**** BEGIN LOGGING AT Sat Jan 30 02:59:57 2010
Jan 30 03:01:08 <pupnik> nada.  anglais por favore
Jan 30 03:12:43 <ElMarioN900> Yo, yo hablo español
Jan 30 03:16:00 <spectre-> n900 keeps crash rebooting
Jan 30 03:16:26 <jebba> yo tambien
Jan 30 03:16:32 <spectre-> only thing i've done prior to this repeat issue is install firefox rc3?
Jan 30 03:16:41 <spectre-> wish n900 kept a syslog
Jan 30 03:16:59 <spectre-> anyone else have this issue?
Jan 30 03:18:04 <ml-mobile> spectre-:  try catting out /proc/bootreason
Jan 30 03:18:38 <crashanddie> ElMarioN900: parla catala?
Jan 30 03:19:08 <pupnik> spectre you have new pr1.1 ?
Jan 30 03:19:13 <crashanddie> o castillano?
Jan 30 03:20:00 <crashanddie> ElMarioN900: este canal es en Ingles solamente
Jan 30 03:20:45 <crashanddie> GeneralAntilles: I should've asked for monk
Jan 30 03:20:50 <crashanddie> GeneralAntilles: rather than contributor
Jan 30 03:25:12 <crashanddie> Oh look at that, Youtube being funky: Current language: Australia
Jan 30 03:33:09 <spectre-> i've got the latest ota update
Jan 30 03:33:16 <spectre-> if that's what you mean
Jan 30 03:33:31 <ElMarioN900> sorry
Jan 30 03:33:52 <spectre-> ./proc/bootreason says
Jan 30 03:34:03 <spectre-> 32wd to
Jan 30 03:34:05 <spectre-> wtf?
Jan 30 03:34:07 <ml-mobile> hmm
Jan 30 03:34:12 <ml-mobile> yeah
Jan 30 03:34:37 <pupnik> http://encyclopediadramatica.com/Firefox_XPS_IRC_Attack  the pest advertises his annoying of freenode / firefox and freenode slow to respond
Jan 30 03:34:42 <spectre-> is that a code or just garbage?
Jan 30 03:34:44 <ml-mobile> try grabbing the full firmware image and reflash, and erase the eMMC
Jan 30 03:34:49 <ml-mobile> it's a code
Jan 30 03:34:49 <ElMarioN900> what if i want to install maemo in other kind of phone?
Jan 30 03:35:03 <spectre-> whats eMMC?
Jan 30 03:35:05 <ml-mobile> the new update resolved most of those
Jan 30 03:35:15 <ml-mobile> the 32GB of storage
Jan 30 03:35:19 <spectre-> ah gotccha
Jan 30 03:35:36 <spectre-> backup/restoring my home will be fine, though, right?
Jan 30 03:35:41 <ml-mobile> but sometimes the OTA method doesn't immediately resolve it
Jan 30 03:35:44 <ml-mobile> yes
Jan 30 03:36:04 <spectre-> got a link to where i can grab the firmware?
Jan 30 03:36:15 <spectre-> appreciate the help
Jan 30 03:36:17 * ml-mobile had lots of 32wd_to reboots before the update
Jan 30 03:36:27 <javispedro> e
Jan 30 03:36:32 <spectre-> no more now?
Jan 30 03:36:41 <ml-mobile> none
Jan 30 03:36:47 <pupnik> i haven't seen any since update either
Jan 30 03:37:11 <ml-mobile> but right now I am in my car in the parking lot at work and want to head out
Jan 30 03:37:23 <spectre-> ok then, so where do i get the firmware?
Jan 30 03:37:28 <spectre-> does nokia have a dev site?
Jan 30 03:37:47 <pupnik> a few seconds of google should help that
Jan 30 03:37:53 <spectre-> aight, i'll google it
Jan 30 03:37:53 <ml-mobile> and while the N900's keyboard is awesome, I can't quite type fast enough to keep up
Jan 30 03:38:11 <ml-mobile> something like tabletdev.nokia.com
Jan 30 03:38:15 <spectre-> well, thanks
Jan 30 03:38:27 <spectre-> i'll give it a shot
Jan 30 03:38:30 <pupnik> i forgot exact url
Jan 30 03:38:37 <ml-mobile> good luck
Jan 30 03:38:51 <spectre-> thanks!
Jan 30 03:39:21 <javispedro> elmarion900: basically, you can't. best alternative is Mer.
Jan 30 03:40:29 <ElMarioN900> Mer?
Jan 30 03:40:32 <ElMarioN900> oh
Jan 30 03:41:08 <spectre-> someone should make a cooliris type app/browser plugin for thie n900
Jan 30 03:41:26 <javispedro> and btw, I didn't know Nokla was shipping Windows CE N900 clones now...
Jan 30 03:41:39 <ElMarioN900> yes
Jan 30 03:41:45 <ElMarioN900> I have one
Jan 30 03:42:10 <ElMarioN900> and I do not like Windows
Jan 30 03:45:18 <ElMarioN900> BUT!, Nokia is not shipping Windows CE, chinese phones (clones) have that OS
Jan 30 03:46:15 <javispedro> who are known around here as " nokla " (l instead of i )
Jan 30 03:46:45 <javispedro> though last time those were using their own homegrown os
Jan 30 03:48:09 <microlith> javispedro: nothing quite like a mystery OS, not compatible with anything
Jan 30 03:48:43 <ElMarioN900> mmm, i have a phone and it says "Nokia" very clear ... and it is not Nokia
Jan 30 03:49:39 <microlith> shanzai phones are not known for being subtle when jacking other companies trademarks
Jan 30 03:52:50 <javispedro> tbh it is rather amusing. i've seen ebay ads not unlike "100% original Nokia _logo_".
Jan 30 03:54:26 <javispedro> and finally the n900 xchat port is usable. rst did a great job.
Jan 30 04:12:51 <ScribbleJ> I think it's great.
Jan 30 04:12:56 <ScribbleJ> I've been using it all week.
Jan 30 04:13:09 <ScribbleJ> Best IRC client on a phone evar.
Jan 30 04:13:12 <microlith> it is
Jan 30 04:13:36 <ScribbleJ> I do wish there were a setting to make it defualt to scrilling when I drag in the window, though.
Jan 30 04:13:38 <ScribbleJ> scrolling
Jan 30 04:13:45 <ScribbleJ> Instead of selecting as it does.
Jan 30 04:13:51 <ScribbleJ> scrolling is used way more often.
Jan 30 04:13:53 <microlith> or both, as it were
Jan 30 04:13:55 <pupnik> must try it then.  hard to fight the power of irssi tho
Jan 30 04:14:00 * microlith finds himself selectscrolling occasionally
Jan 30 04:14:43 <pupnik> fn+uparrow pages up here
Jan 30 04:14:44 <ScribbleJ> If you addicted to irssi because you use it with screen
Jan 30 04:14:55 <ScribbleJ> Then you are doin' it wrong, get a bouncer like znc or dircproxy.
Jan 30 04:15:19 <pupnik> why
Jan 30 04:16:11 <ScribbleJ> Works with anything, freedom to choose, not bound to the command line, can change clients on the fly and miss nothing, or and it's a tool purpose-built for the job.
Jan 30 04:16:21 <ScribbleJ> That's jus toff the top of my head, I'm sure there are other good reasons.
Jan 30 04:16:37 <pupnik> ok thanks
Jan 30 04:17:01 <ScribbleJ> I used to use dircproxy but just recently switched to znc, which has a lot more features and nicer authentication.
Jan 30 04:17:57 <pupnik> i will one up that and claim vnc is better cause you get gfx and any prog
Jan 30 04:18:26 <ScribbleJ> Uhm
Jan 30 04:18:34 <ScribbleJ> Well, that's  a whole different thing.
Jan 30 04:18:51 <pupnik> yeah
Jan 30 04:22:45 <pupnik> one would hope this firefox irc idiocy could be solved soon
Jan 30 04:23:05 <pupnik> or i will make it a point to take out a loltard myself
Jan 30 04:39:34 <crashanddie> fuck me
Jan 30 04:39:50 <luke-jr> pupnik: it's Firefox; what do you expect?
Jan 30 04:39:53 <crashanddie> just had to pay off 6000 quid worth of credit card...
Jan 30 04:39:54 <luke-jr> crashanddie: no
Jan 30 04:41:37 <derf> So how the gekk is one supposed to actually install PR1.1?
Jan 30 04:41:56 <derf> Because it sure doesn't work in appman, nor does apt-get dist-upgrade work.
Jan 30 04:44:57 <crashanddie> derf: the reasons why PR1.1 would fail over the air are pretty unknown, but I'm guessing specific software dependencies make it impossible
Jan 30 04:45:04 <crashanddie> derf: reflash and you're good to go
Jan 30 04:47:34 <derf> crashanddie: Fuck no.
Jan 30 04:47:47 <derf> If you'll excuse my French.
Jan 30 04:50:40 <derf> The errors I get from apt are: http://pastebin.com/mb9eefa8
Jan 30 04:57:05 <crashanddie> derf: non, je ne te pardonne pas
Jan 30 05:12:47 <pupnik_> dist upgrading to help fix package problems?
Jan 30 05:14:18 <pupnik_> that would be more useful in a few hours when europe is at work
Jan 30 05:14:32 <derf> Europe works on Saturdays?
Jan 30 05:15:06 <`0660> :)
Jan 30 05:24:24 <pupnik_> they dont work at wee morning hours
Jan 30 05:25:17 <derf> I thought it was the land of the 35-hour work week.
Jan 30 05:26:43 <Proteous> I thought it was 29
Jan 30 05:27:02 <Proteous> with 2 months of vaction time
Jan 30 05:27:22 <Proteous> maybe that was only france...
Jan 30 06:04:26 <Klowner> anyone know if there's a way to snap widget positions?
Jan 30 06:05:15 <Klowner> PR1.1 changelog mentions it
Jan 30 06:05:19 <DocScrutinizer> Klowner: tweakr app. "grid snap" or somesuch
Jan 30 06:05:40 <Klowner> ah thank you
Jan 30 06:05:40 <DocScrutinizer> never tested it
Jan 30 06:51:53 <RST38h> OMG what are we all gonna do??? "Confirmed: iPhone OS 3.2 has support for video calling, file downloads, and SMS"
Jan 30 06:53:34 <ml-mobile> OMG I dunno, not care?
Jan 30 06:53:36 <ml-mobile> heh
Jan 30 06:55:28 <RST38h> It may even do pseudo-multitasking! Can you believe it?
Jan 30 06:55:58 <jX> sms? uhh, iphones already do that
Jan 30 06:55:59 <jX> and mms too
Jan 30 06:56:10 <jX> but video calling, they have no front facing camera
Jan 30 07:04:07 <pupnik_> new xchat has lots of fans RST38h
Jan 30 07:14:53 <cehteh> one point where iphone is ahead of n900: it is not out of stock
Jan 30 07:14:55 <RST38h> Hehe, Obama cancels Moon/Mars NASA programs
Jan 30 07:15:10 <RST38h> cehteh: you forgot "shiny".
Jan 30 07:15:48 <cehteh> well the chrome fringe around the flash on the n900 is also shiny
Jan 30 07:16:02 <LuciusMare> rite
Jan 30 07:16:16 * cehteh just placed another order .. lets see if its deliverable
Jan 30 07:16:35 <cehteh> basically everywhere sold out in germany except for the expensive shops
Jan 30 07:16:43 <cehteh> even the ones which had one
Jan 30 07:16:56 <LuciusMare> "ps aux|grep browser|awk '{ print $1 }'|xargs kill" is not a correct way how to end all browser instances
Jan 30 07:17:02 <cehteh> not to mention the many shops which never seen them yet
Jan 30 07:18:10 <crashanddie> http://hemoblaster.com/ipad.jpg
Jan 30 07:19:35 <cehteh> http://linux.slashdot.org/story/10/01/30/0022239/Video-Review-of-Hivisions-100-ARM-Based-Android-Laptop   how about maemo/mer on that
Jan 30 07:19:55 <cehteh> well no touchscreen
Jan 30 07:20:06 <cehteh> hey we want a mouse optimized maemo! ;P
Jan 30 07:20:34 <RST38h> it sucks.
Jan 30 07:20:45 <RST38h> the "laptop" I mean
Jan 30 07:20:53 <cehteh> sure
Jan 30 07:21:03 <cehteh> but for $100 ..
Jan 30 07:22:16 <crashanddie> I don't get the whole cheap computer stuff
Jan 30 07:22:48 <crashanddie> I'd rather pay 10 times that price and have a valid laptop that can churn through numbers with decent speed
Jan 30 07:23:01 <cehteh> yes i did that too ..
Jan 30 07:23:27 <crashanddie> but then again, I'm ranting a lot lately, so I'll just shut the fuck up
Jan 30 07:23:34 <RST38h> cehteh: It will be $100 lost
Jan 30 07:23:46 <cehteh> but having some ultra-cheap netbook which wont hurt you when it gets stolen or destroyed for unfriendly terrain can be an option
Jan 30 07:24:11 <RST38h> it is no netbook, just an ultra cheap n800 knockoff that looks like a laptop
Jan 30 07:24:45 <crashanddie> cehteh: it's not the hardware that bothers me, but the data it contains
Jan 30 07:24:58 <cehteh> yeah it needs connectivity ..
Jan 30 07:25:15 <cehteh> you dont want to have valuable data on a volatile device
Jan 30 07:25:24 <Myrtti> five minutes...
Jan 30 07:25:30 <ScribbleJ> How do you mean "Volatile?"
Jan 30 07:25:54 <ScribbleJ> I carry valuable data on my laptop all day long and use an encrypted fs to help minimize the risks.
Jan 30 07:26:03 <cehteh> heh
Jan 30 07:26:08 <cehteh> me too
Jan 30 07:26:20 <RST38h> Myrtti: ...and...?
Jan 30 07:26:30 <Myrtti> exciting!
Jan 30 07:27:00 <crashanddie> "five minutes... and ... exciting!" Myrtti, stop smoking crack
Jan 30 07:27:17 <cehteh> and i carry my more expensive laptop almost always with me
Jan 30 07:27:23 <ScribbleJ> Well, three minutes left.
Jan 30 07:27:29 <ScribbleJ> Hope ya'll are ready for /exciting/.
Jan 30 07:27:36 <crashanddie> eh?
Jan 30 07:27:39 <crashanddie> ready for what?
Jan 30 07:27:43 <ScribbleJ> Exciting!
Jan 30 07:27:48 <cehteh> but i dont want to go backpacking though africa with it
Jan 30 07:27:51 <crashanddie> ScribbleJ: go the hardware encryption route
Jan 30 07:28:03 <ScribbleJ> crashanddie, ?
Jan 30 07:28:15 <crashanddie> ScribbleJ: specific hard drives support hardware encryption
Jan 30 07:28:27 <crashanddie> you don't get the performance hit of software encryption
Jan 30 07:28:37 <cehteh> crashanddie: yeah ... do you trust that? many are defeated :P
Jan 30 07:28:48 <ScribbleJ> Oh, I'm sure that's awesome, but my laptop is an old 32-bit single-core 512mb RAM POS and it does just fine with software encryption.
Jan 30 07:28:48 <crashanddie> cehteh: no they not, shut the fuck up you noob
Jan 30 07:28:58 <cehteh> and software encryption isnt really a big problem
Jan 30 07:29:11 <crashanddie> ScribbleJ: usually there's a 30% performance hit on most laptops
Jan 30 07:29:23 <ScribbleJ> Where'd you get that number?
Jan 30 07:29:29 <crashanddie> work
Jan 30 07:29:35 <cehteh> 30% for sustained I/O
Jan 30 07:29:38 <crashanddie> I'm a security expert, consultant for banks and governments
Jan 30 07:29:55 <cehteh> but a laptop doesnt do i/o continously
Jan 30 07:30:00 <ScribbleJ> What, like a PCI-DSS auditor?
Jan 30 07:30:15 <ScribbleJ> Anecdotally, software encryption causes me no problems.
Jan 30 07:30:23 <cehteh> i agree
Jan 30 07:30:28 <crashanddie> no, professional services consultant, I help organisations implement security solutions, mainly based around smartcards and the like
Jan 30 07:30:29 <cehteh> its barely noticeable
Jan 30 07:30:48 <cehteh> given that this laptop has a ultra slow 1.8" hdd anyways :P
Jan 30 07:30:52 <crashanddie> heh
Jan 30 07:31:12 <ScribbleJ> Ah... well, I'm on the PCI-DSS council, and also do security in the banking industry.
Jan 30 07:31:22 <cehteh> well looking forward for a fast ssd someday ..
Jan 30 07:31:31 <crashanddie> I've seen an intel prototype SSD drive with hardware encryption... can't remember the numbers but pretty damn fast
Jan 30 07:31:46 <ScribbleJ> Have any of you tried the ZAGG screen protector kit on your N900?
Jan 30 07:32:18 <cehteh> crashanddie: i believe the 30% for a server .. but for a laptop where the disk is mostly idle anyways its really not the case
Jan 30 07:32:19 <crashanddie> ScribbleJ: my company sells authentication servers and credential management solutions
Jan 30 07:32:26 <ScribbleJ> crashanddie, that kind of hardware is really fun stuff but it's way overkill for the kind of work I do.
Jan 30 07:32:32 <crashanddie> cehteh: the disk is mostly idle during startup?
Jan 30 07:32:43 <cehteh> i dont startup that often
Jan 30 07:32:52 <ScribbleJ> crashanddie, haaa... I wonder if you're one of the companies that keeps sending me demo equipment.
Jan 30 07:33:02 <cehteh> i speak about performance while working not corner cases
Jan 30 07:33:03 <crashanddie> ScribbleJ: doubt it
Jan 30 07:33:21 <crashanddie> cehteh: again, depends on the use-cases
Jan 30 07:33:45 <ScribbleJ> I've been menaing to try encrypted fs on the N900.
Jan 30 07:33:46 <crashanddie> cehteh: I'm recommending it if you have a use for it, I could definitely see a difference
Jan 30 07:33:56 <ScribbleJ> It'll be interesting to see what the performance hit looks like there.
Jan 30 07:34:05 <ScribbleJ> IT's probably not practical.
Jan 30 07:34:09 <cehteh> having a distcc here in the back make -j10 and distribute over 10Ghz in the back .. thats the case where my hdd really struggles to deliver data
Jan 30 07:34:31 <ScribbleJ> On my notebook, though?  Whatever performance it robs me of I don't miss.
Jan 30 07:34:41 <cehteh> ScribbleJ: yes slow cpu and not much ram for cache will hit you there
Jan 30 07:34:49 <crashanddie> ScribbleJ: I'm currently working on providing a hardware module to the N900 which would allow to offload the processing from the CPU with regards to encryption/decryption
Jan 30 07:35:18 <ScribbleJ> Sounds like hardware encryption is your thing.
Jan 30 07:35:18 <crashanddie> also, secure credential storage in a hardware module
Jan 30 07:35:35 <crashanddie> well, hardware will always be more secure than software
Jan 30 07:35:50 <crashanddie> and faster
Jan 30 07:35:53 <crashanddie> it has obvious benefits
Jan 30 07:36:00 <ScribbleJ> I'm not sure how you would support that assertion.
Jan 30 07:36:16 <crashanddie> FIPS
Jan 30 07:36:17 <ScribbleJ> I mean, that it will always be more secure.
Jan 30 07:36:22 <crashanddie> oh
Jan 30 07:36:29 <crashanddie> generally speaking I geuss
Jan 30 07:37:17 <ScribbleJ> You guys think there is any chance that the N900 will /ever/ be able to act as a USB host?
Jan 30 07:37:36 <ScribbleJ> I really think Magtek's prices on Bluetooth swipers are insane.
Jan 30 07:38:10 <crashanddie> the simple fact that dedicated hardware isolates keys, processing and bugs... Having the same memory used for storing pretty pictures in your browser, and store your private encryption key and have everyone access the whole of the memory is a scary thought
Jan 30 07:38:26 <crashanddie> it also means than any compromised terminal would be able to rob everything you have...
Jan 30 07:38:39 <ScribbleJ> Well, hang on there.
Jan 30 07:38:52 <crashanddie> Whereas in a hardware module (smartcard, usb dongle), the hardware does the computation, and the key never leaves the hardware
Jan 30 07:39:19 <ScribbleJ> If the terminal is comprmised but does not have root then there is little to worry about in a good setup - and if the terminal is compromised and the attacker does have root, he'll be able to access your mounted hardware encrypted drive just as easily as a software one.
Jan 30 07:39:31 <DocScrutinizer> LuciusMare: why not "killall browserd" ? much shorter to type
Jan 30 07:39:54 <crashanddie> ScribbleJ: not talking about encrypted hard drive here
Jan 30 07:40:07 <crashanddie> ScribbleJ: smart card for example, will never export the data it contains
Jan 30 07:40:17 <ScribbleJ> He'll be able to read the unencrypted bits from memory then, on their way to the card.
Jan 30 07:40:52 <ScribbleJ> It doesn't matter if you're doing hardware of software; if you let someone compromise your system all bets are off.
Jan 30 07:40:55 <crashanddie> ScribbleJ: if you have the PIN, you can ask it to do some computation for you, but you can't get the keys... Which means that the person who does the attack has a very limited time frame... Only when the user has his smartcard in said device (compromised) can the attack go through
Jan 30 07:40:56 <ScribbleJ> s/of/or/
Jan 30 07:40:57 <infobot> ScribbleJ meant: It doesn't matter if you're doing hardware or software; if you let someone compromise your system all bets are off.
Jan 30 07:41:14 <ScribbleJ> Oh, that's clever.
Jan 30 07:41:24 <ScribbleJ> I will have to be careful with my regexes.
Jan 30 07:42:37 <ScribbleJ> crashanddie, so it's equivalent to doing software encryption on a removable disk, then.
Jan 30 07:42:46 <ScribbleJ> From a security perspective, I mean.
Jan 30 07:42:46 <crashanddie> not at all
Jan 30 07:43:05 <ScribbleJ> How so?  The attack vectors are identical.
Jan 30 07:43:07 <crashanddie> hard drive encryption is only one of the things, obviously
Jan 30 07:44:07 <crashanddie> ok, going to try to give you a pretty good use case
Jan 30 07:44:47 * cehteh does double keying .. with a key on a usb-flash and regenerating that on every login
Jan 30 07:45:00 <cehteh> invalidates copies one may do from the flash stick
Jan 30 07:45:05 <crashanddie> hard drive is encrypted with key K, this is generated randomly at some point, let's admit it's a good long and strong key, symmetric obviously, not easily crackable
Jan 30 07:46:01 <crashanddie> this key is encrypted with an asymmetric key, key AK, say a 2048 or 4096 RSA key, generated on a smartcard. This key can be escrowed but let's not waste time on that
Jan 30 07:47:15 <ScribbleJ> So to attack it, I'm going to need to either - 1) gain root while drive is mounted; 2) gain root while card is inserted, sniff pin and make my own request to card.
Jan 30 07:47:38 <crashanddie> My certificate for key AK is signed by a CA, which is owned by my company etc. The software that decrypts the harddrive is loaded before the OS loads, just after the BIOS
Jan 30 07:48:06 <ScribbleJ> OK, so 1) is a great scenario, since I can count on the drive to always be decrypted, right from boot.
Jan 30 07:48:40 <crashanddie> ScribbleJ: not necessarily, but for the sake of simplicity, let's go for that
Jan 30 07:48:54 <ScribbleJ> But 1 and 2 are the same as for software, except 2 becomes sniff passphrase for key AK.
Jan 30 07:48:59 <pwnguin> quick poll: is the camera software stack fast enough to take a picture of lightning?
Jan 30 07:49:06 <crashanddie> pwnguin: no
Jan 30 07:49:24 <ScribbleJ> Yes and No; the camera source code seems to take a photo by pulling a frame from video, essentially.
Jan 30 07:49:24 <crashanddie> pwnguin: I don't think you'll find any camera phone that does it
Jan 30 07:49:33 <ScribbleJ> No reason you couldn't use that technique to photo lightning.
Jan 30 07:49:38 <crashanddie> pwnguin: not even P&S cameras will be able to do that
Jan 30 07:50:02 <pwnguin> crashanddie: you seem fairly confident
Jan 30 07:50:14 <crashanddie> yes, comes with the ego
Jan 30 07:50:25 <pwnguin> how long does it take to 'take' a picture?
Jan 30 07:50:33 <DocScrutinizer> ages
Jan 30 07:50:38 <crashanddie> a second? 1.4s?
Jan 30 07:50:41 <pwnguin> in microseconds
Jan 30 07:50:43 <ScribbleJ> I've got a buddy with some great lightning photos he took on his iPhone.
Jan 30 07:50:48 <crashanddie> 1400000?
Jan 30 07:51:07 <pwnguin> crashanddie: are you including jpegenc in that?
Jan 30 07:51:22 <crashanddie> if you hadn't guessed, I'm just giving random numbers
Jan 30 07:51:38 <crashanddie> ScribbleJ: pre-emptive shooting probably
Jan 30 07:51:44 <ScribbleJ> Yeah, he might have got lucky.
Jan 30 07:52:02 <DocScrutinizer> only way
Jan 30 07:52:06 <pwnguin> crashanddie: i figured if i pressed you for enough figures and facts you'd wind up citing nothing :P
Jan 30 07:53:10 <crashanddie> pwnguin: still telling you, there's no P&S or lower (and yes, camera phones are lower) that can do proper lightning pictures through causality shots
Jan 30 07:53:15 <crashanddie> only pre-emptive shots are possible
Jan 30 07:53:56 <pwnguin> im not sure why
Jan 30 07:54:02 <pwnguin> lightning lasts for 400ms
Jan 30 07:54:16 <crashanddie> pwnguin: how fast are human reactions?
Jan 30 07:54:25 <pwnguin> fuck that
Jan 30 07:54:30 <pwnguin> im building a trigger
Jan 30 07:54:33 <RST38h> t.m.o users appear to be using N900 in India, without screen protector, and already lost their stylus this morning
Jan 30 07:54:46 <crashanddie> pwnguin: so you're holding a camera, as soon as you see the flash you click...
Jan 30 07:54:52 <crashanddie> pwnguin: oh, in that case, I don't know
Jan 30 07:55:07 <ifreq> anyone interested to try motion detector spycam on n900?
Jan 30 07:55:08 <crashanddie> pwnguin: you'd have to take care of focusing and exposure before though
Jan 30 07:55:12 <pwnguin> yes
Jan 30 07:55:13 <ifreq> tho i got only binaries and conf atm
Jan 30 07:55:17 <crashanddie> pwnguin: if you can get those completely out of the picture maybe...
Jan 30 07:55:19 <ifreq> it seems to work nicely :P
Jan 30 07:55:30 <ScribbleJ> ifreq, streaming, or just storing?
Jan 30 07:55:44 <ifreq> storing, but i guess it has the inc webserver.. havent tested that yet
Jan 30 07:55:44 <ScribbleJ> it it just a port of motion?
Jan 30 07:55:53 <ifreq> just tested for motion detectiong/pic saving
Jan 30 07:55:58 <ifreq> ScribbleJ: yeah
Jan 30 07:56:06 <ifreq> compiled it yesterday and did the confs
Jan 30 07:56:07 <ScribbleJ> I'll pass then, nice job though.
Jan 30 07:56:13 <ifreq> y :)
Jan 30 07:56:21 <ScribbleJ> I'd recommend just calling it motion.
Jan 30 07:56:22 <pwnguin> my question is mainly, if i construct a gstreamer pipeline and send it a play signal at on detection, if the underlying software is low latency enough
Jan 30 07:56:24 <ScribbleJ> Don't get fancy. :P
Jan 30 07:56:26 <ifreq> need to figure out next howto make proper debs and shit
Jan 30 07:56:32 <ifreq> ScribbleJ: naah nvm :) not my style.
Jan 30 07:57:11 <ifreq> ScribbleJ: ill save the shots under DCIM so i can import them automatically ie. atleast on iphoto :)
Jan 30 07:57:23 <ifreq> remote webstream would be nice too. bbl.
Jan 30 07:57:37 <ScribbleJ> Sounds like fun... I've been trying to port some kind of streaming software I can use onto the N900.
Jan 30 07:57:54 <ifreq> well motion has inc webserver
Jan 30 07:58:03 <ifreq> but you want stream to next hop i guess?
Jan 30 07:58:10 <ScribbleJ> streaming straight from gstreamer is an incredible hassle and it's only got some support for rtp.
Jan 30 07:58:14 <ifreq> ScribbleJ: what about vlc?
Jan 30 07:58:21 <crashanddie> pwnguin: might want to do automated shootnig mode -- just bursting the whole time
Jan 30 07:58:26 <ScribbleJ> vlc is a good choice but it taxes the N900 a bit.
Jan 30 07:58:59 <pwnguin> crashanddie: so basically video at 1fps or whatever the highest resolution operates at
Jan 30 07:59:08 <ScribbleJ> I tried porting over mjpeg_streamer but right now am having a mmap() problem.  It can't mmap() to /dev/video*
Jan 30 07:59:19 <crashanddie> pwnguin: pretty much
Jan 30 07:59:19 <ifreq> ScribbleJ: would be nice to get frontcam enabled on motion too.. i could run it as a deamon and if it gets stolen it takes pics from the guy continuoysly and emails them :P
Jan 30 07:59:35 <pwnguin> crashanddie: i'd probably want to turn off jpegenc
Jan 30 07:59:35 <ifreq> not useful really. but funny thought
Jan 30 07:59:36 <crashanddie> pwnguin: my camera supports burst mode around 4FPS
Jan 30 07:59:40 <ScribbleJ> Not much to do to enable frontacam; rear is /dev/video0 and front is /dev/video1
Jan 30 07:59:50 <crashanddie> pwnguin: and that's with raw and jpg encoding
Jan 30 07:59:59 <ScribbleJ> Frontcam quality is pretty awful though.
Jan 30 08:00:01 <ifreq> ScribbleJ: yeah but it doesnt work well with motion atleast.. or i need to open it first
Jan 30 08:00:08 <crashanddie> so roughly 20M dumped to SD card per picture
Jan 30 08:00:16 <ifreq> i think you need to initiate it 1st before you can use it?
Jan 30 08:00:18 <pwnguin> crashanddie: there's also a cooldown period thats's basically a lightning strike wide that i can see
Jan 30 08:00:51 <crashanddie> pwnguin: obviously, you could speed up the process by basically taking picture and just keeping it in RAM
Jan 30 08:00:59 <pwnguin> DocScrutinizer: happen to have a datasheet on the camera?
Jan 30 08:01:09 <crashanddie> pwnguin: and do a burst of X pictures based on that... Once ram is full dump to disc
Jan 30 08:01:12 <DocScrutinizer> not of that specific one
Jan 30 08:01:34 <pwnguin> DocScrutinizer: so you know which specific one it is?
Jan 30 08:01:52 <DocScrutinizer> not even that
Jan 30 08:02:18 <pwnguin> i really need to start a quality teardown website
Jan 30 08:02:21 <DocScrutinizer> but I know how long a lightning flash takes
Jan 30 08:03:17 <DocScrutinizer> and that's much shorter than even the time you need to move the trigger button from released to engaged posuition
Jan 30 08:03:32 <crashanddie> DocScrutinizer: read up
Jan 30 08:03:33 <DocScrutinizer> mechanically
Jan 30 08:03:47 <crashanddie> we're past that already :)
Jan 30 08:04:01 <crashanddie> DocScrutinizer: I was more thinking along the lines of a burst of pictures around a specific time
Jan 30 08:04:16 <DocScrutinizer> your only chance is you catch a lightning by incident during exposure time
Jan 30 08:04:34 <pwnguin> ive seen people use IR triggers with serious cameras
Jan 30 08:04:53 <DocScrutinizer> no way
Jan 30 08:05:01 <crashanddie> yes, it works
Jan 30 08:05:15 <pwnguin> http://www.glacialwanderer.com/hobbyrobotics/?p=16
Jan 30 08:05:17 <DocScrutinizer> it works as usually you get lightning bursts
Jan 30 08:06:03 <crashanddie> DocScrutinizer: the thing is need you need a massive aperture, usually f1.4 or even lower, and 1/6000th shutter speed
Jan 30 08:08:00 <DocScrutinizer> a cam capapble of 1/6000 might actually be fast enough to trigger on the lightning, using a IR sensor
Jan 30 08:08:33 <DocScrutinizer> if it's a electronic cam, no mechanical parts to move
Jan 30 08:09:13 <crashanddie> lmao
Jan 30 08:10:20 <ifreq> hmm.. motions webserver comes up but cant connect to it on LAN.
Jan 30 08:11:06 * RST38h wonders why put an Arduino controller into something that is clearly analogue
Jan 30 08:11:43 <ScribbleJ> He said he's a hardware moron.
Jan 30 08:11:51 <pwnguin> RST38h: i think he wanted something that can adapt quickly to lighting conditions
Jan 30 08:12:03 <ScribbleJ> Why use an arduino where $5 of parts from Radio Shack would do?
