**** BEGIN LOGGING AT Fri Aug 13 02:59:57 2010 Aug 13 03:04:59 its a damn shame the conference in november will be called meego and not maemo dont ya agree? Aug 13 03:05:59 Don't worry - it'll be called something else next year. Aug 13 03:06:21 Ken-Young: exactly Aug 13 03:06:47 My guess: "moobiboobi" Aug 13 03:07:10 or... "nogomeego" Aug 13 03:08:12 hi Aug 13 03:08:18 good luck attracting developers.....silly names dont help Aug 13 03:08:33 Too late to worry about that. Aug 13 03:09:28 well, just when i thought i had fixed the issue the damn thing fights back, at first jsut renaming .mozilla to mozilla (sans dot) fixed the issue, but now the .mozilla folder is being recreated automaticly each time i strt microB and the inifinite refreshing is back Dx Aug 13 03:09:51 start* Aug 13 03:10:14 is firefox worth installing? Aug 13 03:10:22 on n900 i mean Aug 13 03:10:37 It does some things a little bit better. Aug 13 03:10:41 it depends on what you need it for Aug 13 03:10:51 any idea how i can get this fixed ? Aug 13 03:11:02 what is it better at than the stock browser? Aug 13 03:11:49 N900dude, As a trivial example, the stock browser does not work well with the google translate page - you must type each character twice. No such problem with Firefox. Aug 13 03:12:05 i see Aug 13 03:12:31 My guess is you'll find some things work better with one browser, some with the other, so it's worth having both. Aug 13 03:12:36 man theres a lotta negative people over at talk.maemo.org Aug 13 03:13:19 the stuff about "Nokia abandoned us" and "iPhone does it better" ? Aug 13 03:13:51 that too... and people getting rid of their n900s Aug 13 03:14:05 what reasons are they giving? Aug 13 03:14:39 nokia abandonig it for another os....they have a point Aug 13 03:15:30 that's silly ... it won't stop working just because Nokia would abandon it (which I doubt) Aug 13 03:15:52 no but meego isnt meant for n900.... Aug 13 03:16:56 N900dude, I suspect a pretty fully functional Meego will be available for the N900. It just won't be official. Aug 13 03:17:27 isn't it already? what's http://maemoarena.com/2010/03/meego-now-available-for-download-for-nokia-n900/ ??? Aug 13 03:17:52 * lpotter wonders why some people cant fathom "reference device" Aug 13 03:18:02 yes but wont the n900 be underpowered? somebody mentioned meego requires higher specs and capacitive screen amongst other things? Aug 13 03:18:10 mcepl, Well, I mean a Meego that actually works as a phone, not just a developer-only version with little functionality. Aug 13 03:19:33 you think a reference platform is not going to work as a phone? Aug 13 03:20:11 lpotter, I think it eventually wiil, but it doesn't yet, does it? Aug 13 03:20:12 Stskeeps, you around/awake? Aug 13 03:20:24 s/wiil/will/ Aug 13 03:20:25 Ken-Young meant: lpotter, I think it eventually will, but it doesn't yet, does it? Aug 13 03:20:26 it does kinda feels like the N900 is in a limbo between the old tablets and the upcoming meego devices thuogh Aug 13 03:20:28 doesnt mean it wont ever Aug 13 03:20:38 too bad about the name change....kills continuity and stability Aug 13 03:21:04 I agree. I just wanted to make sure I wasn't wrong in my belief that it is not yet usable as a phone. Aug 13 03:21:04 i don't like "Meego" Aug 13 03:23:10 Why don't they release an update for Maemo5 renaming it Meego0 or somthing? Aug 13 03:23:21 'meego' is better than 'maemo', IMHO Aug 13 03:23:23 that would help a little bit, no? Aug 13 03:24:02 For me, Meego sounds childish and gooey, while Maemo sounds velvety and sexy Aug 13 03:24:20 its spilled milk now so it doesn matter....next year they will call it "beegoboobo" Aug 13 03:24:26 lol Aug 13 03:24:49 i wish i was aware of what was going on back when they were thinking baout gettign a new name Aug 13 03:25:09 so much negativity now in this once vibrant community....too bad Aug 13 03:25:45 i remember when people were excited about maemo Aug 13 03:25:49 Ken-Young: did anybody see ANY Meego phone yet? well, actually, any Meego device? then it's kind of mood issue, isn't it? Besides, with new CEO there is always hope that they will get their acts together Aug 13 03:26:00 N900dude, A lot of people are still positive, I think. I'd like to believe I'm one of them. I'm very happy with my N900, and still badgering friends to get one. Aug 13 03:26:32 besides, I have been using Linux for years as my only platform, so I don't require and expect much ;) Aug 13 03:26:34 if i symlink .mozilla to mozilla would that fix the bug i'm having? (i'm not all that informed about how these things work) Aug 13 03:26:34 mcepl, I'm pretty sure no Meego device has even been officially anounced yet. Aug 13 03:26:37 i love my n900 too... just seems like an unwanted child for nokia Aug 13 03:27:58 whatever it is, it's gonna be the sucessor of the N900 Aug 13 03:28:55 It's my understanding that the N900 will be the last and only phone officially running Maemo Aug 13 03:28:58 well, nokia is working on n900 update Aug 13 03:29:04 i dont believe in this whole "just focus on qt" talk Aug 13 03:29:18 and there was even a codedrop for meego on n900 Aug 13 03:29:43 so how anyone can think that is abandonding the n900, I'll never know Aug 13 03:30:23 lpotter: proper updates and os release Aug 13 03:30:28 N900dude, I think Nokia has only two options - make Qt everywhere work, or jump on the Android bandwagon. Aug 13 03:30:54 Ken-Young: agreed Aug 13 03:30:55 android, schmandroid Aug 13 03:31:14 lpotter: linux, schminux Aug 13 03:31:21 symbian is on more phones than everyone else combined Aug 13 03:31:58 lpotter, I've got an ANdroid phone - there's a lot of really neat stuff available for it that I don't even in my wildest fantasy believe will appear on my N900. Aug 13 03:31:59 Android is too closed Aug 13 03:32:13 lpotter: true but what does it mean? series 40 is on a lotta phones too....so what? Aug 13 03:32:47 why would nokia go with android when they already sell the most phones? Aug 13 03:32:56 With my Android phone, I can speak English into it, and it will speak the French version of what I said. I know enough French to know the translation isn't bad. It's very cool. Aug 13 03:32:59 or, rather why would nokia _need_ to Aug 13 03:33:10 most people dont give a flying rat's ass if it's open or closed os....why should they? Aug 13 03:33:22 N900dude, Exactly Aug 13 03:33:56 i want an os that works.... i dont care what some linux geeks think Aug 13 03:34:54 what nobody really sees or takes into account is what operators want. do you think they want apple and google in control? Aug 13 03:35:25 lpotter: trust me, operators want apple... not meego Aug 13 03:35:29 N900dude, I'm happy with how my N900 works. I do care that it is linux. I love being able to run Python easily, not having to jailbreak for anything. But the Openmoko + Nokia track record on making a really consumer-ready linux phone is not good. Aug 13 03:36:29 lpotter, THe operators want VERY closed systems. Maemo/Meego is the oposite of what they want. Aug 13 03:36:49 no, they want colsed systems that _they_ control. Aug 13 03:37:11 they want to brand there stuff Aug 13 03:37:23 dont really get that with android or ios Aug 13 03:37:29 lpotter, But even a closed system they don't control is better for them than a truly open system. Aug 13 03:41:16 yo dont think nokia knows what operators want? do yo think they would go all open source if it scared operators away? Aug 13 03:41:55 At this point, I don't think Nokia knows what Nokia wants. Aug 13 03:42:30 Ken-Young: agreed Aug 13 03:43:15 having 4 different os dont help...(pls spare me the qt talk) Aug 13 03:45:08 why do you think that? I dont see apple selling any medium or lower tier phones at all. Aug 13 03:45:35 i was talking to a developer who recently went to nokia's developer conference in London UK and he left there underwhelmed.....the feeling is for any significant apps they will still have to written in native language....qt isnt the messiah nokia says it is Aug 13 03:46:12 what makes qt non native? Aug 13 03:46:32 qt is nice and all but... Aug 13 03:47:00 for primitive stuff yes Aug 13 03:47:32 primitve.. eh? Aug 13 03:47:43 imho Aug 13 03:47:44 lpotter, I'm certain that you know much more about the industry than I do. So you're probably right, and I'm probaly wrong. But isn't a closed OS, like ios, preferable to carries than an open OS, because there is an entity in charge of ios? If they decide they simply can't support tethering, for example, they can tell Apple that's a deal-breaker for them, they won't carry the phone if Apple allows tethering, and there's at l Aug 13 03:47:44 east a chance they will get what they want. How do they do something like that with an open OS? Aug 13 03:47:45 you call mobility API primitive? Aug 13 03:48:38 lpotter: we can dig deep if you want... what im saying is the developers arent totally sold on this Aug 13 03:48:48 Ken-Young: just because something is open does not mean they cannot make it into what they need Aug 13 03:49:21 lpotter, But it makes it harder to prevent consumers from making it into what *they* want. Aug 13 03:49:35 no it doesnt Aug 13 03:49:46 how hard is it to jailbreak an iphone? Aug 13 03:50:00 It's a constatn cat-and-mouse game. Aug 13 03:50:16 and have you ever heard of anything like that on a symbian device? Aug 13 03:50:44 I know nothing about Symbian, I'm sorry to say. Aug 13 03:50:53 there was the signed apps only fiasco.... Aug 13 03:51:04 I think most people on maemo talk are just pissed that nokia is now pushing Qt and not gtk Aug 13 03:51:09 symbian is yesterday's news Aug 13 03:51:21 thats what you think Aug 13 03:51:26 lpotter: lol? Aug 13 03:51:33 GTK sucks. it's about time Nokia got rid of it Aug 13 03:51:35 lpotter, I'm not pissed about that. I think the Qt-only approach has a chance. Aug 13 03:51:36 symbian still seels more phones that anyother Aug 13 03:51:41 Nokia says the Symbian^* is still a significant player Aug 13 03:51:50 TiagoTiago: only for phones… Aug 13 03:51:51 sells that is Aug 13 03:51:59 and MeeGo isn't targetting phones afaik Aug 13 03:52:03 lpotter: no....this is what nokia thinks....N8 is the last nseries device Aug 13 03:52:10 so Aug 13 03:52:19 I'll have to convert some code of mine to Qt, but I'll be happy to do that if Nokia produces a consumer-ready device as open as the N900. Aug 13 03:52:22 thats not nokia last symbian phone Aug 13 03:52:31 Ken-Young: carriers will adore open systems as it allows them to customize without help of the original equipment manuf Aug 13 03:52:38 i've been hoping they will launch another one called NX (pronounced "Next") Aug 13 03:52:39 lpotter: wanna wager? Aug 13 03:52:51 N900dude: youd loose Aug 13 03:53:14 I like the pun there, X for ten and pronouncing it Next Aug 13 03:53:19 lpotter: whatever....forget symbian....lets talk whats important Aug 13 03:53:29 Ken-Young: and why would a carrier disallow their customers to make a phone into what they wnat? Aug 13 03:53:45 for loss of revenue Aug 13 03:53:55 there's no such loss of revenue Aug 13 03:54:01 DocScrutinizer, Is that a serious question? DO carriers want phone running bit torrent? Aug 13 03:54:16 sure Aug 13 03:54:18 you think carries want you to make voip calls? dont be naive please Aug 13 03:54:33 imagine the data bills for heavy torrent uses Aug 13 03:54:55 they'll love you exceeding your max allowable data transfer then charge you so they smile like a clam Aug 13 03:55:09 I'm not naive Aug 13 03:55:13 If it's so cheap that voip providers give it for free, imagine the profit margin for mobile operators Aug 13 03:55:17 you're uninformed Aug 13 03:55:34 it's the simplest thing for a carrier to stop your VoIP Aug 13 03:55:42 oh here comes the mighty informed....pray tell me Aug 13 03:55:45 they don't need to lock phone for that Aug 13 03:56:03 they can do it on the network itself instead on your device Aug 13 03:56:09 instead of on* Aug 13 03:56:37 sure I'm a bit more informed than you - at least I've talked with carriers untending to use Openmoko phones Aug 13 03:56:57 would you like me to kiss your ring? Aug 13 03:57:14 I would like you to stoip that offensive nonsense Aug 13 03:57:46 arrogance of this community is amazing....you started being offensive by calling me uninformed Aug 13 03:58:08 you started calling me naive - what do you expect? Aug 13 03:58:21 naive is not offensive ....please Aug 13 03:58:34 uninformed is? Aug 13 03:58:48 ok.... agreed....whatever Aug 13 03:59:18 c'mon make my day, bitch a bit more on me Aug 13 03:59:35 Ken-Young: so… not very open? Aug 13 03:59:50 luke-jr, What's not very open? Aug 13 03:59:54 i just dont think that operators are as crazy about open os as you seem to imply Aug 13 03:59:57 Ken-Young: Maemo Aug 13 04:00:17 and I *know* at least swisscom is Aug 13 04:00:35 ok...swisscom is... your point being? Aug 13 04:00:45 and I heard from first hand about a lot of others Aug 13 04:00:46 luke-jr, Like most N900 owners, I'd love to have a fully open source N900. Having said that, Maemo is open enough for my purposes. Aug 13 04:01:04 Ken-Young: Maemo is more closed than open. Aug 13 04:01:22 luke-jr, But it is still more open than ios or Android. Aug 13 04:01:26 no Aug 13 04:01:29 Android is more open than Maemo. Aug 13 04:01:40 Maemo just uses more standards. Aug 13 04:01:55 luke-jr, I disagree. But neither is very open. Aug 13 04:02:10 I thought Android was a minefield of proprietary blobs Aug 13 04:02:23 Ken-Young: Android is, at least in my understanding, completely open at its common code, like MeeGo is supposed to be Aug 13 04:02:40 only the platform-specific bits are usually closed Aug 13 04:02:46 luke-jr, What I really want is a gnu / linux phone. Maemo is a *lot* closer to that than Android is, and that's what I care about. Aug 13 04:02:50 what we are forgetting is that average joe doesnt care about open or closed os....get it? he wants stuff that works.... Aug 13 04:02:53 N900dude: http://www.allaboutsymbian.com/news/item/11468_Q1_2010_figures_in_for_smartph.php Aug 13 04:03:00 Ken-Young: Maemo has 0% GNU AFAIK Aug 13 04:03:14 N900dude: that's why the Average Joe has Symbian Aug 13 04:03:15 lpotter: great....yawn Aug 13 04:03:31 luke-jr, But you can but Easy Debian on it, and have a full gnu experience. Aug 13 04:03:40 Ken-Young: sure. I have Gentoo on mine. Aug 13 04:03:48 luke-jr: that's kinda correct. Though usually android phones have signed BL and kernel and so are open but nevertheless locked Aug 13 04:03:49 but Easy Debian isn't Maemo ☺ Aug 13 04:03:52 there are probably some parts that can't be opened due to legislation (the other day someone here told me Nokia won't open the GSM modem because that would be against a law in the UK about providing GSM hacking tools) Aug 13 04:03:55 luke-jr, That's not as easy on a Droid. Aug 13 04:04:20 DocScrutinizer: but there are Android phoens w/o that, which puts it at least on par with the single N900 device Aug 13 04:04:23 or somthing like that, i don't rmember the exact details Aug 13 04:04:23 Maemo* Aug 13 04:04:36 Ken-Young: that depends on the device Aug 13 04:04:45 luke-jr: granted, usually those were called developer devices Aug 13 04:04:48 luke-jr, I don't care that Easy Debian isn't Maemo, because Maemo is what makes Easy Debian easy. Aug 13 04:05:19 so whats next for maemo? Aug 13 04:05:22 from what I know, Android wins over Maemo in the free/open area completely Aug 13 04:05:25 N900dude: Maemo is dead. Aug 13 04:05:48 yes Aug 13 04:06:00 N900dude: next is MeeGo. Aug 13 04:06:10 which is supposed to compete with Android in the free/open arena Aug 13 04:06:10 so why is nokia still selling n900 ? Aug 13 04:06:17 N900dude: they like to make money Aug 13 04:06:41 IS there somewhere with a chart or somthing showing a comparison of how open Maemo is vcs Android? Aug 13 04:06:42 ha....by deceiving customers....shame Aug 13 04:06:54 vs* Aug 13 04:06:56 N900dude, How were you deceived? Aug 13 04:07:06 TiagoTiago: andridiot isn't even a proper linux Aug 13 04:07:23 N900dude: N900 has a warranty, not a contract to maintain it Aug 13 04:07:41 Ken-Young: i purchased my n900 thinking maemo was the future....obviously it was a lie Aug 13 04:07:47 TiagoTiago: Maemo is about 40% free; Android is about 90-100% AFAIK Aug 13 04:07:59 N900dude: where did you get that idea? Aug 13 04:08:10 if Maemo was the future, it wouldn't exist in the present. Aug 13 04:08:12 woah, really?! Damn :( Aug 13 04:08:15 i was wrong Aug 13 04:08:36 Somtimes the future is the present with some changes Aug 13 04:08:39 TiagoTiago: N810 was maybe 30% free I think Aug 13 04:09:07 the maemo dudes at the summit presented it as such Aug 13 04:09:20 http://mer-project.blogspot.com/2010/02/mapping-openness-of-maemo-50-pr11-and.html Aug 13 04:09:24 * DocScrutinizer sighs Aug 13 04:09:37 N900dude: maybe you have a case for false advertising, but maybe not ☺ Aug 13 04:09:58 i give up Aug 13 04:10:12 if the 'summit' was after MeeGo was planned, and they portrayed Maemo as the future, that's your only chance :p Aug 13 04:10:37 chance for *what*? Aug 13 04:10:42 of course meego was planned long time go....lets not be naive Aug 13 04:10:52 *ago Aug 13 04:10:59 meego is still in the planning stages Aug 13 04:11:01 naive is your fav word eh? Aug 13 04:11:42 good for nokia... they know how to make $$ on unsuspecting masses Aug 13 04:11:47 if it had been planned long ago, then they had started it long ago Aug 13 04:12:17 heh.. does it _look_ like meego had been started long ago? :) Aug 13 04:12:40 I think it was foolish for Nokia to adopt the name meego, and drop maemo, because it leads to the sort of anger we see hear. But if they had just continued calling it Maemo, and made all the changes they are not planning in the transition to Meego, would people still be pissed? If so, why? Aug 13 04:12:41 DocScrutinizer: based on that link, M5 is actually less free than M4 :P Aug 13 04:12:44 N900dude: you are obviosuly bitter Aug 13 04:12:55 s/hear/here/ Aug 13 04:12:55 Ken-Young meant: I think it was foolish for Nokia to adopt the name meego, and drop maemo, because it leads to the sort of anger we see here. But if they had just continued calling it Maemo, and made all the changes they are not planning in the transition to Meego, woul... Aug 13 04:13:30 lpotter: do you honestly think the intel thing happened out of thin air???? it had to have been discussed for a long time....bunch a liers thats all Aug 13 04:13:32 Ken-Young: I think for practical purposes, the anger is directed toward not having official support on N900 **** ENDING LOGGING AT Fri Aug 13 04:13:39 2010 **** BEGIN LOGGING AT Fri Aug 13 04:14:15 2010 Aug 13 04:14:29 by being evasive nokia lost out... Aug 13 04:14:37 evasive? Aug 13 04:14:39 Ken-Young: ack Aug 13 04:14:48 luke-jr, But the N900 was supposed to be "step 4 or 5" on Maemo. If they just kept calling it Mamo, and didn't officially support the N900 on Maemo 5, I think people would have felt let anger. Completely irrationally. Aug 13 04:14:59 yes Aug 13 04:15:14 s/step 4 of 5/step 4 or 5/ Aug 13 04:16:21 all this step 4 talk is meaningless Aug 13 04:16:57 lpotter: if they knew about their own plans earlier, why then would they nvest so many manyears into harmattan? Aug 13 04:17:00 n900 was meant to generate a quick $ for nokia...mission accomplished Aug 13 04:17:02 Well, they'd better not take a *lot* more steps before they produce a consumer-ready device. Aug 13 04:17:37 DocScrutinizer: you dont think harmattan is still being worked on? Aug 13 04:17:53 N900dude: n900 is not a big money maker for nokia Aug 13 04:18:01 N900dude: yeah, let's stop being naive. N900 was Nokia's greatest success, $$ wise Aug 13 04:18:17 lpotter, Isn't harmattan now a meego variant? Aug 13 04:18:18 lpotter, bullshit. Aug 13 04:18:24 lpotter: I'm sure it's being worked on Aug 13 04:18:28 It's not huge volume Aug 13 04:18:49 But it's profitability has to be big for what is essentially a skunkworks project. Aug 13 04:18:50 lpotter: but they would have done different if they knew meego merger was coming Aug 13 04:19:16 Doc: a little cynical today, are we not? Aug 13 04:19:17 GAN900: pretty big 'skunkworks' Aug 13 04:19:32 It's unfortunate that early adaptors and dedicated contributors are being repeatedly screwed over by Nokia in the process. Aug 13 04:19:35 DocScrutinizer: and same can be said for Qt takeover Aug 13 04:19:39 I, for one, give up. Aug 13 04:19:59 screwed over? how so? Aug 13 04:20:04 N900 got 1 major release and (maybe) 3 minor releases. Aug 13 04:20:18 and it's effectively EoL in less than a year. Aug 13 04:20:27 Worse deal than even the 770 got. Aug 13 04:20:37 make no mistake: nokia knew about the intel merger long time ago....these things dont happen in weeks but months and years....stop believing bullshit Aug 13 04:20:39 GAN900: how do yo uknow there are not more updates being worked on? Aug 13 04:20:50 lpotter, the team is essentially gone Aug 13 04:21:03 lpotter, bugs are having TMs removed. Aug 13 04:21:13 lpotter, maemo.org's budget is gone. Aug 13 04:21:15 GAN900: team is still there Aug 13 04:21:28 working on the next phone Aug 13 04:21:34 as planned years ago Aug 13 04:21:40 lpotter, thus, the screwing. Aug 13 04:21:46 heh Aug 13 04:21:48 right Aug 13 04:21:55 GAN900: fully agreed Aug 13 04:22:11 well I'm starting to feel kicky. So I'll hand over to and hope crashandie will drop in shortly Aug 13 04:22:12 again, what makes you think there will be no more updates to n900> Aug 13 04:22:13 ? Aug 13 04:22:15 bye Aug 13 04:22:23 but its hard to convince the nokia apologists Aug 13 04:22:28 lpotter, I'm not wasting any more of my time or money on a company that seems to hate having me as a customer and a contributor. Aug 13 04:22:51 Almost 5 years was more than enough. Aug 13 04:23:06 great community spirit: lets kick people out! Aug 13 04:23:22 lpotter, all signs point to it. Aug 13 04:23:27 no one is kicking anyone out Aug 13 04:23:37 lpotter, there certainly wont be any major ones. Aug 13 04:23:41 GAN900: not from my vantage point Aug 13 04:23:49 and unsupported meeGo doesn't count. Aug 13 04:24:00 lpotter, well, time will tell, eh? :) Aug 13 04:24:59 perhaps. but some people will never be happy Aug 13 04:26:00 lpotter, GIven that the N900 is the current "reference platform" for Meggo, don't you think it would be smart for Nokia to officially support Meego on the N900, so that the N900 owners feel like their device hasnot either been abaondoned, or has become a dead-end back water? Would it really be that hard to offically support Meego on the device? Aug 13 04:26:20 i read somewhere that older symbian phones (like 2-3 years old) are still gettting updates nowadays, is that true? and can we expect similar behavior with the N900? Aug 13 04:27:58 Ken-Young: depends on what "official support" entails. if you mean OTA updates from maemo to meego, thats not going to happen Aug 13 04:28:33 lpotter, I think people would be understanding if they were told they would have to reflash to get Meego. Aug 13 04:28:37 lpotter, doesn't take much to please me Aug 13 04:28:41 n900 was developed for years before it got 'official support' Aug 13 04:28:53 and I think I've been more than forgiving Aug 13 04:29:41 meego is a work in progress, nokia cannot officially support it because it is still in development Aug 13 04:29:50 meego on the n900 that is Aug 13 04:29:57 But if you can't even vaguely manage a par against your competitors and are now BACKSLIDING, well, I'll take my time elsewhere, thanks. Aug 13 04:30:05 Why is it easier to throw microB into kinetic scrollikng with a fingernail than the tip of the finger? Aug 13 04:30:54 lpotter, But assuming meego eventually becomes a fully usable product, why not "officially" support reflashing it onto the N900? Aug 13 04:31:05 GAN900: nokia is only backsliding because they havent released another smartphone/flagship for a long time Aug 13 04:31:10 lpotter, I expect to be able to have as close an experience to that of the N900+1 as possible given the hardware limitations. Aug 13 04:31:11 Once it is usable. Aug 13 04:32:07 Ken-Young, because Nokia is cheap and they seem to have lost their way. Aug 13 04:32:25 Ken-Young: what's 'official'? there was a recent n900 meego image released from nokia Aug 13 04:32:38 i.e., don't piss off your contributors and early adaptors, and don't screw your customers. Aug 13 04:32:52 its just not supported because its alpha software Aug 13 04:33:18 lpotter, That's basically my point. I think Nokia has handled the "optics" of Maemo->Meego poorly. Aug 13 04:34:02 lpotter, I think changing the name was foolish. I think saying that it won't be officially supported on the N900 is foolish. Aug 13 04:34:49 they changed the name because it is no long maemo Aug 13 04:34:53 longer Aug 13 04:34:55 lpotter, Nokia is making Meego available for N900 users, but making them feel as if it won't be available to them.' Aug 13 04:35:16 The name change was probably some sort of diplocatic thing 'cause of the merger with Intel's Moblin , isntead of only one side giving up their names, both did Aug 13 04:35:19 * Stskeeps yawns Aug 13 04:35:29 diplomatic* Aug 13 04:35:34 lpotter, Maemo is whatever they say it is. THey could adopt Windoze Phone and rebrand it Maemo 6. Aug 13 04:36:25 dont think so Aug 13 04:36:38 TiagoTiago, I suspect somewhere there's a group of people bitching about Intel abandoning Moblin. Just bad PR. Aug 13 04:37:08 I like Moblin more than Meego Aug 13 04:37:13 the name that is Aug 13 04:37:29 I think people throw around the words 'abandoned' and 'obsolete' too easily Aug 13 04:37:31 i have no direct experience with either OS Aug 13 04:38:21 Stskeeps: see? Aug 13 04:39:19 DocScrutinizer: i'm partly blinded by the fact my coffee is not working yet, t.m.o is in /etc/hosts as 127.0.0.1 talk.maemo.org and i don't understand a single bit of what's going on Aug 13 04:39:24 :P Aug 13 04:39:38 hehe Aug 13 04:40:12 that doesn't sound right, least not for an unmessed setup Aug 13 04:40:14 echo 127.0.0.1 freenode.net >>/etc/hosts Aug 13 04:40:17 at least* Aug 13 04:40:25 lol Aug 13 04:40:48 Stskeeps: seems since a few days tmo came over here Aug 13 04:42:26 i do occasionally think about /part #maemo too and focus at technical work instead of politics, too :P Aug 13 04:42:37 * DocScrutinizer just wonders what happened... Has duke nukem forever announced they won't release until ovi gets into shape, or what? Aug 13 04:43:01 lol Aug 13 04:43:32 my device works as great as it did 3 months ago, maybe even better Aug 13 04:46:33 probably we should mess up buildhost again, this time with PR1.3 libs :-P Aug 13 04:46:36 i dont give a damn as long basic stuff works as intended. No sip calls on maemo is what pisses me off. Aug 13 04:47:02 my SIP works great Aug 13 04:47:11 sometimes even over UMTS Aug 13 04:47:20 DocScrutinizer, it is a fluke Aug 13 04:47:54 DocScrutinizer, the dev says that