**** BEGIN LOGGING AT Tue Jun 15 02:59:57 2010 Jun 15 03:51:04 very Jun 15 04:09:31 so, I got an n900 on friday (yey!) but I've noticed that the buttons at the top of the screen (when in landscape) are very finicky when you're using your fingers. Anyone else noticed this? I don't have fat fingers or anything. Jun 15 04:09:58 get the newest firmware Jun 15 04:10:06 I think I have it, one sec Jun 15 04:10:23 I had one of the olderones it was like that... new one took care of it Jun 15 04:10:42 have to be firm with the buttons tho :) Jun 15 04:10:43 could try the screen calibration in settigs, never done that... Jun 15 04:10:52 sure that too Jun 15 04:10:54 oh, you mean hw buttons Jun 15 04:11:04 under settings -> about product I have version 10.2010.19-1.002 Jun 15 04:11:18 that's 1.1 afaik Jun 15 04:11:21 no, touchscreen buttons, and calibration didn't make any difference Jun 15 04:11:23 pwnguin: oh, I see Jun 15 04:11:26 hmm Jun 15 04:11:43 are your fingers fat? :) Jun 15 04:11:45 lemme check Jun 15 04:11:48 is there a way to do it via the update software or is it a flashing thing only? Jun 15 04:12:00 yes Jun 15 04:12:03 flashing was really easy Jun 15 04:12:05 imo Jun 15 04:12:07 ham5: I already saw that question coming, see my initial question :) Jun 15 04:12:30 pwnguin: sorry, what was that "yes" to? Jun 15 04:12:45 actually Jun 15 04:12:46 yea I saw that... thats why I asked again ;) Jun 15 04:12:51 ham5: haha Jun 15 04:12:54 im a victim of loudmouth disease Jun 15 04:12:55 no, no fat fingers here Jun 15 04:12:59 i checked my phone Jun 15 04:13:08 10.2010.19-1.002 Jun 15 04:13:14 bah Jun 15 04:13:17 and i know i have pr1.2 Jun 15 04:13:26 it can be very frustrating at times Jun 15 04:13:57 yea pwnguin Jun 15 04:13:58 also, is the mail software not able to distinguish between a mail which has already been read and an unread one over imap? Jun 15 04:14:00 thats the newest Jun 15 04:14:18 never messed with mail Jun 15 04:14:37 for example, if I read an email on my laptop, and then look at my phone, even after send/receive it doesn't see that it has been read Jun 15 04:14:46 c'mon 10.2010.19 is commonly known as legendary PR1.2 Jun 15 04:15:57 doc|home: maybe because you actually haven't read it on the phone? Jun 15 04:16:59 doc|home: dunno if there's common sense about how clients determine if a mail is 'read' or 'new' - on IMAP Jun 15 04:17:19 imap doesn't provide read/unread? Jun 15 04:17:22 DocAvalanche: perhaps, but my ipod touch "knows" Jun 15 04:17:28 I don't know how Jun 15 04:17:42 but I seems to hear some rumble about IMAP on modest being crap Jun 15 04:17:49 seems so Jun 15 04:18:10 anyway, that's relatively minor compared to the buttons thing :/ anyone got any suggestions on that? Jun 15 04:18:32 doc|home: what your iphone 'knows' doesn't mean anybody else on earth agrees upon Jun 15 04:18:34 hm, so the gsm-ranges of the N900 means it can be used in the US and Europe and probably pretty much everywhere else (damn... with the N810 that was no questio :) Jun 15 04:18:45 which butons? the volume ones or the touch UI? Jun 15 04:19:04 doc|home: (buttons) sorry I don't get it Jun 15 04:19:20 CutMeOwnThroat: that wont stop US people from complaining that it doesnt support ATT or "most cell providers" Jun 15 04:19:43 DocAvalanche: the buttons at the top of the touchscreen UI (the back arrow or the X) seem to require very precise screen touches, too precise for fingers. Jun 15 04:19:58 same for the menu button Jun 15 04:20:11 hmm, no problems here Jun 15 04:20:24 maybe you're used to the iphone too much? :-P Jun 15 04:20:24 pwnguin, ah, just found those limitations on amazon.com ... but I was more wondering about Germany... I wouldn't use it in the US anymore... most probably Jun 15 04:20:32 DocAvalanche: I don't own an iphone Jun 15 04:20:40 never have Jun 15 04:21:10 ooh iPod then Jun 15 04:21:11 CutMeOwnThroat: it works on my tmobile acct, i see no reason it would fail in germany Jun 15 04:21:29 all the same to me Jun 15 04:21:32 right Jun 15 04:21:48 really, I asked a reasonable question. I don't think the attitude is necessary. Jun 15 04:21:50 pwnguin: actually it won't Jun 15 04:23:34 they're selling it there... but without a lot of information on what providers it'll work with Jun 15 04:24:05 CutMeOwnThroat: N900 GSM/UMTS is pretty much international worldwide standard, and will just fail on a few 3rd world countries' nonstandard networks, like in northern korea, or USA AT+T Jun 15 04:24:23 awesome Jun 15 04:25:15 DocAvalanche, ah, you meant "it won't fail" ... I kind of translated that into "it won't work there" :) Jun 15 04:26:21 CutMeOwnThroat: yup Jun 15 04:36:25 how can I restart the desktop with out reseting the phone? Jun 15 04:36:37 would /etc/init.d/gdm restart on debian... Jun 15 04:41:57 not maemo-launcher :\ Jun 15 04:45:46 ham5: maybe killall hildon-home ? Jun 15 04:46:06 why do you want to restart it Jun 15 04:49:24 locked up could still access applications tho to run terminal Jun 15 04:55:21 DocScrutinizer, I haven't heard anything from Quim Jun 15 04:55:34 DocScrutinizer, or anybody else who they were supposedly shipped to. Jun 15 05:01:14 good to know ... thanks Jun 15 05:06:08 GAN900: thanks for update Jun 15 05:07:19 d Jun 15 05:18:50 morn Jun 15 05:20:32 ing Jun 15 05:21:34 Stskeeps: how's the volcano? Jun 15 05:22:42 good Jun 15 05:23:03 :-) Jun 15 05:23:46 drop a N900 when you fly over my place on your way back home ;-P Jun 15 05:24:03 giving them away? Jun 15 05:24:26 hehe, doubt im going over germany and i dont have any, even want a second one for myself Jun 15 05:30:53 Touchscreen not working in ubuntu 9.10, grr Jun 15 05:33:53 where can i find the latest theme template with the pr 1.2 changes? Jun 15 05:34:42 what template? Jun 15 05:34:52 argh Jun 15 05:34:54 sorry :) Jun 15 05:47:07 got aircrack in the repos but dosent come with airmon... how you supposed to collect data? Jun 15 06:01:31 airodump Jun 15 06:02:25 dunno if the chan6 bug is fixed yet Jun 15 06:02:47 seperate deb? Jun 15 06:08:44 morning stskeeps. can you point me to the current example theme/template with the pr 1.2 changes? Jun 15 06:22:23 GAN900: go to bed Jun 15 06:23:12 Man, some news titles are truly disturbing... Jun 15 06:23:31 "RIM testing new Blackberry tablet" Jun 15 06:23:50 I mean... "Rim testing"? Jun 15 06:23:56 lol Jun 15 06:24:27 It's a tablet, they'll never rim it... Jun 15 06:33:03 .o0(??) Jun 15 06:33:15 ~dict rim Jun 15 06:33:18 Dictionary 'rim' (4 of 13): the outer part of a wheel to which the tire is attached ;; \Rim\, v. t. [imp. & p. p. {Rimmed}; p. pr. & vb. n. {Rimming}.] To furnish with a rim; to border. [1913 Webster] ;; furnish with a rim; "rim a hat" ;; a projection used for strength or for attaching to another object . Jun 15 06:34:30 ~google urban dictionary rim Jun 15 06:34:33 obviously a pun for native speakers Jun 15 06:35:21 DocScrutinizer2: http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=Rimming Jun 15 06:36:46 rotfl Jun 15 06:37:08 interesting is the circular clockwise movement in the north emisphere and the anti-clockwise one in the southern emisphere Jun 15 06:37:09 :D Jun 15 06:37:36 I'd be tempted to say "that's bollocks", but I think we've been far enough with the sex talk. Jun 15 06:38:26 hm Jun 15 06:38:32 crashanddie : with bolloks you mean "nonsense"? Jun 15 06:38:35 any word on maemo koffice? Jun 15 06:38:43 or actual bt kb support? Jun 15 06:38:52 nextime: I did Jun 15 06:39:30 crashanddie : ok, thanks ( i'm not native english, so, i ask confirm when i'm not sure about a word ) Jun 15 06:39:57 that's england english Jun 15 06:40:24 not imperial US english :) so it doesn't count Jun 15 06:40:27 Yes, commonly referred to "English" Jun 15 06:40:34 haha Jun 15 06:40:38 Macer : so, the "original" one :) Jun 15 06:40:38 s/to/to as/ Jun 15 06:40:38 crashanddie meant: Yes, commonly referred to as "English" Jun 15 06:41:10 nextime: yes.. you know.. the country that used to have a huge empire Jun 15 06:41:28 your bastard mix of coloquial terms and native-inbred savagery doesn't count as anything worthy being named "English" Jun 15 06:41:32 and managed to lose it in wars and starvation protests Jun 15 06:41:51 :) Jun 15 06:41:56 No, they gave something you may not know in the US... It's called Freedom. Jun 15 06:42:06 Macer : nah, britain wasn't an empire, it was a colonial kingdom Jun 15 06:42:11 You know, like... When you let someone be, and leave them in peace? Jun 15 06:42:13 rome was an empire! Jun 15 06:42:27 there is a huge difference. Jun 15 06:42:28 nextime: the russians used to say the same thing Jun 15 06:42:37 Not that an American would understand why you can't meddle in the affairs of others Jun 15 06:43:03 like ireland? Jun 15 06:43:08 :) Jun 15 06:43:17 What about them? Jun 15 06:43:49 and we werent given freedom. we had to kick british ass to get it Jun 15 06:44:12 erhm, no, you had to get help from the French to get it, you tosser Jun 15 06:44:27 hahaha... touche Jun 15 06:44:36 * Macer bows his head in shame Jun 15 06:44:41 you win :) Jun 15 06:44:52 * nextime interesting us vc british match Jun 15 06:45:06 s/vc/vs/ Jun 15 06:45:25 * Macer thinks about ww2 Jun 15 06:45:29 I don't get why the English-speaking world always makes fun of the French (I live in France atm). Jun 15 06:45:32 :) Jun 15 06:46:08 crashanddie : what about italian vs french? Jun 15 06:46:09 :D Jun 15 06:46:19 there is an italian vs french? Jun 15 06:46:35 crashanddie: well.. hitler took france too easily i suppose Jun 15 06:46:44 I thought that was just between two specific football players, both of which have retired AFAIK Jun 15 06:46:49 crashanddie : usually franch and italians are very competitive in many things Jun 15 06:47:05 frEnch Jun 15 06:47:28 Macer: except for the fact that the netherlands, austria, poland and belgium gave in to nazi germany before France? Jun 15 06:47:30 like food, soccer, wine... Jun 15 06:47:57 ( and in my personal opinion italy win, of course! ) Jun 15 06:47:59 :D Jun 15 06:48:20 ok, time to go to do something more productive than make stupid morning flames :P Jun 15 06:48:22 by all Jun 15 06:48:49 Macer: The only thing that sets France apart is that France had a secondary government, which decided to use a secondary capital (in Vichy), rather than remain in the (rebellion-infested) Paris. Jun 15 06:48:57 byE ( fucking wireless keyboard that lose digits... ) Jun 15 06:50:20 Macer: far from me the idea of "loving" or "supporting" France in any way, shape or form, but I like to be just, and most of the surrender-monkey bullshit is completely unfounded. Jun 15 06:52:14 crashanddie: Macer meant Austria :-P Jun 15 06:54:20 what is this now? Stop these political ramblings immediately and get back to only caring about programming, hacking and talking bad about companies! Jun 15 06:54:38 s/political/pseudopolitical/ Jun 15 06:54:38 mece meant: what is this now? Stop these pseudopolitical ramblings immediately and get back to only caring about programming, hacking and talking bad about companies! Jun 15 06:54:48 ;) Jun 15 06:55:12 lol ^well said Jun 15 06:55:23 did I miss some fun? Jun 15 06:56:34 anyway, damn. The Netherlands crushed Denmark. Makes mece a sad nerd. Jun 15 06:56:49 ahemm. Jun 15 07:01:21 hello Jun 15 07:02:07 vknecht, hi Jun 15 07:02:36 mece: to me it seems Denmark needed no Netherlands to get crushed? Jun 15 07:03:14 DocScrutinizer51: indeed. Jun 15 07:09:55 hello Jun 15 07:10:18 Can anyone comment why QFileDialog.getOpenFileName lags horribly on N900 using PyQt4 Jun 15 07:10:52 opening the dialog takes over 2 seconds and even while scrolling it just stops responding periodically for around 200-500ms Jun 15 07:12:46 * Ikarus is not surprised given how slow Python in general is on the N900 Jun 15 07:21:54 lauri: opening a file in MyDocs ? Jun 15 07:22:11 morning Jun 15 07:25:35 marmoute: yes I think Jun 15 07:26:00 light be the slow access time Jun 15 07:28:10 * RST38h moos at hrw et al Jun 15 07:32:06 app manager is a pito got something like synaptic? Jun 15 07:32:44 has anyone used the eduroam network with the n900? Jun 15 07:32:49 synaptic sucks Jun 15 07:32:53 use apt Jun 15 07:33:08 im still goin for gui tho Jun 15 07:33:08 I thought 1.2 would fix something about it but doesn't seem to work here at least Jun 15 07:33:26 1.2 works Jun 15 07:33:29 and I don't understand the choosing of the certificate Jun 15 07:33:46 there's None to be selected, yet certificate manager shows the one I would like to use as being valid for wlan etc Jun 15 07:34:26 I suppose I could do something with cmcli? Jun 15 07:39:33 I dont understand why you would even be having problems with certificates Jun 15 07:39:34 moin Jun 15 07:40:00 ham5, eduroam requires you to have a certificate in order to connect to it, and you also need to supply your username and password Jun 15 07:40:27 I guess the exact authentication methods have some variance since I've googled someone who has eduroam working, but I guess he's on some other campus or country Jun 15 07:41:24 Jaffa: pingy again... Jun 15 07:41:27 I'm in the wireless connection wizard, I select WPA with EAP, then the EAP type for which I've tried TTLS and PEAP, then it asks for a certificate that I cannot choose Jun 15 07:41:49 if I leave it empty it'll try to connect and if I choose PEAP I even get it to prompt for my password but it fails the authentication anyway Jun 15 07:42:48 this thread leaves the impression it should use the available certificates that have been selected for wlan use but I think it's confusing that it