**** BEGIN LOGGING AT Wed May 18 02:59:57 2011 May 18 04:21:25 anyone here use queen beecon? May 18 04:29:59 sure May 18 04:38:26 DocScrutinizer hey, just trying to understand basics... so I need to add a new widget of queen beecon for each commend I want to run correct? May 18 04:38:30 command* May 18 04:38:45 yes May 18 04:39:33 ok, I'm trying to setup a command to turn my cellphone radio on and off at specific times of the day, not sure if it can be done... May 18 04:39:59 I know I can set a command to recur daily... but I would have to start it at the exact time I want it to occur... is that the only way? May 18 04:40:37 err, aiui QB is for executing cmds on pushbutton triger, not at a specific time of day. You'd probably want to use package alarmed for that May 18 04:40:58 ah ok May 18 04:41:10 thanks May 18 05:06:16 got that scud battery for my n900 shit is f'n amazing May 18 05:06:32 even though it came from china had a very nice box n all May 18 05:06:49 getting really good battery life, no overheating on it very happy May 18 05:23:24 * cehteh needs a new battery too May 18 05:24:04 chem|st: do you want to order some? May 18 05:25:48 well i have my bike dynamo charger now .. seems to work fantastic :) May 18 05:29:24 is 3.5G what is marketed as 4G? May 18 05:31:41 are you talking about wireless or hdd? May 18 05:32:43 wireless May 18 05:32:53 maemo says 3.5G May 18 05:33:12 is that "4G" ? May 18 05:34:29 maemo terminology: gpsr-2g, egde-2.5g, umts-3g, hsdpa-3.5g May 18 05:34:46 *gprs May 18 05:34:50 heh May 18 05:35:00 so... yes? May 18 05:35:34 i dunno what your marketers mark as 4g May 18 05:36:02 hspda May 18 05:36:19 hsdpa May 18 05:36:22 well... actually.. hspa+ May 18 05:37:02 according to wikipedia, 4g is some other thing May 18 05:40:01 who cares how it is called... May 18 05:40:56 Macer, 3.5G is 3.5G May 18 05:41:09 4G is LTE afaik May 18 05:44:39 what's WiMax? May 18 05:45:04 ds3: highspeed wireless standard May 18 05:45:21 in the language of 'G's May 18 05:45:33 3.9G? May 18 06:00:13 ds3, I thought that was 4G May 18 06:05:47 MohammadAG: it is all merky. some places say the LTE the successor to WiMax so that would seem to make it 3.9G May 18 06:06:32 LTE is 4G May 18 06:06:33 has been May 18 06:06:38 WiMax has been around for a while May 18 06:06:52 it's like wifi on 'roids or something along those lines May 18 06:16:11 just forget about these stupid G's and call out exactly what it is May 18 06:16:16 would be so much easier May 18 06:16:39 MohammadAG: tmob doesnt use lte May 18 06:16:55 they use hpda+ i thought May 18 06:17:02 hdpa May 18 06:17:16 heh. i get the letters jumbled May 18 06:18:16 i believe whoever makes the standards allowed them to market what they use as 4G if the tech has the potential to reach the standard's speeds May 18 06:19:16 which is why i asked if 3.5G in maemo is what is being marketed as 4G by tmob May 18 06:19:29 even tho android phones say H May 18 06:19:39 not 4G May 18 06:31:11 GaaaaaH! May 18 06:31:28 my thoughts exactly! May 18 06:31:29 * mece want N9/50 frakking NOW!! May 18 06:32:15 mece: does it exist? May 18 06:33:18 all I can find is a silly teaser May 18 06:33:26 doc|home, well something exists. If it doesn't, then I want the fictional N9/50 frakking NOW! May 18 06:35:21 I hope it's real, just so I can buy a decent phone before they fuck it all up with windows May 18 06:35:29 pardon my french May 18 06:35:32 night May 18 06:35:48 doc|home, o/ May 18 07:18:16 khertan, ping May 18 07:51:01 Morning, all May 18 07:51:54 morning Jaffa May 18 08:19:15 cehteh: batteries? May 18 08:20:04 I am not close to you anymore but Treibholz is still May 18 08:52:16 wtf.. WSEGL_UseHWSync=1 does nothing, right? May 18 08:53:39 it syncs frames so they all take the same time May 18 08:53:53 without blurs, it makes the framerate epic, and the device may crash May 18 08:58:44 Moo. May 18 09:02:50 ...When the substance is heated or disturbed enough it will burst and print an area about 3m from the center of the blast with random latin characters, with no coherent paragraph, sentence or word patterns. May 18 09:11:20 RST38h: skilled observer may also notice small flames bursting here and there inbetween the characters. May 18 09:14:51 jani, they would also notice two spaces between two words :p May 18 09:19:54 lol May 18 09:42:41 MohammadAG, oh. so it actually does something. That's nice. This was one of the things that worked on some devices, and not on others iirc.. May 18 09:53:00 MohammadAG, hmm.. seems everything is a lot slower now with WSEGL_UseHWSync=1 May 18 10:18:31 mece, then you have blur enabled May 18 10:22:01 MohammadAG, how do I disable it? May 18 10:22:25 I thought the symbian/meego choice in that thing that time disables blur May 18 10:27:06 hmm I wonder if the N9 will actually get a usable handset UX... May 18 10:27:54 ruskie: I think it'll be better than the one Nokia contributed to meego.com; but suspect it'll feel different (simpler?) to N900 :-/ May 18 10:29:05 Jaffa, well I'll have to play with it... May 18 10:29:21 I might get it... but I think I'll still prefer the N900 over it May 18 10:29:33 if I do get it it'll be via contract... May 18 10:30:54 and of course it depends on what I can do with it to see if it's actually a viable N900 replacement May 18 10:32:32 Yup May 18 10:33:13 And I still use my N810 with Navicore as a GPS (car mount + offline maps/search/nav) May 18 10:33:18 do we know yet if its capacitive or resistive? May 18 10:33:35 most likely useless cap May 18 10:33:55 developer device != cap those idiots May 18 10:34:12 why do I need cap if there is a hardware keyboard May 18 10:34:46 all the good painting and sketching apps for nothing then... May 18 10:34:49 all the cap devices I tried so far by friends/coworkers that have them that say ow great it works so great etc... *shudder* couldn't have been more useless May 18 10:35:01 +1 May 18 10:35:23 N8 is OK with cap, but it took a while to get used to not using finger nails. Cap on iPad is very good, possibly because larger screen means less precision needed May 18 10:35:27 from the ipod touch various droids... even a symbian device(I'm assuming it is cap) May 18 10:35:42 a friend suffers from taking off gloves by -40°C anytime he uses the phone May 18 10:35:59 hahaha May 18 10:36:03 lol May 18 10:36:15 I actually managed to use the N900 with leather gloves on May 18 10:36:16 that's gotta suck May 18 10:36:41 cap is only on one case logical, and that is for an outdoor mobile to have it highly scratch resistant May 18 10:36:42 those tend to not be the best for precission usually since they have some extra material sewed in and around May 18 10:36:56 I used N900 with gloves on this winter a lot. May 18 10:37:14 and of course the ability to use a stylus... +++++++++++++ May 18 10:37:36 even though I hardly use it May 18 10:37:55 there are styluses but why do I have a proper 3 in one stylus... May 18 10:37:57 I also still wonder how people manage to lose their styli? May 18 10:38:25 ruskie: that and how to navigate on websites without... May 18 10:38:52 well a fingernail can do it amazingly well May 18 10:39:03 the UI is fingerfriendly but the time it gets into editorial work on pdfs and websites I need the stylus May 18 10:39:04 a finger... if it's the only link under the finger... it'll work May 18 10:39:16 else you'll get a random link from the area May 18 10:40:06 ruskie: My N900 stylus is beginning to get quite loose. May switch to my other one. May 18 10:40:24 i lost my stylus :( May 18 10:40:41 how May 18 10:40:47 how do people manage to lose them May 18 10:41:07 someone used it and didnt put it back May 18 10:41:18 i picked up the phone from the table and left :) May 18 10:41:40 trx: that "someone" never gonna happen May 18 10:41:57 I haven't lost the stylus on the palm m105, nds xl, n900 May 18 10:42:57 and now of course.. try and buy a n900 stylus in serbia ;) May 18 10:43:27 and I have only light scratches on the screen only visible in the right angle of light and there only if looked at from the side... but I do not put gum-foil in my pocket with it nor keys nor do I put it in a bag with other stuff... May 18 10:44:07 trx, hehe might be able to get it in slovenia May 18 10:44:27 chem|st, ahh I have a privacy screen protector on mine May 18 10:44:45 it's like 2-3mm thick... just enough to fill up the bevel around the screen May 18 10:45:00 limits the viewing angle to directly in front of my eyes May 18 10:45:02 ruskie well, i can probably buy it in Belgrade (the main city) but its 180KM away.. May 18 10:45:04 no screen protectors no bag no nothing May 18 10:45:08 so must say no scratches at all