**** BEGIN LOGGING AT Tue Dec 07 02:59:58 2010 Dec 07 03:03:32 correspondingly for an eventual 'unlocked' the German term would be "freigegeben" Dec 07 03:12:29 is there anyone who has successfully configured thr n900 to display dmesg type boot messages at system startup? Dec 07 03:13:13 yes Dec 07 03:13:26 you need an fb-enabled kernel for this Dec 07 03:14:07 would this http://www.amazon.com/ProMini-Wireless-Bluetooth-Keyboard-TouchPad/dp/B003ZJEUBI/ref=pd_ts_e_1?ie=UTF8&s=electronics work with the N900? Dec 07 03:14:15 alas such kernels tend to boot-OOPS and frequently need 2..7 retries until they occasionally boot up successfully Dec 07 03:14:54 user: if you're really interested, MohammadAG can tell about the details Dec 07 03:15:09 ...and probably also provide such a kernel Dec 07 03:15:27 The Lenovo sure loves to lose rubber feet. Dec 07 03:15:54 ok. i actually found a guide to the process in the maemo.org advanced booting section. Dec 07 03:15:59 everybody loves to lose rubberfeet :-P Dec 07 03:16:13 it tells to to patch my initfs. but it dznt work Dec 07 03:16:32 user: you need a fb-enabled kernel Dec 07 03:17:13 ok. fb is not enabled in kernel power? Dec 07 03:17:32 nope Dec 07 03:17:45 it makes kernel instable Dec 07 03:17:56 please reread my prev posts Dec 07 03:18:15 ok. thanks a lot. Dec 07 03:19:39 without framebuffer there's nothing for kernel messages to go to and displayed upon Dec 07 03:44:44 hiyas Dec 07 04:09:45 Stupid Lenovo power lock Dec 07 04:13:25 power lock? Dec 07 04:13:37 i have a T400s and never saw a power lock. must be new. Dec 07 04:21:27 my camera was not working yesterday, and today my phone got in a reboot loop :/ Dec 07 04:32:26 chx, IdeaPad, lock switch next to the power button. Dec 07 05:08:53 hmm, there are quite a number of unused key-combinations. Like Fn-down;Ctrl-down;Fn-up;Ctrl-up Dec 07 05:10:58 basically, with a decent driver, you need only one key-combination/sequence, to escape to macro mode Dec 07 05:11:00 speaking of, i should release my made-to-work-on-again-n900 supergenpass plugin Dec 07 05:12:28 supergenpass? Dec 07 05:13:27 Fn-down;Ctrl-down;Fn-up;Ctrl-up you do the hokey pokey and you turn yourself around, that's what it's all about. WOAHHHHHHH THE HOKEY POKEY Dec 07 05:14:16 sounds like rock lobster of B52's Dec 07 05:16:09 or maybe "(why don't you want to) dance with me" Dec 07 05:16:32 probably the song is named differently though Dec 07 05:16:55 probably Limburger Dec 07 05:33:00 hello Dec 07 05:38:15 hi all Dec 07 05:39:49 hay Dec 07 05:40:14 welcome to this friendly community **** BEGIN LOGGING AT Tue Dec 07 08:12:20 2010 Dec 07 08:47:55 Morning, all Dec 07 08:49:13 morning Jaffa Dec 07 08:51:32 morning people Dec 07 08:52:08 sup Maemo Dec 07 09:29:31 Lightning right outside my house :p Dec 07 09:30:07 hmm, nice Dec 07 10:20:58 http://kitenet.net/~joey/blog/entry/Palm_Pre_privacy/ Palm Pre Owners: your device is 'phoning home' a lot of data, including your GPS location. Dec 07 10:21:15 (old) Dec 07 10:26:45 pupnik: hehe. Dec 07 10:27:22 pupnik: Are you reading tmo thread by some lemming who just switched to PalmPre and dying to tell everyone about it? Dec 07 10:27:36 haven't seen Dec 07 10:28:54 haha Dec 07 10:28:56 webos is dead :P Dec 07 10:29:39 almost no one on the team that made it stuck around after the hp buyout Dec 07 10:33:44 my ears are so sensitive i can hear my thinkpad scroll in vi Dec 07 10:34:28 that's pretty weird Dec 07 10:36:30 http://bit.ly/fJjCjx [ Julian Assange arrested by British police | News.com.au ] Dec 07 10:44:22 pupnik, sad news Dec 07 10:45:01 better link: http://www.news.com.au/world/assange-arrested-by-uk-police/story-e6frfkyi-1225967232654 Dec 07 10:46:45 yes, i always mourn the arrest of alleged rapists Dec 07 10:47:06 that's not why he is being arrested Dec 07 10:47:19 he is wanted for "questioning" Dec 07 10:47:28 he is not being charged with rape or anything Dec 07 10:47:57 he's been arrested on a warrant out of sweden, the charges listed include rape Dec 07 10:48:43 No, they didn't. Dec 07 10:48:57 remember when interpol had mike tyson on their most wanted list for rape? Dec 07 10:49:03 oh yea, he wasnt on the list Dec 07 10:49:07 ieatlint, http://www.interpol.int/Public/ICPO/PressReleases/PR2010/PR101.asp Dec 07 10:49:16 Hi all Dec 07 10:49:33 I would really like to be able to copy a sms conversation Dec 07 10:49:54 Is there any easy way fo doing this apart from one page at a time? Dec 07 10:50:06 crashanddie: "Julian Assange, has been arrested by British police in relation to an international warrant issued by Sweden over alleged sex offences there." from the very article you just linked Dec 07 10:50:14 Ehehe Dec 07 10:50:21 ekhm, it's first time i saw a rapist that was chased trough so many borders Dec 07 10:50:24 and via interpol Dec 07 10:50:27 and other stuff Dec 07 10:50:29 Yes, if it's in print, it must be true. Dec 07 10:50:30 ieatlint, note the wording: "At the request of Swedish authorities who want to question him in connection with a number of sexual offences". Dec 07 10:50:37 And that's from interpol, not the media. Dec 07 10:51:00 crashanddie: ok ... and that differs from what i said how? Dec 07 10:51:11 ieatlint, questioning is a far cry from being charged with. Dec 07 10:51:18 he's under arrest, the arrest warrant provided by the swedes include the charge or rape... he is an alleged rapist Dec 07 10:51:29 well, i wouldn't be surprised if somebody who doesn't like him just paid these girls to acuse him of that Dec 07 10:51:34 it happens Dec 07 10:51:36 i never said he was charged, i said there is a swedish arrest warrant that includes the charge of rape Dec 07 10:51:42 No, the warrant doesn't include a charge of rape. Dec 07 10:52:14 He hasn't been charged with anything, it's just "questioning". Dec 07 10:52:20 uh, then why did the uk ask sweden to clarify the maximum jail time for all charges on their arrest warrant before they would act on it, delaying his arrest for the weekend? Dec 07 10:52:49 They're just lazy sods who didn't work on the weekend :P Dec 07 10:52:56 there is a charge of rape on the warrant -- he has not be charged with rape in a court of law, arguably because extradition must precede an arraignment in sweden Dec 07 10:53:34 and i was clear to label him an alleged rapist... the accusation has been made Dec 07 10:53:48 Well, I don't agree with that statement Dec 07 10:53:55 As I haven't seen anything where he was charged with rape Dec 07 10:54:13 yeah, again, i never said he was charged with rape Dec 07 10:54:32 So he's not an alleged rapist :) Dec 07 10:54:41 He's just wanted for questioning, as a witness Dec 07 10:54:43 he is... the accusation has been made Dec 07 10:54:49 as a suspect :P Dec 07 10:54:57 ieatlint, link? Dec 07 10:54:59 you're kidding yourself turning this guy into some sort of martyr Dec 07 10:55:16 lol Dec 07 10:55:44 ieatlint, since when are "alleged rapists" searched by Interpol? Since when do "alleged rapists" get their international bank accounts frozen? Dec 07 10:55:47 uh, the interpol link you sent me will do... "want to question him in connection with a number of sexual offences." ... you think they want to question him about a rape he witnessed? Dec 07 10:56:16 It's obviously a smear campaign Dec 07 10:56:19 Have they found child porn on him already? Dec 07 10:56:28 what other rape cases do interpol involve themselves with? Dec 07 10:56:29 RST38h, nope, that'll be on a USB stick later today Dec 07 10:56:33 simple answers: 1) when a country issues an arrest warrant for it (eg, roman polanski) and 2) when they lie to the bank about their residency to obtain an account under false pretences Dec 07 10:56:49 crashanddie: Oh, still choosing juiciest pics, I see... Dec 07 10:56:56 crashanddie: not really Dec 07 10:57:24 since when have the Swiss been interested about who owns a bank account there and with what information they have opened it? Dec 07 10:57:27 crashanddie: it happens quite often Dec 07 10:57:43 crashanddie: i mean false rape accusations Dec 07 10:57:43 jacekowski, define "quite often"? Dec 07 10:57:47 oh, that. Sure Dec 07 10:58:08 Noma: since the rest of the world has been critical of them, and has forced them to do all sorts of things... including turning over financial info the US gov so it can track down people evading taxes Dec 07 10:58:13 and sometimes other worse stuff Dec 07 10:58:17 during divorce Dec 07 10:58:26 jacekowski, but rarely does it go international like we're seeing now. Dec 07 10:58:36 it does go international Dec 07 10:58:44 jacekowski, I'm pretty sure I could rape some poor chick in Spain and remain in France for 6 months before the police bothered with me. Dec 07 10:58:45 it just never gets so much media coverage Dec 07 10:58:53 crashanddie: not really Dec 07 10:58:59 yes, really. Dec 07 10:59:02 heh, you're very wrong Dec 07 10:59:22 there was that polish bloke that apparently raped a girl in uk Dec 07 10:59:24 if the charges are bullshit, have some faith in the legal system Dec 07 10:59:26 My mother was nearly burnt alive, it took about 2 years before the Spanish police accepted RFIs from the French police. Dec 07 10:59:31 and then moved to poland Dec 07 11:00:17 and yes, I mean sprayed-with-petrol-and-lit-with-a-match "burnt alive". Dec 07 11:00:23 it took only couple days from point when they suspected him to point where they requested extradition Dec 07 11:00:45 so don't give me the kind of shit that international policing is any kind of "fast". Dec 07 11:00:49 extradition is pretty simple in the western world.. Dec 07 11:01:06 crashanddie: it took couple months for it to happen Dec 07 11:01:13 but paperwork started moving quite soon Dec 07 11:01:53 if it weren't for him trying to prove some ego-point, we'd never have heard about the case, and if anything his extradition to sweden would go faster Dec 07 11:01:54 it's only fast when there is a political theatre behind it Dec 07 11:02:11 the mere fact it has so much media attention will slow it down, not speed it up Dec 07 11:02:32 no, you know about that case because he's a wikileaks bloke Dec 07 11:02:46 http://i.imgur.com/Nf1PA.jpg i love this one (funny,sfw) Dec 07 11:02:51 ieatlint, you do realise that the swedish law has been broken, right? Dec 07 11:02:54 if he would be just normal mr jones he would be back in sweden months ago Dec 07 11:03:12 but now everybody is doing everything by the book Dec 07 11:03:21 ieatlint, when they issued the warrant, then retracted it, then issued it again, and *didn't bother notifying Assange while he was in Sweden*, rather went to the media with it? Dec 07 11:03:30 crashanddie: you do realize you're discounting the possibility he may be guilty of a list of crimes he's been accused of simply because you're enthralled with his temper-tantrum? Dec 07 11:03:58 ieatlint: stick to issues Dec 07 11:04:05 while the swedish law expressly says that until the person has been notified, the media may not be informed? Dec 07 11:04:13 who informed the media? Dec 07 11:04:15 crashanddie: ty i didn't know that Dec 07 11:04:25 well, then he has quite the case against the swedish gov then... Dec 07 11:04:34 who informed the media Dec 07 11:04:37 jacekowski, the attorney general, or the swedish equivalent Dec 07 11:04:44 how do you know? Dec 07 11:04:44 kinda funny for him to complain that something from a government was leaked to the press :P Dec 07 11:04:50 jacekowski, press release Dec 07 11:05:33 jacekowski, some dude on slashdot in the comments translated it -- google translate roughly confirmed what he was saying Dec 07 11:05:58 so he can pursue legal action if that is indeed the case Dec 07 11:06:00 well, in poland all court cases are public Dec 07 11:06:05 with some exceptions Dec 07 11:06:15 jacekowski, except it isn't a court case, yet. Dec 07 11:06:29 if a warrant is issued, it is a court case Dec 07 11:06:32 jacekowski, this is the equivalent of officers knocking on your door to get your statement, no need for media. Dec 07 11:06:40 since such allegations are themselves harmful, it's not the place of the police to go to the media with them, ieatlint Dec 07 11:06:57 (at least in common understanding of harmful) Dec 07 11:07:06 well, character assassination Dec 07 11:07:07 pupnik: if that is indeed swedish law, then as said, he has a case against them for it Dec 07 11:07:19 but that doesn't excuse any illegal acts of his own Dec 07 11:07:25 two wrongs don't make a right, etc Dec 07 11:07:35 actually, in the US, that would be enough to nullify the case Dec 07 11:07:48 ieatlint: illegal acts? Dec 07 11:07:56 actually, in the US, there is no obligation to inform the defendant before notifying the media Dec 07 11:08:04 and in fact, arrest warrants themselves are public record Dec 07 11:08:22 ieatlint, no, but unlawful behaviour by the prosecutors is definitely enough to throw it out of court Dec 07 11:08:33 it's not a fucking arrest warrant Dec 07 11:08:39 interpol turned it into an arrest warrant Dec 07 11:08:45 no, it's enough for the prosecutor to be censured Dec 07 11:09:07 if they act irresponsibly... but it's not considered irresponsible to announce an arrest warrant for someone Dec 07 11:09:21 and there is a swedish arrest warrant for him Dec 07 11:09:43 the interpol "red notice" is a request for questioning, but that's separate from the arrest warrant in sweden Dec 07 11:09:49 ieatlint, do you know what the "rape allegation" is? Dec 07 11:10:01 ieatlint, it's the girl who is attacking Assange because the condom broke Dec 07 11:10:12 heh, then sounds like he has nothing to worry about Dec 07 11:10:29 you're so bent out of shape... if it's a bullshit charge, let him face it and stop bitching Dec 07 11:10:49 ieatlint, the problem is that