a decent linux-based router to replace my dying wrt54gl (keeps rebooting randomly) Dec 30 06:23:27 johnx: turn off Wifi :) Dec 30 06:23:35 if it persists, find a compatible power adapter Dec 30 06:23:45 the power adapter usually poops first Dec 30 06:23:47 the wifi isn't the problem :P Dec 30 06:23:48 johnx: just run stock firmware Dec 30 06:23:57 luke-jr, the power adapter...hmm Dec 30 06:24:00 johnx: wifi on mine will reboot randomly Dec 30 06:24:03 well Dec 30 06:24:11 it didn't used to Dec 30 06:24:11 at this point, turning wifi on = insta reboot Dec 30 06:24:15 nope Dec 30 06:24:21 but wifi uses more power Dec 30 06:24:21 johnx: or use DLink, never let me down Dec 30 06:24:27 and strains the power stuff more Dec 30 06:24:44 turning wifi off can survive poor power supply Dec 30 06:25:07 RST38h, i do tend to actually use options that aren't exposed in stock firmware, so openwrt compatibility is a must from my point of view Dec 30 06:25:29 luke-jr, thanks for the idea. I'll dig up another PS and see if it makes a difference Dec 30 06:25:30 RST38h is just trolling tonight :p Dec 30 06:26:03 seeing as, if I turn off wifi I won't be able to actually *use* it as a router :P Dec 30 06:26:05 johnx: if you have another Wifi-capable device, might try turning that wifi off too Dec 30 06:26:12 ah heh Dec 30 06:26:21 maybe turn its power level down? dunno if that would help Dec 30 06:26:24 (no wired connection, except to the cable modem) Dec 30 06:26:35 nah, a dying PS fits *perfectly* with the symptoms Dec 30 06:26:48 I just didn't even think about it Dec 30 06:27:05 it probably even happens during the warmest part of the day... Dec 30 06:27:28 :) Dec 30 06:29:12 still interested in the routerboards though ... :D Dec 30 06:29:41 johnx: myself, I'm hoping something similar to the OpenRD-Client (but with sane power consumption) pops up by the time my setup finally fails Dec 30 06:29:43 hmm my fn key on the keyboard has almost 0 blue paint on it anymore Dec 30 06:29:58 ruskie: mine is like new, since it doesn't work outside Maemo :( Dec 30 06:30:04 wow, the internal camera SUCKS ASS. Dec 30 06:30:11 what's the latest OS revision number? Dec 30 06:30:22 jX, the front facing one? wait, on the N900? Dec 30 06:30:27 yes Dec 30 06:30:28 and yes Dec 30 06:30:33 you have the latest revision Dec 30 06:30:44 yes, well, I'd like to verify that. Dec 30 06:30:48 and yeah, it might improve with the next revision Dec 30 06:30:50 42-11 Dec 30 06:30:54 luke-jr, erm? Dec 30 06:30:54 kthx Dec 30 06:31:08 ruskie: X11 bug, actually Dec 30 06:31:10 I'd heard there were several rev bumps since "release" Dec 30 06:31:27 * johnx will lose connectivity as he reboots his router Dec 30 06:32:46 jX: well i herd u liek mudkipz Dec 30 06:32:48 <.< Dec 30 06:32:57 no, I like turtles Dec 30 06:39:15 sam latinga - *the* dude at sdl was working on the SDL_alsa_audio backend right after the maemo summit :) Dec 30 06:39:44 now to invetisnoop Dec 30 06:41:09 pupnik: success with sdl? Dec 30 06:41:31 so how long until someone makes an app to turn on the flash LEDs and use them like a flashlight? Dec 30 06:43:28 ho-lee-crap. a routerboard rb433 has *3* miniPCI slots Dec 30 06:43:32 that's more like it :D Dec 30 06:44:19 jX, I'm pretty sure it's been done already Dec 30 06:44:26 LOL Dec 30 06:44:27 names? :) Dec 30 06:45:36 RST38h: i can make it sound bad in different ways now Dec 30 06:54:50 pupnik: eh. Dec 30 07:00:26 http://talk.maemo.org/showpost.php?p=442596&postcount=6 Dec 30 07:00:29 not much news Dec 30 07:00:54 im curious about that relationship between period_size and buffer_size Dec 30 07:01:14 the alsa programs end up geting a big buffer. all sdl programs ma at buffer 1024 and period 512 Dec 30 07:01:23 max at Dec 30 07:02:46 frames = SDL_NAME(snd_pcm_hw_params_set_period_size_near)(pcm_handle, hwparams, frames, NULL); Dec 30 07:03:07 seems to be happening there in SDL_alsa_audio.c Dec 30 07:05:37 jX: moodlight i one Dec 30 07:05:51 jX: I think flashlight is the other - in extras-devel Dec 30 07:06:15 ahh, I'll have to add devel Dec 30 07:09:14 Morning, all Dec 30 07:09:23 kree! Dec 30 07:14:17 i could use a "ncd" norton change directory for linux+maemo Dec 30 07:14:41 go right to your target dir without remembering path Dec 30 07:15:27 hmm? you mean like alias? Dec 30 07:16:57 it builds a tree of unique directory names so you type "ncd newgoatpics" from /home/user and it will go to /media/mmc1/philes/2009/fresh_and_lovely/newgoatpics Dec 30 07:17:36 Shows you a list if there's not a unique match? Dec 30 07:17:41 i forgot Dec 30 07:17:58 interesting. sounds a little non-deterministic Dec 30 07:18:13 useless for many people and directories Dec 30 07:18:33 Anyone wanna give me a suggestion on an idea for MMS support I had? Dec 30 07:18:33 but if you end up naming them descriptively, a real keystroke saver Dec 30 07:19:47 http://www.xs4all.nl/~waterlan/ Dec 30 07:20:41 interesting Dec 30 07:22:12 everything i build wants debhelper >= 7 Dec 30 07:22:26 just ordered this one: http://www.pdair.com/catalog/product_info.php?cPath=10100000_1900000_11000787&products_id=27091 Dec 30 07:22:35 will see if it is good Dec 30 07:22:39 pupnik, just try changing the 7 to something smaller and see if it works ;) Dec 30 07:25:55 http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=32129&page=10 any ideas on the last post? Dec 30 07:26:14 johnx: i start doing stuff like that and end up with a working binary and no way to ever make a repository compatible package Dec 30 07:26:53 pupnik, really? in a lot of cases the debhelper version requirement is "inflated" beyond the features the package actually uses Dec 30 07:27:07 well that has worked for me before i admit Dec 30 07:27:25 I remember doing that for cron Dec 30 07:28:51 ok i change 7 to 5 in debian/control, then get the usual dh_clean: Sorry, but 5 is the highest compatibility level supported by this debhelper. Dec 30 07:29:13 errr...I think you need to change it in one other place too Dec 30 07:30:42 hmm fakeroot debian/rules build doesn't complain tho Dec 30 07:32:15 moodlight is ok but Flashlight is awesome Dec 30 07:33:49 ohh foolish me i oversaw debian/compat --- change 7 to 5 Dec 30 07:33:51 jX: LOL Dec 30 07:36:49 morn johnx Dec 30 07:37:13 'night Stskeeps :) Dec 30 07:37:37 (sorry. I really was just on the way to watch some TV with my wife and head to sleep.) Dec 30 07:37:56 I should be around in a "working" capacity later this week Dec 30 07:39:13 Hehe. Nexus One will be $500+ , not $200 as rumors initially say. No surprise and not a killer either. Dec 30 07:42:09 love how wifi stays connected all the time Dec 30 07:42:14 anyone have edge only Dec 30 07:42:27 wondering how skype and voip calls sound over an edge edge connection Dec 30 07:45:44 Probably not very good, who knows though, maybe some googling will show you. Dec 30 07:47:52 blah Dec 30 07:49:43 ok who wants wcd / ncd for n900 Dec 30 07:50:22 http://pupnik.de/wcd_5.1.0-2_maemo1.deb requires libncursesw5 Dec 30 07:51:24 What is WCD/NCD (sorry not an expert in phone technology :/) Dec 30 07:52:15 norton change directory -- reduces typing in the shell Dec 30 07:54:38 Ah, then not me :/ Dec 30 07:55:11 is anyone else getting spammed with explicit file transfer attempts? :/ Dec 30 07:57:43 yikes Dec 30 07:57:50 my root partition is at 99% Dec 30 07:57:56 ls Dec 30 08:08:30 heh t.m.o.. you don't know what you got, until it's gone... you're a hard habit to break... Dec 30 08:10:29 t.m.o isn't down Dec 30 08:11:48 man] Dec 30 08:11:58 pupnik: I've cracked and returned. But trying to limit myself to once a day. Dec 30 08:12:05 having maemo.org start with the same letter as mozilla.org is confusing sometimes. Dec 30 08:12:41 Jaffa: it has transformed. No longer can you peruse the recent stuff to see what is being worked-on. Dec 30 08:12:49 * Jaffa should get cracking with his maemoweeklynews idea, since http://talk.maemo.org/showpost.php?p=433121&postcount=7 is something I'd include in this week's edition Dec 30 08:13:38 pupnik: Indeed; hence the idea of MWN: http://wiki.maemo.org/Maemo_Weekly_News, otherwise known as "other people read tmo so I don't have to" Dec 30 08:13:40 good idea Dec 30 08:13:48 both quims and yours Dec 30 08:14:07 terminal shouldnt be a user app in maemo6 Dec 30 08:14:28 not one that one sees in that app list Dec 30 08:16:30 pupnik, launch it from the termi --? oh wait.. Dec 30 08:23:36 "terminal" reminds of the george carlin skit about air-travel language Dec 30 08:24:18 oh sweet. gtranslate Dec 30 08:26:21 101kB too Dec 30 08:26:53 mooooo Dec 30 08:30:07 sorry had to finish your rhyming. now i'll go back to my number priming Dec 30 08:32:32 :) Dec 30 08:35:35 hello Dec 30 08:35:37 all Dec 30 08:35:48 speaking of mooo, hello all Dec 30 08:36:27 Moo! Dec 30 08:37:00 i may have been wasting time. if the only purpose of hacking the sdl sound is to get a couple of exceptional programs to bypass pulse, i should just bypass sdl-sound as well and use emulib Dec 30 08:39:33 pupnik <-- well on his way to open("/def/fb0",""wb") Dec 30 08:39:37 emulib style stuff Dec 30 08:39:38 s/def/dev Dec 30 08:39:41 nice nice Dec 30 08:41:36 morning andre__ Dec 30 08:41:37 ah, lovely, could add another APN without probs with gconftool.. wonder if it works Dec 30 08:41:49 heja Dec 30 08:42:13 rst38h: just talked to a guy from Nokia, the key question was "Does Nokia have balls to break partnership with *ALL* current russian service centers as the is simply not a single one that is handling warranty service properly?" - he answered yes ;-) Dec 30 08:49:50 Morning Stskeeps! Dec 30 08:49:56 morning tekojo Dec 30 08:52:58 hmm Dec 30 08:53:37 morning tigert Dec 30 08:53:46 morn Dec 30 08:57:41 my N900 was crawling slow today, it wouldn't take a picture without a 5-6 second lag Dec 30 08:57:48 wonder what that was about Dec 30 08:57:57 what happens when you shut down browser? Dec 30 08:58:08 works again, I think Dec 30 08:58:36 I typically have a few windows of browser open during my daily use Dec 30 08:58:46 just leave it open because I'm in a hurry to get somewhere Dec 30 09:03:49 hmm Dec 30 09:04:11 i just realized fennec doesnt use the maemo networking api Dec 30 09:04:23 so it doesnt prompt for a connection Dec 30 09:04:29 or am I mistaken? Dec 30 09:04:51 is fennec the browser that's included with N900, or a different one? Dec 30 09:07:01 different Dec 30 09:07:18 the built in browser is gecko based, but fennec, now Firefox Mobile, is from Mozilla Dec 30 09:07:22 should be out soonish... Dec 30 09:07:50 morning Dec 30 09:07:58 thanks for that info Dec 30 09:08:16 morning BabelO Dec 30 09:11:26 yea, they use the same engine Dec 30 09:11:41 but have different user interface around them Dec 30 09:11:55 well, likely different versions of Gecko Dec 30 09:12:14 but very close anyway from user perspective Dec 30 09:12:58 btw Dec 30 09:13:08 http://www.dafont.com/monofur.font Dec 30 09:13:25 this is pretty cute terminal font for maemo devices Dec 30 09:14:04 koi Dec 30 09:14:19 takes nice advantage of the small pixels Dec 30 09:14:57 I'm so conflicted about the N900 Ovi store situation Dec 30 09:15:29 actually hesitant to dig into customizing my N900 until I've updated with the to-be-released firmware update Dec 30 09:15:51 thinking that the Ovi store access for N900 users would be activated by requiring a firmware update, just guessing though Dec 30 09:16:02 http://slashdot.org/story/09/12/30/0249203/emDuke-Nukem-3Dem-Ported-To-Nokia-N900 Dec 30 09:16:05 need it to fulfill the US rebate Dec 30 09:16:28 pupnik: that /. submission is wanting Dec 30 09:16:41 it's funny Dec 30 09:16:44 yep Dec 30 09:16:49 I see the linked to video showing tilt sensor to move Duke around Dec 30 09:17:11 the text of the /. article doesn't mention that at all Dec 30 09:17:36 hey it's good to get N900 in the news Dec 30 09:17:47 sure! Dec 30 09:17:49 and ukki did a good job with the controls Dec 30 09:18:24 not to mention the drudgework of making a proper package for extras ;) Dec 30 09:19:01 hm, can I disable "switch off device?" prompt from the Enter lock code touch screen prompt? Dec 30 09:19:03 Arkenoy: Now, could you raise the same question with FedEx/UPS/DHL please? =) Dec 30 09:19:45 Arkenoi: Because I am fucking tired of FedEx expeditor calling me and offering to "deliver the package as soon as I pay $300 in customs and processing fees" Dec 30 09:20:02 ouch Dec 30 09:20:15 from where to where? Dec 30 09:20:36 lucent: from anywhere to .RU Dec 30 09:20:53 (and sending stuff *from* .RU is near impossible) Dec 30 09:21:00 oh god Dec 30 09:21:49 I only know what my co-worker (this was many years ago) said about visiting his family in Russia Dec 30 09:22:41 "must pay extra" to customs, and I'm sure he meant a bribe Dec 30 09:23:01 no, you do not normally have to pay anything to customs Dec 30 09:23:07 damn physical goods, 3d printers must evolve Dec 30 09:23:21 only on parcels, especially ones delivered with courier services Dec 30 09:23:24 mavhc: makerbot Dec 30 09:24:03 indeed, my cousin has a reprap Dec 30 09:24:11 * lucent drools a bit Dec 30 09:26:22 http://www.pathname.com/fhs/pub/fhs-2.3.html#OPTADDONAPPLICATIONSOFTWAREPACKAGES the official pathspec for optification (?) Dec 30 09:27:04 * pupnik ponders shipping goods dismantled and hidden in books to .ru Dec 30 09:27:19 prolly won't do Dec 30 09:27:35 legalese is a bit more complicated than you think. Dec 30 09:27:54 Basically, you can import anything <$300 for your personal purposes, tax free Dec 30 09:28:00 hey that's good Dec 30 09:28:31 But the shipping fee is being added into this amount when using FedEx et al Dec 30 09:29:09 On top of that, the local company contracted by FedEx to process shipments charges $50-$100 for its own processing fees, adding it all up Dec 30 09:29:33 So you end up fucked. Dec 30 09:29:48 shame about it that way. Dec 30 09:30:24 government is a racket Dec 30 09:30:42 note that this isn't solely government's fault in this case Dec 30 09:31:16 Pfff, our governments are like cute little kittens compared to some Dec 30 09:31:42 what are the processing fees for a shipment from St. Petersburg to Moscow? Dec 30 09:32:15 pupnik: With FedEx? I dunno. Normal post is not expensive, although you a risking it to be appropriated by post office goblins Dec 30 09:32:44 lots of those in italy too Dec 30 09:32:49 anyway sleep calls - cheers Dec 30 09:32:55 pupnik: The generally accepted method is to pass packages with railroad car attendants Dec 30 09:58:43 ffs. Dec 30 09:59:07 this shop that I ordered from should have received new n900's in 29.12 but guess what Dec 30 09:59:10 NOTHING HAPPENED: Dec 30 09:59:18 *on Dec 30 09:59:36 Hoxzer, yeah, we still don't have ours, and we ordered in September Dec 30 09:59:52 the only reason I have one now is because my prof asked Nokia nicely at Dev Days Dec 30 09:59:53 hehe Dec 30 10:00:08 I feel for you Dec 30 10:01:54 think I'm gonna order it from another shop and see which one delivers faster Dec 30 10:31:03 hello everyone! my name is Kostas and I am from greece. I am looking for the app that appears in this video http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HblSL0hG6Wg at 1:14, in the More... folder, second raw, last column, called "ftdapp" but I really can't find it anywhere. Does anyone have any information on this? Dec 30 10:36:46 why do you want it? Dec 30 10:36:47 internal nokia tool Dec 30 10:37:17 ok, this probably sounds stupid Dec 30 10:37:22 but how do I reply to an SMS Dec 30 10:37:30 one I have currently open that is Dec 30 10:37:39 like you would reply to a im? Dec 30 10:37:49 which is? Dec 30 10:38:04 there are delete / copy / forward options Dec 30 10:38:07 no reply Dec 30 10:38:30 except the fact that I love looking the network details and coverage, I am using it for my studies in my university. Dec 30 10:39:00 uh just type in the conversation and press send? Dec 30 10:39:03 dnaumov you open msg and type something and send it Dec 30 10:39:04 dnaumov: there's an input line at the bottom to type stuff into, isn't there? Dec 30 10:39:10 its chat like view Dec 30 10:39:29 right, so I am only supposed to reply from the conversation window? Dec 30 10:39:35 yes Dec 30 10:39:44 while almost only being able to see a single line, not my entire reply as I write it? Dec 30 10:39:51 lame Dec 30 10:39:53 it expands as you write it Dec 30 10:39:57 ah Dec 30 10:40:06 yeah dont judge before trying Dec 30 10:41:54 my apologies Dec 30 10:42:05 still some quirks after having used Symbian for years Dec 30 10:43:22 anyone here seen/heard of/have a working recipe for syncing contacts betweeen "evolution on desktop", and maemo5 Dec 30 10:44:13 I exported all contacts in evolution to one vcf-file, and imported that onto my n900, worked perfect Dec 30 10:44:49 but now that I've used Hermes to sync with social networks and gravatar, it's much more up to date than what I have in Evolution Dec 30 10:45:16 so, villager and Stskeeps (and anyone who knows of course) anything I can do to get the ftdapp ? Dec 30 10:45:21 so I'm thinking about doing the same thing in reverse, export to vcf and import that into evolution Dec 30 10:45:24 ceda: doesnt using hermes require that your contacts actually are named the same as in facebook for example? Dec 30 10:46:10 never tested the appy myself Dec 30 10:46:41 red: well, yes. But my brother for instance, uses different first names, so that isn't matched automatically. But I opted to import "birhtday-only contacts" and so he was added with his other name as a new contact. After that I just merged the two contacts and now it works as expected. Dec 30 10:46:45 anyway, no idea how to do that on linux Dec 30 10:47:01 but on pc one can export the phone numbers in multiple different formats via pc suite Dec 30 10:47:12 atleast on older models it worked, havent tested on N900 Dec 30 10:47:38 birthday-only contacts? Dec 30 10:47:57 as in only adds a new contact name and a bday? Dec 30 10:48:32 yes. Facebook doesn't expose too much information, so if you have a clean address book and imports all contacts from facebook, they'd only have names and birtday info Dec 30 10:48:47 kk Dec 30 10:48:51 thats annoying =) Dec 30 10:49:12 it's an anti-spam measure Dec 30 10:49:29 anhow, I used pc suite to export contacts from my old phone before I used iPhone. imported those into google contacts and then set up itunes to sync once via google contacts Dec 30 10:49:59 ceda, wait, it syncs your gravatar as well? Dec 30 10:50:01 is that new? Dec 30 10:51:38 jaem|away: Yeah, ceda's done the patch Dec 30 10:51:50 jaem|away: I'm hoping to review & merge today Dec 30 10:52:21 Jaffa, ceda, nice work! Dec 30 10:56:21 ceda: I sync my contacts with syncml server (like scheduleworld, funambol, goosync) from both my n900 and my desktop to keep them in sync... haven't tried with evolution on desktop, but that can probably be done with opensync? Dec 30 10:56:24 this conversation model of displaying SMS can be quite inconvinient... you cant just show a single arrived SMS to a friend, you have to show a part of the conversation, making multiple SMSes visible Dec 30 10:57:22 dnaumov: seems to work to click on a single sms to show its details Dec 30 10:57:36 yeah just click the message in question