May 18 10:45:14 and i dont know where so.. :) May 18 10:45:26 thats barely one mm but ok May 18 10:45:27 trx, yeah I know Belgrade is the capital of serbia ;) May 18 10:45:43 chem|st, the bevel? May 18 10:45:45 well May 18 10:45:50 it just looks thick no matter how I look at it May 18 10:45:54 trx: no webshops? May 18 10:46:19 chem|st there are, but no luck.. May 18 10:46:27 trx, remember used to be the capital of yugoslavia ;) and slovenia was part of that May 18 10:46:41 you are from slovenia? May 18 10:46:42 just order it from somewhere in europe, they surely ship to you May 18 10:46:55 [12:41:09] trx, hehe might be able to get it in slovenia May 18 10:47:16 so, you get it in slovenia, and send it to me :D May 18 10:47:36 it would probably get lost in the mail May 18 10:47:55 yeah :/ May 18 10:48:55 chem|st, as for europe shipping... good joke... unless you're part of the first 12 eu countries there is no guarntee you'll even get a shipping to... and if that it could cost quite a lot May 18 10:49:19 yeah May 18 10:49:28 apparently slovenia is a risk for shipping to... so they charge higher... even though we're in the EU May 18 10:49:31 and paying is a problem too May 18 10:49:38 we dont have paypal here May 18 10:49:51 moneybookers gives you a mastercard for 10 eurs May 18 10:49:52 and i dont like to give out my credit card number.. May 18 10:49:58 prepay mastercard May 18 10:50:01 so you load it up May 18 10:50:04 and use it May 18 10:50:09 didnt know about that May 18 10:50:12 that's what I use May 18 10:50:27 ill ask arround about that, thanks May 18 10:50:33 www.moneybookers.com May 18 10:50:44 or ask any of the banks if they offer prepay master or visa cards May 18 10:52:40 yeah, ill try that hopefully they have it May 18 10:53:10 I just went with moneybookers myself since they offer online payments as well(similar to paypal) May 18 10:53:42 and because none of the banks here really offer anything like that May 18 10:54:00 I prefer to use money I have... not money I have to pay back next month that I used previous month May 18 10:55:12 my bank does have a special master card that is just for online payments May 18 10:55:41 and i have it, but dont like to give out the number to everyone.. May 18 10:56:17 yeah it sucks if you have a pay after use card May 18 10:56:26 I'll try to get hildon on the N9 May 18 10:56:32 Cordia's kind of stalled atm May 18 10:56:54 or a Qt rewrite of it May 18 10:57:12 Qt rewrite of hildon? May 18 10:57:52 would be nice to have on tbh :p May 18 10:58:35 http://www.reghardware.com/2011/05/18/e_ink_epson_retina_display/ <-- hmm May 18 10:59:39 bah...they should call 'retina displays' something that actually puts an image directly to your eye May 18 11:00:00 hehe May 18 11:00:05 yeap, would be nice to have electronic lenses :) May 18 11:00:07 and I've been waiting for ages and still no consumer product that does that May 18 11:00:17 (actually usable) May 18 11:00:20 I'd be happy with a HUD in the glasses May 18 11:00:35 it's silly, we haul around big monitors and have projectors and whatever and all we should need is some tiny thingy in the eye May 18 11:00:38 (or brain even) May 18 11:00:38 and a camera to superimpose data around May 18 11:00:38 :p May 18 11:00:46 these are still too big and cost too much :) May 18 11:00:58 I don't want a direct brain interface May 18 11:01:15 I have enough problems getting coherent thought out May 18 11:01:20 I thought the US army had such a retinal projection thing in the helmets of eurofighter pilots May 18 11:01:25 I'd probably crash everything around me with one of those... May 18 11:01:32 or was it eurofighter...anyway the high-tech fighter May 18 11:01:34 i would like to be able to write software for the brain :) May 18 11:01:49 and put a small wifi antenna on my head :) May 18 11:01:58 joga, probably a normal HUD projected on a display in front of the eye May 18 11:02:00 and unless I'm mistaken, this fighter headset thing was *in the 90s* May 18 11:02:07 stuff that is available May 18 11:02:10 just still costs May 18 11:02:21 costs like hell May 18 11:02:25 ruskie, the pilots allegedly said that they wanted a virtual representation of the cockpit because they could see through the plane May 18 11:02:25 trx, mmm virii in the brain... May 18 11:02:43 trx, not that much May 18 11:02:50 iirc 1000 usd or somewhere in that area May 18 11:02:52 still a lot May 18 11:02:54 i mean quality ones May 18 11:02:55 but not like hell ;) May 18 11:03:11 I'm looking for usable first May 18 11:03:19 if it isn't usable quality is pointless May 18 11:03:37 i actually found some for arround 400 usd May 18 11:03:45 but their quality was poor May 18 11:04:01 ignorant idiots on TMO again... May 18 11:04:08 chem|st, what else is new? May 18 11:04:28 chem|st, btw what are you refering to? really hates trying to figure out what the refernecs are to May 18 11:05:05 ruskie: Possibly the N9 teaser thread May 18 11:05:51 some guys writing that 300% speed howto, "we don't need no disclaimer... anyone on TMO should know that devel stuff can harm... I don't care" May 18 11:05:58 hahaha May 18 11:06:02 lol May 18 11:06:11 Jaffa: lol no May 18 11:06:52 Jaffa: there I just gave infractions to some dude double posting cursing on nokia (did't cause of nokia but the language used) May 18 11:08:08 chem|st: Cool May 18 11:08:21 chem|st: Not that my vote counts anymore :-) May 18 11:08:31 ? May 18 11:09:54 I wish nokia would actually diversify in more mobile OSes... May 18 11:11:39 ruskie: *More*? Because Symbian, Maemo/MeeGo & WP7 isn't enough?! May 18 11:12:55 Jaffa, yes more... May 18 11:13:17 or actually actually make more maemo/meego devices May 18 11:13:27 and they should have had this 5 years ago May 18 11:22:55 love the english in that 300% thread as well May 18 11:24:29 o/ May 18 11:24:45 overcloak... I wonder what that is... May 18 11:24:51 sounds an interesting thing to wear May 18 11:26:06 Overcloaking is wearing too many cloaks. May 18 11:26:16 This can make you too hot, and cause reliability issues. May 18 11:27:02 It can also cause electromicturation, when the police taze you, thinking you have a bomb. May 18 11:38:10 heh :-D May 18 11:38:21 Doc: Check out the comments: : May 18 11:38:26 https://meego.com/community/blogs/imad/2011/update-intel May 18 11:38:56 SSL handshake failed: A TLS fatal alert has been received. <-- hahahaha May 18 11:39:16 "One of the most important supplies that you must have is the bee suit. You need to wear this every time you will go near the bees because miu miu sale this will serve as your protection against their stings." <=== yesssss May 18 11:39:40 "It is really exiting that we will have a truly linux device in our hands." <=== oh yeaaaah May 18 11:39:56 you mean that N900 was not a truly linux device? May 18 11:40:31 It was not really exiting. May 18 11:40:39 N950 will be really exiting linux device though May 18 11:44:22 if it is the same hardware which was planned to be released last autumn it may not be all that exciting May 18 11:45:02 * SpeedEvil wonders about greasemonkey scripts to remove facebook 'like' thumbs. May 18 11:45:06 as long as it doesn't run x86 it'll be fun May 18 11:46:15 I don't care about x86. May 18 11:46:33 If intel manage to get power usage down to something reasonable. May 18 11:46:36 Then fine. May 18 11:47:05 More competition in the low-power space is great. May 18 11:47:19 T-gates are an interesting possible gain. May 18 11:49:28 so why did the Haramattan talk get cancelled? May 18 11:49:41 not talk, the thing on the Sat or Sun that Dave emailed about May 18 11:57:19 I wonder if kerio clicked his heels to transform like that May 18 11:58:18 long story May 18 11:58:28 np :) May 18 12:07:00 N950 will be really exiting linux device though // that's what they said about n900 as well May 18 12:07:39 n950 is much thicker than n900 May 18 12:08:07 it's not cool, as Boris said, weight is realability May 18 12:08:18 if you can't shoot you can always hit with it May 18 12:08:21 hi guys ... May 18 12:08:38 anyone here ? May 18 12:09:02 nope May 18 12:09:06 hehe :D May 18 12:09:08 everyone is out buying n950 May 18 12:09:39 ... there is no such a thing ? :P May 18 12:10:38 heh May 18 12:10:45 ... there is no such a thing ? :P? May 18 12:11:05 anyway May 18 12:11:12 i need some help about my N900. May 18 12:11:18 they told me to connect here and ppl will help me out May 18 12:13:12 well you actually need to describe your problem first May 18 12:13:16 else nobody will be able to help you at all May 18 12:13:53 oh May 18 12:14:05 wel. i saw ppl on utube installing Android on N900. May 18 12:14:14 yeah but don't do that May 18 12:14:21 