**** BEGIN LOGGING AT Mon Jun 06 02:59:57 2011
Jun 06 03:00:06 <DocScrutinizer> quite some hints are scattered all over that page, most of them in "troubleshooting"
Jun 06 03:00:33 <DocScrutinizer> so read troubleshooting section before you even run into trouble ;-)
Jun 06 03:00:53 <DocScrutinizer> read *whole* page
Jun 06 03:09:42 <jeremy501> yeah I already have a problem.  got the flasher installed in ubuntu and in terminal its waiting for the device to be plugged in to start flashing but when I plug in n900 holding u key it comes up normal with nokia in middle of screen and usb in corner but terminal just sits and waits. dose not see the phone
Jun 06 03:10:58 <SpeedEvil> Some have dound hubs are an issue
Jun 06 03:11:02 <SpeedEvil> Also - remove battery
Jun 06 03:11:12 <SpeedEvil> Plug in phone. replace battery
Jun 06 03:11:25 <SpeedEvil> Run flasher in between
Jun 06 03:11:31 <SpeedEvil> some have found hubs
Jun 06 03:15:01 <jeremy501> that didnt work
Jun 06 03:15:16 <jeremy501> still dose not see phone
Jun 06 03:15:28 <SpeedEvil> Is charging intermittent?
Jun 06 03:15:48 <SpeedEvil> Do you get anything showing up on lsusb or in dmesg when you plug it in?
Jun 06 03:23:50 <jeremy501> if I plug into windows pc it detects it and it charges fine.  if I boot phone without usb it starts a bunch of code and stops with 2.838714] [c00089fc>](kernel_init+0x10c/0x1b4) from [<c00089fc>] (kernel_init+0x10c/0x1  2.855499] mtdoops:ready 18, 19 (no erase)
Jun 06 03:26:31 <GeneralAntilles> Ooh, that's sneaky.
Jun 06 03:27:09 <GeneralAntilles> The TechEYE.net blog appends a "Read more: …" link to the end of copied text.
Jun 06 03:27:19 <GeneralAntilles> A gem from mwkn.net this week: http://www.techeye.net/mobile/meego-will-be-dead-in-eight-months
Jun 06 03:28:27 <SpeedEvil> jeremy501: You get text on the screen?
Jun 06 03:28:40 * SpeedEvil wonders what's been done to this phone
Jun 06 03:29:18 <jeremy501> yes on phone I do
Jun 06 03:30:12 <GonzoTheGreat> jeremy501:Have you tried flshing it from windows?
Jun 06 03:30:19 <GonzoTheGreat> flashing
Jun 06 03:31:09 <jeremy501> not from windows yet.  I have a win 7 pc . maybe I should try? I like ubuntu better lol
Jun 06 03:32:04 <GonzoTheGreat> well I don't have windows but as you said it was detected there...
Jun 06 03:33:24 <jeremy501> ill try and let you know
Jun 06 04:09:09 <myuu> hey would simonLR happen to be here by chance?
Jun 06 05:08:22 <jeremy501> no luck on windows either. flasher is waiting for device and I hold u key and plug in usb and get the nokia screen and usb in corner like it should but flasher dose not see the phone
Jun 06 05:08:46 <jeremy501> it did when I tried to install meego and now it dont
Jun 06 05:11:24 <jeremy501> the meego install broke the phone so it cant be seen by flasher.  what is the work around for this. not seeing much on web for this
Jun 06 05:11:55 <GonzoTheGreat> Have you tried taking the microsd card out?
Jun 06 05:12:32 <GonzoTheGreat> not that it should matter, but who knows
Jun 06 05:12:43 <jeremy501> I took microsd and sim out before I started to try installing meego
Jun 06 05:13:13 <GonzoTheGreat> is it out now?
Jun 06 05:13:19 <jeremy501> yes
Jun 06 05:14:08 <GonzoTheGreat> sim as well?
Jun 06 05:14:22 <jeremy501> yes both are out
Jun 06 05:15:07 <GonzoTheGreat> which method did you use to install meego?
Jun 06 05:16:02 <jeremy501> my ubuntu laptop with flasher meego 1.2 for n900
Jun 06 05:17:17 <jeremy501> http://wiki.meego.com/ARM/N900/Install/EMMC
Jun 06 05:17:49 <GonzoTheGreat> ouch.
Jun 06 05:18:19 <jeremy501> followed instructions and it stopped responding and did not finish install after hours I reset phone and now this
Jun 06 05:19:36 <jeremy501> think its still stuck on meego 1.2 install cause when I boot phone it loads a bunch of commands and stops
Jun 06 05:20:18 <robbiethe1st> Does anyone know if it's possible to replace the Maemo browser backend with the one from, say, FF4? That way we'd still have the great stock UI, but a faster browser backend.
Jun 06 05:21:18 <jeremy501> is there a hard reset for n900?
Jun 06 05:21:43 <robbiethe1st> jeremy501: Um, hard reset? Either you mean yanking the battery or reflashing
Jun 06 05:23:51 <jeremy501> robbiethe1st,  reflashing cant see the phone on windows or ubuntu pc after trying to install meego to emmc.
Jun 06 05:24:19 <jeremy501> can ubuntu format n900 ?
Jun 06 05:24:23 <robbiethe1st> Yes.
Jun 06 05:24:39 <robbiethe1st> And, in fact, remember that the n900 is unbrickable: You /can/ reflash it
Jun 06 05:24:42 <robbiethe1st> no matter what you do
Jun 06 05:24:49 <robbiethe1st> Try this:
Jun 06 05:24:53 <robbiethe1st> 1. turn the N900 off.
Jun 06 05:25:11 <robbiethe1st> 2. on ubuntu, run flasher(as root of course)
Jun 06 05:25:15 <DocScrutinizer> jeremy501: reboot ubuntu, start flasher, plug in N900 w/o battery, hold 'u', ins bat - if USB icon shows up upper right and flasher doesn't start, you go check syslog/dmesg for any new kernel modules ubuntu loaded, then ^C and restart flasher
Jun 06 05:25:35 <robbiethe1st> Basically
Jun 06 05:25:54 <robbiethe1st> I wouldn't bother holding U, but yea, that works
Jun 06 05:26:21 <jeremy501> robbiethe1st, tried all that with no luck
Jun 06 05:26:50 <robbiethe1st> what does flasher say when you run it?
Jun 06 05:26:53 <jeremy501> DocScrutinizer, did not try rebooting ubuntu yet and flasher.  think that could be it?
Jun 06 05:27:10 <jeremy501> flasher waits for the device and never sees it
Jun 06 05:27:34 <robbiethe1st> Hm... and you ran it as root, right?
Jun 06 05:27:35 <DocScrutinizer> it's a well known common problem that several distros load modules when N900 gets plugged in, and those block flasher
Jun 06 05:28:01 <DocScrutinizer> lsmod|grep cdc_
Jun 06 05:28:03 <robbiethe1st> that's what... cdc_phonet and phonet?
Jun 06 05:28:12 <DocScrutinizer> yup
Jun 06 05:28:38 <DocScrutinizer> also there's some reports about new distros have a fsckdup ehci
Jun 06 05:29:04 <jeremy501> ran as sudo
Jun 06 05:29:06 <DocScrutinizer> and of course 64bit is special
Jun 06 05:29:44 <jeremy501> ill reboot and brb
Jun 06 05:29:49 <DocScrutinizer> robbiethe1st: when not run as root, flasher throws error, not wait infinitely
Jun 06 05:30:00 <robbiethe1st> Oh, good
Jun 06 05:30:18 <jeremy501> yes this waits infinitely
Jun 06 05:30:29 <jeremy501> brb
Jun 06 05:46:51 <DocScrutinizer> hmm, funny. started flasher-3.5 -i and plugged in N900 -->
Jun 06 05:46:56 <DocScrutinizer> Suitable USB device not found, waiting.
Jun 06 05:46:57 <DocScrutinizer> Unable to enumerate USB buses!
Jun 06 05:47:28 <DocScrutinizer> cursur-up, enter -->
Jun 06 05:47:44 <DocScrutinizer> USB device found found at bus 001, device address 096.
Jun 06 05:47:45 <DocScrutinizer> Found device RX-51, hardware revision 2101
Jun 06 05:50:49 <DocScrutinizer> reproducable
Jun 06 05:50:52 <jeremy501> ha lol reboot ubuntu and now flasher sees phone! thanks DocScrutinizer
Jun 06 05:50:59 <DocScrutinizer> yw
Jun 06 05:51:51 <GonzoTheGreat> How did that affect your use of windows though???
Jun 06 05:53:10 <jeremy501> who me ?
Jun 06 05:53:30 <jeremy501> ubuntu smokes windows every time!
Jun 06 05:54:22 <GonzoTheGreat> Well it should have been different under windows?
Jun 06 06:15:34 <Venemo_N900> good morning
Jun 06 06:26:36 <DocScrutinizer> morning Venemo_N900
Jun 06 06:27:14 <jeremy501> install was successful but now it has a line drawn threw the sim where the signal should be. is there another flash I need or software?
Jun 06 06:28:01 <DocScrutinizer> insering SIM should suffice ;-D
Jun 06 06:28:37 <Venemo_N900> hey DocScrutinizer, what's up?
Jun 06 06:28:53 <DocScrutinizer> nuttin special right now
Jun 06 06:29:45 <jeremy501> where the signal bar should be it has line drawn through a pic of a sim card and it is installed correctly. i pulled it out and back in to see
Jun 06 06:30:15 <DocScrutinizer> that's highly unusual
Jun 06 06:30:27 <DocScrutinizer> please double check
Jun 06 06:30:57 <Venemo_N900> jeremy501, that indicates that either your SIM card is not in, or it's not working
Jun 06 06:31:26 <DocScrutinizer> or you gave wrong PIN, or entered offline mode
Jun 06 06:32:42 <DocScrutinizer> it *could* also signal problems with the GSM modem, but that's highly unlikely
Jun 06 06:35:26 <DocScrutinizer> also, just in case: you are sure you didn't mix SIM and uSD (yes, I know...), and you properly locked the SIM holder
Jun 06 06:35:44 <jeremy501> maybe I install wrong flash ?   sudo flasher-3.5 -F RX-51_2009SE_1.2009.42-11.002_PR_COMBINED_002_ARM.bin -f -R      this is for n900
Jun 06 06:36:00 <DocScrutinizer> quite old
Jun 06 06:36:16 <jeremy501> every time I reboot phone it looses time and date too now
Jun 06 06:36:29 <DocScrutinizer> that's a known hw bug
Jun 06 06:36:41 <DocScrutinizer> please read
Jun 06 06:36:43 <DocScrutinizer> ~flash
Jun 06 06:36:44 <infobot> from memory, flashing is http://wiki.maemo.org/Updating_the_tablet_firmware
Jun 06 06:36:55 <DocScrutinizer> about recent PR1.3 version
Jun 06 06:37:35 <DocScrutinizer> aaah, and _002_ us errr, USA?
Jun 06 06:37:58 <DocScrutinizer> generally everybody suggests to use global
Jun 06 06:38:14 <jeremy501> global ...ok
Jun 06 06:38:24 <DocScrutinizer> as nobody found special "goodies" yet in any localized FIASCO
Jun 06 06:39:14 <jeremy501> I also have this one downloaded  ..  RX-51_2009SE_1.2009.41-1.VANILLA_PR_EMMC_MR0_ARM.bin
Jun 06 06:39:27 <DocScrutinizer> and PR1.2 US FIASCO  (the obsolete one you referred to above) is also known to actually have occasional problems with modem
Jun 06 06:40:03 <DocScrutinizer> also an old one
Jun 06 06:40:09 <DocScrutinizer> please read
Jun 06 06:40:13 <DocScrutinizer> ~flash
Jun 06 06:40:13 <infobot> somebody said flashing was http://wiki.maemo.org/Updating_the_tablet_firmware
Jun 06 06:41:32 <DocScrutinizer> it clearly states RX-51_2009SE_20.2010.36-2_PR_COMBINED_MR0_ARM.bin to be most recent
Jun 06 06:42:41 <DocScrutinizer> oops, not for the VANILLA of your last post, didn't see that
Jun 06 06:42:57 <jeremy501> DocScrutinizer, the one you just listed is most recent?