there indeed is a bug in gstreamer Aug 13 04:47:57 a whale fin? Aug 13 04:48:24 DocScrutinizer, something wrong with gstjitterbuffer Aug 13 04:48:36 tsss, fsckng PA Aug 13 04:48:41 if you use fapman, does the default app manager stop working? Aug 13 04:48:57 lot of people moaning about it on bug #10388 Aug 13 04:48:58 Bug https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=10388 Choppy audio in SIP conversation, WLAN power save problem? Aug 13 04:49:12 i think they loack some stuff from each other, whichever you open last will not work 100% Aug 13 04:49:13 managing jitterbuffer in gstreamer chain - WTF? Aug 13 04:49:15 lock* Aug 13 04:49:18 DocScrutinizer, what wlan ap do you use? Aug 13 04:49:28 uh? Aug 13 04:49:36 https://secure.wikimedia.org/wiktionary/en/wiki/fluke Aug 13 04:49:46 DocScrutinizer, wifi access point? Aug 13 04:49:52 aaah sorry Aug 13 04:49:52 Noun Aug 13 04:49:53 fluke (plural flukes) Aug 13 04:49:55 1. A lucky or improbable occurrence, with the implication that the occurrence could not be repeated. Aug 13 04:49:57 The first goal was just a fluke. Aug 13 04:50:06 buggy Zyxel P660 crap Aug 13 04:51:05 DocScrutinizer, dont call it buggy if sip calls work for you Aug 13 04:52:05 maybe forwarding ports 5060 and 5004...5007 might help? Aug 13 04:52:14 DocScrutinizer, the dev has taken tcpdumps from my system, which suggests issues are with gstrtpjitterbuffer Aug 13 04:52:30 see above Aug 13 04:52:42 DocScrutinizer, i have freeswitch running on 5090 Aug 13 04:52:44 hmm: 1355 688 user D < 89596 36.3 1.3 /usr/bin/mafw-dbus-wrapper mafw-gst-re Aug 13 04:53:01 jitterbuffer outside of RTP handling lib is insane Aug 13 04:53:56 DocScrutinizer, isnt rtp handling done by gstreamer Aug 13 04:54:13 that'd be double insane Aug 13 04:55:03 DocScrutinizer, http://www.gstreamer.net/data/doc/gstreamer/head/gst-plugins-good-plugins/html/gst-plugins-good-plugins-gstrtpjitterbuffer.html Aug 13 04:55:17 * DocScrutinizer shrugs Aug 13 04:55:54 DocScrutinizer, so you are just lucky that your sip calls work. Aug 13 04:55:59 * DocScrutinizer heads out to head up the milk for his latte m. in a plastic cup with a acetylene welder Aug 13 04:56:43 while pondering about brilliant idea to have jitterbuffer outside main SIP managing process Aug 13 04:56:56 heat even Aug 13 04:57:37 DocScrutinizer, but if you to see your N900 fail i can give u a sip uri which will give a choppy audio Aug 13 04:57:55 DocScrutinizer, if you want to try that out Aug 13 04:58:19 DocScrutinizer, that sip uri will read back to u an ebook Aug 13 04:58:47 DocScrutinizer, care to test? Aug 13 04:58:53 maybe Aug 13 04:59:05 I'm not really here anymore Aug 13 04:59:08 it Aug 13 04:59:23 s just my ghost sleeptyping Aug 13 05:00:35 or maybe DocScrutinizer significantly improved Eliza, and I am just a script running Aug 13 05:01:34 does fapman not use the same repo/source lists as the default app manager? Aug 13 05:02:17 it does Aug 13 05:03:01 * RST38h doubts many current Net users will be able to distinguish Eliza from themselves Aug 13 05:03:07 hmm, i can see repos in fapman, but not listed in /etc/apt/sources.list.d/hildon-application-manager.list or /etc/apt/sources.list Aug 13 05:04:31 lol @ RST38h's comment Aug 13 05:07:41 you think Eliza can? Aug 13 05:08:27 no, I can't Aug 13 05:09:23 do you want to tell me about it? Aug 13 05:10:09 *** cought SIGTERM, quiting Aug 13 05:14:06 i download a little proggie made in Puthon, but when i try to run it it complains about missing python-tk , any suggestions? Aug 13 05:14:11 Python* Aug 13 05:17:41 you should install the missing package Aug 13 05:19:08 do yo got a link to a tutorial on that handy? Aug 13 05:22:10 apt-get update;apt-get install python-tk Aug 13 05:22:39 hm Aug 13 05:24:13 hm, unable to lock, but i don't have any other application manager/installer running... Aug 13 05:24:53 is there a command to see who is locking it? Aug 13 05:25:17 Fapman is locking it. Or HAM. Aug 13 05:25:30 Quit both Aug 13 05:25:54 neither are running Aug 13 05:26:22 apt-get/apt-worker? Aug 13 05:26:32 dpkg? Aug 13 05:26:46 ah, there, pyGTKEditor was locking the stuff Aug 13 05:27:21 the catalogue page in my application manager is always blank now Aug 13 05:29:20 python-tk: Depends: blt (>= 2.4z-4.1) but it is not going to be installed Aug 13 05:29:22 Depends: tk8.5 (>= 8.5.0) but it is not going to be installed Aug 13 05:29:24 what now? Aug 13 05:29:52 Guess Aug 13 05:31:45 apt-get install blt ? Aug 13 05:35:52 i hope i don't brick it o.o Aug 13 05:41:21 yay ! it works Aug 13 05:41:49 loll, that GUI engine isn't fit for mobile devices Aug 13 05:44:20 Do yo know of an automatic translator from tk to qt? Aug 13 05:44:31 for python progs that is Aug 13 06:09:52 Where is Jayson? Aug 13 06:21:10 in the house? Aug 13 06:22:00 be aware Aug 13 06:22:13 damn, thumbnailer eats my n900 Aug 13 06:31:56 better than eating your boyfriend. Aug 13 06:34:57 depends on the boyfriend Aug 13 06:35:42 this one: https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=626593 Aug 13 06:35:43 Bug 626593: was not found. Aug 13 06:40:37 aaahahaha! Comment number 2 is full of WIN! Aug 13 06:41:19 pigeon: i have girlfriend btw Aug 13 06:44:35 rmrfchik: does she want to report some bugs too? :) Aug 13 06:47:35 pigeon: only to blizzard Aug 13 06:47:41 hahahaha Aug 13 06:48:08 sc2? Aug 13 06:48:26 wow Aug 13 06:48:30 ah Aug 13 06:48:56 i'm waiting for cataclysm Aug 13 06:49:28 we're doing LK heroic now Aug 13 06:49:30 and RS Aug 13 06:50:03 pigeon, me too, I'm in the beta, so I'm on IRC right now while the latest beta update is downloading. :) Aug 13 06:50:21 EdLin: cool Aug 13 06:50:45 what servers u r playing on> Aug 13 06:50:46 it is, you get free lvl 80 characters to play with. Aug 13 06:51:14 rmrfchick: for the beta? Beta-only servers, you'd probably be on one if you were in it. For regular I'm on anvilmar. Aug 13 06:51:22 EU, US? Aug 13 06:51:26 US Aug 13 06:51:30 ah. EU here Aug 13 06:51:38 rmrfchik, the beta is only US,KR servers anyway Aug 13 06:51:42 EdLin: have u down LK hc? Aug 13 06:51:56 * rmrfchik is not interested in beta Aug 13 06:52:06 rmrfchik, you have to be in wrath to be able to run the beta Aug 13 06:53:06 EdLin: mmm.. sure, as we're on Lich King now Aug 13 06:53:11 * rmrfchik is King Slayer btw ;) Aug 13 06:53:58 Kerry King, of Slayer? Aug 13 06:53:59 rmoravcik, I'm a lowbie character on anvilmar, I have no idea why they picked a casual player like me for the beta. :) Aug 13 06:54:10 Hi. Is the N900 capable of importing contact info (say, from a CSV file) with the software present by default, or do I have to install extra software to do this? If the latter, which software? Is it Wammu/Gammu? Aug 13 06:54:14 oh.. wow. Aug 13 06:55:03 mece: we have down the main bad guy in the universe. /me da rule! Aug 13 06:56:29 EdLin: how is beta? Aug 13 06:58:29 rmrfchik, interesting, underwater quests, even the lowbie areas have changed radically in some cases, unlike all other expansions. Aug 13 06:59:10 EdLin: fly mounts? Aug 13 06:59:26 sure, even in the old-world areas of azeroth Aug 13 06:59:54 what's noticeable? Aug 13 07:00:24 I pretty much summed up the major changes right there, underwater quests and new lowbie areas. Aug 13 07:01:06 oh yeah, and the worgen and the other new race of midget men that slip my mind. :) Aug 13 07:01:24 well, not much ;) Aug 13 07:01:45 it is a lot if you're making an alt. Aug 13 07:01:59 What's about new archeology profession? Aug 13 07:02:12 I haven't played with that yet. Aug 13 07:02:26 you made alt in beta? Aug 13 07:02:41 professions were broke in the beta when I played it last, but I've got a 15GB update downloading that I hope will fix that. Aug 13 07:02:45 yep Aug 13 07:03:02 I made alts and played pre-made lvl 80 characters (now one is lvl 82. :) ) Aug 13 07:03:27 how is if fast to level from ground? Aug 13 07:04:18 how fast to level to level 90 or whatever the new ceiling is from lvl 1? I have no idea, the beta has only been out a short time to testers. Aug 13 07:04:23 at least, to me. Aug 13 07:04:24 s/if/it Aug 13 07:04:53 and how fast you get 82? Aug 13 07:05:08 real fast, it was as easy as going to level 5 as an alt. :) Aug 13 07:05:44 all I had to do was complete an underwater quest or two Aug 13 07:05:54 almost too easy Aug 13 07:06:15 well, not almost, it was too easy. But that's Wow for you, it's too easy. Aug 13 07:06:58 hmm. I hope it will take a more time. Aug 13 07:07:12 And eager to see guild leveling mechanics Aug 13 07:07:30 yeah, I need to join a guild on the beta server to play with that. Aug 13 07:07:43 since we're talking games, may i ask for advice in a matter dealing with forum moderators of forum of a (really) small company's awesome game? Aug 13 07:08:07 TiagoTiago, how did you get in trouble? Aug 13 07:08:58 it was my third day there, we were chatting in the announcement thread of new versions while we waited for the o come and announce the release of a much anticipated new version, Aug 13 07:09:37 me and a few other people got in a somewhat heated conversation, and some other people said we should stop or the thread was gonna be closed by the mods (that happen to be the only two guys in the company) Aug 13 07:10:24 but since many of the people in the convo withme were long time forum members, and since i had been told the moderators were both fair and quite 'lax, i assumed it wasn't gonna be an issue and jsut continue chatting Aug 13 07:11:24 TiagoTiago, my advice is to apologize to the guys you were arguing with and the mods and to lay low for a while. Especially since the mods are so high up, you aren't going to get much leeway in dealing with them. Aug 13 07:11:25 at one point after the few people against the convo kept iantagonizing us, i told them to not feed the trolls, but since they continued to try to get us to stop i assumed they didn't consider what we were doing trolling, another indication that it was alright Aug 13 07:11:41 then i got permabanned without warning Aug 13 07:11:46 uh-oh Aug 13 07:11:59 and they've been ignoring my emails and other attemps of communication ever since Aug 13 07:12:05 TiagoTiago, that sucks Aug 13 07:12:52 yeah Aug 13 07:13:24 TiagoTiago, well, the only thing you can do is email the mods. I figure though it's probably hopeless, because either they are acting like assholes, or you did, or both, so you're kind of stuck. :( Aug 13 07:13:30 the game is awesome, but i would have so much to talk about, so much to ask, so much to suggest etc, that i've not played it ever since; i miss it :( Aug 13 07:14:45 what game is this, if you don't mind my asking? Aug 13 07:14:52 I find it quite weird that someone that is supposed to be fair and 'lax would permaban a 3 days old newbie on their first offense Aug 13 07:14:59 Dwarf Fortress Aug 13 07:15:11 withuot even a warning Aug 13 07:15:14 what kind of game is it? Aug 13 07:15:21 hm Aug 13 07:15:39 obviously fantasy genere Aug 13 07:15:48 it uses ASCII art for graphics, but it's more complex than most games out there Aug 13 07:15:57 oh cool, it's a roguelike? Aug 13 07:16:18 or a MUD? Aug 13 07:16:57 sorry, I realize you don't want to play it anymore after this. :( Aug 13 07:16:59 there is thisthe environemnt is 3D (though not drawn as such), with terrain, rivers flowing according to terrain, you can dig etc, there are dozens, if not hundreds of creatures, weather, each creature is simulated with body parts, tissues, internal organs etc Aug 13 07:17:24 erm, lol, i could swear i had backspaced evberythign before the first "the" Aug 13 07:17:57 it simuates hundreds of years of history before you begin,, including geoligical stuff, distributions of societies etc Aug 13 07:17:59 morning Aug 13 07:18:11 and it works great on the n900+ Aug 13 07:18:12 ? Aug 13 07:18:28 you contorlt he dwarfs and try to build a fortress, usually digging it in the terrain Aug 13 07:18:50 i dunno, it was gonna be one of the things i was gonna suggest, but since i've been permabanned i cant :( Aug 13 07:18:51 test Aug 13 07:19:09 Appiah, it works in Linux and OS X apparently as well as Windows. Aug 13 07:19:15 Yes I can see that Aug 13 07:19:17 Appiah, bet it could be ported Aug 13 07:19:30 it uses ASCII art but it's rendered with OpenGL Aug 13 07:19:54 even then, opengl is available in it's mobile version on the n900 Aug 13 07:20:08 might need a bit of work to port to OGLES Aug 13 07:20:23 yeah, but it's probably doable with some effort. Aug 13 07:20:32 here's the site: http://www.bay12games.com/dwarves/ Aug 13 07:20:40 it isn't exactly Halo 2 or something Aug 13 07:20:47 TiagoTiago: ASCII redered with OpenGL? Like TT? Aug 13 07:21:06 What is TT? Aug 13 07:21:16 TrueType fonts Aug 13 07:22:11 They got the "font" as a PNG with all the characters, plus additional images can be used to replace stuff or add differences to otherwise similar looking thigns and stuff (more or less like this, i'm probably not explaining 100% right) Aug 13 07:22:44 the default characterset resembles DOS font i believe Aug 13 07:22:45 Thunder in Oslo atm. Hmmm Aug 13 07:22:56 TiagoTiago, this really sucks for you, apparently part of the gameplay is trading savegame files on the forums. Aug 13 07:24:05 there are several approaches to playing it, some people try to carve scultupres out of mountains, others try to survive with only a single dwarf for as long as possible (since you start with more than one, often they kill them gruesomely, ot let them locked out untill they starve to death) Aug 13 07:25:04 i was jsut starting, so my only goal was to manage to get the fortress sustainable, they always started to get crazy with all the vermin and deaths and stuff, or simply coudln't make/gather enough food to stay alive Aug 13 07:27:59 Some people even do somthing kidna similar to machinima, taking screenshots and trying to steer the events in a way that would fit the story (but since not even the dwarfs can be controled directly (you can assign them jobs and stuff, but they might not feel like doing it) somtimes unpredicatble events messed up the intended storyline and forced epople to have their story go elsewhere) Aug 13 07:29:27 I used to be really into Nethack and Moria/Angband, so this looks really neat. Too bad the forum mods (aka the developers) used the ban hammer on you. Aug 13 07:30:02 one of the things that makes that game so awesome is the level of detail, lots of effort is put into everything, you often get surprised with more thought put into somthing that you wouldn't even have thought about yourself Aug 13 07:30:12 Nethack is like that Aug 13 07:33:43 What is the gameplay like with Nethack? Aug 13 07:33:58 deceptively simple, but lots of stuff is in the game Aug 13 07:34:26 if you've ever played Rogue, it's like Rogue on steroids. Aug 13 07:34:48 www.nethack.org Aug 13 07:35:33 it also is available for Unix etc Aug 13 07:36:00 in fact, it's the decendant of a game that was originally made on Unix. Aug 13 07:36:15 I played it before Windows 95 was even released. Aug 13 07:36:29 I think DF is to RTS what Nethack is to dungeon crawler/rpgs Aug 13 07:36:30 TiagoTiago: are they paying you to advertise it or something? Aug 13 07:36:45 because i never saw anybody writing so much text on irc Aug 13 07:36:46 jacekowski, why would they? It's a free game Aug 13 07:36:57 nah, i got hooked, it is kidna addiciting, at least for me Aug 13 07:37:52 lol Aug 13 07:38:09 i miss playing it :( Aug 13 07:40:54 EdLin: oh yeah, playing games before win95 was released is such a kudos, eh ;) Aug 13 07:41:21 crashanddie, my first games were on the Atari 2600 and the Apple II, I go back a way. Aug 13 07:41:43 'ive played lots of DOS and 2600 games Aug 13 07:42:08 good times Aug 13 07:42:32 Morning, all Aug 13 07:42:39 do you remember what that 2600 game was that had the pulsing alian spacecraft that every now and then would dart accross the screen? Aug 13 07:43:04 Jaffa, morning Aug 13 07:43:07 Not SI, is it? Aug 13 07:43:10 no Aug 13 07:43:46 you had a shield or something, I vaguely recall, too. Aug 13 07:43:56 or was it the enemy that did? Aug 13 07:44:03 It's been a long time.... Aug 13 07:44:31 Doesn't ring a bell, but that doesn't say much, there were way to many 2600 games out there Aug 13 07:44:34 is there a 2600 emulator out there for maemo? Aug 13 07:44:44 i think so Aug 13 07:44:59 I bet there's an Apple II one, there is for Android and Linux in general. Aug 13 07:45:35 * EdLin has an Android phone atm, but don't kick me out, I have an n810 too. :) Aug 13 07:45:41 there are lots of emu's ported or specificly made for the N900 Aug 13 07:46:09 TiagoTiago, it sounds like the perfect emu device, what with the TV out and included TV cables. Aug 13 07:46:22 yep Aug 13 07:46:51 and you can even play games with a Dualshock3 and a Wiimote :P Aug 13 07:47:02 EdLin: Battlezone? Aug 13 07:47:14 no, battlezone was a tank game. Aug 13 07:47:37 it was a favorite too, never played it on a 2600 tho, played it in the arcades. Aug 13 07:48:31 Did you play that one with the guy that had to reach the roof of a building doging shopping carts and stuff, it had elevators to move between floors and i perhaps escalators too ? Aug 13 07:48:43 and i think perhaps* Aug 13 07:48:57 sounds vaguely familiar, but no, I didn't play it. Aug 13 07:50:50 rebooting, bbl Aug 13 07:51:03 Another one i had that i loved playing was this one with two cowboys, one on each side of the screen, and a destructible obstacle int he middle Aug 13 07:51:55 did you ever play the one with the bombs going down from a wall and you'd catch them with water buckets? Aug 13 07:52:18 The one i played had spiders and you picked them up with a plant vase i think Aug 13 07:52:21 very kid-like, but I was a kid when I played it. Aug 13 07:52:43 or perhaps i'm remembering it wrong, and it was somthing else falling and you had to dodge the spiders Aug 13 07:53:23 oh, i think it was plant vases dropping and you had to dodge them, someone or somthing was runnign on top of the screen dropping them Aug 13 07:53:32 lol, hard to remember, it was so long ago Aug 13 07:53:38 lol Aug 13 07:54:44 after one of the times i moved to another house (there were many over the years), before leaving the previous house i had forgotten about my 2600 for a while, after the move eventually i went looking for it and i couldn't find it anywhere, must have left it in a drawer somewhere in my old house :( Aug 13 07:55:05 I think i was like about 13 or somthing whent hat happened Aug 13 07:57:12 TiagoTiago, bummer Aug 13 08:01:18 yeah :/ Aug 13 08:09:55 Jaffa, GeneralAntilles: http://talk.maemo.org/showpost.php?p=784443&postcount=32 Aug 13 08:11:59 Stskeeps, doesn't look like good news for my old N810 Aug 13 08:12:06 TiagoTiago: dfterm on a server and telnet? Aug 13 08:12:31 the n900 is nowhere near being able to run df2 Aug 13 08:12:36 EdLin: i'm still doing work on meego for n8x0, fwiw Aug 13 08:12:44 it's fatiguing for a quad-core cpu Aug 13 08:12:45 I think that might be a possibility Aug 13 08:12:58 really? Aug 13 08:13:08 EdLin: hoping to set up a similar repository like we have with n900 for the closed bits Aug 13 08:13:27 TiagoTiago: depends on the fortress Aug 13 08:13:37 EdLin: i mean, we have 2.6.35 going and i'm not doing that cos i have to :) Aug 13 08:13:40 i've seen a turing-complete calculator made with dwarves Aug 13 08:14:00 lol Aug 13 08:14:02 EdLin: hate having useless devices around my house and i have 2x n800 and one n810 :P Aug 13 08:14:05 also osso-xterm sucks for nethack :( Aug 13 08:14:14 no 80x24 Aug 13 08:14:16 :( Aug 13 08:14:23 79x25 is the closest one Aug 13 08:14:33 might need a purpose made client Aug 13 08:14:39 kerio: Port your own xterm ;-P Aug 13 08:14:46 TiagoTiago: nah Aug 13 08:14:53 79x25 is fine to play Aug 13 08:14:54 how about Tcl/Tk? there was a TKAngband Aug 13 08:15:10 not to *watch* though Aug 13 08:15:40 grml Aug 13 08:15:48 heh, we're never getting anything opened in m5 Aug 13 08:16:00 so now my contacts from sms dialog are gone... Aug 13 08:16:17 TomaszD: on hardware level a bunch of stuff is, but ok Aug 13 08:16:23 chem|st, I think grml (grml.org) linux comes with Nethack, to tie this all togeather. ;-) Aug 13 08:16:34 Stskeeps, what about m4? Aug 13 08:16:35 EdLin: ;) Aug 13 08:17:00 once I saw meego emerge I knew it would be bad news for legacy as everyone jumps ship to the new shiny thing Aug 13 08:17:11 TomaszD: working on the hardware side and kernel still in my free time Aug 13 08:17:41 and nobody is going to convince me that, hadn't meego been created and maemo 6 released instead, that things would have been *any* different Aug 13 08:17:58 meego does change things a lot, but :shrug: Aug 13 08:18:51 * Stskeeps goes shower and ponders to go for a bike ride Aug 13 08:19:16 so the openness of meego prevents maemo 5 components to be opened. Because had there been an m6 equal in openness to m5, things would have been sooo different Aug 13 08:19:34 Stskeeps: I'm a hacker/poweruser/whatnot - I like to tune my desktop/mobile to exactly fit my needs - Do MeeGo let me do that? (Just wondering) Aug 13 08:19:41 Blargh Aug 13 08:20:20 this is a burned bridges strategy, or in other words "ohh shiny" Aug 13 08:20:35 DuckBoot: yes Aug 13 08:20:58 Stskeeps: Oh - Nice - Then I will atleast have a go at it. Aug 13 08:21:23 DuckBoot: i mean, i made a frankenmix of IVI ux and handset ux Aug 13 08:21:27 .. on a n810! Aug 13 08:21:34 TomaszD: ADD marketing Aug 13 08:21:47 heh Aug 13 08:22:25 Stskeeps: That's was really The feature of Maemo/N900 that caught my attention, and made me spend more money on a cellphone than I ever had. Aug 13 08:23:16 DuckBoot: and we're nowhere near maxing it out Aug 13 08:23:34 DuckBoot: well, if you want a 'varedeklaration' on meego/n900, we have these blobs: SGX (3d acceleration libs), BME (battery management) and wl1251 firmware and bluetooth chip firmware.. rest is open to tinker with Aug 13 08:24:00 rapuyama could run the whole phone by itself, the led chip is a tiny cpu with storage Aug 13 08:24:51 Stskeeps: and the GSM modem parts? Aug 13 08:25:04 ^^ What he said Aug 13 08:25:34 Ford_Prefect: our goal is for entire linux side to be open in telephony stack - only thing that's under doubt is some algorithms for voice, rest is going into pulseaudio/libcmtspeech/ofono Aug 13 08:26:09 Ford_Prefect: people used the work by our effort to get 3g data under nitdroid, for instance. Aug 13 08:26:10 I think he asked about the baseband :) Aug 13 08:26:15 Stskeeps: ah, I thought you mean the maemo5 Aug 13 08:26:28 the obsolete stack Aug 13 08:26:29 :P Aug 13 08:26:30 s/mean/meant Aug 13 08:26:32 :) Aug 13 08:26:36 if you mean whatever rapuyama runs, that's a mystery even for me Aug 13 08:26:40 but doesn't affect linux side Aug 13 08:27:32 I want to port the sbagen binaural beat application to n900. which sound stack does n900 use? Aug 13 08:27:53 jave: pulseaudio/alsa Aug 13 08:28:00 ah nice Aug 13 08:28:07 not really ._. Aug 13 08:28:20 no? Aug 13 08:28:25 Aug 13 08:28:30 morning guys and gals \o Aug 13 08:28:55 audio in Linux is not even close to nice. Aug 13 08:29:08 Someone should measure how often the same flaming/trollery/bashing happens in a given day Aug 13 08:29:19 s/audio/pulseaudio/ Aug 13 08:29:25 jackd is fine Aug 13 08:29:31 I'm coming from openmoko so everything is nice Aug 13 08:29:36 jackd is PAIN Aug 13 08:29:49 DuckBoot: but epic Aug 13 08:29:55 * Ford_Prefect grabs some popcorn Aug 13 08:30:08 kerio: epic PAIN - Yes - that I can agree on Aug 13 08:30:09 pulseaudio would be better if it worked Aug 13 08:30:13 lol Aug 13 08:30:46 anyway, my n900 is mostly more stable than my fedora desktop Aug 13 08:30:53 it's a cpu hog :( Aug 13 08:30:55 isn't some stuff regarding the GSM modem also be closed 'cause of laws? Aug 13 08:31:15 TiagoTiago: rapuyama will probably be closed forever Aug 13 08:31:28 it doesn't really matter Aug 13 08:31:33 although it *does* wake the phone more than it needs to Aug 13 08:32:25 would a "this breaks warranty" be enough to comply with the law? Aug 13 08:33:38 That has nothing to do with it Aug 13 08:34:00 jave: it uses /dev/dsp? :/ Aug 13 08:34:08 it == sbagen Aug 13 08:34:30 The FCC regulates things harshly, and they dont want people adjusting the modem broadcasting power (or w/e) Aug 13 08:34:33 Still, you can probably run it on the phone with padsp or such Aug 13 08:36:56 Ok, how about a Warning along the lines "please obey the local regulations regarding broadcast power etc, or you will go to jail, not to mention void your warranty" ? Aug 13 08:37:57 Don't headphones come with warnings about not setting the volume too loud? Aug 13 08:38:03 Its not up to Nokia. If they want to sell in the US, they have to obey US FCC regulations. Same for regulations in other places Aug 13 08:38:12 TiagoTiago, what did you say? Aug 13 08:38:17 The FCC would probably look at any relaxation of the status quo as an attempt by the phone manufacturer to tacitly encourage violation Aug 13 08:38:17 lol Aug 13 08:38:47 so it looks like qole got meego handset running inside a chroot :) Aug 13 08:38:59 http://www.flickr.com/photos/qole2/4887457976/#/photos/qole2/4887457976/lightbox/ Aug 13 08:39:01 Nice! :) Aug 13 08:39:07 If the device is meant to be sold worldwide, putting local limitations in hardware would make it more expensive Aug 13 08:39:59 o_O Aug 13 08:41:14 what an awesome mail Aug 13 08:41:18 Create delicious fuel for your galactic adventures! May the Force be with you!