may i know why >? May 18 12:14:28 it's extremely slow and useless May 18 12:14:35 uh... May 18 12:14:37 Wedo: hi May 18 12:14:38 you can't make calls or send SMS the last time I tested it May 18 12:14:50 you can do it, and show it off to your friends that your phone runs Android May 18 12:14:54 but it's not for the end user May 18 12:15:01 Sc0rpius: sms should work but still no sound for calls May 18 12:15:08 well, still pretty useless then May 18 12:15:12 +1 May 18 12:15:27 Wedo: stay away from anything but maemo for now May 18 12:15:33 and since rebooting the N900 is a HEAVY battery drain, you can't go around rebooting the phone from Android to Maemo and viceversa all the time May 18 12:15:47 oh.. May 18 12:15:55 so i should stay onMaemo 5 ? May 18 12:16:14 i dont know how to talk privatly chemIst lol :S May 18 12:16:36 What about the Nitdroid thingy ? May 18 12:16:37 /msg nick whatever May 18 12:16:44 I tested two versions of nitdroid and was impressed of the work the guys did, hours after the public release by google but got rid of it in seconds... May 18 12:16:44 oh oky ty May 18 12:16:50 and there is no I there it's | ;) May 18 12:16:57 Wedo: no need for private talks May 18 12:17:14 sorry 1 question. Nitdroid is good or bad ? May 18 12:17:17 fonts need to be more readable... May 18 12:17:22 ruskie: ever used nick-completion? May 18 12:17:48 my font just shows fine but 1l May 18 12:18:16 NITdroid is good or bad guys ? May 18 12:18:21 for me 1 one and l "lowercase-L" are just the same May 18 12:18:23 chem|st, always ;) wrong person ;) May 18 12:18:32 chem|st, then you have a crappy font ;) May 18 12:18:35 mine is just fine May 18 12:18:41 Wedo: bad in terms of usability and where it comes from May 18 12:18:44 iI|1l all look different May 18 12:18:59 So i should put ito n my N900 or .. ? May 18 12:19:06 the first three look different indeed May 18 12:19:11 I just wana my mobile to look cooler and be faster and stuff May 18 12:19:17 to me it's very bad May 18 12:19:18 Wedo: ..or not May 18 12:19:27 I installed it one, and use it like twice for 2 minutes each May 18 12:19:31 Wedo: faster? then not May 18 12:19:38 once May 18 12:19:40 so android and Nitdroid r totally useless for me .. May 18 12:19:42 is not bad is just a unfinish work May 18 12:19:47 oh May 18 12:19:49 faster? hehehe May 18 12:19:54 Wedo: you need learn decide for you own May 18 12:20:00 you check the all aspect of something May 18 12:20:01 Nitdroid is so slow it's unbearable May 18 12:20:03 and decise May 18 12:20:04 Im just new. i bought it like a month ago May 18 12:20:12 thats why i dunno anything :S May 18 12:20:20 the research May 18 12:20:27 google is you friends May 18 12:20:31 and the power search at maemo May 18 12:20:40 oky mr. May 18 12:21:03 Wedo: as you got your device now for 2 month and are quiet new to linux environment as well I suggest to stay on maemo maybe activate testing repository but NO devel and have a look around what suits you May 18 12:21:27 Wedo: I get performance issues with wifi+IM at the moment especially skype... May 18 12:21:38 skype is huge May 18 12:21:58 hm.. May 18 12:22:08 well skype will just get worse now that M$ owns it May 18 12:22:14 i will stop using skype , well i only have 3 ppl anyway May 18 12:22:21 I never used skype at all May 18 12:22:46 my msn account is deleted... my yahoo account is deleted... May 18 12:23:03 as long as people don't use clients capable to do jabber VoIP+video... May 18 12:23:05 it's nice that they finally added a permanent delete option in those May 18 12:23:05 i saw in the forum the subject about smartflex is getting hot again May 18 12:23:18 some ppl say work great some ppl say is bad May 18 12:23:19 etc May 18 12:23:22 chem|st, assuming you need those ;) May 18 12:23:22 ~smartflex May 18 12:23:53 ruskie: one is my girl^^ May 18 12:23:53 chem|st: http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?s=b7d7d79fd1a156d1becee900bf88b527&t=73040&page=6 May 18 12:24:35 the tech world will awesome if everybody follow standards May 18 12:27:04 E0x: OC crap?! May 18 12:27:37 ~smartreflex May 18 12:27:51 chem|st: power manage of arm May 18 12:28:12 http://focus.ti.com/general/docs/wtbu/wtbugencontent.tsp?templateId=6123&navigationId=12032&contentId=4609 May 18 12:28:33 Wedo: still clueless? May 18 12:28:40 wel. May 18 12:28:43 i got the idea now May 18 12:28:45 but im confused May 18 12:28:54 the Nitdroid will amke my mob lox awesome and stuff. May 18 12:28:57 may we enlighten you? May 18 12:28:58 but i wont be able to call or sms May 18 12:29:07 but the Maemo May 18 12:29:10 will make it look kinda bad May 18 12:29:14 ? May 18 12:29:15 but it`ll be perfect in use May 18 12:29:18 for calls and sms May 18 12:29:42 kinda bad? show me one device that can do things like start a full openoffice suite?! May 18 12:29:45 so thats the problem May 18 12:30:01 hmm nice... my work SIP account almost works well on the N900... just for some reason when someone is calling me it doesn't ring... May 18 12:30:23 why do you think maemo is bad? you "for sure" did not see it's limits yet May 18 12:30:42 maybe :P May 18 12:31:01 maemo actually is great May 18 12:31:02 the hardware remains the same no matter what OS you install May 18 12:31:13 ruskie: i read something about the same at tmo May 18 12:31:34 i guess imma stay with Maemo5 then :D May 18 12:31:36 ( no ring for SIP account ) May 18 12:31:48 and if you like to PWN your friends just turn of their TV once in a while May 18 12:31:57 stay far away from his remote May 18 12:32:00 E0x, in my case it's not no ring... it simply the PBX doesn't connect to send a call incoming signal May 18 12:32:06 E0x, it works fine on the n95 though May 18 12:32:31 oh May 18 12:32:32 I can dial out though May 18 12:32:35 xD ? May 18 12:32:55 Wedo: maybe in the near future the powermanagement of meego improves so it gets more reliable May 18 12:33:00 might need to change some settings somewhere May 18 12:33:10 awesome May 18 12:33:16 thx alot u`ve been a great help guys May 18 12:33:21 and maybe the UX improves to actually be usable May 18 12:34:10 meego is still in massive development and not for normal users, but with maemo you got already all the power in your pocket to make any iProwner or Droid wet his pants May 18 12:34:42 as far as I'm concerned maemo did that already May 18 12:34:56 ruskie: read again! May 18 12:35:02 gah May 18 12:35:18 sorry but our office still doesn't have AC turned on and it's insanely hummid May 18 12:35:24 so my brain isn't working as it should May 18 12:35:25 yes meamo have some little limitations and is not already fixed by community because nokia no release some parts of it May 18 12:35:58 true but MohammadAG et al do an awesome job with the CSSU May 18 12:36:25 chem|st: yes , indeed May 18 12:36:50 but like Doc say CSSU is now more for feature add that bug solving May 18 12:36:56 i am think is missing the point May 18 12:37:12 but CSSU anyway is still a great great job May 18 12:37:25 damn May 18 12:37:30 thought this mail for exchange would work May 18 12:37:37 it keeps hanging at calendar and tasks May 18 12:37:44 yeah you cant fix bugs in closed source parts May 18 12:37:57 that sucks :/ May 18 12:37:57 apart from replacing them completely May 18 12:38:40 Macer: with what? google? no! with µ$-exchange kind of! May 18 12:39:49 huh? May 18 12:39:57 yes May 18 12:40:05 which par, lol May 18 12:40:11 i'm using mail for exchange to sync with google May 18 12:40:12 s/par/part/ May 18 12:40:12 chem|st meant: which part, lol May 18 12:40:15 the calendars are getting stuck May 18 12:40:22 during the first sync May 18 12:40:41 it's just kind of sitting there with no completion bar and a rotating blinking circle May 18 12:40:43 Macer: calendar and contacts never worked for me - contacts only one way google -> n900 May 18 12:40:57 well. that sucks :) May 18 12:41:33 yes but that is not maemo's MfE fault it is the borked implementation of active sync by google May 18 12:41:56 well. some people seemed to have gotten it to work ;) May 18 12:42:16 the contacts are what i really want May 18 12:42:20 email syncs :) May 18 12:42:42 yeah it keeps getting stuck on the first sync of the calendar May 18 12:42:54 "some people seemed to have gotten it to work"? there is nothing to manipulate so how should they be able to achieve this? May 18 12:43:19 who knows May 18 12:43:27 i'm trying with the calendar disabled May 18 12:43:35 to see if i can sync email and contacts May 18 12:43:39 the contacts are what i really want May 18 12:43:47 email would be a plus but i can use imap May 18 12:43:57 the calendar is meh.. i don't think i've ever used it May 18 12:44:39 