**** BEGIN LOGGING AT Mon Jul 11 02:59:56 2011
Jul 11 03:00:19 <MohammadAG> USB networking I'd guess
Jul 11 03:00:23 <DocScrutinizer> I gather that's some sort of interference
Jul 11 03:00:29 <MohammadAG> try unloading g_nokia.ko
Jul 11 03:00:41 <DocScrutinizer> MohammadAG: go to sleep
Jul 11 03:00:52 <DocScrutinizer> MohammadAG: we're talking about touchscreen
Jul 11 03:01:05 <MohammadAG> what?
Jul 11 03:01:31 <ieatlint> yeah, when you plug the phone into usb (computer, not tested with wall charger), it gets very weird
Jul 11 03:01:47 <DocScrutinizer> wallcharger here, same issue
Jul 11 03:02:11 <MohammadAG> oh dear
Jul 11 03:02:17 <javispedro> electrocution danger, will robinson!
Jul 11 03:02:25 <MohammadAG> capacitive + charger parts not covered well = that
Jul 11 03:02:26 <DocScrutinizer> in the settings menu I wasn't able to select a menu entry
Jul 11 03:02:40 * javispedro waits for n950 to make engadget front page news like n900 usb port problems
Jul 11 03:02:54 <MohammadAG> I'm surprised, Nokia had experience with c-ts
Jul 11 03:03:00 <MohammadAG> X6, N8 etc
Jul 11 03:03:10 <ieatlint> c-ts?
Jul 11 03:04:14 <MohammadAG> capacitive ts
Jul 11 03:04:21 <ieatlint> ah
Jul 11 03:04:22 <DocScrutinizer> btw seems I've seen a ref to Atmel related ts
Jul 11 03:04:23 <MohammadAG> DocScrutinizer, can I have ssh access tomorrow?
Jul 11 03:04:35 <ieatlint> well i heard they made an error on the n8
Jul 11 03:04:51 <MohammadAG> illegal, if released, but I want to try and get the swipe UI on the N900
Jul 11 03:04:51 <ieatlint> and that the accuracy of multitouch is extremely low
Jul 11 03:04:53 <MohammadAG> MeeGoCE
Jul 11 03:05:04 <MohammadAG> N8 works fine for me
Jul 11 03:05:05 <DocScrutinizer> sure, if you manage to sort the >><DocScrutinizer> anybody an idea why I can log in to 950 via LAN, but not from outside via NAT, shows prompt for password but refuses log in - password been correct though<< issue
Jul 11 03:05:19 <MohammadAG> reverse ssh DocScrutinizer ;)
Jul 11 03:05:24 <ieatlint> yeah, the n8 works, and it's "accurate enough" for the pinch gestures
Jul 11 03:05:35 <ieatlint> but that you can't do much more complicated things than that
Jul 11 03:06:39 <ieatlint> if he can't, i can probably get you a login, depending on what your intentions are :P
Jul 11 03:06:50 <MohammadAG> scp the swipe UI
Jul 11 03:06:55 <MohammadAG> binaries, libs, etc
Jul 11 03:07:11 <ieatlint> can't you just go grab the fw image?
Jul 11 03:07:21 <DocScrutinizer> SpeedEvil: would you know off top of your head where to check for alowed_hosts?
Jul 11 03:07:29 <MohammadAG> no one could mount it afaik
Jul 11 03:07:42 <MohammadAG> also, how does one import contacts on MeeGoCE?
Jul 11 03:07:50 <ieatlint> i thought the flasher tool had an "extract fiasco image" option?
Jul 11 03:08:13 <MohammadAG> yeah, that gives you a non standard rootfs.lzo file
Jul 11 03:08:25 <ieatlint> huh, i'll have to play with that and see
Jul 11 03:09:20 <javispedro> ali1234 already solved that, it was just non-standard block compression
Jul 11 03:10:27 <SpeedEvil> DocScrutinizer: it's in ~/.ssh/
Jul 11 03:10:53 <SpeedEvil> But I'm not sure that's the issue.
Jul 11 03:11:27 <MohammadAG> javispedro, he got another image he couldn't mount afaik
Jul 11 03:11:29 <DocScrutinizer> :-P
Jul 11 03:11:31 <DocScrutinizer> AllowUsers *@127.0.0.1 *@10.0.0.0/8 *@172.16.0.0/12 *@192.168.0.0/16
Jul 11 03:11:44 <DocScrutinizer> how bad is THAT
Jul 11 03:12:04 <javispedro> MohammadAG: I think he did, as that's how that Hurrian guy uselessly bricked his n900.
Jul 11 03:12:14 <ds3> you don't trust the link address (169.169.x.x)?
Jul 11 03:12:19 <ieatlint> DocScrutinizer: that makes sense actually
Jul 11 03:12:29 <DocScrutinizer> that is BS actually
Jul 11 03:12:47 <DocScrutinizer> a lot of LANs are 192.168.1.x or .2.x
Jul 11 03:13:00 <ieatlint> ds3: anyone who isn't able to actually run a network with ip address assignments shouldn't be developing on this phone :P
Jul 11 03:13:03 <MohammadAG> javispedro, he flashed the image? 
Jul 11 03:13:04 <javispedro> that's captured by the 192.168.0.0/16 mask?
Jul 11 03:13:07 <javispedro> MohammadAG: yes.
Jul 11 03:13:15 * MohammadAG facepalms
Jul 11 03:13:16 <ieatlint> DocScrutinizer: the /16 means only match the 192.168 part
Jul 11 03:13:20 <MohammadAG> shouldn't you be in bed javispedro ?
Jul 11 03:13:23 <DocScrutinizer> ooh I see
Jul 11 03:13:24 <javispedro> yes.
Jul 11 03:13:42 <ieatlint> the list of hosts match all home address ones except the 169
Jul 11 03:14:36 <DocScrutinizer> MohammadAG: ok, you can have ssh access
Jul 11 03:16:47 <DocScrutinizer> anybody knows about the >>port 22<< parameter? is it >>port 22, 666<< or >>port 22 666<< or >>port 22\nport666<< ?
Jul 11 03:18:19 <SpeedEvil> man sshd_config - ListenAddress
Jul 11 03:18:19 <MohammadAG> DocScrutinizer, tomorrow please, need to sleep in a bit
Jul 11 03:18:20 <ieatlint> DocScrutinizer: neither
Jul 11 03:18:27 <ieatlint> it's multiple lines
Jul 11 03:18:32 <SpeedEvil>              local addresses.  Multiple ListenAddress options are permitted.
Jul 11 03:18:39 <MohammadAG> I'm leaving for a long trip, taking the other N900 with MeeGoCE on it
Jul 11 03:18:40 <ieatlint> so you do "Port 22" and then another line with "Port 666"
Jul 11 03:19:07 <DocScrutinizer> >>port 22\nport666<<
Jul 11 03:19:10 <Dhraakellian> so how is MeeGoCE for daily use?
Jul 11 03:19:18 <DocScrutinizer> thanks
Jul 11 03:19:22 <MohammadAG> that's what I'm aiming to find out
Jul 11 03:19:28 <ieatlint> DocScrutinizer: correct
Jul 11 03:19:34 <ieatlint> whee, turbulence
Jul 11 03:19:37 <MohammadAG> SMS notifications are fun
Jul 11 03:20:05 <Dhraakellian> I loaded it up on a microSD card and wasn't impressed *quite* enough to keep using it
Jul 11 03:20:18 <Dhraakellian> but it did look greatly improved
Jul 11 03:20:26 <Dhraakellian> just from a casual poking-around standpoint
Jul 11 03:20:40 <MohammadAG> well, imported all my contacts
Jul 11 03:20:43 <MohammadAG> nice script alterego :)
Jul 11 03:20:45 <MohammadAG> and lcuk 
Jul 11 03:20:49 <Dhraakellian> (of course, it doesn't help that my antenna connections are rubbish)
Jul 11 03:21:19 * Dhraakellian wonders if he dares open up his n900 to see if there's an easy fix
Jul 11 03:21:41 <ieatlint> just go buy a nokla n900
Jul 11 03:21:56 <Dhraakellian> should probably grab a cheap GSM Android phone first, just so that I'm not without a phone
Jul 11 03:22:10 <Dhraakellian> actually, I am without a phone right now, since I'm getting the simcard errors every time
Jul 11 03:22:39 <Dhraakellian> ieatlint: running meamo5?
Jul 11 03:22:57 <ieatlint> i don't know what they call the os
Jul 11 03:24:07 <Dhraakellian> Nokla Meamo?
Jul 11 03:24:38 * Dhraakellian guesses poorly-ported Android?
Jul 11 03:26:14 <MohammadAG> alterego, I tried to import contacts, it said saved 235 contacts, but phone and contacts are empty
Jul 11 03:26:23 <ieatlint> MohammadAG: http://forums.internettablettalk.com/showpost.php?s=34b79a78f6fcac3f5af9d55801398625&p=1043548&postcount=303 btw
Jul 11 03:31:31 <hiemanshu> Morning
Jul 11 03:34:52 <divan> Morning. Did anyone installed Meego CE to the eMMC on N900? I follow these instructions http://wiki.meego.com/ARM/N900/Install/EMMC but the script doesn't work for me on Ubunut 10.10.
Jul 11 03:35:35 <hiemanshu> divan: what is the error?
Jul 11 03:36:47 <divan> First of all, it ignores kernel command line parameter, second, it looks for file initrd-n900 (which I don't have), and as a result it cannot bring up usb0 interface. I don't mention bugs with NetworkManager detect/stop functionality.
Jul 11 03:40:40 <divan> Do I need to use Rescure Initrd to install Meego CE? 
Jul 11 03:41:00 <divan> s/Rescure/Rescue/
Jul 11 03:41:01 <infobot> divan meant: Do I need to use Rescue Initrd to install Meego CE? 
Jul 11 03:41:07 <hiemanshu> divan: this is not the right channel, lets talk in #meego-arm
Jul 11 03:41:37 <divan> hanspeter, yep, I've asked there.
Jul 11 04:04:14 <ieatlint> so the maemo/n900 flash utility doesn't work with meego/harmatan, right?
Jul 11 04:12:45 <DocScrutinizer> right
Jul 11 04:13:00 <DocScrutinizer> that's what I think at least
Jul 11 04:16:09 <ieatlint> ah, looks like there is a flasher for the n9/50 on nokia's site here http://tablets-dev.nokia.com/maemo-dev-env-downloads.php
Jul 11 04:16:24 <hiemanshu> yeah
Jul 11 04:16:30 <hiemanshu> and any idea where the images are?
Jul 11 04:17:18 <ieatlint> i think there's just the one public image dated 22-6
Jul 11 04:17:47 <ieatlint> (which btw is a date, it should be week number - day of week)
Jul 11 04:17:52 <ieatlint> (counted 1-7)
Jul 11 05:45:50 <krayon> DocScrutinizer: Did you end up getting an N950?
Jul 11 06:06:21 <pavi> DocScrutinizer, I tried the cable with my netbook running sid , it works :D . 
Jul 11 06:26:39 <divan> DocScrutinizer, talking about fiasco image, should I create it by myself? I see different tutorials in the net, not sure what to choose.
Jul 11 06:27:05 <divan> Any good how-to on this topic?
Jul 11 07:00:05 <Sicelo> nice pavi :)
Jul 11 07:00:49 <pavi> Sicelo, I am thinking that my desktop which has Linux Mint Debian edition has some broken USB drivers .
Jul 11 07:01:14 <pavi> I kind of removed mint repo and upgraded stuff on it . it had some package conflits
Jul 11 07:45:00 <Sicelo> question: if i install h-e-n package, do i still need to get anything else to make it work? (reason for asking is because i don't have the cable for it atm, so i can't test.. but will have use for it soon as i have cable with me)
Jul 11 07:57:03 <hiemanshu> Status is still New Order :(
Jul 11 07:57:54 <hiemanshu> looks like they are shipping today though
Jul 11 08:01:10 <RST38h> moo ladies and gentlemen
Jul 11 08:01:29 <RST38h> hiemanshu: what is the URL to check?
Jul 11 08:03:02 <hiemanshu> RST38h: https://forumnokia.secure.force.com/apex/ProductOrders it should change from new orders to something different
Jul 11 08:03:06 <hiemanshu> and you will have an email too
Jul 11 08:08:02 <RST38h> hiemanshu: thanks!
Jul 11 08:34:24 <Jaffa> Morning, all
Jul 11 08:40:29 <rzr> hi
Jul 11 08:50:41 <khertan> Morning
Jul 11 08:50:48 <khertan> Your order has been sent
Jul 11 08:50:49 <khertan> :)
Jul 11 08:58:46 <Hurrian> ah, how i love the 5 second boot time
Jul 11 09:15:27 <tackat> we have a Qt Components Version of Marble now in the works: https://projects.kde.org/projects/kde/kdeedu/marble/repository/show?rev=gsoc-2011-qtcomponents
Jul 11 09:16:28 <Hurrian> hmm, i was playing with a friend's Nokia 8800 Arte
Jul 11 09:16:46 <Hurrian> it shows you a clock if you double-tap the screen when locked
Jul 11 09:17:39 <hiemanshu> khertan: what was your order number?
Jul 11 09:19:35 <khertan> hiemanshu, i didn't got an tracking number yet
Jul 11 09:19:49 <hiemanshu> khertan: the order number, the OID- something number
Jul 11 09:19:55 <hiemanshu> khertan: tell me the last 3 digits please :)
Jul 11 09:20:07 <khertan> ah this is one :)
Jul 11 09:20:27 <khertan> 52751
Jul 11 09:20:56 <hiemanshu> :( I am 887
Jul 11 09:21:07 <hiemanshu> more than a 100 away :( :( :(
Jul 11 09:21:10 <khertan> ;)
Jul 11 09:21:40 <khertan> hiemanshu, i think there are packaging all device ... and sent seems to be a 5 oclock fi time
Jul 11 09:21:52 <khertan> so there is time to package some more device
Jul 11 09:21:53 <khertan> :)
Jul 11 09:22:05 <hiemanshu> khertan: well yeah, but I am hoping mine goes through today
Jul 11 09:22:11 <hiemanshu> or I will shoot myself waiting :(
Jul 11 09:22:27 <khertan> :)
Jul 11 09:23:17 <cpscotti> hiemanshu, khertan  775 here..
Jul 11 09:23:25 <hiemanshu> cpscotti: sent?
Jul 11 09:23:25 <khertan> :)
Jul 11 09:23:29 <cpscotti> no..
Jul 11 09:23:34 <cpscotti> no tracking number too
Jul 11 09:23:34 <hiemanshu> k
Jul 11 09:23:43 <hiemanshu> well you should get an email telling sent
Jul 11 09:23:43 <cpscotti> well.. but we have a whole week coming..
Jul 11 09:24:14 <hiemanshu> and how hard is it to pack say 1000 phones a day, shouldn't take more than 3-5 mins to pack one :/
Jul 11 09:24:41 <cpscotti> so.. now.. changing subjects.. chaps.. I got a problem.. My notebook is dying (like.. for real).. Any recommendations? Is a thinkpad that good?
Jul 11 09:25:05 <hiemanshu> yeah TP is the way to go for linux
Jul 11 09:25:57 <cpscotti> hiemanshu, that's what I was expecting.. just wanted to b sure :D
Jul 11 09:26:12 <hiemanshu> heh yeah
Jul 11 09:26:16 <cpscotti> the shit is.. they take 2 weeks to ship that.. the bastards
Jul 11 09:42:10 <lardman> morning
Jul 11 09:42:29 <lardman> any dhl news?
Jul 11 09:45:14 <hiemanshu> lardman: yours was sent?
Jul 11 09:46:22 <hiemanshu> cpscotti: more reports of it being shipped or people getting it
Jul 11 09:46:30 <hiemanshu> cpscotti: I suddenly have the need to die :/
Jul 11 09:47:20 <hiemanshu> cpscotti: and some with 92x got the sent email :/
Jul 11 09:47:30 <hiemanshu> s/some/someone/
Jul 11 09:47:30 <infobot> hiemanshu meant: cpscotti: and someone with 92x got the sent email :/
Jul 11 09:47:45 <cpscotti> wooa
Jul 11 09:48:00 <cpscotti> I didn't get the "sent" e-mail
Jul 11 09:48:03 <cpscotti> not yet
Jul 11 09:48:10 <cpscotti> 775 here..
Jul 11 09:48:13 <hiemanshu> well lets wait
Jul 11 09:48:25 <hiemanshu> yeah, I hope they send it today, or somebody is gonna get a hurt real bad
Jul 11 09:48:27 <cpscotti> yeah
Jul 11 09:48:44 <lardman> hiemanshu: I've not received a package nor a dhl email, so I guess not
Jul 11 09:48:46 <cpscotti> I'm waiting patiently.. I think...
Jul 11 09:49:07 <hiemanshu> lardman: did you get the 'Your order has been sent' email ?
Jul 11 09:49:08 <cpscotti> hiemanshu, lol!
Jul 11 09:49:16 <lardman> hiemanshu: no
Jul 11 09:49:18 <hiemanshu> cpscotti: ?
Jul 11 09:49:23 <hiemanshu> lardman: then wait till they send it
Jul 11 09:49:39 <cpscotti> hiemanshu, "somebody is gonna get hurt real bad"
Jul 11 09:49:40 <hiemanshu> lardman: you will get a sent email too
Jul 11 09:49:57 <hiemanshu> cpscotti: heard of russel peters?
Jul 11 09:50:00 <cpscotti> no..
Jul 11 09:50:04 <lardman> hmm
Jul 11 09:50:06 <cpscotti> who's that?
Jul 11 09:50:19 <lardman> would be interesting to see a break down of who's received what
Jul 11 09:51:08 <rcg> meh
Jul 11 09:51:16 <rcg> what was the last thing i send in here?
Jul 11 09:52:22 <rcg> (11:44:47 AM) rcg: ehm.. just a little heads up.. seems like Druid23 messed up the wiki page: http://wiki.meego.com/Community_Office/Community_device_program/Nokia
Jul 11 09:52:22 <rcg> (11:45:20 AM) rcg: messed up as in kinda reverted to a very old state
Jul 11 09:52:22 <rcg> (11:46:06 AM) rcg: should we just revert his change?
Jul 11 09:52:26 <cpscotti> hiemanshu, who's that?
Jul 11 09:52:42 <rcg> just in case i didn't sent it correctly before i got disconnected
Jul 11 09:52:42 <cpscotti> s/that/b/he
Jul 11 09:52:58 <hiemanshu> cpscotti: a comedian
Jul 11 09:53:17 <hiemanshu> cpscotti: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Nn5jlrxcpkI
Jul 11 09:54:53 <rcg> alright Vitaminj fixed it already
Jul 11 09:55:37 <cpscotti> hiemanshu, haheah lol!
Jul 11 09:56:20 <hiemanshu> cpscotti: listen to the whole thing :P
Jul 11 09:56:57 <lcuk> lardman, same here
Jul 11 09:57:41 * cpscotti watching.. :d
Jul 11 09:58:07 <lardman> lcuk: :(
Jul 11 09:58:09 <hiemanshu> cpscotti: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Nn5jlrxcpkI
Jul 11 09:58:28 <hiemanshu> errr
Jul 11 09:58:42 <hiemanshu> cpscotti: N950 email received and device ordered 7th (OID-052796). Sent on 11th (AM)
Jul 11 09:58:43 <lcuk> lardman, it should be sent soon :D
Jul 11 09:58:45 <hiemanshu> from the wiki
Jul 11 09:58:52 <hiemanshu> lcuk: I hope
Jul 11 09:59:05 <hiemanshu> because they are sending random OIDs
Jul 11 10:00:00 <cpscotti> hiemanshu, shiiet.. 
Jul 11 10:00:10 <cpscotti> yeah..
Jul 11 10:00:15 <lardman> well let's just hope they're in gear and will send a tranche today
Jul 11 10:01:00 <cpscotti> hiemanshu, got to the "somebody's gonna get hurt real bad" part..
Jul 11 10:04:25 <hiemanshu> cpscotti: and http://twitter.com/#!/seiflotfy/status/90356475423236099
Jul 11 10:05:24 <cpscotti> hiemanshu, stop this! hehe.. is that torture of some kind? lol
Jul 11 10:05:33 <hiemanshu> yup :P
Jul 11 10:08:20 <cpscotti> hiemanshu, lol! anyway.. I have faith I'll see it sometime this week.. (humm.. !?!?faith!?!?.. am I getting religious about this thing..  geez!)
Jul 11 10:08:39 <hiemanshu> cpscotti: I want it before friday to show off at the Qt meetup
Jul 11 10:09:26 <hiemanshu> cpscotti: so if its not sent today or maybe tomorrow, there is a good chance I wont see it until the next week :(
Jul 11 10:10:41 <chem|st> morning
Jul 11 10:11:55 <cpscotti> hiemanshu, faith man! faith! :P
Jul 11 10:12:23 <hiemanshu> cpscotti: lol, well I am going to see if I can sleep for a bit, head hurts :(
Jul 11 10:15:02 <cpscotti> hiemanshu,  hangover? or too much F5ing?
Jul 11 10:15:10 <hiemanshu> cpscotti: both
Jul 11 10:15:37 <cpscotti> haha.. join the club!
Jul 11 10:16:04 <hiemanshu> :D
Jul 11 10:16:20 <hiemanshu> well I slept after being up for over 36 hours, that adds to the list too
Jul 11 10:16:47 <cityLights> any sed guru in the house?
Jul 11 10:17:48 <hiemanshu> cityLights: just ask, if someone knows the answer, they'll answer
Jul 11 10:18:41 <cpscotti> hiemanshu, gosh.. that's a nice weekend! enough pizza?
Jul 11 10:19:08 <hiemanshu> cpscotti: well no pizza, but a lot of other stuff, and a nice sunday morning trek
Jul 11 10:19:09 <cpscotti> cityLights, try awk it's a lot more "readable"
Jul 11 10:36:31 <cityLights> hi all
Jul 11 10:36:37 <cityLights>  ip route list 0.0.0.0/0  |sed 's/.*dev \([a-z]\+[0-9]\+\).*$/\1/'
Jul 11 10:36:52 <cityLights> is giving me two lines, how to get only one?
Jul 11 10:37:28 <bindi_> hey
Jul 11 10:37:54 <cehteh> which 2?
Jul 11 10:38:04 <bindi_> ive got cssu, and when using camera, it says memory is full
Jul 11 10:38:22 <bindi_> just reflashed and installed cssu
Jul 11 10:38:39 <bindi_> 26G free on internal
Jul 11 10:38:48 <cityLights> cehteh: I got two lines with eth0
Jul 11 10:38:53 <cehteh> strange
Jul 11 10:39:00 <cityLights> I can explian why
Jul 11 10:39:13 <cityLights> I got two defaults with difrrent metric
Jul 11 10:39:32 <cityLights> any way , I can pipe and get one, but is there a sed wt?
Jul 11 10:39:35 <cehteh> i am not logged in to my device but does it really do that? ..
Jul 11 10:39:35 <cityLights> way?
Jul 11 10:39:49 <cehteh> | head -1
Jul 11 10:39:55 <cityLights> right
Jul 11 10:40:04 <cityLights> I was looking for the sed way
Jul 11 10:40:09 <cehteh> some sed or awk way prolly too
Jul 11 10:40:22 <cehteh> actually learning awk would make this easiers :)
Jul 11 10:40:51 <cityLights> this is to fix xen's bridge script
Jul 11 10:41:30 <cehteh> ip route list 0.0.0.0/0  | awk '/default/{print $5; exit(0);}'
Jul 11 10:41:35 <cehteh> does that work?