(TM) Aug 13 08:41:25 lol Aug 13 08:41:26 \o/ Aug 13 08:41:35 Explore the Galaxy with More Star Wars™ Kitchen Gear Aug 13 08:41:35 Millennium Falcon™ and Vader's TIE Fighter™ Sandwiches Aug 13 08:41:46 Ford_Prefect: I ported sbagen to alsa Aug 13 08:41:55 Make every lunch an adventure with our Aug 13 08:41:55 Sandwich Cutters. Transform your Padawan Aug 13 08:41:55 Jedi’s favorite sandwich into a Millennium Aug 13 08:41:55 Falcon™ or Vader’s TIE Fighter™ with our Aug 13 08:41:55 exclusive tools. Aug 13 08:41:56 :D Aug 13 08:42:07 that is class Aug 13 08:42:16 lcuk: URL? Aug 13 08:42:21 spam mail Aug 13 08:42:37 http://www.williams-sonoma.com/products/star-wars-lunch-box-sandwich-cutter/?bnrid=3102184&cm_ven=E3&cm_cat=EDM&cm_pla=0813_Starwars&cm_ite=Bakesilo_cutters&cm_em=liquid@gmail.com Aug 13 08:42:57 thing is, you need to cut sandwiches with a light sabre Aug 13 08:43:08 lol Aug 13 08:43:32 "the n900 is like a dog. Aug 13 08:43:34 if you don't want to spend time for it (to make it better) it maybe the wrong device for you." Aug 13 08:43:49 heh Aug 13 08:44:11 Stskeeps: Thanks. Aug 13 08:44:19 TiagoTiago, don't Aug 13 08:44:23 ? Aug 13 08:44:23 the n900 is NOT like a dog Aug 13 08:44:25 TiagoTiago: Hey, they didn't say that in the ads before I bought it.... Aug 13 08:44:51 context TiagoTiago : https://twitter.com/lcuk/status/21020087412 Aug 13 08:45:05 is it more like a cat, pretty awesome, but only when it feels like it? Aug 13 08:45:30 TiagoTiago: only talks to you when it needs feeding :P Aug 13 08:45:39 lmao Aug 13 08:47:35 umount: /: device is busy. Aug 13 08:47:41 how to know what's using it? Aug 13 08:47:47 lsof Aug 13 08:48:24 prints like 200 processes Aug 13 08:48:27 how to know which one Aug 13 08:48:38 Jaffa: just to explain the situation a little better re my role Aug 13 08:48:38 lsof | grep Aug 13 08:49:00 you can't usually unmount / Aug 13 08:49:10 if you have any processes running... Aug 13 08:49:16 i need to partition the hardisk.. Aug 13 08:49:21 But if you are trying to umount /, then you are up into you neck Aug 13 08:49:31 you need to mount a new / and then do pivot_root to swap them Aug 13 08:49:34 How do I access third level on my N900 keyboard? Aug 13 08:49:37 th3hate: Get a live distro Aug 13 08:49:50 th3hate: run it from a CD/DVD Aug 13 08:49:56 Stskeeps: Matches my understanding, but good to get it written down Aug 13 08:49:58 th3hate: repartition Aug 13 08:50:29 (e.g. the æ on the Scandinavian keyboard) Aug 13 08:50:37 so no way to umount / ? Aug 13 08:50:47 th3hate: Nope Aug 13 08:50:48 without running another live distro Aug 13 08:51:32 if you have a new rootfs mounted you can use pivot_root, but to have / free to unmount you'd need no running programs - so how would you run unmount? :P Aug 13 08:51:53 *sadface* Aug 13 08:52:15 generally you can't partition a live system, but there are a few tools / filesystems that allow it Aug 13 08:52:19 i partitioned hardisk for windows and ubuntu half by half Aug 13 08:52:21 250/250 gb Aug 13 08:52:33 and by the way you should unomount anything that is under / to be able to unmount /, don't you? Aug 13 08:52:35 anyway - it sounds like you should go to #ubuntu Aug 13 08:52:57 ok Aug 13 08:52:58 lazy umount Aug 13 08:53:28 what's that? Aug 13 08:53:39 man mount Aug 13 08:53:55 how to do it? Aug 13 08:54:11 jacekowski: uh... its not going to help Aug 13 08:54:13 the N900 doesn't got man does it? Aug 13 08:54:18 i mena, builtin Aug 13 08:54:36 th3hate: seriously, you can't unmount /. you wouldn't be able to run anything afterwards. like, the partition tool. Aug 13 08:55:05 th3hate: you need to take a different approach - and this isn't relevant to #maemo so go to #ubuntu Aug 13 08:55:15 ok thanks Aug 13 08:55:19 already there Aug 13 08:55:59 coming back to #maemo: how do I input the æ character on the scandinavian keyboard layout? Aug 13 08:57:14 romen, which key would you replace? Aug 13 08:57:39 Robot101: you can umount / Aug 13 08:57:48 Robot101: prepare tmpfs with required tools Aug 13 08:57:48 lcuk, the N900 in Scandanavian countries uses the arrow keys Aug 13 08:57:59 Robot101: and then pivot_root or that kind of thing Aug 13 08:58:13 jacekowski: yes, see earlier when I said that Aug 13 08:58:23 i have mint virtualbox running on windows, can i resize ubuntu's partition from there? Aug 13 08:58:26 jacekowski: but, really, its not what this guy needs to do Aug 13 08:58:41 romen, EdLin http://forums.internettablettalk.com/showthread.php?t=35931 Aug 13 08:58:42 what is he trying to do? Aug 13 08:58:44 heh @ old link Aug 13 08:58:44 th3hate: you need to not ask about ubuntu and windows in #maemo Aug 13 08:58:55 jacekowski: Resize / Aug 13 08:59:02 on maemo? Aug 13 08:59:10 jacekowski: no, ubuntu... Aug 13 08:59:20 well, you can do it online Aug 13 08:59:21 god I hate this channel sometimes Aug 13 08:59:24 modify partition table Aug 13 08:59:34 then reboot to cause reread Aug 13 08:59:45 and resize filesystem Aug 13 09:00:03 and almost all linux filesystem can grow online Aug 13 09:00:07 lcuk: scandinavian keyboard has a key with (ä æ ?) replacing the Up Arrow of the US layout. With no modifier I get the ä, with the "blue arrow" the ?, how to get the æ ? Aug 13 09:00:29 i used to have linux on LVM2 Aug 13 09:00:48 romen, that thread has a load of pointers for changing key layouts, but not a specific one for your exact key, have a read and see Aug 13 09:00:50 with just minimal partition for / with all lvm tools in case it goes wrong + kernel Aug 13 09:00:53 romen: change to norweigan/danish instead of fi/se? Aug 13 09:01:01 everything else could be resized online Aug 13 09:01:23 lvextend -L+10G /dev/vg/home; resize_reiserfs /dev/vg/home Aug 13 09:01:26 I'm not trying to change anything, just trying to understand how to reach the 3rd character of that layout Aug 13 09:01:26 and jacekowski don't you know how to listen. go with th3hate into #ubuntu and continue this Aug 13 09:01:40 it's ok i figured it out Aug 13 09:01:46 @lcuk, @frals Aug 13 09:01:51 You can boot from an iso file without burning it to disk with grub2, with a distribution that supports loading completely to RAM, and resize from there. Aug 13 09:02:04 lcuk: listening to other people is not something i do very well Aug 13 09:03:00 yeah we know jacekowski - but that does nothing to raise peoples impression of you Aug 13 09:05:20 romen: pretty sure thats how you do it as afaiu its mostly a cost saving issue to print all nordic layouts on same hwkb Aug 13 09:06:23 since if you have ö you wont use the danish one etc Aug 13 09:06:26 frals: oh, I didn't figured out it was just a cost saving issue, thanks! Aug 13 09:06:42 note thats just how i perceive it, i might be completlyy wrong :p Aug 13 09:07:48 frals: anyway when you start modifying the keymap you have four "level" for each key, one without modifier, one with "shift", one with "blue arrow", what is the last one? Aug 13 09:08:33 no idea Aug 13 09:08:43 shift+Fn? Aug 13 09:12:45 how may I trigger population of the sms's dialog for contacts? Aug 13 09:14:15 TiagoTiago: I feel very dumb now xD thanks anyway xD Aug 13 09:15:03 my guess was correct? Aug 13 09:15:13 lol Aug 13 09:15:24 TiagoTiago: quite sure xD Aug 13 09:15:38 cool :) Aug 13 09:17:11 * EdLin is installing easy-mer on his N810 Aug 13 09:18:11 Do you know if PlasmaPong can be ported to the N900 with decent performance? Aug 13 09:18:38 TiagoTiago, unknown until you try it! Aug 13 09:18:44 if you have scratchbox give it a go Aug 13 09:18:57 you might surprise yourself and make a hit out of it :D Aug 13 09:19:04 lol Aug 13 09:19:18 i don't think i have the knowledge for porting stuff yet Aug 13 09:19:54 i couldn't even get this python thingy running without assistance Aug 13 09:32:22 anyone? Aug 13 09:33:16 chem|st, hmm Aug 13 09:33:28 frals, didn't you look for similar at some point? Aug 13 09:34:22 lcuk: I don't have contacts within conversations for SMS (the rest is to test just do a backup before I go further) Aug 13 09:35:20 the question is how is this stored and how is it updated so I may do it by hand and have a look later what went wrong Aug 13 09:38:06 chem|st, then IDK Aug 13 09:39:30 * nid0 beats ovi suite with a hammer and cries Aug 13 09:39:34 Stskeeps, so potential for a new Maemo distmaster Aug 13 09:40:01 http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?p=784443#post784443 Aug 13 09:41:41 if there is one, it should be someone with passion for Maemo and understanding of the complexities of open/closed side of things Aug 13 09:43:31 Hi ! Aug 13 09:44:15 grr, osso-xterm not starting Aug 13 09:44:16 khertan_: Hi, sorry I missed your pm last time. Aug 13 09:44:33 X-Fade: hi X-Fade ... no problem Aug 13 09:45:01 lcuk: and unemployed.. Aug 13 09:45:19 lcuk, if you read what quim said, he basically said there wouldnt be another one, because the resources would be better put towards MeeGo Aug 13 09:45:20 This was for talking about "packaging" and maemo repository ... Aug 13 09:45:39 X-fade: This was for talking about "packaging" and maemo repository ... Aug 13 09:45:42 did I miss something? Aug 13 09:46:02 * MohammadAG51 heard packaging Aug 13 09:46:09 crashanddie, Stskeeps got the sack for his late night partying! Aug 13 09:46:13 Stskeeps, why does the unemplyed bit matter? Aug 13 09:46:13 :P kidding Aug 13 09:46:28 lcuk: cos there's probably many people that match but who would be unavailable. Aug 13 09:46:29 TermanaN900, fu, thought you were being serious Aug 13 09:46:31 lcuk: I think he's implying it's a full-time job Aug 13 09:46:53 offer enough money to make it worthwhile and you could hire the pope if wanted Aug 13 09:47:16 and you'd have to be insane to do it with the current attacks on anyone that tries to make a difference Aug 13 09:48:03 I would think knowing to avoid muppets on tmo would be requirement one of the job Aug 13 09:48:25 lcuk, some people might even do it for free Aug 13 09:48:43 why would it be a requirement to be paid? Aug 13 09:49:22 TermanaN900, of course you are right, but how would an unpaid person be able to travel to get involved with the people necessary Aug 13 09:49:49 well, theres a difference between "paid" and "expenses covered" Aug 13 09:49:50 MohammadAG51: http://talk.maemo.org/showpost.php?p=784443&postcount=32 Aug 13 09:49:54 lcuk: Riding the rails! Aug 13 09:50:00 and Stskeeps you have managed the maemo distmaster role alongside all your activities for a while ;) Aug 13 09:50:08 well, i suppose if Nokia wants them to travel, they would cover that. but the main job could be unpaid Aug 13 09:50:12 or is that what quim is saying Aug 13 09:53:59 TermanaN900, that would be worse Aug 13 09:54:14 morn achipa Aug 13 09:54:32 lcuk, how would that be worse? Aug 13 09:54:39 can you imagine having to distract quim or others to clear all expenses as required Aug 13 09:55:06 morn Stskeeps Aug 13 09:55:34 from past experience that is messy and slow and unemployed person would usually not be able to make the outlays to allow them to expense later Aug 13 09:55:35 isnt that what happens anyway? I doubt the maemo.org team are paying for any travel required out of their salery Aug 13 09:55:42 achipa: since you're on council too, this might be a good read to explain a little more about my role currently, http://talk.maemo.org/showpost.php?p=784443&postcount=32 Aug 13 09:55:50 do you know many unemployed people with a credit card? Aug 13 09:56:14 who even said anything about unemployment? Aug 13 09:56:35 lcuk: Apparently to many unemployed ppl have Credit Cards. Aug 13 09:56:50 i just said some people would become distmaster for free. I didnt say they would quit their jobs to do it Aug 13 09:56:53 Stskeeps: council ? what council ? (feeble attempt at a joke) Aug 13 09:57:15 TermanaN900, that makes more sense, apologies mixing with what Stskeeps said :) Aug 13 09:57:29 achipa: :P Aug 13 09:57:38 Stskeeps: I read that yesterday and (at least thought :) ) I understood that Aug 13 09:57:52 Stskeeps: or do you wish me/us to explain this to someone or ? Aug 13 09:58:50 achipa: nah, but i guess the essence is that i really don't function as distmaster anymore and has moved on to meego to help give people a future there.. Aug 13 09:59:18 (professionally) Aug 13 09:59:26 Stskeeps: yes, the naming might be a bit awkward wrt to the current situation Aug 13 09:59:43 things have been awkward since meego got announced Aug 13 10:00:08 Stskeeps: they'be been awkward like forever, with meego they just got VERY awkward :) Aug 13 10:00:53 if anything, i can make sure we have a proper OS for our devices that's open :) Aug 13 10:01:38 someone should enter the nokia hq and release all the sources Aug 13 10:02:51 to Wikileaks? Aug 13 10:03:34 sure, why not Aug 13 10:03:53 but basically it bends down to that i won't be referring to myself as distmaster or perform the roles of this from now on. i am still playing around with meego on n8x0 as i hate having useless devices in my house, though. Aug 13 10:04:13 or a bigass torrent Aug 13 10:04:14 nokia.tar.gz Aug 13 10:04:14 i want meego on my n900 Aug 13 10:04:16 ._. Aug 13 10:04:53 I thought it was already avaiable, but not usuable as the main os Aug 13 10:05:00 kerio, you'll get it, if you have patience Aug 13 10:05:36 let me rephrase that Aug 13 10:05:47 i want a meego that doesn't suck on my n900 Aug 13 10:06:03 kerio: you and me both. Aug 13 10:06:14 i want a meego that uses dpkg on my N900 :P Aug 13 10:06:24 MohammadAG51: that's what i said Aug 13 10:06:33 a meego that doesn't suck Aug 13 10:06:38 why they decided to ditch deb? Aug 13 10:06:59 because they were *really* high on drugs Aug 13 10:07:00 Because rpm is our saviour Aug 13 10:07:01 to annoy users? Aug 13 10:07:09 that's the only reason i can think of Aug 13 10:08:10 Because MeeGo uses Moblin based image creation tools which are geared to rpm Aug 13 10:08:41 we need someone who just quit with nokia and is still working there... as a col. of my bro said lately after he quit his job.."meetings? I don't go to meetings anymore... what will they do? Fire me?" LOL Aug 13 10:09:01 because really, does it really matter if its .deb or .rpm? Aug 13 10:09:17 frals: yes Aug 13 10:09:18 I don't really care anymore. Aug 13 10:09:18 Should've just used portage Aug 13 10:09:32 I'd prefer .deb, as I'm used to it, but I don't really care, it's the programs I care about Aug 13 10:09:33 frals rpm is just f'd up Aug 13 10:09:36 frals: it does Aug 13 10:09:50 MohammadAG51: deb is fucked from where im standing :D Aug 13 10:09:55 i checked an rpm archive some time ago Aug 13 10:09:56 is there some sort of translator from one type to the other? Aug 13 10:10:00 MohammadAG51: yum install apt4rpm && apt-get remove yum Aug 13 10:10:03 TiagoTiago: yes Aug 13 10:10:05 it doesn't store descrtiption Aug 13 10:10:10 or deps Aug 13 10:10:11 TiagoTiago: aliens! Aug 13 10:10:28 kerio, hmm, yum-my Aug 13 10:10:38 i'll stick to meego/harmattan Aug 13 10:10:48 damn hell! Aug 13 10:11:27 ok I am done with anything what could trigger a population of the contact's dialog within sms... any further ideas? Aug 13 10:12:59 a what of what? Aug 13 10:13:10 contacts dialog within sms? Aug 13 10:14:02 * MohammadAG51 slaps chem|st ^ Aug 13 10:15:50 ty, I am just in between 70k lines of delphi my phone and a cup'o'coffee Aug 13 10:16:45 when I tap new sms in conversations I cant type a name for auto lookup neither can I select any contacts from the "To" button, list is empty Aug 13 10:17:47 well I am able to type the name but it tells no known contact Aug 13 10:18:02 to be a bit more precise Aug 13 10:18:17 duh. My devices start to lose Call Log :( Aug 13 10:19:11 weird, i had that when hooking into the abook widget in fmms chem|st Aug 13 10:19:30 ... the solution was to throw an unhandled exception in my code, dont ask me why... Aug 13 10:19:49 frals: that sounds fantastic! Aug 13 10:19:55 haha what Aug 13 10:20:16 .oO(do I throw up now or later? sooner or later I will....) Aug 13 10:21:03 frals: you got any idea how I can trigger anything useful? Aug 13 10:41:08 hmm, is there a limit on the number of photos shown in the n900 default image viewer? Aug 13 10:41:20 i took some new photos and they just won't show up there. Aug 13 10:41:58 but i can see it in the file manager. Aug 13 10:45:44 MohammadAG51: ping? Aug 13 10:46:38 how many pictures do you have there already? Aug 13 10:47:26 pigeon: thats a tracker problem Aug 13 10:47:50 TiagoTiago: only 650 in fact. Aug 13 10:47:52 can anyone tell me how much battery life I can expect from my N900 in 2.5 mode with a data connection + connected to irc? Aug 13 10:48:16 xnt14[N900]: what do you mean with dataconnection? Aug 13 10:48:42 chem|st: ah right, cleaning up the tracker files now... Aug 13 10:48:44 chem|st, a Edge connection Aug 13 10:48:44 thanks Aug 13 10:49:07 is there like a scratchbox compile farm or something :) ? where i can submit stuff for compilation and get the binaries out Aug 13 10:49:19 xnt14[N900]: so no data transfer, you mean connected via edge loggedin to some irc net Aug 13 10:49:27 X-Fade, pong Aug 13 10:49:29 chem|st, yes Aug 13 10:49:58 xnt14[N900]: at least +10h Aug 13 10:50:10 MohammadAG51: Perl-modules will get optified. Aug 13 10:50:11 chem|st, k, thanks Aug 13 10:50:22 well lets say at least +6h as it strongly depends on your signal Aug 13 10:50:32 hi torsten Aug 13 10:50:44 X-Fade, yay, thanks! :D Aug 13 10:51:18 xnt14[N900]: bad reception can drag you down in less than 6hours Aug 13 10:51:53 but that even happend to me with other phones Aug 13 10:52:46 chem|st, hmm, luckily , I have good reception in my general area... Aug 13 10:53:45 depending on your usage it should consume about 150mA as you use, gives you at least 8hours Aug 13 10:54:15 the other way round Aug 13 10:54:17 chem|st: sorry, dunno how to make it happen in a proper app :( Aug 13 10:54:39 frals: no proper app... I want to kick its ass from behind Aug 13 10:54:47 chem|st, ok Aug 13 10:55:19 what happens if I reinstall osso-abook? lets see Aug 13 10:57:03 nothing... Aug 13 10:57:14 there has to be a trigger somewhere Aug 13 11:01:19 hmm Aug 13 11:01:36 the bus just rode through a dead zone -_- Aug 13 11:03:00 a dead zone on gsm in the US... no way.. Aug 13 11:04:29 panic? Aug 13 11:04:52 chem|st, purge! Aug 13 11:05:24 perhaps some transformer blew up and a minor EMP affected the signal? Aug 13 11:05:40 MohammadAG51: which of this daemons? Aug 13 11:05:49 achipa, Stskeeps on the thread about distmaster I have made a post, I would like your input and hopefully support about it :) Aug 13 11:06:08 abook? Aug 13 11:06:12 lcuk: looking into it Aug 13 11:07:08 ... Aug 13 11:07:14 another one -_- Aug 13 11:07:23 but full bars now :) Aug 13 11:07:30 ieatlint, T-Mobile 3G, NY btw Aug 13 11:07:39 outside the city also Aug 13 11:07:51 ugh, wtf Aug 13 11:07:58 1 bar again Aug 13 11:08:09 well, if it's like's the west coast, it's hit or miss, but better than att Aug 13 11:08:14 might be the bus too, feels like a faraday cage Aug 13 11:08:36 walls made out of metal Aug 13 11:09:32 ... Aug 13 11:12:45 What about the electrical wiring of the bus? Aug 13 11:13:02 TiagoTiago, true... iunno about that... Aug 13 11:13:21 how do i turn wifi off? Aug 13 11:13:29 some poorly maintained fluerescent bulbs might be causing sporadic intereference, no? Aug 13 11:13:30 unloading the module is enough right Aug 13 11:13:42 MohammadAG51, offline mode? Aug 13 11:13:52 ifconfig wlan0 down Aug 13 11:13:52 xnt14[N900]_, separately Aug 13 11:13:58 or wmaster0 down Aug 13 11:14:05 ShadowJK, still uses power though right? Aug 13 11:14:07 MohammadAG51, ah, k Aug 13 11:14:17 TiagoTiago, possibly Aug 13 11:14:44 MohammadAG51, not more than module unloaded I'd think? Aug 13 11:15:14 so it uses power even when the module is unloaded? Aug 13 11:16:09 MohammadAG51: let me check that Aug 13 11:16:10 whenever the wifi bug has hit, doing ifconfig wlan0 down has reduced consumption in standy from minimum of 230mA to a minimum of 16mA for the entire device, so I'd say it's "good enough" Aug 13 11:16:13 MohammadAG51, xnt14[N900]_ and anyone else, could you review this post about the maemo distmaster http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?p=785148#post785148 Aug 13 11:16:26 lcuk, k Aug 13 11:16:27 and get adding some thanks if it makes sense Aug 13 11:16:49 ShadowJK: the 16mA I get when I turn of wifi... means disconnect Aug 13 11:17:13 lcuk, k, in a bit Aug 13 11:17:16 achipa, \o Aug 13 11:17:21 ShadowJK, what about doing both? Aug 13 11:17:28 doh Aug 13 11:17:29 ifconfig down and modprobe -r Aug 13 11:17:41 lcuk, \o (I guess :) ) Aug 13 11:18:09 sorry achipa :P i mixed up attilas thanks with you :P Aug 13 11:19:24 lcuk: if that is a joke I need more coffee :) Aug 13 11:19:57 achipa, no I saw a thanks on my post and waved back at you before realising it wasnt you :P Aug 13 11:19:59 * achipa is happy he was able to trick meego.com so he didn't get a split personality (again) Aug 13 11:20:07 MohammadAG51, I'd be surprised if the module has code in the unload section that puts chip in lower power state, and that that code wouldn't be used when wifi is in unused state Aug 13 11:20:14 wierd... turning of wifi (disconnect) I get down to 7-9mA, going to offline mode I am stuck +17mA Aug 13 11:20:52 ok +11mA not 17mA Aug 13 11:21:27 * achipa 's mental processes threw an Exception parsing lcuk's statement Aug 13 11:21:36 chem|st, could it be that the wireless is still scanning in background? Aug 13 11:21:50 achipa, same here sorry just have more coffee Aug 13 11:22:22 psycho_oreos: in offline-mode? Aug 13 11:23:20 MohammadAG51: no difference between rmmod and no rmmod Aug 13 11:23:36 at least not on short notice (minutes) Aug 13 11:23:42 chem|st, yeah, I'm not too particularly sure what you meant by offline mode, as in ifconfig wlan0 down? and there's a possibility that the interface is still managed (and probably not dedicated management) by the wireless manager thingy Aug 13 11:24:03 * achipa curses at the misguided individual who registered on internettablettalk with his nick somewhere in 2007 Aug 13 11:26:49 lcuk, done Aug 13 11:27:58 psycho_oreos: first attempt was just hit disconnect and it went down to 7mA, second was turning on offline-mode, it went up to at least above 11mA, going the way back to rmmod it stayed at 13mA going back in online-mode it stayed at 12mA, modprobe stayed at 12mA... Aug 13 11:28:20 ifconfig it is Aug 13 11:28:37 MohammadAG51: what do you mean Aug 13 11:30:12 chem|st, still don't understand what you mean by offline mode, you mean the device not connected to mobile/cellular network at all? Aug 13 11:30:33 and disconnect being ifconfig wlan0 down? Aug 13 11:31:18 crashanddie, kya hal hai? (iunno, was bored... :P) Aug 13 11:39:16 i use wifiswitcher, is that not enough? :( Aug 13 11:40:42 hmm i wonder if i can apply the same hack as they did for "share via im" for "share via mms" Aug 13 11:41:33 frals: share *what* via mms? Aug 13 11:41:38 low-res photos? Aug 13 11:41:38 :/ Aug 13 11:41:39 frals, see albanc Aug 13 11:42:18 hi guys Aug 13 11:42:34 kerio: yes, sharing photos is one of the use cases of mms Aug 13 11:42:43 sharing *low-res* photos Aug 13 11:42:59 i wouldnt consider 5mpix low res, but each to his own Aug 13 11:43:17 you can't share a 5mp photo via mms :/ Aug 13 11:43:27 frals, http://alban.apinc.org/blog/2010/07/30/send-files-to-your-contacts-on-your-n900/ Aug 13 11:44:15 frals, do you want to do that in your application? we would need some kind of coordination to know where to place your button, and where to place Monorail's "Share via IM" button Aug 13 11:44:36 kerio: i can... :( Aug 13 11:44:40 lcuk: ta Aug 13 11:44:56 albanc: if its possible without messing up the "Share via IM" it would be neat Aug 13 11:45:06 frade, I guess the GtkTable increases automatically, although I didn't test it Aug 13 11:45:24 does monorail work with msn/pecan? Aug 13 11:45:28 and skype? Aug 13 11:46:30 kerio, For MSN, it works with telepathy-butterfly 0.5.12 and Papyon 0.4.9. But none of these versions are packaged yet Aug 13 11:46:45 it does not work for skype Aug 13 11:46:56 albanc: ok, ill have a look at it when i find some time, cheers :) Aug 13 11:47:05 frals: high-res photos over MMS possible, but might not work if it's a cheap phone receieving it, right? Aug 13 11:47:29 why would you use a MMS to send a photo to a phone that can receive emails? Aug 13 11:47:33 BCMM: yes, it gets lost in transit when sending to phones not supporting it or if your carrier hates you, which is usually the case Aug 13 11:47:58 When the telepathy connection manager implements File Sharing, the feature will be automatically added in Monorail: it tests the capabilities of your contacts correctly Aug 13 11:48:04 kerio: because MMS != email Aug 13 11:48:27 kerio: most people receiving MMS doesnt have push email setup on their phones, at least the ppl i know Aug 13 11:48:37 kerio: hence mms > email for my use case Aug 13 11:49:08 * frals is getting pretty tired of all the MMS hate :< none forces you to use it! Aug 13 11:49:16 frals: heh, my carrier sends me a sms when someone sends me an email Aug 13 11:49:26 which is exactly how MMS works, but without having to pay extra :D Aug 13 11:50:24 i dont pay extra for mms Aug 13 11:50:52 you don't pay extra to send them? :o Aug 13 11:50:58 s/extra / Aug 13 11:50:59 no Aug 13 11:51:02 * albanc is thinking of using g_object_set_qdata/g_object_get_qdata on the GtkTable to specify where the next button should be placed. If the qdata is absent, place the button on (2,2) and set the qdata to (2,3) or something. If the qdata is present place the button as specified by the qdata. Aug 13 11:51:03 frals: thats not the case for all ppl I know ;) Aug 13 11:51:32 frade, does it looks sane to use that to communicate between plugins? Aug 13 11:51:37 albanc: kludges over kludges = bad Aug 13 11:51:45 set up a "standard" way to add buttons there Aug 13 11:51:58 open sourcing lib sharing-dialog would be better Aug 13 11:52:04 albanc: sounds good Aug 13 11:52:32 I am not sure if dpkg-diverts can be done twice Aug 13 11:52:38 nokia: please release the source for libsharing-dialog Aug 13 11:52:44 nokia? Aug 13 11:52:51 hmm, not answering... Aug 13 11:53:33 i wonder when they're going to make angry pigs... Aug 13 11:53:37 maybe we need a component which does the dpkg-diverts and have a better interface to place other buttons? Aug 13 11:54:07 I'm not sure what is the right thing to do Aug 13 11:56:32 albanc, :) I am writing a request as we speak Aug 13 11:56:49 your hackery has shown its possible, but would be 100000000000% better if we could do it cleanly Aug 13 11:57:29 albanc: write a standard wrapper that takes care of that, so if/when it gets opensourced you can just change that instead of having to change every program Aug 13 12:00:35 https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=11128 Aug 13 12:00:36 Bug 11128: Opening the source for Sharing services framework Aug 13 12:00:46 albanc, frals and anyone interested in open sharing, please vote on this Aug 13 12:02:16 and albanc :) thank you for going through the trouble of working out how to do it even with the closed aspects. showing open source CAN work around road blocks is important Aug 13 12:11:38 bah, HEL subway needs better 3g coverage Aug 13 12:12:07 in what situation you use 3g ? Aug 13 12:12:19 hiiii Aug 13 12:12:24 voted Aug 13 12:12:38 i asking because i almost use 2g for almost every time because the battery drain Aug 13 12:13:09 heyy anyone! can anyone prove life sucks? Aug 13 12:13:20 wtf ? Aug 13 12:13:35 CameLinis: well, P!