**** BEGIN LOGGING AT Sun Aug 08 02:59:57 2010 Aug 08 03:01:04 http://pc-connectivity.garage.maemo.org/ Aug 08 03:02:36 TiagoTiago: as timeless said, by the release dates, that is probably not built for Maemo 5 Aug 08 03:02:50 but it says it's compatible with the N900 :/ Aug 08 03:02:55 TiagoTiago: which app? Aug 08 03:03:17 it says t in that page i linked Aug 08 03:03:28 TiagoTiago: from this list: https://garage.maemo.org/projects/pc-connectivity <= which one are you trying to install? Aug 08 03:03:39 the manager Aug 08 03:04:14 TiagoTiago, how are you attempting to install it Aug 08 03:04:22 did you download the .deb and using command line? Aug 08 03:04:28 clicking ont he deb and opening with app manager Aug 08 03:05:00 from here: https://garage.maemo.org/frs/?group_id=801&release_id=2648 Aug 08 03:05:11 so does fmms not send over wifi or something? Aug 08 03:05:14 the 0.6.2.armel one Aug 08 03:06:00 did you add extras-devel as it says to do in instructions? Aug 08 03:06:17 i didn't saw that part Aug 08 03:06:35 hm Aug 08 03:06:40 :) Aug 08 03:06:42 http://pc-connectivity.garage.maemo.org/2nd_edition/index.html Aug 08 03:06:45 havoc seems like a good choice Aug 08 03:06:49 give it a try Aug 08 03:07:18 * lcuk tries for a third time to sleep Aug 08 03:07:20 gnite \o Aug 08 03:07:40 good luck Aug 08 03:08:01 WELL. seems like setting it to havok did the trick :) Aug 08 03:08:24 nice to see fmms is working. wonder how long it will be before one can send video Aug 08 03:11:26 fmms will send video. Aug 08 03:11:38 25 mmss/second can be expensive though. Aug 08 03:12:18 what is havoc? Aug 08 03:15:44 it is one of the connection modes of fmms Aug 08 03:16:28 oh Aug 08 03:25:56 since the touchscreen is capable of pressure sensing, woudl it be possible to have soft press to hover the mouse and hard press for clicking? Aug 08 03:26:59 TiagoTiago: yes, probably Aug 08 03:27:05 TiagoTiago: might need to hack the code up a bit Aug 08 03:27:20 pressure sensitivity is a bit problematic Aug 08 03:27:25 why? Aug 08 03:27:57 becasue it's not completely reliable Aug 08 03:28:07 how so? Aug 08 03:38:48 what makes it not completly realiable? Aug 08 03:40:00 the hardware output is jittery Aug 08 03:40:44 A friend of mine is using a PNG with a transparent background for a Skype avatar, and the N900's contact shortcut is rendering the background black. Aug 08 03:40:47 the physical principles that are used to sense pressure are a bit odd for that purpose Aug 08 03:41:08 Is that something fixable, or do I have to go file a bug and hope Nokia does something? Aug 08 03:41:43 it's not sensing pressure but a mix of contact area and contact resistance Aug 08 03:42:53 jaem: what does tell you the transparency isn't working and just showing a black background? Aug 08 03:43:22 SpeedEvil: haha Aug 08 03:43:37 http://thenokiablog.com/2010/07/08/meego-phone-video/ Aug 08 03:44:21 DocScrutinizer: er... I couldn't parse the first bit of that Aug 08 03:44:28 DocScrutinizer: Oh, wait. Aug 08 03:44:46 maybe it's just working, but your background is black Aug 08 03:45:28 DocScrutinizer: The default "blue-faced-dummy" avatar has working transparency, so I guess it should work, then. Aug 08 03:45:42 maybe you have to switch on the light inside N900, to see something thru the transparent parts :-P Aug 08 03:45:56 Ha Aug 08 03:46:44 on a more serious note, the question what is your actual background isn't easy to decide Aug 08 03:47:13 How so? Aug 08 03:47:30 are arm cpus just more expensive in bulk than intel cpus? Aug 08 03:47:41 i'm just curious as to why nokia is swapping over to the intel stuff Aug 08 03:48:03 Macer: wtf? Aug 08 03:48:18 wtf Aug 08 03:48:21 ? Aug 08 03:48:49 it's not jsut detecting the change in measure resistivity? Aug 08 03:48:52 if nokia is looking at meego then i would assume it will be swapping over to an intel mobile atom ? Aug 08 03:49:14 looking at meego? Aug 08 03:49:16 Macer: Nokia created MeeGo Aug 08 03:49:28 er. nokia + intel Aug 08 03:49:29 which supports ARM Aug 08 03:49:34 maemo+moblin=meego Aug 08 03:49:57 AFAIK, MeeGo's creation is purely for marketting purposes Aug 08 03:50:14 yeah, we wanted another chance to get marketting wrong Aug 08 03:50:15 nokia is not working on the arm version Aug 08 03:50:18 they left that to the community Aug 08 03:50:28 and are focusing on the aava build based on the intel cpu Aug 08 03:50:41 and left the n900 side to fend for itself :) Aug 08 03:50:56 jaem: what you see on screen is the result of multiple layers of elements, each with it's own notion of background Aug 08 03:51:00 I would imagine if there's any reason to switch to Intel, it's because they're faster. Aug 08 03:51:18 * timeless ponders Aug 08 03:51:22 macer: um Aug 08 03:51:24 and to boost the development of pocket-sized RTGs to power them? Aug 08 03:51:26 ther's not *one* background - or THE background Aug 08 03:51:33 i'm pretty sure nokia is paying for people to work on meego for th en900 Aug 08 03:51:37 not as a shipping product Aug 08 03:51:41 but still to do it Aug 08 03:51:48 wouldn't that conut as 'working' on arm? Aug 08 03:51:53 timeless: no Aug 08 03:52:04 most of the team which made the n900 is currently working on harmattan Aug 08 03:52:06 official support for n900 is not there Aug 08 03:52:20 which i suspect is arm based Aug 08 03:52:32 it will also sport some sort of confusing meego branding Aug 08 03:52:36 :) Aug 08 03:52:43 Macer: ARM Support != N900 Support. Aug 08 03:52:47 which means the entire team is "working on meego and arm" Aug 08 03:53:28 * DocScrutinizer shakes head, puzzled Aug 08 03:53:54 afaik nokia is going to swap over to intel cpus tho for its smartphones isn't it? Aug 08 03:54:09 no Aug 08 03:54:14 Aug 08 03:54:22 macer: please stop fishing Aug 08 03:54:24 it's annoying Aug 08 03:54:25 and rude Aug 08 03:54:37 * luke-jr peers Aug 08 03:54:41 timeless didn't deny it Aug 08 03:54:43 there's not much of a line between fishing and trolling Aug 08 03:54:58 luke: i deny knowing the future Aug 08 03:55:01 fishing for what? i'm curious if that is the case. Aug 08 03:55:09 i deny trusting anyone who claims to know the future Aug 08 03:55:18 that especially includes anyone who works for nokia Aug 08 03:55:24 Macer: you're stating random nonsense fo rfacts here Aug 08 03:55:28 they have a sign in the cafeteria predicting the future Aug 08 03:55:36 timeless: O_o Aug 08 03:55:39 the sign also predicts they're wrong Aug 08 03:55:42 lol Aug 08 03:55:43 Also: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Trolling_(fishing) ? Aug 08 03:55:44 should i trust them? Aug 08 03:55:47 http://www.techeye.net/mobile/nokia-to-use-intel-chips Aug 08 03:56:22 jaem :) Aug 08 03:56:25 so speculative gossip Aug 08 03:56:30 with no factual basis Aug 08 03:56:50 the channel is for technical help Aug 08 03:56:56 and community buildingi Aug 08 03:57:00 s/gi/g/ Aug 08 03:57:02 timeless meant: and community building Aug 08 03:57:10 asking questions about the future does neither Aug 08 03:57:37 I don't care if it's ARM or Intel, but IMO someone should make a chip that can run off solar power :P Aug 08 03:57:53 luke-jr: Possibly a silicon solar cell? Aug 08 03:57:56 personally i'm annoyed that maemo doesn't run on TRS-80s Aug 08 03:58:01 it's a crimeB! Aug 08 03:58:05 and, to be honest, I doubt you were even able to tell the difference between arm and intel, when looking at the sourcecode Aug 08 03:58:15 timeless: I know! Also my watch can't run it. ;) Aug 08 03:58:21 so where's the big story? Aug 08 03:58:35 jaem: hrm, i don't even have a watch! Aug 08 03:58:40 nokia should give away those for free! Aug 08 03:58:47 plus sources for the entire hardware stack Aug 08 03:58:51 lifetime support! Aug 08 03:58:54 timeless: heh. I still need to poke at mine. Aug 08 03:59:01 oh, and a car remote Aug 08 03:59:05 oh, and a car! Aug 08 03:59:15 so i can run maemo or meego on it Aug 08 03:59:25 hrm, and pay for a driver's license... Aug 08 03:59:26 It has sources for the hardware (including crypto coprocessor), but the wireless protocol stack(s?) are proprietary. Aug 08 03:59:42 are/is? Aug 08 03:59:48 timeless: sorry? Aug 08 03:59:52 oh Aug 08 03:59:54 oh... yes Aug 08 03:59:59 you weren't sure how many stack(s) Aug 08 04:00:20 timeless: BlueRobin is proprietary, but I can't remember if TI's stack is or not. Aug 08 04:00:22 Nokia should launch a wrist-videophone running maemo/meego Aug 08 04:00:34 Also there are rumblings of potential support for 6LoWPAN Aug 08 04:00:37 http://bits.blogs.nytimes.com/2010/02/15/intel-and-nokia-team-up-on-mobile-software/ Aug 08 04:00:45 NokTel :) heh Aug 08 04:01:17 or at least the full opensource Symbian Aug 08 04:01:23 macer: we already ship an intel device iirc Aug 08 04:01:27 it runs Windows 7 Aug 08 04:01:48 mhm Aug 08 04:01:51 it's the Nokia Booklet 3G Aug 08 04:01:53 timeless: i just thought the name was funny in the nytimes article. i could see that happening. but who would buy whom? Aug 08 04:02:02 timeless: yeah i saw that a while back Aug 08 04:02:06 you could buy a dozen and support my employer Aug 08 04:02:17 i was honestly expecting it to be arm based Aug 08 04:02:40 but it seemed to be just a typical netbook Aug 08 04:02:52 and you cant even add more ram Aug 08 04:02:53 so what? Aug 08 04:03:16 win7 on ARM? where to get ANY software for that? Aug 08 04:03:21 jaska: iirc it didn't even support the nokia internal system requirements Aug 08 04:03:31 Macer: Out of curiousity, what sort of beneficial atypicality were you expecting from an ARM-base netbook? Aug 08 04:04:00 * DocScrutinizer wanders off, shaking head Aug 08 04:04:01 jaem: lower power consumption.. but i guess intel managed to squeeze down the atom Aug 08 04:04:11 http://www.xbitlabs.com/news/other/display/20090603123741_Microsoft_Windows_7_Will_Not_Support_ARM_Microprocessors.html Aug 08 04:05:04 i was expecting nokia to release some 3G modem having beast of an arm netbook running some sort of linux based OS which is high quality Aug 08 04:05:08 http://bsnotebook.wordpress.com/2008/01/22/how-do-you-know-when-politicians-are-lying/ Aug 08 04:05:14 like what the touchbook was supposed to be ;) Aug 08 04:05:37 nokia is reminding me of when apple ditched the ppc cpu Aug 08 04:06:42 are you too young to remember 68ks? :) Aug 08 04:07:11 well.. i'm 31. but i still think that was a bit before my time Aug 08 04:07:20 to me, 68ks are Amiga Aug 08 04:07:22 :p Aug 08 04:07:40 luke-jr: get a G5 and run morphOS Aug 08 04:07:46 before your time? im -2 years and i remember 6510 :) Aug 08 04:08:17 Macer: no Aug 08 04:08:21 :) i had a sega genesis Aug 08 04:08:26 if that counts Aug 08 04:08:30 I had Atari Aug 08 04:08:34 so f u Aug 08 04:08:35 :p Aug 08 04:08:42 colecovision ftw :-P Aug 08 04:08:43 I had a 2600 too Aug 08 04:08:52 i'm younger than you and remember them Aug 08 04:09:04 heh. when i was young i went outside instead ;) Aug 08 04:09:26 though perhaps because of money issues i might have had older game consoles than the average people of my age Aug 08 04:09:59 although at one point i did have a vic20 Aug 08 04:11:14 right now luke-jr is probably researching morphOS and realizing how awesome it is haha Aug 08 04:12:04 http://farm1.static.flickr.com/104/299623915_0b69f3023e_o.png Aug 08 04:12:41 i'm still waiting on a hurd based OS :) Aug 08 04:13:13 jaska: I remember the 6502, but that's only because the technical institute I attended for a year used them for ASM classes for some reason. Aug 08 04:13:28 Macer: http://www.archhurd.org/ ? Aug 08 04:13:45 :D Aug 08 04:14:00 jaem: wow. have you tried that? Aug 08 04:15:12 Macer: No. I doubt my video card would have proper driver support. Aug 08 04:15:21 :) Aug 08 04:15:32 I could slap it in a VM, but honestly, I don't care enough about the kernel to bother. Aug 08 04:16:08 i don't know. i think it would be nice to run something good that is non-linux. then again. opensolaris is pretty awesome. Aug 08 04:17:01 there is a hurd debian? Aug 08 04:17:07 whoa. have to check that out :) Aug 08 04:17:20 macer: does this seem on topic? Aug 08 04:17:57 timeless: sorry about bringing that up Aug 08 04:18:40 timeless: could be some day ;) considering openness is part of the nokia PR objective Aug 08 04:19:03 Macer: This just in! Nokia switches to OpenSPARC/FPGA-based phones! Aug 08 04:19:05 -snerk- Aug 08 04:19:16 fwiw, the hurd page on debian.org is out of date Aug 08 04:19:32 it claims the only official debian platform is linux, but that's wrong, http://lwn.net/Articles/266712/ Aug 08 04:19:38 jaem: haha. if any phone ever used a sparc i'd buy stock in the company that did it :) Aug 08 04:21:29 Macer: I was referencing this, for what it's worth => http://geekz.co.uk/lovesraymond/archive/taking-freedom-further Aug 08 04:21:34 *cough* back on-topic *cough* Aug 08 04:22:34 hahahha Aug 08 04:24:45 jaem: it would be interesting if someone actually did release a "fully open" phone Aug 08 04:25:03 Macer: it would be, but the cost would likely be prohibitive. Aug 08 04:25:23 Also, it would be likely to be of the guts-on-a-dev-board variety. Aug 08 04:25:25 i wouldn't think the cost... but more so the production vs profit wouldn't be worth it Aug 08 04:25:54 jaem: well. once the chinese get a hold of something like that it completely loses its value :) Aug 08 04:26:05 and it would also have to have everything that was ever made from scratch and opened Aug 08 04:26:19 greed prevents such a device :) Aug 08 04:26:42 but it is a nice dream Aug 08 04:29:22 hardware gpl is a dream :) Aug 08 04:33:03 Macer: Point of Interest: some of the big DIY groups are drafting an official Open Hardware Definition Aug 08 04:33:09 I'll dig up the link - one sec Aug 08 04:34:19 jaem: heh. either way it goes... for something like a phone you will always end up using something that will be closed by someone else unless someone is just that good where they can make a complete open platform that can be fabricated Aug 08 04:35:00 don't get me wrong. i would LOVE to see something like that come into existance but realistically.. most of the "open" handsets are closed and the "openness" is just good marketing :) Aug 08 04:35:46 Macer: To a point, yes. However, I'd still take "mostly-open" over the predominent status-quo. Aug 08 04:36:33 * Mr_Nobu huggles pronto <3 Aug 08 04:36:49 i dunno. i always wondered what would happen to the n900 if nokia just threw it out there wide open one day Aug 08 04:37:05 Do I know you? Aug 08 04:37:15 Macer: hmm... that is an interesting thought. Aug 08 04:37:33 i mean everything a dev could ever want completely opened without ip restrictions :) it would sell for $10,000 a phone haha Aug 08 04:37:53 Macer: ...and then no FOSS dev could afford it. :P Aug 08 04:38:10 jaem: haha. they'd already have one ;) Aug 08 04:38:44 but it would be extremely cool to see something like that come into the market.. but honestly it would never happen Aug 08 04:39:21 one day nokia posts everything ever needed to do anything on an n900... sounds like a good sci fi movie :) Aug 08 04:39:37 those jokes about built in light sabres might actually come true heh Aug 08 04:42:16 pronto: only fags ban Aug 08 04:42:18 pronto loves a big black cock up his rusty bullet hole Aug 08 04:42:45 On a different note... My friend and myself have noticed our phones being stupid slow lately, when running very little - sharply contrasting what it could handle when I first got mine (shortly before launch day). Aug 08 04:43:11 omfg pronto you really are a faggot haha Aug 08 04:43:13 Before I go wade through stupidly-long forum threads, has anyone actually found anything wrong in that regard with PR 1.2, or am I just imagining it? Aug 08 04:46:29 jaem: i can't say i've had aproblem with 1.2 Aug 08 04:46:41 The Maemo SDK virtual image doesn't seem to have Scratchbox in it. :-/ Hmm. Aug 08 04:47:14 spinningcompass: where did you get the image from? Aug 08 04:47:24 jaem: http://tablets-dev.nokia.com/maemo-dev-env-downloads.php Aug 08 04:47:59 spinningcompass: What made you think it isn't included? Aug 08 04:48:41 jaem: I ran 'find / | grep scratchbox', followed by 'find / | find sbox', followed by 'find / | grep sb2'. Nothing, except for a file in /etc/init.d that would activate scratchbox if it were present. Aug 08 04:49:57 Macer: Hmm... I don't know what's causing it, but basic operations on my phone take much longer now (with a fresh flash) - especially windowing operations. When I first got the phone (release FW), I'd regularly have >5 browser windows and a bunch of other apps open, with no issue. Lately my phone starts crawling when I run less than I did then. Aug 08 04:50:09 there's one imagine which is a dud Aug 08 04:50:19 but you can install scratchbox :) Aug 08 04:50:47 * RST38h moos Aug 08 04:50:50 jaem: you still shouldn't try to have >3 browser windows open Aug 08 04:50:54 mourning. Aug 08 04:50:56 it's still a bad idea Aug 08 04:50:57 Macer: no, I was watching Law and Order Aug 08 04:51:03 already know what MorphOS is Aug 08 04:51:06 rst38h: who died? Aug 08 04:51:15 haha Aug 08 04:51:42 jaem: weird. i honestly haven't noticed much of a problem. i was acutally happy that fmms came out of dev Aug 08 04:51:58 Macer: I didn't initially, either. Aug 08 04:52:02 Macer: open N900 would involve the FCC Aug 08 04:52:54 luke-jr: he. well. i could understand keeping the part of the radio locked out that would allow you totally screw a phone company over Aug 08 04:53:04 so maybe 99.99% would be good enough :) Aug 08 04:53:19 They my friend, who I had obtained a loaner phone for, commented that his (admittedly quite powerful) ~5 year old PDA seemed snappier. I haven't been having problems to the extent he has, but it certainly is being slow at times. I was curious if X or the Window Manager was having issues, as most of the issues seem to occur with delays in windowing events. Aug 08 04:53:26 but i can see some asshole using an open radio to do something a little nuts Aug 08 04:53:44 can the back peice of the N900 be purchased by itself? Aug 08 04:54:08 ds3: doubtful Aug 08 04:54:09 timeless: the russian contestant in sauna championship Aug 08 04:54:20 Macer: you can already get open radios Aug 08 04:54:21 frals: yeah, that was odd Aug 08 04:54:26 it made bbc wn Aug 08 04:54:42 Macer: only a couple $k to get the radio needed to make your own GSM tower Aug 08 04:54:43 http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2010/08/07/world-sauna-championships_n_674582.html Aug 08 04:54:55 Macer: soon to be sub-$1000 Aug 08 04:55:03 ds3: I think one of the companies that makes unofficial replacement batteries has an expanded back cover, if you're really desperate. Aug 08 04:55:04 luke-jr: how much is the fcc lic for it? Aug 08 04:55:04 :) Aug 08 04:55:12 Macer: License? What license? :P Aug 08 04:55:15 Macer: irrelevant, obviously, we're talking about illegal activity Aug 08 04:55:35 it's illegal to make your own tower? Aug 08 04:55:50 Karmic desktop image claims to contain the Diablo toolchain etc.... but the Intrepid image made the same claim. I'll see. Aug 08 04:56:03 it's illegal to broadcast on unlicensed spectrum Aug 08 04:56:06 spinningcompass: Unless they've rebuild the Intrepid image, I can vouch for it. Aug 08 04:56:14 luke-jr: like i said then. :) how much would the lic be? Aug 08 04:56:16 I have no idea about the Karmic image, as I didn't know one existed. Aug 08 04:56:22 Macer: highest bidder AFAIK Aug 08 04:56:27 jaem: I am looking for spare parts so I can get one to drill and modify Aug 08 04:56:28 I suppose I can't just dist-upgrade to it? Aug 08 04:56:31 luke-jr: so millions Aug 08 04:56:34 ds3: Oh? What for? Aug 08 04:56:45 Macer: open modem != license to use it however Aug 08 04:56:48 jaem: I want a way to attach a compass Aug 08 04:56:49 ds3: If you were looking for a spare N810 backplate, I could help you. :P Aug 08 04:57:07 cpu not fast enough on the 810 Aug 08 04:57:12 velcro Aug 08 04:57:37 I need it to not move around the compass can be more accurate Aug 08 04:58:01 glue Aug 08 04:58:05 ds3: wouldn't the metal in the n810 throw the compass off? Aug 08 04:58:27 hoping to calibrate it out Aug 08 04:58:48 Macer: ds3 is using an N900 anyway. Aug 08 04:58:53 don't you need a pretty solid chuck of metal to affect a compass? Aug 08 04:59:27 oh Aug 08 04:59:43 Proteous: my rifle used to throw it off Aug 08 04:59:57 but i guess that might qualify as a "pretty solid chunk of metal" Aug 08 05:00:19 heh, I'm not sure how much you need Aug 08 05:00:48 and now our font of compass knolledge just left the channel Aug 08 05:01:03 s/knolledge/knowledge/ Aug 08 05:01:04 Proteous meant: and now our font of compass knowledge just left the channel Aug 08 05:01:04 do you have a tonal compass⁇ Aug 08 05:01:34 is that a compass that uses sound Aug 08 05:02:30 no Aug 08 05:02:34 haha Aug 