Jun 06 06:43:08 <DocScrutinizer> please read
Jun 06 06:43:11 <DocScrutinizer> ~flash
Jun 06 06:43:11 <infobot> hmm... flashing is http://wiki.maemo.org/Updating_the_tablet_firmware
Jun 06 06:44:17 <DocScrutinizer> it has *ALL* the info
Jun 06 06:44:46 <yigal> tablet, at least physical tablets are now being created that are more of I imagined as a child
Jun 06 06:45:00 <yigal> more of what I imagined as a child
Jun 06 06:45:06 <yigal> sorry a bit drunk as usual
Jun 06 06:45:08 <DocScrutinizer> >>Replace RX-51_2009SE_2.2009.51-1_PR_COMBINED_MR0_ARM.bin with the firmware you wish to update. (Make sure you have downloaded the actual corresponding file.) The latest PR1.3 official (rootfs) images are listed below:
Jun 06 06:46:05 <DocScrutinizer> it's not even any smaller font than the rest of that page
Jun 06 06:46:22 <DocScrutinizer> hell, it's BOLD
Jun 06 06:47:06 <yigal> lol
Jun 06 06:48:27 <jeremy501> ill try the global one if it is suggested
Jun 06 06:48:43 <DocScrutinizer> ok, it's under "windows", but I'm sure I at least 2 times gave the advice to read the *whole* page *carefully*,
Jun 06 06:49:11 <yigal> argh
Jun 06 06:50:22 <wblaze> also dont do anything to firmware whilst drunk, heh
Jun 06 06:50:43 <Venemo_N900> wblaze, :D
Jun 06 06:51:30 * wblaze learns things the hard way so others don't have to
Jun 06 06:51:53 <Venemo_N900> :)
Jun 06 06:53:50 <yigal> man had enough of Netflix back in a Linux/OSS distro. if feels better
Jun 06 07:09:27 <crashanddie> DocScrutinizer, chill :)
Jun 06 07:17:11 <Venemo_N900> MohammadAG51, I found a bug in sociality
Jun 06 07:28:19 <crashanddie> Venemo_N900, it's not a bug, it's a feature
Jun 06 07:29:18 <Venemo_N900> crashanddie, I see
Jun 06 07:29:36 <crashanddie> Venemo_N900, just to be sure, what are you talking about?
Jun 06 07:31:59 <Venemo_N900> crashanddie, old messages are labeled with "xx minutes ago, via some app"
Jun 06 07:32:16 <crashanddie> screenshot?
Jun 06 07:32:17 <Venemo_N900> literally, xx minutes ago
Jun 06 07:32:32 <Venemo_N900> don't ask me to upload a screenshot via EDGE
Jun 06 07:32:43 <crashanddie> oh
Jun 06 07:38:02 <crashanddie> Venemo_N900, what window is it in?
Jun 06 07:38:08 <crashanddie> Venemo_N900, in the main view?
Jun 06 07:40:04 <Venemo_N900> crashanddie, I clicked messages in the main window
Jun 06 07:40:25 <crashanddie> ok, I found it
Jun 06 07:40:38 <crashanddie> it's hardcoded in newsfeedpost.ui
Jun 06 07:41:37 <Venemo_N900> hehh
Jun 06 07:47:35 <crashanddie> MohammadAG51, either he's running an old version, or there is a bug in NewsFeedPost::setTime() [that was added to the master branch on 4th May)
Jun 06 07:48:54 <crashanddie> Venemo_N900 & MohammadAG51: I'd submit a patch, but I cba to create a facebook account to test.
Jun 06 08:16:28 <hiemanshu> hmmm, I could write a twitter client in PyQt
Jun 06 08:16:33 <hiemanshu> wondering I should do it
Jun 06 08:16:41 <DocScrutinizer> hehe, I sympathise
Jun 06 08:16:57 <DocScrutinizer> with crashanddie
Jun 06 08:16:58 <hiemanshu> I dont know much C++ :(
Jun 06 08:20:48 <Jaffa> Arse. abill_uk's started on the latest MWKN thread on TMO
Jun 06 08:23:16 <crashanddie> DocScrutinizer, why?
Jun 06 08:26:02 <alterego> Jaffa: \o/
Jun 06 08:26:18 <alterego> You didn't mention "MeeGo" did you?
Jun 06 08:29:11 <Jaffa> alterego: Apparently it's a "thread" which is "negative about MeeGo"
Jun 06 08:29:21 <alterego> Yeah, just read it.
Jun 06 08:29:50 <alterego> He's changed his tune though, now he seems to be protecting Carstens delicate sensibilities :)
Jun 06 08:30:06 <Jaffa> Indeed. I'm not sure Stskeeps wants - or needs - to be protected from me.
Jun 06 08:30:11 <Jaffa> I'm his Number One Fan ;-)
Jun 06 08:30:27 <alterego> Only a week ago he was saying how MeeGo was a pointless endeavour and the DE project have acheived in a few months what would take him an hour or so.
Jun 06 08:30:28 <Jaffa> As the presents I've been sending to his house will show.
Jun 06 08:30:38 <alterego> Hahah
Jun 06 08:30:46 <Jaffa> Ah, nice. Glad I don't read TMO too much
Jun 06 08:33:02 * RST38h still thinks TMO has to have an "ignore" feature
Jun 06 08:33:16 <Jaffa> RST38h: It does for users. Not for threads, unfortunately :-(
Jun 06 08:33:32 <RST38h> Jaffa: How do I ignore abill_uk dude?
Jun 06 08:34:55 <Jaffa> RST38h: Click on his name, then "View Public Profile", then "User Lists", then "Add to Ignore List"
Jun 06 08:35:14 <RST38h> Jaffa: thanks!
Jun 06 08:35:16 <Jaffa> RST38h: Short version - if you're logged in - this should do it (barring CSRF protection) http://talk.maemo.org/profile.php?do=addlist&userlist=ignore&u=33715
Jun 06 08:36:35 <DocScrutinizer51> crashanddie: FB?
Jun 06 08:37:03 <RST38h> Done.
Jun 06 08:57:01 <crashanddie> Jaffa, I pray for abill's customers if he ever got as far in life as to own his business
Jun 06 08:58:26 <ruskie> haha
Jun 06 09:00:28 <RST38h> crashanddie: prolly not though
Jun 06 09:00:33 <RST38h> moo, ab
Jun 06 09:05:13 <RST38h> "Java is high performance. By high performance we mean adequate. By adequate we mean slow."
Jun 06 09:05:50 <ab> beh, RST38h
Jun 06 09:06:16 <arvut> Hi all, would c++ be a preferable language if I want to develop apps for maemo5?
Jun 06 09:06:46 <ruskie> if using Qt then I'd say yes
Jun 06 09:07:04 <crashanddie> arvut, there's quite a few languages to choose from, and it really depends on what you're trying to achieve
Jun 06 09:07:08 <Necc> develop a dropbox client ._.
Jun 06 09:07:15 <arvut> alright, will keep on studying it then
Jun 06 09:07:20 <Necc> btw your choices are wide
Jun 06 09:07:32 <arvut> crashanddie: what about programming for gps?
Jun 06 09:07:39 <Necc> https://www.dropbox.com/developers
Jun 06 09:07:58 <crashanddie> Necc, what the fuck are you talking about?
Jun 06 09:08:13 <crashanddie> arvut, if you want fast response times and snappy UI, then C++ might be a good option, if you want to develop with ease and not have to deal with stupidly complex things in C++, then go for Python
Jun 06 09:08:41 <crashanddie> arvut, in any case, the GPS interfaces are easy to access in any language, don't know if there are native libraries in every language (it's just a file to open and read from, basically)
Jun 06 09:08:43 <arvut> I wanna make a reminder that tells you what to do when you're in a certain area
Jun 06 09:08:56 <crashanddie> "You just entered Detroit: RUN"
Jun 06 09:09:07 <ruskie> isn't there something like that already?
Jun 06 09:09:09 <arvut> crashanddie: aha
Jun 06 09:09:13 <Necc> i'm part of many many channels in many many many IRC server
Jun 06 09:09:17 <arvut> ruskie: no idea
Jun 06 09:09:45 <crashanddie> "You just landed in Glasgow, would you like to turn back the clock 20 years?" (joke credit: frankie boyle)
Jun 06 09:09:54 <Necc> but this is the only and the real ony ONE channel, where i get the most biggest (mostly write-only motivated) DICK answers
Jun 06 09:10:16 <crashanddie> Necc, don't tell an op he's a dick.
Jun 06 09:10:27 <crashanddie> especially when he's a bastard op to start with.
Jun 06 09:10:32 <ruskie> hehe
Jun 06 09:10:35 <arvut> this is the only channel I know of that makes sense :)
Jun 06 09:11:24 <crashanddie> arvut, also, be aware that you will receive as many opinions on development preferences as there are people in this channel
Jun 06 09:11:34 <arvut> does java run on the n900 btw?
Jun 06 09:11:47 <RST38h> yes, badly
Jun 06 09:11:53 <arvut> crashanddie: always welcome =)
Jun 06 09:11:53 <crashanddie> arvut, do you really want to use a JIT language on such a slow CPU?
Jun 06 09:12:01 <arvut> nope
Jun 06 09:12:12 <Necc> i totally don't care who is who the hell in this world, you can be the president of the US, i even tell it if YOU start fouling about
Jun 06 09:12:16 <arvut> I really prefer speed
Jun 06 09:12:35 <arvut> but C# is actually kinda nice...
Jun 06 09:12:44 <crashanddie> I can understand Python even though it is relatively slow because of the ease of development, even though I used to be a Java dev before, I have a hard time justifying it on the N900.
Jun 06 09:12:56 <crashanddie> Necc, whatever.
Jun 06 09:13:20 <ruskie> arvut, I thought mono was available as well somewhere in the repos
Jun 06 09:14:01 <arvut> I'm in my newbie stage of coding, peeking on different languages and trying to decide what to focus on
Jun 06 09:14:22 <arvut> ruskie: heard mono is a nightmare tho
Jun 06 09:14:23 <crashanddie> arvut, well, I'd recommend C++.
Jun 06 09:14:34 <crashanddie> arvut, I'd recommend against Mono
Jun 06 09:14:40 <arvut> crashanddie: good, I like C++
Jun 06 09:15:03 <crashanddie> Most people will already have all the C++ dependencies installed on their N900, not many will have the Mono deps (and make your app a lot bigger to carry, as well)
Jun 06 09:15:04 <Necc> C/C++ is not the most best language for starters, imo
Jun 06 09:15:08 <arvut> so mono is.. worth installing?
Jun 06 09:15:44 <arvut> yeah, thats the problem with JIT isnt it? those big frameworks
Jun 06 09:15:54 * RST38h sighs
Jun 06 09:16:27 <arvut> Necc: I started with C, moved on to C++, now looking at C# and liking it..
Jun 06 09:16:27 <RST38h> arvut: If you do not have much experience in esotheric software disciplines, you wo't even be able to install Java or Mono properly on your N900.
Jun 06 09:16:31 <robbiethe1st> I'd use Python+PyQT for lightweight apps; stuff that's mostly GUI with a little glue logic. Stuff that needs speed(i.e. games, video/image processing and the like), C++. Period.
Jun 06 09:16:44 <crashanddie> arvut, I'd say: make your first draft in Python (Python is an excellent prototyping language), release it, and get reviews/comments about it. If people complain about sluggishness, analyse what can be optimised, and make v2 C++ if you have the need for it.
Jun 06 09:16:45 <lardman> morning
Jun 06 09:16:54 <RST38h> arvut: So, stay with Python and move to C/C++ once you know enough
Jun 06 09:16:57 <RST38h> HELO lardman
Jun 06 09:17:02 <crashanddie> lardman, moaning
Jun 06 09:17:05 <robbiethe1st> RST38h: I disagree about Java. Just install othe OpenJDK package and you're done.
Jun 06 09:17:08 <lardman> hey RST38h crashanddie
Jun 06 09:17:13 <robbiethe1st> (or was it icedtea?)
Jun 06 09:17:18 <arvut> RST38h: not sure what esotheric software disciplines would be so I guess I'll avoid it 4 now
Jun 06 09:17:19 <RST38h> robbie: ahhaha :)
Jun 06 09:17:28 <arvut> lardman: morning
Jun 06 09:17:42 <robbiethe1st> Hey, it works well enough to run Runescape, so I'd say it's the full Java package.