everyone believes he's guilty Dec 07 11:10:54 everyone thinks he's a rapist Dec 07 11:10:56 Oh yeah, that worked so well with #twitterjoketrial (not that I have an opinion on the Assange case particularly) Dec 07 11:11:06 ieatlint: his lawyer allready said he will turn in Dec 07 11:11:40 He already has been arrested i think Dec 07 11:11:51 yeah, he has Dec 07 11:12:00 Westminster, this morning. Dec 07 11:12:01 crashanddie: if he's found not guilty, it'll be widely covered Dec 07 11:12:21 and the information he's caused to be leaked is not based on his own credibility Dec 07 11:12:22 this is another streisand-phenomenon... Dec 07 11:12:30 chem|st, aye Dec 07 11:12:35 ah ok didn't read any news Dec 07 11:12:35 well, to be honest Dec 07 11:12:43 ieatlint: Hmm; evidence suggests the media doesn't cover retractions as heavily as initial reports Dec 07 11:12:50 the rape thingie is just there to make people worry about assange being a rapist rather than the content of the cables Dec 07 11:13:03 Jaffa: this wouldn't be a retraction though, it'd be the outcome of what has become a high profile trial Dec 07 11:13:12 ieatlint, and he'd still be tainted Dec 07 11:13:25 crashanddie: that's your speculation Dec 07 11:13:30 ieatlint: "No smoke without fire". I don't think The Daily Mail will cover it positively. Dec 07 11:13:37 which has no evidence to back up Dec 07 11:13:49 ieatlint: There are *many* accounts of people accused, and exonerated, of rape having their lives ruined. Dec 07 11:14:13 ieatlint: So much so, there's been discussion in the UK of people accused of rape having *their* anonymity, as well as that already enjoyed by the victim. Dec 07 11:14:35 Jaffa: that's stretching to call them "the media" :P Dec 07 11:14:36 ieatlint, dude, have you seen the list of dirty things that have come out of the cables? Dec 07 11:14:40 crashanddie: sorry, that has what relevance to his alleged criminal acts? Dec 07 11:14:51 at least, his alleged criminal acts in this context :P Dec 07 11:14:53 ieatlint: They count, even if I wish they didn't. Dec 07 11:15:20 "In the case of Ardin it is clear that she has thrown a party in Assange's honour at her flat after the 'crime' and tweeted to her followers that she is with the 'the world’s coolest smartest people, it’s amazing!'" http://www.ibf.uu.se/PERSON/anna/anna.jpg Dec 07 11:15:40 somehow i'm not worried that if he is indeed innocent of rape, that he'll be found not guilty and it'll be highly publicized Dec 07 11:15:43 the U.S. military formally adopted a policy of turning a blind eye to systematic, pervasive torture and other abuses by Iraqi forces: http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2010/oct/22/iraq-detainee-abuse-torture-saddam Dec 07 11:16:11 crashanddie: you act as though this is news Dec 07 11:16:18 or that i care Dec 07 11:16:20 theState Department threatened Germany not to criminally investigate the CIA's kidnapping of one of its citizens who turned out to be completely innocent: http://harpers.org/archive/2010/11/hbc-90007831 http://www.boingboing.net/2010/12/01/wikileaks-and-the-el.html Dec 07 11:16:49 you're shouting off things that are completely disconnected from the allegations at hand Dec 07 11:16:58 the StateDepartment under Bush andObama applied continuous pressure on the Spanish Government to suppress investigations of the CIA's torture of its citizens and the 2003 killing of a Spanish photojournalist when the U.S. military fired on the Palestine Hotel in Baghdad (see ThePhiladelphia Inquirer's WillBunch today about this:"The day BarackObama Lied to me"): http://harpers.org/archive/2010/12/hbc-90007836 http://w Dec 07 11:16:58 ww.philly.com/philly/blogs/attytood/At_least_not_quite_as_many_people_died_when_Obama_lied.html Dec 07 11:17:10 all good leaks Dec 07 11:17:22 the British Government privately promised to shield Bush officials from embarrassment as part of its Iraq War "investigation": http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/wikileaks/8172243/WikiLeaks-British-government-promised-to-protect-US-interests-at-Chilcot-inquiry.html Dec 07 11:17:37 "American leaders lied, knowingly, to the American public, to American troops, and to the world" about the Iraq war as it was prosecuted, a conclusion the Post's own former Baghdad Bureau Chief wrote was proven by theWikiLeaks documents: http://www.thedailybeast.com/blogs-and-stories/2010-10-25/wikileaks-shows-rumsfeld-and-casey-lied-about-the-iraq-war/ Dec 07 11:17:58 the U.S.'s own Ambassador concluded that the July, 2009 removal of the Honduran President was illegal -- a coup -- but the StateDepartment did not want to conclude that and thus ignored it until it was too late to matter: http://www.lrb.co.uk/blog/2010/12/01/john-perry/yes-it-was-a-coup/ Dec 07 11:18:10 ... how long are you going to keep this up? Dec 07 11:18:17 U.S. and British officials colluded to allow theU.S. to keep cluster bombs on British soil even though Britain had signed the treaty banning such weapons: http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2010/dec/01/wikileaks-cables-cluster-bombs-britain Dec 07 11:18:32 Hillary Clinton's State Department ordered diplomats to collect passwords, emails, and biometric data on U.N. and other foreign officials, almost certainly in violation of the Vienna Treaty of 1961. http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2010/nov/28/us-embassy-cables-spying-un Dec 07 11:18:41 I hope I made a point? Dec 07 11:18:46 nope, not a single one Dec 07 11:19:02 not unless one of those cable speaks of setting up fake rape charges Dec 07 11:19:03 ieatlint, then you are blinded by your own unwillingness to debate Dec 07 11:19:10 ieatlint, read the last one Dec 07 11:19:18 yeah, so? Dec 07 11:19:22 we can show that the prosecution is a sham Dec 07 11:19:35 ieatlint, asking diplomats to do spies' jobs? Dec 07 11:19:44 heh Dec 07 11:20:03 there's a reason why you have diplomats and special agencies Dec 07 11:20:09 if you can't see that separation, I'm sorry. Dec 07 11:20:21 anyway, time for a spot of lunch Dec 07 11:20:23 'later all. Dec 07 11:20:24 crashanddie: hope your not looking for a us federal government job. Talking about the cables lessens your security and background clearence Dec 07 11:20:37 uh... you're arguing something very disconnected is my point Dec 07 11:20:47 TermanaDesire, well, I have a security clearance with the UK government Dec 07 11:20:53 you're shouting about how diplomats broke the law, and here i thought we were discussing someone getting arrested Dec 07 11:20:57 cables? I have a ton of cables :) Dec 07 11:21:03 TermanaDesire, and one with the Aussi government Dec 07 11:21:17 TermanaDesire, both of which are probably not valid anymore considering I don't live in the countries anymore. Dec 07 11:21:47 ieatlint, thats the thing ... the rape stuff is making people lose sight of the problems the leaks reveal Dec 07 11:22:15 tank-man: then that's his own failing, for putting himself so much in the public eye instead of letting the information speak for itself Dec 07 11:22:17 X-Fade, sup dawg. i noticed you liekd cables in ur cables, so i put cables in ur cables so you can leak cables using your cables. Dec 07 11:22:29 but that said, it's the leaks that are on the cover of time magazine, not rape accusations Dec 07 11:22:41 crashanddie: If you ask nicely I can tell you all about my secret cables :) Dec 07 11:22:49 is that a euphemism? Dec 07 11:23:00 anyway, lunch, later. Dec 07 11:23:03 Maybe we should publish that info on the interwebs somewhere :) Dec 07 11:24:08 * DocScrutinizer idly wonders about the relevance for chan topic - not saying anything more than exactly that Dec 07 11:24:45 i think we're done now anyway :P Dec 07 11:25:10 Oh, go ahead. Just let me fetch some coffee and popcorn Dec 07 11:25:29 X-Fade: I never have the cable I want though. Say, a short C7 laptop power adapter to euro plug (about 30cm-1m) Dec 07 11:26:05 yeah, i just have to call him an alleged rapist, and suddenly it's all sorts of entertainment :) Dec 07 11:26:58 I'm all for massive distribution of Y-cables, for USB Dec 07 11:28:35 maybe even including some secret circuitry to identify it to N900 as external 5V enabled Dec 07 11:28:59 Nokia's secret Y-cables affair Dec 07 11:30:14 maybe I should run a trial agains Nokia for raping my N900 with MyNokia SMS Dec 07 11:31:21 those 2 topics should be similarly unrelated :-P Dec 07 11:32:29 indeed... i spent $0.20 or so on that Dec 07 11:34:01 * DocScrutinizer yawns Dec 07 11:37:06 * alterego quickly pours coffee down DocScrutinizers' gullet Dec 07 11:37:46 hmm, probably not the worst idea Dec 07 11:38:30 actually yawning is unacceptable after just 15h awake Dec 07 11:42:44 "Once, as she was lecturing, a male student in the audience looked at his notes instead of staring at her. Anna Ardin reported him for sexual harassment because he discriminated against her for being a woman and because she claimed he made use of the male “master suppression technique” in trying to make her feel invisible." Dec 07 11:43:47 red lighrt!! Dec 07 12:09:46 X-Fade: ping Dec 07 12:26:43 Crap, lirc's include statement doesn't work in the global /etc/lircd.conf file Dec 07 12:26:45 Mhm... poor qgil stepping into the fray, predictably being torn apart Dec 07 12:26:52 Only works in the .lirc file .. Dec 07 12:27:03 ~/.lircrc Dec 07 12:27:14 skyyline was pretty good Dec 07 12:27:30 I heard it was awful :P Dec 07 12:29:56 RST38h, where? Dec 07 12:30:50 http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?p=885433 Dec 07 12:30:58 alterego: it was bad til towards the end Dec 07 12:31:16 qgil is a professional, makes sure to mention Meego in every second sentence Dec 07 12:31:34 not his fault that nobody is biting though =( Dec 07 12:32:01 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U5DKBWXFLGI Dec 07 12:32:08 electric eel and alligator Dec 07 12:35:33 crashanddie: according to info i found Dec 07 12:35:38 crashanddie: he's not arrested Dec 07 12:35:50 crashanddie: he went himself to police Dec 07 12:36:42 because of somebody threatening him with death Dec 07 12:45:56 RST38h: meh, the whole thread feels so useless and is depressing... :-S Dec 07 12:46:47 hello guys! Dec 07 12:52:52 how to set username in irssi? Dec 07 12:53:50 I'm new to using irssi in N900. Usually I use empathy in ubuntu. Dec 07 12:54:13 /set username foo Dec 07 12:54:26 or maybe it could be user_name Dec 07 12:54:48 psycho_oreos okay let me do it. thx Dec 07 12:55:31 RST38h, No offence to Quim, but what professional TRIPLE POSTS Dec 07 12:55:32 :P Dec 07 12:55:40 user__: As long as you don't listen to people who say it is /disconnect ,you should be fine ;) Dec 07 12:56:19 user__: /nick foo works too. Dec 07 12:56:35 X-Fade: heh okay. Dec 07 12:56:52 yeah! thanks. Dec 07 12:56:53 See? Much better. Dec 07 12:57:10 Yes. Dec 07 12:57:12 oh you wanted to change nickname :p Dec 07 12:57:29 heh, yes. Dec 07 12:57:37 On the command line, you can use irssi -n jase21 -c chat.freenode.net Dec 07 12:57:47 That will make it connect to freenode and set your nick. Dec 07 12:57:57 Now back to being seroius. Did anyone install erlang on N900? Dec 07 12:57:59 Termana: He was answering questions Dec 07 12:58:10 X-Fade, isn't it irc.freenode.net? Dec 07 12:58:30 RST38h, so? Answer them in the one post Dec 07 12:58:31 * crashanddie sees "erlang" and goes into hiding. Dec 07 12:58:34 Doc: How many tmo threads are *not* depressing? :) Dec 07 12:58:40 crashanddie: Works too. Dec 07 12:59:01 Termana: x3 fewer thanks. Dec 07 12:59:10 crashanddie: http://freenode.net/irc_servers.shtml Dec 07 12:59:19 No one? Dec 07 12:59:19 crashanddie: Says main one is chat. Dec 07 12:59:31 jase21, short answer: no Dec 07 12:59:39 okay. Dec 07 12:59:57 long answer: fuck no. Dec 07 13:00:03 RST38h:touche' Dec 07 13:00:06 erlang is available in extras-devel. Dec 07 13:00:07 Oh I see, so we should just abandon normal forum etiquette to rob the Thanks and karma system blind Dec 07 13:00:24 yes. Dec 07 13:00:24 ~seen qgil Dec 07 13:00:29 qgil was last seen on IRC in channel #meego, 17h 37m 56s ago, saying: 'dneary: clear now, thanks!'