08 05:03:17 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Hexadecimal_compass_by_Nystrom.jpg Aug 08 05:09:18 … Aug 08 05:12:45 luke-jr: haha Aug 08 05:12:51 nystrom made a hell of a calculator too ;) Aug 08 05:12:56 yeah Aug 08 05:13:02 dunno if it used tonal or not tho Aug 08 05:14:46 don't know Aug 08 05:14:56 one of those guys that was way ahead of his time :) Aug 08 05:15:14 Macer: yeah, too bad he didn't live in 7 :p Aug 08 05:15:21 at least /I/ would help him Aug 08 05:15:23 does not take much to divide circle in 16 segments Aug 08 05:15:29 RST38h: exactly Aug 08 05:16:06 now, septadecimal compass would be a feat... Aug 08 05:16:17 RST38h: why? that would be difficult to use Aug 08 05:16:41 Macer: want to try out my tonal-extended Luxi Mono or Console fonts? :D Aug 08 05:18:59 luke-jr: will the font teach me how to play music? Aug 08 05:19:58 Macer: no, just give you 5 new symbols for music Aug 08 05:26:02 I have never managed to successfully get a route plotted on OVI maps. Apparently one must select "View Route", but I cannot find a button or menu option with that label. DOes anyone know how I can view a route? Aug 08 05:26:51 ah, the builder is dead for he second day Aug 08 05:27:29 Ken-Young: you must search first Aug 08 05:27:52 luke-jr, I did, and my destination is plotted as a blue circle. Aug 08 05:28:01 But no route is plotted. Aug 08 05:28:42 now tap the destination label at the top Aug 08 05:28:53 it will return to the Get Directions dialog with a View Route button Aug 08 05:29:10 ...and maemo.org package management UI is one huge clusterfuck =( Aug 08 05:29:13 luke-jr, THanks! That did it. Aug 08 05:29:17 ☺ Aug 08 05:30:26 is there a way to remove al the limits (other than the hardware safety limits) fromt he raios on the N900, ignoring rullings by the FCC etc (like for example if you are going to live in a boat in the middle of onowhere where obeying EM emissions law is a not necessary) Aug 08 05:30:53 tiagotiago: you can install any software you like Aug 08 05:30:57 you can write your own os and load it Aug 08 05:31:04 lol Aug 08 05:31:50 does it ineed any changes in the kernel itself or is it somthing like editing a text file changing a number to a bigger number or somthing? Aug 08 05:35:09 timeless: pfft, that's not accurate Aug 08 05:35:30 timeless: Nokia refuses to release the specs required to even begin writing your own complete OS for these devices Aug 08 05:36:01 not to mention requiring a signed bootloader Aug 08 05:36:34 ppfft Aug 08 05:36:39 it's possible Aug 08 05:36:45 i didn't say it made sense or would be easy Aug 08 05:36:51 just about as possible as making your own device from scratch Aug 08 05:37:29 8/8/10 5:36:13 AM[0x0-0x2fb2fb].com.apple.installerThe domain/default pair of (com.apple.iPhoneSDKInstaller, showAdvancedInstaller) does not exist Aug 08 05:37:29 8/8/10 5:36:13 AMdefaults[74905] Aug 08 05:37:31 The domain/default pair of (com.apple.iPhoneSDKInstaller, showAdvancedInstaller) does not exist Aug 08 05:37:34 oops, wrong window Aug 08 05:41:40 luke-jr: we can go on a black ops mission into nokia hq and steal the stuff needed to truly open the n900 Aug 08 05:41:43 you down? Aug 08 05:42:12 Macer: … Aug 08 05:42:28 how about you steal it, and I make sense of it? Aug 08 05:43:07 and whatever other clauses I need to put in there to avoid being tried as part of your conspiracy Aug 08 05:43:41 haha Aug 08 05:43:51 we can host it using a tor server Aug 08 05:53:51 morn Aug 08 05:54:12 Early morn! Aug 08 05:54:13 moo Sts Aug 08 05:54:28 luke-jr: u-boot thing looked interesting? Aug 08 05:54:36 Stskeeps: sure Aug 08 05:55:19 Stskeeps: but it's 7::3 and time for bed! Aug 08 05:55:25 luke-jr: fair enough Aug 08 05:58:10 Looks like the n900 world is sleeping.... Aug 08 05:58:20 oh? Aug 08 06:04:07 luke-jr: what's with the chars in the time you wrote there? Aug 08 06:04:13 tonal crap probably Aug 08 06:04:47 why not use 0123456789abcdef for hex representation like everyone else? Aug 08 06:09:29 Hehe: http://cryptome.org/dirty-work/spot-spook.htm Aug 08 06:22:52 ` Aug 08 06:27:37 More fun: http://blogs.alternet.org/oleoleolson/2010/08/05/massive-censorship-of-digg-uncovered/ Aug 08 06:30:52 Almost a parallel universe, of sorts... Aug 08 06:38:11 http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20100804/ap_on_he_me/us_teens_drown_louisiana Aug 08 06:40:42 wait, they all didn't knew how to swim? Aug 08 06:41:58 That is Darwin at work. Aug 08 06:42:48 Uncle Chuck has been collecting record harvests lately Aug 08 06:42:49 THe amazing thing is that the parents, who could not swim, sent their kids, who could not swim, into the river to drown tryinh to save another kid. Aug 08 06:43:52 That poo bystander either got bored of the drama or rightly concluded that more lemmings will follow, unless the original one is back to the shore... Aug 08 06:43:59 s/poo/poor Aug 08 06:44:04 perhaps it should be made a law that children need to be taught how to swim, at least at a basic level, enough to not drown when they can't touch the bottom Aug 08 06:44:38 No, let Darwin handle it. THere's no shortage of people. Aug 08 06:44:40 Yes, right, another law. And make violating it punishable by drowning. Aug 08 06:44:47 lol Aug 08 06:45:21 jacekowski: you might be interested in http://pastebin.com/wnMTX0tya Aug 08 06:46:12 regarding that digg censorship thing, is there a way to ignore votes by certain members? Aug 08 06:46:48 no, why? Aug 08 06:47:06 jacekowski: http://pastebin.com/wnMTX0ty , i mean Aug 08 06:47:09 that way people can overcome the effect of those people gaming the system Aug 08 06:47:40 jacekowski: I don't know the details, but sounds like evolution in progress =) Aug 08 06:47:42 people gaming the system all the time, left and right Aug 08 06:48:33 They could've tried for example throwing in something that floats. Aug 08 06:48:34 so, it probably makes sense to simply avoid the sites where what you see can be so easily affected by tweakers Aug 08 06:49:35 (and yes, that includes Amazon book reviews ;)) Aug 08 06:56:42 perhaps they could do somthing like analyze which article syou vote up and which you vote down and put more weight to votes of people that agree with you Aug 08 06:57:18 yes, this sounds more like what Google is doing Aug 08 06:57:38 But all you will get as result is a bunch of clusters consisting of the similar-minded people Aug 08 06:58:27 I.e. your technology will prove what sociologists already know: people are tribal, they will always approve of their chums and spew bile at members of the other tribes Aug 08 06:59:58 isn't it gonna be "subjective", the cloud of dots changing from each user's point of view? Aug 08 07:01:37 right Aug 08 07:01:55 will depend on each user's dot of a view :) Aug 08 07:01:57 if enough people you haven't disagreed with vote up on somthing you will see it together with what a smaller amount of people you've agreed with on several ocasions has voted up, so it isn't gonna cut out the mass Aug 08 07:02:57 Stskeeps: well, there is no m-shield in qemu Aug 08 07:03:00 and with the votes of people you've disagreed with having less weight, you will gradually breed your personal crowd Aug 08 07:03:26 Stskeeps: but the thing is that it looke like only 1st stage bootloader is signed Aug 08 07:03:31 but without locking yoruself out from the rest of the world Aug 08 07:03:32 Stskeeps: 2nd stage bootloader isn't Aug 08 07:18:37 jacekowski: at that point in boot process kernel is in control i'd believe Aug 08 07:30:07 Would it be easy to have the touchscreen work like a laptop touchpad, with draging jsut moving the mouse cursor and taping working for clicking? Aug 08 07:30:18 and tap-draging for draging Aug 08 07:30:26 done already Aug 08 07:30:29 speak to VDVsx Aug 08 07:30:58 is there a tutorial on how to get it like that? Aug 08 07:31:21 there is a tool for that, it is in extras Aug 08 07:31:33 WHAT IS IT CALLED? Aug 08 07:31:40 oops, sorry, bumped on capslock and didn't noticed Aug 08 07:32:36 http://wiki.maemo.org/Bluemaemo Aug 08 07:32:53 no, i mean for controling the cursor on the device itself Aug 08 07:33:19 CaPs LoCk - CRUISE CONTROL FOR COOL Aug 08 07:38:52 any thing like that? Aug 08 07:42:26 I seem to remember that EasyDebian and other generic-linux-desktop-on-Maemo packages simulate mouse like that Aug 08 07:43:10 Based on my experience with FBreader, it will be pretty inaccurate though, due to jitter Aug 08 07:43:51 it seems to work like a touch screen with the mouse cursor showing, not like a touchpad Aug 08 07:45:36 hm, wait Aug 08 07:46:03 perhaps it's half one and half the other, clicking and hovering might be like a touchpad, but the cursor coordinates are absolute, not relative Aug 08 07:47:13 Whatever you come up with, do try coding and running your great idea on a real N900 Aug 08 07:47:26 You will soon find out how wrong you have been ;) Aug 08 07:48:14 ? Aug 08 07:50:22 Lots of positional noise, as far out as 40-50 pixels. Aug 08 07:50:39 The pressure reading can be disregarded, it is never correct. Aug 08 07:50:58 Lots of up/down jitter too Aug 08 07:51:24 when showing the cursor in absolute mode it seems reasonably stable Aug 08 07:51:39 specially when using the stylus Aug 08 07:52:01 Yes, stylus is a bit better. FIngernails too. Aug 08 07:52:24 But even there you won;t get the same nice positional data as from a mouse. Aug 08 07:52:48 Anyways, it makes no sense discussing this topic until you have actually tried working with the touchscreen events. Aug 08 07:52:53 which is why i'm looking for a touchpad relative motion mode Aug 08 07:52:57 well, even crappy mice will have huge amounts of jitter Aug 08 07:53:08 plus, smoothing algorithms have made it a lot easier to manager Aug 08 07:53:38 I won't say the N900 will be used for manipulating a robot doing brain-surgery any time soon, but you can't just discard it for being "inaccurate" Aug 08 07:54:06 isntead of mapping 1-1 you could set sensitivity and have the whole 800x480 map to a motion of just a few dozen pixels Aug 08 07:54:30 yes, BlueMaemo does that, if I understand correctly Aug 08 07:54:50 but i'm looking for somthing to control the mouse ont he N900 itself Aug 08 07:54:58 TiagoTiago: well, that really depends on what you're trying to achieve, but I would recommend having an N900 to play with next to you Aug 08 07:56:25 TiagoTiago: theorising about would could and shan't be done is very nice and cool, but in the end, you'll just be running around in circles Aug 08 07:56:30 go get a device, and be done with it Aug 08 07:56:43 i'm confused, or you are Aug 08 07:57:11 I just woke up, so I'm definitely the culprit Aug 08 07:57:16 I thought you didn't have one? Aug 08 07:58:00 I have one Aug 08 07:58:07 ah, my bad then Aug 08 07:58:32 I'm looking for a way to have the touchscreen work like a touchpad, for the N900 itself, not another machine via bluetooth Aug 08 08:01:54 DocScrutinizer: email address? Aug 08 08:02:28 hmm Aug 08 08:02:35 ffmpeg in repos got h263 disabled :< Aug 08 08:03:37 ok, mouse control in easy deb works like a touch screen, not an absolute touchpad Aug 08 08:08:54 anyone got DocScrutinizer's email address? Aug 08 08:17:30 anybody who has nitdroid knows whether it has sip support? Aug 08 09:01:46 is there a way to have some sort of "karma" indicator for developers and individual programs be incorporated into the default app manager? Aug 08 09:06:04 TiagoTiago: the app manager's source code is open AFAIK Aug 08 09:06:13 TiagoTiago: feel free to create a proposal Aug 08 09:06:58 TiagoTiago: submit an enhancement request and get a 'unlikely to be implemented' response Aug 08 09:07:28 you can always do it yourself, but as the HAM is part of the firmware it's always tricky business Aug 08 09:07:46 what does HAM stands for? Aug 08 09:07:53 not spam Aug 08 09:08:00 lol Aug 08 09:08:03 or, in maemo, Hildon Application Manager Aug 08 09:08:11 oh Aug 08 09:09:23 Just to put requests in proportion, we requested adding a themes/wallpapers section in HAM, and even that is not a straight run Aug 08 09:09:26 it would be nice if the HAM had some sort of plugin architecture so you could modify it's behavior, add funcitonality etc without having to mess witht he firmware itself Aug 08 09:09:35 it would Aug 08 09:10:16 but the HAM is basically deprecated in it's current form, Harmattan will use something completely different Aug 08 09:10:40 I just hope they calculate in repositories that have thousands of packages, because HAM is not too good at those Aug 08 09:15:38 Morning, all Aug 08 09:15:47 morning Aug 08 09:16:13 achipa: How's kisstester going? Aug 08 09:16:45 achipa: Sometimes I think we should fork the whole HAM and tell Nokia to go f itself Aug 08 09:17:03 morning Aug 08 09:17:19 morning Jaffa Aug 08 09:17:23 Jaffa: well I have a sort-of working version in gitorious, you can (almost) try that Aug 08 09:18:03 the onyl thing that's missing functionally is the actual voting, I didn't want to experiment with that without consulting Bergie/Niels Aug 08 09:19:22 as in, they do some midgard favourite trick there and I'm unsure where to get the URL from Aug 08 09:19:40 lcuk: I just found your new vehicle to bring the kids to school Aug 08 09:19:45 Jaffa, you might be interested too Aug 08 09:19:46 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KQ2iNOmPI-0 Aug 08 09:19:48 the REST part is completely useless, it takes 10 minutes until I fetch everything I need Aug 08 09:20:04 so I reverted to scraping, that 'only' takes about 30 sec Aug 08 09:20:10 :( Aug 08 09:21:55 achipa: yeah, it's a shame that the servers are so slow on different kinds of requests Aug 08 09:22:11 achipa: midgard doesn't seem to be something which encourages fast queries (see, for example, bug 11040). One of the problems with document-oriented DBs Aug 08 09:22:17 crashanddie: Nice Aug 08 09:22:33 https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=11040 - Profile list pages get slower and slower to render Aug 08 09:22:45 Jaffa: any news on that one? Aug 08 09:22:50 crashanddie: Nope Aug 08 09:23:40 crashanddie: you need to be really brave to drive something that boxy with serious speeds (brave to drive = US English for foolish) Aug 08 09:24:11 Jaffa: the question is if there is a way to cache it or something Aug 08 09:24:39 Jaffa: even if it's a 10 minute delay, it would still be better that having to wait a minute for the data to load Aug 08 09:30:25 off to lunch Aug 08 09:34:34 is the log bot down? Aug 08 09:41:23 do you now of a program to program raw signal for the TV out (like how it was done on the earliest videogames) ? Aug 08 09:51:34 tiagotiago, it isn't really feasible if you don't have a real-time operating system. earliest videogames didn't have an operating system at all, so it wasn't an issue.. Aug 08 09:52:14 (and no modern hardware gives you that kind of access anyway) Aug 08 09:52:17 perhaps you could emulate the signal processor and just out put the resulting image? Aug 08 09:53:37 umgh Aug 08 09:53:59 output* Aug 08 09:56:01 hi to all, can i ask a question and explain a problem ? Aug 08 09:56:20 not as good as being able to design the signal itself directly though Aug 08 09:56:31 mello: i would expect the answer to be "yes" Aug 08 09:57:08 ok , so here is the problem Aug 08 09:57:39 my n900 is unable to access gsm network ..only 3g works Aug 08 09:57:48 i live in italy Aug 08 09:58:06 is it set to dual mode? Aug 08 09:58:25 in dual mode it go to to 3g net Aug 08 09:58:27 The usb port bork problem, is that fixable? Aug 08 09:58:41 (somehow my female port disappeared) Aug 08 09:58:47 its probably the GSM band used in Italy is not compatible with the available bands on n900 Aug 08 09:58:48 mello: and 2G only doesn't work at all? Aug 08 09:59:00 if i force it in gsm ...nothing appen and the sim icon go transparent (dissappear) Aug 08 09:59:05 try setting it to GSM only mode and see if it find anything Aug 08 09:59:08 oh Aug 08 09:59:12 hm Aug 08 09:59:24 FIQ, probably on one of the male ports, this was an issue with pre-releases of n900 afaik Aug 08 09:59:24 i thought the N900 had all the GSM bands in the world Aug 08 09:59:30 TiagoTiago: me too. Aug 08 09:59:44 could the problem be that is product code is not italy but ireland ? Aug 08 10:00:00 Well, the charger port (dunno what you call it) get out and it's just a hole there Aug 08 10:00:02 mello: the N900 should work all across the world. Aug 08 10:00:04 FIQ: there is a forum thread on talk.maemo.org about that Aug 08 10:00:11 no it doesn't.. there's news saying that it doesn't work with Telstra Next-G here which uses GSM band 900MHz I heard Aug 08 10:00:40 well, we use 900MHz here in Sweden and it works fine here. Aug 08 10:00:49 900Mhz is used for GSM all across europe afaik Aug 08 10:00:52 Please link me if you want, surfing on a P1i is really slow Aug 08 10:00:56 perhaps the simcard is 3G only? Aug 08 10:01:07 swedemike: it doesn't Aug 08 10:01:17 no in my old phone worked in gsm Aug 08 10:01:19 some networks don't do GSM :) Aug 08 10:01:22 yeah, does the simcard work in another phone for 2G, that's definitely a thing to test. Aug 08 10:01:26 or probably different protocol used Aug 08 10:01:45 sim card is from my old phone that was only gsm Aug 08 10:01:50 and worked fine Aug 08 10:02:33 which old phone? and which model? Aug 08 10:02:35 the only "strange" thing i think is the different product code ...could be the source of problems ? Aug 08 10:02:46 nokia n6230 Aug 08 10:02:55 well, so far I've been to Thailand, Singapore, Indonesia, Finland, Sweden, Denmark, Austria with my N900 and it worked just fine with both 2G and 3G as far as I can tell. Aug 08 10:02:58 FIQ: the plug breaking off issue was common on pre-release models and a few people also had it happening with store purchased ones, is it still in warranty for you? Aug 08 10:04:05 i know for sure that n900 work in italy with both 3g and gsm Aug 08 10:04:21 this is one of the threads about the topic: http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=37107&highlight=usb+plug+issues ; there are probably other ones Aug 08 10:04:42 oops Aug 08 10:04:46 http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=37107 Aug 08 10:04:49 fwiw, "3G" is both ambiguous and stupid Aug 08 10:04:55 no need to highlight the stuff Aug 08 10:05:01 especially in the context of GSM Aug 08 10:05:05 if i search manually for a 2g net ..it find it but when i try to connect gives me message "no access" Aug 08 10:05:17 when you're talking baout 3G, you mean "a 3G GSM network" Aug 08 10:05:26 whoops looks like the stupid next-G is on 850MHz band Aug 08 10:05:29 there are non GSM 3G networks Aug 08 10:05:35 but your phone won't work on those Aug 08 10:05:51 your 3G network *is* GSM Aug 08 10:06:17 Thank, tiagotiago Aug 08 10:08:28 another strange thing is that even if product code is ireland ..software installed is the global one (and not the specif for uk/ireland) Aug 08 10:08:57 could this be the problem ? Aug 08 10:12:43 someone could tell me if a difference between product code (region) and installed software version disable the access to gsm network ? Aug 08 10:13:58 achipa_afk: Gitorious link, btw? Aug 08 10:20:24 timeless: GSM is GSM, and it's 2G (or perhaps 2.5G). UMTS is 3GPP 3G, and I'd say that most of the world 2G and 3G is GSMA/UMTS, and it's perfectly valid to use them as such. Aug 08 10:21:14 what about WCDMA? Aug 08 10:21:22 tiagotiago++ Aug 08 10:21:52 3G/3.5G/4G are generation markers Aug 08 10:22:09 they do not specify the technology Aug 08 10:22:17 but when you say Aug 08 10:22:39 since the N900 doesn't support anything apart from the GSMA/3GPP stuff, I don't see your objection as valid. Aug 08 10:22:45 it's all a matter of context. Aug 08 10:22:47 hm, according to Wikipedia, W-CDMA is also known as UMTS-FDD Aug 08 10:23:07 https://secure.