**** BEGIN LOGGING AT Sat Nov 06 02:59:57 2010
Nov 06 03:02:40 <DocScrutinizer> lcuk: ???
Nov 06 03:03:33 <pupnik> why do you people care about maemo
Nov 06 03:03:41 <pupnik> i always wonder about that
Nov 06 03:04:37 <pupnik> maybe you're just scared to think about *why*
Nov 06 03:04:51 <DocScrutinizer> there's quite a number of other things I wonder more about
Nov 06 03:05:20 <pupnik> assholes having control over your computer system?
Nov 06 03:05:46 <pupnik> please share
Nov 06 03:06:09 <DocScrutinizer> ok, you asked for it
Nov 06 03:06:48 <javispedro> ah, the happy hour!
Nov 06 03:07:28 <DocScrutinizer> e.g.: "is there a sure ndicator when pupnik goes philosophical again?" or "why is such a number of people hyping meego, while it's evidently not much more than a POC ATM?"
Nov 06 03:09:41 <DocScrutinizer> for the meego part I feel it resembles a herd that always runs after the lead and gets nervous when there's no movement
Nov 06 03:11:21 <DocScrutinizer> no matter how green the grass were the whole bunch is now - following the leader to somewhere else is just a better feeling than simply staying and pasture
Nov 06 03:12:38 <pupnik> hmm
Nov 06 03:13:21 <pupnik> how does that make an argument for other people controlling my computer?
Nov 06 03:13:50 <DocScrutinizer> who gives a shit about your computer?
Nov 06 03:14:04 <pupnik> the people who want to steal my shit
Nov 06 03:14:14 <lcuk> toilet gnomes?
Nov 06 03:14:24 <pupnik> fucktards lcuk
Nov 06 03:14:32 <pupnik> you're on the borderline of being one
Nov 06 03:14:33 <DocScrutinizer> silicon gremlins
Nov 06 03:14:59 <lcuk> pupnik, bah
Nov 06 03:15:26 <lcuk> DocScrutinizer, a flashing mode that occurs when you first plug in usb
Nov 06 03:15:32 <lcuk> that does something different to normal
Nov 06 03:15:51 <DocScrutinizer> o.O never heard of it
Nov 06 03:15:58 <lcuk> it was you that posted it
Nov 06 03:16:11 <lcuk> you silenced some maemo person from talking whilst it was explained
Nov 06 03:16:12 <DocScrutinizer> sorry, don't get it
Nov 06 03:16:32 <DocScrutinizer> duh, you mean coldflashing xloader/NOLO
Nov 06 03:16:45 <lcuk> i don't know, do i?
Nov 06 03:16:53 <lcuk> post link and I will tell you :P
Nov 06 03:17:18 <DocScrutinizer> ~coldflash
Nov 06 03:17:18 <infobot> i heard coldflash is http://mg.pov.lt/maemo-irclog/%23maemo.2010-10-31.log.html#t2010-10-31T23:09:54 and next ~200 posts
Nov 06 03:17:53 <lcuk> yes, ta
Nov 06 03:17:57 <DocScrutinizer> yw
Nov 06 03:19:33 <pupnik> time is so short
Nov 06 03:20:28 <DocScrutinizer> lcuk: what you mean is ROM bootloader checking USB on powering up device, prior to NOLO and then normal ass rage driver in maemo
Nov 06 03:21:44 <lcuk> bah, swearing detracts fro mthe message of that DocScrutinizer.
Nov 06 03:21:58 <DocScrutinizer> each of them is listening if somebody calls its name, and jumps in if so. Otherwise hands over to next stage (unless NOLO and 'U', or ass rage which obviously has nobody to hand over)
Nov 06 03:22:12 <lcuk> am I right in thinking that with the command line given it will allow complete replacement of the noko and everything?
Nov 06 03:22:22 <DocScrutinizer> yes
Nov 06 03:22:58 <lcuk> though, normally we don't ever touch the nolo and don't need to?
Nov 06 03:23:06 <DocScrutinizer> yes
Nov 06 03:23:13 <lcuk> the maemo images flashed don't replace it each time? right
Nov 06 03:23:20 <DocScrutinizer> dunno
Nov 06 03:23:27 <DocScrutinizer> they might
Nov 06 03:23:31 <lcuk> would the nolo portion be where a real final solid multiboot would sit?
Nov 06 03:23:50 <DocScrutinizer> should, if ever Nokia cared to open up
Nov 06 03:24:14 <lcuk> hm - you mean the spec of how its used currently?
Nov 06 03:24:28 <lcuk> or is there blocking code missing?
Nov 06 03:24:42 <javispedro> nolo is completely undocumented
Nov 06 03:24:54 <DocScrutinizer> yeah, maybe even source. But allegedly NOLO contains IP for dealing with gfx/dunnowhat
Nov 06 03:25:30 <javispedro> lcuk: sts seems to be happy with the current u-boot solution
Nov 06 03:25:31 <DocScrutinizer> undocumented closed blob IP shit PITA blah
Nov 06 03:25:40 <lcuk> ok, so absolute best possible realistically, if anything would be a little documentation?
Nov 06 03:26:40 <DocScrutinizer> sure, and it would need a friggin lot of documentation, as NOLO also does flashing as of what we normaly think it is
Nov 06 03:27:05 <lcuk> right
Nov 06 03:27:13 <DocScrutinizer> and flashing NAND is absolutely nontrivial
Nov 06 03:27:23 <lcuk> so its task is quite indepth and not a simple bootloader stage
Nov 06 03:27:26 <DocScrutinizer> flashing cellmo even worse
Nov 06 03:27:35 <lcuk> rog
Nov 06 03:28:22 <lcuk> hey raster \o
Nov 06 03:28:29 <DocScrutinizer> so uBoot chainloading as of meego is best we'll ever see, realistically
Nov 06 03:28:36 <raster> yo!
Nov 06 03:28:38 <raster> lcuk:  boop
Nov 06 03:28:39 <javispedro> not to mention I personally doubt it has support for loading a kernel image from a mmc card.
Nov 06 03:28:40 <raster> DocScrutinizer:  dook!
Nov 06 03:28:42 <raster> :)
Nov 06 03:29:08 <pupnik> getting FOSS on people's devices isn't just fun, it's a holy calling
Nov 06 03:29:16 <DocScrutinizer> *maybe* just maybe we could move uBoot to NOLO partition, this enabling to flash arbitrary kernels without losing multiboot
Nov 06 03:29:34 <DocScrutinizer> raster: howdy :-)
Nov 06 03:29:59 <lcuk> thats ok DocScrutinizer - its interesting to know anyway
Nov 06 03:30:21 <lcuk> DocScrutinizer, this nolo stage - its not linux oriented in the slightest is it - its OS agnostic
Nov 06 03:30:34 <DocScrutinizer> yes
Nov 06 03:30:50 <DocScrutinizer> you could probably even boot win7moob with it
Nov 06 03:30:56 <javispedro> well..
Nov 06 03:31:02 <javispedro> save for maybe cmdline passing protocol?
Nov 06 03:31:03 <lcuk> do other phones have similar mechanisms?
Nov 06 03:31:08 <DocScrutinizer> yes
Nov 06 03:31:13 <lcuk> i dont see this kind of code being rewritten for each model
Nov 06 03:31:18 <DocScrutinizer> and yes
Nov 06 03:31:52 <DocScrutinizer> NOLO was almost same for N8x0
Nov 06 03:32:14 <javispedro> and I've seen mentions of nolo previously, even on dumb nokia phones
Nov 06 03:32:21 <DocScrutinizer> other phones probably have similar boot mechanisms, just maybe not 3 stages but maybe only 1 or 2
Nov 06 03:32:25 <javispedro> (dunno if its same nolo :) )
Nov 06 03:32:37 <lcuk> probably become generic
Nov 06 03:32:43 <DocScrutinizer> I said *almost*
Nov 06 03:33:11 <lcuk> DocScrutinizer, sure
Nov 06 03:33:34 <DocScrutinizer> anyway, time for breakfast
Nov 06 03:33:51 <DocScrutinizer> means o/
Nov 06 03:33:54 <javispedro> cya
Nov 06 03:34:01 <lcuk> gnite javis
Nov 06 03:34:06 <lcuk> eek
Nov 06 03:34:10 <lcuk> gnite doc even
Nov 06 06:25:35 <andrewfblack> People should be forced to leave a comment on extras when thumb downing a peice of software.  It does no good to thumb down something if you don't tell them whats wrong
Nov 06 06:47:54 <Termana> good morning
Nov 06 06:54:36 <andrewfblack> Termana: morning
Nov 06 06:58:31 <RobbieThe1st> Can anyone tell me -why- maemo has a 8-character limit on passwords?
Nov 06 07:02:33 <ilius> RobbieThe1st: I tested your backup-menu, it was excellent and worked fine :) except few small problems in UI
Nov 06 07:02:54 <RobbieThe1st> Ah, good. Can you please make a post on the forum topic detailing the problems?
Nov 06 07:05:18 <ilius> RobbieThe1st: for example: when choosing "b" (Create a backup) and "t" (both rootfs and optfs) and "s" (SD card) there is a menu contains (m, j and x) and we must press again "s" to do that
Nov 06 07:06:27 <ilius> RobbieThe1st: the last menu (m, j and x) is irreverent and unnecessary
Nov 06 07:07:30 <RobbieThe1st> Um... I may remove it at some point, but it -does- serve a purpose: As specified at the top, the first one is for the Rootfs, the second is for the Optfs. This lets you put, say, your rootfs on your SD card, and your Optfs(which is much larger) on your eMMC
Nov 06 07:07:41 <ilius> *irrelevant
Nov 06 07:08:13 <RobbieThe1st> While I will admit that it's not entirely needed - most of the time people would want it to go to the same place - It is not a mistake or useless.
Nov 06 07:09:16 <ilius> RobbieThe1st: can not backup optfs on sd card?
Nov 06 07:10:09 <RobbieThe1st> No, you can, but the rootfs's ~300mb, while your optfs can be <2GB
Nov 06 07:12:02 <ilius1> RobbieThe1st: but the SD card option does not exist in Destination of OptFS menu
Nov 06 07:12:18 <RobbieThe1st> Really?
Nov 06 07:12:41 <RobbieThe1st> But you saw it in the rootfs menu, correct?
Nov 06 07:13:26 <ilius> RobbieThe1st: no, after that step
Nov 06 07:13:36 <RobbieThe1st> Either way, I found the problem. Thanks.
Nov 06 07:13:59 <ilius> RobbieThe1st: :)
Nov 06 07:18:32 <ilius> RobbieThe1st: is it possible to use ncurses ui? (like debian installer)
Nov 06 07:18:56 <ilius> RobbieThe1st: to use only arrow keys and Space and Enter
Nov 06 07:19:33 <RobbieThe1st> Not really. The problem with the n900 is that there is no Framebuffer by default, so I can't just put text on the screen or use anything directly like that
Nov 06 07:20:00 <RobbieThe1st> The only way to do something like that would be to install a custom Framebuffer kernel. But, this isn't something I expect everyone to do
Nov 06 07:20:53 <RobbieThe1st> Now, arrow keys + enter -are- possible however; I just have to make a bunch of code to "manually" create the menu and update it. But, this is a signifigant amount of extra work, for (not much) gain currently)
Nov 06 07:21:13 <RobbieThe1st> At some point I may... But not right now
Nov 06 07:24:12 <ilius> RobbieThe1st: hmm right
Nov 06 07:26:25 <ilius> RobbieThe1st: i think q is better for exit / quit
Nov 06 07:26:41 <ilius> RobbieThe1st: more common and standard in applications
Nov 06 07:27:11 <RobbieThe1st> Eh, why not.
Nov 06 07:38:24 <RobbieThe1st> Testing v0.54 right now..
Nov 06 08:00:39 <ebzzry> Is there an app that can edit ID3 tags?
Nov 06 08:01:10 <RobbieThe1st> on n900 or windows, linux?
Nov 06 08:01:38 <RobbieThe1st> for Windows, I happen to like http://www.mp3tag.de/en/
Nov 06 08:01:41 <ilius> ebzzry: like mp3info on linux?
Nov 06 08:02:05 <ebzzry> On the N900 itself.
Nov 06 08:02:50 <ebzzry> I'm looking for ways to "fix" the issue posted at the Preenv game compatibility page for Plasma Cannon.
Nov 06 08:03:24 <ebzzry> ilius: I don't know. I haven't tried editing id3 tags, ever.
Nov 06 08:04:03 <RobbieThe1st> I'd just connect it up to your PC, open your mp3 file in your favorite media player and edit it there
Nov 06 08:04:15 <ilius> ebzzry: for mp3 files?
Nov 06 08:05:47 <ebzzry> ilius: Yes.
Nov 06 08:06:19 <ebzzry> RobbieThe1st: I'm sorry, I don't have access to a PC now.
Nov 06 08:06:30 <ilius> ebzzry: package mussorgsky from extras-devel
Nov 06 08:06:38 <ilius> ebzzry: http://maemo.org/packages/view/mussorgsky/
Nov 06 08:06:55 <ilius> ebzzry: http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=42151
Nov 06 08:07:01 <ebzzry> ilius: OK. I'll re-enable -devel and fetch it now.
Nov 06 08:07:56 <ebzzry> ilius: Copy
Nov 06 08:09:52 <ilius> ebzzry: what?
Nov 06 08:09:57 <RobbieThe1st> IT'S FIXED! Finally. For the last week or two, I've been struggling with BackupMenu. I could backup or restore, but only do one thing on the rootfs without a reboot - It wouldn't unmount, and therefor wouldn't mount. I found the solution: cd'ing away from my rootfs directory before unmounting.
Nov 06 08:11:02 <RobbieThe1st> In retrospect, it seems logical enough... But it took me ages to figure it out.
Nov 06 08:11:33 <ilius> RobbieThe1st: oh yes, device mounted on (a parent of) current directory could not be umnounted
Nov 06 08:11:57 <ilius> *unmounted
Nov 06 08:13:27 <RobbieThe1st> Thing that confused me was that -until a week ago - I had no feedback for the mount/unmounts. So, it would never unmount, error out when trying to remount, but still work anyway. I go putting feedback in, and "oh wait, there's an error"
Nov 06 08:15:01 <ilius> RobbieThe1st: hmmm
Nov 06 08:15:33 <RobbieThe1st> Either way, it's fixed now, and works great. I'm happy, and it's gonna be in extras-devel in an hour or so
Nov 06 08:17:02 <ilius> RobbieThe1st: :)
Nov 06 08:26:14 <RobbieThe1st> Hopefully, this version'll be good enough to promote to extras-testing in a few days
Nov 06 08:34:07 <crashanddie> RobbieThe1st: congrats
Nov 06 08:35:18 <RobbieThe1st> Thank you
Nov 06 08:48:21 <djszapi> Which pdf viewer is advised on my Nokia device and maemo ?
Nov 06 08:48:39 <RobbieThe1st> Um, you have a default one, don't you?
Nov 06 08:49:01 <djszapi> which is ?
Nov 06 08:49:25 <RobbieThe1st> Um... "pdf viewer" or something genaric like that
Nov 06 08:49:47 <ilius> djszapi: PDF reader
Nov 06 08:49:55 <RobbieThe1st> ^^
Nov 06 08:50:19 <ilius> djszapi: also tapping on a pdf file opens it
Nov 06 08:50:31 <ilius> djszapi: in file manager
Nov 06 08:50:35 <RobbieThe1st> Or downloading one
Nov 06 08:52:21 <ilius> RobbieThe1st: a personal question: what operating system do you use on desktop?
Nov 06 08:54:51 <ebzzry> djszapi: well an alternative is evince from -devel
Nov 06 08:54:54 <RobbieThe1st> Debian Squeeze+Sid(unstable)
Nov 06 08:55:13 <RobbieThe1st> Why?
Nov 06 08:55:18 <ilius> RobbieThe1st: :)
Nov 06 08:55:23 <ilius> RobbieThe1st: nothing
Nov 06 08:55:37 * ilius use ubuntu 10.04
Nov 06 08:56:01 <RobbieThe1st> I'd go for Ubuntu/Kubuntu normally - but I decided to try Debian. A bit more pain, but it's interesting to try new things once in a while
Nov 06 08:56:23 <ebzzry> ilius: Is mussgorsky really limited in what fields it can edit?
Nov 06 08:57:37 <djszapi> evince sucks :>
Nov 06 08:57:43 <ilius> ebzzry: no idea. i never used it
Nov 06 08:58:12 <ilius> djszapi: evince is good I like it :)
Nov 06 08:58:21 <ilius> djszapi: simple but good
Nov 06 08:58:23 <djszapi> your business :>
Nov 06 08:58:47 <ilius> djszapi: maybe you want a think like okular
Nov 06 08:58:47 <RobbieThe1st> Okular does what I need
Nov 06 08:59:22 <djszapi> ilius: okular is really perfect, but I am not sure it is available.
Nov 06 08:59:29 <ebzzry> djszapi: What made you say that?
Nov 06 08:59:31 <djszapi> as long as it depends on the whole kdelibs stuff.
Nov 06 08:59:51 * ilius beware from Gnome vs KDE wars :P
Nov 06 09:00:26 <djszapi> nothing related to a war, it is just personal preference, that is all.
Nov 06 09:00:42 <RobbieThe1st> :P
Nov 06 09:00:58 <RobbieThe1st> KDE + Compiz = Win, IMHO.