Jul 11 10:42:11 <cityLights> yes
Jul 11 10:42:15 <cehteh> :)
Jul 11 10:43:38 <cehteh> bindi_: configured to save pics to µSD?
Jul 11 10:43:59 <cehteh> or do you have usb still plugged in and in storage mode?
Jul 11 11:09:02 * SpeedEvil completes a nokia survey he has been sent about his current phone.
Jul 11 11:09:10 <SpeedEvil> For all the good it'll do.
Jul 11 11:09:20 <cehteh> lol
Jul 11 11:09:42 <cehteh> [ ] Will you buy a WP7 Phone
Jul 11 11:09:52 <SpeedEvil> Exactly.
Jul 11 11:10:08 <SpeedEvil> Though it also mentioned lenovo as a handset maker.
Jul 11 11:10:15 <SpeedEvil> Of the future phone.
Jul 11 11:10:27 <SpeedEvil> I suppose they are positioned well for it.
Jul 11 11:10:30 <cehteh> haha "anything but nokia" :P
Jul 11 11:10:47 <SpeedEvil> They already make rectangular black things.
Jul 11 11:12:27 <cehteh> when my n900 breaks, i'll buy the next open plattfrom gnu/linux based phone ... maybe i have a few vendors on my blacklist (sony, apple, microsoft) but i dont expect those to come out with an open platform anyways
Jul 11 11:13:27 <cehteh> i'd like if samsung goes the open way, i thing they would be welcome by the community
Jul 11 11:13:41 <cehteh> but iff this certainly takes years for a product
Jul 11 11:14:23 <cehteh> how long did maemo evolve before the n900? 5, 6, 7 ..? years?
Jul 11 11:31:58 <bindi_> cehteh: how to check?
Jul 11 11:32:06 <bindi_> the settings doesnt cover that
Jul 11 11:33:59 <cehteh> yes you can select where to store on the camera app .. settings or the 'memory card' icon on the lower lefr
Jul 11 11:34:01 <cehteh> left
Jul 11 11:34:33 <cehteh> also when/while usb is plugged in in storage mode, the drives are unmounted at the device and not available
Jul 11 11:38:10 <hiemanshu> cpscotti: anything yet for ya?
Jul 11 11:38:23 <cpscotti> hiemanshu, nope
Jul 11 11:38:48 <hiemanshu> cpscotti: gah, ok :(
Jul 11 11:38:55 <bindi_> cehteh: it said root volume
Jul 11 11:39:08 <bindi_> i changed it to internal memory
Jul 11 11:39:14 <bindi_> whats the difference
Jul 11 11:39:26 <cpscotti> :/
Jul 11 11:39:41 <cehteh> woot it can write to root?
Jul 11 11:39:44 <cehteh> thats really bad
Jul 11 11:40:07 <cehteh> if root becomes full, then your device will become unreliable
Jul 11 11:40:24 <cehteh> if you have already some pictures stored there, better move them out of the way
Jul 11 11:40:31 <cehteh> (i dont know that this even works)
Jul 11 11:43:24 <Hurrian> cehteh, full root isnt much of a problem
Jul 11 11:43:31 <Hurrian> on UBIFS
Jul 11 11:43:55 <cehteh> Hurrian: how that? if the OS wants to store something there and this fails then things get hairy
Jul 11 11:44:20 <Hurrian> cehteh, logs in /var are compressed because UBIFS
Jul 11 11:44:43 <Hurrian> linux doesnt panic on full root anywat
Jul 11 11:45:02 <Hurrian> on a side note, the n900's rootfs is lzo compressed right?
Jul 11 11:45:10 <SpeedEvil> Linux doesn't - which doesn't make any difffernecte if the stach you're using over it fall over.
Jul 11 11:46:00 <Hurrian> it's not like we're swapping on root, in fact i got the N900 to start on a read-only file system once
Jul 11 11:46:12 <Hurrian> mostly because of a broken UBIFS, but my point stands
Jul 11 11:46:27 <Hurrian> the N900 will still work with a full root, you may not be able to write new files though
Jul 11 11:46:42 <cehteh> Hurrian: i meant the OS/installation becomes unreliable, not the kernel or filesystem per se
Jul 11 11:46:51 <Hurrian> however, most of everything you download for apps writes to emmc, no problem there
Jul 11 11:47:17 <Hurrian> hmm, wonder if we can recompress the N900's rootfs in zlib
Jul 11 11:47:19 <cehteh> if apt-get cant even create its lockfiles for example (are these on /?)
Jul 11 11:47:33 <Hurrian> cehteh, that's for debian-apt
Jul 11 11:47:38 <Hurrian> fapman works fine
Jul 11 11:47:44 <cehteh> well since 1.2 and 'normal' use, full rootfs is not a problem anymore
Jul 11 11:47:59 <cehteh> but bugs, like writing pictures to root may pose problems
Jul 11 11:48:55 <Hurrian> didnt know that camera-ui even allowed that
Jul 11 11:48:57 <cehteh> Hurrian: well even startup may (i dont know for sure) writes data to root, nologin, lockfiles, fsck marker, and so on
Jul 11 11:49:42 <cehteh> if that fails then the devices doesnt boot correctly .. either fatally or just something becomes unreliable
Jul 11 11:49:53 <Hurrian> cehteh, isn't the N900's fstab 0 0 at the end?
Jul 11 11:50:05 <Hurrian> fsck marker would only be for /home
Jul 11 11:50:31 <Hurrian> anyways, doesnt ubifs not come with a fsck tool?
Jul 11 11:50:33 <cehteh> yeah that was only an example .. there are other things on a 'normal' linux system which require a writeable root
Jul 11 11:50:49 <cehteh> but most/all of this things can be turned off/ relocated
Jul 11 11:51:06 <cehteh> and i dont know how much maemo5 does this on the n900
Jul 11 11:52:36 <Hurrian> cehteh, /dev/sda3 / ext4 ro 0 0
Jul 11 11:52:47 <Hurrian> fastest boots ever
Jul 11 11:53:27 <Hurrian> tmp on ram, /home and /usr on separate drives
Jul 11 12:07:12 <hiemanshu> cpscotti: 2 hours to the end of the day :/
Jul 11 12:08:02 <cpscotti> hiemanshu, you mean.. in helsinki? 
Jul 11 12:08:07 <hiemanshu> cpscotti: yeah
Jul 11 12:08:44 <cpscotti> hiemanshu, hope!
Jul 11 12:08:48 <cpscotti> hehaeuhue
Jul 11 12:10:03 <khertan> we want to believe
Jul 11 12:10:04 <khertan> :)
Jul 11 12:10:22 <hiemanshu> khertan: yours was sent, so STFU :P
Jul 11 12:10:33 <khertan> :)
Jul 11 12:10:56 <khertan> yeah but no tracking number ... and didn't expect dhl to found my little town before next week :)
Jul 11 12:11:13 <hiemanshu> well tracking number will come at the end of the day really
Jul 11 12:11:25 <khertan> i know
Jul 11 12:12:02 <hiemanshu> but atleast the sticker is with your name has been printed
Jul 11 12:12:08 <khertan> yep
Jul 11 12:12:28 <cehteh> and they'll drop it by parchute?
Jul 11 12:12:50 <khertan> :)
Jul 11 12:13:30 <khertan> i just hope they will not use iphone gps ... didn't found my town :)
Jul 11 12:14:17 <cehteh> where do you live? .fr  we have someone from martinique with a .fr domain, bit off the mainland :P
Jul 11 12:18:09 <lardman> hmm, still no notifications :(
Jul 11 12:18:18 * lardman goes to cry into a sandwich
Jul 11 12:18:23 <khertan> cehteh, north of paris ... 77km
Jul 11 12:18:25 <hiemanshu> lardman: same here, the shipping is fucked up :(
Jul 11 12:18:36 <khertan> but in very small town ;)
Jul 11 12:18:52 <cehteh> well .. looks still central 
Jul 11 12:18:55 <hiemanshu> I ordered on thursday, and it and its monday, for fucks sake, send my device alreadyh
Jul 11 12:19:20 <khertan> cehteh, yeah ... but tnt and dhl never deliver thing in time
Jul 11 12:19:27 <cehteh> i am in karlsruhe 15km away from the french border .. and over there on the vosges are really small and hardly reachable towns
Jul 11 12:19:33 <khertan> cehteh, last time tnt said that address didn't exist
Jul 11 12:19:57 <khertan> cehteh, you can say it s hardly reachable ... mine town isn't ...
Jul 11 12:20:25 <cehteh> some valleys are better reachable from the german side than from france :P
Jul 11 12:20:30 <khertan> :)
Jul 11 12:20:50 <hiemanshu> khertan: in the order page, what does your order status show up as?
Jul 11 12:20:55 <khertan> germany have this days a better budget than us
Jul 11 12:21:04 <khertan> which wasn't the case 10 years ago
Jul 11 12:21:30 <khertan> hiemanshu, let me check
Jul 11 12:21:35 * khertan hate OBS and RPM
Jul 11 12:22:19 <khertan> Device Sent to Customer
Jul 11 12:22:24 <khertan> hiemanshu, ^
Jul 11 12:22:35 <hiemanshu> khertan: ok thanks
Jul 11 12:23:12 <khertan> error: Installed (but unpackaged) file(s) found: ... *.pyo <<<< of course dubfull packaging tool it s not suppose to be installed
Jul 11 12:23:17 <cehteh> "device lost while shipping" :)
Jul 11 12:23:23 <khertan> :)
Jul 11 12:23:38 <khertan> cehteh, my last 2 tnt delivery was lost
Jul 11 12:27:40 <lardman> mine says "New Order"
Jul 11 12:28:07 <lcuk> lardman, which page shows the order
Jul 11 12:28:11 <lcuk> or is that the email
Jul 11 12:28:20 <lardman> the order page
Jul 11 12:28:32 <lardman> click on orders
Jul 11 12:28:52 <lardman> https://forumnokia.secure.force.com/ProductOrders I guess
Jul 11 12:29:01 <MohammadAG> New order here too
Jul 11 12:29:09 <CaCO3> my order page also sais "new order", since last thurstday when I oredered it
Jul 11 12:29:39 <lcuk> same here
Jul 11 12:30:24 <hiemanshu> same here
Jul 11 12:30:32 <hiemanshu> I wanna shoot the nokia shipping dept.
Jul 11 12:30:46 <lardman> more interesting would be to know whether that changes to anything else
Jul 11 12:30:58 <lardman> or if it just vanishes once it's been shipped
Jul 11 12:31:12 <hiemanshu> changed to 'Device Sent to Customer'
Jul 11 12:31:18 <hiemanshu> changes*
Jul 11 12:34:13 <CaCO3> well, as we get it for free, i don't want to make pressure
Jul 11 12:34:22 <CaCO3> I see it as good will of nokia
Jul 11 12:35:17 <MohammadAG> would be fun if it changed to "Difficulties while processing your payment"
Jul 11 12:35:40 * Jaffa wants MOAR SOFTWAREZ :-p
Jul 11 12:35:41 <CaCO3> :)
Jul 11 12:35:44 <Jaffa> Hurry up & get your devices.
Jul 11 12:36:01 <MohammadAG> yeah, totally our fault
Jul 11 12:36:06 <CaCO3> I am more disapinted that there is not yet a properly set up building system :(
Jul 11 12:36:27 <hiemanshu> Jaffa: make nokia send us our devices soon
Jul 11 12:37:02 <CaCO3> I already tried to pack/build packages, but without some how to explanations I just got stock
Jul 11 12:37:34 <Jaffa> CaCO3: http://wiki.meego.com/Getting_started_with_OBS and http://forum.meego.com/showthread.php?t=3694
Jul 11 12:38:08 <CaCO3> well, it nowhere explains how to pack the *.tar.gz and the debian.tar.gz
Jul 11 12:38:23 <Jaffa> CaCO3: http://forum.meego.com/showpost.php?p=24047&postcount=15 :-p
Jul 11 12:38:23 <Macer> ok
Jul 11 12:38:31 <Macer> google+ is actually... kind of nice
Jul 11 12:38:32 <Jaffa> CaCO3: (cos I had the same problem, I wheeled out an updated mud)
Jul 11 12:38:46 <Macer> although i hate the way it does that whole blacked out video/photo thing like fb decided to do
Jul 11 12:38:46 <CaCO3> and my dsc files seem to be wrong, at least the builder sais always architecture: excluded)
Jul 11 12:39:06 <Jaffa> CaCO3: Let mud2 create your .dsc for you, if you're using Qt Creator
Jul 11 12:39:07 <CaCO3> well, after 2 days of consulting google I gave up
Jul 11 12:39:11 <Macer> and i am curious how fb isn't suing the hell out of them for a pretty obvious clone of fb :)
Jul 11 12:39:17 <CaCO3> I am waiting until the system is set up and documented
Jul 11 12:39:43 <CaCO3> Jaffa: I got very confused about suse, spec and so on
Jul 11 12:39:51 <CaCO3> I am working on a debian sytsem
Jul 11 12:40:30 <CaCO3> I am packing python projects, so qt creator cant handle them, and the other ones are ports
Jul 11 12:42:11 <Hurrian> http://goput.it/ewx.jpg
Jul 11 12:42:25 <khertan> Whouhou !!! Pyflakes packages
Jul 11 12:42:38 <khertan> Whouhou !!! Pyflakes packaged ... what a pain to package a simple package with obs
Jul 11 12:42:43 <CaCO3> I havent even figured out yet which architecture the N9* will use. Is it armv8el or something 7
Jul 11 12:42:52 <khertan> undocumented errors and full of googling to avoid
Jul 11 12:43:12 <Hurrian> CaCO3 - armv7l
Jul 11 12:43:20 <khertan> CaCO3, for the moment ... i didn't see any target for harmattan on the meego community obs
Jul 11 12:43:38 <CaCO3> thys why I am confused...
Jul 11 12:44:12 <khertan> https://build.pub.meego.com/project/show?project=home%3Arzr <<< some have a harmattan repository
Jul 11 12:44:13 <khertan> :)à
Jul 11 12:44:19 <Hurrian> to be exact, armv7tnhl
Jul 11 12:44:23 <CaCO3> does mud2 work in scratchbox?
Jul 11 12:44:43 <Hurrian> t - thumbee , n - neon , h - hardfp , l - little endian
Jul 11 12:44:49 <Hurrian> *thumb
Jul 11 12:44:51 <Hurrian> woops
Jul 11 12:44:57 <CaCO3> I asked rzr yesterday for some hints, but he didnt want to help or didnt see my request :(
Jul 11 12:45:19 <rzr> sorry guys i was afk
Jul 11 12:46:08 <CaCO3> in my OBS, I cant even add the harmattan repo or something with armv7el
Jul 11 12:46:09 <rzr> CaCO3: ping me again in a couple of hours, else i did rtfm you can try to branch my git
Jul 11 12:46:36 <Jaffa> khertan: http://forum.meego.com/showthread.php?p=25005#post25005 <- how to enable Harmattan COBS target whilst it's not visible yet
Jul 11 12:46:37 <khertan> ;)
Jul 11 12:46:40 <CaCO3> yea, thanks. maybe later, i am just heading off to a job interview
Jul 11 12:46:49 <khertan> Jaffa, thx you jaffa
Jul 11 12:47:08 <Jaffa> khertan: CaCO3: Follow the threads "apps.meego.com in the Nokia N9" and "Qt Creator, debian_harmattan and Scratchbox"
Jul 11 12:47:48 <CaCO3> ok, thanks, I will have another look on it later
Jul 11 12:49:44 <hiemanshu> khertan: did you get an email from DHL?
Jul 11 12:50:11 <khertan> hiemanshu, not yet ... will probably come soon
Jul 11 12:53:37 * CaCO3 is heading off
Jul 11 12:54:26 <ruskie> hmm has anyone tried updating telepathy with a more recent release?
Jul 11 12:54:29 <ruskie> on the n900
Jul 11 12:57:17 <khertan> hiemanshu, i got the tracking number
Jul 11 12:57:27 <khertan> No result found for your DHL query. Please try again.
Jul 11 12:57:32 <khertan> lol already lost ? :)
Jul 11 12:58:01 <Jaffa> khertan: Takes them a while.
Jul 11 12:58:24 <khertan> Jaffa, yeah i know just joking :)
Jul 11 12:58:44 <khertan> PREMIUM Service .... nice for a free device ...
Jul 11 12:58:46 <khertan> thx nokia
Jul 11 12:59:37 <khertan> Jaffa, maybe you can help me
Jul 11 12:59:37 <khertan> :)
Jul 11 12:59:51 <khertan> Jaffa, what excluded really mean in obs ? :)
Jul 11 12:59:53 <Jaffa> khertan: Be quick - got a meeting in a minute
Jul 11 13:00:25 <khertan> yep no problem i m learning packaging for meego and harmattan
Jul 11 13:00:26 <khertan> :)
Jul 11 13:00:30 <Jaffa> khertan: "Excluded" means the target matching functionality didn't find the necessary trigger file. For example, I've configured my home project to build against MeeGo 1.2, but Attitude is "excluded" becaused it doesn't have a .spec file.
Jul 11 13:01:00 <khertan> ok this mean i need a spec file, and a dsc to target meego and harmattan. thx
Jul 11 13:01:24 <khertan> have a good meeting :)
Jul 11 13:21:28 <khertan> %define _unpackaged_files_terminate_build 0   <<< the magic define to be able to build python package with python setup.py
Jul 11 13:34:53 <hiemanshu> khertan: FU, still new order here :( :(
Jul 11 13:35:53 <hiemanshu> well nothing today then :(
Jul 11 13:49:20 <hiemanshu> cpscotti: http://twitter.com/#!/Summeli/status/90415959336157186
Jul 11 13:49:23 <rm_work> hiemanshu: same :(
Jul 11 13:49:31 <rm_work> still "New Order" for me :(
Jul 11 13:49:43 <rm_work> did more people actually get theirs shipped today?
Jul 11 13:49:52 <hiemanshu> rm_work: well fucking nokia, I am not going to develop anything for them now, untill N9 releases and its 2 months old
Jul 11 13:49:56 <hiemanshu> rm_work: yes, like khertan
Jul 11 13:49:59 <hiemanshu> and a few more
Jul 11 13:50:16 <cpscotti> hiemanshu, god! this is getting bad... 
Jul 11 13:50:19 <hiemanshu> s/months/years/
Jul 11 13:50:36 <hiemanshu> cpscotti: yeah, and well its almost the end of the day there in .fi
Jul 11 13:50:37 <rm_work> wtf
Jul 11 13:50:41 <deimos> rm_work, me too since 7 jul :(
Jul 11 13:50:42 <khertan> rm_work, yep i got it shipped today and with tracking number
Jul 11 13:51:16 <rm_work> people really getting pissed off because Nokia is taking a while to loan them a device, for free? :/
Jul 11 13:51:17 <cpscotti> hiemanshu, I see the day tomorrow taking the same course it did today.. lots of hope in the beginning and then hate at the end
Jul 11 13:51:17 <hiemanshu> and they said they will ship within one business day
Jul 11 13:51:24 <hiemanshu> yup
Jul 11 13:51:26 <nmjnb> Hi everyone. I've got some trouble with my N900, it won't connect to Nokia Ovi Suite.
Jul 11 13:51:27 <deimos> khertan, when you made the order ?
Jul 11 13:51:46 <khertan> 7 jully 12h27 fi time
Jul 11 13:52:16 <nmjnb> I didn't need it before but recently I tried the "Kernel Power" kernel, and now I'm trying to reverse it without luck.
Jul 11 13:52:31 <rm_work> seems a little odd, but i guess they should expect that... when you make people feel entitled to something, they get pissed off when you are slow at providing it, even when you didn't have to provide it in the first place and are doing them a favor <_<
Jul 11 13:52:34 <nmjnb> So I was thinking of flashing the OS
Jul 11 13:53:04 <rm_work> it's not like we're paying them a bunch of money
Jul 11 13:53:12 <khertan> rm_work, it s human
Jul 11 13:53:17 <hiemanshu> rm_work: well esp when a big company like nokia takes a whole fucking week to ship something
Jul 11 13:53:21 <rm_work> :/
Jul 11 13:53:28 <hiemanshu> khertan: they cant handle 500 orders in one day?
Jul 11 13:53:30 <rm_work> you made the order on thursday, no?
Jul 11 13:53:33 <khertan> rm_work, and this prove that we have interest in there device
Jul 11 13:53:35 <hiemanshu> rm_work: yes
Jul 11 13:53:51 <rm_work> that means there's only been 2-3 working days now
Jul 11 13:53:51 <khertan> hiemanshu, probably when it s done in an office and not a the production center
Jul 11 13:54:05 <khertan> hiemanshu, and they probably reflash them all before packing them
Jul 11 13:54:08 <rm_work> and they are probably not equipped for this kind of rush
Jul 11 13:54:28 <rm_work> just calm down and give them some credit for doing this program in the first place
Jul 11 13:54:30 <khertan> it s come from the 5th floor
Jul 11 13:54:32 <khertan> :)
Jul 11 13:54:34 <rm_work> and wait :P
Jul 11 13:54:39 <hiemanshu> rm_work: thats stupid, if they weren't equipped for it, they shouldn't have let me order it
Jul 11 13:54:43 <fiferboy> rm_work: New Order for me too
Jul 11 13:54:52 <fiferboy> Maybe they're doing North America last?
Jul 11 13:55:01 <rm_work> i'm excited, and i'm disappointed it's not shipping yet, but i don't feel like i have a right to get pissed at them for it :/
Jul 11 13:55:18 <rm_work> they're doing me a favor, for free, because they decided to
Jul 11 13:55:24 <khertan> you didn't order it ... you ask  it :) they give it free remember
Jul 11 13:55:25 <khertan> :)
Jul 11 13:55:25 <rm_work> and quim and others have put in a LOT of work
Jul 11 13:55:32 <nmjnb> What are you all waiting for? demo samples of the N950?
Jul 11 13:55:38 <hiemanshu> rm_work: we are doing them a favour too for free
Jul 11 13:55:57 <rm_work> I don't look at it that way, so much
Jul 11 13:56:09 <rm_work> i guess if you were JUST developing because you want to help them?
Jul 11 13:56:12 <hiemanshu> rm_work: we shouldn't have to fix stuff the lazy coders there forget to add
Jul 11 13:56:14 <hiemanshu> but its just me
Jul 11 13:56:27 <rm_work> but i'm developing because i want to use this phone and make it the best experience for me and others
Jul 11 13:56:34 <rm_work> :/
Jul 11 13:57:12 <hiemanshu> I am pissed for multiple reasons, plus I have a hangover :P
Jul 11 13:57:15 <rm_work> admittedly, their development department is sometimes frustrating, but honestly they're doing better than a lot of other companies at open-sourcing at least
Jul 11 13:57:33 <rm_work> and they're being strangled at the corporate level at the same time and fighting just to exist
Jul 11 13:57:43 <khertan> the thing that pissed me off is the qml switch
Jul 11 13:57:44 <khertan> :)
Jul 11 13:58:52 <hiemanshu> khertan: do you think they will manually flash images? really?
Jul 11 13:59:08 <hiemanshu> I would hire interns to do that kind of work, packaging/flashing, etc
Jul 11 13:59:20 <khertan> hiemanshu, they do it manually before n900 loan at maemo summit in 2009 :)
Jul 11 13:59:41 <rzr> hi guerby
Jul 11 14:00:06 <khertan> ask to tekojo ... :)
Jul 11 14:00:06 <rm_work> yeah it was ridiculous
Jul 11 14:00:25 <hiemanshu> MEH, its the end of the day in .fi, and this is pissing off really, I would expect a company like Nokia to be really fast
Jul 11 14:00:44 <rzr> guerby:  u talked about compilefarms  last time we met at hsf, do they support scratchbox ?