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/wiki/WCDMA Aug 08 10:23:23 the N900 will display 2G for GSM, 2.5G for GSM with EDGE, 3G for UMTS, and 3.5G for HSPA Aug 08 10:23:35 and I think this is perfectly valid to talk about in this context. Aug 08 10:24:06 and trying to besserwisser people into not using that will only cause confusion. Aug 08 10:24:20 hmm Aug 08 10:24:30 yes, it might not be perfectly valid in all parts of the world, but in the context of N900 talk it's perfectly valid. Aug 08 10:24:39 /dev/mtd5 shouldn't affect the N900's NOLO right? Aug 08 10:24:49 the conversation included a worldwide context somewhere Aug 08 10:25:06 is the N900 capable of measuring signal intensity/quality for more than one cell tower at once? Aug 08 10:25:22 shouldn't charging be handled by the kernel? Aug 08 10:25:28 timeless: that was me, stating I had travveled and it working in several parts of the world which run things that the N900 supports. Aug 08 10:25:39 TiagoTiago: yes, but no. Aug 08 10:25:44 how so? Aug 08 10:25:48 TiagoTiago/Stskeeps: fwiw, the n900 is missing a GSM-3G in the US Aug 08 10:25:51 TiagoTiago: the hardware is quite capable of it. Aug 08 10:25:54 the 3G band used by AT&T Aug 08 10:26:01 TiagoTiago: The software in the modem does not allow this. Aug 08 10:26:12 err, s/Stskeeps/SwedeMike/ Aug 08 10:26:35 MohammadAG: the kernel is GPL or something Aug 08 10:26:46 timeless: yes? Aug 08 10:26:46 is this somthign witht he firmware or a program might be able to bypass the limitation? Aug 08 10:26:47 if you want to keep the code non GPL, then sticking it in the kernel is a bad idea Aug 08 10:27:16 swedemike: one of you wondered about the n900 covering all GSM bands worldwide, just noting that it doesn't Aug 08 10:27:16 Jaffa: errr... http://gitorious.org/kisstester ? Aug 08 10:27:16 timeless, low level charging should be handled by the kernel Aug 08 10:27:23 achipa_afk: Ta Aug 08 10:27:23 bme doesn't run with the device off afaik Aug 08 10:27:24 * timeless shrugs Aug 08 10:27:37 the kernel doesn't run w/ the device off Aug 08 10:27:52 there is also an 450MHz band. Aug 08 10:27:59 hmm, true Aug 08 10:28:06 but afaik, bme doesn't handle charging at first Aug 08 10:28:23 could be the bq27xx chip Aug 08 10:29:08 is the code for the modem closed or is there hope for multiple tower stuff to be implemented? Aug 08 10:29:11 achipa_afk: Is it supposed to build yet, or is it a "run it directly" job atm? Aug 08 10:29:17 TiagoTiago, closed Aug 08 10:29:23 :( Aug 08 10:29:47 you could beg nokia to open it :P Aug 08 10:29:56 Can anyone with the power kernel installed pastebin me find /sys -name "*current*" Aug 08 10:30:11 sec Aug 08 10:30:38 ok, more than a sec :/ Aug 08 10:30:42 actually its probably renesas you have to ask now Aug 08 10:31:09 nokia sold off/moved their modem division to renesas Aug 08 10:31:33 heh Aug 08 10:31:41 TiagoTiago: Nokia cannot open the firmware and sell it legally in many markets. Aug 08 10:31:51 why not? Aug 08 10:31:52 (also, good luck with regulatory bodies) Aug 08 10:32:12 TiagoTiago: In the UK, once it's first used in a criminal act - they have to fix it, or be guilty of mobile phone hacking tool providing offences. Aug 08 10:32:32 lol Aug 08 10:33:04 aren't government regulations grand? Aug 08 10:33:11 In this case - yes. Aug 08 10:33:20 "mobile phone hacking tool" sounds like the somthing i wanna buy Aug 08 10:34:00 If I get to pick between regulation, and someone putting out a tool that lets every 12yo with a phone wipe out calls in a 15km radius, I pick regulation. Aug 08 10:34:05 achipa_afk: Yay, got it running. Doesn't have a mode (yet) for showing all apps which I've got installed with versions which aren't yet in Extras? Aug 08 10:34:25 what if they only make the code avaiable via a server in some country where it isn't an issue, and have the page ask "are you legally allowed to read the contents of this page?" before showing the stuff ? Aug 08 10:34:43 Jaffa: that would be the "recently installed", it is not quite appropriately named Aug 08 10:34:49 might be buggy, granted Aug 08 10:34:54 tiagotiago: unlikely to help Aug 08 10:35:00 they do business in the UK Aug 08 10:35:11 :( Aug 08 10:35:11 it's like giving out a hand gun in one country Aug 08 10:35:20 that sucks Aug 08 10:35:28 and being liable for the use of the hand gun in a certain country Aug 08 10:35:44 are thee any efforts going on for making a open source alternative? Aug 08 10:35:47 you should read about Crypto Muntions Aug 08 10:35:55 s/Mun/Muni/ Aug 08 10:35:55 timeless meant: you should read about Crypto Munitions Aug 08 10:35:57 TiagoTiago: The code is signed. Aug 08 10:36:09 what does that mean? Aug 08 10:36:11 TiagoTiago: So you have to forge the signature, which is nontrivial Aug 08 10:36:23 who checks the signature? Aug 08 10:36:27 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Export_of_cryptography_in_the_United_States Aug 08 10:36:37 yay Aug 08 10:36:40 kernel panic on the N900 Aug 08 10:36:42 the flasher pair on the device side Aug 08 10:36:46 TiagoTiago: Something inside the modem before it accepts the new firmware Aug 08 10:36:49 Nokia would be importing not exporting it, they are from Finland :) Aug 08 10:36:50 AIUI Aug 08 10:37:23 <_trine> is neopwn a big scam Aug 08 10:37:25 basically you'd need to find a way to exploit the validator in the mode Aug 08 10:37:31 or steal a certificate Aug 08 10:37:35 is the sig checker in the modem crackable? Aug 08 10:37:42 we hope not! Aug 08 10:37:44 hmm Aug 08 10:37:44 crap Aug 08 10:37:45 Sending and flashing rootfs image (173568 kB)... Aug 08 10:37:45 0% (1024 of 173568 kB, 3644 kB/s) Aug 08 10:37:45 Write failed after 1048576 bytes Aug 08 10:37:45 usb_bulk_write: Resource temporarily unavailable Aug 08 10:37:50 why not? Aug 08 10:37:52 TiagoTiago: Possibly. Probably not. Aug 08 10:37:59 anybody used an A-data sdhc card? i am looking for some recommendations for sdhc Aug 08 10:38:02 well, because we're nokia Aug 08 10:38:08 would like to use it for nitdroid Aug 08 10:38:23 achipa_afk: Ah, OK - then I'm using less software which needs voting than I thought! :-) Aug 08 10:38:23 ah, i see Aug 08 10:38:27 and it'd be bad if our device was brickable in a bad way Aug 08 10:38:45 achipa_afk: Heh, just spotted a character encoding/UTF-8 bug. I love those :-) Aug 08 10:38:46 Hmm, lesson to everyone here, never dd /dev/mtd5 Aug 08 10:38:50 And worse if the device was usable for advanced hacking/freaking. Aug 08 10:39:04 officially Nokia can' be for the possibility of people gettign their own modem firmwares running 'cause that would look bad 'cause of that mobile hacking tool law thingyt Aug 08 10:39:07 (of the phone nets) Aug 08 10:39:25 TiagoTiago: It can also disrupt emergency calls. Aug 08 10:39:36 achipa_afk: Looks very promising. Aug 08 10:39:43 TiagoTiago: This can actually lead to people getting killed. Aug 08 10:39:46 I want a phreak machine *pouts* Aug 08 10:39:52 achipa_afk: Happy to do some hacking on it too, btw Aug 08 10:39:55 tiagotiago: get a gun and shoot it Aug 08 10:40:01 that'll freak it out Aug 08 10:40:06 lol Aug 08 10:40:15 note: the above is not official advice Aug 08 10:40:20 sure Aug 08 10:40:22 timeless: i have setup a freeswitch server for testing against Bug 10388. Have given the details to Mikhail (Nokia) and Olivier (Collabora). Hope they make use of it. Aug 08 10:40:22 ... you are not expected to actually act on it Aug 08 10:40:23 Bug https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=10388 Choppy audio in SIP conversation, WLAN power save problem? Aug 08 10:40:25 /disclaimer! Aug 08 10:40:34 trumee :) Aug 08 10:40:44 wasn't necessary, at least when dealing with me Aug 08 10:40:57 tiagotiago: this channel is logged Aug 08 10:40:58 timeless: if only these guys came onto irc, sigh! Aug 08 10:41:08 and i really don't want people to claim i gave out advice like that :( Aug 08 10:41:28 are people really that sue hapy? Aug 08 10:41:37 achipa_afk: s/Recently installed/Software you're using that you haven't voted on yet: you leecher!/? Aug 08 10:41:37 i really don't want to find out :) Aug 08 10:41:49 they could get the log and clip the non interesting parts out Aug 08 10:42:19 does pastebin works on the default browser of the N900? Aug 08 10:42:35 TiagoTiago: Many sites work, some that you don't expect. Aug 08 10:42:37 i'm pretty sure i've used pastebin.mozilla.org from it Aug 08 10:42:46 why would pastebin not work? Aug 08 10:43:05 i'm trying to load the page to post somthign there and it isn't showing the stuff Aug 08 10:43:31 which pastebin? Aug 08 10:43:36 .com Aug 08 10:45:01 the other day i read about this guy that figured out how to trick mobiles into conecting to his own mini tower and he was able to spy on calls, i think it was on defcon Aug 08 10:45:18 yep Aug 08 10:45:33 he set up a tower on a frequency not used/regulated in the USA Aug 08 10:45:42 gave it a name to match something they were configured to look for Aug 08 10:45:52 and ran it w/ a "i don't support encryption" marker Aug 08 10:45:53 to avoid law enforcement issues Aug 08 10:46:08 some phones said "oh hi there, can i make a call?" Aug 08 10:46:11 it said "sure" Aug 08 10:46:18 more or less Aug 08 10:46:29 it was in the unregulated ham radio band or somthing Aug 08 10:46:34 yep Aug 08 10:47:19 it's interesting the unregulated band could be used to hack into people's cell conections Aug 08 10:47:19 * trumee is embarrased to ask timeless if he could check nokia internal bug (int-171987) to see whether there is any update. Aug 08 10:48:50 last reference is to https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=10388#c16 Aug 08 10:48:51 Bug 10388: Choppy audio in SIP conversation, WLAN power save problem? Aug 08 10:49:27 timeless: thanks :) Aug 08 10:51:35 * MohammadAG wonders if a 5V USB cable is enough to power the backup menu on the N900 Aug 08 10:52:49 trumee: in other words: the public bug has more current/better info Aug 08 10:53:03 i think you guys have more or less managed to get the engineers into the public. congrats :) Aug 08 10:53:30 http://pastebin.com keeps loading and loading and doesn't work :( Aug 08 10:54:09 ime pastebin.com sucks Aug 08 10:54:25 ehich one do you recomend? Aug 08 10:54:44 which* Aug 08 10:55:36 i tend to use pastebin.mozilla.org Aug 08 10:55:52 but you could try pastebin.ca or paste.lisp.org or .. Aug 08 10:56:09 anyway, are you talking about the initial page or the submit result page? Aug 08 10:56:38 not getting any different result from either Aug 08 10:56:50 hrm Aug 08 10:57:00 i just used pastebin.com from one of my n900s Aug 08 10:57:09 it's working for you? Aug 08 10:57:22 http://pastebin.com/tBpGZ03H Aug 08 10:57:52 that's from pr1.2 Aug 08 10:58:33 ~typing triggers urlbar; enable javascript; stop other web apps: no Aug 08 11:03:27 have you seen that proposal for the 9 screens 2D swiping home screens? Aug 08 11:04:52 pastebin.com keeps loading and doesn't show the contents :( Aug 08 11:11:54 who was asking for find /sys -name "*current*" on power kernel? http://pastebin.com/dCk1m1xf Aug 08 11:12:27 the channel topic points ot irc logs Aug 08 11:13:25 wasn't it SpeedEvil ? Aug 08 11:13:46 ok, i checked the log, it was Aug 08 11:13:51 is he still around? Aug 08 11:13:54 SpeedEvil! Aug 08 11:13:55 yes Aug 08 11:13:57 oh - yes Aug 08 11:14:00 thanks Aug 08 11:14:36 sorry about the delay, couldn't get pastebin to work on the device itself Aug 08 11:14:42 np Aug 08 11:15:06 TiagoTiago, ssh ftw Aug 08 11:15:09 TiagoTiago: hmm. Is there a bq27x00_battery module that you can modprobe? Aug 08 11:15:18 nvm if ou can't easily find out Aug 08 11:15:28 SpeedEvil, afaik there is Aug 08 11:15:54 yes - I'm just trying to work out the sysnode for the current it reports Aug 08 11:16:05 actually i copied it from the terminal and sent the contents in an email to myself and then copied it on my desktop and pasted on the site Aug 08 11:16:28 seems it wasn't the fastest way to do it Aug 08 11:16:35 Wow, created my first merge request. Aug 08 11:17:04 :) Aug 08 11:17:13 :) Aug 08 11:17:18 There is also 'pastebinit' Aug 08 11:17:23 though I never got that to work Aug 08 11:17:29 SpeedEvil, "And you will have a directory /sys/class/power_supply/bq27200-0 containing files: capacity, current_now, temp, voltage_now. Aug 08 11:17:29 " Aug 08 11:17:42 ah - thanks Aug 08 11:17:54 and afiak, kernel-power uses that Aug 08 11:17:58 (Matan's patch) Aug 08 11:18:13 it may not be modprobed by default though Aug 08 11:18:23 yep Aug 08 11:19:27 hm, borked my N900 - again Aug 08 11:19:49 I wonder if i should make myself a t-shirt with a big QR code with the text "Hahah! Made you look!" Aug 08 11:20:06 TiagoTiago: naah. Aug 08 11:20:18 A QRcode to a website with just an image of the QRcode Aug 08 11:20:43 perhaps a link to Rick Astley's infamous video on youtube? Aug 08 11:26:56 Okaay. Searching HAM for power. I get 'power kernel updater' and 'power kernel (obsolete please remove this package) Aug 08 11:27:17 is the kernel updater the package I'm looking for? Aug 08 11:27:31 kernel-power-flasher Aug 08 11:27:39 apt-get install that Aug 08 11:27:55 I suppose I need to pull fcam first Aug 08 11:29:50 achipa: I've submitted a (one-line) patch to kisstester BTW Aug 08 11:30:06 Jaffa: already merged :) though your git setup is is not yet complete (you show up as "user" in the logs) Aug 08 11:30:52 achipa: That's cos I committed it on the N900 and hadn't set it up as you say Aug 08 11:31:00 git should stop you doing that Aug 08 11:31:22 Jaffa: no biggie, just saying in case you were not aware :) Aug 08 11:32:04 I'll go and fix the vote dialog now (it worked but I decided to change it to a mainwindow so we have stacked windows and pushed without realizing that change is only halfway through) Aug 08 11:32:05 achipa: Fixed for future Aug 08 11:32:36 Is this a package in testing as yet? Aug 08 11:32:54 SpeedEvil: it's so not in testing it's not even in devel yet :) Aug 08 11:33:02 I meant devel Aug 08 11:33:09 And suspected so Aug 08 11:33:29 I want it to have at least minimum functionality before going to devel Aug 08 11:33:38 fair enough. Aug 08 11:33:39 as in that you CAN actually vote Aug 08 11:33:55 :) Aug 08 11:34:24 achipa: Suggest renaming "Recently installed" to "Awaiting votes" Aug 08 11:34:25 also, is there a way to obtain .install files from maemo.org ? Aug 08 11:34:36 I mean for extras-testing stuff ? Aug 08 11:34:42 Jaffa: agreed Aug 08 11:34:48 achipa: I think so, but easier to just generate on the fly? Aug 08 11:34:54 Maybe an initial testing version that can only vote on a test package? Aug 08 11:35:09 SpeedEvil: good idea Aug 08 11:35:42 SpeedEvil: if you're interested you can get it from gitourius Aug 08 11:35:55 I don't have a toolchain setup on my laptop. Aug 08 11:35:58 SpeedEvil: (for now)... no need to compile, just run Aug 08 11:36:14 you just need pyqt on the N900 and you're good to go Aug 08 11:36:30 ah - right Aug 08 11:36:36 that's the beauty of python :) Aug 08 11:36:40 there is a thread on talk.maemo.org with a link to get the fcam stuff that is comptible with the powerkernel Aug 08 11:36:52 recompiled fcam-drivers Aug 08 11:36:56 http://wiki.maemo.org/N900_Software_Power_management#Powerscript - a simple script to show wake events. Aug 08 11:37:16 And current battery usage. Aug 08 11:37:43 I'm getting it working with power-kernels battery module too, and then moving on to fixing the rest of the page. Aug 08 11:38:51 Jaffa: note that the progress bar is flaky - don't bother fixing it, I'm doing it completely wrong, just added it so you don't wait half a minute wondering what's going on Aug 08 11:39:56 Jaffa, SpeedEvil : and of course, comments, patches, merge requests welcome :) Aug 08 11:41:00 achipa, Jaffa (morning!) is kisstester in the repos already? or are you guys hacking from source atm until its stable/comfortable? Aug 08 11:41:18 lcuk: morning (err) ! the latter Aug 08 11:42:01 lcuk: no pushing to extras-devel until we're sure people don't get burned Aug 08 11:42:05 cool, make sure it can vote on itself when its time! Aug 08 11:42:22 lcuk: heh, it will do that automatically ! (kidding) Aug 08 11:42:29 :p Aug 08 11:42:51 seems we need an addiotnal repo, somthing like extra-experimental for things even the developers themselves don't feel confortable with Aug 08 11:43:19 TiagoTiago: long ago, in a distant land, there was an idea... and it was called PPA :D Aug 08 11:43:31 what does that stands for? Aug 08 11:43:34 achipa, ++ Aug 08 11:44:12 TiagoTiago: personal/private package archive, as popularized by Ubuntu launchpad Aug 08 11:44:44 hm Aug 08 11:45:02 TiagoTiago, small package repositories from single developers - if you want to track the code and apps a single person/group have been making before they are in official repos you use them Aug 08 11:45:11 exceedingly good idea Aug 08 11:45:24 * timeless shrugs Aug 08 11:45:27 * timeless has one for maemo5 Aug 08 11:45:34 yes you do timeless Aug 08 11:45:35 i was thinking more about somthing that is centralized like the other extra, but with an additional level of there be dragons Aug 08 11:45:39 but we're beyond that point - OBS will probably change everything anyway Aug 08 11:45:43 but not everyone has hosting/skills to manage it Aug 08 11:45:57 TiagoTiago: the point is that one dragon is enough at a time, you don't want to unleash all of them simultaneously Aug 08 11:46:08 lol Aug 08 11:46:37 i see someone else watched "how to train your dragon" Aug 08 11:46:42 it would be the place for devs to post unstable, WIP etc code, things that are expected to not be usable etc Aug 08 11:46:58 * lcuk actually read that line in thick viking/scottish accent Aug 08 11:47:17 lcuk: heh, I just saw the trailer... intend to watch is someday tho :) Aug 08 11:47:23 its fun Aug 08 11:48:06 it's :( Aug 08 11:48:36 TiagoTiago: yes, that's pretty much the concept behind launchpad with extra stuff like built-in bugtracking, roadmaps and all :) Aug 08 11:49:01 but would it be just another extra-* repo? Aug 08 11:49:28 TiagoTiago: with a single repo, the problem is interdependent projects Aug 08 11:49:42 TiagoTiago, it would be a choise to say "ahhh I like achipa's apps and branches and want to have them installed" Aug 08 11:49:47 choice Aug 08 11:49:54 * lcuk goes for coffee and bacon Aug 08 11:50:07 that is diferent from a very experimental unstable etc repo Aug 08 11:50:20 not really Aug 08 11:50:31 achipas stuff is unstable :P Aug 08 11:50:41 lol Aug 08 11:50:43 lcuk: pfft :D Aug 08 11:51:06 TiagoTiago, having everything in one repo makes it hard to differentiate Aug 08 11:51:12 lcuk: unstable is the wrong word. It would have to work in some way in order to be unstable, right ? :P Aug 08 11:51:15 just because I want to track some new cool app Aug 08 11:51:20 differentiate what? Aug 08 11:51:24 does not mean I want to update all the instable ones Aug 08 11:51:36 nor manage which I update on an app by app level Aug 08 11:51:43 u Aug 08 11:51:48 TiagoTiago: I want always the latest mplayer, but not ukeyboard Aug 08 11:51:59 TiagoTiago: and I don't want always to upgrade one by one - as lcuk says Aug 08 11:52:03 i think we are talking about two different concepts Aug 08 11:52:25 TiagoTiago: yes, but the PPA is far more often what people are after Aug 08 11:52:41 TiagoTiago, if ppa were implemented, -devel would revert to being as you say Aug 08 11:52:42 (the experimental repo means something else, even in Debian) Aug 08 11:53:15 what does it mena? Aug 08 11:55:45 TiagoTiago: experimental is (almost) literally just a dump, there is little to no requirement to fullfill dependencies, and it is not a full repo (i.e. you don't always go through it to get to unstable) Aug 08 11:56:22 Hi Aug 08 11:58:00 hm Aug 08 11:58:46 heççp Aug 08 11:59:01 hello* Aug 08 11:59:27 * achipa goes off to fix the vote dialog (finally) Aug 08 12:05:27 hmhm, is n900 requesting usb chargers to be smarts? (I tried using a car charger/usb-adapter and it didn't charge) Aug 08 12:05:56 morning wazd \o Aug 08 12:06:06 d+/d- shorted Aug 08 12:06:34 lcuk: greetings from Mordor :D Aug 08 12:06:45 hello all :) Aug 08 12:06:46 ghaha Aug 08 12:07:30 Sauron's kingdom looks pathetic next to Moscow :D Aug 08 12:10:38 can someone help out with skype viedo call? Aug 08 12:11:13 i dont see an option to do a video call, only "skype call" Aug 08 12:12:18 ShadowJK: so that means “smart”? :) Aug 08 12:12:35 not really Aug 08 12:12:36 ShadowJK: I mean, random usb-adapter won't work Aug 08 12:12:50 it's how dumb chargers should identify themselves as dumb charger Aug 08 12:13:15 try rebooting Aug 08 12:14:03 somtimes it shows somtimes it doesn't, if someone enables their video durign the call (or call you with their video already enabled) the phone app will show the option of you starting your own video during the call Aug 08 12:14:19 I had car chargers, one with standard female A connector, the other with miniB male Aug 08 12:14:22 i haven't figured out yet what makes the option in the contact only show somtimes Aug 08 12:14:37 anyway, i'll go lay down for a bit, cya Aug 08 12:14:47 +2 Aug 08 12:14:57 TiagoTiago: thanx Aug 08 12:15:27 good luck :) Aug 08 12:15:28 TiagoTiago: i saw a similiar hint on talk.maemo.org Aug 08 12:15:54 now i deinstalled my pidgin protocols, hehe Aug 08 12:16:05 anyway, cya Aug 08 12:16:08 cya Aug 08 12:18:15 Okaay - that's bad - install powerkernel, and vi segfaulted. Aug 08 12:18:35 I thought it came with non-overclocked settings. Aug 08 12:29:08 Corsac: I just started looking at this discussion. Having trouble charging the n900 with car USB charger? I know why. Is that the problem, or should I go back and review earlier records of this discussion? Aug 08 12:29:27 Oh, ShadowJK already has it under