Jan 30 08:12:17 <RST38h> pwnguin: he gives a program there, and it does not adapt to anything
Jan 30 08:12:20 <pwnguin> so you change the threshhold without redoing the circuit
Jan 30 08:12:34 <ScribbleJ> pwnguin, all you need is a potentiometer
Jan 30 08:12:41 <pwnguin> RST38h: you could concievably do something like a pot and an opamp
Jan 30 08:13:04 <RST38h> US astronomer Frank Drake has told scientists at a special SETI meeting in London that earthlings are making it less likely that we will be heard in space. In the past, we used huge ground stations to broadcast radio and television signals which could be picked up relatively easily  according to astronomers' calculations anyway. Now we use satellites that transmit at 75 watts and point toward Earth instead of into space.
Jan 30 08:13:04 <ScribbleJ> Anyhow, he gets points for getting it done, in my book.
Jan 30 08:13:09 <ScribbleJ> You use the tools you have.
Jan 30 08:13:31 <RST38h> Must be a good thing though.
Jan 30 08:14:08 <pwnguin> but it doesnt matter because afaik n900 doesn't have an IR trigger
Jan 30 08:14:21 <crashanddie> lol, of course not
Jan 30 08:14:21 <RST38h> Given this: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gaFZTAOb7IE
Jan 30 08:14:34 <pwnguin> which is my other worry at this stage
Jan 30 08:15:00 <ScribbleJ> pwnguin, how do you plan to interface the trigger to the n900?
Jan 30 08:15:05 <DocScrutinizer> pwnguin: lol. it actually has
Jan 30 08:15:20 <crashanddie> RST38h: yeah, looking at how humanity has always gone to war as soon as they discovered a new continent or people, I was actually wondering why people were looking forward to be picked up in space
Jan 30 08:15:51 <pwnguin> DocScrutinizer: i thought it was just an IR led?
Jan 30 08:15:58 <ScribbleJ> pwnguin, no, it does in and out.
Jan 30 08:16:06 <pwnguin> oh thats handy
Jan 30 08:16:12 <pupnik_> the Ur-Quan will be in this sector soon, anyway
Jan 30 08:16:16 <ScribbleJ> I'm not clear on whether it would be useful for this though; can it read analog levels?
Jan 30 08:16:24 <RST38h> crashanddie: And very few are even considering a case where we get discovered by something so totally unhuman, that we look like vermin to it
Jan 30 08:16:26 <DocScrutinizer> ambient light sensor has IR-only and a separate allband sensor
Jan 30 08:16:37 <RST38h> (or food. or funny sex toys.)
Jan 30 08:16:39 <pupnik_> Douglas Adams thought of it
Jan 30 08:16:42 <ScribbleJ> Oh, I did no tknow that, that's even cooler.
Jan 30 08:16:52 <pupnik_> well more like eminent domain
Jan 30 08:16:54 <RST38h> pupnik: Also, Peter Watts ("Blindsight")
Jan 30 08:16:59 <crashanddie> RST38h: slavery taught me you don't need to look unlike someone to be despised...
Jan 30 08:17:01 <DocScrutinizer> pwnguin: alas it's way too slow for your purpose
Jan 30 08:17:18 <RST38h> crashanddie: Actually, slaery is a different thing
Jan 30 08:17:18 <pupnik_> maybe we shouldn't be broadcasting into space
Jan 30 08:17:25 <ScribbleJ> RST, have you read "MAde of MEat?
Jan 30 08:17:45 <pwnguin> the other options are USB, bluetooth and the headphone jack. and i guess the mic
Jan 30 08:17:50 <ScribbleJ> http://baetzler.de/humor/meat_beings.html  Will take you five minutes to read, very funny.
Jan 30 08:17:51 <RST38h> crashanddie: Slavery started because it was economically desireable, and all the dehumanising stuff came later to make slaveholders feel better
Jan 30 08:17:56 <pupnik_> hey at least we communicate with electrons and not flappy food orifices
Jan 30 08:18:03 <RST38h> Scribble: Of course I read the original short story =)
Jan 30 08:18:09 <DocScrutinizer> headphone jack might be feasible
Jan 30 08:18:31 <ScribbleJ> pwnguin, how do you list USB as an option?
Jan 30 08:18:52 <RST38h> crashanddie: In fact, first slaves were white, and initially there was not much tension between them and the black slaves
Jan 30 08:18:59 <pwnguin> ScribbleJ: ive got an arduino mega that does usb B =(
Jan 30 08:19:07 <RST38h> (unless of course our American History class instructior lied :))
Jan 30 08:19:22 <pupnik_> RST38h: i recall very early versions of MAME had much faster vector game rendering.  do you know if any other major slowdowns have occurred for MAME globally in the past 12 years?
Jan 30 08:19:28 <ScribbleJ> Interesting!
Jan 30 08:20:00 <RST38h> pupnik: Well, I do not know much about MAME but it definitely became slower over past 12 years as emulation precision improved
Jan 30 08:20:55 <pupnik_> let's just say this N900 version is a rather academic exercise
Jan 30 08:21:18 <ScribbleJ> Shoudln't an N900 be perfectly capable of running most mame games, int heory?
Jan 30 08:21:22 <DocScrutinizer> so use holdbutton on headset
Jan 30 08:21:23 <RST38h> try mame4all, should be better
Jan 30 08:21:25 <ScribbleJ> I dont' see why it should be academic.
Jan 30 08:21:52 <DocScrutinizer> most simple approach, and has potential for low latency
Jan 30 08:22:00 <pupnik_> because many console games are too powerful to emulate
Jan 30 08:22:13 <pwnguin> emulation overhead can be brutal
Jan 30 08:22:21 <DocScrutinizer> duh
Jan 30 08:22:35 <pwnguin> esp on older stuff thats got analog parts
Jan 30 08:22:42 <ScribbleJ> But we're talking about mame; it's got a catalog of excellent games that aren't even as taxing as the gameboy.
Jan 30 08:22:58 <RST38h> pwnguin: you almost never get to deal with hw that old, even in emulation
Jan 30 08:23:36 <pwnguin> RST38h: true; im mostly thinking of atari
Jan 30 08:23:37 <ifreq> where i can request for new software?
Jan 30 08:23:40 <pupnik_> yeah analog console games.  those were the days ... cough
Jan 30 08:23:51 <ifreq> i can compile the sw myself.. but cant debug whats wrong so i need some expert to check it
Jan 30 08:24:17 <RST38h> Fairchild stuff has been ages ago. And it ended up as a digital chip anyway.
Jan 30 08:24:39 <pupnik_> it was called "pinball"
Jan 30 08:24:41 <pupnik_> :P
Jan 30 08:24:45 <ifreq> http://dindinx.net/hotbabe/ <-- compiles ok for armel but when running it eats a piece from x-terminal and does nothing :P
Jan 30 08:24:50 <jkimball4> You lot seen the new firefox for maemo?
Jan 30 08:24:52 <ifreq> im sure many ppl agree its important piece of sw!
Jan 30 08:24:54 <ifreq> :)
Jan 30 08:25:03 <jkimball4> firefox.com/m
Jan 30 08:25:05 <ScribbleJ> Hahahah, that's funny, ifreq
Jan 30 08:25:12 <crashanddie> RST38h: whether or not your history teacher was wrong or not
Jan 30 08:25:29 <ifreq> ScribbleJ: yeh, wish i got it running tho.. it works on X86 scratchbox OK
Jan 30 08:25:33 <crashanddie> RST38h: the important bit isn't so much what happened exactly (let's allow history to write itself, right?)
Jan 30 08:25:37 <ifreq> but on armel it does something i really cant figure out
Jan 30 08:25:49 <crashanddie> RST38h: but rather that a people is able to animalise another people just in the name of greed
Jan 30 08:26:07 <crashanddie> RST38h: and also, slavery wasn't only something that happened in america...
Jan 30 08:26:30 <pwnguin> the jews were slaves way back in the pharoh's day
Jan 30 08:26:37 <pupnik_> i was a slave for about 45 percent of my workday
Jan 30 08:26:45 <pwnguin> if you take the bible's word for it
Jan 30 08:26:55 <Proteous> I'm a slave to coffee
Jan 30 08:27:01 <RST38h> crashanddie: Yea, but this is not what I meant
Jan 30 08:27:03 <Proteous> such a tasty, tasty master
Jan 30 08:27:13 <crashanddie> my slave went to the shops to get me food
Jan 30 08:27:34 <RST38h> crashanddie: In all these cases you are talking about, people come up with all kinds of theories "proving" that the people they opress are kinda inferior so it is ok
Jan 30 08:27:42 <crashanddie> (no seriously, I was like "Hey, can you go grab me some food?", and she just went "OK", and left)
Jan 30 08:27:52 <Proteous> :P
Jan 30 08:28:18 <crashanddie> ok, time for a fag
Jan 30 08:28:18 <RST38h> crashanddie: Imagine something that comes from space and does not even VIEW you as sentient life, or "life" at all in its own definition
Jan 30 08:28:20 <crashanddie> later
Jan 30 08:28:28 <DocScrutinizer> crashanddie: even without sudo?
Jan 30 08:28:43 <RST38h> crashanddie: You are a germ, and the guy with Lizol comes and sainitizes the toilet bowl
Jan 30 08:28:54 <crashanddie> RST38h: such as the Star Trek TOS episode where they find the silicon-based life form?
Jan 30 08:29:01 <crashanddie> rather than carbon?
Jan 30 08:29:06 <Proteous> ugly bags of mostly water
Jan 30 08:29:07 <Proteous> that's us
Jan 30 08:29:17 * RST38h isn't aquainted with every single ST episode, fortunately =)
Jan 30 08:29:22 <RST38h> acquainted
Jan 30 08:29:24 <crashanddie> or the Doctor Who episode where they realise the sun is a life form?
Jan 30 08:29:34 <RST38h> this one neither
Jan 30 08:29:38 <crashanddie> djeezus
Jan 30 08:29:44 <crashanddie> hand in your geek credentials
Jan 30 08:29:48 <Proteous> lol
Jan 30 08:29:51 <RST38h> crashanddie: But that little "They are meat!" story is a good candidate
Jan 30 08:30:02 <crashanddie> ok, will have a look
Jan 30 08:30:02 <RST38h> crashanddie: Or the Blindsight novel by Watts
Jan 30 08:30:21 <pwnguin> crashanddie: well, communists had little reason to develop sci fi allegories for communist infiltration
Jan 30 08:30:22 <crashanddie> peter?
Jan 30 08:30:31 <DocScrutinizer> prepare for dooooom :-D
Jan 30 08:30:33 <RST38h> Or maybe The Roadside Picnic by Strugatsky brothers
Jan 30 08:31:04 <RST38h> crashanddie: I am not a geek. Nerd is the most you can squeeze out of me.
Jan 30 08:31:44 <crashanddie> RST38h: you're on IRC, not only that but on FreeNode, not only that but in #maemo, and you're arguing a point about aliens invading earth
Jan 30 08:31:51 <crashanddie> you're about as much of a geek as they get mate
Jan 30 08:32:32 * DocScrutinizer awaiting the biggest netsplit ever
Jan 30 08:32:33 * RST38h scratches head
Jan 30 08:32:35 <Proteous> lol
**** BEGIN LOGGING AT Sat Jan 30 08:39:17 2010
Jan 30 08:39:47 <crashanddie> ~ping
Jan 30 08:40:04 <crashanddie> ~ping
Jan 30 08:40:14 <pwnguin> bot's not in yet?
Jan 30 08:40:42 <crashanddie> ~ping
Jan 30 08:41:00 <crashanddie> he should be in
Jan 30 08:41:06 <crashanddie> maybe too much information to process
Jan 30 08:42:39 <RST38h> TEST
Jan 30 08:42:42 <RST38h> http://maemos.ru/wp-content/uploads/2010/01/home_screen_201001271.jpg
Jan 30 08:42:48 <RST38h> Hehe
Jan 30 08:43:09 <pwnguin> an ipad running maemo
Jan 30 08:44:46 <crashanddie> pwnguin: how quaint of you, so that's what the picture was displaying
Jan 30 08:44:53 <crashanddie> thanks for illuminating us, Captain Obvious
Jan 30 08:45:10 <pwnguin> its late
Jan 30 08:45:13 <pwnguin> im going to bed
Jan 30 09:01:34 <doc|home> some things will never change ^
Jan 30 09:06:01 <Proteous> infobot being on the server that gets lost in the netsplit?
Jan 30 09:06:32 <crashanddie> ~ping
Jan 30 09:06:33 <infobot> ~pong
Jan 30 09:06:37 <crashanddie> nope
Jan 30 09:06:54 <Proteous> 01:00 -!- Netsplit *.net <-> *.split quits: Gilly, HouseAway, kurtan, Shapeshifter, infobot, tybollt
Jan 30 09:06:57 <Proteous> 01:02 -!- Netsplit over, joins: kurtan, Shapeshifter, infobot, Gilly, HouseAway, tybollt
Jan 30 09:07:02 <Proteous> anyway, wasn't asking
Jan 30 09:07:12 <Proteous> I was questioning doc|home's comment
Jan 30 09:07:21 <crashanddie> oh my bad, didn't see it
Jan 30 09:07:28 <Proteous> :)
Jan 30 09:08:17 <pupnik> well that wasn't so painful, now was it
Jan 30 09:08:39 <Proteous> my eyes are still red from all the crying when you all left me
Jan 30 09:08:48 <doc|home> Proteous: no, just the netsplit itself
Jan 30 09:08:49 <crashanddie> pupnik: I can make it painful for you
Jan 30 09:11:53 <crashanddie> bloody hell
Jan 30 09:12:15 <crashanddie> fucking line umpires can't just change a match like that!
Jan 30 09:12:25 <Proteous> this is #maemo
Jan 30 09:12:39 <Proteous> you know, a channel about the maemo OS?
Jan 30 09:12:51 <Proteous> not facebook
Jan 30 09:12:57 <Stskeeps> #bacon
Jan 30 09:13:05 <Proteous> must join #bacon
Jan 30 09:13:25 <crashanddie> I don't think I interrupted any important discussion?
Jan 30 09:13:35 <crashanddie> Proteous: and if you're unhappy, that's all the same
Jan 30 09:13:54 <Proteous> all the same as what?
Jan 30 09:14:06 <pwnguin> http://www.flickr.com/photos/qole2/2967497897/
Jan 30 09:14:07 <crashanddie> as in: I don't care?
Jan 30 09:14:10 <Proteous> same as in interrupted discussion?
Jan 30 09:14:13 <pwnguin> can anyone identify that keyboard?
Jan 30 09:14:14 <Proteous> I don't get it
Jan 30 09:14:25 <crashanddie> Proteous: I don't care about your opinion
Jan 30 09:14:30 <crashanddie> clear enough for you
Jan 30 09:14:31 <Proteous> really?
Jan 30 09:14:31 <crashanddie> ?
Jan 30 09:14:38 <Proteous> I'm suprised
Jan 30 09:14:40 <Proteous> but just a little
Jan 30 09:14:48 <Proteous> if that is possible
Jan 30 09:15:23 <crashanddie> for crying out loud, I'm just commenting on a tennis match, do you really need to troll on everything?
Jan 30 09:15:38 <Proteous> wow, for soemone who doesn't care about my opinion you sure do talk to me a lot
Jan 30 09:16:12 <RST38h> Fight! Fight!
Jan 30 09:16:36 <RST38h> In the Arena of Death!
Jan 30 09:29:00 <jkimball4> is there a command to reload icons?
Jan 30 09:29:05 <jkimball4> i got a couple blue squares here..
Jan 30 09:29:12 <Proteous> a reboot usualy helps
Jan 30 09:29:34 <jkimball4> if i were on windows then yeah
Jan 30 09:29:40 <Proteous> :P
Jan 30 09:29:44 <Proteous> even helps on a n900
Jan 30 09:29:55 <Proteous> did you try it an it didn't solve the problem?
Jan 30 09:29:56 <jkimball4> usually in *nix land we don't need to reboot
Jan 30 09:30:12 <jkimball4> i'm not going to reboot for an icon hehe
Jan 30 09:30:25 <Proteous> to easy for ya huh
Jan 30 09:30:27 <jkimball4> i just remembered hearing about a proggie to do it
Jan 30 09:33:35 <jkimball4> ah..looks like someone said there's no more icon chace
Jan 30 09:33:38 <jkimball4> cache
Jan 30 09:34:56 <Proteous> you could try removing the shortcut then readding it I guess
Jan 30 09:42:15 <Stskeeps> for other people interested in what a distmaster -actually- does, http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?p=502204#post502204
Jan 30 10:04:29 * MohammadAG wonders why his motor vibrates for 5 minutes, then breaks again for a week
Jan 30 10:09:36 <acidjazz> .
Jan 30 10:09:39 <acidjazz> sweet
Jan 30 10:09:48 <acidjazz> that was odd i didnt get the notification to register
Jan 30 10:11:43 <crashanddie> anyone watching the game (henin vs williams)?
Jan 30 10:12:52 <slonopotamus> ouch
Jan 30 10:18:30 <wazd> Heya all
Jan 30 10:19:03 <Stskeeps> morning wazd
Jan 30 10:19:05 <Stskeeps> how are you doing?
Jan 30 10:19:40 <wazd> Freezing, waiting for the bus)
Jan 30 10:19:44 <Stskeeps> hehe
Jan 30 10:19:46 <acidjazz> man this hoarding show is totally freaky
Jan 30 10:21:00 <flux> hmph, is there a way to open links in tabs with the firefox mobile, without keyboard?
Jan 30 10:21:16 <acidjazz> well
Jan 30 10:21:22 <acidjazz> in ff ctrl+click does a passive tab open to a link
Jan 30 10:21:27 <acidjazz> shift+click is a new window
Jan 30 10:21:44 <acidjazz> try those or im ugessing no
Jan 30 10:22:24 <flux> however, ctrl and shift are both on the keyboard :)
Jan 30 10:24:04 <wazd> Stskeeps: i think i'm gonna release marina 1.0 today
Jan 30 10:24:25 <wazd> Stskeeps: screw that black inputs
Jan 30 10:26:14 <w00t> wazd: having problems with them still?
Jan 30 10:26:33 <w00t> (updated, btw, the active window brown text is .. much more readable! :P)
Jan 30 10:27:26 <wazd> W00t: yeah, its simply impossible to make em black
Jan 30 10:27:55 <wazd> Without ruining everything else
Jan 30 10:27:58 <w00t> :(
Jan 30 10:32:46 <aquatix> moin
Jan 30 10:33:13 <Stskeeps> moin
Jan 30 10:35:01 <crashanddie> evening
Jan 30 10:35:22 <chaoyi> hello, any one could help me about my n900 keyboard?
Jan 30 10:35:57 <crashanddie> it works a lot better when you actually ask a question...
Jan 30 10:36:58 <chaoyi> when i press shift + blue arrow + J, it is as if k is pressed too
Jan 30 10:37:34 <crashanddie> what is shift + blue arrow + J supposed to yield?
Jan 30 10:37:52 <Stskeeps> wazd: when are you back on a desktop btw?
Jan 30 10:38:01 <chaoyi> ")" symbol,  i think
Jan 30 10:38:23 <crashanddie> chaoyi: isn't that simply blue arrow + j?
Jan 30 10:38:30 <chaoyi> but it displays ")&", same think for shift arrow + k
Jan 30 10:38:54 <crashanddie> chaoyi: don't use shift
Jan 30 10:38:56 <chaoyi> crashanddie: yes, but i am trying to remap level 3
Jan 30 10:39:12 <crashanddie> well obviously the multiplexing is causing issues
Jan 30 10:39:37 <chaoyi> crashanddie: seems like other keys do not have this problem except j k
Jan 30 10:39:53 <crashanddie> chaoyi: j and k work fine on their own?
Jan 30 10:39:59 <chaoyi> yes
Jan 30 10:40:31 <crashanddie> i dunno
Jan 30 10:41:01 <chaoyi> crashanddie: thank you all the same; i am not sure it's only the problem of my keyboard
Jan 30 10:43:05 <chaoyi> crashanddie: would any one has a n900 type "shift + blue arrow + j" in the terminal and see if there are two symbols ")&" pops up?
Jan 30 10:43:15 <crashanddie> chaoyi: sure, hang on
Jan 30 10:43:25 <chaoyi> crashanddie: thank you crashanddie
Jan 30 10:44:06 <crashanddie> chaoyi: confirmed, same behaviour here
Jan 30 10:44:42 <chaoyi> crashanddie: thank you, guess i should skip these two for remapping on level 3
Jan 30 10:44:58 <fragment> I get ); instead
Jan 30 10:45:20 <crashanddie> fragment: you probably have a specific key layout?
Jan 30 10:45:36 <fragment> crashanddie: finnish/swedish keymap
Jan 30 10:45:40 <wazd> Derp
Jan 30 10:45:42 <crashanddie> chaoyi: interesting bug though, could you check bmo to see if there's a bug for it
Jan 30 10:45:45 <crashanddie> ?
Jan 30 10:46:28 <fragment> crashanddie: same with the key "k"
Jan 30 10:46:51 <crashanddie> fragment: yes, j and k do the same
Jan 30 10:47:13 <DocScrutinizer> crashanddie: It should be safe now to set chanmode to -q $~a
Jan 30 10:47:20 <fragment> z and x produce euro sign and $
Jan 30 10:47:34 <crashanddie> DocScrutinizer: there's a q?
Jan 30 10:47:48 <DocScrutinizer> that's the new -/+R
Jan 30 10:47:59 <crashanddie> hmm
Jan 30 10:48:01 <crashanddie> hang on
Jan 30 10:48:57 <crashanddie> DocScrutinizer: we only have R when there's bots
Jan 30 10:49:12 <crashanddie_> !op
Jan 30 10:50:41 <chaoyi> crashanddie: couldn't find related info in bmo, i use keyword "keyboard" "rx-51"
Jan 30 10:51:13 <crashanddie> DocScrutinizer: do you have a website documenting the new registered mask?
Jan 30 10:51:25 <DocScrutinizer> #freenode
Jan 30 10:51:43 <crashanddie> meh, was hoping for a blogpost or something
Jan 30 10:51:50 <crashanddie> damn... Henin lost :(
Jan 30 10:53:28 <DocScrutinizer> [2010-01-30 10:17:25] <mquin> DocScrutinizer: it will have been translated to '+q $~a'
Jan 30 10:53:55 <crashanddie> "Traditionally, full moon was associated with strange behaviour among humans and animals. It was believed that full moon leads to temporal insomnia, insanity, and magical phenomenon like lycanthropy. But psychologists state that the connection is nonexistent."
Jan 30 10:54:10 <crashanddie> my favourite sentence of the month: who writes this shit?
Jan 30 10:54:37 <crashanddie> "psychologists" debunked werewolfs?
Jan 30 10:55:44 <DocScrutinizer> crashanddie: http://freenode.net/using_the_network.shtml is as good as it gets for now I think
Jan 30 10:57:05 <crashanddie> yeah, aware of that, I'm guessing the new q filter is due to the new hyperion version
Jan 30 10:57:08 <range> Yeah. +q $~a doesn't tell the user to go and register anymore, though. +R's behaviour was better.
Jan 30 10:57:11 <DocScrutinizer> crashanddie: anyway -q $~a is confirmed to remove ""+R"" for #openmoko*
Jan 30 10:57:39 <DocScrutinizer> no hyperion version. ircd
Jan 30 10:58:57 <`0660> crashanddie, in that quote it is only said that psychologists say there is no connection between werewolfes and full moon
Jan 30 10:59:21 <`0660> they say nothing about werewolfes being not real :)
Jan 30 11:00:09 <crashanddie> well they say there is no connection between lycanthropy and full moon... and what's a werewolf without a full moon? just a big wolf
Jan 30 11:00:19 <jaska> howling in frustration
Jan 30 11:05:02 <GeneralAntilles> crashanddie, having worked retail quite extensively. I can tell you that those "psychologists" are full of shit. :D
Jan 30 11:05:15 <crashanddie> hahaha
Jan 30 11:06:25 <GeneralAntilles> crashanddie, also: leaving both bathroom doors open (they face eathother across the room) and allowing their mirrors to reflect one another creates a vortex.
Jan 30 11:07:02 <GeneralAntilles> Stskeeps, transparency my ass! I smell karma whoring. :P
Jan 30 11:07:40 <crashanddie> yeah, I'm removing my thanks from that post Stskeeps !
Jan 30 11:08:12 <wazd> GeneralAntilles: check out his signature, Sherlock :D
Jan 30 11:08:34 <thresh> moroning
Jan 30 11:08:52 <wazd> Thresh: moaning
Jan 30 11:09:07 <GeneralAntilles> God that's depressing. the N900 is losing out to the freaking Blackberry.
Jan 30 11:09:10 <Stskeeps> GeneralAntilles: heh
Jan 30 11:09:34 <Stskeeps> GeneralAntilles: at least i can point people to this when they ask what i -actually- do around here
Jan 30 11:09:37 <Stskeeps> :P
Jan 30 11:10:04 <GeneralAntilles> Stskeeps, yeah, yeah.
Jan 30 11:12:03 <wazd> E63 is the best blackberry
Jan 30 11:12:18 <wazd> N900 can't  stand a chance
Jan 30 11:12:32 <Stskeeps> as a blackberry, yeah
Jan 30 11:13:58 <wazd> I wonder if anyone will be sued for "blueberry" trademark :D
Jan 30 11:14:50 <DocScrutinizer> GeneralAntilles: crashanddie: http://blog.freenode.net/
Jan 30 11:15:30 <DocScrutinizer> not much on +R recommendation getting obsolete. But it's obviously self evident
Jan 30 11:15:54 * SpeedEvil ponders a burberry n900 case.
Jan 30 11:16:18 <wazd> Barbery Bold :D
Jan 30 11:18:17 <wazd> ~seen qwerty12
Jan 30 11:18:19 <infobot> qwerty12 <n=faheem@Maemo/community/contributor/qwerty12> was last seen on IRC in channel #maemo, 57d 16h 54m 20s ago, saying: 'Khertan: "As of hildon 2.2, HildonDialog has been deprecated in favor of GtkDialog. "'.
Jan 30 11:18:27 <wazd> Heh
Jan 30 11:18:40 <wazd> That's the spirit
Jan 30 11:24:25 <GeneralAntilles> We seriously need to fix the default Bugzilla search.
Jan 30 11:25:08 <lbt> hmm does maemo sponsor freenode at all?
Jan 30 11:25:09 <LuciusMare> hello
Jan 30 11:25:17 <GeneralAntilles> lbt, not that I'm aware of.
Jan 30 11:25:43 <GeneralAntilles> Of the 3651 bugs filed in the past 4 months, 555 have been marked DUPLICATE.
Jan 30 11:25:55 <lbt> seems like the council should throw something their way?
Jan 30 11:25:56 <LuciusMare> i tried "mplayer v4l2:///dev/video0" but it does not work - what is the right command?
Jan 30 11:26:00 <SpeedEvil> 3651! slacker!
Jan 30 11:26:01 <SpeedEvil> :)
Jan 30 11:26:13 <SpeedEvil> mplayer tv:// -tv device=/dev/video0
Jan 30 11:26:16 <GeneralAntilles> lbt, of their personal funds?
Jan 30 11:26:20 <LuciusMare> oh
Jan 30 11:26:24 <SpeedEvil> also - remember to open the pod-bay-doors.
Jan 30 11:26:26 <lbt> GeneralAntilles: no :)
Jan 30 11:26:38 <GeneralAntilles> lbt, well, there's no discretionary fund as of yet. ;)
Jan 30 11:26:40 <LuciusMare> SpeedEvil: so, no video 4 linux? Okay,then
Jan 30 11:26:46 <lbt> it just seems that #maemo and the rest are really valuable to the community
Jan 30 11:26:48 <Stskeeps> lbt, sponsoring freenode gives me lilo vibes
Jan 30 11:26:49 <Stskeeps> :P
Jan 30 11:27:10 <SpeedEvil> LuciusMare: it's a v4l2 source - I haven'/t seen that form of invocation for mplayer
Jan 30 11:27:12 * lbt prefers grub
Jan 30 11:27:36 * SpeedEvil still uses lilo.
Jan 30 11:27:52 <SpeedEvil> Does what it says on the tin.
Jan 30 11:28:06 <LuciusMare> hm
Jan 30 11:28:06 <lbt> GeneralAntilles: have you used Novell's bugzill
Jan 30 11:28:08 <lbt> a
Jan 30 11:28:09 <LuciusMare> thanks
Jan 30 11:28:14 <slonopotamus> ~ping
Jan 30 11:28:14 <infobot> ~pong
Jan 30 11:28:18 <GeneralAntilles> lbt, not recently.
Jan 30 11:28:21 <lbt> seriously worth a quick look
Jan 30 11:28:31 <GeneralAntilles> lbt, I think I poked around it a while ago for the same reason you're telling me now.
Jan 30 11:28:34 <lbt> Step 1 of 3 - has your bug already been reported?
Jan 30 11:28:45 <GeneralAntilles> lbt, guided submission form.
Jan 30 11:28:47 <lbt> practically forces a search
Jan 30 11:28:48 <lbt> yes
Jan 30 11:28:51 <GeneralAntilles> lbt, blocking on 3.4
Jan 30 11:29:04 <lbt> nah, it allows a straight submit
Jan 30 11:29:10 <lbt> *waaaay* down the page :)
Jan 30 11:29:21 <GeneralAntilles> lbt, no, we're blocking on that with the 3.4 upgrade. :)
Jan 30 11:29:29 <lbt> oh
Jan 30 11:29:53 <lbt> Is it part of std bugzilla now?
Jan 30 11:30:17 <GeneralAntilles> It's part of bugzilla in 2.2.
Jan 30 11:30:27 <GeneralAntilles> But there have been some improvements with 3.4
Jan 30 11:30:34 <GeneralAntilles> and we want to do a number of our own, too.
Jan 30 11:30:53 <lbt> *nod* - granny + eggs eh? <grin>
Jan 30 11:31:36 <GeneralAntilles> lbt, if somebody could con tekojo into giving Karsten some more hours to work on it. . . . ;)
Jan 30 11:32:01 <lbt> he's not doing bzilla is he?
Jan 30 11:32:11 <GeneralAntilles> He's working on the 3.4 upgrade.
Jan 30 11:32:29 <lbt> he should blog about this stuff
Jan 30 11:32:32 <GeneralAntilles> Remember, he was the technical part of the Bugmaster position until Nokia poached him. . . .
Jan 30 11:32:40 <GeneralAntilles> He has been, I think.
Jan 30 11:32:59 <GeneralAntilles> http://blogs.gnome.org/kbrae/
Jan 30 11:33:24 <lbt> is that syndicated?
Jan 30 11:33:26 <lbt> to planet?
Jan 30 11:33:37 <GeneralAntilles> Yes
Jan 30 11:33:59 <Stskeeps> 30BAAAKIN: that's such an illegal nickname
Jan 30 11:34:32 <Quibus> Hahahaha! :D
Jan 30 11:36:57 * RST38h moos at all the present
Jan 30 11:37:10 <jophish> in which repository is portmap?
Jan 30 11:37:46 * Corsac moos RST38h 
Jan 30 11:38:02 * SpeedEvil turns Corsacbox upside down again
Jan 30 11:38:40 * lbt loww back
Jan 30 11:38:43 * Corsac moos again
Jan 30 11:38:53 <lbt> s/loww/lows/
Jan 30 11:39:00 <Corsac> well technically a Corsac is a fox so “moo” might not be exactly accurate
Jan 30 11:39:38 * wazd moos back with his lowest voice
Jan 30 11:39:42 <SpeedEvil> Corsac: Only for animals that conform to their stereotypes.
Jan 30 11:40:12 <RST38h> wazd: how is suffering today? =)
Jan 30 11:41:42 <crashanddie> test
Jan 30 11:41:45 <crashanddie> s/blue/green/
Jan 30 11:42:07 <crashanddie> blue
Jan 30 11:42:09 <crashanddie> s/blue/green/
Jan 30 11:42:10 <infobot> crashanddie meant: green
Jan 30 11:42:18 * crashanddie test
Jan 30 11:42:22 <crashanddie> s/test/action/
Jan 30 11:42:27 <crashanddie> interesting
Jan 30 11:43:10 <jophish> would somebody be able to post their /etc/apt/sources.list?