asks for it then and doesn't provide any choices Jun 15 07:42:52 https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=6259 Jun 15 07:42:53 Bug 6259: WLAN setup does not give the list of certificates, cannot use certificates with WLAN Jun 15 07:43:52 it could be just some setting but I think I've pretty much tried all combinations that are available from the gui wizard Jun 15 07:44:22 these are supposedly the official instructions for our eduroam http://wiki.hiit.fi/display/it/eduroam+for+Linux+users Jun 15 07:49:06 Morning, all Jun 15 07:49:22 lbt: pong Jun 15 07:50:11 morning Jaffa \o Jun 15 07:50:15 hmm... I guess this thread is more relevant for my problem https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1635 Jun 15 07:50:16 Bug 1635: Eduroam (EAP-TTLS+PAP) WiFi auth Jun 15 07:51:27 Nice encouraging words for Hermes: http://talk.maemo.org/showpost.php?p=715367&postcount=219 Jun 15 07:51:55 heh Jun 15 07:52:19 Hey all Jun 15 07:53:24 morning Stskeeps \o Jun 15 07:56:52 Hi everyone ! Jun 15 07:58:19 Anyone know if it's possible to get a search in bugs.maemo.org sorted by votes? Jun 15 07:59:11 jaffa, you can add the votes column to search results and then order the column afaik Jun 15 07:59:14 in PyQt, are actions in menubar connected the same way regular buttons are? Jun 15 08:00:13 maemo.org seems dead as a doornail. Jun 15 08:00:57 "It's not just you! http://maemo.org looks down from here. " says http://downforeveryoneorjustme.com Jun 15 08:01:05 well, its down Jun 15 08:01:21 I guess the world ended when I got an app to extras.. Jun 15 08:01:28 orr maemo.org :D Jun 15 08:01:55 or wait. I didn't get an app to extras apparently. Jun 15 08:01:56 gm Jun 15 08:01:57 hm Jun 15 08:02:09 mece: Has your app been enumerating over all the names of Satan? Jun 15 08:02:27 mooo! RST38h Jun 15 08:02:36 RST38h, yeah. Would that be a problem? Jun 15 08:03:02 hmm.. so I can now promote my app to extras, but I can't because maemo.org is down. I guess it was a last resort sort of thing. Jun 15 08:03:14 :) Jun 15 08:03:15 mece: Ummm...yea, according to some it would be Jun 15 08:03:40 lcuk2: Ta, will try that. Jun 15 08:04:23 quack, lcuk Jun 15 08:06:09 morning Stskeeps. can you point me to the current example theme/template? Jun 15 08:08:15 is it possible to make TouchSelector widget behavior lazy? I mean, if I have 1000 items, load and draw only items, thats fits on screen Jun 15 08:08:19 ian_r: http://gitorious.org/hildon-theme-example-stskeeps/hildon-theme-example-stskeeps - latest i have Jun 15 08:09:04 stskeeps: does that have the new keyboard and other PR1.2 stuff? Jun 15 08:09:31 mece, are you trying to promoting fessebrick ? Jun 15 08:09:34 it was taken at pr1.2 sdk release, if it is not complete, let me know latest tomorrow Jun 15 08:10:50 k, thanks. i'll check it out and get back to you. Jun 15 08:19:54 I've built a little app for N900 using scratchbox and copied it on the phone (in tmp), but can't run it... how should I do it ? Jun 15 08:20:17 I'd prefer not to have to make a .deb for now Jun 15 08:24:41 hey hey Jun 15 08:25:26 grr Jun 15 08:25:35 my connect does nothing! Nothing I tells you! Jun 15 08:26:20 vknecht, is it a binary or a script (python or other)? Jun 15 08:26:45 zaheerm: a binary (Qt/C++) Jun 15 08:26:56 vknecht: did you build it for arm? Jun 15 08:27:03 yep, in scratchbox Jun 15 08:27:16 vknecht: what happens when you run it? Jun 15 08:27:40 vknecht, were you in your armel or i386 root in scratchbox? Jun 15 08:27:43 mece: his battery begins to leak Jun 15 08:28:10 Khertan, sorry, a little afk. no, Qlister Jun 15 08:28:14 well, when I "click" on it from the file manager, it asks me to select an app to open it with Jun 15 08:28:29 ... Jun 15 08:28:41 vknecht, you need to run it from the terminal or create a .desktop file for it to appear in menu Jun 15 08:28:41 are you seriously trying to run a binary from a GUI tool? -.- Jun 15 08:28:48 zaheerm: yes, and "file" command says it's an ARM binary Jun 15 08:28:58 mmm, ok Jun 15 08:28:59 vknecht: you need to move it away from MyDocs, make it executable and run it from xterm Jun 15 08:29:22 vknecht: so cp it to /home/user Jun 15 08:29:30 vknecht: do chomd +x Jun 15 08:29:38 and then ./ to run it. Jun 15 08:29:50 make that first one /home/user/ :) Jun 15 08:30:11 * luke-jr cps mece to /dev/shm/ Jun 15 08:30:39 * mece doesn't know what /dev/shm/ is, so he doesn't really care. Jun 15 08:30:43 shared memory Jun 15 08:30:47 oic Jun 15 08:30:50 we're all gonna look at your DNA Jun 15 08:31:02 :) Jun 15 08:31:13 you must have a lot of DNA. this thing is still copying Jun 15 08:31:35 * luke-jr waits Jun 15 08:31:58 luke-jr, yea, I've been eating a lot of dna lately. Hooked on the stuff ;) Jun 15 08:32:10 you can do that??? Jun 15 08:32:24 D: Jun 15 08:32:35 om nom nom Jun 15 08:32:54 vknecht: how did it go? Jun 15 08:32:56 eck, it's already filled 1 TB :( Jun 15 08:33:03 just how much DNA do you have mece? Jun 15 08:33:17 great, thanks, it works :-) Jun 15 08:33:34 vknecht: what does it do? Jun 15 08:34:42 it's a front-end for Mupen64Plus v1.9+ emulator Jun 15 08:35:07 even though this newer version is not really available yet on N900/Maemo AFAIK Jun 15 08:36:15 :) Jun 15 08:53:26 pmo dead? Jun 15 08:55:04 Jaffa: pingy Jun 15 08:55:56 I hope my latest t.m.o post is pretty even. Jun 15 08:56:50 I did say b*tch ... Jun 15 08:59:31 lbt: pongy Jun 15 09:01:49 just checking... is www.maemo.org is down ? Jun 15 09:01:55 no Jun 15 09:02:13 somebody doesn’t like it at my ISP then :) Jun 15 09:02:24 http://downforeveryoneorjustme.com/maemo.org Jun 15 09:02:29 that gets asked here alot Jun 15 09:02:33 I wonder why Jun 15 09:03:02 well lol I guess it is Jun 15 09:03:13 was just on it like 30min ago Jun 15 09:03:29 30 min ? that’s an eternity ! :D Jun 15 09:03:41 :) Jun 15 09:11:25 is maemo.or gdown? Jun 15 09:11:38 http://downforeveryoneorjustme.com/maemo.org Jun 15 09:11:42 s/ g/g / Jun 15 09:11:42 FIQ meant: is maemo.org down? Jun 15 09:11:53 it's down for me... Jun 15 09:11:59 ok Jun 15 09:12:16 talk.maemo.org is up Jun 15 09:12:50 and so am I Jun 15 09:12:58 I mean awake, not erect .. Jun 15 09:13:42 ..too late.. Jun 15 09:15:42 alterego: talk and maemo.org are 2 different servers Jun 15 09:17:11 achipa_nettop: thank you for informing me of that .... Jun 15 09:17:27 and, erm, why were you telling me this? :P Jun 15 09:17:38 (I already knew btw too :P) Jun 15 09:19:46 and I bet it's even much more complex, probably both a variable number of virtual servers on a farm of real iron Jun 15 09:20:38 with that really annoying static hosting proxy in front of it from akali :P Jun 15 09:20:53 akamei, yep Jun 15 09:21:32 that's the ones Jun 15 09:21:38 though I muse over "static" Jun 15 09:21:51 Heh Jun 15 09:22:20 To be honest, we all know maemo.org has _never_ veen reliable. Jun 15 09:22:49 I'm suprised that now, after four years it's still this way though :) Jun 15 09:23:13 reliably slow with weekend downtimes you can adjust your watch from them :-) Jun 15 09:23:38 Maybe it's because of the exponential growth of the "community" and by community I mean community+leech-users :P Jun 15 09:23:45 alterego: veen Jun 15 09:31:10 okay, now that's two people that have explicitly said something to me I have no idea what they're talking about :) Jun 15 09:31:35 I think it's too early for networked interactions for me. Jun 15 09:31:42 * alterego goes to have a shower. Jun 15 09:38:43 probly why they are going meego Jun 15 09:40:04 its all about choices Jun 15 10:15:20 top - 13:15:13 up 106 days, 52 min, 2 users, load average: 196.99, 196.69, 196.15 Jun 15 10:15:32 Tells the story nicely. Jun 15 10:16:01 how do you get that kind of load Jun 15 10:16:24 ham5: Storage blocking, lots of clients. Jun 15 10:20:15 So what is up with maemo.org? Jun 15 10:20:21 mece: ^^ Jun 15 10:20:27 the load? Jun 15 10:20:37 I don't really understand what those numbers mean. Jun 15 10:20:41 Well, netapp storage underneath the side is gone. Jun 15 10:20:48 *site Jun 15 10:21:52 mece: It means that on aveage - 169 jobs are running Jun 15 10:22:20 or 196.. Jun 15 10:22:24 is that a lot? Jun 15 10:22:29 yes Jun 15 10:22:30 High load averages usually mean that the system is being used heavily and the response time is correspondingly slow Jun 15 10:22:41 anything more then 3 is unbearible to me Jun 15 10:22:49 mece: Anything above 1 is already overloading. Jun 15 10:22:53 it depends on the system anyway Jun 15 10:22:53 wow Jun 15 10:22:57 its for the last 5, 10, and 15min of the computer Jun 15 10:23:01 it depends how many cpus there are Jun 15 10:23:16 Yeah, true. 8 cores in this case. Jun 15 10:23:18 06:21:47 up 24 days, 1:02, 1 user, load average: 0.00, 0.00, 0.00 Jun 15 10:23:39 my dualcore desktop Jun 15 10:23:43 * RST38h has seen 40 Jun 15 10:24:02 Hehe 40 is nothing :) Jun 15 10:27:22 ham5: judging by you load, why have you even got it turned on it's just wasting energy :P Jun 15 10:28:35 alterego, waiting to serve, perhaps? Jun 15 10:29:13 He could get a one dollar hosting service for less than it costs to run that server :P Jun 15 10:29:33 if it is a server Jun 15 10:49:19 arghgh! maemo.org down :( Jun 15 10:49:33 omg Jun 15 10:49:37 hey Jun 15 10:49:39 it isn't down Jun 15 10:50:13 s/down/unreachable/ Jun 15 10:50:14 thp meant: arghgh! maemo.org unreachable :( Jun 15 10:50:40 I keep getting "The connection was reset" Jun 15 10:51:16 well, TMO works for me Jun 15 10:51:39 Hello people Jun 15 10:51:51 tmo isn't maemo.org :P Jun 15 10:52:17 it is part of it, isn't it? Jun 15 10:53:16 it's hosted on reggie's server (former ITT) afaik Jun 15 10:54:13 really? Jun 15 10:54:35 yep - try "nslookup talk.maemo.org" Jun 15 10:55:11 huh, really! Jun 15 10:55:19 I thought Nokia is paying the bills Jun 15 10:55:41 it is Jun 15 10:55:48 oh, okay Jun 15 10:57:22 so today we get all the tmo bashing without the maemo.org productivity? ;) Jun 15 10:57:47 Stskeeps: since you are the distmaster, by any chance do you know any people who are familiar with the inner workings of hildon-desktop? Jun 15 11:00:07 heh, nice load figures there from maemo.org :p Jun 15 11:01:22 Venemo: is this you get current home screen issue? Jun 15 11:01:34 yes, it is Jun 15 11:01:38 I haven't manage to solve it Jun 15 11:01:50 I found this: Jun 15 11:01:50 http://maemo.gitorious.com/fremantle-hildon-desktop/hildon-desktop/blobs/master/src/home/hd-home.h Jun 15 11:02:01 Well, if you can dynamically add you widget does it add an entry into gconf? Jun 15 11:02:17 and also this: http://maemo.gitorious.com/fremantle-hildon-desktop/hildon-desktop/blobs/master/src/home/hd-home-view.h Jun 15 11:02:34 becuase that's where widgets and positions are stored ... Jun 15 11:03:13 the hd_home_view_move_applet function would solve this, but I don't know how to get the required parameters to call it Jun 15 11:03:32 alterego: that is only the case when the widget is loaded by a loader Jun 15 11:04:09 If I had my laptop I could help you but I wont have it until I go home tomorrow :/ Jun 15 11:04:31 alterego: I will be happy if you help me tomorrow :) Jun 15 11:05:14 X-Fade: here? Jun 15 11:05:32 vldcnst: yes Jun 15 11:05:36 X-Fade: can I pm you? Jun 15 11:05:50 alterego: can I take that as a promise? :P Jun 15 11:06:31 ~seen kakashi_ Jun 15 11:06:33 kakashi_ <~kakashi_@nltk/kakashi> was last seen on IRC in channel #maemo, 10h 4m 12s ago, saying: 'I will document about this in Maemo Forum and ofcourse bug everybody here about it tomorrow (technically today for me)'. Jun 15 11:06:42 I wonder what that guy did. Jun 15 11:07:30 Venemo: sure, same time tomorrow :) Jun 15 11:08:09 vldcnst: You can always try :) Jun 15 11:16:33 alterego: thank you, I'm looking forward to it! :) Jun 15 11:18:44 Is maemo.org down? Jun 15 11:19:03 Ken-Young: seems so. Jun 15 11:19:16 Ken: yes it is Jun 15 11:19:21 Thanks Jun 15 11:21:51 ehlo folks who is doing maewsynth Jun 15 11:21:56 *-w Jun 15 11:21:59 :) Jun 15 11:27:32 which channel in TVU that shows the world cup? Jun 15 11:40:08 how to mandatory update button title from Dialog? Jun 15 11:55:43 which channel in TVU is showing the world cup? Jun 15 11:57:19 what's tvu? Jun 15 11:58:47 hail Jun 15 11:58:56 MOUD: we don't care, go ask somewhere else Jun 15 11:59:16 joga: some illegal tv-channel broadcasting thingy. Jun 15 11:59:35 mindraaaaays Jun 15 11:59:39 k Jun 15 12:05:49 hmm, wonder when i promoted fmms... should be 10 days soon! Jun 15 12:05:55 * frals_ tries to open maemo.org Jun 15 12:07:54 crashanddie: k k Jun 15 12:08:41 * vldcnst wonders who from logica ordered chinese and fed it to the servers Jun 15 12:51:43 oww maemo.org Jun 15 12:52:00 still no joy Jun 15 12:54:15 should we set it in the topic ? :) Jun 15 12:55:50 hey guys is it me or is there NO WAY to share photos via SMS on the N900? Jun 15 12:55:56 and damn where is Video Recording? Jun 15 12:57:21 jcrawford: video camera works Jun 15 12:57:27 under the camera app Jun 15 12:57:30 SpeedEvil, ping Jun 15 12:57:38 pupnik, i see nothing on my device for recording video Jun 15 12:57:44 is there a certain app I have to install? Jun 15 12:57:47 open the camera window Jun 15 12:57:58 vldcnst, ping Jun 15 12:58:01 it's open Jun 15 12:58:02 then click the icon 2nd from the top on the upper right, i think Jun 15 12:58:11 select camera mode to be 'video' Jun 15 12:58:46 ohh sweet thanks for pointing that out Jun 15 12:58:48 :) my bad Jun 15 13:00:15 kakashi_: pong Jun 15 13:00:35 any way to send photos via SMS? Jun 15 13:00:42 or is that not supported for real lol Jun 15 13:00:56 that