control. :) Aug 08 12:30:00 that was his problem Aug 08 12:30:38 Agree that it's dumb that you need to short D+ and D- to charge the N900. The whole thing would have been solved by a single 100k (say) resistor, which would have cost Nokia, what, $0.25 to install? duhhh... Aug 08 12:31:24 Anyway, I plan to buy a short USB extension cable and solder D+ and D- so I don't have to solder either my car chargers or my Nokia USB cable. Aug 08 12:33:10 Ideally it would be a small USB adapter that plugs into USB type A plug and accepts also a USB type A plug, but since that adapter would be absolutely useless before I solder the D+/D-, no one would sell such a thing. I guess the USB extension cable would be the next closest thing. Aug 08 12:34:39 kwtm: basically yeah, I had problem with usb car chargers Aug 08 12:35:16 Corsac: Just to be clear: it's solved now, right? Or, at least, you know how to solve it? Or should I tell you the answer? Aug 08 12:35:29 lbt's OBS plan contains PPAs. And that's for Fremantle, Harmattan and MeeGo Aug 08 12:36:26 kwtm: no - the hardware can charge without d+ and d- shorted - it's a software/USB certification thing. Aug 08 12:36:56 kwtm: well, I know the theory (putting a 100k resistor between D+ and D-), now I'm not sure how to do that (since I don't have any resistor, soldering iron or whatever at hand :) Aug 08 12:37:12 SpeedEvil: can't we hack the n900 so it sucks as much power as it can? Aug 08 12:37:13 kwtm: uh it's not a hardware requirement to have resistor/short there, it's a policy/standards thing Aug 08 12:37:49 kerio: it's a several line script. Aug 08 12:38:02 oh noes Aug 08 12:38:03 voltage only and unconnected D could be a PC, and if you pull full power from that you could disable/kill the usb port Aug 08 12:38:05 :P Aug 08 12:38:33 oops, talling ontop of SpeedEvil Aug 08 12:38:34 is a full bme replacement in the works then? Aug 08 12:38:35 anyone knows where I can get the sources of the tuxracer and gltron ports to n900 by mikkov? Aug 08 12:38:41 kerio: yes Aug 08 12:38:48 is it ready? Aug 08 12:39:02 ShadowJK: I know it's not a hardware requirement. But it would be SOOoooo easy to do! Just in case, you know, Nokia doesn't have any software engineers capable of making the N900 charge even without a data connection. Aug 08 12:39:05 not really Aug 08 12:39:28 hmm, sounds like there's a big fire in the area -- just saw a couple dozen firetrucks fly by with sirens and all Aug 08 12:39:34 kwtm, I can make it charge without data connection Aug 08 12:39:46 ... or a product manager who thinks, "Gee, I wonder if I should allow our customers to use car chargers to charge the N900?" Aug 08 12:39:49 No - it needs more work. Donations of hot thai live-in workers to help me with the housework would increase my output on hacking stuff. Aug 08 12:40:07 kwtm: erhm... you don't need data connection for charging Aug 08 12:40:07 kwtm: modern car chargers implement the charger spec Aug 08 12:40:20 where modern is perhaps 2 years designed Aug 08 12:40:24 kwtm, I have a car charger that complies with USB Charging spec. It works fine with n900 out of thw box Aug 08 12:40:29 SpeedEvil: huh, are you sure that won't *hinder* the development? Aug 08 12:40:40 kerio: yes. Aug 08 12:41:29 SpeedEvil: is "hacking" a euphemism, then? Aug 08 12:41:51 hacker? i hardly know 'er! Aug 08 12:41:57 this promises to be amusing Aug 08 12:42:01 ShadowJK: Weren't you the one who sent me the script to allow the N900 to ignore the floating D+/D- inputs? But the casual N900 user shouldn't need to find and run this software in order to use a car charger. Aug 08 12:42:18 and they don't Aug 08 12:42:22 just use a proper charger Aug 08 12:42:26 the casual n900 user should buy a good car charger Aug 08 12:42:35 kwtm, a car charger should be properly designed in the first place Aug 08 12:42:36 the fucking cheap bastard Aug 08 12:42:39 and not wire the USB cable directly to the battery Aug 08 12:42:59 crashanddie: But it charges _really_ fast like that Aug 08 12:43:01 (also, the n900 has no end users) Aug 08 12:43:15 SpeedEvil: oh yeah, it even goes faster than the car :D Aug 08 12:43:21 Well, I'm just thinking of the case where I am travelling with the N900 and for some reason lose my charger. Then I go buy a charger locally. That charger may or may not implement the proper spec. Aug 08 12:43:48 kwtm: again, products don't try to tackle every exceptional worst case scenario Aug 08 12:43:51 So, perhaps my needs/expectations of the N900 are different: I want it to be portable and adaptable so I don't need to bring a whole bunch of peripherals. Aug 08 12:44:04 kwtm: if you lose your charger, though. Use a USB cable and your laptop or buy a proper charger Aug 08 12:44:09 tbh I have to admit I just bought a car charger in a mobile store Aug 08 12:44:20 I'd claim chargers that don't implement usb charging spec are defective :P Aug 08 12:44:42 so yeah it's not a nokia-certified one, but I assumed it would be a conforming one Aug 08 12:44:43 This was based on my experience with my Treo650: I was stuck without a charger overseas, so I hit about a dozen electronics stores trying to get a charger for the non-standard port/non-standard battery, with no luck. Aug 08 12:44:59 kwtm: I built my own USB-hub-hacked-USB-periperhal-charger that is mounted on my motorbike, so it can't be that hard Aug 08 12:45:21 I thought, "Boy, if I had a N900, I would be able to just buy a standard microUSB cable and charge it from anywhere!" But I guess such is not the case. Aug 08 12:45:41 kwtm: I'm about to stop you from trolling Aug 08 12:45:53 crashanddie: You're kidding, right? "I was able to do it, so it can't be that hard." I am able to do it, too, but not if I'm travelling and don't have a soldering iron ready. Aug 08 12:45:54 Problem is it's hard to find standards compliant charger ;p Aug 08 12:46:20 Who's trolling? I think it's valid to expect that the N900 is a portable device to be used when travelling, when one might not have all the resources available from home. Aug 08 12:46:33 ShadowJK: Agreed. So I think the easiest way to get around this is to Aug 08 12:46:46 create a USB cable/adapter with D+/D- shorted. Aug 08 12:47:09 It does mean that you have to carry it around when travelling, so it would be equivalent to Aug 08 12:47:13 Buy a shitload of chargers repeatedly and return the ones that don't work, eventually manufacturers stop making crap ;p Aug 08 12:47:49 I'm starting to get really tired of all the whining kids going "OMG, I paid 500 bucks and it doesn't cover the exact specific use case of mine, LOOOOOOSSER" Aug 08 12:48:30 yeah my car cost 9000 and I can't use the cheap heating oil in it Aug 08 12:48:31 not even diesel! Aug 08 12:48:35 needing a special adapter (just like the Treo does have a USB adapter available for $25 ... which I couldn't get on short notice while travelling overseasl) Aug 08 12:48:49 I have to use something called petrol Aug 08 12:48:56 ShadowJK: omg, sucks Aug 08 12:49:07 ShadowJK: return the car! Go whine on #manufacturer! Aug 08 12:49:57 ShadowJK: like, what if you happen to be in the middle of africa, and they don't have this proprietary petrol you talk of which your car uses, like, HOW CAN THEY BELIEVE THE CAR IS USABLE IN SUCH CONDITION??? Aug 08 12:51:00 and also they're mixing ethanol or something at manplaces now, and it's hard to tell in advance what you're going to get :/ Aug 08 12:51:25 I don't like the E10 petrol though Aug 08 12:51:29 (on a more serious note) Aug 08 12:51:47 Apparently it's corrosive with specific engines (my bike has that problem) Aug 08 12:52:01 So last time I had to do 20 miles to get normal 95 petrol Aug 08 12:52:35 it's the plastic parts that sometimes aren't ethanol resistant Aug 08 12:53:01 they can withstand the solvent capability of normal fuel but not ethanol Aug 08 12:54:11 plastic or rubber? Aug 08 12:57:05 Anyone can help with gtk ? Aug 08 12:57:19 V13, ask question and perhaps someone will know Aug 08 12:57:39 i try to add support for portrait mode and I need to relayout my widgets. Aug 08 12:57:48 but I fail miserably... Aug 08 12:58:24 Isn't 'portrait' mode simply the window being resized to 400*800 not 800*400? Aug 08 12:58:27 I am not destroying the widgets. Instead I try to create some new HBox/VBoxes and put the in there.. Aug 08 12:58:44 SpeedEvil, it's just a flag, yes Aug 08 12:58:57 SpeedEvil: I believe yes, but to have a proper display you have to re-layout the widgets. Aug 08 12:59:05 else the window is ugly. Aug 08 12:59:10 and I fail on re-layout. Aug 08 12:59:42 I'm using python but this should not be the problem. Aug 08 13:00:03 Anyway, the problem seems to be that I cannot change the widgets once they are parented. Aug 08 13:00:13 I tried remove() and add(), but no good Aug 08 13:00:22 I tried reparent()... same... Aug 08 13:01:08 hmmm v13 Aug 08 13:01:19 If anyone has written any gtk app with portrait mode support, should have faced that.. or I'm doing something very wrong. Aug 08 13:01:38 * lcuk wonders why there isnt an orientation flag on a Box widget but thats a different question Aug 08 13:02:08 no need for that.. I've two columns of widgets in landscape and I need to make it one column in portrait., Aug 08 13:02:21 (it's the configuration window) Aug 08 13:03:32 v13, screenshots help to explain your thinking :) Aug 08 13:03:53 imagine two columns of options in landscape that don't fit in portrait. Aug 08 13:03:59 so you just create one column with all options Aug 08 13:04:24 it's like: .. and : Aug 08 13:04:29 sure Aug 08 13:04:48 anyway. that's not the problem. Aug 08 13:04:53 the reparenting thing seems to be Aug 08 13:05:06 but if I were to go and ask people who *would* know the correct way to deal with this, rather than trying to explain in 2000 lines, one screenshot would do the job Aug 08 13:05:22 ? Aug 08 13:05:52 ok.. here's the question. I've an HBox() and a widget in it. Can I move the widget from this HBox to a newly created VBox() ? Aug 08 13:06:04 (no need to explain more) Aug 08 13:06:32 V13: no Aug 08 13:06:51 V13: not easily, and you'll end up with memory leaks Aug 08 13:07:06 arg... Aug 08 13:07:18 so I need to create a new set of widget from scratch ? Aug 08 13:07:19 V13: just store the widget state, delete hbox and widget, and reinstantiate in vbox Aug 08 13:07:26 ain't gtk awesome? Aug 08 13:07:30 it sucks :) Aug 08 13:07:39 upgrade to html :) Aug 08 13:07:39 that was just the confirmation Aug 08 13:07:49 1000x thanks crashanddie Aug 08 13:08:15 * V13 goes back to the coding cave Aug 08 13:08:28 gtk can reparent i am sure Aug 08 13:08:40 it can.. but it doesn't work as expected. Aug 08 13:08:48 lcuk: and everytime I've tried it, over the past 6 years, it's always buggered me Aug 08 13:09:08 stop painting a target on your ass then Aug 08 13:09:24 oooh, so that's why the dart competition hurt so bad Aug 08 13:09:42 I remember an old hack in C where you had to malloc() and memcpy() the widget, then re-parent it Aug 08 13:09:49 Jaffa: quick FYI .... we've installed OBS on new HW at OSU. need to setup projects and get an audit I think Aug 08 13:09:59 I doubt that the python libraries support reparenting Aug 08 13:10:04 anyway, I'm out, 'later all Aug 08 13:17:35 * lcuk likes new kylie song Aug 08 13:19:22 np: Blondie - Maria. Aug 08 13:20:10 hmm Aug 08 13:20:15 i'll listen Aug 08 13:20:21 but you just reminded me of heart of glass Aug 08 13:20:27 and I recall childhood Aug 08 13:20:34 Heart of glass is great too. Aug 08 13:20:46 Maria does not however disgrace it - which is surprising. Aug 08 13:21:09 my mother will be pleased I am listening to crappy songs Aug 08 13:21:22 * SpeedEvil wishes ISPs were compelled to provide a 'you have used this much data' API Aug 08 13:21:41 * SpeedEvil ponders modern music. Aug 08 13:21:59 I think Florence and the machine - My Boy Builds coffins - is one of my current favourites. Aug 08 13:22:46 * lcuk shall have to see when Kylie is coming to UK again for concerts Aug 08 13:22:59 or shall find a way to see her elsewhere Aug 08 13:23:12 Download mastalker. Aug 08 13:23:45 P2P coordination of stalking. With scheduling, to ensure a 24*7 watch on likely locations. Aug 08 13:23:46 twitter exists for that Aug 08 13:25:20 hey SpeedEvil Aug 08 13:25:35 i remember you told me about t-mobiles internet for 20 pounds Aug 08 13:25:40 can you get that anymore? Aug 08 13:25:48 cause i just got my sim card Aug 08 13:25:59 yes - I think so Aug 08 13:26:11 cant seem to find the deal for 20 pounds for 6 months Aug 08 13:26:13 SpeedEvil, thanks Aug 08 13:26:32 http://www.t-mobile.co.uk/services/payg/boosters/ Aug 08 13:26:35 they hide it. Aug 08 13:26:38 For some reason. Aug 08 13:27:11 lcuk: thanks? For anything in particular? /me is confused. Aug 08 13:27:11 thanks man Aug 08 13:27:19 SpeedEvil, enjoying blondie Aug 08 13:27:23 ah Aug 08 13:27:41 the neighbours are too Aug 08 13:28:20 * SpeedEvil was listening to radio 1 - the ibitha set from GrandMaster Flash. Awesome. Aug 08 13:28:31 I regret that my sound system only went to 14. Aug 08 13:28:52 my little speakers are straining, but the high pitched sounds are getting through Aug 08 13:29:15 * lcuk goes for chip butties at Carl Winterbottoms Aug 08 13:29:54 That reminds me of SirMix-A-Lot. Aug 08 13:31:02 what speakers do you have? Aug 08 13:31:17 some labtec ones Aug 08 13:31:22 * lcuk is ashamed Aug 08 13:31:45 * SpeedEvil is more ashamed. Aug 08 13:32:05 http://www.radio-now.co.uk/pure_oasis.htm Aug 08 13:32:14 Which is surprisingly loud, and OK quality. Aug 08 13:32:33 I need to hook my speakers up again - but I've mislaid my class D amp board. Aug 08 13:34:20 * lcuk once had a party at home Aug 08 13:34:29 my entire large bedroom window bowed to the music Aug 08 13:34:47 and cupboard boards fell on peoples heads when we were jumping around Aug 08 13:34:55 (to jump around) Aug 08 13:35:22 it was a great party Aug 08 13:35:28 mooo Aug 08 13:35:28 police came :$ Aug 08 13:36:12 lol Aug 08 13:36:25 * lcuk starts on coldplay Aug 08 13:36:52 viva la vida kicks ass Aug 08 13:37:00 * lcuk might make that an intro to something Aug 08 13:37:23 heh Aug 08 13:37:50 lcuk, lol @ police part Aug 08 13:38:04 MohammadAG, yeah they had complaints about the noise from the next street Aug 08 13:38:28 dave answered the door in his underpants I believe Aug 08 13:38:31 heh, someone called the german police on us while we were in germany Aug 08 13:38:32 or we managed to hide him Aug 08 13:38:46 they brought a translator with them Aug 08 13:38:51 sounds like it was a crazy party xD Aug 08 13:38:54 heh Aug 08 13:39:00 b-man, it was an awesome party Aug 08 13:39:07 we blew up a stereo Aug 08 13:39:08 us? nope, 10 5800s all on the same song Aug 08 13:39:12 LOL Aug 08 13:39:16 and happily managed to produce an identical drop in replacement Aug 08 13:39:20 that was awesome magic Aug 08 13:39:35 there were gatecrashers too o_O Aug 08 13:39:36 ROFL, how do you blow up a stereo? Aug 08 13:39:45 MohammadAG: a bomb? Aug 08 13:39:48 LOL Aug 08 13:39:58 luke-jr, yeah, I should know that Aug 08 13:40:12 MohammadAG, drastic impedence mismatch on the outputs or beer poured into it Aug 08 13:40:42 poor EE Aug 08 13:40:42 lcuk, I'll go with the beer Aug 08 13:41:44 o_O @ original version of James - Sit Down. Aug 08 13:41:50 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ew7Zkkucos8 Aug 08 13:42:09 thats awesome I havent heard that before - its very close to the released version Aug 08 13:42:16 but its just different enough to be cool Aug 08 13:42:57 O_o Aug 08 13:43:08 hmm Aug 08 13:44:30 * lcuk is pleased he put on music today Aug 08 13:45:12 buuurrrp, OMFG. How will I make sure nobody installs *#-ena to PR1.0.1 etc? Aug 08 13:46:31 DocScrutinizer, technically add a dependency (and use it) that reuqires pr1.2? Aug 08 13:46:44 seems the pkg needs a RDEPENDS or whatever, to latest Aug 08 13:47:09 IIRC, PR1.2 uses a different repository. Aug 08 13:47:23 So if you upload it and it gets compiled, it will not be installable by PR<1.2 Aug 08 13:47:24 no? Aug 08 13:47:42 * DocScrutinizer wonders... Aug 08 13:47:52 i think it depends on what it is Aug 08 13:48:02 * lcuk shivers @ song on atm Aug 08 13:48:04 Of course anyone can get the .deb from the site... Aug 08 13:48:07 it's really my first pkg ever, and not vrn a 'real one' Aug 08 13:48:43 some library versions on PR1.3 are the same as PR1.1, some are not Aug 08 13:48:48 **1.2 Aug 08 13:49:01 actually it depends on a certain version of dialer and cellmo I'd say Aug 08 13:49:24 hmm Aug 08 13:49:29 not even sure about that Aug 08 13:50:12 DocScrutinizer: Depend on mp-fremantle-generic-pr >= 10.2010.19-1 Aug 08 13:50:23 (perhaps) Aug 08 13:50:28 k, thanks mate Aug 08 13:50:43 but that's not 100% effective Aug 08 13:50:58 sure, but good enough Aug 08 13:51:04 preferably depend on the package that got updated? Aug 08 13:51:05 that should work for the most part Aug 08 13:51:28 I'd go with frals' suggestion if you know the package Aug 08 13:51:40 i used that method for kernel-debian-img on my upcoming nitdebian port for the N900 Aug 08 13:52:01 rtcom-call-ui, and errr cellmo? Aug 08 13:52:13 is it the modem firmware stuffthingy? Aug 08 13:52:21 yep Aug 08 13:52:29 cmtx-firmware might be the one? Aug 08 13:52:52 but, on 2nd thought, new rtcom-call-ui won't work with old cellmo Aug 08 13:53:02 (btw, just as a hint: nitdebian is structured very similarly to ubuntu-n8x0 ;P) Aug 08 13:53:27 but this time it will be complete Aug 08 13:53:53 and i'm not releasing it until it's structurally finished Aug 08 13:54:13 so if A depends on B depends on C, then A needs to check for B but not for C Aug 08 13:54:42 yeah Aug 08 13:55:15 C should pull in necessary dependencies unless for a special case Aug 08 13:56:23 in which A uses a special feature that C's dependencies don't provide Aug 08 13:56:32 starhash-ena "interacts" with rtcom-call-ui, so checking for right version should suffice Aug 08 13:56:32 I feel soooo rough Aug 08 13:56:39 Stag do last night. Aug 08 13:56:54 Drank from 8am until 4.30am Aug 08 13:57:32 DocScrutinizer, You could just make the package description "Dont be a nob - only install on PR1.2 kthxbye" Aug 08 13:57:51 kinda like the kernel-power package Aug 08 13:57:56 err Aug 08 13:57:57 alterego, you drank so much, time went backwards! :P (kidding) Aug 08 13:58:04 why dont you just set a proper depends? Aug 08 13:58:12 TermanaN900, or just set proper depends Aug 08 13:58:28 because users dont read the description Aug 08 13:58:30 timeless: that's what I'm pondering Aug 08 13:59:03 frals, frankly i think secretly calling them nobs is better than setting proper depends :P Aug 08 13:59:13 how do I take a photo automatically or from the cli? I tried with a basic gst-launch line, which works but gives a tinted and blurry image Aug 08 14:00:26 SpeedEvil might be able to help Aug 08 14:00:59 seems he knows a few "secret spells" for gstreamer Aug 08 14:01:25 dear friends. I have betrayed you Aug 08 14:01:32 I have bought an android phone Aug 08 14:01:54 ok? Aug 08 14:02:38 i+hacked+into+an+airline's+computer+systems+and+stole+a+huge+bunch+of+frequent+flyer+points+then+traded+them+in+for+merchandise+and+got+a+sony+playstation+2 Aug 08 14:02:39 MMMMMMMMMMMMM.+Crunchy,+mushy+CATBOX.+The+PEARL+OF+THE+ORIENT.+You+JERK+THAT+SHIT,+HOLMES.+You+JERK+IT+LIKE+YOU'VE+NEVER+JERKED+BEFORE.+For+the+LOVE+OF+CHRIST+AND+BALLS,+JERK+like+the+WORLD+IS+GOING+TO+FUCKING+END. Aug 08 14:02:42 girl,+you+must+be+rearden+metal+because+i'd+like+to+run+a+train+on+you. Aug 08 14:02:44 The+night+begins,+so+sets+the+sun,+but+chatting+now+has+just+begun.+T'will+yet+be+hours+ere+I+am+done,+for+I'm+the+chat+world's+favorite+son.+Although+by+day+I+am+made+fun+(they+say+that+I+weigh+nigh+a+ton,+they+say+ten+feet+I+cannot+run),+sour+regrets;+I+have+yet+none.+They+may+laugh+and+they+may+shun,+but+words+cannot+match+my+shotgun;+as+fast+and+far+as+they+may+run,+I'll+pick+them+all+off+one+by+one. Aug 08 14:02:45 Pudge+Picnic+:+chubs+on+chubs+with+flab+to+spare.+"No+condoms!"+yelled,+but+we+don't+care!+Dude's+be+fucken,+dudes+be+fucked,+dudes+be+shittin,+dudes+be+sucked.+Writhing+on+the+concrete+floor,+these+chubs+are+sluts.+They're+obese+whores!+And+gross!+They've+never+taken+baths.+Too+much+chili!+Awful+gas!!! Aug 08 14:02:45 DocScrutinizer, Aug 08 14:02:46 wtf Aug 08 14:02:46 ping Aug 08 14:02:47 "Shh,"+Snape+said,+their+mouths+very+close.+He+lifted+his+hand+off+Harry's+erection+and+smoothed+it+over+his+cheek.+It+was+a+breathless+sort+of+moment,+in+a+series+of+moments.+Harry+looked+at+Snape's+face,+enjoying+the+sensual+transformation.+Features+normally+so+severe+softened+by+desire,+flushed,+glistening.+Harry+didn't+have+time+to+wonder+what+Snape+saw+in+his+own+face,+for+Snape+was+kissing+him+again. Aug 08 14:02:47 i+was+going+through+the+logs+in+my+toilet+today+and+i+found+a+letter.