Nov 06 09:01:11 <djszapi> it is high time to leave for me right now ;)
Nov 06 09:01:16 <djszapi> bye
Nov 06 09:03:15 <RobbieThe1st> Playing TF2 via Wine and being able to, at a moment's notice switch to Firefox/irc/whatever and back is so frigging awesome
Nov 06 09:03:23 <RobbieThe1st> </fanboy>
Nov 06 09:04:32 <ham5> yay maemo!
Nov 06 09:07:07 <ham5> irc addon for accounts... how would I go about sending a raw command to the server, ie change user modes, or idenitfy to a nickname?
Nov 06 09:07:18 <mc_teo> hey
Nov 06 09:07:40 <RobbieThe1st>  /msg nickserv identify *password* ?
Nov 06 09:07:52 <mc_teo> ?
Nov 06 09:07:59 <mc_teo> anyway
Nov 06 09:08:01 <ham5> dosent work in a channel or im box
Nov 06 09:08:23 <ham5> will just send the / charter too
Nov 06 09:08:44 <mc_teo> my pyqt apps all broke lately
Nov 06 09:08:59 <ham5> what changed lately?
Nov 06 09:09:25 <mc_teo> turns out pyqt isnt installed since i updated to pr1.3
Nov 06 09:09:54 <mc_teo> and the package in the app manager says its for 1.2
Nov 06 09:10:28 <dRbiG> RobbieThe1st: wine on maemo? works?
Nov 06 09:11:12 <mc_teo> so what will i do?
Nov 06 09:11:28 <mc_teo> install the pr1.2 bindings?
Nov 06 09:11:47 <mc_teo> but i dont know will they work with qt4.7
Nov 06 09:11:58 <mc_teo> actually i doubt they will
Nov 06 09:15:22 <RobbieThe1st> dRbiG: Yes and no. Yes, it does. No, you can't run desktop apps, really. I was talking about my desktop PC
Nov 06 09:16:05 <dRbiG> RobbieThe1st: i guess the emulation of x86 on n900 is just too much for it
Nov 06 09:16:07 <dRbiG> mhm
Nov 06 09:25:21 <RobbieThe1st> Yea, you'd have to essentially run an x86-emulator, then wine on top of that. -very- slow
Nov 06 09:25:36 <RobbieThe1st> Heck, even Java runs about 3x slower than on a desktop PC of the same clock speed
Nov 06 09:32:40 <ham5> presence vnc or vncviewer?
Nov 06 09:50:22 <DocScrutinizer> Wine Is Not an Emulator - so how could it ever even try to emulate x86 on arm?
Nov 06 09:51:18 <DocScrutinizer> you might want to tweak wine to run winmoob7 apps on N900 :-P
Nov 06 09:56:32 <DocScrutinizer> for emulators refer to http://www.tuug.fi/~toni/serendipity/index.php?/archives/9-Windows-NT-4.0-running-on-N900!.html
Nov 06 09:57:15 <DocScrutinizer> there's also been "MacOS on N900" but I don't find the bookmark/link
Nov 06 09:58:55 <DocScrutinizer> hell, I need a search machine for my bookmarks :-P
Nov 06 10:05:04 <kerio> what macos?
Nov 06 10:18:17 <Nitial> 10.3
Nov 06 10:18:30 <Nitial> it's somewhere at the same blog as the nt 4.0 :P
Nov 06 11:00:16 * Noobmonk3y waves
Nov 06 11:46:13 <slonopotamus> anyone tried running this beast? https://dev.openwrt.org/browser/trunk/target/linux/omap24xx/patches-2.6.36/900-n810-battery-management.patch
Nov 06 11:57:36 <Noobmonk3y> nope :P
Nov 06 12:00:24 <ShadowJK> slonopotamus, charging looks kinda incomplete
Nov 06 12:02:51 <cehteh> bah ... no 1.3 ota for me, its flashing time
Nov 06 12:03:36 <elin> Hi!
Nov 06 12:04:05 <elin> How I can get geolocation from comand-line?
Nov 06 12:04:37 <alterego> You can't really,
Nov 06 12:04:48 <alterego> Unless you write an app to do it.
Nov 06 12:04:55 <alterego> Python maybe.
Nov 06 12:06:16 <Noobmonk3y> ;)
Nov 06 12:08:00 <Sargun_Screen> alterego: geolocation by ipA?
Nov 06 12:09:22 <alterego> eh?
Nov 06 12:09:26 <alterego> If you want ..
Nov 06 12:09:35 <elin> Altergo: You suggests use this http://wiki.maemo.org/PyMaemo/Using_Location_API ?
Nov 06 12:09:40 <alterego> You'd still need to wrap it in an app.
Nov 06 12:09:45 <alterego> elin: yes
Nov 06 12:09:58 <elin> altergo, thanks!
Nov 06 12:10:04 <alterego> np
Nov 06 12:10:04 <elin> ups
Nov 06 12:10:22 <elin> alterego, thanks! ;-)
Nov 06 12:23:24 <rokr1> hello guys
Nov 06 12:23:28 <rokr1> i got a prob
Nov 06 12:23:49 <rokr1> ifconfig shows a new interface parallel to wlan0
Nov 06 12:23:51 <rokr1> its
Nov 06 12:23:55 <rokr1> wmaster0
Nov 06 12:24:02 <rokr1> how can  i get rid of it ??
Nov 06 12:24:28 <ham5> you want wmaster
Nov 06 12:24:45 <ham5> the phone has all kinds of interfaces
Nov 06 12:26:09 <rokr1> i DONT WANT wmaster0
Nov 06 12:26:17 <rokr1> its annoying
Nov 06 12:26:28 <rokr1> it starts when wlan0 is up
Nov 06 12:27:02 <SpeedEvil> Umm - why do you care?
Nov 06 12:27:04 <rokr1> N900 as i know so far does not support master mode! correct if i am wrong
Nov 06 12:27:50 <ham5> wtf is master mode
Nov 06 12:27:59 <rokr1> AP
Nov 06 12:28:44 <SpeedEvil> Why do you care about the presence or absence of an interface?
Nov 06 12:28:58 <SpeedEvil> In general you can't simply manage interfaces as icd will get in your way
Nov 06 12:29:27 <asj_> rokr1: use ifrename and call wmaster0 noname0 then you won't have wmaster0 anymore
Nov 06 12:29:42 <rokr1> nice joke asj
Nov 06 12:29:56 <asj_> rokr1: ask a silly question...
Nov 06 12:30:21 <SpeedEvil> Why do you care rokr1.
Nov 06 12:30:31 <SpeedEvil> If you provide a sensible answer, you might get help
Nov 06 12:31:37 <SpeedEvil> http://linuxwireless.org/en/developers/Documentation/mac80211
Nov 06 12:32:15 <alterego> How often do you run ifconfig for this to annoy you?
Nov 06 12:33:05 <asj_> SpeedEvil: the addition of all those headers slows it down, all those extra bytes ;)
Nov 06 12:33:13 <rokr1> just before update from PR1.2 to PR1.3
Nov 06 12:33:32 <rokr1> ok do u guys get that ?
Nov 06 12:33:38 <SpeedEvil> no.
Nov 06 12:33:43 <SpeedEvil> You're making no sense at all.
Nov 06 12:33:52 <rokr1> okay
Nov 06 12:34:06 <SpeedEvil> wmaster0 is an entirely normal and expected interface.
Nov 06 12:34:42 <SpeedEvil> In principle, if you got a recent kernel working on the device, it would go away.
Nov 06 12:37:47 <rokr1> may be because i installed the power user kernel i get that speedEvil ?
Nov 06 12:39:07 <SpeedEvil> Why do you care?
Nov 06 12:39:34 <SpeedEvil> it's there on every n900
Nov 06 12:39:46 <SpeedEvil> (pretty much)
Nov 06 12:40:22 <rokr1> now i am concerned with the kernel now
Nov 06 12:41:39 <rokr1> wats the latest kernel for N900
Nov 06 12:41:40 <rokr1> ?
Nov 06 12:41:57 <rokr1> 2.6.x?
Nov 06 12:42:43 <SpeedEvil> The most recent kernel would need the n900 specific fixes backported before it would boot.
Nov 06 12:42:50 <SpeedEvil> It would however remove the wmaster device
Nov 06 12:43:42 <rokr1> how can i compile the latest kernel to N900 or does N900 has a optimized and modified kernel
Nov 06 12:43:59 <rokr1> to match its hardware ?
Nov 06 12:44:21 <SpeedEvil> Get the n900 kernel from git.
Nov 06 12:44:26 <SpeedEvil> Backport all the patches
Nov 06 12:44:29 <SpeedEvil> compile
Nov 06 12:44:40 <rokr1> wats u r N900 running
Nov 06 12:44:41 <rokr1> ?
Nov 06 12:44:49 <rokr1> just curious :)
Nov 06 12:45:20 <SpeedEvil> power kernel and stock 1.2
Nov 06 12:46:01 <rokr1> so its 2.6.28
Nov 06 12:46:47 <rokr1> i just compiled 2.6.36 for my PC
Nov 06 12:50:12 * asj_ goes to bed
Nov 06 12:50:20 <asj_> SpeedEvil: you have the patience of a saint
Nov 06 12:50:30 <Sargun_Screen> SpeedEvil: power kernel?
Nov 06 12:50:37 <SpeedEvil> yes
Nov 06 12:53:36 <alterego> I very much doubt maemo wouedl work with the latest kernel ..
Nov 06 12:57:58 <Termana> alterego, define what exactly you mean by latest kernel
Nov 06 12:58:21 <alterego> Backporting patches and building the latest source tree from kernel.org
Nov 06 12:58:29 <alterego> Which is 2.6.36?
Nov 06 12:58:30 <Termana> alterego, if you mean latest Maemo kernel then it will of course work fine. If you mean latest kernel as in, a MeeGo/Mainline kernel then no Maemo won't work
Nov 06 12:58:47 <alterego> Yes, that is exactly what I'm talking about.
Nov 06 12:58:58 <alterego> Why would I be talking about a kernel we're already running?
Nov 06 13:00:11 <Termana> alterego, I don't know, why are you using the term backward port? Pulling patches from an older kernel to a newer one would be FORWARD porting
Nov 06 13:01:34 <MohammadAG> which directory is best for logging?
Nov 06 13:01:40 <MohammadAG> /tmp or /var/tmp?
Nov 06 13:01:50 <Termana> alterego, anyway, i suppose if you forward port the OMAP/Maemo specific patches that mainline has rejected then you could probably boot Maemo
Nov 06 13:02:20 <SpeedEvil> Termana: err - yes.
Nov 06 13:02:35 <SpeedEvil> anyway - silly person is sily.
Nov 06 13:02:37 <MohammadAG> hmm, tmp is 1MB, /var/tmp it is
Nov 06 13:02:38 <Termana> But it will only be MeeGo that you'll be able to boot with a plain mainline pulled, no patches applied, kernel
Nov 06 13:02:53 <Termana> SpeedEvil, err yes what? I made a statement, not a question :p
Nov 06 13:03:35 <SpeedEvil> about backport
Nov 06 13:03:53 <Termana> SpeedEvil, I will slap you if you say backport again
Nov 06 13:04:06 <Termana> With a brick
Nov 06 13:04:20 <Termana> :p
Nov 06 13:04:36 <SpeedEvil> I meant that I was agreeing with you that the term backport was not well chosen.
Nov 06 13:04:58 <SpeedEvil> As I wasn't really picking words with care, as the person in question was unlikely to be able to do it.
Nov 06 13:05:07 <Termana> Oh ok. *puts brick away, sigh*
Nov 06 13:05:32 <SpeedEvil> backport backport backport backport.
Nov 06 13:05:52 * Termana slaps SpeedEvil with some FORWARD thrown bricks
Nov 06 13:06:02 <Termana> :p
Nov 06 13:07:22 * SpeedEvil charges his laser.
Nov 06 13:07:30 <SpeedEvil> (50mW module from dealextreme cheap!)
Nov 06 13:07:45 <SpeedEvil> I'm sticking it in a laser level to make it actually visible.
Nov 06 13:08:24 <Termana> SpeedEvil, so it's not that one that sets stuff on fire? :p
Nov 06 13:08:31 * DocScrutinizer ships 2 of his MTHELS to SpeedEvil
Nov 06 13:09:13 <SpeedEvil> Termana: It can light matches I think if you focus it _just_ right
Nov 06 13:09:16 <SpeedEvil> But generally not.
Nov 06 13:09:26 <DocScrutinizer> Termana: believe me, those will set your ass on fire
Nov 06 13:10:11 <Termana> DocScrutinizer, my arse is as tight as a match stick so that sounds reasonable
Nov 06 13:10:32 <Termana> :p
Nov 06 13:11:38 * DocScrutinizer ponders about fried birds. If they will be ready to eat when they drop?
Nov 06 13:12:08 <DocScrutinizer> or probably just vanish into smoke and pooof
Nov 06 13:14:13 <DocScrutinizer> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cCBwLJjzDJQ
Nov 06 13:15:16 <ieatlint> apparently i just walked into a conversation about tight asses and deep fried poultry
Nov 06 13:15:21 <ieatlint> why does this keep happening..
Nov 06 13:18:10 * GAN900 sighs at people who think they know things about art and technology.
Nov 06 13:18:11 <Termana> ieatlint, welcome to #maemo - I see you're new here
Nov 06 13:18:13 <Termana> :p
Nov 06 13:18:39 <ieatlint> :P
Nov 06 13:18:46 <Noobmonk3y> :P
Nov 06 13:42:11 <dRbiG> why is that dpkg -l | ggrep ruby lists libruby1.8 and apt-get remove libruby1.8 says it's not installed?
Nov 06 13:43:08 <alterego> What line is output from your grep?
Nov 06 13:43:23 <dRbiG> okey, i think there may be a hint
Nov 06 13:43:31 <dRbiG> rc  libruby1.8                                          1.8.7.72-3maemo4                 Libraries necessary to run Ruby 1.8
Nov 06 13:43:37 <dRbiG> rc - what does that mean?
Nov 06 13:43:43 <dRbiG> other packages have ii
Nov 06 13:43:44 <alterego> It means it's not installed
Nov 06 13:44:08 <dRbiG> if it's not installed then why's it there?
Nov 06 13:44:34 <alterego> Because it was installed at somepoint?
Nov 06 13:45:03 <dRbiG> yes it was... so dpkg keeps a history of what i had installed?
Nov 06 13:45:08 <dRbiG> is so...what for?
Nov 06 13:45:16 <nidO> it does if config files are still in place
Nov 06 13:45:24 <nidO> if you run a purge it should fully clear it
Nov 06 13:45:28 <alterego> rc means it's removed but there are config files
Nov 06 13:45:31 <alterego> :)
Nov 06 13:45:46 <dRbiG> okey, reasonable behaviour, thx!
Nov 06 13:46:13 <alterego> Well, you say that, but I don't remember any config files for libruby :)
Nov 06 13:47:19 <dRbiG> yes, it sounds a bit wrong in this case, but the overall behaviour of dpkg/debs is okey :) i guess that's why i always choosed debian when i was more or less forced to go with linux :)
Nov 06 14:20:51 <Juozapas> does anyone tried synergy in n900?
Nov 06 14:25:30 <GAN900> Juozapas, many people. It works, although it's uselessly unreliable.
Nov 06 14:26:12 <alterego> My attempt at doing a maemo.nokia.com like tile: http://alterego.metapath.org/projects/columbus/Screenshot-20100826-1220912-rotated.png
Nov 06 14:26:12 <Termana> Yes, many people do things in the past tense at the present time
Nov 06 14:26:15 <alterego> :D
Nov 06 14:33:15 * GAN900 chuckles at tekojo's message on -community.
Nov 06 14:33:31 <GAN900> My cynicism has officially overwhelmed me as a person.
Nov 06 14:41:14 <ieatlint> i'm confident i'll never reach that point myself
Nov 06 14:44:23 <GAN900> Ehehe
Nov 06 14:50:05 <Noobmonk3y> ping crashanddie
Nov 06 14:50:29 <crashanddie> Noobmonk3y: pong
Nov 06 14:50:45 <crashanddie> Noobmonk3y: you need to put my nickname as the first word, otherwise my highlighter doesn't catch it
Nov 06 14:50:52 <Noobmonk3y> ahhhhhhhhh
Nov 06 14:50:53 <Noobmonk3y> sorry
Nov 06 14:50:57 <Noobmonk3y> lucky you are awake then ;)
Nov 06 14:51:12 <crashanddie> yeah, I just looked at the IRC window for... no apparent reason
Nov 06 14:51:13 <Noobmonk3y> can i pick your brains on the listiter thing you helped me with please :)
Nov 06 14:51:15 <crashanddie> telepathy bru
Nov 06 14:51:21 <crashanddie> sure
Nov 06 14:51:23 <Noobmonk3y> http://pastebin.com/5pDFYm9c
Nov 06 14:51:30 <Noobmonk3y> running the same iter through uname -a
Nov 06 14:51:40 <Noobmonk3y> to get the kernel version and kernel date
Nov 06 14:52:04 <Noobmonk3y> how would i just pick, for example line 3?
Nov 06 14:52:13 <Noobmonk3y> while (listIter3.hasNext()) {   (iter while loop)
Nov 06 14:53:36 <crashanddie> Noobmonk3y: doesn't uname -r give the kernel version?