Jan 30 11:44:20 <jophish> when trying to install nfs-common, it is no in any of my repos, however it is referenced by other packages. portmap is not available at all
Jan 30 11:44:44 <wazd> Rst38h: my knee hurts, I'm freezing, well, really good :)
Jan 30 11:44:58 <RST38h> wazd: at least the lights are on
Jan 30 11:45:00 <RST38h> =)
Jan 30 11:45:20 <wazd> Rst38h: heh)
Jan 30 11:46:17 <wazd> It's cold even in subway
Jan 30 11:46:19 <RST38h> wazd: And, thanks to Steve Jobs, we can all be looking forward to a Maemo tablet =)
Jan 30 11:46:28 <wazd> Maybe I'm sick (
Jan 30 11:47:00 <wazd> rst38h: in 2 years)
Jan 30 11:47:56 <RST38h> wazd: Well, trips to the Moon are cancelled for at least 10 years, so maemotablet looks like a really nice goal at 2 years =)
Jan 30 11:48:47 <wazd> Maemo team needs it's own Steve Jobs :)
Jan 30 11:48:55 * wazd whistles
Jan 30 11:49:24 <RST38h> Then they would be doing something completely different
Jan 30 11:49:43 <RST38h> as to not to copy the original Steve =)
Jan 30 11:49:52 <wazd> Sure)
Jan 30 11:49:59 <wazd> That's the plan)
Jan 30 11:51:14 <wazd> Pixel Qi screen + stantum touchscreen + modified wacom pen
Jan 30 11:51:21 <zaheerm> nPad
Jan 30 11:51:32 <wazd> No
Jan 30 11:51:37 <wazd> N 985236
Jan 30 11:53:30 <RST38h> wazd: Wholething made by Wacom and sold for $5999.99
Jan 30 11:53:35 <wazd> Stantum for positioning, pen with some wireless channel,small battery and pressure reader
Jan 30 11:53:49 <wazd> RsT38h: yeah
Jan 30 11:53:52 <crashanddie> how about a phone with a triple screen?
Jan 30 11:53:56 <RST38h> BTW, as someone already mentioned, iPad seems to make a hell of a table game platform
Jan 30 11:54:08 <crashanddie> when it's closed, two of the screens are protected, and you have 1 screen facing outwards
Jan 30 11:54:08 <zaheerm> and given free to all with positive karma on maemo.org?
Jan 30 11:54:09 <RST38h> Like Microsoft Surface only handheld and affordable
Jan 30 11:54:09 <wazd> Rst38h: and it's 30" screen)
Jan 30 11:54:21 <zaheerm> RST38h, i prefer my pool table :)
Jan 30 11:54:22 <crashanddie> so that you can use it without unfolding it
Jan 30 11:54:34 <RST38h> zaheerm: does it show pretty images too? =)
Jan 30 11:54:44 <wazd> RsT38h: 9"? Don't think so
Jan 30 11:54:54 <RST38h> wazd: It is sufficient, really
Jan 30 11:55:05 <zaheerm> RST38h, depends how good your shots are :)
Jan 30 11:55:10 <wazd> Rst38h: nah)
Jan 30 11:55:11 <RST38h> wazd: consider the size of a typical table game foldout
Jan 30 11:55:21 <wazd> Rst38h: 15"
Jan 30 11:55:25 <zaheerm> table games are 6 feet long
Jan 30 11:55:29 <wazd> Rst38h: or even more
Jan 30 11:55:38 <RST38h> wazd: diagonally? yea, sounds right
Jan 30 11:55:40 <zaheerm> or even 9 feet
Jan 30 11:55:52 <wazd> RsT38h: have you seen em lately?)
Jan 30 11:56:00 <zaheerm> we need an iPad maxi
Jan 30 11:56:04 <RST38h> wazd: But can 9" do at the cost of making pieces smaller?
Jan 30 11:56:18 <RST38h> wazd: Yea, lots of D&D people around
Jan 30 11:56:22 <zaheerm> you talking about chess/draughts ?
Jan 30 11:56:44 <RST38h> wazd: Even publishing their own magazine with their own game knockoffs and making their own pieces
Jan 30 11:56:54 <wazd> RsT38h: then you can use n900 for that :)
Jan 30 11:57:05 <RST38h> wazd: Some plastic factory in Gelendzhik (yea, I know ;)) makes and sells them
Jan 30 11:57:20 <RST38h> wazd: I would be willing to try implementing something like that on n900
Jan 30 11:57:46 <RST38h> wazd: Provided somebody does the artwork
Jan 30 11:57:55 <wazd> RsT38h: things like warhammer anf suff have its worth in handpainted figures, not field
Jan 30 11:58:30 <wazd> RsT38h: and you can play monopoly via snes emu :P
Jan 30 11:58:41 <RST38h> wazd: Yea, but have you ever played Japanese strategy stuff? Like the Final Fantasy Tactics?
Jan 30 11:58:52 <wazd> RsT38h: on PS
Jan 30 11:59:00 <RST38h> wazd: Well I played the GBA version
Jan 30 11:59:17 <RST38h> wazd: Imagine something like that on a larger board with networking
Jan 30 12:06:33 <plastun> hello, how to remove package from extras-devel? is it possible?
Jan 30 12:07:16 <RST38h> Ask X-Fade, he will do it for you
Jan 30 12:07:25 <RST38h> jeremiah can also help
Jan 30 12:07:39 <Arkenoi> how do i restart contacts widget without reboot? https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=8691 <- this bug is damn annoying
Jan 30 12:07:40 <povbot> Bug 8691: Contacts widget crashing when trying to place SIP call
Jan 30 12:08:30 <RST38h> Arkenoi: if cycling it does not help, ps -ax | grep telepathy and kill by pid
Jan 30 12:11:26 <Arkenoi> RST38h, nope, killing telepathy does restart communication services but does not affect desktop widgets
Jan 30 12:14:16 <RST38h> Arkenoi: Hmm then
Jan 30 12:14:26 * RST38h is not exactly sure WHAT crashes for Arkenoi
Jan 30 12:15:13 <Arkenoi> rst38h: contacts desktop widget. it dies taking all contacts off desktop
Jan 30 12:15:26 <Arkenoi> until reboot
Jan 30 12:15:33 <Arkenoi> as i know now way to restart it
Jan 30 12:16:38 <RST38h> Arkenoi: go to edit-desktop, disable it, enable it again?
Jan 30 12:17:07 <Arkenoi> rst38h: disable what?
Jan 30 12:18:26 <RST38h> Aerkenoi: oh shit, there IS nothing to disable =(
Jan 30 12:18:34 * RST38h understands the problem now
Jan 30 12:22:58 <Arkenoi> rst38h: seems that placing sip call in "bad state" may crash almost anything whatever app it initiated it. quite strange architecture..
Jan 30 12:24:17 <RST38h> Arkenoi: When you see konttori here, please, bring this bug to his attention
Jan 30 12:24:34 <RST38h> Arkenoi: It is stability related, so theoretically should get top priority
Jan 30 12:25:35 <achipa> is there something cuckoo with the builders ?
Jan 30 12:25:42 <achipa> I just managed to somehow build the same package twice (at least it got built two times in a row...)
Jan 30 12:32:39 <RST38h> armel and i386 maybe?
Jan 30 12:33:49 <LuciusMare> hi, i dont know if this can be caused also by the maemo, but - i have ssh server running on my tablet, i connected to it, with -X and ran an app that needs X, but it ran on the tablet
Jan 30 12:34:27 <inz> yeah, some scripts override the DISPLAY env var
Jan 30 12:34:36 <inz> i notived that too
Jan 30 12:38:34 <LuciusMare> so, how did you solve it?
Jan 30 12:41:53 <LuciusMare> hm - "echo $DISPLAY → :0
Jan 30 12:41:56 <LuciusMare> argh
Jan 30 12:42:11 <LuciusMare> s/:0/:0.0/
Jan 30 12:42:31 <LuciusMare> so this might be the problem?
Jan 30 12:44:40 <inz> lucius, yep, with ssh the display is usually :10, but that didnt help for me
Jan 30 12:44:51 <inz> seems that the x11 forwarding is broken
Jan 30 12:45:04 <inz> missing xhost or sth
Jan 30 12:46:29 <LuciusMare> aw
Jan 30 12:46:31 <LuciusMare> that sucks
Jan 30 12:53:21 <LuciusMare> *ack*
Jan 30 12:53:36 <LuciusMare> there is a sshd instance on my tablet
Jan 30 12:53:46 <LuciusMare> no matter how many times i kill it, it always appears again
Jan 30 12:55:17 <GeneralAntilles> Uninstall it . . . ?
Jan 30 12:55:38 <LuciusMare> i want it to run only at specified times, no need to have it always running
Jan 30 12:56:07 <GeneralAntilles> How are you "killing" it?
Jan 30 12:56:41 <LuciusMare> "ps aux|grep sshd|awk '{ print $1 }'|xargs kill" ;)
Jan 30 12:56:50 <GeneralAntilles> How about "stop sshd"? :)
Jan 30 12:56:57 <LuciusMare> well
Jan 30 12:57:07 <LuciusMare> that didnt appear in my mind
Jan 30 12:57:13 <LuciusMare> but what else does it do, than killing it?
Jan 30 12:57:26 <LuciusMare> also, it also always runs with -D
Jan 30 12:57:42 <GeneralAntilles> You're going through upstart that way.
Jan 30 12:58:38 <Quibus> What's the typical time before someone responds to a request for an extras account on garage?
Jan 30 12:58:52 <LuciusMare> "while [1]; do; ps aux|grep sshd|awk '{ print $1 }'|xargs kill; sleep 2 ;done"
Jan 30 12:58:55 <LuciusMare> ;)
Jan 30 12:59:39 <SpeedEvil> awk '/sshd/{print $1}'
Jan 30 13:00:03 <SpeedEvil> or even awk '/sshd/{system("kill "$1}'
Jan 30 13:00:30 <LuciusMare> heh, the only command i know for awk is print $numberofcollumn
Jan 30 13:00:33 <LuciusMare> ^^
Jan 30 13:00:36 <GeneralAntilles> Quibus, 48 hours.
Jan 30 13:00:39 <SpeedEvil> or more sanely, kill `pidof sshd`
Jan 30 13:00:42 <GeneralAntilles> Quibus, weekdays.
Jan 30 13:01:12 <LuciusMare> pidof sshd|xargs kill
Jan 30 13:02:09 <LuciusMare> anyway,what does it do? the /sshd/system... ?
Jan 30 13:03:32 <flux> luciusmare, how about 'stop sshd'
Jan 30 13:03:46 <LuciusMare> hah
Jan 30 13:03:48 <SpeedEvil>  /foo/ is a pattern. {action} is an action - it is run every time the pattern matches.
Jan 30 13:03:59 <LuciusMare> oh
Jan 30 13:04:01 <LuciusMare> nice,thanks
Jan 30 13:04:07 <flux> luciusmare, and you can start it again with 'start'
Jan 30 13:04:08 <SpeedEvil> So '/foo/{print "I saw foo"}/bar/{print "I saw bar"}
Jan 30 13:04:47 <spectre-> hola!
Jan 30 13:04:48 <acidjazz> HAI
Jan 30 13:04:48 <SpeedEvil> Patterns can also be expressions - such as awk '!a[$4]++'
Jan 30 13:04:54 <acidjazz> who here is writing python apps
Jan 30 13:05:10 <SpeedEvil> This if the 4th column has not been seen before - prints it.
Jan 30 13:05:14 <acidjazz> is this regex talk
Jan 30 13:05:23 <SpeedEvil> awk
Jan 30 13:05:31 <acidjazz> <3 awk
Jan 30 13:05:38 <spectre-> ditto
Jan 30 13:05:47 <LuciusMare> sed!
Jan 30 13:05:52 <LuciusMare> :D
Jan 30 13:06:02 <acidjazz> u know what also rules
Jan 30 13:06:02 <acidjazz> ack
Jan 30 13:06:22 * SpeedEvil has used awk for realtime DSP.
Jan 30 13:06:50 <SpeedEvil> (GPS + awk + soundcard hooked to car injector = realtime miles per gallon reading
Jan 30 13:06:57 <LuciusMare> http://www.pmptoday.com/2009/12/09/nokia-n900-to-get-firefox-mobile/ ?
Jan 30 13:07:10 <acidjazz> lol
Jan 30 13:07:14 <SpeedEvil> it's already available.
Jan 30 13:07:16 <Quibus> GeneralAntilles: thanks
Jan 30 13:07:23 <SpeedEvil> Look at firefox.com/m/
Jan 30 13:07:25 <SpeedEvil> IIRC
Jan 30 13:07:37 <SpeedEvil> but it uses a bit too much RAM at the moment
Jan 30 13:08:10 <LuciusMare> hm
Jan 30 13:08:32 * Alterego thinks xchat needs a few tweaks.
Jan 30 13:08:55 <acidjazz> doesnt the n900 run ff?
Jan 30 13:09:12 <acidjazz> wtf u doin usin xchat
Jan 30 13:09:15 <acidjazz> all about irssi
Jan 30 13:09:18 <SpeedEvil> acidjazz: yes.
Jan 30 13:09:23 <SpeedEvil> xchat is nice.
Jan 30 13:09:29 <SpeedEvil> and yes
Jan 30 13:09:36 <SpeedEvil> scrolly xchat would be nice
Jan 30 13:09:52 <acidjazz> irssi
Jan 30 13:09:53 <acidjazz> pageup
Jan 30 13:09:55 <acidjazz> pagedown
Jan 30 13:10:06 <acidjazz> implement swipe up and down in x terminal to pageup pagedown booya
Jan 30 13:10:17 <SpeedEvil> go do it!
Jan 30 13:10:25 <SpeedEvil> implement it in screen
Jan 30 13:10:35 <Corsac> hmhm, can someone try to edit a contact address and change the country?
Jan 30 13:10:36 <SpeedEvil> so you can bind gestures to a keystroke.
Jan 30 13:10:36 <acidjazz> DONE
Jan 30 13:10:47 <acidjazz> u don tneed to do it in screen
Jan 30 13:10:48 <Corsac> I only have a text field which but I can't save anything
Jan 30 13:10:49 <SpeedEvil> based on the xterm already existing mouse support
Jan 30 13:11:01 <acidjazz> yea SpeedEvil
Jan 30 13:11:02 <acidjazz> well
Jan 30 13:11:03 <acidjazz> no
Jan 30 13:11:10 <acidjazz> id do it at the term level itself
Jan 30 13:11:15 <acidjazz> the client
Jan 30 13:11:22 * lcuk wants mind control interface for my flying car
Jan 30 13:11:30 <SpeedEvil> doing it in screen means you can use any terminal on any platform though
Jan 30 13:11:33 <acidjazz> LOOK ITS 2010 OK
Jan 30 13:11:44 <acidjazz> THE FUCK ARE THE FLYING CARS ALRD
Jan 30 13:11:53 <lcuk> yeah, so wheres my damned duke nukem forever
Jan 30 13:11:53 <acidjazz> android terminal does it
Jan 30 13:12:00 <LuciusMare> also
Jan 30 13:12:03 <LuciusMare> its fucking 2010
Jan 30 13:12:04 <SpeedEvil> acidjazz: I have plans for a hoverboard.
Jan 30 13:12:12 <LuciusMare> and majority of us are still using mainly cli apps
Jan 30 13:12:15 <acidjazz> lol when i was a boy
Jan 30 13:12:21 <acidjazz> and back to the future came out
Jan 30 13:12:25 <SpeedEvil> acidjazz: ~80cm*80cm*20cm ~60Kg. 4Km altitude in 5 mins
Jan 30 13:12:27 <lcuk> they are coming, quadrocopters make for a decent platform
Jan 30 13:12:31 <acidjazz> i remember a rumor at school they sold hoverboards at uhm
Jan 30 13:12:39 <acidjazz> universal studios
Jan 30 13:12:43 <LuciusMare> haha
Jan 30 13:12:47 <SpeedEvil> acidjazz: $60000 or so in small quantities.
Jan 30 13:12:51 <acidjazz> i begged for my LIFE to get one to my parents
Jan 30 13:12:58 <SpeedEvil> acidjazz: though alas quite illegal to ride.
Jan 30 13:13:02 <LuciusMare> WAIT A MINUTE
Jan 30 13:13:09 <LuciusMare> you begged for your llife?
Jan 30 13:13:38 <acidjazz> in trade of my life
Jan 30 13:13:43 <acidjazz> i would hold my breath
Jan 30 13:13:46 <acidjazz> until i was blue
Jan 30 13:13:46 <LuciusMare> :)
Jan 30 13:13:49 <LuciusMare> oh
Jan 30 13:13:52 <LuciusMare> pretty normal
Jan 30 13:14:04 <Corsac> in fact the country seems hardcoded to *my* country
Jan 30 13:14:09 <LuciusMare> i thought of "i would kill myself if you would give me the hoverboard!"
Jan 30 13:14:25 <acidjazz> yea i worded it wrong
Jan 30 13:14:31 <acidjazz> which country Corsac
Jan 30 13:14:46 <acidjazz> wtf would you need countrys in contacts
Jan 30 13:14:53 <LuciusMare> +1
Jan 30 13:14:57 <acidjazz> you konw that many ppl?
Jan 30 13:15:13 <LuciusMare> I personally see no use for the "gender" collumn anyway
Jan 30 13:15:36 <lcuk> acidjazz, please dont insult users who do things differently to you
Jan 30 13:15:41 <lcuk> :P
Jan 30 13:15:41 <acidjazz> lol
Jan 30 13:15:54 <SpeedEvil> acidjazz: consider - you're in belgium - and you're given a local number for someone in the UK by a german.
Jan 30 13:15:56 <acidjazz> i dont mean to insult w/ logical reason
Jan 30 13:16:25 <lcuk> and cant hermes like install all 7000000000 of your facebook contacts
Jan 30 13:16:31 <acidjazz> fuck hermes
Jan 30 13:16:37 <LuciusMare> hermes?
Jan 30 13:16:40 <acidjazz> that shit messes it up bad
Jan 30 13:16:42 <acidjazz> dont try it
Jan 30 13:16:52 <Corsac> acidjazz: hen you enter an address
Jan 30 13:17:15 <Corsac> acidjazz: in my case, when I add an address to a contact, the country is hardcoded to France
Jan 30 13:17:59 <acidjazz> thats odd
Jan 30 13:18:06 <acidjazz> i never noticed a country
Jan 30 13:18:46 <acidjazz> yea dood no country
Jan 30 13:18:50 <acidjazz> are you talkin about maemo?
Jan 30 13:19:11 <LuciusMare> Holy crap why did i just read your nick as "acidjizz?"
Jan 30 13:19:24 <acidjazz> origina
Jan 30 13:19:25 <acidjazz> l
Jan 30 13:19:33 <ieatlint> acidjazz, are you on meth? or perhaps a tad manic?
Jan 30 13:19:49 <acidjazz> just not really paying attention i guess
Jan 30 13:20:43 <jophish> when trying to install nfs-common, it is no in any of my repos, however it is referenced by other packages. portmap is not available at all
Jan 30 13:21:57 <Corsac> acidjazz: try to add an address to a contact
Jan 30 13:22:13 <Corsac> I submitted #8693 in case you want the steps
Jan 30 13:22:42 <acidjazz> mines defaulted to usa
Jan 30 13:22:45 <lcuk> bug #8693
Jan 30 13:22:46 <povbot> Bug https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=8693 contact country address hardcoded to the owner's country
Jan 30 13:22:50 <acidjazz> sorry i was looking @ fields not addresses
Jan 30 13:22:55 <acidjazz> whats the bug?
Jan 30 13:23:03 <Corsac> that I can't change the country
Jan 30 13:23:37 <Corsac> can you?
Jan 30 13:23:43 <acidjazz> yup
Jan 30 13:23:46 <acidjazz> made a contact from tunisia
Jan 30 13:23:47 <andre__> known bug
Jan 30 13:23:47 <ieatlint> i can too
Jan 30 13:23:49 <acidjazz> works fine
Jan 30 13:23:55 <acidjazz> sry
Jan 30 13:24:02 <Corsac> andre__: damn, I didn't find it
Jan 30 13:24:26 <andre__> https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=7515
Jan 30 13:24:27 <povbot> Bug 7515: List of countries not shown on tapping the country picker button
Jan 30 13:25:39 <ieatlint> perhaps a localisation issue
Jan 30 13:25:47 <ieatlint> works fine here in us english
Jan 30 13:25:53 <Corsac> or acidjazz uses 2009.52 :)
Jan 30 13:26:14 <Corsac> I use uk english here
Jan 30 13:26:23 <Corsac> and regional settings are set to France
Jan 30 13:26:31 <ieatlint> 2.2009.51-1.002 here
Jan 30 13:26:48 <acidjazz> how do i find my version
Jan 30 13:26:51 <acidjazz> or build
Jan 30 13:27:01 <ieatlint> go to settings and select "about product"
Jan 30 13:30:20 <ieatlint> it should also be listed in your installed packages in the app manager... the package being "Maemo"
Jan 30 13:31:43 <acidjazz> lol ive downloaded 3 versions of this movie and i cannot find a damn english subbed version
Jan 30 14:03:06 <Stskeeps> wb wazd
Jan 30 14:03:48 <crashanddie> Stskeeps: shut up, your karma whore :P
Jan 30 14:04:11 <wazd> Stskeeps: reheya, home at last
Jan 30 14:04:13 <Stskeeps> no karma for irc
Jan 30 14:04:19 <wazd> Stskeeps: ++
Jan 30 14:04:27 <Stskeeps> wazd: could i interest you in helping me with some css?
Jan 30 14:04:34 <wazd> :P
Jan 30 14:04:39 <wazd> Stskeeps: sure
Jan 30 14:05:51 <RST38h> "How to redesign the internal combustion engine to run on human blood, using only pre-existing parts."
Jan 30 14:06:02 <Stskeeps> excellent for the battlefield
Jan 30 14:06:15 <RST38h> ...and not only..
Jan 30 14:06:33 <SpeedEvil> RST38h: Dry the blood, supply it as a powder, and use a modified deisel engine.
Jan 30 14:06:46 <SpeedEvil> RST38h: lubrication will be a problem - as the ash will be abrasive.
Jan 30 14:07:53 <SpeedEvil> Modified - as you'll need to swap the injector for a system similar to a carbureter - but designed to dispense powder.
Jan 30 14:08:17 <SpeedEvil> Also - large / slow  engines will work best - the combustion velocity will be slow.
Jan 30 14:08:55 <RST38h> Practical, ain't we? =)
Jan 30 14:09:22 <SpeedEvil> NoX levels may be a problem if you want to use it in some legislations.
Jan 30 14:09:24 <crashanddie> dried blood burns?
Jan 30 14:09:34 <crashanddie> what's the calorie level?
Jan 30 14:09:37 <SpeedEvil> dried organic anything burns - pretty much
Jan 30 14:10:15 <crashanddie> I can see how vegetable oil can be used instead of diesel, I have a hard time comprehending how powder would work the same way
Jan 30 14:10:32 <SpeedEvil> crashanddie: look up grain elevator explosions.
Jan 30 14:10:45 <SpeedEvil> There were efforts to get engines running on coal dust.
Jan 30 14:10:55 <SpeedEvil> It works - but abrasion is a horrible problem.
Jan 30 14:11:23 <wazd> You won't have many bodies to use in current conflicts
Jan 30 14:11:26 <SpeedEvil> diesel - old engines - simply put a fine spray of oil droplets into the air.
Jan 30 14:11:37 <SpeedEvil> If you replace that with a fine powder it still works
Jan 30 14:11:59 <inz> You mean blood would combust without ignition?
Jan 30 14:12:07 <acidjazz> would it combust at alL?
Jan 30 14:12:31 <RST38h> wazd: one word: haiti
Jan 30 14:13:00 <SpeedEvil> inz: yes. - dried.
Jan 30 14:13:32 <SpeedEvil> inz: any powder in an atmosphere that is heated to several thousand C - as it is in a diesel type engine - combusts vigourously.
Jan 30 14:13:35 <RST38h> Canadians deliver: http://www.theglobeandmail.com/life/health/time-to-end-pelvic-exams-done-without-consent/article1447337/#
Jan 30 14:13:38 <wazd> Rst38h: and seriously, I thought it's unethic enough :)
Jan 30 14:13:41 <crashanddie> SpeedEvil: so same idea as cornstarch?
Jan 30 14:13:46 <SpeedEvil> crashanddie: yes
Jan 30 14:13:49 <crashanddie> k
Jan 30 14:14:26 <RST38h> wazd: well, if the locals make barricades of them, why not burn them as fuel?
Jan 30 14:14:48 <inz> Speed, who heats it up?
Jan 30 14:15:37 <wazd> Rst38h: cause you're more human than them?)
Jan 30 14:15:46 <SpeedEvil> inz: the compression.
Jan 30 14:16:17 <SpeedEvil> inz: if you compress a gas - it heats up. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Adiabatic_compression
Jan 30 14:17:02 <acidjazz> lol RST38h
Jan 30 14:17:08 <acidjazz> the haiti comment
Jan 30 14:17:11 <acidjazz> too soon?
Jan 30 14:18:56 <inz> Speed, oh yeah, of course it does =)
Jan 30 14:19:55 <inz> Speed, silly me
Jan 30 14:20:35 <RST38h> wazd: I have not said I am going to burn them as fuel personally =)
Jan 30 14:21:09 <wazd> Acidjazz: well, shit happens
Jan 30 14:21:45 <RST38h> wazd: but, of course, not because I am somehow more human, mostly because I am squeamish
Jan 30 14:22:13 <wazd> Acidjazz: if you think that life in Haiti was like in paradise before the quake - think again
Jan 30 14:22:24 <wazd> Rst38h: heh)
Jan 30 14:34:48 <adalal> hello all... any reason why my msn plugin for the contacts keeps timing out (Network Error), and I have to restart the phone for it to get back online... re
Jan 30 14:51:35 <YeTr2> lololol
Jan 30 15:01:22 <n1c0> lo
Jan 30 15:02:25 <LeoD> hi
Jan 30 15:09:05 <Andy80> anyone of you has tried to install latest Firefox 1.0 for N900?
Jan 30 15:09:31 <Andy80> clicking on install link it asks me to add a repository and in the distro name it has "chinook" O_o
Jan 30 15:10:08 <flux> indeed
Jan 30 15:10:11 <flux> worked just fine anyway :)
Jan 30 15:10:26 <kimitake> me, too
Jan 30 15:10:31 <acidjazz> are contacts in maemo stored in sqlite?
Jan 30 15:12:48 <w00t> GeneralAntilles: can you (or someone else) set -q $~a in #maemo-devel please? (it's the equivilant of +R, set from when freenode switched server.. shouldn't be needed anymore, as a result of that switch..)
Jan 30 15:13:34 <Stskeeps> why not just switch to +C?
Jan 30 15:18:05 <dotblank> well I just flased my n900... didn't run into anyproblems.. I thought the backup app works really well
Jan 30 15:20:59 <wazd> ~ping
Jan 30 15:21:00 <infobot> ~pong
Jan 30 15:21:05 <wazd> meh
Jan 30 15:21:34 <dotblank> I used to yell ping in the hallways at school and sometimes a random person would yell pong
Jan 30 15:22:08 <ieatlint> you should've yelled syn
Jan 30 15:22:19 <dotblank> Ack! no way
Jan 30 15:22:29 <ieatlint> :P
Jan 30 15:23:06 <RST38h> ~lawyers
Jan 30 15:24:09 <dotblank> Who says the n900 doesnt have many apps... I have to download 570mb worth of them
Jan 30 15:26:01 <SpeedEvil> ?
Jan 30 15:26:01 <RST38h> why?
Jan 30 15:26:21 <Matthew-> dotblank: I dont think you will be able to
Jan 30 15:26:43 <thresh> for mirroring purposes?
Jan 30 15:27:11 <Matthew-> ah
Jan 30 15:27:12 <Matthew-> !
Jan 30 15:27:19 <Matthew-> i thought on his device ;D
Jan 30 15:27:38 <DocScrutinizer> w00t: seems chanops are reluctant.
Jan 30 15:28:06 * DocScrutinizer suggested same some 5h ago :-P
Jan 30 15:28:20 <LuciusMare> why does my n900 always resets his hostname after reboot?
Jan 30 15:28:26 <crashanddie> w00t: we don't have +R, we only set it during obvious bot attacks
Jan 30 15:28:41 <DocScrutinizer> crashanddie: you *have*
Jan 30 15:28:43 <crashanddie> LuciusMare: because he wants to
Jan 30 15:28:44 <acidjazz> lol wazd so because life was hard there its less of a deal 150k of em died?
Jan 30 15:28:52 <dotblank> Matthew-, I just did
Jan 30 15:28:53 <LuciusMare> and how do i make it stop? I want to set my own hostname
Jan 30 15:29:04 <DocScrutinizer> crashanddie: just it's called +q $~a  now
Jan 30 15:29:10 <acidjazz> dotblank: mb != count
Jan 30 15:29:10 <crashanddie> DocScrutinizer: beg your pardon?
Jan 30 15:29:23 <dotblank> acidjazz, I know :)
Jan 30 15:29:33 <DocScrutinizer> crashanddie: DocScrutinizer51 can't pst to #maemo
Jan 30 15:30:13 <LuciusMare> crashanddie?
Jan 30 15:30:26 <crashanddie_> == Channel modes on #maemo are: +cn
Jan 30 15:30:43 <DocScrutinizer> crashanddie_: /mode -q
Jan 30 15:30:44 <crashanddie_> I don't see an R
Jan 30 15:30:50 <DocScrutinizer> crashanddie: just it's called +q $~a  now
Jan 30 15:30:58 <Stskeeps>  /mode #maemo -q $~a
Jan 30 15:31:00 <crashanddie_> but it's not set!
Jan 30 15:31:00 <Stskeeps> :P
Jan 30 15:31:03 <Stskeeps> yes it is
Jan 30 15:31:06 <Stskeeps>  /mode #maemo q
Jan 30 15:31:08 <crashanddie_> wtf
Jan 30 15:31:13 <acidjazz> lol
Jan 30 15:31:32 <SpeedEvil> LuciusMare: /etc/init.d/rS?
Jan 30 15:31:35 <SpeedEvil> rcS
Jan 30 15:31:41 <LuciusMare> thanks
Jan 30 15:32:18 <crashanddie_> oh ffs
Jan 30 15:32:43 <petey2> hey
Jan 30 15:32:45 <DocScrutinizer51> ~ping
Jan 30 15:32:46 <infobot> ~pong
Jan 30 15:33:00 <DocScrutinizer51> :-)
Jan 30 15:33:02 <crashanddie_> better now?
Jan 30 15:33:07 <DocScrutinizer51> yup
Jan 30 15:33:47 <crashanddie_> how about freenode uses a system which shows up in the old queries
Jan 30 15:33:48 <petey2> I am having problems loging in to the facebook-widget. I am writing the correct email and password but get "wrong email / password" message... I have swedish keyboard layout...
Jan 30 15:33:57 <Orange1> ~ping
Jan 30 15:33:58 <infobot> ~pong
Jan 30 15:34:02 <Orange1> xaxa
Jan 30 15:34:05 <wazd> acidjazz: no, because you only care when lot's of people die
Jan 30 15:34:08 <wazd> lots*
Jan 30 15:34:09 <Orange1> ~ping
Jan 30 15:34:10 <infobot> ~pong
Jan 30 15:34:30 <crashanddie_> don't tell me that's a bot
Jan 30 15:34:34 <crashanddie_> or I'm shooting myself
Jan 30 15:34:37 <RST38h> wazd: well, they also have to die spectacularly
Jan 30 15:34:39 <frals> lol
Jan 30 15:34:41 <crashanddie_> Orange1: identify yourself
Jan 30 15:35:03 <acidjazz> does it have a sandbox python interpreter we can use in the channel
Jan 30 15:35:04 <acidjazz> as well
Jan 30 15:35:09 <acidjazz> maybe itll shorturl links
Jan 30 15:35:16 <acidjazz> aka flood w/ meaningless scroll
Jan 30 15:35:24 <RST38h> wazd: i.e. carpet bombings, tsunamis, earthquakes, nuclear explosions count, hunger and most diseases do not
Jan 30 15:35:40 <crashanddie_> acidjazz: povbot is the only bot allowed in the channel
Jan 30 15:35:51 <RST38h> wazd: Most NATO military actions do not count, unless NATO fucks up real bad
Jan 30 15:35:55 <acidjazz> crashanddie_: im being sarcastic and agreeing w/ u
Jan 30 15:36:20 <crashanddie_> oh my bad, misread that
Jan 30 15:36:23 <crashanddie_> Orange1: ?
Jan 30 15:36:49 <Orange1>  crashanddie ah?
Jan 30 15:37:11 <DocScrutinizer> Orange1: turingtest ;-)
Jan 30 15:37:11 <Orange1> i'm the organe pest
Jan 30 15:37:12 <crashanddie> Orange1: say something human
Jan 30 15:37:25 <Orange1> MUAHAHAHA
Jan 30 15:37:32 <DocScrutinizer> k
Jan 30 15:37:35 <crashanddie> yeah, you're not convincing me mate
Jan 30 15:37:37 <thresh> i'm actually amazed on the quality of n900's photos when there's a sun light
Jan 30 15:37:40 <Orange1> that's ok?
Jan 30 15:37:58 <thresh> now, someone needs to make fotki.yandex share service support:)
Jan 30 15:37:59 <crashanddie> not really
Jan 30 15:38:06 <DocScrutinizer> lol
Jan 30 15:38:18 <crashanddie> DocScrutinizer: opinion?
Jan 30 15:38:28 <DocScrutinizer> passed
Jan 30 15:38:36 <crashanddie> he did?
Jan 30 15:38:39 <eean> thresh: dosn't stop me from bringing my camera when I really want to take some photos. I just wish it was trivial to transfer files between my camera and the phone.
