**** BEGIN LOGGING AT Thu May 26 02:59:57 2011
May 26 03:36:21 <pauly> hi
May 26 03:37:17 <pauly> i have n900 with broken usb is there anyway to reflash it or "start fresh" without usb?
May 26 03:43:11 <SpeedEvil> Does it boot?
May 26 03:43:36 <SpeedEvil> In principle, you can install meego bootloader, boot meego, and flash the normal image from meego.
May 26 03:43:42 <SpeedEvil> This is very non-trivial though.
May 26 03:47:26 <pauly>  i have n900 with broken usb is there anyway to reflash it or "start fresh" without usb?
May 26 03:48:54 <SpeedEvil> (04:42:57 AM) SpeedEvil: Does it boot?
May 26 03:48:54 <SpeedEvil> (04:43:21 AM) SpeedEvil: In principle, you can install meego bootloader, boot meego, and flash the normal image from meego.
May 26 03:48:54 <SpeedEvil> (04:43:28 AM) SpeedEvil: This is very non-trivial though.
May 26 03:50:58 <pauly> ya it boots?
May 26 03:51:06 <pauly> just usb is broken
May 26 03:51:23 <pauly> i have pr 1.3
May 26 03:56:13 <pauly> is there a way to SSu?
May 26 03:56:16 <pauly> ssu
May 26 04:01:04 <SpeedEvil> You can't update to what you have. Where are you?
May 26 04:05:03 <pauly> im in usa
May 26 04:05:10 <pauly> \maryland usa
May 26 04:06:05 <SpeedEvil> Ah - OK - warranty expired then.
May 26 04:06:10 <SpeedEvil> What are you trying to do?
May 26 04:06:53 <pauly> my n900 seems slow battery sucks microb is slow i just wanna go back to stock
May 26 04:08:46 <SpeedEvil> Probably better to ask about 8 hours ago, or in another 8, when more people are awake.
May 26 04:08:53 <SpeedEvil> It's lots more active then.
May 26 04:09:06 <pauly> ya
May 26 04:09:37 <pauly> i like it its just battery sucks and without usb its hard to use
May 26 04:10:05 <pauly> any new neat apps or anything useful?
May 26 04:11:57 <pauly> speedEvil: any idea how to increase wifi speed; im using a linksys router as a repeater to steal wireless internet but its too slow to use?
May 26 04:12:20 <SpeedEvil> Too slow?
May 26 04:12:25 <pauly> btw nothing to do with n900
May 26 04:12:37 <SpeedEvil> What do you mean by too slow?
May 26 04:12:46 <pauly> data rate
May 26 04:13:12 <SpeedEvil> The person you're leeching from may not have fast internet.
May 26 04:13:25 <pauly> signal rate 4-8 % and the repeater is at the window
May 26 04:13:39 <SpeedEvil> get a big antenna and point it.
May 26 04:14:00 <SpeedEvil> Join ##ddwrt
May 26 04:14:04 <{Sergiu}> =) on my 2mb/s wireles hotspot, my n900 can run with 500kb/s MAX
May 26 04:14:04 <{Sergiu}> :)
May 26 04:14:05 <SpeedEvil> or maybe with one #
May 26 04:14:12 <pauly> i tried to flash their router with dd-wrt firmware so i can boost the Tx Level on their side
May 26 04:14:36 <SpeedEvil> Get an antenna. Use it.
May 26 04:14:39 <pauly> oh thanks i forgot
May 26 04:15:51 <pauly> i would love to use my n900 as hotspot but the area im in bareley has edge coverage
May 26 06:33:06 <blizzow> My n900 just puked up all of it's guts.  It is locked at updating firmware, do not interrupt %20.
May 26 06:33:28 <blizzow> I downloaded the flasher and was wondering what the difference between the global and US versions of maemo are?
May 26 06:33:55 <blizzow> gah, NM, google/maemo.org tells me
May 26 06:38:41 <blizzow> ewwww, gross, is my N900 bricked?
May 26 06:39:13 <blizzow> It still says installing software update.  Please do not interrupt.  20%
May 26 06:47:05 <kerio> blizzow: you could try waiting
May 26 06:47:14 <kerio> if it's really stuck... sucks2beu
May 26 06:47:18 <kerio> but it's not bricked
May 26 06:47:23 <kerio> you'll lose your data though :(
May 26 06:47:30 <blizzow> kerio: 1+hour on 20%
May 26 06:47:34 <blizzow> :(
May 26 06:47:50 <kerio> i'd reflash
May 26 06:47:59 <blizzow> I tried re-flashing just now and it just came up at that same screen again.
May 26 06:48:14 <kerio> well you failed at reflashing then :)
May 26 06:48:17 <kerio> follow the instructions
May 26 06:48:35 <blizzow> I didn't think it was that hard to plug a usb cable in while holding the U key.
May 26 06:48:45 <kerio> did you remove the battery?
May 26 06:49:09 <blizzow> yeah.
May 26 06:49:19 <kerio> then idk \_o_/
May 26 06:50:10 <blizzow> I'm waiting until it's a little recharged after waiting for this update, I think I drained the battery a fair bit.
May 26 06:52:22 <kerio> you don't need to update, you need to reflash though
May 26 06:54:34 <Macer> heh
May 26 06:55:21 <dangergrrl> reading a bedtime story on SS7, GSM, and LAPD
May 26 06:57:30 <RST38h> Moo all
May 26 07:00:20 <derf> Moo.
May 26 07:01:30 <RST38h> hey derf
May 26 07:04:28 <derf> How's tricks?
May 26 07:06:38 <MohammadAG> oh policy system, why do you suck so hard
May 26 07:07:58 <Macer> haha
May 26 07:10:32 <RST38h> derf: Tired. Know how to solve all the world problems. Do not know how to utilize all the bodies though.
May 26 07:17:19 <derf> RST38h: Kill them and turn them into zombies.
May 26 07:19:25 <RST38h> derf: Clean methane energy!
May 26 07:21:28 <dangergrrl> the problem with zombies is they run out of brains to eat too quickly
May 26 07:21:58 <RST38h> dangergrrl: clean methane energy is the only answer.
May 26 07:22:30 <dangergrrl> so
May 26 07:22:43 <dangergrrl> are papers on gsm recommended bedtime reading material?
May 26 07:22:51 <RST38h> no.
May 26 07:23:04 <RST38h> and do avoid anything about SMS or MMS infrastructure.
May 26 07:23:17 <RST38h> will leave you fucked up for the rest of your life.
May 26 07:24:16 <dangergrrl> as soon as they even mention SS7 and LAPD my eyes start to get glossy
May 26 07:24:58 <RST38h> unhealthy reading, indeed
May 26 07:26:10 <Macer> hahaha
May 26 07:27:32 <dangergrrl> well, if i remember to breathe deep and calm and that ss7 is all based on x.25 and x.25 is simple...
May 26 07:27:59 <dangergrrl> at least iḿ not reading itu docs
May 26 07:28:16 <dangergrrl> i´m?
May 26 07:28:45 <dangergrrl> bah, where is single quote on this keymap :)
May 26 07:29:41 <RST38h> X.25 is where insanity begins
May 26 07:29:50 <dangergrrl> fount some tutorials but most of them are in german
May 26 07:30:07 <dangergrrl> and my german is not so good (read nonexistant_
May 26 07:30:20 <RST38h> That is because X.25 was invented by nazis during WWII as a covert plan to destroy the best engineering minds of the free world
May 26 07:30:32 <dangergrrl> rofl
May 26 07:30:41 <dangergrrl> this is possible
May 26 07:30:54 <dangergrrl> those nazis were insidious
May 26 07:31:05 <RST38h> IBM supplied them with experimental subjects
May 26 07:31:18 <RST38h> Who later continued working for the company
May 26 07:31:56 <dangergrrl> i thought ibm sold them basically the same tabulating machines used for the us census
May 26 07:32:00 <jaska> and x.400 to catalog all the "untermensch"
May 26 07:32:03 <RST38h> As a side note, anyone knows how to make NANO/PICO *not* to convert ends-of-line from Windows to Unix?
May 26 07:32:18 <RST38h> dangergrrl: Yep, up until 1942 or something
May 26 07:32:38 <RST38h> Never let a few thousand dead Jews interfere with the business...
May 26 07:32:49 <ruskie> http://www.linuxfordevices.com/c/a/News/BlueStacks/ <-- erm... WHY????
May 26 07:32:54 <dangergrrl> i have a book on ibmÅ› involvement
May 26 07:33:41 <RST38h> dangergrrl: seen it at bookstores for a while, but satisfied myself with wiki
May 26 07:34:12 <dangergrrl> there good evidence that Watson knew exactly whet the machines were used for
May 26 07:34:41 <RST38h> dangergrrl: Like there were many possible uses...
May 26 07:34:51 <dangergrrl> i bought the softcopy when it was discounted well for kindle
May 26 07:36:19 <dangergrrl> though it is looking like i may have to use actual windows to break the kindle drm on my books so i can read them on n900
May 26 07:36:41 <RST38h> dangergrrl: there is an easier way
May 26 07:36:44 <dangergrrl> (a violation of the DMCA here in the states)
May 26 07:36:56 <snappy> just powered up a new n900 for the first time, is there anyhting special i need to do to keep it uptodate? or does app manager handle all of this?
May 26 07:39:47 <dangergrrl> app manager does it but if you just powered up you probably have major updates :)
May 26 07:40:48 <dangergrrl> i think mine came from the factory with PR1.2
May 26 07:42:15 <snappy> for some reason it says no updates in app manager, sort of new to all of this heh.
May 26 07:44:14 <dangergrrl> that´s suprising
May 26 07:44:35 <snappy> ah nevermind, here we go, maemo 5
May 26 07:44:38 <snappy> i must've missed something or something
May 26 07:45:19 <dangergrrl> should be a big one :)
May 26 07:53:46 <edheldil> snappy:  read on MyNokia fiasco before putting in SIM card
May 26 07:55:53 <snappy> all good, no simcards going in this
May 26 07:56:25 <snappy> thanks for the warning though
May 26 07:58:03 <petteri> edheldil: what are you talking about. I have been happily using SIM in my n900?
May 26 08:02:24 <edheldil> about the SMS sent to nokia etc.
May 26 08:04:35 <stonda> oh noes!
May 26 08:09:52 <petteri> edheldil: ah, the one sms nokia sent to me?
May 26 08:13:09 <dangergrrl> i was just reading that feature phones store your contact list on the SIM card, do we actually do that? (or is it even true?)
May 26 08:14:01 <robbiethe1st> We don't.
May 26 08:14:31 <robbiethe1st> It's possible to store some stuff on a SIM card, I'm pretty sure... but at best it's like 64K - not enough for a real contact list with all the features
May 26 08:15:04 <robbiethe1st> Nothing like a spare GB of program memory to store /any/ data you want!
May 26 08:15:05 <petteri> at least basic nokia phones can store contacts in the SIM
May 26 08:15:54 <tonypercy> most can but you have limited fields...basically name and number i think?
May 26 08:16:15 <robbiethe1st> Ours stores it in the OptFS... TBH, it should store it in the RootFS - OptFS is too easily damaged on our device.
May 26 08:17:25 <dangergrrl> i was thinking that my skype and sip contacts would be of limited use on other devices anyhow :)
May 26 08:18:15 <edheldil> dangergrrl:  I have some contacts on SIM preloaded, the contact app can import them to addressbook.
May 26 08:18:53 <edheldil> but it's indeed just name+phone
May 26 08:19:23 <dangergrrl> aha
May 26 08:19:31 <tonypercy> edhedil i do the same so i can sms essential numbers from a dongle on a laptop/netbook
May 26 08:19:33 <dangergrrl> just trying to understand what i read :)
May 26 08:19:36 <robbiethe1st> You can pull any data you want out of our addressbook, for use on other devices(if you can find an input)
May 26 08:21:53 <blizzow> Is there a way to force a flash?  My N900 keeps booting into the nokia screen and says "installing software update.  Please do not interrupt.  20%"  I've tried holding down the U key but that  doesn't seem to work.
May 26 08:22:15 <dangergrrl> http://www.maemonokian900.com/maemo-news/nokia-response-to-mynokia-subscription-in-pr1-2/
May 26 08:22:23 <dangergrrl> this MyNokia fiasco?
May 26 08:26:47 <dangergrrl> i used mine on wifi for months before i had a SIM card
May 26 08:27:10 <dangergrrl> never noticed SMS to/from MyNokia
May 26 08:43:37 <snappy> If I repartition/format the /home/users/MyDocs partition, is there anyhting i should be aware of?
May 26 08:45:23 <snappy> ah nevermind, it sjust the MyDocs heh
May 26 08:48:17 <dangergrrl> the MyNokia thing is funny
May 26 08:49:10 <dangergrrl> does it really say ¨registration via SMS required¨ somewhere in the unreadably tiny print on the back of the box?
May 26 08:49:23 <dangergrrl> like i can read that
May 26 09:06:52 <snappy> I'm using nitdroid, and i was messing around with partitioning schemes. Is there a way to reinstall multiboot?
May 26 09:36:40 <DocScrutinizer> snappy: see /topic
May 26 09:37:49 <snappy> haha, totally missed that.
May 26 09:38:55 <snappy> so is that tacitly saying don't bother us with nitdroid shit, or is there a solution here?
May 26 09:39:16 <dangergrrl> oh, they did not do the MyNokia thing to usa users
May 26 09:42:18 <DocScrutinizer> snappy: search in chanlog for multiboot / anrdidiot / batshit
May 26 09:43:37 <DocScrutinizer> nitdridiot
May 26 09:44:28 <dangergrrl> lol
May 26 09:44:52 <dangergrrl> thatÅ› somewhat demeaning
May 26 09:45:45 <dangergrrl> so the shell script for the sdk install fails also but thereÅ› manual step by step instructions later on
May 26 09:48:47 <Shapeshifter> Does someone know how to use opera with a socks proxy?
May 26 09:49:19 <Shapeshifter> Also... my touchscreen is starting to go bust
May 26 09:49:25 <Shapeshifter> quite sad
May 26 09:49:31 <RST38h> http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2011/may/25/china-prisoners-internet-gaming-scam
May 26 09:49:34 <RST38h> Yesssss
May 26 09:49:47 <RST38h> The Tentacled One approves.
May 26 09:58:26 <lardman> morning
May 26 09:58:39 <lardman> did I miss a last minute N9/50 release at the conference?
May 26 10:10:57 <andre__> lardman, no.
May 26 10:11:22 <Creteil> hi all
May 26 10:11:32 <lardman> andre__: ah well
May 26 10:12:09 <Creteil> can someone know if it's possible to edit the web link contained in a shortcut on the desktop ?
May 26 10:13:50 <DocScrutinizer> Creteil: tweakr
May 26 10:14:36 <DocScrutinizer> iirc
May 26 10:15:10 <DocScrutinizer> Creteil: I bet there's also either a file somewhere, or a gconf key.
May 26 10:15:47 <DocScrutinizer> as tweakr can edit just one of both: either title OR URL, forgot which one
May 26 10:15:56 <Creteil> DocScrutinizer :
May 26 10:15:58 <Creteil> -bash-2.05b# apt-cache search tweakr
May 26 10:15:59 <Creteil> tweakr - Control panel applet for tweaking various settings
May 26 10:16:01 <Creteil> But I prefer the gconf option ...
May 26 10:16:02 <Creteil> I need to find where is located the key right now ...
May 26 10:16:35 <DocScrutinizer> well, a peek to tweakr's source might tell
May 26 10:17:05 <Creteil> Good idea, let me see ...
May 26 10:18:23 <DocScrutinizer> or you do a `gconftool-1 -R / >before` then create a new shortcut, then do >after and diff before after, also use `find` (the real one, not messybox crap) to find any file in /etc and ~user which is new and of ctime when you made the shortcut
May 26 10:18:41 <DocScrutinizer> s/-1/-2/
May 26 10:18:41 <infobot> DocScrutinizer meant: or you do a `gconftool-2 -R / >before` then create a new shortcut, then do >after and diff before after, also use `find` (the real one, not messybox crap) to find any file in /etc and ~user which is new and of ctime when you made the shortcut
May 26 10:18:55 <dangergrrl> iḿ sorry but that is bizarre and kinda creepy (chinese political prisoners gold farming)
May 26 10:19:38 <DocScrutinizer> eh?
May 26 10:20:16 * DocScrutinizer takes mental note to update to bash4 on maemo
May 26 10:20:35 <Shapeshifter> mh. been traveling for a month, what is all this 'N950' talk about
May 26 10:20:37 <dangergrrl> the link from RST38h
May 26 10:20:46 <Shapeshifter> some conference and what leaked video?
May 26 10:21:57 <lardman> Shapeshifter: the apparently forthcoming device, though no-one knows quite when
May 26 10:22:08 <lardman> there's a set of FCC docs up
May 26 10:23:14 <Shapeshifter> meego? keyboard?
May 26 10:24:15 <lardman> harmattan presumably
May 26 10:24:29 <lardman> iirc there was a comment in the FCC docs about test with kb open
May 26 10:24:34 <dangergrrl> and we should be excited why? like Nokia has treated n900 customers so well :)
May 26 10:24:34 <lardman> but you'd have to check
May 26 10:24:38 <Shapeshifter> mh
May 26 10:24:41 <lardman> dangergrrl: new hw
May 26 10:25:01 <lardman> dangergrrl: I've no problem with the N900 treatment
May 26 10:25:04 <dangergrrl> so maybe itĺl have flash 10
May 26 10:25:14 <Shapeshifter> where would I buy a replacement touchscreen for the N900 in Europe?
May 26 10:25:15 <lardman> who gives a shit about flash?
May 26 10:25:18 <javispedro> moo
May 26 10:25:18 <dangergrrl> but that will never be updated
May 26 10:25:24 <Shapeshifter> mine's acting up badly
May 26 10:25:46 <lardman> Shapeshifter: if it's a dev device don't send it for warranty as it will be eaten
May 26 10:25:58 <dangergrrl> i would like to be able to watch hulu
May 26 10:26:13 <Shapeshifter> lardman: eaten? dev device?
May 26 10:26:15 * RST38h feeds javispedro a turnip
May 26 10:26:28 <lardman> Shapeshifter: as in not sent back
May 26 10:26:38 <Shapeshifter> howso?
May 26 10:26:43 <javispedro> lardman: that is amsterdam device?
May 26 10:26:49 <lardman> pre-Amsterdam
May 26 10:26:54 <javispedro> ah.
May 26 10:26:59 <lardman> they said it belongs to Nokia, you can't have it back
May 26 10:27:00 <chem|st> ShadowJK: the charger21.sh is buggy and doesn't charge, some of the i2cset commands give errors, I managed to reset the battery without *sweat*
May 26 10:27:24 <chem|st> DocScrutinizer: reset CI=0
May 26 10:27:27 <Shapeshifter> ah, no no, it's a normal N900. I thought you were supposed to send back the dev devices anyway?
May 26 10:27:52 <Shapeshifter> But I remember there was an online shop selling replacement touch screens and displays.
May 26 10:27:55 <lardman> Shapeshifter: this one had an extension
May 26 10:27:56 <javispedro> depends. DDT went through warranty fine.
May 26 10:28:04 <DocScrutinizer> chem|st: \o/
May 26 10:28:06 <javispedro> er.. DDP.
May 26 10:28:44 <lardman> Mine did say "Propery of Nokia, Prototype" or words to that effect; even though the MAC apparently meant it qualified for warranty after a couple of years
May 26 10:29:03 <chem|st> DocScrutinizer: was dropping fast from that point and the charger script did't work... starting bme gave a black screen at first but I managed to recover just in the right time
May 26 10:29:05 <lardman> anyway it does belong to them, so I said no worries
May 26 10:29:16 <Shapeshifter> 'maemo presents the meego coding competition'? hah...
May 26 10:29:33 <javispedro> maemo.org endorses Meego! you know..
May 26 10:29:48 <chem|st> just before that pagelookup died and I wasn't even able to ping over wifi
May 26 10:29:55 <DocScrutinizer> Shapeshifter: forget all the FUD/rumour about "new devices"
May 26 10:30:00 <chem|st> dnslookup I mean
May 26 10:30:00 * javispedro remembers that "endorsement" happened during my council term...
May 26 10:30:07 <DocScrutinizer> Shapeshifter: try saremi
May 26 10:30:43 <chem|st> Shapeshifter: and say hello to shahin (old friend of our family)
May 26 10:31:09 <psychologe> join #aircrack-ng
May 26 10:31:10 <supervacuo> Hi all, could someone point me in the direction of the best place to ask Pimlico-related questions? ("here" is an acceptable answer too :) )
May 26 10:31:26 <RST38h> javispedro: what *is* an "endorsement", anyway?
May 26 10:31:39 <DocScrutinizer> psychologe: seems you missed a "/"
May 26 10:31:46 <javispedro> RST38h: PR-speak-style kind words.
May 26 10:31:56 <DocScrutinizer> supervacuo: what's that?