Nov 06 14:53:41 <Noobmonk3y> lol!!!
Nov 06 14:53:45 <Noobmonk3y> just realised that in terminal!
Nov 06 14:53:49 <Noobmonk3y> ignore my dummyness!
Nov 06 15:05:30 <blubbi> hi all, can anyone tell me where I can finc pyuic4 for maemo?
Nov 06 15:09:08 <Noobmonk3y> doesnt it come with the pyqt packages?
Nov 06 15:11:32 <blubbi> apparently not
Nov 06 15:12:17 <blubbi> python2.5-qt4 is installed I even installed python2.5-qt4-dev but no pyuic
Nov 06 15:12:47 <blubbi> I found a package called pyqt4-dev-tools for debian but this is not available for maemo
Nov 06 15:13:02 <MohammadAG> use it on debian then
Nov 06 15:13:14 <MohammadAG> I doubt you have Qt Designer on your N900 :P
Nov 06 15:13:50 <korhojoa> hey, you never know
Nov 06 15:14:16 <korhojoa> hmm, has anyone put the emmc as ext3?
Nov 06 15:15:57 <psycho_oreos> there's people who have repartitioned their emmc to create the newly created partition as ext3 and then there's images with ext3fs
Nov 06 15:16:45 <psycho_oreos> I don't think there's someone who would convert the entire emmc as ext3, lots of apps would probably fail to work (for instance, camera)
Nov 06 15:40:17 <dRbiG> grr, anyone here using ruby on maemo?
Nov 06 15:40:50 <dRbiG> nokogiri seems unable to find libxml/parser.h while it is where it should be and i'm going mad with this :S
Nov 06 15:43:29 <norayr> hey
Nov 06 15:43:43 <dRbiG> lol, think i found where the problem really is ;)
Nov 06 15:43:51 <norayr> Let's assume I've added hardware keyboard layout with xkb
Nov 06 15:44:01 <norayr> and i can activate it with commandline
Nov 06 15:45:00 <norayr> i assume there should be some xml file where i can add the layout name so it can be shown in the config
Nov 06 15:45:12 <norayr> hm?
Nov 06 15:53:14 <elin> Hi!
Nov 06 15:53:43 <elin> How I can manage a ICd2 conecions form command-line?
Nov 06 15:55:14 <psycho_oreos> maybe via dbus
Nov 06 15:57:34 <elin> psycho_oreos, where i cant find documentation to manage connections with dbus and python?
Nov 06 15:59:22 <elin> or dbus-send
Nov 06 15:59:24 <elin> ??
Nov 06 16:00:07 <psycho_oreos> elin, dunno about python part but there are some scattered documentations available for dbus such as power-users page for maemo tweaking/hacking.. MohammadAG has got some nice scripts which uses dbus and may have icd controls, and there's stuff like USB hostmode
Nov 06 16:00:43 <MohammadAG> hmm?
Nov 06 16:01:01 <psycho_oreos> USB hostmode briefly discusses on editing icd stuff.. the connection part would be stuff I'm not sure off
Nov 06 16:01:04 <MohammadAG> see http://wiki.maemo.org/Phone_control or phone-control in -devel
Nov 06 16:01:05 <psycho_oreos> s/off/of/
Nov 06 16:01:05 <infobot> psycho_oreos meant: USB hostmode briefly discusses on editing icd stuff.. the connection part would be stuff I'm not sure of
Nov 06 16:01:17 <MohammadAG> I don't recall that
Nov 06 16:01:31 <MohammadAG> confusing icd with i2c?
Nov 06 16:01:37 <psycho_oreos> on the bottom part, where one creates dummy network
Nov 06 16:01:52 <MohammadAG> nope, hostmode doesn't do that
Nov 06 16:02:08 * psycho_oreos slaps self in the head, I meant USB networking
Nov 06 16:03:53 * MohammadAG wonders why his haptic feedback isn't working
Nov 06 16:05:28 <psycho_oreos> btw MohammadAG, whilst you're here.. http://mohammadag.xceleo.org/public/maemo/debfiles/ <-- that's your new site right? for all n900 related stuff, just had some users having issues with apt-get and ovi store
Nov 06 16:05:29 <elin> thanks
Nov 06 16:05:48 <MohammadAG> psycho_oreos, yeah
Nov 06 16:06:00 <MohammadAG> install the modded apt
Nov 06 16:06:49 <psycho_oreos> I bookmarked an old forum thread for modded apt that links to your old site.. gave that to them and they said something similar to getting 404 lol
Nov 06 16:07:07 <MohammadAG> ah, ucoz
Nov 06 16:07:10 <MohammadAG> I think that's dead
Nov 06 16:07:15 <psycho_oreos> yup
Nov 06 16:07:22 <psycho_oreos> well its 404
Nov 06 16:15:53 <alterego> Christ I'm crap at making icons
Nov 06 16:16:40 <MohammadAG> alterego, I've never seen good designers and developers
Nov 06 16:16:46 <MohammadAG> maybe someone else can help? :)
Nov 06 16:17:19 <alterego> Well, when it comes to UI design, I like to think I'm pretty good.
Nov 06 16:17:25 <RST38h> helpwith what?
Nov 06 16:17:29 <alterego> It's just creating graphics ..
Nov 06 16:17:44 <alterego> It's annoying because I can draw quite well on paper ^.^
Nov 06 16:17:46 <RST38h> alterego:everybody thinks they are good
Nov 06 16:17:57 <MohammadAG> alterego, pretty much what designing is about :P
Nov 06 16:18:14 <MohammadAG> RST38h, actually, everyone thinks different of an ideal UI
Nov 06 16:18:14 <RST38h> alterego: the only person HERE that can prove he is good is wazd though :)
Nov 06 16:18:30 <alterego> Well, other people think I'm good too :P
Nov 06 16:18:43 <MohammadAG> alterego, bribed? :P
Nov 06 16:18:53 <GAN900> alterego, the voices in your head?
Nov 06 16:19:18 <MohammadAG> we're pessimistic :P
Nov 06 16:20:00 <alterego> You're just jealous :P
Nov 06 16:20:15 <RST38h> yeah and not worthy too =)
Nov 06 16:20:22 <ArkAnGiCIA> Who are jealous ?
Nov 06 16:20:22 <MohammadAG> nah, I can make epic icons
Nov 06 16:20:26 * MohammadAG goes on google images
Nov 06 16:20:41 <ArkAnGiCIA> And ?
Nov 06 16:20:50 <lcuk> alterego, just include some default chunky icons
Nov 06 16:21:04 <ArkAnGiCIA> I like this nickname alterego
Nov 06 16:21:08 <alterego> Heh
Nov 06 16:21:18 <alterego> tbh, I don't like my nick anymore.
Nov 06 16:21:31 <alterego> I thought I liked it, 15 years ago.
Nov 06 16:21:36 <alterego> I thought it was ironic and clever.
Nov 06 16:21:56 <alterego> But now I don't really like it, unfortunately, it's an alias that has stuck ^.^
Nov 06 16:22:13 <MohammadAG> twinsdell then?
Nov 06 16:22:23 * MohammadAG wonders if he got that right
Nov 06 16:22:36 <alterego> swindell
Nov 06 16:22:45 <MohammadAG> damn
Nov 06 16:22:51 <alterego> I dunno, I think it'd confuse too many people :P
Nov 06 16:22:53 * MohammadAG loses 2 internets
Nov 06 16:23:18 <MohammadAG> alterego, they'll get used to it
Nov 06 16:23:25 <lcuk> alterego is now known as the_ircer_formerly_known_as_alterego
Nov 06 16:23:33 <MohammadAG> you have a different nick on tmo
Nov 06 16:23:41 <alterego> :)
Nov 06 16:23:52 <alterego> I do have a different nick on tmo, and meego.com
Nov 06 16:23:55 <MohammadAG> lcuk, I wonder if that would exceed the limit of a nick :P
Nov 06 16:23:58 <alterego> And maemo.org (they're the same.
Nov 06 16:24:00 <alterego> )
Nov 06 16:24:23 <Noobmonk3y> meh
Nov 06 16:25:18 * MohammadAG slaps Noobmonk3y
Nov 06 16:25:41 * Noobmonk3y meh's
Nov 06 16:26:33 <lcuk> MohammadAG, DO NOT SPANK THE Noobmonk3y
Nov 06 16:27:22 <MohammadAG> I slapped him, I don't usually spank people
Nov 06 16:27:57 <lcuk> hes not a person
Nov 06 16:29:29 <RST38h> alterego: Intel x86 Architecture Reference is full of worthy nick candidates! =)
Nov 06 16:29:37 <alterego> Heh
Nov 06 16:29:38 <RST38h> and hello, javispedro
Nov 06 16:29:42 <javispedro> morning
Nov 06 16:29:51 <alterego> Yes, well, I was bought up on ARM :P
Nov 06 16:30:03 <alterego> Intel architecture is only recent for me :P
Nov 06 16:30:54 * lcuk was brought up on zilog and motorola
Nov 06 16:31:02 <GAN900> alterego, hey, at least yours isn't a movie reference. :P
Nov 06 16:31:12 <alterego> :)
Nov 06 16:31:17 <RST38h> yea,like "superman" or "batman666"!
Nov 06 16:31:24 <alterego> Heh
Nov 06 16:31:54 <GAN900> Most of the Europeans seem to think my nick is related to geography.
Nov 06 16:32:14 * Noobmonk3y blinks
Nov 06 16:32:53 <RST38h> While you are a StarWars character?
Nov 06 16:33:22 <Noobmonk3y> GAN900: i thought your name was related to NOMINAL Gaseous Nitrogen, but thats just me
Nov 06 16:33:40 <GAN900> RST38h, aye.
Nov 06 16:36:28 * RST38h suspects Europeans have got other things to worry about than learn movie characters by their names =)
Nov 06 16:37:05 <javispedro> GAN900: well, it reads like HAL9000 too much for me =)
Nov 06 16:37:20 <GAN900> javispedro, expanded nick.
Nov 06 16:37:30 <RST38h> On the other hand, how the hell do they know about Antilles islands?
Nov 06 16:37:34 <javispedro> I know, I know :)
Nov 06 16:37:47 <GAN900> RST38h, possibly, but, c'mon, Wedge Antilles!
Nov 06 16:38:27 <RST38h> GAN: Actually, had to google to figure out just WHO exactly he was (I knew that hewas in StarWars somewhere)
Nov 06 16:38:52 <RST38h> It is that poor shmuck smothered by imperial fighters during attack on the Death Star?
Nov 06 16:39:46 <alterego> Bloody catorize increases my deployment time annoyingly :/
Nov 06 16:40:25 <GAN900> RST38h, guy who blows up Death Star II.
Nov 06 16:40:30 <RST38h> Naah, wiki says he has survived attacks on both Death Stars!
Nov 06 16:40:36 <RST38h> and blew the second one, indeed
Nov 06 16:41:34 <GAN900> Probably thinking of the fat dude
Nov 06 16:41:41 <GAN900> Whatever the hell his name was
Nov 06 16:41:43 <GAN900> or Biggs.
Nov 06 16:42:03 * GAN900 vaguely remembers this stuff from 10 years ago.
Nov 06 16:42:19 <lcuk> GAN900, you werent in star wars? you were in star trek!? http://liqbase.net/star_wreck_keisari_ga.jpg
Nov 06 16:42:23 * RST38h even read afew books set up in SW universe, by Timothy Zahn I think
Nov 06 16:42:44 <GAN900> Uh, Heir to the Empire?
Nov 06 16:42:56 <GAN900> There are actually a few decent Star Wars novels.
Nov 06 16:43:15 <RST38h> No longer remember. It was at the time when I was borrowing a dozen books at a time from the local community library
Nov 06 16:43:36 <GAN900> Thrawn Trilogy
Nov 06 16:43:50 <GAN900> That's the one Zahn is know for, anyway.
Nov 06 16:43:51 <RST38h> Zahn has not registered very high on the radar, compared to Herbert, Harrison, or Zelazny
Nov 06 16:43:59 <RST38h> Yes, the Thrawn Trilogy indeed
Nov 06 16:44:31 <RST38h> Thrawn being a blue skinned motherfucker known of philosophizing,Machiavelli-style
Nov 06 16:45:06 <javispedro> lcuk: lol
Nov 06 16:46:47 <GAN900> lcuk, that'd be funny if the original intent of the creator hadn't been mean spirited.
Nov 06 16:47:44 <lcuk> o_O :P
Nov 06 16:47:47 <lcuk> find the post
Nov 06 16:51:24 <GAN900> That whole thread was nothing but unpleasantness.
Nov 06 16:51:57 <lcuk> hmm
Nov 06 16:52:20 <lcuk> "Council uniforms - design competition"
Nov 06 16:52:26 <lcuk> no wonder you were squirming
Nov 06 16:52:41 <GAN900> lcuk, origin was before that
Nov 06 16:52:59 <GAN900> Relating to the Talk merge and penguinbait's tantrum.
Nov 06 16:53:31 <lcuk> GAN900, nahh it wasnt
Nov 06 16:53:45 <lcuk> i posted that photoshop immediately after krisse posted the original
Nov 06 16:54:07 * GAN900 wonders if he should be offended that somebody felt the need to spell Jesus for him.
Nov 06 16:54:54 <RST38h> Heh
Nov 06 16:54:59 <javispedro> hey, be careful. The Pope is around here atm.
Nov 06 16:55:14 <javispedro> I don't want to be dark-force-lightning fried.
Nov 06 16:55:34 <RST38h> ...and the current Pope has such a resemblance to Emperor Palpatine...
Nov 06 16:55:57 <RST38h> http://media.ebaumsworld.com/picture/ryanposhusta/PopePalpatine.png
Nov 06 16:57:59 <GAN900> lcuk, your memory of that period differs significantly from mine.
Nov 06 16:58:02 <javispedro> that's what I mean http://www.maniacworld.com/Pope-Benedict-XVI-Unleashes-Force-Lightning.jpg
Nov 06 16:58:18 <lcuk> GAN900, the bloody thread is there with it all in
Nov 06 16:58:20 <RST38h> that poor caridnal stands no chance
Nov 06 16:58:24 <GAN900> New MeeGo iPad clone.
Nov 06 16:58:36 <RST38h> heh, indathing?
Nov 06 16:58:47 <GAN900> lcuk, threads don't exist in a vacuum.
Nov 06 16:58:48 <GAN900> http://www.engadget.com/2010/11/06/indamixx-2-atom-powered-meego-tablet-touts-rockstar-looks-999/
Nov 06 16:58:51 <RST38h> sorry, indamixx :)
Nov 06 16:59:01 <lcuk> http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?p=286257#post286257
Nov 06 16:59:03 <lcuk> GAN900, ^
Nov 06 16:59:19 <lcuk> no, thats why we keep our storage computers inside the gravity well
Nov 06 16:59:24 <GAN900> I don't get why they keep putting Atoms in these things
Nov 06 16:59:33 <GAN900> If standby is 8 hours, I don't care.
Nov 06 16:59:54 <javispedro> specially, why an Atom to run something other than Window.
Nov 06 17:00:24 <javispedro> tbh I do not understand Intel's currently "whoever wins I lose" approach.
Nov 06 17:01:35 <GAN900> Oh well, keep on pipe dreaming for hardware I want to use.
Nov 06 17:01:41 <alterego> Hrm, I'm so bored I might attempt to recreate  the MeeGo orientation animation in my application ..
Nov 06 17:01:51 <RST38h> GAN: They keep putting atoms in these things because Meego is primarily made for Atoms
Nov 06 17:01:59 <RST38h> GAN: ARM version is more of a byproduct
Nov 06 17:02:40 <javispedro> so, who wants to bet that the N9+1 will be an Atom device?
Nov 06 17:03:03 <alterego> javispedro: I'll bet against it :P
Nov 06 17:03:37 <GAN900> RST38h, ah, right.
Nov 06 17:04:30 <khertan>  Hello all !
Nov 06 17:05:16 <javispedro> hello
Nov 06 17:05:27 <Noobmonk3y> heya
Nov 06 17:05:42 <MohammadAG> heya khertan
Nov 06 17:06:27 <tank-man> maybe that tablet has an Atom in it cause it is running windows, some of the comments in that link say something to that effect
Nov 06 17:06:44 <javispedro> heh
Nov 06 17:06:49 <javispedro> the videos show it running windows
Nov 06 17:06:52 <javispedro> so all is clear now.
Nov 06 17:06:56 <khertan> someone have already try to use QPlainPlainText area and QAbstractKineticScrolling ? The scrolling is amazing fast ... but really too much to be usable ...
Nov 06 17:07:11 <ieatlint> wait, seriously? the second meego device to be released is another tablet?
Nov 06 17:07:12 <RST38h> Well, it is useless to
Nov 06 17:07:17 <khertan> (while with QTextEdit i didn't have this problem)
Nov 06 17:07:23 <javispedro> in fact, no video, no screenshot shows it running meego.
Nov 06 17:07:24 <RST38h> normal users" if it is not running Windows and it is not an Apple
Nov 06 17:07:31 <javispedro> so whoever wrote the advert may not even know what Meego is.
Nov 06 17:07:51 <ieatlint> does anyone else think it's weird there will be two meego tablets out when meego doesn't officially support tablets?
Nov 06 17:08:19 <RST38h> Who said Meego does not support tablets?