Jan 30 15:38:40 <Orange1>  crashanddie we, the bots, we are very sofistificat'd day by day
Jan 30 15:38:41 <Orange1> (?)
Jan 30 15:38:42 <DocScrutinizer> yup
Jan 30 15:38:50 <thresh> eean: of course.
Jan 30 15:39:03 <RST38h> picasa first
Jan 30 15:39:04 <thresh> it's good enough for ocassional photoing.
Jan 30 15:39:13 <acidjazz> crashanddie_: lol u realize infobot is hte bot and not Orange1 right
Jan 30 15:39:15 <thresh> screw picasa, yandex has unlimited storage ;)
Jan 30 15:39:16 <adalal> hello, how do you get the hciconfig to install on maemo 5?
Jan 30 15:39:17 <eean> the next 'mobile computer' needs a host usb port or we take away nokia's cookies
Jan 30 15:39:44 <crashanddie> Orange1: you'd be amazed at how sophisticated they get... and considering you haven't been making a lot of sense for more than the contents of one sentence, I remain on the skeptic side of the fence
Jan 30 15:40:02 <crashanddie> acidjazz: considering I'm the one who voiced povbot...
Jan 30 15:40:28 <Orange1>  crashanddie the bots wa can get some sex and satisfaktion
Jan 30 15:40:41 <Orange1> oh i forgot to say, drinks 2!
Jan 30 15:40:47 <Orange1> *we
Jan 30 15:40:51 <Orange1> not *wa
Jan 30 15:41:00 <crashanddie> go sleep it off mate
Jan 30 15:41:11 <crashanddie> you're making no sense at all... so you must be drunk
Jan 30 15:41:13 <RST38h> thresh: actually, retromap.ru in something like maemo mapper would be mighty cool
Jan 30 15:41:29 <ieatlint> alcohol is good
Jan 30 15:41:30 <adalal> and how do i get my phone's bluetooth to be realised as a phone, and not others :P
Jan 30 15:41:31 <Orange1>  crashanddie for you dear
Jan 30 15:41:32 <adalal> |?
Jan 30 15:41:36 <DocScrutinizer> actually better than ELIZA
Jan 30 15:41:42 <Orange1>  ieatlint yeah sur!
Jan 30 15:42:57 <crashanddie> ~burn Orange1
Jan 30 15:42:58 * infobot pours gasoline all over Orange1, ignites the fire, and then enjoys some toasty marshmallows with the glorious blaze
Jan 30 15:43:20 <Orange1> ~burn crashanddie
Jan 30 15:43:21 * infobot pours gasoline all over crashanddie, ignites the fire, and then enjoys some toasty marshmallows with the glorious blaze
Jan 30 15:43:28 <dotblank> Has anyone fixed the call with skype invalid number bug?
Jan 30 15:43:29 <Orange1> xoxooxo
Jan 30 15:43:36 <SpeedEvil> eean: it's not 100% clear that USB host mode can't be enabled. However - it's very much a work in progress. There have been a number of statements from nokia employees, and when chased up all the detailed ones seeme to have flawed reasoning. Plus - the hardware - from what docs are available - does not seem to be configurable in a way to stop host mode working.
Jan 30 15:43:43 <DocScrutinizer> yay. may I rethink my vote?
Jan 30 15:44:02 <crashanddie> DocScrutinizer: you can
Jan 30 15:44:09 <SpeedEvil> eean: well - there is save to uSD, and plug it in of course
Jan 30 15:44:47 <crashanddie> Orange1: what president of the USA was shot in 1963?
Jan 30 15:44:53 <Mek> from what I heard, there is some hard-to-reach pin on some chip to whcich you'd need to solder something to get host mde...
Jan 30 15:44:55 <DocScrutinizer> Orange1: last chance - or you'll go for the first human too soaked to pass turng
Jan 30 15:45:26 <Orange1>  crashanddie USA..?? is a new UFO version?
Jan 30 15:45:31 <RST38h> what is gtkparasite?
Jan 30 15:45:50 <Orange1> Kennedy go to sleep to Mars with crashanddie...
Jan 30 15:46:13 <DocScrutinizer> k that's probably weird enough
Jan 30 15:46:28 <Orange1>  DocScrutinizer da ya...?
Jan 30 15:46:56 <Orange1> maybe you wanna hear somethin' of Alice Cooper (?)
Jan 30 15:47:06 <Orange1> oh shit!!
Jan 30 15:47:29 <DocScrutinizer> lollercatz
Jan 30 15:48:07 <crashanddie> he seriously made me doubt
Jan 30 15:48:13 <aquatix> heh, yeah
Jan 30 15:48:15 <DocScrutinizer> me too
Jan 30 15:48:17 <aquatix> .es though
Jan 30 15:48:34 <DocScrutinizer> well then
Jan 30 15:48:41 <aquatix> ah no, that's just the ircap
Jan 30 15:48:43 <RST38h> crashanddit: you forgot +b
Jan 30 15:48:49 <crashanddie> no, I didn't
Jan 30 15:48:51 <DocScrutinizer> those weird andalusians
Jan 30 15:49:04 <RST38h> gooooooooooood
Jan 30 15:49:16 <crashanddie> "Robots evolve to learn cooperation, hunting"
Jan 30 15:49:21 <crashanddie> what could go wrong?
Jan 30 15:49:29 <aquatix> :)
Jan 30 15:49:36 <eean> SpeedEvil: it shouldn't be a hack, there should be an actual USB plug :)
Jan 30 15:49:54 <crashanddie> eean: yup, and world hunger shouldn't exist
Jan 30 15:50:23 <eean> a phone with host usb is hardly as hard to solve as world hungre...
Jan 30 15:50:45 <crashanddie> says you
Jan 30 15:51:09 <ieatlint> i agree... eating food is far simpler than making a phone with usb host mode
Jan 30 15:55:11 <crashanddie> ieatlint: yeah, I don't understand what all the fuss is about... can't they all just go to maccers and have a sandwich every once in a while? I mean come on!
Jan 30 15:56:02 <ieatlint> well, not even knowing what maccers is myself... apparently not
Jan 30 15:56:41 <crashanddie> slang for McDonalds
Jan 30 15:56:58 <ieatlint> heh, that's not food :P
Jan 30 15:57:25 <crashanddie> it's a bloody 3 star restaurant to starvers :P
Jan 30 15:59:25 <DocScrutinizer> ieatlint: still we (OM) managed to get decent hostmode on FR, and I'm sitting here starving ;-P
Jan 30 15:59:27 <ieatlint> bah, only poor neighbourhoods here even have mcdonalds
Jan 30 15:59:42 <ieatlint> hah, i thought i recognised your nick ;)
Jan 30 16:00:08 <ieatlint> true indeed, the fr got hostmode working fine... not much else though :P
Jan 30 16:00:16 <DocScrutinizer> lol
Jan 30 16:00:18 <DocScrutinizer> ack
Jan 30 16:00:45 <Stskeeps> PaulFertser_: around?
Jan 30 16:00:56 <ieatlint> first real gtk app i wrote was laughably slow on it... contained maybe 10 widgets and it took a minute to render...
Jan 30 16:01:11 <PaulFertser> Stskeeps: yep
Jan 30 16:02:09 <Quibus> OK, I ported a few Debian packages to Maemo... but I don't have a real N900... Is someone willing to test them on a real device?
Jan 30 16:05:58 <SpeedEvil> eean: hack as in software - it's an external powered hub, and it 'just works'
Jan 30 16:08:01 <frals> nice, got my gprs connection up without the phone knowing it, fetching mms while the rest of the phone thinks im on wlan \o/
Jan 30 16:08:49 <SpeedEvil> :)
Jan 30 16:15:01 <wazd> http://www.collegehumor.com/video:1928558
Jan 30 16:15:04 <wazd> :D
Jan 30 16:16:41 <DocScrutinizer> fetching mms? o.O
Jan 30 16:17:40 <kuriiri> frals: nice? :)
Jan 30 16:17:44 <kuriiri> eer -? :D
Jan 30 16:17:55 <dotblank> anyone know where the phone's contacts are stored?
Jan 30 16:18:04 <eean> SpeedEvil: you shouldn't need an external powered hub... my use case is plugging in my camera :)
Jan 30 16:18:27 <SpeedEvil> yes, I know.
Jan 30 16:21:08 <Caesium> dotblank: from a quick grep, /home/user/.osso-abook/db/addressbook.db ?
Jan 30 16:22:18 <dotblank> is there a way to modify the contact list from command line..
Jan 30 16:22:37 <dotblank> I would like to add a + before all contacts' numbers
Jan 30 16:22:53 <dotblank> So I would want to write a script to handle that
Jan 30 16:23:57 <kuriiri> frals: so it can also send mms without manually connecting to mms apn?
Jan 30 16:24:10 <frals> its what im trying to do atm ;)
Jan 30 16:24:25 <frals> or well, i succeeded just not, but it needs a lot of work :p
Jan 30 16:24:32 <frals> s/not/now
Jan 30 16:25:14 <kuriiri> great... so new version is in the repo in 35mins :)
Jan 30 16:25:32 <andres> frals: whether that is wholly nice achievement is another question...
Jan 30 16:25:51 <frals> kuriiri: hehe, I wish :P
Jan 30 16:25:55 <ieatlint> dotblank, a quick look shows it's a berkdb database...
Jan 30 16:25:56 <Caesium> dotblank: need to work out what sort of db it is first, maybe perl can open it with NDBM_File or so.
Jan 30 16:26:15 <frals> andres: uh?
Jan 30 16:26:32 <ieatlint> there is wide support for berkdb.. it also appears to primarily be in ascii with a binary header... it *may* be possible to modify it with sed
Jan 30 16:26:39 <andres> fragment: Opening a gprs connection without really being noticed...
Jan 30 16:26:51 <andres> err, frals: ^
Jan 30 16:27:09 <frals> andres: If you have another way of having two connections active at once, I'm all ears ;)
Jan 30 16:27:16 <andres> Unfortunately not ;-)
Jan 30 16:27:34 <andres> I do see your reasoning...
Jan 30 16:27:39 <pillar> is there some documentation about system dbus signals and slots?
Jan 30 16:27:42 <andres> ieatlint: afair, that wont work
Jan 30 16:29:13 <SpeedEvil> frals: does the kernel contain support for multiplexing so that multiple APNs can be connected to?
Jan 30 16:30:26 <frals> no idea, not tested that yet
Jan 30 16:30:55 <ieatlint> andres, sadly you appear to be correct... in scratchbox it does not work
Jan 30 16:32:03 <andres> ieatlint: there are heaps of problems for such a approach: stored lengths, pointers, page borders, page headers...
Jan 30 16:33:02 <ieatlint> yeah, was worth a shot though, as it initially appeared that the only thing separating fields was \r\n
Jan 30 16:33:16 <Caesium> there's a bunch of binary between each record
Jan 30 16:33:26 <Caesium> probably each record is just one text blob though
Jan 30 16:34:39 <petey2> what is the name of the application manager that tells you user scores/popularity etc.. ?
Jan 30 16:35:01 <SpeedEvil> appwatch?
Jan 30 16:35:15 <petey2> cheers!
Jan 30 16:40:06 <villager> frals: oo, you working on two-connections-at-once? what method are you using? someone once mentioned SO_BINDTODEVICE as a possibility for making a socket talk through a particular interface, like a particular apn
Jan 30 16:41:31 <GIUN> �i�O A TuTtI
Jan 30 16:45:36 <RST38h> Mhm, users definitely hate Fennec
Jan 30 16:47:25 <Alterego> Really want fullscreen on xchat
Jan 30 16:47:52 <derf> RST38h: This is surprising?
Jan 30 16:47:52 <tank-man> you can move the divider bars
Jan 30 16:47:56 <RST38h> Ctrl+Enter?
Jan 30 16:48:07 <RST38h> derf: Not at all =(
Jan 30 16:48:12 <TheBigHead> hello room
Jan 30 16:48:33 <RST38h> sucks moose balls, hangs the whole system including the lock switch
Jan 30 16:48:35 <Alterego> oh nice:)
Jan 30 16:48:43 <derf> Nice.
Jan 30 16:48:44 <RST38h> most likely by constant swapping
Jan 30 16:48:53 <Alterego> is there a short cut to task switcher?
Jan 30 16:48:57 <derf> Yeah, that would certainly do it.
Jan 30 16:49:00 <GeneralAntilles> ctlr-backspace
Jan 30 16:49:02 <RST38h> Alter: Ctrl+BS?
Jan 30 16:49:05 <GeneralAntilles> Alterego, install shortcutd too.
Jan 30 16:49:06 <derf> But the device has 1GB of RAM!
Jan 30 16:49:18 <derf> Uh, I mean, not RAM, "memory", that's the ticket.
Jan 30 16:49:23 <Alterego> m'kay
Jan 30 16:49:40 <RST38h> derf: the device has it through an 8bit data path to an SD card driven by an 8bit embedded controller or something
Jan 30 16:49:44 <GeneralAntilles> Alterego, makes camera key move to dashboard.
Jan 30 16:50:01 <derf> RST38h: I'm well aware.
Jan 30 16:50:10 <derf> It was pretty easy to kill an N8x0 by swapping, too.
Jan 30 16:50:16 <derf> Even with a small page file.
Jan 30 16:50:17 <Alterego> cool.
Jan 30 16:50:34 <derf> I have no idea why anyone thought 768MB of swap would be at all useful.
Jan 30 16:51:21 <RST38h> 512MB would probably be enough
Jan 30 16:51:40 <RST38h> Just not on a device that slow
Jan 30 16:51:40 <SpeedEvil> derf: it's not useless
Jan 30 16:51:58 <SpeedEvil> derf: if the swap was properly setup - it'd work well
Jan 30 16:52:01 <RST38h> General: BTW, do you know if anyone tried moving either swap or /opt to an external memory card?
Jan 30 16:52:02 <ssvb> derf: to be able to keep a number of *idle* applications loaded in the background?
Jan 30 16:52:04 <derf> 64MB would have been enough.
Jan 30 16:52:23 <RST38h> The speed of external/internal card should be pretty much the same but hopefully they have different data pipes
Jan 30 16:52:29 <GeneralAntilles> RST38h, not that I know of.
Jan 30 16:52:34 <GeneralAntilles> ssvb, ++
Jan 30 16:52:45 <derf> ssvb: Unless you spent several days swapping out those idle applications...
Jan 30 16:53:54 <SpeedEvil> http://tree.celinuxforum.org/pipermail/celinux-dev/2009-December/001857.html
Jan 30 16:54:05 <SpeedEvil> speed of datapipe is close to irrelevant
Jan 30 16:54:19 <SpeedEvil> unless you do contiguous writes - which  the current swap algo doesn't.
Jan 30 16:55:39 <RST38h> SpeedEvil: Well we are getting much lower throughput than those cards are made for
Jan 30 16:55:50 <RST38h> Both read and write
Jan 30 16:55:56 <Caesium> ieatlint: btw, python anydbm seems to open the addressbook ok, I can't get perl to though
Jan 30 16:56:04 <RST38h> So, yes, at least in the case of Maemo devices, it matters
Jan 30 16:56:14 <Alterego> just read that overclocking thread on tmo ... what a nob.
Jan 30 16:56:17 <ssvb> SpeedEvil: are you absolutely sure that the current swap algo doesn't do it?
Jan 30 16:57:07 <SpeedEvil> ssvb: as I understand it no.
Jan 30 16:57:27 <SpeedEvil> ssvb: Many of the optimisations for flash are somewhat different to disk
Jan 30 16:57:39 <sp3000> hmm, are there some useful crash reporter docs
Jan 30 16:57:44 <SpeedEvil> for flash - random read is cheap - and random write is horribly expensive
Jan 30 16:58:10 <ssvb> SpeedEvil: have you compared swap code of N900 kernel with the code from the upstream kernel?
Jan 30 16:58:23 <SpeedEvil> A 20M/s device can drop to a few tens of K/s if you ask it to write random 512 blocks
Jan 30 16:58:25 <SpeedEvil> ssvb: no
Jan 30 16:58:31 <ssvb> ok, I see
Jan 30 16:58:40 <SpeedEvil> ssvb: Does it differ?
Jan 30 16:59:15 <ssvb> afaik, yes
Jan 30 17:00:01 <SpeedEvil> hmm.
Jan 30 17:00:16 <SpeedEvil> if true, that'd be useful for many devices that want to do swap to SD
Jan 30 17:02:52 <Alterego> Anyone tested disk bandwidth.
Jan 30 17:04:39 <zerojay> ugh... wtf.
Jan 30 17:04:59 <zerojay> Charging overnight... only 50% battery.. and now suddenly, I can't boot up anymore.
Jan 30 17:05:10 <Alterego> O_O
Jan 30 17:05:16 <Alterego> uh, oh ...
Jan 30 17:05:34 <zerojay> Brand new N900.
Jan 30 17:05:59 <Caesium> charging from usb or wall socket?
Jan 30 17:06:00 <zerojay> Had over 50% charge showing... but yet, can't boot.
Jan 30 17:06:06 <zerojay> Wall.
Jan 30 17:06:22 <Caesium> I find that my laptop can't charge it via usb despite it saying it is, had a lucky escape with that, woke up one morning to it at 20% despite being in all night
Jan 30 17:06:38 <GeneralAntilles> zerojay, it's your unclean aura. :P
Jan 30 17:06:45 <Alterego> my laptop can charge it.
Jan 30 17:07:03 <Caesium> yeah my desktop PC manages fine. maybe it's just low powered usb, it's only a little sony vaio
Jan 30 17:07:05 <zerojay> If I try to turn it on... it dies almost as soon as the first set of orbs shows up.
Jan 30 17:07:10 <Alterego> but when it's really busy. tends to just keep it at a constant level :)
Jan 30 17:07:26 <zerojay> And now, it says it's charging, but I just see  a dull Nokia logo on the screen... can't power up.
Jan 30 17:07:39 <Alterego> I'm happy though, tethering was much nicer with just one cable.
Jan 30 17:08:25 <sp3000> bug 8679 -- does the currently available stuff not display the calendar view that was last shown when closed?
Jan 30 17:08:26 <povbot> Bug https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=8679 Make calendar default view configurable via calendar settings menu
Jan 30 17:08:52 <zerojay> Freezing with the second orb highlighted... I gotta reflash now? Seriously? Uggggghhhhh
Jan 30 17:09:12 <Caesium> hm, does the n900 charge in usb flashing mode?
Jan 30 17:09:26 <Caesium> you could leave it sat in usb flash mode for a bit maybe if it does.
Jan 30 17:09:36 <ShadowJK> it doesn't charge in usb flashing mode I think
Jan 30 17:09:51 <bigbrovar> hi guys
Jan 30 17:09:56 <zerojay> Also, charging shouldn't be an issue anyways since I had half a battery still.
Jan 30 17:10:01 <ShadowJK> Caesium, was your VAIO switched on or off?
Jan 30 17:10:06 <Caesium> ShadowJK: on of course :)
Jan 30 17:10:23 <Caesium> the N900 claimed to be charging
Jan 30 17:11:17 <bigbrovar> I hear all the time about people getting like 24 hours batt life out of their n900 with *normal* usage. well the most I ever got out of mine under normal usage is 11 hours
Jan 30 17:12:25 <Alterego> i might cap the cpu to 250 to save power :P
Jan 30 17:12:29 <GeneralAntilles> bigbrovar, clearly something's sucking down power or your definition of "normal" is off.
Jan 30 17:12:50 <GeneralAntilles> Alterego, doesn't work like that.
Jan 30 17:13:10 <GeneralAntilles> Race-to-idle, etc.
Jan 30 17:13:45 <bigbrovar> GeneralAntilles: well am connected to wifi (70% of the time) 3g is turned off and am using gsm mode. listen to music..
Jan 30 17:14:39 <bigbrovar> GeneralAntilles: occassional checking the web.. but nothing intensive.. most times the device is in my pocket and am listening to music via the headphone
Jan 30 17:15:12 <moo-_-> people should just install CPU applet and use top command
Jan 30 17:15:23 <moo-_-> if there is an app which has really gone haywire
Jan 30 17:15:40 <moo-_-> it does not reveal all problems, but at least you see the obvious ones
Jan 30 17:16:53 * sp3000 rather prefers htop
Jan 30 17:17:45 * moo-_- apt-get install htop - didn't know it was available
Jan 30 17:17:58 <moo-_-> powertop is for more advanced problems and more advanced users
Jan 30 17:18:12 <moo-_-> there is nothing powertop cannot resolve
Jan 30 17:18:29 <moo-_-> so
Jan 30 17:18:42 <moo-_-> somebody should just write a tutorial how to use CPU applet + htop +  powertop
Jan 30 17:18:46 <moo-_-> problem solved
Jan 30 17:19:25 <woglinde> jo
Jan 30 17:19:49 <ssvb> moo-_-, even an application which has ~0% cpu load can prevent cpu from sleeping properly, top/htop is not particularly helpful for finding these
Jan 30 17:20:08 <moo-_-> ssvb: powertop
Jan 30 17:20:12 <bigbrovar> what is the longest batt life anyone as ever gotten from the N900 when on wireless
Jan 30 17:20:20 <ssvb> moo-_-, right
Jan 30 17:21:07 <moo-_-> as long as energy goes to main CPU it should be able to detect it
Jan 30 17:21:16 <moo-_-> I am not sure whether baseband can suck power indepdendently
Jan 30 17:21:46 * DocScrutinizer51 wonders where his powertop went to. or where to get it
Jan 30 17:22:13 <bigbrovar> moo-_-: I have heard some people having issues with batt life on the N900 i dont know if its hardware or software related. but mine can only seem to last 11 hours tops
Jan 30 17:22:54 <woglinde> bigbrovar uh
Jan 30 17:23:05 <bigbrovar> moo-_-: and i hear people claiming to get 24 hours from their device for me that has never happened.. even if am only listening to music... the best i get is 12 hours
Jan 30 17:23:07 <woglinde> bigbrovar in offline mode too=
Jan 30 17:23:09 <woglinde> ?
Jan 30 17:23:28 <moo-_-> bigbrovar: idle device can go two days easily
Jan 30 17:23:32 <bigbrovar> woglinde: I havent tried the phone offline. But I could always do that
Jan 30 17:24:00 <moo-_-> bigbrovar: listening to music doesn't have battery life beyond 6-8 hours on any device I know
Jan 30 17:24:01 <DocScrutinizer51> listening music is kinda power hog
Jan 30 17:24:05 <bigbrovar> woglinde: moo-_-: I have 3g turned off and am on gsm mode..
Jan 30 17:24:32 <villager> listening to music is always a big battery hog
Jan 30 17:25:12 <DocScrutinizer51> cpu active all the time to decode and stream (well basically)
Jan 30 17:25:18 <moo-_-> bigbrovar: try here http://www.gossamer-threads.com/lists/maemo/users/53516
Jan 30 17:25:22 <bigbrovar> moo-_-: ok am charging it now, once its full. i would switch to offline mode and just put the music player on via the headphone and see how long it lasts
Jan 30 17:25:48 <zerojay> mmkay... my N900 was charging all night... and still charged, died... even though there was nearly no CPU use and no programs hogging up anything. Awesome.
Jan 30 17:25:57 <moo-_-> bigbrovar: in any case it is not N900 problem
Jan 30 17:25:58 <moo-_-> get ipod
Jan 30 17:26:00 <moo-_-> try play music
Jan 30 17:26:03 <moo-_-> see how many hours you get
Jan 30 17:26:12 <DocScrutinizer51> bigbrovar: why not use it online without music?
Jan 30 17:26:44 <bigbrovar> moo-_-: its worse if i use it online.. 3g and i get just 8 hours.. wireless is 11 hours even without music
Jan 30 17:26:59 <DocScrutinizer51> zerojay: did it *signal* charging?
Jan 30 17:27:15 <zerojay> DocScrutinizer51: I'm not even going to dignify that with an answer.
Jan 30 17:27:20 <moo-_-> bigbrovar: 11 hours surfing?
Jan 30 17:27:27 <bigbrovar> I have an e72 and the N900 so i can easily compare.. the e72 can go for 24 hours under the same usage as the N900.
Jan 30 17:27:52 <moo-_-> N900 has bigger screen
Jan 30 17:27:54 <DocScrutinizer51> zerojay: you're welcome, dude
Jan 30 17:27:58 <moo-_-> if you use it actively it cannot last as long
Jan 30 17:28:03 <bigbrovar> moo-_-: not surfing but just connected to wifi, sometimes chating, and checking emails
Jan 30 17:28:03 <moo-_-> that's the law of the physics
Jan 30 17:28:24 <moo-_-> bigbrovar: just leave it on the table, don't touch it, and you get 2 days
Jan 30 17:28:25 <zerojay> DocScrutinizer51: It's kind of a stupid question to ask, that's all.
Jan 30 17:28:37 <moo-_-> bigbrovar: I think your usage patters just consume the battery
Jan 30 17:28:38 <bigbrovar> moo-_-: I know am just saying that people say they get 24 hours on the N900 and i have never been close to that on mine
Jan 30 17:28:44 <DocScrutinizer51>  aha
Jan 30 17:28:56 <moo-_-> bigbrovar: people are subjective
Jan 30 17:28:58 <moo-_-> people are also ignorant
Jan 30 17:29:13 <moo-_-> and in many case simply not very bright minded
Jan 30 17:29:14 <ShadowJK> I get about 16 hours, but that's with xchat and about 30 irc channels
Jan 30 17:29:21 <moo-_-> if you want have something then have real data
Jan 30 17:29:25 <moo-_-> use powertop
Jan 30 17:29:28 <moo-_-> record power usage
Jan 30 17:29:38 <bigbrovar> moo-_-: ok .. I will leave it connected to wifi and switch to the e72.. would live it in offline mode and no listen to music..
Jan 30 17:30:02 <ShadowJK> My operator doesn't firewall gprs/3g, and sometimes I get the IP of someone who used edonkey.. then random people from all over the world send random UDP packets to my IP, keeping the modem awake.. :(
Jan 30 17:30:16 <woglinde> hm firefox mobile is out
Jan 30 17:30:36 <mtnbkr> anyone know if htere an an app or addin/plugin to the default media player to scrobble to last.fm or other?
Jan 30 17:30:47 * mtnbkr can't believe he just said "scrobble"  sigh
Jan 30 17:30:54 <villager> bigbrovar: you're not connecting it to skype or anything?
Jan 30 17:31:07 <moo-_-> bigbrovar: when you can come back with something like "I surfed with screen max brightness using WLAN 4.12 hours on N900 but 5.68 hours on E72" we can simply say that "N900 has bigger screen and about the same size of battery, what did you expect?"
Jan 30 17:31:15 <bigbrovar> villager: well skype is always connected
Jan 30 17:31:24 <moo-_-> but doing guesswork is just poinstless
Jan 30 17:31:27 <mtnbkr> bigbrovar: I can get no where near 24 hours on my n900... not even close... :(
Jan 30 17:32:03 <villager> bigbrovar: well, then that could be another battery drain
Jan 30 17:32:07 <woglinde> lol
Jan 30 17:32:12 <woglinde> always to skype
Jan 30 17:32:20 <woglinde> no wonder wlan cannt go to sleep
Jan 30 17:33:12 <bigbrovar> moo-_-: if you have been following me, I was trying to compare normal usage. people asked me to define normal usage and that is hard to define.. but I then said i have same usage on my e72 and get 24 hours + batt.. but the n900 only goes 11 hours tops..
Jan 30 17:33:52 <villager> is your e72 connected to skype?
Jan 30 17:34:26 <bigbrovar> moo-_-: am aware its like comparing apples to oranges but I wanted to draw a base line.. I was talking to a friend yesterday and he said he gets over 24 hours, connected to 3g, listening to music, checking mails and occassional surfing the web
Jan 30 17:34:31 <ShadowJK> E72 doesn't have skype
Jan 30 17:34:45 <bigbrovar> moo-_-: mine would die in 11 hours
Jan 30 17:34:58 <ShadowJK> Skype on N900 does the full p2p thing, so that should consume huge amounts on 3g :)
Jan 30 17:35:27 <DocScrutinizer> lol
Jan 30 17:35:44 <DocScrutinizer> skype - uerrrks
Jan 30 17:36:04 <bigbrovar> ShadowJK: nope it doesnt but i always have like 9 apps running in the back ground at a any one time, nokia mail, gravity, mobbler,musicplayer,tasmmanager,and skypelight
Jan 30 17:36:26 <ShadowJK> Those don't use the network as much as skype
Jan 30 17:36:29 <ShadowJK> in terms of wakeups
Jan 30 17:37:01 <ShadowJK> nokia mail is probably set to only check every 5-15 minutes or something, skype light doesn't have the fancy stuff
Jan 30 17:38:03 * RST38h installed Firefox Mobile final
Jan 30 17:38:27 * RST38h does not understand how Firefox developers can claim that it works for them =(
Jan 30 17:38:31 <ShadowJK> it would probably last a bit longer on edge, which doesn't hate wakeups as much as 3g does
Jan 30 17:39:08 <derf> Maybe they didn't try using it to visit web pages.
Jan 30 17:39:13 <bigbrovar> ok I was using the N900 and thinking 11 hours batt life was normal till i read this revew.. and this part caught my attention
Jan 30 17:39:16 <bigbrovar> I don’t use the device heavily for phone calls but I am always using 3G data for email and other things, playing music and even using the FM transmitter. Despite all this I get well over 24 hours out of one charge. 36 hours is not uncommon.
Jan 30 17:39:35 <bigbrovar> source http://danlynch.org/blog/2010/01/n900-review/
Jan 30 17:40:04 <zerojay> ShadowJK: Skype on N900 does NOT do the full p2p thing.
Jan 30 17:40:10 <ShadowJK> I think a call will use about as much power as leaving "ping google.com" running in a terminal :)
Jan 30 17:40:14 <ShadowJK> zerojay, oh?
Jan 30 17:40:53 <ShadowJK> man, someone needs to come up with a nettop that can count wakeups and attribute them to specific processes :)
Jan 30 17:40:56 <bigbrovar> I mean I have owned this device now for close to 3 months now and I have NEVER gotten close to 24 hrs using the device less that what the reviewer does with his device.. the most I have gotten is 11 hours
Jan 30 17:41:04 <derf> But seriously, RST38h I haven't actually tried it. What's so awful about it?
Jan 30 17:41:20 <RST38h> derf: stalls all the time
Jan 30 17:41:28 <bigbrovar> anyway i would put the device of offline mode and see how long it lasts
Jan 30 17:41:32 <ShadowJK> does it use some sqlite database?
Jan 30 17:42:04 <RST38h> stalls when starting, stalls when closing down, stalls when loading page, stalls when scrolling through the page, stalls when typing , stalls when you try to switch away from it
Jan 30 17:42:14 <ShadowJK> lol
Jan 30 17:42:24 <ShadowJK> this sounds exactly like fennec a year ago?
Jan 30 17:42:47 <derf> RST38h: If you go to about:config, what's browser.cache.disk.enable set to?
Jan 30 17:42:50 <RST38h> well, it is a little bit faster, but just a little bit, sometimes
Jan 30 17:43:00 <RST38h> derf: a moment
Jan 30 17:43:21 <Alterego> shame there's no keyboard control in the dash board.
Jan 30 17:43:22 * ShadowJK has it enabled in microb
Jan 30 17:44:02 <dnaumov> bigbrovar: simple tip, recalibrate the battery
Jan 30 17:44:27 <RST38h> derf: false
Jan 30 17:44:37 <dnaumov> bigbrovar: ie. let it run down to 0, as in shut itself off (not until it just starts beeping), then charge to full
Jan 30 17:44:39 <bigbrovar> dnaumov: thanks but how do i do that :)
Jan 30 17:44:43 <villager> I used to be able to get something like 24h out of the n900, but after setting up stuff like skype and sip, it doesn't look like I can anymore... but since there's power where I spend most of my days, it doesn't bother me much
Jan 30 17:45:06 <bigbrovar> dnaumov: ok thanks would try that. :)
Jan 30 17:45:21 <derf> ShadowJK: It may be enabled in microb, but if browser.cache.disk.parent_directory points to a non-existent directory (which it does by default), it's still effectively disabled.
Jan 30 17:46:06 <dnaumov> I took my N900 out of the charger in the morning and been using it all day, including 3 hours of data usage on a TRAIN (which is hell for mobile devices with constant cell switching), it's at 60% now
Jan 30 17:46:30 <dnaumov> and now is 19.46
Jan 30 17:46:34 <Alterego> heh, recalibrate your battery..
Jan 30 17:46:57 <Alterego> lion's don't like being discharged fully.
Jan 30 17:48:15 <derf> RST38h: Well, no idea then. That fully exhausts my knowledge of Fennec.
Jan 30 17:48:49 <ShadowJK> Alterego, it shuts off before 3.2V anywy
Jan 30 17:49:16 <bigbrovar> dnaumov: seriously mine doesnt even get that close.
Jan 30 17:49:19 <DocScrutinizer51> Alterego: that's why the system shuts down before bat is really empty
Jan 30 17:49:36 <bigbrovar> dnaumov: i had to disable 3g all together to get a better batt life
Jan 30 17:50:36 <timeless_mbp> can someone help me?