May 26 10:32:04 <chem|st> DocScrutinizer: want the bq27-log file?
May 26 10:32:05 <psychologe> oh thanks
May 26 10:32:08 <javispedro> RST38h: nothing more back then.
May 26 10:32:19 <Shapeshifter> DocScrutinizer: thanks
May 26 10:32:24 <RST38h> not much more nowadays either
May 26 10:32:25 <DocScrutinizer> chem|st: sure
May 26 10:32:31 <DocScrutinizer> Shapeshifter: found sth?
May 26 10:32:40 <supervacuo> DocScrutinizer: EDS-integrated single-function apps that work on maemo and GNOME (I'm using them on GNOME): Tasks, Contacts, Dates
May 26 10:32:40 <chem|st>  /msg email pls
May 26 10:32:56 <javispedro> supervacuo: pimlico ML might be better
May 26 10:33:09 <DocScrutinizer> chem|st: joerg at openmoko org
May 26 10:33:15 <javispedro> supervacuo: (ML = mailing list) see http://www.pimlico-project.org/index.html
May 26 10:33:26 <supervacuo> javispedro: OK, thanks.
May 26 10:34:20 <Shapeshifter> DocScrutinizer: still looking
May 26 10:34:24 <DocScrutinizer> chem|st: no need for /msg, that addr is quite publicly known
May 26 10:36:03 <DocScrutinizer> Shapeshifter: http://www.saremi-mobilfunk.de/product_info.php/info/p4369_Original-Nokia-N900-A-Cover-Touchscreen.html
May 26 10:36:52 * javispedro needs to remember to buy a replacement stylus...
May 26 10:36:58 <javispedro> before they stop making them that is...
May 26 10:37:16 <Shapeshifter> DocScrutinizer: thanks. will probably need one of those
May 26 10:37:24 <DocScrutinizer> yw
May 26 10:37:34 <Shapeshifter> Didn't expect the touchscreen to die so early though :|
May 26 10:37:51 <Shapeshifter> I even have a foil on it and it never dropped or anything
May 26 10:37:54 <DocScrutinizer> quite strange. What happened to it?
May 26 10:38:07 <chem|st> grml
May 26 10:38:21 <DocScrutinizer> maybe the foil/protector is the cause of the problem?
May 26 10:38:31 <DocScrutinizer> not unusual
May 26 10:39:05 <chem|st> log sent
May 26 10:39:17 <Shapeshifter> if I press on the left or bottom parts of the screen, the cursor is all jumpy, as if I were tapping with another stylus somewhere in the middle if the screen. It's like jumping left/right rapidly
May 26 10:39:24 <chem|st> got two emails... as usual I did't attach teh file at first...
May 26 10:39:45 <DocScrutinizer> chem|st: ;-D
May 26 10:39:53 <DocScrutinizer> waiting for #2
May 26 10:40:00 <Shapeshifter> If I then really do tap on the right side, it 'stabilizes' between the two spots and then it's fine for a short while before jumping around again
May 26 10:40:06 <chem|st> already sent
May 26 10:40:10 <javispedro> sadly, ich spreche kein Deutsch...
May 26 10:40:27 <chem|st> javispedro: thats not a problem most of the germans don't either
May 26 10:40:34 <DocScrutinizer> Shapeshifter: that may easily be caused by protector
May 26 10:40:56 <DocScrutinizer> javispedro: stylus?
May 26 10:40:56 <Shapeshifter> I'll take it off when I get home
May 26 10:41:07 <chem|st> Shapeshifter: have you tried without foil and recalibrate?
May 26 10:41:28 <Shapeshifter> chem|st: will try back home
May 26 10:41:29 <DocScrutinizer> chem|st: don't recalibrate
May 26 10:41:39 <lardman> Shapeshifter: mine went like that, eventually I could press in one place and it would randomly register a touch elsewhere, then it failed ocmpletely
May 26 10:41:44 <DocScrutinizer> the symptoms are not like offset
May 26 10:42:01 <chem|st> DocScrutinizer: I get an (recogniyable) offset after about 15 days
May 26 10:42:05 <Shapeshifter> lardman: awesome
May 26 10:42:21 <lardman> back it up now, very hard with no TS
May 26 10:42:24 <chem|st> DocScrutinizer: the recalibration resets the resistance table
May 26 10:42:24 <DocScrutinizer> chem|st: those symptoms are different though
May 26 10:42:34 <chem|st> afair
May 26 10:42:36 <DocScrutinizer> umm, fair enough
May 26 10:42:50 <DocScrutinizer> #2 :-)
May 26 10:42:58 <chem|st> so if the file got currupted somehow that may work
May 26 10:44:52 <DocScrutinizer> yup, but honestly I doubt. Either the protector is applying some tension so outer plane gets bent, or separator oil oxidized/deteriorated by protector glue solvent diffusing thru plane into oil
May 26 10:45:04 <chem|st> sometimes I'd love to have a little reset button for the hardware layer...
May 26 10:45:19 <javispedro> total cost for 3 stylus pack plus versandkosten = 24€
May 26 10:45:22 * javispedro goes look ebay
May 26 10:45:38 <chem|st> oh they still use glue on those screenprotectors?
May 26 10:45:42 <DocScrutinizer> javispedro: indeed, they cost more than gold, literally
May 26 10:46:00 <DocScrutinizer> chem|st: dunno Shapeshifter 's protector
May 26 10:46:11 <chem|st> that is highly known to damage touchscreens especially the cheap ones from china/taiwan/korea
May 26 10:46:59 <chem|st> javispedro: ehrm found a single one once for 6€
May 26 10:47:37 <DocScrutinizer> possibly they are more cheap at nokia repair ;-)
May 26 10:47:48 <javispedro> I'm pondering wheter to ask them
May 26 10:47:52 <javispedro> maybe they're in a good mood
May 26 10:48:22 <javispedro> hm... will ask and see what happens.
May 26 10:48:22 <chem|st> javispedro: http://www.saremi-mobilfunk.de/product_info.php/info/p4645_Original-Nokia-N900-Stylus-Pen-3pcs.html
May 26 10:48:25 <chem|st> 14€
May 26 10:48:34 <javispedro> chem|st: plus shipping costs / versandkosten
May 26 10:48:37 <javispedro> = 24€
May 26 10:48:47 <javispedro> also VAT
May 26 10:48:48 <chem|st> 10€ shipping?
May 26 10:48:49 <DocScrutinizer> just *sometimes* manufacturers surprise you. E.G. I sometimes get manuals for free while everybody else is charging $$ for a cheap copy
May 26 10:49:17 <chem|st> javispedro: was it at saremi you where looking?
May 26 10:49:22 <javispedro> chem|st: yep
May 26 10:49:25 <chem|st> javispedro: where are you at?
May 26 10:49:35 <DocScrutinizer> spain
May 26 10:49:56 <DocScrutinizer> still insane
May 26 10:50:03 <javispedro> yep, for some reason  I can't copy the URL of the page listing shipping costs
May 26 10:50:15 <javispedro> stupid browser
May 26 10:50:16 <DocScrutinizer> they might send as standard letter, for 55€ct
May 26 10:51:04 <DocScrutinizer> 10€ is clearly prohibition
May 26 10:51:28 <DocScrutinizer> for 3 plastic stick a` 1g each
May 26 10:51:44 <chem|st> 8.90€ to spain
May 26 10:51:52 <javispedro> chem|st: remember VAT
May 26 10:51:57 <javispedro> aka taxes
May 26 10:52:03 <DocScrutinizer> insane
May 26 10:52:06 <chem|st> thats EU no VAT
May 26 10:52:18 <dangergrrl> i found N900 stylus here in the states for $7.99 for 2
May 26 10:52:20 <DocScrutinizer> javispedro: I might get them for you and send via surface mail
May 26 10:52:24 <javispedro> chem|st: oh yes, 19%
May 26 10:52:32 <chem|st> the 19% are included
May 26 10:52:39 <chem|st> inkl. 19 % MwSt.
May 26 10:52:44 <chem|st> it reads
May 26 10:53:24 <ShadowJK> chem|st, what kind of errors?
May 26 10:53:34 <dangergrrl> they will ship international via postal service
May 26 10:53:37 <javispedro> so, 23.79€, not 24€ =)
May 26 10:53:37 <dangergrrl> http://www.mangowalk.com/index.php?sku=65052
May 26 10:53:47 <chem|st> ShadowJK: i2cget some line ~167
May 26 10:53:53 <dangergrrl> probably have to pay VAT in europe
May 26 10:54:19 <chem|st> i2cset comamnd not found is the first
May 26 10:54:19 <dangergrrl> (I lost my stylus too so i looked)
May 26 10:54:29 <DocScrutinizer> chem|st: huh?
May 26 10:54:31 <chem|st> ShadowJK: i2cset it is
May 26 10:54:38 <chem|st> line 197
May 26 10:54:50 <DocScrutinizer> charger script?
May 26 10:54:55 <chem|st> jep
May 26 10:55:02 <DocScrutinizer> check $PATH
May 26 10:55:17 <DocScrutinizer> find where your I2C* are located
May 26 10:55:47 <DocScrutinizer> generally you never should rely on $PATH in scripts
May 26 10:55:58 <DocScrutinizer> always use FQN
May 26 10:56:04 <chem|st> well my path is full of everything wher usual programs are..
May 26 10:56:33 <DocScrutinizer> YOUR path, but maybe not script's path ;-)
May 26 10:57:13 <chem|st> so the script has to be where my I2C is at?!
May 26 10:57:47 <chem|st> find for i2c* does not find any but your i2cget script
May 26 10:57:48 <DocScrutinizer> generally a good idea to do `I2CGET=/usr/local/sbin/i2cget`
May 26 10:58:12 <DocScrutinizer> so you haven't installed i2ctools pkg
May 26 10:58:21 <DocScrutinizer> neither h-e-n ;-)
May 26 10:58:25 <chem|st> nope
May 26 10:58:31 <DocScrutinizer> nor backupmenu
May 26 10:58:34 <chem|st> what for do I need h-e-n?
May 26 10:58:40 <chem|st> or backupmenu
May 26 10:58:50 <DocScrutinizer> dunno
May 26 10:58:59 <chem|st> a descent rsync script does my backups
May 26 10:59:09 <DocScrutinizer> you anyway need i2ctools nevertheless, for charger script
May 26 10:59:13 <Shapeshifter> mhhh. seems like it was the scrren protector. I ran some tests in mypaint drawing straight lines and it got worse and worse, now I took it off and everything is fine. And not a scratch on the display. It's so nice and smooth ;) I should probably get a new protector...
May 26 10:59:24 <Shapeshifter> The old one looked like crap after these odd 15 months
May 26 10:59:41 <chem|st> the i2ctools is in devel right?
May 26 10:59:46 <DocScrutinizer> yep
May 26 10:59:55 <DocScrutinizer> Shapeshifter: \o/
May 26 11:00:23 <Shapeshifter> DocScrutinizer: you're not using a protector, right?
May 26 11:00:33 <chem|st> Shapeshifter: 15 month without protector... no scratch
May 26 11:00:39 * DocScrutinizer asks for his sacrificed goat
May 26 11:00:47 <Shapeshifter> DocScrutinizer: heh
May 26 11:00:57 <chem|st> DocScrutinizer: I prefer sheep!
May 26 11:00:58 <DocScrutinizer> Shapeshifter: right, on N900 I don't
May 26 11:01:39 <Shapeshifter> chem|st: well I _am_ careful with the thing as hell but even just the stylus scratched the foil a couple of times because some dust particle got trapped on the stylus tip or so
May 26 11:01:42 <chem|st> javispedro: should we order some and ship you?
May 26 11:01:50 <Shapeshifter> how do you manage to not scratch it
May 26 11:02:26 <javispedro> chem|st: na, going to ask to nokia care
May 26 11:02:29 <Creteil> Nokia N900 resurection :-) :
May 26 11:02:31 <Creteil> http://www.crunchgear.com/2011/05/25/kingmax-introduces-worlds-first-64gb-microsd-card/
May 26 11:02:33 <javispedro> the guy was very friendly last time
May 26 11:02:46 <javispedro> let's see if they make me a reasonable price.
May 26 11:02:57 <chem|st> Shapeshifter: those scratches I got too but you cannot see them if not looked at the device in 48° sun:64° eyes correlaion
May 26 11:03:08 <DocScrutinizer> Shapeshifter: oh, I actually got a scratch cat 2 when some sharp dust was on my fingernail, plus several microscars that are hardly to spot even with mag glass
May 26 11:03:12 <Shapeshifter> meh I have good eyes
May 26 11:03:21 <DocScrutinizer> me too
May 26 11:04:01 <DocScrutinizer> you can't see either of those scars without a lightsource reflecting on panel in right angle
May 26 11:04:18 <chem|st> Shapeshifter: that is not the problem... the thing is that I can only guess where they are as fingerprints are more of an issue...
May 26 11:04:53 <DocScrutinizer> I hardly ever have fingerprints as I usually use nails
May 26 11:05:01 <Shapeshifter> I guess I'll risk it and just buy a spare touch screen just in case
May 26 11:05:20 <DocScrutinizer> but don't ask what panel looks like after a phonecall ;-P
May 26 11:05:24 <Shapeshifter> now that it's over a year old I guess I'm not overprotective anymore
May 26 11:05:29 <Shapeshifter> heh
May 26 11:05:37 <chem|st> DocScrutinizer: +1
May 26 11:06:04 <Shapeshifter> I was thinking about improving the stylus
May 26 11:06:11 <Shapeshifter> it's not super polished
May 26 11:06:23 <chem|st> Shapeshifter: new screen isn't that expensive although I would buy a new device after warranty anyways (mean new n900)
May 26 11:06:33 <Shapeshifter> ah
May 26 11:06:44 <DocScrutinizer> in fact I thought that would be the only property of stylus that justifies the price
May 26 11:06:48 <Shapeshifter> chem|st: why? hardware seems pretty sturdy
May 26 11:07:00 <chem|st> ?
May 26 11:07:03 <javispedro> DocScrutinizer: it's my worst fear about buying a cheap chinese one
May 26 11:07:11 <javispedro> well, apart from it not even fitting in the n900 slot.
May 26 11:07:30 <Shapeshifter> chem|st: I mean, what good is warranty if the device is sturdy and replacement parts are available
May 26 11:07:37 <chem|st> what for do I need a pentacore 4GB ram 4TBssd phone?
May 26 11:07:52 <javispedro> omg 4TB porn
May 26 11:08:25 <chem|st> there is no need to mirror my desktop to my phone...
May 26 11:08:27 <Shapeshifter> I would enjoy faster browing and faster multitasking. though IO really seems to be the killer bottleneck on the n900
May 26 11:08:42 <DocScrutinizer> chem|st: though SpeedEvil did
May 26 11:08:42 <nid0> tbh, if you had a pentacore phone with that kind of memory and storage
May 26 11:08:45 <nid0> why have a desktop?
May 26 11:09:00 <chem|st> DocScrutinizer: 32GB hdd in his desktop?
May 26 11:09:09 <DocScrutinizer> hehe same here
May 26 11:09:18 <Lynoure> nid0: keyboard and large screen is nice.
May 26 11:09:23 <DocScrutinizer> my home partitions is like 20, root like 14
May 26 11:09:31 <Lynoure> nid0: as the phone does not do mindreading yet :)
May 26 11:09:34 * Shapeshifter loves his SSD...
May 26 11:09:42 <DocScrutinizer> then there's that C and D carp
May 26 11:09:48 <chem|st> nid0: because of the fermi-graphics in my desktop
May 26 11:09:52 <nid0> Lynoure: you can plug keyboards and large screens into most phones.
May 26 11:10:24 <DocScrutinizer> (C / D) which more and more becomes a PITA
May 26 11:10:41 <Lynoure> nid0: give me a docking station, sure, the phone would then be my desktop
May 26 11:10:42 <DocScrutinizer> well, the 60GB disk is kinda obsolete anyway
May 26 11:10:50 <chem|st> DocScrutinizer: system is 20 in sum then there is 160 home and 2TB crypt
May 26 11:11:23 <DocScrutinizer> hey, this is a dirt cheap fujiSie esprimo
May 26 11:11:40 <DocScrutinizer> like 4 y old
May 26 11:12:47 <DocScrutinizer> got a 160 usb
May 26 11:12:54 <DocScrutinizer> for backups
May 26 11:13:16 <chem|st> if I manage to afford a 1TB 2.5" sata I may have another 160gb usb...
May 26 11:13:48 <Lynoure> nid0: but currently the phones fall far short of that. :)
May 26 11:14:15 <chem|st> my netbook got 160gb more than enough, BUT to mirror my desktop... I would need 1TB at least
May 26 11:15:06 <DocScrutinizer> meh, your 'netbook' seems better than my main PC (which is this laptop)
May 26 11:15:57 <chem|st> I want a TX100
May 26 11:15:59 <DocScrutinizer> well, I don't do mp3 collect-the-world or dl of whole films except for an occasional DrHouse
May 26 11:16:45 <chem|st> my mp3 collection is not that big but I started to collect old series like GIS SAC
May 26 11:17:26 <DocScrutinizer> I usually stream movies
May 26 11:17:33 <chem|st> to force my kids some day to watch the "good'ol"
May 26 11:18:06 <DocScrutinizer> if I do at all
May 26 11:18:25 <DocScrutinizer> (this LCD is a PITA, esp the SIS graca)
May 26 11:19:11 <DocScrutinizer> so if I watch movies, I stream to N900 linked to my TV ;-)
May 26 11:20:33 <DocScrutinizer> I kinda hate the quality, but it's magnitudes better than on this laptop junk
May 26 11:22:51 <DocScrutinizer> SiS968 [MuTIOL Media IO] (rev 01)  <--- don't even consider to use this pile of silicon crap for watching movies!
May 26 11:24:04 <DocScrutinizer> esp not when screen is 1280*800 but driver can't do beter than *768 with interpolation
May 26 11:24:19 <chem|st> my netbook renders 720p just fine, and that is mostly cpu afaik
May 26 11:24:33 <chem|st> ouch
May 26 11:24:45 <DocScrutinizer> there's no X driver for this fsckng chip
May 26 11:25:48 <DocScrutinizer> tink it's VESA
May 26 11:25:57 <DocScrutinizer> or HERCULEs ;-)
May 26 11:27:44 <dangergrrl> are there still hercules drivers in X?
May 26 11:27:52 <robbiethe1st> Probably
May 26 11:28:12 <dangergrrl> do any old hercules cards still function? :)
May 26 11:28:35 <robbiethe1st> Yes. Not on modern hardware, no... but there's a few still out there
May 26 11:28:43 <robbiethe1st> Along with everything else of that vintage
May 26 11:31:59 <dangergrrl> i suppose i was using one until 1993
May 26 11:32:26 <DocScrutinizer> where's that friggin XORG startup log?
May 26 11:32:43 <dangergrrl> are there are still pdp-11Å› functioning from the 1970s
May 26 11:32:52 <dangergrrl> and there are
May 26 11:33:02 <dangergrrl> as if my typing did not suck
May 26 11:33:06 <jaska> *shrug* i did break into a pdp-11 during a security checkup in the late 90s
May 26 11:33:11 <jaska> dunno if its still there
May 26 11:33:47 <jaska> was controlling some manufacturing gear
May 26 11:33:51 <dangergrrl> i still remember some default passwords on some vintage equipment
May 26 11:34:07 <jaska> rsx-11m
May 26 11:34:45 <DocScrutinizer> hah, probably my first PDP11 been the one 1990-- at university I contacted via datex-p dialup and found the guest account had kinda root rights
May 26 11:34:50 <dangergrrl> old vms had systest/uetp
May 26 11:35:06 <jaska> sounds like ancient vms
May 26 11:35:53 <dangergrrl> 1983 or so
May 26 11:36:27 <javispedro> DocScrutinizer: have you ever seen bme rebooting if battery fails to charge in N time?
May 26 11:36:36 <chem|st> dangergrrl: and I got one of those just next door
May 26 11:36:39 <DocScrutinizer> err nope
May 26 11:37:14 <DocScrutinizer> javispedro: but I guess dsme will reboot when bme segfaults N times due to bq27200.ko modprobed
May 26 11:38:25 <DocScrutinizer> javispedro: elaborate pls
May 26 11:38:55 <javispedro> just pondering due to a recent tmo message
May 26 11:38:55 <DocScrutinizer> javispedro: you told me about that, on diablo
May 26 11:38:59 <javispedro> yep
May 26 11:39:03 <dangergrrl> chem|st: i just like to play with simh sometimes when i am bored
May 26 11:39:04 <javispedro> that's why I am interested.
