**** BEGIN LOGGING AT Thu Nov 03 02:59:59 2011 Nov 03 04:21:32 ~joergtools Nov 03 04:21:47 ~jrtools Nov 03 04:21:48 methinks jrtools is http://wiki.maemo.org/User:Joerg_rw/tools Nov 03 04:27:00 meh, didn't get update because i didn't have mp-fremantle-generic-pr Nov 03 05:39:36 lol Nov 03 05:39:47 i was watching the e7 commercial on amazon Nov 03 05:39:59 and they showed the ovi store for a minute. and scrolled down a bit Nov 03 05:40:10 and i just thought to myself... "that's probably all it has" :) Nov 03 05:41:26 newbie question... How to turn the phone off in N900? Nov 03 05:41:49 press and hold the power button on top of the device? Nov 03 05:41:52 err Nov 03 05:42:16 that question is rather ambiguous, do you mean you want it to function as a pure tablet? Nov 03 05:42:36 psycho_oreos: sorry for my english ;p I mean the phone function, not the n900 itself Nov 03 05:43:22 LaoLang_cool_, press the power button once and it'll bring down a menu. Press tablet mode, that will switch off phone functionality Nov 03 05:43:42 oreos Nov 03 05:43:45 :o Nov 03 05:43:49 yummy Nov 03 05:44:44 psycho_oreos: oh, it's called offline mode here :) thank you! Nov 03 05:44:54 LaoLang_cool_, no worries Nov 03 05:45:35 weird how its called offline mode, it sounds almost like a symbian device or a maemo clone (with symbian instead of maemo) Nov 03 05:48:30 haha... "tablet mode" :) Nov 03 05:48:32 really? Nov 03 05:48:55 what's so funny about that? Nov 03 05:48:56 did you see the e7 commercial? the desktop looks maemoish Nov 03 05:49:14 i don't know. i just think the n900 is rather small to be considered a tablet Nov 03 05:49:16 on about E7 again.. gotta love symbian trolls Nov 03 05:49:33 i'm not.. just thought it was a nice phone.. but the desktop does look like maemo Nov 03 05:49:46 and the 770, N800, N810 are all too small to be `tablets' too? Nov 03 05:49:48 at least it reminded me of maemo... my n900 made it to california :) Nov 03 05:50:09 well.. they were larger .. even tho the res was the same Nov 03 05:50:27 larger by what? 1 whole inch? Nov 03 05:50:36 1" is a huge difference Nov 03 05:50:56 to you it is Nov 03 05:51:22 tell that to a woman :) Nov 03 05:51:22 gentlemen, discuss your sizes in private :) Nov 03 05:51:31 slonopotamus: hahaha Nov 03 05:51:49 psycho_oreos: size... really does matter :) Nov 03 05:51:59 for someone who hasn't been following the conversation, you just made yourself look more like a tool Nov 03 05:52:17 slonopotamus: did you notice the symbian home screen looks kind of like amamo? Nov 03 05:52:18 Macer, no, not when maemo has been largely considered as a tablet since its birth Nov 03 05:52:21 maybe it is the other way around Nov 03 05:52:38 Come on, sizes and tools elsewhere ;P Nov 03 05:52:58 a newton was a tablet as well.. but calling an n900 "with a phone built in" was kind of lame Nov 03 05:53:10 Macer: no, i didn't look at symbian. Nov 03 05:53:46 slonopotamus: it looks rather nice.. but i haven't bought one yet.. i am going to today or tomorrow tho... if it sucks i will use it as my everyday crap phone and put the n900 in a velvet case :) Nov 03 05:53:47 yet N900 doesn't even have complete proper functionalities that you would normally find in a normal smartphone.. irony? Nov 03 05:54:03 er... ok? Nov 03 05:54:09 i think it worked fine a s a phone Nov 03 05:54:18 it did voice and txts. what more do you want? :) Nov 03 05:54:29 * ShadowJK doesn't really need voice and text Nov 03 05:54:31 it's ok Nov 03 05:54:35 try to do that with meego! Nov 03 05:54:36 * slonopotamus personally doesn't care about *names*. i do care about functionality though. Nov 03 05:54:40 * Macer hides Nov 03 05:54:57 it doesn't do MMS, it doesn't have portrait by default, and I'm sure there's hordes of other missing functionalities that a smartphone normally features. Nov 03 05:55:14 oh.. you had "smart" in there Nov 03 05:55:15 it can with fmms Nov 03 05:55:20 i thought you jut meant "phone" Nov 03 05:55:21 heh Nov 03 05:55:26 Also doesn't do "Mobile TV", "Video Call", "Picture Sharing", "PTT", and a bunch of other stuff Nov 03 05:55:35 LaoLang_cool_, that's not included by default, neither was in integrated into conversations Nov 03 05:55:51 s/in/it/ Nov 03 05:55:51 psycho_oreos meant: LaoLang_cool_, that's not itcluded by default, neither was in integrated into conversations Nov 03 05:56:05 psycho_oreos: that's true, I'm experiencing with n900 for just half an hour ;p Nov 03 05:56:12 i ams ure it would have been had nokia not dropped the nokia ball Nov 03 05:56:24 er.. maemo ball Nov 03 05:56:39 * ShadowJK would've thought mms would fit better into email app Nov 03 05:56:49 care to elaborate on that note? Nov 03 05:56:57 ShadowJK: that would be nice Nov 03 05:56:58 * psycho_oreos points to Macer Nov 03 05:57:10 i always wish google would integrate google voice into google talk Nov 03 05:57:18 mms is clearly 'deliver to console' SMTP Nov 03 05:57:22 and if someone was unavailable it would txt Nov 03 05:57:30 SpeedEvil, and a dose of NIH Nov 03 05:57:37 but beggars can't be choosers :) Nov 03 05:57:38 but such are all 3gpp things Nov 03 05:57:58 psycho_oreos: sure.. they dropped maemo.. i thought that was a pretty obvious statement Nov 03 05:58:15 then turned around.. and dropped meego :) Nov 03 05:58:22 and symbian Nov 03 05:58:26 Macer, like as if that was ever news Nov 03 05:58:38 so how does that maketh maemo in the first place? Nov 03 05:58:40 uhm.. well.. you asked Nov 03 05:58:56 though MMS was never on their list of (planned) maemo features anyways :P Nov 03 05:59:18 ShadowJK: meh. they'd have put it in had it become a default nokia OS i'm sure Nov 03 05:59:41 but they were running around with their heads chopped off watching their stock price go into the gutter while apple and htc were skyrocketing Nov 03 06:00:06 they didn't and still don't have a concept of default os :P Nov 03 06:00:24 sure theyd o.. windows mobile Nov 03 06:00:28 :) Nov 03 06:00:33 no Nov 03 06:00:51 they had plenty of concepts.. just no follow through Nov 03 06:00:54 S40, if anything, is the default Nov 03 06:01:06 not S60? Nov 03 06:01:28 S60 was renamed symbian, and is getting phased out and replaced by windows Nov 03 06:01:46 either way... all i said was that the home screen on the e7 ooks rther similar to a maemo home screen Nov 03 06:01:49 i jut thought it odd Nov 03 06:01:55 argh.. damn transformer keyboard Nov 03 06:02:17 but... the e7 does look pretty nice even if it is obsolete Nov 03 06:02:39 symbian had a bit of potential left... then again tho.. all nokia mobile operating systems did... they just didn't want to stick with them Nov 03 06:04:17 THe only potential in symbian was that they might port QT to it, which would give a sane programming environment, but then, might just as well have used maemo underneath instead Nov 03 06:04:20 maemo/meego Nov 03 06:04:34 fair point Nov 03 06:07:56 blah. let me just buy an e7 off amazon right now. it looks like a pretty fair phone Nov 03 06:08:36 even though i know i will be shooting myself in the foot expecting anything new to come out for it... it will make for a good secondary phone when my usb port breaks on my new n900 :) Nov 03 06:09:31 The only nice thing about it is that is has a keyboard :P Nov 03 06:10:26 heh Nov 03 06:10:45 so does my g2... but it is a total piece of absolute crap Nov 03 06:10:55 more like the design inspired the N950 to look almost identical to E7 Nov 03 06:11:13 psycho_oreos: i would give anything in the world to put maemo on an e7 :) Nov 03 06:11:17 or meego Nov 03 06:11:25 that woudl be absolutely awesome.. but never going to happen Nov 03 06:11:40 Doesn't meet the minimum CPU requirements for meego, for one Nov 03 06:11:56 isn't it like a 600MHz arm? Nov 03 06:11:57 I'd rather get N950 instead and be happy Nov 03 06:11:59 it doesn't? what does it run? Nov 03 06:12:12 arm11 cpu Nov 03 06:12:14 geez.. these mobile operating systems are just being selfish nowadays Nov 03 06:12:17 :) Nov 03 06:12:19 orly? Nov 03 06:12:20 it runs symbian by default Nov 03 06:48:39 -sh: /home/user/.bashrc: line 5: cannot create /dev/cgroup/cpu/user/2526/tasks: nonexistent directory Nov 03 06:48:42 -sh: /home/user/.bashrc: line 5: cannot create /dev/cgroup/cpu/user/2526/notify_on_release: nonexistent directory Nov 03 06:48:46 did anyone receive this error ? just when u open terminal Nov 03 06:51:51 Juozapas, did you copy your .bashrc from desktop machine? Nov 03 06:53:29 nope Nov 03 06:55:01 actually i saw this error only once, just after healthcheck install. I open terminal for something, then i saw it and tried reboot. After reboot everything looks ok but anyway I'm curious what was/is wrong Nov 03 07:32:01 hmm, swipe is not smooth enough in n900 Nov 03 07:58:43 ehlo Nov 03 08:00:35 RST38h, o/ Nov 03 08:21:47 is anyone else having issues this morning with connecting to their yahoo messenger account with Conversation? i've tried removing the removing the server entry as suggested on the maemo forum,but when i click save and come back to it, the server entry is back Nov 03 08:24:40 just connected fine Nov 03 08:25:35 u have 5050 as your port, right? Nov 03 08:37:20 Sicelo: yes 5050 Nov 03 08:39:30 must be your operator then. mine also does strange stuff at times, eg unable to refresh feeds via gprs, complaining of parsing errors, while same feeds refresh without