Dec 30 10:57:44 red: I found the easiest method of contact/calendar trasnfer was to just send them over bluetooth from device to device Dec 30 10:57:45 I suppose you can't reply that way though Dec 30 10:57:47 and you'll only see that Dec 30 10:58:00 aaagrh :) Dec 30 10:58:12 ok, one last stupid question Dec 30 10:58:24 why is there no "you have a new sms" indicator on the screen Dec 30 10:58:38 the phone beeps when a message arrives Dec 30 10:58:49 but no other indication on main screen Dec 30 10:58:50 I usually get a blinking yellow thing in the statusbar at the top when it has a notificatino like a new sms Dec 30 10:58:53 and displays the message in a bubble Dec 30 10:58:59 dnaumov, there is. the upper left corner is white. Dec 30 10:59:02 the dashboard icon changes when theres a new notification Dec 30 10:59:26 or add the conversations widget Dec 30 11:00:29 or maybe it wasn't blinking, not sure, but pretty sure it was yellow Dec 30 11:04:47 Stskeeps: What is going on? Somebody is building default osso packages with autobuilder Dec 30 11:05:06 Stskeeps: -zhhk seems to indicate Chinese versions, but are these really different? Dec 30 11:05:22 morning Dec 30 11:05:28 moorning lardman Dec 30 11:05:45 hi RST38h Dec 30 11:06:51 Hello! I came to ask if anyone had this problem: I left my phone connected to my laptop in the evening and suspended the laptop. In the morning the phone was all black and it won't recharge even off the wall. Dec 30 11:07:31 (N900) Dec 30 11:07:51 sounds like what happened to me a couple of days ago Dec 30 11:07:53 lardman: Any idea why someone is building stock osso- packages with autobuilder? Dec 30 11:08:25 villager: did it get solved? Dec 30 11:08:54 Gilly: solution here: http://talk.maemo.org/showpost.php?p=421699&postcount=40 Dec 30 11:09:21 well, the orange light isn't pulsing :/ Dec 30 11:09:34 then you move on to step 4 (remove and reinsert battery) Dec 30 11:09:36 RST38h: are they updated or not? Dec 30 11:09:51 RST38h: iirc that shouldn't be possible anyway Dec 30 11:10:06 then repeat the charging 2-3 times like it says... I had to Dec 30 11:10:45 villager: alright - I'll try that :) I did remove the battery already but maybe I didn't wait for long enough to put it back in. Dec 30 11:11:59 onion: ping Dec 30 11:12:08 RST38h: url? Dec 30 11:16:54 anyone used the BlueMaemo BT Mouse/Keyboard/etc app? Dec 30 11:17:03 red, on the N810, yes Dec 30 11:17:06 having troubles to get it working on Windows 7 Dec 30 11:17:09 haven't tried it on the N900 Dec 30 11:17:09 ah Dec 30 11:17:15 can't help you there Dec 30 11:17:28 ye, i get to connect and to pick what device I want to use Dec 30 11:17:36 it should show up as a standard HID device, which should work with just about anything reasonably recent Dec 30 11:17:39 ie, click the mouse icon on N900, shortly after just disconnected Dec 30 11:17:44 huh Dec 30 11:17:46 sorry Dec 30 11:17:56 ok theres the problem then Dec 30 11:18:30 when I pair the devices using the app, Windows 7 tries to install 5 devices, and only one succeeds (Bluetooth Modem) Dec 30 11:18:40 oh wait, now the 5th succeeded aswell, as HID device Dec 30 11:18:44 retest brb Dec 30 11:19:01 mmm, the theory about global warming doesn't get many fans from this weather... Dec 30 11:19:19 global warming is a busted myth Dec 30 11:19:26 as far as I am concerned :p Dec 30 11:19:29 Veggen, I think that theory was started by the weather widget in Mer Dec 30 11:19:36 XD Dec 30 11:19:41 :) Dec 30 11:20:12 past 4 years it's actually been getting colder, and the british company investigating global worming got busted hiding evidence about nothing actually warming up :p Dec 30 11:20:21 worming! warming* :D Dec 30 11:20:36 now theres an theory. global worming. Dec 30 11:20:51 http://www.facebook.com/photo.php?pid=4891294&l=f6a6c3fadc&id=727686062 is a picture taken yesterday, from kitchen window. I actually like winter like thos. Dec 30 11:20:54 this. Dec 30 11:21:31 awesome! http://www.sparkfun.com/images/newsimages/Dragon-01-L-1000.jpg Dec 30 11:33:44 Veggen: cool view Dec 30 11:34:09 looks like norway? Dec 30 11:39:05 hrm i was wondering. is it possible to install maemo on a phone which come preinstalled with android? Dec 30 11:39:14 comes* Dec 30 11:39:26 ifreq: it is. Dec 30 11:40:46 i've been reading and meamo seems to me like the superior OS, the problem is other then the N900(which has too big of a form factor for my needs) i couldn't find any good maemo phones Dec 30 11:41:34 but there are plenty of powerful android phones which could probably run maemo easily, so i figured the only limitation is the boot loader Dec 30 11:41:55 villager: hmm.. this doesn't seem to work but thanks anyway :) I guess I'll have to send the phone to nokia. Dec 30 11:42:23 so was it ever done? did someone install maemo on an android phone? Dec 30 11:42:30 Gilly: hmm, it worked for me... oh well Dec 30 11:43:21 well the phone seems like a brick :) i'll probably check if the battery is truly empty if i get my hands on a voltage meter Dec 30 11:43:31 openvpn vs vpnc Dec 30 11:44:27 Gilly: maybe you can charge the battery with a different nokia phone if you have one... Dec 30 11:44:38 anyone? Dec 30 11:45:01 i tried searching google, but couldn't find anything thus far Dec 30 11:45:42 i think the one i have is too old :/ but i could check if my dad's or sister's phone has a suitable battery. Dec 30 11:45:47 look on the maemo talk forums jiy: Dec 30 11:45:51 doh, how hard can this be Dec 30 11:46:31 I either get my PC to recognize N900 as HID device, but then the phone doesnt want to establish connection at all - or when my PC doesnt recognize it, the N900 will happily connect Dec 30 11:46:40 Jiyuu|Work: I don't think it's that straight forward... skipping the bootloader, the kernel needs to be an android kernel since linux doesn't support android hw... then you have proprietary blobs in maemo for the phone/nokia specific bits which likely needs to be supported by underlying kernel functionality.... Dec 30 11:46:51 Jiyuu|Work: maemo on android phone? I don't think you could call it usable as a phone anyway Dec 30 11:47:20 there are numerous components related to telephony among other things in maemo that are closed source at the moment Dec 30 11:47:24 villager: afaik the orange led should blink when it's recharging, even if the battery is empty. Is this right? Dec 30 11:47:36 so the issue is mainly with drivers? Dec 30 11:48:03 also with applications closer to user interface Dec 30 11:48:28 Gilly: think so... when I removed the battery and reinserted the first time, it took a few moments for the orange to start blinking... it of course stopped as soon as I messed with the power button Dec 30 11:48:47 "the kernel needs to be an android kernel" Dec 30 11:48:58 you might be able to turn an android phone to N810-level device with some non-infinite amount of work though Dec 30 11:49:04 i thought android used a linux kernel Dec 30 11:49:07 then again: why one would do all that work? Dec 30 11:49:18 Jiyuu|Work: google forks everything they work on. Dec 30 11:49:44 how do I get this fix on my N900 https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=5597 Dec 30 11:49:45 i would want that so i could use something like the sony x10 Dec 30 11:49:45 Bug 5597: First Synchronization between N900 and Exchange 2003 Server always fails Dec 30 11:49:46 I don't know about limitations of android platform Dec 30 11:49:48 with maemo Dec 30 11:50:05 android seems to me like a pretty sucky platform Dec 30 11:50:31 sure it touts using linux, but in the end you run programs in java Dec 30 11:51:01 thats not really different symbian or any other of the old OSs Dec 30 11:51:05 from* Dec 30 11:51:22 linux phones are always more or less hardware/software embedded/integrated products, and thus quite far from pc+os kind of mindset Dec 30 11:51:59 isn't there a chance that at least some of the hardware is generic enough to be supported? Dec 30 11:52:13 Jiyuu|Work: in theory, not in practice. Dec 30 11:52:50 were there any people who tried it? Dec 30 11:53:02 installing maemo on an android phone that is Dec 30 11:53:23 Jiyuu|Work: the magic key to unlocking it is to create infinite amount of time available for people willing to reverse engineer stuff... Dec 30 11:53:29 if both devices use OMAP3 SoC, there's a chance of having some sort of a start. but in practice, one can't even start the porting effort without tapping to internal serial port and such things first Dec 30 11:55:54 but for instance: if you find N900 and Droid service manuals and service schematics, you can see that many parts of the hardware are really in rather device/manufacturer specific places to control Dec 30 11:56:57 these things are not PCs because in business sense, they don't need to be, and it may even be a drawback they would be Dec 30 11:57:58 i'm not really linux savy so i can't really try these kind of things by myself Dec 30 11:58:00 thp, around? Dec 30 11:58:36 but it seemed to me like something someone at least tried Dec 30 11:58:46 why would it be a drawback? Dec 30 11:59:16 non of the phone manufacturers have any particular reason to lock their phone to a specific OS Dec 30 11:59:45 I'd estimate that bringing an android device to boot maemo in a way that could be called "working", although practically completely unusable for the original purported use would still take weeks of work Dec 30 11:59:49 sure it won't be supported but what do they have to lose from people installing another OS Dec 30 12:00:13 weeks? Dec 30 12:00:30 how about a dualboot? :P Dec 30 12:00:55 if it was possible then maybe it will have some more point Dec 30 12:01:13 "unable to use camera , audio in use by another application" ? Dec 30 12:01:29 this is a strange thing not to be able to use the camera while on a call Dec 30 12:01:50 dualboot is on the easier side, having multiple "distributions" that actually work in the sense you can interact with graphics, touchscreen and keyboard, well, that's harder Dec 30 12:02:11 * Gadgetoid_mbp doesn't like Android Dec 30 12:02:27 i mean, when i read the specs of the X10 i was like "awesome! 1ghz cpu, 256mb ram. thats practically a computer" Dec 30 12:02:46 "X10" ? Dec 30 12:02:48 Of course it's a computer... Dec 30 12:03:06 But 1ghz is pretty naff in the age of quad core hyperthreaded mass market i7 goodness Dec 30 12:03:21 Xperia X10 Dec 30 12:03:27 Not to mention all the other architectural and power considerations that make phones slow, and desktop PCs fast Dec 30 12:03:33 * frals bashes head against MMS Dec 30 12:04:07 makes sense to send the attached image with correct content-type and name... and then in the .smilpart use a different name Dec 30 12:04:15 sure, but you can run linux on a 800mhz PII computer Dec 30 12:04:37 frals: makes sense to just use email instead. Dec 30 12:04:41 X10 isn't based on OMAP3, so porting maemo to it is probably quite a bit of work, or at least cross-breeding different distributions Dec 30 12:04:50 Yeah, but it wont rip my DVD collection this side of the heat death of the universe Dec 30 12:05:03 frals: Remember what I said about MMS specs makingreaders mad? Dec 30 12:05:09 yeah :( Dec 30 12:05:39 Hasn't the 1ghz snapdragon been compared in performance to the 600mhz Omap3 Dec 30 12:06:07 I've said it once, and I'll say it again- why are we back to making 1ghz a big thing over 600mhz when the megahertz myth was dispelled years ago? Dec 30 12:06:28 I believe regarding plain ARM core performance, they have same ops/MHz performance Dec 30 12:06:59 The Droid is clocked lower than the N900, for example, and people swarm over that junk Dec 30 12:07:19 other parts differ, and those are GPU and DSP on OMAP3 Dec 30 12:07:42 The Xperia X10 looks like it's everything the Droid should have been, though Dec 30 12:08:19 * kirma spotted a nine-year girl or such being enthused by Motorola Milestone in local computer shop... surprisingly, his father wasn't as thrilled :} Dec 30 12:08:35 well, nine-ish Dec 30 12:08:42 My 2.5 year old is lucky to get my Dingoo A320 Dec 30 12:09:09 hi Dec 30 12:09:31 what's the command to flash the internal LED on n900? Dec 30 12:09:32 hello Dec 30 12:10:04 actually before i start thinking about the x10 Dec 30 12:10:12 it might be a good chance to ask Dec 30 12:10:26 should it be able to play 720p h264 files? Dec 30 12:10:27 I still favour the N900 over the X10 though Dec 30 12:10:37 is there someone online that ran qt 4.6 preview? Dec 30 12:10:40 cause that is basically my test of performance :P Dec 30 12:10:41 N900 doesn't play 720p Dec 30 12:10:44 yet Dec 30 12:10:50 i heard its likely it will Dec 30 12:10:53 at some point Dec 30 12:10:57 Although I couldn't give a hoot about gaming, I must admit that high definition video decoding would be a good feature Dec 30 12:11:02 from the discussions i've been reading Dec 30 12:11:04 well, it's to considerable extent kind of pointless, even if it'd be fancy Dec 30 12:11:04 anyone knows will the google goggles work on n900 at some point? Dec 30 12:11:08 Jiyuu|Work: that'll rape the battery, surely Dec 30 12:11:18 I don Dec 30 12:11:18 t Dec 30 12:11:20 argh Dec 30 12:11:23 can't you use vlc to run 720p? Dec 30 12:11:25 http://www.remlab.net/files/vlc/fremantle/ Dec 30 12:11:52 the thing is. i do not want to re-encode every episode i download just so i can play it on my phone Dec 30 12:11:55 I don't mind much about lacking the grunt to decode 720p smoothly, I just like to be able to throw DVDrips on there without having to be too exact in my encoding settings Dec 30 12:11:55 its pointless Dec 30 12:12:06 Jiyuu|Work: too right! Dec 30 12:12:22 I use Knots2 to playback videos from my PC onto my phone Dec 30 12:12:31 i don't care if it downscales the video Dec 30 12:12:34 or whatever Dec 30 12:12:46 as long as i don't need to reencode its fine Dec 30 12:12:47 works with any type of file VLC can play on the PC, it remuxes/transcodes it and streams onto your phone on demand Dec 30 12:13:03 live, that is Dec 30 12:13:05 no waiting required Dec 30 12:13:16 google for Knots2 Dec 30 12:13:20 and give it a go Dec 30 12:13:23 red: does it work when you're in the underground waiting for a train? Dec 30 12:13:29 :P Dec 30 12:13:35 ofcourse not, requires a connection d'oh Dec 30 12:14:01 since when metros haven't had 3G coverage? Dec 30 12:14:15 Hmm, I think I'm entitled to download a good District 9 DVDRip for my N900, as I own the Blu-RAY Dec 30 12:14:18 if i'm gonna use some streaming software to serve me video (which btw will probably need to be hosted somewhere with a decent upstream) why do i need all that power for? Dec 30 12:14:19 not everyone has unlimited data plans Dec 30 12:14:44 i could stream the video to h263 or whatever Dec 30 12:14:57 and stream it to any shitty cellphone outthere Dec 30 12:15:13 Jiyuu|Work: if you download overnight you could just set up a command line cron job to enumerate your completed folder and re-encode everything for the N900 on the fly Dec 30 12:15:38 even if horsepower for video decoding would be there, bigger resolutions eat more energy. Dec 30 12:15:53 i don't plan to watch video on my phone Dec 30 12:16:04 which tends to be quite limited resource on my N900 use, at least. Dec 30 12:16:16 Although I tend to download video straight to my N900 using transmission Dec 30 12:16:20 if i want to watch it its usually something i decide a few minutes before i leave home Dec 30 12:16:53 gadgetoid_mbp: transmission works nowadays without making N900 unbearable? nice if so :) Dec 30 12:17:17 reencoding the video take all of the "plug and play" out of watching video Dec 30 12:17:39 kirma: I'd normally only be playing a podcast at that time, as I do my downloads overnight- but I've watched videos on the N810 whilst downloading more via transmission... Dec 30 12:17:42 i don't really mind the power consumption Dec 30 12:17:44 Guys can anyone please help out a newbie with installing qmake with qt 4.6 preview? Dec 30 12:18:07 transmission pretty much mandates a power socket though :) Dec 30 12:18:14 its not like theres a shortage of power outlets.. Dec 30 12:18:21 :P Dec 30 12:18:37 tigert: true, although my N900 managed to see everything to better than 1:1 on about 4 200mb video files before running out of juice Dec 30 12:18:38 it's sort of absurd to be wireless and always on the look for closest power outlet ;) Dec 30 12:18:41 seed* Dec 30 12:19:03 the time i have to watch video is mostly when i comute to work Dec 30 12:19:19 i meant i could recharge the phone -after- i get to work :P Dec 30 12:19:45 surely watching 720p won't drain the battery in 40minutes right? Dec 30 12:20:03 I guess not Dec 30 12:21:01 power outlets dont move with you though :) Dec 30 12:21:16 though a battery pack would, mmm... Dec 30 12:21:17 power/wifi at work, power/wifi at home Dec 30 12:21:23 With not more than half an hour between those two points Dec 30 12:21:43 right now I am at the mall buying food Dec 30 12:21:47 Not to mention I have a spare battery and two power packs for emergencies Dec 30 12:21:54 no power here tjhat would be useful Dec 30 12:22:05 solar? Dec 30 12:22:20 :) Dec 30 12:23:09 power emergencies occur mostly in bars Dec 30 12:23:42 too hard to make a compromise between putting phone behind the bar desk and being online Dec 30 12:25:59 in the end i'll just end up buying a the new model of the fujitsu loox u tablet\netbook with a built in modem and be done with it Dec 30 12:27:03 whatever suits you :) Dec 30 12:28:36 Pandora :D Dec 30 12:28:47 My N900 will probably get neglected then Dec 30 12:30:11 pandora is able to play 720p? Dec 30 12:30:14 netbooks are way too geeky when on the go Dec 30 12:30:16 :O Dec 30 12:30:45 the N900 is like on the limit :) still a "phone" so this looks like I would be sms texting :)ä Dec 30 12:32:54 I've basically abandoned my aspire one after purchase of N900 Dec 30 12:33:21 not because N900 would replace it perfectly, but because it's immensely more portable and good enough replacement Dec 30 12:33:43 * Arkenoi almost never walked with a notebook Dec 30 12:33:47 doh. now my n900 is unable to see and find any bluetooth devices Dec 30 12:33:51 n900 still is a pretty big brick Dec 30 12:33:51 XD Dec 30 12:34:01 with E90 it still made sense to take aspire one to bar sometimes Dec 30 12:34:17 Jiyuu|Work, it is smaller than any phone i ever owned ;-) Dec 30 12:34:20 in my opinion fixation on size is pointless Dec 30 12:34:26 two N900 are about the size of a single fujitsu loox u Dec 30 12:34:39 and thats a netbook Dec 30 12:34:42 \tablet Dec 30 12:34:48 if N900 would be smaller in any aspect I would feel it would slip to floor through my fingers in typical use Dec 30 12:34:51 two times N900 wouldnt fit in your pocket Dec 30 12:35:09 or well, I dont know how big your pockets are Dec 30 12:35:13 but still :p Dec 30 12:35:18 an n900 wouldn't fit into the pocket of all of your pants either. Dec 30 12:35:22 of course, my preceding phones were E70 and E90... Dec 30 12:35:45 btw i have a couple of pants which have huge pockets that fit the loox u in them Dec 30 12:35:45 its true that N900 is quite bulky :) Dec 30 12:35:46 fits into my pants Dec 30 12:35:56 pockets even Dec 30 12:36:03 but its not that bad Dec 30 12:36:03 but the point is its