**** BEGIN LOGGING AT Tue Mar 13 02:59:58 2012 Mar 13 03:42:19 ad-hoc wifi consumes 180mA here Mar 13 03:43:44 it consumes 5mA for powersave managed mode Mar 13 03:44:04 hald the system power Mar 13 03:44:07 half Mar 13 03:45:07 is there possibility to add powersave to adhoc? alternatively to add managed AP mode to driver? Mar 13 03:45:50 No, and dunno Mar 13 03:46:30 Adhoc means that you jsut put the interface in promisc mode, and listen for packets, and hope that tcp does the retransmits. Mar 13 03:46:43 There is no scheduling which is required for powersave. Mar 13 03:47:45 In principle you could roll your own protocol. Mar 13 03:47:52 But it's not there by default Mar 13 03:48:29 yes for w n900s Mar 13 03:51:10 2 Mar 13 03:52:42 very high power usage.. i do not see how listening consumes so much Mar 13 03:53:20 Because it does. Mar 13 03:53:29 Keeping the radio awake is expensive. Mar 13 03:53:54 Use a normal AP, and turn powersave mode off Mar 13 03:57:21 so i want a fully managed mode on n900 Mar 13 03:58:34 Err - what? Mar 13 03:59:59 for mobile hotspot Mar 13 04:01:28 managed is some time division multiplexing? Mar 13 04:02:05 is special/different wifi raio needed? Mar 13 04:02:13 radio Mar 13 04:18:06 thank you for the information SpeedEvil Mar 13 04:26:25 You ... Mar 13 04:26:25 ah Mar 13 08:47:20 talk is offline - again. Mar 13 08:47:31 this sucks without end the third time this month **** BEGIN LOGGING AT Tue Mar 13 09:48:19 2012 Mar 13 09:50:40 Anyone here know what's up with tmo? Mar 13 09:50:53 talk is offline - again. Mar 13 09:51:28 Ok, so this is not scheduled maintainance or something like that? Mar 13 09:52:31 probably not Mar 13 09:52:48 fyi that was an annoyed user's complaint Mar 13 09:54:47 Thanks for the info. I guess since noone here knows it's probably not scheduled outage ;) Mar 13 09:55:58 I sort of have a belief that if there were any scheduled outage, it would be noted in the /topic. Mar 13 09:57:32 Hi guys, I'm looking to overclock my old N900 and was wandering if you could help me with an up-to-date guide? :) Mar 13 09:58:26 have you done the necessary hardware modifications to ensure that your N900 won't fry up in the process? Mar 13 09:59:23 I have done nothing - Was just looking at these old guides on talk.maemo.com (which seems to be down?) and they all seemed like it was a software hack only that wouldn't take more than 2 minutes Mar 13 10:00:32 -Then i saw the name on the package they said to download "Enchanced Linux kernal for power users (obsolete)" with "Please REMOVE this package" in the desc. Mar 13 10:00:33 its not exactly a software hack, it's more like replacing the kernel so that such options can be unlocked at user's expense Mar 13 10:01:25 By user's expense you mean? Mar 13 10:07:47 dixi Mar 13 10:10:09 psycho_oreos - Do you have any guides or advice or anything? :) Mar 13 10:10:43 heh Mar 13 10:10:54 is nokia closing down maemo.org? Mar 13 10:12:26 yes, in 2013 if I remember correctly Mar 13 10:16:06 So.. Anyone else knows anything about overclocking of N900? Mar 13 10:21:44 Lykkepillen: it will kill the device. Mar 13 10:21:56 Lykkepillen: the clock speed is not set for thermal or battery reasons. Mar 13 10:22:19 It will? Thats why the kernel is being removed? Mar 13 10:22:54 well, it may not kill it quickly every time Mar 13 10:23:01 also, what kernel is being removed? Mar 13 10:23:21 BCMM: please explain "kill" meaning :) Mar 13 10:24:43 brick, destroy, eventually-cause-to-become-non-functional Mar 13 10:25:14 if it doesn't kill, it will un-necessarily shortens the life of the device sporadically and exponentially depending on how high the user/owner sets Mar 13 10:29:34 BCMM From my