isn't possible, afaik. but you can send photos with mms Jun 15 13:01:03 search for maemo+fmms Jun 15 13:01:07 i tried fmms Jun 15 13:01:17 always says it is unable to retreive mms message Jun 15 13:01:24 whenever someone sends me anything Jun 15 13:01:28 vldcnst, I got a new battery, I went to the repair center today, but they didn't have the right person! anyways, to flash -- I should try with eMMC content first right? Jun 15 13:01:41 kakashi_: no! Jun 15 13:01:46 vldcnst, as the normal one doesn't work Jun 15 13:02:05 vldcnst, I tried with the PR_Combined arm Jun 15 13:02:22 vldcnst, though I am able to flash, but it gives the same old result Jun 15 13:02:43 jcrawford, what you think of as "sending pictures with sms" is a marketing lie Jun 15 13:02:47 kakashi_: flash rootfs then flash emmc, without rebooting (remove reboot flag from flasher), and use the latest global Jun 15 13:03:33 jcrawford, sms has no support for such things. to "extend" it, telcos creating hideous bastard known as mms Jun 15 13:03:53 s/creating/created/ Jun 15 13:03:53 flailingmonkey meant: jcrawford, sms has no support for such things. to "extend" it, telcos created hideous bastard known as mms Jun 15 13:04:48 flailingmonkey, ok so no way to send with the N900 then? I tried fMMS but it will never download any of the messages that I receive (AT&T) Jun 15 13:05:44 maemo 5 (fremantle) does not have an mms implementation from Nokia, but fMMS is a working solution. I am also on AT&T and have it working Jun 15 13:06:06 it doesn't quite work out of the box/install Jun 15 13:07:09 but putting in the right proxy settings has it working Jun 15 13:08:06 I do suggest reading up on how mms works, it helps explain why its a huge pain in the ass even if its been done before Jun 15 13:10:29 :( Jun 15 13:10:44 not sure why i would need proxy settings i am connected via at&t internet Jun 15 13:10:48 vldcnst, to be thoroughly clear is this the right way --> http://pastie.org/1005292 Jun 15 13:10:49 should just download the messages that I get Jun 15 13:12:06 vldcnst, uh! I am confused after reading this http://sumoudou.org/%E7%9B%B8%E6%92%B2%E5%A4%96%EF%BC%9AFlashing%20Nokia%20N900.html Jun 15 13:13:13 kakashi_: pastie is the correct way. Jun 15 13:13:29 vldcnst, okay Jun 15 13:13:42 kakashi_: do not manually reboot the device between flashing. Jun 15 13:13:56 okay Jun 15 13:15:11 the at&t mmsc server doesn't allow connections that don't go through the proxy, is my understanding Jun 15 13:15:50 flailingmonkey, any direction on where I should read about this then? Jun 15 13:16:11 the fMMS app has a configuration for what proxy to use, so you don't have to change the proxy on the network connection yourself Jun 15 13:16:52 for fmms settings (at&t at the bottom) look on the wiki (i don't know if its up at the moment though) Jun 15 13:17:51 proxyi have mine set to: 66.209.11.32 port 80 Jun 15 13:17:59 what should i flash first rootfs or emmc? Jun 15 13:18:10 on pr1.2 Jun 15 13:18:55 * RST38h asks the Tentacled One to track down the bastard who invented Tracker and suck his brains out Jun 15 13:19:18 What an utterly useless CPU hog... Jun 15 13:19:59 tracker is great. i love how it creates indecies that I don't need at all Jun 15 13:20:24 Somebody's wrong idea of how people use their computers... Jun 15 13:20:59 computers are for storing your porn Jun 15 13:21:10 RST38h: i must say it is a poor hack. An Os should be able to tag a mp3 on file-creation Jun 15 13:21:12 it's google's fault. they didn't start the whole desktop indexing thing but they made it popular Jun 15 13:21:18 index Jun 15 13:21:41 the only stuff you need to reindex is a newly inserted micro-SD Jun 15 13:22:10 thats actually a really good point Jun 15 13:22:24 it should be part of the filesystem level, not userland Jun 15 13:22:44 pupnik: Except that your OS does not create MP3s. You copy them from outside. Jun 15 13:22:48 vldcnst, well, I did that ---> result -- seemingly better ---> I only get the dynamic 4 dots after the Nokia-whitescreen Jun 15 13:23:03 then it would always know when a file changed, instead of polling over and over Jun 15 13:23:12 RST38h: oh i forgot about usb - ty Jun 15 13:23:28 vldcnst, oops, sorry! Success Jun 15 13:23:29 new meme? Jun 15 13:23:30 pupnik: Anyways, I do not want any indexing at all. Well able to use some MP3Tags tool to index and rename my own files Jun 15 13:23:32 vldcnst, thanks a lot Jun 15 13:23:40 i like tracker after sorting out what it shouldnt track, it is however nasty indeed Jun 15 13:23:43 maemo trims? http://www.flickr.com/photos/14560445@N08/4702644921/ Jun 15 13:23:44 kakashi_: hehe, I was waiting :) Jun 15 13:23:46 th3hate, Ideal way -- rootfs then the emmc Jun 15 13:23:58 :) Jun 15 13:24:21 RST38h: just disable tracker in the /etc then Jun 15 13:24:51 Btw, any word on ~qwerty potrait keyboard? Jun 15 13:25:46 pupnik: oh no, it is not that easy Jun 15 13:25:58 pupnik: if you do it, the media player stops seeing music Jun 15 13:26:14 yeah i did that. media player could still launch mp3s from file manager Jun 15 13:26:22 and i used mplayer for the rest Jun 15 13:26:53 look at symphonie in devel Jun 15 13:27:05 Is Symphonie good? Jun 15 13:30:17 kakashi_: wrong! you need to boot a freshly flashed new rootfs *after* you flashed eMMC Jun 15 13:30:37 Anyone experiencing IM connection drops? Jun 15 13:30:39 someone told me it's my router but now I'm on 3.5G Jun 15 13:30:43 dropping every 10 minutes or so Jun 15 13:31:05 DocScrutinizer, I just did the other way round and it worked perfectly, btw -- my device was completely bricked Jun 15 13:32:19 LiraNuna: if it's a jabber connection and the server is openfire then this is a known issue with openfire which doesn't have a released fix yet because $upstream seems to be dead Jun 15 13:32:40 kakashi_: when you flash a new eMMC, then for sure you won't see a perfectly working device unless you also flash new rootfs. New rootfs means unbooted rootfs here Jun 15 13:33:24 kakashi_: so if you correctly do like sugested and don't reboot between eMMc and rootfs flash then you get no problems either way Jun 15 13:33:55 yes, that was what he was told to do, after getting stuck Jun 15 13:34:13 aha! I missed that point, yes I ididn't reboot in between the two flashes Jun 15 13:34:23 DocScrutinizer, my bad! sorry! that is most important Jun 15 13:34:45 i think making sure not to reboot is very often missed Jun 15 13:35:03 if you fail, and reboot, then a frshly flashed new rootfs can cope with a tainted eMMC, but not the other way round Jun 15 13:35:23 exactly, and that is the reason I had to buy a new battery :( Jun 15 13:36:34 and that's the rationale behind flashing eMMC first, THEN rootfs Jun 15 13:48:03 ~flashing Jun 15 13:48:04 flashing is, like, http://wiki.maemo.org/Updating_the_tablet_firmware Jun 15 13:52:59 https://wiki.maemo.org/Updating_the_tablet_firmware#Flashing_the_eMMC_in_the_N900 Jun 15 14:14:37 hrm ok i got fmms to receive mms but cannot send doh Jun 15 14:14:45 times out when i try to send something Jun 15 14:16:24 I had some weird issues with it too earlier. Got a new N900 and installed it -> now it works. Jun 15 14:16:47 But I'm not suggesting you should buy a new one. Reflashing might help :D Jun 15 14:21:27 ohhh i think i got it to work :) Jun 15 14:21:32 thanks flailingmonkey Jun 15 14:39:07 kak?\ Jun 15 14:39:10 kakashi_: \ Jun 15 14:40:13 SpeedEvil, uh! sorry, I was just asking some doubts while I was re-flashing, I could solve yesterday's problem, it was mostly because of the phone's battery Jun 15 14:41:01 ah Jun 15 14:41:03 :) Jun 15 14:51:55 lol, i did it Jun 15 14:51:57 http://rapidfiles.net/images/47985Screenshot-20100615-164847.png Jun 15 14:52:04 exceeded 100k in BE Jun 15 14:54:17 flergh, how long is maemo.org goin' to be down ... :/ Jun 15 14:54:50 three days, fourteen hours and thirty-eight minutes exactly Jun 15 14:55:15 and 456 femtosec Jun 15 14:57:34 kakashi_: were you able to recharge the old battery after you fixed your problem? So you now can use it again? Jun 15 14:57:47 DocScrutinizer, yep that is working Jun 15 14:58:22 DocScrutinizer, that prompts me to look for a solution, if someone has the same kind of problem Jun 15 14:59:05 that solution being like what? Jun 15 14:59:18 charge the battery Jun 15 14:59:29 hmm, yes Jun 15 14:59:34 obviously Jun 15 15:00:04 its a big pain, I went to the nokia center and they didn't have the "right person" to help me out Jun 15 15:00:06 where do you file bugs for things not officially support by nokia, e.g. extras-devel or extras? Jun 15 15:00:40 on the bugtracker mentioned in the package Jun 15 15:00:53 the package should have a bugtracker on maemo.org/packages/view/ Jun 15 15:01:04 I had to buy a new battery specifically for this purpose (ofcourse I am not complaining, the battery should come handy) Jun 15 15:01:05 DocScrutinizer2: so each package has its own bugtracker? a'la garage? Jun 15 15:01:24 each package should have a reference to where bugss are to be reported Jun 15 15:03:23 oh darn, it is down :) Jun 15 15:03:26 So I can't check. Jun 15 15:03:30 oh well Jun 15 15:03:59 someone remember who did chromium port for maemo? Jun 15 15:04:18 check the package itself (the .deb) if you find it somewhere, aiui it should have that info as well Jun 15 15:06:51 my irc logs said jacekowski Jun 15 15:07:08 jacekowski: do you still have your chromium changes available somewhere? Jun 15 15:07:17 i do Jun 15 15:07:29 i have plan to make my own repository Jun 15 15:07:34 but it's WIP at the moment Jun 15 15:07:43 as i do have shitloads of other things to do Jun 15 15:08:14 jacekowski: I know one guy who works on getting chromium working for armv7 and he has some problems with it Jun 15 15:15:57 hrw: cortex == armv7 Jun 15 15:16:35 X-Fade: are you there? Jun 15 15:18:30 yep Jun 15 15:19:14 if i manage to get maemo builder configs from X-Fade i will make my own repo probably today or tomorrow Jun 15 15:19:20 if not it will take longer Jun 15 15:44:25 my bet is that X-Fade's very busy at the moment Jun 15 15:49:52 X-Fade: ping.... need an OK from you Jun 15 16:01:14 question about the accelerometer: I read the file /sys/class/i2c-adapter/i2c-3/3-001d/coord but a standard app does not run with root privileges and I get permission denies. while as root it works. so what should a maemo app do, set the SUID root flag when installing the deb ? Jun 15 16:14:05 benno2, user can read the /sys branch for acclerometers Jun 15 16:14:11 you are doing something wrong :P Jun 15 16:15:05 benno2, many apps make use of the accerometer http://wiki.maemo.org/Accelerometers Jun 15 16:16:11 what is the best way to read acc in terms of ease of use and accuracy? Jun 15 16:17:42 lcuk2, but why does it fail ? I did nothing special. an app packed in a .deb and installed it in /opt/myapp/myapp Jun 15 16:18:00 right, and specifically whats happening.. Jun 15 16:18:31 Nokia-N900:~$ whoami Jun 15 16:18:31 user Jun 15 16:18:31 Nokia-N900:~$ cat /sys/class/i2c-adapter/i2c-3/3-001d/coord Jun 15 16:18:31 18 918 -504 Jun 15 16:18:31 Nokia-N900:~$ Jun 15 16:18:40 and when issuing cat /sys/class/i2c-adapter/i2c-3/3-001d/coord on the xterm it gives me permission denied, but if I do sudo gain root first then it works. it's a N900 with PR 1.2 Jun 15 16:19:14 perhaps the update to PR 1.2 did screw up the permissions ? Jun 15 16:19:15 sounds like someone/thing has borked up sudo for that branch.. Jun 15 16:19:24 doubt it really Jun 15 16:19:39 lcuk2, you running PR 1.2 ? Jun 15 16:19:51 errr ill say yes Jun 15 16:20:07 but i know this has worked from day 1 Jun 15 16:20:11 from before day 1 Jun 15 16:20:21 lcuk2, the question is if I use SUID root on my bin, is that bad ? eg not allowed into ovi store etc ? Jun 15 16:20:47 suid on your bin is wrong if you dont need it to be Jun 15 16:20:54 I tried to search on the net but no postings about permission denied Jun 15 16:21:16 well could you explain your problem beyond "i get permission denied" Jun 15 16:21:20 yeah, works for me Jun 15 16:22:41 benno2, did this ever work on your app? Jun 15 16:22:55 lcuk2, the question is that N900 is pretty standard, had PR 1.1 and got updated to PR 1.2 OTA IIRC, how can I develop an app and be sure that it will not fail on some N900. Jun 15 16:23:53 lcuk2, I did not try SUID root yet, but it was just an idea to solve the problem. I know it's not the best way but we need to understand why it works on your N900 while on on that other one not Jun 15 16:24:11 benno2, your device sounds special, theres so many apps and games and programs using the accelerometer, and in my position i would have heard about specifics Jun 15 16:25:36 lcuk2, I understand, but that N900 to a non-geek user, he told me he did PR 1.2 update via wifi, so I was wondering what I could do to track down the problem Jun 15 16:26:14 benno2, start by pasteinning your /etc/sudoers Jun 15 16:26:24 lcuk2, ok, just a sec Jun 15 16:26:38 something is stopping regular user from catting that /sys branch Jun 15 16:27:02 * lcuk2 waves @ Sampppa \o Jun 15 16:28:01 lcuk2 hey Jun 15 16:30:40 * N900evil takes a horrible risk. Jun 15 16:31:12 I have plugged a disk into my laptop,that if the BIOS became corrupt... Jun 15 16:31:16 Might Jun 15 16:31:19 boot Jun 15 16:31:26 windows! Jun 15 16:31:45 ew Jun 15 16:31:48 don't do that Jun 15 16:31:51 that would be silly Jun 15 16:32:34 Hi Jun 15 16:32:37 maemo.org down ? Jun 15 16:33:08 yeah, retired Jun 15 16:33:10 yep Jun 15 16:33:32 xDaReaperx: we gave up, too many trolls Jun 15 16:33:43 lol Jun 15 16:33:56 hehehe Jun 15 