May 26 11:39:21 <DocScrutinizer> never looked into my diablo bme
May 26 11:39:27 <DocScrutinizer> it's baeh
May 26 11:39:40 <javispedro> but the question was about the n900 one, due to http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?p=1014031
May 26 11:40:25 <DocScrutinizer> \o/ we're at >10^6 posts at TMO - omfg
May 26 11:40:34 <javispedro> I would have expected to reboot endlessly
May 26 11:40:44 <javispedro> but seems that the n900 one doesn't share that behaviour
May 26 11:40:59 <javispedro> hehe
May 26 11:41:09 <dangergrrl> must be naptime, the sun is up here
May 26 11:42:23 <dangergrrl> btw, installing the SDK with the ¨Manual¨ instructions is working well for me thanks for saying the gui was garbage :)
May 26 11:43:06 <javispedro> imho all installers are garbage, /me always installs sb1 first then all targets one by one
May 26 11:43:28 <javispedro> this way I can still install chinook and diablo targets on recent sb1 =)
May 26 11:45:19 <dangergrrl> restarting with rootstrap because apt failed on 1 out of 450 files is nuts
May 26 11:49:12 * DocScrutinizer wonders if MohammadAG will fix that wiki page, to deprecate the pyscript installer hoax
May 26 11:49:56 <DocScrutinizer> I'd guess it caused an economic damage of some tenthousands of $ til now
May 26 11:50:55 <DocScrutinizer> assuming an average wages/h for poor trapped users of like 30$
May 26 11:57:01 <DocScrutinizer> not taking into account any damage done to reputation, CR, and all the devels in spe repelled
May 26 11:58:14 <DocScrutinizer> that's a mere bold abomination
May 26 11:58:48 <DocScrutinizer> a mean prank on users of that wiki intruction
May 26 11:59:40 <DocScrutinizer> darn, we had like 5 requests for help with exactly this shit, during last 2 days
May 26 12:00:07 <DocScrutinizer> ~maemosdk
May 26 12:00:08 <infobot> hmm... maemosdk is http://wiki.maemo.org/Documentation/Maemo5_Final_Installation
May 26 12:02:12 <SpeedEvil> chem|st: I have - typically - a 16G / - this means I can back it up easily.
May 26 12:13:20 <chem|st> SpeedEvil: backups are collected from several machines so a 16g pendrive is not an option
May 26 13:06:41 <ShadowJK> I guess I should add a check for i2c utils :)
May 26 13:28:11 <Volvagia356> alright
May 26 13:28:56 <Volvagia356> I'm have NITDroid on my N900 (eMMC), I want to overclock Maemo, can I just install titan's kernel or is there some thing else I should do?
May 26 13:31:42 <chem|st> DocScrutinizer: would you mind to add the Overclocking  to the last bit of the topic?
May 26 13:31:44 <psycho_oreos> titan's power kernel should be enough for starter
May 26 13:32:22 * psycho_oreos waits for a user to complain a dead device after excessively overclocking
May 26 13:32:35 <DocScrutinizer> ~omapoc
May 26 13:32:41 <DocScrutinizer> ~omap-oc
May 26 13:32:42 <infobot> rumour has it, omap-oc is http://mg.pov.lt/maemo-irclog/%23maemo.2010-08-01.log.html#t2010-08-01T22:16:05  read that!, or and this http://mg.pov.lt/maemo-irclog/%23maemo.2011-03-11.log.html#t2011-03-11T03:04:11
May 26 13:33:30 <DocScrutinizer> psycho_oreos: duh, you need even more of those reports?
May 26 13:33:39 <Volvagia356> so installing titan's kernel won't affect multiboot?
May 26 13:33:49 <DocScrutinizer>  /topic
May 26 13:34:02 <psycho_oreos> DocScrutinizer, I was hoping to see it realtime this time :)
May 26 13:34:09 <DocScrutinizer> hehe
May 26 13:34:28 <psycho_oreos> `ZOMG! my N900 is dead!!! help!!!!!11!1!!!'
May 26 13:34:31 <psycho_oreos> :)
May 26 13:35:04 <DocScrutinizer> so go ahead, tell Volvagia356 how to oc to 1.2GHz and then do video playback while on host-mode and maemo-hotspot
May 26 13:35:57 <DocScrutinizer> don't forget to take pictures when LiIon cell explodes :-P
May 26 13:36:06 <Volvagia356> ==;
May 26 13:36:35 * psycho_oreos isn't keen on guiding someone too far in on overclocking knowing that he never overclocked his N900 and has a pair working just lovely @ 600MHz
May 26 13:36:36 <chem|st> DocScrutinizer: love the one where BCMM says "not-on-fire way"
May 26 13:37:04 <psycho_oreos> probably burnt plastic smell :D hazardous too
May 26 13:39:05 <DocScrutinizer> so probably best thing we can do is to tell Volvagia356 to simply install PK, then when he comes back complaining about no-more-booting_nuttin-helps point him to topic
May 26 13:39:59 <DocScrutinizer> Volvagia356: sorry, some of us are fed up with some particular topics
May 26 13:40:41 <DocScrutinizer> not really planning to play evil pranks on you
May 26 13:41:05 <Volvagia356> I see
May 26 13:41:55 <DocScrutinizer> we're just angry about the OC fanbois that have no clue but claim 'it's safe', and also we are angry on nitdroid guys for using multiboot which is a stinking pile of sh***
May 26 13:42:43 <DocScrutinizer> you were unlucky to mention both buzzwords in just one question ;-)
May 26 13:44:13 * dashavoo tries not to laugh out loud in the office
May 26 13:44:25 <Lantizia> DocScrutinizer, ah but is there a uboot method for nitdroid yet?
May 26 13:44:31 <DocScrutinizer> no
May 26 13:44:47 <DocScrutinizer> nitdridiot dudes just don't care
May 26 13:44:47 <psycho_oreos> probably not publicly available
May 26 13:45:07 <DocScrutinizer> afaik
May 26 13:45:22 <chem|st> afaicare...
May 26 13:45:31 <DocScrutinizer> indeed
May 26 13:46:04 <Volvagia356> so OCing is generally not recommended?
May 26 13:46:25 <chem|st> Volvagia356: nope
May 26 13:46:34 <DocScrutinizer> my standard advice: if you're interested in android, get a dedicated device. Works way better than N900-nitdroid and is probably really cheap
May 26 13:46:55 <chem|st> and gets less updates than n900...
May 26 13:47:13 <chem|st> 84% of sold droids ever got updates
May 26 13:47:22 <chem|st> n*ever
May 26 13:47:52 <DocScrutinizer> /join #android
May 26 13:48:33 <Volvagia356> I see
May 26 13:49:28 <DocScrutinizer> there's also #nitdroid afaik
May 26 13:49:43 <DocScrutinizer> anyway this is #maemo
May 26 13:50:03 <dashavoo> The latest power-kernel did weird things to my N900 (as being as we are vaguely on the topic)... the "turn on device" option after my alarm clock went off stopped turning the phone on
May 26 13:50:13 <DocScrutinizer> we might accept occasional excursions to meego
May 26 13:50:28 <dashavoo> I thought I was just experiencing early morning brain-fails the first few days it happened
May 26 13:51:20 <DocScrutinizer> dashavoo: good find, get someone to confirm it, then open a ticker on bugtraq
May 26 13:51:36 <DocScrutinizer> ticket even
May 26 13:52:04 <merlin1991> DocScrutinizer: were you the one with uboot and kernelpower?
May 26 13:52:12 <DocScrutinizer> dunno who's maintaining PK now
May 26 13:52:25 <DocScrutinizer> I got this combination, yes
May 26 13:52:48 <DocScrutinizer> merlin1991: why?
May 26 13:52:59 <merlin1991> got a fresh microsd here
May 26 13:53:04 <merlin1991> wanna try meego with uboot
May 26 13:53:07 <merlin1991> but have powerkernel
May 26 13:53:11 <DocScrutinizer> np
May 26 13:53:19 <merlin1991> so how did you do it?
May 26 13:53:21 <DocScrutinizer> get MohammadAG 's pk+uboot pkg
May 26 13:53:45 <DocScrutinizer> should be in extras-devel
May 26 13:54:09 <Lantizia> MohammadAG, you know you said paid for ovi packages are on a diff server? is that still an apt repo - can it be used with http auth perhaps (ovi login details)
May 26 13:54:13 <DocScrutinizer> it's pk46, but who cares (see dashavoo above ;-D )
May 26 13:56:24 <Lantizia> Hey I've got the flashlight-applet installed but it doesn't show up on the drop down (the one with clock, internet, profile, bluetooth etc)
May 26 13:56:36 <merlin1991> DocScrutinizer: I'm using the modified powerkernel for the wifi driver, guess I'll have to get MohammadAG to tell me how he did his uboot 46 pkg
May 26 13:57:03 <DocScrutinizer> yep
May 26 13:57:34 <DocScrutinizer> should be documented around / next to uBoot though - possibly meego wiki
May 26 13:57:58 <merlin1991> i looked at uboot source
May 26 13:58:00 <merlin1991> nothing there
May 26 13:58:08 <merlin1991> meego wiki neither
May 26 13:58:08 <Lantizia> nvm i'm being dense
May 26 13:58:20 <DocScrutinizer> it's most probably not really related to source
May 26 13:58:32 <merlin1991> well I hoped to find stuff in the readme :D
May 26 13:58:47 <Volvagia356> so, anything else I should know?
May 26 13:58:49 <DocScrutinizer> indeed
May 26 13:58:51 <merlin1991> btw yay for Mohammads description of the uboot pkg
May 26 13:59:13 <DocScrutinizer> mehehe
May 26 13:59:32 <DocScrutinizer> cat hater?
May 26 13:59:33 <merlin1991> DO NOT USE THIS UNLESS YOU KNOW WHAT YOU ARE DOING. RISK OF REBOOT LOOPS! MAY EAT YOUR BRAIN
May 26 13:59:42 <DocScrutinizer> aaah
May 26 14:00:23 <DocScrutinizer> Volvagia356: nothing comes to mind
May 26 14:00:41 <merlin1991> now it's time to see if I can extract enough info from regular uboot power uboot and other docs todo hacked power uboot :D
May 26 14:00:59 <DocScrutinizer> Volvagia356: except maybe to mention the really cool stuff is happening in CSSU nowadays
May 26 14:01:21 <merlin1991> DocScrutinizer: what do you think about uploading the wifi modules to -devel
May 26 14:01:38 <merlin1991> the latest power kernel does include the kernel side stuff but not the modules
May 26 14:01:46 <DocScrutinizer> lxp or what's been his nick promised to do that, no?
May 26 14:02:05 <DocScrutinizer> merlin1991: go ahead
May 26 14:02:39 <merlin1991> afaik in the tmo thread the new maintainer said he's not going todo the modules but included the kernel side stuff
May 26 14:03:09 <Volvagia356> I'm not sure if it's possible, but is it possible to force the system so that the back cover is always attatched and the camera slider is always open?
May 26 14:03:10 <DocScrutinizer> new maintainer of PK, yeah
May 26 14:03:42 <edheldil> Could the process of pushing packages to extras be enhanced with request for more descriptive descriptions? :)
May 26 14:03:52 <DocScrutinizer> Volvagia356: whatever that means, the answer is: basically no, but on linux everything is 'possible'
May 26 14:04:19 <DocScrutinizer> edheldil: possibly
May 26 14:04:39 <psycho_oreos> there's a hardware hack for that, check mugen's battery cover for N900, it doesn't have camera slider and makes N900 look more slightly bulky
May 26 14:05:05 <Volvagia356> here's what happened
May 26 14:05:12 <Volvagia356> the magnet is gone
May 26 14:05:18 <DocScrutinizer> eew
May 26 14:05:28 <edheldil> Lantizia:  open lens cover and close photo app first
May 26 14:06:05 <Volvagia356> I've put my own magnet in there, it works
May 26 14:06:07 <Lantizia> edheldil, yeah i figured that out :) hence... <Lantizia> nvm i'm being dense
May 26 14:06:16 <b0unc3> hello
May 26 14:06:21 * DocScrutinizer considers to get proper spare magnets and sell those
May 26 14:06:23 <Lantizia> edheldil, don't suppose there's a way of stopping the camera app from autostarting?
May 26 14:06:26 <Volvagia356> however, the sensor won't detect the camera slider openning unless I shine a laser into it (the sensor)
May 26 14:06:29 <merlin1991> anoyone got the link to the tmo thread for the 47 pk, can't find it with search
May 26 14:06:53 <DocScrutinizer> Volvagia356: wut?
May 26 14:06:59 <DocScrutinizer> strange
May 26 14:06:59 <Volvagia356> yeah, pretty odd case
May 26 14:07:14 <DocScrutinizer> check your black/white thing attached to cam slider
May 26 14:07:17 <Volvagia356> it's there
May 26 14:07:23 <Volvagia356> it's a used unit by the way
May 26 14:07:26 <DocScrutinizer> clean sensor
May 26 14:07:35 <Volvagia356> it looks as if someone used a knife and pryed out the magnet
May 26 14:07:39 <b0unc3> I'm trying to build a qml app that loads images from network and build a listview, but I'm getting this error: QObject::connect: Cannot queue arguments of type 'QNetworkConfigurationPrivatePointer'
May 26 14:07:43 <b0unc3> (Make sure 'QNetworkConfigurationPrivatePointer' is registered using qRegisterMetaType().)
May 26 14:08:33 <edheldil> Lantizia:  when something is already using the camera, the camera app does not start. Does not help with flashlight, though :)
May 26 14:08:52 <DocScrutinizer> Volvagia356: make sure your replacement magnet doesn't interfere with sensor (they are really close to each other
May 26 14:08:53 <DocScrutinizer> )
May 26 14:09:17 <DocScrutinizer> some "transparent" scotch tape might suffice to spoil things
May 26 14:11:18 <merlin1991> ffs where's that tmo thread about the new kernel power, I need to find the dev / his email
May 26 14:11:20 <DocScrutinizer> and, as suggested, clean the sensor carefully with some q-tip or similar
May 26 14:11:37 <Volvagia356> I see
May 26 14:11:59 <DocScrutinizer> gently
May 26 14:12:46 <Volvagia356> that's kinda obvious
May 26 14:15:40 <DocScrutinizer> Volvagia356: if you got a second IR sensitive camera, you also could check sensor for emitting short IR strobes
May 26 14:16:09 <Volvagia356> ah, I didn't know that
May 26 14:18:02 <DocScrutinizer> kinda similar to that: http://share.ovi.com/media/joerg900.public/joerg900.10033
May 26 14:19:01 <DocScrutinizer> (though I failed with N900 cam for the proxy sensor, other used better cams and were able to tell proxy is flashing like 5/s)
May 26 14:19:30 <DocScrutinizer> the camslide seens same type of sensor as proxy
May 26 14:20:11 <Volvagia356> I can see the IR light from the proximity sensor, but not the camera slider sensor
May 26 14:21:15 <DocScrutinizer> then odds are it's broken
May 26 14:22:28 <DocScrutinizer> I seem to recall PR1.0 had that funny detail to open up camera whn you removed back cover and placed device on a bright surface
May 26 14:22:39 <SpeedEvil> US warranties suck.
May 26 14:22:41 <SpeedEvil> EU++
May 26 14:23:47 <DocScrutinizer> maybe first owner had those issues when magnet got lost, or - even worse - thought sensor needs cleaning/messing when camera didn't start on door-open when magnet been gone. So that might explain why sensor is broken
May 26 14:24:13 <arvut> I just had the most awesome quad espresso, with 85% chocolate and orange juice. effin sweet munchies that is.
May 26 14:24:52 <DocScrutinizer> first owner killed it, in an attempt to fix things
May 26 14:26:06 <DocScrutinizer> the knife traces where magnet supposed to be suggest the first owner did some nasty attempts to fix sth
May 26 14:26:48 <DocScrutinizer> nasty clueless attempts
May 26 14:27:38 <DocScrutinizer> well, you *might* be able to patch camera-ui to ignore state of cam-door
May 26 14:28:01 <Volvagia356> the problem is not camera-ui
May 26 14:28:08 <DocScrutinizer> or, try the FOSS camera-ui replacement
May 26 14:28:10 <Volvagia356> that can be solved by removing the back cover
May 26 14:28:27 <DocScrutinizer> so what else is the problem?
May 26 14:29:07 <Volvagia356> other apps
May 26 14:29:15 <Volvagia356> that insist on the camera slider being open
May 26 14:29:16 <DocScrutinizer> you said you fixed the magnet with a replacement, and your camdoor sensor seems broken
May 26 14:29:27 <DocScrutinizer> mhm
May 26 14:29:30 <DocScrutinizer> yeah
May 26 14:30:11 <DocScrutinizer> you could probably patch those as well
May 26 14:30:35 <Volvagia356> too bad my programming experience is limited to PHP
May 26 14:30:53 <DocScrutinizer> there's for sure some string in those apps that tells about /sys/foo/bar/GPIO/switches/camdoor/state or similar
May 26 14:31:35 <DocScrutinizer> sys and state is confirmed, rest is made up by me
May 26 14:32:00 <DocScrutinizer> it's the sysnode telling about state of camdoor
May 26 14:32:43 <DocScrutinizer> patch that string to point to sth that returns "open" or "1" (whatever state says usually)
May 26 14:33:33 <DocScrutinizer> e.g. replace sys by szz, and create a stack of directories with a file named state at the end, which has "open" in it
May 26 14:34:27 <DocScrutinizer> lsof|grep <yourapp> might help
May 26 14:35:25 <DocScrutinizer> then open the binary with a hex editor, and search for the "sys/....../state" string, edit it, store
May 26 14:35:58 <DocScrutinizer> don't change length of string!
May 26 14:36:34 <DocScrutinizer> might or might not pan out
May 26 14:37:14 <DocScrutinizer> of course if you got the source of <yourapp> then it's way simpler
May 26 14:37:49 <psycho_oreos> merlin1991, http://forums.internettablettalk.com/showthread.php?t=71879
May 26 14:37:54 <Volvagia356> I see, thanks
May 26 14:38:09 <DocScrutinizer> you also could decide to patch the kernel to deliver whatever you like in that particular sysnode, but that's kinda tedious
May 26 14:38:18 <merlin1991> thanks psycho_oreos
May 26 14:38:58 <psycho_oreos> merlin1991, just be warned there's some issues with this unofficial kernel
May 26 14:39:14 <DocScrutinizer> or, a really strange and weird idea: send device to nokia repair (or another qualified repair shop)
May 26 14:39:35 <DocScrutinizer> get it fixed
May 26 14:40:19 * DocScrutinizer scrolls back to reread that comment about mugen backdoor
May 26 14:41:49 <Volvagia356> I guess he means this http://www.mugen-power-batteries.com/nokia/nokia-n900/mugen-power-nokia-n900-2400mah-extended-replacement-battery-with-battery-door.html
May 26 14:42:14 <DocScrutinizer> hmm that hardware hack most likely is a magnet and a white patch of sticky tape
May 26 14:42:22 <DocScrutinizer> won't help with broken sensor
May 26 14:43:35 <DocScrutinizer> I thought newer mugen back covers have a "switch" for camdoor?
May 26 14:44:25 <DocScrutinizer> as those clowns not even realized the problem with their first version, and had to replace all the 1st-gen covers
May 26 14:46:00 <psycho_oreos> there's an on/off switch on the back from that picture
May 26 14:46:20 <DocScrutinizer> mhm, so that's V2
May 26 14:47:07 <psycho_oreos> yup, it even says its redesigned back-cover
May 26 14:47:59 <DocScrutinizer> >>UPDATE: Comes with new re-designed back cover! microSD and Camera works!<<
May 26 14:48:08 <DocScrutinizer> yeah
May 26 14:48:10 <psycho_oreos> looks a lot better than v1, v1 with N900 looked like an old fat remote
May 26 14:48:45 <DocScrutinizer> I don't like the price
May 26 14:53:46 <psycho_oreos> that also includes the battery, supposedly you can get it without the battery: http://forums.internettablettalk.com/showpost.php?p=872436&postcount=2
May 26 15:00:56 <chem|st> ok got a 300€ spare now... new n900? I wait till n9x if it is capa then I buy another n900!
May 26 15:03:38 <dashavoo> chem|st: I never have money spare, how have you managed that?
May 26 15:05:21 <psycho_oreos> if and when n9x comes out I'll probably purchase it, for now I'm more than happy with a spare N900 that I use for emergencies
May 26 15:09:24 <Lantizia>  http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?p=1016093
May 26 15:09:38 <Lantizia> thought I'd put up my "how to make MyDocs ext3" guide for others
May 26 15:14:54 <chem|st> Lantizia: wiki not TMO pls and then link from tmo to wiki
May 26 15:16:08 <chem|st> but good work!
May 26 15:16:36 <chem|st> if it is in the wiki you dont have to find the thread ever again
May 26 15:17:11 <chem|st> dashavoo: have to pay some things and clean my deposit and then there are 300€ left for fun
May 26 15:17:55 <Itschue> hello can can someone help my device hang up until boot the white screen with NOKIA comes the led lights white and then it shut off
May 26 15:19:34 <chem|st> Itschue: is it charged?