post earlier: -Then i saw the name on the package they said to download "Enchanced Linux kernal for power users (obsolete)" with "Please REMOVE this package" in the desc. Mar 13 10:29:45 -That's what the guide i found told me to download Mar 13 10:29:51 huh, kernel-power isn't gone is it? Mar 13 10:29:55 i thought it was part of cssu now Mar 13 10:30:36 it has all sorts of non-OC uses like iptables Mar 13 10:30:42 No idea what cssu is - My phone didn't work for about a year and when i tried turning it on a few days ago it suddently powered up without problems - I'm outdated on all points Mar 13 10:30:56 ~cssu Mar 13 10:30:58 it has been said that cssu is http://wiki.maemo.org/Community_SSU Mar 13 10:32:18 kernel-provides more than just that, it also incorporates class 10 microsdhc fixes, other improvements within memory management, etc Mar 13 10:34:08 So i should or shouln't overclock my device? It sounded almost like it was allmost risk-free when i read the guide, but that was from 2009 Mar 13 10:35:25 you should question yourself is there ever a need to, and should also read up on the technical information in regards to the very same ARM　Cortex A8 chipset inside that N900 Mar 13 10:36:02 ~oc Mar 13 10:36:02 extra, extra, read all about it, oc is an Optical Carrier, An OC1 has 672 channels or 44.736 Mbit/s Mar 13 10:36:08 ~overclocking Mar 13 10:36:08 "OK, listen up. This is your CPU." apt drops the CPU into a hot frying pan. "This is your CPU on overclocking. Any questions?" Mar 13 10:38:23 Theres no need to overclock it. I'm simply doing this because It's possible. When the phone stopped working i bought a Samsung Galaxy S2 that I'm using ATM so the N900 is really just a toy Mar 13 10:39:49 what do you mean stopped working? Mar 13 10:39:57 It just didn't boot Mar 13 10:40:13 Could have been some sort of water damage since it started working again Mar 13 10:41:08 poor old device, soon it'll probably gain rust before it dies.. and to overclock it will quickly send it on the way to hell Mar 13 10:43:05 Aw i hope not.. Was thinking of using the FM transmitter on the beach when summer hits Mar 13 10:44:18 you hope not.. its not like that's going to help anything.. when it was subjected to water, what were your first reactions apart from going out and buy samsung galaxy s2? Mar 13 10:45:51 FM transmitters with minijacks are sold quite cheap everywhere Mar 13 10:46:52 Haha the water damage part was just a guess, It was just laying on my desk. But i spent hours trying to figure out why it stopped working.. Didn't come up with a solution tho'.. When i think about it, same thing happened with my first iPod Touch - Might just be something in the air Mar 13 10:47:14 -But why would i buy a FM transmitter when i have a perfectly fine N900 with Youtube on it? Mar 13 10:50:11 I've noticed that the SIM holder is quite prone to humidity damage (mine seems to be losing its metallic shine); no clue about the insides of the N900 Mar 13 10:53:16 this is strange since I have a (much older) N95 too which has been exposed to the exact same conditions and seems brand new both inside and out Mar 13 10:54:10 the N900, in the other hand, is showing signs of wear in the corners, despite only having been extensively used for less than a year (and being only a little over 2 years old) Mar 13 11:10:13 I have no idea what you guys do to your phones... my beloved n900 survived a wheatbeer attack and is looking like week 2 after unboxing ever since Mar 13 11:10:53 wheatbeer coke mix to be precise Mar 13 11:11:09 wheatbeer and coke.. sounds pretty foamy Mar 13 11:38:32 Will talk.maemo.org be up again sometime soon? Mar 13 11:43:04 chem|st: do you carry it in a pocket? Mar 13 