problems via wlan Nov 03 09:19:45 What is the browserd program? It takes up 93% CPU on the phone continuously. Nov 03 09:20:14 heh, just noticed on 3G i can update the feeds, but not 2G, meh Nov 03 09:22:04 afaik browserd is the browser/web engine. you can kill it as user (not root). of course, it will re-spawn Nov 03 09:23:17 Sicelo: and why does it take that much CPU? Nov 03 09:23:20 Sicelo: bug? Nov 03 09:25:30 The first Google hit is basically "Dude! Search for the answer..." Nov 03 09:29:57 rly: it's a web browser Nov 03 09:30:17 try killing it Nov 03 09:30:21 it may help Nov 03 09:30:33 unless you have browser currently open Nov 03 09:30:41 with some flash stuff in it and whatnot Nov 03 09:31:15 jacekowski: yes, the problem had already been solved. Nov 03 09:31:35 jacekowski: I was just complaining about spam topics on talk.maemo.org. Nov 03 09:31:50 And more specifically Google's inability to parse those. Nov 03 09:37:54 neither 3g nor wlan let's Conversations sign on to yahoo,but skype & google talk work fine Nov 03 09:53:07 are the pidgin protocols for Conversations still being maintained? no update in over a year... Nov 03 10:16:27 What is the 'network manager' mentioned on http://wiki.maemo.org/N900_USB_networking#Using_USB_networking_for_Maemo_applications? Nov 03 10:22:04 the status menu button where u choose which connection to use Nov 03 10:40:38 LANG=C ifconfig usb0 192.168.2.14 Nov 03 10:40:40 SIOCSIFADDR: No such device Nov 03 10:40:42 usb0: ERROR while getting interface flags: No such device Nov 03 10:41:05 Do I need to do something special to obtain an usb0 device? Nov 03 10:41:15 I have enough usb ports. Nov 03 10:43:24 rly where are you trying to do it? Nov 03 10:43:24 on computer? Nov 03 10:43:24 ZogG: not on the phone, on the computer. Nov 03 10:43:24 you need to run it on nokia Nov 03 10:43:24 try to run it on phone Nov 03 10:43:24 For a typical Linux computer, one might use the command "ifconfig usb0 192.168.2.14" (add "sudo" to the beginning of that command if necessary). Nov 03 10:43:25 Then why do the instructions say the wrong thing? Nov 03 10:43:25 rly does it? Nov 03 10:43:25 Yes Nov 03 10:43:25 lemme see Nov 03 10:43:28 This context says 'a typical Linux computer', which clearly isn't talking about the phone. Nov 03 10:43:57 It's also talking about the 'host', which also isn't the phone. Nov 03 10:45:19 rly, cat /boot/config |grep -i USB_eth Nov 03 10:45:38 what linux do you use? Nov 03 10:45:42 ZogG: Debian Nov 03 10:45:53 rly ^ Nov 03 10:45:57 wait Nov 03 10:45:58 cat /boot/config |grep -i USB_eth Nov 03 10:46:14 ZogG: that command says 'file or directory does not exists'. Nov 03 10:46:27 rly sudo mount /boot Nov 03 10:46:46 ZogG: it's just that the symbolic link does not exist. Nov 03 10:46:53 just a moment ZogG, rly Nov 03 10:46:54 ZogG: but I have no USB_eth there. Nov 03 10:47:09 rly: did u choose PC suite mode? Nov 03 10:47:20 Sicelo: that's the next step. Nov 03 10:47:21 Sicelo i think it doesn't matter Nov 03 10:47:29 Sicelo: I didn't complete this step yet. Nov 03 10:47:41 Sicelo he might not have module/driver to use usb for network Nov 03 10:47:54 ZogG: it matters Nov 03 10:48:10 Sicelo, what distro do you use? Nov 03 10:48:14 I am running 2.6.32 Nov 03 10:48:23 isn't that something like cdc_phonet? Nov 03 10:48:29 rly: that's not second step. iface won't be there if u haven't selected pc suite mode Nov 03 10:48:32 well most of the cdc related modules Nov 03 10:48:41 ZogG: debian 6 Nov 03 10:49:02 cdc_ether as well Nov 03 10:49:16 ok, time to figure out which of the things on my "stuff I wanna investigate" list to do next Nov 03 10:49:27 rly.. u should follow the wiki step by step.. first pc suite mode, then ifconfig usb0 192.168.2.14 on pc, then ifup usb0 on N900 Nov 03 10:49:41 Sicelo: where does the wiki say first pc suite mode? Nov 03 10:50:10 Sicelo: by that I mean, that it doesn't say that. Nov 03 10:50:19 http://wiki.maemo.org/N900_USB_networking#Starting_USB_network_mode Nov 03 10:50:44 jonwil, any plans to release that bit of info on cell tower broadcast messages? I'm curious to give it a stab if its not too complicated :D Nov 03 10:50:51 err code rather Nov 03 10:51:00 rly he is right Nov 03 10:51:04 Sicelo: It says: 'first setup the host' Nov 03 10:51:24 ZogG: please explain that then. Nov 03 10:51:39 ZogG: because the Wiki surely says something different from my reading. Nov 03 10:51:43 well, do it the way i said then Nov 03 10:51:57 first pc suite mode, then ifconfig usb0 192.168.2.14 on pc, then ifup usb0 on N900 Nov 03 10:52:20 rly it doesn't it explaines in the begging what it should do and than all steps Nov 03 10:53:55 http://lists.maemo.org/pipermail/maemo-developers/2011-October/028685.html has all the Cell Broadcast SMS stuff that I have done so far Nov 03 10:54:04 as well i bet if Sicelo has debian and he says what to do, he did it himself and know better Nov 03 10:54:05 well not quite, I am still making tweaks to the algorithim Nov 03 10:54:19 cool thanks, going to have a look :D Nov 03 10:54:57 jonwil what is for? Nov 03 10:54:59 works pretty good on my phone so far :) Nov 03 10:55:06 its for Cell Broadcast SMS Nov 03 10:55:48 \0/ jonwil Nov 03 10:56:01 to me its something like it'll change your operator name (from your device) to the suburb of your nearest cell tower Nov 03 10:56:07 jonwil don't know what it is Nov 03 10:56:09 err the name rather Nov 03 10:56:21 thats what it is Nov 03 10:56:41 it grabs any cell broadcast tower name/id messages sent by the tower Nov 03 10:56:43 and displays them Nov 03 10:57:17 ZogG, I know for my old N95-1 you can turn that feature on, so you can get the name of your provider along the actual name of the cell ID rather than just numbers or in this case with maemo nothing actually appears Nov 03 10:57:52 no clue what are you talking about Nov 03 10:58:04 you mean when you get sms from your operator or any sms? Nov 03 10:58:12 and what and where it should show? Nov 03 10:59:38 what happens is that some operators send out a tower name or ID Nov 03 10:59:48 which is what gets displayed by my code Nov 03 11:00:45 Why do I lose my wifi connection when I connect via USB? Nov 03 11:00:48 I'm looking for screenshots as my current N95-1 does not have a proper sim card so it cannot be registered but you get something like this on the top part of the screen: The signal level from provider, the connection type (2G,3G,3.5G), The name of the operator in all capitals followed by the name of the nearest connected cell tower's name (usually its the name of the suburb) along with the battery level Nov 03 11:01:03 I want that they all work at the same time. Nov 03 11:01:16 You loose wifi because you can only have one network connection at once Nov 03 11:01:18 rly: N900 can have only one connection at a time, afaik. Nov 03 11:01:32 so WiFi or USB or 3G or whatever Nov 03 11:01:41 How inconvenient. Nov 03 11:01:47 Any other phone which does multiple? Nov 03 11:02:02 Nokia 9300i :P Nov 03 11:02:28 icd rewrites the default gw each time you change the connection type. In theory you can be connected to more than one gateways but with an ugly hack and with default gw pointing to either one Nov 03 11:03:07 well I have some ICD related things on my todo Nov 03 11:03:23 psycho_oreos: icd? Nov 03 11:03:43 icd is what handles your network connection Nov 03 11:03:58 rly, internet connection daemon, part of maemo Nov 03 11:04:09 ZogG, "Some mobile operators use Cell Broadcast for communicating the area code of the antenna cell to the mobile user (via channel 050), for nationwide or citywide alerting, weather reports, mass messaging, location based news, etc. Not all operators have the Cell Broadcast messaging function activated in their network yet, and many handsets do not have the capability to support cell broadcast." - quote from wikipedia Nov 03 11:06:49 If that doesn't really help you then I'm afraid you have loads of reading to do ahead of you :p. Its a really nifty stuff if you're familiar with networking along with wireless networking, in fact the same set of knowledge goes on top of wireless networking really. Nov 03 11:07:51 I can ping yahoo.com, and I get an ip address, but nothing comes back. Nov 03 11:08:48 rly ... u need that script from yesterday again :P Nov 03 11:09:05 Not sure what I should work on next Nov 03 11:09:20 N900 is on a different subnet. 