16:34:09 i just wanted to know if it was down , heck i got more info now Jun 15 16:34:12 talk.maemo.org is still up Jun 15 16:34:24 so its more like the trolls took over Jun 15 16:34:33 flailingmonkey: strategic choice. If we shut it down, they would come after us Jun 15 16:34:41 lol Jun 15 16:34:44 sometimes maemo.org gets slow when there is a lot of traffic Jun 15 16:34:51 N900evil: dd if=/dev/null of=/dev/sdX bs=256 count=1 Jun 15 16:35:22 It's even a legitimately owned copy of windows. Jun 15 16:35:24 or maybe better use cfdisk Jun 15 16:35:50 hows the weather DocScrutinizer2 Jun 15 16:35:51 still easy to toggle the "bootable" bit Jun 15 16:36:11 ~weather EDDN Jun 15 16:36:11 beautiful here in glorious hessia Jun 15 16:36:15 Nuernberg, Germany; (EDDN) 49-30N 011-03E 318M; last updated: 2010.06.15 1620 UTC; Dew Point: 55 F (13 C); Pressure (altimeter): 30.03 in. Hg (1017 hPa); Relative Humidity: 60%; Sky conditions: mostly clear; Temperature: 69 F (21 C); Visibility: greater than 7 mile(s); Wind: from the NE (040 degrees) at 8 MPH (7 KT) Jun 15 16:37:30 ~weather Bahrain Jun 15 16:37:32 lol Jun 15 16:37:33 I can't find station code "BAHRAIN" (see http://www.nws.noaa.gov/oso/site.shtml or http://www.nws.noaa.gov/tg/siteloc.shtml for ICAO locations codes). Jun 15 16:37:38 fail Jun 15 16:37:45 benno2, did you fall down the toilet Jun 15 16:37:49 ~fail xDaReaperx Jun 15 16:37:50 xDaReaperx, you Fail! Jun 15 16:38:02 ~weather Detroit Jun 15 16:38:05 the bot fails to fail Jun 15 16:38:05 I can't find station code "DETROIT" (see http://www.nws.noaa.gov/oso/site.shtml or http://www.nws.noaa.gov/tg/siteloc.shtml for ICAO locations codes). Jun 15 16:38:11 more fail lol Jun 15 16:38:13 ~weather ISS Jun 15 16:38:16 I can't find station code "ISS" (see http://www.nws.noaa.gov/oso/site.shtml or http://www.nws.noaa.gov/tg/siteloc.shtml for ICAO locations codes). Jun 15 16:38:19 don't you guys ever learn? Jun 15 16:38:20 -_- Jun 15 16:38:32 lcuk2, the problem is it's on my friend's N900 and he is a noob, so he is not so fast with shell cmds, and file transfers. just a moment Jun 15 16:38:33 ~weather Al Manama Jun 15 16:38:34 ~weather DocScrutinizer2 Jun 15 16:38:35 I can't find station code "AL MANAMA" (see http://www.nws.noaa.gov/oso/site.shtml or http://www.nws.noaa.gov/tg/siteloc.shtml for ICAO locations codes). Jun 15 16:38:37 I can't find station code "DOCSCRUTINIZER2" (see http://www.nws.noaa.gov/oso/site.shtml or http://www.nws.noaa.gov/tg/siteloc.shtml for ICAO locations codes). Jun 15 16:38:41 wtf Jun 15 16:38:53 DocScrutinizer2: apparently not lol Jun 15 16:38:57 ah, the /tg/ in the url ;] Jun 15 16:39:01 ~weather KPHL Jun 15 16:39:03 comeon... Jun 15 16:39:04 PHILADELPHIA INTERNATIONAL AIRPT, PA, United States; (KPHL) 39-52N 075-14W 18M; last updated: 2010.06.15 1554 UTC; Dew Point: 55.9 F (13.3 C); Pressure (altimeter): 30.08 in. Hg (1018 hPa); Relative Humidity: 43%; Sky conditions: mostly cloudy; Temperature: 80.1 F (26.7 C); Visibility: 10 mile(s); Wind: from the NE (050 degrees) at 8 MPH (7 KT) (direction variable) Jun 15 16:39:49 benno2, dont worry i dont expect you or your friend to be a god at linux ;) but whats happening is certainly strange and is not normal. user can and should be able to read the /sys/ accelerometer branch (as we have shown and confirmed) Jun 15 16:40:32 lcuk2, he said he cannot access /sys in general from xterm, now he tries to copy /etc/sudoers as root to MyDocs and send it to me Jun 15 16:41:02 err what? Jun 15 16:41:13 scroll back up a bit Jun 15 16:41:31 there was a netsplit about 5 mins ago ;) Jun 15 16:41:37 and it was discussed then Jun 15 16:41:55 * b-man starts translating all of the comments in liblproc's source code from Spanish to English Jun 15 16:42:20 better than dealing with French SQL Jun 15 16:42:23 b-man, why translate them! comments are for wusses, just regex them out! Jun 15 16:42:49 its variable names that will be bigger problem Jun 15 16:42:57 lcuk2: well, i'm already 2/3 done lol Jun 15 16:43:00 but i suppose you could factor those out too Jun 15 16:43:08 b-man, cant be a big codebase then Jun 15 16:43:26 about 6 c and h files Jun 15 16:43:50 but they have a lot of content Jun 15 16:44:02 how likely is it "he" just tried to *run* the file / directory instead of opening it? Jun 15 16:44:41 lcuk2: sudo?? Jun 15 16:44:45 valdyn, who are "you" talking about? Jun 15 16:44:53 ~ $ ls -l /sys/class/i2c-adapter/i2c-3/3-001d/coord Jun 15 16:44:55 -rw-r--r-- 1 root root 4096 Jun 15 13:12 /sys/class/i2c-adapter/i2c-3/3-001d/coord Jun 15 16:44:57 lcuk2: benno2 Jun 15 16:45:26 that makes a lot of sense valdyn Jun 15 16:45:56 DocScrutinizer2, sure, its owned by root, but user can still read it Jun 15 16:46:03 g2g get a haircut to taim my crazy hair - c ya Jun 15 16:46:21 lcuk2: exactly. How comes sudoers to the game? Jun 15 16:46:29 and i might be wrong looking in sudoers \?/ Jun 15 16:46:34 you are Jun 15 16:46:41 but he mentioned adding stuff and mucking with it ;) Jun 15 16:47:09 that could break sudo , but it couldnt break the cases where sudo does not need to be involved, like reading /sys Jun 15 16:47:11 so what would change permissions of /sys/ branch so user cant access it.. Jun 15 16:47:24 a kernel change Jun 15 16:47:28 lcuk2: some non-trivial modifications to /etc/fstab Jun 15 16:47:39 ( non-trivial for Jun 15 16:47:40 simpler options? Jun 15 16:47:42 ( non-trivial for hime ) Jun 15 16:47:47 basically, he might be trying to execute the file in /sys, instead to reading it with cat, etc Jun 15 16:47:50 lcuk2, here is the user's sudoers file which cannot read the accelerometer: http://pastebin.ca/1883717 Jun 15 16:47:53 s/hime/him Jun 15 16:47:57 flailingmonkey, he said cat failed Jun 15 16:48:08 benno2, we are discussing you :P Jun 15 16:48:24 lcuk2: chmod go-r */*/*/*/coord Jun 15 16:49:22 benno2: please get cmdline and output of ls -l /sys/class/i2c-adapter/i2c-3/3-001d/coord Jun 15 16:49:30 benno2: you can trivially look at the permissions on that file ^^ Jun 15 16:49:39 also of cat /sys/class/i2c-adapter/i2c-3/3-001d/coord Jun 15 16:50:29 DocScrutinizer2, as user you get permission denied when doing ls -ls /sys/class/.... unfortunately my friend with the N900 will be online only in 1h, so we can continue with the tests. Jun 15 16:50:36 ls -la Jun 15 16:50:59 lcuk2, did you see anything wrong in the sudoers file ? Jun 15 16:51:04 benno2: nope Jun 15 16:51:07 no :D Jun 15 16:51:08 thats right, benno2 you don't have an N900! Jun 15 16:51:19 benno2: why would you get permission denied there? Jun 15 16:51:32 ~ $ ls -l /sys/class/i2c-adapter/i2c-3/3-001d/coord && id Jun 15 16:51:33 -rw-r--r-- 1 root root 4096 Jun 15 13:12 /sys/class/i2c-adapter/i2c-3/3-001d/coord Jun 15 16:51:35 uid=29999(user) gid=29999(users) Jun 15 16:52:07 valdyn, thats his question.. Jun 15 16:52:22 strange permission denied things trying to read from /sys branch Jun 15 16:52:24 ~ $ ls -l /sys/class/i2c-adapter/i2c-3/3-001d/coord && id Jun 15 16:52:24 -rw-r--r-- 1 root root 4096 Jun 15 12:00 /sys/class/i2c-adapter/i2c-3/3-001d/coord Jun 15 16:52:24 uid=29999(user) gid=29999(users) Jun 15 16:52:24 ~ $ Jun 15 16:52:25 valdyn, no idea, what I could try is to ask my freind to install an app that uses the accelerometer and see if it works. Jun 15 16:52:27 extra, extra, read all about it, $ is a dollar sign Jun 15 16:52:40 benno2: ask him to list the directories, and not to run them Jun 15 16:53:12 benno2: unusuable /sys breaks alot more than just the accelerometer Jun 15 16:53:21 benno2, just output the exact result of that one little ls -l /sys/... command DocScrutinizer2 asked you to do Jun 15 16:53:34 ( im not sure if his desktop would even run ) Jun 15 16:53:54 guys, he can't. he has to ask his friend to do all these tests Jun 15 16:56:03 flailingmonkey, soon he can :P Jun 15 16:56:08 * lcuk2 vanishes anyway Jun 15 16:56:57 valdyn, lcuk2: ok, as soon as he comes online I will post the stuff on pastebin Jun 15 17:01:45 flailingmonkey, I start realizing that doing maemo development this way is getting quite tiresome :) testing on scratchbox is not like testing on the real thing :) but for those small initial apps (which already work on other Qt targets) I should succed, then at a later stage I can get an N900. :) Jun 15 17:02:39 indeed. most people also assume you have the device in front of you Jun 15 17:04:22 I will say that seeing your creations on your own device, and being able to use them is a lot of fun Jun 15 17:05:40 flailingmonkey, yes, but at least my porting efforts can point out some problems. for example QAudioInput seems to have 5000msec latency when recording, making it useless for interactive audio apps. I'll continune to track the issue down until I find the root of the problem. but looking at the source of QAudio* it seems like the class is incomplete (buffer sizes hardcoded), and then comes pulse audio with its alsa emulation layer. Jun 15 17:05:49 ~weather CDG Jun 15 17:05:52 I can't find station code "CDG" (see http://www.nws.noaa.gov/oso/site.shtml or http://www.nws.noaa.gov/tg/siteloc.shtml for ICAO locations codes). Jun 15 17:07:15 ~weather LFPO Jun 15 17:07:18 Paris-Orly, France; (LFPO) 48-44N 002-24E 96M; last updated: 2010.06.15 1630 UTC; Dew Point: 53 F (12 C); Pressure (altimeter): 30.09 in. Hg (1019 hPa); Relative Humidity: 59%; Sky conditions: mostly cloudy; Temperature: 68 F (20 C); Visibility: greater than 7 mile(s); Wind: from the NE (040 degrees) at 18 MPH (16 KT) Jun 15 17:07:29 ~weather EDIN Jun 15 17:07:32 I can't find station code "EDIN" (see http://www.nws.noaa.gov/oso/site.shtml or http://www.nws.noaa.gov/tg/siteloc.shtml for ICAO locations codes). Jun 15 17:07:53 benno2, double trouble. having audio work and having it work well are very different things Jun 15 17:08:26 ~weather EGPN Jun 15 17:08:29 Dundee / Riverside, United Kingdom; (EGPN) 56-27N 003-01W; last updated: 2010.06.15 1650 UTC; Dew Point: 50 F (10 C); Pressure (altimeter): 30.36 in. Hg (1028 hPa); Relative Humidity: 67%; Sky conditions: mostly clear; Temperature: 60 F (16 C); Visibility: greater than 7 mile(s); Wind: from the E (100 degrees) at 9 MPH (8 KT) Jun 15 17:11:51 flailingmonkey, when we startet the linuxsampler project linux was not even up to the task to provide dropout free low latency audio. so we started writing testing tools and collaborating with kernel developers, they started produce patches and after 1-2 years linux was finally able to do it out of the box (preemption needs to be enabled, not all distros enable it, but at least it is there) Jun 15 17:15:27 lul wut http://img130.imageshack.us/img130/5932/aavamobilemeego.jpg Jun 15 17:15:31 benno2, test cases and metrics are a great way to win over kernel devs :-) Jun 15 17:16:04 benno2, 5000msec? Jun 15 17:16:30 flailingmonkey, yes the only. if you can back up your claims then they listen. and the same is probably true for Qt devs. Jun 15 17:17:14 yes, especially when it comes to audio. the usual response is that its a broken configuration, yadda yadda Jun 15 17:17:52 oo, maemo.org is back up Jun 15 17:17:53 lcuk2, yes, seems incredible but it is so. just opening QAudioInput f=44100 mono, 16bit bufsize=2048 bytes and it says real bufsize around 8000-9000 , chans=2 and if you speak into the mic the data appears a few secs later in the QAudioInput class Jun 15 17:18:48 yeah maemo.org is back Jun 15 17:18:59 yeah it is incredible, i have something using a bodgered arecord and its pretty spritely Jun 15 17:19:02 just that it loads so slow Jun 15 17:19:14 lcuk2, I can write a qt test app, but cannot guarantee when it will be done, we are contemplating to try out the gstreamer interface for audio input. the strange thing is that QAudioOutput works, the latency is decent (probably 100-200msec) Jun 15 17:19:20 but some parts of the site are broken Jun 15 17:19:38 screen shorts, many images Jun 15 17:20:24 benno2, is 0.2 second decent? :$ Jun 15 17:20:44 i know in the past on mplayer classic on my windows box i have to fiddle with latency for some movies Jun 15 17:21:04 lcuk2, ok , not terrible. decent = 50 msec, excellent 5msec Jun 15 17:21:29 godlike -2msec ;) Jun 15 17:22:18 Open Letter/Proposal to allow Maemo on the MeeGo Community OBS : http://lists.meego.com/pipermail/meego-community/2010-June/001041.html Jun 15 17:22:35 lcuk2, given that a DAC introduces 2msec delay too, and sound travels 1meter in 3msec, the difference is not big. therefore around 5msec is a good tradeoff providing "instant" response and not too high cpu usage Jun 15 17:22:54 sure Jun 15 17:23:12 just hearing 5 seconds of lag sounds wrong Jun 15 17:23:59 Where are you getting 'a DAC introduces' from? Jun 15 17:24:00 the only apps that record sound developed by Nokia are closed so we don't have examples Jun 15 17:25:58 huh flailingmonkey ? arecord works Jun 15 17:26:15 and the soundboard pulse(?) is accessible Jun 15 17:26:44 * RST38h reads the drama in bug #10353 Jun 15 17:26:45 Bug https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=10353 result of USSD query should not be shown to user at all (If he wishes that) Jun 15 17:28:18 neither are Qt apps :P Jun 15 17:28:39 nor GTK apps* Jun 15 17:29:07 SpeedEvil, read the data sheet of a DAC (digital analog converter), they are not latency free. since they contain capacitors etc. so 1-2msec is added Jun 15 17:29:14 benno2: Nope Jun 15 17:29:24 benno2: The latency is at most half a sample typically Jun 15 17:29:33 It has to be - there is no analog storage. Jun 15 17:29:41 (other than parasitic capacitances) Jun 15 17:30:02 