May 26 15:20:07 <chem|st> "device hang up until boot" is not a proper description... please elaborate
May 26 15:20:56 <chem|st> the point you describe is where powermanagement kicks in and if uncharged it just shuts down again
May 26 15:21:32 <Itschue> befor it shut down it has 70% bat load
May 26 15:21:51 <chem|st> Itschue: that doesn't matter, the readings can be wrong
May 26 15:22:25 <chem|st> the driver is more like guessing percentage than actualy telling the truth
May 26 15:22:31 <Lantizia> chem|st, ah ok - will get to that when i get back from the shops bbl
May 26 15:22:42 <chem|st> Lantizia: cool, thanks
May 26 15:23:16 <Itschue> some days ago after installing over fapman device did not work then i flashed it it work but it reboot by itself error was sw_rst then i flash vanilla and combined and it worked but in the night it reboots by itself again(but only one time) and yesterday evening it shutdown by itself
May 26 15:23:27 <chem|st> if you need help setting up proper descriptions and stuff you will find ppl here to help you!
May 26 15:24:05 <chem|st> Itschue: there might be some issue with the battery then
May 26 15:24:20 <chem|st> DocScrutinizer: ShadowJK: your turn ;) ^^
May 26 15:24:21 <Itschue> that was my thougt but im wasnt sure
May 26 15:24:42 <DocScrutinizer> uh?
May 26 15:24:48 <Itschue> yrsterday evening i orderd a new bat and the dt-33
May 26 15:24:49 <chem|st> Itschue: I just reset the battery myself yesterday, wrong readings are pain
May 26 15:24:59 <cehteh> is it somehoe possible to put links to webradio urls on the desktop?
May 26 15:25:28 <Itschue> pls in german
May 26 15:25:57 <chem|st> cehteh: directly no, could do desktop shortcuts...
May 26 15:26:38 <chem|st> cehteh: occasionally or repeatingly used?
May 26 15:26:39 <Itschue> ist mein akku tot? kann man den prüfen
May 26 15:27:11 <chem|st> Itschue: dead no, test yes
May 26 15:27:24 <Itschue> and sure it is the batt?
May 26 15:27:32 <Itschue> test how?
May 26 15:27:32 <DocScrutinizer> rather
May 26 15:27:42 <chem|st> Itschue: no not sure but sounds like my battery
May 26 15:27:47 <Itschue> ok
May 26 15:28:02 <chem|st> if properly charged again you may test some stuff
May 26 15:28:19 <chem|st> s/charged/booted/
May 26 15:28:20 <infobot> chem|st meant: if properly booted again you may test some stuff
May 26 15:28:46 <cehteh> chem|st: i just wonder that there is no "put shortcut on desktop" menu in the mediaplayer
May 26 15:29:08 <chem|st> cehteh: the stuff is all basics, nothing advanced...
May 26 15:29:23 <chem|st> generating playlists is a pain
May 26 15:29:34 <Itschue> my english inst the best  i need a working device to test battery ? or can i test it with a digitalmultimeter
May 26 15:29:38 <chem|st> would love to have playlist shortcuts too
May 26 15:30:03 <cehteh> chem|st: yes but its not present
May 26 15:30:51 <chem|st> Itschue: as long as the device is booting something and shuts down again the battery seems OK but there is hardware in the battery and in the device working together te determine readings
May 26 15:31:16 <Itschue> and these hardware can be brickd?
May 26 15:31:44 <Itschue> yesterday i thougt something goes wrong while flashing and i tried to flash vanilla and i cant flash it
May 26 15:31:53 <cehteh> my cheap 2nd battery just died too .. prolly too much bending in the briefcase
May 26 15:32:11 <cehteh> lost contact or so
May 26 15:32:53 <Itschue> sorry i back laterin aprox 45min
May 26 15:33:39 <chem|st> Itschue: yes but no, the hardware has learning cycles to determine the "real" capacity of your battery, removeing the batt and charging it in between in the first few cycles can affect these logic elements
May 26 15:34:06 <chem|st> bad drivers too
May 26 15:34:28 <chem|st> so I am out for dinner then bye lads
May 26 15:56:37 <Volvagia356> just a question, how did NITDroid end up as a "keyword"?
May 26 16:01:25 <ShadowJK> chem|st, removing the battery for long does for sure reset the hw "fuel gauge" to defaults, which are 2000-ish mAh battery, which is obviously not the case on our N900
May 26 16:01:25 <ShadowJK> bme doesn't use the hw fuel gauge (bq27200) chip though
May 26 16:04:11 <SpeedEvil> http://correlate.googlelabs.com/search?e=n900&e=farmville&t=weekly#
May 26 16:11:11 <CaCO3> Hi DocScrutinizer or cehteh or ShadowJK
May 26 16:11:30 <cehteh> or?
May 26 16:11:49 <CaCO3> well, I am lookin for one of you guys :)
May 26 16:11:57 * cehteh runs
May 26 16:12:23 <CaCO3> ;) dont panic :)
May 26 16:12:38 <CaCO3> I saw a irc log from january 2010, where you guys discussed charging current
May 26 16:12:55 <cehteh> DocScrutinizer is the expert there
May 26 16:12:55 <DocScrutinizer> mhm
May 26 16:13:11 <CaCO3> I am building an external bvattery pack for the usb port. Now, when I shorten the D+, D- line, I get max 450mA
May 26 16:13:23 <CaCO3> do you know how to reach the stated 1.2A?
May 26 16:13:38 <DocScrutinizer> hmm, who's stating 1.2A?
May 26 16:13:54 <cehteh> the charger can deliver 1.2A
May 26 16:13:55 <CaCO3> with 450mA, the charging e3fficiency I calculated is only 66%
May 26 16:14:02 <CaCO3> http://wiki.maemo.org/N900_Hardware_Battery_Charger
May 26 16:14:37 <cehteh> CaCO3: well charge current depends on how full the battery is too
May 26 16:14:38 <DocScrutinizer> we all know that page, but I dunno what's your point
May 26 16:14:46 <cehteh> tried with an empty battery?
May 26 16:15:06 <CaCO3> I supply 5V and only can  charge with 450mA max
May 26 16:15:13 <cehteh> and also what kind of electronics and battery do you use
May 26 16:15:18 <CaCO3> jup, battery at 0%
May 26 16:15:25 <DocScrutinizer> charger limits USB current to 950mA for fastcharging, to treat battery nice
May 26 16:15:42 <cehteh> i soldered a usb cable with D pins shortened recently and it works well
May 26 16:15:44 <CaCO3> the external power device doesnt matter, I also tried a dc svoltage supply
May 26 16:16:08 <cehteh> you shortened them on the device side? :)
May 26 16:16:31 <CaCO3> normaly I use 200 ohms, but tried also shortening them
May 26 16:16:55 <cehteh> yeah shortening them is a hack .. 200ohms or so are speced
May 26 16:17:10 <DocScrutinizer> CaCO3: the charger does a CC/CV charging, that means it won't go above the configured current nor above the configured voltage of LiIon cell, whatever kicks in first
May 26 16:17:10 <CaCO3> 950 would be fine as well ;)
May 26 16:17:27 <DocScrutinizer> cehteh: BS
May 26 16:17:46 <cehteh> DocScrutinizer: wikipedia says so :P
May 26 16:17:48 <CaCO3> whats CC/CV?
May 26 16:17:58 <DocScrutinizer> shortening is the spec, where your short must be <200
May 26 16:18:08 <cehteh> ah
May 26 16:18:13 <DocScrutinizer> CaCO3: constant current / constant voltage
May 26 16:19:32 <cehteh> anyway i never measured the charge current .. i only noticed with bad cables that it wont charge at all .. or that charging takes very long
May 26 16:19:37 <CaCO3> well, shortening (0 ohms) gives me at 5.05V only 470mA (battery level at 44%)
May 26 16:20:03 <cehteh> while here at my desk i just plug it in over the normal usb cable to a hub .. that charges slowly but acceptable
May 26 16:20:33 <CaCO3> I made myself a usb extention cable with 200 ohms, as most chargers else do not work
May 26 16:20:41 <CaCO3> (wall chargers)
May 26 16:20:45 <DocScrutinizer> CaCO3: that's what the charger chip does when no support from sw kicks in: detect D+- short, and switch to max500mA@3.7V
May 26 16:21:03 <DocScrutinizer> yeah, forget that 200ohm BS
May 26 16:21:20 <CaCO3> I know, but I didnt like a pure shortcut ;)
May 26 16:21:25 <CaCO3> so how could we tell it to go higher?
May 26 16:21:32 * cehteh just shortened it and it works
May 26 16:22:03 <DocScrutinizer> bme will usually tell charger to go to 950mA@4.20V
May 26 16:22:21 <cehteh> i bet this cheap usb hub has no limiting and acknowledgement of power and i can use my rigged charge cable to fast charge the device on the hub :P
May 26 16:22:24 <CaCO3> so I would have to request it by software
May 26 16:22:33 <DocScrutinizer> if your battery only takes 226mA@4.2V then what can charger do?
May 26 16:22:49 <CaCO3> its the original battery
May 26 16:22:59 <DocScrutinizer> doesn't matter
May 26 16:23:26 <DocScrutinizer> at ~50% charge the LiIon charging curve enters CV branch
May 26 16:23:27 <cehteh> but when its already 44% full it may take less ... most currentl flows when its empty at the first 20 minutes or so
May 26 16:23:28 <CaCO3> you know, it is not really that important, just hoped the charging efficiency could go up. and also the time :) 3..4h is just a lot
May 26 16:23:44 <CaCO3> the nokai charger doies it much faster
May 26 16:23:58 <cehteh> then shortening the pins and dont use 200 ohms and see
May 26 16:24:16 <CaCO3> ok, will try that
May 26 16:24:29 <cehteh> well whats the inner resistance of your power source .. can it deliver more current without voltage drop?
May 26 16:24:32 <CaCO3> after I force drained the battery again :)
May 26 16:24:45 <CaCO3> 3A should be enough .)
May 26 16:24:53 <DocScrutinizer> it starts with 950mA and voltage going up from maybe 3.5V to 4.2V, then it stays at 4.2V and current goes down from 950mA to finally zero(virtually)
May 26 16:25:05 <CaCO3> and my external USB battery pack is designed to supply at least 1A
May 26 16:25:21 <cehteh> at 5V?
May 26 16:25:34 <cehteh> self made pack?
May 26 16:25:50 <CaCO3> I have 2 3.7 LiIon in series to have enough voltage and use a dc dc converter to generate 5V
May 26 16:25:53 <CaCO3> yup
May 26 16:26:10 <CaCO3> at the moment only on the table, but I will pack it into a nice case
May 26 16:26:46 * cehteh buyed the bike Reecharge thingy .. too lazy to build one by myself 
May 26 16:26:51 <CaCO3> the problem is the efficiency :( the charger has only 66% and my circuit as well. that makes it less than 50% efficient in tola
May 26 16:27:05 <DocScrutinizer> CaCO3: there's definitely nothing to optimize with charging, except to go for D+- short rather than this odd ill 200R
May 26 16:27:25 <cehteh> yes not much you can do
May 26 16:27:25 <CaCO3> cehteh: whats the capacity of your batteries
May 26 16:27:29 <CaCO3> (bike charger)
May 26 16:27:34 <cehteh> 1600 mah LiPoly
May 26 16:27:59 <cehteh> http://www.thinkbiologic.com/products/reecharge-power-pack
May 26 16:28:12 <CaCO3> how many charges do you get out of it?
May 26 16:28:30 <cehteh> barely 1 i'd guess. i never used it for that
May 26 16:28:32 <DocScrutinizer> prolly one
May 26 16:28:47 <cehteh> its only for buffering at stops, usually its suppiled by the hub dynamo
May 26 16:28:49 <CaCO3> :( thats also what I expect
May 26 16:29:10 <CaCO3> I will use 4x a LiIon 980mAh
May 26 16:29:17 <DocScrutinizer> btw bq27200 should be way better than 66%
May 26 16:29:20 <CaCO3> might buy bigger batteries if it works well
May 26 16:29:29 <DocScrutinizer> @ 66% charging would overheat device
May 26 16:29:44 <cehteh> well any electronics cant be worse than the nokia CA-146C :)
May 26 16:29:46 <CaCO3> well, I charged it with a  wall charger and measured the current over time
May 26 16:30:34 <CaCO3> then I calculated the used maH and got to roughly 66%
May 26 16:30:43 <DocScrutinizer> and what's the unit of the resulting value? I don't get what you're reading out of that?
May 26 16:30:43 <CaCO3> (very quickly measured)
May 26 16:31:10 <DocScrutinizer> CaCO3: you considered the device running and consuming power while charging?
May 26 16:31:20 <CaCO3> if i charge 4h with average 350mAh that gives 1400mAh
May 26 16:31:23 <DocScrutinizer> quite a bit of power
May 26 16:31:44 <CaCO3> yup, I considered that, no apps running, cpy mostly idle, display off
May 26 16:31:46 <cehteh> how does the bq27200 massage the charging, DCDC converter too or linear?
May 26 16:32:01 <DocScrutinizer> dc/dc
May 26 16:32:05 <DocScrutinizer> step down
May 26 16:32:20 <DocScrutinizer> shominimumuld be at 80%
May 26 16:32:26 <cehteh> yeah .. so you have quite some losses at all ends
May 26 16:32:28 <DocScrutinizer> mmpf
May 26 16:32:38 <DocScrutinizer> should be at 80% min
May 26 16:32:45 <ShadowJK> FWIW, I built my own charger too, and it turned out I was losing a non-zero amount of volts in the cable I used (butchered some generic usb extension cable)
May 26 16:32:52 <DocScrutinizer> prolly more like 90%
May 26 16:33:01 <cehteh> efficiency?
May 26 16:33:07 <DocScrutinizer> sure
May 26 16:33:12 <CaCO3> well, I did it very roughly, might be a bit higher, expecially if I use 0 ohms instead 200 ohms
May 26 16:33:21 <cehteh> yes i guessed too something between 80-90%
May 26 16:33:36 <DocScrutinizer> this doesn't make any diff on digital
May 26 16:33:49 <DocScrutinizer> just 200R are ABS MAX
May 26 16:34:08 <cehteh> but if your battery feeds a dcdc stepdown with 80-90% first and then the device has another dcdc then its not terriby efficient anymore
May 26 16:34:09 <CaCO3> the biggest problem is, when the battery is fully empty, it will limit the current to 100mA as the OS is off, even I would give it more.
May 26 16:34:29 <cehteh> but there isnt much you can do
May 26 16:34:32 <SpeedEvil> It boots once it hits 3.?V
May 26 16:34:44 <CaCO3> dono, never tried
May 26 16:34:45 <SpeedEvil> And then negotiates.
May 26 16:35:05 <DocScrutinizer> look, the charger is a tiny chip with a small choke. If you charge 1A@5V * (100%-66%) you'd melt down that thing
May 26 16:35:18 <cehteh> for massaging the dynamo's current there are some good reasons to use a good old linear regulator too :)
May 26 16:35:37 <cehteh> DocScrutinizer: heatsink, massive Fan :)
May 26 16:35:54 <CaCO3> ah, thats the nose my N900 always makes :)
May 26 16:36:52 <CaCO3> first I did the dc dc converter myself with PWM and a micro controller. But its responding too slow when the current rises. this makes the N900 to deny the charging :(
May 26 16:37:11 <DocScrutinizer> CaCO3: there's NO way to get OS off when charging
May 26 16:37:13 <CaCO3> now I use a chip (MC34063) which works well
May 26 16:37:20 <DocScrutinizer> except battery undervolt
May 26 16:37:32 <CaCO3> well, if the battery is dead it will shut down :)
May 26 16:37:47 <CaCO3> and only start again when the voltage raised
May 26 16:37:49 <DocScrutinizer> and when you charge it will boot up
May 26 16:38:02 <DocScrutinizer> which happens after ~2min at max
May 26 16:38:05 <cehteh> http://www.nokiausers.net/wp-content/uploads/2011/04/3814186139_0ddc2ef5b0.jpg   when heat wants to go out, it finds its way :)
May 26 16:38:06 <CaCO3> hmm, most time (even with the nokai wall charger) I cant boot it up
May 26 16:38:30 <DocScrutinizer> you can't boot to system maybe
May 26 16:38:37 <CaCO3> lol, I read about the danger of that converter
May 26 16:38:41 <DocScrutinizer> but the hw is all up and working
May 26 16:38:55 <CaCO3> ok, that is right, the logo comes on
May 26 16:39:01 <CaCO3> and then goes dark again
May 26 16:39:09 <DocScrutinizer> still up
May 26 16:39:32 <DocScrutinizer> called act_dead
May 26 16:39:41 <DocScrutinizer> init 2
May 26 16:39:43 <DocScrutinizer> iirc
May 26 16:39:56 <CaCO3> :) all right, I understand
May 26 16:40:29 <CaCO3> will give it another try when I have a few hours time.
May 26 16:40:45 <DocScrutinizer> and odds are it *might* consume even more in that state than during some states you'd consider "booted up"
May 26 16:40:46 <cehteh> btw there is some standby mode which is not in use, is that suspend to ram or what?
May 26 16:40:51 <CaCO3> I hope to get at least one full charge out of my 4x 980mAh
May 26 16:41:13 <CaCO3> as I have quite a few of those laying around
May 26 16:41:26 <DocScrutinizer> you'll definitely get a full charge when system is idle
May 26 16:41:42 <cehteh> should be possible .. just dont expect 100% as full charge but be happy with 95%
May 26 16:41:48 <ShadowJK> CaCO3, as for efficiency measurements, consider that device power consujption is 80-100mA minimum while on charger
May 26 16:42:00 <DocScrutinizer> exactly
May 26 16:42:29 <cehteh> if its USB (with data enabled) then even more .. some stupid interrupts keep the cpu warm and cuddly
May 26 16:42:31 <kerio> cehteh: suspend-to-ram works, but you need a bit of support for stuff like the clock
May 26 16:42:32 <DocScrutinizer> system quite busy with charging
May 26 16:42:34 <DocScrutinizer> :-)
May 26 16:42:37 <CaCO3> so when I charge with 500mA I already "lose" 20%
May 26 16:42:51 <kerio> but of course you need to not be charging and you need to turn on the offline mode
May 26 16:42:53 <DocScrutinizer> yes
May 26 16:43:01 <DocScrutinizer> for powering the device
May 26 16:43:03 <kerio> otherwise the radio will just keep waking your phone up :(
May 26 16:43:13 <kerio> radio and bme, i suppose
May 26 16:43:13 <DocScrutinizer> so better charge while using the device
May 26 16:43:32 <kerio> stupid bme :(
May 26 16:43:48 <cehteh> my device gets warmer when charging on usb hub than on wall charger .. while wall charger is faste
May 26 16:43:50 <kerio> no, really, why doesn't the n900 have support for fully softwareless charging? :(
May 26 16:43:51 <cehteh> are
May 26 16:44:06 <DocScrutinizer> kerio: s2ram works but is worthless for almost everything
May 26 16:44:07 <CaCO3> it has, just with low current
May 26 16:44:21 <CaCO3> ond power off :)
May 26 16:44:41 <DocScrutinizer> kerio: because the chip is built that way
May 26 16:45:03 <cehteh> DocScrutinizer: thats prolly the reason why its disabled by default
May 26 16:45:19 <DocScrutinizer> errr who's disabled?
May 26 16:45:25 <cehteh> suspend to ram
May 26 16:45:30 <DocScrutinizer> aah, yeah
May 26 16:45:49 <cehteh> i was just thinking before a transcontinental flight ..
May 26 16:45:57 <cehteh> but then again .. shutting it down is better
May 26 16:46:01 <DocScrutinizer> either you lose all connectivity plus charging, or you resume in a second
May 26 16:46:01 <CaCO3> BTW: does anybody know why the N900 can not handle the battery level propperly of noname batteries?
May 26 16:46:05 <kerio> DocScrutinizer: bme is not disabled, bme is retarded
May 26 16:46:17 <CaCO3> I have 2 of them, and it always shows either 100% or 0%
May 26 16:46:19 <DocScrutinizer> indeed, in quite some ways
May 26 16:46:41 <DocScrutinizer> CaCO3: wrong BSI resistor
May 26 16:46:53 <CaCO3> the one in the battery?
May 26 16:46:57 <DocScrutinizer> yep
May 26 16:47:03 <DocScrutinizer> should be 100k
May 26 16:47:10 <CaCO3> did you ever try to fix that?
May 26 16:47:19 * DocScrutinizer ?
May 26 16:47:28 <DocScrutinizer> never had that problem
May 26 16:47:31 <CaCO3> (if possible at all?)
May 26 16:47:42 <CaCO3> are you using othe rbranded batteries?
May 26 16:48:00 <DocScrutinizer> probe BSI to err, plus? nah minus, err plus?