Jun 06 09:17:42 <lardman> hi arvut
Jun 06 09:18:26 <crashanddie> arvut, he means "if you're not an expert in a specific field of software development, don't use Java/Mono"
Jun 06 09:18:40 <arvut> crashanddie: oh =)
Jun 06 09:18:49 <robbiethe1st> And I agree with that, despite my previous comment
Jun 06 09:18:57 <RST38h> crash: even installing these is difficult - lots of packages, high probability of having to configure them manually
Jun 06 09:19:02 <arvut> good to know
Jun 06 09:19:04 <crashanddie> aye
Jun 06 09:19:18 <RST38h> crash: So, no reason to use this stuff.
Jun 06 09:19:35 <crashanddie> RST38h, I wholeheartedly agree :)
Jun 06 09:20:15 <Necc> OMG runescape x.x
Jun 06 09:20:30 <robbiethe1st> Necc: Yea, I still play it. What of it?
Jun 06 09:21:05 <arvut> so, what should I use for developing apps then? an IDE? a few shells with compilers and editors? how do I complile for this little cpu?
Jun 06 09:21:42 <arvut> I don't think I wanna compile on the phone
Jun 06 09:21:43 <robbiethe1st> If you're using Python, no need to compile: Just transfer the files and run
Jun 06 09:21:53 <arvut> C++
Jun 06 09:21:54 <robbiethe1st> for compiling C++, Scratchbox
Jun 06 09:22:03 <Necc> one of my friend plays that... i never seen so boring and monoton game ever since. i just wonder how that company still can keep their old customers when you do exactly the same things over and over for weeks
Jun 06 09:22:10 <arvut> I'm used to code::blocks
Jun 06 09:23:17 <arvut> Necc: did that too 10 years ago ;) addictive until some rude idiot decided to rob me
Jun 06 09:23:57 <arvut> so, scratchbox? what is it? an IDE?
Jun 06 09:25:46 <crashanddie> Hmm, it would take 115 thousand trillion trillion years for my password to be bruteforced.
Jun 06 09:26:37 <Necc> not if the person uses a GPGPU system :p
Jun 06 09:26:45 <crashanddie> actually, even if they do
Jun 06 09:26:47 <arvut> crashanddie: even with NSA's thinking machine?
Jun 06 09:27:02 <crashanddie> well, assuming they have to validate it over a network connection
Jun 06 09:27:44 <crashanddie> ok, fair deal, by using GPU's and offline cracking, it's just under a thousand trillion years.
Jun 06 09:27:53 <Necc> nah, it's just a matter of time... typically 10 years and the most most most strongest encryptions are hacked
Jun 06 09:28:25 <crashanddie> that assumes the password never changes, and that the encryption is never updated.
Jun 06 09:28:33 <Necc> in the past, people said "it is unhackable" so many times, that i don1t belive it anymore
Jun 06 09:28:49 <arvut> lol I just found the moobox app :)
Jun 06 09:29:03 <ruskie> Necc, you misunderstood... it's not just encryption... it's updating it constantly and changing the password
Jun 06 09:30:11 <arvut> what is a "sid player" btw?
Jun 06 09:30:21 <ruskie> sid - type of music format
Jun 06 09:30:30 <Necc> well, gl. but still, i do not belive anything is unbreakable within ~10 years
Jun 06 09:30:35 <crashanddie> If every year you add one character to your password (not necessarily at the end, anywhere in said password), it becomes manageable enough for you to memorise, and you can use addendums for each different service
Jun 06 09:30:51 <ruskie> C64 music format
Jun 06 09:31:25 <crashanddie> Necc, well, how about this, most security tokens (like the RSA SecurID etc) use encryptions which can be broken in a matter of hours (3DES), yet it doesn't matter :)
Jun 06 09:32:15 <crashanddie> because a typical token will replace its seed every minute or two, making the previous password useless.
Jun 06 09:32:29 <edheldil> crashanddie:  you of COURSE know this, rrrriiiight? http://imgs.xkcd.com/comics/security.png
Jun 06 09:32:35 <crashanddie> edheldil, aye
Jun 06 09:32:51 <ruskie> hehe
Jun 06 09:33:13 <crashanddie> edheldil, I know it especially well considering that two people using a system I deployed were murdered in London using exactly that spirit.
Jun 06 09:33:19 <robbiethe1st> Of course, all I really need to do is get a backdoor'd program onto your system, gain root access...
Jun 06 09:33:36 <crashanddie> robbiethe1st, and then... what exactly?
Jun 06 09:34:07 <edheldil> crashanddie:  eek :(
Jun 06 09:34:09 <robbiethe1st> access to whatever it is you care about :P
Jun 06 09:34:15 <crashanddie> robbiethe1st, yes, and?
Jun 06 09:34:22 <crashanddie> robbiethe1st, let's go for the online banking theory
Jun 06 09:34:43 <crashanddie> you need an OTP to access the account, and an CR for transactions.
Jun 06 09:34:58 <crashanddie> and the CR uses a component of the transaction the *user can verify*
Jun 06 09:35:16 <ruskie> hmm does mappero support offline maps???
Jun 06 09:35:21 <crashanddie> not some blind number that doesn't match anything, it's part target account ID, part amount.
Jun 06 09:35:38 <Necc> ruskie, someone said a few days ago yes
Jun 06 09:36:26 <ruskie> no wonder people went and hacked RSA to get their seeds for the stuff
Jun 06 09:36:28 <edheldil> crashanddie:  that's what at least some banks here use. Even better with SIM Toolkit, that's why I miss it on n900 :(
Jun 06 09:36:43 <crashanddie> SIM?
Jun 06 09:36:59 <crashanddie> I wouldn't trust my neighbour's kids to SIM protection.
Jun 06 09:37:33 <crashanddie> ruskie, RSA doesn't hold the seeds
Jun 06 09:37:46 <edheldil> if you say so - I haven't seen it hacked (that does not say so much) and it's better than plain SMS
Jun 06 09:38:11 <crashanddie> ruskie, and even if they did, the seed is updated based on the amount of times the token has been used, and at what time
Jun 06 09:38:39 <crashanddie> ruskie, meaning that even with the original seed, you couldn't accurately predict what the clock counter and event counter had at $X point in time.
Jun 06 09:39:00 <arvut> isnt tor available for maemo?
Jun 06 09:39:03 <crashanddie> Disclaimer: I used to work for one of RSA's competitors in this field.
Jun 06 09:39:19 <arvut> I think I installed it once
Jun 06 09:39:22 <Necc> arvut, there's a client for it with some GUI
Jun 06 09:39:36 <arvut> Necc: thought so
Jun 06 09:39:42 <Necc> but it's functionality is restricted
Jun 06 09:40:29 <Necc> aaah i mean not complete and not restricted
Jun 06 09:44:34 <arvut> aha
Jun 06 09:45:21 <arvut> anything you could recommend instead then?
Jun 06 09:48:21 <Necc> ... tor 2.0? :D
Jun 06 09:48:36 <Necc> or some VPN
Jun 06 09:48:44 <crashanddie> "We are open every day of the week, except for Sundays, Mondays and Thursdays"
Jun 06 09:49:09 <crashanddie> I'm guessing we don't have the same definition of "every day of the week".
Jun 06 09:49:31 <ruskie> well it's easier to specify the lesser group ;)
Jun 06 10:10:01 <chem|st> ruskie: "We are open from Tuesday till Saturday, except Thursdays" is shorter...
Jun 06 10:11:53 <chem|st> it is like spelling out www in "double U, double U, double U" instead of "world wide web"
Jun 06 10:15:41 <jacekowski> as far as i know it's not "double U"
Jun 06 10:16:09 <jacekowski> it would be double ues
Jun 06 10:19:45 <khertan> Morning
Jun 06 10:30:10 <chem|st> jacekowski: on presentations they used the phrase with the tripplet while talking about the world wide web not about the subdomain
Jun 06 11:10:07 <crashanddie> the few domains I own all have uuuuuu.<domain>.<tld>
Jun 06 11:10:19 <crashanddie> and also vvvvvv.<domain>.<tld>
Jun 06 11:11:09 <jacekowski> ?
Jun 06 11:11:26 <crashanddie> "double u, double u, double u, dot"
Jun 06 11:11:37 <crashanddie> and in french: "double v, double v, double v, point"
Jun 06 11:12:03 <ruskie> hehe
Jun 06 11:12:11 <merlin1991> crashanddie: I want some of that stuff too ;)
Jun 06 11:14:11 <Venemo> good morning
Jun 06 11:14:46 <edheldil> ruskie:  it's market speak. To say We are open Tuesdays, Wednesdays, Fridays and Saturdays is about the same length and rather more intuitive
Jun 06 11:15:27 <crashanddie> Venemo, from earlier when you were gone: "MohammadAG51, either he's running an old version, or there is a bug in NewsFeedPost::setTime() [that was added to the master branch on 4th May)" and "Venemo_N900 & MohammadAG51: I'd submit a patch, but I cba to create a facebook account to test."
Jun 06 11:16:10 <Venemo> crashanddie, thanks :)
Jun 06 11:16:26 <Venemo> crashanddie, I'm running the one from extras-devel, but dunno how old it is
Jun 06 11:16:40 * MohammadAG51 feels lost
Jun 06 11:16:50 <Venemo> hey MohammadAG51 :)
Jun 06 11:16:50 <crashanddie> couldn't tell you, haven't seen my N900 in months
Jun 06 11:16:58 <Venemo> crashanddie, np :)
Jun 06 11:17:04 <MohammadAG51> hey Venemo
Jun 06 11:17:12 <MohammadAG51> what's this about?
Jun 06 11:17:20 <crashanddie> [09:17:02] <Venemo_N900> MohammadAG51, I found a bug in sociality [09:31:50] <Venemo_N900> crashanddie, old messages are labeled with "xx minutes ago, via some app"
Jun 06 11:17:25 <MohammadAG51> crashanddie, stfu you have a kind neighbour
Jun 06 11:17:38 <MohammadAG51> messages?
Jun 06 11:17:44 <crashanddie> posts
Jun 06 11:18:16 <MohammadAG51> sure? cause I use the same widget for news feed/messages/comments
Jun 06 11:18:45 <MohammadAG51> that's the "standard" message when no time is set
Jun 06 11:19:00 <Venemo> no time is set?
Jun 06 11:19:01 <Venemo> weird
Jun 06 11:19:06 <Venemo> MohammadAG51, I also wrote you a PM
Jun 06 11:19:08 <MohammadAG51> Venemo, can you try http://mohammadag.xceleo.org/sociality
Jun 06 11:19:20 <MohammadAG51> oh sorry, I'm on the N900
Jun 06 11:19:27 <Venemo> no problem
Jun 06 11:20:17 <MohammadAG51> anyway, try the binary, replace the one in /opt/usr/bin with that
Jun 06 11:20:59 <Venemo> ok, I'll try
Jun 06 11:30:08 <MohammadAG51> still got that tracker issue :/
Jun 06 11:30:45 <MohammadAG51> "Tracker status is 'Paused'"
Jun 06 11:33:18 <MohammadAG51> wtf 06 Jun 2011, 05:12:46: Tracker-Critical **: Could not open directory 'file:///home/user/MyDocs/.camera': No such file or directory
Jun 06 11:34:12 * lardman curses apt-worker
Jun 06 11:44:10 <MohammadAG51> 06 Jun 2011, 14:43:19: Tracker-Warning **: Could not perform SQLite operation, error:1->'no such table: Volumes'
Jun 06 11:53:44 <psycho_oreos> I think the tracker.cfg allows one to specify where trackerd should scan
Jun 06 11:54:55 <psycho_oreos> and that warning on tracker sounds like some issue with the database or the sqlite software *shrugs*
Jun 06 11:57:40 <mece> hello
Jun 06 12:19:26 <khertan> is there a way to cut only the phone connectivity and keeping the wifi on ? it s emitting beep in my logitech speaker
Jun 06 12:22:28 <SpeedEvil> yes
Jun 06 12:23:40 <SpeedEvil> http://maemo.org/packages/view/cell-modem-ui/
Jun 06 12:26:38 <xkr47> is it the same as starting the phone up and pressing Skip at the pin code entry ?
Jun 06 12:26:49 <SpeedEvil> no
Jun 06 12:38:36 <chem|st> khertan: doesn't tablet mode do that?