http://wiki.maemo.org/N900_Hardware_Bus_I2c Hmm. Jun 15 17:30:10 Is that showing up with no CSS for anyone else? Jun 15 17:30:18 (which coincidentally vastly improves the rendering) Jun 15 17:30:38 SpeedEvil, are we talking about an audio (eg 16/24bit 48kHz) DAC ? Jun 15 17:30:38 dunno, seems to have css Jun 15 17:30:43 no css for me Jun 15 17:30:47 benno2: yes Jun 15 17:30:54 benno2: odd question, did you ever do any L4 related stuff? :P Jun 15 17:31:22 benno2: For it to have 2ms delay - it would need to internally store 88 samples. It has nowhere to do this. Jun 15 17:31:30 * MohammadAG51 slaps Stskeeps with a "why doesn't my ts work in Ubuntu" Jun 15 17:31:43 MohammadAG51: dunno, you figure it out Jun 15 17:31:49 MohammadAG51: chances are you forgot to load the module Jun 15 17:31:57 there's a ts module? Jun 15 17:31:59 yes Jun 15 17:32:01 tsc2005 Jun 15 17:32:02 I installed the libraries Jun 15 17:32:10 also Jun 15 17:32:12 tslib, ts binaries Jun 15 17:32:18 what ubuntu version? Jun 15 17:32:18 Stskeeps, no L4 here, no need for microkernels when vanilla linux solves most real time related problems. I did some stuff with RTLinux , generating pulses for a servo motor, but the jitter is too big a few dozen usecs cause the motor to vibrate and reduces it's life Jun 15 17:32:23 9.10 Jun 15 17:32:27 benno2: ah, wrong benno then Jun 15 17:34:42 bug warrrrsss Jun 15 17:35:26 lcuk2, of course 5 secs is wrong. Nokia did not do their homework when writing QAudio* on maemo, they want to push it as the only api to use in order to port mobile apps to any platform (symbian,maemo,meego) but publish incomplete,buggy stuff. yet maemo is capable of low latency, otherwise voip apps like skype would not work. and exactly things like those turn off prospective devs and make them look around for other platforms, like the iphone. I'm not an iphon Jun 15 17:35:26 e fan nor do I plan to develop for. but looking at the apps every stupid developer can achieve fast audio response for both input and output, eg musical instrument apps, vocoders etc. Jun 15 17:36:17 linux solves realtime problems? Jun 15 17:36:31 how come then, we have to wait for seconds, while "vanilla linux" is s Jun 15 17:36:31 ïïµï½ÿ ï½ï°ï·ï²ï°ï»ï¸ ï² ïµïµ ÿïµÿÿÿ - ÿÿÿ Jun 15 17:36:32 ïï¾ï¨ï¸ï»ï° ïµïµ ï´ï°ï²ï½ï¾ ï¿ï¾ÿïµÿ Jun 15 17:36:35 woah Jun 15 17:36:41 line noise! Jun 15 17:36:41 shit Jun 15 17:36:42 benno2: subm Jun 15 17:36:45 it a bug Jun 15 17:36:59 How come then we have to wait for seconds while "vanilla linux" is accessing mmc? Jun 15 17:37:25 We have lutefisk linux? Jun 15 17:37:35 The matrix is bleeding in Jun 15 17:37:53 Stskeeps, doesn't another OS use the same kernel -> same modules? Jun 15 17:38:03 I am not giving up because I think Qt on mobile phone is the future, write once run (almost) everywhere. but Nokia needs to provide some quality assurance so that things works out of the box. if they have problems with audio stuff they can ask for advices ( people, linux-audio-dev list, us from the linuxsampler project, jackd team etc) Jun 15 17:38:32 benno2 <--- is really new to this thing, apparently Jun 15 17:38:35 MohammadAG51: go look for tsc2005.ko .. Jun 15 17:38:52 RST38h, that depends on the driver, normwally with a preemtive kernel you get quite low latency , single digit msec response Jun 15 17:39:04 Stskeeps, it's in /lib/modules..., I know where modules are Jun 15 17:39:20 MohammadAG51: well, you need to load that then Jun 15 17:39:21 :P Jun 15 17:39:24 RST38h, if you need more (50-100usec, then you have to go RTLinux,RTAI etc). but for desktop apps single msec response times are ok Jun 15 17:39:33 MohammadAG51: also, you probably need to look at how meego xorg.conf looks Jun 15 17:39:38 MohammadAG51: on meego n900 Jun 15 17:39:39 Stskeeps, lol it uses the same kernel, shouldn't it get loaded by default? Jun 15 17:39:44 I used the Mer one Jun 15 17:39:49 from gitorious Jun 15 17:39:53 MohammadAG51: no, live isn't fair Jun 15 17:40:20 RST38h, sometimes some hardware drivers are buggy and hold a software lock for long time, blocking the system. it's not linux' fault. there is even a tool, latencytop which shows you where the problem might be, in what code section Jun 15 17:41:01 Linux is not even soft-realtime Jun 15 17:41:12 And you are talking about hard-realtime Jun 15 17:43:32 SpeedEvil, don't worry I will submit the bug and will not shut up until QAudio* works correctly on all platforms. I think developers don't deserve using a different audio API on each platform when Qt can do everything for them. and maemo is quite a big mess, many audio APIs in parallel, which IMHO are a distraction and complicate things. it might ease the porting of some apps though, but who nowadays wants to use the esound api ? Jun 15 17:44:19 Indeed. Jun 15 17:44:37 s/esound/pusaudio/ Jun 15 17:45:01 * RST38h sighs Jun 15 17:45:09 RST38h, I never used the word hard real time. and the definition of soft real time is that you are not guaranteed to get x usec response times. it might work on 99.9% of cases but there might be outliers. so technically each OS is soft real time, it's just a matter of the average response time. Jun 15 17:45:17 Poor benno2, he has his fight ahead of him Jun 15 17:45:50 moo, zap Jun 15 17:45:50 hm, does Phonon provide the ability to stream data from your sound generating function? Jun 15 17:46:31 RST38h, don't worry. :) if every problem was solved too easily life would be boring Jun 15 17:46:58 benno2: I doubt your "problem" will be solved Jun 15 17:47:12 "Not a blocker. Not critical. WONTFIX." Jun 15 17:47:27 RST38h, you mean QAudio* ? we will see Jun 15 17:53:09 hmph, it seems hacky. you would need to subclass QIODevice and generate avi, mp3 or mpg from it?! Jun 15 17:55:05 flux, last time I checked phonon was not able to do it, which is sad becaue it would be useful some times. sometimes like QAudio* where you can define your own QIODevice and do the stuff in the read,write calls Jun 15 17:55:56 benno2, well, pulseaudio has it beat in that, then :) Jun 15 17:58:39 btw, pulseaudios easy api is indeed quite easy Jun 15 17:58:56 the 'real' api, on the other hand, not so. not to mention it's basically undocumented. Jun 15 17:59:09 flux, if nokia used jackd on the N900 instead of pulse audio we would get stable 5msec audio latency from any app. and with a very easy to use API. there is simply no more performant system than jackd. it was developed by expert members of the linux audio community which too are authors of audio apps which require low latencies like ardour,linuxsampler and others. So sad that Nokia did not do their homework and are continuing to use the same stuff in Meego Jun 15 18:00:09 benno2, but does jack have all the stuff pulseaudio has, especially from the volume level controlling side? Jun 15 18:00:23 the additional daemons could be built, of course Jun 15 18:00:32 jack would indeed be quite nice Jun 15 18:01:50 flux, jack provides an API to control any aspect of the routing between sources and sinks and you can write helpers, virtual mixers etc. so the scenario of jackd on maemo would be jackd as the base and a mixer jack daemon which routes the various channels, mixes applies volume, DSP stuff etc. Jun 15 18:03:03 does meego use pulseaudio as well? Jun 15 18:03:42 and jack gives you fine grained control over latency etc. a client on jack exactly knows what the real latency will be, etc. pulse just lies, resamples on the fly, uses intermediary buffers, adjust buffer sizes to odd sizes etc. Jun 15 18:04:55 flux, http://meego.com/developers/meego-architecture , click on the picture and you will see pulse audio Jun 15 18:05:46 well, I can see why they would like to stay with it. perhaps the.. devil you know is better than the devil you don't?-) Jun 15 18:07:15 hey is there any free word , excel document opening software for N900 ? Jun 15 18:07:20 i searched the web but couldnt find Jun 15 18:07:31 at least with meego, we could try an experiment to replace pulse with jack? maemo isn't going to work just because the closed apps depend on pulse Jun 15 18:08:29 xDaReaperx: koffice i think from repos? Jun 15 18:08:44 ok Jun 15 18:08:57 which repository , ? the devel or extras Jun 15 18:09:06 benno2, you could probably try putting jack on a meego netbook, as a very first step Jun 15 18:10:41 flux, yes of course. but OTOH I am disappinted that such a big company like Nokia cannot work in a more organized way before taking important decisions like multimedia architecture. I can understand a joesixpack 2-man company but but not Nokia. it's embassing and yet they are helplessly watching like their smartphone share shrinks by the day. but I hope they do their homework in future, since with Qt etc, the platforms they have are really open and flexible. Jun 15 18:11:43 flailingmonkey, it will probably work out of the box if jackd can access the raw ALSA device. meego is just a linux distro. but what counts is what audio api they ship with. we cannot tell mego users to kill pulse audio on their phones and install jackd :) Jun 15 18:12:14 start a discussion in #meego, i heard its an open project ;-) Jun 15 18:12:21 Lies Jun 15 18:12:28 * frals slaps MohammadAG51 around a bit with a large trout Jun 15 18:12:30 it's as closed as fMMS is Jun 15 18:12:51 busted, doh! :< Jun 15 18:12:59 open code, closed decisions? Jun 15 18:13:40 frals fMMS worked :D Jun 15 18:13:45 moo frals Jun 15 18:13:45 idk how Jun 15 18:13:52 oom Stskeeps Jun 15 18:13:58 MohammadAG51: :D Jun 15 18:14:16 Stskeeps: arriving in HEL tomorrow? Jun 15 18:14:57 hell Jun 15 18:15:09 * frals currently feel like a goldfish wrt to memory/attention span Jun 15 18:15:09 Helsenki smartass :P Jun 15 18:15:20 helsinki! Jun 15 18:15:26 hell-sink-i Jun 15 18:15:42 frals, automatic MMS sending every 5 seconds from camera to yourself Jun 15 18:15:53 then when you feel lost just take a look Jun 15 18:16:06 with an I, never noticed that Jun 15 18:16:17 frals, you're Finnish? Jun 15 18:16:32 frals: i'm here by now but really tired Jun 15 18:16:33 i think hes a swede, even if his surname sounds finnish Jun 15 18:16:39 lcuk2: will set it up when i get my new sim... mms costs me 0.69€ + 3€ per MB on my swedish plan here :p Jun 15 18:16:47 MohammadAG51: negative, swedish Jun 15 18:16:53 Stskeeps: :) Jun 15 18:16:54 frals, 10 seconds then? :D Jun 15 18:17:04 :D Jun 15 18:17:46 are swedes known for their trout? Jun 15 18:17:51 frals: can you drink a basket of 24 bottles of beer without puking or passing out? Jun 15 18:18:06 whats the timelimit? ;) Jun 15 18:18:20 well, in a day is enough Jun 15 18:18:21 i see what you did there! Jun 15 18:18:36 day, lol Jun 15 18:18:40 we have this thing called 'backhävf' where you do that... but its between 2 persons and in like an hour Jun 15 18:18:50 drink a case without peeing! Jun 15 18:19:13 frals: then you will get bakis :D Jun 15 18:19:30 frals: okay, we have kossu (38 % booze) for that. don't have to drink so much Jun 15 18:19:33 Sampppa: :D Jun 15 18:19:43 lcuk2: we are known for avoiding questions! ;) Jun 15 18:19:54 heh council, now you talk! :-D Jun 15 18:19:57 Scelt: its a student contest typethingy ;-) Jun 15 18:20:14 frals: I can imagine that Jun 15 18:20:17 Sampppa: what have you done to valerio btw? :D Jun 15 18:20:34 what do you mean? :D Jun 15 18:21:06 jaska: drinking 12 bottles in an hour and half is not nice anymore. it's more like driking as there's no tomorrow instead of enjoying Jun 15 18:21:20 Sampppa: where is he? :D Jun 15 18:21:23 frals: i heard that there is some football tournament going on.... Jun 15 18:21:52 bah, soccerr is for girls and britts Jun 15 18:21:58 and portuguese... Jun 15 18:22:02 SOCCERRRRRR Jun 15 18:22:08 no one calls it soccer Jun 15 18:22:14 ice hockey is our game Jun 15 18:22:14 it's football Jun 15 18:22:15 :) Jun 15 18:22:21 BBBBBBBBBBBBBBBBBBZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZRRRRRRRRTTTTTTTTTT Jun 15 18:22:23 watching grass grow is more entertaining than football Jun 15 18:22:35 except us americahns :P Jun 15 18:22:41 I bet you guys don't like any sports ;D Jun 15 18:22:54 course we do Jun 15 18:23:05 office chair olympics rule Jun 15 18:23:08 coding doesn't count as a sport Jun 15 18:23:15 :D Jun 15 18:23:21 Sampppa: yeah, ice hockey is one of few sports worth watching on tv ;) Jun 15 18:23:22 Olympic Compiling Jun 15 18:23:33 frals specially when swe vs fin ... :D Jun 15 18:23:36 My i5 wins! Jun 15 18:24:15 Sampppa: ^^ Jun 15 18:24:27 i hear in .fi the sauna world championchips are coming up/just been Jun 15 18:24:37 lbt: just an URL to meego/mailman would have been nice, for all the maemo-devel readers Jun 15 18:24:48 lcuk2: Finnish tv made a filter to filter out that noise Jun 15 18:24:54 tho, like baseball and american football, its a sport won only by the founding country Jun 15 18:25:05 luck2: but thats not nice to watch....well maybe the ladies serie... :) Jun 15 18:25:23 i wouldnt know Sampppa lol do they have a ladies version :D Jun 15 18:25:32 i hear the guys go in >110deg Jun 15 18:25:38 i think they are not in the same Jun 15 18:25:43 let me check Jun 15 18:25:50 Sampppa, the women who would win that... aren't the ones you want to watch on tv :P Jun 15 18:26:32 maybe :D Jun 15 18:26:51 lcuk2: I recall it's 100 celsius Jun 15 18:26:52 but there are own series for ladies.... and the world championships are in august it seems Jun 15 18:27:36 http://k-systems.fi/www/saunaheinola.com/wb/pages/fi/sivut1/kuvia.php Jun 15 18:27:50 http://k-systems.fi/www/saunaheinola.com/wb/media/kuvia/sauna10.jpg Jun 15 