contacts only one way May 18 12:45:15 well the one way isn't coming this way ;) May 18 12:45:19 haha gmail and imap that's a joke May 18 12:45:20 you said server -> n900 right? May 18 12:45:34 i can't seem to get that to even work May 18 12:45:36 maybe they'll fix it one day May 18 12:45:39 yeah google -> n900 May 18 12:46:05 maybe i am just being impatient May 18 12:46:05 http://www.theregister.co.uk/2011/05/18/apple_sim/ <-- why do we need an even tinier SIM? May 18 12:46:06 it gave an error but I had the "4" contacts on device afterwards May 18 12:46:09 but the calenar seemst o just sit there May 18 12:46:23 as does the contacts May 18 12:46:33 during the first sync.. this sucks. i was excited about this :) May 18 12:47:19 I collect all emails on my own servers imap anyway, was just trying if it is usable and it denied May 18 12:49:38 oh wait. i think i know what the problem might be May 18 12:49:51 it is probably processing all the email since i said to "sync all" May 18 12:49:55 :) that was probably a bad idea May 18 12:53:00 sure was May 18 12:53:18 0 contacts? May 18 12:53:32 nobody likes you ;) May 18 12:54:35 got it May 18 12:54:36 :) May 18 12:54:44 where do you set how often it syncs? May 18 12:55:20 oh nm May 18 12:56:09 chem|st: let me see if i can get it to sync a new contact to the server :) May 18 12:58:23 chem|st: it synced from the n900 to google May 18 12:58:25 email works too May 18 12:59:13 mmh May 18 12:59:19 ok contacts never worked May 18 12:59:44 maybe some of the vcf3 standards the n900 uses arent supported May 18 13:01:46 it is all working ;) May 18 13:01:57 going from server <-> n900 May 18 13:02:02 i am about to test out the calendar stuff May 18 13:12:08 hm. the calendars didn't seem to wrok.. well.. calendar May 18 13:25:49 "A combination of Moore's law and Android will bring down corrupt and authoritarian regimes over the coming years, Eric Schmidt declared at a Google conference on Privacy today." May 18 13:26:36 Drugs and their effects on the corporate public relations, a study. May 18 13:44:25 Hi May 18 13:44:36 i kind of got into a problem May 18 13:44:42 my phone starts with the white LED ligh May 18 13:44:45 with the Nokia logo May 18 13:44:47 but it shuts down again May 18 13:45:05 i installed nitdroid with multi boot , it worked ... but all of a sudden it just shut down May 18 13:45:11 i worked fine even after several boots and stuff May 18 13:47:25 anyone there ? May 18 13:48:27 battery level low ? May 18 13:48:52 uh replaced the battery May 18 13:48:56 i had another one May 18 13:49:00 same problem May 18 13:49:03 so weird May 18 13:50:51 xxdareaperxx, make sure the spare battery is charged up May 18 13:51:02 i'll just plug it to the charger May 18 13:51:07 oh okay May 18 13:53:42 connected to charger May 18 13:53:47 it just shows a dull nokia logo May 18 13:53:50 and it keeps buzzing May 18 13:53:53 no light also May 18 13:54:07 what happens if you press the power button at this point ? May 18 13:54:09 sounds like you might need to try reflashing May 18 13:54:27 ok May 18 13:54:28 fine i'll reflash it May 18 13:59:11 This is what i have to download right ? RX-51_2009SE_20.2010.36-2.003_PR_COMBINED_003_ARM.bin May 18 13:59:17 mines the middle east firmware May 18 13:59:24 i got the windows flasher btw May 18 13:59:27 and installed it May 18 14:04:25 mozilla's "latest-beta" repo doesnt update firefox to 4.0.1 here. doesn anyone have the same problem? May 18 14:05:02 damn May 18 14:05:10 looks like syncing calendars only seems to work one way May 18 14:05:13 i have tried everything May 18 14:05:22 but making an entry from the phone just stalls out mail for exchange :( May 18 14:05:33 it just stays at synchronizing forever May 18 14:07:38 that is so lame :) May 18 14:17:21 Jay me May 18 14:17:33 4900NOK in return for my N900 May 18 14:17:39 my mfe has been broken since my company upgraded to new exchange server May 18 14:18:34 lucky May 18 14:18:39 luck * May 18 14:18:41 you there ? May 18 14:18:45 Who? May 18 14:18:57 says here : Run the following command (TIP: Do not include '-R' if you are flashing EMMC as well, see below): flasher-3.5.exe -F RX-51_2009SE_2.2009.51-1_PR_COMBINED_MR0_ARM.bin -f -R May 18 14:18:59 should i reflash the EMMC ? May 18 14:26:27 xxdareaperxx: depends May 18 14:26:36 tell the whole story please May 18 14:26:52 ~seen lucky May 18 14:26:56 lucky <~lucky@unaffiliated/lucky> was last seen on IRC in channel #norganna, 164d 17h 13m 56s ago, saying: 'and I'm on US realms. '. May 18 14:28:17 xxdareaperxx: if you want your device "clean" like from the factory you flash the EMMC too, if you only want to reflash your root-fs you don't May 18 14:29:59 damn May 18 14:30:07 o_O May 18 14:30:09 damn calendar entries May 18 14:30:13 hehe May 18 14:30:16 if i make one from the phone it just sits there May 18 14:30:19 trying to sync May 18 14:30:28 i can delete them and they disappear from google May 18 14:30:37 and if i make one in google calendars it gets to the phone May 18 14:31:01 but making one from the phone and trying to sync just makes it try to sync forever May 18 14:31:13 why you even try? May 18 14:31:22 ok reflashed May 18 14:31:26 ty May 18 14:31:30 chem|st: everything works except this :) May 18 14:31:31 xxdareaperxx: ;) May 18 14:31:31 too bad May 18 14:31:39 almost got exited about using maemo May 18 14:31:47 at least the contacts and email works May 18 14:32:02 Macer: create a contakt with all fields you got entered "all", and try to sync that! May 18 14:32:13 contact... May 18 14:33:12 such as? May 18 14:34:38 Macer: well all contact details like accounts and birthday and everything May 18 14:35:41 friggin drive by users May 18 14:35:43 as far as I am concerned... I do not want to sync my contacts to google ever May 18 14:35:52 ok May 18 14:36:03 DocScrutinizer: who what and if yes how many May 18 14:36:14 xxdareaperxx May 18 14:36:30 how many? actually zero May 18 14:36:33 yea like that 300% speed thread May 18 14:36:39 just idiots May 18 14:37:20 just started to tell him about friggin multiboot and his only option is to flash rootfs, and never again install that shit May 18 14:37:23 let's make something and make money May 18 14:37:48 I should setup a support hotline 5€/min May 18 14:37:57 I'll join May 18 14:38:13 why chem|st, are you hot? May 18 14:38:31 pupnik: video call costs 5€ Xtra May 18 14:38:43 "oooh, nitdroid. Sorry sir, that's our special helpline, which is 0900foobar and costs 15$/min" May 18 14:39:47 we can try with paypal links in here... charging for the help if it's cause is stupidness May 18 14:40:29 like a fee-r.to.do.it.ever.again May 18 14:40:51 #bash has that technique perfected May 18 14:41:17 _o/ May 18 14:41:17 heh nice May 18 14:41:27 ~topic May 18 14:42:12 did you see the animation i did for nokia? used an old song of mine too http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eVAwoFZKUSQ May 18 14:42:19 that was how i felt about n900 May 18 14:42:32 before management crapped on it May 18 14:42:47 all hopeful and happy May 18 14:48:53 lol @ topic May 18 14:49:19 but if somone comes here to ask, they aren't likely to read the topic of course... May 18 14:55:36 lardman: http://tinyurl.com/paypal-dostortugas May 18 14:55:47 is what they get May 18 15:03:49 DocScrutinizer, may I suggest pointing to #nitdroid May 18 15:05:35 I can't do that as I refuse to even join that channel, to check if it's real May 18 15:06:26 even less I know if you can get any semi-decent help to the issue there May 18 15:07:17 I'd guess the users of that channel are as ignorant about the issue as are the devels of nitdridiot May 18 15:08:15 otherwise nitdriodiot would've adopted uBoot long ago May 18 15:09:10 even streamlined their "distro" to be boot-compatible with meego May 18 15:10:56 nuts May 18 15:11:15 (just change uBoot menu wording from "2) meego" to "2) uSD (meego/nitdoid)") May 18 15:16:56 even "2) uSD partition-set A \n 3)uSD partition-set B \n 4) uSD partition-set C \n 5) eMMC partitons-set A \n 6) eMMC partition-set B" May 18 15:19:37 where partition-set N is the Nth partition with ext-fs and a file /boot/vmlinuz May 18 15:22:41 chem|st: me? May 18 15:24:34 droids May 18 15:24:39 yeah May 18 15:24:53 iPrones and others May 18 15:25:29 iphones are iprions May 18 15:26:21 pupnik: they arent infective, it must be something genetical May 18 15:26:47 dailylinux: test achieved May 18 15:27:47 iPrune would fit too in german May 18 15:50:21 dawn is also nuts! May 18 16:05:38 ISRAEL HAS RECENTLY CREATED A BRANCH OF MILITARY INTELLIGENCE TASKED WITH SEEKING-OUT AND CONFRONTING INDIVIDUALS SUSPECTED OF 'DELIGITIMIZING' ISRAEL ABROAD. -- THAT KNOCK