. Dec 07 13:00:32 you are the last to find out. Dec 07 13:00:48 hmm.. Dec 07 13:00:48 infobot, Yes? Dec 07 13:00:48 yes is probably the opposite of no Dec 07 13:00:52 No wonder I have such a low thanks count Dec 07 13:01:14 slowpoke. Dec 07 13:02:19 I have another doubt. Is there a way to own what you chat without third party controlling it like gtalk? Dec 07 13:02:23 Termana: TMO doesn't have the "multi-quote" feature that FMC has; so it's a little harder - although I try to make the effort. Dec 07 13:02:25 X-Fade: ...groan...testing...groan...list... Dec 07 13:02:32 it's really impeding :( Dec 07 13:02:48 jase21: Jabber through your own server. Dec 07 13:03:20 Jaffa: means that I need to set up a jabber server? Dec 07 13:04:01 Is irc possible of something like that. Dec 07 13:04:43 achipa: Hmm yeah, -ENOTIME is really a pain. Let me see if I can get one of the Nemein guys to debug it. Dec 07 13:04:59 Is setting up my own irc server help? Dec 07 13:05:19 jase21: if you want to chat without third party involved you have to setup the infrastruture yourself (as you don't want a third party involded) Dec 07 13:05:29 setting up a jabber server is not a big deal Dec 07 13:05:47 marmoute: okay. Dec 07 13:06:01 what is the use of IRC when no third party is involved? o.O Dec 07 13:06:23 You can setup an irc server as an alternatif (to chat using irc) or use a irc network you trust. Dec 07 13:06:54 is setting a private irc channel suffice? Dec 07 13:07:10 but setting up a jabber server is pretty easy and allow you to link with the rest of the word. Dec 07 13:07:22 my requirement is that only the people who is chatting ahould have the log. Dec 07 13:07:22 that's just like asking how I make public transportation drive me from my home place to my office, without all those annoying other people around Dec 07 13:07:46 hah Doc. Dec 07 13:08:11 jase21: depending of the critical level of security you want. irc is just fine Dec 07 13:08:20 channel are generaly not logged Dec 07 13:08:34 BS! IRC is the wrong service for private chat Dec 07 13:08:51 * f3ew logs IRC *and* Jabber Dec 07 13:08:55 privacy is hard. Dec 07 13:09:05 * jase21 confused Dec 07 13:09:19 the real question if "jase21 WTF do you want to do ?" Dec 07 13:09:25 jase21 in what context do you want to keep chats private? Dec 07 13:09:33 and for the logging: how would you define "users that chat"? is infobot a "usewr that chats"? Dec 07 13:09:41 ~botsnack Dec 07 13:09:41 DocScrutinizer: thanks Dec 07 13:09:46 ~logs Dec 07 13:09:46 All conversations are logged to http://ibot.rikers.org/channel, where "channel" is replaced by the URL-encoded channel name, such as %23freenode for #freenode. Lines starting with spaces are not logged. logs are updated daily, or the log URL is http://ibot.rikers.org/%23uphpu/ Dec 07 13:10:12 prepared a friends birthday ? arrange a date with you mistress ? have business talk with co-worker/partenary ? Have homeland security meeting ? Dec 07 13:10:22 How about chatting with a girlfriend? Dec 07 13:10:36 :D Dec 07 13:10:45 on IRC? o_O Dec 07 13:10:46 lol Dec 07 13:10:54 MohammadAG: of course... Dec 07 13:11:00 jase21: if you want to do that semi-private, there's /query for that Dec 07 13:11:18 Non not like that. Totally private. Dec 07 13:11:23 /dcc is basically private, but it doesn't have built-in encryption Dec 07 13:11:23 jase21: and why the fuck don't you want google to have you sexchat log ? Dec 07 13:11:41 and it has issues with NATted environments Dec 07 13:11:43 jase21: if you need total security, I suggest using some crypto sacured protocol. maybe skype, or encrypted email Dec 07 13:11:55 you can run several encryption layers over irc, though Dec 07 13:11:58 or talk to her in life Dec 07 13:12:04 Don't convert it into sexchat :D Dec 07 13:12:27 or just send her a letter.. Dec 07 13:12:32 DocScrutinizer: jase21 if you want total isolation and security use a private isolated jabber server with encription Dec 07 13:12:41 Or send her an *encrypted* letter Dec 07 13:12:50 * f3ew gets the wrench Dec 07 13:12:51 haha Dec 07 13:13:24 * f3ew makes a quick xkcd reference Dec 07 13:14:07 yeah private jabber with encryption seems to be a better one. Dec 07 13:14:56 oh then why not just call or sent sms? Hmm.. Dec 07 13:15:03 * DocScrutinizer shakes head on weird ideas of some users Dec 07 13:15:12 jase21: sms imply third party Dec 07 13:15:29 hah. Its okay. Dec 07 13:15:30 and cell call are not that secure Dec 07 13:15:37 sms's are stored in plain-text in the provider's servers Dec 07 13:15:38 oh right. Dec 07 13:15:40 anyone know of a way to upload to imageshack or something similar with N900? Dec 07 13:15:50 theres a yfrog app but its broken Dec 07 13:15:55 and I haven't actually heard anyone claim they are encrypted over-air when I've queried the matter.. Dec 07 13:15:56 meh4, flickr? Dec 07 13:16:01 fsck, how's that IRC or maemo related? Dec 07 13:16:18 crashanddie, i was thinking of something like imageshack cuz it doesnt require registeration Dec 07 13:16:25 * marmoute still wonder why the hell jase21 needs is chat with a girlfriend stay secret to the whole worlds Dec 07 13:16:27 crashanddie, just upload some random picture and get the link and thats it Dec 07 13:16:41 marmoute: ++ Dec 07 13:16:53 marmoute: complete nonsense Dec 07 13:17:05 jase21, the matter of fact is that your life isn't that interesting Dec 07 13:17:31 yeah, what ever. Dec 07 13:17:53 if your talk is so secret and important, then you are probably better off sending it as a pgp crypted mail anyway - you get enough time to think about what you write Dec 07 13:17:55 just wanted to clear my mind on the doubt about chatting in private. Dec 07 13:18:16 jase21, how many people use SMSs? Dec 07 13:18:18 Doc: okay. Dec 07 13:18:39 crashanddie: a lot I guess. Dec 07 13:18:51 jase21, the amount of information being exchanged is enough to make your dialogs "part of the noise" Dec 07 13:19:08 DocScrutinizer: ++ if you need secure communication get them PGP (or whatever else) encrypted during the whole transit. Dec 07 13:19:40 carrier pigeons. Dec 07 13:20:14 heck, write it on paper, scan it to PGP, hide the information in a picture, print as postcard, send that with an innocuous message on the back. Dec 07 13:20:17 could be shot down. it's not secure. Dec 07 13:20:27 http://www.faqs.org/rfcs/rfc1149.html Dec 07 13:20:40 lcuk: ^^^ Dec 07 13:20:47 marmoute: and yet it doesn't give you plausible deniability Dec 07 13:21:02 damn, you need to do that much stuff just to talk? Dec 07 13:21:28 preferably using a scanner with a hardware encryption integrated to it, so that the actual data never reaches your computer USB port (which could've been intercepted) Dec 07 13:21:43 jase21: we are in here for free talk, not for secret talk Dec 07 13:21:43 Ahahaha.. Dec 07 13:21:58 or just get her to use SIP over i2p. Dec 07 13:22:01 I'm doing freetalk. Dec 07 13:22:16 ZRTP Dec 07 13:22:38 or hide it in the wikileaks torrent Dec 07 13:22:50 one porn chat amongst 250k diplomatic cables should go unnoticed. Dec 07 13:22:55 damn. Dec 07 13:23:21 okay lets forget it. Dec 07 13:23:24 or how about just meeting the chick in a bar and talking to her? Dec 07 13:23:29 crashanddie: I guess 50% of those are their own special breed of porn anyway Dec 07 13:23:33 oh, no, that would require going outside, can't do that. Dec 07 13:23:46 DocScrutinizer, for paranoid schizophrenics, it's uber porn Dec 07 13:24:00 hah, you know the geeks in us.. Dec 07 13:24:27 "The Iranian government has been attempting to co-opt the country's Ninjas and other martial artists to help out with some light repression duties, US diplomatic cables released by Wikileaks claim." Dec 07 13:24:32 what happens when they are in some other distant places? Dec 07 13:24:46 DocScrutinizer, I always wanted to prank a PH -- plug your video feed on their TV antenna, and just voiceover "I know you're there. We've been tracking you." Dec 07 13:25:11 Ummm! Ninjas! Dec 07 13:25:19 wikileaks aren't interesting for me. May for some govt. poloticians. Dec 07 13:25:45 what's that got to do with any programmer? Dec 07 13:26:12 because freedom of speech is so far removed from other noble ideas open source tries to proclaim? Dec 07 13:26:32 what got uber secret sex chat to do with IRC and maemo? Dec 07 13:26:34 erm.. Dec 07 13:27:09 well I'm chatting this on N900. Dec 07 13:27:33 * SpeedEvil is naked. Dec 07 13:27:47 * derf is sick. Dec 07 13:27:53 well, lemme chat about my feet here then, moment I switch to my N900 so I'm on topic Dec 07 13:28:46 control your emotions. What I was asking is a logical approach to solve a computer related problem. Dec 07 13:29:00 blue sky, cotton wool clouds, gentle breeze, lovely fresh sea air. sound of waves lapping on the shore. ... my perfect environment. Dec 07 13:29:09 well, lemme chat about my feet here then, moment I switch to my N900 so I'm on topic Dec 07 13:29:11 and thanks for you answer. I think a private jabber with encryption will suffice. Dec 07 13:29:14 [Priceless] Dec 07 13:29:49 let me talk about N900 a bit. Dec 07 13:29:53 jase21, just for the sake of argument, what are you trying to protect? And from whom? Dec 07 13:30:04 RST38h, :D pardon Dec 07 13:30:09 that was in another chan :P Dec 07 13:30:19 no, no, that was nice =) Dec 07 13:30:35 okay, may be from .. I don't know. Isn't it bad to read what other talk anyway? Dec 07 13:31:34 Back to core maemo stuff. Is there any hardware instruction that helps implementing aes on omap? Dec 07 13:31:50 ahhh RST38h - you mean the complete difference in topic quality between #maemo and #meego Dec 07 13:31:51 Do you geeks know? Dec 07 13:32:13 jase21: There is a hardware crypto unit Dec 07 13:32:15 jase21, hang on, meet me in Gandhi Park in 10 minutes. Or maybe St Michael's Church? Dec 07 13:32:38 next week jase21 will built is own chipset with integrated encryption to send "I miss you" to the girl next door without it's dog being suspicious Dec 07 13:32:51 his* Dec 07 13:32:52 SpeedEvil: okay. Any manuals? Dec 07 13:32:53 not it's Dec 07 13:32:56 or its at least Dec 07 13:33:22 http://www.ljplus.ru/img4/a/l/alexandreev/new-year.jpg Dec 07 13:33:27 unless the girl is a blow-up doll, in which case "its" would be appropriate Dec 07 13:33:28 crashanddie:I don't know those places. Dec 07 13:34:06 jase21, so you're not near Coimbatore? Dec 07 13:34:16 damn NAT. Dec 07 13:34:29 speaking of blow-up dolls... http://rixstep.com/1/20101202,01.shtml Dec 07 13:34:42 http://www.mail-archive.com/linux-crypto@vger.kernel.org/msg04318.html jase21 Dec 07 13:34:48 marmoute: damn you guys. stop making fun off me. Dec 07 13:34:50 check related threads Dec 07 13:34:54 pupnik, a blow-up doll has come forward in the Assange case? Crying foul over alleged rape accusations? Dec 07 13:35:38 heh Dec 07 13:35:42 crashanddie: nope Dec 07 13:35:46 quite the opposite Dec 07 13:35:54 SpeedEvil: Document not found. Dec 07 13:36:11 jacekowski: works for me Dec 07 13:36:15 jase21: Dec 07 13:36:47 ? Dec 07 13:37:30 yes it works! Dec 07 13:37:36 crashanddie: allegedly she's 'in the middle-east' now... why??? Dec 07 13:39:11 pupnik, yesterday, on national news, it was said that "Assange was on the run from international police, and could be hiding anywhere in Africa, Asia, America". Dec 07 13:39:32 what a weirdos Dec 07 13:39:39 they are going to waterboard Assange Dec 07 13:39:49 to give up his people behind wikileaks Dec 07 13:40:56 lemme see if I can come up with AES implemnted in asm and C in N900.. Dec 07 13:41:40 jase21: ask here, I think you're re-inventing that Dec 07 13:42:06 iirc jacekowski mentioned something very similar being implemented already Dec 07 13:42:09 Doc: Wow! Is it already written? Dec 07 13:42:37 is it using hardware ? Dec 07 13:42:56 ask jacekowski Dec 07 13:43:07 okay. Dec 07 13:43:10 you do realise that "software" is just a name eh, it actually uses hardware to run :P Dec 07 13:43:24 as for hardware accel, doubt it. Dec 07 13:44:19 crashanddie: hah I expected it.. I meant hardware accelerated .. Dec 07 13:44:24 [PATCH 0/2] crypto: omap-sha1-md5: OMAP3 SHA1 & MD5 driver Dec 07 13:44:36 [2010-12-07 14:34:40] http://www.mail-archive.com/linux-crypto@vger.kernel.org/msg04318.html jase21 Dec 07 13:44:36 * crashanddie listens to Tron OST Dec 07 13:44:56 Doc: that's the link before. Dec 07 13:45:07 orly? Dec 07 13:45:26 I'll look more indepth there (using a pc). Dec 07 13:45:27 The original prosecutor in charge, Eva Finné, dropped the charges the same week they were made and stated they were groundless. Eva Finné was removed from the case by Claes Borgström and a new prosecutor, Marianne Ny, was appointed. Her first act was to reinstate the charges. Dec 07 13:46:06 pupnik: what has that got to do with maemo Dec 07 13:46:30 sorry just remnants from earlier discussion Dec 07 13:46:35 pupnik: ahhahaha Dec 07 13:46:45 http://www.spinics.net/lists/linux-omap/msg39969.html jase Dec 07 13:48:01 http://www.coe.int/t/dghl/standardsetting/childjustice/Marianne%20Ny.asp Send Marianny NY email and let her know what you think about prosecuting Julian Assange of Wikileaks after the prior prosecutor dropped the charges. Dec 07 13:48:21 pupnik: And Mr Assange is squarely ending up in the second occupation =) Dec 07 13:49:22 SpeedEvil: Do you know which repo is it? Is it gitorious? Dec 07 13:49:44 Where is it committed to? Dec 07 13:50:31 Okay.. Dec 07 13:50:54 Hope we had a good dicsussion. Dec 07 13:51:04 Going offline. Dec 07 14:21:22 Mucking around with some QML theming and drawing purdy graphics: http://stage.rubyx.co.uk/research/qtquick/chrome-buttons-001.png Dec 07 14:21:42 Iss quite fun :) Dec 07 14:21:51 Have to install the latest SDK Dec 07 14:22:11 Is QML universally usable on N900s nowadays? Dec 07 14:22:12 RST38h: ? Dec 07 14:22:19 hmm, dudes, is there any HN client for n900? (HackerNews) Dec 07 14:22:19 RST38h: yup, with PR1.3 :) Dec 07 14:22:26 alterego: cooooooooooool Dec 07 14:22:38 :) Dec 07 14:23:23 You don't need Qt Creator to do QML on the device though, I spend about half an hour to an hour at night playing with it with vi on the device every so often in bed ^.^ Dec 07 14:24:24 I'm more proud I actually managed to draw that button graphic myself :D Dec 07 14:24:38 Using inkscape, then cutting it up in The GIMP Dec 07 14:24:46 I feel like a pro-designer now ^.