18:28:01 i could watch that Jun 15 18:29:20 wow - this woman is the youngest competitor, only 18 years old http://k-systems.fi/www/saunaheinola.com/wb/media/Kuvia2008/Kivaa.jpg Jun 15 18:29:23 Stskeeps: maybe you could answer to the "Open Letter/Proposal to allow Maemo on the MeeGo Community OBS" mail on maemo-devel *only*, to deliver the easy access URLs to meego ML for maemo readers Jun 15 18:29:29 Hi Jun 15 18:29:42 lcuk2: lol :D Jun 15 18:30:06 how hot do you have sanua Sampppa Jun 15 18:30:15 sauna even Jun 15 18:30:21 between 70-90 Jun 15 18:30:23 * frals thinks Sampppa needs to take Silja Line to Stockholm more often to see some real girls Jun 15 18:30:25 depens ont he sauna Jun 15 18:30:26 and do you turn it up as you leave to wind up others :D Jun 15 18:31:43 frals: its dangerous because if you take silja line you are not in a condition to go see girls anymore when you get to sthlm Jun 15 18:31:53 Sampppa: :D Jun 15 18:32:01 besides, last time i went to sthlm a seagull bombed my pants Jun 15 18:32:15 and i started swearing in finnish Jun 15 18:33:01 jaska, did you get deported Jun 15 18:33:43 lcuk, no. why would i? Jun 15 18:34:00 for swearing in a foreign language Jun 15 18:34:18 frals: i prefer Tallinn, hot girls also but cheaper alcohol :) Jun 15 18:34:20 im fairly sure they hear plenty of finnish swearing around there. Jun 15 18:35:00 Sampppa: cant compare swedish girls with those from the baltics ;-) Jun 15 18:35:22 frals: you forget that i lived by the border :) Jun 15 18:36:02 well, to be honest, the 'girls' up north arent considered real girls ;-) Jun 15 18:36:12 you mean reindeer? Jun 15 18:36:13 :P Jun 15 18:36:13 benno2, in extras-devel, someone packaged jackd 0.118 Jun 15 18:36:17 :D Jun 15 18:36:18 frals: so much better than in the south :) Jun 15 18:36:20 lol Stskeeps was just typing same :D Jun 15 18:36:36 lol Jun 15 18:37:49 whos playing in the world cup tonight Jun 15 18:37:54 Sampppa: you gone mad from the climate up north, ;) Jun 15 18:38:05 frals: or here in south... Jun 15 18:38:39 lcuk2: that you have to ask from vdvsx :) Jun 15 18:38:50 funny thing about finland, they are about 5 years behind sweden in terms of 'fashion' and stuff :D Jun 15 18:39:10 frals: im not gonna have this conversation over irc :D Jun 15 18:39:12 quite unrealistic picture you have of finns Jun 15 18:39:17 "up north"? Jun 15 18:39:40 Oh, you're all in Europe. Jun 15 18:39:42 Whatever. Jun 15 18:39:58 Sampppa: :D Jun 15 18:40:15 ManoftheSea up north means something near by the arctic circle:) Jun 15 18:40:49 up north means where you see aurora borealis ;) Jun 15 18:40:55 frals: fashion? don't you tell me about fashion Jun 15 18:41:34 i just see a lot of people here on the streets dressed the way ppl in stockholm dressed 5 years ago.. not that i care, i dress the same as i always have :p Jun 15 18:41:41 frals: last fashion thing I heard from sweden was "man purse" which was actually identical to woman makeup purse but for men. Wtf I must say Jun 15 18:41:55 :DD Jun 15 18:42:20 'man bag' aka 'fag bag', no offence to anyone :) Jun 15 18:42:39 aka. swedish bag Jun 15 18:42:39 yeah, ugh Jun 15 18:42:44 Sampppa: :D:D Jun 15 18:42:47 :D Jun 15 18:42:57 vittu Sampppa! Jun 15 18:42:59 Alla svenska pojkar är hom Jun 15 18:43:02 * frals just exhausted his finnish Jun 15 18:43:03 My manbag holds my reproductive materials. Jun 15 18:43:08 osexual Jun 15 18:43:09 frals: you started this? :D Jun 15 18:43:13 "jag heter homo peter"? Jun 15 18:43:16 Sampppa: :D Jun 15 18:43:31 Hej jag heter, hetero peter Jun 15 18:43:33 ok, let's quit this bs :) Jun 15 18:43:45 indeed Jun 15 18:44:33 was just about to say, time for y'all to move over to #dick-waving Jun 15 18:44:56 lcuk2, what was the world cup channel again? :P Jun 15 18:45:22 btw err finns... appearently having a laundry room in the building isnt so common here.. do you all have a washing machine in your apartment or wtf do you do? :D Jun 15 18:45:34 frals, indeed Jun 15 18:45:34 both Jun 15 18:45:35 yes, this is no longer #maemo, this is now #helpfralsrelocatetofinland Jun 15 18:45:37 we're so rich Jun 15 18:45:49 frals: are you in Finland now mister? Jun 15 18:46:01 frals, some people call washing machine as "wife" Jun 15 18:46:08 frals we buy new clothes Jun 15 18:46:13 lol Sampppa Jun 15 18:46:15 frals: but anyway, we do have laundry rooms but also have washing machines very often Jun 15 18:46:30 it depens if you have space in your apartment for that Jun 15 18:46:49 frals: MISTER. what ya doing in Finland? Jun 15 18:46:52 because like out of 5 apartments ive looked at only 1 had laundry room in the building and like the others had to hav the washing machine in the kitchen Jun 15 18:47:02 and there was like 0 room to hang anything to dry :D Jun 15 18:47:07 Scelt: working ;) Jun 15 18:47:09 typically people have own washing machines, but laumdry rooms exist in almost every building or group of buidings Jun 15 18:47:19 frals: in Helsinki? for how long? Jun 15 18:47:33 4ever Jun 15 18:47:50 drying racks are common Jun 15 18:47:52 Sampppa speaks the truth :( Jun 15 18:48:34 frals: where in Helsinki you live? Jun 15 18:48:51 a hotel in ruoholahti Jun 15 18:48:55 you can have a big place, or a place in Helsinki :-P Jun 15 18:49:16 rich swede, living in a hotel :D Jun 15 18:49:20 no need for apartment :) Jun 15 18:49:23 Sampppa: :D Jun 15 18:49:56 ruoholahti Jun 15 18:50:24 gräsviken! Jun 15 18:50:34 (i love how the signs are in swedish) Jun 15 18:50:47 only when working with maemo do I get to meet other finns :) Jun 15 18:51:01 hi everyone, can anyone please tell me where can I get automake-1.11 packaged? Jun 15 18:51:06 w00t_: i commented on the MR finally (incase you missed it) Jun 15 18:51:08 does anyone know how to run cupsd in easydebian without it bitching about missing modules.dep Jun 15 18:51:13 I thought all the cool software came from finns Jun 15 18:51:29 :D Jun 15 18:51:43 it does Jun 15 18:52:03 what else would they do during the winters :p warmed by the glow of their LCDs Jun 15 18:52:48 well arent they speending the whole winter in the sauna Jun 15 18:52:54 with beer Jun 15 18:53:04 and when cooling, write a couple of lines of code Jun 15 18:53:06 thats true Jun 15 18:53:09 but i guess that would give them good coding ideas for summer Jun 15 18:55:15 frals: saw, ta :) Jun 15 18:55:25 relax time now after work? :) Jun 15 18:55:29 yes, by combining sauna and beer, they remain in the "Ballmer Peak": http://xkcd.com/323/ Jun 15 18:55:52 infobot, Ballmer Peak is http://xkcd.com/323/ Jun 15 18:55:53 * infobot throws chairs and screams at Peak is http://xkcd.com/323/ Jun 15 18:55:59 rofl Jun 15 18:56:01 w00t_: hehe, yeah, not that im working much but unwinding at hotel -> videocall home -> pass out and wake up in 12hrs :D Jun 15 18:56:34 hehe Jun 15 18:56:46 got a computer yet? :P Jun 15 18:57:19 heh, got a temp one ;P Jun 15 18:57:34 frals lunch tomorrow? Jun 15 18:57:49 Sampppa: sure Jun 15 18:57:57 are you close to vdvsx Jun 15 18:58:21 Sampppa: im in the room next to him when hes not on the wrong floor.. tell him to pick me up :D Jun 15 18:58:33 okey :) Jun 15 18:59:15 why do people Jun 15 18:59:30 write code that is never used? poor design! Jun 15 18:59:51 why do birds Jun 15 18:59:55 suddenly appear Jun 15 19:00:20 * flailingmonkey unit tests and javadocs more java... rapidly losing his mind Jun 15 19:00:33 eep i appear to have overloaded the family network Jun 15 19:00:45 im getting tech support calls and shouts from random places ;) Jun 15 19:00:55 * lcuk2 stops debugging per pixel data over wifi Jun 15 19:02:42 World Cup 2010! Today: New Zealand 1 - 1 Slovakia (FT), Ivory Coast 0 - 0 Portugal (FT) and Brazil 0 - 0 North Korea (in progress) Jun 15 19:03:51 the infobot needs to report world cup scores :P Jun 15 19:04:31 wtf Jun 15 19:04:37 is this channel also football related? Jun 15 19:04:48 no, just the britts Jun 15 19:05:11 :o Jun 15 19:05:22 bacon related, at least Jun 15 19:05:35 who here is on an american continent? Jun 15 19:05:45 what do you mean Jun 15 19:06:04 * flailingmonkey peers out from Philadelphia Jun 15 19:06:27 that means North/South America Jun 15 19:06:33 Stskeeps, mm? Jun 15 19:06:38 bacon bacon Jun 15 19:06:49 * lcuk2 searches for bacon Jun 15 19:07:09 ~bacon Jun 15 19:07:11 i guess bacon is a filling substance which will make you even fatter than you already are... Take my advice, bacon is a food for the gods or for underweight models such as that McBeal chick... Jun 15 19:07:51 bacon doesnt make you fat. i once ate nothing but bacon for a whole week and lost weight Jun 15 19:07:59 its the damned bread :P Jun 15 19:08:19 meat make you stronggg Jun 15 19:08:38 * pupnik has spinach Jun 15 19:15:14 vegetarian spinach bacon Jun 15 19:25:32 Hey all Jun 15 19:26:29 who's watching E3, it looks epic Jun 15 19:28:12 MohammadAG51: it always does :) Jun 15 19:28:17 what MohammadAG51 is e3 Jun 15 19:28:28 but a new golden eye and a new zelda ooooh do want Jun 15 19:28:48 http://e3.ign.com/2010/live Jun 15 19:29:22 new xbox 360 makes me cry, i just bought one a couple weeks back Jun 15 19:29:23 MohammadAG51, what in particular? Jun 15 19:29:32 Gaming Jun 15 19:29:39 * GAN900 was going to get a new Xbox but got a PS3 instead. Jun 15 19:29:41 Playstation move and 3D Jun 15 19:29:45 MohammadAG51, ah. Jun 15 19:29:45 Cool :D Jun 15 19:29:47 flailingmonkey: :D Jun 15 19:30:02 Yeah, 3D TVs for under $2000 is kinda scary. Jun 15 19:30:08 heh Jun 15 19:30:17 I'll get a 22" 3D display Jun 15 19:30:28 should be relativly cheap Jun 15 19:30:32 Yeah Jun 15 19:30:44 I might shoot for a computer monitor next year Jun 15 19:30:49 3D is where it's at. Jun 15 19:31:01 :) Jun 15 19:31:11 i'm looking forward to it Jun 15 19:31:27 me too Jun 15 19:31:37 Although 3D movies still knock me out. Jun 15 19:31:50 never watched a 3D movie, yet Jun 15 19:32:04 Really? Jun 15 19:32:05 Wow Jun 15 19:32:07 Yeah Jun 15 19:32:09 Something to see Jun 15 19:32:16 Avatar was really cool in 3D. Jun 15 19:32:24 didn't the story suck? Jun 15 19:32:29 which really put me off Jun 15 19:32:32 Meh Jun 15 19:32:42 great tech demo Jun 15 19:32:45 heh Jun 15 19:32:47 It was clichéd Jun 15 19:32:49 as a movie below average Jun 15 19:32:51 But looked amazing Jun 15 19:32:56 hmm Jun 15 19:32:59 and reasonably charming. Jun 15 19:33:13 Avatar was pocahontas, basically Jun 15 19:33:19 lol Jun 15 19:33:27 It was Fern Gully meets Surogates Jun 15 19:33:55 GAN900: an even better comparison Jun 15 19:33:57 Avatar is the first CG movie I've seen where I really didn't notice it was CG Jun 15 19:34:06 Tiger woods with the move, might get me into golf Jun 15 19:34:30 I want 3D Halo, though. Jun 15 19:34:41 heh Jun 15 19:34:49 Killzone 3 is in 3D, i think Jun 15 19:35:01 Killzone 2 was epic in "2D" Jun 15 19:36:17 the unique thing about Avatar was the facial mapping of the CG, capturing more of the actors acting Jun 15 19:37:35 does anyone know what the hell is going on here http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=56214 ? Jun 15 19:39:24 uhm Jun 15 19:40:16 TomaszD: what's your package name called? Jun 15 19:40:23 decoders-support Jun 15 19:40:41 TomaszD: i'd ask the guy to give you his sources.list Jun 15 19:40:57 flailingmonkey, avatar had excellent fx Jun 15 19:41:33 omg what a goal! Jun 15 19:41:44 anyway, hi maemites! Jun 15 19:41:44 Stskeeps: how is that going to help? Jun 15 19:42:21 TomaszD: to help diagnose? :P Jun 15 19:42:24 lcuk2, for reals Jun 15 19:42:39 Stskeeps: hmm :P Jun 15 19:43:12 hey anyone checked how often the pelota widget polls for events? Jun 15 19:43:16 yoohoooo Jun 15 19:43:20 PowerVR works! Jun 15 19:43:28 on what device? Jun 15 19:43:28 :P Jun 15 19:43:48 RST38h, who knew? Jun 15 19:44:04 RST38h, now figure out a use for it :p Jun 15 19:44:46 you much mean, on n810? Jun 15 19:44:56 DocScrutinizer2: an url? Jun 15 19:47:29 lcuklcu Jun 15 19:47:57 lcuk: Oh it has never been a problem Jun 15 19:48:05 Stskeeps: N900 for now Jun 15 19:48:16 ah, no fun then Jun 15 19:48:29 * ptl was playing descent on his N900... Became dizzy Jun 15 19:49:20 Stskeeps: you want it on n810 or what? Jun 15 19:50:03 RST38h, I am missing something, what was accomplished? Jun 15 19:51:20 hi guys , where is the % key on the N900 ? Jun 15 19:51:44 i can see it on the onscreen keyboard but on the the qwerty slider keyboard Jun 15 19:52:10 OMG Jun 15 19:52:19 GAN900, epic choice you made (PS3) Jun 15 19:52:27 Stskeeps, whats fun then :P Jun 15 19:52:35 watch E3 when you get on your PC Jun 15 19:53:02 in order to put in %, press blue, then ctrl, then pick your desired symbol Jun 15 19:53:30 oh ok Jun 15 19:53:31 ty Jun 15 19:54:07 np Jun 15 20:25:26 Portal 2 on the ps3! Jun 15 20:25:43 omg yeah that was yesterday Jun 15 20:25:51 ill have to dust off my CC and pc Jun 15 20:26:03 no, it's live :P Jun 15 20:26:09 heh Jun 15 20:26:48 wait, what Jun 15 20:27:20 YES! Jun 15 20:27:24 portal 2 demo Jun 15 20:27:30 check E3 live Jun 15 20:27:43 wow, looks cool, epic soundtrack Jun 15 20:27:53 sure it does, portal kicked ass Jun 15 20:27:58 2 Jun 15 20:28:03 i know Jun 15 20:28:13 2011?! Jun 15 20:28:15 :( Jun 15 20:29:27 hey, they said it wasn't coming to PS3 before, so still great news Jun 15 20:29:48 * MohammadAG51 goes out and punches a random stranger Jun 15 20:57:27 * pupnik_ pokes dead channel Jun 15 20:59:58 G'evening! guyz, "udevadm monitor --kernel" gives nothing in output, could anyone help check it with maemo omap-1 kernel? Jun 15 21:00:06 ~poke pupnik_ Jun 15 21:00:07 * infobot cuts down a small tree, sneaks