ON THE DOOR MIGHT BE A MAGAZINE SALESMAN, OR IDF May 18 16:05:56 Why all caps though? May 18 16:06:07 for fun May 18 16:06:20 looks more 'cable' like May 18 16:07:03 For fun, I would expect some pictures of evil Mossad commandos sodomizing a typical US liberal May 18 16:07:17 No pictures, no game =) May 18 16:07:26 IDF personell don't do that. May 18 16:07:32 They just shoot them in the head. May 18 16:07:37 Will do. May 18 16:08:13 note the recent goldstone retraction :) May 18 16:08:49 Random. There is a new version of powertop. http://freshmeat.net/projects/powertop/releases/327025 May 18 16:08:53 Not for n900 of course. May 18 16:08:59 (well - not without some porting. May 18 16:11:18 Speed: will it work on omap? May 18 16:12:01 I have doubts. May 18 16:13:00 *facepalm* May 18 16:13:30 off May 18 16:27:46 pupnik: this is a good'un http://reason.com/blog/2011/05/18/no-right-to-resist-rogue-cops May 18 16:29:36 What is the sound of contraband being destroyed? May 18 16:29:58 Will chewing on a box of cuban cigars count? May 18 16:34:34 GeneralAntilles: indiana is now tardistan May 18 16:54:59 what's the N900's microsd card reader's max speed May 18 16:56:35 dd if=/dev/zero of=/home/user/file bs=4096 count=some_big_number should tell you May 18 16:56:54 I don't have a class 10 card to test May 18 16:56:59 just a generic classless card May 18 16:57:07 Sazpaimon: About 12M/s May 18 16:57:14 Sazpaimon: For both internal and external. May 18 16:57:16 is that read or write? May 18 16:57:33 both - write speed will depend also on the card speed more than read May 18 16:57:42 I have a very cheap card that does 12M read May 18 16:58:07 both? that's weird, read should be faster May 18 16:58:14 so it can take any class and use it to its max? May 18 16:58:35 The write and read speeds are the same - from a hardware limit of the reader perspective. May 18 16:59:21 so it could handle up to a class 12 May 18 16:59:28 should such a card ever exist May 18 17:00:09 dunno how the classes work - I just tried with dd May 18 17:00:19 the class is the max sustained write speed May 18 17:01:33 Sazpaimon: http://forum.nitdroid.com/index.php?topic=398.0 May 18 17:02:09 ah, nvm, he tests n900 <-> usb speed May 18 17:02:59 * slonopotamus enjoys running revodrive ssd @ 450MBps read :) May 18 17:03:08 right now I'm trying to find a card with the best random write speed May 18 17:03:23 I want to move swap to microsd and see if there's an improvement May 18 17:03:32 but not a lot of cards document their random write speed May 18 17:04:04 That's as it can be as low as a few dozen K a second. :) May 18 17:04:37 which is why windows phone kept gobbling up microsd cards a while back May 18 17:05:07 Sazpaimon: i think it is safe to buy class 6 card May 18 17:05:11 because windows phone OS saw microsd cards as part of the phone's space, and treated it as such May 18 17:05:34 slonopotamus, I can't just pick up a class 6 card and expect it to have great random write speeds May 18 17:06:13 so, pick a class 6 card with fast random writes :) May 18 17:06:21 http://forum.xda-developers.com/showpost.php?p=13676412&postcount=87 here's a good post May 18 17:06:28 it documents random writes of different cards May 18 17:07:41 looks like class 4 may be the way to go May 18 17:07:51 Ah May 18 17:07:54 thanks May 18 17:09:00 nobody seems to have tested any 32GB cards which is what I REALLY want May 18 17:09:39 I vaguely recall a couple of peeps saying they workr. May 18 17:09:45 However - I haven't run out of space. May 18 17:09:53 I only have a 1G card in. May 18 17:10:08 well like I said, I'm going to use my card and partition it off May 18 17:10:29 put swap on some of it, and either nitroid or meego on another, leave the rest for storage May 18 17:10:34 Looks like the random4k write speed has nothing to do with the card class May 18 17:10:42 Pretty much not. May 18 17:10:44 RST38h, nope May 18 17:10:48 BUT, I doubt Linux will be doing 4k writes to these cards May 18 17:10:50 Swap speed can be 50K/s or so. May 18 17:10:58 In the pessimal case. May 18 17:11:06 RST38h, swap uses a lot of random writes May 18 17:11:07 128kB-512kB is more typical May 18 17:11:13 * SpeedEvil needs to get that flash-circularisation layer. May 18 17:11:16 done May 18 17:11:22 Sazpaimon:But swap has a setting of how much data to write at once May 18 17:11:28 Based on nbd May 18 17:11:31 and it is set to something like 256kB afaiik May 18 17:11:38 RST38h: That means nothing. May 18 17:11:50 It does mean something May 18 17:11:57 Or almost nothing. May 18 17:12:00 means the 4k speed is not the value you want to look at May 18 17:12:40 you think i should be looking at 512KB? May 18 17:13:13 most likely May 18 17:13:25 512K may be the initial swap write size. May 18 17:13:33 It does not stay that way on fragmentation. May 18 17:13:34 problem is it seems the higher the class, the lower the random write speed May 18 17:13:43 it seems inversely proportional May 18 17:14:39 http://forum.xda-developers.com/showpost.php?p=13819977&postcount=112 check out the last rating May 18 17:15:01 17MB sequential write, and 2.7MB 512K random write May 18 17:15:08 i think we have a winner May 18 17:15:50 SpeedEvil:If it swaps always in 512kB chunks, it will get fragmentedin exactly these chunks May 18 17:16:18 Sazpaimon:Do notice how speed may vary wildly for the same card make/class/model May 18 17:16:29 Seems to depend on the card rather than its model May 18 17:16:39 that's true May 18 17:16:55 it definately couldn't hurt though May 18 17:16:58 RST38h: I don't think you can set the swap algorithm to do that. May 18 17:17:10 Speed: There is a setting. May 18 17:17:31 * SpeedEvil still wants to do his circulariser. May 18 17:22:11 Any new block write to a virtual swap device is taken as a delete. The real write happens at a 'head' pointer, which skips over very dense areas, and consolidates less dense areas. May 18 17:23:50 'is taken as a delete of the block in that location' May 18 17:24:04 512k random write is "trivial"... You want to know the speed under 4k random write :) May 18 17:24:13 You would get better results if you had more info as to what the swap alforithm actually wanted to throw away. May 18 17:25:15 * SpeedEvil wonders if swap might support trim at some point. May 18 17:27:14 The current swap algorithm in maemo is like the circulariser, without garbage collection and trim May 18 17:27:32 * ShadowJK plotted access patterns May 18 17:28:11 yeah May 18 17:28:31 read is almost free. May 18 17:28:42 Writing additional data is almost free. May 18 17:29:05 http://enivax.net/jk/kswapd.png the sector of each kswapd write was recorded. Plotted on the Y axis... May 18 17:29:15 You can see it writes sequentially until it reaches the end of the device May 18 17:29:31 then there's a few chunks of sequentialish, and thne it's mostly random May 18 17:29:52 the dots in teh random area get smaller and smaller May 18 17:29:55 sup May 18 17:30:23 Monodevelop seems to be almost stable and I want to move it to etras May 18 17:30:30 What should I do? May 18 17:31:56 Do you have block write size recorded anywhere? May 18 17:32:08 no May 18 17:33:23 Plotting that in 3d, with the third dimension being latency would be cool too. May 18 17:33:31 this was with /proc/sys/vm/block_dump, it came out as 4k requests all the time May 18 17:35:05 Where does that dump to? May 18 17:35:06 Oh May 18 17:35:11 That's handy! May 18 17:35:56 Protip: running syslog at the same time is bad idea May 18 17:36:10 iirc I did cat /proc/kmsg | awk May 18 17:36:11 :) May 18 17:36:43 I'm probably going to get syslog to throw it over the wall at another system I think. May 18 17:37:19 hmm May 18 17:37:30 ? May 18 17:37:33 0 May 18 17:37:41 you need to set it to 1 May 18 17:37:54 [11818.359254] pidgin(2862): dirtied inode 333864 (2011-05-18.180446+0100BST.txt) on sda1 May 18 17:37:57 then pops up May 18 17:39:07 aah, thnx May 18 17:39:21 WTF May 18 17:39:31 i've heard something about microsoft buying nokia May 18 17:39:46 Outright? May 18 17:39:48 :x May 18 17:39:51 old rumor, BS from good ol' eldar May 18 17:39:56 Seems unlikelyish. May 18 17:40:58 check stock, will tell May 18 17:41:15 went up on the rumours May 18 17:41:52 Not much though May 18 17:41:58 It's been bouncing around 8.5 May 18 17:42:00 someone made an #eldork hashtag on twitter May 18 17:42:15 Since feb May 18 17:42:22 whatever that means May 18 17:42:53 eldar, eldork May 18 18:14:25 bah, I much preferred the old days when instead of creating 600+ posts threads of plain BS over a _single_ screenshots of the interface we had intelligent people running the new device sw stack May 18 18:15:25 