^ Dec 07 14:25:27 alterego, are they also shadable? Dec 07 14:25:39 lcuk: no, I'm working on that now. Dec 07 14:25:49 You mean colourisable yer? Dec 07 14:25:57 If that's a real word .. Dec 07 14:26:00 yes Dec 07 14:27:31 lcuk: unfortunately this may not be possible in pure QML Dec 07 14:27:53 Because I need to generate some kind of mask, which I don't think I can do. Dec 07 14:27:55 thats a bit sad Dec 07 14:27:58 Yeah Dec 07 14:28:10 I can do it with a bit of C++ Dec 07 14:29:16 alterego, what properties/methods would be required in qml itself to accomodate such a thing Dec 07 14:29:37 if you were going to implement it, where would you expect to set things Dec 07 14:30:10 Well, you'd need a mask for the shape of the button, which in this case comprises of three segments. Dec 07 14:30:35 Then a custom overlay component, which uses that mask and colours in the area where it's supposed to. Dec 07 14:31:05 Is that sort of what you meant? Dec 07 14:31:28 for a quick thing, yeah Dec 07 14:31:29 The methods would just be implementing the paint method, and properties, well, colour and opacity seem like the only ones required. Dec 07 14:31:52 you know DHTML has properties and built in methods to do this kind of thing? Dec 07 14:31:52 Do you have a better solution? Dec 07 14:32:02 Oh, neat :) Dec 07 14:32:05 No, didn't know that. Dec 07 14:32:06 or is it XHTML or something Dec 07 14:32:16 * lcuk waves hands a bit Dec 07 14:33:05 You can colourise the text if that's any consolation :P Dec 07 14:33:20 I am just pondering not specifically for this one use case, but for more generic things which would allow people to use qml where its not pracitcal atm Dec 07 14:33:25 hehe Dec 07 14:33:32 Yeah Dec 07 14:33:54 I've got another idea, but it only would work with more rectangular buttons .. Dec 07 14:34:20 transparent overlay? Dec 07 14:34:26 Yeah Dec 07 14:34:49 how do people in HTML world manage CSS only rounded corners? Dec 07 14:35:11 and can that kind of thinking be combined with a transparent overlay to get what you are thinking Dec 07 14:35:24 I could write a little framework that does this all in C++, not overlay but colourises the image and allows me to reference that image. Dec 07 14:35:45 So you could come up with button sets of varying color, all of which use the same images internally. But you'd have an unlimited palette. Dec 07 14:35:49 hmm then make that available as a QML basetype? Dec 07 14:35:54 Yeah Dec 07 14:35:57 cool Dec 07 14:36:06 that sounds like the button class from liqbase Dec 07 14:36:34 So MyButton.qml: GenericButton {color: "blue"} Dec 07 14:37:01 alterego, ok, supposing you did this and made a new egobutton.so Dec 07 14:37:06 s/MyButton/BlueButton/ :D Dec 07 14:37:19 Hi, the device maybe old, but is there any support for libvpx for N810? Dec 07 14:37:25 Yeah, not had much luck with QML extensions in the past .. Dec 07 14:37:47 ok alterego but if you spoke to the people around qt and qml libraries about how to implement it cleanly Dec 07 14:37:51 I can never seem to import them when using plain qmlviewer. Dec 07 14:37:52 (there must be examples somewhere..) Dec 07 14:38:02 Oh, I've managed to make a plugin Dec 07 14:38:07 I just couldn't load it in qmlviewer Dec 07 14:38:15 well to be usable by anything, egobutton class would have to be inside qt itself Dec 07 14:38:28 to then be available as a base within all qml things Dec 07 14:38:38 So now I tend to write standalone qml based apps with the necessary infrastructure in the app. Dec 07 14:39:16 Oh, you mean you think it'd be nice to have this in QtQuick itself? Dec 07 14:39:18 standalone .exe apps with their own viewer? or just senidng out the .qml itself? Dec 07 14:39:32 lcuk: using their own viewer widget yeah. Dec 07 14:39:38 alterego, i think finding out the method to do it properly would be good :) Dec 07 14:39:53 lcuk: yes, agreed. Dec 07 14:40:09 That's what I'm doing, effectively :P Dec 07 14:40:21 to open the discussion and find out how practical things such as this would be (even if egobutton was not the specific thing wanting adding) Dec 07 14:40:25 :) good Dec 07 14:40:32 Sure Dec 07 14:40:58 Hrm, cached images may not work actually. Dec 07 14:41:33 Because you'd want opacity and color to be properties that can be animated with PropertyAnimation which makes the caching pointless really Dec 07 14:41:55 * lcuk nods Dec 07 14:45:34 I think what iis really happening here is we're attempting to come up with a general purpose "themeing" engine. Dec 07 14:45:48 Which I think is the purpose of Qt Components. Dec 07 14:45:54 So I've asked the question in there ;) Dec 07 14:46:26 There's extremely rudimentary support in what we have now, which is basically just the existance of border images .. Dec 07 14:48:27 For my next go, I'm going to use SVG instead of pngs for scalability. Dec 07 14:48:53 lcuk, Then we can start talking about morphing SVG directly from within QML ;) Dec 07 14:49:16 hehe Dec 07 15:11:14 Hrm, svg may be a bit more tricky .. Dec 07 15:11:27 * alterego gives up for the time being and carries on doing what he was doing .. Dec 07 15:12:29 http://regmedia.co.uk/2010/11/25/ventblockers_04.jpg Dec 07 15:12:36 http://regmedia.co.uk/2010/11/25/ventblockers_03.jpg Dec 07 15:14:47 woof Dec 07 15:15:46 whole story: http://www.theregister.co.uk/2010/11/26/ventblockers_2/page9.html Dec 07 15:17:12 crash: The little guys definitely liked the positive terminal Dec 07 15:17:24 are they having a competition to post filthy PCs? Dec 07 15:17:37 was it leaking eletrolyte or something? Dec 07 15:20:26 ~ping Dec 07 15:20:26 ~pong Dec 07 15:20:27 BCMM, its theregister, they rarely need an excuse to post dirty pictures Dec 07 15:20:32 but, yeah in this case it is Dec 07 15:20:34 hah Dec 07 15:20:50 i liked their excessive packaging contest best i think Dec 07 15:22:21 lcuk: check this: http://stage.rubyx.co.uk/research/qtquick/chrome-buttons-02.png Dec 07 15:22:22 :D Dec 07 15:22:32 Got TextButton and ToolButton :D Dec 07 15:22:50 cool Dec 07 15:22:56 can you apply both to the same? Dec 07 15:23:02 so you can have icon+caption Dec 07 15:23:26 Yeah, thinking of doing that. Dec 07 15:23:54 alterego, its "normal" for buttons to have that sort of capability Dec 07 15:23:54 fcamera used to produce broken dngs (or dngs that triggered a bug in ufraw) - iirc there was a program to fix old dngs Dec 07 15:23:55 lcuk: I can do it now, but I want a clean way to do it, at the moment if you don't define an icon, it complains that "./.png" is not found. Dec 07 15:24:00 anyone got the link handy? Dec 07 15:24:23 So I'd need a way to dynamically add the icon in javascript, Dec 07 15:24:43 which is fine, or have it force a default-icon on every instance, which would be lame if you want a label only button. Dec 07 15:25:06 * Arkenoi hopes we will get our telepathy-OTR and SMS encryption project to launch first beta before NY Dec 07 15:25:24 maybe i mean dcraw Dec 07 15:25:32 Arkenoi, "our"? Dec 07 15:25:37 moo javispedro, Arkenoi Dec 07 15:25:42 morning Dec 07 15:25:46 ah, got it Dec 07 15:25:49 lcuk: so I think for the time being, having seperate components is probably best. Dec 07 15:26:05 alterego, thats cool Dec 07 15:26:10 those do indeed look awesome Dec 07 15:26:30 lcuk: yeah, who'd have thought a hacker could have a good eye for graphics too :D Dec 07 15:26:53 * alterego is starting to get the hang of all of this now though :D Dec 07 15:27:23 heh Dec 07 15:27:28 lcuk: i have a small team working on it. i am just a project manager not actually involved in coding. Dec 07 15:28:37 Now to come up with my own icons, rather than using a mish-mash of stock gnome and hildon :D Dec 07 15:28:39 Arkenoi, cool, are you on the related collabora channels and doing this as a proper project then or just hacking around Dec 07 15:28:41 Though, they do look nice. Dec 07 15:29:15 * ajf_ needs to make his n900 app look prettyier Dec 07 15:29:17 i asked Marlinspike to provide me with redphone protocol specs to maintain compatibility, but he said there aren't any atm, so we will probably add it later Dec 07 15:29:44 http://eth0.org.uk/~alan/mf900-3.png Dec 07 15:30:29 lcuk, we are hacking PoC now and will try to push it upstream once it's finished. Maybe it is not really the "proper" way.. Dec 07 15:32:56 Arkenoi cool you are doing stuff, make sure you call by #telepathy and keep the guys informed (via encrypted messages :P) and watch out for the project naming Dec 07 15:33:50 lcuk, ok, i'll ask the developers to stay in touch there Dec 07 15:37:38 ajf_: neat :) Dec 07 15:52:04 good afternoon guys Dec 07 15:53:17 hey Dec 07 15:53:20 hello Dec 07 15:53:25 hm, according to UGT there's no such thing like afternoon Dec 07 15:54:00 anyway hi Venemo_N900 Dec 07 15:59:05 DocScrutinizer: there's no such thing as afternoon? why not? Dec 07 15:59:23 ~ugt Dec 07 15:59:24 well, ugt is Universal Greeting Time. Created in #mipslinux, it is a rule that states that whenever somebody enters an IRC channel it is always morning, and it is always late when the person leaves. The local time of any other people in the channel, including the greeter, is irrelevant. http://www.total-knowledge.com/~ilya/mips/ugt.html Dec 07 16:01:29 DocScrutinizer: thx Dec 07 16:01:43 DocScrutinizer: I'm learning something new every day Dec 07 16:02:17 well, this isn't completely serious :-) Dec 07 16:04:00 well, aint learning the "not completely serious" often the most fun Dec 07 16:04:16 who wants to make a simple video game for mameo? "Marrianne Ny's Swedish Rape Patrol" Dec 07 16:04:30 Hah, wha? :D Dec 07 16:04:52 ok channel formed Dec 07 16:05:01 having said that, and in compliance with utg: its really late and i gotta hit the road Dec 07 16:05:43 fbreader still crashes when I use the Book Info dialog Dec 07 16:05:55 at least crashes on exit have stopped happening Dec 07 16:06:19 or maybe the Swedish Dating Game? Dec 07 16:16:48 "A musician who went into a central London sandwich store to buy something to eat has had a 300-year-old Stradivarius violin worth 1.2 million pounds stolen." Dec 07 16:18:06 I see the point in your post javispedro Dec 07 16:18:22 what good will asking Nokia for OSSing sw do, none Dec 07 16:18:23 link? Dec 07 16:18:29 * MohammadAG goes back to looking at Qt Dec 07 16:18:44 crashanddie, same old crap, you've probably seen it N8x0 times I guess Dec 07 16:18:48 sec though Dec 07 16:19:36 http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=66275&page=4 Dec 07 16:19:42 from qgil's post onwards Dec 07 16:19:57 actually, read from the top Dec 07 16:20:17 people always seem to be losing obscenely expensive stradivarius violins all over the place Dec 07 16:20:27 you'd think these people would be rather more careful with such things Dec 07 16:20:49 javispedro: If nothing else, your post made me smile :-) Dec 07 16:21:04 whoah, now that was... Dec 07 16:21:19 though it makes me think Dec 07 16:21:26 will I still buy the N9? Dec 07 16:21:38 MohammadAG: No - you'll get one free. Dec 07 16:21:45 iOS and Symbian have no hope Dec 07 16:21:51 Jaffa, nah :P Dec 07 16:21:53 MohammadAG: Probably/hopefully/delete as appropriate Dec 07 16:21:56 i think i should really do device repairs more often and educate myself in them ^^ i repaired by plainly opening the device and removing the dust from inside it Ö.ö Dec 07 16:22:12 MohammadAG: actually I'm not sure there's a point behind it ;) Dec 07 16:22:18 MohammadAG, I think qgil is going senile. Dec 07 16:22:30 crashanddie, lmao Dec 07 16:22:40 Are we on the "conversations on IRC" bit of javispedro's timeline? ;-) Dec 07 16:22:40 MohammadAG, he used the word MeeGo 4 times in a 3 line paragraph. Dec 07 16:23:03 no, let's start making custom ROMs Dec 07 16:23:15 MohammadAG ++ Dec 07 16:23:16 Jaffa, which timeline Dec 07 16:23:17 include bme and mce in them, the old non relicensed ones! Dec 07 16:23:39 MohammadAG: The Community SSU is one approach for that Dec 07 16:23:40 jacekowski, on that note, have you ever received a C&D for FMTXD? Dec 07 16:24:00 lcuk: See MohammadAG's link to javispedro's post on the "State of Maemo" thread Dec 07 16:24:06 * javispedro notes that the "Community SSU" fits into the "start to fix stuff by themselves" part Dec 07 16:24:14 Jaffa, true, but we can't distribute some minority of apps Dec 07 16:24:35 javispedro: Indeed - but I'm mildly hopeful because it started even before PR1.3 was released. Dec 07 16:24:39 MohammadAG, I wonder, what if we removed the media player altogether? Dec 07 16:24:44 we're allowed to use sed on a binary in a postinst though right? :3 Dec 07 16:24:54 MohammadAG: Indeed; and wget. Dec 07 16:24:59 MohammadAG: And... Dec 07 16:25:04 heh Dec 07 16:25:13 http://talk.maemo.org/showpost.php?p=891542&postcount=51 lcuk Dec 07 16:25:16 * sivang reads the post, there's work to do but this is interesting Dec 07 16:25:21 read from top? Dec 07 16:25:32 It's a tricky question: for the N community to continue to thrive all the leading hackers need to keep it. However, it's in Nokia's interests (and those of the hackers themselves) to get new shiny toys Dec 07 16:25:34 crashanddie, hmm, we need a proper alternative first :P Dec 07 16:25:41 MohammadAG, not an issue Dec 07 16:25:59 sivang: The first half of the thread can be skipped with "council suck" posts. But then look - gosh - we got a straight answer from qgil :-) Dec 07 16:26:05 crashanddie, and if you're hinting at my posts *looks around maemo*, I'll complain about the browser Dec 07 16:26:06 Not a great answer, but an answer. Dec 07 16:26:06 MohammadAG, c'mon, with lcuk, Jaffa, javispedro and you, there's a media player by tomorrow evening. Dec 07 16:26:12 :P Dec 07 16:26:18 Jaffa: it is tricky indeed. note that I do not have a well-formed opinion about the entire issue either, just pointing what I see it's going on. Dec 07 16:26:23 Jaffa: hm, but hackers also need devices they can rely on ;) that's where the n900 fits the story Dec 07 16:26:39 mikki-kun: Maybe, but itch scratching's reduced. Dec 07 16:26:47 crashanddie, if you get involved it can have biometric scanning too Dec 07 16:26:49 crashanddie, kinda doubt it, at least it won't be a 1:1 OSS copy Dec 07 16:26:57 with a sniff detector you could change tracks by farting Dec 07 16:27:09 Qt *does* have an awful lot of abstractions Dec 07 16:27:20 * MohammadAG votes for lcuk as CEO of marketing Dec 07 16:27:22 lcuk, ok, I'll do VoiceOver. Dec 07 16:27:32 your humor might beat Sony's :P Dec 07 16:27:37 humour Dec 07 16:27:38 * sivang sets away and hopes to read the not least interesting backlog from here, starting this discussion Dec 07 16:27:45 * sivang -> reading Dec 07 16:27:55 crashanddie: oh, I really wish. The sad truth is that if you do something like VoiceOver but OSS you would be famous. Dec 07 16:28:05 because