192.168.2... Nov 03 11:10:18 * psycho_oreos thinks the stuff in tmo bugjars might be worth revisiting jonwil ;) if you're keen Nov 03 11:10:36 which stuff specifically? Nov 03 11:10:58 point me at actual n900 system software bugs in closed source software worth looking at Nov 03 11:11:30 well that depends on your interest lol, umm Nov 03 11:11:35 Sicelo: I also have two default routes. Nov 03 11:11:41 Sicelo: that also seems wrong. Nov 03 11:11:51 I just don't get how people make this stuff so complicated. Nov 03 11:12:11 these routes are on N900? Nov 03 11:12:13 There is no need for all this complexity. Nov 03 11:12:14 hmmm, I could work on icd or browser bits or connectivity widgets or the lockscreen stuff Nov 03 11:12:15 Sicelo: yes Nov 03 11:12:24 default 192.168.2.111 0.0.0.0 UG 0 0 0 usb0 Nov 03 11:12:26 default 10.42.43.1 0.0.0.0 UG 0 0 0 wlan0 Nov 03 11:13:02 what is 192.168.2.111? Nov 03 11:13:11 looks like two default gateway define there, not a good idea Nov 03 11:13:24 s/define/defined/ Nov 03 11:13:24 psycho_oreos meant: looks like two default gateway defined there, not a good idea Nov 03 11:14:10 hmm where was that bugjar page. I swear I saw it somewhere.. might just be a thread Nov 03 11:14:11 rly... usb0 on pc side should be 192.168.2.14. that's how N900 wants it Nov 03 11:18:01 Sicelo: I have that. Nov 03 11:18:56 jonwil, hmm my bad, it seems like its only for extras, so these are per program specifics rather than what I thought it would have been the specific closed bits and pieces which requires attention: http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=37106 Nov 03 11:19:27 according to that dumped route output, it doesn't appear to be Nov 03 11:19:50 and two default gateway flags defined (hint `UG') is not a good idea Nov 03 11:20:40 psycho_oreos: now I have one route. Nov 03 11:20:52 let's see it Nov 03 11:20:54 default 192.168.2.111 0.0.0.0 UG 0 0 0 usb0 Nov 03 11:21:01 192.168.2.0 * 255.255.255.0 U 0 0 0 usb0 Nov 03 11:21:10 I switched the order of the lines. Nov 03 11:21:25 the default gateway is still pointing to 192.168.2.111 as opposed to what Sicelo previously mentioned 192.168.2.14 Nov 03 11:21:40 But I configured it to be 192.168.2.111. Nov 03 11:22:05 :/ Nov 03 11:22:08 I used 192.168.2.111 where the instructions said 192.168.2.14 Nov 03 11:22:13 then iptables, etc needs to be adjusted accordingly Nov 03 11:22:28 Is 192.168.2.14 a magic number? Nov 03 11:22:36 I'd hope not. Nov 03 11:23:14 no, its just the way things should work. If it works (for starters) you can then later on change it to whatever you want instead of changing to whatever you want initially and not caring about what wiki states Nov 03 11:24:22 i.e. you don't go changing things if you're not completely aware of what needs to be changed. Nobody will mock/laugh at you even if you used the default config from the wiki page, but if you decide to go about your own way without even testing what is mentioned on the wiki, it over complicates things Nov 03 11:24:27 Ok, how do I bring down the usb0 interface? Nov 03 11:24:35 ifdown usb0 doesn't work. Nov 03 11:24:38 ifconfig usb0 down? Nov 03 11:24:54 That does work. Nov 03 11:24:59 ifdown would require those network scripts Nov 03 11:27:01 psycho_oreos: well put \0/ Nov 03 11:27:36 heh ta Nov 03 11:29:10 also its not really a `magic' number as per se. I have three N900 here, two of my N900 have been properly configured for USB networking. The first N900 uses the wiki stated configs, and the second one uses a slightly different setup (different subnet, different IP address and therefore different gateway). Nov 03 11:34:28 psycho_oreos: ok, I can ssh via usb to the phone, but I cannot ping google.com Nov 03 11:34:50 your /etc/resolv.conf Nov 03 11:35:00 :/ no Nov 03 11:35:02 ^ Nov 03 11:35:21 better yet add google DNS entries Nov 03 11:36:04 psycho_oreos: I did that. Nov 03 11:36:15 i think you will need also iptables to do NAT between usb0 on your laptop and it's external interface Nov 03 11:36:22 that's how i used to do it Nov 03 11:37:24 also make sure you have enabled ip_forwarding in the unix proc Nov 03 11:37:51 yesterday's script rly ;) Nov 03 11:38:03 Sicelo: this is not on my laptop. Nov 03 11:38:16 It also appears that I lost name lookups on this machine now?! Nov 03 11:38:29 it doesn't matter. what ever other machine u are using, lol Nov 03 11:40:30 If I break the N900 connection, my machine can visit websites again. Nov 03 11:41:16 improperly configured routing/firewall can cause that Nov 03 11:42:25 I now enabled the forwarding. Nov 03 11:42:43 I don't even have a firewall, AFAIK. Nov 03 11:43:26 *facepalms*, that is what you're supposed to do pretty much at the beginning, as per noted from wiki... also linux always has firewall by default, its just doesn't come configured and its called iptables Nov 03 11:43:43 s/configured/preconfigured/ Nov 03 11:43:43 psycho_oreos meant: *facepalms*, that is what you're supposed to do pretty much at the beginning, as per noted from wiki... also linux always has firewall by default, its just doesn't come preconfigured and its called iptables Nov 03 11:44:41 psycho_oreos: where does it say that on the wiki? Nov 03 11:44:51 psycho_oreos: I mean an actual quote. Nov 03 11:46:49 It isn't mentioned here: http://wiki.maemo.org/N900_USB_networking Nov 03 11:47:12 rly, its mentioned under host configuration sections Nov 03 11:47:14 rly.... it is mentioned, Nov 03 11:47:44 and i have countlesss time pointed u to a script that automatically does it for you.. Nov 03 11:47:57 all u supply is the two interfaces involved Nov 03 11:50:28 Did anything change between Lenny and Squeeze for configuring this stuff? Nov 03 11:51:03 nothing Nov 03 11:51:41 i used this cript on knoppix (based on lenny) & now on squeeze Nov 03 11:56:02 How to open multi xterm on N900? Nov 03 11:56:08 Sicelo: the script from the wiki? Nov 03 11:56:16 Sicelo: or the one you mentioned yesterday? Nov 03 11:56:30 Again, I lose Internet after executing all those commands. Nov 03 11:56:44 Or rather, I lose DNS queries. Nov 03 11:56:52 And pings. Nov 03 11:57:11 The only reason IRC remains working is probably because there already is a connection. Nov 03 11:57:35 the one i mentioned. btw, what machine/os is that that keeps losing dns... and how is it connected to internet? Nov 03 11:58:43 Can I paste 6 lines here? Nov 03 11:58:54 The Web doesn't actually work now. Nov 03 11:59:27 Or go to #mypastes Nov 03 12:26:11 hmmm, maybe I might try and clone the wifi/network status widget Nov 03 12:27:30 Cant get much further with the cbsms stuff since I dont know enough about gconf and hildon-control-panel Nov 03 12:28:02 oh snap, that value is in miliseconds not seconds Nov 03 12:28:07 so I gotta do yet another respin Nov 03 12:28:55 wth is amazon prime? Nov 03 12:30:57 It's free shipping in exchange for a subscription. Nov 03 12:31:43 free 2 day shipping ;) Nov 03 12:32:07 the shipping might actually be worth the $79/year Nov 03 12:32:31 but then again i don't usually order more than a couple things a year from amazon so maybe not :) Nov 03 12:33:06 I got a free trial of it, which was handy, as I got afree shipping on a couple of items. Nov 03 12:33:10 Don't forget to cancel. Nov 03 12:33:18 haha Nov 03 12:33:25 i'm sure it won't stay at 79/year for long Nov 03 12:33:38 nor will it continue to have a free tiral because of people like you :) Nov 03 12:33:40 hahaha Nov 03 12:33:47 Sure it will. Nov 03 12:33:52 People like me are factored in. Nov 03 12:34:00 And people like me that forget to cancel it. Nov 03 12:34:07 you think? Nov 03 12:34:15 that is a huge chunk to lose on shipping costs Nov 03 12:34:19 It's been around that price for some time. Nov 03 12:34:30 Amazon tends to pay really quite small amounts on shipping. Nov 03 12:35:05 then why do they charge $10 for 2day shipping on an e7? Nov 03 12:35:19 weight vs price seems off when dealing with shipping pricing Nov 03 12:35:40 it is just whatever someone decides to charge you for putting it in a box it seems Nov 03 12:35:44 Amazon shipping is complex. Nov 03 12:36:02 As a retailer, amazon takes their cut of the shipping fee. Nov 03 12:36:10 Even if they don't touch the product. Nov 03 12:36:29 that seems rotten Nov 03 12:36:36 Meh. Nov 03 12:36:49 my n900 left california Nov 03 12:36:52 * DocScrutinizer moos violently Nov 03 12:36:54 en route to chicago from hk :) Nov 03 12:37:25 only took about a week to get to california .. i'm kind of impressed Nov 03 12:37:55 * DocScrutinizer wishes Nokia had provided him with a tracking number Nov 03 12:38:10 makes me wonder why it took me 2 months to get a package in iraq via usps.. but a pkg from ebay shipped from hk takes 2 weeks Nov 03 12:38:21 tracking number for which? replacement N950? Nov 03 12:38:50 you had to replace an n950? rather new isn't it? Nov 03 12:39:11 can't say i'm surprised after sending in my brand new transformer to be repaired for a screen with bad pixels Nov 03 12:42:38 hmmm, what to work on next. http://pastebin.com/5gCdnJwT is the list of things I am thinking about working on, anyone want to suggest specific ideas from that list I should do? Nov 03 12:44:22 is the wireless cal stuff interesting if you can jsut flash the gloal image? Nov 03 12:44:37 Also - what tutorial applet? Nov 03 12:45:07 the "getting started" applet, the one that runs that swf file Nov 03 12:45:23 its basically a browser window with a swf file in it Nov 03 12:45:32 but it would be a great example of how to embed a browser window Nov 03 12:46:11 Ah! Nov 03 12:46:18 Kernel IP routing table Nov 03 12:46:20 Destination Gateway Genmask Flags Metric Ref Use Iface Nov 03 12:46:22 192.168.2.0 * 255.255.255.0 U 0 0 0 n900 Nov 03 12:46:24 192.168.2.0 * 255.255.255.0 U 1 0 0 eth0 Nov 03 12:46:25 as for the wl1251-cal stuff, going to remove it from the list Nov 03 12:46:26 default 192.168.2.1 0.0.0.0 UG 0 0 0 eth0 Nov 03 12:46:29 I have that routing table. Why can't I ping 192.168.2.1? Nov 03 12:46:44 dont think its actually worth further work now that I think about it Nov 03 12:46:53 psycho_oreos: hostmode N9 Nov 03 12:47:00 rly: Is the other side proeprly configured? Nov 03 12:47:13 SpeedEvil: define other Nov 03 12:47:25 Other side of the cable Nov 03 12:47:26 how do i forward an SMS in Conversations? anybody know? Nov 03 12:47:33 so any