**** BEGIN LOGGING AT Sat Feb 13 02:59:58 2016
Feb 13 04:30:11 <Oksanaa> For those who heard of or know about Nokia's battery charger DT-33: how to counter its sensitivity to ambient temperature?
Feb 13 04:32:16 <Oksanaa> Its temperature sensor is intended to detect battery being too cold or too warm, and abort charging. However, it results in annoying no-charging when temperature is too high (like, 28°C in shadow inside house). High humidity (50%-75%) might also contribute
Feb 13 04:37:18 <Oksanaa> While I appreciate craftsmanship of the plastic case, I would prefer the electronics to survive 50°C and 80% humidity extremes (while not charging), and reliably charge in 30°C temperatures
Feb 13 04:38:06 <Oksanaa> It might require different position of temperature sensor(s)
Feb 13 04:41:44 * Oksanaa speaks as user, not as electronics or battery-charging expert
Feb 13 04:46:13 <Maxdamantus> Meh, the carrier for the SIM in my N9 only supports HSDPA.
Feb 13 04:46:23 <Maxdamantus> So .. need a third plan.
Feb 13 04:46:54 <Oksanaa> Fuuun... Three SIM slots in mobile phone, anybody?
Feb 13 04:47:16 <Maxdamantus> Capitalism sucks.
Feb 13 04:47:27 * Oksanaa nods
Feb 13 04:48:01 <Maxdamantus> In rural areas, you have three towers in the same place, hosted by three different carries. In that place because it's relatively optimal in area covered.
Feb 13 04:48:15 <Maxdamantus> Then when you're outside of that area, you're fucked.
Feb 13 04:49:22 <Oksanaa> There are some devices which fork one SIM slot into two slots. Combine that with two-SIM-slots-phone, and you feel better. If software handles this, of course
Feb 13 04:49:49 * Oksanaa remembers something for making N900 two-SIMs-capable
Feb 13 04:50:11 <Oksanaa> I can be mistaken, I wasn't testing it
Feb 13 04:54:04 <Maxdamantus> I imagine it'd depend on the modem.
Feb 13 04:54:21 <Maxdamantus> I think the SIM card is connected electronically to that.
Feb 13 04:54:33 <Maxdamantus> s/electronically/electrically/
Feb 13 04:54:33 <infobot> Maxdamantus meant: I think the SIM card is connected electrically to that.
Feb 13 04:56:07 * Maxdamantus wants to try using his laptop's phone functionality, but apparently has to run something in Windows to enable it.
Feb 13 04:56:15 * Maxdamantus has never booted Windows on his laptop.
Feb 13 04:57:50 <Oksanaa> Why in Windows? Phone functionality sounds like something to be enabled in BIOS?
Feb 13 04:59:34 <Maxdamantus> Assuming the BIOS knows about it.
Feb 13 04:59:36 <Maxdamantus> It doesn't.
Feb 13 05:00:06 <Maxdamantus> Well, it might, depending on the scope of "BIOS".
Feb 13 05:00:31 <Maxdamantus> I suspect it involves agreeing to some license.
Feb 13 05:00:39 <Oksanaa> Then it's closed-source driver-like-switch for something-cellular implemented only for Windows?
Feb 13 05:01:42 <Oksanaa> If it wasn't niche, there would have been hope of RE-ing it, I guess...
Feb 13 05:02:06 <Maxdamantus> There are open source drivers for talking to the modem. You just have to flick some switch using some particular software that runs on Windows .. for some reason.
Feb 13 05:02:12 <Oksanaa> Is it common in phone-laptops, or specific to this manufacturer?
Feb 13 05:02:35 <Maxdamantus> http://support.lenovo.com/nz/en/downloads/migr-68495
Feb 13 05:02:37 <Maxdamantus> Dunno.
Feb 13 05:10:48 <Oksanaa> Maxdamantus: have to windows it. maybe, live cd windows? https://wiki.archlinux.org/index.php/ThinkPad_mobile_internet
Feb 13 07:07:07 <KotCzarny> hurrian: remember that in n9 most of mem is eaten by some java engine (if my memory is not mistaken), so on fremantle 1GB should be more suitable, still, 2G would be even better
Feb 13 07:07:37 <KotCzarny> maxd: there are physical adapters that can switch sim cards (cut out) even in single slot phones
Feb 13 08:12:01 <Maxdamantus> Java engine? O_o
Feb 13 08:13:08 <Maxdamantus> Nothing in `ps aux` here matching "java"
Feb 13 08:13:16 <KotCzarny> well, its not java per se
Feb 13 08:13:22 <KotCzarny> just some sandbox engine
Feb 13 08:13:52 <Maxdamantus> I don't think it uses any sandbox other than Linux itself.