Jan 30 17:50:42 <timeless_mbp> i'm trying to find a web site :)
Jan 30 17:50:49 <DocScrutinizer51> Alterego: actually storing LiIon without charge (or keep on full charge) is much worse than discharging it
Jan 30 17:51:19 <RST38h> And if you strike it with a nail, that would be much much much worse
Jan 30 17:51:23 * ShadowJK probably wouldn't run n900 until it shuts off by itself anyway
Jan 30 17:51:25 <kpel> timeless: sure, which site?
Jan 30 17:51:31 <RST38h> (and way more impressive than just storing it uncharged)
Jan 30 17:51:44 <villager> timeless_mbp: I have a site: www.youtube.com
Jan 30 17:51:56 <timeless_mbp> villager: i need to find a specific site
Jan 30 17:52:03 * timeless_mbp takes kpel up on his offer
Jan 30 17:52:05 <villager> timeless_mbp: well why don't you say it
Jan 30 17:53:34 <villager> maybe I've seen it, or someone else here has
Jan 30 17:54:13 <timeless_mbp> villager: yeah, if kpel can't find it, i'll ask for someone else to help
Jan 30 17:54:51 <villager> so it's kind of a secret site? allright
Jan 30 17:56:41 <kpel> you need to know the secret handshake
Jan 30 17:56:46 <timeless_mbp> nah, just too embarrassing
Jan 30 17:57:01 <timeless_mbp> sometimes it's much better for only one person to see me make a mistake :)
Jan 30 17:57:33 <lcuk> timeless, life.
Jan 30 18:00:53 * RST38h moos at lcuk slightly
Jan 30 18:01:34 * lcuk wonders if RST38h is ill
Jan 30 18:01:43 <lcuk> you have never mood so quietly
Jan 30 18:01:58 <viggi> Is it possible to connect to the internet via USB so that I could use the app manager, browser etc?
Jan 30 18:02:05 <viggi> on the n900*
Jan 30 18:02:20 <Stskeeps> yes
Jan 30 18:02:27 <Stskeeps> dummy connection and usbnet
Jan 30 18:02:33 <RST38h> lcuk: not ill pacified
Jan 30 18:03:08 <slonopotamus> firefox mobile == fennec?
Jan 30 18:03:22 <lcuk> RST38h, bah im just completely worn out
Jan 30 18:03:36 <lcuk> slonopotamus, yes afaik
Jan 30 18:03:56 <RST38h> slono: yes
Jan 30 18:03:59 <viggi> I guess i'll google around a bit then
Jan 30 18:04:09 <RST38h> lcuk: same here
Jan 30 18:05:15 <lcuk> RST38h, what have you been workin on?
Jan 30 18:06:40 <RST38h> lcuk: money.
Jan 30 18:07:16 <RST38h> lcuk: haven't done a thing on my own projects (maemo-related or otherwise) in weeks
Jan 30 18:08:09 <lcuk> i know the feeling, ive been too tired to do anything substantial
Jan 30 18:13:30 <Aquarina> hi, does maemo have support for ext3?
Jan 30 18:13:55 <luke-jr> yes
Jan 30 18:14:12 <luke-jr> but it's not a good idea
Jan 30 18:14:39 <luke-jr> ext3 is designed for magnetic disks, which I don't think can be connected to NITs :)
Jan 30 18:14:57 <Aquarina> mount: mounting /dev/mmcblk0p2 on /media/mer failed
Jan 30 18:15:27 <luke-jr> Aquarina: you probably need to insmod stuff
Jan 30 18:15:36 <luke-jr> or modprobe if M5 actually supports that
Jan 30 18:15:39 <Aquarina> I installed mer on a second partition on internal...
Jan 30 18:15:40 <Aquarina> ah ok
Jan 30 18:15:48 <Aquarina> insmod ext2?
Jan 30 18:16:07 <luke-jr> insmod requires a full path
Jan 30 18:16:20 <luke-jr> but seriously, yeah, use ext2 :)
Jan 30 18:16:30 <luke-jr> ext2 is better than ext3 on a SD card
Jan 30 18:16:32 <Aquarina> hum...
Jan 30 18:16:54 <Aquarina> where are the modles?
Jan 30 18:17:02 <Aquarina> /lib/modules?
Jan 30 18:17:21 <luke-jr> I think
Jan 30 18:17:40 <sp3000> mooodules.
Jan 30 18:18:11 <luke-jr> before my initfs got screwed up, I had Gentoo make the files needed for modprobe <.<
Jan 30 18:18:32 <Aquarina> /lib/dsp/modules?
Jan 30 18:20:04 <luke-jr> Aquarina: /lib/modules
Jan 30 18:20:05 <luke-jr>  -.-
Jan 30 18:20:12 <Aquarina> no
Jan 30 18:20:20 <Aquarina> they're not there
Jan 30 18:20:42 <luke-jr> should be
Jan 30 18:21:12 <ShadowJK> on N8x0 /mnt/initfs/lib/modules/2.6.21-omap1/
Jan 30 18:21:36 <luke-jr> ShadowJK: even on N8x0, /lib/modules has symlinks
Jan 30 18:22:06 <Aquarina> hum... ok
Jan 30 18:22:08 <ShadowJK> oh it's there too
Jan 30 18:23:11 <Aquarina> insmod: cannot insert 'ext2.ko': Unknown symbol in module (-1): No such file or directory
Jan 30 18:23:13 <Aquarina> :-(
Jan 30 18:23:27 <luke-jr> Aquarina: insmod also doesn't resolve dependencies :)
Jan 30 18:23:34 <luke-jr> I think ext2's sole dep is 'mbcache'
Jan 30 18:23:34 <Aquarina> ah ok
Jan 30 18:23:35 <Aquarina> !
Jan 30 18:23:48 <Aquarina> try that...
Jan 30 18:24:14 <Aquarina> modprobe: cannot parse modules.dep X-(
Jan 30 18:24:32 <luke-jr> insmod
Jan 30 18:24:33 <ShadowJK> use insmod then
Jan 30 18:24:47 <luke-jr> or if you by some miracle have it, depmod -a :)
Jan 30 18:25:00 <Aquarina> :-)
Jan 30 18:25:41 <Aquarina> mount /dev/mmcblk0p2 mer/ -t ext2
Jan 30 18:25:41 <Aquarina> mount: mounting /dev/mmcblk0p2 on mer/ failed
Jan 30 18:25:43 <Aquarina> :-(
Jan 30 18:25:50 <Aquarina> ;-P
Jan 30 18:26:04 <Aquarina> ah!
Jan 30 18:26:07 <Aquarina> w8
Jan 30 18:26:09 <Aquarina> p3
Jan 30 18:26:11 <Aquarina> :-)
Jan 30 18:27:02 <Aquarina> ok, mounted mer
Jan 30 18:27:18 <luke-jr> :)
Jan 30 18:27:35 <Aquarina> now... how do I disable automatic login on maemo? It must be the same in mer...
Jan 30 18:27:45 <Aquarina> luke-jr, tks
Jan 30 18:28:39 <luke-jr> Maemo supports multi-user?
Jan 30 18:28:49 <Stskeeps> not really
Jan 30 18:28:58 <petey2> erm ... Does the facebook widget mobile upload not work? It says processing but nothing appears on facebook. Neither videos or pics...
Jan 30 18:29:57 <Aquarina> I tryed to usermod user
Jan 30 18:30:04 <Aquarina> change it's name
Jan 30 18:30:14 <Aquarina> and maemo wouldn't start
Jan 30 18:30:20 <Aquarina> reboot loop
Jan 30 18:30:21 <Aquarina> :-(
Jan 30 18:31:51 <Aquarina> I'd like to try to save my maemo install
Jan 30 18:32:00 <Aquarina> I ruined it by installing gdm
Jan 30 18:32:02 <Aquarina> :-(
Jan 30 18:33:16 <Aquarina> can I chrout inside maemo?... let's try...
Jan 30 18:33:27 <luke-jr> yes
Jan 30 18:33:34 <petey2> is it possible to save what apps one has so that things are reinstalled after a flash?
Jan 30 18:33:47 <lcuk> petey2, use the backup tool
Jan 30 18:33:55 <lcuk> it backs up repositories and list of installed apps
Jan 30 18:34:00 <lcuk> as well as data from those apps
Jan 30 18:34:03 <lcuk> much more sensible
Jan 30 18:34:06 <petey2> lcuk nice 1 ! is it preinstalled?
Jan 30 18:34:10 <Aquarina> :-)
Jan 30 18:34:11 <lcuk> of course
Jan 30 18:34:38 <luke-jr> lcuk: unless the repository has removed the apps <.<
Jan 30 18:35:11 <lcuk> luke-jr, maemo.org extras respoitory is stable and the contents will outlast you
Jan 30 18:35:32 <lcuk> and of course, if you are installing apps from unstable temporary repository thats your tough shit
Jan 30 18:35:58 <petey2> This phone is pure awesomeness. Its like eating a pizza when you've been starving for 2 days. Its fantastic. I love it.
Jan 30 18:36:07 <Aquarina> hehe
Jan 30 18:36:17 <Aquarina> I think I managed to uninstall gdm
Jan 30 18:36:40 <Aquarina> now... what do I need to install on maemo to have the boot menu back?
Jan 30 18:36:40 <petey2> where is the backup stored and does the backup remain on the device after a flash?
Jan 30 18:36:48 <Aquarina> to be able to boot mer
Jan 30 18:36:49 <Aquarina> ?
Jan 30 18:37:13 <lcuk> petey2, the backup is stored on the MyDocs EMMC partition which persists a normal reflash
Jan 30 18:37:28 <lcuk> if you manually download and reflash the eMMC it will be vaped
Jan 30 18:37:34 <lcuk> but thats not the normal routine
Jan 30 18:38:30 <Aquarina> Stskeeps, why do you say it's not a multiuer capable system?
Jan 30 18:38:44 <Stskeeps> maemo isn't, it's designed as a single user one
Jan 30 18:38:56 <Aquarina> ok, but...
Jan 30 18:39:04 <luke-jr> Aquarina: for example, the name 'user' is hardcoded in various places
Jan 30 18:39:30 <Aquarina> that's what i discovered when I changed it to my normal username
Jan 30 18:39:32 <Aquarina> :-(
Jan 30 18:39:33 <Aquarina> hehe
Jan 30 18:39:42 <Aquarina> what about mer?
Jan 30 18:39:55 <Stskeeps> it is designed to be one but we might revert for compatibility's sake
Jan 30 18:39:56 <Aquarina> will I be able to user mer with multiple users?
Jan 30 18:40:39 <Aquarina> I'd realy would like it to be more multiuser
Jan 30 18:40:41 <Aquarina> :-)
Jan 30 18:40:59 * Wizzup wonders if firefox is in the repos now
Jan 30 18:41:32 <Aquarina> well... back from dreams 4 a moment...
Jan 30 18:41:53 <Aquarina> how do I clone maemo to an sd card so I can play with it?
Jan 30 18:42:16 <Aquarina> I'd like to be able to install mer from that second maemo install
Jan 30 18:42:35 <Aquarina> so the first one could be as default and simple as possible
Jan 30 18:42:50 <lcuk> Aquarina, the mer installation instructions get it onto your device
Jan 30 18:43:00 <lcuk> not sure how to clone maemo itself yet
Jan 30 18:43:17 <lcuk> if no1 has yet, it would be an interesting thing to dig into and document
Jan 30 18:43:42 <Aquarina> lcuk, I know... but I would have to install a bunch of other stuff on maemo just to put mer on the divice
Jan 30 18:43:56 <Aquarina> I'd rather do it from another test environment
Jan 30 18:45:13 <lcuk> i thought the footprint required to do dualboot was eextremely minimal and non invasive
Jan 30 18:45:23 <lcuk> theres even a low level entry point on normal maemo bootup
Jan 30 18:46:27 <Aquarina> hum...
Jan 30 18:46:29 <Aquarina> ok
Jan 30 18:46:47 <Aquarina> another thing: how do I get xhost on the device?
Jan 30 18:46:56 <Aquarina> what .deb is it in?
Jan 30 18:47:05 <Aquarina> I can't seem to find it!!!
Jan 30 18:47:16 <lcuk> whats xhost
Jan 30 18:47:33 <lcuk> and what package is it included in for other platforms
Jan 30 18:47:40 <Aquarina> to allow me to X forward
Jan 30 18:47:54 <Aquarina> it's on xauth, I think!..
Jan 30 18:47:59 <Aquarina> lemme check
Jan 30 18:48:08 <lcuk> xforwarding? i thought that was normal
Jan 30 18:48:12 <lcuk> and built in?
Jan 30 18:48:20 <lcuk> im sure ive seen that done
Jan 30 18:48:54 <lcuk> or am i mixing my metaphors
Jan 30 18:48:57 <Aquarina> x11-xserver-utils: /usr/bin/xhost
Jan 30 18:49:43 <DocScrutinizer51> how would I possibly view the call history during a call?
Jan 30 18:53:18 <Aquarina> brb
Jan 30 19:19:09 <TomaszD> evening
Jan 30 19:20:20 <Shapeshifter> ._.
Jan 30 19:20:56 <plastun> 'Mnemosyne for Maemo' is available from Diablo-extras repository!
Jan 30 19:37:05 <chx> hi. do we have rumours of what to expect at Mobile World Congress 2010 ? Nothing ? Small upgrade to N900? Announcement of the "next step", the mainstream phone?
Jan 30 19:37:46 <chx> also do we know how joikuspot works on the N900 given https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=6097 ?
Jan 30 19:37:47 <povbot> Bug 6097: add support for master mode
Jan 30 19:54:28 <ioeee> hi
Jan 30 19:58:08 <petur> good evening... my brand new n900 is driving me up the walls with a sound notification twice every hour (:25 and :55), the sound being that of an empty battery (3 descending tones). Battery is full and it even does this while on the charger. No alarms programmed. Any ideas?
Jan 30 19:59:30 <eean> petur: no other notifications/
Jan 30 19:59:33 <eean> eg email
Jan 30 19:59:42 <petur> no
Jan 30 19:59:57 <petur> and it is very regular, every :25 and :55
Jan 30 20:01:13 <Zoup> guess its top question of FAQ, but any idea how can i upgrade my flash player on n900 to version 10?
Jan 30 20:01:26 <slonopotamus> Zoup, no wai
Jan 30 20:01:49 <Zoup> slonopotamus: and it will never be possible in future?
Jan 30 20:02:04 <slonopotamus> Zoup, i'd bet no.
Jan 30 20:02:38 <Zoup> slonopotamus: thanks pal, flash performance sucks on my n900, its like 1 frame per second :))
Jan 30 20:03:27 <slonopotamus> Zoup, it plays youtube. why else you need flash?
Jan 30 20:04:01 <Zoup> slonopotamus: other website, sport websites for example, they do have 3-4 flash file per page and it seems that flash block is not working as well :(
Jan 30 20:04:43 <Nitial> adobe has already demoed flash 10.1 on n900
Jan 30 20:04:47 <Nitial> some months ago
Jan 30 20:05:03 <Zoup> Nitial: hum, so there wil be a chance for that?
Jan 30 20:05:11 <Nitial> I would say so
Jan 30 20:05:20 <Zoup> anyone get flashblock working on n900?
Jan 30 20:07:00 * petur reboots his n900 to see if that stops the damn notifications
Jan 30 20:08:07 <slonopotamus> macromedia/adobe has totally uncomprehencible policy of keeping flash closed, leading to bad coverage of devices.
Jan 30 20:09:27 <[Tycho]> Go, Silverlight :)
Jan 30 20:09:48 <slonopotamus> [Tycho], ...
Jan 30 20:10:05 <slonopotamus> [Tycho], ms policy is the same.
Jan 30 20:12:15 <doc|home> haha
Jan 30 20:12:37 <doc|home> slonopotamus: not entirely incomprehensible. They make money selling a flash creation tool.
Jan 30 20:13:10 <slonopotamus> doc|home, so why they don't want player to be on as many platforms as possible?
Jan 30 20:13:31 <doc|home> slonopotamus: because if they explained how the format worked fully it would be easier to create a creation tool
Jan 30 20:14:04 <Alterego> I'm reading the tmo thread about no m6 support for N900 and lack of enhancements & fixes for fremantle. Pretty funny.
Jan 30 20:14:32 <Alterego> I should just ask them to donate their devices to me ....
Jan 30 20:14:43 <Ken-Young> Alterego, What's m6 ?
Jan 30 20:14:55 <Ken-Young> Maemo 6?
Jan 30 20:15:00 <Alterego> yeah
Jan 30 20:15:52 <Ken-Young> It is difficult to understand Nokia's strategy.
Jan 30 20:16:09 <Alterego> Strategy?
Jan 30 20:16:16 <doc|home> they have one?
Jan 30 20:16:51 <w00t> <groan>
Jan 30 20:17:57 <Alterego> I'm positive all major bugs and a few enhancements will all be available to N900 users. I can't understand why people think they should get more than that...
Jan 30 20:20:07 <GeneralAntilles> Alterego, because that's where the competition is now.
Jan 30 20:20:23 <GeneralAntilles> Alterego, g1 iPhones are still supported by the latest iPhone OS release.
Jan 30 20:20:30 <Alterego> Anyway, I keep getting this inkling that part of the development plan is to put m6 alpha images on developers N900's
Jan 30 20:20:41 <w00t> GeneralAntilles: did you read Stskeeps' replies on there?
Jan 30 20:20:42 <slonopotamus> so
Jan 30 20:20:47 <Alterego> Erm, G1 isn't
Jan 30 20:21:07 <slonopotamus> my skype can't connect for a day now. is it normal?
Jan 30 20:21:09 <Alterego> iPhone is somewhat limited really.
Jan 30 20:21:12 <Zoup> hey guys, how can i restart browser?! do i have to restart device?
Jan 30 20:21:15 <slonopotamus> on n900
Jan 30 20:21:26 <Alterego> Heh
Jan 30 20:21:37 <mtnbkr> Alterego: and full of DRM badness and iTunes/Apple lock-in
Jan 30 20:21:38 <w00t> Zoup: erm.. I don't understand
Jan 30 20:22:00 <Zoup> w00t: i have installed some addone on microb, it asking for restart, ill click on restart and nothing happens
Jan 30 20:22:18 <GeneralAntilles> w00t, yes.
Jan 30 20:22:26 <w00t> I think microb is bad with addons, frankly. but I haven't had time to research that..
Jan 30 20:22:35 <Ken-Young> Just think of how much more successful the iPhone would be if each model's owners were separated into their onw little OS ghetto.
Jan 30 20:22:40 <w00t> I've had all sorts of funky problems trying to get them to work..
Jan 30 20:22:52 <mtnbkr> I can not for the life of me understand wy Apple won't just plot the ogg-vorbis libraries on their ipds and iPhones
Jan 30 20:23:00 <mtnbkr> s/plot/plop
Jan 30 20:23:13 <w00t> GeneralAntilles: really: I don't think it's worth worrying more about until an official position is made public
Jan 30 20:23:27 <w00t> GeneralAntilles: worries have been made very vocal and clear, I think :P
Jan 30 20:23:37 <Ken-Young> s/onw/own/
Jan 30 20:23:37 <infobot> Ken-Young meant: Just think of how much more successful the iPhone would be if each model's owners were separated into their own little OS ghetto.
Jan 30 20:24:57 <GeneralAntilles> w00t, the official position _I_ heard was that it wasn't coming due to capacitive BS.
Jan 30 20:25:27 <w00t> GeneralAntilles: I've heard _rumours_ of that, too, but I've never seen it on paper in front of me, and really, until I see that, I'll continue to disbelieve it
Jan 30 20:25:36 <GeneralAntilles> w00t, I was sitting in the room. :)
Jan 30 20:25:36 <w00t> because it doesn't make sense, frankly
Jan 30 20:26:21 <GeneralAntilles> w00t, I agree, which I why I regret boing the jerk off the stage.
Jan 30 20:26:27 <GeneralAntilles> _not_
Jan 30 20:26:33 <w00t> so either it was a mistake, or they were pitching BS as a ploy to see what the reaction would be towards not having m6 compatibility
Jan 30 20:27:00 <w00t> but if that is really the case, then well, there's going to be upset people, yeah - and I think they realise that now
Jan 30 20:27:21 * GeneralAntilles did do some quiet snorting.
Jan 30 20:27:39 <w00t> I'd have been rather more vocal than that, yeah :P
Jan 30 20:28:14 <GeneralAntilles> w00t, well, the talk was in Spanish, hard to object in English 5 seconds after it was said. ;)
Jan 30 20:28:37 <w00t> GeneralAntilles: nah, just throw things at them and scream "you iPhone loving bastard"
Jan 30 20:28:40 <w00t> I'm sure he'll get the point
Jan 30 20:28:47 <GeneralAntilles> w00t, hehe.
Jan 30 20:29:06 <w00t> when was the m6 device (tentatively) announced for anyway? 2010?
Jan 30 20:29:12 <GeneralAntilles> 2h2010
Jan 30 20:29:15 <GeneralAntilles> So, Christmas.
Jan 30 20:29:30 <w00t> joy, I get another christmas of financial disaster to look forward to
Jan 30 20:29:31 <w00t> *g*
Jan 30 20:29:42 <Alterego> heh
Jan 30 20:29:42 <GeneralAntilles> w00t, bump your karma and whore for a proto or a discount.
Jan 30 20:29:59 <w00t> I don't whore. I do need to be rather more active than I am, though
Jan 30 20:30:16 <w00t> I have plans on that front that I am working towards, thankfully
Jan 30 20:30:47 <w00t> today was going to be some more work towards that, but alas, I'm so hungover from yesterday that I am frankly nonfunctional for anything except idle chatter
Jan 30 20:31:01 * w00t swears to never ever drink again
Jan 30 20:31:10 <mece> W00t, never say never :)
Jan 30 20:31:29 <GeneralAntilles> Hehehe
Jan 30 20:31:32 <RevdKathy> You need to add a 'till tomorrow' to that statement, w00t
Jan 30 20:31:50 <w00t> RevdKathy: yeah, I know it'll happen
Jan 30 20:31:57 <w00t> this is just what I say after every bad episode
Jan 30 20:31:59 <w00t> and bad it has been
Jan 30 20:32:10 <w00t> 4 hours of sleep, plus a 2 hour nap at 5pm this afternoon
Jan 30 20:32:25 <RevdKathy> oh dear - all night bender?
Jan 30 20:32:36 <w00t> nah.. I just drank far too much redbull with the vodka
Jan 30 20:32:42 <w00t> big big big mistake
Jan 30 20:32:59 <RevdKathy> ouchies! one to put yo to sleep, and one to keep ou awake. The mix screws up the system
Jan 30 20:33:05 <w00t> yeah.
Jan 30 20:33:11 <w00t> hi btw, how's sheep going ;)
Jan 30 20:33:23 <RevdKathy> red bull = breakfast, vodka = supper
Jan 30 20:33:29 <RevdKathy> Sheep are BRILLIANT!
Jan 30 20:33:32 <mece> hey, if i create a directory called .bleh/ in MyDocs, will the tracker index that, or will it be "hidden" from it?
Jan 30 20:33:36 <RevdKathy> now in extras-devel
Jan 30 20:33:37 <sheepbat> yes, we are
Jan 30 20:33:43 * w00t blinks
Jan 30 20:33:45 <w00t> that was unexpected :P
Jan 30 20:33:52 <Jaffa> X-Fade: ping
Jan 30 20:33:54 <sheepbat> baa
Jan 30 20:33:56 <mece> RevdKathy, cool!
Jan 30 20:34:01 <mece> baa indeed.
Jan 30 20:34:04 <RevdKathy> Baaa back, shhepbat
Jan 30 20:34:14 <RevdKathy> seriously, it's a really nice game
Jan 30 20:34:22 <RevdKathy> Hopebeat has done a bang up dob
Jan 30 20:34:25 <RevdKathy> job
Jan 30 20:34:37 <RevdKathy> blast - ginger wine has gone straight to my finger tips!
Jan 30 20:35:04 <Jaffa> lcuk: Launch MWKN issue is shaping up for Monday, BTW :-)
Jan 30 20:36:00 <RevdKathy> that's good news, Jaffa. I'm looking forward to that
Jan 30 20:36:13 <RevdKathy> can we get a shout in it for the Sheep project
Jan 30 20:36:25 <RevdKathy> pretty please
Jan 30 20:36:26 <Jaffa> RevdKathy: Sure, URL?
Jan 30 20:37:00 <RevdKathy> the whole thread is here: http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=36198
Jan 30 20:37:41 <RevdKathy> todays important news about it being in extras-devel is here http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=36198&page=14
Jan 30 20:37:41 <Jaffa> RevdKathy: That doesn't say where to get it, or have a screenshot :-/
Jan 30 20:37:49 <Jaffa> RevdKathy: Ah, perfect.
Jan 30 20:37:57 <RevdKathy> it really is an exemplar of the community at work collaboratively
Jan 30 20:38:43 <RevdKathy> about three artists, a dev, a sheep-impressionist, a bunch of ideas, encouragers and a demented teddy bear make a powerful team!
Jan 30 20:39:15 <Jaffa> RevdKathy: Thank's for the quote :)
Jan 30 20:39:21 <RevdKathy> LOL!
Jan 30 20:39:24 <Jaffa> s/'s//
Jan 30 20:39:24 <infobot> Jaffa meant: RevdKathy: Thank for the quote :)
Jan 30 20:39:40 <woglinde> lol
Jan 30 20:39:56 <RevdKathy> I gotcha. My fingers are very 'Saturday night' tonight, Jaffa. The ginger wine went right to my typing
Jan 30 20:39:59 <Hoxzer> is there a way to add more on screen buttons to x terminal?
Jan 30 20:40:12 * Jaffa needs to wait for mgedmin's IRC log to update
Jan 30 20:40:23 <mgedmin> cron job every 5 minutes
Jan 30 20:40:30 <Jaffa> mgedmin: Ta
Jan 30 20:40:32 <mat0ng> hi everybody, i'm trying to use the function hildon_gtk_hscale_new() in python, but it seems as if it's not available.. http://maemo.org/api_refs/5.0/5.0-final/hildon/hildon-Additions-to-GTK+.html#hildon-gtk-hscale-new
Jan 30 20:40:37 <mgedmin> or strip the '.html' suffix from URL and see the raw log in realtime
Jan 30 20:40:40 <mat0ng> has anybody used it?
Jan 30 20:41:32 <Khertan> Hi !
Jan 30 20:41:56 <Khertan> If i want to sell an app on ovi store
Jan 30 20:41:59 <RevdKathy> Hi back, Hhertan
Jan 30 20:42:06 <Jaffa> RevdKathy: Submitted it into the MWKN content (i.e. Twitter) feed - it'll show up at http://twitter.com/mwkn and then that gets fleshed out into the issue tomorrow night.
Jan 30 20:42:06 <RevdKathy> Khertan
Jan 30 20:42:11 <Khertan> is there any documentation information somewhere ?
Jan 30 20:42:55 <RevdKathy> thanks Jaffa. I want the team to get as much credit as possible - they've been brilliant
Jan 30 20:43:20 <mece> Khertan, start here: https://publish.ovi.com/info/ I suppose
Jan 30 20:43:30 <Khertan> oh thx
Jan 30 20:44:11 <Cabletwitch> Aha, there we go.
Jan 30 20:44:39 <Cabletwitch> Alright peeps, hows it going?
Jan 30 20:45:05 <Khertan> 50$ entry right
Jan 30 20:45:08 <Khertan> beurk
Jan 30 20:47:20 <Jaffa> Anyone know if there's an API for retrieving user access from maemo.org username, apart from screenscraping?
Jan 30 20:51:38 <Claviceps> POWERAID - POWERAID - POWERAID - POWERAID - POWERAID - POWERAID - POWERAID - POWERAID - POWERAID - POWERAID - POWERAID - POWERAID
Jan 30 20:51:39 <Claviceps> POWERAID - POWERAID - POWERAID - POWERAID - POWERAID - POWERAID - POWERAID - POWERAID - POWERAID - POWERAID - POWERAID - POWERAID
Jan 30 20:51:41 <Claviceps> POWERAID - POWERAID - POWERAID - POWERAID - POWERAID - POWERAID - POWERAID - POWERAID - POWERAID - POWERAID - POWERAID - POWERAID
Jan 30 20:51:44 <Claviceps> POWERAID - POWERAID - POWERAID - POWERAID - POWERAID - POWERAID - POWERAID - POWERAID - POWERAID - POWERAID - POWERAID - POWERAID
Jan 30 20:51:46 <Claviceps> POWERAID - POWERAID - POWERAID - POWERAID - POWERAID - POWERAID - POWERAID - POWERAID - POWERAID - POWERAID - POWERAID - POWERAID
Jan 30 20:51:47 <Tonzas> :)
Jan 30 20:51:49 <Claviceps> sportsdrink of the NFL
Jan 30 20:51:52 <Claviceps> sportsdrink of the UFC
Jan 30 20:51:56 <Claviceps> sportsdrink of the NBA
Jan 30 20:52:02 <Claviceps> POWERAID - POWERAID - POWERAID - POWERAID - POWERAID - POWERAID - POWERAID - POWERAID - POWERAID - POWERAID - POWERAID - POWERAID
Jan 30 20:52:04 <Claviceps> POWERAID - POWERAID - POWERAID - POWERAID - POWERAID - POWERAID - POWERAID - POWERAID - POWERAID - POWERAID - POWERAID - POWERAID
Jan 30 20:52:04 <Claviceps> POWERAID - POWERAID - POWERAID - POWERAID - POWERAID - POWERAID - POWERAID - POWERAID - POWERAID - POWERAID - POWERAID - POWERAID
Jan 30 20:52:06 <Claviceps> POWERAID - POWERAID - POWERAID - POWERAID - POWERAID - POWERAID - POWERAID - POWERAID - POWERAID - POWERAID - POWERAID - POWERAID
Jan 30 20:52:08 <RevdKathy> We can Haz a spammer
Jan 30 20:52:11 <thresh> what an ass hole
Jan 30 20:52:33 <andre__> heh.
Jan 30 20:52:34 <Ken-Young> But, but, but - I came here to hear about Sportsdrinks!
Jan 30 20:53:25 <Cabletwitch> Why do people even try doing that anymore?
Jan 30 20:57:04 <mece> Khertan, have you got a minute extra? I have some questions regarding packaging py, and I understand you have some skills :)
Jan 30 20:57:34 <TomaszD> Cabletwitch, I've no idea but I suddenly got the urge to drink a poweraid, whatever that is
Jan 30 20:57:41 <mece> LOL
Jan 30 20:58:37 <Cabletwitch> Heh, theres always one who falls for it, I guess.
Jan 30 20:59:43 <TomaszD> these ads get more and more sophisticated man, that one was almost like NLP
Jan 30 21:00:28 <Cabletwitch> So yes, I thought I'd come and see what the IRC channel was about. New user here, N900. Never used any linux based system to date.
Jan 30 21:03:22 <TomaszD> Cabletwitch, so, how do you like it so far?
Jan 30 21:03:57 <Cabletwitch> Well, it all works with considerably less buggering about than I expected.
Jan 30 21:04:16 <doc|home> that's not even how you spell powerade
Jan 30 21:04:33 <TomaszD> ahh, I knew I heard the name somewhere!
Jan 30 21:04:50 <Cabletwitch> My experience of linux in the past has been largely watching others screwing about in command lines, and the brown mess that is ubuntu.
Jan 30 21:05:02 <sp3000> well it is the misspelled beverages channel
Jan 30 21:05:56 <doc|home> Cabletwitch: that's why people value real experience
Jan 30 21:07:23 <Cabletwitch> I'm still not the kind of person to run linux as a main system, as I'm primarily a gamer. I got the N900 because its A) Not an iPhone and B) The reviews were very good.
Jan 30 21:07:46 <mat0ng> my personal favorite comment of people watching you work in a shell: "why are you still working in that crappy DOS system?" :P
Jan 30 21:07:59 <TomaszD> Cabletwitch, I encourage you not to go to the terminal unless you really know what you're doing. Other than that, have fun. And that brown mess, while considered not cool by the nerds, is actually quite good.
Jan 30 21:08:09 <Cabletwitch> But, I'm here to learn things, and possibly throw a few ideas about too.
Jan 30 21:08:44 <Cabletwitch> I dont doubt it. I like the silver-blue mess that is XP though.
Jan 30 21:09:22 * Cabletwitch has had the preachers try to 'convert' him a few too m"y times... XD
Jan 30 21:09:45 * RevdKathy promises never to try to conver anyone to anything other than maemo
Jan 30 21:09:47 <wolf^> mat0ng, for extra points do "export PS1='C:\> '
Jan 30 21:09:59 <mat0ng> hehe
Jan 30 21:10:34 <mtnbkr> wolf^: lol
Jan 30 21:11:35 <Cabletwitch> Still, I'm here to get to grips with maemo.
Jan 30 21:11:44 * mtnbkr has a client who STILL uses DOS workstations connected to a novell server (server is virtual in VMWare ESX of course) but seriously... DOS in 2010... 
Jan 30 21:11:55 <mat0ng> the accelerometer can measure the angle the device is in right?