May 26 16:48:16 <DocScrutinizer> I have 3 batteries all fine
May 26 16:48:50 <DocScrutinizer> if you get sth other than 100k then either fix or dump the battery - or live with it
May 26 16:49:36 <CaCO3> well, except the status they are fine :) So I started to use the voltage as an indication, that works quite well :)
May 26 16:49:48 <CaCO3> Its more as a backup, in case I run out of battery
May 26 16:49:50 <DocScrutinizer> sure
May 26 16:49:54 <CaCO3> and to tease my Iphone friends :)
May 26 16:50:12 <kerio> i suppose the thing i'm the most bummed about is the lack of "hardware" charging at the bootloader level
May 26 16:50:37 <DocScrutinizer> anyway if you know how to 'short' d+. with 200R you also know how to probe bsi
May 26 16:50:52 <CaCO3> so is the BSI resistance just between GND and the 3th pin?
May 26 16:51:09 * ShadowJK runs without bme
May 26 16:51:57 <DocScrutinizer> kerio: indeed NOLO *could* do charging, unless Nokia was so scared about their bse^Hbme unknown software
May 26 16:52:01 <CaCO3> allright, both of my noname batteries have 67kOhms
May 26 16:52:37 <kerio> DocScrutinizer: bsbme?
May 26 16:52:40 <ShadowJK> kerio, the bootloader actually supports charging.. it charges until it thinks there's enough to boot the kernel :)
May 26 16:52:44 <DocScrutinizer> BSE
May 26 16:52:47 <kerio> ShadowJK: until there's not
May 26 16:52:50 <kerio> :(
May 26 16:53:18 <DocScrutinizer> ShadowJK: indeed
May 26 16:53:42 <ShadowJK> But it "doesn't work" if user fucks up their install so that kernel+os crashes
May 26 16:53:47 <DocScrutinizer> it doesn't charge though during flashing
May 26 16:54:07 <CaCO3> so do you think adjustiing the BSI resistor to 100k would fix that issue?
May 26 16:54:15 <DocScrutinizer> yes
May 26 16:54:22 <CaCO3> I always thought thats kind of a data/measurement line)
May 26 16:54:23 <DocScrutinizer> should
May 26 16:54:36 <ShadowJK> it will fix it if: battery capacity is sufficiently close to 1320mAh
May 26 16:55:06 <cehteh> my battery is meanwhile degraded enough :P
May 26 16:55:19 * DocScrutinizer hands over to ShadowJK who clearly is more experienced with BSI R
May 26 16:55:20 <CaCO3> well, the one I got on ebay has 1300 or so (guessing) and the one I got in westafrica (dont laught :) has the halve capacity
May 26 16:55:21 <vi__> yo
May 26 16:56:01 <cehteh> after my cheap replacement got broken (it worked well for some time) i disassmebled it
May 26 16:56:14 <DocScrutinizer> I guess bme is completely derailed when it comes to batteries != ~1300mAh
May 26 16:56:21 <DocScrutinizer> no matter what'sBSI
May 26 16:56:23 <cehteh> on the outside is 1300mah or so .. but 950mah printed on the cell directly
May 26 16:56:34 <kerio> nobody still wrote a full, opensource replacement for bme?
May 26 16:56:41 <vi__> so I am a lvl57 hyper-naab.  I am trying to get scratchbox to change to the 'armel'target as oppose to x86.  EVerytime I enter:
May 26 16:56:43 <vi__>    sb-conf se FREMANTLE_ARMEL
May 26 16:56:48 <vi__> I am told:
May 26 16:56:58 <DocScrutinizer> kerio: it's hard
May 26 16:57:12 <vi__> sb-conf: You must close your other Scratchbox sessions first
May 26 16:57:24 <CaCO3> vi__ sb-menu
May 26 16:57:30 <vi__> however I have not got any other SB sessions open
May 26 16:57:31 <CaCO3> and restart scratchbox
May 26 16:57:39 <DocScrutinizer> kerio: there's not only bse err bme, there's also IPC between this pile of sh*t and other closed stuff
May 26 16:58:02 <DocScrutinizer> even to cellmo
May 26 16:58:12 <ShadowJK> and management of usb cable, and usb power restrictions
May 26 16:58:31 <vi__> CaCO3: Thank you!
May 26 16:58:33 <DocScrutinizer> of course *all* undocumented and not even completely understood to the purpose of it
May 26 16:58:47 <ShadowJK> espeically the cable management is "annoying" in the sense that if you do it wrong your device ends up eating the battery in 12 hours
May 26 16:58:56 <kerio> omnomnom
May 26 16:58:57 <vi__> CaCO3: can you point me to any resources I may read that can help me avoid asking such dumbass Qs in the future?
May 26 16:59:06 <kerio> batteries are delicious!
May 26 16:59:10 <CaCO3> check the maemo wiki
May 26 17:00:04 <DocScrutinizer> vi__: you especially can avoid leaving chan  10min after asking question, without waiting for an answer - for the future ;-)
May 26 17:00:28 <vi__> sorry, sometimes my connection craps out and I dont notice :(
May 26 17:00:38 <DocScrutinizer> ok
May 26 17:00:53 <CaCO3> :)
May 26 17:01:21 <CaCO3> http://wiki.maemo.org/Documentation/Maemo_5_Final_SDK_Installation
May 26 17:01:22 <DocScrutinizer> vi__: yes, afaik cssu MMHD is a full version incl shortcuts
May 26 17:01:55 <DocScrutinizer> vi__: if you wanna be sure ask MohammadAG
May 26 17:01:58 <vi__> thank you
May 26 17:02:02 <DocScrutinizer> yw
May 26 17:02:13 <kerio> mmhd?
May 26 17:02:17 <CaCO3> all right, thank you all for your advice/feedback! was nice to chat with you
May 26 17:02:20 <DocScrutinizer> modified mhd
May 26 17:02:22 <kerio> also, does cssu include good unix tools?
May 26 17:02:29 <DocScrutinizer> nope
May 26 17:02:30 <vi__> however after a little reading I can see I need to have dbus-scripts installed to take advantage of any of the shortcuts
May 26 17:02:37 <kerio> how about a compiler?
May 26 17:02:40 <kerio> i like a compiler
May 26 17:02:42 <DocScrutinizer> nope
May 26 17:02:46 <vi__> and I wanna avoid dbus-scripts
May 26 17:02:51 <MohammadAG> funny how I just started XChat...
May 26 17:02:59 <DocScrutinizer> cssu is about REPLACING stuff of stock PR
May 26 17:03:05 <CaCO3> I once installed/used gcc on the N900, until I run out of root space and had to reflash :)
May 26 17:03:15 <DocScrutinizer> not adding arbitrary crap that can go extras-devel
May 26 17:03:16 <ShadowJK> CaCO3, i think your "950mAh" battery is lost cause for bme charge tracking
May 26 17:03:22 <CaCO3> It worked, and due my backup I didnt loose anything :)
May 26 17:03:41 <CaCO3> you mean its not possible?
May 26 17:03:53 <CaCO3> Doesnt really matter that much, I was just wundering
May 26 17:04:04 <DocScrutinizer> kerio: there's gnu-* for unix tools
May 26 17:04:09 <CaCO3> and asked before I cut the nokia charger cable to measure the current there ;)
May 26 17:04:11 <DocScrutinizer> in extras-devel
May 26 17:04:28 <DocScrutinizer> so it will NEVER go to CSSU
May 26 17:04:45 <DocScrutinizer> unless we decide to kick out messybox
May 26 17:05:09 <Volvagia356> DocScrutinizer, I'm curious, what made NITDroid into a "buzzword"?
May 26 17:05:57 <DocScrutinizer> the devels over there not getting their shit together with multiboot (and generally being quite ignorant about coexistence)
May 26 17:06:30 <vi__> a buzzword like 'ecosystem' or 'vertical integration'?
May 26 17:06:51 <Volvagia356> what's with multiboot?
May 26 17:06:56 <DocScrutinizer> a buzzword like "do you want the ban with shugar?"
May 26 17:07:16 <ShadowJK> btw, I tried enable 1250mA charging once...but, the device gets unreasonably warm, and the battery wear&tear was noticeable after 50 cycles
May 26 17:07:21 <DocScrutinizer> multiboot breaks systems, every day like 500
May 26 17:07:33 * ShadowJK is back to 0.7C 950mA
May 26 17:07:40 <DocScrutinizer> it's not compatible, can't get deinstalled
May 26 17:07:54 <Volvagia356> only on install, or even after a successful install?
May 26 17:08:08 <DocScrutinizer> all the time
May 26 17:08:29 <Volvagia356> so it just happens, regardless of how it installed
May 26 17:08:39 <DocScrutinizer> you can't deinstall, and you can't update maemo kernel
May 26 17:08:52 <Volvagia356> unless you reflash everything, right?
May 26 17:08:59 <DocScrutinizer> no matter what you do, you end with a broken system
May 26 17:09:03 <DocScrutinizer> right
May 26 17:09:16 <DocScrutinizer> that's why /topic
May 26 17:09:22 <Volvagia356> I can see that
May 26 17:09:59 <Volvagia356> what about the fact that by default, it uses 500MHz min and 700MHz max?
May 26 17:10:40 <DocScrutinizer> will eat CPU a lil bit too fast for me to feel good with it
May 26 17:11:07 <vi__> ow, your talking about nitroid?
May 26 17:11:20 <vi__> the biggest con is that android is complete ass
May 26 17:12:11 <Volvagia356> and that's basically why I spent a month going all over the place hunting for a 1.5 year old phone
May 26 17:23:29 <jonaskoelker> MohammadAG: have you posted sources for the hildon notifier program?  (It feels like "tomorrow" now...)
May 26 17:27:56 <ShadowJK> I wouldn't want to try modify bme
May 26 17:28:11 <vi__> neither would I!
May 26 17:28:38 <vi__> can anyone suggest a begginers guid to making .deb s?
May 26 17:29:02 <CaCO3> what are you packing?
May 26 17:29:05 <CaCO3> python?
May 26 17:29:07 <blizzow> Today I Learned:  You can charge the N900 battery in an N97 chassis!
May 26 17:29:16 <vi__> no
May 26 17:29:19 <vi__> a C program
May 26 17:29:25 <vi__> I have a binary
May 26 17:29:25 <CaCO3> you shouldnt actually build the deb yourself.
May 26 17:29:34 <vi__> that is what I intend to do
May 26 17:29:38 <CaCO3> but rather pack a tar gz and let the builder build it
May 26 17:29:53 <vi__> oh?
May 26 17:29:55 <CaCO3> there are also some tips in the wicki
May 26 17:30:10 <vi__> I cannot find them!
May 26 17:30:15 <vi__> what must I search for?
May 26 17:30:18 <CaCO3> what I did, I took another project and hstudied it
May 26 17:30:30 <CaCO3> mean used it as an example
May 26 17:31:04 <vi__> aaah
May 26 17:31:06 <vi__> ok
May 26 17:31:16 <CaCO3> if you have all the right files at the right place, use scratchbox to generate the needed files to upload them
May 26 17:31:25 <CaCO3> there is a command in scratchbox which does that
May 26 17:31:33 <CaCO3> dpkg-buildpackage -rfakeroot -sa -S
May 26 17:31:47 <CaCO3> just look in the wiki and sudy existing packages
May 26 17:31:55 <CaCO3> so, I have to go now, cu all
May 26 17:35:01 <HCl> }:-)
May 26 17:38:50 <MohammadAG> who knows how to convert an int to a char?
May 26 17:39:22 <ds3> isn't that like putting a quart in a pint?
May 26 17:39:34 <Itschue> verry great chat here thanks a lot docscrutinizer and all other how helped me
May 26 17:39:52 <DocScrutinizer> yw, come back soon
May 26 17:40:09 <DocScrutinizer> hope all work out nicely with your N900
May 26 17:40:18 <Itschue> i hope so too
May 26 17:40:29 <MohammadAG> DocScrutinizer, http://pastebin.com/SmUfaE8M
May 26 17:40:39 <MohammadAG> sorry, a char into an it
May 26 17:40:44 <MohammadAG> basically, argv to int
May 26 17:40:54 <MohammadAG> someone fix line 21 there ^ :P
May 26 17:41:11 <Volvagia356> After some browsing, MultiBoot feels very hackish now
May 26 17:41:16 <DocScrutinizer> MohammadAG: mompls
May 26 17:42:01 <DocScrutinizer> ask the coders, there's a simple strtoint() or sth
May 26 17:42:53 <DocScrutinizer> Volvagia356: extremely hackish
May 26 17:43:00 <ds3> MohammandAG: I donno what gint tries to be but I am guessing - atoi(argv[.... is likely to be worth a try
May 26 17:43:17 <MohammadAG> atoi?
May 26 17:43:19 <ds3> argv['s are a string. atoi converts from ascii string to an integer
May 26 17:43:21 <DocScrutinizer> atoi
May 26 17:43:26 <Choom> MohammadAG: strtol(), strtoul()
May 26 17:43:31 <Volvagia356> come on, reflashing the kernel on OS change?
May 26 17:43:32 <ds3> or strol or stroul
May 26 17:43:36 <ds3> strtol
May 26 17:44:08 <DocScrutinizer> I seem to remember atoi been kinda obsolete ?
May 26 17:44:23 <ShadowJK> atoi()
May 26 17:44:23 <MohammadAG> ds3, part of  standard libs?
May 26 17:44:27 <ShadowJK> strtod()
May 26 17:44:27 <DocScrutinizer> or a bit stubborn, or retarded, or sth?
May 26 17:44:35 <ShadowJK> snscanf()
May 26 17:44:41 <ds3> atoi should be a stock thing
May 26 17:44:46 <DocScrutinizer> snscanf() thats it
May 26 17:45:14 <ShadowJK> atoi might be ancient bsd, *scanf is often a bit overkill
May 26 17:45:17 <ds3> man page claims it is even posix
May 26 17:45:21 <DocScrutinizer> atoi has "issues"
May 26 17:45:32 <DocScrutinizer> iirc
May 26 17:45:48 <ds3> it doesn't do errors
May 26 17:46:02 <cehteh> atoi is standard, itoa isnt
May 26 17:47:12 <cehteh> sometimes atio is just ok .. when you dont need to care about errors
May 26 17:47:15 <Volvagia356> well this will hopefully be my final question here for now
May 26 17:47:16 <DocScrutinizer> atoi might segfault or sth - can't recall the details
May 26 17:47:22 <cehteh> DocScrutinizer: nope
May 26 17:47:39 <ds3> cehteh: is atoi(NULL) defined?
May 26 17:47:46 <Volvagia356> Is it possible to dump kernel, rootfs and emmc into suitable files for flashing using flasher-3.5?
May 26 17:47:55 <DocScrutinizer> no
May 26 17:48:05 <cehteh> none of the stdlib string (cough .. char*) functions is null pointer safe
May 26 17:48:26 <cehteh> strcmp(NULL,NULL) segfaults too
May 26 17:48:55 <ds3> just saying, it might just segfault ;)
May 26 17:49:13 <cehteh> anything might segfault when used in a undefined way
May 26 17:49:17 <ds3> heheh
May 26 17:49:30 <DocScrutinizer> for some reason I decided for the *scanf versions last time I digged into that
May 26 17:49:55 <cehteh> the more interesting thing what does atoi(" 0123")   return? .. how about atoi("\n0123") and so on
May 26 17:49:57 <Itschue> anyone now what the different is of the nokia n8 and n900 usb cable or what can happen wenn i use the usb cable from n900 to plug  zhe n8 on the pc(i dont want to do that but a friend want it and i sy no use your cable becaus there are different nokia numbers)
May 26 17:49:58 <Volvagia356> DocScrutinizer: was that 'no' directed at me?
May 26 17:50:03 <DocScrutinizer> yes
May 26 17:50:09 <Volvagia356> I see
May 26 17:50:25 <DocScrutinizer> backupmenu, as close as it gets
May 26 17:50:39 <cehteh> if you have the slightiest doubt that the string is not a well formed number and may over/underflow the integer then you must not use atoi
May 26 17:50:46 <ds3> cehteh: as long as it is something like 0, that's should be fine
May 26 17:50:50 <MohammadAG> DocScrutinizer, that's the notification source anyway
May 26 17:51:03 <DocScrutinizer> noticed that :-)
May 26 17:51:04 <MohammadAG> passing 0 to timeout would make the notification permanent, till clicked
May 26 17:51:20 <cehteh> atio returns 0 in case of an error but you cant tell if it was beause of an error or the string was "0"
May 26 17:51:32 <ds3> but that's falling into the category of doing dumb things aka GIGO
May 26 17:51:38 <DocScrutinizer> that's just fine here
May 26 17:52:13 <ds3> you could always do if (strcmp("0",str) ==0 && ....
May 26 17:52:14 <ds3> ;)
May 26 17:52:17 <DocScrutinizer> invalid parameter := 0 is just acceptable
May 26 17:52:42 <DocScrutinizer> ds3: maybe that'S why I decided for *scanf()
May 26 17:53:08 <ShadowJK> string handling in C is awesome, because everyone is an expert
May 26 17:53:11 <DocScrutinizer> MohammadAG: seems common sense it atoi is ok
May 26 17:53:30 <ds3> hehe
May 26 17:53:52 <DocScrutinizer> ShadowJK: actually a really god trolling ;-)
May 26 17:54:01 <DocScrutinizer> good*
May 26 17:54:24 <ds3> anyways, that was the shortest (character wise) fix for the question on hand.
May 26 17:54:31 <DocScrutinizer> ask for converting 13.4 to an int ;-D
May 26 17:54:40 <SpeedEvil> The string is a lie!
May 26 17:54:56 <ds3> atoi should handle 13.4 to int
May 26 17:55:07 <ds3> behaves just like casting
May 26 17:55:10 <DocScrutinizer> ooh, it does?
May 26 17:55:14 <DocScrutinizer> cool
May 26 17:55:27 <ds3> it stops at the first character that isn't valid so it truncates
May 26 17:55:35 <DocScrutinizer> would it also handle +13 ?
May 26 17:56:32 <ds3> I know it does do -13, never tried +13
May 26 18:10:06 <vi__> heres a question for you
May 26 18:10:14 <vi__> how do I get xbindkeys to  run at boot?
May 26 18:10:15 <ruskie> http://www.linuxfordevices.com/c/a/News/Skype-dumps-Asterisk/ <-- that took long
May 26 18:10:40 <vi__> I have tried creating an event.d script, it runs but doesnt work
May 26 18:11:09 <vi__> I have tried editing real_af_startup, but that doesnt work
May 26 18:11:36 <vi__> I have tried piggybacking it into other services event.d scritps but that doesnt work
May 26 18:11:40 <MohammadAG> ruskie, microsoft
May 26 18:11:48 <vi__> I have tried rc.local but that doesnt work
May 26 18:12:07 <vi__> How, for the love of god in all that is holy do I get xbindkeys to run at boot?
May 26 18:12:36 <frals> MohammadAG, id be surprised if that was not already the plan before ms bought them
May 26 18:13:20 <DocScrutinizer> vi__: I gather from name xbindkeys is a prog for X
May 26 18:13:25 <vi__> ye
May 26 18:13:30 <DocScrutinizer> can't work until X started
May 26 18:13:35 <vi__> agree
May 26 18:13:44 <DocScrutinizer> .xsession
May 26 18:22:43 <Zucca> Is the usb host mode hack already in extras-testing?
May 26 18:23:19 <Zucca> For N900, to be precise.
May 26 18:25:17 <DocScrutinizer> a) it's not a hack. b) no,  h-e-n is still in extras-devel, and depends on hostmode-enabled kernels
May 26 18:25:36 <DocScrutinizer> :-)
May 26 18:26:23 <Zucca> Ah. So "KernelPower" doesn't have hostmode enabled?
May 26 18:26:25 <DocScrutinizer> at time of this writing, hm-enabled kenels are; the powerkernel v45 and later
May 26 18:27:56 <Itschue> on the n900 are directory beginning with . with which command in x-term can i find these ones
May 26 18:28:14 <Zucca> Ok. But I thought it was a hack since the hardware "wasn't cabable" of enabling host mode.
May 26 18:28:39 <Zucca> Itschue: ls -a
May 26 18:30:04 <ShadowJK> hardwarre is incapable of otg
May 26 18:30:22 <Zucca> Itschue: Or did you meant all of them. In the whole filesystem?
May 26 18:30:45 <Itschue> sure i know that ls - are many things but yes last time i used morr -commands that was on my wrt54g router yes id diddnt tried this on n900 thanks
May 26 18:31:02 <Itschue> io kno a command that schows all but not the .
May 26 18:31:11 <DocScrutinizer> Zucca: so yes, in this way it's a great hack
May 26 18:32:20 <Zucca> ShadowJK: Some (long) time ago there was a thread about N900 not being able of OTG, but hostmode yes that needs to be triggered first.
May 26 18:32:59 <Zucca> Itschue: ls
May 26 18:33:10 <DocScrutinizer> Zucca: we need to exploit diagnostic functions of the hw to implement hostmode
May 26 18:33:44 <Zucca> Itschue: It shows all but not those beginning with a dot (.).
May 26 18:34:02 <Itschue> ok tanks
May 26 18:34:11 <DocScrutinizer> with -a (or --all) it shows the hidden .files as well
May 26 18:34:44 <Zucca> DocScrutinizer: Good to hear that it's not actually a hack.