=NP Aug 13 12:13:56 if you're into crypto, life doesn't suck Aug 13 12:14:04 haha Aug 13 12:14:06 E0x: streaming ;) Aug 13 12:14:14 E0x: using the 'net Aug 13 12:14:17 well no, life full of sucking! Aug 13 12:14:23 kerio, :P Aug 13 12:14:27 400-500kb/s is not unusual here Aug 13 12:14:34 You're born, you suck your mother's tits. You get a little older, you suck your girlfriend's tits. You get married, you suck your wife's tits. That's what life is. Life sucks." Aug 13 12:14:35 i mean, not with my carrier :( Aug 13 12:14:39 but with the main one Aug 13 12:14:42 then life sucks Aug 13 12:15:19 CameLinis: thats not backwards compatible... Aug 13 12:15:42 chem|st: unless you get married to your mother Aug 13 12:16:19 kerio: ? Aug 13 12:16:40 kerio: if life sucks I get sucked not me sucking right? Aug 13 12:16:58 * chem|st is feeling swallowed Aug 13 12:17:15 lol, well, he got a point=x Aug 13 12:17:28 life does suck, i've not known anyone with a high IQ who claims otherwise Aug 13 12:17:50 btw i do a desktop switcher , for change desktop/view/workspace without wipe Aug 13 12:17:55 ieatlint: IQ is bullshit Aug 13 12:17:57 swipe* Aug 13 12:18:00 http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?p=780553 Aug 13 12:18:11 chem|st: depends what you think it means Aug 13 12:18:17 is a very dirty code and not very good , but "work" Aug 13 12:18:29 Chem|St: then whts not bullshit Aug 13 12:18:30 ? Aug 13 12:18:47 andre__, sounds good! Aug 13 12:19:15 ieatlint: by definition it is how old your mind is in regard of your real age so it is bullshit in regard of intelligence if you ask for opinion Aug 13 12:20:08 well, a young kid can own an adult person.. Aug 13 12:20:18 i disagree with your definition of IQ Aug 13 12:20:59 IQ: ability to shine, when everybody can't? Aug 13 12:21:12 many definitions.. Aug 13 12:21:18 at the age of 14 I had an IQ of 125, with math 105 language 135 and the others I don't remember, that doesn't mean I am some what genius, it just means I could do stuff an 18 year old is able to do... Aug 13 12:21:48 heh, either way, my point is not about defining IQ, but that above average intelligent people are prone to unhappier lives Aug 13 12:22:09 chem|st: so does a person aged 50 with a 125 IQ have the mind of a 60 year old? Aug 13 12:22:11 that makes no sense Aug 13 12:22:19 well but intelligent people got their limit Aug 13 12:22:33 intelligence != smart Aug 13 12:22:41 ieatlint: true Aug 13 12:22:57 intelligence is more linked to potential than anything else Aug 13 12:23:51 on a related note, i have whiskey Aug 13 12:23:55 well, not neccessary.. Aug 13 12:24:06 if u mind got tired, u can't solve things.. Aug 13 12:24:20 this means u not intelligent? Aug 13 12:24:23 IQ age-equivilence is generally accepted to level off by about 16, using ratio iq above that age is essentially meaningless, which is why deviation iq is the norm method these days Aug 13 12:24:35 no, it means you're tired Aug 13 12:25:17 then about what u said; ntelligence is more linked to potential than anything else? Aug 13 12:26:03 heh, all i can say is that i spend 80% of my time dealing with people with an IQ over 120, but i'm forced to deal with someone whose IQ is in the upper 70s... and wow Aug 13 12:26:14 blissful ignorance is only blissful when it's a choice Aug 13 12:26:24 any other way to make the cursor visible than the left swipe trick in browser? Aug 13 12:27:09 ihme-TTilus: nope Aug 13 12:27:38 fwiw, that left swipe isnt a trick, its just "the way" to make the cursor visible. Aug 13 12:27:53 frals, kerio : 2 packages (monorail for file transfers and mms) dpkg-diverting the same lib sharing-dialog cannot work... so, yes we need a better standard wrapper to have both sharing via IM and MMS... Aug 13 12:28:32 CameLinis: yeah that is exactly what they said after the test "Your potential skills for ... are, with an influence of ..." Aug 13 12:28:45 nid0: "trick" could be misleading term, yes Aug 13 12:29:16 or with a weightening... cant remember the exact words... but some alike Aug 13 12:30:02 the fact that the browser is capable of making the cursor visible brought up my hopes that it might me controllable in some other ways too ... which i prolly could use with x2x Aug 13 12:30:58 chem|st, btw, battery at 856mAh/68% holding up good so far :) Aug 13 12:31:44 Any idea whats causing this problem: Aug 13 12:31:45 http://img827.imageshack.us/img827/3228/screenshot2010081315261.png Aug 13 12:32:10 i did apt-get update and i still get it Aug 13 12:32:30 hmm Aug 13 12:32:41 there is a problem tho =x Aug 13 12:32:46 ORLY? Aug 13 12:33:00 yeah, u can't see? Aug 13 12:33:19 nah im blind Aug 13 12:33:35 no wonder, that's why u asked. Aug 13 12:33:52 asked? Aug 13 12:34:06 yeah? Aug 13 12:34:10 asked for you getting kicked :P? Aug 13 12:34:11 yep Aug 13 12:34:19 !kick CameLinis Aug 13 12:34:25 wtf with u Aug 13 12:34:30 infobot kick CameLinis Aug 13 12:34:32 * infobot kicks CameLinis Aug 13 12:34:35 owned :P Aug 13 12:35:06 infobot burry CameLinis alive Aug 13 12:35:07 hi, can anyone remind me how to set volume in maemo diablo? Aug 13 12:35:10 let me guess, when u get bored, u talk to the bot? Aug 13 12:35:16 ~botsnack Aug 13 12:35:17 kerio: :) Aug 13 12:35:19 it was something like echo 80 > /sys/.... Aug 13 12:36:51 hey, there *is* a problem with the microusb connector Aug 13 12:36:56 yay Aug 13 12:37:11 hopefully i can get a full replacement with the glued connector Aug 13 12:39:42 MohammadAG: why didn't you tell me that the faulty microusb port was a recognized problem? Aug 13 12:39:50 * kerio feels comforted Aug 13 12:40:01 o_O Aug 13 12:40:16 i asked a lot during these days Aug 13 12:40:25 and nobody told me it wasn't my fault ._. Aug 13 12:40:34 i felt guilty towards my cute little n900 Aug 13 12:42:53 kerio, it is your fault Aug 13 12:43:00 :'( Aug 13 12:43:01 actually, it's frals's Aug 13 12:43:04 yay Aug 13 12:43:10 * MohammadAG blames frals Aug 13 12:43:11 wait, he came here and broke my microusb port? Aug 13 12:43:16 that bastard! Aug 13 12:43:19 TTilus: I use this script that adds a icon in the app menu called MouseCursor , I'll get you the name of the package in a sec Aug 13 12:43:22 yeah, he also started WWII Aug 13 12:43:24 damn.. I'm afraid of getting usb problem. As you in civil world can't get support, what it will in russia? Aug 13 12:43:37 MohammadAG: :O so that's where Hitler hid Aug 13 12:43:43 i knew that suicide thing was fake Aug 13 12:43:45 no worries, in soviet russia, USB ports break you Aug 13 12:43:47 I suppose nokia stuff just shoot customers Aug 13 12:44:01 lol Aug 13 12:44:21 * TiagoTiago is frozen picturing giant sized USB charger raping people until their socket falls off Aug 13 12:44:35 O_O Aug 13 12:44:41 '_' Aug 13 12:44:45 >.< Aug 13 12:45:07 T.T Aug 13 12:45:35 nokia is nightmare... WAKE ME UP Aug 13 12:46:08 Wake me up inside Aug 13 12:46:35 somehow, I think no one here knows that song Aug 13 12:46:39 how to wake u up?:p Aug 13 12:46:57 Evanescence? Aug 13 12:46:57 hmm, save it..? Aug 13 12:47:01 yep. Aug 13 12:47:23 TiagoTiago, ty for proving me wrong, though I hate all their other songs xD Aug 13 12:47:43 inside the fire <3? Aug 13 12:47:59 * MohammadAG goes back to Bullet for my Valentine Aug 13 12:48:02 I prefer My Imortal Aug 13 12:48:09 I suppose if there's nothing on topic, this isn't off topic? Aug 13 12:48:23 what was the topic again? Aug 13 12:48:52 mohammad, where u from? Aug 13 12:49:06 Mars Aug 13 12:49:11 lol Aug 13 12:49:17 heaven :D? Aug 13 12:49:20 INCEPTION Aug 13 12:49:25 CameLinis, where are _you_ from? Aug 13 12:49:29 Jerusalem, PS/IL :P Aug 13 12:49:34 hehe Palestine Aug 13 12:49:40 lol Aug 13 12:49:49 ? Aug 13 12:49:56 NY,US here, pakistani-american Aug 13 12:49:59 xnt, why? u wanna marry me? Aug 13 12:50:15 I missed the joke, could someone care to explain to me please? Aug 13 12:50:25 CameLinis, lol, no. just cause you asked MohammadAG :P Aug 13 12:50:25 no need, u wont get it Aug 13 12:50:34 lol xnt i know :p Aug 13 12:51:05 CameLinis, tab completion? Aug 13 12:51:31 its a tad annoying, my notifications don't work... Aug 13 12:51:54 TiagoTiago: One bear walked in forset. Saw the burning car and sat in there. And burned. Aug 13 12:52:49 i see Aug 13 12:53:26 a quick question, in which folder/file are the shortcuts in the app menu stored? Aug 13 12:53:36 /usr/share/applications/hildon Aug 13 12:53:50 /usr/share/applications/hildon-home for widgets Aug 13 12:54:11 thanx Aug 13 13:01:09 TTilus, try: osso-xterm /usr/bin/togglemouse Aug 13 13:03:30 that is what the shortcut i mentioned does Aug 13 13:04:04 i'm not sure if it has always been there or if i installed that, i an't find any mouse related thing in the list of stuff to uninstall in HAM Aug 13 13:05:11 seems you don't need the osso-xterm part, you can run the togglemouse prog directly Aug 13 13:07:36 are you still there? Aug 13 13:08:08 hm, i can't receive files via skype in the N900? Aug 13 13:10:22 TiagoTiago, afaik, no, sadly Aug 13 13:10:26 MohammadAG, you have been monitoring specific changes made to hildon components a bit more than me - any chance you can put a list together of the different forks and variations Aug 13 13:10:37 so I can highlight them Aug 13 13:12:44 TTilus? Aug 13 13:19:12 the resolution for full wallpapaers isn't 3200x480? Aug 13 13:19:38 TiagoTiago, thats for panaromic wallpapers Aug 13 13:19:57 yeah Aug 13 13:20:15 that's what i meant Aug 13 13:20:48 do i have to split the image or is it supposed to work if i make it that resolotuion? Aug 13 13:26:02 who's interested in making a PS3Trophies.com app? Aug 13 13:26:56 lcuk, hmm, I'll check gitorious Aug 13 13:27:03 what is that ( PS3Trophies.com ) ? Aug 13 13:27:31 MohammadAG, gitorious shows us official ones and can be seen Aug 13 13:27:37 a site for tracking ps3 trophies, there was a request for an app here, http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=59732&page=1 Aug 13 13:27:59 talking to the main site dev, the api will use a pass so the app has to be closed Aug 13 13:28:05 closed source that is Aug 13 13:28:39 Stskeeps, something makes me thing there wont be budget for somebody to refill the role. Aug 13 13:29:35 TiagoTiago: ! Aug 13 13:29:35 GAN900: dunno Aug 13 13:29:50 it works? Aug 13 13:30:26 TiagoTiago: gonna try when im done eating Aug 13 13:30:33 ah, okie Aug 13 13:36:51 MohammadAG_: idea for phone control : IM status change Aug 13 13:39:02 E0x, will look into it :) Aug 13 13:46:38 Stskeeps, I can guess. Aug 13 13:48:51 GAN900: guessing never gets anyone everywhere when it comes to money, asking does Aug 13 13:48:51 :P Aug 13 13:51:10 GAN900, as I said to you the other night, it matters whether you market yourself as dead end or not. I for one will not let 5 years of hard work in the maemo system go into nothingness and think this whole damn community deserves to at least have someone fighting for that Aug 13 13:51:17 Stskeeps, last time we asked, the answer was "no". Aug 13 13:51:37 GAN900: for debmaster? Aug 13 13:51:42 So I'm not optimistic, although it'll certainly be pursued. Aug 13 13:51:43 Yes Aug 13 13:51:51 ovi maps is create using Qt libs right ? Aug 13 13:52:01 i mean ovi maps app Aug 13 13:52:21 i think ovi maps is mostly webruntime :) Aug 13 13:52:26 what do i have to know regarding the battery indicator and unofficial batteries? Aug 13 13:52:27 or even just different batteries Aug 13 13:52:32 does the battery chip get confused somehow' Aug 13 13:52:53 ? Aug 13 13:52:53 ovi maps sucks ._. Aug 13 13:52:58 The chip doesn't, the software does Aug 13 13:52:59 timeless: but the gui of settings and that kind of things Aug 13 13:53:02 ? Aug 13 13:53:10 i think so Aug 13 13:53:16 kerio: yes maybe but the gui is really good looking Aug 13 13:53:39 some of it might have just been HTML+CSS using Gecko Aug 13 13:53:44 in that was i thinking , because i saw the QPlaylist app and look a bit the same Aug 13 13:53:49 the rest of it was basically a plugin Aug 13 13:53:50 with open source, the future is in OUR hands and we determine its future. no OSS project can die. I will try to do what I can to allow it to flourish Aug 13 13:54:00 lcuk: bullshit. Aug 13 13:54:01 ShadowJK: what do i have to do then? Aug 13 13:54:14 it's a used battery vs a fake battery - which is possibly the worst combination there is, short of using a mugen battery Aug 13 13:54:16 lcuk: practicing to be a politician? Aug 13 13:54:17 kerio, so I've seen two behaviours. One is where it displays full until about 15% remaining, at which point it says it's empty "5%". In the other scenario the meter actually moves, but it says empty at 25%, and then shuts down 12 hours later. Aug 13 13:54:18 lcuk: Open source projects die when they do not keep up with other software for porrting. Aug 13 13:54:48 lcuk: I can point at a few opensource projects that have died, and would require huge effort to resurrect. Aug 13 13:55:04 http://www.complang.tuwien.ac.at/ulrich/mergemem/ Aug 13 13:55:13 mergemem - for example. Aug 13 13:55:14 open source projects can die easily Aug 13 13:55:20 Many other out-of-tree kernel modules. Aug 13 13:55:28 Even some in-tree. Aug 13 13:55:36 their codebase can't, though Aug 13 13:55:37 which is what matters Aug 13 13:55:55 If nobody's there to keep improving the code, of course it'll die. Aug 13 13:56:04 It's really not. Aug 13 13:56:12 And that's pretty much where we're at now. Aug 13 13:56:14 yes timeless - sometimes hearing downbeat bullshit for things we work around makes me :( Aug 13 13:56:33 If I can only use the app by installing a 1997 linux system - for whatever reason - it's dead. Aug 13 13:56:50 GAN900, of course, theres plenty of technically capable code there Aug 13 13:57:07 the meego apps should be runnable with some encouragment Aug 13 13:57:10 For example, I have some compressed ext2 filesystems somewhere. Aug 13 13:57:27 without having to change whilst meego OS isnt ready yet Aug 13 13:57:36 can incrementally update Aug 13 13:57:39 The compression format changed, and the only way to rrecover them would be to find out which 2.0.? kernel made them. Aug 13 13:57:43 and build a system Aug 13 13:57:45 and looking at opera revival Aug 13 13:57:53 SpeedEvil: but you *can* Aug 13 13:57:57 that's the point Aug 13 13:58:01 and all the mods and tweaks made to the already open code Aug 13 13:58:24 hell, if someone wanted they could resurrect mer Aug 13 13:58:58 'You can' is a most pernicious misconception. Aug 13 13:59:39 It's like saying "you can cut off your own leg", but really, you wouldn't. Aug 13 13:59:48 http://cu.nniling.us/644/ Aug 13 14:00:02 Also - wtf - I diddn't look at the URL Aug 13 14:00:11 haha Aug 13 14:00:21 http://xkcd.com/644/ Aug 13 14:00:45 timeless, its going to take something to actually try and open the code up, so I might as well practice Aug 13 14:00:53 lulz Aug 13 14:01:54 SpeedEvil, the difference with maemo is its a live running system with a non insignificant highly adept userbase Aug 13 14:02:11 Now, yes. Aug 13 14:02:22 lcuk, remember that problem I had with g and h turning off the phone? Aug 13 14:02:22 and we have seen from lots of sides that improvements come and patches float around Aug 13 14:02:45 The userbase may in fact be large enough to be a continuing community. Aug 13 14:04:06 Given unlimited time and unlimited expertise, sure, you can do anything. Aug 13 14:04:20 is there a way to wipe the content of my n900 without using a usb cable? Aug 13 14:04:32 jophish, hmm no? Aug 13 14:04:41 lcuk, rapidly dwindling. Aug 13 14:05:04 I think i saw it on the forum, or perhaps it was here Aug 13 14:05:17 kerio, you want an autodestruct mode? Aug 13 14:05:41 TiagoTiago: no, i'll just have to give my beloved phone to nokia Aug 13 14:05:49 and i'd like to wipe it good Aug 13 14:06:41 ah, get rid of porn and unauthorized copies of software and other artwork while leaving no trace that you did that? Aug 13 14:06:56 GAN900, i would be saying entirely different things had meego actually been a ready to use replacement on our devices Aug 13 14:07:08 TiagoTiago: i dont have that /usr/bin/togglemouse Aug 13 14:07:18 :( Aug 13 14:07:30 kerio: for x in /dev/*;do dd if=/dev/urandom of=$x;done Aug 13 14:07:43 TiagoTiago: maybe Aug 13 14:07:47 also my personal data Aug 13 14:07:55 SpeedEvil: i bet nokia won't like that Aug 13 14:08:06 just rm -rf /home/user/MyDocs and reset device/browser to default/clear cache etc? that or write over everything from /dev/urandom if you're real paranoid Aug 13 14:08:27 lcuk, anyway, I solved the problem. The pins on the battery had become a bit loose, and certain key combinations must have been flexing the phone just so that the - terminal would lose contact Aug 13 14:08:34 nid0: good point Aug 13 14:08:37 Out of interest, what does the third pin do on the battery? Aug 13 14:08:38 umm, isn't there a clear data option in settings? Aug 13 14:08:40 jophish, o_O wow Aug 13 14:08:51 brb, need to reboot, speakers not working Aug 13 14:08:51 jophish: irt's little more than a battery present connection Aug 13 14:08:53 jophish: data Aug 13 14:08:54 MohammadAG_: Yes there is. Aug 13 14:08:59 it's not data Aug 13 14:09:02 It's a resistor Aug 13 14:09:07 SpeedEvil: "i'm here" it's data Aug 13 14:09:30 jophish, did you bend the pins back in ? o_O Aug 13 14:09:47 lcuk, yeah, after buying a new battery :/ Aug 13 14:09:52 works fine now Aug 13 14:09:58 LOL Aug 13 14:09:59 lol, at least you have a spare Aug 13 14:10:18 * lcuk has not heard of that ever being a problem on any device Aug 13 14:10:30 Taking an aeroplane journey tomorrow, so useful for that Aug 13 14:11:31 GAN900, I would like to allow the Meego handset apps to run individually on maemo. it will help allow developers to improve those applications Aug 13 14:11:34 thereby helping everyone Aug 13 14:11:44 without having to give up a nice stable OS to do so Aug 13 14:11:51 how can i find what the package is called if i only have the app menu shortcut? Aug 13 14:12:01 i bought a unofficial battery + external charger with usb port that hopefully works like the nokia wallcharger - probably not - for 20€ shipped Aug 13 14:12:34 TiagoTiago you have the shortcut name? Aug 13 14:14:45 and the shortcut file Aug 13 14:19:29 hello! I get something strange on my N900... I m trying to show a color gradient picture in my Qt application, and it looks bad, gradient is not smoothy! Like when you convert a gradient 24 bits to 16 bits Aug 13 14:20:10 well, thats to be expected since the x11 is set to 16bit Aug 13 14:20:20 or 15 or whatever it actually is Aug 13 14:20:20 why? Aug 13 14:20:34 multitude of historical performance reasons lost in time Aug 13 14:20:51 Is the hardware display 24? Aug 13 14:21:51 no Aug 13 14:21:57 this is written on the box.. Aug 13 14:22:18 it's 16? Aug 13 14:22:33 http://pastebin.com/7bipRFRL <- the contents of the shortcut file Aug 13 14:22:51 well, smoeone's box.. Aug 13 14:23:05 i think the display is actually 24 but 16 performs better.. Aug 13 14:23:40 TiagoTiago: looks like bluetooth mouse support pkg has showmouse/hidemouse binaries which the togglemouse supposedly uses Aug 13 14:23:49 TiagoTiago: thanks alot! Aug 13 14:24:02 less bits to send to the GPU? Aug 13 14:24:06 cool :) Aug 13 14:24:11 cool! * Aug 13 14:24:16 SpeedEvil, YUV mode shows full colour textures, so much so, when I switch between YUV and RGB I can see gradient steps appear from where smooth ones were visible before Aug 13 14:24:34 http://pastebin.com/LVbCWDB1 Aug 13 14:24:37 xdpyinfo Aug 13 14:24:46 does that mean X can do 24? Aug 13 14:25:03 In general - less data moved means less power use. Aug 13 14:25:20 x11 certainly can, whether all the fixes in place ontop and the compositor etc can is a different issue Aug 13 14:25:23 I have one laptop that uses 10% less power when on (at dimmest brightness) with a 4 bit display than a 24 Aug 13 14:25:28 less data == more speed Aug 13 14:26:08 lcuk: how bpp is YUV? Aug 13 14:26:10 lcuk: 16? Aug 13 14:26:13 24 Aug 13 14:26:20 So look here : http://img26.xooimage.com/files/5/7/a/screenshot-20100813-162200-1f3e3fc.png Aug 13 14:26:20 but different pixel layout Aug 13 14:26:24 less colour pixels Aug 13 14:26:38 lcuk: don't you just need to do tone/colour mapping? Aug 13 14:26:45 well, "just" is maybe the wrong word Aug 13 14:26:52 I need to work out how to get xrandr to do non-orthogonal screens. Aug 13 14:26:57 It _should_ be possible. Aug 13 14:27:01 lcuk, you're not using YV12? Aug 13 14:27:03 I remember back a few Windows versions ago there was some sort of glitch with the drivers that made using 16bpp slower than 24bpp Aug 13 14:27:07 crashanddie, for a tiny square of 4 pixels Aug 13 14:27:13 lcuk, YUY2? Aug 13 14:27:14 there are 4 bytes of grey information Aug 13 14:27:16 DrIDK: that's ugly ._. Aug 13 14:27:17 The manpage says you can. I want a 30 degree offset display on my laptop Aug 13 14:27:24 and 2 bytes of U and V info Aug 13 14:27:42 kerio:do you have a solution Aug 13 14:27:43 ? Aug 13 14:27:44 ShadowJK, I cannot remember the technical name for it I will hunt Aug 13 14:31:23 lcuk, well is it planar or packed? :P Aug 13 14:32:22 ShadowJK, the xvideo layer I write to is planar, but the data is transfered t othe LCD from xv using some chunky format - so BOTH Aug 13 14:32:38 :P Aug 13 14:32:57 Is there a 'simple' way to show an arbitrary colour on the main indicator LED? Aug 13 14:33:09 Or is it make a new pattern Aug 13 14:39:26 I forgot, what's the name of that organisation that defends open source? the big one Aug 13 14:39:54 fsf? Aug 13 14:40:00 TiagoTiago, EFF Aug 13 14:40:02 ? Aug 13 14:40:15 Electronic Frontier Foundation. Aug 13 14:40:45 IS that the one that is the world referenec for "open source" ? Aug 13 14:41:03 Is* Aug 13 14:41:07 hmm Aug 13 14:41:22 I'm trying to rmember the name of that one that gives a seal of aproval for licenses that are trully free Aug 13 14:41:29 ah Aug 13 14:41:32 osu Aug 13 14:41:37 hmm Aug 13 14:43:31 it isn't EFF , is it? Aug 13 14:43:31 TiagoTiago, open source initiative - http://www.opensource.org/approval Aug 13 14:43:47 hmm Aug 13 14:43:51 TiagoTiago, OSI licenses Aug 13 14:44:20 Termana, opensource initiative = osi btw Aug 13 14:44:28 open source != free software Aug 13 14:44:41 TiagoTiago, no, eff advocates oss and net neutrality Aug 13 14:44:43 etc Aug 13 14:44:48 privacy rights Aug 13 14:44:59 freedom of speech too, no? Aug 13 14:45:02 xnt14[N900], I know, but you quicker than me Aug 13 14:45:03 :P Aug 13 14:45:06 you were* Aug 13 14:45:14 TiagoTiago, yes Aug 13 14:45:44 crashanddie, on the amphetamines yet? Aug 13 14:45:53 Termana, lol, I'm on an N900 too... Aug 13 14:45:54 ty Aug 13 14:46:05 E0x, join us now and share the software, you'll be free hackers you'll be freeeee Aug 13 14:46:06 hm, perhaps FSF is the one i'm going for? Aug 13 14:46:23 TiagoTiago, the FSF licenses are those that are free software licenses Aug 13 14:46:24 TiagoTiago, for what? Aug 13 14:46:33 the one i'm trying to remember Aug 13 14:46:53 https://secure.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/wiki/Free_Software_Foundation Aug 13 14:47:33 Oh I scrolled up Aug 13 14:47:41 the original question wasn't even about licenses Aug 13 14:47:42 :P Aug 13 14:47:56 lol Aug 13 14:48:29 TiagoTiago, are you looking for the organisation that does legalese for the FSF? Aug 13 14:48:36 The Software Freedom Law Center? Aug 13 14:49:21 Or what exactly are you defining as defend? Aug 13 14:49:51 GAN900: nope, trying to find a file that is actually a directory, which has a hidden file, which could be named randomly (but we're not sure), and the file(directory)name isn't sure either Aug 13 14:50:06 GAN900: on a production server, where we're also doing our tests Aug 13 14:50:40 *snif* *snif* What is that I smell? Is grandma baking her nice recipe for disaster again? Aug 13 14:50:58 i'm reading this thread on tmo about a petition for opening Maemo, when i'm finished with the 5 pages i'm gonna psot there that i think it wuold be better to make a "bet" with Nokia , people that want them to open stuff will donate to a fund, and if after N years Nokia hasn't openeed things enough, the money would go to FSF instead Aug 13 14:51:25 id they do open it, they get the money Aug 13 14:51:48 if* Aug 13 14:51:58 * mgedmin somehow doubts the amount of money in such a fund would be noticeable compared to nokia's usual income Aug 13 14:52:01 TiagoTiago: you really think that a couple thousand dollars makes a difference to a multinational which has a market capitalisation of $33.000.000.000? Aug 13 14:52:11 crashanddie: list all files and fodlers and sort by date? or you don't know when it was created? Aug 13 14:52:13 hey, it's a free couple thousand dollars Aug 13 14:52:35 kerio: you can't actually donate money to a publicly traded company Aug 13 14:52:42 invest it so it will grow by itself over the years Aug 13 14:53:11 You could promise to buy a whole heap of Nokia shares Aug 13 14:53:20 They should only be a couple of cents at the moment right? Aug 13 14:53:25 :P Aug 13 14:53:38 the donation is to help open up the code, spread free open source software, either by nokia doing it, or by giving the money to FSF for them to do their thing Aug 13 14:53:40 TiagoTiago: ok, let's admit that we manage to grab $5000 from donations Aug 13 14:53:51 SpeedEvil: (LED color) just write arbitrary values to */brightness Aug 13 14:53:53 remeber this will last a few years Aug 13 14:54:24 Nokia is getting $10000 at least from each MeeGo conference sponsors I doubt they are too worried about the communities $5000 :P Aug 13 14:54:25 it's not jsut a one time event, over the yearspeople will donate more and more Aug 13 14:54:38 TiagoTiago: and that we get an 8% interest rate (very unlikely), after 3 years, we'd only have some $6300 Aug 13 14:54:48 s/communities/community's/ Aug 13 14:55:00 TiagoTiago: even after 10 years, there would only be $11000 or something Aug 13 14:55:20 that's not even 3 months worth of salary for ONE engineer. Aug 13 14:55:24 even if the money was invested in somthing profitable for the duration? Aug 13 14:55:33 TiagoTiago: erhm... yes, at 8% Aug 13 14:55:43 you don't get 8% these days Aug 13 14:55:47 you get maybe... 