+i+don't+remember+eating+a+letter.+funny+thing+is..+it+was+a+letter+from+my+colon+telling+me+to+eat+less+fiber.+ps:+i'm+shutting+down+until+you+have+sex+with+men.+after+plowing+the+fields+of+the+nearest+12+guys+i+could+find,+my+brother+walks+into+the+room.+he+says,+"haha+jokes+on+you+i+put+that+note+in+your+turd.+you+just+fucked+a+bunch+of+dudes+for Aug 08 14:02:48 When+I+was+little+a+friend+told+me+that+if+you+swallow+chewing+gum+it+stays+in+your+stomach+for+7+years.+After+I+was+married+I+told+my+husband+and+he+laughed+until+he+choked+me+unconscious+and+then+raped+me+viciously+in+every+hole! Aug 08 14:02:49 as long as you don't start whining about it here now Aug 08 14:02:49 A+note+to+the+idiot+who+keeps+sending+me+anonymous+emails+claiming+to+have+"f*cked"+my+mother:+1)+Do+you+really+think+i+don't+have+your+IP+address+and+have+a+relatively+good+idea+of+who+you+are?+2)+Do+you+really+think+I+care+about+your+weird+sexual+fantasies?+3)+Have+you+even+SEEN+my+mother?+HAHAHA+4)+Keep+it+up.+The+messages+are+being+logged,+stored+and+passed+on+to+the+relevant+authorities+and,+of+course,+your+ISP...+5)+I Aug 08 14:02:51 DocScrutinizer, DocScrutinizer51 Aug 08 14:02:53 :/ Aug 08 14:02:54 I+have+always+fantasized+about+being+a+doll.+like+one+of+those+real+dolls,+only+my+owner+doesn't+know+I'm+in+there.+They+think+I'm+just+a+doll,+when+really+I+am+enjoying+everything+that+is+bring+done+to+me.+Having+no+control+of+my+body,+being+dominated+completely,+and+then+being+put+away+when+I'm+not+being+used.+However,+I+know+that+this+is+not+possible+in+the+real+world,+which+saddens+me.+I+however+I'm+sure+there+i Aug 08 14:02:55 fuck Aug 08 14:02:56 Is+it+politically+correct+on+this+list+to+trash+Microsoft+and+show+destain+for+money?+If+so,+I+must+protest.+Microsoft+is+the+best+thing+that+ever+happened+to+computer+users,+ever.+It+will+never,+never+be+replaced+by+user+unfriendly+software+like+linux+or+TeX.+Never. Aug 08 14:03:06 I'm+not+trying+to+brag+or+anything,+but+yeah,+I+smoke+weed.+I+don't+give+a+damn+what+anyone+says+regarding+marijuana+laws.+Go+ahead,+trace+my+ip.+Tell+the+cops+where+I+live,+I+should+be+able+to+put+whatever+i+want+in+my+body,+may+it+be+marijuana,+a+10+year+olds+childs+semi+erect+penis,+or+cocaine.+The+government+doesn't+have+any+right+telling+us+what+is+"ok"+to+consume. Aug 08 14:03:08 MohammadAG, hes too concerned about the android guy Aug 08 14:03:08 The+girl+can+probably+never+be+said+to+truly+enjoy+the+experience+if+she+is+fearful+for+her+life+or+suffering+the+trauma's+of+the+victimization+but+it+still+seems+funny+to+be+that+if+she+is+going+to+be+raped+anyhow+than+she+should+at+least+get+a+good+fuck+out+of+it. Aug 08 14:03:11 I'm+not+really+gay,+I+just+act+that+way+to+annoy/creep+out+people. Aug 08 14:03:13 Meth+is+the+shortest+word+in+the+English+language+one+can+lisp+while+drunk+and+underage+at+a+gay+bar.+It+can+therefore+be+no+surprise+that+homosexual+males+have+congregated+around+the+substance+since+its+inception.+For+every+meth+mouth,+there+is+an+equal+and+opposite+meth+dick. Aug 08 14:03:17 wtf Aug 08 14:03:21 heh. spam is offtopic :D Aug 08 14:03:25 All+the+guys+in+this+IRC+channel+I+hang+out+in+are+really+profane+and+gross.+They+talk+about+child+porn+and+act+racist+a+lot+of+the+time,+and+every+night+before+I+go+to+bed+I+pray+for+God's+forgiveness,+and+for+God+to+forgive+them.+Then+I+remember+I'm+wiccan.+Blessed+be! Aug 08 14:03:25 DocScrutinizer: might want to ban or at least quiet *!*@gateway/web/cgi-irc/irc.wikia.com/* for a while Aug 08 14:03:27 fuck+all+this+elexctronic+shit.+Give+me+a+typewriter,+a+pushbutton+telephone,+and+a+bank+of+teletype+machines+with+yellow+paper.+Then+you+could+make+sense+of+this+crap Aug 08 14:03:30 I+GOT+SOMETHING+FOR+ALL+U+DAMN+MOMS.+IT+SOMEWHAT+RESEMBLES+THE+PECAN+LOGS+YOU+GET+AT+CHRISTMAS.+THATS+RIGHT+ITS+A+BIG+BLACK+PECKER! Aug 08 14:03:32 Objectivism+is+nothing+but+selfishness+with+a+philosophical+bumper+sticker+stuck+on+its+ass+that+somehow+purports+to+elevate+it+to+respectability.+Objectivism+will+succeed+as+soon+as+human+nature+is+purged+of+empathy,+sympathy,+love+for+one's+family,+love+for+one's+community,+love+for+humanity+itself.+In+other+words,+never.The+only+people+who+take+this+shit+seriously+are+earnest+but+naive+college+students+with+too+much Aug 08 14:03:33 I+get+off+on+sticking+my+dick+into+house+hold+appliances.+one+day+i+put+it+in+a+blender,+i+was+really+drunk.+When+i+woke+up+in+the+hospital+my+forskin+was+gone+and+they+had+to+put+in+50++stiches.+Needless+to+say,+i+enjoyed+it+thoroughly. Aug 08 14:03:34 no duh lol Aug 08 14:03:51 works equally well I guess Aug 08 14:04:11 Anyway as i was about to say before the spamfag came Aug 08 14:04:13 fwiw DocScrutinizer, i think its safe to ban irc.wikia.com as most people who arent spambots use freenode web iface Aug 08 14:04:38 does anyone actually know who that guy is that brought the android phone? Aug 08 14:04:38 DocScrutinizer well I'd disallow unregistered users Aug 08 14:04:41 :P Aug 08 14:04:58 errr I mentioned buying an android phone Aug 08 14:05:11 we don't like to +b/q $~a Aug 08 14:05:13 yes you Aug 08 14:05:19 does anyone know you? Aug 08 14:05:21 :P Aug 08 14:05:23 it has side effects Aug 08 14:05:24 no Aug 08 14:05:27 * MohammadAG suggests bitching on #freenode Aug 08 14:05:29 well..... probably not Aug 08 14:05:30 I'm already there :P Aug 08 14:05:45 DocScrutinizer: *!*@gateway* is *probably* a bit more wide than is really necessary (they started spamming through the wikia cgi-irc shortly after we've captcha-protected webchat.freenode.net, which hasn't been spammed with since then) Aug 08 14:05:55 yesyesyes Aug 08 14:06:14 so if a phone is overclocked and later reverted to stock kernel. does that invalidate the warranty? Aug 08 14:06:25 marienz, why aren't all webchats captcha-protected? Aug 08 14:06:50 TermanaN900: I've had both the n800 and n810 and not deciding to get the n900 was a difficult decision for me Aug 08 14:06:57 MohammadAG: because we don't run them Aug 08 14:07:09 makes sense, shut off all APIs Aug 08 14:07:21 oh wait, nvm, IRC doesn't support that Aug 08 14:07:37 MohammadAG: webchats work by the server they run on (most of them) or the browser itself (java-based ones) connecting to us as a regular irc client Aug 08 14:07:56 MohammadAG: so unless we implement some kind of irc-level captcha we can't captcha-protect webchats not running on our own infrastructure (like this wikia one) Aug 08 14:08:33 I'm going to throttle joins today... Aug 08 14:08:35 marienz, yes I know, we run a private server on our site Aug 08 14:08:49 less users -> less spam though Aug 08 14:08:51 will bite our ass on netsplits I bet Aug 08 14:08:58 is the camera app foss? Aug 08 14:09:02 no Aug 08 14:09:10 hello together, i'm looking for a way to get more rootfs. There are several ways to do so at the maemo wiki. Could you tell which one is the best? Aug 08 14:09:11 fcam is Aug 08 14:10:00 somebody around here good with ircbots? Aug 08 14:10:34 DocScrutinizer, why, what do you want? Aug 08 14:11:19 set up a bot on my box, to act upon multiple fast joins from same IP*mask* Aug 08 14:11:48 DocScrutinizer, why dont you just disallow fast joining with the channel mode? Aug 08 14:11:55 there's e.g dropegg Aug 08 14:12:05 unless freenodes stupid ircd doesnt support that channel mode Aug 08 14:12:22 as join throttle isn't as configurable as that proprietary solution would be Aug 08 14:14:45 Jaffa: if you're up to it, I just pushed a ver with a voting dialog that (gasp) actually displays, plus a few tidbits Aug 08 14:15:03 so if a phone is overclocked and later reverted to stock kernel. does that invalidate the warranty? Aug 08 14:15:12 yes Aug 08 14:15:27 * DocScrutinizer coughs and mumbles "told ya it's not yet over.." Aug 08 14:15:52 frals, but if the phone is not fried is that still an issue? Aug 08 14:16:10 yes, you still did something to it that voided the warranty... Aug 08 14:16:18 * achipa envies people who actually have warranties to worry about Aug 08 14:16:28 its not something you can take back :p Aug 08 14:16:30 ~tell trumee about omap-oc Aug 08 14:16:33 /12 Aug 08 14:16:44 frals, hmm. how does Nokia know that the phone has been OC Aug 08 14:17:21 frals: if you have a car that has a warranty for 100.000km and you get to 120.000km, does the warranty get unvoided if you drive it 40.000km in reverse ? Aug 08 14:17:38 of course it does Aug 08 14:17:43 or sth to that effect :) Aug 08 14:17:44 duh Aug 08 14:17:45 :P Aug 08 14:18:11 achipa: :D Aug 08 14:18:18 trumee: dunno, dont care :) Aug 08 14:18:33 * frals goes back to sc2 Aug 08 14:19:02 /lastlog alterego Aug 08 14:19:20 whoops :) Aug 08 14:19:50 trumee, your answer is yes your warranty is void, but if something happens and your a dishonest person, they probably wont take the time to check and your warranty will stick Aug 08 14:20:44 Who was asking about gstreamer? Aug 08 14:21:20 I was asking about capturing an image, because gstreamer didn't white balance or focus Aug 08 14:21:25 ah Aug 08 14:21:35 I have no idea aout how to get gstreamer to do that. Aug 08 14:21:48 I can post-process white balance, but not focus Aug 08 14:21:58 you could look at the source of lfocus Aug 08 14:22:29 I'll give fcam a try Aug 08 14:22:29 or fcamera Aug 08 14:22:30 meh, COFFEE, sudo make me C0FFEE Aug 08 14:22:47 DocScrutinizer, user joerg is not in sudoers, this incident will be reported Aug 08 14:22:47 is it in any of the repos? Aug 08 14:27:24 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=75ftfH2PoMU Aug 08 14:27:31 crap wrong chan Aug 08 14:30:09 lcuk: cheap brazil remake? Aug 08 14:30:22 remake of? Aug 08 14:30:39 DocScrutinizer, its a followup to the walkin fridge/wardrobe one from last year Aug 08 14:30:44 Brazil, the first film a whole country was named alike Aug 08 14:31:34 don't tell me you don't know Brazil by Terry Gilliam Aug 08 14:31:53 i won't tell you then, and just google it Aug 08 14:34:04 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4Wh2b1eZFUM Aug 08 14:37:47 ok, the trailer is errr humm.... not really representing the mood of the film Aug 08 14:37:55 lol Aug 08 14:39:00 but it should suffice for a "Ohh THAT brazil, sure I've seen that" Aug 08 14:39:01 oh swell Aug 08 14:39:11 I flashed and now modest doesn't show Nokia Messaging Aug 08 14:39:19 damn operator restrictions Aug 08 14:39:19 apt-get remove modest Aug 08 14:39:19 GREAT! Aug 08 14:40:09 getting rid of Nokia msgs can't be anything particularly bad Aug 08 14:40:58 except maybe for Nokians who might be supposed to use it :-D Aug 08 14:43:26 lcuk: at least brazil has kinda same tubing Heineken got in this ad Aug 08 14:43:42 ahhh DocScrutinizer its not unheard of Aug 08 14:43:49 its just beer on call thats fun Aug 08 14:44:36 i saw a few weeks ago some guys had created a cool robot who would go and pull a selection of beer from the fridge and deliver it to you Aug 08 14:44:50 used high tech recognition and AI to perform it Aug 08 14:44:57 Man: laziest of all Aug 08 14:45:18 not exactly Aug 08 14:46:03 the effort to build that thing would dwarf the lifelong burden of fetching your beer the traditional way Aug 08 14:46:58 probably even regular service is more effort than delivering beer to a whole army :-P Aug 08 14:47:55 so you have to be both lazy and blind/stupid to build such a thing to easy your daily life Aug 08 14:48:40 Or you have to find it a recreation. Aug 08 14:49:10 If building the robot is cheaper recreation than - for exampl e- going out to expensive events - then you can't really count it simply as a cost. Aug 08 14:49:34 yep Aug 08 14:50:27 but then it's more the mere joy of doing it, rather than the benefit of it fetching your beer - if everything pans out every once in a while Aug 08 14:51:05 not exactly laziness related Aug 08 14:52:56 * DocScrutinizer muses idly about bots stopping their attacks same moment they are quieted in a channel Aug 08 14:54:28 what an asshole anyway... tried to read a few words of his spam. Disgusting and sad Aug 08 14:58:12 does ps3 six axis controller need a different kernel as well. can that invalidate warranty? Aug 08 15:00:12 i sure hope it doesn't need a new kernel Aug 08 15:00:21 that'd be pretty impressive levels of fail, even for linux Aug 08 15:00:34 ok, wait a sec, i take that back, it'd probably be typical fail Aug 08 15:00:49 Please be a macfag somewhere else Aug 08 15:00:52 :P Aug 08 15:01:05 fwiw,i'm pretty sure that sticking your n900 in the washing machine voids your warranty Aug 08 15:01:09 but, tbh, I fear the strings of spam are just a medley of the mails and posts to irc from the infected PCs rather that statements that skiddie made up Aug 08 15:02:47 timeless, ok i am lost on your response. does sixaxis need a separate kernel? Aug 08 15:02:53 timeless: nope, but starting the program does immediately :-P Aug 08 15:03:06 and is that an issue with warranty Aug 08 15:03:24 trumee: i dunno Aug 08 15:03:42 the general idea is that doing something risky *can* void your warranty Aug 08 15:04:01 but the vendor can be nice and choose to service your product anyway Aug 08 15:04:10 but installing a new kernel isn't per se such risky operation Aug 08 15:04:15 or if it discovers serious damage which had to come from your voiding it Aug 08 15:04:23 well, let's use my washing machine example Aug 08 15:04:31 if i do that and ask them to service my n900 Aug 08 15:04:41 they're likely to laugh at me when they see the water damage Aug 08 15:04:59 it'd be clear that the damage wasn't from proper care, and that i voided it Aug 08 15:05:03 and started the washing program, 95°C Aug 08 15:05:07 similarly, if they see that you've burned out the chip Aug 08 15:05:21 then that too wouldn't happen from the warranteed software Aug 08 15:05:41 timeless, i see your point Aug 08 15:05:42 DocScrutinizer, I don't know, I think I learned a thing or two from the spam. "Meth is the shortest word in the english language one can lisp while drunk and underage at a gay bar" Aug 08 15:05:44 and "Microsoft is the best thing that ever happened to computer users, ever." Aug 08 15:05:54 Or... maybe I guess not Aug 08 15:06:04 No, I guess it wasn't that useful Aug 08 15:06:10 heh Aug 08 15:06:25 achipa: Pulled newest version, once the "Already installed" button has been hit, and dpkg called lots, no packages get display: "Already installed" shown at the top of the screen (selected) with "Complete QA queue" alongside it, unselected. Aug 08 15:06:32 timeless, i guess that means sixaxis kernel is okay to install :) Aug 08 15:06:43 you won't hear that from me Aug 08 15:06:47 but yeah, i'd probably risk it Aug 08 15:06:54 fwiw, i risked the nokia ipv6 kernel Aug 08 15:06:57 of course, that bricked my n900 Aug 08 15:06:59 .. Aug 08 15:07:03 lol Aug 08 15:07:19 and reflashing the kernel left me w/ a broken about dialog Aug 08 15:07:30 MUHAHA Aug 08 15:07:31 flashing can be dangerous :) Aug 08 15:07:54 timeless, especially when your arrested Aug 08 15:08:01 you're* Aug 08 15:08:14 timeless: maybe http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=20465 helps your issue Aug 08 15:09:16 achipa: But if I switch to "Complete QA queue", it shows. Aug 08 15:10:24 i don't get an error if i run osso-product-info Aug 08 15:10:58 heh, how about replacing the shaking-hands video by some nice porn, on next starhash-enabler update? Just for fun, and without prior notice :-P Aug 08 15:11:08 um Aug 08 15:11:16 my flash screen has been replaced for ages Aug 08 15:11:20 sorry, just getting silly Aug 08 15:11:29 DocScrutinizer: And that's why we have 10 day quarantine :-p Aug 08 15:11:30 have you seen my splash? Aug 08 15:12:03 Jaffa: no worries, will trigger on 2010-09-24 Aug 08 15:13:08 um Aug 08 15:13:17 does everyone have /etc/osso_software_version? Aug 08 15:13:25 mompl Aug 08 15:13:51 ls: /etc/osso_software_version: No such file or directory Aug 08 15:14:09 osso-product-info|grep VERS Aug 08 15:14:33 Nokia-N900-42-11:~# osso-product-info|grep VERS Aug 08 15:14:34 OSSO_PRODUCT_RELEASE_VERSION='10.2010.19-1' Aug 08 15:14:36 OSSO_VERSION='RX-51_2009SE_10.2010.19-1_PR_MR0' Aug 08 15:17:07 timeless: (flashscreen) is it >DONT PANIC< ? Aug 08 15:17:15 nope Aug 08 15:17:24 MEH Aug 08 15:17:30 err Aug 08 15:17:33 capslock Aug 08 15:18:15 OSSO_VERSION='RX-51_2009SE_10.2010.19-1.203.1_PR_203' Aug 08 15:18:27 using non global software Aug 08 15:18:28 yuck Aug 08 15:18:57 it is uk firmware Aug 08 15:19:41 there is not much difference between this and global iirc Aug 08 15:20:06 something different about fm frequencies i think Aug 08 15:20:36 the update cycle is worse in non global Aug 08 15:20:44 because of nokia stupidity Aug 08 15:20:52 the regions have the ability to delay updates Aug 08 15:20:57 to ensure "quality" Aug 08 15:21:35 How can you delay updates when you make a global release and the other country firmwares would work anyway? :P Aug 08 15:22:04 termana: 99% of people use OTA updates based on the notifier Aug 08 15:22:07 no notice, no update Aug 08 15:22:23 and the update is based on the meta package, which is distinct per regional release Aug 08 15:22:46 anyone smart enough to replace the region w/ the global image doesn't suffer Aug 08 15:22:48 but isn't typical Aug 08 15:24:18 firmware update is like once in four months. not something which happens everyday so can live with it Aug 08 15:24:40 we're lucky if we do them at 4 month intervals Aug 08 15:26:57 guess PR 1.3 going to take a long time then ;) Aug 08 15:28:05 * DocScrutinizer is googling timeless' quote about PR1.3 supposed to be out the latest on 2017(?) Aug 08 15:28:20 2021? Aug 08 15:29:38 timeless: hope we don't have to call you out on that, -one day- :-D Aug 08 15:29:49 * timeless too Aug 08 15:29:51 that'd suck Aug 08 15:30:06 but i didn't say precisely that :) Aug 08 15:32:09 "and.. you know... 12 years is a long time. I really can't recall if maybe I was drunk or mentally disordered when and if I said such thing back in 2010" Aug 08 15:32:34 Lucky, we have logs Aug 08 15:32:49 Termana: Of the state of timelesses intoxication? Aug 08 15:32:56 yeah Aug 08 15:33:24 logs don't even log state of authentication Aug 08 15:33:49 oh really? they don't? shit! Aug 08 15:34:32 QED (that's been me, the line above - for the logs) Aug 08 15:34:45 I just grouped that in to my account Aug 08 15:34:48 :P Aug 08 15:36:02 I wonder if there is a freenode rule about how many nicks you can register/group :P Aug 08 15:37:28 #Termana: so now you lost the game :-D Ircd logs on freenode are 5 min late to pov.it. So now it's evident you grouped that nick, then posted the line I claimed would be mine :-P Aug 08 15:38:36 DocScrutinizer, you can't fool me. Logs might be 5 minutes late, but they don't get arranged into a different order :P Aug 08 15:42:44 log.freenode.nickserv [15:30] termana-2 grouped to account termana; Aug 08 15:42:46 http://mg.pov.lt/maemo-irclog : Termana-2 oh really? they don't? shit! 18:33 Aug 08 15:43:23 guilty, shoot him Aug 08 15:45:26 DocScrutinizer, I call fake log. You aren't a freenode ircop - only an ircop would typically have access to logs of when I grouped my nicknames :P Aug 08 15:45:54 * Termana wags finger at DocScrutinizer Aug 08 15:46:50 Termana: try to prove that... 2012 at court :-P Aug 08 15:47:44 DocScrutinizer, 23rd of December is the court date I assume? :P Aug 08 15:48:20 dunno, depends on timeless' case I guess Aug 08 15:49:14 maybe 4th of July 2028 Aug 08 15:49:45 if we are all still alive then :-D Aug 08 15:50:18 the doomsday is near Aug 08 15:50:34 ls -ltr will be useless Aug 08 15:50:44 total chaos Aug 08 15:51:04 uhh? Aug 08 15:51:52 Termana: at least the logs will survive, that's for sure :-D Aug 08 15:51:57 isn't that the end of 32bit unix timestamp ? Aug 08 15:52:08 nonono.. they'll be overwritten :P Aug 08 15:52:21 the time ring-buffer will roll over Aug 08 15:52:47 23rd of December, 2012 is the the big 2012 doomsday thing - which is why I said that date :P Aug 08 15:53:19 in fact I've seen such amounts of partially valuable data going down the drain by time ringbuffer - it's amazing Aug 08 15:53:30 indeed.. 