I ponder why nobody asked why the "multitasking view" is different from the meegotouch task switcher... May 18 18:15:54 the latter being more webos-like. May 18 18:15:58 I bet noone realized... May 18 18:16:49 Heya javispedro May 18 18:16:57 oh yay javispedro's back, again May 18 18:17:03 evening RST38h, MohammadAG May 18 18:17:06 * MohammadAG checks if cyanogen's out this time May 18 18:17:16 javispedro: these entities do not know what meegotouch task switcher is May 18 18:17:31 MohammadAG: again, but armed with an informatics degree this time! May 18 18:17:36 javispedro: they may have seen a screenshot of course, but it was a while ago, and they are not big on longterm memory May 18 18:17:46 congrats javispedro ! May 18 18:18:39 RST38h: as I was saying, a complete waste. May 18 18:18:42 * javispedro roots for qwerty12 May 18 18:19:25 qwerty had a point May 18 18:19:46 ty MohammadAG May 18 18:19:53 MohammadAG: bet you did lots of new interesting things? ;) May 18 18:20:26 javispedro, just discovered how hard C APIs are :p May 18 18:20:51 particularly maemo's well -cough- coded ones May 18 18:21:01 oh and I got my driver's license, but that's unrelated :p May 18 18:21:12 hey, I got one of those too. May 18 18:22:14 omg toshiba makes a 4'' 720x1280 screen May 18 18:22:36 yep May 18 18:22:48 but you don't live in a country that tortures their drivers for 2 years :p May 18 18:23:52 javispedro: omg which device May 18 18:24:42 MohammadAG: 2 full years? O.O here that would mean more than 10000€ in taxes May 18 18:25:01 javispedro: hitach i announced a screen like that at 4.5 inches back in feb May 18 18:25:05 chx: none ( http://www.engadget.com/2011/05/18/toshiba-declares-victory-in-pixel-density-war-367ppi-coming-to/ ) May 18 18:25:08 javispedro, well, fact is I can't go alone for 3 months May 18 18:25:33 I have to have someone over 24 years old with a license May 18 18:25:34 given that all my friends are 20 or under, or busy with uni, that means parents May 18 18:25:44 uh May 18 18:25:48 the rest of the 2 years I can't carry more than 2 other people with me May 18 18:26:05 ah, I see. May 18 18:26:47 javispedro, btw, rules apply to everyone, even those over 30 years old May 18 18:26:50 Otellini: ARM servers 'ain't gonna work' May 18 18:28:39 Mohammad: Haven't you got public transportation? May 18 18:30:08 microsoft spain is funding an event where they will exchange 3 1/2 floppy disks for "4-port usb hubs" May 18 18:30:44 RST38h, yeah, but you know how buses should stop at bus stops ONLY? May 18 18:30:50 * javispedro ponders what kind of marketing strategy is that one May 18 18:30:59 OK so i just goot catched up on the news -- it seems this time the N9 might be real -- but who is oging to develop apps for it i wonder May 18 18:30:59 they stop where anyone wants here May 18 18:31:06 a 5 minute trip = 1 hour May 18 18:31:38 Mohammad: Yeah. No minibuses though? May 18 18:31:39 RST38h, Israel's also building a train/metro May 18 18:31:49 of course, that's been since 2004 I think May 18 18:31:51 Mohammad: these stop at request May 18 18:31:56 it's still being tested May 18 18:32:48 RST38h, that's the point, all buses stop at request May 18 18:32:48 that means 10 stops every 5 minutes May 18 18:32:57 Ah, I see May 18 20:58:58 ok i give up May 18 20:59:01 calendars just don't work :) May 18 20:59:02 too bad May 18 20:59:18 well..... works to the point where google can send to the n900 but not vice versa May 18 21:00:09 hi there.is it possible to put maemo to nokia e90? May 18 21:00:42 i don't like symbian,well I seen an article about maemo May 18 21:02:34 or mameo just for tablet phones? May 18 21:05:56 Maemo is composed of open source, and binary components. May 18 21:06:17 The opensource bits cannot work without the closed source parts, which are only designed and licenced to run on teh n900 May 18 21:08:22 thank you May 18 21:10:43 SpeedEvil: well maybe someone should fix mail for exchange :) May 18 21:10:50 so the damn calendars work with google May 18 21:11:05 Can any program made to run on Linux run on maemo? May 18 21:11:21 Also can Android apps run on Maemo? I saw Angry Birds on one. May 18 21:11:57 angry birds is available on maemo natively May 18 21:12:06 Serpher, depends on the libraries required May 18 21:12:21 Couldn't I just intstall those libraries? May 18 21:12:21 and how much faff you want, re porting and screenresolution May 18 21:12:32 and whether the app was designed for .... blah blah May 18 21:12:56 Ok, would I be able to install Android on an N900 and still have it fully functional? May 18 21:13:01 Serpher, if the library has not been added to repositories already, someone will have to do it May 18 21:13:10 what is android? May 18 21:13:34 lcuk: Couldn't I just get the source code and compile it on the tablet? Also Android the phone OS made by Google. May 18 21:13:50 It uses Linux just with modified "clean" headers. May 18 21:14:28 Serpher, depends what you mean by "just", you can certainly download minimal required sdk and build stuff May 18 21:14:55 but time and disk space are the normal limitations, along with non standard busybox tooling May 18 21:16:51 What do you mean by "busybox tooling"? May 18 21:17:47 Serpher, not standard gnu tools, so things which normal builds require (like tar for instance) use the slightly modified versions May 18 21:18:03 installing the gnu tools themselves have a bit of an issue too May 18 21:18:28 Couldn't I just work around that by installing those variations of the tools? May 18 21:18:33 yes May 18 21:18:43 but the maemo boot scripts use the variations.. May 18 21:19:13 so, you either have standard tools and potential bootup issues, or non standard tools and sdk build issues May 18 21:19:21 ok, so I think my N900 USB port has gone now May 18 21:19:36 what can I do? does nokia still repair these? how much does it cost? (UK) May 18 21:19:41 BCMM, is it still physically connected? May 18 21:19:43 lcuk: Guess I'll just have to play around with it when I get my N900. May 18 21:19:49 yep May 18 21:20:01 lcuk: yes, but it looks a little twisted May 18 21:20:23 BCMM: Free warranty for 2 years May 18 21:20:24 BCMM, I did mine with a little fold of card May 18 21:20:32 AIUI May 18 21:20:33 it pushed the usb connector back onto the board May 18 21:20:42 i mean, it appears slightly rotated relative to the phone's case May 18 21:20:48 also, no data or power seems to go through May 18 21:21:02 lcuk: did what? jammed it back in to position? May 18 21:21:21 SpeedEvil: what does warranty mean? new/fixed n900, or new phone that isn't an n900? May 18 21:21:28 new fixed May 18 21:21:30 AIUI May 18 21:21:30 yes, it was a bit finnicky, so I did that May 18 21:21:40 Spare parts are still available May 18 21:21:55 pretty sure it's been less than 2 years May 18 21:22:05 It has. May 18 21:22:20 still hasn't been out two years, has it? May 18 21:22:28 yes May 18 21:22:38 my thinking was that the 18mo contract i had when i got it is still going May 18 21:22:56 so what? i ring up nokia and i can get them to fix it for me? May 18 21:23:04 As I understand it, yes. May 18 21:23:07 thanks May 18 21:23:25 anyone here done this, and happen to know which bit of nokia i should call? May 18 21:24:02 oh, this warranty, is it possible to void it from the software side? May 18 21:24:06 (without overclocking) May 18 21:24:58 I doubt it in practice. May 18 21:25:12 In theory, you can intentuionally destroy the phone May 18 21:25:22 Setting voltage regulators out of spec May 18 21:25:34 i guess i'm just used to stupid rules May 18 21:25:49 backup first of course May 18 21:25:51 from being a linux user and trying to hide this from laptop vendors May 18 21:26:04 yeah, i know i need to backup May 18 21:26:13 since they might replace the whole unit or something May 18 21:26:18 Indeed. May 18 21:26:28 HP was really cool about this, actually. they let me keep the laptop's HDs when i sent it in May 18 21:26:40 even seemed pleased i was reducing their shipping weight that way May 18 21:27:13 but i know that some laptop vendors will try and void it for installing a different OS on, so i guess being used to that made me paranoid that custom kernels and so on would be a problem May 18 21:28:24 Speaking personally, I'd wipe it and flash it. May 18 21:28:27 Oh May 18 21:29:19 SpeedEvil: ha ha. May 18 21:29:20 :) May 18 21:29:28 flashing is the only reason i care May 18 21:29:50 i mean, you can get external battery chargers, and i very seldom use mass storage mode anyway May 18 21:30:16 sftp FTW; cables are fiddly May 18 21:30:41 but i thouroughly intend to brick this device many more times in the future May 18 21:30:49 having to not