11:52:43 Firefox can't establish a connection to the server at talk.maemo.org. Mar 13 11:52:47 today is a good day Mar 13 12:14:55 yup tmo down for me too Mar 13 12:20:33 concept: you mean display foil, phonepocket stuff: no none, just in my pants Mar 13 13:00:29 BCMM: i see. i used to downclock it sometimes, to save battery..but it doesn't worth it Mar 13 13:00:58 guly: surely it has some sort of idle power saving anyway? Mar 13 13:01:26 hope so :) Mar 13 13:01:33 i have no idea if it's still true on ARM, but on modern x86, it basically works out as better to have the maximum non-idle clock speed available Mar 13 13:02:02 since it gets its work finished and gets back to the low-power idle state faster Mar 13 13:02:17 bear in mind that this was about frequency scaling rather than ordinary over/underclocking Mar 13 13:02:51 the conclusion was that it's not a good idea to automatically scale the freq down on an x86 laptop when on low battery as it will make it run out faster Mar 13 13:03:16 adding undervolting to the equation could well shift the balance - does the n900 let you adjust voltages? Mar 13 13:03:44 that's probably a silly question; i would hope a mobile power system is simpler than that Mar 13 13:04:10 I think it does Mar 13 13:04:34 i think so but i think it can be worst before it helps to save battery time Mar 13 13:04:37 You can do that with a custom kernel, I don't think you can in the standard one Mar 13 13:08:58 http://webcache.googleusercontent.com/search?q=cache:zIIkrpMdDpAJ:talk.maemo.org/showpost.php%3Fp%3D595582+&cd=1&hl=da&ct=clnk&gl=dk Mar 13 13:09:21 -When talk.maemo dosen't work Mar 13 13:14:24 ow your N900 is overclocked to 850Mhz using slightly less voltage than stock!! Mar 13 13:14:25 interesting Mar 13 13:35:06 bah, TMO is down :( Mar 13 13:36:05 it's been down for at least 5 hours Mar 13 13:55:08 guly: rush-to-idle is a well known optimal strategy usually Mar 13 13:55:38 OC though is a pretty bad idea Mar 13 13:55:53 even and esp with undervolting Mar 13 14:34:18 sure Mar 13 14:37:49 overclocking isnt gonna kill your device this week Mar 13 14:38:06 and chances are by the time overclocking would have killed it, you would be ready to move on anyway Mar 13 14:47:44 Could you give me a timespan? I wouldn't push it to the limits, just make it a bit faster Mar 13 14:48:16 Nobody can. Mar 13 14:48:38 I it likely to kill it in the time the device still works - possibly not. Mar 13 14:49:02 So.. 6 months? 1 year? Mar 13 14:50:37 Sazpaimon: within a yeaR? Mar 13 14:52:54 luke-jr, if you run it at 100% cpu for a year straight, then maybe Mar 13 14:53:15 Sazpaimon: you wouldn't get to a year at 100% CPU, at default clocks Mar 13 14:53:35 yeah probably not Mar 13 14:53:54 still most of the time you're overclocked, the cpu wont even be running at that clock Mar 13 14:54:46 there are people that have been overclocking for a year already, I havent seen any complaints thus far Mar 13 15:00:16 I am OC since aplil/may 2010, till kp49 up to 900, when kp49 came out up to 805 Mar 13 15:00:59 Well good to know.. I will check back tomorrow to ask a few more questions before i decide lol.. :) Mar 13 15:07:47 well, when your car's engine has a red zone and limiter @ 6000 RPM, is it sane to removeavtune the limiter so you can run the engine @ e.g. 8000 RPM? how long can you do? Mar 13 15:09:49 ah once again, the old car/computer analogy Mar 13 15:10:23 DocScrutinizer, I drive my BMW OC from 136 HP to about 170 HP for 5 or so years :p. No problem at all. Mar 13 15:11:37 and that analogy doesnt really hold up Mar 13 15:12:02 I disagree. Mar 13 15:12:08 if you remove the rev limiter, you would also need to replace the exhaust for it to do