Feb 13 08:13:57 <KotCzarny> hrm
Feb 13 08:14:04 <KotCzarny> then my memory must be playing tricks
Feb 13 10:13:31 <ceene> nobody seems to have tested new yappari at -devel
Feb 13 10:13:39 <KotCzarny> ..yet
Feb 13 10:13:43 <ceene> they're my guinea pigs!
Feb 13 10:13:53 <ceene> i don't want to push it to -testing until someone says something
Feb 13 10:14:29 <ceene> it's working for me, but...
Feb 13 10:14:57 <Sicelo> going to install shortly, when on wifi :)
Feb 13 10:15:16 <ceene> i was thinking too of splitting gui and whatsapp
Feb 13 10:15:22 <ceene> make libyap
Feb 13 10:15:29 <Sicelo> but, i won't be able to test registration, which i guess was the main reason? anything else that changed?
Feb 13 10:15:33 <ceene> in the end it's the thing that has the most changes
Feb 13 10:15:39 <ceene> you will, that's the thing i've solved
Feb 13 10:15:41 <Sicelo> sounds like good idea that .. :)
Feb 13 10:16:40 <ceene> there's some much things i should do
Feb 13 10:16:45 <ceene> i should just use libwa from coderus
Feb 13 10:16:51 <ceene> but the apis are not compatible right now
Feb 13 10:16:57 <ceene> and i'd have to backport libwa to qt4
Feb 13 10:17:07 <ceene> on the other side, it already supports textsecure
Feb 13 10:19:01 <KotCzarny> talk to him about common maintainship of WA stack
Feb 13 10:19:45 <ceene> if i backport it to qt4 i guess he'd be willing to merge it
Feb 13 10:22:16 <KotCzarny> maybe he would help you with that?
Feb 13 10:22:36 <KotCzarny> who knows
Feb 13 10:32:41 <ceene> i just hate this thing
Feb 13 10:33:32 <ceene> https://github.com/stenyak/breakbot
Feb 13 10:33:35 <ceene> maybe this thing works
Feb 13 10:33:51 <ceene> or some other
Feb 13 10:35:04 <ceene> thing is, we don't even have a good telegram client for n900
Feb 13 10:35:15 <ceene> so i can't even try and persuade my friends to use it
Feb 13 10:58:44 <Sicelo> indeed. some geek friends i have have switched to telegram, but again ... not many users. :)
Feb 13 11:04:17 <buZz> if they dont irc, they are just not really geeks
Feb 13 11:10:29 <Sicelo> :)
Feb 13 11:11:34 <buZz> make sure to tell them that :P
Feb 13 11:11:54 <buZz> maybe with something like 'once you used that practise stuff enough, you can come join the real irc'
Feb 13 11:20:48 <ceene> best im application for maemo right now is yappari... which is quite sad
Feb 13 11:21:03 <merlin1991> wat?