risk a reflash would be boring May 18 21:31:43 rsync May 18 21:32:57 Can anybody tell my why Maemo > Android or Android > Maemo? I'm split on what I should get. I'm scared I won't get the app selection Android has. May 18 21:35:34 if you want tons of applications get Android May 18 21:35:58 if you want a very powerful phone with real multitasking and don't bother to code your own software, then get Maemo or wait a little longer to get a Meego phone May 18 21:37:51 Serpher: maemo is a proper linux distro May 18 21:38:07 it has it's idiosyncracies, but it has glibc, xorg, and so on May 18 21:38:29 you can basically recompile a linux application for ARM and run it on maemo May 18 21:38:53 (though obviously the UI could usually use a few tweaks, like bigger buttons) May 18 21:39:18 I want maemo because I can do a lot with Linux, but I want my smartphone to feel like a proper smartphone like Android/iOS May 18 21:39:34 well, what makes it a "proper" one? May 18 21:40:03 i may not have used android/iOS enough to understand this May 18 21:40:14 the n900 mostly feels like a proper laptop to me May 18 21:40:21 I'm scared it'll be much like Linux is on the Desktop xD. Yes, it's terrific and makes sense but you miss out on a lot like gaming and high-quality apps. May 18 21:40:42 there is a much smaller selection of applications, yes May 18 21:41:03 though i wouldn't call android's nor apple's app stores a haven of high-quality apps May 18 21:42:17 I guess I'll have a look around OVI May 18 21:42:30 i wouldn't bother with ovi, tbh May 18 21:42:43 well, most of hte stuff i use isn't from there, anyway May 18 21:42:54 the open-source stuff is largely in maemo extras May 18 21:43:00 ovi store is the "app store" May 18 21:43:16 it's where you get angry birds and gimicky things May 18 21:43:21 there may even be a fart app, dunno May 18 21:43:57 here's an example of why i find the proper smartphone OSs somewhat amusing: May 18 21:44:13 saw people on slashdot arguing about the best SSH clients for iOS and android May 18 21:45:27 actually, where would one go to get an overview of the most popular maemo extras apps? May 18 21:46:39 http://talk.maemo.org/thankedposts.php?since=365 ? :P May 18 21:48:28 MohammadAG: was that an answer to me? May 18 21:49:24 hmm, it's a page saying that most popular applications are ones MohammadAG was involved with... May 18 21:49:29 ;) May 18 21:51:10 I think I'll probably end up going with the Maemo. I like the layout too much plus there's always the bonus of being able to be a pretentious neckbeard xD May 18 21:51:20 heh May 18 21:51:37 i'm really curious as to what a proper smartphone is supposed to be like May 18 21:51:59 BCMM: it needs a nuclear battery, for one thing May 18 21:51:59 i mean, this is very much like using a desktop, since it's just X but with a WM that's suited to a small screen May 18 21:52:25 kerio: no, i want to carry it in my pocket :( May 18 21:52:42 I have a nuclear fission device in my pocket. May 18 21:52:43 BCMM: I'll explain when I get back from dinner May 18 21:52:46 It glows green. May 18 21:52:59 i mean, you do stuff with some application, alt-tab to some other application, close them when you're finished with them May 18 21:53:00 (alas with only around 100nW of power.) May 18 21:53:01 SpeedEvil: is it a glowing keychain? May 18 21:53:05 yes May 18 21:53:21 yes, it gets slow if you have to many open. desktops demonstrate that adults can deal with this and close something May 18 21:53:26 s/to/too/ May 18 21:53:26 BCMM meant: yes, it gets slow if you have too many open. desktops demonstrate that adults can deal with this and close something May 18 21:53:46 SpeedEvil: tritium? May 18 21:53:53 Indeed. May 18 21:54:09 I'd not be so happy to have most other glowing isotopes in my pocket. May 18 21:54:24 Tritium is basically completley safe as long as you don't crack the container. May 18 21:54:36 yeah, really really efficient transformation of mass into light May 18 21:54:40 and no gamma produced May 18 21:54:41 And if you do that, you need to crack it, while inhaling over a naked flame. May 18 21:54:51 yep May 18 21:55:07 And do about 10 of those, and you've hit the maximum dose May 18 21:55:18 in general, only gamma is really dangerous, unless you somehow get it inside you May 18 21:55:23 at which point gamma is the least of your worries May 18 21:55:46 There exist near-UV gammas. May 18 21:55:55 SpeedEvil: nice use of "do". somehow brings drugs to mind and now i can see somebody trying to snort tritium keychains May 18 21:55:55 Well - one. May 18 21:57:11 damnit, why does my USB port have to go when the battery is almost flat? May 18 21:57:30 and i'm going to have to send it for repair when i want to be testing stuff on it May 18 22:00:19 anyone in the UK sent their phone to Nokia for repair? how long does it tend to take? May 18 22:07:38 oh wow May 18 22:07:53 just realised the implications of no USB May 18 22:08:18 before i send this to nokia, i need to do backups, over wlan, with no change to recharge... May 18 22:08:24 i'd better get started/ May 18 22:08:32 ^chance May 18 22:09:46 BCMM: buy an external battery charger May 18 22:10:24 no, because as soon as shops open tomorrow, i'm sending the poor thing off to Nokia Care May 18 22:12:36 Got enough backups? May 18 22:12:43 Deleted the crocodile porn? May 18 22:13:26 crocodiles? May 18 22:13:46 you know, that's weirdly similar to a conversation i was having a few hours ago. May 18 22:14:06 i pretty much do have backups May 18 22:14:21 annoyingly, the recent changes i care about are photos i've taken lately May 18 22:14:55 SpeedEvil: Raw DNGs. 10MB each. May 18 22:17:46 ah May 18 22:20:29 and i've been playing with HDR, so it's often 30 or 40 megabytes per shot... May 18 22:21:46 BCMM: N900 can manage multi-exposure HDR? Or pseudo-hdr from a single shot? May 18 22:22:03 wblaze: well, it has a camera, and is programmable May 18 22:22:16 so exposure bracketing is inevitably possible May 18 22:22:19 i do it with fcamera May 18 22:22:40 seems a bit silly, but fun things often are May 18 22:22:49 hdr? May 18 22:22:55 yeah, i know it's a bit of a cliche May 18 22:23:01 but it's kind of fun May 18 22:23:20 fcamera is pretty cool May 18 22:23:40 it usually achieves all three exposures in in the same second May 18 22:23:50 the fcam API is even cooler May 18 22:24:49 To make this conversation a bit funnier, I was just looking into buying a N900 so I figured I'd hang out in here for a bit and see what peoples' thoughts were May 18 22:24:57 that in itself pretty much made up my mind to go for it. May 18 22:26:30 I'd hold off for a few days May 18 22:26:44 It's possible that the meego device may be announced soon. May 18 22:27:28 The new device is unlikely to cost <$300CAD unlocked without a contract May 18 22:27:32 Indeed. May 18 22:27:35 Fair point. May 18 22:27:57 and with my luck, it'll only have a soft-keyboard May 18 22:28:54 I've stuck with my Blackberry 9700 far too long for that single feature, and I'm rather tired of being stuck with RIM's firmware. May 18 22:33:45 wblaze: it's a lot of fun for photography May 18 22:34:17 there is this fcam API, which basically gives complete control over the camera functions May 18 22:35:04 I was actually just reading up on the featureset, it's rather nice May 18 22:35:25 so there is an open-source way to tell it to do things like fire the flash at this brightness at this time and take an exposure of this length with this ISO number, etc. etc. May 18 22:35:35 oh, and it can capture raw data in DNG format May 18 22:36:51 wblaze: features of fcamera or the n900? May 18 22:37:06 if only my Canon 500D would do the same (DNG vs. RAW) May 18 22:37:31 What's the difference? May 18 22:37:57 fcamera specifically, I've been looking at the n900 since it was released but was never quite affordable enough (imo) to be reasonable May 18 22:39:41 It's a real pity the camera is not really 5MP May 18 22:39:56 Well - there are 5 million pixels. May 18 22:40:22 SpeedEvil: essentially it's more portable and open, though http://www.adobe.com/products/photoshop/extend.displayTab2.html goes into much more detail May 18 22:40:24 But the lens is not actually physically able to resolve due to being so teeny. May 18 22:40:46 yeah, there's only so much you can do with a cameraphone, though a good lens helps May 18 22:40:55 Ah - right. May 18 22:40:55 SpeedEvil: RAW basically means any one of dozens of nonstandard raw formats from different cameras May 18 22:41:10 with differing degrees of hostility to reverse engineering May 18 22:41:29 DNG is a standard raw format + EXIF (i think) metadata May 18 22:41:30 wblaze: yeah - and there