**** BEGIN LOGGING AT Sun Sep 26 02:59:57 2010 Sep 26 03:10:22 CuMLIX LFe Sep 26 03:10:43 just a shot from the hip Sep 26 03:17:41 hmm Sep 26 03:17:45 Status: MHDRC, Mode=Host (Power=62, DevCtl=38) Sep 26 03:17:46 OTG state: a_host:9; inactive Sep 26 03:17:56 no enum it seems Sep 26 03:18:31 meh, enough for today Sep 26 03:22:31 oops, ECHAN :-P Sep 26 03:26:01 Myuu Attack! Sep 26 03:30:15 woo, wrong channel Sep 26 03:30:15 rofl Sep 26 04:52:40 I'm ssh'd into the n900 - is there any way I can send text messages via ssh ? Sep 26 05:01:33 good question jpinx-eeepc Sep 26 05:02:19 along those lines, has anyone found a way to block or ignore messages (IM or SMS) from a contact? Sep 26 05:45:37 Morning Joe shows Peter Schiff's predictions, vindicates them, and Schiff explains the future of the economic crisis: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-8s-tZpyFTA Sep 26 06:07:01 n810 just turned itself off, wouldn't turn on, battery and sd out, gets to white screen then reboots, charger in and battery charging thing comes on, suggestions? Sep 26 06:10:40 pine Sep 26 06:17:08 mavhc, try charging longer? Sep 26 06:43:24 jpinx-eeepc: a dbus message of some sorts, probably Sep 26 07:06:33 hmm, dissect cherry? Sep 26 07:07:34 maybe even this abomination is worth for something :-P Sep 26 07:11:16 Anybody know why my n900 would be unable to play the ringtone without choking on it for a bit? The ringtone is a .wav of maybe 0.5 seconds. It's consistently glitching half-way through every time Sep 26 07:52:27 hey, people of maemo Sep 26 07:53:03 I would like to use qemu with diablo image instead of Nokia SDK, becauseit does not support amd64 or powerpc (my platforms) Sep 26 07:53:21 I've built qemu with n900 patches, to run meego on it Sep 26 07:53:33 But I'm not sure that diablo will work there Sep 26 07:53:53 Did anyone try to run development environment in qemu? Sep 26 08:02:04 OK, how to dump installed image of diablo, and kernel from a real Nokia? Sep 26 08:02:11 in order to try it in qemu? Sep 26 08:02:35 Or it will complicate of process of building/preparing packages? Sep 26 09:06:51 norayr: it works on my amd64 Sep 26 09:07:25 norayr: just disable vdso Sep 26 09:11:05 ok, thanks, i'll try Sep 26 09:16:00 Anyway, it's not crossplatform solution. I am downloading official sdk now, but I would like to be able to use qemu. Sep 26 09:19:40 DocScrutinizer, MohammadAG so you now logs of usb host or not??? Sep 26 09:21:43 yesterday you said u don't need logs because they wouldn't have enough detail and now there is a reques for more logs ind the forum... Sep 26 09:58:06 everybody's asleep ? :) Sep 26 09:58:58 * MNZ zzzz Sep 26 09:59:06 heh Sep 26 09:59:53 hey VDVsx :) Sep 26 10:00:17 hello Sickki Sep 26 10:00:19 ups Sep 26 10:00:27 *sivang Sep 26 10:00:40 yes, it happens to me all the time with irssi auto-complete Sep 26 10:01:09 hello Sep 26 10:01:32 o/ VDVsx Sep 26 10:01:50 does anyone know an open-source replacement for the on-screen keyboard that works? Sep 26 10:01:50 i ran into samppa at the airport on friday.. yesterday i saw the nice pictures of his arm lol Sep 26 10:02:05 AtnNn: it mostly works for me , what's the issue? Sep 26 10:03:10 there's no good documentation for hildon input method plugins Sep 26 10:03:50 frals: you I never managed to make fMMS work :) Sep 26 10:03:55 frals: *know Sep 26 10:04:05 frals: maybe something with my carrier, don't know Sep 26 10:04:07 frals, yeah, lol Sep 26 10:04:20 file a trout report Sep 26 10:04:35 * MohammadAG51 slaps frals with a large trout Sep 26 10:05:28 MohammadAG51: I should, or at leat fry a trout report Sep 26 10:06:01 * frals slaps MohammadAG51 around a bit with a large trout Sep 26 10:06:17 * MohammadAG51 eats frals' trout Sep 26 10:06:26 :( Sep 26 10:06:41 very annoyed with new twitter :( Sep 26 10:06:50 * MohammadAG51 didn't get it yet Sep 26 10:07:39 new twitter is awesome! Sep 26 10:08:14 conversations are so much easier to follow and understand, even if you don't follow all the participants in a convo Sep 26 10:08:43 * sivang hopes twitter won't become the new "google" as developer's best friend ;) Sep 26 10:08:50 tweetdeck ftw Sep 26 10:09:24 MNZ: its shit in microb :( Sep 26 10:09:42 cant scroll in the right pane, doesnt fit horizontally without scrolling :( Sep 26 10:09:50 frals, oh that... hrm. Khweeteur(sp?) then :P Sep 26 10:10:08 yer knaw, MicroB is rather amazing, even compared to desktop browsers. Sep 26 10:10:32 I hate when I accidently click a link when I scroll the page. Sep 26 10:11:00 Hoxzer: that's true, but that is probably not related to the browser but to the gesture tweaking Sep 26 10:11:24 Hoxzer: the browser probably just responds to a "click" event from its POV Sep 26 10:26:23 “You can search throughout the entire universe for someone who is more deserving of your love and affection than you are yourself, and that person is not to be found anywhere. You, yourself, as much as anybody in the entire universe, deserve your love and affection.” Sep 26 10:26:23 “Thousands of candles can be lit from a single candle, and the life of the candle will not be shortened. Happiness never decreases by being shared.” Sep 26 10:26:23 “An idea that is developed and put into action is more important than an idea that exists only as an idea.” Sep 26 10:26:23 “An insincere and evil friend is more to be feared than a wild beast; a wild beast may wound your body, but an evil friend will wound your mind.” Sep 26 10:26:26 “Three things cannot be long hidden: the sun, the moon, and the truth.” Sep 26 10:26:28 “All that we are is the result of what we have thought. The mind is everything. What we think we become.” Sep 26 10:26:31 “Peace comes from within. Do not seek it without.” Sep 26 10:26:37 “To understand everything is to forgive everything” Sep 26 10:26:39 “You will not be punished for your anger, you will be punished by your anger.” Sep 26 10:26:41 “A dog is not considered a good dog because he is a good barker. A man is not considered a good man because he is a good talker.” Sep 26 10:26:44 “Those who are free of resentful thoughts surely find peace.” Sep 26 10:26:46 “However many holy words you read,However many you speak,What good will they do you If you do not act on upon them?” Sep 26 10:26:51 “We are shaped by our thoughts; we become what we think. When the mind is pure, joy follows like a shadow that never leaves.” Sep 26 10:26:54 “You cannot travel the path until you have become the path itself” Sep 26 10:26:56 hmm? Sep 26 10:26:56 “An idea that is developed and put into action is more important than an idea that exists only as an idea.” Sep 26 10:26:59 “When you realize how perfect everything is you will tilt your head back and laugh at the sky” Sep 26 10:27:01 “A jug fills drop by drop.” Sep 26 10:27:07 “The only real failure in life is not to be true to the best one knows.” Sep 26 10:27:09 “Believe nothing, no matter where you read it, or who said it, no matter if I have said it, unless it agrees with your own reason and your own common sense.” Sep 26 10:27:12 “Even death is not to be feared by Sep 26 10:27:57 Maemo's daily eastern musings? Sep 26 10:28:05 *eastern Sep 26 10:28:23 go back to you matrix Sep 26 10:28:28 hehe Sep 26 10:28:44 well, there's one thing right there- 11:28 < neo-the_one> “An idea that is developed and put into action is more important than an idea that exists only as an idea.” Sep 26 10:28:51 ;) Sep 26 10:30:55 jacekowski: he's doing that a lot and craws back into his matrix? Sep 26 10:31:22 Talking profound shit is easy. Doing profound shit is hard. Sep 26 10:31:27 My thought for the day. Sep 26 10:31:39 SpeedEvil: yes, that's more or less rephrases it neatly. Sep 26 10:34:45 i hate usb Sep 26 10:35:08 so poorly designed protocol Sep 26 10:37:43 jacekowski: why do you think it's poorly designed? Sep 26 10:37:57 I have following problem while installing python-pygame http://pastebin.com/8Ntti3Bk Sep 26 10:38:42 bit stuffing to stop long zero runs Sep 26 10:39:01 and that makes my decoder so much more complicated Sep 26 10:40:04 * sivang tries to find the hwoto for setting up USB network between the device and pc Sep 26 10:40:59 http://wiki.maemo.org/N900_USB_networking Sep 26 10:41:21 could anybody help me with installing pygame? Sep 26 10:46:53 delor: are you upgraded to latest version of libs/ maemo? you seem have to a confllicting files from 2 packages, Sep 26 10:47:18 delor: there's a switch to make one override the other, but I wouldn't recommend it before trying to sort it diffrently Sep 26 10:47:33 delor: so try to remove, update, and try again Sep 26 10:47:45 delor: I'eve never installed pygame on Maemo, FYI Sep 26 10:47:52 delor: this is general apt advice Sep 26 10:49:51 delor: or rather, dpkg advice Sep 26 10:51:52 mmm, when i press Fn+Ctrl (for popping up the sym menu) and then select the ` to compose an accented letter, the ` key does not highlight anymore (i have maemo 5, vanilla from nokia) it's probably a know bug, any workaround? Sep 26 10:52:26 on a nokia N900, arg, quite important info Sep 26 10:52:52 Odd. Insalled anything? Sep 26 10:52:56 recently Sep 26 10:54:30 recentrly no Sep 26 10:54:40 i installed something that may have done it starting Sep 26 10:54:55 and i discovered that it is triggered by connecting it to USB Sep 26 10:55:20 if i reboot it goes away and works perfectly anymore Sep 26 10:55:30 i can do a test just now Sep 26 10:56:59 sivang: what would you do in this situation? Sep 26 10:57:15 odd Sep 26 10:57:19 - usb Sep 26 10:57:31 booting and testing, second :) Sep 26 10:57:43 nothing springs to mind, sorry. Sep 26 10:58:33 ok rebooted and perfectly working. connecting to usb and closing the usb menu so it just recharge Sep 26 11:00:09 delor: removing the pygae stuff, apt-get -f install Sep 26 11:01:22 delor: letting it finish, then upgrading and making sure you are current on stuff, and try reinstall, if that deos not help, I recommend making sure the libs that the dependencies pull or provided by are not already provided by some other package, if so this might be a bug in either of them, if this is an extras-devel/testing then this might be and you should take care to know what you are doing. Sep 26 11:01:57 sivang: apt-get -f install output: http://pastebin.com/PtLxxuMA Sep 26 11:02:28 bad.... test failed, now it works even after connection. But it must related to something when i connect it, because it does that each morning, after it worked all day i attach it to charge to usb, and the next morning it does not highlight anymore Sep 26 11:03:41 have you got anything installed that does anything on connection - or alters the keyboard setup Sep 26 11:03:43 delor: not sure about that though, ask others, it probably has something to do with "optification" http://lists.maemo.org/pipermail/maemo-developers/2009-October/021419.html for example, please ask others that is the far I can go with this :) Sep 26 11:05:58 delor: http://wiki.maemo.org/Opt_Problem Sep 26 11:08:30 moo all Sep 26 11:08:46 oow Sep 26 11:08:58 yo RST38h Sep 26 11:09:22 hmm, I'm getting "device memory filled" notifications, /me tries to remove the yesterdayly installed pycallblocker Sep 26 11:09:35 when it says that, it means no room on rootfs? Sep 26 11:09:53 and the dvice mostly refused to do anything I do Sep 26 11:10:07 df Sep 26 11:10:17 oh right, /me opens the terminal Sep 26 11:10:26 yet another vauge notification (tm) Sep 26 11:10:48 *vaugue Sep 26 11:11:11 filling the FS completely is bad Sep 26 11:11:12 vague, sivang Sep 26 11:11:23 RST38h: err, yes :) I never get this one right Sep 26 11:11:40 RST38h: at least I'm not saying "You Loose!" :-p Sep 26 11:12:17 * sivang ROTFls when he recalls that from what timeless told him about an insulting game on one of the early nokia's phone. Sep 26 11:12:36 right, so rootfs is filled. Sep 26 11:12:45 * sivang checks what ate it. Sep 26 11:14:51 gfind / -size +1000k -ctime -2 Sep 26 11:15:10 * sivang tries to reach for the pipe char, ar this is better, thanks SpeedEvil Sep 26 11:16:17 btw, should everything under /opt be owned by root:root? Sep 26 11:16:28 hmm, I got not gfind Sep 26 11:16:31 O_o Sep 26 11:18:40 sivang: install it :D Sep 26 11:18:42 (don't) Sep 26 11:20:24 kerio: with not room on rootfs? how does that optification on the flu works? Sep 26 11:20:37 kerio: does it need room on rootfs? err, but everything else apt needs it... Sep 26 11:20:48 *wooosh* Sep 26 11:20:57 (that's the sound of the joke flying right over your head) Sep 26 11:22:25 kerio: notice I wrote "optification on the flu" accidently :) Sep 26 11:24:11 sivang you did it on purpose Sep 26 11:25:15 ZogG: Freudian_slip ? Sep 26 11:25:44 =) Sep 26 11:26:19 * sivang notes he works on sunday, on top of all Sep 26 11:26:22 * RST38h moos at ZogG evilly Sep 26 11:26:54 something is makign weird noise in my chair when i type Sep 26 11:27:05 RST38h, aloha Sep 26 11:28:16 ZogG: ah, I see you also should be working on Sunday =P Sep 26 11:28:28 * sivang reverts back to du Sep 26 11:28:29 nope Sep 26 11:28:33 we have holidays Sep 26 11:28:47 !google Sukkot Sep 26 11:28:48 Results for Sukkot on Google: Sep 26 11:28:48 -- Sep 26 11:28:51 ZogG: well, but you are deduced vacation time Sep 26 11:29:00 ZogG: we work on hol hamoed Sep 26 11:29:43 we alsso - but as office closed there are less people on shift - so i got only 2 shifts this week =( Sep 26 11:30:07 ZogG: ah, I see , well, at least you ahve mroe time to tinker or threash the device :) Sep 26 11:31:21 sivang right now i stare on it, as i want to send sms to that girl and i shoyuldn't =) Sep 26 11:31:54 ZogG: I have an app upcoming against it :) Sep 26 11:32:16 anyway, lunch time Sep 26 11:32:24 sivang, electroshocking you on stupuid sms? Sep 26 11:32:31 RST38h, so sup? Sep 26 11:32:52 in soviet russia you don't send sms, sms sends you Sep 26 11:33:07 ZogG: Sunday. Sep 26 11:33:30 RST38h, resting? Sep 26 11:33:46 ZogG: Got Qt-based version of Speccy to compile and run yesterday. Found just how much Qt tools suck, exactly. Sep 26 11:34:28 lol Sep 26 11:38:53 RST38h do you use qt based or gtk based DE on desktop? Sep 26 11:41:26 or you use windows? Sep 26 11:48:47 ZogG: I use a standard ubuntu desktop i.e.gnome Sep 26 11:48:58 and Windows too Sep 26 11:49:38 "Phone glitch lets Kansas residents set off tornado alarms by misdialing" <=== hehe Sep 26 11:49:54 don't like ubuntu that much but it's ok on laptop imho Sep 26 11:50:52 ubuntu is the first linux ever that installed on my laptop without me having to have sex with it Sep 26 12:01:25 So. After Flashing my touch screen doesnt response to anything anymore Sep 26 12:01:32 Is there a way to fix it? Sep 26 12:01:38 flashing again didnt fix it Sep 26 12:05:33 Hm, someone started installing Meego onto Android phone Sep 26 12:05:34 s Sep 26 12:11:41 I think some software did broke my touch screen.. I installed psfreedom from extras-devel (it has some depencies can't remember what qt4 atleast), booted, crashed, booted, crashed, flashed it, and now touch screen isnt working anymore Sep 26 12:14:01 Dossis: there is a limit to how much abuse anything will take, but i suggest you take the battery out and leave it overnight and reflash it tomorrow Sep 26 12:15:03 http://doc.trolltech.com/4.6/moc.html Sep 26 12:15:16 * RST38h especially loves the "Limitations" section :) Sep 26 12:19:19 RST38h, i got arch on laptop now, it's weird after gentoo =( Sep 26 12:19:45 RST38h: speccy the game emulator? Sep 26 12:19:50 * sivang back from lunch Sep 26 12:20:16 RST38h: I had to have sex with my 9.0 to make it love the wifi card in my crappy LG T308 Sep 26 12:20:20 RST38h: T380 Sep 26 12:20:31 sivang system info app? Sep 26 12:20:41 sivang, atheros? Sep 26 12:20:46 * ZogG xmms2> Venetian Snares - Posers And Camera Phones ["My So-Called Life" 2010 Timesig] Sep 26 12:22:23 ZogG: I generally just want the system to work. Used FreeBSD for years, for exactly this reason. Sep 26 12:23:11 ZogG: So, most Linuxes do not satisfy my main requirement Sep 26 12:23:22 ZogG: I don't recall the chip, it is not Atheros I think I haad to fight with a very bad driver instructions building and inserrting to kernel from teh vendor site Sep 26 12:23:35 ZogG: and I failed to reproduce the successful setup to the upgraded kernels afterwqrds. Sep 26 12:23:42 ZogG: 10.04 is too buggy for me, though Sep 26 12:23:49 RST38h you have to config it once and than it works exactly the way you want Sep 26 12:24:01 ZogG: No, not really Sep 26 12:24:19 ZogG: In practice, most Linuxes did not even boot on my laptops, for years Sep 26 12:24:33 RST38h ? Sep 26 12:24:51 RST38h something special in hardware? Sep 26 12:25:00 ZogG: If they did, they missed many devices and had weird dependencies (like needing kernel sources for HelloWorld to work) Sep 26 12:25:30 ZogG: No, just the OS being written by homebrewers for homebrewers Sep 26 12:25:46 ZogG: FreeBSD worked on the same hardware Sep 26 12:26:02 what year was it? Sep 26 12:26:26 1994-current Sep 26 12:27:18 So, great kudos to Ubuntu people for taking a toy and making it generally usable Sep 26 12:27:36 RST38h++ Sep 26 12:28:27 I hear that driver is included in the LTS, but can't upgrade straight to ti since i Have 9.04 on the lappie right now and cross version upgrades have well, made me reinstall anyway so that is what I'll probably do. Sep 26 12:30:20 ok, so n810 now boots (after charging for a bit longer, although it was on charge all night), but keeps just turning off, and battery-status says charging when it's not, and when it is Sep 26 12:32:31 ZogG: atheros normally provide fairly documented drivers, till date I don't recall how I