Nov 06 17:08:36 <ieatlint> the lack of a tablet ux
Nov 06 17:08:47 <RST38h> ieatlint: netbook ux is sufficient
Nov 06 17:08:55 <MohammadAG> javispedro, I think the HW acceleration /etc/powervr.d/ thingy causes some instability
Nov 06 17:09:06 <javispedro> MohammadAG: what "HW acceleration" thingie?
Nov 06 17:09:09 <ieatlint> and several nokia reps at a recent meetup here when directly asked by a software contracting firm
Nov 06 17:09:16 <javispedro> MohammadAG: ah, UseHWSync?
Nov 06 17:09:29 <ieatlint> RST38h: as i recall, netbook ux doesn't have libmeegotouch support
Nov 06 17:09:31 <tybollt> wat wat
Nov 06 17:09:33 <javispedro> MohammadAG: that's hardly "HW acceleration", it just enables asynchronous pvr2d
Nov 06 17:09:46 <tybollt> how do I go about getting meego on my dev
Nov 06 17:09:52 <tybollt> I write the big file to sd
Nov 06 17:09:57 <tybollt> and the kernel?
Nov 06 17:10:19 <RST38h> ieatlint:and?
Nov 06 17:10:37 <ieatlint> and i'm going to assume that'd be a requirement for a tablet
Nov 06 17:10:43 <MohammadAG> javispedro, whatever, device crashed 3 times
Nov 06 17:10:45 * RST38h still does not see much win from enabling UseHWSyncstuff
Nov 06 17:10:48 <tybollt> fagblet
Nov 06 17:10:49 <RST38h> ieatlint: no
Nov 06 17:11:01 <tybollt> much fail
Nov 06 17:11:09 <RST38h> Mohammad: Has not crashed here, in spite of heavy use, but does not seem snappier either
Nov 06 17:11:47 <RST38h> Mohammad,javispedro: Do check Fennec 4b3pre1 by the way, it has got much, MUCH better
Nov 06 17:12:00 <ieatlint> ah, so the netbook ux provides an on-screen keyboard, multitouch, and touch friendly widgets... :P
Nov 06 17:12:12 <RST38h> ieatlint: more or less
Nov 06 17:12:34 <RST38h> ieatlint: With the large screen, it is quite usable, same as Win7 though :)
Nov 06 17:12:48 <ieatlint> have you tried using win7 with a touchscreen?
Nov 06 17:13:07 <ieatlint> i'll admit the keyboard isn't bad... but that's about as good as it gets
Nov 06 17:13:32 * javispedro still wants a joggler
Nov 06 17:14:32 <javispedro> they're now uber expensive on ebay
Nov 06 17:14:47 <RST38h> ieatlint: Yes, and XP too
Nov 06 17:15:10 <RST38h> ieatlint: Toshiba produces (produced?) series of touch-screen laptops (Portege M-series)
Nov 06 17:15:25 <RST38h> ieatlint; Worked beautifully, but too heavy for constant use of course
Nov 06 17:15:35 <ieatlint> i'm on a touchscreen laptop
Nov 06 17:15:58 <ieatlint> in linux at the moment, but have win7 on it too... it sucks to try and use it for much of anythings
Nov 06 17:16:32 <javispedro> It's not going to such more than a touchpad, and look at all those people using it.
Nov 06 17:16:35 <ieatlint> and saying the netbook ux will work as well for a tablet as win7 is not encouraging me :P
Nov 06 17:16:36 <javispedro> s/such/suck
Nov 06 17:16:52 <RST38h> ieatlint: depends on what you want
Nov 06 17:17:13 <lcuk> ieatlint, using touchscreen with windows is painful
Nov 06 17:17:13 <RST38h> ieatlint: from a certian point of view, Win7 does not work very well even with a mouse/touchpad ;)
Nov 06 17:17:22 <ieatlint> javispedro: you say that, but then look at a maximized window... now imagine putting your finger on any of the three buttons in the upper right
Nov 06 17:17:37 * javispedro plays openttd on the n900 at the native resolution
Nov 06 17:17:47 <lcuk> ieatlint, gorilla arm :)
Nov 06 17:18:03 <ieatlint> need to get a damned capacitive stylus or something :P
Nov 06 17:18:03 <RST38h> made allthe dialogs fit and those megaannoying news flash windows disappear?
Nov 06 17:18:30 <javispedro> RST38h: no :), still using the sub-millimeter window close buttons :)
Nov 06 17:18:41 <lcuk> ieatlint, hp slates have a dualmode screen
Nov 06 17:18:46 <lcuk> multitouch and a stylus too
Nov 06 17:18:50 <javispedro> lcuk: score extra for hp slate!
Nov 06 17:19:01 * javispedro goes lookup hp slate price
Nov 06 17:19:38 <ieatlint> i was not impressed by my last hp laptop...
Nov 06 17:20:03 <ieatlint> i'm on a thinkpad now with multitouch, and am very pleased
Nov 06 17:20:23 <javispedro> ieatlint: was it consumer/pavilion?
Nov 06 17:20:51 <ieatlint> hmmm... would have to look it up, was a tablet
Nov 06 17:20:58 <javispedro> ah
Nov 06 17:21:04 <javispedro> the pavilion brand sucks
Nov 06 17:21:13 <ieatlint> yeah, hp pavilion tablet
Nov 06 17:21:17 <javispedro> they're still shipping broken nvidia chipsets aiui.
Nov 06 17:21:18 <ieatlint> i agree, heh
Nov 06 17:23:13 <javispedro> $800!!!
Nov 06 17:23:15 <javispedro> wtf.
Nov 06 17:23:29 <psycho_oreos> hp has stupid minipci/minipcie wireless card whitelisting
Nov 06 17:24:05 * RST38h whispers "Toshiba R-series"
Nov 06 17:26:31 <ieatlint> had my current laptop for 3 months and i'm very pleased with it.. 1080p, multitouch, and i average 3-4h on battery with wifi on
Nov 06 17:26:41 <ieatlint> thinkpad w510
Nov 06 17:27:02 <alterego> I've got a higher resolution :P
Nov 06 17:27:13 <psycho_oreos> thinkpads also have those stupid minipci/minipcie wireless card whitelisting
Nov 06 17:27:31 * javispedro buys acer =)
Nov 06 17:27:44 <ieatlint> alterego: on a laptop?
Nov 06 17:27:54 <ieatlint> psycho_oreos: so i'm told...
Nov 06 17:27:55 <alterego> Yeah
Nov 06 17:28:18 <ieatlint> but my wifi card on this works without issue in linux, so i'm indifferent to it
Nov 06 17:28:20 <alterego> ieatlint: 1920x1200
Nov 06 17:28:37 <ieatlint> oooh, you have me beat :P
Nov 06 17:28:50 <ieatlint> here i am, the sucker with my 1920x1080.. :P
Nov 06 17:28:56 <psycho_oreos> ieatlint, it'll be an issue if you have a wifi card that has to use binary blobs and you're having qualms with it
Nov 06 17:29:04 <alterego> Heh,
Nov 06 17:29:11 <ieatlint> psycho_oreos: i am using a binary blob
Nov 06 17:29:15 <MohammadAG> your laptop rapes my flat screen...
Nov 06 17:29:34 <psycho_oreos> ieatlint, lemme guess, broadcom? lol
Nov 06 17:29:36 <alterego> Well, your screen is proper 16:9 ieatlint
Nov 06 17:29:48 <MohammadAG> damn broadcom is shit
Nov 06 17:30:08 <MohammadAG> BCM43224 here
Nov 06 17:30:11 <ieatlint> psycho_oreos: nah, intel
Nov 06 17:30:31 <MohammadAG> might replace it with an atheros, but priorities first, need replacement headphones
Nov 06 17:30:32 <ieatlint> alterego: yeah... not sure why they went for straight 1080p... funny though
Nov 06 17:30:35 <alterego> Is there a way to force hildon-desktop to display my application launcher icon?
Nov 06 17:30:41 <alterego> (and not restart the device)
Nov 06 17:30:52 <ZogG> \o
Nov 06 17:30:53 <psycho_oreos> they're really slow, they've only just recently opened up their source codes to linux community but only for their non ssb based wifi chipsets, broadcom has yet to support many other of their own
Nov 06 17:31:04 <alterego> ieatlint: probably because it's an actual standard.
Nov 06 17:31:09 <alterego> Not sure what ratio mine is ^.^
Nov 06 17:31:11 <javispedro> alterego: bug #6931
Nov 06 17:31:13 <povbot`> Bug https://bugs.maemo.org/6931 After installation of software last icon in list has default icon instead of own one
Nov 06 17:31:17 <ieatlint> alterego: 16:10
Nov 06 17:31:21 <psycho_oreos> ieatlint, you don't need to use binary blob.. apart from the ucode the rest should be pretty much open source and integrated into kernel
Nov 06 17:31:25 <ieatlint> which is standard for widescreen computer monitors
Nov 06 17:31:36 <MohammadAG> alterego, yeah, edit the .desktop file
Nov 06 17:31:43 <MohammadAG> actually, just save it
Nov 06 17:31:46 <MohammadAG> touching doesn't work
Nov 06 17:31:54 <alterego> Erm,
Nov 06 17:31:57 <alterego> I put it in there
Nov 06 17:31:59 <ieatlint> psycho_oreos: dunno, it has a binary "firmware" blob, and the iwlagn kernel module won't load if it can't find it
Nov 06 17:32:04 <MohammadAG> I know, just save it again
Nov 06 17:32:05 <alterego> I'm just getting a blue square
Nov 06 17:32:08 <alterego> Okay
Nov 06 17:32:12 <MohammadAG> that'll kick off menu regeneration
Nov 06 17:32:34 <MohammadAG> alterego, you have to copy the icon before the .desktop file
Nov 06 17:32:47 <alterego> Ah, right
Nov 06 17:33:16 <alterego> Which I'm guessing doesn't happen when relying on debian packaging.
Nov 06 17:33:30 <psycho_oreos> ieatlint, yeah the ucode is pretty much the firmware, as with almost every other wireless chipset manufacturers, it remains binary/proprietary/regulated
Nov 06 17:33:58 <ieatlint> yes, indeed, ucode
Nov 06 17:33:59 <MohammadAG> alterego, depends how you made the deb I suppose
Nov 06 17:34:07 <alterego> qt creator
Nov 06 17:34:09 <MohammadAG> all my debs copy icon first, then .desktop file
Nov 06 17:34:15 <ieatlint> and yeah, i've heard some pretty horrific things about broadcom
Nov 06 17:34:16 <alterego> interesting
Nov 06 17:34:19 <ieatlint> and ndis
Nov 06 17:34:21 <alterego> Anyway, it didn't fix the problem :P
Nov 06 17:34:22 <MohammadAG> idk about that, I make my debs manually with scratchbox :)
Nov 06 17:34:34 <MohammadAG> did the menu regenerate?
Nov 06 17:34:53 <alterego> Yes
Nov 06 17:34:58 <MohammadAG> weird
Nov 06 17:35:02 <MohammadAG> kill the desktop! :P
Nov 06 17:35:04 <alterego> Oh well.
Nov 06 17:35:17 <psycho_oreos> ndis is the other alternative if the manufacturer never bothers to port their wireless drivers to linux.. there's lots of manufacturers that cease to exist, leaving owners with no choice but to use ndiswrapper
Nov 06 17:35:18 <javispedro> alterego: read the bug report
Nov 06 17:35:21 <MohammadAG> which reminds me
Nov 06 17:35:28 <javispedro> alterego: you just need to touch some folders in icons dir
Nov 06 17:36:28 <alterego> javispedro: what's the bug?
Nov 06 17:36:39 <javispedro> bug #6931
Nov 06 17:36:41 <povbot`> Bug https://bugs.maemo.org/6931 After installation of software last icon in list has default icon instead of own one
Nov 06 17:36:59 <javispedro> touch /usr/share/icons/hicolor
Nov 06 17:37:27 <ieatlint> psycho_oreos: yeah, i know a guy who's written a sizable percentage of the network drivers for freebsd, and the author of project evil (freebsd's ndiswrapper) and have listened to him bitterly complain of things :P
Nov 06 17:38:12 * MohammadAG never figured out how to get ndiswrapper working
Nov 06 17:38:16 <psycho_oreos> heh
Nov 06 17:38:25 <MohammadAG> I need the windows broadcom drivers on linux
Nov 06 17:38:37 <psycho_oreos> I've gotten ndiswrapper to work but its not easy and it can crash, etc
Nov 06 17:38:44 <MohammadAG> 18MBps vs 104 makes a difference
Nov 06 17:38:56 * javispedro would want pktdrvwrapper =)
Nov 06 17:38:57 <GAN900> Why do so many tech companies hate their customers so much. . . .
Nov 06 17:39:03 <psycho_oreos> MohammadAG, fyi, there's brcm80211, you'll need bleeding edge kernel or compat-wireless for that
Nov 06 17:39:18 <MohammadAG> psycho_oreos, what's that?
Nov 06 17:39:45 <MohammadAG> oh, FOSS
Nov 06 17:39:51 * MohammadAG doesn't mind bleeding edge
Nov 06 17:40:28 <psycho_oreos> MohammadAG, mac80211 based open broadcom wireless.. its by broadcom but its still WIP
Nov 06 17:40:39 <psycho_oreos> other than that there's wl
Nov 06 17:40:41 <javispedro> GAN900: one would imagine that with current trend of shrinking devices' lifetime, companies would start to actually try to _keep_ their customers so that they buy their next device from them
Nov 06 17:40:51 <javispedro> why that's not happening, dunno.
Nov 06 17:41:02 <GAN900> Baby Boomers
Nov 06 17:41:12 <MohammadAG> psycho_oreos, I have wl, that's shit
Nov 06 17:41:16 <GAN900> If they don't retire or die, we need to start murdering soon.
Nov 06 17:41:29 <MohammadAG> I get 18-56MBps max with it
Nov 06 17:41:36 <MohammadAG> 104-250 on windows
Nov 06 17:41:45 <psycho_oreos> MohammadAG, indeed :) there's not much other alternative.. apart from ndiswrapper or brcm80211
Nov 06 17:47:04 <norayr> is there any "official" way to turn off "phone" application, but still use wifi or 3g internet connectivity?
Nov 06 17:47:13 <norayr> or it just must be killed in the terminal?
Nov 06 17:47:57 <ieatlint> uh, you can forward all calls to your voicemail, which will prevent the phone from ever getting a call
Nov 06 17:49:19 <SpeedEvil> norayr: What do you mean?
Nov 06 17:49:31 <SpeedEvil> Oh - yeah - that
Nov 06 17:55:38 <norayr> but I still can kill it from the terminal, and it won't restart right?
Nov 06 17:56:00 <norayr> thanks for the voicemail option, I didn't know about it :)
Nov 06 17:56:39 <javispedro> btw, on -devel someone just made a RDS decoder for the N900 fm chipset
Nov 06 17:58:48 <ieatlint> that's awesome
Nov 06 18:00:39 <khertan> So noone have try to use a QAbstractKineticScroller with QPlainTextEdit on Maemo ?
Nov 06 18:03:34 <norayr> ok, I'll try to ask again: let's assume I've prepared a new xkb layout for the hardware keyboard. There should be some config file where I can add it in order to include in the list of the supported language layouts, right?
Nov 06 18:04:05 <norayr> so user can activate it with fingers instead of typing setxkbmap in the terminal
Nov 06 18:28:44 <MohammadAG> WH-701 does not work on the N900, non standard 3.5mm jack being used by Nokia?
Nov 06 18:28:52 <MohammadAG> they're turning into apple :(
Nov 06 18:29:04 <MohammadAG> FYI, stock N8 headset
Nov 06 18:30:54 <alterego> The headset that came with the N900 was a non standard 3.5mm jack :P
Nov 06 18:31:28 <javispedro> what's this "standards" you're talking about?
Nov 06 18:32:12 <javispedro> even the composite out suck
Nov 06 18:32:12 <javispedro> s
Nov 06 18:32:27 <javispedro> audio-wise it's still pretty much a headphones out
Nov 06 18:32:35 <javispedro> while TVs usually need something "more beefy"
Nov 06 18:32:49 <MohammadAG> javispedro, it's completely ignored by the N900
Nov 06 18:32:54 <MohammadAG> no headset icon
Nov 06 18:33:18 <MohammadAG> weird thing is, [ 8945.121154] headphone (GPIO 177) is now connected
Nov 06 18:33:52 * MohammadAG gets some 3.5 female-female adapter, sighs along the way
Nov 06 18:34:04 <javispedro> probably misrecognizing it as tvout
Nov 06 18:34:23 <MohammadAG> any way to override it?
Nov 06 18:36:42 <psycho_oreos> it might be an issue with the design of TRRRS on that headset
Nov 06 18:37:26 <unixSnob> lately I have some kind of resource hog dragging down my NIT.  I run "top" and see 4 instances of maemo-launcher
Nov 06 18:37:57 <unixSnob> each instance of maemo-launcher is eating 20-30% of the memory
Nov 06 18:38:01 <unixSnob> is that normal?
Nov 06 18:38:17 <psycho_oreos> which NIT?