not really comfortable either Dec 30 12:36:35 thats why i liked th X10 Dec 30 12:36:37 very much a question of personal opinion Dec 30 12:36:38 * Arkenoi owned 9000, it is almost twice the size of n900 ;-) but it was the only qwerty phone back those days Dec 30 12:36:47 its right there on the sweetspot Dec 30 12:37:07 between being to big, to being too small for use Dec 30 12:37:18 especially the immense interest in thinness of the phone entirely escapes me Dec 30 12:37:50 a lot of pockets are wide\deep enough Dec 30 12:37:54 well, weight even more. I certainly can't tell if my phone is hundred grams one day and two hundred on another. Dec 30 12:38:08 but when the phone is thick its annoying to walk with it Dec 30 12:38:29 weight does seems irrelevant to me too Dec 30 12:38:49 actually the only thing which really bothers me is the thickness of the phone Dec 30 12:39:12 as long as its not like 8" long\wide Dec 30 12:39:29 the length\width are not really an issue Dec 30 12:40:04 same here, only the fatness bothers me a bit Dec 30 12:40:13 its fatter than my old iphone which I had a protective case around :) Dec 30 12:40:20 I think thinness of the phone would make me uncomfortable, if the keyboard to backplate would be considerably less than what it is on n900 Dec 30 12:40:28 red: and yeah iphone did not have physical keyboard Dec 30 12:40:29 of course, one might get used to different alternatives Dec 30 12:40:32 so try to bear with it. Dec 30 12:40:39 ifreq: ofcourse :p Dec 30 12:40:56 i just said its the only thing about the size that bothers me Dec 30 12:41:02 my main choises for getting n900 was keyboard and more open env than iphone itself. Dec 30 12:41:06 yeah np :P Dec 30 12:41:09 there are thinner phones with slider keyboards Dec 30 12:41:12 just had to comment the obvious Dec 30 12:41:14 :) Dec 30 12:41:22 bit too obvious imo :D Dec 30 12:41:24 and... first they make iphone flat as a pancake, then everybody has to choose an outfit for their pet phone to bear the physical reality (skins or whatever they're called) Dec 30 12:41:25 :) Dec 30 12:41:36 style over substance, I say :P Dec 30 12:42:03 kirma: I had the case for resale value Dec 30 12:42:14 a shiny phone sells for more than a scratchy one :) Dec 30 12:42:46 sure, I do have screen protector too ;) Dec 30 12:42:48 and the fact that I might end up slipping it from my fingers onto the floor didnt please me either when having a glass screen =) Dec 30 12:43:54 don't want to do drop tests with N900 though. E90 was quite sturdy on that regard with its' metal body... which has broken in several places over the years, but still works fine Dec 30 12:44:14 probably dropped it from 1.5 meters to asphalt dozen times or something Dec 30 12:45:34 [14:41:02] my main choises for getting n900 was keyboard and more open env than iphone itself. Dec 30 12:45:46 is there anything -less- open then iphone? Dec 30 12:45:48 0.0 Dec 30 12:46:23 well, I was about to mention feature phones, but even those can be more open. well, fixed-function phones, certainly. Dec 30 12:46:31 without java Dec 30 12:47:10 without java Dec 30 12:47:11 XD Dec 30 12:47:38 i think my nokias from the 90's already had java support Dec 30 12:47:38 XD Dec 30 12:48:26 you might be slightly optimistic Dec 30 12:50:43 Jiyuu|Work: with jailbreak iphone is quite open. and it was my prev phone so it was quite easy to move over to n900 :P Dec 30 12:52:09 any phone is "open" once you hack it open Dec 30 12:52:16 to be open * Dec 30 12:52:17 :P Dec 30 13:02:30 brute force opening hack... with an axe. Dec 30 13:14:11 Ahoy there! Hey... I'm not working today and I'm a little bit bored.. is there any n900 projects (preferably python) out there needing help? Dec 30 13:20:17 cpscotti: do a generic "wget a text string and show it on home applet"? Dec 30 13:22:33 tigert: but how generic? u set up an url and it keeps getting that string? Or we'll need some tipe of custom parsing? Dec 30 13:23:04 hm Dec 30 13:23:22 (I agree that's a good idea) Dec 30 13:23:23 I'd use it to get a METAR in raw form Dec 30 13:23:48 maybe have it run a script to pull the data, not exactly sure right away Dec 30 13:23:57 hmm Dec 30 13:24:13 so you would only put the url and it's done Dec 30 13:24:25 set interval, handle disconnected state ok and pull data when you are again connected Dec 30 13:24:45 the url hmm, there might be some processing required Dec 30 13:25:09 yup Dec 30 13:25:17 but a generic fetch-and-display applet would be nice Dec 30 13:25:32 yep.. I agree Dec 30 13:25:33 it should somehow handle multiple instances i guess Dec 30 13:25:39 dunno if that is hard to do Dec 30 13:26:03 but if we could figure out a way to ease the "custom parsing" factor, it would be even better Dec 30 13:26:30 metar and TAF would be nice for me Dec 30 13:27:05 hmm.. Dec 30 13:28:00 fetch-and-push-though-filter-command-and-display, with specified refresh or based on HTTP expiration information Dec 30 13:28:05 feature bloat :) Dec 30 13:28:06 but if it were a script Dec 30 13:28:13 it could do everything else Dec 30 13:28:28 that would be a start Dec 30 13:28:34 "push-though-filter-command" seems good Dec 30 13:28:40 yea Dec 30 13:28:43 but really only directed to "advanced" users Dec 30 13:28:46 more and more sounds like a shell script with output attached to a widget Dec 30 13:28:49 or just run command in first place Dec 30 13:29:01 might not involve http at all even Dec 30 13:29:23 which, of course, would be awkward for non-power users, but ok for nerds that don't promote ease of use too well ;) Dec 30 13:29:29 theres the ip address applet that is written with python Dec 30 13:29:32 hehe Dec 30 13:29:37 might be a good start from Dec 30 13:29:46 well.. what about just doing a "exec" widget Dec 30 13:29:52 perhaps yeah Dec 30 13:29:56 you enter a list of command on the setup Dec 30 13:29:59 show stdout Dec 30 13:30:04 yea Dec 30 13:30:05 exactly Dec 30 13:30:17 for example.. one could use "uptime" Dec 30 13:30:21 yep Dec 30 13:30:27 "lshal | grep bat" Dec 30 13:30:32 yep Dec 30 13:30:43 ok.. let's get to work.. Dec 30 13:30:44 n900 - $470AR - buy.com - http://tinyurl.com/yckydqy Dec 30 13:30:47 one thing I'm wondering though: how to create several instances of such widget, each with different contents? Dec 30 13:30:47 lots of uses :) Dec 30 13:30:54 or any other widget Dec 30 13:31:00 kirma: my question also Dec 30 13:31:05 needs studying Dec 30 13:31:12 but one is a goood start Dec 30 13:31:37 yep Dec 30 13:31:56 ship it with an example commandline of uptime for example Dec 30 13:32:02 also: any way to "specialize" terminal to an application that would run a specific command in it? shouldn't be hard, but a nice wrapper for this would be... nice. Dec 30 13:32:25 hmm? Dec 30 13:32:31 kirma: example... I don't get what you mean Dec 30 13:33:24 osso-xterm -e top Dec 30 13:33:29 ? Dec 30 13:33:49 tigert: basically that stuff, but with nice GUI shortcut Dec 30 13:34:04 Exec=top\nRunInTerm=true Dec 30 13:34:07 in a .desktop Dec 30 13:34:28 http://p.zash.se/XuSmPg.txt Dec 30 13:34:31 like that Dec 30 13:34:32 also, I want the terminal to be useful for other purposes :) Dec 30 13:35:15 anyone know if its possible to disconnect the current network connection with python-conic? from what ive gathered its not :( Dec 30 13:37:31 * tigert would use curl$ wget -q -O - ftp://tgftp.nws.noaa.gov/data/observations/metar/stations/EFHF.TXT | grep EFHF Dec 30 13:37:34 erm Dec 30 13:37:36 $ wget -q -O - ftp://tgftp.nws.noaa.gov/data/observations/metar/stations/EFHF.TXT | grep EFHF Dec 30 13:37:53 this would work for me Dec 30 13:38:52 hm this fmradio thing is strange. I see that scanning is supposed to be supported in the changelog but I can't find the buttons Dec 30 13:40:55 *cough* http://www.proporta.com/F02/PPF02P05.php?t_id=4883&t_mode=des&affiliate=gadgetoid *cough* Dec 30 13:41:19 Me has a feeling that the alu leather case for the N900 is going to suck a bit Dec 30 13:41:44 * Gadgetoid_mbp wants a cozy slip case Dec 30 13:42:11 yepyep Dec 30 13:42:31 i got mine in a little draw string bag atm Dec 30 13:42:45 Hmm, the Maya Digital Camera Case might fit Dec 30 13:42:57 99mm x 58mm x 25mm Dec 30 13:43:00 Bit big, though Dec 30 13:43:02 I think Dec 30 13:43:13 papo: pan, does it stop at a station? Dec 30 13:43:22 swipe, i mean Dec 30 13:43:50 tigert: no Dec 30 13:44:04 but it looks like it's commented out in the source... let's see what happens if I re-enable it Dec 30 13:45:38 ah ok Dec 30 13:48:51 Hi, I can connect to my N900 using ssh, but only as root. Is it possible to connect as 'user' ? What is the passwd for him ? Will it affect the system if I change it using the passwd command ? Dec 30 13:55:39 grondilu, it is safe to change the password Dec 30 13:56:51 sure ? I can execute 'passwd user' ? Dec 30 13:58:04 done. Now I can connect as 'user'. Hope it's ok. Dec 30 14:03:16 hello , is it possible to play .ra streams on the N900... its a rtsp://bbc.net.uk:554/file.ra type link ? Dec 30 14:03:53 if nto then sucky fuck it is. Dec 30 14:04:14 an0therb0x: have you tried mplayer? Dec 30 14:06:34 Hoxzer: media player said audio codec not supported Dec 30 14:06:50 an0therb0x: just try mplayer Dec 30 14:07:13 http://maemocentral.com/2009/12/10/how-to-use-mplayer-on-the-n900-to-play-unsupported-video-formats/ Dec 30 14:07:28 n900 runs linux so it is simply too awsome device Dec 30 14:07:43 a lot of have jizzed their pants just because of the youtube pron about it Dec 30 14:08:23 and what else: No no,... Ihave been waiting this device for like 1 week now and it should have arrived in 29.12 Dec 30 14:08:54 think I will cancel my order because I get it at half the price with a 24kk deal (including the monthly costs of the deal) Dec 30 14:15:37 hello, when i try to connect msn with the butterfly pkugin it says me "not connected", is there a solution ? aybe a new version i use the extras-testing version Dec 30 14:19:21 which package provides "gst-launch" again? garr Dec 30 14:20:47 gst-tools ? Dec 30 14:21:10 arrr. thanks Dec 30 14:21:30 nobody for the msn plugin ? Dec 30 14:21:51 does some people have the same problem ? Dec 30 14:31:19 TomaszD: here now. Dec 30 14:38:22 what's that python command used to fill an empty if? Dec 30 14:39:22 davyg the msn plugin worked for me Dec 30 14:39:41 the butterfly one ? Dec 30 14:39:54 lardman: huh? Dec 30 14:39:58 lardman: fill an empty if? Dec 30 14:40:02 papo: I found the FM radio to be extremely buggy during my short time using it Dec 30 14:40:02 davyg, yes Dec 30 14:40:10 pass? Dec 30 14:40:14 ah Dec 30 14:40:17 that's the one, thanks Dec 30 14:40:18 i changed to haze a few days ago, because i needed icq Dec 30 14:40:27 sorry for my cryptic explanation ;) Dec 30 14:40:30 lardman: I got my N900 by the way Dec 30 14:40:33 furunk31: from extra devel ? Dec 30 14:40:37 just wondering what sort of if you have :) Dec 30 14:40:43 papo: good stuff :) Dec 30 14:40:49 lardman: we talked about mbarcode some time ago... I'm the library guy Dec 30 14:41:02 ah right Dec 30 14:41:03 :) Dec 30 14:41:16 am just going to test gst-zbar and gst-dmtx Dec 30 14:41:25 davyg, yes Dec 30 14:41:34 ok Dec 30 14:42:56 lardman: oh - while you were away - saw a possible sales avenue for you; http://yro.slashdot.org/article.pl?sid=09/12/25/0019250 Dec 30 14:43:36 lol Dec 30 14:44:19 lardman: I have to admit that mbarcode confuses me Dec 30 14:44:33 papo: I'm doing a re-write Dec 30 14:44:42 but ask if you'd like to know something Dec 30 14:45:42 lardman: well what is it supposed to do? I clicked on scan and pointed the camera to a barcode and nothing happened Dec 30 14:45:50 :) Dec 30 14:46:02 well it's supposed to decode the barcode and display it on the RHS Dec 30 14:46:09 what type of barcode was it? Dec 30 14:46:56 unusually well informed comments on that yro article Dec 30 14:47:06 lardman: I have to guess but it looks like code 39 Dec 30 14:47:17 * SpeedEvil ponders code 34 barcodes. Dec 30 14:48:11 Hoxzer: thanks dude Dec 30 14:48:22 * lardman wonders if ZBar is supposed to be able to decode those... Dec 30 14:48:42 lardman: I can send you a picture if you're intersted Dec 30 14:49:10 morning Dec 30 14:49:23 please do Dec 30 14:49:26 morning hrw Dec 30 14:49:34 furunk3l: in fact i wasn't in extra devel, i'm testing now with it, i'm a bit afraid event if i'm an debian unstable user Dec 30 14:49:57 worked like a charm for me Dec 30 14:50:17 ok^^ expect so, but i trust maemo team Dec 30 14:50:33 wow, maemo repository is slow atm Dec 30 14:50:40 lardman: ok Dec 30 14:50:53 'unstable' is much more stable than windows final releases ;) Dec 30 14:51:02 of course Dec 30 14:52:12 that's why i use it ^^ Dec 30 14:52:33 lardman: http://snowball2.ethz.ch/20091230_001.jpg Dec 30 14:53:56 it would be impressive if a reader couuld handle the out-of-focus bars on the left Dec 30 14:54:07 indeed Dec 30 14:54:14 Yeah, I don't think zbar's 1D code is that good, yet. Dec 30 14:54:28 yeah, still needs hard edges Dec 30 14:54:29 just to clarify, that's not the picture I used to check the application, it's just a picture I made afterwards Dec 30 14:54:48 I think you'll have some troubles with that tbh, as you've shown Dec 30 14:55:03 you could try talking to spadix in #zbar when he's back Dec 30 14:55:11 and see what he can do with the decoder itself Dec 30 14:55:17 hi derf btw :) Dec 30 14:55:22 Hi lardman. Dec 30 14:55:52 hmm very odd, gst-zbar isn't recognised Dec 30 14:57:07 ah, undefined symbol Dec 30 14:57:44 Is anyone working on a program to download cover arts on the N900? If not, I would write one which downloads the covert into .cache/media-art so it is shown in the media player but does not show up in the image browser. Optionally, people could select a local image file as the cover. Dec 30 14:59:37 there is one Dec 30 14:59:50 that uses google or something like that Dec 30 14:59:53 oops, forgot to link against libzbar, might be an issue.... Dec 30 15:00:11 Evening everyone Dec 30 15:00:27 evening wazdie Dec 30 15:00:54 juliank: but I'm not sure if it does the second part you mentioned Dec 30 15:00:55 lardman: http://snowball2.ethz.ch/20091230_001.jpg better picture Dec 30 15:01:06 Die?) Dec 30 15:01:34 wazd_e63: naah :P Dec 30 15:02:31 sloooowly heading to my country :( Dec 30 15:02:58 lardman: and even better _002. However http://pastebin.com/f22ca26e7 Dec 30 15:07:10 wazd_e63, http://www.engadget.com/ (see top stories ;)) Dec 30 15:07:49 'Valério Domingos '? Dec 30 15:08:02 re Dec 30 15:08:17 hi lcukn900 Dec 30 15:08:38 VDVsx: Congrats ;) Dec 30 15:08:49 Stskeeps, they probably thought that Valerio Valerio is a typo, lol Dec 30 15:08:53 hiya simon Dec 30 15:09:11 X-Fade, :) Dec 30 15:09:12 my n900 just rebooted Dec 30 15:09:17 good. Dec 30 15:09:22 lcukn900: does it suck? Dec 30 15:09:25 1st time ever on its own Dec 30 15:09:41 n900 is amazing Dec 30 15:09:44 well. how much did you pay for that piece of crap? Dec 30 15:09:52 best computer i ever touched Dec 30 15:10:19 well, just because you only use Pentium I doesn't make you a 1337 Dec 30 15:10:34 err? Dec 30 15:12:20 vdvsx, hehe, congrats) Dec 30 15:12:44 VDVsx: oh, nice to hear you already got the multimedia keys covered :) I won't be doing duplicate work, then (anymore than I've already done) Dec 30 15:12:51 lcukn900: just fucking with you because I have no iddea when I will be getting mine Dec 30 15:12:54 perhaps tomorrow Dec 30 15:13:04 that's waht they said at the store but they're just pissing me off Dec 30 15:13:16 will be paying 233 euros for it Dec 30 15:13:18 checking if it happens again. i only went on playboy to read the articles Dec 30 15:13:48 vdvsx, any shots there? Dec 30 15:15:44 ah, I See Dec 30 15:17:29 phew, sara jean underwood can do yoga on n900 Dec 30 15:17:43 it wasnt playboy that crashed it Dec 30 15:19:30 :D Dec 30 15:20:00 the videos arent mobie optimized tho Dec 30 15:20:25 i can see and here the yoga explanations, they are most informativde Dec 30 15:20:25 im disliking the fact that when i run my service in the background it wont send dbus signals like it should, but works fine with i run it in a terminal Dec 30 15:20:25 videos? :/ Dec 30 15:20:37 dude. wtf, the codecs are mobile optimized Dec 30 15:20:56 videos are suppose to be small as possible Dec 30 15:20:58 well. Dec 30 15:21:05 oke, taking my words back! Dec 30 15:21:18 because resolution and fps are the only things that are mobile optimized Dec 30 15:21:19 i can see and here the yoga explanations, they are most informativde Dec 30 15:22:09 frals is this is your test app Dec 30 15:23:08 probably something to do with python-dbus and this mess with glib mainloop and including different files Dec 30 15:23:14 guess ill have another look at the docs ;) Dec 30 15:24:46 frals mmm its nort simple osso registration isi Dec 30 15:24:48 t Dec 30 15:25:49 not using osso ;o Dec 30 15:26:52 frals i thought everything needed registration? Dec 30 15:28:43 gahhh @ typos beyond Dec 30 15:32:44 in fact even with the new version it's still doesn't work, it still says me not connected, just with the butterfly plugin(work fine with haze) Dec 30 15:34:51 reboot time again Dec 30 15:42:23 heh.. Dec 30 15:42:34 If you get an package voted into extras and then promote the next package to extras-testing then the original package will remain in extras until the updated package clears the QA and it then replaces the older version in extras? Dec 30 15:42:47 during xmas break I managed to get to ~10 entries in a note called "maemo5 bugs to report" Dec 30 15:42:53 wow, that was complicated... Dec 30 15:43:43 joppu: Correct Dec 30 15:43:51 Anssi, actually someone did the new service record and also so testing, I only have to integrate it Dec 30 15:43:55 joppu: Each repository, -devel, -testing and Extras have different versions Dec 30 15:44:30 Anssi, and kick wazd_e63 to make me a new layout for the multimedia keys :p Dec 30 15:45:18 btw - still no 2009.52.1 firmware for users? Dec 30 15:45:31 hrw: NAFAIK, still with community testers Dec 30 15:45:40 ah, was attaching to wrong bus appearently, using System instead of Session made it work Dec 30 15:45:52 Jaffa: thx for info Dec 30 15:45:57 now i just need to make this damn notification launch the browser and im golden Dec 30 15:46:14 Since I already have 7/10 votes and I can't decide if 1. I release a new version with a few bug fixes and wait another eternity to get it passed or 2. Wait until the package is promoted into extras and then release the update to extras-testing Dec 30 15:46:26 joppu: Welcome to the dilemma. Dec 30 15:47:05 :| Dec 30 15:47:05 re lardman Dec 30 15:47:26 afternoon jeremiah Dec 30 15:47:44 joppu: http://www.gossamer-threads.com/lists/maemo/developers/54299?do=post_view_threaded Dec 30 15:48:05 joppu: generally I would do 2. Dec 30 15:48:39 Anyone recall that n900 poarts site. Oddly my bookmark seems to have vanished. Dec 30 15:49:01 anyway I plan to probably ignore maemo repos for own stuff rather then handling all those things Dec 30 15:50:16 joppu, Jaffa, that a very annoying problem, also for users, because that leads the developer to release a lot of versions one after another. Very small updates popping all the time is a bit annoying :( Dec 30 15:50:28 VDVsx: Indeed Dec 30 15:50:54 VDVsx: How are your