made mine work in 9.04 following random guesses at build attempts of the vendor provided drivers Sep 26 12:33:08 * sivang relogins for SDK group addup Sep 26 12:35:51 sivang where did you get n900? Sep 26 12:36:32 sivang, it's windows way // I hear that driver is included in the LTS, but can't upgrade straight to ti since i Have 9.04 on the lappie right now and cross version upgrades have well, made me reinstall anyway so that is what I'll probably do. Sep 26 12:36:50 sivang atheros had no linux support Sep 26 12:37:08 till 2.26.28 i think Sep 26 12:37:22 there was madwifi drivers Sep 26 12:37:26 but they were buggy Sep 26 12:37:49 ? Sep 26 12:37:57 and than one of the guys who developed it for atheros got job from atheros to support driver if i recall it right Sep 26 12:40:11 yes after a bit of dispute over licensing of ath5k Luis got hired by atheros Sep 26 12:42:19 Ruh roh, /opt is filling up quickly. Sep 26 12:42:19 psycho_oreos wasn't it before ath5k module Sep 26 12:42:29 or it was called that since madwifi? Sep 26 12:43:36 h4waii sudo rm -R /opt/* // i hope you understand it's joke =) Sep 26 12:43:46 :P Sep 26 12:44:05 Time to start purging packages. Sep 26 12:45:01 ZogG, madwifi was the original driver that included proprietary HAL from atheros but ar5k (iirc) from freebsd was HAL-independent however I think ar5k had portions of the ath5k driver (which was initially to be linux's first HAL-independent driver) codes which lead to a dispute over licensing Sep 26 12:46:35 щр Sep 26 12:46:46 oh Sep 26 12:47:00 anyway madwifi was buggy, especially with my card Sep 26 12:47:13 its a long and complicated thing, its also well documented on the mailing list somewhere Sep 26 12:47:17 ath5k is better but still not that good Sep 26 12:47:53 ath5k was really buggy initially but is now the future for atheros non-802.11n capable (and also not USB variants) chipsets Sep 26 12:47:57 my card didn't support half things and sometimes after 30min - 1hour use just stop working - need to reboot Sep 26 12:48:12 psycho_oreos there is ath9k Sep 26 12:48:57 ZogG, ath9k is where Luis was hired by atheros to make their atheros 802.11n chipsets natively supported under linux Sep 26 12:49:49 ZogG, old news.. then there's ath6k, ath9k_htc, otus (superceded by ar9170 and supposedly a better variant carl9170 floating around).. and then there's that dormant ar5570 (I think) Sep 26 12:51:13 WOW Sep 26 12:51:17 that's drastic Sep 26 12:51:19 http://www.zdnet.com/blog/hardware/nokia-using-android-like-peeing-in-your-pants-for-warmth-in-winter/9772 Sep 26 12:53:00 you found it just now? a miracle! Sep 26 13:23:28 ZogG: had no issues with ar on the desktop or in the Compaq Mini 310c Sep 26 13:23:34 ZogG: worked out of the box Sep 26 13:23:39 ZogG: 9.04 Sep 26 13:25:12 sivang depends on chip Sep 26 13:25:32 as well mine is old and i had problems back when module wasn't in kernel, not it's in there Sep 26 13:25:39 not=now Sep 26 13:25:43 ZogG: ah okay, I will check the chip and report back Sep 26 13:25:45 afternoon chaps Sep 26 13:25:57 afternoon lardman Sep 26 13:26:11 lardman: How's the weather in your part of england? Sep 26 13:26:29 LOL. Sygic Mobile Maps 10 tries to remove MyDocs and /home/user Sep 26 13:26:37 What a screw up they've become. Sep 26 13:26:39 alright, bit grey but some sun coming through Sep 26 13:26:54 lardman: could photo scanning be used to read a fairly large encryption key? where are the upper bounds on n900? Sep 26 13:26:58 ZogG: I never believed randomly hitting a module rebulding over and over would make it actually work, but it did Sep 26 13:27:06 Am finally getting round to setting up my dev box and cursing the wonders of VDSO Sep 26 13:27:15 heheh Sep 26 13:27:17 lardman: ah, sorted :) Sep 26 13:27:22 pupnik_, what are you thinking in terms of bytes? Sep 26 13:27:32 lardman: I wish it was a bit grey and less hot here, some rain would be appreciated Sep 26 13:27:46 sivang: where are you? Sep 26 13:27:59 lardman: mid-dole east :) Sep 26 13:28:07 ah, warm no doubt :) Sep 26 13:28:16 warm, is , put nicely Sep 26 13:28:17 ;) Sep 26 13:28:23 It's colder here today - 10C, has been warm, grey and wet, not ideal Sep 26 13:28:34 31C right now Sep 26 13:28:44 I'd swap for some sunshine! :) Sep 26 13:28:52 lardman: you're invited Sep 26 13:28:56 lardman he is from country of Palestine :) Sep 26 13:28:56 :) Sep 26 13:29:07 sivang what city are you from btw Sep 26 13:29:07 heh Sep 26 13:29:16 ZogG: Tel Aviv Sep 26 13:29:19 it would have to be a strong key, costing days of effort Sep 26 13:29:35 sivang ha, i just moved to ramat-gan from there Sep 26 13:29:46 So anyone tried to setup SB on Ubuntu Lucid Lynx 64bit? (choosing all the worst options - kernel doesn't allow VDSO to be disabled, 64bit-ness, etc.) Sep 26 13:29:50 pupnik_: trying to make key imports through the camera? Sep 26 13:29:57 yeah why not Sep 26 13:30:05 how long pupnik_ ? Sep 26 13:30:14 512? Sep 26 13:30:29 bits Sep 26 13:30:33 lardman what is SB? Sep 26 13:30:43 scratchbox Sep 26 13:30:52 I think I am using 32bit ubuntu on 64bit hardware Sep 26 13:31:07 pupnik_: 64 bytes, yeah no worries Sep 26 13:31:20 pupnik_: could be nice, so for example in keysining parties you just scan the other parties paper or business card Sep 26 13:31:38 you need to choose a uri for the key Sep 26 13:31:48 so it would go key://nsdjkghasebjkfhasldh Sep 26 13:31:49 etc Sep 26 13:31:49 heya lardman, pupnik Sep 26 13:31:53 hi RST38h Sep 26 13:31:56 lardman: ah right Sep 26 13:32:07 sivang it's not that important Sep 26 13:32:10 ZogG: I am actuall yin the part close to Givataim Sep 26 13:32:16 sivang: need some way to know what the payload of the barcode is Sep 26 13:32:27 though now all apps are moved to 64 support you can go for 64 Sep 26 13:32:40 sivang yad eliyahu? Sep 26 13:32:41 ZogG: a bit weary, from past experience :) Sep 26 13:32:50 ZogG: sort of, yes Sep 26 13:32:57 sivang i use 64bit gentoo =) Sep 26 13:33:11 as there is huge difference on compiling and video encoding Sep 26 13:33:11 oh, that makes a bit of a difference Sep 26 13:33:58 we're getting terribly off topic, is that allowed here? :) Sep 26 13:34:07 ZogG: whehere in ramat gan? Sep 26 13:34:21 yes, till DocScrutinizer is asleep, he is banning everyone here =) Sep 26 13:34:30 had to get a cached copy of the aformentioned http://webcache.googleusercontent.com/search?q=cache:http://www.zdnet.com/blog/hardware/nokia-using-android-like-peeing-in-your-pants-for-warmth-in-winter/9772 Sep 26 13:34:39 sivang herzl near jabotinski Sep 26 13:35:10 * DocScrutinizer51 bans ZogG Sep 26 13:35:14 sivang there is topic on tmo and this is also on engadget i think Sep 26 13:35:19 DocScrutinizer51 =* Sep 26 13:35:39 * ZogG stands on knees and prays to DocScrutinizer Sep 26 13:35:44 heh Sep 26 13:35:48 glorry to the DocScrutinizer Sep 26 13:35:50 at least it is sunday Sep 26 13:35:56 all glory* Sep 26 13:36:03 DocScrutinizer: we hail thee Sep 26 13:36:05 errrrr. k Sep 26 13:37:09 so the article suggests ditching meego/maemo and profit? Sep 26 13:37:25 i dunno Sep 26 13:37:33 sivang: OT isn't OT until somebody shouts "OT" :-D Sep 26 13:37:37 but i think it's just adv Nokia is trying to do Sep 26 13:37:46 DocScrutinizer51: agreed and accounted for! Sep 26 13:38:11 as well i would laugh at meego that they copying android UI if i was google =)_ Sep 26 13:38:14 * sivang always thought the pee gets cold quickly and then makes it worse than before peeing Sep 26 13:38:27 sivang it's true Sep 26 13:38:44 so in a place like Finland, that's even worse Sep 26 13:38:51 (-20 at some of the places?) Sep 26 13:38:57 anyway, enough trash Sep 26 13:38:59 but i liked to pee in winter at snow when i took long bus rides back i was living in russia Sep 26 13:39:18 in soviet russia you do not pee your pants, your pants pees you Sep 26 13:39:43 ZogG: is this applicable in international channels? I only saw it on Hebrew feeds in Hebrew ofcourse :) Sep 26 13:39:59 * sivang is a bit embarrased to have this slip the local facebooksphere, yuck! Sep 26 13:40:21 sivang it's actually internet meme and it get there from interwebz like everything else Sep 26 13:40:32 ZogG: I see, well then. Sep 26 13:40:39 * sivang is back to feeing space on the device without gfind Sep 26 13:40:48 "USB hostmode prealpha" thread overrun by lemmings, ignoring. Sep 26 13:40:56 and don't say jews invented Chuck to make facts about him Sep 26 13:40:56 hehe Sep 26 13:41:35 * sivang thinks the soviet russia paradigm could actually be implemeted using vtables! Sep 26 13:41:42 now that I think of it Sep 26 13:41:59 RST38h, lemming* Sep 26 13:42:07 RST38h people on TMO often are getting out of topic and making stupid post of nothing, like apps i want to see and i hate/love n900 =( Sep 26 13:42:16 MohammadAG good day pal Sep 26 13:42:22 ZogG: No, not these people Sep 26 13:42:26 yo MohammadAG Sep 26 13:42:36 RST38h still -- RAGE!!! Sep 26 13:42:42 ZogG: The "it does not work for me, what it is supposed to do anyway?" people Sep 26 13:42:44 mmmmm, data.... :) Sep 26 13:42:56 heya ZogG Sep 26 13:43:01 and sivang :) Sep 26 13:43:08 MohammadAG next time you are doing any kind of terror bombimg, try not to kill sivang Sep 26 13:43:18 MohammadAG: I was just telling lardman we'd love some rain :-) Sep 26 13:43:22 i just got it - your name is Sivan =)) Sep 26 13:43:34 ZogG: sharp, aren't you? Sep 26 13:43:35 ;) Sep 26 13:43:42 pupnik: did you see my response - yes would be quite easy to encode in a QR code, if you want it to be handled automatically then choose a uri, otherwise you could just copy and paste from mBarcode Sep 26 13:43:49 i hope you are girl =) Sep 26 13:44:00 hrm, not. Sep 26 13:44:00 ZogG: Is there any special reason why he should be spared? Sep 26 13:44:01 in israel it's hard to know the gender by name Sep 26 13:44:15 sivang, damn it, i already wanted to ask you out Sep 26 13:44:24 lardman: BTW, I have got a bug report Sep 26 13:44:32 RST38h: fire away Sep 26 13:45:03 though as I'm currently installing sb, it may take a while for me to be able to do anything about it ;) Sep 26 13:45:06 lardman: 1) it is not clear when the Barcode app actually makes a shot. More than once I feverishly clicked the shutter button Sep 26 13:45:15 RST38h read the log, i though he is a chick =) Sep 26 13:45:26 ZogG: what are chances an Israeli girl called Sivan would be into N900/Maemo/MeeGo hacking ? Sep 26 13:45:28 * MohammadAG strangles ZogG Sep 26 13:45:30 lardman: 2) Once you click on one of the plugins, the application seemingly hangs Sep 26 13:45:35 ZogG: Finnish girl named Henna, maybe Sep 26 13:45:44 MohammadAG: thanks Sep 26 13:45:45 lardman: So I hoped you would show a busy cursor or something Sep 26 13:45:47 RST38h: yeah I'm going to change the code and give the user the option to only perform scanning when the shutter button has been pressed Sep 26 13:45:58 sivang haha, you know i hitted on one girl cause she had n900, even had a date Sep 26 13:46:09 lardman: #2 is actually more of a problem than #1 Sep 26 13:46:10 RST38h: 2) ok, good idea Sep 26 13:46:32 RST38h: could you add that to the TMO thread? I know it's a pain having to go to tmo ;) Sep 26 13:46:40 RST38h just rename the plugin button into pasue button Sep 26 13:46:45 solved Sep 26 13:46:49 lardman: if you give me the thread URL :) Sep 26 13:46:50 ZogG: she did? odd, everyone here has either N97 the most but otherwise they carry iphones. Sep 26 13:47:04 thanks lardman - funness! Sep 26 13:47:04 ZogG: But this is sexist! Sep 26 13:47:09 RST38h: search for mbarcode, only thread with that title and 10k posts :p Sep 26 13:47:10 sivang, yeah it was wierd Sep 26 13:47:12 ok Sep 26 13:47:21 * sivang tries to spot the lemmings Sep 26 13:47:25 RST38h i'm guy, i don't care about this things Sep 26 13:47:38 spot=shot Sep 26 13:47:42 fixed you Sep 26 13:47:45 pupnik: if you come up with something you want to do with the key, then post in the same TMO thread and I'll have a look at writing a plugin for you Sep 26 13:48:29 bbiab, waiting for the sb downloads to finish and installation script to fail Sep 26 13:48:46 MohammadAG i'm thinking to buy backbeat 903/906 Sep 26 13:48:57 lardman: happened to me already couple of times that last weeks, but today it finally finsihed and succeded. Sep 26 13:49:54 I'm back, can write some python Amazon scraping code for my book db app Sep 26 13:50:01 lardman: You may want to add "default plugin" Sep 26 13:50:25 lardman: Or automatically choose based on the barcode contents (i.e. URL = go to URL for example) Sep 26 13:50:41 that is already done Sep 26 13:50:52 lardman: Yes, I would add basic recognition of a few common data item formats (ISBNs, URLs, etc) and do default actions for them Sep 26 13:50:58 eadch plugin is allowed to see the data and if it thinks it can handle it, it is given a button Sep 26 13:51:07 skip the buttons Sep 26 13:51:31 that is the extra stage that slows things down. if you are absolutely SURE you know what it is, do the default action Sep 26 13:51:40 the idea was to allow people to choose which plugin - I know what you mean though Sep 26 13:52:03 mbarcode is python? nice Sep 26 13:52:04 yeah, if only one plugin shows any interest it could skip the button and just go to the plugin, agreed Sep 26 13:52:07 no Sep 26 13:52:20 mBarcode is C/C++ Sep 26 13:52:24 qt? Sep 26 13:52:31 actually, I should check in sb Sep 26 13:52:37 lardman: never mind the oise Sep 26 13:52:43 I got pythonQT compiling but didn't have a chance to push it to extras-devel and integrate it Sep 26 13:52:51 yeah is Qt Sep 26 13:53:19 I had planned to allow both C++ and Python plugins, but not got round to the pythonQT part yet Sep 26 13:53:40 how do I connect a damn button with a dialog in Qt Designer? Sep 26 13:53:44 in the meantime it's possible to register a DBus plugin which will start/raise your app and send it the data, which allows Qt, or anything else Sep 26 13:53:47 god python is so much easier than C++/Qt Sep 26 13:53:57 sure is Sep 26 13:53:58 and a bit more retarded Sep 26 13:54:55 lardman: there's PySide, if you test it the team will appreciate bug reports. Sep 26 13:55:04 wrong way though Sep 26 13:55:13 I need to integrate Python scripting in a C++ app Sep 26 13:55:22 ah Sep 26 13:55:30 so pythonQt is the way to go (that's not the same as PyQt) Sep 26 13:56:35 ah, I was sure that was a type :) Sep 26 13:56:47 lardman: the default action thing can always be made an option though :) Sep 26 13:57:04 oh, lardman, please, AVOID using python in mbarcode, please Sep 26 13:57:05 =) Sep 26 13:57:15 Re Python, it will be optional Sep 26 13:57:47 i.e. I may create a plugin which will handle all python plugins, that way the PythonQt stuff is separated from the main code, no unneeded deps, etc Sep 26 13:58:22 we need a dialog to allow users to select plugins, disable them, etc., so adding a "use this by default" flag is certainly doable Sep 26 13:59:01 otoh, it's still quite nice to see what's in the barcode before you decide to open/handle it Sep 26 13:59:17 I guess that if it's on the back of a book or dvd this is not so important Sep 26 14:01:23 the user can apply "trust" to it if it comes from there I guess. Sep 26 14:01:44 well they know what they're getting with a 1D code on a book Sep 26 14:01:54 not so much with a 2D code on a webpage or in a magazine Sep 26 14:02:13 has anyone seen the geo:// uri in the wild? Sep 26 14:02:48 or even geo: Sep 26 14:03:01 lardman: I do think using all installed plugins is ok Sep 26 14:03:09 lardman: Don't want it -> uninstall it Sep 26 14:03:29 yeah Sep 26 14:03:37 it'll do for now anyway Sep 26 14:03:58 drgaly's done good work on the interface, looks nice and slick now Sep 26 14:04:14 dragly that should be of course, can't type Sep 26 14:07:06 lardman: PythonQt wraps around Python interpreter C object into Qt? Sep 26 14:07:25 hmm, my N900 really needs a TweakUI style app to alter the transition delays rather than fiddling with an .ini file Sep 26 14:08:02 transitioncontrol - written by konttori Sep 26 14:08:06 in -devel Sep 26 14:08:17 I thought it was gone now Sep 26 14:08:22 morning \o Sep 26 14:08:23 I'll look Sep 26 14:08:26 hi lcuk Sep 26 14:09:11 lardman, so you have c++ plugins! or are they c clugins? Sep 26 14:09:44 c++ Sep 26 14:10:01 (i noticed c++ does not expose symbols to be available to apps without the extern "C"{..