Nov 06 18:38:21 <unixSnob> n800
Nov 06 18:38:45 <unixSnob> also, the percentage of memory consumed is way over 100%
Nov 06 18:39:15 <unixSnob> (when I add up the processes in top)
Nov 06 18:39:20 <psycho_oreos> ahh that explains why :) I don't have maemo-launcher being the major CPU hogger (n900)
Nov 06 18:40:04 <unixSnob> well, it's not a cpu hogger
Nov 06 18:40:09 <unixSnob> it's a memory pig
Nov 06 18:40:18 <unixSnob> cpu is showing 0.0%
Nov 06 18:40:33 <javispedro> unixSnob: every builtin application appears as "maemo-launcher" in process list
Nov 06 18:41:05 <unixSnob> javispedro: okay, that's what I was wondering.  How do i ID the real pigs then?
Nov 06 18:41:17 <unixSnob> (note that this is right after a cold boot)
Nov 06 18:41:40 <javispedro> arg0 iirc
Nov 06 18:41:57 <unixSnob> btw, I also have two instances of "browserd", and I haven't even started a browser yet
Nov 06 18:42:12 <unixSnob> both browserd instances are taking ~40% memory
Nov 06 18:42:28 <javispedro> messybox's top memory indicators are broken
Nov 06 18:42:49 <unixSnob> javispedro: what do you mean arg0?  how do I see what arg 0 is?
Nov 06 18:43:21 <javispedro> I do not remember the exact ps syntax, check man
Nov 06 18:43:32 <unixSnob> I do a ps, and see hildon-desktop
Nov 06 18:43:55 <unixSnob> (that is, hildon-desktop matches the process number shown in top to be maemo-launcher)
Nov 06 18:44:05 <javispedro> there you have.
Nov 06 18:44:26 <unixSnob> javispedro: shouldn't I only have one desktop?
Nov 06 18:44:40 <javispedro> two is fine.
Nov 06 18:46:59 <unixSnob> i have to reboot daily, because my device crashes with "operation timed out.. out of memory" popups
Nov 06 18:47:36 <unixSnob> I'm not sure how to approach this.  I was hoping /var/log would show me what I have installed recently
Nov 06 18:47:54 <unixSnob> dpkg -l shows me what's isntalled in total.. but not on a timeline
Nov 06 18:50:51 <unixSnob> wow.. alarmd eats CPU like crazy when I simply launch a browser.  That can't be normal
Nov 06 18:52:23 <alterego> Ooo, blade runner is on tonight :D
Nov 06 18:53:24 <unixSnob> i just read that someone's n800 became sluggish after installing gpe calandar.. that's probably my problem.  I installed that recently, and alarmd is working too much
Nov 06 18:54:06 <unixSnob> at least, I think I installed GPE calandar
Nov 06 18:54:33 <unixSnob> is that an extra tool, or something that's essential?
Nov 06 18:56:33 * unixSnob removes gpe calandar, just for shits and giggles
Nov 06 18:57:10 <unixSnob> I have no idea where the phrase "just for shits and giggles" comes from.. I just use it based on the context that I've heard it
Nov 06 19:00:56 <gpgp1> Is there anyone here who could help me get going in the right direction ?
Nov 06 19:02:06 * joga pushes gpgp1 towards the bar
Nov 06 19:02:15 <gpgp1> i have a n810, flashed yesterday says its version 5.2008.43-7
Nov 06 19:02:22 <gpgp1> lol that will help lots
Nov 06 19:02:27 <joga> :)
Nov 06 19:02:55 <gpgp1> repos are messed up cant install from app manager, dependencies not resolved by apt-get
Nov 06 19:03:17 <joga> hmm, apt-get update?
Nov 06 19:03:24 <gpgp1> havent used the device in a while, maps are missing says it cant find card but card is mounted
Nov 06 19:03:43 <gpgp1> i run that i get errors and it says to run that to resolve the errors
Nov 06 19:04:20 <joga> it's online anyway etc?
Nov 06 19:04:33 <gpgp1> yes can connect to network and repos
Nov 06 19:04:59 <gpgp1> was able to add some repos, but some are broken / updated with new names
Nov 06 19:05:08 <joga> k, well I haven't used the n810 myself so hard to guess right now..
Nov 06 19:05:58 <gpgp1> the hardware seems fine, i am lost about flashing then not being able to use app manager
Nov 06 19:07:09 <unixSnob> anyone in here nerdy enough to use PGP email?  Does claws mail work?
Nov 06 19:07:45 <unixSnob> i mean, does claws mail work for PGP mail?  It's claimed to, but I thought essential algorithms were excluded from libcrypt
Nov 06 19:08:05 <unixSnob> so I'm not sure how claws mail could work as claimed
Nov 06 19:09:30 <javispedro> fscking gentoo.
Nov 06 19:09:41 <gpgp1> is there a correct order to updating apps / adding repos after a flash ? or a current list of working repos ?
Nov 06 19:12:07 <tKMFDM> unixSnob, doesnt claws mail use gpg?
Nov 06 19:12:09 <tKMFDM> and its libraries
Nov 06 19:12:53 <unixSnob> tKMFDM: yeah, supposedly, but the libraries are missing some basic hashes (because the n800 had to be very lean)
Nov 06 19:13:41 <unixSnob> A very typical VPN configuration relies on a hash that the n800 is not capable of
Nov 06 19:13:57 <unixSnob> (because of the reduced libcrypt or whatever)
Nov 06 19:26:04 <lucent> N900 won't "see" flac files, what's wrong?
Nov 06 19:26:17 <lucent> I've tried 'tracker-process --hard-reset'
Nov 06 19:27:08 <ZogG> lucent maybe you need extra codecs package?
Nov 06 19:27:14 <Gorroth> hi
Nov 06 19:27:17 <ZogG> ~flac
Nov 06 19:27:17 <infobot> methinks flac is the Free Lossless Audio Codec, gives 30-50% compression on PCM audio. See http://flac.sourceforge.net/ for details on the format, or apt-get install flac xmms-flac to try it out (if you have xmms, of course).
Nov 06 19:27:19 <lucent> ZogG: I show them as being installed
Nov 06 19:27:26 <Gorroth> just uploaded my squid source packages to maemo for building
Nov 06 19:27:36 <Gorroth> maybe in a few minutes squid will be available.  it failed the first time
Nov 06 19:27:44 <ZogG> squid?
Nov 06 19:27:50 <Gorroth> squid http proxy
Nov 06 19:27:55 <ZogG> oh
Nov 06 19:28:01 <lucent> this is a new behavior since I updated maemo to 20.2010.36-2.002
Nov 06 19:28:06 <Gorroth> i've set it up to build with SSL bump and transparent proxy support
Nov 06 19:28:20 <lucent> since the update, flac files are not picked up by tracker-process, I guess?
Nov 06 19:28:21 <Gorroth> i'm working on making ettercap as well but have to modify the source code a bit
Nov 06 19:31:05 <tKMFDM> lucent, you have to manually add the files to media player in the file manager
Nov 06 19:31:15 <tKMFDM> i had the same issue with mpc files i have found no work around to get the tracker to see them
Nov 06 19:31:26 <lucent> http://code.google.com/p/extra-decoders-support-for-n900/issues/detail?id=11
Nov 06 19:31:37 <tKMFDM> but mpc files also weren't displayed in the media browser on pr1.2 for me
Nov 06 19:31:41 <lucent> looks like similar to my issue
Nov 06 19:32:06 <lucent> tKMFDM: must be mime type or something
Nov 06 19:32:17 <lucent> wish I knew the exact steps to figure out why
Nov 06 19:32:31 <tKMFDM> i found it pretty annoying as well as a lot of my collection is in mpc
Nov 06 19:32:41 <tKMFDM> it also doesn't read the ape tags on mpcs
Nov 06 19:32:53 <tKMFDM> so i have to do everything through file manager
Nov 06 19:33:02 <ZogG> lucent there was discussion on TMO
Nov 06 19:36:33 <timeless_xchat> does mappero have a "don't be stupid option" ?
Nov 06 19:37:15 <timeless_xchat> it seems to think that just because i've browsed away from my GPS location is a good reason to jump me back to it
Nov 06 19:38:09 * timeless_xchat beats the stuffing out of mappero
Nov 06 19:41:24 <Gorroth> the maemo autobuilder is a bit annoying.  it seems like it buffers all the build output instead of putting it directly in the logfiles visible on garage.maemo.org
Nov 06 19:41:28 <Gorroth> just so i can track its progress
Nov 06 19:42:11 <Gorroth> unf
Nov 06 19:42:20 <Gorroth> now the log file is up.. looks like build was good, but no email yet
Nov 06 19:42:36 <lcuk> Gorroth, https://garage.maemo.org/pipermail/extras-cauldron-builds/2010-November/thread.html
Nov 06 19:42:59 <lcuk> and from there you can access the specifics for each build
Nov 06 19:43:08 <lcuk> and enter the folder with full details as they are created
Nov 06 19:43:18 <lcuk> maemo autobuilder is not directly tied to garage
Nov 06 19:43:41 <Gorroth> hmm, okay
Nov 06 19:44:09 <Gorroth> well, i think the build is complete and it's just waiting to upload or do whatever else the builder does
Nov 06 19:45:53 <MohammadAG> does the blackberry messenger offer an API?
Nov 06 19:46:03 <MohammadAG> someone says he's "writing an app", which I doubt
Nov 06 19:48:44 <Gorroth> awesooooome!  now you guys can install squid on your i386 or armel maemo devices, such as the n900.  it has transparent proxying support and ssl bump included
Nov 06 19:48:50 <Gorroth> >:)
Nov 06 19:48:57 <Gorroth> in extras-devel
Nov 06 19:51:10 <kpel> hi guys. I noticed that the re is no PR1.3 image for UK yet. Has it been discontinued?
Nov 06 19:51:49 <wmarone> no
Nov 06 19:52:00 <wmarone> did you get yours via vodaphone?
Nov 06 19:53:19 <MohammadAG> the UK image is TBA
Nov 06 19:53:19 <MohammadAG> with no ETA
Nov 06 19:53:29 <MohammadAG> flash the global one
Nov 06 19:53:41 <haltdef> what exactly is the difference? seems identical to me
Nov 06 19:53:47 <kpel> wmarone: no. Nokia gave me one. I received a text some days ago saying there is an update but when i went to http://tablets-dev.nokia.com/nokia_N900.php i couldn't find the latest UK image.
Nov 06 19:54:01 <_trine> I had a notification to download the UK image
Nov 06 19:54:49 <unixSnob> boooooyaa! hell yea.. I'm so excited.. got a raging purple hardon
Nov 06 19:54:50 <kpel> MohammadAG: what is the difference? will there by any issues with the keyboard layout, localisation etc?
Nov 06 19:54:55 <unixSnob> claws mail works with GPG
Nov 06 19:55:15 <MohammadAG> kpel, nope, no major difference, only some package name changes
Nov 06 19:55:34 <MohammadAG> keyboard layout is stored in cal afaik, so it will be detected
Nov 06 19:55:49 <kpel> MohammadAG: ok thanks. i'll flash the global image
Nov 06 19:55:53 <kpel> btw what's cal?
Nov 06 19:56:27 <_trine> I tried to update my phone but each time it seemed to have finished the download it started from the beginning again
Nov 06 19:56:47 <_trine> this was the UK image
Nov 06 19:56:55 <MohammadAG> /dev/mtd1, it stores persistent stuff, such as IMEI etc
Nov 06 19:56:58 <_trine> for pr 1.3
Nov 06 19:57:02 <MohammadAG> and apparently, it logs which images you flashed
Nov 06 19:57:18 <kpel> i c
Nov 06 19:57:23 <MohammadAG> stores the lock code too
Nov 06 19:57:27 * lucent stabs codec-support
Nov 06 19:58:17 <_trine> MohammadAG, if I was invited to update on my uk phone then the UK pr 1.3 exists doesnt it ?
Nov 06 19:58:23 <MohammadAG> oh my
Nov 06 19:58:26 <MohammadAG> this logs everything
Nov 06 19:58:36 <MohammadAG> it has PR1.0's version number in it
Nov 06 20:01:24 <MohammadAG> and kernel flashes, bummer
Nov 06 20:02:57 <_trine> MohammadAG, I asked you a question
Nov 06 20:03:50 * _trine thinks hes fxcking invisible
Nov 06 20:04:11 <wmarone> no one's obligated to answer your questions ;)
Nov 06 20:04:26 <wmarone> anyway, it obviously exists because PR1.3 exists, why it isn't available in the UK is anyone's guess
Nov 06 20:04:33 <_trine> wmarone, yes otherwise you have to die
Nov 06 20:04:57 <_trine> wmarone, I was saying it looks like it IS
Nov 06 20:12:28 <unixSnob> yup.. gpe calandar is the peice of shit that was slowing everything down, causing memory to run out, when gpe cal wasn't even launched
Nov 06 20:12:53 <unixSnob> performance is back to normal, now that I removed GPE calandar
Nov 06 20:13:02 <Gorroth> unixSnob: yeah, i installed GPE once and promptly removed it, because it's horrible software
Nov 06 20:13:34 <unixSnob> Gorroth: you're lucky.  I paid for that for weeks
Nov 06 20:13:41 <unixSnob> finally had a chance to diagnose things
Nov 06 20:13:52 <Gorroth> well, i just didn't like the interface at all
Nov 06 20:13:59 <Gorroth> i never got a chacne to notice that problem
Nov 06 20:14:38 <unixSnob> it could be an n800-only problem
Nov 06 20:14:55 <unixSnob> gpe cal uses alarmd, apparently, and alarmd was changed quite a bit as I understand
Nov 06 20:17:40 <unixSnob> tKMFDM: i think this is the thread that mislead me => http://www.gossamer-threads.com/lists/maemo/developers/34803
Nov 06 20:18:00 <unixSnob> that thread leads you to think that you can sign, but not encrypt
Nov 06 20:18:07 <unixSnob> but encrpytion works
Nov 06 20:28:54 <MohammadAG> _trine, people sometimes idle
Nov 06 20:28:57 <Gorroth> just installed my new squid package that now sits on extras-devel.  please feel free to give it a whirl and see if you get SSL bump or transparent proxying setup
Nov 06 20:29:07 <Gorroth> my tests were just basic caching, but i did build in that stuff
Nov 06 20:29:46 <_trine> MohammadAG, bollocks you were here
Nov 06 20:29:50 <_trine> no matter
Nov 06 20:30:19 <MohammadAG> [21:55:50] <MohammadAG> and kernel flashes, bummer
Nov 06 20:30:20 <MohammadAG> [21:58:41] <_trine> -MohammadAG, if I was invited to update on my uk phone then the UK pr 1.3 exists doesnt it ?
Nov 06 20:30:42 <MohammadAG> there isn't a UK update
Nov 06 20:31:24 <_trine> MohammadAG, thats why I mentioned it,, I could not understand why I received a message to up date
Nov 06 20:32:02 <MohammadAG> cause that service (MyNokia?) is rather retarded
Nov 06 20:32:03 <_trine> and when I connected as it told me to do with the usb cable it did find an upgrade to pr .13
Nov 06 20:32:40 <_trine> but each time it downloaded the 200.2 meg it started again
Nov 06 20:33:01 <MohammadAG> then you're not on UK firmware
Nov 06 20:33:17 <_trine> I think I am
Nov 06 20:37:17 <_trine> MohammadAG, I just checked to make sure and I am on UK firmware
Nov 06 20:37:28 <GAN900> I hope Harmattan isn't completely portrait-biased.
Nov 06 20:37:59 <_trine> 10.2010.19-1-PR 1.2- UK version
Nov 06 20:38:21 <_trine> and it did find an update
Nov 06 20:39:25 <ZogG> GAN900> I hope Harmattan isn't completely portrait-biased. // so people keep complain?
Nov 06 20:39:27 <MohammadAG> _trine, then update
Nov 06 20:39:38 <Gorroth> GAN900: it can't be, because our n900 devices operate in landscape mode when the keyboard is slid out.  i hope apps flip
Nov 06 20:39:53 <Gorroth> i mean, it could be, but that just seems stupid
Nov 06 20:39:55 <_trine> MohammadAG, you dont appear to be paying attention tonight
Nov 06 20:40:09 <GAN900> ZogG, because I hate portrait for real usage.
Nov 06 20:40:21 <_trine> I told you I tried to update after it did find the firmware update
Nov 06 20:40:22 <Gorroth> really?  portrait is fantastic for websites
Nov 06 20:40:38 <ZogG> GAN900 i like both the same
Nov 06 20:40:42 <WakiMiko_> im trying to use the charge adapter to charge my n900 using an old nokia power supply
Nov 06 20:40:44 <WakiMiko_> but it doesnt work
Nov 06 20:40:49 <WakiMiko_> is that a well know problem?
Nov 06 20:40:57 <_trine> but after it downloaded it all 200.2 megs it kept starting over again
Nov 06 20:41:03 <GAN900> Gorroth, never found that to be the case at 480px
Nov 06 20:41:07 <WakiMiko_> btw my old power adaptor only outputs 3.7 volts
Nov 06 20:41:16 <Gorroth> GAN900: eh, to each their own
Nov 06 20:41:16 <ZogG> _trine on device?
Nov 06 20:41:23 <_trine> n900
Nov 06 20:41:34 <MohammadAG> the image isn't 200.2 MBs
Nov 06 20:41:40 <ZogG> broken file
Nov 06 20:41:46 <GAN900> Gorroth, indeed, I just hope my own doesn't fall by the wayside in the next device (although I know it will).