7 feb 2016 Aug 08 15:53:45 2106 Aug 08 15:54:02 but 2038 is the end of the *signed* 32 bit unix timestamp :) Aug 08 15:54:26 * DocScrutinizer yawns and ponders another coffee Aug 08 15:54:45 what's at december 2012? Aug 08 15:55:00 "too late" :) Aug 08 15:55:03 2012-12 I'd say Aug 08 15:55:25 far away as well Aug 08 15:55:55 * V13 waits for 2038 Aug 08 15:56:08 and for sure another month I'd not miss when vanishing into oblivion, here in Germany Aug 08 15:56:26 half of earth's population will fail to wake up because their alarms will have the wrong time.. Aug 08 15:56:46 kitchen timers will fail, making the food burn Aug 08 15:57:12 yayaya exactly like y2k - what a lame joke Aug 08 15:57:23 well.. in fact this is not a joke Aug 08 15:57:34 i dare you to set the time of your computer to that date :) Aug 08 15:57:34 y2k wasn't as well Aug 08 15:57:44 well.. it was... partially.. Aug 08 15:58:01 it can't be compared with the depletion of IPv4 addresses or the end of the unix timestamp Aug 08 15:58:41 well at least ipv4 isn't a thing that gets used up on a regular basis Aug 08 15:58:50 eh? Aug 08 15:59:02 screw all this, theres a more important set of variables that are due to screw up life as we know it Aug 08 15:59:16 Doctor Who is near the end of all his regenerations!!!oneone11!!! Aug 08 15:59:17 like in "the day the last IPv4 got void" Aug 08 15:59:35 doc: I've lost you Aug 08 16:00:47 V13: even if ICAN or whoever doesn't have any more *new* IPv4 to assign, the old ones still continue on to work happily Aug 08 16:01:06 is it possible to write a script which kills the browser when a sip call comes in Aug 08 16:01:15 and even the media player Aug 08 16:01:19 I fear the worst, I have lost him to - he isn't responding to pings! Aug 08 16:01:21 well.. ICAN will be finished in a year, RIR's will finish in about two years (Except from RIPE which got the extra block already) Aug 08 16:01:58 i am always worried that my browser will eat up the cpu and i will miss the important call Aug 08 16:02:01 trumee: wtf would you want to do that? better hit the big red button and desintegrate the whole device Aug 08 16:02:14 DocScrutinizer: but what you describe is a concern by itself. First of all, there will be not enough addresses for mobile phones... second, the exchanging of IPv4 address is a headache. The BGP table could grow very large. Aug 08 16:03:05 DocScrutinizer, sip call needs 35% cpu. sometimes there isnt much remaining with browser and media player going Aug 08 16:03:25 V13: #1 is moot as GSM is usually over carrier NAT anyway Aug 08 16:03:27 a quick killall browserd will be usefull Aug 08 16:03:39 #2 is a mere performance/resouces problem Aug 08 16:04:05 trumee: man nice Aug 08 16:04:20 DocScrutinizer: It's not a small problem. The size of the BGP table is quite a big concern. Aug 08 16:04:37 do browsers and media player have low priorties on by default? Aug 08 16:05:01 what happens when a youtube video is on and a sip call comes in? Aug 08 16:05:22 anyway, based on the consumption of IPv4 addresses, the need won't be satisfied for a long time after the depletion. Aug 08 16:05:23 V13: yep, one day each cisco switch will have to have a mysql database Aug 08 16:06:18 i will be much happier with a killall command to be triggered when a call comes in Aug 08 16:06:26 trumee: ever thought about just *testing* it? Aug 08 16:07:11 don't let empirical testing stop wild ideas :P Aug 08 16:07:16 well said, i will test it Aug 08 16:07:20 sure :-P Aug 08 16:07:47 but is it possible trigger a shell script at all? Aug 08 16:07:57 iirc youtube vids stop playback as soon as some other screen is foreground Aug 08 16:08:14 not in my system. Aug 08 16:08:19 trumee: it's unix, everything is *possible* Aug 08 16:08:25 in fact i've let a video playing music a couple of times Aug 08 16:08:48 oh... unless you're talking for n900 Aug 08 16:08:49 yes, but where should i trigger the script from? Aug 08 16:09:06 trumee: question is: does it *blend*? Err... make sense Aug 08 16:09:22 trumee: the easiest way is perhaps a python script that listens to dbus messages Aug 08 16:09:56 V13. ah so there is a dbus message on an incomng call Aug 08 16:10:04 yes Aug 08 16:10:15 * DocScrutinizer refuses discussing vapor concepts based on speculative scenarios Aug 08 16:10:33 ok. this is a starting point then. Aug 08 16:10:51 no, this is beginning of madness Aug 08 16:11:00 DocScrutinizer, :) Aug 08 16:11:25 you're re-implementing dispatcher priorities and scheduling, on a really messed up basis Aug 08 16:12:08 or - more colloquial - reinventing the wheel Aug 08 16:13:02 if your sip shit doesn't perform then rise prio (aka lower niceness). If this still doesn't help, run it RT-scheduled Aug 08 16:13:23 (which btw it probably already is, on maemo) Aug 08 16:13:29 doc: that won't help in case of heavy I/O Aug 08 16:13:29 DocScrutinizer, reality check atm is that sip calls dont work for me. so once sip is stable on N900 i will look into this Aug 08 16:13:40 only memory page locking can save you from this Aug 08 16:14:15 and heavy I/O some times means high memory usage, which is a usual sideffect of the browser Aug 08 16:14:16 SIP works for me Aug 08 16:14:20 DocScrutinizer, sip shit! doesnt perform for me at all atm Aug 08 16:14:21 DocScrutinizer, is Brazil worth watching Aug 08 16:14:28 V13: sure, but heavy IO frequently is caused by swapping. I don't think killing a process will cause *less* swapping, at least initially. Au contraire Aug 08 16:14:29 * lcuk will go and get dvd from a friends if so Aug 08 16:14:37 sECuRE, Bug #10388 Aug 08 16:14:38 Bug https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=10388 Choppy audio in SIP conversation, WLAN power save problem? Aug 08 16:14:43 lcuk: is one of my favourites Aug 08 16:14:56 doc: killing a process will immediately free the memory if it's KILL and not TERM. Aug 08 16:15:06 without any extra disk IO Aug 08 16:15:28 sECuRE, 5 minutes of call is what i get before it garbles up Aug 08 16:16:13 DocScrutinizer, then I will Aug 08 16:16:45 V13: sure, but you're not suggesting to SIGKILL several core processes of maemo, to make SIP perform - esp when the problem is wlan related as mentioned in above quoted ticket Aug 08 16:17:04 well.. no I don't. Aug 08 16:17:36 I just said that higher priority will not help on a slow system because of disk IO. Aug 08 16:17:42 * DocScrutinizer refuses discussing vapor concepts based on speculative scenarios - once more Aug 08 16:17:49 DocScrutinizer, it is not related to wlan as per I but the jury is out on that one Aug 08 16:19:18 V13: I've stated several times swapperd is borked by concept, as it doesn't inherit priorisation of the swapped process Aug 08 16:20:28 but that'sclearly something you need to tackle in kernel (swapper daemon), not by messing around with randomly killing processes Aug 08 16:21:35 well.. just like in some illnesses, sometimes you need to do this. Aug 08 16:22:23 you can't cure cancer so you kill cells. Aug 08 16:22:29 SIGSTOP will completely suffice to stop the process from trigering any further swapping, no need to SIGKILL Aug 08 16:22:31 :P Aug 08 16:22:44 well.. I was curious about that... Aug 08 16:22:50 whether STOP/CONT will do the job Aug 08 16:23:10 if it works then it would be perfect for what trumee wants Aug 08 16:23:27 of course, if the sip application was swapped out, it will still have a delay. Aug 08 16:23:28 STOPed processes get no more timeslice, so aren't run anymore, so won't swap anymore Aug 08 16:23:56 * V13 just remebered that STOP can't be ignored Aug 08 16:24:10 so it should work as advertised Aug 08 16:24:11 sip probably isn't ever swapped out, should be memfixed Aug 08 16:24:35 i doubt that they memlock the SIP part. Aug 08 16:24:45 if it's not, then you're free to patch that Aug 08 16:24:57 well.. yes.. Aug 08 16:25:05 easy one Aug 08 16:25:05 I'm also free to rewrite it, write one of my own, etc etc.. Aug 08 16:25:15 hm.. regarding the "easy", I'm not so sure Aug 08 16:25:21 Never done this.. Aug 08 16:25:33 and SIP has a lot of dependencies. Aug 08 16:25:35 dsme-tool --help - I guess Aug 08 16:26:11 I don't see a parameter for locking memory. Aug 08 16:26:22 and that's expected.. It would be cruel to memlock the whole process. Aug 08 16:27:01 hm.. rtcamm-call-ui has 32M VM Aug 08 16:27:27 0kb locked Aug 08 16:27:49 V13: actually nope, dsme isn't managing that Aug 08 16:28:46 csd, ohmd, libstartup... those have locked memory Aug 08 16:29:01 bme_RX too Aug 08 16:29:24 mission-control and telepathy-ring. Aug 08 16:30:00 but I've disabled sip ... let me check Aug 08 16:30:39 Nope, sofiasip doesn't have any locked memory Aug 08 16:31:29 in /usr/lib/telepathy/, only telepathy-ring and telepathy-stream-engine are suid. only those can lock memory Aug 08 16:32:11 telepathy-stream-engine is what kicks in on a sip call Aug 08 16:32:49 trumee when you have a call check /proc//status Aug 08 16:32:58 and see VmLck Aug 08 16:33:14 if it is non-zero then it locks pages. Aug 08 16:33:26 however, it may be using the suid bit just to get lower priority Aug 08 16:34:24 VmLck is 0kb Aug 08 16:35:37 then try what DocScrutinizer said. Aug 08 16:35:48 whenever you receive a call send a SIGSTOP to the browser Aug 08 16:35:56 then , when the call is finished, send a SIGCONT Aug 08 16:36:45 ok, i will try that Aug 08 16:46:56 is builder ok ? Aug 08 16:47:30 I uploaded a package about an hour ago, it sent an OK mail but it is still not visible in the interface Aug 08 16:59:57 v13 - there have been mails that the builder is having issues Aug 08 17:00:16 the last hour ? Aug 08 17:00:37 http://lists.maemo.org/pipermail/maemo-developers/2010-August/027314.html Aug 08 17:00:54 ho.. Aug 08 17:00:56 ffs Aug 08 17:01:00 thnks for the tip Aug 08 17:01:25 np Aug 08 17:04:56 SpeedEvil: o/ Aug 08 17:05:31 ||| (pink, green, blue) (shipped) Aug 08 17:05:35 (to me) Aug 08 17:05:41 \o/ Aug 08 17:24:35 i guess today is credit card day, I have so many offers in mailbox that got through spam Aug 08 17:28:26 * ShadowJK remembers a time when it was impossible to get a cc even if you went to the bank and dropped 5kE on their counter as collateral Aug 08 17:31:55 ShadowJK, something has changed because suddenly I have about 15 places offering them that normally I wouldn't see Aug 08 17:32:50 Well your government /is/ spamming the banks telling them to lend moar :-) Aug 08 17:33:05 heh Aug 08 17:45:26 About fbreader. I hit a bug - DCC download speeds and ETAs completely broken. Aug 08 17:45:42 I think this is due to the patches for low power - where would I sumbit bug? Aug 08 18:00:43 hey guys Aug 08 18:00:52 anyone got an n810 to hand thats charged Aug 08 18:01:05 if so, can you tell me result of "uname -m" Aug 08 18:01:30 or 8x0 Aug 08 18:02:14 i have one in a box Aug 08 18:02:15 never used Aug 08 18:02:25 or an n800 that's charged Aug 08 18:02:47 I sitll have box for my n810 Aug 08 18:02:50 still Aug 08 18:03:03 but its been well used Aug 08 18:03:11 * lcuk has a little sticker over the light sensor still :) Aug 08 18:03:24 both mine have custom kernel Aug 08 18:03:45 ShadowJK, the -m is chip model afaik Aug 08 18:03:49 so shouldn't change Aug 08 18:04:23 lcuk: armv6l Aug 08 18:04:37 Jaffa, ++ great, thanks Aug 08 18:04:40 Linux Nokia-N810-23-14 2.6.21-omap1 #1 Sun Apr 5 11:12:41 BST 2009 armv6l unknown Aug 08 18:05:19 uname -m sounds good, hold on I will get it from all 4 places Aug 08 18:05:19 n900 == armv7l Aug 08 18:05:19 scratchbox == arm Aug 08 18:05:19 scratchx86 == i486 Aug 08 18:05:19 ubuntu == i686 Aug 08 18:05:20 and Jaffa just gave n810 == armv6l Aug 08 18:05:48 ShadowJK, thats normal uname stuff, I was interested in the cpu model underneath Aug 08 18:06:01 amrv6l is there too Aug 08 18:06:11 * lcuk nods Aug 08 18:06:15 \o ta Aug 08 18:06:21 * lcuk goes back to batcave Aug 08 18:06:40 my PC would say amd64 Aug 08 18:06:49 i think Aug 08 18:07:13 yeah ShadowJK i really only needed to try and identify arm Aug 08 18:07:30 but wanted a sample of potential build environments to see if it was usable Aug 08 18:16:43 hello :) Aug 08 18:16:56 Hi Aug 08 18:17:05 can someone please help me with my n900? Aug 08 18:17:21 i came from the link on wiki Aug 08 18:17:36 What problem are you having? Aug 08 18:18:15 hmm Aug 08 18:18:18 nice weather in hel atm Aug 08 18:18:41 either someone is going crazy with a camera or there is a decent frequency of lightnings Aug 08 18:18:46 i always get this message at startup : Aug 08 18:19:44 ALL TELEPHONY FUNCTIONS, INCLUDING EMERGENCY CALLS, ARE DISABLED DUE TO A COMMUNICATION ERROR Aug 08 18:20:22 To recover, you might have to reboot the device/ Aug 08 18:20:28 nicholas-x, Are you sure your SIM is good - has it worked in your N900 in the past? Aug 08 18:20:51 thank you , but yes, Aug 08 18:20:57 it is ok] Aug 08 18:21:09 i get the same on other sim cards Aug 08 18:21:21 and even without them :( Aug 08 18:21:50 Has it worked properly for you in the past? Aug 08 18:21:58 yes Aug 08 18:22:04 no problems Aug 08 18:22:27 Oh wow, MIT opened up a load of course material Aug 08 18:22:35 Lots of cool stuff there .. Aug 08 18:22:53 Does it behave in exactly the same way whether or not a SIM in installed? Aug 08 18:23:38 now.... yes :( Aug 08 18:23:48 is this important that the last time n900 shut down because my baqttery died? Aug 08 18:24:14 I don't know. Aug 08 18:24:42 nicholas-x, did you try removing the sim and reseating it Aug 08 18:24:54 thank you for trying to help/ :) can you please tell me where can I ask for help? Aug 08 18:25:03 yes Aug 08 18:25:03 i might sound silly, but: Are you sure that the sim card is properly placed ? Aug 08 18:25:12 100% Aug 08 18:25:15 :) Aug 08 18:25:24 do you have another sim ? Aug 08 18:25:31 or another phone Aug 08 18:25:35 Have you inspected the contacts that the SIM card connects to on the phone, to see if there might be dirt or corrosion? Aug 08 18:25:38 nicholas-x, please remove and reseat the sim Aug 08 18:25:44 yes, i tried the all - the same problem Aug 08 18:25:51 Kind of want to learn chinese Aug 08 18:25:51 does it ask for pin when it startsup ? Aug 08 18:26:12 I have my pin turned off Aug 08 18:26:16 oh! Aug 08 18:26:26 i remembered 1 detail Aug 08 18:26:43 settings app crashes when it comes to sim - card Aug 08 18:26:45 :( Aug 08 18:26:53 did you put the sim on another phone ? Aug 08 18:26:58 yes Aug 08 18:27:03 did it work ? Aug 08 18:27:07 it works just fine Aug 08 18:27:12 ^) Aug 08 18:27:36 did you try another sim on n900 ? Aug 08 18:28:02 yes... unfortunately, the problem persists :( Aug 08 18:28:30 nicholas-x, just to appease us, could you shutdown phone, remove battery and sim, resaet it, and then bootup. after bootup, could you run dmesg and paste the console log somewhere if its still being a problem Aug 08 18:28:47 after trying what Ken-Young said, I suggest a reflash just to be sure that nothing in software was damaged. Aug 08 18:29:08 1 moment please. thank you guys for trying to help :) Aug 08 18:29:10 lcuk's comment is also a good one :) Aug 08 18:29:24 dmesg could give nice results Aug 08 18:29:33 or trying installing syslogd Aug 08 18:29:57 btw, can you please send me a link with flashing instructions for n00bs ? Aug 08 18:29:58 v13, its good practice to try and diagnose using tools available without faff Aug 08 18:30:01 i user ubuntu Aug 08 18:30:04 use Aug 08 18:30:13 nicholas-x, continue reading the wiki you are currently on Aug 08 18:30:15 ~flashing Aug 08 18:30:16 somebody said flashing was http://wiki.maemo.org/Updating_the_tablet_firmware Aug 08 18:30:18 all hte info is on there Aug 08 18:30:35 ok . rebooting.... Aug 08 18:30:49 not reboot, shutdown, remove etc Aug 08 18:30:56 yes yes Aug 08 18:30:57 thats important :) Aug 08 18:31:58 thanks :) Aug 08 18:33:21 btw, now my nokia now increased the bootup time twice Aug 08 18:34:14 oh-oh ! Aug 08 18:34:42 what exactly should i copypaste from dmesg Aug 08 18:34:49 everything Aug 08 18:34:52 if possible Aug 08 18:35:04 ok Aug 08 18:35:09 i normally do dmesg >file Aug 08 18:35:26 than use a modern age editor to review Aug 08 18:35:27 please explain to the noob :)] Aug 08 18:35:38 * V13 hands a candy to lcuk for his helpfulness Aug 08 18:35:46 dmesg >/home/user/MyDocs/demesg.logfile Aug 08 18:39:46 i am so sorry for being a n00b Aug 08 18:39:51 lcuk Aug 08 18:40:02 Everyone was once a n00b Aug 08 18:40:08 or is :) Aug 08 18:40:15 plese , where is the >/home/user/MyDocs/demesg.logfile Aug 08 18:40:18 aren't we all ? Aug 08 18:40:26 i connected nokia Aug 08 18:40:43 nicholas-x: If you typed this command in a terminal then you'll have the file "demesg.logfile" under MyDocs. Aug 08 18:40:46 MyDocs is the normal location that is shared when you plug in the USB Aug 08 18:40:52 via usb in mass storage mode Aug 08 18:40:57 That's the file you want to share (i.e. copy-paste its contents) Aug 08 18:43:18 oh Aug 08 18:43:19 <_llll_> you can probably upload it onto a pastebin site Aug 08 18:43:46 there is no mydocs folder though i ran dmesg >file Aug 08 18:43:50 command Aug 08 18:44:08 wow. crowded Aug 08 18:44:57 please, guys , how can i copy from x terminal ? Aug 08 18:45:07 <_llll_> go to apstebin.ca and click upload file Aug 08 18:45:08 don't try this Aug 08 18:45:19 ( i mean the copy ) Aug 08 18:45:50 i cannot find any dmesg file on my nokia :( Aug 08 18:45:59 i ran dmesg >file Aug 08 18:46:06 do you see other files from the MyDocs folder ? Aug 08 18:46:45 <_llll_> type "more file" Aug 08 18:46:52 no. only .documents folder:( Aug 08 18:46:54 ok Aug 08 18:47:42 <_llll_> proably need to do "mv file .documents/" before you can upload it Aug 08 18:47:56 MyDocs is sufficient Aug 08 18:48:09 but if you had a usb cable attached, myDocs wouldn't be mounted... Aug 08 18:48:25 <_llll_> this .documents stuff confused me endlessly Aug 08 18:48:31 i ran more file Aug 08 18:48:32 me too Aug 08 18:48:40 do you have an sd card instaled ? Aug 08 18:48:48 no Aug 08 18:48:55 MyDocs is the user visible root Aug 08 18:49:02 .documents is your 'Documents' folder inside root Aug 08 18:49:14 unless of course your locale isn't English Aug 08 18:49:14 timeless: yes, but it's not possible to only see .documents Aug 08 18:49:17 in which case it's something else Aug 08 18:49:24 ?? Aug 08 18:49:25 <_llll_> except it isnt root in the sense im used to Aug 08 18:49:30 oh forget it Aug 08 18:49:44 * timeless goes off to watch Sahara Aug 08 18:50:21 oh, should i do smth. more than check view hidden files in nautilus? Aug 08 18:50:30 <_llll_> nautilus?? Aug 08 18:50:32 anyway, run this: dmesg > /home/user/MyDocs/dmesg.txt then open a browser from n900 and go to pastebin.ca, then upload the file dmesg.txt Aug 08 18:50:37 um Aug 08 18:50:38 <_llll_> you did run this command on your n900, right? Aug 08 18:50:45 try *not* having your n900 connected via a usb cable Aug 08 18:50:46 rofl Aug 08 18:50:49 things will work a lot better Aug 08 18:50:54 and in the future, pay attention :) Aug 08 18:51:13 <_llll_> or is nautilus what ubuntu users call every single graphical program? Aug 08 18:51:23 heh Aug 08 18:51:33 nautilus is explorer Aug 08 18:51:34 roughly Aug 08 18:51:47 but please take your n900 20' away from your computer Aug 08 18:51:56 ensure it has *ZERO* cables attached Aug 08 18:51:59 and follow directions Aug 08 18:52:01 ok Aug 08 18:52:04 the directions are incredibly simple Aug 08 18:52:06 :) Aug 08 18:52:07 as long as you follow them Aug 08 18:52:12 otherwise, you just piss people off Aug 08 18:53:40 i ran dmesg > /home/user/MyDocs/dmesg.txt Aug 08 18:53:49 cannot create Aug 08 18:53:54 noexistent Aug 08 18:53:57 directory Aug 08 18:54:04 * timeless grumbles Aug 08 18:54:05 in n900 Aug 08 18:54:06 ? Aug 08 18:54:12 you don't have any usb cables attached, right? Aug 08 18:54:13 yes Aug 08 18:54:16 yes Aug 08 18:54:17 and you're using the X Terminal on the n900? Aug 08 18:54:21 yes Aug 08 18:54:26 :( Aug 08 18:54:45 ok.. do this: Aug 08 18:54:51 cd ; cd MyDocs Aug 08 18:54:57 in a terminal in your n900 Aug 08 18:55:03 v13: i think using 'mount' might make more sense Aug 08 18:55:15 odds are it isn't mounted, possibly because it's corrupt or something Aug 08 18:55:16 timeless: He'd have to copy-paste :P Aug 08 18:55:24 ah Aug 08 18:55:24 also mydocs isn't same as MyDocs Aug 08 18:55:25 nah Aug 08 18:55:27 timeless: that's what I thought :) Aug 08 18:55:33 mount|grep fat Aug 08 18:55:37 no c+p required Aug 08 18:55:48 typing | though... Aug 08 18:55:53 lol Aug 08 18:56:01 wait.. i've done cd ; cd MyDocs Aug 08 18:56:01 shadowjk: actually, it should be Aug 08 18:56:10 did it produce any errors? Aug 08 18:56:14 no Aug 08 18:56:16 ok.. Aug 08 18:56:20 :) Aug 08 18:56:22 type: dmesg > dmesg.txt Aug 08 18:56:25 oh, hrm, no, MyDocs and below is vfat Aug 08 18:56:34 hence case insensitive Aug 08 18:56:47 timeless: MyDocs is the mount point.. should be case sensitive Aug 08 18:56:51 yea Aug 08 18:56:55 that was stupid :) Aug 08 18:56:56 timeless, 'MyDocs' directory entry is on ext3 though :) Aug 08 18:56:57 done Aug 08 18:57:06 * timeless blames someone from 6 years ago Aug 08 18:57:18 nicholas-x: ok, now open the browser, go to pastebin.ca and upload the dmesg.txt Aug 08 18:58:01 what is this about anyway, why do you want his dmesg? Aug 08 18:58:12 now i see dmesg ! :) Aug 08 18:58:20 thank you! Aug 08 18:58:22 ShadowJK: he has problems with the sim card that are not related to the sim card itself Aug 08 18:58:34 ShadowJK: see the history Aug 08 18:58:52 yw Aug 08 18:59:26 