anything Mar 13 15:12:12 In both cases, you can't tell what will fail. Mar 13 15:13:29 it simply doesn't worth it Mar 13 15:13:35 the risk is to blow up a device Mar 13 15:13:44 the pro is to speed up just a bit Mar 13 15:37:28 A device that is not used because it is slow has effectively blown up. Mar 13 15:37:37 [10:52:54] luke-jr, if you run it at 100% cpu for a year straight, then maybe Mar 13 15:37:50 if you run 100% CPU at 600MHz it'll like fail Mar 13 15:38:10 MohammadAG: that's what I said Mar 13 15:38:23 SpeedEvil: 600 MHz isn't slow. the RAM is where N900 is lacking Mar 13 15:38:33 luke-jr: often Mar 13 15:38:36 luke-jr, just noticed Mar 13 15:39:05 [11:07:47] well, when your car's engine has a red zone and limiter @ 6000 RPM, is it sane to removeavtune the limiter so you can run the engine @ e.g. 8000 RPM? how long can you do? Mar 13 15:39:14 I just stick a paper with a drawn extended gauge Mar 13 15:39:24 then broke the needle that holds it at maximum Mar 13 16:13:19 all decent scientific studies show that user can't even notice 25% faster CPU, esp when other componenys (RAM etc) are still same speed, and when slow storage (HDD, flash) kicks in, clockspeed of CPU is negligible Mar 13 16:15:27 so except for that rage case where you get to 24fps but you'd need gt 25fps, OC is TOTALLY useless Mar 13 16:15:38 rare cases* Mar 13 16:47:57 Is it easy to make N900 to dual boot? If i have one OS in the phone and the other in memory-card of course. Mar 13 16:51:11 yes Mar 13 16:51:54 bootmenu, u-boot, flasher -- those are your options Dynamit, depending on how the second OS is configured Mar 13 16:53:26 u-boot works better for nemo/mer and multiboot for nitdroid. Mar 13 16:53:58 okey i don't have my N900 yet but i hope i have it on Thursday for hope for the Swedish post office to get it from a place near Göteborg to a place quiet near Örnskuldsvik Mar 13 16:54:14 ok thx for the info Sicelo and beford Mar 13 17:00:17 Are Maemo under development or have Nokia abandoned it? I have read that Nokia planning/have abandoned MeeGo. Mar 13 17:00:52 nitdroid/multiboot aren't advised. that's why i left them out in my list Mar 13 17:18:53 ~maemo-multiboot Mar 13 17:18:54 methinks maemo-multiboot is deprecated, and a horrible hack. PROBLEMS WITH NITDROID/MULTIBOOT? reflash rootfs&kernel aka COMBINED Mar 13 17:43:10 Is't any support for Ubuntu One sync in Maemo? Mar 13 17:49:22 Dynamit, https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntuone-client/+bug/512052 Mar 13 17:59:16 reading that link makes me laugh :D Mar 13 18:00:54 Marktrix (markgerlach) wrote on 2010-10-24: I am not a Developer and no Part of Canonical. But I think, the focus is iOS and Android, Maemo go out of date and Canonical needs cost-effectiveness. So first the Bigplayers and than maybe (hopefully) Meego Mar 13 18:02:28 I maybe will use Dual boot then it appearing to be MeeGo and Android or Maemo and Android Mar 13 18:03:36 The only reason i want Ubuntu One in the phone when i get it is because then i can writing in the calender in the mobile and get it sync on many computer's i use Mar 13 18:04:18 That would make my school studding more effective then it's today Mar 13 18:04:58 that's not what i was laughing about though Dynamit. i just find it dumb that the post is clearly about N900, and someone already made attempts to get One on N900. then some apple fanboy pops up and say drop it Mar 13 18:06:20 anyway, looks like canonical did 'follow' that piece of 'dis-advice' - http://voices.canonical.com/ubuntuone/2011/05/09/some-changes-to-contacts-2/ Mar 13 18:07:20 stupid Apple G** person then Mar 13 18:09:31 btw, lol, i don't even know what this One is, although it seems to be