discussions with X-Fade re changes discussed on IRC progressing? (Assuming you've still got ownership of it ;-)) Dec 30 15:51:29 release early, release often Dec 30 15:51:56 if for no other reason than to increase download counts lol Dec 30 15:52:17 Jaffa, X-Fade is pretty busy with the servers, we need to make some decisions about that in the new year Dec 30 15:52:22 but I'm on it Dec 30 15:52:26 Cool Dec 30 15:53:14 Jaffa: #maemo-devel Dec 30 15:53:26 Goddamnit, I'll just throw away the 7 karma point just for the sake of more bugfreeness... It's still annoying as hell to wait another few weeks... Dec 30 15:53:59 joppu: option 3. create own repository Dec 30 15:54:26 lbt, did you get httpd working? Dec 30 15:54:35 or whichever one of them you were building Dec 30 15:54:40 hrw: Not exactly a *constructive* solution, though. Dec 30 15:54:43 hrw: yes, but then the people will never find it unless it's something they are desperately seeking for Dec 30 15:54:58 Like in the emus case Dec 30 15:54:59 Jaffa: I know Dec 30 15:55:28 Jaffa: but so far to get to extras you need to find 10 users which will use app and vote for it - right? Dec 30 15:55:47 hrw: You need to get 10 testers who check the app against the QA process. Dec 30 15:56:11 bb in few Dec 30 15:56:12 hrw: There are members of the community testing as much as possible, even if they're not actually interested in *using* the app long term Dec 30 15:57:58 re Dec 30 15:58:54 Interesting Dec 30 15:58:56 http://www.tessco.com/products/bmd/listItemsForSelectedCategory.do?bmdTypeId=007_26&mfgName=007_26_NOKIA&modelId=785585&groupSubgroupId=SHOW_ALL Dec 30 15:59:03 some bits are in fact quite cheap. Dec 30 15:59:09 The stylus only $.49 Dec 30 15:59:18 but you've gotta order $175 worth of stuff Dec 30 15:59:25 hmmh, apt-get in scratchbox takes a long time in “waiting for headers” Dec 30 15:59:31 is it just me? Dec 30 16:00:27 Corsac: or you got hit by famous "sbox ate your /etc/resolv.conf" bug Dec 30 16:00:49 back Dec 30 16:01:06 SpeedEvil: Start a profitable business of selling styluses to people who have lost them? Dec 30 16:02:03 hrw: ha, maybe Dec 30 16:02:05 will check that Dec 30 16:02:23 (I run scratchbox inside kvm though) Dec 30 16:02:57 /scratchbox/tools/bin/sh: line 1: /usr/sbin/dpkg-preconfigure: No such file or directory Dec 30 16:03:00 yurk Dec 30 16:05:11 hmhm, are the build-dep supposed to be installed outside of the scratchbox target or inside? Dec 30 16:06:30 Hiisty, I'm chatting from my n810, yay! Dec 30 16:07:12 congratulations Dec 30 16:07:43 Corsac: hmmh, apt-get in scratchbox takes a long time in “waiting for headers” Dec 30 16:07:44 Me too. Always. Dec 30 16:08:02 hmm, I haven't figured out how to make x-chat join more than one channel at startup Dec 30 16:08:08 though i do get them eventually. The whole infrastructure (well, minus wiki and bugzilla) is snot slow. Dec 30 16:08:28 jebba: a lot of maintaince going on atm Dec 30 16:08:32 Corsac: don't sweat the "dpkg-preconfigure" noise. Everything still works fine Dec 30 16:08:34 never seen things this busy :) Dec 30 16:08:38 Stskeeps: ya, been watching and waiting... Dec 30 16:08:56 https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=5818 Dec 30 16:08:58 Bug 5818: We need servers Dec 30 16:10:24 jebba: but packages won't be correctly installed Dec 30 16:15:52 Do i something wrong? want to connect to a dynamic wep. in settings > connection added the connection, but how to connect to the saved connections? Dec 30 16:16:29 simple trying to the right ssid gives a dialog asking wep key. Dec 30 16:18:42 Corsac: then everything is broken, because that is how all the packages are done. Dec 30 16:19:08 there is no /usr/sbin/dpkg-preconfigure in the release. Dec 30 16:19:45 any easy way to install n900 emulator on debian linux? Dec 30 16:20:24 ah, lovely, receiving MMS -> click on notification opens it in the browser Dec 30 16:20:27 Hoxzer: perhaps install the full SDK? Dec 30 16:20:39 now if python-conic would let me kill all active connections.. :D Dec 30 16:20:39 Hoxzer: There's no emulator. You can install the SDK which includes a fairly complete Maemo environment on x86 using the GUI installer: http://wiki.forum.nokia.com/index.php/How_to_install_Maemo_5_SDK_using_GUI_Installer Dec 30 16:21:03 though you could do it without the full SDK, i just don't know a "quick way" to do just an emulator Dec 30 16:21:04 Jaffa: Oh darn... I want something to test the feel of the device Dec 30 16:21:15 of course the speed is different anyhow Dec 30 16:21:28 like android emu is a lot slower on PC Dec 30 16:22:04 Hoxzer: Given it's not an emulator, you have the reverse problem on Maemo :) Dec 30 16:22:14 xchat.. its awesome. Dec 30 16:22:15 Hoxzer: You can get a feel for the UI concepts and some of the main apps, for sure. Dec 30 16:22:23 Jaffa: yep, I know but n900 is such a good device that no need to for emu Dec 30 16:22:34 http://maemo.org/packages/ is down. I take that as a good sign, actually ;) Dec 30 16:22:38 Jaffa: just ssh and x-forward would work alright Dec 30 16:22:43 Jaffa: I guess... Dec 30 16:23:00 Hoxzer: Indeed. I often use gedit over sshfs to edit the Python and SSH to start it Dec 30 16:28:06 jebba: that looks like a bad idea :/ Dec 30 16:28:18 I don't know why it has been stripped Dec 30 16:30:11 http://wiki.maemo.org/Category:N900_Hardware Dec 30 16:30:28 contributions from the clueful welcome! Dec 30 16:31:00 Anything hot besides vdvsx fame today?) Dec 30 16:35:08 wazd_e63, your 'designs' are in the article as well :) Dec 30 16:38:58 When did "fone" suddenly become vogue? Dec 30 16:40:22 ph, people, you are not Webster. Dec 30 16:43:37 Corsac: hasnt been stripped. It wasn't in early versions of debhelper or whatever, AFAIK Dec 30 16:44:00 it's in debconf Dec 30 16:44:12 GAN900: teléfono Dec 30 16:44:34 and it was in debconf even in etch Dec 30 16:45:23 debconf 1.4.70.osso2 Dec 30 16:45:28 * jebba looking @ source now Dec 30 16:45:48 so the n900 does not have avahi by default? Dec 30 16:48:33 vdvsx, well, they are yours there, but I Don't actually care much, just happy for you) Dec 30 16:50:20 kov: no. it got installed as an indirect dependency when I installed accounts-plugin-haze though. Dec 30 16:51:16 Corsac: the bug has been around forever: https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=927 Dec 30 16:51:17 Bug 927: Sardine: Missing dpkg-preconfigure causes error messages during installation Dec 30 16:51:40 looking at debconf source package, i dont see how/why it is left out. But it has been gone since sardine at least (like 3 releases ago) Dec 30 16:53:38 pH5, from extras-testing? Dec 30 16:54:55 kov: either that, or even -devel. not sure. Dec 30 16:55:31 pH5, k, thanks, I only found avahi-daemon on those Dec 30 16:55:44 I was expecting this to be in by default, though =( Dec 30 17:02:02 hi, http://www.expansys.fr/d.aspx?i=188856 had 9 N900 a few hours ago, now it's out of stock again Dec 30 17:02:11 any statement from Nokia yet? Dec 30 17:03:15 frals, i was one day out :$ Dec 30 17:03:18 sleep fail Dec 30 17:03:35 and omg @ you getting mms on device :) thats great Dec 30 17:04:43 are there any official n900 accessories available? Dec 30 17:05:00 i'd love to buy another battery, at least Dec 30 17:05:17 and an official case and screen protector Dec 30 17:05:40 i want to get an official n900 hackerbox :D Dec 30 17:08:16 mutt Dec 30 17:08:44 lcuk: hehe :D Dec 30 17:09:46 regarding mms; its very much not according to standards this mms "support" thou, im just getting the mms of the server and then nothing.. should look into sending the correct response once i downloaded it i guess Dec 30 17:10:08 but its working! (as long as your not connected to anything, then you have to run a manual script to fetch it from the sms push file, but still!) Dec 30 17:10:56 frals :) Dec 30 17:16:40 (hmhm, is it possible to erase only one sms?) Dec 30 17:16:55 yeah click it Dec 30 17:17:01 then from there i think you can delete it Dec 30 17:17:03 ? Dec 30 17:17:19 yeah you can Dec 30 17:17:26 * lcuk just tested Dec 30 17:17:27 yeah Dec 30 17:17:32 confirming here as well! Dec 30 17:17:36 ha yeah, it works, with normal sms Dec 30 17:17:53 (I just imported an sms programmatically and I guess I did something wrong :) Dec 30 17:18:08 Corsac, what you using to import/export? Dec 30 17:18:09 because taping on it doesn't give anything Dec 30 17:18:13 nms is being a complete asshole Dec 30 17:18:15 language/lib wise i mean Dec 30 17:18:27 nms? Dec 30 17:18:30 C and rt-eventlogger Dec 30 17:18:36 i wish there was some proper python wrapper for rtcom-eventlogger ;( Dec 30 17:18:37 kewl Dec 30 17:18:40 nokia messaging Dec 30 17:18:43 I started from http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=37354 Dec 30 17:18:49 frals: I wish too Dec 30 17:19:03 you can access messaging api at some level from the easyapi in python Dec 30 17:19:47 hello all Dec 30 17:19:54 * lcuk cant wait for frals to get mms library working :) Dec 30 17:20:01 hmhm, now that sucks if I'm stuck with those smses Dec 30 17:20:03 wonder if easy is still working with maemo5 Dec 30 17:20:04 http://liqbase.net/liq.20091230_041442.user.lolcats.png Dec 30 17:20:15 * lcuk needs to send lolcats :) Dec 30 17:20:29 Corsac: you could *probably* delete them straight from the el.db Dec 30 17:20:36 frals ithink it is, afaik its what the pushn900 people used Dec 30 17:20:38 could someone tell me the path to where the maemo flasher would be installed on Ubuntu? Dec 30 17:20:48 cool, ill have a look at it at some point Dec 30 17:21:06 mack i wasnt aware the flasher installed anywhere? Dec 30 17:21:15 hey woglinde Dec 30 17:21:37 need to make some kind of placeholder ui to run my ugly decode-sms-push.py when not retrieving the mms directly :< Dec 30 17:21:57 well the prob i have is that the flasher can't find the fw files Dec 30 17:22:51 does flasher look for the firmware files? or do you use the console to direct it which file? Dec 30 17:23:57 not sure but ive followed the fw guide on talk.maemo and im getting nowhere Dec 30 17:24:05 VDVsx, gahhhhh sending that mail to tracy involves her sending back a link to shopping site for new couches Dec 30 17:24:44 the fw files are in a folder called maemo in the home folder Dec 30 17:26:38 lcuk: I went with sshfs and read the syncevolution log files that way Dec 30 17:27:10 ahhh k Dec 30 17:27:17 hi lcuk Dec 30 17:27:27 hiya timeless \o Dec 30 17:27:43 timeless: about:config claims touching it ruins your warranty btw Dec 30 17:27:56 yep Dec 30 17:28:14 balls, locked up browser on desktop Dec 30 17:28:19 as far as firefox is concerned, it came w/ no warranty to begin with Dec 30 17:28:21 hhmh, though importing sms add them after all the already present Dec 30 17:28:26 it seems the ordering is done by id Dec 30 17:28:30 and thus touching it voids it Dec 30 17:28:37 timeless: yeah.. it has purpose in firefox but on a device.. :P Dec 30 17:28:49 what should it say? Dec 30 17:29:02 olde style thar be dragons Dec 30 17:29:08 i doubt nokia would approve of "here be dragons" Dec 30 17:29:19 no, but that would be cool Dec 30 17:29:23 that be moomins? Dec 30 17:29:26 thar Dec 30 17:29:31 it's safer not to change things Dec 30 17:29:38 than to let nokia consider them Dec 30 17:29:43 definitely confuses user and send the wrong "touch this void warantee"!!! BS threads that occur. Dec 30 17:29:43 lcuk: ? hackerbox? Dec 30 17:30:00 sts: are you using my locale? Dec 30 17:30:02 SpeedEvil, id show you if my browser werent locked up Dec 30 17:30:11 timeless: http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=38813 Dec 30 17:30:11 jebba: has that happened yet? Dec 30 17:30:12 search for n900 hackerbox ort similar Dec 30 17:30:17 timeless: odd. I sent a bug on that. Dec 30 17:30:23 oh brother Dec 30 17:30:27 timeless: namely that it has no warranty anyway Dec 30 17:31:07 sts: so.. Dec 30 17:31:12 this is stupid Dec 30 17:31:20 disabling ovi for browser is simple Dec 30 17:31:25 you do it from the menu Dec 30 17:31:44 timeless: nah, it was someone claiming maemo isn't as open as it claims cos about:config voids warranty Dec 30 17:31:51 options, add-ons, extensions Dec 30 17:31:58 tap ovi, disable Dec 30 17:32:10 mine is disabled Dec 30 17:32:15 timeless: what Stskeeps said ;) http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=38813 Dec 30 17:32:48 also seen mention of flashing device void warantee too (FUD; but its on forums or somesuch here & there) Dec 30 17:33:03 jebba: it does bring up a larger number of questions though :) Dec 30 17:33:18 ie, does let's say, Mer, void warranty, or flashing your own kernel Dec 30 17:33:22 jebba: the flasher readme is not reassuring - the linux Dec 30 17:33:41 i think they put it there for the reason that people won't do it at then go to ask free warranty reinstall of software because they configured it wrong themselves Dec 30 17:34:21 jebba: would you please comment explaining how to disable ovi Dec 30 17:34:29 since afaict that went unanswered Dec 30 17:34:51 PONG. /me drops ovi in mircob thx ;) Dec 30 17:34:51 timeless: BTW, changing "Ovi" to "App manager" is even easier than hacking Ovi's .desktop. And it's also easy to remove the preferential sorting of the first 12 items on the "More..." menu Dec 30 17:35:07 timeless: done Dec 30 17:35:16 :) Dec 30 17:35:29 jaffa: i'm kinda listening Dec 30 17:35:36 timeless: you know how to disable google search bar? So if you enter "foo" you get 404 or no DNS or whatever and not a google search? Dec 30 17:35:47 (there's jazz music in the background, well, the entire room) Dec 30 17:35:52 timeless: For the former, something like the following (as root): perl -pi~ -e 's/"ovi\.desktop/"hildon-application-manager\.desktop/g' /etc/xdg/menus/hildon.menu Dec 30 17:36:02 oh brother Dec 30 17:36:13 timeless: For the latter, see https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=7450 Dec 30 17:36:13 jaffa: i'll add a package for that Dec 30 17:36:14 Bug 7450: Application sorting ignores first 12 items Dec 30 17:36:58 jebba: hold on Dec 30 17:38:08 hey, do you guys have /usr/share/browser ? Dec 30 17:38:59 /usr/share/browser/browser_custom.desktop Dec 30 17:39:33 is it as funny as i think it is? Dec 30 17:39:39 * timeless sighs Dec 30 17:39:48 feel free to file a bug Dec 30 17:40:06 it's fairly clear that file shouldn't ship Dec 30 17:40:28 ok will do Dec 30 17:42:03 speaking of jokes Dec 30 17:42:04 /etc/gconf/schemas/browser.schemas Dec 30 17:42:23 might as well include that in the same bug Dec 30 17:42:27 hi everybody! i just messed around with the keymap file on my N900 and apparently made a mistake, so now it won't boot up and all I get are these blinking dots. Is there any way to access the device in a rescue mode or something? (like the n8x0 bootloader had?) Dec 30 17:42:49 the n8x0 had a rescue mode?? Dec 30 17:43:02 doesn't sound very nokiaish Dec 30 17:43:05 timeless rescue what? Dec 30 17:43:16 well the bootloader you could install had one (community made) Dec 30 17:43:29 bootloader install? Dec 30 17:43:33 mrweasel: flash it Dec 30 17:43:39 ~flasher Dec 30 17:43:40 somebody said flasher was http://wiki.maemo.org/Flasher Dec 30 17:43:49 SpeedEvil: yeah but then all my settings and stuff will get lost Dec 30 17:43:52 I would not exchange the bootloader on my nxx Dec 30 17:43:58 mrweasel: there's bootmenu but someone needs to give it a loving hand to add usbnet Dec 30 17:44:03 it's not bootloader, it's bootmenu Dec 30 17:44:16 bugzilla should have a "preview" option like forums etc has Dec 30 17:45:10 so if i try to connect it to the pc, i won't be able to access the root partition i guess? Dec 30 17:45:23 right Dec 30 17:45:27 mrweasel: correct, no hope, but help out with bootmenu Dec 30 17:45:35 wtf is an ovi browser extension anyway? Dec 30 17:45:43 Stskeeps: is there already a bootmenu for n900? Dec 30 17:45:48 mrweasel: yes Dec 30 17:45:54 mrweasel: but not as featured as n8x0 one Dec 30 17:46:28 Stskeeps: do you have a link? Dec 30 17:47:56 hmm, how to find in debian/maemo what is a source package for a binary? e.g. what is source to apt get for tablet-browser-ui ? Dec 30 17:48:16 jebba: t-b-u is closed Dec 30 17:48:41 ah Dec 30 17:48:45 bastards Dec 30 17:48:51 lftp is a great ftp client (on n900) Dec 30 17:48:55 pupnik.de:/www> ls gregale/*.deb |wc -l Dec 30 17:48:56 124 Dec 30 17:49:58 jebba: alternatives can be midori Dec 30 17:50:14 mrweasel: http://talk.maemo.org/showpost.php?p=372885&postcount=22 Dec 30 17:50:32 timeless: filed. Dec 30 17:50:46 Stskeeps: ya, i use midori. It's decent, but kind of slow redraw etc Dec 30 17:51:14 hello Dec 30 17:51:14 Stskeeps: thanks Dec 30 17:51:23 is it only me that finds fennec so slow its unusable? Dec 30 17:51:59 aaargh! Dec 30 17:52:00 jebba: mxr.maemo.org covers the open bits Dec 30 17:52:22 tru: nightlies or a release? Dec 30 17:52:29 * lcuk gets lardman a BLT and a glass of wine Dec 30 17:52:31 nightlies Dec 30 17:52:35 thanks lcuk Dec 30 17:52:39 tru_: slooooooooooow Dec 30 17:52:44 was just using nightly-trunk last night. Dec 30 17:52:47 whats boggling you Dec 30 17:53:11 i think it must be built with a ton of debugging or something. If I could find their debian/ dir somewhere, i'd rebuild it myself faster, if possible Dec 30 17:53:14 gst-zbar is coming up with an undefined symbol error Dec 30 17:53:23 i was working up a build of it yesterday too, but starting it from scratch is a bitch. Dec 30 17:53:30 even though gst-dmtx. which is identical but for the names, works fine Dec 30 17:53:48 jebba: i thought we had to make the serch engine "customizable" Dec 30 17:54:02 jebba: re config, use about:buildconfig Dec 30 17:54:16 if it doesn't say --enable-debug, it isn't Dec 30 17:54:36 lardman: doing anything new and exciting with gst? Dec 30 17:54:38 man, there is maemo stuff that always appears. wtf is this mxr thing i'm looking at?? ;) Dec 30 17:54:44 and if you can't find that, please don't waste people's time speculating Dec 30 17:55:05 jebba: it's been in the channel topic since before you joined Dec 30 17:55:07 timeless well about:buildconfig is still way short of a debian/ dir. Eg. the .list files etc. Dec 30 17:55:09 hahahahha Dec 30 17:55:10 RST38bis: adding datamatrix and 1D/QR decoding to the pipeline Dec 30 17:55:15 ah Dec 30 17:55:21 timeless: like i said, soooo much more to still check out Dec 30 17:55:30 RST38bis: not my code, but just packaging it up, unsuccessfully in the case of zbar Dec 30 17:55:40 debian dirs are JUNK Dec 30 17:55:41 jo lardman Dec 30 17:55:44 moo rst Dec 30 17:55:54 hi woglinde Dec 30 17:55:57 heh... do give subtitles a try though=) Dec 30 17:56:03 heya woglinde Dec 30 17:56:18 *g* Dec 30 17:56:22 RST38bis: what adding them? Dec 30 17:56:26 yeah subtitles Dec 30 17:56:32 there is a modul Dec 30 17:56:46 RST38bis: should work with gst out of the box, just need a different media player app to wrap the pipeline Dec 30 17:57:05 yea Dec 30 17:57:24 would be cool to be able to git clone the whole http://mxr.maemo.org/fremantle/source/ Dec 30 17:57:38 it isn't under vcs Dec 30 17:57:43 work with what ya got Dec 30 17:57:48 i could probably setup rsync Dec 30 17:58:17 if you're *very* careful, you could write a spider script Dec 30 17:58:27 for each directory: recurse