http://pastebin.ca/1913398 Aug 08 19:02:56 nothing useful there :/ Aug 08 19:03:36 agreed nicholas-x ShadowJK, bah Aug 08 19:03:36 ... :( Aug 08 19:04:02 [ 5.992950] mmci-omap-hs mmci-omap-hs.0: Failed to get debounce clock <-- is this ok ? Aug 08 19:04:03 it did give the message this bootup didn't it? Aug 08 19:04:10 how long did you remove battery for? Aug 08 19:04:24 not this messege Aug 08 19:04:41 for 1 minute and Aug 08 19:04:53 also tried for 3 hours Aug 08 19:04:54 it did not give the "ALL TELEPHONY FUNCTIONS, INCLUDING EMERGENCY CALLS, ARE DISABLED DUE TO A COMMUNICATION ERROR" message this time? Aug 08 19:04:56 the same Aug 08 19:05:07 it DID Aug 08 19:05:17 :( Aug 08 19:05:27 Stskeeps: what do you mean by "at that point" Aug 08 19:05:53 jacekowski: no idea, but either way, u-boot is interesting to have. Aug 08 19:06:26 should i flash my nokia? Aug 08 19:06:30 http://groups.google.com/group/tmoipv6beta <- cool initiative Aug 08 19:06:31 well, nand stuff has to be ported Aug 08 19:06:33 i think he should probably install syslog and see if anything interesting gets logged Aug 08 19:06:43 or bring to the service center Aug 08 19:06:46 ?? Aug 08 19:06:58 nicholas-x, have you changed the area you live in? Aug 08 19:06:59 nicholas-x: i'd generally bring it to service center when seeing a probem like this Aug 08 19:07:11 * ShadowJK too Aug 08 19:07:13 sounds reasonable Stskeeps Aug 08 19:07:34 hmm Aug 08 19:07:35 hmm Aug 08 19:07:38 i did not change :( Aug 08 19:07:41 crap Aug 08 19:07:46 whats the message you get when you downgrade pr1.2 -> pr1.1 or similar? Aug 08 19:07:50 ie incompatible cellmo? Aug 08 19:07:53 where is that article about n900 keyboard i saw on wiki Aug 08 19:08:20 i cannot connect to ovi suite Aug 08 19:08:31 it does not recognise my n900 Aug 08 19:09:02 is it in pc suite mode? Aug 08 19:09:02 that's why i can't downgrade :( Aug 08 19:09:06 yes Aug 08 19:10:16 nicholas-x I can only suggest a reflash, but before this perhaps you could open a thread in t.m.o or send a mail in maemo-developers. Perhaps you'll get more help from there. If you do so, state that you're new to *nix. Aug 08 19:10:23 nicholas-x: what happened? Aug 08 19:10:41 nicholas-x: it's just not detected by ovi suite or it's not connecting via usb at all? Aug 08 19:11:11 hmmm Aug 08 19:11:26 after this problem appeared "ALL TELEPHONY FUNCTIONS, INCLUDING EMERGENCY CALLS, ARE DISABLED DUE TO A COMMUNICATION ERROR Aug 08 19:11:38 ovi suite stopped recognising n900 Aug 08 19:11:50 hmm Aug 08 19:11:54 what did you do to do that? Aug 08 19:11:57 do you have linux on your pc? Aug 08 19:12:01 thank you very much V13 Aug 08 19:12:03 yes Aug 08 19:12:05 ubuntu Aug 08 19:12:11 and windows 7 Aug 08 19:12:13 are you running it now? Aug 08 19:12:23 running ubuntu Aug 08 19:12:26 ok Aug 08 19:12:33 do you have flasher at hand? Aug 08 19:12:38 and have you backed up your data Aug 08 19:13:05 i am sorry i haven't read about flashing yet Aug 08 19:13:15 i would try to flash it Aug 08 19:13:19 what is flasher? Aug 08 19:13:28 program that does all the flashing Aug 08 19:13:36 hmm Aug 08 19:13:41 can you send me a link& Aug 08 19:13:42 can you check if gps is working Aug 08 19:13:45 ~flashing Aug 08 19:13:46 rumour has it, flashing is http://wiki.maemo.org/Updating_the_tablet_firmware Aug 08 19:13:50 check if gps is working Aug 08 19:14:12 pnatd? Aug 08 19:14:19 AT -> OK Aug 08 19:14:26 bug 9391.. Aug 08 19:14:27 Bug https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=9391 Cellular access unavaible with "no access" error but works after reboot Aug 08 19:14:55 heh, people in helsinki area recommended to stay inside during the storm \o/ Aug 08 19:15:02 umm, trivial cellmo segfault or other lockup? Aug 08 19:15:16 DocScrutinizer: well, cellmo has loads of failsafes Aug 08 19:15:18 frals: oh really? Aug 08 19:15:27 you mean trying to get killed by going outside isn't a good idea? Aug 08 19:15:30 * timeless can't imagine why Aug 08 19:15:33 i think it is ok but as far as i now don't have 3g i cannot establi9sh connection Aug 08 19:15:40 DocScrutinizer: cellmo should restart faulted app and or do full reboot Aug 08 19:15:52 * DocScrutinizer shrugs Aug 08 19:15:53 nicholas-x: check if it can get lock Aug 08 19:16:00 *should* is the word Aug 08 19:16:11 nicholas-x: it may take a while without internet Aug 08 19:16:11 there's a way for the modem to get truly wedged Aug 08 19:16:15 well a couple of ways Aug 08 19:16:19 sorry how can i check? Aug 08 19:16:27 start nokia maps or something Aug 08 19:16:47 yeah, outside Aug 08 19:16:49 jacekowski: isn't Maep a better test? Aug 08 19:16:51 :-P Aug 08 19:17:11 and see if after couple minutes in open air you will get that red dot come up in top right corner Aug 08 19:17:12 gpsjinni Aug 08 19:17:36 still sugesting pnatd Aug 08 19:17:49 when i start nokia mmaps my gps sign is croosed Aug 08 19:17:49 yeah, pnatd is a good idea as well Aug 08 19:17:51 ati1 Aug 08 19:17:54 crossed Aug 08 19:17:55 at Aug 08 19:17:58 ati1 Aug 08 19:18:13 AT -> OK Aug 08 19:18:23 ATI1 Aug 08 19:18:44 ATI1 is this for me? Aug 08 19:19:09 yes Aug 08 19:19:16 well, start pnatd Aug 08 19:19:27 , please what is pnatd Aug 08 19:19:32 ?? Aug 08 19:19:34 well, have you tried rebooting first Aug 08 19:19:42 a program Aug 08 19:20:50 rebooting... how to tart pnatd? Aug 08 19:20:56 \start? Aug 08 19:20:58 * DocScrutinizer suspects cellmo update might have gone wrong, or for any other reason modem FW may have suffered unrecoverable error. Reflashing the *cellmo* thing might help Aug 08 19:21:09 nicholas-x: open xterm Aug 08 19:21:16 type 'root' Aug 08 19:21:24 type 'pnatd' Aug 08 19:21:36 type 'ATI1' Aug 08 19:22:23 ok thank you i'll try this , one moment Aug 08 19:22:52 :( Aug 08 19:22:57 root not found Aug 08 19:23:22 i get an error : root : not found Aug 08 19:23:40 no problem Aug 08 19:23:49 should work without root Aug 08 19:24:05 pnatd will give you no reply Aug 08 19:24:19 just type ati1 Aug 08 19:24:41 or ati Aug 08 19:24:45 wait... Aug 08 19:25:08 pipe endpoint allocation : operation not permitted Aug 08 19:25:10 :( Aug 08 19:25:15 ~ $ pnatd Aug 08 19:25:16 at Aug 08 19:25:18 OK Aug 08 19:25:19 ati1 Aug 08 19:25:21 356938030954300 Aug 08 19:25:23 sudo gainroot Aug 08 19:25:38 ~ $ id Aug 08 19:25:40 uid=29999(user) gid=29999(users) Aug 08 19:25:49 ls -la /usr/bin/pnatd Aug 08 19:25:52 usr bin? Aug 08 19:26:03 does it have suid or something Aug 08 19:26:13 my phone is dead at the moment Aug 08 19:26:14 it has afaik Aug 08 19:26:24 emergency charging Aug 08 19:26:34 ~ $ id uid=29999(user) gid=29999(users) Aug 08 19:26:44 i have this Aug 08 19:26:47 after couple hours spent in my pocket with flat battery Aug 08 19:26:54 Nokia-N900-42-11:~# ls -l `which pnatd` Aug 08 19:26:55 -rwsr-sr-x 1 root root 12676 Aug 27 2009 /usr/bin/pnatd Aug 08 19:27:12 hmm, so cellmo is dead Aug 08 19:27:14 ... whar next? please Aug 08 19:27:28 download flasher Aug 08 19:27:28 reflash cellmo Aug 08 19:27:29 what? Aug 08 19:27:30 and fiasco image Aug 08 19:27:35 please Aug 08 19:27:39 ~flasher Aug 08 19:27:40 i heard flasher is http://wiki.maemo.org/Flasher Aug 08 19:27:45 ~flashing Aug 08 19:27:46 somebody said flashing was http://wiki.maemo.org/Updating_the_tablet_firmware Aug 08 19:27:51 download flasher and fiasco image Aug 08 19:28:19 and then flash ? Aug 08 19:29:23 somebody with better knowledge has to walk you thru exact steps to make sure cellmo firmware actually gets flashed Aug 08 19:29:40 can you please explain what cellmo is? Aug 08 19:29:48 cellular modem Aug 08 19:29:53 rapuyama Aug 08 19:29:58 aha.. Aug 08 19:29:59 CMT Aug 08 19:30:04 the GSM part Aug 08 19:30:16 or "the phone" Aug 08 19:30:32 subsystem of your handheld linux computer Aug 08 19:31:10 i live in Ukraine and do not think anyone here can have experience with flashing n900 :( Aug 08 19:31:12 I'd recommend first do a normal rottfs flash, to rule out problems with linux system (if you didn't yet) Aug 08 19:31:33 rootfs even Aug 08 19:31:44 ok.. thank you.. what command should i run? Aug 08 19:31:55 please? Aug 08 19:31:55 see ~flashing Aug 08 19:31:58 download flasher Aug 08 19:32:02 and fiasco image Aug 08 19:32:13 COMBINED image Aug 08 19:32:38 http://wiki.maemo.org/Updating_the_tablet_firmware#Linux Aug 08 19:32:38 anyone used those chinese version of the nokia batteries for the n900?(the 1700-1900mAh) Aug 08 19:33:11 yeah, but nobody survived to report about the great experience X-P Aug 08 19:33:22 ColdFyre: well, these are not really 1700mAh for starters Aug 08 19:33:31 ok... downloadind and installing flasher Aug 08 19:33:31 ColdFyre: and may explode Aug 08 19:33:43 *may* Aug 08 19:33:57 ColdFyre, someone opened one up and found a 1000mAh battery cell inside Aug 08 19:34:14 even a can of Ravioli *may* explode Aug 08 19:34:41 i'll buy one of them from the US then so i can drive there and mug them Aug 08 19:34:47 if it explodes Aug 08 19:34:58 good plan Aug 08 19:35:34 can you please tell me where to download those images? Aug 08 19:35:46 the ineternet Aug 08 19:35:46 Stskeeps: how to guarantee cellmo is going to get reflashed? Aug 08 19:36:11 the ineternet :)))) Aug 08 19:36:59 nicholas-x: read the wiki Aug 08 19:37:03 nicholas-x: you realized on that wiki page all the orange words are actually links to click on? Aug 08 19:37:04 nicholas-x: everything is there Aug 08 19:37:14 ok :) Aug 08 19:38:41 nicholas-x: also carefully read the WHOLE description of procedure, esp don't miss n 3) Aug 08 19:38:50 err 3. Aug 08 19:39:06 what's in 3? Aug 08 19:39:06 err 3.Ensure the battery is fully charged. Aug 08 19:39:29 fuck yeah Aug 08 19:39:31 reboot loop Aug 08 19:45:03 btw, do i loose warranty if i flash n900? Aug 08 19:46:01 nicholas-x: only if you break it while trying to flash it Aug 08 19:46:08 due to your own fault Aug 08 19:46:22 at least that's a limit set by the USA government(s) Aug 08 19:46:27 no idea on internationally.. Aug 08 19:46:40 ok . thank you] Aug 08 19:48:42 nicholas-x: the answer is: No Aug 08 19:49:17 nicholas-x: Nokia is providing software updates, and flashing is one of the means of update, so there is no warranty void clause (unless you kill your device by being stupid, as luke-jr said) Aug 08 19:49:21 thank you crashanddie Aug 08 19:50:06 crashanddie: over here, it's illegal to void warranty unless someone actually does damage to the device ;) Aug 08 19:50:28 that is, maintenance by third parties is protected Aug 08 19:51:22 so as far as i understood i first flash Latest Maemo 5 Global release for Nokia N900 Aug 08 19:51:25 and then Aug 08 19:51:33 Latest Vanilla version of the eMMC content for Nokia N900 Aug 08 19:51:38 correct? Aug 08 19:51:52 no vanilla Aug 08 19:52:01 just combined Aug 08 19:52:24 aka maemo5 global release Aug 08 19:52:36 ok :) thanks Aug 08 19:53:56 will it flash cellmo? Aug 08 19:55:30 I don't think so, but as mentioned above, you need advice of somebody more savvy with respect to that topic Aug 08 19:56:43 tbh I have no clear idea how flasher, NOLO bootloader and modem play that game of updating the cellmo firmware Aug 08 19:57:20 jacekowski should know a little bit more Aug 08 19:57:51 also Stskeeps I guess Aug 08 19:58:18 w00t: thanks Aug 08 19:58:50 timeless: do you know how to force a cellmo reflash? Aug 08 19:59:09 docscrutinizer: more or less Aug 08 19:59:20 but i don't have signatures so i can't cheat Aug 08 19:59:26 :-) Aug 08 19:59:51 timeless: we don't want to cheat, just resurrect a dead modem Aug 08 20:01:09 (just in case reflashing of rootfs doesn't fix it) Aug 08 20:02:14 timeless: so is cellmo version checked and fw updated just in case, when flashing rootfs the usual way? Aug 08 20:02:29 i believe so Aug 08 20:02:35 fine :-) Aug 08 20:02:54 you can of course force things by dissecting the fiasco and only trying to flash the cellmo Aug 08 20:03:11 yup, that's how much I thought Aug 08 20:03:27 i think there's also a way to trick the ssu cellmo flasher into flashing Aug 08 20:03:44 but anyway if it's done unconditionally on flashing rootfs, then we are probably fine with that Aug 08 20:04:01 ShadowJK: sweet, how? Aug 08 20:04:06 DocScrutinizer: nolo is flashing cellmo Aug 08 20:04:25 jacekowski: that's why I said we need to ask you :-D Aug 08 20:04:59 it would be nice if he would have serial connection to phone as well Aug 08 20:05:02 to monitor progress Aug 08 20:05:08 but well Aug 08 20:05:10 hehe, yes Aug 08 20:05:13 someone's greedy Aug 08 20:05:14 full flash should do the job Aug 08 20:05:25 k Aug 08 20:05:39 nicholas-x: how's flashing going? Aug 08 20:05:48 DocScrutinizer, dunno, I saw it in one of the threads on downgrading to 1.1.1 after people flashed the leaked 1.2-pre Aug 08 20:05:49 you can try coldflash Aug 08 20:06:13 yesyes, thought about that as well Aug 08 20:06:53 alas I never followed that whole topic closely, as pre1.2 never was a point on my list Aug 08 20:07:23 cherging my n900 ;) Aug 08 20:07:28 charging Aug 08 20:07:39 ooh, yes - good plan Aug 08 20:07:47 :) Aug 08 20:08:16 switch off the screen (lock it) so it charges a bit faster Aug 08 20:08:41 it's turned off Aug 08 20:08:52 when green idicator LED you're ready to start the flashing adventure Aug 08 20:08:53 btw can you plese tell me Aug 08 20:09:01 ok :) Aug 08 20:09:28 i bought apacer 8 gb microsd for my n900 Aug 08 20:09:34 but Aug 08 20:10:08 ok after looking at that part of nolo Aug 08 20:10:24 when i copy files there I get mistakes in 85% Aug 08 20:10:36 fiasco flash will only flash cmt if nolo thinks that it should be flashed Aug 08 20:10:43 'memory is read-only until fixed Aug 08 20:10:46 like older version or something Aug 08 20:10:53 hmm, then it's a bad card. Return it for a replacement Aug 08 20:11:19 so if cellmo is dead then it should flash it Aug 08 20:11:24 jacekowski: that's what I expected, yes Aug 08 20:11:31 but doing flash with just mcusw firmware Aug 08 20:11:39 will flash it as well Aug 08 20:11:49 ok .. thanks Aug 08 20:11:52 but Aug 08 20:11:57 so try fiasco flash Aug 08 20:11:58 if it fails Aug 08 20:12:09 then well, get it to nokia care Aug 08 20:12:11 i tried other microsd cards and the problem persisited Aug 08 20:12:19 :( Aug 08 20:12:23 have you tried overclocking it? Aug 08 20:12:27 well, let's see what a normal reflash of / incl the phonet libs (or whatever they're called) will result in Aug 08 20:13:02 overlocking my n900? i bought it 2 weeks ago Aug 08 20:13:08 from? Aug 08 20:13:28 nicholas-x: maybe it's a series of poorly built cards. There's quite frequently such things Aug 08 20:13:37 official nokia-approved internet-shop Aug 08 20:14:05 try another brand and other size of card Aug 08 20:14:17 just for test Aug 08 20:14:34 ok . thanks, bro ))) Aug 08 20:14:40 also try the problem card in another reader/system Aug 08 20:15:40 oh, i love linux and my n900 ... but so much problems, questions... Aug 08 20:15:49 xP Aug 08 20:15:58 that just the beggining of your problems Aug 08 20:16:05 I got a 16G card that failed on my Freerunner phone after some 50..100k written, and on my PC after 600k..5M written (or somesuch) Aug 08 20:16:41 well, freerunner was a design failure Aug 08 20:16:42 nicholas-x: (problems, Qs) that's why you are in here - partially - so you can learn Aug 08 20:17:10 it reminds me shower radio i saw some time ago Aug 08 20:17:19 jacekowski: you are a ... err you got a point there Aug 08 20:17:19 so you can hang it on something in shower Aug 08 20:17:24 yes. but i was glad i managed to install LXdE Aug 08 20:17:42 and freerunner look almost the same Aug 08 20:17:45 very impressive device.. hardware :) Aug 08 20:17:49 colours are different but thats all Aug 08 20:18:06 i'm just not sure Aug 08 20:18:10 :) truly open-source (or free) phone Aug 08 20:18:16 that thing on the bottom/top is that a hole? Aug 08 20:18:26 bottom* Aug 08 20:18:34 shower radio and ice hockey puck were the names I gave to all those :-D Aug 08 20:18:56 DocScrutinizer: that hole at bottom of it, is that a real hole? Aug 08 20:19:05 yes Aug 08 20:19:41 more precisely that's where the GSM antenna is located Aug 08 20:19:55 very cute RF design Aug 08 20:20:02 up untill now i was just thinking that it's speaker or something and it just looks like a hole on photos Aug 08 20:20:10 freerunner has USB ! XD Aug 08 20:20:16 oh Aug 08 20:20:38 impressive... Aug 08 20:20:41 yes, full USB hostmode Aug 08 20:21:22 what is the price ?? Aug 08 20:21:28 now? Aug 08 20:21:32 yes Aug 08 20:21:38 some 200+ bucks I think Aug 08 20:22:01 dunno, never bought any :-D Aug 08 20:22:25 but maybe will sell a few eventually Aug 08 20:23:02 ??? silly q, but where do you get 'em? Aug 08 20:23:12 ~ DocScrutinizer Aug 08 20:23:13 from memory, docscrutinizer is jOERG, a HW-developer and engineer of Openmoko Aug 08 20:24:25 :) ... it's an honor to speak with such a clever guy :) Aug 08 20:24:34 nah Aug 08 20:25:03 so, you are the person that designed the hole? Aug 08 20:25:15 ;))))))))))))) Aug 08 20:25:24 +1 Aug 08 20:25:40 nope, that has been done loong before I joined, and EE isn't involved at all in ME Aug 08 20:28:21 i am glad i moved to linux.. only half a year passed but i now cannot live without ubuntu and can't stand windows :) Aug 08 20:28:43 probably this specific design has been done by same guy who designed the first iMacs (the desk lamp shaped ones) Aug 08 20:29:18 have openmoko seen any real designer? Aug 08 20:29:32 how can i update individual packages? Aug 08 20:29:35 i mean exterior design designer Aug 08 20:30:19 like i downloads msn-pecan intregration using app manager, but i need to update it now Aug 08 20:30:49 im not 100% sure its been updated though, so how to check version would be first i guess Aug 08 20:31:23 i am still a noob but as far as i know you get a messege in the status bar as soon as there is an update Aug 08 20:31:41 I'd like to remove the MyDocs partition and resize the home partition to fill the void. Or at least resize both. Anyone know a forum post, blog entry or something somewhere that discusses the best way to do this? Aug 08 20:32:33 removing MyDocs would prolly cause a lot of problems Aug 08 20:32:50 someone mentioned sed'ing the eMMC image to partition it easily Aug 08 20:33:00 why? the folder would still be there.. just on the same partition as the rest of home Aug 08 20:33:11 default_, theres some posts on site:talk.maemo.org which people have adjusted and messed with things Aug 08 20:33:20 Default_ , just interesting, why do you want to delete MyDocs Aug 08 20:33:29 ?? Aug 08 20:33:34 Sick of the 2gig limit Aug 08 20:33:39 you'll need to change rc.S-late so it doesn't try to mount /dev/mmcblk0p1 on MyDocs Aug 08 20:33:43 i have links somewhere, but its sunday night and I have had a beer Aug 08 20:33:51 That bug 1305 is annoying me Aug 08 20:33:52 Bug https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1305 Planet doesn't list the feeds it aggregates anymore Aug 08 20:33:58 default_, sick why? have you filled space? Aug 08 20:34:07 And there is no good reason for me to have it there other than it is already there Aug 08 20:34:07 lcuk, I hit the cap once Aug 08 20:34:10 or twice Aug 08 20:34:15 i wasnt asking you Aug 08 20:34:42 * MohammadAG cries in the corner Aug 08 20:34:56 :P i know you do stuff which fills it Aug 08 20:35:01 lcuk: got about 150mb free in it.. but bug 1305 won't let app installer install anything with that amount free Aug 08 20:35:02 but it is rare tosee someone else Aug 08 20:35:16 are you sure its 1305? Aug 08 20:35:19 bug 1305 Aug 08 20:35:21 no l[ Aug 08 20:35:22 * MohammadAG deleted 20GB of duplicate files on his PC Aug 08 20:35:25 no ;] Aug 08 20:35:38 hmm Aug 08 20:35:41 bug 1305 Aug 08 20:35:50 povbot's dead Aug 08 20:35:51 bug 1 Aug 08 20:35:52 Bug https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1 test - ignore it Aug 08 20:35:57 or it ignores dupes Aug 08 20:36:16 for good reason Aug 08 20:36:28 bug 10305 is the one you mean Aug 08 20:36:30 Bug https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=10305 Application Manager in PR1.2 says not enough space even though there is. Aug 08 20:36:31 sorry.. bug #10305 Aug 08 20:36:44 for x in range [1..100000]; do echo bug $x; done Aug 08 20:36:54 thats the one ;] Aug 08 20:37:04 DocScrutinizer, I'd like to see it ignore that ^ Aug 08 20:37:17 ok default_ if you have experienced this, be specific vote for the bug, and if you can add new info not already in the report, please add it Aug 08 20:37:27 I'd like to see you trying it :-P Aug 08 20:37:33 there are very few people encountering this, and adjusting it generically is a problem Aug 08 20:37:52 so if you find posts and howtos for adjusting, please also add info there Aug 08 20:38:32 * DocScrutinizer nods Aug 08 20:39:16 well.. it sounds like others are curing this bug by reinstalling the mme.. I was thinking