Nov 06 20:41:51 <_trine> MohammadAG, well thats what it said it was
Nov 06 20:41:58 <MohammadAG> it's lying
Nov 06 20:42:12 <_trine> MohammadAG, well thats why I mentioned it
Nov 06 20:42:22 <_trine> so at least you would know
Nov 06 20:42:26 <Gorroth> GAN900: i doubt it.  even android phone like the really popular Droid and Droid X support landscape.  it is something people love for particular kinds of use-cases, and they won't get rid of it
Nov 06 20:42:28 <doubleukay> portrait makes a web page overview look good. but i prefer reading in landscape.
Nov 06 20:42:55 <_trine> MohammadAG, how big should the file be?
Nov 06 20:43:18 <_trine> appox will do
Nov 06 20:43:32 <MohammadAG> 179
Nov 06 20:43:51 <MohammadAG> well more
Nov 06 20:43:52 <MohammadAG> 191M	Desktop/PR1.3/RX-51_2009SE_20.2010.36-2_PR_COMBINED_MR0_ARM.bin
Nov 06 20:44:03 <_trine> hmm well thats odd because it was downloading a 200.2 meg file
Nov 06 20:45:41 <_trine> It tries to finish the download and when it seems to fail it retries 3 times before giving up
Nov 06 20:46:13 <_trine> but it definatly says it has found pr 1.3
Nov 06 20:46:53 <lucent> tKMFDM: possible fix for the tracker stuff
Nov 06 20:48:13 <lucent> tKMFDM: apt-get remove --purge gstreamer0.10-ffmpeg gstreamer0.10-flv gstreamer0.10-musepack gstreamer0.10-rm gstreamer0.10-mkv gstreamer 0.10-plugins-bad-extra tracker-distutils ogg-support gstreamer0.10-vp8
Nov 06 20:48:22 <lucent> tKMFDM: apt-get autoremove --purge
Nov 06 20:48:31 <lucent> tKMFDM: apt-get install codec-support
Nov 06 20:49:02 <lucent> welll that last line was no good
Nov 06 20:49:14 <lucent> tKMFDM: sorry, it should be apt-get install decoders-support
Nov 06 20:49:46 <MohammadAG> chem|st, ping
Nov 06 20:50:51 <ZogG> damn that sms bug is annoying
Nov 06 20:51:03 <ZogG> even when it's over after some reboots it comes back
Nov 06 20:53:28 <merlin1991> where's the difference btw libsdl-mixer1.2 1.2.6-5+0m5 from the image and libsdl-mixer1.2 1.2.6-5+0m5+ogg+mp3 from extras?
Nov 06 20:53:29 <lucent> I wish google voice SMS was integrated into the maemo SMS
Nov 06 20:57:34 <sjk> Hello! I'm trying to make my own desktop shortcut as described here: http://wiki.maemo.org/Easy_Debian#Creating_desktop_shortcuts_in_Maemo. I want to execute ossa-xterm with a command
Nov 06 20:58:05 <sjk> I've tried: Exec=/usr/bin/ossa-xterm ssh a.b.com
Nov 06 21:01:51 <lcuk> Noobmonk3y, how much of HC is now pure qt?
Nov 06 21:02:15 <Noobmonk3y_> new or old?
Nov 06 21:02:24 <Noobmonk3y_> and i assume you mean code v gui?
Nov 06 21:02:25 <lcuk> new
Nov 06 21:03:22 <Noobmonk3y_> erm, all of the screens are gui'd but all actions, etc are hcoded, so... erm 70 code
Nov 06 21:03:24 <Noobmonk3y_> ish
Nov 06 21:03:32 <lcuk> qt or python still?
Nov 06 21:03:41 <Noobmonk3y_> oh qt
Nov 06 21:03:42 <Noobmonk3y_> all
Nov 06 21:03:46 <Gorroth> buildin' ettercap
Nov 06 21:03:56 <Gorroth> damn it; it still fails
Nov 06 21:04:02 <Noobmonk3y_> which is why ists developing so slowly :)
Nov 06 21:04:05 <Noobmonk3y_> hehe
Nov 06 21:05:02 <Noobmonk3y_> so learning c++/qt all in one go, pretty much like b4
Nov 06 21:06:26 <Noobmonk3y_> oooo rdp works damn well on the n900, v impressed
Nov 06 21:06:32 <Gorroth> it does?
Nov 06 21:06:37 <Gorroth> hadn't even thought to try it
Nov 06 21:07:01 <Noobmonk3y_> just trying it now, cross 3g, no lag!
Nov 06 21:07:15 <Gorroth> nice
Nov 06 21:07:30 <Gorroth> i just like how hackable the n900 is
Nov 06 21:07:39 <Gorroth> don't really like it as a phone though; not yet
Nov 06 21:07:42 <Gorroth> maybe meego will improve that
Nov 06 21:07:58 <ZogG> yeah i wanted n810 wimax
Nov 06 21:08:00 <Noobmonk3y_> lol!
Nov 06 21:08:04 <ZogG> but than n900 was out
Nov 06 21:08:10 <Noobmonk3y_> hehe, hardly use it as a phone
Nov 06 21:08:14 <ZogG> so i said i would have a phone and n810 like device
Nov 06 21:08:23 <ZogG> but i was wrong
Nov 06 21:08:25 <Noobmonk3y_> but as a mini pc it aint bad
Nov 06 21:08:37 <ZogG> should go for nexus + n810
Nov 06 21:08:40 <Noobmonk3y_> lol
Nov 06 21:08:49 <Noobmonk3y_> its works well enough for me
Nov 06 21:08:58 <Noobmonk3y_> lcuk, why the qt q?
Nov 06 21:09:44 <Noobmonk3y_> frals, evenin!
Nov 06 21:09:54 <Gorroth> i use my nexus one as a phone
Nov 06 21:10:02 <Noobmonk3y_> :)
Nov 06 21:10:23 <Noobmonk3y_> i have a shitty e71, actually prefer the n900 as a phone :)
Nov 06 21:11:36 <Noobmonk3y_> MohammadAG, wayyyy to quiet in here, are you and frals plotting to trout the world again?
Nov 06 21:11:53 <lcuk> Noobmonk3y_, pondering whether it will work easily on meego :P
Nov 06 21:12:11 <Noobmonk3y_> mine wont at present, but will when i'm done
Nov 06 21:12:20 <lcuk> thats excellent
Nov 06 21:12:28 * MohammadAG kicks Noobmonk3y 
Nov 06 21:12:40 <Noobmonk3y_> i have it all locked in 'if maemo5' statements at the mo, courtesy of Mo
Nov 06 21:12:47 <MohammadAG> lcuk, see? I didn't spank him
Nov 06 21:12:56 <lcuk> good good
Nov 06 21:13:03 <Noobmonk3y_> so when i eventually try meego, i should be able to add the specific doe
Nov 06 21:13:07 <Noobmonk3y_> cod*
Nov 06 21:13:10 <Noobmonk3y_> e
Nov 06 21:13:29 <Noobmonk3y_> maybe i could get smaller thumbs to type with at the same time!
Nov 06 21:13:47 * MohammadAG wants them Rock band 3 pro instruments
Nov 06 21:13:53 <Noobmonk3y_> lol
Nov 06 21:14:00 <lcuk> infinite Noobmonk3y_'s typing on infinite n900s
Nov 06 21:14:22 <Noobmonk3y_> lcuk..... thats a scary thought!!!
Nov 06 21:15:11 <lcuk> yeah
Nov 06 21:15:21 <lcuk> having one of you around is bad enough :P
Nov 06 21:15:48 <Noobmonk3y_> what bugs me about meego, is i know i could try it now... but i will wait like the rest until it is usable, therefore, release an app 6months after it is out again.....
Nov 06 21:16:06 <Noobmonk3y_> lol
Nov 06 21:16:07 <kerio> every man has 6 legs
Nov 06 21:16:25 <Noobmonk3y_> kerio, wow
Nov 06 21:16:32 <kerio> no man has 4 legs, one man has two legs more than no man, one man has 6 legs - extend for all men
Nov 06 21:16:46 <Noobmonk3y_> :)
Nov 06 21:16:59 <lcuk> Noobmonk3y_, if you make HC carefully enough and try to retain standard api usage, you could theoretically have HC released for you without any intervention from yourself :P
Nov 06 21:17:31 <lcuk> hc on n8
Nov 06 21:17:34 <Noobmonk3y_> not true, it calls specific maemo terminal commands still, so i will need to research and change ema ll
Nov 06 21:17:41 <_trine> 6 legs
Nov 06 21:18:04 <Noobmonk3y_> n8 using symbian?
Nov 06 21:18:11 <lcuk> with qt ontop
Nov 06 21:18:18 <Noobmonk3y_> true
Nov 06 21:18:24 <Noobmonk3y_> the recode will be easier
Nov 06 21:18:34 <Noobmonk3y_> but tis still device specific atm
Nov 06 21:18:41 <lcuk> sure
Nov 06 21:19:06 <lcuk> you will be able to slowly move pieces over, one at a time even, from the console hack to the specific api
Nov 06 21:19:29 <Noobmonk3y_> the aim would be a cool multi device tool... but it myay be a few generations of it before i'm happy hehe
Nov 06 21:19:40 <lcuk> indeed
Nov 06 21:19:41 <Noobmonk3y_> lcuk, hopefully!
Nov 06 21:20:15 <Noobmonk3y_> would be nice to have decent api documentation for all fuctions :)
Nov 06 21:23:11 <lcuk> Noobmonk3y_, theres a fully documented set of meego api stuff around - once the link comes active again i will show you
Nov 06 21:23:34 <Noobmonk3y_> yay! thanks lcuk , will be v useful!
Nov 06 21:24:14 <Noobmonk3y_> i'm up for a new device in april, crossing fingers there is a meego one out around then!
Nov 06 21:24:50 <MohammadAG> and a Symbian API
Nov 06 21:25:00 <Noobmonk3y_> lol
Nov 06 21:25:05 <lcuk> and a drizzle lemon cakre
Nov 06 21:25:08 <lcuk> cake
Nov 06 21:25:19 <Noobmonk3y_> oooo cake
Nov 06 21:25:34 <Noobmonk3y_> mandy has been chocolate making today! yay!
Nov 06 21:26:03 <Noobmonk3y_> so i'm sitting here with a test of all types, and wine.... tough life
Nov 06 21:26:28 <lcuk> Noobmonk3y_, i am going to have to borrow Mandy, I hope you do not object
Nov 06 21:26:54 <Noobmonk3y_> harsh!!!!
Nov 06 21:27:18 <lcuk> Noobmonk3y_, i would like to sample her sweet confectionary
Nov 06 21:27:28 <Noobmonk3y_> take her and you take my cake and chocolate supply, my hairdresser, accountant and oh, girlfriend lol
Nov 06 21:28:05 <lcuk> lol
Nov 06 21:28:19 <Noobmonk3y_> :)
Nov 06 21:29:16 <MohammadAG> the more you see on youtube the more you wish you never "evolved"
Nov 06 21:29:39 <Noobmonk3y_> MohammadAG,  some of us haven't
Nov 06 21:29:46 * Noobmonk3y_ looks at frals
Nov 06 21:30:11 <lucent> having seen the "double rainbow guy" youtube video, I agree
Nov 06 21:30:31 <lcuk> Noobmonk3y_, http://apidocs.meego.com/1.1/core/html/index.html
Nov 06 21:31:12 <Noobmonk3y_> thankyou!
Nov 06 21:31:33 * lcuk had wrong url in head, hence thinking it was broke a minute ago
Nov 06 21:31:51 <Noobmonk3y_> lol!
Nov 06 21:31:59 <Noobmonk3y_> yay to system api!
Nov 06 21:32:57 <Noobmonk3y_> oooo can i start using some of this on the N900 now?
Nov 06 21:34:12 <lcuk> Noobmonk3y_, yes - qt.47 and mobility classes are available in pr1.3
Nov 06 21:34:34 <Noobmonk3y_> w00t
Nov 06 21:34:44 <lcuk> w00t_ you mean :P
Nov 06 21:34:46 <Noobmonk3y_> darn need to start hc again!
Nov 06 21:34:53 <lcuk> lol @ you and hardcore
Nov 06 21:34:53 <Noobmonk3y_> lol
Nov 06 21:35:01 <lcuk> you are a sex maniac :P
Nov 06 21:35:04 <Noobmonk3y_> it is harcore!
Nov 06 21:35:11 <Noobmonk3y_> and yes, yes...... yes...
Nov 06 21:35:20 <Noobmonk3y_> :)
Nov 06 21:39:49 <lcuk> can someone please kick Noobmonk3y_ - he is gross and vile
Nov 06 21:39:55 <Noobmonk3y_> :)
Nov 06 21:40:04 <lcuk> :D
Nov 06 21:40:04 * Noobmonk3y_ giggles
Nov 06 21:40:11 * lcuk opens the window
Nov 06 21:40:14 <kerio> is that a challenge?
Nov 06 21:40:14 <lcuk> then laughs a bit
Nov 06 21:40:43 <Noobmonk3y_> lcuk drugged me and took me out the back.... the started talking to me about sweet things....
Nov 06 21:40:46 <lcuk> no kerio - good fun humour is different to the repulsiveness at your links
Nov 06 21:40:50 <kerio> oh, i see
Nov 06 21:40:55 <Noobmonk3y_> lol
Nov 06 21:42:30 <unixSnob> when I run "dpkg -l" I get a list of packages w/ versions, but not sizes.  How can I see the amount of space that would be freed up if I remove packages?
Nov 06 21:42:48 <unixSnob> i'd like to get it as a list, but if that's not possible, I can script it to give me a list
Nov 06 21:43:33 <lcuk> unixSnob, last time ii needed that, i was interested in the package sizes (download size) not the on disk result size, but
Nov 06 21:43:57 <lcuk> having said that, there are some apps on extras and devel which can detect installed size (space on each partition for optify purposes)
Nov 06 21:44:02 <Noobmonk3y_> brb
Nov 06 21:44:03 <lcuk> so reading their source might reveal
Nov 06 21:45:06 <unixSnob> lcuk: that wouldn't be the full picture either though.. Eg. you remove 1 package, but apt-get sees 5 other packages that could be removed along with it
Nov 06 21:45:25 <lcuk> unixSnob, sure
Nov 06 21:45:31 <lcuk> but thats a different problem again
Nov 06 21:45:39 <lcuk> you would have to recursively generate a tree
Nov 06 21:45:50 <lcuk> including the specific working set of files in that package alone
Nov 06 21:45:56 <nox-> moin
Nov 06 21:45:56 <internetishard> pidgin-otr isn't working on maemo
Nov 06 21:45:59 <unixSnob> I'm thinking I can maybe do a "apt-get remove..." but with a show effort flag
Nov 06 21:46:08 <internetishard> http://www.mail-archive.com/otr-users@lists.cypherpunks.ca/msg00045.html same as this - any ideas?
Nov 06 21:46:09 <lcuk> then sum up the dependencies etc
Nov 06 21:49:04 <unixSnob> bummer.. doesn't work as I hoped.  I tried => apt-get -s remove osso-backup
Nov 06 21:49:17 <unixSnob> but it doesn't actually show how much space it frees up in the simulation
Nov 06 21:51:04 <internetishard> http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=47104&page=2 this says "use Q&A method" on the n900, but I don't see it anywhere in OTR options
Nov 06 22:05:12 <GAN900> Is there a clock with seconds floating around anywhere?
Nov 06 22:06:14 * alterego looks at his wall
Nov 06 22:06:19 <alterego> I've got one :P
Nov 06 22:10:04 <GAN900> Need to set the clocks on a bunch of Win98 machines
Nov 06 22:11:25 <ieatlint> go to terminal, type "watch -n1 date" and zoom in :P
Nov 06 22:11:55 <GAN900> Perfect
Nov 06 22:12:00 <GAN900> thanks, ieatlint.
Nov 06 22:13:32 <ieatlint> np
Nov 06 22:18:52 <ieatlint> there any git gurus in here?
Nov 06 22:19:21 <lcuk> ieatlint, dunno, ask the question, someone who isnt a guru might have encountered it before
Nov 06 22:19:38 <ieatlint> heh, indeed, i'm guilty of a classic faux paux
Nov 06 22:20:13 <ieatlint> anyone know how to setup a git checkout that pushes changes to two git repos (the repos synced -- i want to host the code on two different servers)
Nov 06 22:20:54 <ieatlint> and to add to my bullshit, i think i just answered my own question, heh
Nov 06 22:29:18 <lcuk> ieatlint, :) taking a few moments to present a question often has that effect
Nov 06 22:29:49 <ieatlint> yeah, "git remote" works nicely
Nov 06 22:29:53 <ieatlint> :)
Nov 06 22:30:15 * timeless_xchat sighs
Nov 06 22:31:40 <lcuk> hey timeless
Nov 06 22:32:17 <sivang> timeless_mbp: why sigh?
Nov 06 22:32:56 <timeless_mbp> i just tried using the Camera and Media Player
Nov 06 22:33:08 <timeless_mbp> they have "interesting" "features"
Nov 06 22:33:17 <alterego> Yes, they don't work together :P
Nov 06 22:33:20 <timeless_mbp> they both occasionally show you time in the form of "00:00"
Nov 06 22:33:29 <timeless_mbp> unfortunately, they don't use a monospace font for this
Nov 06 22:33:37 <timeless_mbp> nor do they ask for "tabular numbers"
Nov 06 22:33:55 <timeless_mbp> they do otoh have text or glyphs whose layout is affected by their length
Nov 06 22:33:56 <sivang> so it is very hard to read?