Dec 30 17:58:35 yikes, wouldbe a bit messy Dec 30 17:58:41 for each file: save x?raw=1 as x Dec 30 17:58:48 if any gstreamer gurus are bored and fancy taking a look at the gst-zbar code please do. Enable extras-devel and "apt-get source gst-zbar" Dec 30 17:59:03 i've set up git pulls of tons from maemo.gitorious Dec 30 17:59:15 undefined symbol: gst_video_filter_get_type Dec 30 17:59:28 mxr will have all of maemo.gitorious eventually Dec 30 17:59:41 i just haven't figured out the how Dec 30 18:00:11 the box is a shared resource and doesn't approve of long indexing tasks Dec 30 18:00:13 lardman: You didn't stick around in #gstreamer long enough for an answer. Dec 30 18:00:14 11:08:16 < zaheer_> yes Dec 30 18:00:14 11:08:35 < zaheer_> you compiled it against a version of gstreamer that you are not using it with Dec 30 18:00:17 11:09:16 < zaheer_> video filter base class is probably newer than what is in maemo which is where i assume you're using it Dec 30 18:00:31 so typically indexing needs to be done on another (staging) box Dec 30 18:00:41 and then the result is rsync'd in Dec 30 18:01:00 but my traditional index host is low on disk space Dec 30 18:03:01 derf: had to go out I'm afraid Dec 30 18:03:14 thanks for repeating it for me though Dec 30 18:04:04 is zaheer_ zaheerm? Dec 30 18:04:30 * lardman looks for the #gstreamer logs Dec 30 18:04:58 Yes (he's in here, too). Dec 30 18:05:13 yep, thanks Dec 30 18:06:27 hey derf Dec 30 18:08:09 Hey, out of curiosity, where do you guys place your Exception classes when fitting things into a MVC architecture? Dec 30 18:09:33 i do it in model, might not be "right" thou :D Dec 30 18:09:45 yeah... that's wher ei'm at right now Dec 30 18:10:02 maybe i'll make it its own package Dec 30 18:10:27 since some are validation oriented which are more model.... some are load/save/controller oriented Dec 30 18:10:30 el_zilcho: mvc using what? asp.net Dec 30 18:10:49 nah, this is actually java... i'm at work Dec 30 18:10:58 oh Dec 30 18:11:03 but none of my other windows open have any programmers in them Dec 30 18:11:39 my coworkers would be completely clueless Dec 30 18:11:40 :) Dec 30 18:11:54 don't tell derf, but i put them in the model Dec 30 18:12:13 coworkers tend to be that way Dec 30 18:12:15 hehe k Dec 30 18:12:22 ty Dec 30 18:12:25 both of you Dec 30 18:12:28 hmm, that is interesting though, dpkg -l gstreamer-tools gives this on the SDK: 0.10.23-git305-0maemo5+0m5, but only this on-device: 0.10.23-git305 Dec 30 18:12:29 "Where Google could really innovate is how the phone is sold. The Nexus One is likely to be sold unlocked"... *sigh* Dec 30 18:13:06 Today when shopping a pointed at some finger-less mittens and said "I wonder how long these will still be sold, now that Apple has innovated them" Dec 30 18:13:49 o hai happy new years etc bye Dec 30 18:14:09 lardman on sdk its work? Dec 30 18:14:30 not tried it there Dec 30 18:14:44 however gst-dmtx builds and runs Dec 30 18:14:47 hi aSIMULAtor Dec 30 18:14:52 ah bye Dec 30 18:14:53 sorry Dec 30 18:15:01 later, have fun on your journey Dec 30 18:15:08 and I copied the build files (changing names) to create the gst-zbar package Dec 30 18:15:19 javispedro: didn't you hear? droid is the first smartphone OS based on linux :P Dec 30 18:15:22 gst-zbar builds, but at runtime has that error Dec 30 18:15:44 lardman did you check the compile log Dec 30 18:16:06 maybee it complains about the missing function and link it Dec 30 18:16:10 anyway Dec 30 18:18:34 I didn't spot anything when I last looked, but here';s the output: http://maemo.pastebin.com/m608c235b Dec 30 18:23:10 angasule: your last statement is very false Dec 30 18:23:41 OpenMoko is the first smartphone OS based on Linux. Dec 30 18:24:25 phone may be a bit of a stretch Dec 30 18:24:26 OpenMoko is not a phone Dec 30 18:24:34 *sigh* Dec 30 18:24:35 It was. Dec 30 18:24:40 apple is a laptop Dec 30 18:24:45 it was a mostly usable phone in march 2007 Dec 30 18:24:53 It then sort of dropped the ball. Dec 30 18:25:21 Also - a1200 et al was first Dec 30 18:25:49 greenphone Dec 30 18:25:50 The first sub-project is Openmoko Linux, a Linux-based operating system designed for mobile phones, built using free software. Dec 30 18:25:53 The second sub-project is the development of hardware devices on which Openmoko Linux runs. Dec 30 18:26:33 Heh. The usable one was based on GTK+, while the 2008 one on Qt and E17 (at least that's what wikipedia says) Dec 30 18:26:39 yes Dec 30 18:26:59 * javispedro wonders if fremantle will also be "the usable one" and harmatan "the qt one" Dec 30 18:27:36 I thought the trolltech provided qtopia software for openmlko was the most functional/usable? Dec 30 18:29:54 uhsf: my statement was intentionally wrong, as is obvious if you read what I was replying to :) Dec 30 18:30:10 k Dec 30 18:36:16 heya javispedro Dec 30 18:36:37 javispedro: Well, Maemo is not OpenMoko Dec 30 18:36:39 morning/afternoon RST Dec 30 18:36:50 javispedro: I do not believe it had anything to do with Qt Dec 30 18:37:03 omg. it retains phone contacts after reflash. that made my day !!!!oneeleven Dec 30 18:41:55 openmoko was not the first linux based smartphone Dec 30 18:42:35 apple is a laptop Dec 30 18:42:57 apple is the record company owned by the beatles Dec 30 18:43:37 apple is a delicious fruit Dec 30 18:44:01 heh funny story, I know the guy who first showed mccartney midi on a macintosh Dec 30 18:44:10 apple the fruit is owned by Monsanto Dec 30 18:46:03 i have a n810 but i need use a bluetooth modem in it Dec 30 18:46:19 wvdial in maemo work ? Dec 30 18:47:08 kaudio, I would try add it as a phone in the control panel, and then add a new connection? Dec 30 18:54:22 funny how smartphones are basically linux vs bsd Dec 30 18:54:37 uh, no Dec 30 18:54:43 not really Dec 30 18:55:06 Smartphones are mainly Linux-derived vs Windows CE vs (niche) iPhoneOS Dec 30 18:55:57 at this point, im gonna have to reboot this shit Dec 30 18:56:14 or is iPhone OS actually a BSD unlike OS X? Dec 30 18:56:42 hmm, anyone else notice sending a ":D" in a sms arrives as ":d"? Dec 30 18:56:46 bsd smartphone? Dec 30 18:56:59 MSDOS smartphone! Dec 30 18:57:08 nah, Wikipedia says it's Darwin-based Dec 30 18:57:17 frals: oh boy, that's a disaster waiting to happen Dec 30 18:57:54 iphone is bsd as much as android is linux Dec 30 18:58:08 iphone is as bsd as much as windows nt is bsd Dec 30 18:58:09 yepp! dealbreaker etc.. still annoying thou :P Dec 30 18:58:18 mavhc: nobody said Android was Linux Dec 30 18:58:28 but it is Dec 30 18:58:33 and I'm pretty sure Darwin has no relation to BSD Dec 30 18:58:50 mavhc: not really. Android is an OS that *doesn't* work with Linux Dec 30 18:58:57 it requires its own custom fork(s) Dec 30 19:01:37 has anybody attempted to use something like the vuzix wrap920 with an n900? Dec 30 19:01:47 (and if this is completely the wrong place to be asking, please tell me) Dec 30 19:02:14 annnnd, again Dec 30 19:02:38 hi mst Dec 30 19:03:30 t.m.o totally down? Dec 30 19:03:38 WORKSFORME Dec 30 19:04:45 I guess the question is whether Step is BSD ;-) Dec 30 19:04:57 nextstep I guess Dec 30 19:05:46 luke-jr: you are perhaps forgetting symbian is also smartphone Dec 30 19:06:03 ShadowJK you was right Dec 30 19:06:20 ShadowJK maemo its super Dec 30 19:06:51 What is symbian based on? Dec 30 19:07:00 epoc Dec 30 19:07:12 lpotter: meh, smartphone is useless IMO :D Dec 30 19:07:44 my point was more that 1) Windows is still there; 2) BSD is not there Dec 30 19:07:51 in other words, BSD is dead! Dec 30 19:07:52 <.< Dec 30 19:08:30 if a smartphone is so smart, why does it need additional apps to be installed? :) Dec 30 19:08:53 because your mom Dec 30 19:09:29 joppu, so apparently there's "Symbian", which is a combination of "Symbian OS", S60, UIQ and MOAP(S). S60 runs ontop of "Symbian OS", as does UIQ and MOAP(S), I think. "Symbian OS" is a descendant of Psion's EPOC. Dec 30 19:09:40 hm, my first impression of maemo is "cool, but buggy" :( Dec 30 19:09:55 papo, what bugs have you encountered? Dec 30 19:10:41 mp3 player by console in maemo ? Dec 30 19:10:50 UIQ is dead and MOAP is very very niche Dec 30 19:10:59 So, it is S60, i.e. Avkon Dec 30 19:11:30 kaudio, why console? Dec 30 19:12:16 ShadowJK: colour picker is gray all over the place, skype contacts which are online on my notebook have the status offline, troubles with the GPS, the email application is not working at all, volume control is not respected when playing flash videos in the browser, system sounds are routed to the bluetooth headset if connected, stuff like that Dec 30 19:13:32 ShadowJK i have my .mp3 in a server remote and its more faster y console Dec 30 19:13:43 I guess mplayer works.. Dec 30 19:13:50 ShadowJK: and the clock is not accurate when set to "automatic updated", it's usually off by 2 minutes but showed 31st of January today, even though I don't have any doubts that the operator is announcing date and time properly Dec 30 19:14:36 The + and - keys changing their use depending on context is a feature, I think, as is routing all sounds through bluetooth when bluetooth is connected.. Dec 30 19:15:14 it would be daft to send some sounds through and not others Dec 30 19:15:37 when/if I find a bluetooth receiver I like, I know I'd want it that way too Dec 30 19:15:40 papo, why is the color picker grey? Dec 30 19:15:42 gray even Dec 30 19:16:12 the one in sketch gave me colours atleast :) Dec 30 19:16:13 ShadowJK: yes. I noticed the flash thing because I wanted to watch a flash video in an environment where one is not supposed to be loud. So I set the device to silent but sound came out anyway Dec 30 19:16:32 thats different Dec 30 19:17:07 lalalaa Dec 30 19:17:31 lcuk: I have no idea why this is. I can see some predefined colours on the right, but on the left, where I guess should be some color cloud thing and a hue slider, everything is white. and the squares for the colors are just gray, but I don't know why. Any colour that was selected works though, it's just that I'm somewhat blind because I don't see them in the picker Dec 30 19:17:35 * lcuk understands that one Dec 30 19:18:01 It's kinda funny actually, older apps that don't know about Silent/General profiles end up being quiet when "Silent" profile is activated, and people complained about it as bugs :) I think for them the expectation was that the profile setting specifically controls actions taken on incoming calls and messages Dec 30 19:18:23 normal, nocalls, silent Dec 30 19:18:51 * lcuk would have those profiles Dec 30 19:19:08 running out anyway bl Dec 30 19:19:10 Well I just use volume slider.. Dec 30 19:19:29 ShadowJK: Oh and when I select the ringtone in the settings, it sounds fine, but when the phone is ringing, the ringtone sounds somewhat clipped Dec 30 19:19:31 and alsamixer -c 0 in a terminal, because the lowest volume is still too loud on headphones Dec 30 19:19:56 I've heard about that one before, I wonder if it has been reported to the bugtracker yet Dec 30 19:21:26 ShadowJK i would like something like mp3baster Dec 30 19:22:03 hmm Dec 30 19:22:05 nice Dec 30 19:23:59 the n900 is way more stable than my desktop atm Dec 30 19:24:15 been connected in xchat all night on my phone Dec 30 19:24:23 speaking of which... Dec 30 19:24:30 w32 Dec 30 19:24:33 disconnected on the pc 8 times this am already Dec 30 19:28:16 moo Dec 30 19:36:56 re Dec 30 19:39:09 Kamn900, same internet connection? Dec 30 19:40:23 yep Dec 30 19:40:29 its the wired interface on the router Dec 30 19:40:32 hi, how can I install cmake into a scratchbox Dec 30 19:40:36 all my desktops lose connection at the same time Dec 30 19:40:38 odd Dec 30 19:40:44 but the wireless shit stays stable Dec 30 19:41:03 Im gonna replace it this weekend Dec 30 19:43:08 all of the desktops windows? Dec 30 19:45:42 no Dec 30 19:45:45 only 1 is Dec 30 19:45:52 the other 2 are debian boxes Dec 30 19:47:57 how does that google voice plugin work on the N900 Dec 30 19:48:09 I installed it, but it doesn't show up in IM/VOIP Dec 30 19:48:17 unless its got a wierd name Dec 30 19:50:49 any IM which uses the video? Dec 30 19:54:29 Instant message with video? That's a new one... wow Dec 30 19:56:14 replacement for pink MMS'es obviously Dec 30 19:57:35 It would be nice to be able to gtalk with vid n900<->n800 Dec 30 19:59:21 what other clients can the n800/10 built in IM thing video chat to? Dec 30 19:59:25 video chat is the biggest fail ever for linux Dec 30 19:59:39 uhsf why? Dec 30 19:59:44 Peter Jackson Now Accepting Applications For Extras in The Hobbit Dec 30 19:59:46 mavhc: i've managed to get it to work with 2 random java imp on windows but that's it Dec 30 19:59:53 GO FOR IT! Dec 30 20:00:03 can someone reboot the n770 running maemo.org? Dec 30 20:00:11 corsac lol Dec 30 20:00:55 toggles_w: its called tlephathy-TheOneRing Dec 30 20:01:29 K`: i couldn't get that to log in Dec 30 20:02:48 there was an update last night Dec 30 20:02:53 but now its missing altogether Dec 30 20:03:09 ahh, didn't see that yet Dec 30 20:04:08 1.0 alpha 6 Dec 30 20:04:11 maybe all the nokia / osso packages could get fasttracked without going through the extras builder queue Dec 30 20:04:25 0.1.0-6 Dec 30 20:05:15 RST38h: what was the autobuilder stuff? Dec 30 20:05:39 guess, Im stuck with dialcentral for now Dec 30 20:05:41 yech Dec 30 20:05:42 kaudio, i don't think we could list the number of ways to play mp3s in console. i use mplayer atm Dec 30 20:07:18 Ahh telepathy hurts my brain Dec 30 20:07:52 anybody familiar with it? Dec 30 20:09:23 Hm, nokia is an interesting company. First I wait months for the device and then they shut down maemo.org the day I receive it... Dec 30 20:09:26 AakashPatel, no. but if you have a concrete question, just ask. Dec 30 20:09:38 papo, that's not true Dec 30 20:09:49 andre__: which part? Dec 30 20:09:57 papo, "shut down maemo.org" :) Dec 30 20:10:03 it wasnt really a concrete question, just wonder how to get started creating a accounts IM plugin Dec 30 20:10:18 andre__: Hm ok but something is wrong with it Dec 30 20:10:24 AakashPatel, http://telepathy.freedesktop.org/wiki/ ? :-P Dec 30 20:10:41 papo, which is...? it's slow, yeah. but new servers are currently getting installed and migrated to Dec 30 20:10:42 thanks :P Dec 30 20:11:12 andre__: hm currently I'm failing to load the page at all Dec 30 20:11:34 * andre__ tries himself Dec 30 20:12:25 papo: true, confirming. but as bugs.maemo.org or wiki.maemo.org work I assume that this specific server might get migrated right now. Dec 30 20:12:30 * andre__ should know this but does not. yay Dec 30 20:13:02 andre__: Ok, never mind, I'll read some bug reports in the meantime then Dec 30 20:14:01 ah t.m.o is working even Dec 30 20:15:54 yeah, it's good some things are seperate Dec 30 20:16:02 papo: talk.maemo.org is run entirely separately (AIUI) Dec 30 20:16:15 hm yes, didn't know that Dec 30 20:16:16 Nokia just pay Reggie's bills. Dec 30 20:18:51 what version of mission control does maemo 5 have? Dec 30 20:19:03 5? Dec 30 20:19:42 What IS mission control? Dec 30 20:19:49 telepathy stuffs Dec 30 20:21:03 AakashPatel, libmissioncontrol-server6 5.2.6 and osso-mission-control 5.16 here according to "dpkg -l" Dec 30 20:21:18 ah nice Dec 30 20:22:25 anyone set up a universal remote on the N900 Dec 30 20:22:49 I was looking at irreco, but it seems to have a very limited # of premade remotes, and I don't see a way to create a custom remote yet Dec 30 20:23:19 K`: quit while you're behind Dec 30 20:23:28 K`: ditto, I tried irreco and am not sure how to go about it Dec 30 20:24:02 Gadgetoid_iMac I appreciate the encouragement Dec 30 20:24:07 I think im onto something Dec 30 20:24:42 K`: yeah, the wonderful ability to control your devices almost 50cm away! Dec 30 20:25:08 Gadgetoid_iMac the transmitter on the N900 is that weak? Dec 30 20:25:11 SIR not FIR? Dec 30 20:26:06 I've not been able to get it to do anything much with the Apple remote profiles with the damned thing pressed up against my receiver, so it's probably a combination of crap software and crap hardware Dec 30 20:27:06 K`: I've seen a video on youtube explaining how to set up an irreco profile on N900 Dec 30 20:27:09 I've never had a single IR sporting device that worked well as a universal remote :( Dec 30 20:27:11 I always use bluetooth remotes Dec 30 20:30:34 something wrong with maemo.org or its just me? Dec 30 20:30:42 It's been slow for a while now. Dec 30 20:30:58 server migration Dec 30 20:31:37 reminds me that my server is due next week :-P Dec 30 20:31:42 ok then, do you know when itll be ok? Dec 30 20:31:55 when it's done ;-) Dec 30 20:33:15 * Stskeeps is finally migrating all his equipment into his office as the guys who also live in this apartment is moving out. Dec 30 20:34:01 Stskeeps, flatshare fun? :) Dec 30 20:34:42 lucent Dec 30 20:34:48 Im looking at another guide for the N900 Dec 30 20:35:00 but it appears to stem on someone having already created the remote for your tv Dec 30 20:35:05 slash device Dec 30 20:36:33 andre__: well, they lived here while my wife was abroad so Dec 30 20:37:02 but moving from 60m^2 apartment to a 20m^2 was too much to deal with :) Dec 30 20:39:13 so now we're expanding our living space :P Dec 30 20:40:27 Stskeeps, conquer everything! :-P Dec 30 20:41:24 * Stskeeps is getting rather irritated at software rendering on i386 working fine and looking crap on armel.. Dec 30 20:49:58 Stskeeps: mesa? 24bit on x86 and 16bit on armel? Dec 30 20:50:12 suihkulokki: 16bpp on both Dec 30 20:52:43 (yeah, i've tried mesa-24bpp and hildon desktop, is not pretty) Dec 30 20:53:12 this is weird though, i'm getting background not working and dialogs without content.. Dec 30 20:53:34 you sure you aren't forcing bigendian somewhere in the code for armeb? Dec 30 20:53:44 armel* Dec 30 20:53:54 arachnist: true, there was a colours fix recently Dec 30 20:54:02 i wonder if this is cause.. Dec 30 20:55:07 back again Dec 30 20:58:27 it does feel silly to use software rendering on a n900 but .. Dec 30 21:02:59 RST38h: it does look a little like a rouge nokia employee yes Dec 30 21:03:30 well, or a chinese timeless Dec 30 21:05:24 well. that ducked Dec 30 21:05:28 sucked Dec 30 21:06:03 no n900 tv remote for me Dec 30 21:07:04 Stskeeps: Eh? Dec 30 21:07:17 * RST38h lost this thread. What was it about? Dec 30 21:09:38 RST38h: the autobuilder flood of packages Dec 30 21:10:04 ah Dec 30 21:17:46 i have n900!i have connect to internet share!i have internet on the eth0 (ethernet card) an i want share it by eth1(wireless card)!i tested ad-hoc!but,it is only for wirless internet connection! Dec 30 21:17:56 do you want help me? Dec 30 21:19:33 only if you use less exclamation marks! Dec 30 21:19:49 does anyone know how the activesync log in bug 5597 was obtained? I don't see much in /var/log/ Dec 30 21:19:51 Bug https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=5597 First Synchronization between N900 and Exchange 2003 Server always fails Dec 30 21:19:52 and i didnt really get what you're trying to talk about. Dec 30 21:20:18 do you want help me? Dec 30 21:21:33 mkargar: I'm not sure if I understand what you want Dec 30 21:24:51 papo:ok!i want connect to internet on the n900!but,internet mobile on the my country is