ideas for what I should do from my list? Nov 03 12:47:41 SpeedEvil: I am currently using that connection to chat. Nov 03 12:47:44 DocScrutinizer, ahh I see.. wait what? hostmode N9? you mean in other words N9 doesn't normally come with hostmode? hmm no that doesn't sound right either Nov 03 12:47:48 SpeedEvil: so, I think it is, yes :) Nov 03 12:48:00 SpeedEvil: also, when I break the n900 connection, it works. Nov 03 12:48:17 nevermind. found out how Nov 03 12:48:24 Operator-name into extras? Nov 03 12:48:25 psycho_oreos: N9 comes with hostmode? BWAHAHAAAHA Nov 03 12:48:43 DocScrutinizer: N8 does Nov 03 12:48:49 I know Nov 03 12:48:53 N8 FTW Nov 03 12:48:59 FTL Nov 03 12:49:02 DocScrutinizer: can you have a look at the above routing table? Nov 03 12:49:04 WTF Nov 03 12:49:12 rly: no Nov 03 12:49:17 DocScrutinizer: can you have a look at the above routing table, please? Nov 03 12:49:47 DocScrutinizer, I remember seeing a thread about N9 charing N900 or something.. I could be wrong however but if N9 doesn't do hostmode, that's yet again another crippling feature thanks to Flop Nov 03 12:49:49 If you can use the connection, not pinging isn't a routing thing. Nov 03 12:49:57 s/charing/charging/ Nov 03 12:49:58 psycho_oreos meant: DocScrutinizer, I remember seeing a thread about N9 charging N900 or something.. I could be wrong however but if N9 doesn't do hostmode, that's yet again another crippling feature thanks to Flop Nov 03 12:50:13 The connection is dropping ping, for some reason, or the client on the other end is not responding to pings Nov 03 12:50:16 cant really work on operator-name-cbs-widget because I dont have the skills to do the config stuff really Nov 03 12:50:20 ah Nov 03 12:50:22 psycho_oreos: N900 didn't have hostmode Nov 03 12:50:26 psycho_oreos: and that was before elop Nov 03 12:50:30 SpeedEvil: I also cannot browse websites right now. Nov 03 12:50:40 SpeedEvil: I cannot ping any place on the internet. Nov 03 12:50:41 rly: can you tcpdump on the other side? Nov 03 12:50:52 jacekowski, by default it doesn't but they were hastening to release N900 anyway at the time Nov 03 12:51:01 SpeedEvil: no, that's my router, which has been functioning correctly for basically forever. Nov 03 12:51:04 any other suggestions from my list guys? Nov 03 12:51:09 rly: This is usb-ether? Nov 03 12:51:16 SpeedEvil: yes Nov 03 12:51:35 SpeedEvil: so Router <=> PC <=> USB-ether phone Nov 03 12:51:46 I'm unsure - most of it seems reasonable. Nov 03 12:51:47 jonwil, none that I can think of to be frank. Other than making wl1251 do master mode? that's almost literally impossible Nov 03 12:51:52 SpeedEvil: PC <=> Phone works. Nov 03 12:51:57 rly: ah Nov 03 12:52:09 rly: you need to setup NAT/masquerading on the PC Nov 03 12:52:12 SpeedEvil: and normally I can ping my router just OK. Nov 03 12:52:20 Or point-point route to the router Nov 03 12:52:28 you can ping the PC? Can you ping the router? Nov 03 12:52:32 allow-hotplug n900 Nov 03 12:52:33 SpeedEvil: somebody here is talking him into bridging Nov 03 12:52:33 auto n900 Nov 03 12:52:35 iface n900 inet static Nov 03 12:52:37 address 192.168.2.14 Nov 03 12:52:39 netmask 255.255.255.0 Nov 03 12:52:41 up iptables -A POSTROUTING -t nat -s 192.168.2.15/32 -j MASQUERADE Nov 03 12:52:43 up echo 1 > /proc/sys/net/ipv4/ip_forward Nov 03 12:52:45 down iptables -D POSTROUTING -t nat -s 192.168.2.15/32 -j MASQUERADE Nov 03 12:52:47 down echo 0 > /proc/sys/net/ipv4/ip_forward Nov 03 12:52:49 You mean like this? Nov 03 12:52:51 you need the right modules Nov 03 12:52:51 I did that. Nov 03 12:53:01 SpeedEvil: I didn't do that. Nov 03 12:53:06 If you don't have the masq module/configured in - it won't work Nov 03 12:53:08 SpeedEvil: which modules? Nov 03 12:53:14 hmmm, I think I might do the connectivity widgets Nov 03 12:53:21 i.e. the wifi status bar gizmo Nov 03 12:53:25 jacekowski, also had Flop not came around, maybe we would have seen N950 been properly sold.. not these stupid qwerty-less variants.. and with N950 only be given to developers under some stupid contract and if they damage their N950, they won't get a replacement (like what happened to MohammadAG) Nov 03 12:53:34 an open clone of that might help Nov 03 12:53:58 psycho_oreos: err - MohammadAG was given a replacement, that Israeli customs are pondering exploding. Nov 03 12:54:08 But that's not really nokias fault. Nov 03 12:54:22 SpeedEvil: which modules? http://wiki.maemo.org/N900_USB_networking#Using_USB_networking_for_Maemo_applications doesn't mention those. Nov 03 12:54:27 SpeedEvil, yet he was entitled to get another one should customs lose it, no? Nov 03 12:54:41 SpeedEvil: they've exploded his replacement n950? Nov 03 12:54:47 it's actually MohammadAG 's fault more and more - he ought have reported to Nokia DDP some weeks ago, so sender could have complained Nov 03 12:54:52 * jonwil wonders what Israeli customs has against Nokia handsets anyway Nov 03 12:54:54 Also, why doesn't it say "cannot understand configuration" or something like that. Nov 03 12:54:56 psycho_oreos: how many replacements you can send Nov 03 12:55:12 rly: you need the right modules on the PC side Nov 03 12:55:36 jacekowski, I've not sent any and I won't be sending any of mine to nokia care anyway. It'll probably never get returned because they want to get rid of maemo users Nov 03 12:55:55 * SpeedEvil suspects his n900 has been thrown in a bin today. Nov 03 12:56:01 SpeedEvil: yes, but which modules? Nov 03 12:56:07 (should have arrived at the repair centre today) Nov 03 12:56:08 psycho_oreos: there are better phones around Nov 03 12:56:21 jacekowski, there's none equivalent to N900, period Nov 03 12:56:22 and maemo doesn't have enough applications to make it work Nov 03 12:56:23 rly: I forget the details - they are the iptables modules dealing with masq Nov 03 12:56:34 at least not in mainstream Nov 03 12:56:46 nokia lumia has a chance to pick up in mainstream Nov 03 12:56:50 jacekowski, at least not sold in a fashionable way that you can use Nov 03 12:56:58 lumia is full of fail Nov 03 12:57:04 like what? Nov 03 12:57:18 wp7 woes? Nov 03 12:57:26 e7 comes hostmode as well :) Nov 03 12:57:26 with wp7 nokia has a partner that can and will spend a lot of money on marketing Nov 03 12:57:29 * Macer hides Nov 03 12:57:43 heh, yeah, MS marketing is rad Nov 03 12:57:44 wp7 is fail period Nov 03 12:57:45 with n9 nokia was alone pretty much Nov 03 12:57:46 :p Nov 03 12:57:50 seen that list of woes with wp7 as shallimus on tmo put on his signature? Nov 03 12:57:55 jacekowski: i think the networks would market it more than MS Nov 03 12:58:01 look at how much they market android :) Nov 03 12:58:18 Macer: well, regardless, somebody will market it Nov 03 12:58:27 maemo, not so much Nov 03 12:58:29 spinning turd around Nov 03 12:58:35 and they have to think about what is going to sell Nov 03 12:58:38 i think ms will have to suck the bill up for that one Nov 03 12:58:53 nobody wants to market it for them since android and ios do so well Nov 03 12:58:56 psycho_oreos: i will bet that n900 was one of lowest selling phones Nov 03 12:59:01 too bad having good marketing doesn't help if you just want a good phone like n900 Nov 03 12:59:04 i used a winmob phone. it reminded me of a zune Nov 03 12:59:04 :) Nov 03 12:59:21 jacekowski, so what if it is? it has the features and the functionalities I pretty much need Nov 03 12:59:28 jacekowski: only because they stopped making them :) Nov 03 12:59:33 psycho_oreos: they are not going to make phone only for you Nov 03 12:59:44 psycho_oreos: you can't support whole company Nov 03 12:59:54 psycho_oreos: they HAVE to think about what is going to make them money Nov 03 12:59:55 jacekowski, did I say I needed to support a fail company? Nov 03 13:00:01 exactly Nov 03 13:00:04 they don't care about you Nov 03 13:00:18 i think swapping to winmob was a good move for nokia Nov 03 13:00:18 jacekowski, I have to THINK? umm no Nov 03 13:00:24 they can keep "professionals" on their phones Nov 03 13:00:33 and integrated exchange probably works way better on a windows phone Nov 03 13:00:33 but that's ok, time will tell if their mango handsets sell Nov 03 13:00:56 its all rubbish with microsoft and apple suing the living hell out of google Nov 03 13:01:01 SpeedEvil: iptables -A POSTROUTING -t nat -s 192.168.2.15/32 -j MASQUERADE # executes correctly. Nov 03 13:01:06 don't forget oracle :-P Nov 03 13:01:27 you are masqing a phone? Nov 03 13:01:34 lol Nov 03 13:01:34 jacekowski, the bottom line is that Flop was fail from beginning Nov 03 13:01:52 flop is what they call meego nowadays? Nov 03 13:01:58 psycho_oreos: no Nov 03 13:02:02 Macer: I want to be able to ping my router on my PC and ping the phone on 192.168.2.15. Nov 03 13:02:11 jacekowski, and no I don't have high demands, I'm not the sort of person that would care to buy new nokias as they roll out onto the shops Nov 03 13:02:32 rly: then why are you going through all that? if they are connected to the same wifi router it should just work Nov 03 13:02:33 jacekowski, its ok, we shall see if this turd burger, ahem mango flies Nov 03 13:02:34 psycho_oreos: nokia has to think about what will sell Nov 03 13:02:45 psycho_oreos: maemo didn't sell Nov 03 13:02:46 Macer: don't complicate things. Nov 03 13:02:49 jacekowski, and they chose mango, wise choice.. yes wise choice