you would be the first. Dec 07 16:28:07 crashanddie, fix libsexy spelling in xchat Dec 07 16:28:24 it went ugly with hildon's Entry box Dec 07 16:28:32 javispedro, what, TTS on an id3 tag would be a world first? Dec 07 16:28:47 ah, voiceover is tts only? Dec 07 16:28:54 was thinking recognition, sorry Dec 07 16:28:56 ah I understand it, yes. Dec 07 16:28:57 not used to apple marketing ;) Dec 07 16:29:07 didn't stephen hawking release "satisfaction" which has TTS voiceover? Dec 07 16:29:16 lmao Dec 07 16:30:04 for those who didn't get lcuk's joke: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WF67kuOoWjE Dec 07 16:30:17 (and even for those who got it) Dec 07 16:30:52 satisfaction! Dec 07 16:31:23 crashanddie: i still don't get it.. Dec 07 16:31:24 really really really want TTS plugin for xchat Dec 07 16:31:32 i am in a chan here on freenode that has a stream for it Dec 07 16:31:44 mikki-kun, then go read about stephen hawking Dec 07 16:32:02 (#fmcg jeri ellsworths channel) Dec 07 16:32:12 MohammadAG, design the basic UI Dec 07 16:32:34 done (at least in my head) Dec 07 16:32:36 Jaffa, write the file handling (reading directories, reading ID3 tags when available) Dec 07 16:32:53 lcuk, provide the API to read the files in a separate thread Dec 07 16:32:56 what? no tracker support? Dec 07 16:33:01 fuck tracker Dec 07 16:33:02 no MAFW integration? Dec 07 16:33:02 :P Dec 07 16:33:04 for v1 Dec 07 16:33:26 I'll implement the "random" button. Dec 07 16:33:44 I'll draw the icon Dec 07 16:33:46 javispedro, it doesn't have to play anything in 1.0 Dec 07 16:33:48 then ask wazd to paint it Dec 07 16:34:02 and alterego can implement it in qml Dec 07 16:34:19 qml takes too much memory :P Dec 07 16:34:24 or so he says Dec 07 16:34:25 and here we hit another problem Dec 07 16:34:37 'allo frals :) Dec 07 16:34:44 question is, should I take this seriously and start today? Dec 07 16:34:59 Why the hell not Dec 07 16:35:05 People moan about media player Dec 07 16:35:14 People say "It's open source, yaaaay, we can hack away at it@ Dec 07 16:35:20 I say, fuck it, and let's do it. Dec 07 16:35:21 every time I clap my hands a new media player is born somewhere on the surface of the planet Dec 07 16:35:40 lcuk, or we hack one that is decent and available and package it to replace the stock one Dec 07 16:35:42 ello Gizmokid2005 Dec 07 16:35:58 \o frals Dec 07 16:35:59 lcuk, you don't clap a lot then :P Dec 07 16:36:01 frals: which fmms file? fmms_gui.py? Dec 07 16:36:05 are you implementing send via MMS? :D Dec 07 16:36:10 o/ lcuk Dec 07 16:36:18 lcuk: ? ;o Dec 07 16:36:20 Gizmokid2005: aye Dec 07 16:36:45 on the new media player discussed ^ Dec 07 16:36:56 crashanddie, agreed, I'll start on a UI today Dec 07 16:37:05 Dunno what it is yet, but its' fun: http://stage.rubyx.co.uk/research/qtquick/chrome-buttons-003.png Dec 07 16:37:09 crashanddie, about hacking an existing one, I doubt it'll end up nice Dec 07 16:37:13 lcuk: where what? Dec 07 16:37:21 MohammadAG, cool. Dec 07 16:37:26 What codecs do we support? Dec 07 16:37:31 wav, mp3? Dec 07 16:37:32 in v1 Dec 07 16:37:34 huh Dec 07 16:37:35 crashanddie: we use mafw Dec 07 16:37:35 frals scrollback a page or so to where stephen hawking was discussed Dec 07 16:37:48 all, we use gstreamer Dec 07 16:37:53 alterego, Morris Area Freewheelers Bicycle Club? Dec 07 16:38:09 or mafw, whatever Dec 07 16:38:14 wtf is mafw? Dec 07 16:38:19 lcuk: sure, i have dbus api for starting fmms ;-) Dec 07 16:38:22 alright frals, here some fun funs. "./fmms-gui.py:405: GtkWarning: gtk_list_store_remove: assertion `VALID_ITER (iter, list_store)' failed [next line] self.liststore.remove(miter)" Dec 07 16:38:22 (doesn't mafw use gstreamer anyways?) Dec 07 16:38:25 crashanddie: media application framework, the same backend the stock media player uses/ Dec 07 16:38:26 multimedia application framework Dec 07 16:38:27 crashanddie, a backend Dec 07 16:38:28 frals, win \o/ Dec 07 16:38:33 but it sucks? Dec 07 16:38:35 Gizmokid2005: you can paste everything in a querty, please :) Dec 07 16:38:39 I thought we wanted to improve? Dec 07 16:38:41 crashanddie: but it is open ;) Dec 07 16:38:45 oh Dec 07 16:38:45 No Dec 07 16:38:47 no? Dec 07 16:38:48 The UI sucks Dec 07 16:38:49 what the media player poorly uses Dec 07 16:38:55 ok Dec 07 16:39:00 then let's go for MAFW Dec 07 16:39:02 mafw is pretty cool. Dec 07 16:39:13 Should probably use tracker too .. Dec 07 16:39:18 not in V1 Dec 07 16:39:20 But not rely on it. Dec 07 16:39:21 Gizmokid2005: ah, i suspect i know why its failing... had to change some stuff when enabling livesearch, will add it to my list of stuff to check Dec 07 16:39:23 that's for v1.5 Dec 07 16:39:41 Gizmokid2005: thanks for letting me know :) Dec 07 16:39:48 Are you planning on making it look like the stock player? Dec 07 16:40:01 javispedro, can you look around at replacing the binary? What command line options are used? How is it called? What do we need to replace? Can we use apt to replace it? Dec 07 16:40:01 * javispedro notes that it should Dec 07 16:40:08 frals: thanks for letting me report it :) Like I said, they disappear when I start it up again, just don't remove when I do it now. Dec 07 16:40:13 alterego, design goal of MAFW was to have different backend support Dec 07 16:40:31 as announced it was expected to work with gstreamer and mplayer afaik Dec 07 16:40:41 MAFW has turned into a new project now called Grilo Dec 07 16:40:47 crashanddie: nothing weird about it. Dec 07 16:40:49 Interesting Dec 07 16:40:50 it fixes everything the MAFW guys were ashamed with :) Dec 07 16:40:53 http://live.gnome.org/Grilo Dec 07 16:40:58 if you want something like MAFW, use Grilo :) Dec 07 16:41:08 http://maemoide.nokia.com/fremantle/index.jsp?topic=/org.maemo.mica.maemosdk.help.api.c.multimedia/api_refs/5.0/mafw-shared/chapter-describing-mafw.html Dec 07 16:41:13 We don't want something like mafw .. We want mafw .. Dec 07 16:41:18 "# Dec 07 16:41:18 Independence of the technology. Since MAFW is a plugin based framework, it is not tied to a particular multimedia technology (GStreamer, MPlayer, Tracker). Plugin developers have freedom to choose the technologies they want to use in their plugins, and application developers do not need to know about them." Dec 07 16:41:20 back to physics, brb in some time, we'll start on it today Dec 07 16:41:53 ahhh Robot101 Dec 07 16:41:54 javispedro, can apt replace the binary? (or copy it/symlink) Dec 07 16:42:06 postinst Dec 07 16:42:09 you don't want to do that Dec 07 16:42:20 indeed Dec 07 16:42:24 either upgrade it via ssu or create a new bianry Dec 07 16:42:34 yep Dec 07 16:42:38 upgrade via SSU it is then Dec 07 16:42:45 that's why I hate modified hildon-desktop Dec 07 16:42:55 the package it makes at least Dec 07 16:43:06 new binary is going to fuck up calls -- whenever the rest of Maemo calls the media player, the old one will be used Dec 07 16:46:38 anyway, gotta run Dec 07 16:46:55 Need to finish the roadmap presentation for tomorrow morning Dec 07 16:48:37 * sivang ran for something and is back reading Dec 07 16:50:22 the forum thing is trouble for folks that can't get used it, I must say. It is like moe of the community happening is there and if you prefer MLs you are left out, for the most part. Dec 07 16:51:18 sivang: fortunately we have excellent MWKN coverage about both channels ;) Dec 07 16:51:18 sivang: Ha, I can point to some threads that say the opposite Dec 07 16:51:24 javispedro: :) Dec 07 16:51:42 sivang, same for many things, with multiple ways of communication I doubt there is a person comfortable with all Dec 07 16:51:53 Jaffa: ;) Dec 07 16:52:09 lcuk: true Dec 07 16:52:39 MohammadAG: A new media player should be an improved, open, but basicallt the same, Qt GUI over MAFW/Tracker/Qt Multimedia. Then there's no design challenge (except for obvious niggles) to get to a "happy state" for further customisation. Dec 07 16:53:06 btw, fwiw I was deeply interested in that meeting, but by the time it happened I was so confused with all the happening and a bit sick, that I missed it :-/ Dec 07 16:53:23 I am slowly learning that you can't dance at all weddings in a conf Dec 07 16:53:28 :) Dec 07 16:53:53 As for taking an existing player and customising the UI, the UI's the hardest bit and taking a desktop one of relative significance and modifying it... is mad. Dec 07 16:54:13 IMHO. YMMV. Dec 07 16:54:31 Note that just trying to make it Qt instead of Hildon already makes it different. Dec 07 16:54:38 But a QML media player over MAFW/Tracker should be "relatively" easy. Dec 07 16:54:54 It will be slow to start, for example. Dec 07 16:55:10 javispedro: It's supposed to have similar functionality, be open source and maintain the same interfaces. Dec 07 16:55:24 javispedro: true Dec 07 16:55:39 http://doc.qt.nokia.com/qtmobility-1.1/multimedia.html Dec 07 16:55:57 MAFW= media application framework? Dec 07 16:55:58 and afaik there are already qml bindings for qtm? Dec 07 16:56:12 Depends on the skills of the people implementing it, I guess. But a media player is mostly a UI job Dec 07 16:56:16 sivang: correct Dec 07 16:56:27 so the idea is to have most of the logic of the app in QML? Dec 07 16:56:50 bbl Dec 07 16:57:41 sivang: Picture the Fremantle media player in your head; there are about 6 or so views which map to QML "states" quite nicely. Most of the UI is bespoke, so std. controls are less of an issue. Dec 07 16:58:04 QML startup performance could be an issue, I've only done noddy things so far. Dec 07 16:58:14 hum Dec 07 16:59:18 ? Dec 07 16:59:30 doing such a player in Qt Quick would be the best action we could take from a Meego PoV -- suddenly, Meego gets a reference media player that doesn't suck, and MeegoOnN900 people are happy. Dec 07 17:00:06 however, not so sure if MaemoOnN900 people would be. Dec 07 17:00:34 can we make it easy to have for both {Maemo,MeeGo}OnN900 people? Dec 07 17:00:48 there are other apps that need unsucking, btw Dec 07 17:00:55 not just the media player Dec 07 17:01:06 I mean, out of the meego reference UX Dec 07 17:01:15 but mp could be a good start Dec 07 17:01:20 sivang: Tackle one at a time. Photo viewer & media player are the two easiest IMHO Dec 07 17:01:27 I agree Dec 07 17:01:29 javispedro: Cos of perf or ...? Dec 07 17:01:37 even I can help with an mp Dec 07 17:01:48 if it's lots of QML, to start with Dec 07 17:01:58 performance, potential of non-integration with the rest of the system, etc. Dec 07 17:02:27 what is your opinion, how long will it take for meego/n900 to be feature match for maemo? Dec 07 17:02:32 javispedro: what sort of non integration points are we seeing here apart from different UX? Dec 07 17:02:41 for example, yesterday we were discussing about Sygic muting mediaplayer when giving voice instructions Dec 07 17:02:51 including third-party software etc Dec 07 17:03:02 I do not own sygic, but I believe it uses libplayback for that task Dec 07 17:03:33 how does libplayback interact with Qt? because it interacts quite funnily with SDL: it causes deadlocks everywhere. Dec 07 17:03:36 oh, and its closed. Dec 07 17:03:42 javispedro: ah, finally a turnbyturn app that just works? :) Dec 07 17:04:02 it works, but no traffic data in it yet Dec 07 17:04:21 Arkenoi: having navigational data is ana amazing leap forward, per maemo Dec 07 17:04:25 *an Dec 07 17:04:46 is ti free? Dec 07 17:04:50 sivang: sygic is quite old, it happened on the first days of the n900 Dec 07 17:04:53 nope Dec 07 17:05:14 back when things seemingly were going to be a bit more brighter than previous NITs.. Dec 07 17:05:24 well, mappero does everything except voice assistance. actually a possibility for voice plugins seems to be present in menus, but i do not know if it is really functional Dec 07 17:06:14 it is not free and it is quite expensive for todays standards Dec 07 17:06:23 javispedro: so it looks, yes, looks like a bit of investement went into developing this Dec 07 17:06:39 * sivang hopes mappero can use OSMs Dec 07 17:06:59 alterego, Jaffa - how long is qml startup time at the moment? Dec 07 17:07:08 for even noddy examples Dec 07 17:07:41 so, speaking out of poor practice, maybe having a QML vm prestarted could help? Dec 07 17:07:49 (/me recalls this is doen for python) Dec 07 17:07:52 that's what Hildon does also Dec 07 17:07:54 shudder Dec 07 17:08:15 forget anything else at the moment: what is the startup time :P Dec 07 17:08:27 so we have baseline for people to actually work from Dec 07 17:08:30 lcuk: shudder as a componenet or the literal meaning ? :) Dec 07 17:08:38 literal meaning Dec 07 17:08:45 ~seen Robot101 Dec 07 17:08:46 i am used to practically instant start for things Dec 07 17:08:54 robot101 is currently on #maemo #meego. Has said a total of 17 messages. Is idling for 27m 56s, last said: 'if you want something like MAFW, use Grilo :)'. Dec 07 17:09:03 Robot101: ping Dec 07 17:10:03 http://marcin.juszkiewicz.com.pl/2010/12/07/is-this-the-end-of-maemo5/ Dec 07 17:10:52 hrw|gone: join the rant in the talk.maemo.org Dec 07 17:10:55 thread. Dec 07 17:11:09 regarding maemo's knowledge learned, I'm not sure it is actively used in meego so far, at least from what I've asked and heard even during the conf Dec 07 17:11:21 (reading through the intro on the talk. article) Dec 07 17:11:47 that recent "wontfix by policy" bug in bugs.meego.com doesn't help Dec 07 17:12:25 "If you're waiting for directions as to what you should do next, stop waiting. Continue developing for Maemo or start developing for MeeGo. In the end, both will support each other." Dec 07 17:12:30 seriously? Dec 07 17:12:31 javispedro, uh? got an example URL? Dec 07 17:12:40 andre__: http://bugs.meego.com/show_bug.cgi?id=10739 Dec 07 17:12:41 Bug 10739: Powertop licencing. Dec 07 17:12:45 povbot: shut up! Dec 07 17:12:46 javispedro: Error: "shut" is not a valid command. Dec 07 17:12:55 thanks Dec 07 17:13:38 * javispedro is also condemned to repeat history Dec 07 17:14:08 javispedro: wow Dec 07 17:14:16 javispedro: shocked Dec 07 17:14:17 let me reopen... Dec 07 17:15:28 guys, why i cant find the src of telepathy-sofiasip here, http://maemo.org/packages/package_instance/view/fremantle_root_pr1-2_armel/telepathy-sofiasip/0.6.2-0maemo4+0m5/ Dec 07 17:16:05 * sivang regrets seeing this bug report and the responder's comment. this is taking wind out of sails. Dec 07 17:17:11 thanks andre__ ;) Dec 07 17:17:43 hi Dec 07 17:18:36 trumee: http://repository.maemo.org/pool/fremantle/free/t/telepathy-sofiasip/ Dec 07 17:18:57 trumee: no idea why the interface doesn't show it, probably not implemented for device repos Dec 07 17:18:57 javispedro: thanks Dec 07 17:19:14 yeah, doesn't show any links to free default packages Dec 07 17:19:58 lcuk: FWIW, my simple QML hello world starts in about 3 seconds from clicking icon. Fremantle Media Playeer takes 4 Dec 07 17:20:29 Jaffa, try something simpler - calculator afaik starts quickly Dec 07 17:21:03 javispedro: fremantle mp connects to tracker no? Dec 07 17:21:08 Jaffa: 3 seconds sound snappy actualy Dec 07 17:21:10 javispedro: and asks for items Dec 07 17:21:39 Jaffa: I read you statement about cross platformness, you are aware the promise is far from being complete? Dec 07 17:21:55 sivang: I do not have the whole picture in mind but I think media player just delegates on mafw for media discovery Dec 07 17:22:07 javispedro: and then mafw talks to tracker? Dec 07 17:22:09 lcuk: Clock takes 4 too to replace the pre-startimage with the actual window Dec 07 17:22:11 yep Dec 07 17:22:24 sivang: That was my point ;) Dec 07 17:22:52 javispedro: Single state, Rectangle with gradient and a Text Dec 07 17:22:52 I find it funny that my radio application takes exactly one second to coldboot ;) Dec 07 17:23:39 Jaffa, surprisingly, clock does quite a bit and takes longer than calc afaik (i have both on my desktop) Dec 07 17:24:00 yeah, clock seems weird Dec 07 17:24:02 just my desktop is downstairs Dec 07 17:24:06 lcuk: I don't have Calc on my desktop Dec 07 17:24:19 ahh no prob then Dec 07 17:24:22 lcuk: 2.5 Dec 07 17:24:22 javispedro: ah right, I was getting the impression you were saying "in develop we trust" :) Dec 07 17:24:24 ish Dec 07 17:24:36 lcuk: i.e. on this diff is small between Dec 07 17:25:14 ok fair enough Dec 07 17:25:21 i have a metric tonne of alarms in mine Dec 07 17:25:26 perhaps thats the diff Dec 07 17:26:56 na, I have 4 alarms and even then clock is the slowest application to boot from the entire first page on my launcher Dec 07 17:31:00 i really need to get on top of the forums Dec 07 17:31:09 so much relevant stuff there Dec 07 17:31:23 well, in terms of the council, at least Dec 07 17:34:52 Jaffa, it should also be easily portable Dec 07 17:35:06 hello MohammadAG :) Dec 07 17:35:13 hey Venemo Dec 07 17:35:19 hi sivang Dec 07 17:35:24 I have to get back to work, though this thread is terribly interesting. Dec 07 17:35:34 see you all later Dec 07 17:36:39 This page doesnt discuss how to terminate dnsmasq connection it created on ocsuite disconnect, http://wiki.maemo.org/N900_USB_router Dec 07 17:37:18 and i guess killall -9 dnsmasq in /usr/sbin/pcsuite-disable.sh will not be good idea. Dec 07 17:40:10 hey Venemo Dec 07 17:40:31 what's up? Dec 07 17:41:25 nothing much Dec 07 17:41:43 any depressing news today? :) Dec 07 17:42:19 many Dec 07 17:42:42 A friend of mine passed his interview with Nokia... for a position in the group that makes Ovi Maps. Dec 07 17:43:32 That depressed me, at least. Dec 07 17:43:37 Do they supply the bike, clipboard, and GPS? Dec 07 17:44:13 derf: In Germany? Dec 07 17:46:00 I wonder how Nokia HQ is Dec 07 17:46:25 RST38h: Yes. Dec 07 17:46:42 - "My coffee machine is broken" - "WONTFIX" Dec 07 17:47:04 derf: Oh well, it is still in Germany, so impractical Dec 07 17:47:23 derf: But you can apply for Ovi Services jobs in Boston :) Dec 07 17:48:55 I have a Nokia-branded mug Dec 07 17:49:08 the Nokia logo is printed on the inside Dec 07 17:50:06 Venemo: Well, once you get really pissed off at Nokia, you can use it for urinal or something, rather than vent your feelings at TMO! Dec 07 17:51:44 RST38h: lol Dec 07 17:51:45 RST38h: your sense of humor is nice :D:D:D Dec 07 17:51:54 RST38h: although it's nowhere near lcuk's Dec 07 17:52:13 Venemo: So what has he proposed to use it for? Dec 07 17:53:45 RST38h: what? Dec 07 17:55:33 heh Dec 07 17:55:43 the I got a Pre thread was closed? Dec 07 17:56:00 preemptively I guess ;) Dec 07 17:57:34 according to slashdot, Meego is killing KDE ;) Dec 07 17:57:39 http://tech.slashdot.org/article.pl?sid=10/12/07/1719245 Dec 07 17:59:35 javispedro: by doing zombie attack? Dec 07 18:02:32 bah, as usual, slashdot being trollish Dec 07 18:04:13 crashanddie, so, who's coding the media player again? me, you, lcuk and? Dec 07 18:04:36 heh.. I love that rant thread... 'we open maemo5 code by improving meego' Dec 07 18:06:43 and it reminded me one thing which I have to do - mark all maemo bugs which I opened as wontfixgetlostsucker (if product.vendor==nokia) Dec 07 18:07:18 MohammadAG: sitrep Dec 07 18:07:22 trumee: pong Dec 07 18:07:26 preferably UI screenshot. Dec 07 18:07:37 Robot101: any response from vox? Dec 07 18:07:45 trumee: yeah, the guy called me an asshole yesterday! Dec 07 18:07:52 Robot101: what!!!!!!!! Dec 07 18:07:57 trumee: he apologised though - think he was having a bad day Dec 07 18:08:13 (we exchanged quite a few mails) Dec 07 18:08:24 Robot101: hmm. what was furious about? Dec 07 18:08:36 Robot101: *was he Dec 07 18:08:50 crashanddie_, yeah sure, sec Dec 07 18:08:52 oh just a general rant about demanding board/shareholders/IRS/employees/etc etc and people who were all take take take Dec 07 18:09:24 I explained the principle again - and he apologised - said he'd try and sort the source out by the end of Dec Dec 07 18:09:39 bit weird though, I'm sure he spent more time mailing me than just asking a tech to put the src on the website Dec 07 18:09:57 Robot101: the source is out :) Dec 07 18:10:18 what are you guys talking about? Dec 07 18:10:22 What programm is needed to take Photos? Dec 07 18:10:34 * sivang lied to himself and continued with the thread. Dec 07 18:10:47 crashanddie_: source code of vox-mobile app available on ovi store. Dec 07 18:11:03 trumee: whereabouts? Dec 07 18:11:04 crashanddie_:nice bit of code, adds MWI support to sip. Dec 07 18:11:11 hmm Dec 07 18:11:19 when someone responds to my posts, will I get a notification from tmo? Dec 07 18:11:35 Robot101: he sent me an email yesterday. let me dig it out. Dec 07 18:11:43 if you "watch" the thread Dec 07 18:12:03 Robot101: https://mobile.voxcorp.net/voxmobile/maemo5/pool/main/v/vox-mobile/ Dec 07 18:12:33 a python hildon app no less. Dec 07 18:13:33 hm... python only in deps.. Dec 07 18:13:41 trumee: eh... so why was he flaming me and didn't just give me the URL Dec 07 18:14:10 Robot101: He just sent me an email yesterday so i guess he needed time to sort this out. Dec 07 18:14:39 trumee: who was this? Dec 07 18:14:43 Robot101: Phil Dec 07 18:15:15 trumee: ah, I was talking to someone else - Mark Dec 07 18:15:28 crashanddie_, just wondering, should I follow the same UI as the stock one? Dec 07 18:15:34 cause I can't find the damn icons it uses Dec 07 18:15:42 Robot101: ah i see. Phil is the one who developed that code. Dec 07 18:15:53 MohammadAG: no need for an exact copy -- UI is probably copyright/patented or something Dec 07 18:15:59 MohammadAG: but something in the same spirit Dec 07 18:16:15 crashanddie_: AFAIK, USA has judged UI to be non-copyrightable Dec 07 18:16:15 http://www.forum.nokia.com/document/Maemo_5_Icon_List/html/media_player.html Dec 07 18:16:19 MohammadAG: also, I was thinking about using some kind of visualisation. I'm sure alterego or kot can help with that. Dec 07 18:16:35 actually, http://www.forum.nokia.com/document/Maemo_5_Icon_List/ Dec 07 18:16:38 plus, an exact copy would be quirky Dec 07 18:16:40 Robot101: Now, when are collabora people going to merge it into telepathy sip upstream? :p Dec 07 18:16:42 crashanddie_, gstreamer can handle that too Dec 07 18:16:52 http://www.privetbank.com.ua/cablegate/index.html wikileaks cablegate torrent diffs, deletions, missing files, restored files Dec 07 18:16:53 lol javispedro didn't see that before I pasted the link Dec 07 18:17:10 * javispedro has online docs bookmarked for obvious reasons... Dec 07 18:17:16 yeah, but not well, last I checked a lot of dependencies were missing, MohammadAG Dec 07 18:17:16 Ho ho ho Dec 07 18:19:54 crashanddie_, someone got them working with some pipes Dec 07 18:26:05 I am looking for a new Tablet. I had nokia N810. Nokia n900 is too smal. What could you recommend? Dec 07 18:26:26 too small in what way? Dec 07 18:27:00 it is hardly to read. Fine resolution but small, there is no Stylus, Dec 07 18:27:38 is there something like nokia n810 but more powerfull? Dec 07 18:27:45 n900 does have stylus. next one will not Dec 07 18:28:11 markinfo: you can change font size Dec 07 18:28:18 well - there is many Phone and tablets. Not only Nokia. Dec 07 18:28:50 It would be the best to have the same desktop as here - XFCE. Is it possible? Dec 07 18:29:46 I do not like to learn many new Programs - just small Desktop with some application for calling. Dec 07 18:33:56 markinfo: nothing sane exists, unfortunately Dec 07 18:34:23 markinfo: XFCE on N900 is possible, howeve Dec 07 18:37:03 Robot101: is that code interesting? Dec 07 18:39:38 trumee: I'll get someone to take a look Dec 07 18:39:47 Robot101: nice Dec 07 18:43:38 http://fukung.net/v/2855/vim.gif ubuntu releases 'vi assistant' Dec 07 18:43:50 oooooooooooold Dec 07 18:44:14 ( ;) ) Dec 07 18:44:54 ok Dec 07 18:45:53 crashanddie, UI came out shitty on the N900, sec, getting a designer on board Dec 07 18:46:19 QListWidgets don't work well on the N900 :/ Dec 07 18:47:09 * javispedro lols Dec 07 18:47:26 Judge Howard Riddle of the City of Westminster Magistrates Court, denied Julian Assange bail today http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/nationworld/sns-ap-wikileaks,0,2625246.story?track=rss Dec 07 18:47:32 the idiots at xda eventually got tired of trying to port webos to their htc hero by "editing inittab" so they started faking screenshots Dec 07 18:47:53 heh Dec 07 18:48:29 http://forums.precentral.net/2783080-post69.html Dec 07 18:49:03 I'm sure engadget will fall for it Dec 07 18:51:43 copying a UI is harder than making one Dec 07 18:53:48 Shouldn't use a QListWidget (cc crashanddie) http://i54.tinypic.com/1fa14z.jpg Dec 07 18:54:10 Heh Dec 07 18:54:17 First time I've seen webos Dec 07 18:55:09 alterego, got a workaround/something similar to the media player's buttons in Qt? Dec 07 18:56:02 I could do it quite easily ... Dec 07 18:56:15 Wait which buttons? ;) Dec 07 18:56:59 alterego, take a look at the link above Dec 07 18:58:05 Yeah, that shouldn't be too hard Dec 07 18:58:10 I'd use QML too :P Dec 07 19:00:33 alterego, I thought that wastes memory Dec 07 19:00:46 No, no more than Qt .. Dec 07 19:00:59 And with an opengl optimized canvas it should be nicer. Dec 07 19:01:25 * lcuk desires line drawing in gl Dec 07 19:01:30 unfortunately on the n900 ... Dec 07 19:01:33 a forgotten art Dec 07 19:01:34 non fullscreen gl... Dec 07 19:01:48 javispedro: is that a problem? Dec 07 19:01:53 it is slow. Dec 07 19:02:00 Hmm Dec 07 19:02:09 and you know why ;) Dec 07 19:02:09 especially if we add visualizations Dec 07 19:02:18 Yes, Dec 07 19:02:22 That's annoying Dec 07 19:02:29 why? Dec 07 19:02:53 * lcuk does already know, I just rather have it mentioned for others who are listening with interest Dec 07 19:03:24 the long version or the condensed one? ;) Dec 07 19:03:44 I'm interested to hear both actually. Dec 07 19:03:55 bah, you evil. Dec 07 19:03:57 * alterego chuckles Dec 07 19:04:04 Mohammad: You do not need or *want* to copy Nokia's Media Player UI Dec 07 19:04:08 Mohammad: it is atrocious Dec 07 19:04:25 Mohammad: Please, copy iPod / iTunes player instead, please Dec 07 19:04:29 ehh Dec 07 19:04:42 Heh Dec 07 19:04:45 some guy thinks i'm master hacker and can hack every website Dec 07 19:04:55 I suppose he's got a point .. Dec 07 19:04:57 and he's linking me exploits and asking why they don't work Dec 07 19:05:04 Mohammad: (yes, I know all about iStuff being evil etc, but it is very usable, so mke use of it) Dec 07 19:05:07 jacekowski: s/hacker/cracker Dec 07 19:05:18 s/cracker/fucker Dec 07 19:05:25 and make it rest at that Dec 07 19:05:25 :) Dec 07 19:05:51 RST38h, I've never seen the iPod's music player Dec 07 19:07:03 Mohammad: http://www.google.com/images?um=1&hl=en&biw=966&bih=568&tbs=isch%3A1&sa=1&q=ipod+ui&aq=f&aqi=g1&aql=&oq=&gs_rfai= Dec 07 19:07:23 Mohammad: There is also an unfinished iTunes-like player project for Maemo. Let me look it up... Dec 07 19:07:42 tbh I don not like that UI much Dec 07 19:07:49 Mohammad: http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=30901 Dec 07 19:07:58 tbh also they maemo one and ipod one arent that different Dec 07 19:08:01 make a concepts thread Dec 07 19:08:04 javispedro: Well, it is way better than Maemo5 one Dec 07 19:08:06 discuss till blue in face Dec 07 19:08:17 make multiple mockups Dec 07 19:08:18 lcuk: ...not. Dec 07 19:08:19 feel them Dec 07 19:08:25 qml should allow that? right? Dec 07 19:08:34 lcuk: Take Quasar and either fix or copy it. Period. Dec 07 19:08:53 the idea is to allow designers free reign *grin* Dec 07 19:08:57 no. Dec 07 19:09:04 nah, reinventing