May 26 18:35:42 <Zucca> I' about to buy a USB touch display. It would be great when navigating.
May 26 18:36:03 <DocScrutinizer> depends on you definition of hack, it somewhat sounded disrespectful the way you asked
May 26 18:36:11 <Zucca> Actually it doesn't need to be touch enabled even.
May 26 18:37:56 <DocScrutinizer> Zucca: and h-e-n never will go -testing as it has no chance to go extras, it depends on powerkernel which at least for me is an argument not to promote it
May 26 18:38:07 <Zucca> DocScrutinizer: Didn't mean to be disrespectful at all. And yes, hack sounds a bit like "built fast to do the thing", like gludge sounds.
May 26 18:39:18 <DocScrutinizer> well, others think different, see the friggin overclocking GUI
May 26 18:39:19 <Zucca> I use power kernel because of Mobile Hotspot. Although I don't use it much...
May 26 18:39:59 <DocScrutinizer> but I don't feel like promoting h-e-n to extras, really
May 26 18:40:40 <ShadowJK> I wouldn't feel like promoting anything depending on kernel-power to extras
May 26 18:40:46 <DocScrutinizer> but then in the end moh maintains the GUI pkg, and dunno who the PK
May 26 18:41:06 <DocScrutinizer> ShadowJK: my rationale, see above
May 26 18:41:10 <ShadowJK> but that's just my opinion after discovering the monolithinc patch style development :P
May 26 18:41:10 <Zucca> Also I use that OC GUI, but to lower the clockspeed. I have noticed it saves battery time when I keep ssh connection open to my server.
May 26 18:42:11 <DocScrutinizer> Zucca: now that's a rather interesting find
May 26 18:42:25 <ShadowJK> Mostly the ssh will consume radio power if it's updating something frequently. A single packet is roughly equivalent to 5s talk-time on 3g. 5s of straming music is also roughly equivalent to 5s talk-time :P
May 26 18:43:43 <DocScrutinizer> ssh remote sessions shouldn't keep transmitting things or hog the cpu all the time
May 26 18:44:32 <DocScrutinizer> so if lowering cpu speed helps there has to be sth odd in there
May 26 18:44:59 <ShadowJK> Yeah I have 3 open, had them open 2 weeks without noticing any extra drain (but I also have xchat open)
May 26 18:45:26 <DocScrutinizer> same here
May 26 18:47:10 <DocScrutinizer> wtf is ls --author ?
May 26 18:47:52 <ShadowJK> smells of gnu
May 26 18:48:05 <ShadowJK> and I don't mean the animal
May 26 18:48:22 <DocScrutinizer> yeah
May 26 18:48:39 <mece> LOL
May 26 18:52:00 <DocScrutinizer> -rw-r--r-- 1 root root root 43008 20. Okt 2009  mc.1.gz
May 26 18:52:03 <DocScrutinizer> o.O
May 26 18:52:12 <Venemo> hey
May 26 18:53:08 <Sicelo> rtfm ;P
May 26 18:53:11 <DocScrutinizer> maybe there are FS out there that have author in extended file attributes?
May 26 18:53:37 * Sicelo never knew that either 
May 26 18:53:43 <DocScrutinizer> Sicelo: what do you think I did before I cam e with this
May 26 18:54:29 <DocScrutinizer> what IS the *author* of a file?
May 26 18:55:06 <Sicelo> of course DocScrutinizer. the rtfm wasn't directed to you
May 26 18:55:35 <Sicelo> i was just thinking about how much information is hidden away in man pages
May 26 18:56:02 <DocScrutinizer> jr@halley:~> man 1 ls >x
May 26 18:56:03 <DocScrutinizer> jr@halley:~> ls -l --author x
May 26 18:56:05 <DocScrutinizer> -rw-r--r-- 1 jr users jr 7813 26. Mai 20:55 x
May 26 18:57:10 <Sicelo> please accept my sincere apologies
May 26 18:57:47 <DocScrutinizer> jr@halley:~> sudo chown root: x
May 26 18:57:49 <DocScrutinizer> jr@halley:~> ls -l --author x
May 26 18:57:50 <DocScrutinizer> -rw-r--r-- 1 root root root 7813 26. Mai 20:55 x
May 26 18:58:25 <Sicelo> what language is your N900 set to DocScrutinizer ?
May 26 18:58:46 <DocScrutinizer> err, de?
May 26 18:59:44 <DocScrutinizer> --author == nonsense
May 26 18:59:53 <Sicelo> lol
May 26 18:59:57 <DocScrutinizer> done, next
May 26 19:02:31 <dangergrrl> my slow net connection says ill have nokia-sources and nokia-apps for X86 in like 2 hours
May 26 19:02:33 <dangergrrl> yay
May 26 19:02:45 <DocScrutinizer> \o/
May 26 19:02:54 <Venemo> DocScrutinizer, wut?
May 26 19:03:07 <DocScrutinizer> Venemo: wut wut?
May 26 19:03:19 <Venemo> DocScrutinizer, nokia-sources and nokia-apps?
May 26 19:03:30 <dangergrrl> DocScrutinizer: you probably know or know of the guys who wrote the GSM papers i've been reading
May 26 19:03:31 <DocScrutinizer> :shrug:
May 26 19:03:32 <Venemo> are you installin the SDK?
May 26 19:03:39 <dangergrrl> yes
May 26 19:03:47 <dangergrrl> the closed parts of SDK
May 26 19:03:52 <Venemo> ah
May 26 19:03:59 <Venemo> so how will he get the sources?
May 26 19:04:08 <dangergrrl> i tried to get the gui installer to work like for days
May 26 19:04:45 <Venemo> dangergrrl, it worked for me every time I used it
May 26 19:04:52 <dangergrrl> finally after advisment followed the "Manual" instructions
May 26 19:05:24 <dangergrrl> you probably were not installing over bandwidth clamped 3G
May 26 19:05:48 <dangergrrl> i used the limit on my unlimited* internet like 3 days into the month
May 26 19:06:01 <DocScrutinizer> there's way too many points of failure, and no resume
May 26 19:06:34 <dangergrrl> right, like any one file fails to xfer and it wants to erase all of them and start over
May 26 19:06:42 <DocScrutinizer> so welcome to spinning the big download wheel
May 26 19:07:20 <dangergrrl> most of the nokia blob dependent packages are relatively small, nationalizations and such
May 26 19:08:14 <Venemo> dangergrrl, you're correct, I would never attempt to dl it over 3G
May 26 19:08:37 <dangergrrl> if i had a local caching nameserver it would help
May 26 19:08:54 <dangergrrl> average rtt to my isp is running like 2000ms
May 26 19:10:01 <Venemo> http://www.speedtest.net/result/491981526.png
May 26 19:10:04 <dangergrrl> i don't think tmobile actually cuts the ttl as much as the rfc suggests it should
May 26 19:11:04 <dangergrrl> 3G is what i have for internet this month
May 26 19:11:25 <Venemo> for a long time, I was also dependant on a 3G connection
May 26 19:11:30 <Venemo> that one had HSDPA though
May 26 19:12:06 <dangergrrl> oh, i have it but only until i xfer 5Gb in a month
May 26 19:12:27 <dangergrrl> then they rate limit me to 7.5kB/s
May 26 19:13:13 <Venemo> heh
May 26 19:13:31 <Venemo> my limit was also 5GB, and they overcharged above that. but I never reached that limit
May 26 19:13:39 <dangergrrl> i was taking some 720p video subs on cable internet, those ate my 5GB in no time
May 26 19:14:06 <Venemo> well, be smart. don't download HD videos on 3G
May 26 19:14:18 <dangergrrl> tmobile doesn't charge me for overage
May 26 19:14:24 <dangergrrl> they just make it very slow
May 26 19:15:16 <dangergrrl> that will probably end next year when the clowns at FCC who work for the telecom industry and not the public approve the att/tmobile purchase
May 26 19:15:54 <dangergrrl> i mean DT is evil but att will have a monopoly on gsm service in the us
May 26 19:16:33 <dangergrrl> verizon and sprint and all the small cell companies here are cdma
May 26 19:18:13 <dangergrrl> fcc likely won't see it as a big deal because they already try to keep you captive with locked handsets so what if i own a device thatÅ› now att only in the usa
May 26 19:24:04 <MohammadAG> yeah
May 26 19:25:00 <promgvm> hello all#
May 26 19:25:16 <merlin1991> hey MohammadAG
May 26 19:25:32 <merlin1991> how did you do the power kernel uboot package?
May 26 19:26:42 <MohammadAG> download blu ray rips!
May 26 19:26:54 <merlin1991> wtf?
May 26 19:26:54 <dangergrrl> MohammadAG: thanks for all your wonderful postings to maemo-talk and such i haven't needed to ask more questions to get this to install :)
May 26 19:27:08 <dangergrrl> lol
May 26 19:27:45 <dangergrrl> naah, i subscribe to category5.tv and a lot of nasa HD stuff
May 26 19:28:29 <dangergrrl> itÅ› legal HD content
May 26 19:30:48 <dangergrrl> joachim göller has some good papers on GSM but most are in german and i can look at them but don't understand much :)
May 26 19:32:30 <MohammadAG> merlin1991, I had a kernel-power-source package so I just did some stuff :P
May 26 19:32:46 <MohammadAG> uboot-pr13 does it from binaries, I do it from sources :p
May 26 19:32:56 <promgvm> danger: what do you want to know? i'm german but my english isnt very well
May 26 19:33:22 <dangergrrl> actually i read the one paper he has in english
May 26 19:33:27 <merlin1991> MohammadAG: I want to achive the same for another flavour of power kernel (the wifi one)
May 26 19:33:31 <merlin1991> so source is there too
May 26 19:33:41 <merlin1991> that just leaves the question what you actually did
May 26 19:34:04 <MohammadAG> merlin1991, debian/rules :P
May 26 19:34:15 <dangergrrl> GSMDmChannels.pdf learning a lot from it
May 26 19:34:59 <dangergrrl> i found osmocom.org yesterday and am just learning what i can
May 26 19:36:17 <dangergrrl> http://laforge.gnumonks.org/papers/gsm_phone-anatomy-latest.pdf this paper <-- explains a lot about why open hardware is so difficult to do
May 26 19:37:33 <dangergrrl> iǘe actually wanted to learn more about GSM ever since i watched the demo from last years DEFCON on spoofing a GSM cell tower
May 26 19:40:25 <promgvm> and you a translation now?
May 26 19:40:49 <dangergrrl> i am guessing that the part of the stack you would need to modify to be aware of the trick they did in that demo is closed
May 26 19:40:56 <promgvm> i forgot the "need"
May 26 19:41:11 <dangergrrl> well, his one english paper is good and i haven finished it
May 26 19:41:22 <dangergrrl> no need, i just want to understand more
May 26 19:41:56 <dangergrrl> one point in the defcon demo is than almost no handsets notify the user if the cell tower tels them to drop encryption
May 26 19:42:43 <promgvm> to understand german or GSM?
May 26 19:42:55 <dangergrrl> GSM
May 26 19:43:26 <dangergrrl> iǘe been watching vids on german on deutsche welle but thatś not getting me up to speed for tech papers :)
May 26 19:43:41 <dangergrrl> so iĺl try to find different papers
May 26 19:44:04 <dangergrrl> itu lets you download some docs for free don't they?
May 26 19:44:13 <dangergrrl> or is it all pay?
May 26 19:44:57 <dangergrrl> i'm pretty sure i got rec X.25 for free on a job 13 or 14 years ago :)
May 26 19:45:16 <promgvm> i dont know
May 26 19:47:12 <dangergrrl> i don't know enough about GSM to even have questions yet
May 26 19:47:53 <dangergrrl> it is comforting to know that what i do know about ISDN applies
May 26 19:48:28 <Arkenoi> something is wrong with my phone. call UI after it starts ringing appears more and more slowly
May 26 19:49:20 <joga> Arkenoi when was the last time you rebooted it?
May 26 19:50:16 <Arkenoi> 5 days ago
May 26 19:50:35 <Arkenoi> but it seems to be some not so local effect depending on uptime
May 26 19:50:45 <Arkenoi> it does not behave well even after reboot
May 26 19:50:53 <Arkenoi> and it becomes worse -- slower and slower
May 26 19:54:07 <dangergrrl> indeed all itu docs are free now
May 26 19:54:10 <cehteh> Arkenoi: happens for me too
May 26 19:54:44 <cehteh> just too much swapped out
May 26 19:55:37 <zakkkkm> Hey, according to bottom of http://wiki.meego.com/ARM/N900/QA/Performance , it seems that running OS off microsd is faster?
May 26 19:55:55 <zakkkkm> running say a class 10 microsd, would maemo be much faster?
May 26 19:55:59 <cehteh> .o(my next phone should have real 1GB memory not just in marketing terms)
May 26 19:56:28 <cehteh> zakkkkm: may be or may not be .. depends on filesystem and card
May 26 19:56:34 <zakkkkm> cehteh: my next internet speed will come in bytes, and not bits :)
May 26 19:56:56 <zakkkkm> my next harddrive wont come in "1,000,000 bytes" either.
May 26 19:57:29 <zakkkkm> the graph for meego, shows that it comes with better performan e than the emmc
May 26 19:57:46 <ShadowJK> zakkkkm, I think nobody has found a class 10 that's fast for OS use yet
May 26 19:57:51 <ShadowJK> class 4 and class 6 are probably better
May 26 19:58:00 <zakkkkm> http://wiki.meego.com/images/Randomseeks.jpg for instance
May 26 19:58:30 <zakkkkm> class 4 and 6 are better than  class 10?
May 26 19:58:38 <dangergrrl> not all, just a lot
May 26 19:58:56 <dangergrrl> (itu recs free)
May 26 19:58:58 <cehteh> the controler has some limit too i dont know if it scales for class 10 cards
May 26 19:59:02 <zakkkkm> doesnt class specify minimum write speed, therefore making a class 10 better?
May 26 19:59:14 <zakkkkm> ah
May 26 19:59:16 <cehteh> and ext4 gave some solid performance improvement here
May 26 19:59:17 <ShadowJK> cehteh, controller doesn't really matter in this case
May 26 19:59:33 <zakkkkm> trying to find ways to enhance the phone :)
May 26 19:59:35 <ShadowJK> zakkkkm, class specified minimum SEQUENTIAL write speed in the "IDEAL STATE".
May 26 19:59:44 <ShadowJK> for OS use, it's mostly random write
May 26 19:59:49 <cehteh> ShadowJK: well i dont know whats the max speed and configuration the n900 supports
May 26 20:00:04 <ShadowJK> cehteh, about class 20, if such a thing existed
May 26 20:00:09 <cehteh> overall SD specs are reasonable well defined but there are so much corner case and strange modes
May 26 20:00:11 <zakkkkm> ah
May 26 20:00:43 <dangergrrl> 64GB microsd announced yesterday :)
May 26 20:00:44 <cehteh> ShadowJK: ok on my laptop for example the Ricoh controler doesnt scale well with fast cards
May 26 20:01:00 <zakkkkm> cehteh, running OS on ext4 ?
May 26 20:01:04 <zakkkkm> or just sd card
May 26 20:01:39 <cehteh> zakkkkm: only mydocs and sd card .. and only maemo, never tried meego yet
May 26 20:02:09 <zakkkkm> i have, its way too slow
May 26 20:02:42 <zakkkkm> i was just using that graph since its very recent on performance chart
May 26 20:02:43 <ShadowJK> ext4 looked nice in my own unrelated (to maemo) tests :P
May 26 20:02:49 <DocScrutinizer> dangergrrl: wel, the paper of harald should be good, he knows his GSM stuff
May 26 20:03:15 <DocScrutinizer> at least he did when we talked away the nights in taipei
May 26 20:03:38 <ShadowJK> zakkkkm, I wouldn't trust their SD/EMMC benchmarks.. swap is on emmc, and that gets hit pretty heavily once you start such a benchmark, which would have a negative impact on measured speed
May 26 20:03:55 <DocScrutinizer> ~seen laf0rge
May 26 20:03:59 <infobot> laf0rge <n=laforge@sunbeam.ipv6.gnumonks.org> was last seen on IRC in channel #webos-internals, 568d 18h 41m 41s ago, saying: 'laf0rge sends a 'korean wave' back to rwhitby ;)'.
May 26 20:04:30 * DocScrutinizer wonders what happened to harald :-o
May 26 20:04:45 <DocScrutinizer> maybe he just changed the irc network
May 26 20:04:46 * cehteh sets laptop_mode to 600 .. delaying writes, gives better opportunity to reorder writes, delayed allocation and generally less wear on flash
May 26 20:05:18 <ShadowJK> cehteh, also some combination of OS and OS Version performs very poorly on flash based (USB keys, SD, MMC, etc) media, and that's amplified by class 10 cards which are even more heavily optimized for sequential-only access :P
May 26 20:05:25 <zakkkkm> cehteh, swappotube stuff?
May 26 20:06:08 <cehteh> zakkkkm: first i did that manually later i did that with swappolube, (not using all their defaults just use it as UI for my stuff)
May 26 20:07:16 <zakkkkm> ah
May 26 20:07:26 <cehteh> on my laptop i even have it at 3600 and for a friends CF-Card based terminal computer we set it on a insanely high level (about a week in seconds) ... there isnt much write activity anyways
May 26 20:07:40 <ShadowJK> I thought laptop_mode was 0 or 1 setting
May 26 20:07:44 <zakkkkm> ShadowJK , so you think i should get high sd card, and switch swap to the microsd card?
May 26 20:07:48 <cehteh> note that you should know its implications as in loosing uncommited data
May 26 20:08:16 <cehteh> zakkkkm: there is another bug in the kernel which sometimes makes it hang on high io load
May 26 20:08:17 <ShadowJK> zakkkkm, I'd get a Sandisk Mobile Ultra, and put swap on it :P
May 26 20:08:33 <cehteh> i tried to distribute swap load on emmc and sd card (both same priority)
May 26 20:08:59 <cehteh> which in theory should scale ... the linux kernel would do that and the hardware could do that too
May 26 20:09:00 <zakkkkm> Ohh, nevermind.. took me a bit
May 26 20:09:05 <ShadowJK> I found better improvement from having swap only on microsd, because there's already /home /opt and MyDocs on emmc
May 26 20:09:09 <cehteh> but it doesnt work reliable
May 26 20:09:21 <cehteh> ack
May 26 20:09:29 <ShadowJK> It works quite reliably for me :)
May 26 20:09:40 <cehteh> i'd like to have compcache/zram on the n900 ...
May 26 20:09:43 <dangergrrl> DocScrutinizer: most of the free papers i've found so far have ties to openmoko unsuprisingly
May 26 20:09:54 <DocScrutinizer> hehe
May 26 20:10:22 <zakkkkm> cehteh, is there any progress on that?
May 26 20:10:43 <zakkkkm> ShadowJK: balance out the bandwidth?
May 26 20:11:01 <cehteh> zakkkkm: on what? zram/compcache? guess not
May 26 20:11:12 <cehteh> not for the n900 kernel
May 26 20:11:14 <ShadowJK> zakkkkm, well first stop thinking of it as bandwidth
May 26 20:11:16 <ShadowJK> you don't have bandwidth
May 26 20:11:23 <ShadowJK> you have IOPS, you can do about 4 of them per second
May 26 20:11:24 <ShadowJK> :P
May 26 20:11:31 <cehteh> haha
May 26 20:11:33 <zakkkkm> have a "high" class 4 / 6 card right now in microsd, would it help to use that for swap you think?
May 26 20:11:36 <ShadowJK> (compared to 50,000 on a OCZ SSD)
May 26 20:11:50 <zakkkkm> cehteh, yeah. zram/compcache
May 26 20:11:54 <ShadowJK> Yeah. You need to use a swap partition though, swap files don't work very well.
May 26 20:12:08 <cehteh> yes there is no much you can do
May 26 20:12:16 <zakkkkm> I remember Stskeeps trying that i believe, like years ago
May 26 20:12:26 <zakkkkm> 4?!
May 26 20:12:29 <dangergrrl> n900 doesn't have calypso/iota/rita chipset for the GSM part i'm guessing
May 26 20:12:39 * ShadowJK checks
May 26 20:12:50 <zakkkkm> true i guess it is more iops
May 26 20:13:03 <zakkkkm> im just surprised microsd's are so low
May 26 20:13:07 <ShadowJK> Yes, 4
May 26 20:13:14 <zakkkkm> i only think of IOPs of harddrives and such, not small storage
May 26 20:13:33 <ShadowJK> But it's 4 whether your write is 4k or 1M
May 26 20:14:00 <ShadowJK> Actually the sandisk I mentioned tested out at 7-8
May 26 20:14:44 <ShadowJK> Transcend full size SD 80X 1GB: 13
May 26 20:15:06 <zakkkkm> 4 for emmc or sd?
May 26 20:15:17 <ShadowJK> I haven't tested emmc, but it's probably similar
May 26 20:15:21 <zakkkkm> so SD is considerably faster?