3%? Aug 13 14:56:07 the higher the interest, the higher the risk, so there's a good chance everything would be lost anyway Aug 13 14:56:12 is there a way to manually enable and disable catalogues? Aug 13 14:56:30 * crashanddie facepalms at most people's understanding of credits and interests Aug 13 14:56:45 what about savings account? Aug 13 14:56:56 TiagoTiago: exactly the same principle? Aug 13 14:57:04 not enough? Aug 13 14:57:22 interests never made that much money in low amounts Aug 13 14:57:37 i gotta move me to a country with an 8% interest rate Aug 13 14:57:46 mc_teo`: yeah, I wouldn't mind that either Aug 13 14:58:06 2.75% on one year deposit accounts here atm Aug 13 14:58:26 yeah, best account in FR is currently 2.75 for 3 months, then 1.45% Aug 13 14:58:36 3.75% is the highest ive seen, but thats with a 3 year deposit Aug 13 14:58:38 hi :) Aug 13 14:58:41 DocScrutinizer: hmm - why diddn't I think that's work Aug 13 14:58:42 I once met a guy that had inherit so much money that jsut keeping it invested was giving him like about 5k profit each month Aug 13 14:58:55 TiagoTiago: well, yeah, but only if you have heaps of money Aug 13 14:59:04 i have a question how can i install flashplayer for firefox on n900 Aug 13 14:59:06 TiagoTiago: and the more money you have, the lesser the interest rate Aug 13 14:59:07 ? Aug 13 14:59:17 really? Aug 13 14:59:41 ? Aug 13 14:59:44 SpeedEvil: maybe because it'll getting overwritten whenever mce changes pattern? Aug 13 14:59:46 TiagoTiago: well, yeah... If you invest $2 million, it only gives you like $16000 a year Aug 13 14:59:47 Then why don't you split it over hundreds of savings accoutns each with just a few hundred bucks in it and profit big? Aug 13 14:59:49 ? Aug 13 15:00:00 TiagoTiago: taxes Aug 13 15:00:05 oh Aug 13 15:00:11 SpeedEvil: which basically is on every kbd event at very least Aug 13 15:00:16 forgot about those bastards Aug 13 15:00:20 ITT: people trying to make money from money Aug 13 15:00:22 DocScrutinizer Aug 13 15:00:25 Doc Aug 13 15:00:26 but if you invest big, dont they give you like a really good rate? Aug 13 15:00:28 sigh Aug 13 15:00:31 DocScrutinizer Aug 13 15:00:34 mc_teo`: nope Aug 13 15:00:36 argh Aug 13 15:00:44 yes? Aug 13 15:00:44 hey can anyone solve myproblem ? Aug 13 15:00:49 mc_teo`: well, most likely because people who invest big numbers don't want to take any risks Aug 13 15:00:51 DocScrutinizer: In this app - not an issue Aug 13 15:01:05 * DocScrutinizer nods Aug 13 15:01:31 mc_teo`: Say you invest 5 million, would you rather make 50k a year with near 100% certainty you get everything back, or make 500k and risk losing half your initial bet? Aug 13 15:01:33 how can i install flashplayer so that i can browse www.speedtest.net on maemo ? Aug 13 15:01:51 DocScrutinizer: I want to make the LED go different colours on wakeups Aug 13 15:02:06 h4xordood: Are you aware of the app 'speedy' ? Aug 13 15:02:11 no Aug 13 15:02:33 http://maemo.org/packages/view/speedy/ Aug 13 15:02:34 SpeedEvil, anyways i want flashplayer for other reasons also :) Aug 13 15:02:41 SpeedEvil: on wakeups? like in boot? Aug 13 15:02:41 meh, i thought if you were just saving big moneyz in banks, they'd give you a corperate rate or something Aug 13 15:02:59 do we have any flashplayer for this Aug 13 15:03:00 DocScrutinizer: no - I mean on wakeups as powertop would report Aug 13 15:03:14 I see Aug 13 15:03:16 mc_teo`: well, if you want to take the risk, sure, go for it Aug 13 15:03:50 mc_teo`: most banks will welcome you if you say you want a 10% interest rate on $2 million, but they'll also make you sign gazillions of legalese saying there is a good chance you will lose your money Aug 13 15:03:57 sorry network problem Aug 13 15:04:11 so do we have flashplayer for maemo ? Aug 13 15:04:19 mc_teo`: plus, if you invest that kind of money, you're more likely going to do it by yourself (buy funds or shares directly, or buy parts in companies) Aug 13 15:04:35 h4xordood: for maemo5: yes, flash9 Aug 13 15:04:47 how to install that Aug 13 15:04:49 rather than ask a bank to do it in your stead (that's the only thing banks do) Aug 13 15:04:51 any link > Aug 13 15:04:52 ? Aug 13 15:04:58 h4xordood, preinstalled? Aug 13 15:05:00 h4xordood: it's already instralled in microb Aug 13 15:05:30 so why doesnt it works when i open speedtest.net Aug 13 15:07:09 works here Aug 13 15:07:15 Maybe it hates you Aug 13 15:07:35 speedtest.net works fine here in microb, funny thing is that speedlimited 3g data plan I have reports 0.39/0.99mbps so practically only download is limited (384kbps) Aug 13 15:07:54 not bad for 4 euros per month :P Aug 13 15:08:25 ah brb :) thanks alot Aug 13 15:08:46 they should have addee a tiny magnet to the tip of the stylus to detect when it has been pullsed out, and perhaps even cover the underside of the screen with an array of reed switches or some other magnetometer to detect pen hover Aug 13 15:09:04 added* Aug 13 15:10:04 Hi Aug 13 15:10:44 TiagoTiago, magnets, how do they work? Aug 13 15:10:50 What error msg is it giving you crashanddie? Aug 13 15:10:52 lol Aug 13 15:11:09 lcuk: Aligned spins of electrons, or bulk electron currents. Aug 13 15:11:11 TiagoTiago: a sensor for missing stylus had been suggested and would probably have been easy and cheap if only it had been on the product requirement specs. Better done by one of the IR sensors like used for proximity and lens slider Aug 13 15:11:24 TiagoTiago: eh? I'm not getting any error message Aug 13 15:11:33 what happens when you try to acess the site? Aug 13 15:11:39 wtf? Aug 13 15:11:46 TiagoTiago: wrong person Aug 13 15:11:50 Tey use magnets for detecting when the keyboard is out, no? Aug 13 15:11:52 oh, oops Aug 13 15:11:59 * TiagoTiago scrolls back to see the right name Aug 13 15:12:06 TiagoTiago: Adding more than one sensor is not free Aug 13 15:13:05 TiagoTiago: back cover and kbd slide are reed/hall and magnet, yes Aug 13 15:13:18 well, the light sensor doesn't seem to do much, i never notice screen brightness changing when i cover the area, regardless of the brightness i have set Aug 13 15:13:33 and quite a number of users complained about the side effects Aug 13 15:13:36 it knows you are trying to trick it with finger :P Aug 13 15:13:38 TiagoTiago: If you insrtall simple brightrness applet it largely ignores the brightness sensor Aug 13 15:13:50 * SpeedEvil sighs at his keyboard. Aug 13 15:14:03 SpeedEvil: nope Aug 13 15:14:06 I need to dismantle it fully, and see if I can fix overly sensitive 'r' Aug 13 15:14:17 that is the one that addes the brightness settigns like fromt he control panel, in the power button menu, no? Aug 13 15:14:18 s/largely/somewhart/ Aug 13 15:14:22 TiagoTiago: yes Aug 13 15:14:25 SpeedEvil: it just completely ignores ALS when set to level5 Aug 13 15:14:31 I don't have it Aug 13 15:14:51 I never noticed the equivalent system working on my N73 either Aug 13 15:15:20 TiagoTiago: isn't that a good thing when it works so smoothly you never even noticed it? Aug 13 15:15:40 But even when convering the sensor to make it htink it's dark? Aug 13 15:17:10 it's probably sensitive to Ir too, right? Aug 13 15:17:11 TiagoTiago: WFM Aug 13 15:17:50 ? Aug 13 15:17:51 TiagoTiago: there's a delay though Aug 13 15:18:32 also you'll notice the kbd backlight switching off on reduced ambient light / covering sensor Aug 13 15:18:45 s/off/on Aug 13 15:19:15 switching off kbd BL on high ambient brightness Aug 13 15:19:15 is there a prog to get live readings of the sensor and what is the state of the brightness correction fo the display? Aug 13 15:19:52 cat `find /sys -name lux` Aug 13 15:21:23 also luxmeter Aug 13 15:21:47 http://maemo.org/packages/view/luxus/ Aug 13 15:21:51 can't open no such file or directory Aug 13 15:23:42 hmm, might need root Aug 13 15:24:03 no, that cat line, before getting the prog Aug 13 15:24:37 eh? Aug 13 15:24:42 how much of the brightness of the screen is the backlight and how much is the LCD going opaque? Aug 13 15:24:52 [12:19] cat `find /sys -name lux` Aug 13 15:24:53 none is going opaque Aug 13 15:25:01 ~ $ cat `find /sys -name lux` Aug 13 15:25:02 35 Aug 13 15:25:47 ~sorry Aug 13 15:25:48 * infobot appologizes profusely to everyone, points at the spammers, and says: "IT'S THEIR FAULT, I DIDN'T WANNA DO IT!!!" Aug 13 15:27:05 ok, got the widget running, but it only reports what is measured by the sensor, and not how much the screen is made brighter darker due to those measurements, right? Aug 13 15:27:20 TiagoTiago: the actual screen dimming is managed by mce blackbox Aug 13 15:27:48 no way to measure twhat the mce is doing with the screen? Aug 13 15:28:16 probably you can read out absolute screen brightness value from /sys Aug 13 15:28:53 or run mce with strace attached? Aug 13 15:29:21 cat /sys/class/backlight/acx565akm/actual_brightness Aug 13 15:29:21 0 Aug 13 15:30:05 66 Aug 13 15:30:08 76 Aug 13 15:30:50 never thought you'd be interested in *reading* that :-P looking at the screen to see actual brightness is so much easier Aug 13 15:31:12 Not when devicre is on the floor Aug 13 15:31:21 hehe Aug 13 15:31:31 i don't notice it changing Aug 13 15:31:42 (still typing the command) Aug 13 15:31:52 yeah, I was wondering ehy I got 76, had to go next room and notice it's unlocked Aug 13 15:32:11 TiagoTiago: it has a delay Aug 13 15:32:17 some 20s maybe Aug 13 15:32:32 maybe 10 Aug 13 15:34:14 ok, gonna keep covering the sensor and waiting Aug 13 15:34:20 so setting your brightness to one tick under max, then holding the device facing to bright source of light, and then covering the sensor upper right corner should give you both changing lux values and a screen dimming a few seconds after sensor is covered Aug 13 15:34:29 btw, does it care whether the proximity sensor is sensing anything or not? Aug 13 15:34:39 usually not Aug 13 15:36:39 (give you) plus of course kbd backlight switching on when covering sensor (after delay expired) Aug 13 15:37:53 lol, it gets darker when it gets darker, of course, duh Xp Aug 13 15:38:32 eh? what else? Aug 13 15:38:51 i wasn't really thinking much about what it was supposed to do Aug 13 15:39:47 aah, so making us explain to you in epic verbousity Aug 13 15:40:10 it gets too dark if i'm not pointing the sensor to the sunny window :/ Aug 13 15:41:12 no, i was the one that noticed it got darker isntrad of brighter, you didn't explain that Aug 13 15:41:47 that comment voided your credits for the next ten questions Aug 13 15:41:54 how so? Aug 13 15:43:02 i knew it was meant to change brightness, but untill i pointed to a very bright light source (the overcast white sky on the window) i hadn't seen the brightness change at all in any direction Aug 13 15:44:33 I was expecting the screen, being transreflective, to get brighter when lit by bright light simply because of ht emirror in the back, so when it gets darker it owudl need more of it's own light in order to appear to have the same brightness; but it doesn't work like that Aug 13 15:45:03 Transflective it sort of is. Aug 13 15:45:10 But only in the very brightest of lights Aug 13 15:45:25 hmm, do i have to have a micro sd formatted to anything in particular for it to be picked up by maemo? Aug 13 15:45:47 echo 0 >>/sys/class/backlight/acx565akm/brightness Aug 13 15:45:48 vfat Aug 13 15:45:55 isntead of counting with external light it gotta fight to be bright enough to be seen Aug 13 15:46:08 i have 4gb kingston, thats formatted to fat32 atm Aug 13 15:46:18 should work Aug 13 15:46:22 should i reboot for it to pick it up Aug 13 15:46:34 not usually needed Aug 13 15:46:40 In many lights, this isn't very visible at all Aug 13 15:46:45 just close back cover Aug 13 15:47:10 its a sdhc if that has any impact Aug 13 15:47:18 nope Aug 13 15:49:50 i've seen displays (not personaly) that looked like paper, no need for it's own light while other lights were around, i was expecting transflective to at least be close to that Aug 13 15:50:08 yeah now its reading it Aug 13 15:50:14 cannot creat permission denied Aug 13 15:50:24 that echo line Aug 13 15:50:29 you have to be root Aug 13 15:50:43 I tried prepending sudo Aug 13 15:51:17 sudo isn't enabled by default for arbitrary commands afaik Aug 13 15:52:08 :/ Aug 13 15:52:22 ok, after sudo gainroot it worked Aug 13 15:53:46 damn, either there is not enough trans, or not enough flect going on, white areas almost as dark as the black case itself Aug 13 15:53:55 :( Aug 13 15:54:19 It's OK in bright direct light. Aug 13 15:54:31 not really Aug 13 15:54:46 i mean, without the assitance of the backlight Aug 13 15:54:49 assitance Aug 13 15:55:21 kinda looks like the screen of my 3650 without backlight Aug 13 15:55:33 like a gameboy that you pulled the battery while it was running Aug 13 15:55:38 the first ones, not the new ones Aug 13 15:56:28 and this with a lightbulb so bright that if you stare straight into it you still can't make out the details, it gets overexposed (kinda hurts to look actually) Aug 13 15:57:01 I was hoping it would at least be as good as a wristwatch display Aug 13 15:57:31 the glass reflects more than the screen itself Aug 13 15:57:54 yesyes we got your point Aug 13 15:58:07 this is a color display Aug 13 15:58:32 there's virtually no good transflexife color LCD Aug 13 15:58:40 that is disapointing Aug 13 15:59:12 Consider that half of all light is absorbed by the polarisers. Then 2/3 of that light is absorbed by hitting the wrong colour of pixel. Aug 13 15:59:20 PixelQi? Aug 13 15:59:24 So at best you get 1/6th reflected Aug 13 15:59:35 In pracrtice with most displays, a lot elss Aug 13 15:59:42 i thought that for white the pixels would go transparent Aug 13 15:59:52 no wrong color absorbing anything Aug 13 16:00:42 TiagoTiago: they do. Aug 13 16:00:53 TiagoTiago: but there is a red, green, or blue filter on each pixel too. Aug 13 16:01:24 i thought the LCD twisting to block light was the only filter even on color LCDs Aug 13 16:01:32 It's not. Aug 13 16:01:40 hm Aug 13 16:01:48 The colours are implemented by colour filrters. Aug 13 16:01:52 [Announce] PyLint 0.21.1 should be available in few minutes in Extras-devel repository Aug 13 16:02:01 [Announce] PyPackager 3.0.20 should be available in few minutes in Extras-devel repository Aug 13 16:02:05 Without them you get a - somewhat brighter - b+w display Aug 13 16:02:12 [Announce] VectorMine 1.1.0 should be available in few minutes in Extras-devel repository Aug 13 16:02:43 awesome khertan_ \o/ Aug 13 16:02:46 When you squeeze a n&w LCD you get all sorts of colors, i thought color LCDs just did that in a more contorled way Aug 13 16:02:57 b&w* Aug 13 16:03:19 nope Aug 13 16:03:33 I m looking for a designer that can design me icons for Khweeteur (A n900 twitter client) ... ? Any one interested ? : http://khertan.net/khweeteur for a screenshot Aug 13 16:03:37 when you poke your eye, you also see all kinds of colors Aug 13 16:03:55 i thinkt hose are called phosphenes Aug 13 16:03:59 DocScrutinizer51, we need verification first Aug 13 16:04:01 can you reproduce Aug 13 16:04:03 lcuk: yep :) i was testing a automated script which create src package and send it directly to autobuilder :) Aug 13 16:04:27 but there is a difference between overheatign a CCD and bringing a magnet to a CRT Aug 13 16:04:41 lcuk: now i need to script the last manual operation, the one which convert a setup.py to a deb source script Aug 13 16:04:49 s/script/package Aug 13 16:05:15 thats cool khertan_ Aug 13 16:05:29 lcuk: http://pypi.python.org/pypi?%3Aaction=search&term=pypackager&submit=search Aug 13 16:05:31 and khweeteur looks good to Aug 13 16:05:34 thx Aug 13 16:05:40 its a bit of a mouthful to try and pronounce though! Aug 13 16:05:53 héhé ... i like unpronoucable thiings Aug 13 16:06:26 * DocScrutinizer suggests wikipedia to TiagoTiago Aug 13 16:07:24 suggestion accepted Aug 13 16:07:48 lcuk: you can hear how it should be pronounce here : http://translate.google.fr/translate_t?hl=&ie=UTF-8&text=Khweeteur&sl=en&tl=fr# Aug 13 16:07:49 :) Aug 13 16:08:43 the article on transflectives is a stub :( Aug 13 16:09:06 and how to pronounce my nickname : http://translate.google.fr/translate_t?hl=&ie=UTF-8&text=Khweeteur&sl=en&tl=en#en|en|Khertan Aug 13 16:09:07 :) Aug 13 16:09:20 back Aug 13 16:09:40 heh Aug 13 16:09:44 must go on ... maybe see you on my n900 in the train :) Aug 13 16:09:51 bye Aug 13 16:09:56 khertan_: oh, hello, wanted to ask you a question before Aug 13 16:10:01 wait Aug 13 16:10:04 quick :) Aug 13 16:10:14 i cannot miss the last train :) Aug 13 16:10:25 on khwittereur, how far is it away from being complete? Aug 13 16:10:37 xnt14, review it for us and tell us Aug 13 16:10:43 xnt14: depending what feature are you waiting for :) Aug 13 16:10:47 it looks like a good client, but I want it finished soon... Aug 13 16:10:48 hmm Aug 13 16:10:50 k Aug 13 16:10:52 i use it everyday Aug 13 16:10:58 notification aren't working Aug 13 16:10:58 hmm Aug 13 16:11:00 well Aug 13 16:11:01 and no search Aug 13 16:11:06 it won't load my tweets Aug 13 16:11:09 icons are horrible Aug 13 16:11:12 just one dm Aug 13 16:11:16 other than that Aug 13 16:11:18 it works fine Aug 13 16:11:20 ? Aug 13 16:11:28 i ve never package it Aug 13 16:11:30 it only loads 1 tweet on the timeline Aug 13 16:11:42 khertan_: I ran the __init.py__ manually Aug 13 16:11:44 This should work, get a transparent LCD, get mirror, coat the mirror with RGTB layers of paint on transparent OLED and there you go Aug 13 16:11:53 from gitourius Aug 13 16:11:54 RGB* Aug 13 16:11:56 ah ... oups ... gitorious isn't up to date Aug 13 16:12:00 ah Aug 13 16:12:02 2s Aug 13 16:12:05 can you update it soon? Aug 13 16:12:11 khertan_, go catch your train Aug 13 16:12:16 if you can, thanks :) Aug 13 16:12:21 see you later Aug 13 16:12:23 lcuk: right :P Aug 13 16:12:26 good luck Aug 13 16:12:49 yep ... it s updated Aug 13 16:12:55 i come back in 2 min Aug 13 16:13:01 khertan_: ok Aug 13 16:13:02 (with 3g) Aug 13 16:15:33 re Aug 13 16:15:52 interesting, i put on somepolarizing glasses and the screen of the N900 doesn't look anything like what i expected Aug 13 16:16:33 rotate 90 degrees. Aug 13 16:16:51 (normal to the screen plane) Aug 13 16:17:09 it's jsut slightly rainbowish Aug 13 16:17:37 that hsouldn't matter since each eye on a polirizer 3D glasses is 90 degrees to the other Aug 13 16:17:37 Did you try the new version ? Aug 13 16:18:44 but at extreme angles up and down the rainbow moire patterns icnrease significantly (but not from extreme side to side angles) Aug 13 16:19:22 Khertan_n900: hmm, just downloaded it, noticed that the setup.py isn't empty anymore Aug 13 16:19:26 should I run it? Aug 13 16:22:01 xnt14: yep but icon are shit Aug 13 16:22:11 it s stupid jpg Aug 13 16:22:36 which i can t convert onboard Aug 13 16:22:39 Khertan_n900: hmm, It doesn't matter, all I need is the functionality... Aug 13 16:22:47 well, it doesn't matter atm Aug 13 16:23:21 notifications can full your taks launcher :) Aug 13 16:23:35 refresh is working Aug 13 16:24:01 Nokia 770 PAND question on the mailing lists - anyone able to offer any input to the dude Aug 13 16:24:03 http://www.spinics.net/lists/maemo-users/msg16455.html Aug 13 16:24:07 to reply double click on tweet Aug 13 16:24:10 hmm, :) Aug 13 16:24:36 and the browser icon open link of the selected tweets Aug 13 16:24:36 Khertan_n900: error: http://xceleo.pastebin.com/8XyZkekt Aug 13 16:25:55 seems i forgot some file in the commit :) Aug 13 16:26:00 hmm Aug 13 16:26:11 can you push to the repo from your N900? Aug 13 16:26:49 or just put that file on pastebin Aug 13 16:27:33 new commit pushed Aug 13 16:27:42 Khertan_n900: ok, thank you :) Aug 13 16:28:17 yes i dev ondevice ... commit on device ... package on device ... upload to repo on device ... update site on device :) Aug 13 16:28:18 xnt14, khertan can do pretty much everything from his N900 Aug 13 16:28:33 you are impressed you can internet from it, Khertan_n900 does full dev there! Aug 13 16:28:42 lcuk: exactly Aug 13 16:28:51 lcuk, Khertan_n900: 0_0 Aug 13 16:28:53 hmm Aug 13 16:28:54 well Aug 13 16:28:55 I want to control my hoverboard from it. Aug 13 16:29:02 But first I need to build it. Aug 13 16:29:11 SpeedEvil, someone has built a real hoverboard Aug 13 16:29:21 there is b-man, he used to use his N810/N900 as his main computer... Aug 13 16:29:23 whatch out for the eels Aug 13 16:29:23 hehe Aug 13 16:29:33 lcuk: By hoverboard, I mean a device that can actually do free flight, in a hoverboard shape Aug 13 16:29:39 lcuk: well - nearly. Aug 13 16:29:43 i use it as my main computer too Aug 13 16:29:46 http://vimeo.com/11968215 Aug 13 16:29:57 its a board, and it hovers Aug 13 16:30:00 lcuk: ~100Kw of electric ducted fans and li-ion batteries in a ~60Kg package Aug 13 16:30:16 capable of about 2G accelleration bursts. Aug 13 16:30:32 And 2Km or so ceiling. Aug 13 16:31:11 So no designer can make me nice icons for khweeteur ? Aug 13 16:31:35 make me a sandwhich Aug 13 16:31:51 * SpeedEvil stabs Corsac. Aug 13 16:32:08 ! Aug 13 16:32:48 hum back to khteditor ... i need to finish one plugin Aug 13 16:33:02 * Corsac survives Aug 13 16:33:18 Khertan_n900: hmm, ok I just installed it... Aug 13 16:33:20 loading... Aug 13 16:34:23 hmm Aug 13 16:34:27 still only one tweet Aug 13 16:34:47 * xnt14 rm's ~/.khwittereur/tweets.cache Aug 13 16:34:49 xnt14 : ? Aug 13 16:34:49 did you got error ? Aug 13 16:35:28 Khertan_n900: no error, just still only one tweet, I'm rm'ing the tweets.cache from the old version Aug 13 16:35:55 .... Aug 13 16:36:12 hi again Aug 13 16:36:19 A\b1`: hi Aug 13 16:36:51 did your n900 is connected ? Aug 13 16:36:53 as it didn t open the connection automatically currently Aug 13 16:37:02 Khertan_n900: still only one tweet... Aug 13 16:37:07 i need to lean how to do that with qt Aug 13 16:37:12 Khertan_n900: no its on wifi, Aug 13 16:37:15 it is the right place to ask if i can install the so on a usb drive to run over an intel core2 ? Aug 13 16:37:18 strange Aug 13 16:37:21 hmm Aug 13 16:37:24 * xnt14 takes a screenie Aug 13 16:38:48 did your account have specificals things ? Aug 13 16:39:03 hmm Aug 13 16:39:04 ah Aug 13 16:39:08 I think I found the problem Aug 13 16:39:33 ? oh ? Aug 13 16:39:54 hold on a second, I'm putting it up on pastebin Aug 13 16:41:06 Khertan_n900: http://xceleo.pastebin.com/hH432iCT Aug 13 16:41:25 I'm bored now that Texrat closed that thread. Aug 13 16:42:12 * tybollt calls for GAN to start a new similar one ;) Aug 13 16:42:54 look like that one of person you follow have a wrong image profile Aug 13 16:42:55 Khertan_n900: also, a screenshot of the problem: http://ct.xceleo.org/Screenshot-20100813-123728.png Aug 13 16:43:18 hmm Aug 13 16:43:42 how do I find out which one? Aug 13 16:43:52 and what do you mean wrong? Aug 13 16:44:23 xnt14, it crashed because you mentioned macs Aug 13 16:44:31 i ll try to add some exception managment :) Aug 13 16:44:37 lcuk: thats a dm from a "friend" Aug 13 16:45:01 sure, you say "friend" all you like Aug 13 16:45:08 Khertan_n900: k Aug 13 16:45:31 lcuk: one of those people who want "free technical support" Aug 13 16:45:40 through twitter nonetheless Aug 13 16:45:48 awesome Aug 13 16:46:02 never replied to him btw :P Aug 13 16:46:30 not because you don't want to, but because Khertan_n900's app is broke :P Aug 13 16:46:36 you *tried* to reply :D Aug 13 16:46:58 lol, well, back then I had my ipod touch with tweetie :P Aug 13 16:47:08 GTFO Aug 13 16:47:14 ... Aug 13 16:47:16 :D Aug 13 16:47:18 thats was 2007... Aug 13 16:47:22 well Aug 13 16:47:28 2007-2008 intermim Aug 13 16:47:45 (intermim = I don't remember exactly :P) Aug 13 16:48:27 can you try with the new version push on gitorious ? Aug 13 16:48:33 Khertan_n900: Aug 13 16:48:36 tybollt, "KFC Double-Down chicken sandwiches, would you miss them if they were gone?" Aug 13 16:48:56 **k Aug 13 16:48:57 * DocScrutinizer starts namecalling on GAN900 - to cure the tmo withdrawal symptoms Aug 13 16:48:58 :P Aug 13 16:49:04 N900 owners: Would you miss Nokia if it went under? Aug 13 16:49:10 hmm Aug 13 16:49:26 i haven t manage exception on img profile download ... :) Aug 13 16:49:31 Nokia is in my hearth Aug 13 16:50:11 Khertan_n900: how do I uninstall with setup.py? Aug 13 16:51:16 xnt14 you can t :) Aug 13 16:51:25 why di8 you want to ninstall ? Aug 13 16:51:29 Khertan_n900: so just overwrite? Aug 13 16:51:34 yep Aug 13 16:51:39 ah, lol, ok Aug 13 16:52:00 mirr0r, on fire? Aug 13 16:53:08 GAN900: if you are too bored, consider finding abill's addr and visit him to give him a good let know Aug 13 16:53:33 on python ml Aug 13 16:53:44 grr tram blocked ... will miss my train Aug 13 16:53:54 DocScrutinizer, only if I can get Nokia to sponsor my travel costs. Aug 13 16:53:56 Khertan_n900: it works :) Aug 13 16:54:08 what is this command for: rm -rf * ? Aug 13 16:54:11 Khertan_n900: :/ Aug 13 16:56:34 th3hate: to bust the noobs Aug 13 16:56:52 th3hate: makes your n900 faster Aug 13 16:56:55 alreet Aug 13 16:57:16 hmm, does "rm -rf /" work in busybox? Aug 13 16:57:19 it doesn't work in bash Aug 13 16:57:24 makes me think twice before asking question in this chat Aug 13 16:57:36 sorry was disconnected Aug 13 16:57:38 Khertan_disconne: hi Aug 13 16:57:43 xnt14: did it works now ? Aug 13 16:57:44 Khertan_disconne: it works Aug 13 16:57:45 :) Aug 13 16:58:13 th3hate: you're not actually considering to type in some command you don't know what it does? Aug 13 16:58:26 im asking what does it do Aug 13 16:59:00 well, from 'man rm' I'd guess it deletes everything Aug 13 16:59:01 just to add more into my valuable info.. Aug 13 16:59:13 removes, recursively, without asking for confirmation and ignoring readonly all the files in the current directory Aug 13 16:59:28 Khertan_disconne: this is perfect, not too bloated, fast, and efficient... :) Aug 13 16:59:37 just needs some cleaning up and a bit more functionality Aug 13 16:59:44 kerio, so its like formatting? Aug 13 16:59:48 no Aug 13 16:59:50 th3hate, forcibly remove everything in / recursively. Aug 13 16:59:58 GAN900: no, the command was * Aug 13 17:00:03 so files in the current dir Aug 13 17:00:03 Or what kerio said. Aug 13 17:00:08 kerio, ah Aug 13 17:00:31 whats the star for Aug 13 17:00:32 * Aug 13 17:00:39 rm -rf* Aug 13 17:00:45 wildcard Aug 13 17:00:51 star maches all filenames Aug 13 17:01:10 rah disconnected again Aug 13 17:01:14 hmm Aug 13 17:01:18 DocScrutinizer: want to try that sip uri now? Aug 13 17:01:23 Khertan_disconne: it works :) Aug 13 17:01:24 and now there is a stupid captch on webchat Aug 13 17:01:30 nice Aug 13 17:01:38 khertan_again: this is perfect, not too bloated, fast, and efficient... :) Aug 13 17:01:39 * dumby88 The correct format is "rm -rf /", prior to fdisk. Aug 13 17:01:40 just needs some cleaning up and a bit more functionality Aug 13 17:01:41 did the about works too ? Aug 13 17:01:45 hmm Aug 13 17:01:48 dumby88: huh? Aug 13 17:01:49 * xnt14 tests Aug 13 17:01:58 why would you do that if you're using fdisk anyway Aug 13 17:01:58 and fdisk does nothing Aug 13 17:02:02 it changes the partition table Aug 13 17:02:07 can i do "rm -rf" then app name? Aug 13 17:02:07 xnt14 : which feature are you looking for ? Aug 13 17:02:08 you probably mean mkfs Aug 13 17:02:14 khertan_again: :) thank you :) Aug 13 17:02:14 th3hate: I suggest you do a "apt-get install man-db-n900" in a xterm with root rights Aug 13 17:02:20 th3hate: rm is a delete file command Aug 13 17:02:23 th3hate: them "man rm" Aug 13 17:02:29 then Aug 13 17:02:30 it deletes file from the current directory or with a relative or absolute path Aug 13 17:02:42 is like pusing del on windows explorer Aug 13 17:02:43 what's man-db for? Aug 13 17:02:45 pushing Aug 13 17:02:48 khertan_again: hmm, avatars and nicknames next to tweets... or just nicknames... Aug 13 17:02:49 kerio mkfs after fdisk, yup... Aug 13 17:02:57 trumee: in 30min Aug 13 17:02:57 why would you need fdisk Aug 13 17:03:10 trumee: watching TV news now Aug 13 17:03:10 DocScrutinizer: np Aug 13 17:03:31 .. and before grub Aug 13 17:03:40 oh you want nickname near avatar Aug 13 17:03:46 th3hate: -r recursive, -f force Aug 13 17:03:52 but it takes space on screen Aug 13 17:03:57 hmm Aug 13 17:04:00 BluesLee, thanks Aug 13 17:04:06 but whats man-db-n900 for? Aug 13 17:04:09 khertan_again: then how do you know which tweet is from who? Aug 13 17:05:02 Don't just brick it, blend it! http://www.willitblend.com/ Aug 13 17:05:03 