up behind pupnik_, pokes pupnik_ repeatedly, hilarity ensues. Jun 15 21:02:11 which webbrowser for the n900 consumes the less energy as possible ? Jun 15 21:02:26 using opera atm Jun 15 21:02:46 opera uses most energy... ;) Jun 15 21:02:49 power consumption for browsers is largely moot, since more will be eaten by the radio and screen Jun 15 21:03:18 microlith: I don't agree... try leaving Opera on a page with some animation.... Jun 15 21:03:24 ye i notice it really drains th ebattery quickly.. had to recharge 2 times at work :( Jun 15 21:04:22 It depends. Jun 15 21:04:44 3G isn't actually too bad if you load a page every minute. Jun 15 21:04:59 And screen can easily not dominate if it's not at max brightness Jun 15 21:05:17 nite all, sweet dreams Jun 15 21:05:35 already put that to lowest setting Jun 15 21:06:00 found a battery that has double capacity it seems Jun 15 21:06:36 wifi helps lots. Jun 15 21:07:52 mac brightness is overkill :) but I use it at my desk, when I have it plugged in and want to see from farther away Jun 15 21:08:01 s/mac/max/ Jun 15 21:08:02 flailingmonkey meant: max brightness is overkill :) but I use it at my desk, when I have it plugged in and want to see from farther away Jun 15 21:08:19 lol Jun 15 21:08:41 microb is wonderful for the JAVASCRIPT PAUSING feature! Jun 15 21:08:56 so happy they implemented it :D Jun 15 21:27:01 pupnik_, its quite nice isnt it, but it has effect of people thinking pages stopped (which they have) if they dont know what its doing Jun 15 21:27:43 yes, but this just toooo useful Jun 15 21:32:14 evening simon \o Jun 15 21:32:57 lardman even Jun 15 21:34:08 hey lcuk Jun 15 21:34:59 lardman, this downsampling to get barcodes lark is a bit complex! Jun 15 21:35:18 really? Using the pipeline? Jun 15 21:35:45 no i just followed the original thread of barcode stuff i did way back when Jun 15 21:36:09 grabbing valid barcodes from a 320pixel wide stream Jun 15 21:36:20 valid codes from ~144 pixels Jun 15 21:37:32 ah ok :) Jun 15 21:37:54 lardman, i downloaded mbarcode earlier too - you have green flashes on the gst pipeline! Jun 15 21:38:24 hmm, so I've heard Jun 15 21:38:30 didn't you have that in liq*? :) Jun 15 21:38:32 I'll have to take another look at that Jun 15 21:38:59 MohammadAG51, yeah baseline detection, i decided to follow train of thought to turn them into valid codes Jun 15 21:39:19 lardman, solved green flash in liqbase, but im not sure how you are getting gstream Jun 15 21:39:27 ie, i thought you were entirely in rgb Jun 15 21:39:36 hmm, yes green + purple/pink Jun 15 21:39:50 green is UV layers == 0 Jun 15 21:40:00 we run in YUV as we don't want colour info, just the greyscale stuff Jun 15 21:40:01 purple and pink are other corners Jun 15 21:40:17 yeah its nice like that Jun 15 21:40:39 it's afaicr a side effect of the pipeline pausing while the autofocus is performed Jun 15 21:40:48 yeah it sounds likely Jun 15 21:40:58 how did you solve things then? RGB all the way? Jun 15 21:41:02 its very juddery to flash and focus and green flash at same time Jun 15 21:41:22 no, its related to setting the overlay colorkey Jun 15 21:41:29 just a mo Jun 15 21:41:35 hmm, any code pointers? Jun 15 21:42:27 (C) Just comment it out Jun 15 21:43:18 * lardman wonders how the changelog will look: removed camera interface to avoid green/pink flashing, side effect of not being able to scan barcodes anymore Jun 15 21:43:26 :) Jun 15 21:44:09 http://github.com/lcuk/libliqbase/blob/master/src/liqx11info.c#L195 Jun 15 21:44:26 lardman, that is the point at start BEFORE i opened any windows - i ask system for the settings Jun 15 21:44:34 and i force my own (black) one in place Jun 15 21:44:51 then, to be sure a bit lower down I also set the background color of the window to it Jun 15 21:45:08 actually, its very slightly grey - pure black bleeds through lots of things.. Jun 15 21:45:22 hmm, what about under Qt? Jun 15 21:46:10 qt has this sort of code deep within it :p Jun 15 21:46:11 I always had the feeling it wasn't the background, or does the overlay have a background colour too? Jun 15 21:46:23 i dunno which patchway you are using or whether theres already an analog Jun 15 21:46:29 but thats how i fixed it for me :) Jun 15 21:46:32 oh wunderbar, I'll have to do some digging then Jun 15 21:46:47 sorry! not an answer on a plate but a lead you can follow Jun 15 21:46:48 thanks for the pointer and code, will do some digging Jun 15 21:47:02 yeah I know, just being lazy ;) Jun 15 21:47:07 me that is! Jun 15 21:47:07 arent we all Jun 15 21:47:20 :) Jun 15 21:47:36 lardman, i spent 2 nights playing with barcode and trying to work out why I couldnt scan a UPM Jun 15 21:47:37 UPC Jun 15 21:47:54 oh right Jun 15 21:47:55 before i realised it was an EAN-13 Jun 15 21:48:04 that should work Jun 15 21:48:30 i have learnt all about clean downsampling Jun 15 21:48:58 is the led pattern editor safe to use? ;P it has a scary warning Jun 15 21:48:58 and have taken some random code and made it actually pull out nice fairly accurate bars Jun 15 21:49:12 joga, its scary because its scary Jun 15 21:49:24 fluffy bunnies dont have scary warnings Jun 15 21:49:48 (unless its the Killer Rabbit of Caerbannog Jun 15 21:50:09 shouldn't it be in -devel then Jun 15 21:50:47 why, where is it and what does it matter Jun 15 21:51:07 i can buy guns if i want Jun 15 21:51:14 and those arent safe Jun 15 21:51:47 yeah, but you know what you're buying :) Jun 15 21:52:09 just wondering if someone uses it Jun 15 21:52:38 dunno, where is it tho Jun 15 21:52:54 I wa trying to make the sms and call notifications a different color Jun 15 21:52:55 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XcxKIJTb3Hg Jun 15 21:53:06 I think it's in testing... Jun 15 21:53:07 joga, you said it shouldnt be in -devel Jun 15 21:53:10 ahh well Jun 15 21:53:31 can't remember though Jun 15 21:54:18 anyway, the test worked fine, but when saving, it warns you about possible bricking and urges to manually check everything :) Jun 15 21:54:51 but anyway, I'll leave that for another day, need to sleep now Jun 15 21:54:54 hey Jun 15 21:55:00 anyone here use knots2? Jun 15 21:55:18 mc_teo: yes. Jun 15 21:56:48 norton 360 gives out about netcat Jun 15 21:57:03 and deletes it before it even installs Jun 15 21:57:55 so just wondering what is it actually used for Jun 15 21:58:44 isn't knots a linux app? Jun 15 21:59:06 nope Jun 15 21:59:15 theres a windows installer Jun 15 21:59:36 just relies on the windows ruby interpreter, etc Jun 15 22:00:31 on my n900 i tried to skip forward videos (server is vista), and it just freezes the playback Jun 15 22:01:09 upnp server? Jun 15 22:05:56 tripzero: i have upnp disabled on my router, should i enable it? Jun 15 22:06:11 no Jun 15 22:06:23 my guess is your windows server doesn't support seeking Jun 15 22:06:28 Hello! Does anybody know how to sync contacts and appointsments with KDE desktop? Jun 15 22:06:30 but isn't reporting that capability Jun 15 22:06:45 kW_ syncevolution? Jun 15 22:07:08 kW_, also, google cal Jun 15 22:08:05 tripzero: well, google calendar is not an option due to privacy requirements Jun 15 22:08:23 mc_teo: netcat comes with ruby, google it, it's most likely a false positive. Also, have you tried playing the videos directly with VLC and seeking? it may not be a knots problem. Jun 15 22:08:40 hmm, right, it looks like my issue is that I need to flush or prime the pipeline Jun 15 22:08:50 not sure which Jun 15 22:08:59 vldcnst: ive been playing the videos with vlc, many times, and they play fine Jun 15 22:09:56 mc_teo: does vlc actually crash or? Jun 15 22:10:07 (when using the n900 client) Jun 15 22:12:10 mc_teo: also, have you enabled debug and developer mode? if not, do so and check the knots log. Jun 15 22:13:39 ~seen achipa Jun 15 22:13:41 achipa <~chatzilla@Maemo/community/council/achipa> was last seen on IRC in channel #maemo, 5h 39m 7s ago, saying: 'flailingmonkey: strategic choice. If we shut it down, they would come after us'. Jun 15 22:15:53 tripzero: well, it looks like syncevolution has no complete support for KDE PIM currently...? Jun 15 22:16:16 possibly not Jun 15 22:24:27 lardman, i looked back at the barcode stuff, because im still wanting to make devices say "cheese" and take a photo of them all Jun 15 22:24:53 Qt Creator question, if I edit a header to specify functions, can I get the Qt Creator to automatically generate the skeletons in the .cpp file? Jun 15 22:25:06 * lcuk wanted that Jun 15 22:25:21 would increase speed of prototyping classes Jun 15 22:25:32 i never found one (thats not to say there isnt one Jun 15 22:25:37 lcuk: I'm finally getting cracking on the database plugin so I can list my books, dvds, cds, but is hard work, not much free time atm Jun 15 22:25:56 lcuk: fair enough, not like the "wonders" of M$ then ;) Jun 15 22:25:56 yeah i know - databases are however reasonably straight forward to do simply Jun 15 22:26:11 havent they got datasets and bindable grids? Jun 15 22:26:18 yeah, have to get my head around all this class nonsense though ;) Jun 15 22:26:23 indeed Jun 15 22:26:30 :D Jun 15 22:26:52 vldcnst: where are the logs kept? Jun 15 22:27:14 lardman, a while ago fiferboy had an application Jun 15 22:27:18 for his birdwatching Jun 15 22:27:29 its his rosetta stone - hes done it in many languages and systems ;) Jun 15 22:27:30 I never know whether to use a class or a struct, I guess go classes all the way Jun 15 22:27:38 lcuk: cool Jun 15 22:27:42 anyway, its in qt, uses database and has queries and searhcing Jun 15 22:27:55 I should do some searching for that then Jun 15 22:28:01 a struct is just a class without any explicit members anyway :) Jun 15 22:28:16 theres probably 10 db apps listed in qt creator examples Jun 15 22:28:17 yeah, but I need to think harder now, decide if I need the classiness Jun 15 22:28:45 * lcuk nods Jun 15 22:28:52 yeah I saw, but decided they don't do what I need, so am just going to write some code and evovle I think Jun 15 22:29:15 yup, take a look at fiferboys project anyway, he seemed pleased with it Jun 15 22:29:23 will do, thanks for the heads up Jun 15 22:29:27 im off 2 bed :) Jun 15 22:29:31 gnite simon \o Jun 15 22:29:40 night Gary, nice to chat to you :) Jun 15 22:32:45 Which app do I use to download openstreetmap tiles for offline use? Jun 15 22:34:09 navit uses them, but it is a pain to set up Jun 15 22:34:10 Several will do it. Jun 15 22:34:13 I think maep will. Jun 15 22:34:32 http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Tile_usage_policy bear in mind Jun 15 22:38:38 there are no quick fixes in extras, I'm guessing.. Jun 15 22:38:51 10 days per version minimum. Jun 15 22:39:04 or? Jun 15 22:40:45 hello Jun 15 22:40:48 SpeedEvil: well, maep does not seem to offer such a menu Jun 15 22:45:45 mc_teo: have you found the log? Jun 15 22:53:51 kW_: I was thinking of 'mappero' Jun 15 22:54:21 menu->maps->manage maps Jun 15 22:54:53 SpeedEvil: you mean, in mappero? Jun 15 23:02:17 yes Jun 15 23:09:55 isn't muelli a cereal food? Jun 15 23:10:24 Muesli Jun 15 23:10:24 mmm cereal Jun 15 23:10:37 * SpeedEvil is addicted to porridge ATM. Jun 15 23:10:55 ah, thanks. Jun 15 23:11:04 40g of porridge oats, 100g of milk, 4 dates (pitted) in a small bowl, microwaved for 3 mins. Jun 15 23:11:11 And then more milk on top. Jun 15 23:11:14 Nom. Jun 15 23:11:14 muesli is just un cooked granola I thought Jun 15 23:11:18 Sorry, I use imperial. How many cups is that? Jun 15 23:11:20 Also, really cheap Jun 15 23:11:41 ManoftheSea, depends on the size of the cup :P Jun 15 23:11:43 ManoftheSea: About an ounce and a third of oats. Jun 15 23:12:16 still not a volume measurement... Jun 15 23:12:36 I don't off-hand know the volume. Jun 15 23:12:46 It's alright, I don't hate you because of it. Jun 15 23:12:58 I am currently weighing all my food with: http://www.dealextreme.com/details.dx/sku.17483 Jun 15 23:13:32 (it boots faster than my kitchen scale) Jun 15 23:14:56 GAN900: this is reminding me of you lately http://comicsandoimage.files.wordpress.com/2009/06/crumb-9.jpg Jun 15 23:15:03 and it's accurate to .1g! ;) that's a really good price Jun 15 23:15:08 o/ Jun 15 23:15:15 anyone has exp with NITdroid? Jun 15 23:15:33 asj: it is actually good for consistent spicing. Jun 15 23:16:09 nighty-night all Jun 15 23:16:35 SpeedEvil, Jun 15 23:17:04 Hello ! I m trying to packaging a small qt application with madde.. But mad dpkg-buildpackage return me this error : http://pastebin.com/thrigUhv ! Please help me!! Jun 15 23:17:39 SpeedEvil: but for real accuracy you buy: http://www.dealextreme.com/details.dx/sku.10515 -- heh I wonder how many scales you could buy before they bust down your door and do a drug raid Jun 15 23:18:17 this is my qmake : http://pastebin.com/AnfjZgQE Jun 15 23:18:30 iScale, for the iPad Jun 15 23:18:35 he he he. Jun 15 23:18:48 ice kill for the eye pet? Jun 15 23:18:51 :p Jun 15 23:19:05 and this my file tree : http://pastebin.com/zSmUrpAF Jun 15 23:19:07 DrIDK: is the prefix really supposed to be /usr/LOCAL ? Jun 15 23:19:55 oh, nm it seems to be doing the right thing, I have no clue about madde Jun 15 23:20:18 asj: this tutorial http://wiki.maemo.org/Packaging_a_Qt_application said me /usr/local and this one /usr/http://wiki.maemo.org/MADDE/Packaging Jun 15 23:20:28 HtheB: what? Jun 15 23:20:37 DrIDK: I was refereing to the all caps Jun 15 23:20:57 u know NITdroid? Jun 15 23:21:08 No. Jun 15 23:21:15 Android on Maemo Jun 15 23:21:30 Android on n810 and N900 Jun 15 23:21:32 :p Jun 15 23:21:45 * SpeedEvil sighs at maemo.org