Jun 06 12:39:20 <khertan> chem|st: it s cut wifi too
Jun 06 12:39:28 <chem|st> khertan: tablet mode doesn't
Jun 06 12:39:53 <khertan> hum ... so i didn't understand what is this tablet mode
Jun 06 12:40:09 <chem|st> khertan: offline mode cuts all connections aka Flight mode
Jun 06 12:40:43 <chem|st> tablet mode keeps BT and WIFI on but turns off cell
Jun 06 12:41:24 <khertan> where is it located in menu ?
Jun 06 12:44:11 <khertan> SpeedEvil: oh didn't see your link
Jun 06 12:44:12 <khertan> thx
Jun 06 12:46:31 <chem|st> khertan: powerbutton menu
Jun 06 12:48:03 <chem|st> khertan: sry... thought that is preinstalled as I got that from day one
Jun 06 12:48:12 <khertan> :)
Jun 06 12:48:30 <khertan> any dbus string to do the same thing ?
Jun 06 12:48:36 <khertan> i want to automate that too the night
Jun 06 12:48:40 <chem|st> you get buttons to switch dual/2g/3g
Jun 06 12:48:43 <chem|st> too
Jun 06 12:49:11 <chem|st> khertan: wiki phone control me thinks
Jun 06 12:50:23 <khertan> oh didn't see it last time
Jun 06 12:50:26 <khertan> i ll look thx
Jun 06 13:23:02 <x29a> hi there, is the maemo 5 sdk the latest and most encouraged to write programs for the n900? anything else i should look at? meego good to go? i dont want to have to tinker a lot with the OS, since my focus is on the application
Jun 06 13:33:00 <pcfe> if the built-in media player tells me 'no music' but MediaBox OTOH finds my music just fine, what could be wrong?
Jun 06 13:33:16 <jacekowski> tracker
Jun 06 13:34:26 <kerio> tracker is always deeply wrong
Jun 06 13:34:47 <kerio> that's like the default
Jun 06 13:35:41 <pcfe> would you happen to have a friendly manual to tracker so I can read up on how to make it simply drop the whole DB and start over?
Jun 06 13:36:42 <jacekowski> tracker is unfriendly
Jun 06 13:37:14 <merlin1991> pcfe: there was a command, lemme see if  I find it
Jun 06 13:37:26 <pcfe> merlin1991: oh that would be much appreciated
Jun 06 13:40:52 <merlin1991> pcfe: it's `tracker-processes -r` and one more option wich I can't find atm
Jun 06 13:42:20 <pcfe> merlin1991: thanks, that already gets me further than tracker-control, which seems absent on maemo5
Jun 06 14:06:23 <NIN101> one question
Jun 06 14:06:58 <NIN101> is there a reason why the maemo software is using the lovely tracker? Why not just an dirlist on .camera, .sounds etc.?
Jun 06 14:10:52 <edheldil> NIN101:  probably because than you (or sb.) would bitch about the same issue :)
Jun 06 14:11:03 <edheldil> then
Jun 06 14:19:52 <pcfe> NIN101: with some 30GB of music on my N900 and this being the first bad tracker messup on my phone in 1.5 years, I think I'm overall happier with a moderately quick lookup in a database when I look for a song as opposed to walking a bunch of directories each time
Jun 06 14:20:35 <NIN101> hmm, you are right.
Jun 06 14:20:39 <MohammadAG> fixed tracker, finally
Jun 06 14:21:18 <MohammadAG> setting verbosity to 1 helps a lot, apparently tracker stays paused when storage space is low
Jun 06 14:22:10 <ShadowJK> hm, storage space on /home?
Jun 06 14:24:54 <MohammadAG> ShadowJK, that and /
Jun 06 14:25:13 <MohammadAG> I had 6MBs on / and 28 on /home
Jun 06 14:25:24 <RST38h> Heya Mohammad, ShadowJK
Jun 06 14:25:35 <MohammadAG> hey RST38h
Jun 06 14:25:38 <merlin1991> how did you set tracker verbosity?
Jun 06 14:25:38 <RST38h> Mohammad: tracker has got a setting for that - "run only if XMB is available"
Jun 06 14:25:45 <RST38h> xMB
Jun 06 14:26:06 <MohammadAG> merlin1991, tracker.cfg
Jun 06 14:26:10 <MohammadAG> it logs more stuff
Jun 06 14:26:19 <MohammadAG> RST38h, yeah, seen that
Jun 06 14:35:05 <pcfe> merlin1991: `tracker-processes -r` and then waiting for indexing to complete did solve the issue. Thanks again!
Jun 06 14:47:26 <edheldil> btw, after connecting to (gsm) internet, my n900 is up to several minutes totally unresponsive. Is it normal? I guess it's caused by pacman or whatever is the auto-updates thing called?
Jun 06 14:48:34 <lardman> apt-worker
Jun 06 14:48:50 <merlin1991> apt-worker is evil :D
Jun 06 14:49:09 <lardman> it needs some serious renicing
Jun 06 14:49:12 <lardman> niceing?
Jun 06 14:49:16 <lardman> God knows
Jun 06 14:52:15 <edheldil> lardman:  is there a nice way around it? Like making it work only on wifi?
Jun 06 14:52:35 <lardman> not that I know of, but it's certainly something that should be addressed
Jun 06 14:52:50 <lardman> probably a good cssu target
Jun 06 14:54:22 <edheldil> among others, it's cause of often exhausting daily data limit immediately after connecting to the internet, often before I am able to work with the phone at all :)
Jun 06 14:58:15 <rm_work> O_o
Jun 06 14:58:29 <rm_work> i guess i don't notice because my phone is connected to data 24/7
Jun 06 15:00:24 <edheldil> rm_work:  I try to save the battery
Jun 06 15:00:50 <rm_work> yeah, battery lasts me exactly 12 hours
Jun 06 15:01:02 <rm_work> err, nah 18
Jun 06 15:01:09 <rm_work> which is just enough
Jun 06 15:01:44 <wam> ? Mine works with medium usage with always-on 3.5g, bluetooth and 1-2h per day fm-radio sender for at least 48 hours.
Jun 06 15:02:02 <Sazpaimon> so like
Jun 06 15:02:12 <SpeedEvil> wam: you're not doing regular data transfer over the 3g though
Jun 06 15:02:13 <Sazpaimon> my microb google search icon just changed
Jun 06 15:02:15 <crashanddie> MohammadAG51, you've been doing some good stuff with the facebook app
Jun 06 15:02:17 <Sazpaimon> out of the blue
Jun 06 15:02:19 <crashanddie> MohammadAG51, it looks good!
Jun 06 15:02:22 <wam> ...and wlan
Jun 06 15:02:39 <wam> SpeedEvil: I update my exchange-account and my imap account every few minutes.
Jun 06 15:02:46 <Sazpaimon> to a pink circle with a G in the middle
Jun 06 15:03:06 <Sazpaimon> wtf
Jun 06 15:03:44 <MohammadAG51> crashanddie, :D
Jun 06 15:04:12 <edheldil> speaking of exchange, is there a good n900 solution for remote calendars?
Jun 06 15:04:24 <wam> edheldil: sure, the default one ;)
Jun 06 15:07:56 <MohammadAG51> crashanddie, one thing I've "ignored" though is commits
Jun 06 15:10:51 <edheldil> wam: where can I setup it? When I add a new calendar in settings, it's a "local" calendar. And when I tried to google, I found only pages about GPE
Jun 06 15:11:54 <wam> edheldil: sry, my interface is in german. I'll try to translate that stuff: Go to "settings" -> "Mail for exchange" and set it up ;)
Jun 06 15:13:29 <edheldil> ah
Jun 06 15:13:33 <edheldil> thank you
Jun 06 15:13:51 <edheldil> hopefully it works with non-exchange cals too
Jun 06 15:16:52 <wam> edheldil: I'd bet that exchange accounts only work with exchange accounts (and zimbra ;))
Jun 06 15:19:52 <edheldil> wam:  does not work with just *.ics file over https :(
Jun 06 15:20:30 <wam> might be because a ics-file via http is slightly less than activesync ;)
Jun 06 15:21:06 <nanomad> hi all
Jun 06 15:21:31 <nanomad> i'm trying to compile  the declarative cameraqmlexample but i've got errors
Jun 06 15:21:37 <nanomad> i'm using the latest qt sdk.
Jun 06 15:21:48 <nanomad> can anyone help me?
Jun 06 15:22:23 <lardman> nanomad: pastebin the errors and wait a bit, 1min is a quick response on irc ;)
Jun 06 15:22:25 <edheldil> sure, but that's what I need, mere remote calendar. Works with Thunderbird/Lightning etc :(
Jun 06 15:23:54 <edheldil> but given that the n900 calendar works with exchange ones, maybe there's a location to rsync the remote ics file to?
Jun 06 15:24:15 <nanomad> qrc:/qml/declarative-camera.qml:42:1: module "QtMultimediaKit" is not installed
Jun 06 15:26:00 <lardman> nanomad: Is that module installed?
Jun 06 15:28:23 <nanomad> on the device I have libQtMultimediaKit.so
Jun 06 15:28:45 <SpeedEvil> For the 23rd consecutive edition, masturbating to a litter of newborn puppies is classified as "wrong, wrong, wrong."
Jun 06 15:28:51 <lardman> you will also presumably need the development package installed when you compile it
Jun 06 15:28:51 <SpeedEvil> oops - wrong window
Jun 06 15:29:02 <lardman> lol
Jun 06 15:29:26 <SpeedEvil> http://www.theonion.com/articles/ethicists-update-list-of-acceptable-things-to-mast,20076/
Jun 06 15:31:00 <nanomad> the development package? where can I find it?
Jun 06 15:31:52 <lardman> nanomad: I've no clue
Jun 06 15:32:21 <GAN900> SpeedEvil, that seems to be happening a lot lately to the tune of progressively more bizarre messages. :P
Jun 06 15:39:25 <nanomad> lardman: i'm targetting an n900 and there's no dev package for libqtm-*-multimedia
Jun 06 15:41:38 <lardman> it won't be qtm-* as that's qt mobility
Jun 06 15:41:45 <lardman> or at least I don't think it would be
Jun 06 15:44:17 <nanomad> Qcamera is part of qtmobility API
Jun 06 16:10:43 <Sazpaimon> has anyone ever tried a maemo chroot on android
Jun 06 16:10:47 <Sazpaimon> for shits and giggles mostly
Jun 06 16:11:01 <MohammadAG51> just noticed the clock applet in the status menu (not bar) is dynamic
Jun 06 16:11:09 <MohammadAG51> the analog clock isn't an image
Jun 06 16:18:22 <alterego> Heh, zehjotkah has just said that the consumer Harmattan device is: http://symbianworld.org/wp-content/uploads/2010/07/nokia-u-sketch-1.jpg
Jun 06 16:18:31 <alterego> The winner of the competition last year.
Jun 06 16:24:59 <rm_work> lol
Jun 06 16:25:22 <rm_work> i mean, it looks good -- besides the lack of physical keyboard
Jun 06 16:26:48 <alterego> It looks identical to the N9 leaked last year _with_ the keyboard.
Jun 06 16:26:53 <alterego> Except it's obviously thiner.
Jun 06 16:27:01 <alterego> Sister device I guess
Jun 06 16:27:12 <alterego> One with keyboard, one without, half the thickness.
Jun 06 16:27:35 <alterego> I'd get the one without, and a stand, and use my BT keyboard when I needed to ;)
Jun 06 16:29:29 <NIN101> IIRC zehjotkah said that we will love it even without keyboard, because Nokia will use a net patented technology.
Jun 06 16:29:38 <NIN101> *new
Jun 06 16:29:53 <Proteous> reads your mind and types what you think?
Jun 06 16:30:23 <NIN101> :-)
Jun 06 16:31:28 <alterego> I think I'd be happy without a keyboard.
Jun 06 16:31:38 <wblaze> ugh
Jun 06 16:31:40 <alterego> I'd keep the N900 in one pocket and have an N9 in the other.
Jun 06 16:31:47 <wblaze> no :(
Jun 06 16:32:00 <alterego> The N9 would be my primary phone and bling device, then if I needed to write an email, I'd use the N900
Jun 06 16:32:21 <alterego> (Running MeeGo N900 Developer Edition) :P
Jun 06 16:32:22 <wblaze> just picked up the n900 because it has a real keyboard
Jun 06 16:32:31 <alterego> wblaze: I've got three :P
Jun 06 16:32:38 <alterego> I want to try a phone without a keyboard for a change.