th3hate: you are a linux newbie i gues, what are you trying to do? Aug 13 17:05:14 learning lol Aug 13 17:05:23 th3hate: what exat Aug 13 17:05:26 but im linux newbie for sure Aug 13 17:05:28 th3hate: it installs the man (manual) command which you can use to lookup help Aug 13 17:05:39 th3hate: mandb is for making 'man blabla' work Aug 13 17:06:05 man in turn shows you decent manual about blabla Aug 13 17:06:13 th3hate: what exactly you want to learn, there are many good tutorials ... Aug 13 17:06:14 36mb dang Aug 13 17:06:19 big manuals Aug 13 17:06:41 it's a manual for everything Aug 13 17:06:55 how to open it? app menu? Aug 13 17:06:59 or from terminal Aug 13 17:07:08 terminal Aug 13 17:07:10 it's a text application Aug 13 17:07:12 terminal Aug 13 17:07:12 man man Aug 13 17:07:35 th3hate: http://linux.die.net/man/1/man Aug 13 17:08:06 which is about the same as 'man man' Aug 13 17:08:15 :-) Aug 13 17:08:18 oh man Aug 13 17:08:20 wtf is man man :D Aug 13 17:08:22 lol Aug 13 17:08:25 oh man Aug 13 17:08:33 calls the "man" program with argument "man" Aug 13 17:08:41 in german mannomann Aug 13 17:08:42 that opens up the manual for man Aug 13 17:09:02 manual manual? Aug 13 17:09:13 man rm: http://linux.die.net/man/1/rm Aug 13 17:09:27 help about help Aug 13 17:10:41 very useful: man -k harddisk Aug 13 17:11:02 why linux is so complicated Aug 13 17:11:07 why don't they make GUI for everything Aug 13 17:11:08 searches whole manuals content about keyword 'harddisk' Aug 13 17:11:30 the gui is called xterm Aug 13 17:11:30 xnt14 : i know the icon or i double click on tweet Aug 13 17:11:46 khertan_again: hmm... Aug 13 17:12:16 maybe it can be better i know Aug 13 17:12:35 an option also could be a good idea :) Aug 13 17:12:39 hmm, Aug 13 17:12:42 true... Aug 13 17:12:50 th3hate: because a mouse has 3 buttons, a keyboard has 102 Aug 13 17:12:58 khertan_again: make a settings button in the drop down menu... Aug 13 17:13:03 it's 34 times more powerful Aug 13 17:13:04 what about the touch screen? Aug 13 17:14:06 th3hate: in a directory full of files, take every .txt, remove all the double spaces and compress them one by one Aug 13 17:14:56 kerio sound like a job for sed Aug 13 17:15:12 for file in *.txt; do sed s/ / / $file | gzip - > $file.gz; done Aug 13 17:15:26 now thats complicated Aug 13 17:15:33 do that manually Aug 13 17:15:44 easier than remembering that command Aug 13 17:15:55 for 500 files? Aug 13 17:15:58 1000 files? Aug 13 17:15:58 rename -r 's/ +/ /g' *\ \ * Aug 13 17:16:00 100000 files? Aug 13 17:16:08 zash: not in the filenames Aug 13 17:16:12 wait, -r is a sed option Aug 13 17:16:27 khertan_again: or just a toggle Aug 13 17:16:30 nobody remembers the command, th3hate - that's what man is for Aug 13 17:16:42 finished installing it Aug 13 17:16:45 kerio: sed -i s/\ \/ /g files Aug 13 17:16:51 i write man man to trigger it? Aug 13 17:16:59 zash: nice Aug 13 17:17:03 th3hate: man man gives you the man for man Aug 13 17:17:10 ORLY? Aug 13 17:17:17 man command gives you the man for command Aug 13 17:17:33 so everything have to start with man? Aug 13 17:17:41 man terminal Aug 13 17:17:42 whatthehell? Aug 13 17:19:13 man -k delete Aug 13 17:19:29 gives examples of delete commands? Aug 13 17:20:12 except it's called rm in *nix Aug 13 17:20:29 delete worked Aug 13 17:20:38 and usually acts in a *way* more powerful environment Aug 13 17:20:38 oh, -k is for searching Aug 13 17:20:40 who knew Aug 13 17:21:00 man -k delete gives name and short description of all commands related to delete Aug 13 17:21:12 man-db-n900 ftw, if only it didn't rape the cpu while installing Aug 13 17:21:12 ~$ delete Aug 13 17:21:12 delete: command not found Aug 13 17:21:31 man -k rm printed like 100k word Aug 13 17:21:43 very useful Aug 13 17:21:48 zash: you should use apropos Aug 13 17:22:00 google for 'rm' Aug 13 17:22:17 120M results, google.it Aug 13 17:22:23 man -k == apropos Aug 13 17:22:33 but looks cooler Aug 13 17:22:38 kerio: I use a thingy that lists (and caches) every man page and pipes it to dmenu Aug 13 17:22:42 but i can get what i want from the first result Aug 13 17:23:46 man man gives applet not found Aug 13 17:23:53 man -k is very much like googling Aug 13 17:24:23 man rm (without -k) will yield better results Aug 13 17:24:34 :D GeneralAntilles can I ask, why are you so against trying to make a difference? Aug 13 17:24:47 man rm: pager: applet not found Aug 13 17:25:01 apt-get install less Aug 13 17:25:02 while man -k delete should enable you to find rm is the command you probably want Aug 13 17:25:07 th3hate: btw, take those compressed .txt files, convert them into html files and send them to a remote server, and the local hd has no free space less Aug 13 17:25:42 right.. say the 100 meter long command :p Aug 13 17:25:50 ouch, missing dependency in mandb pk to less? Aug 13 17:26:28 yes Aug 13 17:26:46 i should fix that, but i'm thinking of changing the whole approach of the package Aug 13 17:26:53 yes man man works now Aug 13 17:26:59 how to select things? tab? Aug 13 17:27:05 select? Aug 13 17:27:17 words and options on screen Aug 13 17:27:19 DocScrutinizer51, i'm thinking of symlinking /usr/share/man to /opt Aug 13 17:27:32 mhm Aug 13 17:27:39 what else? Aug 13 17:27:41 then purging docpurge, or getting rid of it in a sneaky way Aug 13 17:27:57 possibly through a postinst that rewirtes it Aug 13 17:27:59 also nice Aug 13 17:28:10 that way, man pages for packages get installed Aug 13 17:29:20 th3hate: space key forwards one page in less, 'b' goes back. 'h' gives help, and 'q' quits Aug 13 17:29:39 lifes much easier now Aug 13 17:29:41 thanks :) Aug 13 17:30:03 has anyone had problems importing vcf files into the contacts of N900? Mine eats first names of my vcf files exported from Kontact Aug 13 17:30:11 will update man-db in a bit Aug 13 17:30:17 so man contains everything about linux? Aug 13 17:30:28 almost Aug 13 17:30:37 packages contain man files, these are purged at installation on maemo Aug 13 17:30:43 GeneralAntilles, who was involved with the n810 SSU process, wasn't it you and the council? Aug 13 17:30:45 that's sooo gonna be fixed in a bit Aug 13 17:30:48 how to ask man how to do this: Aug 13 17:30:49 take those compressed .txt files, convert them into html files and send them to a remote server, and the local hd has no free space less Aug 13 17:30:52 * lcuk cannot remember Aug 13 17:30:59 but perhaps we should poke that to get one out Aug 13 17:31:05 Stskeeps? Aug 13 17:31:11 afaik he was involved Aug 13 17:31:16 could be wrong though Aug 13 17:31:45 lcuk, don't troll. Aug 13 17:31:46 hmmm, thats strange Aug 13 17:31:47 I dunno, I just recall people shouting about it when it was started and that it was feasible Aug 13 17:32:01 hmm Aug 13 17:32:06 I am not GAN900 - I am just curious as to why you are so against it Aug 13 17:32:07 th3hate: http://www.faqs.org/docs/bashman/bashref_toc.html#SEC_Contents Aug 13 17:32:11 thinking of starting an N900 community ssu Aug 13 17:32:16 * lcuk nods Aug 13 17:32:16 formating using official micro sd formatter gives 3.84gb free of 4gb Aug 13 17:32:19 lcuk, against what, exactly? :) Aug 13 17:32:35 MohammadAG51, thats in part why I was asking you about the hildon patches that float Aug 13 17:32:38 you have seen them Aug 13 17:33:05 hmm Aug 13 17:33:11 formatting using sfdisk gives 2.04Gb of 2.1GB Aug 13 17:33:12 community ssu = 1 of two things Aug 13 17:33:33 faking the version number so as to not break the ssu package Aug 13 17:33:38 or updating the package itself Aug 13 17:34:23 MohammadAG51, well, thats running a bit quick Aug 13 17:34:29 I am sure theres other things afoot Aug 13 17:34:40 so don't worry so much yet Aug 13 17:34:47 * RST38h moos at lcuk and mohammad Aug 13 17:34:47 DocScrutinizer, is there a more noob friendly manual Aug 13 17:34:51 it was more the packages and where they are Aug 13 17:34:55 hiya RST38h \o Aug 13 17:35:20 lcuk, Nokia's blocking, I think. Aug 13 17:35:24 th3hate: for sure, but alas I never looked for one, as I'm beyond that stage :-D Aug 13 17:35:29 GAN900, blocking what? Aug 13 17:35:34 lcuk, and you haven't answered my question. Aug 13 17:35:44 Diablo Community SSU Aug 13 17:35:58 GAN900, just your general negativity towards my suggestions and realistically, anything maemo oriented Aug 13 17:37:07 GAN900, its possible theres blocks in place but then lets find out what and get them removed? Aug 13 17:37:09 lcuk, ah, I see what you did there. Aug 13 17:37:45 no, step up and help clarify things a bit so we can get an update out if you think theres one missing Aug 13 17:37:57 * RST38h has heard this a year ago. And two years ago. And... Aug 13 17:38:07 th3hate: http://www.google.de/search?q=linux+commandline+howto Aug 13 17:38:09 yes RST38h Aug 13 17:38:29 lcuk, well, Nokia refused to provide any real assistance or facilitation. Aug 13 17:38:38 Especially infrastructure side. Aug 13 17:38:46 well GAN900 I have been working directly in amongst things for a while Aug 13 17:39:15 lcuk, yes, and now you sound like gnuite. Aug 13 17:39:37 th3hate: just the fact that a command to do *THAT* exists should show you that command line > gui Aug 13 17:40:14 heh, well I did bin a mail from some google recruiter the other day, so not quite the same :) Aug 13 17:40:49 Though Microsoft had initially made a commitment to create versions of dynamic languages that are customized for .NET, recent reports make it clear that the company may be stepping back from this plan. Aug 13 17:41:02 * RST38h laughs satanically Aug 13 17:41:03 all I know GAN isthat I have a strong desire not to see code unmaintained and closed Aug 13 17:41:06 also for file in *.gz; do gunzip $file | txt2html | scp - user@server:/path/to/dir/$file; done Aug 13 17:41:34 lcuk: I do not think yours or mine or GAN's desire matters Aug 13 17:41:41 whilst things are heavily covered I dont have a problem with it - those who know the codebase best are able to maintain it Aug 13 17:42:16 lcuk: All that matters is an opinion of 2-3 nokian corpses who can't tell source code from payroll data Aug 13 17:43:19 RST38h, so you think we should all pack up and go home Aug 13 17:43:41 MohammadAG51: ? Aug 13 17:43:54 lcuk, frankly, yes. Aug 13 17:44:00 Stskeeps, n810 SSU, can you remember who was overseeing it Aug 13 17:44:00 noooo Aug 13 17:44:04 i like it here Aug 13 17:44:11 Stskeeps, he was asking who was part of the community ssu Aug 13 17:44:16 lcuk, lma and sd69 Aug 13 17:44:23 since it was mentioned (probably incorrectly by me and a few others) Aug 13 17:44:32 lcuk: Probably not that extreme Aug 13 17:44:34 ok thanks Aug 13 17:45:07 Nokia seems to be doing what it can to distance itself from Maemo and maemo.org and start fresh. Aug 13 17:45:22 that's idiotic Aug 13 17:45:23 lcuk: But I think we should cut down on rhetorics and work on apps that replace broken Nokian apps Aug 13 17:45:27 Intel has been a big help with that. Aug 13 17:45:31 harmattan > meego Aug 13 17:45:36 RST38h, sure Aug 13 17:45:38 and moblin sucks Aug 13 17:45:45 so me pushing to get those meego apps here also Aug 13 17:45:53 RST38h: ++ Aug 13 17:46:07 lcuk: It is clear that Nokia does not care. So why should we care about Nokia? Aug 13 17:46:08 is microb opensource? Aug 13 17:46:33 kerio, no Aug 13 17:47:00 i think it was supposed to be oss, but they decided to switch to closed source later on Aug 13 17:47:04 RST38h, every app that replaces a built in comonent is indeed super Aug 13 17:47:08 component Aug 13 17:47:14 no qualms there Aug 13 17:47:16 Was supposed to be, but as with many things here, it didn't work out. Aug 13 17:47:25 frankly lcuk the other way round seems more sensible to me, for an approach to meego. Make sane apps for maemo, then port to meego Aug 13 17:47:32 but jumping to meego direct is not feasible at this moment Aug 13 17:47:55 DocScrutinizer, yes - but there are skeletons of apps there now Aug 13 17:47:59 why not help both causes Aug 13 17:48:29 so we make new maemo skeletons (not a bad idea) Aug 13 17:48:37 hmm Aug 13 17:48:39 ++ Aug 13 17:48:42 * lcuk knocks up a template Aug 13 17:49:23 RST38h, .. first thought at DocScrutinizer's idea? Aug 13 17:49:34 we do indeed have a load of replacements already Aug 13 17:49:43 how do you use fcamera's hdr? Aug 13 17:49:59 how do you merge the three different photos? Aug 13 17:51:07 GAN900, you also? Aug 13 17:51:38 (regarding distancing selves - the principle ones to distance were the council) Aug 13 17:52:06 the users and devs around had a look and mostly carried on as before Aug 13 17:52:13 lcuk: Porting gtk+ to qt is too difficult Aug 13 17:52:14 DocScrutinizer: now? Aug 13 17:52:20 RST38h, not suggesting that Aug 13 17:52:22 The council has been pretty well shut out from MeeGo from the start. Aug 13 17:52:26 we have new core apps coming in qt Aug 13 17:52:39 PM me Aug 13 17:52:39 GAN900, I barely have my name on meego through choice Aug 13 17:53:00 The scortched earth policy seem to be in place for infra, experience and expertise from maemo.org. Aug 13 17:53:28 lcuk, where do you propose digging up your hordes of capable application developers? Aug 13 17:53:39 Especially for a dead-end platform. Aug 13 17:53:41 same place meego does actually Aug 13 17:53:52 we have devs already Aug 13 17:53:59 dead platforms have a lot of fans Aug 13 17:54:00 is there a way to increase the auto-lock delay on the N900? Aug 13 17:54:02 actively hacking their little apps Aug 13 17:54:13 fapman! Aug 13 17:54:27 live bg, however many other little apps Aug 13 17:54:32 all the stuff qwerty managed Aug 13 17:54:44 we have knight rider lights :p Aug 13 17:55:13 i would rather work with meego apps whilst the meego OS gets strong enough Aug 13 17:55:38 we know Meego will work better Aug 13 17:55:43 but this is just like it was with mer Aug 13 17:55:59 meego will suck ._. Aug 13 17:56:10 they're using rpm Aug 13 17:56:14 http://talk.maemo.org/faq.php?faq=vb3_board_faq#faq_tmorulestext Aug 13 17:56:18 why would you do that Aug 13 17:56:25 :/ Aug 13 17:56:36 hehe, I sense roman inquisition Aug 13 17:56:55 well Aug 13 17:56:59 kerio, submit patches! Aug 13 17:57:06 to offer debian packaging Aug 13 17:57:11 to the meego apps Aug 13 17:57:19 dpkg/apt is not the best package manager eihter Aug 13 17:57:25 how do i patch something like that? :/ Aug 13 17:57:50 rpm -i dpkg.rpm && dpkg -r rpm? Aug 13 17:57:53 RST38h, hmm why highlight again? Aug 13 17:58:03 Or just submit dpkg at the repos, couldn't be that hard - the hard part is getting good repositories Aug 13 17:58:06 FIQ: it's the best there is Aug 13 17:58:32 fiq Aug 13 17:58:37 lcuk Aug 13 17:58:38 having dpkg in meego isnt a problem Aug 13 17:58:48 its getting the meego apps installable on maemo Aug 13 17:58:53 I never said that Aug 13 17:59:01 like the photoviewer etc Aug 13 18:00:02 instinctiv music player always crashes 10 seconds after opening, is there a log or something to check for errors? Aug 13 18:00:48 th3hate, dunno, tried running it form the console? Aug 13 18:00:52 no one here is a dev, app is closed source, ask on the thread :) Aug 13 18:01:05 run it from command line Aug 13 18:01:26 how to? sorry linux newbie... Aug 13 18:01:40 i still don't get why there's a package ready to upgrade that conflicts with a system metapackagwe Aug 13 18:01:43 lcuk: I expect certain zelaous moderators use this new policy as a pretext to excersize their moderatorial zeal Aug 13 18:01:53 /opt/instinctiv/instinctiv Aug 13 18:02:11 ty Aug 13 18:02:16 lcuk: little guys with banhammers and a license ot use them are always fun to watch Aug 13 18:03:26 didn't crash after running it from command line Aug 13 18:03:44 RST38h, I don't think we have a lot of those. Aug 13 18:03:54 GAN: Ah but we do Aug 13 18:04:03 is mp-fremantle-generic-pr safe to uninstall? Aug 13 18:04:12 and just a couple is all you need Aug 13 18:04:35 may do with one, but then you do not get to watch them fight each other Aug 13 18:05:19 th3hate exec & (scripts, frees command line) Aug 13 18:06:37 RST38h, keep us informed :D Aug 13 18:06:45 anti-troll watch :D Aug 13 18:06:49 kerio, depends, do you want SSU notifications in the future? Aug 13 18:07:10 kerio, hell, wont be getting many of those anyway. So, remove away! Aug 13 18:14:27 ehlo... Any ideas on how it is possible to download a web page asynchronously using gtk ? I'm making a home widget that freezes when using urllib (python). Aug 13 18:15:00 andre__, ping Aug 13 18:15:16 MohammadAG51, pong Aug 13 18:15:32 andre__, is there a way to get an email for every bug opened? Aug 13 18:15:47 i see you're added to the CC list of all bugs Aug 13 18:16:10 I'm not :) Aug 13 18:17:12 hmm, so there isn't a way to get an email for all bugs? Aug 13 18:17:39 don't think so - easiest way that comes to my mind is adding nobody@maemo.org and all @maemo.bugs addresses to your watchlist at https://bugs.maemo.org/userprefs.cgi?tab=email Aug 13 18:17:59 Bug #10294 shouldnt have been closed Aug 13 18:18:00 Bug https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=10294 Email desktop widget does not display mails from Nokia Messaging accounts Aug 13 18:18:35 if they won't fix it then why keep it open Aug 13 18:18:58 why shouldnt it be fixed? Aug 13 18:19:21 if all other Nokia phones work with Nokia messaging, then what it special about N900? Aug 13 18:21:51 trumee: it's the first and last maemo phone, and they have very little interest improving it Aug 13 18:22:20 yep, that's why they're still fixing other bugs Aug 13 18:23:34 trumee, Nokia has dropped support for the N900. Aug 13 18:23:42 trumee, that's what's special. Aug 13 18:23:55 MohammadAG51, bugs are having TMs unset. Aug 13 18:24:28 TMs? Aug 13 18:29:12 GAN900: unset (as an action contrary to "not set")? examples? Aug 13 18:30:56 lo andre__ Aug 13 18:32:41 heja Aug 13 18:35:33 Khertan: are you there? Aug 13 18:35:48 trumee: Should not have been closed similar to "Wars on this planet shouldn't have been started and there should be world peace instead"? ;-) Aug 13 18:36:31 andre__: pass Aug 13 18:37:37 trumee: WONTFIX (if it really is one) is up to Nokia. But I agree for this specific one that I want to know the reasons if they state "legal things". yeah, it's on my watchlist Aug 13 18:38:15 andre__: yup, agree with that Aug 13 18:38:31 IS there somewhere that documents how to interface with the phone and contacts stuff? It's probably still too soon for me to have learned anywhere near enough to do stuff, but i wanna be informed, it's kinda anoying how caller id doesn't always match numbers stored in contacts due to differences in how the carrier formats the id and how we need to type to dial the numbers, i wanna se if... Aug 13 18:38:33 ...would be possible to have a way to work wiht the messed up system over there (not the whole storey, but informative: https://secure.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/wiki/Telephone_numbers_in_Brazil ) Aug 13 18:39:31 over here* Aug 13 18:40:25 if anybody is interested in my findings about WLAN lags: Obviously - according to my router's WLAN "ARP" table, the N900 falls out of association with the AP, then re-associates without actually needing a new DHCP lease after that. Aug 13 18:40:54 trumee, please feel free to ping if there's no response within a week on that ticket by me or a Nokian Aug 13 18:41:21 DocScrutinizer that hasn't anytnig to do with the powersaving mode? Aug 13 18:41:32 andre__: sure Aug 13 18:41:34 sure it has Aug 13 18:42:02 andre__, Ian's theming bug. Aug 13 18:42:16 andre__, unset as in it was slated for a release, now it's not. Aug 13 18:45:51 GAN900, bug ID? Aug 13 18:45:59 because it's not 11014 Aug 13 18:47:09 hi andre__ \o Aug 13 18:47:25 yo lcuk Aug 13 18:48:19 MohammadAG51, are you a member of gitorious? Aug 13 18:48:51 i think so Aug 13 18:49:31 cool, I thought you were just drive by downloading Aug 13 18:49:32 lol Aug 13 18:49:59 lol Aug 13 18:50:11 i read the comment on the latest commit, quite sad :( Aug 13 18:51:13 GAN900, I cannot find any such report. Hence I'd really like to know, if you have some time and are around :) Aug 13 18:51:44 MohammadAG51: link? Aug 13 18:51:49 what does it say? Aug 13 18:52:21 This is the end, there won't be any more "upstream" development. hildon-desktop and friends are truely free now, do whatever you want with them. Aug 13 18:52:46 o.o Aug 13 18:55:15 xnt14, yep i m here now Aug 13 18:55:38 Khertan: salut Aug 13 18:55:56 MohammadAG51: What's up with the "This is the end" stuff? Aug 13 18:56:29 hildon-desktop commit on gitorious Aug 13 18:56:58 'lu crashanddie Aug 13 18:57:03 http://maemo.gitorious.org/fremantle-hildon-desktop/hildon-desktop/commit/624231109e727e7b4c21c9f1a526ff191c309e5a Aug 13 18:57:19 MohammadAG51: that's not a bad thing Aug 13 18:57:43 but the question is, why isn't BME one of hildon-desktop's friends? ☹ Aug 13 18:57:44 the "open" is good. the "no more upstream development" seems bad Aug 13 18:58:12 V13: it needed to be replaced Aug 13 18:58:31 luke-jr: ? for N900 ? Aug 13 18:58:36 period Aug 13 18:59:02 I guess the real question is "no more upstream development" == "no more upstream bugfixes" ? Aug 13 18:59:16 of course Aug 13 18:59:41 v13, not at all, this is merely adams final commit before he switches focus. Aug 13 19:00:00 oh... then the world looks nice again :) Aug 13 19:00:06 :) Aug 13 19:00:24 … Aug 13 19:00:33 you can't do bugfixes without committing Aug 13 19:01:11 Why does the charger doesn't go into some sort of energy saving mode when it's not plugged to a device? Why with so much techonology laying around we still have to go to the wall andpull the plug? Aug 13 19:01:42 TiagoTiago: be glad you have a charger Aug 13 19:01:49 heh Aug 13 19:01:52 luke-jr, the code is maintained by more than one person :) Aug 13 19:02:02 TiagoTiago: It does Aug 13 19:02:11 TiagoTiago: it uses under - IIRC 0.2W - when I measured it Aug 13 19:02:13 hell, I have commit rights there :) Aug 13 19:02:22 TiagoTiago: The message is greenwash. Aug 13 19:02:40 adam has just fixed an awful lot and has known the code a great deal Aug 13 19:02:58 * lcuk raises a vbeer to his fixes for helping make hildon desktop work Aug 13 19:03:04 lcuk: "upstream" implies Nokia in this case Aug 13 19:03:30 couldn't it jsut uncouple from the wall current, and if the device doesn't got enough energy left to jumpstart it you go to the wall and press a button on the charger ? Aug 13 19:03:44 TiagoTiago: pointless Aug 13 19:03:50 why? Aug 13 19:03:51 TiagoTiago: Buttons are expensive. Aug 13 19:04:18 TiagoTiago: Also - low power idle mode for SMPS is now common Aug 13 19:04:27 SMPS == ? Aug 13 19:04:42 i wouldn't expect a switch and a button to manually trigger it to increase the final price by more than at most a couple of bucks Aug 13 19:05:07 V13: switching mode power supply Aug 13 19:05:13 switch mode power supply Aug 13 19:05:18 10x Aug 13 19:05:22 TiagoTiago: 2$ time the number of chargers counts up for quite a lot of money. Aug 13 19:05:45 And not having to physicly pull the plug out each time you unplug the charger from the device is more than worth paying a couple of bucks more Aug 13 19:05:46 frals, apologies for the strange PM from TMO ;) Aug 13 19:06:48 TiagoTiago: cost of manufacturing button ( energy and enviroment cost ) + little bit current to hold relay while charging are higher than 2$ over 2 years of charger life time Aug 13 19:06:52 Having your device kick you in the balls singing "you are not green, nahnahnahnah!!!" each time you unplug it is annoying as hell Aug 13 19:07:16 do you magically become green once your device kicks you in the balls? Aug 13 19:07:22 oh cool, they implemented the ballkicking feature Aug 13 19:07:43 there is an app for that Aug 13 19:07:56 TiagoTiago, requires a hardware mod Aug 13 19:08:02 and ballkicking devices are expensive Aug 13 19:08:03 http://search.digikey.com/scripts/DkSearch/dksus.dll?Detail&name=596-1046-2-ND Aug 13 19:08:05 for example Aug 13 19:08:16 70 centrs for a SMPS controller that uses .05W idle Aug 13 19:08:46 In pracrtice - the existing charger will cost you around 50 cents a year to run idle. Aug 13 19:09:09 in 100 years that's $50 Aug 13 19:09:11 multiply by the number of phones out there. Aug 13 19:09:28 my mom got this hairdrier that got a breaker builtin in the plug, if the wall can't handle it breaks the current, and to use it again you gotta press a button int he plug Aug 13 19:09:30 V13: so what do you propose? Aug 13 19:09:40 * DocScrutinizer slaps TiagoTiago with a bundle of wikipedia, CE, and 200mW Aug 13 19:09:42 TiagoTiago: it's RCD Aug 13 19:09:47 TiagoTiago: not breaker Aug 13 19:09:48 but then again, playing angry birds for a couple more seconds could drain similar amount of power. Aug 13 19:09:49 :) Aug 13 19:10:17 is there a dæmon to relay the GPS coordinatos from the phone to my GNU/Linux laptop so I can test an assisted GPS program? Aug 13 19:10:22 *coordinates Aug 13 19:10:26 Mental note: Never try to turn N900 on when it is connected to the charger Aug 13 19:10:34 why not ? Aug 13 19:10:37 RST38h: why? I do that all the time Aug 13 19:10:48 ptl: goes nuts Aug 13 19:10:49 because you may switch it off Aug 13 19:10:49 TiagoTiago: Ultra-idle power supplies cost less in additional power than a true 'off' button would cost. Aug 13 19:10:54 not on Aug 13 19:10:57 and then it will restart Aug 13 19:10:59 RST38h: I do it all the time - wfm Aug 13 19:11:01 and do loads of stuff Aug 13 19:11:05 weird then Aug 13 19:11:18 nah it tends to misbehave Aug 13 19:11:24 s/in additional power// Aug 13 19:11:44 it's simpler to disconnect it, wait for shutdown and then start Aug 13 19:11:52 ok, wtf is it with tmo-level FUD being spread on IRC? Aug 13 19:11:55 do the chargers that come witht he N900 work like that? Aug 13 19:12:04 TiagoTiago: broadly, yes. Aug 13 19:12:05 Hi Aug 13 19:12:05 tmo isn't big enough? Aug 13 19:12:13 TiagoTiago: not thatr exact chipset, but a very, very similar one. Aug 13 19:12:15 crashanddie, op up Aug 13 19:12:24 i mean in terms of performance Aug 13 19:12:27 TiagoTiago: Well - I haven't taken it apart - it might be thart exact chipset Aug 13 19:12:28 and efficiency Aug 13 19:12:30 TiagoTiago: yes. Aug 13 19:12:40 TiagoTiago: I measured it to use under half a watt idle. Aug 13 19:12:52 so what's with the warning everytime you unplug the N900? Aug 13 19:13:05 TiagoTiago: greenwash. Aug 13 19:13:08 lol Aug 13 19:13:21 andre__, http://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=3659 Aug 13 19:13:22 Bug 3659: Changing icon theme requires reboot to be applied correctly Aug 13 19:13:23 TiagoTiago: It's a feelgood thing that they can point out to environmental groups to make their product look greener. Aug 13 19:13:32 TiagoTiago: Just to Nokia can brag about beeing "Green" Aug 13 19:13:38 The box says everythign is recyclable Aug 13 19:13:46 hm, gotta go, be back in an hour or so Aug 13 19:13:48 * DocScrutinizer glances at TiagoTiago's