Jul 11 14:02:54 <GAN900> ieatlint, build number, not day of the week.
Jul 11 14:04:54 <hiemanshu> GAN900: shipped yet?
Jul 11 14:04:58 <achipa> rm_work: khertan: hiemanshu: guys, note that the DDP is a bit different channel than retail, so there is a lot more overhead. Plus meego.com is not the only channel (see launchpad, Qt Ambassadors, etc), so there are actually a fair number of people to be dealt with
Jul 11 14:04:59 <frals> 15:45:21 < hiemanshu> rm_work: well fucking nokia, I am not going to develop anything for them now, untill N9 releases and its 2 months old
Jul 11 14:05:02 <frals> lol
Jul 11 14:05:14 <hiemanshu> frals: hah :P
Jul 11 14:05:24 <frals> we can forward that to the person responsible if you want
Jul 11 14:05:28 <hiemanshu> achipa: I know, just ranting :P
Jul 11 14:05:35 <frals> im sure the device can go to someone who wants it instead ;)
Jul 11 14:05:37 <hiemanshu> frals: naaah, just ranting :P
Jul 11 14:05:40 <achipa> frals: don't need to, I'm right here :)
Jul 11 14:05:46 <frals> achipa: ^^ 
Jul 11 14:06:27 <khertan> achipa, this is why i try to explain with my word :)
Jul 11 14:06:27 <GAN900> hiemanshu, not yet.
Jul 11 14:06:51 <GAN900> khertan, not fair, my order was placed at 12:04 Finnish time!
Jul 11 14:07:13 <hiemanshu> GAN900: its completely random, someone who ordered much later than me got their shipped
Jul 11 14:07:26 <hiemanshu> achipa: are the devices flashed manually before being sent?
Jul 11 14:07:55 <khertan> GAN900, when you have a ton of things to send, you didn't care about order ... you try to send the whole things as fast as possible
Jul 11 14:07:57 <GAN900> I'm still convinced it's just one unpaid summer intern.
Jul 11 14:08:12 <khertan> ;)
Jul 11 14:08:20 <hiemanshu> GAN900: working part-time :P
Jul 11 14:08:23 <khertan> GAN900, it s fair for unpaid device
Jul 11 14:08:24 <khertan> :)
Jul 11 14:08:48 <achipa> hiemanshu: no, we have cyborg aliens for that purpose :)
Jul 11 14:08:59 <hiemanshu> achipa: hah
Jul 11 14:09:28 <GAN900> khertan, fair or not, it seems like Nokia would want to get these things out quickly.
Jul 11 14:09:36 <hiemanshu> well anyways, I just need the device to test what I have done so far, SDK/sbox doesn't cut it really
Jul 11 14:09:38 <hiemanshu> achipa: ^
Jul 11 14:10:38 <rm_work> achipa / frals: exactly why I'm telling people to CALM THE F#*% down and be happy they're going to all this effort :P
Jul 11 14:10:42 <GAN900> qemu is impressively slow.
Jul 11 14:11:15 <achipa> we're approving/sending as fast as we can, as said, the process has a bandwidth and not much we can do about it (it's as if you get into a traffic jam and say 'well just build a couple of extra lanes')
Jul 11 14:11:56 <hiemanshu> achipa: yeah, and we are just the angry people in the jam waiting to get to work :)
Jul 11 14:12:03 <GAN900> Daniel Wilms and his jig just can't flash fast enough.
Jul 11 14:13:30 <GAN900> Remember kids, everytime you complain about the shipping delay he docks you another week number on your firmware.
Jul 11 14:13:38 <hiemanshu> :(
Jul 11 14:14:29 <GAN900> At least Thursday is about the cutoff for "one week"
Jul 11 14:14:41 <khertan> GAN900, we are the 11th jully, the deadline for submission was the 28th june, result was given few day after, ... it s less than two weeks
Jul 11 14:15:09 <GAN900> khertan, Nokia's estimated ship date from the DDP
Jul 11 14:15:24 <khertan> GAN900, i found that it s pretty fast for a dead plateform, dead didn't walk normally :)
Jul 11 14:15:49 <pabs3> does anyone know who runs http://www.octofish.net/bugjar/ ?
Jul 11 14:15:49 <khertan> GAN900, i didn't get estimated date :)
Jul 11 14:16:15 <GAN900> khertan, either the email or the order summary page said to expect shipment within a week.
Jul 11 14:16:46 <khertan> GAN900, a week ... 11 - 7 - 2 day of week end ...
Jul 11 14:16:53 <khertan> less than a week :)
Jul 11 14:18:11 <GAN900> exactly
Jul 11 14:18:29 <lcuk> pabs3, sjgadsby
Jul 11 14:18:30 <khertan> and dhl isn't better ... no estimated date ...
Jul 11 14:18:44 <GAN900> Hopefully that means it'll ve here by Friday and not Monday
Jul 11 14:19:28 <khertan> i just hope dhl will not lost himself, or lost my precious like the two other time
Jul 11 14:24:15 <hiemanshu> GAN900: it said expect it to arrive by then :P
Jul 11 14:32:54 <hiemanshu> achipa: anyways, any idea if we will get a newer N950 image?
Jul 11 14:38:59 <achipa> hiemanshu: newer than... ?
Jul 11 14:39:24 <hiemanshu> achipa: the 22-6 ones that others hae
Jul 11 14:39:50 <achipa> no, that's the one for all N950s
Jul 11 14:40:09 <hiemanshu> ah ok
Jul 11 14:43:44 <alterego> So, what are the order state changes? I've still got "New Order" :)
Jul 11 14:45:42 <Jaffa> alterego: New order -> Device sent to customer IIRC
Jul 11 14:46:07 <Jaffa> alterego: Then you're in DHL land, "Received shipping information" -> "Collected" -> "With delivery courier" -> "Delivered"
Jul 11 14:48:12 <alterego> Cool,
Jul 11 14:48:25 <alterego> Probably nothing will happen until tomorrow then
Jul 11 14:48:27 <alterego> :)
Jul 11 14:48:33 * alterego waits patiently :)
Jul 11 14:48:36 <hiemanshu> alterego: yeah, waiting here too
Jul 11 14:49:26 <Jaffa> alterego: Mine got picked up from Helsinki at 1900 Helsinki time
Jul 11 14:49:38 <Jaffa> alterego: Although it sat for hours in "Device sent to customer"
Jul 11 14:50:02 <alterego> :)
Jul 11 14:50:15 <alterego> Well, we'll see.
Jul 11 14:59:11 <fiferboy> alterego: At least you've been acknowledged now
Jul 11 15:07:25 <hiemanshu> cpscotti: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lGikV3oOW50 <--- more torture :P
Jul 11 15:09:28 <cpscotti> hiemanshu, lol! I don't wanna watch this! ughh! stopped before he opened the box.. I'll leave that as a surprise! hehe
Jul 11 15:12:18 <hiemanshu> cpscotti: its no suprise really
Jul 11 15:12:28 <hiemanshu> cpscotti: everyone knows there is a phone and USB cable inside that :P
Jul 11 15:12:46 <cpscotti> hehe. I know.. I saw the box and everything inside at a meetup here.. but anyway..
Jul 11 15:15:48 <hiemanshu> cpscotti: the device looks lovely, cant wait to get my hands on it :P
Jul 11 15:17:09 <cpscotti> hiemanshu, yep! same here.. but it's proving quite hard to do so.. eheh
Jul 11 15:17:38 <alterego> fiferboy: indeed, always nice to be acknowledged ;)
Jul 11 15:17:41 <hiemanshu> cpscotti: yeah, well there is no video of the N950 booting up, I'll make one once I get mine
Jul 11 15:17:49 <hiemanshu> cpscotti: and N900 vs N950 comparison
Jul 11 15:19:03 <cpscotti> hiemanshu, cool.. btw anyone knows how far the beast can be overclocked up to?
Jul 11 15:19:14 <cpscotti> (just out of curiosity)
Jul 11 15:19:15 <cpscotti> hehe
Jul 11 15:19:38 <hiemanshu> cpscotti: overclocking is a nice way to kill your device
Jul 11 15:19:59 <hiemanshu> cpscotti: but 3630 can be OCed upto 1200 without hurting it, and around 1.6Ghz
Jul 11 15:20:59 <cpscotti> well.. as far as the n900 goes, overclocking is a nice way to Rock your device
Jul 11 15:21:08 <cpscotti> "live fast, die young"
Jul 11 15:21:18 <cpscotti> all devices will eventually die young anyway
Jul 11 15:21:19 <alterego> Heh
Jul 11 15:23:31 <DocScrutinizer> cpscotti: to 7.75GHz
Jul 11 15:24:33 <cpscotti> DocScrutinizer, you're kidding right?
Jul 11 15:24:48 <cpscotti> bring the ice!
Jul 11 15:26:53 <DocScrutinizer> noooo, it's all true. this is a 1337 device, you can even OC to 16.31415926GHz but we don't want to make you feel bad with your lame 900
Jul 11 15:28:22 <DocScrutinizer> don't you think Nokia considered which clock is the best to save them lots of repair costs during the max 2years warranty while maximizing the thrill and sales of *any* of their devices?
Jul 11 15:31:16 <DocScrutinizer> soo if you're so venturous then please accept you WON'T SELL YOUR DEVICE after you overclocked it, and YOU WONT GET WARRANTY REPAIR when the device breaks during the 2 years warranty time. What makes you think you are using the device so much less than the average user so you can get away with running it OCed for 2 years?
Jul 11 15:32:18 <flux> so, how many broken OC devices are there around? the quoted statistics hasn't really made me a believer that it's likely to brick a device that way.
Jul 11 15:32:33 <flux> it seems that in about 95% of cases the reason for n900 dying is a malfunctionin usb port..
Jul 11 15:32:55 <DocScrutinizer> or are you so convinced there'll be a better device or even just a spare N900 when your device breaks after 6 months
Jul 11 15:33:11 <flux> I sure hope so.
Jul 11 15:35:29 <flux> so I just need to be extra careful with my usb port for the next 6 months..
Jul 11 15:35:50 * DocScrutinizer sels flux a 220V->300V transformer so this guy can "overclock" arbitrary appliances. Image!! OCed incandescent bulbs! Buy 40W get 100W brightness ;-P
Jul 11 15:36:23 <flux> docscrutinizer, have you btw noticed that incandescent bulps are used at their ~full capacity for extended periods of time?
Jul 11 15:36:42 <flux> whereas on a mobile device I hope to use the full capacity for a few seconds, or perhaps fractions of a second, at a time.
Jul 11 15:37:03 <DocScrutinizer> HAHAHAHA
Jul 11 15:37:52 <DocScrutinizer> now this sentence fully qualifies you for OCing to 100GHz, next step will be infinity
Jul 11 15:38:46 <flux> I haven't actually OC'd my device. I'm just dubious about the scale of the bad effects it is advertised as having.
Jul 11 15:40:12 <DocScrutinizer> ~omap-oc
Jul 11 15:40:13 <infobot> somebody said omap-oc was http://mg.pov.lt/maemo-irclog/%23maemo.2010-08-01.log.html#t2010-08-01T22:16:05  read that!, or and this http://mg.pov.lt/maemo-irclog/%23maemo.2011-03-11.log.html#t2011-03-11T03:04:11
Jul 11 15:40:48 <DocScrutinizer> the second link should tell you enough, if you're really so scientifically touched
Jul 11 15:43:48 <flux> so, it appears I've run 0.75 cpu hours a day currently. asusming it's 600MHz, at 800MHz that would be around 0.56h per day. so that 1000h hour 800MHz would be around four years.
Jul 11 15:43:51 <flux> sounds OK to me.
Jul 11 15:51:49 <DocScrutinizer> this calculation isn't exactly based on correct assumptions: much of the CPU hours the CPU spends with polling and similar waiting for slower parts of the system. As you can't OC e.g RAM or esp MMC similar and same amount you could do with CPU, your CPU hours won't reduce liner to clock increase
Jul 11 15:52:36 <DocScrutinizer> linear*
Jul 11 15:53:32 <DocScrutinizer> and you know your CPU is running at full speed during all your call times?
Jul 11 15:54:30 <DocScrutinizer> while the modem TX adds to overall heatup of device and thus is pushing CPU temp, so the degradation factor multiplies another time
Jul 11 15:55:23 <DocScrutinizer> maybe *you* have only 30 min cals per month, average user may have like 90min a day
Jul 11 15:55:50 <kerio> i thought nerds didn't talk
Jul 11 15:56:20 <DocScrutinizer> then maybe pandora is the device for you
Jul 11 15:57:30 <DocScrutinizer> I thought nerds watch youtube videos a lot - flash->max_cpu_clock  plus internet-download->modem_at_max
Jul 11 15:57:33 <kerio> zomg, it's really cool
Jul 11 15:57:37 <DocScrutinizer> same thing like a call
Jul 11 15:59:27 <kerio> holy shit 440€
Jul 11 16:00:00 <kerio> that's a lot (
Jul 11 16:00:01 <kerio> :(
Jul 11 16:00:35 <DocScrutinizer> not for a 1kg brick of platin - what are you talking about?
Jul 11 16:00:53 <kerio> pandora
Jul 11 16:00:54 <cpscotti> DocScrutinizer, I totally agree OC is a crazy thing but then again, isn't the experiment worth? I'm not saying nokia doesn't have a reason to set the clock as they do. What I'm saying is that I'm up for the adventure sometimes.
Jul 11 16:00:56 <hiemanshu> cpscotti: http://forum.meego.com/showpost.php?p=25686&postcount=577
Jul 11 16:01:26 <hiemanshu> DocScrutinizer: well if you want to watch DivX formats on the phone, you need to OC, or there is a lag in the video :(
Jul 11 16:02:02 <cpscotti> hiemanshu, haehae.. whenver u post a link it's like I already know what I'll find but I click anyway..  lol :D
Jul 11 16:02:08 <DocScrutinizer> cpscotti: fair enough, as long as you know what you're doing, are not hyping it for noobs, and agree on the don't-sell&don't_ask_for_warranty policy
Jul 11 16:02:17 <hiemanshu> cpscotti: thats love :P
Jul 11 16:02:40 <hiemanshu> DocScrutinizer: well that and dont rant about it
Jul 11 16:03:16 <hiemanshu> cpscotti: something different http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zn7-fVtT16k
Jul 11 16:03:45 <cpscotti> DocScrutinizer, well.. I'd say most of my CS/hardware knowledge came from playing with something without knowing what I'm doing.. but of course accepting whatever consequences it might bring
Jul 11 16:04:18 <RST38h> moo javispedro
Jul 11 16:04:19 <cpscotti> totally agree with the don't-sell&don't_ask_for_wrrrnty
Jul 11 16:04:21 <filip> hi :)
Jul 11 16:04:24 <DocScrutinizer> javispedro: moo
Jul 11 16:04:30 <kerio> why "don't ask for warranty"? o:)
Jul 11 16:04:33 <cpscotti> but the guys that stole my n900 will probably sell it anyway.. can't help on that
Jul 11 16:05:04 <filip> I am an open source contributor (for example kernel support for jornada7xx), and enjoy hacking. Would you rather suggest a nokia n900 or motorola milestone?
Jul 11 16:05:19 <kerio> n900, definetely
Jul 11 16:05:26 <filip> I am afraid of maemo being the dead end on an n900 after nokia's fail
Jul 11 16:05:34 <hiemanshu> filip: if you ask here, N900, if you are in android forums, milestone
Jul 11 16:05:40 <DocScrutinizer> kerio: because otherwise that'll cause what already happened: Nokia will discontinue the device due to economic disaster from RMA
Jul 11 16:05:55 <filip> does maemo get any funding for development?
Jul 11 16:06:13 <kerio> DocScrutinizer: if it already happened, what's the problem?
Jul 11 16:06:28 <DocScrutinizer> kerio: let's just say OC gave use spare N8 for N900-repair
Jul 11 16:06:44 <cpscotti> kerio, it's like.. it can't get any worse.. so from now on it's just happiness
Jul 11 16:06:51 <kerio> do they still repair N900s?
Jul 11 16:07:03 <DocScrutinizer> no they don't
Jul 11 16:07:29 <kerio> DocScrutinizer: will you repair my n900? :(
Jul 11 16:07:30 <hiemanshu> so if they dont repair N900s and I give mine for repair, do I get a N8 for an extra cost?
Jul 11 16:07:33 <filip> btw, is nokia n9 buyable?
Jul 11 16:07:37 <DocScrutinizer> N900 obviously TOTALLY discontinued, they don't even have swap devices
Jul 11 16:07:39 <hiemanshu> yes
Jul 11 16:07:42 <cpscotti> filip, basically.. everyone I know that owned a n900 still owns it and loves it..
Jul 11 16:07:48 <cpscotti> (random people included)
Jul 11 16:07:59 <DocScrutinizer> kerio: no
Jul 11 16:08:02 <Jaffa> hiemanshu: No, I got an N8 instead. Swapped it for an E7
Jul 11 16:08:13 <kerio> DocScrutinizer: but my usb port is still broken!
Jul 11 16:08:28 <filip> cpscotti: do I understand correctly that meego is a 'merge' of maemo and moblin?
Jul 11 16:08:30 <hiemanshu> Jaffa: yes but yours was in warranty
Jul 11 16:08:35 <chem|st> DocScrutinizer: I would swap for a n900 or a n950 in order of appearance and nothing else!
Jul 11 16:08:42 <DocScrutinizer> kerio: find somebody else to repair it please
Jul 11 16:08:49 <cpscotti> filip, politically yes.. technically no.
Jul 11 16:09:03 <kerio> really though, is there someone who knows how to repair n900s?
Jul 11 16:09:07 <chem|st> kerio: solder it?
Jul 11 16:09:14 <cpscotti> filip, and harmattan is not meego anyway.. 
Jul 11 16:09:18 <filip> cpscotti: so ppl here are generally not very much involved with meego?
Jul 11 16:09:29 <DocScrutinizer> kerio: there are good USB-repair thread on tmo
Jul 11 16:09:31 <chem|st> filip: this is #maemo...
Jul 11 16:09:48 <cpscotti> humm.. I thing we'd say pretty much everyone's involved with qt and linux
Jul 11 16:09:49 <DocScrutinizer> and there are a few cellphone service points in almost every town
Jul 11 16:09:53 <javispedro> mooo
Jul 11 16:09:56 <DocScrutinizer> bring the two together
Jul 11 16:09:57 <kerio> DocScrutinizer: but that would require me to go on TMO
Jul 11 16:10:00 <cpscotti> filip, the bits in between are a bit cloudy
Jul 11 16:10:12 <cpscotti> s/thing/think
Jul 11 16:10:18 <filip> I'm just wondering why development hasn't moved to meego
Jul 11 16:10:27 <filip> is there something you don't like about it?
Jul 11 16:11:26 <DocScrutinizer> filip: for now maemo5 still is the most usable most mature OS for N900
Jul 11 16:11:43 <DocScrutinizer> with the best support "app-wise"
Jul 11 16:11:49 <trx> also, there were no devices that run meego
Jul 11 16:12:03 <filip> trx: it has been partially ported to the n900
Jul 11 16:12:10 <trx> yeap
Jul 11 16:12:28 <trx> and community partialy moved to meego..
Jul 11 16:12:54 <filip> well I think that in the open source world the main scarcity is developers time
Jul 11 16:13:04 <DocScrutinizer> kerio: if you're interested, I got a bookmark colection for USB repair
Jul 11 16:13:10 <filip> that makes me wonder why the force is being split between meego and maemo
Jul 11 16:13:22 <villager> meego partially ported isn't good enough for me to use it regularly, so I'll continue developing for maemo for a while
Jul 11 16:13:27 <kerio> DocScrutinizer: well i suppose i am, the alternative is a n8
Jul 11 16:13:48 <kerio> unless they'll eventually swap my phone with a n9
Jul 11 16:14:04 <javispedro> GeneralAntilles: so, where's the hating?
Jul 11 16:15:17 <ShadowJK> I don't think "partially ported" is a good description. It just happens that plain MeeGo does almost nothing :)
Jul 11 16:15:28 <gri_> the dhl delivery guy knows how to work: let the n950 package stay in the garden without any notification
Jul 11 16:15:28 <DocScrutinizer> ~usb-fix is <reply> Fixate receptacle like this: http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?p=547991#post547991 - get the pic.zip form there http://talk.maemo.org/showpost.php?p=870017&postcount=27 for details how to deal with contact pads came off
Jul 11 16:15:29 <infobot> okay, DocScrutinizer
Jul 11 16:15:56 <DocScrutinizer> ~tell kerio about usb-fix
Jul 11 16:17:44 <filip> so the best open source smartphone is atm the n900?
Jul 11 16:17:45 <kerio> ty
Jul 11 16:17:50 <villager> filip: I don't think you need to assume that community-written software couldn't run on both maemo and meego (and maemo and meego themselves aren't written by the community anyway, but by paid engineers)
Jul 11 16:18:01 <kerio> i doubt i'll be able to do that myself though, i don't have a solder gun or the required manuality
Jul 11 16:18:07 <DocScrutinizer> filip: many here will answer "yes"
Jul 11 16:18:11 <DocScrutinizer> incl me
Jul 11 16:18:26 <kerio> filip: technically there are no open source phones
Jul 11 16:18:36 <filip> DocScrutinizer: what could be better? freerunner is hardly usable...
Jul 11 16:18:48 <filip> kerio: yeah, I mean something more open than androi
Jul 11 16:18:49 <kerio> the openmoko devices get close, and the n900 is somewhat behind
Jul 11 16:18:56 <kerio> oh, absolutely then
Jul 11 16:19:33 <filip> kerio: and n900 can be hacked to support usb host 2.0?
Jul 11 16:19:33 <kerio> DocScrutinizer: do you think a somewhat skilled technician will be able to do it?
Jul 11 16:19:40 <kerio> filip: you mean in host mode?
Jul 11 16:19:46 <kerio> it's already there
Jul 11 16:19:46 <filip> kerio: yup
Jul 11 16:19:50 <DocScrutinizer> filip: future devices incl future OS *could* be better - I don't see this happen any time soon
Jul 11 16:19:56 <kerio> it just works badly
Jul 11 16:19:57 <kerio> :)
Jul 11 16:19:58 <DocScrutinizer> kerio: definitely
Jul 11 16:20:34 <DocScrutinizer> ~lart kerio 
Jul 11 16:20:34 * infobot pushes the wall down onto kerio whilst whistling innocently
Jul 11 16:20:42 <filip> kerio: what are the problems?
Jul 11 16:20:43 <kerio> hey, it *does* work badly!
Jul 11 16:21:03 <filip> kerio: I was wondering about a possibility of using n900 with a bluetooth mouse, usb keyboard and a displaylink video device
Jul 11 16:21:24 <kerio> filip: well, there's tv-out, which is *kinda* what you want
Jul 11 16:21:34 <DocScrutinizer> kerio: you are *using* it badly! ;-P
Jul 11 16:21:46 <filip> kerio: 720x574 is hardly more than the 800x480 internal display :P
Jul 11 16:21:59 <kerio> DocScrutinizer: i am not using it, pay attention
Jul 11 16:22:01 <kerio> my usb port is brok
Jul 11 16:22:33 <DocScrutinizer> kerio: so yeah, obviously USB hostmode works badly for *you* then 
Jul 11 16:22:49 <kerio> it's sad because it's true :(
Jul 11 16:23:15 <kerio> filip: do you really care about the "phone" part?
Jul 11 16:23:22 <hiemanshu> DocScrutinizer: anything for the N950 yet?