an Ubuntu-only feature.. /me has Debian Mar 13 18:10:39 you can use Ubuntu One on Windows too Mar 13 18:10:44 Android i Know Mar 13 18:11:35 ah, news to me. windows & ubuntu one :P Mar 13 18:12:53 https://one.ubuntu.com/downloads/windows/ Mar 13 18:19:26 cooool shit Mar 13 18:19:43 * DocScrutinizer is temped to continue where he left yesterday Mar 13 18:20:29 I.E. rant about canonical and buntkuh, and the idiotic product philosophy behind it, and the poor maintainability Mar 13 18:22:07 ubuntu == "linux" for bored windows users to feel "smart" Mar 13 18:25:49 /kick DocScrutinizer !! Mar 13 18:25:50 :D Mar 13 18:39:05 well, N900 made me start to use Linux... and somehow 'dictated' that i should choose Debian. i didn't like Ubuntu for the very same reason DocScrutinizer mentions. guess one future day i'll look into other linuxes (Arch, Gentoo, and such) :/ Mar 13 18:45:55 dunno if i'll really do Gentoo .. compiling everything is nice for learning -- but i'm not so sure doing it all the time is the best idea for me and types of computers i use. therefore, i think Arch looks like my next one. Mar 13 19:01:51 ping freemangordon Mar 13 19:19:08 so i have n900 now Mar 13 19:19:47 the usb port didn't wobble, don't know what to do with it next Mar 13 19:20:46 ketas: install cssu ;) Mar 13 19:26:13 merlin1991: i would like to have cshu Mar 13 19:26:34 ketas: http://wiki.maemo.org/Community_SSU Mar 13 19:28:07 merlin1991: "Update available for your MicroUSB port" Mar 13 19:28:07 :P Mar 13 19:33:19 lol Mar 13 19:40:14 round-trip min/avg/max/stddev = 119.768/2357.527/10736.500/2708.779 ms Mar 13 19:40:19 i love 3g Mar 13 19:40:21 :) Mar 13 19:41:26 no, it was 100.224/5976.568/27335.730/6531.975 ms actually Mar 13 19:42:16 what i find is that packets get queued somewhere, and then eventually arrive with a delay up to multiple minutes Mar 13 19:42:32 which is ridiculous, as any internet protocol will have timed out by then Mar 13 19:43:47 for example, a dns lookup... a few attempts are made to sed the query udp packet, but no response arrives... a minute later, the response packet to each request arrives... but the source port is closed already, and so for each one, an icmp destination unreachable is sent back to the dns server Mar 13 19:44:46 yea, sucks Mar 13 19:45:43 I've seen pings over 2 minutes -.- Mar 13 19:47:54 now, imagine you want to use ssh Mar 13 19:47:59 :P Mar 13 19:48:22 packet arrives 2 minutes later Mar 13 20:15:31 changed router at home and when I try to use apt-get on wlan i get "could not contact dns servers". browser works without problems. Mar 13 20:19:32 hmm Mar 13 20:19:41 how so Mar 13 20:20:12 shanttu: can you resolve a host? Mar 13 20:26:36 ketas, nope Mar 13 20:27:12 tried google dns/ opendns ? Mar 13 20:29:21 well, use CSD, it is almost realtime. Wait... N900 modem doesn't support CSD, not fashionable anymore :-S Mar 13 20:31:59 I used gui to set opendns and thought it was set. i changed it on /etc/resolv.conf and voila Mar 13 20:42:25 fremantle is not using /etc/resolv.conf, or rather: it must not get altered, as on fremantle you got dnsmasq Mar 13 20:43:55 so changing /etc/resolv.conf to anything other than 127.0.0.1 will break things Mar 13 20:44:18 device can't associate to new networks Mar 13 20:47:50 DocScrutinizer, the truth is now I can use apt-get. i'm extremely noob regarding networking Mar 13 20:48:33 the truth is this will change eventually Mar 13 20:49:01 will change it back then Mar 13 20:49:14 another truth is you haven't got any DNS cache now anymore, as far as I can tell Mar 13 20:49:39 so *each* DNS query now goes via network Mar 13 20:50:21 in short: you fsckdup your DHCP Mar 13 20:52:00 next hotspot you will