} bit Sep 26 14:10:19 not exactly Sep 26 14:10:29 C++ exposes symbols just fine but it mangles them Sep 26 14:10:32 ok then, it exposes them but munged Sep 26 14:10:40 extern "C" keeps them intact Sep 26 14:13:17 ~curse HAM for being sooooo slllloooooowwwww Sep 26 14:13:18 May you be reincarnated as a Windows XP administrator, HAM for being sooooo slllloooooowwwww ! Sep 26 14:13:56 it also won't allow you to uninstall crap once it installed too much of it :) Sep 26 14:14:02 s/it/I/ Sep 26 14:14:03 sivang meant: I also won't allow you to uninstall crap once it installed too much of it :) Sep 26 14:15:30 how can I add my deb line to source.list from the command line? Sep 26 14:15:33 not using vi Sep 26 14:15:48 maybe using echo and >>? ;) Sep 26 14:15:50 some way of echoing a cr then the line itself? Sep 26 14:15:51 lardman: echo "..." >> sources.list? Sep 26 14:16:00 will that add a new line too? Sep 26 14:16:02 lardman: you don't need a cr Sep 26 14:16:08 lardman: yes Sep 26 14:16:12 cool Sep 26 14:16:18 thanks chaps Sep 26 14:16:30 lardman: thank you for making mbarcode :) Sep 26 14:16:39 np Sep 26 14:16:48 thank dragly for making it look nice Sep 26 14:18:34 crap, this is BusyBoxe's DU! Sep 26 14:18:38 * sivang hits busybox Sep 26 14:19:45 m Sep 26 14:20:03 lcuk: cool found transitioncontrol, now I just need to work out what each setting does! :) Sep 26 14:27:15 damn! GStreamer's flacparse was horrible, after fixing it now flac decoding is 3x faster Sep 26 14:27:50 what was the problem with it? Sep 26 14:28:01 nice felipec! Sep 26 14:28:36 lardman: everything Sep 26 14:28:42 :) Sep 26 14:28:48 h4waii, roger :) Sep 26 14:29:22 lardman: ever heard of echo -e ? Sep 26 14:29:27 it was parsing the whole data, and using GStreamer's bytereader, which is horrible Sep 26 14:29:36 ow. Sep 26 14:29:37 lardman, quite frankly, you'll find editing the file easier Sep 26 14:29:49 transitioncontrol is not well detailed Sep 26 14:30:22 so horrible that it was taking for parsing twice the mount of CPU that FFmpeg takes for decoding Sep 26 14:30:34 ooh editing :-D sed ftw Sep 26 14:30:43 DocScrutinizer: nope Sep 26 14:31:08 MohammadAG: fair enough - I've removed the transitions now, but it still seems to pause, just wondering if that's an enforced pause Sep 26 14:32:36 hildon-desktop's source code would be easier to look at :P Sep 26 14:33:50 * sivang wonders how many of Maemo's compoenent and architecture will be in MeeGo Sep 26 14:34:01 seems none Sep 26 14:34:12 it seems easier to look at the maemo architecture diagram then MeeGo's, it is much more detailed Sep 26 14:34:16 DocScrutinizer: seriously? Sep 26 14:34:30 DocScrutinizer: so fro example, a new email client will be created? Sep 26 14:34:35 either they're not maemo but general linux, or they're not going to meego Sep 26 14:34:53 but lots of maemo is genral linux Sep 26 14:34:59 gconf, modest, farsight2 et Sep 26 14:35:20 well, dunno about modest, but for sure none of the closed apps will go to meego Sep 26 14:35:41 right, I guess that's a good thing. Sep 26 14:36:49 modulo nokia's special proprietary flavour of meego. They're free to sell whatever future meego device with same butload of proprietary stuff they did on maemo Sep 26 14:36:54 finally, I'm back in business, sb working, etc Sep 26 14:38:13 and honestly I have no idea how comprehensive the core meego set of apps will be Sep 26 14:38:44 lardman: and just in time to try out http://repo.meego.com/MeeGo/builds/trunk/1.0.90.4.20100924.1/handset/images/meego-handset-armv7l-n900/ Sep 26 14:39:00 or importantly whether they will be well designed for the different screen sizes and other constraints Sep 26 14:39:13 Stskeeps: yay! Sep 26 14:39:27 Stskeeps: still need to install a chroot and the image build tools mind you Sep 26 14:39:57 oh that's flashable, cool Sep 26 14:40:30 sivang: maybe ask Stskeeps - he should know much better Sep 26 14:40:46 Stskeeps: call audio works? Sep 26 14:40:59 DocScrutinizer: yes, he seems to eb knowledgeable Sep 26 14:41:01 ;) Sep 26 14:41:03 * lardman searches for a spare uSD card Sep 26 14:42:27 sivang: yes Sep 26 14:42:36 lardman: dd'able, rather Sep 26 14:42:36 nice Sep 26 14:43:26 meego useable yet? Sep 26 14:43:59 Stskeeps: wow, so it is now in trunk of meego-arm? Sep 26 14:44:01 Stskeeps: could you explain in telegram style how dual booting to meego works? (like "NOLO->maemokernel->chroot->...") Sep 26 14:44:07 this is NICE Sep 26 14:44:45 DocScrutinizer: flasher -l -k vmlinuz -b Sep 26 14:44:48 DocScrutinizer: there's the boot off uSD with a pc host way no? Sep 26 14:44:52 DocScrutinizer: ie, cheating Sep 26 14:45:02 DocScrutinizer: uboot is next step Sep 26 14:45:15 yes, and ubifs support is needed Sep 26 14:45:19 * sivang recites well Sep 26 14:45:27 Stskeeps: you are a good teacher :) Sep 26 14:45:41 Stskeeps: is this loading a new kernel to memory on runtime during "boot" of meego from maemo? Sep 26 14:46:19 can you do that with the on-device flasher? Sep 26 14:46:30 DocScrutinizer: loads it on boot over usb Sep 26 14:46:31 presumably not now I think about it Sep 26 14:46:46 ooh, so you need a 'started host' Sep 26 14:46:48 DocScrutinizer: thus requireing a PC host Sep 26 14:46:57 s/rted/rter/ Sep 26 14:46:58 DocScrutinizer meant: ooh, so you need a 'starter host' Sep 26 14:47:18 DocScrutinizer: right, we are going to use uboot too for 'real' multiboot Sep 26 14:47:31 but this way is nicely non-destructive Sep 26 14:47:32 cool, looking forward to that Sep 26 14:48:12 hmm, does flasher work on 64bit Linux? Sep 26 14:48:25 lardman, yes Sep 26 14:48:36 couldn't you shoot the new kernel to ram memory the dirty hard way, from maemo userland? Sep 26 14:48:42 but is just unhappy to be installed from deb I guess Sep 26 14:48:45 awee Sep 26 14:49:17 notification-daemon has got to have something in place for filtering repeated messages in shrot period of time Sep 26 14:49:24 lardman, yeah, you need to --force-architecture Sep 26 14:49:31 ah ok Sep 26 14:49:32 thanks Sep 26 14:49:34 trying to edit the usb netowrking settings while getting those now annoying popups is not cool Sep 26 14:49:37 * DocScrutinizer seems to remember there's been a loadlinux.exe in the old days... Sep 26 14:49:38 DocScrutinizer: kexec and arm drivers arent friends Sep 26 14:49:44 rsyslog has it, so can notif-daemon? Sep 26 14:49:52 Stskeeps: not kexec Sep 26 14:49:59 DocScrutinizer: how then? Sep 26 14:50:00 really brute force Sep 26 14:50:18 DocScrutinizer: forcefully copying to memory and JUMPing? Sep 26 14:50:29 write to memory absolute address, the jump to start of that program text Sep 26 14:50:40 sivang: exactly Sep 26 14:50:47 DocScrutinizer: thats fairly like kexec Sep 26 14:50:58 * MNZ imagines all the chaos that would create Sep 26 14:51:04 wouldn't the device drivers go crazy? Sep 26 14:51:24 MNZ: they won't "exist" anymore, per se Sep 26 14:51:35 MNZ: in host system it simply would kill everything. Luckily you're never returning to host system Sep 26 14:51:44 reentry is the issue Sep 26 14:52:14 the newly loaded device drivers I mean. The hw would be in a certain state and maybe the driver can't handle being loaded on already working/set-up hardware Sep 26 14:52:30 kill scheduling all together, disable all timer IRQs Sep 26 14:53:10 MNZ: right, so some resetting prior to the copying and JUMPing would be needed. Sep 26 14:53:32 'some' is an understatement sivang :D Sep 26 14:53:32 DocScrutinizer: killing scheduling would mean everything else dies? Sep 26 14:53:34 Stskeeps: then there'll be no reentry. the copy loop moving 4MB to a ram location, then next assembler opcode is a JMP 0 Sep 26 14:53:37 MNZ: ;) Sep 26 14:54:10 sivang: whole system dies as soon as JMP start-of-new-kernel Sep 26 14:54:37 DocScrutinizer: okay, but what if hardware still in waiting/up mode? Sep 26 14:54:53 the hw should be initialised by the new drivers Sep 26 14:55:07 ah right, a driver should not assume anything of a previous state. Sep 26 14:55:11 -solved Sep 26 14:55:17 you'll have a warm boot Sep 26 14:55:28 MNZ: (kernel can't handle...) nope, kernel mustn't make any assumptions about state of hw, usually. NOLO also is messing with hw Sep 26 14:55:31 but it might still be prettier to shut stuff down, to prevent odd screen and sound effects Sep 26 14:55:46 Can I just mkfs.ext3 on /home/user/MyDocs, or there's something else that would need to be fixed? Sep 26 14:56:13 Er Sep 26 14:56:20 Why would you do that? Sep 26 14:56:39 why not? I'm a 100% Linux user, no need to limit myself to vfat Sep 26 14:57:05 Journaling it will slow it down. Dramatically. Sep 26 14:57:05 can i install meego without an sdcard natively on the n900 already? Sep 26 14:57:14 You'll bring a new limit. Sep 26 14:57:30 steinex: you don't really want to, will wipe your emmc Sep 26 14:57:41 and you'll have to ask somebody how it will react, not being vFat Sep 26 14:57:45 lardman: you can do as much of suspending or switching-off to the hw as you like, in meegostart-brute-force maemo ELF, prior to 'loading' the new kernel Sep 26 14:57:55 yep Sep 26 14:57:57 daleglass: you don't want to it be accessible from Windows? Sep 26 14:58:00 Stskeeps: why is that a bad thing? Sep 26 14:58:18 i have no critical data on here anyway Sep 26 14:58:45 steinex: most people have a lot of data in those 32gb.. besides that, there's no easy way to make own mmc image Sep 26 14:58:51 sivang: never use it, and I generally upload stuff through ssh anyway Sep 26 14:58:54 ie, flashable by softupd Sep 26 14:59:25 Stskeeps: wait a sec, so waht do you do if you bricked and need to recover? :) Sep 26 14:59:36 ah no easy, so there is a way :) Sep 26 14:59:41 Write it directly. Sep 26 15:00:12 Stskeeps: (no easy way) but it's easy to change partition sizes, and maybe also rather easy to add new partitions Sep 26 15:00:28 for a VANILLA file Sep 26 15:00:48 NEW-HOME-SIZE=4096 Sep 26 15:00:50 sed -e "s/2048/$NEW-HOME-SIZE/" path/to/*VANILLA*.bin >patched-VANILLA.bin Sep 26 15:00:57 http://wiki.maemo.org/User:Joerg_rw/tools Sep 26 15:06:01 the other issue is that emmc flashing (softupd) is closed source Sep 26 15:07:08 * DocScrutinizer51 wonders if flasher-3.5 --local can already do all this maemostart-brute-force kernel loading to ram, from maemo Sep 26 15:08:04 Stskeeps: but freely available? Sep 26 15:08:05 * lardman twiddles thumbs waiting for dd to finish Sep 26 15:19:37 * lardman twiddles thumbs waiting for 32bit libs to install so he can use the flasher Sep 26 15:20:57 * h4waii jumps on the table Sep 26 15:21:17 flashed, time to see the wonders of Meego first hand :) Sep 26 15:21:41 did they move past the "show an xterm" stage? Sep 26 15:22:06 I have a cursor Sep 26 15:22:07 i thought they had the handset UI already there Sep 26 15:22:26 they do, yes Sep 26 15:23:07 hmm, needs something so you know it's still alive, rather than 30s+ of black screen during boot Sep 26 15:23:43 it needs a lot of things Sep 26 15:24:05 sure, just thinking out loud Sep 26 15:25:39 Hmm, /home is rewritten when the EMMC image is flashed, right? Sep 26 15:25:40 usb networking deos not seem to love me Sep 26 15:26:26 set up everything as in the doc, still not go Sep 26 15:26:28 modules ar eup Sep 26 15:26:30 up Sep 26 15:26:43 both in ubuntu and Maemo, any obvious stuff to check as starters? Sep 26 15:27:53 cdc-eem Sep 26 15:28:00 and 10.04 needed Sep 26 15:29:17 sivang: pastebin what you did and the errors Sep 26 15:30:30 sivang: specifically pastebin /etc/resolv.conf and /etc/network/interfaces from both the n900 and the computer Sep 26 15:42:58 jpinx-eeepc: sure, I did not do much, enabled the modules, set ips, route add gw and ping Sep 26 15:43:03 * sivang pastes Sep 26 15:49:26 * sivang hates playing with default routes Sep 26 15:50:20 jpinx-eeepc: http://paste.pocoo.org/show/267597/ Sep 26 15:51:50 kthomas_vh_: another fellow N90 user from .il ? Sep 26 15:51:57 *N900 Sep 26 15:52:24 sivang, well hello Sep 26 15:52:33 sivang, you're from IL? Sep 26 15:52:38 must've missed that somewhere Sep 26 15:52:55 MohammadAG: I am, told you a couple of times when we ranted about how poor Orange's service is in here :) Sep 26 15:53:25 kthomas_vh_: have you like MohammadAG sinned with development as well? :) Sep 26 15:54:12 MohammadAG: when you had issues and had to use near 56k connection , rmember?:) Sep 26 15:54:30 jpinx-eeepc: anything wrong with the network conffile? Sep 26 15:54:34 LOL Sep 26 15:54:41 with all this cloaking going on, Sep 26 15:54:50 can't even tell where anyone is from anymore :P Sep 26 15:54:54 sivang: not sure about having gateways in both directions... Sep 26 15:54:54 * kthomas_vh_ cues song Sep 26 15:55:18 sivang, ah, when I was in jordan lol Sep 26 15:56:21 MohammadAG: ah, okay heh Sep 26 15:56:39 MohammadAG: service is quite poor in .il as well, but at least UMTS works for most of the parts Sep 26 15:56:59 MohammadAG: service= service representative, consistent billing etc Sep 26 15:57:10 3G sucks Sep 26 15:57:23 in Jordan I got 7.2MBps speeds on 3G Sep 26 15:57:30 i.e + 1MB/s Sep 26 15:57:33 * sivang drove last night from Haifa to Tel Aviv listening to The Voice Sep 26 15:57:39 MohammadAG: you can't get this here. Sep 26 15:57:53 MohammadAG: technically advance, practically crippled :-p Sep 26 15:58:44 * RST38h is mostly pissed off at hand-off problems between 2G and 3G Sep 26 15:58:58 They are bad enough to make me force N900 into 2G Sep 26 15:59:17 * kthomas_vh_ looks around for the Orange 3G dongle Sep 26 15:59:53 kthomas_vh_: I don't think it gets you more then 2.8mbps Sep 26 16:00:08 RST38h: you mean switching? Sep 26 16:00:37 sivang: autoswitching between 2g and 3g, as I am riding a bus or something Sep 26 16:00:50 sivang, and lucky at that Sep 26 16:00:51 confuses the hell out of the device Sep 26 16:01:02 we've also lost the darn thing (not me...!) Sep 26 16:02:15 you can get 8 from the one sold in JO Sep 26 16:02:26 and JO isn't really more advanced than IL, so I'm a bit stumped Sep 26 16:02:54 wait you sold drugs in JO? Sep 26 16:03:04 LOL Sep 26 16:03:40 ~rape ZogG Sep 26 16:03:41 * infobot takes ZogG behind the WallMart and makes a few grunts and screams Sep 26 16:04:45 MohammadAG: .il is randomly adanced Sep 26 16:04:50 oh yeah Sep 26 16:04:55 one more time please Sep 26 16:05:01 RST38h: you also need to use orange.il? Sep 26 16:05:10 ZogG: dude, you're disturbed Sep 26 16:05:14 fortunately, no Sep 26 16:05:16 RST38h, doesn't live in IL Sep 26 16:05:26 RST38h: close? Sep 26 16:05:32 not even remotely Sep 26 16:05:35 sivang: .RU Sep 26 16:05:42 Mohammad: well we are in the same time zone Sep 26 16:05:46 e.g advanced in odd and very domain difference things Sep 26 16:05:59 tried of this latency Sep 26 16:06:02 short flight if you're in the same time zone Sep 26 16:06:10 * sivang logso out of his server and connects directly. Sep 26 16:06:13 hmm Sep 26 16:06:19 anyone in .IL want a N810? Sep 26 16:06:19 kthomas_vh_: you lost an N900? Sep 26 16:06:25 if you live at the exact north pole of the earth Sep 26 16:06:30 what time zone are you in? Sep 26 16:06:41 geographical, not magnetic north Sep 26 16:06:44 sivang, N, just a USB 3G dongle from Orange Sep 26 16:06:49 Mohammad: Determined by whoever owns the pole Sep 26 16:06:56 kthomas_vh_: eh, they charge an outrageous fee for it Sep 26 16:06:57 *N810W Sep 26 16:07:04 anyway, be right back Sep 26 16:07:08 kthomas_vh_ how much? Sep 26 16:07:10 sivang, we got it for free Sep 26 16:07:17 does it work? Sep 26 16:07:19 ZogG, Sep 26 16:07:22 works fine Sep 26 16:07:29 Mohammad: As nobody lives there on the permanent basis, you can as well claim that the pole has no time zone Sep 26 16:07:29 well taken care of Sep 26 16:07:31 how much? Sep 26 16:07:33 ah Sep 26 16:07:37 that's better. Sep 26 16:07:37 * kthomas_vh_ thinks Sep 26 16:07:43 799NIS? Sep 26 16:07:51 for N810? Sep 26 16:08:11 how much dollars is it? Sep 26 16:08:16 * kthomas_vh_ wonders if that should be more, or less Sep 26 16:08:26 ZogG, you're not in .il? Sep 26 16:08:34 i am in here Sep 26 16:08:38 ok, OK Sep 26 16:08:40 just want to compare to prices in net Sep 26 16:09:18 that's ~$217 today Sep 26 16:09:30 RST38h, lol Sep 26 16:10:01 sexy price Sep 26 16:10:11 where exactly in IL? Sep 26 16:10:21 close to tlv Sep 26 16:10:55 do you take payment in credit cards? :P Sep 26 16:10:55 in TLV Sep 26 16:10:56 jk Sep 26 16:11:34 how is it? Like new, used, abused, "you'll wish you didn't buy it"? Sep 26 16:11:48 MohammadAG: it's time for you to get an n810! Sep 26 16:11:53 MohammadAG, how many gold cards can you bring me? Sep 26 16:11:56 and, btw, moo. Sep 26 16:12:08 kthomas_vh_, visas, visa cals :P Sep 26 16:12:21 javispedro, that's why I'm asking about it :P Sep 26 16:12:28 it's used, very good condition Sep 26 16:12:45 +wimax Sep 26 16:12:51 ooh Sep 26 16:12:55 does IL even have wimax? lol Sep 26 16:13:11 it does and I even saw somone who had made it work Sep 26 16:13:13 hey javispedro Sep 26 16:13:28 but I didn't feel like Sep 26 16:13:31 afternoon RST38h Sep 26 16:13:33 losing that much time Sep 26 16:14:22 grr, if only I had a license or something Sep 26 16:14:35 I would've came to tel aviv, it's only half an hour away Sep 26 16:14:42 ? Sep 26 16:14:49 where are you? Sep 26 16:14:49 (speed limits would disagree but... meh) Sep 26 16:14:52 Jerusalem Sep 26 16:15:03 i thought you were in jordan? Sep 26 16:15:13 oh, I'll probably be over there friday Sep 26 16:15:15 * kthomas_vh_ too Sep 26 16:15:16 I was in jordan, summer holidays Sep 26 16:15:17 he's enjoying a bit colder weather then us Sep 26 16:15:25 kthomas_vh_: where in Tel Aviv? Sep 26 16:15:26 what are the speed limits in .il? Sep 26 16:15:30 80 Sep 26 16:15:31 kthomas_vh_: you visitng or here for work? Sep 26 16:15:34 mph? Sep 26 16:15:35 or 90 Sep 26 16:15:39 jacekowski: KMH Sep 26 16:15:39 kph Sep 26 16:15:44 on motorway? Sep 26 16:15:48 yes :) Sep 26 16:15:51 shit Sep 26 16:15:52 Florentine, Sep 26 16:15:52 sadly Sep 26 16:15:56 on the wide Ayalon you can drive almost 100 Sep 26 16:16:13 my dad drives @ 120-130 on the motorway though Sep 26 16:16:15 sivang, some of that... it was high holidays, after all Sep 26 16:16:20 in england it's ~115kmh Sep 26 16:16:22 kthomas_vh_: true Sep 26 16:16:24 and everybody does more Sep 26 16:16:27 kthomas_vh_: and you work in mobile area? Sep 26 16:16:30 between telaviv and jerusalem Sep 26 16:16:32 jacekowski: yes Sep 26 16:16:32 i'm ussualy closer to 160 Sep 26 16:16:41 jacekowski: Autoban? Sep 26 16:16:42 I don't even a damn license Sep 26 16:16:44 no Sep 26 16:16:46 motorway Sep 26 16:16:54 or A class road Sep 26 16:16:54 +have* Sep 26 16:17:06 MohammadAG: that's bad Sep 26 16:17:11 MohammadAG: you can start practicing no? Sep 26 16:17:20 MohammadAG: have you been in army? Sep 26 16:17:23 I turned 17 in august Sep 26 16:17:30 hmm, so next year Sep 26 16:17:31 jacekowski, no, hint's in the name :P Sep 26 16:17:41 nope, that's for israelis only afaik Sep 26 16:17:46 jacekowski: we have issue, don't ask :) Sep 26 16:17:47 sivang, primarily I make little tech parts of Drupal work, these days for $ Sep 26 16:18:46 or at least, for real $ Sep 26 16:18:47 kthomas_vh_: ah I see Sep 26 16:19:00 kthomas_vh_: where are you originally? Sep 26 16:19:34 grew up mostly in the US, mostly in Kentucky Sep 26 16:20:07 FileBox thread overrun by lemmings. Sep 26 16:20:13 if you keep this up I'll tell you about going to Rosh Hashana at Vanderbilt, and being served pork Sep 26 16:20:13 again? Sep 26 16:20:14 :) Sep 26 16:20:17 * RST38h wonders if it is time to unsubscribe Sep 26 16:20:27 kthomas_vh_: hehe Sep 26 16:20:36 kthomas_vh_: I don't do Pork. Sep 26 16:20:57 nothin' wrong with pork, as long as it is consumed under rabbinic supervision! Sep 26 16:21:13 RST38h: 27 pages for a file manager. it is definitely time to unsubscribe. Sep 26 16:21:14 haha Sep 26 16:21:24 after I dropped all the yiddish I know on the kid who organized, Sep 26 16:21:24 kthomas_vh_: where's Vanderbilt? Sep 26 16:21:39 javispedro: 80% of that is "It works for me, thanks" and "It doesn't work for me, why?" Sep 26 16:21:44 he told me the deli charged the same whether he took the pork or not :) Sep 26 16:21:52 oh dear Sep 26 16:21:54 =Nashville, TN Sep 26 16:22:44 TN= Tennessee :) Sep 26 16:22:46 RST38h: sigh Sep 26 16:23:18 javispedro: I am still insisting on a moderated google group. Sep 26 16:23:31 news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20100926/ap_on_hi_te/ml_iran_cyber_attacks Sep 26 16:23:33 lol Sep 26 16:23:45 javispedro: With all the usual suspects getting posting rights, and the rest being able to read but not write for 1-3 months since joining Sep 26 16:23:50 somebody brought porn to night shift Sep 26 16:23:55 yep Sep 26 16:24:08 ZogG: that's old Sep 26 16:24:21 Ain't Revolutionary Guards supposed to catch and prosecuted these people? Sep 26 16:24:27 prosecute Sep 26 16:24:41 not in iran Sep 26 16:24:48 porn ftw Sep 26 16:25:01 RST38h: there's sometimes the single-post user who drops something insightful/useful then forever leaves. Such a system would leave him out. Sep 26 16:25:09 so it's common people who work at nuclear reactor =) Sep 26 16:25:14 javispedro: there is moderation for that Sep 26 16:25:26 Ev'ning Sep 26 16:25:31 hey Jaffa Sep 26 16:25:48 * sivang thinks that there might be enough people to have an .IL maemo hacking/meeting/sprint :-) Sep 26 16:25:53 javispedro: get 5-10 moderators, let them pass some posts through, and grant posting privileges to new people once a week Sep 26 16:26:32 anyway, MohammadAG, if you're actually interested I should be in/around Jerusalem next weekend or so Sep 26 16:26:52 javispedro: Alternatively, it may be possible to establish a complex points system that rates each poster in terms of contribution and lets reader filter the lemmings out Sep 26 16:27:02 Hmm, I actually was away, checked if I had 800 and I do Sep 26 16:27:03 javispedro: But it is way more co,plicated technically Sep 26 16:27:09 I'll ping you during the week I guess :) Sep 26 16:27:30 kk, I'm pretty much always around (here) Sep 26 16:27:48 RST38h: I believe "reader-configurable" is the keyword here, and also the way to go. Sep 26 16:28:18 javispedro: yea, except that nobody is going to make tmo reader-configurable Sep 26 16:28:47 javispedro: so it will have to be a separate forum Sep 26 16:30:09 who knows. Sep 26 16:30:31 at this point thought there's only one future for tmo, and you all know it :) Sep 26 16:30:35 *though Sep 26 16:30:38 javispedro: I know for sure Sep 26 16:30:47 boom. Sep 26 16:31:47 javispedro: What I find the most amusing is that when Nokia releases the Harmattan device, it will lack support and/or community THE VERY MOMENT it is produced Sep 26 16:32:15 Wait, what? Sep 26 16:32:16 javispedro: As it is basicaly going to be a Maemo, which Nokia has now officially abandoned Sep 26 16:32:39 at this point thought there's only one future for tmo, and you all know it :) Sep 26 16:32:43 What are you referring to? Sep 26 16:32:53 RST38h: how's that different from previous devices? =) Sep 26 16:33:04 javispedro: So it will be pretty amusing to see how Nokia's PR/marketing people will weasel their way out of this one ;) Sep 26 16:33:13 javispedro: Of course it is different Sep 26 16:33:39 I got the N810 knowing they where not dropping any more SSUs, I got the N900 knowing they would drop everything and switch to Qt Sep 26 16:33:43 javispedro: With previous devices, there were Nokia-supported dev tools (SB), community (maemo.org), and support (bugzilla) Sep 26 16:33:55 and god knows if I'll ever get the N900+1 even though I know they will switch to Meego. Sep 26 16:34:20 so there are no tools for meego? Sep 26 16:34:24 javispedro: Yep, same here, but only because it does what the other devices on the market can't Sep 26 16:34:35 jacekowski: Harmattan is *not* Meego at the system level Sep 26 16:34:59 i thought the n9 was supposed to run meego Sep 26 16:35:00 jacekowski: So, it will most likely be based on Maemo dev tools + Qt Sep 26 16:35:49 It is possible that Meego Devices will officially switch developers to MADDE, too Sep 26 16:36:12 i'd say that's quite likely, given that that's what meego sdk is based on Sep 26 16:36:14 ie, non-platform sdk Sep 26 16:36:24 Otherwise they will have to support SB1 for god knows how long (they dropped SB2 already) Sep 26 16:38:33 Stskeeps: surely, software porters will be quite amazed:) Sep 26 16:39:10 here's to glibc not breaking ABI compatibility (and thus scratchbox) for the next 10 years! Sep 26 16:39:13 RST38h: having just another release of Maemo with Qt dev tools would not be that bad, I think Sep 26 16:39:23 javispedro: heh Sep 26 16:40:02 hmm Sep 26 16:40:32 anyone an idea if it is possible to catch terminal bells from x terminal? Sep 26 16:40:46 steinex: aren't they special chars? Sep 26 16:40:53 i would like to get notified when i have an hilight in irssi Sep 26 16:40:59 sivang: yes Sep 26 16:41:32 steinex: you can try and scan the output for that or logs if it gets propogated there.. Sep 26 16:41:35 not sure Sep 26 16:41:40 * sivang is talking out of his a** Sep 26 16:41:58 steinex: through a perl script installed into irssi Sep 26 16:42:33 steinex: http://blog.ryara.net/2007/06/29/flashing-taskbar-with-putty-irssi-screen/ Sep 26 16:43:48 yeah Sep 26 16:43:56 that link doesn't mention a script Sep 26 16:44:07 but how with n900s x terminal? ;) Sep 26 16:44:27 satmd: right, it uses PuTTy's sensitivity to bells Sep 26 16:44:30 damn Sep 26 16:44:36 well... it's xterm, isn't it...there's a hint to ~/.Xdefaults Sep 26 16:45:22 steinex: http://scripts.irssi.org/html/beep.pl.html ? Sep 26 16:45:40 19 # beep_command if not empty, the specified command will be Sep 26 16:45:42 20 # executed instead of the normal terminal bell Sep 26 16:45:47 its working for my irssi already. no need for a script Sep 26 16:46:02 just need to configure n900 Sep 26 16:46:16 will look into xdefaults Sep 26 16:46:25 that script allow you to run something like aplay /usr/...some/..wav Sep 26 16:46:33 +s Sep 26 16:46:48 satmd: you can always add a command to send a notification through dbus to notification daemo or somesuch no? Sep 26 16:46:55 through dbus-send , et al Sep 26 16:47:19 mhm Sep 26 16:47:21 but you do need irssi installed on the device Sep 26 16:47:42 * sivang would prefer not tinkering with the N900's xterm Sep 26 16:47:50 actually. I'm only collecting new ideas :P Sep 26 16:48:17 I'm not sure qt reads .Xdefaults Sep 26 16:48:31 in the way we need it Sep 26 16:48:51 satmd: better localize config to irssi Sep 26 16:48:56 my hunch Sep 26 16:49:11 nah, allowing xterm to notify you is a more general solution Sep 26 16:49:32 it probably has a command itself for .Xdefaults to run a command or something Sep 26 16:49:38 ah, okay so to allow any bells to be sent? Sep 26 16:49:45 ... in case it can't make use of hildon's notification Sep 26 16:49:52 * satmd nods Sep 26 16:50:07 that could be nice, sending an SMS when a bells is signaled for example Sep 26 16:50:23 so when I press too many backspaces and irssi bells, I get my SMS account drained! Sep 26 16:50:31 * sivang kids Sep 26 16:50:58 manpage says no :( Sep 26 16:51:51 so. hopefully visual bell works out for steinex Sep 26 16:52:18 trying now Sep 26 16:53:13 steinex: yes, that's what I sw now Sep 26 16:54:47 satmd: how do you intercept visual bell in xterm? Sep 26 16:54:53 satmd: (if not in irssi) Sep 26 16:55:20 you can't. "manpage says no" Sep 26 16:55:32 satmd: ah okay Sep 26 16:57:29 javispedro: ah, I would not worry about glibc on this one :) Sep 26 16:57:50 javispedro: more interested in how many years GNOME has left to live Sep 26 16:58:56 i need to restart my n900 every few days as it gets unbareably slow Sep 26 16:59:52 RST38h: so far, no recent events presage its doom (yes, even with LGPL Qt) Sep 26 17:01:04 javispedro: but is Gnome being developed at all? Have not seen anything new in it for a while Sep 26 17:01:15 (not that it is a bad thing, of course :)) Sep 26 17:01:23 mc_teo`: never happens to me, any exotic apps ? Sep 26 17:01:28 * sivang has ALOT of apps Sep 26 17:01:32 from all over Sep 26 17:01:39 RST38h: well, they at least added a change spell correction language option in textboxes! Sep 26 17:01:47 omg Sep 26 17:01:49 I was quite missing that one =) Sep 26 17:02:17 javispedro: could you check who owns files in /opt? Sep 26 17:02:22 previously all you could do is change locale (or LANG var) and restart application Sep 26 17:02:23 are they all root:root? Sep 26 17:02:54 sivang: well ive a few extra dev or testing Sep 26 17:03:03 not that i use them much Sep 26 17:03:07 RST38h: I saw some new branches created for some compoenents Sep 26 17:03:14 interesting Sep 26 17:03:31 * sivang tries to recall them since gmail is hard to search through today Sep 26 17:03:33 RST38h: you mean on my n900? Sep 26 17:03:36 yes Sep 26 17:03:43 no, some are owned by user:users Sep 26 17:03:47 mc_teo`: try tp open a terminal, and run top Sep 26 17:03:50 (in a typical maemo fashion) Sep 26 17:04:07 like today someone was bringing me, and the phone started vibrating, but the screen stayed black until the 5th ring Sep 26 17:04:16 mc_teo`: or better, ssh to the device and run top through a wifi connection, then you can get a good idea of what's going on when calls are coming in, smss apps running etc Sep 26 17:04:17 then opened in wrong position Sep 26 17:04:40 javispedro: which ones? Sep 26 17:04:48 ... but I have some files owned by 1000 which is my desktop uid so I clearly have some stuff broken Sep 26 17:04:55 *desktop user uid Sep 26 17:05:05 * RST38h accidentally chowned them all to root:root Sep 26 17:05:17 grr, what's wrong with this code http://pastebin.com/1AjDHp4L Sep 26 17:05:19 dunno if it is bad Sep 26 17:05:32 all of offscr-* is user:users Sep 26 17:05:49 Object::connect: No such slot MainWindow::about() Sep 26 17:05:49 Object::connect: (sender name: 'actionAbout') Sep 26 17:05:50 Object::connect: (receiver name: 'MainWindow') Sep 26 17:06:01 gvm is user:users Sep 26 17:06:02 ah yes I know Sep 26 17:06:06 (possibly my fault) Sep 26 17:06:07 you have not processed it with moc Sep 26 17:06:15 moc? Sep 26 17:06:22 google moc qt Sep 26 17:07:02 keep an even keel on the karmic river Sep 26 17:08:13 RST38h: I think that on a default install you can safely assume everything is root:root Sep 26 17:09:06 only offscr-* stuff and some extra third packages aren't Sep 26 17:11:07 hmm Sep 26 17:11:21 10.04.1 LTS's kernel 2.6.32-24-generic just hanged Sep 26 17:11:34 quite a while since that happened to me wiht a linux on a desktop Sep 26 17:11:53 and you say you have an n900? =) Sep 26 17:12:00 ah, sorry, missed the desktop part :) Sep 26 17:13:44 javispedro: good to know Sep 26 17:14:10 Mohammad: Have you got acquainted with moc already? :) Sep 26 17:14:26 come to the basement and i'll show you my unsold gnomes Sep 26 17:14:35 javispedro: I only had to take out the battery twice since I got it Sep 26 17:14:37 javispedro: :) Sep 26 17:14:49 RST38h, well, it says if you use qmake it should autohandle moc :) Sep 26 17:14:57 javispedro: and I do internet radio over 3G through fm trasmitter alot :-) Sep 26 17:15:27 We recommend using Trolltech's makefile generation tool, qmake, for building your makefiles. This tool generates a makefile that does all the necessary moc handling. Sep 26 17:16:10 * sivang wanted to felt like hearing Finnish in last night's driving, N900 made this possible Sep 26 17:16:25 ah...moc Sep 26 17:17:00 s/wanted to felt/felt/ Sep 26 17:17:17 Mohammad: I recommend not Sep 26 17:17:29 Mohammad: half-baked Sep 26 17:17:32 RST38h had a bit of a fight with the tools last night.. Sep 26 17:17:38 running into linkig issues et al Sep 26 17:17:43 and some odd bug? Sep 26 17:17:47 well, if your application is pure-qt you should reallly use qmake, otherwise you might die. Sep 26 17:17:54 Mohammad: Actually, so is moc, but let is hope you will not encounter problems Sep 26 17:18:17 javispedro: I.e. "If you work for Trolltech, you should use qmake, otherwise you might die" Sep 26 17:18:21 RST38h: but the world and his wife are using it on new MeeGo apps and tons of Qt apps built already? Sep 26 17:18:29 RST38h: HAHA Sep 26 17:18:35 RST38h: there's no trolltech anymore no? Sep 26 17:18:37 sivang: How many meego apps, exactly? Sep 26 17:18:42 RST38h: I don't know :-) Sep 26 17:18:46 sivang: Whatever Nokia group it turned into Sep 26 17:18:50 sivang: exactly. Sep 26 17:18:51 RST38h: note "pure-qt" -- their subset/superset of c++ Sep 26 17:18:54 but skype, volvo Sep 26 17:18:57 other companies Sep 26 17:19:00 javispedro: subset Sep 26 17:19:09 ah yes, touch. Sep 26 17:19:11 javispedro: Have you seen moc doc page? Sep 26 17:19:33 yes, superset is a wrong word here. Sep 26 17:19:37 subset+"additions". Sep 26 17:19:50 javispedro: Check this out: http://doc.trolltech.com/4.7/moc.html#limitations Sep 26 17:20:04 (if you are eating, you may want to finish your food before checking this page out) Sep 26 17:20:18 the first one is shocking enough Sep 26 17:21:26 smells of someone fighting hard to keep their ABI stable. Sep 26 17:21:29 javispedro:I got bitten by "Also, be sure that only the first inherited class is a QObject." Sep 26 17:21:47 javispedro: smellsof someone not caring about real world applications of their tool Sep 26 17:22:29 javispedro: Because, let us be frank, there is absolutely no problem generating moc code that explicitely refers to only one of parent classes' QObjects Sep 26 17:22:40 (check the code moc generates, you will see) Sep 26 17:22:54 RST38h: or like Java, where the initial version was all but useless and for some reason recent versions keep willing to maintain compatibility with such useless VM. Thus introducing much-loved stuff like type erasure Sep 26 17:23:20 Well, Java is going to be dead in a year, hopefully. So, let us leave it rest in peace Sep 26 17:24:00 hmm Sep 26 17:24:03 second hang up Sep 26 17:24:12 seems like connecting the N900 to the ubuntu makes it cry Sep 26 17:24:23 or the usb module insertion Sep 26 17:24:27 javispedro: btw neiehter qmake nor moc appear to process #ifdefs/#ifs/etc properly, so if you use these for conditional compilation, you are toast Sep 26 17:24:46 RST38h: they don't use the host preprocessor? O.o Sep 26 17:24:49 javispedro: And no __cplusplus either, so if you mix C/C++ code, you are still toast Sep 26 17:24:59 RST38h: where did you spot this? Sep 26 17:25:00 javispedro: Apparently, they plug in before the preprocessor Sep 26 17:25:12 sivang: Yesterday, when trying to pass my stuff through moc Sep 26 17:25:25 RST38h: I mean, the ifdefs ignorament ? Sep 26 17:25:58 sivang: Even in trolltech's document, they say: "Another limitation is that moc does not expand macros, so you for example cannot use a macro to declare a signal/slot or use one to define a base class for a QObject." Sep 26 17:27:34 only sane approach to this is to keep your code as away from the qt stuff as possible Sep 26 17:28:09 basically, yes, but it did not help me much Sep 26 17:28:28 RST38h: hmm so Q_PROPERTY just gets around that somehow? one of the most used macros I've seen in Qt code.. Sep 26 17:28:35 * RST38h wrote "class EMULib: public QApplication, public QMainWindow { ..." and hell broke loose Sep 26 17:28:42 RST38h: err sorry Sep 26 17:28:54 RST38h: that's irrelavant, as moc only interferes with non standard C++ Sep 26 17:29:16 RST38h: and also limit yourself to their c++ subset when qt stuff is required Sep 26 17:29:36 is the subset documented somewhere? /me checks the moc doc Sep 26 17:29:47 sivang: page quoted a few lines above Sep 26 17:30:06 no virtual inheritance, no templates... seems like java already Sep 26 17:30:21 javispedro: yes, my ubuntu keeps hanging though so I lost it :) Sep 26 17:30:29 sivang: http://doc.trolltech.com/4.7/moc.html#limitations Sep 26 17:30:38 javispedro: thanks Sep 26 17:30:55 * sivang removes packages now though HAM after an apt-get clean saved the day Sep 26 17:31:21 * sivang would like to implement an action to low space, to auto-run clean and then tell users to start removing apps Sep 26 17:31:48 sivang: moc interferes with perfectly legal, standard c++ Sep 26 17:32:28 sivang: and that is a problem, when you are planning to add qt ui to your code, especially existing, industrial code Sep 26 17:33:14 RST38h: I need to do thourhg reading to see where it interferes, I thought was confiend to the slots:/signals: and some other minor stuff to allow it implement it. Sep 26 17:35:44 ha Sep 26 17:36:07 nothing like a good Hayek quote Sep 26 17:36:55 OMWeather