Jun 06 16:32:47 <alterego> I may hate it, but I want to try it :)
Jun 06 16:32:53 <wblaze> yeah, well I am late to the party :p
Jun 06 16:33:06 <wblaze> I've tried it, it sucks
Jun 06 16:33:14 <wblaze> imo, ymmv
Jun 06 16:33:26 <alterego> Depends who you are, my brother has an N900 and he barely ever uses the keyboard ..
Jun 06 16:33:40 <alterego> Different users prompt different use cases.
Jun 06 16:33:50 <Macer> wtf :)
Jun 06 16:33:54 <alterego> For instance, if I was to just use the phone as a camera, upload to facebook device, make/receive calls etc.
Jun 06 16:33:57 <Macer> http://www.heiaheia.com/
Jun 06 16:33:59 <alterego> Who needs a keyboard?
Jun 06 16:34:03 <Macer> 502 Bad Gateway
Jun 06 16:34:07 <wblaze> like I said, my opinion ;)
Jun 06 16:34:14 <Macer> heh
Jun 06 16:34:19 <Macer> i will never buy a phone without one
Jun 06 16:34:20 <Macer> :)
Jun 06 16:34:23 <alterego> Sure, but you probably do a bit more typing than some other people ;)
Jun 06 16:34:24 <Macer> i HATE vkbs
Jun 06 16:34:39 <alterego> Macer: same issue for me on that domain/site
Jun 06 16:34:39 <Macer> but then again i went out of my way to get my bluetooth keyboard to work with my n900
Jun 06 16:34:41 <wblaze> alterego: am on it right now, heh
Jun 06 16:34:42 <Macer> heh
Jun 06 16:34:51 <alterego> *cough* me too ..
Jun 06 16:34:53 <Macer> alterego: just bad networking? :)
Jun 06 16:35:02 <Macer> or something else?
Jun 06 16:35:15 <alterego> Dunno
Jun 06 16:35:17 <Macer> like some multi billion dollar fitness conglomerate decided to knock them off the map?
Jun 06 16:35:20 <Macer> heh
Jun 06 16:35:27 <Macer> as you can see they are removing domains nowadays
Jun 06 16:35:28 <wblaze> still looking for a decent bt keyboard here, everything I've found so far (retail) is huge
Jun 06 16:35:33 <alterego> I can talk directly to their server with ping ..
Jun 06 16:35:39 <Macer> due to money pressure heh
Jun 06 16:35:46 <Macer> alterego: i was just using it to register on my n900
Jun 06 16:35:53 <Macer> so meh .. maybe someone tripped over the power cord :)
Jun 06 16:36:15 <alterego> Heh
Jun 06 16:36:23 <Macer> and i just started using ecoach with it
Jun 06 16:36:26 <Macer> wtf :) go figure :)
Jun 06 16:36:29 <Macer> oh wait.. it's back up
Jun 06 16:36:54 <Macer> WE'RE CURRENTLY DOWN FOR MAINTENANCE.
Jun 06 16:37:38 <alterego> Hah
Jun 06 16:37:43 <alterego> Seemless ..
Jun 06 16:42:24 <Macer> :) ah well. as long as it keeps going
Jun 06 16:42:34 <Macer> i need to get a bt heart monitor
Jun 06 16:42:48 <Macer> and bt headphones
Jun 06 16:42:58 <Macer> omg the wired ones suck for running
Jun 06 17:07:45 <piggz> how do you get a package to show up in maemo.org/downloads ?
Jun 06 17:12:32 <hardaker> piggz: you package it, submit it extras-devel, promote it to extras-testing and then patiently wait for enough people (10) to say it's good enough to be promoted to full extras
Jun 06 17:13:09 <piggz> hardaker: ah...the sticking point is therfore getting it out of extras-devel, when it has a bit warning on it :)
Jun 06 17:13:13 <hardaker> http://wiki.maemo.org/Developer_FAQ#How_can_I_package_software_for_Maemo.3F
Jun 06 17:13:24 <piggz> Warning: Promotion of packages depending on hotfixes is blocked.
Jun 06 17:13:29 <piggz> whatever that means?
Jun 06 17:13:40 <hardaker> what is it depending on?
Jun 06 17:14:27 <piggz> http://maemo.org/packages/package_instance/view/fremantle_extras-devel_free_armel/pgz-spaceinvaders/0.3.4/
Jun 06 17:14:36 <piggz> qtquickcompat maybe?
Jun 06 17:15:16 <hardaker> I believe so
Jun 06 17:17:54 <piggz> i wonder, if the latest version of qt in extras is >= 4.7.1, i wouldnt need to depend on qtquickcompat
Jun 06 17:18:51 <hardaker> I believe that's the case.  I don't remember what the status is though.  The problem is that Qt isn't in extras, it's in the base OS.
Jun 06 17:18:54 <hardaker> which is 4.7.0
Jun 06 17:19:20 <hardaker> unless you install the CSSU, which brings it to 4.7.1 (and more recently 4.7.2)
Jun 06 17:19:36 <piggz> or...i use the qt 4.7 namespace, and remember to comment out bits depending on what platform im deploying on :/
Jun 06 17:19:56 <piggz> i do use the cssu, but that would be no good for getting it into extras :)
Jun 06 17:20:30 <hardaker> yep.
Jun 06 17:23:12 <DocScrutinizer> hostmode fans are invited to give this http://talk.maemo.org/showpost.php?p=1023402&postcount=821 a try and report back at ##mhd
Jun 06 17:26:08 <javispedro> You just fried your N900
Jun 06 17:26:37 <javispedro> j/k ;)
Jun 06 17:30:50 <RST38h> http://communities-dominate.blogs.com/brands/2011/06/deluded-seriously-can-i-really-honestly-claim-that-nokias-ceo-stephen-elop-is-deluded-unfortunately-.html
Jun 06 17:30:59 <RST38h> and hi javispedro!
Jun 06 17:31:10 <javispedro> hi RST38h
Jun 06 17:31:28 <RST38h> see link above, giggle =)
Jun 06 17:31:30 <javispedro> and DocScrutinizer
Jun 06 17:32:07 <javispedro> so, let's read a nokia fanboy's opinion for a change :)
Jun 06 17:37:02 <javispedro> tl;Dr
Jun 06 17:37:32 <javispedro> either way I agree with what seems to be his main point so far about how the US doesn't matter that much and how the iphone doesn't matter that much either.
Jun 06 17:38:52 <RST38h> dunno, so far I amnot buying his "evidence" about that
Jun 06 17:39:03 <javispedro> but I disagree about his initial point of high-end nokia vs cheap makers -- at least here I could pretty much guarantee nokia makes his $$ from low end
Jun 06 17:39:07 <RST38h> "american phones made by asians" is not evidence
Jun 06 17:41:38 <javispedro> IMHO low end is where the fire elop mentions is.
Jun 06 17:42:47 <javispedro> I could see Nokia surviving with the jobsphone in the market, but I would not be so sure when the $50 chinese android phone appears.
Jun 06 17:43:08 <RST38h> Android is still $150+
Jun 06 17:43:08 <javispedro> (note: unsubsidized)
Jun 06 17:43:15 <RST38h> But US market is different
Jun 06 17:43:17 <javispedro> RST38h: trending down.
Jun 06 17:43:28 <javispedro> yeah, I am talking about european here.
Jun 06 17:43:30 <RST38h> $50 is hardly sustainable
Jun 06 17:43:38 <RST38h> margins too small
Jun 06 17:43:40 <javispedro> also, the big european market, not the young hipsters one.
Jun 06 17:43:50 <RST38h> javispedro: Elop does not know what "european" is
Jun 06 17:44:08 <javispedro> RST38h: and that is probably half of the reason this "communities making" guy wrote that post.
Jun 06 17:44:16 <javispedro> (but that's another story ;) )
Jun 06 17:44:29 <RST38h> javispedro: To him, "european" is that cold place with bad food and stupid, stubborn subordinates that shareholders are making him visit monthly
Jun 06 17:45:06 <RST38h> probably can't wait until Nokia HQ gets moved to California
Jun 06 17:45:28 <kerio> i'm not exactly sure why the nokia shareholders are letting elop destroy the company
Jun 06 17:45:47 <javispedro> RST38h: according to that guy, if the phone that has to be the savior of us all is already designed on California, I bet he's not that far from physically moving the HQs.
Jun 06 17:45:51 <RST38h> Nokia has gota lot of large instituonalized US shareholders
Jun 06 17:46:10 <RST38h> javis: He already mentioned moving the HQ
Jun 06 17:46:23 <RST38h> javis:Closer to the primary market, goodweather, good food
Jun 06 17:46:39 <javispedro> good food? move to the south dammit! ;P
Jun 06 17:46:54 * RST38h now starts suspecting the Rare Exports movie was really about Elop =)
Jun 06 17:47:31 <RST38h> javis: If he moves HQ to where you are, there is a good chance some hotblooded southern european type will bomb him =)
Jun 06 17:48:17 <RST38h> But anyway, it is all besides the point,given that Elop is gonna end up back in Seattle one way or another...
Jun 06 17:49:10 <javispedro> it really seems like this is going to end like that
Jun 06 17:51:05 <lcuk> hi javispedro
Jun 06 17:51:13 <lcuk> EHLO RST38h
Jun 06 17:51:15 <javispedro> right after tanking the company, of course. I did not expect share price to get that down =)
Jun 06 17:51:20 <RST38h> HELO lcuk
Jun 06 17:51:24 <javispedro> hey lcuk
Jun 06 17:51:48 <RST38h> javis: it ended at 6.66 last week,furtherproving that Elop is the Evil Santa!
Jun 06 17:51:56 <lcuk> I have a question about recursion
Jun 06 17:52:05 <RST38h> yes?
Jun 06 17:52:15 <javispedro> lcuk: you have come to the right place!
Jun 06 17:52:40 <lcuk> how many levels deep should I keep going for -> http://liqbase.net/liq.20110606_010830.liqdesign2.scr.png
Jun 06 17:52:53 <DocScrutinizer> t900:~# ls -l /usr/lib/locale/locale-archive
Jun 06 17:52:55 <DocScrutinizer> -rw-r--r--    1 root     root     29763056 Jan 22  2010 /usr/lib/locale/locale-archive
Jun 06 17:52:55 <RST38h> until you hit a single pixelof course
Jun 06 17:53:00 <DocScrutinizer> WTF?!
Jun 06 17:53:14 <lcuk> a little simpler on the eyes: http://liqbase.net/liq.20110606_123624.liqdesign2.scr.png
Jun 06 17:53:17 <javispedro> DocScrutinizer: glibc keeps a hash table of all LC_MESSAGES there.
Jun 06 17:53:28 <lcuk> RST38h, that causes CPU problems
Jun 06 17:53:29 <RST38h> or was your question really about quantum theory?
Jun 06 17:53:37 <javispedro> DocScrutinizer: technically you might delete it if in a hurry, but then startup times get way slower.
Jun 06 17:53:46 * GAN900 grumbles about Intel Centrino cards not supporting OS X.
Jun 06 17:53:50 <javispedro> DocScrutinizer: and you need localegen/localedef to regenerate, so don't do it.
Jun 06 17:53:52 <lcuk> I found that a 2x2 rectangle was plenty, but if you think I need more
Jun 06 17:54:14 <RST38h> Doc:if it makes you feel better, Maemo file system compresses it to something like 7MB
Jun 06 17:54:21 <javispedro> lcuk: depends. portal 2 only does 2 levels of recursion
Jun 06 17:54:29 <javispedro> ;)
Jun 06 17:54:37 <lcuk> javispedro, rly? :D
Jun 06 17:54:42 <lcuk> I have not played it yet
Jun 06 17:55:05 <lcuk> that is hardware accelerated too I gather
Jun 06 17:55:48 <javispedro> lcuk: either way, from looking at your screenshot, you now have an IDE in your liqOS? :)
Jun 06 17:56:04 <lcuk> javispedro, oh, liqdesign existed from the start
Jun 06 17:56:16 <lcuk> in original playground, I just added a toolbar
Jun 06 17:56:21 <lcuk> there is nothing "new" in there at all
Jun 06 17:56:23 <lcuk> :)
Jun 06 17:56:45 <lcuk> ideas are seeds and have been described as wanted all along
Jun 06 17:57:12 <lcuk> people ignore things which do not look pretty though
Jun 06 17:57:17 <RST38h> "What is the revenue-share deal in Japans mobile internet? Try 91/09. So yes, you, the mobile service/app developer get to keep 91 cents out of every dollar. Apple only lets you keep 70 cents."