Jul 11 16:23:24 <kerio> because apparently the pandora is better
Jul 11 16:23:28 <DocScrutinizer> filip: 
Jul 11 16:23:32 <DocScrutinizer> ~hostmode
Jul 11 16:23:33 <infobot> extra, extra, read all about it, hostmode is http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=65232
Jul 11 16:23:36 <DocScrutinizer> and
Jul 11 16:23:42 <DocScrutinizer> ~hostmode-charging
Jul 11 16:23:42 <infobot> extra, extra, read all about it, hostmode-powered is http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?p=921203#post921203
Jul 11 16:24:31 <Jaffa> javispedro: Shiny
Jul 11 16:24:51 <javispedro> indeed.
Jul 11 16:25:02 <DocScrutinizer> hiemanshu: regarding hostmode? yeah, we are as fsckd as I expected
Jul 11 16:25:03 * javispedro was impressed when flicking through the time zone list
Jul 11 16:25:22 <DocScrutinizer> hiemanshu: so will be fun again ;-D
Jul 11 16:25:29 <Jaffa> First phone I've had where one of the shipped ring tones is one I quite like
Jul 11 16:25:45 <hiemanshu> DocScrutinizer: hah, well any chances of getting the schematics, or should I put my ninja suit on? :P
Jul 11 16:25:49 <DocScrutinizer> Jaffa: DUH, which one?
Jul 11 16:25:50 <Jaffa> "Blip" is quite sci-fiey and distinctive, without being an annoying tune
Jul 11 16:25:51 <javispedro> the bootsplash is very webos1 like ;)
Jul 11 16:26:04 <Jaffa> javispedro: Ari's influence? ;-)
Jul 11 16:26:10 <DocScrutinizer> hiemanshu: ninja suit is OK
Jul 11 16:26:15 <hiemanshu> javispedro: you got yours?
Jul 11 16:26:44 <DocScrutinizer> Jaffa: lemme check
Jul 11 16:26:46 <javispedro> yep!
Jul 11 16:26:58 <hiemanshu> javispedro: you lucky bastard :(
Jul 11 16:27:33 <javispedro> seems that one of my worries about the UI (that the swiping out thing would be tiresome) has disappeared.
Jul 11 16:27:59 <DocScrutinizer> Jaffa: that's ALL? I'm tempted to sort my glasses on the board and blame my neighbour
Jul 11 16:28:19 <javispedro> for some reason though, when holding it in portrait, it's best to swipe from right to left otherwise I hit sensitivity issues.
Jul 11 16:28:33 <javispedro> but the opposite direction works very well.
Jul 11 16:28:49 <hiemanshu> javispedro: does the phone need charging before the first use?
Jul 11 16:29:10 <gri_> no
Jul 11 16:29:13 * hiemanshu wants to know because I want to make a unboxing video
Jul 11 16:29:19 <hiemanshu> with powering it on, etc
Jul 11 16:29:34 <ruskie> liion/lipo don't need charging for first use
Jul 11 16:29:41 <DocScrutinizer> Jaffa: how's about "Noise Experiment" or "Retrobot" or even "Roboioioi"
Jul 11 16:29:44 <gri_> mine had 75% load at arrving
Jul 11 16:29:46 <DocScrutinizer> ;-P
Jul 11 16:29:47 <ruskie> usual stored charge is ~70% iirc
Jul 11 16:29:51 <ruskie> for li* bats
Jul 11 16:30:01 <hiemanshu> ah awesome!
Jul 11 16:30:15 <ruskie> anyway sharing those ringtones?
Jul 11 16:30:19 <ruskie> erm anyone even
Jul 11 16:30:39 <hiemanshu> well once I get my device I might
Jul 11 16:32:04 <DocScrutinizer> hiemanshu: no, doesn't need charging, but hooking up to N900 wallcharger soonish won't hurt neither your video nor the device. Be aware though the screen is covered by a completely opaque protector ;-P
Jul 11 16:32:16 <ruskie> fun
Jul 11 16:32:28 <ruskie> I can see that going... wtf it's not working...
Jul 11 16:32:35 <ruskie> return to sender
Jul 11 16:32:42 <hiemanshu> DocScrutinizer: yeah, will make sure about that :)
Jul 11 16:33:03 <DocScrutinizer> fooled me quite a bit first time XP
Jul 11 16:33:05 <hiemanshu> <--- dinner
Jul 11 16:33:12 <filip> kerio: yes I do, that's the primary function for me :)
Jul 11 16:33:55 <kerio> filip: then... tough shit, i suppose :P
Jul 11 16:34:32 <kerio> i guess that it could work with easydebian though
Jul 11 16:34:50 <DocScrutinizer> hiemanshu: ruskie: http://share.ovi.com/media/joerg900.public/joerg900.10140
Jul 11 16:35:01 <kerio> install a kernel module to get the fb device, then run X on it from easydebian
Jul 11 16:35:31 <filip> that could be funny
Jul 11 16:36:21 <DocScrutinizer> javispedro: you got your N950? \o/
Jul 11 16:36:50 <javispedro> yes
Jul 11 16:36:57 * javispedro fails to enter his wpa password using vkb
Jul 11 16:37:07 <GeneralAntilles> javispedro, HATE
Jul 11 16:37:12 <GeneralAntilles> javispedro, did you meet DHL?
Jul 11 16:37:48 <javispedro> yes, funny guy, only took like 8h </grumble>
Jul 11 16:37:54 <fiferboy> Just curious, has anyone in North America gotten a device?
Jul 11 16:38:33 <javispedro> why the hell the device comes preloaded by Baidu and lots of chinese bookmarks?
Jul 11 16:38:51 <GeneralAntilles> fiferboy, probably qole, but they just sent him one to make us irritated.
Jul 11 16:39:23 <fiferboy> qole has his?
Jul 11 16:39:33 <DocScrutinizer> javispedro: ???
Jul 11 16:39:39 <javispedro> oh.
Jul 11 16:39:41 <javispedro> I can guess why
Jul 11 16:39:52 <Jaffa> javispedro: ??? Mine didn't.
Jul 11 16:39:54 <javispedro> I selected Spain as region, and probably Spain comes with China bookmarks.
Jul 11 16:40:11 <Jaffa> That isn't particularly obvious
Jul 11 16:40:19 <GeneralAntilles> fiferboy, no, but that would be my assumption.
Jul 11 16:40:34 * DocScrutinizer wonders if he knows where to look for bookmarks at all
Jul 11 16:40:39 <RST38h> javispedro; you already received the device/
Jul 11 16:40:46 <javispedro> yep
Jul 11 16:40:57 <DocScrutinizer> the browser startscreen is pretty annoying and messed up
Jul 11 16:43:11 <Jaffa> Actually, good question. I only thought you had bookmarks through "Add to apps"
Jul 11 16:43:52 <gri_> Jaffa: Is it normal that the n950 syncs contacts with the n900 and all are lost after a reboot? (used your wiki descriptions for that)
Jul 11 16:43:53 <javispedro> nah, browser home page is bookmarks, like on n900
Jul 11 16:44:04 <javispedro> albeit instead of small thumnails it shows horizontally large vertically clipped 
Jul 11 16:45:01 <DocScrutinizer> *cough* the one with lots of rubbish like "Welcome to the..." (SIC!) and "welcome to the Corporate..." (SIC!) ?
Jul 11 16:45:45 <hiemanshu> DocScrutinizer: ah, I noticed that :P
Jul 11 16:45:46 <DocScrutinizer> also hooray for this page not zoomable
Jul 11 16:46:17 <javispedro> question: does touchscreen vibration work?
Jul 11 16:47:25 <DocScrutinizer> hiemanshu: a pity, the protector foil kinda looks WAAAY cooler then the glary glass actual screen ;-P
Jul 11 16:47:36 <DocScrutinizer> than*
Jul 11 16:47:54 <DocScrutinizer> or was it "glossy"?
Jul 11 16:48:18 <hiemanshu> DocScrutinizer: yeah, I would went wow, seeing it for the first time, and then I realized its just a protector
Jul 11 16:48:27 <hiemanshu> s/would //
Jul 11 16:48:27 <infobot> hiemanshu meant: DocScrutinizer: yeah, I went wow, seeing it for the first time, and then I realized its just a protector
Jul 11 16:49:04 <hiemanshu> DocScrutinizer: the missing camera/sensors give it away
Jul 11 16:49:41 <DocScrutinizer> indeed
Jul 11 16:50:34 <DocScrutinizer> yet I never before bothered about removing protector foild prior to first functional tests ;-P
Jul 11 16:50:56 <DocScrutinizer> so I went "WTF?!" on powering N950 up
Jul 11 16:51:23 <GeneralAntilles> I see Lenovo opted for a shitty LCD panel with their U1 tablet.
Jul 11 16:51:43 <hiemanshu> DocScrutinizer: and stupidity strikes again! :P
Jul 11 16:51:44 <DocScrutinizer> ~lart all glossy LCD
Jul 11 16:51:44 * infobot beats all glossy LCD senseless with a 50lb Unix manual
Jul 11 16:52:04 <javispedro> DocScrutinizer: does vibrator feedback when tapping work for you?
Jul 11 16:52:18 <javispedro> I can't get either sound nor vibra feedback, despite feedbackd running.
Jul 11 16:52:26 <DocScrutinizer> hiemanshu: I was just so happy about the matte black screen, I guess
Jul 11 16:52:35 <DocScrutinizer> javispedro: yes
Jul 11 16:52:44 <DocScrutinizer> faintly
Jul 11 16:52:52 * javispedro grumbles
Jul 11 16:53:14 <DocScrutinizer> or actually only rarely
Jul 11 16:53:54 <hiemanshu> DocScrutinizer: matte screens on mobiles isn't really common
Jul 11 16:54:07 <DocScrutinizer> setings-dound_and_vib
Jul 11 16:54:12 <DocScrutinizer> sound*
Jul 11 16:54:14 <hiemanshu> DocScrutinizer: esp when you expect mobiles to have perfect colors and everything
Jul 11 16:56:41 <DocScrutinizer> javispedro: or not at all actually, just booting after ramping everyting up in settings
Jul 11 16:57:07 <DocScrutinizer> javispedro: nope, no feedback
Jul 11 16:57:49 <javispedro> ah, ok, Iwas starting to think broken vibra..
Jul 11 16:58:01 <javispedro> fortunately though I just realized that if you set it on silent it briefly vibrates, and that does work.
Jul 11 16:58:35 <DocScrutinizer> power-on kick also WFM
Jul 11 17:00:40 <DocScrutinizer> however the GUI and UX is a mix of 90% WOW and 10% WTF
Jul 11 17:02:07 <DocScrutinizer> while maemo5 is like 80% WOW, 18% "thank God for that, it's classic", and 2% "meh, this is clearly a case for CSSU"
Jul 11 17:04:05 <DocScrutinizer> a friggin lot isn't working in landscape at all, a clear reminiscence to N9
Jul 11 17:04:07 <javispedro> time to see what this usb sdk mode is for.
Jul 11 17:04:20 <DocScrutinizer> o.O
Jul 11 17:04:22 <DocScrutinizer> ???
Jul 11 17:04:44 <DocScrutinizer> remote GDB etc?
Jul 11 17:05:04 <javispedro> seems usbnet
Jul 11 17:05:12 <DocScrutinizer> mass storage for installing the SDK to PC?
Jul 11 17:05:21 <DocScrutinizer> :nod:
Jul 11 17:07:06 <DocScrutinizer> ~ping
Jul 11 17:07:07 <infobot> ~pong
Jul 11 17:07:26 <DocScrutinizer> DARN, the friggin cdc_ether killed my eth0
Jul 11 17:07:41 * DocScrutinizer unpluggs 950 from laptop
Jul 11 17:08:45 <DocScrutinizer> this thing DOES NOT EVEN HAVE a SIM, still advertises on USB as NIC
Jul 11 17:09:21 <DocScrutinizer> btw sth that never woked like that with N900 for me
Jul 11 17:09:55 <DocScrutinizer> obviously overdone
Jul 11 17:10:03 <DocScrutinizer> for harm
Jul 11 17:10:33 <DocScrutinizer> well, I should blame knetworkmanager or what that thing is
Jul 11 17:11:22 * DocScrutinizer has moved the USB plug back from PC to wallcharger ;-)
Jul 11 17:11:51 <DocScrutinizer> javispedro: tell me when you start to tackle aegis and kernel :-D
Jul 11 17:12:35 <DocScrutinizer> aegis<tabtab> is interesting
Jul 11 17:12:46 <DocScrutinizer> but same time puzzling
Jul 11 17:13:18 <DocScrutinizer> ~seen MohammadAG 
Jul 11 17:13:24 <infobot> mohammadag is currently on #maemo #meego. Has said a total of 77 messages. Is idling for 4h 37m 22s, last said: 'yeah, totally our fault'.
Jul 11 17:20:10 * javispedro ponders what the "password" field in SDK connectivity is, considering the password seems to always be rootme no matter what..
Jul 11 17:24:16 <DocScrutinizer> where?
Jul 11 17:24:46 <DocScrutinizer> I gather you're playing with USB SDK mode?
Jul 11 17:24:52 <javispedro> yes
Jul 11 17:25:55 <DocScrutinizer> I'm wondering if the global policy for developer-mode in aegis is way too restrictive. I'd hope for a developr-mode that basically disables all aegis checks
Jul 11 17:26:19 * javispedro wants to try his SDL before bricking the device ;)
Jul 11 17:26:33 <DocScrutinizer> if you want aegis "protection" then there's "normal" mode for that
Jul 11 17:27:18 <DocScrutinizer> in devel-mode aegis ought not bother about manifests for binaries at all, please
Jul 11 17:27:35 <frals> DocScrutinizer: agreed
Jul 11 17:28:05 <DocScrutinizer> so where do we open this ticket? whom do we pester to fix the issue?
Jul 11 17:29:31 <DocScrutinizer> NB I'm fine with e.g mediaplayer not (fully?) functional in devel-mode  - if that's an implication of completely open mode
Jul 11 17:30:29 <DocScrutinizer> I don't need CSS to work in mediaplayer, when I'm in devel-mode
Jul 11 17:30:51 <DocScrutinizer> I'm happy with videos with CSS simply not playing
Jul 11 17:31:39 <DocScrutinizer> but honestly, that's what aegis mode switching is all about, to allow such a policy
Jul 11 17:31:56 <DocScrutinizer> a devel-mode that's still restricitve is nonsense
Jul 11 17:32:35 <javispedro> one interesting consequence of the swipe out thing is that by default you leave applications open instead of closing them
Jul 11 17:32:46 <javispedro> hope the GiB will be enough for that.
Jul 11 17:33:11 <frals> after that cgroups hopefully terminates the right thing ;)
Jul 11 17:33:34 <javispedro> more worries
Jul 11 17:33:41 <javispedro> cause that's what android would do :(
Jul 11 17:34:26 <frals> well what do you do when out of memory?
Jul 11 17:35:00 <javispedro> it's just a different approach
Jul 11 17:35:06 <DocScrutinizer> javispedro: (leave open) already mentioned and critizised it
Jul 11 17:35:17 <frals> DocScrutinizer: swipe from top closes in later releases
Jul 11 17:35:18 <SpeedEvil> javispedro: yeah - it took me ages to work out how to close apps.
Jul 11 17:35:24 <SpeedEvil> (on the rda)
Jul 11 17:36:03 <javispedro> on fremantle user is the one say "ok, I want this application so much I'm willing to let it waste my precious memory to let it do whatever it is doing"
Jul 11 17:36:20 <DocScrutinizer> frals: <quote me> with swipe-from-top to close apps the gui is almost nice</quote> (OWTTE)
Jul 11 17:36:24 <javispedro> the android way is "the user is an idiot, let's just run all applications and a wizard will choose which ones we close"
Jul 11 17:36:36 <javispedro> harmattan seems like a weird compromise.
Jul 11 17:36:37 <frals> javispedro: and when the system is out of memory, what happens? :)
Jul 11 17:36:42 <frals> roulette with all pids? :D
Jul 11 17:37:01 <GeneralAntilles> Yeah, I prefer Fremantle's approach.
Jul 11 17:37:09 <GeneralAntilles> I'm more than capable of dealing with my own failings.
Jul 11 17:37:10 <frals> id say harmattan is more like, if the user wants to close something he can do it, otherwise we have this fallback for people who have no clue whats going on
Jul 11 17:37:22 <javispedro> frals: on Diablo you got a "out of memory" _before_ launching an app.
Jul 11 17:37:29 <javispedro> on Fremantle I don't think I ever had an out of memory event.
Jul 11 17:37:50 <DocScrutinizer> javispedro: harmattan is like windows6 in that respect
Jul 11 17:38:03 <javispedro> probably because with the close button being so accesible, the average number of open apps was 2. or 3.
Jul 11 17:38:21 <javispedro> while on harmattan, well, after toying with it for a minutes I already have _all_ of the applications open.
Jul 11 17:38:44 <javispedro> (compliment: it is still performing)
Jul 11 17:39:01 <DocScrutinizer> javispedro: but taskswitching gets a PITA
Jul 11 17:39:16 <frals> DocScrutinizer: using the 3x3 grid?
Jul 11 17:39:19 <DocScrutinizer> for mere matters of cluttering the switcher
Jul 11 17:39:22 <javispedro> either way, the close gesture is a welcome adition and probably makes it more like fremantle.
Jul 11 17:39:32 <DocScrutinizer> frals: even then
Jul 11 17:39:49 <frals> fair enough :)
Jul 11 17:40:15 * javispedro still sometimes wants to "swipe cards out" of the task switcher
Jul 11 17:40:46 <DocScrutinizer> duh, never thought about that - what does it do?
Jul 11 17:41:03 <mtnman> hello
Jul 11 17:41:09 <javispedro> that is a webos gesture that got on me, does nothing on harmattan (scrolls actually)
Jul 11 17:41:27 <GeneralAntilles> javispedro, ooh.
Jul 11 17:41:33 <GeneralAntilles> Can't we implement that in the theme?
Jul 11 17:42:08 <javispedro> we had this discussion, and it seems harder than that, because there are no available free scroll "directions"
Jul 11 17:42:18 <javispedro> horizontal switches to launcher or feedview
Jul 11 17:42:29 <javispedro> and vertical pans
Jul 11 17:43:15 <lcuk> javispedro, technically border panning should be available from all edges
Jul 11 17:44:06 <DocScrutinizer> javispedro: actually swipe and flick are redundant in the 3 basic screens
Jul 11 17:44:40 <fiferboy> Are there any multi-touch gestures?
Jul 11 17:44:48 <fiferboy> Like two-finger swipes, or anything?
Jul 11 17:44:48 <DocScrutinizer> it never occured to me I could also flick aka "scroll" to switch from taskswitcher to any other of the 2 screens
Jul 11 17:45:05 <DocScrutinizer> fiferboy: nope
Jul 11 17:45:12 <javispedro> DocScrutinizer: how you'd do it?
Jul 11 17:45:13 <DocScrutinizer> fiferboy: which is quite a pity
Jul 11 17:45:23 <javispedro> DocScrutinizer: fiferboy: try pinching in task view
Jul 11 17:46:19 <javispedro> hmprf.
Jul 11 17:46:28 <javispedro> web browser cannot install non user/* packages
Jul 11 17:46:34 <DocScrutinizer> javispedro: I'd use swipe to switch to screens and reassign horizontal "dragging" of apps out of screen to "close app" - for example
Jul 11 17:46:38 <javispedro> which btw on harmattan seem to be marked as such with a different method
Jul 11 17:47:24 <DocScrutinizer> javispedro: please share how to reproduce
Jul 11 17:47:32 <javispedro> the what?
Jul 11 17:47:38 <javispedro> pinching, p.debs?
Jul 11 17:47:58 <DocScrutinizer> install via webbrowser
Jul 11 17:48:30 <javispedro> click on .deb, click again on download manager, wait a few seconds, get error message
Jul 11 17:48:30 <javispedro> ?
Jul 11 17:48:35 <DocScrutinizer> I'm still lost on how to install *anything*
Jul 11 17:48:59 <khertan> ovi store
Jul 11 17:49:00 <khertan> :)
Jul 11 17:49:03 <DocScrutinizer> yeah that's what I did after typing in the URL of that bash repo
Jul 11 17:49:12 <javispedro> aegis-installing libsdl1.2  lol
Jul 11 17:49:16 <khertan> :)
Jul 11 17:49:16 <DocScrutinizer> khertan: "Coming soon..."
Jul 11 17:49:20 <DocScrutinizer> ;-P
Jul 11 17:49:33 <khertan> DocScrutinizer, yep ... like everything on this plateform
Jul 11 17:50:14 <khertan> at least git should be available in rzr home
Jul 11 17:50:40 <DocScrutinizer> javispedro: so how did you get to any URL where you could actually click on .deb?
Jul 11 17:50:42 <khertan> and pyflakes on my home :)
Jul 11 17:50:48 <javispedro> I would be careful installing things external things until we get to know aegis
Jul 11 17:51:04 <javispedro> otherwise you risk getting the "Device is malfunctioning you dumbastard!"
Jul 11 17:51:08 <khertan> :)
Jul 11 17:51:34 <javispedro> DocScrutinizer: http://depot.javispedro.com/nit/hsdl/
Jul 11 17:51:44 <DocScrutinizer> o.O
Jul 11 17:51:52 <javispedro> as I said, I _couldn't install_ it, but I got a "Package is not wellformed" or sth like that
Jul 11 17:52:04 <javispedro> which is very similar to the one you got in Fremantle when it was not user/*
Jul 11 17:52:05 <DocScrutinizer> same here
Jul 11 17:52:20 <DocScrutinizer> I then clicked again on the local download copy
Jul 11 17:52:20 <frals> package malformed or something seems to be some catch all crap
Jul 11 17:52:33 <javispedro> the way to make user/* packages has changed in harmattan, so no wonder nothing works
Jul 11 17:52:34 <DocScrutinizer> which actually installed the bash.deb
Jul 11 17:52:39 <DocScrutinizer> iirc
Jul 11 17:52:46 <frals> seen it when trying to install proper packages
Jul 11 17:52:50 <javispedro> heh
Jul 11 17:52:58 <frals> or what i consider proper anyway, and whats in the image you guys have so :P
Jul 11 17:53:00 <javispedro> it is not a dep issue as that installs without any external dep here
Jul 11 17:53:09 <javispedro> (I already used dpkg -i )
Jul 11 17:53:12 <khertan> http://repo.pub.meego.com/home:/khertan/Harmattan/
Jul 11 17:53:21 <khertan> :)
Jul 11 17:53:32 <GeneralAntilles> frals, get us a new image. :P
Jul 11 17:53:34 <javispedro> is that user/*?
Jul 11 17:53:49 <frals> :p
Jul 11 17:53:54 <khertan> javispedro, hum ... good point
Jul 11 17:53:59 <javispedro> khertan: http://www.developer.nokia.com/Community/Wiki/Harmattan:Developer_Library/Reference_documentation/Harmattan_Appendix_to_the_Debian_Policy_Manual
Jul 11 17:54:08 <javispedro> khertan: I do not know how much QtCreator automates that.
Jul 11 17:54:20 <khertan> javispedro, oh there is a doc finnaly
Jul 11 17:54:35 <javispedro> yep :)
Jul 11 17:54:42 <khertan> Maemo-Flags: visible <<< nice it didn't respect debian policy
Jul 11 17:54:46 <khertan> whouhou
Jul 11 17:54:58 <javispedro> well, it's better than the maemo trick
Jul 11 17:55:16 <khertan> maemo trick isn't so bad
Jul 11 17:55:17 <javispedro> the maemo trick actually violated policy, this one's just a nonstandard extension.