Nov 06 22:34:01 <timeless_mbp> no, it jitters!
Nov 06 22:34:07 <timeless_mbp> always a good idea...
Nov 06 22:34:11 <sivang> ah, I got used to that already...
Nov 06 22:34:18 * timeless_mbp slaps sivang
Nov 06 22:34:20 <sivang> stuff has been more jittering in 1.3
Nov 06 22:34:23 <sivang> hehe
Nov 06 22:34:28 <timeless_mbp> bad fake user
Nov 06 22:34:34 <sivang> and hebrew fonts got a bit more ugly...
Nov 06 22:34:38 <timeless_mbp> the other thing is spiffier
Nov 06 22:34:57 <timeless_mbp> in the media player while playing a video, if you tap the screen, you get buttons at the bottom
Nov 06 22:35:05 <timeless_mbp> … if you press and hold on e.g. the left button (sharing)
Nov 06 22:35:15 <timeless_mbp> the bottom of the glyph gets chopped off
Nov 06 22:35:21 <timeless_mbp> because the icon wasn't ugly enough as is
Nov 06 22:35:29 <timeless_mbp> s/is/designed/
Nov 06 22:35:30 <infobot> timeless_mbp meant: because the icon wasn't ugly enough as designed
Nov 06 22:35:46 * timeless_mbp waits for people to run out and try these "features"
Nov 06 22:36:06 <lcuk> timeless_mbp, on which os
Nov 06 22:36:16 <timeless_mbp> Maemo PR1.3?
Nov 06 22:36:26 <timeless_mbp> are there other os's that matter in #maemo? :)
Nov 06 22:36:39 <sivang> timeless_mbp: I never upgraded to 1.3
Nov 06 22:36:45 <sivang> timeless_mbp: been reading horror stories
Nov 06 22:36:49 <timeless_mbp> gah!
Nov 06 22:36:54 <sivang> yes :/
Nov 06 22:36:57 <alterego> I've not had a prob with 1.3 :/
Nov 06 22:37:01 <timeless_mbp> 1.3 gives you working support for WPS
Nov 06 22:37:07 <sivang> WPS?
Nov 06 22:37:15 <timeless_mbp> WiFi Protected Setup
Nov 06 22:37:18 <lcuk> hm
Nov 06 22:37:29 <nox-> oh nice
Nov 06 22:37:29 <timeless_mbp> (namely it gives you two copies of each WPS network, one for Classic Password, and one for WPS)
Nov 06 22:37:35 <sivang> timeless_mbp: you mean the auto setting itself stuff?
Nov 06 22:37:37 <alterego> Well, that's a slight annoyance removed :D
Nov 06 22:37:48 <timeless_mbp> since no one actually uses WPS, you can now actually connect w/o manual pain
Nov 06 22:38:06 <timeless_mbp> sivang: yeah, but the reality is that very people know how to use WPS
Nov 06 22:38:15 <timeless_mbp> WPS is basically standard in all new wifi routers
Nov 06 22:38:28 <timeless_mbp> but WPS education is non standard in normal humans
Nov 06 22:38:38 <timeless_mbp> so you get people who say "my password is XXXX"
Nov 06 22:38:45 <timeless_mbp> and you look at your pr1.2 device and cry
Nov 06 22:38:45 <ShadowJK> I remember using WPS in 1.2 and making it talk to a wifi router fine :/
Nov 06 22:38:55 <sivang> timeless_mbp: I never configured my routers to support it so I don't think I'd care..
Nov 06 22:38:58 <alterego> Yeah, I had to previously manually setup WPS in routers on some free hotspots
Nov 06 22:39:02 <timeless_mbp> ShadowJK: using a password or using the WPS part?
Nov 06 22:39:07 <ShadowJK> timeless, the wps part
Nov 06 22:39:17 <timeless_mbp> ShadowJK: this is about the non wps version
Nov 06 22:39:23 <ShadowJK> ah
Nov 06 22:39:25 <nidO> ShadowJK: that always worked fine
Nov 06 22:39:32 <sivang> timeless_mbp: where do you get WPS eduction? ;)
Nov 06 22:39:33 <alterego> Yeah
Nov 06 22:39:44 <nidO> the problem was trying to use a pw instead on a wps enabled router, where you'd have to at a public hotspot for example
Nov 06 22:39:46 <timeless_mbp> sivang =~ s/eduction/education/
Nov 06 22:40:04 <timeless_mbp> anyway, it was possible to work around it, you manually configured the network
Nov 06 22:40:07 <alterego> But manually adding connections in settings was an annoying pain. :)
Nov 06 22:40:07 <sivang> timeless_mbp: yes, sorry, I need a new laptop
Nov 06 22:40:13 <timeless_mbp> but that's incredibly painful
Nov 06 22:40:20 <timeless_mbp> anyway, pr1.3 solves this
Nov 06 22:40:29 <sivang> right, so it is easier with 1.3?
Nov 06 22:40:31 <sivang> nice!
Nov 06 22:40:34 <timeless_mbp> you get 2 available networks
Nov 06 22:40:36 <sivang> I should try it then
Nov 06 22:40:40 <timeless_mbp> one labeled WPS and one not
Nov 06 22:40:45 <ShadowJK> I need to ask work for time off so I have enough time to upgrade to 1.3 in case it goes wrong again :)
Nov 06 22:40:52 <timeless_mbp> if you want to use WPS you pick the labeled one, if not, you pick the other
Nov 06 22:40:59 <timeless_mbp> ShadowJK: lol
Nov 06 22:41:01 <sivang> ShadowJK: :)
Nov 06 22:41:13 <timeless_mbp> anyway, would someone please try my media player bug?
Nov 06 22:41:20 <timeless_mbp> i'd love to know that it works in pr1.2
Nov 06 22:41:26 <sivang> ShadowJK: same here, I can't afford to screw it now but the topic here said that 1.3 is slowly coming, be patient
Nov 06 22:41:30 <ShadowJK> timeless, I don'
Nov 06 22:41:31 <timeless_mbp> i'm too lazy to stretch out my arm to the pr1.2 n900 w/ me :)
Nov 06 22:41:36 <sivang> timeless_mbp: I have 1.2
Nov 06 22:41:37 <ShadowJK> timeless, I don't remember seeing share icons in 1.2
Nov 06 22:41:41 <sivang> timeless_mbp: let's try
Nov 06 22:41:50 <sivang> timeless_mbp: can you again explain how to reproduce?
Nov 06 22:42:04 <timeless_mbp> play a video
Nov 06 22:42:09 <timeless_mbp> tap the screen
Nov 06 22:42:09 * sivang does
Nov 06 22:42:11 <timeless_mbp> you should see a scrub bar
Nov 06 22:42:19 <timeless_mbp> on the left edge of the bar
Nov 06 22:42:24 <timeless_mbp> are two buttons, share and trash
Nov 06 22:42:31 <timeless_mbp> look at the "pretty" picture
Nov 06 22:42:45 <timeless_mbp> now press the top part of the "pretty" picture, and look at the bottom part
Nov 06 22:42:52 <timeless_mbp> it should be chopped off while pressed
Nov 06 22:42:54 <sivang> pretty picture?
Nov 06 22:43:02 <timeless_mbp> it's a glyph
Nov 06 22:43:02 <sivang> the share icon got chopped though
Nov 06 22:43:08 <timeless_mbp> done by a graphically challenged artist
Nov 06 22:43:12 <sivang> hehe
Nov 06 22:43:20 <timeless_mbp> further challenged by someone's clever use of cropping
Nov 06 22:43:27 <timeless_mbp> repeat for trash
Nov 06 22:43:29 <sivang> it is something I would expect 70's reproductionof war of the worlds
Nov 06 22:43:33 <ShadowJK> a marginal part of the jingle bells on the sticks get castrated slightly in 1.2
Nov 06 22:43:38 <timeless_mbp> for bonus points, try to get screen captures
Nov 06 22:43:41 <sivang> but it will trash my video no?
Nov 06 22:43:50 <timeless_mbp> sivang: there's a confirm dialog
Nov 06 22:44:01 <timeless_mbp> ShadowJK: right
Nov 06 22:44:02 <sivang> timeless_mbp: can I trust it? ;-)
Nov 06 22:44:09 <ShadowJK> screen captures wont work at all with media player, I'm sure. You'll get green with UI, or black with UI :)
Nov 06 22:44:12 <timeless_mbp> sivang: i've done it a couple of times
Nov 06 22:44:18 <timeless_mbp> ShadowJK: oddly, it worked fine for me
Nov 06 22:44:20 <sivang> timeless_mbp: ok, /me tries
Nov 06 22:44:28 <timeless_mbp> well, for some definition of fine
Nov 06 22:44:30 <timeless_mbp> it shows the bug
Nov 06 22:44:40 <timeless_mbp> but note: it's a royal pain to take screen shots of this
Nov 06 22:44:44 <ShadowJK> timeless, fancy. Either they killed hw accel, or they went to great lengths to make screenshots work
Nov 06 22:44:57 <timeless_mbp> ShadowJK: i don't need a picture of the movie
Nov 06 22:44:58 <timeless_mbp> just the ui
Nov 06 22:45:01 <ShadowJK> ah right.
Nov 06 22:45:03 <sivang> timeless_mbp: trsh can get's cut of its bottom part, yes
Nov 06 22:45:06 <sivang> darn
Nov 06 22:45:23 <timeless_mbp> anyway, i need to try to figure out how to do a demo showing these things
Nov 06 22:45:23 <sivang> looking more like athens
Nov 06 22:45:27 <timeless_mbp> heh
Nov 06 22:45:28 <timeless_mbp> yes
Nov 06 22:45:33 <sivang> timeless_mbp: we can do with my N900
Nov 06 22:45:43 <sivang> timeless_mbp: if we get a projector and I bring my cables
Nov 06 22:45:48 <sivang> timeless_mbp: for the talk?
Nov 06 22:45:50 <timeless_mbp> yeah
Nov 06 22:45:56 <timeless_mbp> please make sure they know we want to project
Nov 06 22:46:03 <timeless_mbp> oddly, i have *2* cables w/ me atm
Nov 06 22:46:10 <timeless_mbp> otoh, i have *2* devices too, so ...
Nov 06 22:46:12 <sivang> I am going to write an email wit our reqs tomorrow
Nov 06 22:46:26 <sivang> timeless_mbp: mine is going to be with me as my phone so not a problem
Nov 06 22:46:44 <sivang> timeless_mbp: btw, how are we gonna pull the ui handouts stuff?
Nov 06 22:46:57 <sivang> timeless_mbp: also, take note that talk time has been shortened for 40minutes for the longest ones
Nov 06 22:47:09 <timeless_mbp> 'guess we have to finish that by wednesday :)
Nov 06 22:47:12 <timeless_mbp> i'll figure it out then
Nov 06 22:47:20 <timeless_mbp> i'm still @Lyon right now
Nov 06 22:47:26 <sivang> timeless_mbp: right, I figured
Nov 06 22:48:13 <sivang> timeless_mbp: ui handouts were your suggestion, hence why I'm asking- for my parts, I will send you soemthingto see hopefully the day after tomorrwo (always wanted to say that!)
Nov 06 22:48:29 <sivang> timeless_mbp: been cranking on this document store for the last couple of days..
Nov 06 22:57:25 <unixSnob> answer to my question => dpkg -l | awk '{print $2}' | sed -e '1,5d'\ | while read p; do dpkg -s $p; done | grep -E '(Package:|Installed-Size)'\ | sed -e '/Package/N;{;s/Package: \(.*\)Installed-Size: \(.*\)/\2 \1/;};' | grep '[0-9]\{4,\}' | sort -n
Nov 06 22:57:53 <timeless_mbp> ENOTENGLISH
Nov 06 22:57:57 <timeless_mbp> EAWK
Nov 06 22:59:55 <Noobmonk3y> ooo i left irc on :P
Nov 06 23:00:13 <unixSnob> xulrunner is my biggest app.  Is that part of the stock browser?
Nov 06 23:00:16 <Noobmonk3y_> slag
Nov 06 23:00:27 * Noobmonk3y punches Noobmonk3y_
Nov 06 23:00:39 <timeless_mbp> unixSnob: no
Nov 06 23:00:44 <timeless_mbp> that's fennec
Nov 06 23:01:01 <timeless_mbp> apt-cache rdepends or something?
Nov 06 23:01:52 <unixSnob> hmm.. i installed fennec at one point to play around with alternate browsers.. then removed it
Nov 06 23:02:02 <unixSnob> xulrunner should have been removed too
Nov 06 23:02:28 <timeless_mbp> apt-cache show xulrunner|more
Nov 06 23:02:38 <timeless_mbp> MAintainer: Mobile Feedback <mobile-feedback@mozilla.com>
Nov 06 23:02:41 <timeless_mbp> s/MA/Ma/
Nov 06 23:02:43 <infobot> timeless_mbp meant: Maintainer: Mobile Feedback <mobile-feedback@mozilla.com>
Nov 06 23:02:46 <timeless_mbp> does that look like nokia?
Nov 06 23:02:56 <timeless_mbp> section: user/hidden
Nov 06 23:02:58 <timeless_mbp> funny.
Nov 06 23:03:27 <timeless_mbp> it even has a Description: field clearly implicating Firefox
Nov 06 23:03:32 <timeless_mbp> as well as a Maemo-Display-Name
Nov 06 23:03:45 <timeless_mbp> anyway, since it's in user/*, it's probably visible in add remove
Nov 06 23:04:03 <ShadowJK> firefox, fennec, microb... people confuse the 3 together
Nov 06 23:04:08 <timeless_mbp> or whatever the poorly localized app manager was called by some idiotic finn
Nov 06 23:04:09 <ShadowJK> ;)
Nov 06 23:04:32 <timeless_mbp> ShadowJK: because 'f' and 'm' are so close on the keyboard?
Nov 06 23:04:47 <ShadowJK> no because that's what marketing do
Nov 06 23:04:50 <ShadowJK> create confusion
Nov 06 23:05:06 * timeless_mbp rotfl
Nov 06 23:05:08 <timeless_mbp> > "Older Americans are less healthy than their English counterparts, but they live as long or even longer than their English peers,
Nov 06 23:06:40 <unixSnob> wtf.. If I run => apt-get remove xulrunner <= it tells me "Package xulrunner is not installed, so not removed"
Nov 06 23:07:05 <timeless_mbp> it probably has conf files
Nov 06 23:07:09 <unixSnob> but when I run =>  dpkg -l xulrunner <=  i get "rc  xulrunner                              1.9.2a1pre-20090312092403              XUL runtime package"
Nov 06 23:07:14 <timeless_mbp> yep
Nov 06 23:07:19 <timeless_mbp> it's dead, but has conf files
Nov 06 23:07:23 <timeless_mbp> go read the top of dpkg -l
Nov 06 23:07:39 <timeless_mbp> power users are funny
Nov 06 23:08:12 <unixSnob> top line is "Status=Not/Installed/Config-files/Unpacked/Failed-config/Half-installed"
Nov 06 23:08:56 <unixSnob> that's not readable
Nov 06 23:09:06 <timeless_mbp> welcome to Linux
Nov 06 23:09:07 <unixSnob> installed... half-installed
Nov 06 23:09:19 <timeless_mbp> where we do unreadability as an artform
Nov 06 23:09:44 <timeless_mbp> Like Unix, but worse
Nov 06 23:11:16 <unixSnob> i removed the config file, but dpkg -l still shows it's not gone
Nov 06 23:11:46 <unixSnob> rm /etc/gre.d/1.9.2a1pre.system.conf
Nov 06 23:11:57 <unixSnob> what else do I need to remove?
Nov 06 23:12:49 <timeless_mbp> try man dpkg —purge ?
Nov 06 23:14:19 <unixSnob> that's better
Nov 06 23:14:24 <unixSnob> thnkas
Nov 06 23:18:14 <sp3000> r as in Desired=Remove, c as in Status=Conf-files, it's like right there
Nov 06 23:18:22 * sivang back for a little while
Nov 06 23:18:40 <sivang> now do I converse with infobot privately? :)
Nov 06 23:18:55 * sivang re-evaluate pr1.3
Nov 06 23:19:22 <sivang> ~pr1.3
Nov 06 23:19:22 <infobot> methinks pr1.3 is the latest (and probably last) software update for Fremantle, available since Monday October 25 2010. More information at http://wiki.maemo.org/Maemo_5/PR1.3 -- see ~flashing for how to update
Nov 06 23:19:28 <timeless_mbp> sp3000: people using grep don't see that stuff :)
Nov 06 23:19:33 <timeless_mbp> btw, is the xref happy?
Nov 06 23:19:44 <sp3000> freetext isn't :|
Nov 06 23:19:51 * timeless_mbp grumbles
Nov 06 23:19:55 <timeless_mbp> how unhappy?
Nov 06 23:20:04 <sp3000> unhappy
Nov 06 23:20:09 <timeless_mbp> does file find work?