Jun 06 17:57:38 <javispedro> GAN900: and the entire core i* gfx first generation is also not supported, if you plan to buy a new laptop ;P
Jun 06 17:58:19 <DocScrutinizer> so I may rm -rf /usr/lib/locale/locale-archive /usr/lib/locale/ar_* /usr/lib/locale/[srz]*  ??
Jun 06 17:58:25 <DocScrutinizer> javispedro: ^^
Jun 06 17:58:39 <javispedro> DocScrutinizer: if you delete them you will need to know how to regenerate it. Unless you want reduced performance.
Jun 06 17:58:44 <javispedro> On a sane Debian locale-gen would do it.
Jun 06 17:59:05 <javispedro> On unsane Debian you will need to call localedef manually and I don't remember the syntax
Jun 06 17:59:22 <DocScrutinizer> I fsckng don't need 30MB locale, incl klingon
Jun 06 17:59:28 <javispedro> someone who is more experience with the maemo locale setup might be of help here
Jun 06 17:59:32 <javispedro> timeless?
Jun 06 17:59:54 <javispedro> ~seen timeless
Jun 06 18:00:05 <infobot> timeless <ad21c479@firefox/developer/timeless> was last seen on IRC in channel #meego, 1d 6h 21m 32s ago, saying: 'actually, getting most formatting stuff right w/ posix is hard if you need to care about real users :)'.
Jun 06 18:00:09 <DocScrutinizer> and that's just the file, not incl the dirs
Jun 06 18:02:28 <GeneralAntilles> javispedro: got GMA HD (i7 2620M)
Jun 06 18:02:43 <javispedro> GeneralAntilles: aka second gen, so you might have luck.
Jun 06 18:02:47 <DocScrutinizer> HAHAHA, the dirs are empty
Jun 06 18:02:54 <GeneralAntilles> javispedro, yeah, working my way through the setup right now.
Jun 06 18:03:15 <DocScrutinizer> it's *all* in /usr/lib/locale/locale-archive
Jun 06 18:03:24 <javispedro> DocScrutinizer: check /usr/share/locale/*
Jun 06 18:04:29 <javispedro> I've been coding in Python for a single day and it already feels weird going back to C.
Jun 06 18:04:39 * javispedro tries to "import re".
Jun 06 18:05:04 <DocScrutinizer> javispedro: yay
Jun 06 18:05:31 <GeneralAntilles> Airside fastfood worker has to be the worst possible job.
Jun 06 18:05:33 <DocScrutinizer> ok, there's *some* stuff in /usr/share/locale, nicely optified mostly
Jun 06 18:05:58 <GeneralAntilles> Not only do you get to work fast food, but your daily commute involves "TSA screening"
Jun 06 18:06:15 <DocScrutinizer> still I wonder how to free 30+ MB om /
Jun 06 18:06:54 <DocScrutinizer> I am definitely not interested in zh_TW
Jun 06 18:09:36 <RST38h> Doc: Can't, I tried
Jun 06 18:09:49 <RST38h> Not easily, anyway, and you are still only freeing ~7MB in the best case
Jun 06 18:10:15 <DocScrutinizer> isn't there a job purge-locales,  published by Nokia themselves?
Jun 06 18:10:24 <RST38h> General: But look at the bright side: you will be 100% sure there are no Taliban in your ass!
Jun 06 18:10:41 <GeneralAntilles> Always looking to the bright side.
Jun 06 18:10:43 <RST38h> Doc: Won;t rebuild the cache
Jun 06 18:11:29 <DocScrutinizer> RST38h:
Jun 06 18:11:31 <DocScrutinizer> IroN900:~# du -hsx /usr/lib/locale/
Jun 06 18:11:32 <DocScrutinizer> 23M     /usr/lib/locale/
Jun 06 18:13:04 <DocScrutinizer> t900:~# du -hsx /usr/lib/locale/
Jun 06 18:13:06 <DocScrutinizer> 28.4M   /usr/lib/locale
Jun 06 18:13:07 <DocScrutinizer> t900:~# df -h /
Jun 06 18:13:09 <DocScrutinizer> Filesystem                Size      Used Available Use% Mounted on
Jun 06 18:13:10 <DocScrutinizer> rootfs                  227.9M    200.4M     23.3M  90% /
Jun 06 18:13:50 <DocScrutinizer> t900 is a hybrid based on PR1.2
Jun 06 18:14:41 <DocScrutinizer> there HAS to be a way to get rid of this cruft
Jun 06 18:15:19 <RST38h> there is
Jun 06 18:15:23 <RST38h> itgoes like this:
Jun 06 18:15:37 <RST38h> 1) Get Glibc utility that rebuilds the cache
Jun 06 18:15:43 <RST38h> 2) Kill the cache file
Jun 06 18:15:52 <RST38h> 3) Kill all unneeded locales
Jun 06 18:15:56 <RST38h> 4) Rebuild the cache
Jun 06 18:16:11 <DocScrutinizer> I'm afraid the cache file holds nokia blob shit
Jun 06 18:17:06 * DocScrutinizer throws up
Jun 06 18:17:28 <RST38h> why?no, should be a standard glibc locale cache
Jun 06 18:17:57 <javispedro> I ponder if the locale-archive is arch independent
Jun 06 18:18:13 <DocScrutinizer> yeah, but locales for e.g. dialer etc are also in /usr/share/locale?
Jun 06 18:18:22 <javispedro> DocScrutinizer: they should
Jun 06 18:19:12 <DocScrutinizer> wtf isn't the whole crap optified at very least?
Jun 06 18:19:21 <Natanaiel> which of these SD cards work better on N900? class 6 or class 10?
Jun 06 18:19:28 <RST38h> 'cause it should be accessible with mmc dead?
Jun 06 18:19:39 <DocScrutinizer> pff
Jun 06 18:19:40 <javispedro> DocScrutinizer: being a file that is read by _every single fscking process in the system_ I'd expect it to be on NAND.
Jun 06 18:19:58 <DocScrutinizer> again pff
Jun 06 18:20:25 <javispedro> if you were a gentoo user, this is time where you'd say "i18n is for losers either way" and add "-nls" to your $USE
Jun 06 18:20:30 <DocScrutinizer> you don't need locales on an init-S to fix the system
Jun 06 18:20:43 <DocScrutinizer> you don't need locals on early boot
Jun 06 18:20:56 * RST38h does not need locales
Jun 06 18:20:56 <DocScrutinizer> ego: gotta go optification
Jun 06 18:21:52 <DocScrutinizer> RST38h: that's the BS. on maemo you do, otherwise you get Tanna_fi_frobldombl instead of "no such file or firectory"
Jun 06 18:22:31 <DocScrutinizer> "nokia couldn't manage their translators otherwise"
Jun 06 18:22:59 <DocScrutinizer> :-(((( :toktoktok:
Jun 06 18:27:52 <DocScrutinizer> this tana_fi_ crap is such a PITA and so broken-by-concept, and so FUBAR and no hope to ever fix it...
Jun 06 18:28:06 * DocScrutinizer feels urge to go out and have a booze
Jun 06 18:28:55 * lcuk well ahead of you
Jun 06 18:28:56 <javispedro> hey, look at the bright side: the intel guys do not do that sort of thing.
Jun 06 18:29:23 <lcuk> DocScrutinizer, we attempted numerous patches to the core translation stuff
Jun 06 18:29:24 <DocScrutinizer> I do not do intel
Jun 06 18:29:31 <lcuk> to fallback on en_uk translations
Jun 06 18:29:40 <DocScrutinizer> good
Jun 06 18:29:46 <DocScrutinizer> what went wrong?
Jun 06 18:29:51 <rm_work> this guy is talking about "near field" a lot... what is that? apparently every country besides the USA has "near field" phones now... ?
Jun 06 18:29:51 <lcuk> I believe it was one of the last things we tested but that the patch did not work correctly
Jun 06 18:30:16 <DocScrutinizer> rm_work: nah
Jun 06 18:30:23 <lcuk> DocScrutinizer, it was tried and just could not work correctly, generally each langauge is fully translated anyway
Jun 06 18:30:27 <rm_work> i don't even know what "near field" means
Jun 06 18:30:31 <DocScrutinizer> it's a RF tech for <50cm range
Jun 06 18:30:41 <DocScrutinizer> and mostly used in Japan afaik
Jun 06 18:30:45 <lcuk> rm_work, it is the mobile phone equiv of "High 5"
Jun 06 18:30:50 <rm_work> so the way japanese phones do micro-transactions with vending machines? :P
Jun 06 18:31:03 <lcuk> you put your phone near a transaction reader
Jun 06 18:31:07 <rm_work> got to play with that when i was in japan for a month a few years back
Jun 06 18:31:08 <lcuk> and it swipes the payment, yes
Jun 06 18:31:09 <rm_work> yeah ok
Jun 06 18:31:24 <rm_work> you'd tap your phone on a vending machine and it'd spit out your coffee drink :P
Jun 06 18:31:46 <DocScrutinizer> nobody even knows nearfield in e.g. Germany
Jun 06 18:31:58 <lcuk> when beggers on the street start putting waist height readers on the pavement the design will be modified ;)
Jun 06 18:32:15 <rm_work> that's admittedly neat, and the fact that it's implemented pretty much on 100% of vending without any real privacy/hacking problems is... impressive, and very hopeful
Jun 06 18:32:16 <lcuk> born of frustration
Jun 06 18:32:18 <lcuk> james
Jun 06 18:32:21 <lcuk> 1990s
Jun 06 18:33:07 <rm_work> so as of right now, nokia is still planning to release another "Maemo" phone? not meego, but maemo?
Jun 06 18:33:21 <DocScrutinizer> lcuk: maybe each lang is translated, but it's idiocy to require locales to make a program usable
Jun 06 18:34:12 <DocScrutinizer> rm_work: rumour has it it's called meego but is more maemo than meego inside
Jun 06 18:34:22 <rm_work> hrm
Jun 06 18:34:55 <DocScrutinizer> not so much maemo you could call it a true maemo successor zhough
Jun 06 18:34:56 <myuu> hey whats the proper name
Jun 06 18:35:04 <myuu> for that balloon that comes up to notify you
Jun 06 18:35:12 <myuu> when you get sms, ect...
Jun 06 18:35:35 <DocScrutinizer> blloon??
Jun 06 18:35:58 <myuu> the notifications you get on the n900
Jun 06 18:36:05 <myuu> that yellow balloon
Jun 06 18:36:14 <bindi> balloon tip? >.<
Jun 06 18:36:43 <myuu> really? -_-
Jun 06 18:37:22 <DocScrutinizer> $dbus-send --type=method_call --dest=org.freedesktop.Notifications  /org/freedesktop/Notifications org.freedesktop.Notifications.SystemNoteDialog string:"this is a balloon?"
Jun 06 18:37:49 <myuu> lol
Jun 06 18:38:49 <DocScrutinizer> uint32:0 string:"WARN"
Jun 06 18:41:47 <DocScrutinizer> or this?
Jun 06 18:41:50 <DocScrutinizer> dbus-send --type=method_call --dest=org.freedesktop.Notifications /org/freedesktop/Notifications org.freedesktop.Notifications.SystemNoteInfoprint string:"NOTIFICATION"
Jun 06 18:42:44 <DocScrutinizer> prolly you meant the latter - the SystemNoteDialog
Jun 06 18:43:17 <DocScrutinizer> myuu: right?
Jun 06 18:43:52 <DocScrutinizer> http://wiki.maemo.org/Phone_control#Send_notification_.28orange_one_line_popup.29
Jun 06 18:45:13 * DocScrutinizer still wonders if he ever seen a real balloon shaped notification on maemo
Jun 06 18:53:10 <myuu> yes
Jun 06 18:53:13 <myuu> thank you
Jun 06 18:53:19 <myuu> I just wanted a name to put to it
Jun 06 18:54:37 <SpeedEvil> DocScrutinizer: if you've got the phone open when you get a SMS
Jun 06 18:54:55 <SpeedEvil> you get a little ballon shaped thing with just too few chars to read the paypal security number
Jun 06 18:55:05 <DocScrutinizer> haha
Jun 06 18:56:02 <DocScrutinizer> never happened to me I guess
Jun 06 19:50:01 <the_lord> Hi! I'm getting Memory not accessible, unable to save content on my camera, any ideas?