Jan 30 21:12:12 <SpeedEvil> mat0ng: sort-of.
Jan 30 21:12:41 <n1c0> anyone know how to install skype on n900 ?
Jan 30 21:13:01 <Pavel> n1c0: It comes with Skype.
Jan 30 21:13:02 <mtnbkr> n1c0: it's BUILT-IN ;)
Jan 30 21:13:04 <Cabletwitch> Ok, simple question. Is there any way to get the date displayed in the clock area?
Jan 30 21:13:04 <RevdKathy> skype is preinstalled, just confiugre it n1co
Jan 30 21:13:09 <n1c0> i ve not it
Jan 30 21:13:09 <SpeedEvil> mat0ng: for a stationary device, neglecting gain and bias issues,they can measure the orientation. For a moving n900 - measuring the orientation more than approximately is hard
Jan 30 21:13:23 <n1c0> i buy it with phone abonement
Jan 30 21:13:26 <SpeedEvil> Cabletwitch: don't think so.
Jan 30 21:13:29 <inz> PS1="C:\$(pwd|tr '/' '\\\\\')> "
Jan 30 21:13:32 <Cabletwitch> Its driving me mad, yet I cant find any option to do this.
Jan 30 21:13:49 <mat0ng> the n900 has a stand you can flip out so you can watch movies etc. what if... you would monitor if it is in the angle you get when you put in on the stand and then after a few seconds to start the media player
Jan 30 21:13:49 <SpeedEvil> Cabletwitch: there are I think widgets to put it on the desktop
Jan 30 21:13:57 <mtnbkr> inz: heh   yeah, almost forgot dumb-dows back-slashes.
Jan 30 21:14:00 <TomaszD> Cabletwitch, no, there is no option for this. There might be a widget, not sure.
Jan 30 21:14:05 <SpeedEvil> mat0ng: hmm.
Jan 30 21:14:10 <SpeedEvil> mat0ng: not an insane idea.
Jan 30 21:14:42 <n1c0> cool nice integration
Jan 30 21:14:58 <mat0ng> maybe too much of a battery hog if you write a service for it though
Jan 30 21:15:02 <n1c0> im a bit scary a fuccking isp has remove it
Jan 30 21:15:08 <n1c0> but no pb :!
Jan 30 21:15:23 <gomiam> erm... quick oldie question: is it possible to use N800 as a bluetooth audio device for a mobile?
Jan 30 21:15:51 <Toba> is the GPS on the n900 better than the n810 GPS?
Jan 30 21:16:02 <gomiam> I'm asking St. Google but I get nowhere :)
Jan 30 21:16:05 <Toba> I don't want to buy another tablet with "gps" that doesn't work well
Jan 30 21:16:07 <Cabletwitch> SpeedEvil: Ahh. Ok. its just a pain to have to call the menu associated with that bar to see the date.
Jan 30 21:16:09 <SpeedEvil> Toba: there are open bugs witht he GPS.
Jan 30 21:16:13 <Toba> balls
Jan 30 21:16:23 <SpeedEvil> Toba: but - IME - it works very well.
Jan 30 21:16:32 <Toba> where do you live
Jan 30 21:16:37 <SpeedEvil> Toba: and the bugs all are being worked on.
Jan 30 21:16:40 <Toba> and what's the cold acquire time like?
Jan 30 21:16:46 <SpeedEvil> Toba: apparantly, in the middle of the atlantic.
Jan 30 21:16:48 <SpeedEvil> :)
Jan 30 21:16:58 <Toba> how does "IME it works very well" jive with that
Jan 30 21:16:58 <Toba> then
Jan 30 21:17:00 <SpeedEvil> Toba: It depends - with or without network assist.
Jan 30 21:17:01 <Cabletwitch> Its A-GPS, isnt it?
Jan 30 21:17:06 <SpeedEvil> Cabletwitch: yes
Jan 30 21:17:15 <Toba> the n810 supposedly has agps too
Jan 30 21:17:19 <Toba> and it works horribly for me
Jan 30 21:17:24 <Toba> almost never acquires anything
Jan 30 21:17:29 <Toba> worse than no gps
Jan 30 21:17:29 <SpeedEvil> Toba: ok - checking - I last used the GPS a couple of days ago. Going to door
Jan 30 21:17:48 <Toba> thanks for checking :D
Jan 30 21:17:58 <johnsq> Hi
Jan 30 21:18:02 <Toba> hi
Jan 30 21:18:13 <gomiam> SpeedEvil: at least you don't live mid-South Pacific (R'lyeh anyone? ;)
Jan 30 21:18:57 <SpeedEvil> Till I get a GPS fix - 8s
Jan 30 21:19:03 <SpeedEvil> till it gets within 50m - 10s
Jan 30 21:19:15 <SpeedEvil> that's about typical.
Jan 30 21:19:19 <Cabletwitch> The one thing I dont like with the N900 is the battery life when using GSM connections.
Jan 30 21:20:01 <SpeedEvil> If you haven't been using GPS in a while - a day? And you have no internet or GSM connection - it can take a lot longer.
Jan 30 21:20:09 <SpeedEvil> That's in process of being fixed.
Jan 30 21:20:52 <SpeedEvil> https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=7026
Jan 30 21:20:53 <povbot> Bug 7026: Can't get a GPS lock with several satellites at view
Jan 30 21:21:55 <Cabletwitch> I do like the wifi in this, it seems so much better at maintaining wifi links than my old E70
Jan 30 21:22:00 <luke-jr> SpeedEvil: you mean there's a bugreport
Jan 30 21:22:15 <luke-jr> N8x0's GPS problems had bugs, but never got fixed
Jan 30 21:22:19 <janszoon> So with the option "Share with service" there is a compression going on for photos and videos. Why can't this also be applied to emails? I know I can do it manually but....seems the function is already there for services...?
Jan 30 21:22:26 <Cabletwitch> All in all, its a rather lovely OS.
Jan 30 21:22:38 <SpeedEvil> luke-jr: well - yes.
Jan 30 21:23:16 <SpeedEvil> luke-jr: I mean - internal alias - someone not unimportant to the problem seeming to be interested - ...
Jan 30 21:23:29 <SpeedEvil> luke-jr: at least some internal links - see location-test-gui
Jan 30 21:24:12 <Cabletwitch> I wonder... could the screen on the 900 support multi-touch?
Jan 30 21:24:32 <SpeedEvil> nope.
Jan 30 21:24:33 <Cabletwitch> Not that I can think of a use for it, tbh
Jan 30 21:24:42 <SpeedEvil> Well - in principle you can swap the screen for one that does.
Jan 30 21:24:44 <SpeedEvil> But...
Jan 30 21:24:46 * timeless_mbp grumbles
Jan 30 21:24:51 * timeless_mbp needs to rewrite history
Jan 30 21:25:02 <range> Careful with that.
Jan 30 21:25:22 <SpeedEvil> the screen neitehr supports or does not support multitouch - the digitiser does that - and can be swapped. (at authorised repair centres)
Jan 30 21:25:31 <Cabletwitch> Nah, I'm happy with this screen.
Jan 30 21:25:33 <range> timeless_mbp: http://www.abyssandapex.com/200710-wikihistory.html
Jan 30 21:25:35 <SpeedEvil> But - there is no replacement part.
Jan 30 21:27:54 <hcarrega_> anyone using pidgin plugin for facebook chat?
Jan 30 21:31:09 <DocScrutinizer> hum, UMTS really sucks battcharge so there's definitely no tomorrow - at least with SIP and IRC (8 chan)
Jan 30 21:31:54 <SpeedEvil> locking it on GSM can help
Jan 30 21:31:57 <SpeedEvil> but...
Jan 30 21:32:16 <Cabletwitch> Nokia need to hurry up and make a hi-cap battery :O)
Jan 30 21:32:53 <DocScrutinizer> SpeedEvil: eventually will try that. Got the nice GSM/UMTS/DUAL systray selector applet
Jan 30 21:32:56 <gomiam> hcarrega: I think I have Facebook set up
Jan 30 21:33:11 <hcarrega> i put the login
Jan 30 21:33:12 <hcarrega> passwd
Jan 30 21:33:18 <hcarrega> and try to sign
Jan 30 21:33:22 <hcarrega> but nothing
Jan 30 21:33:41 <gomiam> oh, let me try and start it
Jan 30 21:33:45 <hcarrega> ok
Jan 30 21:33:48 <hcarrega> thanks
Jan 30 21:34:09 <Cabletwitch> I'd love it if xchat used the auto-capitals present in the OS.
Jan 30 21:35:02 <gomiam> ouch, I don't have the Facebook extension installed at this n800
Jan 30 21:35:12 <gomiam> hold on...
Jan 30 21:35:15 <hcarrega> k
Jan 30 21:35:25 <b-man|N900> v/me is mnot soo keen of auto-capitals xD
Jan 30 21:35:38 <b-man|N900> ***not
Jan 30 21:35:57 <SpeedEvil> It would be nice as an option.
Jan 30 21:35:57 * b-man|N900 is still getting use to the kb xD
Jan 30 21:36:06 <SpeedEvil> What would be lots cooler would be a corrector
Jan 30 21:36:25 * DocScrutinizer still refuses to get used to the crippled German kbd
Jan 30 21:36:43 <SpeedEvil> for example - if you see ecsmple - correct it to example.
Jan 30 21:36:59 <Cabletwitch> Auto-caps at the start of a sentence is nice to have.
Jan 30 21:37:08 <DocScrutinizer> SpeedEvil: rasters predictive kbd ;-P
Jan 30 21:37:35 <SpeedEvil> yeah
Jan 30 21:37:42 <SpeedEvil> that sort of thing
Jan 30 21:37:52 <DocScrutinizer> SpeedEvil: though had to learn to cope with leftots and douublettes
Jan 30 21:38:08 <SpeedEvil> yeah
Jan 30 21:38:10 <Cabletwitch> ecsmple looks like a cli command...
Jan 30 21:38:40 <DocScrutinizer> Cabletwitch: it is :-P
Jan 30 21:39:26 <Pavel> Hello. I am trying to figure out GnuPG on Maemo 5 (on the N900), could someone who doesn't use gpg please tell me whether their phone has a directory /home/user/.gnupg owned by root? (I am trying to figure out whether it comes like that, or whether I created it by accident.)
Jan 30 21:39:29 <Cabletwitch> There we go then.
Jan 30 21:39:33 <DocScrutinizer> prints "sh: ecsmple: not found"
Jan 30 21:39:38 * b-man|N900 is gonna have an intresting experience trying to get ubuntu-nxx0 running on the N900
Jan 30 21:40:01 <Caesium> Pavel: yes, mine does, and never used gpg
Jan 30 21:40:10 <gomiam> hcarrega: I'll be back in a bit ;)
Jan 30 21:40:12 <Pavel> Caesium: And it's owned by root?
Jan 30 21:40:18 <hcarrega> ok
Jan 30 21:40:22 <Caesium> yes, one file in it, trustdb.gpg
Jan 30 21:40:38 <Pavel> OK, so it's not something I screwed up.
Jan 30 21:40:38 <hcarrega> i going out to cinema
Jan 30 21:40:42 <hcarrega> msg me
Jan 30 21:40:43 <hcarrega> :)
Jan 30 21:40:45 <Stskeeps> b-man|N900: you're going to learn it the hard way this time
Jan 30 21:40:46 <Stskeeps> b-man|N900: :P
Jan 30 21:40:49 <hcarrega> thanks
Jan 30 21:40:55 <Pavel> Caesium: Thank you very much.
Jan 30 21:40:56 <b-man|N900> LOL
Jan 30 21:40:58 <Caesium> no probs
Jan 30 21:41:42 <b-man|N900> Stskeeps: i take that as a challenge :)
Jan 30 21:41:54 <Pavel> Does anyone know whether there is a reference to the N900 filesystem layout?
Jan 30 21:42:14 * b-man|N900 likes pushing the limit xD
Jan 30 21:42:49 * Pavel is trying to figure out what it's there for, and why it's not in /root .
Jan 30 21:43:00 * Pavel should probably ask in -devel.
Jan 30 21:43:15 <Stskeeps> b-man|N900: also, you don't get to use mer's solution for things until you figure it out yourself ;)
Jan 30 21:43:17 * Cabletwitch ponders whether a tv remote app would be worthwhile...
Jan 30 21:43:30 <dnaumov> anyone tried the new firefox mobile 1.0 yet? how does it compare to stock n900 browser?
Jan 30 21:43:31 <Caesium> Cabletwitch: is the IR strong enough?
Jan 30 21:43:41 <SpeedEvil> Cabletwitch: irreco
Jan 30 21:43:50 <SpeedEvil> dnaumov: it crashes too much.
Jan 30 21:43:51 <johnsq> SpeedEvil: no ir
Jan 30 21:43:52 <Cabletwitch> No idea.
Jan 30 21:44:11 <SpeedEvil> dnaumov: and uses too much RAM as yet
Jan 30 21:44:13 <Cabletwitch> The N900 does have IR, I belive?
Jan 30 21:44:32 <SpeedEvil> johns: irreco is the app in the repo to do IR control
Jan 30 21:44:40 <SpeedEvil> If I remember the name right
Jan 30 21:45:11 <johnsq> SpeedEvil: the last time i checked did't send ir with the n810
Jan 30 21:45:43 <DocScrutinizer> SpeedEvil: correct
Jan 30 21:45:45 <johnsq> I have build a IR adapter for the Headphones.
Jan 30 21:46:01 <DocScrutinizer> max distance is somewhat... limited though
Jan 30 21:46:11 <gomiam> hcarrega: Ok, Facebook plugin installed, setting it up
Jan 30 21:46:16 <hcarrega> k
Jan 30 21:46:19 <hcarrega> im here
Jan 30 21:46:21 <hcarrega> :P
Jan 30 21:46:37 <DocScrutinizer> johnsq: N810 has no IR though
Jan 30 21:46:41 <Cabletwitch> I forget, does the 900 have that A2whateveritis for bluetooth audio?
Jan 30 21:46:55 <TomaszD> A2DP
Jan 30 21:47:04 <johnsq> DocScrutinizer: yes, but i have build a IR adapter for the headphone jack
Jan 30 21:47:06 <TomaszD> it's just a bluetooth profile, yes, it does have it.
Jan 30 21:47:13 <DocScrutinizer> aah
Jan 30 21:47:35 <johnsq> DocScrutinizer: the application with nice gui was missing.
Jan 30 21:47:43 <Cabletwitch> I thought it had to have hardware support, no?
Jan 30 21:47:55 <cehteh> is there a tv-b-gone app for the n900 available finally?
Jan 30 21:47:59 <mtnbkr> http://gizmodo.com/5460348/firefox-mobile-10-burrows-onto-nokia-n900s
Jan 30 21:48:04 <hcarrega> gomiam:  im checking the talk.maemo to
Jan 30 21:48:15 <RST38h> mtnbkr: have you tried using it?
Jan 30 21:48:23 <TomaszD> Cabletwitch, not really, you just need Bluetooth 1.2+ compliant hardware (radio)
Jan 30 21:48:26 <nedko> can i access music on my file server (smb) without UPnP?
Jan 30 21:48:29 <cehteh> fennec on n810 .. i wonder how that performs
Jan 30 21:48:33 <mtnbkr> RST38h: no, but I think I saw your complaints about it a little while ago.
Jan 30 21:48:34 <gomiam> hcarrega: ok :)
Jan 30 21:48:48 <RST38h> mtnbkr: Ah, then by all means do :)
Jan 30 21:48:50 <Cabletwitch> TomaszD: ahh, righto.
Jan 30 21:48:50 <mtnbkr> A buddy (who is JEALOUS of my N900)  just sent me that link :)
Jan 30 21:48:52 <nedko> can i access music on my file server (smb) without UPnP? (i'm on n900)
Jan 30 21:49:00 <TomaszD> Cabletwitch, and the radio on the n900 is 2.1, so it supports things like SSP
Jan 30 21:49:09 <SonicSpinner> evening
Jan 30 21:49:26 <mtnbkr> RST38h: what's the fastest way? Is it in extras, OVI store? (have not read article yet)
Jan 30 21:49:41 <SonicSpinner> hows everyone on this fine n900 nite :;D
Jan 30 21:49:57 <hcarrega> gomiam:  can u login?
Jan 30 21:50:19 * mtnbkr is good!
Jan 30 21:50:45 <hcarrega> even i cant install now the facebook app in repo
Jan 30 21:50:49 <johnsq> mmm docmentation of irreco still miss understanding.
Jan 30 21:50:49 <hcarrega> lol
Jan 30 21:51:15 <SonicSpinner> has i ask for some help?
Jan 30 21:51:18 <SonicSpinner> can*
Jan 30 21:51:48 <gomiam> hcarrega: XD I had forgotten my password, setting it up...
Jan 30 21:51:54 <hcarrega> lol
Jan 30 21:51:56 <hcarrega> brb
Jan 30 21:51:58 <hcarrega> leaving
Jan 30 21:52:03 <mece> nedko, no samba mounting out of the box. Dunno if there's something in extras-devel
Jan 30 21:52:04 <Cabletwitch> Right, gonna conserve battery, catch you guys later.
Jan 30 21:52:28 <mece> SonicSpinner, what's up?
Jan 30 21:52:33 <jebba> hey, i'm trying to make a SIP call to a landline via my SIP provider. I'm all logged in ok, and I checked "Use for telephone numbers" in the SIP account. All looks ok there. But when i go to actually make a call I dont see where it allows me to chose to dial with my SIP account instead of calling via GSM.
Jan 30 21:52:36 <jebba> hints?
Jan 30 21:52:48 <gomiam> hcarrega: could not retrieve buddy list
Jan 30 21:52:54 <Stskeeps> jebba: choose account for it, there's a button?
Jan 30 21:53:21 <SonicSpinner> mece> my question is regarding to the tracker config. i have posted a thread in multimedia about how to separate "movies !" from mixing it up with my recorded videos. any suggestions?
Jan 30 21:53:25 <nedko> mece: thanks
Jan 30 21:54:05 <SonicSpinner> jebba>> there is a top bar in the dial pad where u can click , then change from GSM to SIP
Jan 30 21:54:06 <jebba> Stskeeps: no button comes up though. I thought I had seen it a month ago or so (but didn't really use it), but now nothing comes up with it.
Jan 30 21:54:20 <Stskeeps> jebba: hmm. sec
Jan 30 21:54:22 <nedko> mece: i dont know UPnP, if I install UPnP stuff on my file server, will i still need smb access?
Jan 30 21:54:33 <nedko> mece: in order to play the music there
Jan 30 21:54:33 <jebba> ah ya, in the dial pad. If I select a contact to call, it doesn't off it though.
Jan 30 21:54:39 <Stskeeps> jebba: "Call type"
Jan 30 21:54:41 <mece> SonicSpinner, unfortunately I've only opened the config gile once, so I'm not exactly an expert. How do you mean separate?
Jan 30 21:54:49 <Stskeeps> jebba: it doesn't say "Call with SIP"?
Jan 30 21:55:07 <mece> nedko, haven't tried it, but you don't need samba for upnp. It just shows up in media player.
Jan 30 21:55:18 <Stskeeps> jebba: if not, submit a bug
Jan 30 21:55:26 <gomiam> hcarrega: Can't connect because I can't get the buddy list
Jan 30 21:55:36 <jebba> Stskeeps: when i bring up dial pad, I can select "Call type" and options are "Celluar" my gmail acct and my SIP account. But not there when doing contacts.
Jan 30 21:55:39 <nedko> mece: do you know what software i have to use on my server?
Jan 30 21:55:49 <Stskeeps> jebba: not when clicking a contact? interesting
Jan 30 21:55:49 <SonicSpinner> mece> well i have copied 1 season of friends, and 1 season of chaplle show to my n900. i have created a tvshow folder. there are 2 folders in it with each tv show names. so in total 40 avi files. when i go to media player and choose video,. all the tv shows and my own recorded vids  comes up in big mess.
Jan 30 21:55:52 <mece> hmmhmm.. there was a thread about that... lemme see.
Jan 30 21:56:04 <Stskeeps> jebba: since there's 'use for telephone numbers', it not showing up can only be a bug
Jan 30 21:56:05 <jebba> but i thought  i *had* seen it in contacts.  I just added it, perhaps a reboot (restart fone app) will re-read it in.
Jan 30 21:56:43 <jebba> i'll reboot the thing to see if it comes up. Maybe it doesnt get updated dynamically.
Jan 30 21:56:48 <SonicSpinner> jebba: > remember also u can add " sip detail " to a contact. then u can place sip calls  directly from a contact
Jan 30 21:57:14 <jebba> SonicSpinner: ya, thx.
Jan 30 21:57:17 <SonicSpinner> cheers
Jan 30 21:58:03 <mece> SonicSpinner, For browsing through media player, you're screwed, since there are no categories for videos, however there's a way you could do it though...
Jan 30 21:58:44 <SonicSpinner> mece> yea i figured., there is also Sort video after category. there i get " recorded with device " + Films.
Jan 30 21:58:56 <SonicSpinner> i wonder where u define those category. or maybe its hardcoded'
Jan 30 21:59:32 <mece> SonicSpinner, simply disallow tracker to track the directory with the tv series. that way they wont show up in the media player listing, but you can launch them from file manager.
Jan 30 21:59:39 <SonicSpinner> mece> do u understand what the .foldername mean? with a dot., if i create a .tvshow folder.
Jan 30 22:00:01 <SonicSpinner> aah´ ok
Jan 30 22:00:13 <mece> SonicSpinner, yeah, it means that the folder is hidden. For this purpose though I think it's better to have a visible folder that tracker is not allowed in.
Jan 30 22:00:15 <SonicSpinner> whats is the difference in watch tracker and index tracker
Jan 30 22:00:21 <mece> err..
Jan 30 22:00:55 <mece> SonicSpinner, tracker is the thing that pokes about in your phone, looking for videos to list in the media player.
Jan 30 22:01:14 <mece> SonicSpinner, dunno what the differance is between watch and index
Jan 30 22:01:18 <mece> SonicSpinner, yes I do
Jan 30 22:01:19 <SpeedEvil> I think watch by some means keeps a track of the directoris - and will index them if they change. index will index them only when it is asked to
Jan 30 22:01:35 <SonicSpinner> hm okey
Jan 30 22:01:40 <mece> SonicSpinner, right, the ones it watches, it constantly checks. the other ones it pokes about in every now and then.
Jan 30 22:01:46 <SonicSpinner> so u can just use watch. should be enough
Jan 30 22:02:10 <mece> SonicSpinner, if you use watch, they will appear in the media player more quickly after they are uploaded.
Jan 30 22:02:23 <SonicSpinner> okey
Jan 30 22:02:59 <mece> SonicSpinner, I might be mistaken. If you don't want tracker to index, put it in the disallow list, or whatever it's called.
Jan 30 22:03:02 <SonicSpinner> so i should unwatch  the tvshow folder. then use the file manager to launch em from there
Jan 30 22:03:21 <mece> SonicSpinner, you should not just unwatch, you should forbid.
Jan 30 22:03:23 <SonicSpinner> i wonder if it can do sub-folders aswell
Jan 30 22:03:29 <mece> SonicSpinner, it does.
Jan 30 22:03:32 <SonicSpinner> ah yea disallows ok
Jan 30 22:03:33 <SonicSpinner> cool
Jan 30 22:03:55 <SonicSpinner> looks like a big mess in my media player atm. hehe
Jan 30 22:04:05 <mece> SonicSpinner, renaming it to . file works too, but then they won't show up in filemanager by default, afaik.
Jan 30 22:04:21 <mece> SonicSpinner, you need to delete the database too.
Jan 30 22:04:28 <jebba> why does the dialpad have  "*+"  instead of just "*".  I dont see how to get it to do an "+" anyway.
Jan 30 22:04:35 <SonicSpinner> yea ure right. i tried .friends . and i can oinly see with total commander app
Jan 30 22:04:59 <SonicSpinner> jebba:  press twice *
Jan 30 22:05:06 <SonicSpinner> it will change it to plus
Jan 30 22:05:11 <jebba> ah
Jan 30 22:05:14 <w00t> jebba: multiple taps
Jan 30 22:05:16 <w00t> .. beaten
Jan 30 22:05:20 <SonicSpinner> hehe
Jan 30 22:05:36 <RevdKathy> ahh the ginger wine is gone. Time I went to bed then
Jan 30 22:05:41 <RevdKathy> Good night all!
Jan 30 22:05:43 <w00t> night kathy
Jan 30 22:06:15 <SonicSpinner> ive had my n900 for 1 month now,. and i have been playing with different apps nite after nitr
Jan 30 22:06:23 <SonicSpinner> hehe
Jan 30 22:06:50 <SonicSpinner> mece> thanx for ur inputs, ill try em either later or tomorrow
Jan 30 22:07:37 <mece> SonicSpinner, no prob. There's a thread somewhere on where you find the db's and whatnot.
Jan 30 22:07:43 <SonicSpinner> so hows everyones experience with the different IM protocolsd
Jan 30 22:08:04 <SonicSpinner> past 2 nites ive been playing with msn, haze, pecan etc
Jan 30 22:08:10 <SonicSpinner> im still trying to understand whats what
Jan 30 22:08:26 <SonicSpinner> and i cant make " msn " plugin to work. only haze, pecan
Jan 30 22:08:28 <mece> SonicSpinner, haze is everything.
Jan 30 22:08:36 <n1c0> howto play postal babes ?
Jan 30 22:09:05 <SonicSpinner> okey. so the different protocls is called telepathy and somethign else right?
Jan 30 22:09:22 <SonicSpinner> i wanted to test the one with webcam working. but seems 0.8 screwed it up
Jan 30 22:10:03 <n1c0> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PIynCz4-sbE , does it run on maemo ?
Jan 30 22:10:24 <tybollt> muahaha
Jan 30 22:10:33 <tybollt> nice bug I just encountered
Jan 30 22:10:42 <tybollt> phone got "stuck" in portrait mode, wtf? :)
Jan 30 22:11:12 <tybollt> something you cna do to "unfuck" it other than reboot?
Jan 30 22:11:43 <SonicSpinner> shake it?:D
Jan 30 22:12:34 <frals> tybollt: id try opening browser, closing keyboard, rotating it, open keyboard
Jan 30 22:13:04 <mece> SonicSpinner, I've only heard about gtalk webcam. Is there another that has working video?
Jan 30 22:13:12 <SonicSpinner> yes
Jan 30 22:13:20 <mece> SonicSpinner, which one?
Jan 30 22:13:32 <SonicSpinner> the msn protocol 0.7
Jan 30 22:13:41 <SonicSpinner> but only when ur contact asks for it
Jan 30 22:13:55 <dnaumov> meh, firefox 1.0 mobile feels nice, but the limited zoom options (max in, max out) and the zoom keyboard shortcuts being broken and doing nothing is really a dealbreaker for me
Jan 30 22:13:57 <SonicSpinner> also Amsn should work. but its aheavy program.
Jan 30 22:14:05 <tybollt> frals: ah, tried that w/ phone app, no workie
Jan 30 22:14:08 <tybollt> will try browser
Jan 30 22:14:11 <tybollt> here goes nothing...
Jan 30 22:14:14 <SonicSpinner> needs 32mb  device mb lol
Jan 30 22:15:02 <tybollt> frals++
Jan 30 22:15:08 <frals> :)
Jan 30 22:15:14 <tybollt> took a little wiggling but it worked =)
Jan 30 22:15:55 <tybollt> dnaumov: how about the speed of it?
Jan 30 22:16:00 <tybollt> dnaumov: feels slow?
Jan 30 22:16:59 <dnaumov> tybollt: page load and rendering speed feels roughly the same, the UI feels unique and cool, app start time is 2-3 seconds slower than N900 stock browser
Jan 30 22:18:11 <mece> dnaumov, that sounds pretty good. too bad about the zooming.
Jan 30 22:18:17 <dnaumov> yeah
Jan 30 22:18:23 <mece> MicroB zooming is excellent.
Jan 30 22:18:25 <dnaumov> it was my only serious gripe
Jan 30 22:18:42 <dnaumov> but a complete dealkiller still
Jan 30 22:18:48 <mece> yep
Jan 30 22:19:14 <tybollt> mece: ack, I have to say I am way way impressed by microb zoom
Jan 30 22:19:22 <tybollt> granted I really never user zoom
Jan 30 22:19:31 <dnaumov> wonder when is someone going to port utorrent to maemo
Jan 30 22:19:56 <tybollt> torrent? for n900? uhm... uh... ok ..
Jan 30 22:19:59 <mece> I have a question about packaging py. Anyone here who could help with that?
Jan 30 22:20:15 <mece> dnaumov, transmission not good enough?
Jan 30 22:20:45 <dnaumov> mece: is there a gui version?
Jan 30 22:21:05 <TomaszD> transmission is a gui client
Jan 30 22:21:17 <mece> right, that's what I thought.
Jan 30 22:21:20 <mece> I haven't used it.
Jan 30 22:23:08 <tybollt> frals: did you consider porting that web-sms-app to some .se operator?
Jan 30 22:23:24 <frals> uh, that web-sms-app isnt mine :p
Jan 30 22:23:30 <tybollt> nono
Jan 30 22:23:46 <tybollt> but uhm it's gp I guess, one could have a stab at it =)
Jan 30 22:23:54 * tybollt roughly considering to :)
Jan 30 22:24:03 <tybollt> gpl*
Jan 30 22:25:37 <SonicSpinner> mece:  im trying out the tracker config trick now + db cache erasing. rebooting now
Jan 30 22:25:50 <mece> SonicSpinner, good luck with that.
Jan 30 22:26:45 <SonicSpinner> oh crap lol
Jan 30 22:26:57 <SonicSpinner> ah wait something is happening now
Jan 30 22:27:05 <SonicSpinner> BAM
Jan 30 22:27:09 <SonicSpinner> working  :d
Jan 30 22:27:13 <SonicSpinner> weheoo good stuff
Jan 30 22:27:24 <dnaumov> oh WOW, gjelewed is a great port
Jan 30 22:38:10 <SonicSpinner> so
Jan 30 22:38:25 <SonicSpinner> now that i have fixed the tracker , i need somethign else to play around with :D
Jan 30 22:38:45 <SonicSpinner> i wish i could test the msn with webcam. but have to wait for a newer version i think
Jan 30 22:47:22 <nedko> zeenix: it looks i got sucked into upnp too :) i got my collection exported and playable on my n900 :)
Jan 30 22:47:44 <nedko> zeenix: i saw you made a dbus mediaserver spec
Jan 30 22:49:14 <SonicSpinner> nedko:  are u expert in media playing with n900?
Jan 30 22:49:52 <nedko> SonicSpinner: not at all. i was asking stupid questions less than an hour ago :)
Jan 30 22:50:05 <SonicSpinner> oh lo. ok. no question is stupid :D
Jan 30 22:51:48 <Hardknox> hi
Jan 30 22:52:14 <SonicSpinner> has anyone have on screen keyboard working?
Jan 30 22:52:21 <SonicSpinner> hi Hardknox
Jan 30 22:52:45 <Hardknox> mean virtual keyboard?
Jan 30 22:53:32 <SpeedEvil> Hardknox: you have to enable it in settings -> input
Jan 30 22:53:41 <Hardknox> yes
Jan 30 22:53:56 <Hardknox> Im using vk all time
Jan 30 22:54:43 <SonicSpinner> yeah just found out that i had to slide off the keyboard first of course hehe
Jan 30 22:54:50 <SonicSpinner> pretty stupid of me :P
Jan 30 22:54:56 <Hardknox> :)
**** BEGIN LOGGING AT Sat Jan 30 22:55:46 2010
Jan 30 22:55:47 <Hardknox> to protect all media
Jan 30 22:56:15 <Hardknox> someone wrote good app but seems still in develop
Jan 30 22:57:22 <SpeedEvil> to protect all media?
Jan 30 22:57:27 <Hardknox> yepp
Jan 30 22:57:35 <SonicSpinner> whoa
Jan 30 22:57:43 <SpeedEvil> Hardknox: what does that mean
Jan 30 22:57:52 <mece> damn yuuus!!
Jan 30 22:58:06 <mece> spammety spam these disconnects
Jan 30 23:00:11 <Hardknox> SpeedEvil Im watching repos and Can wait for that app but owner disapeared
Jan 30 23:00:26 <wazd> ok, new Marina version is in Extras, please test http://repository.maemo.org/extras-devel/pool/fremantle/free/h/hildon-theme-marina/hildon-theme-marina_0.99_all.deb
Jan 30 23:00:51 <mece> wazd, what's marina?
Jan 30 23:00:59 <lcuk> wazd, extras-devel!
Jan 30 23:01:13 <wazd> lcuk: yeah yeah :)
Jan 30 23:01:20 <Hardknox> marina theme :)
Jan 30 23:01:20 <wazd> mece: maemo 5 theme
Jan 30 23:01:25 <lcuk> pleased its coming though
Jan 30 23:02:09 <Hardknox> botnet or split hmmm
Jan 30 23:02:27 <wazd> lcuk: well, it was a really hard experience to make a theme without actual device
Jan 30 23:03:20 <mece> wazd, ok cool :)
Jan 30 23:05:32 <mece> ooooo.. /opt is an actual directory in scratchbox...