run into trouble, as they usually rely on their own DNS server getting used at very least for authentication via browser frontpage Mar 13 20:52:26 mmh dnsmasq is writing a resolv.conf foreach different connection Mar 13 20:52:33 yep Mar 13 20:52:35 and nameserver used is the one got via dhcp Mar 13 20:52:37 so Mar 13 20:52:52 ->127.0.0.1->dnsmasq->192.168.1.1 Mar 13 20:52:54 exactly what I tried to say Mar 13 20:53:22 and also dnsmasq caches Mar 13 20:53:36 to speed up repeated queries *a lot* Mar 13 20:53:44 sure Mar 13 20:58:44 reading about opendns now and will try that. thanks for your help Mar 13 21:03:32 ummm Mar 13 21:07:56 maybe you simply should delete your home wlan form list of networks, then create it new - obviously after you first switched /etc/resolv.conf back to default 127.0.0.1 Mar 13 21:08:47 checking the config of your new AP also might help a lot Mar 13 21:09:37 and of course restarting the phone also may help to recover from hidden massive changes in WLAN network environment Mar 13 21:11:51 DocScrutinizer: ping Mar 13 21:12:53 DocScrutinizer: i've disassembled my n900, usb port "jumped out" a bit from board on one side Mar 13 21:14:15 when pressing it a bit from top to make it really touch the board, it works Mar 13 21:16:25 yeah Mar 13 21:16:32 semi-off Mar 13 21:16:40 you opened it just in time Mar 13 21:17:01 dos1: so, what's the question? :-D Mar 13 21:17:08 DocScrutinizer: just reporting :) Mar 13 21:17:29 solder it down, touch the connetion pins shortly with soldering iron, good you are Mar 13 21:17:57 don't apply tin to the contact pins when soldering them Mar 13 21:18:28 good flux maybe, but no tin beyond what's inevitably on your soldering tip already Mar 13 21:18:48 so basicaly nothing Mar 13 21:19:20 ok Mar 13 21:20:11 save all the lots of solder for the mach reinforcement blobs at left and right of component ;-) Mar 13 21:20:19 mech* Mar 13 21:20:30 and as always Mar 13 21:20:32 NO EPOXY Mar 13 21:20:40 YUP! :-D Mar 13 21:21:12 thanks for tips, i'll report in few days how it went (i don't have soldering iron here right now) Mar 13 21:21:18 hm I wonder how my usb port in my n900s is doing Mar 13 21:21:57 dos1: I guess it's redundant, and already known, but anyway: Mar 13 21:22:02 ~usbfix Mar 13 21:22:02 well, usbfix is http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=75920 - and **NEVER** use epoxy (unless you want to seal your device for underwater) Mar 13 21:22:37 hm I gues it's impossible to tell if they are broken from the outside Mar 13 21:22:48 yes, mostly Mar 13 21:23:16 you might tell when it moves 0.2mm when you press it "down" with some toothpick Mar 13 21:24:08 actually you can see this very well, as there's a 0.5mm gap from USB to plastic of case Mar 13 21:24:52 down means towards the battery side of the device? Mar 13 21:25:10 yep Mar 13 21:25:33 i tried to push it with stylus when checking for my n900 Mar 13 21:25:38 well, basically it mustn't move in either sirection Mar 13 21:25:43 wasn't wobbly Mar 13 21:26:02 they all seem to be rock solid Mar 13 21:26:19 stylus is a good idea Mar 13 21:26:25 yet, do i need to harden it with solder? Mar 13 21:26:28 still Mar 13 21:27:01 depends on your sleep, are you suffering insomnia when you think about N900 USB_? Mar 13 21:27:34 i don't really want it to break off in future Mar 13 21:27:42 are you a very gentle guy or rather a blacksnith? Mar 13 21:27:46 smith* Mar 13 21:28:22 i don't like to twist cables around really Mar 13 21:28:23 wouldn't the safest method be to remove the connector and solder a pigtail cable instead? ;) Mar 13 21:28:23 hm I wonder how blacksmith soldering would look like :P Mar 13 21:28:28 hm Mar 13 21:28:36 what you