indeed Nov 03 13:02:51 uhm Nov 03 13:02:55 Macer: this is usb over ethernet. Nov 03 13:02:59 psycho_oreos: people said same thing about iOS Nov 03 13:03:01 oh Nov 03 13:03:02 Macer: ethernet over usb. Nov 03 13:03:03 jacekowski, maemo was what? wasn't it a niche market for starters? Nov 03 13:03:27 that seems like a bad way to do it :) Nov 03 13:03:27 jacekowski, except iOS was quite different fyi, have a look at ipods Nov 03 13:03:39 psycho_oreos: and yet, in 4 years iOS has a majority of market Nov 03 13:03:42 jacekowski, ipods were the one that created the trend for iphones Nov 03 13:03:44 so you're just using the phone as a wifi adapter? Nov 03 13:04:04 i guess that is a pretty good thing to do now that i think about it... a quick wifi adapter for those on the go moments Nov 03 13:04:30 psycho_oreos: doesn't matter, it sells Nov 03 13:04:36 jacekowski, again its not iOS alone that did the job, you do realise ipod created the trend and because people generally have fetish over apple products.. afterall we all know that apple has been a huge anti PC competitor since its birth Nov 03 13:04:37 psycho_oreos: maemo didn't sell enough to support whole company Nov 03 13:05:03 symbian is almost dead as well Nov 03 13:05:09 jacekowski: actually .... android has the majority of the market now ;) Nov 03 13:05:11 jacekowski, and so they chose windows apart from all the other possible solutions? wise choice indeed.. Nov 03 13:05:18 in less time than ios too Nov 03 13:05:19 psycho_oreos: like what? Nov 03 13:05:26 heh Nov 03 13:05:28 jacekowski, like what Flop did Nov 03 13:05:43 psycho_oreos: i mean other possible solutions Nov 03 13:05:45 psycho_oreos: name them Nov 03 13:05:54 Macer: well, they both have big part of the market Nov 03 13:05:58 psycho_oreos: macs are PCs :) Nov 03 13:05:58 you have android, you have symbian, you have bada, you have meego Nov 03 13:06:12 Macer, these days they are but they're not completely identical to PC :รพ Nov 03 13:06:16 they were competitors when they were ppc.. now they are just PCs with a different OS Nov 03 13:06:32 Macer, they still don't use BIOS, they use EFI fyi Nov 03 13:06:36 jacekowski, ^^^ Nov 03 13:07:02 who said about no other choice jacekowski? who said nokia had to choose microsoft? Nov 03 13:07:06 psycho_oreos: symbian is dying, bada is not fully open source yet and it's Nov 03 13:07:28 jacekowski, and symbian had how much of market share at the time? Nov 03 13:07:35 now? Nov 03 13:07:38 30% maybe Nov 03 13:07:53 jacekowski, which countries produces symbian clones for various lookalike handsets? Nov 03 13:08:05 lol Nov 03 13:08:26 jacekowski, and don't forget that nokia WAS one of the top manufacturers for handsets way before Flop came in Nov 03 13:08:32 no Nov 03 13:08:39 they weren't Nov 03 13:08:46 they sales were going down before elop came in Nov 03 13:08:54 then who was? Nov 03 13:08:54 symbian was dead long before Nov 03 13:08:55 http://support.dell.com/support/edocs/systems/pe7150/en/ug/35ruvc20.htm Nov 03 13:09:08 what does EFI have to do with the arch? Nov 03 13:09:21 psycho_oreos: they all have about same market share now Nov 03 13:09:46 Dell uses EFI as well. EFI was SUPPOSED to replace the BIOS idiocy still being used from the before time Nov 03 13:09:46 psycho_oreos: and besides, there is big market in US and nokia doesn't exist on it Nov 03 13:09:48 Macer, I didn't specifically note that EFI has to do with arch, I'm talking in relative differences that Macs still use EFI Nov 03 13:09:59 uhm Nov 03 13:10:04 psycho_oreos: my laptop has EFI Nov 03 13:10:05 jacekowski, not so Nov 03 13:10:27 i think you are quite far away from reality Nov 03 13:10:34 as do i Nov 03 13:11:01 jacekowski, apart from US where you have other huge markets out there to look at, you haven't seen what is the norm Nov 03 13:11:14 a mac is a "PC" nowadays. but then again... in the literal sense..a PC is simply any computer used by an end user Nov 03 13:11:23 psycho_oreos: well i'm in the UK Nov 03 13:11:28 somehow "PC" has been used to describe the x86 arch Nov 03 13:11:30 which i never understood Nov 03 13:11:43 jacekowski, never implied you were from US Nov 03 13:11:45 psycho_oreos: and most popular phone here is an iphone Nov 03 13:11:53 in my company Nov 03 13:11:56 jacekowski, point being? Nov 03 13:12:29 nokia has half of apple marketshare in here Nov 03 13:12:29 jacekowski, apple may still have a large market share but its not as big as android conglomerate for the time being Nov 03 13:12:41 and nokia is falling way behind Nov 03 13:12:51 psycho_oreos: and that was the case even year ago Nov 03 13:12:58 before elop Nov 03 13:13:19 jacekowski, so are you saying the news was all a fud? Nov 03 13:13:23 i blame stskeeps Nov 03 13:13:30 no Nov 03 13:13:38 i'm saying that nokia is in very bad position Nov 03 13:13:48 they have been in a bad position for a very long time Nov 03 13:13:50 I think I might work on "figure out external stuff done by icd2 and its plugins", I know people would be interested in it Nov 03 13:13:54 and they were in bad position for very long time Nov 03 13:14:03 they just didn't want to admit it or couldn't see it since they were on the top of the mountain for so long Nov 03 13:14:11 and i don't think they want to be just another symbian OEM Nov 03 13:14:12 it still does not give them the equitable position to choose microsoft as a partner Nov 03 13:14:18 android OEM* Nov 03 13:14:41 microsoft already has mobile experience Nov 03 13:14:46 they have a platform Nov 03 13:14:50 or lack thereof Nov 03 13:14:54 windows mobile Nov 03 13:14:57 it worked Nov 03 13:15:01 it was biggest platform Nov 03 13:15:06 it was a platform that killed palm os Nov 03 13:15:07 and wp7 with issues Nov 03 13:15:07 i think they are just using winmob as a stopgap until they can make something worth using by the masses Nov 03 13:15:18 and how big was palm os? Nov 03 13:15:27 psycho_oreos: before, 100% of market Nov 03 13:15:32 hopefully this time they keep it to themselves so it doesn't get all the hype that meego had Nov 03 13:15:42 and they just release it without anybody seeing it coming Nov 03 13:15:48 i blame open source Nov 03 13:15:48 :) Nov 03 13:15:49 jacekowski, I think that's an overstatement Nov 03 13:16:05 companies love to preach "open" .. it reminds me of obama and "change" Nov 03 13:17:36 and I wouldn't back microsoft, they're hacker hostile, not much different from apple Nov 03 13:18:01 the cattle aren't hackers Nov 03 13:18:13 they want shining lights and beeping noises Nov 03 13:18:15 the cattle aren't always hackers Nov 03 13:18:40 they don't care about open development.. they're companies.. money is the bottom line Nov 03 13:18:50 if you don't like it but 10,000,000 do.. then oh well :) Nov 03 13:19:09 not to mention the headaches avoided by keeping dev in house Nov 03 13:19:11 During all of last year, Palm accounted for 58% of handhelds sold. In 2000, that number was 71%. It was a bad year for Palm, Nov 03 13:19:15 * psycho_oreos recalls of wm or wp7 rooting tool. They (microsoft) apparently paid these developers who made jailbreaks to hush up Nov 03 13:19:45 they lost that marketshare because of symbian and winmo Nov 03 13:20:03 winmo was replaced by android Nov 03 13:20:05 it still doesn't mean that winmo had 100% of market share, that's the bottom line Nov 03 13:20:09 symbian held little bit better Nov 03 13:20:28 psycho_oreos: they had most of market before android Nov 03 13:20:44 jacekowski, indeed but they didn't dominate the market Nov 03 13:21:01 but they had big chunk of t Nov 03 13:21:02 of it Nov 03 13:21:07 doesn't "most" = "dominate" Nov 03 13:21:14 no Nov 03 13:22:00 i think 50%+ of a market with more than 4 competitors is a good domination Nov 03 13:22:34 apple still technically has android beat considering android maintains its percentage of use across many different platforms and companies Nov 03 13:22:36 or I could have simply put it as obliterate Nov 03 13:22:49 whereas ios is apple only Nov 03 13:23:02 another win for closed dev :) Nov 03 13:23:03 and apple likes it like that Nov 03 13:23:13 psycho_oreos: why they wouldn't Nov 03 13:23:15 it works for them Nov 03 13:23:26 if microsoft and nokia go for same model it may work for them Nov 03 13:23:29 it makes them a $hitload of money Nov 03 13:23:38 esspecialy that they have market experience Nov 03 13:23:54 if they can pull it off Nov 03 13:24:16 i am sure there are plenty of people at nokia facepalming and saying "why didn't we do that first" Nov 03 13:24:30 * SpeedEvil sighs at another closed platform. Nov 03 13:24:30 and they had kingitis... where they lost vision because they were on the top for so long Nov 03 13:24:37 jacekowski, hint word: may.. however for now all the news has gone and past that nokia was a pretty much a burning platform with shares dipping after Flop came in, I can see a charred platform Nov 03 13:24:57 SpeedEvil: lol... apply for a job there ;) Nov 03 13:25:06 then it will be open to you Nov 03 13:25:17 psycho_oreos: symbian was going down before elop came in Nov 03 13:25:32 SpeedEvil: err, lost topic, please help me out. Another closed paltform? Nov 03 13:25:38 not only that... but there is a structure.... with a leader... who says how things go... and keeps things in order.. instead of the constant open forking Nov 03 13:25:52 jacekowski, I'm not talking about