Jan 30 23:05:40 <mece> good to know.
Jan 30 23:06:03 <Hardknox> it's anybody know how to make term window with transparency on desktop? like term widget?
Jan 30 23:09:31 <mece> Hardknox, That could be done in a way, but not properly, at least not trivially. I think it would only display output. commands would have to go through options menu or something.
Jan 30 23:10:16 <wazd> If you'll have some time to make fresh screenshots of Marina - I'd be happy :P
Jan 30 23:13:00 <Hardknox> how to join app channel?
Jan 30 23:13:35 <lcuk> whats the name of the chan
Jan 30 23:13:52 <Hardknox> yepp
Jan 30 23:14:06 <Hardknox> Icuk u know that name?
Jan 30 23:14:25 <tank-man> what is the app channel?
Jan 30 23:14:32 <Hardknox> yes
Jan 30 23:14:38 <tank-man> who is on first?
Jan 30 23:15:15 <tank-man> Hardknox, welcome to the app channel
Jan 30 23:15:27 <Hardknox> really?
Jan 30 23:15:54 <joppu> http://imgkk.com/i/zqYx56.jpg 4th panel, is that really a NIT I see there!?
Jan 30 23:15:54 <lcuk> Hardknox, you are failing english.  you say "app channel", we ask what channel name you want to join, you normally give a name of a channel or application
Jan 30 23:16:16 <Hardknox> oh my mistake
Jan 30 23:16:24 <mece> Hardknox, #maemo #maemo-bugs #maemo-devel #maemo-meeting #maemo-ui
Jan 30 23:16:25 <lcuk> joppu, n810 unmistakably
Jan 30 23:16:31 <Hardknox> I mean application channel
Jan 30 23:16:37 <MikeJB> What language(s) does Maemo support for its apps?
Jan 30 23:16:41 <SonicSpinner> what is @ maemo meeting?
Jan 30 23:16:44 <SonicSpinner> just chat?
Jan 30 23:16:48 <Hardknox> thnx
Jan 30 23:17:57 <joppu> yep, it even has the USB port in the correct place :)
Jan 30 23:17:57 <timeless_> MikeJB: err
Jan 30 23:18:04 <lcuk> joppu, undeed it does
Jan 30 23:18:11 <lcuk> in
Jan 30 23:18:11 <timeless_> Maemo is Linux
Jan 30 23:18:32 <timeless_> you can use C, C++, Python, Perl, Ruby,...
Jan 30 23:18:37 <lcuk> timeless, i tihnk he meant to ask which have strong translation support
Jan 30 23:18:53 <MikeJB> Actually, timeless_ was wright
Jan 30 23:18:53 <lcuk> actually now i dunno lol
Jan 30 23:18:54 <MikeJB> *right
Jan 30 23:18:57 <lcuk> lol
Jan 30 23:19:01 <GeneralAntilles> SonicSpinner, no, it's the conference room.
Jan 30 23:19:16 <timeless_> MikeJB: so... Java is mostly unsupported
Jan 30 23:19:25 <timeless_> you'd need to find someone w/ a jvm (e.g. jalimo)
Jan 30 23:19:33 <timeless_> but otherwise...
Jan 30 23:19:34 <tank-man> so much for universal
Jan 30 23:19:47 <mece> lol, well put tank-man
Jan 30 23:19:52 <MikeJB> So much for cross-platform in the smartphone world...
Jan 30 23:20:08 <SonicSpinner> ok cheers
Jan 30 23:20:11 <MikeJB> timeless_: How's the python support?
Jan 30 23:20:18 <timeless_> dunno
Jan 30 23:20:21 <timeless_> i'm a happy perler
Jan 30 23:20:30 <timeless_> but people seem to be able to write apps w/ it
Jan 30 23:20:31 <mece> MikeJB, python support is excellent.
Jan 30 23:20:36 <MikeJB> Good.
Jan 30 23:20:38 <lcuk> from what i can gather python is pretty well integrated
Jan 30 23:20:40 <MikeJB> Python 2 or 3?
Jan 30 23:20:45 <mece> 2.
Jan 30 23:20:48 <MikeJB> Good.
Jan 30 23:20:54 <timeless_mbp> i think 3 is mostly vapormess
Jan 30 23:21:04 <timeless_mbp> someday 3.1 or 3.2 might be a future
Jan 30 23:21:19 <shinkamui> nipples
Jan 30 23:21:24 <MikeJB> Fedora doesn't support Python 3 yet so I really wouldn't be able to develop for Python 3 anyway
Jan 30 23:21:37 <shinkamui> I looked at some python books at Barnes and Nobles yesterday
Jan 30 23:21:43 <MikeJB> (The last thing I want to do is risk breaking yum and other key things by manually installing Python 3)
Jan 30 23:21:45 <shinkamui> certainly not worht 60$
Jan 30 23:22:25 <shinkamui> bought a nice book on 64bit asm :D
Jan 30 23:24:20 <MikeJB> How about planned future phones? Just saw the review on engadget.com and the platform impresses me, but not really the phone.
Jan 30 23:24:47 <timeless_mbp> MikeJB: the future is a secret
Jan 30 23:24:58 <MikeJB> Kind of seems like the N910 or whatever follows it would be more polished...
Jan 30 23:25:13 <timeless_mbp> but i'd recommend against holding your breath
Jan 30 23:25:22 <timeless_mbp> you'd likely die of asphyxiation
Jan 30 23:25:25 <timeless_mbp> and we'd lose a customer
Jan 30 23:25:42 <shinkamui> MikeJB, lol.  generally thats how things work.
Jan 30 23:26:17 <shinkamui> but its your call, the next release of a nokia maemo device could be months away or years away
Jan 30 23:26:25 <MikeJB> I just don't know if I can justify paying $569 for it when it seems like a work-in-progress.
Jan 30 23:26:53 <shinkamui>  yea, if youre having that conversation with yourself, then its probably not the right device for you
Jan 30 23:26:56 <jebba> the fone doesn't impress you? The hardware is the best out there AFAICT.
Jan 30 23:27:14 <jebba> but the software is definitely a work in progress
Jan 30 23:27:16 <shinkamui> but its seems like your the target for the devce as well
Jan 30 23:27:22 <GeneralAntilles> MikeJB, work-in-progress is the whole point of Maemo.
Jan 30 23:27:24 <shinkamui> so isn't that a peculiar situation
Jan 30 23:27:24 <MikeJB> Well, it's a bit pricey for what it is.
Jan 30 23:27:26 <lcuk> im looking towards spending $1000+ on a self assembly robot that cant even stand up on its own without my help
Jan 30 23:27:37 <timeless_mbp> lcuk: fun
Jan 30 23:27:44 <GeneralAntilles> MikeJB, Dell had it for about $430
Jan 30 23:27:46 <MikeJB> Maybe it's what all phones look like without subsidies or something.
Jan 30 23:27:48 <GeneralAntilles> MikeJB, look harder for deals.
Jan 30 23:28:01 <timeless_mbp> it is fwiw
Jan 30 23:28:05 <shinkamui> MikeJB, yep, thats about right
Jan 30 23:28:21 <timeless_mbp> or at least high end phones
Jan 30 23:28:22 <shinkamui> buy a crappy iBone out of contract
Jan 30 23:28:24 <shinkamui> 600$
Jan 30 23:28:32 <timeless_mbp> a low end unsubsidized phone might be cheaper
Jan 30 23:28:46 <timeless_mbp> but it's going to be just a phone
Jan 30 23:29:11 <timeless_mbp> GeneralAntilles: i now have a script that lets me compare a locale against a second locale :)
Jan 30 23:29:19 <jebba> ooh cool
Jan 30 23:29:34 <jebba> you mean you can feed it a string and a couple languages and get it? that would be handy :)
Jan 30 23:29:40 <MikeJB> It looks a little out of my price range... The N900 is the only Maemo device?
Jan 30 23:30:00 <shinkamui> currently, although aigo is releasing the N500
Jan 30 23:30:08 <shinkamui> maemo device with a bigger 4.3" screen
Jan 30 23:30:18 <GeneralAntilles> shinkamui, er.
Jan 30 23:30:23 <GeneralAntilles> shinkamui, that isn't Maemo. :)
Jan 30 23:30:42 <shinkamui> GeneralAntilles, I only read the release from pocketables
Jan 30 23:30:53 <MikeJB> GeneralAntilles: dell.com sells Nokia phones?
Jan 30 23:31:00 <shinkamui> they said maemo, so I went with it
Jan 30 23:31:01 <shinkamui> :)
Jan 30 23:31:10 <MikeJB> I can't seem to find anything lower than about $520 on Google Shopping
Jan 30 23:31:23 <timeless_mbp> jebba: http://pastebin.mozilla.org/700445
Jan 30 23:31:25 <timeless_mbp> for sample output
Jan 30 23:31:33 <GeneralAntilles> shinkamui, that's the Chinese repurposing the open source components from Maemo 4, adding their own shit on top and abusing Nokia's trademarks.
Jan 30 23:31:40 <GeneralAntilles> MikeJB, yes.
Jan 30 23:31:50 <GeneralAntilles> shinkamui, the Chinese also sell N900s.
Jan 30 23:31:55 <GeneralAntilles> shinkamui, doesn't mean they're actually N900s.
Jan 30 23:31:56 <SpeedEvil> GeneralAntilles: how does their shit compare with nokias shit though.
Jan 30 23:32:04 <shinkamui> GeneralAntilles, http://www.pocketables.net/2010/01/aigo-launches-feature-packed-n500-maemo-mid.html
Jan 30 23:32:09 <GeneralAntilles> SpeedEvil, what do you think?
Jan 30 23:32:09 <MikeJB> Hmm, Dell.com has it for $540 according to me.
Jan 30 23:32:15 <shinkamui> just an fyi, thats all I read
Jan 30 23:32:17 <jebba> timeless_mbp: can you give me the script and i'll add it to freemoe-foo-* scripts if you want (like i want  ;)
Jan 30 23:32:17 <GeneralAntilles> shinkamui, bloggers.
Jan 30 23:32:23 <SpeedEvil> :)
Jan 30 23:32:25 <shinkamui> so its LIES!
Jan 30 23:32:28 <shinkamui> :)
Jan 30 23:32:55 <shinkamui> thought it looked crazy
Jan 30 23:33:02 <shinkamui> anyway, thanks for straightening me out
Jan 30 23:33:09 <GeneralAntilles> SpeedEvil, point me to a Chinese knock-off that manages to surpass whatever it's knocking off. :)
Jan 30 23:33:28 <Stskeeps> GeneralAntilles: n900 clone with dual sim! :P
Jan 30 23:33:31 <SpeedEvil> Well - 2 SIM phones actually are better for some users
Jan 30 23:33:56 <SpeedEvil> i would love a second number - even if it's GSM/GPRS only
Jan 30 23:34:17 <SpeedEvil> well - in principle.
Jan 30 23:34:24 <SpeedEvil> If I ever actually used the first.
Jan 30 23:36:30 <MikeJB> Does the N900 only support T-Mobile in the US?
Jan 30 23:36:51 <N900evil> if you want 3g
Jan 30 23:37:29 <shinkamui> soryr, I gotta spam this, its hilarious if you haven't seen it already : http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lQnT0zp8Ya4
Jan 30 23:37:51 <MikeJB> Does the N900 work as a wifi device or is it a phone at heart?
Jan 30 23:38:23 <shiznebit> MikeJB: its both
Jan 30 23:38:24 <lcuk> MikeJB, both
Jan 30 23:38:56 <shinkamui> in fact
Jan 30 23:39:05 <shinkamui> the phone is more of an afterthough imo
Jan 30 23:39:10 <MikeJB> I'm just wondering if it would be worth it if I use something else as a phone and use that over wifi.
Jan 30 23:39:13 <shinkamui> clearly its a "tablet' first
Jan 30 23:39:28 <shinkamui> MikeJB, seems pointless to carry 2 devices
Jan 30 23:39:34 <shiznebit> clearly i will wait for a9
Jan 30 23:39:35 <shinkamui> especially when one of them works
Jan 30 23:40:25 <shiznebit> it does seemless transition between skype and phone
Jan 30 23:40:39 <user_> python3.1 on n900... any thoughts ...?
Jan 30 23:40:50 <MikeJB> Right, I heard about that seemless transition. But would it be phone enough with just skype?
Jan 30 23:42:42 <MikeJB> Does anyone use it just with skype?
Jan 30 23:42:47 <shinkamui> I do
Jan 30 23:42:52 <shinkamui> sucks if you're american though
Jan 30 23:42:55 <shinkamui> :-D
Jan 30 23:43:08 <shinkamui> numbers are expected to be in international format
Jan 30 23:43:31 <woglinde> ~seen jebba
Jan 30 23:43:34 <infobot> jebba is currently on #maemo (37m 48s). Has said a total of 15 messages. Is idling for 11m 17s, last said: 'timeless_mbp: can you give me the script and i'll add it to freemoe-foo-* scripts if you want (like i want  ;)'.
Jan 30 23:43:35 <shinkamui> I took 2 hours and went through my entire phonebook adding the useless extra codes
Jan 30 23:43:54 <woglinde> jebba -> http://blog.exys.org/entries/2010/maemo_toolchain_without_scratchbox.html
Jan 30 23:44:09 <timeless_mbp> shinkamui: heh
Jan 30 23:44:32 <jebba> hey woglinde
Jan 30 23:44:48 <shinkamui> luckily the exchange support on the N900 is decent (minus google) so it was at least doable for me on a computer
Jan 30 23:45:07 <jebba> woglinde: is that your blog?
Jan 30 23:45:10 <woglinde> no
Jan 30 23:45:18 <timeless_mbp> woglinde: sorry
Jan 30 23:45:20 <woglinde> aep on qt posted it
Jan 30 23:45:25 <timeless_mbp> how is that better than scratchbox?
Jan 30 23:46:29 <timeless_mbp> is the win basically from distcc?
Jan 30 23:46:37 <woglinde> seems so
Jan 30 23:46:38 <lcuk> hi javispedro
Jan 30 23:46:43 <woglinde> jo lcuk
Jan 30 23:46:49 <lcuk> hey woglinde
Jan 30 23:46:54 <javispedro> moo lcuk woglinde
Jan 30 23:47:13 <jebba> woglinde: i dont see too much upside there though. They are basically just re-doing a scratchbox chroot AFAICT (?)
Jan 30 23:47:21 <jebba> ah ya, distcc.
Jan 30 23:47:57 <jebba> but rebuilding many .debs, very little of the overall time is actually spent in gcc.  All the setup, shell scripts, etc. take up lots of the compile time.
Jan 30 23:48:18 <jebba> though it seems distcc could be kludged into the scratchbox just as easily.
Jan 30 23:48:57 <timeless_mbp> yep
Jan 30 23:49:05 <timeless_mbp> might as well save yourself pain and use sb2
Jan 30 23:49:12 <woglinde> hm
Jan 30 23:49:22 <woglinde> sb2 cannt handle optify stuff right
Jan 30 23:49:32 <woglinde> at least here
Jan 30 23:49:41 <timeless_mbp> how so?
Jan 30 23:49:47 <MikeJB> If I wrote something for Linux, how easy would it be to port it to Maemo?
Jan 30 23:49:48 <jebba> i'm trying to figure out the *really* best way to do this.  OBS seems to be great, but i haven't gotten it going yet (perhaps will work on it now). BUt what i've spent the last day learning is amazon's ec2 cloud services. Putting OBS there would be the greatest.
Jan 30 23:50:16 <jebba> woglinde: with sb2 you could just run maemo-optify-deb afterwards. I dont think sb2 would have optify drawbacks.
Jan 30 23:50:16 <`0660> MikeJB, depends on the libraries that your application uses
Jan 30 23:50:21 <timeless_mbp> MikeJB: totally amorphous question
Jan 30 23:50:28 <timeless_mbp> if your wrote it for linux-parisc
Jan 30 23:50:33 <timeless_mbp> using parisc assembly
Jan 30 23:50:38 <timeless_mbp> then it wouldn't be very portable
Jan 30 23:50:47 <woglinde> timeless_mbp in develop stage under /opt/maemo the tools are mounted
Jan 30 23:50:51 <jebba> MikeJB: but likely 100% easy, if your interfface can work on something small.
Jan 30 23:50:57 <woglinde> no lib bin stuff
Jan 30 23:50:59 <MikeJB> Yes, but writing in Assembly makes the most efficient apps.
Jan 30 23:51:11 <timeless_mbp> no
Jan 30 23:51:12 <jebba> not efficent porting tho
Jan 30 23:51:18 <timeless_mbp> it makes the biggest headaches
Jan 30 23:51:29 <jebba> woglinde: what tools? i'm a bit lost ther.e
Jan 30 23:51:57 <woglinde> mom
Jan 30 23:52:46 <woglinde> hm
Jan 30 23:52:49 <woglinde> whats that
Jan 30 23:52:53 <woglinde> now its handled right
Jan 30 23:53:34 <shinkamui> anyone dick around with mame
Jan 30 23:53:37 <shinkamui> I love mame
Jan 30 23:53:42 <shinkamui> but a lot of my roms dont work :(
Jan 30 23:53:52 <shinkamui> probably because they're for version .35
Jan 30 23:54:11 <shiznebit> shinkamui: what useless codes did you add
Jan 30 23:54:19 <shinkamui> lol
Jan 30 23:54:32 <shinkamui> +11
Jan 30 23:54:35 <shinkamui> to every number
Jan 30 23:54:49 <shinkamui> they're all US numbers, so it was useless
Jan 30 23:55:07 <shinkamui> I only have 2 international numbers in my phone book, both Ghanaian
Jan 30 23:55:09 <shiznebit> hmm couldn't just add a +
Jan 30 23:55:19 <shinkamui> didn't work
Jan 30 23:55:26 <shinkamui> skype would give me the can't complete call
Jan 30 23:55:36 <shiznebit> that sucks
Jan 30 23:55:41 <shinkamui> plus I only keep the number in my phone book in this format (123)-456-789
Jan 30 23:55:43 <shinkamui> 1
Jan 30 23:55:47 <shinkamui> no big deal
Jan 30 23:56:07 <shinkamui> just a hassle having to edit 300 phone entries in order to make use of skype
Jan 30 23:57:05 <shiznebit> no way to use console and edit the file ?
Jan 30 23:57:46 <shinkamui> it wasn't pure hell, I did it in evolution
Jan 30 23:57:53 <shinkamui> and the changes synced back to the phone
Jan 30 23:58:11 <shinkamui> I didn't even think to try and directly edit the phonebook file
Jan 30 23:58:15 <shinkamui> didn't know there was one
Jan 30 23:58:30 <shiznebit> i don't know if there is one
Jan 30 23:58:32 <shinkamui> well, rephrase, I assumed it would have been stored in a sql db
Jan 30 23:58:59 <Caesium> this came up earlier funnily enough
Jan 30 23:59:04 <Caesium> the addressbook is a berkelydb file
Jan 30 23:59:11 <Caesium> python can open and manipulate it pretty easily
Jan 30 23:59:33 <shinkamui> ridiculous
Jan 30 23:59:40 <shinkamui> I really need to learn python
Jan 30 23:59:56 <shinkamui> the N900 loves python above all else
Jan 31 00:00:02 <MikeJB> Python's pretty easy.
Jan 31 00:00:08 <shinkamui> I hear that
Jan 31 00:00:10 <MikeJB> print "Hello World."
Jan 31 00:00:11 <shinkamui> its super high level
Jan 31 00:00:12 <MikeJB> Like that easy.
Jan 31 00:00:25 <lpotter> my n900 hates python
Jan 31 00:00:44 <woglinde> mine not
Jan 31 00:01:11 <shinkamui> ill take tomorrow and learn the core
Jan 31 00:01:15 <ifreq> my n900 hates humans
Jan 31 00:01:19 <shinkamui> mine too ifreq
Jan 31 00:01:42 <shinkamui> whenever I leave it idle, the load is way down, but as soon as I pick it up, its up in the hi 80s
Jan 31 00:01:48 <shiznebit> something tells me you guys aren't humans
Jan 31 00:01:51 <shinkamui> almost like its saying Im too busy for you
Jan 31 00:01:55 <MikeJB> Hmm...
Jan 31 00:02:06 <MikeJB> When did the N900 come to the US?
Jan 31 00:02:08 <shinkamui> or, stop installing usless shit on me
Jan 31 00:02:13 <shinkamui> MikeJB, never
Jan 31 00:02:13 <shinkamui> :)
Jan 31 00:02:18 <shinkamui> I had mine shipped from finland
Jan 31 00:02:24 <shiznebit> lmao
Jan 31 00:02:33 <shinkamui> I think the tmobile US deal fell through anyway
Jan 31 00:02:41 <shinkamui> so I doubt there will ever be subsidized version here
Jan 31 00:02:47 <shiznebit> to bad
Jan 31 00:02:48 <shinkamui> AND im using it on at&t
Jan 31 00:02:54 <shinkamui> so its like a triple slap
Jan 31 00:02:56 <shiznebit> would have been awesome
Jan 31 00:03:09 <shinkamui> and a grazing testicle shot
Jan 31 00:03:18 <shinkamui> btw, how do you name the phone
Jan 31 00:03:28 <shinkamui> just edit the hostname file
Jan 31 00:03:36 <shinkamui> or is there a proper way to do it
Jan 31 00:04:00 <shinkamui> Im tired of seeing that ridiculously long string show up on my computers when they find the device
Jan 31 00:04:43 <shiznebit> is tethering simple to do on the N900 ?
Jan 31 00:04:51 <shinkamui> yes
Jan 31 00:05:03 <shinkamui> theres an app for that :)
Jan 31 00:05:32 <MikeJB> Bah. This is really bothering me. It looks like a fun toy, but it also looks pricey for a toy if I can't really find it lower than the mid-$500s...
Jan 31 00:06:22 <shiznebit> thats why I will wait
Jan 31 00:06:23 <MikeJB> I mean, it's basically Linux... in a pocket-sized device. I'd love to mess around with it and see what it can do...
Jan 31 00:06:39 <MikeJB> But ideally, I'd pay $400 tops for this.
Jan 31 00:06:53 <shiznebit> MikeJB: almost exactly the same thing a beagleboard can
Jan 31 00:06:53 <MikeJB> Just based on comparative pricing of electronic devices.
Jan 31 00:07:16 <shiznebit> the size is substantially smaller
Jan 31 00:07:35 <MikeJB> Yeah, true, this is smaller than most things I'm comparing it to in my head, which probably makes it more expensive.
Jan 31 00:07:54 <MikeJB> and 32 GB is a good amount of storage. Maybe too good.
Jan 31 00:08:26 <shiznebit> just wait till A9 comes out and Maemo 6
Jan 31 00:08:37 <MikeJB> A9 is the successor device?
Jan 31 00:08:46 <woglinde> processor
Jan 31 00:08:54 <woglinde> or better core
Jan 31 00:09:03 <shiznebit> A9 is the successor processor
Jan 31 00:09:07 <shinkamui> MikeJB, sucks, but thats the deal
Jan 31 00:09:12 <shinkamui> its barely 2 months old
Jan 31 00:09:20 <woglinde> or A4
Jan 31 00:09:20 <woglinde> lol
Jan 31 00:09:21 <shinkamui> you'll have to wait at least a year to see a better price
Jan 31 00:09:43 <shiznebit> wtf is A4 ?
Jan 31 00:09:57 <shinkamui> iTampons processor is derived from it
Jan 31 00:10:17 <MikeJB> shinkamui: I guess it's probably because most phones here in the US are heavily subsidized to about 1/3 of the price.
Jan 31 00:10:24 <shinkamui> yup
Jan 31 00:10:33 <MikeJB> Nasty trick since it leads to a higher total cost of ownership, but it makes us Americans hesitant at paying more than $500 for a phone.
Jan 31 00:10:44 <shinkamui> you should normally expect to pay around 500-600 for a solid device out of contract
Jan 31 00:10:52 <woglinde> shiznebit A4 is the custom arm core soc apple developed for the ipad
Jan 31 00:11:26 <MikeJB> Does the N900 have any paid apps or is it a mostly free (price) ecosystem?
Jan 31 00:11:35 <shinkamui> has some paid apps
Jan 31 00:11:39 <shiznebit> woglinde: any clue what the specs are ?
Jan 31 00:11:39 <shinkamui> they've dissapeared already :)
Jan 31 00:11:43 <shinkamui> angry birds ftw!
Jan 31 00:11:48 <shinkamui> shiznebit, 1ghz iirc
Jan 31 00:11:52 <woglinde> shinzebot google should help you
Jan 31 00:12:18 <shinkamui> MikeJB, but for the most part, everything is free and community produced/supported
Jan 31 00:12:34 <MikeJB> So at least there isn't too many hidden fees there...
Jan 31 00:12:41 <shinkamui> if/when nokia brings the ngage platform to the N900, a ton of pay games will emerge
Jan 31 00:12:53 <shinkamui> MikeJB, but the bottom line is, if you want it, its usually pretty trivial to port it
Jan 31 00:13:11 <shinkamui> unless its something obscure or heavy heavy weight
Jan 31 00:13:19 <MikeJB> shinkamui: Is there already a Wesnoth port?
Jan 31 00:13:23 <shinkamui> yes
Jan 31 00:13:29 <MikeJB> Cool.
Jan 31 00:13:36 <shinkamui> I haven't tried it, but there's a wesnoth port to the N800
Jan 31 00:13:41 <timeless_mbp> anyone here w/ an n900 and 10mins?
Jan 31 00:13:42 <shinkamui> and I believe it runs unmodified ont eh N900
Jan 31 00:13:45 <MikeJB> That's pretty much the only non-trivial game I play on my Linux computer.
Jan 31 00:13:49 <shinkamui> timeless, ys
Jan 31 00:13:50 <woglinde> timless aye!
Jan 31 00:14:11 <shinkamui> MikeJB, lol, I play the crap out of warzone 2100, and Jagged Alliance 2
Jan 31 00:14:19 <shinkamui> both on my debian box and my n900
Jan 31 00:14:21 <lpotter> timeless_mbp: depends on which 10 miutes
Jan 31 00:14:24 <MikeJB> My computer has problems with *some* 3D games.
Jan 31 00:14:30 <MikeJB> Warzone 2100 is one that crashes before loading.
Jan 31 00:14:33 <shinkamui> also warcraft2 powered by stratagus
Jan 31 00:14:50 <MikeJB> I got a laptop with an Intel graphics card because I thought they were supposed to have *better* Linux support
Jan 31 00:14:55 <shinkamui> MikeJB, lol
Jan 31 00:15:24 <shinkamui> intel GMA 965+ has great aiglx support
Jan 31 00:15:31 <MikeJB> I like the community size though.
Jan 31 00:15:33 <shinkamui> but are generally poor performers in the long haul
Jan 31 00:15:38 <shinkamui> MikeJB,  yea its pretty nice
Jan 31 00:15:54 <MikeJB> Almost 500 for an IRC channel, and out of what I presume to be European peak hours, too...
Jan 31 00:15:57 <timeless_mbp> do i want to know why NavIt is a utility instead of a location thing?
Jan 31 00:16:47 <shinkamui> MikeJB, seriously, the N900 has chosen you, you need to get one
Jan 31 00:16:57 <woglinde> timeless ????
Jan 31 00:16:59 <shinkamui> its the device I've been looking for for years
Jan 31 00:17:08 <woglinde> I set the section right
Jan 31 00:17:12 <timeless_mbp> woglinde: i'm using catorize
Jan 31 00:17:18 <woglinde> where did you got the package?
Jan 31 00:17:20 <shinkamui> I started with the HTC Exec dual booting linux poorly
Jan 31 00:17:29 <timeless_mbp> and it shows up in the utilities category
Jan 31 00:17:34 <shinkamui> then the SL-C3000 zaurus from sharp
Jan 31 00:17:50 <woglinde> how can activate catorize?
Jan 31 00:17:53 <woglinde> +I
Jan 31 00:17:56 <shinkamui> and now finally the N900 fits the exact category I was lokoing for, a full fledged linux phone
Jan 31 00:18:00 <timeless_mbp> it's in extras-something
Jan 31 00:18:02 <timeless_mbp> just install it
Jan 31 00:18:03 <shinkamui> woglinde, its automatic
Jan 31 00:18:08 <shinkamui> and I hated it
Jan 31 00:18:09 <timeless_mbp> it'll reorganize your menu system
Jan 31 00:18:09 <shinkamui> :)
Jan 31 00:18:23 <woglinde> hm
Jan 31 00:18:26 <woglinde> lets see
Jan 31 00:18:33 <woglinde> maybee the desktop file is wrong
Jan 31 00:18:36 <timeless_mbp> it might be special casing you
Jan 31 00:18:43 <shinkamui> naah, its actually not bad, but you'll have to go into each.desktop file and twaek the groups if you dont like them
Jan 31 00:18:55 <MikeJB> shinkamui: Idk, I think I might have to wait for Maemo 6 (Wikipedia has it down for 2010-2011) or a $100 price cut in the N900... It looks like fun, and it looks like a good complement to a Linux PC, it just doesn't seem worth the unsubsidized price us Americans are stuck with. Again, in the US we're used to paying 1/3 of the real price.
Jan 31 00:18:58 <timeless_mbp> the package seems right
Jan 31 00:19:05 <timeless_mbp> but given that navit seems to be a debugging tool
Jan 31 00:19:08 <timeless_mbp> (no real ui)
Jan 31 00:19:12 <timeless_mbp> they might have special cased it
Jan 31 00:19:19 <woglinde> args
Jan 31 00:19:23 <woglinde> no programms
Jan 31 00:19:24 <woglinde> fine
Jan 31 00:19:35 <woglinde> timeless ah
Jan 31 00:19:40 <MikeJB> Whenever I make up my mind though I can get it in 2 days with no shipping fee from Amazon Prime. :)
Jan 31 00:19:44 <shinkamui> Mike, Im from and live in the US :)  I know what you're saying, but I never buy subsidized devices.  Until recently, we've always had a shitty selection of carrier locked devices
Jan 31 00:19:46 <woglinde> thats the -dbg package
Jan 31 00:19:47 * Arkenoi wonders if there will be pr1.2 in february and what will be the build date
Jan 31 00:19:48 <timeless_mbp> woglinde: ask the author during a business day? :)
Jan 31 00:20:20 <timeless_mbp> Arkenoi: 30 days has september, april, june and november
Jan 31 00:20:29 <timeless_mbp> all the rest have 31, except february ...
Jan 31 00:20:42 <shinkamui> MikeJB, not that this will be the last phone you ever buy, but at least until a maemo 6 device is released, this is easily hands down the most powerful deviec on the market
Jan 31 00:20:46 <MikeJB> shinkamui: I understand that it has a higher total cost of ownership and all, and I'm currently suffering a feature phone that has nag screens for 3rd party apps (Opera) and lacks any real offerings in the carrier's store... at&t basically makes you choose "iPhone, Blackberry, or poor phone"
Jan 31 00:20:47 <timeless_mbp> since 2010 isn't a  happy multiple of 4
Jan 31 00:20:54 <woglinde> timeless of caterize?
Jan 31 00:20:56 <timeless_mbp> that means it has fewer business day chances for an update :)
Jan 31 00:21:04 <timeless_mbp> woglinde: yeah
Jan 31 00:21:08 <timeless_mbp> Jaffa iirc
Jan 31 00:21:08 <shinkamui> and I dont mean raw power, Im including its flexibility as well
Jan 31 00:21:12 <MikeJB> shinkamui: High end phones are starting to be 1GHz
Jan 31 00:21:25 <MikeJB> If it was at the high end of raw power, I'd be sold right there.
Jan 31 00:21:28 <timeless_mbp> woglinde: fwiw
Jan 31 00:21:36 <timeless_mbp> navit seems to commit suicide here
Jan 31 00:21:40 <woglinde> jupp
Jan 31 00:21:42 <woglinde> I know
Jan 31 00:21:45 * timeless_mbp just saw it do that
Jan 31 00:21:53 <woglinde> I am working on a new package
Jan 31 00:21:56 <timeless_mbp> very disturbing
Jan 31 00:21:58 <bfree> MikeJB: if you just want a phone then fine.   if you compare it to netbooks, handhelds, tablets then I think the pricing is very good.   personally I prefer a device not crippled by some "operator" who just wants to make revenue from you
Jan 31 00:22:08 <Arkenoi> http://www.slashgear.com/notion-ink-adam-hands-on-0969281/ interesting technology, much more promising than stupid ipad
Jan 31 00:22:19 <shinkamui> MikeJB, quite true, however, the 1ghz snapdragon vs the cortex A8,  performance wise I believe the snapdragon loses, when you consider the other features on the A8
Jan 31 00:22:20 <woglinde> autobuilder segafaulted at image-converting a lot
Jan 31 00:22:41 <woglinde> but I finished now the code so I dont need it anymore
Jan 31 00:22:50 <woglinde> and read the svg only
Jan 31 00:22:54 <MikeJB> bfree: I agree 100% that it's the freest major phone I've seen. I'm a Fedora user for many years, so I'm not too far ideologically from the Debian users who probably populate this chan.