May 26 20:15:35 <ShadowJK> That Transcend card is "special" :)
May 26 20:15:49 <DocScrutinizer> dangergrrl: definitely not
May 26 20:16:38 <zakkkkm> ShadowJK: where are you removing emmc's swap, and adding the sd one?
May 26 20:16:42 <zakkkkm> you using fstab?
May 26 20:17:05 <merlin1991> I dunno whenever I read dangergrrl I read dangergirl instead, wishfull thinking on my side?
May 26 20:17:20 <ShadowJK> zakkkkm, I just do it manually on boot
May 26 20:17:23 <ShadowJK> fstab does nothing.
May 26 20:17:34 <zakkkkm> i see a /dev/mmcblk0p3 none swap sw 0 0 , in /etc/fstab. .you just changing the dev node, with mmcblk1p1 (being one and only swap partition.
May 26 20:17:48 <zakkkkm> i see normal swap getting mounted though in fstab
May 26 20:17:54 <zakkkkm> it ignores it?
May 26 20:17:59 <DocScrutinizer> zakkkkm: fstab is a fake
May 26 20:18:12 <DocScrutinizer> gets rebuilt on every boot
May 26 20:18:15 <zakkkkm> blk0p1 mounted to /home/user/MyDocs .. blk0p2 = /home , and blk0p3 - swap
May 26 20:18:20 <ShadowJK> fstab is autogenerated AFTER things have been mounted. So, it only reflects what hte scripts did. Nothing ever acts on it.
May 26 20:18:35 <DocScrutinizer> zakkkkm: one of the nice idiosyncrasies of mameo
May 26 20:18:36 <zakkkkm> ah
May 26 20:18:44 <ShadowJK> Anyway, if you start meddling with the init scripts, you better backup first, because it's very easy to shoot yourself in the foot.
May 26 20:18:44 <merlin1991> hm I think the ati driver on my notebook went crazy
May 26 20:19:07 <merlin1991> or something more serious, now sounds stuttering too and the screen hangs on login animation
May 26 20:19:08 <zakkkkm> im thinking "regular" linux here, dont know how maemo works well
May 26 20:19:41 <DocScrutinizer> definitely *very* easy
May 26 20:19:45 <zakkkkm> so should i umount /dev/mmcblk0p3 , and swapon /dev/mmcblk1p1(i putting it to mmcblk1p1. )
May 26 20:19:58 <ShadowJK> It's complicated a bit by that there's no initfs anymore (*shake fist at people wanting it gone*), and emmc is only available relatively late in boot
May 26 20:20:03 <DocScrutinizer> the good news however are that backupmenu will still work
May 26 20:20:11 <DocScrutinizer> usually
May 26 20:20:16 <ShadowJK> zakkkkm, no, swapon microsd first, then swapoff mmcblk0p3
May 26 20:20:30 <ShadowJK> If you do it the other way, apps start panicing when there's suddenly alot less memory available.
May 26 20:20:56 <zakkkkm> so i mount , then umount?
May 26 20:21:03 <zakkkkm> kk :)
May 26 20:21:23 <DocScrutinizer> you don't mount swap
May 26 20:21:54 <zakkkkm> ah, sorry yeah.
May 26 20:22:09 <DocScrutinizer> I think like it's been mount some 15 years ago, but not nowadays
May 26 20:22:14 <zakkkkm> i consider it mounting cause its being used somewhere.. whether or not in filesystem
May 26 20:22:28 <zakkkkm> i guess a better word is "turn it on"
May 26 20:22:38 <dangergrrl> merlin1991: http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=Grrl - i wear copious amounts of leather and ride a big motorcycle and listen to industrial music :)
May 26 20:23:07 <DocScrutinizer> aslo the friggin mkswap been relatively new to me recently
May 26 20:23:14 <zakkkkm> alright.. .4gb swap lol
May 26 20:23:25 <DocScrutinizer> insane
May 26 20:23:39 <DocScrutinizer> way too much overhead
May 26 20:23:57 <DocScrutinizer> kswapd needs to keep some data tables in ram
May 26 20:23:58 <zakkkkm> swapon :  /dev/mmcblk1p1: Invalid argument
May 26 20:24:23 <zakkkkm> yeah i got confused myself, im like what is the make swap filesystem command? *googles*
May 26 20:24:58 * zakkkkm thinks 15 years ago, he was 5. 
May 26 20:26:27 <zakkkkm> what the, didnt create swap
May 26 20:26:42 <DocScrutinizer> 4gb is insane
May 26 20:27:14 <zakkkkm> setting up swapspace version 1, size = 3997167616 bytes
May 26 20:27:22 <zakkkkm> but it didnt format it at all?
May 26 20:27:28 <DocScrutinizer> mkswap?
May 26 20:27:47 <zakkkkm> DocScrutinizer, i jsut want to see it done, going to partition it properly later.
May 26 20:27:59 <zakkkkm> mkswap /dev/mmcblk1p1
May 26 20:28:15 <dangergrrl> if you get 4gb into swap on a n900 you will be very sad
May 26 20:28:21 <dangergrrl> lol
May 26 20:28:22 <zakkkkm> when i do mkswap it says Usage: mkswap DEVICE
May 26 20:29:06 <dangergrrl> setting up swapspace means it put a swap signature in the partition
May 26 20:29:12 <dangergrrl> thatÅ› all the formatting it needs
May 26 20:29:51 <zakkkkm> dangergrrl: amaze you? :)
May 26 20:29:58 <zakkkkm> why?
May 26 20:30:06 <zakkkkm> adding swap doesnt instantly make it slower
May 26 20:30:32 <dangergrrl> no, but if you were actually using that much it would be so slow...
May 26 20:30:53 <zakkkkm> swapon doesnt work, guess i need to change partition ID?
May 26 20:31:03 <zakkkkm> yeah of course
May 26 20:31:09 <dangergrrl> should be 83
May 26 20:31:31 <zakkkkm> i dont use sd card at all , figured it would be best if i just do whole thing now, while people are still here.. i can set like 800mb to it properly later tonight.. mess with partitioning it and such
May 26 20:33:08 <DocScrutinizer> >>> The  maximum useful size of a swap area depends on the architecture and the kernel version.  It is roughly 2GiB on       i386, PPC, m68k, ARM,
May 26 20:33:34 <DocScrutinizer> CAN'T YOU LISTEN WHEN i TELLYA 4gb IS *INSANE*
May 26 20:33:49 <DocScrutinizer> OOPScapslock
May 26 20:34:00 <DocScrutinizer> sorry
May 26 20:34:23 <dangergrrl> actually i used 4gb of swap on my phenom ii x4 945 with 8gb of ram
May 26 20:34:25 <zakkkkm> Im not gonna have 4gb swap..
May 26 20:34:38 <dangergrrl> but it was way less than my ram
May 26 20:34:53 <zakkkkm> i also need storage for camera pics, and such you realize.
May 26 20:34:58 <DocScrutinizer> dangergrrl: phenom ii is i386?
May 26 20:35:07 <zakkkkm> i just want to see this done .. then i will work on partitioning it
May 26 20:35:15 <dangergrrl> and it did get used when i compiled openoffice from source code in tmpfs
May 26 20:35:25 <dangergrrl> DocScrutinizer: x86_64
May 26 20:35:58 <DocScrutinizer> so what do we learn from that for max allowable swapsize, particularly on ARM?
May 26 20:36:21 <dangergrrl> that it should be much lower on 32 bit :P
May 26 20:36:40 <dangergrrl> 2 sounds like a useful max for 32 bit
May 26 20:37:06 <DocScrutinizer> zakkkkm: RTFM, I.E. man mkswap
May 26 20:37:54 <firstorm> how good r the n900's r drying out?
May 26 20:38:23 <firstorm> how good are the n900's at drying out? - proper english lol
May 26 20:38:50 <SpeedEvil> firstorm: ? First remove the battery. What happened?
May 26 20:38:59 <firstorm> well it's fallen out my pocket in a banger
May 26 20:39:02 <firstorm> and been on the floor
May 26 20:39:09 <firstorm> and we had abit of rain, but it didnt look that wet
May 26 20:39:23 <firstorm> but on top right of screen there is condesation? under it but don't look to bad
May 26 20:39:52 <SpeedEvil> Remove the battery. Do you have a drying cabinet ro similar that will be at >60C?
May 26 20:40:04 <firstorm> it's been in room for couple hours now and it powred up i get nokia logo then nothing after that and it's just got backlight on and nothing. when i ring it i get nothing but other phone rings
May 26 20:40:21 <firstorm> i can put it in the laundry room be warm in there ?
May 26 20:40:55 <firstorm> so it's not being soaking wet just got damp by looks of it!
May 26 20:41:09 <DocScrutinizer> FireFly|n900: device *now* working doesn't mean it's dry. It may continue to erode inside and fail in a week
May 26 20:41:45 <firstorm> never said it's now working lol! i just said i turn it on and i get the nokia logo
May 26 20:42:19 <DocScrutinizer> emove battery, place in a warn and dry place, slide it up, keep it open as much as possible, dry for several days(!)
May 26 20:42:44 <firstorm> servral days! :o :( nothing but hassle with this phone!
May 26 20:42:46 <DocScrutinizer> do NOT place into a bag of rice or similar BS nonsense
May 26 20:43:01 <firstorm> had 3 screens in it only had it a year1
May 26 20:43:39 <cehteh> just microwave it for drying }:>
May 26 20:43:51 <DocScrutinizer> haha, no don't do that
May 26 20:44:05 <SpeedEvil> firstorm: Or 12h if you put it in oven set at 80C. (first verify that the tehrmostat is accurate)
May 26 20:44:14 <MohammadAG> merlin1991, ping
May 26 20:44:34 <DocScrutinizer> 2nd make sure battery is out, it will explode at 80°C
May 26 20:45:13 <merlin1991> MohammadAG: pong
May 26 20:45:26 <firstorm> yer batterys on the side! bloody phone! :(
May 26 20:45:29 <firstorm> i'm lost with out it
May 26 20:45:48 <DocScrutinizer> that's why I got two of them ;-D
May 26 20:46:11 <firstorm> yer well thats a good idea but i don't really use functions enoguh etc i only txt / call / fb from it!
May 26 20:46:50 <firstorm> it's currently got a hair dryer pointed at it !
May 26 20:47:07 <firstorm> it must been on the deck for like 2 minutes if that! and it wasn't even wet :(
May 26 20:47:24 <DocScrutinizer> check hairdryer's temperature, phone will brak at 100..150°
May 26 20:47:55 <firstorm> can't make no difference to it now! it's broken lol!
May 26 20:47:59 <firstorm> nar it's on low setting
May 26 20:48:02 <DocScrutinizer> firstorm: well you said you got condesation in screen
May 26 20:48:34 <MohammadAG> merlin1991, update sociality and click on a youtube vid
May 26 20:48:45 <firstorm> it looks like it!
May 26 20:48:52 <firstorm> but no idea why it's not as i i dropped it in a puddle or anything
May 26 20:49:18 <DocScrutinizer> firstorm: you got to understand that the phone won't break from humidity, but from battery inserted while it's not completely dry
May 26 20:49:39 <firstorm> well it got wet and went flat
May 26 20:49:49 <firstorm> so i just left it on the side to dry
May 26 20:49:57 <firstorm> for couple hours!
May 26 20:49:58 <DocScrutinizer> so do not test if it works until you're damn sure it's dry again
May 26 20:50:22 <firstorm> i thought it was dry lol!
May 26 20:51:42 <jacekowski> it's not water that kills it
May 26 20:51:47 <DocScrutinizer> firstorm: take to sheets of transparent plastic, place some drops of water on one and cover with the other. Try to dry that. So you got an idea how long it'll take for water to dry between chip and mainboard
May 26 20:51:47 <jacekowski> it's corrosion
May 26 20:52:13 <firstorm> oh i know how long it takes to dry things
May 26 20:52:15 <firstorm> i'm nto stupid
May 26 20:52:32 <firstorm> but the fact it's sat on top of a pc for the last 3 hours i thought it would dry seems it didn't really get wet at all!
May 26 20:53:18 <merlin1991> ffs MohammadAG I've waited 10 mins for ham to give me the update view updated
May 26 20:53:28 <merlin1991> to realize that you didn't upload to devel :D
May 26 20:53:36 <MohammadAG> ...
May 26 20:54:04 <DocScrutinizer> merlin1991: haha, disable some useless repos!
May 26 20:54:12 <merlin1991> DocScrutinizer: I only have devel
May 26 20:54:14 <merlin1991> nothing else
May 26 20:54:24 <DocScrutinizer> that's just enough ;-P
May 26 20:54:30 <merlin1991> (some nokia repo too because you somtimes need stuff from there)
May 26 20:54:40 <merlin1991> yeah with extras only using ham update is ok
May 26 20:54:46 <merlin1991> with devel you're fscked
May 26 20:55:06 <DocScrutinizer> indeed, you should do that during night when you're sleeping
May 26 20:55:35 <DocScrutinizer> actually I usually do
May 26 20:55:52 <merlin1991> btw MohammadAG you need a busy sign on loading stuff like your wall too (not only in the news feed)
May 26 20:55:56 <DocScrutinizer> can't stand waiting like 6 minutes
May 26 20:56:26 <merlin1991> lol
May 26 20:56:36 <merlin1991> MohammadAG:  click a youtube vid and then go to task switcher
May 26 20:56:41 <merlin1991> so much win there :P
May 26 20:57:26 <merlin1991> also going back then doesn't stop playback
May 26 20:58:27 <MohammadAG> merlin1991, I had stacked window attribute set on a non stacked window
May 26 20:58:39 <MohammadAG> I figured you might want to browse facebook while listening
May 26 20:58:46 <MohammadAG> oh and maemo 5's QtMultimedia sucks
May 26 20:58:46 <merlin1991> ah k
May 26 20:58:57 <MohammadAG> actually, the pulseaudio policy system sucks
May 26 20:59:03 <merlin1991> but the video playing instead of desktop in taskswitcher is lol
May 26 20:59:33 <merlin1991> and you still have to reduce the height of comment and like buttons in portrait
May 26 20:59:39 <merlin1991> they are too huge
May 26 21:00:28 <firstorm> also i ntoiced if someone rings me the screen doesn't light up / flash n tell me it only shows when i slide screen up?
May 26 21:05:15 <DocScrutinizer> MohammadAG: orly? tell me more
May 26 21:06:13 <merlin1991> who of you guys played with my notebooks monitor cable?
May 26 21:06:59 <merlin1991> it seems to have gottan a loose contact
May 26 21:11:51 <dangergrrl> drwxr-xr-x  3 ariana ariana 4096 Sep 10  2010 /targets/FREMANTLE_X86/opt/
May 26 21:11:52 <dangergrrl> i presume the gui already did this step for me...
May 26 21:12:29 <MohammadAG> DocScrutinizer, opening systemui drops audio
May 26 21:13:08 <merlin1991> now it doesn't boot anymore :(
May 26 21:13:10 <DocScrutinizer> not really much of a surprise
May 26 21:15:13 <DocScrutinizer> MohammadAG: the policy enforcer is *closed  *complex  *crap and **pukeaudio**
May 26 21:15:39 <DocScrutinizer> and still I think it's nowere documented at all
May 26 21:16:06 <MohammadAG> libplayback? ha
May 26 21:16:27 <MohammadAG> bug 6694 was lulz
May 26 21:16:29 <povbot> Bug https://bugs.maemo.org/6694 libplayback missing -doc package
May 26 21:16:45 <DocScrutinizer> so what do you expect from it when it comes to scenario where it has to switch from state B -> state green and back
May 26 21:17:34 <DocScrutinizer> I doubt there's even a proper concept for that
May 26 21:18:55 <DocScrutinizer> for mce LED patterns you at very least got a "stack" of signals, with priorities and all. Where's that thing for audio policies?
May 26 21:18:59 <merlin1991> MohammadAG: new camera ui tells me: no access to memory, cannot save
May 26 21:20:39 <dangergrrl> so, once i have the whole SDK installed, what should i build? :)
May 26 21:20:39 <dangergrrl> lol
May 26 21:20:49 <DocScrutinizer> I.E. who's switching mixer back to the special setup I need for my telephone answering machine, when there's a high priority system alert (read bat low warning) firing during a managed call
May 26 21:21:01 <dangergrrl> yes, i installed the sdk and had no specific thing i wanted to build yet
May 26 21:21:49 <DocScrutinizer> dangergrrl: try Qt's hello world ;-)
May 26 21:22:22 <dangergrrl> thanks, that's a plan
May 26 21:23:47 <DocScrutinizer> MohammadAG: I don't even get it how to adjust volume for sounds via cmdline playsound
May 26 21:24:08 <DocScrutinizer> MohammadAG: it's all just an incredible mess
May 26 21:24:20 <dangergrrl> that's kinda what i was asking for exactly something that should work without too much difficulty
May 26 21:24:45 <dangergrrl> i want to try to port miro but may well give up once i start
May 26 21:24:55 <dangergrrl> itÅ› player is at least gstreamer based
May 26 21:25:32 <dangergrrl> kernels are more my speed than gui apps ;)
May 26 21:25:53 <DocScrutinizer> seems javispedro knows a tiny tad more about how audio works
May 26 21:28:22 <cehteh> http://news.slashdot.org/story/11/05/26/1933219/Chapel-Hill-Computational-Linguists-Crack-Skype-Calls
May 26 21:28:37 <cehteh> hehe .. microsoft will be not amused
May 26 21:30:21 <merlin1991> hm reverted camera-ui to meamo version, that one DID work
May 26 21:30:32 <SpeedEvil> Skype is down for lots.
May 26 21:30:44 <merlin1991> but what strikes me odd, is that the error was localized, but I see no localization in the new ui source
May 26 21:30:52 <MohammadAG> DocScrutinizer, sigh, I'm trying to find workarounds
May 26 21:31:58 <merlin1991> now upgraded again to cssu camera-ui and it still works, WTF?
May 26 21:32:29 <dangergrrl> it is removing maemo-sdk-sounds when i add the nokia packages, i presume that is ok
May 26 21:33:05 <MohammadAG> merlin1991, I'm guessing you're restarting camera-ui between all this
May 26 21:33:09 <dangergrrl> (since i don't have a choice)
May 26 21:33:19 <MohammadAG> dangergrrl, fine
May 26 21:33:24 <merlin1991> MohammadAG: yea restarting whole device
May 26 21:33:26 <MohammadAG> the SDK doesn't support sounds anyway
May 26 21:33:36 <MohammadAG> tsk tsk tsk merlin1991
May 26 21:33:42 <MohammadAG> dsmetool -k /usr/bin/camera-ui
May 26 21:33:51 <MohammadAG> dsmetool -t /usr/bin/camera-ui
May 26 21:33:56 <merlin1991> I guess camera-ui starts to fail over time
May 26 21:34:24 <merlin1991> LOL
May 26 21:34:39 <DocScrutinizer> mmmpf isn't there an event script for that?
May 26 21:34:50 <merlin1991> got meego sd in my n900, tells me storage format not supported when trying to go to it on file manager
May 26 21:35:33 <merlin1991> I think that'd be a good candiate for cssu
May 26 21:35:46 <merlin1991> updating the automount to ext filesystems too
May 26 21:43:32 <DocScrutinizer> no friggin camera-ui job in initctl
May 26 21:44:06 <MohammadAG> Xsession.post.d DocScrutinizer
May 26 21:44:36 <DocScrutinizer> grrrm ofcourse, whatelse
May 26 21:44:54 <DocScrutinizer> thanks MohammadAG
May 26 21:47:21 <merlin1991> so much for me doing some meego dev, my linux notebook went mental http://imagebin.org/155327
May 26 21:55:25 <billmania> merlin1991: Are you referring to the indication of your ubuntu notebook executing a periodic filesystem check? That's normal behavior, not a sign of mental illness.
May 26 21:55:44 <merlin1991> billmania:  I refer to the err perfect screen
May 26 21:55:53 <firstorm> man windows sucks so badly!
May 26 21:56:07 <merlin1991> them lines are not from the pic
May 26 21:56:10 <merlin1991> they are there in reality too
May 26 21:56:17 <merlin1991> and it doesn't get past boot screen
May 26 21:56:45 <merlin1991> billmania: ^^
May 26 21:56:45 <billmania> merlin1991: Ah. The fsck is still running? What is the size of your filesystem(s)?
May 26 21:56:55 <merlin1991> nono fsck went through fine
May 26 21:56:59 <merlin1991> but screen halts then
May 26 21:57:16 <merlin1991> welcome sound starts play and then breaks in the middle
May 26 21:57:29 <merlin1991> after that stalled screen with artifacts all over it
May 26 22:01:49 <MohammadAG> merlin1991, graphics card fucked up by the looks of it
May 26 22:06:55 <DocScrutinizer> merlin1991: resettle your chips (ram, cpu?, *cards...)
May 26 22:07:30 <DocScrutinizer> HDD, optical drive...