OS wise, I'm talking about the company in general Nov 03 13:25:57 http://www.allaboutsymbian.com/news/item/12128_The_smartphone_crystal_ball_th.php Nov 03 13:26:07 jacekowski, but symbian still has had a large market share Nov 03 13:26:24 at least 10 times larger than maemo Nov 03 13:26:42 that's why they have N8 Nov 03 13:26:43 maemo never had very much of a share Nov 03 13:26:46 and other symbian phones Nov 03 13:27:23 but a good business plan has few exit strategies Nov 03 13:27:32 if they can't make anything out of symbian they have wp7 Nov 03 13:27:33 maemo was only targeted for niche markets Nov 03 13:27:57 if they can't do anything there they may go for android Nov 03 13:28:13 jacekowski: i honestly hope they do ... "fix" symbian Nov 03 13:28:33 it would be a shame to see symbian go... regardless of what people say about it.. it probably really is the best mobile OS ever made Nov 03 13:28:48 by the time they switch to android I don't think they would have that much funds to pull off nice handsets but we shall see. maybe the end of nokia is pretty much here if mango is killed Nov 03 13:28:51 in terms of power vs performance etc Nov 03 13:29:09 Macer: well, it's kinda hard to introduce "new" platform to market Nov 03 13:29:19 Macer: symbian^3 with touch is quite new thing Nov 03 13:29:21 although i REALLY wish they stuck with maemo Nov 03 13:29:22 heh Nov 03 13:29:32 google had a lot of funds to pull that off Nov 03 13:29:44 coming from other sources Nov 03 13:29:48 nokia doesn't have that Nov 03 13:29:49 jacekowski: i am buying an e7 still Nov 03 13:29:57 regardless of symbian dying or not ;) Nov 03 13:30:00 Macer: why not n8? Nov 03 13:30:04 qwerty Nov 03 13:30:09 I think Nokia still has more money than a single person can move... every day Nov 03 13:30:17 i want the kb Nov 03 13:30:20 Macer: swype works very well on n8 Nov 03 13:30:33 Swipe/swype is a horrible confusion. Nov 03 13:30:36 jacekowski: i hate swype... and vkbs in general Nov 03 13:30:50 i refuse to buy a phone without a keyboard Nov 03 13:30:55 i don't write poems on phone Nov 03 13:31:00 so i don't really care Nov 03 13:31:03 i have a laptop for that Nov 03 13:31:11 that i ussualy take with me to most places Nov 03 13:31:15 i don't either... but i still write a lot of IMs and txts Nov 03 13:31:18 I wrte unix cmdlines on my phone Nov 03 13:31:21 and hate vkb Nov 03 13:31:30 I write scripts on my device Nov 03 13:31:36 DocScrutinizer: me too Nov 03 13:31:41 that's a pretty big one Nov 03 13:31:46 ssh without a qwerty sucks Nov 03 13:31:53 the vkb takes up the screen Nov 03 13:32:20 and still doesn't offer |{}\ Nov 03 13:32:32 and if vkb dies on you when you don't have a qwerty built-in, you're pretty much SOL until you purchase a compatible BT keyboard Nov 03 13:32:35 etc Nov 03 13:33:18 well, if $XY dies, you're usually SOL Nov 03 13:33:44 :) vkb? Nov 03 13:33:53 i am wondering how a vkb can die on you Nov 03 13:33:56 touchscreen functionality Nov 03 13:33:59 also notice that BT kbd doesn't work with HARM/N9 Nov 03 13:34:01 SOL? Nov 03 13:34:11 jacekowski: shit out of luck Nov 03 13:34:20 Macer, install mscim/qimsys on N900 from extras-devel.. enjoy Nov 03 13:34:24 ~sol Nov 03 13:34:25 [sol] Shit Outta Luck. Sex On Legs. Earth's star, or the note that precedes La, or but really straight out of luck, or a shit beer Nov 03 13:34:50 or even portrait keyboard, sometimes that even breaks the vkb easily Nov 03 13:34:56 i hate words like outta Nov 03 13:35:11 that's nigga english Nov 03 13:35:20 ~factinfo sol Nov 03 13:35:20 sol -- last modified at Mon Oct 6 03:23:25 2003 by debian!~mcppala@is7.pacific.net.hk; it has been requested 3 times, last by DocScrutinizer, 55s ago. Nov 03 13:35:28 jacekowski: in the US we call it ebonics Nov 03 13:36:17 ~wtf sol Nov 03 13:36:19 SOL: shit out [of] luck Nov 03 13:36:30 ironically enough... when schools wanted to rid the world of it... we had a big racism things because "ebonics is part of a culture and should be accepted" Nov 03 13:36:34 also notice that BT kbd doesn't work with HARM/N9 <--- with some hope and maybe luck, we may see a light to this never ending hell hole tunnel Nov 03 13:37:11 it took quite a while for a BT keyboard to properly work with a damn n900 lol Nov 03 13:37:31 my su8w (which worked perfectly on my n800 and n810) didn't work out the box Nov 03 13:37:36 psycho_oreos: based on what? Nov 03 13:37:37 and the bug was WONTFIX Nov 03 13:37:39 hah Nov 03 13:37:55 i am starting to wonder which bugs were actually FIXED Nov 03 13:38:19 SpeedEvil, based on averting the stupid security measures nokia is trying to force us to use and N9's crippled functionality (vs N950) Nov 03 13:39:20 indeed there *might* be hope to see hwkbd go to N9 fw from N950, on a future release Nov 03 13:39:42 s/hwkbd/hwkbd *support*/ Nov 03 13:39:43 DocScrutinizer meant: indeed there *might* be hope to see hwkbd *support* go to N9 fw from N950, on a future release Nov 03 13:40:41 as allegedly BT kbds work on N950 (what an irony) Nov 03 13:41:08 its one of the cool things when you're one of the chosen devs to get N950 Nov 03 13:41:32 DocScrutinizer: why does that matter if there are only 1K N9s and no N950s? Nov 03 13:41:52 btw with N9 not supporting the basic hwkbd infra I'd expect USB kbds also to fail, if ever we get hostmode Nov 03 13:42:34 DocScrutinizer: you won't... N9s and N950s are dead coming out the gate... you should be thankful you were blessed with an n950... collectors item Nov 03 13:42:35 hahahaha Nov 03 13:42:59 I'm not a collector Nov 03 13:43:09 i didn't say you were Nov 03 13:43:13 N9 = severely crippled, so much so that it'll soon need to be placed in a wheelchair Nov 03 13:43:17 i am just saying what it is :) Nov 03 13:43:31 psycho_oreos: the N9 was released as something designed to fail Nov 03 13:43:50 probably to justify abandoning meego and using winmob while they secretly work on making a symbian worthwhile for the masses Nov 03 13:44:05 Macer, ironically nokia continues to tantalise people. Have a look for white N9 Nov 03 13:45:26 wow Nov 03 13:45:29 N9 on amazon? Nov 03 13:45:37 Macer: and I'm just explaining how much I feel blessed Nov 03 13:45:45 $700?! are these people high? Nov 03 13:45:54 DocScrutinizer: i see :) Nov 03 13:46:16 i would get one but not for that much Nov 03 13:47:00 DocScrutinizer: how long does n950 last on battery Nov 03 13:47:04 on single charge Nov 03 13:47:09 jacekowski: NFC Nov 03 13:47:17 you have one? Nov 03 13:47:18 jacekowski: It depends. Nov 03 13:47:37 jacekowski: From a week, to 4 hours. Nov 03 13:47:40 is it possible to get 3 days out of it Nov 03 13:47:44 (gof2) Nov 03 13:47:44 jacekowski: yes. And I actually inserted a SIM and took it out... for ~6h Nov 03 13:47:46 with few phone calls Nov 03 13:47:50 jacekowski: easily Nov 03 13:47:58 looking at map few times Nov 03 13:48:00 jacekowski: battery life is in general better than n900. Nov 03 13:48:01 and some interwebs Nov 03 13:48:11 jacekowski: since then it basically never left the charger Nov 03 13:48:34 wait, not true, I used it even on SIM on that local test GSM net at chaos camp Nov 03 13:48:43 performed quite nicely there Nov 03 13:49:11 hmm, does it have that 2 processor design as well Nov 03 13:49:18 with cellmo and app processor? Nov 03 13:49:32 sure Nov 03 13:49:51 it's basically "identical" to N900, arch wise Nov 03 13:50:42 well, there are some significant diffs in audio hw it seems Nov 03 13:51:18 though I can't tell for sure - no schematics :-S Nov 03 13:51:42 that'S btw the reason I need a N9 for hostmode R&D Nov 03 13:52:21 is there a keybd shortcut to switch standby on/ off? Nov 03 13:52:32 o.O Nov 03 13:52:35 instead of using that knob on the side of a n900 Nov 03 13:52:41 no Nov 03 13:52:50 hm ok Nov 03 13:53:15 jack_lt, though if you press the power button twice it can turn the screen off however Nov 03 13:53:23 unless you accept a dbus-send cmd in xterm as a "shortcut" Nov 03 13:53:51 I accept it for this time ... :) Nov 03 13:54:01 see phonecontrol on wiki Nov 03 13:55:06 http://wiki.maemo.org/Phone_control#Lock_screen_and_keys Nov 03 14:04:56 is there any debian image to "flash" on n900? Nov 03 14:06:24 no Nov 03 14:06:48 elektranox.org/n900/installation/index.html or use debootstrap http://wiki.debian.org/Debootstrap Nov 03 14:07:07 ;) i was just about to say contact NIN101 :P Nov 03 14:07:32 heh Nov 03 14:16:45 debootstrap of course only installs a base system by default, no gui, no kernel etc. and the resulting debian requires some configuration to be more or less useable. Nov 03 14:21:00 DocScrutinizer, unlock seems to be hard cause the n900 doesn't accept input when logging it via the switch Nov 03 14:33:22 bah, icd2 is a mess Nov 03 14:33:28 understanding how it works is nigh-impossible Nov 03 14:34:16 :/ Nov 03 14:35:18 Lets start by seeing what packages depend on it Nov 03 14:39:50 hmmm, I think I can figure out bits of what I wanted Nov 03 14:40:08 dbus seems to be the only hard part to ID :( Nov 03 14:43:42 actually, it doesn't seem as hard as I thought, not if I can find the right bits in the (rather comprehensive) icd2 documentation package :) Nov 03 14:57:07 How to search a app via apt-get? I've tried to man apt-get, but find that no man pages installed... Nov 03 14:57:44 apt-cache search Nov 03 14:59:11 Sicelo: I try to apt-cache search man to search pkg for