meant? Mar 13 21:28:53 r00t-eeepc: well... Mar 13 21:29:04 r00t-eeepc: i thought that, but that's stupid Mar 13 21:29:09 it's really hard to tell what's more risk - disassembling and trying to solder it while no appropriate expertise, or hoping for your luck not to trip over the cable Mar 13 21:29:41 2nd case at least gives you the chance that you don't try todo somehting that might break it Mar 13 21:30:39 ketas: it _looks_ stpid, but it's the best way to prevent destruction of the port ;) Mar 13 21:31:12 of course there are characters that can't build card houses without folding the cards. Those should try to find somebody to do the soldering for them Mar 13 21:33:09 I got no problems with 2 devices with all together >3 years of frequent USB plug-rounds Mar 13 21:33:26 both still fine Mar 13 21:33:37 no preemptive fixing Mar 13 21:33:49 hmm Mar 13 21:34:03 a method i find reasonable is to remove the locking hooks from the micro-usb plug, so it will slip out rather than rip out the port Mar 13 21:34:08 so i leave it without fix for now? Mar 13 21:34:09 but then again, I'm an EE who's supposed to know how to handle that kinda delicate stuff Mar 13 21:34:46 ketas: yours is broken, no? so fixing is obviously needed Mar 13 21:35:04 r00t-eeepc: that's basically BS, you never 'rip out' the port, it always gets loose by levering/bending the plug Mar 13 21:35:12 r00t-eeepc: not yet :P Mar 13 21:35:31 DocScrutinizer: i've seen phones with ripped out port on ebay ;) Mar 13 21:35:51 so be carefull on pulling the plug, don't bend it, and you're most likely fine Mar 13 21:36:13 someone claimed that it just came out Mar 13 21:36:22 DocScrutinizer: and it will also reduce stress on the port by making the plug fit less tight Mar 13 21:36:22 r00t-eeepc: so what? sure you can rip out a loose receptacle component Mar 13 21:37:14 hmm Mar 13 21:37:24 do they make usb plugs without hooks Mar 13 21:37:46 well, it's your cable. easy to replace once you ruined it. I never found it's needed as all my cables go in and out just fine, after ~200 rounds Mar 13 21:37:52 ketas: rip out with appropriate pliers Mar 13 21:38:10 i'll see Mar 13 21:38:16 now that's complete BS Mar 13 21:38:45 DocScrutinizer: rip the hooks out of the plug i mean, to make a hook-less plug Mar 13 21:38:46 go in and out just fine... Mar 13 21:39:06 yes, and I answered on that Mar 13 21:39:27 how else would you remove them (if you wanted to) Mar 13 21:39:40 with teeth Mar 13 21:39:50 meh, how else would you make a pig fly Mar 13 21:40:01 with wings of course Mar 13 21:40:02 ketas: it's unlikely your teeth have that kind of grip ;) Mar 13 21:40:11 simple answer, the whole idea is BS Mar 13 21:40:19 DocScrutinizer: possible Mar 13 21:40:21 also Mar 13 21:40:47 some usb cables are fucking thick Mar 13 21:40:56 which might be better for signal but... well Mar 13 21:41:04 DocScrutinizer: i'm not necessarily saying it's a great idea or helps much - but it won't hurt (the usb port) either Mar 13 21:41:17 will cause plug to fall out when no latches at all Mar 13 21:41:55 yes, but having the plug fall out is sure easier on the port than pulling the phone around by it Mar 13 21:42:20 ketas: when your plug is a bit tight at beginning, paint the outside (!) with a pencil Mar 13 21:42:46 hmm Mar 13 21:42:51 interesting idea Mar 13 21:42:56 graphite lubrication? Mar 13 21:43:00 yep Mar 13 21:43:00 yes Mar 13 21:43:13 what out inside :P Mar 13 21:43:18 about Mar 13 21:43:24 And still even without the hooks if you try on the cable you might be subjecting hte port to bending forces still, before the velocity vector of cable and attitude of n900 reorients to allow for plug to come out Mar 13 21:43:54 thanks ShadowJK, was