Jul 11 17:55:17 <DocScrutinizer> I'm missing a tools-repo actually
Jul 11 17:55:55 <javispedro> DocScrutinizer: with dev mode a metapackage containing most of what was on tools repo is installed
Jul 11 17:56:01 <javispedro> but of course I bet you mean "your" tools repo ;)
Jul 11 17:56:03 <CaCO3_> khertan: what does it mean on the OBS builder when it sais *4 hours" job time? Doues your package take that long to compile or is it waiting sinz 4h?
Jul 11 17:56:05 <javispedro> instead of stuff like oprofile 
Jul 11 17:56:07 <javispedro> etc.
Jul 11 17:56:47 <DocScrutinizer> I mean a proper repo with random stuff like the nnnn pkgs found under develpment in any sane distro
Jul 11 17:56:49 <fiferboy> GeneralAntilles: What are /you/ going to do with a new image?
Jul 11 17:57:00 <javispedro> DocScrutinizer: the calendar app is formidable and the pickers impressive.
Jul 11 17:57:07 <DocScrutinizer> indeed
Jul 11 17:57:20 <DocScrutinizer> see my screenshots on OVI
Jul 11 17:57:51 <javispedro> we finally have something that could compete with Palm's PIM :)
Jul 11 17:57:56 <DocScrutinizer> alas MTF which aiui is deprectaed for app devels
Jul 11 17:58:28 <javispedro> also, in the general direction of making this more like a phone and less like a computer,
Jul 11 17:58:39 <javispedro> the note application now handles the notes database by itself (ie no file picker)
Jul 11 17:59:06 <DocScrutinizer> see the abysmal slotmachine date/time-picker widgets from QMLcomp...(1,2) apps
Jul 11 17:59:06 <javispedro> you could disagree here, but I prefer very much the database approach vs file picker.
Jul 11 17:59:17 <khertan> burk
Jul 11 17:59:33 <DocScrutinizer> eeeew
Jul 11 18:00:02 <DocScrutinizer> and the notes somewhat acted up on me, on first note I intended to enter
Jul 11 18:00:28 <javispedro> woah
Jul 11 18:00:31 <GeneralAntilles> fiferboy, same thing /you're/ going to do.
Jul 11 18:00:31 * javispedro loves floating formatting bar
Jul 11 18:00:36 <javispedro> in notes
Jul 11 18:00:38 <javispedro> beatiful
Jul 11 18:00:40 <DocScrutinizer> also globally no markup+C&P
Jul 11 18:00:43 <fiferboy> GeneralAntilles: I knew that was coming :P
Jul 11 18:00:49 <javispedro> DocScrutinizer: yes there is!
Jul 11 18:00:57 <DocScrutinizer> uhuh
Jul 11 18:01:06 <DocScrutinizer> then it's friggin well hidden
Jul 11 18:01:14 <javispedro> it just appeared on me!
Jul 11 18:01:17 <javispedro> it's a floating formatting bar
Jul 11 18:01:22 <javispedro> great.
Jul 11 18:01:30 <DocScrutinizer> in browser?
Jul 11 18:01:31 <javispedro> albeit I have to see how that works on larger notes.
Jul 11 18:01:36 <fiferboy> DocScrutinizer: link to your ovi screenshots?
Jul 11 18:01:37 <javispedro> DocScrutinizer: no, notes app.
Jul 11 18:01:46 <DocScrutinizer> in arbitrary text input fields?
Jul 11 18:01:52 <javispedro> yet to see that.
Jul 11 18:01:58 <DocScrutinizer> bah!
Jul 11 18:02:13 <javispedro> albeit when I used to work on the input method there was global c&p support
Jul 11 18:02:20 <javispedro> in the form of a button in the vkb
Jul 11 18:02:25 <DocScrutinizer> fiferboy: somewhere next to http://share.ovi.com/media/joerg900.public/joerg900.10140
Jul 11 18:02:26 <javispedro> which does not seem to be present now..
Jul 11 18:02:49 * fiferboy needs to live vicariously
Jul 11 18:03:22 <javispedro> so how do you copy from browser? good question..
Jul 11 18:03:35 <DocScrutinizer> muhaha server error on OVI
Jul 11 18:03:46 <fiferboy> DocScrutinizer: It is working now
Jul 11 18:04:06 <frals> DocScrutinizer: all textinputs should have c&p
Jul 11 18:04:16 <frals> afaik
Jul 11 18:04:24 <frals> but text selection in browser :(((
Jul 11 18:04:26 <DocScrutinizer> frals: maybe, by using kbd
Jul 11 18:04:36 * CaCO3_ is wondering why build.pub.meego.com is not accessable anymore. Is it me?
Jul 11 18:04:39 <frals> DocScrutinizer: no, swipe over text to select and it should appear magically
Jul 11 18:04:53 <DocScrutinizer> you can't highlight text with "the mouse" - thanks c-ts
Jul 11 18:05:00 <javispedro> DocScrutinizer: you can..
Jul 11 18:05:02 <javispedro> hold
Jul 11 18:05:05 <frals> long tap on text for magnifier
Jul 11 18:05:20 <DocScrutinizer> I tried for ~10min, no success
Jul 11 18:05:25 <javispedro> you clearly have never used an iPhone, DocScrutinizer ;)
Jul 11 18:05:31 <DocScrutinizer> my friend neither
Jul 11 18:05:42 <DocScrutinizer> and he owns an iPhone
Jul 11 18:05:56 <javispedro> well weird stuff still happens on this image
Jul 11 18:06:06 <javispedro> for example now vibrator feedback has appeared
Jul 11 18:06:11 <javispedro> for no discernible reason.
Jul 11 18:06:36 <DocScrutinizer> "2 : 1" on lockscreen. Hooray for now "0" missing instead of "9"
Jul 11 18:06:45 <javispedro> mine says " 0:01"
Jul 11 18:06:57 <DocScrutinizer> "2 : 2"
Jul 11 18:07:05 <javispedro> for a moment I thought the clock had been resetted until I remember what DocScrutinizer about weird font missing chars ;)
Jul 11 18:07:22 <javispedro> " 0:0 "
Jul 11 18:07:28 <javispedro> today's missing number is "2" here.
Jul 11 18:07:35 <frals> fwiw its fixed now at least ;-)
Jul 11 18:07:59 <javispedro> btw, screen fingerprint magnet
Jul 11 18:08:20 <javispedro> definitely more than n900.
Jul 11 18:08:31 <DocScrutinizer> woooohaha, vib feedback in notes on vkbd
Jul 11 18:08:31 <javispedro> or maybe n900 already has a shit layer
Jul 11 18:08:43 <GAN900> javispedro, we should make bingo cards.
Jul 11 18:08:59 <frals> DocScrutinizer: seems vibra is only on the vkb and not actually on tapping icons and stuff in my experience
Jul 11 18:09:03 <frals> why its like that i have no idea...
Jul 11 18:09:14 <javispedro> GAN900++
Jul 11 18:09:41 <DocScrutinizer> still I fail to get it how to highlight text even in notes. all I get is the magnifier-view of cursor position
Jul 11 18:09:57 <frals> less pressure and move over the text
Jul 11 18:10:22 <DocScrutinizer> MEH
Jul 11 18:10:24 <DocScrutinizer> OMFG
Jul 11 18:11:22 <javispedro> download manager is also good.
Jul 11 18:11:41 <javispedro> accesible from status area btw.
Jul 11 18:12:15 <frals> transfer ui is pretty good aye
Jul 11 18:12:18 <DocScrutinizer> unbearable
Jul 11 18:12:28 <DocScrutinizer> ohwell that's c-ts
Jul 11 18:13:04 <javispedro> btw, qml applications on stock firmware: qml widgetsgallery, maps, and facebook.
Jul 11 18:13:06 <DocScrutinizer> I now have learned how to highlight random text in word chunks
Jul 11 18:13:25 <DocScrutinizer> random, not arbitrary
Jul 11 18:13:31 <javispedro> DocScrutinizer: :)
Jul 11 18:13:33 <javispedro> step by step!
Jul 11 18:13:45 <DocScrutinizer> screwit
Jul 11 18:14:03 <Scifig> Good morning/evening. Did anyone's status change from "New Order" today? I've noticed some people received their device today, but no one mentioned change in order status.
Jul 11 18:14:09 <DocScrutinizer> this device isn't meant for serious work being done
Jul 11 18:14:30 <javispedro> DocScrutinizer: fortunately, your device still has a keyboard to get some work done
Jul 11 18:14:36 <javispedro> including arrow keys and Ctrl+C
Jul 11 18:14:46 <DocScrutinizer> it a multimedia smartphone, not any kind of palmtop computer
Jul 11 18:16:07 <DocScrutinizer> who minted the term? "optimized to shine on first usage, rather than for serious use"
Jul 11 18:16:48 <DocScrutinizer> you can attract drive-by-customers this way
Jul 11 18:17:12 <Jaffa> grinsekatze:  Worked for me, but I had an effort getting them across. I'd delete all from N950, delete the sync profiles are try again...
Jul 11 18:17:28 <javispedro> DocScrutinizer: well, not that you had consistent and/or coherent global copy&paste on the N900.
Jul 11 18:17:41 <javispedro> each of the applications doing it his way.
Jul 11 18:17:41 <GeneralAntilles> Scifig, not me, not fiferboy.
Jul 11 18:17:42 <DocScrutinizer> pick from display in shop, randomly tap here and there, admire the transitions, buy...
Jul 11 18:17:48 <GeneralAntilles> khertan got a shipping, not sure about anybody else
Jul 11 18:18:11 <GeneralAntilles> At this rate we might all have them by the time Nokia's a Microsoft subsidiary.
Jul 11 18:18:14 <Jaffa> s/grinsekatze/gri_/
Jul 11 18:18:15 <infobot> Jaffa meant: gri_:  Worked for me, but I had an effort getting them across. I'd delete all from N950, delete the sync profiles are try again...
Jul 11 18:19:27 <Scifig> GeneralAntilles - Thanks. Btw I think both of our orders were submitted on same day too 7/7/11.
Jul 11 18:20:07 <javispedro> wth
Jul 11 18:20:16 <GeneralAntilles> Scifig, khertan's went in at about 12:30 (Finnish time) on the 7th, so it's definitely in order of reception (12:04 here).
Jul 11 18:20:19 <javispedro> n950 comes with imagemagick including decades-old "display" image viewer =)
Jul 11 18:20:23 <javispedro> and it even runs =)
Jul 11 18:20:45 <DocScrutinizer> LOL
Jul 11 18:20:57 <DocScrutinizer> I'd love to make maps run
Jul 11 18:21:13 <DocScrutinizer> I'm eager to test that app, more than anything else
Jul 11 18:21:20 * javispedro finally colides with aegis
Jul 11 18:21:24 <DocScrutinizer> alas it fails for me on Nokia account
Jul 11 18:21:31 <javispedro> "Aegis: verification failed (no reference hash)"
Jul 11 18:21:37 <DocScrutinizer> haha
Jul 11 18:21:41 <DocScrutinizer> :-S
Jul 11 18:22:05 <Jaffa> Interesting, gPodder stays landscape in Harmattan in tsk switcher. Will have to ask thp how he does that.
Jul 11 18:22:34 <javispedro> hah, it is very easy if your app is plain X11 :)
Jul 11 18:23:16 <Scifig> GeneralAntilles - I might have submitted around 16:30 Helsinki time, so more wait for me then.
Jul 11 18:23:49 <fiferboy> GeneralAntilles: Do you mean NOT in roder of reception?
Jul 11 18:24:05 <fiferboy> s/roder/order/
Jul 11 18:24:07 <infobot> fiferboy meant: GeneralAntilles: Do you mean NOT in order of reception?
Jul 11 18:24:21 <Jaffa> javispedro: Having 'display' is cool, as displaying random images was always a problem on Maemo
Jul 11 18:24:53 <Jaffa> That reminds me, I must put screenshot instructions on Migrating_from_N900_to_N950
Jul 11 18:24:58 <javispedro> Jaffa: sadly I wouldn't suggest using it because it is probably unoutswiplable 
Jul 11 18:25:44 <javispedro> # touch /home/user/crap
Jul 11 18:25:45 <javispedro> touch: /home/user/crap: Permission denied
Jul 11 18:25:50 <javispedro> I. WANT. REAL. ROOT.
Jul 11 18:26:07 <Jaffa> javispedro: I thought an atom *prevented* that, not enabled it
Jul 11 18:26:25 <javispedro> unredirected windows also prevent it
Jul 11 18:26:39 <javispedro> and seems this uses them
Jul 11 18:27:08 <javispedro> eitherway it seems to work though... albeit corruptely ;)
Jul 11 18:28:17 <javispedro> GOT IT!!!!
Jul 11 18:28:20 <javispedro> develsh
Jul 11 18:28:55 <javispedro> hum.. now I can copy to /home/user but still cannot exec() ..
Jul 11 18:29:38 <dm8tbr> hmm so does anyone know if I can get all sorts of notifications from harmattan easily?
Jul 11 18:29:45 <DocScrutinizer> WOW it accepted my Nokia account!!! \o/
Jul 11 18:29:51 <dm8tbr> like incoming call, text message, IM, ...
Jul 11 18:31:26 <Itschue> moin moin
Jul 11 18:37:04 <DocScrutinizer> the maps app is absolutely overwhelming
Jul 11 18:37:49 <e0x> DocScrutinizer: n950 ?
Jul 11 18:37:57 <DocScrutinizer> yup
Jul 11 18:38:02 <e0x> i hate you
Jul 11 18:38:38 <e0x> i was reject :D 
Jul 11 18:40:19 <Itschue> n900 nachfolger?
Jul 11 18:40:32 <Itschue> sorry dont know nachfolger in english
Jul 11 18:42:41 <CaCO3_> successor
Jul 11 18:48:44 <piggz> any qtmobility experts here? it seems there is some missing symbols in libqtm-12-location
Jul 11 18:48:49 <Jaffa> DocScrutinizer: Maps is better than Fremantle version but still shit compared with Wayfinder on Diablo (I tried using it yeseterday, with Drive, in the car)
Jul 11 18:48:52 <Jaffa> Pretty, but functionally and usably limited
Jul 11 18:48:59 <piggz> either that, or i have messed up, and it maybe isnt finding the libs
Jul 11 18:49:46 <piggz> Jaffa: compared to google maps nav?
Jul 11 18:49:50 <rm_work> Jaffa: I just want an official GoogleMaps app already >_>
Jul 11 18:50:07 <rm_work> i don't see how, faced with the correct way to do things, they still get it so wrong
Jul 11 18:51:09 <GAN900> Jaffa, really?
Jul 11 18:51:15 <GAN900> That's too bad.
Jul 11 18:51:30 <GAN900> Screenshots make it look like a reasonable Garmin replacement.
Jul 11 18:52:21 <GAN900> Contractors
Jul 11 18:53:11 <javispedro> "This selects the Maemo Aegis Security Framework. If you are unsure how to answer this question, answer N."
Jul 11 18:53:14 <javispedro> direct to the point...
Jul 11 18:57:47 <piggz_> pls repeat anything ive missed since 19:45 GMT+1 ...hotel wifi kicked me off :)
Jul 11 18:58:37 <hiemanshu> piggz_: http://fpaste.org/zdbw/
Jul 11 18:59:01 <piggz_> hiemanshu: nothing much then :)
Jul 11 18:59:19 <hiemanshu> yup
Jul 11 18:59:28 <piggz_> still waiting for dispatch of phone...so working on new game
Jul 11 18:59:52 <hiemanshu> yeah
Jul 11 18:59:56 <piggz_> i guess the app im about to release for maemo will have to be re-written using qt components as it uses qwidget
Jul 11 19:00:00 <hiemanshu> same here, hoping it ships tomorrow
Jul 11 19:04:14 <javispedro> oh, zImage is now lzo compressed seemingly.
Jul 11 19:05:15 <ruskie> http://www.linuxfordevices.com/c/a/News/Toshiba-Thrive-ships/ <-- interesting
Jul 11 19:06:33 <GeneralAntilles> 10.1" is way too big for a tablet.
Jul 11 19:07:11 <hiemanshu> no, 10.1 is perfect, anything smaller is bad
Jul 11 19:07:14 <ruskie> I'm still hoping the touchbook becomes more than vapourware
Jul 11 19:07:31 <fiferboy> No, 10.1" is too small for a tablet.  15" at least
Jul 11 19:07:39 <ruskie> naahhh 30" atleast
Jul 11 19:07:55 <javispedro> so, booting a new kernel without aegis = reboot after 8 seconds
Jul 11 19:08:06 <ruskie> javispedro, owww fun
Jul 11 19:08:17 <hiemanshu> ruskie: then its not a tablet, its a full size capsule :P
Jul 11 19:08:32 <ruskie> heh
Jul 11 19:09:41 <GeneralAntilles> 7"
Jul 11 19:09:49 <ruskie> GeneralAntilles, to small
Jul 11 19:09:54 <DocScrutinizer> Jaffa: the POI integration is awesome
Jul 11 19:09:58 <GeneralAntilles> 10.1 you can't hold it and type.
Jul 11 19:10:21 <ruskie> GeneralAntilles, well the touchbook is 8.9"
Jul 11 19:10:25 <hiemanshu> GeneralAntilles: you can, you just have small hands
Jul 11 19:10:27 <ruskie> 1024x600
Jul 11 19:10:30 <DocScrutinizer> maybe shit compared to a *real* navi, but best *I* have seen so far (I never used a 'real' navi)
Jul 11 19:10:43 <ivan4th> that Aegis seem to retain too much from Gorgon... It worries me as I'll receive my N950 soon, too
Jul 11 19:10:47 <ruskie> a nice inbetween a to small 7" and to big 10"
Jul 11 19:10:57 <GeneralAntilles> hiemanshu, my hands are pretty normal sized.
Jul 11 19:11:42 <DocScrutinizer> Jaffa: it finds all the relevant pubs nearby, allows direct phone call, calculates route, gives routing detail...
Jul 11 19:12:03 <DocScrutinizer> but beither map nor drive seems to use the *compass* :-/
Jul 11 19:12:11 <DocScrutinizer> neither*
Jul 11 19:12:17 <javispedro> oh, we have a compass
Jul 11 19:12:35 <DocScrutinizer> javispedro: yeah, bit obviously nuttin that's using it
Jul 11 19:13:55 <DocScrutinizer> which is a nuisance as that bit is one of the most intriguing ones
Jul 11 19:14:22 <DocScrutinizer> even announced and planned an app based on it
Jul 11 19:14:37 <pauly> hey, "yone want to buy my n900 for $250
Jul 11 19:14:56 <DocScrutinizer> hah, now you want to sell?
Jul 11 19:15:01 <pauly> any^
Jul 11 19:15:20 <DocScrutinizer> what went wrong with swapping it for a N8?
Jul 11 19:15:23 <pauly> no 1 has an n8
Jul 11 19:15:32 <DocScrutinizer> timeless had
Jul 11 19:15:41 <pauly> timeless has not been on
Jul 11 19:15:59 <hiemanshu> I want an N8 too, but not after selling my N900
Jul 11 19:16:04 <DocScrutinizer> you spoiled the deal, I guess
Jul 11 19:16:25 <pauly> no i didnt i been waiting for him to come on irc
Jul 11 19:17:54 <pauly> but he not here?
Jul 11 19:26:02 <Jaffa> DocScrutinizer: The biggest problem with it are the light grey roads, on a lighter grey background on a white background.
Jul 11 19:26:09 <Jaffa> DocScrutinizer: Makes using in a car a bit... tricky
Jul 11 19:29:08 <SpeedEvil> !seen timeless
Jul 11 19:29:09 <DocScrutinizer> in drive? yeah that's bad
Jul 11 19:29:16 <SpeedEvil> I think he was on last night.
Jul 11 19:29:19 <DocScrutinizer> SpeedEvil: ~ is the key
Jul 11 19:29:25 <SpeedEvil> ~seen timeless
Jul 11 19:29:35 <infobot> timeless <d04149cb@firefox/developer/timeless> was last seen on IRC in channel #maemo, 4d 52m 47s ago, saying: 'well, for mine, you add my repo and install a locale (en-US/en-GB) :)'.
Jul 11 19:29:45 <SpeedEvil> yeah - for large values of last.
Jul 11 19:30:26 <DocScrutinizer> timeless is known by many names ;-P
Jul 11 19:31:12 <DocScrutinizer> Jaffa: tried nightmode?
Jul 11 19:34:40 <rm_work> ~seen timelessx
Jul 11 19:34:43 <infobot> i haven't seen 'timelessx', rm_work
Jul 11 19:34:52 <rm_work> hrm forget his other name
Jul 11 19:39:27 <DocScrutinizer> http://mg.pov.lt/maemo-irclog/search?q=timeless
Jul 11 19:41:02 <DocScrutinizer> timeless_mbp, timeless_n900, timeless_$randomfoo just some of those
Jul 11 19:41:15 <DocScrutinizer> I really hate this nickname switching
Jul 11 19:45:12 <hiemanshu> DocScrutinizer: true, just use one common nick or a distributed client
Jul 11 19:49:27 <DocScrutinizer> well, I'm the right one to bitch, with my up to 4 different concurrent nicks. It's just not exactly trivial to keep all on one bouncer, and some users may not even have the option to use a bouncer. But if you are logging in mutually exclusively from different clients, then I couldn't care less about learning you're just on your N900, or on your MBP or whatever. And I absolutely hate the itsme_zzZZzz itsme_onToilet itsme_dinner scheme
Jul 11 19:50:51 <hiemanshu> Well i have the same nick from all my devices, and yeah stateful nicks are stupid
Jul 11 19:55:06 <DocScrutinizer> http://sackheads.org/~bnaylor/spew/away_msgs.html
Jul 11 20:00:35 <fiferboy> Is it possible to programmatically assign focus to a Qt Component, say a TextField?
**** ENDING LOGGING AT Mon Jul 11 20:00:49 2011

**** BEGIN LOGGING AT Mon Jul 11 20:02:14 2011
Jul 11 20:02:14 <DocScrutinizer> sure
Jul 11 20:02:24 <DocScrutinizer> just don't ask me about details
Jul 11 20:02:43 <DocScrutinizer> sth along object.takefocus() or whatever
Jul 11 20:03:26 <fiferboy> I can see how to determine if an object HAS focus, but not to assign focus
Jul 11 20:03:30 <DocScrutinizer> setfocus() prolly
Jul 11 20:04:35 <DocScrutinizer> for all I recall from my Qt time 5y back it's trivial
Jul 11 20:04:47 <fiferboy> There is focus and activeFocus, both for determining focus
Jul 11 20:05:07 <fiferboy> There is forceActiveFocus, but it doesn't seem to work as I would expect
Jul 11 20:05:07 <DocScrutinizer> object.focus.set() maybe?
Jul 11 20:07:18 <fiferboy> It looks like "object.focus: true" is supposed to work, but it didn't look like it to me
Jul 11 20:07:21 <fiferboy> Retesting
Jul 11 20:07:32 <DocScrutinizer> http://lists.trolltech.com/qt-interest/2004-02/thread00633-0.html
Jul 11 20:09:07 <fiferboy> Unfortunately, QML doesn't seem to work the same way
Jul 11 20:09:30 <Jaffa> DocScrutinizer: Nightmode wasn't great. Maps' "Terrain" view seemed best, but navigation in there kept crashing.
Jul 11 20:09:36 <fiferboy> But focus is not a read-only property, so maybe setting it from the right place will work
Jul 11 20:09:47 <Itschue> is there any app that change the fm transmitter frequenz autmatical when an other radio sender my n900 stört?