broken!altough Dec 30 21:25:53 papo:ok!i want connect to internet on the n900!but,internet mobile on the my country is broken!i want connec t to internet by shared internet connections!how to i want? Dec 30 21:27:06 i have dsl connection on the my laptop(by eth0) and i want share it by eth1(wireless card)!how to? Dec 30 21:27:20 ah I see Dec 30 21:27:31 mkargar: you want to set up some NAT setup Dec 30 21:27:59 to share the internet connection of the laptop with the nodes connected by wlan Dec 30 21:28:25 and i think even win xp could do that Dec 30 21:28:38 papo:i using arch linux! Dec 30 21:29:12 mkargar: yes it's not that hard with linux, all you have to do is make sure that you can ping the laptop from your n900 and then it's a matter of 2 commands Dec 30 21:30:29 papo:how to ping n900 from laptop?i must use ad-hoc? Dec 30 21:31:06 mkargar: if you don't have any access points or similar hardware, yes, you have to use ad-hoc mode Dec 30 21:31:45 mkargar: why youre not on #archlinux then? Dec 30 21:32:11 and they have damn good wiki too Dec 30 21:32:40 mkargar: some wlan adapters even allow you do act as ap but that's not guaranteed... and I agree with ifreq, all I can give you is the general commands, but distributions usually implement custom hooks for such thinks and I don't know how to to a permanent setup properly for arch Dec 30 21:33:25 re javis Dec 30 21:33:32 moo Dec 30 21:33:50 ifreq:i tried wiki!but,not found best guide about ad-hoc! Dec 30 21:33:55 javispedro: the colour fix causes weird issues on armel Dec 30 21:34:00 javispedro: like mesa-on-armel Dec 30 21:34:11 like? Dec 30 21:34:23 well, the surfaces are totally white Dec 30 21:34:24 mkargar: iwconfig essid mode ad-hoc does not work? Dec 30 21:34:44 i reverted the one that went into gitorious and the issue went away Dec 30 21:35:29 papo:i shoult inter above command on the maemo? Dec 30 21:35:32 Stskeeps: do you have that commit handy? :P Dec 30 21:35:36 yes, hang on Dec 30 21:35:37 *should Dec 30 21:36:35 javispedro: it works fine on 16bpp mesa on i386 which wonders me Dec 30 21:36:38 http://maemo.gitorious.org/fremantle-hildon-desktop/clutter_0_8/commit/2c8f0217b48da492664e372a680612f618258c8b Dec 30 21:36:45 mkargar: I'd run it on the laptop. Then you have to set an IP on that wlan interface and connect the N900 to the laptop Dec 30 21:37:08 clutter 0.8 again Dec 30 21:37:24 I'm not sure if the GUI supports static IPs, so you either have to set up a dhcp server on the laptop or just set an IP address using the terminal on the N900 Dec 30 21:37:39 yes, static ips are supported Dec 30 21:37:47 ok that makes it easier then Dec 30 21:37:51 and have gui access Dec 30 21:37:57 Stskeeps: can you pastebin the output of glxinfo on that target? Dec 30 21:38:07 papo:i tested!it's ok!i useed this guide:https://help.ubuntu.com/community/WifiDocs/Adhoc Dec 30 21:38:27 javispedro: it's a n900 with mesa from ubuntu, but yes Dec 30 21:38:33 * lcuk knows gordon :) Dec 30 21:38:34 has anybody gotten mafw-lastfm to work? Dec 30 21:38:40 papo:but,it guide is only for wireless internet connection! Dec 30 21:38:51 Stskeeps: dunno why armel could cause that to fail, so I can only think of a difference between armel/x86 mesa builds... Dec 30 21:38:57 mkargar: yes but that one has to be up first Dec 30 21:39:29 mkargar: so can you ping the laptop from the N900? it's not worth going on if that's not working Dec 30 21:40:59 papo:i tested!but,no page open on the browser! Dec 30 21:41:36 papo:i tested!but,does not open on the browser! Dec 30 21:41:58 yes that's not supposed to work yet. but pings must work. like ping 192.168.0.1 or whatever IP you gave Dec 30 21:42:12 wow, did they make a ping for web 2.0 that works in browser? Dec 30 21:42:50 papo:i testing....please waiting... Dec 30 21:42:53 lcuk: ICMP 2.0 Dec 30 21:43:42 javispedro: at least not to add to the insanity, the colours problem does appear on armel too :P Dec 30 21:44:19 to be expected... Dec 30 21:45:18 what's weird is that you see white textures Dec 30 21:45:37 I would have expected the color swap to happen always Dec 30 21:45:41 or something like that Dec 30 21:47:16 the only explanation I can think for that is that the armel mesa doesn't support packed_pixels and apps are sending 4_4_4_4 textures. Dec 30 21:47:32 big endian vs little endian maybe? Dec 30 21:47:35 but chances for both things are dim Dec 30 21:48:06 that would cause colors to be swapped always Dec 30 21:48:07 want me to see if it works OK with your patch? Dec 30 21:48:09 like, the original Dec 30 21:48:27 yes please, that should tell us if it's a 4_4_4_4 issue Dec 30 21:50:46 but the glxinfo output would tell me that too :) Dec 30 21:52:42 http://marcin.juszkiewicz.com.pl/download/maemo/Screenshot-20091230-224928.png Dec 30 21:53:12 hrw: does that work without patching hildon-desktop? Dec 30 21:53:22 javispedro: yes Dec 30 21:53:32 nice! Dec 30 21:53:48 there's even support for multiple categories iirc Dec 30 21:53:51 no idea yet why 'More...' is not last one Dec 30 21:54:27 are you touchinng the datestamps? Dec 30 21:54:31 is it necessary to do anything more than move the .desktop files around? Dec 30 21:54:50 pupnik: no Dec 30 21:54:57 touching some xdg menu files probably? Dec 30 21:54:58 ali1234: I do not move file Dec 30 21:54:59 s Dec 30 21:55:10 vi /etc/xdg/menus/hildon.menu Dec 30 21:55:26 nice Dec 30 21:55:51 I was scrolling through h-d source code the other day and found a place where I though they were hardcoding the applications Dec 30 21:55:59 but seems that's not used or something Dec 30 21:56:08 lol @ ^M s Dec 30 21:56:24 heh pupnik i just saw that too... Dec 30 21:56:46 and loooot of .DS_Store files in filesystem Dec 30 21:56:50 ~curse macosx Dec 30 21:56:51 May the fleas of a thousand camels infest your most sensitive regions, macosx ! Dec 30 21:58:29 javispedro: building.. Dec 30 21:58:53 wow it takes effect immediately hildon.menu Dec 30 21:59:05 now i can put all those games in a folder... Dec 30 22:00:11 pupnik: share results Dec 30 22:01:08 javispedro: does the new patch take into considering little vs big endian? you seem to cut kinda short and say it's unsigned short Dec 30 22:01:26 Stskeeps: it does not. but that does not cause white boxes. Dec 30 22:01:48 true Dec 30 22:02:33 papo:whats root password in maemo? Dec 30 22:02:46 Uh oh, Operator tried to send me "WAP" settings. Dec 30 22:02:57 I'm surprised N900 even handles settings messages from operator.. Dec 30 22:03:04 papo:i want ping the adreess!but,it need to pass! Dec 30 22:03:44 dunno if it's been mentioned yet: you actually *can* operate FM-radio and FM-TX concurrently. You can even tune to station "NOKIA" and have a nice feedback X-P Dec 30 22:03:51 what is root pass in maemo? Dec 30 22:04:00 ShadowJK: would be nice if it told you restrictions stuff Dec 30 22:04:09 luke-jr, eh? Dec 30 22:04:11 there's no rootpw Dec 30 22:04:14 "Your Operator asks that you not tether." Dec 30 22:04:25 [OK] Dec 30 22:04:28 luke-jr, it's not in the gsm spec Dec 30 22:04:35 ShadowJK: :) Dec 30 22:04:47 well, *that* DRM is tolerable IMO Dec 30 22:04:50 mkargar: http://wiki.maemo.org/Root_access Dec 30 22:05:09 "Your Operator has forbidden tethering per your terms of service. Just FYI..." :p Dec 30 22:05:15 papo:very thx! Dec 30 22:05:39 you are welcome Dec 30 22:05:50 iirc from s60 the possible fields are: APN, idle time, IPv4 address manual/automatic, IPv6 address manual/automatic, Proxy address, no proxy for , home page Dec 30 22:05:54 probably forgot some Dec 30 22:05:56 mkargar: it may be easier to ping the n900 from the laptop Dec 30 22:06:07 my n900 is belimic Dec 30 22:06:13 oh, username, password was in there too somewhere... Dec 30 22:06:18 though mine doesn't use it Dec 30 22:06:24 just has an APN.. Dec 30 22:06:44 btw - someone knows what Shift-Ctrl-R is supposed to do in maemo5/ Dec 30 22:06:44 mkargar: or in short: install rootsh. Enter cmd 'root' Dec 30 22:07:02 spoke too soon hrw :) Dec 30 22:07:54 205 /* Toggle the portrait-capable flag on and off on the topmost window */ Dec 30 22:09:00 bye anyway Dec 30 22:09:12 bye hrw Dec 30 22:09:21 DocScrutinizer51: I guess he can't do that easily because he has no network access... pinging the other way round should be as fine anyway Dec 30 22:09:23 hrw|gone, i think that's in the next firmware release Dec 30 22:09:32 wack! i always used sudo gainroot Dec 30 22:09:37 it works right now in GPodder Dec 30 22:10:12 shift ^r does? Dec 30 22:10:20 hrw|gone: where TF did you find that?? Dec 30 22:10:34 eh oops no Dec 30 22:10:39 darn Dec 30 22:10:49 DocScrutinizer51: use the source ;D Dec 30 22:11:23 papo:for use sudo gaineroot,i must connect to internet!!! Dec 30 22:11:47 mkargar: yes. This is why I suggested to ping the N900 from your laptop instead of pinging the laptop from the N900 Dec 30 22:11:53 they do call it "always online" device... Dec 30 22:12:46 what about connecting via bluetooth?? .. Dec 30 22:13:00 or use proper wlan router Dec 30 22:13:14 papo:how to ping n900 from laptop? Dec 30 22:13:31 mkargar: tell me why you run archlinux when basic skills are not known? Dec 30 22:13:31 mkargar: ping ? Dec 30 22:13:41 mkargar: it worries me. Dec 30 22:13:49 ifreq: me too to be honest... Dec 30 22:14:46 ifreq, why does it worry you? Dec 30 22:15:35 ifreq:i am a developer and no skills about networking! Dec 30 22:15:44 lcuk: because now ppl need todo amazing effort trying to help him instead of using some OS he can really use. Dec 30 22:16:00 mkargar: okay. well you do know man command? Dec 30 22:16:03 like man ping Dec 30 22:16:09 is there a way to "unsubscribe" imap folders in modest? Dec 30 22:16:13 high barrier of entry can only be eroded by n00bs coming in having trouble Dec 30 22:16:30 wackl: well atleast with proper email client ie. thunderbird you can do em quite nicely Dec 30 22:16:48 its more damning on the original system to retain the high barrier of entry just for cliques sake Dec 30 22:17:04 ifreq:yes! Dec 30 22:17:27 ifreq: hm, in thunderbird im only subscribed to some folders. on the n900 i see them all... Dec 30 22:17:38 papo:how to set ip adress for n900? Dec 30 22:17:44 mkargar: wouldnt it be easier that you just buy wifirouter to be honest? Dec 30 22:17:51 wackl, no way to manage subscribing in modest Dec 30 22:18:01 wackl: after the unsubscrice or? Dec 30 22:18:05 lcuk very well spoken Dec 30 22:19:00 ifreq: the folders were unsubscribed before i created the mail account on the N900 Dec 30 22:19:27 papo:how to set ip adress for n900? Dec 30 22:19:40 ShadowJK: so i always see all folders and have to scrollscrollscrollagain? Dec 30 22:19:50 wackl: okay, this is 2nd time i heard this prob :P so the email client for some reason overrides the unsub flag Dec 30 22:19:51 mkargar in internet-connections Dec 30 22:20:01 mkargar in settings Dec 30 22:20:35 wackl, I'm told it only shows folder subscribed on the server and that you can use something else like thunderbird to manage which folders are subscribed and which ones aren't Dec 30 22:21:07 ifreq: yeah, i checked the courierimapsubscribed files, they are only showing the subscribed folders Dec 30 22:21:30 ifreq: on the server side Dec 30 22:21:50 email client doesn't support offline imap Dec 30 22:22:16 ShadowJK: hm, ok i'll try some more with subscribe/unsubscribe. maybe creating the account again Dec 30 22:22:44 papo:ok!only ip?no need subnet or gateway? Dec 30 22:23:05 Shinkamui: i don't need offline imap. i only want to see 5 of the 20+ folders Dec 30 22:23:14 mkargar: set the gateway to the laptop's IP and select an appropriate netmask Dec 30 22:23:32 mkargar: hum which addresses did you select for the laptop and the n900? Dec 30 22:23:44 javispedro: similar effect Dec 30 22:24:08 mtwas a comment Dec 30 22:24:15 wackl Dec 30 22:24:19 hrm this mail for exchange thing is just not working :(. "Retrieving sync keys failed with status 4" Dec 30 22:25:31 trying gmail? Dec 30 22:25:46 javispedro: nothing arm-specific in mesa source Dec 30 22:25:57 papo:i set 169.254.32.2 fro wireless card! and 169.254.32.2 for n900!it's ok? Dec 30 22:26:05 red: No, I did enough digging through the docs that I know it's not supported Dec 30 22:26:08 red: this is exchange 2007 Dec 30 22:26:20 mkargar: uhm Dec 30 22:26:34 papo: there's a talk.maemo.org thread about it Dec 30 22:26:52 Stskeeps: yes a long one and I think that I went through it Dec 30 22:27:02 Stskeeps: I'm currently checking bugreports Dec 30 22:27:02 Stskeeps: so, not a 4444 issue :( . Dec 30 22:27:18 javispedro: well the old code takes care of BE vs LE Dec 30 22:27:45 but the new code just sends everything as the native order Dec 30 22:27:58 at worst, this may swap colors again Dec 30 22:28:00 isn't there a GL defined order or something for some things? Dec 30 22:28:10 _5_6_5 only has one: native Dec 30 22:28:15 k Dec 30 22:28:29 mkargar: can't you just use one of the usual reserved private blocks instead of the link-local block? Dec 30 22:28:30 so if we're getting textures in both byte orders we'd need to take care of that Dec 30 22:28:38 but that would be weird, since I never noticed that in x86 Dec 30 22:29:28 mkargar: what IP address and netmask does the interface connected to the internet on the laptop has? Depending on that, appropriate addresses may be 192.168.0.1 and .2 Dec 30 22:30:02 Stskeeps: if you want, you could try separating the two BGR/RGB switch branches and ... well.. play a bit :P Dec 30 22:30:37 javispedro: i really don't want to end up adding opengl hacking to my resume :P Dec 30 22:30:43 it's bad enough i have scratchbox on it ;) Dec 30 22:31:03 *g* Dec 30 22:31:15 more like clutter ;) Dec 30 22:31:48 papo: are you sure laptop has wlan0 configured? Dec 30 22:31:59 Hmm. The earplugs that came with N900 Dec 30 22:32:13 red, yes? Dec 30 22:32:19 tried them on my laptop now and sound is horribly distorted unless I pull the plug jack a bit out Dec 30 22:32:28 ifreq: no I'm not sure at all... but you should be... these 169-adresses are assigned automatically so I tend to no Dec 30 22:32:34 and that results in mono sound naturally Dec 30 22:32:50 papo: yeah but i try be now kind so im just in background :) Dec 30 22:33:07 papo: easier to buy a wifirouter for 20eur :P Dec 30 22:33:20 Stskeeps: I was thinking something like this http://pastebin.com/dfaac24b Dec 30 22:33:44 ifreq: probably... or read some docs about networking... but if this is going to be your final setup then a router may be worth the € 20 Dec 30 22:34:01 * javispedro realizes something is really weird with that code Dec 30 22:34:08 anyone else noticed anything odd with the earplugs? Dec 30 22:34:19 havent tested them with the phone though, will try fast now Dec 30 22:34:24 Stskeeps: aiui for resume the fb 'endianness' is compleztely irrelevant, as you don't have a platform transit anywhere? Dec 30 22:34:32 papo: indeed :) Dec 30 22:35:59 Seems like they work without a hitch with the phone. But tried them in my laptop jack and its almost if that it didnt go in deep enough Dec 30 22:36:01 any idea how to reset the sudo grantroot password for the n900 ? Dec 30 22:36:09 sudo gainroot -> passwd Dec 30 22:36:32 red: what's odd with hp? Dec 30 22:36:40 hp? Dec 30 22:37:06 red: nah Dec 30 22:38:02 pff, thought id use these as bythebed earplugs and use my expensive ones on the road Dec 30 22:38:20 cats have a nasty habit of chewing on thin wires so dont like to leave em by the bedtable while sleeping Dec 30 22:38:58 javispedro: trying to build with it Dec 30 22:39:10 hrm is the source code for this m4e thing available? Dec 30 22:39:19 red: the headaet jack is a standard conformant 3.5mm 4pin - compatible with all usual 3.5 3p stereojacks Dec 30 22:39:30 Stskeeps: btw, can I test that with my N810? Dec 30 22:39:53 I mean, what's the latest (at least chrootable) Mer image? Dec 30 22:40:02 javispedro: yes, but it is unusable due to the white backgrounds Dec 30 22:40:17 * VDVsx facepalms @ Wiiwaa game -> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Rwl8WZHy9z4&feature=player_embedded Dec 30 22:40:21 I don't mind if I can just chroot in and run h-d Dec 30 22:40:27 (and it works :P ) Dec 30 22:40:34 javispedro: not sure if it does :P Dec 30 22:40:50 hm. Dec 30 22:40:53 DocScrutinizer51: standard size, but not standard design Dec 30 22:41:03 its a 2-way jack I guess Dec 30 22:41:11 I might try to fix the real color issue (not this year though :P) and having that "test case" would help :) Dec 30 22:41:16 err what? Dec 30 22:41:18 javispedro: true Dec 30 22:41:19 has one more black ring and different composition of the contact Dec 30 22:41:35 javispedro: that issue happens on vmdk too though Dec 30 22:41:40 just compared to two normal 3,5mm plugs Dec 30 22:41:48 javispedro: like, with sw rendering only Dec 30 22:41:57 red: toldya it's a 4pin for headset (has mic) Dec 30 22:41:58 Stskeeps: I mean the armel one, I can reproduce the original colors bug with sbox Dec 30 22:42:03 ah Dec 30 22:42:10 DocScrutinizer51: yepp Dec 30 22:42:21 ah misseed you saying 4pinns Dec 30 22:42:22 red: the headaet jack is a standard conformant 3.5mm 4pin - compatible with all usual 3.5 3p stereojacks Dec 30 22:42:23 blind me Dec 30 22:42:51 anyhow, tested on my laptop and walkman noww Dec 30 22:42:59 both dont connect properly Dec 30 22:43:19 strange Dec 30 22:43:29 however, found an adapter Dec 30 22:43:29 The included headphones only work on Nokia 3.5mm devices. The Nokia devices with 3.5mm port works with most headphones. Dec 30 22:43:37 so can use em bedside Dec 30 22:43:40 maybe you haven't inserted completely Dec 30 22:43:40 :) Dec 30 22:44:09 DocScrutinizer51: its as deep as it goes Dec 30 22:44:23 if you look at the base of the plug Dec 30 22:44:28 ShadowJK: so how that?? Dec 30 22:44:32 javispedro: the white issue should exist in http://stskeeps.subnetmask.net/mer/0.17testing4/mer-armel-n8x0-image-v0.17testing4.tar.gz Dec 30 22:44:36 theres a extruded metal circle there Dec 30 22:44:39 Stskeeps: ta! Dec 30 22:44:47 so prolly nokia device has longer contacct base and it works Dec 30 22:44:59 but it wont work with standard jacks Dec 30 22:45:44 double checked now, its the same size Dec 30 22:45:45 the included ones are still in the plastic bag they came in, haven't tried them.. Dec 30 22:46:12 oh well, doesnt really matter for me, but quite stupid from nokia Dec 30 22:46:16 dunno whats the point Dec 30 22:46:22 the mic and button? Dec 30 22:46:25 dunno whats the point09 Dec 30 22:46:32 thankfully this old adapter works =) Dec 30 22:46:33 red: pas de quoi Dec 30 22:46:59 absolutely no dfference between nolia headset jack and other 3,5 headset or headphone (except missing mic ring) here Dec 30 22:47:30 red, wait, is this about using the nokia headphones with non-nokia devices, or about using non-nokia headphones with n900? Dec 30 22:47:32 How can I tell what percentage the battery is charged on an N900? Dec 30 22:47:44 nokia headphones with other device Dec 30 22:47:44 blizzow1, no way to tell during charge Dec 30 22:47:50 red: hal-device bme Dec 30 22:48:02 adapter from 3.5 to 3.5???? o.O Dec 30 22:48:08 Stskeeps what? Dec 30 22:48:10 ShadowJK: what about when it's unplugged? Dec 30 22:48:30 blizzow1, what sts said Dec 30 22:48:31 err, blizzow1: hal-device bme Dec 30 22:48:31 