too lazy to explain it Mar 13 21:43:58 ShadowJK: now that's some serious connector physics ;) Mar 13 21:44:16 i've seen massive microusb plugs with massive cables Mar 13 21:44:18 try=trip Mar 13 21:44:23 and hard to bend cables Mar 13 21:44:46 yes, that's why you want hooks on those Mar 13 21:44:48 those cables nokia provide are somewhat easier to work with Mar 13 21:45:52 USB *always* breaks on you pulling on the plug not in line with insertion direction Mar 13 21:45:58 aka bending it Mar 13 21:46:05 on pulling out Mar 13 21:46:18 hm? Mar 13 21:46:31 breaks what, how? Mar 13 21:46:53 your USB never will come off on a proper pull out in straight line, not even with hardest latches on plug Mar 13 21:47:04 now, what we REALLY need is induction coupled phone charging... Mar 13 21:47:20 if you need it, you should get it Mar 13 21:47:36 it's been done before Mar 13 21:47:49 helsinki airport has café with induction chargers under the tables Mar 13 21:47:50 well induction charing on phone is kind of hard to design, no? Mar 13 21:47:58 charging Mar 13 21:48:05 it's available somewhere... but probably too expensive to be worth it Mar 13 21:48:23 ~80..100 bucks for material IIRC Mar 13 21:48:36 with a spare for palm pre Mar 13 21:49:09 some cute hacker already did it Mar 13 21:49:13 i just bought an n900 for 100 bucks... Mar 13 21:49:16 on N900 Mar 13 21:54:15 wb Mar 13 21:54:36 oops, much late, nvm that Mar 13 21:56:35 bucks and boosts Mar 13 21:56:52 pali: when you mean 2.6.35 needs proc/bootreason and gpio keys to work... could you point in the right direction for further reading? Mar 13 21:58:07 Hurrian, szopin, if you want I can send my patch for bootreason and gpio to work Mar 13 21:58:30 patch is for meego n900 kernel from git Mar 13 21:58:47 and it create compatible interface for maemo 5 fremantle Mar 13 22:00:27 i'd like that Mar 13 22:00:36 let's see what can be built **** BEGIN LOGGING AT Tue Mar 13 22:04:38 2012 Mar 13 22:05:13 wow, I found my "book to read" for this night: /sys/kernel/debug/kprobes Mar 13 22:05:22 err, /sys/kernel/debug/* Mar 13 22:06:23 hmm, still quiet? Mar 13 22:06:35 yay works... thanks Pali Mar 13 22:07:08 disco_stu_droid: blasphemy Mar 13 22:08:00 cool, going to get debian 6 and scrathbox then Mar 13 22:08:16 hah, /sys/kernel/debug/wl12xx/fw-statistics/* wow Mar 13 22:08:25 sopin, Hurrian, patch is here: http://atrey.karlin.mff.cuni.cz/~pali/meego_n900_kernel_fremantle.patch Mar 13 22:08:48 against this git repo: http://meego.gitorious.org/meego-device-adaptation/n900_kernel Mar 13 22:09:03 please note that you need GCC 4.6 Mar 13 22:09:07 pali: is it possible to compile >.28 in SB, using gcc 4.6 for example? Mar 13 22:09:38 I think scratchobox does not compiling it correctly Mar 13 22:09:48 better install ARM GCC cross compiler Mar 13 22:10:05 oh Mar 13 22:10:06 and also, this patch is very hacky and is not complete!!!! Mar 13 22:10:09 so to get 35 running one can scratch scratchbox? Mar 13 22:10:10 no need for debian then Mar 13 22:10:17 brb, booting ubuntu vm Mar 13 22:10:22 :) Mar 13 22:10:39 ubuntu has package gcc-arm-linux-gnueabi Mar 13 22:10:56 and with it you can easy cross compile n900 kernel without problem Mar 13 22:10:57 @Pali, do I need to build newer binutils for fremantle to boot this kernel? Mar 13 22:11:04 no Mar 13 22:11:10 nice Mar 13 22:11:18 also, i see that you build k-pwr with gcc 4.2.1 Mar 13 22:11:23 libc6/libglib? Mar 13 22:11:26 would that also be necessary? Mar 13 22:11:26 also please note that I did not tested it on real n900 yet!!!! Mar 13 22:11:40 I can crash test it for you Mar 13 22:11:47 in qemu it has problem with BME Mar 13 22:11:49 got a freshly reflashed one Mar 13 22:11:55