May 26 22:07:58 <DocScrutinizer> also check BIOS settings (and bios setting is working at all)
May 26 22:08:56 <DocScrutinizer> try booting a live cd
May 26 22:10:00 <DocScrutinizer> flip the LCD back and forth and see if the patterns on screen change
May 26 22:10:53 <DocScrutinizer> closely watch POST logs on screen for anything suspicious
May 26 22:11:11 <jacekowski> try windows on it
May 26 22:11:14 <jacekowski> windows works all the time
May 26 22:11:28 <jacekowski> it coule be some mess with KMS or stuff
May 26 22:12:22 <DocScrutinizer> (I assume you know how to get POST and linux boot console on buntkuh - ESC?)
May 26 22:14:44 <jacekowski> remove silent or quiet from kernel commandline
May 26 22:14:46 <jacekowski> in grub
May 26 22:15:02 <merlin1991> somethings really fscked this should be the bios: http://imagebin.org/155333
May 26 22:15:02 <joga> heh, looks familiar...
May 26 22:15:16 <joga> merlin1991, overheated often? fan stuck=
May 26 22:15:31 <merlin1991> none of that
May 26 22:15:39 <joga> tried pressing it? ;)
May 26 22:15:52 <jacekowski> do some voodo
May 26 22:15:55 <jacekowski> voodoo*
May 26 22:15:55 <joga> I have a laptop that does the same thing
May 26 22:16:27 <joga> had also another at work, both can be pressed hard and the image gets fixed if you keep pressing ;P the other on has definitely suffered some heat damage, a crappy amilo
May 26 22:16:29 <merlin1991> the weird thing is, that it can't be only the display controler or something
May 26 22:16:37 <merlin1991> because it doesn't get past the autologin to ubuntu
May 26 22:16:41 <jacekowski> it's probably memory
May 26 22:16:46 <merlin1991> the welcom sounds starts, but then starts to repeate at some point
May 26 22:16:57 <merlin1991> jacekowski: I removed both ram sticks once
May 26 22:17:08 <jacekowski> or memory controller
May 26 22:17:09 <merlin1991> what's the chance of both going to fail at the same time
May 26 22:17:14 <merlin1991> :D
May 26 22:17:15 <joga> merlin1991, but it does run cool? temperature is normal?
May 26 22:17:25 <jacekowski> joga: laptops can run at 90C
May 26 22:17:25 <merlin1991> temperature is normal
May 26 22:17:33 <joga> jacekowski, yeah and die eventually
May 26 22:17:34 <merlin1991> atm it's comepletely cold
May 26 22:18:04 <merlin1991> the thing that really strikes me odd is, I used it not 2 hours ago and everything was fine back then
May 26 22:18:52 <joga> I've found the ultimate fix for "can you do something about my laptop, it doesn't turn on / it shuts down randomly / it's messed up" is to disassemble it and blow out *all* the dust and crap on each and every part and especially the system fan
May 26 22:19:09 <joga> but if you have it that bad I don't think a simple dusting will help anymore
May 26 22:19:10 <merlin1991> dedusted it 2 weeks ago :D
May 26 22:19:17 <merlin1991> and also yea
May 26 22:19:31 <merlin1991> if that's overheat damage it's past getting ok by dedusting again :D
May 26 22:19:36 <joga> but the amilo did exactly that when it got hot
May 26 22:19:49 <joga> and eventually, it just stuck, the display was nothing but a mess
May 26 22:20:16 <merlin1991> I had it once in the summer running hot to about 75°C, but then it did flicker and stuff, but not this mess
May 26 22:20:20 <jacekowski> temperature doesn't damage electronics that easily
May 26 22:20:32 <merlin1991> (but that was 2 years ago)
May 26 22:20:41 <jacekowski> everything spends quite a bit of time in reflow oven at 200C+
May 26 22:20:47 <MohammadAG> <merlin1991> because it doesn't get past the autologin to ubuntu
May 26 22:20:52 <joga> jacekowski, that's what I thought too, but if you google for amilo temperature graphics problem or something there's a lot of stuff
May 26 22:20:53 <MohammadAG> graphics card, I'll  bet on it too
May 26 22:21:07 <jacekowski> joga: that's what people think
May 26 22:21:19 <jacekowski> joga: blaming temperature is easiest
May 26 22:21:27 <jacekowski> joga: but it's same graphic card as in other laptops
May 26 22:21:29 <joga> jacekowski, I actually blame where they put the graphics chip
May 26 22:21:36 * merlin1991 wants the laptop to be a newer model ffs
May 26 22:21:36 <jacekowski> joga: it's process related
May 26 22:21:49 <merlin1991> it's old enough that the chip even though ati is still onboard
May 26 22:21:50 <joga> but I didn't care to study it because it was the worst laptop I had seen probably
May 26 22:21:53 <jacekowski> joga: soldering fails rather most often
May 26 22:22:01 <jacekowski> joga: because of mechanical stresses
May 26 22:22:08 <jacekowski> joga: when stuff is heating up/cooling down
May 26 22:22:20 <merlin1991> my newer laptop has the graphics chip plugable
May 26 22:22:21 <joga> jacekowski, yeah and these people throw around their laptops etc
May 26 22:22:56 <jacekowski> i have old sony vaio
May 26 22:23:00 <jacekowski> 4th year now
May 26 22:23:02 <joga> the weirdest gfx related problem I've had will dell d630
May 26 22:23:05 <jacekowski> bought in 2007
May 26 22:23:12 <jacekowski> and it's still working fine
May 26 22:23:17 <joga> oh and it also has such a bug: http://www.cs.helsinki.fi/u/strommer/dell.mp4
May 26 22:23:25 <jacekowski> and it took quite a bit of abuse
May 26 22:23:52 <jacekowski> like being dropped onto steel floor in container
May 26 22:24:37 <joga> (s/will/has been with/)
May 26 22:27:20 <jacekowski> jacekowski.org/asus.mp4
May 26 22:27:27 <jacekowski> i had that kind of stuff happen to me
May 26 22:27:32 <jacekowski> but that was LCD grounding problem
May 26 22:28:14 <joga> heh
May 26 22:28:21 <joga> hardware quirks are the most entertaining though
May 26 22:28:27 <DocScrutinizer> merlin1991: reseat all your plugged components, incl (flat)cables
May 26 22:28:45 <DocScrutinizer> merlin1991: obviously there's something odd with addressing
May 26 22:29:04 <DocScrutinizer> of ram
May 26 22:29:07 <merlin1991> yea, taking it apart atm
May 26 22:29:09 <DocScrutinizer> video ram
May 26 22:29:15 <merlin1991> video ram prob
May 26 22:29:16 <joga> but sleep time now...good night
May 26 22:29:39 <merlin1991> tried to remove one of the ram slots each, but same story with only 1 slot (both of them)
May 26 22:29:49 <DocScrutinizer> actually mostly looks like a short between a addr and data line
May 26 22:30:38 <merlin1991> hm should it get till bios without system ram?
May 26 22:31:17 <DocScrutinizer> but it's actually hard to tell, except for the bit that it affects both video buffer and CPU opcode
May 26 22:31:24 <DocScrutinizer> no
May 26 22:31:35 <DocScrutinizer> usually not nowadays
May 26 22:31:40 * merlin1991 is trying to remove as many components as possible
May 26 22:38:46 <merlin1991> hm removed everything but 1 ram (used another one here that should still work)
May 26 22:38:49 <merlin1991> same result
May 26 22:40:19 <MohammadAG> it's the graphics card :p
May 26 22:44:33 <FIQ|n900> Hi. Something doesn't feel right here. I was going to copy over my microSD card's content to MyDocs. Checked how much space it used -- 5G. Fine. Checking how much space left on MyDocs. 25G - Fine. Copying, but after 51MB, N900 completly stopped responding, and forced me to do a hard reboot. After doing so, MyDocs is read-only. How can I check why this is the case?
May 26 22:45:09 <merlin1991> FIQ|n900: I had similar thing yestserday
May 26 22:45:16 <FIQ|n900> Also checked space after that operation, and nothing is full or anything like that.
May 26 22:45:16 <merlin1991> another reboot made mydocs normal again
May 26 22:45:36 <merlin1991> in my case it was an unzip operation on some 400mb that cause it
May 26 22:45:51 <FIQ|n900> ah
May 26 22:46:11 <FIQ|n900> One other thing I just noticed is that for just one hour ago, this appears in maemo-optify's log: 2011-05-27 00:30:55 :: not enough free space in /home (need at least 200 MB free), quitting.
May 26 22:46:49 <FIQ|n900> That's incorrect, I have 1.5MB free in /home, which is enough, why does it say it's too short on space?
May 26 22:46:55 <FIQ|n900> Er, 1.5GB*
May 26 22:47:37 <FIQ|n900> anyway, going to try a reboot
May 26 22:51:30 <MohammadAG> DocScrutinizer, ever seen http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=71414 ?
May 26 22:51:48 <MoonTiger> hi guys :)
May 26 22:51:53 <FIQ|n900> It worked, but only partially
May 26 22:52:14 <FIQ|n900> Started to copy agai, but after some copies, it went read-only again
May 26 22:52:15 <MoonTiger> anybody know how i can get a cursor on the xephyr screen?
May 26 22:52:19 <FIQ|n900> This time w/o reboot
May 26 22:52:40 <FIQ|n900> Maybe the files it tries to copy over is corrupted?
May 26 22:52:57 <derf> More likely the filesystem you're copying too is corrupt.
May 26 22:53:04 <derf> *to
May 26 22:53:16 <FIQ|n900> That seems fair
May 26 22:53:33 <derf> The vfat driver makes the fs read-only when it finds a problem.
May 26 22:54:19 <Sicelo> MohammadAG:
May 26 22:54:21 <FIQ|n900> Well, I haven't anything that I care of in that partition, so I guess I will just try a reformat, after doing a quick check if i want to keep anything in there
May 26 22:54:38 * Sicelo has seen that before :)
May 26 22:54:51 <derf> You can probably just run fsck on it.
May 26 22:55:13 <Sicelo> & iirc, DocScrutinizer mentioned the method here some time ago
May 26 22:55:19 <MohammadAG> first time I've seen it
May 26 22:55:43 <derf> FAT gets corrupted all the time, especially with a Maemo device that spontaneously reboots and runs out of battery all the time.
May 26 22:57:17 <Sicelo> i'm not sure if he mentioned the link, but he did explain about the pinout and suggested some method to use it
May 26 23:01:09 <ShadowJK> My device never reboots :P
May 26 23:01:24 <firstorm> DocScrutinizer?
May 26 23:01:39 <SpeedEvil> My leading cause of reboots is stopping the wrong watchdogged things.
May 26 23:02:19 <ShadowJK> lol
May 26 23:02:39 <ShadowJK> I've had a couple of times when I ran out of battery without bme running, that's a harsh shutdown :)
May 26 23:02:49 <ShadowJK> Usually with bme running, running out of battery is a clean shutdown
May 26 23:03:06 <SpeedEvil> ShadowJK: That too.
May 26 23:03:31 <SpeedEvil> ShadowJK: But 3280 (or wahtever it is) to 2750 is a useful amount of power.
May 26 23:03:47 <MoonTiger> wow this sb stuff is so f***ing frustrating
May 26 23:04:11 <ShadowJK> It's not that useful really, just a few minutes :)
May 26 23:04:35 <SpeedEvil> Around an hour of mp3
May 26 23:06:28 <FIQ|n900> the fsck helped, ty
May 26 23:07:51 <derf> Yer welcome.
May 26 23:09:48 <merlin1991> fu acer
May 26 23:10:10 <merlin1991> poweron controller is part of the main frame
May 26 23:10:23 <merlin1991> now I'll need to find the right pins
May 26 23:10:59 <Gizmokid2005> is there any way I can see what exactly is causing my N900 to not connect to my Wifi network all of a sudden? Instead of just "network connection error."
May 26 23:20:14 <DocScrutinizer> MohammadAG: now I have seen it :-D
May 26 23:33:34 <merlin1991> hm I got it into enough parts to get to the graphics chip
May 26 23:33:44 <merlin1991> bastard is soldered on the mainboard
May 26 23:33:50 <merlin1991> I'll need a new board
May 26 23:36:35 <DocScrutinizer> Sicelo: actually I mentioned exactly these pad some time ago here when we were discussing cradle designs, and I had same concerns back then as I posted now to this tmo thread
May 26 23:55:44 <DocScrutinizer> MohammadAG: ping
May 27 00:00:37 <DocScrutinizer> MohammadAG: I just had a closer look at the actually only 40 lines notification. Nice! One question though: AIUI there's that option to either close the taskswitcher thumbnail ( [x]), or click either of both the short notifier yellow bar or the taskswitcher yellow window to usually start e.g modest for new mails, phone for missed calls, dialogs for SMS... Could this be done with your code as well, e.g. by returning 0 when clicking on the
May 27 00:00:39 <DocScrutinizer> thumbnail and 1 for closing the thumbnail in taskswitcher? (or am I totally off and the thing looks completely different to what I thought it does?)
May 27 00:06:37 <merlin1991> DocScrutinizer: by any chance you have an acer aspire 1650 you don't need anymore lying around? :P
May 27 00:06:53 <DocScrutinizer> alas not
May 27 00:07:21 <DocScrutinizer> I have an old dusty EeePC701 with dead battery :-)
May 27 00:07:36 <merlin1991> nope that motherboard doesn't fit :D
May 27 00:07:49 <DocScrutinizer> lol, I bet it fits
May 27 00:07:55 <DocScrutinizer> it's really small
May 27 00:08:47 <merlin1991> btw I found out that for bluetooth in mine only the module is missing
May 27 00:08:55 <merlin1991> even the cable is in the case
May 27 00:09:01 <DocScrutinizer> usual
May 27 00:09:43 <DocScrutinizer> there's almost always something to plug in that's contained for next better model of that series
May 27 00:10:11 <merlin1991> in this case it's just the business version of the same thing :D
May 27 00:10:32 <merlin1991> I think the model is too old, can't find any motherboards on ebay except for some crazy us deals
May 27 00:10:45 <DocScrutinizer> alas the modules are prohibitively expensive to get as a spare part, usually
May 27 00:10:48 <merlin1991> and original parts from acer resellers are 350€ and up
May 27 00:11:40 <DocScrutinizer> yeah :-/
May 27 00:12:05 <DocScrutinizer> either you get it fixed somehow, or you'll better get a new laptop
May 27 00:12:21 <merlin1991> well I do have another one (the one I'm using atm)
May 27 00:12:37 <merlin1991> but it's my first own pc/laptop I ever got, so it's sad to bin it :D
May 27 00:12:47 <DocScrutinizer> btw did BIOS still "work" or was it also frozen?
May 27 00:12:57 <merlin1991> bios did "work"
May 27 00:13:06 <DocScrutinizer> hmmmmm
May 27 00:13:20 <DocScrutinizer> hmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm
May 27 00:13:22 <merlin1991> but the graphics chip is soldered on, so no chance replacing that one
May 27 00:13:39 <merlin1991> and it could be something on the board
May 27 00:13:47 <DocScrutinizer> I'm not completely sold to the gfxchip idea
May 27 00:14:04 <merlin1991> that was the bios http://imagebin.org/155333
May 27 00:14:13 <DocScrutinizer> I've seen it
May 27 00:14:42 <DocScrutinizer> you don't get any POST beeps?
May 27 00:14:46 <merlin1991> nothing
May 27 00:15:02 <DocScrutinizer> you tried VGA?
May 27 00:15:08 <merlin1991> yep same result
May 27 00:15:18 <DocScrutinizer> SAME result? o.O
May 27 00:15:25 <DocScrutinizer> mhm
May 27 00:15:26 <merlin1991> vga was the first thing I tried :D
May 27 00:16:13 <DocScrutinizer> yeah it's definitely something hw/soldering then, if there's no short in one of the ram sockets
May 27 00:17:33 <DocScrutinizer> is this a UMA model? (or whatever it's called, the gfx which shares RAM with CPU ram)
May 27 00:18:06 <merlin1991> it has 64 dedicated video ram
May 27 00:18:18 <merlin1991> dunno if it shares too
May 27 00:19:10 <merlin1991> I think it's some soldering issue, because if it hit it the pattern changes
May 27 00:23:48 <merlin1991> vga pic for the lulz http://imagebin.org/155344
May 27 00:46:58 <snappy> Im in the app manager, i've clicked update, and for some reason i can't see the openssh server/client or rootsh in the packages (i clicked all)
May 27 00:47:05 <snappy> i think all the catalogues are updated, Ova, Nokia, maemo, etc.
May 27 00:54:47 <merlin1991> snappy: when you go to xterm and type "apt-cache policy openssh" what do you get?
May 27 00:56:06 <snappy> oh heh, its installed
May 27 00:56:10 <snappy> i must've instaleld all of this already then
May 27 00:56:25 <snappy> oh yeah, duh, looks like i did
May 27 00:56:38 <merlin1991> :D
May 27 00:59:54 <dangergrrl> 7.5G used for the 32 bit ubuntu vm with just maemo 5 sdk
May 27 01:38:38 <DocScrutinizer> merlin1991: (hit it) that's great news
May 27 01:39:11 <DocScrutinizer> merlin1991: no really. This means it can get fixed, not a burnout chip
May 27 01:39:11 <merlin1991> yea but I got no equipment to solder that kind of stuff
May 27 01:40:31 <merlin1991> not exactly the best idea to start soldering somthing where the soldering iron tip is 20 times the size of the pin :/
May 27 01:41:25 <DocScrutinizer> hehe
May 27 01:41:26 <merlin1991> and I also don't know wich part is loose, because if I apply pressure pretty much anywhere on the board the pattern changes
May 27 01:41:48 <DocScrutinizer> that's an expert's job
May 27 01:41:58 <merlin1991> aka expensive job :D
May 27 01:42:06 <DocScrutinizer> hmm, depends
May 27 01:42:29 <SpeedEvil> merlin1991: Swapping out the motehraboard can be inexpenive in some cases via ebay if you get a smashed screen one
May 27 01:42:43 <DocScrutinizer> you could get away with sth like one hours alias 50EUR
May 27 01:43:01 <SpeedEvil> merlin1991: Wehre are you?
May 27 01:43:10 <merlin1991> SpeedEvil: been looking around can't get any damaged models, only boards but that only from the us too
May 27 01:43:18 <merlin1991> so I'm @ ~100€ min
May 27 01:43:21 <merlin1991> Austria
May 27 01:43:45 <SpeedEvil> I forget - is Austria in the eurozone?
May 27 01:43:48 <merlin1991> yep
May 27 01:43:58 <merlin1991> between germany and italy
May 27 01:44:12 <DocScrutinizer> merlin1991: I gather CPU is soldered as well?
May 27 01:44:19 <merlin1991> actually not
May 27 01:44:27 <SpeedEvil> In principle, you could start poking it with a stick - and see what is most sensitive to poking.
May 27 01:44:31 <DocScrutinizer> you reseated it?
May 27 01:45:12 <merlin1991> I didn't, but it's on a plastic sockel
May 27 01:45:23 <DocScrutinizer> yeah, sure
May 27 01:45:24 <merlin1991> where it says foxconn on it oO
May 27 01:45:43 <DocScrutinizer> those are always foxconn it seems
May 27 01:47:11 <merlin1991> just took it out to really test, yep it's not soldered :D
May 27 01:47:21 <DocScrutinizer> I'd not search for bad soldering before I checked *ALL* contact connectors
May 27 01:48:06 <DocScrutinizer> CPU socket is a popular point of failure
May 27 01:48:11 <merlin1991> there's nothing left
May 27 01:48:19 <merlin1991> except for the cpu socket
May 27 01:49:19 <merlin1991> so I reseated cpu, time to try again :D
May 27 01:49:27 <DocScrutinizer> yep
May 27 01:51:25 <DocScrutinizer> even if it doesn't work instantly - as long as *anything* changed on symptoms that's be a good sign
May 27 01:52:01 <merlin1991> same symptoms
May 27 01:52:07 <DocScrutinizer> :-(
May 27 01:53:14 <DocScrutinizer> take a hard stick (glass, spoon) and gently tap all chips
May 27 01:53:59 <DocScrutinizer> knock knock, anybody home?
May 27 01:55:43 <merlin1991> I'll do that tomorrow, now I'm too tired :D
May 27 01:55:55 <DocScrutinizer> I feel withya
May 27 01:56:28 <merlin1991> night #maemo
May 27 01:56:35 * DocScrutinizer glares at MX revolution mouse with its fsckdup switches >:-(
May 27 01:58:13 <merlin1991> oh I had several logitech mice who decided to have broken buttons one day
May 27 01:58:42 <DocScrutinizer> all have same dirt cheap crappy chinese switch
May 27 01:58:44 <merlin1991> my current razer survived abour 3 years by now though :D
May 27 01:59:29 <DocScrutinizer> and I guess I won't find a matching high quality cherry switch to replace them
May 27 02:01:23 <DocScrutinizer> switches are a real pita, as they have so many parameters (mechanically) that need to match exactly for the spare part
**** ENDING LOGGING AT Fri May 27 02:59:58 2011