is only so much you can do with an awesome cam and a 1.5mm lens. May 18 22:42:01 which is why I have a 500D for when the phone just doesn't cut it :) May 18 22:42:18 :) May 18 22:42:23 wblaze: btw, downsides of the camera: rolling shutter, noisy in low light, fixed aperture May 18 22:42:27 I'd love a decent camera, with a decent open OS. May 18 22:42:27 other than that, it's awesome May 18 22:44:04 well, there goes the battery May 18 22:44:49 the really big advantage over most camera phones is that it has variable focus May 18 22:45:02 manually-controllable, of course May 18 22:48:05 my blackberry has variable focus, but I can't say I've ever been particularly thrilled by it May 18 22:48:31 slow and rather terrible in low light May 18 22:50:06 http://www.flickr.com/photos/14560445@N08/5237662575/in/photostream http://www.flickr.com/photos/14560445@N08/4687082204/in/photostream May 18 22:50:26 A couple of my better snaps. May 18 22:51:36 I had the perfechet low light scenario for an awesome pic last weekend, but only the n900 at hand :/ May 18 22:51:58 fcamera can help with that. May 18 22:53:24 SpeedEvil: that second photo is wonderful May 18 22:53:32 http://a3.sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc6/221636_1703867831802_1091165610_31331465_4683407_n.jpg May 18 22:53:39 i take pics like this :) May 18 22:54:08 wblaze: The subject is almost impossible to take a bad pic of. It's just so photogenic. May 18 22:54:09 SpeedEvil: what did you do to get the pics like they are? May 18 22:54:21 merlin1991: What do you mean? May 18 22:54:33 Both of those were straight uploads. May 18 22:54:50 when I take pics with the n900 I normally have some sort of "noise" in the picture May 18 22:55:00 Those were in full sun. May 18 22:55:12 Full sun helps lots May 18 22:55:13 SpeedEvil: true, but the focus and depth of field are rather impressive for a cellphone May 18 22:55:31 SpeedEvil: are those n900 shots? May 18 22:55:34 yes May 18 22:55:35 also I was wondering if you did them with the regular camera app May 18 22:55:41 I think so. May 18 22:55:46 (regular camera) May 18 22:56:04 wblaze: http://benmorris.org.uk/vNmp4Mw.jpeg my favourite of my photos, which i think shows uncameraphonelike focus May 18 22:56:35 Yeah. You can get that effect - but you need to be really quite close to the subject. May 18 22:56:50 (i know it's somewhat poorly un-vignetted and i'd like to know if anyone know the right parameters to use with lensfun) May 18 22:57:08 for shots like that, i set it to manual focus, 5cm (the minimum) May 18 22:57:12 then move the phone to focus it May 18 22:57:46 am i right in saying that most cameras will not focus as close as 5cm? May 18 22:57:57 BCMM: It depends. May 18 22:58:34 BCMM: wow May 18 22:58:59 wblaze: at photo or at n900's 5cm focus? May 18 22:59:08 photo May 18 22:59:10 A480 - for example. May 18 22:59:14 SpeedEvil: was it blessn900 or fcamera or both that didn't work with the power kernel? May 18 22:59:27 wblaze: thx :) May 18 22:59:34 Will do 12mm vertical frame at minimum focus. May 18 22:59:41 5500DPI May 18 22:59:50 merlin1991: fcam and everything using it was broken for a bit May 18 22:59:55 it's all good now though May 18 23:00:02 i can't remember if bless used fcam at that point May 18 23:00:28 I don't think fcam fills in exif May 18 23:00:50 5cm is close, but not too impressive May 18 23:01:08 SpeedEvil: not automatically, at least. you could check fcamera source code May 18 23:01:21 wblaze: for a compact though :) May 18 23:02:08 my 9700 (horrible phone to compare with, but it's what I have haha) will autofocus at ~3cm, I believe May 18 23:02:15 quick testing seems to confirm my memory, though May 18 23:02:42 wblaze: wow May 18 23:02:59 in my experience, the n900 autofocus is a bit of a pain that close May 18 23:03:09 The A480 I mentioned above will go to about 2cm May 18 23:03:21 liable to choose the background instead of the subject May 18 23:03:30 I was having problems with that. May 18 23:03:38 wblaze: fcamera has point focus though May 18 23:03:58 I was trying to take pictures of a butterfly on a plant, and it kept focussing on the plant May 18 23:04:13 (I couldn't use the screen) May 18 23:04:20 don't know if that's the right word, but i mean that you can tap the screen to show it which bit of the frame needs to be in focus May 18 23:04:22 hm install fcamera May 18 23:04:29 I should have tried fcamera May 18 23:04:36 reboot phone -> tracker goes insane wtf? May 18 23:04:39 slower, though May 18 23:04:51 i mean, butterflies fly. May 18 23:05:05 BCMM: I was trying to take pictures when it landed May 18 23:05:30 i was really lucky the other day when a frog decided to stand still for long enough for me to start fcam and focus it properly May 18 23:07:16 http://www.mauve.plus.com/temp/butterfly.jpg May 18 23:07:30 Showing the colour, but little else. May 18 23:07:35 oh wow May 18 23:07:40 you must really hate the autofocus now May 18 23:08:37 off topic, but I do have a question for those here - how do you feel about the N900 comparing it to more recent smartphones? Still holding up or looking to trade it in? May 18 23:09:38 wblaze: i want a modernised version of the n900 May 18 23:09:41 http://www.mauve.plus.com/temp/frog.jpg May 18 23:09:50 Some animals are easier to take pictures of. May 18 23:09:57 wblaze: but other smartphones are smartphones May 18 23:10:03 and the n900 is like a laptop May 18 23:10:21 SpeedEvil: wow! May 18 23:10:42 that toad is ugly and yet weirdly cute May 18 23:10:58 also, that photo puts my frog picture to shame May 18 23:11:00 That was with extra light - keyring torch May 18 23:11:03 i'd post it, but it's on a dead n900 May 18 23:11:24 Oh - you can see the flash on the eye. May 18 23:11:32 that's weird May 18 23:11:52 if i connect it to my computer by USB, i get a dim blinking orange light May 18 23:11:57 i mean, on the notification led May 18 23:13:10 any idea what that means? May 18 23:13:41 ah May 18 23:13:45 dmesg on hte PC is interesting May 18 23:13:55 "Cannot enable port 2. Maybe the USB cable is bad?" May 18 23:14:00 It means it's booted, and is in linux May 18 23:14:01 thank you linux. if only. May 18 23:14:12 SpeedEvil: it isn't "on" May 18 23:14:14 blinking, or throbbing? May 18 23:14:17 blinking May 18 23:14:17 BCMM: I was rather hoping for something like my netbook with a phone, so that sounds about perfect :) May 18 23:14:51 wblaze: do you use linux/bsd on a laptop/desktop? May 18 23:14:58 also, usually this is the type of photo I take on my phone, so I'm not really too demanding of it http://www.facebook.com/photo.php?pid=31511903&id=1423129623 May 18 23:15:09 SpeedEvil: blinking, rapidly, until the desktop gives up and says "suspend root hub" May 18 23:15:36 more often on servers, these days but yes a few of them still run linux May 18 23:16:38 BCMM: Odd. May 18 23:16:48 wblaze: it's like a laptop in that it provides a normal-ish linux desktop, adapted for a small screen May 18 23:16:49 BCMM: That sounds like some sort of power issue. May 18 23:17:10 SpeedEvil: i don't know if you've seen that the USB port is broken May 18 23:17:14 yes May 18 23:17:20 i'm just trying to get a little power into it so i can get the photos off May 18 23:17:27 earlier today, it was working intermitantly May 18 23:17:36 I'm trying to think what the symptoms may be. May 18 23:18:12 wblaze: i mean, it is an ordinary X server with a window manager May 18 23:18:27 although all main windows are always maximised May 18 23:18:56 and it has a special way of displaying modal dialogs and so on May 18 23:19:43 SpeedEvil: fwiw, i can produce no such reaction with the power cable May 18 23:19:48 i mean, the wall charger May 18 23:20:40 power pins are longer than data in USB, right? May 18 23:20:52 i'm going to try half-plugging it in to the PC May 18 23:22:37 i think it starts blinking when the data pins engage May 18 23:24:38 Nope. May 18 23:24:54 It should react to power on the V+ line May 18 23:25:09 the orange light will go on nomatter if there are no other connections. May 18 23:27:25 BCMM: power pins are the outer pins on each side May 18 23:27:37 * SpeedEvil finds processors.wiki.ti.com May 18 23:27:53 and thanks :) May 18 23:34:08 SpeedEvil: hmm. am i right in saying that simply drawing power from a USB port shouldn't make any dmesg output? May 18 23:37:32 No. May 18 23:37:40 Unless you overload it. May 18 23:37:53 It will not 'appear' on USB if plugged in when dead until it boots May 18 23:49:17 The n900 processor can go up to a gig of RAM. May 18 23:49:40 The largest RAM I've found is 512M though in a compatible format though. **** ENDING LOGGING AT Thu May 19 02:59:58 2011