Jun 15 23:21:57 * HtheB browses to www.maemo.org Jun 15 23:22:21 HtheB: I know of the project - I do not know of any progress information, or if it is to be releast on wednesday morning at 9;40AM EST. Jun 15 23:22:33 lol Jun 15 23:22:34 no Jun 15 23:22:38 I just couldnt get it to work Jun 15 23:22:38 Oh - it's back up. Jun 15 23:22:44 oddly specific Jun 15 23:22:45 it doesnt work lol Jun 15 23:30:02 SpeedEvil, wrote about the high audio latency problem and a long rant on the maemo ML. let's see what comes out :) Jun 15 23:30:30 * SpeedEvil finds out tomorrow that benno2 has been killed by the pulseaudio ninjas. Jun 15 23:31:06 They have the power of moving in utter silence, with the sound of their actions occurring several seconds later. Jun 15 23:31:20 SpeedEvil, read the comments of this interview and you see that desktop users do hate pulseaudio too : http://www.cio.com.au/article/320807/open_source_identity_pulseaudio_creator_lennart_poettering/ Jun 15 23:32:28 SpeedEvil, on the contrary on any articles about JACK audio server such comments were completely absent. Jun 15 23:32:46 Firefox has its own breakage. Jun 15 23:32:50 https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=147659 Jun 15 23:32:51 Bug 147659: was not found. Jun 15 23:33:09 benno2: To be fair - that could be as the number of distributions installing jack is tiny. Jun 15 23:33:11 Zero? Jun 15 23:33:43 benno2: I don't like Jack, does that count? Jun 15 23:34:39 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8Hg7M8qI5m8 (than pulseaudio) Jun 15 23:36:19 yawn Jun 15 23:36:20 ALSA works fine for me Jun 15 23:36:53 asj, I am agnostic in that sense, the foundation must be solid. jack has been designed by people that know what they are doing. getting real time audio right is tricky. and ATM I am not aware of soundservers that achieve that kind of numbers. if pulseaudio can be fixed to provide that performance out of the box then it's ok. but I'm sceptical. Jun 15 23:39:29 how do you copy text from an email? Jun 15 23:39:50 benno2: my problems with jack come from 2 sources, and I'm not sure PA really addresses these anyways. 1. It requires all input/output to have the same time base. This is ludicrous on modern desktop systems, especially those with usb who could have a multitude of different input sources. 2. From a users point of view trying to tie audio sources/ssinks/what ever they called confuses the hell out of me. I could learn it, but I can't imagin my Jun 15 23:39:50 grandma doing so. Jun 15 23:40:38 SpeedEvil, yes the number of distros using jack by default is small. probably they would need to ship it with wrappers like alsa-to-jack, esd-to-jack etc and provide some sensible defaults. then it would work transparently. for example I use skype with the alsa-to-jack alsa driver. so basically skype which supports only alsa outputs to jack and I can configure the audio parameters in the jack server. my laptop's soundcard driver has a problem under linux, you Jun 15 23:40:39 need to specify 3 audio fragments otherwise you get crackles. skype with alsa uses 2 fragments and audio calls are unusable. thorugh jackd I get perfect audio quality and can use other apps in parallel. I could even record a call by simply connecting skype jack out port to an audio recorder. Jun 15 23:41:10 (3. jackd crashes on me, and apps can't react gracefully to it. this should be almost seamless when audio isn't being mixed and it's not) Jun 15 23:42:17 asj, yes multiple cards can be a problem, so the solution can be to run one jack instance per card but then the user app would need to chose the other jackd server. everything is doable and perhaps some middleware code is needed, but the foundation is solid Jun 15 23:42:52 asj, about jack "crashes" it's a feature to kick out clients that are too slow to react, eg take too much cpu. it can disabled too (which I would do on a phone) Jun 15 23:43:22 I don't say that jack is perfect, but IMHO it provides a solid foundation to build on Jun 15 23:44:16 Can jack pretend to be pulse? Jun 15 23:45:12 no matter what, Nokia should get their things in order and fix the software layer. then developers should just use Qt Multimedia API and let the underlying layers work out the most efficient communication to the audio hw Jun 15 23:45:30 benno2: that's the wrong answer, jack, or it's input methods should resample the audio to a single time base. Ack! well maybe that's why it "cashes" but the client is Ardour and the only thing the system was doing was multitrack recording/mixing. It could use 100% CPU time, and if it did fine. That's an arugment for robustness, it must be robust, fault tolerant to be used on real systems and it's not. Jun 15 23:46:23 It should only mix to a common timebase if the hardware cannot be configured on the in and out to do a common timebase IMO Jun 15 23:46:27 SpeedEvil, one thing you can do is run pulseaudio which works as a jackd client. so consumer audio apps can use the pulse api while demanding audio apps can use jackd directly. this provides the best of both worlds but not sure if running 2 audio servers is a good idea on a phone, battery consumption, memory, cpu usage Jun 15 23:46:50 I keep meaning to do more than I am. Jun 15 23:47:06 I want to find out why the hell pulse uses about the same CPU that mp3 decoding does. Jun 15 23:47:14 SpeedEvil: that's not really the issue, it's multilple sound cards. One has input at say 44105hz (which varies of course) and the other at 44095hz (and it varies too) Jun 15 23:47:29 hmm Jun 15 23:47:31 point Jun 15 23:47:34 what is the process "trackerd"? Jun 15 23:47:46 shorter: It indexes all your files Jun 15 23:47:47 taking nearly 100% cpu Jun 15 23:47:58 oh Jun 15 23:48:10 shorter: It should - ideally - stop in a few mins - unless you've done something odd like put a backup of your laptop into /home Jun 15 23:48:14 It doesn't like that. Jun 15 23:48:15 :) Jun 15 23:48:22 DocScrutinizer Jun 15 23:48:38 You can edit ~/.config/tracker/tracker.cfg - or something - to alter its behaveiour Jun 15 23:48:42 yeah it is down, I would like to have more control over it though Jun 15 23:48:42 asj, time base resampling on multple cards can be done but OTOH it increases latency, this would be needed only if you do things like playing an mp3 on both card simultaneously etc. but in normal cases you can use separate time based. I'm not sure if windows xp/ 7does this. Jun 15 23:48:56 what program owns it? Jun 15 23:49:10 shorter: owns it? Jun 15 23:49:18 uh Jun 15 23:49:22 shorter: It is started as a daemon in x11.post Jun 15 23:49:27 okay Jun 15 23:49:32 can I manage its behavior? Jun 15 23:49:40 you can tell it what not to index. Jun 15 23:49:53 Using the phone as normal - it should - generally - be quite painless. Jun 15 23:50:11 okay Jun 15 23:50:25 benno2: it bites me when I want multiple inputs. A wonderful linux (or any OS) would be say Ardour and 8+ USB mics. Should be trivial to do, but jack can't even do 2 usb mics. Of course I also want monitor input, etc. So the arguemnt is, go buy a mixer. Fine I can mix it all in analog, but...imho that's lame. Jun 15 23:50:27 SpeedEvil, when devs don't do their homework those things do happen (high cpu usage) Jun 15 23:50:30 I guess it is okay, but I think it would be better if it didn't try to index every time the phone boots Jun 15 23:50:37 IF you have wierd filesystems - you may need to tell it not to index stuff Jun 15 23:50:41 shorter: It shouldn't be Jun 15 23:51:09 how does it know when to? Jun 15 23:51:09 benno2: I'm not sure if it's that, or rif it's because of some bogus behaviour. Jun 15 23:51:17 shorter: It's in the config file. Jun 15 23:51:20 Mine is: Jun 15 23:52:56 asj, it would be interesting to know if this works under windows. eg you use cubase to record from 8 usb mixers and everything gets resampled on the fly. cubase uses ASIO and having written ASIO backends (for linuxsampler) , the API do not support using multiple cards at the same time (at least without some major effort), and nowhere is inter-card timebase adjusting mentioned Jun 15 23:53:12 http://www.mauve.plus.com/tracker.cfg Jun 15 23:53:59 As you see - I've told it not to index ~/data/ Jun 15 23:54:01 SpeedEvil: well, mappero seems to work... however, it seems to crash sometimes... Jun 15 23:54:37 asj, I'm sure the devs at the linux-audio-dev mailing list discussed the issue about multiple audio cards, perhaps someone came up with a solution already. but as said, it's not esy to provide both low latency and real time timebase adjusting Jun 15 23:55:24 * GAN900 preordered an iPhone 4G. Jun 15 23:55:30 kW_: DEvs seemed quite responsive when I found a minor bug Jun 15 23:55:38 Nooooooooo! Jun 15 23:55:46 Unless you're going to blend it. Jun 15 23:55:48 Then it's cool. Jun 15 23:56:07 . . . for my mother. *g* Jun 15 23:56:16 pupnik, bizarre. Jun 15 23:56:24 :P Jun 15 23:56:32 no offense Jun 15 23:56:48 I have packaging my application using this tutorial : http://wiki.maemo.org/Packaging_a_Qt_application ! So All is working... exept I cannot access to my application from the main application view Jun 15 23:56:57 I have to run it from terminal Jun 15 23:57:28 benno2: I don't know enough about it, and I'll admit many problems look easy until you get into them, but I don't understand how resampling data at 44khz could add that much latency. I've done slip buffers at 1.5mhz and it adds us latencies so this should be trivial....anyways meeting time. Jun 15 23:57:51 asj: there is apaprantly sometimes required filtering. Jun 15 23:57:54 But - still. Jun 15 23:58:04 mardi: Hello, are you the developer of Mappero? Jun 15 23:58:07 (neglecting the fact that filtering in line with mp3 decoding is near trivial. Jun 15 23:59:23 how od you disable the ssh server from running automatically? Jun 16 00:00:13 uninstallit Jun 16 00:00:24 heh, I wana start it sometimes Jun 16 00:00:24 you have to install a ssh server for it to run at all Jun 16 00:00:43 I'm not aware of a nice way to manually start it Jun 16 00:00:57 asj, since audio cards do work with audio buffers of sizes ranging 5msec up to several 100msec. you have to introduce a bit of latency in order to track the time base difference and resample on the fly. one soundcard could get warm and then the samplefrequency might drift few Hz. you need to write a resampler which adjusts itself on the fly and still providing low latency and droput free operation. Jun 16 00:01:39 DrIDK: got a desktop entry for your app? Jun 16 00:02:31 pupnik: oh yes! let me look Jun 16 00:04:45 re filtering SpeedEvil - yes it would be preferable to do the eq before the conversion to time-domain Jun 16 00:05:47 but how is that best done? by the app (media player) or by removing mp3->pcm conversion from the app and putting it into the sound server Jun 16 00:06:21 It would have to be really in the backend libraries. Jun 16 00:06:50 You'd want gst-* and friends to know of how to do equalisation - which will differ for mp3, aac, ... Jun 16 00:07:08 And of some way for some middleware to tell them what the equalisation should be. Jun 16 00:07:31 And some way to turn on and off hte sound servers eq, if it can't be done Jun 16 00:07:38 makes sense Jun 16 00:07:46 restarting x - bbl Jun 16 00:07:50 wave Jun 16 00:10:13 * benno2 shuts down for a few hours and continues his audio fight tomorrow :) cya Jun 16 00:21:27 free minds, free markets and free software! Jun 16 00:32:20 pupnik: why filter SpeedEvil? Jun 16 00:32:47 ? Jun 16 00:33:13 euh? Jun 16 00:41:25 is pulseaudio using 30% cpu while on phone normal? Jun 16 00:41:58 shorter: yes Jun 16 00:42:12 shorter: It runs all of the voice throught the CPU Jun 16 00:42:35 It has to do this for NSA reasons to run the keyword detection, and uplink any hot-words. Jun 16 00:43:46 http://linuxplumbersconf.org/2009/slides/Jyri-Sarha-audio_miniconf_slides.pdf Jun 16 00:45:14 nice find SpeedEvil Jun 16 00:46:02 * SpeedEvil points at DocWhatever. Jun 16 00:49:12 i kind of enjoyed talking straight to hw:0 and blocking all other system audio while my app was running Jun 16 00:50:16 * SpeedEvil sighs at not downloading stuff when he finds it. Jun 16 00:50:45 https://datatype.helixcommunity.org/Mp3dec - throwing a database error Jun 16 00:55:04 for NSA reasons!? Jun 16 00:55:05 lol Jun 16 00:55:12 you're a funny guy Jun 16 01:04:50 good morning Jun 16 01:20:12 I hope you were joking SpeedEvil Jun 16 01:22:02 yes. he was joking Jun 16 01:22:34 the NSA performs its keyword detection at the routing nodes, where it has complete control of the line Jun 16 01:22:55 easier to deploy updates Jun 16 01:26:20 luckily our secret communications are all cleverly encoded as geek chatter on irc Jun 16 01:35:44 how do you create a group for sms or voice on the n900? Jun 16 01:36:07 I don't want all the kids from school cluttering my contacts Jun 16 01:37:26 no contact groups in nokia Phone/Contact apps Jun 16 01:38:03 Contacts now has a plugin, but I don't know how much that'd help Jun 16 01:39:18 s/plugin/plugin interface/ Jun 16 01:39:18 flailingmonkey meant: Contacts now has a plugin interface, but I don't know how much that'd help Jun 16 01:45:11 multiplayer platform shooter in ascii graphics... http://artax.karlin.mff.cuni.cz/~brain/0verkill/ Jun 16 01:52:23 g'night everyone Jun 16 01:53:34 nige Jun 16 02:12:18 flailingmonkey - which plugin is this you're talking about for contacts and groups? Jun 16 02:37:47 how would you inport contacts from the regular contacts program to GPE Contacts? **** ENDING LOGGING AT Wed Jun 16 02:59:56 2010