Jul 11 20:10:06 <cehteh> no
Jul 11 20:10:29 <Jaffa> There's an Empty Frequency Finder script
Jul 11 20:10:54 <DocScrutinizer> that wouldn't help much either, Itschue - how would your radio learn about the freq change?
Jul 11 20:11:26 <cehteh> i'd like the opposite, turn microphone on, find out which broadcast is on, and then hijack it with your own music
Jul 11 20:12:00 <cehteh> i sometimes need that when i am guest in others cars :P
Jul 11 20:12:23 <Jaffa> DocScrutinizer: RDS is already used, so the radio should be able to track.
Jul 11 20:12:34 <DocScrutinizer> I suggested the concept of user selecting a quiet spot on radio, then hit a "tune" button on N900 so the device sends an acoustic beacon on each channel and listens to mic to tell the right channel
Jul 11 20:12:47 <Jaffa> Itschue: The biggest problem, AIUI, is that the FM RX & TX can't both be active at the same time
Jul 11 20:12:53 <fiferboy> Setting the focus property within the element definition does not work for me
Jul 11 20:12:59 <cehteh> DocScrutinizer: thats slow
Jul 11 20:13:04 <DocScrutinizer> Jaffa: won't work when the transmission already got messed up
Jul 11 20:13:14 <DocScrutinizer> cehteh: well maybe
Jul 11 20:13:26 <DocScrutinizer> cehteh: I know ways to speed it up ;-P
Jul 11 20:13:40 <Itschue> the radio didnt change it automatic but when i change it on the radio the n90 change it automatic some fm trans devices can do those thing
Jul 11 20:13:42 <cehteh> wider band :P
Jul 11 20:13:55 <cehteh> more output!
Jul 11 20:15:27 <fiferboy> Hmm, http://bugreports.qt.nokia.com/browse/QTCOMPONENTS-403
Jul 11 20:15:30 <DocScrutinizer> Jaffa: obviously. How ould the RX *inside* N900 tell about interference on the car radio some meter distant
Jul 11 20:16:21 <Itschue2> shit fucking disco
Jul 11 20:16:53 <cehteh> can it receive and send at the same time? iirc not the receiver is used to tune the transmitter right?
Jul 11 20:16:53 <DocScrutinizer> Jaffa: though I actually created nice feedback by sending FMRX signal to FMTX and tuning both to same freq X-P
Jul 11 20:17:25 <DocScrutinizer> s/signal/audio signal/
Jul 11 20:17:26 <infobot> DocScrutinizer meant: Jaffa: though I actually created nice feedback by sending FMRX audio signal to FMTX and tuning both to same freq X-P
Jul 11 20:17:51 <cehteh> as i saied, turn microphone on, listen to ambient and analyze it if that what you send 
Jul 11 20:18:37 <DocScrutinizer> cehteh: oh yeah, will for sure pan out - in your car, at max volume
Jul 11 20:18:46 <cehteh> :)
Jul 11 20:18:53 <cehteh> well needs some serious signal processing
Jul 11 20:19:10 <Itschue2> still i use fm boost but this wont work anytime because the radio signal from other sender are stronger
Jul 11 20:19:10 <DocScrutinizer> with extremely smart algos to compensate for RTT and EQ
Jul 11 20:19:25 <cehteh> but on the other hand a frequency analyzer app would be nice for the sound enginerrs on the road :P
Jul 11 20:19:50 <cehteh> yeah and delay compenstation and maximize, not match
Jul 11 20:19:58 <cehteh> i know that :)
Jul 11 20:20:15 <DocScrutinizer> Itschue2: find a silent spot on your car radio, read the freq, tune N900 FMTX to that freq
Jul 11 20:20:43 <Itschue2> fuck ey
Jul 11 20:20:55 <Itschue2> das geht net so einfach weil immer wieder irgendein sender stört
Jul 11 20:21:20 <DocScrutinizer> sorry the, that's not going to get fixed by any means
Jul 11 20:21:22 <Itschue2> ich suche zu hause ne freie frequenz und 15 km später werde ich gestört
Jul 11 20:21:25 <DocScrutinizer> then*
Jul 11 20:21:30 <cehteh> Itschue2: there is some fmtx boosting app and then search for a good spot to place the n900
Jul 11 20:22:20 <Itschue2> i know i have the fmboost script but i dont know how much battery energy it use?
Jul 11 20:22:23 <cehteh> sometimes thats at surprisingly odd places because the car antennas are outside or on the window and the car is a faraday cage
Jul 11 20:22:27 <DocScrutinizer> pro tip: plugging in a dead-ended USB cable is reportedly amplifying the FMTX signal quite a bit
Jul 11 20:22:34 <cehteh> yes
Jul 11 20:23:11 <Itschue2> ohh good idea
Jul 11 20:23:15 <DocScrutinizer> fmboost won't eat significant amounts of battery power
Jul 11 20:23:22 <Itschue2> cool
Jul 11 20:23:37 <cehteh> prolly less than the speakers :P
Jul 11 20:24:07 <DocScrutinizer> it's like ramping up power used by FMTX chip from 0.0000001W to 0.0000005W
Jul 11 20:24:22 <Itschue2> ok that is to forget
Jul 11 20:24:28 <Itschue2> ähm
Jul 11 20:24:31 <DocScrutinizer> you'll hardly find a way to measure it
Jul 11 20:25:04 <Itschue2> how can i change the order of the milkyway desktop pics i want that all 4 pics goes one to left i hope you know what i mean
Jul 11 20:25:33 <cehteh> move all desktop icons one to the right :P
Jul 11 20:25:34 <KhLoveNickSwitch> Departed Facility in HELSINKI - FINLAND 	HELSINKI - FINLAND 	21:51
Jul 11 20:25:35 <KhLoveNickSwitch> :)
Jul 11 20:26:26 <Itschue2> no the start desktop is empty there is only these cool eyes
Jul 11 20:26:56 <cehteh> cool eyes?
Jul 11 20:27:11 <Itschue2> the eyes widget  
Jul 11 20:27:26 <cehteh> well anyways .. the pics are ordered by the theme or whatever container sets this .. you have to redefine/recreate that, possibly thats easy but some work
Jul 11 20:27:39 <cehteh> that certainly eats a lot of power
Jul 11 20:27:57 <Itschue2> the eyes eats lot of power?
Jul 11 20:28:29 * cehteh put the gnome eyes widget on his wifes menubar (desktop computer) and surprisingly its one of the apps which accumulate the most cpu
Jul 11 20:28:47 <cehteh> note that it needs to wake for every screen redraw
Jul 11 20:29:01 <cehteh> doesnt matter for a desktop but certainly matters on the n900
Jul 11 20:29:32 <Itschue2> note that it needs to wake for every screen redraw  in german plz
Jul 11 20:29:50 <villager> I thought it only needed to wake for every input event
Jul 11 20:30:28 <holmesII> I am using QT, in which header that I can get the battery charge level (mhA)  information ?
Jul 11 20:30:34 <DocScrutinizer> Itschue2: it will run on *every* action that takes place on the phone
Jul 11 20:30:44 <DocScrutinizer> Itschue2: it sucks
Jul 11 20:31:08 <Itschue2> but ist cool
Jul 11 20:31:11 <Itschue2> its
Jul 11 20:31:17 <Itschue2> fuck denglish
Jul 11 20:32:05 <holmesII> battery.reporting.current = 847  (0x34f)  (int)  how can i get this information in QT?
Jul 11 20:32:15 <DocScrutinizer> will kill your batteryin half the time :-)
Jul 11 20:32:22 <DocScrutinizer> (eyes)
Jul 11 20:33:15 <Itschue2> hmm i will test it
Jul 11 20:34:04 <Itschue2> and the desktop background pics kann i change the order evene when it is installed or is it better to download the.deb file and change it in this?
Jul 11 20:35:18 <Itschue2> ok time to go see you tomorrow
Jul 11 20:39:05 <DocScrutinizer> desktp wallpapers are changed by clicking on desktop background, clicking on the gear icon, selecting sth like "change wallpaper" from the menu from upper right
Jul 11 20:39:18 <gri_> DocScrutinizer: Am I allowed to use the n900 wall charger for the n950 or will that damage something?
Jul 11 20:40:03 <DocScrutinizer> perfectly sane
Jul 11 20:40:15 <DocScrutinizer> doing it all the time
Jul 11 20:40:50 <gri_> good :)
Jul 11 20:41:14 <DocScrutinizer> if it would break anything, I think I should have a visit at Tampere
Jul 11 20:41:22 <DocScrutinizer> ;-P
Jul 11 20:43:34 <DocScrutinizer> nah, nokia EE mostly know their business - well they practiced for quite some time :-)
Jul 11 20:44:22 <DocScrutinizer> I wish my colleagues in Taipei always had delivvered such quality of hw design
Jul 11 20:44:23 <gri_> ok, I only had in mind that the wall charger is/was not recommed for meego ce, so I thought it might handle things a bit different :)
Jul 11 20:44:35 <gri_> recommended*
Jul 11 20:44:57 <DocScrutinizer> I don't know about any such limitations for meegoCE
Jul 11 20:45:27 <gri_> it was about "might not load, use to usb cable to be sure"
Jul 11 20:45:30 <DocScrutinizer> if they have such limitations then because of their messed up bme implementation that probably doesn't know how to detect the fastcharger
Jul 11 20:46:18 <DocScrutinizer> musb_hdrc driver implemetation might be related somehow as well
Jul 11 20:46:36 <DocScrutinizer> as charger detection is a task of musb_hdrc USB driver
Jul 11 20:47:30 <DocScrutinizer> use ShadowJK 's charger script and profit ;-P
Jul 11 20:47:41 <DocScrutinizer> guaranteed to work with fastcharger
Jul 11 20:47:59 <DocScrutinizer> even unde meegoCE (as long as they don't completely mess up sysfs)
Jul 11 20:48:50 <DocScrutinizer> no, fastcharger works like a charm for N950
Jul 11 20:50:14 * DocScrutinizer ponders where to dump this particular factoid to...
Jul 11 20:50:57 <DocScrutinizer> maybe make Jaffa add it to his "first encounter" compendium?
Jul 11 20:51:11 <DocScrutinizer> Jaffa: ^^^
Jul 11 20:51:58 <gri_> btw, my n950 was missing the "0" at the first start ;)
Jul 11 20:54:06 <DocScrutinizer> hey, "0" here
Jul 11 20:54:10 <DocScrutinizer> now
Jul 11 20:54:18 <DocScrutinizer> yesterday it was "9"
Jul 11 20:54:34 <DocScrutinizer> might be timezone and moonphase dependent
Jul 11 20:55:19 <gri_> second boot was also cool: contacts application said "no contacts" whereas the call-ui showed all contacts 
Jul 11 20:55:20 * DocScrutinizer would so much appreciate to see Nokia opening up nb-tracker to public read access
Jul 11 20:55:41 <DocScrutinizer> all contacts???? where from?
Jul 11 20:55:56 <gri_> copied from n900
Jul 11 20:56:06 <DocScrutinizer> copied as in...?
Jul 11 20:56:08 <gri_> like jaffa wrote in the wiki
Jul 11 20:56:12 <DocScrutinizer> aaah
Jul 11 20:56:13 <DocScrutinizer> k
Jul 11 20:57:19 * ShadowJK has a different version for meegoCE in N900
Jul 11 20:58:56 <ShadowJK> N950 didn't come with a wallcharger?
Jul 11 20:59:44 <gri_> only phone and usb cable
Jul 11 20:59:46 <cehteh> hehe prolly the same for the N9 .. the really dont want you to like it
Jul 11 21:00:01 <DocScrutinizer> ShadowJK: nope
Jul 11 21:00:06 <cehteh> if you want a wallcharger, buy the WP7 Phone
Jul 11 21:00:27 <DocScrutinizer> nonsense :-D
Jul 11 21:00:34 <cehteh> :>
Jul 11 21:00:36 <ShadowJK> usb is slooow
Jul 11 21:00:44 <DocScrutinizer> wallchargers would create need for localized packaging
Jul 11 21:00:50 <ShadowJK> though I do have one hub I can get 700-800mA out of
Jul 11 21:01:14 <DocScrutinizer> ShadowJK: won't fly, unless your hub has D+- short
Jul 11 21:01:18 <cehteh> DocScrutinizer: not really .. almost any device which has a small wallcharger i have came with a adaptor for the plug
Jul 11 21:01:42 <cehteh> well the n900 wallcharger should work for the n950 too
Jul 11 21:01:46 <ShadowJK> DocScrutinizer, well my script ignores d+/d- ;)
Jul 11 21:01:49 <DocScrutinizer> an adapter wouldn't fit into the box ;-P
Jul 11 21:01:58 <DocScrutinizer> ShadowJK: :-D
Jul 11 21:02:13 <DocScrutinizer> ShadowJK: *I* know that
Jul 11 21:02:42 <cehteh> btw i now tried your script with the bike charger on a trip, seems it doesnt work well
Jul 11 21:02:44 <DocScrutinizer> I think I'm the father of all charger scripts ;-)
Jul 11 21:02:47 <ShadowJK> Amusingly: powered hub - self powered hub - n900 and it barely stays at +-0 current with screen on
Jul 11 21:02:54 <cehteh> next i aim for a cap in the charger cable then look ahead
Jul 11 21:03:18 <ShadowJK> cehteh, I'd imagine alot of Undervoltage faults in the log
Jul 11 21:03:43 <cehteh> ShadowJK: yes the n900 can suck more than 500ma constantly .. netradio and some other app are enough
Jul 11 21:03:48 <cehteh> ShadowJK: right
Jul 11 21:04:11 <DocScrutinizer> and how exactly does that matter?
Jul 11 21:04:13 <cehteh> ShadowJK: would be nice to make it back off the current and gracfully restart
Jul 11 21:04:16 <ShadowJK> In other news, google lost patent lawsuit and has to pay 5 million un damages for using *drumroll* a linked list
Jul 11 21:04:24 <cehteh> haha
Jul 11 21:04:28 <nox-> haha
Jul 11 21:04:32 <DocScrutinizer> is your bike charger so weak it can't deliver >500mA?
Jul 11 21:04:45 <cehteh> nah it should deliver 850 ma
Jul 11 21:05:01 <cehteh> it prolly just some power spikes which it cant handle
Jul 11 21:05:14 <cehteh> i really try next time with a buffering capacitor
Jul 11 21:05:25 <DocScrutinizer> there *are no* power spikes in N900 charging
Jul 11 21:05:33 <ShadowJK> checked /home/user/MyDocs/charge.log?
Jul 11 21:05:55 <cehteh> yes
Jul 11 21:06:20 <DocScrutinizer> the charger chip is incapable of drawing significantly more than 850mA from USB
Jul 11 21:07:27 <DocScrutinizer> you're for sure better off placing that capacitor on prinary side of your bikecharger's reulator circuit
Jul 11 21:07:55 <cehteh> http://pastebin.com/i9WnL4ww
Jul 11 21:08:11 <cehteh> DocScrutinizer: i consider both sides :)
Jul 11 21:08:16 <ShadowJK> It seems kinda sensitive to load regulation of the power supply. iirc one guy did a buck/boost circuit with a mcu, and the mcu wasn't fast enough to regulate voltage
Jul 11 21:09:06 <cehteh> well the bike charger has 2 parts .. one rectifier and limiting circruit directly connected to the dynamo
Jul 11 21:09:18 * ShadowJK also failed the other day to make his devnOPP charge from 4*aaa -> ca-146
Jul 11 21:09:21 <cehteh> and then then battery charge and output box
Jul 11 21:09:48 <cehteh> ShadowJK: i tried the ca146 .. but it gets to hot to feel comfortable
Jul 11 21:09:58 <cehteh> if i need a pizza oven, i'd bought one
Jul 11 21:10:18 <DocScrutinizer> haha
Jul 11 21:10:44 <DocScrutinizer> heard CA146A tend to burn down sometimes
Jul 11 21:10:48 <cehteh> it works but it feels like heating 50% energy away
Jul 11 21:10:53 <cehteh> yes
Jul 11 21:10:57 <ShadowJK> hah
Jul 11 21:11:15 <DocScrutinizer> wonder why Nokia is so concerned about N900 maybe overloading chargers with taking unadvertised 500mA
Jul 11 21:11:28 <ShadowJK> bq24150 is for sure not getting clean power
Jul 11 21:11:34 <DocScrutinizer> while same time burning down houses with CA146A
Jul 11 21:12:04 <cehteh> my first idea was a rectifier, cap and zener and then use the ca-146 to charge n900 from the bike hub .. but really i want to have some current left for charging than heating the environment
Jul 11 21:12:34 <DocScrutinizer> haha
Jul 11 21:12:39 <ShadowJK> btw you can get ca146 for like 2 bucks a piece from china, i wonder how many meltdowns have been from the redesigned-for-cheap version :P
Jul 11 21:12:56 <DocScrutinizer> lol
Jul 11 21:12:59 <cehteh> maybe we shall sell extra heatsink packs :)
Jul 11 21:13:00 <ShadowJK> cehteh, what's your current setup?
Jul 11 21:13:23 <DocScrutinizer> silicon oil full suspension
Jul 11 21:13:33 <cehteh> ShadowJK: http://www.thinkbiologic.com/products/reecharge-power-pack  bought that because it looked promising and somewhat works
Jul 11 21:14:02 <cehteh> (actuallc it works most of the time, but sometimes charging fails and then for some time in a row)
Jul 11 21:14:17 <cehteh> and nothing of the parts getting warm
Jul 11 21:14:27 <cehteh> so no big losses
Jul 11 21:14:30 <DocScrutinizer> cehteh: bike dynamos are terrible in any respect
Jul 11 21:14:35 <cehteh> yes i know
Jul 11 21:14:50 <cehteh> as said next i try to add a cap, may help a bit
Jul 11 21:15:03 <ShadowJK> cehteh, input undervoltage when it fails?
Jul 11 21:15:37 <cehteh> yes and too much switching .. possibly be takeover betwenn battery and dynamo isnt clean
Jul 11 21:15:43 <ShadowJK> Oh you definitely need a cap, it has no chance to work with dynamo -> rectifier -> reg/zener -> n900
Jul 11 21:15:47 <DocScrutinizer> you'd need a cap that can deliver min 0.5As for Vmax-Vmin
Jul 11 21:16:02 <DocScrutinizer> where Vmin = 5V + LDO drop
Jul 11 21:16:18 <DocScrutinizer> and Vmax prolly the 6V+x of your dynamo
Jul 11 21:16:19 <cehteh> yes the problem with a bike dynamo is that it has very low Hz
Jul 11 21:16:24 <cehteh> na
Jul 11 21:16:29 <DocScrutinizer> doesn't look good
Jul 11 21:16:36 <cehteh> the reecharge has this input circruit
Jul 11 21:16:59 <cehteh> that rectifies and limits to 5V (prolly linear-regulator)
Jul 11 21:17:24 <ShadowJK> Maybe we could try with lower rate than 950 :)
Jul 11 21:17:58 <cehteh> and then charge in is prolly some stock liion charge cirruit and the 850ma 5V out are DCDC regulated
Jul 11 21:17:59 <ShadowJK> But if it has a 1600mAh battery it should charge n900 even without dynamo
Jul 11 21:18:06 <cehteh> ShadowJK: i tried, doesnt help
Jul 11 21:18:09 <DocScrutinizer> cehteh: I wonder what makes you think a LDO has less loss than CA146A
Jul 11 21:18:19 <cehteh> ShadowJK: yes it works, most of the time
Jul 11 21:18:39 <cehteh> DocScrutinizer: it gets less hot :P ..
Jul 11 21:18:44 <DocScrutinizer> haha
Jul 11 21:18:59 <cehteh> well seriously .. LDO has some advantages in this setup
Jul 11 21:19:20 <cehteh> it has the least losses when you drive slowly and you barely reach the input voltage
Jul 11 21:19:25 <DocScrutinizer> don't you think that *could* be somehow related to surface and generally thermal design rather than efficiency?
Jul 11 21:19:32 <cehteh> and as soon you drive faster losses doesnt matter anymore
Jul 11 21:19:44 <cehteh> while a dcdc would have most losses at the lower end of the scale
Jul 11 21:20:17 <cehteh> nope the regulator from the reecharge is a plastic cast similar to the ca-146
Jul 11 21:20:44 <cehteh> maybe slightly bigger .. but it doesnt get warm at all
Jul 11 21:21:13 <ShadowJK> charge21.sh line 24. change 0x42 (950mA, 150mA term) to 0x20 (750mA, 50mA term)
Jul 11 21:21:14 <cehteh> anyways i like this toy i just want to improve it and fix the remaining problem
Jul 11 21:21:17 <DocScrutinizer> then it's no LDO which is just sane enough
Jul 11 21:21:23 <cehteh> ShadowJK: yes i did that
Jul 11 21:21:28 <ShadowJK> ah
Jul 11 21:21:35 <cehteh> tried different limits but even at 100ma it sometimes fails
Jul 11 21:21:47 <ShadowJK> 100mA is useless btw
Jul 11 21:21:48 <cehteh> really .. my next try is to put a cap there
Jul 11 21:22:07 <cehteh> yes i know i just wanted to see if it will not stop charging because of undervoltage
Jul 11 21:22:17 <ShadowJK> because musb consumes about 80mA, and cpu locked at 500MHz
Jul 11 21:22:25 <DocScrutinizer> cehteh: how could it not fail as soon as you stop?
Jul 11 21:22:38 <cehteh> what?
Jul 11 21:22:59 <ShadowJK> DocScrutinizer, built in battery?
Jul 11 21:22:59 <cehteh> then battery takes over?
Jul 11 21:23:21 <DocScrutinizer> afaik bike dynamoes doen't provide any power at all during no-move periods
Jul 11 21:23:30 <DocScrutinizer> which battery?
Jul 11 21:23:42 <cehteh> DocScrutinizer: http://www.thinkbiologic.com/products/reecharge-power-pack
Jul 11 21:23:50 <ShadowJK> dynamo - [ rect+reg+dcdc -> liion charger -> battery -> dcdc ] -> n900
Jul 11 21:24:07 <DocScrutinizer> what's that dcdc
Jul 11 21:24:08 <DocScrutinizer> ?
Jul 11 21:24:14 <DocScrutinizer> the 2nd one
Jul 11 21:24:30 <cehteh>  dynamo - [ rect+reg+ LCO -> liion charger -> battery -> dcdc ] -> n900
Jul 11 21:24:33 <cehteh> prolly
Jul 11 21:24:35 <DocScrutinizer> and what's the first contraption?
Jul 11 21:25:01 <cehteh> i didnt disassembled it
Jul 11 21:25:15 <cehteh>  dynamo - [ rect+reg+ LCO ] -> [liion charger -> battery -> dcdc ] -> n900
Jul 11 21:25:41 <cehteh> rather this are 2 components .. the first is permanently on the bike the battery and dcdc is strapped on and detachable
Jul 11 21:25:43 <DocScrutinizer> if that friggin thing is meant to operate from a bike dynamo, why on god's earth you use a rect and zener on dynamo then?
Jul 11 21:26:01 <cehteh> eh?
Jul 11 21:26:11 <ShadowJK> I wonder if it's like this toy-ups battery board I have, it has a fet to disconnect its boost circuit and feed input power to output directly, but unfortunately triggers at like 2V instead of something sane like 4.5V
Jul 11 21:28:29 <DocScrutinizer> something is definitely odd with this blackbox and DIY dcdc
Jul 11 21:29:13 <ShadowJK> i dont think he's using any diy in his current setup?