Feb 13 11:21:06 <merlin1991> jabber works
Feb 13 11:30:31 <Sicelo> yes, jabber is great :)
Feb 13 11:30:41 <Sicelo> but again .. who uses it? :)
Feb 13 11:31:12 <Sicelo> personally i'd be happy to use only irc and jabber (as jabber has everything: calls, im, video)
Feb 13 11:32:18 <merlin1991> I do, so do a few of my friends :D
Feb 13 11:35:18 <ceene> merlin1991: it's not the same "works" than "sends image and video, reports and gets receipt/read reports", etc
Feb 13 11:36:17 <merlin1991> iirc there is an extension to the jabber protocol for that
Feb 13 11:36:28 <ceene> on n900 the only thing that does that is yappari
Feb 13 11:36:40 <ceene> i'm not saying there aren't alternatives better than whatsapp
Feb 13 11:36:45 <ceene> i'm saying there aren't any for n900
Feb 13 11:37:00 <buZz> just send them a handwritten letter
Feb 13 11:39:13 <ceene> i'd be thrilled to receive one
Feb 13 11:39:34 <buZz> now, pay those emotions forward ceene 
Feb 13 11:39:52 <ceene> i can send you a handwritten letter if you want
Feb 13 11:40:05 <ceene> postcards were nice
Feb 13 11:40:56 <ceene> i remember there was one piece of software whose author instead of asking for donations, asked for postcards from its users
Feb 13 11:41:36 <buZz> yeah its a license type
Feb 13 11:41:55 <ceene> postcard-ware
Feb 13 12:11:10 <jonwil> hi
Feb 13 12:11:43 <ceene> hi, jonwil 
Feb 13 15:27:34 <DocScrutinizer05> errwhat? >>iPhone's preinstalled app 'health' constantly records all sports activities, without user asking for that<< (quote from TV news, sidenote in a report about health apps)
Feb 13 15:28:32 <DocScrutinizer05> spyPhone, indeed
Feb 13 15:46:04 <Wizzup> and don't tell it the date is 1 january, 1970
Feb 13 15:46:21 <KotCzarny> ;)
Feb 13 15:46:33 <KotCzarny> good sploit
Feb 13 15:46:53 <KotCzarny> 'can i see your phone for a moment?'
Feb 13 15:58:20 <DocScrutinizer05> why? what will happen?
Feb 13 15:58:30 <KotCzarny> he he
Feb 13 15:58:41 <DocScrutinizer05> self destruct?
Feb 13 15:58:46 <Wizzup> it will fail to boot
Feb 13 15:58:50 <Wizzup> on all the 64 bit arm ones at least
Feb 13 15:58:58 <DocScrutinizer05> lol
Feb 13 15:59:13 <Wizzup> and then 4chan made https://i.imgur.com/mnfsKzF.png
Feb 13 15:59:51 <DocScrutinizer05> well, in case you just have to wait one day and then you can edit the resulting date from 2nd Jan 1970 to something more sane ;-)
Feb 13 16:00:23 <Wizzup> yes
Feb 13 16:01:28 <DocScrutinizer05> nice gimmick
Feb 13 16:02:33 <DocScrutinizer05> I just hope it doesn't bootloop and kill the battery before the "day" is over
Feb 13 16:02:53 <Wizzup> if it does, then the clock is reset too
Feb 13 16:02:57 <Wizzup> probably to manufacture date
Feb 13 16:03:02 <DocScrutinizer05> oooh
Feb 13 16:03:07 <DocScrutinizer05> ok
Feb 13 16:03:27 <DocScrutinizer05> I had expected it resets to 1st Jan 1970 :-P
Feb 13 16:04:44 <DocScrutinizer05> well, possibly the bootloader takes care to set a bogus but less 'rogue' date, only if the RTC got reset
Feb 13 16:08:22 * DocScrutinizer05 ponders trying a `>xxx; touch --date="1955-01-01" yyy`
Feb 13 16:08:56 <DocScrutinizer05> s/yyy/xxx/
Feb 13 16:10:20 <DocScrutinizer05> wow
Feb 13 16:10:25 <DocScrutinizer05> jr@saturn:~/tmp> touch --date="1855-01-01" xxx; ll xxx
Feb 13 16:10:26 <DocScrutinizer05> -rw-r--r-- 1 jr users 0  1. Jan 1855  xxx
Feb 13 16:12:16 <Wizzup> very few devices that I know reset to 1970
Feb 13 16:12:22 <Wizzup> except for the sheevaplug
Feb 13 16:13:27 <DocScrutinizer05> man 2 stat; man 2 time  >>time() returns the time as the number of seconds since the Epoch, 1970-01-01 00:00:00 +0000 (UTC).<<
Feb 13 16:14:49 <DocScrutinizer05> I wonder how the heck the filesystem stores, and stat() resturns, dates like 1. Jan 1855
Feb 13 16:16:34 <DocScrutinizer05> time_t clearly seems to be a uint (or ulong, whatever) with seconds since epoch
Feb 13 16:17:27 <DocScrutinizer05> or has that recently been changed to a 64bit int with seconds since bigbang?