Jan 31 00:23:09 <shinkamui> MikeJB, fedora sucks
Jan 31 00:23:10 <shinkamui> you suck
Jan 31 00:23:13 <shinkamui> by association
Jan 31 00:23:15 <woglinde> timeless_mbp and you have to setup your map yourself
Jan 31 00:23:17 <shinkamui> :-D
Jan 31 00:23:39 <timeless_mbp> woglinde: definitely a utility :)
Jan 31 00:23:40 <MikeJB> I'm amazed how in just a few years (true) Linux has gone from the extremely-niche Freerunner to something that a well-known phone maker puts its name on.
Jan 31 00:23:41 <woglinde> timeless_mbp is there a way to tell user something when package is installed?
Jan 31 00:23:58 <timeless_mbp> yes
Jan 31 00:24:07 <woglinde> hm pointer?
Jan 31 00:24:08 <bfree> MikeJB: to me it's not a phone, it's an even smaller replacement for my eee 701+usb dongle+basic phone
Jan 31 00:24:09 <timeless_mbp> there's a way to ask users to accept a nag screen
Jan 31 00:24:15 <woglinde> yes
Jan 31 00:24:17 <timeless_mbp> i think crash-reporter does it
Jan 31 00:24:20 <woglinde> but besides it
Jan 31 00:24:22 <lcuk> woglinde, remember the original liqbase you built
Jan 31 00:24:29 <woglinde> lcuk hm?
Jan 31 00:24:33 <woglinde> that was n810
Jan 31 00:24:34 <SpeedEvil> MikeJB: that's somewhat of a false image.
Jan 31 00:24:39 <woglinde> and diablo
Jan 31 00:24:43 <SpeedEvil> MikeJB: linux has been on phones way before FR
Jan 31 00:24:44 <bfree> MikeJB: linux has been on phones for many many years, just most of them never left Japan
Jan 31 00:24:49 <SpeedEvil> MikeJB: in a very polished way
Jan 31 00:24:55 <SpeedEvil> a1200 forex
Jan 31 00:25:03 <SpeedEvil> Just not open
Jan 31 00:25:04 <lcuk> woglinde, the nag screen might still work tho
Jan 31 00:25:13 <woglinde> ~lart sb2 for over mount /opt/maemo
Jan 31 00:25:13 * infobot puts sb2 into a headlock and administers a mighty noogie, rubbing half of sb2's hair of for over mount /opt/maemo
Jan 31 00:25:14 <MikeJB> SpeedEvil: I put "true" in front for a reason.
Jan 31 00:25:19 <lcuk> cant remember, i know one was gotten rid of
Jan 31 00:25:21 <woglinde> or even not
Jan 31 00:25:22 <bfree> and most have been crippled and locked like every other phone any carrier wants to subsidise
Jan 31 00:25:26 <shiznebit> the n900 isn't completely open either
Jan 31 00:25:36 <shiznebit> stupid imagination tech
Jan 31 00:26:13 <shinkamui> dude, I almost bought the moto A1200 2 years ago
Jan 31 00:26:32 <MikeJB> shinkamui: Linux Torvalds would probably disagree with you on that whole "Fedora sucks, you suck by association" reasoning
Jan 31 00:26:35 <shinkamui> or maybe 3 years, I dont' remember
Jan 31 00:26:42 <shinkamui> MikeJB, I was only kidding bro :)
Jan 31 00:26:53 <SpeedEvil> shinkamui: IIRC possibly more like 5
Jan 31 00:27:27 <shinkamui> SpeedEvil, Im saying I almost bought it a few years ago, it had been long out, but it was during my quest to find a hand held linux device that was truely pocketable
Jan 31 00:27:35 <MikeJB> By the way, Finland has the highest percent of Linux useage according to one stats website.
Jan 31 00:27:38 <MikeJB> at around 4-5%
Jan 31 00:27:50 <MikeJB> Therefore, Scandinavia would be a nice place to visit
Jan 31 00:28:15 <SonicSpinner> dont waste ur time and money @ scandinavia lol
Jan 31 00:28:31 <MikeJB> Found a hole in my logic? :P
Jan 31 00:28:33 <mece> MikeJB, well, linux originated here, so I guess there's a reason there. Doesn't make it a nice place to visit. (Although it might be, all the same)
Jan 31 00:28:37 <shinkamui> MikeJB, yea, but 4-5% of 50 people is still only like 2 people :-D
Jan 31 00:28:40 <SonicSpinner> ull find out that the weather is same as the people
Jan 31 00:28:42 <SonicSpinner> cold and gray :D
Jan 31 00:28:46 <timeless_mbp> MikeJB: visiting is fine
Jan 31 00:28:50 <timeless_mbp> living here is a different story
Jan 31 00:28:56 <mece> aahaha exactly
Jan 31 00:30:49 <Corsac> hmhm, cinaest seems to be bugy here
Jan 31 00:31:22 <mece> can dpkg not put files in MyDocs?
Jan 31 00:31:36 <woglinde> mece sure it can
Jan 31 00:31:37 <timeless_mbp> mece: it shoudln't
Jan 31 00:31:48 <timeless_mbp> MyDocs might not be available
Jan 31 00:31:52 <woglinde> but thats breaking some policies
Jan 31 00:33:12 <SpeedEvil> ah
Jan 31 00:33:21 <mece> woglinde, ok then. I guess I'll have to chown the files or something then. I had a couple of files, wanted them in opt, but they belonged to root, so user couldn't write to them, so I moved them to MyDocs to work around the problem
Jan 31 00:35:03 <timeless_mbp> that's cheating
Jan 31 00:35:09 <mece> figures.
Jan 31 00:35:10 <timeless_mbp> MyDocs /happens/ to be VFAT
Jan 31 00:35:18 <timeless_mbp> but please don't assume it will always be VFAT
Jan 31 00:35:29 <timeless_mbp> if it isn't mounted, it'd actually land there owned by root
Jan 31 00:36:29 <mece> timeless_mbp, right, that would be a problem. So chown then... is that done in a post install script or something? I'm completely clueless about this. Just used py2deb to make the deb.
Jan 31 00:37:20 <javispedro> mece: just do it in debian/rules, install rule.
Jan 31 00:37:23 <wazd> pleeease, can anybody shot some pics of Marina theme? :)
Jan 31 00:37:37 <wazd> I know I'm annoying :)
Jan 31 00:39:12 <mece> javispedro, ok then. got a link to some documentation on that?
Jan 31 00:39:56 <MikeJB> So Nokia is basically Finland's economy, right?
Jan 31 00:40:04 <mece> MikeJB, pretty much
Jan 31 00:40:12 <mece> went up yesterday. yay!
Jan 31 00:40:31 <javispedro> mece: it depends on how are you building the package. most often, you'll have to put there something like chmod perms $(CURDIR)/debian/package_name/usr/share/file.etc
Jan 31 00:41:24 <shiznebit> MikeJB: they have a ton of car racers
Jan 31 00:41:42 <mece> shiznebit, but they don't pay taxes in finland...
Jan 31 00:42:00 <mece> javispedro, ok, I'll examine the rules file generated by py2deb.
Jan 31 00:42:18 <shiznebit> mece: didn't know that
Jan 31 00:42:39 <mece> shiznebit, the bastards move to monaco as soon as they get a good deal.
Jan 31 00:42:59 <mece> shiznebit, at least the F1 drivers. The rally drivers might be a little more patriotic :)
Jan 31 00:43:08 <ifreq> installing theme now wazd
Jan 31 00:43:22 <wazd> ifreq: 0.99?
Jan 31 00:43:27 <wazd> ifreq: great :)
Jan 31 00:44:56 <MikeJB> Wikipedia says that Nokia has 1/3 of the Helsinki stock exchange
Jan 31 00:45:12 <jebba> 2 billion profits Q4 2009  (!)
Jan 31 00:45:22 <mece> pretty amazing that one...
Jan 31 00:45:26 <mece> compared to the last one.
Jan 31 00:45:27 <ifreq> wazd: do you need some scrshots?
Jan 31 00:45:35 <ifreq> and from what exactly
Jan 31 00:45:37 <wazd> ifreq: sure!
Jan 31 00:45:39 <MikeJB> What's it like living in a company-country?
Jan 31 00:45:55 <mece> You see a lot of nokia phones.
Jan 31 00:46:02 <jebba> hahah
Jan 31 00:46:04 <wazd> ifreq: input fields, notification, status area opened, anything you like
Jan 31 00:46:09 <ifreq> ok sec
Jan 31 00:46:10 <mece> MikeJB, Where do you live that's not a company country?
Jan 31 00:46:22 <SpeedEvil> single company country
Jan 31 00:46:28 <MikeJB> mece: Okay, let me rephrase. A country where one company has a big plurality
Jan 31 00:46:29 <mece> SpeedEvil, righty
Jan 31 00:46:39 <MikeJB> Here in America it's a Fortune 500 country ;)
Jan 31 00:46:44 <SpeedEvil> like india for example.
Jan 31 00:46:47 <mece> hehe yep.
Jan 31 00:46:49 <SpeedEvil> With the east india company
Jan 31 00:47:20 <MikeJB> So do the conservative Finns basically remind people it's their patrotic duty to buy from Nokia? Or is that kinda nationalism unique to America these days?
Jan 31 00:47:46 <wazd> MikeJB: Nokia is making good phones
Jan 31 00:48:18 <MikeJB> I realize that. Basically 50% of the smart phone pie chart is Symbian, which kind of surprises me in an iPhone-is-the-hype world.
Jan 31 00:48:57 * ShadowJK suspects the left side finns are more into the "buy finnish" thing
Jan 31 00:49:24 <mece> MikeJB, mostly more left wingers buy domestic.. right ShadowJK
Jan 31 00:49:29 <MikeJB> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Smartphone <- 50.3% right there.
Jan 31 00:50:14 <mece> MikeJB, yep, turns out north america is not the whole world after all :D
Jan 31 00:50:16 <MikeJB> And yeah, that's really odd to an American. Here, I think it's mostly right wingers who try to hype the "buy domestic" thing.
Jan 31 00:50:20 <ShadowJK> My previous Nokia E75 is still a good phone, the only problem is the apps (it's symbian so my favourite linux apps aren't there), and the small screen resolution :)
Jan 31 00:50:42 <mece> MikeJB, our right wingers are your left wingers...
Jan 31 00:50:51 <ShadowJK> If it had bigger screen res and ability to talk sensible protocols (ssh, rsync, openvpn), I'd get it.. oh wait, I did, it's called n900 :D
Jan 31 00:50:59 <MikeJB> mece: And your left wingers are?
Jan 31 00:51:13 <MikeJB> Full socialists?
Jan 31 00:51:16 <mece> MikeJB, people who were thrown in prison in america in the 50ies.
Jan 31 00:51:43 <mece> MikeJB, no, but more socialist than left wing americans.
Jan 31 00:51:58 <ShadowJK> MikeJB, they have "social" in their name. Except for the real communist party who calls themselves "Leftist party" now
Jan 31 00:52:13 <mece> ShadowJK, who is that?
Jan 31 00:52:24 <ShadowJK> vasemmistopuolue?
Jan 31 00:52:39 <mece> ShadowJK, I wouldn't call them communists.
Jan 31 00:52:40 <MikeJB> So, Finland fought the Russians (and thus was on the German side?) in both World Wars? This is facinating since here in the US, history clearly shows the Germans as bad guys, but from the little of Finnish history I've read, the Russians were clearly the instigators against Finland.
Jan 31 00:52:51 <ShadowJK> mece, they used to have "communist" in their name I think?
Jan 31 00:53:20 <ShadowJK> MikeJB, finland was at some point or another, at war with both "sides" ;-)
Jan 31 00:53:28 <ShadowJK> including germany
Jan 31 00:53:50 <MikeJB> That's really interesting, actually. Finland was kind of caught in the middle of Europe, I guess.
Jan 31 00:53:51 <mece> ShadowJK, that might be yes, in the 70ies when communism was a thing. There actually was a real communist party recently. it died out.
Jan 31 00:54:07 <ShadowJK> yeah
Jan 31 00:54:25 <MikeJB> Because the Soviets basically failed to conquer Finland?
Jan 31 00:54:28 <ShadowJK> Now there's only the "True Finns" lunatics left :) (sorry if someone votes for htem)
Jan 31 00:54:32 <MikeJB> But wanted to conquer Finland?
Jan 31 00:55:10 <SpeedEvil> The house unamerican activitied committee in the US was wacky. I much preferred the blackadder unamerican activities one.
Jan 31 00:55:35 <mece> ShadowJK, arent those guys extreme right wing?
Jan 31 00:55:45 <MikeJB> I find Finnish history interesting because it's usually really unique when compared to the rest of Europe's history.
Jan 31 00:55:49 <ShadowJK> mece, I think they're extreme trolls?
Jan 31 00:55:57 <mece> ShadowJK, pretty much.
Jan 31 00:57:10 <ifreq> wazd: any use: http://deviate.fi/n900/screenshots/ ? :P
Jan 31 00:57:16 <ShadowJK> I read somewhere that the majority of election campaign funding in the 60s and 70s came either from the CIA or from the KGB :)
Jan 31 00:59:26 <MikeJB> So is there any big deal about Karelia that was basically stolen from Finland?
Jan 31 00:59:38 <mece> MikeJB, not anymore
Jan 31 00:59:46 <ifreq> no big deals
Jan 31 00:59:51 <ifreq> wazd: poke
Jan 31 00:59:55 <ShadowJK> not really
Jan 31 01:00:20 <MikeJB> That's why Europe has a very odd-mindset to Americans. I'd bet Americans would *still* be complaining about it. :P
Jan 31 01:00:25 <ShadowJK> There are one or two trolls bringing it up now and then
Jan 31 01:00:36 <apol> is it possible to upload maps from linux hosts?
Jan 31 01:00:42 <apol> to the device i mean
Jan 31 01:01:08 <wazd> ifreq: awesome!
Jan 31 01:01:27 <wazd> ifreq: if only you could shot the browser - that would be perfect
Jan 31 01:01:31 <ShadowJK> Atleast here where I live (west coast finland), there's an organisation that makes yearly trips to Karelia with what you'd call "relief" supplies, to help out poor schools and poor neighbourhoods there
Jan 31 01:01:33 <ifreq> wazd: yeah sure
Jan 31 01:01:35 <ifreq> sec
Jan 31 01:01:40 <ifreq> just browser window? humm
Jan 31 01:01:46 <MikeJB> How was Finland in the Cold War?
Jan 31 01:01:47 <wazd> ifreq: yep
Jan 31 01:01:58 <MikeJB> it doesn't fit neatly into any categorizations I learned in European history.
Jan 31 01:02:01 <glass> MikeJB: as a gateway to ussr
Jan 31 01:02:11 * wazd wants to lick his screen :P
Jan 31 01:03:06 <ShadowJK> MikeJB, "politically correct".
Jan 31 01:03:20 <glass> MikeJB: just read about kekkonen, thats post ww2 finnish politics pre-crash-of-ussr
Jan 31 01:03:21 <MikeJB> I don't understand Finland's role in the 20th century. It doesn't fit into the black-and-white American mindset.
Jan 31 01:03:39 <wazd> ifreq: ohoh, and 2 notifications, email (appears in the app swithcer view) and ordinary (volume and stuff)
Jan 31 01:04:40 <glass> MikeJB: basically finland avoided warsaw pact(being occupied) but a lot of politics was dictated by ussr and/or what people thought ussr wants
Jan 31 01:05:24 <ShadowJK> MikeJB, If .fi bought 64 fighter jets, 32 were from Soviet and 32 from West :-)
Jan 31 01:05:29 <MikeJB> So which side of the "iron curtain" was it on?
Jan 31 01:05:40 <MikeJB> This goes against everything Americans teach in history textbooks!
Jan 31 01:05:42 <MikeJB> :P
Jan 31 01:05:46 <ShadowJK> on the western side if any
Jan 31 01:05:48 <Corsac> hmhm, app manager isn't supposed to upgrade everything?
Jan 31 01:05:52 <glass> MikeJB: west, but with lot of trade to ussr
Jan 31 01:06:01 <Corsac> (running apt-get upgrade shows upgrades are available)
Jan 31 01:06:08 <ShadowJK> You could even visit soviet as a tourist
Jan 31 01:06:12 <MikeJB> ...
Jan 31 01:06:26 <MikeJB> You have just killed the entire black-and-white way they teach history here.
Jan 31 01:06:33 <glass> it was pretty popular too. my grandparents went
Jan 31 01:07:01 <MikeJB> The entire 20th century is basically definied as A vs. B throughout all of European history.
Jan 31 01:07:03 <ShadowJK> The militia stormed the tourist buss, collected everyone's passports and wallets, counted everybody's money, and then gave them back. They did the same thing when the tourist buss was about to return to .fi. Except they wanted receipts to account for all the missing money.
Jan 31 01:07:04 <glass> some of the youth viewed ussr as a paradise, but well, propaganda does wonders and rebelling without a cause
Jan 31 01:07:12 <MikeJB> and Finland is basically C
Jan 31 01:07:53 <ShadowJK> Apparently "I spent it all on vodka and all I got was a hangover" was the only valid excuse for not being able to account for the money spent
Jan 31 01:08:00 <MikeJB> lol
Jan 31 01:08:34 <MikeJB> So Finland was basically *above* the iron curtain? It just didn't extend that high? :P
Jan 31 01:08:36 <ifreq> wazd: added 3 more pics on http://deviate.fi/n900/screenshots/
Jan 31 01:09:12 <glass> MikeJB: finland did some quite careful manouvering to stay unoccupied, or thats the general feeling for the reason for the things that were done
Jan 31 01:09:13 <MikeJB> Finland = that space between the end of a curtain and the ceiling?
Jan 31 01:09:30 <glass> MikeJB: and besides, st petersburg has to get it's supplies somewhere
Jan 31 01:09:33 <mece> javispedro, still there?
Jan 31 01:09:34 <glass> at least the rich
Jan 31 01:09:53 <javispedro> mece: yep
Jan 31 01:10:00 <wazd> ifreq: gorgeous :)
Jan 31 01:10:09 <wazd> ifreq: what's your opinion btw?
Jan 31 01:10:20 <ShadowJK> MikeJB, half of .fi's nuclear powerplants were built by a soviet company, to .fi safety standards.. It's said there'd been many more chernobyls hadn't the soviets taken home the safety thinking :)
Jan 31 01:10:26 <ifreq> wazd: i like it :) going to continue using
Jan 31 01:10:43 <ifreq> like when someone put effort to make full theme
Jan 31 01:10:48 <glass> ShadowJK: actually there was a very intresting forum post about that
Jan 31 01:10:56 <ShadowJK> glass, oh do you remember a link?
Jan 31 01:11:06 <wazd> ifreq: yeah, that was really tough :)
Jan 31 01:11:06 <glass> ShadowJK: nope but it was in finnish
Jan 31 01:11:11 <ShadowJK> that's okay
Jan 31 01:11:19 <mece> javispedro, i got a lot of mkdir and cp lines in the rules file, so should I just do the chown pointed at the same file as the cp before did?
Jan 31 01:11:19 <wazd> ifreq: especially without the device :D
Jan 31 01:11:33 <MikeJB> ShadowJK: So what was Finland's economics like?
Jan 31 01:11:38 <glass> ShadowJK: written by some di that was doing it.. basically they didn't get all the manuals and such and a lot of the parts and automation design was done in finland
Jan 31 01:11:40 <MikeJB> The part that isn't Nokia ;)
Jan 31 01:11:48 <ifreq> wazd: haha wheres your device man :)
Jan 31 01:11:55 <javispedro> mece: if the target file is in ../debian/something/... then yes
Jan 31 01:12:01 <glass> but it was purely political that it was ussr tech at all
Jan 31 01:12:07 <mece> javispedro, cool thanks. I'll try that.
Jan 31 01:12:09 <javispedro> mece: also take care of dh_fixperms, you may have to put your instructions after it.
Jan 31 01:12:10 <wazd> ifreq: well, I just don't have one :)
Jan 31 01:12:17 <ifreq> wazd: hope you get one soon :P
Jan 31 01:12:19 <glass> MikeJB: metal, paper, chems
Jan 31 01:12:20 <ShadowJK> MikeJB, some funny stuff too, when Nokia wanted to export a digital telephone central to Moscow, CIA got a sniff about it and was very upset about such high technology being exported to soviet. Eventually it was allowed with the condition that nokia lets CIA know the exact location of the exchanges they installed ;P
Jan 31 01:12:26 <wazd> ifreq: don't think so :)
Jan 31 01:12:39 <wazd> ifreq: it's too expensive in here
Jan 31 01:12:44 <wazd> ifreq: around $1k
Jan 31 01:12:48 <glass> MikeJB: finlands industry got kickstarted by paying ussr a lot of train locomotives etc as war repraials(war-repayments??)
Jan 31 01:12:49 <ifreq> wazd: yeh understoodable :P
Jan 31 01:13:22 <MikeJB> glass: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/War_reparations <- that?
Jan 31 01:13:33 <glass> MikeJB: yeh
Jan 31 01:13:33 <MikeJB> Just a quick wikipedia search
Jan 31 01:13:58 <ShadowJK> Oh I heard a funny story about the war compensations. So they had to build alot of ships for the soviet navy, and they wanted Saunas in them. The soviets demanded the seats be made out of copper (probably the most expensive crazy thing they came up with)... Well just imagine sitting down on metal in 80C room... they quickly went back to wood
Jan 31 01:14:07 <wazd> ifreq: if you'll notice anything wrong - http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=32761&page=8
Jan 31 01:14:23 <glass> MikeJB: but it's like this, st petersburg which is a stones throw away has as many people as all of finland
Jan 31 01:14:46 <MikeJB> ShadowJK: lol
Jan 31 01:14:50 <glass> ShadowJK: haha ouch
Jan 31 01:14:51 <ifreq> wazd: yeh will do, can i remove the pics now?
Jan 31 01:15:11 <wazd> wait a bit, I'll save em
Jan 31 01:15:16 <ifreq> goodie
Jan 31 01:15:21 <MikeJB> I really want to visit Finland sometime now. Europe has so much history America just doesn't have.
Jan 31 01:15:31 <SpeedEvil> yes, it does.
Jan 31 01:15:37 <MikeJB> A little ocean kinda kept us away from everything for a very long time.
Jan 31 01:15:38 <SpeedEvil> It's just most of it wasn't written down
Jan 31 01:15:53 <ifreq> MikeJB: seen any fi movies ?
Jan 31 01:15:56 <ifreq> ie war movies
Jan 31 01:15:59 <ifreq> like winter war
Jan 31 01:16:09 <ShadowJK> they mostly suck
Jan 31 01:16:14 <wazd> ifreq: clear
Jan 31 01:16:19 <ifreq> ok done.
Jan 31 01:17:23 <MikeJB> So is like 90% of Finland concentrated in a certain geographic region?
Jan 31 01:17:48 <wazd> oh those Americans... :P
Jan 31 01:18:02 <lcuk> MikeJB, yeah, mostly within the finnish border :D lol
Jan 31 01:18:49 <mece> javispedro, hmm well it didn't give any errors, but when i dpkg -i'd the deb file the files that were supposed to be chowned, were still owned by root, so apparently that's not the way to do it.
Jan 31 01:19:14 <javispedro> mece: pastebin your debian/rules files
Jan 31 01:19:21 <javispedro> *file.
Jan 31 01:20:51 <mece> javispedro, http://pastebin.com/d77c5400a
Jan 31 01:20:58 <pupnik_> hi t-online germany is blocking DNS for /www.komachose.com/
Jan 31 01:21:23 <pupnik_> german internet censorship blocking / redirecting dns lookups for /www.komachose.com/
Jan 31 01:21:28 <pupnik_> o/
Jan 31 01:21:58 <javispedro> mece: move the chowns after the dh_fixperms line
Jan 31 01:22:09 <javispedro> mece: also, you may want to consider putting that files in $HOME.
Jan 31 01:22:35 <javispedro> (or copying them to $HOME when the user first launches the application)
Jan 31 01:23:34 <pupnik_> some good music there, oh well
Jan 31 01:23:54 <mece> javispedro, ok, so we should have the csv files in home?
Jan 31 01:24:24 <MikeJB> What happened to Nokia's stock? It seems to have peaked around 2007...
Jan 31 01:25:39 <javispedro> mece: i don't know what you're using them for
Jan 31 01:26:04 <inz> MikeJB, 770 was superceded by N800 in 2007...
Jan 31 01:26:08 <inz> ;)
Jan 31 01:26:25 <mece> javispedro, just storing information about comic strips. urls filenames and such. they are modified every now and then from the program.
Jan 31 01:26:46 <javispedro> mece: so they're user settings?
Jan 31 01:26:56 <mece> javispedro, no, totally automagical
Jan 31 01:27:08 <javispedro> so they're some kind of cache files.
Jan 31 01:27:14 <mece> javispedro, yes. very much so.
Jan 31 01:27:16 <MikeJB> I guess 2008 was the year the global economy took a hit.
Jan 31 01:27:31 <javispedro> mece: then don't ship them, and create them when the user first runs the apps under home.
Jan 31 01:27:38 <javispedro> mece: that would be "the ideal thing".
Jan 31 01:27:55 <mece> javispedro, yes, but it makes the program work better if you have them.
Jan 31 01:28:02 <xorAxAx> pupnik_: i cannot resolv that name
Jan 31 01:28:09 <xorAxAx> pupnik_: with my own recursive dns server
Jan 31 01:28:54 <javispedro> mece: so you could make it copy the files from /usr/share/your_ap/file.csv to $HOME/.file.csv if the latter doesn't exist, then write all "cache updates" to the latter file.
Jan 31 01:29:35 <mece> javispedro, yes, that sounds like a pretty good idea.
Jan 31 01:30:51 <mece> javispedro, no need for chowns then, if I let the app create the files.
Jan 31 01:31:25 <mece> and I don't even need to modify the rules file :)
Jan 31 01:31:59 <javispedro> and one change less you'll have to make if for any reason you want to ever run the application under desktop linux
Jan 31 01:34:40 <MikeJB> Ooooh, here's a line you nokia people might like from the CIA World Factbook on Finland (isn't the CIA a lovely organization, compiling all this information on the web on all countries for free in order to better humanity?)
Jan 31 01:34:44 <MikeJB> "Finland excels in high-tech exports such as mobile phones."
Jan 31 01:40:43 <MikeJB> Putting internet users over population, 83.5% of people in Finland use the Internet, which is higher than the 75% here in the US (although we have more people using the Internet)
Jan 31 01:42:18 <inz> MikeJB, you have more people using the Internet than we have poeple.
Jan 31 01:43:40 <MikeJB> inz: My state (provinces in every other country in the world), which is 19th in population, has about as many people as Finland with 5.7 million
Jan 31 01:44:53 <MikeJB> I bet your crime rate is lower though
Jan 31 01:46:17 <derf> There's other countries that call them "states".
Jan 31 01:46:35 <TomTom_> australia for one
Jan 31 01:46:38 <MikeJB> Probably copying the US, like other countries who have the "dollar"
Jan 31 01:46:57 <MikeJB> australia for one
Jan 31 01:47:14 <pupnik_>   
Jan 31 01:47:16 <pupnik_>  
Jan 31 01:47:16 <derf> Yeah, you go tell them that.
Jan 31 01:49:22 <derf> They'll go complain about our money that's all the same size and color and our inability to hold federal elections with a uniform procedure.
Jan 31 01:49:38 <inz> MikeJB, province and state are somewhat different things
Jan 31 01:50:30 <TomTom_> I just added the devel repo to install drnoksnes as there were dependancys. I'm just wondering what other apps people would recommend from this repo that are stable and good
Jan 31 01:50:39 <TomTom_> I am afraid of borking my phone
Jan 31 01:51:09 <TomTom_> for fremantle
Jan 31 01:51:13 <inz> MikeJB, and indeed Australia has states, as has, for example, Germany
Jan 31 01:51:48 <inz> MikeJB, Finland has provinces though =)
Jan 31 01:52:58 <TomTom_> as does Ireland
Jan 31 01:53:01 <shinkamui> tomtom: everything!
Jan 31 01:53:02 <TomTom_> and counties
Jan 31 01:53:09 <shinkamui> just keep in mind a lot of stuff in devel isn't optified
Jan 31 01:53:27 <shinkamui> so be sure not to reboot before verifying the root isn't full
Jan 31 01:53:40 <derf> What do I know. I live in a commonwealth.
Jan 31 01:53:47 <MikeJB> inz: I know, province *implies* central government while state implies a more federal system.
Jan 31 01:54:05 <TomTom_> aye, thats the other thing also. with stuff being non optified, alot of ports probably fall under this title?
Jan 31 01:54:14 <shinkamui> lol
Jan 31 01:54:20 <shinkamui> pretty much
Jan 31 01:54:23 <shinkamui> take it one install at a time
Jan 31 01:54:27 <MikeJB> America is such a monolinguistic country.
Jan 31 01:55:17 <TomTom_> ahh hell, where to start
Jan 31 01:55:34 <shinkamui> I suggest you start with mypaint
Jan 31 01:55:44 <shinkamui> easily the greatest paint application ever made
Jan 31 01:55:49 <shinkamui> second only to the gimp
Jan 31 01:56:33 <TomTom_> any remote control apps in there?
Jan 31 01:56:40 <shinkamui> qtirreco
Jan 31 01:56:48 <shinkamui> not a fan though, none of my stuff is in there :)
Jan 31 01:57:09 <shinkamui> also the remote control server lirc can kill your battery if you dont make sure to kill it when you're done
Jan 31 01:57:21 <shinkamui> that could be fixed in the latest version though
Jan 31 01:57:38 <TomTom_> ta very much
Jan 31 01:57:58 <inz> MikeJB, you have relatively more spanish speakers (12%), than we have swedish speakers (6%), yet we're concidered bilingual ;)
Jan 31 01:58:16 <inz> Or linguistic, whatever
Jan 31 01:58:30 <TomTom_> <-- looking at all the apps.... lost
Jan 31 01:58:32 <MikeJB> inz: Imagine if our largest company did all of our documentation and internal communication in another language.
Jan 31 01:58:36 <shinkamui> I think hte joke is that most americans only speak 1 language
Jan 31 01:59:19 <MikeJB> I don't understand one thing about Finland: why is it the leftists who encourage people to buy domestic? I thought the left was internationalist?
Jan 31 01:59:36 <SpeedEvil> MikeJB: 'left' and 'right' are utmost bullshit labels.
Jan 31 01:59:45 <SpeedEvil> They mean very different things in different countries.
Jan 31 01:59:52 <TomTom_> damn, was about to say that
Jan 31 01:59:58 <TomTom_> hate this right and left thing
Jan 31 02:00:22 <SpeedEvil> And even in countries whrere they mostly mean the same - there may be glaring differences in the smaller policies.
Jan 31 02:01:00 <shiznebit> once 50/50 comes out, im sure every scener and avid pirater is gonna be using it
Jan 31 02:01:56 <inz> MikeJB, our largest company uses quite a bit of it's completely own language in internal communication: Nokianglish
Jan 31 02:02:08 <TomTom_> 50/50?
Jan 31 02:02:24 <MikeJB> inz: Nokianglish? Wikipedia doesn't say that. ;P
Jan 31 02:02:43 <shiznebit> TomTom_: sorry wrong channel
Jan 31 02:02:53 <TomTom_> ok
Jan 31 02:02:54 <glass> it's better than nokfinnish
Jan 31 02:03:41 <MikeJB> I really love this channel's community. I can't believe I've killed so many hours.
Jan 31 02:09:57 * TomTom_ is tired
Jan 31 02:10:10 <TomTom_> this devel list is long
Jan 31 02:10:58 <shinkamui> tomtom do you see quake 1 in devel
Jan 31 02:11:27 <TomTom_> one sec
Jan 31 02:12:24 <TomTom_> nope
Jan 31 02:12:33 <shinkamui> damn, its supposed to be there now
Jan 31 02:13:23 <TomTom_> I found quake 3 and open arena
Jan 31 02:13:46 <shinkamui> yep, those I think are just in extras
Jan 31 02:14:29 <shinkamui> there's also a LOT of debs on the tmo that aren't in any repo
Jan 31 02:14:46 <shinkamui> like stratagus, freeRA, and Warzone 2100
Jan 31 02:15:02 <shinkamui> surprisingly red alert actually runs pretty well too
Jan 31 02:17:07 <TomTom_> ohhh red alert
Jan 31 02:17:13 <TomTom_> now there is a blast from the past
Jan 31 02:21:58 <anpr> hi there guys
Jan 31 02:22:17 <anpr> hi there guys
Jan 31 02:25:12 <TomTom_> hi
Jan 31 02:26:00 <anpr> sup ? :)
Jan 31 02:28:44 <TomTom_> not much
Jan 31 02:28:48 <TomTom_> in work, bored
Jan 31 02:57:30 <crashanddie> GeneralAntilles: just seen geneven and his useful contributions.... I understand why you like the guy so much!
**** ENDING LOGGING AT Sun Jan 31 02:59:57 2010