DocScrutinizer51: yes, very old.. dunno what its called in english, but for making a longer cord Dec 30 22:48:56 DocScrutinizer51: and its quite loose so I could push the nokia jack deeper enough for it to get correct contact Dec 30 22:49:03 red, nokia headphones in non-nokia devices will be pretty random, and will depend on where the jack has placed the ground pin receptors Dec 30 22:49:06 that's no adapter. And won't fix any issues Dec 30 22:49:32 exactly how shadowjk put it Dec 30 22:49:38 The nokia headphoens have split one of the rings into two so that you can talk too Dec 30 22:49:55 the receptors contact differently on the extension jack Dec 30 22:50:03 wow, hal-device bme is a little cryptic. Dec 30 22:50:11 and now that i plugged it into laptop/walkman the audio plays correctly without artifacts Dec 30 22:50:13 ShadowJK: same holds true for all non standard receptacles trying to hold standard pligs ;-J Dec 30 22:50:34 blizzow1, battery.reporting.current and percentage Dec 30 22:50:38 id imagine walkman and asus EEE PC 904 have standard jacks Dec 30 22:50:47 ShadowJK: thanks./ Dec 30 22:51:51 red, it's one way compatibility really, you can plug regular headphones into n900, but you can't plug apple handsfree headphones into n900 and you can't plug apple handsfree headphones or nokia headphones into standard 3.5mm devices (with 100% compatibility) Dec 30 22:52:41 ShadowJK: I understand that aye. Luckily using that extension fixes the issue for me and I can use these at bedside without worrying that my cats chew on my good earplugs :) Dec 30 22:53:10 Watch alot of telly after gf falls asleep so it's daily use Dec 30 22:54:03 What are your good earplugs? Dec 30 22:55:42 they are from shure Dec 30 22:55:53 lemme check the model name, cant recall by heart Dec 30 22:56:46 red: http://www.forum.nokia.com/Technology_Topics/Mobile_Technologies/Connectivity_&_Interfaces/Wired_Interfaces/Nokia_AV_2.5mm_and_3.5mm_Connector.xhtml Dec 30 22:57:14 Shure SE115 Dec 30 22:57:26 thats the exact model Dec 30 22:58:23 ah Dec 30 22:58:25 nice Dec 30 22:58:32 hi Dec 30 22:58:36 red: Nokia AV conector is compatible to all 3.5mm stereo jacks Dec 30 22:58:49 no really Dec 30 22:58:52 not* Dec 30 22:58:53 is it possible to play 720p HD video on N900? Dec 30 22:58:55 as long as *those* are standard Dec 30 22:58:59 lol Dec 30 22:59:13 http://wstaw.org/images/free/2009/12/30/a61df611f16a69b4b6b6a8ed246e3f.jpeg <| who wants to learn cisco? ;) Dec 30 22:59:16 yeah but they don't have to be standard in order to be compatible with standard plugs... heh Dec 30 22:59:47 DocScrutinizer: then it might be that the plugs that came with defect unit, or that compatible is a broad statement :) Dec 30 23:00:18 kinda like linksys thinks Dec 30 23:00:43 their vista drivers for a certain wificard were win 7 compatible Dec 30 23:00:53 * DocScrutinizer sighs and quits Dec 30 23:00:57 as long as you didnt use encrypted connections like ssl or ssh etc Dec 30 23:01:52 and there goes whiney fanboy Dec 30 23:02:35 * lcuk burps loudly Dec 30 23:02:52 noone tried to display HD videos? Dec 30 23:02:56 ShadowJK: guess he cannot comprehend that compatability isnt always 100% :p id trust my other devices are standard when everything else I throw at them work without a hitch, but then these nokia plugs dont work with anything except the phone itself :p Dec 30 23:03:31 or then its a case of them regarding their own design standard and others' not :) Dec 30 23:04:22 arachnist: done 1 year of CCNA and CCNP, no moar. ever. :p Dec 30 23:04:40 wish i had some of those bottles with me while learning tho Dec 30 23:04:52 hehe Dec 30 23:06:31 Koss Plug / Koss Sparkplug, Creative EP-630 and Sennheiser CX-300 are cheap alternatives for "cheap earplugs" Dec 30 23:07:07 chiku -> http://www.schleef.org/blog/2009/11/11/theora-on-ti-c64x-dsp-and-omap3/ Dec 30 23:07:08 The earplugs that came with my ~2 year old walkman were quite good aswell. Nearly on the level of these Shures Dec 30 23:07:29 sony has in-ear stuff? :) Dec 30 23:07:30 was a 115€ walkman and I checked that the earplugs it came with were separately sold for 80€ back then Dec 30 23:07:33 quite surprising Dec 30 23:08:03 yes, out of ear mid/high speaker and a cone with soft (replaceable and 3 sizes came with) cushions for the bass element Dec 30 23:08:19 lemme see if i can hunt down an image Dec 30 23:09:05 I can't use normal earphones, they just never stay close enough to sound good Dec 30 23:09:22 same Dec 30 23:09:31 was about blown away when i first used good plugs Dec 30 23:09:39 Once I used foam earplugs placed in the outer ear to push regular earphones towards eardrums, and that kinda worked Dec 30 23:09:41 "wtf, these actually sound nice and bassy" Dec 30 23:09:44 woglinde, so it looks like not possible for 720p HD Dec 30 23:10:01 had to relisten everything after getting in-ear :) Dec 30 23:10:15 720p is possible Dec 30 23:10:17 w Dec 30 23:10:22 but someone has to code it Dec 30 23:10:31 javispedro: still awake? Dec 30 23:10:39 yep Dec 30 23:10:39 woglinde: vlc cant handle 720p? Dec 30 23:10:58 lag problem? Dec 30 23:11:09 ifreq its not a vlc problem Dec 30 23:11:13 like 1 fps with 720p ? Dec 30 23:11:29 ShadowJK: http://www.techmagnews.com/wp-content/uploads/images/Sony_NW_A840_packs_OLED_noise_cancellation_and_64GB_of_flash_heat_still_thinnest_Walkman_ever_1.jpg Dec 30 23:11:31 Does anyone know how I should have my exchange server configured for MFE to work? I am using exchange 2007 and keep getting an error saying "Error: Either Exchange server requires secure connection or account is disabled." Dec 30 23:11:36 that sorta plugs, but white Dec 30 23:12:08 woglinde: okay Dec 30 23:12:08 http://www.pavtube.com/images/sony_mp3.jpg Dec 30 23:12:13 better picture there Dec 30 23:12:19 Does a specific URL need to be enabled for the MFE client to work? it works fine on my N97, but not on the N900. Dec 30 23:12:19 ah that design Dec 30 23:12:26 think my walkman was 1-2 generations older than the one at the image Dec 30 23:12:31 older.. newer Dec 30 23:12:46 but anyway, they were quite nice for bundled ones Dec 30 23:12:48 blizzow1: sure its 2007? and does it allow non auth devices Dec 30 23:13:09 javispedro: http://pastebin.com/m6eb6007d removes the white problem Dec 30 23:13:19 (i did a minor change) Dec 30 23:13:30 well, ok, it does it partly Dec 30 23:13:41 anyway, time for mythbusters, gn Dec 30 23:14:04 dialogs aren't obscured but the background isn't working (...) Dec 30 23:14:05 Stskeeps: and without that minor change, it doesn't work? Dec 30 23:14:10 ifreq: I'm positive it's 2007. Under Organization configuration -> Client Access -> Properties -> Device Tab every device is allowed. Dec 30 23:14:13 javispedro: correct Dec 30 23:14:24 Stskeeps: so, support_packed_pixel is FALSE? Dec 30 23:14:27 blizzow1: okay just knew there is prob with 2003 but not with 2007 tho Dec 30 23:14:28 O.o Dec 30 23:14:41 Jaffa: how is the maemo newsletter going? Dec 30 23:14:49 ~seen lma Dec 30 23:14:51 jeremiah_: i haven't seen 'lma' Dec 30 23:15:00 Well then you suck infobot Dec 30 23:15:24 * infobot hits jeremiah_ with an anvil and laughs with a contralto voice ... Haha Ha HA Ha, courtesy of crashanddie Dec 30 23:15:25 I'm wondering if a specific url has to be enabled for MFE to work on Maemo. Dec 30 23:15:35 night Dec 30 23:15:39 lardman: yo Dec 30 23:15:59 I doubt that I'll have any more time to chat today, so happy new year everyone) Dec 30 23:16:09 wazd_e63: happy new years wazd Dec 30 23:16:11 wazd_e63: have a good one buddy Dec 30 23:16:13 Happy New Year to you too! Dec 30 23:16:46 wazd is the first? Dec 30 23:16:55 Wish you all goods, kernels, firmwares and drivers) Dec 30 23:17:20 or was it johnx? Dec 30 23:17:48 javispedro: i'll investigate it later, but i'm a bit mystified atm Dec 30 23:18:03 cos now the dialogs and menus work Dec 30 23:18:08 but the background doesn't Dec 30 23:18:13 Could someone who has MFE working tell me if they are able to access outlook via https://yourmailserverhere.com/exchange ? Dec 30 23:18:17 Stskeeps: yeah. I think I want the output of glxinfo more and more :) Dec 30 23:18:43 javispedro: well, there's no GLX extension Dec 30 23:19:03 ehm.. Dec 30 23:19:07 you're using fb? Dec 30 23:19:07 it's libgl1-mesa-swx11 Dec 30 23:19:09 stskeep *g* Dec 30 23:19:19 hm Dec 30 23:19:28 even sw should mention glx stuff Dec 30 23:19:41 need do get some sleep before crazy night so c ya all in 2010 ) Dec 30 23:20:04 nite wazd Dec 30 23:20:18 wazd have a happy new year over there, try not to freeze Dec 30 23:20:33 see you in 2010 and have a new year, wazd :) Dec 30 23:21:23 luck: actually we got pretty mild weather here) Dec 30 23:21:45 -5, fluffy snow) Dec 30 23:21:59 blizzow1: I don't have it working but I'm not adding /exchange Dec 30 23:21:59 javispedro: ah, glxinfo should be possible.. let me apt-get that Dec 30 23:22:30 Stskeeps: I really don't know what's swx11 at the moment, but without glx you wouldn't be able to render to x windows at all. Dec 30 23:22:34 ok, wazd is out Dec 30 23:22:40 blizzow1: I believe it's supposed to work without /exchange, but I can't be sure since it's failing for other reasons on my device Dec 30 23:22:48 javis the mesa software renderer Dec 30 23:22:50 fallback Dec 30 23:22:55 for most cards Dec 30 23:22:58 woglinde: I mean the "swx11" version Dec 30 23:23:04 sw rendering for x11 Dec 30 23:23:05 :P Dec 30 23:23:49 /usr/lib/dri/swrast_dri.so or so Dec 30 23:23:58 nah, that's the dri version Dec 30 23:24:03 hm Dec 30 23:24:06 okay Dec 30 23:24:11 the description says "does not use GLX" Dec 30 23:24:18 which seems weird IMHO Dec 30 23:24:21 not really Dec 30 23:24:26 glx is just a wire protocol Dec 30 23:24:50 but also an API Dec 30 23:26:06 so it implements glx but doesn't call to the server for those functions? Dec 30 23:26:24 either way that means glx is there Dec 30 23:26:25 it implements GL Dec 30 23:26:36 (as far as i can tell) Dec 30 23:26:47 clutter depends on glx, so it implements glx too :) Dec 30 23:27:08 mm Dec 30 23:27:32 gl "alone" doesn't render to anything, not even buffers Dec 30 23:27:40 (from an API PoV) Dec 30 23:28:12 javispedro: http://pastebin.com/m3e717f23 Dec 30 23:28:39 hm mesa 7.4 Dec 30 23:28:44 Stskeeps: thanks again, no surprises seems. Dec 30 23:29:02 btw, why if (0)? Dec 30 23:29:41 Stskeeps: quick way to ensure it's taking the branch it would take "pre-fix" Dec 30 23:30:02 mm Dec 30 23:30:52 * Stskeeps ponders trying something Dec 30 23:33:54 does scratchbox/etc work ok with latest ubuntu? Dec 30 23:34:11 pavlov seems so Dec 30 23:34:14 ok cool Dec 30 23:34:24 * Pavlov needs to setup a new system Dec 30 23:38:53 okay, how do I get the certificate from my exchange server and import it into my N900. The certificate manager doesn't have a feature to add a cert. Dec 30 23:39:16 Debian FTW! Dec 30 23:41:43 does the integrated messenger conversations just not support pictures at all? Dec 30 23:41:58 blizzow1 it has Dec 30 23:42:40 hm Dec 30 23:42:45 in diablo it had Dec 30 23:42:48 woglinde: huh? I'm interested in how that works, I always had to download the cert to the device and opening it in the file manager to import the cert Dec 30 23:42:49 woglinde: doubt it's johnx Dec 30 23:42:55 woglinde: unless he's back in japan Dec 30 23:43:26 papo ah Dec 30 23:43:32 sorry Dec 30 23:43:43 its long since I added it Dec 30 23:44:06 woglinde: and it's probably someone in new zealand or australia who'll be the frist Dec 30 23:44:17 s/ri/ir/ Dec 30 23:44:18 crashanddie meant: woglinde: and it's probably someone in new zealand or australia who'll be the first Dec 30 23:44:38 crashanddie I meant for the channel here Dec 30 23:44:54 woglinde: I'll be living in Brisbane in a couple of weeks ;) Dec 30 23:45:05 woglinde: technically speaking, my sound system and playstation 3 are already ahead of me Dec 30 23:45:37 ah right Dec 30 23:45:45 lorn is in australia Dec 30 23:45:46 lets start a t.m.o. thread about The Y2.01k bug Dec 30 23:47:02 pupnik: it's still in beta -- nobody knows when it'll work Dec 30 23:47:46 don't you hate it when you bring a girl home for two days and she puts pictures of herself everywhere? Dec 30 23:48:17 girl sounds right Dec 30 23:51:11 javispedro: current status is that colors are messed up but showing for dialogs, and background is white Dec 30 23:51:24 (of the desktop) Dec 30 23:51:34 that's with your exact patch from pastebin Dec 30 23:51:43 on top of the current clutter Dec 30 23:52:53 my former patch had screwed up colours too Dec 30 23:55:20 this needs more testing Dec 30 23:55:28 I will do a sample trying to use _5_6_5 Dec 30 23:55:43 crashanddie, everywhere? Dec 30 23:55:44 a GL app, I mean. Dec 30 23:55:46 crashanddie, weird. Dec 30 23:56:08 GAN900: well, I found 6 framed pictures -- that qualifies as everywhere Dec 30 23:56:19 lol Dec 30 23:56:22 crashanddie *g* Dec 30 23:56:26 though that will be after my gettext crash course :) Dec 30 23:56:36 better than peeing on the carpet. Dec 30 23:56:37 javispedro hehe Dec 30 23:56:41 Weird Dec 30 23:56:42 gettext is evil Dec 30 23:56:50 for packagers Dec 30 23:57:03 why? Dec 30 23:57:31 hm okay isnt evil at all Dec 30 23:57:54 install to many stuff you dont need on the device Dec 30 23:58:02 even source code Dec 30 23:58:48 javispedro: alright - think i'm off to bed now. we should probably leave a note in the bug there's something odd about the impl when using it on mesa/armel Dec 30 23:58:57 for running stuff you mostly only needs libintl.so.x.x Dec 30 23:59:33 Stskeeps: hope this is not the only Mer RC bug left :P Dec 30 23:59:47 javispedro: naah. i'm sure i can find more Dec 31 00:00:03 javispedro: worst case scenario i just pull the fix and build that and note it as a known issue Dec 31 00:00:35 got it in a nice branch on gitorious so Dec 31 00:02:48 * javispedro ponders if .po files need to be optified Dec 31 00:03:12 .mo you mean Dec 31 00:03:16 yep, sorry Dec 31 00:03:27 they're small, but they're also among the least used Dec 31 00:03:55 either way I won't do that manually. Dec 31 00:23:16 hm has someone a font name which is on n900? Dec 31 00:26:05 nokia sans Dec 31 00:26:36 hm trying Dec 31 00:28:44 /usr/share/fonts/nokia has them Dec 31 00:29:01 is the droid fonts nice looking? Dec 31 00:29:19 ah nothing special Dec 31 00:29:59 hm, in my opinion, it's a bit uncool that the yellow boxes for new messages disappear... I missed two SMS today :( Dec 31 00:30:05 broke down and am using nokia messaging again Dec 31 00:30:18 cant stand the default imap implementation Dec 31 00:30:25 too slow to see new mail Dec 31 00:30:38 papo: you get the "new activity" icons in the upper left corner, don't you? Dec 31 00:30:48 Wolfie: yes Dec 31 00:31:09 Wolfie: and the blue LED starts flashing Dec 31 00:31:11 ok. Well, i must agree - missed activity should be more prominent. Dec 31 00:31:36 Wolfie: the "new activity" icon is like the ordinary Icon but a bit more shiny, isn't it? Dec 31 00:31:44 papo: yup Dec 31 00:31:56 Is there a config file somewhere that has the update interval for the email client? Dec 31 00:31:57 hm yes, actually I noticed it but it's easy to miss in my opinion Dec 31 00:32:03 except, it's not the 3x2 matrix of icons, but the two overlapping ones Dec 31 00:32:13 Wolfie: ah Dec 31 00:32:52 but, the 3x2 icon is shown if you have no apps open in the background, and the overlapping windows is _always_ showing when you have one or more application open Dec 31 00:33:04 so, then the only difference is the glow around those windows Dec 31 00:33:04 oh I see Dec 31 00:33:28 Wolfie: actually it would be nice if the yellow boxes would just stick around, but I guess I can't change that Dec 31 00:33:37 i would appreciate an icon with the reception/bt/wlan/whatever multibox thingy Dec 31 00:34:00 papo: you know you can set it to flash if you've got unread sms? the LED Dec 31 00:34:08 papo: i woudln't know. Dec 31 00:34:18 SpeedEvil: yes as I mentioned, the LED is flashing blue Dec 31 00:34:24 SpeedEvil: it's still a bit too discrete Dec 31 00:34:26 anyone have idea how to convert linux console font to truetype? Dec 31 00:34:30 but still I happen to miss it... maybe I just have to get familiar with it Dec 31 00:34:38 does tv out use a lot of power? Dec 31 00:34:48 papo: heh, sounds like a usability design fail, to me :) Dec 31 00:35:10 ah cool navit runs now Dec 31 00:35:15 Wolfie: Uh when it comes to usability I have a lot more troubles with other things Dec 31 00:35:20 with the gtk interface Dec 31 00:35:23 i do appreciate the "tablet" approach with the N900, but it seems to easily forget that it's a phone more than anything else for many Dec 31 00:35:28 papo: fair enough Dec 31 00:35:45 Shinkamui: probably nothing compared to decoding video Dec 31 00:35:49 only need to write the liblocation vehicle plugin Dec 31 00:36:07 so, missed mail and especially missed calls should be handled with more importance Dec 31 00:36:07 woglinde: :) Dec 31 00:36:27 I hope some things are going to improve with the next firmware releases... besides a ton of bugs, I dislike the two different contact lists Dec 31 00:36:33 a flashing blue led and a shiny icon isn't quite enough, i agree Dec 31 00:37:42 papo, two different lists? Dec 31 00:40:20 KMFDM: almost three even. There's the address book that appears if I run "Contacts". There I can edit my contacts. Then there's the list built into the "Phone" part of the device (which contains the same contacts, of course. I failed to edit contacts there but there is the alphabetic help at the right (which is quite handy). And if I click on a shortcut to a contact on the desktop, I can't edit either Dec 31 00:41:11 you cut off at "I can't edit either" Dec 31 00:41:38 KMFDM: I constantly keep mixing up these. I click on the shortcut to add a new phone number, I run contacts instead of the phone thing to call people etc. Dec 31 00:41:54 Wolfie: sorry, I forgot this character: "." Dec 31 00:42:22 ok, "I can't edit said contact." or something Dec 31 00:42:24 sorry Dec 31 00:42:27 you can call people from contacts Dec 31 00:43:18 KMFDM: yes but I have > 500 contacts. If I use the phone application, I can use the alphabetic index which is very helpful. If I use contacts, I either have to scroll a lot, use the keyboard or do something I don't know about Dec 31 00:43:36 rdp works nicely Dec 31 00:44:31 so for me, the phone-thingie is superior. And even if it wouldn't I don't see why there are two things which look very similar, do almost the same and could easily be merged (from a design point of view) Dec 31 00:45:31 papo, phone is only phone contacts Dec 31 00:45:44 you don't want your instant messaging contacts appearing in the list when you go to call someone Dec 31 00:46:46 nope skype stuff appears there as well Dec 31 00:47:32 i guess you can use your phone as a skype phone too? Dec 31 00:47:44 KMFDM: but good point Dec 31 00:47:53 Wolfie: yeah Dec 31 00:48:28 well, anyone callable appears Dec 31 00:48:35 which is right for the phone :P Dec 31 00:49:35 hm yeah.. just to clarify, I'm not complaining, just sharing what problems I encountered so far... but I went straight from a Nokia 7110 to this N 900 so I have to get familiar with some "new" concepts Dec 31 00:50:34 papo, voip is considered