broke down =( Sep 26 17:37:10 as soon as i get home i am going offline for a while. not sure what the other end will bring but i have to sort out my head from some family issues. rodarvus i will be in work as soon as its sorted. Sep 26 17:38:36 Hmm. Sep 26 17:39:48 kthomas_vh_: sasha baron cohen "hairy thighes" selma Hyek? Sep 26 17:40:18 well Sep 26 17:40:26 * doc|home has quit (Quit: “The curious task of economics is to demonstrate to men how little they know about what they imagine they can design.” F. A. Hayek) Sep 26 17:41:14 "Another change to the build system is that moc now understands preprocessor directives. qmake automatically passes the defines set for your project (using "DEFINES +=") on to moc, which has its own built-in C++ preprocessor." Sep 26 17:43:57 why, oh why the n900 doesn't have a hardware reset button Sep 26 17:44:10 * sivang shared the pain Sep 26 17:44:28 javispedro, it does, it's called batter and it's "Plug n play" ;) Sep 26 17:44:34 *battery* Sep 26 17:44:42 it can't be good for the battery cover Sep 26 17:46:44 javispedro: the battery cover holds up surprisingly Sep 26 17:47:27 the worst part is that I cannot even run the thing with the battery cover open, as it will refuse to mount the sd card Sep 26 17:48:05 javispedro: nevere checked if the sd card is mounted when the cover is open, otherwise evrything else works Sep 26 17:49:22 it's disabled on the kernel level Sep 26 17:49:28 a custom kernel should solve the problem Sep 26 17:49:43 when cover is open, sd card is dismounted Sep 26 17:49:51 ^ on the kernel level Sep 26 17:50:10 omg vlad broke something big Sep 26 17:50:14 n810 had a separate cover! :( Sep 26 17:50:19 (for the sd card ) Sep 26 17:50:23 a good precaution measure? Sep 26 17:50:29 a design flaw Sep 26 17:50:44 there's a good chance the sd card wil be removed when the cover is open, regardless if the phone is operating or not. Sep 26 17:50:47 so better be safe. Sep 26 17:50:49 I think that's not bad. Sep 26 17:50:56 sivang: huh... no Sep 26 17:51:14 the chance of µsd removal is exactly 0% if the user doesn't want to remove the µsd Sep 26 17:51:46 at boot up it's retarded Sep 26 17:51:59 since I sometimes want to boot another OS after removing the batt Sep 26 17:53:26 here's to hoping they sell replacement covers when mine inevitably breaks down Sep 26 17:53:37 sure, nokia definetely sells them :) Sep 26 17:53:59 javispedro: do you live where the device is official? Sep 26 17:54:12 MohammadAG: how does it run without the battery? Sep 26 17:54:16 yep, but I've never seen one (then again never asked) Sep 26 17:54:22 ^sivang. Sep 26 17:54:39 javispedro: so you'd be at better shape to do that then us :) Sep 26 17:55:07 the battery isn't stuck to the cover Sep 26 17:55:30 javispedro, they do, but the cover is quite strong Sep 26 17:55:35 I change 3 batteries a day Sep 26 17:55:36 MohammadAG: boot another OS after removing the batt Sep 26 17:55:42 MohammadAG: 3?? Sep 26 17:55:45 yes, 3 Sep 26 17:55:47 you ordered in from ebay? Sep 26 17:55:49 MohammadAG: btw on the N810 if you remove the cover battery falls down Sep 26 17:55:59 same on the N95 javispedro Sep 26 17:56:05 it annoyed me Sep 26 17:56:22 but the N95 only had a battery under the cover, so you don't have to remove it often Sep 26 17:56:28 didn't* Sep 26 17:57:45 a quick question: do the tablets-dev n900 meego images open usbnet or something I can use to debug why it's hanging on boot? Sep 26 17:58:09 yes, 192.168.2.15 Sep 26 17:58:21 thanks! Sep 26 17:58:21 what version is it? Sep 26 17:58:29 do you have your back cover on? Sep 26 17:58:29 latest (24 sept iirc) Sep 26 17:58:51 yep, it mounts rootfs Sep 26 17:59:18 I am using a weirdo sd layout so I guess it can't find swap. Sep 26 17:59:24 Stskeeps: do you highlight meego-arm image questions? :) Sep 26 17:59:25 could you drop into #meego-arm? Sep 26 17:59:29 sivang: no, i'm just an irc addict Sep 26 17:59:36 heh Sep 26 17:59:43 it boots without swap for me Sep 26 18:00:01 lo achipa Sep 26 18:00:26 evening achipa Sep 26 18:02:11 'evening Sep 26 18:05:02 I have extracted sdk tgz for diablo from here` http://repository.maemo.org/stable/diablo/armel/, and now Sep 26 18:05:14 How can I chroot into? Sep 26 18:05:20 on device itself Sep 26 18:06:29 what error are you seeing? Sep 26 18:07:18 Ah I did it :) Sep 26 18:07:29 mount -o bind /proc /media/mmc2/sdk/proc Sep 26 18:07:32 same with dev Sep 26 18:07:35 and chroot Sep 26 18:07:36 :) Sep 26 18:09:09 maybe /sys, too? ;D Sep 26 18:20:48 achipa, congrats. Sep 26 18:22:32 from within a chroot: Sep 26 18:22:32 Nokia-N810-43-7:/home/user# apt-get update Sep 26 18:22:32 Ign http://repository.maemo.org diablo/sdk Release.gpg Sep 26 18:22:32 16% [Working]FATAL -> Could not set non-blocking flag Bad file descriptor Sep 26 18:22:32 E: Method http has died unexpectedly! Sep 26 18:22:36 any ideas? Sep 26 18:22:42 and yes I also mounted /sys Sep 26 18:23:13 Besides, what if I add diablo/sdk to my regular sources.list? Sep 26 18:23:20 why do I need chroot? Sep 26 18:23:56 hm Sep 26 18:24:13 this shouldn't be the reason... but did you copy over /etc/resolv.conf from the host? Sep 26 18:24:32 if dns fails... it should be another message, but... well, one thing we can easily check Sep 26 18:24:32 It is able to resolve Sep 26 18:24:36 mh Sep 26 18:24:37 I have checked Sep 26 18:24:46 but /etc/resolve.conf points to 127.0.0.1 Sep 26 18:24:58 I mean, if I copy the system to mmc Sep 26 18:25:00 that should be fine for chroot Sep 26 18:25:27 I will have space for development, etc Sep 26 18:25:45 tbo I haven't seen that message with apt-get yet Sep 26 18:25:45 but, may be initfs_flasher will replace the kernel with rotation support Sep 26 18:26:02 GAN900: thx Sep 26 18:26:58 or may be i can just cp -a the system, and then chroot /mnt/initfs and say it to boot from mmc Sep 26 18:26:59 any hints what's doing the name swap mmc0/1 during boot? when, and how? maybemeven WHY? Sep 26 18:27:14 /etc/fstab I guess? Sep 26 18:27:56 fstab can *remount* /, but not change the root Sep 26 18:28:02 fstab is generated, and can't rename /dev/* Sep 26 18:28:25 technically fstab is too late during boot Sep 26 18:28:46 I thought you want to swap mount points Sep 26 18:28:59 udev? udev rules? Sep 26 18:29:04 * satmd thinks of kexec Sep 26 18:29:15 udev is what I suspect too Sep 26 18:30:11 javispedro: ?? Sep 26 18:30:19 any details? Sep 26 18:30:32 DocScrutinizer51: my n900 is busy at the moment, but I do suspect udev rules too Sep 26 18:30:49 and WHY? Sep 26 18:31:05 there is bmo report iir Sep 26 18:31:06 c Sep 26 18:31:22 ooh thnx Sep 26 18:31:45 bug #2747 Sep 26 18:31:46 Bug https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=2747 inconsistent mmc device naming at boot time when one card is missing Sep 26 18:33:08 * norayr goes to prepare tea and thinks about cp-in rootfs without reflashing kernel image Sep 26 18:33:14 honestly for THAT mess I'd prefer ssitching to mount_by_label, as muc as I usually deprecate it Sep 26 18:34:19 but then prolly messybox mount never heard of that Sep 26 18:34:43 * satmd feels the pain of mmc* renumbering Sep 26 18:35:06 * satmd has the same with 6 sd* devices Sep 26 18:35:07 mounting by label is awesome Sep 26 18:35:11 had that even back in diablo days Sep 26 18:35:12 or by id Sep 26 18:35:48 the label can be changes easily, the id will be the same until you format Sep 26 18:35:52 (the mess, bug) Sep 26 18:35:53 -s+d Sep 26 18:37:47 http://theexplosivegeneration.com/wp-content/uploads/2006/07/hipster!!!.jpg hahaha! {sfw} Sep 26 18:38:59 pupnik: it's true, i've a friend whose done that Sep 26 18:39:10 and the hipster was pissed Sep 26 18:39:12 hilo, anyone using transmission ? cant get mine to work on the n800, maybe i missing something out Sep 26 18:39:22 awesome Sep 26 18:39:29 :D Sep 26 18:49:09 javispedro: (2747) meh, status:reopened Sep 26 18:50:56 hey, what if instead of running nupgrade.sh etc, I just copy root fs to mmc, and then run chroot /mnt/initfs cal-tool --set-root-device ask:mmc2 Sep 26 18:52:53 *cough* what? Sep 26 18:54:05 sounds like arcane spell to me Sep 26 19:02:23 evil DocScrutinizer51 Sep 26 19:02:45 ah, you didn't reopen it =) Sep 26 19:02:59 what's nupgrade.sh? Sep 26 19:04:38 yeah, and what's doin' cal-tool there? Sep 26 19:05:53 cal-tool was there on n8x0 Sep 26 19:14:40 yep, I use diablo Sep 26 19:17:31 heh, it's prolly hard to believe but on N810 I always stayed in a strictly enduser attitude Sep 26 19:19:27 a pity Sep 26 19:24:16 DocScrutinizer51: :) Sep 26 19:27:05 hmm Sep 26 19:27:12 scrolling isn't tear free in the SDK Sep 26 19:27:47 so it IS because of the lack of vsync Sep 26 19:28:26 again this one? Sep 26 19:28:38 scrolling is not tear free mostly because of Gtk+ Sep 26 19:28:46 sorry, I just used the SDK UI :P Sep 26 19:29:08 yes, I know it's smoother in Qt Sep 26 19:29:10 but still Sep 26 19:29:20 look at microB's bookmark list in the SDK Sep 26 19:29:31 anyways, tearing doesn't really annoy me, was just pointing it out Sep 26 19:29:55 my sdk setup is weird. i'm using a customized build of vmgl to render it =) Sep 26 19:30:11 Hello! Is there any good/big n900 channel that regards non-maemo stuff? Sep 26 19:30:12 lol Sep 26 19:30:23 non-maemo stuff? Sep 26 19:30:37 I wan't to install some other OS on the n900 Sep 26 19:30:48 what other os? Sep 26 19:30:49 which OS? Sep 26 19:30:58 :P Sep 26 19:31:00 * MohammadAG checks povbot to see who won Sep 26 19:31:20 grammatically, you. Sep 26 19:31:27 I wan't to try the ubuntu netbook remix, and see if it's nice on the n900 Sep 26 19:31:33 Nirtal: feel free to discuss it here Sep 26 19:31:37 Nirtal: most of the time, it's OK Sep 26 19:31:47 ok =) Sep 26 19:31:57 Does any one know if it's possible? Sep 26 19:32:00 Nirtal: if you go into OS specifics, other channels might be more appropriate (#nitdroid for Android on Nokia Internet Tablets), etc. Sep 26 19:32:04 there's #NITUbuntu, but it's quiet Sep 26 19:32:35 I know Gentoo is possible, never tried or heard about ubuntu though Sep 26 19:32:44 * MohammadAG kicks crashanddie Sep 26 19:32:48 it's my project! Sep 26 19:33:02 though I really haven't worked on it lately Sep 26 19:33:10 I see that there is an armel build for ubuntu netbook Sep 26 19:33:36 http://mohammadag.xceleo.org/public/NITUbuntu/NITUbuntu.tar.bz2 Sep 26 19:34:12 R&D mode required mind you Sep 26 19:34:26 or a watchdog-less kernel, which I doubt anyone compiled/wants Sep 26 19:34:49 Nirtal: well it is possible to run debian so I would be suprised if the same wouldn't work for ubuntu netbook Sep 26 19:34:51 MohammadAG do you have any screenshots of nitubuntu? Sep 26 19:35:05 *debian in chroot Sep 26 19:40:21 http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?p=745610 Sep 26 19:40:33 Hoxzer, ubuntu runs natively, not inside a chroot Sep 26 19:40:48 so it's different from Easy Debian Sep 26 19:41:38 kk nice :) Sep 26 19:42:03 How open source is the maemo media player? Sep 26 19:42:08 0? Sep 26 19:42:14 rats Sep 26 19:42:27 I want to make it better though! Sep 26 19:42:48 we all do Sep 26 19:43:11 Although I'm sure that nothing a mere mortal can do could make such an epitome of user interface and software engineering brilliance any better. Sep 26 19:43:12 jophish: should be reasonably easy, the closed bit is only the varnish over the top Sep 26 19:43:38 now what are the names of the playlist library stuff, etc? Sep 26 19:43:42 lardman: That's probably the bit I want to change, just a simple way to browse music by directory structure Sep 26 19:43:59 mafw? Sep 26 19:44:12 indeed Sep 26 19:44:23 mafw + gstreamer and you're away Sep 26 19:45:34 supposedly anyway Sep 26 19:45:36 ;) Sep 26 19:46:24 * ShadowJK just discovered n900 location subsystem loses the speed transmitted by external bluetooth gps Sep 26 19:46:42 this explains why ovi maps wasn't autorotating into direction of travel Sep 26 19:46:45 it probably only wants to know location Sep 26 19:46:49 oh right Sep 26 19:46:57 and sygic maps was running at 1 fps Sep 26 19:47:20 with speed info, sygic interpolates the steps between gps fixes that come at 1hz Sep 26 19:47:43 does the internal gps supply speed data? Sep 26 19:47:47 yep Sep 26 19:48:01 oh right Sep 26 19:48:13 the external does too, but gpsd/location/whatever loses it Sep 26 19:48:17 sure Sep 26 19:48:32 strange that it's lost on the one but not the other Sep 26 19:48:44 bug! ;) Sep 26 19:49:41 night all Sep 26 19:49:46 well in pr1.0 it lost satellite ifo too Sep 26 19:50:45 and some things used the absence of satellite info to filter out network based inaccurate positions Sep 26 19:50:57 so external gps was basically useless in 1.0 Sep 26 19:58:41 Stskeeps: am I right about this assumption: hal-addon-bme has an interface (of whatever kind, rpc? socks?) to bme, and is converting battery status msgs to a 'better' format, then send it to hal via dbus Sep 26 20:02:00 hi folks. anyone using urpo? Sep 26 20:02:29 DocScrutinizer51: it's communicating over bme socket Sep 26 20:03:56 :nod: but that's exactly the one of 2 ends I'm not interested in as I hope to get rif of bme, socket, and hal-addon-bme Sep 26 20:04:20 rid* Sep 26 20:05:17 sending dbus msgs to hal directly from jrbme instead Sep 26 20:18:57 is there a ssh-askpass package? Sep 26 20:23:04 ssh-askpass? Sep 26 20:25:15 hmm i cant get urpo to work with my pc Sep 26 20:25:27 seems the auth by file fails and i dont know why Sep 26 20:31:14 DocScrutinizer, Mer had a replacement hald-addon-bme btw Sep 26 20:31:47 ShadowJK: I know, that's why I asked Stskeeps Sep 26 20:32:37 just about to find out how hald-addon-* are started Sep 26 20:51:56 Hi, does anyone know what shell scripts was executed on MSM connection/disconnection? Sep 26 20:52:51 MSM? Sep 26 20:52:55 mass storage mode Sep 26 20:53:09 Could be on USB cable connection/disconnection, don't remember exactly Sep 26 20:53:18 Nokia-N900:~# osso-usb-mass-storage- Sep 26 20:53:19 osso-usb-mass-storage-disable.sh osso-usb-mass-storage-enable.sh osso-usb-mass-storage-is-used.sh Sep 26 20:53:46 Oh, nice, thanks Sep 26 20:54:11 pcsuite-enable/disable.sh for PCM :) Sep 26 21:09:20 meh, why did I think hald-addon-bme is talking to hald via dbus... Sep 26 21:11:01 n00b! :P Sep 26 21:11:36 DocScrutinizer, because that would be a simple and straightforward use of technologies already present :) Sep 26 21:11:39 also, HAL is dead Sep 26 21:12:14 alas not on maemo :-D Sep 26 21:12:53 or wait, did you just say maemo stinks? :-P Sep 26 21:16:49 meh. linux distros age fast Sep 26 21:17:08 but no, I don't have a particular fondness for maemo as a distro Sep 26 21:17:58 I'm not sure I'd call Maemo a "distro" Sep 26 21:18:05 But that's just semantics. Sep 26 21:18:07 hey guys Sep 26 21:18:11 HAY Sep 26 21:18:19 hi Sep 26 21:18:25 h4waii, if it's not a distro, what is it? Sep 26 21:18:39 * johnx is curious Sep 26 21:18:52 my N900's battery is completely fried... it is turned on and the yellow LED doesn't light up when I plug in the charger Sep 26 21:19:05 did I just kill it or it will charge eventually? Sep 26 21:19:15 Did you drain it completely and absolutely? Sep 26 21:19:22 yes Sep 26 21:19:25 wait, the device runs and boots? Sep 26 21:19:29 no. Sep 26 21:19:34 it has turned off Sep 26 21:19:36 Leave it plugged in for 4 hours minimum. Sep 26 21:19:38 sorry, not on, off Sep 26 21:19:45 typo Sep 26 21:20:08 yup. just let it sit there for a bit, before trying anything more drastic Sep 26 21:20:11 you might want to try the fridge maneuver Sep 26 21:20:19 so, if I will just leave it on the charger overnight, it will charge? Sep 26 21:20:26 Possibly. Sep 26 21:20:33 achipa: fridge maneuver??? :D what's that? Sep 26 21:20:34 If not, then come back and we'll diagnose. Sep 26 21:20:43 Venemo, it might. but until you're sure it won't, there's no point in doing anything more invasive Sep 26 21:21:11 fridge/freezer mode is to slow down chem degradation. It's far from useful at this point in time. Sep 26 21:21:33 well, I'll just leave it on the charger and see it in the morning then Sep 26 21:22:02 Good plan. Sep 26 21:22:29 sigh Sep 26 21:23:07 my vibrator seems to have borked real bad Sep 26 21:23:38 tybollt, O_o; Sep 26 21:23:43 the device had to be sent from repairshop to factory Sep 26 21:23:54 A physical issue? Sep 26 21:23:56 johnx: :) You took the bait - eh :) Sep 26 21:23:58 h4waii: not just degradation, actually, brought my N810 back to life... Sep 26 21:24:06 couldn't resist :) Sep 26 21:24:09 :D Sep 26 21:24:22 the vibrator in my n900 stopped working Sep 26 21:24:32 figured I had installed some app that had borked it Sep 26 21:24:33 hello Sep 26 21:24:37 oh, THAT vibrator (phew) Sep 26 21:24:40 but flashed it and still problems Sep 26 21:24:50 hey oshin :) Sep 26 21:24:58 hi johnx Sep 26 21:25:14 HELLO FRIEND Sep 26 21:25:24 anyone know how to auto-mount the second ext3 partition on the microsd? Sep 26 21:25:24 okay guys, thanks for helping Sep 26 21:25:33 and now last week th repair shop told me they had to ship the device off site to fix it Sep 26 21:25:35 init script? Sep 26 21:25:36 :-/ Sep 26 21:25:56 like a step by step guide Sep 26 21:26:06 There is none, AFAIK. Sep 26 21:26:10 I see. Sep 26 21:26:21 Wiki up for upstart / event.d Sep 26 21:26:32 thanks! Sep 26 21:26:55 Please post your file before you commit it, however. Sep 26 21:29:31 too busy.. Sep 26 21:30:56 i should be able to just override fstab in some rc? Sep 26 21:31:11 like echo something >> Sep 26 21:31:11 AFAIK, fstab is generated at boot Sep 26 21:31:16 reflashing due to bootloop will keep you real busy Sep 26 21:31:31 i was concerned Sep 26 21:31:42 hmm Sep 26 21:32:28 may be