man page, but lots of output produced... Nov 03 14:59:36 I want to install a man page for commands in OS Nov 03 15:01:03 i think u want man-db-n900 Nov 03 15:01:23 jack_lt: sorry? Nov 03 15:03:55 IroN900:~# apt-cache policy man-db-n900 Nov 03 15:03:57 man-db-n900: Nov 03 15:03:58 Installed: 2.5.1-3maemo6 Nov 03 15:14:21 DocScrutinizer: Sicelo thank you! Nov 03 15:16:23 How to set the env in ash? when I try to use man, it warns: pager: applet not found Nov 03 15:16:35 I guess that's because no $PAGER is defined Nov 03 15:16:47 But no `export` command here... Nov 03 15:16:59 and no setenv cmd too.. Nov 03 15:19:26 I don't think there are manpages Nov 03 15:19:28 you can get bash Nov 03 15:20:34 psycho_oreos: Why ash can't?... Nov 03 15:20:55 SpeedEvil: I've installed man-db-n900 Nov 03 15:21:09 ah Nov 03 15:21:36 In the profile - set RAGER=foo ? Nov 03 15:22:22 LaoLang_cool: apt-get install less Nov 03 15:22:39 DocScrutinizer: I've more... Nov 03 15:22:48 more is enough Nov 03 15:23:11 Or manpage has to use less as pager in n900? Nov 03 15:23:19 LaoLang_cool, I don't know. I hardly use ash myself Nov 03 15:23:35 well, then I guess a `PAGER=/bin/more man man` shall work Nov 03 15:24:14 and I would be surprised to learn busybox had no export Nov 03 15:24:41 busybox-power ftw Nov 03 15:24:43 (well, not really surprised, I mean it's messybox after all. nevertheless...) Nov 03 15:24:52 psycho_oreos: eeew Nov 03 15:25:05 DocScrutinizer, it has fdisk built-in for busybox-power :D Nov 03 15:25:06 DocScrutinizer: you're right, it works, thank you Nov 03 15:25:18 I'll use that any day over sfdisk personally Nov 03 15:25:45 How to set the env var in ash? Nov 03 15:26:04 psycho_oreos: Nov 03 15:26:05 IroN900:~# cfdisk -v Nov 03 15:26:07 cfdisk 2.12r Nov 03 15:26:23 jacekowski:~# cfdisk -v Nov 03 15:26:23 cfdisk (util-linux-ng 2.17.2) Nov 03 15:27:48 LaoLang_cool: Nov 03 15:27:51 IroN900:~# help Nov 03 15:27:53 DocScrutinizer, lol I have cfdisk as well but I much prefer fdisk :D Nov 03 15:28:00 Built-in commands: Nov 03 15:28:07 exit export false fg hash help jobs kill let local pwd read readonly Nov 03 15:29:03 DocScrutinizer: thanks! I'm surprised that can't complete the built-in cmd Nov 03 15:29:51 ~messybox Nov 03 15:29:52 messy... err busybox is meant for lean scripting. Regarding all the missing options and immanent limitations (see su) it's not really the interactive shell of choice. A lot of people hate busybox because a lot of system integrators don't understand the difference between busybox and a decent user interactive shell plus unix utils Nov 03 15:30:15 wait, ok I lied I don't have cfdisk installed on N900 but meh fdisk is plenty Nov 03 15:30:26 DocScrutinizer: I got it, thank you! Nov 03 15:32:34 psycho_oreos: I'd not trust messybox fdisk to even just read out a partition table Nov 03 15:33:26 DocScrutinizer, didn't know your utter hatred for messybox was that deep :) Nov 03 15:33:34 and particularly fdisk and friends I insist in hte original, latest version Nov 03 15:34:33 you'd not trust in cheap china fleabay parachutes, would you? Nov 03 15:35:44 I wouldn't think messybox is comparable to cheap chinese fleabay parachutes :) Nov 03 15:36:12 Busybox has been found by the state of california to cause cancer in rats. Nov 03 15:36:27 hehehe Nov 03 15:37:56 actually I'd suspect busybox been invented by poettering Nov 03 15:41:45 I lost all my 'Catalogs'. How can I get them back? Nov 03 15:45:05 rly: what do you mean "lost" Nov 03 15:45:53 what's catalogs? Nov 03 15:46:51 Phlogistique: after a reboot they were not lost anymore. Nov 03 15:46:52 ham Nov 03 15:47:17 The Debian equivalent is a repo. Nov 03 15:48:01 rly: the debian equivalent is sources Nov 03 15:48:49 rly: and we are on debian... if you are talking about m5 Nov 03 15:49:10 chem|st: according to the filename yes. And hi! Nov 03 15:49:17 DocScrutinizer: hey Nov 03 15:51:02 DocScrutinizer: repo is just what it is called, in all apt envies it is sources... Nov 03 15:51:23 :nod: Nov 03 15:51:40 and HAM calls them catalog Nov 03 15:52:52 So, anyway, I installed bootscreen, but I don't get some fancy 3d animation. Nov 03 15:52:56 catalogs in terms of m5 is repo added to sources where "catalogs" are available, not all files in a repo are shown in ham so it si a "catalog" view of tagged programs which are available in $source Nov 03 15:53:06 I still get the annoying Nokia startup sound. Nov 03 15:53:23 The tie ta do ta ti ta. Nov 03 15:54:20 seems a bit like mail-order to me ;) Nov 03 15:55:03 ~tell rly about jrtools Nov 03 15:58:48 I want to do this, but I don't see the bootscreen applet anywhere. http://thehandheldblog.com/2010/02/21/bootscreen-lets-you-change-the-n900-boot-video-with-one-click/ Nov 03 15:58:59 I can remove the bootscreen package, which suggests that I have it. Nov 03 16:01:54 Ok, I get it. Nov 03 16:01:58 There is just no icon. Nov 03 16:07:25 Great, then it says 'Error copying file'. Nov 03 16:14:07 How is the video folder called on the file system? Nov 03 16:15:39 /opt/usr/share/hildon-welcome/media/ Nov 03 16:17:19 I also find it weird that I don't get the bootscreen app icon. Nov 03 16:17:26 I started it from the CLI which does work. Nov 03 16:18:40 * jonwil wonders if an open source clone of browserd is of value to anyone Nov 03 16:19:12 jonwil: yes, because browserd sometimes uses 95% CPU. Nov 03 16:19:49 Sicelo: will that also get rid of the startup sound, btw? Nov 03 16:19:51 although mostly browserd is just a wrapper around browser-eal Nov 03 16:20:15 and browser-eal is open source Nov 03 16:20:41 I do have code to an unknown version of browserd which is what I am playing with and comparing to the maemo5 browserd Nov 03 16:27:05 Well the fancy start video doesn't work, but it does boot faster now. Nov 03 16:27:17 (and I got rid of the sound \o/ ) Nov 03 16:30:09 shouldn't the same method as n900 work? (commenting the right line on the right file) Nov 03 16:30:20 hmhm wait, this is on n900 **** BEGIN LOGGING AT Thu Nov 03 21:40:18 2011 Nov 03 21:46:15 Sicelo: even after enabling testing i am getting a E: Version '2.6.28-10power47' for 'kernel-power' was not found Nov 03 21:46:45 Is 21.2011.38-1 the CSSU version? Nov 03 21:47:34 maybe devel.. i don't rememberer where 47 is... where did u get it.. u said u have 47... Nov 03 21:47:54 s/rer/r/ Nov 03 21:47:55 Sicelo meant: maybe devel.. i don't remember where 47 is... where did u get it.. u said u have 47... Nov 03 21:48:04 Sicelo: i have both devel and testing enabled now Nov 03 21:48:05 "Upgrade to PR1.3, Nokia's last official Maemo 5 update. If you're unsure if you have, Settings > About product should show Version beginning with 20.2010.36. " Nov 03 21:48:08 rly: no Nov 03 21:48:25 Sicelo: i must have got v47 from devel Nov 03 21:48:42 Sicelo: can I upgrade to CSSU from my version? Nov 03 21:50:44 yes rly. u are on the latest Nov 03 21:51:29 gosh, my net realy sucks :'( Nov 03 21:52:04 Sicelo: seems your command had a typo, should be apt-get -s install kernel-power=1:2.6.28-10power47 Nov 03 21:53:23 heh, yes.. that's what my XTerm has. sorry Nov 03 21:54:33 * Sicelo consults man for apt-get -s Nov 03 21:55:03 Sicelo: does that delete all my applications? Nov 03 21:58:04 Sicelo: still not very happy, http://www.pastie.org/2806869 Nov 03 21:58:47 Sicelo: seems it wants to remove kernel-power* packages Nov 03 21:59:12 trumee: dang! listen!! IT WON'T WORK LIKe THIS! Nov 03 21:59:15 i dunno any further Nov 03 21:59:37 DocScrutinizer: why not? Nov 03 21:59:45 when multiboot comes with KP48 then you can not install KP47 Nov 03 21:59:57 multiboot has "kernels built in" Nov 03 22:00:41 DocScrutinizer: right, but isnt KP independent of multiboot? Nov 03 22:00:45 you are trying to force your system into bricked state and complain it doesn't work Nov 03 22:00:59 NO, IT IS NOT Nov 03 22:01:05 this seems to be ok, apt-get -s install multiboot-kernel-power kernel-power=1:2.6.28-10power47 kernel-power-modules=1:2.6.28-10power47 Nov 03 22:01:38 Sicelo: it says that HAM is running, please exit it and press enter... but it isn't running. Nov 03 22:02:04 What is the binary name of HAM? Nov 03 22:02:13 Then I can just do killall and be sure it is done. Nov 03 22:02:41 don't kill it if u are installing cssu. iirc it says it takes a while Nov 03 22:04:56 trumee: it is worth your while to take it as said. unless u want to re-flash Nov 03 22:05:38 Sicelo: I also read something about being able to use 720p filming on the device. Is that hoax? Nov 03 22:05:41 a hoax? Nov 03 22:06:25 apparently not. but i don't use my device for videos, so idk. haven't tried Nov 03 22:07:22 Does anyone know which package enabled 720p filming? Nov 03 22:07:33 enables* Nov 03 22:07:58 HAM running? wait til it finished Nov 03 22:08:22 can take 5..10 min Nov 03 22:08:32 DocScrutinizer: did that and the upgrade worked, but now it is just apparently doing nothing. Nov 03 22:09:12 browserd uses 98% cpu again. Nov 03 22:09:18 Can I kill that one? Nov 03 22:09:37 check your CPU load - as long as some apt-worker is pushing CPU to 100% yu want to wait for it finishing Nov 03 22:09:50 yes, kill browserd Nov 03 22:10:38 Is there some replacement/update for browserd? Nov 03 22:10:48 I already killed it three times today. Nov 03 22:10:56 and say "thank you" to the designer of that webpage with flash/JS Nov 03 22:11:19 DocScrutinizer: all flash causes that or just some flash? Nov 03 22:11:34 some poorly written JS and some flash Nov 03 22:11:45 most flash Nov 03 22:11:57 But I wasn't even running a browser anymore. Nov 03 22:12:05 flash doesn't stop when the browser loses focus Nov 03 22:12:05 Or does it keep running in the background? Nov 03 22:12:12 Why not?! Nov 03 22:12:18 dunno Nov 03 22:13:31 maybe to make your youtube music not stop while you check mail/whatever? Nov 03 22:14:21 DocScrutinizer: but if I kill the browser window including youtube, then youtube also stops. Nov 03 22:14:35 :shrug: Nov 03 22:14:46 So, to have something in the background running when nothing is visually there, that doesn't make sense. Nov 03 22:14:57 orly? Nov 03 22:15:06 killall browserd Nov 03 22:15:20 ..but not as root :-). Nov 03 22:15:23 and get cpu load applet! Nov 03 22:15:35 DocScrutinizer: I am not following. Nov 03 22:15:59 DocScrutinizer: I am a screen user, if you think I don't know the usefulness of running stuff truly in the background. Nov 03 22:16:14 (or the tons of other daemons that do something useful on a real system) Nov 03 22:16:23 I am not the browserd developer Nov 03 22:16:39 DocScrutinizer: ok, I thought you where making some point. Nov 03 22:16:42 so no use in arguing with me about usefulness of brwserd behaviour Nov 03 22:17:13 it's a "known" problem Nov 03 22:17:21 at least I know it Nov 03 22:17:32 also from my desktop PC Nov 03 22:18:02 So, has Nokia completely burned all maemo code and are they going Windows only, or is that just a marketing gimmick? Nov 03 22:18:29 on my desktop I frequently kill nspluginviewer processes, on N900 sometimes I need to killall nrowserd Nov 03 22:18:36 browserd* Nov 03 22:19:33 NIN101: why not as root? Nov 03 22:19:41 Upgrade complete \o/ Nov 03 22:21:19 DocScrutinizer: well it rebooted my device, but it was -9. Nov 03 22:21:35 umm Nov 03 22:31:29 interesting, http://pastebin.com/raw.php?i=926k0ih6 you need to do it several times. Nov 03 22:32:46 until it reboots. Nov 03 22:53:36 dsmetool? yeah that's known Nov 03 23:29:49 NIN101: dsmetool --help -> >> -t --start-restart= Start a process (on process exit, restart max N times, then do SW reset)<< also see -c --max-count=N and -T --count-time=N Nov 03 23:31:07 DocScrutinizer: thx. Nov 03 23:46:01 i've been wondering about /sbin/preinit on the n900 Nov 03 23:46:28 a large part of it is a bootmenu Nov 03 23:46:40 which we never see on the n900 Nov 03 23:46:52 and all it seems to actually do is mount filesystems and boot Nov 03 23:59:29 how can I play speex files on the n900? Nov 03 23:59:52 mplayer would be an option. Nov 04 00:34:04 I can't understand why vim on maemo missing 'autochdir' feature... Nov 04 00:37:07 Hurrian: AIUI the preinit boot menu is for boting with "console" Nov 04 01:31:27 hello, I'm trying to compile an app on N900, while doing ./configure, there is an error: checking whether the C copiler works.. no Nov 04 01:31:42 How to solve it? I have installed gcc base Nov 04 01:32:10 build-essential Nov 04 01:33:30 ShadowJK: I can't find such pkg on N900... Nov 04 01:33:52 I'd imagine it'd be in sdk tools like gcc Nov 04 01:33:54 apt-cache search build-essential returns nothing Nov 04 01:34:04 but it's probably not such a good idea to be installing stuff from there anyways Nov 04 01:34:18 probably libc6-dev is the most important missing piece Nov 04 01:35:25 ShadowJK: I can't find a bin version for n900 of the app I want, so I have to try to compile it :( Nov 04 01:35:39 errhm Nov 04 01:36:01 The pkg name is fcitx Nov 04 01:36:03 that'smmaemo and not gentoo ;-) Nov 04 01:36:07 A chinese input method Nov 04 01:36:39 DocScrutinizer: I'm missing a suckless input method on n900, hard to use without it :( Nov 04 01:36:45 it's actually discouraged to compile on device Nov 04 01:36:59 DocScrutinizer: so what's the recommended way? Nov 04 01:37:15 the PC based SDK, called scratchbox Nov 04 01:38:31 there's actually not even enough free space on a sane filesystem on N900 to install all the needed bits for proper building of maemo packages Nov 04 01:41:51 Yeah especially if you need lots of -dev packages you'll run out of space quite fast Nov 04 01:46:08 DocScrutinizer: I'm not programmer, so it's very likely that I failed to compile it successfully, I wonder if there is somewhere that I could make a request or let others try to build an app for n900? Nov 04 01:46:23 disconnected... Nov 04 01:53:00 LaoLang_cool: what is the application in question? Nov 04 01:53:38 merlin1991: a common Chinese input method, but there's no build on n900 Nov 04 01:53:44 its name is fcitx Nov 04 01:54:32 it's sad that I have no dev enviroment and knowledge to build it :( Nov 04 01:55:12 LaoLang_cool: got a link somewhere? Nov 04 01:55:18 I could try to build it Nov 04 01:57:55 (I have a complete scratchbox set up) Nov 04 02:00:52 LaoLang_cool: got a link to the projects page? Nov 04 02:00:56 I could try to build it Nov 04 02:01:43 merlin1991: sorry, I'm got disconnected again, I will Nov 04 02:02:21 merlin1991: It's a Chinese website: http://www.fcitx.org/main/?q=node/9 Nov 04 02:02:48 The file is: fcitx-3.6.3.tar.bz2 2010-02-13 Nov 04 02:02:57 is it the same as http://code.google.com/p/fcitx/ Nov 04 02:03:01 ? Nov 04 02:04:03 merlin1991: yes, but the page you give has newer version (above 4), it depends pango, so I guess it's harder to build than old version 3 Nov 04 02:04:38 merlin1991: Another app I'm missing on N900 is a cli dictionary, I'm using sdcv, the website is at http://sdcv.sourceforge.net/ Nov 04 02:04:52 I think it's much more easy to compile than fcitx :) Nov 04 02:05:12 merlin1991: and thank you for your so kind! Nov 04 02:11:49 LaoLang_cool: wich resulting file do you actually need? Nov 04 02:12:02 LaoLang_cool: meanwhile you may want to have an informative glance at http://wiki.maemo.org/Documentation Nov 04 02:12:24 merlin1991: .deb? I'm new on N900 and maemo... Nov 04 02:12:56 LaoLang_cool: esp http://wiki.maemo.org/Documentation/Maemo_5_Final_SDK Nov 04 02:13:21 merlin1991: if it works fine, could you please upload it into official maemo repo? Nov 04 02:13:35 DocScrutinizer: thank you, will read it! Nov 04 02:14:17 merlin1991: My email is vanopen AT gmail DOT com Nov 04 02:15:11 http://wiki.maemo.org/Documentation/Maemo_5_Final_SDK_Installation Nov 04 02:15:15 better ^^^ Nov 04 02:16:21 DocScrutinizer: thank you, vmplayer + img is fit for me :) Nov 04 02:17:18 yeah, another good method, though the vm images need an update to latest after starting them, as the ones deployed are really obsolete - as far as I know Nov 04 02:18:59 DocScrutinizer: Thank you for notice, I guess the speed of update is fast on pc Nov 04 02:21:27 yeah, only takes hours ;-) Nov 04 02:22:20 honestly I dunno, installing a generic scratchbox maemo SDK takes some hours though Nov 04 02:22:27 hours, oh.. Nov 04 02:23:39 but maybe I confuse things here, as I dealt with installing kernel sources and building kernel, and both took quite several hours, incl download though Nov 04 02:26:44 du -hs /scratchbox -> 5,4G /scratchbox Nov 04 02:27:27 arf debhelper doesn't support bz2 Nov 04 02:29:51 I'm curious that why vim on maemo doesn't support 'autochdir'? Nov 04 02:31:18 It supports everything I need except this minor feature, don't know if it's because some technology reason Nov 04 02:32:05 tar on maemo doesn't support bz2 too.. Nov 04 02:35:03 tar is busybox Nov 04 02:35:09 tar is busybox. Nov 04 02:35:20 busybox is crap Nov 04 02:35:26 oh Nov 04 02:35:29 Busybox is great. Nov 04 02:35:32 got it, thanks Nov 04 02:35:32 For what it is. Nov 04 02:35:38 Which isn't an interactive shell. Nov 04 02:36:14 But my shell says it's ash, not busybox Nov 04 02:36:14 yeah, with tar that has no bz2 support Nov 04 02:36:30 believe me it's busybox Nov 04 02:36:34 i think "gnutar" is in repos Nov 04 02:37:20 LaoLang_cool: btw vim = busybox Nov 04 02:37:30 ~messybox Nov 04 02:37:31 messy... err busybox is meant for lean scripting. Regarding all the missing options and immanent limitations (see su) it's not really the interactive shell of choice. A lot of people hate busybox because a lot of system integrators don't understand the difference between busybox and a decent user interactive shell plus unix utils Nov 04 02:37:48 DocScrutinizer: I install vim via apt-get install vim, so it's busybox too? Nov 04 02:38:09 it's not Nov 04 02:38:56 it's not? Nov 04 02:39:01 IroN900:~# ll `which more` Nov 04 02:39:02 lrwxrwxrwx 1 root root 7 2010-06-23 06:13 /bin/more -> busybox Nov 04 02:39:33 DocScrutinizer: vim isn't more... Nov 04 02:39:38 err no vim here Nov 04 02:39:46 yeah I know Nov 04 02:39:52 was unrelated Nov 04 02:40:19 IroN900:~# ll `which vi` Nov 04 02:40:21 lrwxrwxrwx 1 root root 20 2010-06-23 06:19 /usr/bin/vi -> /etc/alternatives/vi Nov 04 02:40:22 IroN900:~# ll /etc/alternatives/vi Nov 04 02:40:24 lrwxrwxrwx 1 root root 12 2010-06-23 06:19 /etc/alternatives/vi -> /bin/busybox Nov 04 02:41:14 DocScrutinizer: vim is not vi Nov 04 02:41:23 I got it :) Nov 04 02:58:57 I think I may just have a set of source files that is functionally identical to the Maemo5 browserd daemon :) Nov 04 02:59:31 Just testing it now Nov 04 02:59:36 hello, does anyone have any idea how to reset passwd? Nov 04 02:59:44 i f-- upp the root password... :-( **** ENDING LOGGING AT Fri Nov 04 02:59:57 2011