Feb 13 16:24:15 <DocScrutinizer05> ummm    #define __TIME_T_TYPE           __SYSCALL_SLONG_TYPE
Feb 13 16:25:02 <DocScrutinizer05> # define __SYSCALL_SLONG_TYPE   __SLONGWORD_TYPE
Feb 13 16:27:24 <DocScrutinizer05> so it's a signed 64bit?
Feb 13 16:28:22 <DocScrutinizer05> ~ 2**63/3600/24/365
Feb 13 16:28:22 <infobot> 292471208677.536010742188
Feb 13 16:29:41 <DocScrutinizer05> suffices til Y2Trillion-problem kicks in ;-)
Feb 13 16:30:03 <DocScrutinizer05> nevermind Y2K-problem ;-P
Feb 13 16:32:24 <DocScrutinizer05> s/(time() returns the time as the number of seconds )since( the Epoch, 1970-01-01 00:00:00 +0000 (UTC).)/\1since\/before\2/
Feb 13 16:42:17 <DocScrutinizer05> ~ 1970 + 2**31/3600/24/365
Feb 13 16:42:17 <infobot> 2038.096259766616
Feb 13 16:47:16 <DocScrutinizer05> Wizzup: anyway you're right. RTCs generally work completely different, having no idea about epoch
Feb 13 16:48:17 <DocScrutinizer05> depends on chip what date they reset to on POR
Feb 13 17:03:06 <DocScrutinizer05> most RTC have a 2digit BCD year value from 00 to 99
Feb 13 17:04:01 <DocScrutinizer05> so odds are it would reset to year (20)00
Feb 13 17:05:22 <Wizzup> olimex boards reset to 2010
Feb 13 17:05:30 <Wizzup> at least the ones that I have
Feb 13 17:05:52 <DocScrutinizer05> wow, so they have a one digit year only
Feb 13 17:06:25 <KotCzarny> :)
Feb 13 17:06:35 <DocScrutinizer05> or a N-bit binary integer for year value
Feb 13 17:08:36 <DocScrutinizer05> Y1Decade problem approaching in 4 years
Feb 13 17:10:30 <DocScrutinizer05> prolly the designers thought it's safe to assume their product won't get older than 16 years, so 4 bit for the year value are just fine ;-)
Feb 13 17:12:19 <DocScrutinizer05> actually you might get away with assuming your system gets booted at least once per 16 years, and you store a new offset somewhere in persistent storage and adjust the RTC accordingly
Feb 13 17:13:42 <DocScrutinizer05> when you assume your system gets booted at least once per year, this scheme can get away without any year values in RTC
Feb 13 17:17:01 <DocScrutinizer05> downside of such scheme: restoring backups will mess up your system time massively
Feb 13 17:20:24 <DocScrutinizer05> when Amiga had no RTC, they simply forward-adjusted the syystem time accordingly whenever they found an arbitrary file on storage with a modification/access time supposedly into the future ;-)
Feb 13 17:21:55 <DocScrutinizer05> so adding a true clock was the very first hack I applied to all my Amiga devices
Feb 13 17:37:09 <DocScrutinizer05> later it got augmented by a DCF77 receiver with decoding in software (had to write a decoder for that)
Feb 13 17:48:56 <DocScrutinizer05> ROTFL, if only I knew back when:  >>There was also a Morse code station identification until 2006, sent during minutes 19, 39 and 59 of each hour<<
Feb 13 17:49:04 <DocScrutinizer05> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/DCF77
Feb 13 18:14:56 * DocScrutinizer05 idly wonders if it wuld be a feasible worthwhile and funny experiment to directly connect a 77.5kHz ferrite antenna + capacitor rrsonant circuit with a FET amp to a computer's audio-in
Feb 13 18:42:10 <kerio> DocScrutinizer05: why didn't you use a NTP client? :>
Feb 13 18:47:12 <KotCzarny> ~ugt
Feb 13 18:47:12 <infobot> hmm... ugt is Universal Greeting Time. Created in #mipslinux, it is a rule that states that whenever somebody enters an IRC channel it is always morning, and it is always late when the person leaves. The local time of any other people in the channel, including the greeter, is irrelevant. http://www.total-knowledge.com/~ilya/mips/ugt.html
**** ENDING LOGGING AT Sun Feb 14 02:59:58 2016