the wheel is funnier! (/me hopes alterego doesn't read this line) Dec 07 19:09:10 that will accomplish nothing Dec 07 19:12:28 qml should allow that? right? << we don't want a slow UI on the N900 Dec 07 19:12:49 well, qml does not necessarily mean slow ui Dec 07 19:13:12 I would at least try qml, to assert how useful it is Dec 07 19:13:40 if it is, in fact, no slower than gtk+, using QML will speed up your UI development by an order of magnitude Dec 07 19:13:44 javispedro: making better wheels is fun Dec 07 19:13:51 o/ hi Dec 07 19:13:54 moin Dec 07 19:14:02 RST38h, swings and roundabouts Dec 07 19:14:05 RST38h, and so will using Qt Designer Dec 07 19:14:11 (I'm sure Bash would like to help) Dec 07 19:14:12 gtk can accept .ui files Dec 07 19:14:20 * javispedro has yet to try qml... Dec 07 19:14:21 or whatever they are Dec 07 19:14:22 tbh, writing core apps in Qt is probably better than using gtk .. Dec 07 19:14:38 depends on wheter your primary target is m5 or meego Dec 07 19:14:43 MohammadAG: what orientation will u be using? Dec 07 19:14:43 s/m5/fremantle Dec 07 19:14:55 landscape? Dec 07 19:14:56 Bash, can you make up a quick UI concept? Probably in photoshop, both Dec 07 19:15:03 both :) Dec 07 19:15:08 javispedro: why would that matter? Maemo 5 has better Qt support than meego anyway .. Dec 07 19:15:12 focus on buttons, instead of graphics for now Dec 07 19:15:17 buttons/widgets etc Dec 07 19:15:24 location or design? Dec 07 19:15:31 alterego: not perfect either, and, is that true? Dec 07 19:15:51 location, a UI concept, how it will look, the same way any app is made :) Dec 07 19:15:54 javispedro: well, yes. Dec 07 19:15:56 then when can add the eye candy Dec 07 19:16:08 hola! Dec 07 19:16:15 javispedro: if you want to write for meego, at the moment you're basically stuck doing fullscreen apps or using mtf Dec 07 19:16:17 Mohammad: Tried Qt Designer. Worthless. Dec 07 19:16:39 I couldnt get Status menu in portrait mode to work , what do you think is wrong? Dec 07 19:16:40 RST38h, couple it with Qt Creator :) Dec 07 19:16:46 Mohammad: You will type the ui code fasterthan you can design it in the qt designer. The same goesfor modifications. Dec 07 19:17:06 RST38h: depends who "you" are ;) Dec 07 19:17:14 reinstall the status menu using my deb and kill the status menu, then make sure you installed my desktop package Dec 07 19:17:15 Though I do everything by hand myself .. Dec 07 19:17:37 RST38h: have you tried javafx? Dec 07 19:17:40 You'll learn more if you do it that way too .. Dec 07 19:18:05 javispedro: no and not going to Dec 07 19:18:10 MohammadAG, is this one http://mohammadag.xceleo.org/public/maemo/debfiles/portrait/hildon-status-menu/hildon-status-menu_0.3.39+0m5_armel.deb? Dec 07 19:18:14 alterego: does not matter Dec 07 19:18:19 writing by hand gives you more freedom, designing in the designer is significantly faster Dec 07 19:18:25 k MohammadAG gimme 15 mins :) Dec 07 19:18:27 lolloo, yep Dec 07 19:18:34 alterego: try designing a really good ui in qt designer (scalable etc) Dec 07 19:18:34 awesome Dec 07 19:18:43 alterego: see yourself failmiserably Dec 07 19:18:59 Meanwhile: "U.S. Celebrates Wikileaks Arrest By Announcing Press Freedom Day" Dec 07 19:19:05 Bash, we're not in a hurry Dec 07 19:19:09 RST38h: I have, that's why I don't use it .. Dec 07 19:20:17 Mohammad: Not faster. Once you go from placing some buttons at absolute coordinates to using layouts with fillers (to get scalable UI), you will see that qt designer is not worth it Dec 07 19:20:31 argh Dec 07 19:20:38 * javispedro suddenly remembers fillers Dec 07 19:20:45 *shudder *shudder* Dec 07 19:20:52 *faint* Dec 07 19:20:52 yea, not the best concept Dec 07 19:21:11 I think if Qt defined layouts in terms of HTML TABLEs, it would have more success Dec 07 19:21:27 that's what SWT designer did last time I saw it Dec 07 19:21:41 also known as grid layout Dec 07 19:21:50 heh Dec 07 19:24:07 mandelUI would be interesting, defining the whole UI based on a set of coordinates within the complex plane :) Dec 07 19:24:37 KOffice kaput! Dec 07 19:25:10 hi , is var/lib/dpkg some kind of tmpfs cause each time i do apt-get update i download everything Dec 07 19:25:56 don't touch that directory Dec 07 19:26:05 /var/cache/apt/archives is the temp directory Dec 07 19:26:38 ok but it is volatile upon reboot ? Dec 07 19:26:55 cause i have a really slow internet connection and each time i have to download 20 meg Dec 07 19:26:59 or 10 Dec 07 19:28:07 Urgh, so many bloody iPhone 4 adverts on TV it's making me quite annoyed :/ Dec 07 19:28:20 buy buy buy buy buy buy buy Dec 07 19:28:22 Oh, that's better (mutes TV) Dec 07 19:28:27 lucky you, I still see 3G ones Dec 07 19:28:28 alterego: buy buy buy buy buy buy buy Dec 07 19:28:43 Angels we have heeeeard on high Dec 07 19:28:51 Tell us GO OUT AND BUY! Dec 07 19:29:33 I like QMLs layout strategy Dec 07 19:29:33 haha Dec 07 19:29:42 You've got columns, rows and grids Dec 07 19:29:51 But you can also use anchor points. Dec 07 19:29:58 Which is cool Dec 07 19:30:48 I'm working on scalable UI elements at the moment. Dec 07 19:37:24 Hi Dec 07 19:43:15 Grrr .. Dec 07 19:45:48 same feeling; http://i53.tinypic.com/900oqe.jpg Dec 07 19:46:00 LOL Dec 07 19:46:56 Noice Dec 07 19:47:29 well, setIcon() isn't the way to go then Dec 07 19:47:50 there should be scale there somewhere Dec 07 19:47:59 * RST38h vaguely remembrs setting icons scale Dec 07 19:48:21 MohammadAG: you probably want to just make that an image rather than a button Dec 07 19:48:27 how didn't I remember to set that Dec 07 19:48:30 Then process the mouse button event. Dec 07 19:49:09 MohammadAG: I guess Qt must have an option to set the stock icon size to use Dec 07 19:49:40 could anybody explain me the problem with apt-get update on maemo , it always download several mega ... seems like no caching Dec 07 19:50:27 thats just the package `index' (which keeps changing) Dec 07 19:51:58 troulouliou: extras gets regenerated every half an hour Dec 07 19:52:30 alterego: ho ok Dec 07 19:53:30 and about aircrack , is it usable actually ? i get a weird error about iw but wireless tools is installed Dec 07 19:57:34 can i use hold with dpkg has under Debian to keep a package at a version ?? Dec 07 19:58:31 heh Dec 07 19:58:48 alterego, set this as a styleSheet for a QToolButton, background-color: a(0); Dec 07 19:58:56 watch Qt Creator segfault Dec 07 19:59:36 * javispedro suggest you file that, could be a potential security bug Dec 07 20:00:39 lol? Dec 07 20:00:49 Heh Dec 07 20:00:50 css parsing related crash Dec 07 20:00:57 specially Dec 07 20:01:03 malformed css parsing related crash Dec 07 20:01:25 or is it wellformed? Dec 07 20:02:37 I don't think so no. Dec 07 20:10:33 well, that's solved, sorta Dec 07 20:12:10 http://i53.tinypic.com/21ovrfd.jpg alterego :P Dec 07 20:14:27 Neat Dec 07 20:15:16 yeah, except it doesn't use layouts :P Dec 07 20:15:57 and I had to move the buttons pixel-by-pixel till they matched the background Dec 07 20:16:26 Well, tbh, you should have been doing that all along :P Dec 07 20:16:40 * MohammadAG grumbles Dec 07 20:17:32 grr Dec 07 20:17:45 Hi does anybody have a good link for dual boot on maemo ? Dec 07 20:17:51 i would like to test neopwn Dec 07 20:18:05 http://xizhizhu.blogspot.com/2010/05/javascript-benchmarking-on-n900-pr12.html Dec 07 20:18:08 neopwn's just a kernel Dec 07 20:18:14 i just found that in my referers Dec 07 20:18:49 MohammadAG: sure ? looks like another distri for N900 Dec 07 20:18:55 with dfferent repos Dec 07 20:19:50 no, it's a kernel Dec 07 20:20:43 mmm Dec 07 20:21:56 Final UI: http://stage.rubyx.co.uk/qmote/Screenshot-20101207-201852.png Dec 07 20:22:20 Well, except the close button, and I'm going to add a switch to dashboard button in the top left aswell .. Dec 07 20:23:23 the #meego-meeting area is discussing (amongst other things) how we can make meego more inviting to maemo users Dec 07 20:23:33 sexy :P Dec 07 20:23:37 now we have a meego OBS that can (almost) build for fremantle Dec 07 20:23:49 aren't the UI buttons small though? Dec 07 20:23:52 just in case anyone wanted to chat Dec 07 20:23:59 MohammadAG: yes Dec 07 20:24:01 They are a bit. Dec 07 20:24:08 But it looks awesome .. Dec 07 20:24:16 lbt, good luck convincing users like me ;) Dec 07 20:24:18 And I can use it well enough. So we'll see how many people complain. Dec 07 20:24:27 * MohammadAG lurks Dec 07 20:24:47 Much better than my original UI :D Dec 07 20:24:54 alterego, start a bugtracker, then when users say it's too small mark the bug as THATSWHATSHESAID Dec 07 20:25:01 * MohammadAG feels childish, back to app Dec 07 20:25:12 Heh Dec 07 20:25:43 btw Dec 07 20:25:58 do you think I should use icons from theme, or just add them to the resources file? Dec 07 20:27:37 and... here's my first problem, http://i52.tinypic.com/211uwcl.jpg :/ Dec 07 20:27:56 (when clicked) Dec 07 20:35:30 Mohammad: should be a separate clicked-icon, no? Dec 07 20:36:05 that's it? Dec 07 20:36:43 * RST38h scrolls back Dec 07 20:36:56 In the resource file, default to icons from theme :))) Dec 07 20:37:52 do you know what the button clicked image is called? Dec 07 20:38:04 no but I can look up Dec 07 20:46:34 RST38h, looked, couldn't find it :) Dec 07 20:46:51 found a few alternaive icon themes, looking there Dec 07 21:00:15 nyargh Dec 07 21:00:30 hey Dec 07 21:00:36 renders fine when using gl, renders glitchy without Dec 07 21:20:53 hi again :) Dec 07 21:23:17 Aloha Venemo Dec 07 21:24:01 hey alterego :) Dec 07 21:27:32 hmm, so if I have the maemo Qt SDK installed, I need another Qt Creator for MeeGo :/ Dec 07 21:27:44 why is that? Dec 07 21:28:03 I thought the same one can be used Dec 07 21:28:04 it's pulling in meego-sdk-qtcreator Dec 07 21:28:11 as per http://wiki.meego.com/SDK/Docs/1.1/Getting_started_with_the_MeeGo_SDK_for_Linux#On_Ubuntu_or_Debian Dec 07 21:28:14 eh. Dec 07 21:28:21 lol Dec 07 21:29:34 root@mohammad-i5laptop:/home/mohammad# mad-admin create -f meego-core-armv7l-1.1No predefined target/runtime 'meego-core-armv7l-1.1' found. Dec 07 21:29:39 meh Dec 07 21:29:43 interesting Dec 07 21:29:54 MohammadAG: you're gonna do MeeGo dev now? :) Dec 07 21:30:14 just having a look Dec 07 21:30:30 hi all Dec 07 21:31:06 w00t_ are you here? Dec 07 21:31:16 ~seen w00t_ Dec 07 21:31:26 w00t_ is currently on #maemo (7d 10h 35m 53s) #meego (7d 10h 35m 53s). Has said a total of 2 messages. Is idling for 4d 4h 14m 32s, last said: 'oops'. Dec 07 21:31:46 ty Venemo :) Dec 07 21:32:38 rsc_: infobot is always helpful Dec 07 21:32:56 ~botsnack Dec 07 21:32:56 aw, gee, MohammadAG Dec 07 21:33:01 I reask for my problem: is there someone that know how start an application (if possible) instead the virtual keyboard? Dec 07 21:33:17 in Fremantle? Dec 07 21:33:23 yes :) Dec 07 21:33:37 rsc_: check out Hildon Input Method Framework Dec 07 21:33:44 firstly, I smell trouble here -- can you describe what you want to do? Dec 07 21:33:49 Venemo, damn, you beat me to it Dec 07 21:33:59 javispedro, probably a virtual keyboard replacement Dec 07 21:34:01 ty Venemo, again Dec 07 21:34:13 MohammadAG: that would be valid, but.. Dec 07 21:34:22 it's the wrong way, I know Dec 07 21:34:32 rsc_: you want to replace the stock keyboard? Dec 07 21:34:32 javispedro: I want to start FastSMS instead of virtual keyboard for writing sms Dec 07 21:34:48 * javispedro looks up FastSMS Dec 07 21:35:16 javispedro: it is an application for write sms using something like T9 Dec 07 21:35:17 T9 sms app Dec 07 21:35:30 ... as I thought, wrong answer then Dec 07 21:35:46 hm Dec 07 21:35:50 this is probably hard Dec 07 21:36:03 eheh...nice news Dec 07 21:36:11 didn't someone do a vertical input method? Dec 07 21:36:50 yes...but only changing layout of virtual kb Dec 07 21:36:58 (I think) Dec 07 21:37:12 no code is executed Dec 07 21:37:13 na, existing vkb doesn't do portrait Dec 07 21:37:23 i'm quite sure I even saw the screenshot Dec 07 21:37:36 that is some boringwork but not terribly hard Dec 07 21:37:55 there's already a "portrait keyboard" in devel Dec 07 21:38:22 so, just merge it and FastSMS and ... instant win. Dec 07 21:38:33 yep! Dec 07 21:38:37 brb Dec 07 21:38:45 ta Venemo Dec 07 21:39:00 yes Venemo, I saw it and took a look to code... Dec 07 21:39:35 but it seems to be something different...but perhaps I'm wronging Dec 07 21:45:10 in postinstall of "portrait keyboard" there are: Dec 07 21:45:19 ./usr/bin/gconftool-2 -st string /apps/osso/inputmethod/default-plugins/finger hildon_im_onehand_fkb Dec 07 21:45:28 ./usr/bin/gconftool-2 -st string /apps/osso/inputmethod/default-plugins/stylus hildon_im_onehand_fkb Dec 07 21:55:34 thank you guys...perhaps you light the right way for solve my problem :) Dec 07 21:55:38 can someone guess the size of the font used in the media player start screen? Dec 07 21:55:50 (the size of "Music" "Videos" etc...) Dec 07 21:57:55 14px Dec 07 22:02:28 alterego, looks smaller, doesn't Qt set Maemo fonts by default? Dec 07 22:03:32 alterego, 13px, but thanks :D Dec 07 22:05:33 MohammadAG: yeah, it does Dec 07 22:06:04 MohammadAG: look at HildonFancyButton (renamed HeFancyButton in Hildon-Extras) Dec 07 22:08:31 MohammadAG, Venemo: What would it take you guys to help with MeeGo development? Dec 07 22:08:49 Basically, what are you waiting for? :) Dec 07 22:09:36 Maemo 5 is too usable, and MeeGo isn't, and I need a device for daily use :) Dec 07 22:10:00 * andre__ wonders about the question and replaces "MeeGo" by "Android", "iPhone" and "Windows phone 7" Dec 07 22:10:14 WebOS!! WebOS!! Dec 07 22:10:26 damn, I forgot my HP stocks, true :-P Dec 07 22:10:46 ShadowJK: understandable. Dec 07 22:11:04 let's see. Dec 07 22:11:45 in my brief experience with cs students, your average human