if I was going to go to that trouble.. I might as well look into fixing the whole mme problem from the get go. I'd easily have filled that 150mb by now if I could Aug 08 20:39:41 Can't really install many of the larger games with the 2g limit Aug 08 20:39:53 mme? Aug 08 20:40:22 errr.. screweing up my terminology again, am I? Aug 08 20:40:23 150mb? Aug 08 20:40:25 default_, sure but now with the 2g limit been there a long time and only a handful of people have come up against it Aug 08 20:40:34 DocScrutinizer, its almost that yes Aug 08 20:41:24 It seems I meant "eMMC" Aug 08 20:41:38 anyway you lost me Aug 08 20:42:13 Really? I remember reading a lot of reviews before the device complaining about that and the root limit. Aug 08 20:42:20 * lcuk remembers the amiga variable allocation RAM drive and smiles Aug 08 20:42:33 is this about filling up /home now, or about free space in / ? Aug 08 20:42:35 default_, root limit and 2gb home are actually 2 different problems Aug 08 20:42:41 But basically blowing it off out of expectation it would be easy to fix since we're talking about debian Aug 08 20:42:51 related yes, but totally different Aug 08 20:43:29 well... yes and no. The cause similar problems but one is a hardware limit and the other is a design limit Aug 08 20:43:34 The=They Aug 08 20:43:57 default_, nobody is blowing anything off, the remaining space on the eMMC is mounted and unmounted at various times, for data thats used as the operating system its not quite a straight forward thing Aug 08 20:44:37 I fail to see how you can fill up 2GB by just usual usage patterns Aug 08 20:44:46 i did Aug 08 20:44:48 quite easily Aug 08 20:44:50 I was referring to the reviewers I had read last year when remarking upon those limits in their reviews.. I apologize for using an overly strong term Aug 08 20:44:52 DocScrutinizer, some games are 200mb+ each Aug 08 20:44:59 eew Aug 08 20:45:00 yep Aug 08 20:45:02 yes, silly Aug 08 20:45:05 but thats it Aug 08 20:45:06 so anyways, to update packages manually, should i just use apt-get? Aug 08 20:45:12 i prefer having device for data Aug 08 20:45:21 data == porn? Aug 08 20:45:27 Nobody has ever described me as being "usual" Aug 08 20:45:43 * DocScrutinizer waves Aug 08 20:45:55 jacekowski, :| Aug 08 20:46:02 But then, if you install a lot of the software available, it is easy to fill 2g Aug 08 20:46:11 But why are we debating this? Aug 08 20:46:23 2gb is easily filled Aug 08 20:46:24 * lcuk is finally glad that this is now the problem and that rootfs no longer fills by default Aug 08 20:46:40 i suppose, gui resize for that 2g partition would be killer app Aug 08 20:46:45 default_, go finding mechanisms to change on the fly then Aug 08 20:46:46 please Aug 08 20:46:50 :) Aug 08 20:47:00 it's simple to resize it Aug 08 20:47:29 I hope nobody thinks I am suggesting that the device should have been sold as I want it... That is certainly not what I am saying. I don't intend on pushing my ideals on others Aug 08 20:47:46 would there be any way to make a percent battery indicater? Aug 08 20:47:48 well, resize is simple Aug 08 20:48:03 default_, I think you are in an ideal position to do the investigation - purely because you need it for your use case Aug 08 20:48:03 jace: you have unmount partitions to resize them Aug 08 20:48:04 delete MyDocs partition Aug 08 20:48:12 default_: nope Aug 08 20:48:13 adding the info onto the specific bug about it is the right thing to do Aug 08 20:48:19 no? Aug 08 20:48:22 no Aug 08 20:48:30 you can update partition table Aug 08 20:48:32 reboot Aug 08 20:48:38 so system will reread it Aug 08 20:48:48 because you can't force reread if it's in use Aug 08 20:48:50 lcuk: I think the other posts on that bug cover all of the angles that I have experienced Aug 08 20:48:53 and then resize filesystem Aug 08 20:49:06 and filesystem resize can be done online with ext Aug 08 20:49:08 ext3 Aug 08 20:49:12 i think Aug 08 20:49:22 i'm not really sure about ext3 Aug 08 20:49:30 i know it was possible with ext2 Aug 08 20:49:39 default_, sure - I see people iwth the issue Aug 08 20:51:37 I hadn't heard that before.. at any rate I'm fine with temporarily booting into a partition on the microSD and then resizing.. but it would be ideal to find someone who has already done it Aug 08 20:53:59 Thanks for the help everyone Aug 08 20:55:13 SpeedEvil has resized his home and mydocs iirc Aug 08 20:57:27 my n900 is redy for flashing :) Aug 08 20:57:40 charged ] Aug 08 20:57:46 ready Aug 08 20:58:21 set Aug 08 20:58:22 go! Aug 08 21:01:36 can someone explain what happens when the battery dies Aug 08 21:01:50 mc_teo`: It goes blibly-boop. Aug 08 21:01:51 git goes to heaven Aug 08 21:01:55 -g damn Aug 08 21:02:24 mc_teo`: DSME tells BME to shutdown. It pops up the banner 'recharge battery' then shuts down. Aug 08 21:02:35 it moans a few times beforehand Aug 08 21:02:38 then has a final wail Aug 08 21:02:59 does it not like save a state when battey is like 1% and then load this state on boot? Aug 08 21:03:02 it should Aug 08 21:03:09 imho Aug 08 21:03:58 mc_teo`, install a framebuffer kernel Aug 08 21:04:02 you'll see it does Aug 08 21:04:12 DSME shuts down the device at bootup Aug 08 21:05:02 ? Aug 08 21:05:15 why would i want the device to shutdown at bootup Aug 08 21:05:32 cause the batt's empty? Aug 08 21:06:21 ~seen Jaffa Aug 08 21:06:23 jaffa is currently on #maemo #meego. Has said a total of 75 messages. Is idling for 2h 36m 8s, last said: '~flashing'. Aug 08 21:07:00 [NITdroid question] I cannot get bootloader to work correctly. It only shows an empty entry (which defaults to Maemo it seems) , how I'm going to boot NITdroid with it? Aug 08 21:08:44 Aranel, #nitdroid Aug 08 21:08:52 actually Aug 08 21:08:55 Aranel, #nitdroid-help Aug 08 21:09:35 achipa, according to that, jaffa has been flashing for hte last 2 hours Aug 08 21:09:40 thanks but It seems they're asleep =) Aug 08 21:09:44 it is entirely feasible he has been arrested Aug 08 21:09:55 lcuk: doesn't sound good, eh ? :) Aug 08 21:10:06 heh not really Aug 08 21:20:21 nite all, sweet dreams Aug 08 21:26:00 Flashing cmt-mcusw... Sending request 0x50 failed! Aug 08 21:26:00 Bootloader error log follows: Aug 08 21:26:00 ERROR: Invalid argument for 'cmt' Aug 08 21:26:00 ERROR: Error processing request, stalling Aug 08 21:26:00 ERROR: EP0 STALL sent Aug 08 21:26:00 ERROR: Algo didn't wake up Aug 08 21:26:02 ERROR: Error processing request, stalling Aug 08 21:26:04 ERROR: EP0 STALL sent Aug 08 21:26:06 ERROR: Premature end of control transfer Aug 08 21:26:18 please i need help Aug 08 21:26:31 what have i done wrong? Aug 08 21:31:24 achipa: pong Aug 08 21:31:30 lcuk: Was just watching Sherlock Aug 08 21:31:59 Jaffa: I hope reflashing did not take Sherlockian (is that a word?) methods Aug 08 21:32:08 people! please help! Aug 08 21:32:27 Jaffa: anyway, I think I got kisstester where I wanted to regarding base look/function Aug 08 21:32:30 achipa: Once I eliminated the impossible, whatever remained - no matter how unlikely - must be true Aug 08 21:32:52 Jaffa: or, in plain English, "I take patches" is now officially in effect Aug 08 21:32:52 achipa: Cool. See my earlier stuff about "Recently installed" (or whatever it's called now) not working for me? Aug 08 21:33:07 did you check the very latest (as in 30 min ago ?) Aug 08 21:33:12 achipa: No Aug 08 21:33:14 * Jaffa does so Aug 08 21:37:19 achipa: "Already installed" is including some packages, such as Scout, 9x9-sudoku, Blue Sky Theme, Neon Theme that I don't have installed Aug 08 21:37:50 Jaffa: or you THINK you don't have them installed (twilight zone theme playing in background) Aug 08 21:39:15 but granted, you might have stumbled upon a bug on how I parse dpkg output Aug 08 21:39:33 achipa: achipa Don't have them installed: http://pastebin.com/ZrefcJ1n Aug 08 21:39:43 (not sure if that is the right way to go about finding installed packages anyway) Aug 08 21:39:50 achipa: The bug wasn't there earlier Aug 08 21:40:11 achipa: Simplest way: ls /var/lib/dpkg/*.list Aug 08 21:40:28 Jaffa: that does not include versions Aug 08 21:40:44 achipa: Ah, true. Aug 08 21:41:19 achipa: Just doing dpkg -l and then manually parsing/grepping /var/lib/apt/lists/*_Packages? Aug 08 21:41:55 achipa: Although dpkg -l truncates, I'm sure there's a way of getting it better Aug 08 21:42:17 jaffa prolly via some dpkg-query stuff Aug 08 21:42:49 * DocScrutinizer51 wonders what happened to nicholas-x Aug 08 21:43:25 achipa: dpkg -l just reads /var/lib/dpkg/status. That looks quickest Aug 08 21:43:26 also what happened to his modem Aug 08 21:45:19 It detonated, He hasn't been back. Aug 08 21:45:24 Jaffa: hah, I think I got it, dpkg-query -W Aug 08 21:45:48 achipa: Perfect Aug 08 21:46:27 Jaffa: any other observations ? Aug 08 21:46:46 hey Jaffa Aug 08 21:47:35 achipa: Does it indicate with green if something's promotable or only red/green depending on your vote? Aug 08 21:47:38 lbt: hey! Aug 08 21:48:22 anyway seems dead (the modem) Aug 08 21:48:28 Jaffa: border color indicates your vote, text color indicates unlock status Aug 08 21:49:04 achipa: Ah, cool. Taking into account timescales as well as votes? (And super-testers?) Presumably you go off status in maemo.org/packages? Aug 08 21:49:12 Jaffa: did you get my note earlier.... just wanted to give you an update for mwn Aug 08 21:49:19 anyway seems dead (the modem) Aug 08 21:50:15 hmm... my desktop must have gone down... Aug 08 21:50:18 lbt: No, I didn't Aug 08 21:50:19 and back :) Aug 08 21:50:28 hi channel Aug 08 21:50:38 we have installed OBS on the OSU boxes Aug 08 21:50:38 Jaffa: timescales ? I just scrape, don't try to think too much, kiss principle and all :) Aug 08 21:50:52 achipa: i.e. 10 days quarantine Aug 08 21:50:57 tons of disk and fair amount of CPU Aug 08 21:50:58 after updating kernel-power, my n900 has a reboot cycle (it does not pass nokia screen) Aug 08 21:51:01 lbt: oh yeah, cool Aug 08 21:51:18 is there any way to fix it ? i tried reflashing following the wiki article, but no luck Aug 08 21:51:25 I thikn X-Fade and I are waiting for an audit and we need to see what sSO is available Aug 08 21:51:43 you saw the small rucus that that bug raised? Aug 08 21:51:48 Yup Aug 08 21:51:57 worth mentioning I think Aug 08 21:52:01 Wondering if to link to that with a "bah, humbug" Aug 08 21:52:10 Jaffa: umm... no ? not sure what/why would I include that ? Aug 08 21:52:13 although I think the result will be favourable Aug 08 21:52:27 I'd like that nailed by the community people ASAP Aug 08 21:52:40 obcecado: what exactly does no luck mean ? reflash went through but still reboots or could not reflash ? Aug 08 21:52:42 it didn't get the attention last time around... Aug 08 21:52:51 it does not flash Aug 08 21:52:56 achipa: "Unlock status" - if I wanted to use the colour to know whether or not to further test, I would prioritise things which hadn't already been unlocked (or were going to be) Aug 08 21:53:01 the flasher keeps waiting for device Aug 08 21:53:20 but I think the +ve thing is that we're really making steps on the OBS/autobuilder for fremantle/meego and, one expects, harmattan Aug 08 21:53:27 Jaffa: err... that's the green text color Aug 08 21:53:40 OK .. bed now... up in 6.5 hrs Aug 08 21:53:45 night all Aug 08 21:53:47 Jaffa: (after X-Fade's style of writing karma with green for unlocked packages) Aug 08 21:53:52 night Aug 08 21:53:54 night Aug 08 21:54:13 so, no ideas on what else i could do ? Aug 08 21:54:19 achipa: OK, to be sure: what do you mean by "unlocked", promotable by the maintainer OR will be promotable by the maintainer once the quarantine expires? Aug 08 21:54:29 besides taking the device to a nokia support centre Aug 08 21:54:37 Jaffa: the former Aug 08 21:55:06 achipa: OK, and my point - partially - is that perhaps some indication for the latter (apart from reading the number) could be useful Aug 08 21:55:19 achipa: But mostly I just wanted to understand without reading the code Aug 08 21:56:10 obcecado: make sure you turned it off Aug 08 21:56:32 obcecado: and then started the flasher, so it waits for you to turn on the device Aug 08 21:57:19 Jaffa: aha, well, did not want to include too much logic that is not ever certain to have been implemented by niels the same way :) Aug 08 21:57:43 Good evening Aug 08 21:58:23 obcecado: pull battery if you can't stop it looping/turning on Aug 08 22:00:24 should i expect some output when it starts flashing ? Aug 08 22:00:40 obcecado: the flasher should say it's flashing Aug 08 22:00:54 obcecado: though it's fairly quick Aug 08 22:04:59 sometimes my n900 shows no signal, but when I shutdown and power on again, the signal appears. is there any way so solve this or it is a problem in my mobile company? Aug 08 22:05:34 achipa: True Aug 08 22:05:34 same problem astruasdh Aug 08 22:05:42 I suspect dirty SIM contacts Aug 08 22:05:46 no good achipa Aug 08 22:05:51 it does not start flashing Aug 08 22:06:40 SpeedEvil, I had "no sim card" symbol, but I solves it putting a piece of paper netween sim card holder and the battery Aug 08 22:06:49 obcecado: does it say any error or ? make sure you're root Aug 08 22:07:38 im running it from windows 64bit (using the boot method to use non signed drivers) Aug 08 22:08:07 as it refuses to run on my fedora Aug 08 22:08:44 obcecado: umm... not sure about windows... Aug 08 22:09:44 well, time to build a liveusb with persistent mode to run that flasher from debian... Aug 08 22:10:56 astruasdh: make sure you properly lock the simcard holder Aug 08 22:12:44 hmmm ok, I'll do that, but I think it is ok Aug 08 22:14:55 obcecado: exactly Aug 08 22:15:51 obcecado: then connect cable to PC, remove battery from N900, start flasher, connect cable to N900, insert battery to n900 while holding U key Aug 08 22:19:29 though, tbh, I don't see why holding 'u' could ever be flawed by borked kernel or rootfs, as this detection is done by NOLO bootloader, so holding down 'u' prior to powering up should do the trick each day. But there's one gotcha and that's discharged battery. Device doesn't charge when bootlooping, and flashing on flat battery is *known* to fail Aug 08 22:20:02 Jaffa: hm.... what if you HAD that version installed but have uninstalled it in the meantime ? I'm inclined to show that, too... Aug 08 22:21:47 NEW MAMEO FUTURE RELATED: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OBB8zTdY4NU Aug 08 22:21:49 ;) Aug 08 22:22:52 DocScrutinizer: i also tried that Aug 08 22:23:57 Jaffa: btw fix for your phantom packages pushed Aug 08 22:24:01 obcecado: yeah, but under windoze aiui Aug 08 22:26:44 ~seen Cazzzzzzzzzzzo21 Aug 08 22:26:45 cazzzzzzzzzzzo21 <~USCHostin@bas3-toronto01-1177778342.dsl.bell.ca> was last seen on IRC in channel #maemo, 4m 56s ago, saying: ';)'. Aug 08 22:27:30 id... :-/ Aug 08 22:27:31 haha wtf Aug 08 22:29:40 sometimes I wish I was a freenode admin Aug 08 22:29:57 most of the time I'm happy I'm not Aug 08 22:32:07 anyway "there's no way to delay / that trouble coming every day" :-) Aug 08 22:34:41 though, tbh, I don't see why holding 'u' could ever be flawed by borked kernel or rootfs, as this detection is done by NOLO bootloader, so holding down 'u' prior to powering up should do the trick each day. But there's one gotcha and that's discharged battery. Device doesn't charge when bootlooping, and flashing on flat battery is *known* to fail Aug 08 22:34:59 pressing u just forces the device to go into flashing mode, it doesn't need to be done Aug 08 22:35:10 just execute + connect N900 Aug 08 22:35:10 MohammadAG: I know what I've posted Aug 08 22:35:13 * ieatlint holds u Aug 08 22:35:14 MohammadAG: huh? really? Aug 08 22:35:14 :o Aug 08 22:35:28 ieatlint: uuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuu Aug 08 22:35:32 NO U Aug 08 22:35:33 anyways Aug 08 22:35:40 deja vu about this flashing while battery dead Aug 08 22:35:41 :o Aug 08 22:35:47 me... Aug 08 22:35:47 2nd, I flashed with the solid yellow light on today, and it was a success Aug 08 22:36:20 MohammadAG: I can do that! just stop bme :-P Aug 08 22:36:52 we need a "c" for charge Aug 08 22:36:59 honestly, NOLO should probably always reset solid yellow Aug 08 22:37:51 so if you managed to get NOLO on screen while still yellow solid, there's really something weird going on Aug 08 22:38:15 and if you managed to flash without NOLO on screen, then even more Aug 08 22:39:38 solid yellow doesn't mean battery is particularly low, it just means no working system has managed yet to reset the bq24150 Aug 08 22:42:18 brother, I got weird ideas... Aug 08 22:44:21 system can be bootloadered (i.e. real boot meaning NOLO is starting) by 3 means: powerbutton, RTC alarm, and VBUS 5V detection. I'm wondering what's going to happen when you power down the system while bq24150 still in boost mode, so the device itself will supply the VBUS 5V Aug 08 22:50:19 MohammadAG: (pressing 'u') of course pressing/holding 'u' isn't exactly mandatory, but it's a nice help to stop system from running into bootloop, esp when you got problems with connectivity to flashing PC Aug 08 22:51:29 kerio: try it, maybe NOLO has such function since 770 Aug 08 22:51:45 honestly, NOLO should probably always reset solid yellow Aug 08 22:51:47 it didn't Aug 08 22:52:08 weird Aug 08 22:52:16 * timeless doesn't remember the 770 having a keyboard :) Aug 08 22:52:23 lol Aug 08 22:52:29 good point Aug 08 22:52:47 DocScrutinizer, you could try it out for yourself Aug 08 22:52:54 but it involves dd'ing /dev/mtd5 Aug 08 22:53:03 where's the fun in that? Aug 08 22:53:11 it sounds like risk+pain Aug 08 22:53:14 kernel panics -> nothing to reset chip Aug 08 22:53:16 anyway see http://wiki.maemo.org/N900_Hardware_Subsystems#Keyboard Aug 08 22:53:28 2: U has its own row Aug 08 22:53:32 timeless, risk+pain=fun Aug 08 22:53:37 k, maybe not Aug 08 22:53:43 masochist Aug 08 22:54:04 ~stab MohammadAG Aug 08 22:54:05 * infobot runs at MohammadAG with an origami Swiss Army knife, and inflicts a nasty paper cut. Aug 08 22:54:27 <_trine> risk+pain=disaster Aug 08 22:55:18 <_trine> risk+nopain=fun Aug 08 22:56:40 sw ep6 :) Aug 08 22:56:49 * timeless seems to recall seeing ep5 this morning Aug 08 22:58:40 * DocScrutinizer pokes jacekowski about other special keys tested in NOLO Aug 08 23:18:35 * MohammadAG51 pokes channel Aug 08 23:18:54 * SpeedEvil pokes back. Aug 08 23:19:00 * SpeedEvil stabs his shitty internet. Aug 08 23:19:20 * MohammadAG51 stabs it again, just to be sure Aug 08 23:26:31 * lpotter points out the internet has 7 heads Aug 09 01:17:47 well. fmms seems to get the job done as far as pics go Aug 09 01:19:27 people still sell n810s for $250? Aug 09 01:19:28 wow Aug 09 01:40:12 heh, I paid 240EUR Aug 09 01:40:33 for the spare Aug 09 01:43:49 Does anyone (here) know if the N900 is still being manufactured? Aug 09 01:44:16 Ken-Young: well - it's still being sold. Aug 09 01:44:34 Ken-Young: It's moderately unlikely they'd have huge stocks. Aug 09 01:44:53 SpeedEvil, yeah, I want to buy one more before stocks dwindle, but I don't know if I should be in a hurry yet. Aug 09 01:45:18 I really doubt it. Aug 09 01:45:45 SpeedEvil, You doubt they're still being manufactured? Aug 09 01:47:41 Oh, sorry - I misunderstood. Aug 09 01:49:07 hya guys..i searched alot but just cant find the info..where do i need to put my aliases? .profile dosent seem to work Aug 09 01:50:42 zeltak, .profile works for me. Aug 09 01:51:21 zeltak, Are you using xterm? Aug 09 01:51:41 Ken-Young: yeah..the default terminal that came with maemo Aug 09 01:52:06 zeltak, Which directory did you put .profile in? Aug 09 01:52:28 Ken-Young: home/user/.profile Aug 09 01:53:05 zeltak, home/user/.profile or /home/user/.profile ? Aug 09 01:53:23 /home/user/profile Aug 09 01:53:32 sorry about the mistype :) Aug 09 01:53:53 here is the current file : http://paste.xinu.at/e1S/ Aug 09 01:54:18 zeltak, Who's the owner, and what are the file permissions on .profile ? Aug 09 01:54:52 me Aug 09 01:55:18 ahh i see the owner is root Aug 09 01:55:36 wierd it dosent work also in ssh (when i log in as root) Aug 09 01:55:38 zeltak, Try making it user. Aug 09 01:55:46 k trying it now Ken-Young Aug 09 01:58:24 yup workon the n900..wonder why it dosent work with ssh when i log as root..i have alos the same file in /root/.profile Aug 09 02:03:26 hm Aug 09 02:03:31 application manager seems screwed Aug 09 02:03:54 trying to install nitdroid Aug 09 02:09:41 say anyone else having problems with usb connection under linux (where it takes a few tries to get it working in usb mass storage mode)? Aug 09 02:40:55 zeltak, i've always used sd card or wifi Aug 09 02:42:27 blah Aug 09 02:42:47 zel: sorry.. I don't use it often (about 2 times a month) .. but have not had that problem as of earlier today **** ENDING LOGGING AT Mon Aug 09 02:59:57 2010