just install sysklogd and mount it with a daemo Sep 26 21:32:29 n Sep 26 21:32:40 * oshin feels too far overengineering. Sep 26 21:32:47 upstart is the easiest way. Use it. Sep 26 21:32:57 ok, thanks. Sep 26 21:33:08 use it to modify fstab right? Sep 26 21:33:44 No Sep 26 21:33:44 just to make sure since i may remove the microsd all the time. Sep 26 21:33:59 and want it automounted when i put it back. Sep 26 21:34:00 Use it to mount your filesystem. Sep 26 21:34:08 so anyone else had their rabbi^W n900 vibrator bork on them? Sep 26 21:34:21 I see. will take a look at that thanks. Sep 26 21:35:00 Use upstart to mount it on boot, and then modify fstab for auto-mount. Sep 26 21:35:08 Guess this is an FAQ, but how does the future of Maemo/N900 look? Any other devices planed? Or is it an dead end? Sep 26 21:35:21 ah ok. Sep 26 21:36:13 yacc: the future is called meego Sep 26 21:36:22 unless new device is resistive, my n900 is irreplaceable Sep 26 21:36:37 Your N900 will always be irreplaceable. Sep 26 21:37:14 but what if someone take it back from the next century when the time machine was invented? Sep 26 21:37:24 n/m Sep 26 21:37:36 i was also tempted to comment oshin Sep 26 21:37:42 The tense in your post just blew my mind. Sep 26 21:38:04 h4waii++ Sep 26 21:38:06 pardon my none-gnlish! Sep 26 21:38:09 asj_, ok, so how's the relationship Meego/Maemo, and are there any Meego devices even announced? Sep 26 21:38:24 yacc: is my name google? ;p Sep 26 21:39:34 I'm still trying to wrap my head around the person who is going to take it back from the next century when the time machine was invented in the future. Why don't I ever make such cool statements? Sep 26 21:39:54 I have no idea for what to do with starcraft Sep 26 21:40:02 sorry, i meant, upstart Sep 26 21:40:06 s/starcraft/upstart/ Sep 26 21:40:11 it's late here. Sep 26 21:40:18 Lmfao. Sep 26 21:40:35 dammit you are good Sep 26 21:40:37 * oshin OTL Sep 26 21:40:54 oshin; upstart will allow you to script something on a specific "boot event" Sep 26 21:41:14 yacc: http://lmgtfy.com/?q=relationship+between+maemo+and+meego Sep 26 21:41:21 h4waii, I must create some file in event.d? Sep 26 21:41:29 You must. Sep 26 21:41:37 * SpeedEvil imagines that returning erotica. Sep 26 21:41:38 I see, got the picture. Sep 26 21:41:47 #34 Sep 26 21:42:18 This is most likely safe... Sep 26 21:42:25 start on started hildon-desktop Sep 26 21:42:25 stop on starting shutdown Sep 26 21:42:25 console none Sep 26 21:42:25 service Sep 26 21:42:25 script Sep 26 21:42:25 mount -t ext3 /dev/mmcblk1p2 /mntpoint Sep 26 21:42:26 end script Sep 26 21:42:51 You'll want to change your "event" of start on started hildon-desktop Sep 26 21:42:52 asj_ well google suggests that Nokia won't be showing anything this year, and Intel has just shown a tablet and smart TV based on Meego, not much of devices, looks to me? Sep 26 21:42:54 Or you cheat. Sep 26 21:43:00 thanks! logged, will try once the torrent finished. Sep 26 21:43:28 And you add mount -t ... to a 'queen beecon' on the desktop set to tun once at startup of display. Sep 26 21:43:45 That's a much safer way, yes. Sep 26 21:44:45 good idea Sep 26 21:45:33 or i may use cron for that? Sep 26 21:45:50 You could use cron and @boot Sep 26 21:45:50 bad idea. Sep 26 21:45:51 ok. Sep 26 21:45:57 fcron is compiled, but it doesn't support @boot Sep 26 21:46:03 I see. Sep 26 21:46:44 yacc: that's all the info I have, plus so close to xmas they wouldn't want to canobalize their n8 sales eh? Sep 26 21:47:00 Up to you. I'd recommend what SpeedEvil said and use QB. I, myself, use upstart. Sep 26 21:47:26 hihi Sep 26 21:47:33 huhu Sep 26 21:47:37 heh Sep 26 21:47:50 pupnik: 'sup? any news about meego-arm with call audio working? Sep 26 21:48:02 yacc, watch the nokia meego conference coming up in a month or two Sep 26 21:48:06 * sivang removed a whole lot of crap from the deivce Sep 26 21:48:06 using queen beacon and I may have to waste a space for it? or can I tell it to disappeared after use? Sep 26 21:48:43 so got more room on rootfs, and I can ssh again and everything. Now to spank off pesky promximityd Sep 26 21:48:52 oshin: I've not investigated it much. I use a script which mounts, and if it does not mount, as it's mounted, dims the dislpay down tho the hardware minimum level. Sep 26 21:49:20 * oshin nods. Sep 26 21:49:34 Which is significantly below the UI minimum level with brightness-applet Sep 26 21:49:53 Does anyone know how I can get a boot menu? Sep 26 21:50:06 SpeedEvil: huh? Sep 26 21:50:11 a script that's what? Sep 26 21:51:17 echo 2 >/sys/class/backlight/acx565akm/brightness Sep 26 21:51:27 makes the screen its hardware minimum brightness Sep 26 21:51:37 SpeedEvil: ah nice, didn't know you can lower it below the brightness-applet Sep 26 21:51:43 SpeedEvil: below what it offers, that is Sep 26 21:52:02 SpeedEvil: you mean below the leftmost knob? Sep 26 21:52:09 Yes. Sep 26 21:52:22 The left most knob is at like 20 pts Sep 26 21:52:24 yes Sep 26 21:52:46 I should compile the brightness widget with patches. Sep 26 21:52:48 But meh. Sep 26 21:52:50 2 into brightness is good for running it with FlipClock as a bed-side clock Sep 26 21:53:00 flipclock? Sep 26 21:53:05 SpeedEvil: alas any change of ambient light will reset it Sep 26 21:53:08 *sigh* Sep 26 21:53:11 Flipclock is a nice full-screen clock Sep 26 21:53:24 Doc, no. Notifications will, however. Sep 26 21:53:44 that... displays the time if you flip the n900? Sep 26 21:53:47 DocScrutinizer: I don'tfind it a problem as I typically use it with sipe-brightness-widget - which tends to mostly lock the brightness, and also as I'm using it in total darkness Sep 26 21:54:01 kerio: no - it's like an old-fashioned flip-clock Sep 26 21:54:05 h4waii: no? what's that what I've seen here then? 1min ago Sep 26 21:54:07 ooooh Sep 26 21:54:11 with flip-letters Sep 26 21:54:16 cute Sep 26 21:54:31 I've never experienced that, Doc. Sep 26 21:55:12 i tried that clock and i thought it was a little ugly. Sep 26 21:55:27 So theme it. Sep 26 21:55:32 i use night mode one Sep 26 21:55:35 instead. Sep 26 21:56:01 but i thought it is still ugly.. but i am still using it. Sep 26 21:56:13 i want to theme it but.. too lazy Sep 26 21:56:47 i am working as a graphics designer btw. Sep 26 21:57:01 h4waii: as well as desktop activity Sep 26 21:57:22 so a little picky on any already good looking things. Sep 26 21:57:43 * sivang continues trying setting up USB networking for Qt Creator, this time on the laptop. Sep 26 21:58:05 * sivang crosses fingers the usb networking module won't halt the kernel of 9.04 as well Sep 26 21:58:21 any luck so far with the usb host mode? Sep 26 21:58:30 Somewhat. Sep 26 21:58:32 Mixed. Sep 26 21:58:54 I see, just want to mount my camera Sep 26 21:58:58 There is a technically poor method released that works for many peple. Sep 26 21:59:11 It does not work for some, or with some peripherals. Sep 26 21:59:29 oshin: that almost sounded like something infobot would say :) Sep 26 21:59:42 :D Sep 26 22:00:24 Mount your camera? Sep 26 22:00:29 At the moment, it's akin to opening a lock by hitting the surround of the lock with several precisely spaced hammers to make the lock jump open. Sep 26 22:00:39 h4waii, just copy image from camera Sep 26 22:00:43 Rather than actually using a key. Sep 26 22:01:11 h4waii: yes Sep 26 22:01:13 "mount" Sep 26 22:01:21 * johnx always liked the idea of the eyefi SD cards Sep 26 22:01:39 johnx: how do you configure them? Sep 26 22:01:50 i always wondered Sep 26 22:02:25 It's a mess. Sep 26 22:02:36 They are designed really to upload to a central server. Sep 26 22:02:51 SpeedEvil, search: eyefi site:hackaday.com Sep 26 22:02:53 am I using psswitcher unknowingly? Sep 26 22:02:59 you have to fake being the remote server on your local network if you don't want them to do that. Sep 26 22:03:06 eyefi sounds cool Sep 26 22:03:09 Did you install it, knowingly? Sep 26 22:03:10 some of the newer ones seem more flexible Sep 26 22:03:21 and is this mime64 looking chunk normal in a package description? http://paste.pocoo.org/show/267772/ Sep 26 22:03:24 h4waii: no Sep 26 22:03:40 h4waii: it is suspiciously coming from extras,so I figured something pulled it in Sep 26 22:03:44 johnx: ah - k - this was commenting as of the release a couple of years ago, I haven't looked at nre advances. Sep 26 22:03:52 h4waii: is it doing anything good? Sep 26 22:04:02 speakers on/off ? never thought about it before Sep 26 22:04:06 SpeedEvil, I think the situation might still be that you need to pretend to be the remote server Sep 26 22:04:08 It's just an icon. Sep 26 22:04:16 sivang - I use PSSwitcher every day. Sep 26 22:04:21 but there's at least some docs on it Sep 26 22:04:29 h4waii: how do you access it from the UI? Sep 26 22:04:35 if the N900 wasn't my 'main' camera I might be arsed to actually buy one and hack it up Sep 26 22:04:49 yeah. Sep 26 22:04:51 * sivang googles Sep 26 22:05:07 SpeedEvil: I love the hammering lock analogy, but how'd you come to say those hits are precise? :-D Sep 26 22:05:10 Access what? Sep 26 22:05:32 Though I in some ways want a mode with even less interaction. Open shutter, press button, take picture, close shutter - auto-upload. Sep 26 22:05:55 DocScrutinizer: precisely placed does not mean in particularly well-chosen spots. Sep 26 22:06:00 Easily achieved with dbus, rsync/unison Sep 26 22:06:00 h4waii: psswitcher, /me tries to find the garage page for it Sep 26 22:06:11 sivang - it's in Settings at the bottom. Sep 26 22:06:12 precise != accurate Sep 26 22:07:21 h4waii: yes, I am trying to spot it but nothing, what's it caled? Sep 26 22:07:26 * sivang marks it for removal Sep 26 22:07:37 and shortcutd should go away as well Sep 26 22:07:54 If it's not there, you obviously don't have the package a). installed or b). configured properly. Sep 26 22:08:06 fcam always freeze my other cameras Sep 26 22:08:26 there was a fcamera update last night, didn't try though.. Sep 26 22:08:48 off it goes then.. Sep 26 22:10:08 HAM is so slow, good I managed to ssh back in again. Sep 26 22:10:15 moin Sep 26 22:10:31 sivang: use fapman Sep 26 22:10:54 moinmoin nox- Sep 26 22:11:02 jacekowski: better application manager? Sep 26 22:11:11 faster application manager Sep 26 22:11:14 is transmission working with file larger than 4GB? Sep 26 22:11:19 moin sivang Sep 26 22:12:15 oshin, not if they are on fat, tho thats not transmission's fault Sep 26 22:12:50 nox-, like.. even the file in the torrent were separated into a few file and all of them smaller. Sep 26 22:13:04 but if the total sum of the file were too large, it won't work either. Sep 26 22:13:08 oh Sep 26 22:13:20 well _that_ sounds more like a bug Sep 26 22:13:30 wonder if that was fixed Sep 26 22:13:43 and finally I have gfind! Sep 26 22:13:43 i am happily using rtorrent over ext3 Sep 26 22:14:31 (or a missing _FILE_OFFSET_BITS definition) Sep 26 22:14:52 ah hm Sep 26 22:15:08 oh rtorrent, ok Sep 26 22:15:16 that i use too (tho not yet on n900) Sep 26 22:15:42 it works perfectly. Sep 26 22:15:52 and I can run it in screen Sep 26 22:16:02 no need to open any window all the time. Sep 26 22:16:32 hello all, can anyone help me? is there possibility to boot maemo5 without running hildon at startup? Sep 26 22:16:48 If you have to ask that, no. Sep 26 22:16:59 * h4waii jerk-mode Sep 26 22:17:19 like showing good old login prompt? Sep 26 22:17:26 yeah Sep 26 22:17:33 try ctrl-alt-f1 yet? Sep 26 22:17:40 anybody care to toss me the gfind line again from today's afternoon? Sep 26 22:17:43 j/k Sep 26 22:17:47 how to put f1 on n900?;> Sep 26 22:17:51 :) Sep 26 22:18:23 hehe h4waii Sep 26 22:18:34 you want to start your own wm? Sep 26 22:18:49 or x11? Sep 26 22:18:49 ah, I take it you guys got those questions all the time now?:-) Sep 26 22:18:54 well, so maybe you know another solution of my problem: I was playing around with 'theme customizer', and after saving changes its rebooting when starting hildon Sep 26 22:19:01 stil reboot, reboot, reboot ... ; ( Sep 26 22:19:40 I don't suppose you have bootmenu installed? Sep 26 22:19:46 i dont Sep 26 22:19:50 Reflash. Sep 26 22:19:53 sivang: i haven't made plans to do anything with meego yet Sep 26 22:19:55 ;/ Sep 26 22:20:00 * oshin pats on your shoulder. Sep 26 22:20:19 can you be quick enough to ssh into it? Sep 26 22:20:25 noo Sep 26 22:20:32 He can't even get a UI up. Sep 26 22:20:38 He won't be able to get connectivity. Sep 26 22:20:45 ah i see.. Sep 26 22:20:46 He can't start USB networking Sep 26 22:20:58 like most of the world, i'm just holding my breath, looking down at the yawning drop-off and the train of cars pulling me down into it Sep 26 22:21:00 i didn't know network depends on ui Sep 26 22:21:08 It doesn't Sep 26 22:21:13 are you sure there is no any magical shourtcut at startup that would help me? :D Sep 26 22:21:16 but how do you plan on starting it, with out being able to input anything? Sep 26 22:21:50 automatic wifi connection? Sep 26 22:22:09 need to turn on ssh manually? Sep 26 22:22:10 Does your device connect to the network before the UI is up? Sep 26 22:22:22 SSH is started fairly early in boot seq. Sep 26 22:22:28 pupnik: http://www.listware.net/201009/meego-dev/92077-meego-dev-starting-development-for-meego-bugfixing-and-feature-implementation-for-core.html Sep 26 22:22:29 no idea, but my home computer don't start in ui Sep 26 22:22:34 ssh is set to OFF at startup Sep 26 22:22:37 on my n900 Sep 26 22:22:38 ;] Sep 26 22:22:42 Because I can still see my wLAN icon flashing AFTER the UI is present. Sep 26 22:22:43 pupnik: no response yet, but this isprobably since it is sunday Sep 26 22:22:49 vltR, if you could get a command line, would you be able to fix it? Sep 26 22:22:56 yeah Sep 26 22:23:03 for sure Sep 26 22:23:07 i see Sep 26 22:23:18 two things to look at then: maemo rescue on sd card and turning off watchdog with flasher Sep 26 22:23:21 Rescue boot kernel with single user mode? Sep 26 22:23:22 what will happen if I set VDSO = 0 permenantly on a ULV laptop? Sep 26 22:23:51 thank you, going to look 4 it Sep 26 22:24:12 sivang, what does the ULV have to do with anything? Sep 26 22:24:54 johnx: don't know, just asking.. Sep 26 22:25:07 ah, simple answer then Sep 26 22:25:15 VDSO will be permanently off on your ULV laptop Sep 26 22:25:32 LOL Sep 26 22:26:04 johnx: hehe Sep 26 22:26:13 you will lose some performance when running 32 bits apps Sep 26 22:26:43 If you bought a ULV laptop, you're already under the bar for performance. Sep 26 22:27:08 h4waii, performance is relative Sep 26 22:27:22 ulv? Sep 26 22:27:38 h4waii: yeah, it bites me all the time- especially when trying to do more than one thing at a time. Sep 26 22:27:52 sivang: don't disable vdso. upgrade scratchbox instead. Sep 26 22:27:52 johnx, fair enough. Sep 26 22:28:32 I mean, my desktop was an A64 3000+ until a week or so ago ;) Sep 26 22:28:37 javispedro: that's the py installer, how can I upgrade it? Sep 26 22:28:44 a ULV would compare favorably to that Sep 26 22:28:49 johnx: hey, I too recently upgraded from such a setup :) Sep 26 22:28:50 Install a new package? Sep 26 22:28:56 kerio, ultra low voltage intel processor Sep 26 22:28:57 Build it from source? Sep 26 22:29:02 sivang: no way I know of, read manual setup and do that instead Sep 26 22:29:02 usually less than 1.6GHz Sep 26 22:30:10 ulv 4100 Sep 26 22:30:24 sivang: or possibly, disable vdso during install then upgrade sbox and reenable it. Sep 26 22:30:45 javispedro: yes, that is what I thought I should do- upgrading is like changing the sources like and apt-get upgrade? Sep 26 22:30:52 javispedro: or do I need to build from source? Sep 26 22:30:59 javispedro: 1.3GHz here Sep 26 22:31:09 er, that was for kerio Sep 26 22:31:20 sivang: actually you only need scratchbox-core (one package). so either fetch it from scratchbox.org or build it. Sep 26 22:31:49 off, thanks guys Sep 26 22:31:51 I got overly attracted by the fact it is less than 2kg and can run for almost 5 hours straight on battery under Ubuntu Sep 26 22:32:26 raw GHz numbers don't matter of course Sep 26 22:32:46 culv 1.3Ghz will be faster than 1.6GHz atom at most things Sep 26 22:33:32 My N900 performs faster than a 1.6GHz Atom Sep 26 22:33:36 sivang, everything is a compromise. I wouldn't say you made the wrong choice if you carry it all over the place Sep 26 22:33:43 h4waii, at what clock speed? :P Sep 26 22:33:53 also: running the same software? Sep 26 22:34:08 johnx: yes, exactly, it is serving me in conferences and lots of travelling quite nicely Sep 26 22:34:18 My TI-86 performs faster than a 1.6GHz Atom. Sep 26 22:34:28 So in short, Atom sucks. Use anything else. Sep 26 22:34:50 I just wish it wouldn't lose keystrocks while not on charger and doing alot of background processing Sep 26 22:35:01 which happens both under windows 7 and ubuntu Sep 26 22:35:16 sivang, tweak the freq scaling Sep 26 22:35:24 or is it some kind of lower-level thing? Sep 26 22:35:58 who knows.. might be the fact that when it does so, the keyboard gets dramatically heated, so this maybe contributing to as well Sep 26 22:36:15 skeery Sep 26 22:36:16 but I will try freq scaling, did not think to tweak there Sep 26 22:36:33 Spin your drive down more. Sep 26 22:36:47 That's what's causing your heat. Sep 26 22:37:02 h4waii: where do I tweak it in 9.04? Sep 26 22:37:07 and let it run at faster speeds on battery. remember "race to idle" Sep 26 22:37:13 anyone familiar with flags in the el-v1.db, where sms is stored? Sep 26 22:37:17 johnx: well, not really, it is by far the most reliable piece of machine I got so far. Sep 26 22:37:40 opdf2, 