Nov 06 23:20:15 <timeless_mbp> (or #include magic)
Nov 06 23:20:37 <sp3000> former looked like no, coming from a link
Nov 06 23:20:40 <sp3000> latter, didn't check
Nov 06 23:21:05 * timeless_mbp considers waking up w7 to ask the vpn what it thinks
Nov 06 23:21:19 <timeless_mbp> i suspect we finally hit the "db too big" fault
Nov 06 23:21:25 <timeless_mbp> oh brother
Nov 06 23:21:37 <sp3000> fwiw the sourcesource was in a slightly skewed state, the first dozen dirs were curiously renamed and building
Nov 06 23:21:42 <timeless_mbp> a mozillan complained about inviting a mosquito to dine on her in her hotel room during TPAC
Nov 06 23:21:50 * timeless_mbp just realized that they've received the same invitation here
Nov 06 23:22:31 <sp3000> there's apparently a fairly narrow window there where it's in the right cloneable state
Nov 06 23:23:04 <sp3000> probably a script starts breaking it asap :)
Nov 06 23:29:37 <Noobmonk3y> hmmm can i use new qtstuff to delve into the n900 bluetooth?
Nov 06 23:30:07 <MohammadAG51> what do you mean?
Nov 06 23:32:40 <Noobmonk3y> ie, find the device, detect state, look at other devices around etc
Nov 06 23:33:21 <MohammadAG51> read about bluez then :)
Nov 06 23:33:27 <Noobmonk3y> meh
Nov 06 23:33:29 <Noobmonk3y> time for bed lol
Nov 06 23:33:32 <Noobmonk3y> see yall tomorrow :)
Nov 06 23:33:44 <MohammadAG51> night
Nov 06 23:33:58 <unixSnob> what's the command to cleanup all the unneeded crap after installing things?
Nov 06 23:34:15 <unixSnob> I think deb files end up getting dumped somewhere
Nov 06 23:34:30 <steinex> unixSnob: apt-get clean will remove the debs
Nov 06 23:34:34 <unixSnob> thanks
Nov 06 23:35:31 <steinex> (they are in /var/cache/apt/archives/, btw)
Nov 06 23:36:23 <steinex> i actually never clean them when not on space pressure, who cares... ;-)
Nov 06 23:36:37 <unixSnob> made quite a difference.. from 3 mb avail to 19
Nov 06 23:36:40 <steinex> and it may be come very handy when you want to downgrade stuff
Nov 06 23:36:55 * MohammadAG51 has archives on MyDocs
Nov 06 23:37:24 <MohammadAG51> 1.2G    MyDocs/archives
Nov 06 23:38:12 <timeless_mbp> downgrading is a myth :)
Nov 06 23:38:56 * MohammadAG51 wants PR1.0 keyboard :(
Nov 06 23:39:16 * timeless_mbp wants a pony
Nov 06 23:39:21 <timeless_mbp> with sponsored stable!
Nov 06 23:39:39 <steinex> after owning my n900 for a half a year now, today i began to love it - there may be 100000 apps in the android-market, but not 1 usable multi-messaging client. my girlfriend rants.
Nov 06 23:40:05 <steinex> wouldn't have thought that.
Nov 06 23:40:39 <steinex> same with a podcatcher
Nov 06 23:40:54 <steinex> there are tons. of. crap.
Nov 06 23:42:32 <sivang> timeless_mbp: LOL
Nov 06 23:42:41 <sivang> timeless_mbp: you sould like that ubuntu guy
Nov 06 23:42:45 <sivang> *sound
Nov 06 23:42:51 <timeless_mbp> housing ponies isn't cheap!
Nov 06 23:43:11 <sivang> anyway, now it is really sleep time for me.
Nov 06 23:43:15 <timeless_mbp> http://science.slashdot.org/comments.pl?sid=1856536&cid=34146698
Nov 06 23:43:20 <timeless_mbp> > No. Not even close. Japan has the world's worst cheese. I went to a fancy restaurant and noticed they had a cheese plate. This is such a rare occurrence in Japan that I thought I must be dreaming. So I asked the waitress, "What kinds of cheese are on the cheese plate?". She replied, "Processed and cream".
Nov 06 23:45:51 <SpeedEvil> :)
Nov 06 23:47:52 <sivang> night all!
Nov 07 00:04:01 <johnx> timeless_mbp, that sounds fairly accurate, with the exception that the US version of processed cheese is actually better than the Japanese version (usually)
Nov 07 00:04:12 <timeless_mbp> heh
Nov 07 00:05:02 <johnx> cliff notes: food is weird in every country except the one you live in
Nov 07 00:05:32 <timeless_mbp> hrm
Nov 07 00:05:40 * timeless_mbp is in France
Nov 07 00:05:43 <timeless_mbp> food is good here
Nov 07 00:05:53 <timeless_mbp> or rather, Kosher food is good here
Nov 07 00:05:54 <johnx> it works, huh?
Nov 07 00:06:03 * timeless_mbp doesn't live here
Nov 07 00:06:03 <johnx> except they eat snails
Nov 07 00:06:06 <timeless_mbp> nope
Nov 07 00:06:08 <timeless_mbp> not kosher
Nov 07 00:06:10 <timeless_mbp> :)
Nov 07 00:06:17 <johnx> they != you
Nov 07 00:06:19 <timeless_mbp> oh, and I live in Finland
Nov 07 00:06:24 <timeless_mbp> and food is not good there
Nov 07 00:06:25 <timeless_mbp> :)
Nov 07 00:06:47 <timeless_mbp> try s/live/grew up/ ?
Nov 07 00:06:55 <johnx> maybe?
Nov 07 00:07:11 <johnx> except you live someplace long enough and the food starts to seem "normal"
Nov 07 00:07:17 <johnx> whatever "normal" means ...
Nov 07 00:07:35 <timeless_mbp> yeah, we normally get crap for food :)
Nov 07 00:07:41 <joga> I guess it's a matter of cooking skills ;p
Nov 07 00:08:01 <timeless_mbp> to be fair, it also depends on your budget
Nov 07 00:08:05 <johnx> joga, but even ingredients can be radically different if you travel far enough
Nov 07 00:08:08 <johnx> also, yes, budget
Nov 07 00:08:23 <timeless_mbp> good food is available in france, but it isn't free
Nov 07 00:08:34 <timeless_mbp> it's unclear whether good food is available in finland
Nov 07 00:08:43 <timeless_mbp> if it is, it'd cost even more
Nov 07 00:08:45 <johnx> you can certainly get good cheese in Japan ... from an import store
Nov 07 00:08:49 <timeless_mbp> heh
Nov 07 00:09:12 <joga> I've certainly eaten good food in finland but I'm not sure what you refer to by "good food" ;)
Nov 07 00:09:17 <ltn> hey guys sorry to interrupt your chat but i was wondering if any of you guys had any problems with the email client on the n900 like crashes with the message internal error and if so how did u fix it :)
Nov 07 00:09:27 <timeless_mbp> according to the thread, you can't in the US, due to USDA/FDA (?)
Nov 07 00:09:48 <SpeedEvil> ltn: sorry - no clue.
Nov 07 00:09:51 <timeless_mbp> ltn: install crash reporter?
Nov 07 00:10:02 <timeless_mbp> if you do that, someone could find out *why* you're crashing
Nov 07 00:10:09 <timeless_mbp> and maybe something could happen..
Nov 07 00:10:10 <wmarone> johnx: you can, but cheese isn't what I'm after if I'm in Japan
Nov 07 00:10:26 <johnx> wmarone, what are you after? :)
Nov 07 00:10:27 <ltn> thx
Nov 07 00:10:28 <timeless_mbp> wmarone: finding kosher food in Japan is hard
Nov 07 00:10:37 <johnx> there are costcos now
Nov 07 00:10:40 <timeless_mbp> so i'd need cheese and other simple things
Nov 07 00:10:40 <wmarone> timeless_mbp: no doubt, considering how much of a minority it would be
Nov 07 00:10:52 <timeless_mbp> wmarone: yep, sadly
Nov 07 00:11:08 <timeless_mbp> johnx: sounds promising
Nov 07 00:11:15 <timeless_mbp> outside tokyo too?
Nov 07 00:11:19 <wmarone> johnx: curry (of various kinds), ramen, soba, udon, sashimi, all the bowls, etc.
Nov 07 00:11:27 <wmarone> okonomiyaki, sukiyaki...
Nov 07 00:11:30 * wmarone drools
Nov 07 00:11:49 <timeless_mbp> ramen/soba/udon are noodles
Nov 07 00:11:57 <timeless_mbp> sashimi is a fish preparation style
Nov 07 00:12:04 <johnx> wmarone, stay there long enough and sometimes you just want food that reminds you of "home" though
Nov 07 00:12:05 <wmarone> I'm being general, here
Nov 07 00:12:11 * timeless_mbp can't remember which yaki is
Nov 07 00:12:21 <wmarone> johnx: I know, spent a year there back in 2003
Nov 07 00:12:30 <timeless_mbp> hrm, speaking of which
Nov 07 00:12:52 <timeless_mbp> Forbidden
Nov 07 00:12:53 <timeless_mbp> You don't have permission to access / on this server.
Nov 07 00:12:53 <timeless_mbp> Apache/1.3.39 Server at desert Port 80
Nov 07 00:12:55 <johnx> timeless_mbp, there are a couple outside tokyo
Nov 07 00:13:05 * timeless_mbp ponders
Nov 07 00:13:11 <timeless_mbp> what kind of dns do i have here?
Nov 07 00:13:42 <timeless_mbp> that's desert.numericable.fr fwiw
Nov 07 00:14:05 <timeless_mbp> seems like a pretty stupid dns configuration
Nov 07 00:14:06 <johnx> ah, something weird set for "servername" in apache2?
Nov 07 00:14:33 <timeless_mbp> nah, dns set a default search of numericable.fr i think
Nov 07 00:14:43 <timeless_mbp> and the canon name for the server must be desert.numericable.fr
Nov 07 00:14:59 <timeless_mbp> since i asked for http://desert/ the server got upset
Nov 07 00:15:06 * timeless_mbp got upset too
Nov 07 00:15:15 <alterego> Awww
Nov 07 00:15:21 <johnx> uh yeah. but there is a "ServerName" variable in the apache config
Nov 07 00:15:34 <timeless_mbp> otoh, i was looking for dessert
Nov 07 00:15:52 <johnx> and that variable isn't related to DNS at all really
Nov 07 00:16:13 <timeless_mbp> timeless-mbp:vbox-svn timeless$ cat /etc/resolv.conf
Nov 07 00:16:18 <timeless_mbp> # Mac OS X Notice
Nov 07 00:16:21 <johnx> what distro is this on?
Nov 07 00:16:22 <timeless_mbp> domain numericable.fr
Nov 07 00:16:22 <timeless_mbp> nameserver 192.168.0.1
Nov 07 00:16:38 <timeless_mbp> Darwin timeless-mbp.local 10.4.0 Darwin Kernel Version 10.4.0: Fri Apr 23 18:27:12 PDT 2010; root:xnu-1504.7.4~1/RELEASE_X86_64 x86_64
Nov 07 00:17:15 <johnx> timeless_mbp, grep -r -i desert $your_apache_conf_dir
Nov 07 00:17:22 <timeless_mbp> eh?
Nov 07 00:17:28 <timeless_mbp> i'm on timeless-mbp
Nov 07 00:17:35 <johnx> <_<
Nov 07 00:17:37 <timeless_mbp> desert != timeless-mbp
Nov 07 00:17:47 <timeless_mbp> but we're both in *.numericable.fr
Nov 07 00:17:52 <timeless_mbp> (presumably)
Nov 07 00:18:09 <johnx> yeah. you're trying to figure out why it's returning desert as its Apache ServerName and I'm telling to that it's set in the apache config
Nov 07 00:18:17 <timeless_mbp> no
Nov 07 00:18:19 <timeless_mbp> i'm not
Nov 07 00:18:35 <timeless_mbp> i'm trying to figure out why the isp was dumb enough to configure domain in its dhcp settings
Nov 07 00:18:35 <johnx> ok, then don't worry about it I guess
Nov 07 00:18:49 <timeless_mbp> which results in http://desert/ being resolved as desert.numericable.fr
Nov 07 00:19:36 <johnx> ah
Nov 07 00:20:50 <johnx> fun times
Nov 07 00:21:07 <timeless_mbp> well, "partially resolved"
Nov 07 00:21:13 <johnx> I think mac os x can get address only from DHCP and set DNS somewhere else
Nov 07 00:21:19 * timeless_mbp needs to ask people if we could change our behavior
Nov 07 00:21:23 <johnx> linux should be able to as well, but it depends on your distro I guess
Nov 07 00:21:35 <timeless_mbp> ?
Nov 07 00:21:41 <timeless_mbp> sure, it could
Nov 07 00:21:45 <timeless_mbp> but…
Nov 07 00:21:51 <johnx> I've come to the conclusion that people can't really change their behavior ...
Nov 07 00:21:55 <timeless_mbp> why can't i expect ISPs to not be stupid?
Nov 07 00:22:09 <johnx> timeless_mbp, because if they weren't stupid they'd cost more
Nov 07 00:22:14 <timeless_mbp> heh
Nov 07 00:23:09 <johnx> you want stupid ISPs? Verizon lied to me for a year and a half, saying I couldn't get FiOS at work, when it had already been run to the building our office was in
Nov 07 00:23:59 <johnx> then they actually got out of the "unprofitable" rural telecom business and pawned us off on a smaller company, who immediately offered us the FiOS server Verizon had already installed
Nov 07 00:25:03 <muelli> hey folks. I'm trying to upgrade packages but it tells me that the rootfs is full. How could I gain more space? I tried the stuff from the wiki, but I only have 60MB free.
Nov 07 00:25:31 <johnx> temporarily uninstall some games or themes?
Nov 07 00:25:51 <johnx> could you link the wiki page so I know what you already tried?
Nov 07 00:25:59 <muelli> sure. hang on a sec
Nov 07 00:26:22 <johnx> ah, actually I wrote a little script to tell me what files were taking up the most space on /
Nov 07 00:26:27 <muelli> http://wiki.maemo.org/Free_up_rootfs_space
Nov 07 00:27:57 <johnx> give this a shot to see if it points out anything big that you didn't know about: http://pastie.org/1278153
Nov 07 00:30:48 <muelli> thx
Nov 07 00:41:25 <alterego> I really wish there was a way to deploy from Qt Creator without all the packaging rigmarole.
Nov 07 00:41:34 <alterego> Oh wait, I can just use a custom deploy strategy ..
Nov 07 00:44:25 <timeless_mbp> http://it.slashdot.org/comments.pl?sid=1856232&cid=34142068
Nov 07 00:45:07 <nox-> :)
Nov 07 00:45:08 <timeless_mbp> johnx: nice (re: fios/verizon)
Nov 07 00:48:58 <johnx> I just wonder how it's possible for a big ISP like that to have such incredibly poor sales tools. I mean, yeah, I except them to see tech support as a cost center, but sales?
Nov 07 01:04:33 <timeless_mbp> heh
Nov 07 01:06:32 <timeless_mbp> sp3000: the internal tracking on 171343 is great
Nov 07 01:12:22 <timeless_mbp> anyone here have any x11 (not hildon) apps handy on their n900?
Nov 07 01:12:47 <timeless_mbp> actually, preferably *not* on, but ssh reachable :)
Nov 07 02:08:21 <mtnman> hello one and all
Nov 07 02:08:45 <muelli> How much space is required to do the 1.3 upgrade?
Nov 07 02:09:07 <ham5> flash dont upgrade
Nov 07 02:09:09 <johnx> muelli, think it says during the install process. don't use apt-get upgrade / dist-upgrade to do it. use app manager
Nov 07 02:09:11 <ham5> bout the same
Nov 07 02:10:37 <bef0rd> the OTA upgrade is like 85 Mb
Nov 07 02:11:12 <muelli> hm.
Nov 07 02:11:43 <muelli> Well. I configured dir::cache to be in my home directory to save space for the downloads, but still won't let me upgrade :(
Nov 07 02:13:02 <johnx> anything you can uninstall, then put back later?
Nov 07 02:17:50 <muelli> johnx: I looked but I can't find anything :-\ I mean, I could, but it'll save just a few MB. Hence my question, how much space the upgrade needs.
Nov 07 02:23:29 <bef0rd> maybe is not about space, what error are you getting when trying to install de  update?
Nov 07 02:24:31 <muelli> bef0rd: "You need to use the PC in order to upgrade, please backup now, ..."
Nov 07 02:26:49 <muelli> "Memory required: 84MB". But apt-get dist-upgrade says, 29MB are required.
Nov 07 02:28:49 <muelli> I have 68.2M available right now :-| I don't know where I could another 20MB  :-\
Nov 07 02:30:10 <nox-> hm i only had 58 MB or so free iirc...  maybe temporarily uninstall some packages?
Nov 07 02:33:55 <muelli> yeah. I'll try. But I wouldn't really wnat to deinstall everything and then figure out that I don't have enough space >.< Also, lots of packages don't install to rootfs, no?
Nov 07 02:34:38 <summel> :o i want a facetime client
Nov 07 02:57:50 <kthomas_vh> how to solve authentication errors on wimax interface (or diagnose!)?
Nov 07 02:57:59 <mtnman> hello one and all from a happy new n900 user
Nov 07 02:58:55 <ham5> questions mtnman or just like repeating yourself?
Nov 07 02:59:19 <ham5> dont think n900 suports wimax
Nov 07 02:59:50 <kthomas_vh> speak for yourself
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