prefers instanteneous reward over long term ones Dec 07 22:12:04 Hopefully once we see MeeGo devices appear, they wont be locked or crippled so that the version they run is obsolete from a dev pov :) Dec 07 22:12:07 javispedro: I agree. Dec 07 22:12:12 good night Dec 07 22:12:22 developing for meego, at this point, means you do not get to make the big post on tmo Dec 07 22:12:25 alterego: waiting for it to get into a usable state Dec 07 22:12:27 bb Dec 07 22:12:57 * ShadowJK fixed external gps bugging with Ovi Maps, and submitted patch, which was rejected, and from looking at source code, same issue exists in MeeGo :D Dec 07 22:13:09 Hi guys, I'm thinking about getting a nokia N900 for Xmas, anyone can tell me why I souldn't ? (if that's off topic, tell me, but I don't know where else to look for that kind of info) Dec 07 22:13:10 what source code? O.o Dec 07 22:13:17 ShadowJK^^ Dec 07 22:13:24 galerien, what's your experience with linux? Dec 07 22:13:52 Using it for 3 years now, only ubuntu but I can write awk and shell quite ok Dec 07 22:13:54 are we discussing the same thing in both channels? Dec 07 22:14:09 alterego, javispedro crashanddie http://i55.tinypic.com/wkr7si.jpg Dec 07 22:14:22 MohammadAG: one window made, 7 to go! Dec 07 22:14:40 still doesn't look pixel perfect Dec 07 22:14:47 2 actually :P Dec 07 22:14:50 The new 5.0 is quite handy, working well with Nokia PC Suite... the downside is the lack of apps but alot of people are working on more all the time Dec 07 22:14:53 javispedro, gypsy is open source Dec 07 22:15:02 MohammadAG: nice :) Dec 07 22:15:15 http://i51.tinypic.com/f2t155.jpg javispedro Dec 07 22:15:15 Isn't the writing a bit far down? Dec 07 22:15:20 ShadowJK: ah, thought it was ovi bug Dec 07 22:15:21 Move it up 10 pixels Dec 07 22:15:22 Carneque, It's just that my HTC desire got stolen and I've been a nokia costumer for years (my company payed for the HTC) and I wanted to go back to the source ! Dec 07 22:15:26 I can't seem to get any good pictures out of the phone Dec 07 22:15:35 javispedro, patches welcome (see what I did there? :P) Dec 07 22:15:44 MohammadAG: move the text up 10 pixels :P Dec 07 22:16:01 MohammadAG: the sane thing Dec 07 22:16:02 javispedro, nah, it also caused Sygic Maps to run at 1fps and consume 100% CPU Dec 07 22:16:14 And I don't want an N8 because Sysbian is too far behind and it's not going to be supported long, as it's the last one... Dec 07 22:16:15 But I haven't tried pictures with the 5.0 update, some improved ISO bug fixes and such Dec 07 22:16:39 galerien: so you came here expecting Nokia support? Dec 07 22:16:51 javispedro, no, just explaining myself Dec 07 22:17:06 galerien: the N900 is already EOLd by Nokia Dec 07 22:17:11 * javispedro smiles Dec 07 22:17:19 EOLd ? Dec 07 22:17:26 No longer supported. Dec 07 22:17:34 end of life d Dec 07 22:17:36 galerien, I think it's a unique phone that lets you play with linux more so go for it Dec 07 22:17:38 End of Life'd Dec 07 22:17:52 EoLd looks geekier Dec 07 22:18:21 maemo 5 can still have a life Dec 07 22:18:39 alterego, http://i54.tinypic.com/k54gae.jpg Dec 07 22:18:48 I have a question, when I am connected to the gprs network, it gives me an ip adress of 10.106.137.205 Is there a way to connect via SSH to that IP? Dec 07 22:19:06 Carneque, ok, so, the only downside is that there isn't much application... ? And is maemo community still active (upgrade and stuff) or are you guys the last resistants ^^ Dec 07 22:19:14 Carneque: depends on your carrier Dec 07 22:19:20 MohammadAG: another 10 :P Dec 07 22:19:23 KPN in holland Dec 07 22:19:39 Mohactually no. Dec 07 22:19:40 I am also interested in some kind of minute tracking app Dec 07 22:19:44 alterego: check your n900 Dec 07 22:19:46 MohammadAG: actually no, that is dead on Dec 07 22:19:47 alterego: that. Dec 07 22:19:51 Carneque: no Dec 07 22:19:55 Carneque: it's behind a nat Dec 07 22:20:12 443 uses in this channel... Dec 07 22:20:24 hum Dec 07 22:20:43 we are decaying vs #meego user count since? Dec 07 22:20:47 ;) Dec 07 22:21:41 alterego, sure about that? Dec 07 22:22:08 Has anyone had any success writing apps using APIs of different carriers? Dec 07 22:22:39 MohammadAG: yes, it looks weird in the stock ui too :P Dec 07 22:22:54 I'm measuring to the curve of the headphone lead Dec 07 22:23:01 You can't be anymore than a pixel off Dec 07 22:24:09 alterego, 10 pixels is a lot Dec 07 22:24:33 MohammadAG: don't move it from the last screenshot. Dec 07 22:24:39 The last one you posted was dead on .. Dec 07 22:24:50 Ignore me telling you to push it up another 10 :P Dec 07 22:24:57 alterego, feel free to measure again on device, http://mohammadag.xceleo.org/mediaplayer Dec 07 22:25:04 got it :) Dec 07 22:25:51 MohammadAG, could you point me towards the file I need to get my fm transmitter boosted? Dec 07 22:26:08 jacekowski.org Dec 07 22:26:28 for the modified / illegal FMTXD Dec 07 22:26:51 what does that one dp? Dec 07 22:26:53 do? Dec 07 22:26:57 http://mohammadag.xceleo.org/public/maemo/PR1.3/fmtx-si4713.ko for the stock module w/o power lock http://mohammadag.xceleo.org/public/maemo/PR1.3/fmtx-si4713.ko Dec 07 22:26:58 I just want 118 Dec 07 22:27:04 it locks to 120 Dec 07 22:27:09 oh :) Dec 07 22:27:16 the one from jace? Dec 07 22:27:45 erm Dec 07 22:27:45 yep Dec 07 22:28:46 alterego, try the binary, clicking the button makes it look ugly :/ Dec 07 22:28:47 mine locks to 120 power Dec 07 22:29:01 and modifies frequency range Dec 07 22:29:15 and will work with headphones and usb cable plugged in Dec 07 22:29:57 :) Dec 07 22:30:09 so what do I do with it? Dec 07 22:30:11 mine goes up to 11 Dec 07 22:30:14 it's a binary it seems Dec 07 22:30:20 /usr/sbin/fmtxd Dec 07 22:30:28 you should be able to figure out what to do :P Dec 07 22:30:34 :D Dec 07 22:30:34 don't forget to chmod +x, it gets messy Dec 07 22:31:34 yes, it's closed source from Nokia Dec 07 22:31:49 modifying it is illegal... oh well :P Dec 07 22:32:08 heheh Dec 07 22:32:15 ftw! Dec 07 22:32:34 no it's not Dec 07 22:32:48 it's very legal Dec 07 22:32:58 as long as i don't share with anybody Dec 07 22:33:48 Thanks guys for the answers, have a good one! Nite! Dec 07 22:34:31 jacekowski, lol Dec 07 22:35:04 * MohammadAG wishes he could mod rtcom-call-ui.launch to remove proximity blanking Dec 07 22:37:19 it's not in rtcom-call-ui.launch Dec 07 22:37:24 it's in rtcom-call-ui Dec 07 22:43:18 MohammadAG: you replaced icons in the mediaplayer? Dec 07 22:57:42 jacekowski: sure? I said same, then changed my mind Dec 07 22:58:11 yes Dec 07 22:58:16 .launch is a symlink Dec 07 22:58:27 but now you confused me Dec 07 22:58:30 maybe it's other way Dec 07 22:58:45 .launch is app and without .launch is a launcher Dec 07 22:59:23 IroN900:~# ll `which osso-addressbook` Dec 07 22:59:25 lrwxrwxrwx 1 root root 13 2010-06-23 05:10 /usr/bin/osso-addressbook -> maemo-invoker Dec 07 23:10:42 jacekowski: http://mg.pov.lt/maemo-irclog/%23maemo.2010-12-06.log.html#t2010-12-06T13:54:00 Dec 07 23:13:17 MohammadAG: why you want to disable that sensor? Dec 07 23:14:03 MohammadAG: because there may be simple way of doing that with LD_PRELOAD and hooking into fopen/open Dec 07 23:14:15 it wastes too much swap Dec 07 23:14:27 proximity sensor wastes swap? Dec 07 23:14:36 how Dec 07 23:14:36 what Dec 07 23:14:55 ???? Dec 07 23:14:55 yes, it calls mce to lock the screen, and apparently, that's usually swapped during a call Dec 07 23:15:18 actually, killing all of mce integration with the phone app would be nice, other than the vibra Dec 07 23:15:32 so how would you lock screen then? Dec 07 23:15:42 I don't want to lock it Dec 07 23:15:48 haha, the proximity sensor is dealt with in mce anyway Dec 07 23:16:11 can anybody check how big is mce? Dec 07 23:16:12 in memory Dec 07 23:17:51 jacekowski, you don't need to compare values Dec 07 23:18:03 # Note: the name should not include the "lib"-prefix Dec 07 23:18:04 Modules=display;keypad;vibrator;led;battery;filter-brightness-als;inactivity;alarm;accelerometer;callstate;camera;homekey;audiorouting Dec 07 23:18:13 from mce.ini Dec 07 23:18:26 I suggest you play a bit with this line Dec 07 23:18:29 lock the screen, time how much it takes form when the lock switch is pressed till the screen is locked Dec 07 23:18:29 do the same during a call Dec 07 23:18:31 i just need to know it's memory footprint Dec 07 23:18:43 because it may be mlocked if it's not too big Dec 07 23:19:07 jacekowski: tell me where to find a decent ps on this shit Dec 07 23:19:17 then I tell you about footprint Dec 07 23:19:57 top Dec 07 23:20:01 fsck Dec 07 23:20:21 top is useless as well Dec 07 23:20:56 maybe htop Dec 07 23:21:03 but it really pisses me off Dec 07 23:21:47 tell me which *-gnu pkg to install to get decent ps Dec 07 23:22:26 bash Dec 07 23:22:30 and coreutil Dec 07 23:22:31 s Dec 07 23:24:54 yeah, BB's ps and top are slightly upsetting Dec 07 23:25:27 jacekowski: you missed the bit where you have to work out where the heck coreutils got installed to and fix your $PATH Dec 07 23:31:32 So just finished my Qml xbox media remote app, upload it to -devel tomorrow. Dec 07 23:31:35 huh? Dec 07 23:31:43 Now I have to think of something else small todo Dec 07 23:32:18 I got nash and coreutils and proper path Dec 07 23:32:24 but no ps Dec 07 23:32:49 neither gps or whatelse Dec 07 23:33:30 g'night folks Dec 07 23:34:38 s/nash/bash Dec 07 23:38:08 lrwxrwxrwx 1 root root 26 2010-07-26 22:57 ptx -> /opt/maemo/usr/bin/gnu/ptx Dec 07 23:38:09 lrwxrwxrwx 1 root root 26 2010-07-26 22:57 pwd -> /opt/maemo/usr/bin/gnu/pwd Dec 07 23:38:27 err Dec 07 23:38:31 lrwxrwxrwx 1 root root 29 2010-07-26 22:57 printf -> /opt/maemo/usr/bin/gnu/printf Dec 07 23:38:33 lrwxrwxrwx 1 root root 26 2010-07-26 22:57 ptx -> /opt/maemo/usr/bin/gnu/ptx Dec 07 23:38:51 no ps Dec 07 23:39:01 sad Dec 07 23:39:47 but well Dec 07 23:39:54 all ps does is parse couple files in /proc/pid/ Dec 07 23:40:00 like stat Dec 07 23:40:03 and couple others Dec 07 23:40:16 but i'm going to sleep now Dec 07 23:40:18 good night Dec 07 23:40:23 IroN900:~# help Dec 07 23:40:24 bash: help: command not found Dec 07 23:40:26 IroN900:~# ps --help Dec 07 23:40:27 BusyBox v1.10.2 (Debian 3:1.10.2.legal-1osso30+0m5) multi-call binary Dec 07 23:40:29 meh Dec 07 23:40:58 IroN900:~# which pwd Dec 07 23:40:59 /usr/bin/gnu/pwd Dec 07 23:42:01 >:-( Dec 07 23:42:29 ~bacon DocScrutinizer Dec 07 23:42:30 * infobot goes Footloose on DocScrutinizer, even though its illegal Dec 07 23:43:17 IroN900:~# apt-cache search ps|wc -l Dec 07 23:43:18 547 Dec 07 23:48:44 anyway, jacekowski Dec 07 23:48:47 25364 root 701 15 -5 5476 2156 1848 S 0.0 0.9 13:38.56 /sbin/mce --force-syslog Dec 07 23:49:31 and I don't think mlocking it is a good idea. Basically there's too much mlocked shit already Dec 07 23:51:39 I also doubt the sense in disabling proximity blanking all together, just because it's allegedly too slow Dec 07 23:56:15 who's maintainer of bash3? Dec 07 23:56:55 could the one pretty please revert the config option that broke bash's builtin help?! Dec 07 23:57:32 I'm not interested in bash trying to compete with messybox :-( Dec 08 00:12:16 does onyone have a good idea what else i can do after an dist-upgrade and now the nokia flshing tool will not detect/discover the n900? btw dmesg shows me only connect and disconnects on the usb port but nothing with the 'name' n900. Dec 08 00:13:15 i tryed the meegoo rescue for 2 times but now it doesn't work too. the last time the backlight goes off and thats all. :( Dec 08 00:13:28 Oh well - it was nice when it lasted. http://www.gnu.org/licenses/gpl-2.0.html Dec 08 00:20:42 site down? Dec 08 00:21:55 yes Dec 08 00:22:24 Ah - back now. Dec 08 00:32:32 k, got it: apt-get install procps Dec 08 00:34:04 roadi: recharge batery. I know you'll have a hard time doing so Dec 08 00:34:52 roadi: dist-upgrade is *known* to wreck your system Dec 08 00:36:30 roadi: no use in trying rescue initrd. You'll have to reflash Dec 08 00:36:58 roadi: flashing needs a charged battery to work Dec 08 00:37:51 roadi: and with current state of your N900 you'll need to find another way to charge battery Dec 08 00:39:48 other way := use external charger | use compatible phone (e.g. 5800) | get a spare battery which usually comes semi-decently precharged Dec 08 00:45:36 woah, with a broken OS there's no way to force the phone to charge? Dec 08 00:47:26 there is Dec 08 00:47:28 BCMM: you're kidding me? Dec 08 00:47:41 ieatlint: ?? Dec 08 00:48:23 DocScrutinizer: as you just stated, you can charge the phone with a wall charger Dec 08 00:48:33 or essentially any charger that shorts the data pins... Dec 08 00:48:43 ieatlint: in fact it will always start to charge, just it has a Vmax of 3.6V or sth Dec 08 00:49:09 which is way too low to do a proper flashing Dec 08 00:49:14 can it even charge while "off" at 100mah? Dec 08 00:49:45 it can even charge @500 while really totally off Dec 08 00:50:07 well, at 500 i know it can, i've done it Dec 08 00:50:12 datapin-short detection is done in hardware Dec 08 00:50:28 yeah, i meant connected to a usb host Dec 08 00:50:51 yes it should charge @100 then iirc Dec 08 00:51:31 Ew Chrome OS Dec 08 00:52:11 heh, yeah, chrome os is getting infinitely more press than meego though Dec 08 00:53:41 doesn't use rpm at least :P Dec 08 00:55:42 Google gets more press than Jesus. Dec 08 00:56:11 DocScrutinizer: i'd kinda assumed that the battery chip could handle charging if the OS failed... Dec 08 00:57:42 it does, see above Dec 08 00:58:40 GAN900: well, jesus isn't exactly the latest news nowadays Dec 08 00:59:33 Well they've led Assange up to his golgotha. Dec 08 00:59:58 GAN900: well, i can prove google exists **** ENDING LOGGING AT Wed Dec 08 02:59:57 2010