statistics of posts ending with '?' Aug 13 19:13:51 TiagoTiago: Almost no users will actually do so. But that way they can claim that when the product is used as directed, there is no power in standby. Aug 13 19:14:05 GAN900, so you did check the History to see what happened, right? Aug 13 19:15:19 someone check this error: http://pastebin.com/mqYngUjY Aug 13 19:15:33 th3hate: go clean your room? Aug 13 19:15:37 th3hate: don't give orders Aug 13 19:15:42 GAN900, according to internal blah it was fixed for PR1.2. Hence TM was set by me or so. After PR1.2 was out Ian reopened as it wasn't fixed for him, and Ian changed the TM to 5.0+. And I reset that as Ian isn't a Nokian fixing Maemo5 bugs as far as I know ;-) Aug 13 19:16:08 crashanddie, who's giving orders? did i say check it or i'll rape you? Aug 13 19:16:20 or it's wrong to ask for help about maemo here? Aug 13 19:16:35 you didn't ask. Aug 13 19:16:45 teach me how to ask then? Aug 13 19:16:49 andre__, specific example aside, the trend is rapidly reaching "no more fixes". Aug 13 19:17:00 th3hate: script kiddie wannabe? or why do I get six popups with your link? ;-) Aug 13 19:17:11 th3hate: Well you start out with 'Why does it burn when I pee?' or some other question. Aug 13 19:17:23 didn't get any scripts Aug 13 19:17:30 open it with pc browser Aug 13 19:17:31 GAN900: true, as unstable development happens in MeeGo. However I don't want to see wrong "proof" for that :) Aug 13 19:18:10 andre__, $10 we're down to one more minor release then nothing else. Aug 13 19:18:11 th3hate: I use PC browser. It's even next level as it also shows images on the interwebs! Aug 13 19:18:21 dude its pastebin Aug 13 19:18:26 why would it give scripts? Aug 13 19:18:45 * lcuk cracks open a beer Aug 13 19:18:50 who needs one? Aug 13 19:18:57 GAN900: I won't bet against, as I don't know. Aug 13 19:18:59 i'd love one mate Aug 13 19:19:00 lcuk, here Aug 13 19:19:25 \o/ Aug 13 19:19:28 lcuk: /dcc send me one, please. Aug 13 19:19:33 * lcuk slides some nice cold ones down the wire Aug 13 19:19:36 crashanddie: Cube analog hardtail w/ suntour shocks... please don't laugh at me :( Aug 13 19:19:50 crashanddie, yes #maemo is now the second level of whining :) tmo is user whining ... #maemo power user whinning :) Aug 13 19:20:08 th3hate: hmm. looks like the twitter script on pastebin.com does weird stuff in firefox3.6 Aug 13 19:20:09 tybollt: what year? Aug 13 19:20:19 "You want some cheese with that whine?" Aug 13 19:20:26 crashanddie: 2010... Aug 13 19:20:34 andre__, ,meh, checked the error anyway? Aug 13 19:20:37 tybollt: looks pretty good Aug 13 19:21:11 well I like riding it... only bummer (pun intended) is my ass is so soar since I have yet to buy padded shorts :) Aug 13 19:21:24 sore soar? Aug 13 19:21:26 sore Aug 13 19:21:32 thanks Aug 13 19:21:54 tybollt: the rear derailleur is crap though, it'll break easily if you go through some wilderness Aug 13 19:22:12 hmm yeah Aug 13 19:22:17 tybollt: so try to steer clear of low bushes on your right side Aug 13 19:22:39 Khertan, one thing Aug 13 19:22:41 tybollt: get better tyres, too Aug 13 19:22:43 Well I've not had her in real x-country just yet. But yeah will think of that Aug 13 19:22:53 tybollt: you probably have metal tubing in the tyres, which makes them very heavy Aug 13 19:22:55 tyres? heh hadn't even given _that_ a thought :) Aug 13 19:23:00 having a power user like yourself whining and pushing updates to maemo.org is a good thing :) Aug 13 19:23:08 crashanddie: Ah I see Aug 13 19:24:29 tybollt: easy ways to massively improve a stock bike with little money: get a good seat (80 euros for very good), good grips (and gloves if you get into x-country), and good tyres (30euros a piece) Aug 13 19:24:57 gloves: 20-30 euros, grip: 20 euros Aug 13 19:25:57 Khertan: sorry, I drowned in t.m.o, read too much... :P Aug 13 19:26:09 so anyways Aug 13 19:26:15 crashanddie: Get a second saddle, some more pedals, and a minion. Aug 13 19:26:18 * xnt14 has a ton of ideas Aug 13 19:26:24 for khweeteur Aug 13 19:26:50 ~dictionary minion Aug 13 19:26:51 see dict minion Aug 13 19:26:53 hmm Aug 13 19:26:59 ~dict minion Aug 13 19:27:02 Dictionary 'minion' (2 of 5): \Min"ion\, a. [See 2d {Minion}.] Fine; trim; dainty. [Obs.] "Their . . . minion dancing." --Fryth. [1913 Webster] ;; a servile or fawning dependant. Aug 13 19:27:03 th3hate: on the error - it looks almost like the package wasn't properly installed. Aug 13 19:27:18 * xnt14 wonders if Khertan is here... Aug 13 19:27:24 * xnt14 waits Aug 13 19:29:27 SpeedEvil, this error occured after i tried to update it Aug 13 19:29:32 using faster app manager Aug 13 19:29:44 it messed up i guess Aug 13 19:30:18 post the pastebin and other details on fapmans bugtracker Aug 13 19:31:24 Will do, anyway to fix the error though? Aug 13 19:31:27 lcuk: np, i read the email notification on bus to airport and it didnt make much sense without proper quote formatting :D Aug 13 19:33:28 th3hate: I would trry simply reinstalling. Aug 13 19:33:36 or deinstalling again Aug 13 19:33:51 what was the error anyways? Aug 13 19:33:58 SpeedEvil, that's the problem, it won't install or uninstall anything untill its fixed Aug 13 19:33:59 pastebin raw please, i hate damn ads Aug 13 19:34:06 http://pastebin.com/raw.php?i=mqYngUjY Aug 13 19:34:14 ah Aug 13 19:34:50 dpkg --force-all -r quick-launch Aug 13 19:34:58 then reinstall Aug 13 19:35:11 or find the deb and dpkg -i it Aug 13 19:35:17 that might not work though Aug 13 19:35:46 wont make more mess (hopefully) Aug 13 19:36:39 force-all couldn't remove it too Aug 13 19:36:40 same errors Aug 13 19:37:15 fetch the deb then dpkg -i it Aug 13 19:37:24 ok Aug 13 19:37:34 you might find it in /var/cache/apt/archives Aug 13 19:37:45 unless fapman clears that dif Aug 13 19:37:47 dir* Aug 13 19:38:15 it clears cache afaik Aug 13 19:38:36 then dpkg -i then deb Aug 13 19:38:51 i download the latest version before the update? Aug 13 19:39:16 0.4= current 0.5= the update Aug 13 19:39:22 update Aug 13 19:41:16 same errors.. Aug 13 19:43:20 MohammadAG51, here: http://pastebin.com/raw.php?i=VBdpCa5k Aug 13 19:44:16 umm Aug 13 19:44:22 time to trick into removing shit Aug 13 19:44:32 > /etc/event.d/quicklaunch Aug 13 19:44:41 echo "" >> /etc/event.d/quicklaunch Aug 13 19:44:55 DocScrutinizer, :) Aug 13 19:45:00 mine is muuuuch shorter, and more geek Aug 13 19:45:28 i'll try the geeky one Aug 13 19:45:35 sorry to be lame and beg for halp here but... I am trying to upload a picture I took on my n900 and it's WAAAAY at the bottom of the list of files... I've always wondered (especially now) is there a fast way to get to the bottom of said list? Aug 13 19:45:36 lol Aug 13 19:46:01 oh Aug 13 19:46:02 dpkg - trying script from the new package instead ... Aug 13 19:46:05 retarded package Aug 13 19:46:17 it should remove the files automatically, not using a damn postrm Aug 13 19:46:46 postinst returns exit code 1, everything else fails on that Aug 13 19:47:32 force it Aug 13 19:47:36 use force luke Aug 13 19:47:43 nothing happened after writing this Aug 13 19:47:44 echo "" >> /etc/event.d/quicklaunch Aug 13 19:47:57 yes, dpkg -i again Aug 13 19:48:04 o Aug 13 19:48:05 ok Aug 13 19:48:59 something happened - it created that file so braindamaged postrm script can remove it Aug 13 19:49:00 MohammadAG51, same error.. Aug 13 19:49:18 quite unlikely Aug 13 19:49:21 uh Aug 13 19:49:26 k, quick solution Aug 13 19:49:29 hmpf, is the 'power kernel' in extras? O_o Aug 13 19:49:37 (just saw it on frontpage of maemo.org) Aug 13 19:49:37 yes :-( Aug 13 19:49:43 rm /var/lib/dpkg/info/quick-launch.postrm Aug 13 19:49:51 DocScrutinizer: what's sad about it? Aug 13 19:50:12 noooo nonono Aug 13 19:50:18 yes yes Aug 13 19:50:23 i hate retarded packages Aug 13 19:50:58 throwing harder works \o/ Aug 13 19:51:01 MohammadAG51, no such file Aug 13 19:51:08 * DocScrutinizer heads out to take his valium Aug 13 19:51:10 uhuh Aug 13 19:51:14 but there is postinst Aug 13 19:51:19 but still wish there was a single key Aug 13 19:51:23 quick-launch.postinst Aug 13 19:58:40 jacekowski: ok, on a single line: http://wiki.maemo.org/Extras-testing/QA_checklist#Security_risks >>...and harm to device components<< Aug 13 19:59:10 but you need additional software for it Aug 13 19:59:22 to harm device components Aug 13 20:00:16 mhm, so taking the two components of a binary exlosive onboard a plane in separate bottles is allowed then? Aug 13 20:01:17 you can do it in a car Aug 13 20:01:24 you have full tank of petrol Aug 13 20:01:34 completly harmless Aug 13 20:01:38 but add a fire to it Aug 13 20:01:53 ok, how about we end this discussion right here Aug 13 20:01:54 gah, I knew it Aug 13 20:02:02 * DocScrutinizer is swallowing another Valium Aug 13 20:02:11 swallow little bit more Aug 13 20:02:14 not too much Aug 13 20:02:22 it's quite funny Aug 13 20:02:27 lol Aug 13 20:02:31 and then if you drink alcohol Aug 13 20:02:38 no, really, it's not. Aug 13 20:03:01 hello! Aug 13 20:03:11 anarcat: hello Aug 13 20:03:22 i am upgrading to maemo 5 now, just got a new device running it... i was wondering if there was a way to make the jabber client *not* remember passwords? Aug 13 20:03:36 upgrading to maemo 5? From what? Aug 13 20:03:48 no idea :) Aug 13 20:03:57 i just got a n900 and went to the app manager and upgraded :) Aug 13 20:03:57 anarcat: you mean reflashing? Aug 13 20:04:00 oh, through a new device, gotcha Aug 13 20:04:03 ah Aug 13 20:04:18 not sure that's reflashing, hope not :) Aug 13 20:04:59 anarcat: no its not, its just that I've never upgraded with app manager, always reflashed, so thats what I think of as upgrading... Aug 13 20:05:07 anyways Aug 13 20:05:13 it's rebooting now Aug 13 20:05:26 my core question is: is there a way to make the jabber client not remember its password? Aug 13 20:05:37 i feel unconfortable storing passwords on this thing Aug 13 20:05:41 not that I'm aware of Aug 13 20:05:52 ok Aug 13 20:06:12 that's .. unfortunate :) Aug 13 20:18:07 crashanddie: hmmm w/ such a shoppinglist I better consult the missus first ;) Aug 13 20:18:29 tybollt: again, you rarely need to buy everything at the same time Aug 13 20:18:51 tybollt: 20e worth of grips here, new seat there, a lot better than everything at the same time Aug 13 20:20:10 * anarcat figured irssi could answer all his needs :) Aug 13 20:21:21 crap, there's no irssi-plugin-xmpp in maemo :) Aug 13 20:21:25 how do i get that in? Aug 13 20:31:23 one more try: Do you know of any way to download a web page (a url) asynchronously with gtk? Aug 13 20:31:53 err... Aug 13 20:31:57 wget? Aug 13 20:32:03 lol :) Aug 13 20:32:11 V13: use a lib curl f.e. Aug 13 20:32:27 and how will it blend with gtk ? Aug 13 20:33:22 if you want a nice gui, you must write it self. the lib handles only the protocol. Aug 13 20:33:43 I'm asking for something "ready" that works with the mainloop and doesn't block Aug 13 20:34:12 Something like QHttp of Qt Aug 13 20:34:27 bloat Aug 13 20:34:57 I tried gnomevfs too but I couldn't find an "open" function. Only a "create" function Aug 13 20:35:24 it also has read_entire_file which works somehow well, but it still block. Aug 13 20:35:26 blocks Aug 13 20:36:23 you make threads, than it doesn't matter Aug 13 20:36:26 hm.. just found open() Aug 13 20:36:44 johnsq: I'm trying to avoid this since it is meant for a widget. Aug 13 20:37:37 Could the virbator be used to emphasize the corresponding frequencies in the music playing? Aug 13 20:37:41 vibrator* Aug 13 20:38:09 no Aug 13 20:38:19 lol, "virbator" makes it sound even dirtier! Xp Aug 13 20:38:22 lol :))) Aug 13 20:38:27 It cannot speed up or down very fast, and you have no easy contrrol over absolute speed. Aug 13 20:38:46 You could do something using the accellerometer, but it would be messy Aug 13 20:39:06 indeed.. It also can only vibrate reliably in one-two frequencies. Aug 13 20:39:09 it does feel like it kicks in and out reasonably fast with theturning on vib Aug 13 20:39:25 TiagoTiago, i'd be more interested in something that reports music frequencies Aug 13 20:39:37 can't you use pulse density modulation to control the speed? Aug 13 20:39:45 TiagoTiago: If you try to program it for a very short period you'll see it takes time to accelerate. Aug 13 20:39:49 VU using keyboard, very high freqs, flash the flash Aug 13 20:39:50 there isn't somthing like that? Aug 13 20:40:04 there's arecord, but that reads mic input Aug 13 20:40:10 TiagoTiago: that's exactly what the sysnode for vibra does Aug 13 20:40:17 why does it feel like it kicks in quickly when you turn the device on? Aug 13 20:40:18 not sure how vlc does it, but it should be doable Aug 13 20:40:44 TiagoTiago: because you suck at measuring stuff accurately. Aug 13 20:40:46 tactile illusion? Aug 13 20:40:50 lol Aug 13 20:40:56 TiagoTiago: human senses are very bad at measuring instants. Aug 13 20:41:36 but you believe we would notice the dlapse in timing when it's vibbing to the music? Aug 13 20:41:45 lapse* Aug 13 20:41:59 TiagoTiago: just try it Aug 13 20:42:06 yes. Aug 13 20:42:17 You can make it throb in time to the beat - sure. Aug 13 20:42:21 But not specific tones. Aug 13 20:42:54 what if it's part of the media player, and the audio is delayed to match the average delay of the acelerometer? Aug 13 20:43:16 it's worth a try I'd say Aug 13 20:43:47 of course it woudn't be a hifi spakear, it would be the vuvuzela version of the "WoW effect" Aug 13 20:44:13 well Aug 13 20:44:22 i can power my PC speakers using the N900 Aug 13 20:44:31 you'll never achieve to 'tune' it to a sync subharmonic of a 200Hz bass, but maybe that's not really needed anyway Aug 13 20:44:48 a VU + vibra + keyboard led lights + flash light + RGB led would be awesome Aug 13 20:44:52 for a small party Aug 13 20:45:19 A very, very small party. Aug 13 20:45:31 would make a nice product placement on a music video, the thing with the little stand in the back deployed, buzzing on the table with the music Aug 13 20:45:33 or get a 100 N900s Aug 13 20:45:43 MohammadAG51: whats the point for a vibra in a small party? Aug 13 20:45:58 Now that you mentioned that... Is there any demo ever written for a smartphone ? Aug 13 20:46:03 i guess it's a matter of location, location location Aug 13 20:46:07 xnt14, idk, but this is a family channel Aug 13 20:46:40 devices with vibrating fucntionality have been known to be used in certain types of very exclusive fun Aug 13 20:46:42 V13: demo of? Aug 13 20:46:43 * DocScrutinizer imagines 7 mice dancing around a beeping and popping and flashing N900 :-> Aug 13 20:46:48 MohammadAG51: lol, N900 D4280 Aug 13 20:47:07 no that moter :P Aug 13 20:47:09 *motor Aug 13 20:47:23 SpeedEvil: you know... demoscene... Aug 13 20:47:35 demo as in a little program that shows fancy graphics and somtiems also audio that doesn't do much mroe than that Aug 13 20:48:01 TiagoTiago: well.. in a device like N900 or other smartphone it could use the leds, the vibrator, even make a call :) Aug 13 20:48:15 V13: not really - for example bounce? Aug 13 20:48:22 oh Aug 13 20:48:29 that type of demo Aug 13 20:48:52 speedevil: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Demoscene Aug 13 20:49:01 well, actually, Bounce is kinda between the two, it demonstrate programing skills and graphics capabilities, abut also isn't a complete game Aug 13 20:49:07 I am aware of demos. Aug 13 20:49:16 :P Aug 13 20:49:21 what is a demo? Aug 13 20:49:25 Never heard of Aug 13 20:50:00 demo versions of programs and games are a limited (often crippled) versions of the full thing, that is used as bait to attract potential buyers of the full thing Aug 13 20:50:17 TiagoTiago: I'm not referring to that. Aug 13 20:50:20 also please... ffs "demo scene" went away like 20 years ago along w/ the amigas... Aug 13 20:50:36 but also there are demos that are like i described earlier, simple programs that display fancy graphics in realtime, somtimes audio too, that don't do much more than that Aug 13 20:50:49 tech demo: a sample application demonstrating a feature or possible idea Aug 13 20:50:50 i believe they do. Aug 13 20:50:58 TiagoTiago: also please... ffs "demo scene" went away like 20 years ago along w/ the amigas... Aug 13 20:51:18 they are very fast, performing many real-time renderings or other effects and they can be very small in size. Aug 13 20:51:24 tybollt: amiga went away?? :-o Aug 13 20:51:35 nah, people still do them for PCs , and some people even puish old hardware to do stuff never thought of back whent hey were current nowadays Aug 13 20:51:49 DocScrutinizer: omg are you one of the Pegasos people? Aug 13 20:51:53 anyway, A demo is by definition the kind of program that would combine the vibra with the music. Aug 13 20:52:01 * tybollt does the cross sign in DocScrutinizer general direction Aug 13 20:52:02 ;) Aug 13 20:52:22 a wraith?! Aug 13 20:52:57 here are some demos: http://awards.scene.org/nominees.php?cat=10 Aug 13 20:52:57 bats are my best friends ;-) Aug 13 20:53:47 Watchout for the white stuff growing in some of their noses, quarantine the poor bastards and find out where they caught it Aug 13 20:54:23 WAit, Doc, are you saying you suck? Aug 13 20:54:54 :-[ Aug 13 20:55:07 blood, i mean blood Aug 13 20:55:10 DocScrutinizer: Coincidentally, I was thinking of a plugin bat detector for the n900. Aug 13 20:55:23 coool Aug 13 20:55:35 we got a ds of the mic? Aug 13 20:55:50 No - not with the internal mic. Aug 13 20:55:59 why not? Aug 13 20:56:09 plug it in the headset/tv-out socket Aug 13 20:56:14 I was assuming it won't go to 100KHz Aug 13 20:56:17 k Aug 13 20:56:25 fair enough Aug 13 20:56:30 TiagoTiago: Indeed, with a mixer. Aug 13 20:56:53 some bat detectors automaticly shift the frequency to audible ranges, no? Aug 13 20:57:30 basicly they work by pickign up their clicks and shrieks and shifitng the frequency down, at least some of the oens i saw on TV Aug 13 20:57:46 mixer == one transistor powered via micbias + headphones out Aug 13 20:57:48 while I don't know of the microphone range, the camera is able to detect IR light. Aug 13 20:58:11 TOO BAD WE ARE DEALING WITH BATS AND NOT BOTS Aug 13 20:58:17 oops, sorry, bumped on capslock Aug 13 20:58:17 just point the tv remote to the camera of the n900 and see it blinking Aug 13 20:58:21 TiagoTiago: basically, yes. Aug 13 20:58:55 wait a minute Aug 13 20:59:19 timer expired Aug 13 20:59:20 What about converting to RF and decoding the signal picked by the FM receiver? Aug 13 20:59:59 ah, wait, what is the frequency of the bat signals? Aug 13 21:00:36 well.. if you're fast enough, you can hit someone two times per second with a baseball bat. Aug 13 21:00:41 * V13 runs Aug 13 21:00:41 TiagoTiago: 10-100KHz IIRC. Aug 13 21:00:52 V13: I think you just struck out with that pun Aug 13 21:00:56 Hey all Aug 13 21:00:58 nah, thought I'd have the datasheet open. But anyway, iirc the sampling goes up to 96k/s Aug 13 21:00:59 ah, that isn't in the FM RF range :/ Aug 13 21:01:06 nah, i laughed Aug 13 21:01:07 MOUD: Hiya Aug 13 21:01:10 "Most bats use frequencies in the range 20-80 kHz" Aug 13 21:01:16 balls Aug 13 21:01:21 sup jaem? Aug 13 21:01:33 MOUD: Just finished lunch. Rather full. Aug 13 21:01:45 Back to code Aug 13 21:01:46 too low for raw encoding int he range of the FM receiver :( Aug 13 21:02:01 good for you Aug 13 21:02:15 V13: here is one demo for n900. released in a party last weekend http://download.hedelmae.fi/derelict.zip Aug 13 21:02:17 Is it possible to use a PS3 or a Wiimote to control the media player of the n900? Aug 13 21:02:51 Yes. Aug 13 21:03:07 yes, i'm nto sure if someone has made it easy already though Aug 13 21:03:23 Nitial: thanks! Aug 13 21:03:47 which one works better? Aug 13 21:04:08 V13: (IR) here you go: http://share.ovi.com/media/joerg900.public/joerg900.10033 Aug 13 21:04:57 DocScrutinizer: this is a video of IR detection ? Aug 13 21:05:07 yep Aug 13 21:05:20 I know.. it is very simple to test.. just use a remote :) Aug 13 21:05:25 I've tested it myself. Aug 13 21:05:56 IRreco :-) Aug 13 21:07:03 !@$$$$$$ debian.. I don't have flash :( Aug 13 21:07:25 dunno, think that's mp4 Aug 13 21:07:41 "Videos are unable to play. Either you have an older version of Adobe's Flash player, or javascript is turned off. Update to the latest Flash player" Aug 13 21:07:47 Why IR universal remote progs always make you searcha nd download stuff yourself while those cheap universal remotes you can buy on the corner got enough models and manufactures that you can just set it to test mode, keep hitting power button and most of the times, the first time it turns on or off your device it's the right one? Aug 13 21:09:31 moin Aug 13 21:10:06 heeei Aug 13 21:10:17 moin slonopotamus Aug 13 21:10:19 TiagoTiago: 42 Aug 13 21:10:24 indeed Aug 13 21:10:38 Noma: ftw! it's 1am here Aug 13 21:10:47 is the find function in the n900 browser partly broken for you guys too? Aug 13 21:11:15 which part is broken? Aug 13 21:11:18 nox-: Not that I recall. What issue are you having? Aug 13 21:12:11 V13: hmm, you could boot to maemo Aug 13 21:12:25 (and i'm drunk a bit) :P Aug 13 21:12:25 ~ping Aug 13 21:12:26 ~ping Aug 13 21:12:27 ~pong Aug 13 21:12:28 says `search finished' and does otherwise nothing altho the searched text does appear further down on the page... Aug 13 21:13:28 mhm, seem to remember such thing Aug 13 21:13:35 (and i'm drunk a bit) :P Aug 13 21:13:40 dunno if on N900 though Aug 13 21:13:41 does it happen on any page or jsut specific ones? Aug 13 21:13:56 nox-: Can you give us the URL and query string? Aug 13 21:15:04 its not public tho i guess i could put the file up... Aug 13 21:15:33 it doesn't happen in any other page? Aug 13 21:15:51 i havent checked Aug 13 21:16:02 nox-: I assume you're not searching for anything odd that could be mistyped without being visually obvious? Aug 13 21:16:11 dont think so Aug 13 21:16:58 does the page in question pass all the WC3 tests that apply? Aug 13 21:17:14 TiagoTiago: That shouldn't affect Find, should it? Aug 13 21:17:22 At least, not unless something is really wrong with it. Aug 13 21:17:38 nox-: For that matter, I presume it /is/ HTML? Aug 13 21:17:50 dunno, perhaps some non compliant part is confusing the browser? Aug 13 21:17:56 yes it is Aug 13 21:18:02 it finds and highlights the text, but scrolls to wrong location Aug 13 21:18:11 * slonopotamus yawns Aug 13 21:18:33 DocScrutinizer51, well it didnt scroll at all... Aug 13 21:18:47 slonopotamus: How is it that yawns are contagious even over IRC, and still science has no sure explanation? Aug 13 21:18:48 I've been having issues where doublicking to zoom somtimes send the browser to the end of the page isntead of focusing on the item in question, but the zoom still happens as expected Aug 13 21:18:58 *yawn* Aug 13 21:19:03 well, search is just broken in maemo Aug 13 21:19:03 mirror neurons Aug 13 21:19:05 TiagoTiago: I've seen that glitch the odd time Aug 13 21:19:33 jaem, they're not Aug 13 21:19:36 they also help paralysed people rehabilitate just by watching people moving on TV Aug 13 21:19:37 jaem: yawns don't care about irc Aug 13 21:19:51 MohammadAG51: they are for me. :/ Aug 13 21:19:58 * MohammadAG51 yawns Aug 13 21:20:03 nope, they're not Aug 13 21:20:53 * slonopotamus tries to decide whether he should start one more useless flame talk Aug 13 21:21:02 slonopotamus: no Aug 13 21:21:32 I saw this thing about this speaker that modualted audible sound on ultrasound to make it propagate with less dispersion and still be hearable as if it was just regular sound, could it work with FM transmittions to pigback a transmission bellow the range of the transmitter? Aug 13 21:21:44 TiagoTiago: no. Aug 13 21:21:54 why not? Aug 13 21:22:03 would the coils still ressonate the same? Aug 13 21:22:08 jaem: could you give us open drivers for n900 hw then? Aug 13 21:22:25 TiagoTiago: 42 Aug 13 21:22:26 like how when you strike a note on a string a few octaves up or down of another string and the other string also vibrates? Aug 13 21:22:55 resonance Aug 13 21:23:02 yeah Aug 13 21:23:09 that is how it works Aug 13 21:23:29 perhaps modulating pulses of FM bursts? Aug 13 21:23:44 idk what this is about btw, i'm just saying what you said correctly :P Aug 13 21:24:05 nobody knows Aug 13 21:24:16 ah, yeah, somtimes my typonese is too fluent for comfort Aug 13 21:25:20 * DocScrutinizer heads out to get a few beer, otherwise feels disconnected to general mood here Aug 13 21:25:34 i guess those 300 pages of physics helped Aug 13 21:25:43 sorry u.u Aug 13 21:34:00 Woah, i've jsut realized it, if the "there is an app for that" mantra was actually real, that would make the iPhone the physical manifestation of rule 34!!!! 0.0 Aug 13 21:34:48 TiagoTiago: There /is/ an app for that... Apple just banned it. Aug 13 21:35:13 lol Aug 13 22:13:28 holy shit Aug 13 22:13:32 machine gun was just fired Aug 13 22:13:51 crashanddie, do what i do Aug 13 22:13:56 don't give a crap Aug 13 22:14:03 crap Aug 13 22:14:07 well, I'd like to check if the car's fine Aug 13 22:14:07 crashie: Still in .ie? Aug 13 22:14:13 tybollt: .ie? Aug 13 22:14:14 i can't set a lockcode on my n900 Aug 13 22:14:17 I've never been in .ie Aug 13 22:14:22 it seems that i set one by mistake Aug 13 22:14:28 o.o Aug 13 22:14:29 crashanddie: ehr... then crack is what I am on :) Aug 13 22:14:34 crashanddie: UK then? Aug 13 22:14:44 nha, left the UK some 8 months ago now Aug 13 22:14:53 south of france, touristic area and all Aug 13 22:15:23 what out for hidden gunners Aug 13 22:15:30 watch* Aug 13 22:15:34 i've read this thread but it's just freakin crazy http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=37808 Aug 13 22:15:45 i don't feel like downloading and running a random a.out from a forum Aug 13 22:15:56 crashanddie: aaah so its the ETA out and about then... Aug 13 22:16:41 ffs Aug 13 22:16:44 it's 12345 Aug 13 22:16:46 bloody hell Aug 13 22:16:52 gotta change the combination on my luggage Aug 13 22:20:15 read down, there is a way to crack the existing passwword without overwriting stuff (at least from what i've read so far) Aug 13 22:20:37 didn't qwerty12 find a way to corrupt it? Aug 13 22:21:43 is there a way to put the applications in alphabetical order without installing catorise or some such? Aug 13 22:22:28 open terminal, rm .config/menus/hildon.menu Aug 13 22:22:40 menu will regerate with a-z order Aug 13 22:22:44 that doesn't sound safe Aug 13 22:22:45 except for preinstalled apps Aug 13 22:22:55 TiagoTiago, it is safe, deal with it Aug 13 22:22:56 :P Aug 13 22:22:59 but what do i know Aug 13 22:23:14 nite all, sweet dreams Aug 13 22:23:20 you too Aug 13 22:23:22 hildon-desktop regenerates it Aug 13 22:23:25 nn Aug 13 22:23:41 MohammadAG51: thanks Aug 13 22:27:07 is there a map program which easily allows you to put a persistent "pin" in the map, as one can in google earth? Aug 13 22:27:24 e.g. mark that fish&chip shop you can never find on the map or something Aug 13 22:28:56 BCMM: I don't know about currently, but the Landmarks API in Qt Mobility supports that, so any new apps using those libs could easily add such a feature. Aug 13 22:29:02 There may be some now - I'm just mentioning that. Aug 13 22:33:41 jaem: what is qt mobility? Aug 13 22:34:25 oh i see, there is an API for managing places of interest Aug 13 22:34:47 BCMM: It's a set of libraries Nokia/Qt is working on to augment Qt with access to functionality of mobile devices. Aug 13 22:35:19 tbh, a simple lat/long/description/possibly colour of marker in a text file would do for management, and it probably wouldn't be a huge deal to implement it on top of maep's lib Aug 13 22:35:34 Qt is great, but if your mobile app still needs to handle every phone's camera/GPS/telephony subsystem separately, it means the benefits of Qt are limited Aug 13 22:35:37 hence QtMobility Aug 13 22:35:56 BCMM: Oh, I wasn't suggesting that it wasn't possible (or simple) now, or that it /isn't/ implemented in anything Aug 13 22:36:28 I was just pointing out that that functionality is baked into the new libraries, so there's little excuse for apps using them to not do so. :P Aug 13 22:39:53 <_< Aug 13 22:41:55 * rm_you waves at GeneralAntilles, timeless, RST38h Aug 13 23:12:14 Do you know of somthing like Dropbox, with multiplatform clients, but that stores the files in a gmail account )much bigger storage) Aug 13 23:12:16 ? Aug 13 23:12:56 with a maemo client ? :) Aug 13 23:13:05 yep Aug 13 23:13:07 wasnt there some gmail fuse thing? Aug 13 23:13:20 (does fusefs work on maemo?) Aug 13 23:14:14 * TiagoTiago goes look "fusefs" on Wikipedia Aug 13 23:14:29 "There were no results matching the query. " :( Aug 13 23:15:31 what's a flash-fading blue light mean? Aug 13 23:15:44 you got mail? Aug 13 23:16:25 well it wouldn't turn on Aug 13 23:16:30 so I pulled the battery Aug 13 23:16:31 check the dashboard for a big yellow card (i dunno what color it is if you're using any theme other than the default one) Aug 13 23:16:31 <.