Jul 11 21:29:36 <Termana> good morning
Jul 11 21:29:47 <cehteh> DocScrutinizer: i dont use diy .. see the link i provided
Jul 11 21:30:41 <ShadowJK> So he's only using this comercial product, consisting of lipo charger, lipo, boost circuit, connected to dynamo on one end and n900 on other end
Jul 11 21:31:02 <ShadowJK> and planning to add capacitors somewhere to "fix" it?
Jul 11 21:31:39 <cehteh> yes
Jul 11 21:32:20 <cehteh> hey and there are chances that this cap may or may not work, but its worth a try, i even bett the odds are on the may work side, its little efforts and costs only a few euros
Jul 11 21:33:06 <ShadowJK> I've made many "emergency charger" type things work by adding some random crappy cap stolen from dead radios :)
Jul 11 21:33:23 <cehteh> who here made his custom charge box? timeless? he reported that adding caps made charging a lot more reliable even when charging from secondary battery only
Jul 11 21:33:31 <cehteh> yes
Jul 11 21:33:41 <cehteh> so i just try and see
Jul 11 21:35:15 <ShadowJK> otoh, my lolcharger made out of RCHobby components worked fine without extra caps :)
Jul 11 21:36:48 <wmarone__> is it just me, or do no twitter clients on the N900 work?
Jul 11 21:37:38 * cehteh doesnt use twitter
Jul 11 21:38:03 <cehteh> but its prolly you .. because someone else certainly uses twitter from the n900
Jul 11 21:38:17 <wmarone__> I guess
Jul 11 21:38:31 <wmarone__> they all bounce back with error 401
Jul 11 21:39:00 <cehteh> over wlan or gsm/umts/whatever
Jul 11 21:39:23 <ShadowJK> 401, is that authorization failed or malformed request?
Jul 11 21:39:32 <wmarone__> auth failed
Jul 11 21:39:45 <DocScrutinizer> http://www.yakahonsu.de/InternetExplorer/IE-Fehler/Reparaturprogramm/Fehlercodes/fehlercodes.html
Jul 11 21:39:57 * wmarone__ tosses it aside for later
Jul 11 21:40:09 <DocScrutinizer> meh, ok another obsolete bookmark
Jul 11 21:43:42 <DocScrutinizer> cehteh: this product line is supposed to work without any friggin Cs or whatnot
Jul 11 21:44:29 <cehteh> DocScrutinizer: yes and? .. seems not to do :P
Jul 11 21:44:34 <DocScrutinizer> and it clearly says it's made to provide continuous power to USB
Jul 11 21:44:42 <cehteh> well as i saied it works most of the time, but sometimes fails
Jul 11 21:44:57 <DocScrutinizer> cehteh: call manufacturer to fix it!
Jul 11 21:45:03 <DocScrutinizer> you paid for it
Jul 11 21:45:34 <cehteh> yeah have luck :)
Jul 11 21:45:54 <cehteh> at best i get my money back
Jul 11 21:48:49 <trumee_> wmarone__, twimgo seems to be ok
Jul 11 21:54:39 <DocScrutinizer> cehteh: or they swap you lemon for a good device with working LiPo
Jul 11 21:56:31 <cehteh> DocScrutinizer: the 'good' one costs 3 times as much
Jul 11 21:56:58 <cehteh> and i saied it works most of the time, so if the cheap cap fixes it, then its ok for me
Jul 11 22:05:11 <javispedro> Jaffa: you said you tested Drive? Mine always says searching for GPS despite Maps saying it already has a lock
Jul 11 22:06:12 <javispedro> also, I found there's something weird about aegis
Jul 11 22:06:59 <javispedro> enabling relaxed-exec in developer mode causes it to ignore missing signatures and allows you to run whatever executable you want.... as long as you are NOT root.
Jul 11 22:08:51 <DocScrutinizer> javispedro: same here, until I stopped maps app :-P
Jul 11 22:09:14 <javispedro> heh
Jul 11 22:09:31 <DocScrutinizer> javispedro: WUT, non-root can execute whatever he wants?
Jul 11 22:09:56 <javispedro> from ssh, run aegis-developer-mode --related-exec 
Jul 11 22:10:06 <javispedro> then aegis-exec -u user -l to get a "user" shell
Jul 11 22:10:08 <javispedro> then run everything
Jul 11 22:10:12 <javispedro> I uploaded a few executables via sftp
Jul 11 22:10:30 <javispedro> they seem to work -- sadly, the only one with UI crashes, but I do not know if it's my fault.
Jul 11 22:12:36 <javispedro> --rela_x_ed-exec (sorry)
Jul 11 22:21:11 <piggz_> is there any qt components port on n900 yet?
Jul 11 22:21:47 <piggz_> i need to make a settings window, and i can either do it myself with rectangles, or use some components :)
Jul 11 22:21:49 <ieatlint> woo, n950 just arrived
Jul 11 22:23:01 <javispedro> ieatlint: unpacking? :)
Jul 11 22:23:17 <piggz_> well, its a good sign that there are qt-components and qt-components-dev packages
Jul 11 22:24:07 <ieatlint> yeah, in a very classy way it has my first name written on masking tape on the box
Jul 11 22:24:22 <javispedro> yeah, surprised.
Jul 11 22:24:32 <javispedro> it is tradition here to do that with christmas presents =)
Jul 11 22:25:12 <ieatlint> this is the cheapest nokia device packaging i've ever seen :P
Jul 11 22:26:34 <cehteh> ziplock bag?
Jul 11 22:26:48 <javispedro> the package is virtually only double the volume of the device itself
Jul 11 22:27:08 <ieatlint> that's standard for nokia packaging for the last year... small boxes
Jul 11 22:27:16 <ieatlint> but the cardboard is cheap as hell
Jul 11 22:27:25 <ieatlint> there's no wall charger (just usb cable)
Jul 11 22:27:34 <ieatlint> i'm surprised there's the "quick start" guide
Jul 11 22:29:58 * ShadowJK has been using N810 and rediscovered music he forgot he had :-)
Jul 11 22:30:30 <ShadowJK> also, a media player that doesn't reorder songs in albums arbitrarily
Jul 11 22:36:00 * javispedro is now rediscovering the weirdest crashes in the innermosts layers of libX11...
Jul 11 22:36:36 <GAN900> javispedro, first day is wrapping up? Good or bad?
Jul 11 22:37:35 <javispedro> so far, good -- I'd say tearfree it's friggin impressive and usable OviMaps is a big plus.
Jul 11 22:38:02 <javispedro> my biggest con is lack of Jabber/GTalk, which makes me think tomorrow I'll go to work with the N900 :(
Jul 11 22:38:23 <DocScrutinizer> javispedro: (double the volume) well a tiny bit more :-)
Jul 11 22:38:24 <ieatlint> wtf is tearfree?
Jul 11 22:38:39 <DocScrutinizer> javispedro: lack of xchat
Jul 11 22:38:41 <javispedro> "without tearing"
Jul 11 22:38:47 <ieatlint> oh
Jul 11 22:38:58 <ieatlint> stupid homonyms
Jul 11 22:39:00 <DocScrutinizer> javispedro: any source for manpages for aegis* ?
Jul 11 22:39:04 <ieatlint> i was thinking tear as in crying
Jul 11 22:39:34 <javispedro> DocScrutinizer: I do not think there are, but there are --help pages, what is on gitorious, and the kernel's Documentation/aegis.txt
Jul 11 22:40:03 <DocScrutinizer> aegis.txt sounds good, --help is not really enlightening
Jul 11 22:40:16 <javispedro> on the other side, I am not impressed by this device's hw kb.
Jul 11 22:40:26 <DocScrutinizer> should the doc be on device?
Jul 11 22:40:34 <javispedro> in fact, I find myself already using the vkb more.... because I fear I'm going to break the hinge.
Jul 11 22:40:38 <javispedro> Yes, it looks that fragile.
Jul 11 22:40:58 <javispedro> DocScrutinizer: nope, it's on kernel source.
Jul 11 22:41:14 <ieatlint> anyone know what you hold down to get the phone to boot into flash/update mode?
Jul 11 22:41:23 <DocScrutinizer> indeed, I'm reluctant to open it the way it's supposed to be, I rather lift the screen's upper end
Jul 11 22:41:37 <javispedro> ieatlint: you don't, just shut down phone and plug cable while flasher on desktop is "waiting for device"
Jul 11 22:41:41 <javispedro> this also works with n900, etc.
Jul 11 22:41:43 <DocScrutinizer> ieatlint: nuttin
Jul 11 22:42:15 <javispedro> DocScrutinizer: can pastebin it for you (doc/aegis.txt), wait a moment.
Jul 11 22:42:26 <javispedro> but it also didn't say anything really enligthening
Jul 11 22:42:29 <DocScrutinizer> javispedro: yup, Nokia streamlined the flashing instructions quite a bit
Jul 11 22:42:37 <ieatlint> ah, ok
Jul 11 22:42:52 <DocScrutinizer> javispedro: appreciated
Jul 11 22:43:12 <DocScrutinizer> ~seen MohammadAG 
Jul 11 22:43:27 <infobot> mohammadag is currently on #maemo #meego. Has said a total of 77 messages. Is idling for 10h 7m 22s, last said: 'yeah, totally our fault'.
Jul 11 22:43:28 <javispedro> DocScrutinizer: http://pastebin.com/C5jbvj7N
Jul 11 22:44:04 <MohammadAG> Funny, I just came in
Jul 11 22:44:11 <javispedro> DocScrutinizer: when you read the part about sysfs settings, you will want to know whetever they are sealed in N950. Yes they are.
Jul 11 22:44:19 <DocScrutinizer> javispedro: thanks :-)
Jul 11 22:44:35 <DocScrutinizer> MohammadAG: hey! hi! :-)
Jul 11 22:44:44 <javispedro> MohammadAG: weren't you on holiday?
Jul 11 22:45:01 <MohammadAG> javispedro, 1:40 AM, home now
Jul 11 22:45:08 <javispedro> MohammadAG: please don't kill me while I write a note on my N950!
Jul 11 22:45:08 <MohammadAG> well, "home" not home
Jul 11 22:45:08 <cehteh> haha this aegis is fail .. years ago someone made a kernel module checking signatures on elf files
Jul 11 22:45:24 <KMFDM> i believe hinge problems are why they didn't sell the n950 to consumers 
Jul 11 22:45:29 <KMFDM> no money left in the project to fix it
Jul 11 22:45:30 <cehteh> .. that worked about one week until someone shown a ld.so written in perl
Jul 11 22:45:32 <KMFDM> so give it to devs
Jul 11 22:45:41 <KMFDM> how is the the virtual keyboard on the n9(50) ?
Jul 11 22:46:12 <DocScrutinizer> well, it's.... virtual
Jul 11 22:46:34 <DocScrutinizer> javispedro: the kbd as is isn't that bad anyway
Jul 11 22:46:55 <javispedro> -- well, it's larger than n900s. Enter is weirdly placed (for me).
Jul 11 22:46:56 <DocScrutinizer> the hinge... well there's a reason for the photos on ovi
Jul 11 22:47:21 <DocScrutinizer> http://share.ovi.com/media/joerg900.public/joerg900.10151
Jul 11 22:47:30 <MohammadAG> lardman, your order shipped?
Jul 11 22:47:30 <javispedro> half of the times I want to open it
Jul 11 22:47:33 <javispedro> I just don't know HOW to open it.
Jul 11 22:47:36 <MohammadAG> or hiemanshu
Jul 11 22:47:42 <javispedro> which side? where to apply pressure? etc etc
Jul 11 22:47:51 <javispedro> it's just too hard and fragile at the same time.
Jul 11 22:48:26 <javispedro> this "slider with angle" is just broken IMHO.
Jul 11 22:48:28 <cehteh> DocScrutinizer: are these arms plastic or metal?
Jul 11 22:48:30 <javispedro> *idea
Jul 11 22:48:39 <DocScrutinizer> unclear
Jul 11 22:48:55 <javispedro> feel like plastic at least externally.
Jul 11 22:49:02 <GeneralAntilles> javispedro, yeah, I don't get the point.
Jul 11 22:49:14 <GeneralAntilles> There's seemingly no real advantage
Jul 11 22:49:24 <GeneralAntilles> I guess you get SLIGHTLY more space for the keyboard.
Jul 11 22:49:40 <javispedro> there's one -- place on a table it is useful.
Jul 11 22:49:42 <DocScrutinizer> I'm even undecided about the battery cover. It sometimes feels like metal, but from inside like plastic
Jul 11 22:50:53 <DocScrutinizer> javispedro: know what was awesome? When yu could swap keycaps
Jul 11 22:50:55 <cpscotti> GeneralAntilles, javispedro .. hmm.. one advantage is that you get the "kickstand" effect you had on the n900 but a lot more stable
Jul 11 22:50:58 <KhLoveNickSwitch> 	Processed at LEIPZIG - GERMANY
Jul 11 22:51:08 <GeneralAntilles> cpscotti, yeah. . . .
Jul 11 22:51:13 <Khertan> still some kilometters:)
Jul 11 22:51:16 <cpscotti> maybe the only one..
Jul 11 22:51:30 <javispedro> cpscotti: fits well with my "placed on a table it is useful" ;)
Jul 11 22:51:35 <Khertan> cpscotti, i love the n810 kickstand :)
Jul 11 22:52:02 <cpscotti> Khertan,  I used the n900's one maaany many times too
Jul 11 22:52:10 <Khertan> cpscotti, not me
Jul 11 22:52:12 <cpscotti> but that one was quite unstable
Jul 11 22:52:27 <cpscotti> I mean like.. the "need" exists.. making it right is another story
Jul 11 22:52:31 <MohammadAG> I loved the N97
Jul 11 22:52:45 <Khertan> me fear that this slider was not robust
Jul 11 22:52:48 <GeneralAntilles> Man, Chris di Bona is such an arrogant ass.
Jul 11 22:52:58 <GeneralAntilles> No one is buying the company line, Chris.
Jul 11 22:53:12 <Khertan> http://share.ovi.com/media/joerg900.public/joerg900.10170?sort=0 <<< aegis look like a nice things
Jul 11 22:53:13 <Khertan> lol
Jul 11 22:53:22 <GeneralAntilles> Khertan, yeah, the N8x0 kickstand was amazing.
Jul 11 22:53:35 <DocScrutinizer> javispedro: yesterday I noticed "shutting down" while on charger doesn't even stop sshd ;-)
Jul 11 22:53:51 <javispedro> am I yet to understand acting dead
Jul 11 22:53:57 <javispedro> seems to be more similar to n8x0 one than n900.
Jul 11 22:53:58 <DocScrutinizer> javispedro: my ssh session survived a "reboot" 
Jul 11 22:54:01 <GeneralAntilles> http://derstandard.at/1308186313932/Interview-Google-Android-is-the-Linux-desktop-dream-come-true
Jul 11 22:55:12 <DocScrutinizer> one funny bit: my box had no name sticker at all
Jul 11 22:55:21 <jacekowski> i was thinking about my next phone
Jul 11 22:55:34 <DocScrutinizer> and I always thought MohammadAG was *special*
Jul 11 22:55:39 <Khertan> http://media.share.ovi.com/m1/s/3048/0ccba66665194c79a24f86f0e31382e7.jpg <<< whao thinner than n900
Jul 11 22:55:39 <jacekowski> and wp7 from nokia looks like the best option
Jul 11 22:56:11 <jacekowski> it's not linux based at all
Jul 11 22:56:35 <Khertan> jacekowski, mouhahahaha
Jul 11 22:56:40 <Khertan> do not feed the troll
Jul 11 22:56:47 <javispedro> acting dead on n950 is fun, is it possible that it does not actually boot the OS at all?
Jul 11 22:57:30 <jacekowski> Khertan: it's just that linux as phone platforms looks dead
Jul 11 22:57:30 <GeneralAntilles> Google is SO EVIL
Jul 11 22:57:33 <MohammadAG> I want my N950 :/
Jul 11 22:57:39 <jacekowski> Khertan: nokia will not make other linux based phones
Jul 11 22:57:42 <javispedro> jacekowski: there's still WebOS.
Jul 11 22:58:10 <DocScrutinizer> GeneralAntilles: you finally *really* can place the device on a table and type on it like on a regular laptop in miniature format
Jul 11 22:58:10 <javispedro> and I do think Nokia will eventually make another Linux phone. The question is whether they will before tanking =)
Jul 11 22:58:31 <DocScrutinizer> aah javispedro mentioned that
Jul 11 22:58:50 * Khertan is asking himself if his n950 will be at home tomorrow
Jul 11 22:58:51 <cehteh> yeah .. like on a laptop .. 10 finger typing :)
Jul 11 22:59:16 <nid0> used to be able to do that fine with any communicator, too
Jul 11 22:59:29 <javispedro> if you think of the n950 hwkb as something only to use on a table... I think it's fine. but on the move..
Jul 11 22:59:42 * cehteh meanwhile really think if an external, usb or bluetooth keyboard, even if mini-laptop format is the way to go
Jul 11 23:00:03 <ieatlint> huh, there must be something i'm missing when i try and flash the n950
Jul 11 23:00:21 <javispedro> ieatlint: why do you want to flash it already?
Jul 11 23:00:42 <ieatlint> it finds the device, then says "Sending ape-algo image (7054 kB)..." "100% (7054 of 7054 kB, avg. 30405 kB/s)" then the phone turns off, and it says "Suitable USB interface (phonet) not found, waiting..."
Jul 11 23:01:46 <DocScrutinizer> javispedro: (is it possible that it does not actually boot the OS at all?) see my stay-alive ssh wlan session . it survived a proper reboot via powerbutton push
Jul 11 23:02:34 <javispedro> that's when I was saying it resembles more n8x0 actdead than n900, but I think it starts way too fast for that
Jul 11 23:02:50 <javispedro> n900 reboots on every state change, n8x0 didn't, it just changed runlevel.
Jul 11 23:04:10 <DocScrutinizer> ieatlint: outch
Jul 11 23:05:05 <DocScrutinizer> that's what N950 does, evidently
Jul 11 23:05:16 <DocScrutinizer> and sshd is active in both runlevels
Jul 11 23:09:02 <MohammadAG> gah internet speed sucks here
Jul 11 23:09:05 <MohammadAG> I feel I'm on 56k or something
Jul 11 23:09:23 <GeneralAntilles> Welcome to 1999
Jul 11 23:09:44 <javispedro> Nokia stock is 30-something again?
Jul 11 23:09:47 <MohammadAG> I don't miss it
Jul 11 23:09:51 <javispedro> but I need to warn the world about Elop!!
Jul 11 23:09:53 <javispedro> sell!!
Jul 11 23:10:48 <Jartza> don't worry
Jul 11 23:11:00 <Jartza> soon we don't have to worry about nokia at all
Jul 11 23:11:06 <ieatlint> huh, if i then boot it, and tell it to go into "sync and connect mode", it says "Device is in Sync and connect mode, sending ADL reboot." on the flasher
Jul 11 23:11:25 <ieatlint> then "RROR: Failed to change protocol" and it exits, and the phone reboots normally
Jul 11 23:11:30 <Jartza> just look at the history, what has happened to companies that "get together" with microsoft :)
Jul 11 23:11:35 <GeneralAntilles> Jartza, what happens when they become a Microsoft powerhouse subsidiary?
Jul 11 23:11:57 <Jartza> GeneralAntilles: they just fade away, not a biggie
Jul 11 23:12:18 <Jartza> there is enough cellphone manufacturers in the world
Jul 11 23:12:36 <Jartza> the knowledge just moves to some other company
Jul 11 23:14:28 <Jartza> http://www.asymco.com/2011/02/11/in-memoriam-microsofts-previous-strategic-mobile-partners/
Jul 11 23:14:34 <Jartza> :)
Jul 11 23:14:58 <cpscotti> javispedro, haha LOLLLed hard!
Jul 11 23:15:18 <cpscotti> Sell! Sell, run to the mountains!
Jul 11 23:15:19 <javispedro> Jartza: the list happens to miss HTC.
Jul 11 23:15:30 <javispedro> cpscotti: :)
Jul 11 23:18:19 <javispedro> haha
Jul 11 23:18:25 <javispedro> GeneralAntilles: say vivainio's tweet?
Jul 11 23:18:28 <javispedro> *saw
Jul 11 23:18:40 <Jartza> javispedro: well that is an old article already
Jul 11 23:18:45 <GeneralAntilles> javispedro, which?
Jul 11 23:18:51 <javispedro> latest
Jul 11 23:19:00 <javispedro> about that piece of android garbage.
Jul 11 23:19:00 <GeneralAntilles> Hehe
Jul 11 23:19:18 <GeneralAntilles> Chris di Bona tried to hit me with a t-shirt.
Jul 11 23:19:22 <GeneralAntilles> I don't care for the man.
Jul 11 23:19:29 <javispedro> and a free device? =)
Jul 11 23:19:38 <MohammadAG> fuck yeah back to 5MBps :D
Jul 11 23:19:49 <GeneralAntilles> It was funny when the question came up about Google not sending patches back to Linux at the LFCS last year.
Jul 11 23:20:01 <javispedro> MohammadAG: you can now hit F5 on the Nokia Developer pages with bandwidth to spare!
Jul 11 23:20:02 <GeneralAntilles> "Well, nobody in the industry does, so we're not exactly behind."
Jul 11 23:20:08 <GeneralAntilles> Half the room said "Uh, Nokia."
Jul 11 23:20:20 <MohammadAG> javispedro, I'm thinking of writing a script / Qt app to hammer the page non stop
Jul 11 23:20:31 <MohammadAG> parse the status field
Jul 11 23:21:08 <MohammadAG> technically, I need a QWebView, dump and save all cookies, load them from QNetworkAccessManager, add a 1ms timer that always loops
Jul 11 23:21:17 <MohammadAG> then hook it up to my server
Jul 11 23:21:27 <MohammadAG> or just wait for an email
Jul 11 23:22:04 <MohammadAG> either way, I won't get the N950 when it arrives in Israel, either someone "forwards" it to me or I get it a week or two later
Jul 11 23:22:46 <javispedro> call DHL and have that arranged =)
Jul 11 23:22:50 <javispedro> though they will charge you
Jul 11 23:22:55 <cpscotti> MohammadAG, 1ms!
Jul 11 23:22:58 <cpscotti> :)
Jul 11 23:23:22 <MohammadAG> javispedro, to Jordan? I don't want it arranged
Jul 11 23:23:35 <MohammadAG> I don't trust postal services here
Jul 11 23:23:40 <javispedro> heh.
Jul 11 23:24:26 * javispedro realizes that he forgot to make clean 
Jul 11 23:24:39 <javispedro> and thus someone is mixing files compiled to different header versions
Jul 11 23:24:44 * javispedro sighs
Jul 11 23:25:04 <javispedro> gdb could warn about that, it can deduce it.
Jul 11 23:28:13 <NIN101> http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/b/b9/AEGIS_Logo.svg lol, I laughed. 
Jul 11 23:30:50 <DocScrutinizer> javispedro: send patches! :-P
Jul 11 23:31:45 <DocScrutinizer> NIN101: well, I see a small black rectangle
Jul 11 23:31:59 <DocScrutinizer> NIN101: I don't laugh
Jul 11 23:32:33 <javispedro> DocScrutinizer: your browser is stupid
Jul 11 23:32:36 <javispedro> DocScrutinizer: http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/b/b9/AEGIS_Logo.svg/500px-AEGIS_Logo.svg.png
Jul 11 23:36:17 <MohammadAG> I wonder, how much battery does the FM radio TX take?