'flags'? such as? Sep 26 22:37:40 opdf2 - which flags? Sep 26 22:37:58 flags that indicate SMS failed, pending, permanent error etc Sep 26 22:38:21 Good question. I have no idea. Sep 26 22:38:33 I opened the db in an sqllite browser, I can't figure it out Sep 26 22:38:33 Export it and take a look? lol Sep 26 22:39:27 opdf2, do you have experience in databases in general? Sep 26 22:39:40 No not really Sep 26 22:39:47 It wouldn't be a hard entry to see, johnx Sep 26 22:40:43 johnx: right, it seems to be running on max freq on battery, but adding the applet errored that I won't b able to change it either due to configuration or lack of support Sep 26 22:41:09 sivang - BIOS option? Sep 26 22:41:16 Here's the problem: I can send and receive SMS fine. My received texts show up fine in Conversations app Sep 26 22:41:17 sivang, upgrade to a newer release. :) you know you want to Sep 26 22:41:32 but sending out does not show up in the app, although the party receives it Sep 26 22:41:32 there's a Flags table Sep 26 22:41:34 that gets my vote Sep 26 22:41:45 johnx: of the laptop? :) Sep 26 22:41:55 h4waii: I will check, thanks for the tips h4waii and johnx Sep 26 22:42:07 opdf2 - sounds like the DB is corrupt. Does this happen for only one recipient or all? Sep 26 22:42:20 one Sep 26 22:42:27 h4waii: I have now great storke responsiveness, as the SDK installation process makes it humm and humm Sep 26 22:42:37 Just as I imagine. Sep 26 22:42:44 Let me tell you what happened Sep 26 22:43:05 A message came in while you were deleting a different message? Sep 26 22:43:12 it also comes with some sort of a firmware linux version that has firefox and stuff Sep 26 22:43:26 useful for recovery and use as an internet point without booting an OS Sep 26 22:43:27 No. It began when it claimed an SMS was still pending Sep 26 22:44:00 If you remove the conversation entry, does it persist? Sep 26 22:44:17 but the SMS was not pending because the party actually recevied it Sep 26 22:44:17 thanks sivang, very kind Sep 26 22:44:25 The entire conversation with the person, that is. Sep 26 22:44:51 I can always do that, but I kinda wanted to figure out what was wrong Sep 26 22:45:07 I tried restoring a backup db, but it happened again Sep 26 22:45:12 Some entries in your database as misaligned. Sep 26 22:45:22 are^ Sep 26 22:45:42 Without hand tagging every single entry, I'm not sure of a better way to fix it - apart from blowing it all away. Sep 26 22:45:51 pupnik: I'm trying as I am interested, but couldn't find anything concrete. It can't be that community will be limited to plain app development, it must be more invovled in the core. Sep 26 22:46:05 yeah... Sep 26 22:46:20 and I don't just mean the single conversation thread. I'm talking the entire database. Sep 26 22:46:48 pupnik: and "fetch the source" or twiddle through the bug list with the hope the something is not "NB" or to guess at who's working on it or not. Sep 26 22:47:18 pupnik: does not count enough as community engagement, at least for me. But that's an issue of early projects, it was the same in Ubuntu as well when we started with it. Sep 26 22:47:43 Yeah, I probably will do that Sep 26 22:47:54 well said sivang Sep 26 22:48:04 although I want to know why it happened Sep 26 22:48:38 I chalk it up to janky-ness. Sep 26 22:49:22 i'm quite committed to the meego phone as a user, not sure about porting yet. i'm definitely concerned about the resources being invested in getting pulse up to scratch. Sep 26 22:50:43 pupnik: yes, I recall the threads about the work it might require ontop of what was invested alrady... Sep 26 22:52:38 um Sep 26 22:52:50 so I need a babyfeeding chart app like now :p Sep 26 22:52:53 sivang: are there developers who are already up-to-speed with pulseaudio internals, who could be brought-in to do project-work? T Sep 26 22:53:00 does anything useful exist, or do I need to write my own? Sep 26 22:53:02 luke-jr: there is one Sep 26 22:53:16 luke-jr: I vaguely recall testing it prefunctrraliy. Sep 26 22:53:19 Umm... Sep 26 22:53:35 Daddies little helper / dlh? Sep 26 22:54:09 If your baby bursts, remember to submit a bug. Sep 26 22:54:23 SpeedEvil: ? Sep 26 22:55:23 pupnik: google says no :/ Sep 26 22:57:02 Overfeeding Sep 26 22:58:07 route -n|grep 10.0.0.2|awk '{print $1}' |xargs -n 1 route del Sep 26 22:58:09 argh Sep 26 22:58:18 I should open eyes before hitting return. Sep 26 22:58:20 xargs: command not found Sep 26 22:59:02 pupnik: found that when googling for the pulseaudio principle developer(s) - http://colin.guthr.ie/2010/02/this-is-the-route-to-hell/ Sep 26 22:59:34 oh pupnik you got a meego device? Sep 26 22:59:45 There are no meego devices. Sep 26 22:59:51 There are devices that can run meego. Sep 26 22:59:58 There is as yet no native meego device. Sep 26 23:00:20 heh ok im just wondering since he said his n900 died... :) Sep 26 23:00:40 or shall i say :( Sep 26 23:00:49 pupnik: :( Sep 26 23:00:50 SpeedEvil: Aava Sep 26 23:00:59 javispedro: Bless you. Sep 26 23:01:00 i love the way the n8 and leaked prototypes look. the lust-force is strong with this one Sep 26 23:01:27 SpeedEvil: … who weighs the baby every feeding? Sep 26 23:01:47 luke-jr: I assumed that was the sort of thing you were looking for. Sep 26 23:01:55 SpeedEvil: hehe Sep 26 23:02:01 can't you install a baby stomach reserve meter that rings the low-battery bell when it's hungry? Sep 26 23:02:01 * sivang rotfls Sep 26 23:02:03 It's the only thing that comes to mind, anyway. Sep 26 23:02:13 pupnik: I want that. Sep 26 23:02:19 pupnik: Well - a similar device. Sep 26 23:02:28 pupnik: But transcutaneous glucometry is hard. Sep 26 23:02:32 maybe an insulin alarm Sep 26 23:02:34 ah Sep 26 23:02:35 haha pupnik Sep 26 23:02:57 I don't have diabetes - I'd just like to keep my blood-glucose a bit more stable than it is at times. Sep 26 23:03:00 bluteooth -- why not nox? Sep 26 23:03:08 SpeedEvil: you have a baby? Sep 26 23:03:17 pupnik: your n900 broke down? :( Sep 26 23:03:26 .oO(we are borg, you will be assimilated...) Sep 26 23:03:28 yeah few months ago Sep 26 23:03:29 :) Sep 26 23:03:32 sivang: Unfortunately, barring really wierd ninjas, no. Sep 26 23:03:52 SpeedEvil: so what's all of that feeding talk? Sep 26 23:03:56 * sivang wants in the joke Sep 26 23:04:10 sivang: need a useful app to track baby feeding Sep 26 23:04:17 luke-jr__: ah, nice Sep 26 23:04:24 ideally in tonal tims Sep 26 23:04:25 <.< Sep 26 23:04:27 you know what i should do - these orphans, javispedro - the crude games that need the simple gui work to make them fun Sep 26 23:04:59 luke-jr: you mean you just want to set a ml/day - and total it? Does DLH actually require daily weights? Sep 26 23:05:00 particularly ones with no upstream updates :) Sep 26 23:05:18 luke-jr: I am unsure if 'siggy' - a budget tracking app - can do that. Sep 26 23:05:19 SpeedEvil: start time, end time, ml made, ml consumed, totals Sep 26 23:05:24 ah - it can't Sep 26 23:05:32 SpeedEvil: it doesn't seem to REQUIRE weight… Sep 26 23:05:39 but it doesn't hide it etiher Sep 26 23:05:44 which means I need to horizontal scroll Sep 26 23:05:50 ml made? Sep 26 23:05:54 well Sep 26 23:05:56 oz made Sep 26 23:05:58 babies are hard to maintain Sep 26 23:06:00 why would you keep track of that? Sep 26 23:06:04 who uses ml? Sep 26 23:06:05 and they don't come with manuals Sep 26 23:06:18 luke-jr: I use ml/g exclusively when cooking. Sep 26 23:06:28 luke-jr: I have a 0.1g/1000g scale I use. Sep 26 23:06:37 so sdk installer hangs, and "Executer accepted request to abort" but is lying Sep 26 23:06:44 (it boots faster than my regular kitrchen scale) Sep 26 23:06:56 SpeedEvil: bottles are proof SI is broken IMO Sep 26 23:07:19 SpeedEvil: for cooking? wawo, I just pour indgridants according to "eye" measure Sep 26 23:07:22 measurements are always done in 10 ml. Tell me why they're not using cl? Sep 26 23:07:42 and in the rare exceptions, they always use x5 ml Sep 26 23:07:44 sivang: I'm also trying to accurately ytack calorie intake - for diet purposes. Sep 26 23:07:51 never x1,x2,x3,x4,x6,x7,x8,x9 Sep 26 23:07:58 sivang: Though I do find the .1g handy for consistrent spicing. Sep 26 23:08:15 luke-jr: you forgot 454ml and stuff. Sep 26 23:08:15 SpeedEvil: maybe if you are dealing with very dominant spices Sep 26 23:08:25 SpeedEvil: never seen that used for bottles Sep 26 23:08:33 luke-jr: imperial equivalents. Sep 26 23:08:38 SpeedEvil: for diet it makes sense , if you manage do , drop a line Sep 26 23:08:42 Maybe they've gone hard-metric now. Sep 26 23:08:58 SpeedEvil: no, bottles are generally measured in oz Sep 26 23:09:02 sivang: http://www.livestrong.com/myplate/ - a sucky web 2.0 site - but it is helpful. Sep 26 23:09:06 the ones I have with ml only have multiples of 10 Sep 26 23:09:18 pupnik: yeah. they're also often the funniest ones Sep 26 23:09:28 http://qkwv.com/weight.gif - my weight over the past 12mo ish. Sep 26 23:09:29 :) Sep 26 23:09:36 pupnik: btw I missed what happened to your n900 (or I forgot :P) Sep 26 23:09:57 some water splashed on the keyboard and apparently crept-in unnoticed Sep 26 23:10:12 oh. Sep 26 23:10:15 or un-prevented Sep 26 23:10:25 at that point the speakers were already dying though Sep 26 23:10:27 :) Sep 26 23:10:31 SpeedEvil: nice Sep 26 23:10:34 and the keyboard was worn-through :D Sep 26 23:10:35 SpeedEvil: more useless units? Sep 26 23:10:50 SpeedEvil: how tall are you? Sep 26 23:11:19 sivang: Nothing really complex, just portion control, and thinking a bit more about what I actually like to eat vs what I do. For example, I used to have a big bowl of cereal for breakfast. I actually prefer what I'm currently having - which is date porridge. Sep 26 23:11:23 pupnik: :( Sep 26 23:11:35 I had to rma mine once because of a broken speaker Sep 26 23:11:41 luke-jr: BMI is somewhat odd yes. Sep 26 23:11:59 SpeedEvil: Kg Sep 26 23:12:11 SpeedEvil: nobody knows what Kg actually means Sep 26 23:12:19 sivang: Throw oats, milk, dates in a small glass bowl onto the way to the toilet, hit nuke for 3 mins, and it's lovely and hot when I'm done. Sep 26 23:12:20 SpeedEvil: I'm 32 at my BMI last time I checked, and strictly speaking it is obeys Sep 26 23:12:22 gotta go google it and find out what it is in lbs Sep 26 23:12:28 luke-jr: I measure everything in kg. Sep 26 23:12:35 javispedro: it's a very good thing i didn't release anything that bypassed XPROT Sep 26 23:12:51 pupnik: yeah, being more careful now Sep 26 23:12:57 SpeedEvil: in any case, what's your weight in normal lbs? Sep 26 23:13:13 pupnik: even though I have to wonder if "sudden mute speaker syndrome" is really caused by that Sep 26 23:13:14 !math 2.2*77.5 Sep 26 23:13:20 lbs just sounds like blubber when you speak it out Sep 26 23:13:23 SpeedEvil: I reduced to 2 meals per day, mostly, almost no carbs, no milk, mostly lean protein and meat occasionally but it is slow... Sep 26 23:13:27 170lb Sep 26 23:13:31 sivang: I diddn't. Sep 26 23:13:34 fatty. :P Sep 26 23:13:56 sivang: The early portion of that graph - when I was losing 1Kg/week - 10% of my calories was coming from chocolate. Sep 26 23:14:04 LOL Sep 26 23:14:05 Because I like chocolate. Sep 26 23:14:13 maybe I should eat some chocolate Sep 26 23:14:26 I weigh 100-110 lbs Sep 26 23:14:30 SpeedEvil: well, it also has lots of sugar which can contribute to calorie burning, but so is coffee and I drink a lot of it Sep 26 23:14:34 95 if I get lazy Sep 26 23:14:38 luke-jr: A whole lot less than I did. Sep 26 23:14:59 javispedro: is there anything interesting you are doing with performance / libs / emus / gfx? Sep 26 23:15:02 luke-jr: I'm aiming at maybe 10lb down from where I am now, but it's not urgent. Sep 26 23:15:20 SpeedEvil: the problem with the sugar in modern chocholate is that it strains your pancreas and that's not good. Sep 26 23:15:20 SpeedEvil: I'm convinced that no matter what my intake is, I won't break 110 Sep 26 23:15:41 luke-jr__: some people are blessed genetically Sep 26 23:15:52 * sivang is amazed at how cool it is to be offtopic here. Sep 26 23:16:23 luke-jr: I bet that is not the case. Sep 26 23:16:25 pupnik: no, nothing at the moment. on tmo someone is porting gbSP Sep 26 23:16:32 * SpeedEvil feeds luke-jr 800 sticks of butter. Sep 26 23:16:43 SpeedEvil: 110 was with me making active efforts to gain weight Sep 26 23:16:55 luke-jr: are you very active? Sep 26 23:16:59 nope Sep 26 23:17:21 sivang: yeah - well - eaten in moderation, nothing is bad. Sep 26 23:17:29 luke-jr, don't worry. in another couple years your metabolism will take a nose dive and you'll gain 30lbs overnight right around your middle :P Sep 26 23:17:39 LOL Sep 26 23:17:41 probably Sep 26 23:17:54 SpeedEvil: that's what I'm doing right now. I had a bad period after my ex left but now I'm really cutting down on the amount Sep 26 23:18:02 javispedro: could a texel/surface shader be applied to the entire maemo5 desktop Sep 26 23:18:25 pupnik: that is already done by hildon-desktop (it's the "blur effect") Sep 26 23:18:37 so yes, but you have to patch hildon-desktop Sep 26 23:18:43 ok can you trigger it.. aarrrrrr Sep 26 23:18:53 johnx: yes, that is something people do not understand- time passes by we have to prepare for when things change and break over time, and as one of my physicians once said "They will break!" Sep 26 23:19:00 SpeedEvil: even iocane powder? Sep 26 23:19:06 i wanted an accelerometer thing that blurred and sharpened tablet depending on how far away you hold it Sep 26 23:19:53 sivang, the other thing people don't understand is how much harder it is to lose / gain weight depending on your life-style and what kind of food is available around you Sep 26 23:20:30 johnx: especially to loose, I gained the weight quite easily :-( Sep 26 23:20:33 I was 30lbs less a bit over a year ago when I had no car and was trying to save money on food ;) Sep 26 23:20:38 sivang: I found the above website of use anyway. I basically haven't gone for diet food route, but portion control. For example, roast pork, potatos, apple-sauce with nice gravy. Is lots nicer than a couple of bowls of no-sugar muesli. Sep 26 23:21:02 SpeedEvil1: I hate muesly :-) Sep 26 23:21:05 * johnx actually likes museli and yogurt Sep 26 23:21:06 SpeedEvil1: it is terrible Sep 26 23:21:21 johnx: I used to like Yogurt until I realized milk so somewhat evil ;) Sep 26 23:21:46 SpeedEvil: but true, it is impractical to try and eat what you won't as yourself, that's why people fail at diests all the time Sep 26 23:21:47 vegetarian here, so I need the protein/calcium from it anyways Sep 26 23:22:06 johnx: it just makes me unwell, others are fine with :) Sep 26 23:22:45 ah, bummer Sep 26 23:22:45 you carry more bacteria in your gut than human cells in your body Sep 26 23:23:01 * luke-jr__ eats some extra meat to make up for sivang Sep 26 23:23:08 pupnik: and more nerves in your brain :) Sep 26 23:23:10 luke-jr, wrong nick :) Sep 26 23:23:14 luke-jr__: hheh Sep 26 23:23:23 oops Sep 26 23:23:27 does'nt matter really tho Sep 26 23:23:29 :p Sep 26 23:23:29 pupnik: than in your brain :) Sep 26 23:23:36 luke-jr: that's an awesome idea. Adopt a vegan. Sep 26 23:23:41 SpeedEvil: LOL Sep 26 23:23:49 Give them a list of the extra meat you've eaten for them. Sep 26 23:23:59 my vegan friends at work claim they get everything from plants Sep 26 23:24:04 luke-jr, doesn't matter anyways. It's a proof of concept. BTW, I'll make sure to use more proprietary software to make up for you :> Sep 26 23:24:05 johnx: I am now eating chicken tenders for you. Sep 26 23:24:06 so they don't touch eggs or milk Sep 26 23:24:19 luke-jr, using vmware right now :D Sep 26 23:24:19 johnx: go ahead, your loss :D Sep 26 23:24:29 today, a little bird fell down into a sticky mouse trap. as i tried to pull its legs off i broke them. Sep 26 23:24:35 gotta get sleep Sep 26 23:24:42 and usb networking was no go today as well :/ Sep 26 23:24:43 good night sivang Sep 26 23:24:45 pupnik: feed it to johnx Sep 26 23:24:47 night pupnik Sep 26 23:24:54 (-all) Sep 26 23:25:09 'night pupnik Sep 26 23:25:16 lol Sep 26 23:25:18 \ Sep 26 23:26:08 what options are there to do an OSM style FOSS 'mobile craigslist'? Sep 26 23:26:38 mobile craigslist? like searchable my lat/lon? Sep 26 23:26:55 yeah, and very convenient to add items with photo Sep 26 23:27:25 no name needed - just ping the userid hash if you want to arrange a negotiation/purchase Sep 26 23:27:31 "send to ..." "moblist" Sep 26 23:28:53 data structures ... key by lat/lon stored in a BSP tree? Sep 26 23:29:28 BSP tree? Sep 26 23:29:41 binary space partition Sep 26 23:29:46 don't really think that needs to be over-engineered Sep 26 23:29:59 what about like an RSS feed or something? Sep 26 23:31:07 i am in the habit of finding the potentially sticky data structure questions early-on Sep 26 23:31:37 rss feed doesn't address my questions about how to partition and access the information Sep 26 23:32:13 i guess any simple database Sep 26 23:32:28 err, partition? Sep 26 23:32:54 I kinda figure there was a PHP server side bit that you queried with a URL and got back an RSS feed that matched what you wanted? Sep 26 23:33:03 or is the idea to be some kind of peer-to-peer thing? Sep 26 23:33:05 neat Sep 26 23:33:34 if you work with that kind of data just use postgresql or any database GIS extensions Sep 26 23:33:34 yuuupy, fresh reflashed n900;) Sep 26 23:33:41 been writing some PHP/mysql stuff lately. "when you have a hammer, everything looks like a nail" Sep 26 23:33:48 well it goes to show how weirdly i think about things in the first few minubtes johnx Sep 26 23:33:53 thanks Sep 26 23:33:56 because then you