Jun 06 20:01:48 <hiemanshu> the_lord: is the USB connected?
Jun 06 20:02:28 <the_lord> hiemanshu: nope
Jun 06 20:02:45 <hiemanshu> the_lord: can you open it via a file manager?
Jun 06 20:03:32 <the_lord> hiemanshu: open what?
Jun 06 20:03:52 <hiemanshu> the_lord: the directories? can you access the data?
Jun 06 20:04:02 <the_lord> I can create new docs in MyDocs
Jun 06 20:07:16 <the_lord> hiemanshu: that means yes
Jun 06 20:07:34 <hiemanshu> the_lord: thats odd
Jun 06 20:07:58 <the_lord> hiemanshu: hell yeah
Jun 06 20:08:06 <hiemanshu> the_lord: open up X Terminal and see what df -h returns
Jun 06 20:08:24 <the_lord> I've got 19Gb free
Jun 06 20:08:50 <the_lord> hiemanshu: pro-user here, all trivial problems already discarded
Jun 06 20:09:01 <the_lord> fsck'ed fat partition too
Jun 06 20:09:06 <hiemanshu> the_lord: ah, dint know that :D
Jun 06 20:09:33 <hiemanshu> the_lord: maybe the others might know about me, /me can't think of anything
Jun 06 20:14:56 <divan> the_lord, are you sure partition is mounted in read-write now?
Jun 06 20:15:29 <the_lord> /dev/mmcblk0p1 on /home/user/MyDocs type vfat (rw,noauto,nodev,noexec,nosuid,noatime,nodiratime,utf8,uid=29999,shortname=mixed,dmask=000,fmask=0133,rodir)
Jun 06 20:15:45 <the_lord> divan: ^
Jun 06 20:16:05 <divan> the_lord, mount shows default options for partition and not the actual one.
Jun 06 20:17:26 <the_lord> divan: are you sure?
Jun 06 20:17:34 <mece> \o
Jun 06 20:18:45 <divan> the_lord, can't check right know, but I've seen a few times partition remounted ro were shown by mount as rw. Thus this assumption.
Jun 06 20:19:26 <the_lord> divan: well, touch /home/user/MyDocs/something does what it has to do
Jun 06 20:19:54 <the_lord> and in the browser, I can save pics, and full pages, same in email
Jun 06 20:19:58 <the_lord> just camera
Jun 06 20:20:08 <divan> the_lord, ok. then it does mounted rw :) The troubles only with Camera?
Jun 06 20:20:18 <the_lord> divan: yes
Jun 06 20:20:25 <divan> check DCIM folder. Maybe permissions/filecount/etc
Jun 06 20:25:27 <the_lord> divan, everything good there
Jun 06 21:02:12 <DocScrutinizer> the_lord: you're pro-user, so I'd expect you to make clear statement of your camera's storage setting (phone/card)
Jun 06 21:05:30 <DocScrutinizer> if camera is set up to store to uSD card, there's only so much use in fuzzing with MyDocs
Jun 06 21:11:11 * javispedro realizes worriedly that I am now a fan of the top global menu bar concept..
Jun 06 21:11:30 <RST38h> Welcome to Amiga.
Jun 06 21:11:50 <yigal> lol
Jun 06 21:12:02 <javispedro> :)
Jun 06 21:19:10 <lcuk2> javispedro, for touchscreens it is annoying
Jun 06 21:19:23 <lcuk2> especially dual mode keyboard ones
Jun 06 21:19:35 <lcuk2> i really want a taskbar on meego netbook
Jun 06 21:19:47 <lcuk2> alt tabbing hurts my brain with the method it does
Jun 06 21:19:50 <javispedro> I disagree, on touchscreens that have decent border sensitivity that is
Jun 06 21:20:15 <javispedro> being on any border is virtually an order of magnitude faster...
Jun 06 21:20:29 <lcuk2> javispedro, location optimised
Jun 06 21:20:35 <lcuk2> on your lap is one place
Jun 06 21:20:48 <lcuk2> on a desk still as a foldered out laptop style is another
Jun 06 21:20:51 <lcuk2> on a wall is another
Jun 06 21:20:54 <javispedro> excuuuuuuuuse me for not having a giant touchscreen
Jun 06 21:20:58 <lcuk2> :P
Jun 06 21:20:58 <javispedro> ;P
Jun 06 21:21:12 <lcuk2> flat on the table is another
Jun 06 21:21:23 <lcuk2> which is odd because of lcd quality and viewing angle on some devices
Jun 06 21:21:45 <lcuk2> I thought of something cool earlier
Jun 06 21:22:02 <lcuk2> replace the down bit on the stairs with an lcd screen
Jun 06 21:22:08 <lcuk2> you have to go up and down stairs
Jun 06 21:22:14 <lcuk2> so you could put calendar there :)
Jun 06 21:22:31 <lcuk2> "tidy your room"
Jun 06 21:22:35 <lcuk2> "clean your teeth"
Jun 06 21:22:42 <lcuk2> other things needed as the kids walk past ;)
Jun 06 21:28:04 * javispedro pondersome looks like this  if lcuk's already looks like a "crystal spires and togas" house
Jun 06 21:28:29 * javispedro wonders which kind of keystroke could have caused the previous disastrous sentence
Jun 06 21:54:08 <mece> Anyone having problems with Qt libs in latest cssu?
Jun 06 22:05:43 <DocScrutinizer> anybody ever heard about amixer --abstract basic and the concept behind it?
Jun 06 22:06:15 <DocScrutinizer> any pointer to docs you could share?
Jun 06 22:18:47 <rm_work> why, you out of things to scrutinize? :P
Jun 06 22:19:07 * rm_work has not ever heard of whatever that is, unfortunately
Jun 06 22:26:45 <alterego> ""users can have more than one full screen app running at once, with a swipe gesture to switch between them." oops.... Apple was first"
Jun 06 22:26:49 <alterego> haha
Jun 06 22:30:20 <mece> alterego, ios5?
Jun 06 22:58:29 <DocScrutinizer> rm_you: obviously about ALSA, and some python stuff
Jun 07 00:12:54 <wblaze> GonzoTheGreat: thats an awesome nick
Jun 07 02:23:28 <c2pLaY> hi all
Jun 07 02:23:35 <c2pLaY> have a problem on my nokia n900
Jun 07 02:23:48 <c2pLaY> desktop icons keep becoming unresponsive
Jun 07 02:24:01 <c2pLaY> i've tried killing hildon-desktop
Jun 07 02:24:10 <c2pLaY> but of course none of the icons come bakc
Jun 07 02:24:34 <cehteh> some software takes all resources?
Jun 07 02:24:38 <SpeedEvil> Do they appear OK on boot?
Jun 07 02:24:39 <c2pLaY> and it remains unresponsive after the the process has been reinitiated
Jun 07 02:24:41 <cehteh> what do you have installed and running?
Jun 07 02:24:54 <c2pLaY> i got all kinds of stuff installed
Jun 07 02:24:55 <cehteh> (including widget)
Jun 07 02:25:05 <c2pLaY> 3 widgets i think
Jun 07 02:25:15 <c2pLaY> the cpu overclocking one
Jun 07 02:25:15 <cehteh> well watch the process list and see if something leaks memory or takes all cpu
Jun 07 02:25:17 <c2pLaY> calendar
Jun 07 02:25:20 <c2pLaY> and showip
Jun 07 02:25:33 <c2pLaY> i have quite a few icons
Jun 07 02:25:45 <c2pLaY> this is happening very regularily
Jun 07 02:25:48 <c2pLaY> i have flashed it
Jun 07 02:25:49 <cehteh> either top from a terminal or conky
Jun 07 02:25:58 <c2pLaY> speaking of top
Jun 07 02:26:04 <c2pLaY> is there a way to scroll down with top?
Jun 07 02:26:08 <cehteh> no
Jun 07 02:26:12 <cehteh> ps aux | less
Jun 07 02:26:20 <c2pLaY> ye
Jun 07 02:26:27 <cehteh> (dunno if aux works on messybox)
Jun 07 02:26:38 <c2pLaY> dunno what messybox is
Jun 07 02:26:49 <c2pLaY> this is a pretty vanilla setup
Jun 07 02:26:50 <cehteh> you can sort top output P for cpu and M for memory
Jun 07 02:26:55 <c2pLaY> so i shouldn't ahve much running
Jun 07 02:26:57 <cehteh> busybox :)
Jun 07 02:27:03 <cehteh> the crippled shell it has
Jun 07 02:27:28 <c2pLaY> im not a super advanced user
Jun 07 02:27:32 <cehteh> (note: uppercase M and P)
Jun 07 02:27:42 <c2pLaY> so if there's anything missing in busybox i am unaware
Jun 07 02:28:05 <cehteh> just use top
Jun 07 02:28:14 * cehteh just trying, works for me
Jun 07 02:28:17 <c2pLaY> im not a complete noob tho
Jun 07 02:28:20 <c2pLaY> i can use ps
Jun 07 02:28:35 <cehteh> ah ps aux works too
Jun 07 02:28:45 <c2pLaY> i usually just ax
Jun 07 02:28:50 <c2pLaY> don't need to see the user usually
Jun 07 02:28:53 <cehteh> well you are only interested in the most resource intensive applications
Jun 07 02:28:56 <c2pLaY> take up alot of extra room
Jun 07 02:29:03 <c2pLaY> unless im looking for something user related
Jun 07 02:29:34 <Macer> x is the most resource intensive
Jun 07 02:29:43 <cehteh> top is quite configureable .. but well this buildin one is a busybox crippled one duh
Jun 07 02:30:03 <c2pLaY> so yeah
Jun 07 02:30:05 <cehteh> so kill X :P
Jun 07 02:30:06 <cehteh> haha
Jun 07 02:30:07 <c2pLaY> 3 widgets
Jun 07 02:30:09 <Macer> hahahahaa
Jun 07 02:30:10 <c2pLaY> heh
Jun 07 02:30:24 <Macer> shell only
Jun 07 02:30:26 <c2pLaY> calendar, showip, and cpu
Jun 07 02:30:30 <cehteh> well go down the list and see if there is anything unusual within the first 10 entries or so
Jun 07 02:30:31 <c2pLaY> widgets
Jun 07 02:30:33 <Macer> surprised someone hasnt done that yet
Jun 07 02:30:38 <c2pLaY> will have a quick look
Jun 07 02:30:40 <Macer> ncurses dialer and what not
Jun 07 02:30:41 <c2pLaY> had to reboot
Jun 07 02:30:42 <Macer> :)
Jun 07 02:31:22 <Macer> i love ecoach
Jun 07 02:31:35 <Macer> first time the gps on this n900 has been useful
Jun 07 02:31:41 <cehteh> huh ..
Jun 07 02:31:41 <Macer> considering ovimaps
Jun 07 02:31:46 <Macer> :)
Jun 07 02:31:48 <cehteh> ovimaps sux
Jun 07 02:31:57 <Macer> i guess geotagging pics
Jun 07 02:32:00 <cehteh> cloudgps is a nice plaything (but lacks features)
Jun 07 02:32:01 <c2pLaY> yeah the gps doesn't seem to be very accurate
Jun 07 02:32:04 <Macer> i know it does
Jun 07 02:32:07 <c2pLaY> was kinda wondering about that
Jun 07 02:32:08 <cehteh> but monav is damn cool
Jun 07 02:32:27 <Macer> ovimaps was absolutely horrible
Jun 07 02:32:29 <Macer> is
Jun 07 02:32:33 <Macer> i tried it
Jun 07 02:32:37 <cehteh> c2pLaY: with assisted gps and give it some time to acquire the position its pretty good most of the time
Jun 07 02:32:42 <Macer> google maps is good but requires net
Jun 07 02:32:46 <cehteh> yes ovimaps is rubbish
Jun 07 02:32:52 <cehteh> Macer: monav!
Jun 07 02:32:59 <Macer> rubbish is too kind
Jun 07 02:33:03 <cehteh> http://monav.openstreetmap.de/
Jun 07 02:33:06 <Macer> cehteh: i will try it
Jun 07 02:33:30 <Macer> ovimaps is total shit
Jun 07 02:33:32 <Macer> :)
Jun 07 02:33:33 <c2pLaY> so how or where do you configure assisted gps?