< Aug 13 23:16:55 oh Aug 13 23:16:56 TiagoTiago, http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Filesystem_in_Userspace Aug 13 23:18:09 i see fuse-utils in apt so its probably working Aug 13 23:18:27 anyone here know for sure? Aug 13 23:19:11 btw, apt-utils in repos Aug 13 23:19:22 and synaptic, but there's a missing dependency Aug 13 23:19:39 you can get it from the sdk repos, sgml-data afaik Aug 13 23:21:39 http://sr71.net/projects/gmailfs/ Aug 13 23:22:00 (not in apt so would at least need to be ported) Aug 13 23:28:03 fuse is working Aug 13 23:29:01 even sshfs Aug 13 23:29:18 afaik Aug 13 23:29:31 cehteh did it Aug 13 23:30:28 do you know about gmailfs? Aug 13 23:30:47 gmilfs? Aug 13 23:30:49 heh. Aug 13 23:30:51 nfc Aug 13 23:33:44 wait, Gmilfs? lol Aug 13 23:34:07 gMILFs? lol Aug 13 23:34:23 no, the G is part of it Aug 13 23:34:50 hmm Aug 13 23:34:53 gnu milfs Aug 13 23:35:01 GrandMa Aug 13 23:36:12 * TiagoTiago is laughing out loud for real picturing the reaction of the rest of the participants of the channel Aug 13 23:40:26 TiagoTiago: new to the gilf thing, i guess? Aug 13 23:40:33 lol Aug 13 23:41:40 http://media.ebaumsworld.com/mediaFiles/picture/517361/442369.png <- sfw. Aug 13 23:41:48 perhaps not your mind. but. Aug 13 23:54:17 IS there a tutorial somewhere that will teach me what to do to setup the gmailfs fuse thing? Aug 13 23:54:59 off to bed, might be away for a day or two, break from IRC etc etc Aug 13 23:55:05 night all Aug 13 23:55:11 rest well, cya Aug 13 23:56:59 I coded python+gtk script and made .deb from it. It runs fine when I start it from terminal, but when I start it from icon it just loads from couple seconds and then nothing. Any ideas? Aug 14 00:06:23 run-standalone.sh ? Aug 14 00:06:33 does it got a , the N900 doesn't recognize the energency number for my country.... Aug 14 00:06:40 good thing this isn't an emergency Aug 14 00:09:24 doesn't recognize the emergency number for Mercosul either Aug 14 00:11:25 WAit, is it illegal for me to have a mobile that doesn't recognize the emrgency numbers for where i live? Aug 14 00:11:28 o.o Aug 14 00:12:12 do u know is samsung galaxy s better than nokia n900? Aug 14 00:12:51 based on all i know on the toipic, i would say no, but i don't know anything about samsung galaxy, so i could be wrong Aug 14 00:12:54 TiagoTiago: probably depends on your local laws. Aug 14 00:15:04 it's not like they're gonna reach in my pocket, reboot the device and try to dial it, and AFAIK we no where it says we must carry a cellphone with us at all times in case of emergency, so i'll probably not risk get arrested at all, but i probably shuold figure out where i need to file this bug report Aug 14 00:20:01 Shuld i go straight to Nokia or is there some place to report such issues online? Aug 14 00:20:59 from what i recall of emergency calls on gsm, it's less about the number you call and more of a specific protocol configured at the cell tower Aug 14 00:21:15 i would bet if you called 112 or 911 you'd get emergency services on it Aug 14 00:21:35 but yeah, i would find a place to submit a bug report Aug 14 00:21:53 my N73 recognises 911, 112 and the local emergency number, my N900 only knows about 911 and 112 Aug 14 00:23:37 so it's not somthing from the towers, unless this is another mobile phone standard the N900 ignores Aug 14 00:24:07 no, not what i meant Aug 14 00:24:36 i mean you call your emergency number, the phone initiates an emergency call, and the tower can route it Aug 14 00:24:47 ah Aug 14 00:24:52 emergency is emergency Aug 14 00:25:05 for instance, where i live, if i call 911 in the city i get the local dispatch because the towers route 911 to them, but if i call on the motorway, i get the state police dispatch Aug 14 00:25:17 you're allowed to connect to *any* cell tower, regardless of carrier Aug 14 00:25:20 same if i call 112, or 999 Aug 14 00:25:33 and there's no "number", for mobile phones Aug 14 00:25:44 hm, i didn't try 999 on either device Aug 14 00:25:57 not sure if it's rapuyama that needs to know that, or the ui Aug 14 00:26:37 well, the phone shouldn't be storing the numbers twice, so the lower level should be it Aug 14 00:26:48 double bookkeeping is bad Aug 14 00:27:46 double bookkeeping is awesome! Aug 14 00:27:47 double bookkeeping is awesome! Aug 14 00:28:03 well, it could have the international standards hardcoded plus additional parameters in a softer part of the system Aug 14 00:35:59 Hello Aug 14 00:36:34 I am planning to byt a new cellphone as my Nokia N97 was stolen. Can anyone here recommen Nokia N900? Aug 14 00:37:29 no, get an iphone Aug 14 00:40:23 xae8koo: are you a linux user? Aug 14 00:40:40 also, the n900 is not a phone Aug 14 00:42:35 ~/MyDocs/.documents/Download $ javaws freenet.jnlp Aug 14 00:42:36 /usr/bin/javaws: exec: line 6: /opt/icedtea6/bin/javaws.real: not found Aug 14 00:42:38 can i do anythign about it? Aug 14 00:45:00 kerio: I use Ubuntu for my laptops, becasue Debian is a hassle with the wireless cards. Aug 14 00:45:11 visz: I'd rather burn my head Aug 14 00:47:06 what kerio said Aug 14 00:47:40 xae8koo: expect some quirkyness and general unconsistancy of the UI Aug 14 00:47:41 allthough i wouldn't count n97 as a phone either Aug 14 00:47:52 apart from that, it's a *great* toy Aug 14 00:47:58 buy it Aug 14 00:48:12 no reason not to buy it Aug 14 00:48:17 Because my N97 was stolen and the insurance money will most likley cover most of it now. Aug 14 00:48:46 Easy Debian seems quite intresting Aug 14 00:48:46 if you're looking for a pocket computer Aug 14 00:49:24 I am looking for a device with phone capabilities that I can show of to my friend who has Htc Hero and make him feel worthless. Aug 14 00:49:41 In a kind caring way, ofcourse Aug 14 00:50:45 android has nice animated backgrounds Aug 14 00:51:28 N900 doesn't? Aug 14 00:51:32 That can be an issue Aug 14 00:51:41 really? Aug 14 00:51:45 But I think N900 is bether for watching movies Aug 14 00:51:55 doubt that Aug 14 00:52:14 I has a video card, and support H.264 Aug 14 00:52:54 why would you watch movies on such a small display? Aug 14 00:53:35 what about live wallpapaers? Aug 14 00:55:23 If you know how to use it, the N900 will be the most awesome pocket thing you ever had, but if you don't, it might be annoying and even disapointing Aug 14 00:56:49 TiagoTiago: I can get around Linux fairly well Aug 14 00:57:02 then it's probably the device for you Aug 14 00:57:31 it migth have a few quirks, but there is no other device on the market that can run a regular desktop distro AND work like a cellphone Aug 14 00:57:40 at least not AFAIK Aug 14 00:58:14 Can I run EVERY Debian program on it? Ofcourse if it has enough ram/cpu/graphis... Aug 14 00:58:54 no, many need to be adapted, but there are several already done Aug 14 00:59:11 do i see that right that firefox is only available via ovi store which needs a registration? Aug 14 00:59:23 and you can kinda run debian with EasyDeb which i uses chroot ( know much less about these topics than you ) Aug 14 01:00:01 i know much less* Aug 14 01:00:14 which uses* Aug 14 01:00:48 for me, the N900 was the device that get me to use linux more serious (before, i've just tested it "for the lulz", for example Kubuntu), even if i could the very basics of how linux works before. :p Aug 14 01:01:18 I feel it seams great. Is the screen good? Aug 14 01:01:54 xae8koo: easy debian just needs a recompile, for normal programs Aug 14 01:02:04 if you want them within maemo, you kinda *have* to adapt the UI of course Aug 14 01:02:09 xae8koo: it is Aug 14 01:02:16 it's a bit small though Aug 14 01:02:31 800x480 Aug 14 01:02:45 i don't know the diagonal measurement by heart though Aug 14 01:02:52 3,5"? Aug 14 01:02:52 very high ppi count Aug 14 01:02:56 2,5"? Aug 14 01:03:01 I think it was 3,5 Aug 14 01:03:26 side to side the whole thing is about as long as my N73 is tall Aug 14 01:03:46 there is about 1.5 centimeters that are not screen on each side Aug 14 01:04:25 xae8koo: depending on the place you live, you may want to remap some keys Aug 14 01:04:50 also the battery management entity (bme) sucks Aug 14 01:05:03 and some builtin nokia apps suck and are not opensourced Aug 14 01:05:06 5mp camera with Zeiss optics :) Aug 14 01:05:09 and bla bla bla Aug 14 01:05:18 it has its flaws Aug 14 01:05:32 yeah, it's not perfect, but you're not gonna find anythign else like it out there Aug 14 01:05:37 and yet, it's still better than any wannabe-smart phones Aug 14 01:06:06 kerio: Oh, I am Norwegian I use the "ÆØÅ" characteres Aug 14 01:06:11 national layouts exists? or do you mean remap as in improve useless key bindings? Aug 14 01:06:22 FIQ: national layouts exist Aug 14 01:07:00 xae8koo: what kind of linux nerd are you? :/ i'm talking about ~$&|<>[]{} Aug 14 01:07:05 it's not a smartphone, its a mobile computer that has cell phone functionality Aug 14 01:07:24 lol Aug 14 01:07:50 kerio: Hehe, those were fairly easy to find on my N97 Aug 14 01:07:55 (those are not present by default on the italian kbd layout) Aug 14 01:08:04 ymmv Aug 14 01:08:12 and it will probably v Aug 14 01:08:38 I will call the insurance company tomorrow and tell them to hurry up Aug 14 01:08:44 If Bush junior had been elected 4 yearslater we could have been in the middle of a nuclear war, Iran and N. Korea got da bomb 0.0 Aug 14 01:08:44 Ah, you meant improve useless key bindings then Aug 14 01:08:46 hehe Aug 14 01:09:10 Hi, rm_you. Aug 14 01:09:11 Has any of you used the infared port as a remote control? Aug 14 01:09:21 FIQ: i have those characters intelligently mapped to shift+fn+key Aug 14 01:09:22 Hey GA Aug 14 01:09:25 xae8koo: qtirreco Aug 14 01:09:35 huge database of tv remotes Aug 14 01:09:40 kerio: Does it work well? easy to configure? Aug 14 01:09:50 * FIQ lags Aug 14 01:09:52 (the ir port is basically just a led though) Aug 14 01:10:00 ah, i use that as well. :p Aug 14 01:10:07 xae8koo: yeah, it is Aug 14 01:10:14 nice ui too Aug 14 01:10:22 but just for the most critical ones Aug 14 01:10:24 GeneralAntilles: in the last three months I've gotten a new job, moved into a different house, bought a car, and switched to all of my own bankiing/insurance/everything services Aug 14 01:10:30 I feel like a real adult O_o Aug 14 01:10:33 could be better though - the buttons are HUUUGE Aug 14 01:10:49 'grats :) Aug 14 01:10:49 rm_you, lol, congrats. Aug 14 01:10:49 What'd you buy? Aug 14 01:10:52 and when will you be a homeowner? :P Aug 14 01:10:59 2006 Mazda3 S Aug 14 01:11:21 6-speed? Aug 14 01:11:25 5 Aug 14 01:11:37 Sweet Aug 14 01:11:38 Fun car Aug 14 01:11:42 yeah Aug 14 01:11:48 like &%|~ Aug 14 01:12:08 was looking for a manual, but this one was an auto and a really good deal / lucky find Aug 14 01:12:11 so I went with it Aug 14 01:12:35 Oh, it's not actually manual? Aug 14 01:12:37 Too bad. Aug 14 01:12:41 nope :( Aug 14 01:12:47 but still fun Aug 14 01:12:48 My friend just did that with a 2006 Civic Sport. Aug 14 01:12:51 Meh Aug 14 01:13:00 These days, if it aint stick, it's not for me. Aug 14 01:13:09 if i feel like being a poser I can switch it to fake-manual mode, rofl Aug 14 01:13:26 which is kind of a joke but lets me at least do things like shift properly around corners Aug 14 01:13:56 Sort of Aug 14 01:14:00 e lawyer that escaped Iran is saying people should focus on the human rights stuff instead of the nuclear stuff, well, if they got the world on ranmson with nukes, it will be even harder to make changes in thigns like humans rights Aug 14 01:14:07 Mostyly it's hilariously slow and useless and shifts on its own ANYWAY. :P Aug 14 01:14:45 that is not that car that lets you decide what gear to go next beforehand and it will change when it thinks it's the right time? Aug 14 01:15:42 it will let me redline it in 1st for as long as i want (or until my transmission fluid hits some heat threshold) Aug 14 01:15:49 not that i'd want to Aug 14 01:15:53 but it doesn't seem to autoshift ever Aug 14 01:16:11 Huh Aug 14 01:16:16 for most applications tho it's smarter about shifting than I am still (with respect to converving gas, at least) Aug 14 01:16:19 My dad's 06 Miata autoshifts. Aug 14 01:16:32 Meh, conserving gas is no fun. :P Aug 14 01:16:39 this one doesn't seem to, in my somewhat limited testing Aug 14 01:16:58 and the manual just says "if the transmission fluid overheats, it will switch back to auto mode" Aug 14 01:17:17 interesting Aug 14 01:17:36 i guess it's kinda like having an electronic assist manual transmission? except still using a slush-box <_< Aug 14 01:18:12 better than my volvo that had "Low" and "3rd" as its alternatives to Auto Aug 14 01:18:32 Hehe Aug 14 01:18:46 If i ever get a car, and if i can afford it, i want one of those with a CVT and computadorized torque control per wheel Aug 14 01:19:52 CVT is quite lossy Aug 14 01:19:55 Generally. Aug 14 01:20:03 Interesting, my battery percentage seems to have stopped at 100% Aug 14 01:20:03 I took out the charger 1h ago Aug 14 01:20:03 (not N900, i use P1i atm) Aug 14 01:20:13 * FIQ don't belive the meter Aug 14 01:20:32 TiagoTiago, no you don't. Aug 14 01:20:35 CVT is the worst. Aug 14 01:20:38 really? all i've heard about CVTs is they allow for the engine to run at ideal RPM regardless of speed Aug 14 01:20:47 and other good stuff Aug 14 01:21:11 hrmrm Aug 14 01:21:41 once this one is completely paid for (not actually too long) and then i save up a bit, I want a Lancer Evo (or maybe just a Ralliart) Aug 14 01:22:05 but i was tired of having to hit my starter with a stick when i got in my car in the morning Aug 14 01:22:34 so I got this in the meantime... a pretty decent car for a very affordable price Aug 14 01:22:48 anyway... it feels like forever since I've done Maemo-y stuff Aug 14 01:22:56 how's the fuel consumption compared to the alternatives? Aug 14 01:23:20 for CVT? or for the mazda3? lol Aug 14 01:23:29 yours Aug 14 01:23:44 supposedly 30 on the highway Aug 14 01:23:52 i used to get 17 on the highway with my volvo <_< Aug 14 01:23:54 lol, another new mnkey species found Aug 14 01:24:05 seems we might find bigfoot in this century Aug 14 01:24:10 monkey* Aug 14 01:24:12 about the save as everything i looked at except honda hybrids Aug 14 01:24:24 CVTs typically have moderately large radiators to cool the transmission fluid. Aug 14 01:24:25 s/save/same/ Aug 14 01:24:25 rm_you meant: about the same as everything i looked at except honda hybrids Aug 14 01:24:45 This is to cool the transmission fluid, and to remove the substantial waste heat. Aug 14 01:24:45 off (or on, depending how you look at it) topic: how Meegoized are things getting around here? Aug 14 01:25:19 since i've been more or less invisible for the last few months, i feel like i must have missed a lot Aug 14 01:25:27 i was looking at buying tickets for Dublin Aug 14 01:25:35 hm, they don't got any better lubes and geometries etc yet? Aug 14 01:25:38 has anyone actually killed their n900 by overclocking yet? Aug 14 01:25:57 hi dudes Aug 14 01:26:29 the other day i tried loading the ideal profile and after half a sec of flaky responsivenes my N900 rebooted, i'll not touch overclicking again anytime soon :/ Aug 14 01:26:40 overclocking* Aug 14 01:27:04 fair enough Aug 14 01:27:15 anyone compiled fish encryption for xchat on the n900 yet ? Aug 14 01:27:17 hmm, that changes the voltage stuff right? Aug 14 01:28:02 i'm busy being sad at lack of any working youtube client Aug 14 01:28:14 @scene looks AWESOME but hasn't worked for me yet because of youtube API changes Aug 14 01:28:42 bumps the maximum clock to 850 and does somthing with the voltage, i think it also messes with the minimum voltage Aug 14 01:29:40 minimum clokck* Aug 14 01:30:17 clock* Aug 14 01:34:03 yeah Aug 14 01:34:45 i've tried briefly just kernel-config limits Aug 14 01:34:48 where is the ir transmitter on the n900? Aug 14 01:34:55 i was under the impression the ideal profile was one of the lightest ones, so if that one made my N900 reboot in less than a second, any other profile will probably summon blue smoke Aug 14 01:35:08 to the right of the camera button Aug 14 01:35:15 i don't know enough about voltages myself. Aug 14 01:36:27 but OC'ing is a russian roullette, some chips can handle it just fine while others get instabrick Aug 14 01:37:33 and to make things even more coomplciate, some appear to handle it just fine, and then some time later they will suddenly fry, even if the OC'ing has been undone Aug 14 01:37:42 complciated* Aug 14 01:37:46 gah Aug 14 01:37:55 i guess that means i've been awaken for too long Aug 14 01:39:57 Have I understood this correctly. The N900 is able to run Maemo 5 programs, Symbian S60 ver 5 programs, and Debian packages (compiled for easy debian)? Aug 14 01:41:12 I believe Symbian progs need to be ported, which is easier if they're made with qt Aug 14 01:42:12 TiagoTiago u seen any chatting about fish encryption for xchat here ? Aug 14 01:42:24 google didnt help me much Aug 14 01:42:33 or im too tired :-) Aug 14 01:42:56 there might have been, i don't remember noticing it though Aug 14 01:43:01 check the chat log :) Aug 14 01:43:11 wanna compile src on the n900 Aug 14 01:43:26 okey Aug 14 01:43:45 think ill go to bed first :-) Aug 14 01:43:49 nn TiagoTiago Aug 14 01:43:56 you too Aug 14 01:44:47 Galg3: Fish cannot work Aug 14 01:44:53 oh okey ? Aug 14 01:44:55 Galg3: Fish is x86 asm code at the core Aug 14 01:44:57 why not Aug 14 01:45:01 ah okey Aug 14 01:45:06 Galg3: So unless someone ports it, it won't work. Aug 14 01:45:15 Well - or maybe does rthe dsbox thing Aug 14 01:45:15 crap :-( Aug 14 01:45:19 dosbox Aug 14 01:45:46 well ill just use irssi then Aug 14 01:45:48 or with qemu? Aug 14 01:45:50 IIRC - from someone discussiong it a couple of months ago. Aug 14 01:45:57 I could be remembering somerthing different. Aug 14 01:46:05 irssi go the fish thing you're looking for Aug 14 01:46:06 ? Aug 14 01:46:09 got* Aug 14 01:46:11 * nox- wonders why irc encryption needs to be written in asm... as if performance would be that important :) Aug 14 01:46:35 XCHAT does work on the N900 already, dunno about encryption stuff with it though Aug 14 01:46:41 XChat* Aug 14 01:46:45 all IRC clients needs to be able to flood sufficiently or it'll look bad ;) Aug 14 01:46:51 haha Aug 14 01:47:18 TiagoTiago ill just ssh to a irssi client , so no need to compil it on the phone Aug 14 01:47:20 what do you consider "sufficient flood"? Aug 14 01:47:34 there is irssi for the N900 already Aug 14 01:47:39 yeah i know Aug 14 01:47:46 ah, it lacks fish Aug 14 01:47:50 yeah hehe Aug 14 01:47:50 whjatever that is Aug 14 01:48:04 encryption Aug 14 01:48:11 for the chatting Aug 14 01:48:19 i see Aug 14 01:48:19 * SpeedEvil slaps Galg3 with a trout. Aug 14 01:48:31 SpeedEvil u know that i like thaT ?:-) Aug 14 01:48:33 shard secret or somthing more like OTR? Aug 14 01:48:55 TiagoTiago dont want ppl too see what i do in pm and such :-) Aug 14 01:48:56 he was looking for fish afterall Aug 14 01:49:03 hehe Aug 14 01:49:14 Galg3: DCC chat does not go through the server Aug 14 01:49:57 and ? Aug 14 01:50:06 is maemo like ubuntu? :) Aug 14 01:50:11 apt-get etc :D Aug 14 01:50:16 to a certain extent Aug 14 01:52:16 http://fish.secure.la/ Aug 14 01:52:26 claims that fish soruce is avaialble for xchat Aug 14 01:52:40 if this is really source, it should be mergeable into the xhat port on maemo Aug 14 01:53:08 nah doesnt work Aug 14 01:53:11 tried it Aug 14 01:53:12 Heag-: yes - apt-get works Aug 14 01:53:17 hm the only asm i see in xchat fish's is in DH1080.c and thats just an rdtsc (read timecounter) Aug 14 01:53:19 Galg3: tried what? Aug 14 01:53:30 to compile it Aug 14 01:53:50 nox-: Ok - maybe the person I was recalling was confused, as I do see as imple xchat binary plugin Aug 14 01:54:03 so maybe thart rwas what they were thinkin of. Aug 14 01:54:15 Galg3: why doesn't it work? Aug 14 01:54:38 wait it depends on miracl, have to check if that uses asm too... Aug 14 01:54:40 hmm sorry dont remember , was a cpl of month's ago i tried Aug 14 01:54:53 ah Aug 14 01:55:12 and thought i would check if there was a solution now Aug 14 01:55:32 hm theres an arm.txt in miracl Aug 14 01:55:50 talks about building a c-only library Aug 14 01:55:53 tried to load the precompiled binarys for linux , but didnt work :-) Aug 14 01:56:08 qemu-lib would be intreresting Aug 14 01:59:27 when isntalling stuff, if given an option, it's better to put it inside /opt, correct? Aug 14 02:00:48 hmm, weird, there's nothing really using the cpu, but the current freq is 500 Aug 14 02:01:06 did you isntall the power kernel? Aug 14 02:01:10 freq range is default 125-600 Aug 14 02:01:11 yeah Aug 14 02:01:25 it blocks 125 and 250 i think Aug 14 02:01:33 avoid frequencies: 125 Aug 14 02:01:43 hmm Aug 14 02:01:50 according to kernel-config show anyway Aug 14 02:01:58 when the device really is iddle it goes to 0 instead of the low clocks that use more energey than they should Aug 14 02:02:09 i think Aug 14 02:02:25 so you get better battery capacity ? Aug 14 02:02:42 i thinkt hat is the idea Aug 14 02:02:51 iju Aug 14 02:02:53 oki Aug 14 02:04:13 but you shouldn't be taking my word on it, i'm quite a newbie in the matters Aug 14 02:04:21 oh right, i'm reading the overclocking page on the wiki, usb plugged means locks to 500 Aug 14 02:04:35 minimum, that is. Aug 14 02:22:27 tripple nine also doesn't get recognized as an emergency number Aug 14 02:25:22 Anyone know if the size on the offline Wikipedia dumps are for the compressed or uncompressed size, given http://dumpathome.evopedia.info/dumps/finished ? Aug 14 02:28:12 because if it's just the compressed file then uncompressed 8GB could be 160GB which won't fit on 32GB. Aug 14 02:29:27 should i be considering trying to figure out how to make http://gitorious.org/blocksnet run on my N900? Aug 14 02:32:39 is your work using it? Aug 14 02:33:44 lol Aug 14 02:34:40 I'm just looking for a multiplatform thing that will allow me to share significant amoutns of data betweeen my computer and my N900 even over the internet, kinda like DropBox, but with less restrictions Aug 14 02:34:53 git Aug 14 02:34:57 ? Aug 14 02:35:06 rsync, ssh Aug 14 02:35:20 even if one of the devices is not online at the moment Aug 14 02:36:19 like with DropBox Aug 14 02:36:57 i suppose "make your computer always be online" isn't an acceptable solution? :P Aug 14 02:37:06 i wish Aug 14 02:38:37 anyone know if there is a way to get to text messages stored on my SIM? (from my old phone) Aug 14 02:38:50 can i import them or something? Aug 14 02:38:58 is your old phone a Nokia? Aug 14 02:39:03 no Aug 14 02:39:36 i thought texts stored on SIM were standard tho, like contacts? Aug 14 02:40:05 just don't know if there is actually an option to import them (can't even find importing for contacts anymore but i know i did it originally) Aug 14 02:40:27 I've been told the N900 doesn't follow all standards commonly avaiable on regular mobiles Aug 14 02:42:39 g'night guys..anyone know how to use the "alt" key on maemo (needed when sshing into my server)> Aug 14 02:43:33 only some Aug 14 02:43:49 toggle it in the terminal bar? Aug 14 02:45:16 TiagoTiago: how do you "toggle" it? Aug 14 02:46:03 oh oh Aug 14 02:47:12 i remember seeing it there, it was in a menu in the left side of the barr int he bottom, i brought up the terminal now and couldn't find it :( Aug 14 02:50:50 gotcha :) Aug 14 02:51:38 i think there is a thread somewhere in tmo about customizing the terminal shortcut bar Aug 14 02:53:34 fish - pffff Aug 14 02:54:16 whats the `real' solution? :) Aug 14 02:54:17 like sending postcards with invisible ink Aug 14 02:54:26 haha Aug 14 02:54:37 nox-: a private channel? with key? Aug 14 02:54:43 OTR? Aug 14 02:55:09 ah otr yeah, if it works on irc too Aug 14 02:55:42 nox-: DCC, ssh to a private server and use talk? even ssh from one client to the other? Aug 14 02:55:43 should work for one on one convos Aug 14 02:56:13 DocScrutinizer, :) Aug 14 02:56:44 would I use advertisment poster space to communicate to one other person in privacy? Aug 14 02:57:10 ou were a spook perhaps Aug 14 02:57:19 if you were* Aug 14 02:57:39 I know of a dude who did excel all his life. He programmed an editor, each cell one char, with linewrap, insert and all Aug 14 02:57:51 so Galg3 now you know :) Aug 14 02:58:01 (i think it was you who asked?) Aug 14 02:58:13 haha DocScrutinizer Aug 14 02:58:56 what I want to say: if you want to communicate unnoticed, the don't use a system that is designed for public chat from first to last byte Aug 14 02:58:59 TiagoTiago, you can customize the terminal's tab bar? Aug 14 02:59:19 i think saw a thread about that in tmo, i don't remember any details though Aug 14 02:59:24 * xnt14 searches Aug 14 02:59:36 hmm Aug 14 02:59:46 why does my chromium window keep on disappearing? :P **** ENDING LOGGING AT Sat Aug 14 02:59:57 2010