can do area searches and it's probably better optimized than any homegrown system Sep 26 23:34:24 "database GIS extensions" as in stuff at the SQL level? Sep 26 23:34:38 look up PostGIS for example Sep 26 23:34:49 * johnx RTFMs Sep 26 23:34:58 basically it includes data types and query extensions useful for geospatial data Sep 26 23:35:03 thanks jarkkom Sep 26 23:35:15 thanks jarkkom Sep 26 23:35:24 we should have been using this at work for the last year ... Sep 26 23:35:27 maybe this makes more sense as a 'web app' Sep 26 23:35:40 or a simple website with a post form for the image upload Sep 26 23:36:04 pupnik, web app + native client Sep 26 23:36:08 always a good approach Sep 26 23:36:26 wider audience is necessary for this kind of thing Sep 26 23:36:40 what about a serverless design Sep 26 23:36:57 download the app and enter your forsale items Sep 26 23:37:12 would you PUSH data to other peers? Sep 26 23:37:39 you could look for peers physically nearby with wifi or bluetooth Sep 26 23:37:56 'i also have item for sale' Sep 26 23:38:03 it feels like something like that should sit one level down Sep 26 23:38:26 like some kind of library for finding other devices locally and querying $something Sep 26 23:38:52 something that lets you broadcast a service type Sep 26 23:39:18 or advertise rather Sep 26 23:39:40 "hi! i belong to tux-swingers! ask me about my wife!" Sep 26 23:39:46 so would that be listening servers and a broadcast query Sep 26 23:39:56 or periodic broadcast advertise? Sep 26 23:40:36 could abuse the essid to advertise a service type or multiple ones Sep 26 23:41:00 wifi ad-hoc? Sep 26 23:41:05 sure Sep 26 23:41:05 that's not very power friendly Sep 26 23:41:26 also interferes with a connection to a base-station Sep 26 23:41:26 ah Sep 26 23:41:32 true Sep 26 23:42:00 Also. Sep 26 23:42:01 i just have this image of broadcast/discover with a decentralized, no-administration, network Sep 26 23:42:12 Unless you have a very high density of users, p2p does not work Sep 26 23:42:19 yes Sep 26 23:42:19 SpeedEvil++ Sep 26 23:42:31 it would work really well at a meego convention though ;) Sep 26 23:45:21 and when you have a very high density of users, p2p doesn't scale well =) Sep 26 23:46:04 pupnik, I think there are two ideas here: 1) a more location aware craigslist 2) a way to locate other mobile phones that are just beyond visual range in an urban/indoor environment Sep 26 23:46:41 yes good point Sep 26 23:47:14 2) locate users with other mobile phones who are making some kind of offer related to physical proximmity Sep 26 23:47:18 For BVR use, I don't think bluetooth quite cuts it. Sep 26 23:47:50 slashvertisement: http://miraveo.com/ Sep 26 23:48:03 and countless other companies that want to do similar things Sep 26 23:48:35 also reminds me of the link-local jabber thing Sep 26 23:48:40 does that actually work, BTW? Sep 26 23:48:42 that's something that looks quite well on powerpoints but I will personally never understand it Sep 26 23:48:44 http://www.grindr.com/Grindr_iPhone_App/Grindr_-Meet_Guys_Near_You_on_your_iPhone.html# got mentioned by Steven Fry on last weeks Top Gear. Sep 26 23:59:43 "Grinder - Meet Guys Near You"??? Sep 27 00:00:02 welcome to the future Sep 27 00:01:19 pupnik: I saw it on Top Gear. Sep 27 00:01:37 * SpeedEvil is not interested in guys that way. :) Sep 27 00:03:20 well that's pretty much the type of thing we'll see more i guess Sep 27 00:03:47 right, so I can let if off ;) Sep 27 00:04:01 whats' the normal stock free space on rootfs? Sep 27 00:04:09 ~80M Sep 27 00:04:12 IIRC Sep 27 00:04:15 hmm Sep 27 00:04:24 I'm at 2.6M Sep 27 00:04:34 That's a bit low. Sep 27 00:04:43 Do you have gnu find installed? Sep 27 00:04:49 I do now, yes Sep 27 00:04:59 gfind / -size +100k -ctime -10 Sep 27 00:05:20 Wil tell you what files over 100K have been touched in the last 10 days. Sep 27 00:05:22 SpeedEvil: ah, I thought finding +2M is good enough Sep 27 00:05:23 err Sep 27 00:05:26 gfind / -mount Sep 27 00:05:37 or that Sep 27 00:05:42 SpeedEvil: right, I already added this to not wait forever Sep 27 00:06:42 http://paste.pocoo.org/show/267794/ Sep 27 00:06:50 gdu -x /|sort -nk1 Sep 27 00:06:51 also Sep 27 00:07:04 I thought apt-get clean would have cleared all the dpkg cruft Sep 27 00:07:43 SpeedEvil: hmm, no gdu Sep 27 00:08:03 the busybox du does not support -x alas Sep 27 00:08:11 - stay in one filesystem Sep 27 00:08:28 i'll install it, just a ec Sep 27 00:08:31 Actrually - it does Sep 27 00:08:41 so just du -x|sort -nk1 Sep 27 00:08:47 I wish it had maxdepth Sep 27 00:09:14 that's why sort is handy Sep 27 00:10:02 yes, it is Sep 27 00:12:27 I wish HAM would allow to mark more than one app for removal Sep 27 00:12:41 SpeedEvil: it is possible to reflash the whole device? I want to learn to do that. Sep 27 00:12:45 SpeedEvil: including the eMMC Sep 27 00:12:54 ~flashing Sep 27 00:12:54 methinks flashing is http://wiki.maemo.org/Updating_the_tablet_firmware Sep 27 00:12:55 ~flashing Sep 27 00:12:58 SpeedEvil: even though the tool is not open source Sep 27 00:12:59 hah, too late! Sep 27 00:13:03 haha Sep 27 00:13:04 thanks guys Sep 27 00:13:39 yup, javispedro. infobot PMed me to tell me I was too late actually :) Sep 27 00:13:47 ~botsnack Sep 27 00:13:47 :), javispedro Sep 27 00:13:48 it does that?! Sep 27 00:13:53 like a female, indeed. Sep 27 00:14:24 "Too late, scare off me!" Sep 27 00:17:46 * sivang did not mean to be unpolitically correct. Sep 27 00:18:35 or politically incorrect? Sep 27 00:18:49 "sivang: you seem to have some misconceptions about those 'females'. Maybe you'd like to try the previously mentioned iphone application?" Sep 27 00:19:01 * sivang apologizes to the ladies, I guess one very neat death experience cant count for all 'em Sep 27 00:19:17 :P Sep 27 00:19:18 javispedro: remind me of it? Sep 27 00:19:31 javispedro: I was fighting with splunk and rsyslog when you guys discussed it Sep 27 00:19:39 sivang nearly killed a lady ? :/ Sep 27 00:19:40 javispedro: heh Sep 27 00:19:49 javispedro: other way around, Sep 27 00:19:51 err Sep 27 00:19:55 jpinx-eeepc: she always made me die Sep 27 00:20:08 jpinx-eeepc: in a non physically violent way Sep 27 00:20:20 she's married with children now, so all is good :) Sep 27 00:20:37 why do themes get stored to rootfs?! Sep 27 00:20:38 consider yourself reprieved ;) Sep 27 00:20:53 sivang, where on the rootfs? Sep 27 00:21:22 err, I just rmeoved it.. let me backlog the terminal Sep 27 00:22:55 johnx: http://paste.pocoo.org/show/267798/ Sep 27 00:23:06 sugarlips? Sep 27 00:23:56 sivang, ls -ld /usr/share/themes Sep 27 00:23:59 ivisteel was there as well Sep 27 00:24:08 and I wiped it and earned a lot back Sep 27 00:25:36 johnx: http://paste.pocoo.org/show/267798/ Sep 27 00:26:09 sivang, kthx. I got it. now run the command I gave you Sep 27 00:26:59 johnx: oops repeated last paste, stupid buffer Sep 27 00:27:14 you don't need to paste the result, just read it Sep 27 00:27:19 I already know what the answer is Sep 27 00:27:26 johnx: 672 Sep 27 00:27:35 johnx: what does all this mean? Sep 27 00:27:51 symlink/hardlink? Sep 27 00:28:22 where the heck did you get 672? Sep 27 00:29:50 that's the size... Sep 27 00:30:28 if you were to run the command I gave you, you'd realize it was a symlink to /opt, ie, not on the rootfs Sep 27 00:30:57 johnx: http://paste.pocoo.org/show/267800/ Sep 27 00:31:20 now see, that's *not* the command I gave Sep 27 00:31:30 the trailing '/' makes a difference Sep 27 00:31:39 ah.. Sep 27 00:31:43 bad bad me Sep 27 00:31:48 :) no problem Sep 27 00:31:55 I thought you were being difficult on purpose Sep 27 00:32:00 nono Sep 27 00:32:20 sorry :/ /me retries Sep 27 00:32:50 sorry to be stubborn, but I'd much rather hand out the tools than the results ;) Sep 27 00:33:30 http://paste.pocoo.org/show/267802/ Sep 27 00:33:43 well that's special Sep 27 00:33:47 are you on PR1.2? Sep 27 00:33:58 no, I am trying to delete stuff to be able to go there :) Sep 27 00:34:20 there are some stuff on /opt/themes though Sep 27 00:34:25 interesting Sep 27 00:34:29 I guess thopse were properly optified Sep 27 00:34:36 in contrast to stock stuff Sep 27 00:35:00 sorry for being stubborn earlier :) Sep 27 00:35:01 what'\s more interesting is that space in rootfs goes a bit up, then down again and up to the same size Sep 27 00:35:07 thorugh apt operations Sep 27 00:35:09 (removal) Sep 27 00:35:34 if you use apt-get from the CLI a lot, remember to use apt-get clean Sep 27 00:35:51 johnx: do it al the time, maybe it is writeback'd ? Sep 27 00:35:53 it only applies to packages you've installed, but it can make a big difference Sep 27 00:37:13 I see, btw, anything I could get rid off fire and forget way from this: http://paste.pocoo.org/show/267803/ Sep 27 00:37:37 nope Sep 27 00:37:56 are those your biggest files? Sep 27 00:38:03 well, you could apt-get remove rsync Sep 27 00:38:38 yes, but I need it to back up the rootfs and eMMC before reflashing.., what about the .bin cache files from apt? Sep 27 00:38:47 and the the ipyhon is obvious Sep 27 00:39:01 johnx: seems like it (biggest files) Sep 27 00:39:03 the apt files will just get remade when you try to upgrade Sep 27 00:40:47 how is the one stock theme called? Sep 27 00:40:52 I want to remove everything else Sep 27 00:41:04 there are two stock themes, I think Sep 27 00:41:20 just use dpkg -S /path/to/theme Sep 27 00:41:26 should tell you which package owns it Sep 27 00:41:46 I just ended up backing up and reflashing Sep 27 00:41:51 seemed to work out ok for me Sep 27 00:44:22 I'll do that and that's it I guess... Sep 27 00:44:45 nice, ipython removed but all its file are there- shouldn't havenever installed something liekthat onto the tablet Sep 27 00:45:05 use dpkg -S on the files Sep 27 00:45:12 maybe they're owned by a related package Sep 27 00:46:02 johnx: will do Sep 27 00:46:46 johnx: I'm getting addicted to this platform- the more I twiddle with it, the more fascinating it gets. Sep 27 00:47:05 it'll be even nicer in meego I think Sep 27 00:47:16 should be a bit closer to a 'regular' linux distro Sep 27 00:50:46 meego doesnt use apt tho, right? Sep 27 00:51:14 it uses yum Sep 27 00:51:32 I've resolved to give it a fair chance Sep 27 00:51:35 johnx: yes, that what I liked in it the first place. It is my phone, but actually is a debian on the go Sep 27 00:51:57 there's is no much point in favoring one packaging scheme to another these Sep 27 00:51:59 days Sep 27 00:52:05 yum is quite usable for experience Sep 27 00:52:19 and caters for an apt experience on centos and fedoras Sep 27 00:52:24 for me at leas, Sep 27 00:52:28 yup, if I didn't give it a fair chance, it would just be me being lazy Sep 27 00:55:01 I don't get what's more eating the space on rootfs Sep 27 00:55:25 anyway, really time to sleeping- I've past my daylight zone Sep 27 00:55:29 almost Sep 27 00:55:32 night all, again Sep 27 00:55:45 'night sivang Sep 27 00:56:01 night johnx , thanks so much for you help. Sep 27 00:56:11 no problem. good luck :) Sep 27 00:56:32 will need it ,thanks Sep 27 00:57:36 johnx, http://d.hatena.ne.jp/bird_dip_jp/20100518 - it'd be awesome to get this going on the N900 :) Sep 27 00:58:02 netbsd? Sep 27 00:58:19 yeah Sep 27 00:58:33 it would be an interesting experiment Sep 27 00:58:37 * SpeedEvil ponders the app he most wants on n900. Sep 27 00:58:37 it would Sep 27 00:59:04 God continuous speech recognition is high on there. Sep 27 00:59:06 good Sep 27 01:00:19 b-man`, at this point, I don't think I could even offer you many hints on where to start that you don't already know :D Sep 27 01:00:48 .oO(why do .jp sites always(?) use strange fonts...) Sep 27 01:00:54 hehe Sep 27 01:01:34 nox-, so your question is "Why do Japanese sites use Japanese fonts?" Sep 27 01:01:45 nox-: Because they're lazy, and won't learn english. Sep 27 01:01:47 nah i meant for english text Sep 27 01:01:56 the fonts look normal here Sep 27 01:01:59 I think it's your config Sep 27 01:02:21 well the spacing is pretty wide Sep 27 01:02:49 yeah, that's because they're using the latin part of a japanese font Sep 27 01:03:09 ah :) Sep 27 01:03:28 though, I don't see it on the site that was linked, so I think it's a problem with the font your browser is choosing Sep 27 01:03:37 heh ok Sep 27 01:03:55 I do remember seeing it in the past though Sep 27 01:04:01 maybe i need to install more japanese fonts then :) Sep 27 01:04:06 The font is not terrible here, it's not great thoguh. Sep 27 01:05:06 yeah it just looks like monospace with wide spacing Sep 27 01:12:09 pupnik, still thinking about that mobile craigslist thing. were you thinking about it in passing, or were you planning to actually make it? Sep 27 01:19:49 Ebay and craigslist and amazon have fundamental problems with being functional monopolies. Sep 27 01:19:57 It's damn hard. Sep 27 01:20:51 To break into an established market Sep 27 01:23:37 yeah Sep 27 01:23:52 I don't have a problem working with craigslist, but they don't have an API Sep 27 01:24:07 and I've heard they purposefully make changes to keep people from scraping their site Sep 27 01:41:31 mobile craigslist? Sep 27 01:41:52 doc|home, something like that Sep 27 01:42:11 how does that work? Sep 27 01:42:37 mainly thinking about ways to get better location data into craigslist postings Sep 27 01:42:55 and then act on that data to return better results to the person searching Sep 27 01:43:05 johnx: no, Unicode annoyingly defines separate codepoints to wide Latin chars Sep 27 01:43:13 which are often used in Japanese software Sep 27 01:43:23 such as input systems Sep 27 01:43:27 johnx: is accuracy of location really that important? Generally if it's in the same city most people are happy. Sep 27 01:44:07 doc|home, kinda. I'm willing to drive 5mi to save $30, but I'm not willing to drive 50mi Sep 27 01:44:41 seattle.craigslist.org covers an area centered around seattle that extends 50mi+ in all directions Sep 27 01:44:46 fair enough then Sep 27 01:45:28 and maybe I'd like to pic up something really common on the way home from work, but if there isn't one near me I'd rather buy it new than drive too far from it Sep 27 01:45:38 s/from it/for it Sep 27 01:47:02 Craigslist is basically fail in my part of the world. Sep 27 01:47:21 SpeedEvil, is there a regional site that works better? Sep 27 01:47:34 no. Sep 27 01:47:40 then give it time Sep 27 01:48:05 For example - the largest nearby town - 140k population. Sep 27 01:48:10 Category 'appliances' Sep 27 01:48:17 There are two listed. Sep 27 01:49:06 maybe people are very fond of their older style appliances :) Sep 27 01:49:31 is there a good market for used appliances? Sep 27 01:49:48 it's also possible that 'appliances' just isn't something people sell used to each other all that often Sep 27 01:51:31 try 'refrigerator' Sep 27 01:51:33 :p Sep 27 01:51:47 Though really, hitting critical mass for something like a classified site takes a long time Sep 27 01:52:11 Appliances for example with a 25 mile range has 130 hits on ebay Sep 27 01:53:23 ah, then ebay is just more popular in your area Sep 27 01:53:33 do you think it has to do with localization? Sep 27 01:53:47 I think it has to do with pizza. Sep 27 01:53:49 kthx Sep 27 01:55:14 craigslist was basically US only for a long time Sep 27 01:55:42 even now, it seems like (for example) tokyo.craigslist.org is mostly used by English speakers Sep 27 01:55:48 and none of the interface is localized Sep 27 01:55:58 that's a really unfortunate omission, IMHO Sep 27 01:56:18 It's not a localisation issue. Sep 27 01:56:28 In scotland, we can mostly understand americans. Sep 27 01:56:48 I didn't know where you were :) Sep 27 01:57:57 SpeedEvil: ya reckon? Sep 27 02:00:14 The words at least. :) Sep 27 02:28:10 nox-: Because they're lazy, and won't learn english. <- unfortunately it is the opposite: computer scientists dont seem to learn something else than *"%&&/(*! english Sep 27 02:30:42 andax, nah. lot's learn C and Python and Scheme and Java, not just English Sep 27 02:32:03 :) Sep 27 02:32:51 andax: Also - you forgot the closing bracket and quote. Sep 27 02:33:00 :) Sep 27 02:33:18 i learned some C too, because it seems there is no other language that works, which doesnt change the fact that some lines of the language looks like ASCII-vomitus :-) Sep 27 02:33:41 )" Sep 27 02:37:05 C isn't bad Sep 27 02:37:22 other languages are way worse Sep 27 02:37:44 thats true Sep 27 02:40:12 and C is somehow "lingua franca" of IT: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lingua_franca Sep 27 02:40:24 with no replacement at my knowledge Sep 27 02:41:01 many languages like python, java, perl et cetera borrowed stuff from C and its predecessors Sep 27 02:48:48 though, i believe C could be much nicer with more different characters than ASCII characters in its ontology and nomenclature. Sep 27 02:49:15 * pupnik slingshots andax back to neptune Sep 27 02:50:15 So that it could be called Überlanguage *g* Sep 27 02:50:46 26 letters ought to be enough for anyone Sep 27 02:50:58 serial > parallel Sep 27 02:52:39 johnx, but only because keyboards have to be tiny today :-) Sep 27 02:53:44 is this more to your liking? http://www.thocp.net/hardware/pictures/ibm_7090_console_med.jpg Sep 27 02:57:28 johnx, pretty cool, blinking lights support was even better at that times :) Sep 27 02:57:42 and quite portable too! :D Sep 27 02:57:44 johnx, i like that one as well http://sprott.physics.wisc.edu/Pickover/pc/moogrc1.jpg Sep 27 02:58:18 looks like my car's electrical system Sep 27 02:58:30 except smaller keyboard ... **** ENDING LOGGING AT Mon Sep 27 02:59:57 2010