Jun 07 02:33:47 <cehteh> if you dont changed anything, then its on by default
Jun 07 02:33:47 <c2pLaY> not familiar with gps all that much
Jun 07 02:33:58 <cehteh> anyways in settings "position"
Jun 07 02:34:01 <c2pLaY> yeah and using googlemaps mobile
Jun 07 02:34:20 <cehteh> there is googlemaps for the n900? with gps support?
Jun 07 02:34:25 <Macer> gnav is great if you had a sat connextion in your car
Jun 07 02:34:31 <Macer> hahaha.. no
Jun 07 02:34:38 <cehteh> i use osm :)
Jun 07 02:34:41 <c2pLaY> i dunno if its supported
Jun 07 02:34:43 <c2pLaY> but it works
Jun 07 02:34:44 <Macer> and i mean internet sat
Jun 07 02:34:51 <cehteh> monav can use offline maps .. vector maps!
Jun 07 02:34:51 <c2pLaY> just shows the location wrong
Jun 07 02:34:56 <c2pLaY> off by about a mile
Jun 07 02:35:07 <Macer> gnav requires a net connection which is nonexistant in the sticks
Jun 07 02:35:13 <c2pLaY> not sure how accurate its supposed to be
Jun 07 02:35:23 <cehteh> c2pLaY: give it some time to acquire the position .. can take up to 10 minutes and needs sight to the sky
Jun 07 02:35:30 <Macer> cehteh: i think the n900 gps isnt too bad as far as accuracy
Jun 07 02:35:30 <c2pLaY> ohic
Jun 07 02:35:32 <cehteh> (well with assisted gps its much faster)
Jun 07 02:35:35 <Jzarecta> hi is ther a way that I can locate the audio for the camera noise
Jun 07 02:35:46 <c2pLaY> very kewl cehteh, i'll have to give that a try
Jun 07 02:35:48 <Macer> i was able to track where i was on an airplane by holding it against the window
Jun 07 02:35:48 <Jzarecta> I am looking to mute the camera sound 'ringtone'
Jun 07 02:35:54 <cehteh> but assisted gps needs internet connection
Jun 07 02:36:01 <Jzarecta> so first question is where is the camera application
Jun 07 02:36:07 <SpeedEvil> http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Accuracy
Jun 07 02:36:15 <cehteh> c2pLaY: and dont use ovi maps .. try monav or mappero
Jun 07 02:36:15 <SpeedEvil> err
Jun 07 02:36:31 <SpeedEvil> http://wiki.maemo.org/N900_Hardware_GPS
Jun 07 02:36:36 <SpeedEvil> GPS accuracy studies
Jun 07 02:36:59 <c2pLaY> so yeah
Jun 07 02:37:02 <c2pLaY> ps ax
Jun 07 02:37:09 <c2pLaY> theres a whole bunch of crap in there
Jun 07 02:37:14 <cehteh> what is 'dm' ?
Jun 07 02:37:15 <c2pLaY> most of which i cannot make sense of
Jun 07 02:37:28 <c2pLaY> might have to output to a file and pastebin it
Jun 07 02:37:34 <cehteh> c2pLaY: hence i saied use top and only look at the topmost things
Jun 07 02:37:41 <SpeedEvil> cehteh: decimeters
Jun 07 02:37:43 <c2pLaY> might ask one of you fine gentlement/women to take a look
Jun 07 02:37:48 <cehteh> i dont want to sort your pastebin either
Jun 07 02:37:54 <c2pLaY> heh
Jun 07 02:37:58 <c2pLaY> kk top it is :P
Jun 07 02:38:10 <cehteh> SpeedEvil: ah didnt expected that :P .. expected some fancy US unit :)
Jun 07 02:39:03 <cehteh> SpeedEvil: do you know details of position acqusition?
Jun 07 02:39:09 <SpeedEvil> cehteh: ?
Jun 07 02:39:13 <c2pLaY> i have 2 browserd running
Jun 07 02:39:22 <c2pLaY> seem to be using up quite a bit of memory
Jun 07 02:39:23 <SpeedEvil> c2pLaY: normal
Jun 07 02:39:26 <cehteh> last week on a bike ride it got horribly wong at the end of the ride
Jun 07 02:39:31 <SpeedEvil> c2pLaY: also - RSS is a lie
Jun 07 02:39:43 <c2pLaY> i don't use rss
Jun 07 02:39:45 <cehteh> position jumped like crazy
Jun 07 02:40:27 <SpeedEvil> c2pLaY: http://www.selenic.com/smem/
Jun 07 02:40:42 <SpeedEvil> cehteh: If it goes to cell positioning - it can get very inaccurate
Jun 07 02:40:45 <cehteh> that was when i was inside a town .. i wonder if it uses wlan in reach for guessing position when gps signals are too weak
Jun 07 02:40:58 <SpeedEvil> Similarly multipath can distort it majorly
Jun 07 02:41:04 <cehteh> yes but it had fine GPS location for some hours
Jun 07 02:41:23 <cehteh> i wonder why it lost the gps lock
Jun 07 02:41:24 <SpeedEvil> Jammers can be an issue.
Jun 07 02:42:08 <DocScrutinizer51> cehteh: nope
Jun 07 02:42:30 <DocScrutinizer51> gps multipath + reflections
Jun 07 02:42:40 <SpeedEvil> See the above openstreetmap page
Jun 07 02:42:48 <cehteh> mhm maybe i should look at the .gpx .. it should record the accurracy for each track point right?
Jun 07 02:42:51 <SpeedEvil> I wrote something on reflections
Jun 07 02:42:54 <cehteh> yeah
Jun 07 02:43:00 <SpeedEvil> cehteh: Some apps don't
Jun 07 02:43:13 <cehteh> lets see
Jun 07 02:43:28 <SpeedEvil> EPE you may be looking for.
Jun 07 02:43:31 <SpeedEvil> Or HDOP
Jun 07 02:43:47 <SpeedEvil> Even satellite number.
Jun 07 02:44:24 <DocScrutinizer51> some are nonsesne, mere calc result from loc and time and efem
Jun 07 02:44:41 <DocScrutinizer51> not the real precision
Jun 07 02:45:04 <cehteh> yeah no accuracy
Jun 07 02:45:05 <cehteh> duh
Jun 07 02:45:47 <cehteh> well i gone over 850 km/h  with my bike :P
Jun 07 02:46:01 <cehteh> the cops wont catch me
Jun 07 02:47:06 <cehteh> DocScrutinizer: btw i need some educated guess from a EE :)
Jun 07 02:47:16 <SpeedEvil> About what?
Jun 07 02:47:25 <SpeedEvil> cehteh: I know a hell of a lot about GPS.
Jun 07 02:47:29 <SpeedEvil> It doesn't help at all.
Jun 07 02:47:38 <SpeedEvil> Simply as the implementation is closed.
Jun 07 02:47:39 <cehteh> i got this bike charger/battery ... soldered the charger cable and it generally works
Jun 07 02:47:43 <SpeedEvil> Ah
Jun 07 02:47:52 <cehteh> but sometimes the n900 reports "cant charge"
Jun 07 02:48:10 <cehteh> i guess the voltage drops because of a power spike when changing cell or so
Jun 07 02:48:27 <cehteh> so the bike charger has a DCDC output 5V regulated
Jun 07 02:48:46 <SpeedEvil> I think can't charge means it may have had a voltage drop
Jun 07 02:48:52 <cehteh> can i put a cap there to buffer spikes? ... maybe a goldcap? or would that be dangerous?
Jun 07 02:49:03 <SpeedEvil> Goldcap will do almost nothing
Jun 07 02:49:18 <SpeedEvil> You want a cap with a reasonably low series resistance
Jun 07 02:49:36 <cehteh> yes i dont know the resistance of goldcaps ..
Jun 07 02:49:47 <DocScrutinizer51> not dangerous but no use in it
Jun 07 02:49:50 <SpeedEvil> quite high - several hundred ohms is typical
Jun 07 02:49:59 <cehteh> ah ok didnt know that
Jun 07 02:50:09 <SpeedEvil> cehteh: Does it charge properly normally?
Jun 07 02:50:24 <cehteh> well on other circruits i put a big elko and a big tantal ..
Jun 07 02:50:27 <DocScrutinizer51> and you need sth like 1AsV
Jun 07 02:50:39 <cehteh> yes also stationary on my desk it charges from this battery
Jun 07 02:51:25 <SpeedEvil> I'd wonder if it was connection issues
Jun 07 02:51:42 <cehteh> its most likely a voltage drop, i just wonder how i can buffer that
Jun 07 02:51:47 <cehteh> no wasnt
Jun 07 02:52:11 <cehteh> connection is perfect i checked all connections 10 times :)
Jun 07 02:52:18 <DocScrutinizer51> ignore
Jun 07 02:52:32 <cehteh> and it restarted charging when i turned the battery off and on
Jun 07 02:52:37 <SpeedEvil> If you smack the battery about a little - does it go off?
Jun 07 02:52:41 <cehteh> no
Jun 07 02:52:42 <SpeedEvil> Check the switch
Jun 07 02:52:48 <cehteh> yes its all ok
Jun 07 02:53:01 <cehteh> assume its a voltage drop, how can i buffer that?
Jun 07 02:53:29 <cehteh> (if goldcap doesnt work i would just do my tantal+elko thing)
Jun 07 02:53:52 <DocScrutinizer51> ignore
Jun 07 02:53:56 <cehteh> or can i tell the device to charge at less current somehow?
Jun 07 02:54:00 <cehteh> DocScrutinizer: impossible
Jun 07 02:54:02 <DocScrutinizer51> cant buffer
Jun 07 02:54:25 <cehteh> it somtimes didnt came up charging 20 times in a row .. sometimes worked for 20 minutes
Jun 07 02:54:31 <cehteh> i must fix this somehow
Jun 07 02:54:42 <SpeedEvil> cehteh: Do you have a DMM?
Jun 07 02:54:48 <cehteh> DMM?
Jun 07 02:54:50 <cehteh> ah yes
Jun 07 02:54:53 <SpeedEvil> I'd start out by seeing if the voltage is on 5V
Jun 07 02:55:11 <cehteh> well not here but yes
Jun 07 02:56:07 <cehteh> the battery DCDC can only deliver 850 mA
Jun 07 02:56:14 <DocScrutinizer51> use ca146-a or a better DC/DC
Jun 07 02:56:16 <cehteh> then the voltage drops
Jun 07 02:56:21 <SpeedEvil> ?You
Jun 07 02:56:39 <SpeedEvil> You can regulate the charge current with the proper charger script
Jun 07 02:56:51 <SpeedEvil> I don't think BME can do this
Jun 07 02:57:12 <DocScrutinizer51> you could use 'jrbme' charger and limit current to less than that
Jun 07 02:57:36 <DocScrutinizer51> he, SpeedEvil beat me
Jun 07 02:57:41 <cehteh> sounds like a plan
Jun 07 02:58:05 <cehteh> bq27200.sh cant display input voltage?
Jun 07 02:58:11 <SpeedEvil> Well - I diddn't write anything distributable
Jun 07 02:58:13 <wblaze> silly question, is there a way to open multiple xterms on the n900?
Jun 07 02:58:13 <SpeedEvil> cehteh: no
Jun 07 02:58:29 <SpeedEvil> cehteh: Tehre are a number of flags on the charger chip that can tell you the state
Jun 07 02:58:37 <SpeedEvil> 200 is the charge monotro
Jun 07 02:58:44 <SpeedEvil> wblaze: tap 'new' in the context menu
Jun 07 02:58:49 <cehteh> well how big are the power spikes the device causes? .. prolly tens of ms
Jun 07 02:59:08 <SpeedEvil> There shouldn't be power spikes - significant ones.
Jun 07 02:59:20 <SpeedEvil> All the spikes come out of the battery
Jun 07 02:59:21 <wblaze> SpeedEvil: ... wow, I can't believe I missed that
Jun 07 02:59:34 <cehteh> well in  that case the battery was almost empty
Jun 07 02:59:35 <wblaze> thanks so much for humoring that haha
Jun 07 02:59:42 <DocScrutinizer51> but a bit >850 for seconds
**** ENDING LOGGING AT Tue Jun 07 02:59:57 2011