a phone application Dec 31 00:50:43 I see Dec 31 00:50:51 KMFDM: are you the father of industrial rock? Dec 31 00:51:48 arachnist, afraid not, but I jacked their name as an internet handle some years ago and have yet to come up with something better Dec 31 00:53:13 i do agree though papo that contacts should be editable from their information pages (for example from the conversation menu) as well as from their phone menu pages Dec 31 00:53:43 it is incredibly frustrating to have navigated through my equally large contact list to find the right contact only to realize i'm in the phone or conversations menu and not contacts Dec 31 00:53:44 yeah that would be helpful because I always use the wrong one Dec 31 01:00:39 i appreciate phone guru discussions thanks Dec 31 01:01:32 I'm trying to change the color of a gtk button under maemo. now, this works if I run the app under scratchbox from the cli without run-standalone.sh, but not when I run it with, nor on a n900. can anybody help me out with why this is (and preferably how I can accomplish this)? Dec 31 01:02:55 run it with..." "? Dec 31 01:03:47 run-standalone.sh Dec 31 01:04:01 oh i see Dec 31 01:04:13 the gtk libs should be the same on both right? Dec 31 01:04:24 uhm. no, I don't think so Dec 31 01:04:32 they look pretty different :) Dec 31 01:04:55 run-standalone.sh is needed to get the 'fremantle look' Dec 31 01:05:06 otherwise it looks like a plain gtk app Dec 31 01:05:41 running it with run-standalone.sh also produces the same result as when running it from the gui Dec 31 01:05:50 in scratchbox you test on x86 or armel target? Dec 31 01:05:55 x86 Dec 31 01:06:14 but the same happens on the phone Dec 31 01:06:22 lemme double check.. Dec 31 01:06:52 can you run the app from the armel target. that would give another piece of clue. Dec 31 01:07:27 damn fontstuff Dec 31 01:10:04 pupnik: how do I shut down dbus etc nicely? Dec 31 01:10:49 'af-sb-init.sh stop' did not seem to do the trick Dec 31 01:11:14 i can't help, just curious Dec 31 01:11:46 ok Dec 31 01:13:22 fyi i have same /usr/lib/libgtk-x11-2.0.so.0.1400.7 in scratchbox-armel and on device Dec 31 01:15:16 so developing in armel target avoids some errors Dec 31 01:17:17 how do I start the UI in scratchbox-armel? Dec 31 01:17:50 af-sb-init.sh doesn't seem to work Dec 31 01:18:08 been two years since i did that Dec 31 01:18:22 :) Dec 31 01:18:24 ok Dec 31 01:18:36 did you set your display variable? Dec 31 01:18:40 yes Dec 31 01:18:49 it should tallk to xephyr just like x86 target Dec 31 01:18:55 ok Dec 31 01:18:59 what error does it give you? Dec 31 01:19:03 Whoohooo, how nice. Dec 31 01:19:13 gah, what's the maemo word for the "main" icon set that you get when you hit the application button in the upper left twice? Like what's that desktop called? Dec 31 01:19:22 pupnik: ah, qemu not found :p Dec 31 01:19:23 My N900's screen went black after showing some weird flickering etc., most probably just a loose display connector Dec 31 01:19:35 Sure, a simple warranty service, but annoyingly at new year's ;/ Dec 31 01:21:13 how do I start the UI in scratchbox-armel? Dec 31 01:21:20 anyway if you get colorchange in armel-target but no colorchange on device, the difference would be the X server used, no? Dec 31 01:21:21 it's a known limitation, you can't Dec 31 01:21:42 MohammadAG: ah, thanks Dec 31 01:21:50 then I'll just stop barking up that tree :) Dec 31 01:21:53 (contacts) there'a not only an aplphabetic index missing. It also has no fulltext search (incl. option to restrict to certain fields. Incl regex - not even substring is implemented. Not even first/last name search implemented). Also I have contacts with 3 phone#, and I have 2 services (sip + gsm) now. Gives me a mess of selectable fields even now. Now make that 5 Mobile on a contact * (3 sip + gsm + skype) :-O Gives me THIRTYTH Dec 31 01:21:53 REE fields just for dialing and SMS Dec 31 01:22:08 np, I got errors that looped when I tried to do it Dec 31 01:22:35 * SpeedEvil wishes some FM radio program would support scanning for free frequencies. Dec 31 01:22:41 MohammadAG:it complains about qemu not being there (which was entirely correct :)) Dec 31 01:22:42 DocScrutinizer51: yeah, the addressbook ui is a mess Dec 31 01:22:50 i have a contact (my sister) with iirc 7 phone numbers Dec 31 01:22:51 found it: Armel target does not bring up the UI framework Dec 31 01:22:56 plus i have skype and 2 sip providers Dec 31 01:23:13 oddly, the two sip providers get lumped as 'sip' and lead to *another* dialog Dec 31 01:23:19 fdv here's a link with the known issues http://wiki.maemo.org/Documentation/Maemo5_Final_Installation#Known_Issues_in_the_SDK Dec 31 01:23:22 but that doesn't save me from skype+sip per item Dec 31 01:23:31 and not in the same place as the original item Dec 31 01:23:53 the call ui/addressbook people are aware of the problem, but haven't quite decided how/what/when to do something Dec 31 01:24:08 as for searching, i suspect that the addressbook has a public api Dec 31 01:24:12 which means someone could fix that Dec 31 01:24:36 pupnik: it seems to me that the fremantle UI somehow disallows changing the color, but I can't be sure. Dec 31 01:24:42 MohammadAG: thanks :) Dec 31 01:25:05 pupnik: but thanks for your interest, I'll have to call it a day now :) Dec 31 01:25:15 fdv: maybe it is because of the 'theming'? Dec 31 01:25:24 good luck tomorrow Dec 31 01:25:30 pupnik: I guess so, somehow, but I don't know how :) Dec 31 01:25:33 :) Dec 31 01:25:46 live to fight another day or something... Dec 31 01:25:54 precisely Dec 31 01:26:06 g'night Dec 31 01:26:10 fdv np :) Dec 31 01:26:26 nn fdv Dec 31 01:26:49 timeless_mbp: API doesn't provide a nice way to integrate search into existing contacts app gui, no? Dec 31 01:27:04 DocScrutinizer51: no, just write a standalone app Dec 31 01:27:14 the api should allow you to show a contact card Dec 31 01:27:19 or show a contact card editor Dec 31 01:27:30 perhaps even show address book scrolled to a given contact Dec 31 01:27:35 not sure how unlame the api is Dec 31 01:27:43 timeless_mbp: lol. yeah exactly. Its not possible to integrate with existing app Dec 31 01:27:47 personally, i want the search more than i need the integration Dec 31 01:27:54 do it, i'll send you money by paypal Dec 31 01:28:34 deal Dec 31 01:29:28 new page thx to hrw|gone: http://wiki.maemo.org/User:Jebba/Tweaks though i need a better description if anyone wants to chime in. Dec 31 01:31:11 what i dont like about the address book is i cant say like "555-1212 (cabin)" or something. Like some people have bunches of numbers for locations. The thing just presumes people slave or are at home. Dec 31 01:31:39 damn somethink is wron with fonts Dec 31 01:31:49 navit segfaults in freetype Dec 31 01:33:47 'slave' heh Dec 31 01:33:56 jebba: you need to create multiple contacts Dec 31 01:34:09 the fact is that the address book ui is not designed for people w/ multiple numbers Dec 31 01:34:30 just make a contact John (Cabin) Doe and another contact John (Slave) Doe Dec 31 01:38:30 heh ok ya. Dec 31 01:41:36 jebba: yup. Free user defined labels for fields really is missing Dec 31 01:43:02 Seems i did that in my Palm IV ,) Dec 31 01:43:18 or maybe i was thinking about something i used in the 80s ;) Dec 31 01:44:25 Is there a simple way to get a webpage rendered to a png using microb? Dec 31 01:44:44 jebba: (menu) wtf? Still struggling to get the semantics. Where is "Ms..." for example? Is there any way to sort things or does it filename based sort idiocy like Illume/Enlightenment (or whatever the name) does? Can we have user defined subfolders ala "mas..." ? Dec 31 01:45:03 SpeedEvil: you want the whole page, or just the current stuff? Dec 31 01:45:26 I want to make a trivial script with wget to pull down a yr.no weather format, parse it a bit with awk to generate a pretty image, and put it into a place where the desktop picture viewer can see it. Dec 31 01:45:45 s/format/forcast/ Dec 31 01:46:24 SpeedEvil: screenshot? Dec 31 01:46:26 i know roughly how to do it with gecko as an extension, but not sure with microb Dec 31 01:46:52 DocScrutinizer51: hmm. Not really ideal - I want to do it hourly. Dec 31 01:47:02 Oh well, I suppose I can do it on a server trivially. Dec 31 01:47:41 SpeedEvil: what's the main evil with ForeCa Dec 31 01:47:43 ? Dec 31 01:48:30 or with widgets in gneral for that one Dec 31 01:48:59 DocScrutinizer51: where it gets its data Dec 31 01:49:20 I find the yr.no forecast better Dec 31 01:49:28 nah. Where *you* get your src skelleton Dec 31 01:51:35 ? Dec 31 01:51:35 NOTE WELL: if you just read my tweaks page and are modifying your main application set, beware that it just foobar'd mine when i tried to revert it. hrw|gone ? Dec 31 01:53:53 jebba: hrhrr I know why I was reluctant to mess with it Dec 31 01:54:47 DocScrutinizer51: can you mail me an original/pristine one to moe@blagblagblag.org plz? :) Dec 31 01:55:02 though i just tried copying my modified one over too, and it's fkt Dec 31 01:55:17 should be feasible :-)) Dec 31 01:55:25 seems like a pretty basic file though shouldn't cause too much chaos hmm. Dec 31 01:55:36 i've definitely changed similar files in fedora etc before Dec 31 01:56:03 which is why .local/share/applications etc should exist... (and very well may work, but i doubt it--havent tried) Dec 31 01:56:12 yeah but then there you always have a VT ;-) Dec 31 01:56:40 ah, copied my file over, rebooted, and now it works. Dec 31 01:57:14 ooh. so no more need for email? Dec 31 01:57:43 tweaks page? Dec 31 01:58:13 DocScrutinizer51: if you could mail it, that would be cool to see if i can revert it or not Dec 31 01:58:18 http://wiki.maemo.org/User:Jebba/Tweaks SpeedEvil Dec 31 01:58:42 jebba: mompl Dec 31 01:59:00 mompl? Dec 31 01:59:12 you know... bluepill mode for mail attachments :-((( Dec 31 01:59:18 sounds like a handy command Dec 31 01:59:40 ~mompl Dec 31 01:59:41 huh? there is such a thing? /me confoozd Dec 31 01:59:41 i heard mompl is a stupid short form for "moment please" Dec 31 01:59:50 ah Dec 31 01:59:55 http://wiki.maemo.org/Category:N900_Hardware Dec 31 01:59:58 i thought it was a script ;) Dec 31 01:59:59 additions welcome. Dec 31 02:00:10 ah, i should be able to look for this in the majick mxr thing too Dec 31 02:00:12 * SpeedEvil has been lying in bed today and that's all I've gotten done. Dec 31 02:00:22 ah, though that isn't a final installed system. Dec 31 02:00:27 *that* would be cool to have too Dec 31 02:00:33 maybe i'll do that, hmm Dec 31 02:00:52 * jebba looking Dec 31 02:01:36 SpeedEvil: you see this? http://www.natisbad.org/N900/ Seems to be down recently, but i snagged from google's cache. Lots of hardware info. Dec 31 02:01:57 up now Dec 31 02:02:08 though maybe not in the form you saw Dec 31 02:03:47 oooh fsckng BUUG. Dec 31 02:05:06 jebba: muchj of the same info looks like Dec 31 02:05:18 when I edit a mail and open dashboard, then mail edit screen is eaten by "new mail" notifier. Hitting that one "storing draft" Dec 31 02:06:01 The popups seem to popup on the wrong screen occasionally. Dec 31 02:06:09 I was installing an app which was taking a while. Dec 31 02:06:17 So I switched to fbreader. Dec 31 02:06:28 it went beep, and the controls froze Dec 31 02:06:40 there was a notification on the app window Dec 31 02:07:20 SpeedEvil: gecko has a way to render pages to pngs Dec 31 02:07:33 look at toDataURL or something Dec 31 02:08:13 DocScrutinizer51 / jebba : what/why are you sorting m['a]s ? Dec 31 02:09:01 timeless: thanks Dec 31 02:09:28 And of course the xml data functionality of yr.no would fall over... Dec 31 02:13:27 timeless_mbp: i dont understand anything people are saying today. m['a]s ? Dec 31 02:14:06 main applications? I'm adding icons to the main set for convenience (?) that what you asking. Ala: http://wiki.maemo.org/User:Jebba/Tweaks Dec 31 02:14:10 sorry, Màs Dec 31 02:14:11 sorry got a disconnect after >>>030931 And of course the xml Dec 31 02:14:29 (02:09:27 AM) SpeedEvil: And of course the xml data functionality of yr.no would fall over... Dec 31 02:15:51 http://www.yr.no/place/Norway/Akershus/Frogn/Dr%C3%B8bak/varsel.xml - for example. Dec 31 02:15:52 jebba: how does maemo manage to have 'Ms...' at end of page? How did *you* move it to somewhere else? Dec 31 02:16:09 Ah! ya, i get it now, mine is in spanish. Gah, time to sleep i think. I added icons and it moved it up. Think it uses this: Dec 31 02:16:35 SpeedEvil: still what would you stop from using a widget for that? Dec 31 02:16:49 X-Osso-User-Position=4 Dec 31 02:17:11 DocScrutinizer51: nothing. Dec 31 02:17:16 duh' where? Dec 31 02:17:41 DocScrutinizer51: merely I can code the other alternative in 5-10 mins. Dec 31 02:18:47 jebba: is this userpos foo in the more... .desktop file? Dec 31 02:19:41 DocScrutinizer51: cool, thx, that sorted things out. I must have just had an error in there Dec 31 02:26:47 jebba: I thought the "more..." icon was autogenerated by hildon applauncher and thus can't be edited nor created any "MyMore2...", nor placed anywhere else than lower right corner Dec 31 02:26:50 Anyone has a N900 and some Qt4-based application installed? I would like to know if the Input Language Switch keyboard accelerator works properly when the current application is Qt4-based one. The keyboard accelerator is CTRL+Space. Dec 31 02:27:16 jebba: but your screenshot shows it somewhere middle of screen Dec 31 02:28:09 DocScrutinizer51: cuz applications like Maep, midori, burgerspace, etc don't use that field at all, so they get punted to the end. Dec 31 02:28:14 to be precise it's middle row right Dec 31 02:28:39 *which* field?? Dec 31 02:30:10 X-Osso-User-Position :) Dec 31 02:30:11 jebba: is this userpos foo in the more... .desktop file? Dec 31 02:30:30 http://www.mail-archive.com/maemo-commits@maemo.org/msg07113.html Dec 31 02:30:33 covers that field :) Dec 31 02:31:34 it's the last one in the list of ones that use the "X-Osso-User-Position=6" things, but after further looking, i could be wrong there too Dec 31 02:33:56 timeless_mbp: sorry but that patch doesn't faintly resemble an answer to my question Dec 31 02:34:06 DocScrutinizer51: it tells you which file :) Dec 31 02:34:08 (namely .desktop) Dec 31 02:34:12 and it hints at an example Dec 31 02:34:16 surely those are answers :) Dec 31 02:34:34 of course, i only see 5 applications that actually *use* that field... Dec 31 02:34:56 grep X-Osso-User-Position /usr/share/applications/hildon/* DocScrutinizer51 Dec 31 02:36:26 jebba: i don't suppose you've done apt-get source alsa-lib ? Dec 31 02:36:51 timeless_mbp: ok. I'll create my soldering directions like "go to x:55.3mm y:21.8mm from fit mark and heat to 288C. " Dec 31 02:36:53 https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=4035 could use verification against an actual source tree Dec 31 02:36:54 Bug 4035: Please remove the alsa => . symlink in /include Dec 31 02:37:07 * jebba doing now Dec 31 02:37:09 (mxr involves various forms of cleanup) Dec 31 02:39:58 timeless_mbp: from alsa-lib apt.-get source: Dec 31 02:39:58 lrwxrwxrwx 1 jebba jebba 1 Dec 30 20:23 alsa -> . Dec 31 02:40:09 i assume you're talking about that Dec 31 02:40:15 yep Dec 31 02:40:32 please reopen and note that it's broken in sources and it's obvious that timeless has manually fixed it (again) for mxr Dec 31 02:40:41 thanks :) Dec 31 02:48:36 haha Dec 31 02:48:51 hehe Dec 31 02:49:02 timeless https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=4035 updated Dec 31 02:49:03 Bug 4035: Please remove the alsa => . symlink in /include Dec 31 02:49:06 :) Dec 31 02:49:09 jebba: so is there actually a .desktop for the "more..." icon? Dec 31 02:49:39 DocScrutinizer51: one would hope so Dec 31 02:49:46 otherwise how would it get translated? Dec 31 02:49:49 or an icon? Dec 31 02:50:11 fine. would you mind to share the name? Dec 31 02:51:05 it's 2:50am and you want me to reach over for my n900? Dec 31 02:51:26 DocScrutinizer51: so... Dec 31 02:51:33 do you have my translation installed? Dec 31 02:51:36 would it be better to preserve bookmarks somewhere in MyDocs where a reflash wont erase them? Dec 31 02:51:39 because it has a tool that would help here Dec 31 02:51:54 pupnik: so that you can't make bookmarks while you're attached to a computer? Dec 31 02:51:58 that sounds like a great idea Dec 31 02:52:22 can you change contact info while attached to a computer? Dec 31 02:52:28 ayup Dec 31 02:52:35 would be kinda lame if you couldn't... Dec 31 02:52:44 do contacts get preserved across reflashes? Dec 31 02:53:06 not if you don't back them up... Dec 31 02:53:11 err wait Dec 31 02:53:14 no no no Dec 31 02:53:18 what kind of 'reflash' Dec 31 02:53:28 there are two distinct flash images Dec 31 02:53:35 one for ubifs (root = /) Dec 31 02:53:43 one for eMMC (home, vfat) Dec 31 02:53:53 if you reflash ubifs, you don't lose much in the way of user data Dec 31 02:54:00 because most user data lives in home, or vfat Dec 31 02:54:12 if you reflash eMMC, you lose virtually all user data Dec 31 02:54:23 you lose the bookmarks. i was wondering if that was unfortunate or maybe desirable Dec 31 02:54:33 that seems odd Dec 31 02:54:39 because bookmarks should be in home Dec 31 02:54:51 ah i meant bookmarks on desktop Dec 31 02:54:54 DocScrutinizer51: grep for 'tana_fi_applications' Dec 31 02:54:58 sorry for my lazy language Dec 31 02:55:01 grep -r More /usr/share/applications/* turns up nothing Dec 31 02:55:02 pupnik: ambiguity sucks Dec 31 02:55:05 jebba: Any idea about name of the more... desktop file Dec 31 02:55:07 jebba: no no no Dec 31 02:55:09 grep for tana_fi_applications Dec 31 02:55:23 jebba / DocScrutinizer51 you really need to install my localization Dec 31 02:55:35 /usr/share/applications/hildon/applications.directory:Name=tana_fi_applications Dec 31 02:55:37 oh ya, duh Dec 31 02:55:42 it gives you a tool which would have let you search for More (although the ... is a single character and searching for it sucks) Dec 31 02:55:46 it's in the list too, at the bottom of hildon.menu Dec 31 02:56:02 there's a shocker =b Dec 31 02:56:13 X-Osso-User-Position=15 Dec 31 02:56:17 heh Dec 31 02:56:27 timless truly is timeless sleep-schedule wise Dec 31 02:56:27 hrm, out of a grid of 15 Dec 31 02:56:36 they asked it to be slot #15, wow Dec 31 02:56:47 Applications Dec 31 02:56:48 applications.directory Dec 31 02:56:48 Dec 31 02:57:22 timeless_mbp: ooh. So I assme that's this incredible translations that made my N810 display "tana_fi home tana_fi home thumb" in the window select bar recently Dec 31 02:57:24 $ grep -r X-Osso-User-Position /usr/share/applications/ | wc -l Dec 31 02:57:24 5 Dec 31 02:57:33 heh Dec 31 02:57:48 DocScrutinizer51: probably Dec 31 02:58:12 are you able to use control panel to switch back to nokia strings? Dec 31 02:58:30 (the one that says American English or British English) Dec 31 02:58:33 yeah I'm incredibly eager to isnstall these on N900 :-S Dec 31 02:58:47 because if you are, you should be able to use the control panel's Advanced Option to get to the fun stuff Dec 31 02:59:11 DocScrutinizer51: oh, my fremantle stuff is safe, it uninstalls :) Dec 31 02:59:23 -- the diablo version didn't really offer that :) **** ENDING LOGGING AT Thu Dec 31 02:59:57 2009