Jul 11 23:36:22 <MohammadAG> err, RX
Jul 11 23:38:44 <DocScrutinizer> few
Jul 11 23:39:06 <DocScrutinizer> javispedro: thanks
Jul 11 23:42:54 <DocScrutinizer> MohammadAG: you didn't use the 950-ssh?
Jul 11 23:44:21 <javispedro> this segphault guy just throwed up that iOS might be using more GNU code than Android =)
Jul 11 23:47:27 <MohammadAG> DocScrutinizer, not yet
Jul 11 23:47:47 <MohammadAG> I'm actually sorting my connection
Jul 11 23:47:58 <MohammadAG> I won't be around a lot, except at night
Jul 11 23:48:07 <DocScrutinizer> hmm, in 5 hours you'll need a new "IP lease" :-)
Jul 11 23:48:35 <DocScrutinizer> always 6:30 CEST
Jul 11 23:55:26 <javispedro> OHNOES
Jul 11 23:55:34 * javispedro forgot to clear a stack variable
Jul 11 23:55:43 <javispedro> stupid compiler could also warn about this. he knows that..
Jul 11 23:55:45 <javispedro> oh wait. he did.
Jul 11 23:56:02 <javispedro> of course, it only crashed on ARM.
Jul 11 23:56:09 <javispedro> see, this is what one needs a device.
Jul 11 23:56:12 <javispedro> *why
Jul 12 00:39:03 <DocScrutinizer> (oh wait. he did.) LOL
Jul 12 00:40:51 * DocScrutinizer gasps on "/dev/sda6              20G   18G  632M  97% /" - friggin scratchbox!
Jul 12 00:43:44 <DocScrutinizer> hmm, 4.7G    /scratchbox/
Jul 12 00:44:05 * DocScrutinizer wonders what's the other cruft
Jul 12 00:45:15 <derf> scratchbox # du -xhs .
Jul 12 00:45:15 <derf> 47G     .
Jul 12 00:45:16 <GeneralAntilles> Docs?
Jul 12 00:46:22 <DocScrutinizer> derf: W*T*F?!
Jul 12 00:47:13 <derf> There's, uh, a few Fennec checkouts in there.
Jul 12 00:48:30 <javispedro> at 100MiB (iirc), wow.
Jul 12 00:48:34 <javispedro> *100MiB each.
Jul 12 00:49:32 <derf> Try 10 times that, unbuilt.
Jul 12 00:55:59 <javispedro> whoa whoa whoa
Jul 12 00:56:05 * javispedro tries the limit of max fingers on N950
Jul 12 00:56:11 <javispedro> I need moar fingers!!!
Jul 12 00:57:03 <javispedro> min of 6 so far 
Jul 12 00:57:42 <javispedro> I cannot really do more than 6 on a screen this size
Jul 12 00:57:49 <javispedro> but it does seem to detect 6 fingers realiably
Jul 12 00:58:23 <javispedro> oops
Jul 12 00:58:30 * javispedro managed to confuse the window manager
Jul 12 00:59:02 <javispedro> indeeed, reboot time.
Jul 12 00:59:31 <arvut> I think Currency exchange widget is somewhat broken
Jul 12 00:59:31 <javispedro> DocScrutinizer: do you know how to take a screenshot?
Jul 12 01:00:11 <arvut> it resets my other widgets so that I have to readd them all (I got quite a lot of widgets..)
Jul 12 01:00:28 <DocScrutinizer> ctrl-shift-P on hildon(?), otherwise use "Widgets Ga..."
Jul 12 01:00:37 <GeneralAntilles> Grrr
Jul 12 01:01:02 <arvut> Widgets Ga..?
Jul 12 01:01:03 <javispedro> GeneralAntilles: hate hate hate!
Jul 12 01:01:08 <DocScrutinizer> the ctrl-shift-P has a cute flashlight effect
Jul 12 01:01:17 <GeneralAntilles> javispedro, I had my 2-Minutes Hate this morning.
Jul 12 01:01:36 <GeneralAntilles> You were definitely the focus.
Jul 12 01:01:42 <GeneralAntilles> Khertan's up tomorrow. :P
Jul 12 01:01:48 <arvut> I know how to take a screenshot. you want one of each desktop then?
Jul 12 01:02:03 <javispedro> so much hate can't be good for health
Jul 12 01:02:24 <arvut> let him hate to death then and be done with it.
Jul 12 01:02:25 <javispedro> arvut: we are not the authors of currency exchange widget
Jul 12 01:02:35 <javispedro> arvut: if you suspect you hit a bug, ask the author.
Jul 12 01:03:16 <arvut> javispedro: i'll see what I can do. but warning ya'll about that widget is what I intended to do
Jul 12 01:03:39 * GeneralAntilles is frightened now.
Jul 12 01:04:09 <arvut> aren't the stuff in all but extras-devel to be verified/tested first?
Jul 12 01:04:15 <DocScrutinizer> javispedro: managed to shoot?
Jul 12 01:04:23 <javispedro> DocScrutinizer: yes, seems to work well.
Jul 12 01:04:49 <DocScrutinizer> pics in some MyDocs/*/* as usual
Jul 12 01:05:01 <javispedro> yep, or in gallery.
Jul 12 01:05:12 * javispedro could get used to something that tries to be filesystem-less, as said.
Jul 12 01:05:19 <DocScrutinizer> or in gallery
Jul 12 01:05:22 <arvut> altho.. you know what? It's bloody amazing to type on this phone, love the keyboard and small screen so much!!
Jul 12 01:05:26 <DocScrutinizer> oder bei OBI
Jul 12 01:05:30 <DocScrutinizer> sorry
Jul 12 01:06:09 <arvut> the keys feels extra-special after a few spellbranches of blaze.
Jul 12 01:07:48 <DocScrutinizer> a PITA the kbd shortcut isn't global
Jul 12 01:07:56 <arvut> gonna build a desert, with dancing scimitars, mindmagi's and lots of blue fog..
Jul 12 01:08:20 <arvut> can I errm.. /msg myself?
Jul 12 01:08:25 <rm_you> anyone know if you can rotate elements (or a whole pane would be easier) in Qt?
Jul 12 01:08:33 <rm_you> it was stupidly difficult in Gtk
Jul 12 01:08:39 <rm_you> but i need to do it for one of my apps
Jul 12 01:08:58 <DocScrutinizer> hmmm
Jul 12 01:09:09 <javispedro> uh oh
Jul 12 01:09:10 <arvut> yes! it wrks!! =)
Jul 12 01:09:15 <rm_you> so like, half of the app is upside-down, so two people on opposite sides of a table can each read half of the screen
Jul 12 01:09:16 <javispedro> for some reason CtrlShiftP only works in MTF apps
Jul 12 01:09:21 <DocScrutinizer> there *might* be a property >rotation< on Qt widgets
Jul 12 01:09:42 <javispedro> rm_you: it is probably way easier in Qt considering the interface is rotated that way in harmattan...
Jul 12 01:09:57 <rm_you> honestly, it just popped into my head so i asked here before even googling it, i'll go check google now...
Jul 12 01:10:05 <arvut> rm_you: that would be hax, or a mirrored image of the app, on half the screen.
Jul 12 01:10:23 <arvut> two screens would be cooler tho.
Jul 12 01:10:29 <rm_you> lol well durp :P
Jul 12 01:10:29 <DocScrutinizer> javispedro: what I said
Jul 12 01:10:37 <DocScrutinizer> (MTF)
Jul 12 01:10:50 <rm_you> what version of Qt does it use?
Jul 12 01:12:24 <DocScrutinizer> javispedro: so you still need screenshot for your app?
Jul 12 01:12:38 <javispedro> seems that widgets gay did the trick
Jul 12 01:12:46 <DocScrutinizer> yoh
Jul 12 01:12:50 <arvut> space music.. right from di.. feels somewhat empty. piano n some echo right now =)
Jul 12 01:13:00 <javispedro> btw boostedWA is faster version of widgets gay
Jul 12 01:13:08 <javispedro> *boostedWG
Jul 12 01:13:17 <arvut> whats that?
Jul 12 01:13:30 <DocScrutinizer> boosted as in faster?
Jul 12 01:13:36 <arvut> and... what's widgets gay?
Jul 12 01:13:38 <javispedro> preloaded
Jul 12 01:13:39 <DocScrutinizer> I already wondered
Jul 12 01:13:43 <javispedro> ooh, beatiful moment.
Jul 12 01:13:58 <javispedro> on my desktop are the two N9{0,5}0 icons, the one made by timeless and the one made by ???
Jul 12 01:13:58 <DocScrutinizer> Widgets Gallery app
Jul 12 01:14:00 <GeneralAntilles> Nice to see the hack back.
Jul 12 01:14:05 <arvut> >.<
Jul 12 01:14:13 <Evanescence> My N900 Maemo5 system crashed now. I changed system font with App "change font". Of course maybe other reasons. but It can not  connect with computer too. I need a good flasher manual. can you suggest some links or keyword for google ?
Jul 12 01:14:32 <DocScrutinizer> aka "Widgets Ga..." as that's what's written on applauncher 
Jul 12 01:15:26 <arvut> I wonder, would it work to use the n900 as a server? with some good server OS on it? sshing into it as a gui would not be needed
Jul 12 01:15:54 <arvut> or.. should one use it the other way around? to ssh into a large serverbox?
Jul 12 01:16:20 <DocScrutinizer> Evanescence: sorry, *what* do you need?
Jul 12 01:16:27 <arvut> s/large/randomsized/
Jul 12 01:16:27 <infobot> arvut meant: or.. should one use it the other way around? to ssh into a randomsized serverbox?
Jul 12 01:16:41 <arvut> =)
Jul 12 01:17:21 <Evanescence> docscrutinizer I need one "flasher" manual to recover system .
Jul 12 01:17:24 <javispedro> http://share.ovi.com/media/javispedro.Pblico/javispedro.10005 ;)
Jul 12 01:17:34 <DocScrutinizer> ~flash
Jul 12 01:17:35 <infobot> extra, extra, read all about it, flashing is http://wiki.maemo.org/Updating_the_tablet_firmware
Jul 12 01:18:03 <arvut> doc, please ask me to leave if you think I should (in case I spamalot) =.=
Jul 12 01:18:10 <Evanescence> docscrutinizer not "flash" I guess that method of recover system is "flasher"
Jul 12 01:18:44 <Evanescence> infobot: is that about recover system ?
Jul 12 01:18:45 <DocScrutinizer> Evanescence: sorry you lost me completely
Jul 12 01:19:06 <Evanescence> docscrutinizer anyway, I just want to recover system .
Jul 12 01:19:07 <arvut> is there a new firmware out there? I got 2010.10 I think
Jul 12 01:19:28 <DocScrutinizer> Evanescence: in which way, from what?
Jul 12 01:19:29 <arvut> ~firmware
Jul 12 01:19:30 <infobot> rumour has it, firmware is hardware that is beginning to melt  Firmware for GrandStream phones is at http://www.hellofone.com/files/
Jul 12 01:19:41 <arvut> l0l
Jul 12 01:20:09 <javispedro> so where do I place my music on N950? It has both the usual ".sounds" and a newfangle "Music" directory on MyDocs.
Jul 12 01:20:26 <DocScrutinizer> Evanescence: the standard recomended way to "recover" is to flash COMBINED as in ~flash
Jul 12 01:20:42 <Evanescence> docscrutinizer can you list out the best way ? it is better if it is simple.
Jul 12 01:21:22 <DocScrutinizer> ok, deleted my typed line about rescue-initrd and meego then
Jul 12 01:21:28 <DocScrutinizer> ~flashing
Jul 12 01:21:28 <infobot> it has been said that flashing is http://wiki.maemo.org/Updating_the_tablet_firmware
Jul 12 01:21:34 <Evanescence> docscrutinizer i see. so is there some link to a good manual about flash ?
Jul 12 01:21:35 <DocScrutinizer> IS the simplest way
Jul 12 01:21:55 <Evanescence> infobot: ok
Jul 12 01:21:56 <infobot> fine
Jul 12 01:22:19 <Evanescence> thanks. 
Jul 12 01:22:51 <DocScrutinizer> infobot: what are you?
Jul 12 01:22:51 <infobot> I am a blootbot. For more info see <blootbot>
Jul 12 01:23:05 <DocScrutinizer> ~blootbot
Jul 12 01:23:05 <infobot> methinks blootbot is an IRC bot written in perl descended from infobot. Hosted on SF. This project is now merged back into the main infobot project. See [infobot]
Jul 12 01:23:22 <DocScrutinizer> ~infobot
Jul 12 01:23:36 <DocScrutinizer> duh
Jul 12 01:23:49 <DocScrutinizer> ~factinfo infobot
Jul 12 01:23:50 <infobot> there's no such factoid as infobot, DocScrutinizer
Jul 12 01:24:06 <javispedro> uah
Jul 12 01:24:15 <javispedro> n950 music player looks _great_
Jul 12 01:24:24 <javispedro> (behind the scenes seems mostly the same..)
Jul 12 01:24:52 <javispedro> I specially love the scroll bars, which also appear on Mail and Contacts btw
Jul 12 01:25:02 <DocScrutinizer> hmm, I only have seen the Hanna Montana pink writing "please connect to your PC to sync your music library"
Jul 12 01:25:29 <javispedro> the scrollbar thingie is great
Jul 12 01:25:42 <javispedro> just flick a bit, then grab the "handle" that appears on the right side
Jul 12 01:25:56 <javispedro> you can scroll like it was a standard desktop scroll bar knob
Jul 12 01:26:12 <DocScrutinizer> o.O
Jul 12 01:27:26 <javispedro> aaaaaaaaaargh
Jul 12 01:27:37 <DocScrutinizer> that's not a systemwide standard as in e.g settings menu there's only a ~3pixel wide scrollbar that I can't pick
Jul 12 01:27:41 <javispedro> obviously, mediaplayer window stops refreshing when on the background
Jul 12 01:27:55 <javispedro> ah
Jul 12 01:27:59 <javispedro> it refreshes
Jul 12 01:28:05 <javispedro> just once every ten seconds
Jul 12 01:28:08 <javispedro> not bad.
Jul 12 01:28:10 <javispedro> could be better
Jul 12 01:28:32 <DocScrutinizer> err wut? in background??
Jul 12 01:28:40 <javispedro> when in task switcher
Jul 12 01:28:44 <DocScrutinizer> aah
Jul 12 01:29:49 <javispedro> DocScrutinizer: yeah, the scrollbar thing is not standard
Jul 12 01:30:04 <javispedro> seems only Mail Music and Contacts
Jul 12 01:30:15 <DocScrutinizer> this all is very very scary/disappointing
Jul 12 01:30:29 <pauly> its raining outside
Jul 12 01:30:39 <DocScrutinizer> nice timepicker - not available for devels
Jul 12 01:30:53 <DocScrutinizer> nice scrollbar - not a standard either
Jul 12 01:31:00 <javispedro> oh, it is available for devs -- using MTF I bet.
Jul 12 01:31:27 <DocScrutinizer> lemme rephrase: deprecated and unsupported for devels
Jul 12 01:32:15 <DocScrutinizer> the new BS: it now asks me for my Nokia account password on every boot
Jul 12 01:32:38 <javispedro> DocScrutinizer: you could say the entire platform is deprecated and unsupported, so...
Jul 12 01:32:50 <DocScrutinizer> mehehe
Jul 12 01:33:21 <javispedro> either way, I do not see that picker widget in MTF
Jul 12 01:35:30 <DocScrutinizer> I wonder if we (the harmattan devels / N950 owners) should all /join #harmattan, and keep this channel for maemo
Jul 12 01:35:53 <DocScrutinizer> javispedro: which picker widget?
Jul 12 01:35:55 <javispedro> this channel would die
Jul 12 01:36:13 <javispedro> DocScrutinizer: date
Jul 12 01:37:06 <cpscotti> DocScrutinizer, I like the idea of paying an endless homage to maemo using this channel, forever.
Jul 12 01:37:06 <DocScrutinizer> I don't think this chan would die, I think it would revert "to topic" and more N900 (and N8x0) related issues would begin showing up
Jul 12 01:37:36 <DocScrutinizer> cpscotti: please rephrase
Jul 12 01:37:45 <cpscotti> DocScrutinizer, but then again, it's less likely to get some help if people don't check this channel so often
Jul 12 01:37:54 <javispedro> we get many N8x0 issues =)
Jul 12 01:38:08 <pauly> i need symbian but no one is on the symbian channel
Jul 12 01:38:21 <cpscotti> DocScrutinizer, I mean.. we all love maemo and the public is pretty much the same.. so.. why changing.. 
Jul 12 01:39:09 <cpscotti> if we had an extremely huge amount of people talking here at the same time to the point that it becomes unmanageable, than I think it would be ace to "fork"
Jul 12 01:39:47 <DocScrutinizer> mainly because harmattan is meego - secondarily because all the N950 topics started to suffocate the maemo5 topics last week, and some users already grumbled
Jul 12 01:40:30 <cpscotti> DocScrutinizer, .. well.. didn't see that but I believe it.. so.. well.. let's go!
Jul 12 01:40:30 <DocScrutinizer> most users may find all that N950 talk just annoying or at very best boring
Jul 12 01:41:26 <pauly> n950 talk is aggervating because alot of people dont have one :(\
Jul 12 01:42:21 <javispedro> I am surprised you are trying to prevent n950 topics suffocating older devices ones
Jul 12 01:42:34 <javispedro> that's exactly what happened during the n8x0->n900 transition
Jul 12 01:42:52 <DocScrutinizer> I know
Jul 12 01:43:39 <villager> well, my n950-envy is relieved a bit by hearing about the device's crappiness
Jul 12 01:43:53 <DocScrutinizer> and I anticipated the very same effect for "meego"-harmattan and called it the last nail to maemo's coffin some months ago already
Jul 12 01:46:51 <SpeedEvil> n950 traffic also emphasises the EOL status of n900, hence puts of dev work.
Jul 12 01:47:04 <SpeedEvil> Dunno if that's significant - as of course QML/... can be done on the n900 too
Jul 12 01:48:07 <DocScrutinizer> well, what does this mean regarding your notion towards or against moving harmattan specific topics to #harmattan?
Jul 12 01:48:19 <cpscotti> DocScrutinizer, well.. I'd be fine with #harmattan but keep in mind that most people prefer one "active" channel than three desert-like
Jul 12 01:48:43 <cpscotti> (and as SpeedEvil is saying... at the end of the day it's all more or less Qt )
Jul 12 01:48:46 <cpscotti> night all!
Jul 12 01:48:55 <javispedro> at the end of the days it's more or less Maemo.
Jul 12 01:48:55 <DocScrutinizer> cpscotti: this channel wasn't desert-like 2 weeks ago
Jul 12 01:49:28 <arvut> haha n900 xray is awesome :)
Jul 12 01:49:30 <cpscotti> DocScrutinizer, fact... but well..
Jul 12 01:50:03 <cpscotti> anyways.. lol
Jul 12 01:51:14 <DocScrutinizer> it just dried out of N900 related topics when N950 started taking over, and I guess a lot of users are just not interested in filtering the few N900 ones from the - in their metrics - noise created by harmattan chat
Jul 12 01:51:49 <DocScrutinizer> fact: x-fade is on #harmattan
Jul 12 01:51:58 <cpscotti> true..actually all your arguments are good
Jul 12 01:52:12 <cpscotti> I changed my mind already.. I'm just bitchin
Jul 12 02:00:43 <lolcat> N950 == N9?
Jul 12 02:00:59 <DocScrutinizer> 0 = 1?
Jul 12 02:01:45 <lolcat> Is it diffrent devices?
Jul 12 02:01:56 <lolcat> And 1 = 0.9999999... so I am not really sure
Jul 12 02:02:12 <DocScrutinizer> lolcat: you've been on vacation last 3 weeks?
Jul 12 02:02:32 <SpeedEvil> N950 = N9 - pretty much.
Jul 12 02:02:43 <DocScrutinizer> nah
Jul 12 02:02:44 <SpeedEvil> The only truly major difference is lack of keyboard
Jul 12 02:02:57 <lolcat> N950 has a keyboard?
Jul 12 02:03:09 <DocScrutinizer> n950 = n9 + pretty much
Jul 12 02:03:40 <javispedro> n950 + amoled + nfc = n9 + keyboard
Jul 12 02:04:19 <DocScrutinizer> lolcat: a search on youtube will get you the most convenient fast track insight to catch up
Jul 12 02:04:26 <lolcat> Can I buy it?
Jul 12 02:04:30 <DocScrutinizer> no
Jul 12 02:04:46 <lolcat> Will I be able to buy it?
Jul 12 02:05:13 <DocScrutinizer> http://forum.meego.com/showthread.php?t=3597
Jul 12 02:05:20 <DocScrutinizer> and no
Jul 12 02:06:23 <lolcat> Dammit
Jul 12 02:06:41 <lolcat> I guess I will have to stick with this  Nokia phone I got for $60
Jul 12 02:06:56 <lolcat> It has a flashligth and can read what time it is in a female voice
Jul 12 02:07:20 <DocScrutinizer> now THAT'S COOL!
Jul 12 02:07:56 <lolcat> Yeah, who needs browsers and that BS when you can *listen* to what time it is
Jul 12 02:09:12 <SpeedEvil> http://maemo.org/packages/view/espeaktime-python/
Jul 12 02:10:00 <lolcat> SpeedEvil: This one has a dedicated button for it
Jul 12 02:10:25 <javispedro> bah
Jul 12 02:10:35 <javispedro> the query animation dialogs are different when using MTF or QML
Jul 12 02:10:57 <javispedro> this platform is going to be an amalgamation of a bazillion UI toolkits
Jul 12 02:11:12 <javispedro> all of them will have "Qt" somewhere in the name and none of them will really be the same.
Jul 12 02:11:14 <DocScrutinizer> yup
Jul 12 02:11:28 <derf> So just like real Linux!
Jul 12 02:12:01 <javispedro> except that the real Linux people still only know one Qt.
Jul 12 02:12:25 <derf> Well, Nokia does need to differentiate in order to succeed in the market.
Jul 12 02:13:06 <DocScrutinizer> seems atm Nokia does a hell of a job to differentiate from itself
Jul 12 02:14:04 <DocScrutinizer> there's a medical term for that, sth with sch...
Jul 12 02:14:26 <javispedro> it just surprises me that they really chose to reimplement everything with every new Qt-based-toolkit-of-the-week iteration
Jul 12 02:14:42 <javispedro> today's bingo says QML? reimplement all the animations in QML.
Jul 12 02:14:44 <DocScrutinizer> hey
Jul 12 02:15:19 <DocScrutinizer> didn't I call QML the "widget set flavour of the week" yesterday?
Jul 12 02:15:25 <javispedro> yes
Jul 12 02:16:37 <DocScrutinizer> javispedro: maybe you want to /join #harmattan?
Jul 12 02:17:25 * javispedro sighs
Jul 12 02:17:51 <DocScrutinizer> :-D
Jul 12 02:17:59 * javispedro indicates the large number of now unused IRC channels we allocated during the n900 launch
Jul 12 02:18:08 <DocScrutinizer> it's actually not been *my* idea
Jul 12 02:19:15 <DocScrutinizer> and I kicked #mer and #maemo-devel out of my autojoin just maybe a month ago ;-)
Jul 12 02:20:08 <DocScrutinizer> I think x-fade pondered where harmattan belongs to
Jul 12 02:56:35 <arvut> huppa!
Jul 12 02:59:35 <arvut> I made a very special cocktail to cure my throat (summer cold) : a quarter of a bud, boiled in some alcoholic herbal liquid called echinaforce (spelling?) and then kan jang added for extra strength! I'm gonna be cured by the morrow. =P
**** ENDING LOGGING AT Tue Jul 12 02:59:57 2011